< 1316304770 236274 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly QUIT :Quit: FireFly < 1316305372 117503 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But one thing should be in TH, is an expression that it require the list of expression and select the first one that typechecks. < 1316305382 28710 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If none of them typecheck it is error) < 1316305501 637208 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1316305874 471841 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let a ☺ b = a / b in 2 ☺ 3 < 1316305875 165457 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 0.6666666666666666 < 1316305967 344652 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Divisiooooooon is the loneliest op'rator you'll eeeeever dooooooooo < 1316306046 410693 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so why does smiley face count as an operator not an identifier? < 1316306092 697008 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the problems with Unicode is that nobody's memorized the difference between lowercase/uppercase letters and lowercase/uppercase punctuation in it < 1316306127 761442 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well since i picked it out from a SO discussion linked on reddit of why that char isn't allowed in javascript identifiers: because it's not a unicode letter. < 1316306200 812907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :☺ is easy enough to type if you have a working compose key < 1316306203 813747 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, JS tokenization actually uses the Unicode categories. < 1316306230 466817 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as does ghc < 1316306239 599619 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there ya go :P < 1316306266 584129 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let 4 = 2 in 4 + 4 < 1316306267 450873 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 8 < 1316306319 222641 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :o < 1316306360 495878 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let 2 = 4 in 4 + 4 < 1316306361 282423 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 8 < 1316306363 195850 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1316306370 798665 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...don't tell me you don't understand that one yet. < 1316306396 303440 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Yet"? I haven't used Haskell in years :P < 1316306497 420400 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I've never bothered to inquire into that particular corner of Haskell < 1316306499 543198 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I understand this one < 1316306507 941097 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let 2 + 2 = 3 in 2 + 2 < 1316306508 638110 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 3 < 1316306518 813456 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh right, that's what I was looking for :) < 1316306519 894876 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the examples above don't seem to be following that pattern < 1316306536 636363 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in particular, I don't get why "let 4 = 2" isn't a parse error) < 1316306537 506288 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you can specific cases for functions, but can't redefine literals I guess. < 1316306549 947855 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, seems like that ought to be caught earlier. < 1316306580 897341 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: 4 is a legal pattern so may be on the left side of = , it just doesn't actually bind any variables. < 1316306598 621534 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1316306603 48633 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So then it should be a /semantic/ error >_< < 1316306612 271541 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how can you tell whether the pattern matched or not? < 1316306636 139896 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't seem to have anything to match < 1316306639 621360 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, patterns in let are lazy so are not checked until a variable in them is used - in this case never, since there aren't any. < 1316306668 630076 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let !4 = 2 in () < 1316306669 763411 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: :3:4-9: Non-exhaustive patterns in pattern binding < 1316306671 443264 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a logical but unintuitive consequence of orthogonal features. < 1316306714 964782 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let a + 2 = 4 in a < 1316306715 660605 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : a < 1316306742 938872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let a + 2 = 4 in a + 2 < 1316306743 633655 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 4 < 1316306750 601650 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1316306761 74262 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the right a isn't in the scope of the first one < 1316306762 118618 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it a here is a value, rather than a variable? < 1316306765 466111 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1316306784 28626 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's actually one of lambdabot's predefined Expr values. < 1316306791 545781 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I thought it'd be something like that < 1316306803 630454 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let ttt + 2 = 4 in ttt < 1316306804 326949 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `ttt' < 1316306810 347390 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let ttt + 2 = 4 in ttt + 2 < 1316306811 85806 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `ttt' < 1316306814 426507 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's way saner < 1316306818 120722 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316306865 558065 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :That defines (+). < 1316306871 290078 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let (x + 2) = 4 in x < 1316306872 519190 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : Parse error in pattern < 1316306883 880445 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :That attempts to use a horrible deprecated feature. < 1316306911 202511 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot already has a ghc version without it? < 1316306917 577193 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@version < 1316306917 748609 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot 4.2.2.1 < 1316306917 921119 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :darcs get http://code.haskell.org/lambdabot < 1316306927 515647 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't say which ghc version < 1316306939 108177 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f (n+1) = n in f 2 < 1316306939 804837 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : : Parse error in pattern < 1316306944 646079 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1316307016 318739 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has always been possible to turn that off. < 1316307043 336381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I sent CTCP SOURCE to lambdabot, but didn't get a reply < 1316307050 248675 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does nobody implement that nowadays? < 1316307056 96613 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, did anyone ever implement that ever?) < 1316307168 791658 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, INTERCAL will have that feature all to itself now! < 1316307200 620816 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(admittedly, it doesn't actually /work/, but it's nontrivial to make it do so without bruteforcing all possible values in the representable range for every variable and constant in the expression) < 1316307239 614441 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you need to work more on your maniackal laughter. < 1316307312 11924 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I've ever seen CTCP SOURCE .... < 1316307356 657653 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's standard! < 1316307380 724301 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but I've got four quarts of curry in my 'fridge. < 1316307382 992038 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's that. < 1316307387 2388 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : haha, INTERCAL will have that feature all to itself now! <-- i thought you were referring to CTCP SOURCE here < 1316307400 286927 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, to putting expressions on the LHS of an assignment < 1316307422 664903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can end up with expressions overloading arbitrary identifiers in INTERCAL anyway, so it was more or less inevitable < 1316307426 399971 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if no one uses CTCP SOURCE, then clearly INTERCAL should. < 1316307450 133433 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(C-INTERCAL won't let you do that with a completely different data type from the one that's meant to be there; CLC-INTERCAL will) < 1316307480 389267 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, maybe I should learn INTERCAL sometime. < 1316307511 186026 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps I should give lessons in-channel, so elliott doesn't have to walk all the way from Hexham to attend them < 1316307639 267186 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't implement CTCP SOURCE because I didn't know the proper response < 1316307690 345735 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the joke is that CTCP SOURCE is actually unimplementable < 1316307773 464510 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you're meant to give details of an FTP server you can get the source of the IRC client from, and where on the server to look < 1316307805 388729 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :An FTP URL would give those details, I think. < 1316307842 815968 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, but there's a different format defined in the standard, IIRC, that nobody uses < 1316307863 359774 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :However I do not run an FTP server and I don't know FTP server to put it on. If you have any FTP server, then I will be glad to upload my IRC client source code to that server and program it to give that information. < 1316307916 485085 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is the nineties, and there is time for FTP server. < 1316307927 958222 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that's the real reason CTCP SOURCE isn't implemented much, the people who remember it exists don't have FTP servers handy < 1316307953 154605 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely IRC doesn't predate URLs ... < 1316307999 260982 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume the frc stuff is still on the nvg ftp server where i put it < 1316308022 416525 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or else somewhat would probably have complained < 1316308026 72652 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*someone < 1316308030 159960 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316308244 150451 :CakeProphet!~adam@h222.0.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316308244 208558 :CakeProphet!~adam@h222.0.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net QUIT :Changing host < 1316308244 208690 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1316308292 223950 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric : > let 4 = 2 in 4 + 4 < 1316308303 243406 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I must be master of Haskells for understanding that one. < 1316308325 749848 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT'S COMPLETELY LOGICAL, I SAID < 1316308335 692206 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah not a semantic error < 1316308340 46428 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a failed pattern match < 1316308442 824765 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric := as equality is a lie! < 1316308480 926921 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no equality in Haskell. it is a fascist language. < 1316308519 415000 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let [] = 4 in undefined < 1316308520 116033 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (GHC.Num.Num [t]) < 1316308520 287165 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from the literal `4' at _> < 1316308896 985133 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my subconscious must be at work. < 1316308908 761218 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking of a system with the following URI schemes: ftp gopher http telnet tape sprunge file h o s x (h = hard drive, o = optical drive, x = USB Plan 9 or network Plan 9, s = active saver directory, tape = encode data in audio I/O) < 1316308918 736860 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sits in an armchair and consternates. < 1316308955 687965 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't forget data < 1316308966 18275 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where the commands are LOAD, SAVE, and DISPLAY with one URL, and COPY with two URLs. (These are in BASIC. However, it will also have corresponding Forth commands) < 1316308978 761503 :oerjan!oerjan@tyrell.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1316309010 351404 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think being inspired by BASIC should be against the rules. < 1316309076 92146 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, and the sprunge URL is write-only URL that is treated like HTTP, but the # if any is the name of the form field to send to ("sprunge" is the default), and there can be a status message. < 1316309126 628076 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example: sprunge://sprunge.us/#sprunge is an upload URL for text programs, and then it has a status message is the "http://" URL which downloads the file. (If you upload to "http://" directly it uses PUT method) < 1316309148 967926 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I have an idea for a chess variant you might be interested in. < 1316309167 286566 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: OK. < 1316309228 724163 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you begin the game with a king, and two portals (knights) < 1316309248 151261 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1316309265 929764 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of your other available pieces are in a pool at the start of the game. When a portal moves it can optionally leave behind a piece from the pool. < 1316309287 558467 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1316309307 597405 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the knight still move and capture as in FIDE chess or is there different rules? < 1316309336 37005 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two cannons (rooks), four arrows (pawns with a sharpie mark to indicate a direction), missiles (pawns), and... some other pieces I haven't decided on yet. < 1316309355 192489 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :different movement rules for everything, except the king who is pretty much the same at this point. < 1316309363 418933 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I may give him some special rules. < 1316309388 349664 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't workd out the movement rules < 1316309390 734650 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. Is there castling? < 1316309403 595150 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316309430 118270 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the basic idea is that when a cannon is adjacent to a missile, then the missile is expended and anything in a straight line from the missile going away from the cannon is captured. < 1316309445 582682 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :missiles can be fired cardinally or diagonally. < 1316309464 641871 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no castling < 1316309468 122076 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1316309468 183620 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing from chess is given. < 1316309490 876172 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, so portals and arrows have directionality. at the end of their move they can be rotated a different direction, also diagonally or cardinally. < 1316309519 831833 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :when an arrow is in the path of a fired missile, it redirects the path of capturing in the direction of its nose (arrows are knights) < 1316309540 970482 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION badmoods < 1316309551 226678 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought arrows were sharpied pawns < 1316309556 453353 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :make up your mind!!! < 1316309559 970700 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: thats a fantastic damn idea < 1316309575 385536 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a missile is fired at a portal, and the sharpie mark on the portal is facing the path of the projectile, then the path of fire continues out of the other portal on the board. < 1316309586 547508 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are they sidewinders? They must be sidewinders. < 1316309593 616173 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, if a portal is captured, its corresponding linked portal explodes and captures itself and all pieces adjacent to it. :) < 1316309631 857407 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pieces can also move through portals, by moving "on top" of the portal, their path of motion continues in the direction the other portal is facing. < 1316309641 766817 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"captures itself" is ridiculous terminology < 1316309651 154384 :augur!~augur@216-164-57-20.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1316309651 361839 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a piece that only moves one square this means that they appear on the other side in front of the portals opening. < 1316309660 471537 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not just use "dies" or whatever, given that you're changing everything else about chess? < 1316309661 976574 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316309682 702576 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so portals act as teleporters as well. these rules are independent of piece color. So you can use enemy portals and arrows just as well as your own. and fired missiles can capture any piece regardless of color. < 1316309718 253143 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it wouldn't be a chess variant any more! < 1316309722 632237 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the goal is to capture the king. < 1316309732 264899 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the number of pieces the same as in chess or can you portal-place at most more or less than chess < 1316309734 217031 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's probably the only thing that stays the same. < 1316309772 426173 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a reason that people don't play much chess on video game consoles < 1316309794 38896 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? this has always puzzled me < 1316309801 727765 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :same number of pieces. you get two portals (knights), two cannons (tooks), one king, one queen (whose role is undecided), two bishops (role also undecided), and four arrows (four specially marked pawns) < 1316309822 628477 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the remaining pawns are replenishable so when they are captured they return to your spawn pool for replacement by a portal. < 1316309844 25176 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :originally the queen was going to be the piece-spawner but I realize the queen would then serve no purpose once all pieces are spawned, other than to place missiles and capture normally. < 1316309851 459109 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: i suppose my argument isn't fair because chess is free < 1316309906 578839 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-16-223.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1316309906 596880 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-16-223.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1316309906 597030 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316310021 244837 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :cannons are slow moving pieces, I'm thinking one square any direction per turn, with no capturing. portals have large movement spans, perhaps 3-4 squares with jumping though I haven't decided if there are any restrictions to how they can move. they can only capture in the direction of their portal, and can only be captured from directions that their portal is not facing otherwise you piece just teleports to the other sid < 1316310046 667858 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/you/the/ < 1316310080 733362 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows move like bishops and can't capture. kings movement and capturing is the same. < 1316310117 553992 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :most pieces can't move very quickly, thus making the missile firing and teleporting more valuable. < 1316310148 552010 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I've got some rules for how infinite loops work with the projectiles. < 1316310172 450720 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can easily set up an infinite loop with four arrows or two portals and any number of arrows. < 1316310201 519303 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALL THE PORTALS ASPLODE. < 1316310236 528698 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so an arrow in an infinite loop can capture in any direction by simply turning, which then breaks the loop but gives one free capture. < 1316310246 842081 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :same with portals. < 1316310271 498975 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also have multiple circuits the loop could take, with arrows and portals acting as switches. < 1316310329 250445 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I imagine in practice the setup time would often not be worth the gain. < 1316310416 358509 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is to make capturing somewhat difficult. you have to rely on misguiding your opponent with convoluted portal/arrow setups. < 1316310437 215438 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :knight pieces would make the best arrows, as they clearly point in a single direction, so no sharpie, but you specify 4 arrows, and there are only 2 knmights < 1316310447 69474 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well portals have direction as well < 1316310450 67778 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are only two of those. < 1316310455 333067 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like four arrows because it allows more craziness. < 1316310471 692956 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :four portals would be, perhaps, too much craziness. :P < 1316310492 167173 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :some bishop pieces have notches on them as well, so arrows could be bishops in that case but then there are only two. < 1316310500 573322 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what the bishop does at this point. < 1316310518 842392 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking one piece would be special in that if a friendly projectile passes through it it would change the nature of the projectile < 1316310522 301347 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno how anyone would use arrows < 1316310523 696206 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps allowing the capturing of arrows. < 1316310531 179774 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: strategically. < 1316310532 51823 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be interesting to program bots for this game and see what people do < 1316310532 70019 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1316310542 563294 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: but how? what strategies? < 1316310551 293493 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well cannons are slow, arrows are fast. < 1316310566 487705 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you don't want to move cannons all over the board, you would just redirect projectiles via arrows. < 1316310603 546669 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm also thinking you could guard your cannon and then use arrows to move around < 1316310610 313049 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you can point your arrows at opponent arrows/portals and utilize them / force them to move elsewhere. < 1316310619 961939 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :by move around I mean go into dangerous places < 1316310629 105829 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially the strategy would be much like chess in that you could set up situations where your opponent has to choose between two pieces. < 1316310634 645983 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :can arrows capture? I think they'd be most intesting if they can't < 1316310641 741585 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can't < 1316310643 308354 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1316310646 792466 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1316310649 667917 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :intesting/interesting < 1316310653 480011 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also they are difficult to capture because they redirect projectiles. < 1316310655 942194 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :intesting is _not a word_ < 1316310658 443105 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I know at least < 1316310679 178045 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I was thinking one of the queens abilities would be to change friendly projectiles that pass through her so that they can capture arrows. < 1316310692 25152 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps the king. < 1316310694 285686 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but < 1316310702 503472 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :utilizing the king in that way to capture arrows seems not so smart. < 1316310724 966247 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do arrows have a fixed direction or is repositioning them a valid move or part of a valid move < 1316310732 212474 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also not sure how missiles work. if they can move/capture. < 1316310734 863688 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how does portal repositioning go < 1316310743 875198 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :repoisition is a valid move and can be done after they are moved normally < 1316310751 734620 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can turn them and leave them in the same place < 1316310756 5098 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or move them and then turn them in one turn. < 1316310768 867725 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :same rules for portals. < 1316310773 50456 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of the directional pieces have this rule. < 1316310778 988283 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently there are only two directional pieces. < 1316310787 563960 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you use the (Maybe Dec) parameter of the VarI constructor? < 1316310818 291806 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: You could have a rule for rooks to flip if you need that too, flip right-side-up or upside-down < 1316310818 713241 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe portals will be highly valuable due to their mobility and their ability to make other things mobile < 1316310824 545905 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you don't want to lose them because they asplode. < 1316310837 970093 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes I've seen that in Ultima < 1316310846 647102 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've considered a possible use for that but don't have one so far. < 1316310883 553101 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the game Baroque (a.k.a. Ultima) you do have one rook up and one upsidedown, but they don't ever flip during the game. < 1316310890 753662 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1316310903 838834 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably wouldn't do that as two cannons seems like a good number < 1316310906 477534 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :one would be very limiting. < 1316310917 280305 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1316310918 205939 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the cannons could have two different moves of operation somehow. < 1316310921 698118 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*modes < 1316310925 139962 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, maybe. < 1316310945 239003 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bahahaha terran siege tanks. < 1316310964 208319 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :siege mode allows firing, tank mode allows faster movement. < 1316310966 632424 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no, this is a bad idea) < 1316311009 86911 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :still need to figure out the queen and bishop < 1316311023 711856 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I realized, that even in FIDE chess, you might have flippable rooks; start upsidedown but flip them the right way up as soon as they make a move or if the king moves. This is used in case it is difficult to remember if you are allowed you castle; now you can know for sure castling or not. < 1316311023 730186 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the queen should obviously do something kind of queen-like. < 1316311039 688254 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yes. < 1316311045 470126 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I implemented Chess.zrf in a similar way to this, actually) < 1316311062 188918 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is a public domain prorgam, an alternative to the standard Chess.zrf) < 1316311062 599006 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do people forget whether they're allowed to castle < 1316311080 794537 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some earlier mental drafts the queen could swap places with any other piece but the king, and spawned pieces at the beginning of the game like portals currently do. < 1316311091 148819 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I like that though. < 1316311112 733066 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: Even if the people do not forget, I used a similar method to make the computer keep track of if castling is allowed < 1316311180 725216 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the idea is for the queen to be similar to that in chess. a very powerful piece but something you wouldn't want to sacrifice and thus limited by that in the early game. < 1316311181 768909 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-250-231.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: Well, it's possible due to being a form of game state that's not directly encoded. < 1316311186 564197 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how that would work with these rules. < 1316311359 634906 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also considered, simply for the fun of the though, that bishops could be prisms. So when they are hit by a projectile the projectile branches in the other three cardinal (or diagonal, depending on the original path) directions. < 1316311371 540500 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is however a terrible idea. but fun to consider. < 1316311380 442795 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/though/thought/ < 1316311413 643433 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the queen could do this. < 1316311473 411421 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are still some issues to work out. < 1316311504 551663 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the topic of chessvariants, one move scheme i thought of one time is giving a piece 2 options. a short move which can capture, and a longer move which cannot capture < 1316311508 111156 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have implemented many variants including 123456 Chess and Chess with Wickets. < 1316311522 392694 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: there are variants with exactly this sort of scheme < 1316311545 775916 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking of street fighter 2 when i thought of it < 1316311551 767618 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in particular one problem is that, if your piece spawner dies, you now have a finite supply of missiles. < 1316311566 243971 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and such things.. where you have this speed vs strength trade off < 1316311578 830623 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just in general this tradeoff exists eh < 1316311596 17904 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so perhaps I should use the original rules, where the cannons spawn missiles adjacent to them, and then the subsequent turn they're fired. making projectiles a 2-turn process, but this also has disadvantages. < 1316311610 910869 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the nimble weakling vs the stumbling oaf < 1316311665 1514 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D :D oh man.. i wonder if they ever made chess variants based off of animes < 1316311678 116849 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm./ < 1316311702 336646 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like dragon ball z, naruto, bleach, these kinds of things < 1316311708 952603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess no one is interesting in offering suggestions so I'll shush now. I was hoping for some ideas. < 1316311719 803295 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry.. im off-topicing < 1316311728 702174 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sidles away. < 1316311741 921800 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: DBZ checkers. when you reach the end of the board you're promoted to super saiyan. < 1316311771 363717 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like the idea of a cannon and a cannonball(which you have called a missile) < 1316311789 532880 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but there are issues with strategy and overall game progression < 1316311800 868804 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as what happens when you lose all of your cannons, or both of your portals, etc. < 1316311818 162121 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if missile spawning is tied to a piece that's expendable then you have a situation where cannons are basically useless. < 1316311818 340945 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a bit like a pinball scheme you have dreamed up.. where the cannon is the launcher < 1316311841 34967 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and once cannons are useless then arrows are useless. < 1316311847 705753 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the arrows are those bouncy parts < 1316311899 928284 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so perhaps cannons should spawn their own missiles. < 1316311913 450217 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like gregor's 2L which i was peeking at the other day < 1316311961 190244 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316311985 722238 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :see im really not a chess guy.. ill drop out here and let someone who better understands in < 1316312053 284975 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there could be no missile pieces. < 1316312057 241299 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :cannons can just fire... < 1316312071 669773 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then pawns are some sort of expendable but useful thing. < 1316312103 58462 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, one-time use trampolines. :) < 1316312106 712468 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps. < 1316312136 784980 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this gives them a defensive use while also making them not overpowered. They're not invincible. < 1316312150 610111 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they protect pieces behind them in the line of fire. < 1316312153 920640 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for one shot. < 1316312157 784852 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps. < 1316312180 589818 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah... < 1316312324 897596 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it definitely makes sense for cannons not to rely on a missile piece for firing. < 1316312444 161501 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1316312477 648662 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the two cannons are different. one fires diagonally one fires cardinally. otherwise they'd be ridiculous. < 1316312490 647878 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also help what is a sidewinder. < 1316312574 725214 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have played pinball games with nonstandard launch, such as JiggleBox. < 1316312606 410119 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Yes, that is idea; you could use rook upsidedown to indicate that, too. < 1316312663 237880 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right that was implied. < 1316312685 84775 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that removes the cumbersome missile requirement without making cannons like super-queens < 1316312697 130577 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, slow super-queens :P < 1316312737 421763 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps the piece spawning mechanic should also be ditched. < 1316312740 682316 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do know about Chinese cannons (in Xiangqi and some other chess variants), but I suppose your game is entirely different cannons and has nothing to do with that. < 1316312775 734831 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes the cannons are vital. portals are probably second most vital. < 1316312785 647155 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are probably more useful than I currently realize. < 1316312815 602660 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, nevermind, I now realize they are useful. < 1316312823 487421 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :than I previously realized, or whatever. :P < 1316312866 214904 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so either the queen or the two bsihops have the arrow-destroying property. < 1316312970 420366 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is going to go read some chess variant rules for inspiration. < 1316313014 166730 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know Emperor-Wars? I had a book about it once, but now I lost it. It is also a chess variant. < 1316313065 231345 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here is my chess variants using mostly normal chess pieces. All URLs start with http://www.chessvariants.org/index/msdisplay.php?itemid= < 1316313156 167683 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the queen /could/ be like an arrow with no direction. < 1316313165 85564 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the player can freely choose in which direction it redirects. < 1316313180 389014 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then there is no drawback to this. there isn't the same sacrifice-dynamic here. < 1316313231 390520 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :MS123456chess MS2choicechess MSblandchess MSchecker-captur MSchesswithcheck MSchesswithquant MSchesswithwicke MScommunistchess MSinvisiblekingc MSvariantswithqu < 1316313231 821745 :augur!~augur@216-164-57-20.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316313325 211209 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :These are list of my variants using mostly normal chess set. A chess/checkers/backgammon set is preferred. < 1316313444 791093 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps two arrows is sufficient. < 1316313453 18035 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then bishops could be arrows. < 1316313469 67382 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1316313566 605342 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know about Shogi or Xiangqi? < 1316313573 55364 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xiangqi yes. < 1316313685 433339 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know how to play both. < 1316313804 674581 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps there could be... no pawns. < 1316313819 465834 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I especially like Tsume Shogi. < 1316313839 722925 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise I think they should be trampolines (think befunge #) < 1316314126 689226 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here are some chess variants: http://www.chessvariants.org/fiction.dir/hitchhiker/zork_and_turn.html (I like many of the variants by Claude Chaunier and Joao Pedro Neto) < 1316314126 744980 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It defines chess variants as follows: Chess is a class of games that comply with the following restriction: There must be at least one special piece, called King. Each player must protect his own King and loses if it is captured or checkmated. < 1316314139 11504 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1316314175 493360 :Zetro!~Zetro@zetro.xen.prgmr.com QUIT :Quit: End of Stream < 1316314176 533520 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1316314182 975089 :Zetro!~Zetro@zetro.xen.prgmr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1316314298 383099 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MSleep < 1316314460 240577 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316314505 61407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so suicide chess isn't a chess variant? < 1316314520 845713 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think it is a chess variant, actually. < 1316314532 185761 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it doesn't have any special powers involving the king < 1316314536 849142 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The definition that description gives is not completely accurate, I think. < 1316314545 504851 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Some forms of suicide chess allow castling. < 1316314559 686798 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is suicide chess anything like strip chess < 1316314571 924762 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the capture or checkmate of the king doesn't end a game of suicide chess < 1316314573 540816 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: not really < 1316314598 908233 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I would think the only real technical requirement of a chess variant is that it bear some semblance to chess. Either using the same board, a similar rule, or the same pieces. < 1316314603 260694 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I know; that is why I say I think that definition is inaccurate < 1316314627 829358 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno how strip chess would work. Is there a good ruleset? < 1316314632 890234 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: That definition is also inaccurate, I think, as seen by the various chess variants existing. < 1316314668 558320 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if a chess variant has a completely different board, completely different pieces, and no rules in common with chess < 1316314672 45270 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it still a chess variant? < 1316314672 778721 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :loser retroactively takes off clothes? is that fair? < 1316314674 347820 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: normally on captures, is how chess is adapted to the usual forfeit-related game-patterns < 1316314690 843810 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although that probably works better with alcoholic chess than strip chess < 1316314713 436267 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, you could also employ piece values to determine various things. < 1316314715 11481 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops! GHC told me to report a bug because the 'impossible' happened. < 1316314728 313735 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in drinking chess the piece value would determine how much or what you drink. < 1316314736 266685 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, it does < 1316314754 463330 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"please report a bug: it's not that anything drastic's gone wrong internally, we're just lonely" < 1316314807 268773 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so the only things to figure out now are a) starting piece position b) purpose of the queen c) make the movement rules a bit more precise < 1316314873 435947 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops! The database for GHC bug tracker is locked. < 1316314880 667663 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the queen can swap with any piece? is that too useless or powerful or similar to other pieces? < 1316314880 896486 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Therefore I cannot report a bug. < 1316314926 168438 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: it's not useless it would actually give it a similar sacrifice dynamic. it would be similar to the portal but more useful I think. Also it needs to have some other purpose besides that < 1316314950 998257 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :originally it was to spawn pieces, but I later ditched that. Also I considered some kind of sacrifice dynamic where pieces adjacent to the queen could be sacrificed and replaced by other pieces. < 1316314956 741113 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that could be a little wonky. < 1316314964 507239 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Type of classInstances is classInstances :: Name -> [Type] -> Q [Name] different from the documentation, and the code producing error is $(classInstances ''Num [ConT ''Integer] >>= reify . head >>= runIO . print >> [| 0 |]) < 1316315007 322889 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I think the queen should permit the capturing of arrows by cannons. perhaps it could also change the nature of friendly projectiles so that they clear an entire path instead of capturing only one piece, but this might make it incredibly easy to checkmate. < 1316315027 325448 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't want your king in an enclosed area where it can't move. < 1316315035 456439 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does "reifyType PredTy" mean? < 1316315051 623387 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: my idea would give the queen the job of positioning important pieces, rescuing important pieces, and fleeing by swapping with an unimportant piece < 1316315078 854424 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :rescuing and what way? < 1316315084 642456 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: important pieces mainly being clumsy slowmoving things like the king and the cannons < 1316315094 139394 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rescuing as in swapping out with a piece in danger < 1316315099 288649 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I would specifically not allow swapping with the king. < 1316315102 491100 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think. < 1316315103 401215 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what!!! < 1316315113 209895 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :special cases are not cool!!! < 1316315121 413979 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure they are. the king is already a special case. < 1316315137 624082 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :diaf, cakechess < 1316315189 713289 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then the queen basically becomes a very useful support tool that is very difficult to capture. Not sure I like that. < 1316315224 782479 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's not to like? not a rhetorical question; I honestly haven't thought much about my queen, beyond what I already said < 1316315237 534429 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I managed to report bug now < 1316315251 946401 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the best way to capture the queen would be to put the king in a check in which the only way to escape is to swap with the queen. < 1316315264 217938 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise the queen can just disappear as it pleases. < 1316315416 94241 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :disappear as it pleases at the cost of sacrificing your pieces!! of coruse all pieces would have to be fairly valuable for this to be meaningful < 1316315416 616469 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the portal fills a similar role albeit in a different way. < 1316315431 345800 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all pieces except pawns are extremely valuable. < 1316315459 93877 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :portal sort of fulfiles the moving a piece into attack role except only once when it places the piece < 1316315491 399258 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: so then i guess you place pawns either when you're out of other stuff to place or you want queen escape teleport fodder? < 1316315493 320598 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes sort of makes the cannons slowness less of an issue, in a way similar but different to arrows. < 1316315551 489561 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: oh by the way I ditched the portal spawning stuff. < 1316315555 836659 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316315555 854439 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you begin the game with all pieces on the board. < 1316315564 794109 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes queens more problematic < 1316315569 616803 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but portal however can still teleport pieces. a piece walks into the direction the portal is facing < 1316315573 365623 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and comes out the other side. < 1316315575 560188 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a poral. < 1316315579 6513 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals are portals. < 1316315581 267677 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was going on the assumption that you had to take turns to place pawns for use with queens < 1316315650 88144 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the queen could always just be a simple piece adept at capturing. < 1316315659 411008 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :something that is lacking in this game. < 1316315668 316516 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently arrows are very tricky to capture. < 1316315677 443997 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are very valuable when strategically placed. < 1316315678 491750 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316315708 76915 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i forgot about portals actually working as portals oops < 1316315719 295327 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes portals will be fun. < 1316315721 384952 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i remember you saying something about portals having a direction? what's that about < 1316315753 673769 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the direction is the direction the portal is facing. you can't capture it from that direction because you just pass through. < 1316315768 267407 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :projectiles pass through as well as pieces. < 1316315784 131423 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all other directions are open for capture though. < 1316315811 262649 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :directional capturing? what's that about < 1316315814 488874 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure how or if portals capture. Perhaps that can capture in one direction, making them kind of useful defensively. < 1316315825 711290 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I mean, I hoped it was kind of an intuitive concept but I guess not. < 1316315835 917158 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"People usually think great things about Planets. The fact is planets are just small and rocky or big and foggy gravity modeled spheres, where complex biological cells try to grab to its surface as hard as they can, in order to invent cable television." < 1316315838 787675 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if anything has knightsmoves, will portals not work for them? < 1316315856 588663 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :knights still have a direction in which they're moving when capturing, so it will still work < 1316315863 418153 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I don't plan on having anything that moves like a knight < 1316315869 104061 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :except that portals can hop. < 1316315902 154254 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.....also I have no considered what happens when a portal tries to pass through a portal it is linked to. < 1316315906 531817 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd thinkt his isn't possible. < 1316315927 335150 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or they just explode or something. < 1316315931 886189 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which could be useful. < 1316315952 670599 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a portal is bound to explode at some point. it's in their nature. < 1316315987 854481 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(explode meaning that all adjacent pieces and the piece itself are captured) < 1316316028 822807 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how big's the board? 8x8 would be hilarious given this complexity < 1316316043 756093 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :8x8 I'd imagine. I don't have fancy boards. < 1316316207 724267 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been running situations in my head and if you use a starting board placement that's exactly the same as normal chess it works out similarly. < 1316316227 541304 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, actually I'll probably modify it a little bit. < 1316316278 419108 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but basically it works similarly to chess from what I can except that where you should move pieces is now drastically different. < 1316316291 969257 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should basically have no need to move cannons until the endgame. < 1316316350 466609 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the cannon essentially acts as a piece that turns other friendly pieces in its path of fire into projectiles. < 1316316364 566537 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :put a portal directly in front of a cannon and now your second portal can shoot things. < 1316316383 430122 :evincar!~jon@129.21.146.240 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316316441 634128 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what is being sacrificed is not directly straightforward, for example. say you have your portal set up directly in front of your cannon, and an arrow is placed so that the enemies cannon can capture your portal. < 1316316454 811247 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, you spend your turn to turn your portal to face the arrow so that the portal won't be captured. < 1316316497 346421 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...but now you've either sacrificed some other piece you own on a completely different location on the board, or you've pointed the potential projectile at an enemy piece and thus caused them not to fire. < 1316316508 140308 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wildly different things could happen as the result of a single move. < 1316316572 847095 :evincar!~jon@129.21.146.240 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thoroughly endorse these shenanigans. < 1316316604 100201 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1316316857 304419 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi evincar < 1316316923 77577 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make a chess variant based on this idea: "A Black Hole is a place where all the White squares has been removed from the local representational Chess board." < 1316316948 794474 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-250-231.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... Relativistic chess? < 1316316981 252014 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. < 1316317242 626713 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need a name for my game. < 1316317253 77868 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been calling it cakechess, once. < 1316317259 546452 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: I don't know. < 1316317280 415052 :evincar!~jon@129.21.146.240 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cakechess is fine as a working title. < 1316317303 406214 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking shellshock but I'm almost certain that's already the name of something. < 1316317306 931857 :evincar!~jon@129.21.146.240 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Ohai. < 1316317428 882329 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's some stupid online game called shellshock < 1316317433 846280 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I could call my game shellshocked < 1316317474 828287 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think cannon placement will be somewhat problematic < 1316317479 876472 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the starting layout. < 1316317538 25874 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I think pawns will perhaps mitigate the problem to a degree. < 1316317581 383082 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially since capturing by cannon is indirect there's no defenses for things like bishops and rooks in chess < 1316317595 998260 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you have many units surrounding the piece to capture it < 1316317602 109915 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the cannon can just capture from afar. < 1316317623 815036 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it's the same thing you just have to think about it differently. < 1316317648 290817 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :those above sentences probably make no sense to anyone else but me. < 1316317746 821372 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so assuming the diagonal cannon is on queenside and the cardinal cannon on kingside. < 1316317757 574734 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-202-111.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316317769 296362 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :moving g2 to g3, then f1 to g2 < 1316317786 851029 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er no, wrong side. < 1316317794 741202 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-250-231.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316317801 832484 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :b2 to b3. then c1 to b2. < 1316317805 914679 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :would be a good starting move for white. < 1316317838 349050 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the arrow protects your diagonal cannon while also allowing you to aim it < 1316317843 788820 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are likely other good starting moves. < 1316317876 229638 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then black will need to do very different things in order to react defensively to white. < 1316317925 562905 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also strange things could easily happen very quickly. :P < 1316318028 59736 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :infinite loops between two opposing arrows would be, uh, interesting. < 1316318103 450449 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I'm thinking the queen could act as a directionless arrow. < 1316318119 509811 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can also capture. < 1316318124 521734 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but doesn't move as quickly. < 1316318303 573318 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have read about program to make up the Haskell function from the type, but can it work with Template Haskell? < 1316318333 894094 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :just integrate @djinn < 1316318339 804181 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn a -> Not (Not a) < 1316318340 325609 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f a b = b a < 1316318352 682977 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn Either (Not a) (Not b) -> Not (a, b) < 1316318353 274132 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f a = < 1316318353 451468 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : case a of < 1316318353 469496 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Left b -> \ (c, _) -> b c < 1316318353 469648 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Right d -> \ (_, e) -> d e < 1316318354 320705 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning that a friendly projectile can be redirected to any path across the queen, and will at that point be able to capture arrows, but enemy projectiles will still capture her. (yes, a special case.) < 1316318437 929401 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this is something that is incredibly useful, but vulnerable < 1316318447 329642 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: That is seem a function taking two parameters, the type specifies only one, what is the Not type? < 1316318460 764630 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Not a = a -> Void < 1316318471 378065 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And how do I do djinn? I cannot find the information it seem broken < 1316318498 304594 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :you just give @djinn a type and it will try to write a function (prove) of that type < 1316318515 99312 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I wrote up there was one of the deMorgan laws < 1316318542 792042 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I understand those things. But it still doesn't explain how to integrate @djinn into another program, because I do not have the information of that program. < 1316318542 815751 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :oddly enough, in haskell, only three out of the four deMorgan laws are true < 1316318563 838872 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/package/djinn-th < 1316318574 764540 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :and http://hackage.haskell.org/package/djinn < 1316318622 939134 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK thanks < 1316318639 952481 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: to avoid infinite loops you could possibly give each arrow a finite number of arrowings per turn < 1316318647 857364 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just a thought < 1316318654 964227 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im sure theres other ways to get around it < 1316318681 364442 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: I have no intention of avoiding infinite loops < 1316318686 932693 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol.. < 1316318695 841979 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only annoying about them is that you need to verbally declare that you have created one < 1316318703 473079 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is kind of annoying and not very chess-like. < 1316318721 813053 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could just say "loop" or something like that, similar to check. < 1316318729 730339 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to declare check right? < 1316318739 172726 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i don't know chess ) < 1316318742 230024 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316318748 55472 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it is chesslike really < 1316318751 574641 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to worry < 1316318753 43240 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yes it's a chess variant. < 1316318767 5049 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :using chess pieces, on a chess board, with what is currently the exact same starting layout. < 1316318776 805457 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean declaring a state of the game is chess-like < 1316318785 795956 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, well, right I just don't want it to be like < 1316318791 731529 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :precidented on "check" < 1316318807 93722 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^precedented < 1316318809 421745 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"oh uh, by the I just fired this cannon here and made this loop here that follows this path like so..." < 1316318815 612085 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION gestures and points awkwardly < 1316318837 685621 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is normally not very chess-like as most of the time it's completely silent. < 1316318851 754408 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I think saying "loop" would be sufficient except in cases where multiple possible loops can happen. < 1316318853 975947 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: Which deMorgan laws not true in Haskell? < 1316318872 207596 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn Not (a, b) -> Either (Not a) (Not b) < 1316318872 719282 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- f cannot be realized. < 1316318887 734872 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not provable in constructive logic < 1316318930 29320 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to do different kind of logic? < 1316318950 884595 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a player may simply declare "loop" in the event that they've fired a projectile that forms an infinite loop. If the opponent wishes the player to clarify, then they must do so." < 1316318959 102803 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, most programming (and proof assistants) model an intuitionist (constructive) logic < 1316318960 213573 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds good to me. < 1316318980 703138 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :classical logic is very non-computational < 1316319008 73247 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: I know, Curry-Howard uses intuitionistic logic, and sometimes it is good, but sometimes you might want different logic and I think I read someone can somehow make it using different logic too < 1316319029 206931 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: actually I forsee loops being a useful defensive and offensive strategy. < 1316319031 745616 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :some type systems encode substructural logics < 1316319043 846631 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are substructural logics? < 1316319046 225713 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you typically don't get classical logic < 1316319046 406641 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is a loop the end of a game? < 1316319054 457239 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :either to respond to an enemies arrow placement with your own arrow pointing in the opposite direction, or to form defensive walls. < 1316319073 918385 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(part of the loop rules include that firing a projectile into an existing loop cancels both the loop and the fired projectile) < 1316319081 829465 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :substructural logics basically place restrictions on what you can do with your context, which in programming language terms, means that you put restrictions on how many times you can (or must) use your variables < 1316319088 944130 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh so the loop persists between turns? :D < 1316319090 590271 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :some say that a variable must be used exactly once < 1316319092 54715 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, Wikipedia does have article about substructural logic, I will read that too < 1316319095 187688 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :others say at least once < 1316319095 280604 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :loops work similarly to how you would imagine them to work, if you imagine the projectile as a deadly laser death wall < 1316319098 107802 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :others say at most once < 1316319098 409295 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: yes. < 1316319100 520375 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1316319101 75510 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: until the loop is broken. < 1316319101 968011 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude you're good at this. < 1316319111 877460 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :even more strict ones say that you must use variables in the same order you declare them < 1316319126 318728 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: so all you have to do is turn an arrow in the loop and you immediately capture something. loops are a very dangerous situation. < 1316319143 962231 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :ATS and clean have type systems that support certain kinds of substructural logics < 1316319147 503343 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or turn a portal. < 1316319166 106650 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this thing you're describing is so far the coolest chess variant i have heard of < 1316319190 1247 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :of how many chess variants have you heard, anyhow < 1316319205 693665 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1,220,005 < 1316319206 218580 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I can forsee some situations in which the best way to counteract an infinite loop being used to capture something is to form another chain in the loop < 1316319215 457733 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this laserchess? < 1316319218 396928 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316319220 980331 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :I loved laserchess < 1316319225 604858 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :had to write an AI for it a while back < 1316319226 4929 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, is that a thing? nevermind < 1316319232 583815 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316319234 49930 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no this is something I've come up with that might be similar. < 1316319244 444118 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should check it out. It's lots of fun < 1316319248 613136 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have a laser and mirrors < 1316319249 737856 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :and rotation < 1316319254 481888 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the complexity is way higher than regular chess < 1316319272 722701 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it basically looks like this game but with way more arrows. < 1316319281 476226 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and different kinds of arrows < 1316319287 761419 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've added portals as well. < 1316319292 76255 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia does mention "Correspondence between classical logic and control operators", it has to do with continuations, apparently. < 1316319315 502736 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah and mirrors don't work exactly like arrows. < 1316319328 739515 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :an arrow forced the direction of a projectile into one specific direction. the mirrors can reflect two different ways. < 1316319349 583206 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er multiple different ways. < 1316319380 207940 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: ok i will say there is no best chess variant. but basically, some games are more memorable than others independant of factors like marketing < 1316319393 344169 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^and word of mouth < 1316319414 886956 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think portals will be great fun. < 1316319428 824451 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never even really followed the portal part of it < 1316319442 373396 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, I've explained it so many times now. :P < 1316319455 347103 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can read log if i have to < 1316319459 735421 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its all there < 1316319462 946274 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah < 1316319483 731204 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals are knights. the direction of their nose is the direction of the portal. You can literally think of it as a portal. If you move a piece into the opening they come out the other opening, moving as they normally would through the portal < 1316319495 507405 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a game only has to be slightly more memorable than the other games in order to achieve mainstream popularity < 1316319496 587609 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :projectiles can travel through the portal opening as well. < 1316319498 328302 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for great fun. < 1316319500 474882 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and profit. < 1316319539 601244 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you capture a portal its corresponding portal EXPLODES and everything around it and itself is captured. < 1316319557 696886 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals can't point to nothing, and obviously this requires that they explode. < 1316319581 576978 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also trying to pass a portal through its sister portal will cause them to EXPLODE in the same fashion < 1316319584 620916 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :paradox is not allowed. < 1316319598 633974 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if i wrote a simulation where people play games and talk about them, the games which were talked about even slightly more would have iterated positive feedback < 1316319602 858291 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and obviously causes explosions. < 1316319635 823094 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, if any other rules I discover cause annoying side-effects, you can be sure something will explode. < 1316319717 398413 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, perhaps I should have four arrows again instead of just two. < 1316319723 350270 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds more fun. < 1316319820 723930 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I can understand why Pierce's law is not deducible, though. If it is a function type, you have a value of type ((a -> b) -> a) there is nothing to call the function because you need (a -> b) which you don't have. Is that correct? (I know there is unsafe functions, and undefined, but I believe you have to be limited to safe and halting computations) < 1316319973 9603 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there is (x ->) monad and I have suggested using do-notation for fantasy rule. Would you simply use different monads, or...? < 1316320323 932874 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically as it currently stands if you lose a portal, cannon, or prism (queen) you are very likely to lose. < 1316320332 12019 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially a portal, as a portal takes many pieces with it. < 1316320344 601665 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix($) < 1316320345 335604 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. a -> b < 1316320354 623970 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, what do you mean by "you don't have" < 1316320361 716408 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn (a->b) -> a < 1316320361 893585 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- f cannot be realized. < 1316320394 22081 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :can anyone think of any interesting ideas for pawns? Currently they move and capture exactly as chess pawns. < 1316320424 654102 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is perfectly fine with me. pawns are definitely one of the most useful pieces in chess. < 1316320509 706324 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymee: Isn't that an infinite loop though? < 1316320533 972635 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they will be even more expendable in this game though, as capturing a pawn with a cannon does not place any of your pieces in danger like capturing a pawn would in chess. < 1316320539 405968 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, yes. < 1316320545 330454 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it fits the type signature. < 1316320602 311155 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you even write a function with the signature (a->b)->a? < 1316320608 882096 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn a->b->c < 1316320609 52536 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- f cannot be realized. < 1316320645 626291 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn a->b->(e->d->c->a->b)->c->d->e->(b->r)->r < 1316320645 800495 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f a _ b c d e f = f (b e d c a) < 1316320660 621140 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn a->b->(e->d->c->a->x)->c->d->e->(x->r)->r < 1316320660 795037 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f a _ b c d e f = f (b e d c a) < 1316320689 225853 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn a->([a]->(a,b,c)->x)->b->(e->e->e->x->x)->c->d->e->(x->r)->r < 1316320689 400414 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: Undefined type [] < 1316320691 563451 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1316320696 962350 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@djinn a->(a->(a,b,c)->x)->b->(e->e->e->x->x)->c->d->e->(x->r)->r < 1316320697 136140 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :f a b c d e _ f g = g (d f f f (b a (a, c, e))) < 1316320702 549231 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION stops silly < 1316320721 278324 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1316320737 454768 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling shellshock AI will be more difficult than chess AI. < 1316320744 464012 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymee: Maybe you can if you have infinite loop and all of that stuff, but for all 'a' and 'b' you probably do not have such a function that is always defined output for all defined input. < 1316320786 117096 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But even if you can, what you need is (((a -> b) -> a) -> a) < 1316320839 57869 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which means you require (a -> b), at least I think it does. < 1316321179 379736 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, here's an interesting idea. perhaps a portal could swap places with any friendly pieces in its movement radius. < 1316321187 740432 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: ^^^ < 1316321222 48235 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is perhaps a bad idea though. < 1316321233 128862 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that would be any place to which it can move? < 1316321237 701590 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316321246 207248 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which, currently is three spaces in any direction. < 1316321250 525716 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but might be shortened to two. < 1316321259 148018 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will play with my first draft and then go from there. < 1316321274 545924 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also portals can hop. < 1316321287 712468 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which puts them near the top of the mobility list, below arrows. < 1316321316 541423 :evincar!~jon@129.21.146.240 QUIT :Quit: Night. < 1316321354 917016 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because both portals and arrows will need to get to places quickly and often. < 1316321377 236881 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they're the primary defensive pieces. < 1316321381 522541 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and offensive pieces. < 1316321383 89935 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1316321427 637516 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone in here played DROD (Deadly Rooms of Death) and Braid? < 1316321474 297942 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Braid sounds familiar. < 1316321575 674380 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is a "dependent product type"? The article about Curry-Howard mentions it, but the article about dependent types, while I read it, I still don't know what dependent product type is. < 1316321586 597442 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've played some braid and I think I've played some drod as well. don't remember either that well. < 1316321733 119041 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, I'll need to clarify the rules involving infinite loops and prisms. < 1316321807 470307 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had an idea two nights ago in bed to combine the time travel elements of braid with drod < 1316321812 740343 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Drod already lets you undo as many moves as you like < 1316321817 158469 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :So why not introduce achronal elements into it? < 1316321999 143505 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let abaa :: ((a -> b) -> a) -> a; abaa p = fix($) < 1316321999 666479 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : :3:39: < 1316321999 839558 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `a1' against inferred type `... < 1316322005 868128 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude shellshock is going to be so fun I can't wait to play it. < 1316322038 948005 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm still going to call it cakechess it sounds better to me < 1316322041 781365 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let abaa :: ((a -> b) -> a) -> a; abaa p a = fix($) < 1316322042 300819 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : :3:30: < 1316322042 475515 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `a1' < 1316322042 493573 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inf... < 1316322056 587784 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, never mind. < 1316322061 114542 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :laser chess would be a good name but that's already taken. < 1316322063 552356 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe portal chess. < 1316322190 851405 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows might be equally important as cannons, or just slightly below importance. < 1316322197 326125 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals are pretty vital I think. < 1316322245 295590 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portal, cannon, prism, arrow. perhaps. < 1316322259 169045 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but losing any of them would be very much like losing a queen in chess. < 1316322387 154786 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody play sc2 < 1316322391 834835 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking about getting back in. < 1316323159 124419 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a similar game: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khet_(game) < 1316323165 544301 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to my chess variant. < 1316323184 30373 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like laser chess though < 1316323285 427393 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has actual lasers too. this is something portal chess cannot do because of portals. :P < 1316323308 40358 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, no, if the portal pieces were electronic, they could have a sensor/laser combo on one of their sides. < 1316323312 440252 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i started taking down some notes on a dbz-chess < 1316323315 643590 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a wireless transmitter. :P < 1316323320 826894 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: oh god no. < 1316323323 145781 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't do it. < 1316323326 721069 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cos thats how i like to pass 10 minutes on a sunday < 1316323338 914731 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :chess does not work like that. < 1316323349 750853 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, no stealing my ideas. < 1316323363 744693 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :feh < 1316323394 902534 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're encouraging me to actually take down more notes! < 1316323403 441367 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1316323405 7217 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however.. to also be mindful of not stealing your ideas < 1316323413 242389 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :your game will be horrible and unbalanced. while mine is obviously not. < 1316323417 820377 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good idea: explosion chess. < 1316323421 823749 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll leave the rest up to you < 1316323428 586973 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes explosions are always good < 1316323432 302823 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially to avoid rule paradox. < 1316323438 810356 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as portals going into portals. < 1316323443 720603 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am probably subconciously stealing ideas. < 1316323455 830052 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: well it's difficult to have DBZ chess without ENERGY BEAMS < 1316323484 392020 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically you'd have something where like... every piece can shoot some kind of projectile, and so everything would just die very quickly and it would be lame. < 1316323487 413379 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad game. < 1316323520 936744 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you could give some piece cool powers like the queen could be cell which would absorb other pieces and take their leet powerz < 1316323533 77871 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it wouldn't matter because everything else would just shoot everything to deth. the end. < 1316323535 966478 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh.. i would scrap the whole idea of using chess pieces < 1316323574 182053 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigho* as long as you're not getting genuinely too upset. < 1316323581 77456 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :either way unless you have a lame hit points system you will have a) projectiles b) rapid death < 1316323592 570773 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I'm furious. < 1316323592 746649 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone else mentioned that some of your ideas are similar to laserchess < 1316323600 777659 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but it's not the same. < 1316323626 685697 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually very different. the only similarity is that there are cannon pieces and there are pieces that redirect the direction of the cannons fires. < 1316323649 369852 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the way they redirect is very different.. < 1316323671 913316 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you're furious because i don't like chess < 1316323674 471666 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as is the number of pieces that redirect. < 1316323685 874624 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my ideas are basically attempts to destroy it < 1316323688 682932 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah I'm just saying dbz chess is probably not a good idea. < 1316323694 150927 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't destroy chess. < 1316323703 668319 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like saying "today I'm going to destroy communism" < 1316323716 607302 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "today I'm going to destroy object-oriented programming" < 1316323726 943406 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :mr fischer, tear down this board < 1316323736 885153 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :*checkmate* < 1316323759 37887 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you think to kill me? There's no flesh or blood within this cloak to kill. There's only an idea. Ideas are bulletproof. < 1316323761 525776 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :months ago i had ideas about streetfighter style fighting game with chess characters drawn in that style < 1316323811 355910 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i even had an idea about a chess platform game < 1316323828 824909 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21 < 1316323833 155174 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you been to www.chessvariants.com < 1316323841 636918 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no don't encourage him. < 1316323870 685705 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ya see.. the characters: King, Queen, Knight, Bishop, Pawn, Rook can be abstracted entirely out of the gameplay structure < 1316323873 948273 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figure either he'll get better ideas or be overwhelmed by all the stuff on the site and ruminate < 1316323897 384475 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm also another neat idea for a chess variant inspired from Khet < 1316323898 466396 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck, you could even make chess the sitcom < 1316323910 581409 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :where your pieces are all arranged in a massive block and movement is done by swapping out pieces. < 1316323921 206622 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure what the objective would be. < 1316323928 82589 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :chess the sitcom: "Welcome home King." "Thanks Queen." *canned laughter* < 1316323950 358560 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Wheres our little pawns?" "Oh they're watching TV" *more canned laughter* < 1316323974 903101 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the pawns would obviously die in horrible ways to protect other pieces. < 1316323975 221008 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: Castlingmost Chess < 1316324003 698805 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the queen would always run away. < 1316324010 187058 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the knight would always hop out of danger. < 1316324019 975452 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"King: It was a busy day at work today. 3 of our men got captured" < 1316324024 537131 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :meanwhile the bishop is doing something strategic. < 1316324051 112049 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and sneaky < 1316324071 884798 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Moooom! Timmy says he's gonna capture me!" < 1316324079 104040 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay this can't continue. < 1316324104 147915 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think there may have been an xkcd comic about a chess raft < 1316324119 895199 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the punch line so far is: "haha anthropomorphic chess family" "haha capturing" < 1316324137 353488 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe its just in my head < 1316324140 585351 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1316324149 694331 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember that comic < 1316324153 311550 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :they were going to settlers of catan < 1316324159 300931 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the knights was having an argument with the bishop < 1316324194 515383 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how does one post a contribution to chessvariants? < 1316324198 73225 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I must write up ze rules. < 1316324206 710043 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: yes anthropomorphic chess characters. < 1316324209 828221 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chessvariants.com/index/membersubmission.php presumably < 1316324212 670713 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :of what is either portal chess or shellshock I can't decide. < 1316324217 625726 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if stuff is still getting added to it though... < 1316324231 807698 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I still need to work out a final draft after some test plays < 1316324237 875468 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so taking something like a manga.. and importing it into chess is simply an inverse operation of anthropomorphizing chess pieces < 1316324239 269245 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but surely they will see the awesomeness and allow it. < 1316324291 747256 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yes. there are still new pages < 1316324296 684154 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :excellent. < 1316324313 321545 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they shall witness what is probably the most excellent game ever made. well, maybe, after extensive testing. < 1316324330 387174 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, you better playtest it :fistshake: < 1316324336 648138 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I will. < 1316324338 552664 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my youth I had an overwhelming desire to come up with chess variants < 1316324341 869000 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no desire to playtest them < 1316324343 782992 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah it was awful < 1316324355 634939 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well playtesting is where you figure out if your game is actually good. < 1316324407 506880 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling it will be extremely fun to begin with, and then get gradually less fun for one person as they lose all of the incredibly important pieces. hopefully at that point losing will be swift. < 1316324429 135371 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :just gg out when you can't win < 1316324430 4252 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess < 1316324454 574501 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sidenote: it is probably always a bad idea to have a portal next to a king < 1316324475 730656 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically i don't like chess for exactly the same reason that chessplayers do like it. i don't like knowing that it takes 50 years to learn to do anything in the game which hasn't been done before redundantly :D < 1316324498 512182 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I should include some kind of indirect check rule in which portals can be placed in check if capturing the portal would result in capturing the king. < 1316324503 664586 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if I should just not care. < 1316324515 282022 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and include that "oh by the way if a portal explodes on a king you lose" < 1316324541 435881 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: chess isn't about breaking the mold, really. < 1316324565 77834 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one idea i had was to make the tiles shaped as golden ratio instead of squares < 1316324575 877774 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :good luck with that < 1316324584 576575 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a golden ratio is not a... shape. < 1316324594 301859 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a golden ratio rectangle < 1316324617 338392 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not an actual thing. < 1316324628 22494 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :an approximation of a golden ratio rectangle < 1316324634 55373 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need more than one. < 1316324655 224272 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah wait, no you don't. < 1316324677 895919 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :still what does changing the dimensions of the squares do exactly? < 1316324685 212790 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't mean anything yeah < 1316324726 477059 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could unfortunately make certain distances on the board seem larger than they are also < 1316324746 989710 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean make a golden SPIRAL? < 1316324763 283617 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just have squares whose side ratios are phi? < 1316324786 3232 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i just mean take the sqaures and turn them into rectangles whose side ratios are pi < 1316324807 768781 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1316324829 313397 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would create a false sense of distance though < 1316324842 707622 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i wonder if that would matter < 1316324846 140706 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it. < 1316324877 553066 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, just found some more things I need to clarify < 1316324883 125159 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :these rules are going to get pretty large I think. < 1316324920 212045 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah wait, no. I don't need the rule I was thinking of. I was thinking in terms of lasers but that's not how it will work. < 1316324929 215856 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Chess rules are hard enough to write down. < 1316324933 484682 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :@google joke chess problem < 1316324934 781910 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joke_chess_problem < 1316324934 948886 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Title: Joke chess problem - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia < 1316324947 718128 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking if at any point the projectile crosses its own path it would nullify itself < 1316324954 830525 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would only make sense if it were imagined as a laser < 1316324975 610174 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not as an abstract path thing. < 1316324977 248410 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Laser beams can cross themselves... < 1316324984 792163 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you mean TRON? Star Wars? < 1316324985 149825 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also that. < 1316324988 376045 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316325011 368139 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :however I am making it a rule that infinite loops act basically like big laser death walls. < 1316325030 339706 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you fire a projectile /at/ an infinite loop then it cancels the projectile that was fired as well as the loop. < 1316325046 173405 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they collide. < 1316325069 40967 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also if an infinite loop captures a piece it ceases to exist. no permanent death walls. < 1316325107 831493 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically you can imagine it as a pointlike projectile move around very very quickly inside the circuit. it collides with anything that crosses the circuit and then goes away. < 1316325119 733477 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :TRON chess, the next big thing since trek chess < 1316325140 910145 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1316325144 563694 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :tron chess would be madness < 1316325150 826776 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd need some kind of piece to keep track of the walls. < 1316325154 651990 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :checker pieces I guess. < 1316325161 523020 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Play on a whiteboard < 1316325174 942266 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :here I think the loops are simple enough that you can simply use your memory to locate loops. < 1316325179 899303 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, every piece moves every turn. < 1316325210 726703 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though perhaps I will precisely define how loops should be handled < 1316325221 531446 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you should have to redeclare a loop if you create a new loop from an existing loop. < 1316325254 701424 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about chess where the board's colours update every round according to a CA (game of life or day and night would be appropriate) and then movement is determiend as follows: http://www.chessvariants.org/boardrules.dir/piedchess.html < 1316325261 226013 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1316325371 920618 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm the simplest loop I think would be a wall structure. on a single row, column, or diagonal you could have: (canon) >> << < 1316325415 755753 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also have an L-shaped circuit, but that would involve the opponent's arrow. shared loops are nasty situations. < 1316325443 763986 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you could have an L-shaped loop between two portals and a connecting arrow inbetween them. < 1316325668 44957 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...bah, I think I'll actually need to give loops a directional quality as well. < 1316325693 910497 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a portal-arrow-portal loop only one portal could change directions wouldn't being captured. < 1316325709 588219 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other would change directions and then collide with the looping projectile. < 1316325932 360348 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically in any portal-based loop there's an in-portal and an out-portal, based on the direction the projectile was originally fired. < 1316325980 588360 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :rotating the in-portal without moving it would cause it to be captured, the out-portal can rotate and move freely, thus breaking the loop and capturing the piece directly in front of it at the end of the turn. < 1316326000 775397 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah... that's probably the most complex rule of the game. < 1316326147 853840 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also makes the out-portal an extremely deadly thing < 1316326181 477183 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it can, in one turn, move three spaces in any direction, hoping over any piece, and face any direction... capturing whatever is in front of it at the end of the turn as it breaks the loop. < 1316327398 889696 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.chessvariants.org/diffsetup.dir/pattsch.html < 1316327446 364513 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, that's hilarious < 1316327521 432271 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really see how that's a double stalemate. < 1316327527 416551 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can easily move one of the pawns forward. < 1316327534 413083 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1316327542 5386 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at where they start < 1316327544 99656 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :then look at a normal board < 1316327547 380664 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice something different? < 1316327567 722067 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :aside from the two pawns above the rank no. < 1316327592 850108 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the colors are flipped. < 1316327609 169610 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, is that implying the pawns move backwards? < 1316327711 596904 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1316327721 465105 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :think < 1316327725 138808 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am. < 1316327740 686358 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :'the players start the game in a position in which they are both stalemated.' < 1316327743 160146 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the page lying? < 1316327764 820301 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"it's a stalemate because it says it is" is not a valid explanation. < 1316327807 196862 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my only guess is that pawns move backwards because they reversed the locations of the pieces. < 1316327829 975877 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :bravo < 1316327844 361102 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'll note that I said that several lines ago. < 1316327858 456822 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you didn't confirm it. < 1316327887 473349 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should have been able to figure it out on your own lol < 1316327902 539002 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't deny it < 1316327927 386586 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :asshole. < 1316327938 490882 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1316327953 744941 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1316327960 381441 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot the :P < 1316327965 181153 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :see now everything is better. < 1316327972 975585 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316328001 757500 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahaha you're a terrible person just kidding hahaha < 1316328014 422297 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hahahaha < 1316328015 467253 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1316328058 904122 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway yeah < 1316328060 724816 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :on chess variants < 1316328064 793272 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :always assume fide rules and rule zero to the letter < 1316328078 526320 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :until it says something contradictory < 1316328102 752550 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :fide rules for instance explicitly says white starts on THIS side black starts on THIS side white's pawns go THIS way < 1316328104 145049 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and so on < 1316328340 597013 :ive!~nn@189.179.246.222 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1316329706 700969 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316329918 838394 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some book i downloaded(stole) it began by explaining its easier to describe fairy chess pieces relative to standard pieces... (please note: i am using my own words here in this paraphrase, and my memory always makes small forgettings) < 1316329941 166776 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :reason for saying this? i suppose that fide provides a stable base < 1316330059 956926 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it's easier to say "this piece moves like a bishop" or "this piece moves like a knight, except.." < 1316330105 387718 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't this is entirely true for portal chess. "This piece moves like a king, except it can shoot bulletz lol" < 1316330115 504297 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :+think < 1316330120 96341 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's a badass king < 1316330125 48894 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :carrys a rifle < 1316330151 185679 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I've found some other abstract strategy games that have a directional componnt < 1316330154 30334 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :calls himself k1ng < 1316330154 49758 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :jwiriwejr < 1316330179 901243 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in one game you had to change direction a single turn, except there was one kind of piece that could move and turn in the same turn. < 1316330202 800629 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log pawn < 1316330214 384254 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think it makes things more interesting if you can move and turn in one move. < 1316330223 80942 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2007-09-26.txt:22:51:33: something like Like a flock of hellspawns \ And stewards of the son of despite \ We parry their guile with the magnificence of disgust < 1316330238 328120 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, though once again I have more loop dilemmas... < 1316330257 950135 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: can i predict laserchess never had loops? < 1316330298 976166 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :loops in chess is sort of cool. loops in chess in _the_ esolang channel, is quite special. < 1316330301 155284 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say I have a loop, and the opponent puts his portal inside of the loop and then turns his piece so that the portal is facing the path of the projectile < 1316330322 20868 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the portal get captured or does it break the loop? < 1316330335 837735 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think it breaks the loop < 1316330357 25723 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are your portals anything like narbacular drop portals? < 1316330375 705605 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can kind of think of them as walls with Portal portals on them. < 1316330384 401516 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can reorient the walls. < 1316330390 720497 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log narbacular < 1316330391 779220 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I've explained it like 4 times at least. < 1316330395 84834 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2008-07-18.txt:15:43:01: shooting a portal through a portal? that worked in narbacular drop < 1316330402 983707 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^_^ < 1316330425 485336 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry cake.. i hate being so wrong that i have to regularly apologize < 1316330461 101149 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so anyways I guess the portal should break the loop... < 1316330474 996088 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any loop-breakage should be calculated at the end of a turn, in other words. < 1316330480 662692 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not halfway through it. that would be kind of arbitrary. < 1316330499 195899 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION will have a fairly large section on loop-breaking at the end of the rules < 1316330506 816959 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the most potentially confusing part of the game. < 1316330516 74256 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im a right groan and grunt < 1316330526 746831 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you big book of rhyming slang < 1316330571 471774 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i see < 1316330577 434469 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so a portal can divert a laser < 1316330582 781232 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :faark thats cool < 1316330592 410119 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah, okay I don't have a solution for this one. < 1316330599 125539 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say you have the simple 2-arrow loop < 1316330619 587662 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok ill stop calling em lasers < 1316330626 860342 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cannon) >>------(loop)------<< < 1316330636 960805 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>> and << are arrows. < 1316330647 771433 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah im following most of it believe it or not < 1316330664 891556 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so in the L-shaped loops, there was an obvious direction to the loop. so that a portal could suddenly jump into te loop and something predictable would happen. < 1316330679 91218 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhhhh < 1316330679 655079 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but... what happens here when a portal jumps into a loop. do you flip a fucking coin? < 1316330721 436212 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316330731 382229 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to decide one way or another. < 1316330743 96067 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :either the portal dies or it breaks the loop safely. < 1316330749 573434 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could default to facing the portal at the cannon < 1316330756 916088 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :along the loop < 1316330758 658141 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh. < 1316330767 135143 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i know that answer sucks < 1316330770 181202 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that breaks my intuitive loop thinking. :P < 1316330781 974290 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :flipping a coin makes the most sense but that's gross. < 1316330801 950909 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, the projectile is moving way too fast there's no way to time it correctly, the portal is always captured. :P < 1316330820 527120 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hummmm < 1316330822 97433 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, portals can hop... thus allowing them to pass through. they just can't stand in it and break the loop. < 1316330879 788465 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah I'll basically have to document the two cases (arrow-based loops vs portal-based loops) and how they differ. < 1316330895 101121 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portal-based loops have a directional quality. arrow-based loops do not. < 1316330901 83711 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what happens if 2 loops cross each other.. is that the explosion case? < 1316330918 777711 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can't happen because if a projectile crosses a loop they're both negated. < 1316330925 144126 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1316330936 587558 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316330941 606862 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the explosion case involves a portal trying to pass through its linked portal < 1316330947 374618 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION troll grins. < 1316330950 664894 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also when portals are captured their linked portal explodes. < 1316330975 40852 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you want to keep your portals alive... < 1316331068 792811 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually portal-based and arrow-based is bad terminology as there's a 4-arrow case with directional qualities < 1316331077 476789 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically I should call them bidirection and unidirectional loops. < 1316331094 71327 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the 4-arrow case would be extremely unlikely as it involves all four arrows on the board) < 1316331146 728386 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at times like this i bet you wish you could code up a simulator for it in 10 minutes < 1316331178 351942 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :........nooooo < 1316331179 919394 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just found < 1316331184 594384 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :something I'm pretty sure cannot be solved. < 1316331192 442947 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :without a major rule change. < 1316331228 927324 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait nevermind. < 1316331232 490370 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can't happen. < 1316331233 311736 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :phew < 1316331264 348668 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so anytime you break a loop, there is ONE predictable path the projectile can take. < 1316331273 850912 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: do you understand what happens when a loop breaks? < 1316331287 320376 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1316331296 363295 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay simplest case: < 1316331306 9345 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cannon) >>------(loop)------<< < 1316331316 854738 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the arrow on the far right moves diagonally up-right < 1316331332 539541 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loop is broken, which causes < 1316331342 481458 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cannon) >>--------(projectile)----------- < 1316331347 793254 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1316331365 599292 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, so everytime a loop is broken a potential capture is possible. < 1316331390 643235 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :making loops a situation where the person controlling the loop has a huge advantage. < 1316331418 445471 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cannon) >>------(loop)------<< (bob) < 1316331423 816134 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there's I think 12 options even in that simple case. < 1316331426 829881 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :of where the projectile can go. < 1316331429 458857 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Cannon) >>--------(projectile)---------(bob captured)--- < 1316331432 465629 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316331452 918195 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no there's 10 < 1316331454 931817 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 options < 1316331470 645585 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the two options that are removed the ones that form the loop < 1316331476 181094 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :+are < 1316331493 830103 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a lot of different ways for things to potentially be captured, and the opponent can only react to one. < 1316331509 56565 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless < 1316331523 636557 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can, in their turn, break the loop via portal. which is not possible in the bidirectional case. < 1316331548 310096 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmmm, maybe it should be. otherwise that very very easy to setup loop could not be easily handled. < 1316331583 338213 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you can declare a loop direction on creation of a loop < 1316331583 685213 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT SAYETH? < 1316331590 936676 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no... that's not how it works. < 1316331595 350189 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok :P < 1316331600 660634 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the projectile moves back and forth. it's bidirectional < 1316331623 419394 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a unidirectional loop moves in a circle thanks to portals or very unlikely arrow situations < 1316331635 789527 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>-----V < 1316331635 928559 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhhhhh i see < 1316331638 769607 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :^-----^ < 1316331640 945697 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1316331646 952842 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :very unlikely with arrows < 1316331666 527078 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but more likely with portals. two portals + 1 arrow = L-shaped loop with a single direction of travel. < 1316331691 67258 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there's also a line-based version. < 1316331705 140293 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :()-------<<------() < 1316331708 950844 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ()'s are portals < 1316331723 987001 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the cannon is perpendicular to the arrow and fires. < 1316331771 143703 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the L-shaped loops is similar but with the portals not on the same rank/file < 1316331787 80863 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :╔═►═╗ < 1316331791 58725 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :▲ ▼ < 1316331792 101734 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :╚═◄═╝ < 1316331795 267268 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep. < 1316331802 302188 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know thats not how it works but it looks cool < 1316331810 230808 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the 4-arrow loop < 1316331825 681917 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only loop that consists entirely of arrows and is also unidirectional. < 1316331838 545729 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i realize in practice those arrows would be on the corners but artistic license < 1316331843 467117 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is owned by both players. Hilarity ensues. < 1316331872 620387 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316331884 467020 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically you would not want to be the person to form this loop as it gives your opponent license to redirect the loop as he pleases. < 1316331914 112491 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNLESS you can somehow make it so that any possible breaking of the loop causes the opponent to lose a piece < 1316331921 854352 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's even more unlikely than forming the loop itself. < 1316331934 36135 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316331942 612428 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok heres a random idea < 1316331952 960910 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316331968 847617 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so for the sake of balance I think bidirectional loops can always be broken by an intervening portal. < 1316331971 30635 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could say that you can only control the loop if your opponent has no pieces adjacent to it.. or that might be going a bit far < 1316331984 829601 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, that's not how it works. < 1316331985 713785 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or it could be if you have more pieces adjacent < 1316331991 391507 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loop is the result of an arrangement of pieces < 1316331998 793844 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :re-arranging those pieces should logically alter it. < 1316332035 844081 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no balance issues with the loop rules as far as I can tell. < 1316332042 880439 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah.. you can imagine how fucked up a chess variant would be if i produced it < 1316332061 157121 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're expensive in time to set up and allow for a wide-number of neat possibilities. all positive things in my opinion. < 1316332077 939520 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to prevent them from being unbalanced and not fun. < 1316332107 207771 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I /could/ make the bidirectional portal break thing-a-ma-jig a coin flip... < 1316332123 234188 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ONLY element of chance in the entire game. < 1316332143 9652 :kmc!~keegan@c-98-216-51-47.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316332157 91647 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but no I think a ortal should be able to break a bidirectional loop always because they're the most trivial to set up and are still very nasty for the opponent who isn't in control of it. < 1316332198 721277 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing drives me more crazy about game design than knowing that victory is usually the result of opponent error < 1316332228 211553 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that where victory is not the result of opponent error it is the result of inherent advantage to one player < 1316332247 701073 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and where those aren't the case it could be pure luck < 1316332273 501708 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes those are generally the three cases. < 1316332275 163077 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still.. that is an extreme and unrealistic way of looking at it i have < 1316332283 495681 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's an interesting case < 1316332292 718838 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>----()()----<< < 1316332312 97146 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also bidirectional < 1316332347 319508 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>----() ()----<< < 1316332352 576217 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or any equivalent arrangement < 1316332361 415489 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what i described is not really the case. and that is where i draw hope from < 1316332368 794714 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its an oversimplifcation i made < 1316332378 218024 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well no if you look at game theory that's pretty much true I believe. < 1316332398 147094 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log nash < 1316332401 572757 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-11-08.txt:15:52:22: Observation: gnash actually ... like ... works 'n stuff. < 1316332409 524175 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log \bnash\b < 1316332413 93616 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-18.txt:07:53:18: `log nash < 1316332416 901135 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log \bnash\b < 1316332420 740022 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-08-16.txt:03:18:46: 362) I've only watched bad movies about video game. I enjoyed every second of it. \ 536) Game theory is not a perfect tool for analyzing video games. Nash failed to create a "video game theory" < 1316332427 274510 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are so called perfect games in which one player can always win. < 1316332435 554703 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my quote is not necessarily true.. < 1316332448 640911 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but theres proof that it is something that plagues me :D < 1316332449 863070 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only case you didn't mention is an impartial game where stalemate is possible if no one makes an error. < 1316332457 825897 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1316332542 808146 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the majority of competitive video games have some degree of chance. < 1316332567 133769 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think even a game like starcraft 2 has elements of chance. < 1316332588 873669 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the end i guess it's that it's not who wins < 1316332633 648904 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah wait no the element of chance I thought existed in starcraft actually does not. < 1316332653 477058 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought the damage calculations were semi-random but they have definite values. < 1316332675 479913 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rant about my ideas a lot < 1316332680 393543 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1316332680 411340 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log test of reflexes < 1316332683 900138 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-18.txt:07:58:00: `log test of reflexes < 1316332688 407120 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log test of reflexes < 1316332691 449516 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-18.txt:07:58:03: 2011-09-18.txt:07:58:00: `log test of reflexes < 1316332696 391719 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316332703 690092 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log test of < 1316332706 780488 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-04-24.txt:02:02:09: i think i uploaded the most recentest of changes < 1316332709 75956 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316332711 166305 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log test of < 1316332714 803408 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-01-08.txt:17:08:12: fizzie: they are not the brightest of bots < 1316332720 901016 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha ha ha haha ha < 1316332723 402636 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-209-4.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316332732 731844 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1316332735 310496 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-202-111.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316332744 116208 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i gotta chill out more effectively < 1316332822 58519 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't be afraid to tell me off.. i have some bad chat habits. < 1316332842 429083 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im basically not much of a contributer < 1316332865 334718 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now ill see if i can get your topic back after i broke it < 1316332907 487978 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so < 1316332918 58286 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a normal piece can be captured by the missile right? < 1316332948 203767 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any piece that doesn't interact with projectiles, yes. < 1316332956 435353 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a cannon can be captured. a missile can be captured. < 1316332963 435536 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :missiles are not pieces anymore < 1316332967 92344 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh < 1316332976 182479 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :cannons fire missiles, which are kind of just abstract rule-things. < 1316333045 502895 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so... there is an interesting case < 1316333073 953233 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(cannon) >>------(loop)------(portal-a) (portal-b)------(loop)-------<< < 1316333099 341762 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats exactly what you said isnt it < 1316333122 870470 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats another of my bad chat habits .. repeating peoples text back at them < 1316333140 196927 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's a case I already covered. < 1316333155 834912 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a more interesting case of the basic bidirectional one < 1316333165 38857 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it can exist on two seperate locations. < 1316333171 946919 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I haven't considered cases involving four portals. < 1316333174 735326 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" here's an interesting case >>----()()----<<" < 1316333198 216136 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i practically copied your post word for word.. < 1316333200 835697 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because as far as the projectile rules are considered opponent arrows and portals are fair game. < 1316333215 771596 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there are 4 portals and 4 arrows total on the board, if none have been captured. < 1316333240 681739 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's interesting because it represents the situation of whether a portal is in a loops path before the loop is created < 1316333256 699603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well not exactly < 1316333271 63136 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not possible to place both portals into a loop unless you have a secondary loop to pass it off to. < 1316333271 758372 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316333298 79129 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :placing one portal into >-----< just breaks the loop, sends the projectile somewhere else. < 1316333314 614186 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which could be a new loop, sure. < 1316333321 821677 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops i mean < 1316333323 40902 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I don't understand what you're getting at. < 1316333348 509456 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in order to have >>----() ()----<< .. it means that a portal is in the loops path before the loop is created < 1316333363 971154 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316333403 102793 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is another way it could be done < 1316333410 979951 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A)------(b) (B)--<<--(a) here's a fun and unlikely case < 1316333416 796956 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you could have..... < 1316333431 955606 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you pushed an arrow into the loop the loop would be cut short < 1316333437 645216 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A)------(b) (B)-----<< < 1316333441 509584 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you could insert a portal < 1316333441 682616 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :followed by < 1316333447 336112 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and remove the arrow < 1316333453 776281 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(A)------(b) (B)----(a)----<< < 1316333466 445255 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er wait... < 1316333471 156821 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hnn.. what does upper case mean? < 1316333473 302279 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that case is not possible I messed that up. < 1316333481 63539 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :upper case is one players portals, lower case is the others. < 1316333491 725250 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah there is no 4-portal case unless arrows are involved < 1316333542 110067 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) >>-----------<< 2) >>------<< << 3) >>------<<() << 4) >>-------() << < 1316333563 191364 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh thats the same problem.. < 1316333564 623972 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see < 1316333566 425437 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in those cases a loop breaks and a new one is formed. < 1316333576 223621 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(2) is wrong < 1316333577 204031 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...in the event that you break the loop < 1316333584 300908 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well two is an entirely possible setup. < 1316333613 780205 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh uhhh no no 2 is correct because the loop would ultimately be shrunk that way < 1316333632 360266 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :an interesting case where a loop breaks and no projectile-flies-off-the-board capturing occurs. < 1316333633 55034 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1316333647 124826 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it gets caught in a second loop. < 1316333648 605597 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) >>-----------<< 2) >>------<< << 3) >>------<<() << 4) >>-------() << ()------<< < 1316333655 222713 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ultimately these loop scenarios are highly contrived and unlikely. < 1316333658 901898 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still possible. < 1316333674 680139 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the rules need to be clear on them. < 1316333697 259080 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes nothing new is happening in these examples. < 1316333705 644874 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i am just pointing out that if loops capture portals theres still ways to use them < 1316333718 508725 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking for cases I haven't considered with possibly ambiguous rules. < 1316333730 329265 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...oh, well sure. < 1316333739 749762 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main use for capturing a loop with a portal would be to capture something on the other end. < 1316333747 676083 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a loop is just a capture waiting to happen. < 1316333769 776615 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does a loop end with a capture? < 1316333802 388912 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean does a capture break the loop? yes. < 1316333813 387119 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean do all loops conclude with a capture inevitably? no. < 1316333844 896978 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the basic rules if a projectile captures something the path of the projectile is stopped. < 1316333861 706788 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :same rule applies for loops as they're essentially projectiles that have been sustained across multiple turns. < 1316333884 838520 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't been paying attention how do you represent active loops < 1316333931 944683 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what happens if the opponent fires a projectile into an active loop < 1316333942 688733 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mutual annihilation? < 1316333948 121283 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1316333995 917102 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: yes < 1316334021 76566 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you declare that a loop exists and if requests by your opponent disambiguate the nature of the loop < 1316334029 358931 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in most situations there's probably only one loop that's possible though. < 1316334044 522938 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and... you just keep a mental note of it. there is no on-board representation. < 1316334047 601904 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316334061 834027 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hidden state is messy < 1316334070 885715 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially in things like this < 1316334073 638026 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316334082 649519 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a consequence of the projectile, which is a hidden state itself. < 1316334088 105630 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be possible to represent a loop with an object on the loops path < 1316334100 416587 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure but it's not really necessary. < 1316334103 239598 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah forget that < 1316334104 268789 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :optional rule. < 1316334109 982334 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im silly. < 1316334123 199521 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: but projectiles normally don't persist, so they aren't problematic < 1316334127 106033 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find it quite easy to picture evil death walls. < 1316334139 996991 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: right, even when they do persist they remain in a stable circuit until broken. < 1316334162 491549 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but how do you know when the circuit is active or inactive (your own memory and the memory of your opponent that's what) < 1316334166 492239 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also directionality can be inferred from arrows along the loop so that's not a problem either. < 1316334197 968755 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: when someone declares a loop it's active, meaning that he spent his turn to fire a cannon into a loop, thus activating it < 1316334205 638185 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it remains so until broken. < 1316334214 541405 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you really wanted you could have a second board which shows the loops :D < 1316334221 175723 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: that isn't my problem < 1316334230 778329 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which occurs as the result of a re-arrangement of the loop components or obstruction by something else. < 1316334231 163847 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: my problem is with loops persisting without indication < 1316334248 440723 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loop declaration is the indication. < 1316334257 860301 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you really wanted you could have a second board which shows the loops :D = the monqy board < 1316334259 600395 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you just remember it < 1316334264 281422 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316334267 132760 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not difficult. < 1316334268 790750 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hidden state < 1316334273 587319 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Worst Thing < 1316334277 844698 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :go back to perl < 1316334279 854239 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :;_; < 1316334281 565365 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1316334287 117403 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also when you move a pawn two squares forward in regular chess < 1316334299 405352 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to remember that it can be captured on the space it would have been had it moved one space. < 1316334308 172398 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*been at < 1316334309 708667 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1316334319 848152 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not remembering < 1316334323 131468 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/En_passant < 1316334328 190313 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure it is. < 1316334334 70389 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could use bits of string on the board even ^^; < 1316334348 547514 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if the pawn had moved one square, and then one square a second turn? < 1316334355 708976 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rule doesn't apply even though the board is in the same state physically. < 1316334357 622157 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh multiple turns i forgot about that. < 1316334363 913977 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuck chess is disgusting ;_; < 1316334399 65931 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the state doesn't have to be hidden.. its just that representing it requies a kludge or 2 < 1316334402 688905 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, btw, "hidden state woooooo" is not a design philosophy of perl. < 1316334409 37556 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know < 1316334416 818324 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're related by being gross < 1316334437 195191 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the irony of perl is that it's not meant to be an esolang < 1316334449 213624 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any case it's not an issue as loops are in practice very short lived entities. < 1316334450 431222 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know perl so empty words from me < 1316334461 624095 :zake!~zake@109.175.10.98 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316334466 581951 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: hahaha good luck making them short-lived < 1316334471 534002 :zake!~zake@109.175.10.98 QUIT :Client Quit < 1316334473 186569 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: ??? < 1316334481 920066 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: nobody will want to enter them < 1316334496 571215 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they'll persist for turns at least < 1316334500 336892 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: bits of string could do it.. as could a second board.. it's not really insurmountable < 1316334502 986251 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :protal chsse 101 < 1316334506 957443 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to break a loop < 1316334515 892328 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) >>-------<< < 1316334521 852725 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :2) >>-----^ < 1316334521 870575 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this notation < 1316334535 931516 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>> and ^ are arrows the direction of the symbol indicates the direction of the arrow < 1316334543 15242 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :------ is a projectile path (aka the loop) < 1316334555 806705 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(>>)/(<<)/(^)(v) = (arrow piece) < 1316334557 56747 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :on one row/file/diagonal. it's a 1d view of the board < 1316334572 749324 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am constrained by IRC < 1316334580 942597 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :use a paste bin < 1316334598 67473 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay basically all you have to do is change the direction of an arrow and the loop will break. < 1316334605 61001 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :change the state of any of the loops components and it breaks. < 1316334613 973149 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and how do you change the direction of someone else's arrow < 1316334617 424446 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :put a portal which can redirect the loop into the loop and it breaks. < 1316334623 583637 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.....you don't. it's yours. < 1316334626 726100 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have two arrows. < 1316334658 63444 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :►═══▼ < 1316334660 338647 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are several ways to break loops. in many cases it will be advantageous to break an arrow as it captures something. < 1316334661 614653 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would you break your own loop if not for the enemy falling into range of one of its constituent arrows < 1316334661 962365 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :║ ║ < 1316334663 310216 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :▲═══◄ < 1316334664 900683 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1316334668 156458 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't understand at all. < 1316334690 293108 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :breaking a loop essentially allows you to capture something by /turning an arrow in a direction/ < 1316334696 726520 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I know < 1316334716 218754 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because someone will put definitely something in that direction < 1316334733 302250 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are 10 of them in the most basic loop you can make. < 1316334735 802408 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 paths < 1316334738 711446 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the loop can break. < 1316334744 930668 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :►═════▼ < 1316334749 538207 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :║ ║ < 1316334750 802612 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :▲═) (═◄ < 1316334785 205361 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even, as you say, "no one will want to break their own loop", the opponent can still place a portal into the loop to redirect it. < 1316334803 449154 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is, consequently, even more reason for the loop-maker to want to break their own loop, otherwise they give their opponent a free projectile) < 1316334805 402962 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :people will want to break their own loops < 1316334809 859235 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316334810 494294 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you reade the "unless" clause < 1316334818 985632 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean "if not" < 1316334833 665241 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the "why would you" not "nobody will ever" < 1316334837 686941 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever < 1316334841 634699 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm? < 1316334876 769571 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah my mistake. < 1316334884 976488 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"nobody will want to enter them" < 1316334888 235969 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dangers of paraphrasing. < 1316334891 462071 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :still all of my points are valid. < 1316334897 280038 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what points < 1316334909 278809 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're assuming people will walk into deathtraps < 1316334915 539957 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. into range of the arrows < 1316334928 373666 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that loops are systematically short-lived entities as a result of their purposes and the ability to be "stolen" from you < 1316334955 155459 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what purposes < 1316334960 461418 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :by stolen do you mean via portals < 1316334972 830009 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to allow 10 or more possible paths of capture at the same time < 1316334973 959248 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes. < 1316334981 950266 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1316334993 621430 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure they could be defensive as well, but again there's the case where a portal can redirect it < 1316334998 237166 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you wouldn't want it to stay around long < 1316335005 281975 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few turns is not a long time to remember the existence of a portal. < 1316335009 237251 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not an issue. < 1316335018 323710 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/portal/loop/ < 1316335062 291602 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) yes it is (2) elegance suffers greatly and i will hate it forever (3) how would you use them offensively, positioning and firing and all < 1316335071 433871 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they seem like a pretty defensive thing to me < 1316335097 581761 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and offensive when broken because you forced the enemy to move into range < 1316335112 143214 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the enemy is being stupid or using a pawn to break it intentionally < 1316335118 459544 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're both. but being able to fire a projectile at will from any of the components is a major perk of breaking them. < 1316335127 592876 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, no one will walk into a death trap. < 1316335129 546041 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess using a pawn isn't fulfulling much of its purpose my train of thought kind of derailed there < 1316335181 562174 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also there are only 4 arrows at any given time < 1316335189 295238 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like the board is going to be littered with loops to keep track of. < 1316335210 716927 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems a lot more like a tool for restricting movement than killing < 1316335217 694777 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also.. how many players do you think is optimal for this game? < 1316335225 178621 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is this a 4 player jubilee? < 1316335228 592489 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....2 < 1316335232 601593 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1316335235 8818 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on a chess board. < 1316335239 703176 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also also < 1316335262 441870 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in loop case 1... >>-----<<...positioning a portal in there...what happens < 1316335263 74255 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :d&d Also? < 1316335267 495859 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is very much a tool for killing. < 1316335273 529380 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it both do the redirection and get destroyed? < 1316335273 714663 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ignore that comment < 1316335286 493667 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: portal redirects it. I considered that case and decided for balance reasons that was the best choice. < 1316335294 212705 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are two variant rules you could play. < 1316335296 346395 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what happens when you put your own pieces in a loop. destruction? < 1316335302 102461 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316335307 197189 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :projectiles are friendly-fire always. < 1316335322 883388 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the exception of arrows, prisms, and portals facing the right direction. < 1316335339 469949 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also need to clarify prism-based loops as they're kind of tricky) < 1316335399 594679 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...actually a prism based loop with arrows is impossible < 1316335413 883886 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1316335431 978509 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the prism, by the way, is the queen piece. it's an arrow without a direction, basically. the player is free to choose a path. also once a projectile passes through a prism is destroys arrows in its path. < 1316335449 264892 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1316335452 445706 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1316335458 486631 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :destroys arrows in its path < 1316335458 874688 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1316335464 349821 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to allow that to be possible. < 1316335472 523607 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as otherwise arrows are kind of difficult to capture and can just roam around easily. < 1316335487 814758 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly JOIN :#esoteric < 1316335498 636259 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: when i was reading about 2L there was a thing which redirects dependant on incoming direction < 1316335500 550233 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are highly useful as well, which compounds the issue of them being difficult to capture. < 1316335525 263096 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so far it's the best idea for a queen piece I have. it might change but I like it. < 1316335553 951549 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I allowed prisms to destroy portals as well then I could avoid clarifying prism-based loops entirely. :P < 1316335557 472260 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not sure I want to do that. < 1316335599 510821 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: oh also prisms can capture, but have restricted movement (currently 2 squares no hoping) < 1316335632 160350 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I might increase their movement capabilities since they're one of the few pieces that are effective at non-projectile captures. < 1316335640 822647 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316335700 71333 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, actually no < 1316335709 535802 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll make prism movement/capturing a combination of knight and king. < 1316335713 903925 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like that better. < 1316335719 670738 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by that < 1316335733 161744 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....it can move and capture like knights and kings can in chess... < 1316335738 991984 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :either way. < 1316335744 540387 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :very simple. < 1316335745 984446 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to grasp... < 1316335781 542997 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh so you choose between them? < 1316335784 823662 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316335788 23359 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1316335795 670401 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah I see the confusion. < 1316335808 885353 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways what do you think about these prisms? < 1316335831 249062 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I basically used as a convenient to close some issues concerning arrow capture. < 1316335839 212859 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/used/used them/ < 1316335844 254586 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/convenient/convenient way/ < 1316335887 248710 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :prisms only have that effect on friendly fire, btw. < 1316335890 903113 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are not like arrows. < 1316335894 415434 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this makes them more vulnerable. < 1316335917 904786 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew gross special case, etc. < 1316335953 576487 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wis this game was ~elegant~ < 1316335956 361651 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wish < 1316335973 781768 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"all pieces are parenthetical lists" < 1316335989 613714 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :question: what makes something elegant? < 1316336010 824312 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :me saying it's elegant (thumbs up) < 1316336052 270806 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anyways if you can think of something better for the queen let me know. < 1316336068 816261 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it gives it queen-like attributes while allowing arrow capture so I think it's pretty solid. < 1316336095 868845 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :queeen like attributes like what < 1316336114 372083 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :being powerful offensively but weak defensively. < 1316336119 223353 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :er, no < 1316336126 688976 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not what it does. < 1316336128 123321 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty defensively powerful < 1316336130 774276 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has knight moves < 1316336148 374235 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :though the queen can escape from a bunch of things as well < 1316336157 121122 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is still vulnerable compared to arrows < 1316336170 342095 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are weird < 1316336172 781246 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not something you'd use < 1316336176 262441 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like < 1316336179 384832 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the beginning of the game < 1316336185 486692 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :My scouter indicates the prism has a power level over 9000. < 1316336194 351168 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because then every arrow decides to point at it, and it must flee. < 1316336213 33112 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: arrows are awesome. < 1316336227 225880 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are definitely all-around amazing defensive/offense. < 1316336278 303141 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :provided they have cannons... < 1316336346 933156 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are probably better defense than offense though, I think. < 1316336368 842394 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they can "block" cannon fire. < 1316336402 880959 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :from multiple sources. < 1316336415 277927 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals can only block from one direction at a time. < 1316336423 571884 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :which game are you discussing? < 1316336433 332659 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a chess variant I created. < 1316336436 748238 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1316336446 456653 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like... laser chess with portals. < 1316336451 2723 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa < 1316336459 218113 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, are there pirates and ninjas too? < 1316336468 272920 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately no. < 1316336470 781162 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :aww < 1316336474 172103 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if instead of special cases you had pirates and ninjas < 1316336478 402534 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would be less angry < 1316336479 383182 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...no < 1316336482 118456 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no special cases. < 1316336483 519205 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :just rules. < 1316336490 274648 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about the hidden state then < 1316336496 748685 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not a special case of anything. < 1316336499 844909 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just a rule. < 1316336506 568275 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, so you removed en passant (nfc about spelling) < 1316336506 918093 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i didn't say it was a special case < 1316336511 399725 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the distinction is completely pointless in a board game. < 1316336515 140202 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a special case in normal chess IMO < 1316336532 78713 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: actually haven't decided. pawns work like chess pawns but I dunno if they should have en passant. < 1316336542 326068 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :use checkerspieces or coins to mark active loops < 1316336558 166193 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: put a coin under each active component? < 1316336577 618341 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it legal to sell money? < 1316336579 860291 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, how are the lasers used? As weapons? < 1316336586 751608 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes they're the primary means of capture. < 1316336594 887836 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: as long as it makes the state explicit and works in all cases, sure < 1316336604 48925 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so you need hitpoints < 1316336605 119154 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eg... if you sell a toy with actual legal tender in the packaging. is that legal? < 1316336610 451684 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the rooks are cannons. the upside-down rook can fire a projectile in any diagonal direction. right-side up rook is the same but cardinal. < 1316336616 703311 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1316336630 826308 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, heh < 1316336635 212088 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably would attract many thiefs < 1316336651 339433 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a projectile will capture anything in its path up to the first thing it captures. < 1316336654 410227 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1316336659 160060 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :a weird way to word it I know. < 1316336667 391058 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, projectile? Doesn't sound like a laser < 1316336678 955212 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's... well it doesn't really matter how you view it. < 1316336692 973026 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an abstract path like thing < 1316336697 187794 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, anyway grenades. < 1316336700 153057 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :laser grenades! < 1316336700 354551 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a direction. < 1316336704 394670 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(no clue how that would work) < 1316336721 59712 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm afraid I already have most of the rules solidified minus some minor future revision perhaps. < 1316336724 95231 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to playtest. < 1316336726 727970 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1316336752 153063 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :remove en passant and i'll be hapey < 1316336756 755415 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, random idea: zombie chess < 1316336767 300821 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never liked castling being a thing either < 1316336772 274903 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah an interesting thing is that you portals. the knights. the direction of their nose indicates the opening of the portal < 1316336781 774917 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: castling is no longer thing. I'll remove en passant sure. < 1316336787 303670 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hurrey < 1316336790 299030 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe even the 2-square pawn thing. < 1316336796 853969 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1316336806 585500 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care as much about that though < 1316336808 619112 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about piece promotion? :D can more cool items be made? silly question i know < 1316336822 155308 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: no, no, and yes. < 1316336834 366342 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I think there are chess variants with zombie pieces. < 1316336837 645846 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1316336844 9353 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, bbl, need to leave for a while < 1316336847 951940 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: http://www.chessvariants.com/other.dir/nemoroth.html < 1316336848 979786 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1316336854 31064 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316336861 135858 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :when pawns (humans) go to the end of the board they're promoted to zombies. < 1316336862 180355 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :vorpal would probably like my lowbrow style of chess variation < 1316336866 190188 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1316336873 783386 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: heyo < 1316336886 582318 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: you're just jealous because my special cases make the game awesome in all ways. < 1316336892 235645 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :;_; < 1316336892 759611 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nyah!!! :P < 1316336903 153892 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also hidden state ;________; < 1316336925 125396 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like "state that is verbally declared and just needs to be remembered" < 1316336930 937115 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be a problematic rule for goldfishes. < 1316336937 630922 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FUNCTIONAL PYTHON <- awful idea? amazing idea? YOU DECIDE < 1316336942 269661 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats a false myth < 1316336960 180584 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mythbusters proved goldfish have good memory < 1316336972 230178 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: itidus21: there's one of those "hidden" states in regular chess < 1316336973 100103 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but maybe theres multiple kinds of memory < 1316336973 826149 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine. snakes. insects. anything. < 1316336981 743130 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Has this king moved yet?" < 1316336984 931862 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he taught a goldfish to run an obstacle course < 1316336993 731886 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: we also determined en passant was similar. < 1316336996 881531 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so maybe its not so much memory as conditioning < 1316336999 184328 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but whatever < 1316337032 596383 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Similar to Functional Python, or similar to deciding whether the king has moved yet? < 1316337036 321730 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but honestly if you can't remember where a loop is you probably should accidentally walk into it. < 1316337039 636846 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's neither really < 1316337064 881538 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: that is a possible design decision :) < 1316337065 435781 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and probably shouldn't be playing a game that's played with chess pieces and involves redirecting projectiles across the board. < 1316337069 828623 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can't remember if you've allocated/freed the memory........ < 1316337083 866943 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*imaginary projectiles < 1316337091 674412 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or what your values are < 1316337106 97105 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because your varaibales are mutable and there's manaul memroy memanagement with poeinters < 1316337111 631498 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of which I have a feeling portal chess AI is very difficult. < 1316337118 483869 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am implementing one of DMM's sorting algorithms in Python! < 1316337121 482464 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you're using c or something < 1316337137 542008 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1316337137 965430 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I occasionally use functional style in Python, but the syntax is very limiting. < 1316337143 524461 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also no tail call optimization. < 1316337152 348300 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess perl has the mutable variables but most of its inelegance is in other areas??? < 1316337168 200503 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: perl is beautiful if not elegant. < 1316337168 512467 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant an entirely functional version of python < 1316337175 762775 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well that's just weird. < 1316337175 781117 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1316337176 592958 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :weirdo. < 1316337180 440201 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Python is dysfunctional by design < 1316337184 827156 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :TCO is Unpythonic -- master guido < 1316337188 905928 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: er, not saying perl is elegant. < 1316337193 121754 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone who tries to fix this will face the wrath of guido < 1316337197 576736 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log unpythonic < 1316337201 66591 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2007-07-03.txt:20:27:55: bsmntbombdood: so? this is still unpythonic. Besides, it's clearly not the only stdout, otherwise you wouldn't need that __stdout__ thing. < 1316337208 747915 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1316337214 205123 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I meant "perl is beautiful, but definitely not elegant" < 1316337220 632042 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1316337228 241968 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the word is common < 1316337239 957349 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes pythonic is a term invented by pythonistas < 1316337242 147816 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a beautiful trainwreck < 1316337243 928858 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is another term invented by pythonistas. < 1316337261 874149 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pythonistas are lame. < 1316337266 70283 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I call them pyfaces < 1316337280 114298 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: if you want to get banned from a channel right now < 1316337288 979332 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :join #python, type "lol", press enter. < 1316337293 29565 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't called them anything consistently, but I've probably parroted "pythonistas" once or twice < 1316337305 162356 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been banned from 2 recently < 1316337305 509173 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy is a good parrot. < 1316337308 41064 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316337338 36382 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :##c-basic because of bad connection, and efnet #xna for being off topic and ranting < 1316337393 741967 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you need any evidence that Python users are style fascists, the "no lol" rule is it. < 1316337404 945533 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok here goes < 1316337415 619696 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION rubs hands together < 1316337431 135134 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can't possibly ban everyone that says lol, I think < 1316337442 721815 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The channel ban list would overflow < 1316337450 923905 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do. < 1316337459 528589 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably temporary bans < 1316337466 880997 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :most likely. < 1316337474 931345 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go in there every day and lol until you get permanently banned < 1316337482 291314 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise they'd ban some long-time visitors that accidentally say it. < 1316337490 433473 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Automate it. < 1316337493 102796 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: no I occasionally ask #python questions < 1316337496 951533 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and occasionally get good answers! < 1316337522 249619 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i left after taunting the quiet room < 1316337535 957547 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did you say < 1316337539 42218 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't really want to be banned bad enough to wait < 1316337553 214455 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said lol more euler problems needed < 1316337562 894204 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :banned from life < 1316337563 137862 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't really want to wait bad enough to be banned. < 1316337580 277133 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: they can still ban you even if you're not there you know. < 1316337590 907502 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i kinda assumed i would be banned when i did that < 1316337607 771739 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they should have a nololbot < 1316337633 450137 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that reminds me of the #jesus bot < 1316337640 144801 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the broken bad words filter < 1316337712 653131 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316337732 307498 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: did it need moar \b? < 1316337764 288162 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it banned when you said "ands" or "an s" < 1316337771 577546 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1316337777 670181 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ants" was special-cased not to ban < 1316337790 951811 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why those phrases. < 1316337797 326314 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was meant to ban on "anus", the baddest word, but I guess "anvs" is bad too < 1316337806 751223 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anqs < 1316337808 666245 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow like.... < 1316337815 456265 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you break something that badly. < 1316337819 369689 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you get that wrong. < 1316337857 568795 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :variants of "fuck" were also repeated everywhere, despite "fuck" itself being in the list of things to ban on even if it's within other words etc < 1316337870 53355 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :One time, yahoo's discussion board censored "breast" < 1316337871 608422 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :man christians sure are weird. < 1316337883 426121 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was not appreciated by women who wanted to talk about their chicken breasts < 1316337904 511221 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :chicken breasts? gross. < 1316337919 728147 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet they didn't censor other variants of the word < 1316337924 117837 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :where they genetically modified? < 1316337930 78007 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.... < 1316337931 334834 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*were < 1316338017 614186 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I challenge you to make a chess variant that is more elegant than mine. < 1316338031 744705 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh snap!!!!! < 1316338045 65323 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND YET RICH WITH COMPLEXITY AND FUN. < 1316338053 521232 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE < 1316338054 219732 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i could take you up on that s-expression chess < 1316338057 253954 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info JOIN :#esoteric < 1316338143 115728 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :K vs K. Can only capture diagonally. < 1316338148 165305 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno how it would go. < 1316338161 258766 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :K? < 1316338164 790271 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :king? < 1316338180 870529 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure of notations < 1316338228 227104 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno about king vs king stuff but I'd be willing to call it a stalemate < 1316338258 985964 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im not sure how my rules would override the usual king vs king rules < 1316338265 680926 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ultima is a neat chess variant. < 1316338267 812241 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :your rules? < 1316338286 679293 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly consisting of odd capturing rules. < 1316338288 773014 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"King vs King. Can only capture diagonally." < 1316338301 492528 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for example there's one type of rook that captures by moving /away/ from something adjacent to it. < 1316338326 156731 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and chameleons (bishop) can only capture pieces by using their capture rules. < 1316338343 414029 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1316338354 286871 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine it's actually cumbersome to play. < 1316338359 692014 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :UNLIKE PORTAL CHESS WHICH IS VERY GOOD. < 1316338364 316522 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1316338367 912005 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :-ahem- < 1316338374 321092 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :excuse me. < 1316338385 335487 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I remember you saying something about knigt-moves having direction? what's that about < 1316338396 590674 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :relevant if any of your pieces have knight moves and try stepping into portals < 1316338411 126312 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what happens when portals step into their counterparts < 1316338419 79736 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that invalid? < 1316338423 895801 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I suppose they have two different possible directions actually. < 1316338426 174387 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do they explode? < 1316338427 335234 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: they explode. < 1316338427 702746 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316338450 375506 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly useful as a suicide strategy but probably a really bad idea. < 1316338453 117909 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log explode < 1316338456 368472 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-09-28.txt:21:09:22: The LWSSes hit it and everything explodes. < 1316338626 40829 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: the portal direction could be made irrelevant for entrance perhaps. < 1316338645 340097 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or knights-likes could simply enter from two directions < 1316338649 748871 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: but then you've got really weird stuff < 1316338665 934462 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? < 1316338699 512443 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nevermind < 1316338709 672542 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually yes do mind it's really weird < 1316338727 680267 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(cannon)>>-------()-------<<(cannon) ()------<< < 1316338729 941601 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1316338748 346069 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: that doesn't breakanything. < 1316338753 830118 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how will you deal with bishop-movers and portals? is them switching to the other coloure just a natural thing? < 1316338757 906590 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1316338762 536328 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its kind of cool < 1316338802 384755 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to say something els ebut I forgot it < 1316338855 908007 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: portals can hop anywhere in a 3-square radius < 1316338865 963120 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus I don't see how bishop movement is a problem. < 1316338877 806200 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok? < 1316338899 219111 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooooh < 1316338900 822627 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1316338906 666524 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it doesn't matter. < 1316338921 292849 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact that would be a useful way to switch colors for arrows. < 1316338931 534244 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are the pieces that move like bishops < 1316338939 391073 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(possibly like queens in the future... I haven't decided) < 1316338946 197355 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :radius? :p < 1316338962 158912 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ok. radius] < 1316338977 315881 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :understood < 1316338977 858197 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably by chebyshev distance < 1316339054 2866 :DH____!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316339076 40505 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: is it chebyshev or is it manhattan or are you So Wrong < 1316339092 496646 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea what that means. < 1316339118 200586 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes < 1316339118 852560 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is your "3-square radius" measured by chebyshev distance or manhattan distance or are you Wrong < 1316339119 372093 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :chevyshev < 1316339119 721173 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i realized that it probably means 3 spaces in 8 directions when i said (ah ok. radius]) < 1316339123 751139 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cheby < 1316339176 586879 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :though perhaps 3 is a bit extreme? especially with hoppage. < 1316339195 941936 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok i see what chebyshev is < 1316339200 7675 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals can't capture can they < 1316339207 117243 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :directly, I mean < 1316339249 980551 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if portals trigger when hopping onto someone you could kill them by portalling dudes into active loops < 1316339270 603287 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1316339287 62576 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if portals trigger when hopping onto pieces you could kill them by portalling them into active loops < 1316339292 370258 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there < 1316339294 236322 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :less confusion < 1316339295 137224 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that < 1316339295 659111 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :time < 1316339297 262369 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, sort of. < 1316339307 798107 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't portal something to a loop though. < 1316339317 938820 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because moving the portal breaks the loop < 1316339318 984678 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1316339328 156860 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :however < 1316339330 396232 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I mean < 1316339331 438901 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a neat trick you can do. < 1316339334 512403 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :portal isn't part of the loop < 1316339339 424421 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the portal is pointing into the loop < 1316339349 778293 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay < 1316339351 679267 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that's possible < 1316339369 670458 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that;s one way to use loops offensively < 1316339390 970509 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also breaking a loop with the out-portal is very nice. < 1316339393 850946 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a little preparation you have an extremely mobile capturing machine < 1316339421 106711 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i guess you could also move portal into loop to get the thing worky < 1316339432 133680 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can hop three spaces, and change direction to release the project whose loop you just broke. < 1316339438 773816 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is actually kind of ridiculous. < 1316339443 85661 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you consider the possibilities. < 1316339446 921880 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm < 1316339450 415063 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right I remembered a thing < 1316339450 942166 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :about < 1316339453 684610 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I was going to say < 1316339454 380613 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :about < 1316339464 437161 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals where the in-portal triggers from any direction < 1316339465 735495 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is < 1316339472 972726 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you capture them? < 1316339479 40208 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yes. < 1316339481 836100 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a problem < 1316339487 473389 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I just need to define the movement rules well < 1316339494 138216 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :answer: a portal explosion (by portal suicide) < 1316339494 660895 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically even if you move like a knight you still have directionality. < 1316339513 59820 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :alternatively a prismed projectile < 1316339523 714952 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that works the same was on portals as arrows < 1316339528 241191 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but currently prismed projectiles do not kill portals. < 1316339531 952892 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316339540 82125 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...might change that? < 1316339540 775875 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they should for consistency < 1316339544 311174 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1316339555 914627 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway I think it'd be best to fix directionality anyway < 1316339559 500240 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, portals can still be killed when facing the wrong direction < 1316339566 891511 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :while arrows work from any direction < 1316339574 122614 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fix it how? < 1316339589 99981 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :to give every movement a direction < 1316339614 144079 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, yes, that's what I meant. < 1316339615 710577 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fior knights it could be the side in which they move more < 1316339618 83932 :DH____!~DH____@unaffiliated/dh----/x-6288474 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316339636 75934 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, no. knights could just have multiple entrance directions. < 1316339637 60649 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :since they move 2 in one direction and 1 in the other isn't it < 1316339645 884236 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works too < 1316339654 170695 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they enter from the applicable one? < 1316339656 995967 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1316339660 66265 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :same with portals < 1316339668 598169 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :who move like knights but with a chevyshev distance of 3 < 1316339702 450179 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no need to get incredibly detailed... < 1316339709 850258 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel it's a fairly intuitive notion. < 1316339716 367397 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do portals hopping onto things have a direction or do they always work or do they not work anymore < 1316339729 846333 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only thing that's not reall very intuitive so far is the bidirectional loop portal breakage rule thing. < 1316339753 540815 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :since portals turn whenever they hop I can see portal hops always working being fine < 1316339761 784150 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I was thinking if portals captured that would be how they capture. only able to capture in the direction they're facing. < 1316339778 503192 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's kind of weird < 1316339785 27056 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :intuitively they should just teleport whatever they land on. < 1316339904 102912 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably a bad idea to teleport things unless they die immediately on the other side. < 1316339920 545519 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1316339922 186343 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. there's a loop waiting for them? < 1316339924 105194 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have nothing to capture. < 1316339924 626620 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316339939 879560 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also the situation where killing the portal on the other side causes an explosion and kills a bunch of the opponents pieces. < 1316339947 345736 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they wouldn't want to capture said portal. < 1316339972 607353 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm imagining moving an enemy piece into any piece via portal will capture that piece < 1316339976 141362 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this way the portal explosion rule can be used for bargaining power. < 1316339988 743239 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess you could use enemy pieces to capture other enemy pieces? or your own pieces if you're dumb < 1316340001 74317 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm... it would capture enemy pieces but would be an illegal move otherwise I think. < 1316340014 212744 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :illegal? < 1316340022 362961 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :..yes because you can't capture your own pieces. < 1316340027 845917 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can;t??? < 1316340028 543161 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I would think not. < 1316340032 974009 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...not without projectiles. < 1316340034 714652 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not!! < 1316340034 886994 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I DON'T KNOW < 1316340040 104922 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAKES SENSE? < 1316340053 484736 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine okay you can elect to capture your own pieces. < 1316340056 727471 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a boss. < 1316340057 422835 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hurray < 1316340079 410544 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in this weird corner case where someone is directly in front of your portal and you teleport something to that portal it gets captured . < 1316340091 971109 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :this game is full of weird corner cases. < 1316340093 391277 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :most likely usually a bad move but getting rid of pawns which are in the way may prove useful < 1316340106 426313 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :naturally emerging corner cases, right? < 1316340110 644662 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316340114 877474 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not special exceptions in the rules good good < 1316340173 922570 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll have to list that as how the portals work. < 1316340175 161165 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to clarify. < 1316340178 655567 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not immediately obvious. < 1316340213 511606 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also if a piece moves through a portal it can continue moving on the other side, as you would expect I hope. < 1316340214 431042 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you note it in such a way to make it clear that it's natural and not just some other rule you made up!! < 1316340222 670754 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as it legaly has more squares that it can move in its turn. < 1316340226 98820 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*legally < 1316340241 197476 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right I was going to ask about that too < 1316340246 299237 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :with regard to direction changing and all < 1316340251 650537 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316340262 164861 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals are direction/location changers. < 1316340279 245270 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm... I wonder if I should include that. < 1316340281 588016 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it won't work with knightsmoves either right < 1316340282 865583 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if an arrow goes through a portal < 1316340290 997152 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it reorients to keep the same angle..... < 1316340294 489095 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that makes sense. < 1316340300 9180 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1316340306 848051 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean reorients and same angle < 1316340314 635900 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay so imagine you're the arrow < 1316340320 114268 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're facing up-right < 1316340324 924130 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you walk through a portal < 1316340335 21189 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are still going the same direction when you come out, but now facing a different way. < 1316340340 253178 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus.... your direction would change < 1316340346 925836 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :your absolutely direction < 1316340349 373357 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :-ly < 1316340357 620589 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that's what I was hoping < 1316340361 932671 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to reflect that your direction actually didn't change as you walked through the portal and reoriented. < 1316340363 675091 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless I interpreted you backwards < 1316340377 874535 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's a pretty complex thing to worry about. < 1316340398 828692 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also knight movers still have legal moves if they go through a portal. < 1316340405 222767 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just need to define knight moves properly < 1316340405 743321 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like if you're going left and facing left into a rightfacing portal and the outportal is up now you're going up and you're facing up < 1316340408 114246 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a series of single-square moves < 1316340411 395060 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for it to make sense. < 1316340413 840832 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :absolute-wise < 1316340426 75907 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316340438 557872 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a series of single-square moves? how will the leaping work then? < 1316340453 34631 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....uh, it just will. :P < 1316340458 924263 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::| < 1316340484 85271 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the prism can leap across pieces in the course of making its move" < 1316340488 590672 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1316340507 42025 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have to interpret it as a LITERAL series of single-square movements where you MUST have an EMPTY square. < 1316340516 121109 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the destination according to the knightsmoves rules and not being "here go three spaces leaping over stuff" < 1316340521 57868 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just to make the directions and portal stuff well-defined. < 1316340543 419183 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm? < 1316340544 115947 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked it better when it was a single move with two directions :( < 1316340556 316998 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the same thing... just different ways to say it. < 1316340566 303125 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really < 1316340589 711465 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will be way easier to comprehend when talking about portals. < 1316340593 10547 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easier to specify the knightsmove conditions for single moves than make a state machine to get three moves to obey the knightsmove rules < 1316340593 912606 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :who can move 3 squares. < 1316340628 113321 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I sense ing???? < 1316340630 823082 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....no it's the opposite of that. < 1316340635 232688 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what???????????????? < 1316340638 175239 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have only ONE direction entering the portal. < 1316340646 367384 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's all defined in terms of single square moves. < 1316340660 414256 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with your system you have two/three directions < 1316340667 34391 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes less sense. < 1316340687 127378 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :three directions? when's that? < 1316340709 122928 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :with your system you have to specify the second and third moves in terms of their predecessors < 1316340714 427288 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is ugly- gross < 1316340735 122850 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hard to follow < 1316340736 332957 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :.......? < 1316340754 414502 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and the three direction case is when you enter a portal on your second jump as a portal---oh wait that causes explosions < 1316340757 683968 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still a valid move I suppose < 1316340769 723066 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in my system knights leap over portals < 1316340782 489352 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they have to hop on them to teleport? < 1316340783 743807 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they leap over all other pieces < 1316340784 963486 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316340791 653145 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1316340799 440152 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then the direction doesn't matter with knights? < 1316340801 78097 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works. < 1316340804 651464 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you might complain about that. < 1316340821 822421 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :either it doesn't matter or it's one of the directions in which they traveled or it's the longer of the directions in which they traveled < 1316340821 993858 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also portals are not restricted to where they can land. < 1316340824 815675 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :either one < 1316340828 714339 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning they don't /have/ to move three squares. < 1316340834 344031 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can move one, or two. < 1316340836 896079 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1316340838 288908 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that ridiculous? < 1316340845 62751 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figured that when you said "within" rather than "at" < 1316340850 598500 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in "within a 3-square radius" < 1316340852 456196 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever it was < 1316340864 740127 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's like... being a queen and a knight 3 squares around you. < 1316340872 464603 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :granted you can't capture anything < 1316340875 292858 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess that's fine. < 1316340891 703966 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can pull off wickednasty stunts though!!! < 1316340896 517090 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316340908 800232 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the portal is mobile but by itself not effective. < 1316340910 206198 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's fine. < 1316340936 632086 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be silly if portals were not very good at jumping around and portalling things. < 1316340956 33105 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed!! < 1316340967 879078 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're currently the second most mobile in terms of sheer distance. arrows are the only pieces that can move an unlimited number of squares in a single direction. < 1316340996 405357 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this makes sense in this game. < 1316341004 242665 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to see it in action now < 1316341011 736856 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...how will you do that? < 1316341024 28626 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: you could write a program for it. :) < 1316341028 478626 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :an IRC bot. < 1316341030 487678 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :never < 1316341034 225015 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait irc bot what < 1316341039 11712 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would that even work < 1316341040 953286 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASCII board < 1316341042 922087 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :commands < 1316341042 940016 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be static animated < 1316341050 371403 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...yes/ < 1316341051 246051 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1316341058 886133 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be very spammy. < 1316341064 190638 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the spamest < 1316341064 530247 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but each turn it would print out the board. < 1316341074 913954 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean as in.. it could have an animation mocked up < 1316341077 254960 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would not be bad, say, in a separate channel. < 1316341082 924984 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: explain. < 1316341087 1149 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that even make sense in IRC. < 1316341089 976899 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and why do you need to animate it. < 1316341113 709796 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a game drawn frame by frame and saved as a gif or something for purpose of I need to see it in action now < 1316341131 716988 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. monqy can just play it with some friends IRL? < 1316341137 266511 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats friends < 1316341140 100316 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh.. < 1316341144 802292 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's how I'm going to playtest it. < 1316341148 585338 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some friends that like chess < 1316341152 338384 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm pretty sure they'd like this game. < 1316341161 428295 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they also like Portal... so... < 1316341167 538506 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do they like lasers < 1316341168 446257 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i used to have friends.. thats almost the same thing as having friends :-s < 1316341169 318917 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and hookah. < 1316341170 733061 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably. < 1316341174 947286 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a joke everyone loves lasers < 1316341192 648641 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if they like prisms. < 1316341197 326178 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1316341204 359265 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if the prism is a good piece... < 1316341207 897060 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :prisms _are_ nifty < 1316341213 441488 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean real prisms < 1316341222 742724 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am somewhat suspicious that they could be improved upon. < 1316341226 646867 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1316341245 298970 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but something needs to capture arrows... < 1316341257 328633 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :can normal pieces not? < 1316341270 907396 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :currently that includes: pawn, king, and queen < 1316341275 529518 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :aahh < 1316341280 863916 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/queen/prism/ < 1316341293 735467 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are bishopes agian i forgot < 1316341296 948150 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows. < 1316341302 536413 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1316341314 321895 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :moved it from sharpied pawns, then? good < 1316341316 61510 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I changed the piece roles a bit near the end of brainstorming. < 1316341317 823813 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316341348 231702 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :queenside rook is the d-cannon, kingside rook is the c-cannon < 1316341353 788682 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's diagonal and cardinal. < 1316341367 536570 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :d-cannon is upside down. < 1316341470 193199 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :these designations may change entirely. needs more playtesting. < 1316341488 183070 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a cannon that fires in all directions seems bad to me. < 1316341495 348211 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then prisms basically do that are more mobile... < 1316341521 219348 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :still they're not offensively mobile in that they need to be in a projectile path to be effective. < 1316341548 248082 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...except when they're just hopping around capturing normally. < 1316341553 619811 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is one of their advantages as well. < 1316341588 509226 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a very effective anti-arrow piece. but not something that's invincible itself. < 1316341644 220330 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was imagining it'd be a pretty good piece for staying in some degree of saftey and sniping at the enemy < 1316341662 158182 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1316341670 447580 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's kind of why I want portals to not be affected by prisms < 1316341671 147375 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as with some assistance it can do what queen-captures without moving itself < 1316341687 461304 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals could be used to defend against prisms then. < 1316341727 464847 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :only if they're facing the right direction!! < 1316341729 50717 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can otherwise just destroy anything in three different paths without having to move out of safety. < 1316341732 154984 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: right < 1316341765 979349 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yeah leaving portals unaffected by prisms would be a nice balance I think. < 1316341830 400242 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows defend against cannon fire, prisms can kill arrows, but regular cannon fire can kill prisms < 1316341857 531714 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals can defend against anything in which it's facing. < 1316341871 85984 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(...results may vary on the other end of the portal. :P ) < 1316341897 695116 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1316341901 882319 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a thing < 1316341922 481346 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes a thing. < 1316341923 737208 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is this chess or a wargame < 1316341926 610110 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens when you have two corresponding portals pointing into each other and someone somehow gets into one of them, say by knightsmoves < 1316341932 913330 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: what is a wargame < 1316341945 5910 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :like panzer general and stratego and so on < 1316341946 223019 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: oh my. < 1316341952 743240 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: explosions? < 1316341957 200482 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: uh...... < 1316341959 970261 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh....... < 1316341962 12982 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah explosions. < 1316341964 890669 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :woohoo < 1316341972 733396 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :explosions are cures for all forms of paradox. < 1316341992 67447 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: stargate rules? < 1316341995 240542 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: uh I'd say it's chess-like < 1316341997 877734 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would be a funny premise for a time travel game < 1316342000 533962 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any applicable rule? < 1316342002 133459 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mess up? EXPLOOOSION < 1316342007 50500 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: never seen it < 1316342020 730000 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont think anything like that ever happened < 1316342027 587383 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but stargate is much like a portal < 1316342033 856259 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: it could just be like illegal or something... < 1316342047 774240 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :illegal is boring < 1316342058 232392 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also how should diagonal movement work through a portal that isn't facing diagonal < 1316342063 879958 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so long as you're making an exception for it, might as well make it explodey < 1316342066 761632 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or similarly with cardinal movement. < 1316342091 163632 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: oh right that was a thing I was going to ask you about. when I was thinking about bishopmovement/portals < 1316342104 834822 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, for example < 1316342108 918416 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a king goes through a portal < 1316342114 930081 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the out-portal is diagonally facing < 1316342119 810672 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :then he should come out right in front of it. < 1316342124 588534 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no problem. < 1316342141 571856 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so < 1316342149 478919 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bishopmove attempt to reorient? explosion < 1316342153 216020 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe things should just always come out on the square adjacent to the portals opening < 1316342156 929931 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then they continue movement from there. < 1316342172 658242 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rookmove attempt to reorient. either way. < 1316342185 673660 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR < 1316342198 770524 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe they continue along the path the portal points them? as a strategic element. < 1316342209 155972 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so a diagonally moving arrow goes through a portal and comes out a portal that's facing in a cardinal direction < 1316342212 702146 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at which point it continues cardinally. < 1316342215 416169 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then they're back to normal after stopping movemntn? < 1316342219 117202 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1316342220 684129 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works < 1316342228 542254 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :best solution < 1316342234 684748 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes allows for shenanigans. < 1316342264 156595 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....wow these rules are ridiculously complicated. < 1316342279 925584 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the implications on this rule is huge < 1316342285 173273 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll be fun trying to explain it all to my friends. < 1316342307 785897 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it really only affects arrows. < 1316342318 353698 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of which there arenot many < 1316342319 653928 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1316342347 83532 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I decide to make something else that isn't a knight-mover or a king-mover < 1316342357 919458 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or which doesn't explode upon going through a portal. < 1316342365 687716 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it would follow that rule as well. < 1316342375 374026 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e., a rook-like could go diagonally. < 1316342391 500448 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION blinks < 1316342400 92915 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that is hardcore < 1316342414 260572 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there are no rooklikes. < 1316342428 141320 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :changing the frame of reference of a chesspiece surely doesn't happen a lot < 1316342456 364118 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is king-like, knight-hop-hop, pawns, or bishop-like < 1316342462 742547 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow. rotating a piece via portal < 1316342499 595614 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: also I realized that the whole angle-reorienting stuff is kind of pointless since you can just change directions at the end of the turn anyways. < 1316342528 485767 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1316342543 867796 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes it a bit less complicated < 1316342547 437146 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I make re-angling take a whole turn? seems kind of... lame. < 1316342562 277480 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's fine as-is < 1316342569 347035 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well this frame of reference thing would be more meaningful in a game with regular pieces < 1316342588 946727 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes but then no projectile shenanigans and loops. < 1316342609 115509 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im just imagining pawns rotated to walk to the walls < 1316342616 692865 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1316342619 473477 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they change back to normal at turn-end < 1316342620 577343 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"walls"? < 1316342622 143348 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :walls < 1316342622 465272 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1316342628 504618 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry.. side panels < 1316342631 309157 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :the chess board is surrounded by infinitely high walls of infinitely thick concrete < 1316342634 334620 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"side panels"? < 1316342635 829905 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :spectator stands of rome < 1316342637 984363 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1316342638 683048 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1316342639 596539 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if < 1316342640 464770 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could move < 1316342642 576856 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :caesar looks on < 1316342642 959955 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :-between the squares- < 1316342645 87365 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :along the edges and corners < 1316342651 263960 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu: woah dude < 1316342653 313301 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually considering that rome probably never saw chess < 1316342659 679211 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :changing back to normal at turn end is how you avoid a choice between hidden state and sharpieing your pawns!!! < 1316342675 617405 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't even make sense for them to continue moving that way afterwards. < 1316342689 26749 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOES AGAINST THE LAWS OF PORTAL CHESS PHYSICS. < 1316342703 645970 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :glados has infected the system < 1316342719 7403 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1316342737 389022 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I'm picturing a simple 'chess with portals' variant now. < 1316342760 224319 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also if you a have a portal adjacent to a king < 1316342771 115547 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any time the linked portal can be captured you're in check. < 1316342790 907805 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :FIDE rules except both teams start with a them-coloured portal on a tile in their third rank. a portal moves to any unoccupied tile. you can move a piece onto a portal and it continues out the other side like the two tiles were in fact right together < 1316342815 608485 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly make both portals neutral instead of owned by a side and add 'no repeating an earlier state' as a rule < 1316342824 233228 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :help where's directionality of portals. < 1316342824 407099 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi I have not tested my game at all < 1316342861 85493 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do find adding a concept of direction to chess to be interesting. < 1316342864 850116 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :could explore that with other variants. < 1316342871 615648 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric-chess? :P < 1316342890 440637 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume they'd never be rotated < 1316342893 328149 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you could add that easily < 1316342916 667690 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :portals have an orientation, you can move it to any tile or change its orientation as your turn. when you go into one portal you look at what its orientation is re: the other one and that's how much it angles by < 1316342942 645259 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lolwat < 1316342967 326182 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@h193n5c1o291.bredband.skanova.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1316342968 742892 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu is not allowed to write rules for portal chess. < 1316342969 224142 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@h193n5c1o291.bredband.skanova.com QUIT :Changing host < 1316342969 242348 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster JOIN :#esoteric < 1316342970 882699 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :example, if both portals face north then there's zero difference so you go through unchanged. if one is bent 90 degrees then going through one bends you 90 degrees < 1316342971 583943 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316342973 405572 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then! < 1316342976 667282 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :!!!!! < 1316342978 61543 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION storms off in a huff. through a portal < 1316342981 720541 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION closes it behind him < 1316342999 801643 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could have chess with a portal gun < 1316343002 620509 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the portal gun is directional < 1316343007 597961 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1316343009 400933 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then fires portals on the infinite concrete walls < 1316343012 734765 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i considered portal gun earlier but stayed silent :D < 1316343013 538321 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : vorpal would probably like my lowbrow style of chess variation <-- oh? < 1316343023 343763 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :(was the last line I saw before putting computer to sleep) < 1316343053 861767 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't completed any though < 1316343068 761549 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21, what is your lowbrow style of chess? < 1316343094 235116 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :he drools on the pieces. < 1316343104 304092 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1316343105 350678 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric : CakeProphet, are there pirates and ninjas too? < 1316343106 486022 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :lowbrow style of chess makes me think of the version of chess played in...sweden? germany? someplace like that. where you throw a piece of wood underarm across a field and try to hit your enemy's king with it < 1316343122 836408 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric : what if instead of special cases you had pirates and ninjas i would be less angry < 1316343124 876775 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, that isn't chess, that is kubb I think < 1316343128 108565 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316343128 611857 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :kubb < 1316343129 335275 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, very different from chess < 1316343141 801536 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might be confusing it with a hhgttg joke < 1316343144 782282 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol patashu < 1316343149 171489 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :soon I will publish my chess variant and no one will play chess anymore < 1316343155 555552 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they will only play PORTAL CHESS!!!!!!111111111 < 1316343173 907243 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, I mean, it has nothing to do with chess. Apart from being a game. It is normally played between two teams. < 1316343192 20238 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION fantasizes about his future fame as a renowned chess variant writer. < 1316343192 197205 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway it is from Sweden, I played it once. I suck at it. < 1316343223 125730 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :spend 10 years becoming a kubb grandmaster < 1316343228 536286 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and complain about how no one appreciates this game anymore < 1316343233 275166 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1316343271 181150 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Patashu, wikipedia indicates it is common in Germany too at least. < 1316343304 244522 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that Wikipedia says nothing about portal chess. < 1316343329 359929 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: if you're checking wikipedia thats because you're afraid of the nasty truths you'll find in google < 1316343333 480646 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, and? < 1316343336 73175 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which i havent checked) < 1316343338 750033 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portal:Chess < 1316343340 180599 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the same. < 1316343344 348341 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1316343370 447832 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm just revelling in my ego right now having just created something entirely new to the world. < 1316343377 489478 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pay no mind. < 1316343390 231378 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, sounds like a combination of chess and Portal. < 1316343397 646043 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes... < 1316343407 230296 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: this isn't a competitor... but... worth looking at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dav9OyEORk4 < 1316343407 499979 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :new things are usually resynthesized from previous ideas. < 1316343412 370918 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this doesn't make them any less original. < 1316343443 67482 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :speaking of games, I recently played Bastion. Very impressive game. Innovative. < 1316343461 575273 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it is right up there with Braid in terms of games being art. < 1316343640 984891 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: ok heres the first bitter taste of your competition. but don't lose hope too easily. http://blog.chess.com/balifid/portal-chess < 1316343672 526682 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316343676 261076 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't even have guns though < 1316343683 179681 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not exactly a big threat < 1316343797 987260 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.quora.com/How-might-one-add-portals-to-chess -- curious < 1316344002 782721 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that doesn't look like a good game. < 1316344013 758979 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now this is a badass idea http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtcGiZelPfk < 1316344098 310111 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :bahaha < 1316344157 538051 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good game * good game = good game < 1316344181 371207 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I would be a good game designer actually. < 1316344194 277321 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done some brainstorming on an Android game I've thought about. < 1316344198 147920 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive been following super mario very closely < 1316344200 560757 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind of a metroid-like game. < 1316344207 387522 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a puzzle game. < 1316344213 156323 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so im excited to see a video of super mario with portals < 1316344224 930292 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :action-puzzle game. < 1316344236 994277 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with things like time dilation missiles. < 1316344256 91304 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and... other things I haven't thought of. time dilation missiles are basically the main idea I've got. < 1316344288 140610 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lemme check my notes... < 1316344303 455242 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so combining themes from laserchess with original loops idea with portals and i think it is likely you're onto something original < 1316344351 12368 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :....I think this is an original chess variant already. < 1316344366 257169 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats what i meant to say < 1316344366 988083 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will need to playtest it but the game seems pretty complete to me. < 1316344376 891712 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cant find any obvious copies < 1316344401 286684 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't even know about laserchess actually. < 1316344417 547310 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :laser chess is more strictly about bouncing lasers everywhere. < 1316344423 169282 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :each piece reflects differently. < 1316344459 523992 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :man I need to sleep. < 1316344464 965616 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :too much thinking about portal chess < 1316344467 212404 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not enough homeworkdone. < 1316344582 260988 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Little known fact: knights in chess travel over other pieces by rocket jumping." < 1316344646 800260 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus21: also what is L2 < 1316344659 774163 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1316344669 890157 :itidus21!~itidus21@120.147.173.44 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2L http://codu.org/eso/2l/README < 1316344783 259109 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: there is now such a thing as portal chess. Obviously you are as excited as I am right now. < 1316344840 492215 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i _do_ have to consider the possibility that the CakeProphet is a lie. < 1316344868 870035 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: no no it's real all the paradoxes cause explosions. < 1316344875 237716 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is fine. < 1316344876 197337 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1316344880 750275 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does SK do the same as KI in a different way? < 1316344887 321671 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: yes < 1316344895 890690 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERESTING < 1316344898 6313 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ALSO WEIRD < 1316344902 831839 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lazy evaluation, anyhow < 1316344904 280301 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t const id < 1316344905 19297 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b. b -> a -> a < 1316344910 141604 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ap const < 1316344910 799087 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b a. (b -> a) -> b -> b < 1316344934 336679 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in (strict) unlambda they're slightly different in what can be evaluated. < 1316344977 651160 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ap const (const id) < 1316344978 386010 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm really thinking in terms of MIBBLLII < 1316344978 425888 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b. b -> b < 1316344999 701374 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ap const undefined < 1316345000 398702 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b. b -> b < 1316345086 296277 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :see I'm tempted to not listen to monqy and gives knights directionality to their movements < 1316345112 3328 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that the adjacent portals with infinitely teleporting knight situation can't happen. < 1316345147 643115 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, infinitely teleporting prism, which can move like a knight. < 1316345180 55694 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next: Portal Monopoly < 1316345203 694023 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah... monqy's rule causes more problems than the way I wanted to do it. < 1316345277 771120 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, monqy's rule it is, then? < 1316345344 786261 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which ap is lambdabot's ap? < 1316345358 864020 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's more than one? < 1316345359 422677 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the usual one... < 1316345361 735724 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle ap < 1316345361 911178 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad ap :: Monad m => m (a -> b) -> m a -> m b < 1316345362 81662 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Graph.Inductive.Query.ArtPoint ap :: Graph gr => gr a b -> [Node] < 1316345362 99664 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Arrow app :: ArrowApply a => a (a b c, b) c < 1316345453 238295 :Taneb_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316345453 761212 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'd like to be able to apply Arrows to each other." "There's an app for that." < 1316345479 388078 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316345482 693596 :Taneb_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad, I presume? < 1316345485 730025 :Taneb_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net NICK :Taneb < 1316345493 34022 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yes < 1316345555 289567 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are weird. < 1316345623 852694 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I understand they're like monads but tuplier < 1316345713 982767 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows = category + applicative + some extra laws < 1316345725 367983 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no bind, unless you have arrowapply < 1316345751 369966 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case they're equivalent to monads < 1316346122 608198 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1316346160 281947 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I should play Braid < 1316346166 760686 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, yeah it is awesome < 1316346229 22309 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-221-248.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316346242 246373 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-209-4.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316346286 341905 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: what was the other game someone was talking about? < 1316346294 241949 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, Bastion? < 1316346307 80208 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1316346310 52722 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :deadly death something. < 1316346313 220262 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft? magicka? Deus Ex? < 1316346318 167201 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet, oh, dead island? < 1316346323 711722 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1316346338 814426 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :harry potter and the deadly hallows (I heard it was shit) < 1316346353 550633 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: wow imagine that. < 1316346371 410758 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deadly Rooms of Death < 1316346377 380952 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :never heard of that < 1316346380 260955 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :what sort of game is it? < 1316346399 996756 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :well *googles* < 1316346405 681036 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, released in 1997 < 1316346980 542541 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316347913 451159 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: you've played magicka? < 1316347920 203377 :CakeProphet!~adam@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a favorite of mine. < 1316348018 249375 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-d932d3ef.pool.mediaWays.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316348726 747420 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :harry potter and the deadly rooms of death < 1316348732 867868 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :he even gets a Really Big Sword < 1316348746 352809 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :and has to sm.. sl... well it kind of works! < 1316348946 548608 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316349076 202164 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know any combinatory logic system things other than BCKW and SKI? < 1316349083 866630 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Iota's < 1316349119 187335 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're all equivalent anyway :downs: < 1316349186 825822 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: there are a bunch of single-combinator bases, e.g. Fokker's X combinator < 1316349190 566206 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :... his paper also has a few alternative single-combinator bases he compares against < 1316349237 844259 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, any complete combinatory logic system is equivalent to all the other complete ones < 1316349254 749593 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that doesn't really make it any less interesting < 1316349750 92866 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316349815 249101 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-16-223.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1316349815 267034 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-16-223.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1316349815 267143 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316349909 406841 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: there's one without K that is not equivalent but nonetheless TC < 1316349946 705552 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: also, if you look at it the right way, Underload is one < 1316350043 290410 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(curry (i think) proved it TC by showing you could approximate K well enough for numbers, or something like that) < 1316350163 402626 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, hm. What do you mean with equivalent if not equivalent computational class? < 1316350181 909137 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it cannot express the same lambda terms < 1316350185 664957 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1316350219 625378 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combinatory_logic#CLK_versus_CLI_calculus < 1316350325 296884 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, interesting < 1316350580 622313 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle (a -> a) -> [a] -> [a] < 1316350580 972036 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude iterate :: (a -> a) -> a -> [a] < 1316350581 144447 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List iterate :: (a -> a) -> a -> [a] < 1316350581 162418 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude map :: (a -> b) -> [a] -> [b] < 1316350631 309668 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: do you want something different from map? < 1316350645 352911 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to modify the head only < 1316350652 262450 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1316350685 728213 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a distinct lack of functions that act separately on head and tail < 1316350700 262238 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List.NonEmpty doesn't seem to have it either < 1316350743 887267 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t uncurry (:) . first ?f . splitAt 1 < 1316350744 759906 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (?f::[a] -> a) => [a] -> [a] < 1316350750 439380 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1316350777 715165 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well, it's easy to write < 1316350821 157635 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should it be a noöp or an error on [] < 1316350894 190879 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would depend on your use case, wouldn't it < 1316350913 751044 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just thinking what makes more sense for the general case < 1316350972 404793 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :noop can easily be converted to the other form < 1316350999 322232 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t uncurry (:) . first (map ?f) . splitAt ?n < 1316351000 100299 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b. (?f::[b] -> b, ?n::Int) => [[b]] -> [[b]] < 1316351014 16072 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :er < 1316351018 372995 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t uncurry (++) . first (map ?f) . splitAt ?n < 1316351019 67062 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b. (?f::b -> b, ?n::Int) => [b] -> [b] < 1316351070 296009 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t uncurry (++) . (map ?f *** map ?g) . splitAt ?n < 1316351070 990285 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall b a. (?f::a -> b, ?g::a -> b, ?n::Int) => [a] -> [b] < 1316351089 396678 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :moar generaller < 1316351346 961934 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316351349 222337 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle [a] -> Int -> Ordering < 1316351349 569334 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude (!!) :: [a] -> Int -> a < 1316351349 587273 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List (!!) :: [a] -> Int -> a < 1316351349 744391 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List genericIndex :: Integral a => [b] -> a -> b < 1316351434 981190 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t null . drop n < 1316351435 681630 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `Int' against inferred type `Expr' < 1316351435 855189 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the first argument of `drop', namely `n' < 1316351435 873801 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the second argument of `(.)', namely `drop n' < 1316351438 135267 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t null . drop ?n < 1316351438 817462 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (?n::Int) => [a] -> Bool < 1316351511 994369 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map (null . drop 5) ["LESS","EQUAL","GREATER"] < 1316351513 488640 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [True,True,False] < 1316351553 336809 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316352096 784574 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1316354264 197183 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1316355090 728565 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am fucking terrible at combinatory logic < 1316355100 28121 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.angelfire.com/tx4/cus/combinator/birds.html < 1316355112 220518 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I go through the process of evaluating Bluebird ((S(KS))K) to f x y < 1316355134 551595 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should turn it into (f (g x)) since that's what B does < 1316355144 380714 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I have no idea what receives what first and how much of it it wants and blah blah blah < 1316355151 526588 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even thouhg I can look at the page and be like oh, S does this and K does this < 1316355157 8025 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au PRIVMSG #esoteric :My head is fucked by actually trying to do it < 1316355496 396306 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316356193 834389 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Quit: MSN: Patashu@hotmail.com , Gmail: Patashu0@gmail.com , AIM: Patashu0 , YIM: patashu2 . < 1316358364 607041 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1316360211 115242 :MSleep!~fyrc@or-67-238-31-252.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1316360906 520657 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316361690 702083 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316362114 620771 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316362123 734942 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1316362153 870547 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, I almost had the middle name Elliott? < 1316362245 791550 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb Elliott Somethingorother < 1316362340 508446 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My initials would have been N.G.E.vD. < 1316362372 567790 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so mcuh name < 1316362692 239490 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: 's name is now Ngevd. < 1316362695 381654 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have here a record of the songs from Disney's the Jungle Book < 1316362699 74467 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net NICK :Ngevd < 1316362808 711334 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you pronounce your name, Ngevd? < 1316362995 980957 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :First is a velar nasal < 1316363033 261968 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then an open-mid front unrounded vowel < 1316363053 938062 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then a voiced labiodental fricative < 1316363093 327031 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then a voiced alveolar plosive < 1316363098 344229 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd < 1316363118 562958 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh good. I was afraid the 'g' might be pronounced independently of the 'ng' < 1316363144 314567 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316363198 458600 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A bit like ng-ev'd < 1316363252 601038 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone know how to convert an LP into an iPod compatible format? < 1316363287 441845 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316363309 254763 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :LP? < 1316363320 494936 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're probably stuck with finding a player with line-out and recording. < 1316363330 292442 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :If there exist players with line out :P < 1316363350 910490 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't be too difficult to make < 1316363361 533254 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, I am not one of life's makers < 1316363372 552456 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it probably quite difficult to buy < 1316363393 343616 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But how else will I listen to Eagles Greatest Hits Volume 2 while on the move? < 1316363401 891449 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.thinkgeek.com/electronics/digital-conversion/c7fd/ < 1316363417 559604 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can probably get these for less than this retarded price too :P < 1316363445 99271 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there's actually someone near HEXHAM, THE CAPITAL OF ESOTERIC PROGRAMMING who does it for a living < 1316363513 150056 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Last summer I converted a bunch of beta tapes to DVD < 1316363662 587010 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've once built the correct analog filter to make a regular line out into something that can be plugged into the "usual" LP player input of an amplifier (because the amplifier in question was from the 1970s or so and didn't really have any sensible "aux" inputs for a computer); the inverse shouldn't be too tricky. < 1316363744 158223 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"First, any self-respecting audiophile would be embarrassed to admit using a USB turntable, as there are no high-end models." < 1316363935 494207 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what if you're not an audiophile :P < 1316363973 790043 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you are unimportant and not worth an answer, I believe. (I'm speaking from the viewpoint of this document, you understand.) < 1316363987 632736 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, you only need about $1000 to do it almost right, that's not too bad. < 1316364074 372196 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or $100 if you already have a good analog turntable.) < 1316364092 464218 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric : I think there's actually someone near HEXHAM, THE CAPITAL OF ESOTERIC PROGRAMMING who does it for a living < 1316364103 784055 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dude, Helsinki is the capital. < 1316364108 352107 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at all the Finns here. < 1316364113 104528 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about this: What if the LP format sucks ass, your records have been sitting around for years and are probably scuffed anyway, and audiophiles are retardedly trying to preserve what amounts to white noise? < 1316364229 859634 :impomatic!~digital_w@168.4.113.87.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316364233 168106 :impomatic!~digital_w@168.4.113.87.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi :-) < 1316364413 489433 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: Let us discuss the correct procedure for converting LP -> FLAC < 1316364491 528396 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The correct procedure is: you put the LP into a flatbed scanner, scan it as a Windows .bmp file, and then rename that file to .flac. < 1316364586 572223 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :*clap clap* < 1316364608 681750 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote Let us discuss the correct procedure for converting LP -> FLAC The correct procedure is: you put the LP into a flatbed scanner, scan it as a Windows .bmp file, and then rename that file to .flac. < 1316364610 302232 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :669) Let us discuss the correct procedure for converting LP -> FLAC The correct procedure is: you put the LP into a flatbed scanner, scan it as a Windows .bmp file, and then rename that file to .flac. < 1316364654 885378 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? It's lossless! < 1316364754 396346 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it isn't. The scanner will introduce some noise < 1316364764 195246 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the very least some thermal noise < 1316364801 901763 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even if you get rid of that you have various quantum noise thingies < 1316364997 87959 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, no, it's called "free LOSSLESS audio codec". < 1316365014 818992 :impomatic!~digital_w@168.4.113.87.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's LP, apart from "Limited Process"? :-) < 1316365042 16872 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Long Playing < 1316365153 294142 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic, which in this case refer to a type of gramophone record < 1316365326 252570 :ive!~nn@189.179.246.222 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316365914 936027 :impomatic!~digital_w@168.4.113.87.dyn.plus.net QUIT :Quit: impomatic < 1316365929 196398 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :We really need better terms for degrees of lossiness. < 1316365943 580552 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since it's not the /format/ that causes loss, it's the /conversion/. < 1316365965 886856 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :FLAC is lossless, but converting from an LP can't be, GIF is lossless but only supports a 256-color palette ... < 1316366526 972068 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assuming we're inside a simulation anyway, converting from an LP sure can be lossless. < 1316367135 472151 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION ponders again the perennial question of what ais' middle name is. < 1316367723 412359 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, does it matter? < 1316367754 985781 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Irene. His parents ... they weren't so good with names. < 1316367801 496802 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, why? What if the simulation runs on a analogue computer? < 1316367819 18156 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor, not implausible, given that he did say that his parents gave both him and his brother gender-neutral names, although not his sister. < 1316367873 652018 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :My guess is "I-don't-have-a-middle-name" is his middle name. < 1316367901 640232 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Irene" is not a gender-neutral name :P < 1316368060 604399 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316368076 67699 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should become a magical girl. < 1316368096 965741 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :... who? < 1316368111 130878 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEVERYONE < 1316368175 686216 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1316368178 469343 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymee, aha, your sock is revealed! < 1316368220 915470 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand windows IO handling. When windows is under heavy disk load, other programs that seemingly should not need to access the disk respond slowly too, that doesn't happen under linux. < 1316368224 746629 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :same disk too < 1316368233 144191 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wtf < 1316368256 12946 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :My what? < 1316368563 602090 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316368954 788440 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316369170 825744 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh yeah, I changed my name < 1316369174 660197 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net NICK :Ngevd < 1316369182 503838 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome back, Ngevd! < 1316369966 105509 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1316370251 119526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1316370258 413006 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/bifunctors/0.1.2/doc/html/Data-Bifunctor-Apply.html < 1316370267 4000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's your (three ampersands) < 1316370289 370555 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :f [three ampersands] g == ((f,g) <<.>>) < 1316370313 923464 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah I noticed that earlier today < 1316370325 293390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Hideous name though < 1316370330 541151 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also filed a bug about the fact that his definitions aren't as lazy as Control.Arrow's < 1316370377 702345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And here I am thinking I'm a genius for realising that what you wanted were essentially Biapplicatives, going to check bifunctors for a detail I needed to write them down, and then noticing they were already there :P < 1316370391 339852 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still need Trifunctors though right??? < 1316370402 680970 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also it's missing `both`. :p < 1316370431 470371 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :join (uncurry (<<.>>)) < 1316370467 897050 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Yes, which is not nice to use < 1316370483 494216 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus giving it a name :-P < 1316370497 485392 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep :-P < 1316370521 130896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be nice if Data.Bifunctor.Apply exported bilift = (<<.>>) < 1316370526 541697 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316370531 245358 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least I wouldn't want to write ((f,g) <<.>>) < 1316370567 633586 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/bifunctors/0.1.2/doc/html/Data-Bitraversable.html Prize to the first person to find a use for these :P < 1316370592 802411 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do electronics disintegrate in my hands? < 1316370643 615904 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: But I was thinking (before I realised all this) that I could snap up the "combinators" name on Hackage, since it's not taken; then I could include nice things like (.:) too. < 1316370658 815341 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And names for flip (.) and flip ($). < 1316370664 594966 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :How cunning < 1316370674 223773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I detect sarcasm < 1316370713 321943 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, more sinful than cunning < 1316370726 999990 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What part is sinful < 1316370730 739913 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Claiming the combinators name? < 1316370731 961598 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :"combinators" < 1316370738 458863 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing should be called that :-P < 1316370752 515596 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Got a good old email account phishing mail < 1316370759 516739 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Completely generic < 1316370770 323694 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: What would you call something that defined all the birds in To Mock a Mockingbird, except with reasonable names so they're not birds < 1316370779 226447 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :birdlike-combinators < 1316370787 440045 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When people reply, is there database automatically or manually filled? < 1316370791 809382 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I UNBIRDED THEM < 1316370810 401069 :SgeoN1!~AndChat@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would happen if I said my password is FUCKPHISHERS < 1316370832 426741 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/User:Ncrazyj isn't as good as some of the spam we've been getting, but I'm about to delete it, so if you care about saving a copy you'd better look now < 1316370874 19707 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank you kindly < 1316370950 537579 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can I delete it now, then? < 1316370963 171951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Absolutely not. (Yes, I doubt I can stop you anyway.) < 1316370971 153477 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(diff) (hist) . . N Talk:Brainlove‎; 23:47 . . (+102) . . Maharba (Talk | contribs) (New page: Don't let User:Phantom Hoover see this. —~~~~) < 1316370972 892302 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sage words < 1316370984 445500 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was hoping the word love would keep him away... --Aptennap 07:14, 18 September 2011 (UTC) < 1316370986 884392 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTHING CAN SAVE YOU < 1316371007 280673 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I raged at it in-channel < 1316371033 548536 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although not very hard, as raging ais523 looks much the same as normal ais523 < 1316371035 807519 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :We need to seriously deincentivise the creation of BF derivatives somehow. < 1316371037 678977 :mycrofti1!~ircguy@h69-128-47-242.mdsnwi.dedicated.static.tds.net NICK :mycroftiv < 1316371049 102042 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, if you make a brainfuck derivative, you have to provide a translation of your page in Swahili. < 1316371053 285549 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's not like all these BF derivatives hurt anyone < 1316371056 82798 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE88F59.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316371061 745262 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it helps get their authors into esolangs < 1316371065 53310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: They hurt me. < 1316371158 982089 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do MIBBLLII and I hate your bf-derivative I really do count as branfuck derivatives? < 1316371186 461176 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked I hate your bf-derivative I really do before it turned out that the author actually likes BF derivatives < 1316371192 219769 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1316371284 282935 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:52:17: bleh, a search for "which punctuation marks are uppercase?" gave me no results < 1316371287 449289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: try ask jeeves < 1316371295 815994 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:57:59: Is there any standard function for "foldr (.) id"? < 1316371298 782849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, I forgot that existed < 1316371302 439221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ala Endo foldMap [succ, succ] 99 < 1316371303 137154 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: `foldMap' < 1316371306 148662 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ala Endo mconcat [succ, succ] 99 < 1316371306 844783 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `(a -> a) -> Data.Monoid.Endo a' < 1316371307 21790 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : again... < 1316371308 761179 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> mconcat [succ, succ] 99 < 1316371309 459934 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ambiguous type variable `a' in the constraints: < 1316371309 633854 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : `Data.Monoid.Monoid a' < 1316371309 651962 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : ... < 1316371313 304368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_< < 1316371315 64322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong intsance < 1316371316 882251 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok wait I forget... < 1316371324 247459 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316371330 415208 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t mconcatMap < 1316371331 75449 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `mconcatMap' < 1316371333 38217 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC it's just an alias for some other search engine, but I'm trying it anyway < 1316371338 513812 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ala Endo (mconcat . map) [succ, succ] 99 < 1316371339 383757 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `[b -> n']' < 1316371339 558324 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `[a ... < 1316371349 416098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ala Endo (const mconcat) [succ, succ] 99 < 1316371350 248817 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (Control.Newtype.Newtype (a -> a) (t -> a1)) < 1316371350 457079 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising fro... < 1316371352 1258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle concatMap < 1316371352 19136 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ala < 1316371352 167750 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude concatMap :: (a -> [b]) -> [a] -> [b] < 1316371352 343627 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.ByteString concatMap :: (Word8 -> ByteString) -> ByteString -> ByteString < 1316371352 361598 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Foldable concatMap :: Foldable t => (a -> [b]) -> t a -> [b] < 1316371353 37125 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall o n b n' o'. (Newtype n o, Newtype n' o') => (o -> n) -> ((o -> n) -> b -> n') -> b -> o' < 1316371359 187057 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle foldMap < 1316371359 359833 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Foldable foldMap :: (Foldable t, Monoid m) => (a -> m) -> t a -> m < 1316371359 562851 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Traversable foldMapDefault :: (Traversable t, Monoid m) => (a -> m) -> t a -> m < 1316371364 93775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ala Endo Data.Foldable.foldMap [succ, succ] 99 < 1316371364 964559 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 101 < 1316371367 59067 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go < 1316371369 324784 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/newtype/0.2/doc/html/Control-Newtype.html < 1316371380 866975 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow, one of the results was even relevant < 1316371396 969636 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nice < 1316371400 453332 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very /good/, but relevant: http://typophile.com/node/60376 < 1316371436 672142 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, oerjan started working this out later on < 1316371472 389448 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :22:59:14: data Many a = One a | Many (Many a) < 1316371480 959362 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: this is the partial computation monad < 1316371504 147207 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CakeProphet: also known as resumption < 1316371508 116555 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:01:08: count (One a) = 1; count (Many a) = 1 + count a < 1316371514 829282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that counts the number of steps needed to complete the computation < 1316371521 852043 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:01:54: also it's isomorphic to that delayed monad thing < 1316371521 869884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1316371627 328828 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :23:32:12: hmm, idea my supervisor had for sandboxing OCaml (whilst preventing uses we don't want of the standard library): reject all mentions of modules other than Pervasives, combined with rejecting the stuff in Pervasives we don't want them to use < 1316371635 869440 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's basically a one-time hack version of SafeHaskell :P < 1316371640 401290 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is in latest ghc < 1316371654 202688 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, glad to know the idea isn't completely stupid < 1316371668 746014 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may put a prctl() on there just to make sure < 1316371674 671682 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: just use UMLBox, dude < 1316371679 549639 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a simple "make" to build < 1316371680 424915 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if it's possible to run OCaml in one of those? < 1316371687 926297 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can disable all file access < 1316371692 811010 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just use nice and sleep to handle the rest < 1316371699 440639 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :five line shell script < 1316371708 332462 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no OCaml module hacks required < 1316371815 807259 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod JOIN :#esoteric < 1316371823 152880 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no? < 1316371871 415709 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:56:27: haha, INTERCAL will have that feature all to itself now! <-- i thought you were referring to CTCP SOURCE here < 1316371871 625200 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :00:56:40: no, to putting expressions on the LHS of an assignment < 1316371875 809014 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the only thing gone is n+k patterns < 1316371883 14083 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can still redefine (+) locally just fine < 1316371893 62404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL reverse assignments work like n+k patterns < 1316371896 897607 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just, on anything < 1316371927 400832 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as long as it doesn't use the same variable or constant twice, e.g. .1$.1 <- #1$#2 isn't going to work well) < 1316371938 428513 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's just finding a fixed point < 1316371949 94379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:05:53: Surely IRC doesn't predate URLs ... < 1316371949 112565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :URLs: 1994; IRC: 1988 < 1316371950 844874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: so yes it does < 1316371984 770625 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, now I'm wondering when the Web was invented < 1316372002 351259 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1989 < 1316372016 51616 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, now why it requires an FTP server location makes a lot of sense < 1316372017 422495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sheesh, I was just about to tell you. < 1316372028 85626 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The web only went public in 1990 anyway. < 1316372072 33064 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was invented by someone from Hexham < 1316372077 610970 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it wasn't < 1316372081 494107 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same country < 1316372094 150197 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316372100 642807 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott JOIN :#esoteric < 1316372163 272071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:32:20: * SgeoN1 badmoods < 1316372163 328440 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a verb < 1316372218 565837 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :01:50:55: intesting is _not a word_ < 1316372218 744915 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's what intestines do < 1316372226 8573 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's up intestines? oh nothing, just intesting < 1316372298 392195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote :D :D oh man.. i wonder if they ever made chess variants based off of animes < 1316372299 948531 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :670) :D :D oh man.. i wonder if they ever made chess variants based off of animes < 1316372316 564958 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a good quote < 1316372376 165219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :02:55:59: is suicide chess anything like strip chess < 1316372376 345948 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :suicide strip chess < 1316372406 961461 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :intercal x_x < 1316372410 349969 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1316372433 42258 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with INTERCAL? < 1316372446 641336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: tiffany just says random words at random times followed by x_x, as far as I can tell < 1316372453 639978 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"A Sieve of Eratosthenes benchmark, computing all prime numbers less than 65536, was tested on a Sun SPARCStation-1. In C, it took less than half a second; the same program in INTERCAL took over seventeen hours.[6]" < 1316372461 527576 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does that even < 1316372465 359553 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, now we finally know what's wrong with intercal < 1316372467 278832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's slower than C < 1316372476 5887 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Noooo! < 1316372477 404598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: make C-INTERCAL produce faster programs and it'll be a great language < 1316372493 503379 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :intercal uses <- for assignment < 1316372495 780485 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :squirrel does too < 1316372496 474750 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :;-; < 1316372496 824875 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: C-INTERCAL is substantially faster, I remember running the same program a year ago < 1316372508 558876 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiffany: congratulations you've figured it out < 1316372519 495312 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why intercal is a Bad Language < 1316372520 915656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the other bad thing about intercal, using <- to assign < 1316372521 788200 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :x_x < 1316372523 706230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, there are only that many plausible syntaxes for assignment < 1316372531 411204 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, INTERCAL's expression syntax needs redoing < 1316372531 763292 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :RUINED FOREVER < 1316372538 122266 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm really happy with the control flow < 1316372546 175413 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not a bad thing < 1316372550 48254 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the expressions, while interesting, are just obstructive for no good reason (other than being INTERCAL) < 1316372557 537980 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I honestly prefer <- over = for assignment of mutable variables < 1316372569 894286 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's that a programming language that i used to like a lot uses <- for assignment, which a parody language also uses < 1316372580 472979 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no < 1316372588 161642 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :squirrel uses variable <- value; and local variable=value; < 1316372591 680659 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't squirrel that boring game extension languages < 1316372598 643387 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes languages PLURAL < 1316372603 892608 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :squirrel's a 6k interpreted language < 1316372609 96545 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :used in the source engine < 1316372611 929345 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and other thingies < 1316372617 206445 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember squirrel being a boring game extension language last I checked < 1316372625 927391 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a fan of having separate "define initial (and thus eventual) value of immutable variable" and "assign to memory pointed to by variable name" operators < 1316372655 101322 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1316372671 149862 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most commonly, languages which make the distinction call them = and := < 1316372680 568682 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiffany: but does that make it interesting < 1316372688 447845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tiffany: so yes then < 1316372693 710136 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the interpreter being 6k and used in places < 1316372707 30878 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I've grown closer to javascript < 1316372708 507433 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i briefly considered using squirrel for mcmap i think but i didn't because it was bad < 1316372715 132835 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well not as bad as javascript certainlt < 1316372716 2862 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :y < 1316372722 286473 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :heheheh < 1316372723 332480 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was bored and wrote a 3D renderer with it using canvas and kind of like it < 1316372731 525357 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :6k's quite big for an interp < 1316372737 281673 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :6k lines of code? < 1316372742 683647 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't lua like 50k? < 1316372749 130107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're aiming for small interp size < 1316372762 69424 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a super basic programming language in 40 lines of lua once < 1316372769 249124 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than speed or clarity of input < 1316372799 51484 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:02:44: Type of classInstances is classInstances :: Name -> [Type] -> Q [Name] different from the documentation, and the code producing error is $(classInstances ''Num [ConT ''Integer] >>= reify . head >>= runIO . print >> [| 0 |]) < 1316372801 313203 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a bug < 1316372804 627570 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're using an older GHC/TH < 1316372810 738976 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/template-haskell/2.5.0.0/doc/html/Language-Haskell-TH.html has the correct type for that version < 1316372828 80711 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does zzo logread < 1316372836 621344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?tell zzo38 the docs for classInstances aren't broken; you're just using an older GHC. see http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/template-haskell/2.5.0.0/doc/html/Language-Haskell-TH.html for the documentation of your version < 1316372836 794104 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1316372854 209378 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my record for small interp is 14 bytes (http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/MiniMAX), but it doesn't do I/O and the source is in binary < 1316372855 780778 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1316372868 904860 :tiffany!~tiffany@188.215.83.116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :._. < 1316372895 769244 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a 36-byte one by someone else which avoids both issues < 1316372915 509838 :rottytooth!~rottytoot@cpe-72-227-189-133.nyc.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1316372918 120506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :03:07:17: OK, I managed to report bug now < 1316372918 335405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do I have to comment /there/ too? < 1316372920 212521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/MinISCule < 1316372925 656495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, rottytooth rings a bell < 1316372933 738450 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll `? welcome all the same < 1316372934 345097 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? welcome < 1316372935 961320 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1316372944 626428 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks `? welcome < 1316372944 800490 :rottytooth!~rottytoot@cpe-72-227-189-133.nyc.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi there < 1316372981 197409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, he had an actual bug < 1316372983 465625 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :compiler panic < 1316372988 518129 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, seems calamari's website is down < 1316372999 882154 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what ghc version though maybe it was fixed?? who knows..... < 1316373006 159402 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :7.0.3 < 1316373034 536120 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: valgrind panics and reports a bug when running in the Secret Project < 1316373037 494441 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I should probably use enumerators for this < 1316373058 717871 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's probably just an effect of the Debugger Repulsion Field < 1316373060 110266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: did you report it? < 1316373063 421892 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1316373067 467091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lame :P < 1316373099 413364 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not convinced the Secret Project counts as a supported platform < 1316373170 200660 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:09:19: no, most programming (and proof assistants) model an intuitionist (constructive) logic < 1316373177 613961 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin: you can always just add LEM as an axiom < 1316373196 514289 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :and stop being able to compute things < 1316373198 300964 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which one's LEM? < 1316373204 230903 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :A or NOT A < 1316373208 64378 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1316373215 210232 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're right < 1316373231 96707 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm wondering what the double negation shift looks like in Curry-Howard < 1316373234 595466 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's fine as long as you're only thinking about truth of statements < 1316373247 349377 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you ever want to deal with anything algorithmically it's pretty useless < 1316373265 181763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a basic rule of computer science seminars is, if you ever see someone write f(¬¬A) = ¬¬f(A) on the whiteboard, you run) < 1316373316 192190 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, OISCs are always going to win, in general, on compiler/interp size, right? < 1316373325 823851 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, a simple OISC will beat a simple more-instruction-set-computer < 1316373328 797102 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not necessarily < 1316373334 371546 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ByteByteJump splits into two instructions fairly easily, IIRC < 1316373336 992814 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a complex one will typically beat a non-OISC of similar complexity < 1316373341 428936 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that might be simpler than implementing the combined one < 1316373354 184866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because lots of OISCs are basically two instructions in disguise < 1316373361 676954 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/ByteByteJump#The_two-instruction_ByteByte.2FJump < 1316373370 462027 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on what you're implementing it in ofc < 1316373425 235324 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :04:14:52: Wikipedia does mention "Correspondence between classical logic and control operators", it has to do with continuations, apparently. < 1316373425 584366 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :v < 1316373426 105956 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://okmij.org/ftp/Computation/lem.html < 1316373595 946866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: quick, what's a Perl script to print if I have two newlines at the end of a file? < 1316373600 653831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to just one terminating newline < 1316373612 420759 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to check for double-newline at the end of a file? < 1316373613 638088 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316373645 232541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316373654 650801 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm... "undef $/; $_=<>; print "ends with double newline\n" if /\n/\n$/s < 1316373656 47819 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1316373658 352107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Haskell frameworks -vs- Arc for web apps" oh no, someone let the kids into /r/haskell :/ < 1316373665 732118 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, I screwed up the quoting the program onto IRC < 1316373671 135653 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :undef $/; $_=<>; print "ends with double newline\n" if /\n/\n$/s; < 1316373672 703901 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go < 1316373673 749212 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1316373676 187938 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think, at least, it's untested < 1316373677 61707 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :people still care about arc? < 1316373693 154687 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :people cared about arc? < 1316373693 172211 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Backslash found where operator expected at -e line 1, near "/\n/\" < 1316373693 330003 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : (Missing operator before \?) < 1316373693 348099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :syntax error at -e line 1, near "/\n/\" < 1316373693 348254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Substitution pattern not terminated at -e line 1. < 1316373694 374285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::-P < 1316373700 300711 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just need to remove the extra / < 1316373702 307499 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :undef $/; $_=<>; print "ends with double newline\n" if /\n\n$/s; < 1316373706 340788 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually an extra / < 1316373712 977712 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, that's what yous aid < 1316373715 940286 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you said < 1316373733 255462 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just assume I'm drunk, it's simpler < 1316373737 962402 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm not, but I get this way anyway sometimes) < 1316373761 961954 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to change my nick permanently < 1316373768 395314 :Taneb!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net NICK :NGEvD < 1316373773 110265 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ngevd < 1316373779 455147 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :taneb: why < 1316373781 375168 :NGEvD!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net NICK :Ngevd < 1316373799 532798 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whos taneb < 1316373802 927847 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :taneb is nicer than ngevd imho < 1316373804 147092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as < 1316373805 19975 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a name < 1316373817 54006 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t "Ping" < 1316373817 754733 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Char] < 1316373847 393303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I see you didn't list javascript. For prototyping, it's hard to imagine how another existing language would make it much faster as it can be done with jQuery currently." < 1316373855 402171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :jQuery: a good language to develop web apps in < 1316373964 333010 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316373979 894320 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye ngevd < 1316373984 114041 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rip ngevd < 1316373985 684317 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :died as he lived < 1316373989 691974 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ngevd < 1316374038 454546 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, there are too many iteratee libraries :'( < 1316374056 85860 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1316374094 290650 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316374112 124893 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i cannot decide between iteratee, enumerator, and iterIO :'( < 1316374138 141907 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, Ngevd is what I am called on IRC now < 1316374145 107148 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless I change it < 1316374151 402386 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :im dont like ngevd < 1316374153 498343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whym not taneb :( < 1316374156 834620 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb|Kindle doesn't like it < 1316374163 745856 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ngevd|kindle < 1316374163 901584 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :why doesnt, he like it < 1316374192 442135 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :whym doesnt < 1316374194 185371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :he like it < 1316374195 408749 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1316374196 102241 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Awkward to type on a Kindle < 1316374223 392038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and < 1316374224 788778 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ngevd isn't < 1316374253 249145 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, Ngevd is < 1316374255 912173 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb isn't < 1316374262 534330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316374263 659016 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316374264 527834 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this sounds < 1316374267 146482 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like superiority for taneb < 1316374268 367130 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi dell < 1316374269 277809 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? welcome < 1316374270 862445 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1316374310 413549 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have simply dropped the idea of llvm-bf converter....i think asm-bf will be awesome! < 1316374312 154579 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1316374327 888849 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316374329 805950 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :were you dell last time < 1316374333 196609 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think you had a different nick then < 1316374333 539545 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :asm? < 1316374335 460760 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that seems like a decent idea < 1316374338 925464 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although could be difficult < 1316374346 946516 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, i told dell to talk to you about gcc-bf, they were asking about it < 1316374361 406543 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they wanted to do llvm-bf and I said to talk to you because you had considered it < 1316374361 999120 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :etc. < 1316374367 235199 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523:real mind fucker project < 1316374368 971211 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I guess that doesn't matter now if... what is asm-bf < 1316374376 749601 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you trying to convert xeightsix asm into bf < 1316374377 272428 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :assembler to brainfuck < 1316374381 478183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which assembler < 1316374382 909428 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 < 1316374385 725672 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1316374387 468485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1316374388 165953 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, BF isn't that bad, despite its name < 1316374390 80590 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :luck with that < 1316374401 584459 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although x86 is possibly going to make life hard for yourself < 1316374408 920491 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316374415 231883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes it easier to drop, which is a good quality in projects < 1316374415 403429 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what the simplest asm would be? Redcode? < 1316374420 115869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: OISC, duh < 1316374422 548623 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find llvm a little too complex to parse < 1316374427 265074 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dell: LLVM has an API... < 1316374429 531887 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't consider OSICs to be asms < 1316374439 66269 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could just write a backend the proper way < 1316374441 678731 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :like ais523 was doing with gc-cbf < 1316374443 110518 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcc-bf < 1316374448 341334 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I looked into llvm-bf < 1316374458 699726 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :LLVM makes so many assumptions that aren't true about BF, I was heartbroken < 1316374465 294802 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas gcc tries not to < 1316374472 617895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: however hard it is, doing it by manually parsing LLVM IR is never going to be easier than writing a backend < 1316374474 719781 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly, the code doesn't actually /work/ < 1316374482 209635 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right, that much is obvious < 1316374485 217078 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I didn't need to comment on it < 1316374501 76494 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just argued with the most recent statement that wasn't < 1316374518 346064 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316374518 364028 :Ngevd_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316374535 70221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was that statement? < 1316374549 477712 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already told dell that you considered llvm-bf more of a pain to do than gcc-bf < 1316374553 667515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :last time they were here < 1316374557 708578 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1316374562 375843 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that llvm was worth using at all < 1316374600 582685 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :LLVM is better designed than C, in my opinion. < 1316374600 747530 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it. < 1316374612 631540 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1316374612 803765 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott said 29m 36s ago: the docs for classInstances aren't broken; you're just using an older GHC. see http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/template-haskell/2.5.0.0/doc/html/Language- < 1316374612 978095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'm not sure that's a good comparison < 1316374612 996657 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell-TH.html for the documentation of your version < 1316374644 577442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like comparing gcc's internal intermediate representation with ADA < 1316374650 862605 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Ada < 1316374686 128893 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Ada is better than cheese. < 1316374710 170455 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :these days i get involved in college crap so much that not getting enough time < 1316374733 642234 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: What I mean is, with a good macro system and literate programming environment, I think LLVM would be a good programming language to program in, instead of being limited to C. < 1316374739 42461 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am still wondering whether to do this in python or C < 1316374748 662973 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do it in asm MORE HARDCORE YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH < 1316374750 719537 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :dell: Doing what in Python or C? < 1316374757 587521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I don't, it'd be rather inflexible and nonportable < 1316374763 339814 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 asm to bf < 1316374787 393098 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you could write it in 32-bit LLVM < 1316374801 44667 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dell: C is a really inappropriate lang for that, and Python is almost as bad < 1316374816 98756 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I'd consider doing that in anything other than a functional language < 1316374819 974598 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, I wouldn't really consider it at all < 1316374827 471207 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : haskell ocaml < 1316374830 605263 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :dell: If you're gonna do an ASM->BF, may I recommend MIPS. < 1316374835 714139 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : FORTH < 1316374843 385306 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh, Haskell and OCaml are both pretty similar for that sort of thing < 1316374846 882254 :Ngevd_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM CURIOUS 'BOUT SOMETHING < 1316374856 856878 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though they're different languages in general < 1316374858 76330 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd_: How you got that stylish underscore? < 1316374858 431190 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: He's set on x86, since that is surely easier than the LLVM-BF he's given up on. < 1316374864 720011 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: lol < 1316374868 187063 :Ngevd_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do pythonbashers generally think of Boo? < 1316374875 546191 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they generally haven't heard of it < 1316374882 732627 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, if you count me as the main Pythonbasher here < 1316374885 694924 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd_: Mostly, "wtf is Boo" < 1316374906 330182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i looked at boo once it is so boring < 1316374915 275460 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's PYTHON... but SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT... < 1316374917 18330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ONLY FOR .NET < 1316374922 252591 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THIS IS WHAT THE WORLD NEEDS < 1316374925 590926 :Ngevd_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's strongly typed python, essentially < 1316374932 360860 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, "for CLI" pretty much means "I love sucking Microsoft's cock" < 1316374934 973211 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh is it strongly typed < 1316374937 112435 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sooooooo, a big no on that one. < 1316374940 773014 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's PYTHON... but SLIGHTLY BETTER < 1316374941 995124 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my objections to Python have pretty much nothing to do with its typing discipline < 1316374951 680315 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a place for both statically and dynamically typed languages < 1316374960 220868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : a, b = 0L, 1L #The 'L's make the numbers double word length (typically 64 bits) < 1316374960 238920 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to "bignum", like Python < 1316374962 137138 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is kind of like Erlang < 1316374967 372038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's use all of Prolog's syntax but none of its semantics < 1316374970 389292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I sort of subscribe to the viewpoint that "strongly typed" has been used to mean so many different things that it's meaningless) < 1316374995 332033 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: IMO, the place for dynamically-typed languages is as a subset of statically-typed ones < 1316375006 24822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :static and dynamic typing are basically two completely different things, anyway < 1316375009 375075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :comparing them is near-meaningless < 1316375020 184317 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if statements are a kind of dynamic typing, really < 1316375058 680746 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like to call dynamic types "monoidal programming" < 1316375062 339287 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for compiled languages, the distinction is easy: a statically-typed language is one where, after compilation, you can take any variable in the program and know what type it is without having to actually run the program < 1316375079 586523 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :languages are not compiled < 1316375084 294976 :copumpkin!~pumpkin@unaffiliated/pumpkingod PRIVMSG #esoteric :implementations are < 1316375133 223960 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes < 1316375148 577647 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :languages that can reasonably directly be compiled then, I guess < 1316375157 703341 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But one thing I think missing in LLVM is explicit unions. You can still do unions by what it has, but I would prefer an explicit type for unions (this can also allow certain optimizations and analysis to be done) < 1316375220 143461 :dell!~ikkyu@117.201.48.243 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1316375296 161817 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could check many things at runtime, even in a system that doesn't actually have pointers, by representing a pointer by an object ID and offset. Object IDs are garbage collected. If you try to dereference a pointer with an invalid offset or invalid object ID, you get an error message. Same thing when using unions incorrectly. You can use it for both static and dynamic analysis. < 1316375534 681299 :Nisstyre!~yours@infocalypse-net.info JOIN :#esoteric < 1316375738 577110 :Ngevd_!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316375955 656646 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey Vorpal, you get to be the substitute fizzie < 1316376127 792717 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1316376145 835908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pah < 1316376220 363002 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316376223 326306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Go wake fizzie up < 1316376244 71386 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how? it's not like he's in the room < 1316376261 731628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well then find the room he's in and be in it so that you can wake him up < 1316376269 569598 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he'd probably wake up naturally first < 1316376283 726375 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's for the universe to know and you to find out < 1316376466 880179 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, seems nobody really uses iterIO < 1316376472 631093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But maybe everyone is just a bad person??? < 1316376488 853168 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1316376655 554096 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Hey, pick the library for me. It is your duty. < 1316376768 426181 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1316376775 924102 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know nothjing about their diffierences < 1316376785 906417 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :never even heard of the ones that aren';t iteratee < 1316376792 532189 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's pretty much between enumerator and iterIO :-P < 1316376800 563101 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :enumerator is like iteratee but more things use it and it's simpler. < 1316376803 692903 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :iterIO is different. < 1316376815 890153 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And has a lot of seeming advantages, e.g. http://www.scs.stanford.edu/~dm/iterIO/, http://hackage.haskell.org/packages/archive/iterIO/0.1/doc/html/Data-IterIO.html < 1316376823 665738 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I do not know :'( < 1316376844 18756 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Because of CPS, iteratee should be capable of delivering the best performance of the three iteratee packages. A disadvantage of iterIO's approach is that every invocation of lift must be propagated all the way up the call chain, where a small amount of overhead is added for each enclosing catchI or similar call. While iterIO can handle most successful IterR outcomes and caught exceptions locally without popping back up the call stack, there is a < 1316376844 191054 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lso potentially overhead from actually checking that the outcome was successful at each bind site. (GHC's inliner may be able to avoid the check in some cases.) < 1316376844 209131 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, iteratee lacks several features of iterIO; offering these features would likely reduce the benefits of CPS and complicate code. For instance, there is no way to execute a pure iteratee without monadic actions (the benefit touted above and described below for LL(*) parsing). Moreover, iteratee's exception mechanism discards the current location in the input stream, making it unsuitable for failed parse alternatives. IterIO provides a gene < 1316376850 243897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ral control mechanism to make arbitrary requests from enumerators (such as seek, tell, getpeername, get SSL information, etc.); iteratee instead overloads the exception mechanism for control purposes, which prevents control operations from returning values. Thus, while iteratee can implement seek, it cannot, for instance, implement tell. < 1316376854 250165 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The enumerator package's approach is closer to iterIO's, but makes every iteratee into a monadic action in the underlying monad m: < 1316376857 39391 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -- From the enumerator package: < 1316376858 961970 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : newtype Iteratee a m b = Iteratee { runIteratee :: m (Step a m b) } < 1316376861 92535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here Step is similar to iterIO's IterR type, but the m wrapper disallows iterIO's LL(*) parsing tricks. It also causes gratuitous invocation of m's bind function, which can be expensive when using stacks of monad transformers. Furthermore, enumerator discards the input state on all errors, making it impossible to resume from failures that leave the input in a known state (such as a parsing lookahead failure) < 1316376937 787099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1316376961 979125 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :iterIO looks like a Fancy Better thing but I don't know if I should use it since it only has one release and nobody else has used it... < 1316376999 554638 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is not a good reason not to use it????? maybe???????? < 1316377009 201897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: but it might have lots of bugs :( < 1316377015 25471 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whereas enumerator is used in a lot of high-profile packages like Yesod < 1316377027 277954 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe iterIO will be really slow or something... < 1316377043 314018 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster PRIVMSG #esoteric : Hey Vorpal, you get to be the substitute fizzie <-- ? < 1316377071 32334 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Turns out I could answer my own question < 1316377074 548528 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe < 1316377085 427834 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering how many packets a Minecraft client would send before it waits for the server to respond before sending any more < 1316377089 50340 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think the answer is just the login packets < 1316377123 610618 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not going to be non-away today, sorry. < 1316377136 716928 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Today I've been mostly Portal.) < 1316377166 879198 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So irresponsible. < 1316377169 19704 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :My guess is also that it just sends the login, if you have a completely quiet server. < 1316377175 641724 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your people NEED you. < 1316377206 841016 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know about the case where you have a server that goes non-responsive in the middle of the game; in that case I think it might keep on sending movement stuff until some sort of a timeout. < 1316377438 697182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: The usecase is pretty much "testing my client parser stuff before writing the server packet code". :p < 1316377447 653620 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whereby code, I mean "protocol.txt-alike". < 1316377453 727705 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316377461 92909 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I think I'll just write the server stuff. < 1316377494 105106 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1316377515 591845 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heloerjan < 1316377529 532353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log hell?oerjan < 1316377533 597869 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-18.txt:20:25:15: heloerjan < 1316377550 664345 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*gasp* < 1316377553 308517 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1316377554 156476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log hell?oerjan < 1316377556 69043 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs hell?oerjan < 1316377557 115356 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i swear ive done it before < 1316377557 423426 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-18.txt:20:25:33: 2011-09-18.txt:20:25:15: heloerjan < 1316377559 888267 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.22953 < 1316377561 297288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so cheating < 1316377567 665633 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-08-31.txt:20:45:31: heloerjan < 1316377569 687374 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::') < 1316377571 976980 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log `log < 1316377572 50175 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmmmm ... no. < 1316377576 340176 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :>:c < 1316377582 624002 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll get you next time. < 1316377585 55661 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-08-31.txt:20:45:31: heloerjan < 1316377586 279131 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-18.txt:20:25:15: heloerjan < 1316377589 764369 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :once before < 1316377590 283236 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymee: HackEgo doesn't like talking to you any more. < 1316377597 601459 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, that's what I just quoted :P < 1316377605 749362 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does `log `log not work anymore? < 1316377615 554378 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering about it < 1316377622 903915 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316377624 118975 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think there's just some anti-Lymia feature < 1316377627 253545 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :too bad there is no way to find out < 1316377632 840366 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like the bots don't talk to each other < 1316377635 797557 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1316377640 34372 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1316377641 664872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log fungot < 1316377642 692804 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1316377642 710897 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: mr president, mrs soltwedel-schfer, perhaps i might continue with the member states, including austria. only by doing so the commission is not allowed to be marketed. this parliament has judged the customs union the economic benefits of the use of the best food industries in the same way as heterosexuals. nor can you say who is to carry out an analysis of the market. < 1316377645 109001 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2010-05-02.txt:17:50:20: http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 < 1316377646 191255 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's an ignore list < 1316377650 887851 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log `log < 1316377652 107865 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :still works < 1316377654 96500 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-09-17.txt:13:54:08: `log recogni < 1316377655 767443 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :see what I mean? fungot didn't respond to hackego's mention of its name < 1316377656 991070 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: as to the " no" campaign was not pushing for a " no" to drugs and arms, which originates with this criminal structure in fnord that is alleged to have been in the vanguard for change as mr martens said, but it was, but she has managed to flout the treaty and widened in the concept of reducing the emission of greenhouse gases ( of which parliament forms a part of these amendments were adopted by the iter. i shall only gi < 1316377674 538525 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (`log ^ul)S < 1316377674 707935 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log ^ul < 1316377678 358387 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1316377678 719176 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"the " no" campaign was not pushing for a " no" to drugs and arms" < 1316377682 32777 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: You could of course dump-to-a-file a mcmap session (it's just one line: "fwrite(net_dpacket.p->bytes, 1, net_dpacket.p->size, clientdumpfile);" in the PACKET_FROM_CLIENT case of proxy.c) and then test your thing with nc localhost 26655 < blah.dump. But since you need to do both directions at some point anyway... < 1316377682 922217 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just say no to legs < 1316377688 481336 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, although hackego does respond to fungot, it seems < 1316377691 157910 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the report on the current uclaf to be strengthened at european level. against that we have had in getting information with regard to monetary policy, a factor of six. i am asking, under rule 115, that we should offer help to alleviate the effects of global warming caused by concentrations of dangerous substances. i can reassure mrs keppelhoff-wiechert: the object of discussion at the intergovernmental conference, mr pre < 1316377694 372632 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (`log \^ul)S < 1316377694 391134 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :`log \^ul < 1316377697 721384 :HackEgo!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011-02-10.txt:16:55:32: elliott: On fungot's ^ul interpreter, we're talking 10s vs 15s or something < 1316377699 254494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Ooh, clever. < 1316377706 885057 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It's easier than that though isn't it < 1316377710 187882 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I can just use nc or whatever < 1316377716 327347 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nc mcserver port | nc -l port < 1316377719 983126 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm < 1316377723 995249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except with tee in there < 1316377726 263605 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nc mcserver port | tee log | nc -l port < 1316377729 49495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then connect to that with MC < 1316377760 294384 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, because that won't feed the output of the final 'nc' back to the stdin of the first 'nc'. < 1316377767 399121 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you need bidirectional forwarding there. < 1316377786 226157 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (!echo hi) < 1316377786 397746 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: just use a fifo, and connect it in a loop < 1316377786 745521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That just needs my "tie" tool. < 1316377790 875820 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No FIFO required < 1316377791 183359 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do that all the time when making IRC bots < 1316377799 238268 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ul (!echo hi)S < 1316377799 256374 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :!echo hi < 1316377801 330382 :EgoBot!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1316377803 245901 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tie is just pipe(), dup[two], and an exec < 1316377803 263980 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed, but it's the easiest way to do it with standard UNIX commands < 1316377812 75809 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it just takes a shell line < 1316377818 993874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, 'strue < 1316377819 168308 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote something tie-like in my first degree < 1316377833 281526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was originally more complex because I thought it needed to take a list of shell statements to pipe < 1316377833 980846 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then discovered mkfifo, which saves having to get a separately-compiled program involved < 1316377837 125712 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I realised you could just join them with | < 1316377844 308935 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: tie is more elegant though :P < 1316377851 279019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a whole suite of pipe-wrangling tools < 1316377857 201599 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, I wrote one < 1316377881 434465 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most general one there was "backpipe" which gave a bunch of FDs connected to each other, so that you could connect programs in arbitrary ways < 1316377890 310430 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it turns out to do the same thing as mkfifo, just more confusingly < 1316377930 701438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, catbus connects each command in a list to every other command < 1316377937 145485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never implemented it, mostly because I could never find a use for it < 1316377946 207560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nc -e can be recreated with tie, you don't need catbus < 1316377949 168465 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tie 'nc server port | prog' < 1316377949 521688 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1316377951 783140 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tie 'prog | nc server port' < 1316377962 413475 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you can rotate the pipeline passed to tie arbitrarily with no semantic effect) < 1316378000 351139 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :prog < fifo | nc server port > fifo < 1316378009 933904 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but that's grosser < 1316378011 892207 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it's probably a little neater with a UUOC < 1316378030 203370 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pretty much just use socat. < 1316378039 643557 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's major overkill for most things, but soooo delicious. < 1316378050 504105 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :socat is awful. < 1316378059 52548 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: YOU'RE AWFUL < 1316378069 697287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But at least it's not GNU netcat, which is just plain defamation of the netcat name. < 1316378076 666379 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ mkfifo fifo; nc p.nerd.nu 25565 log < 1316378076 843172 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This looks right, right? < 1316378092 728555 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :("log" is meant to end up containing everything the Minecraft client sent; it will connect to port 9999) < 1316378156 799298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... I can connect fine, at least < 1316378159 583362 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ dollar sign// < 1316378160 106875 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would've done "tee log >fifo", but there's no particular reason. < 1316378181 563553 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: there is for interactive applications, I think; tee ends up buffering < 1316378222 295852 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, it does? < 1316378223 202264 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would hope bash can do it with an anonymous pipe too; if with nothing else, then with coproc, but coproc's horrible. I would hope you could get by with just "nc server port <&3 | nc -l listenport | tee logfile > &4" + some magic to make the pipe. < 1316378227 744122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: will it flush once the nc -l quits? < 1316378239 246334 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know, but I hope so < 1316378269 95195 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rw-r--r-- 1 elliott elliott 41K 2011-09-18 21:38 log < 1316378269 257273 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems to have worked < 1316378271 347598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :smaller than I was expecting, too < 1316378285 157965 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :although mostly ^As < 1316378295 803326 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Client-to-server direction is a lot less costly too. < 1316378299 459075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Minecraft sends hundreds of pings per second for no obvious reason) < 1316378330 705280 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably take this to -minecraft to avoid annoying ais523, but at least it's fairly esoteric < 1316378356 359820 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh no, you've made me rage at SDL's event loop again < 1316378363 926314 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1316378367 601478 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose I just hate tick-based event loops < 1316378369 904709 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right < 1316378379 321048 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :have I mentioned that @'s event loop is THE BEST? :-P < 1316378384 205240 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it doesn't have one) < 1316378384 556084 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and much prefer the schedule-future-action-then-wait-until-next-scheduled-action version < 1316378407 378670 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, how does @ idle the processor if all process-equivalents are sleeping simultaneously, for whatever reason? < 1316378423 561899 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : My initials would have been N.G.E.vD. < 1316378427 381816 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose, it doesn't have an explicit event loop, but it still needs a scheduler < 1316378433 809575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which has the same sort of issues that an event loop does < 1316378439 729424 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nathan Galactus Elliott von Death < 1316378480 910656 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I wonder ... if you did have a very high-quality scanner, COULD you make a converter from a scanned LP to a super-low-quality audio file? I wonder if you could guess the pits based on something. < 1316378517 376926 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Additional to the result of get it returns the number of consumed bytes and the rest of the input." No it doesn't, you're lying :-( < 1316378522 778629 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: I think someone did that < 1316378534 454068 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :same person as the person who did "use a CRT as a radio transmitter" maybe? < 1316378537 597246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounded quite bad < 1316378547 747054 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evidence that elliott is my evil twin: < 1316378548 57629 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : elliott: well, how does @ idle the processor if all process-equivalents are sleeping simultaneously, for whatever reason? < 1316378548 231402 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.phys.huji.ac.il/~springer/DigitalNeedle/ < 1316378553 982533 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :That seems to be the first likely hit. < 1316378557 992340 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's more like, to do event things you just register handlers at the low elvel < 1316378559 733249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :level < 1316378562 699274 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We both live in the same town, despite never having met < 1316378569 804338 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: or if you block, then your continuation just gets inserted as an event handler, and your (lightweight) thread killed < 1316378576 713077 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We both have some connection to the name "Elliott" < 1316378586 468640 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but you're going to need to implement the thing that dispatches events to the handler < 1316378592 993566 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so if you block on waiting for the next event, your thread's continuation is installed as an event handler, and the thread is killed < 1316378599 883333 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: not really < 1316378602 146250 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I understand that much < 1316378608 312569 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but something has to call the event handler < 1316378609 544905 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: /causing/ the event causes each handler to be spawned as a thread < 1316378615 873702 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :say a process does sleep(1000) < 1316378624 802115 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's responsible for calling the continuation it gives once the sleep ends? < 1316378627 592677 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, e.g., what does writing to a pipe do? spawn off all the read-handlers for that pipe with the data, nothing else < 1316378633 536344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the timer driver < 1316378640 15636 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, OK < 1316378649 650461 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so how does the timer driver idle when it doesn't have any timings to give right now? < 1316378651 915409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably you'd abstract over it to offer sleep to processes < 1316378652 961399 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can't do the equivalent of a sleep < 1316378669 697232 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it can't ask itself < 1316378677 887062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, how do you talk to hardware timers nowadays? < 1316378680 153354 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When questioned about this situation, elliott suggested a fight to the death, I suggested something more civilized < 1316378687 129328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably, there's an interface that doesn't involve polling constantly < 1316378692 213085 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have facial hair < 1316378695 538140 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elsewhere, someone wanted a "line-in to CD" adapter in the same vein as those "line-in to tape" things you can buy to plug your MP3 player to an old tape-only car stereo; now *there's* quite a technical challenge. < 1316378696 745393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might use interrupts < 1316378697 989470 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, fizzie: Yessssssssssss < 1316378698 161065 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: ah, OK, it's triggered by interrupts? < 1316378701 298525 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are basically hardware event handlers < 1316378709 837795 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: goatie? < 1316378711 55590 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that seems to be it < 1316378714 388979 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*goatee < 1316378716 538277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: probably < 1316378728 905375 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ouch, that sounds basically impossible < 1316378735 524351 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it'd have to be wireless < 1316378740 581621 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: No, that requires more hair < 1316378742 149200 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, it's so gloriously bad. < 1316378748 283406 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1316378748 301487 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even then it'd be basically impossible < 1316378749 882581 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is recognizably music! < 1316378751 590252 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: You just need to anti-phaser it < 1316378756 857857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I presume that's possible < 1316378758 252545 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh < 1316378759 122193 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phaser < 1316378764 987747 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the effect that you can hear on the first recording < 1316378773 871756 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some time in 2008-2009, elliott or someone with the same name as elliott kicked someone in the face < 1316378789 766148 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that probably wasn't me < 1316378791 159634 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone who later became good friends with me < 1316378796 62863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, if it /was/ me, I don't remember it < 1316378814 235601 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "someone" in that sentence is Taneb/Ngevd. < 1316378816 326884 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are quite a lot of people called elliott in the world < 1316378817 195880 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, @ handles push-based things better than things you need to poll, I think < 1316378823 130336 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've had two of them here < 1316378825 395008 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but you can model a pull as a push < 1316378838 536223 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :My cat just LEAPED off the windowsill, halfway across the room. < 1316378842 717498 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :She had no reason at all to do that. < 1316378846 549619 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone called Elliott Hird? < 1316378848 120369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: just tell the driver you'd like to know X, and give a handler < 1316378857 404603 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other one had a different surname < 1316378858 475582 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever < 1316378864 760662 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: The later "someone" I meant :P < 1316378875 601204 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: She had the most important reason: she's a cat. < 1316378880 509814 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Tre. < 1316378881 580562 :Gregor!foobar@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :*True < 1316378887 475867 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was neither me nor elliott < 1316378914 409137 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: are you claiming that you're the real Elliott Hird, and elliott is just some sort of imposter who happens to have the same name as you? < 1316378916 497338 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Well, I suppose it might depend on the structure of the reader. You don't really need a rotating fake-disc, "just" some sort of a fixed thing that reads the rotation of the central spine, and a thing clamped firmly on top of the radially moving read-head, that can both read the radial distance as well as change its reflectivity. Still. < 1316378925 918321 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: My name is Nathan < 1316378946 448339 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I am claiming that elliott is my evil twin < 1316378948 888528 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm thinking more about the issue of connecting wires through all possible interfaces for inserting a CD into a reader < 1316378955 881540 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you'd have to know where the read-head was < 1316378973 962505 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Well, yes, it'd work in pretty much one CD player model only. < 1316378977 841215 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it could be at any place rotationally around the disk < 1316378980 790717 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1316378984 798008 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you meant a general one < 1316378985 376597 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, do evil people think that good people are evil? < 1316378991 430857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle (a,b) -> (b->c) -> (a,c) < 1316378991 780356 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Graph.Inductive.Query.Monad mapSnd :: (a -> b) -> (c, a) -> (c, b) < 1316378991 953225 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Arrow (>>^) :: Arrow a => a b c -> (c -> d) -> a b d < 1316378991 973194 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Graph.Inductive.Query.Monad (><) :: (a -> b) -> (c -> d) -> (a, c) -> (b, d) < 1316378994 580195 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, a general one would of course be more desirable. < 1316378997 704242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah < 1316379000 873923 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: < 1316379016 849533 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :flip second < 1316379027 3390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I want it flipped :P < 1316379029 959965 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to write < 1316379031 998764 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : | otherwise = do < 1316379032 17071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : (a, dump') <- runGetState (get :: Get ClientPacket) dump 0 < 1316379032 17220 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : (a:) <$> parseDump dump' < 1316379034 262166 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nicerly < 1316379034 762782 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(e.g. when there's an evil twin, does the evil twin think he has a good twin or that his good twin is his evil twin?) < 1316379057 221771 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :second parseDump $ runGetState (get :: Get ClientPacket) dump 0 < 1316379065 242688 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I need (a,[a]) -> [a] < 1316379071 389191 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hmm < 1316379076 114616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :second parseDump <$> runGetState (get :: Get ClientPacket) dump 0 < 1316379079 75955 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :uncurry (:) . second parseDump <$> runGetState (get :: Get ClientPacket) dump 0 < 1316379079 947143 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1316379080 820767 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: "Perhaps if you had some sort of a separate CD-shaped medium upon which you could (in advance) "print" the required impressions, maybe with some sort of a laser... uh, wait." < 1316379081 346399 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :?ty uncurry (:) < 1316379082 227794 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (a, [a]) -> [a] < 1316379105 293448 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (:) < 1316379106 162792 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. a -> [a] -> [a] < 1316379115 885496 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh that < 1316379129 142906 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix(:) < 1316379129 868425 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a = [a] -> [a] < 1316379130 30971 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Probable cause: `:' is applied to too few arguments < 1316379130 48869 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the first argument of `fix', namely `(:)' < 1316379130 726412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Main.hs:13:38: < 1316379130 932233 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `[ClientPacket]' < 1316379130 950609 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : with actual type `Either String [ClientPacket]' < 1316379130 950786 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Expected type: ByteString -> [ClientPacket] < 1316379130 950897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Actual type: ByteString -> Either String [ClientPacket] < 1316379134 82850 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: Not quite :( < 1316379135 996111 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix(flip :) < 1316379136 696440 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) a b. (Functor f) => [f (a -> b) -> a -> f b] < 1316379138 781816 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I do need something monadic < 1316379159 84921 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : hmm, do evil people think that good people are evil? <-- at least they pretend to think that. < 1316379169 908559 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle fix < 1316379170 284781 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Function fix :: (a -> a) -> a < 1316379170 325842 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad.Fix fix :: (a -> a) -> a < 1316379170 343520 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :module Control.Monad.Fix < 1316379177 442717 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Why do electronics disintegrate in my hands? < 1316379178 661927 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not enough people are signing my epetition < 1316379181 981740 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pauli effect? < 1316379309 814743 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316379389 580259 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :a non-spam esoforum message appears! < 1316379456 662021 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it's a brainfuck derivative. < 1316379502 115199 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix.(:) < 1316379502 846694 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. a -> [a] < 1316379519 14771 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :repeat? < 1316379522 328672 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1316379549 518277 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix.(++) -- cycle < 1316379550 389615 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (Monoid a) => a -> a < 1316379556 560126 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...or that. < 1316379564 887721 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcycle < 1316379616 64587 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :micyle < 1316379640 470376 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I would think you cannot tell the answer to "when there's an evil twin, does the evil twin think he has a good twin or that his good twin is his evil twin?" in general; you need to determine by each specific case < 1316379641 514909 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> head 20 $ fix.(:) 1 < 1316379642 208656 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `a -> a' against inferred type `[t]' < 1316379662 276140 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymee: precedence error < 1316379667 671913 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> take 20 $ fix.(:) 1 < 1316379668 548374 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : Couldn't match expected type `[a -> a]' < 1316379668 566344 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : against inferred type `[t] ... < 1316379673 574481 :Lymee!~moe@unaffiliated/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> take 20 $ (fix.(:)) 1 < 1316379675 11403 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1] < 1316379730 559970 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fix.(>>) -- forever < 1316379731 437370 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (m :: * -> *) a b. (Monad m) => m a -> m b < 1316380148 829704 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah < 1316380189 363976 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cereal's error messages are _not_ helpful. < 1316380327 10533 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wait, Minecraft prefixes the length of strings in /codepoints/? < 1316380328 943836 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :not /bytes/? < 1316380342 545443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THANK GOD, IT ALMOST AVOIDED USING LENGTH PREFIXES! < 1316380353 520968 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :IT WAS ALMOST SIMPLE TO PARSE THIS ONE FIELD TYPE!!!! ALMOST!! < 1316380375 588965 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :minecraft < 1316380387 109463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, this has ceased to be esoteric, now it's just annoying, I'm going to -minecraft to avoid incurring ais' wra- oh, he's gone < 1316380393 204464 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :STAYING HERE THEN HAHAHAHAHAHAHA < 1316380427 494748 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, apparently all the strings are 240 bytes or less, which might come in handy... < 1316380491 478146 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "Note: this structure is not thread safe. It is not safe to use value of this type simultaneously from multiple threads." < 1316380497 787906 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: suffer with me pls < 1316380503 58752 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yes, it has _pure_ functions operating on it) < 1316380507 763435 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"pure" < 1316380531 388090 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, well at least it's UCS-2, so there's no surrogate. < 1316380532 815909 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :surrogates. < 1316380537 868151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it does /kind of/ prefix the length in bytes. < 1316380688 663524 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh my, 1407808682066025 is a very long string < 1316380703 670783 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316380704 891577 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey monqy < 1316380710 162921 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hii < 1316380719 745014 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many bits are there in a short? hint: the answer is not 64 < 1316380734 277922 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :trick question it's system dependant < 1316380746 706849 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it not < 1316380751 237268 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm bad at bit sizes < 1316380775 420099 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Well, it's actually in UTF-16 elements, so you just multiply by two to get bytes. < 1316380785 259353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: DING DING DING WRONG < 1316380794 552361 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least 16 bits per short, iirc < 1316380803 634825 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It's in UCS-2 elements, so that works. < 1316380810 50730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Were it UTF-16, that would not work. < 1316380812 662832 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surrogate.s < 1316380815 969736 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\.s/.s/ < 1316380817 16018 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/\.s/s./ < 1316380848 672298 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :if your bytes are 16-bit, two bytes is enough for any UTF-16 surrogate pair < 1316380853 46322 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: No, it's a Java string; they are UTF-16, just that everything counts surrogate pairs as two elements. < 1316380858 446418 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ dist/build/mchost/mchost < log < 1316380858 464524 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CHandshake "ehird" < 1316380858 464685 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLogin 17 "ehird" 0 0 0 0 0 0 < 1316380858 464799 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :too few bytes < 1316380858 464908 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :From: demandInput < 1316380858 801371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well... it's a start. < 1316380861 87912 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Oh. Weird. < 1316380883 817890 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes his TH code generate Debug.Trace.trace calls. < 1316380884 863058 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So gross. < 1316380973 353771 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :java.lan.String has a separate API which returns codepoints (as 'int's) decoding the surrogate pairs, but I don't think people generally bother to use it, because it's so clumsy (offsets are still counted as 'char's and all). Still, officially it's UTF-16. < 1316380981 163918 :fizzie!fis@iris.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/lan/lang/ < 1316380985 348522 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There should be more Esoteric Markup Languages < 1316381020 163967 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : getClauseExp = [| Debug.Trace.trace (showHex $(litE (integerL (fromIntegral ptype))) "") $(foldl apE (appE (varE 'pure) (conE pname)) . map fieldGet $ fields) |] < 1316381021 556716 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yesssssssssssssssss < 1316381024 690971 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :markup is kind of boringggggggggg < 1316381039 849495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : getClauseExp = [| Debug.Trace.trace (showHex ($(litE (integerL (fromIntegral ptype))) :: Int) "") $(foldl apE (appE (varE 'pure) (conE pname)) . map fieldGet $ fields) |] < 1316381039 867972 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :EVEN BETTER < 1316381041 415282 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice TH < 1316381053 647123 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I implemented Maybe as an instance of Quasi (in Template Haskell) < 1316381056 804622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay, I misparse 0D. < 1316381077 208750 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goodnight < 1316381079 645487 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, float/double confusion. < 1316381079 821789 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: oh? < 1316381079 839863 :Ngevd!~nathan@host-78-146-164-99.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: what a big quitter he is, eh? < 1316381081 75330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: goodnight < 1316381092 772940 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Yes. runIO is the only unimplemented method. < 1316381100 652047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not monqy. < 1316381111 22429 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: Yes. < 1316381140 938257 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do the rest work, then? < 1316381184 197764 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t encodeFloat < 1316381184 896395 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is this: instance Quasi Maybe where { qNewName = const Nothing; qReport _ _ = Just (); qRecover = flip mplus; qReify = const Nothing; qClassInstances _ _ = Nothing; qLocation = Nothing; qRunIO _ = error "Cannot run I/O in Maybe"; }; < 1316381185 74633 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (RealFloat a) => Integer -> Int -> a < 1316381192 237368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What. < 1316381197 12125 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, hmm. < 1316381198 405266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Serialize Double where < 1316381198 580579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : put d = put (decodeFloat d) < 1316381199 802698 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : get = liftM2 encodeFloat get get < 1316381201 720831 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :instance Serialize Float where < 1316381203 814160 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : put f = put (decodeFloat f) < 1316381205 727983 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : get = liftM2 encodeFloat get get < 1316381207 818904 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is not right. < 1316381209 910259 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think? < 1316381212 3510 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this right? < 1316381214 293699 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t decodefloat < 1316381214 963229 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `decodefloat' < 1316381216 357418 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t decodeFloat < 1316381217 228706 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a. (RealFloat a) => a -> (Integer, Int) < 1316381218 797582 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the state monad I could probably make better implementations of these things. < 1316381227 340788 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's not right. < 1316381244 105354 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :your instance looks kind of useless :( < 1316381254 592326 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any Quasi laws < 1316381267 108231 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: I don't know. But if there is, I hope to fix it. < 1316381281 966354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- Conversions use 'STUArray' and the 'ST' monad to reinterpret bytes < 1316381282 138201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- and get /what we assume to be/ the IEEE 754 binary representation < 1316381282 156071 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- of single and double precision floating point numbers. < 1316381283 187461 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :One reason I have it is simply to get an Exp from a [| ... |] < 1316381284 445656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad doggy :( < 1316381295 423328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Hey, you should port your float/double code to Haskell :-P < 1316381357 968601 :ive!~nn@189.179.246.222 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1316381604 189963 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I make an instance of a state monad? < 1316381625 688739 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@src MonadState < 1316381625 864051 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Source not found. You untyped fool! < 1316381629 171223 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1316381634 586599 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-221-248.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1316381645 383669 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t put < 1316381646 255647 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall s (m :: * -> *). (MonadState s m) => s -> m () < 1316381652 710101 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's that class, anyway < 1316381695 142224 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make "instance Quasi (State QuasiState)" but it won't accept that. < 1316381749 453431 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: do you have FlexibleInstances option? < 1316381804 622839 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, it seems to work now. < 1316381823 539667 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise there are some stupid ancient restrictions on instances and their types < 1316381834 310113 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1316381882 795099 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :standards compliance i assume < 1316382034 394366 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :originally it was presumably to make type classes easy to implement < 1316382166 36675 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Haskell 2010, the first revision in 12 years, only did a couple tiny changes to the fundamentals < 1316382187 831386 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of the language, i don't think they touched type classes) < 1316382330 639516 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly they just incorporated the ffi and hierarchical module addendas, i think. and removed n+k patterns. < 1316382355 327221 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was n+k later... < 1316382418 511298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a syntax change, I think < 1316382425 400944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to that stupid layout rule that nobody uses < 1316382427 668371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :("reparse if fail") < 1316382433 630713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or was it just making dangling else work < 1316382436 238750 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as it does in all implementations < 1316382436 938813 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1316382444 671360 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, Haskell has never been easy to implement :P < 1316382447 282555 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the reparse if fail < 1316382452 609745 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :FlexibleInstances really needs to be default. < 1316382456 858051 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was the operator precedence iirc < 1316382468 363071 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was detached from the main parsing, to make things sane < 1316382472 384430 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Um, is there an 0x84 packet type? < 1316382475 523045 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's certainly not on the wiki. < 1316382495 503949 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcmap doesn't know it either. Hmph. < 1316382526 425610 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure I'm not desync'd either: < 1316382529 214642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CPlayerPosition 281.69999998807907 27.0 28.62000000476837 46.51032322405371 True < 1316382529 233366 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CRespawn < 1316382529 233496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CKeepAlive 16777344 < 1316382529 233601 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CKeepAlive 0 < 1316382529 233705 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed reading: Unknown packet type 0x84 < 1316382529 775094 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Empty call stack < 1316382553 577953 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh hmm what < 1316382567 552082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : , packet 0x09 "CRespawn" [] -- dunno < 1316382569 491986 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not helpful, past me < 1316382578 549261 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also pattern guards. http://www.haskell.org/onlinereport/haskell2010/haskellli2.html#x3-5000 < 1316382637 208660 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not much in there, but at least the changes were good.... < 1316382659 173055 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pattern guards are standard now? Great < 1316382683 786649 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, entity_animate is sent by the client, apparently. :/ < 1316382855 727754 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dangling else wasn't mentioned, but it see from http://www.haskell.org/onlinereport/haskell2010/haskellch3.html#x8-320003.6 that it was changed < 1316382875 991108 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool < 1316382905 448856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/haskell-prime/wiki/DoAndIfThenElse < 1316382905 624035 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/haskell-prime/wiki/NondecreasingIndentation < 1316382913 729553 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the first was accepted too < 1316382922 60364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, I use that style in one place in Shiro :-P < 1316383025 299528 :derdon!~derdon@p5DE88F59.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316383219 108566 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i don't think NondecreasingIndentation is there < 1316383234 543046 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1316383287 854818 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I managed to make instance Quasi (State QuasiState) < 1316383307 252805 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i see from < 1316383336 800975 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't implement recover, reify, classInstances, or runIO. It might be possible to implement later, though. < 1316383345 709471 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I know what its implementation should be. < 1316383400 944209 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also "that stupid layout rule which no one uses" is probably used quite a bit. one-liners in particular. < 1316383413 306109 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: It's not used at all because nobody implements it. < 1316383424 680736 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They implement similar behaviour in a different manner. < 1316383428 921023 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1316383443 217565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go ask the GHC devs whether they implement layout by reparsing on failure < 1316383446 2787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: I'm afraid I'm likely to make my TH generate less applicative output :-) < 1316383463 305911 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: (I'm micro-optimising ahead of my time for the hell of it and the Applicative stuff is not inlined out) < 1316383479 174082 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i thought you were talking about the insertion of } at syntax error... < 1316383547 962187 :Zuu!~zuu@unaffiliated/zuu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316383568 601921 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think I am; I'm not sure of the specifics < 1316383599 29012 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.haskell.org/onlinereport/haskell2010/haskellch10.html#x17-17800010.3 < 1316383622 735308 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i guess i should look at h98 version < 1316383703 575266 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :With the Maybe instance I can do that: extractQ :: Q a -> a; extractQ = maybe (error "No value in Quasi") id . runQ; < 1316383725 706198 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-221-248.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1316383754 509898 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: what they _did_ remove is the dependency on operator fixities, which indeed no one implemented, because it's insane < 1316383824 132946 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the dependency on operator fixities? < 1316383869 334778 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://haskell.org/onlinereport/syntax-iso.html end of section 9.3 < 1316383982 583092 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically when operator fixities were allowed to affect whether there is the kind of syntax error which needs inserting a }, things get horribly complicated (especially since fixities can be defined anywhere, even later in the file or in a local scope), so no one ever implemented it that way < 1316384059 801496 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've heard rumors of someone managing to make a paradoxical case where the } insertion affected the size of the local scope of a definition such at the } should be inserted iff it wasn't :P < 1316384067 866158 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*such that < 1316384142 285288 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that, i may be confusing somewhat with my own thoughts on the matter < 1316384166 415385 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's beautiful :P < 1316384171 666608 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe that was what was being talked about, then < 1316384718 383383 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the fixities are not considered, then the underlying layout-free haskell syntax presumably becomes context-free and handleable by a yacc-style parser. since i vaguely think that's how ghc does it. < 1316384846 710206 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, I can understand why to remove the stuff mentioned at the end of section 9.3 because it can be difficult to implement, I read about how some things are implemented in GHC, and fixities are not known at parsing time, so that would make it difficult to implement. < 1316384869 30131 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1316385100 805848 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-210.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1316385100 835159 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-43-210.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1316385100 853034 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316385166 182592 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1316385215 808238 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[GblId, Arity=2, Caf=NoCafRefs, Str=DmdType LU(SAAAAAAAA)] < 1316385221 243744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :SAAAAAAAA! < 1316385260 900733 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like the core is preparing to attack < 1316385263 862354 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :at this point oerjan notices I'm reading core and fears for the safety of neighbouring towns < 1316385265 260472 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :snap < 1316385339 55755 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Core - the story of how haskell destroyed northern england < 1316385361 310847 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: here's a sad thing: GHC turns my "case" on a bunch of Word8 constants (with a single default case) into a bunch of nested if/then/elses, at least at the Core level, rather than some sort of jump table < 1316385372 675232 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was all a plot by the glaswegians < 1316385388 601357 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might have to write my own, say by creating a Data.Vector of monadic actions < 1316385408 139268 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or one of GHC's low-level array things < 1316385451 983729 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1316385455 17058 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316385481 747225 :Patashu!~Patashu@c122-106-155-219.carlnfd1.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1316385504 115516 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :even after optimization? (not that i know this stuff) < 1316385510 471900 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :food -> < 1316385567 921767 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, -O2 < 1316385693 749903 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1316385738 282389 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no i mean, are you printing the core after the optimization stage, i think there are different options... < 1316385809 559132 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-ddump-simpl < 1316385823 487896 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : -ddump-simpl < 1316385823 836453 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : Dump final simplifier output < 1316385823 854470 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : [dynamic] < 1316385824 394258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes < 1316385832 59386 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently GHC never does it, alas < 1316385838 682310 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but backends might, I guess < 1316386150 615057 :FireFly!~firefly@unaffiliated/firefly QUIT :Quit: FireFly < 1316386376 818093 :ive!~nn@189.179.246.222 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316386491 434222 :NihilistDandy!~ND@stu-165-155-171-184.champlain.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316386562 735332 :NihilistDandy!~ND@stu-165-155-171-184.champlain.edu QUIT :Client Quit < 1316386586 659853 :NihilistDandy!~ND@stu-165-155-171-184.champlain.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1316387634 687750 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1316388501 840585 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?t \f x y -> flip f x `fmap` y < 1316388501 994371 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you meant: tell thank you thanks thx ticker time todo todo-add todo-delete topic-cons topic-init topic-null topic-snoc topic-tail topic-tell type . ? @ ft v < 1316388504 352707 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?ty \f x y -> flip f x `fmap` y < 1316388506 532220 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a a1 b (f :: * -> *). (Functor f) => (a -> a1 -> b) -> a1 -> f a -> f b < 1316388510 49417 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle (a -> a1 -> b) -> a1 -> f a -> f b < 1316388510 571264 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad liftM2 :: Monad m => (a1 -> a2 -> r) -> m a1 -> m a2 -> m r < 1316388510 745688 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Applicative liftA2 :: Applicative f => (a -> b -> c) -> f a -> f b -> f c < 1316388510 763604 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude scanr :: (a -> b -> b) -> b -> [a] -> [b] < 1316388515 100237 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmph. < 1316388640 691874 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1316388784 147627 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \f x y -> Prelude.flip f x `fmap` y < 1316388784 877617 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b c (f :: * -> *). (Functor f) => (a -> b -> c) -> b -> f a -> f c < 1316388786 587619 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet JOIN :#esoteric < 1316388792 684118 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1316388862 6410 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl \f x -> fmap . flip f x < 1316388862 181809 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :((fmap .) .) . flip < 1316388887 483364 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1316388914 514954 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.32 JOIN :#esoteric < 1316388934 775950 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl \fmap flip -> ((fmap .) .) . flip < 1316388934 949020 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(.) . (.) . (.) < 1316389082 712952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1316389173 24516 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t flip < 1316389173 720930 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) a b. (Functor f) => f (a -> b) -> a -> f b < 1316389219 191520 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl \ f x y -> flip f x `fmap` y < 1316389219 365844 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fmap .) . flip < 1316389228 109540 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \f x y -> flip x (f `fmap` y) < 1316389228 846519 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) b a b1 (f1 :: * -> *). (Functor f1, Functor f) => (a -> b1) -> f (f1 b1 -> b) -> f1 a -> f b < 1316389230 279948 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl \ fmap flip -> (fmap .) . flip < 1316389230 451700 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(.) . (.) < 1316389235 541211 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1316389245 22485 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1316389259 874967 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \f x y -> f `fmap` y `flip` x < 1316389260 784894 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a a1 b (f :: * -> *). (Functor f) => (a -> a1 -> b) -> a1 -> f a -> f b < 1316389266 5605 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*MWAHAHAHAHA* < 1316389275 319465 :sllide!~jari@ip565eb113.direct-adsl.nl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1316389297 974211 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl \f x y -> f `fmap` y `flip` x < 1316389298 152321 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :flip . (flip .) . fmap < 1316389333 324744 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION sits down to watch heads explode < 1316389335 877223 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fmap fmap fmap < 1316389336 746843 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) a b (f1 :: * -> *). (Functor f, Functor f1) => (a -> b) -> f (f1 a) -> f (f1 b) < 1316389375 853294 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t fmap fmap (fmap fmap fmap) < 1316389376 550710 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) (f1 :: * -> *) a b (f2 :: * -> *). (Functor f, Functor f1, Functor f2) => (a -> b) -> f (f1 (f2 a)) -> f (f1 (f2 b)) < 1316389406 247996 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is good < 1316389449 472094 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :caleskell flip should definitely be an operator somewhere < 1316389462 452243 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it useful < 1316389479 115945 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t flip < 1316389479 986719 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall (f :: * -> *) a b. (Functor f) => f (a -> b) -> a -> f b < 1316389487 296929 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1316389492 147960 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?hoogle f (a -> b) -> a -> f b < 1316389492 844328 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Applicative (<*>) :: Applicative f => f (a -> b) -> f a -> f b < 1316389493 42779 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad ap :: Monad m => m (a -> b) -> m a -> m b < 1316389493 60301 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Applicative (<**>) :: Applicative f => f a -> f (a -> b) -> f b < 1316389498 173190 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, how does that work? < 1316389499 569230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no pure < 1316389506 653217 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah that thing < 1316389515 572674 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks useful but flip is a bad name for it < 1316389519 377775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :?djinn Functor f => f (a -> b) -> a -> f b < 1316389519 934765 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: Class not found: Functor < 1316389523 843859 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: help < 1316389552 934587 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t \ff x -> fmap ($x) ff < 1316389553 805265 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forall a b (f :: * -> *). (Functor f) => f (a -> b) -> a -> f b < 1316389559 552555 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just about to say that < 1316389566 653407 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :except with a isntead of x and f instead of ff < 1316389574 137713 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a space between \ and f < 1316389581 111430 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and $ and a < 1316389602 427754 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I was about to ask a question about zip and map but then I realised that I was using mapM so it was irrelevant :( < 1316389614 384127 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :?pl \ f a -> fmap ($ a) f < 1316389614 562329 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :flip (fmap . flip id) < 1316389637 688353 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-215-70.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :irrelevant? < 1316389646 996591 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i think fmap and caleskell flip together implement the intuition that when you combine applicatives where all except one term is a pure, only Functor is really needed. < 1316389655 538160 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: oh right < 1316389659 932669 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oerjan did it < 1316389660 623961 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :before < 1316389661 184115 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1316389662 230991 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1316389669 86884 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah < 1316389680 553923 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I kind of find Functors ugly :( < 1316389688 659763 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because of the weird restriction to one-argument functions < 1316389696 543243 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be nice if there was a way to get N-argument functions without pure < 1316389706 512033 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe just f a -> f b -> f (a,b) < 1316389921 587976 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can get that with just <*> and <$>, i think < 1316389945 482389 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: how < 1316389947 448558 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1316389948 834898 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right you can < 1316389969 736779 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the question is, what can you implement (<$>) for but not (<*>)? and is it interesting at all? :P < 1316389999 68889 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well Functors are mathematically fundamental < 1316390003 431354 :Vorpal!~AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1316390039 89572 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yeah, I'm just wondering if they're Haskelly fundamental :P < 1316390094 314950 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i think (,) a is an example < 1316390106 856672 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: No, (,) is an Applicative. < 1316390110 126617 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's Writer. < 1316390119 935186 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that requires a constraint though < 1316390123 426320 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: not without Monoid restriction on a < 1316390130 169594 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need some way to combine two a's < 1316390137 588100 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, OK. < 1316390142 79421 :shachaf!~shachaf@204.109.63.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Map k has an instance of Functor. < 1316390172 921953 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty obviously an Applicative too, i think < 1316390199 981477 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in an analogous way as ZipList, just throw away non-common keys < 1316390262 681094 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :might even be a Monad < 1316390314 537396 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, no return/pure is the problem < 1316390351 586456 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :scratch that