00:03:58 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 00:47:38 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep"). 01:32:16 -!- tusho has quit. 02:52:07 -!- Sgeo has joined. 03:37:31 -!- psygnisfive has joined. 03:39:09 -!- psygnisfive has quit (Client Quit). 03:40:51 -!- dogface has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 03:45:34 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | you obfuscated, failed or... are weird?. 04:17:25 -!- psygnisfive has joined. 05:31:18 -!- megatron has joined. 05:31:22 -!- moozilla has quit (Nick collision from services.). 05:44:26 -!- psygnisfive has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client"). 06:02:45 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 06:07:12 i sense the time of go. 06:07:13 -!- oklopol has quit ("( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.2 :: www.regroup-esports.com )"). 06:49:05 -!- psygnisfive has joined. 06:49:15 :O 06:59:37 -!- psygnisfive has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client"). 07:10:42 -!- kar8nga has joined. 07:24:08 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:03:04 -!- kar8nga has left (?). 08:08:52 -!- olsner has joined. 08:16:00 -!- Mony has joined. 08:16:28 hi 09:12:01 -!- oklopol has joined. 09:27:52 -!- oklofok has joined. 09:27:54 -!- oklopol has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 09:45:15 -!- olsner has quit ("Leaving"). 09:45:34 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | hopefully it isn't with oerjan again, or there'll be a longer wait before you get it back this time because you'll have to wait for them to be online. 10:03:16 -!- oklofok has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 10:44:44 -!- megatron has changed nick to moozilla. 10:51:51 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (Connection timed out). 11:19:33 -!- dogface has joined. 11:26:36 -!- Sgeo has joined. 11:42:14 -!- jix has joined. 11:43:19 -!- dogface has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)). 11:51:45 -!- Tritonio_ has joined. 12:04:48 -!- tusho has joined. 12:25:27 -!- moozilla has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 12:25:40 -!- moozilla has joined. 12:26:40 -!- kar8nga has joined. 12:26:57 optbot... 12:26:58 Mony: and I'm not writing a C library to give continuations to INTERCAL 12:27:29 optbot: Why not? 12:27:29 fizzie: i have to sleep now canÄz zype anymore--- 12:27:39 Sounds like a lame cop-out to me! 12:27:56 fizzie: brilliant 12:36:07 -!- Mony has quit ("À vaincre sans péril on triomphe sans gloire..."). 12:47:25 :) smileys fall from the blue sky, sadly. 12:47:26 using esc all the time while awake.' wikipedia 12:47:26 now youve failed 365 times. 12:47:26 i must depart now. i'll fix it.)) the golden ratio" achieved by the shortest known 99 bottles of beeron the wall! 97 bottles of beer 12:47:26 well nm then but thx for help :) 12:50:28 I don't know of "shortest known 99 bottles of beeron the wall" but I don know the "shortest known 99 bottles of beer on the wall" 12:50:37 9 12:50:42 in HQ9+ 12:50:43 ;P 12:58:20 "Beeron" could be some sort of artificial beer-like substitute. 12:58:35 AnMaster: that's a fungot poem 12:58:36 tusho: " code with courage". we're talking about music. referring to itself in the multiple processes it pretends to use in a limited enviroment exported by the module system 12:58:38 he recited it yesterday 12:58:44 and performances of it shall be regular 12:58:46 wow 12:58:50 those first two sentences? 12:58:52 start of another poem 12:59:01 AnMaster: read yesterday's logs, I deciphered the poem 13:00:28 "Beeron" hmmm 13:00:35 fungot: but the music is how? 13:00:36 tusho: to " print" statement should always print to whatever the program's running from??? or fnord? 13:00:45 fungot: I think fnord. So, next ilne? 13:00:46 tusho: not just any kind of biochemistry... but let's not talk about the subject to begin with, it might be faster to use that and also native compilation or at least 13:01:08 fungot, how are native compilation and biochemistry? 13:01:08 fungot: inspiring. line 3? 13:01:09 AnMaster: let's wreak havoc 13:01:09 tusho: looking for ' store' microexps, and setting emacs to backup files in a directory that i mentioned is perfect, thanks 13:01:23 fungot: Wreak havoc? Alright. 13:01:24 tusho: he cooked everything himself and was a pardon issued? 13:01:25 are they related* 13:01:45 fungot: Was it? I don't know. 13:01:46 tusho: you asked how to first do a naive translation, but i 13:01:55 fungot: but you 13:01:56 tusho: no, the mob provides an uzi shield :) there are many of almost equal parts. 0 is 9" 13:02:01 uzi? 13:02:12 AnMaster: gun 13:02:14 that is one that sounds like a fnord to me 13:02:15 ah ok 13:02:22 I'm no expert on such stuff 13:02:31 nor am I, but Worms has a weapon called uzi ;) 13:02:36 fungot, are you saying 0 == 9? 13:02:37 AnMaster: the original name was " furor".): the pain of writing your own cocoa bindings ( which is 0) and ( 13:02:40 fungot: And your last words? 13:02:41 tusho: i've found it. thanks.)) the .x. .y. stuff is hard what's wrong with it? not really 13:02:44 AnMaster: no, 0 is 9" 13:02:46 9 inches 13:02:54 0 is 9 inches? 13:02:56 huh 13:03:03 fungot: so what's 1 13:03:04 tusho: rather, above fnord) nonsense?! what the fuck you are doing? /leave scheme /join java? is there such a thing 13:03:07 so fungot you mean 0 == 9 inches 13:03:08 AnMaster: fnord vm is fnord can only be a few exceptions. so.....you like atlanta? 13:03:25 fnord vm is fnord heh sounds like a meme 13:03:27 that was a beautiful poem 13:03:34 and yes 13:03:37 fungot is up to date on the memes 13:03:38 tusho: that small text would seriously look at plt-scheme servlets? without introducing a *different* lambda.) ack! 13:04:44 tusho, do you think PHP is an ugly language? 13:04:47 AnMaster: yes 13:04:57 oh then we agree 13:05:00 http://pastebin.ca/raw/1192465 First collection of the poemular work of fungot. 13:05:01 tusho: the latter would show the problem better, rather than interrupt-mask/ all... 13:05:29 tusho, anyway are any other languages uglier than PHP? 13:05:34 AnMaster: yes 13:05:36 I can't think of any 13:05:38 many 13:05:39 oh what ones? 13:05:43 AnMaster: cobol 13:05:45 fortran 13:05:52 obfuscated perl 13:06:01 ah well, I don't know cobol and what I seen of fortran doesn't look that bad 13:06:09 well obfuscated C is ugly too 13:06:11 well, it's certainly easier to read php code than fortran 13:06:13 although I see obfuscated perl as art 13:06:14 but that is part of the point 13:06:17 so I actually see it as pretty 13:06:20 so yes art 13:06:22 I agree 13:06:23 but it's ugly in a code way 13:06:29 certainly 13:06:35 php is less artistically pleasing than fortran, but is way uglier as far as code goes 13:06:40 err 13:06:42 but is way less ugly 13:06:44 tusho, my question was not about obfuscated code 13:06:49 i know 13:06:53 you can write obfuscated code in any language I bet 13:06:57 yes 13:07:13 but I don't think PHP can be pretty at all 13:07:14 never 13:07:26 Alternatively beerons could be the subatomic particles in beer. 13:07:51 hm 13:08:08 AnMaster: PHP & Fortran: Fortran is more pleasing in a "ooh, I set my eye on it and it's lovely" way, PHP is more pleasing in a "OK, this code's purpose is clear & elegant" 13:08:13 Of course, neither score very well on either 13:08:28 I think some of it is due to using $ for variables in PHP 13:08:37 shell code can get uggly too 13:08:44 though not as uggly as PHP normally 13:08:45 AnMaster: not really 13:08:46 I often fortran.. uh, I mean, _wonder_ whether there's something fundamentally wrong with PHP, are if it's just that people who write it tend to be... well, you know. 13:08:51 tusho, then what is it? 13:08:52 cleanly-written perl is very pretty 13:09:10 AnMaster: it's that the devs way back in php 3 didn't know shit about how to make a good language 13:09:15 they knew what perl looked like 13:09:18 and they tried to imitate it 13:09:21 and failed, badly 13:09:32 and of course the semantics make you have to write ugly syntax to get around them 13:09:37 issue is I got a course in school which needs using PHP 13:09:38 so... 13:09:47 AnMaster: write a something->php compiler 13:09:48 ;) 13:09:55 tusho, hah 13:10:08 Or a something interpreter in PHP, with the program included. 13:10:40 I once returned a trivial C course assignment as a C brainfuck interpreter, with a brainfuck program included. I think it was automagically graded by some sort of tool, so that was pretty useless. 13:11:07 fizzie, haha 13:11:19 what did the tool think of it? 13:11:24 auto graded? ugh 13:11:26 that sound sawful 13:11:26 Actually I think the language in question was Scheme, not C, which makes it even less sensible. The tool didn't mind. 13:11:42 anyway, don't think they would accept that, the course is web design... and php is the language used, also well commented code is mentioned 13:11:57 AnMaster: kill your shoe. 13:12:02 tell it: get the flu 13:12:06 open the loo 13:12:06 hm? 13:12:09 and there you can do. 13:12:14 that is the solution 13:12:21 Well, it was the "introduction to programming" course which has a metric ton of students, and those were the weekly exercises. The actual "programming project" was graded by humans. 13:12:22 I think I can code PHP, I done it a bit a few years ago, but I don't like the language 13:12:32 AnMaster: protip if you don't want to kill yourself 13:12:41 php.net/function-or-syntax-element-or-whatever gets you to the docs 13:12:51 and php is so illogical that you will need the docs every second function call 13:12:52 tusho, hm... 13:12:59 e.g. php.net/explode 13:13:02 php.net/if 13:13:05 get you to the right place 13:13:20 hah 13:14:04 AnMaster: [[ Although implode() can, for historical reasons, accept its parameters in either order, explode() cannot. You must ensure that the delimiter argument comes before the string argument. ]] 13:14:16 either order? huh 13:14:20 implode(" ", array(1,2,3)) and implode(array(1,2,3), " ") both work 13:14:24 that is how crazy php is. 13:14:47 hmm 13:14:50 both will result in a string I guess? firefox just crashed so couldn't look at the page 13:14:57 yes 13:14:58 one could have a language where parameter order is irrelevant 13:15:08 Deewiant: smalltalk 13:15:09 :P 13:15:12 Deewiant: Lingua::Romana::Perligata does it. 13:15:14 Deewiant, certainly, named parameters for example 13:15:23 AnMaster: however, explode() only takes them in one order 13:15:25 AnMaster: that's not what I was thinking of 13:15:28 and doesn't let you do the other way 13:15:32 tusho, hm... 13:15:35 and I guess that applies to smalltalk as well 13:15:49 Deewiant: well, smalltalk actually has order 13:15:56 (foo bar: x baz: y) is actually 13:16:00 Deewiant, well you could make sure you could always tell by the type or making functions where it didn't matter 13:16:02 however 13:16:07 call #bar:baz: on foo with (x,y) 13:16:08 how would you do pow(x,y) 13:16:11 in such a language 13:16:14 so yo ucan't do (foo baz: x bar: y) 13:16:15 Deewiant: Well, Perligata uses the Latin declensions to indicate the role of any part of the line. 13:16:19 same with obj-c 13:17:15 Okay, admittedly Perligata cheats a bit for function arguments; you need to specify those in order. But the function name and thing-to-assign-the-result-to-if-any and such can be in any order. 13:18:03 AnMaster: return all possible results in a tuple 13:18:06 Deewiant, you could do stuff like max(x,y) and stuff where the types are different, ie foo(int x, string a), but not stuff like a function pow(x, y) (returning x^y) 13:18:12 Deewiant, hah 13:18:15 pow(x,y) returns (x^y, y^x) 13:18:39 hmm 13:19:03 yeah, I guess one could define an order so that you always know which element of the tuple is which result 13:19:33 Deewiant, you could have a language without functions then claim that "parameter order for functions in this language doesn't matter" 13:19:42 of course no one could prove it then ;) 13:19:52 sure you can prove it 13:20:15 well it would be a nonsense statement 13:20:17 is what I meant 13:20:20 all (const False) [] is True ;-) 13:20:41 heh what language is that? 13:20:47 haskell 13:20:57 ah what does that code do then? 13:21:24 it calls all with (const False) and []. 13:21:27 well 13:21:33 it calls (call all with (const False)) with []. 13:21:36 all returns true if the given predicate returns true for all elements of the given list 13:21:53 I find haskell's syntax unusually cryptic for an outsider, most other languages you probably guess what some basic stuff does if you know other languages from the same paradigm 13:22:07 AnMaster: it's very different 13:22:09 though you can 13:22:15 if you knew ML, haskell wouldn't be too hard 13:22:17 Miranda too 13:22:21 even gofer 13:22:32 haskell is an ML descendent 13:22:52 hm 13:23:22 -!- Mony has joined. 13:23:41 if you know math haskell is trivial :-P 13:23:49 that too :p 13:23:57 hi 13:23:58 but i kind of suck at mathematical notation and such 13:24:04 so i know haskell from MLy things 13:28:55 well I know math, but the notation... well same as tusho 13:29:08 i'm not actually all that hot with mathematics ;p 13:29:25 well I do like math 13:29:45 and well the notation I know.... doesn't really match Haskell at all 13:30:20 it does 13:30:22 you just don't know it yet 13:30:34 all (const False) [] is True ;-) <-- Don't remember any smiley in my math text books 13:30:46 in fact nothing like that syntax 13:30:55 AnMaster: um, that isn't code 13:30:59 "is True ;-)" was in english 13:31:04 ah 13:31:05 all (const False) [] was the code 13:31:12 ok that looks like an array? 13:31:16 no 13:31:17 a list 13:31:26 ok. not sure what it does though 13:31:31 specifically the [] part of data [] a = a : [a] | [] 13:31:35 make all elements of a list false? 13:31:35 I explained it above 13:31:48 all returns true if the given predicate returns true for all elements of the given list 13:31:49 well 13:31:52 that was cryptic! 13:31:59 no 13:32:00 what part 13:32:00 it wasn't. 13:32:07 to me it was 13:32:14 what part 13:32:26 Deewiant: the part where you didn't talk in low-level details 13:32:30 hah 13:32:35 meh 13:32:52 Deewiant: quick, explain to him the asm that powers thunks 13:33:03 sorry, I'm unaware of it :-) 13:33:17 Deewiant: evidently, thunks don't exist 13:34:25 so.. it returns true if calling a given function on elements in the list returns true for each object? 13:34:33 err s/object/element/ 13:34:33 yep 13:42:46 well arch is really bleeding edge... GCC 4.3.2 released August 27... It is in stable Arch Linux (not testing) today 13:51:47 a bit too much bleeding edge there IMO 13:52:08 Phew, that was quite an adventure, copying 30 A4 sheets with the copier here. It was all "open right cover and remove jammed paper", "turn lever", "move unit 2", rotate this know, pull this lever, remove the non-existent jammed paper. Warning: hot surface, do not touch... but open it anyway. 13:52:20 s/know/knob/ 13:52:36 heh 13:53:06 non-existent jammed paper, that's a new one to me 13:53:20 And it was pretty hot, I could feel the heat at a distance of ~10 cm. The part right next to it that I had to open was made out of some sort of special fuzzy non-heat-conductive material. 13:54:05 One printer I have used had a habit of inventing paper jams that did not really exist; you just had to open and close all openable parts of the printer, then it would resume. 13:57:19 anyway how does a copier detect paper jams? 13:58:46 Oh, I'm sure there are some sort of sensors in there. 13:58:57 hm 13:58:57 -!- Tritonio_ has quit ("Leaving"). 13:59:56 "We've been rotating this drum a while now, but the sensor before it is saying there's a paper present, while the sensor after it says not, and the situation doesn't seem to be changing" => complain. 14:00:13 hm makes sense 14:00:26 This is all just speculation, though; it could be that they've stuck little goblins in there to monitor the stuff. 14:00:59 couldn't you detect it by checking how much current the motors driving the feeder mechanism used? 14:01:32 probably not a good idea, it would differ between say, normal paper and photo paper 14:02:11 The paper path in that monster of a copier is probably several miles long. Well, not really, but it's still an imposing thing. At least printers are smaller than I am, I don't feel quite so threatened by them. 14:02:24 fizzie, I know my printer got some sort of optical sensor built in, because I see a blue light from inside at the start of every paper, but that goes away if I turn off "auto detect paper type" 14:03:01 it is also used to check the result during aligning carriages (spelling?) I think 14:03:02 There's a gigabyte or so of memory in that beast, too. 14:03:20 well mine is a simple multifunction ink printer 14:03:25 not laser or such 14:05:09 We have a small laser printer at home, and I don't think it has ever had a paper jam, but even if it had, there's a single cover to open. That copier has a dozen of little green levers and knobs and whatnot, and the LCD screen in it just keeps running a two-frame animation about manipulating them all, which doesn't really help a whole lot, especially since I constantly have a feeling that if I make one false move, it'll eat my fingers. And collate and stapl 14:05:14 this printer works very well, from HP. only complaint really is that it is hard to reach inside when changing ink carriages and unjamming paper... the upper part with scanner and such tilt back when you open, except it doesn't tilt a lot. 14:05:22 other than that it is very good 14:06:07 Auto-stapling copiers are scary anyway. If that thing goes on a rampage, it has a built-in weapon in it. 14:06:20 fizzie, heh... 14:06:28 Fortunately it probably won't fit through the doors. 