←2009-12-20 2009-12-21 2009-12-22→ ↑2009 ↑all
00:02:11 -!- snakbar has joined.
00:02:17 <snakbar> Hello
00:02:25 <osaunders> Hi.
00:02:52 <oerjan> hi
00:03:03 <snakbar> i have just written a bainfuck interpreter, but i'm not sure for it's complete working
00:03:18 <snakbar> could you give me some BF sources to test it?
00:03:58 <soupdragon> ++++++++++++++++[.+]
00:04:07 <soupdragon> that should print lots of different letters
00:04:29 <snakbar> yeah :D
00:04:44 <snakbar> this one seems to work
00:04:51 <snakbar> i found that one on internet
00:04:52 <snakbar> >++++++++++>+>+[
00:04:52 <snakbar> [+++++[>++++++++<-]>.<++++++[>--------<-]+<<<]>.>>[
00:04:52 <snakbar> [-]<[>+<-]>>[<<+>+>-]<[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-
00:04:52 <snakbar> [>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>[-]>+>+<<<-[>+<-]]]]]]]]]]]+>>>
00:04:52 <snakbar> ]<<<
00:04:54 <snakbar> ]
00:04:59 <soupdragon> what does that do?
00:05:01 <oerjan> http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Brainfuck#Examples has a couple
00:05:04 <snakbar> it is supposed to show the fibonacci numbers
00:05:19 <snakbar> not working with my interpreter
00:05:24 <soupdragon> :(
00:05:27 <soupdragon> why not
00:05:39 <snakbar> i have no idea
00:05:45 <osaunders> Whitespace issue?
00:05:57 <snakbar> in the source?
00:06:00 <soupdragon> how can you possibly debug something like this?
00:06:05 <soupdragon> this program is so complicated
00:06:05 <snakbar> haha
00:06:12 <soupdragon> there must be another way to tackle it
00:06:25 <soupdragon> how have you written the interpreter?
00:06:45 <snakbar> if you test it, i'll know if it's the code or my program the problem
00:06:45 <oerjan> ^bf ++++++++[>++++++++<-]>.
00:06:46 <fungot> @
00:06:55 <oerjan> snakbar: does that work?
00:07:00 <snakbar> i wrote it i c++
00:07:20 <soupdragon> is it long?
00:07:24 <snakbar> it show @ yes
00:07:31 <snakbar> not too long
00:07:41 <soupdragon> then why don't you paste it to a website
00:07:45 <oerjan> snakbar: what if you insert some whitespace?
00:07:47 <soupdragon> I want to see it
00:08:00 <snakbar> okay, w8 a minute i'll do it all ^^
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00:08:29 <snakbar> whitespace no problem
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00:09:07 <oerjan> ^bf >+++++++++[<++++++++>-]<.>+++++++[<++++>-]<+.+++++++..+++.>>>++++++++[<++++>-]<.>>>++++++++++[<+++++++++>-]<---.<<<<.+++.------.--------.>>+.
00:09:07 <fungot> Hello World!
00:09:15 <oerjan> snakbar: and that one?
00:09:50 <snakbar> hello world is working
00:09:59 <snakbar> my only problem was with the code i gave you
00:10:08 <oerjan> hm think we need to test something with nested loops...
00:10:13 <snakbar> i don't know if it's supposed to work
00:10:32 <snakbar> can you give me a paste website, i can't find one right now
00:10:35 <snakbar> ?
00:10:41 <uorygl> pastebin.ca?
00:10:45 <immibis> http://pastebin.ca/
00:10:58 <snakbar> thank you
00:11:00 <immibis> ^bf +[>+]
00:11:16 <soupdragon> ^bf ((:)(:))
00:11:31 <immibis> ^bf +[.+]
00:11:31 <fungot> <CTCP>.. !"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?@ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[\]^_`abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz{|}~ ...
00:11:38 <oerjan> soupdragon: that's not brainfuck, do you mean ^ul ?
00:12:40 <oerjan> ^bf >++++++++++>+>+[[+++++[>++++++++<-]>.<++++++[>--------<-]+<<<]>.>>[[-]<[>+<-]>>[<<+>+>-]<[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>+<-[>[-]>+>+<<<-[>+<-]]]]]]]]]]]+>>>]<<<]
00:12:41 <fungot> ...
00:12:53 <oerjan> soupdragon: works in fungot
00:12:53 <fungot> oerjan: but its a small city :) i like the lawyer stuff
00:13:01 <oerjan> er, snakbar
00:13:06 <soupdragon> nice
00:13:20 <soupdragon> I didn't realize it printed in decimal
00:13:53 <oerjan> hm...
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00:14:43 <oerjan> ^bf ++++[++++>-<]>.
00:14:43 <fungot>
00:15:00 <oerjan> oops
00:15:04 <oerjan> ^bf ++++[++++>+<]>.
00:15:04 <fungot> ?
00:16:05 <oerjan> ^bf ++++++++[>++++++++<-]>-.
00:16:05 <fungot> ?
00:16:07 <oerjan> sheesh
00:16:16 <soupdragon> ^bf ++++++++++[>++++++++++<-]>-.
00:16:16 <fungot> c
00:16:22 <soupdragon> damn
00:16:28 <soupdragon> I was hoping for more ?'s
00:16:30 <snakbar> do you want me to post it entirely compilable, or just the main functions ?
00:16:39 <soupdragon> snakbar everything
00:16:43 <snakbar> lol okay
00:16:47 <oerjan> snakbar: does ++++[++++>+<]>. work for you? otherwise it could be a wrapping issue
00:16:48 <soupdragon> I just want to glance at it
00:17:09 <snakbar> it has some diferent files ^^
00:17:19 <snakbar> i put it on diferent pastes ?
00:17:46 <snakbar> oerjan > your code gives me one '?'
00:18:17 <oerjan> good
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00:18:21 <oerjan> hm another thing
00:19:20 <oerjan> ^bf ++++++++[->++++++++<][>.<+]>.
00:19:20 <fungot> @
00:19:25 <snakbar> here is a first post, there are not ALL the files but every BF functions
00:19:26 <snakbar> http://pastebin.ca/1721881
00:19:33 <oerjan> snakbar: what does that give you?
00:19:40 <snakbar> it's written mostly in french sorry ^ ^
00:20:05 <snakbar> gives a lot of @
00:20:21 <snakbar> @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
00:20:21 <snakbar> @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
00:20:21 <snakbar> @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
00:20:21 <snakbar> @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
00:20:24 <oerjan> snakbar: ah there we are. you are not skipping loops that start with 0
00:20:27 <soupdragon> @
00:20:56 <oerjan> easy mistake
00:20:59 <snakbar> when i enter a loop, if i'm 0 i should skip hmmmm
00:21:04 <snakbar> okayyyyy
00:23:21 <oerjan> i wonder if there's a test suite for brainfuck like there's mycology for befunge...
00:23:42 <lament> not much to test
00:23:54 <lament> implementations tend to be upfront about cell size and memory limits
00:24:15 <oerjan> well but for the basics
00:25:27 <madbrain> brainfuck is too easy
00:26:22 <snakbar> soupdragon: what do you think about my code?
00:26:40 <soupdragon> it's easy to fix because it's well written
00:26:48 <snakbar> :D ^^
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00:31:42 <snakbar> i'm trying to fix it right now
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01:36:35 <snakbar> here is my function now for the '[' sign in BF
01:36:36 <snakbar> http://pastebin.ca/1721941
01:36:52 <snakbar> doesn't work properly
01:36:58 <snakbar> the interpreter gets to crash
01:37:37 <immibis> why not just use an integer? start with 1, increment for [, decrement for ], stop when it gets to 0
01:37:45 <snakbar> some code work, other don't
01:38:21 <snakbar> yeah why not, your right
01:39:26 <soupdragon> snakbar this is complicated
01:39:36 <soupdragon> too complicated for me :(
01:39:38 <snakbar> have an easy solution?
01:40:22 <soupdragon> I don't know
01:40:45 <soupdragon> maybe one would do a processing step when reading in the brainfuck program at first
01:41:02 <soupdragon> turning every [ into a label that says where the corresponding ] is
01:44:36 <snakbar> okay
01:44:47 <snakbar> i think there's a simpler way
01:44:51 <soupdragon> really?
01:45:28 <snakbar> the counter like immibis said looks simpler to me
01:45:33 <snakbar> i will try it tomirow
01:45:37 <snakbar> getting sleepy now
01:45:40 <soupdragon> oh I didn't notice that
01:46:26 <snakbar> but the counter is the same method i used, a little diferent. so i think my method should work, must be an error somewhere
01:46:55 <AnMaster> oerjan, http://nrkbeta.no/2009/12/18/bergensbanen-eng/ <-- wow
01:47:03 <AnMaster> oerjan, did you watch it?
01:47:24 <oerjan> um no
01:47:33 <AnMaster> oerjan, oh, not even any part?
01:47:52 <AnMaster> how boring
01:48:13 <soupdragon> wow!!!!!!!!!!
01:48:17 <soupdragon> thanks for linking this
01:48:24 <soupdragon> I thought it was 3D graphics at first
01:48:55 <oerjan> hey i'm norwegian, we're spoiled with scenery already >:)
01:49:05 <soupdragon> so it fits on a DVD hmmmmmmmmmm
01:49:08 <AnMaster> oerjan, meh
01:49:29 <AnMaster> soupdragon, what would have been 3D graphics?
01:49:41 <AnMaster> also: no it doesn't
01:49:46 <oerjan> also i don't watch tv, this is the first i hear about it becoming an internet phenomenon...
01:49:48 <soupdragon> the picture on that page looked like 3D graphics
01:49:49 <AnMaster> "The original file was 165 GB, too much for most people to download. We coded a 720 50P, 1280×720 version, resulting in a 22 GB file."
01:49:57 <AnMaster> no way THAT fits on a dvd
01:50:08 <soupdragon> DVD are what 5 GB?
01:50:09 <AnMaster> heck 22 GB is too much for me to download
01:50:28 <AnMaster> soupdragon, 3.2 or so iirc? For single layer single sided
01:50:39 <AnMaster> and burning dual layer just doesn't seem to work well in practise
01:50:46 <AnMaster> bad burns and such
01:51:10 <AnMaster> oerjan, what? internet phenomenon‽‽
01:51:11 <AnMaster> why
01:51:15 <AnMaster> because it is crazy?
01:51:38 <oerjan> AnMaster: well it said so on the page, more or less..
01:51:44 <AnMaster> ah
01:51:57 <AnMaster> oerjan, yeah I got the link from an american
01:52:00 <AnMaster> so I guess that is true
01:54:57 <AnMaster> night →
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02:06:41 <ehirdiphone> http://notalwaysright.com/when-open-source-meets-closed-minds/3305
02:06:45 <ehirdiphone> DEVIANT LINUX
02:07:58 <puzzlet> epic
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04:24:36 <Gracenotes> that's not fake at all. :|
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04:45:29 <ehirdiphone> "you seem to think i’m random, but i’m only psuedorandom. you would be exactly this way, were you seeded at the very same time and place." —why the lucky stiff
04:46:45 <oerjan> hm wasn't that the guy who disappeared
04:46:59 <ehirdiphone> Yes. Well, no.
04:47:16 <ehirdiphone> He deleted himself from the Internet completely.
04:47:40 <ehirdiphone> Specifically, the host human of _why killed _why.
04:48:22 <ehirdiphone> That personality, those works, that *person*, is dead. And nobody knows why but him.
04:50:00 <oerjan> at least no one who is telling
04:50:17 <ehirdiphone> It's sad, but what can you do. Most courts only accept the murder of someone with a physical body.
04:51:02 <ehirdiphone> (note: yes, these are my real opinions on identity—although I don't think it should count as murder :P)
04:52:52 <oerjan> mhm
04:52:57 <ehirdiphone> I wonder what the smallest extension to the pi calculus is that makes it TC.
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04:53:20 <ehirdiphone> Did you get that last message?
04:53:25 * oerjan didn't know the pi calculus wasn't TC
04:53:30 <ehirdiphone> Ah.
04:53:43 <ehirdiphone> It isn't by itself, I don't think.
04:53:49 <ehirdiphone> Ask Wikipedia?
04:53:52 <oerjan> i thought it had an embedding of lambda calculus into it
04:54:07 <ehirdiphone> No, I think that's am extension.
04:54:10 <ehirdiphone> *an
04:54:22 <ehirdiphone> Link me the WP page?
04:54:54 <oerjan> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pi_calculus#Turing_completeness
04:56:25 <ehirdiphone> I wonder if you can implement a typed pi calculus in Haskell.
04:56:28 <coppro> seems like it's TC
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05:21:04 <uorygl> O omniscient fungot, what is the best question I could ask you right now?
05:21:05 <fungot> uorygl: if i knew of sisc? is there anything wrong with it? :)
05:21:33 <uorygl> O omniscient fungot, if i knew of sisc? is there anything wrong with it?
05:21:34 <fungot> uorygl: but i don't think it's worth putting effort into optimizing keyword calls. every lambda's body is a shell, i think....
05:22:34 <uorygl> Note to self: learn of sisc; don't try to optimize keyword calls; every lambda's body is a shell.
05:23:27 <uorygl> It would be neat if some future dude looked at these logs and figured that fung*t is actually omniscient and powerful.
05:23:43 <uorygl> As I'm sure has been said before.
05:29:16 <pikhq> fungot: Has it been said before?
05:29:17 <fungot> pikhq: lua's popular because it's cheaper to buy a new house, and heal my computer with full u+ support" then :)
05:32:55 <snakbar> gn8 thanks for help
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06:00:44 <immibis> fungot: are you omniscient and powerful?
06:00:45 <fungot> immibis: ssh, don't tell me that i forgot to apply sunscreen on my ears, la la la i can't hear a fig?
06:00:59 <immibis> fungot: you forgot to apply sunscreen on my ears
06:01:00 <fungot> immibis: maybe i'll combine them fnord by keeping expressions and statements different things. fnord foo 1/ n fnord bar 1/ n fnord bar 1/!
06:01:13 * immibis wonders where the line before the previous one came form
06:01:14 <immibis> from*
06:01:20 <immibis> fungot: you do that.
06:01:21 <fungot> immibis: an exception can be raised to the fnord
06:01:25 <immibis> fungot: ah i see
06:01:27 <fungot> immibis: hehe. btw, it's ruby code but it's chaotic neutral, in d&d terms. bear with me) up-from to in-sequence suggests the use of improper lists in this manner
06:01:52 <immibis> fungot: please don't talk nonsense
06:03:31 <immibis> anyone have a win32 binary rcfunge?
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13:08:23 <osaunders> Is there a POSIX funge98 compiler/interpreter?
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14:05:17 <Deewiant> osaunders: cfunge is one
14:06:16 <Deewiant> CCBI may be another, depending on what you mean by something being POSIX
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15:41:15 <osaunders> Deewiant: Thank you.
15:43:17 <osaunders> Oh you wrote CCBI.
16:09:14 <Deewiant> I did, yes. :-P
16:09:31 <AnMaster> osaunders, and I wrote cfunge
16:23:02 <osaunders> Impressive.
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16:49:59 <AnMaster> uhu
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19:44:19 <ehirdiphone> I guess I should send Mike Riley an email, instead of putting it off.
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19:58:07 <ehirdiphone> Sent and forwarded to AnMaster, in case he cares.
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20:00:54 <AnMaster> hm
20:07:09 <Deewiant> AnMaster: Did you reply to Mike yourself?
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20:07:21 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Hmm.
20:07:47 <AnMaster> Deewiant, no
20:07:51 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, hmm what?
20:07:55 <AnMaster> I can't run mail client atm
20:08:01 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, that computer is running memtest
20:08:10 <AnMaster> so at least 8 more hours
20:08:34 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, btw I'm probably planning to switch from gentoo on my current desktop. Or upgrade it's components
20:08:35 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: You said hm recently.
20:08:43 <AnMaster> it is getting too slow nowdays
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20:08:58 <AnMaster> can't keep up with the higher demands of new software
20:09:04 <AnMaster> wow did that scare him that much?
20:09:06 <AnMaster> ;P
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20:09:08 <ehirdiphone> Deewiant: Do you want me to forward my email to you too?
20:09:39 <Deewiant> ehirdiphone: Might as well, I suppose
20:09:45 <ehirdiphone> Okay.
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20:10:37 <ehirdiphone> Deewiant: Sent to deewiant@iki.fi.
20:11:16 <Deewiant> Cheers
20:11:29 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: From Gentoo to what?
20:11:46 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, not sure, probably arch for desktop
20:11:51 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, and it won't happen soon
20:11:56 <AnMaster> becuase I have no time to do it
20:12:08 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, but since I'm planning to get a new harddrive anyway for it. probably then
20:12:26 <ehirdiphone> SSD! SSD!
20:12:43 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, too expensive. Not enough space. Plus it would probably be faster than the system bus ;P
20:12:59 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, 500 GB SATA harddrive is what I will go for
20:13:01 <AnMaster> or more
20:13:14 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: 160 GiB Intel SSD ~= $400
20:13:23 <ehirdiphone> 80 GiB = less
20:13:30 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, I can't live with 80 GB
20:13:33 <AnMaster> I have 350 now
20:13:34 <ehirdiphone> Adequate for a system drive.
20:13:37 <AnMaster> and that is a bit cramped
20:13:58 <AnMaster> well that's true
20:14:00 <ehirdiphone> /home goes elsewhere
20:14:21 <AnMaster> on the other hand, arch has fewer packages than gentoo
20:14:24 <ehirdiphone> Also, 1 TB over 500 GB, no question.
20:14:40 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, yeah I guess we have to move with the time
20:14:43 <ehirdiphone> Something like $30 more for twice the space.
20:14:49 <AnMaster> *remembers ibook with 3.2 GB harddrive*
20:14:51 <Deewiant> ehirdiphone: $400 for a drive is too expensive
20:15:04 <AnMaster> what is it in SEK?
20:15:12 <Deewiant> 2908
20:15:19 <AnMaster> hm yeah agreed
20:15:39 <ehirdiphone> Deewiant: It's not a drive, it's a box that magically speeds up your computer more than most CPU upgrades.
20:15:59 <ehirdiphone> And makes it quieter and more reliable.
20:16:15 <Deewiant> It's all relative
20:16:24 <Deewiant> To me, it's mostly a drive. :-P
20:16:32 <ehirdiphone> Anyway, 80 GiB is more like $250
20:16:32 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, it doesn't because you still need the hard-drive for data
20:16:49 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Nothing I said was false.
20:16:59 <ehirdiphone> QuietER, not silent.
20:17:01 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, yes that it makes your computer quieter
20:17:11 <ehirdiphone> ReliableER, not reliable.
20:17:22 <AnMaster> more reliable I agree
20:17:28 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Think about it.
20:17:30 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, but: since now it is ssd + harddrive instead of harddrive
20:17:39 <AnMaster> you have the same noise + no noise
20:17:43 <ehirdiphone> HD accessed less = less noise.
20:17:46 <AnMaster> and x+0=x
20:17:50 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, hm okay
20:17:51 <ehirdiphone> Pretty damn obvious.
20:17:59 <Deewiant> A generation 2 Intel X25-M would be 205 € here
20:18:03 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, but most accesses are from my data disk
20:18:05 <AnMaster> in my experience
20:18:16 <ehirdiphone> Finland has shite prices :P
20:18:25 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Absolutely false.
20:18:27 <Deewiant> Well, it's not far from your $250
20:18:34 <Deewiant> That's $286
20:18:42 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, well, I just based it on stats from my own system
20:19:02 <Deewiant> ehirdiphone: OSs put shit in RAM after the first access
20:19:05 <AnMaster> using iostat
20:19:05 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: If all you do is manipulate ridiculously big RAW files, maybe.
20:19:18 <ehirdiphone> Deewiant: I don't know Euros.
20:19:21 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, no, you mean 16-bit per channel tiff!
20:19:30 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, and HDR floating point encoded tiff
20:19:32 <AnMaster> :D
20:19:45 <ehirdiphone> Deewiant: Also, the stats are that SSDs speed up common tasks by quite a lot.
20:20:00 <ehirdiphone> That's science for you.
20:20:00 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, such as compiling?
20:20:02 <AnMaster> that is common for me
20:20:13 <ehirdiphone> I don't know.
20:20:15 <Deewiant> Compiling is mostly CPU-bound
20:20:16 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, I think what I buy should be based on my own usage stats :)
20:20:20 <AnMaster> Deewiant, exactly
20:20:38 <Deewiant> Anandtech or something tested it and they saw something like a 1% speedup with SSDs
20:20:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, unless it is g++ in which case it is also "more ram than you have"-bound
20:20:45 <Deewiant> Compiling Linux, IIRC
20:20:56 <Deewiant> Or maybe Firefox or something.
20:21:08 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: The majority of desktop tasks you perform are highly different in workings to common ones?
20:21:13 <ehirdiphone> I find that unlikely.
20:21:23 <AnMaster> dm-2 0.14 1.06 1.01 379858 361568 # this is /home
20:21:32 <Deewiant> Nah, it was Pidgin
20:21:34 <Deewiant> http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3631&p=25
20:21:35 <AnMaster> dm-3 0.17 0.73 0.01 260700 2308 # This is /usr
20:21:42 <AnMaster> headers are:
20:21:44 <AnMaster> Device: tps Blk_read/s Blk_wrtn/s Blk_read Blk_wrtn
20:21:55 <Deewiant> And yeah, the difference was essentially zero for HDD vs SSD
20:22:01 <AnMaster> oh and / is:
20:22:02 <ehirdiphone> Pidgin uses monotone as their VCS. No joke.
20:22:03 <AnMaster> dm-0 0.00 0.01 0.00 4458 40
20:22:06 <AnMaster> which is even less
20:22:40 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, see my point?
20:22:47 -!- ehirdiphone has quit ("Get Colloquy for iPhone! http://mobile.colloquy.info").
20:22:52 <AnMaster> /boot just has 5 read and 1 write
20:23:30 <AnMaster> (estimated, since it is based on taking all the dm-* on sda and the values for sda and checking difference)
20:23:34 <Deewiant> http://www.anandtech.com/storage/showdoc.aspx?i=3631&p=20 reminds me why I don't care about SSDs enough at their current price range
20:23:38 -!- Sgeo has joined.
20:24:10 <Deewiant> He starts three resource-intensive programs after boot and sees an improvement of 24 seconds
20:25:09 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well that is great. My boot time is around 35 seconds on my desktop
20:25:11 <Deewiant> 1) I don't do that 2) Even if I would, I don't care if it takes two minutes. I can busy myself in the already-instantly-enough-starting firefox/thunderbird for much longer than that.
20:25:15 <AnMaster> so it would make it almost instant
20:25:26 <AnMaster> and on my laptop it would BOOT BEFORE I PRESSED THE BUTTON
20:25:31 <AnMaster> wow that is crazily fast
20:25:47 <AnMaster> also slightly creepy
20:25:58 <AnMaster> a computer being able to predict when I will turn it on
20:26:02 <Deewiant> That wasn't about boot time, it was about program startup time.
20:26:13 <AnMaster> Deewiant, don't ruin a good joke
20:26:21 <Sgeo> Since when does Firefox start anywhere near instantly?
20:26:25 <AnMaster> Deewiant, also firefox is slow to start
20:26:34 <AnMaster> konqueror is near instant
20:26:51 <Deewiant> On my Linux machine it's instantaneous enough for me.
20:27:08 <AnMaster> Deewiant, arch? hm not readahead then by default
20:33:31 <Deewiant> Booted into Linux; Thunderbird takes about 5 seconds to start, Firefox about 10. When typing the commands for the four or so programs I typically start right away, that's too fast - it interrupts my typing.
20:34:07 <AnMaster> Deewiant, make a script to do it
20:34:15 <AnMaster> and name it ~/s or so
20:34:40 -!- poiuy_qwert has joined.
20:34:42 <Deewiant> No. I don't always start up the same things.
20:34:50 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well okay ~/s 1
20:35:01 <AnMaster> for first configuration and so on
20:35:04 <AnMaster> if you have 9 or less
20:35:14 <AnMaster> otherwise use base64 encoding of the number
20:35:29 <AnMaster> ;P
20:35:38 <Deewiant> I'd rather just type the stuff :-P
20:35:49 <AnMaster> Deewiant, automation is good
20:35:59 <Deewiant> It's just an O(1) improvement
20:36:58 -!- osaunders has joined.
20:37:30 <AnMaster> Deewiant, per time yes
20:37:33 <AnMaster> hm
20:37:42 <AnMaster> well still a constant factor
20:38:03 <AnMaster> Deewiant, you could want to start more instances every time?
20:38:07 <AnMaster> and write a script to do it
20:38:16 <AnMaster> of course that is rather contrived
20:38:17 <Deewiant> No, I wouldn't
20:38:42 <AnMaster> Deewiant, use the ackermann function to calculate number of instances of <text editor of choice> to start ;P
20:40:13 <Deewiant> One instance is enough, and I already have it bound to a shortcut key so I don't really need any more help there :-P
20:41:14 <AnMaster> "meh"
20:41:26 <Deewiant> Exactly. :-P
20:42:09 <AnMaster> Deewiant, no you can't use that comment here
20:42:12 <AnMaster> it won't work
20:44:40 -!- adam_d_ has changed nick to adam_d.
20:50:49 -!- ehirdiphone has joined.
20:51:00 <ehirdiphone> MIKE IS GOING TO KILL HIMSELF
20:51:12 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Deewiant: forwarded
20:51:22 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, what?
20:51:33 <ehirdiphone> Why am I always right about these things >_<
20:51:50 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, alas my mail client is now rebuilding so can't check right atm
20:51:56 <Deewiant> Maybe you just have that effect on people :-P
20:52:05 <ehirdiphone> Heh...
20:52:07 <AnMaster> (yeah I said I was probably switching to arch, see!)
20:52:17 <AnMaster> Deewiant, that is too nasty
20:52:35 <Deewiant> Alright, sorry.
20:53:28 <AnMaster> (wow, did I just take ehird in defence or something?)
20:54:10 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, so I finally went firefox 3.5
20:54:21 <AnMaster> now I'm pissed off with it for the second time
20:54:32 <ehirdiphone> It sure will be fun for his family and friends going through the shock and grief that will probably never fully go away. Unless he doesn't have any.
20:54:40 <AnMaster> and why the heck is it ignoring my scroll wheel
20:54:48 <Deewiant> In what way
20:54:51 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, try to contact them
20:54:53 <Deewiant> (AnMaster:^)
20:55:09 <AnMaster> Deewiant, actually it doesn't react to clicks either
20:55:17 <AnMaster> what is the command to disable all extensions=
20:55:23 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: And what can they do?
20:55:23 <Deewiant> -safemode or something
20:55:25 <Deewiant> Run --help
20:55:30 <AnMaster> Deewiant, let see.
20:55:33 <ehirdiphone> He needs professional help.
20:55:40 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, they can help him get that
20:55:42 -!- adam_d_ has joined.
20:55:53 <ehirdiphone> Only if he consents.
20:56:02 <ehirdiphone> He's suicidal, remember?
20:56:07 <AnMaster> wow:
20:56:09 <AnMaster> Well, this is embarrassing.
20:56:09 <AnMaster>
20:56:09 <AnMaster>
20:56:09 <AnMaster>
20:56:09 <AnMaster>
20:56:10 <AnMaster>
20:56:11 <ehirdiphone> Do try to keep up.
20:56:12 <AnMaster>
20:56:15 <AnMaster> Firefox is having trouble recovering your windows and tabs. This is usually caused by a recently opened web page.
20:56:27 <AnMaster> that's a nice error
20:56:28 <AnMaster> from firefox
20:56:38 <Deewiant> Yes, it can be handy.
20:56:58 <AnMaster> Deewiant, what can be?
20:57:28 <Deewiant> That error page.
20:57:32 <ehirdiphone> Suicide is probably among the most selfish things you can do.
20:57:44 <Deewiant> Agreed.
20:57:50 <lament> probably. One way to find out for sure
20:57:50 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, indeed
20:58:09 <ehirdiphone> lament: Oh the comedy.
20:58:53 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, sorry but I have to rush, you and Deewiant has to handle this with Mike Riley
20:59:05 <ehirdiphone> Oh, what fun.
21:00:00 <ehirdiphone> I know! Suicide is illegal, let's tell the police! ...not.
21:01:10 <lament> Jesus's death was effectively a suicide
21:01:20 <lament> and it's considered by some to be the most altruistic act ever
21:02:02 <ehirdiphone> Mike can't forgive sins.
21:02:06 <soupdragon> if you have a martyr that can be reshaped into a religion, then Jesus and the God are essentially similar, or "homeomorphic", as topologists say
21:02:07 <Deewiant> Dying for the sins of mankind and dying because you're sad are two different things
21:02:11 <ehirdiphone> Well, neither could Jesus.
21:02:27 -!- adam_d__ has joined.
21:02:36 <ehirdiphone> But only because he didn't exist.
21:02:44 <Deewiant> Although the argument could be made that the world would be a better place had Jesus not killed himself either :-P
21:03:20 <soupdragon> Jesus asked, in essence, whether all sins that are not twisted and have no holes in them are homeomorphic to sodomy
21:03:37 <ehirdiphone> If only the invisible pink unicorn did not have to become invisible so that we would not rape her.
21:03:56 <Deewiant> Poor raped invisible pink unicorn
21:04:32 <ehirdiphone> Mike mentioned going to church once. Isn't suicide a sin?
21:04:41 <ehirdiphone> Apart from martyrdom.
21:05:13 <Deewiant> Depends on the brand of Christianity, I believe.
21:05:29 -!- adam_d__ has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)).
21:05:43 <Deewiant> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_suicide
21:06:00 <soupdragon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_homotopy
21:06:14 <Deewiant> soupdragon: Methinks you're on crack.
21:07:28 <ehirdiphone> That's just fax. :P
21:08:42 <ehirdiphone> Homoerotic homomorphy!
21:08:46 -!- ehirdiphone has quit ("Get Colloquy for iPhone! http://mobile.colloquy.info").
21:09:25 * AnMaster is doing a binary search of extensions to find the broken one
21:09:37 <Deewiant> What's breaking?
21:10:11 <AnMaster> Deewiant, clicking anything except scrollbar and menu bar, scrolling with scroll wheel, opening any dialog (including add-ons one)
21:10:38 <Deewiant> heh
21:13:42 <AnMaster> what the. binary search gives weird results.
21:13:51 <AnMaster> maybe it is an interaction between two then
21:13:58 <Deewiant> How many extensions do you have?
21:14:04 <AnMaster> Deewiant, 6 or so iirc
21:14:12 <Deewiant> That's not too bad
21:14:20 <Deewiant> You can try all 64 combinations :-P
21:14:21 <AnMaster> hm?
21:14:51 <AnMaster> Deewiant, oh wait it seems at least two extensions is to blame
21:15:13 <AnMaster> I localised the "can't open dialog" thing to google customize
21:15:20 <AnMaster> which is sadly unmaintained
21:15:31 <AnMaster> so dropping that
21:16:00 <Deewiant> You mean http://www.customizegoogle.com/ ? Works for me
21:16:07 <AnMaster> Deewiant, oops, misremembered: 12
21:16:22 <Deewiant> 4096 is a bit too many to try
21:16:50 <AnMaster> indeed
21:17:17 <AnMaster> Deewiant, also found another issue: pasting with middle mouse button in address box broken
21:17:56 <Deewiant> That works for me fine as well
21:18:25 <Deewiant> I appear to have 26 extensions enabled and 4 disabled
21:18:38 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well it does indeed seem to be an interaction of sorts
21:18:58 <AnMaster> wait a sec
21:19:05 * AnMaster has a horrible suspcion
21:19:14 <AnMaster> yeah I was right
21:19:24 <AnMaster> it isn't deterministic
21:19:32 <AnMaster> as in, restarting firefox sometimes fixes it
21:19:38 <fizzie> Six, out of which one is disabled. (More data points is always good. What, you weren't compiling extension usage statistics after all?)
21:19:39 <AnMaster> sometimes introduces it
21:19:49 <AnMaster> Deewiant, I didn't count the disabled ones
21:19:58 <AnMaster> there are two disabled
21:20:17 <AnMaster> what the crap happened now
21:20:20 <AnMaster> to the add-ons dialog
21:20:39 <AnMaster> scrollbar on wrong side and all the icons at the top replaced with empty white
21:20:55 <Deewiant> fizzie: Now you managed to make me interested in whether such statistics exist
21:21:52 -!- adam_d__ has joined.
21:21:55 <Deewiant> Based on a quick Googling, it appears not.
21:22:24 <fizzie> Deewiant: addons.mozilla.org has their download statistics, but that's not really it.
21:22:26 -!- adam_d has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
21:22:56 <Deewiant> Not really. I was thinking more in terms of "mean number of extensions installed" type things.
21:23:58 <AnMaster> Deewiant, fizzie: either of you use tab mix plus?
21:24:02 <AnMaster> and what about firebug?
21:24:10 <fizzie> Neither.
21:24:17 <AnMaster> hrrm
21:24:24 <AnMaster> fizzie, adblock plus? noscript?
21:24:29 <fizzie> The latter.
21:24:33 <fizzie> The former on the N900.
21:25:05 <Deewiant> AnMaster: All four of those.
21:25:19 <AnMaster> hm:
21:25:25 <AnMaster> [NoScript] [Exception... "Component returned failure code: 0x80004005 (NS_ERROR_FAILURE) [nsIPrefBranch2.removeObserver]" nsresult: "0x80004005 (NS_ERROR_FAILURE)" location: "JS frame :: chrome://noscript/content/Main.js :: anonymous :: line 761" data: no] while disposing.
21:25:27 <AnMaster> on terminal
21:25:28 <AnMaster> looks bad
21:25:39 <AnMaster> only hit I can find is one in a russian forum
21:25:43 <AnMaster> how useless
21:25:45 <fizzie> In the Firebug category, I do have the good old DOM Inspector installed.
21:25:52 <AnMaster> oh and it wasn't the same
21:25:56 <AnMaster> just similar
21:27:29 -!- adam_d_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
21:29:50 <AnMaster> Deewiant, would it be a good idea to email Mike Riley. I don't know what to sya
21:29:51 <AnMaster> say*
21:30:08 <Deewiant> If you wish
21:32:00 <AnMaster> Deewiant, well customizegoogle alone works
21:32:04 <AnMaster> so indeed an interaction
21:32:32 <AnMaster> Deewiant, hm does MKRY live in US?
21:32:39 <AnMaster> if so recommending professional help might be bad
21:32:40 <Deewiant> I think so
21:32:42 <AnMaster> costs and such
21:32:48 <AnMaster> if he can't afford it
21:33:25 -!- adam_d__ has changed nick to adam_d.
21:41:56 <AnMaster> Deewiant, hm it looks like noscript is bugged
21:42:22 <AnMaster> how strange
21:42:29 <AnMaster> maybe resetting it's settings would help
21:57:02 <AnMaster> hm no
21:57:10 <AnMaster> I can't make head or tail out of this
22:00:57 -!- omologos has joined.
22:01:22 -!- ehirdiphone has joined.
22:01:43 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: You know, most people in the US have health insurance.
22:01:52 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, hm okay
22:02:15 <ehirdiphone> Mike probably quit his job if he's tying up loose ends though
22:02:22 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, hm
22:02:26 <ehirdiphone> So he probably doesn't have any
22:02:33 <ehirdiphone> Not like he'd want it
22:03:52 <pikhq> ehirdiphone: Most people in the US have health insurance, sure. It doesn't necessarily cover everything, they will feel free to drop you at the slightest chance, and they will still charge you through the nose to use said insurance.
22:05:46 * pikhq then goes and sees context, and is confused.
22:06:58 <AnMaster> pikhq, what are you confused about
22:07:26 <pikhq> Who is this Mike Riley person, anyways?
22:07:42 <AnMaster> Mike Riley is planning suicide. Due to as he says "dealing with severe depression now for the past couple years and at this point I have pretty much given up"
22:07:48 <AnMaster> pikhq, the author of RC/Funge
22:07:58 <pikhq> Ah.
22:08:55 <AnMaster> so all things considered I think this is pretty bad to say the least
22:09:02 -!- ehirdiphone_ has joined.
22:09:22 <ehirdiphone_> The strategy most likely to work is to convince him to hold it off, "just to make sure he really wants to".
22:09:42 <ehirdiphone_> Anything before that is just racing against an unpredictable clock.
22:09:43 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone_, send a mail to him about it. You are better at English than I am.
22:10:03 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone_, also you obviously know this somehow
22:10:08 <AnMaster> more than I do
22:10:14 <AnMaster> (about how to prevent it)
22:10:21 <ehirdiphone_> Yes. I will. But I'm out of my league, I need to think about it.
22:10:30 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone_, there might not be much time
22:10:47 <ehirdiphone_> AnMaster: Half seeing what other successful preventers do, half logic.
22:10:48 -!- ehirdiphone has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)).
22:10:49 -!- ehirdiphone_ has changed nick to ehirdiphone.
22:11:04 <AnMaster> I never seen any such.
22:11:15 <ehirdiphone> Also, we probably gave at least a day or two. He did say he was tying up loose ends.
22:11:35 <ehirdiphone> *have
22:11:43 <AnMaster> still, you don't have much timne
22:11:44 <AnMaster> time*
22:11:50 <AnMaster> we*
22:12:37 -!- omologos has left (?).
22:12:38 <ehirdiphone> True.
22:13:12 <ehirdiphone> Probably we need a group of people here to show support at some point.
22:13:35 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, I sign up. I guess Deewiant would too.
22:13:43 <AnMaster> not sure who else
22:14:16 <ehirdiphone> He thinks he knows that you two hate him. It's a good idea, but it probably won't work without others as well.
22:14:48 <ehirdiphone> If he doesn't want Rc/Funge to die with him maybe we could use that
22:15:13 <ehirdiphone> Maybe ask him to do one final code cleanup ;-)
22:15:40 <lament> where does he write that?
22:15:49 <ehirdiphone> Email.
22:16:09 <lament> does he ever come to this channel?
22:16:20 <ehirdiphone> He used to.
22:16:39 <lament> what was his nick?
22:16:44 <ehirdiphone> Maybe we could convince him to call the Good Samaritans
22:16:52 <ehirdiphone> lament: MikeRiley
22:16:59 <lament> oh
22:17:39 <ehirdiphone> The good samaritans are practically in the business of preventing suicide after all
22:18:17 <lament> dunno how good suicide prevention services are
22:18:25 <lament> it's not like they can really do anything
22:18:45 <pikhq> lament: They can talk. That can be helpful.
22:18:50 <ehirdiphone> Most people don't really want to kill themselves
22:18:58 <lament> afaik there's a significant number of people who complain to their doctor about suicidal thoughts
22:19:04 <lament> and then go and kill themselves
22:19:08 <ehirdiphone> Mike wouldn't do it if his depression was cured for instance
22:19:16 <ehirdiphone> lament: Cry for help
22:19:29 <lament> right, the point is, the doctor can't do much
22:19:49 <lament> perhaps some sort of chemical intervention would be appropriate...
22:19:57 <ehirdiphone> Doctors aren't specialists in that area...
22:20:10 <ehirdiphone> Also, that would not work, long term.
22:20:55 <lament> emergency measure, at least
22:20:59 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, I talked to my dad about this. He is a professor in psychology.
22:21:22 <ehirdiphone> Psychology is 99% unscientific bullshit.
22:21:24 <AnMaster> his tip: keep a discussion open, ask him about details, try to recommend medicine (unless he already tried it)
22:21:26 <ehirdiphone> But go on.
22:21:45 <AnMaster> and try to get him to seek pro help
22:21:46 <ehirdiphone> You need a degree to come up with that? :P
22:22:15 <ehirdiphone> But yeah, that's my plan at least.
22:22:16 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, well he said it was hard to know without details, like if it was season-dependant and such
22:22:17 <Pthing> well you can't get any magical positivist solutions either so
22:23:13 -!- zzo38 has joined.
22:23:43 <ehirdiphone> Hi zzo38. Not the best time to pop in if you want esolangs talk.
22:23:57 <ehirdiphone> We're trying to prevent a suicide...
22:24:23 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, also: if he is Christian, try to get him to talk to a priest or such (could be easier in US than pro help)
22:24:38 <AnMaster> was another suggestion
22:24:57 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Preists are not qualified for anything but bullshitology.
22:25:03 <Pthing> again
22:25:05 <Pthing> i remind you
22:25:09 <ehirdiphone> I doubt it would help.
22:25:14 <Pthing> where is positivism getting you
22:25:50 <zzo38> Priests are not qualified for anything but religion and the religious service (unless, of course, they know other things too)
22:26:03 <lament> ehirdiphone: priests perform the same function as psychologists, and they have many more centuries of experience of performing it.
22:26:11 <ehirdiphone> "THINGS FALL DOWN." "God" "Magic" "Well no science bring offered GOD IT IS"
22:26:18 <lament> in addition to other things priests do, of course.
22:26:34 <lament> ehirdiphone: ugh shut up
22:26:40 <soupdragon> no science bring offered
22:27:06 <ehirdiphone> soupdragon: Typos! So comedical.
22:28:17 <ehirdiphone> Anyway, we're having an argument about nothing.
22:28:37 <lament> you're still retarded
22:28:45 <ehirdiphone> Cool.
22:28:49 <soupdragon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_%28breakfast_cereal%29
22:29:02 <zzo38> *HOW TO ARGUE ABOUT NOTHING*
22:30:05 <lament> presumably if the guy "dealt with severe depression for the past couple years" he has already looked into medical solutions
22:30:17 <ehirdiphone> Disagree.
22:30:32 <zzo38> Do whatever solution works for you, because some people it is different
22:30:36 <soupdragon> Have you asked why he is depressed
22:30:41 <ehirdiphone> Dealt is being used in the sense of "carried on" IMO
22:30:44 <zzo38> That is a good question to ask
22:30:53 <ehirdiphone> soupdragon: Thats my next step
22:31:00 <zzo38> OK
22:31:11 <AnMaster> <ehirdiphone> I doubt it would help. <--- who knows. It might. It might not.
22:31:36 <zzo38> In how many Forth systems are the WHILE and IF command interchangeable? And in which ones are WHILE and IF commands *not* interchangeable?
22:32:39 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, asking if he tried medicine (SRRI ones) might be good
22:32:47 <AnMaster> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selective_serotonin_reuptake_inhibitor
22:32:59 <AnMaster> err make that SSRI of course
22:33:32 <zzo38> The Half Moon Books telephone is still busy
22:34:54 <lament> i wonder
22:35:28 <ehirdiphone> I think we've covered what to do. I'll reply tomorrow, hopefully, as I'm the one he's told.
22:35:38 <ehirdiphone> lament: You wonder...
22:35:44 <lament> if, say, your family dies in a car crash, you girlfriend whom you love leaves you with your best friend, you get fired, and your house gets broken into and all the valuables stolen
22:35:47 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, why not today?
22:36:02 <lament> presumably you would be rather upset by all that
22:36:04 <ehirdiphone> IPhone typing is nit fun.
22:36:09 <AnMaster> time is probably short. Could be hours in worst case, days in best case
22:36:11 <lament> so can you just take some SSRI and be happy again?
22:36:16 <soupdragon> lament no
22:36:23 <ehirdiphone> It is not hours.
22:36:26 <AnMaster> lament, there is a delay with SSRI on a few weeks.
22:36:48 <lament> suppose you start taking SSRI a few weeks in advance, then :)
22:37:00 <soupdragon> it won't make you happy
22:37:01 <ehirdiphone> He said that he's tying up loose ends. Rcfunge would not be the last item on the todo
22:37:51 <lament> soupdragon: but would you at least not be sad?
22:37:55 <lament> soupdragon: that's a bit frightening honestly
22:38:02 <soupdragon> I think you would still be very sad
22:38:13 <soupdragon> it just stops you from being able to cry
22:38:19 <lament> oh jolly
22:38:23 <soupdragon> and fiddles with your sleep
22:38:33 <ehirdiphone> If SSRI removes such emotions, surely that is what depression is. So it won't.
22:38:38 <soupdragon> drugs don't really make the world go round (not yet anyway)
22:38:43 <ehirdiphone> soupdragon: Sounds awful.
22:38:49 -!- kwertii has joined.
22:39:08 <Pthing> ehirdiphone, masterpiece of scientific thinking there
22:39:31 <ehirdiphone> Pthing: In reference to?
22:39:39 <Pthing> <soupdragon> and fiddles with your sleep
22:39:39 <Pthing> <ehirdiphone> If SSRI removes such emotions, surely that is what depression is. So it won't.
22:40:06 <ehirdiphone> I said that much before that on my end.
22:40:10 <ehirdiphone> Reasoning:
22:40:12 <lament> i suppose clinical depression is different from grief and other related things
22:40:15 <Pthing> obviously
22:40:25 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, consider that some people are helped by SSRI, depressions must be truly awful
22:40:43 <AnMaster> lament, well yes
22:40:44 <ehirdiphone> Depression is usually referred to as lacking "happy" or "sad"
22:40:51 <Pthing> v. science
22:40:59 <lament> ehirdiphone: maybe you should look up clinical depression on wikipedia
22:41:18 <soupdragon> that's drugs like alchohol
22:41:23 <soupdragon> depressents
22:41:25 <ehirdiphone> lament: it was back of the envelope rough approx reasoning
22:41:32 <Pthing> haha yes
22:41:42 <Pthing> writing "depression = sad" on the back of an envelope
22:41:50 <lament> also, nice, suicidal thoughts are actually one of possible side-effects of SSRI
22:41:54 <ehirdiphone> No. I did not say that.
22:41:58 <ehirdiphone> At all.
22:42:14 <ehirdiphone> I said the opposite in fact
22:42:58 <AnMaster> lament, as well as being used to prevent it.
22:43:15 <AnMaster> lament, I suspect it is complex
22:43:19 <lament> no kidding
22:43:20 <ehirdiphone> btw using my irc taps on an iPhone against a statement I made about an entire field of "legit" study
22:43:27 <ehirdiphone> Is a low blow
22:43:43 <Pthing> wat
22:43:55 <ehirdiphone> The latter should be held to MUCH higher standards
22:43:58 <lament> ehirdiphone: so why are you replying tomorrow and not right now?
22:43:59 -!- Gracenotes has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)).
22:44:34 <ehirdiphone> lament: iPhone typing is not so fun. My fingers aren't happy.
22:44:54 <lament> that's... a great justification
22:45:03 <ehirdiphone> P(mike commits suicide before tomorrow) = a very low number
22:45:03 <lament> i'm impressed
22:45:29 <lament> i guess you'll just have to take that chance
22:45:31 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, you are typing a lot on it now
22:45:39 <zzo38> OK
22:45:49 <zzo38> What are your thoughts about text-adventure games?
22:45:59 <ehirdiphone> I'll also note that what everyone else is doing mostly amounts to sneering on the sidelines
22:46:04 <ehirdiphone> So fuck off
22:46:17 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, no. I have sent him a mail already
22:46:35 <AnMaster> But, you are better at English and such.
22:46:48 <ehirdiphone> I take chances every day. quite a few with a lot higher probability than him offing himself before tomorrow
22:47:01 <lament> You do type a lot
22:47:03 <ehirdiphone> Like, say, being in a car
22:47:19 <AnMaster> very well
22:47:37 <ehirdiphone> lament: The iPhones screen isn't big enough to review a long email reasonably anyway
22:47:44 <AnMaster> I do thank you for your concern, it is appreciated. In 39 years of dealing with the underlying problem there has been nobody who has been able to help.
22:47:48 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, just got that reply
22:47:49 <AnMaster> hm
22:47:53 <AnMaster> what the heck
22:48:13 <ehirdiphone> "...a really bad ingrown toenail!"
22:48:20 <soupdragon> invite him to IRC
22:48:22 <ehirdiphone> *out of place rimshot*
22:48:33 <lament> AnMaster: i don't know this riley guy. Do you think it's important that ehirdiphone writes him an email today?
22:48:37 -!- MigoMipo has quit ("Quitter!").
22:48:45 <AnMaster> lament, well maybe. He is the author of RC/Funge
22:48:59 <AnMaster> (that is for identification of who this is)
22:49:07 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster is estimating the probability of him following through within days as high
22:49:13 <ehirdiphone> irrationally
22:49:14 <lament> i mean important for sake of the guy, not esolangs...
22:49:32 <AnMaster> lament, well of course. But I don't know.
22:49:39 -!- ChanServ has set channel mode: +o lament.
22:49:41 -!- lament has set channel mode: +b *!*=ehirdiph@82.132.139.*.
22:49:45 <lament> it's the least i could do
22:50:11 <lament> ehirdiphone: see, I gave your fingers some relief
22:50:12 <zzo38> Why should you do that
22:50:23 <soupdragon> invite him to IRC!!!!!!!!!!!
22:50:35 <zzo38> Which one?
22:52:59 <AnMaster> lament, :/
22:53:23 <AnMaster> soupdragon, I'm not sure that is a good idea. This requires well thought out lines.
22:53:36 <AnMaster> I'll leave that to ehirdiphone
22:54:37 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, as for it being irrationally. We just interpreted what tying up loose ends means differently
22:55:35 -!- Gracenotes has joined.
22:57:34 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone:
22:57:40 <AnMaster> asking for the underlying reason:
22:57:42 <AnMaster> " I would rather not say exactly, other than a very major birth defect. The depression comes and goes, usually gets worse each time."
22:57:51 <AnMaster> uh uh
22:58:09 <lament> AnMaster: have you asked him if he has tried drug treatments?
22:58:43 <AnMaster> lament, I used the word medicine, but yes
22:59:23 <lament> fuck why is ehirdiphone such a horrible little bitch
22:59:25 <lament> i'm pissed off
22:59:38 <soupdragon> lament haha I think it's a great question
23:00:01 -!- ehirdiphone has quit (Client Quit).
23:06:51 <zzo38> Which IRC server software has,only two features I require, + type channels and channel logging. All of the others have too much features that I don't ever need
23:08:43 <AnMaster> lament, could you please unban him
23:09:20 <AnMaster> zzo38, I don't know of any with + type channels except the one ircnet uses
23:09:26 <AnMaster> I suspect it may be the only one
23:09:47 <lament> AnMaster: he logged out anyway
23:09:57 <AnMaster> lament, maybe because of you.
23:10:09 <AnMaster> also he will be back tomorrow probably
23:10:41 <zzo38> AnMaster: The ircnet one however has a lot of other features too. I am looking for one with only + type and not # or & channels, and many commands not needed such as KICK MODE NS CS WALLOPS etc
23:10:57 <AnMaster> zzo38, afaik no such one exists
23:10:59 <zzo38> And how can I make all channels logging by the server, I can add a new command called LOG command
23:11:22 <zzo38> However..
23:11:26 <AnMaster> zzo38, also without kick and mode it won't follow the RFC that defines the IRC protocol
23:11:30 <zzo38> Do you ever play a text-adventure game?
23:11:37 <soupdragon> text-adventure
23:11:39 <zzo38> AnMaster: I know, it will be incomplete
23:11:41 <soupdragon> I LIKE
23:12:06 <zzo38> But those commands are not needed in this case
23:12:08 <AnMaster> zzo38, it happened that I played colossal cave
23:12:19 <AnMaster> which iirc is the original one
23:12:47 <zzo38> AnMaster: Yes it is original one but also I ask, if any newer ones, or if you ever tried to write one, etc
23:13:48 -!- ehirdiphone has joined.
23:14:05 <ehirdiphone> Test
23:14:36 <AnMaster> zzo38, never tried to write one.
23:14:39 <zzo38> ehirdiphone: OK
23:14:40 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, wb
23:15:05 <ehirdiphone> AnMaster: Havr you asked whether he has seeked prof help for the depression not the defect?
23:15:05 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, forwarded last mail from him to you
23:15:20 <AnMaster> hm no
23:15:30 <AnMaster> well
23:15:37 <AnMaster> it might not have been clear which I meant
23:15:45 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, see forwarded mail
23:15:50 <ehirdiphone> K
23:15:53 -!- ehirdiphone has quit (Client Quit).
23:16:48 -!- ehirdiphone has joined.
23:16:54 <ehirdiphone> Anmaster did not receive
23:17:18 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, strange
23:17:34 <ehirdiphone> Brb going off iPhone
23:17:36 -!- ehirdiphone has quit (Client Quit).
23:17:39 <AnMaster> ehirdiphone, Penguinofthegods AT gmail.com?
23:17:42 <AnMaster> hm
23:17:47 -!- lament has set channel mode: -b *!*=ehirdiph@82.132.139.*.
23:18:00 <AnMaster> lament, long live dynamic ip
23:18:15 <AnMaster> and a huge range too
23:18:30 <lament> AnMaster: yes but what a little bitch
23:18:56 <AnMaster> lament, I disagree. I this case I have no reason to argue with him
23:21:19 <zzo38> If you don't like their messages, use the SILENCE command to block them
23:21:56 <AnMaster> zzo38, /ignore. iirc freenodes doesn't have server side silence
23:22:17 <zzo38> Some of the freenode servers do have SILENCE command
23:23:08 <zzo38> Send the SILENCE command and then you can see whether or not your server supports it or not.
23:23:16 <soupdragon> SILENCE MORTAL
23:24:13 <AnMaster> okay maybe freenode does then
23:24:16 <AnMaster> zzo38, only some?
23:24:21 <AnMaster> that sounds very very strange
23:24:56 <zzo38> Yes, only some. I know that sometimes when I connect it is valid command, and sometimes it is invalid. It seems to depend which server
23:25:31 <zzo38> I don't know if it is possible to select which server you want directly, but you can try
23:27:23 <AnMaster> zzo38, well of course it is. just use the host name for the specific one
23:27:28 <AnMaster> see which one you are on in the motd
23:33:31 <zzo38> You don't need to use the MOTD to see which one you are on
23:33:55 <zzo38> Just sending any unknown command or the SILENCE command, or various others, will tell you which server you are on in the sender field of the reply
23:38:09 <AnMaster> zzo38, in a proper irc client you don't see that. It being abstracted away :)
23:38:23 <AnMaster> zzo38, anyway you can use the host name to connect to
23:38:41 <AnMaster> of course a server might be removed or such in the future
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23:40:15 <zzo38> Abstracted away?? What do you mean, of course it should tell you who the sender of the message is
23:40:33 <zzo38> I see it on my computer, at least (in dark cyan)
23:40:57 <AnMaster> zzo38, yes it tells me it is the server
23:41:05 <AnMaster> I don't usually need to worry what server
23:41:40 <AnMaster> it tells me it is the server by using a grey * in front of the line
23:41:53 <AnMaster> this is very compact
23:42:08 <zzo38> O, it is very compact
23:42:10 <AnMaster> saves space
23:42:50 <zzo38> Well, I like the way I have it on my computer, that is why I made it like this. This way it will display all of the fields, in the colors according to which field it is
23:43:00 <AnMaster> what do you mean with that O?
23:43:18 <AnMaster> right
23:43:25 <AnMaster> each to his or her own :)
23:43:44 <zzo38> Yes
23:43:48 <AnMaster> personally I'm happy with a conventional irc client after some modification of settings
23:43:52 <AnMaster> and I like lots of features
23:43:58 <AnMaster> and I don't mind a few that I don't use
23:44:01 <zzo38> Which settings? And which features?
23:44:05 <AnMaster> (I use the majority)
23:44:22 <zzo38> Yes, but which settings and features, specifically?
23:44:24 <AnMaster> zzo38, well, settings could be some of the formatting strings, like how it should align nicks
23:44:39 <AnMaster> I have it right-align against column 9
23:44:49 <AnMaster> if they are wider they overflow into the text
23:44:56 <AnMaster> but that makes the text quite readable
23:45:09 <AnMaster> zzo38, small stuff like that.
23:45:19 <zzo38> OK
23:45:23 <AnMaster> "never send a version reply" of course too
23:45:44 <AnMaster> default quit message change. some aliases
23:45:54 <AnMaster> like I set /aa to mean "allserv away
23:46:04 <AnMaster> s/$/"/
23:46:15 <AnMaster> allserv means "send once to each server I'm connected to"
23:46:28 <AnMaster> this lets me set away status quickly
23:47:10 <zzo38> The client I use supports some of these features. /SET ANSWER is used to tell it whether or not to autoreply to VERSION and stuff
23:47:10 <AnMaster> zzo38, oh and where I want to have the channel tree view
23:47:27 <AnMaster> for server and channels under it
23:47:29 -!- ehird has joined.
23:47:32 <zzo38> /SET FORMAT turns on formatting by control codes or off to make it display the control codes themself, instead
23:47:32 <AnMaster> ehird, wb
23:47:35 <AnMaster> ehird, got the mail?
23:47:40 <zzo38> /SET SHOWTIME makes it show the time
23:48:08 <AnMaster> zzo38, well, not the kind of options I would set. Also are they saved?
23:48:23 <zzo38> And /MAC can be used to set macros, including the things you have described, such as QUIT message and AWAY and stuff
23:48:28 <AnMaster> zzo38, and more important: will it support multiple servers and handle hundreds of channels easily
23:48:36 <ehird> AnMaster: Nope
23:48:37 <zzo38> No, they are not saved, but you can store them in the configuration file and then it will be automatically set
23:48:42 <AnMaster> ehird, weird.
23:48:49 <AnMaster> ehird, I can paste the new lines in /msg
23:48:54 <ehird> AnMaster: dcc it if you want
23:49:32 <ehird> Damn, OS X is so comfy coming from an iPhone.
23:49:57 <zzo38> AnMaster: No, it can't support many channels simultaneously currently, although you can have multiple servers in multiple windows. Possibly I can add a way to create a new window with the same server and different filters, and create a macro to redirect each channel to a separate window, maybe in the next version
23:51:04 <AnMaster> zzo38, I don't think I will use your irc client anyway
23:51:14 <AnMaster> partly because I'm happy with what I use already
23:51:20 <AnMaster> partly because we have different goals
23:51:20 <zzo38> AnMaster: That's OK
23:51:36 <AnMaster> <ehird> Damn, OS X is so comfy coming from an iPhone. <-- I thought iphone ran OS X. Well a scaled down version of it.
23:52:00 <ehird> With a totally different UI, yes.
23:52:07 <AnMaster> ehird, fair enough
23:52:16 <ehird> It's remarkably easy to do research and stuff on for something so small.
23:52:25 <ehird> But a real Mac kind of blows it out of the water a billion times.
23:52:31 <AnMaster> ehird, be glad that you can use apps from elsewhere than OS X AppStore ;P
23:52:54 <zzo38> And of course, the command /SET AUTOPONG is useful too
23:52:56 <AnMaster> ehird, I bet a real linux system would as well.
23:53:08 <ehird> AnMaster: Yes, it would.
23:53:10 <ehird> I never contested that,
23:53:12 <ehird> *that.
23:53:18 <AnMaster> zzo38, I don't think it should be an option. Rather always have it on. There is no point in not having it
23:53:28 <AnMaster> ehird, well I didn't mean to imply you did
23:53:32 <ehird> The iPhone is pretty flawless as a mobile device and does remarkably well for non-mobile things; that's all I'm saying.
23:53:37 <ehird> But a full computer is, yeah, better.
23:53:41 <zzo38> I know a few people who turn it off sometimes (I don't know what client, though)
23:54:32 <AnMaster> zzo38, only reason I can think of is ircd developing and testing some weird bug related to it
23:54:39 <AnMaster> but then I would be using netcat anyway
23:55:21 <zzo38> What I have seen is some people prefer to turn off autopong instead of quitting
23:55:34 <AnMaster> zzo38, pretty strange
23:55:37 <zzo38> But I don't know why
23:55:58 <AnMaster> maybe a good way to try to not look as if they quit in a row or such
23:57:14 <zzo38> Do your IRC clients mask the password? I have heard that some people say their client won't mask the password
23:57:22 <zzo38> Do you know why?
23:57:37 <zzo38> Hopefully, if it doesn't do so, you can modify the software or tell the people who wrote it to fix it
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