< 1281052809 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's far more likely that his evil twin murdered him. < 1281052844 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes! And his evil twin, being evil, is Left-handed! < 1281052849 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It all makes sense now! < 1281052866 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course1 < 1281052921 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@nat-wireless-guest-reg-158-122.bu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281053074 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281053081 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281053119 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know Gregor-W < 1281053167 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo__, you're kidding, right? < 1281053187 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does -W mean? Windows? < 1281053187 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1281053196 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :W is for Work < 1281053198 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1281053204 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :P is for Phone < 1281053207 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@nat-wireless-guest-reg-158-122.bu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281053208 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION knew that < 1281053215 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The Phone, not the Work) < 1281053224 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :L is for Evil Twin Sunk the Ferry I Was On < 1281053228 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314 < 1281053238 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1281053238 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1281053238 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281053992 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1281054047 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281054077 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: New quit message. Entering 2006 in style. < 1281054311 0 :Flonk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.86 [Firefox 3.6.8/20100722155716] < 1281055376 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281055500 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :comex, what is Rock? < 1281055613 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281055933 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1281057090 0 :Gregor-L!~Gregor@75-151-73-57-Spokane.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281058816 0 :Gregor-P!~AndChat@174-145-52-99.pools.spcsdns.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281059002 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-L and [no suffix] are currently the same system, since my laptop is my primary machine right now. < 1281059019 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have ... a lot of ways to connect to IRC < 1281059211 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is now in the Futurama-watching room < 1281059330 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders allowing Pharo to accept Ruby syntax < 1281060011 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281060907 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281061684 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281061886 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last week's Futurama is now on, in case anyone missed it. If you missed it, WATCH IT! < 1281062045 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS CONCEPT OF LAST WEEK CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US < 1281062124 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{{ I'd respond with "SURELY YOU MEAN", but I didn't misspell "Last week", afaik }} < 1281062263 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a different futurama each week? < 1281062343 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes; Futurama is airing again. < 1281062691 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FOR US AMERICANS ANYWAY < 1281062711 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You Euros'll get it in a year or three I'm sure. < 1281062779 0 :Wamanuz!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281062957 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-P: Internet! Bits! Speed of electricity! < 1281063291 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ILLEGALS < 1281063306 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interweb anchor babies! < 1281064537 0 :iamcal!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281064607 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281064835 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281065072 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo__: ok, I'm watching it now < 1281065082 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's almost over < 1281065103 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the contrary, it's only just begun < 1281066106 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, torchwood is a pretty shoddy series < 1281066947 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281068309 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@64.231.53.8 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281068862 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281068872 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281071152 0 :Sgeo__!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281072770 0 :Gregor-L!~Gregor@75-151-73-57-Spokane.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281072859 0 :Gregor-L!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1281076218 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1281077187 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1281080624 0 :relet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1281081599 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1281081600 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1281083552 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1281083780 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Sgeo__ is now in the Futurama-watching room <-- does it have a small shrine? < 1281083793 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a big one, even < 1281085570 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1281086783 0 :tombom!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1281087111 0 :Flonk!~chatzilla@80-123-38-96.adsl.highway.telekom.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1281087121 0 :Flonk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good morning. < 1281087427 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-10-189.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281088378 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1281089473 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1281089494 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@nat-wireless-guest-reg-158-122.bu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281089514 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314 < 1281091465 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@92.233.174.117 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281091704 0 :AnMaster!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1281093878 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281093888 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281093932 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281094964 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281095004 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281095433 0 :lifthrasiir!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1281095438 0 :lifthrasiir!wkkecUq8@haje12.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1281099174 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281100036 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo! < 1281100049 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover! < 1281100095 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still doing whatever it was you were doing? < 1281100178 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You mean the project? < 1281100188 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. The Project. < 1281100204 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's live, but development is on hold while I wait for a testing environment < 1281100293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does it *do*? < 1281100302 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a game < 1281100322 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A futuristic remake of an older game [now defunct] that was in the same environment < 1281100551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What older game? < 1281100684 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're only allowed to use alise's haskell on pro-GNOME operating systems. < 1281100694 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wiki.activeworlds.com/index.php?title=Mutation < 1281100695 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1281100700 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BECAUSE OF THE GNOME-ADS < 1281100702 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8D < 1281100703 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, alise's Haskell? < 1281100707 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1281100712 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise's implementaiton. < 1281100717 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. In what? < 1281100728 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you sure dont get the joke < 1281100848 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gets the joke, but I assume "alise's" is just unnecessary < 1281100860 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1281100865 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely not < 1281100871 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :its definite necessary < 1281100882 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it'd be a pro-sex operating system < 1281100886 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of all the moan ads < 1281100895 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it's a play on "Monads", but I don't get where alise comes from. < 1281100910 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: alise has this thing < 1281100916 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jokes about "monad" and "nomad" < 1281101822 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281102654 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@75-151-73-57-Spokane.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281102726 0 :derdon!~quassel@p5B3E3A72.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281103376 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281103718 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281104022 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281104304 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Another nasty problem arises if you use a mutable object, i.e., an object < 1281104304 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can change its hash value over time, as an element of a Set or as a key to < 1281104304 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a Dictionary. Don’t do this unless you love debugging!" < 1281104314 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone should make an esolang where that's no big deal < 1281104639 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281106888 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1281107384 0 :relet!~thomas@c905DBF51.dhcp.bluecom.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1281108536 0 :cpressey!~CPressey@173-9-215-173-Illinois.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281109011 0 :tombom_!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1281109111 0 :tombom!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1281113207 0 :alise!~alise@91.104.239.35 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281113213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cellophane illegal < 1281113221 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quod? < 1281113253 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1281113306 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: et establishum < 1281113323 0 :Behold!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1281113347 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281113392 0 :Behold!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :BeholdMyGlory < 1281113444 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Malkompren' < 1281113461 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now, we're going to play a track from Cellophane Illegal's new album, "Et Establishum". It's called "Malkompren'"... enjoy. < 1281113470 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-1088894081.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1281113477 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1281113491 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: actually, those /are/ awesome band and album names ... < 1281113496 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are. < 1281113512 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know! < 1281113586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This track is 7:06 long, which is the same as SIX MINUTES AND SIXTY-SIX SECONDS. And if you play it backwards, it sounds like 'Malkompren'', a song by Cellophane Illegal, a band known to be Satanists -- one of their tracks is 6 minutes and 66 seconds long. Coincidence? You decide." < 1281113692 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Apparently, fast images in Super Hi-Vision may cause motion sickness. < 1281113704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This source is Gizmodo via NHK, so credibility is, uh, zero. < 1281113727 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd trust NHK, but not Gizmodo... < 1281113744 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, I suggest that this is bullshit. < 1281113744 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I said NHK because of the language barrier. < 1281113753 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1281113755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NHK via Gizmodo. < 1281113765 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., NHK said it, Gizmodo fucked with it until it sounded hyperbolic. < 1281113831 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just 4320p; *effectively* the same resolution as analog IMAX. < 1281113857 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of course, comparing digital and analog video when both are high-quality is fairly subjective) < 1281113866 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, Toy Story 3 is good. < 1281113881 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a Pixar film. < 1281113900 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Yes it is. < 1281113914 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was Touched by the Holy Hand of His Holiness Steve. < 1281114025 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :May I present Exhibit A? < 1281114042 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. < 1281114046 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Barbie: Authority should derive from the consent of the governed, not from threat of force! < 1281114062 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LMAO < 1281114072 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(No, Barbie is nothing like this in it for anything other than this one line.) < 1281114226 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281114268 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1281114347 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi alise < 1281114488 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Five-Minute "Threshold"] < 1281114489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Janeway: This event will stand with some of the most memorable in history. < 1281114489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Paris: Yeah. Wilbur Wright...Neil Armstrong...Zephram Cochrane ... < 1281114489 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Janeway: I was thinking "Spock's Brain"..."Shades of Gray"..."Let He Who is Without Sin..."... < 1281114936 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: :D < 1281115018 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the one flaw of my lovely laptop is that it is not powerful enough to decode 1080p. I think 720p slows it down a bit too. < 1281115086 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281115115 0 :Flonk_!~chatzilla@188-22-127-153.adsl.highway.telekom.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1281115251 0 :Flonk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1281115260 0 :Flonk_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Flonk < 1281115269 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@bas5-toronto47-2925351791.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1281115366 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION downloads "All Good Things..." from that uber-high-quality rip of TNG to review the quality. THESE KINDS OF THINGS ARE IMPORTANT! < 1281115396 0 :Gregor-P!~AndChat@174-145-52-99.pools.spcsdns.