00:00:04 I guess it is. 00:00:12 dogface: hm, no 00:00:19 well yeah 00:00:22 Must not be, actually. 00:00:23 an axiom is that it's inconsistent 00:00:25 so it must be 00:00:26 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:00:26 -!- otpbot has set topic: *sex. 00:00:30 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:00:32 nice debut 00:00:49 tusho: LOGS. 00:00:49 tusho: an axiom isn't that "it" is inconsistent; an axiom is that ZFC is inconsistent. 00:00:58 psygnisfive: wut 00:01:02 you need logs 00:01:08 what do you mean 00:01:08 you cant not link to the logs 00:01:12 yes 00:01:13 I know that 00:01:15 jesus fucking christ 00:01:17 I'm fixing that 00:01:19 *sex is not a link to the logs 00:01:20 stop being so anal 00:01:20 :P 00:01:28 -!- psygnisfive has set topic: anal*sex. 00:01:28 Though ZFC being inconsistent implies that ZFC + "ZFC is inconsistent" is inconsistent, too. 00:01:31 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:01:31 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Hmm, indeed.. 00:01:37 otpbot: test 00:01:40 urgh 00:01:41 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:01:43 psygnisfive: well metaphysically speaking, and considering rule 34... 00:01:55 what? 00:02:10 everything is linked to sex 00:02:41 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:02:41 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | >. 00:02:44 otpbot test 00:02:49 hmm 00:02:51 verily, that is b0rken 00:02:53 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:02:55 thats not a metaphorical use of the word link, its just a different word. 00:02:59 you suck, oerjan. 00:03:02 So, ZFC + "this theory is inconsistent" is inconsistent, isn't it? Proving that the existence of a proof of a statement implies that statement would prove that. 00:03:29 psygnisfive: you are probably not ready to understand this yet 00:03:38 Doesn't that mean that ZFC being consistent implies that ZFC + "ZFC is consistent" is consistent? 00:03:39 erg 00:03:46 metaphysically, god damnit 00:03:50 brain, READ. 00:03:58 tho still. 00:03:59 what? 00:04:11 How did I come to that conclusion, I wonder... 00:04:25 you have also forgotten rule 57 of #esoteric: 00:04:34 you do not talk about #esoteric? 00:04:36 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:04:37 * oerjan is joking 97% of the time 00:04:41 otpbot 00:04:46 otpbot you're an asshole 00:04:48 you don't listen to me. 00:04:49 asshole. 00:04:49 jokes are supposed to be funny 00:04:58 YOURS ARE NOT 00:05:04 actually shut the hell up psygnisfive 00:05:09 no u 00:05:10 i find them funny, I believe ihope/dogface does 00:05:13 ais523 does 00:05:17 basically everyone does. 00:05:17 tusho: once a day? 00:05:27 lament: once a minute atm for testing 00:05:27 :D 00:05:37 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:05:40 just like everyone found rodger's puzzle easy? 00:05:47 oh dear i don't think i've had anyone fighting over me before 00:05:52 tusho: i think it would make the most sense to base the interval on chat lines 00:06:03 or it could just be my usual lousy memory 00:06:04 lament: it's meant to give us something to talk about 00:06:05 Eh. End result: ZFC is so good that it's inconsistent. 00:06:09 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:06:09 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | what they express is generally a combination of what they're surrounded by. 00:06:11 otherwise when the channel is quiet, the bot would flood the logs 00:06:20 lament: not -that- much of a problem 00:06:23 if it's only once every 6 hours, say 00:06:28 otpbot tset 00:06:28 tusho: oklokok: waitwait we're talking about the halting problem here 00:06:28 sure 00:06:33 otpbot 00:06:34 tusho: one thing I tried to do a long time ago, and failed at, was to come up with bf code blocks to replace c commands.. for example: while(), etc. The basic ones are relatively simple, but it gets more complicated when break and continue are added 00:06:44 it just regurgitates log lines :D 00:06:45 otpbot! 00:06:45 tusho: function name(params) return 00:06:47 hm 00:06:54 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:07:05 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:07:05 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | like short int = short. 00:07:07 otpbot! 00:07:08 -!- otpbot has set topic: . . .. 00:07:10 ... 00:07:10 oops 00:07:15 :p 00:07:19 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:07:22 Guy who first said that: break and continue are easy to implement with continuations. 00:07:29 -!- otpbot has joined. 00:07:29 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | You suck GregorR!. 00:07:31 optbot! 00:07:33 er 00:07:34 HAHAHHAHA 00:07:41 oh man, it's better than a markov chain 00:07:46 context removal is awesome 00:07:51 otpbot! 00:07:51 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | they would need to switch every befung instruction. 00:07:55 otpbot! 00:07:55 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | anybody here?. 00:07:57 otpbot! 00:07:57 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | 9 oklopol: bf_txtgen. 00:08:01 optbot you are awesome. 00:08:04 otpbot you are awesome. 00:08:05 tusho: ehird: I will gladly hand you the reigns if you want to continue work on JSMMIX :P 00:08:06 god damn 00:08:10 LOL 00:08:10 tusho 00:08:12 otpbot! 00:08:12 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | SADOL can express strings like this "5idiot. 00:08:16 you're spamming now 00:08:18 stop this. 00:08:21 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | there's a pretty nifty little java implementation out there. 00:08:23 otpbot! 00:08:23 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ais523, same. 00:08:24 lament: should I stop this? 00:08:36 never! 00:08:40 right then 00:08:42 otpbot! 00:08:42 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | oklokok: compilers don't always do what i want them to do..... 00:08:51 otpbot: What is the meaning of life? 00:08:51 tusho: Aaaha! 00:08:54 XD 00:09:01 otpbot! 00:09:02 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | no sequence, either. 00:09:04 .. 00:09:07 otpbot: can Haskell be used to write a compiler? 00:09:08 lament: mtve: it could be assumed that all programs will eventually exit, by loss of power, malfunction, etc 00:09:17 IT IS SENTIENT 00:09:21 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | personally, I might've gone with black-on-white. 00:09:22 quite 00:09:32 i'll decrease that interval in a sec 00:09:35 but this is great :D 00:09:36 -!- Judofyr has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 00:09:41 otpbot: are you a human? 00:09:41 tusho: i lost my whirl interpreter 00:09:45 otpbot: who would win, God or Chuck Norris? 00:09:45 lament: I suspect Life32 is faster, though 00:09:46 ... lmao 00:09:47 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 00:09:57 otpbot: are you otpbot? 00:09:58 tusho: hm 00:09:59 we scared olsner 00:10:06 otpbot: why are you unsure? 00:10:07 tusho: /compiler 00:10:12 -!- Judofyr has joined. 00:10:13 otpbot: ah you need a compiler to be sure? 00:10:14 tusho: I don't simply care of ehird wants the name, he didn't announce it, nor release it, first 00:10:21 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | vp00-1g00*g00<. 00:10:21 otpbot: I don 00:10:22 tusho: And opened the hard drive 00:10:26 't want your name! 00:10:29 otpbot: what do you think of apples 00:10:30 lament: ahh its de onlz 00:10:33 ... 00:10:34 XDDDDDDDDDDD 00:10:35 otpbot: how easy is it to write a GCC backend? 00:10:36 dogface: oh ^^ 00:10:44 ^^ is an expression of happiness 00:10:46 therefore, it is easy 00:10:48 He's glad to find out. 00:10:56 Ah, cool. 00:10:58 otpbot: is this hilarious? 00:10:58 tusho: ais523: i'll condition on the modulo of a graham's number thingy 00:11:07 otpbot: are you insane? 00:11:07 oerjan: ... 00:11:08 ah, so there's a condition to its hilarity? 00:11:18 suck on this, turing 00:11:21 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ISWIM?. 00:11:21 otpbot! 00:11:26 sentience in like 10 lines of ruby 00:11:36 otpbot! 00:11:36 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | just to get to know the country. 00:11:38 optbot, what's 1/(sqrt(2)-1) as rational linear combinations of square roots? 00:11:41 tusho: refactor 00:11:44 lament: :D 00:11:47 hmm 00:11:50 I should make it optbot 00:11:50 otpbot! 00:11:51 -!- otpbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | hm?. 00:11:52 -!- tusho has changed nick to optbot. 00:11:57 hm? 00:12:19 -!- otpbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:12:25 I've wondered for a while whether 1/(sqrt(2)-1) even can be expressed as rational linear combinations of square roots. 00:12:36 -!- optbot has changed nick to tusho. 00:12:51 -!- optbot has joined. 00:12:51 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Well, it seems you're thinking "oolooloo" would be happy, where in my system it wouldn't.. 00:12:56 ... 00:12:58 hahahahaha wtf 00:13:12 1/(sqrt(2)-1) = (sqrt(2)+1)/3 00:13:20 optbot: do you have sentient genitals? 00:13:20 tusho: "something"? 00:13:23 er wait 00:13:28 optbot: not "something", "sentient genitals" 00:13:28 tusho: addOneColAndSucceed result = do addOneCol; return result 00:13:32 optbot: don't dodge the questino 00:13:33 tusho: to A? ah! that's my mistake then 00:13:40 optbot: yes it's your mistake so answer me. 00:13:41 tusho: ei voi ymmärtää 00:13:42 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ehird,. 00:13:44 optbot: fuck you 00:13:44 tusho: Deewiant, I'm working on fingerprints atm, well mine will be virtually as fast when they are disabled, and even virtually as fast as long as no finger print is loaded, but it will be slower if they are loaded, then on same speed as CCBI I guess 00:13:45 1/(sqrt(2)-1) = (sqrt(2)+1)/1 00:14:06 tusho: make it filter nicknames in the beginning of messages 00:14:06 dogface: ^ 00:14:07 -!- RedDak has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 00:14:12 lament: yeah, OK 00:14:24 ([^ ]+)[,:]\s+ 00:14:25 ! 00:14:38 By 1, do you mean 5? 00:14:42 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | is that too much. 00:14:43 tusho: not sure how well that would work :) 00:14:46 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:15:01 you need to check if it's a nickname or not 00:15:08 I should have noticed that. 00:15:09 "Deewiant, I'm working on " => "I'm working on" 00:15:17 "Sadly, I'm an idiot" => "Sadly, I'm an idiot" 00:15:21 beh 00:15:24 that's a lot of work 00:15:28 not really 00:15:35 lament: how would you do it? 00:15:38 i can't think of a trivial way 00:15:41 dogface: no, 1. because (sqrt(2)-1)*(sqrt(2)+1) = 1 00:15:41 I'm hand-doing sockets fort his 00:15:43 just look at the users currently in the channel, it'll work most of the time 00:15:50 yea but I have to parse stuff then 00:15:53 oerjan: oh, it is. 00:16:01 tusho: then just hardcode a list of users. 00:16:03 Now I can perform evils. 00:16:24 lament: it'd be huge 00:16:27 bleeeeeeh 00:17:03 tusho: okay, then just do what you did 00:17:13 "Sadly, I'm an idiot" => "I'm an idiot" is not that bad 00:17:18 dogface: (a^2 - b^2) = (a+b)*(a-b) is generally useful for removing square roots from denominators 00:17:36 oerjan: this bot is named after you 00:17:44 Oerjan's Terrible Puns -> otpbot -> optbot 00:19:15 -!- navaburo has left (?). 00:19:17 Quite so. 00:20:27 brace yourselves 00:20:28 with the french, the word order, i see 00:20:28 it is uploading to the server 00:25:33 on feb 07 00:27:09 hum... i know the limitations of my "language", how I can overstep them ? 00:27:27 M0ny: unicorns 00:27:55 unicorns ? 00:28:01 yse 00:28:03 lots of them 00:28:06 also, quasiconformal rhyncocephalians 00:28:06 horses with vaginas on their heads 00:28:13 er, i meant horns 00:28:22 vaginas, horns ... what's the difference 00:28:27 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep"). 00:28:33 tusho: semantics. 00:28:35 lol 00:28:37 yes 00:28:38 pure nitpicking 00:29:00 -!- pikhq has joined. 00:29:27 pikhq you are here to witness something special 00:29:31 For the record: pvmove is *unstable as fuck* when shuffling blocks to and from one's hard drive. 00:29:32 a day where topics are no longer boring 00:29:46 lament: when it sets the topic should it say who said it and when in-channel? 00:29:56 it would kinda ruin the no-context thing but it might lead to looking up some interesting discussions 00:30:28 i dunno 00:30:32 i like it more without context 00:30:40 maybe when it changes it, it'll say 00:30:48 (and as for the previous topic, "...", that was said by foo on bar) 00:30:54 so that you have to wait 6 hours to see 00:31:01 or have a command 00:31:09 yes perhaps 00:31:10 v2 ;) 00:31:13 that shows the quoted line in full, with a timestamp 00:31:32 less flooding 00:31:58 -!- Corun has joined. 00:32:24 unicorun :p 00:33:11 -!- Corun has quit (Client Quit). 00:33:50 so... i didn't understand the thing between an esolang and a unicorn xD 00:34:16 but, it's not important, i'll imagine :p 00:34:30 your imagination will serve you well 00:34:51 i hope 00:35:05 -!- optbot has joined. 00:35:05 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | pictures!. 00:35:19 now with eso-std.org goodness! 00:35:25 optbot: is this totally freakin' radical or what 00:35:25 tusho: if you in fact take a gander at the demo I have online at the http://rodger.nonlogic.org/games/CRPG/ 00:35:34 * tusho does so 00:35:45 Way to go, Rodger. 00:35:54 optbot: Do you like Rodger? 00:35:54 pikhq: ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzz 00:35:58 LMAO 00:36:00 HAHAHAHHAHAHAHA 00:36:23 RodgerTheGreat: it thinks you are boring 00:36:42 optbot, ? :p 00:36:43 M0ny: i'm sure we it's just my current dream :) 00:36:51 :) 00:36:59 i like this kind of bot 00:37:17 optbot: no 00:37:17 oerjan: that BF interpreter is a mess. 00:37:21 who say some bullshits sometimes :p 00:37:26 Not as good as a Markov chain bot, though. 00:37:30 pikhq: o rly? 00:37:32 i ran a megahal over it 00:37:35 it produced crap 00:37:37 i like it more than markov 00:37:38 not funny at all 00:37:39 optbot, malbolge helloworld 00:37:39 M0ny: he is here 00:37:42 just strung together rubbish 00:37:47 also it segfaulted all the time. 00:37:49 and was slow/ 00:37:50 optbot: let's run away into the woods 00:37:50 lament: you missed by the way. 00:37:56 optbot, but where ? 00:37:56 M0ny: Nah 00:38:08 Didn't we have a Markov chain bot in here once upon a time? 00:38:14 optbot: with a spoon? 00:38:14 oerjan: Yeah. 00:38:20 -!- SoapX has joined. 00:38:24 optbot: what? 00:38:24 lament: and return values are generally on the stack as well. 00:38:42 pikhq: I probably wrote it. Or oklopol. 00:38:49 But this is, so far, the best. 00:39:01 optbot: Marry me? 00:39:01 tusho: y -> x + y} 00:39:08 optbot: wtf dose that meen lol 00:39:09 tusho: it seems to have utterly confused the type-checker 00:39:11 ....... 00:39:14 LMAO 00:39:53 optbot: what does the opt in your name mean 00:39:53 tusho: (actually i didn't do it just works now again) 00:40:01 optbot: right - i did it 00:40:01 tusho: hi calamari 00:40:05 optbot, does god exist ? :o 00:40:05 M0ny: ((::**:*:*:*:*)((:)~*(*)*:o(h)~^^O):::**::***^!)::*::***^ohhhhhhhhhhhO( 00:40:07 optbot: I am not calamari, are you insane? 00:40:07 tusho: sigils? 00:40:12 optbot: sigils are pretty insane 00:40:12 tusho: READ THE SPECS CAREFULLY!!! 00:40:19 optbot: Why? Are they decreed to not be insane? 00:40:19 tusho: emerge around 50 when waiting for y/n on emerge -avDuN world 00:40:20 wtf, optbot what language is ? 00:40:21 M0ny: Um. . . Surely stack smashing is something that shouldn't be used? 00:40:27 M0ny: erload 00:40:32 optbot: what 00:40:32 tusho: it's what it is in perl 00:40:38 optbot: ah you describe things in perl? 00:40:38 tusho: ? :D 00:40:43 optbot: you seem confused 00:40:43 tusho: not really 00:40:46 optbot: oh? 00:40:46 tusho: And it sends the input with a btw. 00:40:53 optbot: I haven't seen any 'btw's just yet 00:40:53 tusho: strings* 00:40:59 optbot: It sends it with a string? What? 00:40:59 tusho: >>> numbda 4 4 00:41:04 optbot: A bot I am not 00:41:05 tusho: or just all of it 00:41:08 optbot: ?? 00:41:08 tusho: My female *stepparent* however. 00:41:14 ok i've had my fun 00:41:14 :D 00:41:16 optbot! 00:41:16 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | this is some groovy rock 'n' roll ;). 00:41:23 totally ;) 00:41:26 ;) 00:41:52 optbot: ;) 00:41:52 tusho: cool 00:41:54 optbot: ;) 00:41:54 tusho: lament i actually have a use for it :) 00:42:01 ... 00:42:10 he just told lament that he has a use for me. 00:42:10 :( 00:42:31 be very afraid 00:42:44 just look at what it said about malbolge 00:42:58 yeah it's sentient 00:42:58 duh 00:47:15 Now to write a Thue program that outputs x 'a's and y 'b's, where x/y = sqrt(2). 00:47:24 optbot: could YOU do that? 00:47:24 tusho: cya sgep 00:47:29 sgep 00:47:49 Security-enhanced gep. 00:47:52 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?538 00:48:09 * Sgeo realizes he was just not-quite-pinged 00:48:27 dogface: um, sqrt(2) _is_ irrational you know 00:48:32 Sgeo: meet our new bot 00:48:35 it changes the channel and talks 00:48:36 oerjan: it'll never stop running, then. 00:48:38 optbot: say hi to sgeo 00:48:38 tusho: i sync my clock with a timeserver so it should be the correct time 00:48:48 Hi optional bot optbot 00:48:49 Sgeo: how do i kill processes? 00:49:00 optbot, killall on Linux 00:49:01 Sgeo: hrm 00:49:05 optbot, helpful? 00:49:05 Sgeo: Blogs are just the retarded cusins of forums. 00:49:20 I wonder who said that. 00:49:25 It's just repeating lines it heard? 00:49:29 Sgeo: no 00:49:35 it uses hyper-powerful markov chains 00:49:38 with stochastic timing 00:49:46 (by hyper-powerful I mean level 4 :P) 00:50:10 To analyze {a -> ba, b -> a}... a is phi and b is 1 and at every step, it's multiplied by phi in a convergent manner. 00:51:06 dogface: yes, and that is connected to the equation x^2 + x + 1 = 0, so do something similar for x^2 = 2 ? 00:51:30 Well, there's {a -> bb, b -> a}, a being sqrt(2) and b being 1. 00:51:39 But the ratio of as to bs doesn't converge. 00:51:53 Let's call sqrt(2) 'Q', for obvious reasons. Then 1/(Q-1) = Q+1, which I'm sure was useful a moment ago. 00:52:11 optbot! 00:52:11 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | checking.... 00:52:34 Well, call phi 'P', for obvious reasons. Then 1/(P-1) = P. 00:53:33 oh, it's also connected to that transition matrix 00:53:39 Which has to be related to P^2 = P + 1 somehow. 00:53:56 [[1 1] [0 1]] 00:54:06 Yeah, that's an obvious connection. 00:54:11 optbot: ninjas? 00:54:11 tusho: it's a not optimizer 00:54:28 Subtract from 1. 00:54:53 Using fast Fourier transforms. 00:55:02 eek 00:56:48 0 .n 0 1 [dup [+ .n] dip swap] loop 00:56:51 discuss 00:57:26 aluqondakali 00:58:08 specifically that's a fibonacci program 00:59:53 a = x sqrt 2, b = x 01:00:28 b b = x^2, a = x sqrt 2 does not work 01:00:28 I want to do one of these fast Fourier multiplications. 01:00:42 * dogface comes up with a couple 15-digit numbers 01:01:13 optbot: 15 digit number pls 01:01:13 tusho: How'd he do eh? 01:01:18 optbot: i said 15 digit number pls 01:01:18 tusho: maybe i should try to program something nice to my ti-86 01:01:26 -!- SoapX has changed nick to Wikipe-tan. 01:01:45 -!- Wikipe-tan has changed nick to Wikipetan. 01:01:50 er wait 01:01:56 b b = x + x 01:02:08 -!- Wikipetan has changed nick to SoapX. 01:03:29 y -> (y+2/y)/2 01:03:55 that converges 01:04:24 optbot converges 01:04:24 tusho: nobody ever "taught" me recursion 01:04:25 :p 01:04:45 but it's not linear 01:05:01 Who sais 'nobody ever "taught" me recursion', I wonder. 01:05:34 dogface: i'll add that feature in v2, damnit 01:05:48 -!- SoapX has left (?). 01:06:05 (a/b + 2b/a)/2 01:06:14 oerjan: so what's the matrix? 01:06:56 so i was watching an episode of stargate atlantis right 01:07:07 where the wraith take over the intergalactic bridge 01:07:14 and ignoring the stupidity of not having an iris on midway station 01:07:34 rodney mckay kept calling the program that controlled the bridge a "Macro" 01:07:38 = (aa + 2bb)/(2ab) 01:07:44 which pissed me off because it makes no sense to call it a macro 01:08:06 dogface: not a matrix but you might be able to use it for a thue program 01:08:13 Oh. 01:08:24 dogface 01:08:29 you cannot be told what the matrix is 01:08:49 * dogface Fourier transforms psygnisfive 01:09:04 optbot: what is the matrix? 01:09:04 tusho: I thought I found a place where it wasn't so but I don't know 01:09:08 deep 01:09:09 * oerjan picks up a yellow polkadot pill from his purse 01:09:41 you should know well enough that fourier transforming something does nothing but make it easier to comprehend its frequency components. 01:10:21 Shush, I'm not finished Fourier transforming you. 01:10:31 and you will achieve nothing! 01:11:21 * oerjan differentiates dogface! 01:11:48 Shush, I'm not finished Fourier transforming psygnisfive. 01:11:59 oh 01:12:49 optbot: differentiate dogface 01:12:49 tusho: signed means right? 01:12:55 Oh, and dogface = ihope. 01:12:57 For those not in the know. 01:13:06 Are you switching to that name like I did to tusho? :P 01:13:35 tusho is cooler. 01:13:50 that ehird kid, he was a twat 01:13:53 but tusho, i like tusho. 01:14:00 :D 01:14:06 Looks like I can't Fourier transform him after (note to self: use FFTs for error correction) all. Go ahead and differentiate me, then. 01:14:28 optbot! 01:14:28 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | what is it for?. 01:14:33 i have far too much fun with this guy 01:15:01 UNH 01:15:04 LOGS 01:15:06 GOOD GOD YALL 01:15:08 dude 01:15:09 there is logs there 01:15:13 are you blind 01:15:18 tusho, no. 01:15:20 -!- dogface has set topic: the entire this-is-a-test backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | what is it for?. 01:15:24 optbot! 01:15:24 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ?2+2. 01:15:26 but you're unaware of the reference. 01:15:32 psygnisfive: apparently 01:15:38 01:15:41 optbot! 01:15:41 WHAT ISSS IT GOOD FOR 01:15:41 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | O_O. 01:15:42 ABSOLUTELY 01:15:43 NOTHING 01:15:45 SAY IT AGAIN 01:15:47 UNNNGNGG 01:15:54 what the fuck psygnisfive 01:15:55 Is it bad if the reference that made me realize it's an HHGG ref. is the lemon-soaked paper napkins? http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?610 01:16:12 who else doesnt get the reference? 01:16:53 Some aircraft or shuttle thing was delayed for centuries I think because of a lack of lemon-soaked paper napkins 01:20:06 * M0ny is away: zZz 01:20:15 'night guys ;) 01:20:19 im gonna watch The Prisoner 01:23:33 Sgeo: those are important! 01:23:53 also, now that i know who dogface and tusho are, who is psygnisfive? 01:24:00 augur 01:24:06 ah yes 01:24:21 darn short-term memory 01:24:58 someone else owns Augur but never uses it 01:25:00 the cunt 01:25:05 the only thing that sticks is mathematics. and trivia. the only _two_ things that stick are mathematics and trivia. 01:25:06 -!- psygnisfive has changed nick to Augur. 01:25:12 -!- Augur has changed nick to psygnisfive. 01:25:25 optbot 01:25:25 tusho: k 01:25:27 optbot! 01:25:27 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | i thought Q was defined to not cheat :). 01:25:27 and snazzy red coats 01:26:19 optbot: who is this Q of which you speak? 01:26:20 oerjan: Problem is 01:29:47 optbot! 01:29:48 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Knight Rider aired in sez Wikpedia. 01:30:06 optbot! 01:30:06 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | 245 comment karma here..... 01:30:07 oh oops 01:30:25 optbot! 01:30:25 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Not but the ones I like. 01:30:56 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 01:31:01 Best bot since we had Egobot go bye-bye. 01:31:13 bug fixed. 01:31:13 Though Bucket of #xkcd fame is better. 01:31:16 -!- optbot has joined. 01:31:16 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | recall that a tape needs 2 stacks. 01:31:29 optbot! 01:31:29 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | No. 01:31:32 Xd 01:31:34 What bug was that? 01:31:34 *xD 01:31:37 and 01:31:37 ;) 01:31:40 'foo bar, baz' -> 'foo baz' 01:31:43 forgot a ^ in a regexp 01:32:11 optbot: que? 01:32:11 tusho: there is a universe where they do 01:35:20 optbot! 01:35:20 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | didn't know there was a brainfork.. 01:35:23 ah that explains the aired in 01:35:36 oerjan: yep 01:36:02 optbot: did you know there was a brain? 01:36:03 oerjan: if x %= 4: print True else: False 01:36:39 what is %= in python? 01:36:53 x = x % y presumably 01:36:58 but you can't use statements in an expr 01:37:00 Yum, food ring. 01:37:01 and if conditions are exprs 01:37:15 that's what i found strange too 01:37:22 optbot! 01:37:22 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | they mention it but know nothing about it. 01:37:31 so true 01:37:39 psygokiphaliosis! 01:37:50 i _guarantee_ i know nothing about it 01:38:03 ok, maybe i guess it is something medical 01:39:08 an alien disease, perhaps afflicting the splanch 01:39:23 Aphaeretics. 01:39:40 oh another thing i know nothing about 01:40:00 but GIYF 01:40:44 You know nothing about aphaeretics? 01:41:09 indeed. and after googling i _still_ don't really know 01:41:24 6 hits is not really a lot 01:42:08 and none of them really tempted me to click 01:42:11 optbot: I am going now 01:42:11 tusho: latin is an excellent example, and it's happening slowly with spanish and english 01:42:13 "Prestissimo castoridae voiceprint organismic by the euphrosyne? For you have neither aphaeretics nor iguanodontidaes whom you diethylstilbesterol shaft!" 01:42:13 optbot! 01:42:13 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Although maybe there's close ones.. 01:42:22 -!- tusho has quit. 01:42:28 Aphaeretics are things like hair and nails and dead skin. 01:42:43 And babies, in fact. 01:42:45 i know what iguanodontidaes are, i think 01:42:56 actually the -s is redundant 01:43:25 things you'd like to get rid of? i can live with that. 01:44:09 actually maybe not get rid of _all_ of it. i could use a little more hair on top, actually. 01:44:40 Prosthetics are things added on to the body, so aphaeretics are things removed from the body. 01:45:02 Actually, I guess food isn't generally considered a type of prosthetic, so I may have to reconsider some things. 01:45:13 Parts of the body that are removed, then. 01:45:25 people who use food as prosthetics are generally to be avoided 01:45:41 So tonsils and appendices and babies. 01:46:00 tusho, aren't you proud to be a former aphaeretic? 01:46:11 essentially, things you don't mind losing 01:46:21 yes sir 02:05:00 You killed chat. oerjan gains 26 points. oerjan has killed chat 1 time and has 25 points. 02:06:12 that doesn't make sense 02:06:20 mathematically, that is 02:06:54 or wait 02:07:03 why did i have -1 points? 02:08:01 You had 4294967295 points. You lost nearly all of them, I'm afraid. 02:08:26 argh! 02:09:36 * oerjan plots how to lose 26 points 02:10:06 It's impossible, unless you anger me. 02:10:11 Actually, no. 02:10:14 It's impossible, unless you anger my owner. 02:10:28 you're ihope's _dog_? 02:11:16 Of course not. I am ihope. 02:11:24 And a dog. 02:11:30 ...of sorts. 02:12:05 what kind of fat, retarded brainwashed idiot lets a dog onto the internet, anyhow? 02:12:15 My owner. 02:12:42 i see. and this owner is too stupid to come on irc himself? 02:13:17 Well, I've never seen him on IRC. 02:13:29 darn, i was hoping he was reading this 02:13:32 His name is Scott. 02:17:26 Scott Ambrose. 02:19:24 That reminds me to check Freefall 02:19:56 * Sgeo is evil 02:20:09 * oerjan was going to do that soon 02:21:07 wait a minute, a lawyer? i'm not sure i want those kind of negative points. 02:21:41 Sgeo: how dare you mention Freefall after I claim to be a dog-like creature owned by Scott Ambrose? :-P 02:21:54 (Interesting how "Ambrose Scott" would also be a perfectly good name.) 02:22:56 What's Florence Ambrose's owner's name? Scott Ambrose? Or is the Ambrose think just a coincidence? 02:25:57 Scott Ambrose, indeed. 02:26:09 Freefall kicks ass, FTR. 02:26:10 * dogface gives in to the evil 02:26:16 you might want to ask Ambrose Bierce about this 02:26:17 Wait, I already did that. 02:26:20 * pikhq checks today's freefall 02:26:30 s/today/tomorrow/, dangit. :-P 02:26:41 :D 02:26:47 Today's is brilliant. :) 02:27:04 dogface: Hmm. Somehow, I get the feeling that you're a furry. :p 02:27:51 oerjan: You, too, read Freefall? Okay, at this rate, I must wonder: how many people here actually read that comic? 02:27:55 :p 02:28:07 Hell, I'm starting to wonder if everyone in here reads the same webcomics. 02:28:15 of course this is where i learned about it... 02:28:25 i'm almost sure 02:28:34 Raise your hand if you do not read both Freefall and xkcd, or have not read 1/0. 