< 1264982434 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to revamp education with computers as an integral part.. < 1264982463 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I think it would be interesting, if you eliminate all computation by giving it to the machine -- to see what is left < 1264982488 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our "applied mathematics" dep gives courses like that, theorems aren't proven, or at least you don't have to understand the proofs < 1264982507 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is sort of sad because stuff like probability theory is only found there < 1264982521 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION doesn't know what 'understand' means anymore, either :( < 1264982545 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for all intents and purposes, understand = memorize < 1264982567 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well at least for this intent and purpose < 1264982597 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to write a sci-fi about it :P < 1264982607 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err about what? < 1264982613 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should really continue reading... < 1264982615 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :computers < 1264982631 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, this doesn't even seem to work :/ < 1264982666 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's this part about singular cubes in the end i recall was pretty wacky, not sure i want to be reading it at 5 am < 1264982682 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :singular cubes = cube < 1264982689 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty easy stuff if you ask me < 1264982697 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, it *did* work! < 1264982709 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually the image of a cube < 1264982729 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(C) where f is a continuous function < 1264982743 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not exactly the wacky part < 1264982782 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lol < 1264982788 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, idiot here < 1264982791 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1264982824 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot math terms usually also mean something in english < 1264982883 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I the only one who fantasizes about being ENCOURAGED to use a calculator to factor quadratics instead of doing pages and pages of it by hand? < 1264982913 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why should it not be completely natural, when you learn a new algorithmic method of solving problems to program it in a re-useable way? < 1264982927 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just use the quadratic formula; takes roughly as long < 1264982969 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care about the actual quadraitic, tat's just one example < 1264982986 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember being in a class in middle school or so when the were trying to teach people to factor quadratics < 1264983016 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they taught some kind of odd, non-deterministic method involving drawing shapes on paper < 1264983031 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :our exams rarely contain any computations that take more than half a minute even without a calculator... except for integrals < 1264983032 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds cool < 1264983037 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you remember it? < 1264983040 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't like me use the quadratic formula ^_^ < 1264983083 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet, I even got the bijective de/encoding right, now all that's lacking is a weird language to plug in the middle of this < 1264983130 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could draw the shape of the curve and look at the picture to see where zeroes are < 1264983143 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose this was something cleverer < 1264983149 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner what are you talking about? < 1264983152 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I missed earlier < 1264983179 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah what the FUCK are you talking about < 1264983360 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a program that reads stdin as a bijective base-256 number < 1264983371 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bijective? < 1264983372 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then converts the number to base-pi, and back again < 1264983420 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't make sense to have real bases < 1264983429 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah! sure it does < 1264983433 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not? < 1264983466 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, I thought input was base pi, and output was base e? < 1264983474 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or something like that < 1264983482 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah, I just built it with output as base-pi to test that it's really working < 1264983503 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know yet how to convert directly from base-pi to base-e < 1264983528 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the burger is missing but I have the buns, so to speak < 1264983584 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how do you have a real base? < 1264983630 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-integer_representation < 1264983655 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just pi^k instead of 10^k < 1264983677 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: im fax < 1264983704 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that there has a greedy algorithm to generate the representation of any number in any base > 1 < 1264983712 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it works if your digits are reals too < 1264983722 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The numbers di are non-negative integers less than β." < 1264983731 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is really the only thing i wasn't sure about < 1264983743 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, so base-pi has 0,1,2,3 < 1264983759 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: lol, yeah, that would be a pretty compact representation at least < 1264983775 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like e = (e/pi)*pi < 1264983785 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e in base pi < 1264983889 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice to know that works, for some reason i've never bumped into that < 1264983993 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: MissPiggy < 1264984057 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind of messy since it doesn't add up to zero, but it seems that you don't need to bother with decimals to get the required precision < 1264984958 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is... Incredibly slow. < 1264984965 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./a.out `cat rot13.lazy` < ~/lazyk/lazier.scm 7.26s user 0.03s system 99% cpu 7.340 total < 1264984990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For comparison, the shipped interpreter: < 1264984990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./a.out eg/rot13.lazy < lazier.scm 0.70s user 0.02s system 