< 1298505603 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: btw :()^! is also TC, i found out today < 1298505607 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: neat! < 1298505614 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: ithkuil's author at least admits that it isn't natural... < 1298505616 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so like, you have fewer cases in the plural, or not the same modals in the past as in the present, etc etc < 1298505618 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: now just remove ! :-P < 1298505628 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: thinking about it :D < 1298505629 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ithkuil's just a list of elements and a cartesian X < 1298505639 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no conclusive idea yet) < 1298505641 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: Doesn't stop it being _fun_. < 1298505649 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyone can come up with that < 1298505660 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: Sure. does that matter? < 1298505663 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ISTR oklopol was learning ithkuil a while back < 1298505668 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes skills to make something as deliciously torturous as Russian or English or Finnish < 1298505673 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably doing alright at it too... < 1298505685 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i have a sort of transfinite ordinal idea to start showing that :()^ _isn't_ TC, but it may only simplify the problem a little bit) < 1298505685 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: yeah, but there's room for a cartesian product alongside the other interesting stuff. < 1298505707 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, at least the author of ithkuil doesn't believe he's in some kind of mystical communion with the inhabitants of another planet that speaks the language he has channelized < 1298505715 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(there's a conlanger like that...) < 1298505736 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: you misspelled "madman" < 1298505768 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a future boddhisattva that bullies people into supporting his crazy, and has tried organizing conlangers into an organization under his leadership < 1298505781 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the expressed intention of "making conlanging respected by academia" < 1298505791 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and "gaining insight into linguistics through conlanging" < 1298505824 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that guy also is an otherkin < 1298505827 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a cat. < 1298505830 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: at least us esolangers are crazy in similarly predictable ways < 1298505835 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good. < 1298505845 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what's the gravest psychosis present here? < 1298505858 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um not really any as far as i know < 1298505875 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is the only crazy one here :D /me runs away < 1298505878 0 :mtve!~mtve@65.98.99.53 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298505905 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: talk about how terrible lojban is /me gets popcorn < 1298505924 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lojban was intended as an experiment, though, iirc? < 1298505960 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: more like: loglan was, then lojban was formed to develop it to practicality < 1298505969 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "official" name is "Lojban: a realization of Loglan" < 1298505972 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1298505977 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's terrible, btw < 1298505980 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I have a feeling conlangers might < 1298505981 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, I can't keep all that kind of trivia in my mind anyway < 1298505988 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some kind of respect for it < 1298505990 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur would only say "it's not natural" when pressed :D < 1298505991 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know much about it < 1298506012 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my main interests are typology (and syntactical typology primarily) < 1298506030 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lojban jumps between function/verb (forget their name for it) parameters with integral indexes < 1298506033 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a bit lame < 1298506047 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although iirc each index has a specific meaning < 1298506063 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298506073 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is kind of silly, considering that being the subject for some given verb needn't have any real similarity to being the subject of some other, etc. .. < 1298506083 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1298506092 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(otoh, not sure lojban has the idea of subjects) < 1298506097 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(some languages sort of don't) < 1298506162 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :alice in wonderland in lojban is quite amusing, if you scroll down the text fast enough it all looks the same < 1298506185 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1298506191 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on a forum I frequent < 1298506194 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am being called a troll < 1298506206 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a rare event, on the internet! < 1298506218 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :either everyone is trolling or nobody is < 1298506227 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for pointing out that ad hominem is generally not considered fair < 1298506232 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: there's a third possibility, some subset of people are trolling. < 1298506234 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ on a forum dedicated to rationalism! < 1298506235 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hth < 1298506248 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: heh < 1298506254 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not Less Wrong I hope :P < 1298506256 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1298506261 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rationalskepticism < 1298506262 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh < 1298506274 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most "rationalism" forums are a bit (very) terrible < 1298506277 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once I got a moderator advisory there, because a moderator kept misrepresenting my statements < 1298506288 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I called him out on it < 1298506289 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually because they are started by people who equate atheism and rationalism < 1298506296 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously. < 1298506311 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they only pay lip service to the rest of rationalism < 1298506318 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this is something I am afraid may become way more common < 1298506336 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as people too stupid to realize religion is wrong accidentally become atheists < 1298506343 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rationalskepticism looks like an offshoot of the richard dawkins forums to me. but that's just a first impression < 1298506347 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it is < 1298506371 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: well less wrong has very little discussion of atheism but might not be... to the tastes of most denizens of rationalism forums :P < 1298506395 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: law of excluded middle. Nobody can "somewhat troll" < 1298506396 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know of less wrong through another friend, who's kind of fascinated with it < 1298506410 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, uhm, posthumanism and such doesn't really appeal to me. < 1298506413 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: that has nothing to do with the law of excluded middle < 1298506418 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: *transhumanism < 1298506424 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, sorry < 1298506428 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I know. I just like saying random things :-) < 1298506430 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: less wrong isn't mostly about transhumanism tbh < 1298506432 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: :P < 1298506435 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: somewhat, though < 1298506447 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's one of the flavours of stupid that < 1298506449 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: it also sounds somewhat related < 1298506451 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I try and avoid < 1298506451 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Most "rationalism" forums are a bit (very) terrible <-- a bit like "democratic" in the official name of countries? :D < 1298506457 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it attracts me a bit too much < 1298506467 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some reason, stupidity is a thing I love to observe < 1298506467 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it < 1298506470 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: transhumanism isn't stupid IMO; the popular perception of transhumanism on the other hand... < 1298506489 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but like, think of the economy of immortality < 1298506509 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: that only applies if scarcity holds < 1298506511 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: heh indeed < 1298506512 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(immortality, of course, not being all what transhumanism is about, but it's one of the things) < 1298506532 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: more precisely most Less Wrongers are /Singularitarians/ which obviously makes the economy of it irrelevant, ignoring all else < 1298506539 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(because it pretty much implies post-scarcity) < 1298506541 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, singularitarianism is even worse. < 1298506550 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm with Scott Aaronson on that < 1298506553 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :respectfully disagree :) < 1298506562 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thinks that look exponential often turn out to be sigmoid < 1298506569 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: oh ouch, ignore Kurzweil! < 1298506578 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no sane singularitarian argues based on exponential progress < 1298506588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott_: law of excluded middle. Nobody can "somewhat troll" <-- i am wondering if i'm detecting a self-refuting statement here :D < 1298506593 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but even polynomial progress is probably unlikely < 1298506611 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: nobody sane argues for the singularity based on inherent rate of progress either :) < 1298506624 0 :cheater00!~cheater@g229028184.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1298506629 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's not self-referential, so it can't be self-refuting < 1298506634 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from kurzweil it's more a combination of "a singularity would be a good thing; and a singularity is possible" < 1298506668 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, we successfully strayed wildly off topic again! < 1298506671 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i love it when this happens < 1298506678 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :altho I think a singularity would be a good thing, I think it very likely, to the extent it's possible, is less dramatic than we'd think < 1298506692 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: was there a topic? < 1298506699 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: well i first detected accidental self-reference < 1298506714 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: I don't think a suitably-morally-equipped self-improving superintelligence could possibly have a non-dramatic effect, but whatever :0 < 1298506715 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*:) < 1298506732 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereby moral i mean supergoal or equivalent < 1298506741 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do we mean by "superintelligence" < 1298506758 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we barely have a good understanding of what an "intelligence" is, it's hard to really say < 1298506760 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: stop asking questions or i'll end up linking to yudkowsky, which is just too stereotypical < 1298506774 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've read quite a bit of yudkowsky < 1298506781 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm not satisfied with his stuff < 1298506788 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :superintelligence is a well-defined term meaning an intelligence orders of magnitudes greater than a human's, where greater is defined as both more accurate and faster < 1298506790 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not interested enough in the topic to start asking < 1298506797 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298506800 0 :cheater-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1298506803 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not the world's biggest Yudkowsky fan but he's nice enough < 1298506811 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: so.. "I'm right, but too lazy to explain why" < 1298506813 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: so we define something by something we don't quite know wht it is < 1298506822 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: what is it that i don't know what it is < 1298506828 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: no, more like, I may be wrong, but I'm not willing to care enough to be sure about it < 1298506832 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: either Mathnerd314 is trolling, or everybody is trolling. < 1298506840 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: we don't quite know what intelligence is < 1298506843 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. definitely mathnerd < 1298506847 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: yeah, stop trolling already ;-) < 1298506851 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: no, but we don't have to to talk about superintelligences :) < 1298506857 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc Turing said something about there being theorems that anything intelligent will be wrong at times, though < 1298506871 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well, badly rephrased= < 1298506873 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1298506878 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh certainly < 1298506884 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: i realized your statement might not be self-refuting away, since you might be completely trolling < 1298506896 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we don't need to get at the intangible metaphysical ontological epistemological DEEP INNER MEANING of the word "intelligence" to talk about an intelligent being faster and more accurate at making deductions than a human < 1298506901 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(any human, to be precise) < 1298506905 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: Y'know, at this point an artificial human-level intelligence seems not merely possible but will likely happen *soon*. < 1298506919 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: yeah, so is fusion reactors < 1298506925 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: all my statements are intended to be considered as "Mathnerd314 said on IRC that ... " < 1298506927 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I find "soon" far too optimistic. < 1298506930 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both have been decades away for half a century < 1298506932 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can there be Checkout with fixed-point? Is there fixed-point GPU exist? < 1298506942 0 :augur!~augur@pool-74-96-10-120.washdc.east.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298506947 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :miekko: but but but kurzweil told me that < 1298506953 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and unicorns, for everyone!! < 1298506958 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, unicorns < 1298506959 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: We're not too far from it being possible to do whole-brain emulation. < 1298506960 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, I was wrong < 1298506965 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to reevaluate my stance. < 1298506971 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :unicorns, who can oppose them? < 1298506972 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that's not the same thing as writing a self-improving intelligence from scratch :) < 1298506987 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1298506990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I only said human-level intelligence. < 1298506992 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unicrons. < 1298506993 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How are unicorns relevant? < 1298506997 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: oh, didn't see < 1298507007 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: full-brain emulation will be RATHER slow on current hardware though afaik :) < 1298507031 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway < 1298507035 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to reask my question :33 < 1298507036 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Though an emulated brain could plausibly self-improve, what with having no biological limits to care about. :P < 1298507037 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you make the brain you're emulating consider how to optimize your emulation < 1298507055 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: say i want to learn an agglutinative language and ONLY an agglutinative language, how good a pick is japanese < 1298507059 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :vs. say finlandish < 1298507060 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: If it's slower than you, then what's the point? < 1298507062 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should you use quantum computer if you want to attempt this? < 1298507071 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: it'd only be as smart as we are, by definition < 1298507078 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and slower, so we'd do a better job of optimising it than it would < 1298507089 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :never mind that hooking it up to IO ports will take longer than just being able to emulate it < 1298507095 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Depends, how much do you care about Japanese cultural exports? < 1298507096 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it has a much higher incentive < 1298507103 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and of course nobody is likely to raise any complaints when the emulator is switched off permanently, killing a sentient lifeform... < 1298507114 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: not if it doesn't know where it is. < 1298507119 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, not really, think about it, thinking slower is a superpower < 1298507124 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can see stuff pass by much faster < 1298507127 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott_: We're not too far from it being possible to do whole-brain emulation. <-- it occurs to me that it might need a body too in order not to go mad from sensory deprivation < 1298507130 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which, when you have nothing to do, would make things less boring :D < 1298507131 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: sure. I make emulations of sentient people all the time and kill them. < 1298507139 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: indeed. but i doubt that'll stop anyone rushing in to it :) < 1298507143 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: but not sentient emulations < 1298507145 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: s/body/IO/ < 1298507151 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: what now < 1298507156 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: give it an INTERNET BODY < 1298507156 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: is there a difference? < 1298507163 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: just saying you were sucking on chomsky's dick < 1298507165 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing much < 1298507166 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: yes. < 1298507173 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/karthick18/inception/blob/master/inception.c < 1298507174 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no not just IO, we are talking about a _human_ brain here, it needs human-style senses < 1298507185 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: fuck that, internet body < 1298507190 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: The human brain is absurdly flexible about IO, actually. < 1298507193 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hooked right up to porn and reddit < 1298507195 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and irc < 1298507197 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: how many channels are you on? < 1298507199 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: i dont see how that relates to lojban but ok < 1298507202 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :floating in a void of http < 1298507209 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: it was earlier :) < 1298507216 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? < 1298507218 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: all < 1298507219 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: maybe. babies die without touch, you know. < 1298507225 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stick video and sound input *somewhere*, and the brain will actually figure it out. < 1298507230 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: i literally said you were blowing chomsky. < 1298507236 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other senses might be less important, see helen keller < 1298507237 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: impossible, since I have several channels you aren't on < 1298507239 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: yes, you just did < 1298507240 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but why < 1298507241 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what pikhq says is true; the brain can adapt to all kinds of input < 1298507244 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: to insult you < 1298507248 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: o ok < 1298507253 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: entropy < 1298507263 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, yes, getting input is important, but that's not a hard problem. < 1298507268 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: for instance if "artificial vision" were ever done in practice, figuring out how to send it to the brain would basically be unimportant < 1298507273 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the brain could figure it out itself < 1298507277 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: a positive integer, please, expressed in decimal notation < 1298507277 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this has been observed, I strongly recall < 1298507287 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: by joining all channels i have sent out an infinite amount of information, but this information can only alter the universe at a finite rate < 1298507289 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: "Artificial vision" is merely not a common procedure yet. < 1298507299 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: touch would probably be important and the like. but it doesn't need to be mapped to the real world afaik < 1298507301 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*afaict < 1298507309 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: It is, however, actually done. < 1298507320 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: no, because the number of channels on freenode is finite. < 1298507333 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: You would need to make sure your input meets certain parameters < 1298507336 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: not all channels on freenode. < 1298507337 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: and i suspect that if you gave a brain enough data, when it goes all "omg! i'm not getting any touch action", it'd likely map some input it's getting to touch < 1298507340 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*ALL* channels. < 1298507349 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in an "oh, guess my fingers are being all stupid with their signals" way < 1298507351 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the brain is good at dealing with minor details like upside-down-ness < 1298507359 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is, of course, mere speculation. < 1298507368 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: how many channels *on freenode* are you on? < 1298507369 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you still haven't answered my question >:( < 1298507373 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Which? < 1298507380 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: break out of that infinite troll-loop < 1298507383 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: all. < 1298507387 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : pikhq: say i want to learn an agglutinative language and ONLY an agglutinative language, how good a pick is japanese < 1298507387 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : vs. say finlandish < 1298507389 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: sure. < 1298507404 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: you are under my power you will not break out of the loop EVER < 1298507406 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :17:55 < pikhq> elliott_: Depends, how much do you care about Japanese cultural exports? < 1298507415 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: impossible. < 1298507424 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: your soul is mine for EVERRRRRrrrr < 1298507429 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I did not receive that. < 1298507429 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r . r... r. < 1298507440 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I'm asking purely from an agglutinative point of view :P < 1298507446 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to agglutinate SO MUCH < 1298507450 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: hah, how do you know I have a soul? < 1298507455 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Very good. < 1298507460 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314: everyone has a soul. < 1298507460 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: vs. finnish? < 1298507475 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I dunno about Finnish, but Japanese agglutinates a fuckton. < 1298507482 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater00: does... EgoBot have a soul? < 1298507493 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has a ghost. < 1298507494 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: hm < 1298507514 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the major has linked up with it and has found it to have a soul < 1298507530 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ? < 1298507533 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: so does finnish :P < 1298507537 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and batou will tell you she's never wrong about those things. < 1298507544 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but japanese doesn't have an explicit word division right? < 1298507555 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so technically i could speak only in one-word sentences and nobody would notice? SAY YES < 1298507573 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Technically, one-word sentences are pretty common. < 1298507585 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It helps that Japanese is a pro-drop language. < 1298507586 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1298507628 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: speakingsentencesonewordofexclusivelyelliottdesires < 1298507634 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> <_< < 1298507643 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sentencesspeaking < 1298507646 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: i'm just acknowledging your statements without anything new to say... < 1298507653 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh right :D < 1298507655 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot i was like < 1298507656 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :talking < 1298507669 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :japanese is like golfing for speech < 1298507711 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: "iti kotohàno hùn tàke hanasitai"? < 1298507733 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's far too many spaces. < 1298507747 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I would stick that into Google Translate but you're still using your romanisation scheme :P < 1298507768 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...now we see the REAL evil of pikhq's romanisation plot < 1298507770 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :「一言葉の文だけ話したい。」 < 1298507798 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg you can type "jap" to select japanese in the google translate box < 1298507798 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gaaah, I did it wrong, anyways. < 1298507800 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and "en" for english and whatever < 1298507805 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/一/一つ/ < 1298507810 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/iti/hitotu/ < 1298507810 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but but but that's like multiple words! < 1298507843 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Agglutination doesn't go that far in any language, man. < 1298507852 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: does in polysynthetic ones! < 1298507873 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't ainu use kanji? < 1298507877 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's polysynthetic, maybe i could pretend ;D < 1298507880 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh or is it just kana < 1298507887 0 :kwertii!~kwertii@ResNet-32-197.resnet.ucsb.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1298507888 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ainu only uses katakana. < 1298507896 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which are very poorly suited to Ainu, anyways. < 1298507908 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :From Classical Ainu, another polysynthetic, incorporating, and agglutinating language: < 1298507908 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Usaopuspe aejajkotujmasiramsujpa. < 1298507908 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : usa-opuspe a-e-jaj-ko-tujma-si-ram-suj-pa < 1298507908 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : various-rumors 1-APL-REFL-far-REFL-heart-sway-ITER < 1298507908 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : 'I keep swaying my heart afar and toward myself over various rumors.' (i.e., I wonder about various rumors.) < 1298507913 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only problem there is the single space < 1298507918 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just remove that, and it's perfect < 1298507928 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also remove the stupid... communication by overwrought metaphor :D < 1298507943 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:20:57 --- quit: clog (*.net *.split) < 1298507955 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an interesting link to see in the tunes.org logs... < 1298507961 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1298507980 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298507993 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm it's clog_ at the moment < 1298508007 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so probably that was genuine < 1298508152 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:18:31 Switching over to Ion3 ;-) < 1298508152 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:20:25 --- quit: Sgeo (Remote closed the connection) < 1298508152 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:25:49 --- join: Sgeo (n=sgeo@ool-18bf61f7.dyn.optonline.net) joined #esoteric < 1298508152 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:32:50 --- quit: Sgeo (Remote closed the connection) < 1298508152 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :10:34:41 --- join: Sgeo (n=sgeo@ool-18bf61f7.dyn.optonline.net) joined #esoteric < 1298508157 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH GOD, I FEEL HIS MALICIOUSNESS < 1298508158 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;-) < 1298508161 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm scared. < 1298508187 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Further evidence of Sgeo_'s decline: my initial reaction was "SGEO? Using ion3? wait, this is from 2006.") < 1298508407 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: watashinorisoutekinagengodehabunshouha1tsunotangodesu. < 1298508420 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : what. < 1298508438 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I'm not sure I'd call that a single word. < 1298508444 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Do you see any spaces? < 1298508448 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (What does that read as, BTW :P) < 1298508485 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: network repair < 1298508499 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my logical language, sentences will have only 1ne word. < 1298508505 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"1ne" xD < 1298508509 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it that's not idiomatic. < 1298508515 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was *ideal* language, btw. < 1298508536 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, minor mistranslation on my part. < 1298508550 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, it's the wrong word for "word". "Tango" is more in the sense of vocabulary. < 1298508550 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: watashihasubetenobunshoudedonnanitanjunmatahafukuzatsunatan'itsunotangotosoreijoudekouseisareterisoutekinagengonoanatatosubetenowatashinobijonwokyouyuushitaitoomoimasu. < 1298508577 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(私はすべての文章でどんなに単純または複雑な単一の単語とそれ以上で構成されて理想的な言語のあなたとすべての私のビジョンを共有したいと思います。) < 1298508591 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Thank God for the kanji, I was about to tell you "fuck no". < 1298508597 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1298508618 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You want to do WHAT with my mother's goat? ...wait, broke the words in the wrong place." < 1298508642 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: My method, by the way, is using Google Translate, then removing all commas from the output :P < 1298508675 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Google Translate seems to have fucked something up. < 1298508692 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :About 1/4th of the way through the grammar falls apart. < 1298508745 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Koreharomajimokantannabunshounidoredakehayakuseichousurukahijouniodorokida! < 1298508749 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(これはローマ字も簡単な文章にどれだけ早く成長するか非常に驚きだ) < 1298508759 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOW SAY IT TEN TIMES FAST < 1298508789 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: That is, in fact, an entirely normal sentence. < 1298508796 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: But, but, I removed a comma. < 1298508805 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (Is it still normal when I remove all the spaces from the romaji? :P) < 1298508814 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Not from the romaji. < 1298508834 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Japanese speakers will add spaces if they're not using kanji, because it's a motherfucking *pain* to read. < 1298508854 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thisismuchmucheasiertoreadthanthatbullshit. < 1298508955 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: What does ^x mean in ascii romaji? < 1298508957 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 'x? < 1298508966 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is ^ just ^ on top of the next letter? < 1298508978 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or previous? < 1298509004 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Depends, whose romaji scheme? < 1298509014 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Romaji Translator at Romaji.org is a free Japanese to Romaji transliteration tool. You can translate japanese text (Kanji,Hiragana,Katakana) into Romaji or Hiragana. < 1298509015 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT ONE < 1298509017 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1298509026 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"to^suto" is the relevant word < 1298509041 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It goes on the previous. < 1298509046 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same for '? < 1298509064 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ' is almost certainly being used to disambiguate between moraic "n" and initial-consonant "n". < 1298509071 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1298509073 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So irrelevant, then! < 1298509075 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, is "ou" always õ or not? < 1298509087 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ou" is *usually* a long o. < 1298509140 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: kyōfunotôsutonikeńeniki < 1298509205 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :xD < 1298509262 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I just confused pikhq to death. < 1298509327 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, pikhq is just in need of some space now < 1298509934 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: is :()^D tc, where D is dip? >:D < 1298509937 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh better < 1298509937 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::()D < 1298509947 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::~()D maybe < 1298509952 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er ~:()D < 1298509953 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is < 1298509996 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm how do you write ^ in terms of D < 1298510017 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you want ~ < 1298510036 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just trying to be helpful < 1298510041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lessee < 1298510043 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: simple, have only even stack elements matter < 1298510048 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(real)(junk)(real)(junk) < 1298510056 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh < 1298510061 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1298510064 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am guessing it can be done directly < 1298510070 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1298510080 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i'm not guaranteeing that it works like normal dip though < 1298510084 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could put the stack element somewhere else entirely! < 1298510095 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(unless this is obviously impossible to do ^ directly with which i suspect) < 1298510097 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well of course that doesn't matter < 1298510098 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in which case HAVE YER GUARANTEE) < 1298510104 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: oh right, it doesn't... < 1298510115 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking you could examine the result or something < 1298510176 0 :Wamanuz!~Wamanuz@78-69-168-43-no84.tbcn.telia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298510184 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm it's easy to get ^() , that's just (())DD < 1298510202 0 :rodgort!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298510202 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and then : < 1298510202 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :pumpkin < 1298510238 0 :Wamanuz5!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298510238 0 :aloril!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298510239 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah ^ is (())DD: if the stack has at least one element after the ^ < 1298510260 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i don't think this subset has any way of deleting a lone stack element < 1298510293 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er damn < 1298510300 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehow i wrote : for * < 1298510321 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok it's actually difficult to delete anything simple then < 1298510327 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1298510332 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :duh < 1298510344 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ = (())DDD < 1298510365 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :again assuming at least one element on the stack after the ^ < 1298510429 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: ' is not a bloody diactric in Japanese. < 1298510451 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are capable of doing (x)~ as ((x))D < 1298510455 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I thought it was in your super-retarded-romanisation-scheme < 1298510463 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Yes, but not in any other ones. < 1298510471 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I decided to be retarded. < 1298510472 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: i think it looks likely that :()D is TC < 1298510489 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even without ~, obviously with < 1298510496 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ok. what about ~()D < 1298510497 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or *()D < 1298510500 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: In every other romanisation scheme, it exists to distinguish, say, んや from にゃ (n'ya from nya). < 1298510505 0 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298510508 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't knock this bullshit, it could be the key to understanding :()^ ! < 1298510513 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: : is still indispensable < 1298510521 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm < 1298510534 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ok what about this operation: "dip, then duplicate second-on-stack to top-of-stack" < 1298510535 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is < 1298510537 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after dipping < 1298510538 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no way to increase total size otherwise < 1298510539 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a b c < 1298510541 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1298510543 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a b c b < 1298510555 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a fairly important distinction, really. < 1298510560 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for instance ((x))V would push (x) on the top of stack < 1298510563 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also on the third on stack < 1298510663 0 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1298510710 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(y)((x)V -> (x)(y)(x) ? < 1298510717 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*(y)((x))V -> (x)(y)(x) ? < 1298510723 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yep < 1298510756 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we had !, then (x)(y)(z)(!)V -> (x)(z)(x) < 1298510766 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: basically it's < 1298510770 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :D(:)D~ < 1298510770 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1298510773 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1298510786 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the question is ~()V or *()V < 1298510792 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even !()V :P < 1298510889 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well D = V! < 1298510991 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ = (())DDD still, and : = ()()D(^)D < 1298511013 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so !()V is enough at least < 1298511021 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : well D = V! < 1298511027 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only if you have enough stack left < 1298511030 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ok, *()V then < 1298511036 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems like you'll need junk handling again < 1298511036 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um no always < 1298511041 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm < 1298511047 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: V requires more elements than D < 1298511051 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can easily just prefix your program with a shitload of ()s < 1298511055 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in the loops < 1298511056 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it hardly matters < 1298511057 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i...think < 1298511061 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well we need enough stack for ^ anyway < 1298511065 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then maybe you can't do it _forever_... < 1298511069 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in < 1298511073 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't push ()s down far enough in a loop < 1298511106 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um that's not a problem, the parts that need dummy stack elements don't actually disturb them < 1298511120 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm right... < 1298511127 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that < 1298511133 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :((x))V < 1298511135 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is invalid for instance < 1298511161 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1298511266 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just put the maximum () at the start for each emulation, D, ^ and : < 1298511284 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: so *()V and ~()V :D < 1298511288 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will never be disturbed unless the converted program itself runs out of stack < 1298511296 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my secret plan is that one of these will turn out to be semantically equivalent to :()^ somehow < 1298511298 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :forget i said that < 1298511311 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find that unlikely < 1298511313 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok ~()V first < 1298511406 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ouch < 1298511422 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the HARD-HITTING FORCE OF REALITY? < 1298511427 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :after V, whatever is on the top will also be at third < 1298511431 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YEP < 1298511433 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1298511439 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1298511523 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may be necessary to let the programs produce easily removable junk < 1298511630 0 :cal153!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298511673 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so let's say there's a () kept on top of stack near constantly, and converted subprograms expect and preserve it < 1298511722 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait they don't expect it, but they put it there < 1298511835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1298511860 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to neuter the duplication when needed, use _three_ () on top of stack < 1298512003 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really cannot be bothered with this < 1298512164 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: YOU LOSE :D < 1298512173 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is *()V likely to be any easier? :P < 1298512188 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, i left that for last because i have no f idea for it < 1298512189 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haha... Pic having some rodent with a stinger missile. < 1298512222 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just as i still have no idea for :()^*) < 1298512404 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well no more than a vague feeling that i hope means my intuition is working on it < 1298512946 0 :augur!~augur@208-59-167-26.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298512972 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well obviously in that scheme, a is (()~*())* < 1298513516 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1298513537 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: :D < 1298513539 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can ban me for that < 1298513547 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :YES < 1298513561 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-> < 1298513639 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1298513699 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copumpkin < 1298513786 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:44 < Pseudonym> I've almost finished reproducing the 6502 (from the transistor-level simulation) in logisim. < 1298513806 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am in awe. < 1298513830 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasn't that done in js lately < 1298513903 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Well, from the logic-gate level simulation you could put it into Minecraft. < 1298513926 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1298513931 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :VERY SLOWLY < 1298513936 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there might be chunk limits on that though. < 1298513963 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect you could actually get it into a few chunks... < 1298513970 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The CPU would tower from bedrock to sky, though. < 1298514007 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the 6502 is rather more complex than could fit in a few chunks. < 1298514016 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider that redstone is *rather* simplistic. < 1298514019 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And chunks are only 16x16. < 1298514197 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq is secretly tarski's reincarnation < 1298514198 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true fact < 1298514749 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Could you actually get a 6502 in 144x144x128? < 1298514814 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That's 2,654,208 blocks, but of course you need *space* to have redstone, a wire takes up a whole block. < 1298514826 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You also need repeaters (newly-introduced), and who knows how many chunks they will go across? < 1298514845 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Certainly the game only loads the nearest 81 chunks. < 1298514849 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. 9x9. < 1298514852 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you stood in the centre... well... < 1298514871 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: "I doubt it". < 1298514882 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Have you SEEN the size of the ALU? I haven't seen the CPU but it must be much bigger. < 1298514913 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps it is POSSIBLE to crunch the 6502 into that space, although I doubt it. But I bet you'd need to essentially brute-force every possible configuration to crunch it that far down. < 1298514921 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CPUs are complex shit, yo. < 1298514928 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and that's ignoring memory. Which of course you need. < 1298514929 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.weihenstephan.org/~michaste/pagetable/6502/6502-die.jpg There's the entire thing. < 1298514945 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes. You will notice how far zoomed-out that is. < 1298514949 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, maliciousness? < 1298514954 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Also, remember that redstone is significantly less compact than, you know, real electronics. < 1298514956 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is me using Ion3 malicious? < 1298514967 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: So, we need to mod Minecraft. :P < 1298514969 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gates take up quite a few blocks. < 1298514980 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Mod it with a 6502 block. < 1298515151 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wishes that the pirateness allowed for updating Minecraft < 1298515167 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION , alternately, wishes for $ < 1298515256 0 :hagb4rd2!~hagb4rd@koln-4db40b86.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298515416 0 :hagb4rd!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1298515465 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I like Clojure except for the Java stuff < 1298515682 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: just redownload from s3 < 1298515688 0 :azaq231!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1298515688 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: your non-login should still work < 1298515699 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably :P < 1298515725 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: That's just the launcher. < 1298515736 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: from _s3_ < 1298515743 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because mojang suck at security remember? < 1298515747 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. how you got it in the first place? < 1298515751 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1298515758 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just minecraft.jar changes i think. < 1298515767 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't THINK it modifies minecraft.jar to figure out whether you've paid < 1298515772 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just changing that in-place should work < 1298515807 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: (keep a backup of ~/.minecraft just in case it doesn't...) < 1298515835 0 :yiyus!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298515874 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yar, me mateys. < 1298515891 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: it's not piracy. it's direct from mojang itself! < 1298515906 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :java.lang.ClassNotFoundException: net.minecraft.client.MinecraftApplet < 1298515914 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's... Not good. < 1298515938 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Oh, are you still on the old launcher? < 1298515942 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably it only works with the new one. < 1298515953 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.minecraft.net/download/minecraft.jar?v=1298517805112 < 1298515955 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again, copy with care. < 1298515998 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Wait, I downloaded the wrong jar off of S3. < 1298516017 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*There* we go. < 1298517122 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. Redstone delay line memory... < 1298517585 0 :elliott_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1298518247 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1298518253 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is possible to get stone before wood. < 1298518262 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just need to start by punching creepers. < 1298518299 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Cook_Me_Flax < 1298518360 0 :Cook_Me_Flax!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :TLUL < 1298518420 0 :TLUL!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke* < 1298518436 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298519154 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello. Are we boring around here at the current time? < 1298519334 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1298519359 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298519609 0 :Zuu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1298519891 0 :Zuu!zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1298520420 0 :sftp_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298521457 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1298521809 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298522333 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298522855 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1298522857 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :<_< < 1298522883 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mannsì まんじ マンジ 卍 < 1298522908 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah < 1298522921 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott and the clojure guys agree on something! < 1298522927 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :amalloy> in lieu of competing theories, i'm going to propose that it's because you're nuts < 1298522935 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1298522946 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello zzo38 . have a good old-fashioned boring night? < 1298522950 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :To use Checkout with graphics you would need to add some commands, for vector processing and so on? < 1298522971 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is checkout < 1298522979 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Checkout < 1298523097 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the "see also" section there is a link to a list of commands < 1298523896 0 :augur!~augur@208.58.6.161 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298523910 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a long spec < 1298523916 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll finish reading late < 1298523918 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :r < 1298524060 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1298524083 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is OK. However, what things do you know about GPU? < 1298524427 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088172176.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1298524488 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o.O' < 1298524506 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modern x86 processors have instructions that take 0 clock ticks. < 1298524509 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do all level 1 units share the instruction pointer? And is abstain/1 allowed with an else part or not? < 1298524516 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Which instructions? < 1298524544 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: The set of x87 stack swapping instructions. < 1298524814 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My linear algebra professor seems to love proofs. < 1298524835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY, DOESN'T EVERYONE < 1298524848 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So far, I have been assigned every single problem in the textbook that involves proving something. < 1298524889 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is pretty fucking tedious in linear algebra. Like everything else. < 1298524932 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why am i porting ffmpeg to the DSi < 1298524984 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :asiekierka: I don't know why. < 1298524990 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1298524996 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i know why and that's the sad part < 1298525000 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to run youtube on my DS < 1298525004 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many programs have you written on the DSi? < 1298525008 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few < 1298525010 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WireWorld DS is one < 1298525014 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :subleqDS is the worse one < 1298525016 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also many ports < 1298525023 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jim, a TCL interpreter < 1298525027 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MegaHal (done horribly but oh well) < 1298525046 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaaah, Jim. < 1298525052 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Such a nice interpreter. < 1298525632 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i downloaded the ffmpeg port for iOS to my ipod, but i can't use it because mobileterminal won't start :/ < 1298525681 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A MegaHAL is 9000000000 < 1298525690 0 :coppro!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*9000000000 < 1298525902 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq if you want the port ask me < 1298525904 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not now, i gtg < 1298525905 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye! < 1298526207 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1298527602 0 :ferix2x!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1298528062 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are still some questions I have about Checkout < 1298528267 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you'll have to wait for ais523 for that < 1298528318 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1298528979 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Later < 1298529748 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298530228 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298530246 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-192-17.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298530868 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: 9000000000? that's over... < 1298532732 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1298532758 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@209-6-232-56.c3-0.sbo-ubr1.sbo.ma.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298532761 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Changing host < 1298532761 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1298532843 0 :kwertii!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: bye < 1298534399 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1298534400 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1298536572 0 :yiyus!1242712427@server1.bouncer4you.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1298537095 0 :Mannerisky!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1298538312 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-174-181.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298538324 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1298541192 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1298545927 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1298546773 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298546780 0 :SimonRC!~sc@fof.durge.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298546869 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298546990 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181135000.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1298549837 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298550549 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1298552157 0 :Tritonio!Tritonio@afrodite.ceid.upatras.gr JOIN :#esoteric < 1298553015 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088172176.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1298553043 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298554142 0 :miekko!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Zwaarddijk < 1298554147 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298554398 0 :sftp!~sftp@79.174.49.11 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298556091 0 :Mannerisky!~mannerisk@71-38-36-196.frgo.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298557226 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-174-186.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298557282 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1298557634 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298558537 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1298559777 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1298559992 0 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1298560017 0 :Tritonio!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1298560218 0 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1298561123 0 :variable!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298561176 0 :variable!~variable@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1298561261 0 :aloril!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :*.net *.split < 1298561603 0 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1298561648 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298561765 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298561768 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298561926 0 :cheater00!~cheater@e181135000.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1298563257 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@unaffiliated/poiuy-qwert/x-0506151 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298563370 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (((((0)S!:^^^!^)(!:^!^))(!((1)S!:^^^!^)(!::^!!^))(!!(e)(!!:^^^^)))(((0)S)(e))(!((1)S)(!:^!!^))(!!(e)(!!:^!^))):^^(^)(::**)::**^^!^ < 1298563370 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11011 < 1298563386 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1298563478 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (((((0)S!:^^^!^)(!:^!^))(!((1)S!:^^^!^)(!::^!!^))(!!(!:^^^^)))(((0)S)())(!((1)S)(!:^!!^))(!!(!:^!^))):^^(^)(::**)::**^^!^ < 1298563479 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11011 < 1298563501 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298563521 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-210-167.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298563524 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (((((0)S!:^^^!^)(!:^!^))(!((1)S!:^^^!^)(!::^!!^))(!!(e)(!!:^^^^)))(((0)S)(e))(!((1)S)(!:^!!^))(!!(e)(!!:^!^))):^^(^)(::::****)::**^^!^ < 1298563524 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1011111 < 1298563583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (((((0)S!:^^^!^)(!:^!^))(!((1)S!:^^^!^)(!::^!!^))(!!(!:^^^^)))(((0)S)())(!((1)S)(!:^!!^))(!!(!:^!^))):^^(^)(::::****)::**^^!^ < 1298563584 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1011111 < 1298563589 0 :r7!~r7@ideal-1-pt.tunnel.tserv6.fra1.ipv6.he.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298563624 0 :r7!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1298563667 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ^ working two-counter machine with :()^!S < 1298563674 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1298563688 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, this is getting ridiculous < 1298563695 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it the ! is absolutely required in that? < 1298563720 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes, it's the main mechanism for selecting cases in the tables < 1298563751 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw it prints a numeral in reversed binary < 1298563781 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obvious that both : and ^ are necessary, without : there's an entropy rule that lets you prove all programs halt, without ^ you can only ever run commands in the original program and so all programs must halt too < 1298563810 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i wrote arguments for :()^ necessary in the new minimization section < 1298563814 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1298563828 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :() is pretty obvious, given that none of the other commands can legally be run unless () has been run first < 1298563835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1298563879 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw entropy = size of stack in characters + size of remaining program in characters + 3*number of a's < 1298563903 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, 2*times < 1298563912 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one time is included in the others < 1298563918 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*2*number < 1298563928 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just count a pair of parens as 1 rather than 2, then a doesn't need special-casing < 1298563965 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you still need special casing to make it strictly reducing at each step < 1298564039 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it's obvious you cannot run only a's indefinitely, so you will reduce eventually < 1298564238 0 :yorick!~yorick@gateway/shell/shellium.org/x-jgeiecckmldzsmjo JOIN :#esoteric < 1298564530 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1298564581 0 :yorick!yorick@gateway/shell/shellium.org/x-vtukjfaddjsuzelx JOIN :#esoteric < 1298565194 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :APNIC down 0.01: IPv4: 128k to China, 2k to Australia. IPv6: No allocations. < 1298565240 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long will it last at current burn rate? < 1298565703 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Current 30-day burn rate is: 541 517 addresses per day. At that rate, it will last about 4 months. < 1298565776 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch < 1298565821 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I have some questions about Checkout, can you answer me? < 1298565827 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps < 1298565839 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language isn't quite finalised yet < 1298565846 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will also be interesting what happens after it depletes. How much of the demand will shift to other regions? What will happen to the IPv6 demand? < 1298565852 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298565956 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One question is, would some commands need to be added for graphics processing? < 1298565993 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graphics programming works in just the same way, just the driver works out the correct sequence of commands < 1298566005 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Checkout's very low level, it's like asking if you should add commands to asm for web development < 1298566040 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, it is just the driver that adds the graphics commands. If so, then it is OK, no commands should be added for that. < 1298566190 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have idea for the binary representation of Checkout programs. < 1298566226 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what kind of profiles and stuff does a GPU commonly have? < 1298566259 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally, I'd assume two profiles, one for the GPU, one for the CPU that gives it its instructions < 1298566308 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :typically you'd get 32 or so level 1 subunits of a level 2 unit, and the number of level 2 subunits of a level 3 unit is kind-of complicated because in theory it can go up to 65536 or so on modern GPUs, but is often more efficient with a smaller number like 16 < 1298566322 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm, sorry, that's 3 of 4 < 1298566338 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 of 3 goes up to 16 or so, and again is sometimes more efficient with a smaller number < 1298566602 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do all level 1 units share the same instruction pointer? < 1298566630 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1298566640 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all units share the same instruction pointer, full stop < 1298566663 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but things like if and while can sort-of magically disappear the instruction pointer from some units and place it back later < 1298566667 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all in zero time < 1298566682 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sort of thing is why, for instance, you can't put nop/3 inside while/2, because it wouldn't make logical sense < 1298566798 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, I assume you're talking to cheater? < 1298566808 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, to zzo38 < 1298566819 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cheater hasn't said anything since I joined the channel < 1298566827 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you compile a Checkout program to run on GPU, can you do video rendering? (Of course the program would have to fit the specific GPU profiles and stuff, I guess) < 1298566834 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW: Long-term growth rate of APNIC allocations seems to be about 19% per year. < 1298566846 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think it depends on the details of the driver < 1298566871 0 :iamcal!~cal@c-24-4-207-72.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298566901 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, with some GPU architectures, you could just write to the right part of level 5 memory and the rendering would appear onscreen < 1298566908 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's massively system-specific < 1298567009 0 :cal153!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298567242 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At 10x expansion for IPv6 deployment + 19% per year, APNIC would allocate in about 6 years. < 1298567268 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully they'll stop wasting IPv6 the way they wasted IPv4 at some point < 1298567291 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if it 90% runs out before they wake up, there'll still be huge numbers of addresses left < 1298567497 0 :poiuy_qwert!~poiuy_qwe@unaffiliated/poiuy-qwert/x-0506151 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298567564 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reaching 90% depletion would mean expanding address usage from current by about 3.5 orders of magnitude. < 1298567564 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: However, assume now that I have no graphics card and just the GPU and am connecting everything myself. Would you know which GPU devices can be used and how to output to TV screen? < 1298567584 0 :poiuy_qwert!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1298567587 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do suppose I can use macros to make the system-specific stuff for the output < 1298567597 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: GPUs which don't also contain a video card won't output to TV screens at all < 1298567612 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the vast majority of GPUs on existence are on video cards (= graphics cards) for that reason < 1298567678 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Humans are very bad at comprehending huge numbers. And IPv6 involves huge numbers. < 1298567818 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, how would I do if I put the GPU and video output chip, and also a RAM to communicate with other devices (such as CPU) on a board by myself < 1298567875 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION would hazard guess that is what a graphics card _is_ < 1298567879 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a guess < 1298567882 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might want to look up pages about motherboard design; it's a pretty complicated subject, and one that I don't fully understand < 1298567899 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and designing just a graphics card is similar but on a smaller scale < 1298567917 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it likely won't matter in practice, because the vast majority of GPUs you can buy are on graphics cards already) < 1298568042 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many IPv4 /16 or bigger allocations there are? Loads (something like 14 000 individual allocations, to lesser set of holders). Just how many IPv6 /19s there will be allocated? Currently there are 5. < 1298568125 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The point is. IPv4 /16 isn't that large. But IPv6 /19 is frickin huge. < 1298568228 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At even 75% utilization, that would mean 384M /48s. < 1298568230 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean I want to buy one that is not on a graphics card already. I want to learn how to connect it myself < 1298568282 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to learn how to connect it *to* myself < 1298568340 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: You just unplug the optic nerve from your eye, and go from there. < 1298568359 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fiber-optic nerve, mmmm < 1298568574 0 :ais523!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298568587 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember even if you equate /48s and individual IPv4 addresses (!) there are still 13 bits left over... And 13 bits is 8192 times. < 1298568687 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And besides, mobile handsets will probably only eat one /64 per handset. < 1298568850 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even at 16 billion devices (easy to calculate and leaves some margin), that's a /30 total. < 1298568889 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298568897 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-167-41.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298568911 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and there are many more RIR-allocated /48s than there are IPv4 addresses total. < 1298568950 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That count is quite rapidly approaching 10 billion. < 1298568992 0 :TLUL!~TLUL@wikia/The-last-username-left JOIN :#esoteric < 1298569054 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Currently at 9 623 680 978 < 1298570008 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Turn on...the Doom Light! < 1298571227 0 :asiekierka!~asiekierk@078088172176.elblag.vectranet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1298571894 0 :pumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1298572002 0 :copumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298572144 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (((((0)S!:^^^!^)(!:^!^))(!((1)S!:^^^!^)(!::^!!^))(!!(!:^^^^)))(((0)S)())(!((1)S)(!:^!!^))(!!(!:^!^))):^^(^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^)^!^ < 1298572144 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :11011 < 1298572209 0 :Leonidas!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298572645 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@137.125.187.237 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298573584 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1298573667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:30:47 ... < 1298573667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:30:53 It is possible to get stone before wood. < 1298573667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :19:31:02 You just need to start by punching creepers. < 1298573673 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you need wood to craft that into tnt. < 1298573676 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can get diamond before wood. < 1298573682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just taunt creepers into exploding. < 1298573686 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :until you get lucky < 1298573690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: argh, no ais < 1298573705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:48:28 Hah < 1298573705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:48:41 elliott and the clojure guys agree on something! < 1298573705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :20:48:47 amalloy> in lieu of competing theories, i'm going to propose that it's because you're nuts < 1298573707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are, but what? < 1298573732 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-181-197.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298573757 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298574579 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298574608 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298574695 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: new underload section, about minsky machine < 1298574705 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: cool! i'm working on an underload test suite myself, a la mycology < 1298574712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1298574713 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: mostly because everyone gets concatenation the wrong way around, including me :D < 1298574721 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right :D < 1298574731 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul ((a)S)((b)S)((c)S)(^)(!^)*^ < 1298574731 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ca < 1298574739 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul ((a)S)((b)S)((c)S)(!^)(^)*^ < 1298574739 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ba < 1298574844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :invalid instruction (GOOD) < 1298574844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a < 1298574845 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*no a < 1298574847 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1298574908 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (( prop)*S)((DANGER))((OHNO)S)(!^)(^)*^ < 1298574908 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...bad insn! < 1298574916 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: wat < 1298574924 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1298574943 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298574944 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (( prop)*S)((DANGER))((OHNO)S)(!^)(~^)*^ < 1298574944 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DANGER prop < 1298574947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (( prop)*S)((DANGER))((OHNO)S)(!^)(~^)~*^ < 1298574948 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OHNO < 1298574965 0 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@137.125.187.237 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298574975 0 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1298575014 0 :asiekierka!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1298575134 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: btw challenge for you < 1298575144 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1298575180 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have been challenged by elliott! < 1298575209 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: let p === q mean "p is semantically equivalent to q when run", i.e. (()!) === (). construct p such that (p)(p)* === (), (p)(p)^ === (p), and ()(p)^ === () < 1298575322 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A new challenger appears! < 1298575378 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: verily < 1298575385 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, how to test :... < 1298575399 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a simple way to test two smith numerals for equality? :p < 1298575451 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rephrasing (pp) === (), (p)p === (p), ()p === () < 1298575463 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: indeed < 1298575465 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: there's one in the look-and-say program < 1298575467 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: since they are evidently complicated enough to have their own name, probably not :P < 1298575475 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: it's just what i'm calling church numerals in underload >:D < 1298575479 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they're not actually church numerals < 1298575506 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should call them "the satanic numerals" or something, to emphasize that last point. < 1298575515 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1298575518 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i better look up my las scratch file < 1298575533 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: for equality? or for the PEE CHALLENGE wait no < 1298575542 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :necronomical numerals? < 1298575548 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: don't bother if the former < 1298575560 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for equality < 1298575563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't use anything but ()~*^! < 1298575572 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, i don't explicitly test !, I should do that < 1298575588 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok it uses a* of course < 1298575610 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: can't use it then :D, unless I test a before :... < 1298575820 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: btw ()p === () is a bit misleading < 1298575827 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, it can end up with (()!) on the stack instead of () < 1298575833 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they are semantically equivalent < 1298575846 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :similarly, (p)p doesn't have to push (p) directly, just equivalent < 1298575849 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and (pp) for () < 1298575856 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i figured that < 1298575875 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since (pp) cannot possibly be equal to () < 1298575886 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er except for p = < 1298575898 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed :P < 1298575919 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1298575929 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally that _is_ a solution to your challenge >:D < 1298575948 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: uh hm < 1298575961 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: and p =/= null string < 1298575970 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFF < 1298575974 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would tell you why, but it'd spoil my hidden intention >:D < 1298575984 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(given p, (p) = smith numeral -1) < 1298575986 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect you are up to: no good. < 1298575990 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHOOPS SPOILED IT < 1298575997 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: No good is what I am up to! < 1298576007 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it shouldn't be equivalent to the null string either, i take < 1298576013 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: indeed :D < 1298576016 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because then (p) would just be 1 < 1298576048 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if it helps, (!())p can be whatever or even fail to terminate ;D < 1298576053 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(0^-1 = 1/0) < 1298576070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually let's ignore ()p < 1298576078 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :since expecting ^-1 is probably overly-optimistic or something < 1298576085 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(pp) === (), (p)p === (p) < 1298576317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm now how to test a... < 1298576340 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is the same as pp === , no? < 1298576452 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes. oh, note that (pp)^ can fail if the rest of the stack is empty < 1298576464 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say (pp) === (:!) < 1298576496 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's pretty essential < 1298576551 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm do we actually have anything fulfilling pp === without p === < 1298576558 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: === :! < 1298576563 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are you just wondering anyway? < 1298576583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :um i was assuming non-empty stack here < 1298576589 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well right < 1298576591 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure < 1298576600 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: maybe if p goes like < 1298576609 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"is the TOS my special marker? if so, pop it, otherwise, push it" < 1298576610 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh of course < 1298576612 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~ < 1298576620 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that requires _two_ elements on stack < 1298576622 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't acceptable < 1298576626 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ok let's refine it even further: < 1298576632 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sheesh < 1298576637 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(smith numeral)pp === (smith numeral) < 1298576640 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1298576646 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(~)* < 1298576652 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1298576659 0 :Leonidas_!~Leonidas@unaffiliated/leonidas JOIN :#esoteric < 1298576672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul ((~)*))(~)*S < 1298576672 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...bad insn! < 1298576678 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul ((~)*)(~)*S < 1298576679 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(~)*~ < 1298576690 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so is that identical to (p) < 1298576694 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, it's not < 1298576704 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's the (p)p === (p) rule) < 1298576714 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: does your equality tester require :? < 1298576716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if not, i can use it, it seems < 1298576729 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm < 1298576787 0 :Leonidas_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Leonidas < 1298576804 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1298576835 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it does < 1298576877 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't use !, incidentally < 1298576888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh :D < 1298576889 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1298576897 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just wondering how to test : sanely... < 1298576916 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's entirely accidental < 1298576926 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in a way that lets me print (BAD: ...) if, for instance, : just does nothing) < 1298576946 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you probably need ! to actually use this function < 1298576947 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha wait... < 1298576950 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have an idea < 1298576954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1298576971 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(BAD)(GOOD):S < 1298576973 0 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1298576981 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er wait < 1298576986 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(BAD)(GOOD):!S < 1298577020 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, thanks < 1298577026 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: rather, < 1298577029 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298577037 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :((BAD: ...)S(:^):^)((GOOD: ...)S):!^ < 1298577038 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-231-186.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298577081 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure infinite looping is a good idea, what if it doesn't flush output < 1298577118 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it ends with a newline < 1298577125 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is a good idea, because the rest of the tests will go haywire if I don't < 1298577128 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...i guess. < 1298577139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1298577139 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1298577143 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could execute an invalid instruction < 1298577148 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'll probably go better < 1298577154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it's somewhat unlikely (:^):^ will work if : doesn't < 1298577161 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's true :D < 1298577279 0 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1298577285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNDEF: If the following pair of brackets has double-quotes before < 1298577285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :both brackets, your implementation doesn't support the (never-implemented) < 1298577285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quoting rules: "["] < 1298577341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/DDJB < 1298577341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tada < 1298577345 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :burden.ul test suite < 1298577352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1298577353 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :has a todo left in there < 1298577367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/fLWW < 1298577367 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there < 1298577379 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298577395 0 :tswett!~Warrigal@thay.Stanford.EDU JOIN :#esoteric < 1298577407 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that tswett, always cycling to brag with his hostname < 1298577483 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well derlo passes :D < 1298577485 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as does relief < 1298577497 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :who wants to feed it to fungot :D < 1298577552 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298577618 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do have that standalone copy of the interp somewhere. < 1298577674 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that would be cool :P < 1298577716 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey look, oerjan is on reddit: "I got drunk one night, came back to my hotel and booked flights to the North pole.....the next day I was in Svalbard.....AmA" < 1298577748 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1298577812 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: WE ARE EAGERLY AWAITING YOUR STANDARDS CHECKING < 1298577814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :also fungot is gone < 1298577839 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It probably dropped doing my recent, well, dropping. < 1298577860 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I need to remove newlines from your thing, my thing uses \n as end-of-program. :p < 1298577890 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The output of that will be uh... interesting... < 1298577902 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TEMPTED TO DISQUALIFY YOU FOR THAT < 1298577904 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298577924 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1298578035 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/burden -- the "bad insn" at the end could be just something I managed to accidentally add when removing newlines. < 1298578066 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: "XNLX"? < 1298578070 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1298578076 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Probably you newline-terminated the file. < 1298578077 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a silly. < 1298578092 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1298578096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Anyway I refuse to accept your test results unless that cfunge was compiled with -DEXACT_BOUNDS. < 1298578105 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it ends with SXNLX. :p < 1298578112 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise clearly your implementation of Funge-98 is non-conforming and the results are therefore not reliable. < 1298578128 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how it was compiled; I didn't even know I had cfunge in path. < 1298578146 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cfunge 0.9.0 [+con +trace +exact-bounds +ncurses hardened p:64 c:32] < 1298578154 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HMM. < 1298578169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I would trust your results if they came from CCBI or Shiro, two RESPECTABLE implementations. < 1298578186 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :One of which isn't available anywhere < 1298578247 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: EXCUSE ME, I would of COURSE be DELIGHTED to provide fizzie with the REQUISITE IMPLEMENTATION MATERIALS to complete his testing procedure. < 1298578251 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But CCBI is ALSO ACCEPTABLE OF COURSE. < 1298578274 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298578299 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://p.zem.fi/burden-ccbi < 1298578300 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest99439 < 1298578318 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, well, you know those D compilers, they're quite buggy and whatnot. < 1298578319 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you didn't trust CCBI binaries. < 1298578323 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, okay, fine, you pass. < 1298578325 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH. < 1298578330 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant raises an IMPORTANT POINT. < 1298578340 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, you know, for a good cause. < 1298578352 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: That was your opportunity to steal all his IRC logs, dude. < 1298578353 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I were smart, I wouldn't cycle to show off my hostname. < 1298578356 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You BLEW it. < 1298578370 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or _did_ you < 1298578377 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1298578383 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kidnapped a Stanford student to get it, and if someone asked about my hostname, I would have to say so, and then I would get convicted of kidnapping. < 1298578383 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Why is my network so slow all of a sudden?" < 1298578392 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: What. < 1298578397 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O < 1298578559 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm surprised Deewiant hasn't copyrighted "GOOD:" and "UNDEF:". < 1298578583 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not < 1298578590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am. < 1298578708 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/u3t65.jpg | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1298578773 0 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298578865 0 :MigoMipo!~John@84-217-12-4.tn.glocalnet.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298578884 0 :Guest99439!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1298579583 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1298579638 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298580479 0 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1298580497 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298580890 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1298580896 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, that too. < 1298580915 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, what too? < 1298580932 0 :Guest21139!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298580934 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fungot, too. I had forgotten to bring it back. < 1298580935 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: this is the corresponding verb. not a tree anymore. it's 10am. :( i can pay my rent. good thing paper was originally yellow or it be it by now. :) < 1298580963 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: You can pay your rent? Well, it's about time! You're been mooching off us for ever. < 1298580963 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i am your mother.") for online help, try /msg minion cliki? writing a cv in latex is not hard to do, < 1298580981 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1298580991 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A real bum-bot. < 1298581001 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also mismatched punctuation. < 1298581056 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Perl script version of his babbling does properly matching quotes and parentheses only, but I haven't implemented that feature into the Funge-98 version. < 1298581132 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Still, if he's writing a cv, maybe he's finally getting a job.) < 1298581183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"good thing paper was originally yellow or it be it by now. :)" < 1298581192 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think fungot urinated on your stationary. < 1298581192 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ( lambda x x)) < 1298581209 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Very likely. He's worse than the cat that way. < 1298581243 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You so have to add Roomba control code to fungot.b98 now. < 1298581244 0 :fungot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: don't you mean ( b 1) ( y f):: forall t. ( syntactic analysis is parsing. < 1298581255 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Move with a Markov chain! < 1298581293 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, don't you have a roomba? < 1298581316 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Yes, we have one. I haven't really written anything for it, though. < 1298581319 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@137.125.181.62 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298581345 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, YOU KNOW WHAT YOU MUST DO < 1298581354 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :KICK SGEO UNTIL HE GETS A TRANSFER < 1298581419 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just something useful in case you want to print the date/time with leading zero for month, day, hours, minutes, etc, with TeX: \def\lznum#1{\ifnum#1<10 0\fi\number#1} < 1298581446 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is very simple even to figure out by yourself if you know about TeX. < 1298581454 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it has been a topic here earlier: the latest C1x draft -- http://www.open-std.org/jtc1/sc22/wg14/www/docs/n1548.pdf -- now has the diff-marks in the margin given against the final C99 spec. (Now if they'd get the diff-markers colored and add some sort of "jump to next change" hyperlinks, maybe a regular person could actually read it to check all the C99/C1x differences.) < 1298581473 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't tell Quadrescence! < 1298581487 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are differences between C89/C99, C99/C1x, C89/C1x? < 1298581513 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a full list including the details? < 1298581531 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's called a copy of diff and the two specifications. < 1298581537 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry,t hree specifications. < 1298581547 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Sorry, three < 1298581561 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :13:04:33 Don't tell Quadrescence! < 1298581562 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1298581563 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Did they just take a copy of the old specification and change it? If so, then it would work, but if they rewrote it then such things as that will not work. < 1298581575 0 :Deewiant!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: http://home.datacomm.ch/t_wolf/tw/c/c9x_changes.html has a reasonable summary of C89->C99 changes < 1298581580 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, y'know, Mr C89 is the only C which counts. < 1298581590 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, if they changed some section numbers, it might also do some things wrong. < 1298581592 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Probably they maintain it as a diff, by hand, manually. < 1298581595 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PROBABLY. < 1298581617 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :C1x is based on the C99 document; I don't know how much that is the case when it comes to C89/C99. The published PDFs are not so very nicely diffable, though. < 1298581635 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[In what follows, I'll refer to C as it is defined by its original ISO standard (ISO/IEC 9899:1990, including technical corrigenda TC1 and TC2) as C89, the language as defined by C89 plus the normative addendum 1 is referred to as C94.]] < 1298581640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Regretting not buying C94 at this point. < 1298581640 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do they have published .txt files? < 1298581679 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so, at least not officially. < 1298581716 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: There is no DNS on my computer for home.datacomm.ch < 1298581716 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, it will not load. < 1298581726 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But as was mentioned, at least the C1x draft now has margin-markers like | for changed/new text and * for deleted text; perhaps some sort of a THING could extract only those from it. < 1298581727 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Err, you add DNS entries manually now? < 1298581730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Deewiant is the one who linked that. < 1298581745 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trying to launch space shuttle. The range seems to have some trouble. < 1298581760 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Some computer trouble) < 1298581849 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A dude at comp.lang.c also recently made a hyperlinked version of the C89-standard draft that has been floating everywhere around the internets with the name "ansi.c.txt", at http://www.bsb.me.uk/ansi-c/ansi-c -- but since it's a draft, it's not exactly identical to the real C89. < 1298581885 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :FSVO .txt < 1298581909 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298581969 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1298582127 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The C1x draft itself has a summary of "major changes" for both C1x and C99. < 1298582182 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two minutes remaining to fix that problem. < 1298582248 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see they've added a _Noreturn function-specifier (syntactically speaking same sort of thing as "inline"). < 1298582270 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :They fixed it. Counting down from 5 minutes. < 1298582299 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably just rebooted it. :p < 1298582317 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then were all "Oh, now it worked. Weird." < 1298582337 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1298582349 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something was broken... Maybe it is fixed now I don't know < 1298582407 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari: Is this the Discovery last flight thing? < 1298582417 0 :Ilari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1298582665 0 :Guest21139!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :release < 1298582683 0 :release!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lawl < 1298582689 0 :release!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : /nick release != /nickserv release < 1298582703 0 :release!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1298582772 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Release early, release often. < 1298582872 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1298582883 0 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298582931 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298583147 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@dsl.6.28.53.206.cos.dyn.pcisys.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298583199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Instead of focusing on why an increasing number of people abhor the Batman's odious, xenophobic animadversions and are looking for alternatives, like the truth, I would like to remind people that the Batman's apparatchiks can be stereotyped as evil tools of prepackaged political ideology and lecherous, grotty stumblebums to boot." --Muammar al-Gaddafi, professional nutcase < 1298583211 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :The Batman's Apparatchiks | http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D < 1298583259 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that some sort of an expression, like "the bee's knees"? < 1298583283 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sure hope so. < 1298583286 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :More crazy: < 1298583287 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/frsee/90_of_libya_in_rebel_hands_qaddafi_is_left_only/c1i6a10 < 1298583287 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, nutcase, or BEST TROLL EVER? < 1298583300 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Even the Batman's slaves don't care much for its political objectives; they simply wish to associate with other tendentious desperados and capitalize on our needs and vulnerabilities. Although the Batman won't admit it, it's a financial predator who preys on the elderly, the gullible, and the vulnerable. The Batman seeks their assets to support its own lavish existence. Keep that in mind while I state the following: Every so often, it tries ext < 1298583301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :irpating the very things that I cherish. Whenever it gets caught doing so it raises a terrific hullabaloo calculated to practice human sacrifice on a grand scale in some sort of otiose death cult.]] < 1298583301 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Batman seeks their assets to support its own lavish existence. < 1298583315 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Very easy & funny way to prove Pythagorean Theorem, i.e., a^2 + b^2 =c^2" http://themetapicture.com/media/why-couldnt-i-have-been-shown-this-in-maths-class.gif < 1298583320 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :HILARIOUS < 1298583362 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Are all functions f:N->R continuous?" < 1298583362 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If one accepts the framework I've laid out here, it follows that if we don't raise several issues about the Batman's vile wheelings and dealings that are frequently missing from the drivel that masquerades for discourse on this topic then the Batman will intensify race hatred. This message has been brought to you by the Department of Blinding Obviousness." < 1298583365 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: BEST TROLL EVER. < 1298583366 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. No they aren't. < 1298583375 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes they are, noncontinuous functions don't exist. < 1298583381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : < 1298583393 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-_- < 1298583434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I find it necessary, if I am to meet my reader on something like a common ground of understanding, to point out that the Batman's general prostration before prætorianism confirms that in a the Batman-led society, people who reach out to the poor, the marginalized, and those unfortunate enough to have been labeled as inarticulate by the Batman's propaganda machine will be suppressed, vilified, hated, imprisoned, exiled, and killed. But you knew < 1298583434 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that already. So let me add that the spectrum of views between Jacobinism and materialism is not a line but a circle at which neo-malicious, salacious undesirables and unctuous hedonists meet. To properly place the Batman somewhere in that spectrum one needs to realize that the Batman maintains that corporatism is a noble goal." < 1298583437 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT COMIC BOOKS IS THIS GUY READING < 1298583473 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think he's saying that America is the Batman. < 1298583485 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously. < 1298583541 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"And what I think is this: The Batman's terrorist organization (motto: "Replicate the most morally repugnant structures of contemporary life") is as squalid as squalid can be." < 1298583545 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... don't recall that motto. < 1298583567 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did Mencius Moldbug become a big thing? < 1298583575 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I take it that's Moldbug, no?) < 1298583575 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: He's a big thing? < 1298583576 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've not been watching your Batman, evidently. < 1298583583 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: Ha, nope. < 1298583586 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: Gaddafi. < 1298583590 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok. < 1298583590 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: Seriously. < 1298583593 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1298583596 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's even worse. < 1298583597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe Moldbug _is_ Gaddafi. < 1298583605 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's... it's a really tempting proposition. < 1298583608 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it looks like Moldbug's weird humor < 1298583628 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moldbug is a strange guy; I think we need to keep him around just to have a baseline to measure strangeness by. < 1298583631 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of like the kilogram. < 1298583632 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Batman is all about not using guns ever, and replicating repugnant structures. < 1298583641 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moldbug isn't that excessively out there < 1298583642 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: And corporatism. < 1298583657 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he seems mostly just to be some kind of guy that doesn't take things too seriously < 1298583664 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is willing to admit that things probably are wrong < 1298583674 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Batman: "Better put 5 cents in the meter." < 1298583675 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Robin: "No policeman's going to give the Batmobile a ticket." < 1298583675 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Batman: "This money goes to building better roads. We all must do our part." < 1298583682 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- see, it must be that sort of thing. < 1298583707 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: You can only be so sane when you're an anti-democratic royalist and simultaneously support Austrian economics. < 1298583717 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :true, true < 1298583725 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh look, he's made a post that seems to mention Gaddafi. < 1298583742 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say it's "about" that, but I don't think there's ever enough material on any subject to fill an entire UR post. < 1298583743 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ... anyways, he's a thing in that I've run into at least two persons today even aware of him in entirely different online communities < 1298583752 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ooh, also: < 1298583752 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dick: "Gosh, Economics is sure a dull subject." < 1298583753 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bruce: "Oh, you must be jesting, Dick. Economics dull? The glamour, the romance of commerce... Hmm. It's the very lifeblood of our country's society." < 1298583758 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you had reacted with "Moldbug - who?" he'd be less of a thing < 1298583776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: No, no, I am definitely knowing of things that are not things at all. < 1298583781 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I ran across some sort of "Batman lecturing Robin" quote page when trying to find the most Batmanish thing.) < 1298583791 0 :yorick!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298583794 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: Actually I think my first exposure to him may have in fact been via Stanislav. < 1298583803 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, he is a thing! < 1298583810 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Datskovskiy, that is; relevant overblown rants at http://www.loper-os.org/.) < 1298583811 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but uh, I dunno, the text quoted above somehow < 1298583813 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me at least < 1298583820 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :appeared as sort of moldbug-like? < 1298583821 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moldbug — who? < 1298583832 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: http://unqualified-reservations.blogspot.com/ < 1298583834 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moldbug. < 1298584093 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... am I supposed to be confused? < 1298584108 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mathnerd314, yes. Yes you are. < 1298584110 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's just the mo(u)ld on the bug. < 1298584121 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The haze settles after a while. < 1298584205 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... should I read it now, when I'm sick and my mental defenses against whatever crap he's saying are lower? < 1298584223 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's not mad, just strange. Okay, he's mad. But he's not mad mad. < 1298584226 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just strange. And mad. < 1298584263 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make a Magic: the Gathering card like: "Make X copies of target spell controlled by opponent. Targets and controller of copies are the same as the original." < 1298584281 0 :eurasienne!~ergena@AMontsouris-552-1-130-170.w90-46.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1298584347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eurasienne: Do I pronounce that "eurasian"? < 1298584392 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, you pronounce it like "eurasian" but with an "eh" rather than an "ah"? < 1298584467 0 :eurasienne!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you re asian)) < 1298584546 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this channel is about esoteric programming languages. hello. < 1298584552 0 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-184-66.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298584555 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298584596 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Peace in Libya is quite the remote prospect, but at least we'll get some good television out of it. It's a pity that the dramatic events so far have been so poorly recorded." --Moldbug < 1298584611 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: "Hall of Mirrors" < 1298584633 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Hall of Mirrors? < 1298584656 0 :quintopia!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a suggested name for your card < 1298584671 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1298584968 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'd like to see someone copy that spell. :) < 1298584996 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: How did you go about learning Japanese, anyway? < 1298585021 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Formal classes for 4 years, at which point I had about as much competence as a 5 year old (if that). < 1298585030 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1298585034 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds efficient < 1298585061 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then, I learned the kanji from "Remembering the Kanji", and read a lot. < 1298585099 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Formal classes sound like such a pain. :( < 1298585104 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Which, well, works a heck of a lot better. < 1298585107 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Yeah, yeah, I know.) < 1298585107 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, are formal classes just "phrase books but in class"? < 1298585113 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not the voice of someone with a lot of dedication.) < 1298585129 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I doubt learning kanji and then just plunging into books would work ... < 1298585154 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: A friend of mine started learning Japanese at about the time I got back into studying it... < 1298585156 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remembering the Kanji looks like good shit, though. < 1298585177 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: He learned the kanji, *spent a week on grammar*, then plunged into manga. :P < 1298585225 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Kanji first sounds like something that could work for me and also might not ... on the one hand, it wouldn't require much effort or commitment, just basically-mindless memorisation... but on the other hand, it'd feel like a huge waste of time if I couldn't even express basic sentences for a long time. < 1298585243 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: BTW, might I recommend http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/ ? Khatzumoto is awesome, though slightly insane. :P < 1298585259 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's related to Japan. Insanity is a given. < 1298585280 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION → sleep < 1298585283 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I can guarantee that after a couple days of RTK, you'll be better-off than your typical first-year Japanese student. < 1298585296 0 :Phantom_Hoover!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1298585303 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads http://www.enemieslist.net/japanese/ again for inspiration < 1298585315 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Iraqi war prisoners are often forced to major in Japanese. The term "Holocaust" comes from the Latin roots "Holi" and "Causm", meaning "to major in Japanese".." < 1298585318 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(formal classes work more poorly for Japanese than most other languages, simply because kanji present a serious barrier-to-entry.) < 1298585320 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*remove extra . < 1298585350 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not to say they work any good, anyways) < 1298585351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Japanese vocabulary is determined by throwing tiny pieces of sushi at a dart board with several random numbers attatched to it. The numbers are then fed into a machine. The machine is then destroyed." < 1298585390 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Katakana are used only to spell out foreign words in a thick, crippling japanese accent, so that you'll have no idea what you're saying even though it's in English. However, if you remember one simple rule for Katakana, you'll find reading Japanese much easier: Whenever something is written in Katakana, it's an English word! (note: Katakana is also used for non-english foreign words. And sound effects, and Japanese words)." < 1298585405 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and after RTK the hiragana and katakana will probably come really, really easily. < 1298585427 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Kanji are letters that were stolen from China. Every time the Japanese invaded China (which was very often) they'd just take a few more letters, so now they have an estimated 400 gazillion of them. Kanji each consist of several "strokes", which must be written in a specific order or Japanese people will laugh at you. Each character conveys a specific meaning, like "horse" (note that the character for horse could also mean "car". Or "police offic < 1298585429 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :er". Or "Didacticism")." < 1298585430 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What with both kana systems being highly-mutated kanji used for phonetic value only. < 1298585431 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot how amusing this article is. < 1298585446 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Kanji can also be combined to form new words. For example, if you combine the Kanji for "small", and "woman", you get the word "carbeurator"." < 1298585478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: The one thing about Japanese that's putting me off learning a bit is the retarded politeness stuff... < 1298585479 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :少女 ← ? < 1298585528 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Although I suppose I could just pretend to be from Hokkaido < 1298585532 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Was it Hokkaido?) < 1298585551 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If it makes you feel better, the distinction between plain and polite form is entirely regular and fairly easy, and the distinction between polite form and formal forms *doesn't come up much*. < 1298585569 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not to mention that native speakers fuck it up all the time. < 1298585593 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: It should be mentioned at this point that I forget that the word "please" exists on a regular basis. < 1298585594 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's, a dying feature of Japanese grammar, near as I can tell.) < 1298585667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: OTOH Japanese sounds easier than Finnish which is a major plus. (HELLO tswett) < 1298585682 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Sorry, I forgot how to say "Hello" in Finnish. I think it's 25 letters long. < 1298585697 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll probably appreciate the regularity. < 1298585734 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I, er, kind of plan to speak in my own personal polysynthetic dialect. < 1298585783 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The Japanese have what could be called an "interesting" grammatical structure, but could also be called "confusing", "random", "bogus" or "evil". To truly understand this, let's examine the differences between Japanese and English grammar. < 1298585784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :English Sentence: < 1298585784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jane went to the school. < 1298585784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same Sentence In Japanese: < 1298585784 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :School Jane To Went Monkey Apple Carbeurator." < 1298585792 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOOKS LIKE FORTH TO ME < 1298585814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"What's more, the Japanese also do not have any words for "me", "them", "him, or "her" that anyone could use without being incredibly insulting (the Japanese word for "you", for example, when written in kanji, translates to "I hope a monkey scratches your face off"). Because of this, the sentence "He just killed her!" and "I just killed her!" sound exactly the same, meaning that most people in Japan have no idea what is going on around them at an < 1298585814 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y given moment. You are supposed to figure these things out from the "context", which is a German word meaning "you're screwed"." < 1298585826 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Please tell me that "X did it" is a common Japanese defence in court. < 1298585837 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"By X do you mean X, or X?" "Definitely X." < 1298585855 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ジェインが学校へ行った。(Jane [subj.] school [to] go[past]) There, actually correct. < 1298585881 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's with the brackets around [to]? < 1298585884 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Implicit? < 1298585911 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a grammatical particle, and I don't feel comfortable not leaving it in brackets. < 1298585932 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Should I avoid trying to use an IME to "start" with? < 1298585954 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was considering adding a Japanese keyboard layout right now as a sort of reminder-motivator, but then I realised that I'd have to type in semi-romaji or whatever. < 1298585963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which might not gel so well with the learning kanji thing. < 1298585991 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Most Japanese people use an IME and type in rōmaji. < 1298585999 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Yes, I know. < 1298586008 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In some IME you can switch between romaji method or kana method. < 1298586018 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: But does that Remembering the Kanji thing have the romaji as part of the educationamationalearnin'? < 1298586019 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but who the fuck uses the kana layout? < 1298586028 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is it just learning the translations? Well, I guess that would be stupid. < 1298586030 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Remembering the Kanji doesn't have any of the readings. < 1298586041 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: ...meaning that an IME is going to be a bit useless, no? < 1298586046 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1298586060 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I won't bother setting one up, then. < 1298586094 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's more about putting you into a situation analogous to a Mandarin speaker learning Japanese, then to have you Finish Learning All There Is To Know About Kanji™. < 1298586114 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I DO NOT LIKE THESE TRADEMARK CAMELCASINGS < 1298586140 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the funny squiggles having actual meaning to you, you need only care about the language, instead of getting hung up for years on funny squiggles. < 1298586159 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Still, I have this /slight/ delusion that being able to produce Japanese on a whim might help me learn better than just consuming, and writing kanji sounds like a bitch. < 1298586169 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also paper doesn't have you to correct my hee-LARIOUS mistakes.) < 1298586180 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that's a bit of a bummer. < 1298586184 0 :func67AE!~Miranda@95-161-253-21.broadband.spb.TiERA.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298586214 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Read AJATT, for Khatzumoto is one awesomely crazy man. < 1298586231 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Read some Japanese manga book and learn about Washizu mahjong. < 1298586239 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: He went from scratch to fluency in 1.5 years. < 1298586245 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I don't see the direct link between that and learning the romaji :-P < 1298586262 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You're only going to realistically be using romaji for typing. < 1298586275 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you do formal classes! < 1298586275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Precisely. < 1298586285 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Now let me think ... what would I want to use Japanese for... < 1298586287 0 :func67AE!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1298586289 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: AH YES: Reading and typing. < 1298586304 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also some IME allows customizing romaji input method, in addition to allowing you to switch to kana method as well. < 1298586312 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like I'll be writing letters in Japanese. < 1298586328 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You'll probably end up writing a lot of kanji, anyways. < 1298586342 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: But I dislike paper! < 1298586377 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Then write it on the whiteboard. < 1298586381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like you don't add an IME by adding a keyboard layout in Ubuntu. GNOME intuitivity! < 1298586395 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Input methods. OKAY < 1298586412 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Err. Chinese Pinyin? < 1298586416 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that the input method I need? :P < 1298586431 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :@yhjulwwiefzojcbxybbruweejw < 1298586432 0 :lambdabot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"\"" < 1298586441 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. You need to make up your own input method. < 1298586491 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Depends, do you want to learn Pǔtōnghuà? < 1298586497 0 :cheater00!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298586497 0 :cheater-!~cheater@g230229107.adsl.alicedsl.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1298586502 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Unless this is a trick question, no. < 1298586507 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps I don't have the moonspeak IME. < 1298586515 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's Pinyin for "Mandarin") < 1298586529 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, well, obviously, pinyin-transcribed Mandarin. < 1298586543 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: So hey, what spaced-repetition-system thing is good for Linux. < 1298586554 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anki. < 1298586572 0 :AndroUser!~androirc@ti0043a380-dhcp1528.bb.online.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1298586589 0 :AndroUser!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1298586595 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AndroUser: Yes? < 1298586597 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello. < 1298586640 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh, CBA getting an IME set up right now. < 1298586644 0 :AndroUser!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :whtspc < 1298586653 0 :olsner!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's from norway! < 1298586665 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, welcome back whtspc. < 1298586672 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just thinking about Paintfuck yesterday actually. < 1298586683 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ok < 1298586696 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Man, Anki looks like a pain to set up. < 1298586711 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :im actually doing nothing with programming nowadays < 1298586730 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :whtspc: How boring. :) < 1298586734 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just testing irc program on my phone < 1298586741 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1298586782 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tsusch! < 1298586784 0 :whtspc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1298586795 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Uh? apt-get install? < 1298586804 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: No, I meant the actual cards. < 1298586842 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, there's this download thing where the first entry is Heisig's Remember the Kanji (RTK) 1+3. < 1298586844 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :MODERN CONVENIENCE? < 1298586870 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Is it worth learning kana any time soon? < 1298586915 0 :Mathnerd314!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298586919 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Either do it right before RTK or right after. < 1298586938 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: It sounds boring, so let's say right after. < 1298586963 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.alljapaneseallthetime.com/blog/a-day-in-the-life-of-khatzumoto-no-for-real ;; man, this guy has some dedication. < 1298586964 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just learning kana stops you from doing a lot of pronunciation fuckups. < 1298586972 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno if I can spend that much time a day learning :P < 1298586979 0 :MigoMipo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298586980 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Mm... maybe I will then. < 1298587042 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Granted, mostly because it stops you from trying to apply English rules to it. :P < 1298587061 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1298587166 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My soul dies every time someone says "Cone itchy wa." < 1298587167 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learn kana and kanji < 1298587196 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION installs Japanese support. < 1298587235 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :PolicyKit suuuucks < 1298587321 0 :Mathnerd314!~mathnerd3@128.198.97.136 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298587327 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I GAVE YOU MY PASSWORD < 1298587329 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :AUTHENTICATE < 1298587409 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: is japanese sov or osv? < 1298587426 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SOV. < 1298587450 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :With every part of the sentence optional. < 1298587469 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I bored am word orders conventional such by. < 1298587481 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :("I am bored by such conventional word orders.") < 1298587535 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, because of the whole grammatical particles thing, OSV is valid, if motherfucking weird sounding some 90% of the time. < 1298587546 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm. < 1298587557 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, make that 99.99999999%. < 1298587578 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[This same intricate labor-division-responsibility-dissipation system continues today, allowing Western societies to commit acts of violent cruelty both at home and abroad, and then shrug it off and act helpless. < 1298587579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider the steak. One person kills an animal inhumanely, another cuts up her body parts, another packs them, another ships them, another stocks them, another buys them, another cooks them, another eats them.]] < 1298587579 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much annoying veg/etarian/eganism is there in a typical AJATT post? :-P < 1298587595 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't japanese predominantly topic-comment, rather than SOV < 1298587600 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not much, and he loves steak. < 1298587607 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: OH SURE MISTER LINGUIST < 1298587614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :JUST COME AND SHIT ON OUR PARTY < 1298587630 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :shitting on parties is a favourite hobby of mine < 1298587633 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Great big party DUMP. < 1298587649 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why else would I regularly sign up on christian forums, and point out minor things they're wrong about (instead of the big things) < 1298587675 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Self-righteousness? < 1298587719 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1298587754 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A case of dickitis? < 1298587759 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1298587767 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Pfft, my valiant efforts to make my computer talk to me in a language I can't speak a single word of have been thwarted by Ubuntu's user-friendliness. < 1298587776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically despite installing all the support for it the Japanese option remains greyed-out. < 1298587795 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: FURIȲÔ, KORIȲA. < 1298587809 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Furk yoo too. < 1298587858 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, yeah, OVS order isn't too unusual. Kinda suggests a lot of emphasis on the action in question, though. < 1298587869 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I have a pretty bad case of dickitis < 1298587877 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: OVS? in Japanese? < 1298587880 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it'd be pretty off in formal writing, though. < 1298587882 0 :Zwaarddijk!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it pretty strongly verb-last? < 1298587887 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ORANGES EAT SAM!!!! < 1298587903 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zwaarddijk: Typically. < 1298587931 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :all _real_ languages are polysynthetic and have totally free word order < 1298587946 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say, 90% of the time? But sticking the topic at the end is valid and idiomatic, sometimes. < 1298588014 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_, why doesn't my computer want to talk to me in Japanese. < 1298588061 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: His Imperial Majesty did nasty things to it. < 1298588069 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In America, you kill yourself. In Soviet Russia, yourself kill YOU!! < 1298588087 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH. < 1298588092 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just that I have to use its stupid dragging interface. < 1298588096 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mere CLICKING is unacceptable. < 1298588127 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: So, er, if you don't hear back from me when I disconnect, it's because I logged in again, couldn't figure anything out, and am reinstalling my OS. < 1298588264 0 :eurasienne!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1298588301 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You didn't try using the command shell? < 1298588347 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'm kidding. < 1298588381 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298588455 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1298588461 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Oh god everything is in Japanese what have I done < 1298588498 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Wait, wait, I bet I can fool myself into thinking this is a good idea. < 1298588509 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: BY LEARNING HOW TO USE MY COMPUTER LIKE THIS I WILL BEGIN TO UNDERSTAND WHAT ALL THE WORDS MEAN -- HAHA < 1298588510 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh man < 1298588511 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was a good one. < 1298588562 0 :augur!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1298588582 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling that pikhq_ is going to start responding to everything I say in Japanese. < 1298588608 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :勿論。 < 1298588614 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :God damn < 1298588635 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :^_^ < 1298588641 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: I have no idea how to use my computer any more. < 1298588655 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I'm currently trying to disable the menu icons just to spite myself. < 1298588667 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Feb24(KANJI) (Thu) PM11:35" what kind of fucked-up date-time format is that < 1298588689 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is really fucked up. < 1298588715 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Stupid, perhaps? They should use number and kanji for Japanese < 1298588740 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. It's trying to format a UK date format... in Japanese. < 1298588787 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The proper date format would be 2月24日11:35. < 1298588833 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298588852 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298588888 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Quick, spin me some bullshit about how not knowing how to use my computer will help me learn Japanese. < 1298588908 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: If you know not your computer, what else shall you do with your time? < 1298588929 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: Use my computer in hilariously comical ways that emulate failure. < 1298588977 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-panel/+bug/478980 "It's not a bug, it's a feature." < 1298589088 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq_: {+~t}--,\"-- means Server, right? ({} is grouping, symbols represent what they look like, ~x represents x flipped) < 1298589089 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1298589101 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e. grouping N symbols to represent one letter.) < 1298589191 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the Finnish for "hello" is actually "päistääjyppiloidaruustanen". < 1298589199 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Seriously? :P < 1298589207 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, 26, if I count correctly. < 1298589217 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Finns here can attest. < 1298589224 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant fizzie. < 1298589229 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ilari. < 1298589247 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your writing is not very clear it is difficult to read the words like {+~t}--,\"-- < 1298589262 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Well, -- is just a long dash. < 1298589268 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, that's "hi". "Hello" is just "päistääjyppiloidaruusta". < 1298589275 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{+~t} means one symbol that looks like a + sign with a backwards t following it, where the tail goes underneath the +. < 1298589295 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :,\" means a forward swoop like a comma, then the same backwards, with two little ` ticks after it. < 1298589324 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: gee, let me look those up for you. < 1298589328 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, yes I think that does mean "server". At least it sounds like the English word "server", I think.... < 1298589341 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it is just a transliteration? < 1298589351 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would explain why it's so much easier to type out than the other ones. < 1298589369 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I think in that case it is. < 1298589375 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first one is... um. < 1298589377 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric := \pi on top, (P with - on top) and man holding up flat plate on bottom. What kanji is that?! pikhq_?! < 1298589404 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, the word is サーバー. < 1298589422 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's katakana, that's why it wasn't in the hiragana table. < 1298589432 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1298589439 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = \pi on top, (P with - on top) and man holding up flat plate on bottom. What kanji is that?! pikhq_?! < 1298589441 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'M WAITING < 1298589467 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: can you not look these up somehow? < 1298589478 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Probably, but where is the fun in that? < 1298589498 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. < 1298589549 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298589556 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor has come to save you. < 1298589571 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest83343 < 1298589594 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shit, he's gone. < 1298589596 0 :Guest83343!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1298589600 0 :tswett!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, he's back! < 1298589633 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-214-46.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298589653 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :サーバー is most definitely server. < 1298589661 0 :pikhq_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298589683 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sâhầ is how I'd romanise it. < 1298589694 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most people would go with "sābā". < 1298589720 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : = \pi on top, (P with - on top) and man holding up flat plate on bottom. What kanji is that?! pikhq_?! < 1298589780 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Wut? < 1298589797 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's basically a 2x2 grid. < 1298589801 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Top-left looks like =. < 1298589806 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Top-right looks like the pi symbol. < 1298589816 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bottom-left loops like a "P" rendered digitally i.e. no curves, with a - line on top of it. < 1298589825 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bottom-right looks like a swishy "X" with a line above it. < 1298589829 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Connected, that is. < 1298589898 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, wuuut. < 1298589913 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can explain the reading of the word for "server": The first symbol is sound "sa", the second symbol after the long dash is sound "ba" (without two short dot would be "ha"), and the long dash is long vowel mark making the preceding vowel sound longer. < 1298589923 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : Uh, wuuut. < 1298589927 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By grid I don't mean it has any separators. < 1298589933 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just saying that it loks like four symbols in a grid to me. < 1298589962 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, not helping. < 1298589963 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some kanji has two or three or four parts arranged horizontal of vertical. < 1298589971 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/of/or/ < 1298589983 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: http://ompldr.org/vN2p1MQ < 1298589989 0 :zzo38!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also look it up in WWWJDIC, can look up words and kanji. < 1298590036 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18bf618a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1298590102 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: . < 1298590128 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Oh*. < 1298590152 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :=, pi, P with line, X with line! < 1298590162 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT DIFFICULT YO < 1298590162 0 :pumpkin!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :haskellnoob < 1298590171 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :設 < 1298590176 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. That. < 1298590181 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is this not CLEAR to you. < 1298590183 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskellnoob: haha noob < 1298590220 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is. I parse that as 言 + 几 + 又. < 1298590237 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1298590239 0 :haskellnoob!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :copumpkin < 1298590254 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :peer really gets angry at calling others "noob" < 1298590256 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And 言 is itself 口 + some lines. < 1298590288 0 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1298590297 0 :HackEgo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298590309 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like 'E' is 'F' + a line < 1298590317 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Yep. < 1298590449 0 :augur!~augur@96.231.220.68 JOIN :#esoteric < 1298590729 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298590820 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298590957 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1298591231 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1298591457 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298591470 0 :Gregor!~Gregor@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1298591495 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Guest57906 < 1298591628 0 :Guest57906!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Gregor < 1298591761 0 :Gregor!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oy, prgmr is being made of fail tonight. < 1298591776 0 :elliott!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not as much fail as you, Guest57906. < 1298591824 0 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric