00:14:29 quiet today... 00:15:30 true 00:40:07 -!- calamari has joined. 00:40:16 hi 00:41:40 hello 00:51:14 hello 00:53:22 moin calamari 00:56:13 i'm writing low-level psuedo code of 99bob in whirl... eh. 01:10:55 jix: I need to write up a bool debugger so it's easier to verify solutions :) 01:11:17 yes that would help a lot 01:44:18 hmmm 01:44:30 http://zenith.sparcs.net/dev/whirl99bob.txt 01:44:47 i've just finished low-level psuedo code of 99bob in whirl. 01:45:02 (still hard to understand) 02:29:34 -!- jix has quit ("Banned from network"). 04:00:57 -!- calamari_ has joined. 04:02:14 -!- calamari has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 04:04:13 -!- CXI has joined. 04:19:23 -!- kipple has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 04:44:35 -!- pgimeno has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 04:44:35 -!- puzzlet has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 04:45:36 -!- fizzie has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 04:45:36 -!- deltab has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 04:47:35 -!- deltab has joined. 04:47:35 -!- fizzie has joined. 04:47:49 -!- pgimeno has joined. 04:47:49 -!- puzzlet has joined. 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:13:55 -!- calamari_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 08:18:07 -!- calamari has joined. 09:22:40 -!- tokigun has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)). 09:22:42 -!- tokigun_ has joined. 09:22:44 -!- tokigun_ has changed nick to tokigun. 10:05:01 -!- jix has joined. 10:05:31 moin 10:17:54 hi jix 10:18:05 messing with that debugger.. 10:18:28 hehe 10:18:46 actually I should say messing with Swing, since I haven't written a line of interpreter code yet 10:22:07 hehe use ruby/tk 10:22:33 (he means python) 10:22:43 no ruby 10:23:22 pythen is nice but i prefer ruby's syntax and core features and stdlib 10:23:23 I've written a couple new LayoutManager's today.. but they should come in handy in the future 10:25:33 -!- pul has joined. 10:25:37 -!- pul has left (?). 10:37:48 jix: http://images.kidsquid.com/bool.png 10:38:48 nice 10:40:37 jix: thanks :) 10:51:54 -!- Keymaker has joined. 10:52:10 calamari: looks good 10:52:26 bool probably is some language? 10:54:48 it's 1bit brainfuck 10:55:25 ah 10:55:39 i thougth that was called boolfuck 10:55:49 calamari and me are trying to minimize the brainfuck instruction set without adding extra rules just by creating new instructions that can be build out of the old ones 10:55:55 boolfuck is different 10:55:59 ah yes 10:56:02 boolfuck is LE and has bit output 10:56:11 ok 10:56:36 good luck 10:58:30 anyways, i'll be back later. bye 10:58:33 -!- Keymaker has quit ("I've seen this déjà vu before.."). 11:14:33 jix: added the menu.. going to bed :) 11:14:47 -!- calamari has quit ("<=K"). 11:15:31 -!- kipple has joined. 11:17:13 moin kipple 11:17:22 hi 11:51:54 <{^Raven^}> morning 12:05:14 -!- J|x has joined. 12:07:45 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 12:07:48 -!- J|x has changed nick to jix. 12:22:30 <{^Raven^}> anyone know who runs the esoteric.sange.fi mailing list? 12:26:30 I don't know, but it might be the same guy that runs the brainfuck archive 12:26:55 <{^Raven^}> do you know who that is? 12:27:05 Panu Kalliokoski, pkalliok@cs.helsinki.fi 12:27:09 http://esoteric.sange.fi/brainfuck/ 12:28:56 <{^Raven^}> cheers kipple 12:36:04 -!- J|x has joined. 12:38:01 -!- Keymaker has joined. 12:38:38 'ello 12:39:09 moin 12:39:16 <{^Raven^}> afternoon 12:39:33 :) 12:43:49 there is no new-line in morse code (the real, not the programming language), right? 12:44:32 yes 12:44:39 -!- tokigun has quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.3/20050414]"). 12:44:57 ok 12:47:09 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 12:48:41 -!- J|x has changed nick to jix. 12:50:56 <{^Raven^}> there are end of message and internal seperator codes 12:51:03 yeah 12:51:03 <{^Raven^}> ^ Keymaker: 12:51:07 yeah 13:16:06 <{^Raven^}> I've been working on a project that may be of interest to the esolang community 13:17:13 <{^Raven^}> it's a website that may or may not be useful 13:17:51 <{^Raven^}> if you want to take a peek msg me privately and I'll give you the URL 13:18:09 <{^Raven^}> but I don't want it public until I've got permission 13:18:39 <{^Raven^}> I'd appreciate some comments if anyone is willing 13:58:34 ok 14:53:32 -!- Keymaker has left (?). 15:01:55 -!- tokigun has joined. 15:02:21 hello 15:05:12 -!- Keymaker has joined. 15:05:27 Keymaker: I've finished 99bob in whirl :) 15:05:59 (i have to optimize but it works) 15:06:21 woooooooaaaaaah 15:06:28 i can't believe my ears :D 15:06:36 that's really cool! 15:06:45 wait a minute :) 15:06:48 ok 15:06:58 i wonder what the guy that invented whirl will say about that.. 15:07:52 be sure to e-mail him it 15:10:49 Keymaker: http://zenith.sparcs.net/dev/99bottle.wr 15:11:21 woah 15:11:41 it weighs 20,332 instructions 15:11:55 :) 15:12:12 amazing 15:12:25 it was generated by my own whirl assembler 15:12:27 it's a lot instructions smaller than some slarty's hello world 15:12:43 ok 15:12:59 slarty's hello world program gave me the idea about memory initialization 15:49:10 optimized 20,322 instructions -> 19,722 instructions 15:49:28 good 16:02:35 i've an idea for a new brainfuck dialect 16:02:43 cool! 16:02:53 2d 16:02:59 hm? 16:02:59 [|+|[ 16:03:00 |-] ] 16:03:07 is a programm that loops forever 16:03:08 it is 2d 16:03:12 ok 16:03:27 the program is equivalent to [-]+[] 16:03:32 in standard bf 16:03:37 yeah 16:04:56 the commands are: []+-<>,. |^%"$ and maybe (i'm unsure) macros 16:05:10 :) 16:05:46 the dialect throws the symmetry out of window :) 16:06:10 hm? 16:06:39 well, i think brainfuck is very symmetric with [ ] and , . and + - and < > 16:06:42 19,162 instructions. hmm... 16:06:56 the dialect has instructions like | and ^ and so on 16:07:01 oops, 19,158 instructions. 16:07:17 | is a reverse-mode-stop 16:07:30 maybe i should add a reverse-mode-start 16:08:33 ok new instruction set: [] +- <> ,. !? ^v '. 16:08:40 urgh 16:08:49 '.' is used twice ^^ 16:08:52 :) 16:09:03 that looks better 16:09:27 i need to symmetric characters for up and down 16:09:34 two 16:10:03 9 and 6? 16:10:09 hah 16:10:10 yes 16:10:15 [] +- <> ,. !? ^v 96 16:10:57 :) as we know, aesthetics is the most important thing in esolangs.. 16:10:58 and i need an exit character... @ 16:11:13 that seems good 16:11:57 !,[@ 16:11:57 .] 16:11:59 is cat 16:12:41 i suggest you writing some specification of the instructions.. sometime 16:12:46 yes 16:13:00 but i've to do my homework :( 16:13:04 :( 16:14:03 but it's only 3,5 weeks until summer holidays :) 16:14:10 :) 16:14:42 ah... i have final exam tomorrow. oops :( 16:14:54 :( 16:14:54 18,508 instructions. 16:15:02 nice work tokigun 16:18:37 i need a name for my dialect 16:19:12 hmm 16:21:52 YABAL 16:22:01 Yet Another Brainfuck A Like 16:22:07 that's good 16:22:57 argh homework... YABAL... homework.. YABAL... homework... URGH 16:23:01 yabal... 16:23:03 yaball... 16:23:15 18,294 instruction, anyway 16:23:21 good 16:23:35 going to get it below 10000? ;) 16:23:55 Keymaker: hmm... :p 16:24:00 hmm Yet Another Brainfuck A Like (Language?) .. YABAL..YABALL? 16:24:13 it looks like YA BALL 16:24:46 i'm going to write down the specs after the next 2 pages homework 16:24:58 ok 16:38:25 well, back to program in bf.. :) 16:57:21 i found 2 ways for converting bf->YABALL 16:57:31 the first produces polyglots 16:57:39 the 2nd YABALL only programs 16:57:58 the 2nd is more compact and more YABALL style code 16:58:59 hmm polyglots.. 16:59:08 that sounds like a neat way 17:04:37 i have a new nice cat ( and i'm still not done with homework 0o...) 17:04:43 !,[@ 17:04:44 !.]? 17:11:48 is 'fraction bar' this: _ 17:11:49 ?? 17:12:04 _ is underscore 17:12:12 ah i see now 17:12:16 then what is fracion bar? 17:12:26 no idea 17:12:30 d'oh :( 17:13:32 the fraction bar is the line in a fraction but i don't think its an ascii character 17:14:06 hm 17:14:08 can be 17:14:10 maybe slash / 17:14:15 no.. 17:14:23 i'm reading morse code entry at wikipedia 17:14:31 and there is no picture of fraction bar 17:14:49 or well, with picture i mean ascii 17:18:59 but in ascii representation i use / for the fraction bar 17:19:19 eg: 1/2 1212/1231234 6/9 17:19:47 yeah 17:20:11 but there is slash '/' that is -··-· 17:20:26 yes but there is no other ascii representation for a fraction bar 17:20:34 ah 17:20:41 i guess not, then 17:20:48 at least i'll ignore it if there is :) 17:21:07 jix: you mean slash and fraction bar look same but they are different letters? 17:22:15 no 17:22:27 hmm 17:22:36 in ascii there is just one / and no other character that is usefull for representing a fraction bar 17:23:03 i see.. 17:23:22 how about unicode? (bad joke) 17:36:38 -!- sp3tt has joined. 17:36:48 17,826 instructions. 17:37:04 cool 17:41:54 hmm i should add a cronjob for downloading the wiki database 17:47:41 hmmm, i got a new quine idea while writing another brainfuck program 17:47:46 better test the idea later 18:04:42 -!- tokigun has quit ("quit"). 18:22:58 is it normal that a wiki page is that slow? 18:30:34 HELLO WORLD!.... . .-.. .-.. --- .-- --- .-. .-.. -.. -.-.-- .-.-. 18:31:32 (there should be 7 spaces at one place, i hope this opera chat didn't trim them..) 18:31:41 (it at least don't show them) 18:47:30 -!- sp3tt_ has joined. 18:57:02 -!- J|x has joined. 18:57:36 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 18:57:40 -!- J|x has changed nick to jix. 19:01:35 done.. 19:01:37 http://www.bf-hacks.org/hacks/morse.b 19:01:46 read from http://www.bf-hacks.org/programs.html how to use it 19:01:47 :) 19:02:31 it's surprisingly time-consuming to write that kind of program. the hardest part is to keep switching windows to look at wikipedia article etc.. 19:02:41 i hope wikipedia article has the right morse codes.. 19:02:46 anyways, gotta go. 19:02:47 -!- Keymaker has left (?). 19:06:04 -!- sp3tt has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 19:07:12 http://esolangs.org/wiki/YABALL specs done 19:17:13 anyone wants to write a YABALL interpreter for me? 19:19:52 -!- tokigun has joined. 19:20:12 15,556 instructions 19:20:30 tokigun: http://esolangs.org/wiki/YABALL 19:20:39 @15,556 cool 19:20:44 ;) 19:26:40 tokigun: do you want to write a YABALL interpreter for me 19:27:12 hmm i've to read spec before writing it 19:27:33 after final exam (22 june) ;) 19:27:41 (to 22 june) 19:28:19 hmm i thought in the next.. say 2 hours ;) 19:28:25 ;) 19:28:37 http://zenith.sparcs.net/dev/99bottle.wr 19:29:17 it's time to go public? 19:29:44 no idea 19:29:49 i like the wave pattern at the end 19:29:54 ;) 19:30:26 i'm considering c(or whatever)-whirl polyglot 19:31:19 c-brainfuck-ruby 19:31:37 uh whirl-bf-ruby 19:31:47 ruby... i know it but cannot use very well. 19:31:59 whirl-bf-YABALL 19:32:04 cannot -> don't 19:32:06 oh! 19:32:19 if you give me bf code i can convert it to a bf-YABALL polyglot 19:32:25 ;) 19:32:48 and you can fill any spaces in the code with 1s and 0s 19:35:48 i'm done with homework! 19:36:04 i just have to put it together and print it 19:36:09 yay! 19:59:08 -!- sp3tt__ has joined. 19:59:45 jix: the YABALL article doesn't list the , and . operators 19:59:55 aren't they used? 20:00:22 -!- sp3tt__ has changed nick to sp3tt. 20:02:00 urgh 20:02:11 the cat example uses them, and also a @ operator which isn't mentioned 20:02:22 hehe 20:02:32 homework+specwriting doesn't work 20:02:42 i should scan my homework for the @ operator ;) 20:04:32 fixed 20:07:22 -!- sp3tt_ has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)). 