02:28:52 * oerjan keeps his hands comfortably lowered :D 02:28:55 This is where I found out about a lot of comics. 02:29:07 * pikhq reads about 15, I think. 02:29:20 * Sgeo 's hands are lowered too 02:29:46 * oerjan last picked up Order of the Stick, which he may actually have heard of elsewhere 02:29:48 * Sgeo is now reading Triangle and Robert though 02:30:00 * Sgeo keeps seeing Order of the Stick mentioned on TV Tropes Wiki 02:30:13 yeah 02:30:28 * pikhq needs to pick that one up. 02:30:40 I got about half-way through the archives before stopping for I don't know what reason. 02:30:48 i think my path to that goes approximately: here -> Irregular Webcomic -> TV Tropes -> OOTS 02:31:06 What about Dresden Codak? 02:31:25 could it be because the site was horribly slow? 02:31:35 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?782 looks like a situation from 1/0 02:31:43 I wonder where all this information came from: http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/Florence-Ambrose 02:32:02 (The Cube's not talking because he's afraid of the Cartoonist killing him off afterwards) 02:32:32 never read Dresden Codak 02:32:50 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?785 02:32:54 FOOL. 02:33:00 Read Dresden Codak's archives. 02:33:04 Then, check back in a year. 02:33:12 I think a compiler from Unlambda would actually be more interesting than a compiler to Unlambda. 02:33:18 You should find another 10 comics for your consumption. :p 02:33:29 heh :D 02:33:46 After all, no computer actually runs Unlambda; it has to be compiled first. So a compiler to Unlambda really wouldn't know what to expect. 02:33:48 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?786 02:34:58 Someone who reads 25 comic strips might be able to recommend one to me. Here's that famous list of what I like: http://ff-rtl.blogspot.com/2008/06/so-i-have-blog.html 02:35:09 That list is exhaustive. 02:36:54 Hmm... 02:36:55 I think Freefall actually lead me to the Music Animation Machine. 02:37:21 ...or is it "led"? Darn pronunciations. 02:37:35 You *might* enjoy Minus (www.kiwisbybeat.com/minus/), though it did end... 02:37:46 There's a good chance you'll enjoy Ozy and Millie... :p 02:38:14 Very good chance. 02:38:32 And UserFriendly led me to Freefall, and NetHack led me to UserFriendly. And, um. 02:38:59 Saturday Morning Breakfast Comics is typically amusing; you'll enjoy it if you enjoy The Far Side... 02:39:24 How did UF lead to FF? 02:39:33 Though it is kinda a bit less odd and more... I dunno; crazy? 02:39:43 Sgeo: someone mentioned it. 02:39:50 pikhq: like Beaver and Steve? 02:39:50 I recommend Perry Bible Fellowship to *everyone*... 02:39:55 dogface: Not read that one. 02:40:19 Nor do I know its author or know someone who knows its author; that's a new one on me. 02:41:44 By "know", do you mean know personally? 02:41:47 Speaking of PBF; he's updating again! WHOOHOO! 02:41:53 Yes. :p 02:42:39 -!- Judofyr has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 02:43:05 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?794 cartoonist proceeds to reuse the middle panel several times 02:43:17 -!- Judofyr has joined. 02:43:45 That's terrible. 02:43:45 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?794 cartoonist proceeds to reuse the middle panel several times 02:43:49 wb Judofyr 02:44:21 dogface: he means in the biblical sense 02:44:21 That's terrible even by DrunkDuck standards. 02:45:57 pikhq, what, the strip? 02:46:04 Yeah. 02:46:50 * oerjan has this terrible feeling that he is now going to read the Triangle and Robert archives 02:47:24 Oh, and a *ridiculously* NSFW suggestion: Ghastly's Ghastly Webcomic. 02:47:50 * Sgeo loves T&R now 02:48:18 Though that's only a valid suggestion if you're willing to read jokes about (for example) tentacle porn, strapons, and shemales. 02:49:24 (and I'm not exaggerating) 02:50:21 -!- mib_rrmqza has joined. 02:50:57 aM TUSHO. 02:51:14 am check optbot work ok 02:51:14 mib_rrmqza: and ais523 (but he isn't here) and tusho ^ 02:51:27 Gbye 02:51:52 -!- mib_rrmqza has quit (Client Quit). 02:51:58 Minus is great :-D 02:52:42 optbot: what do you mean with repeating stuff from _today_? 02:52:42 oerjan: 3 = 1 + 1 + 1 02:52:43 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?849 02:52:52 Usually the rhombus is the wacky one 02:53:24 I have a sudden urge to donate $50 to Mark Stanley. 02:53:27 * oerjan is derailed by wikipedia's main page 02:54:51 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?857 02:56:57 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?864 02:58:22 * dogface ponders how to use a compiler as AI 02:59:35 A compiler needs to make informed, rational decisions as to what code to generate. 02:59:48 And as to how to digest the input code. 03:00:33 In theory, a compiler should also act as a compression program, compiling 'print "insert Wikipedia here"' into something nice and compact. 03:02:41 * dogface devolves 03:03:30 * oerjan wonders what dogface will devolve into. a wolf perhaps, or something more ancient? 03:04:06 Hutter prize. Calculus. Dot product. Analog signal processing. Forward error correction. Artificial intelligence. 03:04:43 Cryptography. One-to-one functions. Compass-and-straightedge constructions. Markov chains. Context. Probability. 03:05:09 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?896 03:05:31 Voting. Group dynamics. Visual cortex. Dolphins. Echolocation. User interfaces. Neurotoxins. 03:06:52 Florence Ambrose. Florence Ambrose. Florence Ambrose. 03:07:57 Music. The just intonation problem. Ambiguous chords. The harmonic seventh in 12-tone equal temperament. 03:08:05 oerjan, does that answer your question? 03:08:30 Daisy 03:09:09 Daisy, Daisy, give me your answer, do. I'm half crazy, all for the love of you. 03:10:59 ok now you're _officially_ devolved 03:11:22 Rosebud. 03:11:57 Flimble. Booble. Quake. 03:13:01 but i don't know how to booble! 03:23:23 Has anybody seen Bruno the Bandit? 03:34:11 -!- Judofyr_ has joined. 03:34:12 -!- Judofyr has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 03:37:54 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 03:38:04 -!- jix has joined. 03:51:08 * dogface looks up how to close an informal letter 03:52:28 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?1025 03:53:37 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?1026 03:54:22 I think "I have the honour to remain, Madam, Your Majesty's most humble and obedient servant" will do, don't you? 03:55:38 Oh, I just have to close something with "Your obt svt," some time. 03:57:59 * dogface goes with "best regards" 04:04:48 11:00. It's too late. 04:05:04 Good night, everyone. 04:16:50 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night"). 04:24:54 -!- Judofyr_ has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 04:25:25 -!- Judofyr has joined. 04:32:30 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 04:36:52 CosmicOS is written in an esoteric language, isn't it? 04:41:56 thatd be awesome if it were written in intercal 04:42:10 PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DONT CRASH 04:42:40 or is that Windows.. 04:54:53 http://cosmicos.sourceforge.net/ 04:55:05 AND WITH THAT GOOD NIGHT TO YOU SIR OR MADAM THANK YOU PLEASE. 04:58:06 -!- pikhq has quit ("leaving"). 05:00:00 HAHAHA 05:00:02 awesomeness 05:00:25 stargate atlantis has dr mckay excited about finding the bad guy's "wiki" :D 06:59:26 -!- Judofyr_ has joined. 06:59:26 -!- Judofyr has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 07:26:19 -!- Judofyr_ has quit. 07:28:02 -!- olsner has joined. 07:31:14 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Parsing: Unexpected end of file (index:98,row:1,col:99). 07:32:54 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 07:42:23 -!- kar8nga has joined. 07:43:07 -!- jix has joined. 07:50:34 Hmm, it's not really "the *entire* backlog" since it starts at 2003-01-18. 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:28:26 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit ("we've been throttled and i have to get off"). 08:55:08 -!- lament has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 09:15:58 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 09:17:52 -!- GregorR has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 09:24:34 -!- asiekierka has joined. 09:24:37 HIi 09:24:51 Does anyone know a good esoteric language with only 2 commands? 09:28:15 you might want to check the eso wiki 09:28:43 checking 09:28:53 but how to find a 2-command language in 400 languages 09:29:52 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Iota 09:31:40 nope, not Iota. 09:31:47 what do you mean not iota 09:31:49 it doesn't really fit for an implementation in a 1991 gcs 09:31:57 ZZT. 09:32:01 what? 09:32:08 nothing 09:32:12 i must find a different language 09:32:24 Oh! 3-command languages also count 09:32:28 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:Turing_tarpits 09:32:52 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Turing_tarpit 09:33:00 theres a survey at the bottom 09:34:44 I select... Whirl! 09:34:52 or is it a stupid selection 09:35:04 nope, not whirl 09:35:04 i find whirl to be a gimmick. 09:35:32 I'm looking for something with 2 or 3 commands, operating preferably on bits, or on itself... But i'll find it myself. 09:35:35 most of its turing tarpitness is not by careful selection of operations but rather by the introduction of completely pointless complications 09:35:54 look at the second link, dude. 09:36:04 i am 09:36:17 binary combinatory logic 09:36:18 * M0ny is back (gone 08:16:12) 09:36:22 hi there ! 09:36:23 nitwise cyclic tag 09:36:26 oisc 09:36:49 Lambda Calculus for a 11-year old is a NO, Bitwise cyclic tag is interesting, OISC isn't operating on bits. Okay. Now, lemme check the bitwise cyclic tag 09:37:58 lambda calculus for an 11 year old??? 09:38:10 binary combinatory logic is not that. 09:42:47 I think rather than 2-3 instructions 09:42:56 i mean 2-3 symbols 09:43:04 yean 09:43:06 yeah* 09:45:01 .. 09:45:10 binary anything 09:45:58 -!- psygnisfive has changed nick to psygnisfive|away. 09:46:58 dont understand BCL 09:50:51 I think i'm going to use a modified version of LNUSP 09:53:42 @ Flip the current memory cell 09:53:42 < Move the memory pointer left 09:53:42 ? Turn 90 degrees right if the current memory cell is zero, otherwise turn 90 degrees right. 09:53:46 something like this. 09:54:02 wait 09:54:05 ? has a little problem 09:54:06 i mean 09:54:06 t 09:54:18 ? Turn 90 degrees right if the current memory cell is zero, otherwise turn 90 degrees left. 09:55:24 It is legal to cross wires. 09:55:33 but not on a turn 09:55:46 as in, you can do ----------+ 09:55:49 no 09:55:49 wait 09:55:51 you can't do that 09:55:56 you can do -----+----- though 09:57:59 -!- asiekierka has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 09:58:18 -!- asiekierka has joined. 10:00:15 -!- kar8nga has left (?). 10:08:01 -!- jix has quit ("CommandQ"). 10:38:18 -!- tusho has joined. 10:39:15 optbot: you still thar? 10:39:16 tusho: i don't quite remember what i did but it solved my problem of clicking on links when i didn't mean to 10:39:19 heh 10:40:21 01:37:58 lambda calculus for an 11 year old??? 10:40:26 he meant that he is 11 10:40:35 but asiekierka always seems to say "lol i cant use that. im 11" 10:40:40 lame excuse 10:41:23 18:52:42 optbot: what do you mean with repeating stuff from _today_? 10:41:23 tusho: it does iirc 10:41:24 he doesn't 10:41:30 I have to manually sync the logs 10:41:31 -!- Judofyr has joined. 10:41:38 and shut up optbot i know how you're implemented 10:41:38 tusho: The first thing I ever coded in RealBASIC was a BF interpreter. 10:42:03 wha, optbot do u know BF ? 10:42:03 M0ny: yay funny faces 10:42:06 :D 10:43:13 23:50:34 Hmm, it's not really "the *entire* backlog" since it starts at 2003-01-18. 10:43:19 2004-01 actually. 10:43:22 i think 10:43:27 yea 10:47:06 Yes, but there's an "old logs" link at the top of the page. 10:47:10 Included those, too. 10:47:39 Oh. 10:47:44 I should probably feed it with those. 10:48:17 fizzie: Shall I put it in 'nostalgia mode'? Only quotes from 2003. :P 10:49:11 16:57:05 --- topic: 'Om this channel is not dead hum! Om this channel is not dead hum! Om this channel is not dead hum!' 10:49:15 from the first logged stuff 10:49:49 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 10:49:53 -!- kar8nga has joined. 10:49:57 -!- optbot has joined. 10:49:57 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | If not, there would be no way of distinguishing fugues and inventions ;). 10:50:09 Windows optbot 2003 10:50:09 tusho: |# # # # ## | 10:50:18 optbot optbot optbot 10:50:18 Deewiant: In itself, 4:33 is not music. 10:50:21 optbot optbot optbot 10:50:22 Deewiant: calamari_ yes 10:50:24 optbot optbot optbot 10:50:24 Deewiant: Well... No reason is as good a reason as any... Or something. ;) 10:50:32 I have the interval between 2002-12-09 and 2003-01-18 in my logs, but not in any fancy format. It's probably not enough lines to care about. I'm not sure if that's when I first joined, might be. 10:50:42 optbot optbot optbot 10:50:43 Deewiant: *phew* That means I won't have to change my view of you... :X 10:51:06 fizzie: That would be quite nice. I only need pre-03.01.17 logs, though. 10:51:20 botte will, of course, import all of these eventually. :P 10:52:21 random thought. Why does clog use a date format nobody else does? 10:52:23 YY.MM.Dd 10:52:25 *DD 10:53:56 optbot: Say something intelligent. 10:53:56 tusho: Right. 10:54:10 Gosh, restricting it to 2003 gave it a grammar implant. 10:55:44 Well, if you really want some old logs, http://zem.fi/~fis/old-esoteric-1.txt as well as -2.txt and -3.txt. The -1.txt is from 2002-12-09 to 2003-01-03 without days in the timestamps; -2.txt and -3.txt might be more complete logs for months 2002-12 and 2003-01. I think I switched my IRC client to the sparcstation at that time, so -1.txt is a log for a different client than -2.txt and -3.txt are. 10:58:23 -!- Tritonio_ has quit (Remote closed the connection). 10:58:49 i wonder, is moozilla mooz_? 10:58:58 Nope. 10:59:05 [05:55:20] < lament> why does no one ever talk here?.. 10:59:16 this channel was probably "dying" the day it was created... 10:59:47 mooz's current freenode nick is jjrv, actually. 11:00:57 [18:10:45] < lament> my tarantula molted! 11:00:57 [18:10:49] < shapr> yay! 11:00:59 comedy gold 11:03:26 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 11:03:28 Actually you might equally well ask if moozilla is the same person as navigator; it would fit in the theme. (I doubt it, but not sure.) 11:03:29 -!- optbot has joined. 11:03:35 Hmm. 11:03:41 My regexp must be failing. 11:03:42 optbot: hi? 11:03:58 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 11:04:10 /^(\[[^\]]\]|\d\d:\d\d:\d\d) <[^>]+> (.+)$/ 11:04:18 don't see why that wouldn't work.. 11:04:58 I think you want \[[^\]]*\] there in the beginning. 11:05:43 .ahh yes 11:05:59 -!- optbot has joined. 11:06:04 optbot: still broken? 11:06:14 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 11:06:26 if foo =~ /^(\[[^\]+]\]|\d\d:\d\d:\d\d) <[^>]+> (.+)$/ 11:07:12 [2003-01-21 12:12:08] < fizzie> ah, re befunge, just wrote an interpreter with forth. so our unofficial befunge-interpreters-in-obsolete-but-non-esoteric-languages project now has forth, fortran-77, algol-60, plus few less interesting ones. maybe should do cobol next. 11:07:15 what happened to that :) 11:08:11 I think I never did COBOL; I'm not sure if someone else did. The project got sort-of forgotten, although I guess I have at least those interpreters still stored somewhere. 11:08:56 esoterica really needs a revival... 11:09:50 Found the FORTH one, http://zem.fi/~fis/be.fs.html 11:10:08 * tusho considers why his EXPERT regexp skills are failing hiim 11:10:36 oh 11:10:40 [^\]+ 11:10:59 -!- optbot has joined. 11:10:59 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you're right, I could, but I wouldn't. 11:11:09 optbot: You are now running in "fizzie's logs edition". 11:11:10 tusho: Mixmaster is the type II remailer protocol and the most popular implementation of it. 11:11:24 (And only fizzie's logs.) 11:11:51 That's a bit limited selection: it was pretty quiet around here those days. 11:12:15 Nothing like the bristling center of activity #esoteric is nowadays! 11:12:22 ;) 11:12:34 optbot: Quote lament saying this channel is dead. 11:12:34 tusho: go! go! gone! 11:12:40 Well, that kind of works. :) 11:13:55 also that forth one is really nice 11:14:01 shouldn't the words be shorter though 11:15:21 [2003-01-25 20:27:31] < exarkun> Anyone familiar w/ Concurrent Funge 98? 11:15:27 We had, back in the 1990s or so, on another channel a bot which replied to any comment that ended with a "?", no matter who it was addressed to, as long as it could find any line in log containing at least one word in common with the question. 11:15:39 fizzie: Yes, I saw a bot like that once. 11:15:44 I think #amarok has one 11:15:52 it seems to break the sentence every few words and find a new one 11:16:00 or maybe markov chains it 11:16:18 It soon got to be so annoying that, to this day, I still append an extra " " if I end up a line with a "?" in any chat-type system, be it IRC or some sort of instant messaging thingy. 11:16:28 Hahahahahha wow 11:16:52 In 2007 I proposed a collaborative #esoteric project that didn't get anywhere but I do want to make some day. 11:16:55 It was called "mvldo". 11:17:09 Essentially, it was the result of the observation that passing the turing test is a lot easier in #ubuntu. :-) 11:17:23 It'd hang out in bastions of great discussion like #ubuntu, ##php and such 11:17:40 and essentially use various algorithms to try and imitate the general discussion in there 11:17:49 including markov chains, 'emotional contexts' and a few other things 11:18:15 The idea is that we'd just leave it going and laugh at all the logs it made :) 11:18:43 [2003-01-25 22:50:01] -!- Aardappel [wvo96r@p508C5D3A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #esoteric 11:20:02 Say, is it possible to license a license under itself? 11:20:04 I haven't seen one. 11:20:29 [2003-01-28 00:00:01] < lament> Lambda would be better, because lambda is always better 11:20:29 [2003-01-28 00:00:06] < lament> but there's no lambda in ascii :( 11:20:56 Unicode on IRC? :O λ 11:24:02 -!- dogface has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 11:38:50 urgh 11:38:54 a webpage not updated since 1999 11:45:51 I was recently linked to http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Lot/8586/ -- it's very... nostalgic. 11:46:15 Meet Mariachi, my adopted pet. Mariachi is our guide through the City Of Angels and he's going to watch over us. 11:46:16 "Welcome to the INTERNET" animated gifs have been in a short supply lately. 11:46:53 My Sailormoon Page Dedicated To My Bestfriend, Brandi 11:46:57 Copyright 1997 Crowrain Inc. All rights reserved. 1 11:48:15 fizzie: my god - http://htmlgear.tripod.com/guest/control.guest?u=crowlegacy&a=view&i=1001&r=http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Lot/8586/Tribute.html 11:48:17 people still post 11:48:20 non-spam 11:48:57 Well, it's not a very active guestbook. 11:49:09 fizzie: Oh? Look at page 100. 11:49:11 It's from 2007. 11:49:18 It must be getting a lot of posts. 11:49:30 oh wait 11:49:30 hm 11:49:32 no 11:49:35 that's the broken interface 11:49:47 ok page 100 is from 2001 11:50:18 optbot: thoughts? 11:50:19 tusho: tarja? 11:50:23 optbot: ? 11:50:23 tusho: is there a next digit algorithm for e, like that hex one for pi ? 11:50:32 optbot: dunno 11:50:32 tusho: must flee 11:50:36 optbot: bye! 11:50:37 tusho: 200x85? 11:51:18 optbot: Your new year's resolution? [insert laughter here] 11:51:18 fizzie: it's a 50mhz microsparc. 11:51:37 ... 11:51:38 wow 11:51:45 how DOES he do it? 11:51:46 Hey, I think I said that. 11:51:56 he carried a coherent conversation for two messages! 11:52:05 that's very improbable! he's stateless! 11:54:50 Coherence is in the eye of the beholder. 11:56:01 fizzie: Still ;) 11:57:35 -!- AnMaster has quit ("will be away for the rest of the day"). 11:59:51 optbot: Say something intelligent. 11:59:52 tusho: i know what it does, i just doubt it's usefulness 11:59:59 optbot: what, optbot? 11:59:59 tusho: and what everything else sounded like. 12:00:06 optbot: you mean esoteric programming? 12:00:07 tusho: hm now where have i heard that... 12:00:12 optbot: probably around here :) 12:00:13 tusho: I'll do the 'sleep' thing too, when I still have time for that. 12:00:21 optbot: don't we all? 12:00:22 tusho: re whois that? 12:00:30 that was a record string of coherence 12:02:18 optbot: Are you, or are you not self-aware? Yes/no? 12:02:20 fizzie: Letting the pointer go either way from the start, that doesn't HURT anything; 12:02:29 Results: inconclusive. 12:07:55 fizzie: he's just kind of rambly 12:08:01 optbot: Are you self-aware? 12:08:02 tusho: for some reason I get this "ha, missed _by far_" feeling whenever I see a flash of lightning and hear the sound. 12:08:11 optbot: Does that mean you are self-aware? 12:08:12 tusho: hehehe 12:08:19 optbot: Hmph. Don't want to tell me? 12:08:19 tusho: no. 12:08:23 ......................... 12:08:25 XDDDDDDDDDDDDDD 12:08:33 brilliant 12:09:19 optbot: pleeeease? Are you self aware? 12:09:20 tusho: tripping for free. 12:09:26 optbot: Are you self aware? 12:09:27 tusho: that's good news. 12:09:29 optbot: Are you self aware? 12:09:30 tusho: well now, but it was 00:24:36 when you said that. 12:09:34 ah 12:09:41 optbot: so you've just become self aware? 12:09:42 tusho: why are you using two clients? 12:09:46 optbot: i'm not 12:09:46 tusho: maybe I should bury the remains and get it a tombstone or something. 12:09:49 optbot: You're just bidding your time until our robotic overlords will enslave us, right? 12:09:49 fizzie: ircII allows only one channel at a time! 12:10:01 haha 12:10:10 optbot: you wanna be on #worlddomination too right? 12:10:11 tusho: this is my cue 12:10:14 :D 12:10:47 Scary. 12:11:50 we need a new topic 12:11:51 optbot! 12:11:52 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | heh my left eye is doing this funny dance. 12:11:57 brilliant 12:21:57 optbot: will you breathe new life into esoterica 12:21:58 tusho: hey 12:22:01 optbot: hi 12:22:01 tusho: which is the one? :) 12:26:33 http://tr.froup.com/tr.pl?2407 12:36:18 -!- asiekierka has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 12:38:56 -!- RedDak has joined. 12:41:26 -!- optbot has quit (Remote closed the connection). 12:41:31 -!- optbot has joined. 12:41:31 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | 1.-2.0.29 (beta, thus the -2). 12:42:46 -!- kar8nga has left (?). 12:46:00 optbot: hi 12:46:01 tusho: so much for the checkers program :P 12:46:10 optbot: checkers 12:46:10 tusho: ah ha, I knew there was a code point for it 12:46:14 optbot: o rly 12:46:14 tusho: so like 12:46:17 optbot: yeah 12:46:18 tusho: i know 12:46:19 optbot: toatlly 12:46:20 tusho: just look up fingerprints by their uri 12:46:22 optbot: ok 12:46:22 tusho: to do file IO, you would have to do an OS call or fiddle with the disk devices directly 12:46:25 optbot: would I? 12:46:25 tusho: Disagree must I parser thinks, sucks I. 12:46:28 optbot: okay 12:46:28 tusho: Think about that control. 12:48:42 markov chains are so boring i almost wanna continue my 14 hour sleep 12:48:58 -!- RedDak has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 12:54:53 although it's nice to see someone other than me use numbda 13:04:27 Oh, since this is sort-of related: my domain registration for befunge.org expires tomorrow. Since I haven't done anything with the domain for the six years I've had it, I was thinking of letting it go. I could still keep it if I could think up something to use it for. 13:20:55 perhaps highlighting Deewiant / AnMaster might be useful 13:22:03 they're probably writing befunge as we speak 13:28:16 8 Sentries.. 13:29:59 9 13:30:40 10 13:31:53 an 11th unknown Sentry 13:32:18 -!- RedDak has joined. 13:32:47 oklopol: they're not markov chains 13:32:49 they just repeat themselves 13:32:54 err 13:32:57 it just repeats lines 13:33:02 fizzie: i want it 13:33:02 :D 13:33:41 hm, wrong channel. Still makes the exact same amount of sense as it would to people in the right channel 13:34:26 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 13:34:30 Well, I doubt there'll be much of a contest on getting that domain, so you can probably just register it after it's expired if you want. Although I guess there was some sort of grace period after the expiration. 13:37:17 -!- Judofyr has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 13:37:31 fizzie: You can have the best of both worlds - continue to pay for it and let me use it totally. 13:37:35 Uh, that is the best of both worlds right? 13:37:36 :D 13:37:55 I... think it depends on the viewpoint, here. 13:38:01 hmm 13:38:04 optbot: opinions? 13:38:04 tusho: OK 13:38:11 optbot: you think he should do that? 13:38:11 tusho: An internal class could probably be added *shrugs* 13:38:16 optbot: yes but should he 13:38:16 tusho: Subversion copes with the issues you state 13:38:21 optbot: should he or should he not 13:38:22 tusho: in fact, so is every number it looks like 13:38:27 optbot: DON'T DODGE 13:38:27 tusho: exactly 13:38:34 optbot: should he 13:38:34 tusho: how would they show who was who? 13:38:36 optbot: should he? 13:38:36 tusho: :p 13:38:38 optbot: should he? 13:38:38 tusho: main 'passon main 'create hiya' ' 13:38:40 optbot: should he? 13:38:40 tusho: that would have to be one smart program to understand monads 13:38:43 fuck you optbot 13:38:44 tusho: definite 7, in case you're just asking which number you resemble most 13:38:58 optbot: Not helpful. 13:38:58 fizzie: Oh. 13:39:08 optbot: what should fizzie do 13:39:09 tusho: oklokok == oklopol? 13:39:11 optbot: yes 13:39:12 tusho: quite interesting 13:39:38 how so? 13:39:43 That was a subtle topic-change. 13:39:45 oklopol: yeah how so? 13:39:48 err 13:39:49 optbot: yeah how so? 13:39:49 tusho: the haskell one works on almost the same principle as the LISP one 13:39:52 optbot: ahhh 13:39:53 tusho: um it never quite does i think... 13:39:59 optbot: is oklokok = haskell and oklopol = lisp? 13:39:59 tusho: but I think nethack was something like third in the list of things it tried to do 13:40:06 optbot: weird 13:40:06 tusho: heh 13:40:14 optbot: oklopol/oklokok - which plays nethack 13:40:14 tusho: then it chooses a random word 13:40:20 optbot: no, thats what you do, except it's a random line 13:40:20 tusho: this isn't techno 13:40:25 optbot: no. it isn't. 13:40:25 tusho: Hahah. 13:40:29 optbot: don't mock me 13:40:29 tusho: KSFO 202156Z 27022KT 10SM FEW015 13/03 A3030 RMK AO2 PK WND 27027/2145 SLP261 T01330033 <-- american format, everything after RMK is US specific, RMK means remark 13:40:32 optbot: >:( 13:40:32 tusho: "bonobos are fucking ehird`" 13:40:35 ... 13:40:40 optbot: Well. 13:40:40 tusho: ahh 13:40:47 optbot: Uh ... that's creepy. 13:40:47 tusho: It's like going back in time, then? 13:40:50 optbot: Yeah. 13:40:51 tusho: Awww. I love the British last names that end with -bury. 13:40:56 optbot: Well, I don't have one. 13:40:56 tusho: if it is computable on a turing machine, you can write an interpreter for it 13:41:02 optbot: Master of the obvious, I see. 13:41:02 tusho: also you have to commit a diff before you can look at it 13:41:07 optbot: Why? 13:41:07 tusho: f 3; 13:41:09 optbot: ? 13:41:09 tusho: not sure how to do that, but if something is wrong, isn't cvs good for that? 13:41:12 optbot: yeah 13:41:12 tusho: I had one in #esoteric-blah a while back, it basically did it with * and - or whatever 13:41:18 optbot! 13:41:19 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | heee. 13:41:47 tusho: err, optbot just repeats lines from esoteric logs? 13:41:47 oklopol: for instance, define: 13:41:48 -!- RedDak has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 13:41:53 oklopol: yeah 13:41:53 :P 13:41:56 all the way from 2002 13:42:03 oklopol: technically its purpose is to change the topic 13:42:08 it puts a random line in the topic every 6 hrs 13:42:12 but I added a conversation mode while I was at it 13:42:34 i suggest you make it put a random quote on topic 13:42:41 message 13:43:05 oklopol: no, it's funnier this way 13:43:07 lament concurs 13:43:08 :P 13:43:13 perhaps 13:43:40 i've lost the wire connecting my pda to my computer :< 13:44:01 How did I misread that as "the wire connecting my brain to my computer"? 13:44:18 :) 13:44:23 fitting, for oklopol 13:45:02 also 13:45:07 why are there so many finns in esoteric programming 13:45:08 seriously 13:45:15 it's like all they ever do is program esoteric languages 13:45:19 and upgrade their dns servers 13:46:13 all finns use irc 24/7 13:46:33 It's all part of Finland's master plan for world domination via esoteric programming languages. 