< 1234656034 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Good night" < 1234656551 0 :Sgeo_!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234656777 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234657574 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234657684 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who here uses qmail? AnMaster? < 1234657697 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, correct. Night < 1234657700 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes to bed < 1234657709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Impeccable timing. < 1234657753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: You got one second? Guess not. < 1234657769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1234657770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok then < 1234657776 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a headache tough < 1234657778 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what imap server do you use with qmail? < 1234657779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though* < 1234657795 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, um I don't. I use maildir... < 1234657808 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Ah, you read mail directly on the server? < 1234657829 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I'm used to the pine/mutt/alpine family of mail clients yes < 1234657836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How quaint. :p Thanks anyway :) < 1234657857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, also I hate MTAs, that is as long as they are working they are ok, but I hate sysadmining them < 1234657878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's why I'm trying to decide between qmail and letting google host my mail atm. < 1234657945 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1234657958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1234657961 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, qmail config is not as bad as sendmail config though < 1234657964 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and night < 1234658803 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erg < 1234658822 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guys, i have a question you might have a worthwhile opinion on < 1234658883 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you know what my answer is. < 1234658890 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it oko? < 1234658919 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i have no idea. < 1234659157 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my question is this < 1234659183 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have these things called glosses that represent a sort of annotated form of a sentence < 1234659213 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are a number of standard orthographic forms used to annotate < 1234659226 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to be able to integrate this into the database software im building tho < 1234659255 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which the standard orthgoraphic forms are representative of things in the database < 1234659296 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you lost me at "things" < 1234659307 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1234659311 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is too tired for big words < 1234659312 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i store the glosses as just strings like "F.B.Q" and require that searches work on the orthographic forms only < 1234659383 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or should i make the glosses actually store pointers to the items in the DB instead of storing just strings of representation? < 1234660454 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1234661742 0 :Corun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1234662266 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, no oerjan? < 1234662969 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anybody want to play Cheskers? < 1234663108 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO. < 1234663109 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you can play cheskers and I can be in the audience making fun of you? < 1234663152 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1234663186 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1234663191 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheskers < 1234663196 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that some wacky game of yours? < 1234663201 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :checkers + chess < 1234663208 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naturalismo. < 1234663223 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, right, for some reason god only knows, i thought it was a typo < 1234663246 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is slowwww < 1234663252 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...but still NO < 1234663255 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to koed < 1234663256 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1234663277 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :co-educate? < 1234663293 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, interact with females? < 1234663331 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, i'm a pornstar < 1234663337 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone want to play Arimaa? < 1234663338 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, he's just impersonating the word coed, so he'll be interacting with female impersonators. < 1234663356 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Oooh, I should add Arimaa support to my board game software ... < 1234663357 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet, pornstar and crazy-person.. I'm just missing two out of two < 1234663371 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR, what about legal issues? < 1234663401 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: Has legality ever stopped me before? Bahahahahah!!! < 1234663412 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR, I have no clue, obviously < 1234663606 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://arimaa.com/arimaa/license/ < 1234663616 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, should be compatible. < 1234663623 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://arimaa.com/arimaa/license/current.txt < 1234663625 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The software is F/OSS, but that's copyright, not patent ^^ < 1234663694 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Some usage or distribution of Arimaa may be non-commercial, but also not fall < 1234663694 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :under the personal, educational and research (PER) category. For such cases a < 1234663694 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :written authorization must be obtained from Arimaa.com. < 1234663694 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1234663704 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" * I want to freely distribute software that incorporates Arimaa. Such as < 1234663704 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : open source software that plays Arimaa. < 1234663704 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1234663784 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah, why would somebody patent a game created for the purpose of testing the limits of AI. That's so stupid. < 1234663948 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of patents are < 1234664358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that is the one dumb thing about Arimaa. < 1234664386 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really sad, since everything else about Arimaa is rather clever and smart... < 1234664418 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fairly deep game. < 1234667915 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1234667971 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-127-13.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234668739 0 :chuck!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :chuck_cat < 1234668755 0 :chuck_cat!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :chuck < 1234670684 0 :Slereah2!n=fff@ANantes-259-1-44-188.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234670931 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234671448 0 :Slereah!n=fff@ANantes-259-1-36-46.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234671973 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234673358 0 :Dewio!n=dewi@203-217-41-131.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1234674116 0 :Dewi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable) < 1234675136 0 :Sgeo__!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234675265 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1234676002 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234676040 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit < 1234676048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a palindrome embedded in my nick! < 1234676051 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD < 1234676168 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234676952 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lopol is indeeda palindrom < 1234676953 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1234677020 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was actually talking about the "o", but yeah i guess "lopol" is a palindrome as well < 1234677067 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1234677095 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a wonderful ability to counter ones expectations < 1234677139 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do now? it's probably just the lack of sleepness. < 1234677189 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just made my first GC, and it was so trivial i'm a bit ashamed i did it. < 1234677210 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two hours until the breakfast store opens < 1234677223 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i can do until then is troll irc channels by being my tired self < 1234677911 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Everyone has at least len(nick) trivial palindromes :P < 1234677942 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Conservative GC? Mark and sweep? Copying? Generational? Magic GC? < 1234678119 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GC? < 1234678143 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1234678146 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :garbage collector < 1234678147 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok. < 1234678913 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does a conservative gc know how large objects are? < 1234678946 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, duh, it hacks the allocator < 1234679934 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234680584 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: It /is/ the allocator. < 1234680599 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1234680815 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you still have to use a malloc thing < 1234680848 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234681126 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :allocators get awfully complicated < 1234681336 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like in memcached, they decided malloc() isn't good enough < 1234681443 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you still see things like obj_t objcache[128]; < 1234684799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1234684800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1234685322 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Client Excited" < 1234686052 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye all < 1234686076 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1234687737 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@e-29.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1234689000 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1234689279 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i have a palindrome embedded in my nick! < 1234689293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too! six of them in fact < 1234689320 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, seven < 1234689334 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot the empty string < 1234689378 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i was actually talking about the "o", but yeah i guess "lopol" is a palindrome as well < 1234689394 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no that's way to destroy my joke in advance < 1234689401 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*now < 1234689444 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklopol: Everyone has at least len(nick) trivial palindromes :P < 1234689449 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+1 < 1234689473 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i _should_ start reading the rest of the logs before responding. nah. < 1234689609 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, that's technically correct only if you count duplicates, in which case it still isn't, should be 2*len(nick)+1 < 1234689628 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(empty strings all around) < 1234690073 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1234691767 0 :Hiato!n=hiato@dsl-245-3-235.