80% cpu 0.891 total < 1264985179 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I believe olsner is looking for slowness? < 1264985485 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.maa.org/devlin/LockhartsLament.pdf < 1264985495 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :readit < 1264985562 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: "add up to zero"? do you mean the representation of a natural number in base pi is infinite? < 1264985692 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: I suspect it might be, but I think you need a lot less than infinite to actually make it unambiguous after rounding < 1264985794 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: sounds like the current state of mathematics < 1264985808 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :teaching of it, that is < 1264985811 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: ...that's the point < 1264985825 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mathematics in particular? < 1264985832 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't read all of it yet < 1264985925 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i figured it might be about pretty much anything < 1264985944 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah maybe it could be just about math < 1264986020 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay i got on page two < 1264986021 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1264986515 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is LogMeIn safe? < 1264987568 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: reading this, what I can think is... "ok but if mathematics were teached in a creative way, how would the teachers grade 150 different exams fairly" < 1264987569 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1264987599 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use a different method for evaluating performance, perhaps? < 1264987612 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if exams are interfering with learning, there's obviously a problem < 1264987719 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, this is kindof saying "they're not teaching creativity" and what I'm thinking is, "well, nobody teaches creativity" < 1264987721 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give 'em a problem and give points for progress < 1264987937 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is amazed at what difference a few "foo = NULL;"s can do for memory usage. < 1264988024 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poor garbage collection? < 1264988066 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Garbage collectors can't collect things you still have references to. < 1264988071 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if you're not using them again. < 1264988097 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In this case, I was holding on to references before dethunking something. < 1264988108 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about something like this: I'm writing a sound generator. I need a function that will generate a spectrum that is almost periodic, but where the phase and amplitude of harmonics vary with time < 1264988110 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a dethunk can take, well, any amount of time. < 1264988138 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1264988165 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if there are any garbage collectors that actually can infer that information < 1264988182 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ML's apparently can. < 1264988189 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a side effect of its type system. < 1264988249 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway a problem with making any subject better or more interesting to students is most people don't give a shit about anything. no matter how interesting it is, people don't want to hear it. < 1264988298 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1264988347 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The biggest gain I got was making the dethunk function actually remove its closure... That's such a ridiculous source of memory leaks. < 1264988569 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it seems I have a lot to learn about precision < 1264988601 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worked fine for certain sizes of inputs that happened to make the program choose good numbers of bits to work with < 1264988617 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but failed to properly pi-encode "hello world" < 1264990353 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1264990356 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :working on a bignum system? < 1264990384 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you compute, exactly, the representation of a pi-encoded number? < 1264990448 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: Inaccurately. < 1264990550 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: take the biggest power of pi that fits under it, and you get the first digit, then induction < 1264990572 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well biggest power + biggest possible digit you can multiply it with < 1264990578 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1264990605 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't know how to do that exactly < 1264990612 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then figure out at which digit to stop? < 1264990622 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's enough to use as digits the natural numbers under the number being used as base. < 1264990640 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any exponentiation/subtraction you are doing involves representations of pi, not pi < 1264990668 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1264990683 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so? we're still working with the actual number < 1264990749 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say you have 21, you'd take pi^2 first, because that's the biggest power that fits under 21, it fits under it twice, so you take 21-2*pi^2, take the representation of that real in base pi, and you'll have the rest of the digits < 1264990770 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get 2x.xxxxxxxx < 1264990776 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x's continuing forever < 1264990787 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no idea what they are) < 1264990818 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing about this involves "representations", although you'll need some to know what powers fit under what. < 1264990865 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't exactly subtract 2*pi^2 < 1264990872 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't? < 1264990878 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :21-2*pi^2 is a real number < 1264990914 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can represent it as a base pi number that contains only one whole digit, that is, its representation in base pi is of the form x.xxxxx < 1264990948 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is 21-2*pi^2 equal to 3, 1.78, 1.2808, 1.268238, 1.2619555, 1.26082454, etc < 1264990983 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you saying you can't represent 21-2*pi^2 in base 10 using a finite number of digits? < 1264990992 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :using base pi sounds weird < 1264990999 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's completely true < 1264991012 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you also can't represent it in a finite amount of bananas if bananas map in no way to real number. < 1264991013 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s < 1264991045 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you end up having to use an approximation of pi for all your calculations, is what i'm saying < 1264991056 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who said anything about calculations? < 1264991085 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: you could store the operations, then evaluate just the number of digits you need < 1264991096 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we are talking about the existence of the representation. pi has all sorts of algebraic properties, you can probably devise an algorithm for finding exact representations for numbers. < 1264991112 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a general real number that is obviously impossible < 1264991150 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i understand that it exists, i am talking about an algorithm < 1264991159 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1264991172 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's trickier < 1264991263 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, approximate to some amount of digits. not exactly that interesting. < 1264991331 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, pi can be done with, what, some polynomial series? < 1264991471 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: an exact algorithm would be to just have the thing you are trying to represent in the form "21-2*pi^2". you start making approximations for pi to get the correct amount of pi^1's, say n, but then you'd continue with 21 - 2*pi^2 - n*pi, and use approximations to find the amount of 1's needed, etc. < 1264991635 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not actually an algorithm, but at least there's no error) < 1264991646 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i mean it might hang) < 1264991736 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madbr: can't pi be done with pretty much anything < 1264991786 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know better than be probably < 1264991820 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know anything about pi < 1264991847 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't even know why it isn't algebraic < 1264991894 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear it's like totally nontrivial < 1264991920 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...lol my gf will wake up soon, i should really start reading soon :P < 1264991959 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(only 4:38, and i'm already reading about singular cubes, yay) < 1264995550 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I will do anything (almost) for a new router. < 1264997049 0 :puzzlet!~puzzlet@61.251.165.103 JOIN :#esoteric < 1264998000 0 :oklopol!~oklopol@a91-153-117-63.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1264998090 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1265001887 0 :whtspc!~whtspc@g231187.upc-g.chello.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1265002262 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1265003980 0 :Pthing!~pthing@cpc11-pres4-0-0-cust168.pres.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1265004515 0 :Ripley!~biblicalL@222-154-35-34.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1265005545 0 :Ripley!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265005591 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1265006849 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey < 1265006873 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ho < 1265006879 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get a lot of Cannot send to channel for some reason on the other channels for some reason < 1265006882 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What gives! < 1265006944 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't seem to be registered. is it possible they only allow registered nicks to speak? < 1265006965 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Radiateur < 1265007018 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they just changed ircd program, in case you haven't noticed, so some setup has changed < 1265007044 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird < 1265007063 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+R turned into some other quieting option, although i didn't have the impression it should change what happened in practice... < 1265007108 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but the channel I just tried talking doesn't have +R on < 1265007112 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or so it seems < 1265007118 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+R doesn't exist any longer < 1265007125 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I can talk here just fine < 1265007128 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's +q something < 1265007149 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well we've never silenced people here that i can remember... < 1265007152 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just +cnt on ##physics < 1265007179 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure +q shows up by default, i think it's like a ban list < 1265007221 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :07:52 0 - ##physics: ban $~a [by < 1265007222 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JabberWalkie!~superdude@CPE0013d44814fd-CM001bd70964c4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com, 121722 secs ago] < 1265007229 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that might be the one < 1265007242 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(found with /mode #physics +q) < 1265007249 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*##physics < 1265007261 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, let's try now < 1265007446 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works, thx < 1265007470 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1265007809 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1265008120 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1265009984 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265010504 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1265010647 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1265010747 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1265011199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1265011200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1265012118 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1265012118 0 :puzzlet!~puzzlet@wikipedia/PuzzletChung JOIN :#esoteric < 1265012535 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I'm thinking: screw this precision game, let's just choose an "official" number of bits for pi and store everything exactly as rationals when working < 1265012606 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it would be better to just figure out how to make this reliable, that'd teach me something too < 1265015591 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.org <- Nobody cares enough to cybersquat it < 1265015651 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1265015666 0 :Asztal!~asztal@host86-156-193-181.range86-156.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1265015778 0 :fizzie!~fis@2001:1bc8:102:587b:230:18ff:fea9:6f01 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265015822 0 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265016464 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1265017199 0 :MigoMipo!~3e779bfd@gateway/web/freenode/x-qppnixexiosxniok JOIN :#esoteric < 1265018161 0 :scarf!~scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265018594 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1265019799 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1265019816 0 :scarf!