< 1220573311 0 :megatron!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :moozilla < 1220575604 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1220579122 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-60-96.A163.priv.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1220580865 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1220583884 0 :Tritonio_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1220583894 0 :CO2Games!n=CO2Games@75-173-251-127.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1220584538 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make my own brainfuck language. How would I go about getting a compiler for it? < 1220584848 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or should I go for an interpretted language < 1220584878 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making your own Brainfuck language? < 1220584883 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's Brainfuck, it's not your own. < 1220584945 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I want to modify it and make it my own < 1220584985 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1220585005 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got a command I want < 1220585059 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I want a seperate data storage area, not an array, more of a single variable I can cache things into < 1220585112 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably better for everyone if you write your own compiler or interpreter < 1220585161 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like so I can ^<<+[++++++++++>,----------]<[<]>>[.>] < 1220585631 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Takes input until a 10, then echos all of the data < 1220585715 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried running it? < 1220585724 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1220585729 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why this one actually works now < 1220585772 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before I just had a program that went until a null pointer but I'm not exactly going to hit a NULL button on my keyboard to stop the program < 1220585812 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I'm looking for is a way to force a loop to happen at least once, a do...while, rather than a while < 1220585848 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+[ does that < 1220585863 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah I know but then you use up another space < 1220585869 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can get lost. < 1220585892 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would much rather have >{++++++++++>,----------}<[<]>[.>] < 1220585911 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use C < 1220585917 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do < 1220585922 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I want to use brainfuck < 1220585927 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's fun < 1220585954 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1220586008 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I could work on a parser for uhh whatever I'm going to call my little brainfuck derivative < 1220586334 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Look at it. < 1220588647 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok I've decided on having two tapes, the program code cells, and the data storage cells < 1220589634 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need much of a parser when every instruction is 1 char < 1220589684 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck was actually designed to make it easy to compile/interpret < 1220591370 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1220591384 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah but I've got a lot of commands planned < 1220591423 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'ma go to bed now < 1220592736 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip68-98-89-121.ph.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1220592902 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@121-73-162-206.dsl.telstraclear.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1220595701 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1220596154 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1220600494 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@oklopol.yok.utu.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1220601445 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@m-20.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1220601599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1220601600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1220602541 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1220606761 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@cE699BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1220606827 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1220606853 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1220607218 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1220607934 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | and for location of stacks and direction of growing, I'll make that command line arguments < 1220608145 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^rot13 bcgobg! < 1220608146 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot! < 1220608147 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | how do you tell which ones are bad? < 1220608577 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1220608822 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1220608822 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1220608908 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.231 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220609510 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1220609510 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1220609512 0 :moozilla!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1220609512 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1220609526 0 :moozilla!n=moozilla@207.118.49.24 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220609526 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1220609526 0 :lifthrasiir!n=lifthras@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1220609526 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@ludios.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1220609636 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.132 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220610424 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What exactly does "If an attempt is made to modify the result of a comma operator or to access it after the next sequence point, the behavior is undefined." mean? < 1220610442 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is from C99 standard 6.5.17 paragraph 3 < 1220610446 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1220610447 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is from C99 standard 6.5.17 paragraph 2 < 1220610450 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1220610624 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like x = (x=1, 2); ? < 1220610731 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I'm not sure < 1220610746 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however that seems like it should be undefined to me < 1220610752 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably nothing you'd ever run into in practice < 1220610760 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds awfully obscure, anyway < 1220610787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well IOCCC probably... < 1220610801 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said "in practice" < 1220610845 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah true < 1220610876 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway I suspect obscure use of the comma operator is an excellent way to obfuscate C code. < 1220610895 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think anything nontrivial is UB < 1220610904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1220610906 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess so < 1220610925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, however the specs give "f(a, (t=3, t+2), c)" as a valid example < 1220610942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would mean f(a, 5, c) according to the example's description < 1220610945 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but that's fairly nontrivial ;-) < 1220610963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fairly nontrivial? < 1220610974 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evaluate t=3, evaluate t+2. < 1220610984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you added a "non" to much I think < 1220611001 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, apparently < 1220611016 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, still if I ever saw something like like that in real code I would have to read it twice then exclaim wtf :P < 1220612244 0 :Tritonio_!n=tritonio@150.140.216.67 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220612618 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Jesus loves you" < 1220614455 0 :AnMaster_!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1220615207 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1220616282 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@oklopol.yok.utu.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1220616313 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1220616350 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.231 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220616557 0 :tusho!n=tusho@91.105.98.27 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220616772 0 :Tritonio_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1220620975 0 :AnMaster_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :AnMaster < 1220621041 0 :oklofok!n=nnscript@oklopol.yok.utu.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1220621061 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1220622816 0 :Tritonio_!n=tritonio@150.140.226.169 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220623344 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@i-2.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1220623745 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1220625794 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you code a compiler (in a non-TC language) for a TC language? < 1220625963 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220625985 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a lang which goes through 'a=b' in order and applies to stdin and finally outputs to stdout: < 1220625992 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+=ptr[i++] < 1220625993 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1220625995 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ptr[i]-- < 1220625997 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1220625998 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :++ < 1220626000 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you get my meaning < 1220626004 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck->c is just trivial string replacements < 1220626015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1220626043 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bf->simple asm in Befunge-93 should also be possible < 1220626051 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1220627065 0 :Tritonio_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1220628482 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1220629055 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright I just finished my cache and tape classes, not sure if they work or not. < 1220629534 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | cya < 1220631153 0 :Ilari!n=user@a88-112-53-240.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1220632025 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"And I invented doors, no joke!" < 1220632663 0 :Hiato!n=Hiato@dsl-245-24-48.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1220632838 0 :Hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1220633102 0 :Hiato!n=Hiato@dsl-245-24-48.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1220633152 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1220633502 0 :Hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1220633784 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c0F9CBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1220633981 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1220633984 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought ais would be here today. < 1220634205 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@a91-152-136-31.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1220635249 0 :Tritonio_!n=tritonio@150.140.226.169 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220635715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, btw cfunge compiles successfully on GCC and ICC. TCC lacks a certain C99 feature currently cfunge uses but they plan to add that. PCC I couldn't even get to compile a simple hello world on my system < 1220635728 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1220635731 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compiling llvm/clang currently, though clang is experimental < 1220635735 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure why you decided to tell me all that < 1220635736 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but okay < 1220635745 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so will be fun to see if it works < 1220635749 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, can't wait for clang to replace gcc < 1220635755 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what i've heard it is completely awesome < 1220635761 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems rather good < 1220635769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however it is still far from complete < 1220635772 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220635779 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1220635786 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps ais523 should be writing an LLVM backend instead... < 1220635787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, also I suspect trying to compile a kernel using llvm could cause serious issues < 1220635788 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for brainfuck < 1220635789 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example < 1220635791 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or glibc < 1220635796 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1220635804 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, presumably they're targeting regular apps first < 1220635805 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1220635812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, yeah < 1220635821 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway GCC won't be replaced for a long time < 1220635830 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1220635834 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bit of a shame, it is _quite_ warty < 1220635837 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe on OS X, since Apple seems to be LLVM fans < 1220635848 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, os x is still very BSDy < 1220635855 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1220635856 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern BSDy < 1220635866 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, you ever been to #llvm on oftc? < 1220635872 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot seem to match *.apple.com < 1220635874 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1220635883 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea, well, apple have done a lot with llvm < 1220635885 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's cool < 1220635906 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure is < 1220635909 0 :Mony!n=AssHole@AToulouse-258-1-41-67.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1220635917 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, however, llvm is rather large < 1220635925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the cause is that it is written in C++ < 1220635926 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not bloated < 1220635928 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's quite a difference < 1220635933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not something I would like on an embedded system < 1220635935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor GCC < 1220635941 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yea < 1220635946 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on an embedded system I would probably try something like PCC < 1220635946 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1220635947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1220635949 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can't just tweak a regular compiler for embeddedness < 1220635954 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's unsurprising < 1220635955 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hi Mony < 1220635959 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, PCC and/or TCC should work fine there < 1220635963 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220635968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TCC is x86 only though < 1220635970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so well.. < 1220636025 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: does this look ok in konqueror to you? http://eso-std.org/ < 1220636032 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the style i'm going to use for my blahhhg < 1220636038 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a screenshot would be appreciated < 1220636044 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although tbh i don't give a crap about konqueror, nobody uses it < 1220636048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, so you broke the real site? < 1220636059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, it looks better than in firefox < 1220636060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odd < 1220636068 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the real site had nothing there < 1220636073 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except a test post < 1220636083 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the default skin < 1220636088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, why is there an empty white box above the title and below the red bar? < 1220636089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in firefox < 1220636092 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not in konq < 1220636100 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: works in ff3, it's just that ff2 is broken < 1220636103 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the same bug IE has < 1220636110 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the white box is meant to stretch the whole page < 1220636113 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the posts are meant to be in the white box < 1220636119 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does konqueror not even show a white box at all? < 1220636125 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, i knew it was broken but dayum :) < 1220636131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, in ff2 all links are underlined, in konq they are underline on hover < 1220636133 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very strange < 1220636138 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not good for colour blind < 1220636138 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's a konqueror default < 1220636143 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ah ok < 1220636160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh clang finished compiling < 1220636161 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a screenshot in ff2&konqueror would be much appreciated, i don't have them to test with < 1220636192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, the red box around ESO have 90 deg corners in konq < 1220636196 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rounded ones in ff2 < 1220636201 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, but sure a sec < 1220636202 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: again, screenshot would you :P < 1220636204 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1220636211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, just will take a few minutes < 1220636215 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, sure < 1220636539 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ping < 1220636548 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, yes I said a few minutes... < 1220636560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :learn the virtue of patience < 1220636573 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you were 6 minutes. < 1220636574 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1220636857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, issue: < 1220636861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ ompload konq.png < 1220636862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Progress for 'konq.png' < 1220636862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :######################################################################## 100.0% < 1220636862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error omploading 'konq.png' < 1220636862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finished with 1 errors. < 1220636866 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1220636870 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: so use another image host < 1220636872 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not rocket science < 1220636878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what one? < 1220636883 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no login should be needed < 1220636884 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i generally use xs.to < 1220636887 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could use bayimg.com < 1220636898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, command line tool? < 1220636911 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: are you going to die to upload two f*cking images via a browser < 1220636923 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, indeed < 1220636950 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: why, exactly? What's the big deal? < 1220636960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, DCC enabled? < 1220636967 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1220636972 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://bayimg.com/ just upload it, sheesh < 1220636973 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forget it then < 1220636984 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1220636991 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck is the problem with clicking 'browse', selecting a file and clicking upload? < 1220637000 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you make such a goddamn fuss over having to use a GUI program? < 1220637006 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, give me a page that doesn't time out... < 1220637017 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both xs.to and bayimg.com fail? < 1220637021 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlikely... < 1220637023 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220637026 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How big is that file?! < 1220637029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same as a few other ones < 1220637031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird < 1220637037 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imageshack.us? < 1220637044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ du -bsh konq.png ff2.png < 1220637044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :209K konq.png < 1220637044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :206K ff2.png < 1220637050 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strange. < 1220637052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, hm I think my ISP got issues < 1220637057 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Likely. < 1220637071 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets see if DCC works < 1220637087 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Offering ff2.png to tusho < 1220637106 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes it did < 1220637111 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1220637114 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally broken, both of em < 1220637115 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1220637119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, oh? < 1220637122 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, hope you fix that then < 1220637132 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: can't be arsed, it's for my personal blog < 1220637141 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works in firefox 3 & ie 6/7 < 1220637148 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'll make up, uh, all of my traffic. < 1220637149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, opera? < 1220637152 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yep < 1220637153 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have opera btw < 1220637154 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :safari too < 1220637157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, chrome? < 1220637167 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no reason why it shouldn't, it's based on webkit like safari < 1220637175 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, lynx? < 1220637178 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes :) < 1220637180 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the markup is very lean < 1220637183 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be very nice in lynx < 1220637194 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well it works in ff2 and konq too, just not the CSS bit < 1220637199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that doesn't work in lynx either < 1220637204 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shush :P < 1220637228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, doesn't work well in lynx < 1220637232 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: why not < 1220637234 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works fine for me < 1220637238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# ESO < 1220637238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : #Feed < 1220637238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1220637238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ESO < 1220637243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is what it looks like at the top < 1220637256 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the problem... < 1220637263 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :page title, the elements, then the h1 < 1220637264 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, it seems strange < 1220637266 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how lynx displays things, < 1220637277 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :want another screenshot?... < 1220637282 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i have lynx here < 1220637285 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is it's correct. < 1220637296 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#Feed is from the element to the atom feed in my < 1220637301 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second ESO is from the

< 1220637301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1220637305 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first one is from the < 1220637327 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: anyway, firefox's problem there is that that white thing should stretch down to the bottom of the page < 1220637330 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the posts should be contained within it < 1220637344 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, and konq 3.x problem? < 1220637355 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: exactly the same except it lacks the white box altogether... < 1220637361 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever :p < 1220637367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, and got non-rounded corners for the red thing < 1220637370 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you look around ESO < 1220637376 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yea, but only firefox and webkit support those < 1220637380 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, gecko and webkit < 1220637392 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, so it is a non-standard CSS bit? < 1220637392 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-moz-border-radius-bottomleft: 5px; < 1220637392 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -webkit-border-bottom-left-radius: 5px; -moz-border-radius-bottomright: 5px; < 1220637392 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -webkit-border-bottom-right-radius: 5px; < 1220637396 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's in CSS3 < 1220637397 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as border-radius < 1220637405 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nothing implements it apart from gecko and webkit < 1220637408 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since it isn't standard yet < 1220637413 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they use the standard CSS method for unstandard things < 1220637416 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-vendor-property < 1220637424 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they disagree a bit on how to do things like 'bottom left', though < 1220637440 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, it's not-yet-standard CSS because css3 isn't final yet < 1220637461 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, the problem with firefox 2 and konqueror is that they don't let you apply styling to unrecognized elements < 1220637464 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a bug bug bug bug bug bug < 1220637466 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and entirely their fault < 1220637476 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i use HTML5 elements like <article> and such) < 1220637494 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IE6/7 has the same bug but a tiny piece of JS fixes it < 1220637495 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, they don't claim to support HTML5 I guess < 1220637502 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's not to do with that < 1220637507 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they should let you style <asdasdad> < 1220637510 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's how css works < 1220637516 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is an actual bug on their part < 1220637517 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you used XML + your own XML Schema I guess it would work? < 1220637521 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220637523 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's still a bug < 1220637538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well add a custom XML schema for it? < 1220637545 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure that works < 1220637551 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want my pages to be xhtml, can you remember the huge rant in #ESO? < 1220637556 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe I have stated my cause very well < 1220637562 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the people working on html5 100% agree with me too < 1220637581 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, so where in the html5 file does it say anything about what version of HTML it is? < 1220637586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a doctype? < 1220637587 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<!DOCTYPE html> < 1220637593 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doctype is html5-specific < 1220637593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, html5? < 1220637596 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :html6? < 1220637597 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the pre-html5 ones look like this < 1220637604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I know what they look like < 1220637604 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<!DOCTYPE html "-//W3C//dicks dicks butts"> < 1220637607 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however... < 1220637611 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: however, you're wrong < 1220637613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you know what html version < 1220637615 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as browsers ignore the doctype < 1220637619 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from quirks mode vs standards mode < 1220637625 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't actually listen to what version you put in there < 1220637626 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, what about future html6 version? < 1220637631 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: <!DOCTYPE html> < 1220637643 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, so if there were any breaking changes stuff would go pretty bad? < 1220637648 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it does anyway < 1220637652 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :browsers ignore whatever html version you specify < 1220637656 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they use the doctype to determine: < 1220637661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, you mean the major ones do? < 1220637673 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. whether you actually have one (quirks mode vs standards mode) < 1220637678 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's it < 1220637679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't prevent some potential browser from caring about it < 1220637685 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: such a browser would be useless < 1220637690 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, why? < 1220637693 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as the number of broken webpages would be sky-high with it < 1220637707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, it could have a quirks mode as well < 1220637713 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the web is shit, people put shit that contradicts other shit in their shit, and as a browser maker you have to bend over, take it, and add a metric fuckton of hacks to make them work < 1220637719 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's lame but it's true < 1220637735 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: btw - http://annevankesteren.nl/2005/07/html5-doctype < 1220637736 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more reading < 1220639025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, hey! < 1220639029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge compiles with clang < 1220639033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but doesn't link < 1220639037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless I comment out: < 1220639039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signal(SIGPIPE, SIG_IGN); < 1220639041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in main() < 1220639045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty strange < 1220639047 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kay < 1220639048 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1220639054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from that, which I suspect is a LLVM or clang bug, it works < 1220639738 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, found the issue, it clang claims to be GCC by defining __GNUC__, so that exposes some inline asm in a system header... which then clang fails horribly at < 1220639753 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I can see why they claim to be gcc < 1220639754 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even going to bother with reporting a bug < 1220639756 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tons of stuff dies out without it < 1220639761 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they are liars < 1220639763 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really < 1220639766 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that put me off < 1220639768 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*lol* < 1220639780 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: your browser sends a user agent that lies < 1220639785 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and covers up its lie with (compatible; < 1220639788 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gonna stop using that? < 1220639789 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what < 1220639790 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, yes I hate that as much < 1220639792 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does it SO THINGS WORK < 1220639800 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you'd prefer it if everything was broken, huh < 1220639801 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like it either < 1220639811 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I prefer avoiding lies < 1220639814 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOLLLLLLLLL < 1220639827 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has a point < 1220639834 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, the issue is crap that does #ifdef __GNUC__ < 1220639845 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: but he's not going to report a bug because they're DIRTY LIARS < 1220639851 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is ridiculous < 1220639863 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, somewhat. < 1220639875 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :evil, malicious, dirty, conniving LIARS < 1220639878 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they probably lie to everyone < 1220639889 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would he deal with such sleazy folk < 1220640258 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't report a bug either < 1220640270 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: no but you wouldn't report it anyway < 1220640271 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for other reasons < 1220640274 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1220640277 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas AnMaster has stated that the reason is because "they're liars" < 1220640298 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't mind weird reasons < 1220640309 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now to watch stuff -> < 1220640676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Deewiant> really, the issue is crap that does #ifdef __GNUC__ < 1220640722 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well yes, ICC does it too, but at least ICC 1) doesn't fail at it 2) got an option to turn that off (-no-gcc). Though I would prefer if it defaulted to off rather than on < 1220640725 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, so file a bug with glibc :-) < 1220640738 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, as for 1) clang is beta < 1220640773 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, indeed. but they want me to try to create a minimal test case not including any system headers.. well as far as I can see it is a preprocessor issue < 1220640778 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as for preference, again, too much stupid stuff does #ifdef __GNUC__ < 1220640802 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's really irritating to define __GNUC__ if you don't implement GNU C... Stuff that dies without __GNUC__ defined doesn't *deserve* to compile. < 1220640828 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, like glibc. < 1220640845 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the linux kernel. < 1220640859 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought glibc was fairly explicitly designed to not need __GNUC__. < 1220640874 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"look at Tiny C Compiler development list for workaround they had to put up with to use glibc headers. (TCC refuses to define __GNUC__, but what a pain it causes.)" < 1220640880 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(found via google) < 1220640892 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so quite evidently not < 1220640895 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as the Linux kernel goes, yeah; why, exactly, *do* they decide to only work with GCC? < 1220640922 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bleck. < 1220640927 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because they decided to use C for speed, which makes sense, but C is such a crap language that they want to use the GNU extensions, which also makes sense. :-P < 1220640959 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glibc has absolutely no excuse. < 1220640971 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup < 1220640983 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The GNU coding standards fairly explicitly require cross-UNIX compatibility. < 1220640984 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: exactly so it's better to support it < 1220640993 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that it makes them DIRTY SLEAZY LIARS < 1220640995 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right AnMaster < 1220641067 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, no compilers I have can optimize "switch (foo) { case bar: stuff; break; default; assert (0); }" to "stuff;" :-( < 1220641182 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=nice@HSI-KBW-091-089-028-216.hsi2.kabelbw.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1220641194 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<pikhq> It's really irritating to define __GNUC__ if you don't implement GNU C... Stuff that dies without __GNUC__ defined doesn't *deserve* to compile. < 1220641199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well my stuff doesn't < 1220641212 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. < 1220641224 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however it is a lot worse that compilers die when they define __GNUC__ and then get some weird stuff from system headers < 1220641233 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like: what do you expect? < 1220641245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the compiler authors only got themselves to blame < 1220641249 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's beta, so expect nothing. < 1220641270 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course they're going to do something about it given that it's /glibc/ < 1220641271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, as for TCC, it works almost fine on cfunge < 1220641283 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: and they'd get it done faster < 1220641283 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there seems to be one single C99 construct that cfunge uses that TCC can't handle < 1220641285 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if AnMaster reported a bug. < 1220641286 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for (int i... < 1220641287 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but he won't < 1220641289 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they're LIARS < 1220641295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I plan to < 1220641300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once my mail is working again < 1220641301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for TCC < 1220641306 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ah, so you like sleazy liars now < 1220641308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they ask you to use their mailing list < 1220641311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, no TCC < 1220641317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read what the heck I said < 1220641324 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was talking to Deewiant < 1220641335 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you win the reading comprehension prize < 1220641339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<tusho> AnMaster: ah, so you like sleazy liars now < 1220641340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1220641341 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure? < 1220641344 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure it was to Deewiant < 1220641345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to me < 1220641350 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or why did you mention my nick < 1220641351 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. yes it was < 1220641355 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: please read properly < 1220641357 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mentioned TCC < 1220641359 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I was talking to Deewiant < 1220641360 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about you < 1220641363 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and clang < 1220641369 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1220641383 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how they'd fix the bug quicker if it were to be, you know, reported. < 1220641391 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, and well it is not because they are liars, but well they are too. but because they only got themselves to blame < 1220641391 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you won't, because they're "liars" < 1220641395 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if they claim to be another compiler < 1220641398 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and can't handle that < 1220641406 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: so tell them and let them fucking fix it < 1220641417 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it COMPILER EAT COMPILER EVERY COMPILER FOR HIMSELF < 1220641594 0 :Tritonio_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1220641866 0 :Tritonio_!n=tritonio@150.140.226.169 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220642205 0 :GreyKnight!n=wheel@5ad0b3f3.bb.sky.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1220642244 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahhh, that explains it < 1220642273 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got a memo from some randomer asking me to come back here, I guess the addition of ancient logs to the /topic has something to do with it :-) < 1220643139 0 :CO2Games!n=CO2Games@75-173-251-127.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1220643149 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1220643165 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, if I knew who you were, that'd be great. :p < 1220643313 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who? < 1220643353 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight. < 1220643358 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot ? < 1220643359 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mony: !"BF!"100[1-$][['<]['>]['+]['-]['.][',][91][93]8CHOOSE;!,]# < 1220643368 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1220643567 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is just zis guy, you know? < 1220643632 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wo < 1220643633 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w < 1220643634 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight < 1220643636 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you got my memo? < 1220643637 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1220643656 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's a guy from a september 06 log i read a while back! < 1220643658 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is cool. < 1220643664 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think. :p < 1220643675 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless someone else is memoing people demanding their return < 1220643677 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would be strange < 1220643690 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and pikhq, i seem to remember you talking to him in the log :P < 1220643731 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: here http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/06.09.02 < 1220643735 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<tusho> [GreyKnight] is cool. <-- wooo critical acclaim < 1220643753 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is the wacky world of esoterica these days, anyway < 1220643754 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight: rated 5 out of 5 by irc magazine! < 1220643761 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ... pretty much the same, i think. < 1220643815 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1220643817 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1220643824 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Odd; I think I was around in '06. < 1220643837 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I join in '05 or '06? < 1220643841 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrug* < 1220643842 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/06.09.02 has you in it < 1220643851 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is the log i read with GreyKnight in it :P < 1220643858 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight: oh, as for why I saw that particular log < 1220643860 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guess I just forgot Sir Grey. < 1220643868 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our bot here (say hi optbot) < 1220643868 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I might add <ii (reminiscent of html's "ISINDEX") for a form with just a text field, a submit button and optionally a prompt :P < 1220643879 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :- spews out random quotes from the entire backlog of esoteric < 1220643880 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot! < 1220643881 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | Sure it does. < 1220643885 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and keeps our topic interesting. < 1220643893 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw a quote that interested me, so I grepped for it and found that log. < 1220643898 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ended up reading it. ~fin~ < 1220643960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is GreyKnight ? < 1220643966 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I seen the nick before somewhere < 1220643991 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you really are good at asking a question that we've just discussed and answered... < 1220643995 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is from this log http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/06.09.02 < 1220643999 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/06.09.01 and http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/06.09.02 < 1220644015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I'm on a PDA atm, connecting to the bnc, I don't have a lot of scrollback... < 1220644024 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you only need like 10 lines of scrollbar < 1220644027 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*scrollback < 1220644029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 lines is what I have < 1220644050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, issue is I just connected at "<tusho> GreyKnight: oh, as for why I saw that particular log" < 1220644056 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1220644057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so ... < 1220644099 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi AnMaster, I am just zis guy < 1220644104 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there :-) < 1220644108 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1220644159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok off again, should be back to normal computer soon < 1220644299 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok back on desktop < 1220644303 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads scrollback < 1220644318 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Agh I can't get my brainfuck interpreter to work < 1220644322 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right, that explains it < 1220644332 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, what is the issue? < 1220644350 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1220644356 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure yet < 1220644386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the way I recently came up with a new (I think) way of optimising bf < 1220644390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how to implement it < 1220644392 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically < 1220644406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after a [-] you can know you hit 0. Right? < 1220644436 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see bf is still popular these days, then < 1220644439 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if that isn't directly followed by any unbalanced loops or such < 1220644460 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I'm not sure [-] would do that in all cases < 1220644461 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could optimise away [-]>>++++<<+ to set *one* instead < 1220644462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to begin with < 1220644471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even more complex < 1220644474 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight: it shall always be... < 1220644476 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(unfortunately) < 1220644486 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: trivial optimization < 1220644487 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything does it :P < 1220644501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact apart from in unbalanced loops (as in different > and < count) you could optimise about everything to set constants or add fixed numbers < 1220644508 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relative current pointer < 1220644512 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a problem with the brainfuck interpreter I'm writing < 1220644520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you could do loop renumbering < 1220644523 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's parsing everything wrong < 1220644526 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even partly in unbalanced loops < 1220644553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[+>>--<+>-<<-<] < 1220644557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is unbalanced < 1220644559 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however < 1220644575 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[+>+>---<<-<] < 1220644577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then < 1220644592 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[+->+>---<<<] < 1220644596 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and one more step < 1220644597 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh I wrote my first brainfuck program < 1220644604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to remove the first +- < 1220644618 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seen it done for balanced loops < 1220644623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but never for unbalanced ones < 1220644625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ? < 1220644630 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes < 1220644634 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tons of stuff does that < 1220644639 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see bf4.c or whatever < 1220644641 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by that mazonka guy < 1220644648 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1220644662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, my other idea: Befunge: you could probably JIT it < 1220644675 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though not compile it < 1220644682 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least not by any reasonable way < 1220644683 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220644685 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :already done < 1220644688 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see befunge wiki page < 1220644689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, link? < 1220644714 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, can't find the word JIT there? < 1220644723 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is more to reading than ctrl-f < 1220644742 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The bf2c compiler included with the standard Befunge-93 distribution uses threaded code: each instruction is compiled to a snippet of C code, and control flows through the snippets just as it does in a Befunge interpreter (that is, conditionally on the value of some 'direction' register.) This does not result in a significant advantage over a good interpreter." < 1220644747 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :threaded code != JIT < 1220644751 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite different < 1220644767 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also "Note that the bf2c compiler is not correct since it does not handle p correctly, but it would not be impossible to make it do so (although the C language might not be well-suited for this.)" < 1220644790 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Betty I can't find a link to < 1220644790 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: how about actually reading < 1220644791 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... < 1220644793 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Betty. < 1220644797 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and who cares about the link < 1220644800 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still been done < 1220644807 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, someone says that < 1220644824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is not JIT really for B98 < 1220644824 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, evidently they are lying to suppress your ideas. < 1220644827 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only for 93 < 1220644832 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? < 1220644834 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hard bit is g and p. < 1220644836 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the directions < 1220644841 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both 93 and 98 have that < 1220644850 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, betty only handles cardinal directions < 1220644853 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not flying ips < 1220644859 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? it's not a hard extension < 1220644871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because in befunge 98 you can set delta to, say, 5,3 or whatever < 1220644923 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes and? < 1220644957 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well pre-compiling lines may not be that useful then < 1220644972 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so pre-compile instructions < 1220644975 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, anyway the real challenge would be actually compiling it < 1220644983 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really. < 1220644993 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just compile the instruction and a switch based on the direction < 1220644994 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much < 1220644995 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, to self modifying asm I guess < 1220645001 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220645011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, and if the instruction changes? using p < 1220645017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you need to self modify it < 1220645021 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then recompile it and mov it into place < 1220645025 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :betty did this, obviously < 1220645028 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since its the only way < 1220645040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, it could use some JIT framework to do it... < 1220645046 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? < 1220645049 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same code < 1220645054 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just pre-written < 1220645103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it should be possible to make some patological thing like <bytes for longest instruction><jump handler>, to actually use a 25*80*sizeof(celloverhead) < 1220645175 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think what we *really* need is some novel languages :-p < 1220645178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would basically be place for longest instructions (fill rest with nops) + a direction handler < 1220645190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, like ais523's Feather? < 1220645206 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems rather cool < 1220645217 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any linkage? < 1220645223 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know that one < 1220645228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, considering the *grammar* is self modifiable using time jumps < 1220645236 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can rewrite it to be a different language < 1220645247 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lisptastic :-) < 1220645250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would cause a time jump and reinterpreting the whole thing iirc < 1220645282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, well no links, since ais523 have been unable to write up specs or implementation so far < 1220645289 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't yet manage to figure out all the details < 1220645302 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh btw he is the C-INTERCAL maintainer so I'm sure he will manage it :P < 1220645306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sooner or later < 1220645327 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good credentials then :-) < 1220645371 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, the fact that it involve time jumps make it extra interesting < 1220645393 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rewinding the execution timeline and so on? < 1220645400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well more than that iirc < 1220645401 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, can it jump forwards in time too? < 1220645409 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever seen TRDS in Befunge-98? < 1220645415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only two implementations have it < 1220645426 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never got into befunge or brainf*** < 1220645436 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they implement it differently and neither implementer knows who's wrong and about what ;-) < 1220645441 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RC/Funge (author invented it), CCBI (author implemented it and found RC/Funge's one didn't work) < 1220645452 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it is complex < 1220645459 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :extremely complex < 1220645467 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since then, RC/Funge fixed its, but differently to CCBI, and now they're different in an unknown way :-P < 1220645472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that is why I won't implement it in cfunge < 1220645475 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good, "complex" keeps us in business ;-) < 1220645480 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ah yes forgot that < 1220645494 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, http://www.rcfunge98.com/rcfunge_manual.html#TRDS < 1220645497 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :may be of interest < 1220645516 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :appears to be a blank page < 1220645532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, hm.. worked a second ago... < 1220645532 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o rcfunge98.com is down < 1220645548 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :welp, google cache probably has it < 1220645554 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and Deewiant develops ccbi < 1220645558 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not < 1220645559 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since nobody seems to have mentioned that :P < 1220645570 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant :-P < 1220645586 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and dbc is daniel b cristofani, but i think he was here in '06 too < 1220645599 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:gFspwyCbPjkJ:www.elf-emulation.com/funge/rcfunge_manual.html+rc/funge&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2 < 1220645602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there < 1220645639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, lets just hope it doesn't last long now < 1220645666 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, I just got NULL to work in CCBI 2 < 1220645681 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that's a good point to stop hacking for today < 1220645698 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you know NULL and ROMA are easy :P < 1220645716 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1220645726 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course the actual work there was writing the fingerprints framework, not NULL :-P < 1220645737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ah yes I can see < 1220645739 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ccbi2?! < 1220645744 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, does ROMA work too? < 1220645746 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait. Deewiant is doing work? < 1220645756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, his posix_fadvice version ;) < 1220645756 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: cleanup/rewrite < 1220645759 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ducks < 1220645768 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: why are you doing work man < 1220645770 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, only NULL now :-P < 1220645777 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: why not < 1220645781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so loading more than one fingerprint doesn't work yet? < 1220645784 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1220645789 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to test overloading < 1220645792 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, I've just only implemented NULL < 1220645801 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and figured I'd stop for today < 1220645805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ah well < 1220645808 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not like it'd take long to get ROMA, MODU, etc < 1220645837 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, cathedral style development? Or finally going open bazaar style? ;) < 1220645841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs < 1220645890 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ho ho AnMaster < 1220645891 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't be bothered to generate dev snapshots and I'm not sure it makes sense to run a static HTML mercurial repo < 1220645893 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your cutting wit! < 1220645912 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(since I don't have the option of running a proper mercurial server) < 1220645916 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every piece of bugging zealotism becomes a joke if you add /me runs after it < 1220645923 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: KILL JEWS < 1220645923 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what about going to, say, darcs? < 1220645924 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs < 1220645929 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and since I don't want to run on hgweb or some other site which ain't mine) < 1220645939 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: say, because darcs sucks :-P < 1220645949 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ah good point... < 1220645958 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, some people like it < 1220645966 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if I looked into it properly I'd like it too < 1220645970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like some of it's features certainly < 1220645975 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what < 1220645976 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the cherry picking < 1220646005 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very useful when you want to backport some changes to a stable branch for example < 1220646023 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a matter of your workflow < 1220646045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hm? I need to back/forward port bugfixes randomly < 1220646046 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with git, I guess the idea is that you make a new local branch (or what are they called) for each individual change < 1220646059 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"And then-" < 1220646064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, don't think that will help for that < 1220646067 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then if you need to pull a change to a stable branch you just pull from the change's branch < 1220646069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they would have diverged < 1220646076 0 :tusho!n=tusho@91.105.98.27 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220646084 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you would need to pull in other changes from said branch that came from the main branch < 1220646084 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Yup. Topic branches. One branch per change (where change can span multiple commits)... < 1220646087 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, of course in the cherry-pick case you also have to merge them :-P < 1220646087 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I can see < 1220646113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, where would you branch it from? < 1220646115 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see the advantage of cherry-pick in that case, you need to merge the changes in any case < 1220646118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trunk? < 1220646123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or stable? < 1220646127 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either, I guess < 1220646128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a bug fix that needs to go into both < 1220646135 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's smarter to branch from stable in that case < 1220646136 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nitpiking, merge the branch, pulling branch impiles also fetching it... < 1220646179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well wouldn't merging the changes from that topic branch require any changes missing from the target of the merge, and that came from previous branches < 1220646180 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1220646194 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rev 50: branch off stable < 1220646213 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rev 70 (trunk): branch of bug fix branch xxx < 1220646220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :find you need to merge it into stable too < 1220646233 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: At least git.git itself commits more critical bugfixes to mainintance branch and then merges mainintance branch into development (and then merges development branch into less stable development branch). < 1220646235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't that require merging any changes between 50 and 70? If not < 1220646243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If not then it is cherry picking < 1220646248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it needs that: useless < 1220646256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, can you clarify that? < 1220646282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you didn't know the bug fix was needed for stable < 1220646284 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until later < 1220646314 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe some other developer made it against trunk, and didn't know about stable needed it, he not being a stable maintainer < 1220646321 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yourself being that < 1220646336 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, so tell me how that works out < 1220646337 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1220646337 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what about cherry-picking a bugfix change from trunk, how is it different < 1220646348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<AnMaster> wouldn't that require merging any changes between 50 and 70? If not < 1220646349 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<AnMaster> If not then it is cherry picking < 1220646349 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<AnMaster> if it needs that: useless < 1220646350 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that ^ < 1220646364 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not cherry picking in that case < 1220646364 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing is, the version control system should be able to keep track of it < 1220646379 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ? < 1220646382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you mean? < 1220646400 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cherry picking is, take these X changes from branch foo and put them in branch bar < 1220646417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yep < 1220646419 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with topic branches, you've just manually put some of the X changes in another branch < 1220646431 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then it's merge from branch baz to bar < 1220646451 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes... but merge would require merging any other changes from that branch < 1220646452 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that's my understanding of it anyway, Ilari might be able to correct if I get something wrong < 1220646456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I said < 1220646461 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<AnMaster> rev 50: branch off stable < 1220646461 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<AnMaster> rev 70 (trunk): branch of bug fix branch xxx < 1220646463 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: and of course, merge does that, just like a normal merge < 1220646477 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so that means changes from *trunk* between 50 and 70 < 1220646490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can skip them, then it is cherry picking < 1220646501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they are part of the feature branch's history < 1220646559 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if you can skip them, I haven't done much branching myself let alone messing with git enough to know if it has an option for this :-) < 1220646571 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even if you can, I wouldn't call it cherry picking < 1220646575 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a subset of cherry picking, maybe < 1220646590 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you notice that the bugfix is also needed for stable, maybe rebase the bugfix branch? < 1220646611 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, rebase :-P < 1220646618 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah eww at rebase < 1220646621 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense though < 1220646623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is why I prefer cherry picking < 1220646739 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you're screwed in that case if you've already published the bugfix branch < 1220646749 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not sure if that's something you should be doing in any case < 1220646862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if you another developer did it, and you, the maintainer notice it < 1220646881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the original developer (who doesn't have commit access to the official trunk) < 1220646887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then well... what? < 1220646901 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, "shouldn't be doing" still? < 1220646931 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like said, I don't know if topic branches should be published < 1220646970 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not, the original developer shouldn't have and thus hasn't done it, thus he can rebase it and it can be applied to stable < 1220646979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how else should a non-core developer, say Mr. Random Programmer using your project who wants to help contribute a fix. And you notice it applies to stable too, which Mr Random Programmer doesn't use < 1220647001 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he branches your project < 1220647006 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he makes a topic branch for the change < 1220647012 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yes, and don't care about stable < 1220647016 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he pulls the changes from the topic branch into his main branch < 1220647024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I certainly would only look at the part I use < 1220647027 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he pushes or somebody pulls into the devel branch < 1220647031 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you come along < 1220647036 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you ask him to rebase his topic branch < 1220647043 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he does so < 1220647051 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you pull from his topic branch into the stable branch < 1220647054 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something. < 1220647057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hum < 1220647071 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I think cherrypicking is a cleaner approach < 1220647080 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that doesn't prevent the invariant of commits < 1220647089 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like said it's a matter of your workflow < 1220647091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMO commits can not be changed once done < 1220647098 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some sense I think cherrypicking is uglier < 1220647099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are not mutable < 1220647106 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you don't get any separation of changesets < 1220647112 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rebase implies that your commits are mutable < 1220647114 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with topic branches, each branch is its own unit < 1220647127 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, topic branches and cherry picking then < 1220647141 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's fine < 1220647143 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1220647146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but making history mutable < 1220647149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is way way worse < 1220647162 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it goes against the core principle < 1220647163 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think making private history mutable is fine < 1220647175 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, according to the wiki, the 2006 Esolang Contest is *still* going :-D < 1220647183 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that shouldn't amuse me as much as it does < 1220647276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never heard of that contest < 1220647286 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, for me it isn't. < 1220647298 0 :vendetta!n=vendetta@78.176.229.1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220647300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway my workflow isn't topic branches really < 1220647320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not unless they are big changes < 1220647323 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember it from the last time I was here :-) < 1220647338 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess everyone just forget it? < 1220647339 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yeah, I think it's a git thing < 1220647342 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight: That's because judging has yet to finish. ;p < 1220647356 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the judges hasn't been seen for months. < 1220647367 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When did Sukoshi last show up? February? < 1220647382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I make topic branches when I change major core stuff. Like when I last rewrote the entire funge-space code < 1220647389 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was a few months ago < 1220647394 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to clean up a lot of memleaks < 1220647401 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :had to change the whole idea behind it < 1220647408 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: if he can make it through until January then it will be a three-year contest, maybe? :-) < 1220647417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually probably May or even April < 1220647425 0 :vendetta!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1220647476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she. < 1220647520 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-60-96.A163.priv.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1220647562 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he/she/it/they < 1220647604 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sukoshi is a she. < 1220647709 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you implied that already? < 1220647981 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i should make an entry for the competition. < 1220647984 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's time < 1220648089 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woot < 1220648097 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My brainfuck interpreter works < 1220648108 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now to make it into drainfuck < 1220648108 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight: you made that mistake in 2006 < 1220648115 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you discussed the shorthand english < 1220648116 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with sukoshi < 1220648119 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sukoshi=razor-x) < 1220648161 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, most IRC clients don't have CTCP GENDER, so I just use "he" as a generic pronoun like normal < 1220648186 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rarely important in discussions about esoteric programming what the gender of your co-conversationalist is anyway :-P < 1220648510 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, drainfukc? < 1220648512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck* < 1220648521 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, also have you triest lostking under it? < 1220648528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because if that doesn't work it is probably buggy < 1220648537 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1220648538 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uhh < 1220648543 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many cells does it need? < 1220648560 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the data tape < 1220648581 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how many commands does it contain < 1220648612 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: it's 2mb big < 1220648645 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many command characters does it contain? < 1220648666 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 megabytes worth < 1220648678 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how many characters is that < 1220648714 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who wrote it < 1220648741 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well my echo program worked < 1220648759 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it uses all the commands < 1220648791 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ ] > < - + , . < 1220648797 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, does it use several levels of nested loops? < 1220648804 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1220648806 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1220648816 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that could be buggy < 1220648817 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh...I...get what you mean < 1220648831 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah it doesn't support nested loops yet... < 1220648843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://jonripley.com/i-fiction/games/LostKingdomBF.html < 1220648849 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the link anyway < 1220648863 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, and you say you don't know how much 2 MB's of chars are? < 1220648870 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it doesn't support nested loops, it's not turing complete. < 1220648875 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you never coded C I bet < 1220648881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you did, you would have known < 1220648887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, indeed < 1220648892 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: You gain +5 Holier Than Thou < 1220648898 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ding-ding-ding-ding! Level up. < 1220648900 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, hm? < 1220648911 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most PEBBLE-compiled code wouldn't work in it. < 1220648916 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ? < 1220648922 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: I think it just *barely* works in the 30,000 cell limit. < 1220648950 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, in fact everything except trivial programs will need nested loops < 1220648953 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :30,000...hmm < 1220648963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, how many memory cells? < 1220648983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh btw how goes Def-BF? < 1220649002 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok so I can't do this < 1220649014 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't do what? < 1220649020 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1,024,000 code pieces is too much for my interpreter < 1220649026 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's only half < 1220649032 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No work on Def-BF. Busy. < 1220649033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, well why is that? < 1220649035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :malloc() < 1220649039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't use a static array < 1220649040 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehh < 1220649057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, ok < 1220649059 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use a static array to ensure that I can always reach a place via pointers < 1220649065 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1220649075 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not c pointers < 1220649081 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean brainfuck < 1220649091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you still make no sense < 1220649095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: What language are you writing this in? < 1220649096 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here... < 1220649098 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C++ < 1220649105 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and? < 1220649107 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can change it easily enough < 1220649107 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1220649111 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways... < 1220649123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean you got to support large programs < 1220649132 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a system for jumps and absolute pointer-movements < 1220649139 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not hard in C++; just store the large program in a vector... < 1220649156 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works as an array and I don't want to break that < 1220649170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, any interpreter or compiler that can't handle lostkingdom is not worth the files it was written in ;) < 1220649176 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, it is the ultimate test < 1220649187 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's my first interpreter < 1220649190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone have to succeed at it < 1220649192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? < 1220649197 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever < 1220649201 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, my first was in *bash* think of that < 1220649206 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was my first ever < 1220649208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was slow < 1220649210 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1220649215 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but handled lostkingdom < 1220649228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly it took about 5 minutes to *parse* lostkingdom < 1220649229 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can add support by changing the shorts to longs < 1220649237 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that was even using awk to optimise it at string leve < 1220649238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :level* < 1220649241 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to a bytecode < 1220649247 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it sitll handled it < 1220649249 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: good for you, now you can design your second: the rewrite of the first :-D < 1220649256 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1220649258 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not done yet < 1220649262 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, um all cells are 8 bits < 1220649265 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wrap < 1220649270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsigned chars < 1220649274 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in mine < 1220649281 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine is signed shorts that don't wrap < 1220649285 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not defined < 1220649287 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, if the memory cells aren't then it won't run lostking < 1220649288 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's unspecified < 1220649293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just fyi < 1220649304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well lostkingdom won't work then < 1220649306 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can let it wrap < 1220649309 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, make them unsigned chars. < 1220649315 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No not yet < 1220649319 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? no < 1220649320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, why not? < 1220649330 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is drainfuck < 1220649333 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not brainfuck < 1220649336 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drainfuck? < 1220649342 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ever looked at Def-BF then? < 1220649345 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's my little derived thingy < 1220649347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be useful for you < 1220649358 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it have pointers < 1220649360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and such < 1220649363 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has more than just a pointer thinh < 1220649376 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, it Def-BF is meant to be able to write a kernel in < 1220649384 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1220649387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the high level code got functions < 1220649391 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask pikhq for links to specs < 1220649394 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Noooooo < 1220649399 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, I wrote a low level implementation < 1220649404 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want my own language < 1220649404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to handle the pre-processed code < 1220649405 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the real question is why "lostkingdom" relies on unspecified behaviour ;-o < 1220649410 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no one ever wrote the high level part yet < 1220649423 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, because everyone does it that way? < 1220649429 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: You should invent a nice new one! BF clones are ten-a-penny. < 1220649445 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, oh yes there are lots < 1220649449 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: so standardise it :-P < 1220649449 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah I want something like brainfuck < 1220649455 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight: It's unspecified but de-facto behavior. < 1220649459 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm keeping the standard functions, mostly. < 1220649471 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm adding a static variable you can access < 1220649485 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, and apart from Def-BF and Boolfuck, they are just really stuff like "map ook to >, eek to >" or whatever (oh that variant is called "Ook!" iirc) < 1220649503 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, to copy a cell, ^ then move over to the destination cell and V < 1220649508 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: And Dimensifuck? < 1220649517 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, haven't heard of that one I think? < 1220649523 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait is that the several tapes one? < 1220649523 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's one I devised. < 1220649524 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then yes < 1220649533 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not the one with several tapes. < 1220649535 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it is one of the actually interesting ones < 1220649540 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The code itself is in N dimensions. < 1220649542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh how does it differ then? < 1220649558 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that's called befunge/trefunge/n-funge :P < 1220649569 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact lost kingdom won't run on drainfuck because it has to be prepended with drainfuck:: at the start of the source < 1220649570 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is unefunge too < 1220649577 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@i-179.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1220649577 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, though it's vaguely inspired by the funges. < 1220649589 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 dimensional "Hello, world!". < 1220649590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1220649595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drainfuck:: <-- huh. why double : ? < 1220649601 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Idk < 1220649609 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just looked cool to me < 1220649624 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it has to be lowercase < 1220649631 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the moment, that is < 1220649635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, well try it with unsigned char to make sure lostkingdom works, so you get all the details like nested loops and so on < 1220649637 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then change it < 1220649652 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No no, I'm going to stay with this < 1220649659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, got a link to that? < 1220649679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, k, so the nested loops probably are broken < 1220649679 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You see, the cell count and the maximum value per cell is only one off < 1220649691 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll fix the nested loops < 1220649694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lostkingdom is the best test suite for bf there is < 1220649702 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a final test < 1220649704 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But this isn't brainfuck < 1220649706 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's drainfuck < 1220649718 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't follow all of brainfuck's standards < 1220649719 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, doesn't mean the same bugs couldn't show up < 1220649730 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Dimensifuck < 1220649752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you should make an opengl based editor with sound effects for it ;) < 1220649753 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Drainfuck < 1220649795 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So far I have E, ^, and V coded, but none of them are tested < 1220649811 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, oh yes there is one for some semi-funge one btw. BeQunge or something like that, B93 + extra dimensions + not limited to 25x80. And buggy < 1220649813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very buggy < 1220649823 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHAHAHHAHA < 1220649824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however not a bad idea < 1220649826 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah will love this < 1220649830 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Melab is one of the esco crew < 1220649835 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes and removes all their links again < 1220649842 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, "melab"? < 1220649854 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: an esowiki user who added tons of unfinished languages and weird categories, etc < 1220649860 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has now added back all the esco links into pages < 1220649928 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So lost kingdom uses wrapping? < 1220649957 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, esco, sounds familiar, iirc silly idea + crappy implementation < 1220649963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, iirc yes < 1220649966 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit < 1220649969 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1220649973 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it tries to implement all esoteric languages in one shitty c++ program < 1220649978 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, cell wrapping < 1220649984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, as in integer overflow < 1220649986 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are unintentionally hilarious < 1220649992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not < and > wrapping < 1220649992 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They say: "Byter is a language for training your brain" < 1220649994 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's actually < 1220649994 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't work < 1220649997 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Byter is a language for training brains" < 1220649999 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1220650025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, eh.... < 1220650027 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh* < 1220650044 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yea they added links to themselves to every esolang article they support < 1220650049 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i get to have fun with REMOVING THEM ALL! < 1220650049 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1220650053 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :already done, actually < 1220650111 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1220650112 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2 you probably don't mean "next" and "previous". < 1220650128 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah that's what the interpreter does atm. < 1220650135 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah :) < 1220650147 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasn't thinking about nested stuff < 1220650175 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But now that I think about it...ooops. < 1220650240 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to check for the other markers and increment a counter if it encounters one of itself, decrementing when it meets an opposite and only when the counter is 0 should it accept an opposite as its own < 1220650261 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, lost kingdom would probably be shit if I got it to work on drainfuck < 1220650278 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drainfuck doesn't 'stream' the code right out of the file < 1220650286 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It parses it into the code tape < 1220650307 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The interpreter uses three tapes: code, data, and inactive < 1220650308 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"brainfsck" <-- that's just silly < 1220650321 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the "fsck" joke got old decades ago anyway :-P < 1220650347 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: most good interps parse < 1220650351 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X swaps the data and inactive tapes, L copies the data over the inactive < 1220650391 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So lost kingdom would take 4 megs of ram just for the code < 1220650402 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whee :-) < 1220650426 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's more than my program allocates < 1220650465 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my program allocates a short for each positive value in a signed short < 1220650472 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The matching method you describe is comparatively slow and complicated. < 1220650482 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you could swap sections of tape in and out of memory to tempfiles depending on your current position? Would probably take a rewrite though. < 1220650501 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :listen to me, trying to give advice, don't even know this language :-D < 1220650526 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the tapes are all classes so I could essentially just give them a save and load command < 1220650533 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus you could have a save state for the programs < 1220650544 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although they would all be of equal size < 1220650572 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since the memory allocated is always the same assuming an error didn't happen that I didn't catch < 1220650589 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, arrays are quicker than tapes :) < 1220650604 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was talking about swapping out *sections* of tape though, to solve your "program's tape too big to have all at once" problem. Maybe I am talking nonsense, check with an expert :-) < 1220650614 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1220650627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could just have a dynamic array... < 1220650634 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tried that < 1220650637 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vector<char> is not all that hard to write. < 1220650637 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :decided no < 1220650675 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also they are shorts, not single bytes < 1220650688 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signed shorts < 1220650691 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<GreyKnight> "brainfsck" <-- that's just silly < 1220650692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1220650700 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :static code analyser for brainfuck! < 1220650701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1220650710 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1220650724 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is obviously what brainfsck would be < 1220650731 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1220650739 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where did you guys here brainfsck < 1220650742 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just what bf-land needs, more punnery :-P < 1220650743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't get jokes do you? < 1220650758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, try #include <humor> < 1220650759 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why signed? < 1220650759 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1220650768 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not? < 1220650778 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't wrap around anyways < 1220650781 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, try #include <relaxation> // :-) < 1220650800 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR, well I'm not a C++ coder like CO2Games so I leave the .h in :P < 1220650806 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1220650808 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(doesn't wrap why?) < 1220650811 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just trying to talk to CO2Games in a way he knew < 1220650814 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tab-completion strikes again! < 1220650821 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Decided not to do taht < 1220650845 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in C++ it would take extra work to make a short NOT wrap, right? < 1220650856 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1220650861 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait they wrap already? < 1220650869 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, you have to actually check right before you increment it whether it's at the top of its range, and then make a problem if it is? < 1220650884 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1220650897 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it is it just lands at the top and doesn't bounce off or anything < 1220650902 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lot of work to achieve a loss of functionality, unless the point of the program is to check whether a brainfuck program uses wrapping. < 1220650907 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or bottom if going the other way < 1220650918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, I think CO2Games is thinking of wrapping space rather than wrapping numbers < 1220650921 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't think shorts already wrapped around < 1220650927 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is the only sense his comments would make sense < 1220650936 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games, wrapping *signed* numbers is undefined < 1220650937 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1220650947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrapping unsigned numbers happen automatically < 1220650954 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit < 1220650959 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster nah...because that wouldn't have anything to do with signed vs unsigned. < 1220650963 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that solves it all < 1220650963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you overflow a unsigned number it will wrap of course < 1220650976 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you overflow a signed one... anything could happen < 1220650979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, ? < 1220650988 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k I guess I will do this < 1220650999 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example you could hit a trap representation < 1220651001 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That's mostly because the representation of signed numbers is undefined; 2's complement will, of course, wrap a bit differently from sign bit. < 1220651024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, um ever heard of trap representation? < 1220651029 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1220651032 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a computer in common use where overflowing or underflowing a signed number does something other than wrap (and set an overflow flag for other things to look at and react to as they like)? < 1220651046 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, a certain value may be reserved for "can't be used" < 1220651075 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, normally 0x8..... (that is all the rest are zeros) for int iirc < 1220651076 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :may be < 1220651081 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually think x86 sets an overflow flag. (correct me if I'm wrong) < 1220651085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then program would fail < 1220651097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, x86 doesn't have a trap representation < 1220651108 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor does any *common* platforms as far as I know < 1220651108 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Overflow flag, not trap representation. < 1220651122 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and yes it sets a carry flag iirc < 1220651131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can't reach that from inside C < 1220651135 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | >.< < 1220651142 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq yeah, that's what I thought. < 1220651148 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless one uses inline assembly. :p < 1220651155 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, which isn't C < 1220651159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is an extension < 1220651162 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, yeah, yeah. < 1220651164 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asm() isn't valid in ISO C < 1220651171 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ANSI if you are american < 1220651172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1220651173 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically the moral of the story is "don't let signeds overflow" :-) < 1220651182 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, you got it < 1220651184 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"it's like really bad" < 1220651187 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and never trust NULL to be 0 < 1220651188 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1220651208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, potentially really bad, but mostly it works on normal computers < 1220651213 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially not if you have to write code on something I may have designed. < 1220651215 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I literally just got through fixing a bunch of someone else's code of that exact problem < 1220651221 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes you invoke undefined behaviour if you let signed overflow < 1220651224 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is correct < 1220651232 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has been really tempted to use 0x0 for the syscall gate in a kernel < 1220651242 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1220651276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I was rather thinking for that C -> Lisp CPU compiler < 1220651281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that existed I heard < 1220651294 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, Symbolics Lisp computers or something like that < 1220651300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :their NULL wasn't 0 < 1220651309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and their signed had bad issues when overflowing < 1220651317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure about that < 1220651338 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway. In this "Drainfuck" there doesn't appear to be any need for negative numbers unless it's to address cells below cell 0, which I'm guessing don't exist...they haven't been mentioned, anyway. < 1220651373 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And therefore there's no obvious benefit to using signed cells. < 1220651386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lisp_machine < 1220651440 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...wo < 1220651441 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :w < 1220651445 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first compile worked < 1220651451 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's testing time < 1220651548 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :65536 cells per tape now < 1220651562 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good number. < 1220651571 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1220651581 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's the maximum a short can point to? < 1220651612 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's part of the series 0, 1, 2, 4, 16, 65536... < 1220651628 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi dbc < 1220651636 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are my favorite numbers. < 1220651640 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi tusho. < 1220651664 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :65536 is a pretty bitchin' number < 1220651665 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta agree there < 1220651686 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the one after that is too long to memorize) < 1220651745 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and the one after THAT is too long to store anywhere) < 1220651849 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 2 4 8 16 32 64 128 256 512 1024 2048 4096 8192 16384 32768 65536 < 1220651861 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tah dah < 1220651871 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 5 5 7 7 3 8 23 98 124 8 8 345 2 2 947 < 1220651884 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er? < 1220651893 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1220651910 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now my long series of numbers simplified < 1220651911 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it Random Integer Sequence Day already? < 1220651923 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<dbc> (and the one after THAT is too long to store anywhere) < 1220651924 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't got a hat or anything! < 1220651925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1220651931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, you mean 2^64? < 1220651934 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no? < 1220651938 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1220651953 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, what series then? < 1220651978 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(n)=2^(f(n-1)). < 1220651984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1220652001 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also known as "the powers of two" < 1220652001 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1220652005 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 5 5 7 7 3 8 23 98 124 8 8 345 2 2 947 < 1220652005 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1220652007 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1220652010 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was trying to work it out < 1220652013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually no < 1220652014 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking touchpad. < 1220652035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, some hyper operator? < 1220652039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait no < 1220652061 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 10 100 1000 10000 100000 1000000 10000000 100000000 1000000000 10000000000 100000000000 1000000000000 < 1220652089 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10000000000000 < 1220652095 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :100000000000000 < 1220652100 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agh I'm lost < 1220652105 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too many zeros < 1220652111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, you mean: f(1) -> 1; f(N) -> math:pow(2,f(N-1)). < 1220652113 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*brain segfaults* < 1220652113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in erlang) < 1220652159 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but start with f(0) -> 0 instead. < 1220652173 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 5 5 7 7 3 8 23 98 124 8 8 345 2 2 947 < 1220652177 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1220652179 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and again < 1220652180 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, ah < 1220652183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, you know erlang btw? < 1220652191 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't. < 1220652250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4> X = fun(0) -> 0; (N) -> math:pow(2,f(N-1)) end. < 1220652250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#Fun<erl_eval.6.13229925> < 1220652252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in an erlang shell < 1220652260 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :special syntax needed there < 1220652276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"anonymous" function < 1220652291 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOOOOOO < 1220652295 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My tape is broken < 1220652298 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that won't work < 1220652300 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The constructor doesn't work < 1220652306 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Figured. fun vs f. < 1220652325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, need to ask in #erlang now < 1220652380 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, the normal syntax would work in a compiled erlang module htough < 1220652382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though* < 1220652440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<ttyerl> Y = fun(0, X) -> 0; (N, X) -> X(N-1) end. < 1220652443 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe of course < 1220652488 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11> X = fun(0, Y) -> 0; (N, Y) -> math:pow(2, Y(N-1, Y)) end. < 1220652489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works < 1220652500 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2Games: the typical life of a program of this sort is that eventually the author rewrites it from scratch at some point. ;-) It is actually a good thing because, having written one once, he has now figured out how to do it even better! < 1220652529 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1220652560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, unless he or she wrote it in a functional language, in a modular way, and with good design < 1220652567 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he or she should easily fix it < 1220652576 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1220652579 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :always throw one away. < 1220652580 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, yes < 1220652584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, depends < 1220652585 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in functional languages < 1220652589 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a basic principle of software design < 1220652601 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :write one knowing that you will throw it away, then throw it away and write another < 1220652603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well yes, you throw the first interpreter away < 1220652612 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise you get bloated, overengineered programs < 1220652613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I threw away bashfunge really < 1220652615 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: actually, in any language, you can often get some improvements. Great modularity means you can throw bits of it away at a time, is all ;-) < 1220652617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wrote cfunge instead < 1220652618 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that AnMaster would know anything about *those*... < 1220652626 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I already done it that way :) < 1220652636 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been trying to think what's the best way to match brackets in self-modifying variants of brainfuck. It can be done for constant cost added to increment and decrement (for the code "tape")... < 1220652637 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GreyKnight, indeed < 1220652645 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I replaced large parts of cfunge several times < 1220652647 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, writing a program with a kafka book as guidance would be lulzy < 1220652652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it is coded in modular C < 1220652662 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of course, in order to learn how to *do* good design in the first place usually involves a lot of throwing away on prior projects) < 1220652755 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, only issue with that erlang code uses math:pow which returns floating point values < 1220652760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it can't compute the next value < 1220652768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normal erlang numbers are bignums < 1220652771 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1220652778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for integers it would work < 1220652788 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't feel like writing my own pow < 1220652825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc, actually math:pow/1 to be specific above ;) < 1220652848 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh yes, erlang got strange notation for referring to functions, it is name/<count of parameters>) < 1220652852 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I used gnu bignum library to get the next number a long time ago, so I don't need such a program myself) < 1220652862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if parameter count differs then it is different functions) < 1220652897 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION calls q(). in the shell < 1220652915 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(alias for init:stop/1) < 1220652933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm no < 1220652935 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1220652938 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :init:stop/0 actually < 1220652943 0 :puzzlet!n=puzzlet@147.46.241.231 JOIN :#esoteric < 1220652946 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop/1 is different one < 1220652969 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CO2, how do you modify the code tape anyway? Or do you? < 1220652970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, there? < 1220652986 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I got a question about conforming funges in exceptional circumstances! < 1220653024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, for example, what if the programming language the funge is written in *can't* return a specific exit code to the shell. Or if the language will always print the return value of the function before exiting? < 1220653047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, does that prevent implementing Befunge-98 in such a language? or does it count as a special circumstance < 1220653060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all it is actually the shell of the interpreter of the interpreter that prints it out < 1220653067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the befunge interpreter itself < 1220653073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it is really not a part of it < 1220653083 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a part of the shell (erlang shell or whatever) it runs in < 1220653132 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not so strange: Prolog uses "predicate/arity" notation too. < 1220653152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway what do you think about the return value and stuff issue? < 1220653169 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the befunge interpreter won't run from command line either < 1220653174 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you will need something like: < 1220653181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ erl < 1220653185 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erlang (BEAM) emulator version 5.6.3 [source] [64-bit] [async-threads:0] [hipe] [kernel-poll:false] < 1220653186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eshell V5.6.3 (abort with ^G) < 1220653186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1> < 1220653200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then enter efunge:run("path/to/program.b98"). < 1220653201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.vjn.fi/pb/p554424121.txt < 1220653210 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm? < 1220653214 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't been really following all this, only just arrived back here. < 1220653227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, question was just about 5 lines above < 1220653244 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there. < 1220653247 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8-5 lines before your comment < 1220653283 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, wow < 1220653295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, and the next step? < 1220653297 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1220653304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, anyway you can't call that on 7 < 1220653320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so xrange 10... < 1220653340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume that means {0..10} < 1220653408 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Personally I wouldn't really care about the "q" exit code missing if there's a reasonable reason. < 1220653421 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what? < 1220653440 0 :GreyKnight!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"zzzzz" < 1220653451 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xrange(10)=[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9], yes < 1220653486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well it wouldn't be missing. since everything has a return value in erlang, and the shell prints that out when the function returns < 1220653489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would look like: < 1220653549 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's certainly good enough. < 1220653557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1220653560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wait < 1220653562 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hit a bug < 1220653569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got a befunge93 version here < 1220653581 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odd bug < 1220653636 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'night < 1220653639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1220653643 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't like ~ in paths < 1220653644 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, really, I got the point; if your interpreter is a function under some sort of "eval"-type situation, I think you can and should substitute the "exit code" of the spec with "return value". < 1220653651 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"À vaincre sans péril on triomphe sans gloire..." < 1220653661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, http://rafb.net/p/NJr9IR26.html < 1220653670 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the code is compiled, to bytecode < 1220653678 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is then run under the erlang vm < 1220653688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I figured out how to do FPDP here < 1220653692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is really nifty < 1220653695 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :want to hear? < 1220653703 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't do the union style trick < 1220653703 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1220653718 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can make the stack, a list, contain other stuff than integers < 1220653725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you make a tuple: < 1220653732 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{float, <value>} < 1220653762 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if your normal routines pop that, then you just let to code see some dummy value < 1220653773 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from of course keeping track of the metadata still < 1220653779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it is handled if pushed back < 1220653786 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, think that would work? :D < 1220653850 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I plan to make it befunge 98 and then implement MVRS < 1220653857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I get some time < 1220653865 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a non-homogenous container like a list that can store anything, sure, I don't see why you couldn't stick type-tagged tuples in there for the uncommon case. < 1220653891 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes, just need to handle it gracefully if the befunge program tries to do something strange with it < 1220653900 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, say, add an integer < 1220653909 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does FPDP even define what happens then? < 1220653913 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nop < 1220653919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but shouldn't crash at least < 1220653924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will probably make it reflect < 1220653932 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, one issue though < 1220653963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erlang doesn't have single/double < 1220653968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just have floating point < 1220654011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got no idea what type of float < 1220654020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could even be long double < 1220654055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway this befunge-93 is already turing complete, it got bignums < 1220654058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1220654072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh however input is weird < 1220654074 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't work well < 1220654082 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google says Erlang uses IEEE 754 64-bit floats, i.e. doubles. < 1220654083 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shows [] as a prompt all the time < 1220654166 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a piece of Perl for writing MATLAB's binary ".mat" file format which stores the desired MATLAB type of the value by "bless"ing (Perl's curious class system here) it to a class name indicating the type. < 1220654189 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, huhu < 1220654231 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I were inclined to write a Perl-based Funge thing, which I don't, I guess I would do FPDP and friends by sticking in the stack a reference to a scalar blessed to Funge98::Float or something. It would be appropriately perverse. < 1220654293 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1220654438 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hehe < 1220654578 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, http://eso-std.org/ has been all improved (note to people seeing it the first time: not the design that will be used for ESO's site but just for my personal blog) < 1220654581 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of little tweaks < 1220654659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, even worse in ff2 now < 1220654668 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: screenshot? :P < 1220654671 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally.. is FPDP usally done by using two consecutive stack cells or something? I think I've seen talk like that here, although I haven't really been reading very carefully. If so, does it actually say so anywhere in the spec? Is there any spec other than the RC/Funge manual? < 1220654689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, sure, once I recover from the brain damage < 1220654692 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of seeing it < 1220654703 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brain damage causing site < 1220654703 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome < 1220654733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, firefox crashed < 1220654735 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait a bit < 1220654738 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is just buggy < 1220654745 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :firefox I mean < 1220654745 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: firefox 3 doesn't crash < 1220654746 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1220654752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, not on the site < 1220654760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, just by having 3 lines of tabs in general < 1220654773 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psht i have like 300 tabs open at once < 1220654858 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1220654893 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At work approximately every ~100th time I try to plot something -- especially if it's a "pcolor" style spectrogram plot -- it goes and kills my X server. It is very very very very annoying, and I haven't really figured out a really good workaround for it. < 1220654912 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The previous sentence was supposed to have the word MATLAB in there somewhere. < 1220654917 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not quite sure where. < 1220654925 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, MATLAB's the "it" there. < 1220654928 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://browsershots.org/screenshots/0269e9f697ee09b438699e1bb2ed4501/ < 1220654930 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that _is_ bad < 1220654933 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but totally not my fault < 1220654934 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1220654944 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the same "elements it don't know can't be styled" < 1220654964 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't usually use FF3 for plotting.) < 1220655033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, http://omploader.org/vcTJ2 < 1220655043 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea < 1220655048 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: gimme a sec < 1220655056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well, just consider that design bad < 1220655065 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, just consider that browser broken < 1220655071 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, compatiblity < 1220655072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1220655077 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck that. < 1220655083 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the people I know use firefox 3 and IE 7 < 1220655089 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really give a shit about anything els < 1220655090 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1220655105 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my code is totally valid & 100% semantic < 1220655110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that attitude, no more testing from me < 1220655113 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works in the two browsers that will actually visit my blog < 1220655117 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's the end ofi t < 1220655137 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i didn't actually needed your testing < 1220655142 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you were nearby so i told you to < 1220655147 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could have asked someone else < 1220655282 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, yay, all i need now is tusho.net < 1220655316 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Valid and valid; the doctype doesn't even say what sort of HTML it is. < 1220655394 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: html 5. < 1220655399 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently a draft. < 1220655404 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://validator.nu/ is an html 5 validator < 1220655417 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and <!DOCTYPE html> is the actual html 5 doctype < 1220655441 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1220655445 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not actually valid html5 < 1220655446 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme fix that < 1220655643 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://validator.nu/?doc=http%3A%2F%2Feso-std.org%2F < 1220655644 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :done < 1220655895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason that whole "doctype is just trickery to trigger a rendering mode in browsers" thing makes me feel vaguely uneasy. I do understand the rationale, it's just an emotional thing. < 1220655908 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: html 5 is pragmatic < 1220655923 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doctypes today ARE just for triggering rendering modes, and remembering them is hell anyway < 1220655940 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the html 5 guys discovered a doctype that makes stuff go into standards mode and has no version and is easy to remember < 1220655943 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<!DOCTYPE html>, voila. < 1220656004 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I did say I understood the rationale. < 1220656035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still think <!DOCTYPE html 5> or so would have been saner < 1220656041 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1220656044 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's not a valid doctype < 1220656045 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm just being contradictionary for no reason; I like the Perl pragmatism, but for some reason I don't like it in HTML. < 1220656047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, true < 1220656050 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, versioning is dead < 1220656056 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for html < 1220656066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, what will happen to xthml in the future < 1220656069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet it won't die < 1220656074 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: HTML 5 can be expressed as XML < 1220656076 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is called XHTML 5 < 1220656082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, that was not my question < 1220656097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xhtml 1.1 xhtml 2.0 maybe < 1220656099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1220656117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ? < 1220656121 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh < 1220656127 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about them? < 1220656139 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: xhtml 2.0 will probably be finalized in 10 years and a grand total of 3 people will use it < 1220656149 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xhtml 1.1 will continue to be used by a fringe < 1220656151 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, [citation needed] < 1220656162 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: xhtml 2.0 has absolutely no steam behind it < 1220656170 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is losing pace compared to a snail < 1220656173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ok. xhtml 1.1 still does < 1220656177 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not much. < 1220656183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that was the [citation needed] < 1220656186 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a fringe of geeks use it ... that's it < 1220656195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, [citation needed] < 1220656198 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you go out and find me some xhtml 1.1 websites < 1220656199 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll wait here < 1220656222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, http://rage.kuonet.org/~anmaster/cfunge/ < 1220656223 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/ :p < 1220656226 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the first one < 1220656231 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ok, that's one, and it's fringe < 1220656238 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a nerd's site for an esoteric language interpreter < 1220656240 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm not a fridge!" < 1220656253 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: nerd's tiny site with fringe info. < 1220656287 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, what about xhtml 1.0 then? < 1220656301 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's used pretty widely and will probably continue to < 1220656313 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prediction: html 5 will slowly, but steadily gain steam < 1220656317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml11/ < 1220656318 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAH! < 1220656319 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1220656325 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: zomg!11121212 < 1220656326 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1220656327 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is xhtml 1.1 itself < 1220656344 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, xhtml 1.1 isn't really very exciting and i doubt it'll see a huge influx of sites < 1220656345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main w3.org is xhtml 1.0 < 1220656351 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but html 5 is getting quite the buzz out there < 1220656364 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously growth will be sloooooow but i don't think it'll stop for a while < 1220656365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, between the geeks yeah < 1220656373 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: geeks are the ones who make webpages < 1220656380 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, fringe < 1220656381 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://xkcd.net/ is also XHTML 1.1, and it's at least popular, even if it's a "nerd" site. < 1220656382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1220656394 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't seen xhtml 1.1 on a site targeted at non-geeks, though. < 1220656404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, html5 is so neardy < 1220656419 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you're misinterpreting my point and turning it around so you look like an idiot again < 1220656420 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just fyi < 1220656428 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, show me *one* single site using html5, apart from your own and one that is actually advocating html5 < 1220656433 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so blog about html5 doesn't count < 1220656446 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://intertwingly.net/, http://diveintomark.org/ < 1220656453 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course all of them are nerd sites now < 1220656468 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the more it's specified and talked about, the more it's supported, the more non-geek sites will switch over < 1220656493 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :intertwingly.net is XHTML 5 < 1220656494 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1220656582 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbc: I intend to add code-tape modification commands < 1220656602 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I can't get my thingy to work now < 1220656699 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, all lighttpd's auto generated directory indexes are XHTML 1.1 < 1220656709 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that means a lot of sites probably < 1220656712 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that hardly counts as a site ;) < 1220656721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, counts once for every site :P < 1220656730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, waht does apache use? < 1220656735 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess xhtml 1.0 < 1220656737 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1220656739 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't know < 1220656740 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doctype-less < 1220656744 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not html 5 anyway < 1220656744 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and <UPPERCASE TAGS> < 1220656745 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, eww < 1220656749 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just eww < 1220656758 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that code probably hasn't been touched since 1995 < 1220656764 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I hope html 5 forbids uppercase tags! < 1220656769 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1220656775 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok that is eww < 1220656777 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lowercase* < 1220656786 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lower case tags are better < 1220656790 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop trying to troll CO2Games < 1220656791 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would it be forbidden anyways < 1220656852 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reguardless, I can't get my interpreter to work < 1220656878 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :drainfuck::>+[++++++++++>,----------]<[<]>>[.>]E < 1220656903 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It gets lost after the first loop ends < 1220656914 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both with and without nested loop support < 1220656929 0 :CO2Games!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it wasn't the addition of the nested loop support that broke it < 1220657316 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.cpan.org is XHTML 1.1 and it's also sort-of for non-"geeks", since it's pretty much targeted to all Perl programmers. I'm having trouble thinking of "non-geek" sites given that the places I visit... < 1220657608 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, same < 1220657953 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: is it served application/xml+xhtml < 1220657957 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not, it's not xhtml 1.1 < 1220657964 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it specifically disallows sending it as text/html < 1220658165 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1220658180 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@a91-152-136-31.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1220658190 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: Could I have a citation on that? The XHTML 1.1 spec I have says "XHTML 1.1 documents SHOULD be labeled with -- application/xhtml+xml" < 1220658202 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it's somewhere in the spec < 1220658243 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it can be, if they already say SHOULD there. < 1220658254 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in some appendix of the xhtml 1.0 spec, then < 1220658258 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it definitely is somewhere < 1220658267 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not the XHTML 1.1 spec. < 1220658288 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yo < 1220658288 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-media-types/#summary < 1220658292 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOULD NOT < 1220658314 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if it is valid, browsers treat it as invalid html 4 < 1220658315 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hixie.ch/advocacy/xhtml < 1220658335 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SHOULD NOT does not equal "specifically disallows". < 1220658382 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the other hand, cpan.org has their doctype public ID wrong, I think. < 1220658424 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good you beat tusho < 1220658434 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: because it's a fucking war < 1220658440 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus christ you are so childish, everything is about beating or winning < 1220658449 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm having what is referred to as a DISCUSSION < 1220658451 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, hope you learn the difference between should and must in standards from now on < 1220658467 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: go fuck yourself, i misremembered the standard, so fucking what < 1220658467 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, and I'm just adapting to your style < 1220658470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :childish I mean < 1220658475 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you're just trolling actually < 1220658493 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"adapting to someone's supposed style to irritate them" = "trolling" < 1220658510 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea how to ask my Firefox "what do you think about this page?", but at least page info says "Render Mode: Standards compliance mode". I'm a bit disappointed that it doesn't say what standards those are. < 1220658511 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I mean adapt as in do the same as you do < 1220658512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1220658519 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hoped you would feel a home < 1220658521 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at* < 1220658527 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: see, that is plainly trolling < 1220658538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, how so? < 1220658540 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Aww! I'm doing the same thing you do! Doesn't it piss you off? Haha!" < 1220658553 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. you are not doing what i do, you are exaggerating what you think I do < 1220658554 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, iirc "When in Rome do like the Romans" is an English proverb? < 1220658556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1220658565 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: and also a bullshit one < 1220658572 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I disagree < 1220658595 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you're just trying to piss me off by acting like an exaggerated version of what you see me as, which is completely unrelated to how i am < 1220658601 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is pretty much the definition of trolling. < 1220658606 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adapting to the local culture is better than trying some imperialist style and imposing on other < 1220658615 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as the English did with their colonies < 1220658616 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly < 1220658624 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course that is unrelated to modern time < 1220658656 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you're portraying yourself as some wonderful person who adapts to people to fit in < 1220658666 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're just acting annoying to piss me off, and don't try and fucking sugar-coat it < 1220658723 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, I'd say it was rather successful if your interpretation was correct. and sadly rather a failure if you respect the truth that I just said about it < 1220658738 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, yes it has pissed me off. congratu-fucking-lations, you are able to piss people off. < 1220658740 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a wonderful powre. < 1220658742 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*power < 1220658745 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pissing people off is _easy_. < 1220658746 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably non-idiomatic) < 1220658768 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: now you may _NEVER_ accuse me of being a troll again, lest I accuse you of being an utter hypocrite < 1220658778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ooh a super power? Captain piss off? The piss-off man? < 1220658780 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ducks < 1220658782 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hope that it was worth giving that up, since you seem to do it very often. < 1220658798 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, of course I am a hypocrite, like you are < 1220658820 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, and you still troll more than I do < 1220658824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was a joke < 1220658826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not trolling < 1220658840 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: just shut the fuck up. you're being immature, trolling, being hypocritical, and shouting random accusations without bias. i am going now, i dearly hope you are less of an idiot/asshole in the morning < 1220658841 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1220658869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hhehe