< 1206835204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, who here is made out of chicken < 1206835477 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not I. < 1206835493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am < 1206835496 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I am playing with squeak < 1206835498 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smalltalk is love < 1206835548 0 :vixey!n=vicky@amcant.demon.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1206836417 0 :Deformative!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206836455 0 :Deformative!n=joe@c-68-61-240-49.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206836940 0 :timotiis!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1206838017 0 :Deformative!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Konversation terminated!" < 1206838059 0 :Tritonio_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206838178 0 :Deformative!n=joe@c-68-61-240-49.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206838764 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, minor issue, you know if fungus? while it is not as extensive as mycology I notice ccbi segfaults on it < 1206838768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Loading module stackstack < 1206838769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Loading module finghrti < 1206838769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Segmentation fault < 1206838797 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(while mine get into an infinite loop) < 1206838801 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: He knows of fungus. < 1206838809 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's what made him write Mycology. It's bad. < 1206838812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yep < 1206838821 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but interpreter should still not segfault on it < 1206838824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hardly < 1206838826 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its broken iirc < 1206838827 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the thing I like to point out < 1206838841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and his binary is stripped < 1206838852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(gdb) bt < 1206838852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#0 0x080c4af7 in ?? () < 1206838852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#1 0x08109990 in ?? () < 1206838852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...... < 1206838852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#5 0x00000000 in ?? () < 1206838874 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, point is anything but sefault is fine < 1206838883 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interpreter should never segfault or assert imo < 1206838891 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinite loop? sure, it's fine < 1206838914 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1206839417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you know what I want? < 1206839419 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inline structures < 1206839628 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-233-27.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1206839693 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :howdy folks < 1206839715 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1206839723 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'sup, vixey? < 1206839794 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just returned from the NMU programming competition- great fun < 1206839813 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did it go? < 1206839826 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my team did pretty well- 4th place out of about 20 teams < 1206839852 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo. < 1206839853 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we all got T-shirts and free food, so I'll chalk it up as a win. :) < 1206839856 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, pikhq < 1206839887 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Been a while. < 1206839903 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, school is getting pretty crazy on my end < 1206839914 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spent the past week with family. < 1206839930 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, not been on much. ;) < 1206839979 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's looking like I'll spend the summer taking more classes at MTU- so far I've lined up Coding Theory, an art class and a course on technical writing. < 1206840072 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vixey: are you new here, or have I been completely out of it? < 1206840207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :new, afaik < 1206840265 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, well then, welcome to this festering hive of insanity and highly intellectual ranting < 1206840351 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206840601 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just in case anyone was wondering.. < 1206840609 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpp supports circular header definitions, and gets them right. < 1206840609 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow. < 1206840624 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nifty < 1206840632 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shudder to consider how you determined this < 1206840640 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: You don't wanna know. < 1206840648 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, I'll tell you anyway. < 1206840650 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1206840764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :schream/value.h includes the definition of scm_tag. A scm_tag (which is the structure identifying the tag for a specific type of object) has a name (i.e. for integers it's 'integer'). This name is of the type I use to represent strings (contains length, allocated, and the string) - (scm_string *), defined in schream/string.h. But scm_string's are valid objects too, and string.h defines a scm_tag for them, so it needs to include the header file defining < 1206840764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :scm_tag... schream/value.h < 1206840773 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Amazingly, cpp figures out what I mean and terminates. < 1206840788 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amazing < 1206841660 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, what's everyone up to this evening? < 1206841673 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coding this < 1206841673 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1206841675 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Getting a laptop to run Gentoo. < 1206841677 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's 00:47 < 1206841686 0 :Tritonio_!n=Tritonio@150.140.229.252 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206841690 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wishing I could think of something good to code.. < 1206841699 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kinda feel like coding something, but I don't have any immediate goals < 1206841717 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vixey: embed prolog into $LANGUAGE < 1206841724 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a couple ideas for new game projects, but nothing that I think I can just slam out in an evening < 1206841751 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vixey: what language(s) do you use? < 1206841760 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might suggest appropriate applications < 1206841801 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll use anything < 1206841841 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. well, that doesn't narrow things down much. < 1206841856 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vixey: Delphi? APL? < 1206841863 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java? PHP? < 1206841878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Actually I was suggesting languages I expect vixey would not in fact code in. < 1206841889 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1206841895 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt your two were in the same vein, but I agree! :) < 1206841939 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I'll put votes in for Rails and TinyBASIC < 1206841973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rails as in the one on the gem? < 1206841983 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RoR certainly isn't a language. < 1206841995 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ruby is, though. And Rails happens to be a rather badly designed framework built on top of Ruby. < 1206842020 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rails adds untold horror to an already hideous language < 1206842046 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and coding a non-web2.0 app actually *using* rails could be pretty hilariously painful < 1206842059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Ruby is not a hideous language < 1206842080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have heard that from many people and their reasons were all flimsy. Starting to hate Ruby is becoming 'hip' right now and a lot of them just went with the interblags.. < 1206842096 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, here's something horrific: the term 'web2.0' < 1206842117 0 :slereah_!n=slerjeah@ANantes-252-1-53-171.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1206842154 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1206842162 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wb slereah_ < 1206842180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And there is silence!) < 1206842192 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks. < 1206842646 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a rather interesting idea: http://www.ansible.co.uk/writing/c-b-faq.html < 1206842751 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: i didn't realise it was a parody until near the end < 1206842752 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/sigh < 1206842785 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, it's fiction, but thought-provoking fiction nonetheless < 1206842807 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's old :o < 1206842842 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motif_of_harmful_sensation < 1206842877 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like to see that 'parrot' distortion. < 1206842890 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would gradually undistort it. :p < 1206843060 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I have an image- one sec < 1206843090 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found this a while back, saved it because it was neat: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1206839450-d66c44db02a18598796ea18e5504d0fdde567d69.jpg < 1206843207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: haha, wow < 1206843211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there an undistorted version? ;) < 1206843216 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :har har < 1206843219 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, that picture does look like the kind of thing that would break the brain though < 1206843353 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: Is it specified what kind of distortion is in that? < 1206843364 0 :ihope!n=ihope@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206843365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1206843370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that purports to BE the undistorted version < 1206843376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you read the text < 1206843381 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, bye all, i had fun ;) < 1206843392 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cya < 1206843427 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a joke, RodgerTheGreat < 1206843428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1206843543 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1206843554 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, presuming the parrot would kill you < 1206843603 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: http://www.infinityplus.co.uk/stories/blit.htm < 1206843611 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems to be what that thing draws off < 1206843632 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1206843636 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION reads
< 1206843768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, if the Parrot ever came into existance that'd be the one time i'd argue for complete government opaquity and censorship < 1206843769 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1206843783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, that seems pretty unlikely to me < 1206843785 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my ideals are safe < 1206843823 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1206843848 0 :slereah_!n=slerjeah@ANantes-252-1-53-171.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1206843859 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :funniest joke in the world trumps the parrot < 1206843882 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vixey: haha- yeah, that was a great sketch < 1206843887 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vixey: except that the parrot is legitimately scary ;) < 1206843889 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :parallels i'd say < 1206843897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: do you know how this - http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1206839450-d66c44db02a18598796ea18e5504d0fdde567d69.jpg - was made? < 1206843905 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :manually by a human? or some kind of algorithm? < 1206843910 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, I just found it on an image board somewhere < 1206843926 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like someone took fractal render into some image program.. < 1206844077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this kind of stuff is one of the few themes in horror fiction that actually scares me < 1206844079 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1206844083 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and even then only marginally) < 1206844088 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the other stuff is just tacky < 1206844103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then the brain is one of the most interesting things i know of :) < 1206844129 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's just enough on the edge of something that sounds possible to get you paranoid < 1206844201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1206844222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if it was real, then it'd be *highly* scary, of course < 1206844253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would imagine the suicides from people reading about them and becoming paranoid might exceed the rate of deaths from the image itself < 1206844266 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(another analogy in comedy: Boite diabolique) < 1206844371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems this can be either really, really funny or scary < 1206844896 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://reddit.com/info/6dw0m/comments/ reddit'd < 1206845954 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ansible.co.uk/writing/t3_002.html < 1206846047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: same guy who did the faq & wrote that original story < 1206846089 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1206846101 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why I thought it would be a good link < 1206846242 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: it references geb < 1206846243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so ++ < 1206847490 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1206848585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Konversation terminated!" < 1206850323 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1206850451 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@209.248.124.243 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206851611 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1206851990 0 :shinkuzin!n=r0x@189.13.8.220 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206852244 0 :shinkuzin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1206852476 0 :shinkuzin!n=r0x@189.13.8.220 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206859688 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1206860933 0 :shinkuzin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1206861050 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1206862092 0 :spal!n=spal@unaffiliated/spal JOIN :#esoteric < 1206863999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1206864000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1206865483 0 :spal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1206869142 0 :Sukoshi!n=MuneNoKa@user-11fb6jf.dsl.mindspring.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1206869709 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Sukoshi < 1206869716 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heya. < 1206869734 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is the nomic stuff going (if it is)? < 1206869762 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not :( < 1206869765 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows Vista is going :( < 1206869771 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make that last one a :((( < 1206869782 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1206869797 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sends you a get well soon card
< 1206869821 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Objectively speaking, Vista is a leg up from XP. It's more UNIX-like. < 1206870797 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.81.172 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206871668 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Killed (NickServ (Comando GHOST usato da DIO))" < 1206874651 0 :Sukoshi`!n=MuneNoKa@user-11fb6jf.dsl.mindspring.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1206875578 0 :puzzlet_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1206876062 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yay, that thing with fungus is a compiler bug in GDC < 1206876089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, oh nice to find < 1206876125 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: already been reported in november < 1206876140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no one fixed it since then!? < 1206876168 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GDC development appears to have slowed down < 1206876180 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really follow what's going on with it myself < 1206876202 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be fixed in the latest SVN < 1206876222 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I doubt it, since the bug isn't closed < 1206876248 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the problem is there's only one author, apparently, and he doesn't interact that much with others < 1206876271 0 :Sukoshi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1206876273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1206876274 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could work around the bug but I think I'll just compile with DMD instead < 1206877654 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@ti211310a341-2735.bb.online.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1206878367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I must have an old ccbi version because it says BAD: J doesn't set delta < 1206878373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for SUBR < 1206878382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, where is your current binary? < 1206878389 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION can't find url
< 1206878397 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's being uploaded < 1206878452 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iki.fi/deewiant < 1206878532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odd, looks like number of env variables differs < 1206878546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes to cut them out and sort them to make it possible to compare
< 1206878693 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, http://pastebin.ca/963235 <-- interesting < 1206878740 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, seems like ccbi add a env variable there, that is two spaces and is equal to the full path to the interpreter binary? < 1206878747 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err three spaces < 1206878878 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't do it here with y, at least < 1206878913 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, no, yes it does < 1206878916 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like a DMD quirk < 1206878954 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, only the DMD-compiled binary does it < 1206878962 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :food now -> < 1206879022 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so compile part with gdc and other part with dmd? ;) < 1206879068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, still says "BAD J doesn't set delta" for ccbi. huh < 1206880094 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: won't link together < 1206880102 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :singe GDC doesn't respect the D calling convention < 1206880131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1206880139 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and J works here just fine < 1206880157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odd, maybe my hg checkout is outdated? < 1206880168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of mycology < 1206880181 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doubtful < 1206880199 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does hg identify say < 1206880248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :7450b1fdaa5d+ tip < 1206880301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, also how do I switch upstream in mercurial now again to point to that domain name instead directly to the ip (and what was the domain name now again?) < 1206880327 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that won't help you since I don't keep the server running :-P < 1206880376 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1206880422 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's the latest myco < 1206880436 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... it seems fungus detect a difference that myco doesn't < 1206880440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with file loading < 1206880454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because cfunge enters an infinite loop in fungus < 1206880473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not on any specific module < 1206880515 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungus uses o in a way that myco doesn't, at least < 1206880518 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about i < 1206880586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.ca/963248 < 1206880591 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is at same point < 1206880594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just after first i < 1206880597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :differs a bit < 1206880673 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, it loaded negative? < 1206880681 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm no < 1206880868 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the J thing was a myco bug < 1206880883 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1206880887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you said it worked for you? < 1206880887 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pull from tar.us.to:8000 if you want < 1206880898 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that was against old myco, my bad < 1206880977 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait i wasn't wrong, something else is up < 1206880985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, sure a sec will pull < 1206881121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v▒22▒▒ < 1206881121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : X < 1206881121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 091+v < 1206881130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs. < 1206881131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v▒22▒▒ X < 1206881131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 091+v < 1206881134 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1206881227 0 :atsampso1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1206881236 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that is just after loading fspace < 1206881241 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the actual first difference < 1206881251 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what this is that mycology doesn't test < 1206881275 0 :atsampson!n=ats@7hw.poik.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206881282 0 :atsampso1!n=ats@7hw.poik.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206881288 0 :atsampso1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1206882056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, in D what is "static if"? < 1206882077 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compile-time if < 1206882082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1206882084 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of like #ifdef but better < 1206882096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"static if (needBegX) {" depends on from where it is called < 1206882099 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or more like #if rather < 1206882105 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that means two versions will be output? < 1206882108 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of the routine < 1206882110 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ye < 1206882115 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1206882545 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what I don't understand is the way ccbi loads the fspace module in fungus < 1206882547 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is: < 1206882556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v▒22▒▒ < 1206882556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : X < 1206882556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 091+v < 1206882573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me it seems like the X should end up on first line < 1206882625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't single step through the ccbi file loading code and I can't see what in the file loading code causes it to be loaded with the X on the second line < 1206882652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming the output from area is correct? < 1206882751 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might not be < 1206882781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1206882797 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially if it has to output binary < 1206882812 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, if the value at (0,0) is 10 for instance < 1206882817 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it'll output a line break there < 1206882858 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yep, (7,0) is 10 < 1206882884 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and (16,0) is the X < 1206882890 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it is on the first line < 1206882896 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the display is just messed up because of the NL < 1206882982 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1206883049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION again wish for a way to make ccbi output each instruction as it is executed so he can compare
< 1206888361 0 :timotiis!n=timotiis@jfkew.plus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1206889185 0 :vixey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1206890194 0 :ais523!n=ais523@sm01-fap01.bham.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1206890532 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1206891165 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"switching to a client that doesn't require me to type in PONGs by hand, because I'll be doing something else for a while" < 1206891206 0 :ais523!n=ais523@sm01-fap01.bham.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1206892955 0 :Tritonio_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206893033 0 :timotiis_!n=timotiis@jfkew.plus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1206893349 0 :timotiis!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1206893786 0 :ihope!n=ihope@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206893841 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ABAABABAABAABABAABABAABAABABAABAABABAABABAABAABABAABABAABAABABAABAABABAABABAABAABABAABAAB! < 1206893845 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ello. < 1206893909 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello sir. < 1206893992 0 :timotiis_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :timotiis < 1206894080 0 :wildhalcyon!n=chatzill@c-69-243-94-185.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206894095 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hola < 1206894123 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hai < 1206894133 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What you up to slereah? < 1206894246 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not much. < 1206894262 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You? < 1206894385 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Work's been draggin me down a lot < 1206894427 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keeping me from my project(s) < 1206894502 0 :ehird!n=ehird@91.105.71.247 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206894575 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just had a great idea < 1206894582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :set that Parrot image to Never Gonna Give You Up < 1206894586 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :put it on youtube as Basiliskroll < 1206894594 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill everyone < 1206894601 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..., profit < 1206894643 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see a flaw in your plan < 1206894646 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rick Astley < 1206894676 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: But if I removed Rick Astley it wouldn't be Basiliskroll :( < 1206894697 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more specifically ZOMBIE Rick Astley. The dude said, "NEVER gonna give you up" < 1206894727 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you kill Rick Astley with a Basiliskroll and you've got some real trouble on your hands < 1206894742 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It wouldn't work. < 1206894752 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For Never gonna give you up is a life giver. < 1206894760 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has been shown to cure terminal cancer patients. < 1206894847 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure? I thought they did a study that showed Rickrolling to be HIGHLY carcinogenic? < 1206894847 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: well, once Never Gonna Give You Up became untrue, everyone would die < 1206894849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of shock < 1206894870 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well... that may be the case. < 1206894898 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there's no way I'll be falling for a basiliskroll. I've got some neighborhood kids I've hired to watch all youtube links. You know... just in case. < 1206894925 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, once they see it and die, you won't be able to check further ones < 1206894939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's basically the mission plan of how that would work: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1206839450-d66c44db02a18598796ea18e5504d0fdde567d69.jpg < 1206894941 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just hire some new ones. < 1206894966 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: But when they're all gone... http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1206839450-d66c44db02a18598796ea18e5504d0fdde567d69.jpg explains that < 1206895019 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are those fractals, anyway? < 1206895021 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I thought the action was immediate. < 1206895043 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: it depends < 1206895048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the original BLIT has it to be pretty much immediate < 1206895052 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however < 1206895059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in BLIT, the main character sees it under protection < 1206895070 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but eventually submits to it because it had infected his brain due to long exposure < 1206895078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :& that was not immediate < 1206895093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would seem the immediateness is canon, but i find the delayed idea interesting too < 1206895103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope: I think it's some fractal edited < 1206895111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But hah, now you're both fscked. < 1206895121 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1206895130 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks to me like just two fractals superimposed. < 1206895138 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Created in UltraFractal, perhaps. < 1206895152 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No that parrot looks like it was made that way < 1206895163 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it fits the BLIT description almost perfectly (jagged parrot salami) < 1206895187 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1206895253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and http://www.old-computer-mags.com/Magazine/Your%20Sinclair%20N.23/Your%20Sinclair%20N.23.htm < 1206895748 0 :Tritonio_!n=Tritonio@150.140.229.252 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206896716 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@cE699BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1206897937 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@wads-5-233-27.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1206897951 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello everyone < 1206898071 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hulo < 1206898368 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: hello < 1206898373 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's it going, slereah_, ais523? < 1206898384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has been implementing INTERCAL all week
< 1206898394 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool- in what language? < 1206898396 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... I nearly typed @ical{} rather than INTERCAL then < 1206898400 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: C < 1206898406 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I maintain C-INTERCAL, an INTERCAL-to-C compiler < 1206898424 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't aware of that- neat < 1206898425 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I've been implementing new features in an attempt to do catchup with CLC-INTERCAL and to add some new things < 1206898436 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: awesome < 1206898436 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: sudo apt-get install intercal on Debian < 1206898459 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or http://intercal.freeshell.org is the home page for both of the main INTERCAL implementations < 1206898471 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think that package is available on Darwinports/Macports? < 1206898491 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: I don't know, but it isn't all that popular so I doubt it < 1206898502 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1206898608 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is designed to be portable, though < 1206898618 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that some of the newer features require gcc < 1206898641 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the INTERCAL to C link code requires gcc because I hook into the compiler between its preprocessing and compilation stages < 1206898654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and therefore have to use strange gcc command-line args like -x) < 1206898699 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spent ages on the autoconf script a couple of versions ago, so I'd be interested to know how well ./config.sh && make && sudo make install goes < 1206898718 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I know how much of a pain it is to get gcc installed on a Mac (I watched a friend do it once), so you might not want to bother < 1206899007 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: gcc is trivial on a mac < 1206899010 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. put in cd < 1206899016 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. select developer tools < 1206899018 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. hit next a few times < 1206899022 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4. there is not step 4 < 1206899037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: ah, they were trying to do it downloading things from some Apple developer thing over the Internet < 1206899048 