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1234692162 0 :Hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234692270 0 :Hiato!n=hiato@dsl-245-3-235.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1234692745 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: oklopol: Conservative GC? Mark and sweep? Copying? Generational? Magic GC? <<< variant of m&s. < 1234692798 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would probably feel less dirty if it was something algorithmically contentful < 1234692849 0 :appletizer!i=user@82-32-123-8.cable.ubr04.hawk.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1234692980 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: there is an infinite amount of empty strings in every hole, isn't there? < 1234693162 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :counting duplicated may not be such a great ida < 1234693164 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*idea < 1234693166 0 :appletizer!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1234693852 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: i assume you count only once per position... < 1234693882 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it would get SILLY, and we wouldn't have THAT < 1234693888 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, infinite amount, but they all have the same position, yes i guess that's solid logic < 1234693897 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, exactly :) < 1234694166 0 :Hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1234695546 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c809ABF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1234696201 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1234696421 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1234696520 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@e-44.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1234697147 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234697191 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c809ABF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1234697199 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1234697538 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d-d-d-d-D-D-D-DANNNNCE aLLLL nIGHT lONGGGGGGG < 1234697832 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi people. < 1234697852 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi you. < 1234698747 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-0-48.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234698986 0 :ais523!i=93bc93e6@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-ef9b176d5a67e4d7 JOIN :#esoteric < 1234699325 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=nice@HSI-KBW-085-216-041-121.hsi.kabelbw.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1234699397 0 :jix!n=jix@tmo-096-38.customers.d1-online.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1234699757 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-8-161.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234700408 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1234700408 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1234700408 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1234700418 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@iruel.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1234701101 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client" < 1234701893 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234701935 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c809ABF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1234703369 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1234704734 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1234704849 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1234705521 0 :Slereah2!n=fff@ANantes-259-1-78-39.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234706073 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234707527 0 :ais523!i=93bc93e6@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-5a14e26676752e25 JOIN :#esoteric < 1234707850 0 :olsner_!n=salparot@h-60-96.A163.priv.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234708694 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1234708697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[14:35:33] [05:53:09] i just made my first GC, and it was so trivial i'm a bit ashamed i did it. < 1234708703 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're right that's trivial < 1234708706 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ehird < 1234708707 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, you know, it's fun. < 1234708709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1234708717 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a GC for Overload a while back < 1234708721 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two, in fact < 1234708733 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the GC semantics are part of the language < 1234708738 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: gcs CAN be algorithmically contentful < 1234708740 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first one was mark-and-sweep < 1234708744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do it parallel, and generational < 1234708744 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the second one was weird < 1234708749 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's tricky < 1234708850 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i know < 1234708863 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yah < 1234708865 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just suggestering < 1234708961 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well this is in c++, and it's just not fast enough to code in to be all that fun. < 1234708969 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i just made something simple that works. < 1234709012 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: did you make it for a reason, or just for fun? < 1234709018 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and which algorithm did you use? < 1234709021 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's for a c++ course. < 1234709028 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i didn't really use an algorithm < 1234709045 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the code has to be using some method to do it < 1234709050 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even trivial algorithms have names < 1234709065 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think it's mark-and-sweep < 1234709070 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc < 1234709122 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mark and sweep is pretty much the most dumb thing ever < 1234709122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you know giving mark-and-sweep a name is like naming different ways to call a function, it's just kinda stupid, since anyone will come up with it given the problem statement, there is absolutely no insight to it. < 1234709126 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's no wonder gc had a bad rep < 1234709138 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: it's useful when talking about it < 1234709141 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well different ways to call a function is a bad example. < 1234709143 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, debian 5 is out < 1234709146 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pass-by-value, pass-by-reference, pass-by-name < 1234709147 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: sure. i still don't like it. < 1234709148 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: "5"? < 1234709154 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1234709157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :debian 5.0 "lenny" < 1234709160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's Lenny, and something like the ninth or tenthversion < 1234709164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.debian.net/News/2009/20090214.en.html < 1234709167 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Debian GNU/Linux version 5.0" < 1234709170 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't even aware Debian had version numbers < 1234709174 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, very bad example, also you could consider call conventions another categorization < 1234709184 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously, it must have version numbers that don't follow an obvious pattern < 1234709187 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :much more algorithmical insight to it < 1234709189 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm pretty sure Lenny and the like are just codenames, like Tiger and Leopard < 1234709198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although apple are now marketing with those names, they didn't use to < 1234709210 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: sort of, except that those names are the names of the repositories < 1234709223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet internal apple code has "Leopard" in it, too < 1234709226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the way it works is that a few weeks ago, "Lenny" was the testing repository < 1234709238 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Lenny" is now the stable repo, and testing is "Squeeze" < 1234709250 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those names are the names you actually have to give to the package manager for it to work < 1234709259 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I just looked it up, debian's gone: < 1234709264 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.x, 1.x, 2.x, 3.x, 4.x, 5.0 < 1234709277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not the ninth or tenth release, they're just slooooow. < 1234709278 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: maybe a better example is something like insertion sort, sure it's useful to have a name for it, but it's not like anyone implements insertion sort, insertion sort is what you implement if you don't feel like thinking or reading and want to get the job done. < 1234709285 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can either say "stable" to automatically stay on the stable repo (which would upgrade from etch to lenny automatically) < 1234709295 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :4.0 was released april 2007 < 1234709302 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so 5.0 is a positively fast release < 1234709304 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or say "etch", then it stays on etch until you tell it to upgrade to lenny < 1234709310 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and etch is now the oldstable repo) < 1234709328 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.debian.net/doc/manuals/project-history/ch-detailed.en.html#s4.6 < 1234709330 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly deaths... < 1234709335 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Important Events section) < 1234709398 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what do you think debian will do when they run out of toy story names? < 1234709411 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :persuade Disney to release Toy Story 3 < 1234709431 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, they're already making it :P < 1234709437 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are still quite a lot they haven't used yet, though < 1234709601 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit, linus uses _this kind of emphasis_ a lot < 1234709603 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.version-control.git/217 < 1234709663 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah: < 1234709664 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other codenames that have been already used are: buzz for release 1.1, rex for release 1.2, bo for releases 1.3.x, hamm for release 2.0, slink for release 2.1, potato for release 2.2, woody for release 3.0, sarge for release 3.1, and etch for release 4.0. < 1234709675 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the codename changes more frequently than the major release < 1234709686 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this is the 10th release or thereabouts < 1234709690 