< 1330041681 770877 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: ha, your suggestion might actually be required to implement e.g. 99bob < 1330041683 986822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :to terminate a loop < 1330041728 867200 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1C4C1.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330041895 280247 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No loops are necessary to implement 99bob ;) < 1330041974 953064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :True :P < 1330041988 455092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohh, I don't need dynamic statement creation < 1330041992 515539 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just line templates < 1330042006 141431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except I'd need universally quantified don't-come-froms >_> < 1330042080 42667 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't-come-froms in the type system < 1330042158 604596 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does one describe a programming language capable of implementing 99bob through more interesting means than cat does :) < 1330042206 307591 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :nbob in O(log n) strokes < 1330042219 513810 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're feeling particularly generous, o(n) < 1330042230 438249 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uhhh, O(log n) is impossible. < 1330042238 119493 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :As usual, see Knuth for more information < 1330042293 892793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha, waitasecond < 1330042302 333928 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the very least, the number of bytes you have to write is O(n), so there will be an O(n) multiplier. You can't do better than O(n). And cat can do it in O(n). < 1330042315 830409 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: i think he's referring to program size < 1330042319 779967 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ohhhhhhhhhh < 1330042329 750780 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't sure what "stroke" meant X-D < 1330042349 448970 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program is extensionally equivalent to the output, anyway, so the output size is also o(n). < 1330042353 699220 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the intuition we want is that an nbob program can be written which is parameterized on n. < 1330042423 512000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, < 1330042424 791399 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 20 and don't come from 199 and set n to 100 < 1330042424 978336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 10 and set n to n-1 < 1330042424 978536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 don't come from 100+(n==0) and exit < 1330042424 978642 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :101 don't come from 10 and don't print n < 1330042432 42486 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But having (==) is totally cheating, so lemme rework this... < 1330042463 828890 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :The fun thing is that your programs are mostly uncomposable. < 1330042471 670333 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 20 and don't come from 100 and set n to 100 < 1330042471 856927 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 10 and set n to n-1 < 1330042471 857119 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 don't come from 100-n and exit < 1330042471 857221 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :100 don't come from 10 and don't print n < 1330042475 15224 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it is less fun when you write the programs. < 1330042483 781433 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tada, that's for (int i=99;i;i--) printf("%d\n",i) < 1330042489 175614 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*i); < 1330042491 980475 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or close to it, anyway. < 1330042525 760316 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is the best paradigm, you guys. < 1330042539 537289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, "exit" is redundant < 1330042546 93502 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just create a line that nothing can come from, and that can't come from itself < 1330042552 474463 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That will lead to execution. < 1330042555 143696 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1330042556 382423 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*termination < 1330042562 41449 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or execution of the program's life :P < 1330042593 200496 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The best thing about the CAPTCHA is it tells me when I forget to log in X-D < 1330042611 60969 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 100 and set n to 100 < 1330042611 247756 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 10 and don't come from 30 and set n to n-1 < 1330042611 434495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 don't come from 10 and don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 100-n and exit < 1330042611 434671 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :100 don't come from 10 and don't come from 30 and print n < 1330042617 781300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: The old wiki had a CAPTCHA too :P < 1330042619 822408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was just bad. < 1330042631 664142 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh? I ... never noticed somehow??? < 1330042638 992277 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was just a trivial sum. < 1330042657 924695 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was it already visible before you tried to edit? Maybe I just never thought about it because it didn't really interrupt me. < 1330042684 507748 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 200 and set n to 100 < 1330042684 710215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 10 and don't come from 30 and set n to n-1 < 1330042684 897009 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 don't come from 10 and don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 200-n and exit < 1330042684 897202 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :200 don't come from 10 and don't come from 30 and print n < 1330042685 391446 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fix't < 1330042694 260304 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(100-n would be actual program lines sometimes >_>) < 1330042701 653466 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: It showed up once you tried to edit for the first time. < 1330042706 600190 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: is this a mix of INTERCAL and Forte? < 1330042717 12588 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was based on the same "framework", just disabled for registrations and using a simpler CAPTCHA module. < 1330042720 691787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No Forte, numbers don't change :P < 1330042732 65748 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: But it's an INTERCALish-control-flow constraint-solving tarpit. < 1330042737 105735 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL, to be precise. < 1330042743 774398 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CLC and J-INTERCAL, too. < 1330042749 258390 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no, every INTERCAL apart from the original. < 1330042754 655970 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And COME FROM is undeniably INTERCALish :P < 1330042786 367548 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Basically, all you have on every line is an arbitrary number of don't come froms and one optional "additional" command (set, print, input or exit). < 1330042806 926775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control flow starts at line 10, and then goes wherever it's not banned. < 1330042961 582226 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330042973 143173 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Come on, this is great!!!!!!!!! ! ! < 1330043232 132825 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-250-44.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330043359 423861 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-222-220.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330043728 76171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: I pronounce fancy L as "L". < 1330043741 727053 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Fancy L" is an ugly pronunciation. < 1330043757 217940 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pronounce fancy l as "ℒ" < 1330043777 244980 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :me 2 < 1330043798 11363 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pronounce fancy L as ⅃ < 1330043831 936933 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-248-197.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330043839 699518 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quadruple L: 卐 < 1330043866 853871 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :box :'( < 1330043960 567597 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-250-44.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1330044008 155772 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1330044011 814353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :me 2 < 1330044340 467360 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-248-197.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :卍卍卍？ < 1330044421 532334 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :me 3 < 1330044449 511415 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :me 9 < 1330044472 997654 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :me G_{G_64} < 1330044492 74506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :help < 1330044525 98302 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow at some date observations on Reddit < 1330044540 92545 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dobservations < 1330044551 4817 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :HTML and Linux were initially announced within a week of each other < 1330044621 205895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, print and input should probably operate with ASCII, not digits < 1330044630 420725 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but one statement per character would be... < 1330044634 320944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :incredibly tedious < 1330044646 529411 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I'll just have both print and print < 1330045078 875278 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330045483 969081 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have added a few more to Truth-machine < 1330045595 293308 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1330045625 617899 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: are you sure dc is an esolang? :P < 1330045640 661933 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-248-197.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1330045731 549634 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1330045778 532608 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it can be implemented anyways just to show the use of a few other programming languages that are different from others common ones. < 1330045805 873850 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :righ < 1330045807 110113 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :tt < 1330045962 847588 :cheater_!~cheater@dslb-084-057-032-076.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1330045993 119476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant: How painful is using Trifecta? < 1330046702 918326 :cheater_!~cheater@dslb-084-057-004-229.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330047234 367148 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-204-1.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330047481 285521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> m a < 1330047481 699927 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List find :: (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> Maybe a < 1330047481 886611 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude dropWhile :: (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> [a] < 1330047481 886810 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List dropWhile :: (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> [a] < 1330047490 1640 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> m (Maybe a) < 1330047490 325171 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List find :: (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> Maybe a < 1330047490 511786 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Foldable find :: Foldable t => (a -> Bool) -> t a -> Maybe a < 1330047490 511998 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.List findIndex :: (a -> Bool) -> [a] -> Maybe Int < 1330047653 636756 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle local < 1330047653 953326 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :System.IO localeEncoding :: TextEncoding < 1330047654 140055 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :GHC.IO.Encoding localeEncoding :: TextEncoding < 1330047654 140252 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Time.LocalTime module Data.Time.LocalTime < 1330047695 877691 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-252-105.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330047698 389807 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I solved today. It was fun. You recommended io.smashthestack.org once, right? < 1330047741 705452 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i too solved it today < 1330047748 655128 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking forward to my free t-shirt < 1330047752 145383 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :io.sts is a lot of fun < 1330047764 718060 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :level06 was insidious. < 1330047777 636737 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spent far too long trying to do it in ways that didn't work. < 1330047786 575818 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :of the stripe one? < 1330047790 512331 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's not that I'm insidious so much as that I'm stubborn. < 1330047794 146182 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I haven't done other ones. < 1330047809 278368 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you enjoyed it you should play io :D < 1330047822 42127 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also spent far too long trying to stuff use argv[0] instead of buf in level03 < 1330047838 341020 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nod* < 1330047839 437125 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got it working without ASLR. < 1330047842 121903 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-204-1.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1330047843 891572 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(how does this channel feel about spoilers?) < 1330047895 21638 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I guess that was a spoiler. < 1330047902 809339 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Well, I just /clear'd in case I want to try it later. < 1330047909 171234 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I probably won't. < 1330048269 511396 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any opinions on Enlightenment? < 1330048435 893891 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Opinions < 1330048493 328473 :NihilistDandy!~NihilistD@65.183.136.231 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Mu. < 1330048522 257847 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :any opinions on the Enlightenment desktop environment? < 1330048554 444894 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sux < 1330048556 958541 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hth < 1330048561 720582 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1330048571 358620 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lisp or Tcl? < 1330048585 929123 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lisp < 1330049010 430552 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-237-234.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330049041 643235 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-252-105.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1330049635 49815 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :have any of you guys switched to Gnome 3 and found it usable? < 1330050170 718176 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330050193 173093 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :# of people in here who have tried gnome 3: at least 2 < 1330050197 875 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :# of people in here who have tried gnome 3 and disliked it: at least 2 < 1330050371 102167 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel so stuck when it comes to desktop environments... < 1330050379 736338 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just want a well-maintained GNOME 2 forever. :P < 1330050382 524652 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically. < 1330050465 277848 :[insertnickhere]!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330050475 560293 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe one day GNOME will be like "okay guys we were wrong we're switching back to a traditional desktop environment!" < 1330050486 4573 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hahaha) < 1330050505 409868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: just use xfce or switch to something better < 1330050506 434661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle lookupWithDefault < 1330050506 621526 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No results found < 1330050517 670565 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"something better" what would that be. < 1330050527 811079 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a desktop environment < 1330050528 15725 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the one I'm looking for. < 1330050539 423180 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :/kick monqy < 1330050544 425285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle liftIO < 1330050544 622183 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.CGI liftIO :: MonadIO m => IO a -> m a < 1330050544 808918 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad.IO.Class liftIO :: MonadIO m => IO a -> m a < 1330050544 809114 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Network.CGI liftIO :: MonadIO m => forall a. IO a -> m a < 1330050552 522280 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Something that isn't a DE. < 1330050571 640383 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use xmonad. < 1330050575 897366 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :me too < 1330050576 99418 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh..... < 1330050591 829069 :[insertnickhere]!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh? < 1330050605 272027 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd have to invest a lot of time to even figure out if I want to use it. < 1330050616 693869 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I haven't. < 1330050618 121476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That applies to every environment equally. < 1330050622 998019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It took me 2 days.) < 1330050637 352413 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it would be easier to get accustomed to than something like gnome 3 < 1330050642 107912 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :due to the minimal features. < 1330050649 752850 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmonad is not minimal. < 1330050652 407360 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not with xmonad-contrib, anyway. < 1330050665 763147 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're running Arch now right? < 1330050698 32485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I plan to migrate to Debian. < 1330050703 75046 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, why? < 1330050729 849866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because Arch is annoying me and I use Debian on solidity anyway. < 1330050742 176921 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard bad things about out-of-date packages, which is the main reason I want to try something like Arch. < 1330050789 681232 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian stable is out-of-date. Debian testing is not. < 1330050807 900855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian unstable is even less out-of-date (by a few weeks, and it keeps going through the release freeze), but is unstable. < 1330050811 777538 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the version of GHC for testing? < 1330050814 616975 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You use Ubuntu, yes? < 1330050817 805736 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this is the ultimate test) < 1330050818 369636 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1330050821 716119 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If so, then testing will be more up to date than what you have. < 1330050824 5899 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :11.04, still. < 1330050830 846266 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because lolunity < 1330050837 838630 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://packages.debian.org/testing/haskell/ghc6 7.0.4 < 1330050844 200012 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://packages.debian.org/unstable/haskell/ghc6 has 7.4.1, so testing should get it sometime soonish. < 1330050857 707289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(within the next few weeks, or maybe a month or two at the worst) < 1330050858 754356 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see I see. < 1330050864 446400 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not bad at all. < 1330050873 79622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Arch has 7.0.3.) < 1330050881 218418 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(7.2 was in [testing], but got removed.) < 1330050904 132478 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's just called "ghc" nowadays, not ghc6. < 1330050907 578098 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably because it's no longer version 6. < 1330050917 327185 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, good call Debian. < 1330050935 537721 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was basically debating Debian vs. Arch < 1330050941 234825 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I'll just try Debian. < 1330050961 366404 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/daily-builds/daily/arch-latest/amd64/iso-cd/ < 1330050967 998181 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(http://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/daily-builds/daily/arch-latest/amd64/iso-cd/debian-testing-amd64-netinst.iso to be specific.) < 1330050981 756980 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use the graphical installer (not expert), use empty root password to get sudo. < 1330050988 393209 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remember to de-check "Desktop environment", or it'll install GNOME. < 1330050994 428258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do it in a VM first. < 1330051002 934524 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait I have to decide on what WM/DE I want. < 1330051009 490788 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do that after installation. < 1330051035 930660 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that requires me to actually make a swift decision. < 1330051061 112025 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, not with a VM < 1330051176 422705 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: If you do use xmonad, don't use Debian's. < 1330051181 505231 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay. < 1330051182 811783 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This applies to Haskell packages in general.) < 1330051187 956360 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is OK to use Debian's cabal-install, however. < 1330051191 533940 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try it out in VirtualBox. I've certainly procrastinated long enough. < 1330051222 782309 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cabal install xmonad is fine? < 1330051237 713324 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's fine. (You'll want cabal install xmonad-contrib pretty soon after that for non-trivial configuration.) < 1330051245 533231 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that occasionally the nightly installer can fail to install a working system, but that's rare and will fix itself in a day or two. < 1330051260 49917 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The testing installer image is actually the nightly testing build of the installer itself that just happens to install testing.) < 1330051274 963916 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there such a thing as a command line web browser? < 1330051316 734249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you seriously not know the answer to that? < 1330051354 219948 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330051372 947197 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't had a need for a command line web browser. < 1330051390 154673 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sudo apt-get install (w3m|lynx) < 1330051392 225668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Preferably w3m.) < 1330051397 360302 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But come on, how do you not know about lynx? < 1330051412 20630 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what set of circumstances would lead me to know about lynx? < 1330051449 256395 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :wget $1 --output-document=- | html2text | less < 1330051464 505298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: The internet. < 1330051500 676143 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1330051612 788641 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol this flash support SUCKS < 1330051618 839161 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :come on where's my Web 2.0? < 1330051638 798852 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats that < 1330051647 538757 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the second version of Web < 1330051662 89205 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1330051664 743326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Come on, w3m can do images. < 1330051750 101100 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :reading Wikipedia is actually pretty reasonable. < 1330051803 926756 :[insertnickhere]!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :PiRSquared < 1330051837 30025 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm # thingies don't work correctly... < 1330051840 184927 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember what they're called < 1330051865 706555 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1330051867 647967 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :suddenly, they work! < 1330051890 911439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1330051925 654575 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, # thingies < 1330051926 994445 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the URLs < 1330051946 337980 :PiRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pound/hash/bangs? < 1330051957 433594 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no they have a name... < 1330052023 686126 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I have 4 GBs of memory, is 500 MBs reasonable for a VirtualBox install of Debian? < 1330052026 918325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: anchors < 1330052039 258650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 512 is reasonable, 1024 would be reasonable too < 1330052051 18834 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :check free -m (second line) to see how much you can give away < 1330052066 779776 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm using exactly half of my memory right now. < 1330052263 708144 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :VirtualBox.exe Private Bytes 144,520 K Working Set 108,544 K < 1330052274 220430 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1330052589 61703 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: WINDOWS USER DETECTED < 1330052592 784647 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sirens
< 1330052686 419300 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :mv /usr/bin/VirtualBox /usr/bin/VirtualBox.exe < 1330052737 790977 :NihilistDandy!~NihilistD@65.183.136.231 QUIT : < 1330052765 877317 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Good night < 1330052893 355127 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow this installer is really swift... < 1330052912 8789 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Longer than Ubuntu's... < 1330052924 9525 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the interface part. < 1330052928 559806 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the actual installation. < 1330052932 12623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Oh, and you don't want the automatic HD formatting stuff. < 1330052938 397110 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It creates like 4 partitions. < 1330052941 580146 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1330052948 220530 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll offer to organise the HD partitions for you. < 1330052952 861805 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1330052953 957795 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no thanks < 1330052955 840977 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just choose the manual partitioner and create one big jfs partition or whatever. < 1330052974 561791 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not have an encrypted home? < 1330052984 764503 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not have an encrypted /? < 1330052987 164502 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, for this VM it matters not... < 1330052990 787648 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or that < 1330053003 654720 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: You can do that by doing that. < 1330053012 66070 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll offer to do LVM stuff for you. < 1330053012 876871 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :All that /home stuff only makes sense for multi-user systems. < 1330053016 147336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, err, have you ever used LVM? < 1330053019 84893 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330053034 7405 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd recommend not caring about encryption, then. < 1330053061 793088 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless that's what Ubuntu does.. < 1330053116 328597 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, well, probably. < 1330053148 303993 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"All files in one partition" that doesn't sound like 4 partitions to me. < 1330053150 745608 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it lying? < 1330053208 183253 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that might work. But it'll use the wrong filesystem. < 1330053237 976778 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :fsvoe wrong < 1330053251 693017 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(note: that's "for some value of elliott") < 1330053273 161445 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I should say fsvoe-wrong < 1330053309 666783 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Well, ext3 is deprecated. < 1330053313 926196 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ext4 is planned to be deprecated by design. < 1330053317 433185 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :btrfs is unstable and Oracle-controlled. < 1330053323 463381 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's almost certainly going to select ext4. < 1330053375 143113 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1330053416 465825 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: So unless you *want* to store your data on something planned-obsolete for btrfs by design... < 1330053446 619810 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1330053462 771630 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe? < 1330053469 978423 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I just don't give a shit for this install... < 1330053570 64855 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The idea of a test install is that you do what you plan to do for real, but whatever. < 1330053574 354950 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the One True Elliott filesystem. < 1330053585 503016 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, put more simply < 1330053587 564462 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you recommend/ < 1330053608 186312 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use jfs. < 1330053611 245090 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my main goal is to see how I like Debian with various interfaces on top. < 1330053619 800995 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the filesystem choice isn't really crucial to any of that. < 1330053636 978768 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, if you try Xfce, don't install xfce4-goodies. Just install the core xfce package. < 1330053681 885737 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Second by the way: Use XFCE. It's the only tolerable one ^^ < 1330053770 141172 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure I already know what to expect from XFCE, but I might try it if I don't like xmonad. < 1330053777 14053 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then, there's always KDE... < 1330053778 464906 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Xfce < 1330053779 173278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Xfce < 1330053779 712149 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PART :#esoteric < 1330053782 995665 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330053787 174379 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Eliot < 1330053787 474834 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :xFCE < 1330053787 876078 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :KDE 4 is unmitigated shit. < 1330053808 834456 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can also ask Friendship, pikhq and Vorpal, former users of KDE 3, if you want a second opinion on this.) < 1330053817 382985 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least I think pikhq used KDE 3. < 1330053853 378933 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's for some reason taking a reaaaalllly long time to erase data on the virtual hard drive its installing itself on... < 1330053862 758372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would it erase data? < 1330053865 958960 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are no existing partitions. < 1330053876 736260 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, I don't know. it is. < 1330053884 887867 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :should I be concerned? :P < 1330053889 937289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :How did you set up the filesystems? < 1330053922 279065 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the automatic settings, on the one sda device available to install on, using encrypted LVM < 1330053932 389572 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and /home partitions < 1330053937 395693 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ < 1330053951 6288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have fun with that. < 1330054081 770378 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay. < 1330054177 205228 :aloril!~aloril@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe7ef900-153.dhcp.inet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1330055229 345540 :Nisstyre!~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1330055334 525371 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :KDE 4 is so, so, so bad :'( < 1330055344 958062 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And KDE 3 was so, so, so good :'( < 1330055445 184442 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :As much as ais wants me to keep this nick, I think I prefer "Gregor" < 1330055473 494720 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gergor < 1330055565 813610 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Why is Parsec? < 1330055638 81457 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ask ddarius. < 1330055656 790055 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, ddarius isn't the maintainer anymore. < 1330056393 797972 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330056717 116982 :PiRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 QUIT :Quit: restarting client < 1330056938 520952 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-201-50.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330057101 346292 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-237-234.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1330057361 258732 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, starting execution at line 10 is ugly. < 1330057370 573033 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle findMin < 1330057370 780345 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.IntMap findMin :: IntMap a -> (Key, a) < 1330057370 966860 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.IntSet findMin :: IntSet -> Int < 1330057371 153399 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Map findMin :: Map k a -> (k, a) < 1330057372 180252 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle minView < 1330057372 409159 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.IntMap minView :: IntMap a -> Maybe (a, IntMap a) < 1330057372 595540 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.IntSet minView :: IntSet -> Maybe (Int, IntSet) < 1330057372 782242 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Map minView :: Map k a -> Maybe (a, Map k a) < 1330057396 495806 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> M.findMin M.empty < 1330057397 412517 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: Map.findMin: empty map has no minimal element < 1330057403 73741 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Look at that shit. < 1330057431 224345 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: M.minView? < 1330057440 105956 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1330057442 421862 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just said that. < 1330057466 756530 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, ASCII partial question, get a partial ANSI < 1330057510 846261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330057536 743375 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :type Exec = ReaderT Program (StateT Env (RandT StdGen IO)) < 1330057707 90347 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do I have enough monads yet? < 1330057810 450558 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should name your program ExecMonad < 1330058196 413470 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what distinguishes RandT from StateT < 1330058435 266697 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Main> System.Random.newStdGen >>= (Control.Monad.Random.runRandT (Control.Monad.State.runStateT (Control.Monad.Reader.runReaderT run test) M.empty) $) < 1330058435 492882 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello, world! < 1330058435 973951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :woot < 1330058528 140974 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-238-175.as43234.net QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1330058546 110499 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, according to the source, RandT is just a newtype of StateT < 1330058571 246754 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-238-175.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330058668 393921 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: What's the difference between anything and \mathbb{N}? < 1330058677 540024 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes we've been over this. < 1330058688 224031 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :notice I didn't say anything about it being useless as a result. < 1330058701 516313 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :RandT, e.g. has no put. < 1330058705 269619 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or get. < 1330058707 640698 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or modify. < 1330058712 108430 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was curious as to what the implementation difference was, I found that the answer was "not very much", and commented on it. < 1330058891 960282 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you think you are going to lose if you have PROFESSOR OAK card? < 1330058946 954617 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat in Tangle: < 1330058948 415279 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 10 and don't come from 21+c and getchar c < 1330058948 602859 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 11+c and don't come from 20 and putchar c < 1330058968 277759 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes my opponent's resistance to my attacks is actually to my advantage < 1330058985 287722 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it isn't really rare either < 1330059004 989436 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Come on, guys, this is literally the perfect paradigm. < 1330059019 66551 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, it's slightly broken. < 1330059030 432347 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 10 and don't come from 21+c and getchar c < 1330059030 619083 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 11+(c%2) and don't come from 20 and putchar c < 1330059033 81393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There. < 1330059036 57176 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (-1) `mod` 2 < 1330059036 864261 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1330059039 955284 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (-1) `rem` 2 < 1330059040 761714 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : -1 < 1330059051 972743 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1330059086 894270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :% almost makes loops TOO EASY. < 1330059105 181463 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't have enough energy to attack, they won't get knocked out, they have not enough energy to retreat either, and they are also confused. < 1330059118 774155 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet zzo38 likes my language. :( < 1330059149 898709 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much do you want to bet? < 1330059157 33881 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :$9,99999999,9999,4 < 1330059166 451277 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats a lot of 4s < 1330059174 992910 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not have that much money do you have a lot of money? < 1330059203 57947 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes lots infinite < 1330059235 575410 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: BTW, sorry for omitting the fact that ℒ is defined as P restricted to just the program L from [[ℒ]]. < 1330059236 12217 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you bet against someone who does have a lots of money? < 1330059239 504869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not quite sure how I managed that. < 1330059243 95495 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott might even have... An awful lot of money. < 1330059252 169454 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is enough for a big diamond, you know. < 1330059329 694570 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-238-175.as43234.net QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1330059376 568368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Do *you* like my language? < 1330059407 252756 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you should mind your language, young man. < 1330059425 363492 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you ever say anything interesting? < 1330059430 342443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I don't. < 1330059438 384005 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: *defined as L restricted to ust the program P < 1330059446 164339 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-238-175.as43234.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330059448 524756 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION hasn't been reading the logs.
< 1330059456 759328 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, an esoteric language in #esoteric? < 1330059460 475540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330059469 580826 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 10 and don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 200 and set n to 100 < 1330059469 767353 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 30 and set n to n-1 < 1330059469 959693 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 don't come from 10 and don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 200-n and exit < 1330059470 146172 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :200 don't come from 10 and don't come from 30 and print n < 1330059474 422130 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go to, like, some other channel for that, man. < 1330059477 40787 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This program prints 99, 98, ..., 0 and then stops. I think. < 1330059478 665252 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I don't like your language. < 1330059486 849278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's the best. < 1330059505 430795 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Needs more indirect comefrom. < 1330059550 713452 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :My opponent is idiotic they keep playing bench pokemon cards but in fact their bench pokemon cards keep getting knocked out due to their resistance to my cards. But even if they didn't do that, they would still lose due to running out of cards in their draw pile because they have card "advantage"... ya, right... what kind of "advantage" is that??? < 1330059601 548012 :coppro_!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Are you confused about the notion of card advantage or quoting? < 1330059626 851242 :coppro_!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca NICK :coppro < 1330059628 339448 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro_: I am not confused. It is my opponent who is confused < 1330059635 757177 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Why doesn't 200 come from 200? < 1330059648 589369 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I told you already < 1330059652 752473 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: card advantage is a significant advantage < 1330059657 906789 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Because it shouldn't jump straight from 200 to 200. < 1330059662 905236 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should go to 20 (to decrement) first. < 1330059677 622148 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: Only if the cards can get them out of the bad situation in time..... < 1330059830 715298 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: What kind of "advantage" is that? < 1330059877 228270 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: In specific moments it may not be the ideal play to go for more cards < 1330059884 645048 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in the long term, the player with more cards wins most TCGs < 1330059887 657465 :MoALTz!~no@host-92-8-238-175.as43234.net QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1330059956 741256 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most games end before anyone gets decked < 1330060044 54891 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually win a quarter of the time due to opponent getting decked because my defense is strong enough (often my opponent's resistance to me and stuff like that is what is to my advantage, not theirs) < 1330060204 102677 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1330060364 704628 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you think that resistance is good thing to have then you are also confused < 1330060390 442311 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :everyone is confused < 1330060411 670659 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you should use your Secret Strategy and use it to win pro games. < 1330060422 897316 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :doubly used. < 1330060432 61864 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: It isn't secret I told you what it is. < 1330060440 145826 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT DO THE PROS KNOW? < 1330060444 464843 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could capitalize off of that. < 1330060446 875157 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :revolutionize the game. < 1330060461 422773 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose the pros must know too, isn't it? < 1330060471 554167 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1330060476 52047 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you never know < 1330060535 337451 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro just threw some fancy strategy-related terminology and you demonstrated how it's meaningless. maybe the pros are just stuck in a broken vocabulary. < 1330060563 137368 :coppro!~scshunt@denardo.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I judge Magic tournaments < 1330060568 300467 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's OK: coppro is just confused. < 1330060583 688780 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: OK; well, I was talking about Pokemon card it is a different game. Specifically, Pokemon card old-style. < 1330060592 114409 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: STICK TO YOUR OWN GAME. < 1330060592 301558 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know in SC2 strategy it's very common that a strategy "just works" because it beats the common trend in that matchup. < 1330060609 67724 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 don't come from 10 and don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 200 and set n to 100 < 1330060609 254496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 don't come from 30 and set n to n-1 < 1330060609 254688 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :30 don't come from 10 and don't come from 20 and don't come from 30 and don't come from 200-n and exit < 1330060609 254800 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :200 don't come from 10 and don't come from 30 and print n < 1330060609 254934 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(10) [10, 20, 30, 200] n = 100 < 1330060611 2416 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(20) [30] n = n-1 < 1330060613 122123 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(30) [10, 20, 30, 200-n] exit < 1330060615 98444 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(200) [10, 30] print n < 1330060617 119381 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: The former is, like, the better syntax, right? < 1330060646 47832 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, most of those strategies are reliable in their own right, but they're especially effective because they beat the common strategy of the month, or whatever. < 1330060653 702145 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't believe there could be a good syntax for this language. < 1330060671 374946 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: You're just jealous because you haven't invented your own esolang. < 1330060693 401078 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's definitely shorter, which is better for an esolang IMO. < 1330060697 943012 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the words are very COBOLy < 1330060737 203347 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I totally did! < 1330060748 672809 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: What does SC2 strategy mean? < 1330060756 386671 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :starcraft 2 < 1330060761 127934 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The definition went something like s/blah/>/ s/bluh/ That makes inputting -2 impossible. < 1330061562 179212 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well... < 1330061568 797627 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just represent n with n-1 < 1330061575 971124 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1330061597 114322 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :quick! exception system! < 1330061609 518332 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also what's the name of this language so I read about it. < 1330061617 402575 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh-oh. < 1330061627 336148 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tangle might be the name. < 1330061629 428494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't decided yet. < 1330061639 464738 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :just make an esoteric exception system < 1330061640 120280 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"@" stands for "Tangle"?! < 1330061646 857758 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recommend the one that I and, I think ais, came up with < 1330061658 987227 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that has a "lower" in addition to a "raise" < 1330061689 773017 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what does the "lower" mean? < 1330061707 216001 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(throw/unthrow works as well, as far as naming) < 1330061727 335781 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :lower would signal the exception down a stack level, or terminate the program if it's at the lowest point already. < 1330061737 681685 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :raise is your typical exception throw, which travels upward. < 1330061757 84708 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you have your directions reversed. < 1330061764 492024 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But running code is always at the (top|bottom)most element of the stack. < 1330061767 336553 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I don't see how that would work. < 1330061780 586859 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that would have to not be the case. < 1330061788 78304 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :during exception handling. < 1330061789 940104 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least. < 1330061800 504605 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so unthrow would work in a catch block only? < 1330061814 576807 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's the simplest way I see it working.. < 1330061825 298847 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's possibly other ways to do it that I haven't considered, of course. < 1330061831 914713 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :CL's conditions can do that. < 1330061843 479104 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. you can raise a condition in the code that raised one, inside a handler thing. < 1330061906 888157 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also in terms of raise/lower mismatch. I'm sorry that I was once a heavy Python user. < 1330061978 198118 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah esoteric exception system < 1330061979 781786 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :best option. < 1330062033 52276 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise a) terminate b) use some special value c) implementation defined < 1330062085 319734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(b) is impossible < 1330062087 278092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) sucks < 1330062091 614808 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(c) i'm writing the impl right now < 1330062108 807637 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :then yeah, since those four options are the DOMAIN OF ALL POSSIBILITY < 1330062121 113565 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means you have to make an esoteric exception system. < 1330062202 214780 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm considering just removing numeric IO support. < 1330062227 15397 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But since there's no way to abstract anything since every change affects the whole program, decimal conversion would be... "fun". < 1330062268 115775 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than that, I'll probably go with (a). < 1330062770 838951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nexts :: Integer -> Program -> Exec [(Integer, Command)] < 1330062771 47366 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nexts i = fmap (`appEndo` []) . execWriterT . mapM_ consider . M.toList < 1330062771 233821 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : where < 1330062771 234037 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : consider (j, Line es c) = do < 1330062771 234142 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : ok <- lift $ noneEqual i es < 1330062771 937868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : when ok . tell . Endo $ ((j, c) :) < 1330062775 106077 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :This would be elegant, were it not so slow. < 1330062907 850638 :Tiktalik!znc@ec2-46-137-240-165.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com NICK :Captain_Obvious < 1330062913 507992 :Captain_Obvious!znc@ec2-46-137-240-165.ap-southeast-1.compute.amazonaws.com NICK :Tiktalik < 1330063601 893276 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Where fungot < 1330063825 929503 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Ping < 1330063924 749483 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if you use indexed writer monad, in case you can use morphisms that are not endomorphisms? < 1330064850 37225 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I assume you keep up with /r/haskell < 1330064858 502274 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note the separation of conduits from resourcet < 1330065569 528431 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do keep up with /r/haskell, yes. < 1330065594 26543 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle m a -> k -> Map k a -> m a < 1330065594 458860 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Map findWithDefault :: Ord k => a -> k -> Map k a -> a < 1330065594 645343 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Graph.Inductive.Query.BFS lesp :: Graph gr => Node -> Node -> gr a b -> LPath b < 1330065594 645527 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Graph.Inductive.Query.BFS esp :: Graph gr => Node -> Node -> gr a b -> Path < 1330068786 224475 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Ping2 < 1330069030 514844 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I see some good ideas came about during the night... don't come from :) < 1330069065 67405 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you implemented that yet? < 1330069077 889983 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: i have a haskell implementation, yes, though one without a parser < 1330069173 163549 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, neat < 1330069274 521092 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just < 1330069323 224019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lineno don't come from X and don't come from Y and ... and (set VAR to EXPR | getint VAR | getchar VAR | putstr "literal string" | putint EXPR | putchar EXPR) < 1330069328 991391 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :except you can also leave out the command on the end < 1330069331 109895 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also X and Y are exprs < 1330069340 468505 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and expr is const/var/negate/add/sub/mul/div/mod < 1330069348 900479 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno whether it needs anything more for the turingosity < 1330069383 820966 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds like it has too little state, unless the variables are arbitrary-precision < 1330069392 749451 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're bignums < 1330069394 885616 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :integers < 1330069421 22818 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :though, yes, you might need "infinite lines" to do BF or such because of that < 1330069421 344377 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, beegnooms < 1330069421 531208 :Madoka-Kaname!~moe@inportb/loli/cirno-chan PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000 - 1 < 1330069422 326303 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : 999999999999999999999999999999999999999 < 1330069424 903199 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :however modulo is very helpful there < 1330069481 321886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: so how much do you know about rsync :P < 1330069506 308379 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :rsync? I've used it < 1330069519 182623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :excellent, how decent is the daemon stuff < 1330069531 460127 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea, I've only used it over ssh < 1330069596 953173 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pah < 1330069720 618685 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-208-189.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330069728 569185 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-201-50.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330069955 180845 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1330069997 701654 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Thanks; WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT SRYNC < 1330069998 731639 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :RSYNC < 1330070023 546871 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't it some kinda band? Wait, no, that was 'N Sync. < 1330070072 438076 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it does deltas. < 1330070083 200332 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :∆s. < 1330070095 597444 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330070108 543791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, be more helpful, 'n shit. < 1330070116 745419 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That's not even a Greek Δ, it was the mathematical-operator ∆.) < 1330070129 806725 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what you want to know about it. < 1330070249 587022 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, the daemon, and shit. < 1330070398 394731 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :'vn't used it; I've just done the pass-over-ssh one. (Though I guess technically it runs the same code, it just spawns the remote side over ssh instead of having a DEMONIC.) < 1330070419 545687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOT YOU TOO < 1330070423 885752 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about zsync? < 1330070524 833350 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I see you interromagated others, like, just before. (Also haven't done any zsyncing.) < 1330070577 837062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should kick yourself. < 1330070580 710998 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For being unhelpful. < 1330070584 43535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :As God I demand it. < 1330070614 212273 :ChanServ!ChanServ@services. MODE #esoteric +o :fizzie > 1330070615 299678 NAMES :#esoteric < 1330070616 340511 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie KICK #esoteric fizzie :We don't tolerate unhelpful people around these parts. < 1330070616 527163 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie JOIN :#esoteric < 1330070625 617015 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you. < 1330070645 350125 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you considered that you may be feeding my narcissistic God complex? < 1330070687 445947 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't generally "consider". < 1330070703 568232 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. I didn't think it'd autojoin. I'm not supposed to have anything like that on. Though maybe it's the bouncer. < 1330070715 287307 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"autojoin_on_kick (default: true): If set to false bip will not attempt to re-join a channel from which you were kicked." < 1330070719 394589 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :What sort of foolishness. < 1330070743 87216 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know channels where you get autobanned for autojoining after an (auto)kick. (Okay, the last one is not typically auto.) < 1330070787 429711 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should be. Can you set up a bot to automatically kick people? < 1330070788 393726 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ಠ_ಠ What client defaults that to true? < 1330070811 189214 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, bip. Missed it. < 1330070821 231271 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note to self: avoid bip < 1330070839 613586 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not exactly a client, but still. < 1330070863 627746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a bouncbereoubrcaerboaercoaerc bonbon. < 1330071060 708866 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I make document new programming language similar Haskell but half of things difference and other things too, then maybe it can be called "Ibtlfmm"? (O, it is like, "Iuckqlwviv Kjugobe", but completely difference except first letter? Also the letter they seem to just put together... but both of these thing have their ways of making the letters) < 1330071095 898270 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330071097 279266 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :> map pred "Iuckqlwviv Kjugobe" < 1330071097 998780 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : "Htbjpkvuhu\USJitfnad" < 1330071153 884308 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both of these thing have their *different* ways of making the letters. < 1330071258 587571 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many Scrabble variants have you played? < 1330071312 975010 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 < 1330071337 881498 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many have you heard of, read about, and/or invented? < 1330071464 687555 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :9 < 1330071509 333672 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: SCRABBLE EXCEPT ALL THE TILES ARE BLANK < 1330071519 327877 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-161-133.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrabble is called alfapet over here < 1330071526 895985 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know about Ecology Scrabble, where if there is blank tile on the board, and you have a letter in your rack which can be used in its place, then you can switch it around (and it is still your turn). < 1330071547 501250 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Scrabble where you flip a coin but it's really really big. < 1330071562 731196 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given 18 minutes per game. < 1330071581 851154 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given 19 minutes per game. < 1330071622 405047 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it the same except the time limit? < 1330071647 509661 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1330071658 400853 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given 40000 minutes per game. < 1330071705 388374 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given 30 minutes per game. < 1330071737 150652 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given G_64 minutes per game. < 1330071750 942099 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given -1 minutes per game. < 1330071778 111733 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there is double-bag Scrabble, in which you put all the consonants in one bag and vowels in another, and then when you pick up tiles from the bag you select at first, how many consonants do you want and how many vowels do you want. < 1330071815 792660 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another idea would be double-deck, where there is twice as many of all tiles; possibly you can extend the board by adding an extra row/column at each edge. < 1330071926 399227 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The way I prefer to treat blanks is that the letter it corresponds to can change at any time as long as it is the same letter at the beginning of your turn as it is at the end of your turn, and the same letter horizontally as it is vertically. < 1330072030 155635 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrabble in 4D! < 1330072037 924337 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrabble in 1d < 1330072114 327277 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what they’ll call 3D movies when real 3D display technology becomes available, since they call stereo-2D “3D” now? “4D”? < 1330072155 918089 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :conti-- contingent on it being scrabble < 1330072172 477920 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: Perhaps 3.5D. (See: 3.5G networks.) < 1330072176 825195 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330072188 11968 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric : ;-o < 1330072191 466837 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The way I usually play is "challengeless"; you are allowed to view the dictionary at any time whether or not it is your turn, and if you challenge a word there is no penalty; if it is a correct word nothing happens and if it is incorrect the player takes back the tiles and can play again. It can be combined with timed games to make time penalties for such things < 1330072193 114759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: TruD < 1330072198 826784 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :RealD < 1330072200 713692 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :TurD < 1330072203 675687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :3+1D < 1330072212 739169 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: There's already a "4D movie theatre" at the Linnanmäki amusement park. (It's got chairs that wiggle and some water-sprayers or whatevers.) < 1330072226 664956 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: I dislike calling those movies "3D"; I call it "stereovision" instead < 1330072231 961465 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Can you write my declarative debugger for me? < 1330072233 172274 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1330072234 668065 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Three spatial dimensions and one wetness dimension < 1330072248 168429 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't do stereo-2D, though. :p < 1330072253 792382 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :................... getting ideas < 1330072257 480934 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quick somebody help < 1330072259 246932 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(At least IIRC.) < 1330072265 678087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Also, have you rsync? < 1330072266 531187 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's been there long before "3D" movies popularimatized.) < 1330072274 463993 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Sure. < 1330072279 75954 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I declare this program debugged" < 1330072279 952278 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Have you rsync daemon? < 1330072282 829091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1330072300 499821 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the rsync question? < 1330072304 46360 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :scrabble using an alphabet in mathematical sense < 1330072328 56260 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence, brainfuck scrabble < 1330072333 790483 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrabble where the board gets random reärranged on every turn. < 1330072336 772963 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrambble. < 1330072357 572408 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :each [ must have a matching ] < 1330072361 545650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: rsync daemon? < 1330072363 318181 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is the question. < 1330072364 549496 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...... oh wait < 1330072370 16489 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about.. a befunge scrabble < 1330072391 393338 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrabble where the tiles have single digits and the words must be base-36 numbers which represent ASCII strings. < 1330072421 886064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I repeat: Scrabble where you flip a coin but it's really really big. < 1330072436 665984 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :The that’s-what-she-said scrabble? < 1330072477 380929 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrabble where the only legal move is to describe a Scrabble variation. < 1330072481 345959 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: No. < 1330072494 823313 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Yes I have thought of various things like that, not only brainfuck with matching [] but also where pipes must be connected, where numbers are used and you must subtract or multiply or compare them or something, and even an idea where the tiles have one meaning horizontally and another vertically < 1330072546 516796 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think we can safely agree that continuous scrabble is only going to derail the conversation, and thus disregard.. lions tigers and bears < 1330072621 824885 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :A scrabble board with a torus topology. < 1330072643 916075 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ack.. ive been here long enough that the tropes seem old < 1330072662 929498 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrabble in rot-13. < 1330072681 748947 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrabble where the only letter is Q. < 1330072684 751208 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's only one. < 1330072684 938037 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: that one has the nice benefit that we already know what tile distribution to use < 1330072748 227651 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about, a Scrabble game where the tiles are marked on both sides, with different letters on each side so that each tile has two purposes < 1330072759 152728 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :That already exists. < 1330072768 7981 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Little known fact: The other side of every scrabble tile is blank. < 1330072807 199102 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: if you know the paddle move, you can win at scrabble every time < 1330072810 32466 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I know that, but the other side is not usable in the game < 1330072814 28777 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Palindrome scrabble < 1330072836 694564 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Sure it is. < 1330072850 997875 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some people play by mixing tiles face down, others in a bag. Another way is to use the bag and gloves like Washizu Mahjong does. < 1330072851 748636 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :(until your friends notice there are five blank tiles on the board...recommend getting them drunk first) < 1330072865 299550 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that is cheating < 1330072885 969707 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, zzo38. Cheating is a scrabble variant < 1330072900 469483 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Unless you make a variant where it is allowed, of course; in which case you can play any tile blank and not earn points for it) < 1330072910 905708 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, zzo38, i just used "zzo38" twice in that last post, zzo38 < 1330073084 890692 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also know a variant where the game is timed using chess clocks. Each player is given 20 minutes per game. < 1330073223 329527 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way to use TFM ligature/kern programs or combining with something, and will make it Turing complete? < 1330073927 586231 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also the variant where all the tiles are blank and each one is worth more points than all the others put together. < 1330073989 322259 :NihilistDandy!~NihilistD@stu-242-155-171-184.champlain.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1330074021 745695 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make up some esolang that forms a category, but that it is not Cartesian-closed, that the objects do not correspond to the types, and the morphisms do not correspond to functions < 1330074037 744580 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it is a completely different kind of category than would be used in such as Haskell and so on. < 1330074810 172663 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Catch-22 (logic): A situation where someone is in need of something that can only be had by not being in need of it." I have once made up a computer game like that, where at one point in the game you are offered two water energies, but they say they will only give it to you if you don't need it. (You do need it later in the game.) However, if you say you don't need it they do believe you anyways < 1330074867 714492 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not how Catch-22 works. < 1330074943 166219 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know, it is not quite like that. I simply copied the description from Wikipedia and then mentioned something I made before, based on what the description reminded me of. < 1330074991 222633 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :a real catch-22 is the newcomb paradox played by someone with a $1,001,000 debt < 1330075041 305829 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, now I understand! < 1330075644 668811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: PINGGGGG < 1330075848 30542 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have read article about "Chainstore paradox" in Wikipedia; what is the goal? If the goal of each player is to maximize his own score, it seem A should always select COOPERATIVE (since that gives A two points) and therefore everyone else should always select IN (since that gives them two points when A selects COOPERATIVE). I am a bit confused? < 1330076399 914874 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :As far as I can tell they should not select OUT just because if AGGRESSIVE is selected once in order to deterence, it seem wrong since that prevents earning a score, just once, while it is each one an individual adding to the score you cannot affect the past < 1330076707 769722 :NihilistDandy!~NihilistD@stu-242-155-171-184.champlain.edu QUIT : < 1330077376 395886 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott TOPIC #esoteric :So good to be in the Morning....In America! | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ | http://esolangs.org/wiki/ has moved servers! < 1330077552 67626 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In here, is night time < 1330077565 240869 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's because you're not in True America. < 1330077572 512632 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know I'm not. < 1330077674 821168 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :“So good to be in the Morning....In America!” doesn’t necessarily imply it *is* morning in America. < 1330077705 164958 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, the reason is because of timezone; whether or not you are in True America is irrelevant. < 1330077707 811054 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it is though < 1330077714 352246 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is morning in True America < 1330077715 799979 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :right now < 1330078246 274134 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in True America it is always morning < 1330078252 884327 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is how I can tell it is morning in True America < 1330078260 517962 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right now < 1330078296 987973 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a map of where the sun rises. < 1330078552 10694 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll give you a hint everyone: anywhere outside the arctic circle, and most places within it < 1330078579 216156 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I mean for a given date and time < 1330078642 948544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: not in True America < 1330078646 327847 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sun never sets, so it never rises < 1330078661 533413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :an eagle cries off in the desert, weeping for Freedom; he dwells in False America < 1330078698 414630 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: you are a liar and a heretic < 1330078711 486255 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the sun is always rising in true america! because it is always morning! < 1330078751 931918 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a moving sun would be imperfect < 1330078758 649412 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's So Good morning because it's always the best < 1330078760 628515 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no need for change < 1330078764 638734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So Good in America < 1330078776 983477 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOTE : this america ( C ) president of america < 1330078830 509738 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it is not the sun that moves. it is the hopes and dreams of True Americans that is truly rising! < 1330078911 92607 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foul! Cretin! Devil! They cannot rise because they are already at maximum levels of dreaming and hoping! < 1330078918 193232 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So Good in America! < 1330078981 789721 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they rise beyond the maximum < 1330078986 912397 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they never stop < 1330079057 955820 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Basic_Input/Output_Commander i am not sure what to make of this < 1330079093 492637 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mythical? < 1330080030 310082 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seriously mythical. < 1330080101 583514 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay spam < 1330080267 838620 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1330080313 710926 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i kind of like the insane-ness of BIOC < 1330080378 494246 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :insanity? < 1330080380 566230 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :write vga0:587:172 127 .. writes color 127 to pixel at (587,172) < 1330080393 194065 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330080434 350632 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330080434 651978 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :marvelous < 1330080438 111560 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops i mean < 1330080439 536640 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330080475 329184 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and.. write con:0 65 66 67 68 .... writes ABCD to the console < 1330080501 619840 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330080507 236884 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :splendid < 1330080518 103174 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330080591 85991 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i can understand it, it probably isn't very esoteric < 1330080614 984667 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it could somehow be granted permission to write to any memory location, it could be, in combination with a turing-complete cpu, a turing-complete language, yes? < 1330080616 79920 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20, the new standard for esoteric < 1330080651 103055 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont fully understand it though < 1330080704 894400 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so is it more of an almost esoteric, or a just barely esoteric < 1330080737 892647 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i dont see why vga0 is a word but con:0 is delimeted by the : < 1330080745 566940 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that could just be the way it goes < 1330080754 451775 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1330080760 805476 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :vga0 is a device name < 1330080765 389188 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :con is a device name < 1330080768 806313 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah ok < 1330080777 671981 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric no more < 1330080783 747031 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330080785 119819 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the magic, the mystery < 1330080786 656611 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all gone < 1330080794 974300 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(diff | hist) . . N Home insurance‎; 10:46 . . (+6,544) . . Krishna1 (Talk | contribs | block)‎ (Created page with "Home insurance, also commonly called hazard insurance or homeowner's insurance (often abbreviated in the real estate industry as HOI), is the type of [http://reslife.tamu.edu/...") < 1330080795 160996 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no it's still mythical < 1330080795 347791 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(User creation log); 10:44 . . Krishna1 (Talk | contribs | block)‎ New user account < 1330080797 652224 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :krishan1. < 1330080798 856959 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i trusted u. < 1330080803 471295 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you-- < 1330080806 666943 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, what the FUCK? < 1330080812 489656 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :How did that get past the CAPTCHA? < 1330080818 693724 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell ais523 A spambot just got past the CAPTCHA. help < 1330080818 884026 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1330080829 665205 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to beef it up < 1330080832 538131 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :doublecaptcha < 1330080852 833431 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets not insult the spammers though... < 1330080871 685527 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the new captcha is to write an essay about how spammers are dumb and totally suck < 1330080935 694221 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can tell you how; they made a copy of the CAPTCHA for another service in real time < 1330080945 630807 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the new captcha is to create an esolang and write the first draft of the spec that you will post on the wiki < 1330080951 843744 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect they paid someone to fill it out. < 1330080956 640802 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1330080957 809373 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know < 1330080962 571165 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :just filled it out themselves < 1330080966 427481 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, err, solving the CAPTCHA involves clicking a link and reading a paragraph of fairly technical English. < 1330080979 495671 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hope they realize.. this means war < 1330080981 960634 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: The existence of CAPTCHA-filling farms is well-known. < 1330080991 64641 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: indeed < 1330080992 971125 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt any one spambot operator would bother to fill in Esolang's. < 1330081000 781499 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, this is troubling. < 1330081020 707140 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was banking on the people being paid not being able to click links, read a paragraph of text, go back, and fill in an answer based on information from that link. < 1330081022 536736 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or not bothering. < 1330081038 568720 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll look into more "behind-the-scenes" techniques before changing the CAPTCHA itself. < 1330081044 471365 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the paragraph change? does the answer change? < 1330081047 755370 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get paid to look at car commercials, not read all this paragraph. < 1330081067 807377 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"not bothering" < 1330081078 991774 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : - a captcha farm < 1330081082 749218 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: What? < 1330081091 832075 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are about 5 CAPTCHAs. They're all esoteric programming trivia. < 1330081097 492146 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1330081098 730830 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They link to articles on the wiki which contain the answers in the first paragraph. < 1330081106 91117 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :new esolang policy all articles are distorted beyond readability < 1330081107 376630 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha < 1330081110 792495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The chances of any CAPTCHA farming pawn knowing the answers without clicking the links is 0. < 1330081117 366564 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have an idea < 1330081120 56046 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: agreed < 1330081130 338498 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets replace all esolang articles with spam < 1330081139 45862 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then we can not care about spammer < 1330081141 394530 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i have an idea.. make the questions really long < 1330081160 245834 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like.. 60 seconds of reading < 1330081182 836672 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :124.123.139.13 - - [24/Feb/2012:10:46:56 +0000] "POST /w/index.php?title=Home_insurance&action=submit HTTP/1.1" 302 5 "http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Home_insura < 1330081183 61023 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nce&action=edit" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 5.1; Trident/4.0; GTB7.3; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 3.0.4506.2152; .NET CLR 3.5.30729)" < 1330081184 856935 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck you man!!!! < 1330081194 224378 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the new captcha is a turing test vs. itidus20, with itidus21 as the judge < 1330081237 659475 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, this thing is actually loading the JS and everything. < 1330081245 702401 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it wasn't a spambot; someone entered the spam manually. < 1330081246 80291 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :124.123.139.13 - - [24/Feb/2012:10:44:59 +0000] "POST /w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&action=submitlogin&type=signup&returnto=Main+Page HTTP/1.1" 200 4871 "http:// < 1330081246 266748 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&type=signup&returnto=Main+Page" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 5.1; Trident/4.0; GTB7.3; .NET CLR 2.0.5 < 1330081246 267029 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :0727; .NET CLR 3.0.4506.2152; .NET CLR 3.5.30729)" < 1330081246 809721 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man. < 1330081251 817406 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck you so much, POSTer!!! < 1330081264 502189 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: A lot of the spambots in the logs seem to have hostnamse with a bunch of ".NET CLR" in them. < 1330081274 620495 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I'm sceptical. < 1330081277 643188 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :abuse a msie8 bug to make esolang unusable for the spam farme < 1330081290 479497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it could be some automated thing where people are given an automated IE frame thing loaded to random wikis and have to create an account there. < 1330081296 643634 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well what matters is they don't know that at this wiki people literally discuss each spammer and collaborate on how to react < 1330081322 311280 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the battle against spam, < 1330081325 579368 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric : it's the thought that counts < 1330081348 442424 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://reslife.tamu.edu/current/insurance/propertyInsurance.asp < 1330081353 987219 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a link krishna spammed < 1330081354 520866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :,,, < 1330081378 776899 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about the new CAPTCHA be...visit this channel and convince someone that you are worth giving the CAPTCHA answer to < 1330081382 854085 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the system SCP uses < 1330081406 646022 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-253-208.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330081424 560429 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :One way, is use other protocols (other than HTTP and SMTP). Or else, use HTTP but use PUT rather than POST < 1330081426 441589 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we don't say in the instructions how to find this channel < 1330081430 869112 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: No, I hate that. < 1330081435 931150 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's effectively locking people out. < 1330081446 154040 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Better to think smart than to think obstructive. < 1330081460 685543 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-208-189.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1330081485 85689 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn. we could meet so many people that way :P < 1330081510 536994 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :captcha where you write the answer but it's really really big < 1330081515 585606 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe krishna1 was a systemic anomaly < 1330081540 385318 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw < 1330081543 913345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :who wants a lot of boring tedious work < 1330081555 68379 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: krishna2 will be a trend < 1330081584 93574 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I nominate "not monqy" for tedious work < 1330081584 335842 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: boring tedious work...like deleting spam accounts? < 1330081596 468295 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :could admin itidus20 < 1330081615 411317 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i don't blame you to be afraid < 1330081637 677231 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: specifically, filtering spam accounts from non-spam accounts < 1330081639 977276 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "smart" solution would be a bot that classfies wiki articles as spam/not-spam, and flags the spam articles for deletion/userbanning after hiding them < 1330081642 572587 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers&limit=5000 < 1330081661 769180 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mind you I have some SQL queries that turn up a few hundred of them < 1330081668 256019 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few more queries should get even more < 1330081689 30358 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :as IBM once said: machines should work, people should think < 1330081717 40986 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i'll just put them all on mechanical turk < 1330081724 828213 :Jafet!~Jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :If people don't want to think, should machines think for them? < 1330081726 301865 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1330081747 726709 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: the only time people dont want to think is when the thinking is too much work :P < 1330081756 969022 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i was only half-kidding < 1330081769 464935 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you're willing to pay < 1330081773 272371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think they'd be too conservative < 1330081783 336969 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"959 buy viagra" or whatever is obviously a spam username < 1330081801 461479 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they won't know that e.g. redlinked username = more likely to be a spammer, and integrating viewing deleted contributions and the like would be a huuuge pain < 1330081810 257513 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so probably easier to use SQL queries to get the bulk of them + manual filtering for the rest < 1330081818 1578 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if you frame the question as "on a scale of 1-10, how likely is this user to be a spambot" < 1330081821 470776 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have 4,501 or so users and all but a few hundred at maximum are spammers < 1330081826 662640 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can set the threshold yourself after the fact < 1330081837 538202 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330081839 332996 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: the idea that humans can accurately rate things on a 1-10 scale seems nonsense to me. < 1330081845 413266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, that would help. < 1330081852 766874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh the whole thing would take more time and effort than doing it locally :P < 1330081853 571386 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd! < 1330081860 441210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you want a boring, tedious but REALLY WORTHWHILE task? < 1330081868 966896 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it doesnt rely on accuracy if enough people do it. eventually you'll find the good threshold. < 1330081883 369187 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :(using averages) < 1330081888 711859 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :new users must pass the trials of heart. everyone knows robots and spammers have no hearts, so this will stop them. < 1330081917 344228 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1330081918 957664 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaaah! < 1330081923 888917 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that many spammers!?! < 1330081926 703032 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :trials of heart: name the captain planet character with the power of heart < 1330081934 679831 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's going on? < 1330081963 226394 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you passed the trials of heart yet < 1330081995 956202 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mati or matee .. i never really saw it spelled out < 1330081997 787909 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: a spambot passed the captcha < 1330082000 94480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i'm going ALL OUT < 1330082015 163981 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Special:ListUsers&limit=5000 please sort these usernames into three piles: definite spammers, possible spammers, not spammers < 1330082016 403182 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanx < 1330082022 930254 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can only do the first thousand or so if you must < 1330082030 329293 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, any user with a bluelink i.e. existing user page is certainly not spammer < 1330082045 417128 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :any user with no contributions is suspicious (i can confirm by looking at deleted contributions) < 1330082046 438689 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :THANXE < 1330082068 58350 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about spammers whose userpages didn't get deleted or did they all get deleted < 1330082082 894875 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: since most of those users registered while the site was at its old location, probably the spam users wont find the new site. thus, you could clear them all out by simply deleting EVERYONE who hasn't visited the site at its new location. after perhaps sending an email telling everyone that you're gonna do that < 1330082086 510223 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: There's no spam existing on the wiki. < 1330082089 158026 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: "find the new site"? < 1330082095 526863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it'll be incredibly difficult to go to the EXACT SAME DOMAIN AS BEFORE. < 1330082113 201266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They, like, go by geographic location of data centres. < 1330082119 484763 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :$username: probably spam < 1330082132 349459 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: sorry. was operating on bad info. < 1330082137 334570 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, that's a terrible idea, because (a) tracking "visited site at new location" is basically impossible with the logs we have; < 1330082150 314782 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :00Davo: not spam < 1330082156 88510 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(b) 90% of the wiki's legit users will be inactive enough that they probably won't see such an email. < 1330082162 114358 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(c) emails aren't even required < 1330082165 295953 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in any case, deleting all inactive accounts will not annoy too terribly many people :P < 1330082173 246655 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few hundred tops < 1330082175 335852 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1330082190 999215 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :1079844050: possibly spam? < 1330082191 974750 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I really don't like user-hostile solutions like that. < 1330082203 66372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: The terrorists have won, etc. < 1330082216 26527 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: OK, I wasn't completely serious. < 1330082217 641498 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i'm being absurd because i don't see the point in deleting inactive spam accounts really < 1330082223 555326 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :114 buy levitra: probably spam < 1330082226 447596 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I DON'T CARE < 1330082234 848512 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: If you gotta do it, at least do it in a text file :P < 1330082237 773930 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I'll stop < 1330082239 301960 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But "buy levitra" is most cetainly spam. < 1330082242 976330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: They're not inactive. < 1330082249 373387 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: They keep coming back and creating new pages. < 1330082262 457453 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: if they are doing that then we can identify them based on their activity < 1330082269 132664 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Go on. < 1330082286 273357 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already have some obvious SQL queries to try, but it's still just based on finding mass lists of users to delete. < 1330082289 358374 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, they clog up the user list and such. < 1330082299 875994 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh who uses the user list < 1330082318 160564 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think anything with integer space buy space text is a spammer < 1330082353 588817 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed, but there's few of them. < 1330082365 192276 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could also try hiding the wiki from Google; see if that helps < 1330082370 613062 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :My queries have produced 200-600 users or so each. < 1330082387 878690 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about captchas on [create page]? how likely is that to help without being annoying? < 1330082388 65064 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: That could conceivably help, but it'd also remove 99% of traffic to the wiki and make sure nobody finds it ever. < 1330082397 358516 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: There are CAPTCHAs for every single anonymous edit. < 1330082401 220429 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And for user registration. < 1330082404 404081 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I see. < 1330082407 100201 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For registered users. < 1330082407 802980 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i meant for registered yeah < 1330082426 380818 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that would be possible. But it would be annoying. What would be nice is if I could add e.g. three broken tries at the CAPTCHA and your account is blocked. < 1330082441 463100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the time spent writing such an extension is, again, longer than the time it'd take to round up every existing spammer and delete them. < 1330082451 460643 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesnt mean it isnt worth it < 1330082464 567272 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :since you could improve all mediawikis everywhere that way :D < 1330082484 640868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would not like to contribute to editor annoyance on MediaWikis. < 1330082499 294497 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, the only MediaWikis really infested with spam are the ones ignored by their admins. < 1330082538 845969 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could reduce editor annoyance by making it possible to become a Trusted User with admin intervention... < 1330082586 995050 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see why you're so attached to solutions that involve more user annoyance and more long-term effort than a one-time purge operation. < 1330082608 393769 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :because i don't know that it is a one-time purge operation? < 1330082620 702579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is that supposed to mean? < 1330082632 272693 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only way any new users can trickle in is by solving a CAPTCHA. You proposed a CAPTCHA on the create page function. < 1330082636 279835 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :krishna1 could be an anomaly...or a sign of things to come < 1330082643 334198 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there is no benefit if the spammers can solve CAPTCHAs. < 1330082667 705225 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, ominous language aside, spambots that can solve CAPTCHAs are not the issue I'm dealing with. < 1330082672 501009 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how fast do wiki spambots usually work? < 1330082679 943756 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spambots that can't solve CAPTCHAs but get through with existing accounts are the issue I'm dealing with right now. < 1330082684 434640 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Fast howso? < 1330082695 765514 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many articles do they post a second around the web < 1330082717 574372 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not omniscient. < 1330082722 972304 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps you can somehow use time to discourage spams? Will changing the default skin to an uncommon one do anything? < 1330082725 654838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Google it or something if you want statistics. < 1330082749 771869 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that was my thought, but i suspect that wiki spambots are slow, so not a good idea < 1330082766 769275 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: how many captchas are there? < 1330082774 421533 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: There are certainly spambots per minute hitting the wiki. < 1330082777 106306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Unsuccessfully.) < 1330082791 366373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: How many CAPTCHAs what? Pages with CAPTCHAs? CAPTCHA Q&A pairs? < 1330082793 201657 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think hiding it from Google is a way to do so anyways. I set up the robots.txt to hide everything from Google, and then removed all internal (and external) links, and changed the root page to redirect to the root gopher menu instead, and then I told the gopherproxy owner to block access to my computer from there. Therefore, this help a lot. < 1330082797 689810 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, the latter < 1330082832 599581 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Yes, it helps a lot. It also ensures nobody visits your site. < 1330082857 79721 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ngevd: Five. But if people are manually clicking links and filling them out, adding new ones won't help. < 1330082911 662476 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Not true... a few people do. They can tell other people manually if they like to do so. < 1330082968 660468 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you block account creation and anonymous edits from Internet Explorer clients? < 1330083017 112692 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, which would exclude legitimate IE users. < 1330083024 461110 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance, oerjan uses IE. < 1330083034 252242 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But oerjan already has an account. < 1330083039 91801 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, he already has an account, but it's an example that IE users can be valuable. < 1330083044 645227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's unlikely to be the last helpful IE user. < 1330083150 842330 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unlikely, but wouldn't it make one spiffy business card title? "oerjan oerjan\nthe last helpful IE user", centered. < 1330083166 602079 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm not so sure about the names, so I improvised.) < 1330083195 817179 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like the last of the mohicans. < 1330083211 222376 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1330083218 203795 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :([fancy O]rjan Johansen.) < 1330083234 994438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :AKA oerjan "[fancy O]rjan Johansen" oerjan. < 1330083256 84050 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :�rjan < 1330083295 629124 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ørjan "Fancy Ørjan" Johansen. < 1330083306 293593 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :O^H/rjan < 1330083313 426272 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :$\emptyset$rjan < 1330083337 90358 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Φrjan < 1330083343 926847 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :∅rjan looks just silly. < 1330083354 813331 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phirjan? < 1330083369 373519 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :⎈rjan < 1330083379 257941 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, the correct TeX symbol is {\O rjan Johansen} < 1330083420 109654 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :∅h < 1330083442 157728 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :⊅rjan < 1330083448 293530 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :œrjan, to keep in touch with the nickname. < 1330083465 423389 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :⏁rjan? < 1330083473 31789 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :023C1 DENTISTRY SYMBOL LIGHT DOWN AND HORIZONTAL WITH CIRCLE [⏁] < 1330083479 602706 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :☺rjan. < 1330083488 448277 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :☹rjan < 1330083506 796124 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :☻rjan in my terminal. < 1330083521 173561 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You've got an ☿rjan in your terminal? That's fancy-o. < 1330083539 669904 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :😸rjan < 1330083555 753550 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :😹rjan < 1330083566 219100 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :King ♔rjan, like e's known to the populace. < 1330083627 437568 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And of course the famed activist, ☮rjan. < 1330083627 665840 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :☃rjan < 1330083639 388282 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :💩rjan < 1330083654 992627 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :♳ < 1330083659 166046 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :♳rjan < 1330083666 549629 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or would that be ♹rjan? < 1330083682 153345 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :⎋rjan < 1330083694 340090 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330083716 146128 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, it's Phantom_H∞ver < 1330083729 963172 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :O̸⃥rjan. < 1330083735 342466 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :∞rjan? < 1330083746 237004 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :∮rjan < 1330083753 205693 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also known as "Contourjan" < 1330083764 18792 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rjan < 1330083773 245183 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, the combining slashes are so not centered with the O. < 1330083808 373275 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have to try O⃠rjan. < 1330083822 77104 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's fancy. Though horrible in a terminal. < 1330083858 763955 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose it should've been Ø⃠rjan, though. < 1330083934 207586 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :^show celebrate < 1330083934 433051 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :( \o| |o| |o/ \m/ \m/ |o/ \o/ \o| \m/ \m/ \o| |o| |o/)S < 1330083934 945150 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :69   |   |   |    `\o/´69    |   |   |    `\o/´69    |   |   | < 1330083935 131962 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :69   |\  |\ /|      |      |\ /´\ /|      |     /<  /'\ /| < 1330083935 132129 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :69                 /`\                   /'¯|_) < 1330083935 132231 :myndzi!myndzi@c-67-168-184-168.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :69               (_| |_)               (_| < 1330083981 303155 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay celebration < 1330083981 692255 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it. < 1330083986 206690 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :⬠̸rjan, the Five-Sided. (Okay, that's enough for me.) < 1330083987 742272 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also myndzi has been fixed yay < 1330084015 111898 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def test ul Can you just put any sort of text in to be show'd for an ul thing? < 1330084015 336919 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1330084018 607834 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^show test < 1330084018 794521 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you just put any sort of text in to be show'd for an ul thing? < 1330084020 904373 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :only a true masochist could click on every name for > 1000 names and determine from it's contribution history if its a spam bot < 1330084023 799961 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that's just silly. < 1330084042 283240 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def test bf I don't think the same thing works for bf at all. < 1330084042 469899 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1330084044 200666 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^show test < 1330084044 387251 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1330084140 814827 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I wonder if it tape-cell-size modulo's the numbers already at that stage. < 1330084144 662313 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def test bf ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ < 1330084144 849015 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1330084149 153187 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^show test < 1330084149 340231 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :+2 < 1330084155 633464 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Appa-rently. < 1330084205 574030 :derdon!~derdon@pD9E1DF7F.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330084220 210529 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf +100. < 1330084220 398977 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :
< 1330084221 340480 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com QUIT :Quit: NO DIAL TONE < 1330084235 139841 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't understand that notation as input. < 1330084235 382377 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woops < 1330084238 940952 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that was just +. < 1330084250 796221 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may have killed zzo38 < 1330084274 952403 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds unlikely. Unless you e.g. shot him while saying that, or something. < 1330084402 755026 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of the spam names are obvious like AkylazgWUY and ScottTuckerPaydayLoansyyy ... but then theres names like Alexander88 and Alhirzel. and i see that most of the names fall into the painful reasonable doubt category < 1330084711 747435 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330084775 904759 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1330084779 93617 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :check @messages < 1330084822 773883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1330084823 449847 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott said 1h 6m 44s ago: A spambot just got past the CAPTCHA. help < 1330084837 500807 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: clearly the spammers are solving a few of the questions by hand < 1330084851 85083 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :adding more would help, as would checkusering and blocking the spambot that did it, as would abusefiltering its patter < 1330084854 138648 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*pattern < 1330084889 312531 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: adding more I'd prefer to avoid; I already blocked the spambot but didn't checkuser yet < 1330084890 397258 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it happens again we'll be able to spot the pattern < 1330084896 238196 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll go checkuser it < 1330084901 479982 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, hold off for a bit < 1330084906 101849 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that and abusefilter would work, but I'd prefer to block more than one spambot in one go < 1330084921 655650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with less user-visible solutions; I'm looking at the available anti-spam extensions for MW < 1330084971 456076 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm surprised whoever it was that filled it out managed to click the link, read the page, and understand it enough to fill in the CAPTCHA < 1330084990 841949 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, indeed < 1330084997 183509 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm more trying to see what sort of range it's in < 1330085005 951619 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems to be a /18, which is rather uncomfortably large to block < 1330085060 181860 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think an IP block would work there anyway < 1330085069 828095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :too large a range < 1330085085 581742 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pattern in the access logs used similar hostnames to other spambots < 1330085089 148346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with lots of .NET CLRs in them < 1330085094 590567 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect it's some kind of embedded IE browser < 1330085111 342407 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that directs the CAPTCHA-farmer to a wiki and tells them to register or such < 1330085116 305511 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it followed slow, browser-like patterns < 1330085118 583305 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :loading all the JS, etc. < 1330085127 248996 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to most spambots in the logs, which just blindly shoot off a few requests < 1330085146 208345 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that's correct, then there's basically nothing that can be done, if there's a human behind the wheel of a real browser who will follow links to fill in a CAPTCHA < 1330085152 777928 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incidentally, did you see the fetch of the page with the CAPTCHA answer too? < 1330085160 832534 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh, good point, I didn't check < 1330085164 971838 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :silly me < 1330085203 565021 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :124.123.139.13 - - [24/Feb/2012:10:43:50 +0000] "GET /wiki/IRP HTTP/1.1" 200 7685 "http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Special:UserLogin&type=signup&returnto=Main+Pag < 1330085203 751320 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :e" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 8.0; Windows NT 5.1; Trident/4.0; GTB7.3; .NET CLR 2.0.50727; .NET CLR 3.0.4506.2152; .NET CLR 3.5.30729)" < 1330085204 327650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1330085210 77471 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :human-controlled, without a doubt < 1330085234 937644 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's also the easiest CAPTCHA to answer, since it's in the first few words of the article... but I'm not sure that's relevant < 1330085344 900138 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 124.123.139.13 you mentioned is from a DHCP range for some Indian ISP, Beam Telecom. (In particular, from a /24 that's labeled "Mehdi Patnam Zone (DHCP)".) I don't know how CAPTCHA-answer farms operate, whether they bother to forward traffic through botnets or just have the "employed" person just use their 'net connection, since it doesn't really hurt them so much if some random people get IP-blocked. < 1330085455 246883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Googling for various hostnames of bad-behaving spider bots and the like suggests to me that the common solution to all this rubbish is to, like, block the entirety of India, Russia and Asia. < 1330085459 970784 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find that somewhat undesirable. < 1330085462 596560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Okay, not the entirety.) < 1330085465 863056 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But pretty huge ranges.) < 1330085507 242994 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/BLIW < 1330085552 460251 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type error, or typo? < 1330085556 564512 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm surprised it got that far, actually < 1330085642 8711 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like an actual type error < 1330085661 690398 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: did you ever decide whether underload is cbpv? < 1330085681 815967 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no, I'm having that discussion at the moment, actually < 1330085683 607645 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is part of that < 1330085687 784655 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :cbpb? < 1330085693 842409 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/pb/pv/ < 1330085698 589047 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :call-by-push-value < 1330085748 616526 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I replace that cat with a free variable, it types ;) < 1330085752 635659 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, lunchtime < 1330085760 659964 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :More like... BRUNCHTIME. < 1330085776 20252 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, bruch is 10-12 < 1330085785 355771 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lunch is 12-2:15 < 1330085878 448941 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :HOW RUDE. < 1330085881 489124 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330085882 357396 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :of you. < 1330085907 841991 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :brunch is if I haven't eaten breakfast < 1330085928 275130 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so really it ends up being from 13-15 < 1330085930 284468 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :brunch is if ur not fuly human < 1330085935 935460 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy: wow you get up early, monqy, < 1330085969 729847 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i thought it was well-established I was subhuman, months ago < 1330085978 596718 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget why. < 1330086038 318774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe because < 1330086040 116393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monqy < 1330086060 662131 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps < 1330086332 440754 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1330086496 479084 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaargh < 1330086517 591703 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net NICK :Taneb < 1330086526 116200 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel better when I'm Taneb < 1330086539 60120 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1330086543 248927 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1330087389 614257 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1330087704 737751 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: hello < 1330088207 858616 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330088245 529813 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, so without forcing the type of that cat, it types, although it doesn't type /correctly/ < 1330088338 380059 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, typed underload, it's impossible to do an infinite loop without adding an explicit fix combinator < 1330088346 306939 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(dup // eval is a type error) < 1330088356 414448 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(as expected, really) < 1330088453 695952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously < 1330088455 989608 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ap id id and so on < 1330088467 492797 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I bet you can do it with rank-n types or something < 1330088472 353650 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is that dup forces the two copies to have the same type < 1330088483 104873 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which fails the occurs check later on < 1330088945 277075 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Back < 1330088967 572507 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1330089948 359226 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Pingpingpingg < 1330090096 656641 :Taneb|Hovercraft!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330090291 395231 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-93-108.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1330090714 388840 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-216-88.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330090716 943308 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-253-208.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330090768 612290 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-57.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Friendship pong ^^ < 1330090908 732017 :Taneb|Hovercraft!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: Goodbye < 1330092494 586061 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330092546 267451 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: right < 1330092559 579680 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330092575 836718 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, the point is that in typed lambda calculus, you can't write an infinite loop < 1330092582 933416 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you add a constant to the language whose purpose is to make loops possible < 1330092593 274653 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if dup // eval worked, then you could < 1330092656 315709 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the mockingbird combinator is the dirtiest of used-in-the-implementation-of-recursion combinators, it doesn't type in anything) < 1330092659 676193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably not even Anarchy) < 1330092685 846822 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, hmm, I wonder if Underlambda's continuation primitives work typed < 1330092744 46424 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, the very basic one is n, but n is really weird in its own right < 1330092752 263387 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(n determines whether the stack is empty) < 1330092777 801904 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's backwardsly scoped, or something < 1330092812 457804 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, and C, I'm not even convinced it's expressible in a pure language < 1330093369 319986 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: in Haskell, is there any way to express a type A such that A = (A, Int)? < 1330093374 199456 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :without adding extra type constructors? < 1330093547 189990 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, by design < 1330093551 962161 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ocaml can do it with -rectypes < 1330093558 601016 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, awesome < 1330093564 161810 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think) < 1330093567 543823 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it can certainly type Y) < 1330093572 531002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so I don't see why type synonyms would be restricted) < 1330093578 752739 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you may need special syntax for it, though < 1330093585 658230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :try writing some recursively-typed stuff to find out the syntax < 1330093587 755640 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, hmm < 1330093592 31732 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if you can type Y in Anarchy < 1330093592 361995 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done it before < 1330093607 830623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: -rectypes is sound I think < 1330093608 451764 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you probably could, because it's possible to write an infinite loop in it < 1330093609 593445 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but very confusing < 1330093619 143113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that's exactly the type system I've been looking for, I think < 1330093619 877028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y doesn't type in Haskell and it has infinite loops < 1330093627 157981 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it has let rec < 1330093633 35111 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. a fixed-point constant < 1330093641 333571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has no "let rec" construct :) < 1330093641 557043 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, so does Anarchy, I'm being stupid < 1330093648 112129 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it has fix and recursive bindings, yes < 1330093653 890857 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fix being defined in terms of the latter < 1330093668 880444 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can call the construct in general let rec, even if Haskell's impl of it isn't called that < 1330093670 690376 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a good name for it < 1330093754 781812 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# dup // eval ;; < 1330093756 137663 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- : '_a * ('_a * 'b -> '_c as 'b) -> '_c = < 1330093801 889682 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, I've just realised that Anarchy trivially compiles into OCaml -rectypes! :) < 1330093830 816479 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of using T (a, b), you use (T, a, b), where T is the only value of a type with one value < 1330093886 888928 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is actually mindblowing :) < 1330093955 744114 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# q(dup // eval) // dup // eval ;; < 1330093955 930506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1330093957 125520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- : '_a -> 'b = < 1330093967 800293 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in retrospect, /that/ was inevitable :) < 1330093990 643070 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ofc, (:^):^ really can map any stack to any other stack < 1330093991 777807 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: note that LC is trivially typeable with -rectypes < 1330094000 38833 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, you're giving up a lot by adopting it as your type system < 1330094008 272948 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may end up rejecting no programs at all < 1330094017 458705 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1330094019 138954 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330094023 672590 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1330094028 805418 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is to reject programs that have non-total pattern matches < 1330094090 639781 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. (+) "a" "b" would be rejected in Anarchy, because "a", being a list of chars, uses type constructor Cons, and (an assumed natural number +) only pattern-matches against Succ and Zero < 1330094096 490265 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the program wouldn't type < 1330094098 224007 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Taneb, btw < 1330094132 482269 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I guess (+) 2 "a" /would/ type, the return value would be something that gave a string if decremented twice < 1330094193 954071 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but (+) n "a", for an n calculated at runtime, could only be pattern-matched by things that expected a number, a string, or a successor of a string < 1330094202 294137 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a kind-of silly combination < 1330094371 862761 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: put it this way: not all types are function types, so programs still get rejected < 1330094412 375562 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Cont < 1330094413 243827 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: data constructor `Cont' < 1330094417 445953 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::k Cont < 1330094418 349615 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :* -> * -> * < 1330094513 227062 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, actually, I'll still need sum types < 1330094529 488215 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so -rectypes isn't enough by itself < 1330094545 722754 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this is not the same as ADTs, as they have a fixed list of type constructors) < 1330094602 3117 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I can build them by hand using Either < 1330094912 116114 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, oerjan-swap doesn't give the right type with -rectypes either (it gives a general type where function = stack->stack, stack = stack*function, which can describe any Underload-minus-S program, not just swap in particular) < 1330095400 352802 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, no, /actually/ got it < 1330095404 673473 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :say we have three tags, A, B, and C < 1330095444 438288 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then a function which accepts type A(X) + B(Y) + C(Z) can have type (X -> Q, Y -> Q, Z -> Q) -> Q < 1330095518 204782 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, hmm, is that right? < 1330095524 955160 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, no < 1330095653 211024 :augur!~augur@208.58.5.87 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330095743 689164 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: Goodbye < 1330095821 35415 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[A(x)]] = (x -> q, j1 -> k1, j2 -> k2) -> q; [[A(x)->y]] = ((x -> y, j1 -> 0, j2 -> 0) -> y) -> y; [[B(x)]] = (j1 -> k1, x -> q, j2 -> k2) -> q; [[(A(x)+B(y))->z]] = ((x -> z, y -> z, j1 -> k1) -> z) -> z < 1330095860 530951 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where 0 is assumed to be a type with no values) < 1330095886 501808 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way, a function of type A(x)->y can't take an argument of type B(x), as that'd try to match y with 0 < 1330095899 296601 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's where the typing failure comes in < 1330095960 247599 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's how you get a type error in Anarchy < 1330096190 625333 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :an actual implementation of, say, A(4), would be fun (f, g, h) -> f(4); of B(4) would be fun (f, g, h) -> g(4); of function | A(x) -> x would be fun a -> a (id, fail::0, fail::0); of function | A(x) -> x | B(x) -> x would be fun ab -> ab (id, id, fail::0) < 1330096210 692130 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder how you write a type with no values in OCaml < 1330096253 311081 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does ocaml have newtypes? < 1330096259 10072 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :with rectypes, 'a as 'a might work < 1330096266 865862 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, let me try it < 1330096315 799274 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I could, alternatively, give it one constructor that I just didn't use for anything else < 1330096442 602383 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's gross, don't do that < 1330096455 324800 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does ocaml have newtypes? basically one-constructor one-field data types with no runtime overhead < 1330096460 313536 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the type is erased at compile-time < 1330096471 531764 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so < 1330096475 881787 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just been looking up the syntax < 1330096492 498521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the only type definition keywords are "type" and "exception", both of which need at least one constructor < 1330096530 343216 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait no, that's the name of the type, misleadingly named < 1330096539 744735 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wait < 1330096543 518727 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what's wrong with just < 1330096546 64402 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it seems you can just write "type zero;;" < 1330096546 316065 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :data Void = Void Void < 1330096547 563325 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-equivalent? < 1330096552 701369 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OCaml is strict, after al < 1330096553 735383 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*all < 1330096558 772845 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it creates a type with no constructors for you :) < 1330096559 904413 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, wait, you could do it cyclically < 1330096561 512560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bleh < 1330096562 180687 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes < 1330096564 336856 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would work :P < 1330096591 873272 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# type zero = zero ;; < 1330096593 213020 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: The type abbreviation zero is cyclic < 1330096633 421390 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# type zero = Zero of zero ;; < 1330096634 794325 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type zero = Zero of zero < 1330096636 343809 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, there we go < 1330096655 914329 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that type has no values, due to being in a strict language < 1330096675 730848 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :out of curiosity, does 'a as 'a work? < 1330096690 636398 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I couldn't figure out what you meant by that < 1330096701 858822 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried a few permutations but they were all equivalent to things you obviously didn't mean < 1330096715 606349 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. type 'a zero = 'a as 'a;; is the same as type 'a zero = 'a;; < 1330096735 644667 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and type zero = 'a as 'a gives an unbound type parameter message < 1330096741 567440 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :-rectypes < 1330096745 489774 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric : - : '_a * ('_a * 'b -> '_c as 'b) -> '_c = < 1330096749 505945 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am using -rectypes < 1330096756 241330 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so try and type something as ('a as 'a), and that should be the type A = A < 1330096759 423952 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which should have no values < 1330096831 947495 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just get "unbound type parameter 'a" when I try that < 1330096848 914366 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas # type zero = (('a * 'a) as 'a) ;; works < 1330096865 258506 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess it's just a scoping thing < 1330096877 498333 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it needs to be a non-type-variable on the lhs of as < 1330096881 715608 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1330096899 430501 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# type ursala = 'a list as 'a ;; < 1330096900 718667 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :type ursala = 'a list as 'a < 1330096902 308710 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh :) < 1330096994 830129 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, hmm, this Anarchising program transformation, I recognise seeing it before < 1330097001 604283 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in an Underlambda header < 1330097028 460022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Paul Levy proved it equivalent to a sum type on a whiteboard in front of me a few weeks ago < 1330097035 311561 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it should be safe to use < 1330097068 259887 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Has Paul Levy kindly informed you that Underlambda is weird as heck yet? < 1330097082 834093 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, because I haven't managed to explain it to him yet < 1330097123 284662 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Have you told him about Feather yet? < 1330097136 245625 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :typed underlambda seems neat, the type-checker can statically prove that the stack never underflows < 1330097147 53050 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, I haven't managed to explain that to /anyone/ yet, including myself < 1330097308 71122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of stack-typed languages can do that < 1330097310 722538 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Factor, for instance < 1330097344 71482 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :JVM bytecode < 1330097354 137424 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: FINALLY < 1330097362 969391 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: You run an rsync server thing. How does it, how good it, how easy it, how it < 1330097363 156090 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guh? < 1330097368 878588 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hrm < 1330097393 450301 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since I have absolutely no memory of how I set it up, those questions are hard to answer ;) < 1330097397 216929 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I assume it wasn't too bad. < 1330097454 449627 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Do you use rsync --daemon? < 1330097461 859993 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330097462 708382 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I installed rsyncd, then did what seems to be extremely minor twiddling of /etc/rsyncd.conf < 1330097462 895256 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to decide between rsync and zsync for the esowiki XML dumps. < 1330097489 849438 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zsync has the advantage that I don't need to run another server, and people can still download the file through "normal" means (I think). < 1330097495 337266 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rsync is probably a lot more common though. < 1330097542 324657 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, here's my /etc/rsyncd.conf (minus comments): http://sprunge.us/OEag < 1330097558 300406 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thx 4 ur password < 1330097604 132829 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mmhm < 1330097654 87597 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh look, somebody removed my parade o' death. < 1330097654 871471 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: I was gonna ask whether your distro has zsync, but loldebian so yeah it does < 1330097660 566167 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arch don't. < 1330097666 611480 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But AUR do.) < 1330097673 163312 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: That was me. < 1330097721 487807 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a good REPL for r5rs Scheme/ < 1330097791 255142 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scheme48? SISC? < 1330097812 4649 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIT Scheme? < 1330097960 457436 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1330097963 399483 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330097974 787757 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIT Scheme seems to be i386-only < 1330098032 907698 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm looking for good readline-like behavior, e.g. tab completion of identifiers < 1330098047 246332 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know of anything like that. < 1330098061 136569 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gambit's REPL (gsi) does that well < 1330098062 789002 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIT Scheme supports x86-64. < 1330098066 20119 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's always rlwrap :) < 1330098073 336432 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The program that proves that readline's license is pointless) < 1330098075 419175 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: which won't tab-complete identifiers < 1330098080 182684 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rlwrap won't give me tab completion of what elliott said < 1330098086 122351 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not without extra work < 1330098091 507849 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, rlwrap might be good enough < 1330098102 283091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest you take typing lessons or something, since nothing like that exists AFAIK :P < 1330098125 281633 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to be able to tab-complete my parentheses. < 1330098165 666746 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, gsi exists < 1330098168 290255 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it has other problems < 1330099086 976920 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Use gsi to drive an R5RS-compliant interpreter underneath. < 1330099104 105758 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-243-83.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330099107 348183 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-216-88.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1330100064 727430 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :go deeper < 1330100089 614032 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually the reason i want a scheme interpreter is to run a little interpreter i wrote < 1330100101 7517 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a fexpr / vau calculus thingy < 1330100128 936579 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like kernel < 1330100140 318089 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway SISC has very good R5RS compliance iirc < 1330100158 154015 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i haven't used it < 1330100160 638159 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and doesn't seem to suffer too much being JVM-based (in that it doesn't go for "java interop" at all) < 1330100167 389610 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :working my way through the 416 page PhD thesis < 1330100185 377701 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but s48 is more popular and mit too I think (although perhaps less so) < 1330100201 724953 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zombie 6.001 uses racket < 1330100205 137348 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which causes no end of trouble < 1330100212 563075 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it only reluctantly sort of acts like a scheme implementation < 1330100227 835845 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to use MIT Scheme but switched < 1330100230 815696 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for reasons i do not recall < 1330100259 150428 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MIT Scheme itself might work on x86-64, but the Debian packages are i386-only < 1330100292 185667 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1330100315 735973 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :give scheme48 and sisc a try then :P ... i like several other implementations but they're not too r5rs-strict < 1330100342 826946 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't really need strict compliance < 1330100347 488201 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :just annoyed by a few of racket's divergences < 1330100355 778106 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like distinguishing mutable pairs from pairs < 1330100360 97951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. then pretty much anything that isn't racket should suit you fine < 1330100365 578326 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: erm, that goes away if you turn on the R5RS language < 1330100371 722600 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :racket is a multi-language environment < 1330100375 768346 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :#lang r5rs at the top of a file < 1330100391 388571 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think that's still not strictly compliant. but it won't have a major divergence like that < 1330100603 781050 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-33.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330100617 132347 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-243-83.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1330100704 883999 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't wanna put garbage at the top of my file ;) < 1330100715 136343 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a command-line thing for it, sheesh < 1330100730 639129 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which in turn interferes with racket's readline mode < 1330100740 294049 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :bah < 1330100746 131393 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well racket supports per-language modules < 1330100749 468383 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't feel like shaving all these yaks < 1330100751 27630 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :figure out how to divide it properly or something :P < 1330100752 994648 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah < 1330100755 673285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use something else < 1330100764 464933 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie is a schemester, ask his opinions < 1330100801 362892 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sisc-scheme.org/r5rs_pitfall.php is a helpfully pedantic r5rs comparison :p < 1330101581 404737 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf +.>+++++++[<++++++++++++>-]<+.-----------------.+++++++++++++.+.----------.++++++.-.>+++++++[<----------->-]<. < 1330101581 633085 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :
VERSION
< 1330101635 474442 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: Don't make fungot said CTCPs. You know what happened the last time it did that. < 1330101635 660339 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i was thinking < 1330101643 605269 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you don't, all the more reason! < 1330101687 874112 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happened the last time it did that? < 1330101691 341267 :Guest66243!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330101717 721693 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why hasn’t it been fixed to send automatic messages as NOTICEs? :-P < 1330101739 791151 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: Some shit who remains anonymous to this day whined to a staffer, fizzie was forced to take fungot down until he fixed it, and a staffer lurked in the channel for montsh. < 1330101740 431144 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: the lexically-scoped nature of the god object notation." if you want real efficiency, i'd download textgen.java. < 1330101741 436451 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*months. < 1330101766 62157 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1330101767 221686 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(OK, "anonymous" as in "everyone thinks it's the same person but won't say it publicly".) < 1330101775 401439 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: Someone used it to send the sendkeylogger thing IIRC. < 1330101782 793373 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which of course did nothing, since nobody here has a broken router. < 1330101788 841361 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, duh. < 1330101815 138109 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it's nonsense because anyone who could make the bot send it could just as easily send it themselves. < 1330101823 22597 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1330101970 710943 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I take it fungot does at least handle newlines in bf output properly? :-) < 1330101970 923362 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: that's a traditional chinese character meaning " education".) < 1330102045 496295 :Guest66243!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ion: hopefully < 1330102119 815236 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf ++++++++++.>+++++++[<++++++++++>-]<.++.---------.+++++++++++++.---------.++++++.------------.>+++++[<------->-]<----.>+++++++[<++++++++++>-]<+++.++++++.-.>+++++++[<----------->-]<-.>+++++[<+++++>-]<+.>+++++++[<+++++++>-]<++++.>+++++++[<----------->-]<--.>+++++++[<++++++++++>-]<++.-------.++++++++. < 1330102120 2004 :fungot!~fungot@a91-152-37-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :.PRIVMSG ion :o hai < 1330102125 976352 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does. :-) < 1330102198 402214 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# pop ;; < 1330102199 735095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- : (('_a * '_b -> '_a) * ('_c -> zero) -> '_d) -> '_d = < 1330102201 249996 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# q 4 // pop ;; < 1330102202 744881 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- : '_a -> '_a = < 1330102204 264184 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# pop ;; < 1330102205 771968 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- : (('_a * int -> '_a) * ('_b -> zero) -> '_a) -> '_a = < 1330102210 218812 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do people agree with me that this can only possibly be a compiler bug? < 1330102247 114206 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330102252 580331 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ocaml is probably unifying types as it goes < 1330102258 95116 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to make pop more monomorphic or sth < 1330102284 150552 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, the whole point of it is to be polymorphic < 1330102296 10752 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, I don't see how using a function can make it less polymorphic < 1330102353 780605 :Guest66243!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :PiRSquared < 1330102386 420270 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# q 5 // pop ;; < 1330102387 814462 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- : '_a -> '_a = < 1330102389 266966 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# q "x" // pop ;; < 1330102390 772940 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Error: Unbound constructor < 1330102410 242166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, is /that/ a compiler error? the error message makes no sense any more < 1330102513 910641 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well consider ML references < 1330102518 679420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can be polymorphic < 1330102522 615082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but as soon as you fill a type in it's fixed < 1330102527 523703 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what the '_a stuff means after all < 1330102543 118077 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, is there a difference between '_a and 'a? < 1330102631 325810 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd love it if there was a way to do types that didn't get instantly fixed < 1330102645 231893 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that just stayed polymorphic if they could < 1330102691 603575 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh, maybe i'mt hinking 'a vs. ''a < 1330102700 402288 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, polymorphic references are a well known problem in ml community < 1330102706 504875 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1330102709 103494 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you must disallow putting in an int and taking out a string and such < 1330102711 610103 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this is pure functional, no mutable values anywhere < 1330102714 90222 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :so some "fixing" must be required < 1330102927 801279 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think with references it's fine; if a ref is both read and written, it fixes its type from both variances < 1330102962 494823 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah < 1330102965 19156 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have a ref 'a < 1330102967 691849 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can use it as a ref int < 1330102971 254140 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can use it as a ref string < 1330102975 544506 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how polymorphism works < 1330103124 204129 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, because it depends on variances < 1330103353 559309 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1330103469 551289 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake JOIN :#esoteric < 1330103532 155427 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf internet < 1330103535 891704 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY U NO WORK < 1330103619 884287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :please /part the channel to punish yourself, thanks < 1330103638 544528 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: erm < 1330103658 193777 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: if (r :: forall a. IORef a), are you denying that (writeIORef r (42 :: Int)) and (readIORef r :: IO String) are both perfectly valid expressions? < 1330103696 484164 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I am < 1330103727 693780 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1330103752 959038 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: then, I accuse you of not understanding polymorphism < 1330103760 20483 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :for reference, writeIORef :: forall a. IORef a -> a -> IO () < 1330103764 837676 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :readIORef :: forall a. IORef a -> IO a < 1330103768 509297 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you're looking at each expression seperately < 1330103772 994528 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not, say, combined with a >> < 1330103778 431123 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i think you are mixing up your quantifiers < 1330103782 323427 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because OCaml leaves them implicit < 1330103792 926036 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :those two programs are undeniably well-typed for an r of that type < 1330103823 432537 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the types of writeIORef and readIORef that you've listed are wrong, or at least don't reflect what those functions actually do < 1330103833 262542 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, so you're lying < 1330103856 47432 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: "lying"? < 1330103859 392854 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you say, "it's fine" and contradict my statement with "no, because it depends on variances", you actually mean "it *should* be fine" and "ideally no, because it should depend on variances" < 1330103875 180762 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I was rather clearly not talking in the context of some hypothetical system < 1330103876 378427 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I think we're defining "references" differnetly < 1330103886 567107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't realise you were referring to a particular broken system of references < 1330103886 886793 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :those types for {read,write}IORef are perfectly correct, and they match the corresponding types for ref in ML < 1330103893 389028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm referring to ref < 1330103894 691366 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ref is broken in ML too < 1330103897 646015 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh < 1330103926 559248 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :note however that: writeIORef r (42 :: Int) >> (readIORef r :: IO String) < 1330103928 426509 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can only assume you are being deliberately obtuse, since I was explaining why that behaviour is valid in an ML derivative, relating it to the solution to the polymorphic references problem < 1330103929 878837 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is not a valid program. < 1330103939 775874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which obviously applies to actual references that exist, not ones you imagine < 1330103944 683822 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: yes it is, if r has the type I gave < 1330103952 378544 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :try it yourself, stub out r = undefined < 1330103953 953435 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it was rank-2. < 1330103954 204539 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see… writeIORef should have type "forall a. IORef (a or more specific) -> a -> IO ()", readIORef should have type "forall a. IORef (a or more general) -> a -> IO ()" < 1330103955 35296 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1330103956 121253 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1330103958 21460 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :no rank-2 at all < 1330103984 606434 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait nevermind < 1330104039 879811 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that "forall a. IORef a" is a type that can't possibly have the semantics you'd want from a reference, unless it does unsafe casting or something, because it /would/ be able to store arbitrary types and convert them to arbitrary other types < 1330104071 820897 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you don't want a reference witht ype (forall a. IORef a), that's the entire polymorphic references problem < 1330104095 676366 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I won't bother discussing this further since you're just going to end up rehashing the whole standard problem without actually reading up on it... < 1330104160 270905 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, I don't get what's wrong with this suggested solution < 1330104163 280523 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so uh, what happens semantically in that example. < 1330104170 729828 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nobody said it was wrong < 1330104173 714124 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is, however, beyond irrelevant < 1330104175 271945 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and going back to the original point, this all seems irrelevant to the polymorphic non-references problem I was describing earlier < 1330104189 442878 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was describing why your observed behaviour was not _unambiguously_ a compiler bug. that is all. < 1330104197 108930 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, OK < 1330104197 582035 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :types changing due to use is accepted in ML. whether it is what you are observing, I cannot say. < 1330104205 554610 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: the evaluator hits r and an exception is thrown < 1330104214 203069 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the program then terminates with "*** Exception: Prelude.undefined" or such < 1330104217 642329 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not documented in the manual, but then the manual doesn't even explain type inference < 1330104228 567144 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: huh, okay. < 1330104237 216717 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I've just never encountered a polymorphic reference. < 1330104240 91837 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: this tends to happen when stubbing things out with undefined. < 1330104250 556201 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems almost like an unsafeCoerce. < 1330104265 212467 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you can implement unsafe coercion with a polymorphic reference. < 1330104281 116561 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_O < 1330104286 624963 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, graue joined for three hours to say ... nothing. < 1330104290 305472 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :say r :: forall a. IORef a, then cast :: a -> IO b; cast x = writeIORef r x >> readIORef r < 1330104295 793483 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330104297 24813 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obviously) < 1330104309 643786 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :other things you can implement unsafe coercion with: < 1330104311 397306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- unsafeCoerce < 1330104312 793734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- unsafeCoerce# < 1330104316 556524 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, at least it's IO-ified < 1330104320 994107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :- other features that are unsafe and thus provide unsafe coercion < 1330104327 185436 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... guess. < 1330104334 15782 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :polymorphic references should not make you frown any more than these < 1330104344 444306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may be assuming there is a way to get one without unsafe mechanisms < 1330104348 852258 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is completely false < 1330104354 848140 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the way, I'm grumpy and tired, have a nice day < 1330104356 926520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: btw, does IOT exist? I can't remember whether it does or not < 1330104360 199384 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no < 1330104360 503535 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no it just seems to destroy type safety... < 1330104362 314554 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: time travel < 1330104373 836049 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: yes. just like unsafeCoerce, unsafeCoerce#, other features that are unsafe and thus provide unsafe coercion < 1330104380 865458 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but there's no warning here. < 1330104383 186171 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of things that are not possible in haskell 98 break type safety. < 1330104388 75209 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why can't it be implemented the same way as ReaderT and WriterT? < 1330104389 379272 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :which isn't a huge deal. < 1330104391 547287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :getting a polymorphic reference is one of these. < 1330104398 427306 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seem to be ignoring the point i am beating into your head. < 1330104405 786452 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :unsafeThisIsAWarningCoerce < 1330104407 813078 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is impossible to get a polymorphic reference by design < 1330104410 666773 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :without unsafe* < 1330104415 82008 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: IOT Cont < 1330104423 748745 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ReaderT and WriterT seem irrelevant < 1330104429 591049 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I'd just expect the IO to end up outside the continuation, then < 1330104430 628091 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :IO isn't ReaderT and it isn't WriterT < 1330104434 398336 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not StateT, either < 1330104437 29526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, that's ContT IO < 1330104441 846201 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see < 1330104443 572788 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :IOT Cont would let you reverse IO < 1330104452 772332 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, IO is only State if you ensure linearity < 1330104455 126077 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or repeat IO computations multiple times. < 1330104456 674531 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :more likely. < 1330104457 206798 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the whole thing IOT needs to break < 1330104463 71776 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the underlying monad can cause you to jump around < 1330104470 884669 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as you can't replace the real world, it all falls apart < 1330104478 673320 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, Paul Levy claimed today that StateT Cont and ContT State happened to be the same, was he wrong? < 1330104493 59632 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(claiming that monad transformers didn't commute in general, but those two did) < 1330104502 529785 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think he's right, but i'm too tired to think about it < 1330104505 450404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it'd seem to me that one would leave the state inside the continuations, and the other the state outside < 1330104515 427279 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps he had a different definition of continuations < 1330104518 230618 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1330104519 837395 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, he is wrong < 1330104522 480431 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my favorite thing about [State s a] is State s [a] < 1330104522 840868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :one lets you rewind state < 1330104525 347974 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other advances state blindly < 1330104529 908634 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :regardless of continuationing < 1330104533 867128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, that's what I thought < 1330104540 130563 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my guess is that his ContT doesn't affect state < 1330104544 60385 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if it's inside < 1330104552 905380 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it specifically aims only at a part of the language < 1330104613 145724 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think his definition of "monad transformer" can be very standard then < 1330104617 988820 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's "looking" at parts of the underlying monad < 1330104624 121102 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I think ReaderT Cont and ContT Reader would be the same though? < 1330104648 148883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: it's more that his effects are impure, so they don't work quite the same way as Haskell monads < 1330104661 222193 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: yes, ReaderT commutes with just about everything < 1330104675 688819 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :distribute is a more accurate word than commute methinks < 1330104688 972489 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there any underlying property of ReaderT that makes so. something you could, say, generalize to other monads to show that they're also commutative? < 1330104694 460438 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or distributive or whatever may be the case. < 1330104711 805725 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :distributive sounds right... < 1330104773 599338 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sequence is basically the distributive law for the list monad, it would seem. < 1330104776 676825 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :most monads are functions underneath < 1330104779 23835 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ReaderT is a function < 1330104782 380619 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1330104784 382589 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a -> b -> c) ~ (b -> a -> c) < 1330104785 567496 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :q.e.d. < 1330104792 275423 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah okay. < 1330104796 1100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not convinced ReaderT and ListT distribute in the same way < 1330104807 883916 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :sequence is a distributive law, yes < 1330104809 892661 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :traversable generalises it < 1330104821 599329 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traversable t = t distributes over any Applicative < 1330104823 362806 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :or w/e < 1330104826 860371 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t sequenceA < 1330104827 798542 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: `sequenceA' < 1330104830 281417 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you < 1330104832 581031 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :@hoogle sequenceA < 1330104832 768353 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Traversable sequenceA :: (Traversable t, Applicative f) => t (f a) -> f (t a) < 1330104832 955344 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@li85-105.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Data.Foldable sequenceA_ :: (Foldable t, Applicative f) => t (f a) -> f () < 1330104843 165733 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm still not entirely clear on why Kernel needs the wrap/unwrap primitives in addition to vau < 1330104854 437006 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, i seem to have shot myself in the foot by lacking them in my toy language < 1330104871 879100 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: to be able to evaluate anything < 1330104876 483285 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: you can also just have eval, I think < 1330104883 874953 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can implement eval with wrap < 1330104884 63022 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh nice I was wondering if sequence was generalized. < 1330104886 922107 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forget what unwrap is for though < 1330104902 320412 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :unwrap is used to implement apply < 1330104912 121635 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think my real problem is, i'm trying to use apply on operatives < 1330104920 224588 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the paper explicitly states that this is terrible and disgusting < 1330104934 835249 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel kernel has some concepts it could unify and clean up < 1330104955 694670 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm unconvinced the distinction between thingys (the normal functiony things) and fexprthingys is productive < 1330104965 334858 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :as opposed to just having fexprthingys that happen to evaluate their arguments in an orderly fashion < 1330104979 15353 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1330104992 970398 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :applicatives vs. operatives < 1330104993 901738 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's my feeling as well < 1330105001 769259 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i haven't used this stuff very much < 1330105023 35425 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my toy language lacks that distinction < 1330105081 625808 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically you look at the underlying structure of the type to determine if it distributes. showing that ListT is distributive is done recursively -- basically it's the code of sequence. :P woah it's like curry-howard, man. < 1330105279 769604 :tzxn3!~tzxn3@cpc5-mapp3-0-0-cust464.12-4.cable.virginmedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330105320 361645 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think real distributivity is a biconditional though. here we're talking about a single implication unless both of the monad transformers are "distributive" < 1330105370 592155 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's [m a] -> m [a] but no m [a] -> [m a] forall Monad m => m < 1330105460 800424 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's how I know distributivity. Perhaps in abstract algebra it's only required that one operator distributes over the other. < 1330105619 23344 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :pure . fmap head < 1330105620 403273 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what now < 1330105625 571347 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :nooooooo < 1330105635 166316 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn58-57.yok.fi QUIT : < 1330105650 766984 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330105650 953960 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what. < 1330105660 879317 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no... < 1330105663 801999 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1330105666 876934 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi!! < 1330105699 764704 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: also pure is Applicative not Monad nyahahahaha blah blah. < 1330105723 705978 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you like pure so much? < 1330105732 23753 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it's shorter? < 1330105733 958735 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seem to prefer it to return. < 1330105737 96634 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the examples I've seen. < 1330105752 41274 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually use whichever requires the fewest class constraints. < 1330105775 247615 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use pure whenever using it as a unit (as opposed to as part of a larger monad computation) when the type is monomorphic. < 1330105782 198048 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :For instance I always use pure :: a -> [a] rather than return. < 1330105793 232734 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the type it was used as above < 1330105800 268935 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: seems '_a really is different from 'a < 1330105801 718407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/aFRG < 1330105839 461832 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I suppose the question is, what technical limitation of OCaml causes it to type q and r differently? < 1330105846 718727 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :see I would use pure if I were only using Applicative functions, and return if only using Monad functions... I guess I would pick pure if both were already in use and there was no way to simplify the code to use only one constraint. < 1330105876 219083 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :# let s x = c i i x ;; < 1330105877 447192 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :val s : (('a -> 'a) -> ('b -> 'b) -> 'c) -> 'c = < 1330105905 298829 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, aha, eta-expansion causes it to work, it must not like polymorphic function values (as opposed to polymorphic function definitions) < 1330106079 293771 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, this type is beautiful, if ultimately not what I wanted: http://sprunge.us/HGXN < 1330106141 955313 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1330106162 109048 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty < 1330106185 298124 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also not actually usable for swapping :) < 1330106189 200127 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(q 4 // q 5 // oerjanswap doesn't type) < 1330106256 256321 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what do you make of http://esolangs.org/wiki/Basic_Input/Output_Commander? < 1330106261 793332 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's... < 1330106279 602994 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi QUIT :Quit: Solaris + USB disks = ffffffuuuuuuu < 1330106292 486194 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind of risky to implement < 1330106302 484708 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :given that it has a command that's entirely capable of repartitioning the hard drive < 1330106324 987714 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :virtualbox that shit < 1330106327 420630 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't have any memory storage, or any control flow < 1330106344 590866 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't writing to RAM be memory storage? < 1330106344 968605 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's from the person who brought us [[mindscrew]] < 1330106348 667739 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :clearly a visionary we're working with here < 1330106348 854448 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1330106354 834988 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, obviously the ip is a file thing < 1330106356 299707 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably it's nonetheless TC as it can rewrite your OS to run the program for oyu < 1330106357 778401 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you < 1330106364 457845 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and automatically order more storage from Amazon when it runs out < 1330106386 203529 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :given a suitable credit card < 1330106404 768156 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :TC dependent on available lines of credit and liquid assets < 1330106407 83607 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting properties. < 1330106505 430313 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: haha, I really hope AWS starts expanding before it reaches capacity and then never stops and entropy is halted < 1330106516 551356 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :just so your proof by Amazon ends up being inadvertently valid < 1330106563 100060 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anyone managed to successfully use AWS? < 1330106573 530149 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's quite a mess of services. < 1330106588 101375 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :by "anyone" I mean people in this channel, of course. < 1330106593 49241 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only relevant people in the universe. < 1330106655 678424 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm sure someone in here has used EC2 before < 1330106662 883120 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I gather that apart from S3 and EC2 they're mostly rubbish < 1330106711 859514 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to use it once... and decided that it would be easier to just use a dedicated server. < 1330106801 863328 :kmc!~keegan@c-65-96-1-204.hsd1.ma.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, how much have you used Kernel, and what for? < 1330106820 859198 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: 0, nothing < 1330106826 505885 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't "use" languages ;) < 1330106847 553303 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I read at *least* 25% of the paper! < 1330106855 593611 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I perform theoretical language abuse on a theoretically daily basis. < 1330106903 129763 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330106994 811566 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I swear my dreams are becoming increasingly rave + computer science oriented < 1330107001 320982 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds goofd < 1330107008 230271 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :not to be confused with good < 1330107044 270059 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`addquote I swear my dreams are becoming increasingly rave + computer science oriented < 1330107047 103268 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :my personal Heaven would be endless computer science raves where I have magical powers such as flight < 1330107052 324928 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :809) I swear my dreams are becoming increasingly rave + computer science oriented < 1330107095 441998 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today's Dinosaur Comics is pretty much awesome. < 1330107353 547846 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107355 258557 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107356 655958 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :387) Lymia, I don't know what that is but I want to hit you for it on principle. < 1330107356 842511 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107357 152077 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330107357 340352 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330107358 248270 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107360 313068 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330107360 603195 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107362 194935 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330107365 646167 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1330107388 135533 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We've hit quote limit < 1330107453 15322 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: ^ < 1330107498 478451 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107501 307556 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :694) Vorpal: I was paying too much attention to elliott and not enough to my HP < 1330107505 327596 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote < 1330107507 464899 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330107517 462264 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Headlines: FBI investigation of chat logs reports illegal #esoteric environmental cloning experiment fails catastrophically < 1330107663 22098 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :gah, the force-quit tool's malfunctioned and left a window covering my screen, how do I force-quit it? < 1330107669 547082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hey, what ad/script-blocking/anonymising FF extensions do you use? I'm becoming sufficiently annoyed by Google's context-sensitivity and YouTube ads to want to do something about it < 1330107686 510670 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can tell you the ones I use in Chrome... < 1330107689 40344 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, killall gnome-panel worked < 1330107696 579851 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a sign that they must be doing something /really/ wrong, if it's so terrible they're overwhelming my immense apathy < 1330107699 20214 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: AdBlock Plus, NoScript, and RefControl < 1330107699 425164 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: sure < 1330107709 824150 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :combined with turning off Flash in Firefox, and using a different browser when I want it < 1330107714 349710 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and I want to block Analytics too, although I can't quite articulate why < 1330107717 480222 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use AdBlock Plus as a general annoyance-blocker < 1330107734 794076 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was considering http://disconnect.me/
< 1330107736 999354 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because they're taking information from you that is worth money, and if they're taking it without your consent you can't sell it to them later < 1330107742 427922 :Deewiant!~deewiant@cs27125254.pp.htv.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1330107746 492122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :which purports to disable google's bubbling and facebook's cross-site stuff and the like < 1330107756 280362 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does "bubbling" mean, exactly < 1330107764 482935 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :result personalisation, essentially < 1330107767 279296 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, OK < 1330107769 134161 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that annoys me < 1330107773 684632 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well, it's not an ethical objection per se, those don't bother me enough to do something < 1330107784 845115 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's that Analytics tracks slightly more than I'm OK with < 1330107787 860756 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the same reason that kerio plays computer games in English despite setting everything else to Italian < 1330107788 63449 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :for Chrome: Ghostery, No Track Plus, Adblock Plus < 1330107798 55805 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ghostery is kind of like noscript but less annoying < 1330107799 120562 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc it tracks which links you click, right? < 1330107813 431563 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION isn't really interesting in blocking scripts in general
< 1330107815 353382 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*interested < 1330107831 64457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I blacklist by default but am free with adding to my whitelist if I find a site whose scripts I want to use < 1330107831 251152 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also here's ABP lists related to privacy protection: http://adversity.uk.to/ < 1330107842 255337 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: oh, I also set cookies to no third-party, prompt for first-party, in Firefox < 1330107844 661256 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Ghostery specifically targets a huge list of advertising company tracker script things. < 1330107846 191257 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not an extension but a core setting < 1330107864 809944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: doesn't blocking ads take care of that? < 1330107865 292083 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's pretty annoying, because if you reject one cookie from a site, Firefox then prompts you for all the others it tries to set, unless you choose "always reject" < 1330107870 96334 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there should be a "deny for session" option or something like that < 1330107878 577287 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: first-party cookies I'm OK with too < 1330107896 142692 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: well, say, first-party cookies from Google I'm not OK with < 1330107899 522310 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they can be used to personalise results < 1330107901 468044 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think so. Ghostery blocks scripts. I'm not sure if Adblock can block scripts... < 1330107903 102264 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly I want to banish ads/tracking, and preferably disable "customisation" like Google's < 1330107917 942978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I need to store a Google cookie, I'll use Chromium < 1330107933 12379 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://lifehacker.com/5887140/everyones-trying-to-track-what-you-do-on-the-web-heres-how-to-stop-them < 1330107934 419129 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"• Truly depersonalize searches on search engines like Google and Yahoo (by blocking identifying cookies not just changing the appearance of results pages), while staying logged into other services — e.g., so you can search anonymously on Google and access iGoogle at once." < 1330107936 567260 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds useful < 1330107982 525407 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :has extensions listed for FF and Chrome < 1330107982 711950 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: ABP handles YouTube video ads, right? < 1330107988 339458 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, it's spotty. < 1330107991 263875 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it can. < 1330107992 179367 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are really what's driving me up the wall sufficiently to do this :P < 1330107998 535833 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes I still get ads. < 1330108001 678224 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not often < 1330108012 874428 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes ABP should be installed regardless < 1330108027 669579 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an essential web browsing tool. :P < 1330108043 588255 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll probably go with just AdBlock, IIRC it's slightly better than ABP for Chrome < 1330108090 720686 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also recommend http://adversity.uk.to/ < 1330108091 67785 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder what would happen if I wrote an extension to accept cookies but randomly change their contents < 1330108147 946550 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: anyway, you clearly accept cookies from esolangs.org < 1330108148 833177 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the priv3 extension looks interesting. < 1330108155 862523 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm surprised you trust me more than :P < 1330108165 984683 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: but I want the site to track me < 1330108177 536107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that it can attach my user name to my edits and let me make admin actions < 1330108182 560527 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm actually bubbling everybody's recent changes. < 1330108186 105522 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover doesn't see any BF derivatives. < 1330108192 856951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 only sees things needing cleaning up. < 1330108200 987973 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do I see? < 1330108205 147518 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh, that gave me a good laugh < 1330108207 687948 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Nothing. < 1330108214 213772 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Correct! < 1330108223 497283 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which we learn that shachaf is actually blind < 1330108239 37892 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Champagne. < 1330108272 196174 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1330108291 736522 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: which kernel should I install: linux-image-3.2.0-1-adm64, linux-image-amd64, or none. < 1330108302 313513 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Which one is the default? < 1330108305 868189 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :first < 1330108307 848466 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And why are you using the expert install? < 1330108311 739034 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pick whichever one is the default. < 1330108313 251008 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am? < 1330108319 111238 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I picked "graphical install" < 1330108320 860289 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe they prompt for kernel on regular installs now. Silly. < 1330108322 869960 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was no expert option. < 1330108367 54818 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what happens when I install none. < 1330108384 373745 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what exactly is Debian without a kernel? < 1330108413 355658 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian without a kernel. < 1330108418 341594 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :unbootable, obviously. but... why would you do that? < 1330108451 372659 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there other ways to install kernels into a "Debian without a kernel"? < 1330108467 445494 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :BSD Debian. < 1330108469 942887 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could boot the kernel on something else and point it at the partition. < 1330108474 916723 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, there is Debian/kFreeBSD. < 1330108481 286689 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Debian is also the official GNU HURD distribution. < 1330108482 333320 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1330108513 818262 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Seriously: http://www.debian.org/ports/hurd/) < 1330108525 303207 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... believed you the first time. < 1330108580 787461 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the hardware erasing section of the install was doing one of those "make multiple passes with random bytes" things. < 1330108583 713395 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it took forever. < 1330108620 31941 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That was probably because you selected encryption. < 1330108623 933805 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1330108626 720952 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure that's why. < 1330108631 187057 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it wouldn't be so paranoid. < 1330108635 235223 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I would hope) < 1330108661 116856 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: To my knowledge, Debian is not "the official" GNU HURD distribution, it's merely "the only" GNU HURD distribution. GNU is still the official one, in spite of the fact that it hasn't had a release in a decade. Unless this policy has changed recently. < 1330108694 927616 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is GNU even doing today. < 1330108696 337097 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder. < 1330108699 524624 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :working on HURD? < 1330108702 925866 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Hmm, yes, you're probably right. But it's what everybody uses, and what the LiveCDs are :P < 1330108704 656397 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: ...? < 1330108708 758539 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Maintaining hundreds of software packages? < 1330108712 157364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :glibc? Emacs? gcc? < 1330108714 244889 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you heard of these? < 1330108717 93175 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1330108717 569691 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Eeyup. < 1330108726 155485 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GNOME? < 1330108733 559066 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :GNU is not a centralised organisation, so they don't really "do" anything. < 1330108740 758213 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, beyond administration and advocacy and so on. < 1330108753 997157 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Individual GNU projects range from incredibly active and ubiquitous to dead dead dead. < 1330108757 566566 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have an office don't that? I'm wondering what they do on a daily basis. < 1330108788 147494 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's awesome that the "official GNU snapshot" has a link to a 404, and isn't even hosted at gnu.org < 1330108814 57730 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Boring administration, I suspect. < 1330108823 444535 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you sure GNU have an office? < 1330108825 49035 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The FSF do. < 1330108829 498364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure GNU does. < 1330108830 168534 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's probably what I'm thinking of. < 1330108850 305740 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the FSF handle lots of legal matters, do lots of promotional campaigns, advocacy, is rms' nanny... < 1330108880 280363 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :They maintain the licenses, have servers, etc. < 1330108880 466333 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds good < 1330108894 870104 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"is rms' nanny" X-D < 1330108903 811646 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :root mean square? < 1330108911 410852 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rusrs < 1330108926 282641 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :whut < 1330108928 189230 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Someone's gotta pay the guy's expenses :P < 1330108930 389082 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: r u srs < 1330108931 546144 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Raytheon Missile Systems? < 1330108937 591229 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :troll < 1330108950 538997 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I actually have no clue what that acronym is supposed to expand to. < 1330108967 969628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1330108974 476227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :stallman you dimwitted dimwit < 1330108975 361793 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It expands to "rms m stallman" < 1330108985 633562 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :..wat < 1330108989 617633 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Watch as we find out that kallisti does not know who Stallman is. < 1330108989 804185 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1330108994 231128 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I do. < 1330109016 170868 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :rms = Richard Matthew Stallman. HTH HAND < 1330109016 357527 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :MORE LIKE RMS M STALLAN < 1330109022 200502 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :*STALLION < 1330109025 201909 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :D-8 < 1330109027 252553 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHY WOULD YOU EXPECT ME TO KNOW STALLMAN'S MIDDLE FUCKING INITIAL. < 1330109033 647515 :PiRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :M < 1330109042 720951 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: my little rms freedom is magic < 1330109051 935932 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: Dude. < 1330109054 763993 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: It's "rms". < 1330109056 757985 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone calls him rms. < 1330109066 52103 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's like esr, except rms is more tolerable. < 1330109072 612177 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :...sorry I wasn't born in the 70s hacker culture as you apparently were. < 1330109081 97198 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :.................. < 1330109090 122109 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: So, if you got op status, would you kick kallisti right now? < 1330109094 373335 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm planning my votes. < 1330109097 541061 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They count extra, since I'm God.) < 1330109110 205299 :PiRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :HalfTauRSquared < 1330109138 22005 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :"memorize Wikipedia" is still on my list of todos < 1330109178 713108 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hate to say it, but willful ignorance isn't necessarily kick-worthy. < 1330109186 844316 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1330109197 248788 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :willfull? < 1330109204 314527 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :with two l's < 1330109208 528911 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :extra ful < 1330109210 826242 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Dude. < 1330109213 169406 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are The Problem now. < 1330109216 995105 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1330109218 994054 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, but ... < 1330109221 895781 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is Magic
< 1330109232 224674 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would say that ignorance of some subjects is... necessary. < 1330109235 955499 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :to like, functioning daily. < 1330109240 896292 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :and being a human being. < 1330109245 732622 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Come on man. < 1330109248 518623 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stand up for what's right here. < 1330109400 387725 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: so, if you don't know the name of every episode of Supernatural because the list freely available on the internet < 1330109405 764003 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that willful ignorance? < 1330109413 525254 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, a result of opportunity costs? < 1330109416 556135 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti: This is #esoteric, not #shitty-tv-shows < 1330109428 367735 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric free software advocates. < 1330109460 639268 :Friendship!codu@codu.org TOPIC #esoteric :Home of esoteric free software advocates | So good to be in the Morning....In America! | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ | http://esolangs.org/wiki/ has moved servers! < 1330109462 229969 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. < 1330109531 28008 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :just you wait until I get a chance to chastize your lack of knowledge of middle initials.. < 1330109536 688971 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :there will be hell to pay. < 1330109550 267056 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOU BETTER START STUDYING. < 1330109571 540454 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :<-- GFR < 1330109584 931569 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Because I have established in the imaginary canon of #esoteric that my middle name is Friendship) < 1330109591 740389 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :<-- ALC < 1330109597 251287 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Noted. < 1330109598 660811 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh we weren't actually listing our actual initials actually. < 1330109642 881347 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :K"LP"K < 1330109652 927350 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :short for kallisti "likes Perl" kallisti < 1330109686 271613 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION nods sagely.
< 1330109694 998980 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :<-- NGEvD < 1330109701 212113 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except without the e < 1330109708 752906 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o( < 1330109731 322464 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think ":o(" are much better initials. < 1330109773 852638 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The "E" stands for Elliott. And I almost actually had that as my middle name) < 1330109784 976662 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330109830 794693 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :IAGTSAAOMSVTUOA < 1330109949 356903 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake PRIVMSG #esoteric :League for Programming Freedom sounds like a superhero organization. < 1330110264 232095 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.gnu.org/graphics/bwcartoon-m.jpg <-- it is < 1330110284 808877 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does one program freedom? < 1330110294 1405 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :import freewill; < 1330110317 785940 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :while(1){ doWhatYouWant() } < 1330110352 970554 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hoorah! < 1330110629 986509 :kallisti_!~eris@h151.51.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330110636 858708 :kallisti!~eris@wikipedia/The-Prophet-Wizard-of-the-Crayon-Cake QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1330110886 48844 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found something else wrong with esolang wiki. If you select what you want from special pages dropdown list, it is 404 error. < 1330110993 853294 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Example? < 1330111022 553679 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you forgot to install the "redirect.php" file < 1330111041 974033 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330111343 758759 :mRoman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/mpf1KzFL <- truth-machine gone OOP < 1330111447 10328 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the manual says redirect.php is only for legacy stuff < 1330111460 452060 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did install it but didn't map it to the web server; I can if it's causing you problems < 1330111467 325888 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was the other thing wrong with the wiki? < 1330111479 561042 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :spam < 1330111499 903920 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: is the moon waxing or waning? < 1330111501 483905 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: have you installed apache before < 1330111511 351210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolangs.org is using nginx < 1330111517 562540 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i have used apache in the past < 1330111568 315560 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I meant, the other thing zzo38 found that's wrong) < 1330111615 318585 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: why do you ask? < 1330111686 828686 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I thjink waxing? < 1330111706 220002 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay < 1330111734 224349 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: The thing about redirect.php (the special pages dropdown in the Nostalgia skin uses it) is the only thing I was saying is wrong < 1330111753 885420 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. < 1330111756 528624 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll fix it. < 1330111777 243861 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Done. < 1330111780 246099 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can say a lot of other things are wrong but the things other than that are mostly just a matter of my opinion. < 1330111820 474893 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope it works now :P < 1330111828 746021 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it works now < 1330111854 193443 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1330111881 859790 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Can't you look it up yourself the phase of the moon? Why did you ask me? Sure, I can figure it out too, but still < 1330111888 206599 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: because i am considering installing it now on my vps and want an idea of what kind of task it is to install < 1330111912 827963 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, you just seemed the right person to ask < 1330111931 827607 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So long as mRoman is making it OO, I'll make it Smalltalk (but with no real OO ^^) < 1330111933 816085 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/BjbO < 1330111987 859708 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: There is absolutely no reason to make a new Apache installation today. < 1330111995 779338 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially not on a VPS which will have comparatively low memory. < 1330112001 199199 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use nginx. < 1330112007 20819 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1330112022 430439 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is that? < 1330112034 830408 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apache is a memory hog and pretty slow to boot. Also, its configuration is really baroque. < 1330112051 71811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, not that it can't be made performant. < 1330112058 142227 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's definitely not optimised for the kind of environment you get on a VPS. < 1330112060 764719 :kallisti_!~eris@h151.51.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott prefers more romantic configuration styles. < 1330112061 105903 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so nginx is easier to install and use? < 1330112065 830878 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does nginx support CGI, or only FastCGI? Looking at documentation for nginx, it seem various things I use in Apache which nginx don't have < 1330112069 128688 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :kallisti_: me too < 1330112073 405964 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Definitely. (It's also pretty popular.) < 1330112079 999970 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Why did I seemed the right person to ask? < 1330112092 520774 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: because you know where the sun is rising < 1330112103 313000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://news.netcraft.com/archives/2012/01/03/january-2012-web-server-survey.html (third most popular webserver) < 1330112116 272460 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only alternatives in the "server that can do general stuff" stakes are... uhh, ISS and lighttpd. < 1330112121 748208 :kallisti_!~eris@h151.51.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Did you know...] that the Sri Lanka Eye Donation Society has donated over 60,000 corneas for transplantation in 57 countries, including those of the late President of Sri Lanka, J. R. Jayewardene? < 1330112130 70649 :kallisti_!~eris@h151.51.18.98.dynamic.ip.windstream.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want those corneas. < 1330112132 156945 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :lighttpd leaks memory like a sieve, or did, and isn't all that popular; IIS is... presumably not one of your options. < 1330112134 830705 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: so how long do you think it will take to configure? < 1330112137 761820 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I only know where the sun is rising and what phase of moon and these things because of the computer program Astrolog, can plot charts which makes it clear these things. < 1330112147 49509 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I dunno, I just thought "Hmm, the moon. Is it waxing or waning? I know who to ask! zzo38!" < 1330112151 662679 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: It depends on what you want to do. < 1330112159 575368 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: There are CGI<->FastCGI bridges. < 1330112179 555015 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Hm, I'm surprised that lighttpd isn't higher on the list ... < 1330112182 543698 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's true that nginx doesn't support CGI OOTB but it's easy to make it do so. < 1330112187 628543 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i will probably put a wordpress or something like that in it. some well-supported and documented content manager < 1330112232 896239 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Wellll, since I'm assuming you don't know what you're doing (no offence), I'd assign half a day or so to the task. 90% of that will be reading http://wiki.nginx.org/WordPress. < 1330112235 694243 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're using Debian, right? < 1330112255 356269 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Download Astrolog onto your own computer and then figure out phase of moon and these things by yourself (although you would have to learn how to read the horoscopes and other charts) < 1330112257 977488 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1330112266 783565 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :If so, setting up PHP for FastCGI is really easy (install one package and you're done), so the only thing you'll likely need to do is write a ~50-line nginx site description. < 1330112270 533893 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: (What Debian release?) < 1330112274 838861 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure stable has php-fpm. But it might. < 1330112296 631013 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :its actually ubuntu maverick < 1330112341 744532 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks for the link < 1330112352 688267 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's in Maverick. < 1330112361 701263 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be careful with WordPress. < 1330112393 387276 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: You can do that, learn phase of moon and that stuff by yourself. Why don't you learn it by yourself in this way? < 1330112446 319475 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: i know not to download templates from non-wordpress sites, and keep it up-to-date < 1330112493 561526 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: That does nothing to protect you from the countless security flaws that have been discovered in the core code in the past... but perhaps they're better these days. Anyway, how big is your VPS? < 1330112496 410636 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, I don't know. < 1330112497 797103 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll want to install that WP Super Cache thing. < 1330112516 925664 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :In addition to phase of moon, and where sun is rising, I used Astrolog to figure out when is Chinese New Year, when is solar noon, and more things. < 1330112552 520669 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Oh, and you'll want to install APC, there are guides on the net... ignore most of the tuning advice for your purposes except upping the memory to 64 megs. < 1330112558 158705 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION must ask why quintopia doesn't go with wordpress.com or something.
< 1330112576 568615 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: 1kRAM, 1TB bandwidth, 60GBHDD < 1330112595 685372 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not committed to wordpress. if you know a better CM < 1330112605 611932 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :One kilobyte of RAM? Impressive. < 1330112618 395267 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less than a VIC-20. < 1330112625 369989 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1330112626 969847 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1330112627 539863 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :What kind of terrible VPS host is that that's giving you 1 terabyte of bandwidth per month on a RAM/HD plan that small? < 1330112628 825004 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's got four.) < 1330112634 429290 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're being ripped off. < 1330112634 615906 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :1kMBRAM < 1330112658 820466 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :its not a ripoff. its fairly cheap < 1330112674 993874 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a ripoff, in that there's no way they'll be happy if you use all that bandwidth. < 1330112678 57655 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thus they're overselling. < 1330112685 345522 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :A kilomegabyte is the funniest unit. < 1330112687 635838 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1330112705 460788 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm not paying for the transfer really < 1330112716 427787 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just want the RAM and the always-on status < 1330112726 675367 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I'm not sure why you're using a VPS if you just want to run a single CMS like WordPress. I mean, there are hosted solutions. But it's your time. < 1330112731 571103 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I like the grambit more. < 1330112808 98264 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder about prgmr's bandwidth limits. Technically they have those, but no-one has even clarified me the units (it's probably /month, but it's *almost* within the realm of possibility it's /day), and the billing site's "view my usage" page always shows only zeroes. < 1330112810 632351 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i already have the VPS. i would have the VPS with or without the webface < 1330112826 501332 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i figure since i have it, i can put a blog on it too yeah < 1330112853 578984 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, i eventually want to plug my bot into the webserver < 1330112860 248768 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If you had it, you should have put a blog on it", doesn't someone rap like that? < 1330112860 923119 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i have ulterior motives < 1330112861 110047 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: It's most definitely per-month, unless prgmr have wildly differing bandwidth plans to the rest of the universe. < 1330112881 386306 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably first thing you should do if you install Astrolog, is to adjust the configuration settings in ASTROLOG.DAT file to your timezone, geographic location, preferences, and macros. < 1330112908 324568 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, there is no way The Lorax is not going to be the most terrible film ever created. < 1330112930 942442 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :only one way to find out! < 1330112936 228476 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[Now people are having a (rather justified) heart attack about the fact that The Lorax is now being used to cross-promote a new SUV. Earlier this week, Mazda announced that it has partnered with Universal Pictures to promote the new "'Seuss-ifed' 2013 Mazda CX-5 crossover SUV." The cross-promotion includes commercials with a cartoon version of the car driving through a valley of Truffula trees. The ads claim that the car is "Truffula tree friend < 1330112936 415145 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ly"]] < 1330112940 437122 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Literally no way. < 1330112971 738454 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, you've seen that, eh :) < 1330112998 965269 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why did you want the phase of moon anyways? < 1330113018 816928 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: It's not *that* different from e.g. buyvm, which is another cheap thing. I mean, they give 1000GB of bandwidth for the 256M/30G $5/month plan. < 1330113061 115764 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You suggesting buyvm will be happy if you use all that? < 1330113077 144532 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: Perhaps not, but that's their nominal "BW" number. < 1330113094 87628 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, which just means they, too, are overselling, which is unsurprising for an ultra-budget provider like that. < 1330113152 388095 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: they wont be upset though, since they are selling based on the fact that for every person that does use it, 100 others won't. it works out. < 1330113201 230364 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, "works out". < 1330113218 929237 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why everybody ran into all those horrible clogging problems with that overselling provider -- was it DreamHost? -- some years ago. < 1330113239 584811 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lying to your customers works OK, because most of them won't realise it! < 1330113245 267585 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: that still happens to BlogNomic occasionally < 1330113247 279318 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's hosted there) < 1330113294 490132 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: as long as they stay on top of adding bandwidth when they need to, they shouldn't be causing problems < 1330113331 636215 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: That same argument would suggest that they should just offer completely "unlimited" bandwidth. < 1330113341 695892 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :And heck, RAM too, because for every person that uses it... < 1330113344 541593 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: no it wouldnt < 1330113367 943419 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :your extrapolation tactics wont work on me, fallacious arguer < 1330113377 610304 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am undone. < 1330113377 941380 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :1000 GB/month equals 3 Mbps; that much per customer is I guess slightly much. < 1330113383 207345 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330113434 32727 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I was more wondering whether prgmr actually has a counter or not at all, since it doesn't seem to be user-visible. < 1330113458 684436 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :My best guess is that it doesn't. < 1330113469 471490 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :They just set a number so that if somebody starts being a problem they can point to it. < 1330113472 4326 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wow, that's a handy escape route out of TVTropes < 1330113478 897833 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Genius Programming links to our wiki < 1330113489 703218 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :prgmr don't really watch anything. < 1330113494 805745 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :The limits are more like... guidelines :P < 1330113580 156115 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Welllll, the HD and RAM limits are pretty well limits. < 1330113607 699000 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :DRAW OUTSIDE THE LINES < 1330113610 91927 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I seem to have moved a total of 4 GiB in 75 days (unless these counters have wrapped around), so I suppose I'm one of their "not a problem" users when it comes to that. < 1330113636 417012 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :2.21 gigs in however long the esowiki's been up here. < 1330113646 37757 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :99% of that is spambots and rogue crawlers from less-regulated parts of the globe. < 1330113655 748131 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably block the latter. Except they don't actually look at /robots.txt. < 1330113658 311259 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, I think I added that link. < 1330113665 655474 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks, Phantom_Hoover < 1330113673 739081 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thantom_Hoover? < 1330113680 111390 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're still my favourite person in Northern Edinburgh < 1330113736 363944 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :True love. < 1330113753 582105 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote now is not the time < 1330113756 413116 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1330113762 435483 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote Dammit < 1330113764 307462 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330113767 420673 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O < 1330113771 282764 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :FFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUU < 1330113774 711769 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It keeps happening, yes. < 1330113789 686537 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :DAMMIT 1.19 COME OUT FASTER < 1330113798 476658 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I just have an image of HackEgo endlessly falling down a staircase ENDLESSLY < 1330113805 11873 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHERE DID ALL MY SPACE GO?! < 1330113805 370099 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: You should make Transactional HackEgo hapen. < 1330113816 523205 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastequotes < 1330113819 420793 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.29212 < 1330113841 9668 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 668 < 1330113842 900741 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Failed to clone the environment! < 1330113851 606285 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Foiled by the clone army. < 1330113853 520118 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll do this manually < 1330113854 85695 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :668) 678) Dammit, Gregor, this is not the time to fall in love 187) Gregor: You should never have got her pregnant. what whaaaaaaaaaaaat < 1330113920 598746 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the only way to make file pile stop from getting taller, etc. < 1330113957 53896 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: I don't think it's all HackEgo though ... but if it's not, I don't know what it is >_> < 1330113969 386829 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Shhh, I just have to shoehorn as many SBAHJ references in as I can. < 1330113971 851598 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blame fizzie. < 1330113977 916920 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: Would it help if I deleted some quotes? < 1330113982 664618 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1330113989 944939 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :(http://www.mspaintadventures.com/sweetbroandhellajeff/?cid=031.jpg, for posteriority.) < 1330114228 915246 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I LIKE WRITING BIG, IT MAKES ME FEEL COOL" -- Friendship, 2005 < 1330114231 376895 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't remember the context to... < 1330114234 239895 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 511 < 1330114242 688063 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :511) So it's like... Rummy mixed with... breakout? < 1330114318 750183 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ihopandthelorax.com/ < 1330114321 229780 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :WHAT < 1330114913 425239 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you mix rummy with breakout? < 1330114973 204489 :mRoman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have to destroy the blocks in a specific order or you lose? < 1330115416 306823 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs Rummy mixed with... < 1330115448 438502 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1330115455 88020 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`help < 1330115457 512275 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ < 1330115580 736799 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Help! < 1330115702 425241 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mahjong! < 1330115710 400055 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what's like rummy mixed with breakout! < 1330115734 191289 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is mahjong like rum mixed with breakout? < 1330115801 504239 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1330115834 691390 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You asked me that last time < 1330115835 934179 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`welcome oerjan < 1330115839 10610 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1330115847 354225 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay! < 1330115857 530391 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :my what a nice wiki < 1330115927 585630 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I run it. < 1330115929 539960 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the best. < 1330115933 785085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, < 1330115937 327028 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :`@ oerjan ? esoteric < 1330115940 444346 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: This channel is about programming -- for the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net. < 1330115944 931593 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't believe in astrology or anything, right? < 1330115949 156293 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did not realize that there were 5 billion different PHP CMS's < 1330115957 835678 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION awaits swattage.
< 1330116013 323031 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION swats precognizant elliott -----###
< 1330116303 688906 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: So do you want to be a wiki admin yet? < 1330116309 887294 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oerjan did do the horoscope for Agora Nomic, although that is not entirely relevant. and anyways they just used the default settings without adjusting them so you just do it without understand really < 1330116339 525334 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that oerjan is a poser astrologist. < 1330116456 464495 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortune -o offended me. It considered a quote I don't find offensive as offensive. < 1330116477 176187 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: is that a quote? < 1330116502 457149 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the logs are just too long today < 1330116538 149143 :augur!~augur@129.2.129.33 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330116541 949666 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I'm just being silly. In my UNIX class, I showed someone the fortune command, and noted the -o option, so he installed it. The first two quotes that came out of fortune -o may have been from the atheism vocabulary or something? < 1330116552 245949 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hope you enjoy RECENT CHANGES, then < 1330116597 641219 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Third one was some limerick about a whore. < 1330116600 68063 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: -o mostly enables stuff that isn't actually offensive, and things that you don't *want* it to output because they're actually blatantly offensive rather than interesting or amusing. < 1330116618 17425 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the fortune program also has option to select from both offensive and nonoffensive? The one I have always selects from both offensive and not offensive files, it doesn't have option to change them < 1330116618 374210 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you just have to deal with not seeing any swear words and missing out on a bunch of unobjectionable stuff because the organisation is crap. < 1330116704 860958 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you can list the ... files it uses? < 1330116746 720077 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if today's xkcd has a point he's not getting
< 1330116783 906160 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks pretty? < 1330116795 960334 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, not that. < 1330116811 527669 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is very pretty :D < 1330116815 72883 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reminds me of the <100 days. < 1330116831 530152 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't tell whether actually pencil-drawn, or just made to look it. < 1330116872 67521 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I like it. < 1330116884 91767 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of the really old comics were essentially meaningless too. < 1330116904 975464 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: Make sure I'm not just going crazy. < 1330116921 231559 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like trying to draw beach scenes sometimes.. and i am not good at drawing.. that scene is so well drawn i would want to pack my bags in < 1330117106 352502 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok so the bread represents gathering people together... eg facebook < 1330117125 307108 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then selling those people off < 1330117169 846461 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh.. that is to say, a website business.. you attract users.. and then sell their personal data etc < 1330117194 716493 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats my interpretation < 1330117211 496668 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :diabolical < 1330117251 739038 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott, I like it too; it doesn't have that "look at me I'm funny" feeling that most newer xkcd does. < 1330117274 64831 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like white beret guy < 1330117646 617050 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like black hat guy any mor. < 1330117648 269872 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*more < 1330117680 474261 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :He stopped being an entertaining sociopath and started just being an asshole ages ago. < 1330117906 922448 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://xkcd.com/284/ OK, xkcds used to be entertaining even if you didn't get them at all. < 1330117932 751809 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked that one because I have done pretty much that < 1330118173 14839 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1330118362 386513 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait how did he not get that < 1330118363 326900 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :has < 1330118371 127732 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :has he never tried to extend a tape measure < 1330118404 856745 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is a recluse. He has no access to tape measures. < 1330118421 130178 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if he needs to measure something < 1330118436 380731 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :He gets a meter stick < 1330118437 581162 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes "you didn't get them" doesn't mean "i didn't get them" < 1330118466 699588 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: i do not think that applies < 1330118569 39293 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to me the funny part is that it's a reference on the internet to the activity of extending tape measures in the air and seeing them collapse < 1330118720 487886 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sort of like if he did a comic book about losing the end of a stickytape roll when using the tape.. to the extent that some companies started to include a tab of paper to make it easier, and others included a plastic dispensor with a metal cutter < 1330118759 343867 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and needing to have scissors on hand... the way tape can distort and get ruined when you try to break it by hand < 1330118775 911990 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1330118788 902088 :azaq23!~derivecto@unaffiliated/azaq23 QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1330118795 284347 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-33.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott is British. They don't use tape measures, because tape measures don't support fathom/hand/centimeter measurements. < 1330118828 505821 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-33.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, *centimetre*. < 1330118847 858516 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has a plastic dispensor with a plastic cutter
< 1330118895 236220 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and a tape measure < 1330118909 905702 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(um, not as one item) < 1330118944 874113 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant plastic dispensor in terms of what the dispensor was made of( an adjective), not what the dispensor dispensed (a noun) < 1330118967 334586 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but so did you < 1330118971 237366 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i feel like a fool < 1330118981 855385 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh the ambiguity is diabolical < 1330119007 750097 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect the tape may be plastic too? < 1330119023 718995 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in the dispensor. the tape measure is metal.) < 1330119046 567483 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/o/e/g, i suspect < 1330119135 309509 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was kinda imagining a dispensor dispensing plastic for the purpose of manufacturing things with plastic < 1330119199 930946 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :those 3d printers might have some < 1330119344 142601 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION writes a Common Lisp macro
< 1330119354 915220 :Sgeo!~sgeo@ool-ad034d00.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Just a duplicate of an existing macro, to help me get the hang of macros) < 1330119455 313580 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :write a macro for duplicating macros, duh < 1330119706 832947 :Nisstyre!~yours@c-208-90-102-250.netflash.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330119841 901979 :pikhq!~pikhq@174-22-152-33.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1330119850 249818 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-240-180.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330119902 961464 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~nice@p5B133586.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330119989 267174 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~nice@p5B133586.dip.t-dialin.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1330120045 154927 :TeruFSX!~quassel@63-226-178-185.mpls.qwest.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1330121877 707380 :Taneb!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: Goodbye < 1330122692 589202 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-151-97.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330122820 191879 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-240-180.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1330123990 516525 :HalfTauRSquared!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 NICK :PiRSquared17 < 1330124150 525947 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330124446 109902 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330124571 11820 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric : "I LIKE WRITING BIG, IT MAKES ME FEEL COOL" -- Friendship, 2005 < 1330124575 904520 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I /probably/ said this. < 1330124595 603738 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello! < 1330124682 299434 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :He picked up way too many cards! Now he has only ten turns remaining and still needs to pick up six side cards to win, I don't think so especially since they keep getting paralyzed < 1330124758 188482 :PiRSquared17!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs [1!]{5,} < 1330124768 295526 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.28199 < 1330124973 331249 :PiRSquared17!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keymaker did a lot of them < 1330125093 453990 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That being said, I assumed he was talking about caps, not exclamation points? < 1330125107 323282 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And my main thing is that I used to overuse the tongue-face smiley, anyway. < 1330125273 106345 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have a lot of ENERGY REMOVAL and stuff, but none of that will help if you are just going to deck yourself. < 1330125305 980676 :PiRSquared17!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf was with !!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!! < 1330125308 826038 :PiRSquared17!~area@wikipedia/PiRSquared17 PRIVMSG #esoteric :??? < 1330125360 856836 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect he may have wanted some !!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!!ATTENTION!!!!!!!! < 1330125381 692287 :zzo38!~zzo38@h24-207-49-17.dlt.dccnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Especially if your opponent has enough defense. < 1330125414 951945 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION nods sagely.
< 1330125476 288543 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/2005-01-21.txt < 1330125486 276473 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't clarify very much < 1330125593 526117 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Friendship: what's more strange is that that log file seems to contain everything twice < 1330125976 843164 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :mRoman: Discuss similarities re Stlang and Glass kthx? < 1330126028 524951 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pastelogs [1!]{5,} < 1330126051 977349 :HackEgo!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.24049 < 1330126094 193734 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: In response to your previous statement, that is a lie and you should feel bad. < 1330126097 140711 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :>_> < 1330126097 771108 :Friendship!codu@codu.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :<_< < 1330126099 974943 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-207-183.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330126132 422708 :pikhq_!~pikhq@174-22-151-97.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1330126461 857567 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :;_; < 1330126588 134616 :Ngevd!~Taneb@host-2-99-92-169.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: Goodbye < 1330126611 312071 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow that jhix guy.. he's 14 and he's writing interpreters in haskell and he knows lambda calculus and everything!!!!!! < 1330126637 758703 :monqy!~swell@pool-71-102-226-192.snloca.dsl-w.verizon.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's so special about that < 1330126712 624735 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that depends on whether writing interpreters, coding in haskell, and knowing LC is special or if not really < 1330126823 783961 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the jury is out... unfortunately i selected a jury of lollypop ladies < 1330126870 282091 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-207-183.clsp.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :itidus20: Special relative to the general populace. Not very special relative to the set of people for whom that sentence makes sense. < 1330127113 909313 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trick [as trick identification is always important when describing things] is to extend every other activity and skill a person does and has by the development of new skills and activities < 1330127380 59526 :itidus20!~itidus21@120.148.51.249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i wanted to say something like "extend every extra" < 1330127496 840467 :pikhq_!~pikhq@71-219-198-237.clsp.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330127683 788550 :pikhq!~pikhq@71-219-207-183.clsp.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1330127983 124596 :hagb4rd!~perdito@koln-4db41a08.pool.mediaWays.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1330127989 968574 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION -> sleep
< 1330127991 354541 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover/x-3377486 QUIT :Quit: Leaving