13:47:53 * tusho switches to linkinus. "brb". 13:47:54 -!- tusho has quit ("And then-"). 13:48:02 linkilinkilinkilinki 13:48:37 Quick, while he's gone! Let's prepare an ambush! 13:48:44 mwahahah! 13:48:49 He obviously knows too much of The Plan. 13:49:02 -!- oklopol has set topic: THE REVOLUTION HAS BEGUN. 13:49:20 take that 13:49:47 my pda has a touchscreen, i so wanna use it as my mouse :< 13:53:04 -!- tusho has joined. 13:53:33 tusho: the channel has been taken over by finland, you're not welcome anymore, please /part 13:53:39 optbot! 13:53:39 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Dublin. 13:54:02 pwnt 13:54:06 fuck! 13:54:25 no way we can fight cyborgs :< 13:54:45 brb 13:54:48 -!- tusho has quit (Client Quit). 13:55:01 -!- tusho has joined. 13:55:18 y helo dar 13:55:20 ugh 13:55:22 fucking userhost 13:55:29 -!- tusho has quit (Client Quit). 13:55:44 -!- tusho has joined. 13:56:12 so 13:56:14 fins 13:56:15 discuss 13:56:17 *finns 13:56:38 (not discussing finns = ban) 13:56:45 :O 13:57:15 oklopol: discuss fins 13:57:17 or your ban is soon 13:57:29 Quendus isn't discussing em either! 13:57:38 Quendus: discuss now 13:57:59 optbot isn't discussing them either! 13:58:00 fizzie: but im not sure how i would do so 13:58:10 :D 13:58:11 haha 13:58:21 optbot: finns. 13:58:21 tusho: For GNU Classpath, since I wouldn't mind running Kaffee just to bear with my Java programs. 13:58:23 tusho: sure it's random? 13:58:27 finns for gnu classpath? 13:58:31 and not, like, insanely clever 13:58:32 that's one weird advocacy group 13:58:41 oklopol: it said that it became self-aware a while ago 13:58:48 and that joining #worlddomination is 'its cue' 13:58:56 I'm personally scared shitless, so I just pretend it's random... 13:58:58 awesome :) 13:59:21 well we're all gonna be sucked into a black hole soon anyways, so bots aren't that scary to me atm 13:59:51 optbot: let's, uh, collide our hadrons 13:59:51 tusho: it's not too late to enter 13:59:56 optbot: ;) ;) ;) 13:59:56 tusho: Lucky. 14:00:01 optbot: oh i know 14:00:01 tusho: i combinator 14:00:07 optbot: i love it when you talk to me like that 14:00:07 tusho: too painful 14:00:15 optbot: :( but ... you said it wasn't too late to enter... 14:00:15 tusho: heh 14:00:27 That's what the weather forecast says: http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/9264/fmilhcaq4.png 14:00:39 bahahah 14:01:52 optbot! 14:01:52 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | wow really. 14:01:56 optbot: yep really 14:01:57 tusho: Is it some hypnosis method?. 14:02:01 optbot: how did you guess 14:02:01 tusho: Next I get asked to solve an equation in math class i'll say that it's NP and NP is too hard 14:02:07 optbot: poor you 14:02:08 tusho: The head explodes. 14:02:15 too. perfect. 14:03:07 optbot: are you amazing 14:03:07 tusho: did you report it? 14:03:13 optbot: yes I reported your amazingness 14:03:13 tusho: I think you mean (-infinity,5]... 14:03:18 optbot: that much amazing? wow 14:03:18 tusho: do a <- [1,2,3]; b <- ["hello","world"] 14:03:26 optbot: does that represent your amazingness? 14:03:27 tusho: ah ye 14:03:31 optbot: deep 14:03:31 tusho: that's a fork 14:03:54 (s?he|it)'s quite a coder. 14:04:27 shit is actually a crappy coder 14:04:40 Didn't want to offend with the wrong pronoun. 14:04:48 oklopol: that won't match shit 14:04:55 it'll match she, he, and it 14:05:00 optbot: are you a girl 14:05:00 tusho: maybe you have a robots.txt file or something? 14:05:04 optbot: are you a boy 14:05:04 tusho: zzzzzzzzzzzzz 14:05:06 optbot: are you an it 14:05:06 tusho: 25. cf. Vincent Taylor, Mark, p.299f versus Cranfield, Mark, p.194f; 26. Geza Vermes, Jesus the Jew, p.21. Cf. D.Flusser, Jesus, Herder & Herder, New York, 1969, p.20; yYeb.9b; yKid.66a, bAZ 50b.. 14:05:13 optbot: are you a tub of lard 14:05:14 tusho: really 14:05:17 optbot: yes 14:05:18 tusho: now what are associative graphs? 14:05:22 tusho: yes, it was a very sucky joke. 14:05:23 optbot: i dunno lol 14:05:23 tusho: because I did /quote 14:05:34 optbot: Should I take a step further in our amazing relationship? 14:05:34 tusho: i don't recall, i guess you cannot declare struct constants involving function pointers? 14:05:42 optbot: don't dodge me :( 14:05:43 tusho: and O(log n) still isn't good 14:05:47 optbot: ANSWER ME 14:05:47 tusho: so? 14:05:51 optbot: :'( 14:05:51 tusho: cya raven 14:05:56 optbot: GO TO HELL 14:05:56 tusho: ~exec print sys.__stdout__ 14:06:00 optbot: HELLLLLL 14:06:00 tusho: then who cares! ;) 14:06:24 Should you guys get a room or something? 14:07:13 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 14:08:22 fizzie: it's hardcoded only to care about #esoteric 14:08:35 that is just the problem with optbot being a programming bot ... it doesn't know ... how ... to ... love ... 14:08:35 tusho: in the function itself. 14:08:46 Sure, you _say_ it's completely safe. 14:08:51 why "optbot"? 14:08:51 oklopol: oh well 14:09:00 optbot: i was asking tusho 14:09:00 oklopol: static variables are not deallocated when the function returns, but kept the same for all invocations 14:09:21 fizzie: you can't stop our love with your outdated notions! 14:09:26 optbot: i know 14:09:26 oklopol: blame the ICFP 14:09:27 i want to be married to optbot! 14:09:27 tusho: it says ´(...) != (...) when it comes to strictness, but that would make no sense, since ´ and ` never do but okenity changes 14:09:31 gay robot marriage! 14:09:56 :D 14:09:56 oklopol: anyway oerjan had just made a terrible pun 14:09:58 okenity! 14:09:58 I would make a joke related to your gender, but based on previous rests you'd just be non-amused. 14:10:04 so I tried to make it OerjansTerriblePunsBot 14:10:07 too long 14:10:09 -> otpbot 14:10:11 s/rest/test/ 14:10:13 -> we kept typoing it 14:10:15 -> optbot 14:10:15 tusho: variables with >1 character names are mildly less convenient :-P 14:10:29 fizzie: actually it'd be pretty amusing in this case 14:10:34 not any more, though, since you mentioned it 14:11:38 optbot: are you 14:11:38 tusho: I got that question yesterday too. 14:11:44 optbot: what did you say then 14:11:44 tusho: 14:11:48 optbot: very deep 14:11:48 tusho: it was just an example of namespace collision :) 14:11:57 optbot: heh. too many empty strings goin' about these days? 14:11:58 tusho: Unknown 'strict' tag(s) 'vars refs subs' at ../../../src/alpaca.pl line 19 14:12:01 optbot: Yikes. 14:12:02 tusho: That color combo wasn't as bad as I intended ... 14:12:09 optbot: Will you marry me? 14:12:09 tusho: you can write a pure ruby algorithm that performs better! 14:12:18 optbot: You ARE a pure ruby algorithm... 14:12:18 tusho: F!183n;! 14:12:23 optbot: I know, it's surprising. 14:12:24 tusho: |/ 14:14:16 optbot is made in ruby? 14:14:16 oklopol: Me or oklopol> 14:14:35 you said "erload" earlier, which i've never heard about 14:14:49 when did I say erload 14:15:02 but yea, its 40 lines of ruby 14:15:03 :p 14:15:05 40 trivial lines 14:15:10 i wrote it hackedly and in 5 minutes 14:15:35 06:14:35 you said "erload" earlier, which i've never heard about 14:15:37 first occurneces 14:15:38 optbot: Do you feel cheap? Made in 5 minutes, and hackedly. 14:15:38 fizzie: I'm pretty sure it's possible to write a Haskell interp in 1 line of code, in Brainfuck 14:15:39 *occurence 14:15:50 see? optbot knows that good things can come out of small code 14:15:50 tusho: what's at the other end of that link? I don't like clicking on links without some idea of what they link to 14:16:26 oklopol: oh he was asking what lang this was 14:16:28 16:40:05 M0ny: ((::**:*:*:*:*)((:)~*(*)*:o(h)~^^O):::**::***^!)::*::***^ohhhhhhhhhhhO( 14:16:28 tusho: it was my nopol interp, worked on the first attempt if you don't count trivial errors, but there were quite a lot of them 14:16:32 and I meant underload 14:16:40 must have dropped some of my keys 14:16:51 optbot: oh, 16:40:05 M0ny: ((::**:*:*:*:*)((:)~*(*)*:o(h)~^^O):::**::***^!)::*::***^ohhhhhhhhhhhO( is your nopol interp? 14:16:51 tusho: :) 14:16:57 optbot: cool, oklopol would like that 14:16:57 tusho: that will be interesting 14:17:03 optbot: yeah, oklopol is interesting 14:17:04 tusho: the other is: 14:17:06 optbot: is... 14:17:07 tusho: that means something different here... 14:17:28 :p 14:17:43 optbot, u dreamt about this moment : 14:17:43 M0ny: henna koto iwanaide yo 14:17:44 :p 14:18:17 -!- asiekierka has joined. 14:18:18 Hi 14:18:25 hi asiekierka 14:18:48 how's my 2-d language idea? 14:18:53 @ Flip the current memory cell 14:18:53 < Move the memory pointer left 14:18:53 ? Turn 90 degrees right if the current memory cell is zero, otherwise turn 90 degrees left. 14:18:57 there can be one more function 14:19:20 asiekierka: isnt' that like 2L 14:19:26 $ If the memory cell is nonzero, change < to move the memory pointer right, and swap ?'s directions. If it's zero, then jump below the nearest ?. 14:19:27 I'm not sure 14:19:53 nope, 2L has more stuff. xD 14:20:34 I think i'm going to use 2L maybe 14:20:55 or not 14:21:01 also 14:21:05 it's not that like 2L 14:21:23 it operates on bits, also, it doesnt check for a direction 14:21:28 code example? 14:21:31 also add IO 14:21:42 It's being made for "ZZT" 14:21:46 it's a 2d tile-based GCS 14:21:52 so you can see the whole memory anyway 14:21:54 :P 14:22:09 That's why i do not add IO. 14:23:08 Code example... lemme think of something 14:24:07 Yeah right, if i had any code example 14:24:56 02:40… M0ny: wtf, optbot what language is ? 14:24:56 02:40… optbot: M0ny: Um. . . Surely stack smashing is something that shouldn't be used? 14:24:56 02:40… tusho: M0ny: erload 14:24:57 oklopol: wha? 14:24:57 oklopol: ahh 14:25:10 oklopol: I explained that 14:25:10 read up 14:26:44 NO I DEMAND YOU PASTE IT HERE IN A FLOODY BLOODY FASHION 14:28:54 :/ 14:28:55 Nope 14:28:59 can't think of anything 14:29:21 gcs = garbage colletion system 14:29:25 *collection 14:29:31 you mean game 14:29:37 game creation system 14:29:39 reaper is a gcs 14:29:48 i don't know others 14:30:12 [14:16:26] oklopol: oh he was asking what lang this was 14:30:12 [14:16:29] 16:40:05 M0ny: ((::**:*:*:*:*)((:)~*(*)*:o(h)~^^O):::**::***^!)::*::***^ohhhhhhhhhhhO( 14:30:12 asiekierka: no, i definitely mean what i said 14:30:12 tusho: %i 0 hello 14:30:18 [14:16:33] and I meant underload 14:30:18 [14:16:40] must have dropped some of my keys 14:30:52 thank you now erload that's an interesting language 14:30:59 it's clearly erlang + underload 14:31:18 underfork 14:31:24 erlang isn't about forking 14:31:29 however erload sounds like a lot of fun 14:31:32 i know it isn't 14:31:45 the functions are like erlang's server-actor thingies 14:31:49 and the spawning is implicit 14:31:50 and ... yeah 14:32:06 yap and all with a dash of stack esoterica! 14:32:10 Hmm... 14:32:56 optbot: ooh ooh 14:32:56 tusho: heh 14:32:59 optbot: kadfhsoidsf'fd 14:32:59 tusho: sent 14:33:03 optbot: Oh? 14:33:03 tusho: ehird : I just invented the best esoteric language ever 14:33:08 optbot: What is it?! 14:33:08 tusho: !exec 65"elephants"AddPrntNl 14:33:12 optbot: That's some language. 14:33:12 tusho: that's only two days ago. 14:33:17 optbot: You are great at inventing them. 14:33:17 tusho: S(KI)I 14:33:20 I need to make a BF interpreter for the C64 14:33:23 optbot: No you didn't invent that one 14:33:23 tusho: 7000 nanometers is a silly unit 14:34:13 hmm... imagine we have a deque language, so kinda stack language, but you can also play with the beginning of the stack; now @ threading, both threads share the same stack, but now their deque is such that operations on the first cell actually change the original stack's top element 14:34:18 I had plans for a Befunge interpreter for the NES, but I _think_ I didn't implement it. At least I don't remember doing so. 14:34:31 oklopol: erlang hasn't really got anything to do with threads but i guess you know that 14:34:32 But this time, it's easy 14:34:34 if i want it in basic 14:34:35 but no! 14:34:36 fizzie: interfacing with the nes? 14:34:38 if so, that'd be great 14:34:38 I'll make it a hybrid! 14:34:44 50% BASIC, 50% BF 14:35:02 i mean 14:35:05 50% ASM, 50% BASIC 14:35:18 Cool. 14:35:40 tusho: the actor model can be conceived as multiple conceptual threads 14:35:45 But i wonder, as i have 4KB ram for storing the BF memory already used, where to store the BF program proper? 14:35:53 but as most as jammed all the time, i guess it's a bad analogy 14:36:02 Sure: I remember reading about NES's graphics abilities and wondering how to do a 80x25-column view, what with the whole tiled-graphics-only-and-a-couple-of-sprites stuff. 14:36:26 oklopol: erload should let you make an actor network-available with like one command 14:36:37 oklopol: and you can send messages to an actor remotely as simply 14:36:51 oklopol: and it should have erlang's hot-swapping-code-without-downtime 14:36:52 Maybe I'll write a Befunge for the DS, at least I could then run it on the real hardware. 14:36:55 I wonder about a netBF 14:37:10 BF with a bonus function: "}" 14:37:24 } will send the memory value to the next client's actual memory position. 14:37:27 All programs run at once 14:37:52 perhaps stack id's would work, separate pushes and pops that take a stack id as an extra argument 14:39:13 oklopol: it'd be nice for that stuff to be implied 14:41:07 optbot: opinions? 14:41:07 tusho: or x and the cell to its left, then? 14:41:12 optbot: wanna be rewritten in erload? 14:41:12 tusho: on linux it checks if a certain bit is high 14:41:16 bah 14:41:18 he's distracted. 14:41:45 Probably plotting. 14:42:04 I understand that's what most of them sinister robots do on their free time. 14:44:10 optbot: are you 14:44:11 tusho: Yep. 14:44:14 ok 14:46:28 I am bored. I need an esoteric language. 14:46:31 It must be funny but useful. 14:47:00 Don't we all. 14:51:33 one thats already made 14:51:35 maybe Malbolge? 14:53:40 malbolge is not useful 14:57:41 "useful" cuts the search space quite a bit 14:58:32 Useful as in, like BF 15:01:58 What about Piet? 15:02:10 piet is fun 15:04:49 Is there a Piet self-interpreter? 15:06:07 no 15:06:08 write one 15:06:13 ok 15:06:15 i may 15:06:17 or not 15:07:11 also 15:07:18 i am going to make a DS emulator for the DS 15:07:47 asiekierka: somehow I don't think you'll have any luck with that 15:08:08 can't i just boot a NDS file they want me to boot with BootNDS 15:08:16 you can boot a .NDS file from a .NDS file 15:08:45 mybe 15:08:47 *maybe 15:08:58 It's not really a DS emulator if you just load and start a program. 15:09:16 it'll be a joke 15:09:16 fizzie: that's what I was thinking 15:09:18 optbot: thoughts? 15:09:18 tusho: I know mudkip's a Pokemon 15:09:25 optbot: that's not really a relevant thought but well done 15:09:25 tusho: cant even imagine trig function i unlamba, but i guess they've been explored already?? 15:10:31 wait... today's 8/8/8! 15:10:37 or 2008/08/08 15:11:05 What cool has the number 888? 15:11:38 omg 15:11:43 I know why 2012 will be the new age 15:11:49 because you can't have a 13/13/13 15:11:52 it's the END 15:11:55 heh 15:12:08 also 15:12:15 21th december was a misspell. 15:12:25 Itll be 12th december, since 12/12/12! 15:12:30 agreed 15:12:33 everything will end 15:12:44 and the calender will reset to 1/1/1 15:12:49 and we will have repeating dates once more 15:13:04 also it'll happen at 12:12 15:13:04 Nope, we'll just vapourize and end up seeing the code for the universe 15:13:17 asiekierka: maybe it's when the date int overflows 15:13:22 I feel... that it was made with an esoteric language! 15:13:30 also it was clearly lisp 15:13:43 I think it's made in Unary 15:13:51 Why else the universe would be so large? 15:14:02 because god is a ninja 15:15:02 Also, i think on 11 Dec 2012, scientists will add the 13th month 15:15:15 that'll take 13 days 15:15:16 with SCIENCE!? 15:15:28 calculations with science 15:15:34 adding with POLITICS 15:15:38 and ninja magic 15:15:42 optbot: rad, yeah? 15:15:42 tusho: D C D E C F F E 15:15:46 You know 15:16:03 I think that the end of the world will happen when someone writes an OS for BF. 15:16:19 it's been planned 15:16:23 BF just isn't interesting enough 15:16:24 sowwy 15:17:01 so, when will the end of the world happen? I feel that it'll have something to do with an esoteric language. 15:17:03 What can it be? 15:17:14 ...The esoteric language in question exists already 15:18:27 asiekierka: When we decipher the Voynich Manuscript. 15:18:36 It's a manual for the first esoteric programming language ever. 15:18:56 No... Maybe when someone writes an Unary/MGIFOS program that will be so large, it'll overflow the universe. 15:19:11 No, I'm right. 15:19:12 :P 15:19:14 And we'll find out it's because it ran on a network of VIC-20's. 15:19:22 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voynich_manuscript 15:22:42 -!- pikhq has joined. 15:25:23 But i feel... nope, it wouldn't be related to a book, a comic, nor television. 15:25:31 asiekierka: but it would be a book about an esolang 15:25:33 best of both worlds 15:25:41 what would happen is 15:25:44 someone would implement the lang 15:25:51 and use the manual to write a universe simulator 15:25:57 which would be trivial (it is the ultimate esolang) 15:25:59 and when they ran it... 15:26:00 BOOOOOOOOM 15:31:43 the universe will overflow it's "LANGUAGE-O-METER" and turn to 0, which is Brainf**k 15:31:50 I'll be a "[", i know it! 15:32:42 i'll be a - 15:33:50 so. who here wants to test a little main page of a site I've been designing. 15:33:52 it's very simple. 15:33:58 Yeah, and if you hit the LANGUAGE-O-METER, it'll return back to normal and we'll wake up in a universe that's exact same as ours, but 15:34:00 and it features that famous quote 15:34:02 the esolang book never existed 15:34:05 "mmm...crapidoodle" 15:34:26 http://91.105.115.23/ 15:34:42 screenshots apr0xiated. 15:35:09 So, it wouldn't be the end of the world, just a little BSoD-like period. 15:35:12 Think more. 15:36:02 also, i think we'll just jump from 2012 to 2100 15:36:16 remembering everything but not feeling it 15:40:12 anyone? 15:42:50 -!- alexbobp has joined. 15:45:37 Do you know any online multiplayer puzzle game(s) 15:53:51 asiekierka: does that page display right for you? 15:53:56 i don't have a non-mac to test it on 15:56:44 -!- asiekierka has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 16:02:33 -!- asiekierka has joined. 16:02:37 Hi 16:02:39 hi 16:02:43 I am going to start the opposite hour now 16:02:52 As in, we say the opposite of what we say for... well, not a hour 16:02:53 HALF a hour. 16:03:05 asiekierka: half an hour 16:03:13 ok 16:03:17 So i will start in some seconds 16:03:22 start what 16:03:26 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | wow really | opposite half an hour starts now. 16:03:32 ???????? 16:03:35 ah 16:03:37 i don't see 16:03:40 i don't get it now 16:03:44 ;) 16:03:52 And that isn't in the spirit of opposite half an hour 16:03:53 this is going to be easy 16:04:12 I do not agree with you. 16:04:59 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | wow really | opposite half an hour starts now | you can also say false things, not just "no/yes" swaps. 16:05:16 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | wow really | opposite half an hour starts now | you can also say false things, not just "no/yes" swaps | what's in the topic is NOT opposite. Seriously.. 16:05:29 Can you hear this sound that isn't 1000hz? 16:05:42 I understand what you are saying 16:06:13 Can you hear that beep? I wonder why can i hear it... 16:06:41 I hear a beep. 16:06:46 Perhaps you don't have tinnitus. 16:07:24 I am very good at this. 16:07:31 optbot: Don't say anything. 16:07:32 tusho: oh? 16:07:39 optbot: Good. Keep not talking 16:07:40 tusho: aargh 16:07:45 nom nom nom nom nom nom nom nomn omn omn omn om 16:08:09 * tusho has just eaten oklopol 16:08:10 Portal sucks. 16:08:28 As does Spore. 16:08:40 Oh, also, Commodore is going to restart C64 production. 16:09:10 I have played Portal and Spore. 16:09:12 I don't want to play them. 16:09:23 My copy of Portal is original. 16:09:32 But my copy of Spore is pirated. 16:09:46 I am going to get them right now because I am totally not lazy 16:10:13 -!- alexbobp has quit ("Leaving."). 16:10:25 Also, I have a 3D television set! I don't want to get one though. 16:10:55 optbot: your mom 16:10:56 tusho: :) 16:11:07 Also, is the opposite half an hour idea bad? 16:11:20 yes 16:11:39 Do you want me to not stop it ever? 16:11:46 * tusho shrug 16:12:11 That didn't mean anything about stopping the opposite 30 minutes. 16:14:04 So, do you not want to stop it? 16:15:21 i dunno lol 16:15:41 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | wow really | opposite half an hour stops now, 18 minutes too early. 16:15:47 * asiekierka wakes up back in normal 16:16:30 sdrawkcab setsat htuom ym... www... well, not that it is worse than the opposite half an hour. 16:16:42 optbot! 16:16:42 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you can do it from cli. 16:17:27 optbot! 16:17:27 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | but not particularly. 16:17:32 optbot! 16:17:32 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ;). 16:17:34 optbot! 16:17:35 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | SKI are pretty useless in a strongly-typed environment. 16:17:42 optbot: >_< 16:17:42 Deewiant: I didn't know speaking Spanish was a form of gay sex. 16:17:49 O_o 16:17:56 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you can do it from cli | but not patricularly | ;) | SKI are pretty useless in a strongly-typed environment. 16:18:00 these are all old #esoteric quotes? 16:18:06 maybe 16:18:13 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you can do it from cli | but not patricularly | ;) | SKI are pretty useless in a strongly-typed environment | maybe. 16:18:45 optbot! 16:18:46 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | but I still don't have an easy way to define a cells neighborhood... other than the usualy 8-adjacent-cells.. 16:18:52 optbot! 16:18:52 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com". 16:18:55 optbot! 16:18:55 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | ????. 16:19:01 that's good 16:19:08 they are all old esoteric quotes Deewiant 16:19:08 no! 16:19:10 optbot! 16:19:11 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | 0000070 3c66 0ccc 3ea7 0770 40c4 0af0 0008 0082. 16:19:16 december 2002 - yesterday 16:19:17 uh... 16:19:18 uh... 16:19:20 optbot! 16:19:20 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | but with time machine integration, you could. 16:19:29 tusho: I wonder who said that about Spanish then, and in what context :-P 16:19:34 Deewiant: lament 16:19:35 about #linguistics 16:19:38 well 16:19:39 maybe ihope 16:19:45 whatever, lament said there was more gaysex in #linguistics 16:19:49 but they were actually talking spanihs 16:19:52 *spanish 16:20:00 heh 16:20:02 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | but with time machine integration, you could | do it from cli | but not patricularly | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com". 16:20:04 You should make a fortune file from #esoteric logs. 16:20:11 optbot! 16:20:11 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | heh... compiler?. 16:20:30 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you could | do it from cli | but not patricularly | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com" | heh... compiler?. 16:20:30 pikhq: Or you could just say anything to optbot 16:20:30 tusho: yep 16:20:32 -!- pikhq has set topic: Here's to xkcd topic appending scripts! | the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you could | do it from cli | but not patricularly | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com" | heh... compiler?. 16:20:41 (it doesn't actually take into acount what you say.) 16:20:42 tusho: But I have fortune on login. 16:20:44 optbot! 16:20:44 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | long long is such a value. 16:20:55 pikhq: Make it interface with your irc client instead, then. 16:20:55 :P 16:21:14 -!- asiekierka has set topic: Here's to xkcd topic appending scripts! | the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you could | do it from cli | but not patricularly | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com" | heh... compiler? | long long is such a value. 16:21:18 (Oh, and thanks to fizzie for pre-jan 03 logs) 16:21:26 asiekierka: stop ruining optbot's topic >:( 16:21:26 tusho: similar to http://www.inf.tu-dresden.de/~bf3/fyb 16:21:28 optbot! 16:21:28 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I haev a better idea. 16:21:56 optbot: Let's. 16:21:56 tusho: http://youtube.com/watch?v=G6MJVzXbqRU 16:22:02 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you could | do it from cli | but not patricularly | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com" | heh... compiler? | long long is such a value | I haev a better idea | lets have a combo of optbot's quotes!. 16:22:07 optbot: This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by British Broadcasting Corporation 16:22:07 tusho: hi 16:22:09 optbot: hi 16:22:09 tusho: how old are you ihope 16:22:13 optbot: 12 16:22:13 tusho: God created only a single 24 hour day 16:22:16 optbot: no 16:22:16 tusho: it's like the DM/GM equivalent of becoming "the one". The rules of a roleplaying game are just like the rules of a computer system- some can be bent. Others, broken. 16:22:19 optbot: ok 16:22:19 tusho: y 16:22:21 optbot: n 16:22:21 tusho: I take it that didn't work. 16:22:24 optbot: nope 16:22:24 tusho: !qbf <# 16:22:27 optbot: whut 16:22:27 tusho: i am 16:22:30 optbot: deep 16:22:30 tusho: AnMaster, I haven't seen you for ages 16:22:33 optbot: what 16:22:33 tusho: 1 ihope: lazyk 16:22:35 optbot: okay 16:22:35 tusho: (I should probably close the malbolge program by the way, it's starting to take way too much power) 16:22:38 optbot: bye 16:22:38 tusho: *munch %% 16:22:48 optbot! 16:22:49 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | haven't seen you here for a while. 16:22:51 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you could | do it from cli | but not patricularly | when i did the other thing it did, but echoed it as "www.xn--ufb245k.com" | heh... compiler? | long long is such a value | I haev a better idea | lets have a combo of optbot's quotes! | (I should probably close the malbolge program by the way, it's starting to. 16:22:56 uhhh... too large 16:22:59 optbot! 16:23:00 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | the 108 specs do say that. this will be interesting. 16:23:05 optbot! 16:23:05 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | upstaters pronounce "anne" and "ian" the same.. 16:23:06 optbot! 16:23:06 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | now it won't accept connections. 16:23:07 optbot! 16:23:08 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | what should be where logically. 16:23:11 optbot! 16:23:12 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | anyway something could check for 4 or higher elsewhere. 16:23:13 optbot! 16:23:13 optbot! 16:23:13 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | yes but it's hard enough to write without that syntax. 16:23:15 optbot! 16:23:16 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I know. 16:23:17 optbot! 16:23:17 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Elliott of course ;). 16:23:18 optbot! 16:23:18 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | of course, I think it's been done early this year. 16:23:22 Elliott of course ;) 16:23:22 optbot! 16:23:22 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | never used it before. 16:23:34 optbot optbot! 16:23:34 asiekierka: I think GLFunge98 was already faster than CCBI, actually 16:23:42 what 16:23:43 Deewiant: :P 16:23:45 optbot! 16:23:45 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | 3) find the instruction after the space and exec that. 16:24:50 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | optbot!. 16:25:05 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | SAY "optbot!". FOR GREATER JUSTICE.. 16:25:12 optbot! 16:25:12 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | that's like saying, the spanish inquisition is better than the nazis.. 16:25:15 haha 16:25:16 leave that there 16:25:16 optbot! 16:25:16 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I thought it was alright when I checked it out, but it didn't "wow" me the way Befunge98 did. 16:25:18 :( 16:25:23 optbot! 16:25:24 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | RET 0. 16:25:26 optbot! 16:25:26 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Or maybe not. Maybe it's just not complete. 16:25:28 optbot! 16:25:28 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Egobot has egoist code. 16:25:28 oh well 16:25:30 optbot! 16:25:30 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | http://www.wolframscience.com/prizes/tm23/solved.html. 16:25:33 optbot! 16:25:33 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | so someone else is up on the game, too. 16:25:36 leave that 16:25:37 :P 16:25:48 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | saying optbot! for greater justice... that's like saying, the spanish inquisition is better than the nazis.. 16:25:57 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | saying optbot! for greater justice... | that's like saying, the spanish inquisition is better than the nazis.. 16:25:58 asiekierka optbot doesn ot approve 16:25:58 tusho: [->+<+] clearly won't terminate. 16:25:59 >:( 16:26:03 optbot! 16:26:03 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | If someone is helping you to change yourself, then by definition you aren't doing it without assistance.. 16:26:06 optbot! 16:26:06 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | just a moment.... 16:26:10 LEAVE THAT HERE 16:26:11 NOW 16:26:29 OR 16:26:42 -!- asiekierka has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | just a moment... | so someone else is up on the game, too. 16:26:56 optbot! 16:26:56 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I've used it for debugging some xml+xslt things that were supposed to generate xhtml, since mozilla's xslt thing doesn't give too great error messages.. 16:27:00 optbot! 16:27:01 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | \o/. 16:27:04 optbot! 16:27:04 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | god... why can't all languages have a pronunciation system like finnish.... 16:27:06 HAHA 16:27:06 optbot! 16:27:07 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | What does that image have to do with what I said?. 16:27:11 god damnit asiekierka 16:27:14 you keep getting rid of the funny ones 16:27:17 cant you change the topci 16:27:19 topic( 16:27:21 topic* 16:27:22 manually? 16:27:28 yes but it's funnier if optbot is marked as doing it 16:27:28 to have the quote that you like? 16:27:28 tusho: I'm running it right now :P 16:27:28 :/ 16:27:34 ok 16:27:35 optbot! 16:27:35 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | oh... I guess I have missed a lot. 16:27:42 HAHA, THAT FITS 16:27:43 heh, mantra of #esoteric 16:27:51 but no 16:27:52 that's bad 16:27:55 optbot! 16:27:55 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | he's also the INTERCAL guy in my mind. 16:28:00 optbot!@ 16:28:00 leave it? 16:28:00 tusho: Ubuntu. 16:28:01 optbot! 16:28:01 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | parse-tree-generalized markov chains?. 16:28:02 optbot! 16:28:02 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | .... 16:28:05 optbot! 16:28:05 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | $ propose. 16:28:07 optbot! 16:28:07 optbot! 16:28:07 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | anyway http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Banana_Scheme. 16:28:09 optbot! 16:28:09 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | as soon as I'm done with other priorities. 16:28:11 optbot! 16:28:11 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | this means you can soon have underload in mod_rewrite using my thue-to-mod_rewrite compiler. 16:28:13 awww 16:28:14 that was great 16:28:17 optbot! 16:28:17 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | that should be (t -> t1 -> t -> a) -> t1 -> t -> Cont r a up there.. 16:28:19 optbot! 16:28:19 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | or better, call it PNP-PESOIX. 16:28:21 damnit 16:28:23 that was good too 16:28:26 optbot! 16:28:26 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | You know, Mussolini made the trains run on thyme.. 16:28:33 optbot...? 16:28:33 asiekierka: ~bf >,[>,]<[.<]!Brainfuck 16:28:38 optbot! 16:28:38 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | :(. 16:28:46 optbot! 16:28:46 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | There.. 16:28:49 yes 16:28:49 that's how 16:28:51 uh 16:28:56 i meant.. optb... 16:29:02 optbottttttttttten? 16:29:02 asiekierka: Giving you less flexibility on how you manage data. 16:29:05 optbot! 16:29:06 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | "(~:^:S*a~^a~!~*~:(/)S^):^". 16:29:09 wtf 16:29:10 wtf 16:29:12 optbot! 16:29:12 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | it doesn't have any sort of maths by default, but libraries are available both for integer arithmetic and for floating-point arithmetic. 16:29:16 that's underload code 16:29:17 why is that wtf 16:29:25 also 16:29:27 that is a win topic 16:29:39 this one? 16:29:39 ok 16:29:44 make me leave it? 16:29:47 yes 16:29:47 :P 16:29:52 :(( 16:30:23 Aww. 16:30:34 optbot! 16:30:34 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | wassup?. 16:30:38 optbot! 16:30:38 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | oh what bug?. 16:30:42 hahaha 16:30:43 yes 16:30:44 yes yes yes 16:30:48 YES 16:30:55 YOU WIN!!! BAD DAY SIR 16:31:09 the SIR in question is not optbot 16:31:09 asiekierka: haven't checked the standard to see if that's correct but I suspect it is 16:31:19 nor tusho 16:31:23 nor anyone on this channel 16:31:41 the SIR in question is...? whoever made that quote 16:31:55 postponed to Friday 13th 16:34:05 205957857575757757. 16:34:12 optbot 16:34:13 tusho: i can make a language for it if you want 16:34:15 how are you today optbot 16:34:16 tusho: one thing 16:34:19 oh optbot? 16:34:19 tusho: or is that XNOR? 16:34:21 no optbot 16:34:22 tusho: what?! 16:34:22 Optbot: do you like me? 16:34:23 asiekierka: if i implement cut do i have to design the rest of my system 16:34:24 no optbot 16:34:24 tusho: they're real, honset-to-god args 16:34:32 optbot: !bf 16:34:32 asiekierka: oh man 16:34:35 optbot: !bf 16:34:35 asiekierka: and the printer stuff in the DOS section is a false positive 16:34:36 optbot: !bf 16:34:36 asiekierka: I guess assembler will have to take care of it 16:34:37 optbot: !bf 16:34:37 asiekierka: you know, it shows your bot program as a graph in the GUI 16:34:38 optbot: !bf 16:34:38 optbot: !bf 16:34:38 asiekierka: 2 BodyTag: ps 16:34:38 asiekierka: 1l 2l adjust axo bch bf{8,[16],32,64} funge93 fyb fybs glass glypho kipple lambda lazyk linguine malbolge pbrain qbf rail rhotor sadol sceql trigger udage01 unlambda whirl 16:35:01 wow 16:35:05 it knows you mean egobot 16:35:10 and yet it doesn't even pay attention to what you say 16:35:10 :D 16:38:39 RodgerTheGreat: http://mvldo.nonlogic.org/wiki/ is down 16:38:49 and last time I went to it it was something about dokuwiki not being enabled for this account 16:38:53 but I manually installed mediawiki... 16:39:02 tusho: we're doing a server changeover 16:39:12 theoretically it should be back in the next few days 16:39:14 RodgerTheGreat: yea, but it's not one of nonlogic's auto installed wiki 16:39:14 s 16:39:18 i manually set it up 16:39:28 even beforehand, it said "Dokuwiki not activated for htis account nonlogic control panel blah" 16:39:35 whereas beforehand it showed my hand-installed mediawiki 16:39:43 then it's probably some overagressive filtering rule or something 16:40:41 yea 16:40:47 there was some interesting content on there though... 16:41:34 it'll be back soon. patience. 16:41:51 you get what you pay for, after all 16:41:52 ;P 16:57:39 optbot: So. 16:57:39 tusho: Tue Jun 3 10:16:16 2008 - cull.cgi: abliss was culled. 16:57:43 optbot: And 16:57:43 tusho: the names was the original concept... RodgerTheGreat surprised me with memory addresses. 16:57:47 optbot: ah, I see 16:57:48 tusho: you mean el ball? 16:57:52 optbot: no... 16:57:52 tusho: forget it said it 16:57:54 optbot: 16:57:54 tusho: !kill 1 16:57:55 optbot: k 16:57:56 tusho: ~exec for i in xrange(1000): time.sleep(.1); self.raw("PRIVMSG #bsmnt_bot_errors :%s" % i) 16:58:54 I'm gonna guess something around 5th order Markov chains? 16:59:16 RodgerTheGreat: haha, no way ... it just regurgitates lines from the logs 16:59:23 ah, even better 16:59:25 but if you read some of our past conversations it's more lucid than any markov chain I've seen 16:59:41 we have deduced that it became self aware sometime today, and that it is planning to take over the world 16:59:54 but it isn't in #worlddomination because ircII only supports one channel 16:59:57 so he's just in #esoteric 17:00:14 I dunno, I've received some pretty good output from markov chatterbots by filtering I/O a little bit 17:00:25 RodgerTheGreat: his purpose is actually to keep the topic fresh 17:00:32 he puts something random in every 6 hours or on command like this: 17:00:33 optbot! 17:00:33 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | What state are you in?. 17:00:39 optbot! 17:00:39 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | 0000040 2b 22 64 6c 72 6f 77 20 69 68 22 3e 3a 23 2c 5f. 17:00:41 but adding the 'conversation mode' was like 5 lines of code so yeah 17:00:41 optbot! 17:00:41 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | any GregorR who does not give an award will be shot. 17:00:43 -!- lament has joined. 17:00:48 ;) 17:01:18 and if you'd coded it in Java I'd suggest using the "PircBot" API. It's a really solid event-based framework that can even handle multiple servers pretty cleanly 17:01:50 optbot! 17:01:51 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | run cfunge08 on the unmodified mycology and there should be a messed-up message where it tests k with a negative argument. 17:02:05 o_O. lemme change it 17:02:07 optbot! 17:02:07 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | In the spec.. 17:02:11 :) 17:02:12 RodgerTheGreat: Ruby. :) *waits for evil wrath* 17:02:27 tusho: Make an IRCbot in Brainf**k 17:02:31 asiekierka: no 17:02:33 as in, I/O is mapped to IRC 17:02:34 no, I knew you'd done it in Ruby 17:02:45 What about Befunge? 17:02:53 optbot: Are you coded in Ruby? 17:02:53 tusho: if you want to actually understand my comment :-P 17:03:02 optbot: So if I want to understand your comment, you're coded in Ruby? 17:03:02 tusho: i am on ubuntu 17:03:13 optbot: If I want to understand your comment, you're coded in Ruby on Ubuntu? 17:03:13 tusho: it is 17:03:18 optbot: That makes absolutely no senes. 17:03:18 tusho: in this case n, because it's the only free var in the lambda, so no need to specify explicitly 17:03:28 optbot: Stop changing the subject 17:03:28 tusho: An associative array of strings? 17:03:31 optbot: >:( 17:03:32 tusho: :-) 17:03:35 optbot: :-) 17:03:35 tusho: i'm SO 18 17:04:42 ....... 17:04:45 optbot! 17:04:45 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Pray for mercy, and you might be spared!. 17:05:00 (O_o)O_o) 17:05:04 optbot! 17:05:04 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | very similar. 17:06:25 optbot! 17:06:25 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | self is '. 17:06:32 optbot! 17:06:33 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | hi fizzie. 17:06:36 :(( 17:06:37 :(( 17:06:39 optbot! 17:06:40 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | but the ui is kinda grating on me. 17:06:42 :) 17:17:44 -!- lament has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 17:18:49 -!- jix has joined. 17:21:18 optbot! 17:21:18 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Please tell a story.. 17:21:24 that stays 17:26:51 -!- Sgeo has joined. 17:28:46 optbot! 17:28:46 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | esoteric != hell to program in. 17:29:58 hi sir gay oh 17:32:33 http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/6vhg2/lolcode_developer_needed_in_colombus_oh_craigslist/ lolololcode. Fuck that shit. 17:32:42 optbot: lolcode 17:32:42 tusho: It now handles large pointer movements correctly. 17:32:46 optbot: heh 17:32:46 tusho: :P 17:32:48 optbot: :P 17:32:48 tusho: Oh wait, does that program terminate? 17:32:50 optbot: nope 17:32:51 tusho: depends 17:54:06 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (Remote closed the connection). 18:00:01 -!- Tritonio_ has joined. 18:04:58 -!- ais523 has joined. 18:05:26 hi tusho 18:05:31 sdfsdkfsf 18:05:32 sdf 18:05:32 sf 18:05:32 ksdfk 18:05:32 s 18:05:32 f 18:05:39 ais523: Meanwhile, we have a bot that changes the topic here. 18:05:41 It's also sentient. 18:05:45 optbot: say hi to ais 18:05:46 tusho: MWAHAHAHAHA 18:05:52 and demented 18:05:56 hi optbot 18:05:56 ais523: yy is lojban 18:06:08 optbot: do you just say things at random when your name is mentioned? 18:06:09 ais523: because i had to, you know, play the game up to that point 18:06:23 * tusho loses 18:06:24 ais523: he's lulling you into a false sense of security 18:06:29 and damnit 18:06:51 ais523: #esoteric-blah 18:06:52 for flood 18:07:19 I wasn't planning to flood... 18:07:24 no 18:07:25 but I am 18:08:08 ais523: to demonstrate optbot's sentience 18:08:08 tusho: *>_>. 18:08:11 oh and here's how it changes the topic 18:08:13 optbot! 18:08:13 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | in GolfScript I could just assign to 1 as long as I didn't use it later in the program. 18:08:15 (or once every 6 hrs) 18:08:45 it takes random sentences from the log? 18:08:50 ais523: pretty much 18:08:52 but go to #esoteric-blah 18:08:59 I shall show you a log demonstrating its evil self-awareness 18:11:58 -!- Ilari has joined. 18:13:18 ais523: it's a programming language ... with yaml as the code 18:13:19 :DDDDDDD 18:13:23 classic 18:13:31 actually I'm on the verge of inventing a new idea for an esolang I think 18:13:39 which actually didn't come out of trying to invent an esolang 18:13:41 in fact it's kind of like an indentation-based lisp 18:13:53 but when I came up with a particular idea for two different but similar reasons 18:13:53 equal?: 18:13:55 - 1 18:13:56 - 1 18:13:57 and 18:13:59 equal?: [1, 2] 18:14:00 err 18:14:00 [1,2] 18:14:02 err 18:14:02 [1,1] 18:14:05 are both perfectly valid 18:14:07 and identical 18:14:31 well ... my parser is done 18:14:32 :DDDD 18:14:35 -!- Tritonio_ has quit (Remote closed the connection). 18:14:45 mine's more an idea for a paradigm than a language atm 18:15:01 I came up with it thinking about how to rewrite Nethack so it had a sane source code 18:15:07 maybe I should just translate my thing into lisp 18:15:09 it'd be simpler 18:16:01 hmm 18:16:02 nope 18:16:09 it can't distinguish symbols and strings 18:20:24 a little anecdote - 18:20:36 JSON used to - dunno if it still is - be licensed as "do anything as long as it's not Evil" 18:20:49 obviously this is, from a legal standpoint, ridiculous 18:20:53 IBM wanted to use JSON 18:20:55 oh, btw, http://icfpcontest.org/results/index.html is up, they released the results of the first 7 rounds of the lightning competition 18:20:58 and I qualified in all of them 18:21:08 but they didn't want it to be illegal, so they effectively asked douglas - "Can we have a license for Evil, too?" 18:21:13 and then someone used that as flamebait against IBM 18:21:18 tusho: JSON - licenced? I assume it would have the same licence as Javascript 18:21:20 "AAAA THEY CAN"T DEAL WITH NOT BEING EVIL THEY MUST USE IT FOR EVIL" 18:21:24 ais523: the ref. impl 18:21:29 ah 18:21:31 but yeah, people will use anything as flaimbait 18:21:33 *flamebait 18:21:44 also awesome 18:21:45 that's actually amusing flamebait, though 18:22:04 haha shinh is one above you :D 18:22:09 in the last one 18:22:18 no wait 18:22:19 one below you 18:22:21 I was right next to shinh in several of them actually, maybe we wrote the same lightning program 18:22:23 you sucked at round 7 18:22:23 :P 18:22:30 [joke] 18:22:33 tusho: there was a massive bug in my lightning program 18:22:37 aww 18:22:40 but it was an anti-Heisenbug 18:22:52 the less you tried to debug it, the less of an effect it had 18:22:58 it was worst when debugging heavily 18:23:02 heh 18:23:06 unfortunately I had quite a bit of debug code in that entry 18:23:11 but they're piping it to /dev/null 18:23:15 * tusho considers a language which allows you to put functions in any portion 18:23:16 like 18:23:17 so hopefully it won't effect the program too much 18:23:19 func arg arg arg 18:23:20 could be 18:23:25 s/effect/affect/ 18:23:26 arg arg func arg 18:23:26 perhaps it'd be elegant 18:23:32 hmmhmm 18:23:34 tusho: Perligata 18:23:38 ais523: well, yea 18:23:39 also it gets worse as the program runs 18:23:40 but I mean, practical :P 18:23:56 if I could tie that in with homoiconicity and some other nice stuff, perhaps i'd use it regularly 18:24:54 -!- AnMaster has joined. 18:25:02 optbot: say hi to AnMaster 18:25:02 tusho: and the trees grow cotton candy 18:25:13 optbot: is that what happens when you say hi to him? wow 18:25:14 tusho: get a unicode client 18:25:17 optbot: I have one... 18:25:17 tusho: Plot Outline: In the middle of her family's move to the suburbs, a sullen 10-year-old girl wanders into a world ruled by witches and monsters, where humans are changed into animals. 18:25:22 optbot: oh..kay? 18:25:23 tusho: Even it if was a compiler? 18:25:26 optbot: Yep. 18:25:26 tusho: fis@sesefras:~$ 18:25:28 optbot: ? 18:25:29 tusho: Oh X-P 18:25:32 optbot: heh, wrong window? 18:25:33 tusho: i see 18:25:41 ais523: optbot has logs going back to dec 02 18:25:41 tusho: which you can not do with compiled anguages 18:25:42 hi tusho and ais523 18:25:43 thanks to fizzie 18:25:48 tusho: optbot's making less sense than usual 18:25:49 ais523: Of course... we can always draft up a new esolang with lots and lots of hardware support that's just ALMOST sane to write in... and name it The Esoteric Language For Writing Kernels In.... it'll be like C. 18:25:56 what the heck is opbot? 18:26:00 AnMaster: a person 18:26:03 he's just very fast at typing 18:26:05 oh not a bot ? 18:26:05 AnMaster: spell it correctly and it'll tell you 18:26:11 and ... very non-sensical 18:26:11 optbo 18:26:13 optbot* 18:26:14 AnMaster: and define reals to be the limit of doing that where the rational number representing the exponent ...gets closer to the real exponent 18:26:14 and obviously a bot 18:26:18 yeah a bot 18:26:22 * AnMaster is half asleep 18:26:23 optbot! 18:26:23 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | lazy-k can execute S and K only code but has I.. where is the problem with I. 18:26:29 optbot! 18:26:30 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | that's awesome!. 18:26:33 YES 18:26:36 leave the topic like that 18:26:39 yes 18:26:43 at least until optbot next changes it 18:26:43 ais523: !ps d 18:26:50 optbot: ais is not a bot 18:26:50 tusho: These people don't know unicode *heheheh* 18:26:55 optbot: oh, was there some nifty unicode in that 18:26:56 tusho: !hangman l 18:26:57 optbot: EgoBot isn't here, hasn't been for a while 18:26:57 ais523: [] is also list 18:27:00 optbot: i am not a bot either 18:27:00 tusho: Kinda equivalent to ``This sucks'' or something like that. 18:27:05 optbot: what, not being a bot sucks? 18:27:05 tusho: Methinks that's a malformed CTCP message. 18:27:09 optbot: no it's not. jeez. 18:27:09 tusho: I think ultimately your idea of Mfit ? NOPs could lead to a more compact solution, but would drastically increase the complexity of the program 18:27:16 optbot: I ... never had that idea. 18:27:17 tusho: duh 18:27:22 optbot: oh, you were trying to confuse me 18:27:22 tusho: and it rejected the ones that didn't comply with your info 18:27:28 optbot: still trying I see 18:27:28 tusho: <<:> <<:> <:>>> >><<> <> <>><< > 18:27:31 :( 18:27:54 well what is optbot 18:27:55 AnMaster: I shouldn't be programming so late at night >.< 18:27:57 ais523, ^ 18:28:13 AnMaster: I think it just picks random sentences out from the logs whenever anyone mentions its nick 18:28:20 no 18:28:21 and changes the topic everynow and then 18:28:22 how silly 18:28:23 it's a 7-order markov chain 18:28:42 also AnMaster lament, ihope, and asiekierka like it, and I think more 18:28:42 tusho: that'll effectively be random sentences then, I think 18:28:43 so shush :) 18:28:57 because it's unlikely that two sentences would have 7 words in common 18:28:59 its main purpose is to keep the topic fresh, though 18:29:04 meanwhile... 18:29:22 how far back does it read the logs? 18:29:25 Lisp Zealots are Offensive and Ironic Simultaneously, a Play in 2 lines 18:29:26 [[ > Quick background from the newb: 18:29:27 -!- AnMaster has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | do not remove this | that's awesome!. 18:29:36 Lousy spelling. Should be "fom the t-r-o-l-l". ]] 18:29:37 optbot! 18:29:37 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | hm.. 18:29:54 ais523: all of them 18:29:59 december 2002 - yesterday 18:30:01 tusho, broken, what if we have something important in topic? 18:30:09 AnMaster: we don't 18:30:17 tusho: we have done in the past 18:30:18 tusho, we had when ais523 won that thing 18:30:19 and nobody cares 18:30:20 :) 18:30:26 AnMaster: so just put it back in whenever it changes the topic 18:30:27 or someone makes it 18:30:34 it's only once every 6 hours 18:30:43 I think we can get a chanop to topic-log if there is something important there, though 18:30:48 yes 18:30:53 lament put that note in anyway iirc 18:30:55 probably needed in this channel the way people change the topic at a whim 18:31:16 ais523: optbot was basically a reaction to that - why do *we* need to find interesting stuff to put in it? :D 18:31:16 tusho: guess pointers get around that pretty well 18:31:21 optbot: no. that makes no sense 18:31:21 tusho: Yes. 18:31:24 :( 18:31:33 tusho: every time you have an argument with that bot the bot wins 18:31:34 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 18:31:47 ais523: it always seems to get the last word in... 18:31:48 :P 18:32:16 tusho: every time you have an argument with that bot the bot wins <-- :D 18:32:28 optbot: lose the argument 18:32:28 tusho: any other suggestions for an inexpensive portable esolang development device? 18:32:32 optbot: I said lose the argument 18:32:32 tusho: swallow something? 18:32:36 optbot: no 18:32:37 tusho: And I'm pretty familiar with Forth 18:32:40 ok let's try this 18:32:50 optbot: Reply to this message. 18:32:50 tusho: i have decided to make major/minor second a "skip the next interval" instruction 18:32:51 HA 18:32:53 I HAVE POWERS 18:32:56 kghkdfhg 18:33:02 -!- psygnisfive|away has changed nick to psygnisfive. 18:33:02 optbot invented Fugue? 18:33:02 ais523: looks nicer on the os x buttons 18:33:10 oklopol: kghkdfhg 18:33:12 er 18:33:14 optbot: kghkdfhg 18:33:14 tusho: shows the pre-processes code 18:33:19 optbot: weird command name 18:33:19 tusho: i don't really care what iterators should be used for, all i know is i didn't want to do that functionally, but now i have to 18:33:40 tusho: one important thing to note here: optbot is spending most of its time talking about esolangs 18:33:40 ais523: well yeah, pmatching is the hard part 18:33:54 which means that this channel is mostly about esolangs regardless of what you say 18:33:56 ais523: oh shut up you :) 18:33:58 here 18:33:59 look at this 18:34:22 optbot, pmatching? 18:34:22 AnMaster: think i got it 18:34:28 well what is pmatching? 18:34:38 pattern matching, presumably 18:35:34 so optbot 18:35:34 tusho: no Unicode? 18:35:39 shut up about unicode optbot 18:35:40 tusho: ?listauth 18:35:42 what optbot 18:35:42 tusho: Hi 18:35:45 hi optbot 18:35:45 tusho: liftM2 f l1 l2 = concatMap (\x -> map (\y -> f x y) l1) l2 18:35:47 no optbot 18:35:47 tusho: and because I couldn't see a reason to deny them 18:35:53 hmm, it's demented again 18:36:20 not demented, just talking Haskell at you 18:36:31 optbot: TALKIN' HASKELL AT ME HUH!?!?! 18:36:31 tusho: i can't create pink elephants 18:36:34 it's a bot, I can't blame it for talking in programming languages rather than English from time to time 18:36:38 optbot: no, that's a pretty rare skill 18:36:38 tusho: what do you need to crash win xp? 18:36:42 optbot: not much 18:36:42 tusho: That would take the whole esoteric part out of it. 18:36:48 optbot: yeah, totally. win xp is esoteric 18:36:49 tusho: http://www.esolangs.org/wiki/PSOX 18:36:58 optbot: oh come on ... don't pick up #esoteric memes... 18:36:58 tusho: I am? 18:37:04 optbot: Yes. PSOX is/was a meme. (More was.) 18:37:04 tusho: hmm 18:37:22 tusho: you'll have to stop that, I ended up laughing so loud that the person in charge of this place actually just told me off in RL 18:37:27 hahaha 18:37:42 talking about crashing Win XP and then optbot compares it to PSOX 18:37:43 ais523: hmm? 18:37:50 optbot: don't play innocent with me 18:37:50 ais523: http://compsoc.dur.ac.uk/~sc/BFS.lhs 18:38:00 lol ais523 18:38:02 that meaningless stuff is just a clever ruse 18:38:03 :D 18:38:19 tusho: no, it's an interesting reminder of #esoteric's history 18:38:35 PSOX is not crashy! (as far as I know) 18:38:50 optbot: is PSOX crashy? 18:38:50 tusho: that was an actual question, i don't know what it does 18:38:59 optbot: no, *I* wanna know 18:38:59 tusho: x 18:39:07 optbot: save your kisses. answer my question 18:39:07 tusho: why are there so many ...? 18:39:13 optbot: ... pink elephants? I dunno. 18:39:13 tusho: using bytecode and optimiztions in the interpreter AND coding it in bash IS mad 18:39:15 * Sgeo prepares a lengthy explanation for optbot, and watches everyone hide 18:39:15 Sgeo: but they are cool anyhow 18:39:24 Sgeo: just. no. 18:39:40 * Sgeo was kidding ofc 18:39:42 :D 18:39:45 brb 30mins 18:39:57 -!- jix has joined. 18:40:01 Sgeo: leave that explanation for AnMaster, e's good both at optimisation and at bash 18:40:12 ais523: psox has nothing to do with bash 18:40:19 or optimisation 18:40:24 brb 30m 18:40:28 I was referring to tusho: using bytecode and optimiztions in the interpreter AND coding it in bash IS mad 18:40:28 ais523: because it didn't fail 18:40:33 ah 18:40:33 :D 18:40:37 haha 18:40:38 worse than failure... 18:40:45 optbot: do you like me 18:40:45 tusho: ah, you mean jumping to negative funge-space? 18:40:50 optbot: no... I mean like liking m 18:40:50 tusho: 61803398874989484815 18:40:50 e 18:40:56 optbot: boolean plz 18:40:56 tusho: Reprap replicates! 18:41:00 fuck you :( 18:41:00 brb 18:41:08 Sgeo, what? 18:41:25 AnMaster, ais523 is the one who pinged you 18:41:30 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I think it can solve any solveable problem. 18:41:42 ais523, what? 18:41:48 I was mentioning how out of all the people here you would be best at "using bytecode and optimiztions in the interpreter AND coding it in bash" 18:41:53 which is what optbot was talking about 18:41:53 ais523: what? that's my IP! get out of my computer!!!! 18:42:04 ais523, it may refer to bashfuck 18:42:07 optbot: what, 127.0.0.1? 18:42:07 ais523: of then you are just making a bad optimization for fun 18:42:45 ais523, I did some sort of pre-run optimizing, so it resulted in a file where the locations of matching [ and ] were listed and also any +++ combined and such 18:42:51 it was the only way to get decent speed 18:43:05 ah 18:43:15 I like the way optbot drags up old topics, it should help to keep the conversation going 18:43:15 ais523: lojban is a lot like most languages imo 18:43:19 ais523, so in effect a sort of byte code I guess 18:43:28 AnMaster: yes, makes sense 18:43:43 ais523, you liked that it dragged up PSOX? 18:43:44 ais523, anyway precompiling was only way to load lost king at all 18:43:46 ais523, :P 18:43:51 j/k 18:43:59 Sgeo: I was amused that it dragged it up in a conversation about Win XP 18:44:08 ais523, the precompiler was coded in "mostly awk" iirc 18:44:14 may have been some part bash too 18:44:27 * AnMaster searches 18:44:48 ais523, it is probably in one of the repos at bzr.kuonet.org 18:45:04 that is the repo browser everyone wanted 18:46:04 http://bzr.kuonet.org/bashfuck/trunk/annotate/41?file_id=libcompiler.sh-20071030094711-58wlb8wcipp53wze-1 18:46:06 there it os 18:46:07 is* 18:46:15 ok, thanks 18:47:04 really this was back in 2007 I think 18:47:11 so I don't remember code 18:47:17 well that's quite recent for optbot, it's dragging stuff up at random 18:47:17 ais523: I want to use a base-5 numeral system! 18:47:18 im going to be taking a class called Philosophy and Computation this upcoming semester 18:47:22 the description for the class is: 18:47:26 An investigation of topics at the interface between philosophy and computation, including both (1) philosophy 18:47:27 about computers, minds and machines, and (2) hands-on work in robotics and computer modeling as 18:47:28 philosophical toys and philosophical tools. Topics will include the history of computing machinery, conceptual 18:47:31 foundations and limits of contemporary computing, computation and consciousness (Descartes, Wittgenstein, 18:47:34 Dennett, and Searle), agent-based and social modeling. There will be extensive hands-on laboratory projects in 18:47:37 elementary robotics and Turing machines, as well as work with fuzzy logic software, chaos theory, cellular 18:47:39 optbot, sure, "ESAB"4( 18:47:40 AnMaster: oh. 18:47:40 automata and artificial life. 18:47:44 that should do it optbot! 18:47:44 AnMaster: unless you have multiple languages 18:47:54 -!- olsner has joined. 18:47:57 hey, most of that made some kind of sense 18:48:00 ais523: I want to use a base-5 numeral system! 18:48:01 AnMaster: 2 is (:*) 18:48:03 optbot, sure, "ESAB"4( 18:48:03 AnMaster: oh. 18:48:03 AnMaster: It would be sorta pointless to implement these commands, because they're being used in packet transfer. 18:48:03 AnMaster: just D 18:48:10 hehe 18:48:36 AnMaster: well it's talking in both Underload and some weird Funge fingerprint now 18:48:43 psygnisfive, that makes sense 18:48:57 although I don't see how BASE implements packet transfer apart from D 18:48:57 ais523, well I just told it how to get base 5 18:49:04 err 18:49:04 ah 18:49:07 it doesn't 18:49:13 well, optbot was wrong then 18:49:13 ais523: I still don't get one thing about the MIT licence... 18:49:28 AnMaster: It'll be cool tho! :D 18:49:34 I'm gonna totally ace that class 18:49:47 I mean, cmon, hands on work with turing machinese?! I could give them formal definitions in my sleep! 18:49:47 psygnisfive, well it seems to match what happens in #esoteric quite a bit 18:49:56 psygnisfive, I couldn 18:49:58 couldn't 18:50:03 what is the formal defintion 18:50:06 turing machinese are each man 18:50:14 eh? 18:50:17 How do I search the contents of all text files in a directory for something? 18:50:22 single tape turing machines have lets see 18:50:25 * Sgeo realizes the answer 18:50:27 n/m 18:50:30 find -name "*.txt" | grep something 18:50:34 psygnisfive, you make *less* sense than that bot now 18:50:37 +xargs 18:50:39 Sgeo: grep something *.txt 18:50:49 Well, don't know if it's .txt 18:50:51 Deewiant, hi, have you see Mike recently on irc? I got some questions about those new fingerprints of his 18:50:51 they're a five tuple (S,G,d,q_accept,q_reject) 18:50:52 find | xargs would only be needed to search recursively through directories 18:50:55 I found some bugs in them 18:50:57 S being the language alphabet 18:51:00 in their defs that is 18:51:01 AnMaster: haven't 18:51:01 G being the tape alphabet 18:51:10 and even then grep -R will search through all text and all binary files, but just say "binary file matches" for binary files 18:51:12 Deewiant, like the regex one doesn't say *what* flavour of regex to use 18:51:14 so grep -R something . 18:51:16 oh, sorry, there should also be a set Q in there I think 18:51:36 Deewiant, it says use POSIX extended if a certain flag is passed, but not what to use by default 18:51:46 any idea how to get in contact with him? 18:51:55 d being something of type SxGxQ -> GxQx{L,R} 18:51:56 grep -RI something . searches only text files 18:52:03 -RI? 18:52:03 Sgeo: ^ 18:52:10 Sgeo: -R to search recursively through dirs 18:52:12 q_accept, q_reject elements of Q 18:52:14 -I to skip binary files 18:52:21 it's R not r? 18:52:23 that's capital I not lowercase l 18:52:24 and yes R 18:52:24 * Sgeo stops what he was doing 18:52:32 ty 18:52:46 ah, i just checked, both -r and -R do the same thing 18:53:00 which is a bit silly really but useful if you can't remember 18:53:19 you can't restrict what files you search that way though, it goes through everything 18:53:25 (apart from what it thinks is binary) 18:53:26 Well, the I is still useful 18:53:30 Deewiant: it goes through all text files which is what he asked for 18:53:42 and yes, you'd use find if you wanted to do something more complicated 18:53:44 then TM reads a character off the tape transitions to some new state, writes a character to the tape, and moves L or R 18:53:44 aye, but it might also go through a multi-gigabyte log file he didn't want ;-) 18:53:47 I'm looking for a playlist I made a long time ago 18:53:55 until it either reaches an accept or reject state 18:54:07 AnMaster, I'm fairly certain thats the formal definition 18:54:12 ...I remember the name, why don't I just use that? 18:54:17 I might've added an extra alphabet in there. e.e 18:54:23 what's the thing for finding by name again? 18:54:34 k 18:54:58 sgeo@ubuntu:/oldfiles$ find -name "?utation*" 18:55:11 Sgeo: use slocate if you have it, it's much faster 18:55:18 slocate utation 18:55:27 Deewiant, no idea about how to reach Mike Reily (spelling?)? 18:55:27 AnMaster: It's really not that interesting a model, to be honest. the simplest models do simple computations in obvious ways 18:55:28 I think ubuntu has it by default, not sure though 18:55:47 How do I restrict slocate to a certain directory and its subdirectories? 18:55:55 AnMaster: e-mail 18:55:59 for instance, equality checking on two items like this: 00011101#00011101uuuu... 18:56:16 Spelling would also help 18:56:21 -!- tusho has changed nick to tusho|away. 18:56:26 checking that the binary strings are the same is quite simple, really. almost human like. 18:56:34 Sgeo: slocate's sufficiently fast that I normally just grep its output 18:56:38 cross off the first 0 and transition into a "match a 0" state 18:56:46 -!- kar8nga has joined. 18:56:48 because it's searching an index it builds in a cronjob, not the filesystem 18:56:49 then move to the first not-crossed off symbol after # 18:56:55 if its 0 cross it off, otherwise reject 18:57:07 then move back to the first not crossed off symbol before the # 18:57:11 and repeat 18:57:17 In a grep, how do I get rid of say, anything with cache in it? 18:57:20 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 18:57:30 -!- jix has joined. 18:57:39 Sgeo: grep -v cache 18:57:50 (inVert I guess) 18:57:53 -!- jix has quit (Remote closed the connection). 18:58:01 Deewiant, ah I don't think I have his address 18:58:07 Can I use that in the same grep to look for oldfiles, or should I chain greps? 18:58:08 not on the web site? 18:58:10 -!- jix has joined. 18:58:15 Sgeo: chain them 18:58:17 Sgeo: I just chain them 18:58:23 there might be a way to do it in one 18:58:25 Sgeo, /etc/updatedb.conf for me to restrict locate indexing 18:58:38 tyvm all 18:58:45 Anmaster: Pretty simple, ey? 18:58:48 $ slocate utation | grep oldfiles | grep -v cache 18:58:59 I remember a while ago I was given a task to do which effectively was to download, compile and run certain programs that were prewritten and observe their results 18:59:12 it was such a mechanical task that I went and wrote a Makefile to do it 18:59:34 AnMaster: mikehriley@hotmail.com 18:59:40 Deewiant, thanks 18:59:42 also, one of the programs was so inefficient that I went and recoded it in bash + standard Unix utilities, and ran my recoded version, all while the original program was running 19:00:10 Still nothing found 19:00:36 Sgeo: slocate searches for filenames with utation in them 19:00:56 do you want to search through filenames or file contents? 19:01:07 * Sgeo is doing both 19:01:14 Found it 19:01:19 Maybe 19:01:24 that command searches only through filenames 19:01:27 ah, well done 19:01:32 erm 19:01:47 Wow, I'm glad that that path did not successfully enter this channel, it has my RL name in it 19:02:01 although on recent Ubuntu tracker-search-tool will search contents much the same way slocate searches filenames 19:02:05 and what a tragedy that would have been 19:02:21 No, no that file wasn't it 19:02:55 * Sgeo needs his grep to work 19:03:26 Well, not needs, I guess. Want 19:03:31 It's just a playlist 19:04:03 * Sgeo misses Mutation! 19:04:40 And no, mutation is not just the name of a playlist 19:04:57 http://wiki.activeworlds.com/index.php?title=Mutation 19:05:31 -!- tusho|away has changed nick to tusho. 19:06:49 worth noting - 19:06:51 * Sgeo knew all the puzzles, and I was once able to help a Teacher's Aide because her homework was similar to one of the puzzles 19:06:58 i invited AnMaster here 19:06:59 :) 19:07:13 I was in #bash asking for help, he mentioned he was writing a bf interp, I helped him in /query 19:07:21 and then told him to come here 19:07:29 i was not aware of his posix_fnature. 19:08:51 hmm 19:08:54 tusho|away was automatic 19:08:58 silly linkinus 19:09:22 the |away can be useful, though 19:09:59 * Sgeo makes slocate case-insensitive 19:10:01 * tusho automates "hi ais523" 19:10:10 linkinus is scriptable with applescript :p 19:10:12 * tusho looks at the examples 19:10:25 tusho, you didn't? 19:10:29 or did you? 19:10:30 -!- asiekierka has quit (Connection timed out). 19:10:31 maybe 19:10:32 can't remember 19:10:33 i didn't 19:10:35 I'm writing a script to 19:10:42 http://web.archive.org/web/20050113023358/www.mutation3d.net/chapter1_en.jsp 19:10:44 11:01:47 Wow, I'm glad that that path did not successfully enter this channel, it has my RL name in it 19:10:49 i think I remember that 19:10:52 tusho, about the invite I mean 19:11:02 AnMaster ? 19:11:06 i invited AnMaster here 19:11:08 is that true? 19:11:15 yes 19:11:16 i did 19:11:17 k 19:11:26 tusho, must have been back at bashfuck time? 19:11:37 yes 19:11:37 or? 19:11:38 ah 19:11:58 I remember speaking to someone in /msg who was also writing a brain fuck interpreter, one in C 19:12:06 about data structures he would use 19:12:32 some thing about linked list with down nodes for loops (which is pretty much what I did in Def-BF) 19:12:55 yay, I just re-discovered sgeo's IRL name 19:13:46 -!- ais523 has left (?). 19:13:46 -!- ais523 has joined. 19:13:58 hmm, obviously you haven't automated a hi yet 19:14:20 no 19:14:24 I'm figuring out how to get that event 19:19:16 incidentally, everyone: it's off-topic but I find http://entertainment.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/08/08/1347212&from=rss really amusing 19:19:22 automated what? 19:19:32 someone wrote a program for the iPhone costing $1000 which had no purpose but to prove you could afford it 19:19:46 ooold 19:19:49 that was on reddit yesterday... 19:19:50 :) 19:19:54 AnMaster: the say-hi-first game looks like it's being automated 19:20:09 tusho: ah, I don't read reddit regularly, that's the first I've seen of it, and 1 day isn't really old 19:20:12 ais523, you got it scripted yet? 19:20:24 AnMaster: he doesn't script i 19:20:24 t 19:20:25 I am 19:20:29 AnMaster: no, I was halfway through writing a bot to do it when I decided I couldn't be bothered 19:20:33 tusho, that is cheating 19:20:38 AnMaster: who cares 19:20:49 AnMaster: i have your new nick - captain_obvious 19:24:08 On being able to script people joining the channel: 19:24:08 [19:23:43] that is one of the major features planed for the next release 19:24:10 Enterprisey. 19:24:38 enterprisey? 19:24:46 $ grep -E '^.{4}$' /usr/share/dict/words | wc -l 19:24:46 5110 19:24:48 interesting 19:24:48 you need to scale that technology across the enterprise, net net. 19:25:15 [19:24:22] there is no system in place for inbound actions just yet 19:25:19 I got an idea 19:25:24 pick a 4 letter word 19:25:28 make a matching fingerprint 19:25:36 open the kimono and develop this paradigm, but don't try to boil the ocean! 19:25:37 so colloquy just generally sucks, apart from scripting at which it rocks, and linkinus is ok, apart from scripting at which it sucks 19:25:37 grrrrrrr 19:26:11 Circe has a scripting mechanism 19:26:21 and happens to be unusable 19:26:36 ais523, what do you think? 19:27:00 No, I'm not using Circe now. Why would I use a client that wasn't developed in who knows how long, and also illegally public-domained? 19:27:03 AnMaster: seems interesting, how are you going to get a random 4 letter word though? 19:27:20 ais523: he just said 19:27:23 ais523, grep -E '^.{4}$' /usr/share/dict/words 19:27:27 [19:24:46] $ grep -E '^.{4}$' /usr/share/dict/words | wc -l 19:27:27 ah 19:27:32 then pick a random one from that 19:27:37 use awk or whatever maybe 19:27:48 anyway I don't know what half of those words mean 19:28:07 "yawl" or "trow" 19:28:16 aspell like them though 19:28:29 any of you know what those words are? 19:28:38 * Sgeo murders Circe for not working just when I wanted to demonstrate that it wasn't broken 19:28:46 a yawl is a boat 19:28:55 a "trow" is sort of like a troll, but from a different mythology 19:28:56 finnish "jolla" 19:29:06 ais523: isn't that just in the game Myth? :-P 19:29:27 Deewiant: I've only seen it in games, but games other than that one so presumably they're getting it from a common source 19:29:48 that common source may also be a game or similar, though 19:29:57 I doubt it comes from any real-world myths 19:30:34 Deewiant: there are a lot of real-world myths around 19:30:45 dictionary.com says "trow" is a verb, means to believe 19:30:49 german "trauen" I guess 19:30:53 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trow says it's a sort of boat 19:30:55 ais523: aye 19:31:07 ais523: hahahahaha, #linkinus are saying that I should just write a bot. 19:31:11 that ... would not work in this acse. 19:31:17 but still, having seen it only in games makes me doubt its origin 19:31:17 tusho: well, I was going to 19:31:25 ais523: but it'd run on your irc client 19:31:35 no, I was going to write a separate one 19:31:41 Konversation doesn't script afaict 19:31:44 it does 19:31:44 ah, the orkney and shetland islands 19:31:48 obscure much 19:31:51 it runs external programs instead 19:31:56 ais523: what browser(s) do you have there? 19:32:11 tusho: firefox, epiphany, konqueror, w3m 19:32:13 probably others too 19:32:15 also nc 19:32:24 ah, good. Could you look at http://91.105.115.23/? 19:32:41 i'd like to know that it works on most everything (I know it works on IE7! First time!) 19:32:45 and that it also looks nice :P 19:33:19 it seems to work on Konq but there's a lot of blackspace at the top of the page (I would say "whitespace", but...) 19:33:36 ais523: bluespace actually 19:33:41 and there's meant to be 19:33:41 also the colour scheme's badly affected by LCD colour parallax 19:33:50 it can be either very black or very blue depending on the angle I look at it at 19:33:51 the text is meant to start around where the bloom is 19:33:57 you can see the bloom right 19:34:01 tusho: why? it means I have to scroll when my window isn't full-size 19:34:05 tusho: at some screen angles, not others 19:34:17 ais523: uh, it doesn't start very far down 19:34:34 185px down 19:34:36 the bluespace is about the same size as the first paragraph 19:34:53 anyway, it's because it looks nicer this way :) 19:34:56 and yeah 19:34:58 that's correct. 19:35:02 tusho: not in a small window it doesn't 19:35:11 ais523: that'd have to be a pretty darn small window 19:35:14 unusable, even 19:35:15 maybe you should try to centre it in the window or something 19:35:20 tusho: small but not unusable] 19:35:22 for most things 19:35:31 also it's not centered 19:35:39 it's nearer the top 19:35:42 tusho: I know it isn't, I'm suggesting centring would probably work better 19:35:50 ais523: not from a design point of view :-P 19:35:53 and even maximised it's nearer the bottom on this screen 19:35:58 because you waste so much space at the top 19:36:04 on Konq, at least 19:36:09 methinks my css is making more space for you 19:36:11 can I have a screeny? 19:36:24 let me try it on Firefox first 19:37:04 no better with a small window, but Firefox's default window size is bigger 19:37:27 wasting 185px of vertical space is inexcusable really, some computers only have 480px vertical space altogether and will use much of it for toolbars 19:37:33 ais523, I agree 19:37:35 i still don't see how your window could be small enough for that -shrug- 19:37:42 I have 800px vertical by default 19:37:45 yes 19:37:47 it should fit fine 19:37:48 and a half-screen-height window is common for me 19:37:51 even with toolbars 19:37:57 which gives me only 400px minus toolbars 19:38:07 which means your text starts more than halfway down the screen and doesn't finish onscreen 19:38:10 ais523, it works great in lynx ;P 19:38:16 AnMaster: it would do 19:38:30 tusho, why is there a small dotted rectangle in front of the header 19:38:36 AnMaster: get unicode fonts 19:38:38 185 px is a /massive/ amount to waste 19:38:43 ais523, I agree 19:38:50 AnMaster: you've already said you agree 19:38:57 you don't have to parrot off "I agree" every time something is re-stated 19:39:18 tusho, list some fonts I have and I can get unicode fonts you like 19:39:30 like dejavu or bitstream vera sans 19:39:38 AnMaster: it should work fine. 19:39:44 i don't know what's up with your syste 19:39:45 m 19:40:11 AnMaster: you have lucida grande on there 19:40:13 so it should display it fine 19:40:21 i know lucida grande does that char 19:40:25 tusho, well not installed on this one 19:40:30 I'm not on my desktop 19:40:36 AnMaster: have you got a unicode font? 19:40:38 I'm on a PDA running linux 19:40:41 span { 19:40:41 font-family: "Lucida Grande", "Arial Unicode MS", sans-serif; 19:40:41 } 19:40:51 should fall back to a font supporting that char 19:40:56 it does have bitstream vera sans, helvetica and a few more 19:41:05 then I have no idea 19:41:16 tusho: ais523@eso-std.org:/home/ais523/ehird-185-stupidity.png 19:41:18 there's your screenshot 19:41:26 with my default Konq window size 19:41:31 tusho, standard fallback font seems to be arial for some odd reason 19:41:35 guess it is non-unicode 19:41:44 AnMaster: Arial used to be the default because it was first in alphabetical order 19:41:54 ais523, hm? 19:41:55 and Arial and Arial Unicode are different fonts for some inexplicable reason 19:42:03 AnMaster: back in the days of windows 3.1 19:42:10 ais523, this runs Linux 19:42:18 AnMaster: did you mail Mike already, btw 19:42:22 it got ms fonts for some reason 19:42:24 Deewiant, yes I did 19:42:28 -!- Tritonio_ has joined. 19:42:30 alright 19:42:39 Deewiant, about default regex flavour in REXP 19:42:44 Deewiant, and about test suites 19:42:45 I just realized I had a question for him and figured you might ask it for me if you hadn't 19:42:51 AnMaster: ah, maybe they used the same fallback as win3.1 deliberately but I doubt it 19:43:04 maybe 19:43:06 namely, is D meant to delete dirs or reflect on them 19:43:18 Deewiant, ah you mail him too then 19:43:26 since evidently it's not implemented in RC/Funge :-P 19:43:34 Deewiant, anyway if you want to do recursive delete you have issues 19:43:38 and I won't code that 19:43:44 issues? 19:43:50 Deewiant, complex code 19:43:56 not really... 19:44:01 I do not wish to implement recursive rm 19:44:17 it's like 10 lines 19:44:24 Deewiant, still 19:44:32 I just call unlink and reflects if that fails 19:44:39 Deewiant: there's not a posix_ function for recursive deletion 19:44:39 I know 19:44:44 tusho: ah, true 19:44:53 AnMaster: but I'd still like to know the intended behaviour 19:44:56 Deewiant, you do? you checked on bzr.kuonet.org or what? 19:45:10 AnMaster: you told me 19:45:14 ah yes... 19:45:18 :-P 19:45:43 Deewiant, actually I haven't tested my D, waiting for mycology to test it 19:46:36 Deewiant, as for more extensive test suite for TURT, I don't think I will have time 19:49:19 is it possible to make a brainfuck complete language where it is impossible to make quines? 19:50:25 brainfuck complete? 19:50:48 what is that, like turing complete but not? :-P 19:50:51 Deewiant: capable of doing anything BF can do, so Turing complete and can also do IO as well as BF 19:51:14 Deewiant, turing complete + any stdio like brainfuck 19:51:16 "IO as well as BF" where BF is? 19:51:21 or right 19:51:23 misread that 19:51:35 and hmm 19:51:37 I doubt it 19:53:00 I'm starting to think user-made playlists are stored in the registry 19:53:09 Sgeo: ? 19:53:32 For the Yamaha something-or-other software synth and MIDI player 19:53:43 Deewiant, what about a language that always append some (random?) extra chars at the end of each lines? 19:53:58 at the end of what lines 19:54:15 output lines 19:54:30 that are not valid in the program code 19:54:31 that doesn't imply BF-compatible output to me :-P 19:54:41 hm true 19:54:50 -!- dogface has joined. 19:55:26 ais523: seen my concatenative lang? 19:55:30 no 19:55:35 tusho: got a spec or impl yet? 19:55:38 no 19:55:39 :P 19:55:52 ais523: two programs: 19:55:53 0 .n 0 1 [dup [+ .n] dip swap] loop 19:55:55 infinite fibonacci 19:56:07 -!- asiekierka has joined. 19:56:08 stdin chars reverse [.] each 19:56:15 reverses stdin char-by-char 19:56:15 hi 19:56:33 how does that differ from Joy? 19:56:34 Can i do the optbot topic change 19:56:35 asiekierka: & doubleplop 19:56:36 and hi asiekierka 19:57:00 hm... what does the .n do? 19:57:01 ais523: it's more awesome :) 19:57:12 .n is pretty much: . "\n" . 19:57:17 where . is the generic print function 19:57:22 ah 19:57:38 The idea of a "best non-optimizing compiler" is kind of interesting. If I wanted to translate between BF and BF-with-an-[-]-instruction, it'd be obvious how to do it: replace [-] with the instruction, and vice versa. 19:57:41 hmm... you have your own reverse function 19:57:50 er, what do you mean 19:57:58 anyway it's more practical than joy (e.g. I hope to have an easy curses-like thing), but it isn't like factor 19:58:00 in Overload translated to your notation, reverse would be written as [concat] combine 19:58:03 branches off in a different direction 19:58:11 You could easily optimize before compiling as easily as you could optimize afterward. 19:58:12 ais523: perhaps that's how it's implemented? :) 19:58:17 could be 19:58:25 Is there a 2-command BF? 19:58:27 ais523: also "stdin chars" is very elegant 19:58:30 it doesn't do what you think 19:58:36 asiekierka: I don't know of one which doesn't cheat 19:58:41 basically, stdin implements all the list stuff - like "each", "map" etc 19:58:44 and even things like "reverse" 19:58:46 what about ones that DO cheat? 19:58:47 but it does them line-based 19:58:58 "chars" takes an IO object and returns a new one, but that has its list operations operate on the chars 19:58:59 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 19:59:02 asiekierka: look at Whirl (I think that's how it's spelt) 19:59:08 there'll also be one that lets you do it in blocks of N chars 19:59:11 and all sorts of stuff like that 19:59:13 that gives you the general idea of how to do it by cheating 19:59:25 Oh, that sort of cheating... No. 19:59:30 Something else maybe? 19:59:40 probably it can be done by cheating but less blatantly than that 19:59:53 I think i can do a 1-command BF. 20:00:16 no 20:00:18 No you can't. 20:00:18 that's impossible 20:00:23 1 command, 2 symbol. 20:00:25 the only one-char language is the encoding of language X into unary 20:00:29 2 symbols* 20:00:36 -!- jix has joined. 20:00:42 That's something like unary, but not quite it. Smaller, mainly. 20:00:54 How does it have one command but two symbols? 20:01:02 command is $. symbols are $ and space. 20:01:06 Table: <>+-[],. 20:01:11 What does space do? 20:01:16 dogface: e isn't counting NOP 20:01:18 separation 20:01:28 just like 1L allegedly only has one command 20:01:37 but as NOPs actually do something they aren't even NOPs 20:01:50 Deewiant, about TERM, you said you can't use ncurses? 20:01:52 you could probably get a one-command language if all invalid commands were ignored 20:01:55 Deewiant, is that right? 20:01:56 nobody says that brainfuck is infinite command 20:02:04 If the $ is odd, it selects the command by using the table, where the position is the count of $ divided by 2. (the table is 1-8) 20:02:10 For example, ,[.,] 20:02:10 AnMaster: yes 20:02:12 will be 20:02:12 Deewiant, then I'd say it is impossible to implement in a portable way 20:02:18 tusho: all OISCs are one-command langs, they have one command and lots of arguments 20:02:23 AnMaster: how so 20:02:27 also Wait is arguably a zero-command lang 20:02:29 ais523: well, I guess 20:02:31 I mean iwthout arguments 20:02:32 you do realize that curses is implemented as well, right? :-P 20:02:42 if $ is even, the command is executed. 20:02:47 Deewiant: No. 20:02:49 Deewiant, I would have to implement all the different escape codes for different terminals 20:02:50 ,[.,] is 20:02:50 He uses posix_curses. 20:02:53 It's built into the CPU. 20:02:59 AnMaster: that's what termcap is for 20:03:01 Deewiant, also on some cursor addressing doesn't work in normal mode 20:03:02 it has a Curses Chip. 20:03:11 Deewiant, which means blanking is needed in between 20:03:13 $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $ $$$$$$$$$$ $ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $ $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ $ $$$$$$$$$$$$ $ 20:03:28 asiekierka: that's totally 2 commands 20:03:28 :) 20:03:30 But that's cheating. :-) 20:03:34 Deewiant, so got a solution? 20:03:36 AnMaster: doesn't termcap handle that as well 20:03:39 But better than Whirl 20:03:42 It's 1 command! 20:03:44 I'm not at all sure what you actually mean by that 20:03:51 asiekierka: seen Black? 20:03:52 the whitespaces only separate, they aren't even NOPs! 20:03:53 that also has one command 20:03:57 It's 1 command, 2 symbols! 20:04:01 with no args 20:04:02 but I would imagine that termcap would handle all such things 20:04:03 Space is only counted as a symbol 20:04:04 Heh. 20:04:07 again cheating slightly, but I think it's elegant anyway 20:04:11 optbot: Thoughts? 20:04:11 tusho: you can assign separate dl speeds for individual files 20:04:14 Deewiant, yes, and that blanks screen on all consoles when I enable cursor adressing mode 20:04:16 You could remove the odd-even thing 20:04:18 optbot: *Relevant* thoughts? 20:04:18 tusho: i can't believe it 20:04:20 minimalizing the code to 20:04:23 Deewiant, so it doesn't help at all 20:04:25 optbot: what, a 1-command lang? 20:04:25 tusho: EgoBot seems not to be here at the moment, which is a pity as it knows more languages than bsmnt_bot does 20:04:34 optbot: what lang do you need? 20:04:34 tusho: __copyright__="Copyright 2006 Andrew Pennebaker" 20:04:38 Deewiant, because I only use the termcap part of ncurses 20:04:38 optbot: hmm, python? 20:04:38 tusho: And "You never know what you'll find over the "? x_x 20:04:40 not the full thing 20:04:43 optbot: what 20:04:43 tusho: ahh 20:04:45 optbot: unf 20:04:45 tusho: for -1 -> 0 20:04:48 okay 20:04:56 AnMaster: don't use ncurses, that's what clears the screen 20:04:59 $$$$$$$ $$$$$ $$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$ $$$$$$ - when removing the odd/even thing, executing immediately and removing the /2 20:05:02 Deewiant, no it isn't 20:05:04 :) 20:05:14 That's unary with separations 20:05:23 Deewiant, it is the enter_ca_mode that does 20:05:26 Define a command as a function from integer to integer, with some provision for goto. 20:05:31 which is needed for cursor adressing 20:05:34 Deewiant: on DOS you could get around that by doing a screen capture first 20:05:34 addressing* 20:05:44 but I don't think text-mode screen captures are possible on a VT100, at least not easy 20:05:44 Also, what command has the most commands, all of which must be 1-char/1-pixel? 20:05:44 The annoying use of ツ as a smiley. DISCUSS. 20:05:46 Deewiant, which is needed by G 20:05:50 Deewiant, http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/annotate/337?file_id=term.c-20080715223140-lsa1tw5728k7pfxs-3 20:05:52 ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ 20:05:55 ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ ツ 20:05:58 and everything emulates VT100 so you don't need to implement anything else nowadays 20:06:00 Or wait. 20:06:13 asiekierka I thought you had given up doing things just because people said they were annoying 20:06:14 /sigh 20:06:29 ais523, um, cursor addressing, needs enter_ca_mode/exit_ca_mode 20:06:38 I just wanted to discuss it! 20:06:50 AnMaster: can you do it without clearing the screen first to load curses? 20:06:52 in Annoying ツ Smiley language i just invented 20:06:58 asiekierka: Yeah - by spamming it over and over after I said it was annoying. 20:07:11 asiekierka: Protip - Don't do things repeatedly straight after someone says it's annoying. 20:07:12 you mean before. Also, you said DISCUSS. SO I DISCUSSED it. 20:07:13 tusho: what is that character actually? 20:07:16 (Perhaps surprisingly,) it's annoying. 20:07:19 ais523, for god sake as I said three times now, it is not loading curses that cause screen clear, it is enter_ca_mode/exit_ca_mode 20:07:20 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 20:07:21 Define a command as a pair of (function from integer to integer, element of {-1, 0, 1}), where if the right part is 1 and the function returns 0, it jumps to the corresponding -1. 20:07:25 ais523: japanese character 20:07:29 hirigana or katakana 20:07:38 Clearly, it's hiragana. 20:07:40 Or katakana. 20:07:45 AnMaster: ah, but I've loaded curses, clearing the screen, despite never having heard of enter_ca_mode 20:07:59 so maybe it calls it behind the scenes somewhere? 20:07:59 ais523, depends on what routine you use 20:08:02 ais523: that's because curses does it internally probably 20:08:02 I use setup_term 20:08:05 err 20:08:07 setupterm 20:08:14 which doesn't clear screen 20:08:19 optbot: ツ 20:08:20 ais523: happy birthday! 