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I wonder what makes them decide whether a release is minor or major/ < 1234709729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, they seem to be going for major release = codename, once every year and a half or so < 1234709739 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :going by etch and this new one here < 1234709746 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :major release = codename is necessary < 1234709751 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or their whole release process would fail < 1234709759 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I mean is, < 1234709764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not changing the codename on a minor release < 1234709767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like they used to, as above < 1234709783 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1234709807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I mean is, there doesn't seem to be any way to tell whether a Debian release is minor or major, except from the version number < 1234710068 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234710077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess those minor releases were not that minor < 1234710085 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1234710089 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, the way Debian works < 1234710096 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that they have unstable, which is cutting-edge < 1234710106 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and experimental, which is even more cutting-edge < 1234710115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234710119 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unstable contains the latest versions of whatever packages they're using < 1234710123 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, say, the latest version of KDE 3 < 1234710124 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I used debian as a desktop OS I used sid < 1234710130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because everything else was hopelessly slow < 1234710134 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas experimental contains the latest version of KDE 4 < 1234710139 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because 4 isn't in mainstream yet < 1234710142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unstable = testing, right? < 1234710146 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not quite < 1234710146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and experimental = unstable < 1234710149 0 :Hiato!n=1@dsl-245-3-235.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1234710167 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if something's been in Debian unstable for a certain number of days and nobody reports a bug in it, it moves into testing < 1234710171 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234710181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the number of days depends on how serious the bug that fixed it was < 1234710188 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, say when I release a new C-INTERCAL version < 1234710200 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it goes into unstable as soon as Debian package it, and into testing if nobody reports a bug after 8 days < 1234710205 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :longer if there's a code-freeze on < 1234710224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234710228 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every so often, they gradually code-freeze testing < 1234710242 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and delays there get longer and longer, until they're only porting fixes for release-critical bugs < 1234710266 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when there are no release-critical bugs in testing, and there's a freeze at the time, it becomes the next stable version < 1234710611 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=arvid@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234711364 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think I'll note again that in case anyone has a boardgamegeek membership, I've got an "esoteric language programmer" microbadge available. http://boardgamegeek.com/microbadge/7285 < 1234711876 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client" < 1234711901 0 :ais523!i=93bc93e6@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-0ff4e72a282e7694 JOIN :#esoteric < 1234711911 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIBBIT PLEASE STOP DOING THAT < 1234711930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, allcaps < 1234711935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a first? < 1234711941 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1234712279 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1234712305 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o8o < 1234712462 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"rebooting" < 1234712636 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=arvid@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234713944 0 :Slereah2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1234714075 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@e-58.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1234714099 0 :Slereah!n=fff@ANantes-259-1-78-39.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234714209 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1234714254 0 :Slereah!n=fff@ANantes-259-1-78-39.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234714289 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1234714919 0 :Slereah!n=fff@ANantes-259-1-78-39.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1234715012 0 :Hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1234715190 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234715937 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=arvid@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234716538 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, apparently there's a process called Electrowinning. < 1234716731 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it do? < 1234717014 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Electrowinning, also called electroextraction, is the electrodeposition of metals from their ores that have been put in solution or liquefied. Electrorefining uses a similar process to remove impurities from a metal. Both processes use electroplating on a large scale and are important techniques for the economical and straightforward purification of non-ferrous metals. The resulting metals are said to be electrowon. < 1234717306 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is working on a HIDEOUS ABOMINATION. < 1234717345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Objectivist-C. Entities fight for processor and memory. More efficient producers (e.g., a prime checker using a better algorithm) end up killing other entities. < 1234717354 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All based on the C we know and love! < 1234717569 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1234717649 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1234717684 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-0-48.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234717743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : pass-by-value, pass-by-reference, pass-by-name < 1234717753 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, are there any more esoteric ones, i wonder < 1234717817 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pass-by-arbiter. Rather than getting the object, you get an object that can access the original, but you have to access it through annoying proxy-like requests. < 1234717823 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there were, i'd expect INTERCAL to have incorporating some... < 1234717826 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ed < 1234717845 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1234717877 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes < 1234717883 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm prototype OO falls under that, doesn't it < 1234717897 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: call by copy-restore < 1234717900 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call by sharing < 1234717904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call by need < 1234717908 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call by macro expansion < 1234717910 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call by future < 1234717930 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-copy-restore ought to be functionally indistinguishable from pass-by-reference < 1234717939 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, call by need i should have remembered < 1234717945 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evaluation_strategy#Call_by_copy-restore < 1234717958 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: not with concurrent programming < 1234717963 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah yse. < 1234717964 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*yes < 1234717988 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-macro-expansion is effectively call-by-name < 1234717993 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: there's the method Feather uses < 1234717998 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: i was going to ask that < 1234718004 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pass-readonly-by-value-or-reference-it-doesn't-matter < 1234718024 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can retroactively change the value of any object you were passed < 1234718034 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which causes it to change in the past, thus you get passed the new changed value < 1234718037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the object is always readonly < 1234718038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-macro-expansion is not call by name < 1234718044 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well that applies to any pure language too like haskell < 1234718052 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234718052 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(x) = x*2 < 1234718054 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(y-3) < 1234718055 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and such < 1234718062 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although haskell doesn't retroactively change function arguments < 1234718066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and scoping < 1234718073 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-macro-expansion can access variables in its expander < 1234718075 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ML, really < 1234718077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-name can't < 1234718100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: in Haskell, every value is a function returning its value. after the first evaluation, it actually rewrites its own machine code into a trivial return < 1234718102 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's only evaluated once < 1234718131 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would be surprised if ais523 didn't already know that < 1234718137 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm... that's in a particular implementation of Haskell, you mean < 1234718144 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing about the language suggests machine code is involved < 1234718146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's the standard way < 1234718156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes, it's sensible < 1234718157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: he knows haskell, but doesn't seem to know much about its implementation < 1234718160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't make it the only way, though < 1234718164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1234718166 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: more I don't care much about its implementation < 1234718170 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah, in _theory_ haskell can be faithfully implemented with call-by-name instead of need, i think < 1234718170 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just the fun, esoteric, efficient way < 1234718172 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that doesn't affect use of the language < 1234718174 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just insane < 1234718179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it just specifies "non-strict" < 1234718181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I wouldn't call it esoteric < 1234718191 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an auto-memoizing, auto-parallel call-by-need haskell would be valid < 