< 1273883094 0 :augur!~augur@96.231.230.150 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273883180 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: underflow < 1273883188 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, Finnish. < 1273883196 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273883197 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translate suden kesy jalostettu muoto < 1273883199 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :processed form of the domesticated wolf < 1273883219 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's actually a much better translation than what I got last time. < 1273883274 0 :gm|lap!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1273883275 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, "suden" is the genitive of "susi"? Or is it the accusative? < 1273883298 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If "kesy" and "suden" have to match case, then I guess it has to be the accusative. < 1273883308 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: [BX] Outwit. Outplay. Outlast. Survivor BitchX. < 1273883361 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Muoto" is just the accusative, of course. How does "jalostettu" come about? What's that word made of? < 1273883561 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 Humble Indie Bundle < 1273883571 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273884079 0 :augur!~augur@96.231.230.150 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273884087 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273884234 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273884239 0 :myndzi!myndzi@tengototen.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273884321 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: how's HackEgo doing the translating there? < 1273884397 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using Google Translate. < 1273884498 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: null < 1273884565 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1273884669 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pukes
< 1273884867 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273885271 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273887127 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273887196 0 :mre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1273887219 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273887586 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273887599 0 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273887636 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1273888258 0 :mre!~Agent@203.109.161.103 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273888980 0 :Gregor-L_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: THAT IS NOT THE CORRECT WAY TO MAKE SOUP < 1273888989 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is not the correct way to puke < 1273889231 0 :augur!~augur@c-68-54-80-152.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273889556 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L_: there are a lot of events after which you could say that. < 1273889588 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1273889603 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, your L got flipped about a 45-degree line and scaled up by a factor of sqrt(2). How did you do that? < 1273889615 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-L_: Well, you see, first you stick the dragon in the soup. Then, you put stuff in it. Then, you take out the dragon. < 1273889629 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: UNDERSCORE < 1273889646 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is alise < 1273889649 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1273889651 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :???? they talk to me sometimes < 1273889669 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise is all the voices in your head. < 1273889707 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-48-53.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273889834 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273889878 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Polynomial < 1273889884 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at the hello world :) < 1273889893 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't realize it would be so huge < 1273889933 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pardon all the zeroes, I wrote a program to generate trinomials from zeroes and it's not very good yet < 1273889984 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello!!!!!!! < 1273890006 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :) < 1273890024 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you see the hello world? < 1273890079 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1273890089 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's insane < 1273890116 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried putting it into Wolfram Alpha to get the final result and it didn't have enough space for all the numbers in the search box :) < 1273890168 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how I'm going to trim down these coefficients < 1273890199 0 :augur!~augur@c-68-54-80-152.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273890206 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the final coefficients probably overflow all data types in C. < 1273890213 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including long long :) < 1273890217 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use bignums < 1273890222 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1273890238 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How will I get the final polynomial of the hello world, though? < 1273890247 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would take me all day to do it by hand < 1273890266 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, more like a month, or several years =D < 1273890284 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should write a program to do that < 1273890299 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Yes, this is why computers exist. < 1273890304 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=D < 1273890311 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why we learn C. < 1273890334 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, have you ever used D? < 1273890347 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HORRORS UPON HORRORS AWAIT YOU < 1273890355 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it that bad? < 1273890367 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Language isn't terrible. < 1273890380 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad language such as swear words < 1273890384 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The runtime is such a massive bitch to get running. < 1273890388 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard it doesn't have much support, though < 1273890395 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No IDEs or anything < 1273890408 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does have two standard libraries, though. < 1273890420 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1273890420 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the syntax from the look of it. < 1273890430 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe someone should make D++. < 1273890463 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or E < 1273890479 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One that has support and good runtime < 1273890493 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The secret is to not fork the language. < 1273890500 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean? < 1273890590 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The way I like is a variations of C like this: < 1273890601 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : x=y; --> y@x! < 1273890608 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What???!!! < 1273890610 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : *x=*y; --> y@@x@! < 1273890623 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : x=strlen(y); --> y strlen;x! < 1273890624 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so ! is assignment, and @ is derep < 1273890631 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's postfax < 1273890643 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ; is function call operator < 1273890652 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1273890657 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Postfax...what kind of language is that? < 1273890662 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION adds this language to tHE WIZARD
< 1273890673 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is "tHE WIZARD"? < 1273890684 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 hypothetical langage design wizard < 1273890691 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1273890693 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a parody of trendy things like ruby and python and such < 1273890700 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1273890701 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically you get a bunch of check boxes and radio buttons < 1273890710 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you choose things like syntax, evaluation order, .. etc < 1273890715 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/84556/whats-your-favorite-programmer-cartoon < 1273890716 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it prints out an interpreter for the language < 1273890750 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the one with the kid's name being a MySQL injection < 1273890766 0 :Gregor-L_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor-L < 1273890772 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273890782 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : int main(int argc,char**argv){puts("Hello, world!\n");} --> :main(int'argc' char**'argv'--int){"Hello, world!\n"puts;0} < 1273890786 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notice that the top one doesn't even print newlines :) < 1273890814 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you have any URL or examples of wizard? < 1273890899 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1273890915 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: I want to make that! < 1273890933 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I invented another problem on anarchy golf < 1273890937 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, at least, to have that. < 1273890946 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anarchy golf? < 1273890963 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273890977 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 - I had written a wiki page about it, but I deleted my wiki < 1273890992 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Count+asterisks+ < 1273891003 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if anyone likes this idea I would love improvements < 1273891007 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it? < 1273891019 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to explain it to ehird but he just ignored me < 1273891042 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: Without seeing it how can I send improvement? < 1273891055 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 well the idea is all that exists < 1273891067 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: What is this site? < 1273891089 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: The anarchy golf is a site for codegolf, try to write a short program for the given input/output, there is many program language choices < 1273891127 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so the challenge is to write a program that outputs the number of asterisks? < 1273891130 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't invent that site, but I did post some of the problems < 1273891140 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's an interesting idea < 1273891143 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool < 1273891159 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what do the rankings mean? < 1273891173 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, how are they ranked? < 1273891174 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Yes, that's it. However, any program that complies with the example input/output is OK, even if it doesn't count the number of asterisks. (If your program is cheating, you can write "(cheat)" after your name) < 1273891185 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ranking is, 10000 for the shortest program < 1273891194 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, that's how the "score" is < 1273891201 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "rank" column is 1 for the shortest program < 1273891224 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "size" tells how many bytes in the program < 1273891232 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So people compete for shortest program, lowest time, etc? < 1273891247 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "statistics" column is binary/alnum/symbol < 1273891264 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The time is mostly not used. You compete for the shortest program. < 1273891270 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273891272 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The time is available just in case you are interested < 1273891276 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds cool, I should try it < 1273891286 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feeling kind of lazy now, though :) < 1273891297 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can try it. Push "use form" and then you can select the program langage you want, and enter your name in "Your name" field. < 1273891309 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273891319 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, that's a lot of languages < 1273891336 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it is a binary file you can just upload the file < 1273891347 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can it be known if a program would work or not? < 1273891360 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the site have its own compilers? < 1273891370 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The site does have its own compilers on the execution server < 1273891375 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is a great idea < 1273891376 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it will tell you if it is success or not < 1273891385 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, it has brainfuck :) < 1273891388 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This should all be in a Hackiki :P ) < 1273891401 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone ever made the smallest program for a problem in brainfuck? < 1273891428 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273891435 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow :) < 1273891449 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once I generated brainfuck programs by size and searched for ones that printed text < 1273891452 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the statistics, is size measured in bytes? < 1273891457 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I didn't actually find any interesting text.... < 1273891465 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1273891468 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you meant on the golf < 1273891470 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also just make the shortest program in each individual category, and if you post for more than one program language you can have multiple scores < 1273891472 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't play the golf < 1273891476 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is measured in bytes < 1273891493 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So someone made a solution in Flogscript with 2 bytes??!!! < 1273891497 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of the formats are binary formats. < 1273891507 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: Yes. < 1273891508 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, it's a cheat < 1273891521 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one in Befunge isn't, though < 1273891525 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Impressive < 1273891539 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still might be a cheat. < 1273891541 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you view the programs they submitted? < 1273891552 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes the authors did not put "(cheat)" after their name < 1273891558 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can view the programs at post-mortem time. < 1273891563 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13day(s) and 23:27:55 before deadline (05/29 10:03:09 JST), all source codes will be revealed after the deadline < 1273891572 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, ok < 1273891574 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that means, in 2 weeks you will be able to view the programs. < 1273891578 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeo < 1273891584 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops, I meant yep :) < 1273891595 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can still post programs after the deadline, but the date will be red in that case) < 1273891669 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even for ones that are cheats, you can try to figure out how to cheat in that problem! But you can do both cheat and genuine solution. I like to post both cheating and genuine solutions to problems, some other people also like to do so < 1273891687 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Palindromic+prime < 1273891690 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might try that < 1273891705 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1273891728 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many palindromic primes are needed? < 1273891764 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See the example output, that's how many are needed < 1273891773 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273891789 0 :augur!~augur@c-68-54-80-152.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273891867 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking at some finished ones, and the smallest code is ugly :) < 1273891878 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I guess that's necessary to make a small program < 1273891946 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, a few other hints: "exec is denied" does not apply to shell scripts. The source file name is always "test." and the extension. In interpreted languages, usually the source file will be the only file in the current directory. < 1273891959 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273892000 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm going to die: main() without return type or arguments :) http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?char+pyramid/nn_1271263335&cpp < 1273892005 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pikhq < 1273892026 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: no arguments is fine... no type is not < 1273892033 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I know < 1273892040 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use int main() all the time < 1273892050 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But just main()...disgusting... < 1273892061 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C does not actually require the type, the type is assumed "int" < 1273892067 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you use the correct compiler parameters) < 1273892079 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still a gross stain upon the language :) < 1273892114 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1273892150 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :public static void main(String[] args) < 1273892153 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could be worse. < 1273892157 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the asterisk problem, how is the input generated? i.e. is it with newlines? < 1273892171 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yay java < 1273892172 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, Java doesn't even return an int :) < 1273892186 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean, how is the input generated? < 1273892194 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there's a System.exit or something < 1273892197 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each input is run through the program a separate time. < 1273892198 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there newlines? < 1273892210 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are newlines if that is how it is shown < 1273892225 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273892229 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So at the end of each line there will be a newline character. < 1273892277 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273892289 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then EOF at the end? < 1273892327 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it will be EOF when the end is reached < 1273892357 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, I get it now < 1273892408 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These are also my problems: http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Half+Sierpinski http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Half+Sierpinski < 1273892415 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I like the other problems too < 1273892450 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you think is the function with the least character that reads from standard input? < 1273892455 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fgets, maybe? < 1273892475 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. I don't know for sure but I think so < 1273892483 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll use that < 1273892486 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye now < 1273892501 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273892588 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I won "PrinterOriented Banner" problem even though I did not create that problem < 1273892654 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I improved JSMIPS' speed today. < 1273892657 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By a little bit. < 1273892670 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OHHHH that's what vi is for < 1273892693 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay z80 still rocks < 1273892696 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean, what's wat vi is for? < 1273892720 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in anarchy golf < 1273892763 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I still don't understand your comment < 1273892774 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you refering to any specific problem? < 1273892795 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1273892805 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Interpret+Perl+Code <-- the bash ones are kinda obvious < 1273892816 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it certainly is < 1273892820 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same deal with zsh + fish < 1273892829 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, is same zsh and fish even < 1273892836 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a z80 entry in sight :/ < 1273892870 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write one if you want to < 1273893030 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes I write a bit strange solution for "Network mask v2" http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?Network+mask+v2/zzo38%28file%2Cpostmortem%29_1273244351&zsh < 1273893030 0 :gm|lap|oops!~gm@121-73-186-186.dsl.telstraclear.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273893097 0 :Oranjer!~HP_Admini@adsl-243-203-60.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273893104 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many problems have you gotten best score? < 1273893168 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they need to add a input-fix mode (I have written the patch already) < 1273893185 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1273893192 0 :gm|lap|oops!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1273893192 0 :gm|lap|oops!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1273893200 0 :gm|lap|oops!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :gm|lap < 1273893207 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1273893219 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273893527 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273893703 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "Count asterisks" is difficult to make with dc, because if the input difficult, but I still managed to do it. (But this program does not actually count all of the asterisks) < 1273894653 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1273894719 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273894878 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1273895312 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273895369 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1273895479 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273895507 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1273895556 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273895558 0 :Gregor-L_!~Gregor@67-129-37-226.dia.static.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273895631 0 :Gregor-L_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor-L < 1273895642 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1273896043 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273896419 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273896423 0 :Halph!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1273896433 0 :Halph!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :coppro < 1273899169 0 :augur_!~augur@96.231.216.193 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273899243 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273899551 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273899650 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273899744 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I am leaving. You are about to explode. < 1273900059 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273901009 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't explode yet < 1273901163 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273901310 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273901483 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have not yet exploded. < 1273901556 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wants his damned HTTP access back
< 1273901607 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you out of HTTP access? < 1273901610 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1273901612 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again. < 1273901617 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A. Fucking. Gain. < 1273901643 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But why? What happened? What is going wrong? < 1273901667 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can access IRC and Gopher. < 1273901673 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? Because my ISP sucks. < 1273901714 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, look. It's back. It was out for a few hours, but it's back. < 1273901726 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like last night. < 1273901736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking hell I hate this. < 1273901923 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does FTP and SMTP and POP3 work? < 1273901932 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, no, and no, respectively. < 1273901934 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why does HTTP stop working even though IRC and Gopher continues to work? < 1273901946 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because fuck you, we have a monopoly. < 1273901975 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Near as we could conclude last night, I was having an 88% packet loss rate, and IRC was only barely able to work during that. < 1273902008 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least a lot of my text files are accessible using Gopher protocol! < 1273902334 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When my internet stops, *all* protocols stop working. < 1273902351 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's satellite. < 1273902809 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's almost like they go "What, you were expecting service? Sorry, we're just going to take your money. Much more profitable." < 1273903086 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd have freaking better Internet access if I went to the Northern Territories of Canada. < 1273903102 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE ROADS < 1273903271 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1273903311 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: soupdragon < 1273903892 0 :Oranjer!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273904435 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I noticed the GNU FDL contains something which seems to be in there specifically so that when Wikipedia relicensed all of their files, it would not be a violation of this license. < 1273904496 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's correct < 1273904519 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that clause was put in at the behest of the Wikimedia Foundation. < 1273904535 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As, frankly, the FDL was a terrible choice of license for Wikipedia. < 1273904611 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1273904632 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: well, at the time, there weren't many licenses around < 1273904643 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :True. < 1273904645 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they picked FDL because it existed, which was a strong benefit over many of the other licenses people have suggested < 1273904651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still terrible. < 1273904654 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's pretty much its only advantage < 1273904669 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GFDL is good for some things; I used it for the C-INTERCAL manual < 1273904677 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty much designed for book-style manuals < 1273904690 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1273904696 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's decent for a manual. < 1273904706 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's *workable* for books. < 1273904725 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not entirely sure it's *possible* to follow it for a wiki. < 1273904840 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is, but Wikipedia didn't < 1273905058 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like command-line version of DigitalMZX Vault? < 1273905060 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/bB8e9wNY < 1273905099 0 :Adrian^L_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Adrian^L < 1273905265 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Adrian^L at 2600? < 1273905286 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, phalse.2600.COM and 2600.com resolve to the same IP address < 1273905313 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps you faked it? Or is it proper? < 1273905513 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reverse DNS resolves to phalse.2600.COM however, it seems < 1273906392 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found a list of secret services codes < 1273906398 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I won't tell you right now < 1273906404 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273906420 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WELL THEY'RE SECRET, DUH < 1273906528 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's it < 1273907136 0 :mre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1273907275 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you become a threat to society by taking pictures of Secret Service agents in your own office? < 1273907387 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not see Obama on the list of secret codenames. < 1273907396 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps because it is secret! < 1273907406 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sort of people who think of doing that are possibly threats to society for other reasons < 1273907489 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that is necessarily the case at all. < 1273907505 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VERY GOOD ANSWER, CITIZEN AIS523 < 1273907512 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even then, you aren't necessarily deliberately taking pictures of Secret Service agents. It could be automatic due to security cameras and so on. < 1273907527 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ducks beneath the rock again
< 1273907535 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it comfortable down there? < 1273907539 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Secret Service might even be a threat to society too, there are reports about such things < 1273907560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it's a bit cramped, but it does have internet access < 1273907623 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE ARE NO SUCH REPORTS. ANYONE BELIEVING IN SUCH REPORTS IS A DANGER TO SOCIETY. < 1273907749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Unlike me. < 1273907750 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1273908226 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not finished writing a solitaire card program yet. But it is nearly completed. < 1273908483 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Why do people think legalizing drugs is The Answer? I thought The Answer was 42. < 1273908501 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :legalizing 42 drugs, that's the ticket < 1273908546 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which 42, though? < 1273908588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHICHEVER ARE GOOD FOR SOCIETY < 1273908685 0 :gm|lap!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1273908695 0 :mre!~Agent@203.109.161.103 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273908836 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273908880 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1273909250 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273910247 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!run bash < 1273910257 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!echo hi < 1273910264 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1273910281 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so I am still connected < 1273910399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1273910400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1273911508 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273912285 0 :sofia!~pc-2@118.96.179.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273912315 0 :sofia!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273913136 0 :SgeoN1!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1273914780 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-2-46.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273916484 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1273916940 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-28-177.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1273917008 0 :cheater3!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1273917620 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1273920350 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273921179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn ais just left :( < 1273921186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn,* < 1273921189 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, there? < 1273921205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait you didn't know VHDL did you? Only verilog < 1273921369 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1273922309 0 :mre!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: I'll be back < 1273924540 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273925592 0 :hiato!~fdulu@41-135-6-154.dsl.mweb.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1273926122 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, how large does the stack usually become in befunge93? < 1273926142 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, would 2047 entries be enough for all "common" programs? < 1273926153 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is thinking about befunge93 in VHDL
< 1273926182 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dynamic size would be an extreme PITA < 1273926771 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1273927150 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.226.164 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273927177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flawbatness < 1273927462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, two possible summer projects that I'm considering: befunge93 in VHDL, befunge93 on Lego Mindstorms < 1273927468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, opinions? < 1273927471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VHDL < 1273927482 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mindstorms is a fairly regular robotic platform from what i gather. and you can use C < 1273927484 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so too easy < 1273927485 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNLESS < 1273927488 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the lego would be fun too, output would be a flashing lego led < 1273927488 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :each robot was a cell in fungespace < 1273927494 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they physically walked around < 1273927498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I only have two RCXes < 1273927500 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that is the case, that * G_64 < 1273927509 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: eh, 2-celled unefunge < 1273927511 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who needs more < 1273927514 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1273927546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but I was thinking of using a flashing LED to output the bits of console output < 1273927552 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sensors to input 1/0 bits < 1273927555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd go for VHDL, because it's so fucking alien < 1273927559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it'd be the FASTEST. BEFUNGE-93. EVAR < 1273927561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, I could do sound! < 1273927598 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, except I don't own an FPGA to test it on, so it would be simulation only (but with the aim to make most synthesiable (sp?) in theory) < 1273927602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could do sound with vhdl <3 < 1273927605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the exception would be file loading and console IO < 1273927612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I could do sound on RCX < 1273927628 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has a built in speaker, but I think it is limited to some set of 8 or whatever different beeps < 1273927631 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's boring < 1273927633 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even whoring < 1273927645 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, not sure about brickOS... but that needs a gcc 2.95.x cross compiler < 1273927652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I'm not sure I can even get working nowdays < 1273927700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.flickr.com/photos/starsammy/4605760111/sizes/o/in/pool-16135094@N00/ ;; good lord, this is /not/ how recipies should look! < 1273927701 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                       | < 1273927702 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                       |\ < 1273927707 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks myndzi < 1273927872 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273927918 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.nlm.nih.gov/dreamanatomy/images/1200%20dpi/IV-A-01.jpg < 1273927935 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/Xf057.jpg ;; translation < 1273928137 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273928165 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://www.flickr.com/photos/starsammy/4605760111/sizes/o/in/pool-16135094@N00/ ;; good lord, this is /not/ how recipies should look! <-- wonderful idea < 1273928171 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, just wonderful < 1273928176 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :flow charts! < 1273928179 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Horrible idea; just horrible. < 1273928183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, why < 1273928210 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it makes gooking into engineering, easy to follow < 1273928210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recipes are perfectly fine; obfuscating their clear prose with multi-directional diagrams that leave no obvious order in which cooking should be done and leave out vital details is ridiculous. < 1273928222 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recipes /are/ easy to follow. < 1273928227 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And imagine that diagram for a complicated recipe. < 1273928228 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-239-38.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1273928231 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, they need to be bullet lists then < 1273928236 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would start looking more like fungot's graph. < 1273928237 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: the diggers must have been enough to fnord and remote farmers who at some period of life appeared to have two sharers of his mysteries; a fnord portuguese fnord from the house and the ancient pain. < 1273928239 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, plus this allows concurrent cooking < 1273928243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :English is scalable. < 1273928271 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, plus → is increasing time < 1273928279 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and some tasks are concurrent there < 1273928305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find those incredibly easy to follow < 1273928308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You sing its praises but have you actually taken it on yourself to think of - perhaps even read - the corresponding recipe before deciding that the flowchart is superior? < 1273928311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the diagrams I mean < 1273928321 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now consider a more complicated diagram, and its corresponding recipe. Iterate until you're convinced. < 1273928324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no where are they? < 1273928333 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Pardon? < 1273928340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, "corresponding recipe" < 1273928343 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where are they? < 1273928354 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, get out your nearest recipe book. < 1273928366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah could be a problem < 1273928368 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google? < 1273928371 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah good idea < 1273928380 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273928385 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but there may be different variants of the same recipe? < 1273928388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Admittedly amateur-written recipes might not be of such good quality, and professional ones may have copyright issues, but I'm sure you'll find something. < 1273928390 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, yes. < 1273928393 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't really matter. < 1273928414 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273928457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay the flow chart isn't perfect, for example it says "mix" but with what? an electric mixer? a wooden ladle? < 1273928471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the idea isn't fundamentally flawed though < 1273928485 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now imagine extending that "mix" to have the full information. < 1273928495 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite horizontally extended, you might say. < 1273928496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :footnotes? definitions chapter? < 1273928501 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By which I mean "I hope you like scrolling in two dimensions." < 1273928502 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multi-row? < 1273928507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And good luck /printing/ this. < 1273928512 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or will you put a computer right next to all your foodery? < 1273928522 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: So now it's obfuscated English text, cross-referenced. < 1273928527 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll take simple words. < 1273928527 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yes, on the freezer door :P < 1273928540 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: And jog over to your freezer whenever you complete a step? < 1273928546 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, okay but simply making the arrows wider to allow 2 lines of text would work < 1273928549 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people keep cookbooks right next to their working surface. < 1273928560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Do that, then replace the arrows with "then". What's lost? < 1273928570 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well okay, computers everywhere. I'm still waiting for the holographic terminals. Oh and the flying cars... < 1273928580 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the Singularity... < 1273928584 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that < 1273928630 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it won't matter since we won't have to cook. :P < 1273928635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1273928662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway I think a directed graph would be better. Could also be nicely rendered with graphviz < 1273928667 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you want to. But then you'll just use your amazing memory to know the entire recipe. < 1273928715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the problems with current recipes is that it is hard to keep your location in them, maybe some sort of marker placed on top of the text would help < 1273928723 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you need to check back several times during cooking < 1273928775 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it should be strictly chronological order. It is no good to find that you should have done something else in another beaker 10 minutes before, and during that done the thing described first < 1273928783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seen that happen < 1273928801 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, that is simply a badly-written recipe. < 1273928806 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~chatzilla@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273928809 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, most ones are IME < 1273928817 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most words are badly written. < 1273928819 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, not written for engineers at least < 1273928827 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What makes you think flowcharts won't be badly made too? < 1273928837 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cookingforengineers.com/? I've never used it, mind. < 1273928841 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1273928846 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks
< 1273928887 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah! I thought someone else had invented ginger jam before me, but it is savoury! < 1273928896 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't seem too different from normal < 1273928897 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I am the first to produce a substance that will turn a Rich Tea into a Ginger Nut! < 1273928904 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've commonly had rhubarb and ginger jam! < 1273928917 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It's certainly more precise. < 1273928918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ginger jam? sounds familiar < 1273928925 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, to some extent yes < 1273928927 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it seems people use the term to mean something you'd put on meat. < 1273928935 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But nothing! Nothing! That will turn a Rich Tea into a Ginger Nut! < 1273928936 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, at least no "add salt until it tates good" < 1273928939 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am the sole innovator in this area! < 1273928954 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rich Teas are disgusting. < 1273928956 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no I seem ginger jam on toast < 1273928956 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: "I don't like putting hot items into my refrigerator, so I like to use an aluminum half sheet pan as a heat sink." < 1273928959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Die. < 1273928961 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Shit. < 1273928962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't like it myself < 1273928969 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't like ginger at all in fact < 1273928970 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is quite spicy. But it was nice on biscuits. < 1273928976 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was sweet and all. < 1273928979 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: They're bland and useless for dunking! < 1273928988 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, :D < 1273928992 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about the heat sink < 1273928995 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I quite like them dunked. They're no more bland than Digestives. < 1273929003 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273929003 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway. < 1273929016 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recipe for ginger jam - so imprecise that AnMaster will cry -: < 1273929033 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, however, what about stuff like "fry the bacon", how do you know when to stop? In most recipes it doesn't seem to give an exact time < 1273929036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put a little bit of ground ginger into a mixing bowl. Add water until it is not opaque; a bit more than 50% opaque. < 1273929037 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mix. < 1273929041 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I beg to differ. They have so little structure that they disintegrate when you hold them in the steam. < 1273929041 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus that would vary anyway < 1273929046 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Add about two-to-three slightly-more-than-teaspoons of sugar. < 1273929047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need some good measurement for that stuff < 1273929048 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mix. < 1273929050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no? < 1273929055 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put in a pan. Gas Mark 5 or so. < 1273929058 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here comes the imprecise bit < 1273929068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every now and then, add about 1/3 of a tablespoon of cornflour. < 1273929072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And some sugar to offset its taste. < 1273929073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what is gas mark 5 on an electric stove? < 1273929073 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mix. < 1273929083 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait until the sugar explodes^Wcaramelises. < 1273929086 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Take off the hob. < 1273929088 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Leave for a minute. < 1273929091 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tada, a little bit of ginger jam! < 1273929099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't have gas stoves in Sweden. Well we probably do but extremely rare < 1273929100 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scale up to make something that'll actually cover two slices of toast... IF YOU DARE. < 1273929105 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it starts boiling you've done something wrong. < 1273929116 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yeah I don't know actually, I did this at the unit out of extreme boredom < 1273929122 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't have a gas stove here I don't think < 1273929134 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it produces something quite nice. Very sweet obviously. < 1273929147 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I swear, spread it on a Rich Tea and it tastes like a Ginger Nut. Or your money back. < 1273929149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably in stuff like mobile units like at campings < 1273929154 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever you call them < 1273929165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Electric stoves tend to be so, so slow to heat up! < 1273929167 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smaller than mobile home units towed by a normal car < 1273929172 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, maybe *shrug* < 1273929186 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Every now and then, add about 1/3 of a tablespoon of cornflour. <-- how often < 1273929190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this IS TO IMPRECISE! < 1273929192 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every now and then. < 1273929193 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*TOO < 1273929197 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TOO yes < 1273929202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically when you notice "no this is very runny". < 1273929212 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, how do we define "very runny"? < 1273929212 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It shouldn't be thick though. The huge explosion of the sugar makes it thick. < 1273929220 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Like it's only slightly thicker than pure water. < 1273929227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how slightly? < 1273929229 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1273929233 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thingy. < 1273929237 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, see why I have problems with recipes? < 1273929248 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I would have written it down but this was the first time I'd done it. < 1273929255 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm okay < 1273929256 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it was basically, you know, "oh fuck it let's add some more". < 1273929261 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sage takes up ~1.4GB. < 1273929263 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1273929269 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Because. < 1273929273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, also how much sugar is required to offset the taste? < 1273929289 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: About half a slightly-bigger-than-teaspoon (a slightly-bigger-than-teaspoon is one of those plastic spoon things.) < 1273929291 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, plus this could be represented in a flow chart with a loop :D < 1273929300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with entry/exit condition of course < 1273929325 0 :hiato!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: going for my weekend away in bryanston~ < 1273929329 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, there needs to be a nice name for the sequence (x+1)/x for integral (natural?) x. < 1273929338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if it is just (1/x) + 1. < 1273929370 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still think that a name is needed for the various sets of complex numbers. < 1273929370 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I think we should list it in moles. Just imagine: ... mol sugar (chemical formula goes here) < 1273929384 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where a and b are in N, Z, Q and R. < 1273929390 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complex numbers are weird, man. < 1273929396 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird as fuck. < 1273929397 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know that for Z it's Gaussian Integers. < 1273929408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, not really. Not compared to quaternions < 1273929437 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only thing weirder is infinitely complex numbers. Which I just defined to be complex numbers, extended with recursion: you have (a + b ii) where ii^2 = -1 and a and b are infinitely complex numbers. < 1273929450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOUR MIND WILL BLOW < 1273929484 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if you have a complex of the form a+bi, if a and b are complex then it's still complex. < 1273929486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ii^2 = -1? < 1273929490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that even work < 1273929500 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ii is a new unit, not i*i. < 1273929503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273929505 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1273929505 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't use i because i \in C. < 1273929508 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's ii \in IC. < 1273929514 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but is that (ii)^2 ? < 1273929518 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Hmm, true. < 1273929520 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What differentiates it from i? < 1273929524 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing. < 1273929531 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except it's in IC, not C. < 1273929533 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, why not use k? < 1273929538 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Meh :P < 1273929541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should have < 1273929550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no functional difference as far as I can see. < 1273929554 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I mean, j is used by engineers for i, so that would be very confusing < 1273929567 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: And quaternions use i,j,k. < 1273929571 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1273929572 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although nobody uses quaternions. < 1273929577 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Indeed. < 1273929577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what about h then < 1273929581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about DJSAOId < 1273929585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's unambiguous! < 1273929585 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ / / < 1273929611 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[["Brobdingnagian" appears in the Oxford English Dictionary as a synonym for "very large" or "gigantic".]] < 1273929615 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, math hates multi-letter abbrevs < 1273929619 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAIK quaternions are used in some 3D modelling stuff. < 1273929620 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mathematics < 1273929625 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*abbreviations < 1273929629 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You contradict thine own self! < 1273929635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, why can't I shorten it? ;P < 1273929636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: But that's computers. :P < 1273929644 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'm not a math student < 1273929645 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm CS :P < 1273929681 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cs is just a branch of mathematics < 1273929689 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly a runt < 1273929697 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION googles define:runt
< 1273929733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm I'm not sure which meaning < 1273929734 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A weak, pathetic young animal. < 1273929737 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1273929754 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, also it is bordering on engineering at most unis < 1273929759 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I don't dislike CS. :-) < 1273929760 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the one I'm on too < 1273929765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, that is the real problem. < 1273929784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computer science is definitely mathematics, but engineering of any sort is not. < 1273929799 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, engineering is like applied mathematics < 1273929806 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not really. < 1273929807 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that refers to something else iirc < 1273929810 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They use mathematics though. < 1273929818 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, yeah applying it to problems. < 1273929830 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. But then so does, say, accounting. < 1273929835 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah the phrase "applied mathematics" is already in use iirc < 1273929843 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Everything* is ultimately applied mathematics. < 1273929850 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, except pure math? < 1273929856 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair point. < 1273929884 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a sort of urge to play with set theory. < 1273929913 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We all get that sometimes/ < 1273929926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1273929929 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's perfectly natural! < 1273930010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has been observed in penguins! < 1273930038 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes quite. When kept at reasonable levels it is nothing to worry about. But you should watch out so you don't get addicted. Could result in your downfall. Just imagine, a setoholic... < 1273930069 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@87.115.109.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273930072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even worse, I have an urge to write an English-language translation of the axioms! < 1273930082 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To indoctrinate poor, innocent mathematical children into the false religion! < 1273930089 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay now you are into dangerous stuff < 1273930119 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm I wonder how VHDL integer type handles underflow/overflow < 1273930131 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably "not". < 1273930139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be neat with an integer with the range 0-79 < 1273930143 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can be done < 1273930149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah not sure about overflow < 1273930175 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love Tarski's axiom so much < 1273930177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[For every set x, there exists a set y whose members include: < 1273930177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * x itself; < 1273930177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * every subset of every member of y; < 1273930177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * the power set of every member of y; < 1273930178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : * every subset of y of cardinality less than that of y.]] < 1273930191 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it implies the axioms of infinity, choice, power set, and the existence of inaccessible cardinals < 1273930202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :∃y [x ∈ y ∧ ∀z ∈ y [∀w (w ⊆ z → w ∈ y) ∧ ∃w ∈ y ∀v (v ⊆ z → v ∈ w)] ∧ ∀z [z ⊆ y → (z ≈ y ∨ z ∈ y)]] < 1273930215 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why the [[]]? < 1273930239 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno, it's the same as () < 1273930244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess to make it easier to read < 1273930255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the English version of Tarski's axiom. < 1273930265 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh; that's my quote marks. < 1273930283 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are indeed strange. < 1273930333 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know the name for the symbol like an 'O' but tiny and on the baseline. < 1273930343 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Null? < 1273930350 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in aleph-null? < 1273930358 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, subscripted O? < 1273930378 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: Where is it used? < 1273930378 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or subscripted O with negative vertical space (ugh!) < 1273930392 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, as in aleph-null. < 1273930409 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, isn't that just a subscripted 0? < 1273930414 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I can't find a HTML or Unicode entity for it < 1273930428 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<sub>0</sub>? < 1273930428 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's simply subscripted zero. < 1273930435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: ₀ < 1273930436 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not O. < 1273930437 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's zero. < 1273930443 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is also Aleph-one, etc. < 1273930447 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, unicode has a subscripted 0 letter iirc < 1273930451 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: However, using the Unicode subscripts is bad style. < 1273930454 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use <sub>0</sub> instead. < 1273930458 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They are only there for legacy reasons.) < 1273930462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, why is the unicode subscript bad style? < 1273930473 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useful on IRC < 1273930478 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unicode in general is pretty stupid. < 1273930480 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :x² for the suberscript < 1273930482 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: only in Unicode for compatibility reasons; not every character can be subscripted, just an arbitrary, small subset; Unicode is a character set, not a typesetting system < 1273930490 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yeah they didn't include klingon :( < 1273930497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are officially deprecated < 1273930497 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Tengwar. < 1273930510 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well missing klingon is worse < 1273930515 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well,* < 1273930543 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have never watched any Star Trek, with the exception of the 2008 movie. < 1273930549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273930561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never saw that movie iirc < 1273930579 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Star Trek is quite entertaining. Just fluff, though, of course. < 1273930589 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spock kills Kirk with Rosebud and then it turns out that they're both Tyler Durden! < 1273930602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The 2008 movie? < 1273930605 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you mean the 2009 one? < 1273930613 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273930617 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1273930623 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That one is even more fluffy. :-) < 1273930631 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. < 1273930671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This idea was later used to create the 2009 film, SProxy-Connection: keep-alive Cache-Control: max-age=0 r Trek." --Wikipedia < 1273930680 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat. < 1273930702 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[This idea was later used to create the 2009 film, [[Star Trek (film)|SProxy-Connection: keep-alive < 1273930702 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cache-Control: max-age=0 < 1273930703 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r Trek]].]] < 1273930703 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--page source < 1273930704 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which page? < 1273930711 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country]] < 1273930721 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't change it < 1273930724 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best Trek movie title ever < 1273930758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, XD < 1273930760 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks at history.
< 1273930766 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like vandalism though < 1273930771 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or a filter issue. < 1273930775 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that < 1273930784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Coming soon... < 1273930786 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A world... < 1273930786 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bloody weird vandalism. < 1273930790 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never seen before... < 1273930793 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Space... < 1273930795 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unleashed... < 1273930798 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DUN DADANDANDAU DNUUN DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN < 1273930800 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DRAMATIC CLIPS < 1273930801 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273930807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SProxy-Connection: keep-alive Cache-Control: max-age=0 r Trek. < 1273930813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, The final frontier! < 1273930816 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273930834 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, To boldly go where no TCP packet has gone before! < 1273930857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"WHAT?! They're not caching our pages!" < 1273930863 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Someone... has... infiltrated... our... server." < 1273930864 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Red alert! < 1273930866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"IT RUNS OUR SHIP!" < 1273930871 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SIRENS SIRENS SIRENS SIRENS < 1273930878 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The CPU cannae tak it! < 1273930886 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'll use Mac OS X to hack our own Ruby on Rails admin interface!" < 1273930892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and including realistic reversing of polarity! < 1273930894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the first time ever < 1273930895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"THE PASSWORD IS 'ROSEBUD'!!!!!" < 1273930907 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, reversing polarity of the DC circuit it infected! < 1273930918 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the diodes will block it, shut it down < 1273930921 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kane... hacked... the Enterprise! < 1273930953 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273930957 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spock... is a HUMAN < 1273930960 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From an ALTERNATE REALITY! < 1273930964 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HE HOLDS THE KEY TO THE CACHING < 1273930966 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay that's too weird < 1273930969 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He must sacrifice himself... < 1273930971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To safe... < 1273930974 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The universe... < 1273930974 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I like it :) < 1273930979 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, save* < 1273930984 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273930992 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ship's drive is so powerful that if it isn't cached, the sheer energy will OBLITERATE THE UNIVERSE! < 1273930996 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But DON'T TELL HEALTH AND SAFETY! < 1273931000 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1273931012 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I liked my idea of realistic reversing of polarity < 1273931018 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1273931020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably they have installed easy switches for it by now < 1273931023 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they do it so often < 1273931029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ship is based on solving Diophantine equations. < 1273931035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mechanical ones probably < 1273931039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, oh? < 1273931043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273931047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you mean < 1273931047 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is never elaborated upon. < 1273931051 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273931058 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, however, used in the climax to save the universe. < 1273931073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay that sounds like treknobable gone bad < 1273931075 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1273931077 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :worse than usual < 1273931091 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can we use the inevitable breakdown of causality due to FTL travel as a plot point? < 1273931099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, been done iirc? < 1273931108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In ST? < 1273931112 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in star trek yes < 1273931116 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :next generation I think < 1273931117 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: They used the proof of Poincare's conjecture to prove that the circles of the ship MUST evaporate!!!! < 1273931123 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, yes we can. < 1273931136 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It turns out that you can do infinitely long tasks in finite time if you don't care about causality. < 1273931141 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The computation reaches BEYOND the end of the universe. < 1273931148 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is how it solves Diophantine equations. < 1273931155 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We shall build a TwoDucks interpreter! < 1273931163 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1273931192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, which one was Poincare's conjecture? < 1273931193 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And hence defy the Halting Problem! < 1273931202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poincar%C3%A9_conjecture < 1273931205 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a theorem, at least! < 1273931220 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's about circles tightening. And spheres. < 1273931229 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The second-last sphere in the image looks like the Death Star. < 1273931233 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So clearly this is a Trek/Wars crossover. < 1273931242 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also clearly the redesigned Enterprise is circular. < 1273931244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And gets shrinked. < 1273931247 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the Death Star. < 1273931266 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We must refashion it into a torus before we are crushed! < 1273931280 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273931304 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if anyone has developed a theory of the reals and complexes enough in a proof assistant to define the analytically continued zeta function. < 1273931306 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no the circle is slightly to small for the death-star < 1273931327 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That requires convergent infinite sums and analytic continuation; sounds painful < 1273931356 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That's just a continuity error < 1273931426 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, XD < 1273931469 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dammit, I have a horrible, horrible need to give a value to the harmonic series. < 1273931497 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, of what? the death star's resonance frequency? < 1273931508 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sum(n=1, inf) 1/n < 1273931511 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273931518 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I preferred my interpretation :P < 1273931529 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273931549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could calculate it from the movies. Isn't it a green laser? < 1273931553 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We already have values for {sum(n=1, inf) 1}, {sum(n=1, inf) n} and indeed all forms of {sum(n=1, inf) s^n} apart from n=-1. < 1273931589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by measuring exact hue on that laser it should be possible to calculate what type of laser was used < 1273931607 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's patently not a laser. < 1273931622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm right, unless there is a lot of dust in space for it to reflect from < 1273931640 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so some ionised plasma weapon perhaps? < 1273931646 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More likely. < 1273931663 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea at all about how to calculate anything on that < 1273931665 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so meh < 1273931672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it will also be necessary to explain the behaviour of the beams when they intersect. < 1273931687 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I don't remember that < 1273931690 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean < 1273931693 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does this Aleph-null look okay? See bottom of page, reference 1 - http://corewar.co.uk/darwin < 1273931730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, the usual name I heard for it is aleph-zero < 1273931731 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273931732 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's fine. < 1273931733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, hm < 1273931743 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's exactly how you should write it. :) < 1273931752 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Officially it's called the "superlaser", but of course there's no requirement that "superlaser" need be an instance of laser. < 1273931758 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good, thanks :-) < 1273931767 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: In TeX it's written \aleph_0. < 1273931773 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay wikipedia calls it "Aleph-naught" in one place < 1273931774 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., letter "aleph", subscript 0. < 1273931776 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never heard that before < 1273931778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ^ < 1273931782 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia calls it "aleph-null" sometimes too. < 1273931874 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wookieepedia says the death star thing is "composed of several exotic matter beams accelerated and amplified by gigantic focusing magnetic lenses and coils, producing a single powerful beam", and taking "energy from a massive hypermatter core, converting the energy present in hyperspace into highly unstable particles that were tremendously destructive in normal space". < 1273931888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what is the beam intersection thing you mentioned? < 1273931892 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not exactly clear how to compute anything from the hue. < 1273931916 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, where did they get that from? Is it canon? < 1273931946 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It's from one of the EU novels; I think they have several levels of canonicality in there. < 1273931962 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :EU = European ....? Nah can't be... < 1273931983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh extended universe I guess < 1273931990 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got rejected by DMOZ again. They really don't trust me to edit sections of the Open Directory! :-/ < 1273932009 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, what? open directory? which year is this? < 1273932013 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1995? Right? < 1273932021 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Expanded, I think. < 1273932024 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1273932054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, anyway, I don't think you can compute anything from that description at all < 1273932059 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Open Directory is still there. Listing is way out of date but still ranking well in Google. < 1273932063 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it is technoable all the way down < 1273932086 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, uhu < 1273932106 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just wanted to update a couple of sections so it doesn't reflect badly on the subject. < 1273932135 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably be better if DMOZ just got wiped off the net. < 1273932173 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, well, in a full-power shot, "the amount of energy involved were so great it would generate miniscule space-time singularities, sending part of the target's mass to hyperspace and generating a massive shockwave from high-energy tachyons from hyperspace". < 1273932177 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I see no technogabble here." < 1273932186 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, babble. < 1273932193 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1273932211 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I didn't know Star Wars (ab)used tachyons as well < 1273932287 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone here know which i/o header files includes? < 1273932304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, in what? < 1273932307 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C++ < 1273932310 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah no clue < 1273932315 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it has < 1273932321 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know what else, though < 1273932322 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use C not C++ < 1273932324 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273932328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, read the file? < 1273932329 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the spec? < 1273932332 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273932341 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or I'll just write code and see if it compiles. < 1273932352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, might not be portable then < 1273932355 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's for a golf thing :) < 1273932367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, it is /usr/include/c++/4.5.0/ios here < 1273932374 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks < 1273932387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't find cstdlib in it, probably included indirectly < 1273932397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, anyway the path will vary between systems < 1273932397 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1273932405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one I mentioned works on arch linux < 1273932405 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I know printf() works with it < 1273932416 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do C++ requires prototypes for everything? < 1273932420 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use Ubuntu, it's a pretty similar path < 1273932420 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C doesn't after all < 1273932430 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean by prototypes? < 1273932444 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/include/c++/4.3.3/ios on my ubuntu system < 1273932449 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, uh, the usual thing? < 1273932453 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273932464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like: void foo(int); in a header? < 1273932476 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah < 1273932483 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if it's required < 1273932490 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always do it, though < 1273932491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, you can leave that out in C after all, but compiler will likely warn you < 1273932498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are good reasons to NOT leave it out < 1273932504 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's a good idea to do so < 1273932525 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never tried doing it otherwise, so I'm not sure if it's an error. < 1273932724 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, printf() isn't actually included with < 1273932728 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strange < 1273932745 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would this compile, then? http://golf.shinh.org/reveal.rb?char+pyramid/nn_1271263335&cpp < 1273932799 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no clue < 1273932800 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very strange < 1273932821 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe there's something weird with the site's C++ compiler < 1273932824 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, perhaps it does allow implicit declarations (thus skipping prototype < 1273932825 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1273932830 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe < 1273932832 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try to remove the include < 1273932840 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried compiling it myself and it didn't work < 1273932854 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't recognize printf() < 1273932854 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1273932876 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, I can't see why it wouldn't compile as C99 at least < 1273932885 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1273932891 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without the include < 1273932970 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoah...I think I'm going crazy or something...I just used #import instead of #include :) < 1273932974 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too much python < 1273932983 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Java < 1273933030 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, that code used import yes < 1273933031 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very strange < 1273933052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might have a meaning with some preprocessors < 1273933067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think anything forbids such an implementation specific extension < 1273933077 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1273933096 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should do that with the site's compiler, since it cuts down on characters < 1273933108 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Objective-C has an #import preprocessor directive. < 1273933119 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is C++, though < 1273933125 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly the compiler recognizes it even in C++ mode, then. < 1273933133 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe < 1273933136 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If it is a combined C/ObjC/C++ thing.) < 1273933150 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This golf site has like a million languages < 1273933156 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even brainfuck :) < 1273933236 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My GCC does in C mode, albeit noisily. < 1273933238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ cat > test.c < 1273933238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#import < 1273933238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :int main(void) { printf("foo\n"); return 0; } < 1273933238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ gcc -o test test.c < 1273933238 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :test.c:1:2: warning: #import is a deprecated GCC extension < 1273933239 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fis@eris:~$ ./test < 1273933241 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo < 1273933243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777: sinh? < 1273933249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, objc++? < 1273933276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm GCC extension? < 1273933280 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm... < 1273933285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm interested < 1273933291 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't be the objc thing then < 1273933292 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's gcc, though < 1273933301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, yes, what do you use? < 1273933306 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C++, so g++ < 1273933308 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clang? < 1273933311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273933330 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get the same thing from g++ too. < 1273933338 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, that's weird < 1273933343 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me try it again. < 1273933343 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g++ (Ubuntu 4.4.3-4ubuntu5) 4.4.3, to be exact. < 1273933397 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're right < 1273933401 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very strange < 1273933415 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When was import ever used? < 1273933465 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, look at this: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/8etzzkb6%28VS.71%29.aspx < 1273933473 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but that's not the GCC #import. < 1273933486 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a GCC #import? < 1273933496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : test.c:1:2: warning: #import is a deprecated GCC extension < 1273933499 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sure looks like one. < 1273933500 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah < 1273933518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly it's like the Objective-C #import, just extended to work in the C/C++ modes too. < 1273933545 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure it doesn't do what the even weirder Visual C++ #import does. < 1273933548 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/172262/c-include-and-import-difference < 1273933576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Import in gcc: The import in gcc is different from the import in VC++. It is a simple way to include a header at most once only. (In VC++ and GCC you can do this via #pragma once as well)" < 1273933577 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273933591 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1273933620 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of the answers noted the "deprecated GCC extension" warning < 1273933741 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's nice that my desktop doesn't need any file from /lib/firmware. My laptop seems to use two binary firmware blobs, one for ethernet (tg3) and one for wlan (iwlagn) < 1273933767 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh oh < 1273933769 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Count+asterisks+ < 1273933779 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got the largest program size :) < 1273933795 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the whole thing (mine was in C++) < 1273933828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay I'm pretty sure that the befunge93 one can only be that short by checking first char < 1273933829 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should really do this in C instead (less std::) < 1273933839 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some are cheats < 1273933856 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In FlogScript, someone did it with 2 chars < 1273933868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :befunge93 with 3 chars? I don't believe it < 1273933870 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, there it is in the manual; http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-3.3.6/cpp/Obsolete-once_002donly-headers.html < 1273933871 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even with cheating, i still don't understand how that's possible < 1273933885 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck not even without cheating < 1273933887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1273933888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with* < 1273933895 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :&.@ < 1273933912 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Works for the two samples anyway < 1273933915 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You think it would be cheating if I checked for non-whitespace? < 1273933934 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, oh duh < 1273933943 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, what is the char code of * < 1273933948 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :42 < 1273933970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1273933972 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easy then < 1273933987 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Don't you mean ~? < 1273934000 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never remember which is which < 1273934004 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since you sound sure, I probably do < 1273934017 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I only sound sure because I checked the spec. :p < 1273934021 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So do you think looking for non-whitespace would be cheating? < 1273934047 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1273934051 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273934053 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1273934054 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1273934061 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'll do this in brainfuck < 1273934074 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm more than 2 chars there right? < 1273934080 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1273934080 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have number output < 1273934088 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean? < 1273934103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maedhros777, "output as ascii code" vs. "output as number" < 1273934112 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean in brainfuck? < 1273934114 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in printf "%d" < 1273934119 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok < 1273934120 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah you don't have that < 1273934139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, I wonder what it does with the extra whitespace < 1273934142 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably it strips it < 1273934215 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh they have asymptote < 1273934218 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's wonderful < 1273934227 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no TeX or LaTeX or Plain TeX as far as I can find < 1273934462 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay how does it do the erlang thing... < 1273934476 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the erlang thing? < 1273934481 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in anagolf < 1273934489 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it seems to require a full module < 1273934498 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what would the entry point be < 1273934509 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :entry is m iirc < 1273934516 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273934520 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, arity? < 1273934527 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find out. < 1273934543 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah got it working < 1273934557 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now to make it shorter < 1273934600 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn, you beat me :) < 1273934619 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think mine is so long because of the std::'s all over the place < 1273934635 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should've done "using namespace std;" < 1273934641 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although that's a lot of characters < 1273934685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest not using C++ :-) < 1273934696 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, I'll use C < 1273934753 0 :Gracenotes!~person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1273934947 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://golf.shinh.org/p.rb?Palindromic+prime < 1273934953 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm doing this one in C < 1273935048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, if you resubmit after making it shorter, is the old one removed? < 1273935050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems so < 1273935059 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no? < 1273935066 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it does, that is a bug < 1273935072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I used same name < 1273935073 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273935081 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think you should be allowed to do that < 1273935083 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :write shinh in #anagolf < 1273935103 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so you can't have multiple entries by your nick < 1273935117 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, not anagolf < 1273935118 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I realised how to cut down on the length you see < 1273935119 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget < 1273935125 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's a bug because it means anyone can overwrite < 1273935132 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah #anagol < 1273935174 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273935184 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it kept the minimum it seems < 1273935195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or.. I don't know < 1273935202 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#anagol < 1273935214 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it may be me that got confused somehow < 1273935297 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm new record . lets see what happened < 1273935313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay it definite let me overwrite < 1273935324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the erlang code can be made shorter if not using form < 1273935330 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you can make a shorter module name then < 1273935415 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, mentioned it in that channel < 1273935420 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets see what happens < 1273935450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ping shinh about it < 1273935551 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no need it seems < 1273935625 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1273936084 0 :cheater2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1273936088 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@87.115.109.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273936097 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273936729 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC #import is identical to #include, except it is sane if you use it more than once. < 1273936787 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes we found that < 1273936804 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1273937114 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the structure of a circle for complex values of x and y? < 1273937309 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273937337 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1273937379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Complex. < 1273937449 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what are x and y here? < 1273937466 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The variables in x^2+y^2=1 < 1273937472 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273937496 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why not plot it < 1273937527 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not sure how. < 1273937552 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, you take a pen or pencil and some paper < 1273937563 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you draw as required < 1273937570 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's a 4-dimensional shape! < 1273937575 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good point < 1273937589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you can maybe use x,y,z,colour? < 1273937594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc mathematica can do that < 1273937602 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3D plot with colour function or such < 1273937606 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot the details < 1273937625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember getting something that looked really hippie from something rather simple < 1273937635 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait the Wolfram Demonstrations Project has something. < 1273937649 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember alise said something like "what was that in my drink" or similar as a response to mentioning it in this channel < 1273937661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot when it was < 1273937678 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grep logs from last year or a bit more < 1273937688 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or don't because it doesn't matter so much :-) < 1273937693 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true < 1273937699 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but iirc I pasted the code for it < 1273937702 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could help Phantom_Hoover < 1273937715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just modify the expressions required < 1273937725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :same Plot3D or whatever over-all structure < 1273937938 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, btw for some reason I'm getting more battery time on my thinkpad nowdays than when it was new < 1273937952 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like from about 3 hours → about 5 hours < 1273937977 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both with wlan turned off and semi-bright screen (brightest is too bright anyway in many places) < 1273938100 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, found it: http://sprunge.us/QMhM < 1273938107 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was even using complex stuff < 1273938110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so might be very useful < 1273938150 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's it a plot of? < 1273938201 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, something random as a test. Was trying to figure out how to plot something similar < 1273938213 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will play with later. < 1273938214 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, forgot what the actual function I wanted to plot was < 1273938222 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, anyway it may allow you to plot that circle < 1273938260 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll need the circle to be implicit. < 1273938265 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Byr for now. < 1273938273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well should work too? < 1273938662 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273938993 0 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1273939908 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b7/Peter_Treveris_-_engraving_of_Trepanation_for_Handywarke_of_surgeri_1525.png < 1273940056 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^_^ < 1273940098 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273940131 0 :MizardX!~MizardX@unaffiliated/mizardx JOIN :#esoteric < 1273940205 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That picture is so the opposite of ^_^ in every way :P < 1273940464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well yes, it was "^_^" at you linking it < 1273941172 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kuratowski ordered pairs require deciding equality on sets :/ < 1273941239 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1273941245 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan! < 1273941251 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g'day < 1273941263 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this mean i've been missed? < 1273941274 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I just do that. < 1273941284 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1273941352 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you browse the logs? i've been commenting on your beta reduction questions but your connection dropped < 1273941367 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Day? < 1273941378 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some time last week? < 1273941391 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly several times < 1273941585 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273941589 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan < 1273941602 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi alise < 1273941814 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan < 1273941815 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi alise < 1273941822 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi uorygl < 1273941831 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi me. < 1273941839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi me. < 1273941919 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, I was hoping we would have all six. < 1273941926 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Adrian^L Alex3012 AnMaster augur BeholdMyGlory bsmntbombdood cal153 chickenzilla comex Deewiant FireFly fizzie Geekthras Gracenotes Gregor Ilari ineiros jcp jix Leonidas lifthrasiir Mathnerd314 MizardX mtve mycroftiv myndzi olsner P4 Phantom_Hoover pikhq pineapple Quadrescence rodgort sebbu2 SimonRC Slereah sshc wareya yiyus ZeroOne < 1273941938 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION slaps oerjan around a bit with a very large trout
< 1273941939 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: deth2u < 1273941945 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarg < 1273941947 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION runs away
< 1273941956 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION chases oerjan.
< 1273941969 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it _seemed_ the obvious followup < 1273941976 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TO WHOM??? < 1273941977 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION catch oerjan and tear him apart
< 1273941997 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to alise, Phantom_Hoover and uorygl < 1273942010 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait i should have left out Phantom_Hoover in the list < 1273942021 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAMES spam can be good, because it brings a channel together against a common enemy < 1273942023 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no need being _redundant_ < 1273942030 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gracenotes: I agree. < 1273942032 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless that enemy is not immediately kickbanned :| < 1273942053 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least given a week of paid leave < 1273942055 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, where's our /attack command? We should be able to drain oerjan's hitpoints. < 1273942080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION attacks oerjan with a flash drive.
< 1273942090 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh no, not the flash! < 1273942110 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The inedible flash! < 1273942209 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION munches the drive
< 1273942217 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT INEDIBLE < 1273942226 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION chuckles
< 1273942245 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The drive had poison in it! < 1273942252 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eek < 1273942257 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION drops dead
< 1273942264 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, .... < 1273942265 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION rises
< 1273942269 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brains... < 1273942273 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Turn undead! < 1273942273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION squashes oerjan
< 1273942277 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what? < 1273942281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CIGARS ARE LIKE FLOWERS < 1273942290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, for that mass-highlight < 1273942311 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, dropped a 1-gigaton weight on top of you < 1273942317 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if it's possible for a Life spaceship to travel at < 1273942366 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cannot have a spaceship at == c iirc < 1273942372 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :travel at >c? < 1273942373 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/c is of course impossible by definition < 1273942388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget the proof, but it has been proved that some spaceship is the fastest possible < 1273942408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I wonder if we could add an "axiom" to Life that functions as a >c-travelling spaceship. Then observe the hilarious effects of time travel. < 1273942422 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you need a track? < 1273942429 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, can't you do something like a tunnel iirc by placing some pattern which basically "forwards" the glider at faster than c < 1273942433 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alas, Life doesn't obey relativity. < 1273942440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course that is cheating but I saw it in some golly example < 1273942440 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: It's an illusion. < 1273942443 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't get time travel unless it's also invariant under lorentz transformations < 1273942451 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: right, with a track, you can go at c. < 1273942465 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No effect propagates faster than c, it just looks like that. < 1273942476 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah possibly, I don't remember the details < 1273942479 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone heard of an IRC bot in an esoteric language other then fungot? < 1273942479 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poiuy_qwert: the fnord clan of devil-worshippers. the tramp ship and its crew remain an elusive mystery. though i saw him monstrously perched atop a mountain of beef, < 1273942508 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poiuy_qwert, yes < 1273942512 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I think it checks whether the front of the spaceship is there, and if so, puts the back on a spaceship whose front it's already produced. < 1273942512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais had one in thue iirc < 1273942513 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Alas, Life doesn't obey relativity. < 1273942515 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what! < 1273942516 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Roughly speaking. < 1273942528 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah cool < 1273942528 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : you don't get time travel unless it's also invariant under lorentz transformations < 1273942529 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAKEIT < 1273942529 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, hm perhaps < 1273942539 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: i had a theory once that rule 110 _does_ obey some kind of relativity, because the speeds of many gliders seemed related by a certain function < 1273942541 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, you guys collectively said three lines in the time it took for me to type "Roughly speaking." < 1273942554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*MAKE IT < 1273942561 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, seriously, adding axiomatic >c travellers to Life. < 1273942562 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens? < 1273942567 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however i concluded later it may just be an artifact of rule 110's "ether" structure < 1273942573 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stuff goes faster than c. < 1273942579 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stuff goes faster than c. < 1273942594 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, slow typer? < 1273942598 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do it yourself by editing it each generation. < 1273942620 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I type at... let me think, I don't want to name a number that sounds impossible, so 70 WPM. < 1273942632 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: thue has sockets? < 1273942635 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poiuy_qwert: netcat < 1273942635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, no idea for me < 1273942638 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I type at something like 110 wpm when I'm trying. < 1273942645 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More like 80-90 wpm when I'm not trying. < 1273942652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I never measured < 1273942654 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: thats an extension or something? < 1273942659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poiuy_qwert, ... < 1273942661 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :netcat < 1273942663 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how fast I can type on the iPhone. < 1273942664 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :try man netcat < 1273942666 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poiuy_qwert: no, it's just a program that hooks stdin/stdout to a network < 1273942667 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in your terminal < 1273942668 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or man nc < 1273942669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: stop assuming people are on unix < 1273942670 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i see < 1273942678 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I refuse to stop assuming that < 1273942686 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is fairly safe to say that I am an above-competent typer, since I've been doing it since I was three. < 1273942687 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well I can start assuming everyone is on plan9 then < 1273942689 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm on a Mac, and even I am on Unix. < 1273942697 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: ais523's bot was in thutu(2?), not thue iirc. it supported an underload interpreter... < 1273942698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people are not in Unix. < 1273942699 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well actually im on Mac so i should know this, but im fairly new to unix command line < 1273942700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*on < 1273942704 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::X < 1273942704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ah maybe < 1273942710 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, it was so long ago < 1273942717 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :poiuy_qwert: It's okay not to know things. Nobody expects you to be psychic. Well, nobody reasonable. < 1273942720 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah it was thutu2 < 1273942720 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea if macs include nc by default < 1273942745 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1273942756 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine has nc. < 1273942759 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So probably. < 1273942761 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273942808 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :making an IRC bot in an esoteric language has been my goal since starting esoteric languages :P < 1273942852 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1273942878 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(btw it might still be that rule 110 has _some_ lorentz transformation-like thing possible, but it's probably going to require something like those life cell simulated in life things, with a time shift.) < 1273942993 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: So what effects do you think a >c spaceship would have interacting with other things? < 1273943028 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It really depends. < 1273943034 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well almost by definition it would mean the c isn't _really_ the c for the CA... < 1273943035 0 :chickenzilla!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi oerjan ! < 1273943036 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does this spaceship work? < 1273943041 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I guess if you have three observers a few cells apart on the same line, and a spaceship travelling towards them, they'd see it come right next to them then disappear; the observers behind it would then experience the same. < 1273943044 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Axiomatically. < 1273943069 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider cells to have colour white, black or octarine; octarine cells in certain configurations are defined as moving faster than c in directions according to those configurations. < 1273943070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But do we have an extra state, or a weird change to the transition rules? < 1273943074 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: true... < 1273943089 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so how do octarine cells react with white and black cells? < 1273943095 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: For all other purposes -- such as deciding what should happen to other cells -- octarine cells are considered as white. < 1273943108 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :White means dead, right? < 1273943110 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how do they themselves interact? < 1273943149 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: It makes no difference, but I consider them live. < 1273943167 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dead and live are not the same thing. < 1273943170 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Live makes sense in this context. < 1273943174 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :White means alive. < 1273943196 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: How do octarine cells work? < 1273943202 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason, I think of octarine as being periwinkle, even though everyone knows it's a greenish-yellow purple. < 1273943203 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They interact with each other in a way that encodes which direction they go. < 1273943213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How that is is unknown. < 1273943223 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But suppose they exist; then what? < 1273943244 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then an effect can travel faster than c. < 1273943262 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To work out all the implications we need more information. < 1273943266 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-48-53.