< 1238198403 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, I guessed right thne < 1238198405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then* < 1238198408 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or stones < 1238198426 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1238198436 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stones? < 1238198437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1238198447 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[23:58:16] [...] really rocks :) < 1238198456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1238198458 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bouldering along... < 1238198463 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my < 1238198481 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no < 1238198490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right way is to say jazz along < 1238198491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1238198510 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking about something once < 1238198513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds distinctly non-geological < 1238198520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, rocks. Rock and roll < 1238198521 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: me too! < 1238198523 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus jazz < 1238198525 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238198528 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1238198534 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, makes perfect sense < 1238198537 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well < 1238198543 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Translating some english named music genres into swedish sounds really awkward < 1238198556 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heavy metal -> tungmetall < 1238198559 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jazzå < 1238198566 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, rock and roll -> stenar och rullar? < 1238198569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238198574 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rock and roll -> sten och rullar < 1238198575 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even < 1238198583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238198584 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cule, even < 1238198586 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rulle* < 1238198592 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah < 1238198598 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, sax! < 1238198602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238198602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1238198605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :påse! < 1238198606 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even < 1238198612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the right answer I think < 1238198620 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rulle wins over påse < 1238198622 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::> < 1238198628 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason < 1238198630 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rulle isn't in the game < 1238198634 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sch < 1238198636 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Details.. < 1238198640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is sten, sax, påse < 1238198660 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rock, scissors, bag in English I think < 1238198665 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1238198674 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/generic/b597/ < 1238198677 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paper < 1238198684 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For påse < 1238198693 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :paper, scissors, stone? < 1238198710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, maybe. Different variation than the Swedish one then < 1238198729 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the same game >_< < 1238198766 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just that in english they s/bag/paper/ < 1238198772 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or something < 1238198822 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rock paper scissors < 1238198907 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1238199105 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.thinkgeek.com/tshirts-apparel/unisex/generic/9080/ <-- a lil' tad overkill < 1238199328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it < 1238199845 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1238200180 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1238200243 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1238200390 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NetHack style is a recent addition, yes. < 1238200404 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1238200404 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc lovecraft nethack* pa speeches ss wp < 1238200413 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: make a fungot style < 1238200414 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you're going into the surrounding walls and ceilings of the god of craftsmen. he gazed after tron, asking himself what in the middle ages, people swinging on chandeliers, swordfights over the lower body of a horse which was swifter than the sword. < 1238200419 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not more than a week or so, I guess. < 1238200420 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :feed it all the lines its blabbed so far < 1238200421 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1238200430 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NetHack style what? < 1238200452 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238200457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, hi < 1238200457 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: disenchanter: ask not, as if a deity is pushing you, my friend." " true!" she laid aside the bag, bag of gems. < 1238200461 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, that ^ < 1238200498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, "he gazed after tron"? < 1238200499 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1238200517 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a Tron quote in the "grid bug" entry. < 1238200522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1238200535 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style nethack < 1238200535 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Selected style: nethack (NetHack 3.4.3 data.base, rumors.tru, rumors.fal) < 1238200539 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the files it's from. < 1238200562 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1238200630 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: give me some nonsense < 1238200631 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ulch! that meat was painted! i'm being held prisoner in a mirror to notice. i once saw a crowd, a long sword named frost brand makes you feel cooler than you are aware of that kind. born in 1226, he crops in the dungeon it's not for the weak of heart. < 1238200786 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-108-115.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238200929 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grammatical sense. That line made none. < 1238200943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ^ < 1238200985 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION paints some meat with lead
< 1238200996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, dangerous < 1238201102 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Four-core machines are already widely available, with affordable six processors on the horizon. As if that's not enough, some hard-core gamers have dual quad-core processors installed" < 1238201110 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err is it just me or are 8-core machines common < 1238201339 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Out of pure random change, that nethack style was built with trigrams only, so for each word only the two previous ones matter when selecting it. < 1238201542 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238201807 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238202099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm ok < 1238202110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the other ones used quattrograms? < 1238202118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever you call them < 1238202126 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quadgrams? < 1238202293 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think when it gets to >= 4 it's just n-gram with n=4 or whatever. Uni-, bi- and trigrams are the only names I've commonly heard. < 1238202303 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1238202349 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must sleep now, g'night. < 1238202462 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a=$(mktemp); (echo 'int main(int argc, char **argv){'; cat; echo 'return 0;}') | cc -x c - -o "$a" && $a < 1238202558 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :&& rm $a < 1238203128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night too < 1238203204 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-''- < 1238203213 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nighty < 1238203216 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1238203749 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-60-96.A163.priv.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1238203836 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rob Pike's email is r@google.com < 1238203911 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly he needs us to send him some more letters < 1238204072 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238206326 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238206921 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/why_static/ < 1238207880 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :....plan 9 doesn't do dynamic linking? < 1238208658 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh haha didn't realize this was in here < 1238208690 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saw the pike comment then when I looked back in there it was gone < 1238208696 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION .oO(wtf)
< 1238209807 0 :Slereah_!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-81-4.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238210608 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238210678 0 :revcompgeek!n=revcompg@74.249.sfcn.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1238212486 0 :revcompgeek!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my Ans interpreter is working beautifully < 1238212680 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Robdgreat, why'dyou do ".o0(stuff)"? A certain thingy for an RPG does that < 1238212720 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :approximates a cartoon thought bubble < 1238212758 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jParanoia does that < 1238212772 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, not familiar with it < 1238216716 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1238220674 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1238220719 0 :revcompgeek!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ans interpreter has been posted (http://esolangs.org/wiki/Ans#Interpreter) < 1238222100 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1238222721 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"X-Chat -> http://xchat.org <- At least when I quit I don't look like a lamer" < 1238223060 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-14-133.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238223910 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238226542 0 :Slereah_!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-104-60.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238227199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1238227200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1238227365 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238227383 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-125-110.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238227980 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238231952 0 :Mony!n=Harmony@AToulouse-258-1-62-31.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232006 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plop < 1238232489 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232491 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238232517 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232519 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1238232526 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232527 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1238232533 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232535 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1238232550 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232553 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1238232569 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232571 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238232596 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232599 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1238232627 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232629 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238232721 0 :cherez!n=cherez@r02snw275.device.mst.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1238232728 0 :cherez!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1238233126 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew mony < 1238233128 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dont you plop on us < 1238233129 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1238233141 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1238233142 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why ? < 1238233148 0 :psygnisfive!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its disgusting! < 1238233191 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for me, it's just a word without any meaning < 1238234687 0 :andreou!n=al@athedsl-4513040.home.otenet.gr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238235052 0 :andreou!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1238235085 0 :andreou!n=al@yoda.netmode.ece.ntua.gr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238236309 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@e-40.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238236525 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1238237441 0 :dbc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1238238077 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1238238102 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1238238967 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1238239301 0 :BeholdMyGlory!n=BeholdMy@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1238239667 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, #esoteric-style spam < 1238239668 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is yoour penis: 8--o < 1238239669 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is yoour penis on drugs: 8=====O < 1238239768 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!n=nice@HSI-KBW-091-089-027-168.hsi2.kabelbw.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1238239805 0 :neldoret1!n=user@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238240640 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 113 (No route to host) < 1238241378 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: you talking about viagra? < 1238241425 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've deleted the spam, but I guess it was something similar < 1238241442 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reminds me of the ASCII weapons of #esoteric < 1238241612 0 :Slereah_!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-99-132.w92-139.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238242006 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238242458 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1238242990 0 :Slereah_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238243640 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Quit" < 1238243838 0 :lifthras1ir!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :lifthrasiir < 1238246333 0 :KingOfKarlsruhe!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238246360 0 :neldoret1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1238246365 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1238247269 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-10-164.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238247438 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1238247502 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238247507 0 :neldoreth!n=user@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238248156 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello all < 1238248272 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1238248276 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1238249244 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pushes lots of changes to cfunge
< 1238249799 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, bzr assumes that gethostname() returns ASCII < 1238249873 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/193089 < 1238249930 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, hello AnMaster and Deewiant < 1238249954 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, Mr. Pyfunge, hi :-) < 1238249961 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1238249974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1238249995 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is writing changelog for ~60 new revisions atm
< 1238250018 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot the bouncer... :S < 1238250019 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, btw I'm down to 0.036 seconds wall time for mycology when using a clean environment now. :) < 1238250045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if lifthrasiir can beat that in Pyfunge
< 1238250049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is that not the goal? < 1238250058 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in Python it isn't ;-P < 1238250063 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah true < 1238250072 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pyfunge is the next-slowest interpreter after Language::Befunge, I think < 1238250078 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least of the ones that pass Mycology < 1238250081 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly of all < 1238250084 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: if that's goal i must speed up 100x or 200x < 1238250097 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, heh ok. Not realistic in python I guess < 1238250110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that is using fully buffered output though (the -b switch) < 1238250120 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's cheating < 1238250121 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is slightly more with the default life buffered < 1238250132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, no it isn't. The specs doesn't forbid it < 1238250142 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Most Significant Bit 4 (0x10): high if unbuffered standard I/O (like getch()) is in effect, low if the usual buffered variety (like scanf("%c")) is being used. " < 1238250147 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, as long as I fflush() before reading any user input < 1238250153 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I submit that "the usual buffered variety" is line buffered for terminals < 1238250180 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, scanf() isn't intrinsically line buffered < 1238250191 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, also I'm talking about output not input < 1238250203 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :input is line buffered as usual < 1238250204 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but using it on approximately all terminals will be < 1238250215 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that also says I/O, the examples just happen to be input < 1238250251 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i just optimized an important class to get 2-3x speed-up, but yet slower... < 1238250258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, err no, it doesn't depend on terminal. It depends on setvbuf(), or implementation defined default if app didn't call it < 1238250303 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(myco takes 25-30s with some fingerprint enabled, and now takes 10s....) < 1238250305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, Well you can't seriously expect to beat C with some inline asm for performance critical parts (with pure C fallbacks for other compilers/platforms of course) with Python can you? < 1238250317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, oh, without fingerprints it is even less of course < 1238250340 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course not all fingerprints are implemented, so it should be slower... :S < 1238250354 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, and the defaults for approximately all libraries are that if it's a terminal it's line buffered < 1238250359 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I don't implement them all either < 1238250386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that is true, which is why I only enable fully buffered with -b passed < 1238250431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ env -i bash --noprofile --norc -c 'time ./cfunge -bF ../../trunk/mycology/mycology.b98 >/dev/null' < 1238250431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.019s < 1238250431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.011s < 1238250431 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.007s < 1238250434 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about that? < 1238250435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1238250457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-F disables all fingerprints < 1238250486 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woah. < 1238250536 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any kind of runtime optimization, aside from bottleneck code? < 1238250540 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if outputting to terminal and without -b it is closer to 0.070 seconds. But that isn't really odd. < 1238250549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, you mean JITing or such? No < 1238250566 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JITing doesn't work well with threads anyway < 1238250574 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i agree. < 1238250591 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, jitfunge (which fizzie is working on) will likely be even faster once it is done < 1238250593 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, so I guess you're around 2-3 times as fast as CCBI? < 1238250607 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well CCBI is much slower here < 1238250614 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like 0.1 to 0.2 seconds, right? < 1238250618 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you have a faster computer < 1238250618 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or do I misremember < 1238250619 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check < 1238250673 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give me segmentation fault huh < 1238250674 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks
< 1238250678 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238250686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Testing fingerprint SCKE... loaded. < 1238250686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNDEF: 0"1.0.0.721"H pushed 2130706433 < 1238250686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: P pushed 0 for socket without data < 1238250686 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: line 1: 26252 Segmentation fault ../../trunk/other/ccbi/ccbi_linux/ccbi ../../trunk/mycology/mycology.b98 < 1238250687 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like that < 1238250695 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which version? < 1238250707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, 1.0.13 it seems < 1238250710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it is outdated < 1238250719 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.0.19 was released in january :-P < 1238250725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1238250733 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think 1.0.14 fixes that one, looking at the changelog < 1238250780 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok last version now segfaults in another place < 1238250781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: A claims 2008-04-01 minus 32 days is 2008-02-29 < 1238250781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: D claims the number of days from 2008-04-01 to 2008-02-29 is -32 < 1238250781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: line 1: 26320 Segmentation fault ../../trunk/other/ccbi/ccbi_linux/ccbi ../../trunk/mycology/mycology.b98 < 1238250792 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1238250805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, real 0m0.516s for reaching that point of segfault btw < 1238250826 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, that slow < 1238250842 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that a repeatable result? < 1238250846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, but this is not 100% fair anyway, my cfunge was compiled for x86_64, while your is just 32-bit. Though that is not the only reasonj < 1238250849 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reason* < 1238250851 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or wait < 1238250852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the segfault? yes < 1238250857 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant the time < 1238250858 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: A claims 2008-04-01 minus 32 days is 2008-02-29 < 1238250858 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: D claims the number of days from 2008-04-01 to 2008-02-29 is -32 < 1238250858 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: line 1: 26332 Segmentation fault ../../trunk/other/ccbi/ccbi_linux/ccbi ../../trunk/mycology/mycology.b98 < 1238250862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what I get < 1238250864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is from DATE < 1238250906 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the number in front of the Segmentation, is the PID I think < 1238250913 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is < 1238250929 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what on earth could segv in DATE, there's practically nothing there :-P < 1238250945 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the test at that point? < 1238250947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, search me. gdb or valgrind both doesn't work properly on D source < 1238250950 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's most recent version? < 1238250959 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably if he said it is ;-) < 1238250974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, I just downloaded CCBI a few minutes ago from http://users.tkk.fi/~mniemenm/files/befunge/interpreters/ccbi/ccbi_linux.zip < 1238250978 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... i have to install tango in mac os x... < 1238250992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I just can't build it myself < 1238250994 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might want to get LDC if you want to build it < 1238251000 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D is the most messy language to get working < 1238251017 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: LDC is pretty much unzip, cmake, and go. < 1238251031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, really? What about the stdlib thing? < 1238251037 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LDC comes with Tango. < 1238251045 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: assuming LLVM is installed, right? < 1238251047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, and if you need the other one for some program? < 1238251057 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Yep. < 1238251060 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, well I have llvm installed in ~/local/llvm-svn < 1238251073 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Then you get tangobos. < 1238251073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :svn head as of ~1 week ago < 1238251096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, short for tango-bossanova? ~ < 1238251157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway Deewiant how do you mean "what test is run"? < 1238251159 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would I check? < 1238251171 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@e-196.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238251173 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: You have a working interpreter, right? < 1238251184 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yes, called cfunge indeed < 1238251196 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I implmenet DATE < 1238251245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh I get some BAD in cfunge for DATE suddenly, wth < 1238251249 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1238251250 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it worked this morning < 1238251271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ^ < 1238251274 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think DATE just doesn't like us < 1238251281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, it makes no sense < 1238251284 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DATE hate < 1238251292 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238251296 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works in another build < 1238251306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just -O0 works... < 1238251310 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-O1 or above doesn't < 1238251312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARGH! < 1238251329 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... I'll have to go debugging GCC now I guess < 1238251345 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1238251345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: A claims 2008-04-01 minus 32 days is 2008-02-29 < 1238251345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: D claims the number of days from 2008-04-01 to 2008-02-29 is -32 < 1238251345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: T claims the 366th day of 2008 is 2008-12-31 < 1238251345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOOD: T reflects given day 400 of 2008 < 1238251348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway that is it ^ < 1238251359 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, so T probably fails < 1238251366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was T now again? < 1238251383 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like it's given a year and a doy and it gives the date < 1238251390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I suggest reproducing it locally < 1238251458 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have D properly set up so it'll take some work < 1238251471 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, I'll have to take a look at some point < 1238251526 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I have to add a notice to the README about mycology test of R in FILE is broken. I plan to release a new cfunge version very soon < 1238251536 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in 1-2 days < 1238251548 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :geez, it needs LLVM 2.5... < 1238251568 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tried to compile LDC with LLVM 2.3 (maybe)