~scarf@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265021633 0 :oklofok!~oklopol@a91-153-117-208.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1265021785 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1265021903 0 :oklopol!~oklopol@a91-153-117-63.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1265022053 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1265023232 0 :scarf!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1265025317 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1265028397 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1265028446 0 :MizardX!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1265028705 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1265028896 0 :Pthing!~pthing@cpc11-pres4-0-0-cust168.pres.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1265029280 0 :MigoMipo!~3e779bfd@gateway/web/freenode/x-schynkpjqpcnlpjs JOIN :#esoteric < 1265030373 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@d83-183-181-73.cust.tele2.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1265030373 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1265030373 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1265030876 0 :adam_d!~Adam@cpc2-acto6-0-0-cust48.brnt.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1265032293 0 :MizardX-!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1265032395 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1265032408 0 :MizardX-!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :MizardX < 1265034690 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1265036073 0 :Pthing!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1265036184 0 :whtspc!~whtspc@g231187.upc-g.chello.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1265036265 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265036629 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what should 0j@ do? should it remain on j forever or should it reach the @ at some point? < 1265036730 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If 1j is like # then 0j is like z. < 1265036796 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hm does mycology test 0j? < 1265036803 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beats me. < 1265037006 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, so 0jv should take the down path then < 1265037021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well strange, it looks like the code in cfunge does the wrong thing, but it does in fact do the right thing < 1265037126 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait... now I see how it works < 1265038039 0 :cpressey!~CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265038083 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I am leaving. You are about to explode. < 1265038398 0 :cheater!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi AnMaster < 1265039230 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1265039489 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1265039498 0 :whtspc_!~whtspc@g231187.upc-g.chello.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1265039755 0 :whtspc_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1265040718 0 :oklofok!~oklopol@a91-153-117-208.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1265040805 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1265041629 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1265041806 0 :MissPiggy!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1265041898 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1265042010 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265042127 0 :Deewiant!~deewiant@kekkonen.cs.hut.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1265042622 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Scheduled downtime approaching < 1265042640 0 :MizardX-!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1265042760 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1265042789 0 :MizardX-!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :MizardX < 1265043533 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh. This lib needs to call closure as callback, but the function to register callback doesn't take context. :-/ ... Well, I think this needs trampolines (yay, runtime code generation). :-) < 1265043964 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if you don't care about it being even vaguely reentrant, you could just use a global. :P < 1265044412 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately, that isn't an option there. < 1265044636 0 :uoryfon!~uoryfon@mobile-166-137-136-197.mycingular.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265044851 0 :tombom!~tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1265045258 0 :uoryfon_!~uoryfon@166.205.11.236 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265045478 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1265045487 0 :uoryfon_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :uoryfon < 1265045563 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1265046032 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265046465 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1265046677 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1265046874 0 :uoryfon_!~uoryfon@166.205.8.237 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265047058 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION suddenly wants to start a punk band called "sudo rm -rf /" < 1265047062 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1265047063 0 :uoryfon_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :uoryfon < 1265047131 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265047178 0 :uoryfon_!~uoryfon@166.205.8.75 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265047359 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1265047359 0 :uoryfon_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :uoryfon < 1265047488 0 :uoryfon_!~uoryfon@166.205.10.226 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265047689 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1265047692 0 :uoryfon_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :uoryfon < 1265047788 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi < 1265048043 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :javawizard2539 < 1265048080 0 :javawizard2539!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :jcp < 1265048800 0 :augur!~augur@129-2-175-79.wireless.umd.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1265048946 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1265048951 0 :lifthrasiir!0VlqKUid@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1265050432 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1265050756 0 :MissPiggy!~quantum@amcant.demon.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1265050758 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1265050759 0 :MissPiggy!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1265051582 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think of a simple loop based language that you can write O(n^k) programs (for any fixed k) < 1265051610 0 :whtspc_!~whtspc@g231187.upc-g.chello.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1265051986 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, if one can only do fixed-count iteration, then one can only write algorithms that are in P. < 1265052016 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :every algorithm in P? < 1265052084 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that's only if one can only iterate over collections. Number-based iteration allows algorithms not in P. < 1265052100 0 :uoryfon!~uoryfon@166.205.9.62 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265052104 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oop < 1265052230 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, if one has number-based fixed iteration, one could do at least up to EXPTIME-complete. < 1265052343 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was NEXPTIME < 1265052378 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least up to... < 1265052411 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So might be some even bigger class... < 1265052437 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I don't remember where I heard that, and I don't know if I'm remembering it correctly. < 1265052581 0 :whtspc__!~whtspc@g231187.upc-g.chello.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1265052585 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At any rate, it contains every algorithm described as "feasible", which means... for "practical work" you don't need a Turing-complete computer. You only need TC if you want to write an interpreter :) < 1265052670 0 :whtspc__!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265052731 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/computer/language/ to be a bit more precise. < 1265053089 0 :Slereah_!~Slereah@ANantes-259-1-20-227.w92-135.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1265053130 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1265053205 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1265053622 0 :whtspc_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1265054128 0 :uoryfon_!~uoryfon@mobile-166-137-139-057.mycingular.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265054260 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1265054263 0 :uoryfon_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :uoryfon < 1265054760 0 :adam_d!~Adam@cpc2-acto6-0-0-cust48.brnt.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1265054784 0 :uoryfon_!~uoryfon@166.205.8.121 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265054985 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1265054987 0 :uoryfon_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :uoryfon < 1265055099 0 :uoryfon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Colloquy for iPhone - http://colloquy.mobi < 1265055102 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, so writing an interpreter isn't feasible then? ;P < 1265055290 0 :MigoMipo!~MigoMipo@84-217-3-178.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265055292 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1265055320 0 :MigoMipo!~MigoMipo@84-217-3-178.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265055321 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Excess Flood < 1265055650 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Apparently not! I do like the distinction you can draw from it, though: "If I can prove my code halts, it's an algorithm. Otherwise, it's an interpreter." < 1265055988 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, you could have interpreters for sub-tc languages you know will always halt < 1265056015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc ais/scarf designed one reversible always-halting language < 1265056023 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot the name of it < 1265056034 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais/scarf? Is that his name now? < 1265056055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, he used scarf sometimes recently < 1265056084 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neat. Now I know who scarf is. < 1265056095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1265056107 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm 614 new mails < 1265056111 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most are probably spam < 1265056132 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually no, it looks like there has been some huge debate on flightgear-devel list < 1265056202 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, if that' < 1265056244 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, ? < 1265056251 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's an interpreter, then so is a program that solves the travelling salesman problem, is all I meant. < 1265056259 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, heh < 1265056263 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where the language there is weighted undirected graphs :) < 1265056286 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very, very sub-TC, you might say... < 1265056350 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, back to fighting my favourite thing to ever come out of gnu: libtool. < 1265056357 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION groans. < 1265056400 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I will do anything (almost) for a new router. < 1265056462 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if the worlds of pain caused by shared libraries could have been avoided by just having OSes/filesystems that do hash consing. < 1265056545 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, probably not, b/c you have to rewrite all those pointers when you link statically, so the same library statically linked into two different files would look different in each. Ah well. < 1265057000 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, why are you using libtool? < 1265057025 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do shared libraries without libtool just fine < 1265057033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, also how do you mean hash consing? < 1265057111 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: basically, every time you allocate a new piece of data, check to see if you already have an identical piece of data, and if so, just keep a reference to the existing data instead. The name comes from the research where the technique was developed in LISP. < 1265057141 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for why libtool... because i am stupidly trying to build some tools i need (subversion, right now) from source < 1265057173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, like venti? < 1265057185 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(plan9 thing iirc) < 1265057193 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yeah part of plan9 even) < 1265057233 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, they tend to just work after ./configure --prefix=$HOME/local/subversion && make && make install < 1265057298 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yes, it's very nice when they just work :) Darn thing keeps telling me it can't find expat, though. < 1265057315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, so install expat < 1265057324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo pacman -S expat < 1265057333 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or sudo apt-get install expat-dev or whatever < 1265057376 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Building shared libraries without libtool is a pain to do portably. < 1265057378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah seems to be libexpat1-dev on ubuntu < 1265057388 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Building anything *with* libtool is a pain, so I guess it evens out. < 1265057399 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, does it work on *bsd and linux easily without libtool? < 1265057423 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really care about HP-UX, VMS and other obscure systems < 1265057430 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh AIX too < 1265057430 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It *works*, but people seem to suck at it. < 1265057441 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, isn't it just gcc -shared ? < 1265057445 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(next person to build a shared library without -fPIC gets a kick to the balls) < 1265057456 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well yes of course you use -fpic < 1265057458 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Add -fPIC for fucks sake. < 1265057462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also -fpic NOT -fPIC < 1265057475 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lower case version is better on some platforms iirc < 1265057507 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, like DOS. < 1265057507 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And DOS. < 1265057509 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also DOS. < 1265057521 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sparc < 1265057565 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what? -fpic vs. -fPIC? < 1265057566 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1265057577 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, wait... < 1265057586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes a difference only on SPARC, m68k and RS/6000 says man gcc < 1265057595 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :According to the man page, it only makes difference on m68k, PowerPC, and SPARC. < 1265057609 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1265057623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, mine lists SPARC, m68k and RS/6000 under -fpic but m68, PowerPC and SPARC under -fPIC < 1265057625 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-fpic makes a smaller offset table. < 1265057628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever that is supposed to mean < 1265057636 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's too small, it'll not compile. < 1265057641 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-fPIC will always work. < 1265057644 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, it is faster though < 1265057649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc < 1265057660 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: If your shared library is small enough. < 1265057662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and if you need such a large GOT you have too many functions < 1265057675 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :divide it in more < 1265057690 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a library should follow the unix philosophy too < 1265057696 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(do one thing, do it well) < 1265057699 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways. < 1265057710 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on sparc the smaller table means single instructions can be used to load offsets into it, -fPIC generates double-instruction constant loading that can handle large offsets < 1265057712 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many build systems build shared libraries *without* using position-independent code. < 1265057730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, right < 1265057736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the x86 dynamic linker will manually relocate the library if it's not PIC. < 1265057737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that won't load < 1265057744 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on x86-64 iirc < 1265057746 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will on x86. < 1265057748 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And *nowhere* else. < 1265057751 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not on x86-64 < 1265057760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure about that < 1265057763 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes. That's not x86. < 1265057771 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well the difference is slight < 1265057778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also x86-64 is the norm nowdyas < 1265057781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :days* < 1265057785 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for linux < 1265057791 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The difference between the CPU architecture is slight. < 1265057798 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ABI is radically different. < 1265057804 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1265057826 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is the x86 abi < 1265057834 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only read the amd64 abi < 1265057841 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Undefined. < 1265057844 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's per-OS. < 1265057848 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And often per-compiler. < 1265057852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well it must be documented for linux... < 1265057854 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhere < 1265057860 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you're on Windows, give up now. < 1265057868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, also Microsoft ignores the amd64 abi yes < 1265057882 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microsoft defines its own, yes. < 1265057893 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows on x86 has 3 or 4 different calling conventions. < 1265057923 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Linux x86 ABI is defined in the LSB. < 1265057957 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would like a nice, easy to use, 3D modeller, based on using boolean functions between primitives. Such as "intersection of this cube and (union of that cylinder and that sphere)". Anyone know such a thing? < 1265057985 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for C++-specific details; those are from the IA64 ABI documentation for all GCC-supported architectures. < 1265057987 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this would in other words not be based on polygons (or it could be as well) < 1265058013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, linux use different calling convetions on x86 too. regparam for example < 1265058019 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Coyote finally caught me < 1265058028 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: regparam is very, very rarely used. < 1265058038 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge uses regparam attribute on x86 to speed things up (there is a measurable difference) < 1265058053 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: thank you. libexpat1-dev worked. Why it worked and why plain 'expat' did not, I still have no good idea -- it's not like extra so's were installed (and that's what it was saying it couldn't find.) < 1265058066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, plain expat is a program it says < 1265058077 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, "expat - XML parsing C library - example application" < 1265058082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apt-get tells me that < 1265058087 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1265058088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apt-cache < 1265058124 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wheras on Windows, there's fastcall, stdcall, cdecl, safecall, and pascal calling conventions... < 1265058124 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but expat installs /usr/lib/libexpat.so* ... which should be enough to link to, given that it didn't complain about headers. < 1265058127 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@adsl-71-142-225-118.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265058143 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, well. maybe it needs *.la or *.a? < 1265058145 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1265058160 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And those are just in use by Microsoft's compiler. < 1265058170 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, if you are doing subversion why not apt-get builddep subversion < 1265058173 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it builddeps < 1265058174 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1265058177 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1265058180 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well, libexpat.la appears to have been in my lib dir since Jan 19 as well < 1265058196 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At any rate, it's built. best not to think any more about it, right? :) < 1265058199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, delphi (which is pascal) used fastcall internally iirc < 1265058203 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's *also* the Borland fastcall and the GNU cdecl. < 1265058209 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it a modified fastcall? < 1265058212 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well probably < 1265058222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, gnu uses it's own cdecl on windows? < 1265058233 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: The difference is in struct packing. < 1265058246 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : At any rate, it's built. best not to think any more about it, right? :) <-- wrong. You always try to figure out *why* something unexpected happened < 1265058251 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, -_- < 1265058255 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It packs its structs differently from Microsoft C. < 1265058255 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@adsl-71-142-225-118.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265058263 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, that isn't calling convention! < 1265058266 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With an attribute for Microsoft packing. < 1265058271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :struct packing is, well, ABI yes < 1265058276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not calling convention < 1265058278 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, fine, remove the GNU cdecl. < 1265058292 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Borland still has its own fastcall. < 1265058306 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(different registers are used) < 1265058312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, anyway regparam with gcc isn't that rarely used. Let me grep cfunge sources for number of times it is used! < 1265058337 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge is the first thing I've heard of actually *using* it. < 1265058342 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: maybe my smiley should have been a ;-) < 1265058343 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, does MS still use fastcall? < 1265058349 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, maybe < 1265058353 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1265058368 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, for what sort of functions < 1265058369 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Random parts of Win32 use it. < 1265058373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, also what about thiscall? < 1265058390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just a C++ implementation detail. < 1265058392 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1265058393 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"First argument is this". < 1265058403 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/C++/python/ ;P < 1265058414 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(except there it is explicit!) < 1265058420 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heheh. < 1265058462 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microsoft at least went sane on x86_64... < 1265058464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how comes C++ needs it's own "different from C" ABI, while python manages fine with the C abi. < 1265058468 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is one calling convention. < 1265058468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes I can see the reasons < 1265058470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1265058472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes you wonder < 1265058490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, different from linux one though on x86_64 < 1265058499 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, also doesn't syscalls use their own? < 1265058504 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on both linux and windows < 1265058506 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but it's at least a *single* calling convention. < 1265058516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Syscalls must -- there's no way to just "call" them. < 1265058523 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, call gates? < 1265058530 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a vague memory of reading about that < 1265058538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how it worked < 1265058540 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Even that requires some specific work on them. < 1265058578 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Linux call gate is linked in before the dynamic linker is started. < 1265058591 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Linux call gate is at a specific address. < 1265058592 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1265058596 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also no longer used < 1265058602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it uses SYSCALL/SYSRET iirc? < 1265058607 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... No, the call gate is still used. < 1265058609 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it SYSENTER/SYSEXIT? < 1265058613 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The call gate is a *recent thing*. < 1265058617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, if you mean the vdso... < 1265058627 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's the call gate. < 1265058636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not the call gate in the meaning I used it < 1265058642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call_gate < 1265058652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Assuming a call gate has been set up already by the operating system kernel, code simply does a CALL FAR (LCALL in AT&T syntax) with the necessary segment selector (the offset field is ignored). " < 1265058669 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that bloody thing. < 1265058684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, so you know about it? < 1265058732 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux doesn't use that. < 1265058742 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did I say it did? < 1265058747 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1265058757 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm saying it doesn't at all, though. < 1265058781 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SYSENTER is quite funky. IIRC, it does not save address that called it. < 1265058790 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it damned well doesn't help matters any. < 1265058799 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it SYSCALL that is used then? < 1265058813 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux's entry methods are an interrupt, syscall/sysret, or sysenter/sysexit. < 1265058817 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there can only be one SYSENTER in each VM space. < 1265058828 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Linux VDSO uses whichever one is the fastest. < 1265058828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It should be noted that call gates are more flexible than the SYSENTER/SYSEXIT and SYSCALL/SYSRET instructions since unlike the latter two, call gates allow for changing from an arbitrary privilege level to an arbitrary (albeit higher or equal) privilege level. The fast SYS* instruction only allow control transfers from ring 3->0 and vice versa. Upon comparing call gates to interrupts, call gates are < 1265058829 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : significantly faster." < 1265058835 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting stuff. < 1265058872 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think they would be a lot faster, especially for some access patterns (though maybe not ones that are frequently used in modern OSes) < 1265058893 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that SYSENTER is part of Linux-gate VDSO. < 1265058899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, iirc virtualbox uses ring 2 a bit if there is no VT-d/whatever support < 1265058905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or VT-x or whatever it was < 1265058912 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Waiting for the next interrupt can be killer. < 1265058921 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Only if it's present. < 1265058926 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari, even on x86-64?' < 1265058931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/'// < 1265058946 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it used syscall exclusively on x86-64 < 1265058981 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1265058989 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically AMD64 deprecated Intel's sysenter in the AMD64 specs < 1265058993 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION opens the file < 1265059021 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"6.1.2 SYSENTER and SYSEXIT (Legacy Mode Only)" < 1265059022 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, if X64 has SYSCALL, its probably better than SYSENTER. < 1265059040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" L i ke S Y S C A L L a n d S Y S R E T, S Y S E N T E R a n d < 1265059040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SYSEXIT are low-latency system call and return instructions designed for use by system and < 1265059040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :application software implementing a flat-memory model. However, these instructions are illegal in < 1265059040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :long mode and result in an undefined opcode exception (#UD) if software attempts to use them. < 1265059040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Software should use the SYSCALL and SYSRET instructions when running in long mode." < 1265059044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeargh < 1265059048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION kills evince < 1265059057 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the hell did it do there < 1265059067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that spacing < 1265059072 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Syscall and Sysenter do roughly the same thing. < 1265059082 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One was created by Intel, the other by AMD. < 1265059100 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And presumably SYSCALL saves RIP... < 1265059126 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1265059150 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't linux map the clock in process memory for gettimeofday() and such < 1265059158 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is iirc done in the vdso magic < 1265059181 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly. < 1265059385 0 :soupdragon!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1265059623 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1265061008 0 :MissPiggy!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1265062053 0 :MissPiggy!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: * I'm too lame to read BitchX.doc * < 1265062561 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1265062798 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1265064019 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1265064052 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1265065493 0 :adam_d!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1265066163 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1265066163 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066432 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, getting a newer gmp and compiling mpfr and gmp locally seems to have given around 20% < 1265066473 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :optimizing while the program isn't even made correct <3 < 1265066495 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: restarting the X CPU-Hoggin System < 1265066538 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Coyote finally caught me < 1265066558 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@adsl-71-142-225-118.dsl.scrm01.pacbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066572 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Reconnecting < 1265066572 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@chronon.pointtec.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066572 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1265066572 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066596 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1265066666 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066739 0 :Leonidas_!~Leonidas@chronon.pointtec.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066739 0 :Leonidas_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1265066739 0 :Leonidas_!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1265066756 0 :Leonidas_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Leonidas < 1265066942 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1265066973 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1265067164 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1265067549 0 :XRY!~XRY@95.98.69.111 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265067551 0 :XRY!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1265067641 0 :XRY!~XRY@95.98.69.111 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265067646 0 :XRY!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265067698 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1265067714 0 :XRY!~XRY@95.98.69.111 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265067719 0 :XRY!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265067803 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1265067923 0 :XRY!~XRY@95.98.69.111 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265067928 0 :XRY!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265068035 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.org <- Nobody cares enough to cybersquat it < 1265068051 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1265068177 0 :XRY!~XRY@95.98.69.111 JOIN :#esoteric < 1265068186 0 :XRY!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1265068318 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1265068714 0 :mquin!~mquin@freenode/staff/mquin JOIN :#esoteric < 1265068725 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-48-53.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1265068730 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finally, it works! < 1265068739 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works! The OASYS->TAVSYS works! It works! It {OUCH}