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273943268 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, "periwinkle"? < 1273943271 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can an octarine arise naturally? < 1273943279 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Purply. < 1273943281 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273943296 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about this: If there's an L- or J-tetromino within an otherwise empty 4x7 block, then the next generation, it moves forward by two. < 1273943303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An octarine cannot arise naturally. < 1273943309 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1273943312 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is an Act of God for octarine cells to exist in the initial configuration. < 1273943326 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can be destroyed by colliding with white cells as if they were themselves white. < 1273943345 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So they are not indestructable, but locally in their own configuration of octarines and blacks they perform completely differently, as spaceships exceeding c. < 1273943346 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how do octarines produce more octarines? < 1273943355 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so they go away after 1 generation? < 1273943358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do not; or rather, they only do so by moving more than one cell per cycle. < 1273943360 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No. < 1273943381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273943403 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so let us suppose that we have an octarine, and that each generation it dies and a new octarine is produced two cells to the right. < 1273943441 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, let us say that. In reality, they would be in packed configurations determining the direction. < 1273943454 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, also say that if there are other cells in its neighbourhood: < 1273943458 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about the l-tetromino? < 1273943470 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Run the general algorithm to find out whether it would live or die were it white. < 1273943475 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it would life, move it two cells to the right as planned. < 1273943483 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it would die, make it dead; the spaceship is destroyed. < 1273943492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the purposes of the algorithm in all cases, octarine cells are treat as white. < 1273943501 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so what if it would live but mutate into a different shape? < 1273943502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And nothing ever creates an octarine cell. < 1273943507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: That is impossible. < 1273943509 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We are talking about single cells. < 1273943511 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So an octarine block would be a spaceship in a vacuum? < 1273943512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273943513 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1273943521 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, travelling at >c. < 1273943529 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As, indeed, would any still-life. < 1273943539 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Howso? < 1273943541 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do not move. < 1273943550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any octarine still-life. < 1273943553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, depends on your reference frame < 1273943553 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273943561 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you are traveling at the same speed... < 1273943566 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The questions are: from an "observer's" point of view, how do these spaceships work?; and how do collisions with them work? < 1273943578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: No, CA space is not relatavistic. < 1273943586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it would be fun if it was! < 1273943603 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/relatavistic/relativistic/ < 1273943604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so implement it and test it < 1273943613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I'd rather have us collectively think about it first. < 1273943619 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1273943628 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens if an octarine would clash with a live? < 1273943658 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is a good question. < 1273943664 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, presumably one would overwrite the other, or both would die < 1273943670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will either become octarine, become alive, or become dead. < 1273943673 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These are the only choices. < 1273943676 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let the octarine override. < 1273943676 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, let's think about collisions. < 1273943681 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that is what I said ;P < 1273943681 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A spaceship bashes into a wall. < 1273943691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's say the wall is infinitely strong. < 1273943695 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The spaceship is destroyed. The wall is not. < 1273943701 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is an argument for become-alive. < 1273943705 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A spaceship bashes into a wall. < 1273943713 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The spaceship is infinitely strong; the wall not. < 1273943719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wall is go bye-bye; spaceship takes its place. < 1273943721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what if both the spaceship and the walls are infinitely strong? < 1273943723 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is an argument for become-octarine. < 1273943725 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A spaceship bashes into a wall. < 1273943728 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both are infinitely strong. < 1273943728 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember, the spaceship is travelling at twice the speed of light. < 1273943733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The universe explodes. Both disappear. < 1273943736 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is an argument for become-dead. < 1273943753 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, if neither is infinitely strong? < 1273943766 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, infinitely strong really just means stronger than the other. < 1273943768 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest become-octarine. < 1273943771 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, Phantom_Hoover, hm you could get quantum tunneling like effects by this < 1273943777 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems that become-dead involves a>b, b>a. < 1273943778 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the wall and the ship are correctly aligned < 1273943779 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So we can ignore that. < 1273943782 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could pass through the wall < 1273943785 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :without colliding < 1273943793 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So which are stronger, regular still cells or fucked up faster-than-light spaceships? < 1273943797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess spaceships. < 1273943798 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, a wall can still destroy an octarine. < 1273943802 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it becomes octarine. < 1273943805 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes; if it goes next to it. < 1273943806 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yep < 1273943809 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's my main interest < 1273943813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm < 1273943819 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait < 1273943825 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let o = octarine, a = alive, . = dead < 1273943835 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oa. -> depends because the a would change the octarine right? < 1273943842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.a. -> o obliterates a < 1273943850 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@jol13-1-82-66-176-74.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273943852 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, let's now consider an octarine string. < 1273943853 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is there a configuration of octarines and alives such that octarines skip over the alives? < 1273943856 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ^ < 1273943861 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but feel free to consider < 1273943871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there could be, don't know < 1273943874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: doesn't a line die instantly in life? < 1273943879 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1273943881 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1273943881 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on how the wall looks < 1273943886 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ofc < 1273943886 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise,: < 1273943888 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273943890 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+++ < 1273943892 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273943893 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :↓ < 1273943897 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.+. < 1273943897 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.+. < 1273943898 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.+. < 1273943899 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see? < 1273943901 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273943910 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is going to be one fucked up space ship :) < 1273943921 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, oh you mean the rotating mincer yeah ;P < 1273943935 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273943948 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rotating, CONSTANTLY ACCELERATING AT 2C, mincer < 1273943952 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if octarines can skip certain walls < 1273943957 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those walls just have to be in the right place < 1273943958 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no I meant the +++ one < 1273943958 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the right time < 1273943960 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as the mincer < 1273943961 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they will avoid death! < 1273943965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes, but now imagine the +s are octarine < 1273943968 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any spaceship hitting that < 1273943969 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ooh < 1273943993 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, how is it constantly accelerating though? < 1273943997 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess octarine cells can be created < 1273944005 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we're considering the neighbourhoods of octarines < 1273944009 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of creating whites we create octarines < 1273944014 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well they have to, otherwise you will always have still-lifes < 1273944016 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh. < 1273944017 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: because octarines move if they survive by definition < 1273944017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lives* < 1273944023 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :two cells to the rgith < 1273944024 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*right < 1273944033 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That still irks me. < 1273944035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273944044 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what does? < 1273944059 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life should be symmetric. < 1273944074 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it should yeah < 1273944077 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh? < 1273944081 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is this not symmetric? < 1273944083 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the rightwardsness. < 1273944091 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273944094 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, the long-term plan was that certain configurations of octarines move in different definitions. < 1273944096 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*directions < 1273944107 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, we consider an 8-neighbourhood as a binary number saying direction. < 1273944110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what sort of configurations < 1273944113 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273944125 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such that the "reversal" of a configuration moves in the opposite direction. < 1273944128 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ta-dah, symmetry. < 1273944133 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This requires breaking more rules though. < 1273944136 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So neighbourhood%4=direction? < 1273944148 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Something like that, let us say. A neighbourhood of octarines and blacks, that is. < 1273944152 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you forgot non-cardinal then < 1273944153 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::/ < 1273944166 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH, symmetry is still destroyed. < 1273944268 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273944271 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: but perhaps this is the Key < 1273944299 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe consider the Moore neighbourhood for 2 cells around? < 1273944315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway, isn't this by definition defining the value of c in this CA? < 1273944325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Probably. But ssh. < 1273944328 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sure. < 1273944339 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Define c as one cell per generation. Problem solved. :P < 1273944359 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I think you need a relativistic CA for c to become interesting < 1273944366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I can't imagine how that would happen < 1273944379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. Let's do it. < 1273944380 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relativistic CA I mean < 1273944382 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wolfram would be proud. < 1273944384 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relativity sort of implies non-discrete time and space. < 1273944405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, exactly the issue yeah < 1273944406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And speed isn't an integral concept. < 1273944436 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a term we use to describe the behaviour of patterns that regenerate themselves somewhere else. < 1273944549 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reminds me of that esolang... Gravity iirc < 1273944551 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, we can invent discrete relativity. < 1273944553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasn't it uncomputable? < 1273944559 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes < 1273944563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes and no < 1273944566 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1273944566 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's complicated < 1273944578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so how do we define speed axiomatically? < 1273944579 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well uncomputable in general iirc < 1273944584 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a CA? < 1273944593 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, that might work too, but I can't figure out how you get discrete relativistic effects < 1273944594 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Let's NOT! < 1273944602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesiree, relativity without primitive time! < 1273944609 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or if that's not possible, eh, we'll Work Something Out. < 1273944613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1273944621 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then how do we work out any relativistic effects? < 1273944644 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes time will pass at different rates in different parts due to relativity. Well not different parts. For different observers rather. < 1273944679 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Cleverly. < 1273944680 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we would still have a c, but it would be relative observer, no? < 1273944684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, we need a physicist here. < 1273944688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not one < 1273944689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we haven't defined *what* speed is, we can't do relativity. < 1273944711 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't really make sense for non-spaceshippy objects. < 1273944728 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what doesn't? speed? relativity? < 1273944758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, why do we need a discrete CA? < 1273944768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not make a non-discrete one? < 1273944772 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because CA's *are* discrete! < 1273944778 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're *cellular*! < 1273944800 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A continuous CA has several problems, such as: not being a CA; and being uncomputable. < 1273944801 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, composed of *discrete cells*! < 1273944807 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah the latter is a problem < 1273944812 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, we need to define a notion of another cell being the "heir" of another cell. < 1273944813 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1273944823 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then the speed is the distance between a cell and its heir across a generation. < 1273944837 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: This would have to be held as a cell state. < 1273944850 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope. < 1273944854 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, actually it is a CA even if not discrete. Except CA now stands for Continuous Automaton ;P < 1273944858 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not if we define the CA such that we have some equation. < 1273944865 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such that given a cell and its neighbourhood, we can point to its heir. < 1273944877 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The cells are each in a discrete state, right? < 1273944905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273944920 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that's the only data held about them? < 1273944931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. But the neighbourhood provides more information. < 1273944955 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... it's reversible? < 1273944975 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No? < 1273944978 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life isn't reversible. < 1273944980 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, to it's heir, not to it's parents < 1273944982 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite different < 1273944984 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1273944987 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the latter would be reversible < 1273944987 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: *its < 1273944989 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what AnMaster said. < 1273945020 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, how can we get anything relativistic from this though < 1273945042 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By relativistic effects we mean contraction and time dilation, right? < 1273945042 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, time slowing down or such depending on observers sounds like something we should have < 1273945045 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, my definition gives us a definition of speed. < 1273945049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that sort of stuff yes < 1273945055 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then we just need to sort of discretise the relativity formulas and tweak them a bit. < 1273945066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure it is so simple < 1273945066 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Cells from heir? < 1273945078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, also is this special relativity only? < 1273945085 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duh. < 1273945092 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAs can't have gravity/ < 1273945101 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, don't. < 1273945107 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be possible. < 1273945113 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Consider a notion of distance xDy. < 1273945120 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not. you could compute some sort of average by number of alive cells at any point < 1273945131 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: OK. < 1273945134 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given two pairs of coordinates (a,b) and (c,d) (a,b)D(c,d) is some distance metric on them, such that (a,b)D(a,b) = 0. < 1273945137 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with some function to reduce weight when further away < 1273945138 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And probably some other properties too. < 1273945161 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: So we define speed as the distance from the heir? < 1273945162 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then consider the heir of a cell (x,y) according to its state and its neighbourhood being a set of coordinates (xH,yH). < 1273945178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then the amount a cell (x,y) moved across a generation is (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273945182 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i go away to make food and here you go reinventing _my_ idea of relativistic CAs. shame on you. < 1273945196 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, for the generation, its speed was (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273945198 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, with something like inverse square root you would get newtownian gravity. I don't really know the formulas for general relativity style gravity, but can't see why something similar shouldn't work (but with a different function of course) < 1273945201 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, its speed can change. < 1273945205 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Good enough? < 1273945231 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1273945233 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, let's not say speed, let's say velocity. < 1273945240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also... < 1273945249 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, by that definition classical life would have a velocity of 1 right? < 1273945251 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should we just write (a,b) - (c,d) instead of distance? < 1273945257 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b) - (c,d) = (a - c, b - d) < 1273945258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or hm < 1273945263 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this manhattan distance? < 1273945267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or straight line? < 1273945269 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ^ < 1273945281 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Classical life has no heirs. < 1273945284 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you can define a good notion of heir for Life. < 1273945289 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm true < 1273945312 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway should we use straight distance or manhattan distance? < 1273945313 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you can't have cells with non-integer speeds. < 1273945324 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and wouldn't the distance vary with velocity (relativistic effects) < 1273945330 0 :soupdragon!~quantum@unaffiliated/fax JOIN :#esoteric < 1273945336 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Manhattan seems appropriate. < 1273945338 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Well, < 1273945342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d)=(a-c,b-d) < 1273945348 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this Manhattan or straight? < 1273945367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh... that is a vector between them < 1273945372 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not a distance as such < 1273945376 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes. < 1273945379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But velocity is a vector. < 1273945382 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. < 1273945384 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1273945387 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But what I meant by velocity is. < 1273945391 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you get my message alise < 1273945392 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :manhattan is |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945395 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: no < 1273945397 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, momentum? < 1273945414 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Silly with no concept of mass. < 1273945427 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well okay, bad word choice < 1273945427 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let us define: < 1273945429 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d)=(a-c,b-d) < 1273945429 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)(c,d)=\|a-c\|+\|b-d\| < 1273945432 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :urgh < 1273945433 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1273945434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me write it out < 1273945435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but isn't momentum a vector? < 1273945439 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273945440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might misremember < 1273945443 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945444 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good? < 1273945444 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is. < 1273945454 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, do photons have a momentum? < 1273945458 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273945459 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then "v = (x,y)D(xH,yH)", yes? < 1273945462 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't ask me how. < 1273945464 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, they have no mass < 1273945470 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so well if reality can do it... < 1273945473 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why solar sails work. < 1273945474 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why can't we < 1273945479 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes they have energy < 1273945479 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And those spinny glass things. < 1273945486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what spinny glass things? < 1273945489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273945489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273945489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273945489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273945492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ DO SO < 1273945507 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: We have no concept of energy, either. < 1273945513 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, good point < 1273945525 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but we would with some general relativity :P < 1273945537 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what do you mean Name? < 1273945538 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: E^2 - (pc)^2 = (mc^2)^2, where only the whole thing is 0 for a photon < 1273945538 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is why relativity is silly in the first place. < 1273945545 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d((a,b),(c,d)) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945547 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thants manhattor < 1273945549 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: give them variable names and give them names like "velocity", etc < 1273945559 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ah < 1273945563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: repeat the message plz < 1273945574 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was stupid < 1273945578 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want you to read it < 1273945583 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anyway I say this won't work since you can't get time slowdown and distance reduction (whatever they were called, forgot) < 1273945586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1273945591 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't see how you can get that < 1273945595 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: well... tell me anyway! < 1273945597 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you approach some speed c < 1273945606 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its in the log but dont read it < 1273945610 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Too much chat < 1273945616 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I won't; which day so I know which day not to read? < 1273945621 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1273945629 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not joking! < 1273945631 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usually I logread every day. < 1273945656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, name them dammit! < 1273945669 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273945672 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no idea < 1273945682 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh, you do it Phantom_Hoover. < 1273945685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273945685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273945685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273945685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273945688 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but I can't see how you can get relativistic effects from it :( < 1273945698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well after this we'll define relative velocity... < 1273945704 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah hm < 1273945722 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, we need some fixed light speed to get any relativistic effects, no? < 1273945730 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but let's name these first :P < 1273945736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or some other absolute for every observer < 1273945737 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, we need not to have a fixed reference, right? < 1273945765 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no still-lifes. < 1273945766 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, how would we get relativistic effects between observers then? < 1273945796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relative velocity. < 1273945840 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273945856 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The simulator can, of course, have a fixed reference. < 1273945862 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how would that be ensured to have relativistic effects? < 1273945877 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: NAME IT DOG GAMMIT < 1273945877 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just needs to be inaccessible to any patterns. < 1273945881 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273945882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273945882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273945882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273945898 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fred! < 1273945902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:09:59 Message to alise from the roughly 4 days in the past: < 1273945902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:10:20 Ï€/√8 = 1 + 1/3 - 1/5 - 1/7 + 1/9 + 1/11 - ... < 1273945902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:10:21 Ï€^2/8 = 1 + 1/3^2 + 1/5^2 + 1/7^2 + 1/9^2 + 1/11^2 + ... < 1273945902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:10:39 End < 1273945905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the thing i must not read yeah? < 1273945913 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yer < 1273945935 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but isn't the point of relativity that, from any given observer everyone else is moving no faster than light? < 1273945943 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1273945954 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, no. < 1273945957 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no? < 1273945960 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hubble and such. < 1273945967 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm? < 1273945971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273945971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273945972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273945972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273945972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Name (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273945975 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: fine, you name the above :-) < 1273945977 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Things can appear to be travelling faster than light due to space's expansion. < 1273945992 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Call them displacement and distance! < 1273945994 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well okay but without that expansion it can't happen right? < 1273945996 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the heir being the cell that (x,y) is considered to have "moved to". < 1273946002 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well one should be distance < 1273946004 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(xH,yH) is always alive < 1273946008 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nmae? < 1273946009 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1273946010 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: which is which? < 1273946011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other one yeah displacement sounds nice < 1273946017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, D is distance < 1273946019 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's taxicab/madhatter metric < 1273946023 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1273946025 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madhatter lol < 1273946030 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273946032 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :displacement and distance start with the same letter < 1273946036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :give them variable names :P < 1273946039 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, x < 1273946043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1273946046 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a variable! < 1273946049 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1273946052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should one be called velocity? < 1273946067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, delta also starts with d < 1273946069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so hm < 1273946070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1273946087 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, none of them are velocity afaik? < 1273946089 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: could use the uppercase delta < 1273946092 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even the lowercase < 1273946104 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you mean the greek letter heh < 1273946106 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Δ or δ < 1273946118 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use that for displacement, yeah? < 1273946123 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is what you use for distance delta < 1273946124 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :δ clashes with derivaterivy stuff but meh < 1273946128 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally < 1273946129 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273946145 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, Δ clashes with derivaterivy too, no? < 1273946152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah... but we're not doing derivatives < 1273946154 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, how do you write delta? < 1273946156 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since that's real, continuous stuff < 1273946160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we're in a finite world < 1273946163 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, copy and paste from alise < 1273946165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273946165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273946165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273946165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :δ = (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273946165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Δ = (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273946165 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is how < 1273946166 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :δ is displacement; Δ is distance. < 1273946176 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can say delta and Delta for convenience. < 1273946182 0 :lament!~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273946183 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, now that is confusing < 1273946183 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or \delta and \Delta if that is not unambiguous enough for you. < 1273946187 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine < 1273946190 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever :P < 1273946194 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1273946197 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's define velocity now < 1273946198 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so δ can have negative numbers. < 1273946199 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Δ is the other finite derivative < 1273946213 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Δ must have positives. < 1273946227 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :δ is not a number < 1273946230 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a vector < 1273946237 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can be a negative vector < 1273946238 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's what I meant/ < 1273946240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1273946240 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but well < 1273946242 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273946246 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok. < 1273946252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is you reference frame < 1273946256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for that vector < 1273946257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, how does stuff accelerate < 1273946260 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, relative what? < 1273946263 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :δ is unrestricted; Δ is > 0 < 1273946269 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: we have not defined velocity < 1273946275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it does not matter yet i think < 1273946282 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: don't we need velocity to define acceleration? < 1273946304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it does, you need a coordinate system to have a vector in if you want to put any numbers to it < 1273946313 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which you need for that definition < 1273946318 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since time is discrete, displacement and velocity are pretty much equivalent. < 1273946326 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: True. < 1273946327 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm probably < 1273946327 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946329 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946331 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946333 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, ...? < 1273946334 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946336 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why the spam < 1273946336 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So why not call (x,y)-(xH,yH) v, for velocity? < 1273946338 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946342 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, stop spamming < 1273946342 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: stfu < 1273946344 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946345 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: ^ < 1273946347 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : So why not call (x,y)-(xH,yH) v, for velocity? < 1273946352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any ops around? < 1273946353 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1273946358 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan? < 1273946362 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm he stopped < 1273946363 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1273946364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273946364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273946364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273946364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v = (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273946364 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d = (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273946365 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1273946365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v is velocity/displacement; d is distance. < 1273946367 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1273946369 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, stop it < 1273946371 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good? < 1273946378 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: lament: < 1273946382 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop fucking overreacting for christs sake < 1273946387 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please hit soupdragon with a bat < 1273946388 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, works < 1273946389 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Call d speed. < 1273946390 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you idiots < 1273946391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bat of pain < 1273946399 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what Phantom_Hoover said < 1273946403 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, oerjan, oerjan < 1273946408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273946408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273946408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273946408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v = (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273946408 0 :cheater2!~cheater@ip-80-226-26-140.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1273946410 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d = (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273946412 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v is velocity/displacement; d is speed/distance(sort of). < 1273946412 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, he is not connected < 1273946425 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah. < 1273946426 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :god it's like a bunch of stupid idiots in here < 1273946430 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fucka < 1273946430 0 :nooga!~Administr@86-63-124-134.sta.asta-net.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1273946430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1273946433 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We still have yet to define how to calculate a heir; it depends on the actual CA rules, so we'll just leave it as postulated for now. < 1273946436 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19txZDTkbBw CTO < 1273946456 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so how does stuff accelerate? < 1273946457 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: We should define relative velocity now, yeah? < 1273946482 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, and that must have an upper bound. I'm pretty sure we don't get relativistic effects otherwise < 1273946486 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see any problem with using the usual http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_velocity definition. < 1273946509 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~chatzilla@cpc5-sgyl29-2-0-cust220.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273946517 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I miss anything? < 1273946522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : OK, so how does stuff accelerate? < 1273946522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover: We should define relative velocity now, yeah? < 1273946522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise, and that must have an upper bound. I'm pretty sure we don't get relativistic effects otherwise < 1273946522 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I don't see any problem with using the usual http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_velocity definition. < 1273946528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what you missed < 1273946545 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19txZDTkbBw <- my 8080 crunching some numbers < 1273946548 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273946556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, it needs to be manhattan/madhatter distance or such < 1273946563 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or well < 1273946573 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1273946575 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Manhattan relative velocity < 1273946575 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273946578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm true < 1273946580 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (xH,yH) be the heir of (x,y) according to its neighbourhood. < 1273946580 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)-(c,d) = (a-c, b-d) < 1273946581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b)D(c,d) = |a-c| + |b-d| < 1273946581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v = (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273946581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d = (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273946583 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v is velocity/displacement; d is speed/distance(sort of). < 1273946585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let v[(x,y)] be v with the specified (x,y), and so on. < 1273946586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably carries over to the relative < 1273946587 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relative velocity: < 1273946588 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG ALISE STOP SPAMMING DUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR < 1273946589 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v[A rel B] = v[A] - v[B] < 1273946591 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The interesting thing here is that it depends on the heirs of two separate < 1273946593 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :particles, that will "move" into their new positions this generation. < 1273946596 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IHELPP!!!!!! ARE THERE ANY OPS I CANT HANDLE THIS < 1273946599 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: seriously just shut up. < 1273946600 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fucking pathetic < 1273946604 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273946604 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::[ < 1273946611 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i'll watch that vid now < 1273946613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't need sound right < 1273946617 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes that paste was uncalled for kind of < 1273946627 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I wsa just putting the current state of play < 1273946628 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*was < 1273946636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll use pastie now it's big, swear. < 1273946636 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, we need pastebin very soon < 1273946638 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273946643 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know which stores would sell Latin suited tarot cards? < 1273946648 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: that 8088 is a masterpiece < 1273946653 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, sprunge! < 1273946654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1273946660 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: I've revised my opinion of you, for making a custom 8088 computer from scratch you are cool < 1273946667 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :; < 1273946674 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :beh < 1273946680 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to get RAM working < 1273946685 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: so < 1273946691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have up to relative velocity < 1273946691 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then move to multiprocessor configuration < 1273946695 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd be awesome < 1273946696 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273946696 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we should define acceleration, right? < 1273946699 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1273946717 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember, no momentum. < 1273946720 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let (x,y)H be (xH,yH) < 1273946722 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1273946728 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then we have the distance between two movings: < 1273946729 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1273946743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, next one: built it from simple logic DIP things. I suggest the 74HC* series < 1273946749 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in the cpu itself from that < 1273946750 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|d[A] - d[AH]| < 1273946754 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which becomes < 1273946768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|(x,y)D(xH,yH) - (xH,yH)D(xHH,yHH)| < 1273946770 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which becomes < 1273946789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| |x-xH| + |y-yH| - |xH-xHH| + |yH-yHH| | < 1273946807 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i thought about that but then i realized it would be too big to assembe it without mistakes < 1273946814 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, ah < 1273946827 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, brb < 1273946831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, for multi-cpu won't you need some kind of MMU? < 1273946839 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: OK, so how does a cell get delta-v? < 1273946844 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| |x-xH| + |y-yH| - |xH-xHH| + |yH-yHH| | = can we simplify this? < 1273946871 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, I mean, to avoid collision they need to sync somehow when accessing the shared ram < 1273946872 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: so then we have the accelleration between two instants < 1273946878 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Abses make everything tricky. < 1273946878 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so we just have to generalise that < 1273946882 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have built a simulation of CPU using a simulation of logic components < 1273946893 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but what causes acceleration? < 1273946894 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, nice < 1273946918 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1273946928 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gravity < 1273946934 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I don't think we can simplify past an abs() no. Not without loosing some possible values < 1273946940 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1273946944 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind of like square + square root when it comes to that < 1273946946 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway that is |d[A] - d[AH]| < 1273946952 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact it is pretty much exactly like that < 1273946965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across two generations: |d[A] - d[AH]| < 1273946976 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across three generations: |d[A] - d[AH] - d[AHH]| < 1273946983 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh < 1273946989 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, why the middle term? < 1273946989 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1273946992 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1273946995 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across three generations: |d[A] - d[AHH]| < 1273947000 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across n generations: |d[A] - d[A{H^n}]| < 1273947013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, do we need relative speed? < 1273947014 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273947020 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but what about the cells causes that? < 1273947021 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can we define that in the same way as relative velocity? < 1273947046 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't you just take manhattan distance of the relative velocity? < 1273947049 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y/n? < 1273947061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely relative speed is just the difference? < 1273947066 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is relative velocity < 1273947081 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should we rename d to s, if it's being called speed? < 1273947082 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, we still haven't got any relativistic effects here < 1273947089 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: We have to freaking build a foundation first. < 1273947102 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, this is a newtonian+manhattan foundation :/ < 1273947122 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of velocity across n generations: v[A{H^n}] - v[A] < 1273947122 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across n generations: s[A{H^n}] - s[A] < 1273947126 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should this be v[A] - ... < 1273947130 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ... - v[A]? < 1273947132 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but we need to *define* acceleration and velocity before we can start on relativity. < 1273947156 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're doing this backward < 1273947157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but won't those be defined differently when you have relativity? < 1273947169 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you don't even know about lagrangian density . < 1273947175 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's basically a joke < 1273947187 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thenagain if your having fun hwatever < 1273947194 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good morrow < 1273947197 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Difference of speed across n generations: s[A{H^n}] - s[A] < 1273947197 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1273947203 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across n generations: s[A] - s[A{H^n}] < 1273947204 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, but it's helpful to have an idea as to what they look like. < 1273947205 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or with an abs? < 1273947208 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :relative velocity/speed don't have abses < 1273947213 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, hm < 1273947213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm sort of averse to using an abs there < 1273947228 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relative speed has an abs. < 1273947233 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As speed is a scalar. < 1273947240 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, good point < 1273947243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273947249 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and difference of speed too < 1273947250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of speed across n generations: |s[A{H^n}] - s[A]| < 1273947250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumabl < 1273947251 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1273947255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(s is the new name for d) < 1273947260 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1273947263 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of velocity across n generations: v[A{H^n}] - v[A] < 1273947264 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1273947267 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, don't we have non-integer speeds here? < 1273947269 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Difference of velocity across n generations: v[A] - v[A{H^n}] < 1273947272 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: no < 1273947277 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I mean, consider a velocity of (1,1) < 1273947280 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the speed? < 1273947281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally relative speed is s[A rel AH] < 1273947282 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1273947283 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot < 1273947285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :manhattan < 1273947286 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1273947292 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to wake up or something < 1273947315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what is []? < 1273947325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/961772.txt?key=owdr0qfbg56tuesrlbceg < 1273947327 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let v[(x,y)] be v with the specified (x,y), and so on. < 1273947330 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1273947331 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v = (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273947339 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273947341 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v[A] where A=(a,b) is (a,b)-(aH,bH) < 1273947349 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :read x[y] as x subscript y < 1273947354 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so a directed finite distance? < 1273947355 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since that's how it'd be rendered normally < 1273947362 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, a vector from a specific point < 1273947372 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: so we have differences of velocity and speed across n generations < 1273947373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, right? < 1273947382 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I guess so < 1273947388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: how should we define acceleration? < 1273947413 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are we talking about its mechanism? < 1273947417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, mathematically vectors have a length and direction. But not an x,y location or anything such < 1273947429 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, well ordinarily we'd do a = dv/dt where v(t) is velocity at a certain time < 1273947435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey!! < 1273947438 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is the finite calculus! < 1273947442 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hurffff < 1273947442 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I think the answer is "not yet" < 1273947447 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = Delta v(t) < 1273947450 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did Isay that earlier < 1273947451 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273947452 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = v(t+1) - v(t) < 1273947456 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait nobody was listening to me AS USUAL < 1273947457 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where 1 is the smallest time increment, one generation < 1273947466 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, only because you were rather rude < 1273947469 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NO U < 1273947515 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate being smarter than everyone < 1273947555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sucks at social skills though. not enough data to figure out your intelligence < 1273947576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, wait, smallest time increment? < 1273947585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sec < 1273947586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, we can't get the relativistic time effects then can we? < 1273947588 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm writing stuff out < 1273947596 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: funny, thinking you're smarter than everyone else is a sure sign you aren't < 1273947597 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so go away < 1273947602 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck off alise < 1273947607 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a joke < 1273947612 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster < 1273947619 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :semaphore < 1273947622 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, hm? < 1273947625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean < 1273947656 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try to make semaphores on various sections of RAM < 1273947673 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is everyone so nasty to me < 1273947694 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273947695 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: because you are nasty to them < 1273947712 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273947721 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does that idiom exist in English as well? < 1273947723 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and write a kernel that runs on single processor and controls other units < 1273947725 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"waking up on the wrong side" < 1273947728 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ^ < 1273947730 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1273947730 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \o/ < 1273947731 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :          | < 1273947731 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :          |\ < 1273947734 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :broken < 1273947736 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: yes < 1273947741 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :waking up on the wrong side of the bed < 1273947743 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I definitely think soupdragon did that < 1273947743 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1273947743 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1273947744 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        /´\ < 1273947755 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ah right, in Sweden we skip the "of the bed" bit < 1273947767 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another bot? < 1273947779 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, no a script of a non-bot < 1273947783 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never seen that guy talk though < 1273947784 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Poland we say "To get up with the left leg." < 1273947791 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, that's strange < 1273947797 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In soviet russia we say "Bed gets out of you" < 1273947806 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1273947809 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idioms are idioms < 1273947831 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, good point < 1273947844 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway how will you do the semaphores? < 1273947870 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, you need some sort of low level arbiter if both requests to read/write arrive at once < 1273947876 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some kind of bus ownership or whatever < 1273947911 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't have more than one device writing on a bus at once. (well you can but it isn't a good idea...) < 1273947915 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, we're going to have to write the simulator for this ourselves. < 1273947924 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well yes, and? < 1273947931 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet alise will do it. < 1273947942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once he thinks of a name for it < 1273947945 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1273947969 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and invented three separate OS and one replacement for the concept of file systems) < 1273947976 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(invented, not actually wrote them) < 1273947978 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1273948033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then acceleration, a, is < 1273948033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = Delta v(t) < 1273948034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = v(t+1) - v(t) < 1273948034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = v[A rel A{H^t+1}] - v[A rel A{H^t}] < 1273948034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = v[A] - v[A{H^t+1}] - v[A] - v[A{H^t}] < 1273948034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = A - AH - A{H^t+1} - A{H^t+2} - A - AH - A{H^t} - A{H^t+1} < 1273948036 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = -2 AH - 2 A{H^t+1} - A{H^t+2} - A{H^t} < 1273948046 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That seems a very strange result. < 1273948048 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what? < 1273948054 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is rel? < 1273948055 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, man, it /is/ the wrong way around. < 1273948061 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sec, just rewriting it < 1273948065 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I'll pastie the whole thing < 1273948068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, also where did the abs() go? < 1273948072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sssh < 1273948107 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had idea making up a new pack of cards. < 1273948110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't believe you can get rid of all abs() quite that easily... < 1273948137 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The case has multiple compartments, for four decks of cards, poker chips, pegs, dice, etc < 1273948137 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v = (x,y)-(xH,yH). < 1273948138 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s = (x,y)D(xH,yH). < 1273948139 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is wrong < 1273948141 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be < 1273948148 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v = (xH,yH)-(x,y) < 1273948149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, make 3D cards. < 1273948150 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I know < 1273948153 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(whatever that means) < 1273948167 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga, so how are you going to solve both trying to write at once? < 1273948188 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The cards have the suit/number also written in horizontal in the right corner as well as the suit/number vertical on the left corner, so that you can see the suit even if arranged the cards in a different order < 1273948195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, also it would be funnier with a comma between "poker" and "chips" < 1273948196 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1273948199 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1273948205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, wb < 1273948212 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Hahahahahaha I suppose it is funny. But that's just the joke < 1273948220 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, link oerjan to our current draft... < 1273948236 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a sec < 1273948238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1273948244 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't he say he had some idea for it? < 1273948245 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, no? < 1273948251 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ii didn't think about the details yet but still, multiprocessor is my goal :D < 1273948252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, how far did you get with that idea? < 1273948272 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Four packs of cards, one with blue checkerboard pattern on back, one with red checkerboard pattern on back, and two with spiders on back (both identical, and also invertible). < 1273948292 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The blue checkerboard cards and one of the spiders pack has blue dots next to the number on the front of the cards. < 1273948300 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very far. i was sort of hoping rule 110 was an example. < 1273948303 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably i would need some clever piece of hardware that buffers output of units < 1273948317 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The outside of the case is also a checkerboard, cribbage board, and with an arrow so you can keep track of who is dealer or whatever. < 1273948317 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, huh? < 1273948365 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rule 110 has lots of gliders of various speeds, as you'd expect from a CA with relativistic features < 1273948381 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And since the game has eight jokers in all, each joker can be differently on the front. Each deck has one black and one red joker (indicated by black/red star where the number/suit gues), and different designs on the front. < 1273948384 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, but was it relativistic? < 1273948405 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, and doesn't GOL have gliders at various speeds too? < 1273948408 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never found a working lorentz transformation (which would have had to be one-way btw) < 1273948413 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, one joker might have one suit on each edge, one might have roman numbers I to IV on each edge, one might be V to VIII, etc. In the middle of the design, there might be reference to poker hands or whatever else might go there. < 1273948431 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i suppose it does < 1273948432 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is one way of keeping track of trump suits. < 1273948432 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, very... elaborate... < 1273948440 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as other things. < 1273948442 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I fail to see what such a pack is good for < 1273948460 0 :Alex3012!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273948482 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hm? what do you mean lorentz transformations? < 1273948491 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway a "real" relativistic CA should have at least some working lorentz transformations < 1273948491 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, also how do you get time dilation in rule 110? < 1273948496 0 :Alex3012!~chatzilla@ool-18b989d3.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273948505 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is one other thing I forgot: On each card, there is an arrow to the left of the right indicators. It is pointing upwards if you are holding the card one way, downwards if you hold the card the other way. < 1273948513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lorentz transformation is the map for changing coordinates in relativity < 1273948517 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ah < 1273948539 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I am not discussing a single pack, but rather, a case containing four decks as well as other things. < 1273948555 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, so a traveling gaming kit? < 1273948556 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I called this set ULTRACARD. < 1273948558 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once you have that, time dilation is obvious, since gliders map into different speed gliders with it < 1273948565 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :travel* < 1273948576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, interesting < 1273948578 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about the GOL < 1273948584 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it can be travel card game, but it can be used for other things as well, even. < 1273948595 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I think this is more advanced than what we are doing. Hope alise post that link soon < 1273948602 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can easily tell which are single and double packs of cards, even! < 1273948606 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: i'm rewriting it a bit, see /msg < 1273948617 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273948619 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what /we're/ doing is badly translating basic physics into CA terms < 1273948622 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't even know whether a CA lorentz transformation is possible, fwiw < 1273948624 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And many cards games might use some extra equipment, which is included here. < 1273948645 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least a reversible one. < 1273948649 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I think my design of the jokers is improved way of design of jokers. < 1273948659 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273948674 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you know that if you display tha CA grid from a perspective of obserfver placed on the grid and taking assumption that information travels with the speed of one square per tick < 1273948694 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you get a doppler effect when glider approaches the observer? < 1273948737 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see how, if it is not relativistic space? < 1273948746 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, what about contraction though? < 1273948756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, the other special relativity effect < 1273948758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(iirc) < 1273948824 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: those are connected really. basically the lorentz transformation i'm thinking of is approximately a linear/affine map of one spacetime to the other, preserving the maximal speed (as in ordinary relativity) < 1273948834 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: since you add the speed of information... < 1273948857 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from that it follows that the transformed versions of things will seem contracted and dilated < 1273948928 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rule 110 was interesting because the maximal speed within its "ether" grid pattern is _not_ 1 as it is for the full automaton < 1273948951 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the ether grid pattern _looks_ sort of time shifted already < 1273948981 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the shortest repetition is something like 4 steps left, 1 step forward in time) < 1273948985 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273949045 0 :Gracenotes!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273949069 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, also general relativity of some sort. At least I see that as a good if we get something working for special. It would be rather trivial to define gravity in any given point anyway < 1273949108 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :general relativity is immensely more complicated than special < 1273949136 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it makes no sense in this context. < 1273949139 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, pseduo-general then < 1273949167 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a non-fixed spacetime is sort of the _essence_ of it, the opposite of a CA < 1273949193 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, well you could define alive cells to have a mass of 1, then compute "mass-something" in any given point by looking at neighbourhood with a function to reduce the importance of far-away cells < 1273949196 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I heard wolfram is doing some work in this area < 1273949212 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, shouldn't that work for finding out mass centers < 1273949217 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then we shall beat them to it! < 1273949228 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: that's just basic gravity, general relativity is about gravity changing spacetime < 1273949241 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or _being_ spacetime < 1273949248 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, yes we get to that, but before we can get to it we need a notion of mass, no? < 1273949277 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1273949298 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273949315 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd want a notion of mass for really doing special relativity as well < 1273949322 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I'm defining my stuff :P < 1273949324 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll see it soon < 1273949328 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, well that is what I gave above? < 1273949338 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the standard model doesn't have mass < 1273949352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273949359 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The standard model != relativity. < 1273949374 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't standard model quantum mechanics? < 1273949382 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which we aren't doing < 1273949427 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, so once you have this notion of mass I gave above, then you have to compute how much it deforms space time in any given point. < 1273949436 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the standard model is special relativistic, though < 1273949461 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAs can't have curved spacetime. < 1273949471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Here you go: http://pastie.org/961798.txt?key=srjlqknik7dtjpwunkeg We used to say a cell A and AH directly, but this abstracted particle-function notion has simplified things a lot. < 1273949478 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, has let me used finite derivative. < 1273949481 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I can't see why not, as long as it is curved in a discrete way < 1273949485 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not much, I'm basically just defining discrete trivial physics. < 1273949494 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there you go; derivatives map to finite derivatives as they should and all. < 1273949497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make of it what you will. < 1273949499 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: How does it affect things? < 1273949528 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, by bending their path. Needs to be in discrete steps of course < 1273949537 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: The rule for acceleration seems... strange. < 1273949546 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can we just focus on special for now? < 1273949566 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GENERAL ANNOUNCEMENT: http://pastie.org/961798.txt?key=srjlqknik7dtjpwunkeg is the latest thing < 1273949579 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently the acceleration of a particle A is A(t+2) - 2 A(t+1) - A(t) < 1273949587 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where A(n) = A{H^n} < 1273949605 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Starting at t=0, acceleration is AHH - 2 AH - A < 1273949606 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go figure. < 1273949618 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GAH < 1273949623 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, lets see.. what is {}? < 1273949626 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, ? < 1273949630 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: {} is just lexical stuff. < 1273949633 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A{H^0} = A < 1273949636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A{H^1} = AH < 1273949636 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1273949639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hm < 1273949639 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We don't use it any more < 1273949642 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was just what I used before < 1273949645 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273949646 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's now particle functions < 1273949660 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, sure we can translate this back into a CA though? < 1273949684 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, okay < 1273949711 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let A(n) = (0,n+1). Starting at t=0, aA = (0,3) - 2 (0,2) - (0,1) = (0,3) - (0,4) - (0,1) = (0,1). < 1273949730 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that does not seem quite right < 1273949735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A isn't accelerating at all < 1273949789 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273949807 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1273949809 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something's wrong < 1273949812 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1273949813 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aA should be (0,0) < 1273949820 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because A has a constant velocity of (0,1). < 1273949821 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check that < 1273949847 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ (0,1) < 1273949853 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be < 1273949870 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hm what? < 1273949876 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aA = Delta vA(t) < 1273949876 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = vA(t+1) - vA(t) < 1273949876 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = A(t+2) - A(t+1) - A(t+1) - A(t) < 1273949876 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = A(t+2) - 2 A(t+1) - A(t) < 1273949881 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the acceleration should be A(t+2) - 2 A(t+1) + A(t) < 1273949892 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming i remember my finite differences right < 1273949896 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let A(n) = (0,n+1). vA(t) = (0,t+2) - (0,t+1) = (0,1). < 1273949899 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so I got a step wrong then < 1273949903 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1273949909 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delta f(x) = f(x+1) - f(x) < 1273949914 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vA(t+1) - vA(t) < 1273949920 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :expands to A(t+2) - A(t+1) - A(t+1) - A(t) < 1273949923 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I don't see how this is + A(t). < 1273949939 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, you are forgetting the -*- = + rule < 1273949978 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoops < 1273949993 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273950042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I detected that you were trying to use your Internet service. Would you like me to help you? *unplug*" < 1273950052 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what? < 1273950070 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where is clippy? < 1273950084 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my Internet, dropping my packets. < 1273950088 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHEREISITAAAAH! < 1273950113 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I have the ridiculous new derivation using your definition that A's acceleration is (0,-7) < 1273950117 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, I probably made another stupid error. < 1273950141 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :given that i already calculated it to be (0,0), i should think so < 1273950175 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i have it to be -1 :-) < 1273950180 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the mathematics taught in high school and college is fragmented, out of < 1273950180 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :date and inefficient! < 1273950182 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, scalar? < 1273950185 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*facepalm* < 1273950185 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soilent green is people! < 1273950207 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aA = (0,3) - 2 (0,2) + (0,1) = 0 < 1273950209 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1273950210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was using t < 1273950212 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soylent Green is purple! < 1273950212 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not t+1 < 1273950250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://pastie.org/961806.txt?key=rordooczee0nr3qggjgxnq < 1273950255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should we call the difference of speed? < 1273950267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then, after that, we can consider the Awful Question: how do we start getting some relativity into this base? < 1273950281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoops i made another error < 1273950283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : aA(t) = (0,t+3) - 2 (0,t+2) + (0,t+1) < 1273950283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = (0, (t+3) - (t+2) + (t+1)) < 1273950288 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should be 2(t+2) there of course < 1273950381 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273950396 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might want to write = A(t+2) - A(t+1) - A(t+1) -^H+ A(t) as = (A(t+2) - A(t+1)) - (A(t+1) - A(t)) for clarity < 1273950434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :write it as the incorrect form for clarity? < 1273950446 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er no wait < 1273950447 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no the latter is correct < 1273950448 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1273950449 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1273950451 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems my Internet has decided to have greater instability. Wonderful. < 1273950453 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am so immensely confused now < 1273950457 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you still have it wrong on that page though < 1273950461 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so what /should/ we call the difference of speed across generations < 1273950466 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the intermediate calculation) < 1273950488 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all i know is that the derivative of acceleration is sometimes called jerk < 1273950492 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273950503 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1273950521 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it annoys me that velocity and speed are denoted by bold/italic function names < 1273950525 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how the hell should we write that out? < 1273950531 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :**? < 1273950539 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, are they? < 1273950596 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vectors are sometimes bold, and measured quantities are usually italic < 1273950613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact < 1273950614 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sA(t) = A(t+1) D A(t) < 1273950615 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this? < 1273950625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I always wrote vectors underlined < 1273950634 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it displacement? < 1273950643 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is D < 1273950648 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is how I learnt to write vectors < 1273950652 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's because in ye times of yore you indicated bold for printers that way. < 1273950654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, a newly defined operator I think < 1273950658 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: taxicab distance < 1273950665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, treat it as just distance for analogy to regular terms < 1273950673 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273950710 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well looks like as good a candidate for speed as any < 1273950735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to analogise with standard kinematics, though < 1273950750 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :velocity is vector and speed is scalar... < 1273950762 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am pretty sure it is displacement < 1273950777 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what's the latest version of the page? < 1273950783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :being written < 1273950785 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's both, naturally < 1273950802 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you fixed s(A rel B)? < 1273950818 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you use 1 as your time difference most of the time < 1273950822 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or v(A rel B)? < 1273950842 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm < 1273950844 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would you call it? < 1273950846 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :speed or displacement? < 1273950856 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess, in a way, it is speed since we can't "finite integrate" v to get s < 1273950902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/961819.txt?key=esgkaovh9wc6mi1yy0sjtg < 1273950905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here is the current state of play < 1273950906 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A(t+2) D A(t) would be a displacement with a different time interval < 1273950914 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discrete, finite trivial physics < 1273950924 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now we need to make it relativistic in some way < 1273950928 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cough* *pokes oerjan* < 1273950955 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well for a start the relative velocity is completely wrong < 1273950988 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also when doing special relativity you really want spacetime vectors < 1273951003 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :v(A rel B)(t) = vA(t) - vB(t) < 1273951003 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = (A(t+1) - A(t)) - (B(t+1) - B(t)) < 1273951009 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I realised it was wrong in a different way too < 1273951013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(need to swap the + in) < 1273951033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: mm < 1273951038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems hard to adapt this to, though < 1273951046 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: latest: http://pastie.org/961821.txt?key=evbqznopsmamodomdr6yaa < 1273951148 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: one thing I note is that we can't allow particles to be arbitrary functions < 1273951155 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or we can have particles sight-seeing by blipping to random locations < 1273951164 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why A(t+1) must be the CA-defined heir of A(t) < 1273951186 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the neighbourhood here? < 1273951220 0 :ws!wswieb@akson.sgh.waw.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1273951225 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Irrelevant. < 1273951238 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The CA must define neighbourhoods, and successors based on these neighbourhoods. < 1273951243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that only alive particles have heirs and the like. < 1273951246 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dead particles are just vacuum. < 1273951296 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1273951373 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273951510 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: So... < 1273951511 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What now? < 1273951569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are spacetime vectors? A 3D vector with time being one of the components. < 1273951576 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/./?/ < 1273951586 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1273951587 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273951661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what physics we can define for CAs using these definitions already. < 1273951676 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now the spacetime distance between (x1,y1,t1) and (x2,y2,t2) is ((x1,y1)D(y1,y2))^2 - (t1-t2)^2 < 1273951692 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :might put in a c there if it's not 1 < 1273951706 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i'm not sure if taxicab distance in space is a good thing < 1273951719 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we certainly cannot use for the whole of spacetime, i think < 1273951723 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*use it < 1273951877 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, oh? < 1273951913 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273951935 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um well if there is a taxicab relativity i don't know about it :D < 1273952002 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1273952003 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl food < 1273952007 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm well i guess the problem is that taxicab metrics have very few invariant transformations < 1273952038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273952043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wasn't the one who thought of using taxicab < 1273952046 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you basically _have_ to map an axis to an axis < 1273952059 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(direction) < 1273952104 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273952122 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so we should use Euclidean distance? < 1273952128 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it requires reals... < 1273952132 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't /have/ reals < 1273952149 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i forgot a square root up there < 1273952160 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :differentiation following space-time < 1273952169 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however if we _don't_ take the square root, we don't need reals < 1273952184 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: dose that ... work? < 1273952208 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*does < 1273952210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for two-d < 1273952213 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273952234 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1273952235 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :euclidean is < 1273952242 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b) D (c,d) = sqrt((a - c)^2 + (b - d)^2) < 1273952244 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you are proposing < 1273952246 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b) D (c,d) = (a - c)^2 + (b - d)^2 < 1273952250 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this even make any sense??? < 1273952269 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not that much < 1273952284 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i mean, let's put it this way, we at least need an abs around the whole thing < 1273952288 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a,b) D (c,d) = |(a - c)^2 + (b - d)^2| < 1273952299 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i wasn't the one who thought of using taxicab <-- I suggested taxicab as an alternative iirc. Plus it allowed us to have integer distances < 1273952301 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm it's always positive < 1273952305 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh true < 1273952310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :granted. now explain how on earth it makes sense < 1273952315 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I also mentioned that we could do straight line < 1273952336 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok it doesn't make sense, satisfied? ;D < 1273952341 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, but that was shot down iirc by you or Phantom_Hoover for not doing integer < 1273952343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no but could we use it as a metric? < 1273952368 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we want the metric to preserve scalar multiplication, i should think < 1273952381 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er i mean < 1273952392 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiplication with a scalar < 1273952417 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there clearly needs to be an Online Repository of Distance Metrics. < 1273952423 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway even if our coordinates are integers, our distances don't have to be < 1273952444 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure they do < 1273952448 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least rationals < 1273952465 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because one, it'd be nice to compute this, and two, it does not make sense to travel a real distance in discrete space!! < 1273952487 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh < 1273952490 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what :P < 1273952559 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i don't know how this should work anyway, except that there should be _some_ lorentz transformations ;) < 1273952577 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway (a - c)^2 + (b - d)^2 isn't even a distance metric < 1273952582 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't obey the triangle equality < 1273952589 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHATEVER < 1273952597 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273952626 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thuoght a,b,c,d were integers < 1273952632 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are < 1273952641 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're talking about (a,b)D(c,d) here < 1273952641 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's a counter-example to the triangle law? < 1273952671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok um actually i just used the wrong mathematica command to try and decide it :D < 1273952771 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273952790 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In[26]:= ForAll[{x0, x1, y0, y1, z0, z1}, < 1273952791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : dist[{x0, x1}, {z0, z1}] <= < 1273952791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : dist[{x0, x1}, {y0, y1}] + dist[{y0, y1}, {z0, z1}]] < 1273952791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Out[26]= \!\( < 1273952791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SubscriptBox[\(\[ForAll]\), \({x0, x1, y0, y1, z0, z1}\)]\( < 1273952792 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SuperscriptBox[\((x0 - z0)\), \(2\)] + < 1273952794 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SuperscriptBox[\((x1 - z1)\), \(2\)] <= < 1273952796 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SuperscriptBox[\((x0 - y0)\), \(2\)] + < 1273952798 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SuperscriptBox[\((x1 - y1)\), \(2\)] + < 1273952800 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SuperscriptBox[\((y0 - z0)\), \(2\)] + < 1273952802 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\*SuperscriptBox[\((y1 - z1)\), \(2\)]\)\) < 1273952804 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In[27]:= Resolve[%, Integers] < 1273952806 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Out[27]= False < 1273952808 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :proved beyotch < 1273952813 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(0,0)D(1,0) = 1, (1,0)D(2,0) = 1, (0,0)D(2,0) = 4 Q.E.D. < 1273952829 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1+1 > 4 ? < 1273952832 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what mathematica is saying soupdragon is that /no/ pairs obey that law :-D < 1273952838 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think < 1273952864 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um that's incorrect, (0,0), (1,0) and (1,1) do obey it < 1273952869 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i tried that first) < 1273952872 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# The British Rail metric (also called the Post Office metric or the SNCF metric) on a normed vector space is given by d(x, y) = ||x|| + ||y|| for distinct points x and y, and d(x, x) = 0. More generally ||.|| can be replaced with a function f taking an arbitrary set S to non-negative reals and taking the value 0 at most once: then the metric is defined on S by d(x, y)=f(x)+f(y) for distinct points x and y, and d(x, x) = 0. The name alludes to the tendency < 1273952872 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : of railway journeys (or letters) to proceed via London (or Paris) irrespective of their final destination. < 1273952874 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's use that, then! :P < 1273952880 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well mathematica is dumb < 1273952936 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also unreadable *ducks* < 1273952956 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the output text was obviously rendered more nicely on screen... < 1273952991 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rail metric = taxicab, surely < 1273953023 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1273953039 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1273953043 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :taxicab(p,q) = ||p-q||_1 < 1273953053 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rail(p,q) = ||p||+||q|| if p<>q; 0 otherwise < 1273953055 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :misread < 1273953059 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rail metric could be 'river metric' I guess < 1273953068 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course the rail metric is ever so slightly ridiculous < 1273953084 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, wrong again, it's not the river one < 1273953117 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Clearly what we need to define is finite square root. < 1273953124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*facepalm* < 1273953130 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No? :P < 1273953154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well we did use floor(sqrt(x)) in a previous discussion recently < 1273953167 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pah, that's like saying the ... floor... of the derivative is the finite derivative. < 1273953230 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: How's this for a distance metric, (a,b)D(c,d) = |(a-c)*(b-d)| < 1273953243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note: May not actually obey any relevant laws < 1273953295 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd think < 1273953306 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it that you're looking for, btw.? < 1273953322 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a metric on Z^2 with values in Z+? < 1273953338 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we already have that < 1273953348 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it just doesn't really work for the purpose :D < 1273953365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273953365 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :another one btw is max(|a-c|,|b-d|) < 1273953376 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I went away for a bit and we had screens and screens of stuff :P < 1273953381 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now did you get anywhere? < 1273953386 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(corresponding to L^infinity like taxicab corresponds to L^1) < 1273953392 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ws: yes < 1273953397 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ws: that we can do relativity with nicely < 1273953415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so /does/ |(a-c)*(b-d)| violate any laws? :D < 1273953445 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE UNIVERSE _IS_ A GIANT SQUARE CA DAMMIT AND WE'LL PROVE IT BY SQUEEZING RELATIVITY INTO IT < 1273953459 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PRECISELY! < 1273953460 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: almost certainly < 1273953464 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and quantum mechanics ... (... eep) < 1273953474 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[oerjan runs away screaming] < 1273953491 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: it zeroes too much ;-) < 1273953494 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ANY PROBLEMS WITH DIMENSION WILL BE SOLVED VIA THE HOLOGRAPHIC PRINCIPLE) < 1273953505 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ws: you zero too much! < 1273953507 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok what about < 1273953509 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|a-c| * |b-d| < 1273953518 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: a metric should zero iff these pairs are equal < 1273953519 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aka exactly the same < 1273953540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :State of play, STAT! < 1273953554 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, miraculously absolute value distributes over multiplication < 1273953563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: SHUT UP :D < 1273953571 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm in silly mode not think mode < 1273953575 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I SAID STAT! < 1273953576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: WE HAVE NO CLUE < 1273953577 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey it's a neat fact < 1273953600 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's a fact too < 1273953604 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok what about floor(|a-c|/|b-d| + |b-d|/|a-c|) < 1273953612 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where x/0 is defined to be, uh, 0 < 1273953619 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : and quantum mechanics ... (... eep) <-- can we do that after we got general relativity done? < 1273953624 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: PROBABLY NOT < 1273953630 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which we will do after we have special relativity done < 1273953632 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Definitely not. < 1273953639 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ah, so we won't ever get there? < 1273953643 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :QM requires nondeterminism < 1273953648 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1273953653 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering that "discrete quantum mechanics" is the most hilarious lunacy ever dreamt of < 1273953661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well. many worlds! < 1273953662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, :D < 1273953679 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPACE IS FOUR-DIMENSIONAL, FOUR-SIDED CELLULAR AUTOMATON; ONE SIDE IS TIME < 1273953689 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND THE OTHERS EXPERIENCE TIME-EFFECTS FROM IT < 1273953689 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIME CUBE < 1273953694 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: It's nondeterministic as to which world we go into. < 1273953695 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIME CUBE IS DISCRETE QUANTUM MECHANICS WTF < 1273953700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: just list them all :D < 1273953709 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :space is NOT four dimensional < 1273953716 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spacetime is. < 1273953736 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: but time cube is! < 1273953740 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and time cube IS platonic space! < 1273953742 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be a *very* small fourth dimension. < 1273953746 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it claims that then it's bullshit < 1273953750 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a 5-torus. < 1273953754 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey discrete quantum mechanics is not that lunatic, spin operators are discrete after all iirc < 1273953767 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And time cube is naturally bullshit. < 1273953771 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h < 1273953795 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Heisenberg? < 1273953798 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you want discrete string theory < 1273953799 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a /very/ small fourth dimension :D < 1273953803 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I think is a contradiction < 1273953810 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure < 1273953815 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Discrete... string... theory? < 1273953817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is way above my head, string theory I mean < 1273953818 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: may be his discovery, i don't recall < 1273953820 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So are the strings just badly interpolated lines? < 1273953822 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, :D < 1273953824 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :string theory is false < 1273953830 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are THREE dimensions _only_ < 1273953837 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, eh... what? < 1273953840 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I smell nerd religious wat! < 1273953844 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/wat/war/ < 1273953848 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your string theory claims 11 or 26 dimensions then sorry but it's _Wrong_ < 1273953852 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: I see; your proof? < 1273953859 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, where is your proof of this < 1273953863 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is this along the lines of your amazing proof "Plants grow; therefore god exists". < 1273953869 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, god. < 1273953870 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if anyone wasn't there: I'm not exaggerating, he said exactly this) < 1273953880 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O.o < 1273953895 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you build a klien bottle that doesn't self intersect? No you can't QED < 1273953904 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :discrete string theory would be like little rosaries, right... < 1273953909 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can *if it's 4D*. < 1273953923 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: OH MY WORD! All the string physicists missed that completely! < 1273953926 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll tell them right now < 1273953931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just did so, they've decided to abandon it < 1273953935 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How did they miss that? < 1273953956 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ since he can't form a valid counterrargument... < 1273953987 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so what does the self-intersection of Klein bottles have to do with the number of space dimensions? < 1273953994 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :count-err-arguments, the most common type on the internet < 1273954048 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon really believes he has disproved string theory in the strongest sense by stating "you can't build a klein bottle that doesn't intersect" < 1273954054 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ladies and gentlemen, we are witnessing true insanity < 1273954066 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ladies and gentlemen, we are witnessing ad hominem < 1273954073 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well either that or true (but lousy) trolling < 1273954082 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you know I'm right, but you can't admit defeat you're just doing this < 1273954098 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, we have *no idea* how your argument works. < 1273954100 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are funny soupdragon, i think you would make a fun pet < 1273954103 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i could go around saying things < 1273954108 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you'd always make me laugh by saying something incomprehensible < 1273954118 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :study the topology of klien bottle i fyou don't understand my proof < 1273954119 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is what pets are for < 1273954149 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : can you build a klien bottle that doesn't self intersect? No you can't QED <-- not with current technology < 1273954157 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't same as "in theory" < 1273954162 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, not with any technology ever -- it's a fundametal fact of the universe < 1273954167 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, proof of this < 1273954192 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a basic topology agument < 1273954195 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: State, concisely, why the self-intersection of a Klein bottle precludes there being more than 3 space dimensions? < 1273954197 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assumed everyone knew this.. < 1273954197 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: well what you are saying does not make much sense. < 1273954198 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, tell me < 1273954203 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: but that is not why he is wrong < 1273954206 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://xkcd.com/171/ < 1273954231 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The smallest number of dimensions you can immerse a klien bottle in is 4 < 1273954234 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really simple < 1273954237 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1273954238 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :correct < 1273954245 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE CALABI-YAU MANIFOLD IS EDUCATED EVIL < 1273954249 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that preclude 4D space? < 1273954251 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, ever heard of flatland? < 1273954276 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, I see. < 1273954278 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've read that.. its a nice book < 1273954289 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: incorrect, the klein bottle can be immersed in 3 dimensions < 1273954303 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immersion_(mathematics) < 1273954306 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We can't construct non-intersecting Klein bottles, so we can't have 4D spacce. < 1273954319 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes oerjan, that's right I used the wrong word < 1273954323 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ty < 1273954326 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MWAHAHAHA < 1273954344 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: Is that your argument? < 1273954421 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/Vx0xg.png < 1273954435 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know. < 1273954444 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be easy to see that the self intersection can be remedied by pulling that handle out through 4D < 1273954455 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :topologically you can prove this is not possible in jsut 3D < 1273954483 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you claim that the universe is more than 3D the burden of proof is on you to produce a klien bottle that doesn't self intersect < 1273954523 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^ I learned that trick from atheists < 1273954562 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, but we can't mani < 1273954569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forget that. < 1273954591 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rest of the sentence disappeared into the 23rd dimension < 1273954606 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote if you claim that the universe is more than 3D the burden of proof is on you to produce a klien bottle that doesn't self intersect ^ I learned that trick from atheists < 1273954608 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :159| if you claim that the universe is more than 3D the burden of proof is on you to produce a klien bottle that doesn't self intersect ^ I learned that trick from atheists < 1273954613 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Insanity too amazing not to preserve. < 1273954630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look, soupdragon, if you can't see why you're wrong, I can't be bothered. < 1273954643 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I give up.. what's the fourth dimension? < 1273954650 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Firstly, the repeated misspelling of Klein; secondly, the patently incorrect application of burden of proof; and thirdly, jesus christ on a freaking pogo stick man. < 1273954663 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's incredibly small and toroidal. < 1273954672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So we haven't the ability to move stuff in it. < 1273954689 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm invisible dragon in the garage much? < 1273954702 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: you do realise that burden of proof NEVER implies anything is false? < 1273954705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION chuckles
< 1273954709 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just that we don't have to consider it? you stated it was /false/ outright < 1273954711 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and besides, no < 1273954719 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't mean we can't detect it. < 1273954719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can make predictions about these spaces with a coherent theory of them < 1273954724 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that we can't decide on one :-) < 1273954837 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273954857 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`help < 1273954858 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ < 1273954878 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`help quote < 1273954880 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ < 1273954887 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1273954888 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :97| i am sad ( of course by analogy) :) smileys) < 1273954901 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote help < 1273954903 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :66| It looks like my hairs are too fat. Can you help me split them? < 1273954912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...what. < 1273954917 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o hai oerjan < 1273954931 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'evening augur < 1273954982 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273955007 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1273955009 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :77| no Deewiant No?! I've been living a lie yep. Excuse me while I jump out of the window -> < 1273955030 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortunately it was a first floor window. < 1273955031 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run ls < 1273955032 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bin \ cube2.base64 \ cube2.jpg \ hack_gregor \ hello.txt \ help.txt \ huh \ netcat-0.7.1 \ netcat-0.7.1.tar.gz \ out.txt \ paste \ poetry.txt \ quotes \ share \ test.sh \ tmpdir.19787 \ wunderbar_emporium < 1273955043 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: It'd still hurt. < 1273955054 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I didn't jump < 1273955066 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: YOU STINKING LIAR < 1273955085 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i may have meant basement. < 1273955093 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is that ground floor < 1273955094 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the quote'd been any longer it'd've clarified that < 1273955100 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1273955122 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`define basement < 1273955124 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* the lowermost portion of a structure partly or wholly below ground level; often used for storage \ * the ground floor facade or interior in Renaissance architecture \ [22]wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn < 1273955140 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess jumping out a basement window would not be that impressive. < 1273955150 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it would! < 1273955153 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it would, just in the wrong kind of way. < 1273955157 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd /rise/ < 1273955174 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or fall through the Earth, then /oscillate/. < 1273955182 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273955223 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah you'd be swallowed by the black hole in the center. < 1273955234 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What black hole? < 1273955251 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PERHAPS IT WOULD BE RELATIVISTIC. < 1273955254 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one at the center of the earth < 1273955260 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay I went away for another bit < 1273955270 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what did you end up with for the CA? < 1273955278 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have relativity yet? < 1273955283 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(special that is) < 1273955286 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: nope < 1273955291 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WE HAVE RELATIVITY < 1273955295 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, :D < 1273955295 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in a CA though < 1273955299 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Which log has soupdragon saying that plants growing proves God? < 1273955300 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1273955304 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, still trying? < 1273955304 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: not sure < 1273955310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use "grep --crazy" < 1273955329 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't get the lot in greppable form. < 1273955339 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote use "grep --crazy" < 1273955343 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :160| use "grep --crazy" < 1273955352 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, wget -r -np < 1273955366 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how large it is < 1273955389 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what she said < 1273955411 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about 50 megs because of minimum file size iirc < 1273955460 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well you don't download a block of zeros < 1273955465 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that is the important bit here < 1273955471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only download actual file size < 1273955477 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let Delta^h f(x) = (f(x+h) - f(x))/h. < 1273955477 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure on disk it will be larger < 1273955490 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah, robots.txt looks like it's blocking me. < 1273955497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let Delta^Sigma f(x) = lim k->inf (sum h=0 to k, Delta^h f(x))/k < 1273955510 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, create a fake robots.txt and tell wget to not refetch files < 1273955512 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then Delta^Sigma -- I'll abbreviate DS -- < 1273955512 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works < 1273955518 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DS (x) = 1 < 1273955522 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DS (2x) = 2 < 1273955524 0 :ws!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: [BX] Been around the world and found that only stupid people are breeding. < 1273955527 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DS (x^2) = infinity < 1273955531 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and finally < 1273955538 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, or < 1273955552 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, just download Gregor's hg repo with the logs in < 1273955556 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot url < 1273955565 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he will love you wasting his bw like that < 1273955568 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DS (2^x) = < 1273955589 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, anyway I could grep my logs, which go back about a year (older archives on cd) < 1273955593 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lim k->inf (2^x log(2) - i 2^x (-i H_k - i 2^(k+1) Phi(2,1,k+1) + pi))/k < 1273955605 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will take a while because it is lzma compressed (or bzip2 for older ones) < 1273955605 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, yeah, I think it's safe to coin DS "Fucked-Up Derivative". < 1273955612 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :switched to xz recently < 1273955618 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, Limit Sum Derivative; LSD. < 1273955625 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, XD < 1273955634 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what phrase should I grep on? < 1273955637 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Try grep atheist < 1273955642 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt... < 1273955644 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but okay < 1273955647 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, which year? < 1273955648 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: grep plant | grep grow < 1273955650 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this year < 1273955663 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grep plant 10.* | grep grow < 1273955671 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A "mere" 21% packet loss, but I can't get any freaking Internet connectivity. < 1273955684 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone got an IP over ICMP tunneling scheme? < 1273955697 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, no relevant hits from 2010 < 1273955704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The LSD of (-1^x) = 0 < 1273955711 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(-1)^x, that is. < 1273955717 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, just uorygl oklopol and fax < 1273955718 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pikhq < 1273955723 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: fax = soupdragon < 1273955727 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the lsd < 1273955736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-05-01/01_freenode-#esoteric.log.gz:apr 25 14:36:31 watch a plant grow: You have witnessed it < 1273955736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-05-01/01_freenode-#esoteric.log.gz:apr 25 14:50:08 oklopol: I can prove god exists: You can see a plant grow < 1273955737 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Let Delta^h f(x) = (f(x+h) - f(x))/h. < 1273955737 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And no, not making that up. Anyone got an IP over ICMP tunneling scheme handy? < 1273955737 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Let Delta^Sigma f(x) = lim k->inf (sum h=0 to k, Delta^h f(x))/k < 1273955744 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delta^Sigma is the LSD, Limit Sigma Derivative. < 1273955746 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Objectivism states that "Existence exists" and "Existence is Identity." To be is to be "an entity of a specific nature made of specific attributes." That which has no attributes does not and cannot exist. Hence, the axiom of identity: a thing is what it is. < 1273955754 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD (x) = 1 < 1273955756 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD (2x) = 2 < 1273955758 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(strange it was .gz...) < 1273955760 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD (x^2) = undefined < 1273955765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD (2^x) = lim k->inf (2^x log(2) - i 2^x (-i H_k - i 2^(k+1) Phi(2,1,k+1) + pi))/k < 1273955772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD ((-1)^x) = 0 < 1273955788 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, note: dates there are either UTC or CET/CEST < 1273955792 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect LSD (2^x) is undefined < 1273955795 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so it may be one day off compared to clog < 1273955797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but like hell am i gonna work it out < 1273955806 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't be arsed to calculate which direction < 1273955814 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: that fit quite well into the surrounding insanity < 1273955868 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD (1/x) = 0 < 1273955871 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of LSD is this! < 1273955879 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the kind that reduces INT < 1273955891 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LSD (x/n) = 1/n < 1273955899 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1273955904 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: wat < 1273955904 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: What date is it? < 1273955921 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it says in that line < 1273955934 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the logs are rotated monthly < 1273955944 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1st April? < 1273955944 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dir name is rotation date < 1273955955 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, " 2010-05-01/01_freenode-#esoteric.log.gz:apr 25 14:36:31 watch a plant grow: You have witnessed it" <-- "apr 25" < 1273955958 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see that near the middle < 1273955971 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I think it is Swedish date format for some unknown reason < 1273956034 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273956037 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : the kind that reduces INT < 1273956039 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did you mean here :P < 1273956068 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well if you reduce INT you would end up with NAT I guess < 1273956071 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1273956075 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a pun attempt on integration and intelligence < 1273956084 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273956088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay my pun was worse < 1273956095 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :slightly roleplaying inspired < 1273956106 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I was just about to ask about that yeah < 1273956124 0 :impomatic!~chatzilla@87.115.109.119 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273956152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1273956175 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's funny how... silly LSD is. < 1273956185 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the results seem almost random. < 1273956222 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Psychedelic drugs are like that < 1273956230 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's just A = (f(x+1)-f(x) / 1) + (f(x+2)-f(x) / 2) + (f(x+3)-f(x) / 3) + ... < 1273956243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then basically the limit as k->inf of k terms of A / k < 1273956252 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's because it's the difference "in the large" < 1273956356 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Sorry, my home computer (and so my logging) is down :P < 1273956480 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273956511 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273956521 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, hg clone https://codu.org/projects/esotericlogs/hg/ if you'd like. < 1273956525 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll be a while though :P < 1273956535 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once I do that myself, I'll update them to today. < 1273956601 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, hm < 1273956684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was writing a script to keep a log archive up-to-date, rename files to YYYY-MM-DD, and make the times UTC (including wrapping to other files) < 1273956690 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I got bored at the wrapping-to-files bit. < 1273956730 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, it's up to date. < 1273956753 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, it will be once I hg push :P < 1273956759 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now what silly username/password did I use here >_> < 1273956769 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My personal logs are in a PostgreSQL database, but they're not quite as comprehensive. < 1273956774 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FIX THE TIMES < 1273956784 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: "snugglebunnies" < 1273956789 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There we go :P < 1273956817 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273956841 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10.02.13:21:12:29 `google snugglebunnies < 1273956912 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273956920 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION thought for a moment Gregor had somehow utterly failed to give HackEgo a command
< 1273956942 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just snugglebunny-grepping :P < 1273956956 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : I'll grep YOUR snugglebunny < 1273956975 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what she said < 1273957002 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273957010 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um wait < 1273957035 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273957046 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't really make sense with an _actual_ innuendo, does it. < 1273957144 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1273957195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, why not < 1273957233 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean it doesn't make sense but why is that an issue < 1273957240 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the whole point is to point out an unintended innuendo < 1273957246 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, gave up on the relativistic CA yet? < 1273957263 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVER < 1273957264 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVER! < 1273957266 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hm good point < 1273957273 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, so how is it going? < 1273957283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Its velocity is 0! < 1273957290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1273957296 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also 1/2 ! < 1273957301 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 1/3 ! < 1273957306 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and -2/5 ! < 1273957310 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1273957318 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, link to last version though? < 1273957350 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/961891.txt?key=iqkvno8jakp5xeyub3mkq < 1273957358 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: and sqrt(0) (not 0!) < 1273957372 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why of course, 0! is 1 < 1273957377 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I WAS ABOUT TO-- < 1273957396 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you think i carefully added spaces < 1273957415 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1273957463 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273957511 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273957566 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nedroid.com/comics/2010-02-04-beartato-popcorn.gif < 1273957667 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the attack of the killer zombie maize < 1273957690 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Suggested dessert: http://nedroid.com/imagesb/beartato-ridiculousbeliefsb.gif) < 1273957921 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273957933 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah everyone knows the earth revolves around me! < 1273957941 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, me! < 1273957951 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273957968 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CAS. LET US RELATIVISE THEM. < 1273957969 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :infidel! < 1273957996 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly we just need to bend the grid in funny ways. < 1273957997 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that was about the "No, me!" not the cas.) < 1273958032 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: How does the concept of curvature apply to discrete spacetime? < 1273958050 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273958052 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't, we bend the image on screen < 1273958072 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean we bend the screen < 1273958108 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273958303 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... < 1273958314 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does Golly support toroidal universes? < 1273958329 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :golly, i don't know < 1273958365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i doubt < 1273958368 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :golly lol < 1273958384 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273958399 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273958411 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : CAS. LET US RELATIVISE THEM. <-- what? Relativistic computer algebra systems? < 1273958420 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool. < 1273958421 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this doesn't even make sense < 1273958423 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want one. < 1273958424 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might also be cool. < 1273958426 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon! < 1273958430 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pounces soupdragon
< 1273958435 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey augur *hug* < 1273958437 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, oh did you mean CAs? < 1273958448 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously. < 1273958465 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like to be an artist and paint pictures < 1273958467 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hows it goooin soup? < 1273958508 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jutst watching quantum physics on youtube < 1273958532 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup < 1273958577 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i am not entirely sure if soupdragon is a master troll or if alise is a master at being (or pretending to be) trolled < 1273958595 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both. < 1273958595 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1273958597 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: meh. i dont care. soup has some interesting in theoretical linguistics < 1273958598 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1273958607 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey i've been laughing at him not getting angry < 1273958611 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION loves augur
< 1273958617 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273958618 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, a budding romance. < 1273958623 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D: < 1273958625 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're not compatable :P < 1273958625 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dont love me! < 1273958627 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D: < 1273958633 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, she's a she < 1273958635 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope augur is a proponent of the three-dimensions-ONLY plants-imply-God theory. < 1273958636 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :square ped round hole < 1273958639 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :peg < 1273958651 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon, ah you need a converter box? Like between dvi/vga or usb/serial < 1273958652 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1273958653 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :square ped < 1273958653 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell, I'm sure you could square the circle < 1273958654 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1273958658 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly _four_-dimension plants would be the work of the devil < 1273958658 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION rubs alise's bum
< 1273958660 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With God < 1273958661 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;o < 1273958664 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: ... < 1273958665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okayyy < 1273958675 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? she said square ped < 1273958682 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1273958699 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION drinking
< 1273958712 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote * augur rubs alise's bum [...] what? she said square ped :| < 1273958712 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273958717 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :161|* augur rubs alise's bum [...] what? she said square ped :| < 1273958734 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1273958741 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273958762 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I really have no clue what this guy is talking about.. somethign to do with molecular configuartions < 1273958767 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non sequitur ad astra < 1273958769 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1273958790 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does not follow to the star? < 1273958815 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*stars < 1273958817 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im reading a book called Anarchy Works < 1273958828 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it does < 1273958832 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait... < 1273958838 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Aster..? < 1273958847 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that decline...? < 1273958882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Maybe it's like Microsoft Works. < 1273958891 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wiktionary has only the plural meaning < 1273958894 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss anarchy with a "doubt".) < 1273958902 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a pretty good book < 1273958905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, ouch < 1273958905 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it has no copyright < 1273958920 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fishes, are also not copyrighted. < 1273958922 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is related. < 1273958932 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well, the issue with it is bullies. Well.. one of the issues < 1273958942 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically anarchy is nice utopia sure < 1273958946 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The issue with communism is people won't come to work! < 1273958954 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: hm wiktionary doesn't have aster except as a broken link from the english < 1273958954 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make bad critiques of incredibly naive versions of ANY theory. < 1273958955 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try again. < 1273958956 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, one of the issues maybe < 1273958970 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, anarchy isn't stable < 1273958971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The issue with capitalism is that corporations will just go around KILLING everyone for PROFIT! < 1273958976 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has astra though, which is stars < 1273958980 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: you should read this book < 1273958982 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll repeat again: You can make bad critiques of incredibly naive versions of ANY theory. < 1273958995 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, you said this yourself some time ago though < 1273959008 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really that. < 1273959009 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway. < 1273959013 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point of it is to go through example after example of why anarchy /can/ work and /can/ be stable < 1273959027 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: -a plural would normally be neuter... but aster doesn't look neuter. and wiktionary gives no gender. < 1273959040 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aster, aster... < 1273959106 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the original greek is masculine and has no -a (or alpha) in sight < 1273959109 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E1%BC%80%CF%83%CF%84%CE%AE%CF%81 < 1273959149 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273959150 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm except accusative < 1273959164 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION doesn't know greek grammar
< 1273959195 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: anyway i was just mangling two latin phrases together < 1273959204 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1273959318 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: oh hm it can _also_ be neuter in greek, http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/%E1%BC%84%CF%83%CF%84%CF%81%CE%BF%CE%BD < 1273959348 0 :Alex3012!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1273959368 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/astrum < 1273959407 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so it's "Does not follow to the stars." < 1273959506 0 :Alex3012!~chatzilla@ool-18b989d3.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273959817 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273959850 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't a Life IRC channel, is there? < 1273959912 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273959921 0 :Alex3012!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273959952 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, I think it would be better to redefine the speed of light in Life as c/1. < 1273959961 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/c/1/c/2/ < 1273959962 0 :Alex3012!~chatzilla@ool-18b989d3.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273959969 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1273959973 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that gliders move at lightspeed? < 1273959976 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s|c/1|c/2|, you mean. < 1273959978 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moving at lightspeed shouldn't be possible. < 1273959988 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because nothing can go faster than c/2 < 1273959996 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a vacuum. < 1273960010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems nicer. < 1273960019 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Seem to recall a "faster-than-lightspeed" hack. :P < 1273960081 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given that there are theoretical ways for us to go FTL if there is already infrastructure in place, it seems appropriate. < 1273960122 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing can go /faster/. < 1273960131 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But nothing should go /as fast/, except light; and GoL has no light, or at least it is implicit. < 1273960139 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it should be c/3. < 1273960150 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It doesn't work; it's an illusion. < 1273960164 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's logically impossible. < 1273960165 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: is that book ancap? < 1273960169 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or regular anarchism < 1273960172 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yeah, that's called scare quotes. < 1273960222 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: it's probably more socialist anarchism but its got a fairly broad array of ideas. one of its examples is of this multinational corporation that runs on strong anti-authoritarian principles < 1273960244 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273960245 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Corporations are a kind of authority, really. < 1273960259 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273960268 0 :augur!~augur@216-164-33-76.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1273960278 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.226.164 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273960280 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops. < 1273960283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: it's probably more socialist anarchism but its got a fairly broad array of ideas. one of its examples is of this multinational corporation that runs on strong anti-authoritarian principles < 1273960283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection) < 1273960283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Corporations are a kind of authority, really. < 1273960294 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh they are, definitely < 1273960308 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that wasnt the point of the example :p < 1273960328 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: iirc the c/2 limit for life is only for _spaceships_. chaotic disturbances like long lines can travel at c proper. < 1273960333 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also certainly quite a bit anti-capitalist rhetoric, but it's aimed towwards capitalism qua contemporary evils of capitalism < 1273960344 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: Was the corporation in question presented as a co-operative? < 1273960347 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not capitalism qua individualist free association sort of markets < 1273960355 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the least authoritarian form of corporation I know; and it works in practice. < 1273960373 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yup, seen that, and not even as a hack. < 1273960387 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: no, its Gore and Associates, a fluoropolymer R&D/manufacturing company < 1273960405 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Evidence: http://hcoop.net/, http://tech.coop/, and, oh, one of the biggest supermarkets/"other stuffs" in Britain.) < 1273960411 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: oh, I thought it was a hypothetical < 1273960417 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no < 1273960419 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its actual < 1273960425 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats the intent of the example < 1273960436 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Co-operatives are awesome, incidentally. < 1273960437 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a real corporation that does real corporation stuff but has no hierarchical management < 1273960449 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole book is nothing but examples of anarchy working < 1273960456 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for all the things people say it cant work for < 1273960491 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb gonna shower < 1273960501 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU COULDN'T SHOWER WITHOUT AUTHORITY < 1273960528 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wants HTTP. D':
< 1273960538 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: use EgoBot as a proxy < 1273960539 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is feasible. < 1273960550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I know. < 1273960556 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wants bandwidth not measured in bits per second
< 1273960833 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : s/c/1/c/2/ <-- broken < 1273960843 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a sed expression I mean < 1273960857 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah alise mentioned that below < 1273960882 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not I < 1273960911 0 :coppro!~coppro@unaffiliated/coppro JOIN :#esoteric < 1273960919 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1273960941 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi pooppy! < 1273960945 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also known as coppro. < 1273960987 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's crappo < 1273960988 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :get it right < 1273961031 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :awehsddns;klfgbhhdssbjsdhfjkosadhnjvbkoxfncjh; < 1273961031 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1273961045 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o hai < 1273961049 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, now that I think of it, that does look like the Greek word "kopros". < 1273961055 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT GIVE ME MORE THAN 5 PACKETTS PER SECOND < 1273961068 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Number of packets doesn't really matter as long as they're big enough. < 1273961072 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, which means? < 1273961080 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that greek word I mean) < 1273961089 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: Except that packets can't be big enough. < 1273961089 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: just some shit < 1273961093 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, XD < 1273961115 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, and you said modem was slower? < 1273961116 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it means poop or crap or shit or dung or feces or excrement or BM. < 1273961127 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: In the past, it was. < 1273961132 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: nothing /exceeds/ c in GoL though right? :D < 1273961133 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, BM? bat manure? < 1273961138 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bowel movement. < 1273961139 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no pathological pattern :-P < 1273961140 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273961146 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently, semaphore would be faster. < 1273961146 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Manure, there's another word. < 1273961151 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: erm of course not < 1273961155 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i was joking < 1273961179 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, is it really 5 packets per second? < 1273961189 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that is still slower than semaphore < 1273961194 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, the Caterpillar is a work of beauty. < 1273961195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1273961195 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :faster < 1273961197 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not slower < 1273961202 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: packets can be arbitrarily large in IPv6! < 1273961205 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty much, anyway. < 1273961206 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: *Less* currently. < 1273961207 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: hm could be fun to put that as an easter egg in a gol program < 1273961212 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, since a packet can contain a lot more than one bit < 1273961213 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: Pity I don't have IPv6! < 1273961220 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say, a pacman pattern really speeding along < 1273961222 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1273961226 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, it is still limited by physical MTU isn't it? < 1273961234 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever it was called < 1273961243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :D < 1273961247 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should learn what MTU is. < 1273961258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maximum_transmission_unit < 1273961261 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hey can we use chaotic lines and stuff to do >c/2 communication in GoL? < 1273961266 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, that < 1273961266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't /have/ to use gliders to communicate, surely < 1273961290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the issue with doing communication with them is that they are, uh, chaotic < 1273961295 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have to use gliders to communicate, but with the appropriate GoL program, gliders are as fast as anything. < 1273961300 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well they're not /that/ chaotic < 1273961304 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: not in-universe < 1273961319 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: There are /many/ >c/2 comms systems. < 1273961325 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, do we really care about in-universe speed? < 1273961332 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Are there any =c? < 1273961333 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, there are space fillers too, they are faster iirc? < 1273961334 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: Yes. < 1273961336 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're Theorists. < 1273961340 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The lightspeed telegraph. < 1273961344 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: they fill space at c/4 or something < 1273961346 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: It's the only meaningful notion of speed *in* Game of Life! < 1273961348 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, oh maybe < 1273961350 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we don't need to fill space < 1273961353 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need to communicate < 1273961354 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: wut < 1273961360 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's a blip which travels through an agar at c. < 1273961361 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh yeah! < 1273961372 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Do you have Golly? < 1273961378 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but I can get it in a pinch. < 1273961382 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, agar??? < 1273961398 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A stable, extensible arrangement of cells. < 1273961399 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An agar is a pattern that tiles the entire plane. < 1273961417 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, still life? < 1273961418 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or moving? < 1273961424 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either < 1273961432 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, I mean, a regular pattern of *** would fit it then < 1273961439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are oscillating agars, but they're less common. < 1273961445 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is an oscillator < 1273961451 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah. < 1273961452 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the one I mentioned? < 1273961466 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's not too much reason not to consider that an agar. < 1273961467 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably, but it doesn't really count. < 1273961469 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :too tired to work out minimum distance < 1273961470 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So you clearly know a bit about GoL, huh. < 1273961471 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, why not < 1273961491 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yes, though not as much as I'd like. < 1273961503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so why doesn't it count ... it seems strange < 1273961504 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most complex signal circuitry confuses me. < 1273961506 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What is the lightspeed telegraph? < 1273961531 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :gliders move at 'lightspeed' < 1273961540 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: no. < 1273961542 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a system that sends a signal along a stretched, regular line of beehives at C. < 1273961545 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they move at c/2 < 1273961550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon: You fail at Life. < 1273961555 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plenty of things move =c in life < 1273961560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and others merely >c/2 < 1273961567 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not move, but have effects at < 1273961568 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961568 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961568 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961568 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961569 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961569 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961569 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU < 1273961570 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what about non-cardinal gliders? don't they move faster than cardinal ones? Or was that for space ships < 1273961572 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961572 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961572 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961572 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1273961573 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961573 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961573 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961573 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU < 1273961574 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961574 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUCK YOU FUC < 1273961576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soupdragon is seriously fucking unstable < 1273961576 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, ! < 1273961576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: < 1273961583 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan oerjan oerjan! < 1273961586 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, do you job as an op there please :) < 1273961588 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spamtastic! < 1273961588 0 :ChanServ!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+o oerjan < 1273961588 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously just ban her until she, I don't know, stops being crazy??? < 1273961588 0 :soupdragon!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was at Phantom_Hoover < 1273961594 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :+b *!*quantum@unaffiliated/fax < 1273961598 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, her? < 1273961600 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like maybe a notch down from completely crazy would do < 1273961602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: transgender < 1273961608 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh okay < 1273961612 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh okay what < 1273961615 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever < 1273961633 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :she's not the first transgendered person we've had here... < 1273961641 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so transmission at c. < 1273961643 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This boot, I have gotten 5.4 MiB of data. < 1273961643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the other wasn't here for very long iirc < 1273961655 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what is the lightspeed telegraphhh < 1273961675 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a system that sends a signal along a stretched, regular line of beehives at C. < 1273961690 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's very big and complex, but it works. < 1273961710 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: so what does "whatever" mean < 1273961715 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. < 1273961722 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's orthogonal, though. < 1273961728 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And I take it is impossible to have any c communication without a wire by definition. < 1273961735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273961736 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so why doesn't that pattern I suggested count as an agar? < 1273961740 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sort of. < 1273961742 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: I don't understand what you were trying to say. < 1273961746 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1273961763 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I take it that Eric Weisstein's Treature Trove of the Game of Life is not the most up-to-date infosource? < 1273961768 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't have the lightspeed telegraph. < 1273961781 0 :cahill!~cahill@cev75-2-82-66-208-76.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273961788 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can imagine a really long superstring would transmit through vacuum, but it'd destroy your transmitter and probably the receiver, too. < 1273961796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I'm not sure. < 1273961802 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: because the definition of an agar excludes it. < 1273961815 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't really a central reference source, though LifeWiki is OK. < 1273961817 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, oh? how is it defined then < 1273961846 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like "a pattern that tiles the plane and is not just a bunch of wicks or oscillators that don't interact". < 1273961867 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, it could be a static pattern, didn't Phantom_Hoover say that? < 1273961874 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273961882 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My definition doesn't exclude static patterns. < 1273961887 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh true < 1273961901 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, btw, wicks? < 1273961923 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, is the pattern allowed to extend itself, like a space-filler? < 1273961924 0 :cahill!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
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< 1273961925 0 :cahill!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :K-Lined < 1273961929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1D extendible patterns. < 1273961944 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quick kline there < 1273961951 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A wick is something that's periodic in one dimension only. < 1273961967 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273962001 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And practical diagonal transmission at C is still elusive. < 1273962015 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fastest so far is 2c/3. < 1273962037 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, how are the known ones impractical? < 1273962048 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Known whats < 1273962050 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's always the one-cell fuse. :P < 1273962050 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1273962068 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Known c diagonal transmitters. < 1273962096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can transmit stuff at c diagonally, but the wire is destroyed. < 1273962108 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: link to something about the lightspeed telegraph? < 1273962126 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love the Game of Life it's so rich < 1273962126 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, here's the lightspeed wire, which might be the same thing: http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Lightspeed_wire < 1273962136 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a theorem that it's infinitely rich. :P < 1273962152 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's not. < 1273962159 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but it's like < 1273962166 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are so many human-interesting-and-comprehendable interacting patterns < 1273962168 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from such simple rules < 1273962170 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they're so pretty < 1273962177 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jason Summers made it, and I think the LST is referenced in an article in the LW article. < 1273962200 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.yucs.org/~gnivasch/life/lightspeed/index.html < 1273962210 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The LST is ~2/3 down. < 1273962241 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273962261 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see it < 1273962264 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rather, i see tons of them < 1273962281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273962281 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see < 1273962298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Earlier you mentioned cardinal gliders? < 1273962309 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yeah cardinal as in befunge < 1273962316 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know what it is called < 1273962320 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in GOL < 1273962334 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it was spaceships < 1273962338 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going up or down or sideways? < 1273962339 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1273962340 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't remember the difference between them < 1273962345 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yes < 1273962346 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEST SIGNAL EVER: http://www.yucs.org/~gnivasch/life/lightspeed/tags.gif < 1273962346 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's orthogonal. < 1273962350 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, well, okay < 1273962354 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: WHY < 1273962361 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE IT'S AWESOME < 1273962363 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone made some sort of theory of physics for GoL? < 1273962365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, couldn't you have lightspeed-mostly wires btw? < 1273962367 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah, the bubbles are cool. < 1273962382 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lightspeed-mostly? < 1273962387 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, as in, non-lightspeed only for turning corners and at the endpoints < 1273962393 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: well, after studying it for a while, I've discovered that the entire Game of Life universe can be described by a few simple rules. < 1273962396 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but lightspeed for straight stretches < 1273962398 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273962400 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, see what I mean? < 1273962403 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why wasn't this on autojoin? < 1273962407 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1273962416 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: Sarcasm is sarcastic. < 1273962419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, should be reasonable enough I find < 1273962425 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it would be bloody complicated, I suppose. < 1273962432 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1273962453 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life signal circuitry in general is bloody complicated. < 1273962459 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: No shit. :P < 1273962460 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273962463 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I mean, something that builds on top of that. < 1273962468 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I quite prefer wireworld myself < 1273962470 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To describe what "movement" is, since the primitive notions have none. < 1273962474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything needs to be *exact*, or else it all blows up. < 1273962475 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :found it a very interesting CA < 1273962480 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Wireworld is nice. < 1273962482 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc. < 1273962492 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and not quite as sensitive < 1273962492 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this lifewiki is amazing < 1273962503 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, link? < 1273962521 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hu alise < 1273962523 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://google.com/search?q=lifewiki < 1273962529 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: This is why a relativistic CA is silly, because there's no inbuilt idea of speed or individual things. < 1273962531 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: hu. < 1273962534 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page < 1273962540 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Above cells, it's all abstraction. < 1273962566 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: Yes, but it lacks the variety of Life. < 1273962567 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has his computer tethered to his phone via USB, which is getting its Internet access from wifi
< 1273962578 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does what it was meant to do, and well, but that's it. < 1273962591 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273962614 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't have infinite growth, or replication, or spaceships. < 1273962653 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, seen that computer in wireworld? < 1273962658 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is quite awesome < 1273962662 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc it is included in golly < 1273962665 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Spartan_universal_computer-constructor < 1273962668 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at this. < 1273962669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jesus christ. < 1273962677 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Game of Life is just amazing. < 1273962691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a computer that controls a universal constructor. < 1273962700 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, not /quite/ universal, but a damn good constructor. < 1273962708 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Because the machine itself consists exclusively of still lifes with seven or fewer cells, a sufficient program tape would allow the machine to self-replicate forever." < 1273962718 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1273962728 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Holy Grail of Life. < 1273962745 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Self-replicators are weirdly elusive. < 1273962748 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have we yet invented Life computers that can store memory sanely? :) < 1273962764 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a Turing machine in Life. < 1273962765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1273962765 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wireworld has a universal computer < 1273962772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: does it construct? < 1273962774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a simple Turing Machine in Life. < 1273962778 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"simple" < 1273962781 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No. < 1273962784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does look "real", though. < 1273962795 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant does WireWorld's construct. I guessed not. < 1273962796 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WW doesn't have construction. < 1273962797 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wireworld has no constructors at all. :) < 1273962799 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Could you hook up the lightspeed telegraph to a memory store? < 1273962807 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273962809 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure it's not possible for a wireworld system to build < 1273962832 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just stick the output to a memory system. < 1273962849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And input? < 1273962855 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can it be a lightspeed memory-access device? < 1273962877 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's an idea. The space around your WireWorld circuit is Game of Life space. WireWorld-live cells act as live for Game of Life, but not vice versa. Once there are six live cells (of either type) surrounding a Game of Life cell, it becomes a dead WireWorld cell. < 1273962888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any interfacing would be at spaceship speeds. < 1273962896 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Darn. < 1273962902 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you cannot build a lightspeed memory? < 1273962926 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This also provides an obvious way of producing ROM, though ROM is probably less efficient than the memory you already have. :P < 1273962934 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Wireworld-live" as in has a wire, or has an electron part? < 1273962940 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: has an electron part. < 1273962953 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1273962967 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Well, not /quite/ universal, but a damn good constructor. <-- you mean garden of eden patterns? < 1273962978 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: Or make some metacells for WW. < 1273962984 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Universal constructors don't need to construct those! < 1273962990 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there garden of eden still lifes btw? < 1273962996 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, that can't happen < 1273963011 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be pretty awesome. :P < 1273963015 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, I'd assume n.. right. How about GoE-like still lives, where the only parent is the pattern itself? < 1273963015 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I mean, like garden of eden pattern, but can be directly reached from itself < 1273963018 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and nowhere else < 1273963029 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since obviously it must be reachable from itself to be a still life < 1273963045 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, yeah what I said, same second < 1273963058 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1273963066 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, so are there such? < 1273963071 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I said it first < 1273963079 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sure don't know of any. < 1273963088 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, reverse order here < 1273963090 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273963092 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was first locally < 1273963095 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*srhug* < 1273963099 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shrug* < 1273963101 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, we need a Verilog-to-GoL compiler. < 1273963103 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might possibly be even harder than a garden of eden pattern, since it would have to have only one parent _everywhere_, rather than having no parent _somewhere_, so to speak < 1273963104 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's check the logs! < 1273963106 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, VHDL* < 1273963110 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1273963112 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid MODE #esoteric :-o oerjan < 1273963120 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Verilog-or-VHDL-to-GoL compiler. < 1273963125 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep, I'm first < 1273963127 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, eh? < 1273963151 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Garden of Eden pattern only needs to be parentless in one physical location. < 1273963156 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That will make the entire thing parentless. < 1273963158 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: a garden of eden pattern can easily contain _parts_ that would have multiple possible parents if the rest of the pattern had < 1273963181 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it might be that that is essential to make it all work < 1273963189 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*had any < 1273963190 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273963193 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a Garden of Eden still life, however, it can't have two parents anywhere; it must be only-one-parent everywhere. < 1273963196 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wants a pattern that has no descendents!
< 1273963199 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, right < 1273963222 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION notices that pentadecathlon.net is active as of April.
< 1273963225 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, but as long as you can't get the whole eden still life? < 1273963235 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are patterns with no parents; therefore, by the pigeonhole principle, there are patterns with no children. :P < 1273963243 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have such parts it need to be unstable if any bit of it is removed < 1273963249 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION swats uorygl -----###
< 1273963251 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: back to the tournament! < 1273963252 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, no that doesn't follow < 1273963276 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, since we more than one pattern mapping to the same < 1273963286 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there you have it. < 1273963299 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two parents with only one child between them? Clearly, one of the parents is childless. < 1273963315 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1273963319 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but could there be patterns that are stable still lifes but can't be reached from any other configuration? < 1273963333 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :however on a finite space it _does_ follow that "there are patterns with no parents" <=> "there are patterns with more than one parent" < 1273963334 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, group sex or something ;P < 1273963339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: What did you mean by lightspeed memory? < 1273963346 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(from the pigeonhole principle) < 1273963348 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By that definition, all sex is group sex. :P < 1273963372 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, uorygl: http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/images/9/9d/Grin_preblock_evolution.png < 1273963379 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even that may not work for infinite space, in fact i think it doesn't < 1273963405 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.conwaylife.com/wiki/index.php?title=Main_Page < 1273963407 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1273963408 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh lifewiki times out here < 1273963410 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now < 1273963412 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops! Google Chrome could not connect to www.conwaylife.com < 1273963418 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so it wasn't just me < 1273963420 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, it died seconds ago < 1273963435 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously us. < 1273963440 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what? < 1273963449 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We must have overloaded it. < 1273963457 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I thought you meant US < 1273963464 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is being ironic
< 1273963486 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, what is the difference between a glider and a spaceship < 1273963506 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A glider is a specific spaceship, the first to be discovered. < 1273963510 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A glider is a specific spaceship; it's the five-cell one moving diagonally at c/4. < 1273963526 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A spaceship is any pattern that translates itself. < 1273963532 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hm < 1273963541 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's spaceship 5-1-4. :P < 1273963549 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do things like the Fast Forward thingy work? < 1273963566 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: by detecting the front end of a ship and, if it's there, applying the back end of a ship. < 1273963568 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1273963569 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah* < 1273963569 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It creates a LWSS regardless of whether it gets an input. < 1273963578 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe not. < 1273963580 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: clearly a still life without any parent but itself must cover nearly the whole space < 1273963590 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: No, that's it. < 1273963597 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because otherwise you could put a single, dying pixel somewhere < 1273963610 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, eh? < 1273963620 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, he has a point, there. < 1273963625 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273963635 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, so let's look for GoE-like still lives in worlds of a finite size < 1273963654 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, well I excluded non-interacting patterns here < 1273963659 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273963659 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is < 1273963665 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ones moving far away or such < 1273963679 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, better yet, let's do what AnMaster said < 1273963689 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm but < 1273963695 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe we should just consider unconstructible patterns in general. < 1273963697 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :any interacting pattern must destroy it < 1273963709 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Lag: 29.77] < 1273963713 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCKING FUCK FUCK < 1273963725 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WITH A HINT OF FUCK < 1273963733 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if a glider approaches it can't be allowed to self-repair < 1273963735 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: What are you connecting wiith. < 1273963739 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just kill the glider < 1273963740 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, ^ < 1273963748 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Freenode. < 1273963756 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, -_- < 1273963758 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, killing the glider won't work. < 1273963762 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, exactly < 1273963768 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, that is what I said -_- < 1273963780 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : like if a glider approaches it can't be allowed to self-repair or just kill the glider < 1273963781 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see? < 1273963793 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, OK. < 1273963861 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, but a glider passing a bit away (would it need 4 cells or such? not sure of exact distance) would be fine. As long as it didn't interact in any way with the pattern < 1273963868 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how large is the required margin for that? < 1273963890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 cells empty space, I think < 1273963905 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure it isn't 3? < 1273963905 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1273963910 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1273963913 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm right < 1273963940 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The AND NOT gate is universal, right? < 1273963954 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, you mean nand? < 1273963956 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then yes < 1273963963 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc so is nor < 1273963969 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean like p AND NOT q = p AND (NOT q) < 1273963970 0 :maedhros777!~michael@c-76-118-245-128.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273963972 0 :maedhros777!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1273963979 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think AND NOT is also uiversal. < 1273963990 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? didn't know that < 1273963998 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not != nand < 1273964009 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1273964011 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, English is vague < 1273964017 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1273964035 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"and not" could sound like "and followed by not" < 1273964040 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it was gates < 1273964044 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would make a nand < 1273964067 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all you make an AND gate from a nand and an inverter normally (in CMOS at least) < 1273964070 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, 1 & !a is !a, so 1 & !(a & !(1 & !b)) is NAND < 1273964078 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, thus it was var from obvious < 1273964144 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The great thing about WireWorld is that it's really easy to make a PRNG. :) < 1273964170 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1273964175 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 & !(a & !(1 & !b)) <=> 1(a(1b'))' <=> (a1b)' <=> (ab)' < 1273964178 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, yep < 1273964182 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange notation you used < 1273964199 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION stress-tests a certain AND NOT gate.
< 1273964202 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, oh? < 1273964218 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What notation are you using? < 1273964228 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: what oh? < 1273964270 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I may be mistaken about the PRNG thing. < 1273964297 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, ah < 1273964301 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the "oh" < 1273964307 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that PRNGs were easy < 1273964309 0 :Gracenotes!~person@wikipedia/Gracenotes JOIN :#esoteric < 1273964356 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, challenge: construct a reversible gate in wireworld < 1273964357 0 :Sgeo_2!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273964357 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is < 1273964365 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which actually works if you send signals either way < 1273964383 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, this one is kind of reversible. < 1273964401 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, so you can switch inputs with outputs? < 1273964404 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Call this gate o <= p AND (NOT q). < 1273964413 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also works as q <= p AND (NOT o). < 1273964419 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1273964443 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, and does it have as many 1 in as out? Other thing required for a reversible one iirc < 1273964444 0 :Sgeo_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders what's to blame for the lag
< 1273964457 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Essentially, it's a deleter: it looks at a wire and deletes a signal whenever it hears a signal coming in the third wire. < 1273964460 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well states with 1 in and out) < 1273964478 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obviously not for a given value, see inverter for example) < 1273964492 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, can't be reversible then can it? < 1273964510 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1273964510 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if data is lost < 1273964512 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1273964528 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The cross is a gate that works either way. The problem is, it can only be used to make OR gates, I think. < 1273964535 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1273964548 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't create a 2-in 1-out gate that is reversible. < 1273964553 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, I suspect that reversible gates need to be symetric, I'm not sure though < 1273964563 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in wireworld I mean < 1273964578 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with that I mean physically symmetric < 1273964579 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would that be the case? You can do lots of things in WW that don't affect anything. < 1273964581 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1273964592 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, well okay, "active elements" then < 1273964613 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure you could add a wire stump that just dies out < 1273964613 0 :Tritonio_GR!~Tritonio@84.38.7.214 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273964623 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely you can simulate a symmetric thing with an asymmetric thing. < 1273964635 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, well possibly < 1273964667 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have one side that has p NAND (not q), one that has (not p) OR q. Or however that goes. < 1273964674 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And modulo capitalization. :P < 1273964677 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, but doing one circuit for one way and another for the other way and then detecting from where the signal came is kind of cheating < 1273964696 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of. < 1273964720 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr, my bigger PRNG also stabilized. < 1273964724 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(detection needed to block feedback from output) < 1273964730 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, into a cycle? < 1273964759 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, don't all PRNGs cycle if you wait long enough? I'm not sure this is true. < 1273964784 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: P and (not Q) is only universal if you also have the constant 1, otherwise you cannot construct anything which is always 1 from it < 1273964814 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, all finite PRNGs cycle eventually. < 1273964817 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This PRNG cycled quickly. < 1273964821 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post's_lattice (if you dare) < 1273964842 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, yeah, nothing's universal if you have only one state available to you. :) < 1273964876 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: P nand Q is universal as a function of the states given, though < 1273964884 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(boolean function) < 1273964942 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1273964943 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1273964957 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in WireWorld, all NOT gates have to have clocks anyway. < 1273964989 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since only one pattern is static. < 1273965050 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, hm? < 1273965083 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In WireWorld, every pattern that does not consist entirely of dead wire and empty space turns into something else in the next generation. < 1273965093 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273965094 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1273965110 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, but why do you need a clock in an inverter in ww? < 1273965133 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has it been proven? < 1273965152 0 :Sgeo_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster, if no signal goes in, how do you make a signal come out? < 1273965155 0 :Sgeo_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless 0 isn't just no signal, but something else < 1273965162 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_2, ah depends on how you define 0 < 1273965163 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1273965168 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can have two-wire signaling < 1273965188 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like fizzie did in that logic circuit in that game < 1273965192 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot it's name < 1273965205 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :transport simulation... *not* simutrans < 1273965207 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other one < 1273965256 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1273965258 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :openttd < 1273965259 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was it < 1273965271 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl: in fact iirc (and trying to read that web page) P and (not Q) generates _precisely_ the class T_0^inf of those functions that have an argument such that the whole function cannot be 1 unless that argument is 1 < 1273965274 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, you wouldn't need a clock with complementary signals right? < 1273965285 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus this could be unclocked completely I think < 1273965290 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :allowing async stuff < 1273965297 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shall attempt to play with the TCP rate control algorithm
< 1273965305 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not exactly, you still need to generate a signal somewhere < 1273965310 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, good luck < 1273965315 0 :uorygl!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AnMaster: right. < 1273965352 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : RX bytes:7276136 (6.9 MiB) TX bytes:1575377 (1.5 MiB) < 1273965356 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uorygl, such a circuit would be more resilient against everything not matching up perfectly too < 1273965374 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as the wires did it wouldn't matter if you got a bit of delay with no signal on either < 1273965666 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1273965749 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-106-123-222.cust.wildblue.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273966179 0 :Sgeo_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We are happy to be able to continue to offer episodes of Stargate SG-1 through January 2011." < 1273966181 0 :Sgeo_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH HAPPY DAY! < 1273966288 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1273966431 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1273966442 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : alise: What did you mean by lightspeed memory? < 1273966448 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :memory that can be written and read to at lightspeed < 1273966454 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :through a communication path < 1273966458 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no matter what bit of memory is accessed < 1273966538 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :phantom meant http://pentadecathlon.com/ not .net btw < 1273966608 0 :impomatic!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.5.9/20100315083431] < 1273966738 0 :Oranjer!~HP_Admini@adsl-243-203-60.cae.bellsouth.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1273966974 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.radicaleye.com/DRH/pi.html < 1273966978 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Life really is the Physics Esolang. < 1273967031 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[As the number of ticks (t) increases, the population of the entire pattern approximates (pi-2)/720 t^2. At four million ticks, when the images below were captured, this works out to a value of pi correct to two places after the decimal point... so this is not quite the most efficient way to calculate pi.]] < 1273967038 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The POPULATION APPROXIMATES PI. Seriously. < 1273967077 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1273967084 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beautiful. < 1273967092 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1273967181 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.226.164 JOIN :#esoteric < 1273967194 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What did I miss? < 1273967331 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was this procession of colorful cats < 1273967425 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1273967539 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Theory: We live in a relativistic, quantum universe... emulated on a Game of Life pattern. < 1273967757 0 :Sgeo_2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no real way to prove or disprove that