1234718199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and work apart from things like unsafePerformIO < 1234718202 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it'd work, just go haywire < 1234718227 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsafePerformIO breaks the semantics of Haskell < 1234718234 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 'unsafe' is there for a reason... < 1234718241 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1234718245 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsafeCoerce is funner, though < 1234718253 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like looking at the code of a function in Underlambda breaks its semantics < 1234718266 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do it by printing out a continuation and reading it in as text, but that's unsafeCamelCase < 1234718269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in ghc, (unsafeCoerce () :: Double) gives you something like 3.2752 < 1234718273 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of segfaulting < 1234718276 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does unsafeCoerce do? < 1234718283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: unsafeCoerce :: a -> b < 1234718292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oh dear... < 1234718302 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can guess < 1234718309 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it reminds me rather of the _cast operators in C++ < 1234718317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except more dangerous < 1234718323 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except those would crash if you tried to do an impossible coercion, even dynamic_cast<> < 1234718335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and crash with an exception rather than segfault < 1234718335 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it lets you segfault in haskell < 1234718344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsafeCoerce 3 :: Either () () < 1234718346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prints out < 1234718349 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, how does unsafeCoerce figure out what types its arguments are < 1234718350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Left < 1234718355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: umm, it doesn't < 1234718362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just gives back the internal pointer data < 1234718363 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, its result < 1234718366 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: obviously if you coerce into something with pointers in it < 1234718366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you tag it < 1234718372 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(unsafeCoerce a :: TypeIWant) < 1234718386 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like you can do (2+2 :: Integer) < 1234718396 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes < 1234718427 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: what does unsafeCoerce () return < 1234718429 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't tag it? < 1234718441 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: meaningless question i think < 1234718449 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has all types < 1234718452 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: forall b. b < 1234718452 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it has to either return something or error < 1234718458 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like how < 1234718460 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2+2) < 1234718461 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is of type < 1234718462 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's its type < 1234718466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Num a) => forall a. a < 1234718470 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what value the interp prints, though < 1234718474 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it doesn't < 1234718478 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no instance for (Show (forall a. a)) < 1234718479 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1234718481 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can't make one < 1234718485 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get a type error < 1234718490 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh < 1234718496 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need an unsafeShow, obviously < 1234718500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1234718527 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that requires the interpreter to have enough information, fortunately it probably has due to gc < 1234718539 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to distinguish pointers at least < 1234718547 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just print out a hex representation or something < 1234718559 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a series of Haskell commands that create the value that's there < 1234718565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's probably an unsafePointer# :: a -> Integer < 1234718569 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, Int < 1234718596 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl has Data::Dumper::Dumper, you apply it to an object and get a series of commands to create that object < 1234718598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want an inefficient haskell impl that has a playground < 1234718602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, < 1234718614 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes but perl has dynamic types < 1234718631 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nativeCallCC :: ((a -> a) -> a) -> a < 1234718634 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perl's more untyped than dynamically typed < 1234718637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can do < 1234718656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nativeCallCC (\f -> f 3 + 2) --> 3 < 1234718671 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :callCC makes no sense in a non-strict language < 1234718677 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure you got the type of nativeCallCC right? < 1234718684 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sure it does < 1234718690 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: err, it should be < 1234718694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1234718695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right < 1234718712 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see... a continuation is of type a -> (), isn't it? < 1234718713 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: + forces its arguments (obviously), and when (f 3) is evaluated the current evaluation chain is given up < 1234718716 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no < 1234718728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[17:25:23] :t callCC < 1234718728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[17:25:25] forall a (m :: * -> *) b. (MonadCont m) => ((a -> m b) -> m a) -> m a < 1234718728 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it clearly doesn't return < 1234718740 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason I had a as the result is so you can use it in expressions like that < 1234718750 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's play Cheskers! < 1234718755 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somebody! :P < 1234718783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Me!! < 1234718784 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: callCC has the type of pierce's [sp] law in boolean logic < 1234718787 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: that's like making printf return an integer so you can do printf("Hello, world!\n") + printf("Bye!\n"); < 1234718798 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: http://codu.org/cheskers/client/cheskers.html# game 18, join as white < 1234718800 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not the reason printf returns an integer, and if it was it would be stupid < 1234718801 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's useful because nativeCallCC (\x -> x 2) should be valid. < 1234718816 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I've never heard of pierce's law < 1234718818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Loading... < 1234718822 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Works on Safari? < 1234718832 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Haven't tested it on Safari ... works on Konq :P < 1234718833 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: peirce's < 1234718841 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Just hangs at "loading". < 1234718846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I don't think it should be valid, it's semantically nonsensical < 1234718853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no it isn't < 1234718871 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you've written there would translate into C as int func {return return 2;} < 1234718879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... I don't think you understand call/cc < 1234718885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I do < 1234718889 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's one of the laws of boolean logic that aren't in intuitionistic logic < 1234718901 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like excluded middle < 1234718923 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a continuation doesn't return a value, by definition, so it doesn't make sense to make it return a value < 1234718941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it returns the Void valu < 1234718941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1234718945 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in haskell, (forall a. a) < 1234718947 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... actually, giving it type forall b. a -> b would make sense < 1234718950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is standard, e.g.: < 1234718954 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :error :: forall a. String -> a < 1234718967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha wow, in Ruby 1.9 you can use λ to make a proc < 1234718970 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's a unicode lambda) < 1234718978 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the physical unicode character? < 1234718982 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're stealing from INTERCAL! < 1234718986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1234718989 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh wait, it's ((P -> Q) -> P) -> P < 1234718997 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm, that is the right type < 1234718998 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, I was wrong < 1234718999 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(CLC-INTERCAL for ages, and C-INTERCAL for a while, accept ¬ as a synonym for NOT) < 1234719001 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ais523 was too < 1234719030 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... oerjan's type looks righter than ehird's, at least q can be () then < 1234719051 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234719054 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan's type Is right < 1234719059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's what haskell's callcc continuation monad uses < 1234719066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Valid ruby: < 1234719073 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add = λ(a,b){ a + b } < 1234719075 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :puts add.(1, 2) < 1234719086 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, why the dot? < 1234719092 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Doesn't work in midori either, but firebug is being unhelpful. < 1234719098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because in ruby you can call functions without parens < 1234719109 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lambdas give you Procs < 1234719116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a.(b) is short for a.call(b) < 1234719125 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also valid ruby: < 1234719128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add = λ a, b { a + b } < 1234719131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(omitting parnes) < 1234719132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*parens < 1234719153 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Perl that would be $add=sub{shift+shift}; say &$add(1,2) < 1234719160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1234719164 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the parens are optional, &$add 1, 2 would work too < 1234719173 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, shift+shift is ridiculous < 1234719183 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it isn't defined which order the shifts evaluate in, but it doesn't matter < 1234719195 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shift-shift might not work because you don't know which shift evaluates first < 1234719212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s = λ x { λ y { λ z { x.(z).(y.(z)) } } } < 1234719212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k = λ x { λ y { x } } < 1234719212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i = λ x { x } < 1234719213 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$_[0]-$_[1] is the same number of chars and shorter < 1234719223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1234719225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the same number of chars < 1234719226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shorter? < 1234719241 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant more correct, not shorter < 1234719246 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1234719327 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Aha, fixed. Will push in a sec. < 1234719333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1234719369 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, pushed. < 1234719376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: < 1234719376 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : c = 2; -> ;c { c = 1 }.call; c # => 2 < 1234719380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA < 1234719395 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The problem is I was checking whether firebug was enabled so I could use its console, but my check didn't work on Safari, so thought it was always enabled. < 1234719411 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: link < 1234719422 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: http://codu.org/cheskers/client/cheskers.html# , join game 18 as white < 1234719432 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: did you write cheskers? < 1234719438 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Loading... < 1234719439 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Loading... < 1234719439 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Loading... < 1234719459 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Half. < 1234719462 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: WTFBBQ < 1234719494 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I joined 18 and it seems to work for me < 1234719510 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Works on Midori :P < 1234719524 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it that the checkers move as in checkers and the chess pieces as in chess/ < 1234719529 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes. < 1234719529 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the win condition? checkmate? < 1234719532 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes. < 1234719533 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : All based on the C we know and love! < 1234719534 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're all mac hating blubberheads. :| < 1234719540 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not objective C? < 1234719541 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Wanna play? :P < 1234719542 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: anyway, play a move < 1234719558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:( < 1234719560 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WANNA PLAY :| < 1234719569 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: I am playing < 1234719580 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So am I, it's your turn ;) < 1234719586 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Whoops, spoke too late. < 1234719590 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it isn't ;) < 1234719603 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are captures compulsory? < 1234719606 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the checkers? < 1234719609 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No. Nor is multi-jumping. < 1234719617 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GAH I'LL DOWNLOAD FIREFOX. < 1234719618 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: They're slightly more like pawns than checkers in that sense. < 1234719624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVEN THOUGH FIREFOX IS _AWFUL_. < 1234719624 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I want you to play! But I can't test Safari :P < 1234719635 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No wait, yes I can, I have a mac laptop :P < 1234719644 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you HATE ME so you won't :P < 1234719650 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :safari is one of the worst and buggiest mainstream browsers on Windows, but apparently it works a lot better on Mac < 1234719689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apple suck at windows software < 1234719694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :case in point: quicktime < 1234719700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quicktime is the worst, most annoying piece of crap on windows < 1234719706 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on mac, it's the best way to play non-music media < 1234719713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was that apple's originally? < 1234719715 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads firefox < 1234719719 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did they buy it off someone else? < 1234719720 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: QuickTime is Apple's yes < 1234719734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On OS X it's actually the core media framework < 1234719758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange, it won't let me move my king to f1 or g1 < 1234719778 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uhhhh, it should ... < 1234719783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: OK, link < 1234719795 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see what happened < 1234719798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you put yourself in check last move < 1234719801 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think that confused it < 1234719802 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION pukes over firefox a bit < 1234719807 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: http://codu.org/cheskers/client/cheskers.html# , but now I'm in the middle of a game with ais523 :P < 1234719809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're still in check, by the way < 1234719813 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: How so? < 1234719813 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should have just taken your king < 1234719818 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh looka that :P < 1234719824 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't have moved THAT checker :P < 1234719828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your king and queen are the wrong way round < 1234719846 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No, they're not, that's a change we made for cheskers. < 1234719852 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's utterly unfair if they're not swapped. < 1234719852 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is what makes that trick possible < 1234719857 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes < 1234719870 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :end your stupid game with ais523 < 1234719871 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M COMIN' IN < 1234719874 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what number < 1234719875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1234719919 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should make moving into check impossible, it screws things up < 1234719933 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or do it as in Shogi, where if your king is captured you lose even if you weren't checkmated < 1234719973 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the chess pieces seem a lot more useful than the checkers, but I suppose that isn't surprising < 1234720013 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: The checkers serve more to get in the way, but that doesn't make them not part of the strategy. < 1234720037 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, obviously, the relatively useless pieces are the same for both players < 1234720047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: what numberrrrr < 1234720067 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: We're playing 18, but don't go taking that over :P < 1234720076 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I'll start a new one < 1234720081 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it 3-player < 1234720082 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1234720092 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: http://codu.org/cheskers/client/cheskers.html# join 19 as white < 1234720106 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Actually the server should more-or-less support that, there are just no rulesets in the DB defined for three players. < 1234720124 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, so what're the rules :x < 1234720130 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :joined btw < 1234720147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: the same as in chess and in checkers (draughts) combined < 1234720159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yikes. i'm crap at both :-D < 1234720167 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I find it somehow unsurprising that you're better than me at chess :P < 1234720170 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: That's fine, I suck too :P < 1234720179 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Your turn. < 1234720183 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm so crap that I can barely remember how chess works :-D < 1234720188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err, let's move a checker. < 1234720209 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can the two piece types interact? < 1234720235 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, checkers can take chess pieces by jumping them, chess pieces can take checkers by collision < 1234720238 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as in the actual games < 1234720247 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1234720300 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I used to be captain of the house chess team, although I haven't played since school < 1234720312 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: That was a lot of work to decide that move :P < 1234720320 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: I had it planned < 1234720326 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Sorry, go ahead :P < 1234720331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taking the bishop was relatively obvious, after all < 1234720359 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've played chess about thrice in my live < 1234720367 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Enjoy my queen :P < 1234720412 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://homepage.mac.com/avidrissman/extimgs/st.png <- Oh heck yes. < 1234720431 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: it's not as if I didn't set a trap for her two moves ago < 1234720442 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you got a bishop and rook in exchange, that's normally about fair compensation < 1234720475 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: In case you haven't noticed, I don't HAVE your rook :P < 1234720502 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, two bishops < 1234720508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a bishop and rook, you misplayed that slightly < 1234720524 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could have used the king to defend the queen, and got the rook that way < 1234720573 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Sorry our game is going slow, but ais523 is kickin' my arse :P < 1234720635 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Thanks for the queen :P < 1234720645 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Uh, you just moved into check :P < 1234720652 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any way to watch games in progress? < 1234720652 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1234720653 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I WIN < 1234720662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM STILL MOVING < 1234720662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1234720674 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You can join any game as any player and just don't play. We have an observer player built in, but I forgot to add it to the UI X-D < 1234720687 0 :Hiato!n=1@dsl-245-3-235.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1234720716 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: does it detect checkmate/ < 1234720722 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should at least ban moves into check < 1234720728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/7xe5p/give_it_up_reddit_python_c_print_njoin_joinn_for/c07o0ty <- first reply is golden < 1234720730 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It should, but it doesn't :P < 1234720821 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what happens when you crown a checker? < 1234720844 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It turns into a king. < 1234720848 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: a BF program that does something ekse < 1234720848 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: HAW HAW JUST KIDDING < 1234720857 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It turns into what we call an "ace", which is just like a checker king < 1234720857 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: a checkers king, or a chess king? < 1234720861 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1234720878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ehird: a BF program that does something ekse < 1234720878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1234720889 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It'd be funny though if it turned into a chess king ;) < 1234720902 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the BF program doesn't do the same as the Python program < 1234720941 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't tell from my head what it does print, but it prints lots of different letters, not just * and space < 1234721001 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ... "first reply is golden" < 1234721007 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :was the keyword in that link < 1234721012 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server" < 1234721026 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is struggling for good moves :( < 1234721075 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: it's even funnier in that it's correct, though < 1234721079 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be funny even if it was wrong < 1234721089 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234721095 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seemed to be looking at just the first post,t hough < 1234721098 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: you only /have/ one legal move here... < 1234721108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: it's more fun when trying to work out if the post is correct < 1234721116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I thought it was a joke at first < 1234721148 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: That doesn't mean I can't cry myself to sleep looking at the board :P < 1234721169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like it's going to be a long endgame which I win convincingly, based on that < 1234721317 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: check, just to make sure you notice < 1234721350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mate < 1234721371 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WITH MY DYING BREATH I KILL YOUR QUEEN < 1234721396 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAAAA ANARCHIST CHESS < 1234721411 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I really have to spend the time to take all your other pieces too/ < 1234721415 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your king is already dead... < 1234721429 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No :P < 1234721433 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not dead, it's just resting... < 1234721444 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :captured, to be precise < 1234721447 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my castle < 1234721457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want anarchist nomic < 1234721470 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, nomic without rules? < 1234721475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that an oxymoron? < 1234721525 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oxymoron: someone so stupid they don't deserve to breathe air < 1234721558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: :D < 1234721654 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So anyway, aside from how much I suck at chess, don't you think that cheskers adds an interesting dynamic to the game? (Since some of your pieces which would otherwise take a few moves to release are free, but because they start out free they're quite valuable and so bringing them out too early is unwise) < 1234721697 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's somewhere between chess and shogi in terms of playstyle < 1234721713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it basically forces open games, as it's impossible to clog the board up with pawns < 1234721719 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuh < 1234721719 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's harder to defend things < 1234721870 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that you needed to defend anything >_< < 1234721887 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's because you weren't attacking < 1234721900 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's because I was spending half the game defending :P < 1234721914 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/half/all/ < 1234721928 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does black play first? < 1234721933 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1234721949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa, Leopard's speech synthesis is creepily realistic. < 1234721987 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that's not right :P < 1234721991 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :White is supposed to play first :P < 1234722004 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION uploads example < 1234722040 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't know what you're talking about, white plays first and that's how it's implemented! *cough* < 1234722075 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234722098 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi FireFly < 1234722104 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello < 1234722123 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... what esolang projects are people working on at the moment? < 1234722131 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: sure you're name isn't really George L? :D < 1234722133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*your < 1234722138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not, really, I'm busy with other things (although continuing to think about Underlambda) < 1234722154 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm finding Sir. Cut interesting < 1234722155 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ........................................... joke: FAILED < 1234722169 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DID NOT < 1234722179 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: WELL I DIDN'T GET IT < 1234722185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, trying to work out if an infinite-memory version of Advance Wars would be Turing-complete with the default AI < 1234722205 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...the game? < 1234722208 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1234722212 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: i guess you don't read Darths & Droids, or anything else Star Wars... < 1234722212 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I managed to create a loop < 1234722219 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh < 1234722221 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tell me < 1234722223 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a red infantry and a blue infantry who continuously walked round in circles < 1234722231 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds interesting < 1234722232 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creepy OS X text to speech: http://filebin.ca/zfgscj/speech.ogg < 1234722257 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you go city plains river river plains plains river river city plains river river plains plains river river < 1234722268 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLICK AT YOUR OWN RISK < 1234722268 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bent round in a loop so the last river connects to the first city < 1234722273 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and start an infantry on each city < 1234722292 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the two infantry will both go round in the same direction, never encountering each other < 1234722297 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least with the "defensive" AI < 1234722304 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1234722331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason being that going forwards, the infantry goes city / plains river / river plains / plains river / river city < 1234722334 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and repeats from there < 1234722336 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION almost forgets swatting FireFly -----### < 1234722344 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? :< < 1234722359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :going backwards it would be city / river / river plains / plains river / river plains / city < 1234722362 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is one turn longer < 1234722368 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1234722370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the AI always chooses the shortest route < 1234722371 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense < 1234722373 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: you're a firefly < 1234722375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, i was just not paying attention < 1234722377 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so both infantry go round in the same direction < 1234722377 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has a fly swatter < 1234722388 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION dies < 1234722404 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they want to keep going round so as to capture each other's cities, which exchange ownership every 5 turns < 1234722418 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's really interesting < 1234722430 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this principle can be extended with 3 players to make increment and decrement operations on two counters < 1234722437 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where the counters are the amount of money each team has < 1234722449 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is getting that to affect control flow < 1234722467 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does nobody find it as creepy as I? < 1234722499 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, infantry walking round and round in little squares in a post-apocalyptic wasteland forever is pretty creepy < 1234722519 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that < 1234722520 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1234722576 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: This: http://filebin.ca/zfgscj/speech.ogg < 1234722603 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: this isn't my computer, and it doesn't have speakers or ogg codecs < 1234722608 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the chance I'll be able to play it? < 1234722612 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1234722631 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not over 9000% < 1234722651 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where does the over 9000 meme come from? < 1234722653 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234722658 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a youtube video < 1234722667 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using a few seconds of the show Dragonball Z < 1234722683 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I've heard of Dragonball Z < 1234722689 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but IIRC, 9000 is rather low in the context of that show < 1234722695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Here's a text transcript: http://qntm.org/?9000 < 1234722702 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is qntm.org? < 1234722708 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this terminal has internet filters < 1234722734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :qntm.org is the website of Sam Hughes. < 1234722746 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it blocked? < 1234722749 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never heard of him, I don't think < 1234722756 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no idea, I'd have to click on it to find out < 1234722761 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just text. < 1234722763 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and visiting a blocked website gets you in trouble < 1234722764 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sam Hughes is a brilliant sci-fi author. < 1234722768 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some really weird things are blocked here, though < 1234722771 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as the X11 licence < 1234722775 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: How to Destroy the Earth - he wrote that. < 1234722781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the licence isn't weird, but the fact it's blocked is < 1234722787 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Btw, the DS version of advance wars? < 1234722788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Earth Destruction Advisory Board. < 1234722793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Fine Structure series. And ... < 1234722798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: there are two DS versions of advance wars < 1234722808 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah.. Well, theres also a GBA version < 1234722812 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was trying on Dark Conflict, which is probably better for esoprogramming because of the temporary ports < 1234722815 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, at least one < 1234722819 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1234722820 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are also two GBA versions, so oyu fail in that respect too < 1234722820 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brb google < 1234722826 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::< < 1234722832 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Brb google"? < 1234722848 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nvm < 1234722865 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fnd. Grb lk lpsfn < 1234722968 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh. < 1234722970 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ferret.c: In function ‘rs2s’: < 1234722970 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ferret.c:165: error: ‘struct RString’ has no member named ‘ptr’ < 1234723106 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well let's hope it's easy to ferret out that bug < 1234723123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION kills oerjan with a fork < 1234723123 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ferret.c? < 1234723142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ferret = ruby bindings to indexer thingy < 1234723143 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION vaguely mumbles something about cruelty to forks < 1234723154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION realizes he deserves it, and croaks < 1234723162 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm not binding, native, okay < 1234723169 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION revives oerjan because puns are fun < 1234723470 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brains... < 1234724132 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION realizes ehird is a master strategist < 1234724144 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He is capable of many-pronged attacks... < 1234724158 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that's a good pun < 1234724266 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1234724355 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@a-43.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1234724547 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client" < 1234724748 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://welldonefillet.blogspot.com/2009/01/stabbing-fork-what-is-it-good-for.html < 1234725379 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-0-48.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234726252 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An irritating algorithm to code: Find the rightmost, deepest application in an SKI application. < 1234726394 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1234726534 0 :Hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving." < 1234726564 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This, by the way, lets you lazily evaluate SKI and get a non-blowing-up SII(SII): < 1234726565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :```sii``sii < 1234726565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :``i``sii`i``sii < 1234726565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :``i``sii``sii < 1234726565 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :```sii``sii < 1234726584 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Non-blowing-up" being the technical term of course. < 1234726588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since you evaluate the rightmost, deepest expression that can be reduced (`sx can't be reduced, ```sxyz can be) < 1234726590 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Yep. < 1234726621 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234726635 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: say, is that reduction lazy? < 1234726637 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1234726666 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234726684 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, here's a new chess variant: Stupidly-friendly chess. You're never allowed to put a king in check :P < 1234726687 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um lazy implies leftmost... < 1234726696 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: sure? < 1234726715 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: winner decided by arbitration? < 1234726734 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure < 1234726749 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it would check the parent expression < 1234726763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in ``kk```sii``sii, it wouldn't loop < 1234726774 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Eventually somebody has to give up from being bored of the sixteen hour game they've just been playing :P < 1234726781 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because while ```sii``sii is the rightmost, deepest expression you can evaluate, its parent is a `kx < 1234726784 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: a tie will happen eventually < 1234726788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it skips straight to the ``kkx < 1234726798 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, it's assumed you're trying to avoid stalemate :P < 1234726807 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, well that's crap. :-P < 1234726814 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NORLY!?! < 1234726815 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1234726839 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well then you aren't really doing rightmost < 1234726842 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chesssss: Stupidity-friendly chess but whoever makes the move leading to a tie wins. < 1234726844 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: true < 1234726853 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like that might make sense if the winner is decided by strength of pieces remaining (what's the term) when a tie happens < 1234726856 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rightmost-deepest-if-would-be-evaluated-anyway < 1234726864 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still lazy < 1234726874 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a precursor to chess in which if you get it into a stalemate you win. < 1234726880 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that's not without precedent. < 1234726886 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1234726914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: in ````skkkk```sii``sii, it'd evaluate the func to find out if it's k first, ofc < 1234726915 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and it is) < 1234726965 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you are ending up with leftmost, i say < 1234726981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, because: < 1234726981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:36:04] ```sii``sii < 1234726982 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:36:04] ``i``sii`i``sii < 1234726982 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:36:04] ``i``sii``sii < 1234726983 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[19:36:04] ```sii``sii < 1234726987 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(evaluated in my head according to these rules) < 1234727085 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you replace the first ``sii with something else that turns into `kk but only _after_ applying it, but still without using its argument... < 1234727098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm? < 1234727111 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it checks the result of the evaluation but does not replac < 1234727120 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it sees that `i``sii = ``sii, but leaves it as is in the expression < 1234727122 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it can do rightmost < 1234727150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1234727164 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what < 1234727181 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially you evaluate leftmost until you find that something more rightward happens to be evaluated, then you backtrack < 1234727193 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much < 1234727206 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still lazy, as far as I can tell, and evaluates ```sii``sii without growing < 1234727233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1234727247 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know call by _need_ is what you really want, i think < 1234727264 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't do that in ski < 1234727268 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since there are no bindings < 1234727274 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the expansion happens only because evaluating one copy doesn't evaluate the others < 1234727276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call by need = call by name, without bindings < 1234727359 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do graph sharing < 1234727365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: vut < 1234727382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, search the tree for all occurances of the same expr < 1234727382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1234727386 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. when doing ```sxyz -> ``xz`yz , the z should be _shared_ < 1234727397 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1234727407 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact that's enough since that's the only ski rule that duplicates things < 1234727408 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but ``xz`yz isn't reduced immediately < 1234727421 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm doing step-until-x-==-eval(x) < 1234727431 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'll just return App (App x z) (App y z) < 1234727439 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where z = App S K or whatever < 1234727506 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so how do you do it then? < 1234727527 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well haskell datatypes don't usually allow sharing detection < 1234727531 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1234727550 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need some id or monadic references for that < 1234727559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I'm avoiding :-( < 1234727600 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also use a tie-the-knot trick, where you bundle the evaluation of z with z < 1234727607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"bundle"? < 1234727649 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does haskell do multiplication lazily? < 1234727654 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: no < 1234727661 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's 0 * _|_ < 1234727668 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you define a numeric datatype where it does < 1234727673 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's _|_ < 1234727695 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the standard datatypes, arithmetic is strict in all arguments < 1234727882 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i'm not sure if it would be useful to you, essentially it would implement ski laziness with haskell laziness, but maybe add some symbolic tags or something < 1234727882 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for reasons of SPEED < 1234728705 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION installs gtk2hs to install yi < 1234728708 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to edit this ski thingymabob < 1234729939 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cheskers now has support for chess (minus proper promotions (always promotes to queen) and en passant) < 1234730065 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also castling? < 1234730133 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :castling is a rule that's actually used, you can't leave *that* out. < 1234730183 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it strictly requires keeping some extra state, though < 1234730196 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops, forgot about castling entirely X-D < 1234730223 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as does en passant < 1234730236 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :En passant requires less. < 1234730266 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1234730357 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1234731173 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1234731350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird|away < 1234731461 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1234731780 0 :ehird|away!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird < 1234732268 0 :Judofyr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"sleeping" < 1234733659 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Implemented castling :) < 1234733683 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, what is this? < 1234733688 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BFchess? < 1234733700 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, no, it actually has no relevance to this channel whatsoever :P < 1234733708 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KICKBAN < 1234733727 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A friend of mine and I wrote a game server to play a mix of chess and checkers (cheskers), and now I'm generalizing it to play most any game on a vaguely chess-like board. < 1234733738 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(As well as properly supporting all the basic chess rules :P ) < 1234733801 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mixed how? < 1234733831 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You start with a row of chess pieces and two rows of checker pieces. < 1234733864 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok... < 1234733912 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-0-48.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234733921 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's it :P < 1234733928 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beyond that it's just standard chess and checkers rules. < 1234733939 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it changes the dynamics of the game a lot. < 1234733944 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server" < 1234733983 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine one ends up with a useful bishop and a crap bishop < 1234733995 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1234734010 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We call them the "free" bishop and the "pinned" bishop. < 1234734019 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ö < 1234734021 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same is true (to a much lesser degree) of the knights. < 1234734024 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r < 1234734044 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ü < 1234734061 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :m < 1234734165 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird|away < 1234734310 0 :ehird|away!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1234734315 0 :ehird|away!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ehird < 1234734319 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't exist < 1234734338 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're an anti-entity < 1234734340 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1234734346 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, not you < 1234734350 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, well you're an auntie-entity < 1234734356 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other guy, who said hi < 1234734372 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your evil remote twin < 1234734446 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :auntities and other uncleanness < 1234734456 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aunt titties < 1234734509 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever turns you on < 1234734524 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... *stab* < 1234734543 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for which one? < 1234734552 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird. < 1234734564 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::´( < 1234734582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is dead. :-( < 1234734590 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: What, you think I'm stabbing with sunshine and rainbows? :P < 1234734608 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm does that mean your auntity now exists? < 1234734884 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a little bit of aunt titty in all of us. < 1234735155 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uuuuhhhhh, ooook < 1234735178 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi SimonRC < 1234735517 0 :Corun!n=Corun@94-193-40-216.zone7.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1234736362 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1234737685 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1234738541 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes < 1234739004 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1234739205 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@iruel.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1234739380 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Argh" < 1234739596 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1234740240 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-095-033-082-181.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1234740652 0 :psygnisfive!n=psygnisf@c-71-57-164-119.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1234740663 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird da < 1234740687 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i showed the Life sierpinski gasket to my philosophy-and-computers prof and his response was "you gotta be frikkin kidding me" < 1234740776 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DD < 1234740803 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1234740990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Sierpinski gasket in life? < 1234740994 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1234741000 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes? < 1234741002 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION want see < 1234741021 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i showed it off the other day after ehird's doubly mirrored gasket :| < 1234741033 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellnowwhat.net/transfers/Golly1.jpg < 1234741035 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellnowwhat.net/transfers/Golly2.jpg < 1234741040 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh whoops < 1234741052 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellnowwhat.net/transfers/Golly1.png < 1234741054 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wellnowwhat.net/transfers/Golly2.png < 1234741107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: just draw a long perfectly straight line < 1234741113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :voila: sierpinski. < 1234741124 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. Damn. < 1234741126 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1234741128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has to be one of the top coincidences of the century. < 1234741130 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty crazy < 1234741140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure there's a deep mathematical reason for it < 1234741142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just amazing < 1234741145 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh there is < 1234741148 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More accurately, it's not a coincidence at all, as i'm sure there's a deep mathematical reason for it < 1234741150 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its pretty simple when you look up close < 1234741156 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its amazingly obvious < 1234741160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: it wasn't intended, though < 1234741168 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the best of my knowledge < 1234741177 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the reason is basically this ok < 1234741177 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, 'struth. < 1234741190 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the long line spawns two neighboring lines, right < 1234741199 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of the rule for cell activation < 1234741200 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1234741205 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you go from ...010... < 1234741210 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to ...01110... < 1234741227 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"godnatt" < 1234741230 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this then creates two more neighboring lines, while killing off those original three due to crowding < 1234741235 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1234741235 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get ...0100010... < 1234741248 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now you have the same thing again < 1234741250 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1234741251 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only doubled < 1234741256 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and separated by 3 0's < 1234741260 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the debris it generates = sierpinski < 1234741272 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this keeps happening, separating out the long single lines, doubling each time < 1234741304 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that as they build outwards, they naturally form sierpinski's triangle by just .. spreading and doubling. < 1234741463 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"activating sleep mode ......... Done" < 1234741481 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm this explains why it forms initially on the border of the shrinking lines, but not why it doesn't decay more afterwards (although the picture shows some decay) < 1234741491 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Caught sigterm, terminating..." < 1234741502 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not decay < 1234741504 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it smoothes out < 1234741508 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesnt decay afterwards because it just ends up producing oscillators < 1234741544 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so somewhat accidental perhaps < 1234741559 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe symmetry comes into it < 1234741678 0 :comex!n=comex@teklinks.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1234741696 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dude < 1234741699 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Golly has the metapixel < 1234741719 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1234741725 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has a number of them it seems < 1234741734 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the self-simulation of Life < 1234741778 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait golly = GoL ? < 1234741788 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no Golly is an app for running GoL < 1234741798 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah