< 1273708839 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1273708882 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: try the Google AI challenge < 1273708907 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the tron game) < 1273708930 0 :charlls!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Saliendo < 1273709574 0 :libaneses!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273710035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you can get it for free, unless it is past May 24th, when you will have to pay money again <-- huh? < 1273710037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where? < 1273710052 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, steam < 1273710054 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://store.steampowered.com/freeportal/ < 1273710055 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1273710058 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ... the servers are overloaded so try anothre day < 1273710068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, I would play it in wine < 1273710071 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that is lost < 1273710418 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1273710428 0 :aschueler!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1273711298 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273712533 0 :Oranjer!~HP_Admini@adsl-243-203-60.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273712932 0 :Tritonio_GR!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1273714163 0 :Gracenotes!~person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1273714430 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-18-97.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1273719360 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: soupdragon < 1273720001 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273720088 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273720105 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314 < 1273720150 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1273720267 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : So, you replace all free instances of "v". ;) < 1273720274 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, no that is not sufficient. < 1273720326 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :((\v -> (\t -> v)) t) < 1273720356 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you must rename some of the bound instances of variables mentioned in x < 1273720369 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, blah, alpha reduction necessary. < 1273720370 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for ((\v->e) x) = e[v := x] < 1273720373 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1273720397 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Some more work required" < 1273720546 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've never implemented lambda calculus myself, but i'd guess alpha reduction is a more awkward part than beta. < 1273720579 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd imagine it'd be less awkward (and less efficient) to just transform it into SK. < 1273720592 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(without it no one would bother with all that deBruin index stuff and things, would they) < 1273720681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah abstraction elimination isn't so bad. i have nearly implemented that. (improved someone else's eliminator for "optimizing" unlambda) < 1273721346 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1273722127 0 :augur!~augur@c-98-218-226-149.hsd1.dc.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273722193 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I recall you explained Norway's voting system to me a while ago. Can you run it by me again? < 1273722312 0 :Gregor-L!~Gregor@75-151-73-57-Spokane.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273722345 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each county is a voting district, electing a number of representatives (dependent on population and area) < 1273722355 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by proportional representation < 1273722363 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing like STV? < 1273722420 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we just choose one party list. it has varied whether we can do amendments of candidate positions. < 1273722479 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, thanks < 1273722480 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in addition to the fixed number of direct local representatives, there is 1 candidate per county chosen based on national total votes, to smooth out things < 1273722534 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so generally representation ends up pretty proportional to national representation, _provided_ the party gets at least 4% of total votes. < 1273722548 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many seats? < 1273722576 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however if it dips below 4%, it gets only the direct votes, which can be catastrophal like it was for Venstre last year < 1273722588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :169 i think, let me check < 1273722604 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1273722613 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1273722617 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a place where I can read up on it? < 1273722642 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.google.no/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=14&ved=0CFsQFjAN&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FParliament_of_Norway&rct=j&q=stortinget&ei=vGjrS9TLIpef-gb0qJnABA&usg=AFQjCNG3Vy-ocOwR89eLiisHtkKB9XOUbQ GOT FUCKING DAMN GOOGLE < 1273722650 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, what's your opinion on how well it works, and does it give voters much leeway in selecting individual candidates they like? < 1273722655 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't want your fucking redirection < 1273722689 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost no leeway, i don't think the candidate modifications are even used for the national elections anymore < 1273722707 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, so that's a downside < 1273722709 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i guess that link works even if it is annoying) < 1273722712 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at the same time, one that's easily fixe < 1273722714 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*fixed < 1273722723 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koira! < 1273722732 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well they _undid_ it, so obviously they didn't like it < 1273722742 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or it had almost no effect anyway < 1273722798 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_in_Norway < 1273723035 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for local elections there is a lot more leeway though, apparently you can even add candidates from other parties http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_municipal_elections#Ballots < 1273723041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming that's up to date < 1273723639 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION adds another seven Finnish words to his flash card deck. < 1273723706 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flash cards are harmful! steve jobs says so. < 1273723772 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evidently he's had a change of heart, as these flash cards are on my iPod Touch. < 1273723797 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read Apple's Flash spiel; it does have some points. < 1273723813 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just an old app they haven't got around to deleting yet. expect it to disappear soon. < 1273723825 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww. < 1273723856 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hasn't bothered to read Apple's Flash spiel, but cannot avoid noticing all the reddit headlines... < 1273723888 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, technically i _can_, i suppose < 1273723889 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Flash is proprietary, they say. < 1273723902 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :While running a proprietary platform. < 1273723908 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The irony is nearly corporeal. < 1273723924 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1273723936 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the gist i got of it, yes < 1273723944 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also said that there should be only one platform, because that way, developers don't need to restrict themselves to the set of common features. < 1273723961 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273723965 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That part of it I kind of disagreed with. :) < 1273723991 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is some very esoteric logic right there < 1273724214 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, if developers would be FORCED to use Flash if Flash was supported, I could understand < 1273724217 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finally convinces the flash card app that he kinda knows those new seven words now. < 1273724245 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That took about ten minutes. Not really too shabby. < 1273724305 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I can kinda sorta read the first four sentences of the Finnish Wikipedia article about koirat. < 1273724423 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION recognizes "ruokana" as being the essive case and correctly guesses the meaning of "ruoka" by the illustration. < 1273724555 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :be careful. soon you will start getting this inexplicable urge to drink heavily in hot, steamy places. and carry a knife. < 1273724571 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do Finns all carry knives? < 1273724605 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i vaguely think oklopol said something about them being banned in cities < 1273724607 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would never drink heavily in hot, steamy places. Drinking heavily in hot, dry places, on the other hand, is starting to sound like a good idea. < 1273724610 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... < 1273724618 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: Any reason for learning Finnish? < 1273724636 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't matter, because you will also get an urge to move to a desolate hut in the middle of a forest. < 1273724642 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and yes, I will accept "just because" as an answer) < 1273724650 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I like Scandinavia, and I also want to learn a non-Indo-European language. < 1273724654 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, Finnish. < 1273724661 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finnish is Indo-European. < 1273724670 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1273724671 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats pikhq -----### < 1273724681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IS NOT < 1273724682 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You made me check. < 1273724686 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's Uralic, isn't it? < 1273724690 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. < 1273724699 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No wonder it's so weird. < 1273724715 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Along with Hungarian! < 1273724724 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Igen! < 1273724752 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only Indo-European influences, then, are due to Sprachbund. Fun. < 1273724885 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think after my vocabulary catches up to the first paragraph of this Wikipedia article, I'll have to find a Finn who can explain all these suffixes. < 1273724931 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shall continue preferring Japanese. Mmm, language isolates... < 1273724957 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should merge language isolates with each other! < 1273724958 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well. Nearly. It *is* related to those pesky Ryukuan languages.) < 1273724967 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ryukyuan. XD) < 1273725018 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I must sleep. < 1273725042 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION pauses to allow someone to interject about the unnecessity of sleep. < 1273725065 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :COFFEE < 1273725069 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good night, everyone. < 1273725731 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1273726485 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1273728269 0 :augur!~augur@c-68-54-80-152.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273728647 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1273729370 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-66-16-26.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273729393 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1273729562 0 :Oranjer1!~HP_Admini@adsl-243-203-60.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273729604 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1273729806 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273730691 0 :Oranjer1!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273731819 0 :oklofod!~oklopol@a91-153-122-35.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1273732098 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1273732131 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273732265 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273733149 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273734428 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1273736436 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I am leaving. You are about to explode. < 1273736440 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273736823 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1273737043 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273737476 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273737599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1273737600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1273738023 0 :Gregor-L!~Gregor@67-129-37-226.dia.static.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273739708 0 :gm|lap!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1273742914 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1273744899 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1273746158 0 :oklofod!~oklopol@a91-153-122-35.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1273746195 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's "peux" < 1273746233 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofod: Definition: Put a 501 on, you'll know what I mean. Look good you do ? Example: C'mon Gofa, show me a move :@ Tu peux... pas SUPA MOULANT < 1273746265 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you a markov chain bot? < 1273746331 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i'm just passing my supybot's urbandict reply < 1273746332 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shit this is some sort of jesus day < 1273746340 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah figured < 1273746345 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cute (: < 1273746346 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you translate that to english? < 1273746373 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you asked about polish, i'd say 'yeh', but in case of english - i'm sorry :P < 1273746397 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna shoppe, but jesus closed all the shoppes. < 1273746518 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so "can" < 1273746533 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then my guess is "i can use some other weird language" < 1273746819 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1273747562 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : are you a markov chain bot? <-- hm I was wondering that too :D < 1273747627 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P4, what about E...o? < 1273747632 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(see topic for what that is) < 1273747651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(second section to be precise) < 1273747859 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't :P my mom wanted to start learning E...o, but i suppose she's too old for that :P < 1273748680 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's with people learning E...o? < 1273748697 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are... different :) < 1273748702 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i'm working on a semi-actual programming language for R...ZZle < 1273748805 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. for "noose": @f2\n\tgf;\n\t?cb f2; ?\n\t?cr gl ? ?cb gr ? ;\n\tgf;\n@\n\n@f1-\n\tf2;\n\t?cr gl; ?\nf1;@\n\nf1; < 1273748830 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the puzzle is: "BBBBBBBrBBBBBBB<\n......rbr.......\n.....rb.br......\n....rb...br.....\n...rb.....b.....\n...b......b.....\n...b......b.....\n...b......b.....\n...b......b.....\n...rb.....b.....\n....rb...br.....\n.....rBBBr......\n" < 1273748840 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a "b" under the robot < 1273748848 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(capital letters contain stars) < 1273748904 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, after adding a couple of instructions, i've worked out how it's possible to do while loops < 1273748938 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's 10 instructions total (turning + moving + painting are functions) < 1273748974 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait i'm confused, what did you come up with exactly? < 1273748988 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a programming language for robozzle < 1273749003 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@name ... @ defines a function < 1273749012 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :?cond ... ? defines an "if true" block < 1273749014 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you seriously underestimate the laziness of irc people if you assume someone is going to copypaste the level in a text editor to see what it looks like ;) < 1273749029 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and you overestimate our intelligence if you assume we wouldn't have to, i think) < 1273749063 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python -c 'print "BBBBBBBrBBBBBBB<\n......rbr.......\n.....rb.br......\n....rb...br.....\n...rb.....b.....\n...b......b.....\n...b......b.....\n...b......b.....\n...b......b.....\n...rb.....b.....\n....rb...br.....\n.....rBBBr......\n"' < 1273749064 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you compile into robozzle? < 1273749077 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might work < 1273749079 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, it gets compiled into a bytecode < 1273749106 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a stack-based thing < 1273749124 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can already program in robozzle, aren't you just taking the fun out :P < 1273749134 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it actually helps with some of the harder puzzles < 1273749153 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it allows for more interesting constructs < 1273749162 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :python -c 'print "\n@l_lockup-l_lockup;@\n@l_loop = @\n@l_until_cg ~cg --; ~ @\n\n@f_swp1\n\t@f_swpc\n\t\tf_swp2;\n\t@\n\t@f_fire\n\t\tgf;gr;gr;gf;\n\t@\n@\n\n@f_swp2\n\t@f_swpc\n\t\tf_swp1;\n\t@\n\t@f_fire\n\t\tgr;gr;\n\t@\n@\n\n@f_main-\n\tgr;\n\n\tf_swp2;\n\t\n\tl_loop;=\n\t\tgf;\n\t\t?cr f_swpc; ?\n\tl_until_cg;--\n\t\n\tf_fire;\n\t\n\tl_loop;=\n\t\tgf;\n\tl_until_cg;--\n\t\n\tgr;\n\tgf;\nf_main;@\n\nf_main;\n"' < 1273749179 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it would help with harder puzzles if you compiled into robozzle < 1273749197 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := is "duplicate top of exec stack" < 1273749204 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and - is "pop top of exec stack" < 1273749258 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i DID use it for igoro's "explore the world" thing, though < 1273749263 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nono "-" should be nop and " " should be pop! < 1273749284 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh can you somehow test the programs in robozzle anyway? < 1273749302 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you compile into ROBOZZLE bytecode? < 1273749344 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, nope, this is my own custom bytecode < 1273749372 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can you run the programs in robozzle? < 1273749375 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope :/ < 1273749386 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1273749390 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you wanted to make a hack for the JS client < 1273749414 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you could always compile to robozzle, if it weren't for the size limits < 1273749437 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also ";" is "run function named on value stack" < 1273749440 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1273749446 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you push a name onto the stack, not a function < 1273749466 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you can redefine functions on the fly < 1273749470 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :call . look-up < 1273749474 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := ; < 1273749488 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, what < 1273749502 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell notation < 1273749519 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what would be a good turing-complete lang to implement? < 1273749544 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would smallfuck do? < 1273749560 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell is one of the prerequisites for the channel < 1273749578 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you could implement one of my languages?!?!? < 1273749580 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, i've been here for several years, mostly intermittently < 1273749587 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. ? < 1273749596 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll need to go to bed soon, though < 1273749608 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess just toi and clue have enough stuff online to be possible < 1273749628 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm not sure they are the best ideas < 1273749639 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither is particularly easy to implement < 1273749670 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Clue <--? < 1273749678 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or at least not nearly on the level of smallfuck) (also i don't remember what smallfuck is, but i assume it's a simplified bf) < 1273749681 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it's not that one < 1273749684 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in the wiki yet < 1273749699 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.vjn.fi/oklopol/clue.py maybe < 1273749706 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1273749709 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1273749717 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.vjn.fi/oklopol/clue.rar < 1273749724 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1273749744 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway no documentation, try toi instead unless you want to search esoteric logs for specs :P < 1273749750 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1273749765 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's an example program, this dude inferred how the language works from that < 1273749776 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmkay < 1273749796 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the interpreter does not currently implement all of Toi, and is definitely not a reference implementation, it is also incredibly space consuming, hopefully the author will fix it tomorrow) < 1273749802 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's not true :P < 1273749813 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it currently does implement all of it, or should at least < 1273749819 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways, i'm going to have to go to sleep now, gnight < 1273749833 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought about fixing that, but then i thought nah < 1273749834 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night < 1273749841 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1273749857 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ilut < 1273749874 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :qt3.14 < 1273750462 0 :hiato!~fdulu@41-135-6-154.dsl.mweb.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1273751551 0 :soupdragon!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1273751560 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: 'IIRC sapir whorf is a theory for babby linguists until they figure out it's wrong.' < 1273751654 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273751726 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273751992 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's xn--v8jad0f7b6z4eoa6v0hk534a7hlwhnnl8s ? < 1273752671 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273753393 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me ask my nondeterministic turing machine < 1273753397 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: Probably 僕が問題にユニコードが好きだ。 < 1273753577 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1273753608 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not that I know russian, but I guess you mean that text is what the ASCII encodes) < 1273753871 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273753889 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: that is chinese, probably simplified :) < 1273753924 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ー_ー < 1273754469 0 :P4!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually that's japanese "Unicode problem like me." :) < 1273756882 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273757428 0 :oklofod!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273761314 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273762589 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1273763099 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273763237 0 :MizardX!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1273763580 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273763614 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1273763631 0 :soupdragon!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1273766764 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1273766866 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : then my guess is "i can use some other weird language" < 1273766885 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translate étrangère < 1273766900 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foreign < 1273766903 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofruit < 1273766913 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oeryam < 1273766916 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so not quite < 1273766928 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEgg < 1273766947 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a soupdragon _really_ shouldn't call other people food, you know < 1273766952 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1273767387 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: omghaahhahaohwow < 1273767958 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273768302 0 :Tritonio_GR!~Tritonio@150.140.229.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273768894 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273769029 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273769126 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273769748 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1273769940 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1273774185 0 :charlls!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273774258 0 :MizardX-!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1273774387 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1273774403 0 :MizardX-!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :MizardX < 1273777343 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273778336 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273779608 0 :tombom_!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1273779628 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1273780011 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273780078 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1273780250 0 :charlesq__!~charlls@201.226.222.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273780359 0 :charlls!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273780534 0 :charlesq__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1273782028 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1273783147 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273783195 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273784324 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@87.115.109.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273784884 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: null < 1273785663 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1273785762 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone wanna stubify the latest articles on the wiki? < 1273785805 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1273786299 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273786301 0 :p_q!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273786322 0 :p_q!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273787062 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273787140 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, does anyone have any ideas? I'm creating an esoteric language called Polynomial in which the whole program is a polynomial, statements are in the zeroes of the function. How would I factor the polynomial in the compiler such that the statements are in the correct order? < 1273787164 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I could factor it, I just don't know how to do it in order < 1273787228 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, why does it say "I want to use an esoteric language also" in French in the topic? :) < 1273787250 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: I'm not sure I follow you, you want to find the roots of a polynomial in 'order'? < 1273787251 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If roots are rational, there are tricks for finding the roots... < 1273787294 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know how to get the roots, I'm just wondering how the compiler would distinguish between (x + 5)(x + 3) and (x + 3)(x + 5) < 1273787297 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When factoring < 1273787305 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See what I mean? < 1273787314 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't. < 1273787325 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any ideas for the language, then? < 1273787348 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(x + 5)(x + 3) = x^2 + 8x + 15 = (x + 3)(x + 5). < 1273787355 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know < 1273787382 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But let's say (x + 5) reads in a value, and (x + 3) outputs a value. So which would the compiler know to do first? < 1273787391 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, sort them? Unless you mean the order in which they were encoded, which is then impossible, unless you muliply them by ordered primes < 1273787405 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would you do it by ordered primes? < 1273787429 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :encode them as root 1 = ( x - 2^instr1) ( x - 3^isntr2 ) etc < 1273787437 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273787456 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prime factorisation is unique < 1273787473 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I understand what you mean. < 1273787475 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or have the instructions cyclically repeating and execute them in increasing order. < 1273787479 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you know it's the one that factorises by 2 that gives you instr1 < 1273787480 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eg < 1273787508 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(x + 5)(x + 3) -> (x+2^5)(x+3^3)=whatever < 1273787521 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, once you have found the roots of whatever < 1273787526 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :factorise them < 1273787531 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273787546 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and start execution with the on that is a perfect power of 2 < 1273787551 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then 3,5,7... < 1273787570 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, so are you saying that the encoding should be different? < 1273787574 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like if root mod n is 0 its operation A, if its 1, its operation B, etc... < 1273787576 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes and no < 1273787576 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today's not the weekend < 1273787582 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: no < 1273787592 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just add two more steps < 1273787594 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't understand. Can you give an example? < 1273787615 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, (x-3) == output, (x+5)== input < 1273787631 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So how do you propose to encode? < 1273787641 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to encode, you take the order it was in, say, outp then inp < 1273787653 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and assign primes, 2 and 3 < 1273787658 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273787671 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, you do exponentation for the root values < 1273787694 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh...you mean (2^x - 3)(3^x + 5)? < 1273787706 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so (x+5)(x-3)-->(x+2^5)(x-3^3) < 1273787712 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you make the polynomial < 1273787729 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you determine which bases to use for the exponentiation? < 1273787734 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, to decode, you find the roots < 1273787741 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: increasing primes < 1273787748 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I get it < 1273787752 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :starting rith 2 for the first instruction < 1273787758 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So 2,3,5,7,11, etc ? < 1273787762 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273787775 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, great idea. Thanks! < 1273787779 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1273787789 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought my whole idea was destroyed :) < 1273787793 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Naah < 1273787794 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But now I can do it < 1273787804 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just need to write a compiler now. < 1273787821 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, my idea: Assume there are 15 different instructions and you want to do 5 and then 3. Since 3 is less than 5, add 15 to get 18. Then the polynomial is (x-5)(x-18). Alternatively one could substract 15 from 5 to get (x+10)(x-3). < 1273787822 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone know of a good method for factoring complex/imaginary zeroes? < 1273787842 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Newton-Rhapson for real < 1273787877 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that where p/q is the root and p is a factor of the last term and q is a factor of the first? < 1273787886 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the only one I've learned < 1273787890 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of brute force, though < 1273787941 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: No, that's not it. But there are tricks to speed that method a lot. < 1273787974 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I looked it up -- it uses derivatives < 1273787987 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still guessing, but not brute force < 1273787990 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: I see what you're saying, but it is possible that that will give anoter root, eg, say you want -1, after -2, so you get (x-2)(x-1) -> (x-2)(x-16) -> (x-2)(x-4)(x-4) .... < 1273788026 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, is the Newton-Rhapson method the one from which Newton's fractal is created? < 1273788071 0 :power!~aaa_xswza@94.183.66.38 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273788092 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: How did you get that last step? x-16 != (x-4)^2 < 1273788120 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, (x-4)(x+4), still encodes anoter instruction < 1273788142 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I've seen, Newton's method uses an initial guess. How would you put that in a compiler? < 1273788143 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newton's_method < 1273788144 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, x - 16 != (x - 4)(x + 4) = x^2 - 16. < 1273788157 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: aaah, good point < 1273788158 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, I'm already on that exact page :) < 1273788209 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: but I'm sure that there would be ambigous factorisations of non linear roots for that notation < 1273788239 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I just thought of something. How would I use hiato's method with complex zeroes? < 1273788250 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can a real have a complex exponent? < 1273788256 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: why encode them? < 1273788264 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Polynomial factorization in reals/complex is always unique modulo order of factors. < 1273788265 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273788265 0 :power!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :nice < 1273788271 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1273788275 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Silly me :) < 1273788293 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does newton's method work with complex numbers? < 1273788309 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Not very well... < 1273788315 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does? < 1273788331 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: (x^2-16) -> (x±4) or (x^2-1) -> (X±1) ? < 1273788338 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in your encoding < 1273788342 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it will work with complex numbers < 1273788345 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you trying to do? < 1273788348 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how will you know when to subtract < 1273788352 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least what root it converges to can jump wildly. < 1273788378 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato: Well -4 executes before 4 (same with -1 and 1). < 1273788380 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: Find the zeroes of a function in my compiler. < 1273788389 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what function? < 1273788416 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm creating an esoteric language called Polynomial. The whole program is a function. < 1273788422 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Statements are in the zeroes. < 1273788427 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :,rmmmmmm < 1273788453 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: no, I'm saying, does (x²-16) give instructions ±1 or ±4? As you don't know whether 15 was added/subtracted to encode it before or after another arbitrary instruction < 1273788461 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know solving quadratic equations is easy < 1273788466 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1273788469 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey maedhros, are the roots all on the real line/ < 1273788469 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273788473 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are they complex too < 1273788479 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both < 1273788482 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ummmmmmmmmm < 1273788494 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is impossible to implement < 1273788495 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously < 1273788509 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using hiato's method it's not. < 1273788523 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: so your way is ambigious for any partial (and thus any at all) factorisation < 1273788599 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: Why would you think so? < 1273788618 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the roots of a polynomial are t1,t2,..,tn then the polynomial (x-t1)(x-t2)...(x-tn) = x^n +/- (t1 + t2 + ... + tn)x^(n-1) + ... +/- (t1 t2 ... tn) < 1273788633 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? < 1273788649 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :N(t1 t2 ... tn) = N(t1) N(t2) ... N(tn) hm < 1273788656 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So? < 1273788681 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can we put a circle around the roots of a polynomial? < 1273788689 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: yes, but still possible if he implements it well < 1273788694 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if all the roots |ti| < 5 < 1273788700 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can we find a bound like 5? < 1273788734 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: so far as I understand, that will be solved by virtue of the roots only encoding a finite set of instructions < 1273788744 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are the roots gaussian integers? < 1273788755 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't know < 1273788758 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are they wild trancendentals < 1273788762 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1273788772 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.......which < 1273788779 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, well there you have it < 1273788780 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The whole language is in integers < 1273788788 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it is integers this makes the problem much easier < 1273788794 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1273788802 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could try things like rational roots I guess < 1273788807 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and irreducibility testing < 1273788808 0 :nice!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273788812 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and finite field factorization < 1273788827 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what half that stuff is :) < 1273788849 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, heh, naah, we manually encode the polynomials, so no need to check for anything < 1273788854 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a really crude first approach you could probably just grab SWI prolog and write (x-t1)*...*(x-tn) #= input and it'll solve for t1,t2... < 1273788864 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"manually encode" like how? < 1273788879 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they arent' written in the form 6x^4 - 7x^3 + ..? < 1273788884 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Increasing primes < 1273788890 0 :dougx!~dougx@vc-41-28-119-188.umts.vodacom.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1273788907 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. (x + 3)(x + 5) -> (x + 2^3)(x + 3^5) < 1273788924 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hiato's idea < 1273788949 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, it let's you unambigiously determine the order of encoding < 1273788951 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :............ what < 1273788968 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is an example input to the program? < 1273788970 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye now < 1273788973 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273788979 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The idea was that you take some set of integers and encode them as roots of a olynomial < 1273788982 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*p < 1273789007 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that set being the instructions, of whatever meaning < 1273789023 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck why did he leave < 1273789033 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, lol < 1273789039 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foreigners < 1273789046 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man that guy has no idea what he is doing < 1273789049 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1273789059 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have no idea what he is doing < 1273789063 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1273789063 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is frustrating < 1273789070 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a vague one < 1273789072 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seemed to describe about 20 different situations < 1273789077 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1273789114 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, I think I know what he was trying, and I think I gave him a solution thatworks, but I doubt he can use it < 1273789150 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:54 < maedhros777> I just need to write a compiler now. < 1273789158 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that he will < 1273789164 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for polynomials < 1273789266 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if it would be possible to get Dwarf Fortress to work on Android < 1273789321 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks playing dwarf fortress is harder than being NASA mission control < 1273789353 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would name his children Sgeo if he found a way < 1273789821 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sends a message to his professor saying that, while my script wasn't perfect, it's far better than the professor's answer. < 1273790052 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ideone.com/u582h < 1273790185 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273790209 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273790448 0 :gm|lap!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1273790605 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.9/20100315083431] < 1273791108 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vabot die < 1273791120 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong chan :P < 1273791317 0 :tombom_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273791560 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273792106 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273792219 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rawr. < 1273792250 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My Internet connection hates rain. < 1273792297 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: underflow < 1273792317 0 :dougx!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273792347 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hates people with crappy Internet connections. < 1273792367 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273792374 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello again < 1273792407 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, sorry for leaving without answering your question, soupdragon < 1273792443 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've (partially) recovered < 1273792454 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An example program would be zeroes of 72 and i < 1273792466 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273792492 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the input would be x^2 - (72+i)x + 72i = 0? < 1273792513 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1273792516 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hang on, let me consider < 1273792542 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273792568 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273792574 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it would be x^3 - 72x^2 - x + 72 < 1273792586 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complex conjugates aren't executed < 1273792595 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, one of them is executes < 1273792602 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops, I meant executed :) < 1273792608 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well I am confused < 1273792615 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's (x - 72)(x - i)(x + i) < 1273792623 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see it that way < 1273792625 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := (x - 72)(x^2 - 1) < 1273792627 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273792648 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 and -1 are the zeros of x^2 - 1 < 1273792657 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i and -i are the zeros of x^2 + 1 < 1273792660 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, oops :) < 1273792664 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're right < 1273792683 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why is it a cubic? I mean that has 3 roots < 1273792687 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This darned thing seems to be obsessed with dropping connection. < 1273792696 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :72, i and -i < 1273792717 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I am having absurd difficulty getting a single freaking webpage to load. :( < 1273792739 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complex zeroes of the form a + bi are only considered by the absolute value of b < 1273792750 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a, but that's unrelated < 1273792768 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, negative a is different from a < 1273792769 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1273792772 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But -b = b < 1273792774 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1273792789 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273792790 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to go now, sorry to leave you devastated :) < 1273792802 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is lost but it's okay < 1273792803 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273792852 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-46-253.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1273792858 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1273792939 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273793171 0 :Oranjer!~HP_Admini@adsl-243-203-60.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273794705 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1273794758 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1273794773 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quantum computers can do linear search in O(sqrt(n)) < 1273794774 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273794872 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273795058 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273795137 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273795143 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello, I'm back < 1273795170 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi...... back ......... :D < 1273795175 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just been wondering -- are there any esoteric or real programming languages in another language (besides English)? < 1273795185 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strange thought < 1273795195 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A programming language in another language :)