←2007-07-19 2007-07-20 2007-07-21→ ↑2007 ↑all
00:00:27 <Figs> Yes
00:00:33 <Figs> sure it can
00:00:47 <Figs> that's why I suggested it
00:01:01 <Figs> but I doubt it'd be particularly easy to do from scratch
00:01:09 <pikhq> Probably not.
00:02:29 <ihope> Has anybody written a pattern description language to give to Conway's Life universal constructors?
00:02:36 <oerjan> it would be cool if the life state was shaped like a giant numeric display
00:02:44 -!- liber has left (?).
00:04:19 <ihope> If how?
00:05:34 <oerjan> like the final result of the calculation was shown as the final pattern of cells
00:05:57 * ihope nods
00:18:18 <pikhq> It's not even been proven that a universal constructor is possible in Life. . .
00:18:48 <pikhq> Or, for that matter, a replicator.
00:22:33 <Figs> bbl
00:32:52 <bra|ket> i bet they aren't
00:33:56 <bra|ket> er, a universal constructor is disproven, nothing can construct the gardens of eden
00:34:10 <bra|ket> similarly, nothing can replicate them either, since that would involve constructing them.
00:36:29 <bra|ket> unless "universal constructor" means something else?
00:38:12 <pikhq> A replicator is a pattern which creates itself.
00:38:29 <pikhq> A universal constructor would be a device which can create anything, given appropriate instructions. . .
00:39:15 <pikhq> I'd say a universal constructor *is* impossible in Life, since garden of eden patterns are in existence.
00:39:22 <pikhq> A replicator, though? Might be possible.
00:39:38 <ihope> Not truly universal.
00:39:40 <pikhq> Maybe a constructor which can create anything which has a previous pattern. . .
00:39:52 <pikhq> Yeah, it wouldn't be universal.
00:39:56 <ihope> A universal constructor is something that can build anything that can be built.
00:41:29 <pikhq> Otherwise, I'd call it a universal constructor. ;)
00:41:55 <ihope> An as-universal-as-it's-going-to-get constructor.
00:42:04 <pikhq> So, it could build everything but garden of eden patterns. . .
00:42:11 <ihope> Or, if you think that's clumsy, a limit-universal constructor.
00:42:11 <pikhq> Hmm./
00:42:11 <pikhq> So, no proof.
00:42:13 -!- Figs has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
00:42:20 <ihope> What about the successor of a Garden of Eden?
00:42:47 <pikhq> That depends: can those be built by other patterns?
00:43:01 <ihope> Maybe.
00:44:10 <pikhq> It's not been proven either way. ;)
00:47:59 <bra|ket> this is like proving properties about "programs except those which don't halt"
00:48:40 <bra|ket> well, no, that one is actually very useful :)
01:41:09 -!- Figs has joined.
01:41:19 -!- sebbu has quit ("@+").
01:57:08 <RodgerTheGreat> how about taking the biochemistry approach here- identify a specific number of "molecules" (gliders, stable patterns, etc) to use in the construction process. Then just make a machine that can make any arbitrary arrangement of said elements
01:57:48 <RodgerTheGreat> or were you guys interested in a UC more as a theoretical construct than a useful one?
01:58:18 <oerjan> i recall something considered about building anything that can be done starting with gliders
01:58:51 <RodgerTheGreat> well, glider collisions are generally how you make stuff in Life.
01:58:59 <oerjan> possibly with the gliders coming from an arbitrary large distance
01:59:23 <pikhq> You can make stuff from other of the spaceships. . .
01:59:58 <RodgerTheGreat> pikhq: ah, yes- I was using my terminology incorrectly. By "glider", I meant any self-moving pattern
02:00:05 <pikhq> Ah.
02:00:23 <oerjan> my comment was about gliders proper
02:00:38 <RodgerTheGreat> gliders can be quite versatile
02:00:44 <oerjan> afair
02:01:00 <RodgerTheGreat> are there reliable methods for making glider "reflectors", if you get my meaning?
02:01:52 <ihope> Self-moving patterns are properly called spaceships.
02:02:02 <ihope> Gliders can be reflected easily, I think.
02:02:14 <RodgerTheGreat> ihope: I am aware of this- I forgot myself for a bit
02:02:19 <RodgerTheGreat> hm
02:02:21 * ihope nods
02:03:03 <RodgerTheGreat> I wonder if we could map any of the stream-deflecting 2d esolangs directly into Life
02:04:21 * SimonRC indicates the "Ladder" patterns
02:06:32 <bsmntbombdood> a turing machine with a finite tape is really just a FSM right?
02:06:39 <RodgerTheGreat> yeah
02:07:11 <ihope> RodgerTheGreat: we probably could.
02:07:49 <RodgerTheGreat> a something -> Life pattern could be very interesting
02:08:09 <RodgerTheGreat> a compiler, if you will
02:23:53 <Figs> boo!
02:23:58 * Figs is back
02:24:18 <oerjan> eek
02:24:45 <Figs> are you guys still talking about that life thing? :P
02:25:10 <oerjan> well the last comment before yours was about it
02:25:12 <Figs> hehe,
02:25:25 <Figs> yes, and I was surprised
02:25:39 <Figs> :P
02:25:45 <Figs> didn't think my topic would last so long
02:26:23 <DeviALT> Is there any science to setting the XP Pagefile to a fixed size relating to performance?
02:26:50 * Figs prods oklopol
02:27:08 <oerjan> is that a cattle prod?
02:27:21 <Figs> it's an okloprod
02:27:50 * SimonRC goes to bed
02:28:20 <Figs> cya
02:28:44 * Figs waves good-bye to SimonRC
02:29:02 <RodgerTheGreat> cya, SimonRC
02:30:19 <Figs> hehehehe, make a life <-> malbolge cross compiler :D
02:30:30 <Figs> in brainfuck
02:31:08 <oerjan> then, a brainfuck <-> malbolge cross compiler in life
02:31:16 <Figs> :P
02:31:26 <Figs> that'd be hard
02:31:58 <oerjan> and then, you can probably get a life <-> brainfuck compiler in malbolge automatically
02:35:13 <pikhq> Just make a Brainfuck > Malbolge compiler or interpreter, and I will worship you.
02:35:47 <pikhq> Same prize as for solving the halting problem for Turing machines in a Turing-complete system.
02:36:25 <pikhq> Hell, I'll even give you that prize for creating a halting oracle.
02:37:50 * Figs turns randomly flips the switch on the database server
02:38:03 <Figs> bwahaha! A halting Oracle...
02:38:42 <pikhq> Not what I meant. . .
02:39:00 <Figs> That's for the lawyers to decide :D
02:39:06 <Figs> :P
02:39:32 <Figs> "Yes, but in subclause 12.1.1 you said..."
02:40:20 <oerjan> *sigh*, worship is so expensive nowadays. unless you can sing or do sports.
02:41:06 <Figs> or not wear shorts.
02:43:04 * oerjan isn't wearing shorts.
02:43:41 <Figs> beware for your ports!
02:44:13 <oerjan> i have a firewall on.
02:44:13 <RodgerTheGreat> pikhq: but how are we supposed to *make* an Oracle? Turing made it pretty explicitly clear (as we could determine with a bit of logic) that an Oracle cannot be a machine
02:44:33 <RodgerTheGreat> wait, wait
02:44:42 <RodgerTheGreat> an Oracle is improbable
02:44:48 <oerjan> RodgerTheGreat: you are missing the point :)
02:44:50 <Figs> Rodger, you must give birth!
02:44:57 <RodgerTheGreat> if we can calculate *exactly* how improbable one is...
02:45:00 <Figs> yes, you!
02:45:04 <Figs> The chosen one...
02:45:12 <oerjan> Figs: an _oracle_, not a _miracle_
02:45:13 <RodgerTheGreat> feed it into a finite improbability generator,
02:45:26 * Figs gives rodger some tea
02:45:27 <RodgerTheGreat> provide a good brownian motion source
02:45:30 <RodgerTheGreat> bingo
02:45:51 <Figs> the probability is 42
02:45:57 <Figs> you can figure out the units on your own.
02:46:00 <RodgerTheGreat> and pow! I win the International Turing award for extreme cleverness
02:46:48 <Figs> we need a language called brainspunge
02:47:16 <RodgerTheGreat> and subsequently will be lynched by a mob of irate computer scientists who decide that what they *really* can't stand is a smartass
02:47:18 <oerjan> whence the sp?
02:48:00 <oerjan> all computer scientists are smartasses already
02:48:09 <Figs> use spoon
02:48:37 <Figs> Brainfuck + Spoon + Befunge = Brainsponge
02:49:13 <oerjan> i figured the others
02:49:24 <Figs> :P
02:49:26 <pikhq> Actually, you'd be celebrated, since all hackers are smartasses. ;)
02:49:33 <RodgerTheGreat> that too
02:49:36 -!- GregorR-L has joined.
02:49:57 <pikhq> Figs: When a contract is not sufficiently specific, the intent of both parties is considered.
02:50:59 <oerjan> lessee, if you have Spoon and brainfork, there should also be a brainknife?
02:51:28 <RodgerTheGreat> what about BrainHammer?
02:51:31 <Figs> yes yes, but you will still need a brainsponge to clean up all the mess from eating
02:51:45 <Figs> And a brainsink
02:52:24 <oerjan> BrainHammer sounds like a descendant of FYB
02:52:30 <Figs> FyB?
02:52:52 <pikhq> Brainscaple. ;)
02:52:54 <oerjan> with massive legions of fighting programs
02:52:57 <RodgerTheGreat> it's (brain)Hammertime!
02:52:59 <pikhq> Fuck Your Brain.
02:53:04 <Figs> oh
02:53:07 <GregorR-L> pikhq: WRONG SPELLINGZ!
02:53:08 <oerjan> Brane
02:53:11 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Fuk Yor Brane
02:53:20 <pikhq> GregorR-L: It's not my fault that you can't spell two words.
02:53:24 <GregorR-L> lol
02:53:26 <pikhq> And use "brane" in the wrong context.
02:53:37 <RodgerTheGreat> I made a BF-powered robot fighting game kinda like RoboWar
02:53:43 <Figs> http://tinyurl.com/2rfynx
02:54:01 <RodgerTheGreat> and then I realized what a shitty idea it actually was when I started trying to make warriors
02:54:11 <GregorR-L> Figs: Self portrait?
02:54:21 <Figs> lol
02:54:40 <RodgerTheGreat> the best I ever did was a bot that could kinda ram into other ones
02:54:56 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: nice use of "The Angles"
02:54:59 <Figs> Rodger, that's why you need GA
02:55:07 <Figs> The Angles? O.o
02:55:12 <Figs> I didn't take this
02:55:15 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
02:55:15 <Figs> I found it on wikipedia
02:56:23 <Figs> http://tinyurl.com/2jxotg
02:56:33 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: good point, but the main realization I had was that it was extremely difficult to provide robots with enough information about the world around them to make smart decisions or act out some kind of strategy
02:56:58 <Figs> heh :P
02:57:10 <Figs> isn't that kind of neat?
02:57:24 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: what pretty blue eyes
02:57:25 <Figs> it's a dragonfly's eye
02:58:10 <Figs> well, if you really want to know what I look like....
02:58:11 <Figs> http://tinyurl.com/yse8c9
02:58:14 <RodgerTheGreat> I have two favorite pictures on wikipedia: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/Lockheed_SR-71_Blackbird.jpg
02:58:37 <RodgerTheGreat> and this one: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0b/Z-machine480.jpg
02:58:52 <RodgerTheGreat> (which is much cooler in super-huge format)
02:59:25 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: lies and propaganda! I see only one fig there, not a pluralism!
02:59:35 <Figs> it's a close-up :)
02:59:41 <RodgerTheGreat> haha
02:59:42 <Figs> on my nose.\
02:59:44 <Figs> :P
03:01:50 <Figs> wow
03:01:54 <Figs> I had a weird idea
03:02:02 <RodgerTheGreat> this is a self-portrait I drew a while back in sharpie: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1182990062-SelfPortrait.png
03:02:28 <Figs> :P
03:02:31 <Figs> what's JE?
03:02:37 <RodgerTheGreat> my initials
03:02:45 <Figs> You mean ...
03:02:54 <Figs> You aren't really Rodger the Great!
03:02:57 <Figs> Impersonator!
03:03:01 <Figs> :P
03:03:22 <RodgerTheGreat> I like to think of it as my semi-secret identity
03:03:29 <Figs> lol
03:03:51 <RodgerTheGreat> when I roam the digital wild west as a caped-crusader, I'm Rodger The Great.
03:04:30 <GregorR-L> http://www.codu.org/Gregor.jpg < A self-portrait I made.
03:04:37 <RodgerTheGreat> nice
03:04:59 <RodgerTheGreat> I admire the subtlety of line quality you make use of here
03:05:06 <RodgerTheGreat> it's really quite a striking composition
03:05:28 <Figs> LOL
03:05:34 <Figs> :D
03:05:56 <pikhq> I admire how you declare a self-portrait of yourself as being made by you.
03:06:14 <Figs> o-|<
03:06:20 <Figs> that is my self portrait
03:06:25 <GregorR-L> pikhq: I only said it was a self-portrait I made, not that it was a self-portrait of me that I made.
03:06:34 <GregorR-L> pikhq: I could present you with a self-portrait somebody else made, but it wouldn't be of me.
03:06:38 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm bored. Does anyone want me to make them a cool avatar-thingey based on their face?
03:06:47 <GregorR-L> Sure 8-D
03:06:56 <RodgerTheGreat> source image.
03:07:02 <GregorR-L> http://www.codu.org/hats/Tyrolean-med.jpg
03:07:19 <Figs> {(8^o)-\<
03:07:25 <Figs> A slightly better self-portrait
03:07:26 <RodgerTheGreat> what rez are you looking for- 96x96 or 128x128?
03:07:40 <RodgerTheGreat> that's actually a fairly cool hat, I must say.
03:07:43 <GregorR-L> RodgerTheGreat: How 'bout 128x128 - I can always shrink to what I need *shrugs*
03:08:08 * RodgerTheGreat cringes at the thought of resizing pixel art
03:08:30 <Figs> lol
03:08:31 <GregorR-L> I don't know exactly what you're making, so I just guessed it would be resize-able :P
03:08:49 <Figs> it's a magic fish!
03:08:51 <Figs> ...
03:09:06 <RodgerTheGreat> haha
03:09:06 * Figs bursts into song
03:09:11 <Figs> Maaaaaaaagic Fish!
03:09:28 <Figs> MaAaAaAg-~~i~~~c FIIIIIIIIIIIiiiiiIIIIIIISH
03:09:30 <pikhq> GregorR-L: It's titled "Gregor", and it's on your website.
03:09:38 <pikhq> Obviously, it's a portrait of you. ;)
03:09:43 <GregorR-L> OK, good point :P
03:09:55 <Figs> Anthony and AnthonyG are != on this network :P
03:10:10 * RodgerTheGreat flies into action
03:10:11 <Figs> Gregor and GregorR-L do not have to be the same
03:10:17 <Figs> you can fly?!?!
03:10:27 <pikhq> But I know that www.codu.org is his website. . .
03:10:32 <pikhq> And that Gregor's his name.
03:10:47 <GregorR-L> And that there are about two other Gregor's in existence on Earth :P
03:10:49 <oerjan> of course he can fly. he's got a semi-secret identity!
03:11:16 <Figs> O_O
03:11:22 <Figs> Vehicular Homicide....?
03:11:30 <Figs> times...
03:11:31 <Figs> shit
03:11:32 <Figs> :P
03:11:41 <GregorR-L> Vehicular homicide times shit.
03:11:43 <GregorR-L> Oh kay.
03:11:59 <oerjan> i _think_ this goes beyond my mathematical abilities.
03:12:14 <Figs> you have remember to care the crap manually, otherwise you'll get an overflow error
03:13:41 <Figs> http://www.codu.org/badinsurance-2/ <<-- what is this, anyway?
03:14:12 <GregorR-L> Figs: Utterly random manipulated insurance quote :P
03:14:16 <pikhq> oerjan: Not really. All I need to do is figure out what the multiplication operator means in terms of the non-numbers.
03:14:25 <Figs> :P
03:15:27 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: of course I can fly. I'm a caped crusader on the internet, remember?
03:15:36 <RodgerTheGreat> after all, flying is pretty Great
03:16:01 <oerjan> those capes are _very_ aerodynamical.
03:16:45 <Figs> http://www.codu.org/eso/glass/
03:16:58 <GregorR-L> oerjan: Don't you mean Aero-Dynamic-Host-Configuration-Proticolable?
03:16:58 <Figs> 403
03:17:03 <GregorR-L> Figs: WHOOT
03:17:06 <RodgerTheGreat> oerjan: indeed. absurdly so.
03:17:33 <pikhq> RodgerTheGreat: Sorry, but only Cory Doctorow has a cape.
03:17:54 <oerjan> !glass {M[m(_o)O!"Hello, world!\n"(_o)o.?]}
03:17:57 <GregorR-L> Figs: Refresh.
03:18:00 <RodgerTheGreat> mine is metaphorical, so it's all good
03:18:02 <oerjan> !help
03:18:02 <pikhq> GregorR-L: Is there a badinsurance-1?
03:18:07 <GregorR-L> pikhq: There was once :P
03:18:18 <GregorR-L> pikhq: It disappeared in mysterious circumstances.
03:18:36 <pikhq> Permission requested to get something more evil.
03:19:56 <pikhq> Let's try to get a 10-year-old on that policy. . .
03:20:15 <GregorR-L> You do realize you have no reason to ask my permission? :P
03:20:21 <pikhq> I know.
03:20:32 <pikhq> More just declaring intent than anything else. :p
03:21:11 -!- calamari has joined.
03:21:20 <pikhq> It's squidman!
03:21:35 * Figs prods oklopol
03:21:40 <oerjan> ooh, two superheroes in one channel!
03:21:53 <Figs> FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT, FIGHT....!
03:21:54 <Figs> :P
03:23:31 <Figs> power metal cakepan O.o
03:25:34 <oerjan> for all your household negotiation needs?
03:25:46 <Figs> http://www.codu.org/omusic/?title=ale-power%20metal%20cakepan.mid
03:26:10 * RodgerTheGreat is listening to Chiron Beta Prime by Jonathan Coulton from Thing a Week
03:26:47 <GregorR-L> Figs: Apparently it's explore-Gregors-site day?
03:26:51 <Figs> :D
03:26:59 <Figs> Yes.
03:27:04 <Figs> Didn't you get the memo?
03:27:09 <GregorR-L> 'fraid not.
03:27:13 <Figs> O_o
03:27:13 <Figs> wtf
03:27:16 <GregorR-L> At least go to www.choosemyhat.com
03:27:19 <pikhq> GregorR-L: It comes up every once in a while.
03:27:26 <Figs> the writer monad page turned brown
03:28:01 <oerjan> there's a writer monad page on Gregor's site?
03:28:31 <GregorR-L> lol
03:29:23 <Figs> no
03:29:45 <Figs> ok, I voted for a hat for friday
03:29:46 <Figs> :P
03:31:39 <oerjan> no brown page here: http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/latest/html/libraries/mtl/Control-Monad-Writer-Lazy.html
03:31:45 <Figs> not that page
03:31:53 <Figs> http://www.haskell.org/all_about_monads/html/writermonad.html
03:32:09 <Figs> I guess I didn't know I scrolled down
03:32:15 <Figs> I've had it open for like, a week
03:32:25 <Figs> switched into it and was like WTF, brown?!
03:33:48 * pikhq attempts to do bad insurance from Progressive. . .
03:34:03 <pikhq> I'm claiming to have a paid-off Mustang, and a Model T I'm still paying on. . .
03:34:18 <GregorR-L> HAH
03:35:08 <Figs> ;P
03:35:11 <pikhq> I'm also putting a 7 year old on the policy.
03:35:18 <pikhq> And failed.
03:35:39 <GregorR-L> Heh
03:35:45 <GregorR-L> It only lets you put in /drivers/ :(
03:35:54 <Figs> lol
03:36:12 <pikhq> Hey! 7 year olds are legal in. . . Burbumskistan.\
03:36:31 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Progressive doesn't have policies in Burbumskistan :P
03:37:00 <pikhq> Shame.
03:37:18 <oerjan> that's not very progressive.
03:37:46 <Figs> lol
03:38:11 <Figs> is it bad I like "power metal cakepan"?
03:38:28 <Sukoshi> Don't listen to the Haskellites!
03:38:38 <pikhq> I also put an 88-year-old man as the child of a 15 year old.
03:38:41 <Sukoshi> They want to use you for their fiendish stateless reasons!!!
03:38:42 <pikhq> Yay, time travel.
03:38:42 <oerjan> Sukoshi: infidel!
03:39:17 <Figs> Sukoshi, but they keep the seperation between Church and state so well though...
03:39:19 <Figs> :P
03:39:38 <pikhq> Now for violations.
03:39:39 <bsmntbombdood> it's impossible to prove that a halting oracle cannot be built
03:39:44 <bsmntbombdood> i think
03:39:56 * Figs flips the database's on/off server
03:40:03 <Figs> hahahah!!! halting oracle
03:40:10 <bsmntbombdood> ha. ha.
03:40:23 * Figs drops dead for violating the laws of CS
03:41:10 <Figs> oh shit
03:41:15 <oerjan> bsmntbombdood: well it would require proving something about the physical world, which is impossible.
03:41:15 <Figs> I forgot the batteries
03:41:26 <bsmntbombdood> oerjan: right
03:42:09 <pikhq> Vehicular homicide *and* leaving the scene.
03:42:21 * oerjan is going to bed.
03:43:01 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night").
03:44:23 <Figs> these cheap earphones hurt
03:44:54 <bsmntbombdood> these moderately priced earphones don't
03:45:00 <bsmntbombdood> they even sound good too!
03:45:39 <RodgerTheGreat> GregorR-L: what do you think? http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1184899477-gregor.png
03:46:31 <GregorR-L> Deeuwd! It's meeee!
03:46:42 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: I actually thought the Church/state thing was a mildly clever pun. :)
03:46:46 <bsmntbombdood> did you draw that?
03:46:46 <RodgerTheGreat> GregorR-L: :D
03:46:49 <RodgerTheGreat> yeah
03:47:01 <GregorR-L> I think that me is a bit whiter than me :P
03:47:02 <RodgerTheGreat> and I used the original photo's background for added flair
03:47:53 <RodgerTheGreat> (original photo: http://www.codu.org/hats/Tyrolean-med.jpg)
03:48:10 <GregorR-L> That's so cool 8-D
03:48:58 <RodgerTheGreat> take it and be merry, GregorR-L
03:49:29 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm pretty decent with dithered black and white: http://rodger.nonlogic.org/art/Wumpus.gif
03:50:26 <bsmntbombdood> RodgerTheGreat: nice
03:50:31 <RodgerTheGreat> thanks
03:52:21 * RodgerTheGreat cracks his knuckles.
03:52:29 <RodgerTheGreat> who's next? :D
03:55:31 <pikhq> The fuck?
03:55:36 <RodgerTheGreat> ?
03:55:43 <pikhq> Somehow, increasing the coverage amount decreases my policy.
04:03:41 <RodgerTheGreat> hey, Sukoshi- would you like an avatar like the one I made for Gregor?
04:03:46 <pikhq> $15,999.00 is my current 6 month estimate.
04:03:54 <RodgerTheGreat> hm
04:04:07 <RodgerTheGreat> wait, coverage or cost?
04:04:15 <pikhq> That's cost.
04:04:22 <RodgerTheGreat> insuring what?
04:04:27 <pikhq> WE HAVE HIT $16,000!
04:05:12 <pikhq> A 1908 Model T and a Ford Mustang, with a 15-year-old driver with 3 homicides, 3 failures to report, 3 leaving the scenes, and 1 running from police. . .
04:05:33 <pikhq> His child is an 88 year old with 3 homicides, 2 failures to report, 3 leaving the scenes, and a misreport.
04:05:48 <RodgerTheGreat> lmao
04:06:57 <RodgerTheGreat> I'd almost want to buy that policy just to watch the insurance agent shit his-/her- self when they read the forms
04:07:25 <pikhq> Also, since I made up the names and addresses, that's without any credit at all.
04:07:49 <RodgerTheGreat> hm. Too bad you can't spoof some kind of horrific credit history
04:08:36 <RodgerTheGreat> "Declared bankruptcy 7 times in 3 states. Currently is over $120,000 in debt."
04:10:09 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: Maaaybe.
04:10:22 <RodgerTheGreat> <:D
04:11:06 <RodgerTheGreat> we aim to please, and will produce an image to whatever exacting specifications you desire!
04:11:46 <RodgerTheGreat> (we referring, of course, to myself and my army of enslaved leprechauns and pixies used in the generation of art.)
04:13:19 <pikhq> Good leprechauns and pixies?
04:13:24 <RodgerTheGreat> mostly
04:13:47 <RodgerTheGreat> I also have a puck, and he's a right bastard.
04:14:27 <RodgerTheGreat> amazingly fast with a xerox machine, though
04:14:44 <RodgerTheGreat> he can churn out photomosiaics like nobody's business
04:17:37 <Figs> hi
04:17:43 <RodgerTheGreat> hi, figs
04:18:17 <Figs> I was afk
04:18:18 <Figs> sorry
04:18:23 <Figs> did I miss much?
04:18:51 <Figs> oh, cool pick rodger
04:18:53 <Figs> *pic
04:18:58 <RodgerTheGreat> thanks, figs
04:19:10 <Figs> I should get you to do pixel art for my game... if I ever get around working on that engine
04:19:18 -!- Sgeo has quit ("Ex-Chat").
04:19:21 <Figs> got to finish this parser crap first :D
04:19:28 <Figs> one project at a time :PO
04:19:28 <pikhq> $16,781!
04:19:31 <Figs> *:P
04:19:33 <pikhq> Sorry.
04:19:36 <pikhq> $16,721
04:19:47 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Wowzers.
04:20:00 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: Sure. I've helped a number of people with graphics for their games over in ##Nonlogic
04:20:13 <pikhq> And now, let's add on a couple of DUIs. . .
04:20:59 <RodgerTheGreat> the most recent game I'm helping with is sortof a mario clone being coded by a guy named Merthsoft
04:21:16 <RodgerTheGreat> here's the ground tileset I whipped up for it: http://nonlogic.org/dump/images/1184878772-MonkeyTiles2.png
04:21:30 <Figs> cool
04:21:36 <Figs> want to take on my pic?
04:21:36 <Figs> Tiles2.png
04:21:39 <Figs> O.o
04:21:45 <Figs> wtf happened to my paste :P
04:21:55 <Figs> http://wiki.thecodebit.net/Image:Figs.jpg
04:21:58 <RodgerTheGreat> and an anim I did for the player: http://rodger.nonlogic.org/images/monkeyWalk.gif
04:22:18 <Figs> ah :P
04:22:27 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: sure thing. Any specific requests?
04:22:37 <Figs> Something I can use as an avatar for MSN/AIM
04:22:46 <RodgerTheGreat> what size would that be?
04:22:49 <pikhq> DUI, drag racing, without a license. :D
04:22:52 <Figs> let me check
04:22:59 <GregorR-L> pikhq: NOICE
04:23:28 -!- Tritonio has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
04:24:01 <Figs> 48x48 for AIM, 96x96 for MSN O.o
04:24:03 <Figs> I think
04:24:05 <Figs> hmm
04:24:07 <Figs> :P
04:24:21 <RodgerTheGreat> ok, I'll do my best
04:24:31 <Figs> one of them can be either double or half
04:24:34 <RodgerTheGreat> do you want it in color, grayscale or black and white?
04:24:41 <Figs> color could be nice :)
04:24:45 <RodgerTheGreat> okles
04:24:51 <Figs> muchos gracias :D
04:24:54 -!- Tritonio has joined.
04:24:58 <Figs> That pic is like 2 years out of date
04:25:02 <Figs> but it's the most recent I can find :P
04:25:07 <RodgerTheGreat> I guess I'll try to go for 48x48- we'll see what I can do
04:25:09 * Figs doesn't like to have his picture taken :P
04:25:10 <pikhq> GregorR-L: Does not having a valid license help?
04:25:25 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Idonno, I didn't try very hard :P
04:25:34 <Figs> put license suspended in 3 states :D
04:26:25 <pikhq> WOOHOO!!!!
04:26:28 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: I just listened to that midi file you posted- it's really cool
04:26:30 <pikhq> $20,617.00
04:26:33 <Figs> which one?
04:26:34 <RodgerTheGreat> what's it from
04:26:45 <RodgerTheGreat> pikhq: what felonies have you committed now?
04:26:57 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: "power metal cakepan"
04:27:05 <Figs> Gregor's site, I think
04:27:08 <pikhq> Just drag racing, DUI, and driving with suspension. . .
04:27:11 <GregorR-L> Written by a friend of mine.
04:27:11 <pikhq> Yesterday.
04:27:20 <RodgerTheGreat> cool
04:27:24 <bsmntbombdood> and i thought my car insurance was expensive
04:27:59 <Figs> add Grand Theft Auto
04:28:45 <pikhq> License status does jack.
04:28:54 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Weird.
04:29:11 <pikhq> I'm still putting it as suspended. >:D
04:29:22 <Figs> lol
04:29:57 <GregorR-L> pikhq: My assumption was that it would basically not count a suspended/expired/not-usable license since it would assume that was basically a non-driver.
04:30:13 <bsmntbombdood> someone has a bad algorithm
04:30:20 <pikhq> A suspended lets you get insured.
04:30:33 <pikhq> Expired/revoked/non-licensed does jack.
04:30:40 <Figs> +10 kudos if you can figure out what type of building I was in when that picture was taken :)
04:30:44 <pikhq> You can't go any further in the system.
04:30:53 <GregorR-L> Figs: Something VERY nerdy.
04:30:57 <bsmntbombdood> Figs: what picture?
04:31:04 <Figs> my picture
04:31:06 <bsmntbombdood> ...?
04:32:15 <Figs> scroll up bsmnt
04:32:25 <GregorR-L> I see two fans, a window and a nerd.
04:32:33 <Figs> haha :P
04:32:34 <GregorR-L> And a whiteboard.
04:32:50 <GregorR-L> Just looks like a living room to me.
04:32:51 <Figs> what fans?
04:32:53 <Figs> :P
04:33:01 <RodgerTheGreat> possibly a school building of some kind
04:33:07 <pikhq> $26,681.00
04:33:08 <Figs> Rodger: getting there
04:33:09 <bsmntbombdood> wtf is Figsies doing?
04:33:22 <GregorR-L> Figs: Reflection of a fan on the far left (may not be a fan), and something that looks like part of a fan on the right (may not be a fan)
04:33:23 <RodgerTheGreat> bsmntbombdood: it's this odd toy. Kinda like a yo-yo
04:33:28 <RodgerTheGreat> I've seen them before
04:33:36 <Figs> that's a boat, I think
04:34:07 <Figs> on the right, that's a very big antenna
04:34:24 <GregorR-L> Heh
04:34:30 * GregorR-L += fail
04:34:54 <Figs> the room is air conditioned :P
04:34:57 <Figs> so I know it's not fans
04:35:10 <Figs> and that thing's been hanging there for god knows how long
04:35:18 <pikhq> Now, to add a Pinto.
04:35:28 <Figs> but I think it can pick up a wifi connection from 26 miles away :P
04:35:33 <GregorR-L> lol
04:35:40 * bsmntbombdood += GregorR-L
04:35:41 <Figs> very narrow though :P
04:35:50 <GregorR-L> O_O
04:35:59 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: Are you propositioning me???
04:36:01 <bsmntbombdood> what's the L stand for?
04:36:03 * pikhq += PERSON_T_MAX
04:36:22 <GregorR-L> Laptop
04:36:43 <Figs> basically, it looks similar to this
04:36:45 <bsmntbombdood> use irssi + screen + ssh, stupid
04:36:57 <bsmntbombdood> do you want me to be propositioning you?
04:37:00 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: I did for a while, but that sucked.
04:37:01 <Figs> http://www.radiolabs.com/products/antennas/2.4gig/2.4grid.php
04:37:07 <pikhq> Lies.
04:37:12 <pikhq> irssi + screen = <3
04:37:25 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: People always thought I had been there for a while when I just joined, so I could never get joined into the convo properly.
04:37:31 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: Basically terrible in every way :P
04:38:00 <bsmntbombdood> i use irssi + irssi-proxy + ssh + xchat
04:38:24 <Figs> ok, I give up
04:38:32 <Figs> it's a physic teacher's office :P
04:38:40 <Figs> *physics
04:38:55 <Figs> it was also my computer science class room
04:38:59 <Figs> :P
04:39:14 <RodgerTheGreat> you kids and your "computer science classrooms"
04:39:21 <bsmntbombdood> i bet they didn't teach computer science!
04:39:25 <RodgerTheGreat> we have a shell server
04:39:35 <Figs> they didn't.
04:39:40 <Figs> :P
04:39:45 <Figs> They taught us networking
04:39:54 <Figs> and I self-taught myself some CS
04:39:59 <RodgerTheGreat> and it's named WOPR because our computer science department has some very oldschool nerds
04:39:59 <Figs> while working on that parser
04:40:03 <pikhq> $37,011.00
04:40:05 <pikhq> I win.
04:40:10 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Holy shmott
04:40:13 <bsmntbombdood> pikhq: that's a lot of moneys
04:40:13 <Figs> pikhq: that's more than my tuition
04:40:24 <Figs> :P
04:41:12 <Figs> I'm still listening to 'cakepan'
04:41:19 <pikhq> It's amazing what driving a Model T, a Mustang, and a Pinto can do.
04:41:31 <pikhq> $40,762.00 with a lower deductible.
04:41:48 <bsmntbombdood> what site bes this?
04:42:10 <bsmntbombdood> what is the plural of be, anyway?
04:42:49 <RodgerTheGreat> wow
04:42:59 <GregorR-L> pikhq: I would have never thought to add a Pinto :)
04:43:20 * RodgerTheGreat is listening to The Only One Left by Elwood 79
04:43:28 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: be
04:43:35 <bsmntbombdood> GregorR-L: no!
04:43:40 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: In the singular case, you use 'is'
04:44:18 <bsmntbombdood> silly GregorR-L, right grammar is for silly people
04:44:28 <Figs> bsmnt, are?
04:44:32 <bsmntbombdood> wait...
04:44:36 <Figs> sites are
04:44:39 <Figs> not bes
04:44:58 <bsmntbombdood> you guys are boring
04:45:07 <Figs> but
04:45:25 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: YOUR FACE IS BORING
04:45:31 <Figs> just for you, special $99.95 only, you can make the plural of Be into Ce today.
04:45:34 <GregorR-L> bsmntbombdood: BORING INTO THE SURFACE OF THE EARTH
04:45:35 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: what color would you say your eyes are- blue-grey?
04:45:38 <bsmntbombdood> no, it's so ugly as to be interesting
04:45:41 <Figs> brown
04:45:45 <GregorR-L> Heh
04:46:25 <pikhq> GregorR-L: Let's change the 88 year old to another teenager.
04:46:41 <GregorR-L> pikhq: First try >100
04:46:44 <GregorR-L> 115ish
04:46:49 <pikhq> Invalid according to them.
04:46:53 <GregorR-L> :(
04:47:14 <GregorR-L> So, no 300-year-old either? :P
04:47:18 <Figs> so, if I'm 115, I can't get car insurance without lying about my age?
04:47:26 <RodgerTheGreat> ok, lol- this picture sucks
04:47:45 <RodgerTheGreat> I zoomed way in, and they look blue-grey
04:47:48 <pikhq> I think you have to call it in.
04:48:25 <Figs> *Shrug* some people tell me they look hazel
04:48:26 <pikhq> $52,682.00!
04:48:28 <Figs> I call them brown :P
04:49:01 <GregorR-L> They're clearly ruby red.
04:49:05 <Figs> bwahaha!
04:49:17 <Figs> no. they're perl white :)
04:49:51 <Figs> yes, I am going to pun hell for that one :P
04:50:07 <pikhq> "This is what happens when you play GTA in what you *think* is VR."
04:50:15 <Figs> ...
04:50:16 <Figs> :P
04:51:04 <Figs> "Wow, the graphics are so good! How'd they make those special effects? That guys dialog still sounds fake though."
04:51:19 <Figs> guy's
04:51:22 <pikhq> I need somewhere higher rated for these people to live.
04:51:33 <Figs> Florida
04:51:46 <Figs> New York
04:51:57 <Figs> Louisiana
04:51:59 <GregorR-L> Cali-for-ni-a
04:52:10 <pikhq> Got a zip code in there?
04:52:13 <Figs> cali.for(ni -> a, !!)
04:52:19 <Figs> Hawaii?
04:52:24 <GregorR-L> http://www.google.com/search?q=california+los+angeles+zip+codes
04:52:46 <Figs> hehehe
04:52:52 <Figs> guess where that picture was taken
04:53:00 <GregorR-L> Hell, Michigan
04:53:09 <Figs> no
04:53:11 <Figs> wrong state
04:55:18 <Figs> welcome to the tackiest place on earth
04:55:18 <Figs> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d6/Breezewood%2C_Pennsylvania.jpg
04:55:19 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: what do you think of this? http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1184903649-fig.png
04:55:34 <Figs> pretty good so far
04:55:34 <GregorR-L> Figs: >_O
04:55:40 <GregorR-L> Figs: That picture makes me want to die
04:55:45 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
04:55:54 <Figs> I've been there
04:56:15 <Figs> roadtrip from DC -> Pittsburg
04:56:19 <RodgerTheGreat> it's pretty much done- I'm not sure what else you want
04:56:36 <pikhq> $76,943.00
04:56:42 <RodgerTheGreat> haha
04:56:44 <RodgerTheGreat> what now?
04:56:53 <Figs> O_O
04:57:15 <Figs> pikhq, see if you can make it top a CEO's pay :D
04:57:18 <Figs> (any CEO's)
04:57:22 <Figs> (not every)
04:57:36 <RodgerTheGreat> well, you already beat steve jobs, not counting stock options
04:57:43 <bsmntbombdood> RodgerTheGreat: that's awesome
04:57:49 <RodgerTheGreat> thanks, bsmntbombdood
04:57:55 <pikhq> $79,218.00
04:58:28 <bsmntbombdood> whoa
04:58:37 <RodgerTheGreat> well, Sukoshi- have you made up your mind yet? :)
04:58:52 <Figs> OUCH
04:58:54 <Figs> note to self
04:58:59 <pikhq> I think I'm done.
04:59:01 <Figs> don't drop chair on crotch
04:59:05 <Figs> it hurts >.<
04:59:08 <RodgerTheGreat> eep
04:59:16 <RodgerTheGreat> I empathize with your pain
05:00:00 <Figs> that rate is more than I have made in my entire life
05:00:10 <RodgerTheGreat> haha- same here
05:00:20 <bsmntbombdood> pikhq: this is for 6 months?!?!
05:00:23 * RodgerTheGreat is listening to Grass Stains by Tackle from Cave Story Remix Project
05:00:25 <Figs> O.o
05:00:30 <Figs> YES!
05:00:30 <Figs> :D
05:00:32 <RodgerTheGreat> this song is so awesome. :)
05:00:52 <Figs> Dokutsu Monogatari FTW
05:01:02 <RodgerTheGreat> fuck yes!
05:01:12 <Figs> I'm stuck at hell :P
05:01:18 <Figs> I can't beat the giant press
05:01:19 <pikhq> bsmntbombdood: Yeah.
05:01:25 <pikhq> GregorR-L: Want it for badinsurance-3?
05:01:27 <bsmntbombdood> O.o
05:01:37 <RodgerTheGreat> normally I hate platformers, but Cave Story instantly carved out a spot in my heart
05:01:49 <pikhq> :p
05:02:04 <RodgerTheGreat> it sits next to Kirby Superstar as the exceptions to my platformer rule
05:02:05 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Sure
05:02:20 <pikhq> http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/Quote.html
05:02:59 <GregorR-L> WTF, $80K X-D
05:03:02 <RodgerTheGreat> I just can't read "Vehicular Homicide" without laughing my ass off and thinking of UT2004
05:03:10 <RodgerTheGreat> "Vehicular Manslaughter!"
05:03:45 <pikhq> I call the drag racing violations the most beautiful of them all.
05:04:01 <RodgerTheGreat> it was certainly a stroke of genius
05:04:24 <GregorR-L> Drag racing while under the influence and under suspension :P
05:04:56 <RodgerTheGreat> I have this mental image of "The Fast and the Furious: Model T Drift"
05:05:04 <GregorR-L> HAHAHAHAHA
05:05:08 <Figs> lol
05:05:09 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
05:05:16 <GregorR-L> OH MY GOD, HE'S GOING 40
05:05:27 <RodgerTheGreat> lmao
05:05:48 <pikhq> LMAO
05:05:51 <Figs> see what it is with Geico
05:06:24 <pikhq> I'll do that later.
05:06:28 <bsmntbombdood> http://revistes.upc.es/wiki/images/f/f2/Rofl-mao.jpg
05:06:57 <Figs> :O
05:06:59 <Figs> that's bad
05:06:59 <RodgerTheGreat> that image could not be used at a more appropriate time
05:07:00 <Figs> :P
05:08:04 <RodgerTheGreat> "The Ford Model T: If you're not outta control, you're not IN control."
05:08:23 <pikhq> "Model T: I'd steal this."
05:09:37 <RodgerTheGreat> heh
05:10:13 <RodgerTheGreat> who wants to help me make a Model T offroad racing game at some point in the unspecified future?
05:10:14 <Figs> I've actually seen a model T in use :P
05:10:44 <RodgerTheGreat> "We're gonna pimp that T out in a new paint job- you can get it in any color ya want as long as it's black."
05:11:13 <pikhq> "Word".
05:11:25 <Figs> "Model T Offroad!: It's T-rickin'"
05:11:32 <Figs> or T-riffic
05:11:35 <Figs> if you prefer :P
05:11:37 <RodgerTheGreat> heh
05:12:14 <pikhq> "Would I pay all my salary on this? Damned right."
05:13:39 <RodgerTheGreat> Ford should reintroduce the line. "At the Detroit Auto Show, the biggest announcement of the season: The new 2008 Model T."
05:14:12 <GregorR-L> Hah
05:14:23 <pikhq> Coming in every color *but* black.
05:14:33 <Figs> make it pink
05:14:45 <Sukoshi> Drive the new Ford Model T. It's T-rashy, we guarantee it!
05:14:46 <GregorR-L> Including puce and navy.
05:14:51 <RodgerTheGreat> haha
05:15:10 <RodgerTheGreat> don't forget mauve, burnt umber and seafoam green
05:15:27 <Figs> Devil's Own Black
05:15:47 <Sukoshi> Bowser raep?
05:16:10 <RodgerTheGreat> pure Magenta.
05:16:16 <Sukoshi> :P
05:16:41 <RodgerTheGreat> don't be dissin' on my colors
05:17:24 <pikhq> No, no, no.
05:17:34 <Sukoshi> You always forget the red people. Always :(
05:17:42 <pikhq> 2008 Model T: designed by Henry Ford via Ouija board.
05:18:00 <RodgerTheGreat> that would be awesome
05:18:28 <Sukoshi> The whole Ouija board thing became cool in our school last year for a few months.
05:18:45 <RodgerTheGreat> it'd be hand-built, totally standardized, the engine would run like a fine watch (at around 10hp), and there'd be some antisemetic commentary in there somewhere
05:19:13 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: really? How did *that* fad begin?
05:19:14 <Sukoshi> Ooh. Can I provide the Anti-semetic commentary?
05:19:22 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: go for it
05:19:27 <pikhq> And it'd be available in black or swastika-textured black. :p
05:19:31 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: You know teenagers and the sudden unge for the super-natural.
05:19:45 <Sukoshi> I have a new cool nickname at school.
05:19:47 <Sukoshi> Marx.
05:19:52 <RodgerTheGreat> fun
05:20:05 <pikhq> Groucho?
05:20:09 <Sukoshi> Heck no.
05:20:14 <Sukoshi> The one and only Karl.
05:20:31 <RodgerTheGreat> at least they aren't referring to you as a dude who was embalmed and placed on display after his death
05:21:03 <Sukoshi> Ever since most of us have gone to AP World History, Communist has become a larger and larger fad at our school.
05:21:20 <RodgerTheGreat> the next "emo", eh?
05:21:31 <Sukoshi> Only among honors students though.
05:21:32 <RodgerTheGreat> should mean some fun down the road
05:21:37 <RodgerTheGreat> huh.
05:21:42 <Sukoshi> Some of the people in the fad are actual Communists, methinks, but most of us just do it for the fun of waving around red flags and drawing neo-Marxist symbols.
05:22:02 <Sukoshi> I made the Hammer-Sickle smilie-face ;)
05:22:07 <pikhq> I'd prefer to be a French revolutionary.
05:22:23 <pikhq> Randomly shout "Liberte, egalite, fraternite!" (misspelt, I know)
05:22:43 <RodgerTheGreat> after my honors english class read and discussed Animal Farm, everyone in class referred to one another as "comrade" for the remaining three years of high school
05:23:29 <Figs> lol
05:24:19 <RodgerTheGreat> we also did an activity where we divided the classroom into a small "ruling class" and proletariats, and the idea was that the ruling class would become corrupt. Problem was, we put so many checks and balances into the system when we created it that it turned out utopian.
05:24:29 <pikhq> Noice.
05:24:35 <RodgerTheGreat> It was a hilariously bad "example of how communism is evil"
05:25:09 <pikhq> Communism isn't neccesarily evil, it just depends upon a hard-to-corrupt democratic system to actually work.
05:25:47 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm not saying it's evil, I'm saying that was the point we were supposed to learn from the activity (although not explicitly stated as such)
05:26:00 <pikhq> Which is kind of stupid.
05:26:05 * RodgerTheGreat shrugs
05:26:17 <RodgerTheGreat> it's a literature class.
05:26:24 <pikhq> It's usually implied that communism is a system of government, rather than an economic system. . .
05:26:28 <pikhq> Ah.
05:26:31 <Figs> we had to build things out of paper in my literature class
05:26:40 <pikhq> Well, in that case, the teacher should just be beaten, rather than executed. :p
05:26:42 <Figs> I think we had to build a structure that could hold up books out of just paper
05:26:55 * pikhq really doesn't like teachers that are horribly wrong
05:27:15 * Figs hands pikhq HP6
05:27:16 <Figs> *5
05:27:17 <RodgerTheGreat> the only time I ever had to build things out of paper was my "introduction to engineering class" (which I was transferred into when my HS cancelled Electronics ||.)
05:27:21 * RodgerTheGreat shakes his fist
05:27:39 <Figs> O_o
05:28:23 <Figs> I should learn how to obfuscate perl and scheme
05:28:25 <Figs> err
05:28:31 <Figs> Pascal and Java
05:28:33 <RodgerTheGreat> but it was pretty sweet. 12 inches high, made out of 3 pieces of 8.5x11 paper and a meter of masking tape, held 9.8 kilos
05:28:33 <Figs> haha
05:28:34 <RodgerTheGreat> :D
05:28:40 <Figs> big typo
05:28:41 <Figs> :P
05:28:56 <Figs> some would call that a Freudian Slip... :P
05:29:10 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
05:30:06 <Figs> ... So, Newton, Pascal, and Einstein are playing hide and seek...
05:30:11 <RodgerTheGreat> obfuscating Java is pretty much as simple as abstracting everything to a ridiculous degree until people can sift through all your code files, read TONS of javadoc comments and be utterly incapable of figuring out where your code is
05:30:23 <Figs> Einstein starts counting, and Pascal runs off.
05:30:23 <RodgerTheGreat> it's like looking through the JavaC source.
05:30:49 <Figs> Newton, on the other hand, pulls out a bit of chalk and draws a 1 meter by 1 meter square on the floor and stands in it.
05:30:52 <RodgerTheGreat> I page through a ton of anstractions and interfaces, get to the center of things, and I'm like "where *IS* it?"
05:31:10 <Figs> Einstein finishes counting, and, of course, sees Newton still standing there
05:31:17 <Figs> "Ah ha! Found you Newton..."
05:31:25 -!- Devi| has joined.
05:31:38 <Figs> "No no... This is 1 Newton per square meter, and that's Pascal!"
05:31:38 <RodgerTheGreat> I just assume that programmers at Sun are magical and figured out how to abstract everything until it requires zero code to implement
05:32:15 <RodgerTheGreat> so, Sukoshi: final answer: want an avatar?
05:33:52 -!- pikhq_ has joined.
05:34:29 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: lol
05:35:45 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: Yeah!
05:35:50 <Sukoshi> Make it a Communist one too!
05:36:07 <Figs> http://www.berro.com/joke/best_lawyer_story.htm
05:36:20 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined.
05:36:22 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: Or you can pass Objects everywhere and cast when you need something ;D
05:36:33 <Sukoshi> (Basically copying the C obfuscation process of casting void* )
05:36:55 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: sweet! do you have a source image?
05:37:08 -!- GreaseMonkey has changed nick to N0body.
05:37:27 <RodgerTheGreat> ooh, the evils of Just-In-Time casting. clever.
05:38:59 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: Hmmm...
05:39:20 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: How large is this avatar?
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05:39:43 <Figs> http://www.berro.com/joke/best_10_answering_machine_messag.htm
05:40:11 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: any size you want. I normally do them at roughly 128x128, but the source image can be any size
05:41:46 <Sukoshi> http://faculty.umf.maine.edu/~walters/web%20104/ww1%20halt%20the%20hun.jpeg <-- See the German guy? Make his costume red.
05:41:58 <Sukoshi> ;P
05:42:16 <RodgerTheGreat> hm...
05:42:29 <RodgerTheGreat> do you want me to make it look like you at all?
05:42:34 <Sukoshi> Nope.
05:42:45 <Sukoshi> Because I'm not even of that skin color, to begin with :P
05:42:53 <Sukoshi> Gender, height, etc, etc.
05:43:01 <RodgerTheGreat> I am aware of this
05:43:18 <RodgerTheGreat> but I'll be working with the *magic* of creative embellishment here
05:43:21 <Sukoshi> But I always envisioned a romanticized Bolshevik as one of those guys, but in red clothing.
05:43:40 <Sukoshi> And with a Hammer-and-Sickle on their chest.
05:43:45 <RodgerTheGreat> so, do you want the person in roughly the same pose?
05:43:51 <Sukoshi> No, not neccessarily.
05:43:53 <Sukoshi> Just that costume.
05:44:02 <Sukoshi> The spike on the head is quite awesome :P
05:44:06 <RodgerTheGreat> indeed
05:44:08 <Sukoshi> (WWI germans had style, that's for sure.)
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05:44:11 <RodgerTheGreat> the helmet ought to be fun
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05:47:45 <Figs> rofl!
05:47:46 <Figs> http://www.berro.com/joke/cardiologist_proctologist_gynecologist_joke.htm
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05:59:14 <RodgerTheGreat> very, very rough and non-done, but what are you thinking of this sketch, Sukoshi? http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1184907472-suki.png
06:01:52 <RodgerTheGreat> *poke*
06:03:32 <Figs> Rodger, there are 10 kinds of people... those who know binary, and those who don't.
06:03:45 * RodgerTheGreat prepares to quote bash
06:03:57 <RodgerTheGreat> Figs: that's only 2 kinds of people, moron!
06:03:59 <RodgerTheGreat> STUPID
06:04:05 * RodgerTheGreat concludes quoting bash
06:04:07 * RodgerTheGreat bows
06:04:09 <Figs> lol
06:04:13 * Figs claps
06:04:20 <RodgerTheGreat> :)
06:05:19 <pikhq> http://xkcd.com/c292.html
06:05:53 <RodgerTheGreat> heh
06:06:49 <Figs> :D
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06:07:09 <Figs> my brain hurts
06:07:12 <Figs> is that a bad sign?
06:08:08 <RodgerTheGreat> possibly
06:10:44 <Sukoshi> Lemme see.
06:11:22 <Sukoshi> Hey, that *is* quite awesome!
06:11:34 <Sukoshi> Can you put a yellow hammer-sickle on his red tunic?
06:12:23 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm drawing one on the side of the helmet- I think you'll like how the final version looks
06:14:04 <Sukoshi> :)
06:14:33 <RodgerTheGreat> don't go anywhere for a minute or two, just gotta complete a few finishing touches...
06:14:37 <Figs> o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o.o
06:14:44 <Figs> -.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
06:14:49 <Figs> q.q.q.q.q.q.q
06:14:51 <Figs> z.z.z.z
06:14:57 <Figs> b.b
06:15:00 <Figs> S
06:15:18 <GreaseMonkey> what lang is that?
06:15:29 <Figs> Insanity
06:15:32 <RodgerTheGreat> http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1184908475-suki.png
06:15:38 <RodgerTheGreat> ta-da!
06:15:40 <Figs> Sleep Deprevation
06:15:54 <Figs> No eyes?
06:16:09 <RodgerTheGreat> the brim of the helmet conceals them
06:16:44 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm not trying to draw 100% realistic anatomy here- it's a cartoon. :)
06:16:49 <Figs> :P
06:17:02 <Figs> I need to learn how to do shading
06:17:10 <Figs> how do you make it work?
06:17:37 <RodgerTheGreat> uhm.. you kinda...
06:17:38 <RodgerTheGreat> er
06:17:56 <RodgerTheGreat> imagine a light source... kinda raytrace the object in your head
06:18:03 <RodgerTheGreat> I dunno how to explain, really
06:18:21 <RodgerTheGreat> you're best off just studying how other people do it
06:19:12 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: where are you?
06:19:22 <GreaseMonkey> that's pretty funky pixel-art there
06:19:26 <RodgerTheGreat> feeeedbaaaack! feeeeeeeedbaaaaaack
06:19:33 <RodgerTheGreat> GreaseMonkey: :D
06:20:17 <GreaseMonkey> if you want feedback, just crank the volume up on the amplifier
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06:20:50 <RodgerTheGreat> or reset your digital feedback compensators
06:21:16 <RodgerTheGreat> I saw that happen to a sound guy once- he just about shit himself
06:21:20 <Figs> WEeeh arrrrrrrrnekll BZZZZ EEEERRRRMMMMPH!
06:21:30 <Figs> ZZZZZZZZt
06:21:40 <RodgerTheGreat> and then you could see him just *frantically* trying to adjust for everything manually
06:21:43 <RodgerTheGreat> I didn't envy him
06:21:51 <GreaseMonkey> lawl
06:21:56 <Figs> lol
06:22:03 * Figs pokes oklopol
06:22:11 <Figs> Hey Oklopol, wake up
06:22:36 <RodgerTheGreat> 'course at that time I was sitting at the light board waiting to press "go" to step to the next cue in the huge list I'd punched in for the show
06:22:58 <RodgerTheGreat> it kinda takes the fun out of running a show when you just hit one button all night
06:23:04 <RodgerTheGreat> I felt like george jetson
06:23:36 <Figs> well, at least that way, your button pushing finger won't get sore
06:23:54 <bsmntbombdood> <RodgerTheGreat> but it was pretty sweet. 12 inches high, made out of 3 pieces of 8.5x11 paper and a meter of masking tape, held 9.8 kilos
06:24:01 <bsmntbombdood> damn, how did you do that?
06:24:19 <RodgerTheGreat> a little magic, a little natural engineering talent.
06:24:22 <Figs> triangles, I'll bet :P
06:24:34 <RodgerTheGreat> I built it like a triangular honeycomb, oriented vertically
06:24:52 <Figs> sounds like out projects :P
06:25:18 <RodgerTheGreat> and I came up with a clever way to minimize the usage of tape, so I could make it a bit wider than it would've been otherwise
06:26:04 <Figs> :P
06:26:36 <RodgerTheGreat> I still have the beam, along with my balsa-wood bridge and my crowning achievement- my egg-drop vehicle.
06:26:46 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm so freaking proud of that last one
06:26:51 <Figs> egg-drop vehicle?
06:27:08 <RodgerTheGreat> a thing you can put an egg inside and then drop about 30 feet onto concrete
06:28:07 <RodgerTheGreat> *BOTH* my egg and my vehicle were completely unharmed (and the vehicle was *really* lightweight because of how I built it), and I proved it by dropping the thing a second time just for shits and giggles
06:28:17 <RodgerTheGreat> both trials went as smooth as silk
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06:29:22 <RodgerTheGreat> the one thing I utterly failed at (and have failed at repeatedly throughout my school career) was the mousetrap vehicle. I got something like 3rd in the class, and I hated that thing
06:29:27 <RodgerTheGreat> it was ugly and inelegant
06:30:07 <RodgerTheGreat> my bridge performed pretty well- 16 inches wide, 44 grams heavy and it held about 46 pounds of sand.
06:31:04 <RodgerTheGreat> it was built mostly out of toothpicks with some small balsawood main members, very intricate crossbracing and a road surface made out of posterboard
06:32:18 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: WHERE ARE YOU?
06:32:25 * RodgerTheGreat begins a fire for smoke signals
06:34:02 <Figs> :P
06:34:12 <RodgerTheGreat> :/
06:35:42 <RodgerTheGreat> ok, Figs- here's a joke you can add to your collection. I thought of it in one of my CS classes.
06:36:08 <RodgerTheGreat> "I'm going to start a children's cartoon series about String manipulation in C".
06:36:28 <RodgerTheGreat> "We'll call it 'The Char * Vars'"
06:38:25 <RodgerTheGreat> you can now laugh or similar
06:38:59 <pikhq_> GregorR-L: Thanks to your website, I have come to one conclusion: you have changed your AIM screenname.
06:39:03 <pikhq_> :p
06:39:08 <RodgerTheGreat> haha
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06:39:44 <GregorR-L> pikhq_: Hrm?
06:39:51 <pikhq> cdgregorr.
06:40:02 <pikhq> You're not logged in under that on AIM, and that's no longer valid on Yahoo.
06:40:10 <GregorR-L> I am logged in under that on AIM.
06:40:18 <GregorR-L> I haven't used YIM in years because nobody uses it :P
06:40:26 <pikhq> I know one person that does. . .
06:43:23 <pikhq> Are the internets still being juggled?
06:45:45 <RodgerTheGreat> hooray. I finally made another news posting for my website.
06:47:44 <RodgerTheGreat> behold: http://rodger.nonlogic.org/index.php
06:49:26 <GregorR-L> Hey, I have a sprite-based 3D shooter!
06:49:28 <GregorR-L> http://gregorr.homelinux.org/js3d/t3d/3d.html
06:50:02 <RodgerTheGreat> holy poop, GregorR-L- I just now realized you can walk around
06:50:07 <RodgerTheGreat> haha- this is so awesome
06:50:45 <GregorR-L> X-P
06:50:50 <RodgerTheGreat> we seriously need to figure out how to make this into a game or something
06:51:05 <GregorR-L> I totally agree.
06:51:14 <GregorR-L> But I'm incapable of anything creative or interesting.
06:51:29 <Figs> kind of empty
06:51:39 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm capable of somewhat creative and interesting things
06:51:44 <RodgerTheGreat> and I can make some sweet graphics
06:52:31 <GregorR-L> I'm in if you're in.
06:52:40 <RodgerTheGreat> okles
06:52:46 <GregorR-L> I originally made it to make something on the Wii :P
06:52:55 <RodgerTheGreat> <:S
06:53:13 <Figs> I'm capable of never finishing anything
06:53:13 <pikhq> You need to do some SVG stuff if possible.
06:53:34 * GregorR-L finds it unlikely that it's possible.
06:53:37 <RodgerTheGreat> I can do SVGs
06:53:57 <RodgerTheGreat> but yeah, that would suck to try getting working on most browsers
06:54:01 <GregorR-L> Right.
06:54:07 <RodgerTheGreat> PNGs and the like are a best bet
06:54:20 <RodgerTheGreat> so we're best off making graphics that are *meant* to look pixelated
06:54:28 <RodgerTheGreat> which is where I come in. :D
06:54:34 <GregorR-L> 8-D
06:54:40 <Figs> cave story!
06:54:53 <pikhq> GregorR-L: You're a fucking genious. . .
06:54:55 <GregorR-L> http://www.donotputthebaby.com/index.php?s=Pixel :)
06:54:56 <RodgerTheGreat> cave story doesn't lend itself well to being 3d
06:55:16 <RodgerTheGreat> haha- yeah, I remember doing that
06:55:18 <GregorR-L> pikhq: Your spelling ... isn't ;)
06:55:48 <Figs> damn it
06:55:52 <Figs> I need a keyboard again
06:55:58 <pikhq> So?
06:56:02 <Figs> My musical creativity is shitty now without a keyboard :(
06:56:02 <GregorR-L> I just bought a keyboard on the internets yesterday.
06:56:06 <GregorR-L> Oh :P
06:56:09 <GregorR-L> That kind of keyboard.
06:56:11 <Figs> I own one :P
06:56:12 <Figs> but
06:56:17 <Figs> it's on the other side of the continent
06:56:32 <RodgerTheGreat> well, I have classes tomorrow, and I must sleep
06:56:36 <Figs> :(
06:56:42 <Figs> cya
06:56:48 * Figs prods oklopol
06:56:50 <RodgerTheGreat> 'later everybody. Somebody tell me what sukoshi thinks of the avatar when I get back
06:56:55 <Figs> HEY OKLOPOL
06:57:01 <Figs> byebye :D
06:57:04 <RodgerTheGreat> and then gregor and I can come up with some ideas for a 3d game
06:57:07 <RodgerTheGreat> 'later all
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07:04:06 <bsmntbombdood> dijkstra should have never written his goto paper :(
07:05:15 <pikhq> Not true.
07:05:32 <bsmntbombdood> now everyone needlessly hates goto
07:05:37 <pikhq> Dijkstra should have written it, and then formed the National Society for Executing Goto Users.
07:06:00 <bsmntbombdood> goto is not inherintly bad
07:06:21 <bsmntbombdood> it's only bad when bad programmers use it
07:06:48 <pikhq> Who are the only ones that do.
07:07:07 <bsmntbombdood> incorrect
07:07:18 <bsmntbombdood> call/cc is a superset of goto
07:07:43 <pikhq> In assembly, yes.
07:08:16 <bsmntbombdood> huh?
07:08:41 <pikhq> "foo: call foo" is an infinite loop in assembly. ;)
07:10:04 <bsmntbombdood> ((lambda (x) (x x)) (call/cc (lambda (k) (k k)))) is an infinite loop in call/cc
07:10:37 <pikhq> Name to me one valid usage of goto.
07:11:06 <bsmntbombdood> control constructs the language designers didn't think of
07:11:12 <Figs> pikhq: obfuscation
07:12:12 <pikhq> Figs: Granted.
07:12:16 <pikhq> bsmntbombdood: Not granted.
07:12:24 <pikhq> If you need goto for that, your language sucks.
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07:18:53 <bsmntbombdood> call/cc is goto
07:19:05 <bsmntbombdood> err, i alreayd said that
07:19:35 <pikhq> Stating that it is doesn't mean anything about the validity of its usage.
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07:34:01 <immibis> !ps
07:34:06 <immibis> still no egobot then
07:34:06 <GregorR-L> $ grep -l goto sss/* | wc -l
07:34:06 <GregorR-L> 285
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07:37:06 <immibis> !ps
07:37:09 <EgoBot> 1 immibis: ps
07:38:24 <Figs> bah @_@
07:38:29 <Figs> my music is teh suxor
07:39:27 <bsmntbombdood> GregorR-L: what's sss?
07:39:36 <bsmntbombdood> and, grep -c
07:40:18 <GregorR-L> :P
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07:41:33 <Figs> I can't tell...
07:41:34 <Figs> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=DKNHJR30
07:41:38 <Figs> is this good or shitty?
07:43:32 <Figs> opinions?
07:44:03 <GregorR-L> I'm not going to download it, because that question has no correct answer :)
07:44:30 <Figs> sometimes it has an obvious answer :P
07:48:39 <Figs> ok, how about this...
07:48:39 <Figs> does this sound like video game music?
07:49:26 <GregorR-L> It works pretty well, but it feels like the melody is never allowed to come to a natural conclusion.
07:49:35 <Figs> well, it's not finished
07:50:17 <GregorR-L> Well, yeah :P
07:50:17 <Figs> it's just a 20 second or so bit that I just wrote :P
07:51:24 <Figs> any suggestions for how to improve it?
07:51:25 <Figs> (other than finishing it :P)
07:52:15 <GregorR-L> Not really.
07:53:32 <Figs> http://www.megaupload.com/?d=W5O7TOFK
07:53:48 <Figs> I wrote this yesterday... my friend thinks my percussion is psychotic
07:54:06 <Figs> (I'm not very good with that :P)
07:55:14 <Figs> can you distinguish the melody?
07:59:01 <GregorR-L> I can distinguish me going to sleep.
07:59:02 <GregorR-L> Byeeeeeeee
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07:59:09 <Figs> :( :P
07:59:15 <Figs> anyone else :D
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08:37:04 <Sukoshi> Woohoo!
08:37:07 <Sukoshi> That's a nice avatar!
08:50:36 <bsmntbombdood> what be nice avatar?
08:50:40 <Baughn> ...isako's /mean/
08:58:30 <fizzie> Here's probably the ugliest "goto" line I have in C code I've written: goto *(*((void *(*)[256])&bff[oo]))[pf[ipc]]; (Uses GCC's computed-goto extension, basically a way to manually build jump tables.)
08:58:58 <fizzie> Too bad both the goto-ers already left.
08:59:00 <bsmntbombdood> wiw
09:07:51 <Baughn> fizzie: For what it's worth, I agree that it's ugly. Cast and all.
09:10:40 <Sukoshi> There are times when old code is too unreadable and must be replaced by new code during a revision.
09:10:44 <Sukoshi> This is one of those times.
09:16:06 <Sukoshi> Why does a BufferedReader throw an IOException?
09:16:20 <Sukoshi> Wait hmm. Maybe I should print out that string message thingamabobber.
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10:28:31 <Sukoshi> So. What causes an IOException in a BufferedReader?
10:33:56 <fizzie> Most probably an IOException from the underlying WhateverReader.
10:34:09 <Sukoshi> That helps :P
10:38:24 <fizzie> You should probably provide more information if you want a more detailed answer. The possible reasons for exception are quite different for, say, an InputStreamReader reading a socket than a FileReader.
10:38:55 <Sukoshi> It's a FileReader.
10:39:48 <fizzie> I assume it's just a generic IOException and not one of the N more specific subclasses you can also catch with a catch(IOException e)?
10:42:09 <Sukoshi> No, it's not
10:42:10 <Sukoshi> .
10:42:20 <Sukoshi> It's an IOException only.
10:42:34 <Sukoshi> I've guarded against EOFs and such, so, I'm failing to see the problem here.
10:44:40 <fizzie> It happens when you read(...) things, I assume? And the file is a plain old regular file?
10:45:06 <Sukoshi> Yeah.
10:47:12 <GreaseMonkey> gnight everyone
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10:49:27 <fizzie> That's... interesting.
10:49:55 <fizzie> The .getMessage() message wasn't enlightening at all?
10:51:16 <Sukoshi> ``null''
10:51:34 <Sukoshi> Great, huh? ;D
10:54:19 <fizzie> Is that the official Sun runtime you're doing this on? :p
10:59:24 <Sukoshi> Yes.
11:01:35 <Sukoshi> An existentially qualified goal G is a logical consequence of a program P if there is a clause in P with a ground instance A <- B_1, ..., B_n, n >= 0 such that B_1, ..., B_n are logical consequences of P, and A is an instance of G.
11:03:21 <Sukoshi> This is one of those times to go ``ROFL wut?!''
11:06:45 <Sukoshi> Essentially, it's saying that, if a logical clause is substituted with another clause and produces the goal, the set of facts that make up the goal represent a program.
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12:46:26 * SimonRC thinks that Figs needs some web hosting
12:47:57 <SimonRC> hell even a pbwiki would help him host stuff
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12:53:00 <SimonRC> RedDak: WRU?
12:54:38 <andreou> SimonRC: bored, aren't we?
12:55:51 <sp3tt> COFFEEE
12:56:29 <andreou> got an old p2 mobo (with a p3 cpu, running just fine). damned thing, doesn't see my 80GB ide disk
12:56:32 <andreou> any workarounds?
12:56:56 <SimonRC> andreou: yeah
13:01:04 <fizzie> I used to have a 32G limit problem with one motherboard, before they (finally, after a lot of waiting) made a BIOS upgrade (released only as a beta version) for it. In the meanwhile a working workaround was to jumper the disk to look like a 32G one, and set CONFIG_IDEDISK_STROKE on. That configuration setting doesn't seem to exist any more, though.
13:02:39 <andreou> i thought linux didn't use bios settings to detect the disks
13:03:54 <andreou> or that it wasn't absolutely bios dependent
13:04:33 <fizzie> In my case the box didn't boot at all if a larger drive was present, so that necessitated the jumpering.
13:05:05 <andreou> well it boots but doesn't detect the disk. or when in auto/lba, it just sticks there
13:05:08 <fizzie> And CONFIG_IDEDISK_STROKE was necessary for Linux to see that it really wasn't a 32G disk.
13:05:58 <fizzie> If your disk has the 32G limit jumper, you could of course pretty easily turn it on and check if it helps. Who knows, maybe Linux nowadays notices the real size without any strange configuratations.
13:07:06 <fizzie> Besides, 32G should be enough for everyone!
13:07:32 <ehird`> 2 cells of tape should be enough for anyone
13:08:00 <ehird`> well i guess if you have arbitary-sized integers on the two cells it is :)
13:08:13 <andreou> maybe if i enter the C/H/S data by hand it'll be ok
13:09:14 <fizzie> If you end up using the 32G-cap jumper, do boot your kernels with "hdX=stroke" (where X is the right letter, of course); seems that they've changed it from the configure-time option to a boot-time option in 2.6.7.
13:09:33 <fizzie> Without that it'll use the capped capacity.
13:10:18 <andreou> i think i have issues against stroking my hard drive
13:10:34 <fizzie> You need to stroke your hard drive if you want it to appear larger.
13:10:51 <andreou> ;p
13:15:26 <andreou> xm maybe i should use capacity limit
13:15:36 <andreou> that and stroke
13:20:15 <andreou> fist the chs input
13:20:19 <andreou> brb, off to blow up a disk
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13:34:31 <andreou> crap
13:34:35 <andreou> drivestatus error
13:34:39 <andreou> and again and again
13:34:46 <andreou> (with cap on and stroke on or off)
13:35:46 <andreou> any way to update the bios from within linux (and without a floppy)
13:47:16 <fizzie> Usually I've just written a suitable boot floppy image to an El Torito floppy-emulation-boot-CD, but that might not be an option.
13:48:55 <andreou> dtk can well be one of the worse mobo manufacturers
13:49:01 <andreou> and how come that all the .tw sites are so slow
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14:19:38 <andreou> back to the other box, the disk goes
15:15:21 -!- pikhq has quit ("leaving").
15:39:06 -!- RodgerTheGreat has joined.
15:39:12 <RodgerTheGreat> 'sup, everyone?
15:40:02 <andreou> hey roger
15:41:27 <RodgerTheGreat> hello, andreou
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16:00:32 -!- RedDak has quit (Remote closed the connection).
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16:23:27 <SimonRC> RodgerTheGreat: ooh, soup
16:26:54 <SimonRC> RodgerTheGreat: I found another bug in CRPG
16:27:00 <SimonRC> erm ww
17:14:34 -!- bra|ket has changed nick to lament.
17:23:31 -!- blahbot` has joined.
17:24:53 <blahbot`> test.
17:33:10 * ihope tests
17:33:21 <ihope> You're welcome.
17:49:55 <blahbot`> thank you.
17:50:07 <blahbot`> it is appreciated. i cannot test as i am a lowly bot.
17:50:11 <andreou> /ctcp blahbot`version
17:50:22 <blahbot`> thank you for being kind to a poor, lonely, helpless bot.
17:50:37 <andreou> oh god it's HHGTTG all over again ;p
17:50:49 <blahbot`> can i run some brainfuck in return? or do you request no payment?
17:50:49 <andreou> blahbot`: unload depression
17:51:12 -!- blahbot` has changed nick to marvinbot`.
17:51:31 <marvinbot`> i'll go and unload my memory circuits now.
17:52:29 <ehird`> %bf ,[.,]
17:52:37 <marvinbot`> i can tell you don't really want to run that code.
17:53:53 <ihope> marvinbot`: can you offer a suggestion as to what code should be run?
17:54:25 <marvinbot`> ERROR: memory circuits unplugged, please remember something to continue
17:54:47 * ihope remembers something
17:55:12 <ehird`> no, marvinbot` has to remember something
17:55:34 -!- RodgerTheGreat has quit.
17:56:08 * ihope reminds marvinbot` of something
17:56:39 <ihope> marvinbot`: I'll buy your life for $1.50.
17:56:55 <marvinbot`> i can tell you don't really think it's worth that much.
17:57:45 <ihope> Are you calling me dishonest?
18:36:17 <Tritonio> andreou, ti ginetai?
18:37:46 * SimonRC eats dinner
19:13:55 <Sukoshi> Does InputStream.read() only read 1 byte?
19:43:35 -!- jix has joined.
19:47:12 <ehird`> Sukoshi, huh?
19:57:14 <Sukoshi> ehird`: Never mind. I just made a big booboo while coding.
19:57:23 <ehird`> what language, tohugh
19:57:28 <Sukoshi> Java.
19:57:41 <Sukoshi> I just did a C-ism and didn't realize, heh.
19:58:00 <Sukoshi> I feel like writing an emulator in C. It's been a while since I've done nice low-level coding.
19:58:06 <Sukoshi> That, or I should work on ecp again :(
20:03:12 -!- oerjan has joined.
20:06:39 * ehird` wants to implement his APL-alike language in APL
20:06:47 <ehird`> or my perfect-language in perfect-language
20:06:59 <ehird`> low level programming in high level languages is fun :P
20:07:26 <ihope> Perfect-language...
20:07:38 <ehird`> is the language in my head which is perfect in every way.
20:07:42 <ehird`> and almost impossible to implement.
20:07:48 <ihope> What is it?
20:08:26 <ehird`> what do you mean?
20:08:30 <ehird`> it's a programming language
20:08:43 <ihope> First-order logic pretending to be something new?
20:08:48 <ehird`> oh, no
20:08:49 <ehird`> :P
20:08:57 <ehird`> how did i describe it, again...
20:08:58 <ehird`> i think it was
20:09:33 <ehird`> "a metapattern-filled holy cross between Lisp, Perl, Python, Ruby, Tcl and C# that isn't as horrible as it sounds"
20:09:44 <bsmntbombdood> i hope it has sexps
20:09:46 <ihope> Hmm...
20:10:24 <ehird`> bsmntbombdood, the compiler, interpreter and parser are all written in itself and you can extend its syntax. use its interface to write an s-exp parser, set the parser to that, voila
20:10:41 <ihope> You know, I should prototype my wonderful language.
20:11:06 <ihope> There's let and lambda...
20:11:19 <bsmntbombdood> let is lambda
20:11:42 <ehird`> oh yes, Haskell is in the mix too
20:11:47 <ehird`> so you have monads, i guess.
20:12:14 <ehird`> so you have the bizzare situation of having memory-allocate, memory-free, and things about a million times more high-level than them
20:12:53 <ihope> Let is lambda?
20:13:06 <ihope> Yes, let is lambda...
20:13:07 <ehird`> ihope, yes
20:13:19 <ihope> How convenient.
20:17:44 <Sukoshi> I like low level programming.
20:27:52 <ehird`> i do too but not when it involves C!
20:27:59 <ehird`> I only write low level code in my perfect language!
20:33:59 <ihope> Your perfect language is the only one you write it in?
20:34:16 <ihope> As opposed to it being the only thing you write in it?
20:35:24 <ehird`> former
20:35:34 <ehird`> i only write low-level code in my language, that includes implementing my language
20:36:41 <ihope> I'm thinking you should implement your perfect language.
20:37:51 <bsmntbombdood> yes
20:41:17 <ehird`> but how will i run it since i'll have to write it in itself.
20:42:25 <bsmntbombdood> huh?
20:45:22 <ehird`> well
20:45:32 <ehird`> implementing MyLanguage is low-level
20:45:38 <ehird`> i can only write low-level code in MyLanguage
20:45:42 <ehird`> -> ???
20:46:00 <ehird`> and i can't write a bootstrap interpreter, or anything, since that would be low-level code in something other than MyLanguage
20:46:38 <Sukoshi> I like low level coding in ASM, C, and Forth.
20:47:20 <Sukoshi> That's how I started programming after all, so.
20:47:46 <bsmntbombdood> yay
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20:56:51 <Figs> Hello!
21:00:31 <ehird`> forth is fun
21:00:49 <bsmntbombdood> very
21:05:15 <ehird`> but confusing when you write the first few words.
21:05:37 -!- Figs has left (?).
21:09:34 <lament> i started programming in basic
21:09:36 <lament> that's why i like basic
21:24:32 <bsmntbombdood> 0 IF Sukoshi THEN
21:31:37 <ehird`> FORTH LOVE IF HONK THEN
21:32:58 <bsmntbombdood> oh damn
21:33:14 <bsmntbombdood> i want the bumper sticker
21:35:51 <oerjan> hm, only 35 google hits for that phrase
21:37:47 <bsmntbombdood> Results 1 - 10 of about 138,000 for FORTH LOVE IF HONK THEN
21:38:19 <oerjan> that's for the separate words
21:38:37 <bsmntbombdood> Results 1 - 10 of about 142 for "FORTH LOVE IF HONK THEN"
21:38:56 <oerjan> hm, unreliable...
21:39:09 <oerjan> i used hyphens. i thought that was equivalent.
21:39:27 <oerjan> (and lower case)
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21:54:56 <RodgerTheGreat> howdy, folks
21:57:27 <lament> bsmntbombdood: you have a car?
21:57:46 <bsmntbombdood> no, but i probably will soon
21:58:27 * lament considers the implication of putting a "ONE LESS CAR" sticker on a car
21:59:00 <bsmntbombdood> i don't get it
21:59:21 <oerjan> mapM_ honk . filter (love haskell)
21:59:22 <lament> me neither
21:59:48 <lament> I like "honk if you love honking"
22:00:00 <bsmntbombdood> honk if you love peace and quiet
22:00:08 <oerjan> :D
22:01:57 <oerjan> "honk if you hate bumper stickers"
22:03:05 <oerjan> hm, 905 google hits
22:05:51 <GregorR> "honk if u luv mudkips"
22:06:07 <RodgerTheGreat> "honk if you love the sound your car's horn makes"
22:06:52 <GregorR> "Honk if you drive an SUV to make up for physical shortcomings"
22:07:00 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
22:07:15 <oerjan> "Honk if you are deaf"
22:07:25 <GregorR> lol
22:07:33 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: did you ever see the final version of the image I drew yesterday evening/this morning?
22:07:48 <RodgerTheGreat> "Honk if you can read."
22:08:30 <GregorR> "Hnko fi slydexic aer oyu"
22:09:03 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
22:09:21 <GregorR> Took you a while, didn't it? ;)
22:09:29 <oerjan> "Honk if, Yoda are you"
22:09:42 <RodgerTheGreat> actually, that wasn't as hard to read as one would imagine
22:10:19 <GregorR> oerjan: Yodaspeak is OSV, not OVS
22:10:47 <lament> honk if you are blind
22:10:57 <RodgerTheGreat> that one would be in braille
22:11:04 <GregorR> X-D
22:11:40 <oerjan> Rsearceh swohs taht ppoele need olny the frsit and lsat ltteer to be in the cerorct pacle.
22:12:22 <lament> that's bullshit, though.
22:12:32 <oerjan> i read it on an ad :)
22:12:37 <lament> so?
22:12:49 <oerjan> "so?"
22:12:50 <RodgerTheGreat> oerjan: that only works properly with carefully selected sentences
22:12:52 <lament> it was a sadly popular meme a year or a few back.
22:13:03 <lament> it's complete nonsense, like most internet memes
22:13:10 <RodgerTheGreat> any anagramatical word pairs are impossible to distinguish if they share first and last letters
22:13:34 <RodgerTheGreat> it *is* impressive when it works, but it doesn't work every time
22:13:55 <lament> RodgerTheGreat: i don't see how it's all impressive. Simply randomly arranging letters also works sometimes.
22:14:03 <lament> all/at all
22:14:30 <RodgerTheGreat> maybe I should be more clear here
22:14:42 <Sukoshi> RodgerTheGreat: I did.
22:14:46 <Sukoshi> It's nice :)
22:14:52 <lament> humans are smart and good at dealing with corrupted information.
22:14:57 <RodgerTheGreat> it's "impressive" in the same way the "birthday paradox is". It's striking because it's counterintuitive
22:15:04 <oerjan> i note that some people here have a strange ability to misinterpret me as serious.
22:15:04 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: thanks. :D
22:15:27 <Sukoshi> By the way, is it cheaper perfermonce-wise to convert a char[] to a String or a StringBuffer to a String in Java?
22:15:31 <lament> RodgerTheGreat: it's counterintuitive because it's false.
22:15:42 <Sukoshi> Since the size of the char[] will stay fixed.
22:16:06 <RodgerTheGreat> oerjan: well, it was ambiguous wether or not you were trying to be funny, and we just launched off into tangential discussion of it anyway
22:16:49 <oerjan> incidentally in my family we have 3 pairs of people sharing birthdays. (i'm in one of them.)
22:17:05 <RodgerTheGreat> lament: it's counterintuitive and is true in at least some cases, which is enough to *suggest* that it could be true.
22:17:08 <Sukoshi> I'm thinknig char[] -> String is cheaper.
22:17:11 <RodgerTheGreat> it's an internet meme
22:17:34 <RodgerTheGreat> Sukoshi: I would think so, but I don't know much about how javac post-optimizes
22:17:53 <lament> RodgerTheGreat: it's true in some cases, but that humans can read text where each word is randomly scrambled is also true in some cases, and a much stronger statement.
22:18:08 <RodgerTheGreat> I'm pretty sure that quoted strings are String literals in java, not char[] literals like in C
22:18:31 <Sukoshi> Well, the thing is, a char[] is fixed length while a StringBuffer is not.
22:18:42 <Sukoshi> So probably StringBuffer deals with malloc/realloc constructs at some level.
22:18:44 <RodgerTheGreat> hm
22:18:53 <RodgerTheGreat> might be cheaper with the char then
22:19:06 <RodgerTheGreat> probably less runtime checking of things
22:19:10 <Sukoshi> Yeah.
22:19:27 <Sukoshi> Because a char[] only needs an initial malloc, if it even does malloc'ing or just does it the C way of arrays.
22:19:28 <GregorR> Are these questions about D?
22:19:32 <Sukoshi> No. About Java.
22:19:43 <GregorR> I didn't know charrays looked like "char[]" in Java X-P
22:19:47 <GregorR> Shows how much I nkow.
22:19:48 <GregorR> *know
22:20:06 <Sukoshi> [] is used anywhere that * is in C, basically.
22:20:08 -!- Tritonio has quit ("Bye...").
22:20:23 <GregorR> Just like olde K&R C 8-D
22:20:27 <Sukoshi> :P
22:20:28 <RodgerTheGreat> although I will point out that it can be misleading to think about JVM memory management in terms of malloc/realloc/dealloc operations
22:20:40 <RodgerTheGreat> they don't necessarily happen where you'd think they would
22:20:56 <ihope> What's realloc?
22:21:10 <RodgerTheGreat> I dunno, Sukoshi said it. :S
22:21:17 <RodgerTheGreat> reallocate, I assume
22:21:30 <Sukoshi> Well, even then, they probably push the offset and the initial location onto the stack and operate like that.
22:21:41 <bsmntbombdood> ihope: re-alloc
22:21:48 <Sukoshi> ihope: realloc() from C.
22:21:55 <bsmntbombdood> resizes memorys
22:27:27 <bsmntbombdood> "Mom wants schools to ban books filled with sin. There goes my trigonometry textbook"
22:28:18 <ihope> Just don't ban them completely.
22:30:25 <RodgerTheGreat> we just need to rename sin as something better, like Piety() or Virtue()
22:30:32 <oerjan> There goes the Bible
22:30:37 <RodgerTheGreat> lol
22:31:31 <lament> sin (the trig function) is a strange word
22:31:42 <lament> it's a shortening of sine
22:31:55 <lament> is it really necessary to shorten a 4-letter word to 3 letters?
22:32:28 <lament> oh, i suppose actually sin is from sinus (latin) and has nothing to do with english
22:33:31 <bsmntbombdood> it's terribly annoying when people pronounce those trig functions like their abbreviations
22:33:57 <RodgerTheGreat> yeah
22:34:13 <RodgerTheGreat> I always say the whole name when I write the abbreviation
22:34:39 <lament> in russian we just use the latin terms without any attempt to rusify them
22:34:45 <RodgerTheGreat> how many people here pronounce "char" as "care" and how many pronounce it as in "charred"?
22:35:00 <oerjan> in norwegian too
22:35:26 <lament> because english failed to do so, they now have "tangent" meaning two different things
22:35:49 <bsmntbombdood> i pronounce char like charred
22:36:04 <oerjan> er, were those actually different in Latin?
22:36:05 <RodgerTheGreat> bsmntbombdood: well, that's cute. But it's WRONG!
22:36:27 <RodgerTheGreat> an abbreviation should retain the original pronunciation!
22:36:32 <bsmntbombdood> actually i don't think i've ever said char outloud
22:36:37 <RodgerTheGreat> good, good
22:36:51 <RodgerTheGreat> this means you have a good chance of having an actual life
22:37:00 <lament> oerjan: probably not, but the "tangent line" is translated, unlike the trig term
22:37:25 <lament> oerjan: so for tangent as in "tangent line" we just use "touching"
22:37:27 <lament> the touching line
22:38:00 <oerjan> lament: strangely enough norwegian uses "tangent" for one and "tangens" for the other
22:38:32 <lament> oerjan: tangens is latin. Is tangent norwegian?
22:38:36 <oerjan> but "tangent" is not a free-standing Latin noun
22:38:47 <oerjan> well, both are obviously borrowed
22:38:55 <lament> tangent could be borrowed from english
22:39:03 <lament> but that seems odd
22:39:17 <oerjan> doubtful, because is stressed on the last syllable. French more likely.
22:39:19 <lament> oh, perhaps french
22:39:20 <lament> yes
22:39:23 <lament> it's tangente in french
22:39:26 <oerjan> *it is
22:39:42 <lament> both norwegian and english borrowed from french, then, while russian borrowed directly from latin
22:40:00 <lament> (and norwegian also borrowed directly from latin for the other term)
22:41:04 <lament> wikipedia says that the terms tangens and secans (i.e. the direct latin borrowings) were introduced by a dutch mathematician
22:41:29 <lament> while 'sin' and 'cos' (the abbreviations) are Euler's
22:43:17 <oerjan> which wikipedia article? the english tangent article only mentions a Danish mathematician
22:43:49 <lament> that's interesting
22:44:28 <lament> ah, my mistake, right, danish
22:44:59 <lament> and, er, of course he used the latin terms since the book was written in latin.
22:49:39 <ehird`> i say char as car
22:52:41 <RodgerTheGreat> silent H, eh? Never head anyone say it that way.
22:52:43 <RodgerTheGreat> *heard
22:53:09 <lament> i've never heard anybody say it that way either, although i've read opinions of people who think that's how you should say it.
22:53:52 <ihope> Rather odd.
22:54:10 <lament> well, it is a contraction of character.
22:54:46 <bsmntbombdood> programming languages were never meant to be spoken
22:54:56 <lament> so those who pronounce 'sin' as 'sine' might as well pronounce 'char' as 'car'
22:55:15 <RodgerTheGreat> lament: that's why pronouncing it like "care" seems appropriate
22:55:28 <lament> right
22:55:38 <lament> i don't do it because it sounds ridiculous
22:56:11 <bsmntbombdood> no, those who pronounce 'sin' as 'sine' should pronounce 'char' as 'character'
22:56:22 <GregorR> Heh
22:56:24 <lament> bsmntbombdood: yeah, that would make the most sense
22:56:44 <GregorR> Incidentally, /me says "car"
22:56:53 <ihope> What if the programming language happens to include both "char" and "character"?
22:56:53 <lament> but then by extension they would have to say 'integer' for 'int'
22:57:01 <GregorR> ihope: Throw it away :P
22:57:07 <ihope> Haskell has both Int and Integer.
22:57:17 <GregorR> lib == lieb or lihb? :)
22:57:23 <bsmntbombdood> i think a better solution is to not try to speak unspoken languages
22:57:40 <bsmntbombdood> lihb, definately
22:57:42 <ihope> Yeah, I guess that's a good solution.
22:57:48 <GregorR> I've seen people say "lieb"
22:57:54 <ihope> (Also, libb?)
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22:57:59 <ihope> (Libe and libb?)
22:58:01 <lament> bsmntbombdood: then how are you supposed to discuss your code with somebody else?
22:58:13 <ihope> lament: translate it into English on the fly!
22:58:17 <bsmntbombdood> irc!
22:58:29 <bsmntbombdood> whiteboard, etc
22:58:34 <lament> er
22:58:47 <lament> consider: you and somebody else are sitting in front of a computer screen looking at some code.
22:58:55 <ihope> main = getLine >>= putStr
22:58:55 <bsmntbombdood> i have a whiteboard in my room :D
22:59:04 <GregorR> lament: Wet-erase marker ;)
22:59:09 <ihope> Pronounce it "Upon entry, get a line and output it."
22:59:19 <lament> bsmntbombdood: instead of saying "hey, instead of char foo, you should write int foo", you would stand up, go to the whiteboard, and write that on it?
22:59:33 <ihope> lament: tell them s/char/int/
22:59:44 <ihope> Or, better, write that on the whiteboard.
22:59:49 <ihope> Or do it for them.
23:00:05 <oerjan> Ach, du lieber!
23:00:17 <ihope> Or you could pronounce everything as in Spanish.
23:00:42 <ihope> "Eent fo-o", roughly.
23:00:53 <bsmntbombdood> riiiight
23:00:55 <ihope> Where the - doesn't actually mean anything.
23:01:26 <ihope> Mine equals hate leenay...
23:02:43 <lament> s/spanish/portuguese
23:02:56 <lament> then char becomes "shahr"
23:04:38 <ihope> They pronounce "ch" like "sh" rather than like "ch"?
23:04:52 <lament> right
23:05:12 <lament> depends on the dialect
23:05:32 <lament> "string" would be "string" in some dialects, and "shtring" in others
23:07:34 <ehird`> ihope, main equals getline 'ros putStr
23:07:40 <ehird`> s/equals/equal
23:07:51 <ihope> 'ros meaning arrows?
23:07:54 <ehird`> yes.
23:08:02 <ehird`> but pronounced briefly, because of big blocks of code.
23:08:09 <ihope> Putster.
23:08:25 <ehird`> "put-ster"
23:08:40 <ehird`> i might use "to" instead of 'rows
23:08:46 <ehird`> and "is" instead of "equal"
23:08:55 <ehird`> e.g. "main is get line to put ster"
23:09:02 <oerjan> hah, use Czech, then putstr is simply "putstr" :)
23:09:02 <SimonRC> ISTR that >>= is calle "bind"
23:09:08 <bsmntbombdood> what is the >>= op called?
23:09:15 <lament> i have no problems pronouncing putstr as such.
23:09:18 <SimonRC> bsmntbombdood: "23:08:07 < SimonRC> ISTR that >>= is calle "bind""
23:09:35 <ihope> oerjan: they have no problem saying "tstr"?
23:09:39 * SimonRC asks the experts
23:10:18 <ihope> Maybe >>= should be pronounced "buh" to abbreviate.
23:10:26 * bsmntbombdood goes into the monolingual corner
23:10:28 <ehird`> char *hello[50]; is "car-putr hello a50" (putr is pointer said quickly and abruptly, and a is like a cross between a and o ("array"))
23:10:35 <SimonRC> #haskell says "bind"
23:11:01 <ehird`> car-putr sounds like "carpeter" but with less "e" in "e"
23:11:33 <SimonRC> in unix, the pipe is properly pronounced "goes into"
23:11:46 <oerjan> ihope: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Str%C4%8D_prst_skrz_krk
23:12:01 <SimonRC> /g@"zint@/
23:12:31 <SimonRC> that's some kind of SAMPA, not a regex
23:12:52 <bsmntbombdood> guzinta
23:13:15 <bsmntbombdood> stick finger through throat!
23:17:43 -!- sebbu has quit ("@+").
23:47:32 <ehird`> spoilers start about.. now
23:48:06 <ihope> Spoilers?
23:48:51 <bsmntbombdood> harry potter
23:51:35 <ehird`> book release time estimated at: real soon now
23:51:46 <ehird`> spoiler release time estimated at: oddly, the same time
23:52:22 <lament> eh? spoilers are already released.
23:53:00 <bsmntbombdood> yeah, the leak
23:54:04 <lament> the leak, plus the ~1000 books released early which have confirmed the leak to be genuine.
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