14:06:42 fizzie, how did they get it in then? 14:06:52 or was it built in the room? 14:06:53 Maybe they built the building around it. 14:07:10 fizzie, is it on street level then? 14:07:26 No, third floor. They must've suspended it in the air with wires or something. 14:07:29 ah ok 14:07:57 fizzie, does it act as printer as well? 14:08:21 Sure. And as a scanner, too; you just use the touchscreen to enter your email address, and it'll send the scans as .tiffs or .pdfs to you. 14:08:35 I remember seeing some that showed up as a network postscript printer, think it was at one of my parents work place... 14:10:16 I'm not sure whether we have a printer queue for that copier, since there's a rather big HP LaserJet 8150 printer right next to it. But in a previous workplace all "over 100 pages or so" print jobs were recommended to be sent to the copier for printing. 14:10:34 The printer setup dialog had a nifty thing where you could specify which corner of the paper to staple. 14:12:52 100 pages... that's a lot 14:14:32 fizzie, how many "heaps" of paper can it staple at once? 14:14:53 heaps? O(log n) to find the smalles piece of paper? 14:14:57 +t 14:15:15 -!- moozilla has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)). 14:15:48 Deewiant, as in if you specify 5 copies of a bunch of papers, then it feeds each to a different tray and can staple those bunches with one button press or whatever 14:17:12 No clue, really. There's also some sort of upper page count for things to be stapled together, but I don't remember that either. 14:17:46 fizzie, anyway lets hope the door is thick in case of.... problems... 14:17:57 -!- moozilla has joined. 14:18:02 ;) 14:25:42 It's a glass door... maybe not even velociraptor-proof. 14:26:06 ouch 14:26:34 fizzie, that is a work safety issue 14:27:03 Well, I'll have to leave (to go buy a fridge/freezer) in ~15 minutes anyway, so the copier won't get me today, at least. 14:28:09 cya 14:28:37 i chipped my tooth recently 14:28:50 there was some glass covering something but I didn't see it so I just smacked right into it 14:28:51 Bye. Didn't remember to look at the OS X cfunge linker thing, but since I'm theoretically speaking supposed to be working here, maybe it's for the best; will consider it at home later. 14:28:52 :D 14:29:01 fizzie, anyway why not unplug the copier while fixing the issue+ 14:29:02 ? 14:29:18 I would never try to replace a fan or whatever in a plugged in computer 14:29:22 I don't dare, it could interpret it as an act of aggression. 14:29:32 Besides, I wouldn't see the "helpful" instructions if it were unplugged. 14:30:42 i have plugged in ram on a turned-on computer before, I think 14:30:50 had to restart, ofc 14:30:55 to make it recognize it :P 14:31:41 I have hot-swapped several cards that weren't really meant to be hot-swapped, although it's obviously just stupid. I think some ISA card actually even worked without a restart. 14:32:13 The "let's remove the PCI display card and plug it back in to reset this otherwise unfixable display issue" attempt wasn't as successful. 14:32:33 i pretty much think that dying because of hotswapping a computer component and bursting into flame would be pretty awesome 14:32:43 so it's not like i'll go out of my way to make sure i hotswap stuff safely 14:33:43 It's significantly more likely to just kill your hardware, not you, which would kind of suck. 14:33:55 Not that I want you dead or anything. No-no. 14:38:25 hehehe :D 14:39:28 but actually I once started a computer with open case, only as far as bios though, needed to find out which of the fans didn't work 14:40:18 I had a computer with no case running as a router on my floor for a year or so. :p 14:40:31 I've been paranoid about death for a while now, not really out of any fear, but in that ... what will you guys think? 14:40:33 oh btw, don't try to hotplug PS/2 keyboards 14:40:36 I mean, i'd just not ever come back online. 14:40:45 You'd just think I'd "dropped off the face of the internet" as is said. 14:40:47 caused a reboot when I tried 14:40:59 Then I dropped a coca-cola glass on top of it's hard drive, which broke both of 'em; that's when I resolved to get a case for that box. 14:41:03 as in computer had just pressed reset button 14:41:45 -!- kar8nga has quit ("Leaving."). 14:41:58 Fridge-hunting now. -> 14:42:46 tusho, think -> means "heading out" or "going afk" or similiar 14:42:48 I* 14:42:52 yes I know 14:42:55 but why do all finns use it 14:42:55 :) 14:43:02 good question 14:43:05 can't answer it 14:44:16 hmph 14:44:23 google ought to have a search query that returns totally random results 14:44:26 same for image search 14:44:32 that'd be fun 14:44:39 hmm, you could make a game out of the image search 14:44:45 a website that presents two totally random google images 14:44:49 you pick which one you like best 14:44:53 and there are high-scores, etc 14:44:57 that would be amusing 15:06:09 -!- Judofyr has joined. 15:11:56 -!- Sgeo has quit ("Ex-Chat"). 15:45:34 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=esobot&word2=egobot :( :(. 16:12:43 -!- kar8nga has joined. 16:16:00 That was very efficient. 16:25:07 -!- Hiato has joined. 16:25:18 -!- Hiato has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 16:26:35 -!- Hiato has joined. 16:27:53 -!- Hiato has quit (Client Quit). 16:42:20 fizzie: a 16:48:49 A what? 16:50:16 fizzie: a a. 16:50:52 A++++ would buy again. 16:51:35 fizzie: a a+++++ a a a a. 16:55:55 Has someone been doing some s/\w+/a/g stuff here again? 16:56:10 fizzie: a? 16:56:19 A. 16:56:23 fungot: A? 16:56:24 fizzie: not quite sure why you would use car that many times. basically everyone seems to think that i shall never hear a poem frightful as a bear, that keeps pooping primes. 16:57:25 That's a pretty frightful bear indeed. 17:01:19 fungot: A new poem, I see. Care to compose it with optbot after this? 17:01:20 tusho: ( not straight.). i hope they're not watching. 17:01:21 tusho: It's also UNIX-only. Maybe even GNU/Linux-only. :P 17:01:43 ^echo optbot 17:01:44 optbot optbot 17:01:44 tusho: btw: 2^3*5^2*11*17*19*31*53*61*101*109*151*181*271*541*811*3001*4051*5779*12301*18451*42391*43201*109441*119611*140401*221401*394201*5020651*15608701*230686501*3467131047901*6641555895901*1114769954367361*1361918785737982855951*11981661982050957053616001*10237949952357183751384463924412751*656996318953349439721732908912325829378630572990405083901 17:01:44 fungot: for instance I think you need ^ to swap elements 1 and 3 of the stack 17:01:45 optbot: considering only processors still useful today, though not any less flexible... it predates my compiler rewrite. the author must be taking the tfy-0.201 course this autumn. 17:01:46 fungot: i'm still improving my assembler 17:01:47 optbot: one of them :p, 2) it's ( syntactically) long, and brainfuck command keys 17:01:47 fungot: instruction if it is the iterated one 17:01:48 optbot: at least if you find some ones in string searching, by any chance?) 17:01:49 fungot: 1.8ghz. 17:01:49 optbot: heh. i tried saving into one of them is about to execute instruction at ( 1,2), ( 1 2 3 4 5 6 17:01:50 fungot: kipple: no 17:02:17 wow 17:02:18 that's some poem 17:02:23 fungot: any last words or does it stand for itself? 17:02:24 tusho: counting to ten modulo two before punching him? does it involve? doing it the way you would calibrate a normal thermometer. bf 17:02:37 ah a new poem's start 17:02:47 fungot: moar? 17:02:47 tusho: sweet. thanks soegaard. i halfway there :) fnord bytes now, i could use a move instruction on the bf program on the phone, and it 17:03:02 fungot: Verbose lines these days 17:03:03 tusho: but is there a reason to be in normalized syntax is not the 17:03:33 fungot: I love your rearrangement of the deconstruction of the syntactical elements - it borders on the legible while still meta-commenting on the meaningless of the elements' structure. 17:03:34 tusho: in my head requires conditionals. don't complicate the simple primitive if. cond 17:03:47 fungot: I know - great minds do not know what they achieve... 17:03:55 I'm not entirely certain the line-ending algorithm of fungot works; the stuff sounds pretty truncated. 17:03:56 fizzie: more simply put: siod sucks as a general purpose language. 17:04:11 Maybe there is a line in the logs that ends "is not the". 17:04:14 fungot: The truncation is what powers the self, is it not? 17:04:15 tusho: lower species can be that the implementation was just broken. for other stuff, it calls the recursion again and tries to prove what we were about to divide that or so. 17:04:29 fungot: Your final ll;ine? 17:04:30 tusho: open any scheme source file with an alternative reader for ( a b c d" perl fnord ' print " n".join(s)' line 17:04:54 [2006-12-05 14:12:48] < egal> 13:11 < ELECTR00> losing energy like an idiot is not THE 17:04:57 Apparently so. 17:05:09 The incorporation of the comparison with programming languages' syntaxes and their relative uniformity as a satire on natural languages is inspired. 17:05:29 http://rafb.net/p/bSDi5y65.html poemular work of fungot issue 2 17:05:29 tusho: my favorite part is " equal")' prints nothing) it doesn't compile. having the language be useable to some extent. it just happens 17:05:33 they just keep getting longer lines 17:05:54 the latest one is more dense & obscure than the first by a lot. 17:06:07 Perhaps a new era in fungot's poemular work is needed? Will it return to minimalism? 17:06:08 tusho: the only thing that can't completely be optimized is stuff where a part of scsh is already nearly completely documented, and only if there is any 17:06:16 Apparently not. 17:07:37 I can return it to minimalism by decreasing the number used to divide the amount of words already generated when deciding whether to stop or not. But maybe that would be too cruel. 17:08:16 Currently every six generated words increases the stopping probability by .05 or something like that. 17:11:40 fizzie: Do it, he must be tweaked! 17:13:51 ^reload 17:13:52 Reloaded. 17:13:59 fungot: Do you feel like being less verbose now? 17:13:59 fizzie: a pro at that :)) 17:15:23 Actually it's .0625, not .5, in the Befunge version. It was easier to throw a d16 with ? than a d20. 17:16:02 (And it's now so that each generated token gives that +.0625.) 17:39:35 fungot: Poemular next lin? 17:39:35 tusho: yeah, we like such people much more then fnord the syntax if you want 17:39:50 fungot: Your new poem sounds like a rap. 17:39:51 tusho: taupan i tought that scheme worked with pointers/ references 17:40:02 fungot: *scratches record* 17:40:02 tusho: later tell bunny_314 we ( velco, forcer and r2q2? 17:40:08 fungot 17:40:09 tusho: one of my formally fnord questions consists of ordering 25 functions by their asymptotic behaviour. :( 17:40:19 fungot: Last line? 17:40:25 optbot: fungot 17:40:26 tusho: dind't crash. 17:40:30 er. 17:40:35 fizzie: say fungot 17:41:27 fizzie: plz 17:42:44 fungot 17:42:44 Deewiant: an hour each time he comes close to something hot. 17:56:50 anyone know if php handles tail recursion well? 17:56:54 I guess answer is no 17:57:03 very doubtful 17:57:10 most imperative language implementations don't 17:57:20 Deewiant, I seen some that does 17:57:28 yes, as have I 17:57:37 I said "most", not "all" 17:58:54 so now to implement Sieve of Eratosthenes in php (eww) and yes it is for a course in school 17:59:04 otherwise I wouldn't touch php at all 17:59:16 PHP course? 17:59:29 Deewiant, Webdesign + PHP basics 17:59:43 sieve of eratosthenes? 17:59:51 is that web design? :-P 17:59:57 no part of the php bit 18:00:40 assignment was "Print all prime numbers in the range 2-100", well iirc sieve of eratosthenes should fit well for that 18:00:59 AnMaster: 18:01:02 print [2,3,5,7... 18:01:05 why do you take that ourse 18:01:15 although Deewiant++ 18:01:35 and since the range is that tiny 18:01:47 it's easier to make a primality checker 18:01:54 and just loop 2-100 18:01:58 tusho, well in Sweden you have to take a set number of hours in total, and that was the least bad course left to select for the last 50 hours 18:01:59 :P 18:02:14 ++wikipedia: http://www.think-lamp.com/2008/08/sieve-of-eratosthenes-in-php/ 18:02:20 AnMaster: web design & php course sounds pretty fucking bad to me :) 18:02:29 tusho, well sure 18:02:39 i mean, i love web design and all that but all the courses i've seen have sucked 18:02:44 as well as 99% of the tutorials 18:02:48 it's a shame 18:03:30 'regardless of what wikipedia might say :(' 18:03:40 i think i'll trust wp over your lame blog for algorithmic complexity shizz. 18:04:25 hee, implementation of NULL is now just `mixin (Fingerprint!("NULL"));' 18:04:34 Deewiant: cute 18:04:40 now make it (fingerprint "NULL") 18:04:51 or fingerprints NULL = [] 18:05:09 sorry, this is D, I can't improve the syntax 18:05:21 or rather, this is D 1.0 18:05:29 in a later version of 2.0, or 3.0, I should be able to 18:05:35 Deewiant: so don't use d ;) 18:05:46 my second example was meant to be haskell 18:05:54 it wasn't, though 18:05:57 :-P 18:06:06 or hmm 18:06:10 yes 18:06:10 it is 18:06:12 okay, yes, it could be 18:06:15 data Fingerprint = NULL | ... 18:06:17 yeah 18:06:21 misthought 18:06:21 fingerprints :: Fingerprint -> [(dunno)] 18:06:32 ofc, that pattern matching would suck 18:06:34 you'd need a map 18:06:34 but anyhoo 18:06:37 and then it gets less elegant 18:06:43 we already have a haskell impl 18:06:49 so might as well stick with D :-P 18:07:36 hmmmmmmm 18:07:43 what nice fast language is it unimplemented in... 18:07:54 ocaml 18:08:08 Deewiant: i said nice 18:08:15 tusho: Nice 18:08:18 ;-P 18:08:23 Deewiant: :D 18:08:26 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nice_(programming_language) 18:08:26 CHARITY 18:08:29 and i know 18:08:58 I don't know, what else is nice 18:09:04 after Haskell nothing seems nice any more :-P 18:09:16 Clean, maybe 18:09:30 Deewiant: i said Charity 18:09:30 :P 18:09:59 is it nice? 18:10:50 it's impractical 18:10:51 :P 18:10:54 subturing 18:11:15 meh 18:11:43 http://www.ultratechnology.com/scope.htm 18:38:35 -!- oerjan has joined. 18:38:57 hi oerjan 18:39:18 'evening 18:41:51 optbot! 18:41:51 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | I improved my trombute :P. 18:42:49 now to do the same with the troitar and the flugan 18:45:59 oerjan: care for the poemular work of fungot, issue 3? 18:45:59 tusho: fnord or something 18:46:23 fungot: i'm using that as a title for this collection 18:46:23 tusho: lets make a spec first anyway... start a game! 18:46:50 fungot: that part about ordering functions by asymptotic behavior sounded painful 18:46:51 oerjan: rammstein is far more familiar with inner product spaces than i am 18:47:10 hah 18:47:21 that was eerily topical 18:47:32 well, nearly 18:47:47 oerjan: http://pastebin.ca/raw/1192758 18:48:07 fungot: what do you know about hedge funds? 18:48:08 oerjan: but it'll be there the next time you mispaste, please use your wonderful powers to get ipv6 to actually happen. 18:49:37 avoiding the question and trying to shuffle work onto me. that is an evil, evil bot 18:51:05 fungot: surely you cannot be serious 18:51:05 oerjan: no worries either way, very ingenious. 18:51:24 oerjan: i think optbot needs some more love 18:51:25 tusho: it's amusing 18:51:29 exactky 18:51:31 *exactly 18:51:50 * oerjan hugs optbot 18:51:51 oerjan: i never really believed in that 18:52:00 hah 18:52:23 does anyone got a good tutorial about the PE Format ? 18:52:31 tusho, Deewiant: there? 18:52:39 sure 18:52:48 I found a tutorial about the PE Format in Win 3.1 ... 18:52:49 no 18:53:01 how would one go about printing the 100 first primes? Sieve of Eratosthenes is "primes in a range" not the same 18:53:05 Deewiant, just wondering 18:53:16 :| 18:53:24 AnMaster: start at i=0. 18:53:30 from 0..infinity 18:53:32 and go to i=100. 18:53:34 if it is a prime 18:53:38 then increment i 18:53:40 tusho, and then keep going until I found 100 primes hm... 18:53:41 right 18:53:42 stop if i is 100 18:53:50 duh, that I didn't think of that 18:53:58 expert programmer. :| 18:54:12 it might be more efficient to use the sieve with an overestimated range 18:54:22 oerjan: but also overengineering. 18:54:27 oerjan, um? 18:54:33 it's just for a class assignment 18:54:39 this is most likely how they're expecting it to be done 18:54:41 this part was not 18:54:44 even if it's not, it's a better solution 18:54:47 this was just wondering 18:54:47 ah 18:55:01 the class assignment was "find all primes in the range 2-100" 18:55:06 cost-benefit ratio would lead to this solution 18:55:09 for which I used the sieve 18:55:10 AnMaster: then do the same thing :P 18:55:21 for i in 2..100, if prime(i) print i 18:55:23 while I just happened to wonder "what about the first 100 primes" 18:55:23 simple as it gets 18:55:28 and the best way to do it 18:55:30 for such a tiny range 18:55:40 AnMaster: computers can check less than 100 primes very fast, you know 18:55:45 the sieve is a waste 18:55:47 tusho, yep 18:56:03 AnMaster: i'd give more marks for the simple for-loop than the sieve 18:56:10 tusho, oh? 18:56:11 it shows a better way of thinking about the problem 18:56:24 i.e. it's simpler to write a for loop and a trivial prime checker 18:56:27 for such tiny ranges 18:56:33 and thus a better use of time than an all-out sieve 18:56:34 that's what I said 18:56:36 which is overblown for the tiny range 18:56:41 therefore, I would mark the for-loop higher. 18:56:52 tusho, function takes upper limit as parameter ;P 18:56:54 but I don't know 18:57:03 AnMaster: you're missing the point, as usual 18:57:09 takeWhile (<=100) primes is pretty 18:57:21 Deewiant, that is haskell again? 18:57:26 yes 18:57:33 ok so what does that one mean 18:57:33 AnMaster: I want to know how primes are relevant to webdesign. 18:57:40 AnMaster: primes is an infinite list of every prime 18:57:43 what do you think it means 18:57:47 tusho: shush 18:57:50 tusho, as I mention above, it was the introduction to php bit of the course 18:57:51 takeWhile gives all the elements of a list 18:57:54 up to when the predicate fails. 18:57:58 it is webdesign mostly 18:58:01 bah, tusho 18:58:11 Deewiant: there are better ways to irritate AnMaster 18:58:13 that's the kind of thing that should be figured out and not explained 18:58:19 I'm not looking to irritate 18:58:27 I'm not a jerk-ass troll like you :-P 18:58:30 however first section is introduction to php, for example first one was "convert Fahrenheit to Celsius" 18:58:40 yes, but the day AnMaster understands haskell, i'll make a video of me dancing to never gonna give you up 18:58:42 AnMaster: that has the advantage that the other question is just take 100 primes 18:58:43 and i'll post it on youtube 18:59:03 tusho: of course that's a non-statement unless you define "understands haskell" 18:59:11 I don't understand most of Oleg's stuff 18:59:11 oerjan, ? 18:59:23 Deewiant: understands it as much as me, let's say 18:59:25 or many of the GHC typesystem extensions 18:59:27 (and i'm not very good at haskell) 18:59:27 :P 18:59:34 AnMaster: take n list gives the first n elements of a list 18:59:35 tusho, I do understand erlang which is also functional, so maybe I'll try haskell later, won't have time to learn it for some time though 18:59:42 AnMaster: please don't 18:59:44 oerjan, yes 18:59:48 oerjan, ? 18:59:51 tusho, why not? 18:59:54 AnMaster: please do, let's make him post that video 19:00:06 probably next summer 19:00:06 AnMaster: well, do it only when i'm offline 19:00:09 or the xmas 19:00:10 thanks 19:00:21 tusho, maybe at some other random point though 19:00:33 not the next few months at least 19:01:55 fizzie: Could I publish these fungot poems in a book 19:01:56 tusho: now let's up them, right? :) ( but why ledit scheme if you squint 19:02:03 and an interactive cd 19:03:09 tusho: The Mark ov Poetry? 19:03:10 tusho, btw google chrome fail at 64-bit currently, a lot would need to be reworked apart from the java script code generation, for example: the GC used 19:03:16 oerjan: hah 19:03:20 I asked around a bit 19:03:23 AnMaster: what-everrrrrrrrrr 19:03:32 tusho, hm? 19:03:43 AnMaster: that was my demonstration of my lack of caring :D 19:04:14 tusho, you used up your quota of "r" 19:04:21 AnMaster: oh dea. 19:04:24 -!- oklopol has joined. 19:04:31 more r's means more caring, clearly. 19:04:47 have you heard about the rabbit and the rabbi? 19:04:58 hm except it could be just keyboard repetition 19:05:17 was that an answer to mine? 19:05:27 oklopol: sorry, we are leaving out r's not t's at the moment 19:05:56 well that's just kille 19:06:09 although you could tell abbit of the joke 19:06:26 http://hideou.se/counter/ is dead 19:06:27 :( 19:06:38 tusho: what was it? 19:06:44 oerjan: no, it's alive 19:06:46 just not being used 19:06:48 tusho, why is that? 19:06:52 "Top clickers 19:06:52 AnMaster: nobody is clicking. 19:06:52 1. Loading... 19:06:52 " 19:06:54 then nothing 19:06:58 huh. 19:07:01 that shouldn't happen 19:07:04 no, the site works fine 19:07:04 oh javascript 19:07:05 ... 19:07:06 people have just stopped clicking 19:07:09 right 19:07:11 AnMaster: duh :P 19:07:17 oklopol is clicking it seems 19:07:19 you wouldn't be able to click very fast if it didn't use JS 19:07:25 ah, seems i just spurred him on 19:07:25 :P 19:07:41 tusho, I can't see myself I noticed 19:07:42 i just clicked because that was linked 19:07:44 weird 19:07:48 or how many clicks I have 19:07:53 AnMaster: 'cause you've dropped off the highscores 19:07:57 oklopol: er, what about that rabbi and that lagomorph 19:07:57 you're about 1000 behind 19:08:02 tusho, well how many do I have? exactly 19:08:07 AnMaster: 8000 or so 19:08:11 tusho, you should always show yourself 19:08:17 so you've said. 19:08:18 FIVE TIMES 19:08:22 no 19:08:23 i've said it once 19:08:25 first time I said it 19:08:31 tusho, ais said it 5 times 19:08:35 i'd say v4, but since people aren't using it v4 seems unlikely. 19:08:54 people aren't using it because they can't see themselves, methinks 19:09:36 tusho, so where am I now? 19:09:44 oklopol: except the higher-ups aren't clicking 19:09:49 btw i had this idea, dunno if it's any good, you could drop everyones score to half of what it was at the end of every week, and @ every drop, you get a separate point if you're @ the top 5 19:09:53 AnMaster: i am not logging in and checking. you are 8000-something 19:09:57 at 9002, you will be on the highscores 19:10:08 tusho, I still want to know 19:10:14 AnMaster: i am not logging in and checking. 19:10:20 tusho: true, coolness would definitely compete if #2 started clicking again 19:10:20 tusho, I want to stop at 9000 19:10:26 AnMaster: have fun 19:10:29 tusho, then make the webui show it (second time) 19:10:32 i am not logging in and checking. 19:10:38 or logging in and working on it. 19:10:41 tusho, then make the webui show it (third time) 19:10:44 or logging in and working on it. 19:10:49 accept that I will bug you? 19:10:55 accept that i will /ignore you 19:10:58 tusho, damn I went too far :( 19:11:09 i have not /ignored you yet. 19:11:12 but if you do bug me i will. 19:11:34 AnMaster: you just need to learn to count carefully :D 19:12:10 AnMaster: if you get to 15,000 I will set your score to 9000 19:12:19 tusho, no thanks 19:12:25 your los 19:12:26 s 19:12:26 because if I got that far I wouldn't care 19:12:47 AnMaster: ok, if you get to 15,000 i'll make your name fade in rainbow colours. 19:13:06 ON THE MOON 19:13:20 oerjan: i'll add a picture of the death star next to him too. 19:13:25 or rather, any 16x16 picture he gives. 19:16:28 'av a 'tar... 19:18:07 tusho, well maybe I'll reach that some day 19:18:10 not today anyway 19:18:14 got other stuff to do 19:20:18 g 19:21:26 g? 19:21:32 g 19:21:39 a fine letter indeed 19:21:50 invented by the ancient romans 19:22:18 oerjan, did they invent lower case too? 19:22:38 maybe not strictly speaking 19:22:39 oerjan: what is your favourite typeface 19:22:59 times roman, 1000 point 19:23:23 oerjan: i asked about typeface, not size. though i can't imagine times roman@1000pt is very readable 19:23:29 got to compete with old Trajan there 19:23:42 ah, good old Trajan 19:23:44 the movie font 19:23:44 it is from a distance 19:24:00 i mean the monument 19:24:38 Tajan? 19:24:41 Trajan* 19:24:42 ?? 19:24:46 AnMaster: GOOGLE 19:24:54 my favourite typeface is arial, or perhaps verdana! 19:25:12 ah there is a trajan font 19:25:13 Marcus Ulpius Nerva Traianus, commonly known as Trajan (September 18, 53 – August 9, 117), was a Roman Emperor who reigned from 98 until his death in 117. Born Marcus Ulpius Traianus into a nonpatrician family... 19:25:15 right 19:25:22 AnMaster: and see the top line 19:25:28 AnMaster: you might want to add 'font' to the google string 19:25:32 given that that was the topic and all 19:26:08 I am sad that nobody mauled me for saying my favourite font was arial or verdana 19:26:18 Was it too subtle? Should I have said Comic Sans MS? 19:26:22 I'll only maul you if... yeah, that. 19:27:13 Deewiant: except i did not mean the font, at first 19:27:32 darn 19:27:41 tusho: what-everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr 19:27:49 * oerjan ducks 19:27:55 oerjan: I'm glad you care so much thanks :) 19:27:58 Remember? More r = more care. 19:28:08 You said it yourself. 19:28:10 I prefer the Bitstream Vera family of fonts 19:28:17 * tusho mauls AnMaster 19:28:18 and then i changed my mind, remember? 19:28:19 for printed I like Computer Modern 19:28:20 :D 19:28:21 it rucks 19:28:24 rocks* 19:28:33 AnMaster never ever do anything that involves anything like typography ever 19:28:35 ok :D 19:28:42 tusho, it was a joke duh 19:28:49 though CM isn't that bad 19:28:55 but indeed not for printed 19:28:55 'I prefer the Bitstream Vera family of fonts' 19:28:56 was that a joke 19:28:59 or anything 19:29:02 because that's what i mauled you for. 19:29:06 tusho, I do use it on IRC and such 19:29:16 Bitstream Vera Sans Mono 19:29:19 to be specific 19:29:23 AnMaster: well, i use monaco 10pt on irc, doesn't mean i consider monaco @ 10pt typographically nice ;) 19:29:26 or maybe it is dejavu 19:29:30 -!- Corun has joined. 19:29:30 tusho, indeed 19:29:33 but that wasn't what I said 19:29:41 but from a typeface point of view bitstream vera fonts are pretty crap 19:29:45 they're just so bland 19:29:51 and the proportions are really weird, to me 19:29:53 that's not necessarily bad 19:30:02 Deewiant: yea, but it's not bland in a good way 19:30:06 tusho, what do you think of CM? 19:30:09 it's bland in an "oh, bitstream vera. beh" 19:30:22 AnMaster: it has a charm, but i'm not a fan 19:30:24 well, it's a matter of opinion 19:31:49 i quite like Univers 19:31:52 so what is a good serif? 19:31:53 free 19:31:54 but not as something to put a book in 19:31:59 for use with printed stuff 19:32:07 AnMaster: there are, like, 3 freely-licensed fonts out there. 19:32:14 none of them are much good 19:35:15 tusho, CM, LM, AE, (all variants of CM really, so not fair), Bistream Vera, Courier, Courier New, Utopia and iirc a few more 19:35:23 not sure how free they are 19:35:28 AnMaster: okay, so like 10 19:35:29 :P 19:35:30 let me check licenses for packages 19:35:53 heck, most typefaces predate the very recent idea of "free culture" 19:36:33 yes... 19:38:40 well Utopia isn't open, it is free as in beer only it seems 19:39:00 provided you include "Copyright (c) 1989 Adobe Systems Incorporated" 19:39:02 heh 19:39:03 AnMaster: funny - if you drop the capital from the U there it seems to remain just as true. 19:39:21 tusho, topia? 19:39:26 'the capital from the U' 19:39:29 i.e. it becomes 'u' 19:39:40 um 19:39:43 "well utopia isn't open, it is free as in beer only it seems" 19:39:53 well utopia doesn't exist :P 19:42:10 utopia, by definition, does not exist 19:42:23 it is a word though 19:42:30 ye 19:42:31 yes* 19:42:59 utopia/heaven is a paradox anyway 19:43:08 "everything is perfect" sounds awful to me 19:43:22 life is great because of all the bad stuff, all the little less-than-perfect thiings, combined with the perfect things 19:43:28 everything perfect is just draining and monotonous 19:43:49 * oerjan wants to beat up tusho now to make him happier 19:44:02 oerjan: er, not quite :D 19:44:28 and that btw was almost no joke at all 19:44:33 life is awesome 19:44:45 oerjan: you disagree with me then? :P 19:44:47 oklopol: totally! 19:44:51 yep 19:45:08 oerjan: er, not quite :D <-- so you aren't into that then? 19:45:08 ;P 19:45:13 oerjan: wanna advance some arguments? :P 19:45:45 if boredom is possible, then it is not really perfect 19:46:03 oerjan: right, but boredom isn't perfect 19:46:08 therefore if it is perfect it cannot have boredom 19:46:19 ergo nothing is perfect and utopia/heaven cannot exist 19:46:21 it's 5 years since i last was bored 19:46:30 i don't really remember what it feels like 19:46:36 O_O 19:46:38 probably just as fun as the rest though 19:47:55 oklopol: you need to write a self-help book for others to learn that :D 19:47:56 oklopol: i am going to grep "oklopol" "i'm" "bored" 19:48:03 and "oklopol" "i" "am" "bored" 19:48:06 in optbot's logs 19:48:07 tusho: Among other things, Linux 0.1 has a hard-coded keyboard map. . . 19:48:08 and we'll see. 19:48:51 you do that 19:50:19 tusho: done? 19:50:26 almost 19:51:04 tusho@rutian:~/optbot$ egrep -i ".*i'm.*bored" * 19:51:04 07.11.04:12:54:10 i'm not bored 19:51:05 tusho@rutian:~/optbot$ 19:51:05 lol 19:51:05 tusho: how about run-time lazy type checking? :P 19:51:05 tusho: not that 19:51:30 and nothing for i am bored 19:51:40 oklopol: you win 19:52:37 what a surprise :P 19:52:40 tusho, what about me? 19:53:04 tusho, anyway you forgot oklofok 19:53:06 and a few more 19:53:10 while you're at it, why not find an occasion of me complaining about the rain 19:53:20 or perhaps that i hate esoteric languages 19:53:40 AnMaster: oklokok has never been bored either, now for oklofok 19:53:58 nope 19:54:03 tusho, and me? 19:54:06 AnMaster: none 19:54:10 hah 19:54:10 not searching /mes 19:54:13 cause i can't be arsed 19:54:15 tusho: try never+bored 19:54:23 oklopol: no lazy 19:54:56 tusho, what about yourself? 19:55:19 wtf 19:55:19 no results 19:55:24 that's not right 19:55:39 I'm usually not bored either 19:55:46 I tend to rather have too much to do 19:57:08 there can be only one explanation 19:57:14 oklopol is satan 19:57:22 oerjan, eh? 19:57:24 tusho: try "was bored" 19:57:39 i don't believe in satans 19:58:01 that's what you want us to think 19:59:45 I can be bored by doing stuff sure, but never because I got nothing to do 20:00:11 AnMaster: what does that mean? 20:00:12 tusho: I obviously have nothing against a fungot book, but I have no clue whatsoever whether the stuff fungot spews out is some sort of a derived work. 20:00:12 fizzie: i understand what u were asking 20:00:24 fizzie: fair use probably 20:00:42 i guess i'll just make a book with all sorts of non-directed writing 20:00:48 stolen fair and square 20:01:00 markov bots, where you write without trying to write anything in particualr ( i forget the term) 20:01:02 etc. 20:01:51 bye 20:01:55 -!- Mony has quit ("À vaincre sans péril on triomphe sans gloire..."). 20:03:47 bye 20:04:03 what's vaincre? 20:04:20 darn 20:04:35 i was trying not to wonder about that 20:05:01 Vaincre - To conquer 20:05:55 ah 20:06:05 is peril... err... peril? 20:06:15 you'd think so 20:06:23 no i wouldn't 20:06:33 or danger 20:08:00 Deewiant, anything new with befunge the last few days? 20:08:02 http://fr.wiktionary.org/wiki/p%C3%A9ril 20:08:05 haven't had time to keep up 20:08:09 it even has the quote 20:12:27 AnMaster: not really afaik 20:13:08 beeeeeeeeeeee 20:13:28 did you get stung? 20:14:27 yes i sure and totally did 20:14:31 it was effin awesome 20:14:40 oklopol: do you not feel pain 20:14:48 i shall be leaving now, need to read my book 20:14:51 i do feel pain 20:14:56 i don't really feel cold though 20:18:09 Robots do not feel pain! 20:18:35 oklopol: so wait 20:18:39 does the pain, like, hurt? 20:18:48 you don't seem to have the averse reaction that most humans do to it. 20:19:17 it doesn't really hurt when bees sting 20:19:31 and pain isn't usually that bad 20:20:00 unless it's in the eye or the ...belly button, seems i only know the kid term :P 20:20:20 Navel. 20:20:47 As in, "navel-gazing", an idiom I don't think we have in Finnish. Or do we? 20:21:14 1. omphaloskepsis, navel-gazing -- (literally, the contemplation of one's navel, which is an idiom usually meaning complacent self-absorption) 20:21:35 I don't think I've ever heard anyone say "navankatselu" or something. 20:22:21 well, navlebeskuelse is in norwegian 20:23:08 well people talk about caring only about ones own navel 20:23:18 but i'm not sure there's an actual idiom 20:23:49 The MOT dictionary translates navel-gazing as "omaan napaan tuijottaminen", lit. "staring at one's own navel", but I don't think it's exactly the same thing. 20:24:08 There's a distinct sense of selfishness there. 20:24:26 well i don't know navel-gazing 20:24:40 assumed it's selffishness 20:24:45 *selfishness 20:25:17 a social fish so selfish 20:25:23 Shellfish. 20:25:28 how can that be 20:25:31 hmm 20:25:42 well that's not really pronounced the same 20:25:50 but if you can fit it in, it would make that better 20:26:08 not that social fish and so selfish are pronounced the same either 20:26:24 It can be if you have "s"-pronunciation trouble, I think. 20:26:36 the olde shibboleth 20:26:37 like,lisp 20:26:40 like, lisp 20:26:51 lisp can do that! 20:27:07 hmm actually lisp is that other thing i think 20:27:13 godfuck, i really need to read :) 20:27:14 -> 20:28:24 -!- psygnisfive has joined. 20:28:33 tusho 20:28:37 oh no 20:28:48 you look like david deutsch. 20:28:53 ok. 20:28:59 only younger. 20:29:03 and more esoteric. 20:29:08 oh no <-- hey! for once that wasn't directed at me! :D 20:29:10 * AnMaster runs 20:29:27 LITHP is said to be useful in protheththing lithtth. Says the fortune. 20:29:49 i like how you didn't lisp all the s's 20:30:02 Only the part I was directly quoting. 20:30:16 You know you just missed oklopol, right? 20:30:52 we all miss him. it was such a tragedy. 20:31:06 A senseless waste of human life. 20:31:16 as long as the body's still warm 20:31:24 imagine, to be drowned in koskenkorva. well it was appropriately finnish at least. 20:32:39 koskenkorva? 20:33:13 swedes should use absolut instead 20:33:29 transvestites love jar jar binks. 20:33:52 jar-jar, you're a genius 20:35:17 oerjan, I'm a "nykterist" 20:35:23 not sure if you got a word for that over there 20:35:45 nor sure of English word 20:35:59 teetotaller 20:36:01 AnMaster: what does that mean? 20:36:02 teet- ah. 20:38:34 it means teet? 20:38:35 :P 20:38:44 In Finnish the corresponding word is "absolutisti", and there are lots of bad puns related to that and the "Absolut" brand vodka. 20:39:00 fizzie: Absolut-isti 20:39:02 haha i maed pun 20:39:17 psygnisfive, tusho, it means I don't drink alcohol 20:39:25 i am aware. 20:39:32 god, you treat me like a preschooler 20:39:40 well you asked me 20:39:41 norwegian: avholdsmann/-kvinne 20:39:43 ... 20:39:48 AnMaster: no, but oerjan already said it 20:39:49 and i said 'ah'. 20:39:52 oerjan, sounds like it fit 20:40:03 also just because someone makes a joke -see psygnisfive- doesn't mean they don't understand 20:40:49 so whats new in the world of esolangs guys 20:40:59 nothing 20:41:12 -!- kar8nga has quit ("Leaving."). 20:41:17 -!- kar8nga has joined. 20:41:28 ¿./$%./..$%$$$/././.$$./././.%%%$$$%$%$%/./.$%/.$%$%$%$$$$$$$$? 20:41:33 That could totally be an esolang. 20:41:44 its not already? 20:41:50 probably another bf clone 20:41:55 yeah. 20:42:00 most esolangs are bf clones :( 20:42:08 cyphered BF clones. 20:42:09 :\ 20:42:17 Yeah, malbolge is totally a bf clone. 20:42:34 theoretically all are, if you just make the cypher complicated enough :D 20:42:44 corun: do you understand the meaning of "most"? 20:42:47 im guessing not. 20:43:03 mm, most 20:43:06 Do you understand that I was clearly not being serious 20:43:07 eplemost, that is 20:43:12 I'm guessing not :-) 20:43:31 so you weren't being sarcastic? 20:43:32 Corun: psygnisfive only understands the 'joke with punchline' kind of humour 20:43:36 Oh 20:43:42 (He's american) 20:43:59 quite the contrary tusho 20:44:04 what 20:44:05 i interpreted what he said as being sarcastic 20:44:07 youre not amercian? 20:44:09 hence why i responded why i did 20:44:31 I was being sarcastic, but I was also not being serious. 20:44:36 Corun: exactly 20:44:48 he was joking with sarcasm 20:44:51 i don't see the point of it. was it supposed to be funny? 20:44:54 as tusho implies? 20:44:55 psygnisfive: it was funny 20:44:59 i chuckled 20:45:06 yes, but ask yourself why 20:45:37 if you chuckled because you thought it was a humorous retort against what i said, then it fails, because its not a retort at all. 20:45:42 no 20:45:43 i didn't 20:45:46 ok. 20:45:51 see, you're treating it as sarcasm to make a serious point 20:45:51 oerjan, only most? 20:45:52 you have a weird sense of humor then. 20:45:57 he was being sarcastic to make a joke 20:46:04 i dont get the joke. 20:46:10 why is it funny? 20:46:10 oerjan, oh true, there are the quantum ones, and then the banana-scheme or whatever it was called 20:46:12 right 20:46:44 what line are you referring to psygnisfive and tusho? 20:46:57 My line about malbolge 20:47:00 the comment that Malbolge is a BF clone 20:47:07 psygnisfive: that is not the comment 20:47:16 Corun: see. american. :| 20:47:21 tusho: what? 20:47:24 yes it is 20:47:26 "CorunYeah, malbolge is totally a bf clone." 20:47:35 psygnisfive: yes, but it was a sarcastic comment 20:47:39 i know that 20:47:43 and then, it evaluated then inverted 20:47:46 to account for sarcasm 20:47:50 that statement that you get there 20:47:51 was a joke 20:48:02 humor is not sarcasm 20:48:07 and sarcasm is not humor 20:48:08 no 20:48:11 that was not the humour 20:48:15 the sarcasm was a layer over the humour 20:48:15 then what was the humor 20:48:16 god 20:48:23 psygnisfive: the humour was in the statement post-sarcasm processing 20:48:26 this is all so confusing 20:48:28 and yet it wouldn't be funny without the sarcasm 20:48:36 what post-sarcasm processing? 20:48:39 now shut the hell up and stop saying "lol i didnt get it lol" over and over again. 20:48:40 thanks. 20:48:45 the inversion of the meaning? 20:48:52 yes. 20:48:54 i don't get it 20:48:59 sarcasm _is_ inversion of meaning. 20:49:00 Corun: can you just explain it to him 20:49:00 kthx 20:49:03 so where is the humor. 20:49:17 tusho, you're just an idiot and don't know what the fuck you're laughing about. 20:49:27 psygnisfive: yes, and fuck you do 20:49:29 *too 20:50:16 corun, what makes it funny. 20:50:33 #esoteric, the channel with TC humor 20:50:55 * tusho is vaguely amused that psygnisfive, faced with something he can't understand, always claims that others are just fools instead of accepting that he was the one who didn't get it 20:51:42 now _that's_ american *ducks* 20:52:02 oerjan: :) 20:52:06 What, are American ducks somehow different? NURRR so confused. 20:52:07 tusho, perhaps the fact that your explanations are vacuous is why i called you an idiot 20:52:10 "Corun Yeah, malbolge is totally a bf clone." 20:52:11 well 20:52:20 theoretically all are, if you just make the cypher complicated enough :D 20:52:23 there 20:52:24 fizzie: they come in pairs 20:52:41 Sigh 20:52:44 hmm, I see we are all displaying our talents 20:52:52 psygnisfive randomly insulting everyone because he doesn't get something 20:52:56 AnMaster missing a joke 20:53:00 and oerjan making a terrible joke 20:53:00 AnMaster: i _was_ forgetting the super-TC ones though 20:53:03 and Corun sighing 20:53:15 and tusho being an idiot. 20:53:19 I don't have a special talent? :( 20:53:20 can't forget that. 20:53:24 oerjan, as I suggested 20:53:24 -=S¡gH-= 20:53:34 fizzie: no, as you're generally reasonable. 20:53:36 oerjan, is Quantum ones super-TC? 20:53:39 I guess not 20:53:45 /saɪ/ 20:53:55 psygnisfive: you win the prize for 'closest demonstration of point':'when point was said' ratio. 20:53:55 I guess I need some sort of special power now, to fit in here. 20:54:00 congratz. 20:54:21 although i ask, if i'm always such an idiot, why don't you just /ignore me? 20:54:22 anmaster: if you ask david deutsch, quantum computers are not more powerful than turing machinese 20:54:25 they're just faster 20:54:28 AnMaster: no, just more space efficient 20:54:41 right 20:54:53 anyway I'm so sleepy 20:54:56 going to bed 20:54:57 night 20:54:57 his lack of reply shows that he might have 20:54:59 awesome 20:55:04 * tusho brbs regardless 20:55:28 er wait 20:55:30 tusho: sorry, i didn't see what you said. i didn't say you're always an idiot, just that you excel at it. 20:55:32 _time_ efficient 20:55:51 and space efficient. 20:55:57 tho it depends on how you define space :) 20:56:34 It was funny because of multiple reasons. The thought of malbolge being a bf clone is, in itself, slightly amusing. But it wouldn't be properly funny without the sarcasm because the sarcasm makes it appear as though it's a serious point. Except that actually, it's just intended as a joke. Which, also makes it more funny. 20:56:41 given that quantum computations occur on more particles in more universes than there are particles in ours, that might be considered slightly inefficient 20:56:42 lol. 20:57:20 corun: ok. i still don't see how its funny to simply state something that's false as tho it were true. 20:57:29 the sky is red! lololol. 20:57:35 You're not looking at the detail 20:57:40 It doesn't work with just any statement 20:57:47 You can't apply simple rules to make humour 20:58:24 In that exact context, it was funny. But you didn't find it funny cos you took it as a serious statement 20:58:25 ayeeh! the sky is blood-colored! armageddon is at hand! 20:58:29 sure but i dont see why its even funny in context 20:58:41 And you're not gonna find it funny looking back because the moment is lost 20:59:08 indeed. 20:59:17 Not only is it lost 20:59:20 BUT YOU RUINED IT. 20:59:22 :-) 20:59:22 i just can't even imagine how it might be funny. 20:59:27 i think you ruined it. 20:59:29 by saying it. 20:59:30 :P 20:59:52 can i have a special talent? 20:59:55 being absent? 20:59:59 being sexy. 21:00:02 oklopol: you're the pervert 21:00:13 oklopol is certainly not a pervert, oerjan 21:00:14 It's not like, "rofl" funny. But it is kinda "heh" funny. I mean, it's just a slight joke. Ya know. 21:00:18 not with me in the room. 21:00:41 corun: the majority of people i know say "heh" to indicate unfunniness. :P 21:00:53 Heh. 21:00:55 its the small fake laugh you give when someone failed to be funny. 21:00:59 don't pop my prejudices! 21:01:10 can i pop your something else? 21:01:16 You're wrong again ;-) 21:01:22 maybe 21:01:26 im wrong again about most people i know? 21:01:27 No-one says "heh" in actual speach 21:01:37 And in IRC it just means a small laugh 21:01:37 says you! 21:01:45 well we obviously know different people 21:01:51 The people you know suck. 21:01:53 :-) 21:01:57 many of them do! 21:02:08 i'm more perverted than psygnisfive, i'm just more shy about it 21:02:14 That's still better than "don't mind if I do". 21:02:17 oklopol: you so aren't 21:02:26 we'll see 21:02:33 ...shall we now 8| 21:02:36 I hope that was a pun 21:02:40 your big perversion is MAYBE scat. 21:02:42 i really need to read -> 21:02:54 is that so? 21:02:56 You both need to publish your purity test results, that's a good starting point at least. 21:03:06 or atleast thats all you'll admit to. 21:03:07 psygnisfive: you have no idea about my perversions 21:03:23 and by admit i mean reply at all. :P 21:03:27 and i haven't admitted anything. 21:03:37 i want you to admit EVERYTHING! i want to know it all. 21:03:38 :3 21:04:12 reading, if you really wanna, you can be more perverted, i was just trying to make oerjan feel better 21:04:25 dont. oerjan deserves nothing. 21:05:10 * oerjan cries 21:05:20 psygnisfive is mean! 21:05:31 BLAME TUSHO. HE MAKED ME ANGRY. GRR. 21:05:44 normally i'd give you marshmallows and hugs but nooooo 21:09:02 back 21:23:44 hey bitch. 21:24:57 no. 21:27:48 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night"). 21:30:33 no, not hey? 21:42:47 tusho: closures in objective-C, http://www.macresearch.org/cocoa-scientists-part-xxvii-getting-closure-objective-c 21:42:54 Deewiant: yes, seen it 21:42:56 like, 5 days ago. 21:42:57 on reddit. 21:43:05 great 21:43:07 my toying about was inspired by that 21:43:13 ah 21:43:16 i think my {} syntax is nicer than theirs, though 21:43:24 and their type syntax is almost the same as funtion pointers 21:43:28 thus still has the problem i mentioned 21:43:34 also, theirs are less flexible regarding modifying vars 21:44:09 i commented on it :D 21:44:29 they unfortunately conflate a number of issues in that article. 21:44:36 or they atleast dont adequately distinguish them. 21:45:03 yes, i know 21:45:06 that;s not the point 21:45:08 the feature is what i saw 21:45:22 Last week, Chris Lattner — who manages the Clang, LLVM, and GCC groups at Apple — announced that work was well underway to bring ‘blocks’ to the GCC and Clang compilers. ‘So what?’, I hear you ask, ‘My kid has been using blocks since he was 9 months old.’ Fair point, but maybe not these blocks. 21:45:28 ... 21:45:34 -!- optbot has set topic: the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | and it's wrong. 21:46:18 oklopol: welcome to "shitty programming sites" 21:54:26 i do think there was something magical in "Fair point, but maybe not these blocks.", but otherwise, that was a god-awful joke :) 21:55:43 ::plays with oklopols blocks:: 21:56:51 oklopol: it seems that the more theoretical a scientist is the better jokes he makes 21:57:01 see: oerjan's terrible puns, his being a mathematician 21:57:44 mathematics is almost purely theoretical 21:57:53 surely you mean theoretical ~ worse jokes then 21:59:03 psygnisfive: but oerjan's terrible puns are greart 21:59:08 much better than that blocks joke 21:59:14 which is on a science site not a mathematics site 22:00:09 well, in books about game-programming you find stuff like "this is a good thing.... NOT!", ai - a modern approach has had like 3 jokes, and i've actually laughed out loud once 22:00:44 so then.. oerjans puns arent terrible they're great? D: 22:00:46 im confused! :( 22:02:05 terrible and great don't really differ much in meaning 22:02:21 terrible is bad, great is good. 22:02:35 psygnisfive: no. 22:02:38 yes? 22:02:40 oerjan's puns are terrible and great. 22:02:45 D: 22:02:47 im confused! 22:02:51 you confuse me! 22:02:52 psygnisfive: you are using logic 22:02:53 stop that 22:03:00 in what sense are they terrible? 22:03:18 if you need explaining after reading one... 22:03:30 terrible like unfunny painful and stupid, or terrible in the way thats funny? 22:03:39 :( 22:03:40 terrible in a "oh god, that joke was awful, ahahaahah" 22:03:48 and the "ahahahahahah" bit leads to the "great" bit. 22:03:50 funny in its awfulness. ok. 22:03:58 as opposed to just awful. 22:04:26 this channel should be more o-ful 22:04:28 o 22:04:28 o 22:04:28 o 22:04:31 oko 22:04:36 okokokokokokokokokokokokokokoko 22:04:39 no psygnisfive 22:04:42 we were doing an oko tower. 22:04:44 o 22:04:53 an oko tower? 22:04:55 yes 22:04:56 like this 22:04:56 o 22:04:57 oko 22:04:58 okoko 22:04:59 okoko 22:05:01 er 22:05:05 fucked up there :D 22:05:05 o 22:05:06 oko 22:05:07 okoko 22:05:08 okokoko 22:05:10 okokokoko 22:05:12 okokokokoko 22:05:14 okokokokokoko 22:05:16 okokokokokokoko 22:05:18 okokokokokokokoko 22:05:20 okokokokokokokokoko 22:05:22 okokokokokokokoko 22:05:24 okokokokokokoko 22:05:26 okokokokokoko 22:05:28 okokokokoko 22:05:30 okokokoko 22:05:32 okokoko 22:05:34 okoko 22:05:36 oko 22:05:38 no. 22:05:38 o 22:05:40 oklopol invented them on his own, then people started doing them collaboratively. 22:05:42 we haven't seen as many lately 22:05:53 we werent doing that at all. 22:06:08 oh yes we were 22:06:09 right oklopol 22:06:10 also, oklopol, you're insane. 22:06:10 :P 22:06:14 <3u 22:06:42 i've invented oko *towers* perhaps, but this is not the birthplace of oko, and i'm not the inventor of it 22:07:24 oklopol: i imagine it came from #vjn? 22:07:32 well, I claim that since #vjn is apparently a finnish place 22:07:34 yes, but no one there really remembers how it started 22:07:36 and there are only 2 people in finland 22:07:40 :P 22:07:40 that the chances that YOU invented oko 22:07:45 as one of the two people in finland 22:07:47 and thus in #vjn 22:07:49 it's more likely coolness invented it. 22:07:51 is extraordinarily high. 22:07:55 but we don't know for sure 22:07:55 oklopol: you are coolness 22:07:58 he's the other guy 22:08:08 no ,the other guy is Deewiant & fizzie 22:08:13 oh, right 22:08:19 sometimes i get confused myself. 22:08:19 and the rest of that crowd of #esoteric 22:08:24 #vjn is just you, i think 22:08:27 :P 22:08:33 well there's a swedish guy on the chan 22:08:44 actually not anymore 22:08:49 that was AnMaster 22:09:32 #vjn? 22:09:58 vjn basically means me and my friends 22:10:05 although we're a registered group 22:10:11 oklopol: all your friends are you, though 22:10:14 we've just established that 22:10:19 so vjn is a synonym for oklopol. 22:10:20 tusho: that's a bit beside the point 22:10:23 oklopol is a registered group. 22:10:28 containing: oklopol 22:10:34 russel is spinning in his grave 22:10:37 yes, spinning 22:10:41 well physically maybe, but it's better to think of my personas as separate people, especially on irc 22:10:47 well 22:10:55 still, oko is a kind of metaphysical spiritual thing 22:11:00 so it makes sense to say you invented it 22:11:04 even if it was another aspect of you 22:11:07 we discovered an interesting bug in the finnish registered group system 22:11:13 a group can join another group 22:11:25 so it can join itself, as that's not explicitly disallowed 22:11:45 we can immediately see there are all kinds of fun infinite loops 22:11:49 oklopol: do it 22:11:52 for instance @ voting 22:12:07 well we were thinking more like making a few more groups, then joining in a chain 22:12:11 so it's less obvious 22:12:40 i need to watch some stuff -> 22:13:47 did russell die before godel proved incompleteness? 22:15:17 psygnisfive: dunno 22:18:24 -!- jix has quit ("CommandQ"). 22:21:02 -!- kar8nga has quit ("Leaving."). 22:30:40 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 23:15:29 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (Remote closed the connection).