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they got it working, but it took about an hour < 1206899052 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including manually editing various things < 1206899147 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf? < 1206899172 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really pretty straightforward < 1206899177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think part of the trouble may have been that they were trying to install other things at the same time < 1206899187 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe they got an unstable release or something by mistake < 1206899205 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never mind, anyway, if it's easy then that's one less hurdle < 1206899344 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really pretty funny how many "developer tools" come with macs out of the box- the full JDK, python, perl, ruby, vi and nano, tons of the usual unix utilities, etc < 1206899440 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, and pretty ironic how you have to install them on some Linux distributions nowadays < 1206899460 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for instance Ubuntu is missing all the C header files unless you specifically request them) < 1206899657 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it meshes with Apple's main goal for the "out of box experience"- yeah, OSX comes with a ton of drivers and things you probably don't need, but by preinstalling them nearly everything "just works" when you plug it in. < 1206899727 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: agreed. At least Ubuntu does that with drivers, and I suppose the no header files thing is for much the same reason as burying the command line in the menus < 1206899795 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in general, I think Apple has struck a good balance between making things user-friendly and avoiding "dumbing down" the unix environment for people who want to use it. < 1206899845 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, are you going to try to install C-INTERCAL, then? < 1206899914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i think i did c-intercal on os x once < 1206899927 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might < 1206899931 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: It's changed a lot since then, unless you did it recently < 1206899965 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I redid the build system for version 0.27 < 1206899995 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... pity oerjan isn't here, I found a bug in his INTERCAL Unlambda interpreter that was masked by a bug in the compiler itself < 1206900012 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and when I fixed the compiler bug, I had to fix the Unlambda interp too < 1206900102 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is madness. < 1206900142 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slereah_: what is madness? < 1206900155 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL unlambda < 1206900175 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slereah_: it works! < 1206900184 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is madness :o < 1206900199 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it must have been doubly difficult for oerjan to write, it served as a useful test case for the new comment-handling system < 1206900206 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, my first version of Lazy Bird was tried on the Love Machine 9000 < 1206900209 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because oerjan likes to vary styles of commens a lot < 1206900210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: maybe you should write a build system in 5 lines of perl < 1206900211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1206900211 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It didn't work though < 1206900215 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/commens/comments/ < 1206900222 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: they'd have to be long lines < 1206900235 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there are so many files to sort out and put into various places < 1206900248 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a C-INTERCAL build system golf would be an interesting challenge, though < 1206900513 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206900528 0 :okopol!n=oklofok@spark.turku.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1206900584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okopol: you've dropped the l again < 1206900619 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully it isn't with oerjan again, or there'll be a longer wait before you get it back this time because you'll have to wait for them to be online < 1206900631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: makeit glob < 1206900631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1206900642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as the 'what if files are missing' < 1206900644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it check the web < 1206900646 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a file list < 1206900648 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, not web < 1206900648 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: the dependencies don't follow a pattern < 1206900649 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something p2p < 1206900653 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no single point of failure < 1206900654 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1206900659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: analyze the header includes, duhh < 1206900665 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I often install C-INTERCAL on a computer that isn't connected to the internet < 1206900678 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: that's dependencies on header files < 1206900686 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the object files connect together in more than one way < 1206900697 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so some global variables are used just to transmit which files are connected < 1206900710 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as another example, some data files can be read on disk or compiled into the program < 1206900729 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and which method is used depends on whether you're compiling convickt (a command-line utility) or libick.a (a library) < 1206900821 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, um < 1206900827 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grab the dependencies from the p2p < 1206900828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1206900835 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just load a perl file from the web and eval() < 1206900838 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one line build system < 1206900839 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1206900852 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: very abusable < 1206900860 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh shush < 1206900861 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1206900866 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I do not have Internet access ususally when building C-INTERCAL < 1206900874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ususally/usually/ < 1206900891 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Windows computer that I test the DOS build on doesn't have Internet access ever < 1206900929 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'java for smalltalk programmers': the saddest title article i've seen all day < 1206900961 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: that's a pretty bad title < 1206900970 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reversing the language names would make some kind of sense < 1206900994 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: If you reverse it I don't want to work with any resulting programs < 1206900995 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1206901008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: agreed < 1206901021 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems sad that someone knows enough smalltalk to know how to tell people how to switch from it to java, and yet still reccomends doing so < 1206901168 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMO the only advantage of Java is its ability to do crossplatform GUIs < 1206901182 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and although that's a massive advantage the rest of the language is so bad as to make me not want to use it again anyway < 1206901530 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and the api for the uis is horrible < 1206901534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well as most of the end user experience < 1206901543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I know < 1206901556 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had to study it for a semester < 1206901564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in the end we had to produce networked Snakes-and-Ladders programs < 1206901573 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is one of the most pointless games ever to run networked < 1206901579 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Squeak can do cross-platform UIs though. That may have something to do with the fact that it runs in its own window & VM and tries to avoid interacting with anything outside that window. :-) < 1206901588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the interaction was just clicking on a button to make your move < 1206901598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's good for development though: the UI is suited to it < 1206901602 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a few other controls to set up the network connection in the first place < 1206901619 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has been playing a little with smalltalk recently, currently creating a wiki with Seaside incredibly rapidly
< 1206901627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the model takes a lot of getting used to < 1206901634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm picking it up quickly < 1206902693 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-080-228-178-129.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1206902813 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1206902836 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-091-096-050-044.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1206902956 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this could make a great desktop: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/2a/Spider_crab_at_the_Kaiyukan_in_Osaka%2C_Japan.JPG < 1206903120 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: it's easier on the person following the link to link to the image description page rather than the image itself, so as to be able to see the copyright conditions easily < 1206903132 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :going from the URL back to the description page is annoying to have to do < 1206903148 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the other way is just one click < 1206903154 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, sorry: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Spider_crab_at_the_Kaiyukan_in_Osaka%2C_Japan.JPG < 1206903165 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: 'mediawiki is crap, fix it for me' < 1206903166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1206903195 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you really expect MediaWiki to be able to influence the content of a direct link to an image? < 1206903229 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :changing the metadata might be one way to do it, but would be counterintuitive < 1206903257 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i expect mediawiki to discourage linking to such direct resources when the common user wants some metadata too < 1206903294 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I'd like it to do that too, but having direct links to the images is needed for some purpose too. There needs to be some way to educate users not to post links to them, though. < 1206903315 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Worse: most users I come across just post direct links to the /thumbnails/, which is not really useful to anyone) < 1206903348 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Just make the inteerface clearer < 1206903366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basic case: don't make the image itself a link on the description page. < 1206903371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is people are used to right-clicking on images < 1206903374 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put a 'download' link somewhere. < 1206903386 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there is currently ongoing work to make the description pages more obvious < 1206903405 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: are they going to make the code sane after that? :-) < 1206903418 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MediaWikiBagOStuff, what great OOP design < 1206903421 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: actually they rewrote the image backend a few months ago < 1206903446 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i meant the whole thing < 1206903447 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1206903468 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems unlikely that there'll ever be a Phase 4 nowadays < 1206903485 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the phase number goes up by 1 with each complete rewrite, it's at 3 at the moment) < 1206903492 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: enterprisey < 1206903514 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but it's relative to what's used on Wikipedia rather than MediaWiki itself) < 1206903528 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :((Phase 1 wasn't MediaWiki-based at all IIRC)) < 1206903534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: one problem with mediawiki -- < 1206903540 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actual core revision system < 1206903551 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only handles linear, simple changes < 1206903557 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and doesn't even store them efficiently < 1206903582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a wiki based on the ideas behind darcs or git will be the future -- no 'LULZ ALREADY EDITED' messages (well, maybe 1 or 2) < 1206903585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe even USING git or darcs < 1206903586 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends on what you mean by 'efficient' < 1206903599 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, MediaWiki is bad for edit conflicts < 1206903606 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly because their diff algorithm is rubbish < 1206903643 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikimedia use GNU diff3 noncustomised for edit conflict merges IIRC < 1206903669 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the issue is that wikitext rarely contains newlines < 1206903688 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: mediawiki is a great big hack that has its outsides polished to look modern < 1206903689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1206903761 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1206903769 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems irony is all the range when it comes to web stuff < 1206903771 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: C-INTERCAL is a great big hack, but that's deliberate < 1206903783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Avi Bryant, creator of Seaside, 's blog is powered by typepad < 1206903793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ruby on rails website is powered by PHP < 1206903796 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could go on < 1206903797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are things like Perl idioms dropped into the C code that manages CLC-INTERCAL character set translation (because CLC-INTERCAL is written in Perl) < 1206903826 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: isn't making it a great big hack kinda hard to maintain < 1206903826 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1206903837 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, yes < 1206903857 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I wouldn't have got into maintaining an INTERCAL compiler in the first place if I was scared of 'hard to maintain' < 1206903897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1206903913 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... it's a pity that vim.org doesn't have a 'generator' < 1206903922 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was hoping it would say that it was written in Emacs < 1206903925 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1206903935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gnu.org might have some vi pages < 1206903938 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems pretty likely < 1206903943 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.81.172 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206903953 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be jealous of my new T-shirt acquisition: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/images/1206899749-shirt.png < 1206903978 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: die < 1206903979 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now < 1206903981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::< < 1206903981 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the back says "programming enrichment activity test subject" < 1206903991 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1206904009 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delicious cake. < 1206904012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: was there cake, and was it delicious < 1206904018 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more importantly < 1206904019 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it moist < 1206904022 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately, it was a lie < 1206904027 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I checked the Emacs page there, and there was no note of a generator anyway < 1206904030 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you refrain from crying over every mistake? < 1206904035 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typos are inevitable, you know. < 1206904038 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/anyway/anywhere/ < 1206904053 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION notes another example of comic timing in the last two comments
< 1206904081 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: your QDB should have an IRC logger < 1206904081 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do people develop on Vista? < 1206904091 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we can just say $$QDBTHIS$$ or some other special token < 1206904097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: haha < 1206904100 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Computer Science got done, and we made a neat gun for the people who are still alive. < 1206904101 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the QDB will automatically add the quote < 1206904106 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well i'll probably get a logger in here sometime < 1206904109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because ircbrowse's interface sucks < 1206904120 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi`: with difficulty, and by paying a lot of money for MS development tools < 1206904132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the logger will probably plug into the bot which will be done at the same time (jesus, second coming thereof) < 1206904136 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hi Sukoshi` < 1206904138 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hear the MS development tools are free these days. < 1206904138 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'll be @remember < 1206904140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or soemthing < 1206904148 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but.. how does it know how many lines to quote? < 1206904155 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1206904159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mostly you want to cut out irrelevent lines < 1206904173 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: it would have to be manually edited < 1206904188 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either that, or just use a stream editor language, like sed or TECO, but with the lines numbered in the reverse direction < 1206904226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so to quote the exchange above, I could write $$QDBTHIS:1,21d;24,$d$$ < 1206904243 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's sed by the way, I don't know TECO) < 1206904261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it would seem that exchange is less efficient than using the mouse < 1206904270 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: to do what? < 1206904274 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you swipe over the lines you want, type 'qdb.eso-std.org/submit' < 1206904276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paste it < 1206904277 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my mouse can't send emails by itself < 1206904283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :delete the lines < 1206904284 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :click submit < 1206904288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1206904309 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm serious here. < 1206904311 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I want to be able to do things entirely over IRC < 1206904331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi`: I'd probably use cygwin or DJGPP if I had to do development on Vista < 1206904331 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm on Vista, and I'd like to be able to do Windows development and cross-platfom development. < 1206904341 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I've been looking into Cygwin and MinGW. < 1206904342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi`: mingw < 1206904342 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't do Windows development < 1206904355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never do plain windows dev, btw < 1206904359 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will murder you in your sleep. < 1206904361 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, not plain Windows dev < 1206904371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that should be completely avoided because the Windows API is so strange < 1206904371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1206904380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we're like soulmates! < 1206904381 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of. < 1206904383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without the soul part < 1206904384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last I checked, the Windows equivalent to fork() had 11 parameters < 1206904384 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the mate part < 1206904392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that was back for Windows 95 < 1206904394 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's scary. < 1206904425 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortunately, I can't remember what they were all for, or I'd have gone mad by now < 1206904433 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I never tried to use it < 1206904452 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just used the Windows equivalent of system(), which is not the right way to do things but is good enough sometimes and easier to understand < 1206904468 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1206904480 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION used to do Windows development back sufficiently long ago that they usually targeted Windows 3.1
< 1206904529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1206904535 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a list of languages with continuations < 1206904538 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there just aren't enough of them < 1206904565 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: depends on what you mean by 'continuation' < 1206904574 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does setjmp produce a continuation, for instance? < 1206904581 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about try/catch/throw? < 1206904588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: definately not < 1206904589 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about C-INTERCAL's MAYBE? < 1206904592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are not continuations < 1206904596 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those 'continuations' are downwards-only < 1206904610 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once dropping below their creation point on the stack, you cannot call them < 1206904621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the second criterion: reusable < 1206904621 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the INTERCAL one can be used both ways < 1206904626 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but is not reusable < 1206904626 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :continuations can be called multiple times < 1206904634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: then it's not a continuation < 1206904644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's a continuation in a loose sense < 1206904649 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a thoroughly useless one < 1206904650 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can make a reusable version by putting MAYBE in a loop < 1206904664 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1206904669 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... maybe I should write an INTERCAL program that CREATEs genuine continuations using MAYBE < 1206904675 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuation#Example < 1206904686 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can do that with MAYBE and a loop then yeah C-INTERCAL has real continuations < 1206904697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that tempts me to write a continuation-based web app in it < 1206904699 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would just be hilarious < 1206904718 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one issue is that the continuations return void, which makes things harder than normal < 1206904733 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do have a programmer-specified finite supply of global continuation-unaffected variables, though < 1206904736 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can you pass values to the continuations? < 1206904744 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but each of them is a single bit and hard to read < 1206904745 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: no < 1206904747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in scheme, < 1206904763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(call/cc (lambda (k) ;; k is a procedure. when called with X, this call/cc returns X < 1206904769 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I know < 1206904781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL doesn't have first-class functions < 1206904785 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just first-class integers < 1206904790 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so all you could pass back would be an integer < 1206904804 0 :oklopol!n=oklofok@oklopol.yok.utu.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1206904819 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :come to think of it, they aren't true continuations simply because you have no way to store them < 1206904841 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, if you go back to an earlier continuation, you lose all the continuations made since then because you had nowhere to put them < 1206904869 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you reference a continuation by counting back how long ago a particular continuation was created) < 1206904901 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, the whole MAYBE thing is just a special case of the threader, so you could still get true continuations by defining something that worked like MAYBE but acted differently < 1206904926 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, it wouldn't get the special optimisation the compiler does on MAYBE, so your program would get slower the more continuations were in existence < 1206904968 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has even more insane plans to extend the threader to be able to do lambdas too, but that's still an early-stage concept
< 1206904999 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION gets to work on an INTERCAL continuation library, just for fun
< 1206905026 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... INTERCAL has variables. Should INTERCAL continuations record and restore those? The problem doesn't come up in Scheme. < 1206905034 0 :okopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :No route to host < 1206905035 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: scheme has variables. < 1206905035 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be inclined to say that they should < 1206905041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: here, i'll define a continuation: < 1206905046 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you copy the call stack, not the heap < 1206905049 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get local variables etc < 1206905053 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not globals < 1206905053 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND < 1206905065 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you store a reference into a local, the object referenced is changed later on, then you jump back < 1206905069 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the object in the reference has changed < 1206905077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so: a continuation is a copy of the call stack. < 1206905085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calling it just wipes the call stack and replaces it with the copy < 1206905087 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: INTERCAL doesn't store 'auto' variables on the call stack < 1206905091 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead each variable has its own stack < 1206905099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: dynamic scoping? < 1206905103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then continuations will be hard < 1206905119 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but, just copy every variable < 1206905121 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it SHOULD work < 1206905122 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more that you can change the scoping mechanism at will, even during the execution of a program < 1206905131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuation#Example just get that working < 1206905132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1206905147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll store all the variables and the stashes inside the continuations, because that's what the compiler currently does < 1206905189 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except the top STASH element for .1, so you can send a 16-bit integer back < 1206905223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is there anything that comppiles down to intercal? < 1206905235 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, wait < 1206905242 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the only way you can do continuations when using the c stack < 1206905247 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is copying the c stack's memory < 1206905257 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i'll make it easy for you < 1206905258 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://homepage.mac.com/sigfpe/Computing/continuations.html < 1206905261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's continuations for pure c < 1206905268 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :older-style c though < 1206905273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you should be able to utilize it < 1206905279 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I already have code that copies memory around < 1206905289 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm not writing a C library to give continuations to INTERCAL < 1206905300 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but instead writing the code to give continuations to INTERCAL entirely in INTERCAL itself < 1206905303 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok then < 1206905307 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the latest version is self-extending < 1206905307 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but look at that c code < 1206905308 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may hhelp < 1206905346 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I have done < 1206905514 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: makecontext/setcontext may be proper continuations in c < 1206905515 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am testing < 1206905577 0 :ihope_!n=ihope@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206905614 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : char func1_stack[16384]; < 1206905614 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1206906114 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: challenge - once doing the continuations, implement prolog in it < 1206906115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1206906138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: look at pit/tests/permute.i in the C-INTERCAL distributions < 1206906150 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses backtracking to write out all permutations of I-VI < 1206906168 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the backtracking already exists, it's just continuations that need to be written < 1206906180 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I have plans for a Prolog to INTERCAL compiler already < 1206906196 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1206906196 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1206906197 0 :sekhmet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1206906371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... netsplits are interesting things, especially as I seem to get a different server at Freenode every time I connect to it < 1206906401 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe clients should just try disconnect/reconnect if they aren't voiced or opped in the hope that they end up on the large side of the netsplit at random < 1206906402 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@cE699BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1206906464 0 :wildhalcyon!n=chatzill@c-69-243-94-185.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1206906522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, wildhalcyon did < 1206906588 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did what? < 1206906595 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@209.248.124.243 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206906597 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : maybe clients should just try disconnect/reconnect if they aren't voiced or opped in the hope that they end up on the large side of the netsplit at random < 1206906601 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1206906605 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you might have only one server reasonably close by < 1206906615 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yes < 1206906633 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I tend to get a different server every time I connect, so maybe it should be a preference, or the client should experiment and find out < 1206906634 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case, reconnecting across the world just to bypass a netsplit seems a bit.. pointless < 1206906660 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if you connect to the generic irc.freenode.net or whatever they usually dole out servers at random < 1206906681 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, maybe it tries to give a fast server < 1206906730 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I find that I usually connect to a server on the west coast of the USA (I'm in Europe) if I connect to the 'generic server' < 1206906804 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get kubrick often < 1206906813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[16:28] [MOTD] - kubrick.freenode.net Message of the Day - < 1206906813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[16:28] [MOTD] - Welcome to kubrick.freenode.net in Los Angeles, CA, USA! Thanks to < 1206906813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[16:28] [MOTD] - Velocity Networks (www.vel.net) for sponsoring this server! < 1206906813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[16:28] [MOTD] - < 1206907166 0 :sekhmet!n=pez@wilug/madlug/sekhmet JOIN :#esoteric < 1206907187 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is on leguin at the moment, which is in Sweden
< 1206907969 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1206907975 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really DO want a list of languages with continuations < 1206907975 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1206908110 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, INTERCAL once I finish this, Unlambda, Underlambda, Subtle Cough, that's about it for esolangs (from memory) < 1206908131 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Subtle Cough has a whole lot of it. < 1206908154 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION does not know what continuation is.
< 1206908162 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slereah_: pity it's an unusable language, oerjan and I independently proved that there are only three non-equivalent programs, two of which just end and one of which is an infinite loop < 1206908185 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're working on continuations for intercal? < 1206908190 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: yes < 1206908200 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm actually implementing them in INTERCAL itself, just to show that it's possible < 1206908202 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1206908236 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you're extending some intercal compiler/interpreter written in intercal? < 1206908238 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the upcoming C-INTERCAL 0.28 has a CREATE statement that allows you to create new syntax on the fly; CLC-INTERCAL has had a similar statement with different syntax for a while) < 1206908244 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't mean esolangs, hehe < 1206908251 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if SKI + c is equivalent to lambda-mu calculus. < 1206908253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i proved that independantly too < 1206908259 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: the compiler is written in C, and compiles to C < 1206908269 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can write extensions to it in either C or INTERCAL < 1206908273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: ais523 maintains C-INTERCAL < 1206908281 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he recently added a way to write extensions to it in INTERCAL itself < 1206908292 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so recently it hasn't been publically released yet < 1206908302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was on Thursday IIRC, or possibly Friday < 1206908303 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hadn't imagined actual users of intercal actually existed < 1206908314 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: here's one for the qdb -- Chirpy, on approval of a quote, sends a trackback/pingback to every URL in the quote which takes them < 1206908317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1206908334 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: certainly there aren't many intercal programs < 1206908347 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the implementations do sure support a lot of advanced stuff that no program will ever utilize ;) < 1206908440 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I count 62 INTERCAL programs as examples supplied with C-INTERCAL, many of which aren't very interesting < 1206908456 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we add any INTERCAL programs we find as examples, as long as the licences are compatible < 1206908472 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(CLC has its own examples too, some of which are just tests) < 1206908489 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I want a combination of Prolog, ML and INTERCAL < 1206908491 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in one thing < 1206908494 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how < 1206908497 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it should look crazy < 1206908502 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but the infamous CLC-INTERCAL 'Hello, world' isn't in the C-INTERCAL example repository because it doesn't work on C-INTERCAL) < 1206908523 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Prolog+INTERCAL's more or less been done; you'll have to tell me about ML, though, because I know the name but no more than that < 1206908541 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ML inspired Haskell < 1206908545 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's strict and non-pure though < 1206908549 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1206908551 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Ocaml descends from it < 1206908555 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia it, the article's good < 1206908563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ML & Ocaml are notorious for being crazy fast) < 1206908580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION will have to actually implement their plans for Functional INTERCAL some time
< 1206908629 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it only needs one tiny extra ability, the ability to create a woven thread but with some variables' read-only statuses themselves made read-only < 1206908652 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should take the time to learn intercal some day... < 1206908676 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the woven threads would be dormant, but could NEXT FROM the current thread if no other threads wanted to < 1206908718 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: when you do, read the C-INTERCAL and CLC-INTERCAL docs for a perspective on what the language is like nowadays (http://intercal.freeshell.net), most docs are out of date < 1206908740 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant http://intercal.freeshell.org < 1206908756 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION managed to get freeshell and freenode confused again
< 1206908871 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO CREATE (8200) GET CONTINUATION IN .1 RECEIVING .2 < 1206908876 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO CREATE (8250) CONTINUE WITH .1 SENDING .2 < 1206908894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: how's that for syntax for INTERCAL continuation statements? < 1206908914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, sorry < 1206908917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ignore the bits from the line label and earlier, the bit after the line label is the syntax that's created) < 1206908917 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those continuations are useless < 1206908922 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: why < 1206908931 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's (call/cc (lambda (k) (set! .2 k)) < 1206908936 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL doesn't have first-class functions, remember < 1206908937 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need (call/cc (lambda (k) ...)) < 1206908940 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes < 1206908943 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but < 1206908947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just allow a check: < 1206908952 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'have i just thawed out of a continuation?' < 1206908955 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, then ..., else ... < 1206908975 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning to use the second arg for a check, the same way C does it with setjmp/longjmp < 1206908984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: then you can't recv some values < 1206908990 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get 0 if you are receiving from a continuation, and >0 otherwise < 1206909014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: first, you can't send a 0 in C either, and second, what's wrong with not being able to receive some values (remember this is INTERCAL we're talking about) < 1206909018 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'get cont in .1 recv .2; if thawed? ...; else !!!' --> '(set! .2 (call/cc (lambda (k) (set! .1 k) !!!))) ...' < 1206909032 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: first, C doesn't have continuations, and second I guess not but still.. < 1206909035 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 isn't an uncommon value. < 1206909040 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but maybe I should get it to ABSTAIN #1 FROM NEXTING instead as a notification < 1206909058 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words, if you've just thawed, turn off procedure calls until the user turns them back on < 1206909072 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way you wouldn't need to do an if, you'd just do the call and if you'd just thawed, nothing would happen < 1206909078 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you'd turn them back on on the next line < 1206909097 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's more INTERCAL-style, I'll do that and it still has the same syntax < 1206909108 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you'll need closures < 1206909111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1206909111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not < 1206909123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah, wait < 1206909131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's useful for a continuation-using procedure to be able to return after a call/cc < 1206909136 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can just call a procedure it's not that useful < 1206909145 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: but you can return < 1206909160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you think you wouldn't be able to? < 1206909181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in INTERCAL it's even possible to return from a different procedure than the one you're in at the moment, which causes hilarity to ensue < 1206909188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, good. < 1206909194 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you just have to return 2 levels down < 1206909198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very good < 1206909199 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO RESUME #2 < 1206909211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what's the syntax for intercal procedure calls? < 1206909216 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO (1000) NEXT < 1206909229 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the same syntax is also used for GOTOs < 1206909244 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just have to discard the return address immediately afterwards with DO FORGET #1 < 1206909300 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, ick and yuk < 1206909335 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what about a string with 'hello world' in it < 1206909337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :100231238123 lines? ;) < 1206909357 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's nontrivial, but I've got a copy lying around somewhere, I'll paste it if you like < 1206909385 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not a printing one < 1206909388 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean something i can give to a procedure < 1206909404 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I know < 1206909413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is thinking of a page that displays 'Hello, world!' and an OK box, then 'Goodbye, world!' and an OK box, then loops
< 1206909414 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1206909417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, in pseudocode < 1206909431 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while 1: show_msg('Hello, world!'); show_msg('Goodbye, world!') < 1206909441 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO;1<-#3 < 1206909443 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO;1SUB#1<-#48376$#10752 < 1206909443 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO;1SUB#2<-#28676$#2836 < 1206909443 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PLEASE;1SUB#3<-#61120$#896 < 1206909444 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where, of course, show_msg stores a continuation then kills off the current execution thread < 1206909458 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, that's not too bad < 1206909475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's machine-generated of course, and is compressed as 4 bytes to the array element and so needs to be unpacked before printing) < 1206909828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... I need to generate unique numbers for each continuation < 1206909848 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means storing the lowest unused number somewhere were it won't be affected by continuation resumes < 1206909855 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, maybe intercal should have a module system for registering line numbers < 1206909862 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I can store it in a separate thread < 1206909869 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or some kind of tree structure rather than line numbers at all < 1206909893 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: we have something 'better', in a twisted sense of the word. Because all known INTERCAL programs are stored in the same place, you can just look at them and pick a line number that doesn't conflict < 1206909903 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however I admit that that isn't ideal < 1206909961 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: correction, that Hello, world! string was obviously packed 8-to-the-element, or there's no way it would fit in just 3 elements < 1206910145 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah < 1206910154 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: maybe there should be a string library < 1206910155 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that lets you do that < 1206910156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1206910168 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: generally we use yapp.i in the INTERCAL distribution < 1206910185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a filter that reads in a string on stdin and outputs an INTERCAL program that prints that string on stdout < 1206910233 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can then just extract the relevant parts, allowing for the Turing Tape pointer (that is, C-INTERCAL string I/O specifies characters to output as offsets mod 256 from the previous character output, so you need to keep a state variable to do I/O correctly) < 1206910304 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah, but the concisity would help < 1206910311 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :& the fact that it would be less manual < 1206910325 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yes, it would be useful to have a string library < 1206910342 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a program for producing packed strings, and subroutines for printing them < 1206910350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, printing them and unpacking them and.. < 1206910350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe some things for input too < 1206910370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extract individual characters, substring match... < 1206910376 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe even regexps while we're at it < 1206910716 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: heh < 1206910886 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION just found this in the Emacs changelog: "The old bindings C-M-delete and C-M-backspace have been deleted"
< 1206910897 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how many people got caught out trying to use them before? < 1206910988 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1206912091 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :""Going home"" < 1206912098 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LMAO < 1206912165 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use those bindings all the time! < 1206912231 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :much simpler than good old M-x reboot and M-x kill-x-server < 1206912518 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206912599 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :j0 < 1206913121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION mutters at #gsoc
< 1206913136 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There may or may not be a deadline extension for Google Summer of Code applications. < 1206913169 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1206913405 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"may or may not"? what's the use of having that information? < 1206913421 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: None. < 1206913428 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just irritating as fuck. < 1206913443 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The deadline, BTW, is tomorrow. < 1206913449 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(5:00 PST) < 1206913465 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: Maybe you're an intuitionist, and doesn't believe in the excluded middle :o < 1206913472 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's a third option or something < 1206913553 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, a v \+a /= T if the middle is not excluded < 1206913658 0 :slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Konversation terminated!" < 1206914870 0 :RedDak!n=dak@87.18.81.172 JOIN :#esoteric < 1206915699 0 :RedDak!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1206916380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehirDoxCoding < 1206916397 0 :ehirDoxCoding!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird < 1206916671 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, people aren't warming up to my idea < 1206916673 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-( < 1206916702 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was it < 1206916750 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.osdev.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16641&sid=fc48cb502be44b2cb268e10886963cb7 < 1206916766 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can ignore the session id I suppose < 1206916771 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :osdev.org? neat < 1206916817 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, its a neat site < 1206916839 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know it < 1206916989 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems like there's some people who just don't get my idea, and some people who don't think its worthwhile. No one says "Hmm, that might have real-world applicability!" < 1206917060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: it seems to be a good debate < 1206917067 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: but your idea has no real-world applicability < 1206917069 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is true < 1206917073 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Its a great debate, actually. < 1206917073 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting in theory < 1206917101 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"interesting" is the best response I've received so far. < 1206917241 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely this is not for Real World systems but is supposed to be esoteric? < 1206917249 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: I sure hope so < 1206917301 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, its not meant to be quite as esoteric as you might think. < 1206917331 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remove the 2D spatial programming language (fungeoid) and replace it with something more conventional. That's really the only esoteric part about it < 1206917344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.osdev.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=16587 lollynoob is more like lollyidiot < 1206917345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1206917509 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: Dex is funny < 1206917529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you see when he left the forum dramatically and said he was going to get rich from a web os? < 1206917554 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The problem is that lollynoob starts with a bad argument, makes a good point, then screws up with the rest of it. < 1206917570 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who is dex? < 1206917604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: osdev.org user < 1206917625 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't seen anything of him. But I just joined the site this week < 1206917704 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildhalcyon: I visited the old osdev.org a few times < 1206917736 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a forum on mega-tokyo.com: http://www.mega-tokyo.com/forum/ < 1206917746 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which also housed stuff for agi development < 1206917755 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(agi = sierra adventure game engine) < 1206917760 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it seems like it has potential, but I don't know if OS development is quite the right forum for this anyways < 1206917790 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :& the best users on osdev.org are the ones from mt < 1206917794 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brendan, etc < 1206917811 0 :wildhalcyon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Im starting the idea off as a simulation anyways. gamedev.net is probably better suited. < 1206919337 0 :Sukoshi`!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sukoshi < 1206919603 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"CommandQ" < 1206920510 0 :timotiis!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving"