00:00:27 -!- FireFly has quit ("Brb IRL").
00:00:32 <oklopol> oerjan: finns tend to drop articles, and occasionally swap a/an. i don't think "an english" could ever happen.
00:00:43 <oklopol> the english maybe
00:01:20 -!- CakeProphet has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
00:01:25 <oklopol> ofc there's no such thing as a reasonable mistake
00:03:59 <oklopol> i want to make a graphical programming language :|
00:04:11 <oklopol> not only based on graphs, but also, like, graphical.
00:04:15 <ehird> i wrote a 6 line concatenative program
00:04:20 <ehird> non-concatenative version? 20 fucking lines.
00:04:22 <ehird> fuck yeah.
00:04:31 <ehird> more like 25 actually.
00:04:43 <oklopol> what's the program
00:05:30 <ehird> it isn't technically a program as much as a program fragment I cooked up when thinking about concatenative langs for a game engine scripting language
00:05:35 <oerjan> ehird: so you have a non-concatenative fucking programming language where the programs consist of fucking lines?
00:05:37 <ehird> :P
00:05:38 <ehird> class: <person> name age ;
00:05:39 <ehird> : make-person <person> make 'age set! 'name set! ;
00:05:41 <ehird> : speak [ 'name get ] dip "%s says: %s\n" printf ;
00:05:43 <ehird> class: <npc>:<person> evilness ;
00:05:45 <ehird> : make-npc make-person <npc> downcast 'evilness set! ;
00:05:47 <ehird> oerjan: verily,.
00:12:17 -!- jix_ has joined.
00:16:59 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
00:32:27 -!- Corun has quit ("This computer has gone to sleep").
00:36:00 -!- jix_ has quit ("...").
02:20:18 <bsmntbombgirl> ugh
02:20:26 <bsmntbombgirl> i HATE not being able to read full text of paper
02:20:28 <bsmntbombgirl> goddamn
02:27:26 -!- CakeProphet has joined.
02:42:19 -!- bsmntbombgirl has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
02:45:40 -!- bsmntbombgirl has joined.
02:46:30 -!- bsmntbombgirl has changed nick to bsmntbombdood.
03:13:04 <bsmntbombdood> i need an idea
03:13:37 <oerjan> buy wallabies!
03:14:56 * oerjan notes that the genius of his idea has left bsmntbombdood speechless
03:15:31 <bsmntbombdood> a _good_ idea
03:16:19 <oerjan> what do you have against wallabies, you animal fiend
03:17:44 <bsmntbombdood> Ken Thompson visited our lab at QMC while I was developing it and said something like: "yeah, I've seen editors like that, but I don't feel a need for them, I don't want to see the state of the file when I'm editing".
03:17:55 <bsmntbombdood> when discussing em vs ed
03:21:07 -!- Sgeo has joined.
03:48:48 -!- sazl has joined.
05:01:15 -!- oerjan has quit ("leaving").
05:09:11 -!- sazl has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:09:11 -!- mtve has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:09:11 -!- Leonidas has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:09:14 -!- Leonidas has joined.
05:09:21 -!- sazl has joined.
05:09:27 -!- mtve has joined.
05:09:40 -!- mtve has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:09:41 -!- SimonRC has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:10:04 -!- sebbu has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:10:04 -!- adimit has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:10:23 -!- sebbu has joined.
05:11:31 -!- Sgeo has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:11:47 -!- Sgeo has joined.
05:12:10 -!- sazl has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:10 -!- Leonidas has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:10 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:10 -!- oklopol has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:11 -!- dbc has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:11 -!- lamente has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:12 -!- AnMaster has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:26 -!- oklopol has joined.
05:12:29 -!- dbc has joined.
05:12:32 -!- lamente has joined.
05:12:59 -!- bsmntbombdood has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:12:59 -!- Slereah has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:13:00 -!- ehird has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:13:00 -!- GregorR has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:13:05 -!- ehird has joined.
05:13:07 -!- Slereah2 has joined.
05:13:27 -!- puzzlet has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:13:28 -!- comex has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:13:37 -!- comex has joined.
05:13:38 -!- GregorR has joined.
05:13:48 -!- rodgort has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:13:54 -!- rodgort has joined.
05:13:58 -!- Sgeo has quit (Client Quit).
05:14:05 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined.
05:14:21 -!- comex has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:14:21 -!- Slereah2 has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:14:22 -!- MizardX has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:14:22 -!- Dewi has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:14:23 -!- Ilari has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:14:23 -!- ineiros has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:14:24 -!- Leonidas has joined.