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281115408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello Gregor-Urine. < 1281115421 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION mature < 1281115429 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1281115478 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... wow < 1281115502 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: If it is absolutely super-awesome, then glee. < 1281115508 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : BECAUSE OF THE GNOME-ADS < 1281115519 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION whacks augur with the saucepan ===\__/ < 1281115594 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: It has a downside, though. Wesley, too, will be in high-definition. < 1281115624 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: As will beardless Riker. < 1281115626 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shudder* < 1281115649 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, but you can avoid him more than you can avoid Wesley. < 1281115671 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is ridiculous, how can two episodes be 1.6 GiB? < 1281115677 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why am I not downloading at a greater speed? >_> < 1281115698 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see how well mplayer can play partial files. < 1281115702 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best thing about moving back to CO: REAL. GOD. DAMNED. INTERNET. < 1281115709 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speed? < 1281115709 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And mplayer can play partial files very well. < 1281115720 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is America, so let me guess: 3 Kb/s, on a good day? < 1281115737 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's sitting at about 40 megabits/sec. < 1281115746 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Oh, the uploader merged "All Good Things..."'s two parts. < 1281115755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I was downloading Preemptive Strike, too. < 1281115761 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in CO, god is real, but the internet is damned < 1281115767 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know. < 1281115771 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tests < 1281115777 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Whfuck you. < 1281115784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) Fuck you all I have is 8 Mb < 1281115789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) I'm moving in see you soon brb plane < 1281115829 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a ... takeWhileFold? < 1281115835 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g., "take while sum < 3" < 1281115857 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhileFold (+) (< 3) lst < 1281115925 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um what's tested the sum or the list values < 1281115936 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm < 1281115950 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and what's returned, for that matter < 1281116000 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh with 0 in there too < 1281116021 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously there is no single such predefined functino < 1281116026 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically we see if "fold[rl] (+) 0 [] < 3" fits, else sub "take 1 lst" for [] < 1281116034 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :else sub "take 2 lst" < 1281116035 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1281116035 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1281116072 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: can you give an actual _example_, your explanation is not clear < 1281116107 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1281116115 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhile tries [], take 1 lst, take 2 lst, take 3 lst, ..., lst < 1281116124 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION swats alise -----### < 1281116126 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until "condition (take N lst)" satisfies < 1281116130 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_no_ explanation. < 1281116134 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then returns that list < 1281116138 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want an example with actual _output_ < 1281116143 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: okay < 1281116174 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhileFoldl (+) 0 (< 10) [1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10] < 1281116178 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yields [1,2,3,4] < 1281116182 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1281116184 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because foldl (+) 0 [1,2,3,4] == 10 < 1281116224 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um don't you mean [1,2,3] < 1281116242 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 is not < 10, after all < 1281116251 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, right < 1281116311 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, what's the thing for "all but last element" again? < 1281116323 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :init < 1281116343 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that doesn't actually help here < 1281116355 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is quite a subtle function, it involves sending information back across recursions < 1281116368 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to make that function actually _lazy_, then it's probably best to write it directly... < 1281116408 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1281116451 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmmmmemoize < 1281116460 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what do I need to get RandomGen? < 1281116465 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't it use to be in prelude? < 1281116476 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :System.Random < 1281116484 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1281116689 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@92.233.174.117 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281116739 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhileFoldl op acc p (x:xs) | p acc = x : takeWhileFoldl op (acc `op` x) p xs; takeWhileFoldl _ _ _ _ = [] < 1281116744 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: btw, did you know that seq, much like the CAKE, is a LIE???!? < 1281116755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: In that it doesn't do deep sequencing? < 1281116758 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait no < 1281116770 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I obtained this: < 1281116772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhileFoldl :: (a -> b -> a) -> a -> (a -> Bool) -> [b] -> [b] < 1281116772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhileFoldl f _ _ [] = [] < 1281116773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :takeWhileFoldl f z c (x:xs) < 1281116773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | c (f z x) = x : takeWhileFoldl f (f z x) c xs < 1281116773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | otherwise = [] < 1281116810 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i forgot to use acc `op` x in the test < 1281116846 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first and last lines can still be combined like i did < 1281116923 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :grr, how do you show a Rational as a decimal again? < 1281116926 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: seq is a lie in two ways: (1) in the absence of either of its arguments being "undefined", it's semantically a NOP. (2) even in practice, a Haskell implementation could evaluate its arguments in a different order, e.g. if it thought it that reduction ordering was more efficient < 1281116950 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan filled me in on this LIE yesterday :) < 1281116958 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also giving f z x a name may help < 1281116962 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) of course < 1281116965 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) of course < 1281117076 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: fromRational to get a Double? >:) < 1281117116 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed ... < 1281117129 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> fmap fromRational (approxE 10000) < 1281117130 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1.723 < 1281117131 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not e. < 1281117265 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, it seems to be approximating e-1. < 1281117266 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, not. < 1281117279 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell exp (-1) < 1281117281 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.36787944117144233 < 1281117300 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I think I have to disagree with, or at least modify, the characterization of monads yesterday. They do *in practice* force an evaluation order, even if they do it *by* imposing an order on data flow. Maybe it's not true for some weird or trivial monads out there -- but those would be the exceptions. < 1281117319 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: no, actually < 1281117320 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot of useful monads are lazy < 1281117321 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, you know lists are monads, right? < 1281117322 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :list, for example < 1281117325 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lazy state < 1281117331 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no, lists aren't monads < 1281117332 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] is a monad < 1281117358 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, then I still don't understand them. No surprise. < 1281117361 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't >>= defined for lists? < 1281117400 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: monads force an order of _effects_. even in IO, evaluation of pure values is not always forced. < 1281117431 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: >>= is defined for [] a. < 1281117435 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell do x <- return undefined; print "No evaluation of x here" < 1281117435 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But if it *is* forced, it's going to happen in the order that the monad establishes. Right? < 1281117442 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: maybe you'd have more luck reading the theoretical definition < 1281117446 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"No evaluation of x here" < 1281117448 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: NO THANK YOU < 1281117453 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tried that < 1281117473 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, the theoretical definition says nothing about evaluation order. < 1281117536 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it doesn't say anything about evaluation < 1281117542 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Pfft. Philistine! < 1281117543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# < 1281117549 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/#/just delete the damn line/ < 1281117549 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Only specific monads say anything at all about evaluation. < 1281117551 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, hence it says nothing about evaluation order. < 1281117593 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It says nothing about turnips either. < 1281117602 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, exactly < 1281117602 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell do x <- return undefined; putStr "No evaluation of x here; "; putStr (show x); putStr " we never get to here though" < 1281117610 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No evaluation of x here; *** Exception: Prelude.undefined < 1281117617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But cpressey is not talking about turnip monads. < 1281117630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell [] >>= undefined < 1281117639 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] < 1281117649 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find that very odd... < 1281117679 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell concatMap undefined [] < 1281117680 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[] < 1281117684 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, makes sense now. < 1281117692 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, [] >>= _ = [] < 1281117697 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := _ = < 1281117701 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: the undefined function never gets any arguments passed, so never needs to be evaluated < 1281117706 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not happy about appearing there. < 1281117716 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(rather than, y'know, [] >>= x = x `seq` [] -- or some such) < 1281117740 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, got that, but I didn't know that undefined :: (b -> m a) worked. < 1281117747 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can ALSA function if PulseAudio is running? < 1281117751 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t undefined < 1281117756 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, yeah; undefined :: a < 1281117757 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell :t undefined < 1281117757 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., if I remove the bypass it has to PulseAudio, what will happen if I play audio to ALSA? < 1281117758 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :undefined :: a < 1281117769 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, didn't realise that applied to functions as well. Do now. < 1281117777 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Functions possess types. < 1281117780 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I don't understand is the use case for writing a monad which does not establish an order. What does a "lazy state" monad do, except save you from an explicit additional argument to your function? In that, using a monad is a lot like writing pointfree code (a practice with which I do not often agree.) < 1281117784 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence, a includes functions. < 1281117818 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: It saves you from an explicit additional argument to your set of functions. < 1281117828 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is the entire point of the State monad. < 1281117840 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Riker: Hey baby, what's your sign? < 1281117843 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Troi: You've known me for twelve years. Will, I know you care about me, but... well.... < 1281117843 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Riker: Well what? < 1281117843 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Troi: It's your beard. It just isn't sufficient anymore. < 1281117843 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Riker: WHAT? < 1281117843 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Worf: In case you can't tell, Commander, I'm grinning. But it's hard to see that through my thick, thick beard. < 1281117852 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Some code utilising lazy State would be hideously ugly without it. < 1281117943 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Not really a compelling argument. How much of that is the 'do' sugar? < 1281117970 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Not much at all. < 1281117986 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you're just calling other functions that use that state and don't mutate it yourself, it helps a lot because you can completely elide it. < 1281117990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: The do sugar is really, really thin. < 1281118002 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When you're mutating state inamongst other calls, it isolates this change, rather than making you e.g. pass state' instead of state around everywhere. < 1281118087 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About the only thing that's even vaguely "thick" is that pattern matches get a "_ -> fail" case added... < 1281118087 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Can ALSA function if PulseAudio is running? < 1281118088 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : i.e., if I remove the bypass it has to PulseAudio, what will happen if I play audio to ALSA? < 1281118090 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: When not using monads, when you calling some other function that doesn't use that state, you just don't include that explicit argument. < 1281118091 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone know? < 1281118101 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Whoa, they do? I didn't realise. < 1281118105 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yeah. < 1281118115 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: That DO use state, I said. < 1281118134 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Now answer my ALSA question :P < 1281118135 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, misread. < 1281118143 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: If you have mixing enabled in ALSA, *yes*. < 1281118152 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(either hardware mixing or dmix) < 1281118161 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is it enabled by default if I have PulseAudio in a typical crapbuntu setup? < 1281118173 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Ubuntu should have dmix by default, yes. < 1281118181 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if it's a PulseAudio stack? < 1281118185 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1281118196 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I think ALSA now just makes dmix on by default... < 1281118208 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, two new questions: < 1281118217 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(1) How do I disable ALSA's redirection? I've forgotten what file it's in. < 1281118229 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) What's the best/quickest/etc. ao/vo for mplayer? < 1281118237 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-ao sdl seems pretty good, but what about -vo? < 1281118252 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using built-in Intel sound and video cards. < 1281118255 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno, -ao alsa or -ao oss or -ao sdl, and -vo gl or -vo xv < 1281118283 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SDL must necessarily be worse than ALSA/OSS, yeah, because it outputs there? < 1281118308 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder with vo is default. < 1281118310 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*which vo < 1281118326 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably something like -vo x11 < 1281118332 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or -vo xv or -vo gl < 1281118347 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goeth to shower < 1281118383 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISTR -vo gl being slow. < 1281118412 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"-vo xv" is good if it works. < 1281118418 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hardware colorspace conversions and so on. < 1281118423 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And scaling.) < 1281118441 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But for just straight playback? And could it possibly "work" without actually... working? < 1281118446 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, emulating it somehow. < 1281118448 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, I'm tired. < 1281118481 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... guess it could, but I think usually if Xv is supported, it's supported mostly on hardware. < 1281118495 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it works; *should* it work, on this built-in Intel card? < 1281118506 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, sure. At least most likely. < 1281118538 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On NVIDIA cards, there's the (old) xvmc and (new) vdpau stuff to move even the video stream decoding, and IDCT, and other such stuff, on hardware; but I have no idea how (and if) that's supported on Intel graphics and Linux. < 1281118563 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not. < 1281118581 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :These GPUs are... not the most powerful. < 1281118662 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay; how do I make ALSA reload its config? < 1281118684 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I guess "xvinfo" will tell you mostly what the hardware supports, if you're curious. < 1281118703 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I was under the impression that all libalsa-using processes read the .asoundrc fluff on startup, and that's about it. < 1281118743 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf. < 1281118746 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More a server configuration file. < 1281118930 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can someone please tell me exactly ONE reason not to remove PulseAudio and just use ALSA+dmix? < 1281118968 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some idiot feels that adding a layer of abstraction for no benefit is a good idea. < 1281118984 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1281119006 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just shocked that so many people clamour to bundle this technology which does ABSOLUTELY NOTHING FOR YOU, AT ALL into their distributions. < 1281119010 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does PA actually /do/? < 1281119013 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even X11 does more. < 1281119027 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Takes audio in. Mixes it together. Sends it off to ALSA or some other device, which can already mix audio. < 1281119046 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, it can also do EQ and stuff on the audio. Which, you know, is totally unnecessary as everything that you'd want to EQ can already do EQ. < 1281119050 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apart from that? < 1281119056 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Takes up RAM and disk. < 1281119063 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Umm... that's it. < 1281119112 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, the role of PulseAudio in a typical Ubuntu user's life is akin to that of Ubuntu One's: annoying and pointless. < 1281119147 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As such, I will hereby remove both. < 1281119172 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu is heavy < 1281119182 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good word. < 1281119253 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can also do things like networked audio, but your regular user won't have much use for that. < 1281119275 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Projects for an Insane Man And/Or Woman Who Inexplicably Wishes to Make Linux Slightly Better: (1) Develop an X11-compatible, accelerated graphics server that doesn't suck. (2) Develop an independent libX11 implementation exclusively for (1) that sucks... well, less. (Optionally libxcb, too, although nothing uses that.) (3) Develop a sound system that doesn't suck. Uh, you could just use OSSv4. < 1281119277 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a convenient interface for per-process volume controlling. < 1281119295 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: That's nice. If only it didn't make everything else suck. < 1281119313 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such as latency (really really really sucks for some hardware), not-having-a-bloated-piece-of-shit-running-ness, ... < 1281119315 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, is there anything you don't think sucks? < 1281119325 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is getting *really* tiresome. < 1281119326 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It mixes my audio without causing sound quality problems like ALSA did by default (and I couldn't find a way to fix). < 1281119327 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. It's just not very interesting to talk about. < 1281119343 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, neither are things you think sucks. < 1281119347 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/sucks/suck/ < 1281119349 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You don't say things when I talk about things I like. Presumably because they don't annoy you, so you don't think to say anything. < 1281119371 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe I speak of things that suck probably less than you think. < 1281119412 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Nor do you complain to other people who complain things suck, e.g. pikhq and cpressey, although their complaints usually happen after I make one.) < 1281119435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I find /your/ complaints, about my complaints, annoying too. < 1281119510 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I find your complaints about my complaints about your complaints annoying. < 1281119525 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delightful. < 1281119574 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, better. I have complaints about your complaints about my complaints about your complaints. < 1281119602 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now why do I lack asoundconf(1) ... < 1281119662 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By default, asoundconf's configuration file is ~/.asoundrc.asoundconf < 1281119663 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and must be included in ~/.asoundrc. Open this file to make sure it is! < 1281119663 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1281119775 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# Specify default video driver (see -vo help for a list). < 1281119776 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# vo=xv,x11 < 1281119778 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright then. < 1281119851 0 :tombom_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281119920 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: There was something I was going to say to you. I've been /wii'ing you a couple of times to see if you happened to be around. < 1281119956 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is wiiing an effective way of seeing whether Deewiant is around? < 1281119958 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm usually around, I just haven't said much on freenode recently < 1281119962 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does he appear in the wii? :| < 1281120051 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281120072 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a program it does not work with Windows named pipes, but it works with UNIX named pipes if it is compiled with Cygwin. < 1281120097 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, very good. < 1281120129 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I don't know how to develop an X11-compatible, accelerated graphics server that doesn't suck. < 1281120150 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, this is alise-suck, which is a nebulous concept. < 1281120203 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Phantom_Hoover has some sort of automatic system whereby he automatically likes everything I dislike and automatically ignores anybody concurring with me. < 1281120236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'm not saying it doesn't suck, only that I'm not entirely sure how you define suckiness. < 1281120248 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alright then. < 1281120256 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It shouldn't suck by not sucking. < 1281120280 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: That doesn't help, because I still don't know how to develop accelerated graphics server, anyways. < 1281120295 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gah, anyone know how to get the old ALSA mixer in the Ubuntu panel? < 1281120303 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The new-fangled one only does Pulse. < 1281120307 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, you had "Work" and then "Going home" (or some-such) as away messages. < 1281120319 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: On the other hand, I have no longer any clue what it was I was going to say. < 1281120344 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It helps to just say it and wait, perhaps hours, for an answer < 1281120444 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALSA Gnome panel applet in Ubuntu 9.10 Karmic < 1281120445 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1281120450 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i386 < 1281120451 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nay < 1281120502 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa. I used the Pulse volume control and my GTK reverted to Raleigh. < 1281120504 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that work? < 1281120512 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, because I removed the applet. Uh. < 1281120514 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does that work? < 1281120527 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaand now it's back apart from X-Chat. < 1281120643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does "aptitude download" apply patches? < 1281120653 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, never mind. < 1281120829 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Is there some straightforward way to ask C for an integer type that's the same size as a machine pointer for the architecture? (would be nice for what i'm doing, but i can also live without it) < 1281120868 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :intptr_t < 1281120870 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C99 < 1281120887 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's at least as big as a pointer < 1281120896 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#include < 1281120900 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@nat-wireless-guest-reg-158-122.bu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281120904 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uintptr_t is unsigned < 1281120925 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey what's the kosher way to build a debian package given its debian-patched source directory? < 1281120999 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Use sizeof() to check these things? < 1281121026 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, sizeof(void*)==sizeof(int)?1:-5 < 1281121029 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that was my backup plan. < 1281121050 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's that intptr_t, yes, though I think it's optionallish. Of course everyone with sensible pointers (and a big enough integer type) does provide it, since it's so easy. < 1281121062 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if C89, might have to resort to that. < 1281121067 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :struct _check_sizes { int z[sizeof(void*)==sizeof(int)?1:-5]; }; < 1281121100 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compile-time asserts like that are always so awesome. < 1281121129 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :will that actually be evaluated at compile time? < 1281121142 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Yes it will be evaluated at compile tile < 1281121146 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/tile/time/ < 1281121203 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1281121210 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: I'd just use intptr_t. < 1281121213 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything supports it. More or less. < 1281121225 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0% [1 libart-2.0-dev 9506/75.8kB 12%] < 1281121236 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was going at some three thousand bytes per second. < 1281121237 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Peculiar. < 1281121262 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tile-based compilation < 1281121371 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Okay, my video is lagging. Or my audio. Severely. alsa/xv. mplayer. What. Why. < 1281121380 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably go with defaulting to intptr_t, but making it configurable in the code gen. < 1281121385 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not an uber-high-quality file, either. < 1281121412 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And asserting that it can hold an int and a ptr in the generated source < 1281121445 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: What are you making now? < 1281121445 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Movie-Aspect is 1.30:1 - prescaling to correct movie aspect. --mplayer < 1281121447 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1281121497 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: O - this is for Eightebed. A "safe" language without GC. because Gregor said it couldn't be done :) < 1281121515 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm oversimplifying of course) < 1281121519 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION yawns. < 1281121533 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION heckles. < 1281121540 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1281121567 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The following packages are BROKEN: < 1281121570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ubuntu-desktop < 1281121570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The following NEW packages will be installed: < 1281121570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : libsdl1.2debian-alsa < 1281121570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The following packages will be REMOVED: < 1281121570 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio{a} < 1281121571 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BROKEN! < 1281121573 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am violating the Holy Creed. < 1281121580 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Die, Pulseau < 1281121586 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Die, PulseAudio! Die! < 1281121616 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it's a strong dependency, not a recommendation? < 1281121619 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :99.99%, yet it refuses to believe the torrent is completed. < 1281121622 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :45 seconds at ... heh, this is fun. < 1281121624 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes < 1281121627 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: all of ubuntu-desktop is < 1281121633 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ubuntu-desktop does nothing, of course < 1281121636 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :used to be, but I thought they changed it < 1281121643 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except install more useless crap ubuntu adds each upgrade < 1281121708 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Write a different distribution if you don't like it...... (I don't particularly like Ubuntu either) < 1281121961 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yeah, uh, not that easy. < 1281121966 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's easier to complain. < 1281121972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Could that rescaling be slowing down mplayer? < 1281122001 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it is easier to complain probably, but one day if I get new computer, I like to write Linux distribution, too (I must have told you that before?). < 1281122080 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, a few times. < 1281122262 0 :calamari!~jeffryj@32.97.110.61 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281122272 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1281122277 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What this world needs is more distributions with near-0 userbases. < 1281122284 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also HI < 1281122339 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nullix, the POSIX compatible OS with _no_ users. also, no copies. < 1281122519 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20061122013747/memoryalpha/en/images/0/0c/KIRK_IS_A_JERK.jpg < 1281122560 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I write Linux distribution because I want to do so, in order to make it improvment in the way that is in my opinion. And then maybe some other people can use or maybe not < 1281122669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :debian/rules:18: /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/patchsys-quilt.mk: No such file or directory < 1281122669 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/share/gnome-pkg-tools/1/rules/gnome-get-source.mk:31: warning: overriding commands for target `get-orig-source' < 1281122670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/share/gnome-pkg-tools/1/rules/gnome-get-source.mk:31: warning: ignoring old commands for target `get-orig-source' < 1281122670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make: *** No rule to make target `/usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/patchsys-quilt.mk'. Stop. < 1281122670 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dpkg-buildpackage: error: fakeroot debian/rules clean gave error exit status 2 < 1281122672 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What ... < 1281122675 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, can't remember whether I asked.. did you root your phone? < 1281122686 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1281122698 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, got debian working without a chroot, it was very easy, dunno what my problem was before < 1281122713 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err dpkg/apt < 1281122721 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Schweet < 1281122743 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put that shtuff on the Market! 8-D < 1281122746 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Window manager shall include taskbar with clock, tiling and floating windows, background can be solid color or background picture (the background picture must be non-animated and the same size as the screen, because stretch is not available), and not much else other than many keyboard functions and mouse chording to manipulate windows and signals. (The taskbar needs only the list of windows open and the time, nothing else) < 1281122752 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that should make it easier for me to finish the egobf package, since I don't have to deal with bionic now < 1281122767 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, not going to pay $25 for that, sorry! < 1281122783 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which phone do you have? < 1281122784 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you have multiple screens, you can change the taskbar color and background color on each one < 1281122811 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: How about I pay, host the archive, and get all the credit? :P < 1281122819 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: How about I pay, host the archive, and get all the credit? :P < 1281122822 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Errr < 1281122823 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go for it < 1281122830 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: Samsung Moment < 1281122840 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm < 1281122848 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool that's what a friend of mine just got too < 1281122849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why can't calamari just publish an .ipkg? Or whatever they are. < 1281122850 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.ipk. < 1281122854 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apk < 1281122866 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Certainly he can. < 1281122872 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could < 1281122902 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Putting it on the Market is just a convenience. < 1281122917 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol.. a package that is a glorified shell script < 1281122942 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, what's in your $PATH? < 1281122975 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: A distinct inability to paste into IRC ;) < 1281122977 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have been running cyanogenmod so long I have lost touch with the real world < 1281122989 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, AndChat ftw < 1281123008 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AndChat ftf < 1281123028 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay i gotta try this out < 1281123037 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could swear I pasted in it before < 1281123084 0 :calamari-!~kidsquid@32.97.110.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281123135 0 :iamcal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1281123231 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash-4.1# echo $PATH < 1281123250 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrmm very strange < 1281123257 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh.. right.. slashes in irc are bad < 1281123286 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...... /usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/system/sbin:/system/bin:/system/xbin:/system/xbin < 1281123308 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari, /say or just /. < 1281123328 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1281123339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/see? < 1281123345 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"//foo" sends "/foo". < 1281123350 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"/say /foo" sends "/foo". < 1281123351 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, thanks < 1281123351 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/foo < 1281123379 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-P: I'm selectively installing old versions of some Debian (well, Ubuntu) packages, then installing a patched version of an old package that depends on them. < 1281123382 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This includes important GNOME libraries. < 1281123386 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Am I insane, or doubly insane? < 1281123394 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently not in andchat < 1281123396 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the final outcome of this insanity is ... a sound mixer. < 1281123409 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari, /say? < 1281123436 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say isn't a valid command for me < 1281123446 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"//" might still work, though. Unless you tried that too. < 1281123457 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's okay.. the leading dot worked < 1281123463 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :leading spaces didn't < 1281123471 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Neither, I've done that before, usually works. < 1281123486 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, anyhow.. do you have /datalocal/bin in your PATH? < 1281123493 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor-P: I'm pretty sure this is /downgrading some parts of GNOME to a lower release of GNOME/, though. < 1281123493 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/data/local/bin < 1281123495 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actual *libraries*. < 1281123497 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I'm insane. < 1281123541 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: No. < 1281123543 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, pidgin sounds work now. < 1281123554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is not a good thing. :P < 1281123559 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must be cyanogenmod then < 1281123612 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's okay.. is /data mounted rw? < 1281123670 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ /foo works on some clients too. < 1281123691 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But, again, probably not in that one.) < 1281123756 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe is a monad, isn't it? < 1281123801 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep... < 1281123902 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very simple monad, too. < 1281123913 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only one simpler is Identity. < 1281123918 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Maybe without Nothing) < 1281123940 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is that actually /for/? < 1281123948 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe? < 1281123967 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Simple failure handling. < 1281123976 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, Identity. < 1281123984 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course I know what Maybe is for. < 1281123993 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Mostly* demonstrating a simple monad. < 1281124027 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It could also hypothetically be the bottom part of a transformer stack if for some reason you wanted a monad as the bottom that doesn't have a non-transformer version. < 1281124053 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We must tell cpressey... < 1281124077 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine monad transformers break his brain. < 1281124090 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : / < 1281124095 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : / < 1281124096 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what they are either... < 1281124112 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm space does work, not sure why it didn't before < 1281124115 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: Yes, and you need to highlight me to get my attention :P < 1281124118 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a type constructor which takes a monad and results in a monad. < 1281124145 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, well, that makes sense. < 1281124149 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, ContT is a monad transformer. ContT IO is a monad. < 1281124149 0 :calamari-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1281124193 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And StateT Cont is a time-travel monad. < 1281124212 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: these are not exactly simple examples, except for demonstrating how one gets a monad out of monad transformers. :P) < 1281124214 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In what sense? < 1281124238 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay ... new volume control has unbelievably ugly icon. < 1281124285 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: With StateT Cont, the state in the StateT is *part* of the continuation. So, every time you use a continuation, you end up using the state in that continuation. < 1281124304 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In effect, you are jumping forward and backwards in the computation when you use a continuation in StateT Cont. < 1281124417 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, it's StateT s (Cont y), but that's just because, y'know, monads actually have values "in" them. :P) < 1281124807 0 :Gregor-P!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281125048 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know the unending horror that is GNOME? < 1281125167 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@j-108.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1281125288 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, as in, understand? < 1281125299 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, just ... be able to tell me how to replace a panel's icons. < 1281125313 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find the file it uses and change it? < 1281125322 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. The first bit is the bit I require assistance with. < 1281125372 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/share/pixmaps or /usr/share/icons might be a place to start. < 1281125381 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know /that/ much. < 1281125390 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./ubuntu-mono-light/status/22/audio-volume-muted-panel.svg < 1281125391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./ubuntu-mono-light/status/22/audio-volume-muted-blocking-panel.svg < 1281125391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./ubuntu-mono-light/status/22/audio-volume-low-panel.svg < 1281125391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./ubuntu-mono-light/status/22/audio-volume-medium-panel.svg < 1281125391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./ubuntu-mono-light/status/22/audio-volume-high-panel.svg < 1281125391 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :./ubuntu-mono-light/status/22/audio-volume-low-zero-panel.svg < 1281125393 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc < 1281125395 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are the ones I need to replace. < 1281125398 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just need to find what I need to replcae the,. < 1281125434 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, wait. < 1281125436 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those are correct. < 1281125808 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad.State; import Control.Monad.Cont; newtype Wrap x y = Wrap (x (Wrap x y) -> y); main = print . flip runCont id . flip evalStateT 0 $ do (l, Wrap cont) <- callCC (\cont -> return ([], Wrap cont)); s <- get; put (s+1); if length l < 10 then cont (s:l, Wrap cont) else return l -- now if this works on first try... < 1281125818 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2,1,0] < 1281125821 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1281125855 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except - those _shouldn't_ have been changing values D: < 1281125976 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1281126027 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad.State; import Control.Monad.Cont; newtype Wrap x y = Wrap (x (Wrap x y) -> y); main = print . flip runCont id . flip evalStateT 0 $ do (l, Wrap cont) <- lift callCC (\cont -> return ([], Wrap cont)); s <- get; put (s+1); if length l < 10 then cont (s:l, Wrap cont) else return l < 1281126078 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1281126120 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you seen a chess puzzle game where you have to mate in infinity plus fifteen? < 1281126148 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad.State; import Control.Monad.Cont; newtype Wrap x y = Wrap (x (Wrap x y) -> y); main = print . flip runCont id . flip evalStateT 0 $ do (l, Wrap cont) <- lift $ callCC (\cont -> return ([], Wrap cont)); s <- get; put (s+1); if length l < 10 then lift $ cont (s:l, Wrap cont) else return l < 1281126150 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0] < 1281126153 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah! < 1281126185 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT THE FUCKKK < 1281126224 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: apparently the callCC method for StateT Cont is defined in such a way that it preserves the state too. if i use an explicit lifted callCC from the underlying Cont monad instead, _then_ the state time-travels. < 1281126254 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: StateT stores the state /outside/ the other monad, doesn't it? < 1281126263 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like StateT Parser doesn't backtrack the state < 1281126267 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why Parsec needs its own state < 1281126278 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you should fix my computer < 1281126289 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: how is it broken? < 1281126323 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: inexplicably, no matter how many times I replace icons, my (installed from older version of gnome) mixer applet doesn't acknowledge these new icons < 1281126332 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: um i didn't think Parsec _needed_ its own user state, it was just convenient to include it with the rest it has to track... < 1281126332 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I cannot figure out why; perhaps it is requesting specifically .png, not .svg, but I doubt that < 1281126359 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: the obvious conclusion is that Ubuntu has caught the recent icon vulnerability from Windows < 1281126371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, where are you replacing the icons? < 1281126378 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and _no_ state transformer can do anything "outside" the transformed monad < 1281126380 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: /usr/share/icons; I've tried Humanity, Humanity-Dark, ubuntu-mono-dark < 1281126381 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :none work < 1281126386 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, what vulnerability? < 1281126396 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1281126411 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281126420 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: there was a hugely exploited vulnerability that was a bug in icon processing < 1281126428 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it was exploited indirectly via .pif and .lnk files < 1281126434 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why would Ubuntu have it? < 1281126436 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Microsoft issued an out-of-band patch on Monday < 1281126439 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it wouldn't, I was joking < 1281126471 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Still the timetravel monad. :) < 1281126491 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do these things tend to happen to Windows? < 1281126521 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no monad transformer < 1281126530 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows is badly designed < 1281126649 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I've heard that constantly, but why? < 1281126718 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance (MonadCont m) => MonadCont (StateT s m) where callCC f = StateT $ \s -> callCC $ \c -> runStateT (f (\a -> StateT $ \s' -> c (a, s'))) s < 1281126778 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I don't know. Maybe because they are bad programmers and not opensource < 1281126813 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows is horribly designed, and they don't update their BSD libraries that often. < 1281126822 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it explicitly includes the StateT state in what's passed to the "underlying" continuation from the lower monad < 1281126853 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Soley to reduce the confusion caused by time travel, I'm sure. < 1281126858 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1281126921 0 :Gregor-P!~AndChat@174-145-52-99.pools.spcsdns.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281127029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you give the -vo driver options? < 1281127077 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-vo driver:options:seperated:by:colons < 1281127113 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, -vo drivers,seperated,by,commas,listed,in,order,of,preference < 1281127151 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, libcaca plays the video at full speed just fine. < 1281127153 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a solution. < 1281127160 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just get used to watching videos with libcaca. < 1281127187 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281127201 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Movie-Aspect is 1.30:1 - prescaling to correct movie aspect. < 1281127206 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm *sure* that's what's slowing it down! < 1281127218 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can I disable scaling? < 1281127255 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, -noaspect. < 1281127259 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nope, still lagged. < 1281127269 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Okay, what? < 1281127276 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY does Linux suck at AV so much? < 1281127302 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries VLC in case mplayer is being stupid. < 1281127307 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: What's the full mplayer command line? < 1281127335 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Anything! -ao sdl, -ao alsa, -vo xv, -vo sdl, -vo xv:somethingaboutcolorkeysorsomethingthatchangednothing < 1281127350 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1281127354 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try -vo x11 < 1281127365 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am sceptical that that will be quicker, but I will try. < 1281127367 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If that works, your video card officially Sucks Ass. < 1281127375 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intel video doesn't suck that much. < 1281127388 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It handles Compiz and all that jazz just fine, better than any other card on Linux due to its "open-sourceness". < 1281127406 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ mplayer -ao sdl -vo x11 "7.25 All Good Things….mkv" < 1281127407 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grumble... < 1281127412 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Wait, you're running Compiz? < 1281127418 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: -vo x11 is even worse. < 1281127422 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiz hates video. < 1281127424 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Won't the compositing /help/? < 1281127427 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hateshateshates. < 1281127441 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it were implemented well, perhaps. Compiz hateshateshates video. < 1281127451 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I switched to Compiz without compositing. < 1281127467 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either my perception of mouths is broken, or it still doesn't help. < 1281127471 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll enable Metacity compositing? < 1281127475 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to bypass the WM somehow? < 1281127489 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Without compositing it shouldn't matter at all. < 1281127500 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except that Metacity will be drawing shit itself? < 1281127516 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Under X, how video is finally drawn depends largely on the X window manager in use. With properly installed drivers, and GPU hardware such as supported Intel, ATI, and nVidia chip sets, some window managers, called compositing window managers allow windows to be separately processed and then rendered (or composited). This involves all windows being rendered to separate output buffers in memory first, and later combined to form a complete graphical interfac < 1281127516 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e. While in (video) memory, individual windows can be transformed separately, and accelerated video may be added at this stage using a texture filter, before the window is composited and drawn. XVideo can also be used to accelerate video playback during the drawing of windows using an OpenGL Framebuffer Object or pbuffer. < 1281127517 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Metacity, an X window manager uses compositing in this way. The compositing can also make use of 3D pipelines accelerations such as GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap. Among other things, this process allows many video outputs to share the same screen without interfering with each other. Other compositing window managers such as Compiz also use compositing. < 1281127554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I suggest that THIS SHIT SUCKS and what drivers might work well without X11? < 1281127560 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will fbdev be fast enough? < 1281127646 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Gah; can I have a test file to test A/V sync? < 1281127656 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like one that starts playing audio as soon as the screen turns from black to white? < 1281127661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know of one? < 1281127720 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Apparently you need compositing for Xv to work properly? < 1281127777 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ξ Windows would so fix this. < 1281127925 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Other compositing window managers such as Compiz also use compositing" thanks guys < 1281127926 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why the xi? < 1281127928 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: ... No, don't really need compositing for that. < 1281127936 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION rhymes < 1281127945 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's "compositing", but it's absurdly naive 2D compositing. < 1281127950 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Okay. Now make it work. :| < 1281127953 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a decade and a half old. < 1281127958 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I gotta name it /some/ Greek letter! < 1281127964 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fbdev is actually very fast. < 1281127968 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: My CPU is 1.33 GHz but it can _definitely_ decode this video. < 1281127972 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yeah, but fbdev is still desynch'ed. < 1281127974 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect audio is the problem. < 1281127978 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As Linux audio SUCKS. < 1281127992 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could just install OSSv4 but that sucks to do on Ubuntu. < 1281127993 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Desync'd? That's definitely the audio layer's fault. < 1281128006 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mplayer is ridiculously good at AV sync. < 1281128009 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are you discussing compositing WMs? < 1281128019 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And HOW ARE YOU HAVING TROUBLE WITH THIS < 1281128030 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My God, man. I have never had problems with mplayer on Gentoo. < 1281128040 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just works on fucking *Gentoo*! < 1281128053 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, I only /just/ lobotomised Ubuntu by removing PulseAudio. < 1281128062 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It came out with a higher IQ, but god knows how ALSA is configured. < 1281128063 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my current only problems with audio are that sometimes after logging on it doesn't work < 1281128067 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it does if I log out and back in again < 1281128088 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course, Gentoo's handling of things like audio involves using the default settings for ALSA. < 1281128096 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which just works) < 1281128110 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apart from being ALSA. < 1281128122 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have never had problems with it. < 1281128129 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, apart from the API sucking. < 1281128133 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, how about I just install OSSv4 and meditate. < 1281128143 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Worth a shot. < 1281128144 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Low latency, high quality, high sanity. < 1281128152 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The /last/ time I did this I Broke Everything and installed Arch. < 1281128172 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notes http://insanecoding.blogspot.com/2009/05/perfect-sound-with-oss-version-4.html < 1281128226 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if OSSv4 supports my card. < 1281128243 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intel High Definition Audio (Azalia) *BETA* < 1281128246 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that is reassuring. < 1281128365 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALISE < 1281128370 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there actually any contexts in which one would use monady things on lists? < 1281128380 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am fairly sure i have today met the mother of my children < 1281128406 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: yes < 1281128418 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What like? < 1281128437 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: stuff < 1281128444 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Helpful. < 1281128460 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's ... uh, it's like prolog without cut and stuff < 1281128486 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has forgotten what cut does < 1281128516 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: list monads feel more like multithreading than backtracking < 1281128557 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do a <- [1,2,3]; b <- [4,5,6]; guard (a+b > 6) < 1281128573 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, that doesn't quite work < 1281128576 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do a <- [1,2,3]; b <- [4,5,6]; guard (a+b > 6); return (a,b) < 1281128651 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞΞ < 1281128672 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does guard do? < 1281128685 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably monad-fails if the condition is false < 1281128735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1281128854 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad; main = print $ filterM (const [False,True]) ['a'..'e'] < 1281128857 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :["","e","d","de","c","ce","cd","cde","b","be","bd","bde","bc","bce","bcd","bcde","a","ae","ad","ade","ac","ace","acd","acde","ab","abe","abd","abde","abc","abce","abcd","abcde"] < 1281128898 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does filterM do? < 1281128925 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it filters a list, in a monad ;D < 1281128935 0 :tombom_!tombom@wikipedia/Tombomp JOIN :#esoteric < 1281129039 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad; main = print $ filterM (\x -> [x <= 5, x >= 3]) [0..7] < 1281129057 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1281129077 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell "Boo!" < 1281129092 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5],[0,1,2,3,4,5,7],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6],[0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7],[0,1,2, < 1281129101 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: looks like it worked, just was slow < 1281129116 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :did EgoBot just DCC you a wall of text? < 1281129133 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_maybe_. iirc there's sometimes a bug that makes the output only happen on the _next_ command. < 1281129136 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no. < 1281129226 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... < 1281129245 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION misjudged the length of that list < 1281129245 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Greek Audio: You ask for a certain number of Hzes and bits. You send raw audio data over the channel. The end. < 1281129271 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad; main = print $ filterM (\x -> [x <= 3, x >= 3]) [0..4] < 1281129274 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[0,1,2,3],[0,1,2,3,4],[0,1,2,3],[0,1,2,3,4],[0,1,3],[0,1,3,4],[0,1,3],[0,1,3,4],[0,2,3],[0,2,3,4],[0,2,3],[0,2,3,4],[0,3],[0,3,4],[0,3],[0,3,4],[1,2,3],[1,2,3,4],[1,2,3],[1,2,3,4],[1,3],[1,3,4],[1,3],[1,3,4],[2,3],[2,3,4],[2,3],[2,3,4],[3],[3,4],[3],[3,4]] < 1281129405 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION isn't sure he understands that one himself < 1281129755 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There had been a lot of very bad feeling around here about the way Tasha Yar was sent off. So we were determined to give Wesley a send-off that had real value and something that stayed with us. We finally decided that he would go to the Academy, which I think was Gene's idea [and] the most reasonable and easiest idea, which also keeps him alive for future episodes." < 1281129762 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, everyone would have preferred you killed Wesley horribly. < 1281129792 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281129863 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1281129867 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yar was ok < 1281130028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any notable sci-fi that has large space ships be portrayed as political countries, rather than by analogy with sea-based vessels? < 1281130040 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've actually not seen it, unless i'm misremembering - which i tend to do when this tired < 1281130108 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad; import Control.Monad.State; isubs l = flip evalStateT (head l) . filterM (\x -> do prev <- get; if prev > x then return False else join $ lift [return False, do put x; return True]) l; main = print $ isubs [1,3,4,2,3,5] < 1281130109 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ships would have to be pretty large mind < 1281130225 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1281130237 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!haskell import Control.Monad; import Control.Monad.State; isubs l = flip evalStateT (head l) $ filterM (\x -> do prev <- get; if prev > x then return False else join $ lift [return False, do put x; return True]) l; main = print $ isubs [1,3,4,2,3,5] < 1281130240 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[],[5],[3],[3,5],[2],[2,5],[2,3],[2,3,5],[4],[4,5],[3],[3,5],[3,3],[3,3,5],[3,4],[3,4,5],[1],[1,5],[1,3],[1,3,5],[1,2],[1,2,5],[1,2,3],[1,2,3,5],[1,4],[1,4,5],[1,3],[1,3,5],[1,3,3],[1,3,3,5],[1,3,4],[1,3,4,5]] < 1281130255 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl29-2-0-cust326.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1281130598 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Probably only sci-fi with sleeper ships. < 1281130632 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When travel to port is going to take livable amounts of time, analogy with sea-based vessels kinda makes sense. < 1281130677 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, the Culture, to a degree. < 1281130692 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inasmuch as the Culture has individual political units. < 1281130719 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah; something a little less abstract would be cool. < 1281130742 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, generation ships would probably be like countries. < 1281130764 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, the thing I have filed for Would Be a Good Sci-Fi Show About a Generation Space Ship has it like that. < 1281130773 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If only I could write. < 1281130775 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Ah, yes. Sleeper or generation ships are going to inherently be like countries. < 1281130793 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, sleeper ships are more like *going to be* countries, but still. < 1281130809 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to remember if the Algebraist had anything similar. < 1281130813 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, what about long-mission ships that can still travel large distances, but with a large number of crewmembers? I guess without a defined, "short-term" mission they don't exist. < 1281130839 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I don't see how sleeper ships would be like that. < 1281130844 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They barely have any people. < 1281130849 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Conscious, that is.) < 1281130861 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: The unconscious crews shall found a colony or some such. < 1281130872 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either that or they'll be back in 100 years, making it more naval. < 1281130886 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, in hard SF generation ships would probably rarely interact. < 1281130895 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And? < 1281130901 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, "like" 100 years. Long time-span, but the point being that it's returning and the country may well exist in the end) < 1281130908 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Politics exist even in a vacuum. Uh, or something. < 1281130919 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The unconscious crews won't do anything until they're off the ship. < 1281130925 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmm, yeah. True. < 1281130928 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At which point nothing they do changes how the ship is politically structured. < 1281130929 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, why would it be portrayed as a country? < 1281130954 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Because when you have thousands