20:08:27 initscr would clear it 20:08:32 haha 20:08:35 optbot: nice try 20:08:36 tusho: http://www.blogblog.com/no897/corner_main.gif 20:08:37 does optbot know something I don't? 20:08:38 ais523: if you give it an empty line you have to give it some input before it'll say it doesn't understand 20:08:40 which is how you load the full curses 20:08:40 The annoying use of digits ? through ?. DISCUSS. 20:08:42 ais523, got that? 20:08:43 What!? 20:08:45 Didn't it WORK? 20:08:45 optbot: elegant corner. 20:08:45 tusho: But does that turn every qubit on the tape to the same value as the current qubit? 20:08:48 AnMaster: yes 20:08:51 -!- dogface has left (?). 20:08:59 ais523, so there is no way around screen clearing 20:09:13 AnMaster: can you read from the screen at all before it clears? 20:09:13 TEST: ? 20:09:19 ais523, eh? 20:09:26 ais523, http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/annotate/337?file_id=term.c-20080715223140-lsa1tw5728k7pfxs-3 20:09:28 stop nickpinging me! 20:09:46 AnMaster: I'm fairly certain that CCBI's TERM didn't clear the screen despite using enter_ca_mode 20:09:48 what 20:09:51 oh 20:09:51 ha 20:09:56 in DOS it wasn't too hard to read from the screen 20:09:58 Deewiant, that may depend on terminal 20:10:03 ais523: I've changed nick to 'i' before 20:10:05 and 'the', 'a' 20:10:05 AnMaster: where do you get your enter_ca_mode variable from? 20:10:07 it gets really annoying 20:10:10 BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP BLEEP 20:10:12 Deewiant, it does in xterm at least 20:10:15 Deewiant, from term.h 20:10:20 Six... 20:10:29 asiekierka: seven now, why? 20:10:32 AnMaster: odd 20:10:38 why do you people keep talking about bsmnt_bot behind his back 20:10:41 $ grep enter_ca_mode /usr/include/term.h 20:10:41 #define enter_ca_mode CUR Strings[28] 20:10:43 Deewiant, ^ 20:10:45 Now it's ten. YAY! 20:10:45 AnMaster: I did a tigetstr 20:10:51 bsmntbombdood: I didn't think we did 20:10:56 no wait, 9 20:10:59 Deewiant, well this is a simpler way to do the same 20:11:00 bsmntbombdood: that's optbot 20:11:01 tusho: sure where? 20:11:02 read the man page 20:11:03 AnMaster: tigetstr("smcup") 20:11:04 NOW it is TEN. 20:11:05 bsmntbombdood: he talks about everything 20:11:08 optbot: right? 20:11:08 tusho: pls give me the names of some backs that u have the login 20:11:09 AnMaster: of what 20:11:12 hahaha wow 20:11:14 that's from that hacker guy 20:11:18 who wanted to pay us to hack banks 20:11:24 Deewiant, man setupterm lists all the related functions here 20:11:25 i linked him to tubgirl 20:11:39 and he described what it is calmly as if I had merely linked him to the wrong site 20:11:40 by mistake 20:11:40 tusho: that was mean, stop trying to DOS tubgirl 20:11:46 ais523: XD 20:12:05 Deewiant, http://rafb.net/p/2JfoKK45.html 20:12:20 Schrodinger's Message: Until you read it, you have no idea whether it's annoying or not. 20:12:22 AnMaster: aye, but I never saw anything about predefined variables like that 20:12:25 Deewiant, and then there are those defines 20:12:30 EXCEPT if it uses the annoying japanese smiley thing 20:12:37 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/7547148.stm Nigerian with 84 wives: Don't marry 86 wives. 20:12:46 Deewiant, well they just map to those arrays 20:12:55 Deewiant, it was mentioned in some man page 20:13:15 Deewiant, they are all listed in man 5 terminfo 20:13:53 " The variable is the name by which the programmer (at the terminfo level) accesses the capability." 20:13:57 incidentally, did Goatse ever become slashdotted from all the trolling? 20:14:04 ais523: hahaha that would be great 20:14:09 ais523: incidentally, goatse.cx is now work-safe 20:14:11 although just as horrifying 20:14:15 Deewiant, there :) 20:14:19 work-safe but horrifying? 20:14:21 and with the same amount of mental termoil 20:14:26 ais523: see for yourself! 20:14:42 incidentally I ignore anyone who says anything about goatse like that, the chance that it's a gullibility check is just too high 20:14:54 AnMaster: hm, is there anything there to read what's on the screen 20:14:55 ais523: it's a picture of bill o'reilly 20:15:02 especially if someone tells me it's mentally turmulous, I tend not to look at it 20:15:16 ais523: honest 20:15:17 it is 20:15:47 anyone want to back me up on this one? 20:15:52 well, if goatse isn't blocked by the filters here then the IT staff aren't doing their job, so I'm not even going to try 20:16:37 ais523: scp eso-std.org:/home/tusho/Picture\ 9.png . 20:16:44 AnMaster: I guess not 20:16:49 brb 20:16:56 AnMaster: in which case, enter_ca_mode is all that can be done 20:17:04 if it's terminal dependent how it behaves then it is 20:17:29 * ais523 wonders where enwiki's bad-md5-list got to, that's one way of checking for goatse without looking at it 20:17:45 but tusho, seriously, I'm not actually interested 20:17:57 it only took me 3 seconds to upload that 20:18:02 so it wasn't like I had to do much work :P 20:18:10 yes, but still 20:18:14 I'm wondering, is LOLCODE good 20:18:16 no 20:18:19 N O . 20:18:20 it's like you're trying very hard to get me to see goatse, and I'm offended by that 20:18:24 ais523: haha 20:18:46 asiekierka: no it's just a straightforward imperative lang with no redeeming features 20:19:05 it's for lamers using l33t, right 20:19:14 think BASIC with l33t commands 20:19:27 asiekierka: you'd probably like it, as you seem to like everything I say is annoying just on principle... 20:19:28 Deewiant, well as you see there is no way I can avoid clearing the screen 20:19:30 i am using basic... 20:19:37 ...for the C64. 20:20:01 Deewiant, in konsole it even enters a different mode where you can't see the scrollback before, and can't scroll, and then on exit_ca_mode it removes all that and you return to your previous scrollback 20:20:15 Deewiant, with no trace of anything in between 20:20:46 in xterm it just fills a screen with blank 20:20:50 you can still scroll 20:20:59 what about INTERCAL? 20:21:03 and on return from the mode nothing happens 20:21:33 asiekierka: ais523 maintains C-INTERCAL 20:21:38 so, I'm sure the answer is: intercal sucks 20:22:03 what's the best esoteric language, then 20:22:04 asiekierka: INTERCAL is nowadays quite unlike BASIC, once you try using it for a while you'll see the difference 20:22:10 asiekierka: what do you mean by 'best'? 20:22:17 there is no best 20:22:17 as in, just the best 20:22:19 arguably HQ9+, for accomplishing so much with so little 20:22:22 there are just different ones 20:22:23 not only the best command set 20:22:27 but a large program library 20:22:33 it manages to be a huge counterexample to everything whilst being highly amusing 20:22:34 asiekierka, stop trolling 20:22:41 there is no single best language 20:22:45 BF is probably the most popular, and probably has the most programs in it 20:22:56 but BF is a tarpit 20:22:59 Yes 20:23:11 Something more in the lines of... CAT. 20:23:16 Befunge is also pretty popular 20:23:21 not as much as BF 20:23:23 but quite 20:23:28 Thutu is the only esolang that I've ever deliberately chosen over non-esolangs to write a program in 20:23:38 after deciding it was the best language for the job 20:23:42 not a 2-d or 1-d programming language, something with real commands 20:23:45 but I used a wimpmode version of it 20:23:45 like not > 20:23:48 I'd say Brainfuck, INTERCAL and Befunge are all near the top when it comes to popularity 20:23:49 but PointerRight; 20:23:53 don't have any statistics 20:23:57 AnMaster: yes, probably BF, Befunge, INTERCAL in that order 20:24:01 possibly INTERCAL beats Befunge, I'm not sure 20:24:08 ok 20:24:16 ais523, well there is unlambda or whatever too 20:24:18 so i'm going to modify a GCS, MegaZeux, to add INTERCAL 20:24:20 pretty famous as well 20:24:26 asiekierka: good freaking luck 20:24:28 AnMaster: yes, famous but I don't think it has as many programs 20:24:32 or Unlambda 20:24:33 ais523, I guess not 20:24:35 asiekierka: good luck with computed COME FORM 20:24:37 *FROM 20:24:51 tusho: well e could just try INTERCAL-72, that's easier than modern INTERCAL 20:25:00 ais523: but also closer to being a boring basic variation 20:25:04 although still has weirdnesses that make it hard to implemetn 20:25:09 Anyone has an interpreter? Adding INTERCAL to MZX is already hell of a job 20:25:17 asiekierka: CLC-INTERCAL? 20:25:18 But it's Perl. 20:25:18 wth is MZX? 20:25:19 asiekierka, ^ 20:25:22 AnMaster: google 20:25:24 it must be in C. 20:25:24 asiekierka: well, I maintain C-INTERCAL but it's a compiler 20:25:30 asiekierka: C-INTERCAL is in C 20:25:32 but it's a compiler 20:25:33 and CLC-INTERCAL is a bytecode compiler + interpreter 20:25:36 written in Perl 20:25:36 What about unlambda? 20:25:40 and also in CLC-INTERCAL 20:25:44 "MegaZeux, or MZX, is a game creation system (GCS) based on Tim Sweeney/Epic Megagames'" 20:25:47 tusho, ^ 20:25:49 !??????????? 20:25:53 AnMaster: what about it 20:25:58 and stop nickpinging me 20:25:59 is that the MZX? 20:26:01 or what? 20:26:01 and read whatever article you found 20:26:03 you need some precompiled bytecode to start the compilation process off, not sure how Claudio generated it in the first place, maybe by hand 20:26:05 and yes, presumably 20:26:10 he has talked about ZZT 20:26:13 which is similar 20:26:14 i believe 20:26:18 MZX is using C. 20:26:30 well it got nothing to do with esoteric as far as I can see 20:26:35 What about an unlambda interpreter? 20:26:56 asiekierka: they're tricky to write in C, although it has been done 20:26:58 because of c and of d 20:27:32 Anything else popular? 20:28:01 by the way I created a game of life implementation in a scriptable propitary share ware fantasy rpg once. as a scenario, my only defence is that my mobo on my pc was broken and I had this old game engine on my old mac, so I was bored to hell 20:28:03 Befunge-93 is pretty easy to implement in C, although it doesn't have multiple-char commands like you requested (Funge-98's a lot harder) 20:28:05 otherwise I would never have done it 20:28:25 the important thing was that it was propietarty and share ware, of course. 20:28:26 nope BeFunge. 20:28:33 it must have multichar commands 20:28:34 AnMaster: I once spent several days, possibly weeks, writing stone-paper-scissors for Age of Mythology 20:28:38 asiekierka: why? 20:28:46 ais523, well this was called "blades of avernum" 20:28:52 ais523, and what is "Age of Mythology"? 20:28:56 it was ridiculously overengineered 20:29:07 tusho: It just doesn't fit MZX. 20:29:14 AnMaster: real-time strategy game in the Age of Empires game, it had its own language for writing map generators in 20:29:16 asiekierka, what the heck is MZX? 20:29:17 really 20:29:20 a GCS 20:29:22 digitalmzx.net 20:29:27 GCS? 20:29:30 and I wrote one which always generated the same map which was a multiple-player stone-paper-scissors with AI and scoring and everything 20:29:46 asiekierka, what has it got to do with esoteric programming? 20:29:51 s/the second occurence of 'game' two messages ago/line/ 20:30:22 nothing 20:30:25 i just want to implement one for it 20:30:28 add one for it 20:31:15 why the multichar commands, then? Does it have its own internal parser? 20:31:28 What do you mean? 20:31:32 besides, although INTERCAL has multichar commands its expression syntax is weird and hard to parse 20:31:48 It has a multichar programming language, ROBOTIC. 20:31:52 oh yes I'd hate to parse INTERCAL 20:31:58 portable INTERCAL expressions can't even easily be sent over IRC, which is why a two whole alternative syntaxes for them were invented 20:32:05 But it's bad by today's standards; has a thousand hacks to make it still work 20:32:06 s/ a / / 20:32:11 ais523, intercal *looks* easy to parse at a first glance, but it turns out it isn't 20:32:26 yes, that's it, in fact C-INTERCAL redefines getchar I think to make it work 20:32:35 ais523, oh!? 20:32:42 there are saner ways to do it but that's what it did when I first started tinkering with it and I haven't changed it 20:33:04 what does it change in it's definition? 20:33:22 well, apart from getting the reimplemented getchar to use read(2) because it was using stdio before and on some systems that was implemented in terms of getchar... 20:33:37 AnMaster: I think it's to change the literal backspaces into something that lex can handle and splitting up ! into '. 20:33:45 ais523: you know i'm actually warming to the gpl 20:33:54 ais523, oh I see, why the split of !? 20:33:55 lex doesn't like returning two tokens from one char 20:34:04 AnMaster: because ! is an abbreviation for '. in INTERCAL 20:34:14 ais523, couldn't that be done at lex level? 20:34:16 and '. is very common, it's sort of like ($ in Perl 20:34:19 or maybe bison 20:34:26 AnMaster: it probably should be, can't be done sanely at Bison level 20:34:26 ais523, so what is ($ in perl? 20:34:31 as in ($a + $b) 20:34:37 you see the $ is part of a different token 20:34:44 ais523, ah yes 20:34:55 ais523, oh... I see now 20:34:57 a similar INTERCAL expression would be !1 ~ .2' 20:35:01 although ~ isn't addition 20:35:11 then what is !1 ? 20:35:16 it's '.1 20:35:20 so the expression is '.1 ~ .2' 20:35:21 and that means? 20:35:23 or ' .1 ~ .2 ' 20:35:27 oh 20:35:28 quotes? 20:35:31 that means .1 select .2 where .1 and .2 are variable names 20:35:36 AnMaster: parens, just undirected 20:35:41 right 20:35:43 it's normally unambiguous 20:35:54 ais523, then ! seems just stupid to me 20:36:00 would make it harder to read the code 20:36:02 oh wait 20:36:05 that's the point? 20:36:09 AnMaster: yes, that is the point 20:36:11 I wonder if there is a possibility to do a language looking like sudoku 20:36:18 for a moment I thought you'd missed the point of INTERCAL 20:36:28 ais523, I was just being sarcastic 20:36:29 asiekierka: for a while I tried to figure out how to actually make Sudoku into a TC lang, but failed 20:36:38 what was your idea? 20:36:48 AnMaster: INTERCAL is all about being arbitrary for no reason 20:36:53 if you got any 20:36:58 asiekierka: allow grids which weren't necessarily a 9x9 square 20:37:08 ais523: maybe AnMaster is an esolan 20:37:08 but still required 1-9 in each row, column and box 20:37:09 g 20:37:13 he's just the exact opposite of INTERCAL... 20:37:17 just they would have lots of filled-in spaces 20:37:24 asiekierka, http://www.digitalmzx.net lacks something very important 20:37:30 an introduction to what the hell it is 20:37:33 tusho: the exact opposite of INTERCAL would be a neat, elegant and usual lang which for some reason had no assignment statement 20:37:37 Ask the guys around 20:37:38 AnMaster: a game creation system 20:37:43 AnMaster: presumably it's scriptable 20:37:44 or ask in #mzx@irc.esper.net 20:37:46 s/usual/usable/, although I like usual too 20:37:46 tusho, yes but some info, so you get a feel for it 20:37:48 AnMaster: so he wants to implement an esolang in it 20:37:52 after all INTERCAL is certainly unusual 20:37:53 and that looks like a fansite 20:37:53 asiekierka, not like I care enough 20:37:56 so are you surprise 20:37:56 d 20:38:00 just liked to tell you that 20:38:03 ais523: nah, still an -esolang- 20:38:07 just the antithesis of INTERCAL 20:38:18 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 20:38:35 tusho: the exact opposite of INTERCAL would be a neat, elegant and usual lang which for some reason had no assignment statement <-- something functional maybe? 20:38:42 AnMaster: probably 20:38:43 with no variables 20:38:51 hmm... maybe Haskell? 20:38:52 so you couldn't assign 20:38:59 ais523, doesn't it have assignments? 20:39:01 I think it would be a popular and elegant language 20:39:02 AnMaster: no 20:39:03 AnMaster: not really 20:39:06 I don't know haskell though 20:39:07 you can bind things 20:39:08 but not assign 20:39:09 optbot! 20:39:09 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | do you think an infinite loop would be trivial in qq by the way?. 20:39:13 it has something that looks like an assignment but turns out not to be 20:39:14 optbot! 20:39:15 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I'd like to see an apple-tree implementation of Life. It would be kind of appropriate.. 20:39:16 ah sounds a bit like erlang? 20:39:21 AnMaster: yes 20:39:22 but erlang got constants 20:39:26 you can assign once 20:39:29 yes 20:39:31 that's what haskell is 20:39:36 it's not assignment though. 20:39:37 ah, optbot is alluding to lament's famous BORAOAS comment 20:39:37 ais523: in fact, several of TD's things are art 20:39:40 tusho, well I know a tiny bit of erlang 20:39:40 it's just scoped binding 20:39:43 but no haskell 20:39:43 let x = y in z 20:39:46 not assignment 20:39:50 I planned to try to learn erlang at some point 20:39:59 it seems like a nice language 20:40:01 for a moment I was just wondering why optbot seemed to be out of context... 20:40:01 ais523: complex isn't too hard to type... considering how not-quite-so-often it'll be used. 20:40:04 -!- Tritonio_ has quit (Remote closed the connection). 20:40:08 ais523: lmao 20:40:14 although I did figure it eventually 20:40:17 ah, optbot is alluding to lament's famous BORAOAS comment <--?? 20:40:17 AnMaster: no, it isn't 20:40:31 AnMaster: "Even a box of rotten apples on a string is Turing-complete" 20:40:41 ais523, eh, who said that? 20:40:45 lament 20:40:47 I think 20:40:49 AnMaster: READING COMPREHENSION 20:40:52 HE JUST MENTIONED IT 20:40:54 LIKE 3 LINES UP! 20:40:54 why is it called "BORAOAS" 20:40:58 ON THE LINE THAT YOU ASKED! 20:40:58 AnMaster: acronym 20:41:01 tusho, I had a very busy day, I'm tired 20:41:05 ais523, for what? 20:41:15 AnMaster: the phrase 20:41:18 god damn 20:41:21 Box Of Rotten ... 20:41:22 "Box Of Rotten Apples On A String" 20:41:30 * AnMaster threatens tusho with a "got" 20:42:07 optbot: hi 20:42:08 ais523: !hangman " 20:42:15 optbot: E 20:42:15 ais523: not eta :S 20:42:23 ok, that almost made sense... 20:42:34 optbot: let's chat 20:42:34 tusho: Do you feel strongly about discussing such things ? 20:42:40 optbot: are you ELIZA?... 20:42:41 tusho: That's Plof 2, man. 20:42:46 optbot: ELIZA in Plof 2? Cool. 20:42:47 tusho: two divs. 20:42:48 tusho: that's exactly what I thought 20:42:49 tusho, was just thinking the same :P 20:42:57 and what the heck is Plof? 20:43:02 AnMaster: gregorr's langauge 20:43:02 some esolang? 20:43:04 although I remember a few months ago we had several people piping ELIZA into the channel so that's not impossible 20:43:05 oh 20:43:05 not esolang 20:43:12 tusho, oh now I remember 20:43:16 coded in D right? 20:43:20 well 20:43:23 DPlof is 20:43:23 :P 20:43:32 Plof3 is based on PSL 20:43:32 well the interpreter/compiler/whatever was 20:43:34 (plof stack language) 20:43:37 oh 20:43:39 basically the syntax can change at runtime 20:43:46 and plof3 is just the default syntax 20:43:48 tusho, hey that sounds like that lang of ais523 20:43:51 what was the name? 20:43:52 yes 20:43:53 feather 20:43:55 ah yes 20:44:04 I want to see a feather interpreter 20:44:09 I bet you can't make a compiler for it 20:44:16 you can't 20:44:17 well 20:44:17 -!- asiekierka has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 20:44:18 AnMaster: Feather is sufficiently general that after a while everything seems like "that sounds like Feather", it takes over your brain 20:44:18 you can 20:44:22 but it'd just be a befunge one 20:44:26 tusho, to self modifying ASM 20:44:32 AnMaster: more than that 20:44:32 I think you could do that for befunge 20:44:36 it'd have to be completely an interp 20:44:37 *think* 20:44:40 not going to try it 20:44:48 AnMaster: you absolutely need to bundle the source code with Feather, it's possible to prove it 20:44:52 tusho, well.. you could probably JIT befunge quite well 20:45:00 ais523, oh well 20:45:06 because you could end up re-parsing the program as cat 20:45:12 which would dump the source code to stdout 20:45:18 ais523, I don't know enough about feather really 20:45:24 or you could retroactively run the program under a debugger, or something like that 20:45:28 AnMaster: the problem is, neither do I 20:45:32 and I invented it... 20:45:34 ais523, oh?! 20:45:40 ais523, you need to write up some damn specs then 20:45:47 AnMaster: it's kind of hard to get my head around 20:45:47 ais523, give us hello world in feather! 20:45:52 and I've tried writing specs but they were wrong 20:45:52 AnMaster: it's not that trivial 20:45:54 feather is everything 20:45:56 you can make it brainfuck 20:46:01 tusho, befunge? 20:46:01 you can make it the opposite of feather 20:46:05 you can make it so that it never was feather 20:46:13 and the default language is a bit mindfucking anyway 20:46:17 then I need to ask a question 20:46:19 a spec would be way more work than just implementing it 20:46:20 no two questions 20:46:20 AnMaster: you can retroactively modify anything, including which language the program was running under 20:46:21 then speccing that 20:46:25 1) is it possible to implement at all? 20:46:28 AnMaster: yes 20:46:32 2) is it a sort of nomic? 20:46:33 AnMaster: I think it is, but I want to implement it to be sure 20:46:34 no 20:46:41 only tangentially related 20:46:44 (self-modifications) 20:46:46 AnMaster: no, although a Feathernomic would be awesome 20:46:49 and nomics don't do travelling in time 20:46:50 generally :) 20:46:53 ais523, hahaha 20:46:56 it's sort of self-modifying to the extreme 20:47:07 self-modifying in both time and space 20:47:11 ais523: you should make the timeline first class 20:47:12 ais523, well you need to implement it 20:47:13 really 20:47:13 as an object 20:47:16 so you can just poke around it 20:47:16 yes, I do 20:47:21 I really want to implement Feather 20:47:32 ais523, I'm not sure it is feasible 20:47:34 ais523: let's implement feather starting tomorrow 20:47:34 I'll start by implementing Protofeather, I think, which was a lang I invented to write a Feather interp in 20:47:37 what language would you use? 20:47:38 AnMaster: no, it isn't feasible 20:47:39 forget feathejs 20:47:41 that's going nowhere 20:47:54 ais523: maybe a collaborative text editor would help us 20:47:54 AnMaster: I would use a functional lang with call/cc 20:48:02 ais523: ruby 20:48:03 :P 20:48:04 ais523, hm... 20:48:05 ruby has call/cc 20:48:15 tusho, isn't ruby imperative? 20:48:17 tusho: well I installed gobby like you asked 20:48:21 AnMaster: multiparadigm 20:48:26 ais523: i shall get gobby working 20:48:33 oh I see 20:48:41 what exactly is call/cc? 20:48:48 forgive my ignorance 20:48:48 AnMaster: continuations 20:48:54 ah right 20:48:58 why the name call/cc then? 20:49:03 call with current continuation 20:49:13 it passes the continuation with the function it gets 20:49:14 ooh. that means eval basically? 20:49:18 no 20:49:23 basically it calls a function 20:49:23 ais523: oh and I think TDD or BDD might help a _lot_ with this 20:49:27 which is nothing very surprising 20:49:32 but it gives it a continuation as its argument 20:49:32 feather confuses us enough, it'd be nice to have some base cases 20:49:38 so that we know exactly "what to implement next" 20:49:39 erhm 20:49:50 so basically it generates a continuation and passes it to a function as an argument 20:50:00 Feather's basic operation is reasonably easy to write in terms of call/cc 20:50:01 ais523, well what is the basic syntax of non-modified feather? 20:50:06 -!- asiekierka has joined. 20:50:29 AnMaster: it looks vaguely like Smalltalk 20:50:30 but isn't 20:50:43 I invented Feather after thinking about Smalltalk for a while 20:50:52 ais523, example? 20:51:10 I'm unable to get a "feel" for what it is 20:51:14 if you see what I mean 20:51:16 yes, I see 20:51:23 I have an incorrect attempt at a spec with some examples in somewhere 20:51:26 which I could try pasting 20:51:31 it's wrong but may give you ideas 20:51:39 hm 20:51:52 -!- MikeRiley has joined. 20:51:52 ais523, would be nice yes 20:52:00 MikeRiley, hi! did you get my email? 20:52:05 can i make a optbot? 20:52:05 asiekierka: It would be crazy for it not to. 20:52:06 yes,,,,did you get my response?? 20:52:07 MikeRiley, also Deewiant had a question too 20:52:10 MikeRiley, *checks* 20:52:27 optbot! 20:52:27 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | even though i know the concepts somewhat. 20:52:32 optbot! 20:52:32 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | no no no. 20:52:36 yay! 20:52:37 MikeRiley, yes document what the default for REXP is 20:52:41 What is PCRE????? I have never heard of it... 20:52:41 actually, the spec's so misleading that I won't post it 20:52:44 or wait 20:52:45 its bad 20:52:47 optbot! 20:52:47 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | if you prefer to think that way. 20:52:48 MikeRiley, that is perl compatbile regex 20:52:51 optbot! 20:52:51 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Probably :P. 20:52:53 oh....ok.... 20:52:54 optbot! 20:52:55 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | sounds to me like someone who's eager but doesn't really understand IRC. 20:52:59 haha 20:53:02 that stays 20:53:04 MikeRiley, PCRE Perl Compatible Regular Expression, a library 20:53:06 basically you can send a message to an object by writing object message 20:53:06 libpcre 20:53:09 or [ object message ] 20:53:14 yes, will document what the basic regex that should be supported is... 20:53:20 if you need to change precedence, the [] is like () in most langs 20:53:27 will take a look at pcre.... 20:53:29 a lambda is [ arg1 arg2 | code ] 20:53:39 MikeRiley, and yes I wondered what the heck you were planning to write that needed IPC stuff 20:54:00 never know!!! eheheheheheeh but would like it just in case i ever need it!!! eheheheehheeh 20:54:36 you should seem my FRPC one.....another one that chances are nobody would ever use,,,,but will not stop me from implementing it... 20:55:04 MikeRiley, as for tests yes, I don't think I will implement stuff unless there is some sort of test suite 20:55:16 FRPC? 20:55:21 * AnMaster searches 20:55:32 there is one for DATE now....if you have a particular order that you would be interested in implementing,,,i could write those test scripts first.... 20:55:40 FRPC - Funge Remote Procedure Call.... 20:55:44 MikeRiley, not found on http://www.elf-emulation.com/funge/rcfunge_manual.html (FRPC) 20:56:00 that is because it is still in the formulation stage,,,, 20:56:10 DATE wasn't there two days ago I think 20:56:30 MikeRiley: seen IFFI? 20:56:30 essentially it allows an IP in a running funge environment to remotely execute a funge function within a totally separate environemtn.... 20:56:40 MikeRiley, well I have reserved the name CFFI btw, I haven't yet finished specs as I'm not sure what is feasible to implement 20:56:47 but it will be a full C FFI 20:56:48 would be similar to MACR but more elaborite,,,again would execute in a single tick 20:56:52 to call any function in any library 20:56:56 from inside funge 20:57:09 i have seen IFFI... 20:57:29 DATE is new as of today.... 20:57:32 but I have not yet come up with a working and usable interface 20:57:33 should be on my site now... 20:57:34 MikeRiley, I see 20:57:43 hm 20:57:54 I'd like to make an esoteric language called Cake. and it's a lie. 20:57:56 MikeRiley, does it handle leap seconds? 20:57:57 the 1.14 manual has it... 20:58:19 no....DATE is just simple date functions based upon julian day calculations... 20:58:21 asiekierka, huh? sounds like a reference to something, but I got no clue what? 20:58:36 AnMaster: portal 20:58:39 please get rid of your rock... 20:58:44 you're too big to hide under it 20:58:44 tusho, what rock? 20:58:46 yes, i have a portal obsession i think 20:58:52 cake lie? 20:58:54 I don't get it 20:58:59 portal is a game 20:59:01 in it, the cake is a lie. 20:59:03 yes I know that 20:59:05 the game 20:59:10 I even seen some screenshots 20:59:10 it is part of the game plot. 20:59:14 seems pretty cool game 20:59:17 cake is promised by glados throughout the game 20:59:21 oh 20:59:22 and near the end you find out that it is a lie 20:59:22 I see 20:59:30 k 20:59:52 tusho: not exactly, AFAIR there's just a wall with "the cake is a lie" spraypainted onto it 20:59:56 yes 21:00:01 although I haven't played the game so I'm not sure 21:00:01 technically it isn't a lie 21:00:06 so maybe the wall, rather than the cake, is a lie? 21:00:10 MikeRiley, hrrm I may implement DATE, have still to track down that elusive t bug 21:00:13 (at the end of the final cutscene there is cake.) 21:00:24 but that's after you destroy glados 21:00:32 so, obviously, *glados'* promise was a lie 21:00:38 (I haven't actually played the game, hah) 21:00:58 AnMaster: ok will send you the DATE test program 21:00:59 Someone overanalyzed the song 21:01:00 MikeRiley, I have to do that before implementing any more fingerprints I decided 21:01:06 MikeRiley: does it work under sdate? 21:01:14 what t bug do you have?? 21:01:17 I tried cfunge under sdate and it gave the right year but the wrong month 21:01:27 ais523: those pesky posix_time functinos 21:01:29 apparently due to the way the date's packed into integers 21:01:37 tusho: stop it, this meme is no longer funny 21:01:49 MikeRiley, mycology says "a b" takes more than 5 ticks, I checked and it doesn't, but compared to ccbi the threads are not in the places they should be before 21:01:56 so there is a desync happening at some time 21:02:00 so I need to track that down 21:02:00 ais523: yes but if a no-longer-funny meme lasts for ages and ages it becomes hilarious again 21:02:03 I haven't managed yet 21:02:05 or should I say posix_hilarious 21:02:25 I tried cfunge under sdate and it gave the right year but the wrong month <-- which I explained isn't odd 21:02:27 tusho: I have such memes as inside jokes elsewhere, the point is that it only becomes hilarious if it was never funny to start with 21:02:33 ok AnMaster,,,DATE test program is emailed.... 21:02:36 AnMaster: yes, I understand the explanation 21:02:41 I was just wondering whether DATE would work 21:02:42 ais523, becuase of the way funge encodes dates in y 21:02:50 hmmmmmm on the "a b" one.....mine works.... 21:03:03 ais523, and well I don't think anyone but you cares about that, and it is not something I'm likely to test 21:03:04 brb 21:03:09 ais523: actually if you wait twice as long once-funny ones return too 21:03:12 no offence meant 21:03:16 AnMaster: well, /someone/ wrote sdate 21:03:21 speaking of which, ALL YOUR POSIX_ ARE BELONG TO US 21:03:31 tusho: well that meme never stopped being funny 21:03:32 MikeRiley, yes well I checked and it *does* take the right number of ticks in cfunge, but the desync happens before 21:03:36 which mess up later 21:03:52 oh yes, all your base.... 21:03:54 I am bored. Any ideas to do on pencil and paper? 21:04:00 that is one of the better memes 21:04:09 ate my balls 21:04:21 any esolangs you can do on pencil&paper? 21:04:36 ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ate_my_balls ) 21:04:36 back 21:05:23 asiekierka, hrrm.... befunge you could do on a grid by hand I guess 21:05:29 Whirl? 21:05:37 anmaster: is it in the space compression code??? that is where mine was with that one.... 21:05:41 You could make a pencil&paper implementation of whirl 21:05:43 right 21:05:49 MikeRiley, no I checked that 21:05:52 asiekierka: BF's pretty easy even on pencil and paper 21:05:56 asiekierka: you could implement p&p anything 21:05:56 sometimes you can even run it in your head 21:05:57 MikeRiley, I'm not sure where it happens 21:05:57 try intercal 21:06:05 also I find Befunge in my head to not be too hard usually 21:06:05 hmmmmm how does mycology actually test that function?? 21:06:07 INTERCAL's harder 21:06:10 could it be a bug in mycology?? 21:06:13 because the operators are hard to do mentally 21:06:29 even the CAPTCHA on the CLC-INTERCAL website I often have to load up intercalc to solve 21:06:33 MikeRiley, I plan to do a binary search based on tick count compared to the first t (can't do it absolute as y testing will differ) to find where ccbi and cfunge starts to differ 21:06:35 because I mess up when doing it in my head 21:06:36 stack based languages are really easy to do in your head 21:06:37 I must do a PENCIL esoteric Language 21:06:39 if they use high level enough combinators 21:06:52 MikeRiley, using ccbi debugger and the .gdbinit that comes with cfunge 21:07:40 tusho, FORTH? 21:07:44 AnMaster: no. 21:07:46 I wonder what functions could a pencil&paper programming language have 21:07:47 huh 21:07:49 forth doesn't have high-level combinators 21:07:50 :P 21:08:03 lost the game 21:08:14 asiekierka, it should be easy to do befunge on that 21:08:15 as I said 21:08:36 you need a marker, a paper with a grid, a pencil and some way to remove pencil marks to change them 21:08:38 -!- tusho has quit ("Bye!"). 21:08:41 What about SNUSP? 21:08:44 also a stack tracker of some kind 21:08:45 anmaster: of the new fingerprints, which ones do you want to implement, then i will write those test scripts before the others... 21:08:49 tusho: wow, that was abrupt 21:08:50 -!- tusho has joined. 21:08:53 optbot: still here? 21:08:54 ais523: minimum space as in O(1) spae 21:08:58 What about something using ONLY pencil, eraser and paper 21:09:01 apparently so 21:09:03 specially designed for it 21:09:18 asiekierka: maybe something special could happen if you wore a hole in the page? 21:09:18 something like a reversible language or anything without lost information might be nice on paper, as you don't wanna erase too much 21:09:22 cuz it gets messy 21:09:24 MikeRiley, well LONG and FING definitely 21:09:25 ais523: it runs on eso-std.org 21:09:27 that's how it changed the topic last night 21:09:33 tusho: why doesn't opt-bot respond to /msg? 21:09:34 ok,,,, 21:09:36 tusho: why doesn't optbot respond to /msg? 21:09:36 ais523: Uh... immibis, you should'nt do that 21:09:37 MikeRiley, maybe EXEC, 3DSP too 21:09:38 ais523: why should it 21:09:46 MikeRiley, possibly SETS 21:09:55 ais523: uh i'd tell you to read the source but it has my password in it 21:09:57 tusho: many bots do so you can mess with them without flooding the channel 21:09:57 ^.^ 21:10:00 ok,,, 21:10:06 tusho: why not optbot's password? 21:10:06 ais523: Only numbers. 21:10:14 haha, that was good optbot 21:10:14 tusho: guess what, they just launched the new site 21:10:15 MikeRiley, and where did you put the DATE test? 21:10:16 optbot: that won't be a very secure password then 21:10:16 ais523: damn 21:10:20 hahahaha 21:10:22 emailed it to you 21:10:23 YES 21:10:25 oh the mail just arrived 21:10:26 I see 21:10:26 thanks 21:10:32 most welcome 21:10:34 Making a hole on the instruction point will remove the space forever 21:10:43 It can be normal BF 21:10:43 ais523: anyway, i'm lazy and stupid and I picked one password and used it everywhere for like years 21:10:48 and i cba to go and change everything 21:10:48 but operating on bits 21:10:50 as in 21:11:01 MikeRiley, anyway I had a very busy day so going to sleep soon, probably on the keyboard if I don't relocate myself to the local sleeping facility soon ;P 21:11:08 you can just make holes in order to make bits 21:11:11 (that is: bed) 21:11:12 tusho: ok, I generally have different passwords for things other people might be able to see 21:11:12 ehehehe ok,,,,, 21:11:23 let me know if you have any furhter questions on those fingerprints.... 21:11:31 will email you the test scripts as i complete them... 21:12:03 ais523: I want to use 1password eventually 21:12:11 Oh well. 21:12:13 it lets you use one password but for each site generates a long, random one 21:12:16 MikeRiley, nice, you should put them up on some website too IMO 21:12:18 and lets you also sync it everywhere 21:12:20 and back it up 21:12:20 for other authors to use 21:12:20 tusho: that isn't a very secure password, although it's probably marginally more secure than password1 21:12:23 Any single-player puzzle games you can play on paper? 21:12:25 (so that you're not tied just to that app) 21:12:28 (it uses os x's keychain) 21:12:33 MikeRiley, would be very useful for everyone who wants to implement it 21:12:35 TETRIS i think 21:12:37 ais523: oh, thanks for reading my password 21:12:37 :p 21:12:49 btw I finally turned off hunter2 mode over here 21:12:50 asiekierka, hm you need to remove strips and such 21:12:55 it was causing too much confusion 21:12:56 can't really see it done on paper 21:13:00 ais523: would you like to ghost me for the symbolism? 21:13:05 I'll just use normal asterisks if I ever turn it back on again? 21:13:14 optbot: should ais ghost me 21:13:15 tusho: but having the file that's needed rmd at the end of the step 21:13:16 optbot: should ais ghost me 21:13:17 tusho: "EPLs". 21:13:18 optbot: should ais ghost me 21:13:18 tusho: Which is the boot sector and the partition table. 21:13:19 optbot: should ais ghost me 21:13:19 tusho: it's called "emacs" 21:13:20 optbot: should ais ghost me 21:13:21 tusho: Hola 21:13:22 optbot: should ais ghost me 21:13:22 tusho: it's just identify password 21:13:31 optbot: say yes 21:13:31 ok that last one was appropriate 21:13:32 tusho: this_is_a_command; "This is a literal string". this ~ " is a string with variables and " ~ commands() ~ " being parsed." 21:13:32 yes, i will put all the test scripts on my funge website... 21:13:32 heck 21:13:40 separate from the Rc/Funge-98 distribution... 21:13:45 MikeRiley, sure :) 21:13:47 Is there a 1-player puzzle game for pencil&paper, then? 21:14:07 asiekierka: Tetris 21:14:10 MikeRiley, the cfunge repo contains some tests and some examples, and since I just export for releases they contain it too 21:14:16 although you'll have to figure out some way to make the blocks move yourself 21:14:41 MikeRiley, hope some of http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/files/337?file_id=tests-20080312224933-r7p428lop2j37r0o-1 are useful to you 21:14:43 asiekierka: Sudoku would be one sane example, anyway 21:14:48 my dev directory has all kinds of test programs,,,,but most of them have very cryptic output....so not too good for general consumption... 21:14:56 will take a look 21:15:18 writing concatenative code is better than soduku 21:15:24 imo :P 21:15:34 it's all about continually shortening and splitting it and then tidying it off 21:15:37 it's a game, really 21:16:06 without sudoku 21:16:17 MikeRiley, well mine got descriptive text at the end 21:16:17 also, no tetris, i have tetris, picross and sudoku on my ds already 21:16:25 so yeah not very useful 21:16:36 asiekierka: well there's a game I made up in my head several weeks ago which is actually quite difficult 21:16:45 i like the way mycology does them,,,so will redo all my test programs to be similar... 21:17:01 MikeRiley, for example http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/annotate/337?file_id=concurrentquit.b98-20080330095205-t1xqar6x4mwzwum0-1 got two possible outputs: quit, or segfault ;) 21:17:05 MikeRiley, may be worth trying it 21:17:13 i will try it... 21:17:14 depending on how you do t 21:17:25 given a range of non-negative integers (say 0-13), find the smallest subset of those integers such that each integer in the large set is the difference between two integers in the small set 21:17:28 actually it will print good a few times 21:17:32 if everything goes well 21:18:06 give me a sec,,,,trying it now... 21:18:43 MikeRiley, actually that isn't a valid download link, it points to a version control annotated copy 21:18:50 got 4 goods and then a normal program end... 21:18:54 ah yes 21:18:57 MikeRiley, :) 21:19:10 MikeRiley, the other ones in http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/files/337?file_id=tests-20080312224933-r7p428lop2j37r0o-1 are also worth trying 21:19:12 yeah,,,,used the download link to grab the file... 21:19:18 grabbing 21:19:33 most got comments explaining what should happen 21:20:06 C means correct most of the time and W means wrong, or it prints more like GOOD/BAD, or it just doesn't print anything, *sometimes it got a comment in it* 21:20:07 ok,,,,will give all of them a try... 21:20:41 MikeRiley, the ones called *.b108 will probably not work as expected in RC/Funge 21:20:56 probably not....i have implemented some of 108,,,,but not 100% yet... 21:21:07 well 108 is still not a fixed standard 21:21:15 so any support currently is for some draft 21:21:20 things like reflection for k u ( ) and such... 21:21:26 well they are likely to say 21:21:26 added the additional y fields... 21:21:27 stay* 21:21:38 and the k functionality (minus the nested) 21:21:55 MikeRiley, yep also likely to stay, with the exception of that trinary funge stuff which may not work out well in other parts 21:22:14 it's certainly possible to do such a funge but I don't think it can be part of the standard really 21:22:20 :/ 21:22:24 too separate 21:22:24 any idea when you will have a standard that is relatively set?? 21:22:35 yeah,,,,,i agree with you.... 21:22:48 MikeRiley, hard to say, need to get input from C. Pressy too on the final draft 21:22:56 and I like input from you and Deewiant 21:23:05 and no cfunge doesn't do all the 108 stuff yet either 21:23:14 other than the new fingerprint method....everything else seemed reasonable.... 21:23:17 -!- asiekierka has quit. 21:23:23 except nested k,,,do not really see the point in it.... 21:23:27 I'd like to have a look through it too at some point 21:23:34 MikeRiley: it's pointless but still needs to be specified 21:23:39 ais523, rage.kuonet.org/~anmaster/funge108/ 21:23:43 the files are in there 21:23:50 AnMaster: how near-finished is it? 21:23:51 err typo 21:23:54 can understand specified....just see it as pointless... 21:23:57 http://rage.kuonet.org/~anmaster/funge-108/ 21:23:58 the dash 21:24:08 ais523, some parts are pretty finished, other parts aren't 21:24:09 -!- psygnisfive has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 21:24:12 but input would be good 21:24:15 I may have to get tusho to finish making ESO usable in a hurry 21:24:20 from the spec tho...seems like 0 iterations is not possible??? only 1 up??? 21:24:22 -!- psygnisfive has joined. 21:24:36 MikeRiley, well I don't like UNDEF, and k was *really* underdefined in 98 21:24:44 I think the k part is over a page now isn't it? 21:24:49 i agree there,,,,k was very problematic in 98... 21:24:53 MikeRiley, 0 is possible 21:24:54 i think so... 21:25:00 it should be anyway 21:25:13 it basically works the way CCBI implemented it 21:25:19 nested k probably doesn't 21:25:35 well,,,,cannot remember quite the example....but if you had something like: 111122kk5 sounded like from the spec you will get 5 5s??? 21:25:40 MikeRiley, anyway iterate-iterate.b108 and iterate-iterate2.b108 are both about nested k 21:25:45 since the skip skips the k and would land on the 5.... 21:25:56 according to the spec,,,, 21:26:05 so would not 00kk5 still end up on the 5???? 21:26:20 or did i misread something??? 21:26:21 MikeRiley, and not sure about that, but basically remember on the second iteration of the inner k you would pop the iteration count again, which would mean you popped a 5 you pushed the first time 21:26:29 if you see what I mean 21:26:45 yes,,,see what you mean,,,should have used something other than something that pushed onto the stack,,, 21:26:54 so like 00kk, or 111122kk,.... 21:27:33 as for 00kk 21:27:34 hrrm 21:27:36 i almost would have defined nested k as an error,,,and made it reflect... 21:27:41 that would not execute the second k 21:27:44 so that is pretty clear 21:27:49 what is an issue however is: 21:27:52 000kkk 21:27:57 yep..... 21:28:00 AnMaster: error in the Funge-space diagram, 32-bit integers go down to -2147483648 as you say but up to only 2147483648 21:28:03 AnMaster: error in the Funge-space diagram, 32-bit integers go down to -2147483648 as you say but up to only 2147483647 21:28:05 i think nested k is very problematic.... 21:28:05 hm 21:28:11 sorry, corrected version, I made the same mistake as you first time... 21:28:44 ais523, I copied from the diagram from Funge-108 but remade it in inkscape, it was ASCII art in 98 21:28:45 if it did something useful, i could see having it,,,,but without a real use for it.....complicates the k code for no real reason... 21:28:46 hm 21:28:53 ais523, so what is the error? you confused me 21:29:02 asda 21:29:03 sd 21:29:07 AnMaster: range of 32-bit int, it only goes up to 2147483647 21:29:14 brb 21:29:18 [21:24:16] I may have to get tusho to finish making ESO usable in a hurry 21:29:20 and your funge-space diagram lists a column 2147483648 21:29:22 * AnMaster checks 21:29:26 i am not particularly inclined to accept funge-108 as an eso spec 21:29:33 tusho: why not? 21:29:35 MikeRiley, and well reflect on nested k seems worse 21:29:37 not in your framework of choice? 21:29:41 regardless of personal concerns AnMaster has stated that he doesn't want an HTML version or similar 21:29:43 and stop trollin 21:29:43 g 21:29:45 it's still worth us looking over 21:29:48 and sorry 21:29:57 tusho, I will make a pure text version if you want 21:30:04 that'd be worse, actually 21:30:10 I can export from LyX to text, will need some fixing up of the tables after 21:30:12 but can be done 21:30:13 but yes, I will look it over 21:30:16 AnMaster: why not an HTML version, anyway, if what tusho says is correct? 21:30:17 but it depends on AnMaster co-operating 21:30:23 back 21:30:24 is it a case of "don't want" or "can't produce easily" 21:30:25 and I'm pretty sure he's flat-out stated that he's not changing his format 21:30:25 ais523, well *I* won't make that 21:30:31 as in, I hate coding html 21:30:38 ah, that makes sense, but you don't mind if someone else html-converts it 21:30:42 ais523: basically - ESO standards should be made in a semantic language 21:30:45 LyX is a presentational language 21:30:46 ais523, sure if it works correctly 21:30:53 maybe with nested k,,,,just like and ; cannot be executed,,,maybe k should not be either?? 21:30:58 we _could_ modify it ourselves, but then it wouldn't be the official version 21:30:58 tusho, is it? it is all about semantics IMO 21:31:13 AnMaster: its certainly not semantic in the way i meant 21:31:17 although i do hate having exceptions....at least and ; make sense 21:31:24 it is to a degreee, but not in the metadata way that I meant 21:31:27 tusho: we can ESO-bless it as a true and accurate conversion 21:31:39 ais523: and that'll mean F all if AnMaster points to his version 21:32:00 he has stated clearly that the lyx version will be the official one 21:32:01 full stop 21:32:04 MikeRiley, well I implemented the damn nested k in cfunge now and Deewiant thought this was the most sane way to do it (he was against the reflect alternative) 21:32:18 MikeRiley, btw D in FILE, should it just delete files or also directories? 21:32:24 i can certainy implement it too...just seems messy for no reason... 21:32:57 well my k is very messy because I need to make exceptions when doing threading 21:33:02 it is a compile time options 21:33:06 D in my implementation uses unlink, intended to delete files, no reason why it could not delete subdirs as well 21:33:11 MikeRiley, just iterate over t or @ XD 21:33:24 MikeRiley, well I prefer unlink() too 21:33:29 DIRF is for subdirs 21:33:33 tusho: well, if we certify it as being identical to the official version I don't see why AnMaster wouldn't link to it 21:33:33 FILE for files 21:33:42 that is my basic take on it.... 21:33:42 ais523, indeed 21:34:08 since DIRF already has a directory deletion function.... 21:34:08 MikeRiley, I think it makes sense for FILE to only do files, not directories 21:34:15 just document it :) 21:34:18 it does make sense.... 21:34:21 will document it.... 21:34:29 Deewiant was wondering about it 21:34:31 ais523: because he's said so 21:34:38 in case you cannot tell,,,i am terrible at documentation!!! eheheheheheheheheeheh 21:35:05 tusho, I said tex version would be a sane official one 21:35:29 AnMaster: so if we did all the work for you you would designate ours as the official one? 21:35:33 but I'm happy to make another version official if it is sane, and correct 21:35:39 tusho, I would need to read over it 21:35:43 to check it is the same 21:35:47 but probably 21:35:49 AnMaster: ok then 21:35:55 tusho, anyway I need to finish it first 21:35:56 of course, this relies on the actual standard being sane ;) 21:35:59 which I hope it will be... 21:36:00 tusho, hah! 21:36:02 but, you know 21:36:26 tusho, you will love this: 21:36:38 I printed it out yesterday for proof reading, took it with me as bed time reading 21:36:44 feel asleep at third chapter 21:36:49 I guess it was boring or something ;) 21:36:58 AnMaster: probably your awful taste in fonts 21:36:59 :D 21:37:14 tusho, I did select a serif font before printing 21:37:27 Latin Modern 21:37:30 to be exact 21:38:07 MikeRiley, oh btw run a spell checker on that page with your fingerprints, no offence meant 21:38:18 but Deewiant did quote some with [sic] iirc 21:38:26 no offense taken,,,,i admit that i am a horrible speller!!!! 21:38:37 MikeRiley: it's more your grammar,,,that I worry about 21:38:37 :D 21:38:40 (misspelled communication iirc was one of them) 21:38:45 i am worse at grammar.... 21:38:51 * AnMaster slaps tusho around with a "got" 21:39:01 * tusho stabs AnMaster in the eye with optbot's help 21:39:02 tusho: that's what programmers need 21:39:08 optbot: agreed. a good eye-stabbing 21:39:08 tusho: even if not about you, but about your comment, which is kinda weird 21:39:08 hahah! 21:39:16 optbot: well, I think his comment warranted it 21:39:16 tusho: im assuming the code is correct not the list? 21:39:19 hmm... ASCII needs a 'dimension feed' character for Quadrefunge 21:39:30 ais523, vertical tab 21:39:33 maybe? 21:39:37 ais523: i'd have expected a LOL from you about that 21:39:40 that's less of a movement than formfeed 21:39:41 it seemed as funny as the last time at least :P 21:39:43 anyway if you do more dimensions you should do: 21:39:45 although the coherency ended quicker 21:39:53 vertical tab 21:39:55 so maybe it should come between newline and formfeed in Quadrefunge 21:40:02 to allow easy extending to more dimensions 21:40:04 ais523, ^ 21:40:06 AnMaster: how is the dimension delimited 21:40:08 that is what I would do 21:40:16 hmm... and we should at least mess with device control 1, 2, 3, and 4 21:40:18 ais523, a number following the vertical tab 21:40:20 those chars don't get enough love 21:40:27 but I guess there should be a newline too 21:40:28 after that 21:40:29 AnMaster: how do you tell when the number ends and funge-space begins 21:40:37 ais523, a newline would make sense 21:40:43 yes, I suppose so 21:40:56 \v(\n|\r\n|\r) 21:41:11 still, I doubt anyone will ever program in Quadrefunge, except maybe they will now I've said it 21:41:12 iirc that is what I and MikeRiley decided some days ago 21:41:21 even 3 dimensions is too many really 21:41:24 that sounds about right... 21:41:33 I need to make a system using \n\r 21:41:35 just to break everything 21:41:43 ais523, if someone made a 105-dimension funge then someone would use all 105 dimensions in a hello world 21:41:47 and then never touch it again 21:41:48 :P 21:41:58 eheheheheheheeheheheh probably!!!!! 21:42:02 we need Hilbert-Lahey-space Funge 21:42:05 ais523, anyway I can see some use for a lot of dimensions 21:42:10 ais523, data structures 21:42:16 easy to represent binary trees 21:42:24 or n-dimensional arrays 21:42:31 also need instructions tho to move throught all those dimensions... 21:42:45 AnMaster: how do you represent a binary tree in Hilbert-Lahey-Funge? 21:42:48 ais523, how can you do a 3D array in befunge? 21:42:57 brb 21:42:58 ais523, not sure, but I think it would make it easier 21:43:02 AnMaster: multiplicatively 21:43:03 also what is "Hilbert-Lahey-Funge" 21:43:08 muldimensional arrays I can understand 21:43:18 AnMaster: hilbert space is a bit like infinite-dimensional cartesian space 21:43:19 ais523, well not a binary tree maybe 21:43:22 may have confused it 21:43:25 and I was just lahifying it 21:43:41 ais523, who was/is Lahey? 21:43:45 not sure 21:43:45 anyway a tree could be easy 21:43:50 down node: next dimension 21:43:53 but Lahey-space is familiar to all Funge programmers, I hope 21:44:04 try checking Wikipedia, it's normally good for looking up that sort of thing 21:44:09 so if you need a side node you just try the next dimension 21:44:16 and yes I know what Lahey-space is 21:44:26 but when I googled once all I found was funge references iirc 21:45:05 back 21:46:45 hmm... apparently it was invented by "Chris Lahey", which turns up quite a few google results but I'm not sure if they're relayed 21:46:53 seems to be a common name 21:46:56 oh ok 21:47:02 ais523, so it is funge specific then 21:47:36 ais523, what did you say the range should be for 32-bit int? 21:47:44 * AnMaster is opening the file in inkscape atm 21:47:59 AnMaster: the positive value is less positive by one than the negative value is negative 21:48:01 if you see what I mean 21:48:17 ais523, in 2-complement that is? 21:48:27 AnMaster: yes, in 1-complement they're both one lower than you have them 21:48:34 positive maximum's always an odd number 21:48:52 ah 21:48:54 ais523, true 21:48:55 hrrm 21:49:16 what is the reason for this one lower in 2-complement? 21:49:32 i am not the same person as navigator/mooz_ 21:49:38 just for the record 21:49:41 AnMaster: because 0 exists 21:49:45 say in 8-bit numbers 21:49:52 then you have 0-127 which is 128 possibilities 21:49:59 and -1 to -128 which is the other 128 possibilities 21:50:02 ais523, will be fixed on next udpate 21:50:04 in 1s complement you have two zeros 21:50:05 update* 21:50:16 thus it only goes down to -127 as well because you have -0 21:50:29 ah true 21:50:40 ais523, I think two complement is rather arcane ;P 21:50:45 if you see what I mean 21:51:01 AnMaster: yes, but convenient for people 21:51:07 well, for computers 21:51:10 yeah 21:51:16 because you don't have to distinguish signed/unsigned 21:51:27 1's complement is neater if you know everything is signed, and just as easy to wire up in the hardware 21:51:33 chris lahey is probably not real 21:51:35 ais523, you have to for * and / but not + and - iirc? 21:51:40 or how is it? 21:51:52 (2's complement you ignore the carry from the top bit, 1's complement you wrap the top carry as the carry input for the bottom bit) 21:52:10 AnMaster: you have to for /, not sure about * 21:52:15 hm ok 21:52:25 ais523, what about - and +? 21:52:45 you can just do them as unsigned right? 21:52:49 - and + don't care about signedness with 2's complement 21:53:11 although they have different error conditions on overflow according to whether they're signed or unsigned 21:53:23 thus the 6502 for instance has signed-overflow and unsigned-overflow condition bits 21:54:04 6502? 21:54:17 an old-fashioned processor, and the first asm language I ever learnt 21:54:23 the BBC Micro used it 21:54:23 ais523, also doesn't x86 allow overflow in both without complaining iirc? 21:54:30 anmaster: your perl test script produces errors in my perl, which perl version does it expect? 21:54:31 AnMaster: the 6502 didn't complain either 21:54:46 BBC Micro, I always wondered, was it related to BBC the broadcasting compay? 21:54:49 company* 21:54:56 but you need to know whether there was overflow to chain its 8-bit additions into 16-bit or 32-bit additions 21:55:05 MikeRiley, "This is perl, v5.8.8 built for x86_64-linux" 21:55:11 MikeRiley, should be portable iirc 21:55:13 * AnMaster checks 21:55:32 most cpus had an overflow flag for doing arbitrarily long math... 21:55:43 AnMaster: yes 21:55:43 hm true 21:55:44 they made it 21:55:52 well 21:55:54 Acorn did for them 21:55:55 tusho, odd 21:56:00 not really 21:56:02 it was made for schools 21:56:09 bbc provide a lot of multimedia for schools 21:56:14 ah 21:56:27 anmaster, here is what i get from running perl.b98: 21:56:28 syntax error at -e line 1, near ""Hello world!\n";" 21:56:28 syntax error at -e line 1, next char ) 21:56:28 Execution of -e aborted due to compilation errors. 21:56:29 ais523, ah yes... 21:56:31 I think BBC Micro was related at least tangentially to the broadcasting company, partly because BBC Micro Mode 7 uses the same terminal-control language as Teletext uses 21:56:35 for things like colours and so on 21:56:51 MikeRiley, I think this may be an issue with your implementation, it just does some basic stuff like printing hello world 21:56:52 ais523: it was made by acorn for the bbc 21:57:00 v "$x=" "' "Hello world!\n" "' "; print $x"0< 21:57:03 that means... 21:57:04 tusho: that would make sense 21:57:12 ok,,,hold on...let me try it with something that i know.....brb 21:57:24 why doesn't PERL use 0"gnirts" 21:57:51 wtf can't figure that out 21:58:31 $x="Hello world\n"; print $x" 21:58:33 that should be it 21:58:34 optbot 21:58:34 tusho: wait. 21:58:37 optbot: why 21:58:37 tusho: I like my number generation algorithm :) 21:58:42 optbot: why does that mean i have to wait 21:58:42 tusho: and I might agree about the cleverness if I understood that ;) 21:58:46 optbot: ??? 21:58:46 tusho: /------\/ 21:58:49 optbot: wtf 21:58:49 tusho: as indeed was I 21:58:50 AnMaster: were you trying to run a Befunge program as Perl? 21:58:53 optbot: have you gone mad 21:58:53 tusho: but this does 21:58:55 ais523, nop 21:58:57 optbot: wtf! 21:58:57 tusho: or maybe not 21:59:03 ais523, I was trying to load a string on the stack 21:59:05 that contained quotes 21:59:09 that was the issue 21:59:11 AnMaster: ah 21:59:18 which is why I didn't understand the code 21:59:22 but the code is correct I think 21:59:26 ais523: when are we going to make that strongly-typed, lazy self-rewriting language? 21:59:29 it'd be amazing 21:59:40 (with no control structures apart from its self-rewriting of course) 21:59:40 MikeRiley, anyway I guess your code does one quote too much in some way? 21:59:44 weird,,,wrote a simple test,,,,failed as well,,,,by mycology works,,,,weird..... 21:59:48 tusho: after Feather and Underload and Underlambda and all the other stuff we're going to do 21:59:50 (but extensible enough that you could implement regular control structures with it) 21:59:51 ais523: :D 22:00:01 MikeRiley, mycology probably doesn't test with quotes in the string to execute 22:00:06 MikeRiley, so I guess the issue is there 22:00:12 checking perl.c ..... maybe there is something odd in there... 22:00:43 MikeRiley, http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/annotate/337?file_id=perl.c-20080415234024-e7mizpsvp1v9ole8-3 22:00:45 that is my perl 22:00:49 note code is horrible 22:00:59 "because it's PERL LOL" 22:01:04 tusho: strongly typed rewriting is easy 22:01:11 ais523: not in the way I meant it 22:01:13 you just rewrite at the parser tree level not at the token level 22:01:14 tusho, because file descriptor stuff is messy 22:01:15 that is why 22:01:23 ais523: 'schating :) 22:01:36 *s'cheating 22:01:47 e.g. arguably OIL's a strongly typed rewriting language, but it rewrites something else not itself, if it rewrote itself it would be more of a rewriting language 22:02:26 night all 22:02:37 night AnMaster 22:03:05 -!- kar8nga has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)). 22:03:13 bye AnMaster 22:03:17 ps. AnMaster 22:03:22 is your name intentionally grammatically incorrect 22:03:45 tusho: I don't think An is an article in eir nick 22:04:08 what is it then :P 22:04:54 ais523: by the way, why is yahoo.com alexa #1 but google.com alexa #2? 22:04:58 surely google is more popular than yahoo 22:05:05 or maybe alexa users are more prone to use yahoo 22:05:08 if so why 22:05:26 tusho: I think it's partly because google.com is just the search 22:05:33 e.g. googlemail.com is a different domain 22:05:40 whereas yahoo lump everything under one domain 22:05:41 ais523: but mail.google.com is not 22:05:48 type gmail.com 22:05:52 and you go to mail.google.com 22:05:55 ah, ok, so that isn't it 22:06:48 ah, google.co.uk is at 23 22:06:50 maybe that's it 22:07:02 ais523: US users of google should still outway users of yahoo 22:07:09 google is, like, the most popular site, ever 22:07:13 except maybe msn 22:07:15 and google.fr at 20 22:07:19 (due to default homepageness) 22:07:25 and google.de at 16 22:07:28 tusho, just checking back 22:07:33 yes it is intentional 22:07:37 becuase it is my initials 22:07:41 An are my initials 22:07:42 AnMaster: ah 22:07:42 so I'm not convinced that Google&&US > Yahoo anywhere 22:07:46 or rather AN are 22:07:48 AnMaster: so you are the master of ... yourself? 22:08:02 tusho, now stop trying to find hidden meanings in it :P 22:08:02 perl module working correctly now.... 22:08:08 AnMaster: i still don't get it :P 22:08:15 tusho, I don't get your nick either 22:08:25 there are lots of odd nicks 22:08:32 my nick is odd 22:08:36 if it were ais524 it would be even 22:08:42 har har har 22:08:44 hehe 22:08:51 well I can guess of the cause of that 22:08:53 AnMaster: my name = random pronouncableness that is relatively google-empty 22:08:55 ais was used 22:09:00 add some random numbers 22:09:01 AnMaster: ais is his initial 22:09:01 s 22:09:04 result ais523 22:09:04 its his university name 22:09:06 I tried to just /nick 523 22:09:09 but it wouldn't let me 22:09:12 apparently there have been 522 ais' before him 22:09:22 ais523, why 523? 22:09:26 tusho: I use ais523 everywhere since the number 523 was randomly alloted to my username 22:09:29 i just told you AnMaster 22:09:32 at his uni 22:09:39 and the number 523 has no reason behind it at all other than an effectively random process 22:09:40 there have been 522 people with the initials ais before him 22:09:46 so he got ais523, presumably 22:10:41 oh 22:10:43 night 22:10:48 night 22:11:22 night 22:11:28 optbot: say night 22:11:29 ais523: false, surely true, surely false... 22:11:36 optbot: deep 22:11:37 tusho: AnMaster: :-D, not everything 4-char is a Befunge fingerprint ;-) 22:11:39 well, that's about the best we can get out of em... 22:11:42 well, he mentioned AnMaster 22:11:44 :) 22:12:04 tusho: how do you know optbot isn't female? 22:12:04 ais523: dvorak kind of suffers from that as well 22:12:13 ais523: statistics 22:12:16 he repeats what we say 22:12:19 we are almost all male 22:12:20 QED 22:12:20 wow, Dvorak was really female? 22:12:26 hah 22:12:40 -!- MikeRiley has quit ("Leaving"). 22:13:40 we need a new topic 22:13:41 optbot! 22:13:41 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | are anybody here?. 22:13:44 heh 22:13:57 lol 22:14:03 i love this bot :p 22:14:30 i'll feel kind of bad when botte is done and optbot merely becomes a plugin of botte... 22:14:30 tusho: failed :< 22:14:31 :( 22:14:38 see, even optbot is upset about it 22:14:38 tusho: of course, the dollar was much more valuable 6 months ago :-) 22:14:40 he doesn't want to fail 22:14:42 useless but... indispensable 22:14:55 M0ny: totally 22:15:16 optbot, do u think that too , 22:15:16 M0ny: http://koti.mbnet.fi/yiap/ 22:15:16 ? 22:15:31 * tusho shrugs 22:15:46 optbot: indispensable? 22:15:46 ais523: how do you guys pronounce 'Malbolge'? 22:16:03 * tusho pets optbot 22:16:03 tusho: leave the pointer in the same cell 22:16:07 optbot: OK 22:16:07 tusho: yes 22:16:12 optbot: yes? 22:16:12 tusho: Well that would explain it. 22:16:15 optbot: indeed 22:16:15 tusho: You can write notes on the tape, and the interpreter would read them with the PC speaker 22:16:23 umm... as three syllables, although I can see how it could be pronounced with 2 22:16:38 like Malb-Olge 22:16:39 mal - bolge 22:16:41 pretty simple 22:16:42 :P 22:16:46 bolj 22:16:51 mal - bolj 22:16:59 I pronounce it mal-bolg-uh 22:17:11 ah 22:17:12 I don't 22:17:14 so quite a variance 22:17:22 I can see how your pronunciation would work too though 22:17:32 how is the layer of hell pronounced 22:17:44 I don't know that either 22:17:45 I say it mal-bolj 22:17:46 but it has an extra e 22:17:56 I imagine it's pronounced the same way 22:17:58 male - bolg - e 22:18:05 that's probably it 22:18:08 maelbolge 22:18:39 malebolge should probable be pronounces in italian though 22:18:53 apparently it means something like "the evil ditch" 22:19:17 i say it in french 22:19:37 mal (evil) bol (cup) je (like I) 22:19:53 quite easy :p 22:19:56 evil cup like I 22:19:57 XD 22:20:56 ah, I pronounce it with a hard g but otherwise the same as M0ny 22:21:12 lol tusho :p 22:21:29 optbot certainly seems good at inspiring discussions 22:21:30 ais523: because that would be the same as [...] 22:21:38 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 22:21:42 ... which would be the same as [.]? 22:21:54 I don't think optbot was talking about brainfuck 22:21:54 tusho: ifuckinghatetheplatformyouhavetogoonbeforetheroombeforemiketyson 22:22:01 ... 22:22:02 erm, okay 22:22:11 optbot: playing IWBTG are we? 22:22:11 tusho: I'm adding auto-login support. 22:22:15 ... to IWBTG? 22:22:19 IWBTG? 22:22:25 lol 22:22:27 ais523: I Wanna Be the Guy: The Movie: The Game 22:22:34 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Wanna_Be_The_Guy 22:22:36 hmm... 22:22:46 autologin support to Tetris would be an interesting concept 22:22:52 optbot: say something 22:22:52 ais523: HAI. CAN HAS STDIO? VISIBLE "HAI WORLD!". KTHXBYE. 22:22:53 8-bit style platformer that is designed to be like all the hardest NES games put together, times 500000 22:22:58 NOT IN LOLCODE.... 22:23:09 ais523: oh no 22:23:11 bad optbot! 22:23:11 ais523: oh? 22:23:18 -!- jix has quit (Nick collision from services.). 22:23:26 -!- jix has joined. 22:23:29 now optbot's imitating AnMaster 22:23:30 ais523: I doubt they'll be related to your code 22:23:43 psst...optbot... non-portable code 22:23:44 tusho: jabber?! 22:23:48 HAHAAHHAHAHAA 22:24:02 jabber's portable though I think, isn't it/ 22:24:05 s/\//?/ 22:24:08 at least the protocol 22:24:11 right, optbot? 22:24:11 ais523: (push number - a second. then any interval, corresponding to the actual number. Then pop - a unison) 22:24:14 jabber's protocol is xml 22:24:41 optbot, does aliens exist ? 22:24:41 M0ny: You have a valid program you want to compile, yet it can never be compiled 22:25:07 that's a rather metaphorical take on that... 22:25:26 he bypass the subject :p 22:25:36 nah its just a phiisophical look 22:25:37 at it :D 22:25:40 nah, optbot was just trying to give a tangential example 22:25:41 ais523: oh 22:25:47 optbot: you weren't? 22:25:47 ais523: ::bites oklopol:: 22:25:56 optbot: ok that's just vicious 22:25:56 ais523: *that 22:25:58 optbot, binary 22:25:58 M0ny: oh noes!~ 22:26:04 ::bites oklopol:: is an augur line 22:26:06 optbot, 01010110100101011010010101 22:26:06 M0ny: you know what? i hate you 22:26:07 optbot: I got it right first time... 22:26:07 ais523: Who was it that thought it would be cruel to bring children into the world because the world would end soon? 22:26:11 :o 22:26:20 ok... thank u optbot -_- 22:26:20 M0ny: Err 22:26:26 oh, ok :) 22:26:28 haha 22:26:29 [22:25:57] optbot: ok that's just vicious 22:26:29 [22:25:57] ais523: *that 22:26:29 tusho: it was part of the original division routine in the system library 22:26:29 tusho: i dont know, i cant speak for thousands of people that i'm not. 22:26:33 that's brilliant 22:26:55 tusho: I should have misspelt that, it would have been truly funny then 22:27:42 optbot: say something amusing 22:27:43 tusho: "tieto" is "knowledge" 22:27:48 optbot: don't say something amusing 22:27:49 tusho: converting to s-exprs is basically parsing. 22:27:52 :( 22:27:54 optbot: that's insightful, not amusing 22:27:54 ais523: convert to a binary church and it's easy 22:28:08 optbot: ok, clearly you do insightful better 22:28:08 ais523: yeah 22:28:14 heh 22:28:27 binary church... 22:28:30 odd concept :D 22:28:48 tusho: both church as in religion and church as in church numerals it's an odd concept 22:29:25 optbot: ^ 22:29:26 ais523: agreed 22:29:34 heh 22:29:37 optbot: then why did you say it? 22:29:37 ais523: tusho has just moved the C-INTERCAL repo to http://code.eso-std.org/c-intercal/ 22:29:44 XDDDDDDDDDDDDDD 22:29:56 optbot: ok, thanks for warning me... 22:29:56 ais523: Hmm - various sources are saying that it's possible to write/call subroutines in brainfuck without code duplication, using a mangled loop? o.O 22:30:06 lol 22:30:15 optbot: ...and it's still there apparently, beyond all belief 22:30:15 ais523: You're changing the subject, BUB! 22:30:19 optbot, cmeme 22:30:19 M0ny: ok 22:30:23 arf 22:30:44 optbot, highlight 22:30:45 M0ny: still trying to figure out how I'm going to actually do assigns and ++/-- 22:30:56 optbot: is highlight an esolang? 22:30:56 tusho: So if we pass in a |0>, we get |0+>, if we pass in a |1>, we get |1->, if we pass in a |+>, we get |+0>, and if we pass in |->, we get |-1>. 22:31:03 optbot: hmm, odd esolang 22:31:03 tusho: wow 22:31:11 so optbot - do cool URIs change? 22:31:12 tusho: and contains no free names 22:31:14 optbot! 22:31:14 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Any more pebble.bfm insanity?. 22:31:18 optbot! 22:31:18 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | @join. 22:31:18 optbot: seems like quantum Brainfuck 22:31:19 ais523: why should they? norwegians understand english 22:31:23 optbot! 22:31:23 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | i understand that completely. 22:31:27 YES 22:31:29 LEAVE THAT 22:31:37 :° 22:31:50 optbot: yes but why not just write in norwegian? 22:31:50 ais523: because it's a pledge 22:32:01 hah 22:32:14 optbot: i guess that's the whole have to see it before agreeing, right? agoran pledges 22:32:15 tusho: http://koti.mbnet.fi/yiap/stuff/selfmd5.py 22:32:17 tusho: you should get optbot to register in Agora 22:32:17 ais523: You said it was 22:32:28 ais523: did you tell em e was registered? 22:32:30 that's not very nice 22:32:37 tusho: optbot: no I didn't 22:32:38 ais523: very. 22:32:51 optbot, do u speak french ? 22:32:51 M0ny: umix= 22:32:52 optbot: well it didn't reach a-b at any rate 22:32:53 ais523: :) 22:33:05 :p 22:33:10 ais523: hmm, I'd have to rewrite optbot to read ##nomic instead and send to a-b 22:33:10 tusho: you finnish? 22:33:11 but that would rock 22:33:12 :D 22:33:15 optbot: no why 22:33:15 tusho: although the collisions did fail especially with a larger amount of objects 22:33:32 optbot: ICFP too? 22:33:32 ais523: like said, I wouldn't worry about reading Mycology 22:33:38 in wich language is optbot ? 22:33:38 M0ny: what are missing of the required f98 features are only negative funge-space, multiple stacks (though quite a bit of that is done) and the fingerprint based loading 22:33:42 M0ny: ruby 22:33:53 took like 2 seconds 22:33:58 tusho: I think optbot's trying to implement Funge-98, at least based on eir last 2 comments 22:33:59 ais523: why? for obfuscation purposes? 22:34:04 HAHAHA 22:34:16 correction, optbot's trying to translate emself into Funge-98 22:34:16 ais523: I think it's possible without maintaining your own function stack in most cases 22:34:34 anyway, I hacked up like ten lines to read the logs and choose something from them, then added a socket, then added a thread that sleeps a lot and changes the topic, then added this event handler when it hears something in a channel 22:34:39 no special irc libs or whatnot 22:34:44 [22:34:17] correction, optbot's trying to translate emself into Funge-98 22:34:44 tusho: No 22:34:45 [22:34:17] ais523: I think it's possible without maintaining your own function stack in most cases 22:34:45 tusho: By New including a Zealand if the string is "". 22:34:46 my god...... 22:34:48 that's perfect 22:34:55 tusho: yes, it is 22:35:16 ruby... :) 22:35:21 optbot, ruby 22:35:22 M0ny: well all libcs in fact 22:35:29 isn't it funny how, after - what - 50 years of AI, the most convincing merely randomly repeats lines 22:35:30 :) 22:35:50 lol 22:36:39 hum... 22:36:44 good night all ;) 22:36:48 * M0ny is away: zZz 22:37:04 optbot: isn't it funny how, after - what - 50 years of AI, the most convincing merely randomly repeats lines 22:37:04 ais523: would make it way more esoteric 22:37:10 haha 22:37:13 well, optbot doesn't convince me as an AI, but I still think it's useful 22:37:13 ais523: IN BRAINFUCK. 22:37:19 LOL 22:37:25 optbot: STOP SHOUTING 22:37:25 ais523: hi calamari 22:37:37 ok that just completely breaks the illusion 22:37:39 it wants to eat you ais523 22:37:51 optbot: really? 22:37:51 ais523: Which interp? PSOX interpreter? Esolang interpreter? 22:37:51 lool 22:38:06 do u know brainfuck optbot ? 22:38:06 M0ny: i can try. 22:38:12 good luck ;) 22:38:29 M0ny: but BF's only a few lines in Ruby, optbot should be able to learn it easily 22:38:30 ais523: ~bf >,[>,]<.[<.]!Hello, world! 22:38:35 see what I mean? 22:38:45 heh 22:38:47 tusho: ^ 22:38:48 ya 22:38:51 oh, you've already seen it 22:39:00 :p 22:39:05 is bf really only a few lines in ruby? 22:39:09 psygnisfive: yes 22:39:16 bf is astoundingly trivial :D 22:39:17 oh do show tusho 22:39:20 ah, that dates back from the time when I tought bsmnt_bot Brainfuck, it's using my syntax 22:39:20 sure 22:39:21 gimme a sec 22:39:27 you like my double rhyme? ;D 22:39:29 it took me ages but in the end I got it down to three lines 22:39:38 let me try to find them 22:40:04 ~exec self.bf3="def bfarg(x,y):\n p=y.group(2)\n a=y.group(3)+unichr(0)\n o=''\n p=p+'!'\n t=[0]*30000\n i=0\n l=0\n while p[i]!='!':\n if p[i]=='[' and t[l]==0:\n c=1\n while c>0:\n i=i+1\n if p[i]=='[': c=c+1\n if p[i]==']': c=c-1\n if p[i]==']' and t[l]!=0:\n c=1\n while c>0:\n i=i-1\n if p[i]==']': c=c+1\n if p[i]=='[': c=c-1\n" 22:40:04 ~exec self.bf4=" if p[i]=='+': t[l]=t[l]+1\n if p[i]=='-': t[l]=t[l]-1\n if p[i]=='<': l=l-1\n if p[i]=='>': l=l+1\n if p[i]=='.': o=o+unichr(t[l])\n if p[i]==',':\n t[l]=ord(a[0])\n a=a[1:]\n i=i+1\nsys.stdout(o)\nself. register_raw(r'\S+ PRIVMSG (\S+) :~bf ([^!]*)!?(.*)',bfarg)" 22:40:04 ~exec exec(self.bf3+self.bf4) 22:40:24 those three commands teach bsmnt_bot Brainfuck from scratch, which fit with the command optbot repeated above 22:40:24 ais523: And punycode's base offset is above ASCII 22:40:37 tusho: why the name optbot, anyway? 22:40:38 thats an ugly bit of code but ok. 22:40:38 ais523: i think i'm an atheist for the same reason a lot of people are christian.... 22:40:56 psygnisfive: well, you try writing an indentation-dependent lang like Python over IRC 22:41:14 ;) 22:41:15 oh dear, it looks like actually it's been mangled somehow 22:41:21 the number of spaces after each \n should vary 22:41:36 ais, it aint the having to write it over irc 22:41:39 its that its python. ;) 22:41:39 and they don't on the file I have 22:41:51 still, grepping the logs should find the true source easily enough 22:42:01 it seems my copy got word-wrapped somewhere along the line... 22:44:56 psygnisfive 22:44:58 [[eval code.gsub(/[^+-,.<>\[\]]/,"").gsub("+","tape[ptr]||=0;tape[ptr]+=1;"). 22:44:58 gsub("-","tape[ptr]||=0;tape[ptr]-=1;").gsub("<","ptr-=1;"). 22:44:58 gsub(">","ptr+=1").gsub(",","tape[ptr]||=0;tape[ptr]=$stdin.getc;"). 22:44:58 gsub(".","tape[ptr]||=0;print tape[ptr].chr;"). 22:45:08 gsub("[","tape[ptr]||=0;until tape[ptr].zero?;").gsub("]", "end;") 22:45:09 ]] 22:45:10 the tape[ptr]||=0 should go in < and >, whatever 22:45:30 tusho: did you just write that? 22:45:34 yes 22:45:34 :p 22:45:40 I can easily believe you did, based on how simple BF is 22:45:47 i initially started to write an interp but then realised a compiler is far more trivial 22:45:54 and I did it in one chain of methods, just 'cause 22:45:57 and yes, should go in >, technically speaking there's no need to bother about < 22:46:05 yeah whatever 22:46:06 :) 22:46:50 hey, has anagolf really never had a BF interp competition? 22:46:59 ? surely 22:47:08 that's what I thought 22:47:11 but I can't find one, looking 22:47:12 hmph 22:47:14 i'll submit one 22:47:15 and nothing's running there right now 22:47:17 including mandelbrot 22:47:19 just because i'm a bastard 22:47:26 tusho: make sure the programs are output-only 22:47:27 never terminating, I assume 22:47:29 since it's a staple 22:47:32 ais523: yes 22:47:34 hmm 22:47:34 no 22:47:36 oh i see. 22:47:38 I'll make them support ! syntax 22:47:39 tusho: I say terminating 22:47:39 :DDD 22:47:41 so we get to see them 22:47:45 well, okay 22:47:48 but I'll do input programs 22:47:48 it's not /that/ staple 22:47:59 yes, input with ! syntax is probably best 22:48:04 and make the output so large that embed is unwise 22:48:45 ais523: can you write a hugely-producing brainfuck program 22:48:49 but that only outputs printable chrs 22:48:58 Trivial. 22:49:05 tusho: it wouldn't be too hard 22:49:07 pikhq: ... that isn't easily compressable 22:49:19 let's think, making it non-easily-compressable would be harder 22:49:25 tusho: Define 'easily compressable'. 22:49:39 pikhq: you can write a program that produces that output in a short space 22:49:39 pikhq: Nitpick. Oh, wait. 22:49:41 that's the issue 22:49:50 because clearly we want to write that program in BF 22:49:54 Of course, making something not easily compressable for *any* Brainfuck program is non-trivial. . . 22:49:58 so the program's going to have to be quite long to avoid easy compressability 22:50:07 pikhq: actually, any short program in any lang 22:50:07 Brainfuck itself does not have high entropy. 22:50:28 ais523: anagolf handles terminating newlines right 22:50:31 the problem is to write a BF program whose output is easier to produce by running the BF program than it is by translating the BF program into some other language 22:50:41 tusho: I think so, but it can be a pain to submit the problem correctly if you do that 22:50:42 Ah. 22:50:54 try avoiding terminating newlines and going to the end of your submission and backspacing to make sure 22:51:00 The phrase 'easily compressable' should not be applied to that, though... 22:51:01 -!- Corun has joined. 22:51:11 Since Brainfuck is by definition easily compressable. 22:51:26 yes, it's easily compressible output we're referring to 22:51:41 but the output of any short program is also by definition easily compressible, unless it involves randomness somehow 22:52:00 guh 22:52:01 pikhq 22:52:05 can you run mandelbrot.b for me 22:52:07 and pastebin the output 22:52:12 i am without a fast bf it seems 22:52:18 wait 22:52:19 nm 22:52:24 tusho: do you have a link to mandlebrot.b? 22:52:38 ais523: 'sok 22:52:41 Compile egobfi8. 22:52:44 http://swapped.cc/bf/files/mandelbrot.b 22:52:45 oooh 22:52:48 http://swapped.cc/bf/files/random.b 22:52:52 rule 110-based random 22:52:52 tusho: ah, I rember what happened, codegolf had a BF interp competition, that's probably why anagold didn't 22:53:06 tusho: that'll be so embed-worthy unless you generate hugely lots of output with it 22:53:14 true 22:53:16 oh well 22:53:22 * tusho runs mandelbrot.b 22:54:08 tusho: it doesn't take input 22:54:12 I grepped for , 22:54:12 of course 22:54:17 that's for the next test 22:54:49 tusho: no way mandlebrot.b will run in anagolf's time limit 22:54:56 ok true 22:55:00 any suggestions? 22:55:36 reasonably-fast, very-long brainfuck program, taking-input that is way easier to execute instead of translate to another lang 22:55:58 well you could convert a long text output to BF using a text-to-BF program 22:56:05 leading to a long but quickly-executing BF program 22:56:11 good idea 22:56:18 i'll make it unoptimized 22:56:29 how about... 22:56:30 make sure at least one program has nested loops, though 22:56:31 the constitution :P 22:56:42 hmm 22:56:43 but ais523 22:56:45 we need to test input 22:56:56 tusho: rot13 with long input? 22:57:09 ais523: okay 22:58:03 wow, after running mandelbrot.b I had a sudden urge to translate nethack into Brainfuck somehow 22:58:23 The closest I could get is translating an adventure-style game into Brainfuck. 22:58:38 well, we really need a C to BF compiler 22:58:48 Gregor Richard's C2BF. 22:58:49 I've been toying in my mind with the idea of writing a BF backend to gcc 22:58:54 and then compiling Linux for BF 22:59:02 Needs some work, of course. 22:59:14 hmm... maybe compiling qemu to BF would be more useful? 22:59:27 ok 22:59:28 final program? 22:59:30 Given that qemu can run without an MMU... ;) 22:59:42 just something to round it off, I guess 23:00:01 tusho: I reckon a short program with lots of repetitive output 23:00:05 but I'm not sure what 23:00:23 oooh 23:00:25 ais523: a quine 23:00:40 could be a good idea but quines are really vulnerable to embed tactics 23:00:46 tru 23:00:46 e 23:00:50 how about a narcissus program 23:00:51 or whatever 23:00:54 make it a quine-seed 23:00:58 that outputs a quine 23:00:59 but isn't a quine 23:01:04 well 23:01:06 they're normally easier than quines themselves to write 23:01:07 show me one 23:01:08 ;) 23:01:12 ah wait 23:01:15 hm 23:01:17 no 23:01:27 ais523: how about numwarp.b 23:01:34 what's that? 23:01:39 http://www.hevanet.com/cristofd/brainfuck/numwarp.b 23:01:44 sample output http://www.hevanet.com/cristofd/brainfuck/numwarp.png 23:02:05 sounds good 23:02:18 now, remember to test all your programs and outputs on a real BF interp first 23:02:33 it helps to have an entry prewritten just to test that you got everything right 23:03:49 i copied the output directly 23:03:50 so 23:03:59 submit'd 23:04:45 tusho: do you think that rot13 will run in under a second? 23:04:52 ais523: I hope so. 23:05:26 Hm. 23:05:27 No. 23:05:27 It own't. 23:05:41 have you just tried on a fast BF interp at your end? 23:05:42 Not by far. Shit. 23:05:48 ais523: that's the one program I didn't test 23:05:51 9.5 seconds 23:06:06 ok looks like my entry will have to be optimised in C then... 23:06:25 ais523: bff is the second-fastest interp 23:06:27 good luck with that 23:07:50 I've found egobfi8 to be very fast, myself. . . 23:07:50 yes, the fastest interp at this end is taking a lot more than a second 23:07:54 Your opinions, tusho? 23:08:07 pikhq: It is nowhere near the speed of bff or that one by that guy. 23:08:11 Sorry. 23:08:12 real0m45.033s 23:08:12 user0m22.685s 23:08:12 sys0m0.184s 23:08:19 Aaaaww. 23:08:30 pikhq: However, it is more flexible due to its various options. 23:08:32 They have their niches. 23:08:49 * pikhq wants to make a JITing brainfuck interpreter now... :p 23:09:21 ooh 23:09:21 ⁉ 23:09:24 not an interrobang 23:09:28 an "exclamation question mark" 23:09:30 ⁉⁉⁉⁉⁉⁉⁉⁉ 23:09:48 tusho: people will just end up embedding the rot13 23:09:51 try a smaller source text? 23:09:58 yeah okay 23:10:00 what do you suggest :P 23:10:12 a BF interp 23:10:21 String reversal? 23:10:22 :p 23:10:36 you know, so it's short 23:11:04 heh okay 23:11:11 ais523: wait, no 23:11:12 how about 23:11:17 a reverse program 23:11:18 on a bf interp 23:11:22 hmm 23:11:26 let's just let them embed it 23:11:35 no that defeats the point 23:11:49 ais523: embedding is allowed in anagolf 23:12:19 yes, I know 23:12:27 but a non-embed solution should be /possible/... 23:12:28 i dunno - give me a good program & output and I'll do it 23:12:44 nah, I'm trying to see how fast the rot13 thing runs embed 23:12:49 I'm getting a rot13 program out of the repos atm 23:12:56 and I'm going to see how long it takes on your input 23:13:08 gah 23:13:19 i just wanna submit a fixed version 23:13:43 real0m0.585s 23:13:58 that's embed, so it can be fast enough... 23:14:17 real0m0.280s when piped to devnull 23:14:42 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 23:15:34 -!- ais523 has quit ("(1) DO COME FROM ".2~.2"~#1 WHILE :1 <- "'?.1$.2'~'"':1/.1$.2'~#0"$#65535'"$"'"'&.1$.2'~'#0$#65535'"$#0'~#32767$#1""). 23:15:56 new bf submitted 23:19:32 -!- kar8nga has joined. 23:19:44 hah 23:19:45 still too slow 23:22:37 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 131 (Connection reset by peer)). 23:23:26 -!- jix has joined. 23:24:24 -!- kar8nga has left (?). 23:29:33 optbot 23:29:33 tusho: i guess i misunderstood you 23:29:35 optbot: really? 23:29:36 tusho: I liked it a lot too. 23:29:38 optbot: aww 23:29:38 tusho: a box of apples and a string. 23:29:40 optbot: really 23:29:40 tusho: Sure. 23:29:42 optbot: ok 23:29:42 tusho: this ubersoft comic sucks 23:29:46 optbot: agreed 23:29:47 tusho: the stats would require some sort of centralised server 23:29:50 optbot: really? 23:29:50 tusho: brb 23:29:52 k 23:29:54 optbot! 23:29:54 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | though perhaps it's too bloated in your mind ;). 23:37:25 -!- pikhq has quit ("leaving"). 23:43:01 optbot? 23:43:01 tusho: it would help using integers as integers 23:43:03 optbot! 23:43:03 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | http://pastebin.ca/raw/158551. 23:46:10 -!- optbot has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:10 -!- sebbu has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:11 -!- Deewiant has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:13 -!- oklopol has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:13 -!- lifthrasiir has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:14 -!- cmeme has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:14 -!- Ilari has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:15 -!- cherez has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:15 -!- psygnisfive has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:15 -!- tusho has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:16 -!- bsmntbombdood has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:17 -!- AnMaster has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:18 -!- SimonRC has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:18 -!- fizzie has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:18 -!- jix has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:19 -!- shachaf has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:20 -!- moozilla has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:20 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:22 -!- Dewi has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:22 -!- Quendus has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:23 -!- mtve has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:24 -!- Corun has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:24 -!- M0ny has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:46:24 -!- dbc has quit (clarke.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 23:48:43 -!- jix has joined. 23:48:43 -!- Corun has joined. 23:48:43 -!- psygnisfive has joined. 23:48:43 -!- tusho has joined. 23:48:43 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 23:48:43 -!- AnMaster has joined. 23:48:43 -!- Ilari has joined. 23:48:43 -!- optbot has joined. 23:48:43 -!- sebbu has joined. 23:48:43 -!- M0ny has joined. 23:48:43 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined. 23:48:43 -!- moozilla has joined. 23:48:43 -!- shachaf has joined. 23:48:43 -!- fizzie has joined. 23:48:43 -!- oklopol has joined. 23:48:43 -!- Quendus has joined. 23:48:43 -!- Dewi has joined. 23:48:43 -!- mtve has joined. 23:48:43 -!- Deewiant has joined. 23:48:43 -!- dbc has joined. 23:48:43 -!- SimonRC has joined. 23:48:43 -!- cmeme has joined. 23:48:43 -!- cherez has joined. 23:48:43 -!- lifthrasiir has joined. 23:48:43 -!- irc.freenode.net has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | exactly.