< 1313712192 889294 :kwertii!~kwertii@ResNet-33-19.resnet.ucsb.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1313712730 783585 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, my muxer works perfectly, with the small caveat that it doesn't work. < 1313712736 535355 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Sounds like mine. < 1313712740 18636 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was wrong with mine again? :-P < 1313712751 344266 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yours just didn't send shit anywhere :P < 1313712757 458187 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: And your does? :P < 1313712759 847386 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine works, it just gets all wonky after a few K. < 1313712766 59611 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well that's far better :P < 1313712769 289023 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least mine fails predictably < 1313712780 419398 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'm doing something wrong with nonblocking I/O. < 1313712800 458732 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Can I sell @ Enterprise Solutions to you? < 1313712805 463896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They make non-blocking I/O... a CINCH < 1313712823 717888 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ enterprise solutions < 1313712832 936660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's identical to @ < 1313712914 310548 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor will have none of this @ in his redneck computer system o-tron. < 1313713204 737662 :botte!~botte@95.149.229.26 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313713213 931701 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :botte: WHAT'S THI < 1313713214 468897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :S < 1313713218 736354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And < 1313713219 399967 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also < 1313713221 842929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is it buffering like that < 1313713222 449659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1313713223 766354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I know why < 1313713229 927776 :botte!~botte@95.149.229.26 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313713234 793107 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye botte < 1313713240 557169 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1313713241 789720 :botte!~botte@95.149.229.26 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313713242 486650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why isn't it < 1313713245 986691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :botte: Why aren't you < 1313713312 467389 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :help why is it < 1313713323 59972 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is what help < 1313713328 765806 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it < 1313713329 727848 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313713332 406159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313713343 744621 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313713549 647340 :botte!~botte@95.149.229.26 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313713665 175538 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does/did botte do < 1313713689 553616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :its < 1313713690 755137 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :note working < 1313713691 982265 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sonothing < 1313713703 210777 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should it do... < 1313714553 365614 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I FIXED IT 8-D < 1313714558 708457 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suck at nonblocking I/O though :P < 1313714560 844141 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: WHAT DID YOU DO < 1313714561 942051 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WAS IT MAGIC < 1313714591 530890 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just fixed a read that should have been blocking. < 1313714749 311541 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1313714946 852285 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`killall linux` feels like a really bad command. < 1313714948 328165 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: killall: not found < 1313714960 460412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :X-D < 1313714993 601782 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1313715005 945264 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm ... this may or may not be working ... < 1313715013 12885 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it is working, it's supaslow. < 1313715215 125546 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That is, working via tty redirection) < 1313715390 261636 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh < 1313715409 861046 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel sick for being unable to think of a nice functional solution to a problem that looks like it ought to have one < 1313715426 575166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. You're sick. < 1313715441 971487 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a sgeo problem < 1313715488 204366 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor doesn't want to implement mudem in @ I WNODER WHY < 1313715527 774849 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This code is so imperative ;( < 1313715558 280759 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sickening < 1313715614 916042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: what languagea e you using < 1313715625 595522 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ruby < 1313715633 406246 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1313715643 416406 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to know what a nice Haskell solution looks like though < 1313715650 41619 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the problem < 1313715700 39585 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: whats the problem < 1313715706 470358 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hold on < 1313715719 34537 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313715719 907217 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no holding < 1313715721 50663 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :only haskell < 1313715722 855399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :forever < 1313715736 753448 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/2394254 < 1313715748 131332 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch my eyes < 1313715756 86570 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/pastes/2394254/text < 1313715756 975868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ur welcome < 1313715760 227327 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION reads < 1313715778 69501 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i can do this < 1313715826 968661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: the ordering doesn't matter, right? < 1313715831 273869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. it's five numbers in arbitrary order < 1313715845 743351 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure < 1313715860 6457 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is way too ambiguous as specified if I don't know that < 1313715864 230886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :doe "set of three ones" mean "three consecutive ones" < 1313715867 561962 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "three ones in any order" < 1313715868 913985 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[asterisk]does < 1313715878 899691 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :assert_equal 250, score([2,5,2,2,3]) < 1313715895 500912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that doesn't answer my question < 1313715901 458368 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it does < 1313715902 927256 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo,....................... < 1313715909 494595 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any order. Which I thought it wasn't, so oops < 1313715927 747957 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greed_(dice_game)#Scoring < 1313715928 980779 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure < 1313715970 241268 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shouldn't be asking for this now, it feels like asking for homework help < 1313715986 109805 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's one of the test cases given, so... < 1313716032 434960 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i'm donig it in haskell < 1313716034 230563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how will it help you < 1313716041 284691 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about giving me the actual link to whatever it is < 1313716047 36841 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i can see all the test cases < 1313716050 664393 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this wikiped does not agree with this what sgeo pasted... < 1313716094 997657 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/edgecase/ruby_koans/blob/master/koans/about_scoring_project.rb < 1313716102 992227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :# * A one (that is not part of a set of three) is worth 100 points. < 1313716103 344970 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :# < 1313716103 418132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :# * A five (that is not part of a set of three) is worth 50 points. < 1313716106 224655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the stupidest fucking game ever < 1313716111 718429 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I understand the game of Greed < 1313716119 778763 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your turn ends when you don't score points, how do you ever get a straight? < 1313716121 942538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: wait, score takes an arbitrary-length list? < 1313716127 932432 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh "up to five" dice < 1313716133 242087 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH nevermind < 1313716175 906156 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, my problem here is with thinking, not the language < 1313716184 740063 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But unordered should be much easier < 1313716420 743647 :CakeProphet!~adam@h171.58.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313716420 854415 :CakeProphet!~adam@h171.58.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1313716420 854495 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1313716491 811591 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It shouldn't be cheating to use pry to explore things like Hash's methods, right? < 1313716508 771618 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Looked for a way to set a default value in a hash, and found it) < 1313716509 305034 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1313716593 344246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I almost have a nice-ish solution < 1313716604 842745 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I almost have something nice-ish too < 1313716635 33926 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the way my solution is turning out. Still a little imperative, but still < 1313716651 776086 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> score [1,5,5,1] < 1313716651 941937 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :100 < 1313716653 280312 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1313716663 505096 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sob* WHY IT NO WORKY :( < 1313716740 905098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://sprunge.us/TRiI < 1313716749 230435 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: This is mine... triples is fairly ugly, but it could be a lot worse. < 1313716753 753831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: What's yours look like? < 1313716772 57193 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not done im learning the split package :( < 1313716895 354922 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313716900 94916 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Did mine get through? < 1313716914 159440 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, I haven't tested or anything < 1313716918 128218 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I mean < 1313716919 931408 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did the link to mine < 1313716921 50298 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :get through < 1313716924 749128 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313716927 326404 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1313716930 112127 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1313716941 73992 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the link was 18:20:55 < elliott> Sgeo: http://sprunge.us/TRiI < 1313716942 287471 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least < 1313716945 641750 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1313717017 553529 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: If you clean up triples let me know ;-) < 1313717036 814962 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I think I can < 1313717036 897445 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm multitasking so much right now < 1313717054 364065 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :recently i have also been putting food in my mouth < 1313717068 587609 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fmap succ (0,9) < 1313717069 198453 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : (0,10) < 1313717166 251746 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bleh, I have no idea why this isn't working ... < 1313717169 640092 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha < 1313717176 222113 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: monqy: http://sprunge.us/SVcQ < 1313717178 129481 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now it's pretty nice. < 1313717181 431607 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it. < 1313717189 10038 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it ineed looks better < 1313717330 172011 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: What's yours look like < 1313717343 951940 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not done < 1313717358 347789 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313717383 926824 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/2394371 is what it currently looks like though < 1313717469 640469 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, hmm, I could simplify mine a lot. < 1313717594 710854 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably clone before deleting from a Hash while looping through a hash < 1313717651 809417 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1313717674 229296 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn, I suck at variable names < 1313717725 150412 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :didnt someone in here used to have "lament" as their username? :| < 1313717796 729300 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: lament used to be in #haskell, at least. < 1313717806 675133 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament is an op here. < 1313717813 365496 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :He only comes to try and irritate us lamely nowadays. < 1313717821 608103 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also he hates Haskell. And programming. :p < 1313717825 32538 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well! < 1313717829 996901 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle divmod < 1313717830 105249 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude divMod :: Integral a => a -> a -> (a, a) < 1313717830 178067 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Fixed divMod' :: (Real a, Integral b) => a -> a -> (b, a) < 1313717831 905613 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle quotRem < 1313717831 997771 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude quotRem :: Integral a => a -> a -> (a, a) < 1313717859 500667 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well theres a lament in #math who says he has no idea what #esoteric is < 1313717862 617360 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe hes lying :D < 1313717866 693037 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :He is. < 1313717870 986807 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :* [lament] (~lament@S0106002312fa554a.vc.shawcable.net): Nikita < 1313717874 537785 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right hostname, realname. < 1313717968 233043 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313717976 982398 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament < 1313717978 212691 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF < 1313717980 496578 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :where are you < 1313717995 404916 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :moses_: in #math! < 1313718020 524287 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :omg < 1313718023 84486 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1313718024 503607 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fuck < 1313718025 338345 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :way to ruin my life < 1313718025 413436 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is going on < 1313718034 622412 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moses_: ????????? < 1313718046 781439 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, you were once my hampster!!! < 1313718058 678435 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know. < 1313718062 346570 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then I passed away. < 1313718066 522511 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still with you in spirit, moses_. < 1313718091 309284 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually you got lost in my house < 1313718107 910433 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok no but seriously what is it with lament?? < 1313718111 390595 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are you here < 1313718122 658528 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you dont know lament? < 1313718129 144782 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I do < 1313718132 979319 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, fsvo know < 1313718139 933463 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he is an op here, why? < 1313718149 541374 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hates me < 1313718189 560872 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hates a lot of things < 1313718190 444956 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it true that he doesn't come here anymore specifically because of elliott_ specifically < 1313718197 775274 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313718199 559898 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i believe so < 1313718202 261733 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah :D < 1313718205 117671 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :he hates someone in this channel < 1313718207 540600 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moses_: what's your point, and why are you coming here to make it < 1313718209 656670 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what is this channel? < 1313718215 277948 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's about esoteric programming languages < 1313718220 996057 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are like which? < 1313718222 391761 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :C? < 1313718226 79822 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :muhahahaaha < 1313718228 142242 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :jkjk < 1313718235 314660 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck, intercal, unlambda :P < 1313718241 319830 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but nobody likes brainfuck much.) < 1313718255 688692 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wait < 1313718266 336877 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moses_: does lament going around telling people how much he hates this one guy in #esoteric or something < 1313718271 538877 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's hilarious < 1313718281 833114 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone called him out on it < 1313718347 677427 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur, hello < 1313718358 27328 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1313718358 738579 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :moses_, hello < 1313718372 280189 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they told me to ask you about brainfuck < 1313718386 674821 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: someone let dbelange out of the cage again < 1313718430 838814 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok my score looks worky < 1313718441 878084 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I just did it in a nice way except sprunge is down oops < 1313718445 541116 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really like how the layout turned out, but other than that, I'm pleased with it < 1313718456 107199 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1313718461 482609 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll hpaste mine I guess?? < 1313718483 206178 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: who are you < 1313718503 255637 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbelange: a beautiful snowflake < 1313718507 57260 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone here know erlang < 1313718507 411950 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Sgeo: here we go: http://hpaste.org/50453 < 1313718509 51083 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's fast now < 1313718518 690308 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to learn erlang but nobody uses it because it's useless < 1313718520 791610 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Sgeo: http://hpaste.org/50454 < 1313718522 168631 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I come here < 1313718545 998923 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbelange, Erlang isn't considered "esoteric" < 1313718553 337700 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: dude dbelange has been in here before < 1313718556 898536 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there may be people here who know some ... oh < 1313718611 972504 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: yours requires language extensions :( < 1313718616 72440 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably want a newline before the | anyway < 1313718628 919746 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: yeah < 1313718638 745212 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: What did I do last time that was so memorable? < 1313718653 855084 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbelange: I think I primarily remember coppro shooing you away < 1313718654 852828 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I guess my thing got scrolled down so the {-# LANGUAGE PatternGuards #-} got cut off < 1313718663 267057 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: anyway I can't live without pattern guards < 1313718669 189519 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish guards could nest < 1313718670 945716 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be nice < 1313718693 351272 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: yours doesn't scale very well if your dice miraculously grows a few thousand extra sides, just sayin' < 1313718699 614480 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313718707 982944 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was my first try < 1313718718 102292 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder if fusion eliminates the map altogether < 1313718725 894169 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a pretty simple "fold . map . construct" pipeline < 1313718729 678614 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks at the core < 1313718888 224032 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i gues the thing i import requires extensions too but i forgive it because i can't live without extensions either < 1313718898 191042 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: fold fusion?? < 1313718925 629250 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: yes fusion < 1313718955 682267 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION finishes < 1313718957 501615 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: it does not look like it's eliminating the map entirely HMMmmmmmMMMMmmmmmmmmmmmmmMMMMmmmmmmmMMMmmmmMMmmmmMMmmMMMmmmMMmmmMMmmmMMMmmMMmmmMmmmmmmmmmmmmmm < 1313718966 508697 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION tries to make it use a list COUNTERINTUITIVE BUT WILL IT WORK??? < 1313718971 900667 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastie.org/2394478 < 1313718976 833162 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, map-fold fusion certainly eliminates the map altogether < 1313718986 795848 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but because of identification < 1313718987 731854 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: you could manually put the thing in the fold????????? < 1313718992 918337 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t foldl' < 1313718993 523109 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b -> a) -> a -> [b] -> a < 1313719004 415567 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: map as in Data.Map in this case < 1313719009 345116 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :foldr f z . map g = foldr (f . g) z < 1313719016 53817 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, well then! < 1313719019 457993 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows < 1313719028 431779 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Data.Map.fold < 1313719029 121825 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b k. (a -> b -> b) -> b -> M.Map k a -> b < 1313719036 72678 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask in #haskell! < 1313719065 610402 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, this is almost certainly the best solution < 1313719167 57157 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sgeos solution is too much mutation for me :( < 1313719239 985231 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let feels = fmap (>>= (const Nothing)); batman = Just (Just False) in feels batman < 1313719240 720309 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Just Nothing < 1313719251 889745 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some assumptions in this area that there won't be more than 5 dice. Otherwise, multiple triplets may be < 1313719252 394422 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :underreported < 1313719253 874728 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pro < 1313719261 543634 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine handles an arbitrary number of triples < 1313719268 387152 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also dice of any size???? < 1313719273 657422 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also lists of any side < 1313719274 339631 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im good < 1313719275 205129 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :size < 1313719286 10096 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think mine handles multiple triplets as well < 1313719287 879568 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_ has excellent size. < 1313719303 931272 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: mine is the best y/y < 1313719309 787252 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure fine whatever < 1313719314 80417 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: FEEL BAD < 1313719318 652019 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine should also handle dice of any size, lists of any size??? < 1313719326 380181 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldnt know i cant read it its too wide < 1313719346 127694 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let feels = fmap (>>= (const Nothing)); batman = Just (Just (Just (Just (Just (Just Nothing))))) in feels batman < 1313719346 812170 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Just Nothing < 1313719374 373034 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> join (Just Nothing) < 1313719375 9507 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Nothing < 1313719430 566869 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders porting the Haskell prelude to Ruby < 1313719437 563921 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1313719438 856900 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313719496 731201 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would you ever < 1313719498 264368 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone ever < 1313719498 930993 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do that < 1313719524 332858 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the useful functions? < 1313719531 616641 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it for the learning rubey experience < 1313719543 418034 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not for both? < 1313719569 798923 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :both are useless because ruby sucks < 1313719669 270462 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really understand why ruby sucks. < 1313719676 166200 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it, for instance, more sucky than Python? < 1313719697 430972 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes and also no, but it's on the same tier as python < 1313719703 118626 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's in the region of unacceptably afwul < 1313719704 890173 :kwertii!~kwertii@ResNet-33-19.resnet.ucsb.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :any language with syntactically significant whitespace automatically gains 550 suck points, just for that. < 1313719705 56910 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what exactly are you looking for in your language. < 1313719709 359335 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of its flaws are different than python's < 1313719739 565202 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :syntactically significant whitespace is pretty okay. (thumbs up) < 1313719748 519549 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it is. < 1313719750 734741 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: haskell < 1313719757 107058 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some people just don't like being told what to do. < 1313719761 86527 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1313719764 242446 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if they were going to do that very thing anyway. < 1313719766 50148 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sees nothing wrong with significant whitespace as long as it's done properly < 1313719771 748438 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :properly: Haskell < 1313719777 381262 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :improperly: Python < 1313719789 158143 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is Python's improper? < 1313719799 608907 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no non-significant option < 1313719805 293439 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with {}'s and such < 1313719847 990510 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, to be fair, at least it's intentional in Python. < 1313719854 303460 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes it even worse. < 1313719855 732941 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"There should be ONE TRUE WAY." < 1313719865 446808 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :one true bad way < 1313719866 113873 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an idealistic language. :P < 1313719869 148854 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hyu k huyk < 1313719869 231750 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means it's an ideological fuck up and not just a fuck up of negligence. < 1313719890 97683 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So long as we know where the problem is. < 1313719894 456574 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION knows all about the Python "philosophy" < 1313719900 687869 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's almost as bad as the Ruby way. :P < 1313719919 845440 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and maybe Perl ranks up there somewhere in "programming languages turned into philosophies gone wrong" < 1313719937 879697 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a freakin' religion, okay? it's a programming language. < 1313719940 803585 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :does any language have a good philosophy? < 1313719952 713603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 assembly < 1313719953 429940 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't perl's philosophy that there's multiple ways to do things < 1313719959 876356 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, among other things. < 1313719971 269816 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 has a philosophy? < 1313719973 320857 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"do what I mean" is another. < 1313719978 130036 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's wrong with Only One Obvious Way To Do It? < 1313719995 948170 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if x86 has a philosophy, it's godawful, ok. < 1313719996 798673 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one thing I don't like about Perl6 is changing the meanings of $, @, and % based on context. < 1313720003 149576 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heres my philosophy THE LANGUAGE IS PERFECT AND DOES WHAT YOU MEAN < 1313720008 888178 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is about as achievable as only one obvious way to do it < 1313720009 263592 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than "$ always gets me a scalar". < 1313720010 517416 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :evincar: rest in peace hilariously bad misfeatures < 1313720024 350921 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked typed dereferencing operators. :( < 1313720029 779020 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: exactly < 1313720029 944809 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there's usually more than one way to do something? < 1313720030 16756 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in Python. < 1313720054 850277 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and because you cant make everything obvious < 1313720057 472319 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless everything you do is trivial < 1313720062 497281 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is true for most pyhton programmers i guess < 1313720125 87539 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Perl's philosophy is a better approach, honestly. Though it may not be the best language. < 1313720175 56315 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"do what I mean" is pretty bad < 1313720186 364721 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it can be. < 1313720191 826161 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perls is timtoady < 1313720197 532907 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, like Javascript implied semicolon? < 1313720206 794451 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also "make the easy things easy and the hard things possible" < 1313720236 678916 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I hate that sort of thing < 1313720254 935262 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"you can put semicolons here if you want them, but it's fine if you leave them out" is just ugh < 1313720273 142436 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember reading about a Javascript quirk that's exactly due to implied semicolon < 1313720281 916151 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: let x=0; y=9 in z < 1313720286 743466 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: let {x=0; y=9} in z < 1313720292 307800 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can put braces here if you want them [...] < 1313720318 167118 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: i indeed dislike that,,,haskell isnt perfect,,, < 1313720338 472654 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an incredibly trivial thing to dislike, though... < 1313720350 504270 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never said it made me want to kill people or anything < 1313720352 90302 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: js' implied semicolons cause shit < 1313720353 546570 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :function x() < 1313720353 889966 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ < 1313720355 333656 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hatred of JS implied semicolon is sensible though. < 1313720355 591128 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :return < 1313720356 8404 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :{ < 1313720357 111116 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :x:9 < 1313720358 207813 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :}; < 1313720358 565294 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :} < 1313720359 363755 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mildly dislike it < 1313720363 7124 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess what that returns < 1313720368 619878 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was referring to the Haskell thing. < 1313720370 843640 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hint, it's not {x:9} < 1313720371 622205 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not JS. < 1313720374 443321 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I was too < 1313720380 693238 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1313720384 166270 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: the javascript one is more dislikeable < 1313720450 639784 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because with let..in it's completely disambiguous where it starts and ends. < 1313720468 200253 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :starts with a let, ends with an in < 1313720473 830535 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unambiguous < 1313720478 877272 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1313720486 595210 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :too much wikipedia, obviously. < 1313720651 290103 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find the Python design goals to be insulting really. < 1313720670 184015 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :very conservative inclusion of features so that our feeble minds aren't overloaded. < 1313720706 739272 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :we can't add that it makes it possible to write unreadable code! < 1313720835 466141 :variable!~thing@unaffiliated/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1313720892 852225 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...you don't even declare variables in Python. really I don't want to know what testing a large Python application is like. < 1313720908 146798 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it must be something like what I imagine hell to be. < 1313721021 288987 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost as bad as testing a large Perl application < 1313721041 288657 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey at least Perl has some compile-time errors that aren't syntax errors. < 1313721108 832888 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"hey you didn't declare this variable" "uh, hey this is an array reference but I want an array" < 1313721131 384546 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, not much better, with more room to fuck up due to complicated syntax. < 1313721164 278594 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd imagine using subroutine prototyping would greatly improve compile-time errors. < 1313721255 549083 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : "hey you didn't declare this variable" "uh, hey this is an array reference but I want an array" < 1313721258 798246 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :only with use strict/warnings < 1313721265 584524 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...right. < 1313721277 239868 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :who in their right mind would not use strict/warnings when writing a Perl application. < 1313721288 335646 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's their problem not Perls. < 1313721300 640841 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Option Explicit < 1313721348 28389 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact unless you're using Perl < 1313721354 887250 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :'s -e option to write a short command line thing < 1313721362 714791 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much every program needs a use strict; use warnings line < 1313721481 383105 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one line? gross < 1313721503 865271 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.....really? < 1313721512 57254 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, it's that big of a deal that I write use strict; use warnings; < 1313721513 358007 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of < 1313721514 968539 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :use strict; < 1313721516 455706 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :use warnings; < 1313721537 693317 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :man that newline character makes such a different < 1313721549 118406 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, effect. < 1313721734 474649 :jcp|other!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313721751 363197 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1313721752 409082 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it does. < 1313721811 908230 :jcp!alex@bzflag/contributor/javawizard2539 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313721828 980225 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you didn't care about superficial syntax differences? < 1313721850 98933 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1313721861 693114 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1313722000 865552 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION kind of wants to play with Heroku >.> < 1313722094 683184 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Heroku guys seem nice, but they also support non-Ruby languages < 1313722116 764425 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :_why would you do that < 1313722127 605767 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's hardly a reason to torture yourself < 1313722143 8470 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not really finding this torture yet < 1313722147 915672 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a personal flaw < 1313722317 117475 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Besides Ruby, they support... Node.js, I don't see what else they support. < 1313722329 128100 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you'd say Javascript is actually better than Ruby < 1313722357 927665 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks harder < 1313722422 519203 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clojure too, but also anything statically linked. < 1313722471 712561 :derrik!~xix@gprs-inet-65-51.elisa.ee JOIN :#esoteric < 1313723489 482750 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313723669 672625 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313724104 911170 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :W. T. F. < 1313724106 458526 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :range.first + rand (range.last + (range.include_end? ? 1 : 0)) < 1313724128 442618 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313724136 85785 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops, wrong thing < 1313724140 261942 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's _my_ code < 1313724145 32720 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ruby-forum.com/topic/93106#187674 < 1313724300 481509 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey JOIN :#esoteric < 1313724683 193758 :derrik!~xix@gprs-inet-65-51.elisa.ee QUIT :Quit: all work and no play < 1313725106 309885 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You know, with a decent union FS, writing a purely-functional package manager is really trivial. < 1313725239 445908 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modulo dependencies, which have no general solution, due to recursive build-time dependencies. < 1313725295 479750 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: How on earth can you say those have no general solution? There's more than one way to get the package [name-version-hash] than following the build script. < 1313725310 817997 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, downloading an archive from a known binary source and verifying its checksum, thus giving bit-identical results. < 1313725321 709106 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :: gcc |> |> gcc < 1313725327 629469 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is what you have to encode. < 1313725333 111217 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: There are no unsatisfiably cyclic _dependencies_, only methods of getting these dependencies. < 1313725349 281624 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather than "build GHC -> build GHC -> ...", you want "build GHC -> download GHC". < 1313725351 938261 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again, < 1313725352 315051 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : pikhq: How on earth can you say those have no general solution? There's more than one way to get the package [name-version-hash] than following the build script. < 1313725352 462809 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : For instance, downloading an archive from a known binary source and verifying its checksum, thus giving bit-identical results. < 1313725362 235125 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Building from source is just one way to get the same bit-for-bit result. < 1313725446 728083 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: And if your package manager only supports one way of getting a package, it's pretty lame. Rebuilding is a waste of time unless you want abnormal flags. < 1313725464 997685 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, of course, if you want abnormal flags, that doesn't change GHC's dependencies; GHC compiles with a stock GHC, no matter what flags you're giving it. < 1313725529 111999 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No? < 1313725637 322910 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :GHC foo built with GHC foo != GHC foo built with GHC bar. What you want for cyclic dependencies like that is the fixed point... < 1313725647 418757 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think this thing is teaching best practices < 1313725652 646159 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Why? < 1313725663 180704 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: GHC is parameterised on its flags; it depends on GHC(stock-flags). < 1313725677 732959 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It taught how to access and modify instance variables from within a module, but didn't say "Don't do that" < 1313725686 73841 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: A GHC parameterised on flags =/= stock-flags might not even be able to build a useful GHC -- for instance, if you want a GHC that compiles for ARM. < 1313725698 950917 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Because that's not bad practice in Ruby. < 1313725709 535838 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So what if there's a conflict? < 1313725710 936372 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Shit language, shitter idioms, shittest community. < 1313725731 213145 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Does GHC(stock-flags) depend on GHC(stock-flags) or GHC(version--, stock-flags)? < 1313725742 861794 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the only language I've never seen smacktalked in here is haskell < 1313725755 498381 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: I could smacktalk Haskell all day if you'd like < 1313725763 823525 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure B) < 1313725766 907894 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: The latter will probably work, but I'd specify the dependency as the former. < 1313725783 551135 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Yes, it's a cyclic dependency, but that doesn't mean its unresolvable; it only is with a naive method of package-finding. < 1313725791 140184 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Then you're going to be finding the fixed point of package building. < 1313725796 86261 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: No. < 1313725802 501389 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You keep saying that, but it's not true. < 1313725814 520588 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : pikhq: Yes, it's a cyclic dependency, but that doesn't mean its unresolvable; it only is with a naive method of package-finding. < 1313725819 960378 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :_Building is not the only way to install a package._ < 1313725837 573009 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Building is the only way to install a package if the package does not already exist. < 1313725845 501961 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: Module system should be more like ML's, record system sucks, IO monad sucks should be more like FRP (but this leads to an entire operating system, well... see @), ... < 1313725853 240836 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Sure, if you own the only computer in the world. < 1313725857 577910 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: You could also get the package from someone else. < 1313725861 705682 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. *AT ALL*. < 1313725877 694203 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: How exactly does wgetting the package from a package repository fail to produce the package? < 1313725878 320441 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, rather, in a form at all usable on your system. < 1313725890 340018 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Where does the package repository get it from? < 1313725894 350877 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thin air? < 1313725928 834031 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely there's a nice clean idiom for having modules store state that doesn't interfere with the instance variables of the class < 1313725936 710161 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Building it locally. To start with, you'd simply make an initial binary package of the current version by building it on another machine or downloading the provided haskell.org/ghc/ binary distribution, extracting that tree, and packaging it up. < 1313725957 455797 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: That package can then be used to satisfy the dependency. < 1313725971 929001 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Ruby sucks. < 1313725979 87300 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: I could go on, but those are pretty big problems. < 1313726011 899833 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now you're either going to be building GHC with the same configuration of GHC, eventually getting the fixed point of building GHC, or you're going to have one funky build dependency chain. < 1313726023 791133 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now are we done confusing each other? < 1313726056 71299 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I don't see how branding the obvious thing to do as a "funky dependency chain" makes it not the obvious thing to do. < 1313726063 955355 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :'module system should be more like ML's' what is ML? < 1313726083 7521 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: Um, one of the oldest functional languages in existence? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ML_(programming_language) < 1313726104 469966 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_ML#Module_system is relevant. < 1313726128 699987 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: ghc7->ghc6->ghc5->ghc4->ghc3->ghc2->ghc-non-bootstrapped is a funky thing to specify as your dependency chain. < 1313726144 485967 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially if you don't want anything earlier than ghc7 still around. < 1313726145 213158 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I never said that < 1313726147 352746 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But w/e < 1313727171 630678 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh pipes are weird. < 1313727180 227034 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"HEY YOU HAVE INPUT! READ IT! READ IT NOW! Oh it's zero bytes." < 1313727617 145860 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: doesn't read returning 0 = eof or error < 1313727653 281317 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not if you're nonblocking. < 1313727663 786596 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohohoh < 1313727667 256127 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why be nonblocking < 1313727669 56260 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I didn't explain properly :P < 1313727674 389962 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use select or w/e < 1313727688 263171 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Um, that still applies. < 1313727692 661225 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :read() returned -1, I just meant it was select()ing and then giving me no bytes. < 1313727703 668762 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: It's just that one of the errors you get is "There's no data here right now". < 1313727716 220525 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: that means error, i think < 1313727717 592099 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm starting to consider C# favorably in relation to Ruby < 1313727723 961124 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'm wrong < 1313727728 367662 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1313727729 274331 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed, it is errors :P < 1313727735 540606 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason my connection is unidirectional. < 1313727742 472834 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least I'm blind to any masive C# warts, even if it's not quite as smoothly powerful < 1313727743 694151 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: but yeah why nonblocking < 1313727754 170070 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: That was just a bit of overgeneralization *shrugs* < 1313727756 502105 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have since fixed it. < 1313727758 281808 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: EAGAIN, telling you that there's no data pending right now, is an error. :) < 1313727758 369929 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its just more painful and iirc doesnt work on sockets < 1313727776 252821 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/sockets/pipes/ < 1313728167 898780 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, this is painful. Someone please freeze me until Newspeak or similar language with decent modularity overtakes the world. < 1313728184 322464 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1313728281 53542 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313728284 350816 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does vanilla Smalltalk not have this kind of stupidity? < 1313728319 673949 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Oh, right, it does, kind of < 1313728381 969828 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey sexies < 1313728470 375817 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :sup quintopia < 1313728475 89105 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am a sexy < 1313728483 916868 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1313728488 322044 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to have you around < 1313728493 31411 :evincar!~jon@d-burl-bng2-64-223-167-241.ngn.east.myfairpoint.net QUIT :Quit: Sleemp. < 1313728577 840029 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1313728766 617535 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313728804 24780 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: about what are you so upset < 1313728827 982353 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :modules with instance variables that can conflict with eachother < 1313728837 439782 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When included into a class < 1313728850 85117 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suggestions by one person include long variable names < 1313728850 294527 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313728893 112989 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's no way to handle it? < 1313728901 860404 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's ridiculous < 1313728911 293375 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1313728920 33204 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello mr. o < 1313728941 565517 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There probably is a way, but certainly not built-in or anything. Supposedly, Ruby 2.0 will make a lot of these things much better < 1313728957 464896 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :good morning Q < 1313728972 61314 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not yet 1 am here < 1313729012 301737 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah you want to make me believe in that stupid time zone theory < 1313729055 81997 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least there is a way to deal with conflicting method names < 1313729111 822973 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, hmm, static typing makes more sense than duck-typing for that purpose < 1313729149 705842 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since with duck-typing, a rename means something that just expects a class that conforms to the API of one of the modules that tries to simply use an instance of the class breaks < 1313729313 860893 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugh, I made a patch to Newspeak a while ago < 1313729319 832492 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should have submitted it somewhere < 1313729326 481008 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The lack of it is now bothering me < 1313729542 155319 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :repatch! < 1313729596 315773 :dbelange!~dbelange@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wangs < 1313730297 195764 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1313730464 574556 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PART :#esoteric < 1313730811 137106 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow. in C# you can write 'sql' http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb311045.aspx < 1313730813 65903 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to try that < 1313730835 466275 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaah, LINQ < 1313730872 843311 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313731305 575945 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: AKA monad comprehensions. < 1313731422 989211 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you need to cackle evilly when you say that. < 1313731631 469285 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :a ha! C# is functional after all < 1313731738 741276 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah right < 1313733496 23153 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote That's the stupidest thing I've heard all morning. (Though I did wake up five minutes ago, so I haven't had a chance to hear very much.) The "Why are you still asleep? I told the cat to wake you up." comment does come pretty close, though. < 1313733497 889080 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :600) That's the stupidest thing I've heard all morning. (Though I did wake up five minutes ago, so I haven't had a chance to hear very much.) The "Why are you still asleep? I told the cat to wake you up." comment does come pretty close, though. < 1313733498 841285 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie EXPOSED TO THE WORLD < 1313733506 91271 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, nice 600th quote. < 1313733553 725620 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: NOW YOU CANNOT DELETE ANY OF THE PREVIOUS ONES *MWAHAHAHA* < 1313733575 749178 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1313733611 42609 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :a wicked dilemma < 1313733667 777304 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can only assume the Mr_Grim in #ruby is not the MrGrim on Reddit. < 1313733671 926066 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless he manually moves later ones to before it < 1313733679 688188 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume MrGrim on Reddit has an IQ of above 50 < 1313733689 833290 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :or he could move that one to position 100, since 100 is more auspicious than 600 < 1313733722 779104 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: #ruby-lang is the official channel (I forget whether it's better or worse...) < 1313733723 607055 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1313733729 117193 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zenspider is an op in #ruby-lang < 1313733731 932291 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess it has to be worse < 1313734041 135093 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: quintopia: monqy: if you guess the question i ask i turn into god...... < 1313734132 868798 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :then i won't guess < 1313734144 319800 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :because as unlikely as it is, i might be right < 1313734227 178480 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313734230 6512 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :guese or die < 1313734230 275486 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i somehow doubt that. < 1313734244 901468 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :guese or dei < 1313734269 457728 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess and deus < 1313734287 796437 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :GES OR DE < 1313734304 320060 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :DO UT DES < 1313734317 132795 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*VT < 1313734329 725015 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313734334 325597 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hi Taneb < 1313734341 218944 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1313734353 816210 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea what you were on about last night. < 1313734375 176335 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: i think i commented on your Cab = a or b question while you were away < 1313734384 181877 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: i like being incoherent its great < 1313734434 42296 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, any combinator such that Cab = a must as a lambda expression be eta-equivalent to \x y -> x, and similarly for b < 1313734474 630931 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, I read "IM TAB" as "Go to the IM tab" < 1313734476 530791 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313734489 120160 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no on < 1313734492 553411 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just identifying with tabness < 1313734514 901210 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence my private message < 1313734520 993237 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow im tab too < 1313734539 208404 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: tab frends < 1313734568 881984 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ola < 1313734575 99152 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :helo < 1313734581 720132 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you in spain now???? < 1313734600 872115 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bonjourno? < 1313734607 159851 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1313734633 115959 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: also, system F (explicitly typed polymorphic LC) explores the idea of defining booleans as the type forall t. t -> t -> t, which in that system has only those two solutions. < 1313734649 987323 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... < 1313734653 434010 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313734654 31238 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well irreducible solutions < 1313734677 506586 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*normalized < 1313734678 37907 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking in terms of MIBBLLII output < 1313734683 102708 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313734712 710602 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isnt mibbllii impure < 1313734716 815328 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye pianoo hi pianoo < 1313734734 820537 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Only in terms of IO? < 1313734736 685257 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :system F can define other data types in that way too, e.g. church numerals are forall t. (t -> t) -> (t -> t) < 1313734746 740863 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: that's the point :P < 1313734762 107112 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1313734784 450610 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't quite get language purity < 1313734839 229320 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what part? < 1313734845 397399 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313734866 275472 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hum sorry for that... < 1313734870 653823 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it's basically: < 1313734875 961199 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- Evaluating an expression cannot cause any side-effects to happen; < 1313734882 502816 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- A function's return value cannot depend on anything but its argument. < 1313734921 59934 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :- Values don't change. < 1313734942 296089 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: That's inherent in the definition of value :-) < 1313734958 627723 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: well i mean in the context of your function arguments < 1313734961 153969 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still need to make my Scumbag Ola Bini pic < 1313734972 903875 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1313735001 961496 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, pure languages cannot have interactive IO? < 1313735004 80327 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise that _could_ be interpreted as the function's return value depending on just what its argument _currently_ is. < 1313735014 295125 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: not as part of their evaluation < 1313735021 53445 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: That's true in some ways, and untrue in others. < 1313735022 270880 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1313735038 176631 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider Haskell; all Haskell code is pure, except for that code inside the IO monad. < 1313735063 96437 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: But consider Lazy K < 1313735064 475846 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: original haskell managed, in a convoluted way, to have the main program be a pure function without any monads. < 1313735080 211925 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's misleading < 1313735084 674220 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, how is the IO monad not pure? < 1313735089 932242 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can define a simple IO type that has PutChar and GetChar < 1313735094 23238 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but code inside it still isn't pure < 1313735094 889780 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's only main that's treated, at execution, in an impure way < 1313735098 938464 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is internally, but not externally < 1313735127 87501 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Would you be offended if I said that I didn't think you had a good enough understanding of Haskell to give a satisfactory answer? < 1313735132 562242 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fact is that you can perform impure operations from within IO. < 1313735150 32241 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That you can contain these effects is nice, but does not make the IO monad itself impure. < 1313735155 633788 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is pure, but the IO monad isn't. < 1313735168 42694 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you mistyped < 1313735171 997832 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIBBLLII's about as pure as Haskell, if I'm understanding this correctly < 1313735173 704019 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Where? < 1313735180 115872 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : That you can contain these effects is nice, but does not make the IO monad itself impure. < 1313735185 260665 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/impure/pure/ < 1313735193 495072 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no pun intended) < 1313735197 524511 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> takes the next bit from the I/O stream, and then evaluates it in the following format: < 1313735197 774293 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :< a prints whatever a 1 0 evaluates to, and returns null. < 1313735198 137576 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : parse error on input `,' < 1313735199 714837 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Sorry, no. < 1313735204 707041 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIBBLLII is an impure language. < 1313735221 651002 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evaluation of an expression could cause things to be printed or read from the input stream. < 1313735233 348758 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The latter is a dependency of a function on something other than its argument; the former is causing a side-effect. < 1313735293 637278 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can mostly ignore everything I said about the IO monad, it's a sticky corner-case.) < 1313735302 175750 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The behaviour when you override if should still work as expected, but will make the global performance of that program slower for the rest of the execution." < 1313735305 486062 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tell me how I could do interactive IO without becoming impure < 1313735308 325721 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like that < 1313735323 97212 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Seph has mutable lexical scopes." < 1313735326 111472 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like that < 1313735327 439047 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Model a program as a function from input stream to output stream; read all input up-front. < 1313735347 293526 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm... < 1313735362 963523 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm, what's your opinion on Lazy K's pureness? IMO, the fact that IO can be interactive in the Haskell interact style makes me consider it impure, because by causing expressions to be evaluated you can cause input to be read < 1313735367 901011 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would give me space to have S and I combinators < 1313735369 506491 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1313735371 238876 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :While still looking a lot like brainfuck < 1313735391 310622 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Obviously you need to encode the input and output stream somehow -- a Church list of Church numerals is the obvious representation. < 1313735398 667647 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, Church stream < 1313735405 102616 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons = \hd tl f. f hd tl < 1313735408 763387 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you know how Church numerals go < 1313735419 123661 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: it depends on exact lazy evaluation order for I/O ordering doesn't it < 1313735420 507487 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah < 1313735420 713816 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then just model input as "cons inputchr (cons inputchr (cons ..." < 1313735428 104598 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And terminate it on some too-large character < 1313735440 159395 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(256 if you're doing bytes) < 1313735448 253901 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: or terminate on 0, to give it the same IO weakness as brainfuck :) < 1313735452 166830 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yep < 1313735456 586630 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: which I would consider impure < 1313735465 755446 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: it's pure if you think of it as a batch program pipe, but not for interactive use < 1313735486 141612 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well, doing benign rearrangements on it when considering the program as a pure function can change its interactive behaviour < 1313735497 908133 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-176.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Actually, at EOF you have fix (256:), not just 256. :) < 1313735498 407161 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I agree that reading all input up-front would solve the problem which is why I suggested it to Taneb < 1313735514 663137 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: But IMO as far as interactive use goes, Lazy K is definitely impure < 1313735520 175688 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is ironic considering its goals < 1313735543 921505 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIBBLLII isn't brainfuck. EOF is an infinite stream of 256s < 1313735561 825169 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: What, don't want to advertise Unicode support? :-) < 1313735566 707329 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that gives you binary processing < 1313735573 66641 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can just write your own UTF decoding routines :D < 1313735581 128354 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT IS DECIDED < 1313735589 682577 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or possibly EOF is an infite stream of threes < 1313735590 185110 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm, I wonder what the simplest model of stdio that retains purity _and_ interactivity < 1313735591 503419 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: although actually when you consider bottom, it's not that obvious, because that reduces the amount of rearrangement you can do - reading an extra character could give I/O error as bottom, and so rearrangement is not equivalent even purely. but there are probably corner cases. < 1313735600 243895 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, purity in the technical sense, allowing "cheating" like Haskell's IO monad < 1313735614 888807 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I/O error as bottom is not standard Lazy K afaik < 1313735655 400312 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: well alternatively think of it as lazy K having to act equivalent even if its input is not correctly formatted < 1313735681 926057 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm, what do you mean? < 1313735699 46858 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could define 1 as \l a b -> a and 0 as \l a b -> b and EOF as... \l a b -> \l a b -> b < 1313735712 676542 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And do it bitwise < 1313735732 9839 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: if you can only do rearrangements that give the exact same LC function up to eta equivalence, then i don't think you can read an extra character. < 1313735741 320775 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: well the data-type you want is < 1313735750 861687 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Input = EOF | Cons Bool Input < 1313735754 541153 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll let oerjan church-encode that :P < 1313735756 406322 :Pianoo!~whynow@207.204.228.219 QUIT :Quit: Rooms • iPhone IRC Client • http://www.roomsapp.mobi < 1313735766 961881 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always forget the church-encoding of lists < 1313735780 734033 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: foldr < 1313735783 810509 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right < 1313735807 635971 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's (:) with that representation? < 1313735822 912895 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\in. in (:) [] would be your cat program, obviously < 1313735826 756153 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott_: if you can only do rearrangements that give the exact same LC function up to eta equivalence, then i don't think you can read an extra character. < 1313735832 10938 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but surely you can mix up input and output in the wrong order < 1313735920 574616 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i take it you were too scraed to answer oerjan: hmm, I wonder what the simplest model of stdio that retains purity _and_ interactivity >:) < 1313735940 760256 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[asterisk]scared < 1313736064 662169 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In practice, however, interactive Lazy K programs tend not to exhibit these problems. The first case cannot arise if the "H" of "Hello" depends in some way on the end of the user's input. The most obvious way of writing this particular program is to cons together the "Hello, [name]!" string in an expression which is conditioned on receipt of a newline. If you do this you are safe, because there's no way for any evaluator to prove in advance that the u < 1313736064 826534 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ser will ever type a newline. < 1313736064 910416 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The second case does not occur as long as the prompt ("What is your name?") is consed together irrespective of the input — again the obvious thing to do. The reason this works is that the Lazy K interpreter uses lazy evaluation, which by definition tries to produce output as early as possible and do everything else (including input) as late as possible. < 1313736067 633770 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's no practical problem with interactive software. Nevertheless, there's something unpleasant about the way the second case is prevented. A referentially transparent program should not have to rely on lazy evaluation in order to work properly." < 1313736071 692256 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it seems clear to me that Lazy K is definitely impure in this manner < 1313736097 410388 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: a simple (G)ADT for IO? < 1313736131 392232 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's rather vague -- if you do < 1313736150 559121 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :data IO where Stop :: IO; GetChar :: (Char -> IO) -> IO; PutChar :: Char -> IO -> IO < 1313736164 716788 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can mechanically transform that into the monadic form < 1313736167 576151 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: yeah < 1313736169 285064 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(see Russell O'Connor :P) < 1313736184 73393 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like calling that the simple ADT for IO is misleading, in that it's presupposing monadic IO < 1313736194 491103 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you inevitably need _some_ sort of ugly ordering, though < 1313736206 492496 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :um no it doesn't, there's no return. it's CPS style isn't it. < 1313736206 659287 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders what the church encoding of _that_ is < 1313736211 747580 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well yes < 1313736219 770231 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's "close" in the sense that the transformation is very simple < 1313736235 299428 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :data IO = Stop | GetChar (Char -> IO) | PutChar Char IO < 1313736240 880280 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should really remember how to church-encode things :( < 1313736286 466066 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have to use foldr when it's untyped anyway, just use pairs for conses < 1313736298 5586 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's gross < 1313736328 931908 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :A | B | C encodes as forall t. (A -> t) -> (B -> t) -> (C -> t) -> t < 1313736339 313570 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1313736347 630196 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313736350 260724 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :?ty foldr < 1313736350 909695 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. (a -> b -> b) -> b -> [a] -> b < 1313736358 994109 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :always forget the way round the a/bs are < 1313736381 803191 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*data X = A a | B b | C c endodes as forall t. (a -> t) -> (b -> t) -> (c -> t) -> t < 1313736385 898414 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*encodes < 1313736403 733338 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :io :: b -> ((Char -> b) -> b) -> (Char -> b -> b) -> IO -> b < 1313736404 444926 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe? < 1313736434 216674 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, wait < 1313736451 259371 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :never mind me < 1313736458 649593 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: im not smrt < 1313736594 880786 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :um drop the -> IO i think < 1313736666 323611 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I was doing it as foldr, but right < 1313736671 744402 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313736685 570569 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Changed MIBBLLII spec < 1313736694 739096 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is now more pute < 1313736696 586561 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\stop get put. put 'a' stop < 1313736697 723294 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :um list foldr only applies to lists afaik < 1313736699 916410 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :purer, too < 1313736701 323433 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\stop get put. put 'a' (put 'b' stop) < 1313736703 767781 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I meant... never mind < 1313736715 61571 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\stop get put. put 'a' (put 'b' (get (\c. put c stop))) < 1313736719 728446 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, that's actually quite nice < 1313736737 48138 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hmm < 1313736749 593520 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat might be a bit difficult :/ < 1313736750 853873 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need fix < 1313736771 577276 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :some haskell version did have a CPS IO style < 1313736777 515420 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\stop get put. fix (\r. get (\c. eof? c stop r)) < 1313736778 91298 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, Ruby has a Parsec < 1313736781 734504 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right, right? < 1313736782 573409 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :erm, I mean < 1313736785 996414 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\stop get put. fix (\r. get (\c. eof? c stop (put c r))) < 1313736790 40251 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's right, right? < 1313736794 119244 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: but is it any good < 1313736801 553429 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, no idea < 1313736808 520540 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :expressed as a church list of church booleans corresponding to the bits of the input, ending with an infinite stream of church trues < 1313736813 782666 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: um there is no way to detect EOF with this scheme < 1313736821 539368 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the user might have typed in a million ones, or it might be EOF < 1313736843 361830 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :EOF by universe heat death < 1313736878 823505 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: guess what other language has parsec < 1313736890 503380 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHP < 1313736898 209643 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION runs away < 1313736935 937653 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A language in whch I struggle to do simple tasks? < 1313736939 3386 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thing is, they don't type in 1s or 0s, they type in characters < 1313736949 989953 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which are converted into 1s and 0s < 1313736956 559190 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which < 1313736960 192586 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Maybe because you haven't learned it yet < 1313736966 40653 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: there is no way to detect EOF with your IO scheme. < 1313736993 770187 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just need to know what encoding it uses < 1313737012 636432 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And check for a number of consecutive ones that is too many for a valid character in that encoding < 1313737033 993130 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, if the encoding is bytes, then no. < 1313737038 906886 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :an infinite stream of ones is valid. < 1313737041 933915 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :....why is this blank http://rubydoc.info/gems/rparsec/1.0/frames < 1313737051 4137 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: rubydoc sucks, get used to it < 1313737055 143046 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's the YARD thing < 1313737056 292625 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's in ASCII, then yes < 1313737070 322150 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: well you'd better specify an encoding then... < 1313737083 14049 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm keeping that implementation dependent. < 1313737083 943719 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: wait, no, you are totally wrong < 1313737094 455442 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I mean < 1313737100 934744 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's only true if you pad out the encoding with at least one bit < 1313737108 122306 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I don't want to think about it right now. < 1313737110 345973 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you use the minimal number of bits then infinite ones will _always_ be valid < 1313737122 571188 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't leave it implementation-dependent because it changes whether your language can do all the IO it needs to be able to or not < 1313737139 113527 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the benefit of a repeating series is you don't need as much information to communicate it < 1313737148 2529 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :<< Captain Obvious < 1313737183 838765 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, the encoding is to be decided by whomever makes the first implementation with a sensible encoding. < 1313737235 630436 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw your wikipedia link is broken :P < 1313737247 379154 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/L/K/ < 1313737280 713226 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I really do not want to think about it < 1313737281 675061 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it isn't < 1313737305 113816 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rparsec (on github) looks unmaintained. Does something like rparsec need maintainance even? < 1313737383 332913 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Do libraries need maintenance?" --Sgeo < 1313737388 697396 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably, I can't imagine any ruby coder getting it right for the first time < 1313737405 543348 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, even the Haskell version has maintenance < 1313737602 74750 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: hel < 1313737604 754599 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313737607 472169 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: help < 1313737624 915736 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :why am i awake elliott? < 1313737639 360634 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Help me, elliott_, you're my only home! < 1313737651 607146 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're only home is bone < 1313737671 679963 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: thats a question i ask myself a lot < 1313737689 368526 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you ever have an answer < 1313737698 742863 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i could use an answer < 1313737700 309171 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: because being asleep is for the weak. < 1313737707 9612 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are only. home is bone. < 1313737720 747938 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: help < 1313737729 649208 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: help < 1313737746 546396 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb has moved in with elliott_? that was quick. < 1313737761 359057 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: < 1313737784 763819 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I've moved in/to/ elliott_. < 1313737798 43795 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1313737801 634931 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll move into taneb < 1313737816 264717 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then if elliott moves into me, the cycle will be complete < 1313737818 964874 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we can sleep < 1313737835 39256 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313737841 101895 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ok my answer is usually < 1313737843 321219 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ask irc about it???? < 1313737846 52403 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and oerjan wont answer < 1313737847 497489 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and monqy usually < 1313737850 503635 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :says something about not being a slep doctor < 1313737855 79424 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then i coerce him to tell him to go to sleep < 1313737859 56933 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which i should do now oops < 1313737860 274427 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1313737862 187081 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1313737866 90526 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what about me < 1313737869 676051 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me < 1313737872 767028 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im... you could try asking monqy??? < 1313737875 461603 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not a slep doctor either help :( < 1313737878 380242 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: help < 1313737892 288377 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hlep < 1313737908 885497 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: im still noit a slep e doctor < 1313737912 123489 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Try asking good ol' fungy < 1313737921 76809 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: help < 1313737921 885263 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: and no macros), so it worked nicely, although builds took a long time since i saw scheme i wanted to choose fnord, but don't < 1313737931 962685 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot is not a slepe doctor... < 1313737932 696335 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i'm in a fnord style for the operator. i know marc consider the interpreter as root, device files are your biggest foe. < 1313737934 753939 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew fungot, mind matching brackets? < 1313737935 305991 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: but you still shouldn't do that < 1313737940 193763 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313737945 893768 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what should i do fungot? < 1313737946 595543 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: eval ( string-ref " n" are for < 1313737947 375184 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (flip testBit) [0..] 'a' < 1313737948 14692 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `GHC.Types.Char -> t' < 1313737948 85938 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred... < 1313737961 437274 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle [a -> b] -> a -> [b] < 1313737961 651384 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Applicative (<*>) :: Applicative f => f (a -> b) -> f a -> f b < 1313737961 724879 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad ap :: Monad m => m (a -> b) -> m a -> m b < 1313737961 797296 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Applicative (<**>) :: Applicative f => f a -> f (a -> b) -> f b < 1313737969 154925 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (flip testBit) [0..] <**> 'a' < 1313737969 743093 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `[(a -> GHC.Bool.Bool) -> b]' < 1313737969 815026 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against ... < 1313737976 978657 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (flip testBit) [0..] <*> 'a' < 1313737977 610037 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `[a]' < 1313737977 681900 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `GHC.Types... < 1313737981 365163 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hepl < 1313737982 971938 :kwertii!~kwertii@ResNet-33-19.resnet.ucsb.edu QUIT :Quit: bye < 1313737985 269282 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i sleep or code or write or what fungot? < 1313737986 222887 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i expect whoever made the plt-file. dunno about the r6rs progress report' is probably save. < 1313737988 646059 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Recommendations for books on the lambda calculus. Go. < 1313737994 665743 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: how long have you been awake?? < 1313738010 844023 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: i dont read books books are lame < 1313738015 772824 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUCK BOOKS < 1313738022 406322 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess around 13 hours < 1313738025 775431 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess people like to mock a mockingbird?? is that close enough < 1313738026 811991 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :its pi o'clock now < 1313738027 177231 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t sequence < 1313738027 797073 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (m :: * -> *) a. (Monad m) => [m a] -> m [a] < 1313738030 368411 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: oh < 1313738032 298178 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: well stay up duh < 1313738038 78860 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: ^ < 1313738047 612395 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I've already read that. :D < 1313738048 215590 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> mapM (flip testBit) [0..] 'a' < 1313738048 806095 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (Data.Bits.Bits GHC.Types.Char) < 1313738048 878408 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of `D... < 1313738052 261809 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t mapM (flip testBit) [0..] < 1313738052 879752 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Bits a) => a -> [Bool] < 1313738056 299132 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: omg hot < 1313738057 959710 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much longer should i stay up < 1313738063 448831 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \a -> mapM (flip testBit) [0..bitSize a] a < 1313738064 88141 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Bits a) => a -> [Bool] < 1313738068 992157 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (\a -> mapM (flip testBit) [0..bitSize a] a) (99::Int) < 1313738070 196255 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: e < 1313738070 361796 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [True,True,False,False,False,True,True,False,False,False,False,False,False,... < 1313738080 381516 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (\a -> mapM (flip testBit) [0..bitSize a] a) (99::Word8) < 1313738081 668285 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :e hours? < 1313738081 740865 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [True,True,False,False,False,True,True,False,False] < 1313738087 29151 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try < 1313738107 664734 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> length ((\a -> mapM (flip testBit) [0..bitSize a] a) (99::Word8)) < 1313738108 981967 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 9 < 1313738115 84545 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: are you like me and do not know lambda calc or do you need a method to teach someone else lambda calc? < 1313738140 156933 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: Why are you asking? < 1313738147 426044 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: itidus20: I'm sort of familiar with it, but I'd like something more rigorous < 1313738157 854594 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: oh your question asking method is so elegant < 1313738175 251470 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used to know lambda calculus. i even evaluated THREE PLUS ONE in standard lambda calc once. i don't remember the substitutions anymore. < 1313738202 407616 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a good 3D thing for making a craft game easily? < 1313738226 209885 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :craft game? < 1313738230 312113 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If such a thing exists, that is < 1313738232 874663 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: if it were easy, it would be easy. < 1313738238 22256 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :craft game = minecraft genre < 1313738238 488841 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a craft game? < 1313738240 867035 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313738241 870153 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :enjoy opengl < 1313738245 315887 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1313738247 940101 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know minetest uses irrlicht < 1313738248 579777 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but uh < 1313738254 214906 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah if you are wanting a painless experience < 1313738256 609198 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :write something two dimensional < 1313738259 328072 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fromBits = foldl (.|.) 0 . map (\(i,b) -> if b then bit i else 0) . zip [0..] < 1313738261 897324 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: help it's ugly :( < 1313738272 198385 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i eat and shit games... so such questions are elementary to me hahahahhaa < 1313738288 319445 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know the answer but i mean the meaning of "craft game" < 1313738294 388999 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :well < 1313738296 699076 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: fromBits = foldl (.|.) 0 . zipWith (flip flip 0 . flip if' . bit) [0..] < 1313738303 599278 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: what's that supposed to do < 1313738306 384693 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: GENIUS < 1313738309 574284 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you actually shit games, you are the answer to taneb's prayers < 1313738309 746068 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: (Bits a) => [Bool] -> a < 1313738316 307401 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :An ncraft < 1313738324 498107 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: do you play minecraft < 1313738326 679876 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: MINECRAFT BY INDUCTION < 1313738330 548577 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: there is a genre of japanese absurd games. < 1313738336 451184 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :taneb: find the right combination of games to feed itidus, and you shall have your painless creation of a craft game < 1313738344 498633 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: no. if i did i would have at least asked about the esolang minecraft server < 1313738352 828697 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: are you _sure_ it's not easier to use Num a? < 1313738365 8222 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry to be snarky < 1313738368 950025 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: um how would that help < 1313738370 851644 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bits has NUm < 1313738376 8232 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Num < 1313738379 836482 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: we have one of those :P < 1313738383 782186 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gotta chill out < 1313738388 514077 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t readInt < 1313738389 112105 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Num a) => a -> (Char -> Bool) -> (Char -> Int) -> String -> [(a, String)] < 1313738389 226382 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you were snarky? < 1313738398 319629 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i felt snarky < 1313738399 794443 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fromEnum True :: Int < 1313738400 444683 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1313738407 574144 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fromBits = foldl (\n b -> (n `shiftR` 1) .|. fromEnum b) 0 < 1313738408 535058 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go < 1313738416 493108 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better < 1313738434 830247 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm it requires Char. that's actually a stupid restriction... < 1313738468 563431 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: would you kindly eat Minecraft, Team Fortress 2, the FunOrb version of Chess, and also VVVVVV? < 1313738488 915631 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: while lambda can't be understood by analogy or such.. it seems the weakness is that lambda is a method of symbolic manipulation < 1313738511 42271 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1313738516 974690 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: How is that a weakness? Symbolic manipulation is like 80% of my daily life :D < 1313738518 749070 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: my mibbllii interpreter is almost done. < 1313738533 519214 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: and yes I'm doing this just to give it a good IO model :) < 1313738542 652184 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: it is a gap in lambda calc's armor where we might attack him < 1313738549 804213 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Yay! < 1313738559 806646 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: one guess as to the language < 1313738566 301935 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Haskell < 1313738576 802899 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW DID YOU KNEOWNOE < 1313738582 373397 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :RE YOU A MAGIXIAN???? < 1313738587 664872 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aw, I was *just* about to guess Visual Basic for Applications. < 1313738591 583042 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I would have done it in Python < 1313738591 999359 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: LC λf.λx. f (f (f (f x))) LYFE < 1313738595 358614 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: WHO TOLD YOU LALL MY SECRETS.............. < 1313738600 197593 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: i mean it is a weakness of lambda calc's attempts to hide its understanding < 1313738642 270308 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: LALL YOUR SECRETS ARE BALLONG TO AAS < 1313738644 873891 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the notation is clearly bollocks < 1313738656 970419 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't lend itself to being understood < 1313738696 842954 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: It doesn't seem that opaque, really, I just enjoy the books that people that are more educated than I am write about subjects about which I have some small knowledge < 1313738709 188130 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd never have known about LC unless I'd stumbled on Haskell :D < 1313738747 690405 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just have to get used to Greek < 1313738751 308552 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can someone say an asterisk plz < 1313738757 627146 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: i mean to be both friendly and confronting < 1313738764 197715 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a hell of a lot easier to understand than SKI < 1313738767 447218 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*? < 1313738768 332331 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: ASTERISK < 1313738771 317589 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :* < 1313738772 33146 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: FUCK YOU < 1313738773 10174 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1313738774 424713 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1313738779 516303 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: you assume that the lambda calculus is deliberately trying to be obscure. < 1313738783 303562 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can see now what is eventually coming < 1313738795 246970 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: you are merely the next generation of machine coders < 1313738804 78900 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehehe < 1313738836 547705 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont really mean that... < 1313738840 612250 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: lambda calculus is older than any machine code. except possibly babbage's... < 1313738850 343744 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a machine code isnt it < 1313738858 93856 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really < 1313738868 386381 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :noone has yet had the tenacity to abstract it < 1313738869 117556 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a method of describing functions of functions < 1313738874 269216 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: We should program on looms. < 1313738889 567312 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right looms < 1313738906 824047 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looms are the height of abstraction < 1313738907 317303 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well one could compile to lc right? < 1313738912 43413 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :they may lack a little something on the turing-completeness front < 1313738944 381693 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: We shall see. When my BF loom is complete, ye shall have your comeuppance~ < 1313738977 96659 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :my comeuppance, and perhaps a new carpet. < 1313738986 366186 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never seen a turing complete computer. < 1313738988 285076 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words, LC could be a compile target right? < 1313738994 340957 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've read about them, but not seen them < 1313738995 378214 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: it kind of is (GHC Core) < 1313738999 381301 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably a very ugly carpet < 1313739015 939683 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : noone has yet had the tenacity to abstract it < 1313739020 205681 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: this is called functional programming languages. < 1313739020 647449 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: I got reasonably far with a brainfuck to lambda calculus translator < 1313739028 28071 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I hate reading Core. It makes me feel insane. < 1313739046 121919 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, I'm terrible at it < 1313739048 143856 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... < 1313739071 55593 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any actual benefit to abstract it to a point where you can't see the lambda happening? < 1313739095 302087 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :my conception here is probably getting out of alignemnt with reality < 1313739139 577311 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> parse (expr <* eof) "" "+--" < 1313739139 827734 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right (App B (App C C)) < 1313739142 572563 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hepl < 1313739145 351812 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: ok i guess.. < 1313739147 954007 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: you can "see the lambda happening" in haskell. < 1313739156 671822 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \x -> \y -> x < 1313739157 276105 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1. t -> t1 -> t < 1313739158 978303 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: see, a lambda. < 1313739169 213258 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\ is the name for λ. < 1313739189 404483 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess the point is that i don't understand lambda calc... and that fact is not something which should be escaped by building a layer on top of it < 1313739194 213102 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: how does write parser :( < 1313739194 981492 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-" < 1313739206 964044 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: wat hepl, it seemed to work ... < 1313739214 649671 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no, that should be App (B C) C < 1313739227 713810 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :expr = do < 1313739228 171 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : o <- op < 1313739228 81409 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : (App o <$> expr) <|> return o < 1313739228 947403 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not right :( < 1313739248 906795 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \f x y z -> f (x y z) < 1313739249 485169 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1 t2 t3. (t2 -> t3) -> (t -> t1 -> t2) -> t -> t1 -> t3 < 1313739251 821728 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :LAMBDAS < 1313739261 828781 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ((.).(.).(.) < 1313739261 901300 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: ah you want it left recursive, which is problematic directly. < 1313739262 434886 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :parse error (possibly incorrect indentation) < 1313739264 956103 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle chainl < 1313739265 39872 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ((.).(.).(.)) < 1313739265 112146 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.Parsec.Combinator chainl :: Stream s m t => ParsecT s u m a -> ParsecT s u m (a -> a -> a) -> a -> ParsecT s u m a < 1313739265 184037 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.ParserCombinators.ReadP chainl :: ReadP a -> ReadP (a -> a -> a) -> a -> ReadP a < 1313739265 184178 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.ParserCombinators.Parsec.Combinator chainl :: Stream s m t => ParsecT s u m a -> ParsecT s u m (a -> a -> a) -> a -> ParsecT s u m a < 1313739265 676562 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) (f1 :: * -> *) a b (f2 :: * -> *). (Functor f, Functor f1, Functor f2) => (a -> b) -> f (f1 (f2 a)) -> f (f1 (f2 b)) < 1313739272 600687 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: try those ^ < 1313739297 302930 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: huh, never seen that < 1313739308 566403 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I don't know what that final a is meant to be though < 1313739335 614872 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \x y z -> x z (y z < 1313739336 230502 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :parse error (possibly incorrect indentation) < 1313739342 510647 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, hmm < 1313739355 640496 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \x y z -> x z (y z) < 1313739356 223246 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall t t1 t2. (t -> t1 -> t2) -> (t -> t1) -> t -> t2 < 1313739372 915071 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it works if I specify undefiend for the last parameter and then it gives undefined on empty input < 1313739375 142277 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that feels wrong though :/ < 1313739379 109923 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there must be a way to make it fail from within < 1313739384 875223 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle chainl1 < 1313739384 976509 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.Parsec.Combinator chainl1 :: Stream s m t => ParsecT s u m a -> ParsecT s u m (a -> a -> a) -> ParsecT s u m a < 1313739385 48370 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.ParserCombinators.ReadP chainl1 :: ReadP a -> ReadP (a -> a -> a) -> ReadP a < 1313739385 48570 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Text.ParserCombinators.Parsec.Combinator chainl1 :: Stream s m t => ParsecT s u m a -> ParsecT s u m (a -> a -> a) -> ParsecT s u m a < 1313739386 570464 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1313739386 826942 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1313739413 754690 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: now the question is, how do you do parens :/ < 1313739417 198388 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1313739419 662758 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313739421 837540 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I see how < 1313739440 579568 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: between is nice < 1313739469 904604 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :although with the newfangled applicatives you can do it directly, i think < 1313739482 36561 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: argh yes but the problem is that if I do "chainl1 op (pure App)", there's no recursion at _all_ < 1313739487 607279 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means I can't just simply insert a paren alternative < 1313739498 649802 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need chainl1 (op <|> withparens) (pure App) I think < 1313739503 24542 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the secret to unobscuring LC seems to be in exploiting the fact it is about symbolic manipulation.. < 1313739511 566400 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: yeah < 1313739517 678116 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1313739518 486300 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works < 1313739529 960878 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the standard LC notation seems to strain itself to become intuitive < 1313739561 629023 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: the math standard is very compact < 1313739574 863501 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and haskell only slightly less < 1313739594 93494 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many symbols need to be recognized in the most primal form of LC? < 1313739607 372621 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry.. should i say glyphs? < 1313739627 51964 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. you need variable representations, so in _principle_ infinite but you can choose something more efficient. < 1313739639 577863 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I take it whitespace is ignored < 1313739648 124792 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhmm < 1313739677 498880 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :alpha conversion means you sometimes must introduce new variable names on the fly < 1313739677 611141 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhmm < 1313739702 241329 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: suppose that we introduced a metasymbol called an identifier for such situations < 1313739714 102455 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :which implementations do under the hood, probably < 1313739724 319494 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: well yeah. < 1313739726 891555 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps metasymbol is not a real world < 1313739729 883079 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :^word < 1313739747 233948 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well.. supposing we took care of such things in a way like that < 1313739761 897142 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :\() and variables are all you need in the most primitive form < 1313739774 233177 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many glyphs or symbols basically is it made up of < 1313739781 696297 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so just the 3? < 1313739786 880971 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 + variables? < 1313739790 622324 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1313739801 24011 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and does every ( need a corresponding ) ? < 1313739830 385642 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :however it's very convenient to be able to list several variables in a row after the \, which needs another symbol, customarily . < 1313739830 468569 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: yes < 1313739840 86415 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: well in the orginal syntax yes. < 1313739842 528640 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t splitAt < 1313739843 166271 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. Int -> [a] -> ([a], [a]) < 1313739853 114326 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitAt 9 [0..] < 1313739853 732242 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ([0,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8],[9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25,26,... < 1313739865 805046 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: if you change the syntax rampantly you could go for unlambda syntax, just `sk < 1313739890 343189 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then it's combinator calculus, not lambda, really < 1313739975 440070 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so with 2 bits a symbol could be differentiated as being a \, a, ( a, ) or a variable < 1313740027 630604 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what insane world should shift-backspace be mapped to delete?????? < 1313740028 130230 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :then being a variable it could be followed by n bits to say which variable < 1313740085 530572 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: what's the a < 1313740105 775746 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :an ungrammatical article < 1313740106 809906 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1313740112 384548 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313740114 581600 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have used an 'an' perhaps < 1313740126 404044 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. 00 = \ 01 = ( 10 = ) 11 = variable < 1313740140 250919 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no i think those start with consonants if pronounced < 1313740152 698120 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hummm < 1313740163 437496 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i knew it was trouble when typing it < 1313740180 852207 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: well everything can be encoded as 0 and 1, that's basic information theory :P < 1313740192 734309 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Isn't that fairly standard on keyboards that don't have a discrete delete key? < 1313740207 905830 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: no, fn+backspace is < 1313740218 378333 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :then suppose you had 4 variables... you could follow a "11" with another 2 bits to indicate which variable is being referred to < 1313740235 461051 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: So it is < 1313740256 205863 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: it is default and unchangeable in this application. and it is annoying, since sometimes i yell in my comments and also make typos and also i dont ccaps lock < 1313740266 768937 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so 00 01 11 10 would mean \(a) < 1313740325 812935 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, later < 1313740332 306445 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1313740333 348812 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1313740398 833910 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: You're getting dangerously close to Gödel numbering now < 1313740423 911808 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: hmm, indeed, all invalid characters are ignored, I presume... < 1313740526 848199 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t withFile < 1313740527 452386 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `withFile' < 1313740619 514071 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: http://sprunge.us/SZCU < 1313740621 836255 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This might work :-P < 1313740655 200859 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The IO scheme is: takes a stream, outputs a stream. A stream is of the form (\end zero one. end), (\end zero one. zero restofstream), or (\end zero one. one restofstream). < 1313740684 489647 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So id is cat, as usual. < 1313741848 80175 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wants to play with Shoes >.> < 1313741886 466477 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagining sgeo playing with shoes now < 1313741903 955868 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh a ruby gui thing < 1313741907 915870 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :disappointment < 1313741918 503861 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: shhh it's by why < 1313741921 788272 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything by why is good < 1313741927 208775 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://shoesrb.com/ oh man what they made the webpage boring :( < 1313741942 599479 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to look like the nobody knows shoes book < 1313741950 610929 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a bunch of pencil illustrations < 1313741989 655145 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if anyone ever managed to archive all of hackety < 1313742009 691933 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess http://viewsourcecode.org/why/hackety.org/ has all of it < 1313742128 447833 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that thing's missing a lot of the images < 1313742279 909198 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Rubyists love life. Boy, I tell you. They love humans. They love cars!! They looooooove dishes of real, actual food. You don’t even know. Airplanes in mid-air, refueling? They love that!" --Sgeo < 1313742291 784747 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...? < 1313742313 822858 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://viewsourcecode.org/why/hackety.org/2008/11/21/aCostlyParade.html < 1313742340 516200 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not _why. < 1313742353 149985 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's true. < 1313742357 597650 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Can we all agree on that? < 1313742361 171932 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im agree < 1313742368 912837 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1313742377 804921 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Let me put it this way. Suppose you’ve got Zed Shaw. No, wait, say you’ve got “a person.” (We’ll call this person “Hannah Montana” for the sake of this exercise.) And you look outside and this young teen sensation is yelling, throwing darts at your house and peeing in your mailbox. For reals. You can see it all. Your mailbox is soaked. Defiled. The flag is up." < 1313742377 971068 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :help im laughing and i cant stop < 1313742499 936353 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, where is that from < 1313742511 681369 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Agreed < 1313742536 544422 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://viewsourcecode.org/why/hackety.org/2008/11/21/aCostlyParade.html (enjoyable without a single bit of knowledge of the Ruby community and its drama, in fact better without it) < 1313742545 306737 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It’s like Jesus. Except Jesus never had the forthrightness and temerity to actually kick a guy in the jugular if he had to." < 1313742570 765068 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, oh they are people known in the ruby community? < 1313742583 806941 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Uh... you mean Hannah Montana? < 1313742604 161281 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, yeah. And Zed Shaw. Either they are that or they come from popular culture. < 1313742608 303549 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know neither < 1313742611 866692 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. Yes, let's go with that. < 1313742622 137972 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're from the hit US TV show "Zed Shaw and Hannah Montana". < 1313742631 387368 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313742636 642276 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll google it < 1313742655 582981 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: that hello world thing reminds me of something i said yesterday (whistles non-chalantly) < 1313742656 737745 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hepl < 1313742666 455835 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: hepl < 1313742670 525340 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: repl < 1313742671 475301 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what has happened < 1313742676 275714 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :laughterl < 1313742680 763806 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not stopl < 1313742681 37586 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone set up us the bomb. < 1313742684 153070 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, wait, the latter is a TV show. But Zed Shaw is not. Right. < 1313742685 477118 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im dead < 1313742690 805488 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :What you say? < 1313742714 609884 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: I RECOGNIZE YOUR REFERENCE < 1313742730 292429 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too. it killed me. dead. < 1313742732 618161 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, move all zig < 1313742741 555452 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(killed is a bad thing) ((not a good thing)) < 1313742778 788114 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if that came in the correct place, lucky, I completely forgot the order) < 1313742794 590530 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know the whole poem < 1313742796 354596 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :#ethoteric < 1313742799 678328 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :"poem" < 1313742814 665647 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, see what i did there :P < 1313742818 428239 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy, eth0teric? < 1313742834 476747 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: No, #ethoteric with a :ithp < 1313742836 571080 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*L < 1313742840 672402 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy, so no ifconfig then < 1313742856 45718 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What with all the parenthetheth < 1313742862 694249 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that all your base deserves to be included in a poetry compendium some day < 1313742870 195244 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if they need rights from the company < 1313742875 657532 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think something broke and I switched to eth1 because I was too lazy to figure out what happened < 1313742898 669378 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, copyrights do expire. Though hm not sure what happens if a company owns a copyright < 1313742936 819872 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do i make a bot search for something i said yesterday? < 1313742944 925983 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps it needs to be quoted? < 1313742950 314876 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1313742955 473913 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1313742979 255195 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i said something about hello world's < 1313742997 244866 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"At last, open source works as it should. Certainly, patching is cool. Branching is cool. But nothing beats intruding in my repo and just finishing the whole thing." everything on this blog is gold < 1313742997 593394 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :try the logs, and grep them < 1313743016 765462 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :whence might I find the logs? < 1313743029 624137 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the topic < 1313743032 588705 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good stuff, that topic < 1313743034 330267 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313743037 64518 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahha < 1313743047 182810 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also do !logs or whatever it is < 1313743053 736825 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and rsync them good < 1313743056 188018 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of them < 1313743062 720366 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you know the date, it may be easier not to bother < 1313743089 147224 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol @ stalker mode < 1313743264 105877 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://viewsourcecode.org/why/hackety.org/2008/05/16/blimlimb.html <-- me < 1313743291 123641 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(https://github.com/bterlson/blimlimb/tree/master/logs for those links) < 1313743373 655766 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :am i still here? i think my connection on this network is just about over < 1313743378 470232 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: no < 1313743386 130340 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, you are not here < 1313743425 441008 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am on one network burning up bandwidth because it is due to soon be disconnected and for me to jump onto another when my brother returns < 1313743468 996688 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can irc ever burn up bandwidth. It is low bandwidth. I mean I used it on plain GSM ffs! < 1313743475 349954 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :torrents < 1313743485 177727 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a network? < 1313743490 552697 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm no.. < 1313743493 603964 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :isp i should say < 1313743550 169313 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric : ok heres a topic has hello world worn out it's welcome? yeah the world is starting to get pissed < 1313743569 318737 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :typical of oerjan. < 1313743573 534261 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :People who read Homestuck: update < 1313743594 966188 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :When was the last time homestuck actually took a command? < 1313743599 536135 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric : 02:44:49: ok heres a topic 02:45:05: has hello world worn out it's welcome? Meanwhile, from the worst member of the channel to the best... < 1313743604 179207 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Is that what all your other cryptic things for the last weeks have been? < 1313743612 189987 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was on 17th august < 1313743616 800841 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NihilistDandy: It's Sgeo who does the cryptic things. < 1313743619 632489 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly. < 1313743623 20191 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Problem Sleuth < 1313743623 186066 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Early 2009 < 1313743627 537180 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I see a "SNOP". This will be good. I take my leave. < 1313743630 678117 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whatever. You're all the same. Fucking whities. < 1313743638 745785 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313743647 292804 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :now today being the 19th of august, i clicked on elliott's hackety.org link.. and i see "What makes a good Hello World program? Because Hello World itself is a terrible Hello World." < 1313743661 516547 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, ty < 1313743672 50223 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh independant co-discovery < 1313743681 764092 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how you rue me < 1313743703 890323 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :^how I rue you < 1313743729 913038 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Sgeo: I HAVE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS EVER SINCE THE SCRATCHING BEGAN < 1313743737 54614 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proof that I am right always, naturally. < 1313743806 232559 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: well that is exactly what i was thinking re: hello world. it should be an application which takes advantage of multimedia capabilities of a prorgamming lang and it's standard library < 1313743818 761721 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Most languages don't have much of that < 1313743834 520440 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1313743837 399724 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the purpose of a hello world program is usually to get the user accustomed with how to actually run a program < 1313743841 781830 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And save it, etc. < 1313743848 344289 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The more non-trivial it is, the more that focus is lost < 1313743853 490123 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1313743878 782273 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :that Max/MSP looked vaguely fun. < 1313743917 906123 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hope you've got the cash to fork over for it < 1313743930 189598 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :didn't look that fun < 1313743937 31419 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehehe < 1313743945 855505 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: You probably aren't in the target market :-P < 1313743956 140441 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am a competitor < 1313743965 626548 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just don't have any products developed < 1313743973 476802 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pro. < 1313744009 923321 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i am using words which would make stallman upset < 1313744058 242631 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok my net is back to speed < 1313744065 708212 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hurrah! < 1313744077 79064 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :howzaaaat < 1313744078 214201 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: What words would make Stallman upset < 1313744088 143784 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :"products" < 1313744107 816340 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :"developed" is probably borderline < 1313744120 548715 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think he would prefer if i said < 1313744135 341108 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just haven't authored any software of that kind yet. < 1313744152 898349 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Who cares what Stallman thinks < 1313744170 833510 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. ha ha. ha ha. certainly not me. < 1313744196 666817 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20 also known as richard stallman < 1313744217 390048 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :also known as richard matthew stallman? < 1313744234 304832 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also known as Ricky < 1313744257 849023 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :also known as emakasu no kami < 1313744319 678850 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of very few real life celebrities to feature in XKCD < 1313744341 722813 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :also known as < 1313744348 335938 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :GNU/XKCD < 1313744379 205104 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313744388 401571 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry i am killing you < 1313744413 405318 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i read that bot troupe thing and it was great < 1313744446 675210 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: did you read the logs they're beautiful trainwrecks < 1313744470 845310 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i read most of one of them < 1313744483 338930 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget why I stopped < 1313744488 945378 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :prin and whitely is the better one < 1313744496 661918 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he said as as a connosiaoruower < 1313744496 826975 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it was that one which I read < 1313744759 430293 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"People, Ruby isn’t a game. It isn’t a hobby. It’s certainly not a very good food source and it’s not an article of clothing. You can’t just put Ruby in the wash with a load of whites. Nice try, but no. No. Jeez, grow a brain. Ruby isn’t a tambourine you can bang loudly in my ear. I’m trying to use my iPhone here, guy. < 1313744759 682974 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Ruby is not some bachelor’s party with a foxy lady in a sherlock holmes hat. Hardly: Ruby is all dads. Put a petticoat on, woman. Pop those balloons. We’re all getting paid here and we’re all having kids here. Get with the program." < 1313744771 877709 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe why disappeared to become a beat poet < 1313744795 536850 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a guru < 1313744807 442249 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no i am the can't think sort of tired without being the feel like slep tired i prefer it the other way around :'( < 1313744807 855379 :NihilistDandy!~ND@c-75-69-129-101.hsd1.nh.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A beat guru < 1313744825 874042 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least i am not the horrible sick die tired. i dislike that tired.. < 1313744834 246668 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you get that tired a lot < 1313744841 71787 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313744873 130057 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://viewsourcecode.org/why/hackety.org/2007/11/14/rubyIsMoney.html for posterity < 1313744878 447398 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget what it feels like aprat from frealing bad < 1313744889 945090 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :#1 best dad < 1313745003 30494 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why seems like a good person < 1313745010 872407 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for how long has he been mysteriously disappeared now < 1313745073 371784 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :two years or so < 1313745090 676144 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313745091 468338 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact < 1313745094 399034 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly two years to the day < 1313745097 640216 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1313745101 294670 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1313745105 670254 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok oerjan stop it < 1313745109 152963 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop making me believe in synchronicity < 1313745112 875095 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's _rude_ < 1313745153 773245 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi mollu < 1313745156 931035 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :molly < 1313745158 211205 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e2/Sch%C3%A9ma_synchronicit%C3%A9_in_English.png synchronicity < 1313745184 342779 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do i find this diagram hilarious help < 1313745219 550721 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lmao < 1313745280 421970 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should just < 1313745283 256170 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :draw it everywhere < 1313745291 176216 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :graffiti < 1313745294 726354 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :public restrooms < 1313745322 536552 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just add random lines going at different angles < 1313745330 917772 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Political-industrial complex" < 1313745334 889758 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Socioeconomic factors" < 1313745342 199905 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Supermarket lineage" < 1313745362 439995 :moses_!~moses@c-98-255-129-109.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1313745371 807687 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Supermarket Lineage: band name < 1313745441 22670 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for some reason i thought of stock music stores and their awful stock music collections for tasteful play in markets and elevators and held phone lines < 1313745446 475024 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever they are < 1313745458 781796 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.muzak.com/ like this thing < 1313745488 884477 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :muzak sells smells? < 1313745581 548900 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome < 1313745588 574930 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm going to start the first smell band < 1313745598 937334 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.muzak.com/products/scent < 1313745604 414630 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im going to elevate this to an art form < 1313745612 517308 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ScentWave® < 1313745614 388796 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ScentDirect® < 1313745616 876988 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ScentStream® < 1313745622 640 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :edgy experimental release that basically just smells like human excrement for an hour < 1313745640 680277 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pop scents that smell lightly fragrant but not really of much anything at all < 1313745645 897274 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yessssssss i will corner this market < 1313745692 997157 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmm these music samples are still so tasteful < 1313745703 629561 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote mmm these music samples are still so tasteful < 1313745707 726125 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :601) mmm these music samples are still so tasteful < 1313745716 166787 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im sampling ultra hip holiday < 1313745758 426189 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hes the boogie woogie santa clause < 1313745768 321298 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :switching to oktoberfest < 1313745796 370571 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes i would love to shop to this < 1313745867 294762 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote im sampling ultra hip holiday hes the boogie woogie santa clause switching to oktoberfest yes i would love to shop to this < 1313745869 203240 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :602) im sampling ultra hip holiday hes the boogie woogie santa clause switching to oktoberfest yes i would love to shop to this < 1313745869 412080 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :scotchtoberfest < 1313745874 481579 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"beer-drinken beer-drinken" - good song < 1313745913 130674 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ultra hip holiday description is so good < 1313745923 201740 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey Santa Daddy-O, only the coolest of the cool get to play here. Timelessly hip and ever relevant, this program celebrates the holidays with swing, style and panache! Vocals and instrumentals combine to give a special musical sophistication to the season. Artists like Louis Prima, Frank Sinatra, Ella Fitzgerald and Louis Armstrong ring in the holiday with timeless style. < 1313745926 183882 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :link < 1313745939 816544 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.muzak.com/samples/music_programs/category/holiday their holiday themed selection < 1313745947 167877 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :holiday best genre < 1313745968 491875 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hi help < 1313745971 471437 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: sdl help < 1313745978 792608 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: help theyre sielnt < 1313745993 319970 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :holiday remix is so tasteful too < 1313745993 568894 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh now it osunds < 1313746005 35175 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :help i < 1313746006 151922 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverted my < 1313746006 653488 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :window < 1313746008 254236 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now its < 1313746009 172918 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverted < 1313746010 430259 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverted??? < 1313746012 476468 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313746016 121761 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does that < 1313746016 748377 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mean < 1313746020 110278 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :inverted < 1313746020 678401 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :colours < 1313746024 986256 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did that happen < 1313746031 364316 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im hotke < 1313746031 447323 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1313746035 847583 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hotkey < 1313746042 655369 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what sort of hotkey would < 1313746043 73070 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do < 1313746043 443991 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1313746045 426324 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :who would do that < 1313746074 734028 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What SDL what. < 1313746100 591500 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what is the "proper" way to go from r g b to the packed pixel for a surface (the surface is the screen) < 1313746106 603428 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or can i just pack it in the obvious way if it's the screen??? help < 1313746127 157913 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to know how to do that < 1313746145 850641 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: windows+n < 1313746147 97657 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is invert key, < 1313746173 30899 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can look at surface->format, I'm not sure if there was a function for it already. < 1313746208 878686 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ugh I forget how I knew how to do it < 1313746209 399308 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hSDL miiight not offer a function for that. < 1313746213 888006 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :How the fuck are you even meant to poke pixels with SDL. < 1313746220 177159 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/SDL/hSDL/. < 1313746228 597093 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I am Missing Something. < 1313746232 941015 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :SDL_MapRGB(SDL_PixelFormat *format, Uint8 r, Uint8 g, Uint8 b). < 1313746236 35701 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That one. < 1313746251 819627 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1313746255 833062 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to get the PixelFormat, though. < 1313746334 929280 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :surfaceGetPixelFormat :: Surface -> PixelFormatSource < 1313746349 49874 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Disregard the "Source" bit, that got miscopied too. < 1313746365 994591 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hm. Yes. That might work." < 1313746369 946848 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :surfaceGetPixels :: Surface -> IO Pixels < 1313746377 728176 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also surfaceGetPixels :: Surface -> IO Pixels. < 1313746377 904280 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what "Pixels" are, though. < 1313746377 976723 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pixel is a Word32. < 1313746381 125093 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's that too, although it returns a pointer to an opaque type, so it'll be "fun" to use. < 1313746390 699919 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :data PixelsData < 1313746390 815847 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Pixels = Ptr PixelsData < 1313746398 583934 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact Pixels isn't even exported, so lol. < 1313746409 765498 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :since when do esolangers have the right to render individual pixels? < 1313746413 886637 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also like: that mapRGB returns in IO. < 1313746429 811089 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: would it be safe to unsafeperformio? < 1313746445 912431 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was there a reason to make it io < 1313746459 185084 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to return in IO because it has to do a withForeignPtr to access the thing. < 1313746468 911084 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :PixelFormat being a ForeignPtr Something. < 1313746478 838573 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the PixelFormat _could_ be mutated from underneath you. < 1313746483 37775 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That sounds pretty rude though. < 1313746496 123085 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sdl.beuc.net/sdl.wiki/SDL_PixelFormat < 1313746503 706568 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought they were meant to have read/readwrite information. < 1313746658 235272 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313746767 264378 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: halp < 1313746769 691743 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot < 1313746780 91416 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, why are you doing SDL? < 1313746790 126535 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: As opposed to? < 1313746802 440324 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, I don't know. I'm asking for the context here. < 1313746821 228691 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fiddling about with some Haskell thing. It's as vague as it sounds. < 1313746826 647806 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1313746862 618643 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, anyway if you want alternatives: allegro. opengl. direct frambuffer access. < 1313746866 252009 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks now im curious < 1313746874 919966 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :data RGB = RGB Word8 Word8 Word8 < 1313746875 88490 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Coord = Rational < 1313746875 180081 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Point = (Coord, Coord) < 1313746875 252407 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Picture a = Point -> a < 1313746876 152105 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: hth < 1313746886 215973 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Allegro is lolretro and there aren't any Haskell bindings that I know of. < 1313746897 227451 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: OpenGL still needs a windowing library, i.e. SDL, and for what I'm doing that makes it overkill. < 1313746903 221375 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Direct framebuffer yes definitely. < 1313746904 644744 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://wiki.allegro.cc/index.php?title=Allegro_languages#Haskell < 1313746911 950529 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: SUSPICIOUSLY FAST < 1313746924 411220 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you mahogny < 1313746926 348516 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monghy < 1313746929 15691 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1313746930 697337 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, seem to remember there was a windowing library for opengl. Was it glut or was that something else < 1313746930 953057 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not < 1313746934 590061 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :r u sure < 1313746940 484160 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Yes, and GLUT sucks massively. < 1313746946 233146 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes im sure elliott wants to use opengl and glut < 1313746952 462464 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a thing elliott wants to do < 1313746954 300387 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, ah okay. I never used it < 1313746956 987244 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think anything in PixelFormat is supposed to be writable, and I also don't think it is supposed to ever change in the lifetime of a "normal" surface; not sure even for the screen, since after SetVideoMode probably the old pointer is something you shouldn't use. < 1313746960 379939 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever happened to glfwpipe anyway < 1313746995 900363 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, what is/was that? < 1313747009 948840 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I'm ostensibly going to patch GPipe to be windowing system independent instead < 1313747015 658430 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what if the user goes to the screen settings in the OS and changes the bit depth? < 1313747023 715087 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you want i should mail mahogny? < 1313747028 959714 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: no < 1313747030 183312 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: sounds good; whatever happened to that, then < 1313747036 359388 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: its been days dude < 1313747037 711258 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: but uh < 1313747039 345611 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1313747040 481252 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive been doing other things < 1313747043 386646 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought it had been weeks < 1313747048 972601 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im out of so much loop < 1313747051 966776 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313747054 992657 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it might have been like < 1313747056 784123 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :two weeks at most?? < 1313747062 992894 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Not sure SDL handles that gracefully, really. But I guess it *could* change the screen's pixelformat. I suppose the only real guarantee is that it won't change in-between a LockSurface/UnlockSurface pair. < 1313747079 240047 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: gpipe but glfw or windowing system independednt instead of depending on glut < 1313747084 33912 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Not all surfaces require locking. If SDL_MUSTLOCK(surface) evaluates to 0, then you can read and write to the surface at any time, and the pixel format of the surface will not change." < 1313747084 281955 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, heh < 1313747091 900603 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy, ah < 1313747093 151537 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I guess for hardware surfaces it might change. < 1313747098 449901 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :im amazed you guys all know how to do graphics < 1313747112 450146 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FSVO know, graphics < 1313747117 301910 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also how, to, do < 1313747119 788057 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats a grahpics elhp < 1313747123 887881 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also guy. < 1313747128 421211 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also s < 1313747165 922604 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oh I know how to do graphics too < 1313747207 846778 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.<; < 1313747212 495462 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1313747234 689574 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :did we frighten you < 1313747243 778047 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to learn how to a graphic read http://fly.cc.fer.hr/~unreal/theredbook/ < 1313747270 232518 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: does that thing even cover shaders < 1313747282 62454 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, that is the old stateful opengl stuff which is deprecated isn't it < 1313747290 466204 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like it < 1313747291 847067 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not that I got a clue about how you do the new modern stuff) < 1313747296 294524 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shaders < 1313747297 459292 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more shaders < 1313747299 106924 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and more shaders < 1313747305 299092 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how 2 use shaders < 1313747309 730326 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: write shader < 1313747310 747680 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :run shader < 1313747313 105480 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shader < 1313747313 711251 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313747340 704027 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, so how do you load the vertices and textures into the graphics card? < 1313747345 492585 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i learned c++, winapi, first few chapters of opengl redbook in a certain autodidactic period... which however got cut short by i forget what < 1313747355 84347 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope it isn't a loading shader < 1313747360 595292 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh - shader, shader, shader / I made it out of clay / and when it's compiled and link'd / with shader I shall play!" < 1313747369 391991 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: dunno, pointers???? < 1313747376 313794 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, XD < 1313747383 32393 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Vertex buffer objects, I believe. < 1313747385 913909 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313747387 69779 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1313747388 50182 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds familiar < 1313747390 5874 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, for textures? < 1313747398 335052 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Vertex Buffer Object (VBO) is an OpenGL extension that provides methods for uploading data (vertex, normal vector, color, etc.) to the video device for non-immediate-mode rendering. VBOs offer substantial performance gains over immediate mode rendering primarily because the data resides in the video device memory rather than the system memory and so it can be rendered directly by the video device. < 1313747407 493101 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you SHADE THEM < 1313747408 4700 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :youse.. write stupid codes < 1313747409 867385 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1313747430 699209 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :from what I heard, directx has a less annoying API. Hm. < 1313747435 721774 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: do you know any languages other than c++? I dislike c++. < 1313747445 527697 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: I've heard bad things about winapi as well, but never used it myself < 1313747448 672217 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i once killed a person because they used c++. < 1313747449 782133 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :: ) < 1313747451 499673 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was singing with fizzie < 1313747453 636423 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION glares at itidus20 < 1313747456 73777 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :: ) < 1313747459 105740 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :: ) < 1313747462 967374 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know c++, winapi or opengl < 1313747480 925667 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so does the GPU do translation? As in, you upload a model and then give an offset to define where in the world it should be and so on? < 1313747484 721738 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you said that before fizzie sunge.s.. < 1313747486 737001 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know nothing! < 1313747497 439328 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you said you learned it < 1313747505 177099 :cheater!~ubuntu@ip-80-226-24-5.vodafone-net.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :phew, good luck i don't use c++, otherwise elliott_ might want to kill me < 1313747506 560768 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: You do that within the geometry shaders. < 1313747509 23892 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had a shot at it < 1313747516 501010 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah... < 1313747521 211471 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i didnt complete the learning < 1313747538 968843 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Or, well, maybe in a vertex shader. Anyhow. < 1313747541 979090 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had several projects i tried to make at that time.. but then i burned out < 1313747561 717942 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and well fundamentally i wasn't really ready as a coder for such things < 1313747573 386619 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so you upload a new shader each time you want to move an object!? < 1313747589 178745 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: They can have parameters, you know. < 1313747593 199360 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh okay < 1313747615 330389 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, is it one shader per program or do you use different shaders for different objects or such < 1313747624 612709 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :can I use shaders to mine bitcoins? < 1313747625 28281 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(per type of shader) < 1313747625 610326 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :You use whatever you want, I suppose. < 1313747638 426886 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so having multiple vertex shaders is possible? < 1313747646 818462 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as an example) < 1313747655 965168 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: The GPU miners use shaders, yes. Or, well, OpenCL, which is basically the same thing. < 1313747662 448198 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hooray! < 1313747666 612274 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: ...but there are better uses of your GPU. < 1313747671 909180 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah right. < 1313747672 964774 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what? < 1313747674 625864 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :drawing things? < 1313747676 971930 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm making money here < 1313747677 470933 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Playing Elliottcraft. < 1313747679 584320 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, stitching panoramas < 1313747683 504441 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CHECKMATE BITCHES < 1313747695 638024 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: It's still stateful in that there's the currently active "program" (a collection of shaders). < 1313747701 952426 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliottcraft should use left over gpu time to make bitcoins for you < 1313747716 625668 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :mahogny is Johan Henriksson < 1313747734 359851 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds Swedish. < 1313747752 601610 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, ah < 1313747753 152151 :cheater!~ubuntu@ip-80-226-24-5.vodafone-net.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact he's a namibian princess, it's just a decoy. < 1313747765 978746 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I have a feeling the "global" modelview and projection matrices still exist too, and the shader can utilize their product, but I'm not entirely certain about that. Went through our OpenGL course before it had been updated to all this programmable-pipeline fluff. < 1313747768 359444 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well there is the state of loaded vertex buffer objects too < 1313747792 111963 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mahogny.areta.org/ < 1313747809 726510 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well I have an opengl course this autumn. I hope it is updated < 1313747816 713684 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I kind of wish my opengl class wasn't the stateful kind now < 1313747825 741366 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :b/c it looks like everything I'll use from now on will be shaders shaders shaders < 1313747827 792465 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and vertex buffers < 1313747848 56030 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: use gpipe and have fun < 1313747854 403825 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, and texture buffer objects I think < 1313747861 273848 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :them too < 1313747869 151298 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: compiles functional haskell into efficient shader code ON TEH FLY.... < 1313747871 187025 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And FBOs, for fancy render-to-texture stuff. < 1313747882 624622 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: handy! < 1313747898 579746 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: I SNESE SARCAS < 1313747899 508365 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :m < 1313747911 542400 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it does sound handy < 1313747920 911934 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I guess that would be useful in order to create portal or screens in-game? < 1313747931 386110 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :gpus are suited for functional programming anyway? because they're highly parallelized < 1313747994 485239 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why did no-one tell me how fun children's train toys were? < 1313748024 113060 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1313748031 34425 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: it is the Great Secret < 1313748049 70268 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh that train has a toilet which empties onto the tracks < 1313748051 94828 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1313748081 209499 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote toilet < 1313748082 962586 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :147) alise: mainly it's the fact it blows so hard i cannot avoid hitting the walls of the thing, which completely goes against my basic public toilet hygiene principles \ 488) * Sgeo mutters about broken toilets #toilet is useless is #toilet even a thing I'm looking for help with toilets \ 489) < 1313748095 374697 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastequotes toilet < 1313748097 755219 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.4134 < 1313748098 620103 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :valuable information < 1313748104 376961 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1313748105 929561 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and mmemories < 1313748132 499972 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: im ehird and tusho and estoppel and alise btw.................................... just realised that you may not know my alternate nicks...................... < 1313748144 268500 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want more elispeses < 1313748147 805869 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to eat) < 1313748166 285037 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i knew ehird, i knew about tusho but forgot the exact name, forgot or never knew about estoppel and alise < 1313748178 715475 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :estoppel i did not use much < 1313748182 811656 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im hungary too...but cnnot eat until hours < 1313748182 884734 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1313748215 367596 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not recognize estoppel < 1313748235 901666 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone used CryoPID? < 1313748238 689689 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :'quote alise < 1313748246 674559 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1313748250 654215 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote alise < 1313748252 603862 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :128) use "grep --crazy" \ 129) * augur rubs alise's bum [...] what? she said square ped :| \ 131) alise: why internet is like wtf \ 135) like, just like I'd mark "Bob knob hobs deathly poop violation EXCREMENT unto;" as English alise: that's great filler ais523: well it < 1313748264 619137 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1313748277 226034 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Those, and (not the render-to-texture thing, FBOs in general) general post-processing of the final render, by a fragment shader or something. < 1313748277 940041 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: im geting centepides help < 1313748279 840661 :augur!~augur@c-75-74-128-156.hsd1.fl.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: helloooooooo < 1313748283 53159 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :augur: whatoiht < 1313748295 395432 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: help < 1313748301 64730 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote im hungary too...but cnnot eat until hours < 1313748302 745065 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :603) im hungary too...but cnnot eat until hours < 1313748309 558743 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that funny < 1313748313 39663 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hungary < 1313748313 121768 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont get it < 1313748313 716692 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313748315 989196 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a country, < 1313748316 156317 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1313748318 947150 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was intentional < 1313748321 734463 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you cannot eat until hours... < 1313748323 517003 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :DMM knows who I am... < 1313748336 18359 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: THE FAMOUS DMM < 1313748339 646207 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o what? how? < 1313748356 496837 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: is DMM what passes for a celebrity in your country < 1313748381 876506 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm < 1313748383 776489 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :What passes for a celebrity in my country is as follows: < 1313748385 653109 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, he mananged to connect forum me to IRC me < 1313748398 273445 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1313748407 228109 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if anyone knows me < 1313748410 269741 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: hard feat what with them having exactly the same name < 1313748418 762572 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1313748444 924047 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Players of cricket. Players of aussie rules football. Actors starring in the soap opera home and away. Actors starring in the soap opera neighbours. Politicians. < 1313748455 407316 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :DMM. < 1313748473 531386 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you guys even have more than two soap operas < 1313748473 879747 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also certain musicians of course. < 1313748484 349792 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those two are like < 1313748486 490024 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :your country's primary export < 1313748497 523627 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dont; know what counts as famouse...i am bad at fame < 1313748498 190069 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seachange was good but didn't last very long < 1313748501 88343 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1313748514 459419 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im glad this is a channel where people have opinions on australian soap operas < 1313748515 328684 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am out of all the fame loops < 1313748524 236136 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im just sitting here grinning likean idiot < 1313748528 329738 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the australien soap opera loops < 1313748537 883630 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so much loop / s omcuh < 1313748541 107118 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote i am out of all the fame loops and the australien soap opera loops so much loop / s omcuh < 1313748542 694486 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :604) i am out of all the fame loops and the australien soap opera loops so much loop / s omcuh < 1313748549 474073 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have sort of met toadfish once in a nightclub < 1313748558 232178 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :please do tell < 1313748561 24743 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :while famous loop { } < 1313748570 183928 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :*runs 0 times* < 1313748581 614263 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :my friend who used to boss me around asked me to offer him a beer. he was kinda creeped out by me. < 1313748588 918018 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1313748609 670613 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is toadfise < 1313748613 327060 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i uh < 1313748615 763360 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know who that is < 1313748619 950213 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :a fictional character in neighbours < 1313748620 462270 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you said "a toadfish" < 1313748627 115747 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I was like < 1313748630 192161 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313748631 568105 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa what's a toadsish < 1313748635 362516 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :toadfish was kinda creeped out by itidus20 < 1313748635 613313 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :toadfish, sorry < 1313748639 229061 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toadfish < 1313748640 938594 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a thing < 1313748646 754419 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20 met one once in a nightclub < 1313748650 85972 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/29/Neophrynichthys_latus_%28Dark_toadfish%29.gif < 1313748658 659249 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : hey iti offer to buy a beer for that guy < 1313748662 14413 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is actually how i imagine itidus20 < 1313748666 107319 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : hey toadfish i buy beer??? < 1313748669 706861 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/29/Neophrynichthys_latus_%28Dark_toadfish%29.gif < 1313748676 192343 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that toadfish picture describes my mental image of itidus20 perfectly < 1313748678 236149 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once visited the set of Home and Away, I think < 1313748680 73625 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :"For the television character, see Toadfish Rebecchi." < 1313748682 84143 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: ahahaha < 1313748695 677935 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/55/Toadie_Rebecchi.jpg < 1313748696 93351 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/29/Neophrynichthys_latus_%28Dark_toadfish%29.gif < 1313748698 195494 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the resemblance is uncanny < 1313748699 453414 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PART #esoteric :"I am outta here" < 1313748707 576267 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313748709 304986 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :taneb can't take the heat < 1313748717 821721 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the heat being comparisons of soap opera actors to fish < 1313748718 71051 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know I could do that < 1313748718 686072 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/91/OysterToadfish.jpeg helo < 1313748726 666294 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/55/Toadie_Rebecchi.jpg same person?? < 1313748728 766580 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe same photo < 1313748745 450512 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya that guy < 1313748768 641021 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :his brother in the tv show is named stonefish :P < 1313748793 315616 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :stonefish does not jive with my mental itidus20 image < 1313748801 764934 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is stonefish.... < 1313748812 216301 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stonefish_stings_in_Australia < 1313748813 880039 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :another character in that tv show < 1313748820 993936 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :toadfish's brother < 1313748825 463626 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :stonefish is not sgeo either < 1313748828 623238 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e2/Sch%C3%A9ma_synchronicit%C3%A9_in_English.png <-- soap operas < 1313748829 560729 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a good sgeo fish < 1313748863 419155 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : No results found for "sgeo fish". < 1313748864 249929 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313748880 463864 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313748891 108597 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313748894 453666 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying +sego +fish < 1313748905 155187 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.charlesgilchrist.com/SGEO/Gal1101.html < 1313748909 453701 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :first result < 1313748961 767894 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where fish < 1313748974 871385 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :C.G. "Yes. As I am sure you remember, Leslie, and as I have told you many times before: Sacred Geometry is the architecture of the universe. You can observe these proportions everywhere; in fish and shells, birds and beasts of all kinds, many forms of insects, it's in plants and trees; God's Golden Mean is to be found everywhere in nature." < 1313748985 931843 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :C.G. "I have no idea, Leslie, and I don't believe anyone knows that for sure. The Golden Mean Rectangle and the related Phi Ratio have been perceived in numerous cultures dating back to the roots of recorded history, especially in the Middle East and the Far East. But the information was a guarded part of esoteric wisdom and was not shared with anyone but the most privileged initiates of very obscure and secret societies." < 1313748990 712360 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the information was a guarded part of esoteric wisdom and was not shared with anyone but the most privileged < 1313748995 169045 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :part of esoteric wisdom and was not < 1313748997 135551 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :part of esoteric wisdom and < 1313748998 702644 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of esoteric wisdom and < 1313749000 210536 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of esoteric < 1313749002 224501 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric < 1313749005 731766 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric wisdom < 1313749008 780706 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric /SGEO/ < 1313749018 283986 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e2/Sch%C3%A9ma_synchronicit%C3%A9_in_English.png < 1313749200 553447 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :just coincedence < 1313749217 254881 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/8/84/Sgeoct.wav helpful audio clip from sgeo wikipedia userpage < 1313749222 914284 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :pun intentional < 1313749230 941497 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That second-to-latest reminded me of this guy: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3e/Kauko_Nieminen.jpg < 1313749293 402314 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's written 15 "books" about his "aether whirlpool theory". < 1313749294 49729 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he looks like a bro < 1313749316 892332 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i thought: vortex math < 1313749324 336922 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kauko Armas Nieminen (born 15 February 1929 in Kuopio, Finland) is a Finnish self-taught physicist. His work is pseudoscience.[citation needed] < 1313749324 503835 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although Nieminen is most known for his works in physics, he does not have any academic training or degree in physics, but is entirely self-taught. He has a bachelor's degree in law from the University of Helsinki. < 1313749325 113513 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bro? help < 1313749351 27225 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kauko Nieminen was a deputy member of the city council of Helsinki from 2001 to 2004. < 1313749353 226266 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what happened < 1313749358 42855 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :His work is pseudoscience.[citation needed] < 1313749364 580818 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313749367 492450 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Nieminen's research and theories in physics are unusual.[citation needed]" < 1313749370 449691 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, Wikipedia. < 1313749392 182962 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION laughs aloud < 1313749401 319716 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Maybe he wanted to concentrate on his real work instead of politics? (I don't know.) < 1313749402 24441 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sgeo.deviantart.com/ is this sgeo i have a suspicion it isnt < 1313749419 472798 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i mean how did he... get in < 1313749456 911426 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Well, by being elected, I would suppose. < 1313749461 361771 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: how < 1313749593 88865 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.helsinki.fi/~pvalimak/sitaatit/nieminen.htm what does this mean < 1313749594 289583 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good frog < 1313749608 328571 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wikipedia said it's an interview with crazyman but I can't read < 1313749634 362 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: tranarnslate it < 1313749639 929469 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :chrome askes me too, you should, get that < 1313749642 245664 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Many of us think they know what is to be a bohemian scientist or spend a carefree university life - beer, an old Kuppila and stuff. But the absent-minded scientist, or a bohemian being is like other things. Others are amateurs, and some charismatic individuals you're verissä: they will become professionals who are leaving other in the shade. The latter caste is vice Notari Far Nieminen. < 1313749650 788574 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you going to continue the political uraanne? < 1313749650 962758 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I will continue, if I find the party, which is not only selfish bourgeois juntteja reindeer. Has gone low. " < 1313749664 14343 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not only selfish bourgeois juntteja reindeer < 1313749669 694650 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :has gone low < 1313749680 166664 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: is he complaining about the bourgeois reindeer, say yes < 1313749760 58185 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am vice Notari Far Nieminen, I have published reach much further than Jesus. At their chapter The overall co-benefit and other places it occurs. After all, I witnessed OF CREATION, which is achieved eternal life in the broadest sense ETHERS ETERNAL POWER OF. < 1313749763 127203 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: It seems he got 221 votes (out of 230k) in the 2000 muncipal elections. But do note that that he was just a deputy member; got the second-most votes from the independents, but the independents in total got one seat out of 85, so... < 1313749764 60654 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ROAD READY ON, CAN find it! < 1313749766 546929 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :REMOTE RECORD Nieminen AIKAJA SUBSTANCE NOT BUY bookstores, HELSINKI EDULLISEMMAT Second-hand bookshop. " < 1313749778 411647 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : fizzie: is he complaining about the bourgeois reindeer, say yes < 1313749781 684874 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also < 1313749784 707604 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my SDL.fillRect code < 1313749786 324976 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is sloe :( < 1313749795 381420 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gess i wil ltry pixels < 1313749796 169028 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what happens when (whatever you did here) < 1313749824 782058 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: um help how do i know what memory format the plixes is in....... < 1313749837 943611 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasn't there a function for that < 1313749842 143757 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybes??????? < 1313749845 391845 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I... I don't want to lie; no, he's not. The source word "poroporvarillinen" translates to "really bourgeois", even though "poro" as a stand-alone word means reindeer. < 1313749876 601177 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is surfacegetpixelformat a function which you want < 1313749889 891337 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: The pixels is in the format specified by the PixelFormat, of course. (And each line is separated by surfaceGetPitch bytes. < 1313749970 434517 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: could you translate the entire line which says "I will continue, if I find the party, which is not only selfish bourgeois juntteja reindeer. Has gone low. " ? < 1313749977 563408 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What if I assumed the format..................... what then < 1313749985 580733 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a big ask.. i have no obvious means of thanks < 1313749993 883984 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think http://sdl.beuc.net/sdl.wiki/Pixel_Access is how i learned how to do pixel stuff with sdl,,,,,it was years ago. < 1313750000 846789 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically I suppose what you need to do is to run your RGB values through mapRGB (because the Haskell binding doesn't seem to expose the fields of the PixelFormat struct) and then use the pixelFormatGetBytesPerPixel and surfaceGetPitch values to calculate the offset in surfaceGetPixels, and stick pixelFormatGetBytesPerPixel bytes of the mapRGB-returned Word32 there. < 1313750032 877000 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: were you even born years ago...... < 1313750040 450941 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few of them,,,,,,,, < 1313750043 959736 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: what if i just assumed it was how it is........... < 1313750048 719069 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: and hardcoded....... < 1313750051 573911 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :would i be bad < 1313750054 510431 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew / gross < 1313750057 991132 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :would it break < 1313750072 354910 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, yes very gross < 1313750079 672178 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :aether way it is no skin of my nose < 1313750090 199420 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: YOURE GROSS ASSHOLE < 1313750094 390085 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION creis < 1313750094 985306 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION creis < 1313750095 653029 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION creis < 1313750096 125671 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION creis < 1313750099 195835 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313750102 11421 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1313750110 180206 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :nett < 1313750122 256641 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neurological Emergencies Treatment Trials < 1313750151 413915 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haberdashery Exegesis LARPers Purdue < 1313750156 97637 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Well, you could draw to a createRGBSurface you constructed yourself, with the right format, and then just blit that into the screen, then SDL will take care of the conversion. (Possibly disable double-buffering in that case, since it's already double-buffered in software.) < 1313750184 931295 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh i forgot to ask for doubline ufbfuerring or anything... < 1313750188 312557 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Roughly translated... "I will continue [my political career], if I can find a party that consists of not just ur-bourgeois selfish rednecks. It's gone low." (I don't really know what that last part means. I guess it's just a lamentation of how bad things are.) < 1313750192 827150 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : surface <- SDL.setVideoMode w h 32 [] < 1313750194 731402 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :would that speed this up < 1313750199 968988 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's slow) < 1313750218 922520 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: thanks < 1313750327 857091 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :The selfish bourgeois juntteja reindeer has gone low. < 1313750328 637896 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: I think the slowness could be because each fillRect call will do an internal lockSurface ... unlockSurface pair, and if the surface you're drawing to is a in-video-memory hardware surface, that may involve a round-trip to the display card memory. You could easily try that by sticking a SWSurface in your setVideoMode call. Though I guess it could also easily be something else wrong in the fillRect way. < 1313750382 826123 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, I'm doing it via poking now, and it works (wow, first time!), but... it's still not fast. < 1313750389 16715 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I have a feeling my representation is just non-ideal. < 1313750393 867033 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :((Rational,Rational) -> RGB) < 1313750396 841851 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For pictures.) < 1313750403 495732 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT I WILL OPTOMIZE < 1313750407 915689 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : The selfish bourgeois juntteja reindeer has gone low. <-- I'll assume low is a logical 1 in this case. < 1313750409 800292 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm calling mapRGB all the time, that's gotta be slow. < 1313750434 754344 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is b normally least-significant, or r? < 1313750442 217192 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1313750475 970575 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, why not just cache the mapRGB results? < 1313750488 848456 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1313750493 618509 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: because the rgb differs each time... < 1313750502 649368 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a map lookup will be slower < 1313750510 106897 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm true < 1313750534 731552 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is even doing < 1313750541 148501 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, anyway what are you doing really. Maybe I can suggest a better way < 1313750545 314678 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used SDL quite a bit < 1313750556 25080 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(from C though) < 1313750569 660369 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The RGBA/ARGB/BGRA/ABGR is often anyone's guess, really, thanks to sometimes it being sensibly "RGBARGBA..." in memory, but in some other times they've wanted to put it so that it looks like 0xRRGGBBAA when viewed from a little-endian CPU. < 1313750596 193042 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: did it do anything amusing? < 1313750596 302766 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Rendering pictures. Later animations. < 1313750605 811304 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :data RGB = RGB Word8 Word8 Word8 < 1313750605 980091 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Coord = Rational < 1313750606 62297 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Point = (Coord, Coord) < 1313750606 134301 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Picture a = Point -> a < 1313750615 667254 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Picture RGB is the relevant type. < 1313750624 800247 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just doing a 500x500 checkerboard, it's slow. < 1313750629 915295 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And no, s/Rational/Double/ doesn't help much. < 1313750631 55519 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you need pixel manipualtion to do this.... < 1313750632 77124 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, if you render a picture why not just blit the textures or whatever? < 1313750635 182487 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Takes multiple sconds to render. < 1313750654 359529 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not draw big boxes < 1313750659 531625 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: The pictures are continuous. < 1313750660 71311 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed what monqy said < 1313750668 576786 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the animations will then depend on input factors. < 1313750684 747695 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is this a fine-grained checkerboard < 1313750686 72012 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"don't write your program in the first place" isn't terribly helpful advice. < 1313750690 748948 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, if you are drawing a checkerboard, just use the box drawing primitives < 1313750698 486053 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Just... < 1313750704 34270 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, just what < 1313750704 977920 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shut up, you have no idea what I'm trying to do. < 1313750707 520599 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : "don't write your program in the first place" isn't terribly helpful advice. < 1313750716 681645 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Shut up, you have no idea what I'm trying to do. <-- because you aren't explaining < 1313750718 142638 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The representation isn't up for discussion; how to render it is. < 1313750728 585717 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: i hope you are not using some variation on putpixel < 1313750738 507186 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, I say the representation is wrong. < 1313750745 673237 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Then stop talking. < 1313750746 644124 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dagn!!!! < 1313750754 904694 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, fine. < 1313750774 36063 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliot.. also.. try making it 512x512? < 1313750780 405470 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont know? < 1313750784 633049 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, at least try profile it. < 1313750795 606173 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :im just throwing silly ideas out there < 1313750804 147487 :itidus20!~itidus20@c210-49-78-148.dandn3.vic.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case power of 2 < 1313750807 616926 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want to avoid mapRGB, you *could* perhaps use a hardcoded format of your own, an in-memory byte-buffer done however that sort of thing gets done in Haskell, and then the oh-there's-no-documentation createRGBSurfaceFrom :: Ptr a -> Int -> Int -> Int -> Int -> Word32 -> Word32 -> Word32 -> Word32 -> IO Surface. That should avoid any nonsense in the SDL binding, maybe. < 1313750810 17667 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: There are about five calls in the loop that takes the time. Trial and error is faster than profiling. < 1313750947 422635 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: In-memory byte buffers look pretty much the same in Haskell as C. :p < 1313750995 998776 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think im shoudl probably slep soon < 1313751024 365636 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: what tmie is it........... < 1313751038 335150 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost 0352 < 1313751040 377028 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1313751041 468955 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is that < 1313751048 29291 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was about to type almost 0400 < 1313751050 284833 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then i didn't < 1313751053 525752 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i typed 0352 < 1313751100 851495 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha < 1313751107 630829 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Coincidentally, I was wondering what the difference between tryCreateRGBSurface and tryCreateRGBSurfaceEndian is in the bindings. Source -> "tryCreateRGBSurfaceEndian flags width height bpp = tryCreateRGBSurface flags width height bpp" < 1313751149 745471 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313751172 512897 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Nice. Probably for backwards compatibility. < 1313751188 745973 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not particularly tired but i have other reasons for sleep desire < 1313751197 296074 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: why slep desire < 1313751199 455963 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why an slep desire < 1313751225 886122 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :avoiding bad consequences of not slep, such as yelled at < 1313751244 180124 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in an utopia not slep would be as unto slep but with les slep < 1313751258 603059 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my choice is either yelled at for slep deprivation, or yelled at for slep too late < 1313751282 417228 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you slep deprive hide................................. like a SLEUTH............... < 1313751295 778606 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :alternatively, preemptively yelled at if anyone wakes up and hears me not slepeing < 1313751300 704012 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohhhh, it *continues* three lines later with "{-# LINE 412 "Graphics/UI/SDL/Video.hsc" #-} 0x000000FF 0x0000FF00 0x00FF0000 0xFF000000" which are of course additional arguments to that tryCreateRGBSurface call. Well, that makes sense. Also, pretty formatting. < 1313751313 309841 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm spooked out by noises i may or may not be hearing < 1313751315 245914 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this spooks me < 1313751316 350399 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :im leave < 1313751324 267156 :monqy!~chap@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1313751499 474419 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, it _is_ generated code. < 1313751661 782537 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : let rgb = (fromIntegral r `shiftR` 16) .|. (fromIntegral g `shiftR` 8) .|. fromIntegral b < 1313751666 146536 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does it mean if this produces blue for black. :p < 1313751674 900967 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not pure blue, either. I think. < 1313751682 738064 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might be wrong about that one. < 1313751725 410016 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If r, g, b are all 0 and you get blue out, that's quite impressive. < 1313751786 61380 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Erm for white. < 1313751788 423041 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not for black. White. < 1313751790 955720 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1313751846 195187 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's still quite interesting. But the needed shifts are pretty much always one out of (16, 8, 0), (24, 16, 8), (0, 8, 16) or (8, 16, 24); that's just four alternatives to try. < 1313751849 325182 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It means you're using that as an 8-bit value? < 1313751863 55616 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And later fromIntegral'ing it again to get something bigger < 1313751863 799656 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I guess it could be that too. < 1313751873 190837 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : let RGB r g b = picture (fromIntegral x, fromIntegral y) < 1313751873 439721 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- SDL.Pixel rgb <- SDL.mapRGB fmt r g b < 1313751873 522955 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : let rgb = (fromIntegral r `shiftR` 16) .|. (fromIntegral g `shiftR` 8) .|. fromIntegral b < 1313751873 595362 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : pokeElemOff pixels (x*w + y) rgb < 1313751876 853279 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFAICT what you've got there is Bits a => a < 1313751877 648273 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : let pixels = castPtr pxs :: Ptr Word32 < 1313752029 617813 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :print $ peekElemOff pixels (x*w +y) < 1313752175 953559 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: =<<, not $... but yeah okay. < 1313752187 461517 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, you're right. < 1313752191 327698 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that makes literally no sense. < 1313752197 999049 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote that as traceShow . unsafePerformIO originally but then I realized it was in IO < 1313752207 501012 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, pokeElemOff _takes a wordthirtytwo_ here. < 1313752218 22464 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So rgb being eight-bit just doesn't work. < 1313752231 769480 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :let rgb :: Word32 < 1313752241 588405 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't make a difference < 1313752249 684187 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cargo-cultist :) < 1313752264 181333 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just for testing < 1313752267 680405 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Doesn't work, ha, world still makes sense < 1313752276 229430 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why doesn't it work < 1313752279 123528 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I guess I might have my alignment wrong or something?? < 1313752283 850906 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: As in, works, produces same results < 1313752290 353295 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I thought you meant it doesn't compile :-P < 1313752429 428991 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote bonkers < 1313752431 438660 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :26) so i can only conclude that it is flawed, or the world is utterly bonkers \ 27) IN EINEM ALTERNATIVEN UNIVERSUM (WO DIE NAZIS WON): So kann ich nur schliessen, dass es falsch ist, oder die Welt ist vollig BONKERS. Gegrusset seist du der Fuhrer Hitler! \ 29) PA ET ANNET UNIVERSET DER DE ENESTE PERSONEN OERJAN: < 1313752433 239092 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Current working assumption < 1313752456 598811 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's like... BBAAAAGGRR < 1313752459 754814 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(least significant to most) < 1313752461 145842 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That makes sense < 1313752462 173498 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-) < 1313752470 880203 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Waitwait < 1313752475 728530 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: "shiftR" < 1313752510 333114 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, you probably want shiftL < 1313752522 394024 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never liked those names :-P < 1313752536 12675 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now it works, and it's a whole imperceptible faster than the pure version! < 1313752543 551621 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I suggest "bigger" and "smaller" < 1313752546 442215 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :n `bigger` 9 < 1313752568 635076 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :.<<. .>>. < 1313752577 474777 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since that's what they did for the |^& < 1313752584 739548 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-d < 1313752585 601741 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-D < 1313752616 936065 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some sort of pack :: (Bits a, Bits b) => [a] -> b would have been a nice addition < 1313752624 422060 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using the sizeOf < 1313752759 536082 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Did they do that for ^? I thought Data.Bits did only the middle-finger (.|.) and the (.&.) and then "xor". < 1313752770 608107 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, true that. < 1313752789 509632 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know haskell had the boobies operator < 1313752804 788789 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(.).(.) < 1313752900 717545 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though (..|.) would be the true middle-finger operator. (Left hand, seen from the front.) < 1313752922 612594 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :..|.. < 1313752926 499965 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :,,|,, < 1313752952 753301 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the middle finger should crash haskell < 1313752965 991656 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(..|..) = error "fuck you" < 1313752979 894827 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehehe < 1313753270 788535 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: pack ys = go 0 (reverse ys) where go _ [] = 0; go s (x:xs) = fromIntegral x `shiftL` s .|. go (s + bitSize x) xs < 1313753279 132990 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really annoying that this can't be made ... < 1313753283 723387 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Yes, I'm aware it can be implemented. :p < 1313753287 138518 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pack :: (Integral a, Bits a, Bits b) => [a] -> b < 1313753294 705580 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :... fast. < 1313753306 318445 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It needs the Integral though < 1313753333 747787 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, to be performant < 1313753468 624537 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: You can do it with "bit", I think < 1313753469 239880 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pack ys = go 0 (reverse ys) where go _ [] = 0; go s (x:xs) = f x `shiftL` s .|. go (s + size) xs; f x = foldl1' (.|.) [bit i | i <- [0..size-1], x `testBit` i]; size = bitSize $ head ys < 1313753472 922087 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :To avoid the Integral constr- yeah. < 1313753478 202574 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pack :: (Bits a, Bits b) => [a] -> b < 1313753489 281918 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, that's expensive :-P < 1313753501 175560 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Well, you really want it in the (Bits a) class. < 1313753514 879619 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That could just be the deafult. < 1313753517 136757 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :default. < 1313753530 312213 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would you want this in the class < 1313753546 322834 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: So that it can have the right signature (Bits a, Bits b) => [a] -> b while still being performant < 1313753556 851037 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :By specialising the implementation to various specific a types < 1313753567 453064 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same reason Bits isn't just like two functions < 1313753594 241567 :cheater!~ubuntu@ip-80-226-24-5.vodafone-net.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1313753594 241727 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see how this would be specialized < 1313753611 431608 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: elliott_: pack ys = go 0 (reverse ys) where go _ [] = 0; go s (x:xs) = fromIntegral x `shiftL` s .|. go (s + bitSize x) xs < 1313753617 298978 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a fast implementation for any a with Integral < 1313753639 174180 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd just make that a separate function :-P < 1313753653 105954 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: You have no sense of elegance :-( < 1313753682 706898 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pack is obviously possible for every (Bits a, Bits b), and so that's the signature it should have; the fact that it's much more efficient with (Integral a) is a reason to put it in the class so that each a can implement it ideally. < 1313753693 335458 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :If elegance is big classes look no further than Data.ListTrie.Base.Map < 1313753709 464723 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Under the constraints of the language as it is :-) < 1313753722 137012 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I was in charge of things Bits would look like this: < 1313753727 166552 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd think that pack isn't the appropriate function to put in the class < 1313753727 238604 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :class Bits a where < 1313753731 203032 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : toBits :: a -> [Bool] < 1313753733 325625 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rather, (Bits a, Bits b) => a -> b is < 1313753734 564697 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : fromBits :: [Bool] -> a < 1313753991 527375 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :bits2bits :: (Bits a, Bits b) => a -> b is sufficiently simple that it could be in the class IMO, but pack isn't < 1313754035 321270 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :bits2pieces. < 1313754308 176690 :cheater!~ubuntu@ip-80-226-24-5.vodafone-net.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1313754445 968912 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1313754862 414535 :GreaseMonkey!~gm@unaffiliated/greasemonkey QUIT :Quit: The Other Game < 1313755353 826812 :BeholdMyGlory!~behold@unaffiliated/beholdmyglory JOIN :#esoteric < 1313755700 93931 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1313755899 998219 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313755934 304993 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1313756257 931419 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote The only happy dorf has a compassion stat of 0. Well, 20, but it amounts to the same. < 1313756260 64382 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :605) The only happy dorf has a compassion stat of 0. Well, 20, but it amounts to the same. < 1313756930 365601 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1313756930 365784 :hiato!~nine@clam.leg.uct.ac.za QUIT :Client Quit < 1313757026 895137 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Ooh, ooh, what if I parallalemalised my draw loop??? < 1313757035 261934 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why poke to one memory location in sequence when you can poke to a HUNDRED? < 1313757138 490789 :Taneb!~taneb@host-78-146-170-91.as13285.net PART #esoteric :"I am outta here" < 1313757281 245158 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://i.imgur.com/JuUTG.jpg < 1313757281 317551 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You have 2 new messages. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read them. < 1313757286 276341 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best translation. < 1313757298 407981 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1313757300 535355 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Welcome to, like, four years ago. < 1313757345 110187 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_, I CAN'T BE BLAMED < 1313757495 182186 :guardian!~lotus@124-171-222-96.dyn.iinet.net.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1313757514 173761 :guardian!~lotus@124-171-222-96.dyn.iinet.net.au PART :#esoteric < 1313757519 729681 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rip grauniad < 1313758245 754792 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: X11 forwarding accomplished. < 1313758256 624701 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For no good reason 8-D ) < 1313758263 822137 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Well aren't you a shithead I MEAN CONGRATULATIONS < 1313758293 780692 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Now I need to one-up you :P < 1313758303 992675 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man that's a lot of lines of code. < 1313758546 809831 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh piffle, it's not even 1,000. < 1313758588 991839 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine was like two hundred :P < 1313758697 672605 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine works :P < 1313758703 621630 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine ALMOST works :P < 1313759455 11433 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mine is HARDCORE < 1313759461 23519 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also mine is more generalizable :P < 1313759505 390158 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1313759541 772113 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: And what do you plan to generalise it to? :P < 1313759547 853673 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you change the protocol? < 1313759567 267704 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :tcp6, for example. < 1313759581 644334 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I change the protocol only insofar as it's a push-only protocol now. < 1313759584 361822 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweet, now you support all three IPv6 hosts :P < 1313759595 865401 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I just have the ability to support them :P < 1313759601 996542 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :SWEEEEEEET < 1313759613 42569 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Appletalk! < 1313759618 73948 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :YESSSSSSSSSSS < 1313759632 873453 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1313759648 177998 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :IPX networking is the best form of networking. (Disclaimer: a context-free comment.) < 1313759797 527339 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You should switch to epoll for SCALABILITY. < 1313759867 371475 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not switch to Scala for SCALAbility. :3 < 1313759905 498308 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or C for sCalability. < 1313759911 386540 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, is it in fact C already? < 1313759914 898441 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1313759916 43608 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know what it's all about. < 1313759930 73213 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Arbitrary socket multiplexer over tty. < 1313759941 925104 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The only outside-world communication UML offers is via ttys, so... yeah. < 1313759975 809057 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"every value is an object!" such a deep paradigm. < 1313760085 861921 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone even like OOP any more? I haven't been keeping track. < 1313760094 244954 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not strictly speaking true for "UML", though of course I don't know the scenario. (For example, the TUN/TAP uml_net thing requires some root privileges for setting it up.) < 1313760096 138529 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people I talk to don't. < 1313760107 377054 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot of my professors seem to like it. < 1313760110 70093 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Well, talk to Gregor; ISTR tun/tap was ruled out for various reasons. slirp too. < 1313760112 48459 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically all they teach. < 1313760122 1606 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the needing-root + ugliness outruled it. :p < 1313760137 453206 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that doing it over a tty isn't ugly, but it's also cute. < 1313760143 771362 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my second intro to programming class that spent like, a lecture going over recursion. < 1313760144 793184 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Needing-root sounds like a reasonable reason not to play with taps. < 1313760148 906698 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run curl http://www.google.com/ 2> /dev/null < 1313760151 119744 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ \ q = query(continue_id) \ File "/hackenv/bin/wl", line 44, in query \ response = urllib2.urlopen(url).read() \ File "/opt/python27/lib/python2.7/urllib2.py", line 126, in urlopen \ return _opener.open(url, data, < 1313760481 864515 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I broke it. < 1313760493 396868 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... don't know what happened there. < 1313760495 256152 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor? < 1313760503 768077 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl jasoiaoisdj hello < 1313760506 272434 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): \ File "/hackenv/bin/wl", line 52, in \ q = query(continue_id) \ File "/hackenv/bin/wl", line 46, in query \ print e.reason \ AttributeError: 'HTTPError' object has no attribute 'reason' < 1313760514 134529 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wl jp penis < 1313760517 307063 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): \ File "/hackenv/bin/wl", line 52, in \ q = query(continue_id) \ File "/hackenv/bin/wl", line 44, in query \ response = urllib2.urlopen(url).read() \ File "/opt/python27/lib/python2.7/urllib2.py", line 126, in urlopen \ return _opener.open(url, data, < 1313760535 822769 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run wl jp penis 2>&1 | paste < 1313760538 366447 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.12766 < 1313760544 429015 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1313760551 311165 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird, it seems that Google Translate's "auto" doesn't work anymore ... < 1313760561 294342 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the rest of the service is ... intermittent. < 1313760562 813247 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`translatefromto es en Hola < 1313760566 97252 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): \ File "/hackenv/bin/json", line 4, in \ data = json.loads(sys.stdin.read().decode('utf-8')) \ File "/opt/python27/lib/python2.7/json/__init__.py", line 310, in loads \ return _default_decoder.decode(s) \ File "/opt/python27/lib/python2.7/json/decoder.py", line 346, < 1313760571 451902 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, intermittent X-D < 1313760575 893814 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : `translatefromto es en Hola < 1313760575 978163 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : Hello < 1313760578 187765 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well < 1313760595 19102 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I suspect your proxy is crapping out somehow :P < 1313760601 848450 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because "" is not an HTTP header line, yo. < 1313760609 845613 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :-i isn't on there. < 1313760628 404997 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run curl http://www.google.com/ 2> /dev/null < 1313760630 293119 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​_> < 1313760655 822596 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :See how I used your ajax-site name too. < 1313760690 256821 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Gregor: I suspect your proxy is crapping out somehow :P < 1313760690 397610 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Because "" is not an HTTP header line, yo. < 1313760693 174687 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the wl error < 1313760700 571938 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I didn't see that ... < 1313760703 148058 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to know how many queries they get from "http://www.my-ajax-site.com" literally, because that's in the curl examples of the API doc. < 1313760716 36707 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: They may very well reject that. < 1313760718 98996 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.my-ajax-site.com/ <-- nice < 1313760725 45156 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: But what about the owners of http://www.my-ajax-site.com/? :P < 1313760735 243821 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd think Google would just snap up that domain for example purposes. < 1313760796 867710 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION uses 4chan.org for all example URLs. < 1313760808 906739 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK OK, so obviously something can go wrong here X-D < 1313760851 401613 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm not fixing it now! So foo 2 u! < 1313760857 416332 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good work Gregor < 1313760910 411819 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ghc --version < 1313760912 193800 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: ghc: not found < 1313760920 860039 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Hey, can I build GHC in HackEgo? < 1313760921 717403 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : BAD WORK GREGOR < 1313760929 308867 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: Doubtful, it has a 30sec timeout :P < 1313760942 104453 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I'm sure that's circumventable... cronjob? < 1313760957 725550 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott_: If you can configure in <30sec, you could do the rest in successive makes 8-D < 1313760975 621754 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet < 1313760983 628831 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's only like a billion make invocations to do < 1313760995 351024 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: OK, I'll do the reasonable thing and install a binary build :P < 1313761007 554196 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Is there any way for me to change the PATH, or do you have to do that? < 1313761014 255141 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess there might be a .profile or sth I could edit < 1313761019 755182 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :There isn't :P < 1313761024 178083 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't want to clutter bin so I'm thinking about creating local/) < 1313761030 102877 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Meh, I can just symlink local/bin < 1313761037 46837 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`arch < 1313761037 119320 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That'd be good *shrugs* < 1313761038 894462 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: arch: not found < 1313761041 459333 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`uname < 1313761043 703712 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux < 1313761046 623362 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`uname -a < 1313761048 415005 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux (none) 3.0.1-umlbox #5 Fri Aug 19 13:17:44 UTC 2011 x86_64 GNU/Linux < 1313761054 751438 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, enjoy the 10MB file limit. < 1313761060 598634 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: Does `fetch have... right. < 1313761072 457663 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: What would you say about increasing that by, say, 99 megabytes? < 1313761090 47286 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got 99 megabytes but GHC ain't one. < 1313761100 26581 :Gregor!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it appears to be ~12 < 1313761124 465859 :elliott_!~elliott@95.149.229.26 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run curl http://debian.org/ < 1313761126 346019 :HackEgo!Gregor@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :​\ ERROR: The requested URL could not be retrieved