< 1236816020 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what was the Golly program that you had that generated the dual gasket + randomness? < 1236816029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1236816029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :straight line < 1236816036 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we went over this already :P < 1236816042 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesnt produce that in GoL < 1236816048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :crooked line < 1236816059 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why dont you make it work and then send me the file < 1236816075 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long does it need to be? i tried some in mcell but i don't think i got it big enough. < 1236816080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: psygnisfive: http://hpaste.org/fastcgi/hpaste.fcgi/view?id=2322 < 1236816086 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complete sierpinski program in Haskell. < 1236816090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including command line parsing :P < 1236816093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In 19 lines! < 1236816100 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1236816106 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme do it in ruby! :o < 1236816113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good luck getting as pretty < 1236816122 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% runhaskell sierpinski.hs 30 30 a < 1236816122 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sierpinski.hs: usage: sierpinski [w h] < 1236816122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :intercalate "\n" is unlines < 1236816123 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1236816125 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ermove "sierpinski" < 1236816141 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ? < 1236816151 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, except the final \n < 1236816173 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: psygnisfive: http://hpaste.org/fastcgi/hpaste.fcgi/view?id=2322#a2323 < 1236816174 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :updated < 1236816175 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does unlines fo, anyway < 1236816177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*do < 1236816186 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: [[String]] -> [String] < 1236816188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adds \ns./ < 1236816194 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1236816201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, psygnisfive, if you can get it that elegant in that short as code I'll be very impressed < 1236816205 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you may have guessed, I have a highlight on the word "INTERCAL" < 1236816207 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is exceedingly godo at this type of stuff < 1236816210 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and apparently it's case-insensitive < 1236816210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1236816211 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh < 1236816218 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it depends on your notion of elegant ;) < 1236816219 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exceedingly Godot < 1236816232 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: end end end end end is very elegant. < 1236816233 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not. < 1236816239 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :}}}}} < 1236816241 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1236816246 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: < 1236816247 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: intercalate is a recent addition, no more than a couple years < 1236816256 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck yeah indentation. < 1236816259 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I also have a highlight on the word "ais523" < 1236816270 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, indentation just messes up too many things that don't come up very often < 1236816283 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen whitespace borkage far too often to be comfortable with it < 1236816307 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WFM < 1236816330 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: for instance, what if you're trying to type a python program over a serial cable by hand? < 1236816336 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't do that. < 1236816339 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you really don't want to have to type out the indentation in that case < 1236816348 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: exactly, that's a limitation of the language < 1236816355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :% runhaskell sierpinski.hs 0 0 < 1236816355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* < 1236816356 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, an off by one < 1236816365 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1236816370 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, tabs vs. spaces < 1236816380 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally not a problem, you can just automatically reindent < 1236816383 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huge problem in Python < 1236816394 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tabs in Python produce a warning < 1236816400 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on every run < 1236816401 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :problem solve < 1236816402 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1236816411 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, now you're just inflating code size for no reason < 1236816423 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by SEVERAL BYTES < 1236816436 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: whitespace is a substantial proportion of a typical python program < 1236816441 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially at 4-space indentation < 1236816442 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1236816444 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pastie.org is down D: < 1236816447 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it is < 1236816455 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what can i use instead :| < 1236816458 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so much for ehird's permanent pastes for helping logreaders things < 1236816464 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use rafb.net, it annoys ehird < 1236816465 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rafb deletes permanently < 1236816468 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pastie just happens to be down < 1236816471 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: paste.lisp.org < 1236816496 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has no ruby < 1236816506 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ok < 1236816506 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what < 1236816507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have eyes < 1236816539 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://paste.lisp.org/display/76862 < 1236816547 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two eyes live, one eye dies. < 1236816564 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hpaste.org/fastcgi/hpaste.fcgi/view?id=2322#a2323 is more readable, more elegant and quicker < 1236816569 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1236816572 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you missed command line arg processing < 1236816576 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont find your elegant at all D: < 1236816585 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not supposed to be command line bitch :| < 1236816591 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could make it 2 lines of haskell, btw, but I was making it verbose and readable < 1236816592 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont care about your ugly commandline shit < 1236816600 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make it smaller! < 1236816602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugly, lol < 1236816605 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I like it < 1236816609 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to see smaller < 1236816619 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could do more readable too i guess < 1236816621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k, here < 1236816652 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Data.Bits < 1236816652 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Data.List < 1236816653 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sierpinski w h = [ [ x .&. y == 0 | x <- [0..w] ] | y <- [0..h] ] < 1236816655 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = putStr . unlines . map (map (\b -> if b then '*' else ' ')) $ sierpinski 30 30 < 1236816657 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could omit the sierpinski definition line: < 1236816668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :main = putStr . unlines . map (map (\b -> if b then '*' else ' ')) $ [ [ x .&. y == 0 | x <- [0..30] ] | y <- [0..30] ] < 1236816691 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/lQGGDWNZ <- on the #haskell codepad, newsham added me < 1236816723 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you're missing a * at the right and at the bottom < 1236816730 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no hes not < 1236816736 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just didnt go up to that start is all :p < 1236816744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, 31,31 would fix that < 1236816747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is fine < 1236816750 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, ok < 1236816814 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: http://codepad.org/Y1PV2gVc < 1236816817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newsham centered it :D < 1236816847 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1236816882 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, very nice algorithm psygnisfive < 1236816891 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you noticed how much the sierpinski definition resembles the mathematical one you gave? < 1236816892 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not my discovery. < 1236816895 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, that's how awesome it is :P < 1236816899 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i havent actually < 1236816915 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i also discovered a way to generate a gasket inductively over a graph < 1236816932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ (x,y) : x,y in N, &(x,y) = 0 } < 1236816932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ (x,y) | x <- [0..w], y <- [0..h], x .&. y == 0 ] < 1236816941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first is your mathematical one, second is my haskell one < 1236816944 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oh well < 1236816958 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first one was actually intended to be pseudohaskell from the beginning ;) < 1236816974 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1236816977 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :inductively on a graph: < 1236816998 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :G = (Nodes,Edges) where Nodes = N^2 < 1236817015 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1: The edge ((0,0),(0,1)) is in Edges < 1236817025 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2: The edge ((0,0),(1,0)) is in Edges < 1236817045 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what in the bitwise patterns gives rise to sierpinski < 1236817048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the God fractal... < 1236817070 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: clearly this is evidence that the universe is run by cellular automata! < 1236817096 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3: IFF (i,j) is of incoming degree 1, then ((i,j),(i+1,j)) and ((i,i),(i,j+1)) are in Edges < 1236817144 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er.. that should obviously be (i,j) not (i,i) on the right there < 1236817157 0 :Jophish!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1236817285 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres also another very simple algorithm that produces an identical gasket < 1236817308 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats similarly simple but not as mathematically pure < 1236817363 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ofcourse the simple duplicate-to-form-a-new-item algorithm works < 1236817395 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a more general way so as to produce not just the sierpinski gasket but also the cantor set, etc. < 1236818667 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236818691 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird < 1236818701 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1236818707 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :send me the golly file < 1236818721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lazy < 1236818725 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1236818739 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know who else is lazy? < 1236818740 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slereah < 1236818743 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you dont want to be like slereah do you < 1236818822 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that depends. is he rich? < 1236818826 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1236818830 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hes a homosexual! < 1236818837 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a communist < 1236818851 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :communist? < 1236818856 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1236818864 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, hes french < 1236818865 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1236818866 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same thing < 1236818871 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspected the homosexual but i never really got it confirmed before < 1236819257 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell is fun like a kitten. < 1236819263 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1236819269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a kitteny kitten. < 1236819276 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird < 1236819282 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're clearly either a girl, or a faggot. < 1236819285 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :take your pick, < 1236819292 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about both < 1236819301 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately both dosnt apply < 1236819326 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean lesbians don't like kittens? < 1236819330 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1236819334 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they hate them with a passion < 1236819344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about < 1236819345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lesbian < 1236819346 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kittens < 1236819357 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you learn something new every day < 1236819445 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i discovered a way to make a fuse in GoL < 1236819551 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: http://bash.org/?105356 < 1236819605 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a very good point < 1236819610 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meth makes you like that big time < 1236819616 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuse: < 1236819621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then I must be permanently on meth. < 1236819632 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[right down down left down down] < 1236819641 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut < 1236819644 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat until you dont want to < 1236819654 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :color a cell < 1236819655 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :move right < 1236819657 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :color a cell < 1236819658 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mov down < 1236819659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Omg, golly 2.0 is out < 1236819662 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :color a cell < 1236819663 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :move down < 1236819671 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1236819687 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1236819689 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it removes itself? < 1236819694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, a wavy horizontal line does that < 1236819696 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :diagonally < 1236819697 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorta < 1236819697 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh not as such < 1236819701 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sort of... < 1236819706 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :burns itself up :) < 1236819718 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just do it. make it very long < 1236819743 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloes < 1236819744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, right < 1236819745 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :simple < 1236819748 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oi oi < 1236819757 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ie < 1236819783 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i just say < 1236819786 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much i love you guys < 1236819794 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for being so dorky that i cant talk about this shit with you < 1236819795 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1236819824 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, "cant"? < 1236819833 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can* < 1236819842 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn fingers < 1236819856 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION swats psygnisfive's fingers for him -----###
< 1236819864 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1236820048 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash sucks < 1236820093 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also have i mentioned hardcover books are awesome < 1236820100 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are just incredible < 1236820113 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially when they're really thick and clean < 1236820121 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like 1300 pages < 1236820122 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one < 1236820146 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should probably buy another one of those for just touching and licking < 1236820161 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1236820183 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew :| < 1236820190 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :booksexual < 1236820204 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew? < 1236820234 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm a bibliophile in many senses < 1236820295 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmm also when you open it, there's tons of shit i'll never understand, but it's so pretty < 1236820297 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"and then you'd just have giant red orbs flying around the planet that can eat up functional satelites katamari-style. " < 1236820302 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAAA, NA NA NA NA NA NA NA < 1236820425 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im off to the cafe < 1236820431 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boys goys < 1236820512 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good night < 1236820689 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: er, what? < 1236820701 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: katamari damacy < 1236820733 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i've slightly heard of that, but it was the rest of it i wondered about < 1236820788 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if they could use it for cleaning up space junk... :D < 1236821063 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:23 Tseg: That makes sense. Here's my reference trick: mfix(f)=let r=newRef(Nothing) in ContIO(\to->in runIO(f(unJust(readRef(r))))(\v->do {writeIORef(r)(Just(v)); to(v)})) < 1236821065 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH MY GOD IT IS C. < 1236821072 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: THAT IS HASKELL WTF < 1236821084 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck < 1236821089 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even I know that's bad Haskell < 1236821097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's a newbie from C < 1236821098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but JESUS CHRIST < 1236821121 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :runIO $ f $ unJust $ readRef $ r < 1236821123 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plskthx < 1236821129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"readRef $ r" fail < 1236821132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's readRef r < 1236821133 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also ti should be < 1236821134 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, yeah < 1236821139 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :runIO . f . unJust . readRef $ r < 1236821161 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that work? < 1236821164 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ confuses me < 1236821170 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an operator that does nothing but it has a high precedence < 1236821180 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1236821180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't do nothin < 1236821181 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1236821183 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :() is the empty operator < 1236821185 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does nothing < 1236821185 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :($) = () < 1236821188 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1236821192 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a $ b = a b < 1236821195 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the definition < 1236821197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that regular application is an infix operator with a 0-length name < 1236821200 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ is an explicit name for it < 1236821211 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yes, I know that's a YO DAWG situation) < 1236821276 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a yodawgmorphism < 1236821326 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or strictly speaking, supdawgmorphism, which is dual to an infdawgmorphism < 1236821839 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: also, that is so much harder to read than runIO(f(unJust(readF(r)))) < 1236821843 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though much prettier < 1236821851 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but less clear on what it's doing < 1236823760 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1236823805 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok im back < 1236824369 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1236824692 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-126-222.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236825380 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236825906 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825906 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825906 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825907 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825908 0 :Dewio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825909 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825909 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825909 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825909 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825909 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825909 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825910 0 :ski__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825910 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825914 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236825921 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1236825921 0 :lifthrasiir!n=lifthras@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236825997 0 :kerlo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236826202 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236826202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236826259 0 :lament!n=lament@S010600110999ad06.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :kerlo_!n=ihope@normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :lifthrasiir!n=lifthras@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-126-222.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@c-71-202-121-102.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-4-12.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :MizardX!i=MizardX@92.254.128.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :psygnisfive!n=psygnisf@c-71-57-164-119.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :Ilari!n=user@a88-113-39-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :fungot!n=fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :ehird!n=ehird@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826259 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@cpc2-stkn13-2-0-cust73.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :Leonidas!n=Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :Dewio!n=dewi@124-171-184-160.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :Asztal!n=moo@chunkybacon.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-15-119.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :mtve!n=mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :ineiros!n=ineiros@kosh.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@r03jjw8v9.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :Robdgreat!i=rob@unaffiliated/robdgreat JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@ludios.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :ski__!n=md9slj@remote3.student.chalmers.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236826260 0 :irc.freenode.net!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o lament < 1236826385 0 :Deewiant_!n=deewiant@tavi.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236827022 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1236828596 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236830046 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1236831455 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Good night" < 1236831617 0 :sEvher!n=ubuntu@delta.ds3.agh.edu.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1236831741 0 :sEvher!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1236832641 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1236832691 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-129-204.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236832720 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1236833030 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :given a big directory of text, i need a fast way of searching it < 1236833036 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(faster than simple grep) < 1236833756 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it's sorted (or some known permutation of sorted) you can't go any quicker than grep < 1236833926 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... or has any other property you can exploit for speed < 1236833955 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can build an index < 1236833990 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :building the index ~ grep < 1236833996 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :search < grep < 1236834248 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :building the index + searching > grep < 1236834712 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhow, I don't know much about indexing, and am to tired to research it now. Good night. < 1236836389 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1236843037 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236843050 0 :kwertii!n=kwertii@c-71-202-121-102.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236843148 0 :asiekierk!i=africalo@078088180066.elb.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1236843149 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1236843287 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey. < 1236844799 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1236844800 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1236845624 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1236846024 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"bye" < 1236846481 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@a91-153-121-248.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236847207 0 :Deewiant_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236847324 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@tavi.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236849306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MizardX, building an index is a one time cost though, so once you done it you can use it several times < 1236849329 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for a one time search a plain grep would be faster than first building the index < 1236849416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that assumes the datset doesn't change, if it does you would need to rebuild (possibly partial, for text files you could speed up rebuild by skipping if modification time hasn the index. < 1236849419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hasn't changed) < 1236849450 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blergh at hitting enter instead of ' ... < 1236849530 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also indexing is non-trivial if you want to include things like stemming. < 1236849570 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that there wouldn't be a pile of tools and libraries for that short of stuff. < 1236849574 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/short/sort/ < 1236849577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ok < 1236849586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, grep is non-trivial if you want that too < 1236849595 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but grep's already there always. < 1236849607 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like a natural law; there's grep everywhere. < 1236849613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well I mean, you can't do stemming in grep afaik < 1236849620 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not GNU grep at least < 1236849632 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, you meant that. Well, no. < 1236849667 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if not the GNU tool then probably no other grep either. It's like a natural law; the GNU tools are always the most bloated ones. < 1236849692 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stemming in grep would be a bit over-the-top even for a GNU tool. < 1236849704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1236849724 0 :tombom!i=tombom@82.26.197.58 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236849725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway I don't know if it would be possible to use any sort of index for stuff like grep -E < 1236849743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose basic wildcards work with indexes. Or how would LIKE work in SQL? < 1236849794 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least PostgreSQL optimizes only LIKE expressions of the type "foo%" (i.e. prefix-matching) using indices. < 1236849802 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1236849826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is the FTS stuff in postgre about btw? < 1236849831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :full text index or something iirc < 1236849839 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The optimizer can also use a B-tree index for queries involving the pattern matching operators LIKE and ~ if the pattern is a constant and is anchored to the beginning of the string — for example, col LIKE 'foo%' or col ~ '^foo', but not col LIKE '%bar'." < 1236849848 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's got a full-text-search thingie. < 1236849861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that for LIKE or for something else? < 1236849870 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something else. < 1236849878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. How does it work? < 1236849887 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's got a different way of making queries, pretty much a bag-of-words that you can search for. < 1236849894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1236849915 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it works "the usual way", with a so-called inverted index: there's a mapping from words to "documents" where they occur. < 1236849962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236849976 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect using indexes for regex would be hard < 1236850011 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; though you could possibly use them in some special cases to limit the amount of records that need to be actually tested with the real regex engine. < 1236850020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well true < 1236850037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"foo|bar|quux" would be trivial to use an index for for example < 1236850048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait is that valid? two "for" after each other... < 1236850179 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could (in that particular case) match the words in your index (which is less text than the indexed stuff) against foo|bar|quux, and then select those places where they occur. < 1236850179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, though I know the current xkcd is from yesterday I think it is much better than recent average < 1236850195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just forgot to comment on it yesteday in here) < 1236850225 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A suffix tree is also nice if you really need a fast way of "check if this long piece of text exactly contains this arbitrary substring", but I think it takes more space (larger than the original text) than your general full-text-search inverted-index (which I think in reasonable use cases ends up being less; I think I saw a figure like "30 % of your data" in some Lucene documentation or something). < 1236850245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, best way: CAM < 1236850247 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1236850256 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Client Excited" < 1236850288 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I doubt that would help for regexes < 1236850308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, it is probably the fastest way to search in general. < 1236850376 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't really help when all you've got is software, of course. < 1236850388 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1236850395 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll go do an early-ish (10:33 local-time) lunch now. < 1236850402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, one sec < 1236850408 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm? < 1236850413 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it seems hard to speed up regex at all really < 1236850430 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to many other types of searches < 1236850453 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or? < 1236850463 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I'd certainly say so. < 1236850492 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the same goes for one loopup -> several regex matching < 1236850502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like for a spamfilter < 1236850526 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then I mean spamfilters for ircds mostly < 1236850529 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google Code does regular expression search over a large set of data; but no-one knows (well, except Google themselves) how it's done. < 1236850542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ok *that* is interesting < 1236850554 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236850557 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a large set of constant data, wouldn't help in an ircd spam-filter where every sentence is new. < 1236850576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes, and you need to match each line to several regexes < 1236850583 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia just has some idle speculation: "... but appears to have combined precomputed indices with a POSIX compliant regular expression engine.[citation needed][original research?]" < 1236850602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a set of wildcard patterns you could do some easier matching < 1236850634 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :storing them sorted would help selecting a better one earlier for example < 1236850647 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unlike a regex. (zzz)?aaa < 1236850676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you still have to deal with * at the start though < 1236850688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, cya. Have to leave too. < 1236850718 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For "multiple regexps against a single line", you can combine the regexps into a single one, then compile that one to a single huge state machine. < 1236851744 0 :ais523!i=93bc1b55@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-03036bc5012d38da JOIN :#esoteric < 1236853938 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm ok < 1236853948 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, good idea even < 1236855714 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client" < 1236855869 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think flex does sort-of something like that in the scanners it builds. I mean, basically what it does is to have a large set of expressions to match against the input, and the scanner it generates seems to resemble a state machine. I haven't looked at the details. < 1236856194 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yH_j8-VVLo - amusing short piece on Erlang < 1236856439 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh; I missed the "promoted videos" side-bar heading, so the page looked as if it said "[down-arrow] Related videos", followed by "Funny Face Yoga", "The Cat Phone - PetTube..." and "Failed Toy Pitch - Come...". They didn't sound very related to me. < 1236856453 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I guess Erlang use can easily lead to Funny Face Yoga. Or something. < 1236857910 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc I saw a regex -> C generator < 1236857912 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot the name < 1236857949 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes re2c < 1236857952 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never tried it < 1236858206 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yH_j8-VVLo - amusing short piece on Erlang <-- old < 1236858295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah no, just the small preview image was old. from another video < 1236858314 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have that regex -> brainfuck generator. :p < 1236858318 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also one of those images are from BOIC screen saver... < 1236858330 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BOINC* < 1236858386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wait what? PCRE? < 1236858386 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"For maximum performance. [Footnote, tiny print: The expression "maximum performance" is based on the reasonable assumption that your computational platform is based on the Brainfuck industry-standard low-level architecture.]" < 1236858403 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, link? < 1236858403 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just very basic regexps. < 1236858432 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kleene star, the | operation and concatenation; I don't know if I had anything else. < 1236858462 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll grep my logs; I dug it up not very long time ago (certainly not more than a couple of months) for someone else on this channel. < 1236858471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thought it was http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKfKtXYLG78 first < 1236858510 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is IMO way funnier and interesting < 1236858651 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but that one's actually old. :-P < 1236858787 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://zem.fi/~fis/BFRE.java -- then "javac BFRE.java" and "java -cp . BFRE '(ab)*' > test.b" should generate a test.b which accepts (outputs "acc!") strings like "abab" and "abababab" but rejects (outputs "rej!") strings like "abba". < 1236858810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you like java so much < 1236858811 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to remember it generating rather large brainfuck output files. < 1236858830 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't, I just was having a Java phase at that moment. < 1236858843 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently I'm back in the Perly period, having gone through a short bit of Python there. < 1236858872 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about C++? < 1236858893 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm eagerly waiting for the next C++ sprint, I could actually work on jitfunge a bit at that point. < 1236858896 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jitfunge was in C++ right? < 1236858920 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like you read my mind here. < 1236858968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so what if you need to use another language suddenly? < 1236858976 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like an assignment or whatever < 1236858979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which doesn < 1236858989 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't* match the current sprint < 1236858999 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever you called it < 1236859025 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A "period", by way of analogy to, say, Picasso's blue period. < 1236859055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I guess it was lucky that there wasn't a shortage of blue paint during that period < 1236859057 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I guess that depends. It's not like I couldn't touch other languages, it's more of a preference for any on-my-free-time things. < 1236859067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe there was a shortage of other pigments? < 1236859070 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from blue < 1236859081 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually that compiled (ab)* isn't so bad; it's just something like 18.5 80-column lines. < 1236859156 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, in cfunge it would be way shorter: "PXER"4( "*)ba(" ;something I forgot; ;forgot what commant it was in REXP; < 1236859162 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1236859176 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does CCBI implement REXP btw? < 1236859186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ^ < 1236859191 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 3DSP < 1236859192 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: v < 1236859194 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1236859197 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ^ < 1236859199 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: v < 1236859200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1236859200 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1236859201 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ^ < 1236859260 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: There's an option in BFRE to generate commented brainfuck: just change line 621 from "String bf = re.bf();" => "String bf = re.bf(false);" and recompile. < 1236859281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : v > < 1236859281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v> > < 1236859281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : # < 1236859281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> v^< < 1236859281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ^ < 1236859281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1236859297 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Infinite loop, oh dear < 1236859302 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, no? < 1236859309 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1236859312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1236859316 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v< < 1236859318 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have been that < 1236859327 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait no < 1236859332 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, not infinite loop < 1236859332 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The v in the lower right corner is an infinite loop < 1236859353 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the same sense than your plain old "v" was. < 1236859358 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But of course that whole thing can only loop forever anyway) < 1236859360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, exactly < 1236859381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well I assumed that too < 1236859382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just wondering if I was supposed to traverse all the chars or not < 1236859393 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, huh? < 1236859435 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, right, I'm supposed to start at the ^ and not the v :-P < 1236859443 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well. < 1236859452 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought that was quite logical, since it's what was after the "name:" part. < 1236859458 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm iirc someone said GCC is getting a plugin architecture soon. Can anyone confirm this? < 1236859458 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That BFRE thing doesn't even optimize long strings of +s or -s; could save a lot in the generated output with just that. So don't use it in a production system. < 1236859467 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION doesn't have browser running atm
< 1236859468 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I read it as "execute the above". < 1236859516 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, maybe cfunge should have optional plugin support, to support static analysers and such < 1236859549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what I planned just needs to parse the trace output < 1236859553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236859783 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like to work on jitfunge more if there wasn't that damned self-modification going on. I can't even compile a constant-argument p into a simple memory store, without worrying that later the jitter is going to create a compiled trace at that location, and it will then be invalidated if this particular p instruction is ever executed. < 1236860059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh < 1236860069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I'm sure it can be solved somehow. < 1236860117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, also if there wasn't self modification you could just compile it normally without needing JIT < 1236860160 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given the funky Befunge code-flow, that's not completely trivial either; I'd still suspect a tracing JIT could be the way to go. It'd just be a lot easier. < 1236860216 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently jitfunge has a "solution" which basically boils down recording in funge-space all the cells where any compiled-to-memory-store-puts refer to, and later if we end up executing code in such a place, invalidating the referring code. < 1236860238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1236860264 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which means that when it's recompiled and compiling the 'p', it knows to use the put-it-there-carefully function call instead of a compiled store.) < 1236860295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, put it there carefully mean "invalidate compiled code"? < 1236860303 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :means* < 1236860306 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, pretty much. < 1236860328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, how did you handle pop on empty stack now again? < 1236860376 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have a solution to a piece of code where there are two "routines", and each of them 'p'-modifies the other, then "calls" (well, goes to) the other; they both end up being recompiled all the time, but it'd need serious cleverness to notice something like that and compile the routines into "before-the-modified-place" and "after-the-modified-place" halves. < 1236860398 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what about ' and s ? < 1236860457 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a PROT_NONE memory block "under" the stack, and I catch the SIGSEGV, extract the machine context from the signal, examine the opcodes near the offending instruction to see what was going on, then manipulate the necessary registers to simulate a "it returned a zero but did not move the stack pointer" situation. < 1236860469 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway one idea would be to note that the place is edited often, and once a threshold is reached skip compiling the cell that p writes to, and compile two traces one on each side of that point < 1236860514 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm so popping on empty stack has quite high overhead? < 1236860538 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't measured, but very likely. < 1236860548 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the very least something compared to setjmp/longjmp usage. < 1236860555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1236860601 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the most likely case of hitting that would be on >:#,_ idiom < 1236860609 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so optimising that specially maybe? < 1236860617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the* < 1236860628 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always put an explicit 0 there; I usually have other stuff on the stack anyway. < 1236860659 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But a print-loop could be detected specially, yes. < 1236860659 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mycology pops an empty stack quite often, I think < 1236860679 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well depends, I often write test cases, so I tend to know if it is "GOOD" or "BAD" and not have anything useful on stack any more < 1236860686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus probably doing an n < 1236860705 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I have garbage on it < 1236860706 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "note often-edited places" is also something I've thought about. But it's yet more stuff to track, I'd need to keep write-counts on just about all modified-by-code funge-space locations to see if they are modified often. The simplest "someone wrote there once, so someone's probably going to keep modifying it" rule might be too simple. < 1236860713 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I tend to do "n" instead of "0" in Mycology < 1236860727 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, doesn't Java HotSpot do something like that? < 1236860729 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well often executed < 1236860731 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case < 1236860754 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it doesn't need to track all data storage memory for potential changes also. :p < 1236860756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I suspect that is most common in test case code < 1236860765 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I often use the first row as temp storage < 1236860772 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I could have a "someone modified a location which actually contained some code that was previously executed" rule. < 1236860775 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean I don't need it after the start < 1236860792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is setup, and later temp storage < 1236860824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand, sometimes the setup code write stuff into the program once < 1236860862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, does anyone have a ?-based unbiased RNG for funge? Range 0-9 < 1236860893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried a tree structure but it is hard to make sure you get an even probability for all cases < 1236860916 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fungot keeps some stuff semi-permanently on the stack (I don't remember what stuff; some numbers related to the raw IRC socket data under processing, I think) so I can't clear it. Since I don't use the stack-stack at all. < 1236860959 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, another thing that might be useful to optimise somehow is if one side of a ? has an > pointing at the ? < 1236860979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite common when you want n outputs for n < 4 < 1236861041 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really remember how I did ? right now. I think currently it always ends a compiled piece of code. < 1236861400 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think http://zem.fi/~fis/rand.txt should work for unbiased [0-9]; it's based on the ? => ??? tree of generating unbiasedly 0-11 (0-3 from first ?, 4-7 from second, 8-11 from third) except that here the two unnecessary outputs are redirected back to the initial ? for a re-roll. < 1236861492 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1-9 is easier < 1236861517 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, since you can just make the 1-3, 4-6, 7-9 decision, and then use a three-output ?. < 1236861538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://paste.lisp.org/display/76883 < 1236861541 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like that yes < 1236861578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm what about one with an upper time bound? < 1236861588 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean both or ours is O(inf) in worst case < 1236861605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine could possibly bounce between >? forever < 1236861605 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O(inf) sounds pretty slow! < 1236861608 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your redirect back < 1236861613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah, worst case < 1236861622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah, "random, if bad try again" < 1236861625 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have a >? in the first three-way decision, it could keep bouncing there. < 1236861629 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The probability of that worst case is zero though < 1236861642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, really? 9999999999999999999999999 < 1236861667 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Given a ? which is guaranteed to go in all directions, it is < 1236861687 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yes it is, on average and if you wait long enough < 1236861761 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhoo, if you want an even and bounded 0-9 generator in Befunge with ? I'm fairly sure it can't be done, you can only get powers of 2 < 1236861787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236861822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, this gives raise to an interesting question... < 1236861833 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"bounded time even randomness complete" languages < 1236861847 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236861848 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can be done with the generator in FIXP, I forget the instruction's name (probably R) < 1236861882 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can get a "reasonably even" one by generating a large 2^n number in an even way, then taking %10; the biasedness goes down the larger number you bother to create there. < 1236861884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hm another idea: implement a PRNG in funge, using ? for the seed or randomness pool < 1236861888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depending on how you do it < 1236861926 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And you can get "reasonably bounded" by doing >? :-) < 1236861986 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After all, "rand() % N" (or the division-based alternative to get supposedly better, higher bits) is not even either, unless (RAND_MAX+1) % N == 0, but people still do it. < 1236861996 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't. :-P < 1236862011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I remember the glibc random() is supposed to have good randomness in all bits < 1236862011 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, unless I don't care. < 1236862016 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't do it in CCBI. < 1236862075 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: If RAND_MAX is 4 and rand() is even and you take rand()%2, you're mapping [0,1,2,3,4] to [0,1,0,1,0]: 0 comes out with probability 3/5, 1 with 2/5 < 1236862077 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually fungot uses the "reasonably even" route when selecting what to babble, but that's mostly because I need a rather large range, and it was simpler that way. < 1236862077 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: there you are < 1236862131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, mhm < 1236862184 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, rand() != random() though. Man page says range for random() is 16 * ((2^31) - 1) < 1236862192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"approximately" < 1236862197 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1236862198 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It doesn't matter what function you use < 1236862198 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :misread < 1236862200 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was the period < 1236862202 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1236862215 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I said applies for any random number generator < 1236862220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so what bits are best to take? the middle ones? < 1236862233 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: On the other hand, RAND_MAX is typically something like 2^31-1. < 1236862235 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't matter either, unless the generator says some bits are crap < 1236862246 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, so the error is small in practice. < 1236862287 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd have probabilities of .49999999976716935623 and .50000000023283064376 for 0 and 1. Or the other way around. < 1236862296 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: IMO the only way to make it even is to go the unbounded route, that's what I do < 1236862308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, in CCBI? < 1236862317 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and wherever I care about evenness < 1236862335 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't do it in cfunge, you'll slow it down! :-P < 1236862343 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to eat now -> < 1236862345 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fungot does something like "n = 0; for (i = 0; i < 10; i++) n = (4*n) + rand(4); n = n % range;" where rand(4) is done with a single ?, and it's not actually 10, it's something else I forgot. < 1236862347 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I do have a comment in the code about it < 1236862363 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it suggests sending a patch if you need a more uniform rng < 1236862377 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because since RAND_MAX is so large the actual error is very small < 1236862409 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: How biased are you? < 1236862409 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i used to have one with size as well as < 1236862434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The versions of rand() and srand() in the Linux C Library use the same random number generator as random(3) and srandom(3), so the lower-order bits < 1236862434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : should be as random as the higher-order bits. However, on older rand() implementations, and on current implementations on different systems, the < 1236862434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : lower-order bits are much less random than the higher-order bits. Do not use this function in applications intended to be portable when good ran‐ < 1236862434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : domness is needed. (Use random(3) instead.) < 1236862444 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from man srand < 1236862451 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man rand gives me some openssl man page instead < 1236862457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in section 3 < 1236862483 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh? My openssl rand is in section 1. < 1236862487 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it's a command. < 1236862494 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does refer to RAND_bytes(3). < 1236862496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there is OpenSSL API docs < 1236862502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAME < 1236862502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : rand - pseudo-random number generator < 1236862502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SYNOPSIS < 1236862502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : #include < 1236862524 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RAND_bytes and several more functions are documented there < 1236862534 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have such. I might not have installed some openssl-doc package. < 1236862538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No entry for rand in section 1 of the manual < 1236862568 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, my openssl is built with useflags: gmp sse2 zlib -kerberos < 1236862573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where - is turned off < 1236862585 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no separate doc package < 1236862594 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have this: RAND(1SSL) -- rand - generate pseudo-random bytes -- openssl rand [-out file] [-rand file(s)] [-base64] num < 1236862603 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bit silly to have all those openssl commands separately, though. < 1236862613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I only have an entry for that in openssl(1) < 1236862616 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don < 1236862621 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't* have any 1ssl section < 1236862642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cannot open the message catalog "man" for locale "sv_SE.UTF-8" < 1236862642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(NLSPATH="") < 1236862645 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder what that means < 1236862715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my man didn't install any gettext files or such at least < 1236862901 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are four instances of ? actually executed as code in fungot sources: one is that [0, 2^24-1]-range loop-based generator, two are in a a "unrolled" two-iteration loop generating [0, 15], and the final is in ^bool selecting one out of two outputs. < 1236862901 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what are the other major difference is how much more complex one. < 1236862955 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually the ^bool case is a bit silly, since it has a >?< structure to get only two outputs; I could've gotten a less bouncy unbiased version very easily. < 1236863083 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There's also the ? character in a "ping? pong!" comment, another comment in the list of punctuation symbols the babble-generator can produce, and yet another in the '? part where the babble-generator actually does a question mark.) < 1236863505 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236863525 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much of fungot source file is actually needed to run fungot < 1236863526 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: mine is fuller extent than many other languages and modules. see scheme/ fnord ls < 1236863532 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc there were a huge block of comments at the end? < 1236863549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION considers delayed loading and then thinks better of it
< 1236863789 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1236863828 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Out of 495 lines, only 381 are needed. < 1236863861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still optimising >:#._ might be worthwhile for cfunge in the static area, but the run time overhead of checking for it, hm... < 1236863876 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still,* < 1236866307 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-095-033-077-007.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1236866364 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usually I like writing in TeX math-mode, but occasionally it's not quite as clean as the resulting output: http://www.cis.hut.fi/htkallas/latexmath.png < 1236866494 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'occasionally' < 1236866508 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite often in my experience < 1236866534 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially when you have complex arrays and you need to put stuff like \phantoms all over the place to get stuff to align nicely < 1236866577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm tried LyX? It is quite a nice frontend, and iirc it handles math quite well too < 1236866577 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may have been attempting an understatement. There's one \rule there for spacing. < 1236866583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about the most advanced stuff < 1236866600 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, that example isn't that bad IMO :-) < 1236866630 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tried LyX, didn't like it. Maybe it's just my normal aversion to all things gooey. And it was not recently, they might have improved it since then. < 1236866649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, recent LyX is a lot better than when I started using LyX < 1236866660 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was maybe a year ago or so < 1236866710 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'm sure it was at least two years ago when I last tried it. < 1236866730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, lyx optionally supports pre-rendering the math expressions on the fly, to be able to show any unsupported commands too < 1236866733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a new feature < 1236866758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, however make sure to use the very last release, often package managers in distros lag behind < 1236866772 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh also I only used the QT4 frontend for it < 1236866801 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc they dropped the GTK one since it sucked < 1236866821 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really have a choice of what to use on this work-workstation, except I can bug our administrators of course. < 1236866860 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, can't you install it in ~ ? < 1236866865 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want to. < 1236866884 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially since they've thoughtfully provided us with a version. < 1236866886 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I recommend lyx-1.6.0 or later. 1.6.1 is what I use < 1236866899 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're having disk space issues anyway, I think. < 1236866899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I definitely wouldn't use older ones any more < 1236866909 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.6 improved things a lot < 1236866914 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Installed LyX here is "LyX version 1.5.6 (Sun, Jul 27, 2008)". Not *old*, but not *new* either. < 1236866917 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, of course I would also use a very recent texlive < 1236866931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well 1.5 is not so good < 1236866947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the math stuff really improved in 1.6 < 1236866988 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The /home share is again 92 % full; and that's a rather good situation, it's been completely full on occasion. < 1236866992 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Filesystem Size Used Avail Use% Mounted on < 1236866994 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :baldrick:/vol/home 488G 447G 42G 92% /m/fs/home < 1236867017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1236867020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, quotas? < 1236867023 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :None. < 1236867025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how many users < 1236867051 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a public, autogenerated-every-weekend list of "disk space usage per user", sorted by amount of space used, so you know who to blame. < 1236867059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1236867072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so where is you on that list? < 1236867073 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your /home is smaller than our /home < 1236867092 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Yes, well, it's not the size, it's how we use it. < 1236867111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway, don't you have your own computer? < 1236867121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a laptop or whatever < 1236867126 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nfs:/home 1.3T 211G 444G 33% /home < 1236867148 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that work? 211 G used, 444 G free, total size 1.3 T? < 1236867161 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, I was just wondering about that myself < 1236867171 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do believe the 'free' number is the one that's correct < 1236867186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236867197 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's our project-shares, where all non-temporary ("work" is for that) big files should be kept: < 1236867198 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, what file system is it really? < 1236867200 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :baldrick:/vol/project0 2.0T 1.5T 540G 74% /m/fs/project0 < 1236867203 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blackadder:/vol/project1 1.4T 1.4T 25G 99% /m/fs/project1 < 1236867208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it is ext* then the "reserved for root" space... < 1236867217 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and over nfs I'm not sure how that works < 1236867228 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's mounted over NFS, and I'm not quite sure how it works either. < 1236867237 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyhoo, I used to lead diskhogs at 14G < 1236867246 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah wait < 1236867249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it isn't a partition mounted < 1236867254 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then somebody had a broken script and filled the drive with a diskhogs value of 493G < 1236867256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a direction on a partition on the server < 1236867281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course that would happen then < 1236867290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :size of the sub tree vs size of disk < 1236867310 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm #91 in our /home directory size-usage list, with ~1.4G. #1 has 20G. And actually ineiros here on this channel is #2 with 18G. :p < 1236867340 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ours only shows the top 10 < 1236867370 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think I've been off the mailing list for a few months < 1236867391 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last one I got was in December < 1236867407 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The project directory disk-usage chart is less useful, since it just shows the directories, not directly whose fault it is. < 1236867475 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about using lyx on your own computer fizzie ? < 1236867506 0 :ais523!n=ais523@92-236-187-64.cable.ubr08.king.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1236867542 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The laptop is less comfortable than this workstation, with an external monitor, keyboard and mouse. And besides, I couldn't plug my own laptop into the network anyway. < 1236867551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1236867552 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even using wireless? < 1236867579 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a separate sort of network then. < 1236867584 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No direct SSH access to lab machines. < 1236867699 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indirect, though? < 1236867838 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, "james" is accessible from the Interwebs. But it's still not quite as convenient, even though sshfs-like stuff could make it bearable, if the wireless wasn't so unreliable and laggy. < 1236867892 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't there a plug into the outer network < 1236867913 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From what I heard, they're replacing the old "aalto" network (which required a https-based web-page-login) with a completely open "aalto Open" (which is even less part of the university network), and because of that the old network is not actively maintained, while the new one is very under-construction and doesn't seem to be available here. < 1236867933 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I saw "aalto Open" in one of the lecture halls, though. So maybe they really are working on it, and it's not just a convenient excuse. < 1236867947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1236867948 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aalto Open works better outdoors < 1236867955 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is "aalto"? < 1236867955 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in the main building, too, I think < 1236867959 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Wave" < 1236867963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1236867964 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fi:aalto is en:wave, yes. < 1236867976 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also: The noun aalto has 1 sense (no senses from tagged texts) < 1236867976 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. Aalto, Alvar Aalto, Hugo Alvar Henrik Aalto -- (Finnish architect and designer of furniture (1898-1976)) < 1236867983 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WordNet is so comprehensive. < 1236867985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a brand name of wireless access points or something? < 1236867989 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The name of both the old wireless network and of the upcoming university which is an amalgamation of a couple of current ones < 1236868023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear, those names are always awful < 1236868033 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed < 1236868038 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the name of then? < 1236868051 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, this year is the last change to graduate from Helsinki University of Technology; after that your papers are from Aalto University. < 1236868064 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better hurry! < 1236868068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah < 1236868069 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I hope; in a worst-case scenario they're going to call it the Wave University.) < 1236868088 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds like some sort of surfboarding school. < 1236868091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that sounds, um, new age? < 1236868097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that < 1236868126 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Aalto University is created through a merger between the Helsinki School of Economics, the University of Art and Design Helsinki and the Helsinki University of Technology." Phew, they're not translating it. Not that I seriously thought they would. < 1236868136 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why is our name mentioned last, anyway? < 1236868139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would be wrong with "Helsinki University" then? < 1236868143 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tsunami University, Tidal Wave University have been some relatively popular derogatory names (in Finnish) < 1236868144 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's taken. < 1236868149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I see. < 1236868150 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: There is a Helsinki University alraedy < 1236868155 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ae/ea/ < 1236868165 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why separate universities? < 1236868175 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or actually it's University of Helsinki, in English. < 1236868223 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it would be logical to have one university for all wouldn't it? And different faculties or whatever you call them < 1236868224 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually know if they even considered merger with the University < 1236868241 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Which reminds me, of course it should be Wave High School < 1236868245 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And University of Helsinki is this multi-disciplinary generic sort of university, with pretty much everything they do on the university level. < 1236868293 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : IE loads mozilla.com faster than Firefox, and Firefox loads microsoft.com faster than IE < 1236868307 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea what, if anything, this proves... < 1236868319 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1236868332 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, source? < 1236868366 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?displaylang=en&FamilyID=cd8932f3-b4be-4e0e-a73b-4a373d85146d < 1236868368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I don't believe microsoft would release that if firefox was faster at microsoft.com... < 1236868378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1236868381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl food! < 1236868385 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they released it because their data "proves" that IE is the fastest browser < 1236869123 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869123 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869123 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869126 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869128 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869128 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869128 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869129 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869129 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869133 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869133 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869135 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869135 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869135 0 :kerlo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869135 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869136 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869136 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869138 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869139 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869141 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869141 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869141 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869142 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869144 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869144 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869144 0 :Dewio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869147 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869147 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869148 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869149 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869151 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869151 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869152 0 :ski__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236869365 0 :lament!n=lament@S010600110999ad06.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :ais523!n=ais523@92-236-187-64.cable.ubr08.king.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-095-033-077-007.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :tombom!i=tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@tavi.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@a91-153-121-248.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :asiekierk!i=africalo@078088180066.elb.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-129-204.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :kerlo_!n=ihope@normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :lifthrasiir!n=lifthras@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-4-12.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :MizardX!i=MizardX@92.254.128.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :psygnisfive!n=psygnisf@c-71-57-164-119.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :Ilari!n=user@a88-113-39-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869365 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :fungot!n=fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :ehird!n=ehird@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@cpc2-stkn13-2-0-cust73.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :Leonidas!n=Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :Dewio!n=dewi@124-171-184-160.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :Asztal!n=moo@chunkybacon.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-15-119.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :mtve!n=mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :ineiros!n=ineiros@kosh.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@r03jjw8v9.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :Robdgreat!i=rob@unaffiliated/robdgreat JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@ludios.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :ski__!n=md9slj@remote3.student.chalmers.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236869366 0 :irc.freenode.net!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o lament < 1236869412 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, that table, over how many runs is it averaged < 1236869412 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the details are in the PDF, I think < 1236869418 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1236869425 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole article is about methodology for running comparative browser speed tests < 1236869492 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure those differences are actually significant... < 1236869523 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither am I < 1236869526 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would go and read the study, but my system is not on the list of Supported Operating Systems on that download page. < 1236869530 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also depends on which you tested first to a certain degree. DNS cache < 1236869535 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: neither is mine, but it worked for me < 1236869541 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same < 1236869546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I opened in kpdf < 1236869550 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it's just a pdf, last time I tried to get something from microsoft.com it was a pdf wrapped in an exe < 1236869562 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, there is an xls file too hm < 1236869567 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if that is the raw data < 1236869572 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1236869573 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.xps, not .xls. < 1236869573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1236869575 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xps < 1236869575 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xps? < 1236869577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is xps < 1236869579 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's microsoft's rival to pdf < 1236869582 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see < 1236869583 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that nobody cares about but them < 1236869609 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"XML Paper Specification." Funny name. < 1236869629 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, did they try to make it an ISO standard? < 1236869719 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're trying to make it an ecma standard at the moment < 1236869729 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISO won't standardise it unless it's standardised by another standards body first < 1236869736 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either one out of two of Microsoft's student-related stuff-delivery-things (DreamSpark or the MSDN Academic Alliance thing) contained a copy of Windows (2k3 server for DreamSpark, various versions for MSDNAA) that was a .iso image (since you need to be able to install it) wrapped in an .exe file (so you can't actually burn it if you don't happen to already have access to a Windows system). < 1236869751 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although ECMA's widely believed to be controlled by Microsoft, I'm not sure whether that's true or not < 1236869758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1236869767 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: did it work under WINE? < 1236869770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does ECMA stand for? < 1236869799 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MSNDAA requires you to run a custom downloader. :( < 1236869802 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :european computer manufacturer's association < 1236869811 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it used to < 1236869812 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I actually think it didn't. Don't remember the details. It might've actually been the MSDNAA downloader, in fact. < 1236869815 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they renamed it to just ecma < 1236869818 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are european computer manufacturers? < 1236869826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when they decided to expand their own remit < 1236869828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARM I know, but they just design processors < 1236869833 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :microsoft certainly aren't european < 1236869859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well duh, but what are the European computer manufacturers if any that exist? < 1236869916 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I can't find any on Google < 1236869927 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't a good sign, but I'm not very good at using online search engines < 1236869935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1236869974 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fujitsu Siemens is partially German (the Siemens side, surprisingly) and they manufacture computers. < 1236870137 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Granted, that's the only big-company example I can think of right now. < 1236870171 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: which isn't a good sign, but I'm not very good at using online search engines <<< google is not a search engine < 1236870182 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean, google isn't a search engine? < 1236870210 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google is a browser. < 1236870218 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't actually take your string and look for it on pages, at least when you'd actually need it to. < 1236870238 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i guess it's a bad search engine, it's a good suggestion engine maybe < 1236870260 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it finds what you want to find if you're searching for something that's easy to find anyway. < 1236870281 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ecma was founded in 1961, apparently; the computar system market back then might've been a bit different. < 1236870287 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's a browser, yes < 1236870380 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Microsoft Robotics Developer Studio 2008". They certainly crank out those tools at a rate. < 1236870422 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1236870432 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will soon get the parts for my mechanical TV < 1236870445 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nipkow Disk - done; Schematic collection - done; Buying - not done :( < 1236870450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierk: you're building a mechanical TV? < 1236870452 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1236870455 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sptv.demon.co.uk/nbtv/ < 1236870457 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on this tutorial < 1236870459 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is easy < 1236870462 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...way too easy < 1236870466 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any stations broadcasting in mechanical TV format? < 1236870483 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, how many pixels horizontal resolution will you get? 16? < 1236870489 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :32x48 < 1236870492 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1236870494 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not bad < 1236870497 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1236870502 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some even experimented with NTSC color < 1236870508 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and slightly larger res < 1236870511 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like 48xsomething < 1236870517 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the NBTV standard is 32x47 < 1236870518 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x48* < 1236870519 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1236870540 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Nipkow disk was tested a bit of times < 1236870595 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I used paper glued on "something quite better than cardboard" < 1236870603 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and made 32 holes for the image AND the hole in the middle < 1236870613 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And tested it on my lamp, so I know all the holes work < 1236870656 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, spun it manually < 1236870659 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1236870844 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870844 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870845 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870848 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870849 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870849 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870851 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870852 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870854 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870856 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870856 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870856 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870856 0 :kerlo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870856 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870856 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870858 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870861 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870862 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870862 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870862 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870864 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870865 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870865 0 :Dewio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870865 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870868 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870868 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870870 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870871 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870873 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870873 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870874 0 :ski__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :calvino.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1236870948 0 :lament!n=lament@S010600110999ad06.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :ais523!n=ais523@92-236-187-64.cable.ubr08.king.blueyonder.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-095-033-077-007.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :tombom!i=tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Deewiant!n=deewiant@tavi.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :oklopol!n=nnscript@a91-153-121-248.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :asiekierk!i=africalo@078088180066.elb.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-129-204.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :kerlo_!n=ihope@normish.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :mtve!n=mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :ineiros!n=ineiros@kosh.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@r03jjw8v9.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Robdgreat!i=rob@unaffiliated/robdgreat JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :rodgort!n=rodgort@ludios.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :SimonRC!n=sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :dbc!n=daniel@130-94-161-238-dsl.hevanet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :ski__!n=md9slj@remote3.student.chalmers.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-15-119.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Asztal!n=moo@chunkybacon.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Dewio!n=dewi@124-171-184-160.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Leonidas!n=Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@cpc2-stkn13-2-0-cust73.11-2.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :AnMaster!n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :ehird!n=ehird@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :fungot!n=fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :fizzie!i=fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Ilari!n=user@a88-113-39-59.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :psygnisfive!n=psygnisf@c-71-57-164-119.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :MizardX!i=MizardX@92.254.128.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-4-12.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :lifthrasiir!n=lifthras@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1236870948 0 :irc.freenode.net!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o lament < 1236870989 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and any manufacturer using the name "bluegreenish" would be killed by their own marketing people < 1236870989 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, why these two? They can reproduce a lot of natural colors < 1236870989 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They should use something like "Apple Blue" < 1236870989 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for marketing :) < 1236870989 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because humans see red as more different from blue or green than they see blue from green < 1236870989 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like that idea < 1236870989 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red would be "Apple" < 1236870989 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yellow would be "Sun" < 1236870990 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Orange could be, er, "Sunset" < 1236870990 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, most humans can see in four colour channels < 1236870990 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some can only see three, colourblindness is if you can see in two or less < 1236870990 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Green would be "Ecological" < 1236870990 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Purple... < 1236871013 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it most? I thought tetrachromacy was rather rare? < 1236871027 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's not 100%, it's most < 1236871028 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"One study suggested that 2–3% of the world's women might have the kind of fourth cone that lies between the standard red and green cones, giving, theoretically, a significant increase in color differentiation.[3] Another study suggests that as many as 50% of women and 8% of men may have four photopigments.[2]" < 1236871028 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I thought tetrachromats were rare, and only among women < 1236871034 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if it's 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999%, it's "most" < 1236871040 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1236871045 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's not "all" < 1236871054 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but 2-3 % is not really "most". < 1236871069 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Azstal: I'm thinking of red, green, blue, and white < 1236871076 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :three cone channels and the rod channel < 1236871088 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tetrachromats can see in /five/ colour channels < 1236871114 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which five < 1236871134 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever they like, they have this nob at the back of their heads < 1236871136 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, "red, blue, green" are just common names for particular sorts of cone pigmentation < 1236871139 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X, Y, Z, white, and something else < 1236871162 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :given that if you have four sorts of cones you can distinguish colours that can't be distinguished any other way < 1236871171 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there must be colours tetrachromats can see that other people don't have a name for < 1236871173 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, uh, they have H, S, L switches in the back of their head? < 1236871177 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they can also see white? < 1236871195 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1236871197 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's on the rods < 1236871206 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, rods generally don't work in the same situation as cones < 1236871225 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in bright light, the rods are swamped and don't produce useful information, that's why your peripheral vision gets worse if it's too bright < 1236871238 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in dim light, the cones don't respond, so your vision is fuzzier and only in black and white < 1236871245 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in between, your vision functions as normal < 1236871274 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, the normal four-color people can see "in farbe" and the tetrachromats can see "in living color"? :D < 1236871295 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, to be precise there are an infinite number of colours < 1236871300 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and an infinite number of possible colour channels < 1236871301 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1236871308 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are "infinity-1" colors < 1236871323 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a good-quality spectrometer, you can distinguish colour channels that no human can distinguish < 1236871325 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are "(infinity+amount_of_colors)/2" colour channels < 1236871340 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierk: no, aleph-one to the power of aleph-1 I believe < 1236871348 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is probably aleph-2 < 1236871355 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a leph? < 1236871367 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aleph notation is one of the ways to represent infinities < 1236871376 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but mathematicians aren't entirely clear on what infinities are available < 1236871388 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it turns out there's more than one possible choice that leads to the maths being consistent < 1236871405 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, how much is "infinity-(infinity-523)" < 1236871414 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not-a-number, obviously < 1236871420 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1236871421 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 523 < 1236871428 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, nice squabbling in the history there: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cones_SMJ2_E.svg < 1236871438 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmmm. < 1236871438 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only if the infinities are identical < 1236871444 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Infinity is infinity < 1236871448 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE'S NO OTHER DEFINITION < 1236871453 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are many infinities. < 1236871459 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An infinite amount, in fact. ;-) < 1236871471 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But what infinity is the infinite amount? < 1236871496 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe it's aleph-null? < 1236871499 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :epsilon-zero, I believe < 1236871505 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww < 1236871507 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to say < 1236871507 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : anyway, most humans can see in four colour channels some can only see three, colourblindness is if you can see in two or less <-- um? < 1236871508 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"...Deewiant, do you live in the another universe?" < 1236871516 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least, that's the name for the name for the number of infinities that can't be represented otherwise < 1236871517 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now you're just making stuff up :) < 1236871518 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you said something completely logic < 1236871529 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hoped you would say "there are infinite possibilities" < 1236871531 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1236871540 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: He counts the rod cells as a color channel; read on further. < 1236871541 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that's not the case. :-) < 1236871541 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right explained a bit below < 1236871543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: most humans can see in three cone channels (red, green, blue), and one rod channel < 1236871572 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if someone can see in two cone channels and two rod channels < 1236871578 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the channels are orange and bluegreenish < 1236871595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I know, nobody's ever found a colour-specific rod < 1236871597 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can reproduce a fair bit of colors < 1236871604 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, rods are averaged over a large area < 1236871610 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, a quite-orange and a quite-blugreenisgh < 1236871613 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blugreenish* < 1236871617 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1236871618 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1236871624 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a quite-Sunset and a quite-Apple Blue < 1236871628 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you couldn't extract colour information from them even if they could receive it < 1236871680 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, that's just like using a b&w receiver for living color! < 1236871692 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you can buy a field-sequential adapter set! < 1236871727 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's of course "colour-specific" in the sense that there is some frequency you can say is the peak: "Experiments by George Wald and others showed that rods are most sensitive to wavelengths of light around 498 nm (green-blue)" <- so blue-greenish is not far off. < 1236871749 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's still orange < 1236871751 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1236871751 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1236871752 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Susnet < 1236871753 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1236871755 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sunset! < 1236871772 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You may need to make your own sunset-rod. < 1236871782 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, but I need a 2cm Nipkow disk < 1236871796 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and an orange filter < 1236871801 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a photocell < 1236871804 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a blue-green LED < 1236871809 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1236871811 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did I say orange < 1236871813 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and blue-green < 1236871817 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The marketing is gonna PWN me for that! < 1236871873 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1236871909 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So basically, HSL will be Appleness, Livingness and Shadiness respectively < 1236871912 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALS! < 1236871921 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1236871974 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also Viagra makes you see all blue-green: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanopsia < 1236871977 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How coincidental. < 1236871987 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236871989 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU MEAN APPLE BLUE! < 1236872001 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure Apple wants to be associated with *that*. < 1236872047 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not Apple Blue as in the company < 1236872051 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But Apple Blue as in the fruit < 1236872069 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last I heard the Apple apple was white < 1236872094 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't think it was any particular colour < 1236872095 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe nowadays; it used to be rather more colorful. < 1236872096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would be the best way to see all colours. Since the biological system doesn't work < 1236872106 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't some sort of spectrometer or such work? < 1236872120 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e3/Macintosh_128k_transparency.png has the good old logo in the lower-left corner. < 1236872148 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL THAT ONE DIDN'T HAVE A SPECIFIED COLOR! < 1236872163 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEY COULDN'T MAKE UP THEIR MIND OR WHAT? < 1236872168 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: prism works too < 1236872170 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shout mode off* < 1236872171 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a primitive spectrometer < 1236872173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : But Apple Blue as in the fruit <-- apples are green/red/yellow. I haven't seen any *blue* apple < 1236872187 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you still need to register the photons in some way < 1236872190 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it separates the physical locations of the colours, so you can see which ones are there and which ones aren't < 1236872197 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1236872202 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm talking about Green apples < 1236872208 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Green Blue, Blue Green, bluegreenish < 1236872235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierk, nah, they tend to be yellowgreenish around here < 1236872246 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't seen any bluegreenish < 1236872275 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well wouldn't it be rather bulky? I mean, it is far from compact < 1236872276 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why it's Apple Blue not Apple < 1236872284 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you couldn't really use it to make a vision system < 1236872294 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, yes < 1236872310 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but put it this way, humans simply don't have a sense that handles that much information at once < 1236872313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so what about some solution that *could* make a vision system < 1236872339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what about robots? < 1236872350 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Simple_spectroscope.jpg has a nice picture of a prism-based spectroscope showing how liney a spectrum can be. < 1236872351 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even they only see in three colour channels, or one < 1236872358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :red/blue/green is typical for a charge-coupled device < 1236872359 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I heard that the brain receives about "100 bytes" per... uh... i don't remember < 1236872380 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1236872397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierk, how would you measure that... < 1236872406 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know < 1236872409 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just heard it somewhere < 1236872415 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and about 100 bytes is not exactly 100 bytes < 1236872415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well it could be useful with more < 1236872421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well duh < 1236872422 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think your garden-variety killer robot really needs that many color channels. < 1236872433 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it reffered that every while, only a small part of data is sent from the eyes to the brain < 1236872438 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, the part you're concentrating on < 1236872447 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I was thinking about robots used in, say, scientific stuff. Like exploring Mars or whatever < 1236872457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they could definitely use it < 1236872489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, iirc the mars rovers do have some forms of spectrometers < 1236872499 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not visible light < 1236872502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remember < 1236872573 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, did you know common digital cameras can "see" a bit of infrared < 1236872583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just try it in front of a remote control < 1236872642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looked pink when I tried with my mobile phone camera (which I don't normally use, too bad resolution and no optical zoom) < 1236872678 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I wouldn't be surprised, but there are a huge number of possible shades of infrared < 1236872685 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a much broader range than visible < 1236872695 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'd only expect very near infrared to be visible < 1236872722 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Opportunity has a spectrometer for picking up scattered alpha particles and x-rays, and another in the gamma-ray range of frequencies; but I think the ones that actually take pictures with, you know, spatial information in them, only use a reasonable number of specific color channels. < 1236872722 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is lament still opped? :P < 1236872740 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wp page is not being very specific about the cameras. < 1236872783 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of our signal processing assignment had four-color-channel satellite photography; one was in the near-infrared range, the others corresponded vaguely to traditional red, green, blue. < 1236872808 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... it seems the BBC got control of a botnet < 1236872823 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and used it to spam themself, and DDOS a company they had a prior arrangement with < 1236872845 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then they changed the desktop background of all the infected computers and removed the botnet software using the botnet itself < 1236872856 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, mhm < 1236872858 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, THAT BBC? < 1236872859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1236872867 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in the UK TV company < 1236872872 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :z...zomg < 1236872880 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not, it gave them something to show programs around < 1236872881 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*about < 1236872895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pancam.astro.cornell.edu has a technical briefing explaining they use an eight-channel system, so it's at least bit more than usual. < 1236872914 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, link. or it didn't happen? < 1236872917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/click_online/7884387.stm < 1236872931 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the link that the infected computers were redirected to (via an URL shortener) < 1236872937 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/click_online/7932816.stm < 1236872939 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the article about it < 1236872955 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wth < 1236872961 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wanted to set lots of cookies < 1236872972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got 58 messages from firefox asking about cookies < 1236872973 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the BBC's website is handwritten in Perl < 1236872978 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no way I'm clicking on that again < 1236872988 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ^ < 1236873003 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds like a rather legalistically vague thing to do. < 1236873015 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I thought < 1236873018 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'm looking at the cookies now < 1236873036 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're all "If this exercise had been done with criminal intent it would be breaking the law. But our purpose was to demonstrate botnets' collective power when in the hands of criminals." but it does sound quite UK-centric at the very least. < 1236873039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only got three cookies < 1236873044 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The law", as if there's a single law in there. < 1236873067 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of them is massively long, though < 1236873076 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it appears to be a long hash in hex, followed by my useragent but URL-encoded < 1236873089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1236873108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I suspect the BBC are unlikely to worry about any laws but UK law in what they did < 1236873120 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and investigative journalists do all sorts of weird quasi-legal things < 1236873129 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the basis that they're hardly ever prosecuted for them < 1236873172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well usually they tend to not use it for bad stuff. But clean up after themselves and warn people about the risk < 1236873206 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a show on the UK where they steal stuff from people, then give it back < 1236873214 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm surprised they haven't got in trouble for that yet < 1236873294 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they're just trusting the legal system to be sensible with all that "with criminal intent" stuff. Very optimistic. < 1236873317 0 :FireyFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236873333 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I mean, I once found a botnet control channel on a network I was oper on. First thing I did after I was sure it was a botnet (by which point I had seen some commands executed too and know the syntax) was kill all the scriptkiddies controlling it, then I issued a command to pop up a dialog with a link to some website about how to remove this, think it was at fsecure, then I made all bots remove < 1236873333 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : themselves from auto startup and then quit < 1236873355 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there are cases where you need to "quasi legal" things I guess < 1236873363 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"kill all the scriptkiddies controlling it" <<< this is probably illegal even without a criminal intent < 1236873364 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though the BBC one was worse < 1236873370 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol, /kill on irc.. < 1236873375 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :learn what it is < 1236873379 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-_- < 1236873396 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1236873403 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're awesome < 1236873403 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well actually I used /kline iirc < 1236873409 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know you did < 1236873413 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it was a few years ago < 1236873444 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, actually writing code and then tricking people to run it; code that does all kinds of email-sending stuff and so on, and introduces who knows how many security-related bugs while it's at it; is a bit different from snuffing out someone else's botnet like that. < 1236873456 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: actually, they're trusting the Crown Prosecution Service not to prosecute < 1236873470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1236873483 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Isn't that sort of part of "sensible behaviour from the legal system"? < 1236873499 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the CPS aren't really part of the legal system < 1236873501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amazingly, it took only 60 machines to overload the site's bandwidth. <-- interesting < 1236873503 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit confusing < 1236873507 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder how fast connections they had < 1236873513 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're more involved with the police, but they aren't part of those either < 1236873531 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it would've been BBC paying for any costs if their code had a horrible, hard-disk-eating bug. < 1236873539 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my guess too < 1236873555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1236873561 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: your removal, wouldn't that leave the botnet software there just inactive? < 1236873562 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't take many ADSL connections < 1236873569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have 1 mbps up < 1236873573 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, changing the desktop background is probably cleverer than popping up a message box < 1236873579 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so 100 of them would hit a 100 mbps < 1236873581 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because people ignore messages boxes on Windows nowadays < 1236873588 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well I wouldn't know how to change the background < 1236873602 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Especially if it's a message box which says "Your Computer May Be At Risk!" < 1236873617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, also it was impossible to fully uninstall it from itself. There seemed to be no general "execute command" < 1236873620 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1236873622 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: haha < 1236873635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway most ran windows 98 < 1236873637 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-_- < 1236873651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most were South America, which is strange too < 1236873655 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was < 1236873677 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :were from* < 1236873691 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:19 ais523: there must be colours tetrachromats can see that other people don't have a name for < 1236873693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hot < 1236873700 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanna get another cone implanted :P < 1236873714 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:54 fizzie: I'm eagerly waiting for the next C++ sprint, I could actually work on jitfunge a bit at that point. < 1236873715 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:54 AnMaster: jitfunge was in C++ right? < 1236873717 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:55 fizzie: It's like you read my mind here. < 1236873719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1236873721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:27 fizzie: Yes, this year is the last change to graduate from Helsinki University of Technology; after that your papers are from Aalto University. < 1236873724 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew < 1236873726 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you are dealing with lag < 1236873728 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1236873736 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-3-104.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236873737 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I'm logreading < 1236873738 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heard of it? < 1236873757 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually the wp page had an amusing sentence about implanting cones: "Notably, mice, which normally have only two cone pigments, can be engineered to express a third cone pigment, and appear to demonstrate increased chromatic discrimination, --" < 1236873758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes but here the C++ line was before fizzie's line < 1236873766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't stop it being funny, AnMaster. < 1236873770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes it does < 1236873781 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The word "engineered" there is funney. < 1236873783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway. I still don't see how 60 machines could overload the *bandwidth* of the server. Assuming normal home connections. < 1236873786 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's rich coming from mr "all humour is subjective therefore if you think I'm not funny ehird you are wrong" < 1236873786 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's engineer some mice! < 1236873812 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:56 AnMaster: oklopol, /kill on irc.. < 1236873812 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:56 AnMaster: learn what it is < 1236873813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:56 AnMaster: -_- < 1236873815 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fail :D < 1236873818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for AnMaster, that is) < 1236873822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it is just "lag induced humor" is old < 1236873826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun the first time < 1236873829 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun the tenth time < 1236873832 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not the 100th time < 1236873835 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :blah blah blah, it was funny, so just shut up < 1236873847 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, jokes get old < 1236873878 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're just bitter because you're the target of it < 1236873906 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the technical term here is "butt". < 1236873930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's acting more like I just shot him. < 1236873998 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where does the "butt of the joke" thing even come from? Some ur-joke involving butts? < 1236874021 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sptv.demon.co.uk/nbtv/ <-- is there a pic of this in operationamation < 1236874065 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's also: "A mark to be shot at; a target.". Maybe it's just that. How boring. < 1236874103 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comment on that munctional video: "the disparity between the quiet sections and the loud sections is too great. you should fix it. " < 1236874104 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XDD < 1236874170 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : No, it's more like if your door is already busted wide open and burglars are coming in and out, and a reporter wanders in. < 1236874174 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION beats someone with dynamic range.
< 1236874181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a good analogy, I wonder if the reporter would be doing something illegal than? < 1236874224 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: There's pictures of NBTV working in their forums. < 1236874235 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you should be able to find some video on Youtube. < 1236874237 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see no forums < 1236874338 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The goodness of the analogy depends on how they actually spread that little piece of their code. Was that mentioned in the article? I might have just skipped it. < 1236874441 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wut are we talking about < 1236874510 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: the BBC grabbing control of a botnet < 1236874524 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::DDDd < 1236874525 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how? < 1236874553 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buying it from some criminals, AFAICT < 1236874575 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, they just bought it. Well, that's a bit different. < 1236874583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psht < 1236874584 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they didn't actually say < 1236874585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's boring < 1236874589 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hoped they would exploit it < 1236874591 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still < 1236874591 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they said they hung around in shady IRC channels < 1236874594 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taht's pretty awesome for the BBC < 1236874596 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and got it that way < 1236874601 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not the details < 1236874606 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably they didn't want anyone to copy them < 1236874606 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like this channel? < 1236874617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, probably not. < 1236874622 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what would happen if someone tried to buy a botnet here < 1236874625 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a joke. < 1236874638 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By prior agreement, Click launched a Distributed Denial of Service (DDoS) attack on a backup site owned by security company Prevx. < 1236874639 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Click then ordered its slave PCs to bombard its target site with requests for access to make it inaccessible. < 1236874642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ermmmm < 1236874642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, also why ask what we are talking about, just read scrollback. Like you said so many times < 1236874646 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hypocrite < 1236874646 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are the BBC admitting to htat < 1236874649 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could sell them a fungot-net. < 1236874649 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: is there a way to < 1236874657 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: For that, I would *make* a way to. < 1236874657 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ( but which knows the base path of the file < 1236874664 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: shut up; I'm annoyed when people try and reply without reading, not when people ask what we're talking about < 1236874676 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your accusations of hypocrisy would be more convincing were they ever right < 1236874685 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you have been annoyed by both < 1236874689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so false < 1236874698 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, once they were done with spamming themselves and DOSing their friends, they changed the desktop background on the infected computers and disinfected them < 1236874701 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm, sure, I'll just take your word for it. except I haven't. < 1236874703 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, also if you read the article < 1236874705 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"By prior agreement, Click launched a Distributed Denial of Service (DDoS) attack on a backup site owned by security company Prevx. " < 1236874711 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't sound "bad to admit" < 1236874721 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude I fucking pasted that from the article < 1236874732 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=arvid@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236874739 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and of course that'd bad to admit? < 1236874744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bbc are admitting they ddosed a security company < 1236874759 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: but the security company said they could < 1236874762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1236874762 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, "prior arrangement", that means "go ahead" < 1236874764 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1236874766 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you misread the bit that AnMaster pasted? < 1236874768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read the article < 1236874768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought they meant prior agreement with the people they got it from < 1236874772 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, _I_ posted that < 1236874777 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, he repasted it < 1236874785 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, and tells me to read the article < 1236874786 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:17 ehird: By prior agreement, Click launched a Distributed Denial of Service (DDoS) attack on a backup site owned by security company Prevx. < 1236874787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, " dude I fucking pasted that from the article" <-- But I asked about "read" < 1236874788 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:17 ehird: Click then ordered its slave PCs to bombard its target site with requests for access to make it inaccessible. < 1236874789 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not "paste" < 1236874790 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you pasted more than one bit, so talking about the bit he repasted it specified it better < 1236874791 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:17 ehird: ermmmm < 1236874793 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently he's blind < 1236874794 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which seems to be different in your case < 1236874814 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, about the analogy; it sounds like it *might* be illegal in Finland, but might not; you can get a fine or up to 6 months of prison for "invading or secretly entering or entering by diverting someone" a place protected by the "domestic peace" rules. But if the door is open and you can walk in, maybe not. < 1236874821 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, talking about yourself in third person? < 1236874831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, since you didn't see "By prior agreement" < 1236874839 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I did, I misunderstood it, jackas < 1236874840 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1236874856 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb food < 1236874983 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you know why the formula that psygnisfive gave — "If (x&y)==0, the point is in the sierpinski triangle" — works? < 1236875006 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy enough to prove < 1236875010 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I know < 1236875013 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, I have a program doing it < 1236875014 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm wondering about how to see it in an intuitive sense < 1236875017 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't know -why- < 1236875020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sierpinski is everywhere.. < 1236875031 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perfectly straight line in GoL, in this trivial formula... < 1236875036 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(IN THE SIERPINSKI TRIANGLE <-- hur hur) < 1236875085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Mathematically, it's quite odd... < 1236875090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, bitwise and is an odd operation. < 1236875098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're choosing an arbitrary base, then operating on the individual digits. < 1236875104 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which isn't very senseful, IMO. < 1236875112 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I don't know why that would lead to Sierpinski... < 1236875121 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, bitwise operations tend to create similar patters to the sierpinski triangle < 1236875130 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think of the fractal structure < 1236875148 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the same as binary, it doubles each digit < 1236875153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1236875155 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1236875159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1236875175 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I wonder if it works for N dimensions? < 1236875179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you get a 3d sierpinski with x&y&z? < 1236875185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1236875209 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's great < 1236875212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a lovely coincidence < 1236875222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1236875224 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1236875226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really a coincidence < 1236875229 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server" < 1236875236 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, how many recursions is it at? < 1236875243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what < 1236875243 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends on what you mean by 3d sierpinsky < 1236875249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, or iterations rather < 1236875251 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not a coincidence, but, not intended < 1236875253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's not iterations < 1236875255 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong word first time < 1236875264 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just < 1236875265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sierpinski < 1236875272 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if x & y == 0, then (x,y) is in the sierpinski triangle < 1236875276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in = place a * < 1236875279 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in = place nothing < 1236875303 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://codepad.org/lQGGDWNZ < 1236875307 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, lets say you have an 8x8 gird. then the (x&y) == 0 -> black? < 1236875315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> white. < 1236875319 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where black = background. < 1236875320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok right < 1236875322 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see my codepad link < 1236875334 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you do it at a 512x512 gird? < 1236875339 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :newsham made it centered, I've made it the right way up, I'm going to combine them < 1236875341 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: THE SAME DAMMIT < 1236875355 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so it is scaled or jut a section of it? < 1236875361 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both. < 1236875367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes the output < 1236875369 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it helps if you give it powers of two < 1236875382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise you get odd behaviour < 1236875397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what if you want it at a higher resolution? Like you know first iteration of a fractal, second and so on < 1236875404 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's infinite < 1236875407 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't seem to understand < 1236875408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1236875448 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236875464 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :codepad.org/Y1PV2gVc <- newsham's centered one, now I'll combine this with my downwards one < 1236875685 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, every triangle can be divided in three new triangles and a hole in the middle. So your statement "in the sierpinski triangle"must indicate "edges" right? All other points will eventually be a hole with enough iterations. < 1236875701 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1236875707 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that what "in" means for fractals? < 1236875725 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, given that many fractals are infinitely thin you have to count the edges < 1236875754 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, centering is non-trivial: < 1236875760 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * < 1236875760 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ** < 1236875762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * * < 1236875764 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : **** < 1236875766 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because of the odd-ness. < 1236875769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well I don't know the technical terms for them. But what about a fractal like the mandlebrot. in could also indicate the area inside it. It seems to "fractalise" "outwards" rather than "inwards" < 1236875796 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I have some of your drugs? < 1236875810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hah. < 1236875814 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the mandlebrot isn't infinitely thin < 1236875823 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So's your penis < 1236875825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, my point < 1236875825 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but on the other hand, it has an obvious protocol for inside/outside < 1236875829 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hpaste.org/fastcgi/hpaste.fcgi/view?id=2336#a2336 Sierpinski version 2. < 1236875837 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome code, awesome fractal. < 1236875838 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can tell if a point's in it or not just by doing the calculation < 1236875838 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, exactly what I meant! < 1236875843 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right way around, and aligned center. < 1236875875 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas something like sierpinski the edges are obviously part of it, because if they weren't nothing would be < 1236875875 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well true. But look at an image at n iterations. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Mandel_zoom_00_mandelbrot_set.jpg or whatever, the black area is very definitely "in it" < 1236875885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: are you not reading what I wrote? < 1236875888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, my point exactly. < 1236875892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes I am < 1236875894 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds like you think I disagree with you < 1236875899 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the problem with the mandelbrot set, it's mostly a huge black hole :-D < 1236875904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiple ones even < 1236875909 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the interesting stuff is on the outskirts < 1236875929 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1236875931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, and there are even more of it there < 1236875953 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand, the sierpinski triangle is easier to "intuitively" understand how it is generated < 1236876000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cantor dust is easier, I independently invented cantor dust < 1236876003 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1236876005 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cantor set < 1236876017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, how did "set" end up as "dust" < 1236876018 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cantor set's like a 1D sierpinsky < 1236876026 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sierpinski < 1236876026 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: cantor dust = multi-dimensional cantor set < 1236876027 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sprinkles some Cantor dust on ehird
< 1236876028 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah < 1236876031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1236876033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :problem is, the cantor set is ... really boring < 1236876036 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1236876041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes it is easy to understand < 1236876149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but something like madelbrot, I have to sit down and look at the maths and even then I'm not really sure < 1236876182 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I resent the Mandelbrot fractal a bit though < 1236876187 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1236876189 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It makes people forget about the old fractals < 1236876197 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there is a reasonable intuitivity about that thing: given any NxN square of bit-patterns for 00...00 to 11...11; you get the horizontal and vertical lines because of the 00..00, and the diagonal because ~x => N-x, and ~x & x == 0 always; and you get to do the same thing in the smaller N-1 x N-1 squares for those cases where the leading bits are either (0, 0), (0, 1) or (1, 0) because in those cases the bit in the and result is a zero, but in the final s < 1236876199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh...? < 1236876201 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, mandelbrot is probably the prettiest, Slereah < 1236876201 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like the Weierstrauss function or the Peano filling curve < 1236876214 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what about the Julia set? That can be quite pretty < 1236876216 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: but in the final s < 1236876218 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- the final sub-square where the leading bits are (1, 1) there's always a common bit so the and is never == 0. < 1236876221 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people seem to assume that it's the oldest < 1236876221 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Julia set is basically a warped mandelbrot :P < 1236876227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well true < 1236876261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:725_Julia_sets.png < 1236876264 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :remind you of anything < 1236876268 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, by N-1 there I mean N/2, of course. < 1236876273 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Julia's related to Mandelbrot < 1236876277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : yes < 1236876280 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can make nice coloured versions of mandelbrot too < 1236876282 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a Julia set for each point in Mandelbrot < 1236876320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coloured sierpinski? < 1236876324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably boring < 1236876352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1236876354 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've seen it < 1236876357 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1236876363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1236876373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:725_Julia_sets.png definitely looks familiar < 1236876389 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why I believe it is some Julia sets! ;) < 1236876392 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236876393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: < 1236876394 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/02/Sierpinski_triangle_%28RGB%29.jpg < 1236876396 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coloured sierpinski < 1236876406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, coloured according to what rules < 1236876425 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Top triangle is tinted red, bottom-left green, bottom-right blue. < 1236876425 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems to be just one corner R, one corner G, one B and them colour mixing < 1236876428 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Repeat recursively, of course. < 1236876431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1236876449 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, boring. If I want to watch that I'll open the pallet in gimp or something ;) < 1236876450 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you can intuit that and-sierpinsky in a simpler way too: take a NxN square, where N is a power of two; the "lower-right" quadrant is always empty, since there you always have the leading 1 bit in common, while in the other three the leading bit of the and-result is always 0, so the content is just a down-scaled version of the whole square. This rather intuitively leads to a sierpinski. < 1236876457 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if there's a pretty fractal without great big holes. < 1236876543 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The sierpinski-square-based pyramid looks nifty, though: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sierpinski_pyramid.png < 1236876551 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe not very constructable-out-of-legos. < 1236876556 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it occurs to me that the and-sierpinski is more efficient than most algorithms for it (maybe all) < 1236876558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no recursion or anythin < 1236876559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1236876566 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just O(size) or something < 1236876576 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=BeholdMy@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236876578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, some of the prettier julia sets seems to happen around the edges of mandelbrot in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:725_Julia_sets.png < 1236876595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1236876598 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:725_Julia_sets.png is very... Xzibit. < 1236876607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you know what I mean. < 1236876610 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, "Xzibit"? < 1236876612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I don't < 1236876616 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo dawg. < 1236876624 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...? < 1236876629 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've told you this 10 times. < 1236876642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xzibit is the guy on the horrible MTV show "Pimp My Ride", which is where the "yo dawg" meme comes from. < 1236876649 0 :asiekierk!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :asiekierka < 1236876664 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, sure you told me? It doesn't even sound slightly familiar < 1236876677 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you told me unless you can prove it in logs < 1236876685 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very well, I shall grep. < 1236876704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you said "Yo dawg." before though < 1236876710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not "Xzibit" < 1236876725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:08 ehird: To Xzibit's body. < 1236876725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:08 AnMaster: huh? < 1236876726 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:08 ehird: Xzibit is the origin of the yo dawg meme. < 1236876726 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, of course, I could be wrong < 1236876729 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-03-05. < 1236876732 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236876734 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this is just from late February, when I upgraded. < 1236876737 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, later than that. < 1236876744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used Linkinius at first. < 1236876750 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So this is just from when Linkinius expired. < 1236876753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, mhm. < 1236876914 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I've ever had a shareware program expire on me < 1236876930 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor an unactivated for-pay Microsoft program, I generally activate them ASAP < 1236876934 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :over the telephone! < 1236876953 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the GPL EULA thing would have expired by now, but I just edited out the licence check < 1236876963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Buddhabrot.jpg <-- now that looks cool. Just a way to render Mandelbrot but still.. < 1236876994 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never had an unactivated for-pay Microsoft program expire on me because I don't use them < 1236876995 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes < 1236876997 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the burning ship fracta < 1236876998 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :l < 1236877008 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Burning_Ship_Fractal_Zoom.png < 1236877010 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't seen that one *googles* < 1236877010 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1236877012 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a more ghostly image somewhere on WP < 1236877016 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't find it < 1236877020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for once I'm prepared to google and you link it < 1236877020 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I used to use other people's Windows computer before I got Linux < 1236877022 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P ~ < 1236877030 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually used to be a Windows power user, but am a bit rusty nowadays < 1236877039 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just being good at Windows doesn't make Windows any better to use... < 1236877041 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, it was obscure enough to warrant it < 1236877060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I used windows from 1998-2006; it was pretty rough all the way through. < 1236877069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that look like "Eifel Tower as seen by " < 1236877076 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1236877077 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remember name right now.. < 1236877078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Salvador Dali. < 1236877082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes < 1236877084 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right < 1236877092 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :come on, I'm art illiterate and even I know that :-P < 1236877101 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I didn't remember how to sell it < 1236877103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spell* < 1236877116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :selling Salvador Dali paintings is probably very easy. < 1236877120 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1236877132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so predictable that joke :P < 1236877265 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Nebulabrot.jpg < 1236877275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nice. < 1236877304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, apparently it is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Buddhabrot.jpg but different colour set < 1236877553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, btw I remember seeing mandelbrot in vim < 1236877558 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remember url < 1236877584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is quite interesting. (compared to if it was emacs, then it would probably be built in ;) < 1236877677 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I showed you that. < 1236877683 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When talking about TECO. < 1236877691 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.spacetimetravel.org/tuebingen/tuebingen.html <-- anyone know the program that let you do this on arbitrary 3d shit? < 1236877694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used it onc < 1236877694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1236877695 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh ok. When was this? Must have been at least half a year ago < 1236877695 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was fun < 1236877702 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, it was yesterday or the day before. < 1236877712 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, err I have known of such a program for ages in vm < 1236877713 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vim* < 1236877718 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-03-10_Freenode.txt:19:27 ehird: http://www.df.lth.se/~lft/vim/mandelbrot < 1236877730 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your reply: < 1236877731 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:28 AnMaster: .se... oh my < 1236877746 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes, I didn't remember seeing it on .se < 1236877758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Emacs doesn't have mandlebrot built in < 1236877763 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, but I have seen mandelbrot in vim before < 1236877765 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are lots of implementations on the Internet < 1236877767 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mandelbrot < 1236877769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I even ran it < 1236877782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sshed to a box with vim and tried < 1236877796 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you don't have vim on your own computer? < 1236877809 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, no. As I said many times before < 1236877821 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not everyone has emacs, not everyone has Gnome. Not everyone has KDE < 1236877824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have vi? If not, your machine isn't POSIX or UNIX compliant. Congratulations on your zealotry. < 1236877836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I do have a minimal vi yes < 1236877841 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all POSIX computers have a vi implementation, but at least on Ubuntu it's a minimal implementation not vim < 1236877851 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God, that mandelbrot vi program is slow. < 1236877855 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Manual-synced NBTV parts: still waiting < 1236877858 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :la la < 1236877859 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ busybox vi < 1236877860 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like slow slow. < 1236877860 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : LA LA < 1236877861 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :la la < 1236877864 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck off < 1236877866 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have an even more minimal vi on my computer < 1236877866 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: < 1236877877 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...THAT'S WHAT [EHIRD] SAID! < 1236877880 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(before anyone says that was harsh, asiekierka's "la"s go on for 30m) < 1236877884 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Options: < 1236877885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -c Initial command to run ($EXINIT also available) < 1236877887 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -R Read-only - do not write to the file < 1236877888 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : -H Short help regarding available features < 1236877898 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(la la, LA LA, la la, I am not listening) < 1236877900 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh god, that towers of hanoi game < 1236877903 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is actually < 1236877904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :playable < 1236877904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I took my vi from http://ex-vi.sourceforge.net/ I think < 1236877905 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the user < 1236877907 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never use it < 1236877907 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not joking < 1236877916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not an AI < 1236877918 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just cool < 1236877935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. < 1236877937 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas vim.tiny gives me loads of options < 1236877939 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just typing zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz wins. < 1236877944 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hah < 1236877946 0 :comex!n=comex@teklinks.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236877947 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1236877960 0 :comex!n=comex@teklinks.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1236877983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, anyway vi isn't required by POSIX in fact. Since shell or other standard tools are actually optional < 1236877992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to make it possible to support POSIX on embedded systems < 1236878004 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's certainly required for UNIX < 1236878007 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a special "embedded profile" or something, forgot the name < 1236878008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's required by workstation POSIX I think < 1236878010 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you have a shell I believe you must have vi < 1236878014 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes but POSIX != UNIX < 1236878018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, true < 1236878032 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just pointing out that ehird was factually incorrect < 1236878036 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, in busybox vi < 1236878037 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so anyone know about that speed of light thing < 1236878041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ? < 1236878043 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typing ? then newline makes it segfault < 1236878048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1236878057 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a bug, I should see if it's still in the most recent version < 1236878067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, says "pattern not found" here < 1236878073 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: using busybox < 1236878075 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1236878076 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes < 1236878084 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone want to help me with prolog? < 1236878087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1236878099 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BusyBox v1.10.2 (Ubuntu 1:1.10.2-1ubuntu7) multi-call binary < 1236878101 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, busybox 1.13.2 /bin/busybox: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.6.9, statically linked, stripped < 1236878103 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: I'll help if you like < 1236878108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, my busybox is old < 1236878129 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody know? < 1236878138 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://pastie.org/414276 < 1236878153 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can load that, but if I then type valid(X), I don't get any results < 1236878160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1236878161 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.adamauton.com/warp/ < 1236878162 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas I expect amo, amas < 1236878170 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you run first_conj? < 1236878172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, in my package manager the versions 1.12.2-r1 1.13.2 ~1.13.3 are available. ~ signifying testing, since I'm running a stable system it would require me to unmask that one with an entry in /etc/portage/package.keywords < 1236878184 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, you didn't < 1236878187 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that program doesn't run first_conj < 1236878194 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it /defines/ firstconj(am) as a fact < 1236878201 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need :- first_conj(am). to run it < 1236878286 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which prolog is a language and not first-order logic :u < 1236878307 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway *uninstalls ex-vi* *links /bin/vi to /bin/busybox < 1236878308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: it would work fine if you were using backward chaining < 1236878311 0 :BeholdMyGlory_!n=BeholdMy@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236878312 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is? < 1236878314 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few saved bytes < 1236878315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1236878320 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: not using assert < 1236878324 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and instead doing the conjugation at runtime < 1236878326 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't want to use assert < 1236878328 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do I avoid it < 1236878334 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what exactly are you trying to do? < 1236878343 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I just say valid(Word), I get an existence error < 1236878343 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1236878349 0 :BeholdMyGlory_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1236878355 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's because valid should be defined to calculate if a word is valid < 1236878366 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make a big list of valid words < 1236878369 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by building up endings < 1236878381 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in valid (Word) :- root(R), ending(E), atom_concat(R,E,Word) < 1236878387 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and root listing valid roots, and ending listing valid endings < 1236878397 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I have to go backwards? < 1236878397 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I forgot the full stop on my example, but you can add it < 1236878413 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: it's called backward chaining in that it doesn't calculate the list unless you ask for it < 1236878434 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words, if you write valid('amat'), it then looks for a root and ending that fit together to make 'amat' < 1236878456 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :putting atom_concat at the start of valid rather than the end would be faster if an argument was provided, but crash if you just wrote valid(X) < 1236878457 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the tutorials use something like < 1236878469 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man(socrates). man(plato). < 1236878475 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can ask who is a man. < 1236878479 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1236878483 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what's happening here < 1236878487 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my example < 1236878492 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the full program would be < 1236878495 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, in that example I have to define all possible roots in one big thing < 1236878510 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you "get" prolog. < 1236878515 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I don't. < 1236878522 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ending(o). ending(as). root(am). valid(Word) :- root(R), ending(E), atom_concat(R,E,Word). < 1236878525 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't write procedures that template facts; prolog has that built in. < 1236878527 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's called foo :- bar. < 1236878529 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's your template. < 1236878554 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: except what if I want to say < 1236878566 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's valid, and valid(foo), and valid(bar) < 1236878572 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't want to stick it in one big expression < 1236878576 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: do < 1236878577 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :valid(foo). < 1236878580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't stuck in one big expression < 1236878581 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only template if you have :_ < 1236878583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::- < 1236878584 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can doo < 1236878591 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :valid(foo). valid(bar). valid(Word) :- ... < 1236878598 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? < 1236878601 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1236878603 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... yes ... < 1236878604 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that makes more sense < 1236878607 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like haskell pattern matching, comex < 1236878612 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each definition you give is an alternative definition < 1236878615 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can define it multiple times, except it's one < 1236878618 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it tries them all < 1236878651 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why the program you pasted doesn't work, it's treating first_conj(am) as an alternate definition of first_conj, not an attempt to run it < 1236878678 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, actually running an expression is quite difficult in prolog, although possible, because it's generally bad form < 1236878697 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tries to write a better version
< 1236878712 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.drmaciver.com/2009/02/spam/ < 1236878809 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: http://pastie.org/414288 < 1236878813 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works, but it seems very verbose < 1236878819 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236878819 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236878820 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to say first_conj twice etc < 1236878820 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236878822 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236878824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fail < 1236878836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: "very verbose"? < 1236878840 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The planets we live on; they differ. < 1236878845 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sovietrussia.org/code/src/1182815183936.png < 1236878847 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1236878851 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's typical Prolog < 1236878853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: old. < 1236878862 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You hurt my feelings < 1236878882 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to make it shorter, you can do s1(X) :- member(X,[s,t,mus,tis,nt]). < 1236878889 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's just a slightly shorter abbreviation < 1236878896 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :writing it out in full is idiomatic < 1236878902 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's talking about the valid() < 1236878903 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :part < 1236878925 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's nothing wrong with that, apart from Prolog's traditional lack of nested expressiosn < 1236878927 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*expressions < 1236878929 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is is a hack, really < 1236878946 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: FWIW, if you want to be more current, I would focus on "GRUNNUR". < 1236878960 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a way for me to "split" the goal into two, so I would just say first_conj once? < 1236878989 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but that would also be unidiomatic < 1236878992 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1236878995 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can use ; to combine common parts of two goals < 1236878995 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but what is it :p) < 1236879020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh, comex just wants to write his perfect language in every language < 1236879033 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: not really, I just want to generate a list of valid latin words with minimal typing < 1236879043 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :valid (Word) :- first_conj(Root), (atom_concat(Root, o, Word) ; s1(Ending), atom_concat(Root, a, X), atom_concat(X, Ending, Word)). < 1236879050 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're typing an awful lot of complaining about the AWFUL VERBOSITY into #esoteric < 1236879054 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: thought prolog might be a good way to do it < 1236879057 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes you repeat a few characters when coding! < 1236879059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how crazy < 1236879060 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a good way < 1236879071 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just deal with the verbosity, it's _one_ _line_ < 1236879079 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even a full line < 1236879080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a tiny line < 1236879085 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex: typical indentation style with that ; would be to line up the ; vertically underneath the opening bracket of the (;) group < 1236879087 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, Hm. Erlang looks like Prolog, but prolog doesn't look like Erlang. < 1236879090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523's version is way unreadable < 1236879091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is my conclusion < 1236879108 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: if you run it through gprolog's pretty-printer, it's relatively readable, but the idiomatic version is better < 1236879142 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is actually a slight semantic difference between the version with ; and without < 1236879157 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what? < 1236879158 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that the version with ; only runs side-effects that first_conj might have once, and the split version runs them twice < 1236879177 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 non-functionally-pure languages < 1236879194 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :; is just semantic sugar, though, for defining a new predicate and using each of the two halves of the predicate as an alternative definition for the new predicate < 1236879208 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ; is nice because you don't want to go around defining lots of junk predicates for no reason < 1236879217 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, most of Prolog is syntactic sugar < 1236879221 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1236879225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you should use the idomatic one < 1236879228 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case < 1236879228 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really < 1236879230 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, yes < 1236879235 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :; is mostly useful only in really big predicates < 1236879249 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if you really really need to avoid duplication for some reason < 1236879262 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : first_conj(Root), < 1236879266 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the entirety of the duplication < 1236879267 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think about that < 1236879271 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in C< that would be < 1236879271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, like golfing? < 1236879275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first_conj(root); or whatever < 1236879277 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's saying < 1236879281 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, like if something had side effects < 1236879281 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that refactoring into a procedure < 1236879282 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then calling it < 1236879285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1236879286 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes the multiple calls REPETITION < 1236879289 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's _ridiculous_ < 1236879290 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you definitely don't want to call fork() too many times, for instance < 1236879305 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fork_prolog(Pid) is in gprolog's standard library < 1236879324 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't want to duplicate that, and you probably wouldn't want to backtrack past it either unless you really knew what you were doing < 1236879327 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, not in both resulting threads < 1236879331 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*processes < 1236880348 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forking, prolog, heheh < 1236880359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's so weird about that? < 1236880366 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's much the same as forking in any other language < 1236880897 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you come onto an IRC network and find that services are down < 1236880907 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it usual to write your own copy of ChanServ to guard a channel for you? < 1236880931 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/414328 < 1236880932 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1236880954 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks good < 1236881297 0 :neldoret1!n=user@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1236881457 0 :jix_!n=jix@dyndsl-095-033-112-229.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1236881778 0 :Judofyr!n=Judofyr@c349BBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1236882118 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :No route to host < 1236882252 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1236882855 0 :ehird___!n=ehird@91.105.126.163 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236882872 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Richard M. "Orwell" Stallman: < 1236882874 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Adobe flash plug-in is non-free software, and people should not < 1236882874 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :install it, or suggest installing it, or even tell people it exists. < 1236882874 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That Firefox offers to install it is a very bad thing. < 1236882909 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does any of this explain his giant disgusting beard < 1236882948 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Stallman doesn't 'get' free software < 1236882949 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The beard is a byproduct of his bullshit-producer (mouth) < 1236882954 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just look at the original licence to his Emacs manual < 1236882969 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just as with proprietary software, he was trying to put on unremovable restrictions < 1236882978 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily, the GPL stops him just as much as it stops everyone else... < 1236882979 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you mean refusing to tell people non-free software exists won't solve the problem of non-free software?! shit! < 1236882994 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1236883002 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we ignore them, maybe they'll disappear! < 1236883003 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and refusing to port Emacs to Windows won't stop people porting it to Windows < 1236883023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bruce Perens has much the right idea, I think, he wrote the DFSG < 1236883028 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least was very influential behind it < 1236883031 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, can you ping 208.78.103.223? < 1236883038 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want me to try? < 1236883048 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I can't; it's my slice < 1236883070 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yes, I can < 1236883080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64 bytes from 208.78.103.223: icmp_seq=1 ttl=45 time=120 ms < 1236883082 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64 bytes from 208.78.103.223: icmp_seq=2 ttl=45 time=119 ms < 1236883091 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I haven't heard Bruce Perens say anything that isn't insane, which is more than I can say for most FOSS people < 1236883098 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64 bytes from 208.78.103.223: icmp_seq=1 ttl=56 time=0.000 ms :D < 1236883129 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: sshd is running over there < 1236883131 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0ms? you lucky bugger, how fast is that connection! :P < 1236883134 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although pretty obviously I can't log in < 1236883142 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: good. I cannot connect via SSH or IRC. < 1236883147 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus the ___ < 1236883156 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :three underscores? that's quite a lot < 1236883182 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had __ for asking #slicehost, because I didn't want to risk just _ being online for some reason, but it hasn't disconnected yet :P < 1236883298 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ESR on Bruce Perens: Damn straight I took it personally. And if you ever again behave like that kind of disruptive asshole in public, insult me, and jeopardize the interests of our entire tribe, I'll take it just as personally -- and I will find a way to make you regret it. Watch your step. < 1236883303 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A strong endorsement. < 1236883568 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Having recipes for non-free programs in the ports system is more like < 1236883568 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including present-day neofascist web sites in the list of "interesting < 1236883568 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :links" in your web site. I am against censorship, so I do not believe < 1236883568 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in closing down those neofascist web sites. But I won't refer people < 1236883568 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to them. < 1236883573 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ gahahahahahaha < 1236883602 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, change of plans, i'm not getting a miniature toy fan and modifying it < 1236883605 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm getting a motor < 1236883614 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but tommorow, sadly < 1236884300 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, I've never written a Mandelbrot set viewer; just realised. < 1236884308 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I've tried, but the algorithm never was right. < 1236884375 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've written one < 1236884384 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it breaks down if you zoom too far due to FP rounding errors < 1236884407 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell has a library for infinite precision floating point I think < 1236884435 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't get infinite precision generalised floating point < 1236884440 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can get infinite precision rationals < 1236884450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and arbitrarily high precision floating point, that's what a bigfloat is < 1236884453 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hcouldn't you find a base that can represent a number precisely in finit edigits, for any number? < 1236884529 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: pi? < 1236884532 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :root 2? < 1236884548 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can find a base that represents a number precisely in finite digits for any rational number, but not for any irrational number < 1236884576 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1236884580 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i mean, things like, oh what it is < 1236884585 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.2 is 0.199999999999 or something < 1236884590 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION catches ehird in a butterfly net -----\XXXXX/
< 1236884595 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was focusing on those errors < 1236884612 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, those can be fixed using bigrationals < 1236884674 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but do bigfloats automatically change their precision? < 1236884681 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/numbers/latest/doc/html/Data-Number-BigFloat.html doesn't < 1236884696 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if there's gmp bindings < 1236884937 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr, I'm unplugging/repluggin my router < 1236884962 0 :neldoret1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1236885167 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1236886010 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1236886234 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: whoa! by adding only a few, very simple lines of code to my sierpinski program, it's rendering a PNG of it! (just need to fix one bug) < 1236886273 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird___: the joy of a good stdlib < 1236886283 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would probably be just one extra wrapper function in mathematica < 1236886286 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: actually, it's from Hackage, but it was just a one-liner to install it < 1236886291 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whose only redeeming feature is a good stdlib < 1236886294 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's amazing what good-factored code gets you < 1236886298 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1236886692 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oi < 1236886705 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ve avoi < 1236886784 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im glad to see my comments on the sierpinski gasket generated such lengthy discussion < 1236886796 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any solutions to the problem of why its so ubiquitous? < 1236886867 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps God is a gigantic sierpinski triangle. < 1236886875 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps! :O < 1236886917 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HUZZAH < 1236886983 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got into University of Maryland :D < 1236887073 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1236887149 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tony morris found by police; unharmed < 1236887222 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that's useful, I hope he stays alive < 1236887242 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wb neldoreth < 1236887251 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he had lots of time to kill himself had he wanted to. < 1236887261 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1236887276 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if he actually wanted to, we'd have no chance because he'd h ave been dead before the message was sent out < 1236887343 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks and hello all < 1236887347 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hi < 1236887412 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird___: some people want to commit suicide but don't really want to, so they give people a chance to talk them out of it first < 1236887418 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, let's move onto less morbid things < 1236887430 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 -- my current centering algorithm (stole from newsham :)) is "insert ((height - y)/2) blank spaces before the sierpinski stuffs" -- any way to fix that? because on the last line, it produces (h/2) spaces < 1236887437 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, yes, I know that... I'm not thick. < 1236887461 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird___: what particular is wrong with that? < 1236887503 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 -- http://www.nopaste.com/p/abzexHoIj < 1236887586 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: what's y? < 1236887599 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | y <- [h-1,h-2..0] ] < 1236887610 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., from h-1 to 0, downwards < 1236887638 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it ends up as (h-0)... hmm... ah, wait... < 1236887640 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that algorithm shouldn't be producing the results you pasted < 1236887658 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in particular, it would lead to only half a space on line 1 < 1236887669 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :integer division :P < 1236887697 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you have loads of spaces on line 1 < 1236887704 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than none < 1236887731 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except; the extra spaces come fromL < 1236887737 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [ x .&. y == 0 | x <- [w-1,w-2..0] ] < 1236887743 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is catenated to the blanks < 1236887753 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I'm too tired to think about this atm < 1236887764 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm seriously sleep-deprived after a couple of intensive modules < 1236887772 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/Y1PV2gVc the original version, which works without flipping < 1236888054 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://groups.google.ca/group/rec.arts.sf.written/msg/073bea1aa44c9396 was a funny story. < 1236888077 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236888175 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236888219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :google for "pi" and the calculator gives you: pi = 3.14159265 < 1236888221 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1236888227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := ? < 1236888309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be ≈ < 1236888323 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathematics: it's not like it's an exact science. < 1236888340 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about tony morris < 1236888348 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its true, he'd been dead long before the message was sent < 1236888360 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@a-230.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1236888363 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cause he'd probably code a chat bot to send the message for him < 1236888384 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of idiots attempting suicide, where'd they find him? < 1236888398 0 :ehird____!n=abc@91.105.87.195 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236888406 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it WAS scripted -- multiple emails and IRC channels at once < 1236888410 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh was it? < 1236888413 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha. nerd. :D < 1236888424 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, btw if pi is a *normal* number as well as a transcendental one (which iirc is proven) wouldn't that mean that every number sequence will in the long run show up in the decimals on pi < 1236888427 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, he's not an idiot, he had chronic pain due to an ankle injury for 2 years < 1236888432 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, right? < 1236888435 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, this is why geeks shouldnt commit suicide. they're too awesom. < 1236888438 0 :ehird___!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 145 (Connection timed out) < 1236888453 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you try having excruciating pain 24/7 for 2 years < 1236888469 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long have i been coming here talking to you? < 1236888475 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to boot, he thinks the doctors misdiagnosed him -- and there hasn't been any progress on it so far. He tried to self-amputate a while back. < 1236888488 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, har har har < 1236888491 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus that would've been a mistake < 1236888491 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P < 1236888495 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1236888507 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...and, why? He can't exactly use the ankle. < 1236888507 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure normality is required, but yes, I guess at the very least a normal number should get every number sequence sooner or later. < 1236888509 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, what's up with your nick btw? < 1236888511 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amputating a leg that's had chronic pain for an extended period of time often leads of phantom limb syndrome < 1236888528 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which the pain remains, but the limb can no longer be anaesthetized, etc. < 1236888533 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: yikes. < 1236888535 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. < 1236888538 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yikes indeed. < 1236888543 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: router troubles, connected via telnet < 1236888554 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, which would make PI a so called "illegal number" in theory. Since it would contain the binary, and source code, of every program in existence. Or ever possible < 1236888559 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1236888576 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, your thoughts are as old as the 70s. < 1236888582 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What matters is _INTENT_. < 1236888598 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read http://ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/lawpoli/colour/2004061001.php < 1236888599 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, well yes. But this would be an interesting new file sharing idea. Just share offset in pi < 1236888602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1236888610 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compression too < 1236888612 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pi-based file-sharing is not a new idea either. < 1236888618 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1236888622 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, let's wait until the head death of the universe before sharing anything other than pi < 1236888624 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen it proposed (unseriously) somewhere. < 1236888640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, err this is an IWC reference? < 1236888642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or? < 1236888649 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heat death. A typo. < 1236888652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1236888662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it did end up as an IWC reference though :) < 1236888676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yes of course it wouldn't be practical < 1236888677 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now; someone fix my shit router. < 1236888678 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :theres some file sharing system out there < 1236888685 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, tried rebooting it? < 1236888685 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you never download whole files < 1236888689 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but instead download pieces of noice < 1236888691 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :noise* < 1236888696 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh, yes anmaster < 1236888697 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can be reused for MULTIPLE files < 1236888707 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no one piece can be claimed to be infringing on anything < 1236888709 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, what is the issue you are having with it? < 1236888713 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, yes, it's stupid, it's written by an idiot who knows nothing about copyright law < 1236888731 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know. it sounded bullshit because ok the noise isnt copyrightable < 1236888735 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the key to decode it is < 1236888743 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster, i can't reach my slice < 1236888747 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive, what if that key is a prime number? < 1236888755 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the key is more than just that tho < 1236888759 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, your slice? < 1236888761 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a prime whose source is decss < 1236888766 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gzipped < 1236888772 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, I know < 1236888776 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was making a reference to that < 1236888781 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you distributed it as a prime thing, that's fine < 1236888788 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you distirbuted it as decss, that's illegal < 1236888788 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the key is a decode number plus references to the pieces of noise that need to be decoded < 1236888791 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, coloured bits < 1236888796 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slice = slicehost VP < 1236888797 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S < 1236888813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ah, you can't reach your vps. I could try to traceroute it if I knew the ip < 1236888823 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Others can connect; 208.78.103.223 < 1236888825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in case it is the vps that is having isues < 1236888828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :issues* < 1236888829 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not < 1236888830 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm ok < 1236888836 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you try traceroute? < 1236888841 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :traceroute gives my VPS, then * forever < 1236888870 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21 hops but works fine here < 1236888881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, maybe it is some firewall gone wrong on the vps? or such < 1236888929 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S AN ISSUE ON MY ROUTER < 1236888933 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i said, twice < 1236888937 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok right. How do you know? < 1236888963 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because everyone else can ping, traceroute and connect via ssh, because I can't reach manage.slicehost.com either, and because the traceroute fails AFTER MY ROUTER < 1236888967 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_right_ after it < 1236888969 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like I said < 1236888979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1236888981 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1236888983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1236888995 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, does it affect just slicehost or anything else? < 1236889018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it is like that thing I remember reading about. Wikipedia being blocked by UK ISPs for some time iirc < 1236889037 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's really not. there's absolutely no basis for claiming it is, other than "UK" being in common < 1236889037 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You said "traceroute gives my VPS, then * forever" which does not sound equivalent to "fails right after my router". < 1236889038 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if they blocked something else on the same ip < 1236889044 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/vps/router/ < 1236889072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed < 1236889117 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, try to calm down. I read about this thing called "mindfulness", though it did look like a piece of bull****, it might help. don't know~ < 1236889134 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now if you people could stop being interesting for tonight, I might get done this thing I need to write. < 1236889149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so you can't access manage.slicehost.com either. Would that extend to *.slicehost.com ? < 1236889214 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1236889222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no? < 1236889227 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1236889230 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1236889273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, this is very strange indeed. Two ips at slicehost doesn't work, but everything else does? < 1236889274 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1236889310 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though I know routers are crappy I have a hard time seeing how it could be that crappy < 1236889383 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, I wish you good luck making it work. Tried a factory reset? How to do that varies between models. On some you hold some button down while it is booting for example < 1236889392 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd rather not < 1236889396 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(like power button on mine) < 1236889413 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, I understand that < 1236889421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, tried telneting to your router? < 1236889435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually that works better than webuis < 1236889454 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't. < 1236889461 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1236889465 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on mine it works < 1236889473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and shows lots of nice hidden options too < 1236889477 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yours isn't a locked down piece of shit rented from orange as part of the plan < 1236889493 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, mine was sent by the ISP as part of the plan < 1236889496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not same ISP no < 1236889509 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :combined ADSL-modem/router < 1236889517 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ehird:~] % telnet 192.168.1.1 < 1236889517 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trying 192.168.1.1... < 1236889517 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :telnet: connect to address 192.168.1.1: Connection refused < 1236889542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well for fun try nmapping it, just do it at slow rate or you are likely to crash it < 1236889571 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's a random piece of trivia: I have a ZyXEL ADSL thing, which speaks a bit of SNMP, but only the outgoing link speed is visible in the SNMP values (as interface speed); the incoming speed, which I'd sort-of like to monitor out of curiosity, is not even the ZyXEL-specific SNMP MIB, it's only available in the telnet (and webui) interfaces. < 1236889656 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I don't think mine has SNMP. How would I check? < 1236889722 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, well, you can poke it with a SNMP request, but presumably if it has it, the community IDs ("public", "private" by default) are configurable somewhere. < 1236889749 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it has quite a few open ports < 1236889760 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :53/tcp open domain < 1236889760 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :80/tcp open http < 1236889760 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :9100/tcp open jetdirect < 1236889760 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :49153/tcp open unknown < 1236889786 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, which port? < 1236889788 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, how do you kill telnet from inside? it's irritating < 1236889799 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ^[ iirc < 1236889804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is Ctrl-[ < 1236889817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the escape code for it in my case < 1236889818 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It's an UDP thing, and it might not answer to invalid-looking requests, so you probably need some snmp-utils package installed. < 1236889820 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, it's ^] < 1236889825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, oh maybe < 1236889832 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, it says when you start it < 1236889833 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1236889851 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nmap no good? < 1236889851 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, all the ports are boring apart from 9100 which gives "3" -- wonder how to use them. < 1236889871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, did you try service scan thingy < 1236889878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of nmap < 1236889892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-sV iirc < 1236889892 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wuzzat < 1236889903 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ? < 1236889907 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kay, running it < 1236889912 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, I guess you could try nmapping UDP port 161, I mean theoretically it could send back icmp port-unreachables or something if it doesn't answer at all. < 1236889926 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, it could I guess crash a bad router if the router crashed on random data < 1236889998 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I have results < 1236890010 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nopaste.com/p/aTrKL9mcmb < 1236890011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it is filtered on other random udp ports too < 1236890018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so doesn't tell me much < 1236890025 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, some dns shit, the configuration, Upnp server and an unknown thang. < 1236890039 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The unknown thang & the dns seem interesting, all else boring. < 1236890040 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, very likely. Well, if you have them tools, "snmpwalk -Os -c public -v 1 ." usually gives everything the device knows. < 1236890050 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux 2.6, though, ey. < 1236890058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, dns isn't unexpected. All routers have that afaik < 1236890066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all consumer ones at least < 1236890067 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, right. < 1236890080 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S owhat is that jetdirect, do you think? < 1236890083 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I don't have the tools < 1236890096 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, printer shit < 1236890107 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... totally locked down, you can get in to it, but you need a serial cable < 1236890109 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, that is what the port is meant for < 1236890120 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my router supports connecting a printer, so yes < 1236890120 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, but it probably isn't used for that... < 1236890125 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh really, hm < 1236890130 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for networked printing < 1236890135 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can probably craft a SNMP packet with hexedit and send it with netcat's udp mode, but that probably would not be worth the trouble. < 1236890151 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does SNMP offer any nice backdoors? :P < 1236890152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1236890205 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of backdoors, my WLAN access point firmware had a custom non-linked page, with manufacturer-fixed username and password, which let you execute any shell command with a web-form and see the outputs. < 1236890209 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That wasn't very nice. < 1236890211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1236890216 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was using wrong nmap option < 1236890220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this seems interesting < 1236890240 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though it takes some time < 1236890246 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1236890258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed ouch < 1236890272 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PORT STATE SERVICE VERSION < 1236890272 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :161/udp open|filtered snmp < 1236890272 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAC Address: 00:14:7F:EE:BF:74 (Thomson Telecom Belgium) < 1236890295 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If anyone can gimme tips on cracking open my router's shell, i'd appreciate it < 1236890305 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what nmap's "open|filtered" means. < 1236890314 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird____, tool called hammer < 1236890320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if that fail: sledge < 1236890325 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sledgehammer* < 1236890333 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :har har. < 1236890334 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wlan AP's debug-page was reasonably useful for getting shell-like access without having to upload a custom firmware or anything. < 1236890353 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just would've preferred it to use the configured administration password and not some manufacturer default. < 1236890355 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!! THATS AN IDEA < 1236890359 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can back up your Livebox configuration to a file on your computer. < 1236890365 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_and_ restore it -- JACKPOT?! < 1236890371 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1236890372 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1236890382 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there might be hidden settings in there < 1236890392 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, interesting. The telnet access I get is kind of crippled, a menu interface with lots of options < 1236890392 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh, it's a binary file < 1236890396 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no real shell access < 1236890407 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't think it runs *nix even < 1236890422 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there was no telnet access to the wlan AP at all, even though it was a linuxy thing. < 1236890425 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modifying cfgsave.dwb files from a Wanadoo Livebox <-- oo < 1236890473 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This ADSL box most probably isn't linux-based either. < 1236890482 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This file is just a tar file that has been 'encrypted' by adding 0x1b to every byte in the file. " < 1236890488 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make this shit up, you can't. < 1236890541 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ran into that sort of "encryption" somewhere too. < 1236890542 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey you can get telnet with just this apparently! hot < 1236890547 0 :ehird____!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1236890564 0 :ehird_______!n=abc@91.105.87.195 JOIN :#esoteric < 1236890566 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently the box doesn't know what day it is either. < 1236890568 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :styx> sys date < 1236890568 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Current date is Tue 2009/01/06 < 1236890569 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's HACK IN TIME < 1236890594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly, heh < 1236890595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1236890597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ^ < 1236890602 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :me downloadz HACK TOOLZ < 1236890615 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's "ZyNOS version: V3.40(AGE.2)". < 1236890634 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird_______, cool < 1236890643 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that sort of "encryption" sucks < 1236890650 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but good for power users < 1236890689 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tar: This does not look like a tar archive < 1236890741 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :opening it, I see shell files, though < 1236890745 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just no header < 1236890758 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :starts- d6a72aaac5a6ce5f9622633d162f908f - < 1236890802 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anmaster, any ideas? < 1236890813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1236890817 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, there's a tcpdump-like packet trace facility in the ADSL box. < 1236890838 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that looks like a hash of stdin from md5sum < 1236890849 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ echo foo | md5sum < 1236890849 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d3b07384d113edec49eaa6238ad5ff00 - < 1236890851 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see? < 1236890855 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, I'll s trip it off < 1236890869 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no idea if that will break stuff < 1236890875 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably, I'll need to put one back when I'm done! < 1236890889 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway when I save settings from my router using the backup feature I get a plain "user.ini" file < 1236890900 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is in fact an ini file < 1236890914 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WORKS NOW < 1236890941 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/private/tjvsp5kpxzg5bgqowkka <- FUCK YEAH < 1236890991 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a funny format for a configuration dump. < 1236891004 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it extract any tar file you upload to it, no matter what the paths are? :p < 1236891014 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1236891028 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, that's friendly. < 1236891030 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As long as you add the md5sum properly, and then add 0x1b to each byte < 1236891060 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :squee, this is aesome < 1236891081 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to make my livebox serve over http < 1236891084 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the net < 1236891087 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hello from router" :D < 1236891125 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is pretty good, all their configs are plain text and COMMENTED < 1236891130 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird_______, it has bluetooth? < 1236891133 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with _useful comments_ < 1236891135 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, yes < 1236891143 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1236891149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird_______, what is that used for? < 1236891156 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1236891160 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1236891163 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't recall < 1236891171 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird_______, not debug port then? < 1236891187 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg you can configure the dns and everything <3 <3 <3 < 1236891199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird_______, in what way? < 1236891214 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my main objective: add an sshd < 1236891219 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will be T R I V I A L < 1236891227 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just modify the wifi.conf shell script, to add the commands you want to run < 1236891230 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repackage it < 1236891233 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import the config < 1236891235 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and VOILA < 1236891302 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236891318 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-60-96.A163.priv.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236891327 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=BeholdMy@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236891338 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster - isn't incompetence lovely? < 1236891373 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might also be some subversive soul thinking "hey, let's give the poor plebs a way of actually using their device". < 1236891380 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure is when you can gain advantage of it < 1236891390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, would be nice < 1236891394 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, considering the comments that's quite possible fizzie < 1236891407 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what comments? < 1236891418 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the configuration files < 1236891419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, what comments specifically < 1236891431 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# The interface that udhcpd will use < 1236891437 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, if a device runs Linux, people are probably going to hack around with it even if it means soldering in custom connectors for a serial port or stuff. < 1236891438 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that's from udhcpd though < 1236891444 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird_______, anything like "fuck the management, lets make this encryption silly"? < 1236891450 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1236891461 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is JSUT configuration files, I will need ssh to explore the whole fs < 1236891473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm... < 1236891488 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe only the most hardcorey people would apply a soldering iron on a rented device, but anyway. < 1236891572 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One good way of finding stuff out is to locate the "open-source-compliace" website of the device manufacturer; I think most companies that do linux-based routery things have some sort of "here's a random pile of sources" distribution, which you certainly can't use to build a working firmware out of (since no-one bothers to support that) but which can be very informative of how the system works. < 1236891623 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://jean.thecoderblogs.com/2008/12/05/got-root/ <- somoeone's done this already, that's a :( and a :) < 1236891624 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZyXEL has a ftp://opensource.zyxel.com/ ftp-site with really random content, and Linksys also at least used to have outdated source code distributions hidden somewhere in the support sites. < 1236891786 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will now do http://jean.thecoderblogs.com/2008/12/05/got-root/, so I amy hack further < 1236891983 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, you can only write to /etc apparently < 1236891990 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I'll make /etc/x/ for stuff I put < 1236892052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm it seems openwrt should work on my router < 1236892056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :according to some googling < 1236892068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not going to try, I don't want to mess up < 1236892179 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OpenWRT should sort-of almost-work on my wlan AP (a Linksys WAP54G), except that the AP-only version I have only has 2 megs of flash instead of the normal 8 megs in the good old WRT54G, so there's not much space for stuff. < 1236892228 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah probably same < 1236892236 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this router is about half a year old < 1236892312 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, preparing to get myself an sshd onto thine router < 1236892389 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236892407 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gonna try it now, brb < 1236892408 0 :ehird_______!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"aaa" < 1236892411 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=arvid@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236892413 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thou shalt not ssh onto thine router, for that is an abomination. < 1236892497 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is some set of numbers, strictly greater than the rational numbers and strictly less than the real numbers, which can be mapped reversibly but not 1-1 to integers by means of writing a program to generate the number. With these generator programs, you can perform addition, multiplication, etc, but cannot perform comparisons, as two numbers may be equal even if their generator representation is not, and I don't plan to solve the halting problem. I < 1236892497 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s there any problem with this observation, and is it even vaguely useful? < 1236892535 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I suppose you can perform comparisons just as reliably as you can perform any other operation, it only becomes a problem when you try to display the result in non-generator form. < 1236892559 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(With everything else you can get a partial early result, but with that you'd have to wait infinite time for any result) < 1236892602 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My bouncer works now < 1236892604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1236892606 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HERE GOOOOOOOOES < 1236892621 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soon there will come smoke out of your router. < 1236892625 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless we can prove that, for some particular translation to generators, all generators for equal values will eventually resolve to identical code sequences, which might actually be the case ... < 1236892634 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Doesn't seem likely though) < 1236892704 0 :MigoMipo!n=MigoMipo@84-217-10-189.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236892743 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh come on, this is #esoteric , somebody has to be interested in my math oddity :P < 1236892762 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I fucked it up < 1236892763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1236892777 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: they're called computable numbers < 1236892778 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is your math oddity the same thing as "computable numbers"? < 1236892785 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah. < 1236892837 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is this math oddity < 1236892865 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The main thing I'm trying to point out is that I recall somewhere it being claimed that there are strictly more real numbers than integers, but in fact there's a set in between rationals and reals that has the same cardinality as integers. < 1236892867 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ssh: connect to host configuration.adsl port 22: Connection refused < 1236892891 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR : There's a shitload, actually < 1236892932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ssh: connect to host 192.168.1.1 port 22: Connection refused < 1236892934 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whyyyyyyy < 1236892949 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: Do you mean "strictly more rationals than integers" in that comment? I mean, I don't see who'd object to "strictly more real numbers than integers". < 1236892951 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :N->Z->Q-> constructible numbers -> Algebraic numbers -> computable numbers -> definable numbers < 1236892961 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :All of them are aleph null < 1236892968 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: there're many sets containing the rationals that have the same cardinality as integers do. < 1236892988 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, all useful numbers have that cardinality < 1236892988 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame my math teacher for making that unclear X-D < 1236892997 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: for example, the algebraic closure of 1 and sqrt(2) < 1236893001 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH WAIT < 1236893006 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE I HAS FIX < 1236893014 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1236893032 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=BeholdMy@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1236893072 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, not algebraic closure < 1236893081 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmmm < 1236893083 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just the field defined by < 1236893224 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The field define by one and sqrt2? < 1236893228 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a pretty small field < 1236893239 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, oh? < 1236893243 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1236893252 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just isn't responding to ssh < 1236893259 0 :kerlo_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :orelo < 1236893301 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: it's not that small < 1236893338 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, cardinality of two :D < 1236893365 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1-1=0 < 1236893368 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1236893386 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION unhides a downloaded one to see if changes took effec
< 1236893386 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1236893414 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they did not. < 1236893454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH < 1236893507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1236893508 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying again < 1236893562 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually that "add 0x1b" "encryption" is not the most canonical "silly encryption"; a xor operation would've been more usual than addition. < 1236893574 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so this is dumb, I was thinking about that and I came to the conclusion that any infinite set that be defined by induction has the same cardinality as reals. Then I realized that that's completely fucking obvious. < 1236893612 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, glibc has that memfrob(s, n); function and everything. < 1236894209 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236894221 0 :lament!n=lament@S010600110999ad06.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236894246 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"QuitIRCServerException: MigoMipo disconnected from IRC Server" < 1236894616 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR: excluding countable ones, I presume. < 1236894683 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ERM, same cardinality as /integers/ I meant. < 1236894699 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you can create the set by induction, it's countable. < 1236894713 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1236894725 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why any useful number is in such a set < 1236894735 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because they can't be defined otherwise < 1236894749 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Useful" :P < 1236894826 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Related to usefulness of numbers, a well-known quote: "The real numbers are the dependable breadwinner of the family, the complete ordered field we all rely on. The complex numbers are a slightly flashier but still respectable younger brother: not ordered, but algebraically complete. The quaternions, being noncommutative, are the eccentric cousin who is shunned at important family gatherings. But the octonions are the crazy old uncle nobody lets out of the atti < 1236894872 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1236894988 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish there was a sound way to define the theory that any set larger than the computable numbers (that is, any set S for which the computable numbers are a strict subset of S) is also contrived :P < 1236895059 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Erm, larger but still with the same cardinality as integers that is) < 1236895086 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That makes no sense! :P ) < 1236895142 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, so a countable set that includes all computable numbers, plus something else. < 1236895152 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but is not contrived X-P < 1236895153 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't be hatin' Chaitin's constant dude < 1236895163 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONTRIVED < 1236895166 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1236895186 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The set of all 1-computable numbers, defining "1-computable" as meaning a particular thing. < 1236895194 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. (1) contrived -- (showing effects of planning or manipulation; "a novel with a contrived ending") < 1236895212 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Touché sir :P < 1236895220 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Touch� on your weiner < 1236895237 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Namely, computable on a 1-computer, defining "1-computer" as meaning a particular thing. < 1236895249 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got one: Computable with a halting oracle. < 1236895265 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That includes Chaitin's number. < 1236895276 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An n-computer is a Turing machine with a halting oracle for every m-computer where m is an ordinal number less than n. < 1236895284 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(By "contrived" I really meant to imply that you don't just go "That set plus Chaitin's constant") < 1236895298 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perfect! < 1236895307 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now where did I leave that halting oracle ... < 1236895316 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it would suck to have a job as a halting oracle. All day people would be asking about "does this halt" and "does that halt" and on and on and on. < 1236895318 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is Chaitin's constant less contrived than definable numbers? < 1236895327 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't believe the job advertisement's "flexible hours" stuff. < 1236895346 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It means they will bend them out of shape < 1236895349 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah: when GregorR said "don't", he meant "do". < 1236895383 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except "don't" is also a valid way of saying that, because either English is weird or GregorR is weird. < 1236895390 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1236895409 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was correct colloquial English, and is conveniently interpretable to mean either of two opposite things correctly :P < 1236895436 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there ain't no problem with that! < 1236895459 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR, why are you so very melon < 1236895461 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard it said that "I could care less" and "I couldn't care less" mean the same thing. < 1236895496 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1236895502 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO-O-O < 1236895505 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why people shouldn't say "I could care less". < 1236895507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my router isn't doing the right thing < 1236895546 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Maybe you should watch the "warriors of the net" video to more appreciate the tough job your router has. < 1236895550 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whenever somebody says "I could care less", I put a broadsword through their head. < 1236895561 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Unless they actually could care less) < 1236895570 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"How does a router look like? What color does a IP packet have? How does a IP packet travel through firewall. All the answers and many more can be found in the Warriors of the net move [sic]." < 1236895572 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In which case that's just a weird statement) < 1236895584 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, by all accounts, it should have started the sshd. < 1236895589 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it _has_. But I can't get to it. < 1236895601 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o h < 1236895609 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe that < 1236895617 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tries
< 1236895945 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION presses some buttons on his calculator
< 1236895949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck ass, I think I know the problem. < 1236895957 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, no < 1236895960 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1236895965 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It says "zebra". < 1236895974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. < 1236895975 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, < 1236895981 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't downloading the file. < 1236895984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why, I have no fucking idea. < 1236895988 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(From my machine) < 1236895991 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now it says "cebra". < 1236896028 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now it says "wolf", and now it says "lobo", and now it says "sheep, ewe", and now it says "oveja". < 1236896047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: any ideas? It just isn't running the code < 1236896204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#notify_file #default: (no script) < 1236896204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#notify_file /bin/dumpleases # <--- usefull for debugging < 1236896208 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha! A way to run a program. < 1236896345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1236896350 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was afk
< 1236896378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, anyway I now have root on my router: http://deckardt.nl/blog/2008/06/28/speedtouch-fun-the-root-hack/ < 1236896381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very useful < 1236896401 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I have a rather new firmware < 1236896454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :orelo, what sayz zebra? < 1236896495 0 :Corun!n=Corun@93-97-219-19.zone5.bethere.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1236896821 0 :atrapado!n=nnn@cm19117.red91-117.mundo-r.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1236897126 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This ZyNOS packet-trace looks rather spiffy: http://www.tcgweb.com/netgear/trace-snif.html < 1236897129 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No filters, though. < 1236897730 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, I give up < 1236897843 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hpaste.org/fastcgi/hpaste.fcgi/view?id=2345 < 1236897845 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sierpinski v3. < 1236897850 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now outputs a PNG. < 1236897854 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: try it! < 1236897858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc --make -O2 sierpinski-gd.hs < 1236897858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1236897865 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./sierpinski-gd sierpinski.png < 1236897869 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :open sierpinski.png and voil < 1236897870 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1236897875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't have ghc, I can give you an OS X binary < 1236898073 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOLY CRAP < 1236898075 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: < 1236898079 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you return x&y < 1236898082 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of just checking it for 0 < 1236898085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get an awesome infinite background pattern < 1236898089 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shaded blue < 1236898103 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pic or it didn't happen < 1236898107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SURE THANG BRO < 1236898122 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uploading < 1236898153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: http://imgur.com/5ZN9A.png < 1236898154 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could not find module `Graphics.GD' < 1236898155 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::< < 1236898159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just interpreting x&y as an rgb colour < 1236898161 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly: "cabal install gd" < 1236898178 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: pretty cool, huh? < 1236898200 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1236898222 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Checkerboard sierpinski ;o < 1236898224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was expecting something less, well, uniform < 1236898229 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly: exactly < 1236898234 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hereby dub & the sierpinski operator < 1236898429 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :My other car is a cdr | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=N;O=D | s�$B\KGP(Bɹ �$BYQ(Bo�$BHF(B�un < 1236898515 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly: got it working? < 1236898547 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, it is awesome. < 1236898562 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: my calculator. < 1236898564 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope < 1236898566 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1236898590 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1236898631 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION attempts to figure out that image
< 1236898665 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's clear in some places that one pair of opposite squares is brighter than the other. < 1236898685 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the pattern remains as you zoom in. < 1236898697 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The question is how much brighter. < 1236898758 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly: do you have cabal? < 1236898759 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, just do: < 1236898763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cabal install gd < 1236898765 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all will go smoothly < 1236898767 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and within each pair, the upper-right square is brighter than the lower-left. I think both are brighter than the upper-left and lower-right, which are equally bright. < 1236898802 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that due to a modulo, though, the four big squares of the entire image are identical except for the green component. < 1236898814 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I havn't really used haskell that much, but I appearently have the libhugs-cabal package installed < 1236898819 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But no command "cabal" < 1236898821 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're identical full stop < 1236898822 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe < 1236898823 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact that the image is 512x512 is evidence for this hypothesis. < 1236898827 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireyFly: Oh, hugs? < 1236898828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't use hugs. < 1236898832 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uninstall hugs and install ghc. < 1236898834 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I do have ghc installed to < 1236898836 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too* < 1236898837 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1236898843 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Install libghc6-cabal, or whatever it's installed. < 1236898849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then find "cabal-install" package and install that too. < 1236898852 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it should work. < 1236898853 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah wait. < 1236898855 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc comes with cabal < 1236898855 0 :orelo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION successfully runs hugs
< 1236898857 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just the cabal install one < 1236898895 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either 'buntu packages sucks, or I do < 1236898899 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's the latter < 1236898908 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh < 1236898912 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :repos, that is* < 1236898918 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1236898919 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will ask #haskell < 1236898970 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks quite a lot like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Sierpinski_square.jpg except that one has used more coloursies. < 1236898988 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And done with an IFS, not just bitwise and. :p < 1236899008 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. of course. < 1236899011 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's sierpinski without the hole. < 1236899019 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, an IFS is way slower than a bitwise and :P < 1236899139 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm,. < 1236899146 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I can antialias that there sierpinski. < 1236899343 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :psygnisfive: ping < 1236899513 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1236899538 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@97-118-129-204.hlrn.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1236899562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interrobang with ~: ‽̃ < 1236899570 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/LIS7.jpg < 1236899656 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imgur sounds like Sumerian < 1236899662 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IM GUR < 1236899675 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1236899747 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Peace and Protection 4.22.2" < 1236899750 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On this font and size, the interrobang with ~ just renders like an interrobang except the top part is even messier. < 1236899752 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't think GD would be so simple I could do that in 36 lines < 1236899756 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ditto < 1236899760 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1236899770 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hereby deem this channel the Haskell+GD Appreciation Club. < 1236899880 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://zem.fi/~fis/tilderrobang.png < 1236900019 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1236900024 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if using | instead of & gives a fractal < 1236900037 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1236900040 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It gives whiteness. < 1236900057 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1236900065 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least for the == 0 case, it would. I guess otherwise too. < 1236900094 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1236900100 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe xor. < 1236900107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xoractal. < 1236900117 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do they have a combining ? so you can display "interrofoo" \forall foo \in Unicode? I don't think they have. A shame. < 1236900132 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :U+033C sounds like a road sign: COMBINING SEAGULL BELOW < 1236900146 0 :jix_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"..." < 1236900166 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a combining seagull do < 1236900202 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a vaguely McDonalds-y logo down there you can combine with. < 1236900219 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a flattened m, maybe. < 1236900221 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I mean like < 1236900222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRL < 1236900224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sign is saying < 1236900227 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COMBINING SEAGULL BELOW < 1236900232 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :data structure problem < 1236900234 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so presumably we're on a road high in the air < 1236900239 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what does a combining seagull do < 1236900245 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, well. I don't know, but I think it involves bird excrement. I don't want to think about the details. < 1236900275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it perhaps find other combining seagulls and permanently attach them to itself, thus creating a fractal seagull? < 1236900284 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CONCLUSION: Sierpinski is every-fucking-where. < 1236900299 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :given a mapping of strings -> value, i need to return all the values who's keys contain a substring < 1236900314 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in less than linear time obviously) < 1236900315 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given that they have the combining anticlockwise ring overlay, the combining right arrowhead and down arrowhead below, the combining rightwards harpoon with barb downwards, and even the combining acute-grave-acute and the combining grave-acute-grave, I don't think a combining question mark would be too much to ask. < 1236900426 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Contain a substring" is often suffix tree work, if you don't mind the space overhead. < 1236900465 0 :FireyFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1236900490 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have a "generalized suffix tree", it "can be built in Θ(n) time and space, and can be used to find all z occurrences of a string P of length m in O(m + z) time, which is asymptotically optimal". < 1236900510 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a set of strings of total length n, that is. < 1236900606 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have many strings though < 1236900643 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; that's what the "generalized" part there is. You can build a single tree for a set of strings, and find all matches (in any of the strings) for a given substring. < 1236900656 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1236900659 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess in your case you could directly stick references to values in there. < 1236900672 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1236900679 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What're m and z < 1236900692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zeroes xs = sum [ 1 | 0 <- xs ] < 1236900693 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the heck is the topic < 1236900700 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It says right there. z occurrences and input string length m. < 1236900710 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right < 1236900719 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, way to skip the relevant half of the sentence < 1236900728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :(eq? (cdr my-cars) 'cdr) | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=N;O=D < 1236900734 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: That's just like you, you're just reading the channel for the formulas. < 1236900860 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i take that to mean you don't know what it meant < 1236900873 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and hi < 1236901029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So. < 1236901031 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi oerjan. < 1236901034 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is neat. < 1236901064 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unwords . repeat $ "yes" < 1236901083 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fix ("yes "++) < 1236901135 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cycle "yes " < 1236901153 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1236901156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:39 ehird: > "The answer is: " ++ fix ("Yes! " ++) ++ "Haskell can do that." < 1236901156 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:39 lambdabot: "The answer is: Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes!... < 1236901157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:39 ehird: ...virginia < 1236901178 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Maybe, Virginia.") < 1236901187 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("Just True, Virginia.") < 1236901190 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm confused < 1236901202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: arfnoble grifgraff? < 1236901269 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1..]>>"yes " < 1236901275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ooh! < 1236901289 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's beautiful < 1236901333 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but longer than cycle"yes " < 1236901338 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alas < 1236901369 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello oerjan < 1236901375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hej hej < 1236901382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :execWriter . forever . tell $ "yes " < 1236901391 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, irreguljär webserie < 1236901393 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION runs
< 1236901405 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too short, already read < 1236901417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: system "yes 'yes '" < 1236901422 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yeah I was busy hacking my modem/router < 1236901424 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that adds newlines < 1236901426 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't see you join < 1236901427 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Bad command or file not found < 1236901434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I had some success btw, but not much < 1236901437 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: And it's IO :-P < 1236901437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for my router < 1236901452 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: unsafeCoerce (system "deltree /y C:\*.*") :: String < 1236901455 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, wait < 1236901456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it seems you need JTAG to do anything useful with it < 1236901462 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: unsafeCoerce (unsafePerformIO (system "deltree /y C:\*.*")) :: String < 1236901473 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf +[[,----------]>+++++++++[<+++++++>-]<.[-]++++++++++.] < 1236901476 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1236901478 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf +[[,----------]>+++++++++[<+++++++>-]<.[-]++++++++++.]!hello world < 1236901480 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...out of time! < 1236901485 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...out of time! < 1236901490 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: main = return () -- sorry, can't touch this < 1236901513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: that sounds a bit - restrictive < 1236901526 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1236901539 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[,----------] seems like it's looking for newlines. < 1236901544 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :import Prelude hiding (return) < 1236901548 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's from ed.bf < 1236901554 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe it is a complete impl of ed < 1236901557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what are you doing? < 1236901580 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not doing anything < 1236901588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :return _ = system "rm -rf ." < 1236901595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1236901604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is trying to delete their system? < 1236901605 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm probably needs another import for system < 1236901612 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Deewiant < 1236901616 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why < 1236901640 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird was deleting a hypothetical Windows / DOS system in Haskell < 1236901652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that would be hard. It would be a side effect < 1236901658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of windows) < 1236901676 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION swats AnMaster -----###
< 1236901685 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :side effects are not hard in haskell! < 1236901707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, you missed the joke < 1236901708 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-_- < 1236901718 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no, it cannot be! < 1236901726 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, you missed his joke. < 1236901730 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION weeps frantically
< 1236901733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no I just missed ~ < 1236901736 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woe is me! < 1236901740 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the nth time around < 1236901741 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poop is me! < 1236901747 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pope? < 1236901754 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well same thing < 1236901784 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION will now rent his swatter to any practicing catholics nearby
< 1236901785 0 :atrapado!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Abandonando" < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pope is made of poop. < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that ed just outputs ? every newline < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:50 wli: I have a tough time writing ed in Haskell. I have to believe he used some kind of codegen from another language. < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CHECKING FOR "10" AND OUTPUTTING A CHARACTER IS REALLY HARD < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, why? < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :religion is for insulting < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:55 AnMaster: religion is for insulting <-- you're an idiot. < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I forgot ~. sorry < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should just tag ~ on to my every line < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that might be a good idea in fact < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, actually ~ is too boolean. Either serious or sarcasm < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need a marker for said with "wink of eye" < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would suggest ¤ < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest ";-)" < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, meh. So outdated... ¤ < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :¤ already has a meaning < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so does ~ < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I don't think I've got it on my keyboard layout < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, but not ";-)" < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, Finnish? < 1236902382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, ~ = < 1236902382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or rather, it has that meaning < 1236902382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, ~ ? < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: colemak < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, iirc Swedish and Finish have the same? < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ^ < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, "colemak"? < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You recall correctly, but as I said I use colemak < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wth is that < 1236902382 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :colemak.com < 1236902382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what? < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway ¤ is Shift-4 here < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, misbraintab < 1236902382 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is no one making sense < 1236902382 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know, that's what it says on my 4 key as well :-P < 1236902382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, why not dvorak btw?