< 1291161602 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :avarything should be a pointer < 1291161613 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like in a goddamn C# or something < 1291161663 0 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291161665 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is Factor more popular than Newspeak? < 1291161675 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why am I comparing apples and oranges? < 1291161677 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: SHUT < 1291161679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: UP < 1291161683 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1291161688 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1291161693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... so anyway, ok seriously, what's the easiest way to become nobody in a shell script < 1291161706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, su nobody ? < 1291161708 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such < 1291161719 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wouldn't that require root access? < 1291161723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: require's nobody's password. it, of course, has none. < 1291161733 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, root shouldn't need it < 1291161735 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: sudo works for any user, of course, but requires the user's password < 1291161738 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: indeed, i'm not root < 1291161746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then you can't change user < 1291161749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes you can < 1291161755 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and you can use sudo < 1291161757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ sudo -u nobody whoami < 1291161758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[sudo] password for elliott: < 1291161758 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobody < 1291161760 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, to do it without password < 1291161763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as i said, pointlessly requires the user's password < 1291161772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i'd rather not depend on sudo < 1291161773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes indeed sudo is suid root < 1291161776 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is why it can do it < 1291161779 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes... < 1291161779 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :su is suid root too < 1291161783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you still haven't answered my question < 1291161804 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stop trying to hack into nobody's account! nobody runs web servers! < 1291161804 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but you can't do it without having root or *effectively having root thanks to being suid root* < 1291161813 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or, well, should. Regular users shouldn't) < 1291161822 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the latter is slightly acceptable. < 1291161825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the former is not < 1291161825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, no it shouldn't. A special www user should < 1291161832 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, ah. < 1291161832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: any user on a system should be able to build a package < 1291161836 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the latter wouldn't work on the shell script < 1291161848 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i could just write an asnobody.c < 1291161856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but... < 1291161856 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure < 1291161865 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is what you would have to do < 1291161866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really like strictly more setuid programs than necessary :) < 1291161874 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or use sudo with NOPASSWD < 1291161880 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i'm tempted to < 1291161894 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think is is a bad idea though in general < 1291161896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: (I wonder why there isn't an asnobody already, all it can do is reduce privileges...) < 1291161898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1291161916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it feels insecure. Could they mess up for other users also building packages? < 1291161939 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what else on the system uses nobody? < 1291161939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: not really < 1291161949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1291161956 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess they could rm -rf it < 1291161965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what we really need is asnewtemporaryuser :) < 1291161975 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, plash? < 1291161988 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: debian-specific, and WAY overblown for this < 1291161995 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's as simple as setuid(rand()) :P < 1291161997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1291162004 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's as simple as setuid(max_uid_in_etc_passwd+rand()) :P < 1291162025 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291162063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i might actually just use su here, it may end up that you need to run it as root anyway < 1291162068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: due to busybox tar not having --owner= < 1291162117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why do you use busybox? < 1291162127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: as opposed to? < 1291162133 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also if you are packaging projects what about stuff that needs to install as separate uses < 1291162134 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :users* < 1291162140 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just look at qmail for example < 1291162145 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :several different users < 1291162160 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :qmailq, qmails and so on iirc < 1291162161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: --owner just changes the owners of the files < 1291162187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes and they need to be different owners. Not all should be changed to root < 1291162194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: postinstall script :P < 1291162198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291162201 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's because packages aren't built as root for obvious reasons < 1291162205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean there's little other option really < 1291162217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :night → < 1291162218 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :postinstall script for the rare such package is probably the easiest way < 1291162324 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNIC: 3.67 /8s in RIR Pool... And APNIC is extremely likely to get the last 2x/8s. < 1291162464 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's apparently work on NS3 < 1291162475 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1291162834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Question. Should I bother including cc in the build dependencies for any package? < 1291162838 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or libc? < 1291162840 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm lazy, you see. < 1291162851 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fakeroot is always an option. :p < 1291162853 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I say "yes". < 1291162862 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: requires dynamic linker. < 1291162867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: so no, in fact < 1291162876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yeah, but... who tries to compile a package without them? :P < 1291162884 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though most distros just say "If it's in the base system, it's not marked as a dependency of anything." < 1291162884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Fine, fine...) < 1291162890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No they don't! < 1291162896 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. Debian doesn't. < 1291162942 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's because Debian doesn't fuck around. < 1291163030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I most definitely fuck around! < 1291163032 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@128.198.97.64 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291163036 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, fakeroot with some sort of ptrace-hooked syscalls, then. The elegant choice! < 1291163038 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My package manager is like a piece of string! < 1291163040 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then there's less known problem of ASN depletion. < 1291163047 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The string is FLIMSY! < 1291163056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Hey, an Actual Runtime Dependency for vi. < 1291163058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (termcap) < 1291163064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well. termcap-db. < 1291163068 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Got a better name for that?) < 1291163093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# The preferred choice for ex on Linux distributions, other systems that < 1291163093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# provide a good termcap file, or when setting the TERMCAP environment < 1291163093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# variable is deemed sufficient, is the included 2.11BSD termcap library. < 1291163093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# < 1291163093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TERMLIB = termlib < 1291163107 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: ... ASN depletion. < 1291163111 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Oh fuck. < 1291163133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oi oi oi we're naming packages here! Focus on the important stuff! < 1291163190 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's of course an upgraded spec that solves it. But you need upgraded systems to peer with AS with extended ASN... < 1291163191 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it was extended to 32 bits a few years ago. I hope that the BGP routers actually have been updated. < 1291163213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: So what should I call the termcap db. :p < 1291163226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or is it all terminfo these days? As quoted, vi uses 2.11BSD termcap.) < 1291163226 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: termcap-db < 1291163229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Are the files the same?) < 1291163270 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Not termdb? < 1291163278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any other kind of terminal database other than termcap, really? < 1291163311 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Terminfo. < 1291163334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Can't that read termcap files? < 1291163343 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least ASN upgrade should be less of a hassle than IP upgrade, since only systems that peer with extended ASNs need to be upgraded. < 1291163379 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I mean, I really don't want to fuck around with terminfo because it uses binary files and crap. < 1291163406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Please validate me :P < 1291163408 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can convert to/fro termcap file / terminfo database, at least up to some extent. < 1291163409 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Pretty sure they're incompatible. < 1291163412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bleh. < 1291163418 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just build everything with termcap and hope for the best. < 1291163422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, in fact. < 1291163428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'll offer both termcap and terminfo in the same package. < 1291163433 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, termdb. < 1291163454 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There you go. < 1291163467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. :P < 1291163480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goodnight. < 1291163484 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Seems that some programs explicitly call out to termcap or terminfo... < 1291163494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1291163495 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gag. < 1291163530 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't seem to have termcap files anywhere any more. < 1291163774 0 :sftp!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291163853 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian seems to have thrown out their old "termcap-compat" package. (They just ship a ncurses "libtermcap" that actually reads terminfo; termcap-compat was for old code you couldn't for some reason or another recompile. And/or those people with custom termcap reading code.) < 1291164038 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Already five years ago, in fact. < 1291164208 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1291164212 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@97-124-35-105.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291164230 0 :Mathnerd314_!~mathnerd3@128.198.97.64 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291164266 0 :Mathnerd314_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Mathnerd314 < 1291164267 0 :oklofok!~oklopol@xdsl-83-150-123-242.nebulazone.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1291164291 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291164445 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291164526 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Files are extremely important in current computing experience. Much too important. Files should be put in their place; they should be put away." < 1291164610 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Ultimately, it is about control: If you don�t have a file system, it becomes harder for you to download content from unauthorized sources. This is also good for security, and in a perverse way, for the user experience. And it�s also good for software service providers." suddenly, I feel ill < 1291164679 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think this person actually supports that as a reason to get rid of file systems < 1291164797 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything implies a true proposition < 1291164861 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that file systems should be gotten rid of) < 1291164908 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really understand what he's saying < 1291164932 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gbracha.blogspot.com/2010/02/nail-files.html < 1291165035 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spamusers fails at sodomy. < 1291165045 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's correct < 1291165050 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the nail guy < 1291165208 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still don't see what the security thing was < 1291165236 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :does he assume that with objects comes some sort of not being able to download arbitrary objects and do whatever the fuck you want with them < 1291165252 0 :madbr!~madbrain@modemcable032.155-200-24.mc.videotron.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1291166349 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@97-124-35-105.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291166350 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291166472 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291166534 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@97-124-35-222.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291166602 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291167276 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1291167983 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This proposal should be considered an emergency proposal. IANA < 1291167996 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exhaustion is likely to occur prior to the next ARIN meeting." < 1291167997 0 :BeholdMyGlory!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291168024 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Looks like the depletion is expected to occur very soon... < 1291168030 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Hmm? < 1291168033 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1291168133 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looking at when APNIC could justify allocation, depleting the pool completely... The IANA depletion could occur at any moment. < 1291168144 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The next ARIN meeting is apparently early April. < 1291168153 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, the IANA depletion could occur *any moment*? < 1291168163 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dang. < 1291168204 0 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1291168237 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Formally, the depletion estimates have not changed because APNIC allocates last, but in practice, the date may have changed... < 1291168337 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :An that "at any moment" comes from global policies. APNIC probably could justify allocation even now. < 1291168339 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So. D-day is basically any time in the next 5 months or so. < 1291168458 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it is in next 3 and half months... < 1291168496 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm allowing for *extreme* optimism. < 1291168646 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some bastard is going around suggesting that companies think about IPv6 migration "in the next 2-5 years". < 1291168660 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By which time the Internet will have been full for several years. < 1291168662 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O < 1291168682 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even Houston model, which seems optimistic predicts 04-Mar-2011 ... That's sightly over 3 months away... < 1291168705 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeaaah. < 1291168759 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now there's new predictions about X-day this year. < 1291168774 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Link? < 1291168825 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, celebrations in 3 months? < 1291168826 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:D < 1291168840 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFK SGU < 1291168860 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION laughs maniacally
< 1291168890 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prepare for having to do it sooner... A lot sooner... < 1291168985 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, no official model predictions... But informal ones... < 1291169401 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291169525 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wonder when next IPv6 allocation will occur (bringing the pool down to 505 blocks, which is under 99%)... < 1291169600 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It amazes me that even 1% has been used. IPv6 is just so very, very large... < 1291169670 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 various block and 5 RIR blocks... IIRC, the actual amount of delegations is 0.027% or so... < 1291169697 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ah*. < 1291169706 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is, those allocations are at about 2.7 or so... < 1291169710 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*2.7% < 1291169710 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's being pieced up from the IANA in ridiculously large blocks, then. < 1291169735 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/12s ... 1M * 2^32 networks. < 1291169758 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's a pretty gigantic block. < 1291170113 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and then there are 3456 blocks in undefined address ranges... < 1291170143 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IPv6 address space is just gigantic. < 1291170260 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. Currently the IPv6 space is *only defined* in 2000::/3 < 1291170470 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Global unicast space, that is. There are also some other blocks, such as ULA space and broadcast space. < 1291170497 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow. The "NFL International Series". A scheme whereby the NFL plays a regular season game in London. < 1291170517 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... I didn't know American football had any fans at all outside of North America. < 1291170689 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291170846 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh... The "realtime" IPv4 depletion counter that uses the Houston model is down. < 1291170853 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. There's an American football World Cup. The US didn't play in the first two. XD < 1291171024 0 :madbr!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1291171109 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 SGU < 1291171118 0 :Zuu!zuu@0x55529f1b.adsl.cybercity.dk JOIN :#esoteric < 1291171124 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I almost thought... meh, no spoilers here < 1291171158 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, it works now. < 1291171640 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To a character: "In case you forgot, [spoiler]" < 1291171653 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the audience forgot < 1291172440 0 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291175271 0 :guny!~guny@ip-78-108-153-1.klient.poruba.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291175287 0 :guny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi watch my music video!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Q6U2O-qx4 < 1291175289 0 :guny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi watch my music video!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Q6U2O-qx4 < 1291175290 0 :guny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi watch my music video!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Q6U2O-qx4 < 1291175292 0 :guny!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi watch my music video!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Q6U2O-qx4 < 1291175294 0 :guny!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1291175360 0 :zeotrope_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291175470 0 :zeotrope!~zeo@bas3-kitchener06-1096752467.dsl.bell.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1291175496 0 :zeotrope!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest75069 < 1291176519 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291176676 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291176755 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291178823 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: ilua < 1291179577 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate being a polite programmer < 1291179584 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do I have to say please :( < 1291180814 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1291181220 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL, I presume? < 1291181850 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291182685 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291182728 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291182786 0 :yorick!yorick@gateway/shell/shellium.org/x-furktzxejybhhrbm JOIN :#esoteric < 1291183350 0 :adu!~ajr@pool-173-66-11-168.washdc.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291183373 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291183408 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291183699 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1291183757 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"And when Simon Peyton Jones, one of the designers of Haskell, was asked why Haskell has only such a basic module system, he said that they didn't feel they were smart enough to design a real one. Let that sink in ... The designers of Haskell. Not smart." < 1291183761 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4057973/osgi-like-modularity-in-other-programming-languages < 1291183765 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is... that a real thing? < 1291184072 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1291184122 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i've heard something similar < 1291184138 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but SPJ didn't use the word "smart" in the version i read < 1291184161 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he made it sound as tho it was "sufficient" the way it was < 1291184370 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The fact that one rarely needs more than one window is one of the things I really like about Hopscotch. There�s no need for a docking bar, or tabs for that matter. Tabs are popular these days, but they don�t scale: they occupy valuable screen real estate, and beyond half a dozen or so become disorienting and unmanageable." < 1291184377 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gbracha.blogspot.com/2008/07/debugging-visual-metaphors.html < 1291184384 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So much for a tabbed Newspeak browser < 1291184691 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow OSGi sounds interesting < 1291184887 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION attempts to redirect adu to Newspeak
< 1291184913 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's Newspeak < 1291184938 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://newspeaklanguage.org/ < 1291184950 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the language fawned over in the answer to that SO question < 1291185030 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO? < 1291185077 0 :Goosey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291185164 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :StackOverflow < 1291185325 0 :Guest75069!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1291185502 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1291185980 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Newspeak sounds a lot like io < 1291185997 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has only heard of IO and knows nothing about it