< 1238251593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, Btw if you compile LLVM manually, avoid using old GCCs. At least GCC 4.1.2 miscompiles LLVM. < 1238251604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Silently miscompiling, resulting in runtime bugs < 1238251609 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta love broken compilers <3 < 1238251648 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, oh yes. I wouldn't have noticed if I didn't bootstrap llvm-gcc. < 1238251656 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stage1 was broken < 1238251667 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus unable to compile stage2 < 1238251684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failed with an assert() < 1238251690 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION gave up
< 1238251694 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1238251711 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, what? compiling llvm isn't hard. Just time consuming < 1238251718 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why I leave it running in the background < 1238251725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love multitasking OS ;P < 1238251735 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's exactly why I gave up. :p < 1238251752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, it isn't really an issue. And I don't even have multi-core < 1238251755 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just leave it running < 1238251781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan < 1238251807 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi AnMaster < 1238251836 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know, but I have other things to do besides funge things ;) < 1238251865 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, I use llvm for other stuff too < 1238251899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what is the version specification for mycology? I have no idea how you would refer to a specific version of it < 1238251905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in the current last one with broke FILE check < 1238251913 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: 1.0.x < 1238251927 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, mycology? Not CCBI.. < 1238251932 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, Mycology < 1238251938 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just use the release date < 1238251946 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's in the readme < 1238251959 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm DMM left out the obvious tvtropes link today < 1238251985 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe he has linked it before < 1238252157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, what would that obvious link be? < 1238252196 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MeanwhileInTheFuture < 1238252213 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has < 1238252329 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The actual phrase is only ever used seriously in Fan Fic, since the only people who can say it with a straight face generally can't get published." :D < 1238252531 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heheh < 1238253797 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost 80 lines in Changelog for this release. With the major important changes. < 1238253798 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238253806 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait more < 1238253816 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :85 even < 1238253876 0 :revcompgeek_!n=revcompg@74.249.sfcn.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1238254158 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/annotate/628?file_id=changelog-20080319201658-czs9f8hg18hz0xo7-2 < 1238254168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, you may be interested too < 1238254331 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With mycology, RCS's 3DSP test and some tests included with the cfunge source I now have about 97% coverage of the source according to gcov. Most of the rest is code handling malloc() returning NULL and such. Branch coverage around 85% IIRC. < 1238254360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(tested a few days ago, don't have the output files around any more due to slightly typoed rm command) < 1238254369 0 :revcompgeek_!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1238254838 0 :revcompgeek!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238255209 0 :Mony!n=Harmony@AToulouse-258-1-62-31.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238255622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, did you say you used OS X? < 1238255822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if yes I would like to ask a favour... If you have cmake 2.6 (or later) installed, could you try building http://kuonet.org/~anmaster/tmp/cfunge_r631.tar.bz2 on OS X? I made some changes in this version that I'm not sure will work on OS X you see.. < 1238256366 0 :Dewio!n=dewi@124-171-216-90.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1238256381 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Working on" is a bit over-optimistic term in this context. < 1238256408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, could you check http://kuonet.org/~anmaster/tmp/cfunge_r631.tar.bz2 on your OS X thingy? If you have it around. < 1238256473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did find one bug in the build system or possibly in FreeBSD headers, not sure yet. If cmake fails with a message about netinet/tcp.h, please comment out the line "CFUNGE_REQUIRE_INCLUDE(netinet/tcp.h)" in CMakeLists.txt. I'm working on figuring it out atm. < 1238256506 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guess so. It's inside our TV stand (the box we were using for DVB-watchery gave up the magic smoke) but there's always SSH. < 1238256520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238256576 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the record, I have "cmake version 2.6-patch 0" on that thing. < 1238256576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, the main reason I'm wondering about OS X is that I did some changes to the build system regarding linker flag handling. I just hope the detection of supported linker flags works as it should on OS X... < 1238256586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that should be new enough < 1238256774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, cmake fails to include before < 1238256785 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"PJIRC @ http://webirk.dy.fi" < 1238256788 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, here cmake/ccmake did not complain or anything, and "make" finished the build just fine. < 1238256796 0 :oklowob!n=oklowob@a91-153-121-248.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1238256798 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, nice :) < 1238256805 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were two warnings from lib/genx/genx.c, though. < 1238256810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, expected. < 1238256819 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about discarding const iirc < 1238256833 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Well, "discards qualifiers"; I guess it's usually const. < 1238256844 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1238257023 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well i tested it and it works well, though mycology reports one BAD (1R reflected). < 1238257033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, known bug in mycology < 1238257037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant just hasn't fixed it yet < 1238257047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks a lot :) < 1238257048 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then works correctly ;) < 1238257127 0 :Dewi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 101 (Network is unreachable) < 1238258551 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:36 bsmntbombdood: ....plan 9 doesn't do dynamic linking? < 1238258563 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said that! < 1238258659 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1238258661 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a feature. < 1238258668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That it doesn't.) < 1238258737 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's stupid < 1238258747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's not < 1238258871 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it is < 1238258883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :talking to you is so pointless. < 1238258905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, interesting, how does it justify it? I can see there are reasons to avoid dynamic linking certainly, as well as advantages with it. < 1238258926 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are no tangible advantages. Did you click my link? No? Do so. Or don't because the server is down actually. < 1238258946 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks for the link
< 1238258958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not on google cache or wayback. < 1238258964 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I can't see it? I unignored you like 15 minutes ago or so < 1238258970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that may be why I didn't see the link < 1238258977 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My timestamp: '01:36' < 1238258980 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is 15:48. < 1238258983 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take a guess. < 1238258990 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I ignored you back then < 1238259006 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 01:36 bsmntbombdood: ....plan 9 doesn't do dynamic linking? <-- first line after unignoring < 1238259015 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:36 < 1238259017 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:49 < 1238259020 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was HOURS AGO < 1238259025 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely this isn't hard for you to understand < 1238259079 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you sent that line mentioning what bsmntbombdood said at 01:36 at the time 15:41:30 in your timezone. And yes I know you commented on something way before < 1238259082 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.plan9.bell-labs.com/wiki/plan9/why_static/ is a broken link < 1238259088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that is the link < 1238259091 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I said the server is down. < 1238259102 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you did. < 1238259147 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is pi^e useful in any way? < 1238259177 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: being roughly 22 1/2? < 1238259203 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure what you're implying < 1238259227 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may consider that a useful property < 1238259243 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not that close to 22.5, and 22.5 isn't that useful < 1238259244 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's a useful approximation for 22.5 < 1238259263 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: .459 < 1238259265 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i already got tons of useless answers on #math < 1238259272 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :approx -> .46 < 1238259275 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :approx -> .5 < 1238259300 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well admittedly it's .4591 < 1238259306 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my point exactly, you can't get a much worse approximation < 1238259312 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But .459157! < 1238259313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, why do you think it would be useful? Any specific reason? < 1238259322 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's listed in schaum's mathematical handbook < 1238259327 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :72 is not a very good approximation for 22.5. < 1238259328 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in "special constants" < 1238259342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ^ = exp, sillay < 1238259348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, heh < 1238259366 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Yes, I just mentioned 72 since oklowob said you couldn't get worse approximations. < 1238259368 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i wouldn't classify it as an approximation, since it doesn't get rounded to it using any common rule. < 1238259374 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1238259383 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1238259394 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, what operation did you think fizzie did instead of exp? < 1238259408 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xor < 1238259409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or sht < 1238259410 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sth < 1238259449 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does xor on a non-integer even make sense? < 1238259471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tries to figure out what it would do...
< 1238259504 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it make sense on an integer? < 1238259544 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IEEE, bitchez. < 1238259551 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an operation on the polynom (mod 2) you can represent with a binary number < 1238259560 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on numbers it makes no sense < 1238259569 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bitwise operations are pretty stupidz as far as mathsssss goes < 1238259575 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no they aren't < 1238259583 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238259595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, agreed < 1238259604 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hai ais523 < 1238259605 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you'd be wrong too < 1238259606 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hi ais523 < 1238259607 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1238259617 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wrote another Enigma level
< 1238259622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1238259629 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rather more action-oriented than the others, because I wanted to please AnMaster < 1238259630 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me paste it < 1238259643 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, and I merged several API breakage changes back into cfunge trunk. Had to be done < 1238259652 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's fine < 1238259665 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: shit, all 1 users of your API will have to change their code. < 1238259670 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you may want to look at http://bzr.kuonet.org/cfunge/trunk/annotate/head:/ChangeLog the list is rather long < 1238259673 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in edge-case circumstances. < 1238259676 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's disasterous < 1238259697 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I'm the only person who uses the TAEB API too, I think < 1238259701 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, two now, me and shabble < 1238259705 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, err. It changes the parameter count of some core functions. And renames some data type (to make the API more consistent) < 1238259709 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, huh? < 1238259713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm forever moaning about API changes in there, although it's for a good cause < 1238259719 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: shit shit shit! your 1 users will sue you for everything you've got < 1238259725 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you break their enterprise applications < 1238259732 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I will be your lawyer. < 1238259733 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://filebin.ca/gexxmq/ais52306_1.xml anyway < 1238259735 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah TAEB.. < 1238259741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what sort of level is it? < 1238259747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: a speed level < 1238259752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah this could be interesting < 1238259753 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a bit of intelligence and knowledge too < 1238259804 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wants a database of useful reals
< 1238259807 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does the ais52306_1.xml mean? I mean the first bit is your nick, but the 06_1? < 1238259876 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: there's a filename convention < 1238259888 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, it's the sixth level I've started creating (although the third I've distributed) < 1238259892 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the _1 goes up if I make a breaking change < 1238259899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238259902 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to a released version < 1238259902 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :breaking change :D < 1238259922 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, as in changes what max time could be or? < 1238259926 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or min time rather < 1238259940 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that's a change to score compatibility < 1238259949 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, isn't that a breaking change? < 1238259955 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what is a breaking change then < 1238259956 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the revision number, that's the _1, goes up if you change the nature of the level < 1238259970 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, it looks substantially different, it's a different shape, or a different concept, or whatever < 1238259979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but not score compat? < 1238259990 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, changing the revision generally changes score compat too < 1238259997 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can change score compat without changing the revision < 1238260002 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say if you changed the friction of the floor < 1238260006 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1238260008 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would change score compat but not revision number < 1238260019 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMO that would be a breaking change < 1238260026 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: There's that old joke-"proof" for the interestingness of all natural numbers, but you must've heard that one. And interesting is not really the same as useful. < 1238260052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm? I don't think I heard it < 1238260064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have* < 1238260070 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, but you can't apply that to reals < 1238260088 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: trivial < 1238260092 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: the proof works for usefulness too < 1238260093 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you think there's nothing useful about the lowest useless number < 1238260098 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the first uninteresting number is interesting < 1238260102 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that it's the first uninteresting number < 1238260107 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1238260108 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, it's not uninteresting, it's interesting < 1238260113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, all numbers are interesting. QED < 1238260113 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an interesting real is a number for which there is a turing machine that outputs their digits < 1238260118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1238260132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: err isn't that every real < 1238260136 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mathematically speaking, actually i just want the ones that have actually been used < 1238260138 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: no < 1238260140 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1238260141 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1238260173 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how useful even the lowest useless number is. < 1238260191 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1238260193 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, wouldn't that be -aleph_0 ? < 1238260199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1238260200 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's useful as an example of a useless number < 1238260212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's useful is it not < 1238260219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, well true. < 1238260220 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1238260225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does -aleph_0 even make any goddamn sense? < 1238260226 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, talking of natural numbers here, to avoid that. < 1238260230 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, unknown < 1238260267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would negative infinity not make sense? < 1238260279 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err do you know what aleph 0 is < 1238260319 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, one type of infinite. To be specific it is related to the set of all natural numbers (iirc) < 1238260332 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x.x < 1238260344 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may be wrong < 1238260373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I think the word I'm looking for instead of "related" is "cardinality" < 1238260395 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds distinctly like you looked it up on wikipedia < 1238260428 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, no I didn't. I just didn't remember it at first < 1238260450 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which part sounded like wikipedia? < 1238260468 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11 AnMaster: ehird, I think the word I'm looking for instead of "related" is "cardinality" < 1238260472 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after a long delay < 1238260527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yes I was grepping /usr/share/dict/words for the right word. I remembered it was something like "cardinal" but not what the ending was < 1238260552 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think someone here categorically defined that all interesting sets have a cardinality of at most ℵ₀. < 1238260583 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: therefore my "doesn't work for reals" comment < 1238260595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: reals are uninteresting? :D < 1238260597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I know what I was looking for was the right word to mean "size of set" basically. Just "size of set" wasn't the correct term... < 1238260599 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also fuck you and your unicode < 1238260602 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not therefore, but same thing < 1238260612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that unicode renders fine here? < 1238260620 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did I say it didn't < 1238260629 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i assume he meant that's the biggest kinda of set all of whose members can be interesting < 1238260631 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why did you say "fuck you and your unicode" then? < 1238260636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounded like you didn't like it < 1238260674 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not liking it isn't the same as saying it doesn't render well on your computer < 1238260677 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That subscript-0 is a bit silly in that at least here it doesn't go lower than the baseline of other text. < 1238260688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, what other reason would he have for not liking it? < 1238260692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was implying that fizzie was pretentious for using fancy schmancy unicode to represent "N0" or "aleph0" < 1238260707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, here it goes about 2 pixles below or so < 1238260715 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well it might not render well on his computer < 1238260732 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, heh < 1238260734 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you see i'm just being pedantic < 1238260753 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :urgh one whole page of special constants to memorize < 1238260758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :saying \aleph_0 might be more interesting < 1238260768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, why do you need to memorize them? < 1238260776 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just happen to think that since someone went and defined all those codepoints, I might as well use them. < 1238260779 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i don't remember them yet < 1238260789 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's the enigmising going? Anyone tried the level yet? < 1238260810 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sadly no time for that < 1238260812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes and I gave up, too stressful. < 1238260815 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: ah, o < 1238260817 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ok < 1238260818 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but o too < 1238260828 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after memorizing these, need to start reading about my processor architectures < 1238260828 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: lol pleasing AnMaster is impossible I think < 1238260828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: "stressful"? < 1238260834 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need a relaxing action level. < 1238260835 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oko < 1238260839 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like it's obvious whether you've won or not after 40 seconds < 1238260840 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, ok... I meant: why do you need to remember those constants? < 1238260840 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: okoko < 1238260848 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*not obvious < 1238260892 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's an axiomatic need < 1238260897 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cannot break it down any further < 1238260899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I think I mentioned before I like levels that are full of items to use and such. Exploring and such < 1238260904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, ah... < 1238260920 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can just say something gay like "why do swallows breathe" < 1238260938 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: to verify that they're unladen < 1238260952 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I hate those levels, you play for 40 minutes and then one slip and you die, and you have to start again < 1238261003 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, so you hate nethack too? You play for weeks, and then one Arch-Lich... < 1238261008 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well okay, maybe a safer gay philosophy question would be something like "why do people want to stay alive" < 1238261032 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but the games are always different < 1238261047 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : does it make sense on an integer? < 1238261064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, ok that is true, but you could randomise enigma levels using it's scripting language. < 1238261067 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xor = nimber addition, which makes sense not just on integers but also on transfinite ordinals < 1238261086 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: logical xor is addition < 1238261090 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :binary isn't < 1238261093 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on numbers < 1238261099 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1238261107 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_nimbers_ < 1238261112 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, "nimber"? < 1238261117 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh sorry < 1238261121 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought it was a number < 1238261123 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a nimber < 1238261127 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :equivalence classes of nim games < 1238261130 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1238261138 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well anyway it's polynomial addition too isn't it < 1238261150 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when operating mod 2 < 1238261151 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically every nim game is equivalent to a single heap of a certain size < 1238261170 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes. ordinal numbers have base expansions < 1238261182 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so it's an infinitiary number? < 1238261183 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with infinite bases, even < 1238261196 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :polynomials are basically that < 1238261208 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course not so simple when you start taking modulos but anyway < 1238261213 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well an ordinary finite nim game gives a finite heap when you add (i.e. xor) < 1238261220 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nimber < 1238261222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's hot < 1238261244 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sprague%E2%80%93Grundy_theorem < 1238261251 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, bus -> < 1238261280 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have a bus. < 1238261288 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1238261423 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was the name of that golf programming page? < 1238261434 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :golf.shinh.org? < 1238261439 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org http://codegolf.com are the too main onces < 1238261441 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ones < 1238261455 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :codegolf is updated approximately 4 times in a blue moon < 1238261463 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, it was the shinh one I had in mind < 1238261465 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks :D < 1238261495 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Walk+the+line < 1238261497 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is my problem < 1238261500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know what I hate? < 1238261507 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate that 90% of the solutions are cheats. < 1238261509 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's killing anagolf. < 1238261515 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Lost terminal" < 1238261515 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :agreed < 1238261524 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the meal of the day there all the time, just embed embed embed. No skill, no fun, shinh should ban them < 1238261528 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very hard to propose a puzzle where a legit solution is shorter than a cheat < 1238261535 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: DATE doesn't segfault here < 1238261537 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally I favour a technological solution < 1238261542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, mhm. < 1238261544 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like codegolf's randomly generated puzzles < 1238261548 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, let me try gdb then < 1238261550 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it would be harder to code in < 1238261559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Programmers are obsesesd with technological solutions < 1238261573 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's a programming website, what do you expect? < 1238261586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(gdb) bt < 1238261586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#0 0x080fec41 in ?? () < 1238261586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#1 0x00000001 in ?? () < 1238261586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#2 0x00000001 in ?? () < 1238261593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, yay for no debugging symbolks < 1238261598 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*symbols < 1238261599 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: quite < 1238261607 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might be able to get you a debugging binary < 1238261612 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :64-bit, to boot < 1238261617 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I seriously doubt 0x00000001 is in one of your code pages anyway < 1238261619 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) < 1238261623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, true < 1238261628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, no frame pointer I guess < 1238261631 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that looks like stack corruption to me < 1238261637 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, or no frame pointer? < 1238261654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you can get a debug backtrace even without a frame pointer < 1238261660 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have enough information about the code, and gdb does < 1238261668 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, no debugging symbols though < 1238261673 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if there wasn't enough, it wouldn't even be able to give the address < 1238261674 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gdb said it at load < 1238261680 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"no debugging symbols found" < 1238261686 0 :neldoreth!n=user@unixboard/users/neldoreth JOIN :#esoteric < 1238261757 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Try http://88.114.248.232/ccbi.lzma < 1238261767 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I assume you can decompress that?) < 1238261768 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@a-70.