< 1221869116 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221869934 0 :Ogy!n=IceChat7@207-255-11-008-dhcp.jst.pa.atlanticbb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1221869949 0 :Ogy!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1221870351 0 :hotidlerchick!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'" < 1221871105 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YO < 1221871108 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHO PINGED ME < 1221871436 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1221871438 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol and AnMaster < 1221871441 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: cool < 1221871442 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: fuck you < 1221871448 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just my canned responses to those people) < 1221871608 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: just joking by the way < 1221871611 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not actually angry with you < 1221871613 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's too much work < 1221871614 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1221871617 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just don't say something stupid. < 1221871899 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: u sux0rz (but he won't actually read this since he just uses canned responses) < 1221871911 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: butts < 1221874040 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1221874418 0 :ihope!n=Peggy@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1221877025 0 :Slereah_!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221877025 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221880125 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1221880249 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1221880297 0 :Calamous!n=harry@hawk-c-047.resnet.purdue.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1221880635 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1221881546 0 :Calamous!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1221881815 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1221882019 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221882061 0 :psygnisfive!i=82f5c439@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-b9acc8fa682658e7 JOIN :#esoteric < 1221882488 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | and there would be no CAR to JESUS CHRIST GET INTO < 1221883249 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1221883991 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1221885618 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1221886190 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but but there were no cars at the time of Jesus < 1221886202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he made one with a miracle < 1221886230 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they didn't put it into the gospels because no one could wrap their mind around the concept < 1221886398 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot! < 1221886398 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | or even partial < 1221886402 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot! < 1221886402 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | trying 1.5s < 1221886926 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm petting my cat, and she's kneading, but she gets such a good grip on the carpet, she's actually dragging herself forward slowly :P < 1221887119 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you will slowly be leaving us, then < 1221887592 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh. < 1221888601 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1221892429 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1221893915 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"So, how much do you love noodles?" < 1221897599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1221897600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1221898419 0 :Mony!n=AssHole@AToulouse-258-1-148-172.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221898425 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1221903829 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"À vaincre sans péril on triomphe sans gloire..." < 1221904088 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | does it have a good module/function browser? Does it provide good autocompletion? Tooltips which show the types of functions as you type them in? Does it have a good debugger? A refactoring tool? How well is it integrated with QuickCheck? < 1221904178 0 :Mony!n=AssHole@AToulouse-258-1-148-172.w86-201.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221904647 0 :Slereah2!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221904647 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221905819 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1221905852 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot ? < 1221905853 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mony: WOOH! < 1221905863 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot ^^ < 1221905863 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mony: Urgh. Missed some stuff. < 1221905885 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hum .... optbot ? < 1221905885 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mony: if you have an interpreter, you can do all sorts of neat stuff < 1221905895 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right ^^ < 1221906822 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221906973 0 :Slereah2!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221907469 0 :tusho!n=tusho@91.105.68.172 JOIN :#esoteric < 1221909912 0 :Corun!n=Corun@halls-129-31-82-181.hor.ic.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1221911383 0 :Slereah_!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221911384 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221911713 0 :lilja!n=okoko@a91-152-136-31.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1221912708 0 :Slereah2!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221912708 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221912881 0 :Slereah_!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221912881 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221913346 0 :Slereah2!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221913346 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221914767 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@151.60.133.238 JOIN :#esoteric < 1221914790 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.piratejesus.com/nerdcore/nerdcore017.gif ahahahahahhaha < 1221915338 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1221915343 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :written by the guy who made that Chronotron time travel game < 1221915345 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::S < 1221915346 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:D < 1221915628 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1221916238 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=nice@HSI-KBW-091-089-028-216.hsi2.kabelbw.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1221917657 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221919419 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1221919929 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1221920262 0 :Slereah_!n=x@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221920267 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1221923103 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221923125 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optbot, < 1221923126 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mony: Just change the name to COMPLICATED and you've got an esoteric programming language :-) < 1221923134 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1221923320 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1221923331 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221923775 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1221924098 0 :lilja!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"KVIrc 3.2.0 'Realia'" < 1221924630 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221924646 0 :Slereah2!n=butt@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221924803 0 :Slereah_!n=butt@ANantes-252-1-93-206.w81-53.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221924807 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1221924809 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221924821 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221925388 0 :ais523!n=ais523@sm01-fap04.bham.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1221925389 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1221925497 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi tusho < 1221925503 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523! < 1221925503 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Mony < 1221925510 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Mony < 1221925511 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need some help with your sql query in a min < 1221925512 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1221925518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I didn't even realise there was a memoserv on here... < 1221925521 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 ;) < 1221925523 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1221925688 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | i wasn't making any argument so there was nothing i could specify < 1221925723 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1221926498 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@151.60.135.166 JOIN :#esoteric < 1221927089 0 :Slereah2!n=butt@ANantes-252-1-30-147.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221927176 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-11-36.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221927743 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1221927797 0 :ihope!n=Peggy@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1221928098 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221928102 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221928181 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221928508 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1221928594 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@151.60.135.166 JOIN :#esoteric < 1221928626 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1221928685 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221928765 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=nice@HSI-KBW-091-089-028-216.hsi2.kabelbw.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1221930408 0 :Corun_!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221930761 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221932736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm this is undefined in C right: < 1221932737 0 :Corun_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221932737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*(i++) == *(i++); < 1221932747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, modifies i twice between sequence points < 1221932754 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, exactly what I need < 1221932758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for a quiz) < 1221932775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, OK, I wondered what on earth you were trying to write therer < 1221932777 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/r$// < 1221932829 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like: "What does this code do in C: *(i++) == *(i++);" 1) blah 2) blah 3) It is undefined 4) blah < 1221932843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if you can come up with hilarious stuff for the other 3 answers I would like to know < 1221932877 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I imagine much hilarity could ensue if i were a macro < 1221932894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hum? < 1221932925 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine #define i (char*)0x05),(intptr < 1221932932 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a machine with memory-mapped addresses < 1221932941 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1221932959 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, nah assume is is char *i; < 1221932966 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is set before at some point < 1221932969 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the start of a string < 1221932987 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most compilers will increment i by either 1 or 2 given that code < 1221933001 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcc will error out on it if given the right settings < 1221933028 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, it's likely to return false if i increments by 2 and the two characters in question are different, could be either true or false but more likely true if i increments by 1 < 1221933042 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however this is just based on what compilers normally do in practice, not on what they could do < 1221933208 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, I just tried it in gcc and it optimised it into 1; because I never used the value of i after that < 1221933213 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me make my test program more interesting... < 1221933310 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hehe < 1221933326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I already made up the bogus answers < 1221933426 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw does php really not have either tuples or structs? < 1221933430 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems very very odd < 1221933507 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well what gcc-bf does is equivalent to (i+=2,1) < 1221933518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems that it increments i twice because there are two i++s in it < 1221933530 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but because the expression on each side of the == is the same it does common subexpression elimination < 1221933540 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and decides that the two sides are always the same < 1221933545 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1221933562 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, just goes to show that you can't guarantee any sensible behaviour from code like taht < 1221933615 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is annoyed that so much stuff assumes 32-bit int nowadays < 1221933639 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcc spends ages zero-extending the argument to putchar from char to int < 1221933670 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the algorithm it uses is something like typedef char int[4]; int i; i[0]=c; i[1]=0; i[2]=i[1]; i[3]=i[2]; < 1221933674 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which does not translate well into brainfuck < 1221933696 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in BF register=constant is a lot easier than register=register < 1221933715 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :putchar has been putchar(int) for, well, ever... < 1221933719 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there's some setting somewhere to influence what code it generates < 1221933735 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm fine with that, just not fine with people assuming 32-bit int when 16 is perfectly allowed by the standard < 1221933744 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would double the speed of all my calls to putchar... < 1221933788 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, putchar's slow enough anyway due to stdio overhead < 1221933793 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221933807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably I'll implement __builtin_fastputchar and __builtin_fastgetchar that just map to . and , directly < 1221933817 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so people can avoid using stdio in short programs and produce considerably shorter output < 1221933833 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, will it be possible to cross compile gcc to brainfuck some day? < 1221933839 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is compile gcc itself with gcc-bf < 1221933851 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are various obstacles to doing that < 1221933853 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how much disk space would you need? < 1221933858 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main one being that the result wouldn't run even on a supercomputer < 1221933868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahah < 1221933870 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and gcc needs more than 16MB of memory to run, normally < 1221933871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the other ones? < 1221933877 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah well < 1221933882 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's another big problem, I'd need to make bigger pointers < 1221933890 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that hard? < 1221933903 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very, but it would make the marker code even more inefficient than it already is < 1221933917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's bad enough that calculating *i is O(n) in the value of i < 1221933928 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something which doesn't even make sense in the context of pointers in normal C < 1221933929 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1221933940 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, O(n^2) < 1221933943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what about i[a] then? < 1221933957 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's O(n^2) in i+a < 1221933962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1221933971 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however if i points somewhere on the stack it's a lot faster < 1221933982 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pointers to auto variables can be accessed faster than pointers to heap if you have a big heap < 1221933984 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1221934002 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, brainfuck is really bad at pointers, yet gcc seems to think they're fast < 1221934013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are normally... < 1221934014 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1221934017 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to get gcc to stop all those backwards optimisations < 1221934047 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like optimising x*=10; into {int a, b; a=x; b=x<<3; x+=a; x+=b;} < 1221934061 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first is quite a lot better in brainfuck with char x < 1221934063 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so for gcc-bf -O0 is better than -O3? < 1221934070 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, unfortuately < 1221934070 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe -Os? < 1221934079 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Os is an interesting one, I might try that < 1221934086 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but things like register variables speed things up a lot < 1221934097 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should look at all the optimisations individually to see if they help < 1221934106 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and redefine -O1, -O2 and -O3 accordingly < 1221934117 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're not supposed to do that, by the way < 1221934120 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1221934124 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I may as well if it leads to better code < 1221934124 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"À vaincre sans péril on triomphe sans gloire..." < 1221934126 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and bye Mony < 1221934126 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, about register variables... doesn't GCC handle that itself? and ignore the register keyword? < 1221934133 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it depends on the optimisation level < 1221934137 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes at -O2 up, I think < 1221934140 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC does that kind of optimization at a higher level than at machine code generation level? O_o < 1221934140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221934154 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yes, and IMO it shouldn't, at least in gcc-bf < 1221934156 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, no one said GCC had a clean architecture < 1221934162 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably it does it at the RTL level < 1221934167 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though gcc-bf is certainly not a normal case < 1221934176 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case I could get round it by wrapping multiplications in an unspec, but that's kind-of hacky < 1221934190 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, I've done all sorts of other things in my code to hack around limitations in gcc < 1221934193 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, unspec? < 1221934193 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I've heard it doesn't, doesn't mean I can't be surprised at that anyway :-P < 1221934214 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: something that gcc doesn't know about but can manipulate < 1221934220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, huh < 1221934234 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the archetypal example would be an __asm__ statement < 1221934241 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1221934241 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where gcc has no clue what the asm does, but can move it around anyway < 1221934254 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that ironically __asm__ isn't an unspec, it's something else that acts similarly < 1221934270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, um what about the "automatic select registers to use" feature of __asm__ in gcc < 1221934282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure that exists < 1221934293 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, that's reasonably irrelevant here though < 1221934297 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an unspec can operate on pseudos < 1221934308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are things which will eventually go into registers, just gcc hasn't decided which one yet < 1221934317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, an example of ridiculous hackiness: (match_test "GET_MODE(op) == mode || GET_MODE(op) == VOIDmode))) || (((0") < 1221934329 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the gcc-bf code < 1221934352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I don't understand it < 1221934357 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from that it isn't C < 1221934363 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the bit inside the quotes is C < 1221934366 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bit outside is almost lisp < 1221934367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221934378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the bit inside is unbalanced < 1221934384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's what I was getting at < 1221934396 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I don't know the context of that < 1221934396 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the unbalancing being to work around a bug which makes it impossible to write your own predicates that match constants < 1221934406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lisp heh.... < 1221934412 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because in gcc constants don't have data types < 1221934416 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, internally < 1221934426 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just whether they're integers or floating points < 1221934430 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't there some famous quote about complex C projects and clisp interpreters < 1221934434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot the wording < 1221934450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so everywhere where you want to compare data-types, you have to special-case constants < 1221934455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they forgot to so I had to do it by hand < 1221934464 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, gcc's .md files are written in a sexp-based language < 1221934466 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1221934474 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is basically lisp expressions without any sort of flow control < 1221934496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I know what sexp are. I like that as a generic data format < 1221934499 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :much nicer than xml < 1221934518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's basically like writing a polyglot as the .md files are compiled into two stages of the program < 1221934528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example, the game supertux use sexp for all it's levels, and other non-binary data files (that is, everthing except images and sounds) < 1221934530 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one that converts GIMPLE to RTL, one that converts RTL to asm < 1221934561 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you have to write code that works in both directions < 1221934661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, does PHP really lack both tuples and structs? < 1221934668 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know PHP, really < 1221934671 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I wouldn't be surprised < 1221934675 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1221934676 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has objects and arrays < 1221934680 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and objects can be used as structs < 1221934689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well arrays sure, but objects aren't POD < 1221934711 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I understand it < 1221934750 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want an array of tuples really < 1221934761 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you use an array as a tuple? < 1221934771 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean an array of arrays? < 1221934775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seeing as in PHP you can index arrays with arbitrary objects < 1221934782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well nice except the tuple contains one nested array < 1221934782 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they work sort-of like hashes < 1221934783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1221934786 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes could work < 1221934790 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :messy though < 1221934800 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's PHP, it's messy whatever you do < 1221934804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, true < 1221935031 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221935632 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@151.60.135.166 JOIN :#esoteric < 1221937401 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :off topic: how do I create an iso image from a cd, using command line tools. < 1221937425 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dd < 1221937435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well actually a dvd in this case. < 1221937444 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a good block size for dd then? < 1221937455 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some large size, doesn't matter much < 1221937456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering the dvd is 5.3 GB < 1221937472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, it will handle when the disk doesn't match in block size right? < 1221937483 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1221937504 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could probably just as well use cat if you wanted to < 1221937510 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or cp < 1221937516 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, probably not cp < 1221937522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as that doesn't copy the content of devices by default < 1221937525 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the devices themselves < 1221937556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, also I don't have enough free disk space on any computer with a dvd reader, I guess I'll use nfs < 1221937560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope that works < 1221937732 0 :Corun!n=Corun@host81-154-61-144.range81-154.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1221938141 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1221938626 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.5 of 5.3 GB copied... < 1221938766 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa! < 1221938769 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 is STILL HERE < 1221938777 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot all about that, and I need major SQL help still, damn < 1221938788 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: they fixed the door < 1221938799 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: goddamn < 1221938808 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go so I can be annoyed that you're not here to fix the problem < 1221938810 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that bad? < 1221938810 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then come back tomorrow < 1221938816 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and continually remind me of your prescence < 1221938820 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that I have time to get the help I need < 1221938820 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1221938835 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may go soon, just because I need something to drink < 1221938843 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just getting caught up with this week's Agora stuff first < 1221938913 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what door? < 1221938932 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the door to the building in which my normal Internet connection is < 1221938937 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1221938942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ah what was the issue with it? < 1221938942 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought you meant to #esoteric < 1221938944 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lulz < 1221938944 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had problems connecting for ages because the door was broken and I couldn't get in < 1221938955 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: they had to lock it by hand because it kept opening in the middle of the night < 1221938957 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I didn't have a key < 1221938961 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: have a drink of SQL < 1221938965 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221938985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so you connected from elsewhere? < 1221939002 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how goes gcc-bf btw? Solved the divide 64-bit ints but yet? < 1221939003 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bit* < 1221939014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I've been working on something else completely unrelated to esoprogramming < 1221939029 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :deadline coming up in real life and none of the other people who are supposed to be helping me have noticed, it seems < 1221939033 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even responded to my emails about it < 1221939043 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know the freebsd kernel source contains an efficient (for normal processors) implementation of signed and unsigned quad word divide < 1221939051 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that made me laugh < 1221939055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ouch < 1221939064 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, not offensively < 1221939067 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good luck and all < 1221939071 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF efficiency follows completely different rules to normal processor efficiency < 1221939072 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it made me laugh for an unrelated reason < 1221939107 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1221939173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4.5 GB copied... < 1221939209 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm the drive is slow I guess < 1221939352 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1221939508 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: SQL totally sounds like an obscure energy drink. maybe it is. < 1221939517 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1221939530 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses I.N.D.E.X.E.s for that extra boost < 1221939536 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'm zooming off for a bit < 1221939537 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are some health concerns (makes you fat), but meh < 1221939543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you shout loudly enough now I'll come back a bit later though < 1221939547 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AIS523! < 1221939552 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAIISS552233! < 1221939553 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that'll do! < 1221939553 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAIISS552233!! < 1221939556 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1221939559 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"coming back in a bit" < 1221939569 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently too obscure to have a wikipedia page ;) < 1221939614 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is he using the echo to find his way back? < 1221939650 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221939657 0 :Slereah2!n=butt@ANantes-252-1-30-147.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221939703 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did they delete his page?! < 1221939714 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1221939715 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they didn't < 1221939720 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1221939721 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you meant SQL < 1221939722 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1221939726 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1221939805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, OS X question: in OS X, how do you eject an unmounted CD. say I unmounted it using umount as root in a terminal < 1221939809 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then later want to eject it < 1221939810 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders why Buck Godot doesn't update regularly when Girl Genius does < 1221939828 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: simple < 1221939831 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean the frequency is regular but not the time of day < 1221939831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1221939840 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the eject button on the keyboard. if your keyboard is stupid, try the F12 key. < 1221939845 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, not F12 < 1221939846 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1221939858 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme remember what it was for retarded keyboards :D < 1221939867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, didn't work < 1221939868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried < 1221939879 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a macbook < 1221939883 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it got an eject key < 1221939891 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you have to hold it down possibly? < 1221939894 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just tapping it doesn't work < 1221939900 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to avoid inadvertently ejecting < 1221939903 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, yes and the "eject" symbol showed up on screen < 1221939910 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1221939912 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see why < 1221939922 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only other thing i know then is 'drutil tray eject' in a terminal < 1221939934 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that fails, i guess you'll have to re-mount it and i don't know why any of these would fail < 1221939934 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1221939935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ah thanks < 1221939960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, how would you remount it under /Volumes, I get a "permission denied" as root < 1221939991 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: put the disc back in? < 1221939991 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1221940008 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, what does mount say? < 1221940010 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it shouldn't say that < 1221940027 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mount should work fine < 1221940031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, "mount: Permission denied" < 1221940038 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yeah, but how did you call it < 1221940039 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1221940090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mount -o nodev,nosuid,read-only /dev/disk1s3 "/Volumes/Mac OS X Install Disc 1" < 1221940099 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: with sudo in front of it? < 1221940119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, no since I had used sudo su - 3 lines above < 1221940135 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't think you would need sudo when you were in a root shell < 1221940141 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: did you mkdir /Volumes/Mac OS X Install Disc 1? < 1221940155 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mount for me has always required you mkdir the target dir... < 1221940155 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, it still exist from when I ran unmount < 1221940160 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umount* < 1221940168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ls confirms that < 1221940170 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then...that should work perfectly < 1221940176 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and does for me < 1221940185 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: try rmdiring it and mkdiring it, just in case < 1221940190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, Tiger? 10.4.11 < 1221940192 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :other than that...shrug, your machine is crazy < 1221940193 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes < 1221940213 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely it remounted when you plugged the disc back in though < 1221940216 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/plugged/put/ < 1221940222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, apple hardware test (booting cd with d pressed) reports no errors < 1221940232 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely it remounted when you put the disc back in though < 1221940268 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well issue was I couldn't eject it, but drutil worked and yes it remounted on insert < 1221940281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't you think I tried to mount it again before I asked you in the first place? < 1221940294 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it remounted on insert ... why do you need to mount it < 1221940294 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1221940314 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well I was just curious there. But thanks for that drutil line < 1221940328 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, well, closed as WFM < 1221940329 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1221940336 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, eh? < 1221940340 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worksforme < 1221940409 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, also the "drutil tray" seems strange to me < 1221940417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a slot type drive < 1221940421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't see any tray < 1221940427 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION slaps AnMaster  < 1221940431 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop being so silly :P < 1221940449 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and drutil is named as such because it uses the DiscRecording framework to interact with the drive < 1221940459 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Common verbs include burn, erase, eject, help, info, list, < 1221940459 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : status, and tray. < 1221940464 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Info, status and tray are now verbs. < 1221940466 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221940468 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION trays AnMaster  < 1221940481 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was maybe "DRiveUtil" < 1221940488 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would make sense too :P < 1221940498 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it's Doctor Utility < 1221940554 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-091-096-039-071.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1221940773 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221940782 0 :Slereah2!n=butt@ANantes-252-1-30-147.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221940803 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :verbs verb verbally < 1221940972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, also verbs: "subchannel" "version" "cdtext" < 1221940977 0 :ais523!n=ais523@sm01-fap04.bham.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1221940977 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1221940978 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a few more < 1221940983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hi ais523 < 1221940988 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Shut up or I'll subchannel you < 1221941011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1221941019 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wb ais523 < 1221941020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that actually sounds as it make sense on irc < 1221941023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear, has an argument grown up while I've been missing? < 1221941025 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, I haven't logread for months < 1221941027 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to logread all the time... < 1221941038 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, no we are *for once* in agreement < 1221941049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is extremely unlikely relly < 1221941052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really* < 1221941067 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not! < 1221941079 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what are you disagreeing about, then? < 1221941084 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could do with some context, really < 1221941085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, no clue < 1221941093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: < 1221941095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oh and drutil is named as such because it uses the DiscRecording framework to interact with the drive < 1221941095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Common verbs include burn, erase, eject, help, info, list, < 1221941095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : status, and tray. < 1221941095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Info, status and tray are now verbs. < 1221941099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : tusho, also verbs: "subchannel" "version" "cdtext" < 1221941103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from same man page < 1221941118 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's such a load of trash! < 1221941185 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Common verbs include burn, erase, eject, help, info, list, status, and tray. < 1221941185 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The rest of the verbs are: bulkerase, cdtext, discinfo, dumpiso, dumpudf, filename, getconfig, poll, subchannel, trackinfo, and version. < 1221941192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the complete list < 1221941200 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: in INTERCAL "NEXT" is a verb < 1221941205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously there are no other verbs < 1221941205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at all < 1221941206 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people talk about "NEXTING" and so on < 1221941214 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this caused me issues translating it into Latin, though < 1221941237 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Apple made man page (as opposed to "a self made man [page]") states so < 1221941246 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1221941268 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's NEXT in latin? < 1221941299 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DEINDE < 1221941315 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I formed into an infinitive as DEINDERE < 1221941321 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and from there the gerundive as DEINDENDUM < 1221941331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably the best that can be done < 1221941444 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, wtf is "gerundive"? < 1221941479 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to remember now < 1221941507 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in INTERCAL English uses gerunds, which makes gramattical sense, but the Latin version uses gerundives probably because someone mistranslated years ago < 1221941535 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see... a latin gerundive like "deindendum" translates best into English as "having/needing/wanting to be nexted" < 1221941553 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well they have some common uses iirc < 1221941566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Hogwarts motto is a good example < 1221941577 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"draco dormiens numquam tittilandus [est]" < 1221941587 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: um that's a different use < 1221941596 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It is never the case that a dragon is needing to be tickled", more or less literally < 1221941604 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so in my view it's the same case, pretty much < 1221941613 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what do you think the difference is? < 1221941690 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a different use of the gerundium, similar to -ing in english < 1221941701 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's just the pure gerund IIRC < 1221941708 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would be "deindens" in this case, meaning "nexting" < 1221941712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no! < 1221941714 0 :Slereah_!n=butt@ANantes-252-1-30-147.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1221941720 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the one that ought to be used in INTERCAL but isn't < 1221941721 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :english -ing has two different meanings < 1221941724 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, agreed < 1221941729 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"nexting" as in "the act of nexting" < 1221941734 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the noun version of -ing < 1221941734 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1221941744 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's gerund in both English and Latin < 1221941751 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1221941753 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Latin has gerundive, too, which doesn't correspond directly to anything in English < 1221941769 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, deindens isn't the gerund, is it < 1221941772 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the other sort of -ing < 1221941773 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but iirc those have the same form in latin, with -ndum < 1221941780 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, that's why I was confused < 1221941790 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hogwarts motto is definitely gerundive not gerund though < 1221941826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A sleeping dragon is never tickling" is nonsense semantically in English, and gramatically in Latin as participles are never used like that in Latin and a gerund would be a noun not an adjective < 1221941830 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, "gerunds"? < 1221941848 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: "programming", referring to the noun, for instance < 1221941856 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1221941861 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I am programming" is a participle, whereas "Programming is my favourite subject" is a gerund < 1221941868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :English uses -ing for two different things and confuses the issue < 1221941872 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the hogwarts use is definitely the "needing to be" use < 1221941879 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the gerundive < 1221941884 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"needing" isn't exactly the right word < 1221941892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1221941894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's enough to get the sense of the translation < 1221941895 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Latin is complex < 1221941903 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, i am programming in the gerund sense. < 1221941904 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, Latin is simple, English is complex < 1221941906 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in Swedish we don't even have a -ing form really. < 1221941926 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you have -ande, don't you? < 1221941930 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: for pretty much everyone in this channel, I'd disagree, but for you, that's perfect < 1221941945 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1221941947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, well yes, but we don't use it for "I am programming", we use the "present tense" form then < 1221941952 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if that is the right English name for it < 1221941952 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: ping, by the way < 1221941955 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you asked me to < 1221941971 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's the two meanings english confuses < 1221941972 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: pretty much only English uses forms of "is" with a participle < 1221941974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finnish does it that way too < 1221941978 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1221941979 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can be expressed in many other languages but they never use it < 1221941990 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but both finnish and swedish have the awkwards -ing form too < 1221941993 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, the progressive is a third thing, really < 1221941999 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*awkward < 1221942008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like Latin, for instance, "deindens sum" makes sense, sort of, but is so anti-idiomatic that they never used it < 1221942013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh, I don't even know the terminology for this in English < 1221942021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can manage it fine *in Swedish* I think < 1221942025 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: progressive is the am -ing thing < 1221942034 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it seems ais523 has generalized my point and thus owned me quite bad. < 1221942049 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll go read some more math -> < 1221942051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, except that deindere isn't actually a verb, because INTERCAL doesn't date back to ancient Roman times < 1221942055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what is the "present tense" then in English? < 1221942063 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in am/is < 1221942067 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I program. < 1221942073 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i, program. < 1221942073 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty rarely used in conversation though < 1221942078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, is present tense the right word? < 1221942080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or alternatively "I am programming" < 1221942081 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes < 1221942085 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the new movie < 1221942088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that is what we would use instead of -ing in Swedish < 1221942092 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I am programming" would be the most common way to do it, that's the progressive active < 1221942093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for "I am programming" < 1221942102 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I program" would be most commonly used for speech acts < 1221942107 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we wouldn't use our rarely used -ande form that oerjan mentioned < 1221942127 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the start of formal complainy letters: "I write to you because I am very upset about the way you have treated my computer..." < 1221942153 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well we would use it informally too, our -ing form is very seldom used < 1221942156 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: in swedish and norwegian i guess that's used only for forming adjectives, not as a part of verb tenses < 1221942168 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, as I said English is unusual in this respect < 1221942171 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ah yes that is a use for it < 1221942177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :confuses foreigners quite a lot until they get used to it < 1221942192 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ithkuil uses both quite a lot < 1221942203 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ithkuil? < 1221942204 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is that < 1221942209 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the language < 1221942219 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: anyway, the gerundive is pretty useful, it's annoying not having it in English, it's sort of the opposite of the participle < 1221942220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what country? < 1221942235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, "participle"? < 1221942247 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: itkuil is a conlang < 1221942248 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: a conlang i presume < 1221942251 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I am programming", in English, but "Feather is correct-to-program", in Latin literally translated to English < 1221942256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I don't think we have gerundive in Swdish < 1221942259 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: a participle is an adjective made from a verb < 1221942260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one with a reputation of being so hard there's no use trying to learn it < 1221942288 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strangely using them in English is non-idiomatic < 1221942292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's hard in that you need to master all of its aspects before being able to say the simplest thing < 1221942296 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i think we use the infinitive for the other -ing use < 1221942308 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Norw. and Sw.) < 1221942316 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The running policeman shouted at the burglar" is about the closest I can get to an idiomatic uses of a participle < 1221942324 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't part of a verb phrase like "I am running" < 1221942341 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no words, just kinda word bodies consisting of two consonants; you create words by inserting the details of how you want to use those bodies to make the actual objects < 1221942347 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a present active participle, Latin has past passive participles and sometimes past active participles too < 1221942347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes < 1221942358 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(mind you not _everything_ is the same in Norwegian and Swedish. they use -st passive much more than us i think) < 1221942377 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance sea, ocean, lake, river, rain and such would probably just be the "water" word body, with a lot of infliction < 1221942377 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I can think stuff like "Programmerandets skönhet" would be plausible but sound rather strange < 1221942391 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone should learn it, hkuil, i mean < 1221942396 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather I would use "skönheten i programmering" or something like that < 1221942410 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: heh that wouldn't even be possible in norwegian, another difference < 1221942429 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it wouldn't? < 1221942434 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have to use -ing < 1221942457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, err the noun you mean? < 1221942461 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-ende is purely present participle, and also completely uninflectable < 1221942478 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, also doesn't Norwegian come in two flavours? < 1221942489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nynorsk and BokmÃ¥l < 1221942493 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah it would -ande in Nynorsk < 1221942496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what the real difference is < 1221942500 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and which is the most common < 1221942509 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bokmål is the most common < 1221942518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bokmal is the one that non-Norwegians come across most often < 1221942528 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact Nynorsk is probably closer to swedish on this point < 1221942547 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, I've heard of them both but never seen Nynorsk in a language list but Bokmal crops up all the time < 1221942575 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: its abbreviation is nn iirc < 1221942592 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nb for bokmal, they changed it from no pretty recently IIRC < 1221942601 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nn is presumably nynorsk < 1221942611 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you _do_ sometimes see it in wikipedia's left panel < 1221942630 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are there two ones then? < 1221942633 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It make no sense < 1221942662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, there? < 1221942666 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: why are there both American and British English? < 1221942677 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, how do you set the "package" property on a directory in OS X using command line < 1221942712 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, because there are two different countries, and until the last 100 years or so travel between them was not something you did easily < 1221942726 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they took separate paths in the "evolution" of the language < 1221942742 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I can imagine the same happening to two dialects of Norwegian until they became two different languages < 1221942751 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Norway is one rather small country < 1221942770 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :norway was under denmark. < 1221942774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, Nynorsk literally means "New Norse" < 1221942777 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until 1814. < 1221942782 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, new norwegian < 1221942782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so sounds like not that old < 1221942785 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1221942787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1221942800 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(bad translation of "Norska") < 1221942815 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until then, the official language in norway was danish. obviously we wanted to change that. < 1221942822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1221942829 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: new means absolutely nothing in a name. < 1221942829 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what was wrong with BokmÃ¥l? < 1221942846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, really? < 1221942846 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that the thing was new when it was born... which is true of quite a lot of things. < 1221942860 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1221942864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows NT < 1221942868 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bokmål was created by gradually norwegianizing the danish spoken in the capital and cities < 1221942869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(New Technology iirc) < 1221942882 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, and Nynorsk? < 1221942884 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an upper class dialect < 1221942892 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nynorsk on the other hand < 1221942905 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1221942943 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was created by a linguist (Ivar Aasen) collecting samples from various norwegian dialects, and creating a new written language out of it (with some norse inspiration too, i think) < 1221942945 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes. Even worse was Microsoft advertising "new NT technology" in one of their adverts, which is doubly redundant < 1221942987 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus in the beginning Nynorsk was more obviously "Norwegian" i guess. < 1221943001 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ouch < 1221943009 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while Bokmål had the support of the upper classes < 1221943039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yet BokmÃ¥l (Book language???????) "won"? < 1221943061 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nynorsk grew quickly, and somewhere around 1950 was used in about 50% of municipalities i think < 1221943070 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1221943078 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, came television. < 1221943085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right and? < 1221943102 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I know that when television came in the UK the BBC managed to basically standardise English by themselves < 1221943107 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably something similar happened in Norway < 1221943115 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly sent from Oslo, where the language was bokmål-like < 1221943125 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i think happened in norway too < 1221943151 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1221943166 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why didn't Radio have this effect? < 1221943169 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :television is required to have a part Nynorsk, but only 25%, and they apparently cheat by including actual dialects in it, or they did < 1221943171 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all that is still sound < 1221943178 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well maybe radio did too < 1221943199 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i am telling this from somewhat vague impression < 1221943224 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to mention (or i just did) the Samnorsk disaster of that age < 1221943259 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they attempted to _merge_ nynorsk and bokmål, by using only the common forms < 1221943276 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the result was .. ugly, from both points of view < 1221943345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1221943371 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there were reports of parents correcting their children's school books :D < 1221943377 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, also what do you mean with including "actual dialects" < 1221943418 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well bokmål and nynorsk are both in principle written forms. this does not prevent them from having somewhat standardized pronunciation < 1221943440 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is used by official newscasters and such < 1221943460 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, some people speak natively quite close to bokmål, and maybe a few to nynorsk) < 1221943484 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a great channel, where else could I get up-to-the minute interesting information about Norwegian dialects that actually developed from something ontopic? < 1221943528 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in norway, spoken dialects have an unusually high prestige, and so many people _don't_ standardize when they speak < 1221943536 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't, for example) < 1221943559 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this developed from the 60's or so, i think < 1221943604 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the TV channels included those that did this in their "Nynorsk" quota, for a while < 1221943620 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well there was just one channel really until around 1980) < 1221943637 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which meant nynorsk itself was marginalized even further < 1221943638 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't mÃ¥l goal in both swedish and norwegian < 1221943659 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both goal and speech < 1221943681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if there's any relation between the meanings < 1221943741 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't think of anything < 1221943743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think maybe it also means "paint" in swedish? (norw. "mal") < 1221943762 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that's nynorsk too < 1221943785 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1221943807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, in Latin "latus" means both "having been carried" and "wide", you can get all sorts of weird combinations like that < 1221943876 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ferre, tuli, latus. that's one weird verb. < 1221943885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, definitely < 1221943913 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least the "ferro" and "ferre" forms almost form a pattern < 1221943943 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although to fit with other verbs it should really be ferrere not ferre < 1221943997 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how well do you ppl know latin? < 1221944010 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fero actually < 1221944028 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION read a grammar 20 years ago. impressive memory, really. < 1221944040 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean even i am impressed < 1221944058 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember things from 20 years back too < 1221944059 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :few actual words though < 1221944084 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grammar sticks in your mind, vocab I've forgotten most of really < 1221944103 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although English is sufficiently based on Latin that most Latin words correspond to some English word < 1221944105 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: more like ferere, except dropping the middle -e- all over the place iirc < 1221944107 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just not normally the most common one < 1221944109 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a few weeks after conception, i was checking out the wall of the uterus < 1221944113 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was kinda dark < 1221944119 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's not much to it < 1221944135 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: heh < 1221944146 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a baby's vision is in black and white for the first few days < 1221944155 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rods are ready immediately but the cones take some time < 1221944166 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've had the same experience with grammar, i can imagine being able to perfectly learn a language in a few weeks, apart from the vocab < 1221944166 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: [citation needed] :D < 1221944186 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: this is me remembering it from somewhere, not sure where, so not sure if it was a reliable source or not < 1221944205 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are lots of random data I remember from years back, most of which are true by chance but many of which are likely complete nonsense, or urban legends < 1221944213 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so take that with 0.294 of a pinch of salt < 1221944227 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: maybe that's something we esolangers have in common < 1221944231 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a volume unit joke, ais? < 1221944281 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: yes, also I'm poking fun at the whole pinch of salt metaphor < 1221944292 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well usually i can just take a few pages of data from the grammar book, and summarize them in a more general rule < 1221944307 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since these are usually pretty simple concepts, it's not like you can forget them < 1221944321 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Latin grammar is pretty regular, except when it isn't < 1221944327 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but lots more regular than English, anyway < 1221944345 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently Hungarian has an even more regular grammar, but I would probably never be bothered to learn the vocab < 1221944354 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :english has no grammar! it just has sentences, and you have to memorize them < 1221944374 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION laughs out loud in real life < 1221944377 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try lojban, it's fun and nice :-) < 1221944382 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily there's nobody to hear me and throw me out this time < 1221944392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like there often is when people in #esoteric make me laugh a lot < 1221944407 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you been thrown out? :P < 1221944452 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not quite, although I got a warning once < 1221944462 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and some funny looks more than once < 1221944505 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the moment though I'm on my own in an empty lab < 1221944511 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have a pretty fun course at the uni, the project is to code a texas hold'em ai, and there's a tournament at the end of the period < 1221944511 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even have music blaring as nobody else is here < 1221944526 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all the lights in the building have turned themselves off due to nobody being around < 1221944531 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was thinking esolangs :-) < 1221944531 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from the ones in here < 1221944537 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: are there money prices? :D < 1221944561 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly no, and since i don't think the actual playing part is part of the grade, many will just make a randomizing ai < 1221944599 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually about distributed computing, basically the grade is for getting java to connect to the server and to coordinate the ai threads :) < 1221944619 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have multiple ai's that can cheat by reading each other's data < 1221944631 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's really strategically quite different from normal texas hold'em < 1221944650 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can say that o_O < 1221944651 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that it matters of course, since i doubt i'll need anything that sophisticated to beat everyone to the ground < 1221944666 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: not everyone's data < 1221944681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221944688 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a few agents, the opponents have a few agents, and your agents are kinda allies. < 1221944748 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was just a warning, as in 1.5 months i shall disconnect from irc forever in case i lose < 1221944770 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not, but you know, i'll change my nick to okloser or something, and cry for a few days < 1221944780 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is a bad loser < 1221944814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah you're just an okloposer < 1221944830 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ducks < 1221945099 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: your multithreaded networked Java assignment is a lot more interesting than ours < 1221945110 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had to create a multiplayer networked Snakes and Ladders game < 1221945116 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a server and any number of clients connecting to it < 1221945138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably one of the most pointless projects ever, given that Snakes and Ladders has no inputs from the user so all players could do was click a button whenever it was their turn < 1221945165 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, snakes and latters make no sense < 1221945176 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we actually implement it on another course. < 1221945183 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's more about the gui < 1221945184 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I overengineered it in protest < 1221945188 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1221945203 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had to make a poker hand class for one of the introductory courses < 1221945217 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :server automatically quitting at the right moment, handling disconnections and players quitting gracefully, could make multiple attempts to connect if you screwed up the parameters first time, and so on < 1221945222 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i made a full-blown poker game < 1221945223 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION often overengineers things in protest < 1221945248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hehehe < 1221945250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1221945250 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it was not that complicated, but as what i was supposed to do was basically a 2-tuple, it was something. < 1221945253 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do the same < 1221945258 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just write things in brainfuck in protest. < 1221945258 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, no 3d engine? < 1221945274 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: we had to use a pre-provided class for the actual gameplay itself < 1221945280 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which drew snakes-and-ladders boards < 1221945286 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just interface to it < 1221945291 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221945302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :source code for it wasn't provided either, just the compiled version < 1221945317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I had to do a bit of reverse-engineering to get it working in my AWT program, as it was Swing itself < 1221945324 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :figuring out what sort of wrappers it needed < 1221945330 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should've reverse-engineered what it output to the screen, and rerender it to 3d < 1221945338 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the Scheme "introduction to programming" course one of the weekly assignments was "draw something including some text and an ellipse" (using the provided "xdraw" library/app); a friend wrote a raytracer for that. < 1221945344 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION dislikes Swing as they don't see why Java should force their GUI on users rather than the one they're used to < 1221945353 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, for example "make a php page that implements a quiz with three 4-possible-answers questions". Pointless IMO. So I made a extensible quiz engine that can handle any amount of predefined questions with any amount of answers < 1221945376 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And received 0 points, I think, since the metacircular evaluator used by the automatical-grading-bot was so slow it didn't finish rendering the scene.) < 1221945392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably everyone in here overengineers the answers to stupid programming questions < 1221945395 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: what about you? < 1221945399 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what is the diff between Swing and AWT? < 1221945417 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: AWT uses the platform's widgets, Swing is almost an OS of its own < 1221945426 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with rendering the entire window, and everything < 1221945429 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, automated grading bot. Ugh < 1221945443 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I hope he/she talked to the teacher about that! < 1221945450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION agrees with AnMaster < 1221945469 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and well I prefer using native widgets < 1221945471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks better < 1221945474 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do I < 1221945494 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: tusho doesn't have assignments < 1221945496 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why I used AWT, whereas everyone else used Swing because it was easier to interface with the teacher's code and what I was taught < 1221945498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, though arguably, on Linux "native" widgets aren't well defined < 1221945509 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It's the "introduction to programming" course with gazillion students, and with N weekly programming assigments I don't think the department has the resources to manually grade them; at least the final "programming project" part was looked at by a human. < 1221945511 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I'd argue on my desktop that happens to be KDE < 1221945515 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION remembers another teacher, where we both spent most of the lessons complaining about how stupid the syllabus was < 1221945529 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well native is whatever AWT uses on your system, from Java's point of view < 1221945536 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well didn't he/she complain about that specific issue to the teacher < 1221945555 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: complaining about bugs in the grading system is worthwhile IMO, even if autograders are fine normally < 1221945561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, "syllabus"? < 1221945583 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the set of knowledge that a university or school course is meant to teach < 1221945588 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221945607 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, it was how to write ELIZA-alikes and expert systems using POP11 < 1221945628 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's more of a "feature" that it doesn't get stuck in infinite loops; I think it was the only "sensible" program that went over the execution time limit. Don't know whether he complained or not, it might not have made any difference in the course grade. I'm sure he at least talked about it with the teacher. < 1221945628 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and POP11 is a pretty uninteresting and annoying-to-use imperative language < 1221945643 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, or "print all primes between 0 and 100 using php" -> full blown Sieve of Atkins(!) in PHP, took about a day. < 1221945666 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it had rudimentary pattern matching, and did loops with recursion, and that's about it for its interesting features < 1221945671 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, not auto grading, the teacher did give me a strange look the lesson after, but didn't comment on it < 1221945672 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and he also wrote a patch to the "xdraw" drawing thing, because that was the major reason the raytracer was so slow. The silly thing had a putpixel performance that was (at least) O(n) where n is the amount of colors used in the image. < 1221945700 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you could have done that without even a t < 1221945880 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the part of the word that was obvious, rather than the confusing part < 1221945880 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean in mine < 1221945907 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you left the tion in, it disappears in the inflected word in this case < 1221945924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah well, that is one part I dislike in English < 1221945928 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more exceptions than rules < 1221945971 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, no exceptions, no rules, just sentences :) < 1221946005 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: but that isn't even a sentence... < 1221946349 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :module random: < 1221946351 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EXPORTS < 1221946351 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : seed() -> ran() < 1221946351 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Seeds random number generation with default (fixed) values in the process dictionary, and returns the old state. < 1221946352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1221946370 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there is a seed(A, B, C) too, that you can use if you want something random) < 1221946387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like {A1,A2,A3} = now(), random:seed(A1, A2, A3) < 1221946480 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who pinged me, why < 1221946482 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will kill them < 1221946493 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, ais523 I think < 1221946509 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I pinged you because you asked em to < 1221946511 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/em/m/e < 1221946519 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221946520 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\/e$/e\// < 1221946526 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : s/em/m/e <-- wtf? < 1221946536 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: a typo, I fixed it on the next line < 1221946549 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could also have fixed it with sub m () {"me";} < 1221946551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hey use a different separator whe you use sed on an existing sed expression! < 1221946556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's sed < 1221946558 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not perl < 1221946561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very clear < 1221946562 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would have been a lot more obscure < 1221946564 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is perl < 1221946566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also my corrections are in Perl < 1221946568 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's sed < 1221946571 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's not < 1221946574 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 knows, he wrote it < 1221946577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is < 1221946580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you've seen how complicated my regex corrections get sometimes you'd know why < 1221946598 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The sky is green" "No it's not, it's blue" "Yes it is" "No it's not" "Yes it's green" "No, it is most definitely blue" < 1221946622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, it[who?] has been proved that if there are only two people in Finland, and 5 of them are in #esoteric then ais523's corrections are in sed not perl < 1221946632 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine is based on logic < 1221946634 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yours is not < 1221946639 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus darwin (the pope) agrees with me < 1221946639 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :qed < 1221946641 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: luckily there are more than 2 people in finland < 1221946647 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also your argument is correct but irrelevant < 1221946656 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well tusho said there were only two < 1221946661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few days ago < 1221946667 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are only two < 1221946669 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and six or so are in here < 1221946671 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see! < 1221946681 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can link you to the logs with my elaborate proof < 1221946682 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you wish < 1221946684 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | there are only two people in Finland, and 5 of them are in #esoteric < 1221946688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well that still holds true, thanks to the extended hypothesis < 1221946703 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darwin was a pope? < 1221946706 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes < 1221946711 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can link you to the proof of that too < 1221946716 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, not the one I know of < 1221946749 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes < 1221946750 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes he was < 1221946757 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, 1 darwin = 10 darwins < 1221946765 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, popes are antidarwins < 1221946767 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in actual fact < 1221946769 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pope is darwin < 1221946771 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in denial < 1221946776 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that gets confusing when you realise that the pope was darwin to start with < 1221946776 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only if darwin == infinite < 1221946785 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because darwin cannot doubt himself. < 1221946792 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, we must all hail darwin, defeater of human preconceptions < 1221946793 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only then does 1 darwin = 10 darwin hold true < 1221946796 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: wrong < 1221946803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, oh? < 1221946804 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's okay, because 1 darwin = 10 darwin holds only in africa < 1221946807 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's african mathematicis < 1221946810 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mathematics < 1221946810 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What the fuck are you people talking about < 1221946815 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_, no clue < 1221946815 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it involve any bees < 1221946815 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: darwin < 1221946817 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION agrees with Slereah_ < 1221946817 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his Supreme Popeity < 1221946839 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION agrees with ais523  < 1221946840 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is actually just an elaborate collection of injokes that actually makes sense in its own closed world with warped logic, btw < 1221946851 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(now we just need Slereah_ to agree with me to form a cycle) < 1221946864 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree with Darwin < 1221946872 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am darwin < 1221946872 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok that was interesting < 1221946874 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so are you < 1221946879 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore you agreed with me < 1221946889 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: actually Darwin is an operating system < 1221946891 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the statement was: "Slereah_ should eat his hat and post pictures on the internet" < 1221946896 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, that ismerely a manifestation < 1221946901 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of the darwin time cube < 1221946910 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do not let the popes pope drone mobiles from sheffield take you away < 1221946920 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know they are coming when...you hear... the... sound..... < 1221946927 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I think I'm going to put tusho on ignore now, and I hope so are you < 1221946954 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric is a serious business zone! < 1221946964 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: before I came here I used to read Usenet a lot, although I never killfiled anyone I got quite adept at ignoring them mentally < 1221946965 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only 100% serious enterprise business - like the cfunge committee - can be discussed here. < 1221946967 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Curiously in Discordianism, according to their scripture (such as it is), everyone is a Pope; so Darwin would've been one too. < 1221946969 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is of great importance. < 1221946977 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, "killified"? < 1221946978 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Discordianism is the pope < 1221946986 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: killfiled < 1221946991 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not quite the same < 1221946998 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, which is? < 1221946999 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: am I on mental ignore < 1221947015 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also AnMaster still has not figured out a way to get his computer to search the web for information, is ee < 1221947015 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: depends on what you say < 1221947017 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i see < 1221947023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: killfiling on Usenet is like /ignore on IRC < 1221947027 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: time cube educated stupid darwin pope am i on mental ignore < 1221947032 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ah < 1221947034 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although good newsreaders let you killfile threads as well as people < 1221947048 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the IRC equivalent is /part, I think... < 1221947065 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hah < 1221947089 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's more like unsubscribing. < 1221947121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah yes < 1221947127 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We could all add a conversation identifier prefix to our messages so it would be possible to ignore "threads". < 1221947181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wouldn't work well < 1221947223 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: why not? < 1221947228 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have multiple convo tags < 1221947231 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on linux how do you mount one partition on a cd when the cd got several? like a hfs one and an iso one < 1221947241 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, timecube and linux < 1221947245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and tusho is on mental ignore < 1221947250 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :timecube linux @ AnMaster: You educate stupid! < 1221947252 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see < 1221947266 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: do the partitions have separate filenames? < 1221947270 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the timecube operating system < 1221947273 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, it's easy, just use the mount command by hand < 1221947274 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, all I see is /dev/sr0 < 1221947281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# file -s /dev/sr0 < 1221947281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/dev/sr0: Apple Partition data block size: 512, first type: Apple_partition_map, name: Apple, number of blocks: 63, second type: Apple_Driver_ATAPI, name: Macintosh, number of blocks: 4, third type: Apple_Free, name: , number of blocks: 0, < 1221947288 0 :optbot!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :the entire backlog of #esoteric: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric | see ed murphy's reply < 1221947308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got no idea how to look at the separate partitions of it < 1221947324 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, can we use the timecube to implement twoducks? < 1221947331 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, //dev/sr0 is my dvd reader btw < 1221947335 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: twoducks is HARMONIOUS TIME CUBE POPE < 1221947345 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be low-level stuff, I'm not too sure how it works but there may be some way to mknod a block-special-device for that partition < 1221947379 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But < 1221947381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, udev should handle it < 1221947383 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If time is cube < 1221947385 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is space < 1221947404 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess i should read some timecube stuff to find out. or maybe i should try to preserve the last vestiges of sanity. < 1221947445 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I suggest the latter < 1221947450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ah, not sure if it isn't working, I don't know that much about that sort of thing < 1221947457 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: to answer that, you need a space time pair of ducks < 1221947463 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily there are lots of other Linux users on IRC, some of them will probably know < 1221947469 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan : Boo! < 1221947470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, guess so < 1221947481 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will look at it tomorrow < 1221947484 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: see Triangle and Robert < 1221947485 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You also need a kernel with CONFIG_MAC_PARTITION=y to get those partition tables read. < 1221947540 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Probably.) < 1221947557 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not quite sure about hfs/iso hybrid-CDs. < 1221947657 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I have that option < 1221947700 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I asked in #linux, but issue is no one ever responds there (though a few respond to the newbie questions all the time, none responds to advanced ones) < 1221947909 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just remember that mkisofs/genisoimage can do iso/hfs hybrids, don't know about mounting. Although if you yourself can read the relevant formats, usually you can mount just about anything with -o loop=/dev/sr0,offset=magic-number-to-start-of-partition. < 1221947922 0 :poiuy_qwert!n=poiuyqwe@bas2-toronto47-1242437529.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1221947974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm I don't know the offsets < 1221947980 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: why do you always bother me about your os x troubles < 1221947981 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not fizzie < 1221947984 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he uses os x too < 1221947993 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well I didn't know that < 1221947996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks for the info < 1221948000 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1221948002 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess you're deaf < 1221948008 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since he's talked about running cfunge on os x < 1221948013 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and misc. mentions of os x < 1221948017 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also answered your os x qs before < 1221948022 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but I thought that was some temp thing < 1221948072 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No Man or God exists as One, for _Cubic fish of Opposites_, divide the Egg into 4 Opposing Quadrants. < 1221948171 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a iBook laptop that just seems to work better with OS X. And actually I'm currently writing this using it, since my main desktop managed to get some mysterious hardware issues during the move to this new apartment. < 1221948489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I have an really old ibook. first model of ibook. PPC, 3.2 GB harddrive < 1221948495 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS 9 or 8 iirc < 1221948503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :32 MB RAM(!) < 1221948527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though extended with another 32 MB module to 64 MB < 1221948565 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a home built laptop would own < 1221948569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why that is so hard < 1221948577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :home built towers sure < 1221948580 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why never laptops < 1221948625 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: deep < 1221948639 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Good ol' Time Cube gave me that one :P < 1221948659 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1221948659 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1221948702 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time cube is a joke right? < 1221948707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is someone actually that mad? < 1221948743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) _someone_ is actually that mad, for whatever value of mad (2) don't know about time cube < 1221948743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, GregorR ^ < 1221948767 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, huh? < 1221948769 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time cube is not a joke, no < 1221948775 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gene ray is just a deranged old man with schizophrenia < 1221948790 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did quite a bit of idle research in to it < 1221948804 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: for whatever value of mad, there is always someone that mad < 1221948836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1221948855 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Time Cube is a joke to everyone except Gene Ray :P < 1221948885 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah gene ray is quite thoroughly mentally ill < 1221948891 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i doubt anything can really be done for him < 1221948902 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best thing to do: laugh heartily < 1221948915 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theory: by an amazing coincidence, everything gene ray says is actually perfectly correct, but it will take humanity millennia to discover this < 1221948959 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ftp://ftp.mklinux.apple.com/pub/Other_Tools/ < 1221948962 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.timecube.com/TheWisestHuman_newimg_GeneRayCube.jpg < 1221948964 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mac-fdisk < 1221948966 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ deranged old man. < 1221948989 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1221948992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the url is broken < 1221948998 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[I] sys-fs/mac-fdisk < 1221948998 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Available versions: 0.1-r6 < 1221948998 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Installed versions: 0.1-r6(23.15.49 2008-09-20) < 1221948998 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Homepage: ftp://ftp.mklinux.apple.com/pub/Other_Tools/ < 1221948998 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Description: Mac/PowerMac disk partitioning utility < 1221949014 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: this is our problem and we can fix it, certainly < 1221949021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but download worked < 1221949022 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however.... that is OLd by the looks of it < 1221949024 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PowerMac? < 1221949027 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from gentoo mirrors < 1221949035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, well... lets see... < 1221949044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember using one < 1221949049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ages ago < 1221949051 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatevs < 1221949056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably before you were born tusho < 1221949058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1221949060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ducks < 1221949064 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pre-1995? < 1221949068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah ok < 1221949072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after you were born < 1221949074 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1221949085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but before you started school < 1221949090 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh. < 1221949090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1997 or so) < 1221949090 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so when. < 1221949094 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221949102 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho, maybe 1998 < 1221949104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1221949114 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but something like that < 1221949117 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time cube was founded in 1997 < 1221949121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1221949121 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coincidence? I think not. < 1221949127 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coincidence < 1221949143 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1221949146 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time cubincidence < 1221949150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a carefully-planned coincidence < 1221949160 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like all coincidences < 1221949264 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i seem to recall you believe in syncronicity :P < 1221949265 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sp < 1221949297 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1221949303 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fixed mounting the dvd < 1221949314 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use mac-fdisk on dvd to get offsets < 1221949321 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, mount with offset parameter < 1221949415 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: on my better days < 1221949439 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: clearly it is synchronicity when your better days are < 1221949445 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1221949455 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-085-016-239-200.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1221949457 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grammar your excellent is < 1221949471 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yoda am i < 1221949503 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone pointed out there was no International like Yoda speak Day < 1221949514 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found it let us < 1221949538 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in IWC's ITLA Pirate D thread, i think) < 1221949557 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too much work it is < 1221949579 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :naw < 1221949587 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a website need we make just < 1221949600 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, in Latin the Yoda word order was one of the most commonly-used < 1221949615 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seen my website have? clearly for me still too much work it is < 1221949629 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: then volunteer do i < 1221949634 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Latin you could more or less randomly jumble the order of words in sentences and they would still mean the same thing if they weren't too complex < 1221949642 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Yoda word order popular was... < 1221949686 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My dick you can suck < 1221949687 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe google absolutely sure it not already does exist to make i should do < 1221949709 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: idea good is that < 1221949717 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn they were lying < 1221949731 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1221949738 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.talklikeyoda.com/ < 1221949748 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damnit < 1221949754 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a bit out of date that website is < 1221949758 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slightly < 1221949764 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CODE LIKE YODA < 1221949769 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1221949776 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is "code like Yoda" RPN? < 1221949778 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LIKE YODA CODE < 1221949790 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: What about an International Talk Like a ...! < 1221949797 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Whereinst you talk like a Ninja) < 1221949802 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Ninjay.) < 1221949808 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ninjas don't talk, tusho < 1221949811 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't make noises < 1221949815 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: exactly. < 1221949816 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus the < 1221949817 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...! < 1221949823 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ... is eerie silence < 1221949827 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ! is them cutting your throat < 1221949842 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: actually i think Yoda order is OSV while Latin was fond of SOV? < 1221949866 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yoda order is SOV IIRC < 1221949872 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Word order free english talk am I in experiment as. < 1221949875 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, Latin is definitely SOV by default < 1221949877 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS being rare but not unknown in human languages (Malagasy e.g.) < 1221949880 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Understand you can me? < 1221949898 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho : Go further < 1221949901 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Letter order < 1221949901 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although adjectives make things more interesting as in Latin they needn't be attached to the noun they affect < 1221949908 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: Confusing that is too. < 1221949916 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like this let us talk < 1221949922 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, definitely OSV or close, _it_ _is_ < 1221949930 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1221949937 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then, "it is" is one word in Latin < 1221949945 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so when the subject's a pronoun, Latin is OSV < 1221949946 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true that is < 1221949974 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amazing monocles < 1221950039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monocles sounds like a Greek name, if you pronounce it Mono-cles < 1221950042 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a long e < 1221950044 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres < 1221950060 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :monnasdas < 1221950061 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's hardly typical word order, it's poetic word order < 1221950066 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you anagram the sentence to make it scan well < 1221950079 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but it separates the adjective from the noun < 1221950080 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey guys let's talk in RPN english < 1221950083 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and pack everything into one sentence < 1221950088 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we get tons of nouns and adjectives such < 1221950089 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe < 1221950090 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's confusing < 1221950092 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until the verbs at the end < 1221950093 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort it all out < 1221950114 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i that idea good is think < 1221950186 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I idea good all you think not see < 1221950188 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should prepositions be postponed? < 1221950195 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know not < 1221950214 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it experiment with perhaps < 1221950231 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :way optimal the to find < 1221950294 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brain almost hard grammar thinking quota out of is < 1221950343 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I I that got think < 1221950382 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I game the lost just < 1221950390 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: how? < 1221950453 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i27.tinypic.com/zxts7d.gif this image, which I've already forgotten where it was posted due to the annoyance of losing it but I think it was wikipedia or a forum or something < 1221950515 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, i forgot about the rpn < 1221950529 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would have been epic in rpn < 1221950555 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads http://home.nvg.org/~oerjan/agora-horoscope/ again < 1221950591 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what exactly the rules for yoda grammar are? < 1221950594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1221950608 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the force you must use < 1221950727 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.talklikeyoda.com/howto/ < 1221950752 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although there was an essay linked to that i just gave up on < 1221952404 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1221952448 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tusho: I idea good all you think not see <<< could someone parse this for me < 1221952454 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1221952458 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here < 1221952465 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bracketize it < 1221952481 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ((idea good) (all you) think not) see < 1221952488 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be (you all), possibly < 1221952502 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in regular english: < 1221952515 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see you all think not good idea < 1221952567 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y'all think that? < 1221952586 0 :tusho!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1221952593 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with you all it's pretty sensible yeah < 1221954600 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"9"