20:08:19 kipple: any comments about YABALL 20:08:44 looks nice, but too close to BF for my taste 20:09:45 its hard not getting to close to any other language 20:09:51 too 20:12:17 the concept of different modes is interesting. that's pretty original I think 20:15:23 -!- sp3tt__ has joined. 20:15:53 -!- sp3tt has quit (Nick collision from services.). 20:16:05 -!- sp3tt__ has changed nick to sp3tt. 20:16:08 I don't understand the cat example: when the [ moves the IP down, why doesn't the ] cause it to go right back up again, causing an endless loop? 20:16:45 because it's in normal mode and moves right after moving down 20:17:21 ah, I see 20:17:44 guess I'm thinking befunge 20:18:25 my first esolang was a vary simple fungoid 20:19:49 are the cells signed or wrapping? 20:20:07 signed or unsigned makes no difference 20:20:11 but they are wrapping 20:21:21 well, signed makes a difference if you try to output a negative number... at least it doesn't say anything about that 20:21:47 ok they are unsigned 20:22:12 " Values less than 32768 are reserved for future extensions" 20:22:26 do you mean _more_? 20:22:43 more? 20:23:02 greater I mean 20:23:46 0-255 stdout 256-511 stderr 512 close stdout 513 close stderr 514-32767 reserved 32768-?? custom 20:23:52 or is it Values >513 and < 32768? 20:24:02 ah yes 20:24:36 0-255 are also less than 32768, so you might want to be more precise ;) 20:24:53 feel free to clean that part up.. it's a wiki 20:25:21 ok, if you aren't editing it now... 20:30:06 1107 bytes already... bloody bloatware! {^Raven^}, i'm not sure whether to thank you or to curse you for bringing that contest to my attention 20:30:28 what contest? 20:30:36 golfing? 20:30:45 i want to golf! 20:31:02 * kipple hands jix a driver 20:31:30 jix: http://www.geocities.com/dunric/advcomp.html 20:32:57 hmmh 20:33:01 my english isn't that good 20:33:47 a german text adventure.. would be a lot easier for me (even tho the german grammar is horrible) 20:34:35 well, engrish has its charms too :) Just think of Zero Wing 20:35:22 zero wing? 20:35:44 "All your base are belong to us!" 20:35:48 ah ^^ 20:36:07 someone set us up the bomb... 20:36:18 what happen? 20:36:45 may i use other platforms than those on the page? 20:37:08 jix: you'd have to ask the person holding the contest 20:37:35 i 20:37:35 i'm thinking of a COSMAC ELF II 20:37:43 heh. 20:37:59 well, if there's a free emulator... there's always a chance 20:38:02 with a 1802 cpu 20:38:20 http://www.tinyelf.com/ is for mac os x 20:39:38 away 20:45:28 that's an interesting contest. though the rules are a bit confusing... 20:47:59 yeah 20:48:24 i wonder how much abuse they'll be subject to. 20:49:12 is linux an allowed platform? 20:49:59 I guess they'll have to be lenient with the rules 20:54:50 -!- sp3tt has quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.68a [Firefox 1.0.4/20050511]"). 21:08:03 <{^Raven^}> i am assuming that *any* programming language is acceptable 21:08:17 <{^Raven^}> as long as...etc 21:09:18 <{^Raven^}> cpressey: I'm still on paper 21:12:29 <{^Raven^}> cpressey: I'm going to max mine out at 2,899 bytes. I wish the organiser would decide on a definate limit with no leeway 21:14:09 <{^Raven^}> *definite - bah 21:17:48 <{^Raven^}> it says that the listed platforms include what is allowed but doesn't state the competition is limited to them only 21:23:55 in what languages are your adventures? 21:25:17 i've finished 99 bottles of beer in whirl: http://page.tokigun.net/obfuscation/file/99bottle.wr 21:25:52 tokigun: yay 21:26:09 <{^Raven^}> for this I am using BBC BASIC, was tempted to use 6502 but BASIC is more efficient 21:26:54 maybe i'm going to use ti-89/92(+)/v200 basic 21:27:04 or chipmunk basic 21:37:53 -!- Keymaker has joined. 21:38:05 'ello 21:38:12 tokigun: good job! 21:38:40 ;) 21:39:07 i'm writing a letter to author... 21:39:14 cool 21:53:38 cpressey: what programming language are you using? 21:57:59 -!- calamari has joined. 21:59:23 hi calamari 22:00:18 Keymaker: http://sparcs.kaist.ac.kr/~tokigun/dev/whirl99bob.txt 22:00:20 moin calamari 22:00:31 my Whirl assembler script ;) 22:00:36 hello calamari 22:00:38 wow 22:00:47 it is just a script.. but it helps me a lot 22:00:58 yeah.. confuses me a lot 22:02:38 so, that's the code you feed for your whirl assembler and it generates the 01 stuff? 22:02:43 yes 22:03:02 ok. btw, is the assembler available? 22:03:18 this script is assembler 22:03:35 oooh 22:03:38 main function is whirlasm, whirlasmtable. 22:04:13 first it assembles the given code, using whirlasm() 22:04:14 hey, is that python? 22:04:16 yes 22:04:19 ah 22:05:03 then it generates table that program uses, using whirltable() 22:05:10 yes 22:05:26 hi key, jix & toki :) 22:05:29 table is translated to whirl psuedo-code, using whirlasmtable(). 22:05:31 calamari: hello ;) 22:05:43 toki... in Korean it means "rabbit". ;) 22:05:55 :) 22:05:58 anyway... 22:06:18 program psuedo-code and table psuedo-code is combined, 22:06:34 and assembled again using whirlasm. 22:06:39 be vewwy vewwy quiet.. I'm hunting wabbits! 22:06:40 ok 22:06:46 so, the assembler could be used for any other program as well, when changing stuff inside p = r""" .... """ to some other..? 22:07:29 Keymaker: yes, but there are many restrictions. 22:07:37 ok 22:08:00 jix: assembly language 22:08:20 currently my assembler cannot preserve ring state... i.e. selected ring, selected instruction of each ring, direction of each ring. 22:08:33 rabbit gun? 22:09:13 cpressey: for what cpu/computer? 22:09:18 lament: hmm 22:10:01 lament: "-gun" is suffix in Korean/Japanese... 22:10:20 it has some nuance... eh... i don't know how to explain it. :S 22:11:00 Keymaker: so i have to arrange ring state manually... /0, /1, !blah/blah command is used for this reason. 22:11:11 jix: 286/MS-DOS 2.0 22:11:11 ok 22:11:38 maybe some 386 instructions if i get lazy :) 22:11:49 cool, that script was written tomorrow :) 22:12:25 calamari: what script? :) 22:12:39 whirl99bob.txt 22:12:47 ah ;) 22:13:04 it is 6:13 am Monday here. 22:13:15 :) 22:13:25 early riser 22:13:41 i don't think he has even gone sleepin' 22:14:00 Keymaker: gave him the benefit of the doubt :) 22:14:14 :) 22:14:18 i have exam in 9:00 am, 11:00 am... so i didn't get to sleep ;) 22:14:36 heh 22:15:46 I stayed up way too late last night working on that java gui.. barely made it to church this morning 22:16:18 :) 22:23:46 -!- jix has quit ("Banned from network"). 22:58:58 yes! i'm at 1011 instructions now.. 22:58:59 http://bf-hacks.org/hacks/quine.b 22:59:24 i hope to break the 1000 limit soon (although not tonight) 23:01:10 good luck ;) 23:01:32 cheers 23:09:40 wow, bf quine 23:10:10 heh, my first weights 7000+ instructions 23:10:36 My quine written in Aheui - http://puzzlet.org/puzzlet/%EC%95%84%ED%9D%AC~%EC%BD%B0%EC%9D%B8 23:10:46 i've gotten ideas randomly, like for example doing something and then "hey, i could try that trick" and so on :) 23:11:00 wow 23:11:04 looks cool :) 23:11:24 and sounds crazy in Korean 23:11:31 heh 23:12:19 by the way how you get ideas while doing some other things? 23:12:31 you must be multi-threaded 23:12:31 well, dunno 23:12:34 hehe 23:13:06 that just happens. i'm doing something non-brainfuck related and then i get some idea i could try :) 23:13:26 can be that the language has modified my brains.. 23:15:21 probably. 23:16:16 i sometimes feel funge iterator points wander around in my brain 23:16:30 heh 23:16:35 or aren't they instruction pointers? 23:16:47 forgot what IP stands for 23:17:00 not sure 23:18:22 instruction pointer seems correct 23:22:20 -!- heatsink has joined. 23:22:41 cool mumbai is spelled correctly 23:23:08 what is that stuff? 23:23:36 ? 23:24:26 that package from mumbai 23:24:40 i don't get the line in topic.. 23:24:57 no se. 23:26:18 nose. 23:49:56 oh no.. i have dentist time today, in ~10 hours 23:50:06 :( grrrrrrh 23:50:17 well, good nite 23:50:20 -!- Keymaker has left (?).