05:14:29 -!- sazl has joined.
05:14:29 -!- MizardX has joined.
05:14:32 -!- comex has joined.
05:14:36 -!- cherez has joined.
05:14:43 -!- Slereah2 has joined.
05:15:06 -!- Leonidas has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:15:06 -!- lamente has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:15:08 -!- decipher has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:15:08 -!- kerlo has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:16:01 -!- MizardX has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:16:02 -!- sebbu has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:16:02 -!- CakeProphet has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:16:02 -!- Judofyr has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:16:04 -!- ski__ has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:16:19 -!- MizardX has joined.
05:16:29 -!- CakeProphet has joined.
05:17:32 -!- oklopol has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:17:32 -!- Asztal has quit (kornbluth.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:17:52 -!- sebbu has joined.
05:18:30 -!- puzzlet has joined.
05:19:00 -!- Judofyr has joined.
05:19:27 -!- Leonidas has joined.
05:24:12 -!- ski__ has joined.
05:24:17 -!- Asztal has joined.
05:24:34 -!- ineiros has joined.
05:24:42 -!- SimonRC has joined.
05:31:10 -!- clog has joined.
05:31:10 -!- clog has joined.
05:31:11 -!- comex has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:31:11 -!- CakeProphet has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:31:11 -!- GregorR has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:31:21 -!- sebbu has joined.
05:31:21 -!- rodgort has joined.
05:31:23 -!- comex has joined.
05:31:39 -!- CakeProphet has joined.
05:31:56 -!- GregorR has joined.
05:32:45 -!- pikhq has joined.
05:33:03 -!- Judofyr has joined.
05:33:05 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined.
05:33:20 -!- ehird has joined.
05:34:08 -!- puzzlet has joined.
05:37:19 -!- MizardX has joined.
05:37:22 -!- MizardX has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net).
05:37:43 -!- Deewiant has joined.
05:37:44 -!- sazl has joined.
05:37:55 -!- MizardX has joined.
05:38:18 -!- kerlo has joined.
05:41:18 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined.
05:41:52 -!- oklopol has joined.
05:42:16 -!- lifthrasiir has joined.
05:42:39 -!- Leonidas has joined.
05:42:57 -!- fizzie has joined.
05:43:18 -!- decipher has joined.
05:44:11 -!- ski__ has joined.
05:44:33 -!- Ilari has joined.
05:45:34 -!- lamente has joined.
05:45:57 -!- AnMaster has joined.
05:52:49 -!- cherez has left (?).
07:02:45 -!- jix has joined.
07:20:20 -!- CakeProphet has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended).
08:00:00 -!- clog has joined.
08:46:11 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
08:59:52 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit ("Client Excited").
09:07:37 -!- puzzlet_ has joined.
09:08:20 -!- puzzlet has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
09:18:42 -!- comex has quit (Remote closed the connection).
09:18:55 -!- comex has joined.
10:59:26 -!- jix has joined.
11:47:36 -!- Slereah has joined.
12:01:52 -!- Slereah2 has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
12:06:50 -!- Sgeo has joined.
13:46:21 <Deewiant> Is there no "not implemented" category/list on the wiki?
13:49:41 <fizzie> Isn't that just the set subtraction of the language list and the Implemented category? (What, MediaWiki doesn't do set operations?)
13:50:11 -!- Sgeo has quit ("Leaving").
13:50:14 <Deewiant> (Not in the UI, at least.)
13:50:17 <fizzie> Related: there are 192 articles in the "Languages" category, but 200 articles in the "Implemented" category. That probably means there are -8 unimplemented languages.
13:51:06 <Deewiant> fizzie: Unfortunately you'll find that the 192 refers only to the number it's showing on that page, which is less than 200 due to the subcategories.
13:51:14 <fizzie> Yes, that was the silly.
13:51:16 <fizzie> Just noticed.
13:51:38 <Deewiant> Aaand evidently subcategories aren't shown on just one page either.
13:51:40 <Deewiant> http://www.esolangs.org/wiki/Category:Unimplemented
13:51:46 <Deewiant> Hooray for UI.
13:51:47 <fizzie> Yes, it seems to be sorted.
13:53:34 <fizzie> Heh, Καλλίστῃ is apparently written with a kappa instead of a 'k', since it's at the end of the list there.
13:54:05 <Deewiant> Hooray for byte value-based sorting.
13:56:14 <fizzie> Anyway... 71 in Unimplemented, 200+62=262 in Implemented, 192+179+11=382 in Languages; this time I counted them right. 49 languages are neither implemented, nor unimplemented; probably some sort of superposition of both.
13:56:51 <Deewiant> Moving some of the Unimplemented to Unimplementable might be in order
13:57:10 <Deewiant> For instance, the already mentioned Καλλίστῃ.
14:44:27 -!- Judofyr has quit (Remote closed the connection).
14:51:46 -!- jix has quit ("...").
15:23:15 -!- decipher has quit (Remote closed the connection).
15:24:03 <MizardX> $base(111011010,2,10)
15:24:13 <MizardX> ... forgot //echo -a
15:26:47 <MizardX> and missed a 0
15:26:59 <ehird> :<
15:37:55 -!- sebbu2 has joined.
15:44:34 -!- sebbu has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
15:57:16 -!- Slereah2 has joined.
16:03:23 -!- Slereah has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)).
16:08:04 -!- puzzlet_ has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)).
16:08:07 -!- puzzlet has joined.
16:13:53 -!- Slereah has joined.
16:15:05 -!- MigoMipo has joined.
16:31:14 -!- Slereah2 has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
17:07:52 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined.
17:12:56 -!- oerjan has joined.
17:14:33 -!- puzzlet has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
17:15:00 -!- puzzlet has joined.
17:23:18 -!- oerjan has quit ("Whoosh!").
17:50:35 -!- Metcalf has joined.
17:52:14 <Metcalf> Hi :-)
17:55:58 -!- Metcalf has changed nick to impomatic.
17:56:05 -!- FireFly has joined.
18:17:41 <impomatic> Is there a term for mainstream languages that are rarely used / hear of? E.g. Oberon
18:24:26 <ehird> Dead
18:24:27 <ehird> :P
18:27:41 -!- Azstal has joined.
18:27:43 <MizardX> impomatic: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080118233717AASGNps
18:28:06 -!- kar8nga has joined.
18:28:27 <impomatic> Hi ehird, and thanks MizardX
18:28:42 <ehird> lol, yahoo answers
18:28:54 <ehird> impomatic: I saw a reddit submission of yours earlier today :-)
18:28:59 <ehird> recognized the name
18:30:59 <ehird> impomatic: what's a reverse call? I'm not sure I understand
18:31:11 <ehird> also, is #2-return, <stack just a comment?
18:31:18 <ehird> not too hot at redcode...
18:31:59 <impomatic> I use impomatic in most places, twitter, stumbleupon, delicious, blogger, reddit
18:33:20 <impomatic> Each redcode opcode has two operands (though sometimes they're omited)
18:33:20 <impomatic> equ defines a macro
18:33:41 <ehird> ah
18:33:46 <ehird> so "mov    #2-return, <stack "
18:33:49 <ehird> is mov with two arguments
18:33:49 <ehird> OK
18:34:01 <impomatic> so: call equ mov #2-return, <stack ; defines call to be a mov #2-return, <stack
18:34:03 <impomatic> :-)
18:34:17 <ehird> what about a reverse jump? a function that is before the IP or something?
18:34:22 <ehird> er
18:34:23 <ehird> reverse call
18:37:03 <bsmntbombdood> mainstream, but never heard of?
18:37:06 <bsmntbombdood> how does that work?
18:40:41 <impomatic> There are a couple of solutions to that problem on my blog, but they're both a bit messy
18:40:41 <impomatic> There's a redcode specific IRC channel, #corewars on irc.koth.org
18:40:41 <impomatic> If the subroutine is above the call in the source listing, the calculated addresses are incorrect
18:40:41 <impomatic> Due to wierd behaviour in the macro pre-processor
18:41:19 <ehird> Weird.
19:01:58 -!- kar8nga has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
19:24:26 -!- olsner has joined.
19:34:44 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Remote closed the connection).
19:35:53 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined.
19:50:42 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined.
20:32:35 -!- jix has joined.
20:48:13 -!- sazl has quit ("Lost terminal").
20:54:49 <impomatic> ^bf ++++[>++++<-]>+[>>++>+>+>++<[+++++<]<-]>>>++.>-.-<++++..+++.>>--.+<<<.----->.---<[.>]
21:03:03 -!- kar8nga has joined.
21:41:03 <ehird> impomatic: no output?
21:48:32 <impomatic> No, is the bot broken?
21:48:40 <AnMaster> hi ehird
21:48:50 <ehird> ^bf ,[.,]!I am alive
21:48:54 <ehird> impomatic: er, three is no bot
21:48:55 <AnMaster> ^help
21:48:56 <ehird> fungot isn't online
21:48:58 <AnMaster> ah
21:49:00 <ehird> fizzie:
21:49:13 <ehird> fizzie: fungot's down
21:49:16 <ehird> (just some context :P)
21:49:17 <AnMaster> ehird, just to freak you out I'm going to test the results of using tcmalloc from http://code.google.com/p/google-perftools/ with cfunge ;P
21:49:29 <ehird> Ouch.
21:50:29 <impomatic> notepad k
21:50:39 <impomatic> Wrong window!
21:52:47 <AnMaster> I have no idea what the result will be.... Also this may take a while: building instructions for x86_64 linux is kind of complex due to glibc unwinder may call malloc on x86_64 causing a deadlock. So I need to install a snapshot version of libunwind first amongst other things
21:54:37 <ehird> What about the firefox/freebsd malloc? jemalloc
21:55:20 <AnMaster> ehird, it seems harder to get going as non-freebsd malloc
21:55:33 <ehird> I thought speed is what mattered. :p
21:55:40 <AnMaster> but apart from that it seems optimised to keep memory fragmentation low, rather than ultimate speed
21:55:47 <ehird> Ah.
21:55:58 <ehird> Just write yer own damn malloc. :p
21:56:00 <AnMaster> good speed yes, and good multi-cpu performance
21:56:11 <AnMaster> but not good against fragmentation
21:56:14 <AnMaster> err
21:56:17 <AnMaster> good against speed
21:56:21 <AnMaster> on single cpu
21:56:34 <AnMaster> and I don't have multi-core, nor does cfunge use more than one thread
21:57:07 <AnMaster> ehird, anyway I'd rather not do that
21:57:13 <ehird> Single-core systems. Weird shit.
21:57:19 <ehird> Do you keep a dinosaur next to it? :P
21:57:24 <AnMaster> ehird, rather a quite good system from 2005
21:57:29 <AnMaster> I just don't have that much money
21:57:35 <AnMaster> so I can go buy new every year
21:57:48 <ehird> Yeah, it's just that multi core is really really useful.
21:57:49 <AnMaster> I'm going to use this until it is really no longer usable and/or breaks
21:57:59 <AnMaster> ehird, you pay for it?
21:58:04 <ehird> because you can have a cpu thrashing away at a problem and still run smoothly
21:58:12 <ehird> AnMaster: Hm? Well, yeah, multi core systems cost.
21:58:13 <ehird> Still.
21:58:28 <ehird> It's kind of like an OS without multiprocessing to me :-)
21:58:49 <AnMaster> ehird, ah you pay for it then? Great thanks. Just send me your credit card number and the code :D
21:58:57 <ehird> O crap
21:59:21 <ehird> Um I don't have a credit card :P
21:59:29 <AnMaster> ehird, also I will send it on to a friend from Nigeria who is looking for a UK account for some millions.
21:59:29 * impomatic has an 8 cpu mini-computer :-P
21:59:34 <AnMaster> oh crap
21:59:35 <fizzie> Oh.
21:59:45 <ehird> impomatic: heh
21:59:50 <AnMaster> impomatic, hm? What sort?
22:00:08 <fizzie> "IRC read failed." Seems that freenode had some issues at some point.
22:00:12 <impomatic> Unfortunately it's from something like 1990, so not very impressive.
22:00:42 <AnMaster> fizzie, oh yes during the night, doesn't it auto reconnect?
22:00:50 <AnMaster> or don't you run it under a supervisor
22:00:57 <AnMaster> say, daemontools
22:01:00 <AnMaster> from djb
22:01:01 <impomatic> AnMaster: 19" MVME boards, with a "Cray" logo on the front
22:01:01 <AnMaster> :)
22:01:08 <AnMaster> impomatic, CRAY!!!!!!!!
22:01:09 <AnMaster> :D
22:01:16 <AnMaster> impomatic, picture?
22:01:21 <fizzie> I don't want to do that, it sounds far too serious.
22:01:24 <AnMaster> impomatic, also what is 19" in metric?
22:01:31 <fizzie> The bot itself just @s if the read fails.
22:01:36 <AnMaster> hah you got a point fizzie
22:01:51 -!- fungot has joined.
22:02:02 <AnMaster> of course, we all know esoteric languages is serious business!
22:02:06 <AnMaster> ^style
22:02:07 <fungot> Available: agora alice darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc* lovecraft pa speeches ss wp
22:02:13 <AnMaster> ^style speeches
22:02:14 <fungot> Selected style: speeches (misc. speeches from Project Gutenberg)
22:02:16 <ehird> impomatic: does it run an infinite loop in 6 seconds?
22:02:17 <AnMaster> hi fungot
22:02:18 <fungot> AnMaster: does mr bentham deny this? if he had fallen in a common vehicle. they were dominant at oxford, powerful in the inns of court, not in those known and responsible counsellors to whom he early attached himself, and then proceed to another.
22:02:35 <ehird> I nominate fungot for president 2012
22:02:38 <fungot> ehird: the effect of the victory. in 1824 the free men who seek to better their conditions, but also the most faultless, that the ablest men have been chosen as deputies of the nobility, what was never forgotten by anyone else who ever read it, as will give a single instance from our existing laws, some alterations are thought to be of any weight, who refuses to adopt the tariff, we think his explanation fnord at least, behindh
22:02:50 <ehird> A noble speech.
22:02:57 <AnMaster> bentham? isn't he the person who wanted to be preserved or whatever?
22:03:07 -!- MigoMipo has quit ("QuitIRCException: MigoMipo out of IRC").
22:03:20 <fizzie> 19" is a standardish rack size, around half a metre.
22:03:25 <AnMaster> ah
22:04:17 <impomatic> About 47cm, haven't got a photo - looks like a washing machine without the door. Never tried the infinite loop!
22:04:54 <impomatic> Is lovecraft a esolang? That'd be cool :-)
22:05:15 <ehird> hehe, ^style controls fungot's babble
22:05:16 <fungot> ehird: after the adjournment of congress, i could easily account for the obscurity of the african. the fnord sings, the spinning-wheel turns round, the wedding-day is fixed, not by the shortest fnord abate the nuisance, they pull down the house.
22:05:17 <ehird> ^style
22:05:18 <fungot> Available: agora alice darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc lovecraft pa speeches* ss wp
22:05:21 <ehird> ^style darwin
22:05:21 <fungot> Selected style: darwin (Books by Charles Darwin -- you know, that evilution guy)
22:05:24 <ehird> fungot: Be heretical!
22:05:25 <fungot> ehird:/ cumbre, includes all/ chief races have not descended by independent lines from/ rock-pigeon. this reflection :)/ moon " as indexed by/ tides, unaided by a heavy fall :) snow on rocks.
22:05:30 <ehird> oh, the :) and / bug
22:05:37 <fizzie> There's still the famous Darwin smiley issue, yes.
22:05:55 <ehird> Darwin was a happy man.
22:07:32 <fizzie> "the cumbre, includes all the chief races have not descended by independent lines from the rock-pigeon. this reflection of the moon as indexed by the tides, unaided by a heavy fall of snow on rocks." in fixed format.
22:08:05 <fizzie> It is comforting to know we have not all descended from the rock-pigeon.
22:09:16 <MizardX> ^bf ++++[>++++<-]>+[>>++>+>+>++<[+++++<]<-]>>>++.>-.-<++++..+++.>>--.+<<<.----->.---<[.>]
22:09:17 <fungot> hello world!
22:09:29 <MizardX> 85 characters :P
22:09:45 <impomatic> I've got one in 84 now!
22:13:00 <AnMaster> impomatic, oh?
22:13:00 -!- jix has quit ("...").
22:13:46 <AnMaster> is it possible to prove a specific bf program is the shortest possible encoding of a specific string in bf?
22:14:19 <olsner> by exhaustively searching all shorter programs :D
22:14:29 <AnMaster> so there is no short cut?
22:14:40 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (Remote closed the connection).
22:15:01 <impomatic> ^bf ++++[>++++<-]>+[>>++>+>+>++<[+++++<]<-]>>>++.>-.<++++..+++.>>--.++<<<.---->.--<[-.>]
22:15:02 <fungot> hello world!
22:15:07 <AnMaster> well you could exclude any program without output, and all programs with input would be uninteresting
22:15:17 -!- kar8nga has left (?).
22:15:20 <olsner> there could be, but I think there's a reason optimization is hard in general
22:16:33 <AnMaster> hm
22:19:42 <impomatic> We're also talking about bf in #corewars on irc.koth.org
22:20:30 <ehird> Tell them to come here :-P
22:20:38 <lamente> nice, corewars
22:20:38 <olsner> I had a 116-char bf hello world as a test case for my thue interpreters
22:21:43 * ehird tries to work out impomatic's name in #corewars
22:22:32 <olsner> it couldn't be just "impomatic"?
22:22:46 <ehird> there is no impomatic in there.
22:22:59 <ehird> also, nobody's talking.
22:23:07 <impomatic> OoS
22:23:20 <olsner> it's a fish with a reddish hue, that's what it is
22:23:47 <impomatic> It's OoS. I already mentioned #esoteric
22:26:29 <impomatic> ehird: it was busy before you arrived http://www.koth.org/irc-logs/2009-01-27.txt
22:26:41 <ehird> I kill everything I touch.
22:26:50 <impomatic> We're a bit shy around strangers ;-)
22:27:39 <oklopol> o
22:27:43 <ehird> impomatic: if you can get BF hello world in a standard 80-char line I'll be amazed
22:27:57 <AnMaster> ehird, result: At least this build of tcmalloc is slower than glibc malloc for cfunge
22:28:05 <ehird> i see.
22:28:11 <oklopol> WE'RE NO STRANGERS TO LOOOOOOOVE
22:28:23 <AnMaster> bu around 0.020 seconds
22:28:33 <AnMaster> tested over 50 runs each
22:29:18 <impomatic> ehird: I don't think I can knock off the last 4 instructions
22:29:20 <AnMaster> still the heap profiler should be interesting :)
22:29:24 <ehird> impomatic: aw
22:29:27 -!- nescience has joined.
22:29:36 <ehird> well
22:29:37 <ehird> [.>]
22:29:40 <ehird> is a pretty shoddy way to do it :P
22:30:05 <oklopol> AnMaster: is it possible to prove a specific bf program is the shortest possible encoding of a specific string in bf? <<< if you're asking in general, you can't be serious
22:30:17 <ehird> oklopol: no, he is
22:30:31 <ehird> I don't think AnMaster has ever fully grasped the halting problem, he says things like that all the time
22:30:33 <AnMaster> oklopol, I'm only asking for "hello world!"
22:30:34 <AnMaster> ...
22:30:45 <AnMaster> and I suspected it would run into the halting problem yes
22:30:46 * ehird rolls eyes
22:30:49 <AnMaster> but I wasn't sure
22:30:57 <oklopol> ooooooooooooooooooooooo
22:31:11 * oklopol dances a wild dance of oko
22:34:46 <ehird> [21:15]<OoS> http://golf.shinh.org/
22:34:50 <ehird> another anagolf player!
22:35:13 <MizardX> 453339721324993013548175354624816937305067727045881380840502707195746854576 possible bf-programs of length 85 :) ... that's 75 digits!
22:35:37 <AnMaster> wtf is "gv"?
22:35:49 <AnMaster> I get "could not find gv" as a cryptic error
22:35:58 <ehird> MizardX: yikes
22:36:05 <ehird> what about length 80
22:36:39 <MizardX> 15114869455135780537081431784864382700651060085404149964957776780638292 of length 80, 71 digits
22:37:01 <AnMaster> would a genetic search work at all for this? Probably not
22:37:11 <ehird> ...
22:37:12 <AnMaster> MizardX, what about excluding input?
22:37:16 <AnMaster> since it isn't relevant for this
22:37:17 <ehird> AnMaster: You're really attentative.
22:37:20 <ehird> EgoBot did that.
22:37:24 <ehird> impomatic's beaten it by far.
22:37:29 <AnMaster> ah
22:37:32 <oklopol> so.... 80 digits in octal = 71 digits in base 10? that's quite an observation :P
22:37:40 <ehird> oklopol: :P
22:37:48 <AnMaster> oklopol, :D
22:38:32 <MizardX> 284508415089842693556340016101767865172552487769291117597604246945 of length 80, without input, 66 digits
22:38:39 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined.
22:38:45 <AnMaster> MizardX, does this include invalid programs like ]]]]
22:38:50 <MizardX> no
22:38:57 <oklopol> oh it doesn't?
22:39:01 <MizardX> balanced [ ]
22:39:03 <oklopol> right, right, you're not an idiot
22:39:07 <AnMaster> good
22:39:19 <MizardX> neither ] [
22:39:37 <AnMaster> MizardX, how long would an exhaustive search take? :D
22:39:45 <AnMaster> assume a modern desktop computer
22:39:55 <AnMaster> and an optimised bf implementation
22:40:11 <AnMaster> and that each program will be terminated after, say, 10 seconds at most
22:40:22 <AnMaster> since there is no way to know if it will halt at all
22:40:52 <MizardX> 9.0157127687693897e+53 years given 1ms execution time per parogram
22:40:55 <MizardX> program*
22:41:00 <Azstal> Now we just need to know http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaitin%27s_constant to get an estimate!
22:42:10 <ehird> AnMaster treats huge brute forcing like I did a year ago.
22:42:22 <oklopol> also median running time of all halting problems
22:42:38 <oklopol> ehird: you mean all awe about combinatorial explosion?
22:42:57 <oklopol> lecturer showed today a loop that started 10 threads
22:43:11 <oklopol> for(i=0;i<10;i++)pid[i]=fork();
22:43:16 <ehird> no, just continually asking if halting problem-related things can be solved, and asking how long huge brute forcing will take as if it's even worthy of consideration
22:43:57 <impomatic> Hmmm... sounds a long time
22:44:03 <AnMaster> MizardX, and assuming IBM RoadRunner or whatever the current fastest super computer is?
22:44:11 <impomatic> It requires 12 . only two of which are next to each other
22:44:17 <ehird> I rest my case
22:44:24 <AnMaster> ehird, I was joking...
22:44:27 * oklopol waits for someone to lol @ lecturer :<
22:44:29 <AnMaster> sorry that I forgot ~
22:44:42 <ehird> Yeah, I was "joking" too in 2007
22:44:47 <impomatic> If the 1st . doesn't output a 'h' it can terminate
22:44:47 <impomatic> Forget that, . could be in a loop :-/
22:45:14 <AnMaster> ehird, so? You have been here way longer than I have
22:45:30 <ehird> Being in #esoteric is not the be-all end-all of computational knowledge.
22:45:40 <AnMaster> ehird, fully agreed
22:45:55 <AnMaster> oh gv is some "view *.ps" thing
22:45:57 <AnMaster> right
22:47:29 * Azstal invents Brainfrak, where the square brackets have chamfered edges.
22:48:03 <ehird> proto: halting problem solver which, when given P, outputs "go to hell" and terminates the program.
22:48:53 <impomatic> ghostview?
22:50:41 <FireFly> fungot?
22:50:43 <fungot> FireFly: " 651? 1. this paragraph was published in/ :( notices" just alluded to. in/ tenth chapter it was shown that no ascertained limit to/ amount :) structural difference between/ inhabitants :)/ radack archipelago, a length :) time.
22:50:45 <FireFly> Hi
23:00:43 -!- oerjan has joined.
23:03:33 <AnMaster> impomatic, yep
23:03:58 <AnMaster> ^style irc
23:03:59 <fungot> Selected style: irc (IRC logs of freenode/#esoteric, freenode/#scheme and ircnet/#douglasadams)
23:04:06 <AnMaster> also: night
23:04:45 <impomatic> Does anarchy golf use 0 for EOF?
23:05:11 <FireFly> Does the fungot chat style thing select random lines?
23:05:12 <fungot> FireFly: on mac osx maybe? maybe switch on both?) ( else ( occurn ( cdr markers) ( cdr list) value)
23:05:21 <FireFly> 'kay
23:05:48 <ehird> impomatic: yes
23:05:49 <ehird> IIRC
23:07:12 <oerjan> FireFly: markov chain of words
23:07:39 <FireFly> Ah
23:07:49 <oerjan> the style files are preprocessed
23:09:46 <MizardX> impomatic: Heh. Right after your program has printed out "hell" in "hello world!", exactly 666 operations has been executed. :P
23:10:52 <oklopol> haha
23:11:02 <impomatic> Nice, I wish I'd planned that!
23:11:18 <impomatic> Is that the 84 instruction version?
23:11:26 <MizardX> 85
23:12:51 <MizardX> I also counted [, ] as single operations. Loop length is (1 + inner_ops)*num_cycles + 1
23:13:12 <oerjan> <AnMaster> wtf is "gv"?
23:13:18 <oerjan> ghostview iirc
23:13:29 <AnMaster> oerjan, already found out
23:13:34 <AnMaster> ...