and thousands of personnel on board, you're going to have an awful lot of opinions, and probably quite a bit of crime. < 1281130966 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially so on e.g. a generation starship, when people aren't specially selected -- not after the first generation, anyway. < 1281130973 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*where people aren't < 1281130986 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another thought: why do so many sci-fi settings seem to try and have all the various settled planets under a single legal framework, regardless of speed of transit between them? < 1281130988 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That means that anything with generation ships counts, then. < 1281130994 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking at *you*, Enderverse. < 1281131002 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: normally as a result of conflict < 1281131028 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Asimov's Foundation series, for instance, everywhere starts under a single political system and legal framework < 1281131029 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQp5l4-sfFA < 1281131030 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!!! < 1281131033 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it all falls apart as the series goes on < 1281131034 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone watch < 1281131047 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(gah, slow-ass ships being the only means of transit, but a central government? I don't even know how that works *with* the ansible, much less without.) < 1281131063 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, settlement is an extremely complex business, so it would make sense that only one organisation would be able to do it in any significant amount. < 1281131077 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't make sense that everyone would stay bound to that org forever < 1281131080 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Assuming superluminal movement.) < 1281131080 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless it was /really/ scary < 1281131088 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I suppose. < 1281131091 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: And how do you maintain political bonds when it's subliminal movement? < 1281131108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, you don't. Does the Enderverse do that? < 1281131111 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: are you assuming liminal communication as well as subliminal movement? < 1281131115 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. < 1281131121 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shudders < 1281131145 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, superluminal movement does get invented several centuries in. < 1281131167 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Also, it has instantaneous communication. < 1281131169 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Notably, Orson Scott Card isn't a very good writer. < 1281131184 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tau Zero was fairly good about the whole "governance in a closed environment" thing. < 1281131187 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(...also a homophobe) < 1281131195 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OTOH there were only around 50 people on the Leonora. < 1281131200 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: I *like* his writing when it's not got anything to do with his religion. < 1281131215 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It gets vomit-inducing when his religion is at all involved. < 1281131287 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has never read any of OSC's stuff < 1281131293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1281131304 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, did you read the Culture series? < 1281131309 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. But I will. < 1281131314 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still need to figure out the chronology :^) < 1281131318 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had it written down, somewhere! < 1281131339 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I've read Inversions and LTW in the meantime. < 1281131341 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: He's a decent sci-fi author, but also a literal, honest-to-god fascist. < 1281131359 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Mormon fascist. < 1281131375 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, LTW is definitely after Excession, and contains spoilers, but I don't think that affects thing. < 1281131384 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/thing/things/ < 1281131416 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's The State of the Art that matters most to me. The main story in it was published /before/ another novel, separately, though I forget which. < 1281131487 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, TSOTA is before UOW, so read them consecutively. < 1281131533 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1989; TSOTA was published 1989. < 1281131553 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Player of Games comes after Consider Phlebas? < 1281131558 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1281131589 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a long-running dispute over which you should read first. I read CP first, and it didn't do me any harm. < 1281131600 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, we talked about that. < 1281131615 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I want absolute chronological order; equivalently, avoiding spoilers. < 1281131629 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can make the commitment to read past Consider Phlebas beforehand, so it can't possibly turn me off the series. < 1281131661 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are about 2 explicit spoilers I've ever encountered, excepting the outcome of the Idiran War, which hardly counts. < 1281131661 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which are the ones in TSOTA that are set in the culture? < 1281131666 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Gift from the Culture, Descendant? < 1281131674 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And TSOTA. < 1281131679 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1281131687 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# "A Gift from the Culture" - originally published in Interzone #20, Summer 1987 with illustrations by SMS. < 1281131687 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# "Descendant" - originally published in the anthology Tales from the Forbidden Planet, Roz Kaveney (ed.) 1987, Titan Books, ISBN 1-85286-004-9. < 1281131693 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awesome, 1987, a chronological hint. < 1281131704 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So those two should be read before The State of the Art. < 1281131711 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AGFTC is impossible to place within the internal chronology, BtW. < 1281131748 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Descendant after Gift, because Descendant was published October, while Gift was "Summer". < 1281131758 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should find Interzone #20's publication date. < 1281131772 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yeah, but publication order is a secondary measure. < 1281131783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider Phlebas < 1281131783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Player of Games < 1281131783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Gift from the Culture < 1281131783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Descendant < 1281131783 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The State of the Art [novella] < 1281131784 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use of Weapons < 1281131785 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, I'm pretty sure Descendant is chronologically before Gift. < 1281131785 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Excession < 1281131787 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inversions < 1281131789 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look to Windward < 1281131791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Matter < 1281131793 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this about right? < 1281131795 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Oh? < 1281131797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you said it was impossible. < 1281131802 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, well, probably. < 1281131815 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How can you tell? I don't mind minor spoilers; they're only short stories. < 1281131826 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They probably aren't around the same time, because then Gift would have mentioned the Idiran War. < 1281131835 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gift could be before, I suppose... < 1281131849 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, Gift can go whereever. < 1281131906 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, what's your personal hunch? < 1281131911 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gift is before Idiran War? After? < 1281131916 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be a start. (I am anal about this stuff.) < 1281131938 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably after, since everything else is. < 1281131959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much after, then, if you consider its not mentioning the Idiran War a hint? < 1281131971 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As an aside -- is Descendant set before The Player of Games, then? < 1281131979 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1281131999 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, assuming it's set during the Idiran War, which seems pretty reasonable. < 1281132020 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I'll be reading a short story before my first "proper" (non-Phlebas) novel. How quaint. < 1281132028 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider Phlebas < 1281132029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Descendant < 1281132029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Player of Games < 1281132029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The State of the Art [novella] < 1281132029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use of Weapons < 1281132029 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Excession < 1281132031 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Inversions < 1281132033 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look to Windward < 1281132035 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Matter < 1281132037 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Insert Gift somewhere, anywhere. < 1281132039 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But only in the right place!) < 1281132061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go by publication date if you really need to make a meaningful decision. < 1281132077 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read the entirety of TSOTA after CP and UOW. < 1281132090 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I couldn't find POG for ages. < 1281132119 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does TPOG mention the War much? < 1281132122 0 :MizardX!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1281132138 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really. < 1281132142 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You seem to imply that Gift unusually for something near the War doesn't, so perhaps I can figure it out by measuring how "fresh" the War is in the books. < 1281132144 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn. < 1281132149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well. < 1281132155 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It mentions the outcome, but that's pretty obvious. < 1281132169 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Now for the ultimate anality: < 1281132180 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which publications are best! < 1281132183 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And CP doesn't even deal with the end of the war outside the appendix. < 1281132278 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Large preference for hardback. Antipreference for large hardback. < 1281132282 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that you'll know. At all. < 1281132365 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@92.233.174.117 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281132379 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise, what are you even planning to use to get them? < 1281132435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ... internet? < 1281132473 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I only have paperbacks of the weird abstract cover variety. < 1281132574 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Actually, things that operate *on* monads are a lot easier for me to comprehend than monads *themselves*. < 1281132585 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It, Robot: 1" is so badly-written. :( < 1281132593 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it wasn't for the rest of the Ed stories, it would be unforgivable. < 1281132603 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, do you understand Maybe? < 1281132605 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281132611 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1281132642 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Hah. < 1281132661 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: Okay, you might gain comprehension using Identity or Maybe. < 1281132683 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Identity: (Identity x) >>= f = f x; return x = Identity x < 1281132714 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe: Nothing >>= _ = Nothing < 1281132724 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Just x) >>= f = f x < 1281132737 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :return x = Just x < 1281132740 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hey, do you know what TeX value I need to tweak to tell it not to create widows or orphans or whatever this one is (paragraphs with their last line on their own page)? < 1281132846 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Underfull \vbox (badness 10000) has occurred while \output is active [3] < 1281132847 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. < 1281132871 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I don't. < 1281132887 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn. < 1281132901 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, do you know of any simple script I can tweak that will just match "..." dammit and replace them with ``...''? < 1281132909 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, I could write one myself, but I forget the rules to determine start/end. < 1281132910 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, does that help? < 1281132995 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you gotta do the cooking by the book! < 1281133024 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non sequitur culinaris < 1281133039 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: No, but I'd love one. < 1281133077 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I mean, it's basically word-boundary (start of line or space)" -> ``, non-word-boundary -> ''. < 1281133087 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But this is a bitch to do via a regexp. Here, I volunteer you go and write one, and I'll. < 1281133107 0 :jcp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1281133158 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You're creepin' me out. < 1281133169 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1281133193 0 :jcp!