00:05:41 impomatic: And now you're gone :P 00:06:05 If anybody wants a logbot, glogbot is pretty stable now. 00:11:08 !logs 00:11:08 Logs: http://gregorr.dyndns.org:8080/logs/_esoteric/?C=N;O=D 00:11:15 -!- Phantom_Hoover has set topic: The Glorious People's Socialist Democratic Egalitarian Progressive Republic of Esoterica | DECADENT CAPITALIST NEOPAGANS NEED NOT APPLY | Try out GLORIOUS SOVIET yoob @ http://catseye.tc/lab/yoob/applet.html | SOCIALIST HISTORY: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | JOURNAL OF COMRADE GLOGBOT: http://gregorr.dyndns.org:8080/logs/_esoteric/?C=N;O=D | NEW SOCIALIST TRADITIONS APPR. 00:11:21 glögbot, on the other hand, just keeps on drinking. 00:11:24 -!- Phantom_Hoover has set topic: The Glorious People's Socialist Democratic Egalitarian Progressive Republic of Esoterica | DECADENT CAPITALIST NEOPAGANS NEED NOT APPLY | Try out GLORIOUS SOVIET yoob @ http://catseye.tc/lab/yoob/applet.html | SOCIALIST HISTORY: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | JOURNAL OF COMRADE GLOGBOT: http://gregorr.dyndns.org:8080/logs/_esoteric/?C=N;O=D. 00:11:33 Gregor: is that yours? should be called flogbot 00:11:57 glöggbot <3 00:11:59 My name does not start with an 'f' :P 00:12:05 * Phantom_Hoover → sleep 00:12:09 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:13:18 It needs more g's. 00:13:33 What's the maximum nick length on Freenode? 00:13:54 experiment 00:13:57 It shall remain glogbot :P 00:14:04 20 chars or so, IIRC. 00:14:06 Not gggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggglogbot? 00:14:19 giggityglogbot? 00:14:22 gluebot. 00:14:36 pikhq_: 17. 00:14:50 entgegengegangen, my favourite german word. 00:14:57 No, 16. 00:15:50 It's a multiple of 4 anyway, because when I changed fungot to antiantianti... for testing, it got cut off between the 'anti's. 00:16:19 16 indeed, it seems. 00:16:26 "Most bacon consumed in the United Kingdom is back bacon." The UK is full of HEATHENS and SINNERS AGAINST BACON 00:17:25 -!- fungot has joined. 00:18:29 What does "entgegengegangen" means? 00:18:55 Misread that as "black bacon", thought it was some sort of term for completely burned bacon, was all "huh, that's a weird preference". 00:18:55 Ent gegen gegangs 00:19:04 zzo38: it's even googleable 00:19:24 "gone to meet", apparently 00:19:38 -!- sftp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:19:57 Yes; past tense of entgegen/gehen, one of their silly two-part verbs. 00:21:26 I think the context it was introduced to me was a person gone to meet someone else at the train station. "gehen" is "to go", while "entgegen" is generally "against". 00:23:40 -!- pikhq_ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 00:25:18 Finnish idiom "mennä vastaan" (lit "to go against ") for sort-of going to "receive"/meet someone (who's e.g. coming to a visit) might well be from that. 00:26:08 -!- pikhq has joined. 00:48:54 -!- cheater99 has joined. 00:52:41 I wrote my log converter in C for some lunatic reason. Easily the worst C program I've written in my entire life. 00:52:50 I need no log bot I have server logs. Server logs works better. 00:52:56 Gregor: Then write a better C program. 00:53:18 zzo38: ... you have server logs ... of FreeNode? 00:53:27 No, only of my own server. 00:53:30 -!- cheater99 has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 00:53:41 Well then there's that :P 00:53:44 I do not need server logs of FreeNode, I can use the clog for this channel. 00:53:59 And glogbot can also be used for this channel, as well as the other logs. 00:54:24 The other channels that are logged have their own logs. 00:55:41 Gregor: Don't you know that string processing is the single worst thing to do in C? 00:55:43 But I think server logs works better in general. 00:55:55 pikhq: strtok, bitch! 00:56:06 I'd sooner 切腹. 00:56:16 pikhq: I can do string processing in C. C works for many things that are not specific to only one computer. 00:56:33 zzo38: Yes, but it's so insanely tedious to do string processing in C. 00:56:46 It's not far above Brainfuck on that front. 00:57:07 Pretty much the only advantage you get there is *more than one pointer*. 00:57:50 Bleh, I don't think you can do the equivalent of tail -f with C stdio only. 00:58:48 pikhq: No, I can do string processing fine in C. You just have to know what it is that you need, and then just make it. 00:58:53 while (1) { fopen fseek fread fclose } 00:59:19 zzo38: It is *possible*, yes. 00:59:31 zzo38: It's just about on par with doing it in Brainfuck. 01:00:22 Deewiant: Oh yeah, I guess I could work it out with fopen/fseek/fclose ... didn't work with just opening it once throughout. 01:00:48 pikhq: No, in C you can use macros and more than one pointer, and memory allocation, and stuff like that. 01:01:43 zzo38: Still insanely tedious compared to doing it in, oh, *nearly any other high-level language*. 01:04:54 pikhq: Probably, but I am capable to do some insane things, and it is not too difficult if you know what you are trying to make, therefore it is OK. But it is OK to use other program language, too. 01:05:57 pikhq, now arguing sanity in #esoteric. has he lost his marbles? 01:06:26 arguing for sanity is a clear sign of not having any 01:06:45 olsner: No, it is possible to have both sanity and insanity. 01:06:59 Sometimes. 01:10:26 Is there program to convert PCL printing file to other format in case your printer does not use PCL? 01:14:34 -!- variable has joined. 01:37:33 -!- esowiki has joined. 01:37:45 -!- glogbot has joined. 01:37:45 -!- HackEgo has joined. 01:43:27 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 01:43:39 -!- pikhq has joined. 01:44:01 * Gregor hopes the fool things stay connected. 01:45:23 -!- sebbu has joined. 01:45:23 -!- sebbu has quit (Changing host). 01:45:24 -!- sebbu has joined. 01:48:02 -!- sebbu2 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 02:10:03 -!- zzo38 has joined. 02:28:41 -!- variable has quit (Read error: Connection timed out). 02:30:07 -!- variable has joined. 02:30:59 -!- pikhq_ has joined. 02:34:00 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 02:48:08 Man, checking user modes is a friggin' pain. 02:54:51 -!- variable has quit (Read error: Operation timed out). 02:55:12 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 02:55:38 -!- copumpkin has joined. 02:56:04 -!- variable has joined. 02:58:38 -!- pikhq_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 02:58:45 -!- pikhq has joined. 03:06:15 -!- jcp has quit (Quit: Later). 03:12:19 -!- jcp has joined. 03:15:06 If you wanted to make a public logger bot, how would you make it verify that a request to join a channel is legit? 03:15:23 Note that I can't determine who the ops on a channel are without joining it ... 03:18:03 Oh wait, /whois does 03:24:26 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 03:24:31 -!- pikhq_ has joined. 03:32:24 Gregor, only if they are on the same channel IIRC (or they don't have the secret options set) 03:32:39 you *could* query chanserv access - but that wouldn't be complete 03:32:54 -!- esowiki has joined. 03:33:06 -!- glogbot has joined. 03:33:51 I seem to be whoisable, is secret even default? 03:33:59 If it's not default then who cares, they'll just have to not be so sneaky to use it :P 03:34:30 Oh dear, loghandler is running hot ... how odd. 03:34:39 +s isn't default 03:34:43 +p is a candidate too 03:34:51 (+p hides from whois, shows on list) 03:35:01 wait a second, +s IS default, this is freenode 03:35:03 why would they do that anyway 03:35:26 If +s is default, then why am I not +s? 03:35:31 +s is a channel mode 03:35:37 +i is invisible 03:35:45 OH 03:35:46 which hides you from /who and /names 03:35:56 +i hides a user from channel listings 03:36:00 +s hides a channel from user listings 03:36:00 ;p 03:36:06 Is +s only default for chanserv-controlled channels? 03:36:07 well, "information" not "listings" 03:36:10 i don't know 03:36:14 i joined a random string of letters 03:36:20 and it was set +s 03:36:27 Hm 03:36:30 +ns, what a weird default 03:36:46 but i guess there could be reasons for it 03:36:59 i once found a bunch of oper channels by getting on a server that crashed right after it came up 03:37:01 and whoising opers 03:37:08 before the server resynched 03:37:08 :P 03:37:28 because they autoreconnceted to the server and joined the channels, but the channels weren't +s because they weren't with chanserv yet! 03:37:33 Hmmm foobar. 03:37:51 Not sure how to make requests legit in this case >_> 03:38:10 join the channel 03:38:16 if it's not legit, ignore the user 03:38:23 * myndzi shrugs 03:38:43 Bleh 03:39:03 you can at least verify that the channel exists before joining it 03:39:06 Since I require them to be an op anyway, I could just say they have to temporarily set it to -s ... or is that a huge pain due to ChanServ rumblings. 03:39:07 and perhaps has > X users 03:39:18 also it seems like on freenode nobody bothers to op up 03:39:25 so requiring ops would be a bit of a pain 03:39:32 Well this is just a one-time thing to prevent fraud. 03:39:38 one possibility would be to join and announce something the first time you join the chanenl 03:39:40 channel 03:39:43 If you want logging, you op yourself then request the bot, then you never have to again. 03:39:48 such as "ops may ban me from this channel with this command" 03:39:49 or whatever 03:40:07 * [Gregor] #esoteric 03:40:10 Ops can request that glogbot leave a channel at any time, but there shouldn't need to be ops around to prevent it from improperly logging a channel. 03:40:19 variable: ... fascinating. 03:40:32 true enough 03:40:44 i was thinking of "don't log at first" or something 03:40:45 but meh 03:40:51 however you look at it it's a bit of an annoyance 03:40:54 Gregor, my point is that if you are on any other channels - I can't see them 03:41:08 variable: Ah, yeah, >_> 03:41:11 I'm on, like, dozens :P 03:41:15 does freenode even use chanserv? i messaged chanserv 'help' but no response 03:41:20 oh wait 03:41:24 it went into another channel window wut 03:41:33 myndzi, yes it does 03:42:25 myndzi, :- 03:42:26 p 03:42:36 too bad you can't use WHY without access 03:42:54 (my lag is ~ 10s now :-( ) 03:42:56 ah well, i guess it comes down to you basically just have to either make them jump through hoops or risk being irritating 03:43:22 wtf, I set ##glogbot23 (a temp testing channel) to -s and it still can't see it in /whois ... 03:43:32 Gregor, tasting a channel should be fine: you get asked to join, join channel, check if person is ops) 03:43:33 if courses there is a race condition there 03:43:56 Gregor, are you +i ? 03:44:04 variable: Nope 03:44:04 that shouldn't matter 03:44:10 +i doesn't hide your channels 03:44:14 Can somebody else /whois me? 03:44:17 it hides you from user searches 03:44:20 Gregor: i only see #esoteric 03:44:25 wtfbbq 03:44:26 apparently freenode is Privacy Happy 03:44:29 * [Gregor] #esoteric 03:45:04 Damn it, this is so obnoxious. 03:45:28 well 03:45:34 runescript joins to check the names list then parts 03:45:42 and i know they'd have figured out a better way if it was feasible 03:45:46 (that is called 'tasting' myndzi ) 03:45:47 so yeah, you're pretty much stuck doing that 03:46:05 That's so lame ... should I make the bot apologize if it's requested improperly? 03:46:28 Gregor, no. j/p spam usually don't matter 03:46:31 well you could use the part message 03:46:39 *doesn't matter 03:46:42 definitely ignore the obnoxious user 03:46:45 at least temporarily 03:47:00 Gregor, as well as limiting channel joins to 1/3 min or so 03:47:07 myndzi: I don't want to ignore, it's possible that they just forgot to op or something. 03:47:26 ok, ignore on two offenses then ;p 03:47:36 Gregor, idea: 03:47:39 Maybe I'll just keep it as-is: Only people who are considered ops to glogbot itself are allowed to !glogbot_join, but others may !glogbot_part if they're ops on the channel in question. 03:47:40 make it depend on /invite 03:47:45 OOOOH 03:48:02 oh, i thought he was already making use of /invite 03:48:14 i never /invite, forgot you had to be op 03:48:17 thought it was conditional 03:48:23 myndzi, by default you must be op 03:48:26 like, if channel is +i only ops can invite or something 03:48:37 there is a channel flag for everyone invite 03:48:41 huh 03:48:49 freenode specific probably then 03:48:58 myndzi, possibly 03:49:11 Gregor, another option is to *join* but not *log* 03:49:19 but on fn /invite works 03:49:26 I'm loving the /invite idea. 03:59:54 -!- variable has quit (Read error: Operation timed out). 04:03:46 Yup, /invite = good times. 04:08:31 So yeah, if anybody wants their channel logged, /invite glogbot. 04:09:28 glogbot? 04:09:39 My fancy new logger bot I made because I wanted logs in a raw format. 04:09:44 Perhaps it can help that immediately after invited, sends a NOTICE to the channel with the URL of the logs for that channel? 04:10:06 Gregor: That is good, now we have 2 formats on glogbot and 1 format on clog. 04:10:13 zzo38: You're right, it should. 04:10:27 It should be a Freenode service 04:10:43 Sgeo: Or perhaps a subcommand of CS 04:10:48 That way, logs in topic can be.. well, can't know if theere are other logbots, but 04:11:03 Semi-enforced 04:11:28 Like, CS LOGS to configure logs for a channel and view status information about logs for a channel. 04:12:43 At least to me, it makes sense, that if it were a Freenode service, make it a subcommand of the CS command. Now anyone can check if there is logs by typing something such as CS LOGS STATUS #freenode 04:13:03 Or CS LOGS #freenode STATUS 04:13:46 -!- variable has joined. 04:15:38 Perhaps if they do that, subcommands of CS LOGS might be: STATUS START STOP NEW TIMEZONE MESSAGE AUXLINK ANNOTATE 04:30:44 Gregor, another option is to *join* but not *log* // btw I don't really have the ability to use this option, as my logs include literally every byte into and out of the bot excluding the nickserv identification request. 04:31:20 Even privmsgs are all publicly logged. 04:31:30 Gregor, ah, I see 04:31:42 /invite works on Freenode then 04:31:51 on other networks I duno 04:31:58 INVITE is a standard IRC command. 04:32:01 This is a one-network logger bot :P 04:32:10 zzo38: The problem with other networks is that I'm using /invite to imply +o 04:32:18 zzo38: That's only true (by default) on Freenode. 04:32:22 zzo38, yes - but I don't know if it could be guaranteed to be limited to opers 04:32:34 erm - what Gregor said :-p 04:33:14 Well, glogbot is for Freenode only anyways; if it is made for other networks as well then more features to edit those configuration can be added to it. 04:33:50 Yuh 04:35:39 On my own server it is not problem for a few reasons, one of which is that it uses server side logging. Also the policy is different, and only channels with topic messages are logged anyways, so there is no such problem. If other IRC networks could also do server side logging then it is not much of the problem anymore. Such as adding a CS LOGS command, for networks that use the CS command. 04:36:29 In Freenode, if you use the command HELP INVITE it tells you a few things about the INVITE command in IRC. 04:39:26 Neither HELP INVITE nor HELP CMODE tells anything about only operators use INVITE command. 04:40:27 Another possibility is to have it log channels with the property USEGLOGBOT set. 04:41:55 I think even with networks with CS, they do not all support CS SET PROPERTY though. 04:44:03 -!- pikhq_ has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 04:44:12 -!- pikhq has joined. 04:51:16 I probably should not start humming My Heart Will Go On when I see some trigonometry 04:51:38 Sgeo: Do you? 04:52:03 Just in this one case 04:53:02 Why? 04:53:22 "That's a very complicated way of doing it, so there's an easier way" as though difficulty just makes easier ways appear out of magic 04:53:45 Because "near [cos], far [sin], wherever you are"... 05:03:20 ? 05:04:46 -!- variable has quit (Quit: Daemon escaped from pentagram). 05:11:10 Let's move to space! 05:11:49 -!- wareya has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 05:12:48 -!- wareya has joined. 06:36:02 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 06:36:16 -!- copumpkin has joined. 06:52:31 -!- copumpkin has changed nick to hipsterpumpkin. 06:59:41 -!- pikhq_ has joined. 06:59:50 -!- GreaseMonkey has joined. 06:59:55 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 07:07:10 WHY AM I STILL AWAKE? 07:08:54 BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT STILL SLEEPING! 07:08:59 -!- zzo38 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 07:09:23 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 07:09:36 * pikhq_ is getting a kick out of the myth of Osiris and Isis... 07:10:14 Osiris died and rose again. Through him all can have eternal life. 07:10:30 And it was a common ritual to consume his flesh, in the form of unleavened bread. 07:31:33 -!- augur has joined. 07:38:04 Man, there's still native speakers of one of the languages on the Rosetta Stone. 07:42:55 Fucking Greek. 07:43:25 Having the oldest writings that can, in a genuinely meanigful sense, be said to be in a modern language. 07:47:41 pikhq_: no. 07:47:47 that is incorrect. 07:48:08 ancient greek and modern greek are not mutually intelligible. 07:48:32 I thought they actually had a large degree of mutual intelligibility? 07:48:35 no. 07:51:22 Okay, then I guess the claim for "oldest writings that can, in a genuinely meaningful sense, be said to be in a modern language" would almost have to go for Classical Chinese. Except the damned bastards in China had to kill that off last century. :P 07:51:44 also classical chinese is quite distinct from mandarin. 07:51:51 Yes, I'm well aware. 07:51:57 and even last century noone spoke classical chinese natively 07:52:23 The use of Classical Chinese was more akin to the use of Latin than anything else, except it took longer to stop. 07:52:35 yes 07:52:40 but that doesnt make it a modern language. 07:53:34 Except that it served as essentially the *only* form of writing. 07:53:49 so? 07:54:02 So, "modern" in the sense that people actually used it, not modern in the sense that it was a fucking zombie language. 07:54:07 no 07:54:14 "people" didnt actually use it 07:54:33 it was the written language, sure 07:54:33 but you forget 07:54:46 most chinese people were completely illiterate, and the only people who could write did so for rather officious reasons 07:55:12 Oh, dur, Chinese literacy only really came about after the switch to "vernacular" Chinese. 07:55:20 exactly. 07:55:45 (though, Written Chinese is only an accurate encoding of the vernacular for a *subset* of speakers of Chinese languages... But I digress.) 07:56:07 modern written mandarin is indeed only accurate for mandarin speakers 07:56:19 but thats like saying modern written dutch is only accurate for dutch speakers 07:56:21 well duh 07:56:26 germans write in written german 07:56:32 cantonese speakers write in written cantonese 07:56:44 And every other speaker of a Chinese language is boned. 07:56:52 what 07:57:13 Most of the Chinese languages are not commonly written. 07:57:40 true, but most chinese speakers write their native chinese language. 07:58:10 and the top half dozen or so chinese languages are commonly written 08:01:43 Perhaps I should stick to talking about languages I actually know. :P 08:01:55 :) 08:02:47 Clearly this means I need to become immortal, and thereby have time to learn all languages. :P 08:02:57 wont help 08:03:05 And a time machine. 08:03:11 so basically 08:03:14 if you were a time lord 08:03:20 Yes. 08:05:19 if you were a timelord you'd already know every language in the universe 08:05:22 mostly 08:05:43 Yes, if I were actually a timelord. 08:06:04 If I merely had some of the properties of a timelord, I'd have to work at it. But what's a few millenia out of eternity, anyways? 08:09:34 -!- asiekierka has joined. 08:44:50 -!- pikhq has joined. 08:45:00 -!- pikhq_ has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 08:53:09 pikhq: mind you, time lords only get 13 lives 09:15:12 -!- MigoMipo has joined. 09:20:11 -!- GreaseMonkey has quit (Quit: The Other Game). 09:20:33 -!- asiekierka has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 09:21:07 -!- asiekierka has joined. 09:22:38 -!- BeholdMyGlory has joined. 09:30:26 -!- sftp has joined. 09:37:33 -!- oerjan has joined. 09:38:42 -!- BeholdMyGlory has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 09:48:39 -!- MigoMipo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 09:54:19 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 09:54:23 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Changing host). 09:54:24 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 10:09:40 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 10:09:47 -!- TLUL has quit (Quit: *disappears in a puff of orange smoke*). 11:44:30 -!- pikhq has quit (Read error: Operation timed out). 11:45:02 -!- pikhq has joined. 12:24:12 COMRADE PIKHQ WHY IS GLORIOVS CHANNEL TOPIC CONTAINING CAPITALIST LOWER CASE 12:29:33 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 12:40:35 -!- Wamanuz5 has joined. 12:43:43 -!- Wamanuz4 has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 12:51:03 -!- Wamanuz has joined. 12:54:57 -!- cheater99 has joined. 12:55:03 -!- Wamanuz5 has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 13:08:39 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 13:22:58 -!- esowiki has joined. 13:23:09 -!- glogbot has joined. 13:54:24 [[A falling cat's terminal velocity is 100 km/h]] — WP 13:54:29 I... how did they... 13:55:31 Maybe with the vertical wind tunnel + net thing. 13:56:02 BEST MENTAL IMAGE EVER 13:56:21 -!- hipsterpumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 13:56:25 Or maybe with MATH. 13:56:28 You lunatics. 13:56:48 -!- hipsterpumpkin has joined. 13:56:49 " Maybe with the vertical wind tunnel + net thing." <<< luckiest cat in the world 13:57:17 There's no citation for that number. :/ 13:57:35 well anyone can check it 13:57:37 [citation needed] 13:57:52 you just need a cat and an earth 13:57:52 oklopol: But that would be ORIGINAL RESEARCH, a big no-no. 13:57:58 :P 13:57:59 tru 13:58:15 I am now eternally depressed that that experiment has already been done. 13:59:01 why don't they like original research? it makes sense but i'm not sure why 13:59:15 which reminds me that i really really want to play mc right now 14:00:59 the pixels are too big on my screen 14:02:08 I play MC with the 960x1200 window instead of fullscreen partially because the vertically oriented window doesn't make it scale the UI parts so hueg. 14:02:49 oh sorry the mc and the pixel comment didn't have anything to do with each other 14:02:58 Ah. Well, still! 14:03:02 oklopol, #esoteric-minecraft 14:04:02 i'm not actually *going* to play, i have to prove theorems and prepare a lecture and watch a season of house 14:04:20 In that order? 14:04:29 well, umm 14:04:49 probably in the order 1. watch a season of house 2. oh fuck it's late i'll wake up at 3am to do the rest 14:05:28 but a man can drem 14:05:29 *dream 14:05:39 *dremel 14:05:57 No, oklopol can drem. 14:07:18 Best word seen on WP: "destinated". 14:17:13 There are in fact 42 instances of "destinated" *bran axplote* 14:17:15 ... 14:17:17 *brain too* 14:17:35 How many instances of "axplote"? 14:17:45 Zero, thankfully :P 14:18:08 the material i'm doing had this pretty hilarious theorem, "for small enough value of a there exist d = d(a) and a constant B_a such that m_B(B_d^n(y)) <= B_a*e^(-nh) for all y \in X, n >= 1" where m_B is a measure, and B_d^n(y) is a kind of ball around y; and then they build, given a value of a, d and B_a with a straight face :D 14:18:21 well i guess you had to be there. 14:18:26 but i can't stop laughing 14:19:37 d and B_a depend on a, and they don't even explicitly mention what "small enough" means, even though that is all that matters since m_B(B_d^n(y)) <= B_a*e^(-nh) doesn't even use "a" anywhere 14:23:16 actually for fun, let me define B_d^n(x), it is the set {y \in X | \forall 0 <= i < n: dist(x, y) < d}, where X is a compact metric space and T is an homeomorphism of the space to itself (the dynamics, which we assume reversible here) 14:23:18 erm 14:23:44 B_d^n(x) = {y \in X | \forall 0 <= i < n: dist(x, T^i(y)) < d} of course 14:24:12 okay last attempt: B_d^n(x) = {y \in X | \forall 0 <= i < n: dist(T^i(x), T^i(y)) < d} 14:24:22 now it should make sense 14:29:12 people never join the definition frenzy with their own definitions, and it's no fun alone 14:29:15 :( 14:29:58 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 14:30:04 -!- pikhq_ has joined. 14:30:27 okay let (X, T) be as previously, we say T is expansive if there exists a constant d such that for all x, y \in X, exists n such that dist(T^n(x), T^n(y)) > d 14:31:49 all x!=y of course 14:39:41 hmm, it seems if there are no isolated points then necessarily the n don't have a uniform bound: given d, we take an arbitrary x. by continuity of T, there exists d_1 such that dist(T'(x), y) < d_1 implies dist(x, T(y)) < d, where T' is the inverse of T. similarly, we find d_i for all i, so that if dist(T'^i(x), y) < d_i, then dist(x, T^i(y)) < d. if there are no isolated points, we can then always choose some such y 14:39:58 x isolated point = {x} is an open set 14:40:09 that is, there exists an open ball that is a singleton set 14:40:21 (that contains x) 14:42:00 actually my first instinct was that there must be a uniform bound, by what compactness usually gives you. but it's actually a rather retarded thing to think now that i think about it. 14:45:08 DEFINITION FRENZY 14:47:44 frenzy (n): See orgy 14:48:03 actually i was just thinking about math orgies today 14:48:15 Best (worst?) kind of orgies. 14:49:18 Sgeo has some good definitions i'm sure 14:49:30 Sgeo: would you like to engage in exchange of mental fluids 14:49:54 I'm going to pretend I'm AFK 14:49:58 :D 14:50:21 on a completely other matter, what have you learned on the courses? 14:51:28 did you ever manage to prove that (x + y)/2 + 0/2 = x/2 + y/2 14:51:41 you gave up last time 14:52:46 Wha? 14:53:01 the intersection of diagonals problem 14:53:14 i can give you a hint: you need two axioms, one is not enough 14:54:15 sadistic bitches, there are like 10 axioms so level 2 requires like 100 attempts 14:55:27 oh wait then there's the axioms (ab)*v = a*(b*v) where a, b in the field, v a vector. when the scalars are R, that might take some time 14:55:32 *axiom 14:56:00 you can apply that... what's 4 times uncountable? 14:56:04 anyway that many times 14:56:40 but it's divisible by two, so maybe you could prove the claim for p*uncountable where p is a prime first, and then show the the numbers that satisfy it are closed under multiplication 14:57:12 (i hope i don't have to clarify that this makes absolutely no sense) 14:57:34 erm and i meant 4 is composite 15:06:32 Sgeo, so wait, have you given up on the category theory? 15:07:12 oooo category theory :o 15:07:22 Sgeo: teach me some category theory 15:08:07 oklopol, it's, like, lines. 15:08:16 ah okay so far so good what then 15:08:24 Hmm, oerjan mentioned he was a line researcher once... 15:08:29 can you have many lines, like, over 67 15:08:35 Perhaps you could ask him for insights on the matter. 15:08:42 67 is far beyond my ken. 15:08:47 okay 15:08:52 I can barely go above 5. 15:09:02 5 is actually pretty big 15:09:48 Yeah, took me years to get that high. 15:11:28 Phantom_Hoover: u got any fun definitions 15:11:30 Phantom_Hoover, if I could learn all of math all at once, I would 15:11:46 There happens to be more convenient learning material for multivariable calculus 15:11:52 me too especially all of it 15:12:00 Sgeo, multivariable calculus is the boring. 15:12:01 and in particular, everything 15:12:10 calculus is pretty meh yeah 15:15:18 semigroups are the more fun 15:16:24 "Semigroup" is such a stupid name. 15:16:38 They're a third of a group, not half! 15:16:48 yes yes and pi should be 2pi, stop repeating your crazy arguments 15:17:47 glogbot now sends you a notice if you set the /topic to something that doesn't contain the logging URL. I estimate time until somebody bitches about that to be roughly two days. Excluding the response immediately to this message. 15:18:25 -!- Phantom_Hoover has set topic: The Glorious People's Socialist Democratic Egalitarian Progressive Republic of Esoterica | DECADENT CAPITALIST NEOPAGANS NEED NOT APPLY | Try out GLORIOVS MARXIST yoob @ http://catseye.tc/lab/yoob/applet.html | DIELECTRIC SOCIALIST HISTORY: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | JOURNAL OF COMRADE GLOGBOT: REMOVED FOR SOCIALIST SCIENCE. 15:18:28 Gregor: i dislike you because you implemented that penis of a feature 15:18:48 lawl, apparently it always notices me X-D 15:18:49 *fixfix* 15:19:02 -!- Phantom_Hoover has set topic: The Glorious People's Socialist Democratic Egalitarian Progressive Republic of Esoterica | DECADENT CAPITALIST NEOPAGANS NEED NOT APPLY | Try out GLORIOVS MARXIST yoob @ http://catseye.tc/lab/yoob/applet.html | DIELECTRIC SOCIALIST HISTORY: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | JOURNAL OF COMRADE GLOGBOT: REMOVED FOR MORE SOCIALIST SCIENCE. 15:19:02 OK, NOW it notices the offender :P 15:19:22 -!- Phantom_Hoover has set topic: The Glorious People's Socialist Democratic Egalitarian Progressive Republic of Esoterica | DECADENT CAPITALIST NEOPAGANS NEED NOT APPLY | Try out GLORIOVS MARXIST yoob @ http://catseye.tc/lab/yoob/applet.html | DIELECTRIC SOCIALIST HISTORY: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | JOURNAL OF COMRADE GLOGBOT: http://gregorr.dyndns.org:8080/logs/_esoteric/?C=N;O=D. 15:19:34 Freenode policy since when? 15:19:42 since ever 15:19:52 Since the beginning of time. 15:20:07 I thought it was just a suggestion. And/or to mention the logging in the welcome message, not the topic. 15:20:21 and what does mister newbie know 15:20:29 i've been here for years 15:20:39 and i wonder even read part of the welcome message of this channel 15:20:47 ... 15:20:48 *once 15:20:52 "If you're publishing logs on an ongoing basis, your channel topic should reflect that fact." 15:20:57 I guess at least now it says like that. 15:21:09 Still a "should". 15:21:12 It's somewhat unclear whether it's a strict policy or just a strong suggestion. 15:21:23 But either way it's a glogbot policy to consider it a Freenode policy :P 15:21:36 it's #esoteric policy tho 15:21:38 "Be sure to provide a way for users to make comments without logging --" 15:21:58 That's trickier with a raw logging bot :P 15:22:29 heeey i want to be able to make comments without logging 15:22:46 Suggested mechanism? 15:22:52 I could make it not log channel notices. 15:22:57 then i won't have to censor my speech all the time 15:23:15