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238261774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1238261800 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's 7 megs big so I guess it has some info ;-P < 1238261802 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, no segfault < 1238261807 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well yay < 1238261817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, but the one you uploaded before was 32-bit < 1238261821 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while this one is 64-bit < 1238261823 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I guess I can just upload a new binary then :-P < 1238261829 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, you can try a 32-bit one too < 1238261833 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One moment < 1238261837 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1238261873 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Same file < 1238261908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no segfault < 1238261911 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1238261927 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I guess I'll have to roll out 1.0.20 today :-P < 1238261936 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, maybe mycology update too? < 1238261954 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the FILE thing at least, yes, since I've already committed the fix to CCBI ;-P < 1238261960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I ran valgrind on that one... "==6989== ERROR SUMMARY: 11900 errors from 28 contexts (suppressed: 6 from 1)". Just wow. < 1238261968 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238261972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :things like: < 1238261973 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==6989== Conditional jump or move depends on uninitialised value(s) < 1238261973 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==6989== at 0x80A418C: _D3gcx3Gcx4markMFPvPvZv (in /home/arvid/src/cfunge/trunk/mycology/ccbi) < 1238261988 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea how to unmangle that one < 1238261988 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the GC is broken. What else is new? ;-P < 1238262000 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcx.Gcx.mark and the rest is type info < 1238262009 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't read the types myself, I think the v at the end means it returns void < 1238262012 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, lots of other GC funcs too < 1238262015 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Pv might mean pointer to void < 1238262041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==7004== More than 10000000 total errors detected. I'm not reporting any more. < 1238262045 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1238262046 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :first time I ever seen that one < 1238262052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==7004== Final error counts will be inaccurate. Go fix your program! < 1238262065 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 10 million errors? How? < 1238262066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==7004== Rerun with --error-limit=no to disable this cutoff. Note < 1238262067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==7004== that errors may occur in your program without prior warning from < 1238262067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :==7004== Valgrind, because errors are no longer being displayed. < 1238262072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, broken GC it seems < 1238262091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that was the 64-bit version btw < 1238262100 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I can see those too < 1238262128 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I think it might make sense since it's from scanStaticData < 1238262139 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And those scan* functions in general < 1238262154 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, of course they can run into uninitialized data < 1238262199 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But whatever, I'm off to sauna -> < 1238262203 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrh < 1238262204 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh* < 1238262332 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238262766 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, err.. your IFFI test suite thing doesn't work < 1238262773 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what wat? < 1238262775 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*way? < 1238262778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :docs say last line should be XVIII < 1238262784 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I get XV < 1238262786 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :run with -a < 1238262794 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./iffit1: can't grok -a < 1238262797 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, compile with -a < 1238262805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah that helped yes < 1238262806 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in addition to the other switches < 1238262814 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that last bit can only be tested with -a given < 1238262866 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, then I'll soon push some IFFI fixes for current cfunge trunk (which will be released soon, working on some build system issues on *BSD atm) < 1238262869 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: as it happens, I'm trying to get C-INTERCAL finished off atm < 1238262878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that too heh < 1238262880 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a beta release on April 1 < 1238262896 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you think of 0.-2.0.29 as a version number? < 1238262898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I was planning Mars 31 < 1238262904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for cfunge < 1238262907 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just becase < 1238262920 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, err that is CLC style isn't it? < 1238262921 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why don't you use english dates when talking in english < 1238262937 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afk urg < 1238262950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1238262957 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i have used such version once, e.g. starting at 0.9.-999, ... < 1238262978 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :version scheme* < 1238263006 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i never heard of negative minor version... hmm, < 1238263167 0 :ais523_!n=ais523@147.188.254.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238263169 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: "u r gay" < 1238263172 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1238263174 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ais523 < 1238263184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: o < 1238263188 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: oko < 1238263195 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okoffffff < 1238263218 0 :ais523_!i=93bc93e6@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-61e4930f94624212 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238263409 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I must never use two OSes at the same time ever again. < 1238263417 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep using features from one in the other. < 1238263650 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something in Windows that doesn't work in OS X? < 1238263690 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... there are a few things that work in windows xp/vista but not os x, mostly ui paradigms < 1238263704 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, going to a window via the task bar using opening-order memory < 1238263715 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in os x / windows 7, you'd use the dock instead which works differently < 1238263914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: os x / plan9 < 1238263923 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why Plan 9? < 1238263924 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, those are very different I imagine < 1238263929 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although they have some things in common < 1238263932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Plan 9 is good. < 1238263935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: er, they do < 1238263935 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1238263942 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: So no particular reason? < 1238263943 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean apart from unix heritage under the seams < 1238263950 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It's good and I like to use it. < 1238263951 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, they're the two OSes that I'd think are most likely to have a global spellchecker < 1238263953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that a good reason? :P < 1238263959 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to a separate spellchecker in each application < 1238263966 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I right? < 1238263971 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: plan 9 doesn't really have a global spellchecker, it's manual (ie you pipe it to spell) < 1238263974 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but same sort of thinkg < 1238263978 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1238263986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :os x has it baked into the text input controls < 1238264023 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :os x is sort of like an inside-out version of plan 9 ui-wise, in a way < 1238264031 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in plan 9, you have wrapper programs, and pipes, that process data from things < 1238264041 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in os x, each program uses libraries which make them all work the same way, from inside < 1238264047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not quite so simple to spellcheck a document in acme < 1238264058 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, maybe it is < 1238264067 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: How well do programs work in it? I imagine you can't find many binaries but POSIX stuff generally compiles and runs as you'd expect? < 1238264077 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: No, it is not posix compatible. < 1238264080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I think POSIX stuff would probably need porting < 1238264081 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it does not use X11. < 1238264085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, there is APE < 1238264087 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't it emulate POSIX somehow/ < 1238264087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a posix port environment < 1238264090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you generally don't use it < 1238264091 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s:/:?: < 1238264092 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that < 1238264093 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1238264099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because posix programs aren't very, well, plan9. < 1238264100 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: does it translate pathnames? < 1238264105 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no < 1238264115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaik < 1238264157 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, even if it isn't POSIX, it would be nice to get C-INTERCAL running on Plan9 < 1238264169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, I got it running on DOS and that isn't POSIX either < 1238264179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: To get it working "plan9y" you'd have to change, for instance, every call of printf < 1238264184 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to use Bio and the unicode Rune sytem < 1238264185 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :system < 1238264192 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it has stdio, though) < 1238264206 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there isn't a whole lot of I/O in C-INTERCAL, and what there is is confined to a few functions < 1238264230 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for the big main() glop, but AnMaster refactored that a while back so it isn't as bad nowadays < 1238264233 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think it also has its own replacement for the string.h functions < 1238264244 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also, its own argument parsing facility < 1238264247 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no optparse) < 1238264248 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238264249 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no getopt < 1238264262 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please tell me it uses the new string-handling functions from C94 < 1238264262 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: What, ANSI C doesn't work by default? < 1238264265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which nobody cares about < 1238264269 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It'd be a full port rather than a fixup if you wanted it to work properly < 1238264276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: It does work, you just shouldn't do it like that. < 1238264286 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha < 1238264295 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Considering it's the same people I think they pretty much are entitled to make their C whatever they want :P < 1238264300 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also their C does have extensions < 1238264304 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and removes some ansi things < 1238264315 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the C94 functions seem to be a perfect fit for Plan9, maybe they were invented for it < 1238264320 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, nobody else seems to use them < 1238264323 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: link? < 1238264328 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're in C99 < 1238264335 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they mostly handle multibyte strings < 1238264343 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then no. < 1238264353 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plan 9 has its own, custom 16-bit unicode system called Runes < 1238264358 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I guess it doesn't handle the astral planes) < 1238264363 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Because they didn't exist at the time) < 1238264423 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, C94 is sufficiently obscure that even Google has few relevant results < 1238264435 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm searching for C94 199409L in an attempt to find it < 1238264451 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(199409L is the STDC_VERSION code for C94) < 1238264452 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone else seems to do the non-BMP characters as silly surrogate pairs, too. Java and something else I ran across very recently, to just mention two. < 1238264495 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF-16 does that, which is why Java and Windows and others do that. < 1238264544 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a structure or union may contained unnamed substructures and subunions; the fields of the substructures or subunions can then ebe used as if they were members of the parent structure or union < 1238264549 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the resolution of a name conflict is unspecified) < 1238264554 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when a pointer to the outer structure r union < 1238264561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is used in a contxt that is only legal for the unnamed substructure, < 1238264571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the compiler promotes the typw and adjusts the pointer value to ppint at th subtructure < 1238264580 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the unnamed struct or union is of a type with a tag name specified by a typedef < 1238264580 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C94 was basically a point relase to C89, it wasn't anything near as radical as the C99 changes < 1238264582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :statement, the unnamed struc- < 1238264588 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ture or union can be explicitly referenced by < 1238264592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1238264603 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^^^ that's badly typed from the screen, but, also, that's pretty non-ansi < 1238264626 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is valid int a[] = { [3] 1, [10] 5 }; < 1238264627 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess that it does < 1238264638 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's < 1238264645 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int a[11]; a[3] = 1; a[10] = 5; < 1238264680 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet, they eliminate the linker's -l < 1238264685 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#pragma lib "foo.a" < 1238264686 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1238264692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :link with /$objtype/lib/foo.a < 1238264717 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, they accept // comments < 1238264718 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... interesting; lots of compilers /can/ do it like that I think, but nobody ever does < 1238264721 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's been in VC++ and D forever < 1238264728 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and their long long is 64 bit in 32 bit code < 1238264736 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I expect GCC has something like that as well < 1238264740 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I wouldn't be surprised if they were one of the 3 compilers in the world which were fully C99-compliant < 1238264747 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and long long is always at least 64 < 1238264747 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they also support: < 1238264749 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3? < 1238264750 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by definition < 1238264753 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :struct foo = { .x 1, .y 3 }; < 1238264755 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without the = < 1238264757 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: are there more nowadays? < 1238264760 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or did I remember too many? < 1238264763 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Are there that many? < 1238264763 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, they're not c99 < 1238264763 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there aren't a lot, I know < 1238264767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't like c99, I believe < 1238264773 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can think only of Comeau < 1238264780 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Some features of c99 [...] are implemented" < 1238264781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well, IIRC Sun have a c99-compliant C compiler < 1238264802 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: "Amazing C99 Support" < 1238264806 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that mean "total"? < 1238264806 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Evidently so < 1238264811 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Probably not < 1238264815 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c99 is probably self-contradictory < 1238264860 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :personally, I think you'd be mad to use any of the C99 features which aren't supported in gcc+glibc < 1238264868 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they do all the easy-to-implement ones, and some of the harder ones < 1238264873 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Well, they claim they do support C99 fully < 1238264874 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1238264908 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, " what" <-- "afk urg" meant "away from keyboard, urgent". In this case because of a bleeding nose < 1238264929 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's gotta be one epic bleeding nose to warrant "urg" instead of "urgent" < 1238264948 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that would be a good description yes < 1238265042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where will we be ten years from now? CRT’s will be < 1238265043 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a thing of the past, multimedia will no longer be a buzzword, < 1238265044 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pen-based and voice input will be everywhere, and university < 1238265046 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :students will still be editing with emacs. < 1238265048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :— Rob Pike, 1992 < 1238265059 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1238265060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Add a few years and drop the pen/voice and he's dead on. < 1238265061 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" ais523: To get it working "plan9y" you'd have to change, for instance, every call of printf" " (it has stdio, though)" <-- printf is part of stdio... < 1238265067 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Were CRTs a thing from the past in 2002? < 1238265074 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's what I meant; pls read. < 1238265078 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: "add a few years" < 1238265080 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: In other words, he wasn't dead on. :-P < 1238265084 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: most students don't use emacs IME, Rob Pike missed the huge rise of Windows < 1238265093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, if it has stdio, then printf should work fine? < 1238265099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: computing students use a Real Editor, surely? < 1238265114 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I find that most use nano or gedit < 1238265116 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: do you understand what 'though' means in a parenthical remark? no. < 1238265117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :look it up < 1238265120 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Eclipse, for Java < 1238265135 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: here at university for programming sources they try to get us to use unpaid shareware versions of TextPad < 1238265138 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I see no reason to change it if it will work.. < 1238265139 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I used Emacs anyway < 1238265158 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: because stdio is deprecated in plan 9 < 1238265165 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it won't integrate well < 1238265166 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I don't have access to Emacs, I either use Notepad if Notepad is capable of what I'm doing (which is rare), or Notepad++ from my USB stick < 1238265177 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha, the plan 9 c compilers's preprocessors don't support #if < 1238265185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: put it this way, would you write C programs using implicit int < 1238265186 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(compilers, plural, it has one per architechture) < 1238265199 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: do they share front-ends? < 1238265208 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: dunno. almost certainly < 1238265210 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check < 1238265212 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cd /sys/src
< 1238265223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_that's_ how you do open source. < 1238265252 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the disappointing thing is that UNIX had directories for sources, and still does IIRC, but nobody uses them < 1238265293 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: /sys/src/cmd/8c just has some optimization and code generation files, so I assume the frontend is elsewhre < 1238265294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me look < 1238265339 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1238265342 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/sys/src/cmd/cc/ < 1238265352 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(found by looking at 1c/mkfile) < 1238265380 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they just compile w/ the frontend files, so each binary has its own frontend < 1238265381 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's the same code < 1238265390 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the same frontend per binary is just how plan 9 does it, so not surprising < 1238265391 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238265392 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :separate < 1238265393 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :frontend < 1238265418 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for C94, ##c managed to track down some people who are still selling it, apparently the PDF costs £39.78 < 1238265427 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: link? < 1238265436 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://infostore.saiglobal.com/store/Details.aspx?DocN=isoc00076751 but it isn't very useful < 1238265437 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tempted to buy it, that thing must be bitrotting to extinction < 1238265438 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a price list < 1238265454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a problem with the page you are trying to reach and it cannot be displayed. < 1238265454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We apologise for the inconvenience. Please try again in a few moments. < 1238265464 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, sorry < 1238265465 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, they have an advert for LAW 9000: the framework for good legal practice management < 1238265469 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://infostore.saiglobal.com/store/Details.aspx?DocN=isoc000767513 < 1238265471 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's exactly equal to nine thouuuusand < 1238265473 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copy-paste fail < 1238265485 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1238265512 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1238265517 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you think the hard copy comes with a pdf, ais523? < 1238265518 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not < 1238265519 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : AnMaster: put it this way, would you write C programs using implicit int <-- not unless golfing < 1238265520 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1238265532 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ais523: i think he missed your metaphor) < 1238265566 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :implicit int is weird < 1238265572 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, FreeBSD uses /usr/src to contain kernel and userland. If you install them < 1238265573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck < 1238265575 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which I have installed) < 1238265579 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cc/lex.c < 1238265584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what did you mean with " the disappointing thing is that UNIX had directories for sources, and still does IIRC, but nobody uses them" < 1238265585 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if(argc > 1 && systemtype(Windows)){ < 1238265591 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1238265592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that windows < 1238265596 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the plan 9 source tree < 1238265597 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am bemused < 1238265598 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: there are directories in the FHS for reserving source code < 1238265608 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: maybe plan9 cc has been ported to Windows? < 1238265615 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but that's crazy < 1238265616 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1238265618 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1238265622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, which ones do you mean? /usr/src and such? < 1238265624 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because because because windows! < 1238265626 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes < 1238265636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well as I mentioned freebsd does use that < 1238265637 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: it's no crazier than porting C-INTERCAL from UNIX to Linux to DOS < 1238265648 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure it's more crazy < 1238265658 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because c-intercal isn't a bastion of platonic amazing purity. < 1238265662 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of researchity. < 1238265675 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, you forgot +4 < 1238265680 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1238265686 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: would you say it is more or less crazy than translating the source code of Windows into Haskell? < 1238265691 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ... < 1238265693 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: . < 1238265694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1238265696 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238265702 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.... < 1238265709 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..... < 1238265709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ffffffffffff < 1238265720 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly, nobody's seriously tried that AFAIK < 1238265734 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that anyone even considered it amazes me < 1238265742 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I invented it just now < 1238265746 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should've added some context: if(argc > 1 && systemtype(Windows)){ print("can't assemble multiple files on windows\n"); errorexit(); } < 1238265749 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea of considering it, I mean < 1238265759 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: no, not assemble < 1238265761 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cc < 1238265767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/assemble/compile/ < 1238265772 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, this was from 2a/lex.c. < 1238265774 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the fact is that they took special considerations for windows. < 1238265779 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you want cc/lex.c < 1238265785 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I *want* it. < 1238265808 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, is this plan9 or plan9port? < 1238265809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ais523: digraphs, , more additional specification of wide and multibyte characters and additional functions and macros. < 1238265813 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: plan 9 < 1238265815 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<--- ##c on what's new in C94 < 1238265823 0 :Slereah!n=butt@ANantes-259-1-10-164.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238265824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm ok that is even odder < 1238265826 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is poppavic there? < 1238265841 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yes, but with different capitalisation < 1238265846 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1238265849 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just about to join < 1238265879 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ortdotlove.net/poppavic_wisdom.html < 1238265904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time i've been in ##c when he's there I get multi page markov-esque rants about things I didn't ask, instead of answers < 1238265923 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, I clicked on the "people who bought this also bought" thing for C94 < 1238265928 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there was loading for about 5 seconds < 1238265931 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then a blank list < 1238265935 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems there's no love for C94 at all < 1238265954 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has a sudden urge to translate C-INTERCAL to C94
< 1238265959 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: should I get the hardback, or the pdf, or both < 1238265967 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the hardback is more awesome, the pdf is more... snippet-pastingable. < 1238265969 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: what, you're actually planning to buy it, why? < 1238265973 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the both is expensive < 1238265986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because in 5 years, you won't be able to buy it any more, I bt < 1238265986 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bet < 1238266002 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, why not buy a spec for which there are no compilers? < 1238266013 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'd say that /if/ you're planning to buy it, go hardcopy for awesomeness, but I'd advise against buying it altogether < 1238266042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could OCR it I suppose < 1238266044 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to mention that the PDF is probably DRMed if it's that expensive < 1238266047 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although that would require cutting it u < 1238266048 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :p < 1238266051 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so may not be copy-pastable at all < 1238266057 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: PDF DRM is only relevant if your reader respects it. < 1238266061 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why cut it up? just take photos and OCR those < 1238266071 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because it's hundreds of pages? < 1238266074 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I assumed there was encryption so that readers that didn't respect it couldn't read protected contents at all < 1238266080 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, scanning would be far more accurate < 1238266085 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: if you're only pasting snippets, you only need to OCR the snippets < 1238266093 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how does that work? accept the drm, get the text, then allow it to be copy pasted < 1238266097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and, well, true. < 1238266123 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I assumed that they were encrypted somehow and Adobe only gave the privkey for decrypting to people who put DRM in their readers < 1238266138 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: open source readers can read protected files < 1238266141 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and allow you to copy < 1238266142 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so /shrug < 1238266162 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PDF encryption is defined in the released spec. And it's not a asymmetric-encryption-thing. < 1238266183 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not in the spec as it was originally released, but they did finally release the encryption-specific parts.) < 1238266204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PoppaVic is so infamous that someone I've talked to from ##c started ##free-c, which is "##c sans PoppaVic" in practice < 1238266212 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xpdf upstream does respect the DRM, though. I think at least Ubuntu or someone patched it to have a "--force"-style flag, too. < 1238266224 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pipe through gpg < 1238266226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: is it illegal not to or sth? < 1238266228 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE IS NO MACHINE CODE < 1238266235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, for kpdf it is a option in some menu iirc < 1238266237 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: probably only in the US < 1238266242 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: people need to wake the fuck up and stop pointing their finger at you, right? < 1238266256 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNIX PHILOSOPHY MAN < 1238266276 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tar c|gzip|gpg -c|netcat FUCK YES < 1238266289 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: also, I suspect that that C94 is only the diff from C89 < 1238266294 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as that's how it was released originally < 1238266301 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm, that's less epic < 1238266304 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you'd need C89 too to get the whole thing, and it's a lot more expensive < 1238266314 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::< < 1238266318 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no afirs < 1238266319 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fairs < 1238266364 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I suspect it isn't worth it < 1238266424 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian-packaged xpdf has debian/patches/02_permissions.dpatch which adds #ifdef ENFORCE_PERMISSIONS around most of the permission-checking blocks and does not define that symbol. < 1238266449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JOIN US NOW AND SHARE THE SOFTWARE < 1238266451 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU'LL BE FREE HACKERS < 1238266454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU'LL BE FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE < 1238266456 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Upstream author disagrees, though: http://www.foolabs.com/xpdf/cracking.html < 1238266462 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JOIN US NOW AND SHARE THE SOFTWARE < 1238266463 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU'LL BE FREE HACKERS < 1238266466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU'LL BE FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE < 1238266472 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOARDERS MAY GET PILES OF MONEY < 1238266474 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT IS TRUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE < 1238266475 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HACKERS < 1238266477 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT IS TRUEEEEEEEEEEEEEE < 1238266480 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, i turned into rms there. < 1238266483 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Excuse me -> < 1238266488 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<- what < 1238266547 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ITYM "→" and "←" there. Another Useless Use of Unicode. (U³) < 1238266564 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I need hotkeys for jew knee code < 1238266568 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't know how to make 'em < 1238266577 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Notably superscript-3 is latin-1.) < 1238266612 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: finally i managed to make PyFunge 9x faster. *sign* < 1238266614 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh* < 1238266620 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1238266621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir is the pyfunge guy? < 1238266623 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an cool < 1238266625 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1238266736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I just pushed a patch to IFFI that makes it works against cfunge r633. < 1238266740 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the very last one < 1238266748 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ah, good < 1238266754 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where's the website to pull from, again? < 1238266760 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now mycology takes 3.5s average, compared to 30s+ for first ever version passes mycology (without any fingerprints) < 1238266763 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sec... < 1238266791 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, http://rage.kuonet.org/~anmaster/c-intercal/darcs/ < 1238266808 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://kuonet.org/~anmaster/c-intercal/darcs/ should work too btw < 1238266994 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, there may be other changes from before you are missing < 1238266995 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1238267012 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the way darcs works, I get all the changes in your repo that aren't in mine < 1238267039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes I know < 1238267050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I mean, better check in case there are other things too < 1238267066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's time to write another toy Scheme. < 1238267071 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To try a Concurrent & Parallel gc. < 1238267152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, that sounds interesting, and hard < 1238267157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1238267159 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. Very easy. < 1238267161 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would imagine that that is the way to make garbage collection faster than manual memory allocation < 1238267173 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: gc is already faster than manual allocation in many cases < 1238267176 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is just an extra boost < 1238267178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, really? Not stopping the mutator should make things complex. < 1238267179 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's automatic paralellism < 1238267180 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :albeit a huge one < 1238267181 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1238267185 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is rather exciting < 1238267191 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, really? < 1238267199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: how many freaking times will you ask that?!! < 1238267213 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: well, sarcasm isn't always easy to detect < 1238267219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I mean, I thought you had to care about stuff like memory barriers and so on... < 1238267222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1238267224 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :watch; < 1238267226 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by analogy, non-sarcasm isn't always easy to detect either < 1238267253 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make a new thread { fork { run mark stage. send list of unused objects back to parent }; free unused objects } < 1238267271 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: that's what i was talking about yesterday < 1238267274 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: yep < 1238267276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1238267277 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't steal my idea < 1238267280 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er no < 1238267281 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1238267282 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw it elsewhere before < 1238267285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a mailing list < 1238267291 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which made me talk about concurrent gc < 1238267294 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you said the same thing < 1238267304 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice the ":P" < 1238267306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, hm so the actual collection is done in the mutator thread? < 1238267309 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: yah < 1238267313 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1238267315 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you do it in another thread < 1238267324 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see those { }s? < 1238267325 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they match up. < 1238267325 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :copy on write is awesome < 1238267326 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1238267327 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read them. < 1238267335 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, which thread is the "parent" then? < 1238267337 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of it happens in a separate thread < 1238267344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: GRIHAUHSAKFdhADJALS:adfs;as;d'kas < 1238267344 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g < 1238267348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mutator or the collector? < 1238267350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's freaking obvious < 1238267353 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also bbiab phone < 1238267356 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you actually read what i asid < 1238267413 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: if(fork()){run mark stage, return free objects to parent} else {schedule a signal handler to recieve free objects, then resume computation} < 1238267430 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: you should just do that as a thread < 1238267432 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trivial-er < 1238267439 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and less 'global' < 1238267442 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :errrrr, my clauses are backwards < 1238267446 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238267454 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, mine is just one thread < 1238267459 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yours has the overhead of fork() + signal handler < 1238267467 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess signal handler is quite fast < 1238267498 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a signal is elegant < 1238267508 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238267512 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: threads are as elegant as forks in theory. < 1238267522 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's a fuckin' gc, I think speed trumps elegance < 1238267550 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signals are also fast < 1238267561 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and threads are useless here... < 1238267584 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signals are the wrong way to do this < 1238267588 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1238267593 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: the signal handler has to execute asynchronously < 1238267595 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to free them < 1238267599 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't fork() in a signal handler, iirc < 1238267616 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't do any freeing < 1238267619 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238267621 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1238267629 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just use the unmarked objects for allocation < 1238267642 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um when you use malloc that's what free() does. < 1238267652 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're not using malloc... < 1238267655 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o rly < 1238267657 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should do the sweep while executing the program < 1238267660 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: even GC languages use malloc < 1238267662 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they just don't use free < 1238267667 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, normally they don't call it malloc) < 1238267668 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't, my solution is more async than yours < 1238267693 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and sometimes it's implicit in .copy() or = or whatever else makes copies in the language) < 1238267700 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :signal_handler(){ read(pipefromchild, free_objects); } < 1238267709 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: that's bullshit < 1238267710 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the allocator just looks at free_objects to allocate < 1238267822 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit, half my actions are plan 9 ones that aren't working on this system < 1238267824 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm dying here < 1238267825 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see how you can do the mark-and-sweep find-unreferenced-objects stuff while threads are running and mutating whatever they want, without doing a fork() so you get that copy-on-write "snapshot" of the process. < 1238267843 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, you can just put the free map in shared memory, and then you don't even have to notify the parent of anything < 1238267853 0 :kar8nga!n=kar8nga@b-4.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238267857 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you do a fork(), that's the point < 1238267858 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I do do a fork < 1238267861 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just do a thread too < 1238267924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, aha < 1238267941 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1238267947 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i explained that like 30 mins ago AnMaster < 1238267980 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was afk for phone I said. And before that you were incoherent < 1238268000 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not my fault that you can't understand the most basic english pseudocode possible < 1238268005 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good lord < 1238268008 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop being a douche < 1238268019 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, now we get to argue over who that was targeted at. < 1238268021 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Ah, so the "overhead of fork() + signal handler" wasn't meant to imply that you don't fork around. Sorry, that's just what it sounded like. < 1238268029 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I did the fork in another thread < 1238268033 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the overhead was just that of creating a thread < 1238268038 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238268058 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would forking in another thread save you... < 1238268059 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1238268064 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can do it without threads OR signal handlers < 1238268066 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: not setting a signal < 1238268070 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, it's not like the fork would magically execute without consuming any resources, even if it happens in its own thread. < 1238268076 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with shared memory < 1238268078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, exactly < 1238268085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: overhead = HOW LONG THE PROGRAM BLOCKS < 1238268087 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when a gc is triggered < 1238268109 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it will execute on a different proc < 1238268123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't see why you would want to fork() at all. < 1238268147 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't scan the object graph as it's being mutated < 1238268151 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need a static copy < 1238268178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, that is much less of an issue in single assignment languages < 1238268196 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238268197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's not < 1238268204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the object graph still mutates when you create objects < 1238268265 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not very sure the system will keep threads running while it's doing whatever the fork machinery needs to do to get a real copy of the process with all its threads, no matter in which thread you actually call the fork(). (Admittedly I guess it should be pretty fast.) I do rather like the at-least-superficial-simplicity of (presumably) doing fork+wait+"free" in one thread, though. < 1238268299 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: fork() blocks all threads? I don't think so... < 1238268311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, The fork() one does have some interesting aspects though. If a object is found to be unreferenced it would be that in the parent too even after it mutated (since you can't magically reference an unreachable object legally) < 1238268328 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yep < 1238268338 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using forks and threads together is insane < 1238268339 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right, in a pthreadsy system the child is created with just the fork-calling thread. < 1238268341 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, however you can't do compacting GC this way... < 1238268345 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: exactly < 1238268350 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is _absolutely_ what you want < 1238268386 0 :olsner!n=salparot@h-60-96.A163.priv.bahnhof.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1238268394 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, so there is no way to handle memory fragmentation, except having a different GC strategy that is run less often and isn't concurrent < 1238268415 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, you can always use a concurrent gc < 1238268454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, btw you depend on that the Linux fork() is copy-on-write it seems. On some systems it may be a lot slower because it copies all at fork() time < 1238268470 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: which of these systems are in actual use? < 1238268475 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me so that I can destroy every one of them. < 1238268480 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: older versions of Sun UNIX < 1238268487 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may have one here which doesn't cow < 1238268491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, Older UNIX. Windows (iirc) < 1238268491 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: out of shit legacy code < 1238268492 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check the definition of vfork < 1238268501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though it doesn't call it fork() at all < 1238268502 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which won't be running newer interps anyway < 1238268509 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: oh, yes, cygwin fork isn't copy-on-write, but it was a big struggle to get it to work at all < 1238268516 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, exactly < 1238268548 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION opens Solaris 9 running CDE 1.5
< 1238268551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why couldn't you do COW without fork()? I mean, implement what the kernel is doing for COW basically < 1238268555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how it does it < 1238268574 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it is some ring-0 hardware trick I guess it wouldn't work < 1238268612 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pre-10 Solaris also had fork() behave as fork1() (child with just that single thread) when linked with -lpthread, but like forkall() (child with all threads) when linked with -lthread. Or that's what this Solaris 10 man page says. < 1238268613 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... CDE doesn't want to load atm < 1238268624 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that ever since I got this Linux laptop, nobody's bothered to log into it at all < 1238268639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you could do it by basically marking the pages as non-writable and then handle the page faults by copying the pages (and adding the writing flag back) < 1238268656 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I remember how x86 works correctly < 1238268700 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically it would be same thing as how swap works, except you only trigger on writing. Right? < 1238268752 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders why this pdf just opened with a zoom of 400%...
< 1238268817 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fork without copy on write is pointless < 1238268819 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our silly 16-processor "Tru64/OSF1 V5.1a" Alpha box seems to also have been let go. How sad. < 1238268829 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The vfork() function creates new processes without fully copying the address space of the old process." < 1238268833 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, Solaris 9 is non-cow < 1238268842 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, i haven't figured how to do compaction yet < 1238268845 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Solaris 9? < 1238268846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, not pointless. Rather the cow bit is rather new < 1238268848 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how modern's that < 1238268848 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: You mean lactose-intolerant?! < 1238268859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, "modern's"? < 1238268867 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's a contractoin < 1238268868 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :contraction < 1238268870 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heard of them? < 1238268878 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather new? < 1238268882 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think so < 1238268893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ah, not as in "ehird's client" or such then? < 1238268909 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern-is < 1238268914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"how cool's that?" < 1238268917 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how cool-is that < 1238268933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would say modernish probably or such < 1238268946 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's possible to have a simple compactor that runs synchronously < 1238268949 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what :D < 1238268949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's ridiculous AnMaster < 1238268954 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modernish means nothing like modern's < 1238268958 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean... what < 1238268962 0 :M0ny!n=Harmony@AToulouse-258-1-62-31.w90-55.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1238268962 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes no sense whatsoever < 1238268971 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: one of the meanings of "'s" is " is" < 1238268973 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so what would "ehird's" mean? "how ehird's car is that?" < 1238268974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238268986 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it doesn't make any sense < 1238269005 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and adjectives don't have a genetive, so in "modern's" it must be " is" < 1238269048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, hm. Let me go get that English grammar book downstairs... Think it was Oxford or Cambridge... < 1238269060 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: have fun doing that < 1238269064 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, oh? < 1238269074 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah you mean this is slang or? < 1238269089 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1238269090 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not slang < 1238269097 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just highly trivial < 1238269099 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you've heard it in things like "it's" < 1238269104 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can't believe you don't know it < 1238269105 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, yep. < 1238269107 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can use it pretty much anywhere. < 1238269145 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's slang in that you oxford might not say it's good english. < 1238269148 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*your < 1238269181 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob, oh possibly, I think it is from ~1985 anyway, so probably not worth even checking then < 1238269186 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then again are contractions ever < 1238269199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in 1985 we talked like the proper gentlemen that we were. < 1238269210 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ah good old jolly chap! < 1238269218 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1238269222 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's :jolly good old bean" < 1238269222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait.. I got them in wrong order didn't I? < 1238269223 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny because none of us were alive back then < 1238269226 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/:/"/ < 1238269229 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, ah yes < 1238269235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, when is "chap" used then? < 1238269242 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never. chap is phony bullshit! < 1238269254 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1238269266 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess Hollywood got that wrong too :) < 1238269466 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Our moon seems to disappear during an eclipse. Some people say this is because an old lady covers the moon with her cloak. She does this so that thieves cannot steal the shiny coins on the surface. Which of these would help scientists to prove or disprove this idea? < 1238269467 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A) Collect evidence from people who believe the lady sees the thieves < 1238269469 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :B) Shout to the lady that the thieves are coming < 1238269471 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C) Send a probe to the moon to search for coins < 1238269473 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D) Look for fingerprints < 1238269475 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :— http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/7967600.stm < 1238269477 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION facepalm
< 1238269517 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :absurd... < 1238269632 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look for fingerprints in what, exactly? < 1238269672 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i seem to remember memcached switching to a custom memory allocator after discovering malloc was too slow < 1238269676 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder how that works < 1238269682 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very hard < 1238269720 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1238269726 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think most non-mallocy memory allocation things use either sbrk to grow the data segment, or mmap to allocate. < 1238269731 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, simple even, 1) get some huge chunk of memory from system at the start or such, use malloc() or mmap() or whatever. From that point onwards allocate from this block < 1238269738 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: uh, no shit < 1238269754 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's step 2 that's interesting < 1238269755 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'AnMaster: uh, no shit' <-- how redundant < 1238269803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, yes then you need to find a good way to allocate for your app, it might be memory pool style with fixed item sizes if you always use the same size, or some other style. < 1238269811 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jesus lord < 1238269815 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I thought you asked about the first step rather than the second < 1238269818 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: :DD < 1238269827 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: now try this every day and you become me < 1238269842 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, you weren't precise enough in your question anyway. < 1238269863 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would suggest studding the source of various allocators if you want to know how they work. It can be rather interestign < 1238269867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting* < 1238269888 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i asked how the memcached memory allocator worked < 1238269892 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is that not precise enough? < 1238269895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The interwebs say it's a slab-style allocator. There's a free-list of all 2^n sizes for 64, 128, ... 1MB, and they just round up. < 1238269922 0 :Mony!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1238269931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, " i wonder how that works" I interpreted as custom allocators in general < 1238269946 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no memory fragmentation in the classic sense, but high overhead for wonky-sized allocations. < 1238269946 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238269947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, interesting < 1238269988 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, it seems x86_64 supports the following pages sizes: 4 kb, 2 MB, 4 MB, 1 GB < 1238270001 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting jump to 1 GB there.. < 1238270022 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: you mean internal rather than external fragmentation < 1238270038 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1238270056 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux kernel has that SLAB allocator for in-kernel use, and I think they relatively recently switched to SLUB ("unqueued allocator") as the default allocator there. I don't know how the newer one works. < 1238270080 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"minimizes cache line usage instead of managing queues of cached objects" is about all the help text says. < 1238270100 0 :kerlo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION frowns at the idea of "A is evidence for B" meaning something other than P(A and B) > P(A)*P(B)
< 1238270125 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sauna-time. → < 1238270127 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, iirc they recently changed to one called "SLUB", don't know the details < 1238270139 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is just what I said, isn't it? < 1238270146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes < 1238270148 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :misread < 1238270150 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: he has no scrollback, remember < 1238270180 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A single-line window with no scrollback would make for quite a surreal IRC experience. But → really. < 1238270195 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finns < 1238270197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you sauna < 1238270197 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1238270360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I agree about finns and saunas < 1238270373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though we have saunas in Sweden too we aren't as crazy about them < 1238270442 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, I have my ghc setup working < 1238270443 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just remembered < 1238270456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, did you have issues with ghc before? < 1238270465 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: bootstrapping ghc is a bitch. < 1238270468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1238270470 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it has some issues on os x < 1238270472 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you gotta patch i < 1238270472 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :t < 1238270474 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that "splitting the heap" thing with compacting gcs really bugs me < 1238270477 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :configure.ac and stuff < 1238270490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, iirc they provide binaries for most platforms that are already patched? < 1238270500 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that they do. < 1238270512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, so why did you need to build your own? < 1238270517 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're compiled with the extralibs package, which I don't want, and for something I use as heavily as ghc I like to compile my own < 1238270520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you aren't on gentoo! < 1238270528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ok < 1238270547 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll be easier next time < 1238270553 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I'll have a ghc already installed to bootstrap with < 1238270560 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw, do you have saunas in UK? < 1238270561 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the new build system they're making < 1238270563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1238270568 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ok < 1238270571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe. < 1238270579 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en-us&q=uk+sauna&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 < 1238270583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gay Sauna Listings < 1238270583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gay and gay friendly sauna listings for the whole of the UK. Simple easy to read layout make the list the most comprehensive on the Internet. < 1238270586 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah uh thanks. < 1238270589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1238270659 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1238270692 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: ping < 1238270694 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong < 1238270714 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: i get .cabal/config contains the stuff for docs & profiling, but what about when I'm manually installing a cabal package < 1238270720 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[like to get cabal-install's deps :P] < 1238270741 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: runhaskell Setup.hs configure --help < 1238270775 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see anything relevant < 1238270783 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--enable-profiling for the other < 1238270783 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1238270789 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't remember the other < 1238270806 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : haddock Generate Haddock HTML documentation. < 1238270811 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder if install will do that < 1238270835 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION modifies cabal-install's bootstrap.sh
< 1238270856 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: How can I make CMake use a C++ compiler which needs flags to work? It either looks for 'foo --bar' and says file not found or tries to test it using only 'foo sometestfile' which fails < 1238270874 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: does haddock go before or after build? < 1238270878 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :After < 1238270886 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, err you mean passing CXXFLAGS= < 1238270904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : --hoogle Generate a hoogle database < 1238270904 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like: CXX=foo CXXFLAGS="--blah" cmake .. < 1238270905 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh. < 1238270905 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I'm editing stuff in ccmake and putting them in CMAKE_CXX_FLAGS doesn't work < 1238270935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, ah you can't set CC or CXX there. Those two must be set before. Once cmake or ccmake starts they are fixed for this build directory < 1238270940 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know why < 1238270951 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, that makes sense. (Not!) < 1238270958 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, agreed it doesn't make sense. < 1238270972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error during cabal-install bootstrap: < 1238270972 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Haskell package 'parsec' is required but it is not installed. < 1238270975 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, however, not sure about the flags bit if it is needed to work < 1238270984 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you fucking install that, dipshit program < 1238270991 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you really need to be more specific about what the issue is < 1238270994 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Well, it expects you have the extralibs that come with GHC < 1238271004 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yeah, I don't want extralibs :) < 1238271027 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I'm trying to use 'schroot -pq -- g++' as my C++ compiler. < 1238271044 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And not succeeding. < 1238271107 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: --prefix=${HOME}/.cabal" < 1238271108 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238271110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hm.. < 1238271113 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that actually do anything? < 1238271115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has --user before < 1238271117 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I don't know < 1238271120 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1238271141 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, the easiest way is probably creating a shell script which runs that. like #!/bin/sh\nschroot -pq -- g++ "$@" < 1238271146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then using that as the C++ compiler < 1238271152 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: there's not --enable-profiling, just --enable-{library,program}-profiling < 1238271160 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I assume I just want library profiling? < 1238271163 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I suspect you can do it some other way too, I just got no idea how < 1238271172 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Well, unless you want profiled executables. :-P < 1238271179 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: what would that entail < 1238271188 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I don't know, I've never used it. < 1238271191 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ksu < 1238271193 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kay < 1238271194 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, stuff like: CC=$HOME/local/llvm/bin/llvm-gcc cmake .. works fine < 1238271199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Setup.hs: At least the following dependencies are missing: < 1238271199 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mtl -any < 1238271200 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kill nao < 1238271218 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mtl is needed by approximately every second program :-P < 1238271221 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill nao? why? Apart from the lag from europe < 1238271222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Europe* < 1238271235 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~~ < 1238271255 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Warning: The documentation for the following packages are not installed. No < 1238271255 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :links will be generated to these packages: rts-1.0 < 1238271256 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238271260 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: is that normal? < 1238271267 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Yes. < 1238271269 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Later" < 1238271276 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: can you generate docs for rts? < 1238271286 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so, no. < 1238271296 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kay < 1238271296 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can try. :-P < 1238271355 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Haskell package 'parsec' is required but it is not installed. < 1238271356 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1238271357 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just installed it < 1238271359 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? ? < 1238271368 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :og < 1238271369 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1238271371 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I installed parsec 3 < 1238271373 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wants 12 < 1238271374 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 < 1238271562 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yow, profiling libs compiles everything twice < 1238271566 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1238271577 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Yes, that's rather the whole point < 1238271582 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1238271635 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238271694 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gandolf.homelinux.org/~smhanov/blog/resume_comic.png "-1 Has Ph.D" s/programmers/shit \0/ < 1238271739 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I have no .cabal/config < 1238271789 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best create one then < 1238271799 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: You said read .cabal/config to see the defaults < 1238271805 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I create one htf do I do that < 1238271818 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: Have you run cabal-install even once? < 1238271823 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1238271830 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can edit the cabal configuration file to set defaults: < 1238271830 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-/ < 1238271830 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /Users/ehird/.cabal/config < 1238271831 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I can't. < 1238271880 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1238271883 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :had to run an actual operation < 1238271884 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Writing default configuration to /Users/ehird/.cabal/config " < 1238271924 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was nice and easy < 1238271949 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I am about to make you scream, with just three words. < 1238271953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "Nethack in Haskell". < 1238271972 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't make me scream < 1238271976 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning to rewrite it in Prolog < 1238271976 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ioccc.org/1987/wall.hint <- Perl v0.1 < 1238272003 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf68ca.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1238272027 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Silly compilers confusing =+ and += < 1238272038 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :itt: 1987 < 1238272060 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THINGS THAT MAKETH ME SAD: ghc doesn't work on osx/64bit < 1238272151 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THINGS THAT MAKETH ME KILL BITCHES: quitting ghci not stopping the lagfsest of "let a a= a" < 1238272153 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = a < 1238272293 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: but =+ was used in ancient C < 1238272312 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was later changed to += < 1238272315 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Yes, I know < 1238272317 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes he knows < 1238272333 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't stop me from calling them silly :-P < 1238272500 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : THINGS THAT MAKETH ME KILL BITCHES: quitting ghci not stopping the lagfsest of "let a a= a" <-- process still running invisible or something? < 1238272512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is confused
< 1238272518 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: forked ghc or sth < 1238272521 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1238272523 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is (let a a = a) a loop anyway? < 1238272540 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find it hard enough figuring out what it does at all < 1238272543 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I assume killing the relevant processes help? < 1238272544 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :helped* < 1238272550 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1238272555 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i said < 1238272556 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let a = a < 1238272559 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a correction < 1238272561 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, ok < 1238272563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: THINGS THAT MAKETH ME KILL BITCHES: quitting ghci not stopping the lagfsest of "let a a= a" < 1238272563 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:28 ehird: a = a < 1238272564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes a lot more sense < 1238272571 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: let a a = a is just \x -> x < 1238272573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aka id < 1238272583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because it's < 1238272583 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: That could easily have been a correction from 'a= a' to 'a = a' < 1238272587 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let a = \a -> a < 1238272589 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do the first and second as there have different scopes? < 1238272592 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the binding trivially shadows it < 1238272596 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1238272602 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just very confusing seeing that particular shadowing < 1238272608 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that's why shadowing is looked down on < 1238272622 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude> let a a a = a a a < 1238272622 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::1:6: < 1238272623 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Conflicting definitions for `a' < 1238272625 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the definition of `a' < 1238272633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude> let a = \a -> \a -> \a -> a a a < 1238272633 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::1:26: < 1238272634 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: t = t -> t -> t1 < 1238272638 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it does check for argument shadowing. < 1238273010 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1238273016 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cabal-install says I can upgrade cabal, haddock and process < 1238273022 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess upgrading cabal isn;t too clever < 1238273042 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, you can do that fairly safely IME < 1238273052 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haddock and process too? < 1238273057 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :process probably not < 1238273068 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why; what's wrong with upgrading process? < 1238273074 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a base lib < 1238273076 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GHC depends on it < 1238273085 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1238273087 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Upgrading such libraries tends to break things < 1238273099 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, I'll leave them unupgraded for now < 1238273101 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least, make it hard to get them working properly :-P < 1238273105 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haddock should be fine though < 1238273107 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would cabal even offer the possibility then? < 1238273112 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's scroll-down in less if you can't use the arrow keys? < 1238273118 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: j? < 1238273126 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: apparently not < 1238273128 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guessed j too < 1238273129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why can't you use the arrow keys though? < 1238273132 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: enter < 1238273135 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: space? < 1238273136 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why would j do it? < 1238273149 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: because I'm using CDE over X forwarding, and it doesn't seem to like arrows < 1238273157 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: vi keys < 1238273157 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enter < 1238273160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I guessed j because less is similar to vi < 1238273172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, enter and space works here < 1238273176 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :space jumps one page < 1238273179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :enter one line < 1238273181 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see what happened < 1238273185 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:44 ehird: ais523: enter < 1238273185 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it opened more, not les < 1238273187 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*less < 1238273189 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y'all blind? :P < 1238273192 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and more doesn't support arrow keys < 1238273192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, h opens help < 1238273194 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: enter worked fine < 1238273199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I saw it < 1238273204 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but everyone kept saying other things after < 1238273249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why more even exists? < 1238273256 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's older < 1238273281 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a stupid question < 1238273285 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does ed exist? < 1238273340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what do you gain with more? < 1238273359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it's smaller and simpler < 1238273373 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance, I imagine more is a better fit for busybox than less < 1238273390 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: more was made before less < 1238273394 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you don't even gain any memory unless the user scrolls down, but if the user waits until all output is produced you still have to wait as much < 1238273395 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you want a time machine or something < 1238273400 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :busybox more works, and busybox less doesn't < 1238273404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/wait as much/load as much/ < 1238273416 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: more is a smaller binary than less, I imagine < 1238273425 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : busybox more works, and busybox less doesn't <-- it has both iirc? < 1238273427 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my more is less(1) anyway < 1238273430 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wtf are you talking about < 1238273433 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ ls -l `which more` `which less` < 1238273434 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 30316 2008-09-25 14:08 /bin/more < 1238273436 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 120884 2008-02-02 03:51 /usr/bin/less < 1238273443 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, my busybox doesn't have less compiled in < 1238273448 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would it, that's missing the point of busybox < 1238273449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(~) more < 1238273449 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Missing filename ("less --help" for help) < 1238273450 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine has both < 1238273458 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) busybox emacs < 1238273459 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why should it have http at all? < 1238273459 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, interesting to see that more is in /bin but less is in /usr/bin < 1238273464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :httpd* < 1238273477 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a way more interesting question < 1238273487 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means that more has to fit on the root partition, but less can be in a separate /usr partition < 1238273500 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense, you have more for troubleshooting mount problems, and the larger less for everyday use < 1238273555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sources.busybox.net/index.py/trunk/busybox/networking/httpd.c?view=markup btw < 1238273566 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from time to time i reduce all learning into one integer, which simply measures the time spent learning, and start wondering whether it's actually any use studying, as people will learn from everything anyway < 1238273567 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :httpd makes senes < 1238273568 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sense < 1238273586 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean clearly there's a different learning factor for each activity < 1238273587 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, busybox httpd actually works on here < 1238273591 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how good the httpd is? < 1238273595 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it makes more sense than less < 1238273601 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you sleep, you won't learn as much as when actually studying < 1238273603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hah hah < 1238273606 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :busybox httpd is a very small and simple httpd < 1238273611 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :busybox more is a very small and simple more < 1238273614 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, was the pun unintentional? < 1238273615 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it has a config size < 1238273620 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: file < 1238273622 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and does cgi < 1238273636 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: still pretty simple compared to most < 1238273638 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for some reason my intuitive factors oscillate between sensible values, and equals for all activities < 1238273642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well? < 1238273643 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just wanted to share this < 1238273643 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i agree < 1238273649 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use it wisely < 1238273733 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that httpd is 743 lines with comments, cpp and blank lines stripped < 1238273737 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1238273739 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not cpp removed < 1238273744 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cc -E httpd.c | sed 's/#.*//' | sed '/^$/d' < 1238273751 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty small for its features < 1238273755 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1238273758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, it uses some commented out areas with #if 0 though < 1238273761 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not accurate < 1238273765 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: cc -E < 1238273767 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :removes those < 1238273768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1238273768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1238273805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, -E would include headers though < 1238273909 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: it ony lincludes libbb.h < 1238273913 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I don't have, so that works fine < 1238273919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah true < 1238274178 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this mouse wheel is unfortunately tall; finger that rests on it's hurting < 1238274190 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: you rest a finger on the mouse wheel? < 1238274196 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1238274200 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I use a mouse, I have a finger on left-click and a finger on right-click < 1238274208 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and move from left-click to wheel to use the wheel < 1238274213 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I use the scrollwheel every few seconds, and I middle click to open links in a new tab < 1238274219 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, same for me < 1238274223 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use the middle button and wheel more than the right button < 1238274249 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :index finger on left button, middle finger on scrollwheel, ring finger on right button < 1238274266 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wish I was polydactyl < 1238274282 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be awesom < 1238274283 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1238274287 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :index finger on right, middle finger on left for me, or the opposite. I tend to use the mouse equally well with either hand < 1238274356 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always move the index finger when scrolling though it seems < 1238274366 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: are you polydactyl < 1238274370 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seem the type < 1238274376 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: so have you started writing that gc yet? < 1238274402 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: no, because it'd be like 35 lines in a scripting lang [for a prototype i don't care about speed] < 1238274404 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only issue is that I can type well with only left hand, but not with only right < 1238274413 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: NO < 1238274416 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you must write in C < 1238274468 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: fu _|_ < 1238274483 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the gc itself would be trivial but i cba to write memory management shit for a proof of concept interp < 1238274517 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :trival = not fast < 1238274554 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: i said proof of concept < 1238274573 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure I could spend my whole life perfecting it like the boehm guys but I don't want to at first, just want to prove it works < 1238274574 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the concept is already prooft < 1238274586 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never seen an impl. < 1238274615 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? < 1238274630 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I want to write one. < 1238274647 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so write a fast one < 1238274676 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? that's wasted work until I can prove it works well < 1238274680 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and doesn't sound as fun. < 1238274770 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, ehird is right in this case. < 1238274794 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: retract that statement, not because ehird is wrong but because it'll cause a rift in the universe if you personally say that too much < 1238274817 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i'm talking with a slight swedish accent these days < 1238274823 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can I panic now? < 1238274867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't panic. < 1238274875 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that confirms it < 1238274875 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION hopes ehird is lying, to save the integrity of their brain
< 1238274876 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION panics
< 1238274895 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just quoting HHGTTG < 1238274898 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh I'm sorry, do you need ~ markers to detect jokes? ;P < 1238274904 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1238274908 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: not normally < 1238274911 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even that time < 1238274911 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1238274913 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1238274914 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1238274916 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA < 1238274918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, even I saw it was a joke... < 1238274918 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1238274920 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the mere possibility you weren't joking was too horrible to contemplate < 1238274930 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you all missed the metajoke < 1238274932 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jerks < 1238274933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I thought ais523 was meta-joking... < 1238274934 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1238274943 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:14 ehird: ais523: oh I'm sorry, do you need ~ markers to detect jokes? ;P <---- this is something AnMaster would say < 1238274951 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I thought someone was metajoking, but I couldn't figure out who < 1238274953 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially the ;P < 1238274962 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I mentally filter out smileys < 1238274965 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they tend not to mean much anyway < 1238274966 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA was the last vestiges of ehird panicing inside < 1238274968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, aren't we still meta-joking? < 1238274971 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from :>, because it brings back fond memories < 1238274971 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238274982 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, I think we've got up to at least two metas now < 1238274982 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, fond memories or what? < 1238274984 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe three < 1238274987 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: *of? < 1238274991 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, four in my count < 1238274992 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and eso-std.org < 1238274993 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, yes < 1238274996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1238274998 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I fly around in a spaceship :> < 1238275013 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still parked, by the way < 1238275024 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every time I read that line I get a full mental picture of the lil' :> smiley in a tiny spaceship buzzing around space < 1238275042 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's not parked parked; i could renew it for the regular cost right now < 1238275065 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I get a mental image of a spaceship that looks like a :> < 1238275081 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, that wasn't the intention, the :> was what the author of the sentence looked like < 1238275094 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose a :> spaceship could work, but it's less amusing IMO < 1238275104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so which side of the keyboard you prefer to put the mouse on? Or are you equally good with either side? < 1238275114 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: er, right handed people at right sid < 1238275115 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1238275117 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :left at left < 1238275124 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, I manage both equally well < 1238275131 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you're ambidextrous < 1238275140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, yet I'm right handed when I use a pencil < 1238275149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't use a pencil with my left hand at all really < 1238275160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you're ambisinistrous < 1238275180 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and for fork/knife I'm definitely left handed. Always swap compared to the usual style < 1238275189 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://moonpatio.com/vacuum/gallery/dblist.html < 1238275193 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://moonpatio.com/vacuum/ < 1238275228 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a long on a 64 bit platform is 64 bits right? < 1238275233 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1238275236 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an int should be but isn't. < 1238275260 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, depend on *which* 64-bit platform... < 1238275270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but usually yes < 1238275271 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: the answer is 'yes' < 1238275301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, Not always. < 1238275305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually yes < 1238275344 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: did you try my Enigma level, btw? < 1238275362 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope; relink and i'll dl < 1238275417 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION digs out the URL
< 1238275447 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://filebin.ca/gexxmq/ais52306_1.xml < 1238275448 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb -> < 1238275450 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if it's still there < 1238275458 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird, Is it specified anywhere that long corresponds to machine word size? < 1238275464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seemed to say so above < 1238275465 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1238275471 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in theory int corresponds to machine word size < 1238275475 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that fails on an 8-bit system < 1238275478 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and on some 64-bit systems < 1238275488 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in practice, long corresponds to machine word on 32 and 64 bit < 1238275492 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in theory that's incorrect < 1238275508 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, C99 specs indicate that long must be at least 32 bits. It specifies minimum acceptable values for LONG_MAX and such < 1238275518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C89 indicates that long's at least 32, too < 1238275529 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means it never corresponds to machine word if the machine word's shorter than 32 < 1238275530 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would fail on a 8-bit machine < 1238275536 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1238275540 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back when systems were either 16 or 32, int was the one that corresponded to word size < 1238275552 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but so many programmers assumed int=32 that most 64-bit C compilers also have int=32 < 1238275564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though int=64 is theoretically correct on those < 1238275578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, thus long is 64 bits in practise on 64-bit platforms, but it isn't guaranteed. < 1238275581 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not to mention, you'd have to use int16_t to get a 16-bit int, because short would presumably be 32-bit) < 1238275584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, might be useful to know < 1238275605 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in theory, long can be 128 on a 64-bit platform, but nobody does that < 1238275616 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally even long long is 64, although it can be 128 < 1238275626 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, in practise long long is also 64 bits on 64 bit platforms iirc < 1238275634 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1238275637 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about long long long long long long? < 1238275638 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1238275644 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: only two longs can be stacked < 1238275644 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, syntax error I think < 1238275652 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no, it's equivalent to long long I think < 1238275660 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like you can write const const int and it works, IIRC < 1238275662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, use C99 and then include stdint.h. Much better < 1238275666 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure, though < 1238275667 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use int32_t and such < 1238275675 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stdint doesn't have int128 does it? < 1238275684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, that is non-standard < 1238275693 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood, most implementations doesn't have it < 1238275701 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GCC does as __int128_t < 1238275719 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stdint is allowed to have an int128_t by the standard < 1238275722 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it isn't mandatory < 1238275732 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1238275735 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, it's allowed to have an intN_t for any N < 1238275741 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if it isn't a multiple of the bitwidth of char, IIRC < 1238275749 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, intt_t? < 1238275750 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1238275754 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int3_t* < 1238275754 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although uintN_t must have N a multiple of CHAR_BIT < 1238275762 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, that would make no sense < 1238275763 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because uintN_t can't have padding < 1238275774 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, err... why can't they? < 1238275778 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes it would, most likely it would be stored in one byte, with 3 bits value and 5 bits padding < 1238275781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because the standard says so < 1238275790 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d87/peavypeavy/farnsworth.jpg < 1238275792 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any reason for the no padding bit? < 1238275812 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: presumably so you can specify exact-sizes properly < 1238275824 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't care about exact size, why aren't you using uint_fastN_t? < 1238275826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what about bit addressable systems? < 1238275838 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: C doesn't support those directly < 1238275842 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because CHAR_BIT has to be at least 8 < 1238275849 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, maybe because you need to optimise memory usage rather than speed in the specific application? < 1238275856 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uint_leastN_t, then < 1238275870 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah true, forgot about that one < 1238275943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does most system only use ring 0 and ring 3? I mean there are two more levels in between on x86... < 1238275960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would they be useful for anyway? < 1238276155 0 :k!n=kar8nga@a-54.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238276178 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1238276180 0 :k!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :kar8nga < 1238276299 0 :revcompgeek!n=revcompg@74.249.sfcn.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1238276688 0 :FireFly!n=FireFly@1-1-3-36a.tul.sth.bostream.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1238277263 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh some x86 data structures are crazy < 1238277280 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a processor has datastructures? < 1238277282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean 20 bit field for segment limit? < 1238277294 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, stuff like TLBs, segment descriptors and such < 1238277315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not TLBs, they are the caches for the page translations < 1238277326 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you can see segments, you're likely to be doing it wrong < 1238277332 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, you know about interrupt vectors? < 1238277346 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, what? < 1238277371 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the first thing most modern OSes do on the x86 is turn off segmentation < 1238277386 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, well yes, but the registers are still used partly for some stuff < 1238277389 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are x86 interrupt vectors like? < 1238277390 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in 64-bit mode < 1238277406 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, don't remember off hand. Anyway the page entries have crazy formats too < 1238277433 0 :ais523_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client" < 1238277670 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, the stuff it pushes on the stack though for interrupt vectors seems crazy < 1238277707 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, packed odd sized words... < 1238277718 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1238277727 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1238277756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, I'm reading the AMD64 docs btw.. < 1238277830 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1238277864 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1238277879 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, ever seen the x87 saved state format? It is possibly even worse < 1238277895 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is used during task switching to store and restore the register state < 1238277921 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :80-bit FP stack saved in a funny way? < 1238277952 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, yes and SSE registers are saved into some reserved space in there :D < 1238277958 0 :revcompgeek!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1238278014 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :causing slow context-switches, surely? < 1238278099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, not really, also the OS can do it lazily, that is set some flag that causes an interrupt when the app tries to use floating point, thus avoiding setting it up when not used < 1238278102 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238278113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know Linux makes use of that, at least in recent versions < 1238278114 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, cool beens < 1238278170 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I heard of it first in Synthesis (which you must have read about) < 1238278183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err what? < 1238278208 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway the format of the dump from FSAVE is described using a diagram which covers two pages in the pdf < 1238278217 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: (ah, you might be interested to read about the synthesis OS then) < 1238278236 0 :ais523!n=ais523@147.188.254.128 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238278244 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, link? < 1238278259 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waitamo < 1238278259 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: New CCBI/Mycology up. < 1238278275 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(its idea is that you don't do lots of ifs and table lookups every time someone wants to read a load of bytes froma file, instead you compile a custom reading function when the open the file.) < 1238278282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, oh? Nice < 1238278315 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Link? < 1238278330 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: iki.fi/deewiant < 1238278358 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks
< 1238278397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, not sure how much that would help. Also self modifying code would mean invalidating lots of cache lines < 1238278402 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1238278412 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so usually not a good idea for files < 1238278473 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does G in STRN do? < 1238278506 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=10.1.1.29.4871 < 1238278525 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Reads a zero-terminated string from funge-space with a fixed delta of x=1, y...=0. < 1238278543 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1238278543 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and it infinite-loops if there isn't a zero < 1238278569 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION started doing teh lottery
< 1238278571 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's pretty hard to test for a tight infinite loop using nothing but standard Befunge... < 1238278571 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks to Mycology most interpreters actually reflect there :-P < 1238278576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1238278583 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeah, that was my original thought < 1238278588 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: how? by checking the entire Lahey-line to see if there isn't a 0? < 1238278593 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to be a millionaire < 1238278612 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: seriously? the lottery has negative expectation, on average you lose money < 1238278613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah postscript.. heh < 1238278615 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no matter what you do < 1238278628 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Once you've come back to where you started you know there's no 0 < 1238278633 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure oklowob's reality-warping properties can help there. < 1238278635 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yep < 1238278638 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but it has a great standard deviation, and that's all that matters if you only live once < 1238278650 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually runtime specialising constants is a cool idea... < 1238278655 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: err... but what if you lose rather than win? < 1238278658 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's more likely, after all < 1238278658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was considering it for cfunge (seriously) < 1238278665 0 :tombom!i=tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1238278676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean I can know if tracing is enabled once I parsed arguments < 1238278677 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's much more probably to become a millionaire playing lottery than playing a game with smaller prices and 99% expectation < 1238278680 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*probable < 1238278691 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: well, yes < 1238278697 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but on average, you'll lose more than a million pounds trying < 1238278703 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you don't /have/ a million pounds < 1238278710 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i won't live nearly long enough to use that much < 1238278722 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll probably stop after losing a few thousand < 1238278724 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but he weighs a million pounds < 1238278726 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*rimshot* < 1238278731 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a rubbish rimshot < 1238278736 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at least i've given perfect life a shot < 1238278746 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't say a million is enough for a perfect life nowaday < 1238278748 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nowadays < 1238278758 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd be hard-pressed to buy a 1-bedroom house in Central London for that < 1238278780 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, iirc you reflect if you pass the edge at all? < 1238278783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in G I mean < 1238278795 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I think that is what you made me implement as a result. IIRC < 1238278798 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ah, but the code do < 1238278800 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Possibly... that's a bug then ;-) < 1238278803 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1238278809 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you suggested that iirc. < 1238278809 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure is, you can get two pizzas every day just from the interest < 1238278810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1238278821 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant, the problem of chache lines is analysed in the paper < 1238278827 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, it's UNDEF as usual. < 1238278838 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: You could also argue that since G doesn't do space-suppression, passing the edge means you have to return an infinite string. < 1238278841 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: why would i want a bigger house than i have now < 1238278843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, not going to be corrected for this version anyway < 1238278852 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Ah right, that'd explain why. < 1238278854 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: not a case of bigger, it's a case of nearer < 1238278861 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not at today's interest rates you won't < 1238278865 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1238278865 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: What fizzie said. < 1238278870 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just want to be able to universitize all my life < 1238278874 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I reflect though < 1238278893 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Funge doesn't support infinite strings. < 1238278895 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: you'd be hard-pressed even paying international university fees + accomodation on the interest from a million pounds < 1238278899 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the uni is about 500 meters away < 1238278901 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So reflecting is the only option. < 1238278902 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, ok < 1238278947 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :international maybe not. finnish definitely yes. < 1238278950 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, indeed. Also you could argue that it was due to OOM. My computer doesn't support a string that is 2^31 chars (and even less 2^63) < 1238278951 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: You could fake it by marking that particular stack-stack to return 32 on underflow instead of 0. Although then there's y and such. < 1238278959 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I have 1.5 GB RAM "only" < 1238278985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :though you could write a bit at either extreme < 1238278986 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Heh. < 1238278986 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1238279011 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: And yes, that's exactly why. < 1238279034 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway I think fizzie's explanation makes sense < 1238279043 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why I will continue to reflect < 1238279079 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you sure? You could save a few cycles by looping infinitely ;-) < 1238279090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah hah < 1238279109 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, profiling doesn't show it as a major bottle neck currently < 1238279116 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer to spend time where it actually helps < 1238279129 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: For kicks you can try the 64-bit CCBI binary and see how slow it is < 1238279146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, 32-bit or 64-bit funge space? < 1238279165 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure actually. Probably 32-bit. < 1238279167 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int_fast32_t. < 1238279197 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I thought it was D not C..? < 1238279213 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I've told you many times before that the D standard libraries include the C standard library. < 1238279234 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well here that ends up as 64-bit < 1238279238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On this box, based on a very cursory header-look, I've got an 8-bit int_fast8_t, and 64-bit in_fast{16,32,64}_t. < 1238279242 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope your y reflects that correctly Deewiant? < 1238279246 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders how easy it would be to write a Funge-98-like interp that gets a BAD on every single test in Mycology that it can without exiting, yet nevertheless manages to run through to the end
< 1238279247 0 :GregorR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1238279251 0 :GregorR!n=gregor@65.183.185.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238279256 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Of course. < 1238279279 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway that is plain wrong. 32-bit funge space is always faster for cfunge on x86/x86_64 < 1238279282 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Relatively easy. < 1238279306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, there are a few tests you must do GOOD on to continue though < 1238279336 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I know, that's why I said "without exiting" < 1238279337 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone link current mycology? < 1238279348 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iki.fi/deewiant < 1238279351 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even more interestingly, is it possible to fail sanity.bf yet pass mycology.bf? < 1238279357 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No. < 1238279368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Archive: ccbi-linux-x86.zip < 1238279368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : inflating: ccbi-linux/ccbi < 1238279368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :replace ccbi-linux/changelog.txt? [y]es, [n]o, [A]ll, [N]one, [r]ename: y < 1238279370 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, very fun < 1238279375 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try different directory names < 1238279385 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that was intentional. < 1238279392 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe it might fail on small files for some reason < 1238279423 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you managed to get the +x bit correct this time. Congrats! < 1238279435 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, I'm on Linux. < 1238279462 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it's 4 bytes here. < 1238279464 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: that's not current mycology, but thanks anyway < 1238279473 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: It's close enough. < 1238279475 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, then D differs from C. < 1238279489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ time ~/src/cfunge/trunk/other/ccbi/ccbi_linux/ccbi.32 mycology.b98 >/dev/null < 1238279489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.631s < 1238279489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.599s < 1238279489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.018s < 1238279502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : time ~/src/cfunge/trunk/other/ccbi/ccbi_linux/ccbi.64 mycology.b98 >/dev/null < 1238279502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.663s < 1238279502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.612s < 1238279502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.038s < 1238279519 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's somewhat unexpected. < 1238279531 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, still quite a bit to go to reach even cfunge with full env and output to stdout < 1238279536 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yes, that's why i thanked < 1238279554 0 :neldoret1!n=user@81-223-127-237.stpeter.xdsl-line.inode.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1238279555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, when not redirecting ccbi to /dev/null I get times around real 0m0.812s < 1238279572 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 0m0.895s for the 64-bit one < 1238279574 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :got that's a lot of befunge < 1238279576 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*god < 1238279579 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why the 32-bit one is faster. < 1238279600 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably asked this, but is that time traveling thing tested? (TRDS?) < 1238279603 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, no idea. Maybe your compiler sucks? < 1238279607 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklowob: mycotrds.b98 is there. < 1238279610 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhh < 1238279610 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: LLVM... < 1238279611 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, also didn't you test locally? < 1238279620 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I didn't time them. < 1238279623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, that should work well < 1238279625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :llvm I mean < 1238279634 0 :revcompgeek!n=revcompg@74.249.sfcn.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1238279636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what CPU did you optimise for though? < 1238279646 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either my own or none? < 1238279650 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for me you would need whatever means the same as GCC's -march=k8 < 1238279657 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't pass any -march < 1238279661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well -march=k8 -msse3 < 1238279662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even < 1238279724 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For LDC it's -mcpu and not -march, evidently. In any case, I guess it's best to not do anything for public binaries. < 1238279798 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I've just noticed something in your Mycology testing output < 1238279802 0 :neldoreth!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :No route to host < 1238279804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, oh ok. I always do that when comparing. setting CFLAGS='-O3 -march=k8 -msse3' at least < 1238279809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're marking programs as wrong when they claim the path separator is / on Windows < 1238279812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have tested and found that: < 1238279817 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Quite. < 1238279819 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-O3 -march=k8 -msse3 -ftree-vectorise -DNDEBUG -pipe -fweb -ftracer -frename-registers -fprefetch-loop-arrays -fomit-frame-pointer -fmodulo-sched -fgcse-sm -fgcse-las -fgcse-after-reload -funsafe-loop-optimizations -fno-math-errno -fno-trapping-math -ftree-loop-linear -ftree-loop-im -ftree-loop-ivcanon -fivopts -fvariable-expansion-in-unroller -fbranch-target-load-optimize < 1238279821 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works very well < 1238279825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah insane I know < 1238279828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern Windows supports either / or \ as the path separator, certain methods of determining the separator on Windows give / as the output < 1238279830 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because after all it works < 1238279831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is gcc 4.1.2 too < 1238279858 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It doesn't work in all contexts, which is why I'd prefer \. < 1238279874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\ doesn't work in all contexts either, IIRC < 1238279878 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION waits for anyone to comment on that list above...
< 1238279879 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I wonder how much difference the UPX compression makes? < 1238279881 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Really? < 1238279885 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: For CCBI, that is. < 1238279889 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, oh that would slow down definitely < 1238279890 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure, I haven't used Windows for ages < 1238279893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is my experience < 1238279896 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you're trying to create a file called CON or something < 1238279897 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, try removing that < 1238279897 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, but how much. < 1238279908 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a trick involving multiple forwards slashes and various other incantations < 1238279911 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I don't remember. time it yourself < 1238279919 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I haven't used UPX for years < 1238279931 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, apparently prefixing \\.\ works too < 1238279937 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe it can be done with just backslashes < 1238279948 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I don't have cfunge to test against, since bzr is broken. < 1238279960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, your bzr is broken? huh < 1238279968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, even 0.92 should work iirc... < 1238279968 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Not mine, all bzr are broken. < 1238279975 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I posted the bug report earlier today. < 1238279975 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1238279976 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should've used ctdrl, eh? < 1238279977 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what do you mean all bzr are broken? < 1238279985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, how are they broken? < 1238279988 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-03-28 15:15:34 ( Deewiant) Yay, bzr assumes that gethostname() returns ASCII < 1238279990 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and which bug report < 1238279992 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-03-28 15:16:48 ( Deewiant) https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/193089 < 1238279992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1238279999 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i spent all night optimizing PyFunge... (it's 6:30 AM here) it's now 20x faster than original. hmm. < 1238280006 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, err how does that affect cfunge? < 1238280019 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It means that no matter what bzr command I run it crashes at start. < 1238280032 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ host 67.202.82.20 < 1238280032 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20.82.202.67.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer rage.kuonet.org. < 1238280039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you mean local host < 1238280040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1238280041 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: My hostname, not yours. < 1238280050 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ponders an alternative way of making unlambda palindromes
< 1238280065 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: -mcpu=core2 made practically no difference for CCBI here, maybe 0.01s. < 1238280069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, Read the last comment to that bug < 1238280073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I don't have a core2 < 1238280085 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, but I do, my point being that the difference is likely to be small. < 1238280090 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway for cfunge -msse3 does make a difference since I use -ftree-vectorise < 1238280101 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, I read it and laughed: "we should probably" a year ago. < 1238280105 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can every bzr everywhere be broken < 1238280112 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely they wouldn't have pushed an update that didn't work? < 1238280115 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hm < 1238280123 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: A bug tends to affect all binaries, not just one. ;-) < 1238280138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I mean, why didn't they test before distributing the binaries? < 1238280140 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Of course, whether that bug affects you or not depends on various things, but the bug still exists. < 1238280144 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, it is broken when you have a hostname like ööö.lan < 1238280146 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1238280147 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I hate to say it, but I think it's your fault for having a "funny" hostname. < 1238280154 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not "why does the bug affect all binaries", but "why did they let everyone have a buggy binary" < 1238280162 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: is the non-ascii hostname common btw? < 1238280165 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Bugs happen, you can't fix them all. < 1238280167 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: I doubt it. < 1238280174 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, I figured someone would say that. :-P < 1238280177 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: does PyFunge pass Mycology yet? < 1238280180 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes. < 1238280182 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, actually is that even valid? I mean DNS uses the odd -- notation for a reason < 1238280183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238280190 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No reason why it shouldn't be. < 1238280195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to agree with fizzie here < 1238280196 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'll test. < 1238280203 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test with it.* < 1238280232 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway, fix your hostname I'd say < 1238280246 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I don't want to. < 1238280256 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um i thought there was international agreement that unicode hostnames were to be made legal < 1238280258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I think it isn't valid currently. < 1238280275 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not a valid DNS name as-is, but I don't see why it couldn't be a hostname. < 1238280276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, err what about the punnycode thing or whatever the name was. < 1238280281 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I'd rather that programs wouldn't do stupid things like crash on non-ASCII. < 1238280293 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway why should it care about encoding at all < 1238280297 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly. < 1238280299 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is just bytes for gods sake < 1238280302 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1238280302 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly! < 1238280304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is python < 1238280309 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i didn't read the conversation < 1238280310 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It is also X.org and KDE. < 1238280311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a high level unicodeish stringy < 1238280315 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they need to show the bytes to the user. < 1238280316 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, err? < 1238280320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, they crash too? < 1238280321 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Two other things that have broken. < 1238280333 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or I'm not 100% sure about KDE. < 1238280339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that's up to the terminal! < 1238280349 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, how should the system know what encoding is used < 1238280351 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't < 1238280352 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But 'iceauth' in X.org had a completely pointless isascii() check for the whole of the hostname. < 1238280355 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Locales! < 1238280371 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well I use sv_SE locally on some system that has en_US for root < 1238280374 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where I don't have root < 1238280382 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want locales, then gethostname should return the name in the current ctype. < 1238280383 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any case, Postel's law, for crying out loud. < 1238280383 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, still think locale makes sense? < 1238280391 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes? < 1238280397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, the locale that root user could differ from the user locale < 1238280399 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well... it seems to be unbuffered I/O still get BAD < 1238280400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is even common < 1238280404 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: So use the root user's locale? < 1238280408 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: O_o < 1238280414 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: It shouldn't, I tested it < 1238280418 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :message has been changed but condition looks same < 1238280422 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, how would you be able to find that in a distro independent way? < 1238280423 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't < 1238280425 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: by the way, are you planning to get comparisons between Befunge-93 interps using Mycology-93? < 1238280427 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... starnge. < 1238280432 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Nope. < 1238280436 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Most of them work. < 1238280437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, your idea just doesn't work. < 1238280440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :period. < 1238280441 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well, I suppose so < 1238280448 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are lots of fun corner cases in -93 too < 1238280453 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Is there no way to find it out? < 1238280459 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance interfunge crashes if given a program bigger than 80x25, rather than trimming it < 1238280465 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think that's legit behaviour < 1238280475 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, well you could have a list of distros and try to find the relevant file in /etc, which varies between distros < 1238280480 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some might not even have it there at all < 1238280484 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: And in any case, how likely is it that you run sv_SE.iso88591 under en_US.utf8 or whatever < 1238280485 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't think that is a good idea at all < 1238280496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, the opposite happened though < 1238280525 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: In which case there'd be no special characters in the hostname since it's en_US :-P < 1238280533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, fr_CA.isowhatever for system and locally I used sv_SE.utf8 < 1238280542 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1238280542 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that could have odd chars < 1238280569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I don't even remember what distro it was, it might have been bsd even < 1238280582 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway point is you can't really solve this < 1238280590 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'd say: tough luck < 1238280591 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iconv exists. < 1238280599 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: http://pastie.org/430096 < 1238280613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, how can you figure out what encoding is used?... A lot of strings could be several < 1238280619 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Personally I would really not rather mix up gethostname and locales. < 1238280624 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, same < 1238280632 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say "not a bug" for that bzr bug < 1238280636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I was a developer < 1238280636 0 :revcompgeek!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1238280640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of bzr) < 1238280642 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it screwed stack and terminates early. < 1238280647 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: So what's your 1y pushing?? < 1238280663 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is 0x01, the later is 0x11 < 1238280676 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, did you fix that incorrectly? heh < 1238280684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in change the text but not the check < 1238280686 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, it was already broken. < 1238280694 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, I'm not that stupid. :-P < 1238280735 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION analyzes the forest of funge codes
< 1238280738 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: What exact value? 0b10011? < 1238280742 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : That this Funge has 1 dimensions < 1238280744 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BAD: should be 2, or we wouldn't have got this far < 1238280746 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beautiful < 1238280748 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: yes < 1238280757 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, it is off by one in the stack < 1238280767 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ah, ok < 1238280769 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, he already said 0x11 < 1238280773 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still a beautiful error message though < 1238280774 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They still could easily make the bzr code not *crash* when given strange bytes from gethostname, and that way make it more robust. < 1238280780 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Right, x and not b < 1238280783 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Misread < 1238280805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, you should be able to convert that to binary easily :P < 1238280820 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm no good at reading hexadecimal < 1238280829 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00010001 < 1238280834 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty good at reading hex < 1238280838 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1> io:format("~.2B~n", [16#11]). < 1238280838 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10001 < 1238280843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what I would do < 1238280855 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erlang rocks for working with unusual bases for numbers < 1238280865 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"bc" works for that too. < 1238280871 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, now it works only for 0b11111 or anything below 0b10000. < 1238280884 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, how did you manage that? < 1238280905 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, but I have a hunch. < 1238280922 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why q(). in erlang returns you to a prompt and then quits about a second later < 1238280933 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it is async but it seems a bit weird < 1238280945 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also that is just a erlang shell mapping to init:stop() iirc) < 1238280983 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1238281014 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man, this piece of code is starting to annoy me. < 1238281017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, interesting hostname btw. Why did you select that? < 1238281022 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is like the 20th time I've fixed it. < 1238281039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, test it for all possible combinations. There aren't that many < 1238281040 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Is it visible somewhere? < 1238281059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, it says "bartimäus" in https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/193089 yes < 1238281059 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1238281063 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, I know, the problem is more fixing it. < 1238281066 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Not my bug report. < 1238281069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1238281075 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I thought you said it was? < 1238281081 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You thought wrong. < 1238281085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so what is your host name then? < 1238281094 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it matter? :-P < 1238281120 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Yes. If it's sufficently funny, we might let you keep it. < 1238281129 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, anyway my plan is to release cfunge 0.4 on Monday. Just FYI. < 1238281134 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to keep it anyway and bitch at broken programs < 1238281148 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :POSIX gethotname just says it returns a null-terminated array of bytes, and does not specify any limits except a maximum length of HOST_NAME_MAX bytes, so we don't even have the law on our side, really. < 1238281161 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gethotname? < 1238281162 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238281172 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/hot/host/ < 1238281178 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, that would be a useful library function. < 1238281185 0 :oklowob!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1238281193 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could just call gethotname() when I need a name for a project. < 1238281265 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :host names are defined as "network host names" it seems < 1238281278 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but that does not really imply any rules. < 1238281318 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 'nodename' field for uname is defined to "contain the name of this node within an implementation-defined communications network". < 1238281365 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And anyway, you could argue that it's legal and sensible to have a (say, UTF-8) hostname and a punycoded unicode-DNS-name pointing at that host. < 1238281452 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't, though. < 1238281536 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS X probably has a reasonably well-defined encoding for the host name, actually; and I'm sure non-ascii names are far more common there, since it's very logical to write funny characters in pretty dialogs. < 1238281552 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"it's very logical to write funny characters in pretty dialogs" < 1238281553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1238281555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1238281556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1238281562 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows also. < 1238281582 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, I guess his point was that command line users know to be careful with non-ASCII. < 1238281587 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With an interface that pretty, I personally would have the feeling that it's okay to stuff unicode in. < 1238281619 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though gethostname() on OS X seems to do some sort of magic related to reverse-lookups and whatnot, based on the fact that the hostname shown in bash prompt tends to change when I connect to different wlans and such. < 1238281634 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :While the defined-in-the-pretty-dialog "computer name" does not. < 1238281657 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, I'd guess it uses that name *somehow* if there's no network connection. < 1238281904 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On that system the hostname corresponds to a kern.hostname sysctl entry, but I can't find any documentation about what "string" there means, encoding-wise. Just the property names are specified to be ASCII. < 1238281980 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hostname shown in bash prompt tends to change when I connect to different wlans and such" < 1238281983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how irritating < 1238281993 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, that would seriously suck < 1238281996 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, Linux sysctl syscall manpage: "Glibc does not provide a wrapper for this system call; call it using syscall(2). Or rather... don’t call it: use of this system call has long been discouraged, and it is so unloved that *it is likely to disappear in a future kernel version*. Remove it from your programs now; use the /proc/sys interface instead." < 1238282000 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope you can turn it off < 1238282021 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't seen how to turn it on, but generally most things tend to be possible. < 1238282024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, yeah because it was a pain to maintain iirc < 1238282048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, for gentoo just tell dhcpcd to not accept hostname < 1238282071 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: show me some nonsense < 1238282072 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: mine*: made by the way. it captures its prey by remaining very still and blending into the dust; the red marble table in front of him does not imply being happy and that another covered his ears, and elrond their child. ( knight of the tatra mountains. < 1238282073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :config_eth0=( "dhcp" ) < 1238282073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dhcp_eth0="nodns nontp nonis nosendhost" < 1238282082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1238282085 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nodns isn't for that < 1238282096 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is because I have a local caching dns server < 1238282123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, nethack? < 1238282123 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: trolls are born again. < 1238282131 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1238282133 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1238282133 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher ic irc lovecraft nethack* pa speeches ss wp < 1238282134 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :direct quote? < 1238282138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style nethack < 1238282138 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Selected style: nethack (NetHack 3.4.3 data.base, rumors.tru, rumors.fal) < 1238282140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about trolls < 1238282140 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite probable. < 1238282166 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rumors.fal:They say that most trolls are born again. < 1238282219 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure why that's classified as a false rumor, since I think trolls do revive? Unless you do something to the corpse, anyway. < 1238282229 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Mycology should be fixed now. < 1238282235 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1238282242 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1238282253 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't try all 32 permutations but it really should work this time. :-P < 1238282277 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That wikia-nethack-thing has some very "practical" methods for troll removal: "Completely fill the level with monsters so that the troll has nowhere to revive." < 1238282292 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Does it work now? < 1238282360 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nighr < 1238282362 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night* < 1238282364 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1238282379 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mailman2.u.washington.edu/pipermail/alpine-info/2008-September/001220.html says that iPhones can have UTF-8 hostnames. < 1238282393 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well, that's the only known way to get rid of the Horsemen of the Apocalypse < 1238282399 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you may as well kill spare trolls while you're at it < 1238282402 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: `?d`?c`?d`?c`?d`?c`?d``v````````````.H.e.l.l.o.,. .W.o.r.l.di`d```````````````d`id.l.r.o.W. .,.o.l.l.e.H.````````````v``d?`c?`d?`c?`d?`c?`d?` < 1238282412 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alternative method < 1238282431 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what does `?d do if you've never input anything? < 1238282437 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well, this time it doesn't work correctly with buffered i/o... :S < 1238282450 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sigh. < 1238282450 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same as no match, iirc < 1238282454 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Which bit pattern? < 1238282460 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you're rather taking advantage of the fact that hello world ends in a legal Unlambda comman < 1238282462 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*command < 1238282462 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Death farming", what an amusing concept. < 1238282466 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm testing with all possible 32 combinations. < 1238282470 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: fastest way to score points < 1238282486 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but i explained on the wiki the substitution we discussed < 1238282506 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Oh, wait, you're right, it doesn't work here either. O_o < 1238282516 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm just too tired, I shouldn't be doing this now. :-P < 1238282530 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It still sounds hilarious. "If the number of death-dropped items exceeds 32,767 on the same square, the game will probably crash, so periodically checking Death's square and redistributing the items (possibly by teleporting them away, or polymorphing them together) is necessary." < 1238282538 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, looks like it just broke the stack, the test itself works. < 1238282564 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: really? I see in the recent changes log your solution, but not an explanation of it < 1238282566 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for taking advantage, i have a feeling it should be possible for this particular case to do some of the work in the padding, e.g. by starting with `.d < 1238282568 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I look at the actual page? < 1238282596 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um last line < 1238282603 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it mentions the substitution < 1238282607 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes the test works. sanity test (is it less than 32?) is also okay. < 1238282617 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course i don't use it here because it's unnecessary < 1238282651 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a 0 on the stack; where is it coming from, I wonder? < 1238282672 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if some crazy interpreter returns negative number for 1y
< 1238282700 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, I do in efunge for size of cells. Since it use bignums I just say -1 < 1238282700 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you using `vd`padding to get rid of the padding? < 1238282704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not 1y < 1238282714 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that 2y? < 1238282717 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1238282721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir, don't remember < 1238282726 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: um neither wiki example avoids the padding < 1238282786 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if i were to let the padding do work then it would have to be v d based rather than e of course < 1238282801 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using e is cheating < 1238282808 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you think so? :D < 1238282820 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheating in esolangs is generally allowed, though < 1238282828 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(_a)0*= does nothing, right? < 1238282833 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has the advantage that you return the right evaluated result < 1238282838 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would (_a)0= make _a hold a pointer? < 1238282858 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Now at last?? < 1238282862 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://qoid.us/cgi-bin/scribd.cgi < 1238282864 0 :comex!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thoughts < 1238282872 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Peace and Protection 4.22.2" < 1238282875 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: mycology updated? < 1238282878 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1238282906 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: until today i thought it couldn't be done without e < 1238282934 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uugh... < 1238282934 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the padding must start with `. or `?, and without e there is no way to avoid applying those < 1238282966 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you'd get spurious printing? < 1238282966 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may be able to do it with k and d, actually < 1238282966 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, for general programs. since Hello, world ends with d that might still work < 1238282967 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not needing v < 1238282972 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: That doesn't sound good ;-P < 1238283007 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: it now screws the stack for 16(0b10000) to 31(0b11111)... i think. < 1238283018 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the previous one didn't? < 1238283018 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um well since ?x without a previous @ always applies to v .... < 1238283034 0 :swistakm!n=swistak@chello084010208142.chello.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1238283040 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, you're right, why did that change do that < 1238283050 0 :calamari!n=calamari@ip70-171-213-254.tc.ph.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1238283053 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought this code wasn't even run for that case :-/ < 1238283070 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, aha < 1238283073 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here we go < 1238283078 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now /this/ better work < 1238283123 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Uploaded < 1238283154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now if it was possible to avoid both ?x and e altogether we might have an 1.0 solution < 1238283231 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: still same. ...well do i have the most recent version? < 1238283266 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, that's another one where 0b11111 works but not any other unbuffered one < 1238283273 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I manage this? :-P < 1238283328 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame all my troubles on zero-terminated strings < 1238283330 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh. < 1238283347 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: what do you use when editing funge code? < 1238283351 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what editor* < 1238283355 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously, for the past 15 minutes all I've been doing is trying to zero-terminate a string < 1238283358 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: vim < 1238283365 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just vim? < 1238283368 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1238283378 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION recalls a trefung editor written in trefunge somewhere
< 1238283379 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O < 1238283385 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1238283393 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget what it's called but it should be googlable < 1238283421 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Perhaps now? < 1238283437 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well... it may be GLFunge editor mode. < 1238283473 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: And what do you use, then? < 1238283508 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: okay! it works correctly. < 1238283515 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finally! < 1238283528 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i tried some of combinations and all works) < 1238283535 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Annoying piece of string-printing code that can be entered from four different contexts :-P < 1238283544 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think there is such a thing as a GLfunge editor mode. < 1238283574 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although certainly there was a vision of one. < 1238283606 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just looked up man pages from google, so obviously i don't know whether it is implemented. < 1238283615 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It has a command line option for editor mode, but it doesn't seem to do anything < 1238283628 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Heh, that's sad. < 1238283632 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: There are two Befunge editors, both of which crash quite early in Mycology < 1238283644 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh. < 1238283644 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: huh? < 1238283653 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: Huh? < 1238283666 0 :M0ny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :M0ny, huh ? < 1238283667 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought mycology was a test of interpreters, not an interpreter itself < 1238283686 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is < 1238283692 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By 'Befunge editor' I meant 'Befunge editor' < 1238283696 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not 'editor written in Befunge' < 1238283713 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be both < 1238283721 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or strictly speaking 'Befunge editor with bundled interpreter', I guess. What other use would a Befunge editor be? < 1238283723 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Your "Befunge editor" seems to imply that the editor is also capable of interpreting. < 1238283733 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And yes, that's what I implied. < 1238283745 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well, it could invoke a seperate bef terp < 1238283749 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!glass {M[m (_t)(_o)O!(_t)(_o)o.?]} < 1238283750 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :emacs-style < 1238283760 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :..why didn't I get a response? < 1238283766 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For Trefunge, a good editor even without a bundled interp might be good. < 1238283773 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1238283774 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: But what kind of stuff could it do without builtin functions that practically make it an interp? < 1238283778 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, the glfunge98 sourceforge page has a very old, very non-working email address, too. Must be why I get no feedback. < 1238283783 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!glass {M[m(_o)O!"Test"(_o)o.?]} < 1238283796 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!glass {M[m(_o)O!"Hello World!"(_o)o.?]} < 1238283802 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the interpreter here? < 1238283804 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, GLfunge98 segfaults on mycology < 1238283811 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well, defaulting to overstrike mode, and moving rectangles around easily < 1238283811 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: That's unsurprising. < 1238283813 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This may or may not be known. < 1238283819 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's glfunge98 like? < 1238283823 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Horrible. < 1238283824 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no < 1238283824 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Old, mostly. < 1238283825 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they would apply to any grid language, not just befonge < 1238283826 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :egobot left years ago < 1238283835 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1238283840 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I test my glass then < 1238283842 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: Most decent editors can do that. < 1238283853 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I actually prefer not being in overstrike mode most of the time. < 1238283855 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: how do you make vim do it? < 1238283869 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: Replace mode for the former and visual block mode for the latter. < 1238283878 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Do you use the virtualedit thing? < 1238283893 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes. < 1238283897 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, are there any Glass interpreters? < 1238283900 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :virtualedit=block,onemore IIRC. < 1238283973 0 :swistakm!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Lost terminal" < 1238283976 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: well I never knew visual block did that < 1238284009 0 :ehird!n=ehird@208.78.103.223 JOIN :#esoteric < 1238284013 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1238284021 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :b < 1238284027 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cz < 1238284061 0 :Asztal_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good move < 1238284073 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mood gooveee'z < 1238284101 0 :swistakm!n=swistak@chello084010208142.chello.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1238284137 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I wrote a bit of Glass-to-Java compiler, but I'm not sure how finished it ever was. Probably not very. < 1238284192 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/files/glass/ < 1238284193 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also lol@okloplottery < 1238284198 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :swistakm: hi. you new? < 1238284212 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: swistakm was in #IRP, looking for information < 1238284213 0 :swistakm!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: yes < 1238284225 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :swistakm: welcome < 1238284257 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:19:06 I wouldn't say a million is enough for a perfect life nowaday < 1238284261 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on your definition of perfect life < 1238284265 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who would want to live in london? :-) < 1238284265 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes < 1238284269 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and heh < 1238284270 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, there's still someone in #IRP? < 1238284273 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I have here glass-0.{9,10,11}.tar.bz2 (the remains of that broken befunge.org link in the esolangs wiki, I let the domain expire) but if that place has glass-0.12.tar.bz2, I guess that's not very useful < 1238284297 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: not only that, several people in #IRP < 1238284298 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION blames fizzie
< 1238284308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(your reaction seems typical of #esotericers, though) < 1238284320 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#IRP's like alt.lang.intercal; still read-active, but people rarely speak there < 1238284329 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah we higher #esotericians are full of disdain for the hoi polloi #IRP < 1238284413 0 :swistakm_!n=swistak@chello084010208142.chello.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1238284427 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't believe the lottery is so popular in the uk < 1238284431 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do people have no brains?! < 1238284440 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looking at the topic, I had a sudden urge to set it "it's been [0] days since the topic was last changed", and tell you to keep it updated. < 1238284458 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't even guard the stupidity of it behind some stupid game < 1238284463 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is common enough < 1238284482 0 :swistakm_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: some people have brains. They make loteries < 1238284488 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: wanna play a game? < 1238284493 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: no :) < 1238284495 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: if you give me $100, there's a chance i'll give you $1000000 back < 1238284504 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: and this chance is? < 1238284516 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: I dunno, the lottery isn't that sutpid < 1238284521 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's something like 7 gajillion to one consider me uninterested < 1238284522 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: i can't quantify it exactly. It's quite small. < 1238284534 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :utility isn't linear with amount of money, y'know < 1238284535 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It depends on the number of tickets sold. < 1238284567 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC: the fact is that lottery players (and I generalize here because the winners are few enough to be statistically insignificant) waste one pound a week continuously < 1238284583 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it £2? < 1238284589 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's just say the return expectation value is positive for one of us < 1238284614 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, it is wise to buy one's lottery ticket as late as reasonably possible < 1238284627 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, hm? < 1238284632 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like ebay auctions < 1238284634 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to reduce the chance of being killed in a road crash below that of winning, or whatever < 1238284645 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1238284656 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :reminds me of Sgeo's time traveling computer < 1238284657 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION can't recall that actual time
< 1238284659 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SimonRC, so basically, if you get killed, you won't have wasted the lottery ticket money < 1238284663 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1238284666 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehird: are you risk-neutral? < 1238284674 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah, I think < 1238284702 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: it depends. < 1238284702 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are silly things like a cab to the airport being far more dangerous than the airplane ride itself < 1238284711 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may be mis-remembering < 1238284723 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more risk averse than seeking, in general < 1238284745 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which death sounds better: The death being on the national news (airplane), or local news (cab ride)? < 1238284754 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, dunno < 1238284768 0 :ehird!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, why the fuck does it matter, I'm dead :D < 1238284798 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't buying lottery tickets the risk-averse thing to do?