~jw@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281133203 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf alise < 1281133220 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello [^:word:] < 1281133227 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello [^\W] ?? < 1281133236 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even [^\w] ?? < 1281133266 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(^| )"=\1``|"='' < 1281133271 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :go Cyclexa < 1281133316 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: it's not massively hard via /two/ regexps, incidentally < 1281133331 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Perhaps not, but Perl et al seem to have a fucked up definition of word boundaries that make it always break. < 1281133333 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :use one to replace " with `` where necessary, the other to replace the remaining " with '' < 1281133340 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be glad to see your regexp. < 1281133372 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Since, in most Smalltalk environments, the execution stack is a first-class citizen, coroutines can be implemented without additional library or VM support. < 1281133373 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1281133385 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/(?:^| )\K"/``/g; s/"/''/g; < 1281133388 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there you go < 1281133390 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks Wikipedia, for telling me it can be done, but not giving me the slightest clue how < 1281133422 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does that work with #!perl -p, I wonder? < 1281133439 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it does. I think. < 1281133490 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So "s/(?:^| )\K-\K(?:$| )/--/g;" for a - on its own, or what? < 1281133503 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\K twice makes no sense < 1281133515 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it means "don't substitute anything before this point in a s/// expression" < 1281133525 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1281133553 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/(^| )-( |$)/$1--$2/g; < 1281133554 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then < 1281133577 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281133601 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1281133637 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You seem overly concerned about whether I "understand monads" or not. < 1281133649 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, it's part of the Plan. < 1281133664 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're more susceptible to the Device if you understand monad. < 1281133671 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ad/ads/ < 1281133943 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notes that there's another Culture book coming out in October. < 1281134051 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gotta read more of those < 1281134054 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i liked the ones i did read < 1281134061 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281134062 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134062 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         |\ < 1281134063 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also: the names of the ships :D < 1281134072 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi, indeed. < 1281134088 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which ones, then? < 1281134127 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't remember :) < 1281134132 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever ones were at the used book store < 1281134191 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :consider phlebas, i think < 1281134193 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and another one < 1281134195 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi, any ship names you can remember? < 1281134211 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe i have inversions but i haven't read it yet < 1281134224 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, honestly i don't remember all that much about either of them < 1281134231 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a shitty memory that way < 1281134263 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could list them when i get home if you are particularly interested or something :P < 1281134300 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_o_ < 1281134300 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134300 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         |\ < 1281134311 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o\ /o/ \o\ < 1281134311 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : |   |   ¦ < 1281134311 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/<  /'\ ´¸¨ < 1281134314 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1281134316 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i forgot about that < 1281134357 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/o/ < 1281134388 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/o/o/ < 1281134395 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's odd, it should have detected one of those at least i'd think < 1281134403 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe flood protection or something < 1281134413 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/o/ < 1281134416 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1281134417 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is sure he recalled some bug involving something like that < 1281134427 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o\\ < 1281134427 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134427 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         >\ < 1281134435 0 :AnMaster!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1281134438 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm maybe < 1281134438 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may be some regex failure on my part < 1281134446 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o\\o\ < 1281134446 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : |  | < 1281134446 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/| /< < 1281134449 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o// < 1281134449 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134449 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        /´\ < 1281134450 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think so though < 1281134452 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281134452 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134452 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        /| < 1281134457 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/o < 1281134458 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the regex for that one is pretty simple < 1281134468 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1281134472 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_o_o_o_ < 1281134473 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/a < 1281134479 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : _o_o_o_ < 1281134479 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1281134481 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know what it is < 1281134494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It ignores if there's a non /\_ character after the arm. < 1281134496 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i modified the regex to help avoid things like urls with _o_ in them < 1281134497 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                          | < 1281134497 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                         /< < 1281134508 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1281134510 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it has a \w check now < 1281134517 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then that may have been after the bug < 1281134530 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably, it was a pretty recent change < 1281134533 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU RUINED THE BUG < 1281134536 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1281134557 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there, i took the \w check out < 1281134561 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/o/ < 1281134561 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ¦ < 1281134561 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :´¸¨ < 1281134568 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_o_o_o_ < 1281134568 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : |  | < 1281134568 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : >\/| < 1281134572 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of guys stepping on landmines these days < 1281134575 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha that's awesome < 1281134592 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually not a bug though: `\(o_O)/' < 1281134594 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thar's the bug < 1281134595 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1281134597 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually not a bug though: `\(o_o)/' < 1281134602 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :failure, maybe it is a bug < 1281134618 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_o < 1281134624 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_o_o < 1281134624 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : | < 1281134624 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/< < 1281134635 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am so confused right now < 1281134640 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dance of the mutants < 1281134654 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and honestly, i do not want to debug this: /((?]|([.·oº])_Â?(?!\2)[.·oº]|ಠ‿ರೃ)/gS < 1281134654 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                                                                                                                           ¯|¯⌠ < 1281134654 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                                                                                                                                                           /| | < 1281134668 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rewrite it for that matter < 1281134674 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281134674 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1281134674 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /< < 1281134689 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_o_o o_o_o o_o_o < 1281134692 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1281134695 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1281134695 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1281134696 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  >\ < 1281134707 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the o_o thing is for the funky faces < 1281134708 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/o/o/o/o/o/o/ < 1281134708 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         |   |   |   | < 1281134708 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         |\  |\ /´\ /| < 1281134718 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(._º) < 1281134719 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1281134719 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  |\ < 1281134733 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could swear it should pick up (o_o) < 1281134735 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it doesn't < 1281134740 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(O_o) < 1281134760 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(._o) < 1281134760 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1281134760 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  >\ < 1281134765 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :must be a failure of the first regex < 1281134768 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(o) < 1281134775 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if they differ somehow < 1281134776 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_o_ < 1281134776 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  | < 1281134776 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  >\ < 1281134781 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/o/o/o/o/o/o/ < 1281134781 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         |   |   |   | < 1281134781 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        /'\ /`\ /|   |\ < 1281134786 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281134787 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134787 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         >\ < 1281134787 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281134787 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281134787 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :        /< < 1281134791 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what's the perl to slurp all of stdin? < 1281134796 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1281134797 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "stdin + arguments", that thing < 1281134797 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do < 1281134803 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can't be the same character < 1281134808 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1281134809 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: undef $/; < 1281134810 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: just all of stdin in one string < 1281134815 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :means that Perl won't consider anything a line separator < 1281134816 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nononono, the way that doesn't hurt babies < 1281134828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{local $/; $stdin=<>;} < 1281134831 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bug should be fixed < 1281134833 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_o_o_ < 1281134841 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, as long as you let no babies between the braces, you should be fine < 1281134858 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}dots{}' < 1281134858 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A monad is a pair of higher-order functions which encapsulate the pattern of passing extra parameters between the functions to which they are applied. < 1281134858 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1281134861 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE. < 1281134862 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i used something like $_ = join <>, '' somewhere < 1281134869 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/.../\ldots{}/g; < 1281134870 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoops. < 1281134874 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want it more readable, ... join it like that. < 1281134874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that removes all newlines < 1281134879 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!show slashes < 1281134879 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perl (sending via DCC) < 1281134885 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$_ = join <>, $/; < 1281134891 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would add whatever the newline char at the time was < 1281134898 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and as a bonus, $/ is shorter than "\n") < 1281134903 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!show slashes < 1281134903 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perl (sending via DCC) < 1281134909 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$_ = join '', <>; it was < 1281134921 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yo, ais523, your regexp is crampin' my style < 1281134923 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew I'd eventually understand it. < 1281134927 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/

/\n\n/g; < 1281134927 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/<\/p>//g; < 1281134928 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that most definitely doesn't remove the newlines < 1281134930 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!show pi < 1281134931 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This makes it replace all quotes with `` < 1281134931 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sh read p; if [ "x$p" = "x" ]; then p=5; fi; echo "scale=$p; a(1)*4;" | BC_LINE_LENGTH=490 bc -l | tr -d '\\' < 1281134934 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I put it before your regexp, man < 1281134946 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's up wit dat, duude. < 1281134959 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: well, obviously < 1281134959 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, does $/ break ^ in regexp? :D < 1281134962 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ matches the start of a line < 1281134967 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously why? < 1281134968 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1281134971 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the start of a string < 1281134977 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :add the /m flag at the end of the regex < 1281134979 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it'll match newlines < 1281134983 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and things like "abc" at the start of

-lines that become "-starting-lines, the " gets replaced with `` < 1281135007 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, it works now. < 1281135105 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone know any nice typewriter-y fonts? Not necessarily monospaced, just the kind of thing that /looks/ typewritery/terminaly. < 1281135105 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course, feel free to tell me I'm still wrong. < 1281135113 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To set the monospaced portion of http://qntm.org/dropout. < 1281135151 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Something actually typewriter-like? Might I recommend Courier New? < 1281135163 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: you're right pretty much < 1281135177 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's monospaced, though; I don't particularly require monospcaed. < 1281135179 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*monospaced < 1281135189 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, it's like passing the parameters by reference more than by value < 1281135196 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides ... Courier is nicer than Courier New. < 1281135197 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: Yeah, but it's actually typewriter-imitation. < 1281135204 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, Courier. < 1281135224 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay; now tell me of a nice pdfTeX version. :P < 1281135267 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Additionally... Is there a nice LaTeX command to set those little "break in text" flourishes used to mark mini-sections (often three stars like ***)? < 1281135273 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alise: \usepackage{courier} < 1281135273 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically with the space before and after. < 1281135275 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Eeer umm... kinda but also no. < 1281135289 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: also a good description < 1281135346 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and Courier's apparently not merely typewriter-imitation. < 1281135358 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the actual typeface that was used in most typewriters from the 50s on. < 1281135386 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there were multiples, IIRC < 1281135390 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Courier, Elite, Orator < 1281135394 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think Courier was the most common < 1281135411 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, Courier was the most common due to being free to use. < 1281135496 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay; now how do I use courier with the verbatim environment? < 1281135512 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or does it automatically do that? < 1281135522 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The font that is actually provided is URW Nimbus Mono (A Courier clone)." Oh, great... < 1281135547 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Urgh. < 1281135582 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm. Terminal-y font? Maybe fixedsys? < 1281135608 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, Courier is great for this. < 1281135620 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any command in LaTeX for... "vskip one blank line"? Like, including line height and such? < 1281135631 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmkay. Guess it'll just be a pain getting Courier installed right, then. < 1281135668 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, I'll just use the imitation for now. < 1281135684 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not /awful/ or anything; it's not like monospaced fonts are paragons of typographic excellence, anyway. < 1281135688 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This extra space, especially when co-occurring at a page break, may contain an asterisk, three asterisks, a special stylistic dingbat, or a special symbol known as an asterism." < 1281135723 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love me some asterisms < 1281135726 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*asterisms. < 1281135726 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asterism_(typography) contains actual latex code < 1281135733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\newcommand{\asterism}{\smash{% < 1281135733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \raisebox{-.5ex}{% < 1281135733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \setlength{\tabcolsep}{-.5pt}% < 1281135733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \begin{tabular}{@{}cc@{}}% < 1281135733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \multicolumn2c*\\[-2ex]*&*% < 1281135733 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \end{tabular}}}} < 1281135735 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1281135744 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I still need that skip-one-line thing. < 1281135770 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems that that \asterism won't center properly. < 1281135787 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\vspace{...some length...