< 1184371213 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example english tends to use the word 'the' more often than other languages :) < 1184371213 0 :test__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1184371304 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but i don't really concentrate on single words when readin < 1184371305 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*reading < 1184371364 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can always tell which language it is if i actually logically derive it from a word in the sentence, i just find it weird it doesn't automatically happen as i read the actual gist of the sentence in < 1184371374 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-in < 1184371596 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many languages do you know? < 1184371679 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know 2 well enough to think in them, plus 2 i can somewhat communicate with < 1184371689 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've read a bit of everything though < 1184371699 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it'll pass if you learn more ;) < 1184371703 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, i know my friend's language ZX3 pretty well < 1184371707 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, true :P < 1184371718 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :next japanese and spanish < 1184371725 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :japanese because... well everybody does it < 1184371729 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and spanish is sexy. < 1184371770 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a mi tambien me gusta el espan~ol < 1184371786 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tambien = also? < 1184371789 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1184371808 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and japanese... i could learn the language but i have no hope of completely learning and understanding the culture.. so what's the point? < 1184371811 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that whole structure is a bit strange to me, but i understand that much :P < 1184371829 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should all just speak the same language < 1184371835 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, a learned language is a learned language, who needs another reason than that. < 1184371847 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: and play with imaginary ones like spanish. < 1184371849 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then we could build a tower to heaven < 1184371854 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: well, what would you use it for? < 1184371873 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: to be able to read japanese literature, simply knowing the language is not enough < 1184371884 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need to understand all the cultural references < 1184371906 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is true of every language, but japanese culture is just so... alien < 1184371915 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: there aren't really any cultures i know that well. < 1184371955 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i watched a japanese movie recently, and then read an overview of what happened there, and i basically missed everything :) < 1184371959 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i think i *could* read japanese literature by learning the language < 1184371962 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1184371964 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because of not knowing the culture) < 1184371976 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you specify what exactly you misunderstood? < 1184372012 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, the low caste of the main character could be deduced from the fact that he used to work as a shoemaker. < 1184372027 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the main character holds a high position in a shoemaking company) < 1184372101 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the key concept there is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burakumin < 1184372114 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he holds a high position there, but is still low caste? < 1184372147 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quoting that article: < 1184372148 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Akira Kurosawa made a political statement by having the main character work as a shoe industry executive who rose from humble origins as a simple leather worker, clearly implying (to Japanese audiences) the main character's burakumin status. < 1184372165 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously that was completely lost on me < 1184372209 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you read literature and constantly miss things like that, that's not really "understanding" < 1184372223 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just learning the language is not enough :) < 1184372228 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't understand anything like that no matter what i was reading. < 1184372250 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would certainly catch more references to western culture, since you live surrounded by it. < 1184372253 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i don't think you can make a political statement in english except explicitly. < 1184372294 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, for example you could make the leading character black. < 1184372315 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't notice. < 1184372322 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a character is a character :\ < 1184372333 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are black leading characters rare? < 1184372354 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's less of an issue these days < 1184372368 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is *something* an issue these days? < 1184372373 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, okay, child porn < 1184372377 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's also illegal. < 1184372386 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of things are issues < 1184372388 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, basically nothing is a statement of any kind. < 1184372389 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184372397 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i wouldn't know < 1184372402 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please enlighten me :) < 1184372403 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which country do you live in? < 1184372430 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finland < 1184372443 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could make a statement by making the main character sexually deviated < 1184372443 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have no idea what the issues in finland are :) < 1184372459 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would you notice if the character were a Muslim of Russian descent? < 1184372477 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a sexually deviant muslim of russian descent < 1184372487 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hardly ever pay attention to stuff like that when reading < 1184372507 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :authors rarely put stuff like that at random < 1184372514 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's there, it's there for a reason < 1184372524 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not always, of course) < 1184372532 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do they give characters names then? < 1184372541 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never remember those, and they aren't important < 1184372547 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :names are often important. < 1184372567 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how? < 1184372573 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: i never remember a name, and i remember details like religion if they are somehow important in the events of the book < 1184372623 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: sometimes it refers to a specific trait of the character. < 1184372640 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't think there's anything tabuish anymore, anywhere in the western countries. < 1184372647 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if tabuish would be the same as issueish. < 1184372658 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: sexuall deviancy < 1184372669 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, no. < 1184372671 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: are you nuts? < 1184372681 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, as i said, you can't rape a child, anywhere < 1184372687 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's all i can think of that's bad < 1184372696 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: "bad" is not the same as issues < 1184372724 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :negrophilia is okay on tv, in books you can even tell details about it without even mentioning it in the cover or smth < 1184372729 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: perhaps not < 1184372738 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really know < 1184372742 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that cultural < 1184372747 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i watch family guy all day long. < 1184372748 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1184372752 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you expect < 1184372763 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either you are trolling, or are really stupid < 1184372778 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not trolling, perhaps i'm stupid < 1184372789 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where was i being stupid? < 1184372805 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :family guy consists almost entirely of cultural references. It's all about "present-day issues". < 1184372816 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but i don't get those < 1184372817 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1184372826 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i laugh at the characters < 1184372831 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: well < 1184372839 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: you'd be able to appreciate japanese literature in the same way < 1184372846 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklokok: but it's a fairly shallow understanding < 1184372856 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i don't want to know anything that deeper in any cultures :) < 1184372865 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't realize popstars etc were culture < 1184372866 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wish to be ignorant? < 1184372869 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :errr < 1184372874 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about some stuff, yes < 1184372903 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want to remember stuff about sportsmen and musicians writing worse music that me < 1184372905 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*than < 1184372913 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1184372919 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, worse music than better musicians < 1184372926 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you heard about 9/11? < 1184372930 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1184372935 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would you catch a reference to 9/11? < 1184372938 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately < 1184372944 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's an "issue" :) < 1184372985 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, you've convinced me somewhat < 1184372997 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i doubt i'd miss anything i'd care to have understood. < 1184373136 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be central to understanding the actions of the characters. < 1184373153 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so without understanding the reference, it would seem that the characters are acting irrationally. < 1184373176 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've watched anime, they seems pretty rational :\ < 1184373216 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for the fact they get excited about everything and otherwise show emotions, but that also happens in series in the us < 1184373246 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, for example, a difficult decision could seem simple and obvious to you < 1184373258 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a decision taken by a character) < 1184373271 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you don't know where the difficulty lies, not knowing the culture. < 1184373326 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see what you mean, but i don't believe that would disturb me < 1184373354 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sometimes you could misinterpret the actions completely < 1184373364 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do believe, of course, that i wouldn't understand what's happening, but the only thing i do *not* enjoy in a book is when it's predictable < 1184373377 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, somebody in irc saying "im smrt" is a reference to the simpsons < 1184373381 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love david lynch's movies, and i don't understand even the stuff most people do :) < 1184373392 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could misinterpret it as them not knowing how to type < 1184373397 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and thinking they're smart... < 1184373406 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: i've seen every episode of simpsons 1-3 times, and i didn't know that < 1184373413 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except if it was in a very new episode < 1184373432 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184373437 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was that an example? :D < 1184373452 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, it's not really from simpsons is it? :D < 1184373459 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is. < 1184373462 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh :| < 1184373470 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm bad at understanding anything, really < 1184373473 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from where? < 1184373484 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at some point homer says "I'm smart! S-M-R-T!" < 1184373500 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, weird you'd remember that :| < 1184373514 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he misspells a lot of words in the course of the series :) < 1184373533 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, i actually remember him shouting that now < 1184373547 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good that my hours watching them weren't a complete waste. < 1184373563 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not only i remember that, but i haven't actually seen that episode. < 1184373570 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh :D < 1184373571 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just know the reference, because it's pretty common. < 1184373580 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184373605 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never seen it elsewhere < 1184373642 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, being in finland you don't have to catch all the references to american culture :) < 1184373642 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel, tv series and science books are my only source of english, though, that might be a reason. < 1184373650 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1184373670 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's an example of how not knowing the culture could lead you to misinterpret stuff < 1184373696 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :books by serious writers often have detailed commentaries that list and explain all the references < 1184373711 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184373711 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(eg james joyce is impossible to read otherwise) < 1184373713 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's cheating < 1184373718 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1184373756 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't read a line of joyce < 1184373768 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i learned the name playing an irc-trivia :) < 1184373795 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would say that the culture almost _is_ an aspect of the language itself < 1184373815 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it affects the meaning of what you say < 1184373944 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but i find it a lot less crucial than you, obviously :) < 1184373954 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you are smarter than me, so you are probably right. < 1184373973 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(try and beat that argument!) < 1184374022 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What *is* all that waffle? < 1184374979 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzzzzzzzz < 1184375114 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: actually, about the 911 reference, fg has a whole episode about a plane crash, with at least a few 911 jokes, it took me 3 watchings of that episode to understand them < 1184375115 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: Being in America, it's hard to catch all the references to your own culture. :p < 1184375158 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, actually, i wouldn't understand a 911 joke unless it was obvious like hell < 1184375232 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just a quick remark) < 1184375572 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION assumes it's clear that kok/pol are the same thing < 1184376321 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is aware < 1184377872 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is also aware of his *severe* laziness towards actually designing a game to go with his engine < 1184377936 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is lazier than you < 1184377970 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really? < 1184377973 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prove it. < 1184378060 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what've you done during the last 7 hours? < 1184378074 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wake up. < 1184378076 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i haven't. < 1184378078 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184378080 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's all? < 1184378088 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've chatted on this chan < 1184378089 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang out on IRC. < 1184378091 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's it. < 1184378098 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184378105 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you walked? < 1184378112 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did one trip to the kitchen < 1184378126 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I walked from the bed to the computer to the kitchen and back to the computer. < 1184378161 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, this may not sound as amazing until you realise that I woke up at noon. < 1184378196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i woke up 16:00. < 1184378226 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Noice. < 1184378244 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I stand corrected: you barely win. < 1184378256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1184378293 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did learn the periodic table last night < 1184378310 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not always lazy, but when i am, i own at it < 1184378315 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ought to go around and pimp his Brainfuck game engine for a bit. Claim to have done *something* with the day. < 1184378325 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the last 6 hours i've been planning to open family guy < 1184378330 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not open. < 1184378374 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, finishing ankos might also fit in the last 7 hours, i don't really know when i read it < 1184378386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hours pass by so silently < 1184378419 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the time there's no chatter anywhere, you know what a pro idler does then? he idles. < 1184378445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when i'm not creating these great monologues, i usually sit and stare at the still screen < 1184378461 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when the screen saver gets on, i click a button < 1184378798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, i didn't actually learn the whole table, just all the abbreviation/name hashes < 1184385466 0 :GregorR-L!n=gregor@c-76-27-232-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184388802 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had an idea for a language recently, called "TER", which stands for To Every Rule. < 1184388869 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :logic, flow control and variables would all be synthesized around an Exception-based model. < 1184388914 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea came to me while reading some absolutely hideous code that used TRY...CATCH blocks woven deeply around its logic. < 1184389185 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thoughts, anyone? < 1184389195 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this idea worth writing a spec for? < 1184389195 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa. < 1184389246 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that something reasonably elegant in terms of flow control could be constructed around this concept < 1184389247 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1184389273 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet, at the same time, using the language would be a painful ordeal, which is generally a positive trait in esolangs < 1184389277 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: How goes the Smalltalking? < 1184389288 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recently got an idea for an esolang based around unit testing. < 1184389302 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where flow control is acheived through the successful execution of a bunch of tests for individual units. < 1184389324 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have made no progress with smalltalk in the last two days. Crypto + helping teach a class to middle-schoolers = tired rodger < 1184389364 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to write a tutorial titled ``Learn Smalltalk for Lispers!'' heh. < 1184389396 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: hm. I wonder if you could write something like that in an existing debugging system's commandset? < 1184389401 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: Write a tutorial titled "Learn Lisp for Tclers!". < 1184389412 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's your job, TCLer ;) < 1184389422 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm writing a tutorial for writing games. < 1184389438 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: I don't know Lisp. ;) < 1184389446 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: o_O < 1184389463 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: A question -- what's the advantage of using the State practice pattern over a large case statement? Modularity? < 1184389476 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Yeah. Aim it for the experienced non-game programmer. < 1184389487 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I realized the other day that the most intuitive way to explain object oriented programming to kids could be teaching them to play human-pong, and then using that model throughout rebuilding the system in code. < 1184389488 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too many idiot tutorials for learning how to write games out there. < 1184389504 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the BSD Robots model more. < 1184389512 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you played BSD Robots? < 1184389532 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've played RoboWar for the mac and Corewar. Similar? < 1184389533 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ought to write "Writing Adventure Games in Brainfuck (using pebble)" < 1184389534 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1184389543 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not at all RodgerTheGreat. < 1184389557 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: It's a very simple game, and perfect to implement in any new language. < 1184389571 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of those weird examples which can utilize almost every language's special strengths. < 1184389575 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, the premise: < 1184389588 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're a player, and you're in a room (a grid) with a bunch of robots. < 1184389596 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make a paper that basically outlines the most important concepts and algorithms that you have to know cold for game programming. Things like using the state-machine model, types of collision detection, things you can do with timing and velocity, basic AI routines, etc < 1184389658 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll assume familiarity with a language, and give examples in Java, without relying on anything major from the API. < 1184389681 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can move in the four cardinal directions, but robots can as well. Every step you take, the robots will get closer to where you were on the preceding turn. The object of the game is to maneuver such that the robots crash into each other. When one robot crashes into each other, it turns into a piece of trash. If you collide with a piece of trash or a robot, the game ends. If a robot collides with a piece of trash, it becomes on tras < 1184389681 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h in that same spot. < 1184389689 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may conclude with some detailed Applet coding tricks, too, because they can be hard to come by these days < 1184389713 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: ah. The original arcade game like that is called "Robotron" < 1184389728 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's one last thing: the player has a special ``teleport'' command, which telports you to a random point -- unfortunately, it can teleport you on top of a robot or outside of the field. In which case, you lose. < 1184389739 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another version, in which you are Doctor Who, armed with a hypersonic screwdriver, is called "Daleks" < 1184389763 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's very well suited to objects, IMO. < 1184389773 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never played with a teleport that could send you outside the field. :S < 1184389786 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree with a lot of developers that Smalltalk teaches OOP methodologies better than Java (because it's easy to learn, and OOP). < 1184389786 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you play a more evil version than I do, it would appear. < 1184389802 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the BSD version :P < 1184389833 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java is less pure than Smalltalk, but it's more readily accessible, and the API makes it more immediately useful to people that want to write things like games < 1184389836 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also it's nice to teach, because the transition from ST to Java is very small. < 1184389870 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java's like C implemented on top of ST, minus ST's syntax. < 1184389870 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for the whole "WTF is a primitive again?" thing. :) < 1184389883 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. But the class hierarchy is almost exactly the same. < 1184389892 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So are the methods and generics, and *everything*. < 1184389924 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java's design seems roughly based on the idea of starting with C++ and fixing it. It's good, but there's only so far you can go with just another curly-bracket language < 1184389952 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Sun had a lot of ST investments back in the day. < 1184389958 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1184389966 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hurry up and learn :3 < 1184389979 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're dedicated, you can probably finish that book in 2-3 hours (Smalltalk by Example). < 1184390011 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll stop by the library tomorrow and see if they have a copy. < 1184390030 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Curly-brackets can work pretty well for a language. < 1184390038 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plof == :) < 1184390052 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer square brackets. :D < 1184390059 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOGO and Bullet for the win < 1184390127 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Square brackets? You'd love Tcl, then. < 1184390150 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bullet's syntax is best described, currently, as looking like a mixture of LOGO and Verilog, with a pinch of COBOL mixed in. < 1184390158 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've got your quote marks, curly brackets, and square brackets *right here!* :p < 1184390177 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://brotherhood.twilightparadox.com <-- The cult thing is weird, it's on myspace (ewww), but read. < 1184390184 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mechanics of the language are a little C, a little Java, and a little LISP < 1184390196 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: I linked you to it in the section of free books. < 1184390211 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like dead trees, damnit < 1184390221 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, when I'm learning a language < 1184390225 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We all do, but good luck finding the dead tree :P < 1184390253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :set var 0;puts [list "This is a quick example! $var" {See? $var won't be expanded here.} [expr $var ? "This won't be output." : "This will."]] < 1184390277 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Outputs "This is a quick example! 0 See? $var won't be expanded here. This will." < 1184390298 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the MTU library has a shitty fiction section, but damned if we don't have a good collection of CS texts < 1184390576 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the advantage of the State pattern over a case statement? < 1184390630 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1184390687 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have a finite amount of states which are determined by say, parser input of a stream, what advantages would the polymorphic state pattern have over just a large case statement? < 1184390724 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :polymorphic... state pattern.. erm. Hm. < 1184390737 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would that be something that intermixes state code or something? < 1184390771 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. I thought you had read the Design Patterns thingamabobber. < 1184390790 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here, an article says there's no point unless the case statement will be changed often. It won't here, so I may as well forego the state. < 1184390792 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back to Japanese. < 1184390805 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION rifles through safari windows for the design patterns thingamabobber < 1184391687 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's amazing how psychologically beneficial a pet can be, even if it isn't particularly "cuddly". < 1184391731 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find myself deeply attached to my Betta, who has been my constant companion since about halfway into last year. < 1184391867 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I force myself to wake up on crappy days to feed him. Perhaps that's what pets are good for- they give you a reason to uphold your daily routine, and give you something in your life that you can feel in control of. The positive feedback of keeping another living creature alive through diligent work and your attention satisfies something deepset. < 1184391956 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either that or humans have such a deeply ingrained nurturing instinct that we have difficulty self-actualizing without something to care for. < 1184391974 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some people like plants, some people like cats, I like my fish. < 1184392010 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1184392020 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you think, pikhq? < 1184392025 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if nurturing for a computer counts. :p < 1184392025 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Japanese is my reason for a daily routine. < 1184392043 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I lack a daily routine, although I could probably use one. < 1184392123 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personifying a computer can probably satisfy some of the needs I discuss, I suppose (Hey, I name my computers too), but I can't help but think that a living organism is better suited to the task. < 1184392147 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True. < 1184392182 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The laptop I'm typing on is named Indigo, but I talk about Alpha, my fish, a great deal more often by name. < 1184392218 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm on Frodo here. < 1184392274 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's reassuring to have his bowl on the desk, where I can turn my head for a moment to see him peacefully watching what I'm working on or occasionally flitting around to grab my attention and remind me it's feeding time. < 1184392325 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This reminds me- I need to name the powerbook 145 I rescued from a dumpster the other day < 1184392431 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my naming schemes are greek/roman/norse pantheon for servers and heavy-duty machines (like Hyperion, my ultra10) and colors for my personal computers (like indy here and Argent, my box back home.) < 1184392454 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"personal computer" maps to "macintosh computer" in this case < 1184392490 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my mom actually overlaps my color-name scheme- her laptop is named Aubergine < 1184392549 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=saru@222-154-161-215.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1184392559 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm on Yamayurikai. < 1184392641 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. I'm considering Vermillion, Saffron, Slate, Arsenic, Azure and Ultramerine < 1184392661 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This kernel is named Mariasama. < 1184392662 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does "Yamayuraikai" mean something in Japanese? < 1184392665 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The next one shall be named Kanako. < 1184392681 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ultramarine < 1184392686 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Mountain Lily Club. It's the name of the student council in an anime/manga/novel series I am absolutely *fangirl frothy* about. < 1184392688 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't believe I made that typo < 1184392704 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah- haha < 1184392726 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All my kernel names come from there too. < 1184392737 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My last one was Sachiko, and before that it was Touko? < 1184392760 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no. The one before Sachiko was Kashiwagi. The one before *that* was Touko. < 1184392764 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I gave a spare thinkpad to a friend of mine, she named it Gilliam, which I thought was clever < 1184392780 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: You name your *kernels*? < 1184392786 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Of course I do. < 1184392790 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my trusty Handera is known as Durandal < 1184392800 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Handera? I should name one Hanadera soon. < 1184392809 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION should probably do that. . . < 1184392813 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: the kernel is the soul of the machine, after all, as the CPU is the heart < 1184392817 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Hanadera is the name of the boys' school in conjunction to the girls' school that contains the Yamayurikai.) < 1184392823 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hunh < 1184392839 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The girls' school being called Lilian.) < 1184392864 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the Handera 330 was the last and greatest of the 68k line of palm-compatibles, and I love mine dearly < 1184392885 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hanadera has hot boys :P < 1184392904 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't stop laughing after I said that :D < 1184392924 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1184392965 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a service picture of Kashiwagi (the hottest guy in that series and one of the overall hottest anime guys ever) in boxers and t-shirt after he stepped out of a panda suit. < 1184392968 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monosugoi. < 1184392985 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, one of like 5 guys in the series, but I digress. < 1184393003 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(3 of whom are almost totally filler.) < 1184393040 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Having no experience with this series (for obvious reasons), the first thing that popped into my head was mechazawa from "Cromartie High", which now has ME laughing < 1184393058 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah. I'm not into Shounen stuff. < 1184393081 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cromartie is an absurdist comedy series < 1184393088 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. I know. < 1184393109 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Marimite (the shortened form of the anime's name Maria-sama ga Miteru) is pure shoujo, and has very little action or plot. Mostly character development. < 1184393115 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And social subterfuge. < 1184393125 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1184393236 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general, I'm a fan of shows that mix cool sci fi themes with a thoughtful storyline, like Bubblegum crisis Tokyo 2040, The Big O, Lain, Outlaw Star, Ghost in the shell and the like. < 1184393255 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good animation + science fiction = gold in my book. < 1184393271 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is generally a fan of good science fiction on dead tree. ;) < 1184393331 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've read my fair share of Asimov, Bradbury, Clarke, Stephenson and Heinlein- my father taught me well < 1184393353 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was taught by mother and grandmother. < 1184393397 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, animation appeals to my artistic interests, and it's more often that I have two hours to watch a movie than the time to read a book for fun. College doesn't really reduce your free time, but it sure chops it up into smaller pieces < 1184393443 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two hours? That's about enough time to get 1/4 to 1/2 of the way through. . . < 1184393446 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like to spend all day and zip through half a novel, rather than spacing something out over weeks- when I start, I must finish < 1184393479 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(feels like it, at least) < 1184393504 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When a friend introduced me to the Sandman series, I devoured all 11 volumes in less than a week, and I didn't get a lot else done. :) < 1184393525 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dad hates SF and my mom thinks it's weird gibberish :P < 1184393532 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<:/ < 1184393549 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only person resembling me in my family line is my grandfather the ``nutty'' professor. < 1184393568 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could either of them appreciate Dune or Ender's Game, at least? < 1184393573 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course not. < 1184393589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My grandmother's the one who got me into Ender's Game. . . :) < 1184393590 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can't even stand politically correct gay jokes on TV :P < 1184393599 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<:( < 1184393624 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also blame her for my introduction to Heinlein. < 1184393641 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My mom's to blame for McCaffrey and Asimov. < 1184393655 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My father gave me ender's game when I was in middle school (this was shortly after I finished 1984), and it resounded deeply with me. < 1184393683 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I discovered Ender's Game in my grandmother's bookshelf. (I believe it was the first paperback printing) < 1184393702 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it was the first bit of serious sci-fi I read. . . < 1184393727 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dune was one of my first. < 1184393750 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :before that, mostly Asimov and Bradbury's lighter stuff- short stories and the like < 1184393789 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've only been getting into Asimov's lighter stuff fairly recently. < 1184393797 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There will come soft rains" is still one of my favorite Bradbury stories < 1184393802 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Bradbury? I've really only read Fahrenheit so far. < 1184393812 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I need to find more Bradbury stories. :( < 1184393813 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1184393832 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "The feeling of power" was bradbury, right? That one is outstanding. < 1184393848 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Feeling of Power is Asimov. < 1184393860 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And one of his greatest short stories, IMO. < 1184393876 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think The Last Question is Asimov's best. < 1184393922 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'd be tied between "The 10000000 names of god" and "The feeling of power" < 1184393958 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please somebody tell me they remember "There will come soft rains". < 1184393973 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Tick-tock, seven o'clock! Time to get up, time to get up!" < 1184394022 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hasn't read "The 100000000 Names of God" < 1184394030 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, god. I remember that one now. . . < 1184394039 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was hidden in one of my English textbooks. < 1184394042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brilliant. < 1184394054 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's about the monks that have spent centuries writing out the 10 million names of god in books < 1184394071 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, they buy a computer to help speed the job < 1184394074 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I find it odd that some English professors deride science fiction, while publishing it in their textbooks) < 1184394083 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol- indeed < 1184394097 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I first read "The Smallest Dragonboy" in one, as well. < 1184394229 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although if you *just* read "The Smallest Dragonboy", it's hard to tell that it's sci-fi, not fantasy) < 1184394506 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer Fantasy over SF. < 1184394580 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I, obviously, don't. < 1184394705 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To me, the difference between fantasy and SciFi is that in science fiction everything has a justification, backstory and explanation, if not explicitly. In fantasy, things are taken as given. Shadow of the Torturer, for example, is set in what appears to be a mideval era (actually later revealed as post apocalyptic), but is most definitely Science Fiction. Dune straddles a very fine line between the two genres < 1184394855 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fantasy tends to stress more upon character development while SF focuses more on plot. < 1184394883 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is also correct < 1184394913 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer character development on the whole to plot. < 1184394920 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, not always. < 1184394933 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man, I wish "Programmer" was as impressive a title in the real world as it is in "The Feeling of Power" < 1184394970 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To some, it somehow brings up the idea of a grunt worker rather than someone a bit more. . . Creative. < 1184395048 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the capital P is what does it. "Programmer", rather than "programmer". < 1184395058 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1184395088 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to sound impressive, I like things like a "Program Architect" < 1184395107 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which brings with it connotations of meticulousness and care < 1184395517 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hacker" < 1184395602 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem with hacker, aside from media misrepresentations, is that it brings with it the idea of ramshackle, barely functioning creations pulled off with barely any tools or time < 1184395617 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a positive thing, but Hacking is rarely about elegance < 1184395627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: "hacker" implies either fugly creations, or wonderous artistry. < 1184395653 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using it as a title usually entails the artistry of your work. < 1184395660 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's about shrewdness and intuitiveness in problem solving, not clarity and perfection of the end result < 1184395668 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hack can describe elegant < 1184395698 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll concede that, yes- hacking could generally be described as doing a traditionally mundane job in an artful fashion < 1184395768 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such a shame that the word has been misapplied. < 1184395796 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true. < 1184395851 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pioneers in the "field" of cybercrime were and still are hackers, but to claim that that is the only realm of the hacker is tremendously disappointing. < 1184395889 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can't help but think that the hackers who do commit crimes do so for reasons other than money < 1184395900 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do it because the challenge is there < 1184395904 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1184395930 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the difference between petty thieves and hackers. The motivation, not the methods < 1184395942 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i still think breaking into a computer can be a hack < 1184395952 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, of course < 1184395976 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it requires novel approaches to problems, problem solving, dedication < 1184395977 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd call the work on breaking DRM schemes a case in point. < 1184395990 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1184396001 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The motivation is the desire to actually own your stuff, and, of course, because you can. < 1184396014 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's no different from the whitehats working to secure networks or patch memory leaks in firefox. < 1184396015 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both are obvious motivations for a hacker to get to work. :) < 1184396040 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: In some cases, it's the same people. < 1184396047 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I believe) < 1184396049 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the phrase that has *always* rung true for me is "What I cannot create, I do not understand" < 1184396069 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cannot help but agree. < 1184396070 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus, the nonlogic motto- "reinventing the wheel for fun" < 1184396081 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whitehats are lame < 1184396084 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun, but at the same time thrilling discovery < 1184396091 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is part of the fun. < 1184396225 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discovery is the intersection of fun and learning < 1184396353 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Discovery is your mom. < 1184396382 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm sorry but, that chance just *couldn't* have been let down.) < 1184396386 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come one < 1184396398 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck, i hate it when i make typos < 1184396412 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really, i expect better from you < 1184396511 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi: you are incorrigible < 1184396543 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :second'd < 1184396575 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everybody knows that Discovery is Daft Punk's greatest album < 1184396597 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is listening to Harder, Better, Faster, Stronger by Daft Punk from Discovery < 1184396605 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: I just had to spoil the moment, that's all ;P < 1184396612 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1184396628 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION decides to download that album for no reason < 1184396689 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was merely pointing out that you could spoil the mood in a somewhat less stereotypical manner, and potentially gain an even better non sequitur < 1184396724 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: I highly recommend it < 1184396913 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 15 minutes i will be in musical bliss, then < 1184396928 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever listened to Daft Punk? < 1184396938 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never < 1184396952 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you ever listened to any House music? < 1184396966 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :small amounts < 1184396973 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you like it? < 1184397028 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhat < 1184397058 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signs are highly encouraging that you'll enjoy Discovery < 1184397088 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION puts his magic 9-ball back in his pocket discreetly < 1184397434 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww, i've only got a magic 8-ball :( < 1184397434 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you like it, do the world a favor and buy it. < 1184397460 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways, i came up with a unique esolang today < 1184397461 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreaseMonkey: don't feel bad, the 9-balls were actually limited release factory defects. < 1184397465 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got mine on sale. < 1184397483 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it still black? < 1184397506 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it a colour with a stripe? < 1184397527 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had a standard 10-ball :D < 1184397547 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but occasionally it comes up with an irregular fortune like "Fuck you" or "I was lying earlier. OR WAS I?" < 1184397567 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can be unsettling at times < 1184397613 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if you can have an quine in english < 1184397643 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"please write this entire sentence, exactly, on another sheet of paper." < 1184397651 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, I think that one's a virus. :S < 1184397657 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops. < 1184397659 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was inspired by "i'm not going to dignify that with a response, other than 'i'm not going to dignify that with a response'", which is obviously incorrect < 1184397670 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1184397673 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a good one < 1184397826 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, finished downloading < 1184397998 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on an unrelated note, I am once again making progress in my RPG project. Observe the new indoor tiles in action: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1184374760-lab.png < 1184398132 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=406 < 1184398147 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1184398214 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=408 < 1184398257 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been reading questionable content from the beginning < 1184398268 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did that a while back. good times. < 1184398304 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eugh. today's woot is really expensive for what it is: < 1184398305 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.woot.com/ < 1184398324 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a standard socket set for $40? < 1184398340 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those cost like $25 in a store, and these are in no way special < 1184398342 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel cheated < 1184398363 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I almost bought the R/C minicopter for $20 yesterday. < 1184398370 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably should've. < 1184398544 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :sebbu < 1184398677 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, g'night everyone < 1184398700 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1184398803 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the singing, if you can call it that, is pretty cool in this song < 1184398811 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Harder, Better, Faster, Strong < 1184399049 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.paulgraham.com/thist.html < 1184399999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1184400000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1184400236 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa! < 1184400240 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=452 < 1184405572 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1184408810 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :☹ gnight ☹ < 1184408819 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1184410310 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-080-228-189-135.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1184417878 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.81.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1184422424 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"reboot" < 1184423088 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1184423670 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-20-213.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1184427972 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@122.46.183.20 JOIN :#esoteric < 1184430076 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1184430092 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-080-228-179-011.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1184430296 0 :puzzlet_!n=puzzlet@122.46.183.20 JOIN :#esoteric < 1184431077 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1184431505 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: It's singing via talk box. < 1184432190 0 :ehird`!n=test@user-514f618c.l4.c3.dsl.pol.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1184434870 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1184437190 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there an abstraction eliminator somewhere? < 1184437197 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1184437202 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't take that long to make though < 1184437216 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: on my webpage < 1184437232 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll use that for checking, but i'll make it myself first < 1184437235 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(modified from the one in the unlambda distribution) < 1184437273 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually you probably rather want the latter, mine uses d heavily for optimization < 1184437285 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d? < 1184437291 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language or? < 1184437297 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlambda's delay operator < 1184437303 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay < 1184437317 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm actually just doing ski :) < 1184437324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guessed so < 1184437348 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gonna make something big first, then learn the basics < 1184437368 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'all are insane. < 1184437390 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d is to prevent eagerness? < 1184437396 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Call me up when you write a language which compiles to Brainfuck, and end up doing two rewrites of it. :p < 1184437406 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are all mad here. I am mad. You are mad. < 1184437452 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1184437595 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah i see ho you'd use that < 1184437605 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though i don't actually know how you use d < 1184437616 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`di returns i unevaluated? < 1184437622 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.ca/619342 I can't believe this is what PEBBLE used to look like. . . < 1184437623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1184437629 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ii returns i unevaluated < 1184437631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err no < 1184437645 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err guess i don't know anything. < 1184437662 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`d expression returns the expression unevaluated < 1184437685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: can you show me some pebble code? < 1184437703 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm too lazy to open the game engine i have on my hd < 1184437707 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: You want a short example, or a long one? < 1184437712 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looong < 1184437718 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but one i can see in the browser < 1184437731 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me get PFUCK out. < 1184437804 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.ca/619346 < 1184437862 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, quite pretty < 1184437868 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but back to unlambda < 1184437880 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay, back to the ski. < 1184437888 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blues skis < 1184441590 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-232-125.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1184441604 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi everyone < 1184441724 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Lo. < 1184441738 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo-z. < 1184441746 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Found Smalltalk by Example at your local library, RodgerTheGreat ? < 1184441763 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually just woke up. :) < 1184441772 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow o_O < 1184441812 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I was up until ~3am my time, and it is now 2:30pm my time < 1184441821 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is also a weekend < 1184441850 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My normal sleep time is 3 AM -> 7 AM on non-summer, and 3 AM -> 8 AM on summer. < 1184441876 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I value my sleep. < 1184441906 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't require 8 hours, but I tremendously enjoy it (or 11 hours) when I can get it. < 1184441914 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Booorrriiing :P < 1184441931 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like Reelaaaxiiing < 1184441977 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My normal sleep time is "From collapse to getting up". < 1184442176 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even with my sleep hours, I don't have enough time to do everything I want to do. < 1184442309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd need to sleep about -500 hours per night to be able to do everything i want to do. < 1184442333 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, i'd like to walk to japan right now and then continue my unlambda < 1184442346 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's actually more like -100000 < 1184442365 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need the ability to stop time to get everything I want to do done. < 1184442386 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead, if i did walk there now, that'd take a big chuck of my life, < 1184442391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-, < 1184442898 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is t3h bored. . . < 1184442919 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the pikhq of boredom... < 1184442939 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There will be. . . STACKFUCK. < 1184442963 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it never occurred to me that you could pronounce his name like that < 1184442971 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a fascinatingly oblique pun < 1184442972 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shit. Done already. < 1184442975 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds like a kind of group sex < 1184442991 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where one person has less fun < 1184442995 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Who? < 1184442998 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, two < 1184443026 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: how would you pronounce it? < 1184443039 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the head node and tail node would in theory receive 50% of the experience of the interspersed nodes < 1184443061 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: pick-h-q < 1184443090 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost like pikachu < 1184443098 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: "Peek-h-q" is my preferred proununciation. < 1184443119 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was 8, and a fan of Pokemon at the time I came up with the nick. . . And I've just not stopped using it since. < 1184443135 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1184443166 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's better than "PokeMonMaster51187" or somesuch < 1184443191 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was at least *sane* when I was 8. ;) < 1184443224 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1184443284 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of my projects at the time was to make a Pokemon clone. . . I was a sucky programmer, so I never finished, though. < 1184443318 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you were a sucky programmer at the age of 8? < 1184443322 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what :| < 1184443327 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1184443342 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1184443349 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-that < 1184443365 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1184443376 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was gonna write something but decided not to :) < 1184443384 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then accidentally pressed enter < 1184443391 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://rodger.nonlogic.org/games/CRPG/ < 1184443421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made a qbasic formula 1 game when i was 8 < 1184443429 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was straight from a book though, for the most part: ) < 1184443437 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just added points and stuff < 1184443441 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :score < 1184443449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had just barely gotten player movement working. < 1184443462 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrays were too hard for me to understand, iirc :DD < 1184443491 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember even finding a mention of them until I moved on to non-BASIC languages. < 1184443494 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess that was due to the fact 8-year-olds aren't generally that good with reading examples from a book < 1184443500 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Ah, Tcl. . . :D) < 1184443542 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I at least *think* Tcl was the first one that I was serious about coding in; before that, I'd mostly done pointless toys. < 1184443550 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just knew basic and c at that time, and i was too scared to touch c < 1184443567 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got a copy of QBASIC for dummies and learned a fair amount from that, and then a lot really clicked for me later while reading the DarkBASIC manual < 1184443573 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still hasn't made anything but pointless toys < 1184443576 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't truly learn C until very, very recently. < 1184443579 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1184443603 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah. I'd done Javascript long before Tcl. Created some somewhat useless but 'serious' scripts in it. < 1184443628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure what you mean by serious < 1184443649 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I, uh, am no longer sure what I meant by it either. < 1184443746 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the definition of "serious" is constantly revised as we become progressively better programmers < 1184443788 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm certain that all of us can look back on ourselves even a year ago and find ourselves now to be tremendously better at coding. < 1184443871 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I did a year ago involved something more than 100 lines of code being outstanding. . . < 1184443900 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I've done a hell of a lot of coding in the past year, and didn't do quite so much previously) < 1184443916 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never written a long program really, but i can't really think of anything that requires a long code < 1184443926 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually it's redundant stuff people get it long with < 1184443975 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiler. < 1184444013 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anything with a GUI gets pretty long without really requiring a ton of effort < 1184444023 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :games generally get pretty complex, too < 1184444039 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most things can be done under a few thousand lines < 1184444258 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My torrent client is already at like 500 lines, and it's just the parser and the structure :D < 1184444369 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other thing to remember is that the value of line count is heavily dependent on coding style. I tend to write things very densely, so most of my classes are only a few hundred lines long in complex cases < 1184444391 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use a lot of line breaks. < 1184444426 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seperate variable definitions from code with a line break, I seperate loops and conditionals from code with line breaks, in C I seperate malloc allocate/check blocks with line-breaks, etc. < 1184444543 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually only use line breaks to indicate a "hole" in code where I'm still working or to break up method definitions for different types of tasks. < 1184444566 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :much of my code organization is based on vertical arrangement of methods in a sensible fashion < 1184444575 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@c-24-5-40-52.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184444615 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compilers get long, true < 1184444623 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and guis, but guis i never make for that reason :) < 1184444633 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GUIs? Long? < 1184444638 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :generally, contructors-code that is important to the functioning of the class-accessors and oneliners-"utility routines" that I might want to copy-pasta later on. < 1184444644 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i've done c mostly < 1184444649 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they like to get lonf < 1184444650 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*long < 1184444750 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tcl == short GUIs. < 1184444751 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1184444788 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tk == My eyeeeesssss < 1184444790 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1184444811 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pack [button -text "Hello, world!" -command exit] < 1184445037 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly, Tk would be nicer if it used GTK or Qt widgets on Unices. . . < 1184445114 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone implemented a ski evaluater in thue? < 1184445123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tktable.sourceforge.net/tile/index.html I bet something could be done with this. < 1184445220 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remind me to not evaluate ...sii..sii with the javascript thue interpreter again.... < 1184445234 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: haven't seen one < 1184445251 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so i haven't wasted 1hour of time.... < 1184445269 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone should make a listing of all eso->eso translation < 1184445275 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*translations < 1184445289 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: there is such a list on the wiki for interpreters < 1184445299 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: you made it in one hour or you made it for one hour, then thought there might already be one? < 1184445308 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: indeed < 1184445310 0 :ihope!n=ihope@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184445317 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i completed it and it took me one hour... < 1184445324 0 :RedDak!n=dak@host115-89-dynamic.16-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it JOIN :#esoteric < 1184445327 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i thought i should ask in here whether someone else did that.... < 1184445332 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#haskell and #esoteric: the pair that something can probably be said about. < 1184445399 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1184445426 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: can i see the interpreter? < 1184445823 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no there is still a bug in there :/ < 1184445923 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i wrote an abstraction eliminator once < 1184446094 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1184446262 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can reduce ....s.k.si..s.kkix'x to .'xx < 1184446269 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any other test cases so i can find potential bgus? < 1184446272 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*bugs < 1184446313 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf sntax is tat? < 1184446316 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. is unlambda ` ? what is ' ? < 1184446329 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x is one var 'x is another one ''x yet another one < 1184446361 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thue source would have been very large if i'd add x y z or something.... < 1184446406 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S(K(SI))(S(KK)I)ab would be the standard syntax < 1184446457 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parsers elude me < 1184446473 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1184446566 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i shouldn't use that javascript interpreter... < 1184446628 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my python interpreter is clever enough to terminate ```sii``sii after a while < 1184446675 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it do infinite loops in 2 seconds? < 1184446685 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, chuck beats it. < 1184446845 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try ......s..s.kski..s..s.kski..s..s.kskix'x < 1184446950 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nargh sometimes i get deadlocks even with my example < 1184446969 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my ski reducer does an infinite loop in about...3 seconds < 1184446984 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: it can't do any infinte loop in 3 seconds.... < 1184447002 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it can < 1184447035 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no that's impossible < 1184447089 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it's 4.7 seconds, sorry < 1184447119 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time echo -e '```SII``SII\n:q' | python ski_repl.py < 1184447125 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m4.714s < 1184447275 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i give up.... < 1184447283 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: but that is just one infinte loop < 1184447314 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could write a program that infinte loops if some large number is prime and it doesn't if it's not prime... < 1184447326 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you are saying you can do a prime check in constant time.... < 1184447350 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :write it in combinatory logic and we'll find out < 1184447354 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^ < 1184447395 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you claim to solve the halting problem... which is impossible < 1184447434 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the halting problem is impossible for turing machines, sure < 1184447439 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't mean it;'s impossible for everything < 1184447453 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: i'm pretty sure bsmntbombdood is aware of that :) < 1184447462 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yeah probably.... < 1184447569 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.madore.org/~david/programs/unlambda/ how the hell do you use the multiplication in there? < 1184447580 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either it doesn't work or my interpreter is flawed < 1184447665 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually it does work < 1184447673 0 :oklokok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my keyboard, however, does not. < 1184447721 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it disconnected < 1184447722 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird < 1184447757 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get database errors quite often when browsing the wiki... < 1184447811 0 :GregorR-L!n=gregor@c-76-27-232-8.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184447823 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's quite annoying < 1184447835 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we all do < 1184447899 0 :ttm!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1184447948 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1184448008 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"They eat birds. They eat mammals." "We're mammals." "Yeah we are." < 1184448018 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"They"? < 1184448123 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red-tail boa constrictors. < 1184448128 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is watching Dirty Jobs :P < 1184448149 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was constricted by a boa constrictor once < 1184448171 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've got an SKI interpreter. . . Which detects infninite loops? < 1184448180 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either it doesn't always do so, or you're a god. < 1184448196 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it just detects expressions that take longer than n reductions to reduce < 1184448225 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1184448246 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: He wouldn't have to be a god, he would just have to have discovered and implemented a theory of computation that's higher-level than Turing Completeness. < 1184448255 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or rather, more powerful than a Turing Machine. < 1184448261 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR-L, Isn't it the same thing? < 1184448266 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1184448266 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...and implemented it < 1184448279 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: Hence "discovered and implemented" < 1184448287 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1184448288 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird`: Well yeah, but I thought the later was more clear :P < 1184448307 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not known that there is no higher model of computation < 1184448313 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: Did you make the infinity machine?!?!? < 1184448350 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinity machine? < 1184448384 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/infinity.html < 1184448515 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR-L: And implemented. . . On a finite state automaton. < 1184448534 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: He only said he had an interpreter, not that it ran on a standard computer. < 1184448570 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He wrote it in Python, and interpreted it on a UNIX box. Ergo, probably an FSA. < 1184448599 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP DESTROYING MY HAPPY FANTASY WORLD < 1184448695 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's for InfiPython, and has version checks to run as well as it can on a real computer, though lacking its most important (and infinite) feature. < 1184448722 0 :Figs!n=Figs@ip72-220-174-159.sd.sd.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184448729 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.softwaredeveloper.com/features/ghosts-in-machine-071207/ < 1184448731 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1184448746 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An article on 12 languages that never took off < 1184448776 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(considering their choices for some of them, I question whether they really thought they were meant to be used as practical languges O.o) < 1184448785 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brainfuck and Befunge, for example... < 1184448804 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brainfuck/Befunge are not "serious" languages < 1184448807 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This /is/ #esoteric < 1184448820 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm talking about the article I posted the link to < 1184448822 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1184448832 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been here before ^.^ (though not much recently) < 1184448865 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you guys might like the article, so, voila! I'm here! < 1184448881 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Figs, you taught me paint hacks < 1184448882 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1184448896 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oklopol :) < 1184448896 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"try programming in brainfuck for about 15 minutes, but anything beyond that and the damage to your cerebrum might be irreversible." oh, that's why i laugh manically. < 1184448902 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1184448949 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still working on my language -- rewriting the regex library in C++ for the umpteenth time :) < 1184448962 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid article writer < 1184448998 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, ++ < 1184449003 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if it was meant to be serious or not ;) < 1184449010 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it is < 1184449015 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of them are < 1184449026 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's a pretty terrible article. < 1184449027 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but others look like they just put them in there for the wtf factor < 1184449140 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the content could just as well be "LOL, LOOK AT THESE LANGUAGES, ISN'T IT FUNNY HOW THEY'RE NOT PRACTICAL OR WERE FADS ONCE AND THEN SUCKED??? HAHAHAHA" < 1184449157 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also haskell doesn't belong on that list. < 1184449165 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and delphi, most certainly not - it's huge < 1184449179 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't finished reading the article actually ;P < 1184449227 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nearly half of these languages are esolangs- this article is ridiculous < 1184449268 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR-L: that infinity machine isn't super turing i don't think < 1184449271 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually the objections to haskell seem valid, if poorly presented < 1184449274 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VRML isn't even a programming language! < 1184449297 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a hard language to learn. < 1184449305 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you aren't familiar with the concepts.) < 1184449312 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: Sure it is. All you have to do is infinity { runMyTCProgram(); halted = 1; } if (halted) { ... } else { ... } < 1184449330 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1184449331 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...perhaps i didn't read hard enough < 1184449435 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, it can run infinity instructions in 2 seconds < 1184449447 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird`: Only 15 minutes to go insane? < 1184449456 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weak. < 1184449460 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1184449460 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is super-turing. you could, for example, run an operation on every non-negative integer < 1184449465 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 2 seconds. < 1184449518 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: It can run infinite instructions in finite time. Ergo, it can solve the halting problem merely by running a program until it either halts or infinity passes by. < 1184449545 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, I don't think I'd ever heard of REBOL before this article O.o < 1184449553 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if I'd heard of it, never knew what it was < 1184449573 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe that there is no halting problem on the Infinite Machine; the same solution for Turing machines is also valid for itself. < 1184449574 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rebol is pretty well known < 1184449591 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be, but I didn't know about it. < 1184449612 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some sci-fi along these lines: http://qntm.org/responsibility < 1184449617 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(super-turing) < 1184449649 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, you've seen this, right? < 1184449650 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.xs4all.nl/~weegen/eelis/analogliterals.xhtml < 1184449739 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1184449742 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it < 1184449744 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1184449763 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1184449772 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most code editors would royally suck at making the 2d literals, though < 1184449800 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the 3d ones would be more annoying ;) < 1184449811 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Figs, use befunge syntax highlighting < 1184449816 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, wait. < 1184449819 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1184449821 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd be 2d < 1184449833 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, 3d is even worse < 1184449860 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't actually have to write it vertically though < 1184449868 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just write it all in a line ;) < 1184449907 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5d? < 1184449930 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION still thinks that he ought to write a Dimensifuck editor sometime. . . < 1184449934 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would 5d be a grid of cubes or something? < 1184449953 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: you can represent it that way < 1184449985 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1184449989 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it would be interesting to have to program in rotations of a cube < 1184450037 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, each cube would have 12 functions.... < 1184450046 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending which edge is facing forward < 1184450092 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an esoteric visual language, hmm? < 1184450103 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh! < 1184450132 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking of 6 functions, for each face, taking the rotation of the face as a parameter from 1-4 < 1184450146 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it so that the cubes vibrate at certain frequencies depending which side is up, and you have to balance the interference between multiple cubes you put in a pool of water and "gates" that execute functions < 1184450189 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like a very complex version of noit o' mnain worb. < 1184450200 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be. I don't know what that is :) < 1184450238 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme see if I can find a description- it's a pretty obscure one < 1184450259 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, bingo: http://www.esolangs.org/wiki/Noit_o'_mnain_worb < 1184450323 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did i read that "noir's normal form" < 1184450342 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :massive dyslexia? < 1184450344 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1184450390 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha :) < 1184450398 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have got to design something based on that idea < 1184450422 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you had a typo :D < 1184450434 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps with the ability to add compression < 1184450440 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that i can say "this whole pressure block is henceforth called 'x'" < 1184450468 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest taking the basic mechanisms of worb and trying to make it more practical for the creation of useful circuits and the like < 1184450471 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: lol < 1184450484 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would you make a timer in a system like that? < 1184450509 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Figs: a loop with something that generated output in response to the loop being in a particular state < 1184450535 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe add some kind of high-level "remote gate switching" or "remote spawning" capability < 1184450583 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184450596 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about making a language where ! is a pulsator < 1184450606 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you put 'o's around it < 1184450616 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and when a signal hits a o < 1184450628 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it causes any !'a next to it to emit a pulse < 1184450633 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1184450647 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can use ^>, v, < in that order of remainders? < 1184450807 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just thinking directly opposing forces cancel first < 1184450814 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1184450821 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worb sounds great < 1184450830 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gee, I could have a lot of fun with this < 1184450835 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should really read the wiki through < 1184450839 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, your solution may yield less undefined behavior < 1184450852 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://catseye.tc/projects/worb/doc/worb.html < 1184450863 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1184450863 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ that is a much more detailed description < 1184450874 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we also need one way one way mirrors < 1184450886 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be useful < 1184450915 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use / and \- they always generate a pulse in the original direction and in the reflected direction < 1184450942 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. i still like Mover < 1184450949 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think / and \ should be general mirrors < 1184450954 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rotating 90 degrees < 1184450964 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie, for / < 1184450966 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if ! simply generated a pulse in all directions when hit, it would auto-cancel the originating direction < 1184450969 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you come in > it goes ^ < 1184450973 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < goes v < 1184450979 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you could use o as a signal "absorber" < 1184450979 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ goes > < 1184450991 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, o obsorbs and activates whatever it touches < 1184451000 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might be better than one way mirrors < 1184451024 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non premade characters allow for the definition of new constructors in a space < 1184451025 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agreed- just use ! with an arrangement of o around it to block unwanted pulses < 1184451040 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, what I was thinking was for the xor gate < 1184451053 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a one way mirror < 1184451075 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie, if you hit it from one direction, it reflects < 1184451078 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the other, it goes through < 1184451087 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1184451094 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about $ < 1184451096 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'll bbiab- food < 1184451105 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vertical would be allowed through < 1184451113 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :horizontal would bounce < 1184451120 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no! < 1184451120 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better < 1184451123 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use ( and ) < 1184451140 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie, *) bounces back <-- < 1184451141 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1184451148 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :)* keeps going <-- < 1184451176 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip72-200-73-175.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184451216 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, < 1184451222 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other way around makes more senes < 1184451224 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sense < 1184451227 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*) --> < 1184451235 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :)* bounces --> < 1184451246 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from up/down, it'd just absorb < 1184451268 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hitting from both sides at the same time would only return one pulse < 1184451277 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1184451291 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, this will be fun to write < 1184451297 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# is a wall < 1184451312 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ would be an input or output < 1184451346 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well just say components have hyper time < 1184451359 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are executed as a single step in higher constructs < 1184451420 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION needs some help with writing a regexp. . . < 1184451430 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I suck at regexps) < 1184451463 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to get something which matches either a digit or "." < 1184451475 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[.+-0] < 1184451477 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1184451481 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[.0-0] < 1184451482 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[.0-9] < 1184451492 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^^^^^ < 1184451525 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never actually used regexes though < 1184451609 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://regexlib.com/CheatSheet.aspx < 1184451727 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. . . Never mind. The bug I was having wasn't even in my various attempts at a regexp. < 1184451738 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*All* my attempts matched correctly. -_-' < 1184451865 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1184451873 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pERL? < 1184451877 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err... *Perl? < 1184451883 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tcl id guess < 1184451887 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1184451913 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip72-200-73-175.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1184451939 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ehird is right. < 1184452016 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does he win? :) < 1184452027 0 :ehird`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an infinity machine < 1184452048 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DIY invisible notebook kit < 1184452063 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's invisible, and you can't feel it either! < 1184452071 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your secrets are _utterly_ secure :) < 1184452088 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From LotsOfCrap2k Technologies! < 1184452131 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need a duplicator < 1184452133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to complain. My dog ate my invisible notebook! < 1184452152 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You said nothing about smell) < 1184452202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Figs: ask Oklo{pol,kok} < 1184452211 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1184452222 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He looks fairly duplicated to me < 1184452224 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Oklo{pol|kok} < 1184452237 0 :Oklo{pol|kok}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1184452245 0 :Oklo{pol|kok}!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Figs < 1184452270 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about % < 1184452276 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a good re-emiter? < 1184452294 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you hit it, it shoots out *'s in every other direction < 1184452303 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# will be walls < 1184452317 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you hit a wall, the pulse gets destroyed < 1184452349 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a pulse enters from a side with multiple @'s < 1184452356 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is created at each at < 1184452363 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*at each @ < 1184452463 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#@@# < 1184452463 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@%%@ < 1184452463 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@%%@ < 1184452463 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#@@# < 1184452476 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a simple program to re-emit any pulse < 1184452481 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in all directions < 1184452973 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm back < 1184452978 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :howdy, calamari < 1184453004 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should limit the lifetime of a particle to 10,000 steps < 1184453282 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should write a program using only water and vacuum in two dimensions, assuming that the water can't change phase or volume. < 1184453293 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or any of its other properties, really, except pressure and velocity. < 1184453326 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if I do this (dunno if I will, just fun to think about) < 1184453338 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just make it pulses < 1184453348 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easier to think about for me to write the system ;) < 1184455532 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-89-167.w81-49.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1184455535 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Good night" < 1184455596 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"I'm quitting... Bye all" < 1184456449 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"@+" < 1184456645 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1184457356 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figured out how to make a timing circuit! < 1184457363 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> % < 1184457386 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once fired, it will emit pulses every 4 steps < 1184457421 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :012 FIRE! 012 FIRE! ... like that < 1184457439 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 1 2 3 Fire! < 1184457443 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you prefer to think that way < 1184457488 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :012 FIRE! -> OMG FIRE < 1184457489 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1184457511 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i seem to really have a newfound dyslexia < 1184457567 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1184457576 0 :Figs!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://rafb.net/p/4vrzsK64.html