23:14:00 <AnMaster> oerjan, maybe you shouldn't do like me, and instead read the whole scrollback first
23:14:05 <AnMaster> ;P
23:14:07 <AnMaster> night
23:14:16 <oerjan> but then i would forget that there was something to answer :D
23:14:17 <GregorR> READING THE BACKLOG IS FOR THE WEAK
23:17:03 -!- CakeProphet has joined.
23:22:47 <oklopol> GregorR: well what do you do in order to make sure you haven't missed any of the fun then?
23:23:10 <oklopol> (you mum?)
23:23:20 <oklopol> *your
23:24:03 -!- puzzlet_ has joined.
23:24:52 -!- puzzlet has quit (Remote closed the connection).
23:42:20 -!- olsner has quit (Remote closed the connection).
23:42:27 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit ("bye").
23:42:44 <oklopol> so umm anarchy gold is actually *alive*?
23:43:56 <oklopol> ...
23:43:57 <oklopol> *golf
23:44:13 <ehird> yeah, to a degree
23:44:17 <ehird> it's never been particularly active, but people play it
23:44:19 <ehird> and #golf
23:44:32 <ehird> err
23:44:34 <ehird> #anagolf
23:44:36 <oklopol> anagolf
23:44:43 * oerjan swats oklopol for making him google a nonexisting term -----###
23:44:47 <oklopol> err.
23:44:47 <ehird> eh
23:44:49 <ehird> whatever the chan is called
23:44:54 <FireFly> }o/
23:44:55 <ehird> wat
23:44:56 <FireFly> With \
23:45:35 <oklopol> oerjan: don't google a term with "gold" in it.
23:46:16 <oerjan> you mean you want to hoard it all yourself?
23:46:58 <oklopol> http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?99+shinichiroes+of+hamaji <<< so umm 14 characters of ruby?
23:47:42 <ehird> sure.
23:47:44 <ehird> who knows
23:47:55 <ehird> probably a sneaky cheat
23:47:57 <ehird> $_,$x=split"!",<>;$x=reverse$x;s/</\$i--;/g;s/>/\$i++;/g;s/-/\$a[\$i]--;/g;s/\+/\$a[\$i]++;/g;s/./print chr\$a[\$i];/g;s/,/\$a[\$i]=chop\$x;/g;s/\[/while(\$a[\$i]){/g;s/\]/};/g;eval$_
23:48:00 <ehird> wonder why this doesn't work.
23:48:28 <oklopol> just seems like kinda hard to cheat in a program that just prints a fuckload of text.
23:48:36 <ehird> yeah
23:48:37 <ehird> I dunno
23:49:01 <oklopol> of course, would be interesting if it was his submit, and shinichiroes of hamaji wasn't actually anything sensible, but just something that he could easily print.
23:49:49 <ehird> the guy's hame is "shinh"
23:49:53 <ehird> nick, at least
23:49:58 <ehird> -> shinichiro hamaji
23:50:03 <ehird> so it's probably the owner's submission
23:50:08 <oklopol> yes
23:51:11 <ehird> http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Print+out+a+lot+_56K+BEWARE_
23:51:14 <ehird> my challenge ^.^
23:51:38 <ehird> probably shoulda chosen less determinatistic output
23:51:48 <ehird> 1-99999 is pretty easy
23:54:19 <oklopol> fungot
23:54:20 <fungot> oklopol: homo sapiens hei_e__er_ensis ' !hangman lcase-guess' to guess a letter!! fnord::: 0xff sponsor gift
23:54:34 <oerjan> ^style
23:54:34 <fungot> Available: agora alice darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc* lovecraft pa speeches ss wp
23:54:48 <oerjan> heidelbergensis
23:56:20 <oerjan> except it's apparently consider an own species, not a subspecies of sapiens
23:57:12 <oklopol> cise would probably be like Jn" .1e9
23:57:18 <oklopol> if i put in 1e9
23:58:00 <oklopol> i would prefer not having numbers at all (you know, for purity), but wouldn't be very golfy.
23:58:49 <oklopol> btw: thought of a new fun unimplementable feature for cise
23:58:49 <ehird> oklopol: #anagol
23:58:57 <oklopol> there's a lot of parse trees
23:59:03 <oklopol> how about if there's ambiguity
23:59:13 <oklopol> you can specify an assert
23:59:29 <oklopol> Ass
23:59:45 <oklopol> ehird: oh i tried it right after #anagolf.
23:59:55 <ehird> XD lol