}, i presume < 1281135800 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\vskip works < 1281135806 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'd like it to figure out the length for me < 1281135855 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is presumably some length designation for that particular length < 1281135894 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1281135905 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what you mean. < 1281135924 0 :Starmage!~Guest820@200.144.24.176 JOIN :#esoteric < 1281135937 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Starmage < 1281135939 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :latex has many length designations, like em for the width of an m < 1281135943 0 :Starmage!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellow < 1281135999 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.tug.org/pipermail/xetex/2010-January/015564.html is relevant to the centering < 1281136062 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.tug.org/pipermail/xetex/2010-January/015565.html says to delete the \smash < 1281136091 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\centerline works < 1281136094 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1281136114 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know about em, that's a standard typographical unit. < 1281136123 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not believe there is one for "vertical space of one line, including spacing"... < 1281136259 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Communication Fail :( < 1281136336 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks of a name for the break, since \break is taken < 1281136388 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.public.asu.edu/~rjansen/latexdoc/ltx-86.html < 1281136427 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\baselineskip < 1281136429 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\baselineskip + \parskip or something like it < 1281136430 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1281136473 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, i'm not so sure < 1281136476 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just line spacing + par spacing < 1281136479 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the actual length of the line < 1281136482 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think \textheight would do that < 1281136511 0 :Starmage!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1281136528 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh, and those /set/, silly < 1281136534 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1281136612 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1281136691 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, I'm terribly confused < 1281136724 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1281136894 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got it working, thanks :P < 1281136903 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1281136939 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/O/ < 1281137002 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Sam Hughes could do with a typography lesson. < 1281137010 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least, Ed stories-era Sam Hughes could. < 1281137022 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe Fine Structure actually has proper quotes and e[nm] dashes. < 1281137138 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1281137149 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"...which would cause the universe as we know it to cease to exist, with potentially devastating consequences." --Ed < 1281137173 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :potentially. < 1281137231 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1281137251 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders why Be Here Now lists the total number of chapters in its chapter titles < 1281137252 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1281137256 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Well, Ed is that kind of guy. < 1281137270 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who's Ed? < 1281137435 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://qntm.org/ed < 1281137444 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, you could wait for my super-duper nicely-typesetted one. < 1281137451 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION notes that one of Gaiman's short stories has been made into an obscene number of films < 1281137463 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which? < 1281137474 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We Can Get Them For You Wholesale. < 1281137490 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Searching for it on Youtube is ridiculous. < 1281137496 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@nat-wireless-guest-reg-158-122.bu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1281137553 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that story is awesome < 1281137561 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't know there was a film for it < 1281137569 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or (m)any of his others < 1281137569 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281137575 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did see the bbc(?) neverwhere production < 1281137590 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi, there are a mad number of student films of that one. < 1281137590 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that one novel.. hell, i can't think of the name of it at the moment < 1281137594 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanna say star something or other < 1281137601 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stardust? < 1281137604 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1281137613 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've become rather a fan of gaiman haha < 1281137617 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my collection should be about complete < 1281137624 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even the kids books ;) < 1281137640 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still need some of the Sandman specials though < 1281137655 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I *still* can't find Season of Mist. < 1281137658 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Smoke and Mirrors is one of my favorite publications though < 1281137668 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been looking for *months*. < 1281137672 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's just so MANY good stories in there < 1281137686 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has read Season of Mist *MWAHAHAHA* < 1281137693 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, DIE. < 1281137699 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or send me your copy. < 1281137709 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't say i had a _copy_ :D < 1281137715 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AA < 1281137716 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read it at the library < 1281137722 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually oerjan has the original < 1281137722 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.alibris.com/booksearch?qwork=10919118&matches=15&keyword=season+of+mists&cm_sp=works*listing*title < 1281137724 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Ahhhh, and now I get it," says Ed-B. Now I see why you came back and left everyone behind in your old universe." < 1281137729 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You missed an opening quote, Sam. < 1281137739 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a number of copies starting at around $12 < 1281137743 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where they presumably still has one (or two, probably at least one in norwegian and one in english) < 1281137752 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*have < 1281137759 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my Sandman copies are that newer two-tone color cover < 1281137762 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, steal it and drop it off at the top of the Scott Monument at noon on Wednesday. < 1281137763 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i liked the other covers better < 1281137772 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i couldn't beat the price and getting to buy them all at once < 1281137793 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i kinda wanna buy the covers i liked and sell the other ones or something, but that'd be a pain < 1281137797 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'm not really all that picky about covers < 1281137836 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, gonna have to look up that youtube stuff, sounds fun < 1281137864 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do I have a horizontal scrollbar on this chat window? < 1281137879 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey, FASCISM < 1281137881 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask your irc client < 1281137882 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see nothing that failed to wrap < 1281137889 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: you visited the link, yes? < 1281137901 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I couldn't get audio. < 1281137909 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am confused < 1281137921 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not a link that requires audio < 1281137922 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean me, individually. < 1281137937 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is however a link where you can purchase what you were looking for < 1281137937 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1281137950 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: what about myndzi's last link? < 1281137960 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I thought you were talking about something else. < 1281137973 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1281137975 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it wrapped < 1281138010 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you scroll down there are some new copies for like $15 < 1281138018 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, one < 1281138024 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION buys it and goes NYAHAHAHA < 1281138025 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;p < 1281138047 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: er, i'm not terribly interested in the book itself, if that's what you meant < 1281138058 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi, UK. < 1281138061 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: no it was just a guess < 1281138073 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: so? i'm sure you can find someone who will ship there < 1281138078 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, you know the plan? < 1281138095 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would you like me to proxy buy one for you? < 1281138100 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, it involves a man and a canal in panama < 1281138133 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a man, a can, a pan < 1281138165 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can a man nap? < 1281138182 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can a nan map? < 1281138235 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :madam, can adam plan a canal? < 1281138267 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adam, can madam do anal? < 1281138268 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;p < 1281138286 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i am about to leave; you can drop me a query if you decide you want to take me up on the offer < 1281138294 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :myndzi, NEVER < 1281138294 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i'll see it later < 1281138298 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281138303 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O < 1281138310 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMN YOU! < 1281138314 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\o/ < 1281138316 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why doesnt work /o/ < 1281138322 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|o/ < 1281138328 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_o_ < 1281138329 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281138329 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         |\ < 1281138331 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i maek mastake /o/ < 1281138331 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :                | < 1281138331 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :               /`\ < 1281138334 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is fix < 1281138412 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eep < 1281138427 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1281138441 0 :augur!~augur@c-71-196-120-234.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1281138444 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1281138450 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ < 1281138450 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         | < 1281138450 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :         >\ < 1281138462 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: im glad you liked my joke :D < 1281138468 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this what you were hunting for? a man, a plan, a canal: panama < 1281138476 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone read Ed stories? I know pikhq and Sgeo have. < 1281138495 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari: hunting? we were already dismembering the body < 1281138499 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/o/ _o_ |o| \o\ < 1281138499 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  |   |   |   | < 1281138499 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :  |\ /|   >\ /| < 1281138502 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I don't see it < 1281138511 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess I lost a line < 1281138543 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ram a lack ok, calamari! < 1281138582 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1281138641 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :armadillo, rama lama ding dong < 1281138752 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1281138801 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :``I wanna go to Andromeda,'' says Ed, rotating the ship to point < 1281138801 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :towards an extraordinarily distant blob of light. < 1281138802 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :``We can't go to Andromeda,'' I remind him sternly. < 1281138804 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lulz, lampshading. < 1281138822 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION read the Ed stories earlier this year and alise is probably to blame for it < 1281138831 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1281138838 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1281138944 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I told you to read them. So, yeah. < 1281138957 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Either you didn't like them, or you just wanted to make me feel bad. :P < 1281138960 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(wrt "blame") < 1281138998 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :false dichomoty! < 1281139002 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*tomy < 1281139079 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so what's the true option? :P < 1281139104 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Okay, do you know the variable to adjust to stop -- from appearing at the start of a line? < 1281139106 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's ugly. < 1281139125 0 :alise!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, a way to make it disable ligatures when stretching text would be nice. Ha ha, only kidding, I've read the microtype docs, TeX sucks enough that that's impossible. < 1281139131 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought they were all right, and was joking