< 1291186035 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are several languages I wish could have babies < 1291186054 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go + Io + Prolog + Haskell < 1291186075 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be a cute kid < 1291186557 0 :yorick!yorick@gateway/shell/shellium.org/x-vgknreueiwwztszv JOIN :#esoteric < 1291186961 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291187416 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291187816 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291187888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Go + Io + Prolog + Haskell <-- how would that work? < 1291187917 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1291187942 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adu, oh? you think so? < 1291187946 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1291187963 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291187968 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adu, I can't see how you could reconcile the imperative and purely functional aspects there < 1291188004 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :adu, and if you think it would work so well, why not implement it! < 1291188028 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything Go does would be of type IO () and everything Prolog does would be at the typeclass level < 1291188034 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io doesn't really fit < 1291188051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know much about Io so I can't say anything about that < 1291188115 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have to leave now, cya < 1291188122 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's pretty much a 1-to-1 mapping between (almost) anything imperative and Haskell's IO () < 1291190216 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291190399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1291190400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1291190730 0 :adu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: adu < 1291191266 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291192125 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1291192129 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1291192716 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://open.spotify.com/album/29dWA4uMn07qxfEAGO3wSh < 1291194361 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291194498 0 :FireFly!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: swatted to death < 1291195095 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291195218 0 :augur_!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291195219 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291195399 0 :atrapado!~rodrigo@193.144.79.241 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291195957 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291196211 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291196245 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291196873 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: "Uh." (Incidentally, I've never heard any of the in-game music.) < 1291197081 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291197370 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291197953 0 :perdito!~perdito@koln-d9329a84.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291198236 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291198834 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291199087 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1291199101 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it appears that UK is paralyzed because of some minor snow < 1291200224 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291202384 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1291202641 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291203628 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Coyote finally caught me < 1291203639 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@li14-39.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291203714 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291204374 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quit < 1291204545 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291205402 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291206055 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291206179 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@97-124-45-106.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291206299 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1291207364 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291207364 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291207391 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291207847 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291208071 0 :myndzi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1291208150 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :great < 1291208159 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my raytracer now generates modern art < 1291208661 0 :myndzi!myndzi@c-24-19-39-178.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291209651 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1291209752 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@cpc12-sgyl29-2-0-cust185.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291209861 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291209865 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1291209952 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.50.208 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291210691 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!~phantomho@cpc3-sgyl21-0-0-cust116.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291210865 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1291210866 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291211129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur_: I find your recent statements about INTERCAL highly offensive < 1291211818 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What were they? < 1291211883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/eecvm/a_compiler_language_which_has_nothing_at_all_in/c17hc7w < 1291211902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ais523 and oerjan, accomplished INTERCAL programmers, would take great objection to this slight. < 1291212052 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Appalling! < 1291212170 0 :FireFly|n900!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291212489 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is your school closed? < 1291212500 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1291212505 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahhaha < 1291212514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am unsure why you are laughing < 1291212518 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what... snow is toxic or what? < 1291212533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, yes it is. < 1291212560 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more seriously, i don't suppose you comprehend the idea of driving in heavy snow that continues to fall being perhaps /dangerous/? < 1291212581 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do this during whole winter < 1291212618 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i think we have firmly established that Poland has not quite come to grips with the concept of safety yet < 1291212626 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not safety < 1291212642 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask some secure swedes < 1291212648 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tehy've got shitloads of snow too < 1291212649 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what, we don't all drive Volvos. < 1291212682 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1291212714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm is it known which s gives SHA-1(s) = 0? < 1291212716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there such an s? < 1291212732 0 :MigoMipo!~John@62.119.155.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291212734 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://img.wiadomosci24.pl/g2/4b/cd/83/11082_1162885840_b968_p.jpeg < 1291212739 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ winter tires < 1291212749 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ modern cars with ASR, BAS and whatever < 1291212753 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you're safe < 1291212788 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: yes, we do indeed remove snow from roads. guess what! we have rural areas. < 1291212795 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what! it takes time to clear the snow from everywhere. < 1291212883 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AWKWARDNESS < 1291212986 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, the schools reopened here today. < 1291212999 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even though the snow is considerably worse than yesterday. < 1291213015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: They decided they were open, and upon looking out the window immediately decided that no, they're not open. < 1291213040 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yeah, jesus christ, this snow. < 1291213047 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nope, I went. Although we all went home at lunch. < 1291213057 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I meant here. < 1291213072 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the frigid southlands. < 1291213083 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's because our cretin of a First Minister said that the schools should reopen and they did, in spite of the police saying the opposite. < 1291213178 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::F < 1291213192 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ppl could just walk to school < 1291213205 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what we mostly did. < 1291213209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: i don't think you realise the kind of distances present in britain... < 1291213215 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh come on < 1291213222 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still stupid, especially since the previous two days were both snow days. < 1291213237 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in poor Poland we've got schools max 3-4km from home < 1291213244 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So apparently once the snow goes over a certain critical depth it ceases to matter. < 1291213247 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in towns < 1291213250 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: do you delight in being really fucking stupid? < 1291213262 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i delight annoying you :D < 1291213264 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291213394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Quick! What's the SHA-1 hash of a directory? < 1291213423 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A carrot! < 1291213438 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, what's the SHA-1 algorithm? < 1291213460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complicated. < 1291213671 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hash algorithms always are... < 1291213799 0 :FireFly|n900!~n900@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1291213961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Not so! < 1291213968 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CubeHash < 1291213976 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: The SHA-3 competitor I'm rooting for, thanks djb. < 1291213984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's not "rooting" is it?) < 1291214067 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1291214101 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think CubeHash is all *that* simpler; the wikipedia doesn't bother listing the round transformation, which is he usual add-rotate-swap-style mess, just like the SHA-1 compression function. < 1291214119 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It *is* nice to see something that's not the usual Merkle–Damgård construction though. < 1291214251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: djb instantly simplifies everything he touches. duh. < 1291214277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :schneier's function has been cryptanalysed a bit cuz he's a luzr < 1291214282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should make "djb facts" < 1291214291 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I can't think of any :P < 1291214307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Merkle–Damgård construction < 1291214308 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Redirected from Merkle-Damgård construction) < 1291214309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1291214335 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a different sort of hyphen. < 1291214357 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1291214367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing in the wikibox links to one that's redirected < 1291214368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone fix that < 1291214381 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that someone could be you! < 1291214405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Although no proof has been constructed, Oozlybub and Murphy is thought to be Turing-complete if and only if Goldbach's Conjecture is true." --cpressey < 1291214424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oozlybub and Murphy is a programming language. Despite appearances, this name refers to a single language. < 1291214424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : The majority of the language is named Oozlybub. The fact that the language is not entirely named Oozlybub is named Murphy. < 1291214424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1291214424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the sake of providing an "olde tyme esoterickal de-sign", the language combines several unusual features, < 1291214426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : including multiple interleaved parse streams, infinitely long variable names, gratuitously strong typing, and only-conjectural Turing completeness." < 1291214428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://catseye.tc/projects/oozlybub-and-murphy/doc/website_oozlybub-and-murphy.html < 1291214478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It even has Unicode support! < 1291214650 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey is a monster < 1291214896 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A monster! < 1291215100 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BEAST! < 1291215218 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291215225 0 :Sasha!~WHAT@97-124-45-106.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291215235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"That's true though. I invented DNA. I also invented the invention itself." --Peter Sunde, Pirate Bay co-founder < 1291215327 0 :augur_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291215346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hahaha! Huckabee wants to execute Assange. < 1291215353 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291215390 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291215396 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291215406 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird, apparently the Lego MMO is extremely good. < 1291215414 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is not what I would expect at all. < 1291215421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Finally, Julian Assange is no hero. He is a twit. He should not be made into a liberal icon. He gives hackers a bad name. He and his organization are indeed enemies of the U.S. government and the people represented by that government; they should be stopped, and they richly deserve to be punished for this latest leak. And that goes double for the person or people in the U.S. government who leaked the documents in the first place. None of t < 1291215421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hese people deserve your support any longer." < 1291215429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- Larry Sanger, solidifying his reputation as... a twit. < 1291215463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The rest of this "essay", if you can call it that -- http://www.larrysanger.org/wikileaks.html -- constitutes basically saying "Well, you see, they're MEANT to be private, because the government decided releasing them to the public would be a bad idea. Therefore it's dangerous to do so, and no government would ever abuse this! DUH.") < 1291215499 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have certain reservations about Wikileaks due to the whole "names of informants" thing, but I wouldn't go that far.. < 1291215509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Um, they've been redacting names. < 1291215530 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes, but they didn't for that earlier military leak. < 1291215543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC, they did. < 1291215543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: (They also asked the US government for *help* redacting information that could endanger people to minimise any risk. The US refused.) < 1291215549 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for the most recent leak) < 1291215657 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@97-124-33-18.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291215670 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1291215692 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291215693 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh, well. I approve, then. < 1291215719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just love the chain of events there -- < 1291215746 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikileaks: Hello, you know those documents we're going to release. We don't want anyone to get hurt; it's in your best interests to help us redact any information that could put people's lives at risk. < 1291215748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :US: No. < 1291215750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[later] < 1291215757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikileaks: [releases documents] < 1291215772 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :US govt., mass media: That's IRRESPONSIBLE TERRORISM! Think of the LIVES at risk! < 1291215778 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi ais523. < 1291215798 0 :Sasha!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291215855 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikileaks does good work < 1291215945 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if its founder looks like a bit of a prat. < 1291216016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Really? How? < 1291216032 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The hair is... silly. < 1291216039 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :His... hair? Seriously? < 1291216056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Julian Assange is more a lightning rod than anything else, anyway -- you never hear about anyone but him and just about all you ever hear about him is negative; nobody else gets any shit. That's definitely intentional. < 1291216105 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Semi-relatedly, have you seen his old blahhg? http://web.archive.org/web/20071020051936/http://iq.org/ < 1291216106 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. But his hair is still stupid. < 1291216109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was on reddit a while ago. < 1291216171 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291216235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: in a file of " ", how would you denote a directory? < 1291216249 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been using an sha-1 length of zeroes, but it's conceivable that some string could actually hash to 0. < 1291216284 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" "? < 1291216285 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With a / appended? < 1291216296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Umm... what the hell is the SHA-1 hash of a directory? < 1291216690 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1291216717 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make it "0", then append the / to the name so there's no chance of confusion, < 1291216793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Just 0? Not 40 0s? < 1291216818 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine. < 1291216844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. < 1291216954 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alternately: make it "", no hash. < 1291216994 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make it a random 40-digit hex string, and then change a single, random digit in there to a "g". < 1291217077 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forget my suggestions, use fizzie's. < 1291217092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: :D < 1291217121 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was optimized for confusion, of course. < 1291217166 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, better: change a random 0 into an O. Or 1 into l. < 1291217198 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I think the g is best. < 1291217205 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh! < 1291217213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Change one "a" into the identical, Cryllic "a". < 1291217220 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If there is no a in the string, regenerate it.) < 1291217233 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those pesky crylls < 1291217292 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aren't crylls just palette-swapped trolls? < 1291217305 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :_possibly_ < 1291217337 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, zuh? < 1291217377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You got 15 out of 19 Programming Language if You Know Their Creators. < 1291217401 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'd just leave the hash out < 1291217409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One mistake was really embarrassing... one or two of them I'm proud of... and the last one I just feel meh about. < 1291217413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: But that's ugly! < 1291217418 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or hash the directory itself, they are technically speaking files, just you can't read them via normal methods < 1291217436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1291217438 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.sporcle.com/games/supreddit/prog_lang_wirth < 1291217439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Can you name the Programming Language if You Know Their Creators? (Niklaus Wirth Edition)?" < 1291217445 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :best quiz ever < 1291217454 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, no :P < 1291217466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "cat" will cat a directory on NetBSD :) < 1291217469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as on plan9, but :) < 1291217476 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, is it decidable whether two regular expressions (actual regular expressions, without backreferences etc.) match the same set of strings? < 1291217492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Differences between Oberon-07 and Oberon < 1291217492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Niklaus Wirth, 8.8.2007 / 17.12.2007 < 1291217492 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oberon-07 is a revision of the original language Oberon as defined in 1988/1990. < 1291217495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is the man still alive... < 1291217498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't /think/ so < 1291217508 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :really? I was guessing yes < 1291217516 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I know that you can't minimise a regexp to its provably shortest form, IIRC < 1291217518 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, obviously yes < 1291217523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how? < 1291217530 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for ordinary regular expressions, you can compile them into state machines < 1291217540 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then because there's a finite number of states, you can bruteforce < 1291217558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, obviously < 1291217564 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel silly now < 1291217575 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes it is decidable < 1291217587 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I feel a bit silly that I had to ask rather than figuring it out < 1291217596 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do set difference and union < 1291217597 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a lot less obvious with backreferences involved < 1291217603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"- Applied to values of type SET, the unary minus denotes the set complement, and the function < 1291217603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ABS yields the number of elements of a set. The relations <= and >= denote set inclusion." < 1291217622 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from which you can construct xor of two languages < 1291217622 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so you can do - on the empty set, and get a set of everything? < 1291217623 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zuh? < 1291217635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I sure hope so! < 1291217641 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm, that's a different proof from the one I gave, and requires assumptions I didn't know < 1291217655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder why there is not more literature on I\Xi. < 1291217682 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291217724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can I have permission to troll the esolangs wiki with a language < 1291217824 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :would the language be at all interesting in its own right? < 1291217834 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose being created for the purpose of trolling makes a language an esolang < 1291217836 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a Turing-complete-and-no-greater language in which all programs nonetheless halt < 1291217838 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(/me coughs at LOLCODE) < 1291217841 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: A regular expression is a DFA, you can construct the minimal equivalent DFA pretty easily, and the minimal DFA (up to state naming) accepting a particular regular language is unique; so just construct the DFA (might have an exponential number of states, though) and minimize it for both regexps; if they are the same, they match the same set of strings. < 1291217855 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is that even theoretically possible? < 1291217857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: of course, such a language is only implementable on a machine with a Turing machine halting oracle; I will, therefore, provide an implementation. In Banana Scheme. < 1291217872 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that was pretty close to my proof < 1291217874 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: go for it < 1291217876 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's theoretically possible on a super-Turing machine; if halts(X) then run(X) else done < 1291217902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, http://esolangs.org/wiki/Banana_Scheme has a serious error! < 1291217928 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fixed < 1291217964 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'm not entirely sure that such a language would technically be TC < 1291217982 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :plot plot plot plot plot plot plot plot banana scheme < 1291217984 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, by the typical mathematical definition, it definitely wouldn't be < 1291217993 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's why it's trolling! < 1291217996 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@137.125.188.14 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291218015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you can run any Turing-complete-requiring computation you want to; even if it doesn't halt, you can run N steps for arbitrary finite N < 1291218018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just can't loop forever < 1291218026 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-plot < 1291218041 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my new obsession is Newspeak < 1291218053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ooh, now I want to make it so that you can write a Brainfuck program which halts if you put in "blah" and doesn't if you put in "bluh" < 1291218062 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and then make sure my implementation doesn't stop the program until you put in "bluh" < 1291218085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, so I have to do (H 0 `(assuming-we-get-the-character ,n)) for all 255 ns < 1291218088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :at every read < 1291218091 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1291218099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, wait, much before every read < 1291218100 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmmm < 1291218104 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, too much of a pain < 1291218107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll do it dbfi-style < 1291218120 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does Newspeak look? samples? < 1291218133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: like Smalltalk. < 1291218155 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except a bit more syntax < 1291218167 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And slightly different conventions < 1291218177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooga: http://newspeaklanguage.org/. just ignore Sgeo, he has never known a language he didn't fall in love with and then reject for really stupid fucking reasons before ever using it < 1291218265 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So he did that to Factor and Smalltalk as well? < 1291218272 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Scala, I remember that one as well. < 1291218303 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, 4 of the last 11 /8s were just allocated < 1291218320 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION would love to see Slava and Bracha collide
< 1291218328 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291218336 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when the next two are assigned, the RIRs get one each, so it's not long before there are no free /8s left < 1291218352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:01:18 It's just that udev's better. :p < 1291218380 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember the context at all. < 1291218417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor do I! Let's FIND it! < 1291218496 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better than devfs, it seems. < 1291218516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeah, but people were calling it "2 of the last 9" because 2 of those went to ARIN, which was absolutely *going* to allocate yesterday. < 1291218520 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're better than devfs. So there. < 1291218523 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just RIPE's allocation is a surprise. < 1291218575 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you know us Europeans, we like to be surprising. < 1291218615 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And APNIC could allocate any time in the next few months, thereby causing IPv4 depletion. < 1291218726 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION swats fizzie -----###
< 1291218741 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't expect that. < 1291218752 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a bit of friendly european surprise < 1291218772 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nobody expects the Norwegian swatquisition. < 1291218793 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Showing results for sw acquisition. Search instead for swatquisition" < 1291219027 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should be a quote < 1291219091 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" hmm, is it decidable whether two regular expressions (actual regular expressions, without backreferences etc.) match the same set of strings?" <<< yes, obviously < 1291219124 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" for ordinary regular expressions, you can compile them into state machines" " then because there's a finite number of states, you can bruteforce" <<< just be sure it's an algorithm and not a semialgorithm tho < 1291219237 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" ais523: a Turing-complete-and-no-greater language in which all programs nonetheless halt" <<< enumerate turing machines that halt, the program 1 runs the first one, 2 runs the second one etc < 1291219263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: I'm trolling, remember? It's going to be brainfuck. < 1291219278 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291219295 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291219302 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, while you're at it, biject to the computable reals. < 1291219357 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing that has an interpreter that's just a BF interpreter but those interpreters don't correctly report invalid programs < 1291219360 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1291219380 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what < 1291219385 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@75-173-239-57.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291219391 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, your language that you're discussing < 1291219400 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : oklofok, while you're at it, biject to the computable reals. < 1291219414 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :difficult, since you'd have to consider programs under the equivalence relation of "same result as" < 1291219428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise you'd have countably infinite programs for each computable real < 1291219434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: no, the interpreter is written in banana scheme. < 1291219461 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... so will the language count as implemented or unimplemented? < 1291219470 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i heard today that if you assume the negation of aoc, you can prove there is a subset of R that doesn't have a countable subset, and i was surprised < 1291219477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:28:17 Wow. The "NFL International Series". A scheme whereby the NFL plays a regular season game in London. < 1291219477 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18:28:37 ... I didn't know American football had any fans at all outside of North America. < 1291219477 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that common knowledge? < 1291219478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't! < 1291219482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: implemented, just not compuatbly < 1291219486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*computably < 1291219490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: i remember hearing that once... from wikipedia :P < 1291219508 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axiom_of_choice#Statements_consistent_with_the_negation_of_AC < 1291219511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: fun section < 1291219515 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291219517 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1291219544 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :# There exists a model of ZF¬C in which real numbers are a countable union of countable sets.[11] < 1291219547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my favourite one < 1291219569 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION
< 1291219574 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1291219574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: die. < 1291219597 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coolness < 1291219622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:48:07 hi watch my music video!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_Q6U2O-qx4 < 1291219624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is terrible < 1291219627 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i think there's even an american football team in Oslo < 1291219639 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was pretty trivial yeah < 1291219648 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She's going over bitwise operators < 1291219664 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She asked the class if anyone's classes delt with bitwise operators. Of course not < 1291219668 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate this school < 1291219682 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously they are too trivial to teach < 1291219741 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a friend of mine used to play american football so it's here too i guess < 1291219742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:47:34 Go + Io + Prolog + Haskell < 1291219743 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:47:55 that would be a cute kid < 1291219744 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with tentacles < 1291219770 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway_American_Football_Federation < 1291219775 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:47:53 ineiros: "Uh." (Incidentally, I've never heard any of the in-game music.) < 1291219776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: but it's nice! < 1291219784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:38:36 fizzie: http://open.spotify.com/album/29dWA4uMn07qxfEAGO3wSh < 1291219785 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwat < 1291219917 0 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1291219949 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh < 1291219968 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Newspeak comes with late night wisdom < 1291220014 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ideone.com/mf4Lm < 1291220114 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, do you actually /program/, or do you just get incessant and short-lived obsessions with languages? < 1291220133 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The latter < 1291220145 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually think you've written less programs I know of than me. < 1291220162 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have written about 3 programs. < 1291220164 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :None of them anywhere near complete. < 1291220180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: HE WROTE PSOX < 1291220198 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a bunch of Python scripts to do random things on my old HD < 1291220213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, #exoteric is taken. < 1291220235 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including scraping a news site's sports section for photos from my home HS < 1291220237 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.> < 1291220244 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This was when I was in HS. Don't get ideas) < 1291220248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are crazy. < 1291220321 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that's a negative program! < 1291220331 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a few Haver clients lying around < 1291220350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops haver sucks < 1291220362 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not my fault, is it? < 1291220368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1291220442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:23:05 Hmm, what about a language where the dimensions are finite, but the number of them is infinite? < 1291220443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:23:18 You know: a 2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x... universe. < 1291220444 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :approve < 1291220460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :09:27:27 And, assuming integral coordinates in each case, is it clear by the diagonal argument that there is more space in that kind of universe than in an infinite univers with a finite number of dimensions < 1291220461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291220464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obvious, but :D) < 1291220540 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A 2^\infty universe is obviously real-indexed. < 1291220562 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION had a bit of trouble visualizing that diagonalization, but figured it out
< 1291220578 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, the Cantor diagonalisation? < 1291220580 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I may be visualizing it wrong still < 1291220599 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I know what it looks like for decimals and... I was visualizing it for the 2x2x2x.... wrong < 1291220632 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/ee95j/whats_the_most_internet_famous_thing_youve_done/c17guwl < 1291220633 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was visualizing 2 rows, and only 0 and 1 were digits in both numbers < 1291220716 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, why do it like that? < 1291220724 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I'm tired < 1291220734 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And wasn't thinking properly < 1291220759 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It still holds though < 1291220769 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moreover, the set of programs is logically equivalent to the set of subsets of the reals. < 1291220793 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only need to swing down to the second number once in fact to make the nonstored num... it occurs to me that that is a bit overkill < 1291220802 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the situation that I was envisioning < 1291220856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:12:27 Mathematica is like unto a God: < 1291220856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:12:28 In[1]:= Sum[1/(2^i), {i, 1, Infinity}] < 1291220856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:12:28 Out[1]= 1 < 1291220856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:13:12 yeah, but God got the answer by summing thw whole lot < 1291220856 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:13:37 F*ck knows how Chuck Norris got his answer. < 1291220857 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :15:14:03 Who knows how Mathematica did it; might be magic! < 1291220859 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie wolfram < 1291220914 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, ihope's suggestion is intriguing. < 1291220945 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, are the accessible cells restricted to those indexed by a CR? < 1291221045 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: No. < 1291221049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that I know of. < 1291221055 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://ideone.com/to8J2 < 1291221082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11:02 * SimonRC has worked out the definitive difference between scripting languages and "real" programming languages: in scripting languages, a simple string can be like 'foo' or "foo", but "real" languages only accept one of these (usually the former). < 1291221082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11:30 usually the altter < 1291221082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11:32 latter < 1291221082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11:43 erm, *latter < 1291221082 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11:50 yeah, thanks < 1291221085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :16:11:54 bah, real languages doesn't have strings... < 1291221088 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so it's unimplementable? < 1291221093 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: It's not a language. < 1291221126 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 09:23:05 Hmm, what about a language where the dimensions are finite, but the number of them is infinite? < 1291221139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1291221143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Why not ask him? < 1291221171 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When was he last seen? < 1291221210 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's on freenode as tswett < 1291221260 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't come here much < 1291221273 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not at the moment, and not that I can remember recently. < 1291221301 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...he's on the network now, says whois < 1291221311 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he just doesn't come to this channel < 1291221334 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: OH MY GOD I HATE GHEXTRIS < 1291221374 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hum. I wonder what made my computer crash the moment I plugged in my mouse. < 1291221396 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :works perfectly now, worked perfectly in my laptop today < 1291221420 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what's GHEXTRIS? < 1291221431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: sudo aptitude install ghextris < 1291221433 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It's 3:00:00 am. Go get some rest!" < 1291221437 0 :perdito!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291221445 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: brownout, I wonder? it could be there's an intermittent short circuit in the mouse and it browned out your computer when you plugged it in < 1291221452 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^What Newspeak's IDE will tell you at the bottom if it's open at that time < 1291221493 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, tetris on a hex grid? < 1291221512 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes. and oh dear god it is impossible < 1291221539 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION recalls playing hextris back in the day
< 1291221547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HEXAGONAL GEOMETRY MAKES NO SENSE < 1291221650 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She's now teaching the class hexadecimal < 1291221675 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, ...you didn't already know that? < 1291221679 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AT TWENTY-ONE. < 1291221687 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("You" in the plural form) < 1291221907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:19:08 * _wildhalcyon_ blames linux for Kevin Federline's career. < 1291222154 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: being taught hex doesn't mean you don't know it already < 1291222160 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just that someone wanted to teach it to you < 1291222169 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are some subjects I ended up learning over and over again < 1291222188 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :boolean algebra is one I remember, I was taught it at least twice and new it already before then < 1291222192 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*knew it already < 1291222192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*knew < 1291222194 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291222200 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... I want to revive ESO OS, now < 1291222204 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after reading this log < 1291222223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will feel accomplished if I can get enough of an interpreter into a bootsector that there's enough space left to write the actual bootloader in the esolang < 1291222225 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pretty much type by sound, for some reason, rather than by spelling < 1291222233 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I often have to go back and correct a word into one of its homophones < 1291222237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hooked on phonics eh < 1291222256 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: some interps would fit into a bootsector just fine < 1291222262 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MiniMAX, for instance, or many other OISCs < 1291222283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:36:47 (Of course there's _always_ a workaround: perhaps adding an evil library (to mangle the stdout in an __attribute__((constructor)) routine) to LD_PRELOAD might work, if stdout exists already when those are called.) < 1291222284 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aiee < 1291222298 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but you need to have enough space left in the boot sector to put the bootloader program in, written in the esolang < 1291222307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: can MiniMAX programs do "int 10h"? < 1291222330 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should google that, so I will < 1291222341 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I wrote a couple of extensions for that < 1291222356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: are they on the wiki? < 1291222365 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a 32-byte interp that could not only do arbitrary DOS system calls, but also return values from them to a jump table < 1291222371 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I never ran it and am not entirely sure if it works < 1291222373 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I hereby proclaim the OS to be the ESO OS, edition E < 1291222381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, that isn't quite a palindrome < 1291222385 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION videos elliott
< 1291222391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I hereby proclaim the OS to be the ESOS (ESO OS), edition E < 1291222392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ESOSE < 1291222411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: brownout, I wonder? it could be there's an intermittent short circuit in the mouse and it browned out your computer when you plugged it in <-- maybe < 1291222422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, how could I check this? < 1291222430 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OS ed. ESO < 1291222439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm... the problem is, I don't even fail vaguely like writing a minimax program :) < 1291222445 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I haven't put the extensions on the wiki, mostly because I'm not sure whether they work, and can no longer remember how they work < 1291222456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: maybe I'll base it on Underload < 1291222456 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: intermittent shorts aren't at all easy to check < 1291222466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow, extending Underload seems less awful than extending brainfuck < 1291222466 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and some methods of checking for them have a tendency to set things on fire < 1291222471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'm not sure how I'd do mutating a register < 1291222480 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I wouldn't want that < 1291222483 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291222486 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She's now talking about swapping variables with tempoary variables < 1291222489 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is Perl... < 1291222490 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's what happened to my shorting power supply, though < 1291222497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ($a, $b) = ($b, $a) < 1291222501 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: ($a, $b) = ($b, $a) < 1291222506 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how did you type that so quickly? < 1291222509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: *hi5* < 1291222512 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, we both missed the semicolon < 1291222514 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: because I type really quickly < 1291222519 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291222521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, don't need it if it's in {} :) < 1291222523 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Her response: "It depends on the language" < 1291222524 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, anyway it could be the computer. I very rarely hotplug anything except the mouse to my desktop < 1291222529 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is correct, obviously < 1291222531 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, is there any nice way to handle reals in Coq? < 1291222536 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I take it this is a USB mouse? < 1291222541 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, of course < 1291222541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: The non-computable reals? < 1291222550 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PS/2 mice aren't hotpluggable, and have been known to break motherboards when people try < 1291222556 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's a rather old technology < 1291222563 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :by now < 1291222570 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I'm aware. Which is why I would never hotplug this keyboard < 1291222573 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is PS/2) < 1291222578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: For any constructivist Coq work, including the computable reals, use http://c-corn.cs.ru.nl/. < 1291222578 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(serial mice are hotpluggable, but you have to be someone like me to ever have used one) < 1291222588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION read that as the hotpluggable reals
< 1291222589 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I have *heard* of them that is all < 1291222598 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I own one < 1291222603 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1291222603 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't used it in a while, though < 1291222611 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: I *think* the Reals section in http://coq.inria.fr/stdlib/ is non-constructive, by using axioms instead of constructions. < 1291222616 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, anyway this mouse is technically serial when you expand the abbrev. USB < 1291222616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: But C-CoRN is awesome. < 1291222623 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, I think I technically own three, but only one works nowadays < 1291222624 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Russell O'Connor runs it. < 1291222637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: any suggestions to someone feeling like extending underload? apart from "don't"? < 1291222651 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: remove the S statement and replace it with something more appropriate < 1291222659 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can compile it without having to keep the source around as well < 1291222663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i wasn't planning to support S anyway < 1291222667 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Underload's actually pretty extensible < 1291222684 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, now I'm wondering what an Underload interp in Forth would look like < 1291222689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I was thinking about adding a command % which takes one value off the stack and "interpcalls" it < 1291222690 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so some other way of output? Or just having the final program state as output? < 1291222697 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: no output < 1291222702 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just wondering how to do a minimal Underload interp, and what I thought up was very like the way Forth works < 1291222703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the value would be expected to be an underload church numeral < 1291222710 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm okay < 1291222730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so e.g. (::**)% would be "syscall 3", and the remaining things on the stack could be arguments < 1291222730 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: church numerals aren't massively space-efficient < 1291222739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, no, and this is also a rather boring extension < 1291222741 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah so a system call like mechanism? < 1291222745 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes < 1291222749 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more or less the best you could do would be along the lines of (:*:*:*:*:*)% for a high-numbered syscall < 1291222757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I just want to be able to read a floppy using the BIOS in an extended esolang :) < 1291222767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that I can write an interpreter/compiler for short enough to fit in a bootsector with enough space left to have the program there < 1291222770 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no more efficient representation of numbers in underlambda? < 1291222772 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1291222775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :underload < 1291222777 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm tired < 1291222781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: they both represent numbers the same way < 1291222785 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1291222802 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in underlambda, at least, where you don't have S to worry out, I'm assuming that most decent interps will recognise numbers and optimise them internally < 1291222804 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unload < 1291222808 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*worry about < 1291222819 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, but can there not be any general number representation that is more space efficient in underload? < 1291222823 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, there's really an underlambda? < 1291222838 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't recognise /all/ numbers as that's an uncomputable issue, but you can identify most common ways to construct them < 1291222838 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with general I mean "not special cased to a finite range" < 1291222844 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes, it's semi-vaporware < 1291222860 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://eurekamag.com/keyword/u/026/underlambda.php < 1291222881 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: hmm, I somehow doubt that's the meaning I use the word for < 1291222883 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION checks the link
< 1291222892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To differentiate their respective functions, oligonucleotide-directed site-specific mutagenesis was used to change the ATG start codon of the.vphi.X174 A* gene, previously cloned into pCQV2 under.lambda. Repressor control, into a TAG stop codon. The altered A* gene was then inserted back into.vphi.X replicative form DNA to produce an amber mutant,.vphi.XamA*. Two different Escherichia coli amber suppressor strains infected with this mutant produc < 1291222892 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ed viable progeny phage with only a slight reduction in yield. In Su+ cells infected with.vphi.XamA*,.vphi.X gene A protein, altered at one amino acid, was synthesized at normal levels; A* protein was not detectable. Prophage integration occurs at different chromosomal sites, including lacY and malB, but not at attB All.lambda.cam112 prophages are excised from the chromosome after induction but with various efficiencies for different locations. H < 1291222893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eteroduplex analysis of.lambda.placZ transducing phages isolated from a lacY::.lambda.cam112 prophage reveals an insertion sequence 1 element at the joint of viral and chromosomal DNA Two lines of evidence indicate that.lambda < 1291222897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolspam < 1291222916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hm what about compression? On very large church numerals you could presumably apply a compression algorithm to get a smaller one. (The usual caveats of compression applying here of course. You will get larger values sometimes) < 1291222918 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the word doesn't appear anywhere there but the title < 1291222939 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, under.lambda < 1291222942 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: :*:*:*:*-style compression isn't /that/ bad, really, it's O(log n) < 1291222954 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you could obviously convert a church numeral to some binary representation < 1291222968 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, Underlambda was the proof-by-isomorphism language, wasn't it? < 1291222976 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: yep < 1291223011 0 :tswett!~Warrigal@arch06.cis.gvsu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1291223017 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh oh, what did Phantom_Hoover_ do. < 1291223023 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or maybe tswett reads logs compulsively.) < 1291223040 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I receive an SMS every time someone says something in this channel. < 1291223042 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION whistles innocently.
< 1291223046 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: you could obviously convert a church numeral to some binary representation <-- well yes < 1291223054 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They cost me 25 cents apiece, so you'd better not say anything unless it's important. < 1291223060 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, but I meant in underload as the source is written < 1291223061 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: O KAY < 1291223070 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: that is probably a bad idea < 1291223099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think ais523 has a broken joke lobe < 1291223103 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Uh oh, what did Phantom_Hoover_ do. (Or maybe tswett reads logs compulsively.) <-- there is some context missing here? < 1291223113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes, it's called read your damn scrollback :) < 1291223130 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, my scrollback goes back to when I joined after the crash half an hour ago < 1291223138 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: my typical reaction to identifying jokes is to act like they're serious and try to drive the conversation into the absurd < 1291223147 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately, this means I act much the same way whether I miss a joke or not < 1291223149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you could do it more interestingly :) < 1291223163 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: well that :*:*:* style _is_ essentially binary, adding :* multiplies a number by 2 < 1291223170 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, hm I actually do the same sometimes. < 1291223176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: you're lucky, this is the first time we've talked about esolangs in months < 1291223176 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is fun < 1291223187 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hm okay < 1291223197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:49:05 I love how devfs survived for like a year :-P < 1291223197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:49:34 yeah, what was wrong with it? worked for me < 1291223197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:50:04 I really don't know. < 1291223197 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:50:08 Always worked great for me. < 1291223199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not object XML enough. < 1291223204 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's what I was thinking; it has *2 and +1 operations < 1291223206 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Is devfs in the newest kernels?) < 1291223210 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, no, it isn't. < 1291223212 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a sort of generalised binary that allows arbitrary digits < 1291223217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Removed in 2.6.13; glorious ... < 1291223217 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't think udev uses XML? < 1291223224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, but it might as well. :) < 1291223226 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and adding 1 is putting : and * _around_ the number, isn't it? < 1291223248 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no xml would be worse < 1291223269 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm saying that it's so overcomplex that making it use XML would hardly change a thing. < 1291223269 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :She wants us to install MySQL Query Browser < 1291223278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I will see if devfs works on current kernels. < 1291223287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just use static /dev like I was planning to. < 1291223295 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there is that other one there was some talk about. Don't remember details < 1291223312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if devtmpfs can work without udev. < 1291223338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, anyway, why do you want to move stuff into a monolithic kernel? < 1291223355 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: udev would be no better if it was in the kernel < 1291223368 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you seen /etc/udev? < 1291223372 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I have < 1291223381 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is overcomplicated yes to some degree. < 1291223383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. when was the last time you were using devfs and thought -- < 1291223388 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I wish I could rename my hard drive device file." < 1291223404 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but then I doubt devfs allowed you to run a script that loaded joystick calibration values when it was connected < 1291223410 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm all for flexibility, it's just that when you add too much flexibility and try and modularise *Unix*, everything fucks up. < 1291223420 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fair point < 1291223431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See Hurd for the extreme of this. < 1291223437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291223465 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://lwn.net/Articles/330985/ Yay -- devtmpfs looks like a proper devfs. < 1291223470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"/dev will be fully populated and dynamic, and always reflect the current < 1291223470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :device state of the kernel." < 1291223482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And apparently it makes init=/bin/sh work perfectly. < 1291223492 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THINGS THAT ANNOY ME: people who equate "real" with "floating point". < 1291223502 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See: Fortran, Pascal. < 1291223529 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hm that is nice < 1291223593 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, things that annoy me: people who seem to take fortran or pascal seriously today. < 1291223596 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;P < 1291223620 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it's a symptom of a greater evil! < 1291223622 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Removed /home (sorry!)" -- now that's interesting. < 1291223628 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what? < 1291223633 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, from where? < 1291223638 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That of putting a stupid amount of store with floating point! < 1291223639 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what it says on the latest blog post. < 1291223645 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, blog post of? < 1291223647 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Blog post of? < 1291223649 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://notch.tumblr.com/ < 1291223650 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, echo < 1291223654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god. < 1291223660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I refuse to update. < 1291223665 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? it removed /home? < 1291223666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where? < 1291223667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1291223670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Newest update. < 1291223676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back up .minecraft now, y'allz. < 1291223687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ cp -R .minecraft .minecraft_has_home_for_fucks_sake < 1291223698 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291223699 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see if it's going to force me to upgrade! < 1291223700 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh not /home on the fs < 1291223703 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be a server-side change, though. I don't quite know how commands work. < 1291223718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HAHAHAHA FORCED UPGRADE < 1291223725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK YOU NOTCH < 1291223727 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would it remove /home < 1291223732 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because notch sucks < 1291223739 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also it says server upgrade is not mandatory < 1291223743 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl food < 1291223755 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but also that there is a "rather bad memory leak bug in the server". < 1291223770 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Instead of updating, why not try restarting the server every now and then? < 1291223773 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, look, I died before quitting. < 1291223775 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does rm -rf / actually do? < 1291223783 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remove the inode for /? < 1291223954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Recursively remove everything in /, duh. < 1291223959 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or refuse to, if it's GNU rm. < 1291223967 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://imgur.com/gseyK.png http://imgur.com/ZZWCa.png http://imgur.com/xqBXT.png < 1291223970 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Stop that, it's silley. < 1291224003 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what happens after it finishes? < 1291224006 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A daily stone-bath does wonders for your textures. < 1291224010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Um, bad things. < 1291224167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: http://imgur.com/tzQ07.png http://imgur.com/1wqWD.png < 1291224198 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are my feet sticking out through the bridge? < 1291224202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes. < 1291224307 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Banana_Scheme <<< erm, so, what's banana scheme? < 1291224345 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hey i invented a new language called X, the language called Y is defined as follows" < 1291224360 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: they are the Banana Schemes, collectively < 1291224364 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's terminology from some irc log, see talk page < 1291224366 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1291224390 0 :Slereah!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIME TRAVEL < 1291224703 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: You breakin'? < 1291224722 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Breakin' what? < 1291224728 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Minecrafty. < 1291224766 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Have you been putting those extra steps on the skyway? < 1291224777 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I need a break. Also, this torrent is doing awful things to my connection. < 1291224782 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that was Vorpal. < 1291224791 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Has he realised that you need three, not one? < 1291224793 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also that it's ugly? < 1291224824 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Three what's? < 1291224827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Steps. < 1291224832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To make a barrier. < 1291224912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://politics.usnews.com/usnews/php/galleries/image.php/162/46/46.jpg < 1291224913 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did some of the widening too. < 1291224935 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that was /almost/ funny < 1291224942 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, it's already easier to walk like that, I don't really see why you'd need an actual barrier around. < 1291225062 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*whats < 1291225081 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Nobody ever told me you could ascend water without drowning! < 1291225104 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can. < 1291225111 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There, now you've been told. < 1291225124 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : And that was Vorpal. < 1291225126 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1291225131 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizze < 1291225147 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"My home is like a 20 minute walk from spawn!!!!!!!!" "Isn't that what portals help you with." yeah cuz portals work in MP < 1291225202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey. < 1291225203 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just realised. < 1291225207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Getting stuck in stone is now unfixable. < 1291225213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are stuck there. Forever. Until the server /tps you out. < 1291225232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You guys are missing the point. /home was not a feature implemented by Notch. Therefor he doesn't want it implemented. Like bureau.nic says, Perhaps it causes a huge bug in the code. Either way, notch has been coding and developing for a VERY long time. If he removes a feature that he knows people love (obvious he does or he wouldn't have said sorry) I'm sure he knows best and has a damn good reason for it. It IS his code game after all. So, why < 1291225232 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : don't you sit down like a good alpha tester, and play the game like it's meant to be played." < 1291225234 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly you're supposed to suffocate, but I guess you still could easily get stuck. < 1291225240 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1291225243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Notch KNOWS BEST" < 1291225256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: He added code to suffocate rather than fixing the bug? Srsly? < 1291225266 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, you have to lose your inventory because of a bug? Niice. < 1291225288 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I think you've always supposed to have been suffocated if you ended up inside a non-air block somehow. < 1291225293 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, what's all these comments talking about /spawn? Our server seems not to have that. < 1291225307 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the key is to not get stuck in a mine. thats the point of the game." < 1291225310 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, thanks for that! < 1291225377 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the "play the game like it's meant to be played" comment. I suppose same sort of reasoning could be used to logicalize why any sort of unauthorized modding is ethically worng. < 1291225405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"How could a player teleportation command cause bugs or issues? If it did, why weren't the others removed?" < 1291225408 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"idk ibm. Are you a programmer? Maybe learn a bit about that before you ask ignorant questions." < 1291225412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a programmer, #2 is full of shit. < 1291225437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: why is everyone acting like /spawn does something, it doesn't for me < 1291225454 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know, I've been wondering about spawn-point-setting too. < 1291225475 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, incidentally. < 1291225484 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems that hMod already has a "enable-health" server option. < 1291225499 0 :nopseudoidea!~nopseudoi@85-168-235-235.rev.numericable.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1291225532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, but does disabling it work? < 1291225537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If so: ineiros: HMOD LOL < 1291225541 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, according to some comments, yes. < 1291225545 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know. < 1291225570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Now tell me what the heck /spawn is meant to do >_< < 1291225572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does nothing! < 1291225636 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wiki.hey0.net/index.php/Commands#.2Fspawn maybe? < 1291225640 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That's the hMod command list.) < 1291225644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We are not implementing anything crazy here like devfs did, including the later versions - there is no modprobe behind your back, no lookup hooks, no stupid new naming scheme, no new filesystem type to register." < 1291225664 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Nice... so people are saying "just use /spawn!" when mods are meant to be BADHORRIBLE according to Notch. < 1291225673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hMod does seem rather nice. < 1291225683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, it has support for "kits". < 1291225684 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On "paper", anyway. < 1291225686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/kit diamondtools < 1291225696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool, you can set your own /home. < 1291225701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Totally requestin' hMod < 1291225742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sievers outlines the differences between devtmpfs and Adam Richter's proposal from 2003. It mostly boils down to complexity; devtmpfs is a much simpler scheme, which really adds very little to the kernel. The implementation is around 300 lines of code, in comparison to roughly 3600 for devfs and 600 for an early version of Richter's mini-devfs." < 1291225743 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait WHAT < 1291225748 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notch removed /home? < 1291225753 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bastard! < 1291225776 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So the patch notes say; we haven't actually tried out the new server version yet. < 1291225794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And we're not going to! Well, not without hMod yet. On pain of ineiros being murdered. < 1291225816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Also, I love the idea that there can be a "proper" way to play a sandbox game. < 1291225890 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Phantom_Hoover_: Has he realised that you need three, not one? <-- first it was fizzie who made it like that. Second 3 is wide enough to walk on without barrier with minimal risk of falling off < 1291225958 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, link?? < 1291225969 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: http://notch.tumblr.com/ < 1291225974 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Shouldn't you know that address already? < 1291226073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: Nice... so people are saying "just use /spawn!" when mods are meant to be BADHORRIBLE according to Notch. < 1291226074 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1291226081 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that only applies to client mods iirc < 1291226094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt he approves of deobfuscating, modifying, reobfuscating and then distributing the server code. < 1291226101 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what I remember he said that since you don't need to pay for server anyway he minds much less for server mods < 1291226129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Forge seems to be working in SMP now, aside from the animation. Also, is health supposed to regenerate? If so, is there a setting?" < 1291226130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"turning off monsters currently sets the server to peaceful mode. It will be an option." < 1291226132 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, iirc he said that quite a bit of the code is shared between client and server (which seems sensible) < 1291226136 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about making it an option before breaking it... < 1291226146 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, but he's still too stupid to make singleplayer = connect to local server. < 1291226168 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: @notch Why did you remove the /home command? Bugs? < 1291226169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@PHLAK it's not supposed to be there! < 1291226171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr it's not coming back < 1291226179 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I wouldn't be able to play single player then since then it would be far above the memory available on here < 1291226183 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty impressive if two lines is tl;dr. < 1291226192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Indeed. < 1291226202 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That's just because the server code sucks. < 1291226219 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, possibly. Go implement your own one? < 1291226229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Others already are. < 1291226233 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway I don't feel like figuring out the protocol. < 1291226236 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's probably braindead. < 1291226241 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, complaining here doesn't really give any result :P < 1291226255 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The damn comment page won't load for me... < 1291226269 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not just figuring it out, it seems to be a moving target. < 1291226275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL: http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/12/01/the-minecraft-experiment-day-7-when-you-are-engulfed-in-flames/ < 1291226282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hilarious. < 1291226307 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"/home was basically a way to get yourself out of impossible places, but now that you can kill yourself more easily, it's purpose has been fulfilled. Maybe he'll bring it back in another way." < 1291226318 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(From the comments.) < 1291226332 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, but he clearly won't since it seems it wasn't "meant" to be in there. < 1291226335 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe he only noticed now. < 1291226352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I ignored the game entirely when it was a purely creative toy – yeah, yeah, people made amazing stuff. I’m amazed. I’ve been amazed so often now that I’m in a permanent state of maze, and it would take someone building a working time machine in Zuma Deluxe to un- and subsequently re-maze me. But when it added a health bar, suddenly I was interested. I can die? I love to die! I’m there." < 1291226381 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think the idea is that it's basically doing an end-run around the "difficulty" of the game < 1291226391 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine adding a /home command to a typical roguelike < 1291226394 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :instant escape item! < 1291226410 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That guy's Galactic Civilisation II playthroughs have to be seen to be believed. < 1291226417 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, indeed < 1291226422 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but we don't play it as survival < 1291226424 0 :atrapado!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Abandonando < 1291226426 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from maybe Vorpal but nobody cares about him < 1291226437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we're essentially playing it as creative, but with minecarts and circuits and all that fun modern stuff < 1291226446 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't really either indeed < 1291226451 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You're playing it wrong! < 1291226456 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: which worked, right up until notch decided that making it into survival like it's meant to be without even adding switches to turn it back into peaceful was a good idea < 1291226460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: which is, of course, rather insulting. < 1291226460 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well, Creative mode will be implemented for the current version at /some/ point. < 1291226470 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: (it would not be as bad if updates weren't automatic and involuntary, and you couldn't connect to old servers) < 1291226479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yeah... at /some/ point. Just like adventure mode. < 1291226482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/home isn't coming back though. < 1291226490 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And /home is damn useful if you're not playing to survive and just want to explore and create. < 1291226494 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, we can survive without /home < 1291226502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I can survive without Minecraft too. < 1291226506 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not can, it's want. < 1291226511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1291226522 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hMod seems nice anyway. < 1291226527 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has those kits, which are like automated multi-/gives. < 1291226538 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can set a personal home that you can teleport to. < 1291226540 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As well as spawn point. < 1291226552 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ops can set arbitrary predefined teleportation points. < 1291226558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can disable health. :p < 1291226573 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems nice yes < 1291226587 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, connection refused? < 1291226598 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It said on the blog it was an optional server upgrade < 1291226627 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it crashed because of all the memory leaks. :p < 1291226635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been down for a lil' while. < 1291226637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was up earlier though. < 1291226649 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291226660 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't seem that hMod has yet been updated to 0.2.7, but it's probably just a matter of (short) time. < 1291226677 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the remember server bit fails < 1291226682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can write plugins for it! < 1291226683 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Endless fun! < 1291226685 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since it doesn't remember port number < 1291226686 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it drops the port number. < 1291226695 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, it doesn't in the config < 1291226696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros can finally have his /donateacreeperto. < 1291226701 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Protip: < 1291226704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put the server in, click cancel. < 1291226707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will remember the port forevermore. < 1291226711 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least it did for me... < 1291226716 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no it won't after restarting the client < 1291226723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What, Minecraft just updated again I think. (Did it?) < 1291226725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh. < 1291226729 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the config is: key: which means key:value:port < 1291226737 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which I guess is why it fails to parse it properly < 1291226737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...fail. < 1291226740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it writes the right thing < 1291226753 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm? < 1291226766 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is a sane config format. But with xml it wouldn't have failed :P < 1291226776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"When dawn finally does break, I climb out of my awkward hole and look around. There’s something different about this mountain today. I don’t know if it’s the grass, the earth, the rocks, the walking pillars of flame – hm, were there walking pillars of flame yesterday?" < 1291226776 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, connection failure to your server < 1291226792 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, it simply times out < 1291226825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Hi. Please install hMod at your earliest convenience. Not only can we set a "home" point to teleport to as well as teleporting to spawn point -- the newest server update just removed /home -- but you can create "kits" like diamondtools that people can award themselves willynilly; you can also disable health. < 1291226829 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, apparently not a voluntary update, this. < 1291226830 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-12-01 19:52:39 [SEVERE] Unexpected exception < 1291226832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Oh, and you can set arbitrary named spawn points as an op. < 1291226834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is voluntary. < 1291226837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the old server has a memory leak. < 1291226841 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you ran out of memory. < 1291226844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Anyway, see above :P < 1291226852 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what was the name of that blog again? < 1291226854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hMod doesn't run on the newest server yet, but "only a matter of time". < 1291226863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: towardsdawns.blogspot.com; but I'm not quoting from that. < 1291226871 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh where was it from then? < 1291226885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.pcgamer.com/2010/11/20/the-minecraft-experiment-day-1-chasing-waterfalls/ < 1291226885 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, it's Tom Francis' playthrough. < 1291226889 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: In which he deletes his world whenever he dies. < 1291226891 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Hilarious. < 1291226891 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, account of playing. < 1291226916 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also worth reading: both his Galactic Civilisations II playthroughs. < 1291226924 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even *more* hilarious, and epic. < 1291226952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In landscape gardening – bear with me here – this is called a ha-ha. A drop that acts like a wall in one direction, but is almost invisible to the fops and dandies sipping tea on their manicured lawn above. I mention this in part to explain why I thought it would be a good idea to stand on top of it, laughing at the creatures and punching them in the face." < 1291226954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They're creepers.) < 1291226974 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1291226974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://media.pcgamer.com/files/2010/11/Minecraft-Diary-Creeper-Tail-Closest.jpg AAAAAAAAAAAAAAH < 1291227028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I know this seems slow to you, but I’m pretty sure it took the human race longer than this to invent tools, and I’m probably going to discover fire before teatime." < 1291227044 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=161570&site=pcg < 1291227060 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[ I couldn't do it. The Spectres bow to no-one, plea for no quarter. Engraved on the seal at the base of a mile-high statue of their leader, Paul Davies Mutilator of Worldsblood, are the words "Bring it the fuck on." In Latin.]] < 1291227062 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The "Painterly" texpack's default moon has three crater-looking creeper faces on it. < 1291227070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ;_; < 1291227087 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mossy cobblestones have creeper larvae on them. < 1291227094 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: STOP IT STOP IT STOP IT STOP IT < 1291227112 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, read the GCII playthroughs! < 1291227117 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No this is better. < 1291227128 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"At some point my staircase hits an earthy patch, and I can hear running water. An underground river! The best thing possible!" < 1291227131 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read that, then those! < 1291227167 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It turns out I already have metal, about 16 blocks of it – it’s those lumps of Caramac I’ve been finding in the stone. I thought it might be, but I couldn’t figure out a way to turn them into something I can craft with." < 1291227172 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting way to describe Caramac. < 1291227214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"As soon as I do, I strike legs. A rich vein of purest legs. I wasn’t mining for legs, I am not trained in leg extraction, but legs I have found. In quantity." < 1291227235 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, "legs"? < 1291227253 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: RTFLog :P < 1291227258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Zombies) < 1291227262 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh < 1291227269 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, still down? < 1291227276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: HOLY SHIT IS THE SERVER ODWON; < 1291227282 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :odwon, the purest state of being. < 1291227297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I don’t know if reaching through zombie legs to loot treasure chests is dangerous, but it feels dangerous." < 1291227303 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm "I will start looking at server-side inventory soon in an attempt to reach beta soon." < 1291227305 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that scares me < 1291227305 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-12-01 20:14:29 [INFO] Connected players: fizzief, ehird < 1291227309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where are the inventories now < 1291227319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Eggs! For that souffle I’ve always dreamed of! < 1291227320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gunpowder! For that gunpowder souffle I’ve always dreamed of!" < 1291227324 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: IN YOUR MIND < 1291227327 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, it fails to connect to it still. < 1291227334 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. I'll restart. < 1291227342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"When I stop dancing, I get back to digging my tunnel. And before long, I hit another type of block I’ve never seen before. I have a split second to identify it as ‘lava’ before it floods into my face." < 1291227353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: SO WILL YOU USE HMOD :| < 1291227354 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With capitals. < 1291227378 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hmod hasn't been upgraded yet (at least fizzie said that above) < 1291227387 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but *will* he. < 1291227389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, the future. < 1291227390 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and I doubt he would want the mem leak < 1291227393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but *will* he. < 1291227394 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, the future. < 1291227401 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed that is the question < 1291227460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://kerneltrap.org/node/4893 < 1291227464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I make a single boot+root floppy disk in minix file format and lilo boot loader." --2005 < 1291227495 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1291227505 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, restarting it sure is slow < 1291227518 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You should've paid for a better SLA. < 1291227537 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, indeed :P < 1291227544 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291227553 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I blame notch not ineiros for this though < 1291227571 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: So, have you ever written an actual minimax program? < 1291227604 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean as in the minmax algorithm for game solving? < 1291227613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. No I do not. < 1291227617 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Sorry, I'm rebooting the whole server, since I've avoided that for a few kernel updates already. < 1291227622 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, ah < 1291227630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Is it running on Kitten? < 1291227631 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then what? < 1291227636 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: JFEsolangsI < 1291227639 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah < 1291227652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: where would he have downloaded kitten? < 1291227654 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: So yay or nay for hMod? :p < 1291227656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: My mind. < 1291227666 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, interesting < 1291227741 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'll look into it when I have time. Definite maybe. :) < 1291227762 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: You do realise it's just a few .classes to replace? :p < 1291227763 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But yay. < 1291227773 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like this flashlight. LED, 60 lumen, made of Aluminium. Feels very solid and durable. And still compact (just two AAA batteries) < 1291227797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Hmm, in fact, it's a batch file that downloads the server and does its magic. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. < 1291227808 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not ported yet < 1291227808 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: Oh, there's an .sh too. < 1291227812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I KNOW GOD DAMMIT < 1291227819 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: And it supports MYSQL! Note: Don't use MySQL. < 1291227840 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, out of morbid curiosity: what does it use mysql for? < 1291227852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You can make it use MySQL as opposed to flatfiles. < 1291227855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably that's quicker. < 1291227867 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, for the game world? < 1291227883 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prseumably. < 1291227885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Presumably. < 1291227885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291227886 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps not. < 1291227895 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would guess just the hMod-specific warp-points and kits and such. < 1291227902 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291227918 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, MySQL is A Bad Thing, then? < 1291227920 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ban lists, whatevers. < 1291227927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_: Yes. < 1291227933 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, well duh < 1291227933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is not an uncommon position :P < 1291227943 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also oracle now. Even worse < 1291227957 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Vorpal, I never knew... < 1291227959 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, rebooting atm? < 1291227964 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, or what point is it at < 1291227965 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh shut up < 1291227973 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S DONE WHEN HE SAYS IT'S DONE < 1291227974 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, just wondering how far it got < 1291227988 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try now. < 1291228007 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"IRC <--> Minecraft chat relay and advanced administration bot". The most sensible thing evar. (Perusing the hMod plugin list.) < 1291228075 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I would like that, just to annoy people who are playing. < 1291228102 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, are you logged in atm? Or do we get ghosts of logged in people now? < 1291228117 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since dwarf in there just stands around doing nothing < 1291228237 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[All other secondary schools (23 in total) will be open for 4th-6th year pupils tomorrow]] < 1291228247 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Forth Road Bridge closed due to snow today. < 1291228252 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has never done this before. < 1291228258 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is as stupid as hell. < 1291228272 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S FOR YOUR EDUMCACAITNO < 1291228399 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's because we have a poseur and idiot for a First Minister. < 1291228407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ineiros: Vorpal: I am on fire near the spawnpoint. I refuse to stop being on fire. < 1291228425 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay? < 1291228439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aww, Connection lost < 1291228441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :End of stream < 1291228655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I suicide-fired. < 1291228657 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus the ALLAH. < 1291228663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION tasteful
< 1291228663 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291228694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: 14:53:14 * GregorR-W doesn't even know what tldr means :P < 1291228694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:53:51 heh, I had to look that one up too < 1291228694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:54:36 Too Long Didn't Read? < 1291228694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14:54:38 XD < 1291228832 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay destroying the world whenever you die sounds like an awesome idea < 1291228892 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean say in a mmorpg, there could be an infinite amount of worlds, and when you die in one, you're forever blocked from reentering it < 1291228913 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your friends could all kill themselves to join you in the new world, but < 1291228947 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1291228950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Vorpal: Phantom_Hoover_: http://imgur.com/IwLKB.png < 1291228988 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291228993 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291229026 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, everyone seen that < 1291229030 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not as foggy though < 1291229036 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, do you use tiny or short distance? < 1291229042 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Short. < 1291229049 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have more impressive ones: < 1291229051 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291229057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I seen such on far before < 1291229062 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it is nothing new < 1291229069 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: That was looking *downwards on top of the sea*. < 1291229087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I been on top of holes with seeing caverns below too < 1291229090 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imgur.com/L6ouQ.png http://imgur.com/WZqgE.png http://imgur.com/vkQoS.png These are really nice. < 1291229161 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, I been on top of holes with seeing caverns below too < 1291229227 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@137.125.180.96 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291229257 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say that in a deep Southern accent for great hilarity. < 1291229288 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291229384 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, Sgeo. Have any liaisons with Newspeak planned for tonight? < 1291229434 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I plan on actually trying to write something < 1291229448 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Saucy. < 1291229463 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't it a little early in your relationship? < 1291229466 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :think about it, really the only thing mankind is lacking in games is true fear of death < 1291229491 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll probably abandon it in 3 days like you did with Smalltalk, Factor, Scala, ... < 1291229505 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did I abandon Factor in 3 days? < 1291229509 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah Sgeo you're a real fuckface and everyone hates you < 1291229509 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Smalltalk? < 1291229532 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is just trying to be popular
< 1291229588 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, let's see if I can avoid doing the same with real relationships < 1291229606 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :abandoning people in 3 days that is < 1291229607 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1291229617 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't... think I would < 1291229644 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suuuuure. < 1291229654 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you haven't abandoned me yet < 1291229661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: he never truly loved you < 1291229663 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we've been in an ircual relationship for years < 1291229670 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: http://wiki.nexua.org/Plugin:iStick wat < 1291229680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: well it's well known that Sgeo is extremely gay of course < 1291229682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and loves Finns < 1291229684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i didn't expect this < 1291229699 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's nothing gay about true online friendship < 1291229733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok: indeed; there's nothing faggy about a deep loving relationship with another man! < 1291229773 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1291229780 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, gah < 1291229794 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just realized newborns would probably be rather homicidal < 1291229801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote i just realized newborns would probably be rather homicidal < 1291229817 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :context being the mmorph with death < 1291229817 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ended up in stone thanks to the issue, had to /home < 1291229820 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well < 1291229826 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*mmorpg < 1291229826 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1291229829 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and just after I saw spawn I timed out < 1291229853 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1291229876 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, I noticed a pattern in your connection issues: off peak hours there are fewer drops. If fewer are playing there are fewer drops < 1291229878 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ended up somewhere underground too. < 1291229881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"@notch instead of being an ass why don't you downgrade the server so we can play on smp you jeesh we're not your fing beta testers" < 1291229883 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft is buggier than AW. [Yes, I know that that's not saying anything at all] < 1291229884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"@warlordv1 actually, you're alpha testers.." < 1291229888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, maybe it is related to traffic? < 1291229893 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291229923 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo, PLEASE tell me that was self-irony. < 1291229938 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, down for quite some time now < 1291229956 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note the subtle mockery of Vorpal) < 1291229976 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I never said anything like that < 1291229977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even more subtle when you point it out. < 1291230022 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I remembered too late that Vorpal is about as subtle as a brick. < 1291230040 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And has the memory of a BBC Micro. < 1291230056 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: aren't you going to stand up for the Micro?! < 1291230057 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I don't believe in subtlety < 1291230100 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, come now, it was hardly the Memory Man. < 1291230112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But ais523 grew up on it! < 1291230114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's actually a BASIC program. < 1291230161 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen photos of ais523. < 1291230170 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah -- he's quite the pixel painter. < 1291230183 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He has a BEARD. < 1291230187 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION looks on his Wikipedia page.
< 1291230189 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is RIDICULOUS. < 1291230198 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, he no longer has a Wikipedia page. < 1291230210 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 is now a redirect to "Wolfram's 2-state 3-symbol Turing machine". < 1291230215 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it is. < 1291230216 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How sad. < 1291230216 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291230220 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, why is it ridiculous? < 1291230233 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikisnubbed. < 1291230242 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, why is the beard insane? < 1291230247 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or ridiculous < 1291230262 0 :cal153!~cal@70.36.237.178 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291230286 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I mean, who doesn't have a beard... < 1291230294 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291230294 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.wolframscience.com/prizes/tm23/images/alex_smith_wolfram_turing.jpg < 1291230295 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, in all his beardy ridiculousness. < 1291230310 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, most women, I hear. < 1291230320 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa, he has a beard. < 1291230321 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, okay in the subset men < 1291230329 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I don't see why it is strange that he has a beard < 1291230335 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or why it is ridiculous < 1291230340 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to refer to ais523 as Wolfram's 2-state 3-symbol Turing machine today. < 1291230346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1291230346 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, for some reason the photo reminds me of a soccer player. < 1291230347 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1291230349 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/today/from now on/ < 1291230355 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, could you please enlighten me why the beard is ridiculous? < 1291230392 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, Vorpal, fizzie, Phantom_Hoover_: Are you able to log in now? < 1291230396 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm going to have to wait for wolfram's 2-state 3-symbol Turing machine to return before the fun begins. < 1291230407 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, trying again < 1291230411 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, no < 1291230415 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, look at it and use your goddamn in-built ridiculousness sensor. < 1291230419 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, just times out < 1291230421 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, the one you get from being human. < 1291230429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's not human < 1291230432 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Since "wolfram's 3-state 3-symbol Turing machine" is so long, every time I type "wolfram's 3state 3-sombol Turing machine" incorrectly, I'm going to replicate the typo from then on so that it will get shorter.) < 1291230438 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, I have a beard too. Not the same model < 1291230451 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION stops saying stuff that doesn't contribute to the conversation at all.
< 1291230453 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still it looks perfectly normal < 1291230485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Flark. < 1291230501 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Greem zob? < 1291230532 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I don't really want to think about how ridiculous you look full stop. < 1291230555 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, there is NOTHING silly or ridiculous with how ais523 looks on that photo < 1291230579 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LEAVE AIS ALONE! < 1291230599 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: i note you already introduced a typo < 1291230623 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or two, even < 1291230629 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Three. < 1291230644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover_, well it was you who criticised him in the first place so that seems a bit hypocritical to say. < 1291230652 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, still timeout < 1291230652 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I typo "wolfram's 3state 3-sombol Turing machine" every time I type "wolfram's 3state 30-sombol Turing machine". Except not one of those times. < 1291230663 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It got longer. I'm going to throw out typos that make it longer. < 1291230680 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett is hill-climbing towards the empty string. < 1291230684 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett, sombol? < 1291230746 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, downess is still a property exhibted by the server < 1291230792 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that poor, dow server < 1291230814 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Department of What? < 1291230826 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1291230854 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: By the way, Vorpal is AnMaster if you've been gone long enough not to know that. < 1291230869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I'm not going to tell you who I am because it's bloody obvious. < 1291230899 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know him from before < 1291230907 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1291230917 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very forgettable guy, Vorpal < 1291230918 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291230919 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, you do. < 1291230926 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes I checked whois after < 1291230928 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1291230930 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, before that I didn't < 1291230940 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, reading failure < 1291230960 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah unfortunately nobody can ever forget Vorpal. < 1291230978 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he vorps into your mind < 1291230999 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, haha < 1291231077 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, anyway: very much down < 1291231081 0 :cheater99!~cheater@g231050193.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1291231451 0 :Sasha2_!~WHAT@75-174-218-84.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291231453 0 :nopseudoidea!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Quitte < 1291231485 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal is AnMaster. You're Mr. Hird. < 1291231496 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or do you have a different title now? < 1291231548 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Supreme Dictator Hird < 1291231566 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291231580 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wolmfra's 3state 3-synmob Turing machine. womfra's 3state 3-symbon Turing machine. womfra's 2state 30synbom Truing machine. womfra's 3state 20symobn Truing machine. < 1291231663 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wombat's 3-stack 20-sylph Turning machete. < 1291231740 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett, what about "W.'s 2,3-TM"? or such < 1291231818 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Mrs. Hird < 1291231932 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :womfra's 3state 29synb Truying macihemn. womfra's 3state 29smb Truing maicne. womfr'as 3state 29mws Truign amicne. womfr'as 2state 29mws Truign amicne. womfra's 2state 29mwd Truign acmien. < 1291231948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to make an esolang called "womfra's 2state 29mwd Truign acmien". < 1291231994 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :womfra's state 29mswd Trign amcien. womfra's state 29mws Tirng amcien. womfr'as state 29mws Tirng amcien. womfra's state 29sms Tirng amcien. womra's state 29sms Ting amcien. wom's state 29sms Ting amcien. woms' state 219sms Ting amcien. < 1291231995 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will be a fncutonal language < 1291232002 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's getting there. < 1291232058 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woms' state 2s9sms Ting amcien. wom's state 29sms Ting amcien. woms' state 29sms Ting amcien. woms' state 29sms Ting amcien. woms' state 29sms Ting amcien. woms's tate 29sms Ting amcien. woms' tate 29sms Ting amcien. woms' tate 29sms Ting amcien. woms' tate 29sms ting amcine. < 1291232082 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also I don't think it is hill climbing. It seems more like simulated annealing. < 1291232111 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: T' = mutate(T); if (fit(T') > fit(T)) T = T'; repeat < 1291232121 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome' state 29sms ting amcine. wome' tate 29sms ting amcine. wome' stst 29sms ting amcine. wome stst 29sms ting amcine. wome stst 29sms ting amcine. wome stt 29sms ting ancine. wome stt 29sms ting ancine. wome stt 29mss ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. < 1291232127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In this case, fit(s) = -length(s) and mutate(s) = try and write s carelessly. < 1291232127 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes but does he check all the neighbours in each step? < 1291232127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No? < 1291232133 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh shaddup. :p < 1291232183 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, thus the closer fit to simulated annealing. With a slow temperature change < 1291232187 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when in wome, do as the womans < 1291232194 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think hill-climbing in general means you'd check all neighbours. < 1291232207 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In simple hill climbing, the first closer node is chosen, whereas in steepest ascent hill climbing all successors are compared and the closest to the solution is chosen." < 1291232214 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, it's the first alternative there. < 1291232232 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdmd ting ancine. wome stt 29emje ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome xstt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stff 29dndd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. < 1291232237 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh I didn't know about "simple hill climbing" I only heard about the second one < 1291232239 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's pretty much stabilized now. < 1291232251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome stt 29 mdd thing machine. < 1291232256 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome stt 2w9mdd ting acine. < 1291232257 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome stt 28tingachine < 1291232263 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woms tt 2wm89dnd ting acin < 1291232268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woms tt w2mws989dnd ting aicn < 1291232271 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wms tti 2m89dnd ting acni < 1291232274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome tt 28 thingachine < 1291232277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wms tti 28jndmndnd ting acin]# < 1291232283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wms tti28m89dns tninag gnc < 1291232284 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome th2 thingachine < 1291232296 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wom th 2 thinaghine < 1291232299 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Try "wms tti 2m89dnd ting acni"; that's the shortest I've got so far. < 1291232304 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wom th2 thinachine < 1291232305 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Shortening that middle block will be hard. < 1291232309 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wom th2 thingachine < 1291232320 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wom th2 thingchine < 1291232326 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wom th2 thingchine < 1291232328 0 :Phantom_Hoover_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Phantom_Hoover < 1291232330 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah stabilised < 1291232347 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome stt 29mdd ting ancine. wome stt 29mdd tinvg acine. wome stt 29mdd ting acine. wome stt 29mdd ting acine. wome stt 2mdd ting acine. wome stt 29mdd ting acine. wome stt 2mdd ting acine. wome stt 2mdsd ting acine. wome stt 32mm ting acine. wome stt 3mm ting acine. wome stt 3mm ting acine. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. < 1291232358 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett, still longer than the one I got to < 1291232373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well lets implement a genetic algorithm on this < 1291232381 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion => he types better. < 1291232395 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, who does "he" refer to here < 1291232399 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett. < 1291232400 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome stt 3mm ting aicne. wome st 3mm tine acine. wome sst 3mm tine acine. some st 3mm tine acine. some st 3mm tine acine. some tt 3mm tine acine. some tt 3mm tine acine. some ttt 3mm tine acine. < 1291232401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett. < 1291232403 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291232405 0 :cheater99!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you there? < 1291232405 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet tt3 m m tine ianc < 1291232409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet 3t3t n m tine aicn < 1291232413 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet t3jio nm tiainc < 1291232414 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet tt3 m m tine inac < 1291232417 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet tjio nm itnac < 1291232421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet tinj oj nm ainta < 1291232422 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some tt3 m m timtatn < 1291232424 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet tjinco nm itacn < 1291232428 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet tjio nm itanc < 1291232431 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some thingie oh-my titanic. < 1291232432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet itoj nm tiacn < 1291232432 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :som tjio nm oitia < 1291232437 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(what?) < 1291232437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smet itoj nm itan < 1291232442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smet itjo nm itan < 1291232443 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mset iot nmi tn < 1291232447 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mset iot nmi tn < 1291232450 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mset niot n < 1291232455 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :msetnio tn < 1291232457 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :msetn iot n < 1291232457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mset nio tn < 1291232459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mseit not < 1291232463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: mseit not. < 1291232463 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mset no < 1291232466 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :msetn ot < 1291232467 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smetno t < 1291232468 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some tt 3mm tine acine. some tt 2m3m tine acine. some tt 3mm tine acine. some tt 3mm tine acine. some tt 2mm tine acine. some ti 3mm tine acine. some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti 3mm tine ciane. < 1291232468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mseton < 1291232468 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Multiset, NMI not. < 1291232472 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mston < 1291232474 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: mston. < 1291232478 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mstn < 1291232480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Try mston. < 1291232484 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mstn < 1291232485 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I got shorter :P < 1291232486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: There. mstn. < 1291232486 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mastodon. < 1291232494 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mess-ton. < 1291232496 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: http://www.mastodon.biz/ < 1291232497 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1291232501 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: /nick mstn < 1291232503 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :messton < 1291232507 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meston < 1291232511 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :meston < 1291232513 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1291232513 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mston < 1291232515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's go back the other way < 1291232517 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mston < 1291232518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's try and typo it larger < 1291232520 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mstn < 1291232521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to get back to the original < 1291232525 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, hah :P < 1291232534 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M SURE THIS PROCESS IS REVERSIBLE YOU GUYS < 1291232534 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, THIS TIME! a genetic algorithim < 1291232538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :algorithm* < 1291232538 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti 3mm tine caine. some ti emm tine caine. some ti emm tine caine. some ti emm tine caine. some ti emm tine caine. some ti emm tine caine. < 1291232555 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now that it contains "ti emm", I'm going to replace those sounds with the letters they name. < 1291232568 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mstn < 1291232569 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :stmrio < 1291232570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :smtoni < 1291232570 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sermnotin < 1291232572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mn soertn < 1291232573 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :msoinert < 1291232574 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mseortni ertoin < 1291232575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mseorit < 1291232576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :moseitn soertn < 1291232578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :soemn tooi i < 1291232580 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet irtm oem < 1291232582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :someti reiom tine nc < 1291232585 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :osmetie cireom ncein < 1291232585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you can do multiple on same line like tswett does < 1291232589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sotmeime ceion ncein < 1291232591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: this is to keep my honset < 1291232593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somteime cein ceni < 1291232597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometime tji 3m jioct < 1291232601 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, huh < 1291232604 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :som etiem im 3ioj < 1291232608 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this will never work :D < 1291232619 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some TM tine caine. some TM tine caine. some tM tine caine. some tM tine caine. some tM tine caine. some tM tine caine. some tM tine caine. some Tm tine caine. some Tm tine caine. some Tm cint caine. some Tm cint caine. some Tm cint caine. some Tm cint caine. some Tm cint caine. some Tm cint caine. some Tm cint caint. some Tm cint taine. some Tm cint taine. some Tm cint taine. some Tm tcint taint. some Tm cint taint. some Tm cin < 1291232640 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, still very very down < 1291232644 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, just checked again < 1291232663 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not just down, or very down; it is in fact very very down. < 1291232677 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll need to start it thrice to get it all the way back up. < 1291232686 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :some Tm cint taint. some tm cint that. some tm cint that. some tm cint that. some tm cint that. some tm cint that. some tm cint that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. some t cnt that. < 1291232714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somet mi cent hat < 1291232715 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, I've gone far enough for my taste. < 1291232717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometiei mcetahti < 1291232717 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sdojitgsdiogj < 1291232719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oijsdfoi < 1291232720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sdjf < 1291232721 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :djf < 1291232722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :djf < 1291232722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :df < 1291232723 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :d < 1291232724 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1291232731 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: your name is now "some Tm cint taint". < 1291232789 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, port is still open says nmap < 1291232820 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it wouldn't stay in the "logging in" mode if it wasn't, I guess. < 1291233034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You may have thought the latest Postoffice beta release was a fairly trivial one. But no, that honor is reserved for discount, which has been pushed up to version 2.0.3 by simply updating the markdown(1) and markdown(3) manpages to correctly describe the thicket of MKD_flags available in the 2.x version of the published interface." < 1291233057 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wha? < 1291233088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Just David Parsons' insane software ramblings. < 1291233234 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder whether postoffice is less pain than qmail. < 1291233237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(To set up.) < 1291233326 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ls -A | xargs -d'\n' find \ < 1291233333 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm bugging you today -- < 1291233344 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: How could one write this in a way that works? As it is, it gives the path last to find, which Does Not Work. < 1291233350 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(No, I can't use GNU xargs's -I.) < 1291233443 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1291233452 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, waiting for rest of command :P < 1291233457 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there is a \ on the end < 1291233462 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :> < 1291233463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The rest is irrelevant (just find expressions). < 1291233468 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The issue is that you can't give find paths after expressions. < 1291233477 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed you can't < 1291233486 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So my xargs doesn't work there. < 1291233488 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if you use ls -A I guess no space < 1291233495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What? < 1291233510 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the paths obviously are sanely delimited? < 1291233513 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait newline < 1291233514 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291233515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes. < 1291233521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So the issue is, how can I do this? < 1291233522 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, MAAAYBE mess with IFS < 1291233526 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Ugh. < 1291233528 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, but I don't know < 1291233535 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: All I want to do is have find not put "./" before everything. < 1291233538 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, use a saner language than shell script < 1291233559 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, find ... | sed 's/^\.\///' ? < 1291233562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :find is the Right Thing here. < 1291233563 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't you just postprocess the find output to sensib... < 1291233572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \( -type l -printf '0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 %p\n' \) -o \ < 1291233572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \( -type d -printf '0000000000000000000000000000000000000000 %p/\n' \) -o \ < 1291233572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : \( -type f -exec sha1sum '{}' \; \) < 1291233576 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Maybe, but not with that script." < 1291233594 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I suggest that you post process it indeed < 1291233596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait; BusyBox find doesn't even have printf. < 1291233598 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hooray post-processing. < 1291233603 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just not using find. < 1291233617 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why are you limiting yourself to busybox here? < 1291233656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because Kitten uses BusyBox. < 1291233663 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BusyBox isn't exactly lacking in features. < 1291233669 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Take a look at "busybox ls --help" sometime.) < 1291233690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: If you know of any coreutils replacement that's even vaguely as complete, I'd love to hear about it... < 1291233701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, whatever *BSD uses? < 1291233710 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well freebsd mostly < 1291233719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *BSD have coreutils in their source tree. They are not portable. < 1291233721 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :openbsd is quite a lot worse < 1291233732 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, oh? what sort of BSD specific functions? < 1291233736 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do not compile on anything other than BSD; perhaps not even anything other than *that* BSD. < 1291233740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Mostly headers, actually. < 1291233750 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: But the Makefiles also only work with BSD make and require the BSD make includes (bsd.prog.mk and the like). < 1291233754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I pretty much just gave up at that point. < 1291233781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried Minix but their Makefile system is similarly tangly. < 1291233790 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I have to apply the update. < 1291233825 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, right. < 1291233827 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The server seems to keep doing those unexpected exceptions. < 1291233839 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently it doesn't work well with the updated client. < 1291233861 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay, how reliable < 1291233885 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what sending it specially crafted (no pun intended) packets would do? < 1291233897 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably easy to crash it < 1291233942 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmph. Maybe I'll store the type of the file before the hash. < 1291233952 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Writing a useful manifest is irritating... < 1291233981 0 :mtve!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1291233989 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, why not sha2? < 1291233993 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sha1 is meh < 1291234010 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Because the sole thing this is used for is for checking whether the user has changed a given file. < 1291234015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I could even get away with CRC32. < 1291234021 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah not for download integrity then < 1291234024 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1291234031 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yeah, rsync will handle that. < 1291234058 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Basically, when you uninstall, it'll remove all the files whose hashes match, and print out the names of all the files that don't. < 1291234063 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can remove configuration files manually if you want. < 1291234069 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ah interesting < 1291234079 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This means I don't have to keep track of what's a package file and what's a user file. :p < 1291234095 0 :ineiros!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Updated. < 1291234106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, btw I thought about the owner thing. Pretty much every daemon that installs files into /var and that can get away with not running as root will have files that shouldn't be owned by root < 1291234149 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Well, I could write something that goes and chmods every file owned by the user building the package. < 1291234155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it seems easier just to use a postinst script. < 1291234161 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, mhm < 1291234184 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also stuff like nethack that is sgid games < 1291234196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Some distros run NetHack as root. :-) < 1291234199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course, I'm not that stupid.) < 1291234202 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whaaat < 1291234209 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that way there can only be one player? < 1291234213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...no. < 1291234217 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would you think that? < 1291234225 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, uh. if you run as root you are root? < 1291234231 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the player you are I meant < 1291234242 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Um, I think it checks the different UID. < 1291234244 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one that doesn't change. < 1291234251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But there *was* a security flaw in NetHack that left such distros vulnerable.) < 1291234251 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1291234260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION make menuconfigs uClibc
< 1291234268 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, utilise the MMU. :p < 1291234277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the FPU, too! < 1291234296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ If you want the uClibc math library to contain the full set C99 │ < 1291234296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ math library features, then answer Y. If you leave this set to │ < 1291234296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ N the math library will contain only the math functions that were │ < 1291234296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ listed as part of the traditional POSIX/IEEE 1003.1b-1993 standard. │ < 1291234296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Leaving this option set to N will save around 35k on an x86 system. │ < 1291234301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I love how specific some of these options are. < 1291234320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ j0, j1, jn - Bessel functions of the first kind │ < 1291234320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ y0, y1, yn - Bessel functions of the second kind │ < 1291234323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... don't think I need those. < 1291234391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ The kernel source you use to compile with should be the same │ < 1291234391 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ as the Linux kernel you run your apps on. < 1291234392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh. < 1291234402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's... really irritating. < 1291234467 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291234523 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, I'm not even sure how to solve that. < 1291234528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Upgrade my kernel manually on Debian? < 1291234578 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291234610 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, there? < 1291234623 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, what if you need to compute Bessel functions! < 1291234639 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PIC doesn't work with static libraries, right? :p < 1291234655 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'd assume PIE would < 1291234670 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, doubtful on 32-bit x86 though < 1291234674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: x86-64 < 1291234676 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmmm, PIE. < 1291234685 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: i.e. should I bother telling uClibc to use -fPIC if I'm doing all static linking < 1291234691 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: (oblig. http://www.weebls-stuff.com/wab/pie/) < 1291234696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Saved you the effort of Vorpal's questioning! < 1291234701 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, yes probably < 1291234705 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, know of a 3x3 shaft with spiral stair next to your house? < 1291234706 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : But I don't HAVE Flash! < 1291234713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, tell it to use -fPIC? Really? < 1291234713 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, does all the way down and all the way up < 1291234730 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure you can't do ASLR without it < 1291234756 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Which doesn't work with static linking... < 1291234759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Duh. < 1291234783 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, sure? I thought it did < 1291234791 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, since it could move around heap and stack and such < 1291234798 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, and also where the binary is loaded < 1291234946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: "# < 1291234946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Security measures like load address randomization cannot be used. With statically linked applications, only the stack and heap address can be randomized. All text has a fixed address in all invocations. With dynamically linked applications, the kernel has the ability to load all DSOs at arbitrary addresses, independent from each other. In case the application is built as a position independent executable (PIE) even this code can be loaded at rand < 1291234946 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :om addresses. Fixed addresses (or even only fixed offsets) are the dreams of attackers. And no, it is not possible in general to generate PIEs with static linking. On IA-32 it is possible to use code compiled without -fpic and -fpie in PIEs (although with a cost) but this is not true for other architectures, including x86-64." < 1291234948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: --Drepper < 1291234958 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So: no. < 1291234972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ASLR is really not that useful, though; it's a bit of a niche exploit to cover for.) < 1291235017 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other news, I read all of the Ed stories. < 1291235109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: They are rather good. < 1291235127 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, although the depressingness rises exponentially. < 1291235177 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: The ending is quite happy, really... apart from that one thing. < 1291235203 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, except for the "how little we deserved it" bit. < 1291235209 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that one thing. < 1291235256 0 :Quadrescence!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: omghaahhahaohwow < 1291235260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I have lost my PDF copy of it! < 1291235262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was nice. LaTeX'd. < 1291235294 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1291235309 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Have you read the epilogue? http://qntm.org/free < 1291235320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I included it in the PDF after a few blank pages. < 1291235426 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Ambiguous. < 1291235430 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could be... you know... < 1291235521 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I think it's sort of meant to take place outside of any actual timeline. < 1291235550 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose. < 1291235629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ bcmp, bcopy, bzero, index, rindex, ftime, │ < 1291235629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ bsd_signal, (ecvt), (fcvt), gcvt, (getcontext), │ < 1291235629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ (getwd), (makecontext), │ < 1291235629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ mktemp, (pthread_attr_getstackaddr), (pthread_attr_setstackaddr), │ < 1291235629 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ scalb, (setcontext), (swapcontext), ualarm, usleep, │ < 1291235630 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ wcswcs. │ < 1291235632 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmmmmmmmmmmm. < 1291235634 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I need these, I wonder. < 1291235660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha! There's an option not to include gets solely because it's obsolete. < 1291235661 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think not. < 1291235671 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291235675 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ulrich Drepper there is blatantly lying. < 1291235679 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh? < 1291235720 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Position independent executables are entirely feasible with static linking. However, you get fixed offsets in the binaries. < 1291235721 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, are you torrenting or something? it is very laggy < 1291235724 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, but not timing out < 1291235733 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros: You must feel so scrutinised. < 1291235737 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Torrent away; Vorpal needs a break. < 1291235748 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Mm. I think I won't bother though. < 1291235749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Making it much less *useful* than with dynamic linking, where each library can be loaded at a random address. < 1291235757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Address space randomisation is... well... fairly pointless. < 1291235829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Answer Y to enable repeated reading of the '/etc/TZ' file even after │ < 1291235829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ a valid value has been read. This incurs the overhead of an │ < 1291235829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ open/read/close for each tzset() call (explicit or implied). However, │ < 1291235829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ setting this will allow applications to update their timezone │ < 1291235829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ information if the contents of the file change. │ < 1291235830 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1291235832 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It makes a certain class of attacks somewhat harder, but in that class of attacks you're already pretty well fucked. < 1291235833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, it's not much overhead. < 1291235842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :/etc/TZ is not a nice name for the file though. < 1291235846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any suggestions? < 1291235939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Is it evil to have a file named /etc/timezone with completely different syntax to glibc's? < 1291236119 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, FWIW, I had a little niggle at the back of my head when the energy virus was introduced by analogy with Life. < 1291236278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What was it this time. :p < 1291236279 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, down? < 1291236301 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the niggle? < 1291236308 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seems that way. < 1291236319 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes. < 1291236323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Am I baaaaaaaaad? < 1291236332 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, looked like an optimised design < 1291236338 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is the obsidian risk in it? < 1291236340 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: *OPTOMIZED < 1291236345 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and how much goes back into the lava? < 1291236351 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, there's no such pattern known in Life, and I'd put large quantities of money on it not existing. < 1291236355 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that z is so american < 1291236365 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, back up < 1291236387 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291236403 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of pattern doesn't exist in life? < 1291236404 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: What, something that can eat everything? < 1291236414 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, indeed. < 1291236419 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1291236425 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I'm not so sure... < 1291236442 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, "almost" anything anyway. < 1291236446 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, show me a spaceship that can survive a collision with a blinker. < 1291236449 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have to think about this < 1291236460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: who says it's necessarily a spaceship < 1291236482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: have some eaty things on the end, and have a special kind of spacefiller in the middle that, when it collides with the eaty things from *behind*, "pushes" them further forward < 1291236487 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the principle is identicle. < 1291236494 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :| <-- how does one type this character? < 1291236495 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not so sure < 1291236498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I think it's unlikely < 1291236498 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@CPE001b115db0ae-CM0018c0c24ffc.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1291236504 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: | < 1291236505 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :|| < 1291236507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: altgr-` on uk keyboards < 1291236508 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1291236517 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spaceship: self-propagating pattern into vacuum. < 1291236531 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Energy virus: self-propagating pattern into *everything*. < 1291236533 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, we're asking, for a given CA, if there exists a finite pattern such that given any configuration with that pattern in the middle, the orbit converges to 0 < 1291236533 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't output the character i meant to because apparently it is unicode < 1291236545 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :orbit of the configuration i mean < 1291236564 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291236565 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, such patterns exist in several CAs, and some unconventional formulations of Life. < 1291236566 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in english, bigger and bigger balls are filled with 0 < 1291236576 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the vertical bar in you messages at 15:33 and 15:36. what unicode value is it? < 1291236591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i don't know, ask python < 1291236601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>> ord(u'|') < 1291236601 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :124 < 1291236603 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: well yes, obviously you can make a CA with such a pattern < 1291236610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems it's just | < 1291236616 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on windows it's a broken | < 1291236617 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, also, for this purpose I'll go for chaos for some value of "chaos". < 1291236617 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can even make it nilpotent, in which case every pattern has that property < 1291236649 0 :kar8nga!~kar8nga@k-248.vc-graz.ac.at JOIN :#esoteric < 1291236674 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you ever want to run a glibc program, absolutely TERRIBLE. < 1291236679 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, almost all dense agars have that problem. < 1291236683 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Otherwise, not at all. < 1291236700 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: doesn't glibc look at $TZ before /etc/timezone < 1291236713 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the blank universe isn't really distinguished from the infinitely striped universe. < 1291236714 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i don't get your chaos comment < 1291236719 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: i do want to be able to run quake ii, which is circa-1997 gcc/glibc static linking :) < 1291236727 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You're asking about how brain-damaged Glibc is. < 1291236732 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The answer is "very:". < 1291236736 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any further questions? < 1291236749 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No! Okay, name it then. Basically, writing to this file is the same as setting $TZ to the contents. < 1291236754 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: /etc/TZ is the default but that is *ugly*. < 1291236757 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Maybe /etc/tz? < 1291236773 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, it needn't be 0 within the bubble, just that the bubble overwrites all preëxisting structures and is almost impossible to stop. < 1291236786 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes obviously we can define identicles w.r.t. every configuration (i liked your typo so much i'd like to name this concept that, even though it probably has a name already, and identicle doesn't make any sense) < 1291236803 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost impossible? < 1291236804 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: /etc/org.sun.xml.config.time.zone.xml < 1291236805 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1291236806 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said identicles? < 1291236817 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GYAAAAA < 1291236818 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you just typoed identical "identicle" < 1291236840 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but so erm what does almost impossible mean < 1291236842 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION commits sepukku.
< 1291236863 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess measure theoretical or topological duh < 1291236888 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, it's hard to define formally, but that almost all possible patterns will be destroyed would do. < 1291236936 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could just take the topological denseness and measure theoretical full measureness, and hope they make sense in this context too < 1291236941 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, incidentally, engineering isn't a very good solution to durability in Life. < 1291236947 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Perhaps you should commit sehų'ku instead. < 1291236962 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, sorry. se'hųku < 1291236970 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, MY GUTS ARE SPILLING OUT YOUR ROMANISATION IS NOT IMPORTANT < 1291236982 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Your romanisation was spelled wrong anyways. < 1291236987 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: "Seppuku". < 1291237009 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I COMMIT SUICIDE AND YOU CRITICISE MY SPELLING < 1291237011 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: This is just wrong: http://imgur.com/yMEWy.png < 1291237013 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAt < 1291237015 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover too < 1291237019 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sepukku" comes out as something like "back poo phrase" < 1291237032 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: hey if pikhq hadn't, i would < 1291237046 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie facewalls at his duplication. < 1291237105 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of the sparkles, http://zem.fi/~fis/current-hird.png < 1291237108 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: is there an identicle for gol? < 1291237179 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291237199 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what if you have two of them colliding? < 1291237213 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1291237230 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's problematic about that < 1291237257 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, what have you defined an identicle as? < 1291237258 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/cable/2008/01/08OTTAWA136.html < 1291237260 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have two growing balls of zeroes, those would just both have to keep growing < 1291237274 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1291237288 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The US... Actively monitors Canadian TV for unAmerican things on prime time‽ < 1291237298 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: a finite pattern P such that, given any configuration C with P in the middle, T^n C --> 0 where T is the CA rule < 1291237305 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 0 is the all zero configuration < 1291237316 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and limits are taken w.r.t. product topology < 1291237341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: RR RUEHAG RUEHAST RUEHDA RUEHDF RUEHFL RUEHGA RUEHHA RUEHIK RUEHKW < 1291237341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RUEHLA RUEHLN RUEHLZ RUEHPOD RUEHQU RUEHROV RUEHSR RUEHVC RUEHVK < 1291237341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RUEHYG < 1291237341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DE RUEHOT #0136/01 0252315 < 1291237341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZNR UUUUU ZZH < 1291237342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1291237344 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, there does have to be a wavefront made of live cells at the edge of the identicle. < 1291237363 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moreover, there are rules about propagation into vacuum. < 1291237368 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bounding boxes and things. < 1291237371 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: [["THE BORDER" -CANADA'S ANSWER TO 24, W/O THAT SUTHERLAND GUY]] LOL < 1291237384 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We need to do everything we can to make it more difficult for Canadians to fall into the trap of seeing all U.S. policies as the result of nefarious faceless U.S. bureaucrats anxious to squeeze their northern neighbor." < 1291237394 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. How's about you stop doing stupid shit. I think that'd do it. < 1291237407 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :surely there is a wavefront, yes < 1291237437 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"rules about propagation into vacuum, bounding boxes and things"? < 1291237449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[GIVE US YOUR WATER; OH WHAT THE HECK WE'LL TAKE YOUR COUNTRY TOO]] < 1291237451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: these headlines are amazing < 1291237476 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And this was *never once classified*. < 1291237478 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you meant < 1291237478 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, OK, and the absolute, unbreakable rule about propagation into the vacuum is that it must stay within a diagonal box expanding at less than c/2. < 1291237480 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the definition < 1291237483 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a wavefront? < 1291237487 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe not < 1291237488 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :limits in product topology is a pretty lenient requirement, the zero region can expand as slowly as it wants < 1291237511 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: imo that's the correct definition < 1291237518 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Now watch as I fail to disappear. < 1291237525 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's restricted further to less than c/4, but I'm not sure. < 1291237526 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, if there's one in Life it *must* have a wavefront. < 1291237534 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i'm just pointing out that it doesn't conflict with slow propagation < 1291237535 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If any bubble of empty space expanded [tab complete]. < 1291237559 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c/2 is rather arbitrary, if you halve a rule, make it slower that is, it can suddenly have no identicle, even though it's essentially the same rule < 1291237563 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is crazy < 1291237564 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1291237569 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :c/2 changes too tho < 1291237601 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: what must stay within a diagonal box exp...? < 1291237606 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the wavefront? < 1291237630 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any configuration of live cells cannot expand beyond the box. < 1291237639 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" oklofok, if there's one in Life it *must* have a wavefront." <<< yes and i'm sure we can prove the existence of a kind of wavefront in general, in non-nilpotent rules < 1291237673 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, movement at >= c/2 diagonally basically writes "THIS RULE EXPLODES" on the starting grid. < 1291237676 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is propagation into vacuum even? < 1291237745 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i find that a less beautiful definition than mine though, i would prefer say calling certain identicles explosive, or even better, defining their explosion speeds < 1291237767 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, turning on of live cells into an area filled with state 9. < 1291237774 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*0. < 1291237839 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291237921 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, incidentally, is your T^n thing indicating that T is a transition function operating n times? < 1291237940 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so erm, can you reiterate, what are the things you'd like in the definition? < 1291237957 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1291237977 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wants a Truing machine
< 1291237989 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes false statements true by changing reality < 1291238013 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^^would have been funnier without those last three words, I think < 1291238024 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1291238026 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :we'll never know < 1291238029 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, well, the T^n C → 0 thing was pretty good. < 1291238038 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just poorly expressing why I think no such configuration exists. < 1291238039 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it's nice and pure < 1291238070 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you were? i'm not really interested in gol in particular, i just thought there might be some neat properties you could prove for identicles in general < 1291238127 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm... < 1291238147 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually < 1291238166 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. "In general" is pretty boring in CAs, since there's very little common ground other than the discreteness. < 1291238174 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically what an identicle is a neighborhood such that all points of it converge to zero < 1291238191 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in fact there is a very natural way to express this concept for a general dynamical system < 1291238240 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: in general is not boring in ca's, and when it happens to be, you assume a property from the ca's, you don't take one particular one, that's ugly < 1291238284 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like talking about the properties of the number 8, who gives a shit < 1291238292 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1291238304 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not exactly, but close :D < 1291238370 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This *started* with Life-related pedantry. < 1291238383 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although where it will end up is anyone's guess. < 1291238400 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, given a point in a CA, an identicle is an open set such that blah blah, this concept is probably very much connected with attracting sets or something < 1291238431 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: i usually hope it ends in a theorem/-y < 1291238466 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, stop knowing more maths than me. < 1291238468 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find it mocking. < 1291238474 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :where did i know maths you don't < 1291238485 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're talking about attracting sets, i basically just said i don't know anything about those :D < 1291238490 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1291238494 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What open sets are! < 1291238499 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually i didn't say the part where i know nothing about them < 1291238500 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1291238504 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't know what open sets are? < 1291238526 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case or in no case? < 1291238535 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on whether it's in terms of intervals or topology and stuff. < 1291238551 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the same thing, except w.r.t. the metric on the space of all configurations < 1291238578 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not intervals but balls < 1291238589 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an open set is a set U such that for each x \in U, there is an open ball B(x, r) \subset U < 1291238589 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also know it there. < 1291238611 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Intervals are one-dimensional balls < 1291238665 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, if you're considering lifeoid CAs there are some laws you can work out in terms of speed limits in some configurations. < 1291238671 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the metric says roughly that if you take the ball B(x, r), given a configuration x, you actually take the pattern P in x in the ball around origin, of size 2^(-r), and you take all configurations y that have that pattern in the middle < 1291238696 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, two points are close if they are the same around the origin < 1291238706 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much anyway you define that formally gives you the same topology < 1291238724 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, for anything to move diagonally at c/2 or greater through an area with no live cells, the rule basically has to be explosive. < 1291238741 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh there's a definition for explosiveness? < 1291238786 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i thought that was your definition of explosiveness < 1291238812 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course gol is particularly interesting for this question precisely because that CA apparently makes it impossible to create a structure that can survive contact with arbitrary chaos < 1291238980 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :" Depends on whether it's in terms of intervals or topology and stuff." <<< i don't think open sets refer to anything but the topology kind < 1291238980 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i contain an open ball around all of my points for corrections ofc < 1291238981 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed, but intervals \subset topology stuff. < 1291238981 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I only knew that subset. < 1291238982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Care to hear about my INSANE MINECRAFT FORT PLANS? < 1291238982 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm right, i actually slightly misparsed you < 1291238982 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1291238982 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or misunderstood more like < 1291238982 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I do. < 1291238983 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: let's talk about identicles instead < 1291238983 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like insane plans! < 1291238983 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, explosive rules are those in which patterns which expand without bound are very common. < 1291238984 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a given value of "very common". < 1291239008 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i didn't know it was known for it's ability to that < 1291239057 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i mean, i've never heard of anyone inventing a gol structure that can survive such contact < 1291239187 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklofok, that's basically why Conway settled on it. < 1291239189 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would certainly like to know what given value < 1291239190 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1291239191 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know, i thought he just thought hey this is neat. < 1291239191 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1291239193 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"lol this glider is cute" < 1291239212 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think he tried multiple Lifelike CAs and went for the one he found that supported long-term dynamic behaviour without everything filling the board with chaos. < 1291239267 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a most resilient known structure, and it's not very resilient. < 1291239279 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And static. < 1291239293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the eater? < 1291239303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: hm but can you build a spacefiller that works by replicating itself? < 1291239304 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, sure, tons of them may die < 1291239313 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1291239314 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1291239314 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1291239314 0 :sshc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1291239314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're replicating fast enough that eventually, they will end up destroying the debris < 1291239347 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, all complex structures in life are *really really fragile*. < 1291239366 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, "whoops I hit it with a glider and it's dead" fragile. < 1291239381 0 :sshc!~sshc@unaffiliated/sshc JOIN :#esoteric < 1291239381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: So make the structure simple. < 1291239393 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Rather than trying to fill space, just make a simple thing that makes little baby space-fillers. < 1291239397 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Gemini replicator would completely fail if a single glider in its instruction tape was changed. < 1291239401 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, instead of trying to grow to fill the space... < 1291239406 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just try and fill the universe with paperclips. < 1291239406 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, a spacefilling replicator with simple structure? < 1291239407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Constantly. < 1291239417 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would that even *work*? < 1291239421 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, OK, I would try it in a Life-like rule with simple replicators first. < 1291239432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the basic idea is: Keep replicating further away from yourself, constantly. < 1291239439 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spacefillers leave no room; they expand outwards at maximum speed in all directions. < 1291239449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I didn't mean a regular kind of spacefiller. < 1291239459 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just meant something that eventually gets rid of everything else on the plane. < 1291239465 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so a breeder, then? < 1291239475 0 :Sasha2_!~WHAT@75-174-218-84.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291239475 0 :Leonidas!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1291239475 0 :nooga!~nooga@maverick.aircity.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1291239480 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Sure. Except that instead of one breeder, each unit is a breeder in itself. < 1291239496 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Spacefiller" is actually fairly well defined. < 1291239497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If one of them gets sucked up by some debris, no problem; another will end up being bred to fill its space. < 1291239543 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that is just a replicator, surely? < 1291239543 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And all of them will die when they attempt to replicate over each other. < 1291239674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Well, the trick is to make two colliding replicators result in one replicator. :p < 1291239693 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I'm next to a deeep pit < 1291239706 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, from 20 below surface to lava lake < 1291239710 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, or so < 1291239726 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Phantom_Hoover knows a deeper pit. < 1291239726 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, 1x1 wide almost all the way < 1291239735 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, you mean the one you fell in? < 1291239740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No. < 1291239755 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean a *really* deep pit. < 1291239759 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, argh an even deeper one over here < 1291239774 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not as deep as Phantom_Hoover's. < 1291239782 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I'm assuming he means the hole in the bedrock I found under the Mt. Hoover tunnel. < 1291239786 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, this one goes down to the minecart tracks < 1291239787 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DON'T TELL HIM < 1291239790 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah right < 1291239795 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I saw him mention that < 1291239800 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't consider it a pit < 1291239801 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is the void < 1291239802 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so without any assumptions on the rule, is it true that, for each patterns P and block Q, where P is an identicle, there exists a constant k such that for all configurations C with P in the middle, Q is filled with 0 from T^k onwards? i don't think the function from configurations to "first everzeroings" is continuous, but it still seems like this should be true < 1291239820 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is necessarily continuous < 1291239823 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, this pit ends up above the cobble-water barrier next to the minecart tracks < 1291239841 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pattern < 1291239869 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: How to set a timezone in kitten: "echo CST6CDT >/etc/tz". < 1291239898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Although you should probably also add "export TZ=CST6DT" to /etc/profile to avoid file accesses. < 1291239907 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: In fact, I'll probably add "export TZ=$(cat /etc/tz)" to /etc/profile. < 1291239909 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh it goes up to surface too < 1291239918 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291239939 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm i guess there's still a direct compactness argument < 1291239948 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1291240037 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not, i'm too tired < 1291240145 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: BTW, cfunge will get bug reports if it doesn't run on Kitten. < 1291240155 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1291240159 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, okay? < 1291240162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION removes xattr support.
< 1291240171 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: So be prepared to support Linux/x86-64/pcc/uClibc :) < 1291240190 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I depend on POSIX 2001 < 1291240193 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, + XSI < 1291240198 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't do that then fuck you < 1291240207 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I do include XSI functions. < 1291240213 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how 2001y uClibc is but it should be good. < 1291240222 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Math functions are slightly lacking but I doubt you use the full extent of POSIX math. < 1291240248 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I use sinl and such < 1291240254 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Those are of course included. < 1291240264 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I somehow doubt cfunge will work with pcc, though. < 1291240274 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, also mmap extension < 1291240282 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1291240291 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it works with gcc, icc and clang. tcc except that tcc had somewhat limited C99 < 1291240296 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pcc I never tried < 1291240297 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.noradsanta.org/js/data.js NORAD have leaked Santa Clause's Christmas flight path!! Somebody submit this to Wikileaks! < 1291240371 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, whaat? < 1291240373 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you < 1291240374 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :talking < 1291240376 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :about < 1291240403 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NORAD_Tracks_Santa < 1291240431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[According to NORAD's official web page on the NORAD Tracks Santa program, the service began on December 24, 1955. A Sears department store placed an advertisement in a Colorado Springs newspaper. The advertisement told children that they could telephone Santa Claus and included a number for them to call. However, the telephone number printed was incorrect and calls instead came through to Colorado Spring's Continental Air Defense Command (CONAD < 1291240431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) Center. Colonel Shoup, who was on duty that night, told his staff to give all children that called in a "current location" for Santa Claus. A tradition began which continued when the North American Aerospace Defence Command (NORAD) replaced CONAD in 1958]] < 1291240437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MOST AWESOME ORIGIN STORY *EVER* < 1291240451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey! "Many volunteers are employees at Cheyenne Mountain and Peterson Air Force Base." < 1291240460 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if Daniel Jackson is there, or has he gone and ascended again? < 1291240517 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Should I bother supporting locales? I know, I know, I'm a bad person if I don't... < 1291240568 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 他の言語があるぜ。 < 1291240584 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Supporting locales != supporting other languages < 1291240602 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Supporting locales == supporting output and UI text in other languages even though there are a ton of untranslated programs /anyway/ < 1291240610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt, for instance, BusyBox has many transaltions. < 1291240613 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*translations. < 1291240628 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I did that last year... stayed up until midnight answering phone calls :-) < 1291240638 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Support locales so that it's possible and/or easy to actually *do* translations. < 1291240645 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: awesome :) < 1291240658 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But, but, it bloats things up! < 1291240659 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without locale support you literally have no choice in the matter. < 1291240675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Also, not true; pretty sure you can statically select a gettext translation at compile-time to be the default. < 1291240697 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Your precious metric system is only supported via locales. < 1291240722 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Either what you're saying is true but irrelevant or trivially false... < 1291240763 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Programs that display units will look at the locale for which units to use. < 1291240763 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Date formatting! Different decimal point separators! Proper sorting order for alphabets! It's not just translations. < 1291240782 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, like most everything else, default to US standard. < 1291240852 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You'd say that; you're a Finn. < 1291240852 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PH: why quit? < 1291240855 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fine, fine, locales. < 1291240863 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: BUT I WARN YOU THAT THE CTYPE.H FUNCTIONS WON'T USE TABLES < 1291240866 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but how does it work if it's distributed? you don't want some Chinese server giving you results in Chinese if you live in France < 1291240881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be aware that enabling │ < 1291240881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ this option will make uClibc much larger. < 1291240885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ughhh... locales. < 1291240888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Enabling UCLIBC_HAS_LOCALE with the default set of supported locales │ < 1291240888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ (169 UTF-8 locales, and 144 locales for other codesets) will enlarge │ < 1291240888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ uClibc by around 300k. You can reduce this size by building your own │ < 1291240888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ custom set of locate data (see extra/locale/LOCALES for details). │ < 1291240888 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, then it will not be locale-aware < 1291240893 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: 300k!!! < 1291240895 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, no locales: I won't use kitten ever < 1291240906 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Don't worry, I really don't care if you use it or not. But I probably am including locales. < 1291240907 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: It's based on the locale environment variables. < 1291240917 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I wonder how much of that 300k is included in a typical program? < 1291240926 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Oh, and it'll default to USD for currency! < 1291240938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: If you can't write a simple program and get a 10K executable or less it's broken. < 1291240939 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And our MM/DD/YY date display! < 1291240943 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : pikhq: I wonder how much of that 300k is included in a typical program? < 1291240977 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Very little of that should be included... < 1291241010 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but what happens if it's a long-running daemon? changing the environment variables will have no effect. < 1291241032 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: And? < 1291241047 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you'll still get results in Chinese < 1291241097 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: ... Yes... < 1291241107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314 does not quite understand, methinks. < 1291241248 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Ugh. I don't really want to include every single locale; list all the languages that matter. :p < 1291241260 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (The one advantage of dynamic linking: I could just build a uClibc based on whatever locales the user wants.) < 1291241262 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: so... there seems to be no way for pain-free locale support < 1291241281 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: you do realise it's implemented in just about every existing linux system? < 1291241285 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: You seem not to understand what locales do. < 1291241287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: and your complaint about servers makes no sense? < 1291241322 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok... my complaint is that you can't change the locale while a program is running < 1291241353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: why is that an issue? < 1291241369 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Better than Windows, which doesn't allow changing the locales without *rebooting*. < 1291241372 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to this day) < 1291241383 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Servers shouldn't care what locale you're using. < 1291241389 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only matters for normal programs and client programs. < 1291241396 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's an issue because programs never stop < 1291241402 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Servers shouldn't care what locale you're using. < 1291241434 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only bad thing about Newspeak that I see is its lack of libraries at the moment < 1291241449 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Anyway, if somehow you really want to change, say, the language that server logs are written in, and it is ABSOLUTELY VITAL that the server NEVER, EVER go down, not even for a second, then just support setting the locale as part of the server's control console. < 1291241451 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's very rare. < 1291241454 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And all the features still not implemented or fully designed < 1291241455 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: on my home PC, I have had uptimes of months < 1291241471 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Which, of course, you do not need, being that it is a home PC. < 1291241489 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: And how often do you want your program to switch from French to Chinese UI and back? < 1291241491 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Will you hate me if I only build in a subset of locales? < 1291241494 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Mathnerd314: And how often do you want your program to switch from French to Chinese UI and back? < 1291241497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even relevant, we're talking servers here < 1291241514 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Test the effects of having all the locales first? < 1291241518 0 :kar8nga!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291241522 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: fairly often; I try to learn new languages < 1291241531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: We're talking about servers. < 1291241532 0 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1291241542 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Please tell me why you would want to change a server's language while it's running. < 1291241546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi mtve! haven't seen you for... ages < 1291241646 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because I do, OK? < 1291241660 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: that is not a valid complaint < 1291241672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: you have yet to show why that is even vaguely desirable; i suspect you do not understand what locales are used for < 1291241689 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what use-case would you want to change the locale of a server process? what would you hope to accomplish by doing so? < 1291241700 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: programs should support features, and this is a feature. it doesn't matter if nobody uses it. < 1291241718 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: wait, let me check -- < 1291241729 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: do you think every program should support every feature possible, regardless of whether it is even vaguely useful? < 1291241732 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314, zuh? < 1291241739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: If so, you're a complete and utter moron, stop wasting my time. < 1291241756 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, want some more cobble? < 1291241761 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I can put some in that chest < 1291241768 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think that it should be able to. < 1291241780 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Mathnerd314: do you think every program should support every feature possible, regardless of whether it is even vaguely useful? < 1291241783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: please answer this question < 1291241785 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, I have plenty. < 1291241795 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, ah okay < 1291241833 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, if you want a cobblestone generator I can build one, but I need your help since /home no longer works < 1291241839 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: Yes or no? < 1291241847 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, so one person must keep door to castle of doom open while the other fetch lava < 1291241853 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: at any given time, a program will not support all possible features. but somebody should be able to support it in an extensible manner. < 1291241866 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/it/a given feature/ < 1291241867 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: OK, but that is not an actual yes or no answer to my question. < 1291241870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I said should, not will. < 1291241917 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd have to say yes. but one particular feature it should support is removing features. < 1291241930 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: You sound suspiciously like zzo38. < 1291241939 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: But hey, take heart -- you could, one day, be a GNU coreutils maintainer. < 1291241949 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They like your sort, and this is evidenced by the man page for ls(1). < 1291242037 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, does busybox ls colour code the output? < 1291242044 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, if not: oh well, won't use it < 1291242047 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but once it supports enough features, it might as well be an operating system < 1291242076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: yes with --color=auto, presumably some env variable could make this default < 1291242106 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, alias ls='ls --color=auto' < 1291242109 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: anyway you have to realise that I *really* don't give a shit whether you use Kitten or not; I will provide support if you do and mock you mercilessly if you run into problems Kitten doesn't have, but fundamentally you can use whatever you like, and if one of your requirements conflicts with one of my requirements, mine take priority. < 1291242112 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a function wrapper < 1291242196 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, that mocking would be annoying. I assume you can turn that off < 1291242221 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's the risk everyone takes by not using Kitten. < 1291242258 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Oh, and anyone who tells me that they'd "use Kitten, if only it had a proper installer rather than a guide to partitioning and installing the basic packages using a host Linux system" will get, I don't know, IP-banned from the package repository or something. < 1291242262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or just mocked. Mercilessly.) < 1291242280 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note: I totally will make an installation program, I just don't want to be bugged about making one.) < 1291242301 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, well I done gentoo. And LFS. I'm no stranger to lack of installers < 1291242312 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, heck I even done cross-lfs < 1291242321 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, not canadian-cross lfs though < 1291242324 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would hate that < 1291242338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It shouldn't be very painful, anyway; due to static linking, all you really have to do is manually unpack the package manager and its dependencies, tell the package manager to install everything, and edit a few config files. < 1291242346 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Canadian-cross LFS. Oh man. Has anyone done that? < 1291242349 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds amazing. < 1291242367 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I don't know if it CAN be done even < 1291242436 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, I just realised that there's probably no TZ value that uClibc supports that handles automatic DST. Heh. < 1291242441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh well; file under solve later." < 1291242442 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I assume it will support software RAID? < 1291242456 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, it can't read zoneinfo files? < 1291242481 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: So, should be only about as hard as installing Debian via debootstrap. < 1291242522 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which I have totally done before.) < 1291242585 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I figured out a way to get lava without going into temple of doom < 1291242612 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, yaaaaay. < 1291242642 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I refuse to tell anyone since the admin would fix it < 1291242647 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if he knew what I was doing < 1291242656 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No he wouldn't. < 1291242672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is it? < 1291242678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, I assume it will support software RAID? < 1291242684 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, if it works then yes. Otherwise no. < 1291242687 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott, it can't read zoneinfo files? < 1291242693 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No; it has no /etc/timezone. < 1291242712 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You put a string like CST6CDT in /etc/tz and /etc/profile sets TZ to that. < 1291242753 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, where do you want the generator? < 1291242770 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Bottom of the hull. < 1291242775 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, where in it < 1291242779 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, and which model? < 1291242784 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, fizzie made another one < 1291242805 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, whichever has the greatest output. < 1291242824 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You'll have to recompile the distro next time some country decides to fuck with their time zones. < 1291242839 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: And countries are positively in *love* with the idea. Fuckers. < 1291242846 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, unknown as of currently < 1291242866 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: fizzie's leaves you with ghosts of yourself in the pool. < 1291242870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal's is safer too. < 1291242879 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Well, it's not even something I can configure. Anyway, "CST6CDT" implies to me that you can put offsets there. < 1291242881 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal's then. < 1291242894 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yet another reason that the time zone EVERYWHERE should be a rounded-to-the-hour approximation of the offset from GMT!) < 1291242901 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, mine is the largest one < 1291242912 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, I doubt that ghost was related to the issue in any way < 1291242916 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1291242921 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the generator that was < 1291242923 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, hardly a shortage of space in the ROU, < 1291242933 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(NOBODY gets to fuck with their time zones!) < 1291242946 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Build it in the air if it's somehow too large for the bottom of the hull. < 1291242947 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, where in the bottom of the hull? < 1291242966 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, near the column at the centre. < 1291242995 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it will almost the whole width < 1291243001 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, of the base layer < 1291243011 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, all but two colums if you put it along a side < 1291243012 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, that's OK. < 1291243016 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously. < 1291243016 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the middle just one column < 1291243041 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, lag atm... < 1291243044 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't do a thing < 1291243064 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :timed out < 1291243067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just jumped down the Temple of Doom's lava and survived all the way. :p < 1291243078 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, did you crash the server or something? < 1291243086 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1291243087 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no it is just lagged to hell < 1291243133 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@75-174-217-43.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291243151 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it needs to go down 1 into the floor, I have to raise the thing I realised < 1291243152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Set this to compile all sources at once into an object (IMA). │ < 1291243152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ This mode of compilation uses alot of memory but may produce │ < 1291243152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ smaller binaries. │ < 1291243155 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Am I crazy enough? < 1291243206 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1291243236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, even better, build it in the air somewhere and connect it to the axes. < 1291243254 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, gah already got quite far < 1291243262 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Awesomeness. < 1291243276 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ Note that you need a very recent GCC for this to work, like │ < 1291243277 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : │ gcc >= 4.3 plus eventually some patches. │ < 1291243278 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm scared. < 1291243280 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, OK, put it there. < 1291243281 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You want that option. It is awesomeness. < 1291243289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But I want to build this with pcc eventually! :-) < 1291243296 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But FINE. < 1291243313 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make: *** [extra/locale/c8tables.h] Error 1 < 1291243314 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1291243318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : GEN extra/locale/c8tables.h < 1291243318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :make: *** [extra/locale/c8tables.h] Error 1 < 1291243328 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :could not find a UTF8 locale ... please enable en_US.UTF-8 < 1291243329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1291243426 0 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn37-64.vpn.utu.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1291243484 0 :Sasha2_!~WHAT@97-124-47-244.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291243541 0 :oklofok!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1291243594 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1291243773 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, so wait, you've still not moved past The Story So Far in Fine Structure? < 1291243781 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: indeed < 1291243799 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO SO < 1291243811 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augh < 1291243818 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quit using the cordless phone, parents < 1291243825 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it knocks out the wireless signal < 1291243970 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a cordless phone < 1291243974 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it a cellphone < 1291243981 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1291243988 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a phone without a cord < 1291243990 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :landline < 1291243991 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah yeah i know what it yes < 1291244010 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is < 1291244026 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sasha2_, what idiot designed that? < 1291244079 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: No idea < 1291244094 0 :Sasha2_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :SashaPrime < 1291244102 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find them and screw with their wifi. < 1291244118 0 :SashaPrime!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1291244127 0 :SashaPrime!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they use 2.4 GHz < 1291244127 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, ARE YOU READING IT NOW < 1291244130 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1291244214 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it is done < 1291244236 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, YOU SHOULD BE < 1291244251 0 :SashaPrime!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291244271 0 :Sasha2!~WHAT@97-124-47-244.phnx.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291244318 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It takes an astounding moron to make a cordless phone that hogs the 2.4 GHz space like that. < 1291244331 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1291244331 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"But what person would ever want two cordless phones?" < 1291244339 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :spams the spectrum with noise < 1291244345 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've got like 6 < 1291244369 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one for each room < 1291244381 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though they haven't got a cord to keep them in that room < 1291244388 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they gravitate towards the sofa < 1291244454 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... One for each room? < 1291244457 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your parents are morons. < 1291244473 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1291244488 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, my phone, the one by this computer, is corded < 1291244490 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I built ot < 1291244493 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it* < 1291244517 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then modified it < 1291244538 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it flashes instead of rings, no screen, uses tone-dialing, and has a mute switch. < 1291244559 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh* < 1291244574 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The entire POTS is such a freaking archaic joke. < 1291244578 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :As is the cell network. < 1291244584 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the cable system. < 1291244589 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1291244590 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And analog radio. < 1291244603 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :totally keeping this phone though < 1291244616 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it plugs into the phone jack and sits there < 1291244625 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact, every single telecom system that's not an Internet link is just awful. < 1291244633 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really want a cell phone < 1291244639 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're annoying < 1291244668 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maintain several completely distinct high-bandwidth telecommunication systems? Such a stupid idea. < 1291244907 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1291245089 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION imagines a world where the entire radio spectrum is in use for Internet. And is ecstatic.
< 1291245214 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb. < 1291245284 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION imagines an alien race that sees that spectrum wiping us out because of light pollution
< 1291245308 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sasha2: Eh, we'd already be fucked. < 1291245317 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty much every chunk of spectrum that can be used, is used. < 1291245321 0 :Sasha2!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1291245924 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank goodness for dark sky communities...and eventually orbital telescope arrays < 1291246073 0 :Vorpal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ineiros, gah < 1291246151 0 :perdito!~perdito@koln-d9329d22.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291246198 0 :kresnicka!~Lara@89-212-40-115.dynamic.t-2.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291246225 0 :Goosey!~goose124@99-60-156-25.lightspeed.elpstx.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1291246642 0 :kresnicka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1291247051 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : thank goodness for dark sky communities...and eventually orbital telescope arrays < 1291247054 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i value internet more than the former < 1291247064 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though that barely makes any sense < 1291247067 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :your message didn't anyway < 1291247337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[The worldwide Haskell community met up over beers today to celebrate their unprecedented discovery of an industry programmer who gives a shit about Haskell. < 1291247337 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :On Wednesday, researchers issued a press release revealing that 27-year-old Seth Briars of North Carolina, a Java programmer at Blackwater accounting firm Ross and Fordham, actually gives a shit about Haskell.]] < 1291247338 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :--http://steve-yegge.blogspot.com/2010/12/haskell-researchers-announce-discovery.html < 1291247471 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is, of course, physically impossible to Google for criticism of Newspeak < 1291247482 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[["I'm kind of surprised I'm the only person on earth who gives a shit about it," Briars continued. "I'd have thought there would be more people following the press releases closely and then not using Haskell. But they all just skip the press releases and go straight to the not using it part."]] < 1291247663 0 :Quadrescence!~Quad@unaffiliated/quadrescence JOIN :#esoteric < 1291247808 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[I'm really disappointed that more programmers don't get actively involved in reading endless threads about how to subvert Haskell's type system to accomplish basic shit you can do in other languages.]] < 1291247835 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION learns of Ioke
< 1291247936 0 :wareya!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1291247964 0 :wareya!~wareya@cpe-74-70-142-220.nycap.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric