00:00:51 I had a haskellion tell me vehemently that I shouldn't implement a type system in a language by referring to things as having a "kind", because "kinds" are an utterly distinct thing from a "type" in haskell 00:01:28 i don't think it's just haskell, but type theory in general 00:01:29 well that's type theory generally 00:01:47 they're fucking words 00:01:48 though yeah those words are kind of. vague 00:02:09 and it doesn't matter what the words mean in haskell when you are writing a language which is not haskell 00:02:13 it's just that if you say "kind" to mean what people would think of as a "type" then you'll probably confuse people, so just stick with the shitty language we've got and hope things work out 00:02:30 RodgerTheGreat: "kind"'s meaning is well agreed upon in PLT in general, not just Haskell. 00:02:45 (Well, relatively well-agreed; ambiguity arises when you get to types-of-kinds.) 00:03:02 an ieee-754 double does not have enough granular precision to express how little I care 00:03:10 type three: revenge of the meta 00:03:14 okay well maybe you should just shut up 00:03:27 since you clearly know nothing about either category theory or type systems 00:04:22 no, no, throw in a nerdy insult 00:04:29 make this as horrible as possible for everybody 00:05:03 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 00:05:42 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 00:05:56 no I think I will just make it simple by telling the person who has joined and then done nothing other than shout loudly about how proud they are about how little they know to shut up and see how it goes from there 00:06:10 that everything is horrible should be self-evident 00:06:28 he was talking about creatures with sgeo yesterday! 00:06:32 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 00:06:39 they were comparing strategies for making small fictional animals miserable 00:06:58 disagree with the importance of terminology -> knows nothing, obviously 00:08:02 Clearly the people who made Haskell should have used a term other than "monad", to avoid stepping on APL's toes 00:08:37 the ghost of leibniz will venge them all 00:08:44 RodgerTheGreat: I think it's fairly clear that if you think category theory is dedicated to making up a bunch of words to confuse people you're probably just scared of them because you don't know what any of them mean. 00:08:50 `addquote an ieee-754 double does not have enough granular precision to express how little I care 00:08:59 941) an ieee-754 double does not have enough granular precision to express how little I care 00:09:05 There seems to be no such thing as a word that has a consistent meaning across every programming language. I do not know whether this is a terrible thing or not. 00:09:12 kmc: awesome 00:09:32 it's great when two communities have two different, completely incomprehensible terms for the same idea 00:09:40 like "flyweight pattern" and "hash consing" 00:09:56 it's hard to think of a worse name for this idea, let alone two 00:10:14 * Sgeo has mostly noticed the other way, two completely different ideas for the same word 00:10:31 wtf is flyweight pattern 00:10:36 bla bla descriptivism bla logic bla bla nihilism bla 00:10:59 say what you will about the tenets of Java, at least it's an ethos! 00:11:01 Sgeo: hash consing!! 00:11:05 "In computer programming, flyweight is a software design pattern. A flyweight is an object that minimizes memory use by sharing as much data as possible with other similar objects; it is a way to use objects in large numbers when a simple repeated representation would use an unacceptable amount of memory" 00:11:11 Wait, are you serious. 00:11:41 Clojurists call that "persistent data structures", I think 00:11:52 i think it's a bit different 00:12:07 it's like if you have a word processor and an object for every character 00:12:23 you probably don't want a different object in memory for every instance of a normal-weight 12pt times new roman 'e' 00:12:28 Sgeo: doesn't persistence usually mean it persists across invocations of the runtime and shit 00:12:34 'interning' is another term for this 00:12:39 Sgeo: does the clojure meaning differ from the usual http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistent_data_structure ? 00:12:40 Bike: different definition of persistent 00:12:45 not quite the same thing as hash consing, if so 00:12:47 kmc: smalltalk "smallInteger" comes to mind 00:12:48 right. right, of course 00:12:59 SILLY ME 00:13:11 although in that case they're baked very deeply into the vm implementation 00:13:24 elliott, that seems to be the same as the Clojure meaning, except I think the Clojure meaning also implies some efficiency in the process, not sure 00:13:24 this idea of interning is somewhat different from the persistent data structures idea, which is like "if we insert into a binary tree to get a new tree, we can point back into most of the nodes of the old tree" 00:13:54 oh, i thought flyweight was more of the latter 00:13:56 a lot of langugaes have interning for small integers 00:14:03 python: 00:14:03 >>> 256 is 255+1 00:14:04 True 00:14:04 >>> 257 is 256+1 00:14:05 False 00:14:06 even java does it 00:14:22 that's more because of machine convenience isn't it 00:14:28 well in Java you also have primitive ints, it wouldn't make sense to intern those 00:14:33 kmc: er, they use bignums past 256, or what? 00:14:35 but maybe it interns Integer objects for all I know 00:14:36 kmc: I meant the boxed types 00:14:48 Bike: don't think so 00:14:58 it interns boxed integer types from like -127 to 128 00:15:05 but they statically allocate the heap object for small integers 00:15:13 oh, huh 00:15:15 even if they may contain a machine integer 00:15:17 Bike: python stores integers on the heap and stuff 00:15:22 but it caches teeny ones 00:15:36 "cool" 00:15:39 ints are objects, they have attrs and shit 00:16:05 In [4]: (99).bit_length() 00:16:06 Out[4]: 7 00:16:09 ghc interns small Chars, i recall 00:16:12 although stupidly you can't write 99.bit_length 00:16:19 why not 00:16:23 syntactic stupidity 00:16:28 yay! 00:16:38 Oh, because it could interpret it as a number with a radix point. 00:16:43 Ruby and Rails take this to the extreme, of course, and monkeypatch all kinds of nonsense methods onto the number class 00:17:09 because writing "3.sexy_goats" reads so much better than "sexy_goats(3)" 00:17:18 kmc: the "smoke 'em if you've got 'em" principle of language and API design 00:17:44 kmc, Smalltalk too, to some extent 00:17:56 who cares if you gratuitously modify the core language, as long as your client code looks superficially nice in huge font on a meticulously styled webpage 00:18:10 that sentence has too many adverbs 00:18:14 are you mad 00:18:24 I don't see anything inherently wrong with modifying the core language as long as it doesn't disrupt other parts 00:18:31 kmc: it's not code, it's ~poetry~ 00:18:34 oerjan: if only unicode was small enough to cache them all 00:18:45 "I don't see how that could go wrong, unless the monkeys started hurting people. Which they almost certainly would." 00:18:48 If that sexy_goats had some sort of namespace, so other things could add their own sexy_goats method to Object or whatever to do something different, I would have no complaint 00:19:07 RodgerTheGreat: right yeah 00:19:42 i would never understand, i'm just a software engineer, not a rockstar code-poet painter hacker 00:19:53 Although I guess in that case if the equiv. of doesNotUnderstand ... hm 00:19:55 ninja hustler 00:19:59 how terrible to have the self image of a well-paid highly skilled engineer 00:20:06 no kid wants to be that when they're growing up right 00:20:26 it's just so boring and middle class! 00:20:28 what's a doesNotUnderstand 00:20:30 unlike having a job typing 00:20:45 RodgerTheGreat: According to the API docs, Integer.valueOf will "always cache values in the range -128 to 127, inclusive, and may cache other values outside of this range". (new Integer(0) will of course always make a new Integer.) 00:20:47 kmc, the Smalltalk equivalent of method_missing 00:20:49 ok 00:21:00 although it's doesNotUnderstand: not doesNotUnderstand 00:21:18 Ruby and Python support basically the same kinds of fancy dynamic shit, but the communities have vastly different norms for when it's appropriate to use them 00:21:30 fizzie: right, got the ranges backwards 00:21:32 community norms >>> hard language rules 00:21:42 even Haskell's supposed purity is a community norm 00:22:04 kmc you sound like an anthropologist what's wrong ;_; 00:22:05 Combined with some minor awkwardness in impure syntax. 00:22:05 to be fair Python makes monkeypatching a hell of a lot more painful than Ruby in general 00:22:12 language structure dictates community norms 00:22:18 to some degree 00:22:26 (imperative programming in Haskell is quite doable, but it's also syntactically awkward, y'know?) 00:22:32 It's a kind of an arbitrary range anyway, since there doesn't seem to be a very strict reason for it to be a particular amount of bits, except perhaps for a slightly more micro-optimized range test. 00:22:40 pikhq: aww, I like imperative programming in Haskell! 00:22:45 it's such a good imperative language 00:22:54 `addquote If that sexy_goats had some sort of namespace, so other things could add their own sexy_goats method to Object or whatever to do something different, I would have no complaint 00:22:56 highly expressive, precise control over who can touch what state, good threads, fast 00:22:58 kmc: Not saying it's bad or anything, just that the syntax for it ain't the cleanest thing. :) 00:22:59 942) If that sexy_goats had some sort of namespace, so other things could add their own sexy_goats method to Object or whatever to do something different, I would have no complaint 00:23:00 STM 00:23:02 yeah it's not the best 00:23:13 I like imperative programming in Prolog. (It's so easy?) 00:23:16 Whiiich is why you tend do imperative when necessary and functional otherwise. :) 00:23:18 "no" 00:23:20 fizzie: I think it was something like "we need a reasonably small number of these to not be ridiculous. How 'bout the range of a byte? Cool, let's break for lunch." 00:25:41 bonghits for everyone 00:26:23 today on great images of wikipedia http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ed/BRDF_Diagram.svg 00:26:39 I don't even 00:26:43 * Sgeo misses Encarta 00:27:11 i miss Microsoft's special purpose mini encyclopedias 00:27:14 like if you like dogs 00:27:18 there was a CD you could buy 00:27:21 that had some stuff about dogs on it 00:27:24 not a lot, just one CD worth 00:28:01 elliott: what the hell? 00:28:13 Bike: submit to BRDF diagram. BRDF diagram now owns your existence 00:28:22 ._. 00:28:27 Not a part of Encarta I think, but there was this one CD that had a thing that let you fly around the Earth 00:28:32 was it 00:28:34 flight simulator 00:28:41 earth simulator 00:29:11 Microsoft Crash Into The Willis Tower Immediately Simulator 00:29:28 Microsoft Holy Damn This 747 Has A Lot Of Switches Simulator 00:29:32 I have here in my bookshelf a "Microsoft Encarta 1994 Edition", "For Distribution Only With a New PC". 00:29:42 kmc: does that just simulate the lone emotion of the 747 having a lot of switches 00:29:46 yes 00:29:48 and not any other aspects of the 747 flight experiecne 00:29:49 good 00:29:51 I would play that 00:29:55 Microsoft Surgery Simulator 2013 00:29:58 If I recall correctly, it had something like six or a dozen articles with video (!) in them. 00:30:06 microsoft sugary simulator 00:30:18 microsoft actually being bill gates simulator 00:30:25 it's a jewel case with a CD-shaped wafer of aspartame inside 00:30:31 Microsoft Actually Being Steve Ballmer Simulator 00:30:36 x = microsoft working at microsoft on the x simulator simulator 00:30:39 The video clips were in some 288x216 15fps format. But they were still terribly exciting. 00:30:41 Now with a hotkey for DEVELOPERS 00:30:53 > cycle "DEVELOPERS " 00:30:54 "DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPE... 00:32:00 Next to Encarta there is "Microsoft Cinemania 1994 Edition", which I don't remember what it was like, and "Microsoft Dinosaurs", which presumably has dinosaurs in it. 00:32:13 These are all "For Distribution Only With a New PC". 00:32:56 Microsoft Sit On Your Balls Simulator 00:33:45 I have encarta '95 in my CD wallet 00:33:56 "Welcome to Microsoft® Dinosaurs! You'll be exploring a world unlike any you've experienced before, discovering amazing facts and long-buried secrets at every mouse click! Now, let's get on with the expedition!" 00:33:58 elliott: here is a game about how many switches the A-10 Warthog has: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huVi6rdPE4I 00:34:03 spoiler alert: a lot of switches 00:34:37 i also had some magic eye CD-ROM 00:34:44 that looks like too many switches for me 00:35:14 where you could MS Paint any drawing you want (read: penis) and then make a magic eye out of it 00:35:18 verb trains are so easy 00:35:27 oh god 00:35:29 it's spreading 00:35:45 kmc: you needed a separate program for that? 00:35:50 no, it's just sgeo 00:35:57 milhouse is not a meme, sgeo 00:35:59 I used to impress people by quickly implementing a stereogram generator in Excel 00:36:13 you can do it in about 10 lines of VBA, it doesn't take long 00:36:28 that's cool 00:37:10 Someone in #clojure just called me a markov train bot 00:37:28 markov train 00:37:35 everybody get on the markov train! 00:37:44 They called me a markov chain bot, not a markov train bot 00:38:00 Does the program come with the kind of patterns they put in those books? 00:39:53 fungot: Did you know that in the Markov train, what's in the front coach only depends on the contents of a finite number of the following coaches. 00:39:54 fizzie: however, sudh as storing machine language ( in the program g0es to the next screen line set the same shape. 00:40:10 juxt is like a J verb train with the concat operator between every given function 00:40:15 Sgeo: Well, that concludes it -- you're definitely a Markov chain bot of some sort. :-P 00:40:24 wow are you really telling #clojure about J 00:41:10 did you know: hidden Markov models are named after Hidden Markov, the Soviet Union's equivalent of Where's Waldo 00:41:27 HMMs were used in early computer visual search research in the USSR and the analogy stuck 00:41:47 haha, gonna have to pass that on 00:41:49 tell your friends 00:41:55 i know a guy who's a big fan of markov's son (yes really) 00:42:16 Did you know: Conditional Random Fields... aren't that easy to make a pun about. 00:42:31 They may or may not be random? 00:42:58 Is that really a pun so much as a rephrasing 00:43:40 (CRFs are spiffy.) 00:47:13 does markov's son have any sons, or will he break the chain 00:52:21 -!- augur has joined. 00:52:24 boo hiss 00:52:58 -!- augur has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 00:53:08 -!- augur has joined. 01:01:20 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:04:32 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 01:05:26 Sgeo: How's Ada going? 01:05:28 http://scienceblogs.com/goodmath/2006/11/02/the-c-is-efficient-language-fa/ 01:05:39 shachaf, haven't looked in a bit, will later 01:18:03 Ada is the new Sgeolang? 01:18:07 does that mean Agda is next? 01:18:59 jAgda 01:24:09 ajda 01:27:45 @quote shachaf Agda 01:27:45 shachaf says: Everyone forgets about Agda Lovelace, the first constructivist. 01:41:34 hehe 01:45:16 http://www.reddit.com/r/haskell/comments/17idma/how_to_write_unmaintainable_haskell_code/ 01:45:40 i'm clicking your link against my better judgement 01:46:35 "the Succ (Succ Zeroth) Obfuscated Haskell Code Contest" is peano a Haskell Thing now 01:47:57 how to write unmaintainable haskell code: just write any haskell code "trolololo" am i right kmc 01:48:07 truly people will think "i mad" upon reading these words 01:48:19 Link the trolololo video first. 01:48:44 Bike: and what if i don't 01:48:48 Bike: will you have a...... problem 01:48:58 yes i'll have a not being trolled problem!!! 01:49:19 have u considered Bike.... that that is the truest troll of all 01:49:19 : ) 01:49:45 "Haskell's expressiveness allows coding in a very concise style. For example it renders comments redundant and makes you able to call all your types T and typeclasses C and them import them qualified." 01:49:53 this is pretty lame but i like the henning thielemann joke 01:51:10 "renders comments redundant", i'll have to remember that one 02:08:38 -!- monqy has joined. 03:20:02 -!- jconn has joined. 03:22:09 `list 03:22:10 Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo alot 03:22:13 ) 1 + 2 3 4 03:22:13 Sgeo: 3 4 5 03:26:57 what strings did you pull to get that thing in here 03:27:24 "hey have your bot join #esoteric" "fuck off sure" 03:27:59 Not that hostiley 03:28:02 whee ):[)$$7--1[)$3~[)$~!~~%~)]$2<[):]~:]~)~~[)~~~[~)~$7~~:~~([$3~)+[~~~<~()+48]~~~-)~10*)]/]--10):]] [42] [H] 03:29:14 Sgeo: imo use ada 03:29:35 no use fueue, look how simple it is to print a number in decimal! 03:30:15 * oerjan feels obligated to cackle evilly, but somehow doesn't put much feeling into it 03:31:28 I wish Ruby's functions were first-class. :-( 03:31:53 ruby has functions? 03:33:17 Good point. 03:35:13 -!- augur has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 03:35:38 well there's that thing where you wrap a function in an object!!! ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha 03:35:39 -!- augur has joined. 03:35:49 i thought it had methods 03:38:17 does ruby have monoids 03:39:01 It has + and *!!! 03:40:23 Do J's verbs count as first-class? 03:40:26 What is first-class? 03:40:36 J verbs can only be taken as arguments by adverbs and conjunctions 03:40:49 (which can also take nouns as arguments) 03:40:52 First-class is a thing to make fun of Pascal programmers with. 03:41:03 ? 03:42:39 -!- Arc_Koen has left. 03:44:31 what is love? 03:45:41 Are there any terms that are completely unambiguous, only one meaning across languages and that there's no room to argue about? 03:46:25 hahaha 03:46:39 pick one and i'll argue with you about it 03:46:55 identity comparison 03:46:57 sgeo, do you know what "prescriptivism" and "descriptivism" are? 03:47:42 Um, descriptivism = words have the meaning that they have from common usage, prescrip = words have fixed meanings 03:47:57 (Sorry, playing Mafia in another channel) 03:48:44 ) 5 1 $ 'Hello' 03:48:45 Sgeo: H 03:48:45 Sgeo: e 03:48:45 Sgeo: l 03:48:45 Sgeo: l 03:48:45 Sgeo: o 03:48:46 So if you accept descriptivism, your question is ill-posed. If you accept prescriptivism, you're dumb, and also need a dictionary nobody will argue with. 03:50:44 ) < 'test' 03:50:44 Sgeo: +----+ 03:50:45 Sgeo: |test| 03:50:45 Sgeo: +----+ 03:51:03 ) 'hi' CR 'bye 03:51:03 Sgeo: |open quote 03:51:03 Sgeo: | 'hi' CR 'bye 03:51:03 Sgeo: | ^ 03:51:06 ) 'hi' CR 'bye' 03:51:06 Sgeo: |value error: CR 03:51:06 Sgeo: | 'hi' CR'bye' 03:51:10 ) 'hi' LF 'bye' 03:51:10 Sgeo: |value error: LF 03:51:10 Sgeo: | 'hi' LF'bye' 03:51:15 ) 'hi',LF,'bye' 03:51:16 Sgeo: |value error: LF 03:51:16 Sgeo: | 'hi', LF,'bye' 03:51:20 ) 'hi',CR,'bye' 03:51:20 Sgeo: |value error: CR 03:51:21 Sgeo: | 'hi', CR,'bye' 03:51:21 bah 03:51:34 "thanks" 03:52:20 I don't get how it's ill-formed in descriptivism 03:53:06 hm maybe i don't agree with your summary of descriptivism 03:53:32 i think it's more like "words have meaning in the context of whoever you're communicating with", that is, you're describing how people view words 03:53:42 not just saying "it's common (whatever that means) for X to mean Y so X means Y" 03:53:51 maybe i'm just too radical for the dictionaries 03:54:10 I like your description better 03:54:33 But still don't see how it's ill formed. if everyone who bothers to use the term uses it for the same thing or not, is still a valid question 03:54:51 well i suppose you'd need everyone to think the same about that term then 03:54:57 so maybe not ill-posed, i dunno 03:56:56 the feeling of watching a YouTube video and then realizing you already saw it while super drunk 03:56:59 `list 03:57:01 Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo alot 03:57:10 oh hey yay 03:59:12 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PCOcyt7BPI so, i now know true fear 04:04:54 o_O 04:05:09 -!- monqy has quit (Quit: hello). 04:05:35 it's really a testament to how safe air travel is 04:05:44 that they could do this hundreds of times a day (at that one airport) and only occasionally crash 04:06:25 i didn't even know you could do that with 747s 04:09:03 i want to go to hong kong 04:09:34 you won't be using that airport, of course 04:09:37 right 04:09:43 they built an island and put a new airport on it 04:09:48 extended an island, anyway 04:09:50 apparently the new one is on a - yeah, and a twenty minute drive 04:09:51 kinda sucks 04:09:58 i assume there is public transit 04:10:06 twenty minute busing 04:10:15 20 min from airport to city center is pretty good 04:10:41 is it? huh, i must not be cosmopolitan enough 04:11:07 it varies a lot but 20 min is on the low end for cities i've been to 04:12:08 i suppose it is a very common destination 04:12:11 JFK to manhattan is like a 30 min drive with no traffic 04:12:29 and like an hour on the subway :( 04:13:24 ditto EWR 04:14:16 ORD to downtown Chicago is like 45 minutes on the train 04:21:40 Do they use Ada on planes? 04:22:59 Sgeo: Yep. 04:23:53 ada on aeroplanes 04:26:20 Sgeo: you'll be hard-pressed to find a "language as cool as ada" 04:40:40 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 04:44:57 http://vooza.com/videos/culture/ 04:49:43 There's a yandere theme and a yandere02 theme 04:50:04 in ada? 04:50:21 Wrong channel 04:50:46 should be in ada 04:52:56 -!- WeThePeople has joined. 04:55:24 "Spotify meets Grindr, but for rental cars, but run as if it were for a hotel" 05:17:28 Something should be Done about people who listen to music so loud in their headphones that you can hear it from across the room. 05:17:45 better headphones 05:20:27 "earphones" in this case, I suppose. 05:21:31 It's annoying how with cryptography things, you don't get any useful debugging information when something goes wrong. 05:21:34 you'd expect earphones to be less leaky than headphones, but they tend to be leakier 05:21:49 best headphones in terms of low leak I ever got were in-flight on Air Canada 05:22:05 it makes a lot of sense that those wouldn't leak, if they were designed for use on aeroplanes with people sitting right next to you 05:24:19 airplanes are loud 05:24:27 it's hard to hear leak 05:24:40 only sometimes 05:24:52 and depending on where you're sitting 05:24:57 but it didn't leak even when not on the aeroplane 05:25:30 The noise of drums beating etc. breaks my concentration. 05:25:36 I don't mind the hum of airplanes so much. 05:26:10 i find that even the quiet bits of airplanes have a lot more leak-masking noise than, say, an office 05:26:21 unless you are the secretary of state and your office is an airplane 05:26:24 then it's probably about the same 05:27:43 -!- DH____ has joined. 05:27:53 -!- DHeadshot has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 05:29:48 air force 1 is smaller than a typical commercial airliner, isn't it? 05:29:59 also probably more manoeuvrable 05:35:14 air force 1 is a 747 05:35:28 well technically it's whatever airplane happens to be carrying the president at the moment 05:35:41 but it's /usually/ a 747 05:36:44 I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 05:37:03 -!- azaq23 has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 05:37:22 hm let's see if i can do this 05:37:26 `addquote < Sgeo> I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 05:37:30 943) < Sgeo> I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 05:37:34 wait, no 05:37:37 `delquote 943 05:37:38 ​/hackenv/bin/delquote: 3: Syntax error: "fi" unexpected (expecting ")") 05:37:49 fucked 05:37:50 why must everything i touch die........... 05:38:00 `cat bin/delquote 05:38:01 ​#!/bin/sh \ id=$1 \ if ! expr "$id" ">=" 0 "&" "$id" "<" $(wc -l /dev/null; then id=$(expr $RANDOM % $(wc -l quotes.new \ tail -n +$((id+1)) quotes >>quotes.new \ diff quotes quotes.new >/dev/null && exit 1 \ printf "*poof*%s" "$(quote $id | cut -d')' -f2-)" \ mv quotes.new quotes 05:38:12 hmmmmm nope gonna go with fuck it 05:38:40 It is, it just lists all permutations of the input list 05:38:49 Should really be some simpler way imo, not sure if there is 05:39:27 have you read your taocp today? 05:39:41 Well, besides other variations and besides the explicit 3 : '(!#y)A.y' 05:39:50 Erm, that's wrong 05:40:03 3 : '(i.!#y)A.y' 05:40:15 Sgeo: That syntax is confusing. 05:40:22 Can you show it in Ada instead? 05:40:48 ^ 05:41:08 Does it help to know in that 3 : thing that y means the argument on the right? 05:41:51 # is number of items in a list. ! is factorial. i. is list from 0 to argument - 1 05:42:04 Sgeo: Nope, doesn't help. 05:42:09 I'd rather see the Ada. 05:42:19 yeah i'm gonna need to see ada. or ideally, a j->ada compiler. 05:42:21 I assume that Ada would involve an explicit loop 05:42:31 Maybe... 05:42:37 I guess an Ada->J compiler would also work! 05:42:39 Bike: what, you're not up to debugging a hairy shell script inside many-worlds linux over IRC 05:42:59 mostly i just don't understand the qdbformat 05:43:08 even though < name> actually does bug me aesthetically 05:43:15 Bike: did you mess with `delquote................................................... 05:43:23 no, it's just fucked. 05:43:25 you can also fix it with sed but i too don't know what i'm doing plus i'm drunk 05:43:27 oh my god 05:43:30 thank you randall 05:43:33 see: 21:37 < kmc> fucked 05:43:34 `run sed 's///' quotes | tail -n 1 05:43:35 sed: -e expression #1, char 0: no previous regular expression 05:43:40 `run sed 's/a/a/' quotes | tail -n 1 05:43:42 ​< Sgeo> I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 05:43:45 s/exy/tim/e 05:43:55 `run sed 's/< Sgeo>//' quotes | tail -n 1 05:43:56 ​ I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 05:44:01 `run sed -i 's/< Sgeo>//' quotes 05:44:05 No output. 05:44:13 "lets hope there were no "casualties"" 05:44:39 shachaf you're my hero except I don't know what you did exactly? could you write what you did in some other language, like one for airplanes maybe, airplanes are nice. 05:44:57 Bike: imo Sgeo is the expert 05:45:11 sgeo: help? 05:45:15 Sgeo: ada plz 05:45:18 `quote 943 05:45:20 943) I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 05:45:47 `run sed s/se/ten/ quotes | tail -n1 05:45:48 ​ I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verboten 05:45:50 it's.... beautiful........... 05:46:02 shachaf: good fix imo 05:47:46 music for airports 05:47:53 Bike: they should have sent a poet 05:47:54 good album 05:48:40 coppro: randall? 05:48:53 coppro: redbull? 05:49:02 `pastequotes Sgeo 05:49:07 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.3314 05:50:06 shachaf, are you still a Forth? 05:50:14 HOT TENXY TENX BITS 05:50:31 Sgeo: Forth? 05:50:51 `quote 869 05:50:53 869) GreyKnight, shachaf is like a high-level Forth 05:50:55 Bike, the xkcd person 05:51:06 ^ 05:51:14 are you threatening coppro? is that how you know? 05:51:24 don't make coppro conform to your sick whims. 05:52:37 `quote N-Gage 05:52:39 86) (still, whatever possessed anyone to invent the N-Gage?) \ 832) 88) (still, whatever possessed anyone to invent the N-Gage?) [...] Is there supposed to be a joke in 88? Unless "N-Gage" is some pseudoscientific spiritual mumbo-jumbo, I don't get it. Oh, it's a cell phone gaming thing apparent 05:52:51 huh, that quote's still there 05:53:04 the joke is that it's bad hth 05:53:36 `pastequotes monqy 05:53:41 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.32023 05:53:45 kmc: it wasn't intended for the purpose of getting quoted 05:53:46 oh for a second i thought that quote 88 was a quote about quote 88 05:54:01 `pastlog `addquote (still, 05:54:04 grep: missing ) 05:54:06 probably needs a backslash 05:54:10 `pastlog `addquote \(still, 05:54:12 88 is a common neo-nazi codeword and also a lucky number in chinese 05:54:15 is that part of it 05:54:22 whoa 05:54:39 isn't it just 8 though? you can't just like, make more eights for more luck 05:54:41 No output. 05:56:00 390 is glorious, btw 05:56:01 `quote 390 05:56:03 390) * Sgeo mutters about broken toilets #toilet is useless is #toilet even a thing I'm looking for help with toilets 05:56:15 hahahaha 05:56:26 Bike: more 8s is more lucky duh 05:56:38 a lot of chinese grocery stores have names like "Super 88" 05:57:05 where does the madness end! 05:57:50 help i'm addicted to mafia 05:58:49 Sgeo: IRC mafia or forum mafia? 05:58:54 IRC 05:58:55 `pastequotes oerjan 05:59:01 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.28766 05:59:03 -!- Bike_ has joined. 05:59:06 the forum version's better, and moves slowly enough that it's less addictive 05:59:36 I doubt I have the attention span for forum version 06:00:03 -!- Bike has quit (Disconnected by services). 06:00:05 -!- Bike_ has changed nick to Bike. 06:00:10 don't underrate your ability to play games sgeo 06:00:46 the forum version of #toilet 06:03:07 `pastequotes elliott 06:03:12 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.5421 06:03:26 btw, this is a degrees of separation thing 06:03:28 read someone's quotes 06:03:38 based on them, choose someone it would be interesting to read the quotes of 06:03:45 see how many steps it takes to reach elliott 06:03:47 Wait, why do you make fun of Sgeo for living in Farmington with that Gregor quote. 06:05:21 "245) 320 quotes and still not a funny one yet!" gosh this channel is picky 06:07:57 `pastequotes zzo38 06:08:03 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.19991 06:10:05 bleh, we need a `quotecontext, but it'll be a pain to implement 06:10:56 note to self: actually do work this summer 06:11:09 there's a prize at the end if I succeed 06:11:20 well, two prizes which I value completely wrongly 06:11:52 -!- WeThePeople has quit (Quit: Leaving). 06:12:03 -!- RodgerTheGreat has quit (Quit: RodgerTheGreat). 06:12:04 311) AV is better than first-past-the-post, like every voting system apart from the Random Elephant Stomping method <-- i think sortition is probably better than fptp in many situations!! 06:12:30 Bike: I was planning to ask elliott what the Random Elephant Stomping method was 06:12:42 I sort-of have an idea, but can think of at least two possibilities 06:12:50 depending on whether the elephants are aimed at the politicians or the voters 06:12:53 it's either sortition or - yeah 06:13:03 i see you're well versed in psephology 06:14:13 * ais523 concludes that zzo38 is actually the only sane person on the internet 06:14:25 i think we all knew that. 06:15:45 RodgerTheGreat was here? :D 06:16:03 He left? :( 06:16:23 `quote 340 06:16:25 340) Learn to be Chinese and kill yourself 06:16:33 I flat out cannot imagine zzo38 saying that. 06:16:41 `quote 842 06:16:43 842) The reason it isn't more popular is because I wrote it today. 06:16:52 that's probably the most typical zzo38 ever 06:17:51 `pastequotes fizzie 06:17:56 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.10858 06:18:09 btw, reading the zzo38 quotes page made me laugh enough irl I was actually having difficulty breathing 06:18:16 let's hope the fizzie quotes page is less potentially fatal 06:19:53 OK, 489 is excellent 06:19:55 `quote 489 06:19:57 489) That's the stupidest thing I've heard all morning. (Though I did wake up five minutes ago, so I haven't had a chance to hear very much.) The "Why are you still asleep? I told the cat to wake you up." comment does come pretty close, though. 06:20:57 this was a bad decision I think 06:21:06 reading `pastequotes at 30:20am 06:21:09 `quote 285 06:21:10 285) I think I managed to make Stack Overflow work on gopher, now. 06:21:53 funny how elliott referred to him as the guy who just joined when i think of him as a legendary esolanger of ye olde. 06:24:25 `pastequotes Bike 06:24:30 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.4035 06:24:41 ?? 06:24:43 ok, winner 06:24:46 `quote 894 06:24:47 894) fungot: Are you the previous version of zzo38? fizzie: i run some interactive tex programs 06:24:54 Sgeo: i'm too cool for ascii school 06:25:01 that one's good but I prefer the quote about the cat 06:25:02 Why did my browser download it instead of showing it 06:25:20 ais523: thank you, you've made my evening^Wmorning 06:25:25 because an encoding thing makes pastebot present it as octets instead of text/fuckeverything, I think 06:44:38 hm it sends Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ascii" 06:45:05 "HTTP/1.1 200 Script output follows" 06:45:12 that's a... nontraditional response message 06:45:20 lol. 06:45:54 also both the weird characters i used actually are ascii so hm 06:49:56 which characters are those 06:50:33 that server will definitely send charset="ascii" on files containing high-bit bytes :( 06:50:39 ^B and ^O 06:50:42 heh 06:51:06 whippersnapper bitches don't know bout my control characters 06:51:38 ahem I think that's called STX and SI 06:52:05 Start of Text, Shift In 06:52:18 i should start a webdev trend of using ASCII control characters for their original meanings 06:52:22 it's like REST but more old school 06:52:51 haha oh god yes 06:58:39 STAND BY FOR TRANSMISSION 06:59:04 kmc: Do it! 06:59:14 -!- copumpkin has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 06:59:45 -!- copumpkin has joined. 08:01:26 -!- ais523 has quit. 08:02:22 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 08:11:53 -!- DH____ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 08:11:59 -!- DHeadshot has joined. 08:18:27 http://www.python.org/doc/humor/#python-block-delimited-notation-parsing-explained 08:19:41 -!- DHeadshot has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 08:20:18 -!- DHeadshot has joined. 08:26:00 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 08:32:10 -!- FreeFull has quit. 09:23:00 -!- Bike has quit (Quit: leaving). 09:33:34 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 09:39:29 -!- Taneb has joined. 09:41:43 Esolang idea: Normal looking language that makes things like malicious code hidden in plain sight too easy 09:41:57 You mean PHP? 09:43:15 PHP is itself malicious, so it isn't really the same thing. 09:44:00 Sgeo: Hmm, does Ada have that property? 09:45:01 I doubt it but I don't know Ada and am guessing based on what is effectively Ada marketing. 09:45:59 Sgeo: Well, you should learn Ada. 09:46:02 That way you'd know. 10:00:24 * Sgeo was not expecting Ada to be hard to google 10:00:24 :/ 10:00:35 Although J is definitely worse 10:00:40 Google keeps thinking I want Java 10:01:20 "Pentagon. Hackers are nearly unanimous in observing that, technically, it is precisely what one might expect given that kind of endorsement by fiat; bloated, crockish, difficult to use, and overall a disastrous, multi-billion-dollar boondoggle (one common description was "The PL/I of the 1980s")." 10:01:39 "It's quite apparent that the evolution of the C family of languages (C, C++, Java, C#) is converging on a language very like Ada, except unfortunately as a kludgepile rather than a clean design. 10:01:39 " 10:03:34 "The code name itself was an inside joke: Ada Augusta, Countess of Lovelace, was a famous armchair programmer/system architect who never in her entire life had gotten a single program to compile, link, or run." 10:03:45 http://bit.csc.lsu.edu/~gb/csc4101/Reading/gigo-1997-04.html (note: humor) 10:06:01 o.O 10:06:03 'Ada initially planted a subconscious Y2K time-bomb: "YEAR: INTEGER range 0..2000;" [Ada79, p.3-12], but then got Third Reich ambitions: "YEAR: INTEGER range 0..4000;" [Ada83, p.3-34], before settling on a Y2.1K time-bomb: "subtype YEAR_NUMBER is INTEGER range 1901..2099;"' 10:06:23 Does... um... Ada actually come with a YEAR_NUMBER type like that? 10:07:23 http://www.ada-auth.org/standards/12rm/html/RM-9-6.html 10:07:27 subtype Year_Number is Integer range 1901 .. 2399; 10:08:54 Sgeo: You're the Ada expert, though; you should've told me! 10:13:22 There is an /r/ada 10:13:35 The motto seems to be "When the software HAS to work" 10:14:11 Sgeo: It might do you good to write software that works. 10:14:34 I have written software! 10:14:45 That mostly but not entirely works 10:18:07 That's why you need Ada. 10:18:50 Yes because a million compile-time checks will totally help when I make a wrong assumption about incoming data 10:19:08 And when I can't figure out an optimal algorithm for a problem 10:19:26 Hmm 10:19:33 I could like Basshunter 10:19:48 That's not a could, that's a must. It's mandatory. 10:20:47 Sgeo: Look, first learn Ada, then talk. 10:21:10 I'm reading one of the wikibooks 10:22:07 "This book is intended for professional readers." 10:22:14 * Sgeo is totally paid to just sit around and read 10:23:58 shachaf, is it ok if I read a tutorial written for Ada 2005? 10:24:22 Ada 2012 is better. 10:24:28 But whatever helps you learn the language. 10:26:32 * Sgeo can guess at a few features Ada wouldn't have 10:26:56 macros, changing stuff around at run-time 10:27:34 I don't know if it has any functional programming stuff, but wouldn't be surprised either way (as in, doubt it would be there from way back when, but could have been added in later for all I know) 10:30:13 Oh hey Ada for is a foreach 10:30:21 Or, wait, no 10:30:36 for variable in range loop 10:30:46 Guess I don't know what constitutes a range yet 10:32:27 * Sgeo is shocked that shachaf is not in #ada 10:32:41 I didn't know there was a channel! 10:33:02 It's in aid a' Ada 10:33:18 Hmm, some familiar names. 10:35:14 http://www.ada2012.org/ 10:35:25 There's a video about Ada 2012 10:38:24 They're still making comparisons to C++ 10:38:25 :( 10:38:58 Could they at least _look_ at other languages? Looking at languages that existed decades ago stops you from seeing new ideas, some, if not all, of which may be useful 10:41:48 There aren't many languages that seriously try to compete with C++ in its niche. 10:41:54 (Quite a big niche.) 10:43:15 @quote multi.?paradigm 10:43:15 No quotes match. BOB says: You seem to have forgotten your passwd, enter another! 10:43:48 "Conditional expressions provide a compact notation for a common idiom." 10:44:25 That... a) That seems late to get that, but b) Leaving it out completely makes some sense 10:44:36 So, adding it in 2012 just... doesn't make sense to me 10:46:24 http://rule34.paheal.net/post/list/LHC-tan/1 10:47:10 ^ NSFW. And screw the ads on that site. And what character is that? 10:47:27 http://rule34-data-003.paheal.net/_images/d6855b9194279e9cae3087959ee995fd/780128%20-%20LHC-tan%20Ru-Chans%20large_hadron_collider.jpg 10:47:27 ...large hadron collider? 10:48:30 Yes, it should be noted that the website named "rule34.paheal.net" may contain pornographic images 10:50:41 Sgeo: Axmax6 knows Haskell. 10:54:40 What's SPARK? 10:56:32 wtf is jvm-windows 11:01:17 Ada has goto. 11:02:15 Oh, SPARK is a restiction of Ada I think 11:02:17 Restriction 11:15:00 Hmf. This computer is not mounting my phone as a USB mass storage device for some reason. (It did mount a stick a while ago.) 11:20:10 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 11:21:12 Oh, I suppose it's the phone's fault, it says "device storage in use". Curious. 11:36:39 -!- DHeadshot has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 11:37:16 * Sgeo decides that in J, the next number after negative 1 is infinity 11:38:51 Sgeo: What about Ada? 11:39:38 Would be nice to find an actual tutorial on recent Ada 11:39:46 Wikibooks does not count as a tutorial as far as I'm concerned 11:40:26 Maybe you should ask in #ada instead of repeating platitudes. 11:45:17 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 11:45:36 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 11:55:52 "That said, it really isn't used nearly enough. For instance, it is naturally almost immune to buffer overflow exploits, so it really ought to be the preferred language for OS development." 11:56:04 Because Ada is the only language immune to buffer overflow exploits 11:59:06 How can I tell emacs that this file with a weird extension is XML and should be syntax-highlighted as such? 11:59:47 http://www.adapower.com/index.php?Command=Class&ClassID=FAQ&CID=359 11:59:54 Ada vs. Eiffel flamewars? 12:00:49 Ada > Eiffel, obviously. 12:00:58 Sgeo: You could also learn Sather, though. 12:01:10 sather: better than eiffel???????? 12:01:33 -!- oerjan has joined. 12:05:49 Sgeo: J's number literals are sorta weird 12:05:58 Especially negative infinity... "__" 12:06:58 If a rank _2 verb operates on pieces of 2 ranks lower than its argument, and a rank _1 verb operates on pieces of 1 rank lower than its argument, what rank verb operates on pieces of rank 0 lower than its argument? 12:08:43 * FireFly didn't know about negative ranks 12:09:25 Hmm, didn't elliott dabble with J ages ago? 12:09:47 Well, nouns can't be negative rank 12:10:09 ) <"_1 (1 2 3) 12:10:09 Sgeo: +-+-+-+ 12:10:10 Sgeo: |1|2|3| 12:10:10 Sgeo: +-+-+-+ 12:10:19 ) sqrt 2 12:10:19 shachaf: |value error: sqrt 12:10:20 shachaf: | sqrt 2 12:10:24 ) sqrt 3 12:10:25 shachaf: |value error: sqrt 12:10:25 shachaf: | sqrt 3 12:10:26 ) %: 2 12:10:26 Sgeo: 1.41421 12:10:29 ) sqrt 4 12:10:29 shachaf: |value error: sqrt 12:10:29 shachaf: | sqrt 4 12:10:32 Hmm. 12:10:35 It's broken. 12:10:36 ) sqrt 5 12:10:37 shachaf: |value error: sqrt 12:10:37 shachaf: | sqrt 5 12:10:40 You're broken 12:10:48 HireFly 12:10:49 ) sqrt =: %: 12:10:49 Sgeo: |ok 12:10:53 Hachaf 12:11:13 ) sqrt 5 12:11:13 Sgeo: 2.23607 12:11:43 ) sqrt^:(_1) 5 12:11:43 Sgeo: 25 12:11:55 > (sqrt 5 + 1) / 2 12:11:57 1.618033988749895 12:11:58 ) (sqrt 5 + 1) / 2 12:11:59 shachaf: |value error: sqrt 12:11:59 shachaf: | ( sqrt 5+1)/2 12:12:01 Hmm. 12:12:03 Still broken. 12:12:19 ) sqrt 12:12:20 Sgeo: %: 12:12:29 ) 1 + 1 12:12:29 shachaf: 2 12:12:39 -!- Sgeo|web has joined. 12:12:42 ) sqrt 12:12:43 Sgeo|web: |value error: sqrt 12:12:48 / isn't division 12:12:56 % is divisio 12:13:00 division 12:13:02 / is (basically) a fold 12:13:06 And I guess we all have separate sandboxes? 12:13:09 -!- Sgeo|web has quit (Client Quit). 12:13:13 ) 4 / 2 12:13:13 shachaf: |domain error 12:13:13 shachaf: | 4/2 12:13:16 ) +/ i.10 NB. sum of the first 10 integers 12:13:16 FireFly: 45 12:13:19 That should be 2 12:13:24 ) 4 % 2 12:13:24 Sgeo: 2 12:13:26 This language is broken. 12:13:30 Sorry. 12:13:33 No, you can't fold the operator 4 over the list [2] 12:13:44 FireFly: Um, / means division. 12:13:47 Can't you read?! 12:14:06 > 4 ÷ 2 12:14:06 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 12:14:07 ) / =: % NB. probably won't work 12:14:07 Sgeo: |syntax error 12:14:07 Sgeo: | /=:% 12:14:10 lambdabot: you're broken 12:14:13 You can't divide :( 12:15:00 Pretty sure / is a solidus btw, not a division operator ^_^ 12:15:05 FireFly, your argument is invalid. 12:15:20 :( 12:16:42 > 2 ⟌ 4 12:16:42 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 12:16:51 (U+27CC LONG DIVISION.) 12:17:38 > let () = (/) in 4 2 12:17:39 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 12:17:41 aw 12:17:49 Doubt it could be made to work 12:17:50 fizzie: It should be called AMERICAN LONG DIVISION 12:17:55 We learned it the other way. 12:18:01 > let = (/) in 4 2 12:18:02 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 12:18:10 > "" 12:18:11 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 12:18:14 :( 12:18:20 Unicode character names are always so... Unicodey. U+27C1 WHITE TRIANGLE CONTAINING SMALL WHITE TRIANGLE. 12:18:54 fizzie: That looks like a small white circle to me. :-( 12:21:10 ) (0.5&* @: (] + 2&%))^:(_) 4 12:21:10 FireFly: 1.41421 12:21:21 Hm 12:21:26 > sqrt 2 12:21:28 1.4142135623730951 12:21:34 !haskell main = putStrLn $ let bläh = 42 in bläh 12:21:37 runghc: : hGetContents: invalid argument (invalid byte sequence) 12:21:41 EgoBot: You're equally silly. :/ 12:22:34 * Sgeo understands a little of what FireFly did 12:22:48 It uses some sqrt approximation algorithm I guess 12:22:58 That ^:(_) means repeat until fixed point 12:23:04 It's http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methods_of_computing_square_roots#Babylonian_method 12:23:25 (] + 2&%) is essentially \x -> x + 2/x 12:23:32 It repeatedly does this: Adds argument to.... I knew that 12:24:12 Although, couldn't you have used a ... not a fork, the other one 12:24:17 ) (0.5&* @: ( + 2&%))^:(_) 4 12:24:18 Sgeo: 1.41421 12:24:20 hook? 12:24:21 :p 12:24:24 yes 12:24:24 Probably, but I forgot how they worked 12:24:34 So I added a ] to be sure 12:25:04 Hm, (f g) y = y f (g y) I guess 12:25:06 So yeah, that'd work 12:25:14 ) -: 2 12:25:14 Sgeo: 1 12:25:20 ) (-: @: ( + 2&%))^:(_) 4 12:25:20 Sgeo: 1.41421 12:25:31 `pastelogs patch 12:25:35 ) (-: @: ( + +:))^:(_) 4 12:25:36 Sgeo: _ 12:25:38 ! 12:25:45 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.4986 12:25:58 What's doubling again, bluh 12:26:01 Um, that's 2/, not 2* 12:26:11 Oh, derp 12:26:12 or rather, 2%, not 2* :P 12:26:16 `run echo 'main = putStrLn $ show (let (÷) = (/) in 4 ÷ 2)' > /tmp/l.hs && runghc /tmp/l # save us from Unicode problems HackEgo? 12:26:19 `pastelogs hg.*patch 12:26:20 2.0 12:26:24 ) (-: @: ( + +:))^:(_) 4 5 6 12:26:25 Sgeo: _ _ _ 12:26:26 HackEgo: Thank you! 12:26:29 ) (-: @ ( + +:))^:(_) 4 5 6 12:26:32 Sgeo: _ _ _ 12:26:32 :( 12:26:42 ) (-: @ ( + +:))^:(_)"0 4 5 6 12:26:42 Sgeo: |length error 12:26:42 Sgeo: | (-:@(++:))^:(_)"0 4 5 6 12:26:46 ) (-: @ ( + +:))^:(_)"(0) 4 5 6 12:26:46 Sgeo: _ _ _ 12:26:54 Oh, I'm still using the broken one 12:26:56 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.9543 12:26:58 (Maybe there was already a `haskell or something.) 12:26:58 goddammit HackEgo don't quit now, i'm trying to repair you 12:27:12 ) (-: @: ( + 2&%))^:(_) 4 5 6 12:27:12 Sgeo: 1.41421 1.41421 1.41421 12:27:23 Hmm, I don't think I entirely understand @: vs @ 12:27:25 the parameter is the initial guess btw 12:27:32 oh 12:27:45 the hard-coded 2 is the thing you're sqrt-ing 12:27:52 I still greatly simplified it 12:27:55 Yep 12:28:25 Replace composition with a cap ... 12:28:39 ) ([: -: ( + 2&%))^:(_) 4 12:28:40 Sgeo: 1.41421 12:28:59 ) ([:-:+2&%)^:(_) 4 12:29:00 Sgeo: |domain error 12:29:00 Sgeo: | ([:-:+2&%)^:(_)4 12:29:07 buh 12:30:43 > let sqrt' y = fst . fromJust . find (uncurry (==)) . (zip`ap`tail) $ iterate f y where f x = (x + y/x) / 2 in sqrt' 2 12:30:45 1.414213562373095 12:31:08 `run hg diff -r1891:1871 | patch -p1 12:31:10 Almost as short and equally readable 12:31:14 patching file 'bin/?' \ patching file 'bin/?e' \ patching file bin/delquote \ patching file bin/delquotee 12:31:36 It's not *that* bad to read J after you get used to it, IMO 12:31:38 `addquote Testing this bitch 12:31:42 944) Testing this bitch 12:31:46 `delquote 944 12:31:48 But then again, maybe it's not worth getting used to it.. 12:31:51 ​*poof* Testing this bitch 12:32:21 `quote 943 12:32:22 943) I feel like (A.~[:i.[:!#) is verbose 12:32:38 whee! 12:33:01 How did delquote break anyway? 12:33:01 (Jafet messed things up just before HackEgo crashed for days) 12:33:21 That was a very fast answer 12:33:33 yw :P 12:33:38 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 12:37:36 1) Tony Hoare severely criticized Ada in his Turing Award lecture, 12:37:37 saying (literally) that the future of mankind was at stake if we were 12:37:37 to use Ada, and that Ada was "doomed to succeed." Who's gonna argue 12:37:37 with Hoare? If he said it, it must be true, right? 12:38:08 do people actually use ada 12:38:41 Hoare said so! 12:38:46 Who's gonna argue with Hoare? 12:39:16 if hoare said you should jump off a cliff would you do it 12:40:01 http://www.adapower.com/index.php?Command=Class&ClassID=Advocacy&CID=39 12:40:18 -!- sebbu has joined. 12:40:18 -!- sebbu has quit (Changing host). 12:40:18 -!- sebbu has joined. 12:52:04 subtypes remind me a little of newtype except without explicit dealing with the constructor (still not sure about that though) 12:52:14 Explicit casts are needed for them 12:53:02 Blerg, the air is full of wet snow. 12:53:41 Sleet, fizzie. 12:53:56 We call that sleet. 12:54:22 more werewolves time 12:54:29 sludd og snøbyger 12:54:57 Phantom_Hoover: That's a silly word. 12:55:24 That's what everyone else thinks of finnish words! 12:55:41 https://dl.dropbox.com/u/113389132/Misc/20130130-so_much_snow.jpg though it doesn't really register on-camera. 12:55:47 Game starting in #wolfgame 12:56:24 `run words --finnish 20 # not silly at all 12:56:28 korvallesiinsä kiinneperia himoitukemmältä hentäville astaan tihaisemmiltako ahduintämää tiensa ahkeampaamallisemme lipusketilasi kustaville ahdentäviertämmä houkuttumaksenemmäs toisimpiamme hallaan kullanne hankaimmille hyyttävinenikoittelevillä levanne lasi 12:56:41 Phantom_Hoover, aww :( 12:56:44 kustaville! 12:56:59 Sgeo, i'm not getting involved in your creepy wolf games! 12:57:35 3 meaningful words in that set AFAICT 12:57:53 `run words --portuguese 20 12:57:55 correal estionis nites vidasterirei esmemos dolarasourizaria vertem abombarbolsa reendalandá apitas autelemos desafá flastes reencatombie frinhado embeijareis infrinhas esqua formelhava engalhar 12:58:03 `run words --hebrew 20 12:58:04 * oerjan wishes vim had a command to go to the matching bracket to the one you just deleted; or alternatively a way to delete two matching brackets _without deleting what's between them 12:58:05 ​סות ואברכי ממבול פרס העוש לנטות ממקוד גחלת נילוף חצמוד להטתברכה דמליה ומרי היתי בשבישרא בתפלג נקין וחט וציאל ומוכר 12:58:24 *has, i don't really _know_ it doesn't 12:58:34 *_without_ 12:58:44 ===oerjan 12:58:46 s/.// 12:58:47 oerjan: surround.vim 12:58:53 `words 12:58:57 dysfore 12:59:00 Deewiant: Kustaville, hallaan, lasi? 12:59:04 fizzie: Yep 12:59:19 oerjan: I.e. AFAIK plain vim doesn't but with that plugin you can do it 12:59:23 shachaf: what? 12:59:35 oerjan: I agree. 13:00:21 `words --canadian-english-insane 20 13:00:23 emsellumit proup machizzlin felladien dochia flambernelo gainvive klat nonucle tumboid priorae ecgoniacean preaniki pastern misdefahda maedialiancialization ster neum previlfuria unrepa 13:00:35 Deewiant: You could argue for "kullanne" to be a dialectal/colloquial form of "kultanne" (in the 'sweetheart' sense), I think. 13:01:01 `words --irish 20 13:01:02 fizzie: I don't think you could, but maybe. 13:01:03 ninde-sín staí jainn raiméin lánchuladh loineorpair bpolaí heirméaróirín leathghéiseac d'amachta tríoga táit scraigh vótáilte scaothúlaíomaith aithirsteipt héachaiscríoga straíche hiosánta staonadar 13:01:20 yeah that pretty much looks like irish 13:02:25 Deewiant: Oh, an also for being a part of the negative present potential tense of "kullata"; hän ei kullanne sitä kirjaa. 13:03:14 fizzie: Ah, true, no argument there. That's a 20% hit rate for the generator then. 13:07:14 And if you allow for given names of people (e.g. by choosing some some quasi-official source of "valid" "Finnish" names), there's also "astaan". (There are 6074 Finnish women named Asta in the national registry, so it's not a particularly rare one; plus it has an entry in the name day calendars.) 13:08:09 Admittedly it does have the wrong case then. 13:35:59 Is it possible to license a license? 13:37:06 Maybe, if you have a license for it? 13:38:34 Imagine something like GPL where you had to share under the same license, but the license itself was proprietary 13:39:30 Oh dear god I'm in 10 IRC channels on 2 servers 13:39:34 This is unexpected 13:41:03 Taneb is approaching irc singularity 13:41:50 Okay, now I'm only in 9 13:41:53 That's a bit nicer 13:47:18 Speaking of which, does anyone happen to know the freenode channel limit offhand? 13:47:34 ISTR that IRCnet had something like 30. 13:47:58 CHANLIMIT=#:120 hokay. 13:48:05 That's a big number. 13:52:32 EFnet CHANLIMIT=&#:20, IRCnet CHANLIMIT=#&!+:21. 13:53:26 "the fly species inhabiting North America, Hawaii, Australia, and Papua New Guinea are separated by vast oceanic expanses and dont have Facebook." 13:54:08 Oh, twenty-one. 14:00:47 -!- noam__ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 14:01:13 -!- noam__ has joined. 14:02:17 > ord '>' 14:02:19 62 14:03:21 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Quit: Leaving). 14:03:27 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 14:06:38 ^ord > 14:06:38 62 14:06:41 JUST CHECKING 14:06:54 OKAY 14:07:51 > ord 'ø' 14:07:52 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 14:07:56 ørdjan 14:09:18 ^ord ø 14:09:18 195 184 14:09:26 Oh well. 14:09:39 That don't look right. 14:09:46 ^ord ab 14:09:46 97 98 14:12:35 `ord ø 14:12:36 248 14:12:41 "lets hope there were no "casualties"" <-- there wasn't, but still dammit... 14:12:56 ^ord is very byte-oriented. 14:12:56 105 115 32 118 101 114 121 32 98 121 116 101 45 111 114 105 101 110 116 101 100 46 14:13:15 fungot: Yes, thank you, very helpful. 14:13:15 fizzie: if for some practical program- ming applications. tod consists of tiny dots called pixels. 14:13:18 oerjan: What? 14:13:27 Should I have not done it? 14:13:29 fizzie: you've noticed my hints that we need a utf-8 version, right? 14:13:36 I guesss I could've just let you do it. 14:13:48 What's the "right way to fix" it? 14:13:48 shachaf: well you could have checked if anything _did_ break. 14:13:52 oerjan: You can just use `ord for your newfangled UTF-8s. 14:14:03 shachaf: to prepend the line number (which is also the quote number) 14:14:13 wa`t 14:14:20 `run which ord 14:14:22 ​/hackenv/bin/ord 14:14:26 `cat bin/ord 14:14:27 ​#!/bin/sh \ echo "$@" | perl -C7 -pe 'chomp; $_ = join(" ", map { ord } split //, $_);' 14:14:45 `ord øho 14:14:46 oerjan: But I don't know sed....................................... 14:14:46 248 104 111 14:14:48 `ord ☃ ♥ ø 14:14:50 9731 32 9829 32 248 14:15:07 shachaf: sad trombone 14:15:13 I bet it's something simple like "prepend the line number". 14:15:16 fizzie: yay! 14:15:23 Just like it is in vim/ex/ed????????????????????????? 14:15:41 shachaf: yep. you may note the name similarity with the last one. 14:16:33 oerjan: For years I thought sed stood for "super ed" 14:17:17 fizzie: wait you rascal you made that just before i asked... 14:17:22 oerjan: Yes, I did. 14:17:34 -!- boily has joined. 14:17:38 `run locale 14:17:39 LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8 \ LANGUAGE= \ LC_CTYPE="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_NUMERIC="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_TIME="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_COLLATE="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_MONETARY="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_MESSAGES="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_PAPER="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_NAME="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_ADDRESS="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_TELEPHONE="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_MEASUREMENT="en_NZ.UTF-8" \ LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_NZ 14:17:50 There's probably some reason why it's en_NZ? 14:18:38 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 14:19:07 fizzie: i think Gregor got slightly annoyed with our nagging it should have a properly set locale 14:19:16 `run env LC_MESSAGES=fi_FI.UTF-8 rm /dev/null # they sound so hilariously silly 14:19:17 rm: tiedostoa ”/dev/null” ei voi poistaa: Kirjoitussuojattu tiedostojärjestelmä 14:19:54 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 14:20:18 fizzie: is that "rm: impossible de supprimer « /dev/null »: Permission non accordée"? 14:20:33 `run env LC_MESSAGES=nb_NO.UTF-8 rm /dev/null 14:20:34 rm: cannot remove «/dev/null»: Filsystem med kun lesetilgang 14:20:40 That's a nice hybrid. 14:21:05 Or maybe "cannot remove" is Norwegian, who knows. 14:22:19 "cannot remove" is Norwegian, but "cannot" has a meaning close to English's "remove", and "remove" inverts the meaning of the preceding verb, like "cannot". 14:23:17 The Finnish version says "write-protected filesystem", instead of "read-only". 14:27:58 `run env LC_MESSAGES=he_IL.UTF-8 rm /dev/null 14:27:59 rm: cannot remove `/dev/null': Read-only file system 14:28:04 Hmph. 14:33:57 -!- ogrom has joined. 14:34:46 fizzie: no it isn't. 14:37:19 `run env LC_MESSAGES=ja_JP.UTF-8 rm /dev/null 14:37:20 rm: cannot remove `/dev/null': 読み込み専用ファイルシステムです 14:37:28 Seems that it's also Japanese. 14:37:47 A rather curious linguistic phenomenon. 14:37:53 `run env LC_MESSAGES=zh_CN.UTF-8 rm /dev/null 14:37:54 I got `/dev/null' を削除できません: 許可がありません 14:37:54 rm: 无法删除"/dev/null": 只读文件系统 14:40:25 Phantom_Hoover, is your DF mod with the coal online at all? 14:40:40 Er... I don't think so. 14:40:50 Having a bad time with mineral distributions? 14:41:10 Having a bad time being bored, want to go on Dwarf Fortress 14:41:21 So, yes 14:41:38 I guess I can paste most of the relevant files. 14:42:37 http://sprunge.us/DZBh is inorganic_stone_mineral.txt 14:43:03 http://sprunge.us/MjgN is reaction_smelter.txt 14:43:18 http://sprunge.us/KDLH is entity_default.txt 14:43:28 That should do it. 14:44:52 Thanks 14:46:15 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 14:46:41 -!- augur has joined. 14:48:18 -!- augur_ has joined. 14:48:23 -!- augur has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 14:52:41 -!- augur_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 14:59:32 I hate absolutely everyone in #wolfgame 14:59:38 They can all suck a burning match 14:59:50 How's Ada going? 15:00:05 Stop h8in', start learnin'. 15:00:07 Ada is on the back-burner due to my mafia addiction 15:00:39 why are you learning ada Sgeo 15:00:58 Phantom_Hoover: because it's "the cool language to" learn?? 15:02:04 Phantom_Hoover, because shachaf told me to 15:02:43 Sgeo: if you're into ada, may I suggest you VHDL? 15:02:55 why on earth would you listen to anything shachaf tells you 15:03:06 he's untrustworthy! 15:03:26 The ... marketing around Ada is interesting at least. 15:03:34 Phantom_Hoover: I thought Sgeo could use some guidance. 15:03:56 shachaf don't do that... it's unethical... 15:04:33 Which part? 15:04:47 making sgeo do stupid things because he doesn't know any better 15:05:10 If Ada is so stupid, then why do people in #ada say it's good? 15:05:33 they're like sgeo! 15:05:51 There ARE language channels where the people in them don't claim their language is good. 15:05:53 Aimless and in need of guidance? 15:05:55 ##php 15:06:23 shachaf, aimless and in need of guidance by someone who isn't you! 15:06:43 Phantom_Hoover: I was hoping they could all guide each other for a bit. 15:06:51 And maybe Sgeo could go be guided there. 15:07:44 But you know what they say, the blind can't lead an elephant into a glass house.. 15:10:10 Sgeo: Did you install GNAT yet? 15:10:16 Not yet 15:10:53 It's in APT, you know. 15:11:25 Phantom_Hoover: After Ada I'm thinking I'll have him learn some MMIX assembly. 15:11:31 That's actually useful! 15:14:54 -!- Lumpio- has quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds). 15:15:26 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 15:16:35 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 15:17:14 -!- Arc_Koen has joined. 15:20:51 -!- Taneb has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 15:22:38 incidentally, fuck the cross product 15:23:03 What's the matter with cross products? 15:24:06 they're too damn chiral 15:24:08 -!- FreeFull has joined. 15:24:14 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: reilraE). 15:26:09 Phantom_Hoover: do you love monoids 15:26:38 i have no strong opinions on them 15:27:03 i love monoids 15:27:05 they are so easy 15:27:28 -!- augur has joined. 15:29:05 -!- impomatic has joined. 15:37:30 Ok, I apparently can get very mean sometimes 15:37:42 I don't show it here, but I just said, in someone's channel 15:37:47 So, if this channel isn't supposed to have fools, why are you here? 15:39:12 You would never say that in here. 15:39:17 Everyone in #esoteric is a fool. 15:40:52 I ain't no fool! 15:41:09 (at least, not your regular, plebeian kind of fool.) 15:42:02 @wn fool 15:42:02 *** "fool" wn "WordNet (r) 3.0 (2006)" 15:42:03 fool 15:42:03 n 1: a person who lacks good judgment [syn: {fool}, {sap}, 15:42:03 {saphead}, {muggins}, {tomfool}] 15:42:03 2: a person who is gullible and easy to take advantage of [syn: 15:42:04 [15 @more lines] 15:42:11 @more 15:42:12 {chump}, {fool}, {gull}, {mark}, {patsy}, {fall guy}, 15:42:12 {sucker}, {soft touch}, {mug}] 15:42:12 3: a professional clown employed to entertain a king or nobleman 15:42:14 in the Middle Ages [syn: {jester}, {fool}, {motley fool}] 15:42:17 v 1: make a fool or dupe of [syn: {fool}, {gull}, {befool}] 15:42:18 [10 @more lines] 15:42:22 boily: You think you have good judgment? 15:42:25 @more 15:42:25 2: spend frivolously and unwisely; "Fritter away one's 15:42:25 inheritance" [syn: {fritter}, {frivol away}, {dissipate}, 15:42:25 {shoot}, {fritter away}, {fool}, {fool away}] 15:42:26 3: fool or hoax; "The immigrant was duped because he trusted 15:42:28 everyone"; "You can't fool me!" [syn: {gull}, {dupe}, 15:42:30 [5 @more lines] 15:42:34 is this necessary 15:42:41 hi elliott 15:43:27 see, I need paragraphs of explanations to make me realise my foolness! 15:44:47 Foolsub and wisdom. 15:45:23 @more 15:45:23 {slang}, {befool}, {cod}, {fool}, {put on}, {take in}, {put 15:45:23 one over}, {put one across}] 15:45:23 4: indulge in horseplay; "Enough horsing around--let's get back 15:45:23 to work!"; "The bored children were fooling about" [syn: 15:45:23 {horse around}, {arse around}, {fool around}, {fool}] 15:48:07 -!- Taneb has joined. 15:56:17 There's probably some reason why it's en_NZ? // Are you not satisfied, you antikiwi? 15:56:31 hi Gregor 15:56:40 `wehlcohme Gregor 15:56:42 Grehgohr: Wehlcohme to the ihntehrnahtiohnahl huhb fohr ehsohtehrihc prohgrahmmihng lahnguahge dehsihgn ahnd dehployhmehnt! Fohr mohre ihnfohrmahtiohn, chehck ouht ouhr wihki: http://ehsohlahngs.ohrg/wihki/Maihn_Pahge. (Fohr the ohthehr kihnd ohf ehsohtehrihca, try #ehsohtehrihc ohn ihrc.dahl.neht.) 15:57:17 -!- Gregor has changed nick to TwilightSpockle. 16:02:58 `run ls bin/*h*h* 16:02:59 bin/?hh \ bin/wehlcohme 16:03:02 `run ls bin/*h* 16:03:03 bin/h \ bin/?h \ bin/h! \ bin/hatesgeo \ bin/?hh \ bin/quachaf \ bin/searchlog \ bin/show \ bin/unh \ bin/wehlcohme 16:06:48 TwilightSpockle: spockle? 16:07:14 It is a traditional Vulcopony name. 16:07:35 -!- Nisstyre-laptop has joined. 16:10:12 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 16:14:23 -!- Lumpio- has joined. 16:16:12 `hatesgeo 16:16:43 No output. 16:18:03 `hate 16:18:04 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: hate: not found 16:18:08 don't hate 16:18:18 `paste bin/hatesgeo 16:18:20 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/bin/hatesgeo 16:18:41 help 16:25:58 -!- sebbu has joined. 16:31:22 don't help 16:33:53 -!- RodgerTheGreat has joined. 16:57:48 -!- Nisstyre-laptop has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 16:59:39 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 17:04:30 Phantom_Hoover, what's so terrible about Ada? 17:04:55 1.6. Release notes for version 7.6.2 17:04:55 The 7.6.2 release is a bugfix release. The changes relative to 7.6.1 are listed below. 17:04:58 1.6.1. GHC 17:05:00 A long-standing typechecker bug which allowed unsafeCoerce to be written has been fixed. 17:05:03 thank's 17:06:31 elliott: DeriveFoo isn't fixed. :-( 17:06:49 "have fun with ur handwritten instances!!" 17:08:37 elliott, help I can't tell if shachaf is trying to torture me when he tells me to learn Ada 17:08:54 Sgeo: I think it would be better for everyone involved if you learned it. 17:09:16 I keep reading that it's "large". Are you saying that because it would take a while? 17:09:32 Although that's not going to stop me from talking about it, so how does it help? 17:09:37 Eh, is it that large? 17:09:48 Don't know, just read rumors 17:10:05 You should learn it and find out. 17:31:45 "I OFTEN GET ANGRY WHEN WRITING CODE IN THIS LANGUAGE" 17:31:49 Ada much more than C# 17:38:39 The Ada people say it's highly imperative. Why would I look twice at this language? 17:40:02 Sgeo: You haven't given it a fair chance. 17:40:26 Try reading about the language instead of what about what people say about the language. 17:40:45 I'm doing both 17:41:12 What's another language that lets you do things like define a type for a range of integers? 17:41:33 Any dependently typed language? 17:42:30 -!- carado has joined. 17:42:39 http://i.imgur.com/N60FT3A.png 17:43:07 Sgeo: What actual real-world-usable languages? 17:47:21 Hmm. Haskell is about as run-time-inflexible as Ada, and I like Haskell a lot except for that. So why Ada when I have Haskell> 17:47:22 ? 17:47:44 Ada is totally lacking in the two things that I regret not having when writing Haskell. 17:48:23 what are those 17:48:29 Congratulations, you are the first person in history to compare Ada to Haskell. 17:48:32 What about things like precise control over memory layout? 17:48:33 and also what does "run-time-inflexible" mean 17:48:43 Adskell, the ad-funded "freemium" version of Haskell. 17:49:21 Easy-to-use macros and easy to change the program as it runs. I am aware of Template Haskell and that it's considered annoying to use, and that there are some libraries for plugin-like stuff 17:50:57 macros aren't runtime... 17:51:47 "change the program as it runs" is too ambiguous to really respond to, but it seems to be either a trivial property (i.e. exhibiting dynamic behaviour in general) or something related solely to a runtime rather than a language 17:58:50 -!- DHeadshot has joined. 17:59:41 oh pick a language already 17:59:55 I try 18:00:03 imo ada 18:00:13 spend your time learning about things other than languages 18:00:28 kmc, why? Other things are boring 18:00:32 you're wrong 18:00:58 Languages are interesting but the thing you're doing probably won't give you much of the benefits of that. 18:01:09 And also other things are more interesting than languages. 18:01:55 talking to yourself about whether Ada is better than Factor is not interesting 18:01:58 not for the rest of us anyway 18:02:39 kmc: um it's clojure 18:03:02 Sgeo: out of curiosity, what was the last program you wrote for a reason not motivated by the language you were using 18:03:05 and what language did you use 18:03:41 Do programming competitions count? 18:03:45 yeah 18:03:47 I used Python for one problem Haskell for the other 18:03:52 cool 18:03:58 were they interesting problems? 18:04:21 Eh. Somewhat 18:04:35 I think I actually understand how to parse parentheses now, as in, a good understanding 18:04:45 ...well, I still need recursion 18:06:27 There was also a bot I wrote for another channel last year but the reasoning behind my choice of language (Tcl) was because it was the language I was interested in 18:07:52 i'm with Sgeo, languages are more interesting than actual programming. that shit sucks. 18:08:09 Sgeo: Stop that crap, choose task then choose language appropriate for task and start code. 18:08:49 although i do hate it less now that i do it regularly-ish 18:09:13 perhaps i will relearn to love it eventually? 18:11:30 it always seems strange and sad when programmers describe to me their experience primarily in terms of what languages they know 18:11:44 it's like a carpenter bragging about all the different tools in their shop, rather than what they've built 18:11:55 major mark against in an interview, imo 18:12:32 :/ 18:12:55 * Sgeo is totally screwed wrt. that interview 18:14:32 -!- DHeadshot has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 18:14:39 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 18:14:50 -!- DHeadshot has joined. 18:14:52 -!- DHeadshot has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:20:40 -!- azaq23 has joined. 18:20:49 -!- azaq23 has quit (Max SendQ exceeded). 18:21:01 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 18:21:06 Hello 18:21:10 -!- azaq23 has joined. 18:21:28 -!- Bike has joined. 18:22:03 >let map mар maр = mар : map mар maр; mаp mар = map mар mар in mаp "map" 18:22:12 > let map mар maр = mар : map mар maр; mаp mар = map mар mар in mаp "map" 18:22:12 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 18:22:14 kmc: would it be equally bad to descibe one's experience in terms of what paradigms one has experience with? 18:22:32 maybe 18:22:38 i'd still rather hear about what you've actually done 18:22:40 Damn ;_; 18:22:52 and will ask questions about that 18:22:58 though i ask questions about languages as well 18:23:14 -!- AnotherTest has left. 18:23:19 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 18:23:42 I could answer that I have tonnes of incomplete toy projects, but I'm not sure if that'd help me 18:23:59 do you have course work or something? 18:24:15 almost everyone who has completed interesting projects also has many incomplete or abandoned projects 18:24:28 if somebody claims to know a language / paradigm but can't explain anything substantial they've done in that language / paradigm, it casts doubt on the original claim 18:24:39 Well, yes, but those are less interesting than the incomplete toy projects 18:24:57 don't get me wrong, it's important to know a variety of tools and understand their strengths and weaknesses 18:25:09 it's just, i want to know what you can do with those tools as well 18:25:19 Yeah, fair, that makes sense 18:25:56 -!- Bike has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 18:26:03 -!- ogrom has quit (Quit: Left). 18:26:06 and yeah, it will differ between experienced and inexperienced candidates 18:26:37 talking about incomplete toy projects is totally fair game imo 18:26:45 -!- Bike has joined. 18:26:54 kmc: i know at least 500 languages, please hire me to work on that silly irc clone thing 18:26:57 ty 18:27:09 elliott: be honest, how many of them are brainfuck derivatives 18:27:12 I don't think esolangs count 18:27:18 kmc: no more than 432 18:27:24 ok maybe 433 18:27:33 i request a modest salary of $money / month 18:28:06 $monqy/month is better 18:28:25 $texas 18:32:29 " major mark against in an interview, imo" i do agree that if you want to become a programmer, obviously you should like programming more than languages. and perhaps Sgeo does want that. 18:33:51 rather random thing to quote but why not. 18:33:56 there's also the fact that people will, for example, say "I know JavaScript" when what they mean is "I have experience with frontend web development" 18:34:21 and they'll talk about advantages / disadvantages of "JavaScript" but they're really talking about their experience with the web as an applications platform 18:35:26 likewise if you say you know AVR assembly, then we can probably chat about digital logic and realtime programming under space constraints etc 18:35:30 but it's not really about the language 18:36:28 i have extensive experience in frontend web development with Caterwaul 18:37:21 i have expensive experience with `dd` and partition tables 18:39:13 I remember the good old days when I thought boot sector = MBR = booty-thingy, whatever, man, and I wanted to switch from the Windows bootloader to GRUB, so I did dd if=/dev/hda4 of/dev/hda bs=512 count=1 18:39:21 i have extensive experience in the operation and typical maintenance of the human body 18:39:26 Therefore make me a doctor. 18:39:28 I made a backup in my home directory! 18:39:41 That took a while to get out of. 18:39:47 i am a programmer and therefore a genius in every field 18:39:48 shachaf: haha 18:39:57 i did some things like that too, strangely I believe some of them worked 18:40:20 for a while I had a dual boot system where NTLDR was the primary bootloader 18:40:38 Yep, that's what I had. 18:40:42 With Windows 2000, I think. 18:40:44 i think this involved dd'ing the first 512 bytes of my Linux partition (containing LILO stage 1) and putting that in C:\ 18:40:57 yeah me too 18:40:58 Right! I remember that. 18:41:03 life got so much simpler when I ditched windows :) 18:41:21 To be fair, the same goes for LILO. 18:41:26 I remember that too. 18:41:32 shachaf: what goes? 18:41:42 Life getting simpler when you ditch it. 18:42:07 Flagged Arch's ghc package as out of date 18:42:11 i'm not sure about that 18:42:14 My work is done 18:42:17 LILO was fine :) 18:42:24 does the job 18:42:24 simple 18:42:27 kmc: I use syslinux now 18:42:31 Remember having to update the boot sector on every kernel update? 18:42:34 you had to remember to run 'lilo' 18:42:45 yeah, not a big deal imo 18:43:03 syslinux is good 18:43:14 Simple and convienient 18:43:25 shachaf: now i have to run update-initramfs after ever kernel update instead ;P 18:43:31 (except not usually, because debian does it for me) 18:44:17 Bah, LOADLIN.EXE. 18:44:20 yes 18:44:32 before NTLDR i had a dual boot setup with Win98 and LOADLIN and an AUTOEXE.BAT "boot" menu 18:44:36 Simplest and convenientest. 18:44:38 AUTOEXEC.BAT i mean 18:45:06 running Linux on 68k macs was similar 18:45:14 @ simplifies things. 18:45:30 you would boot into OS 7 and run this "Penguin" app and your screen would go all crazy as it loads the kernel all over the framebuffer and then poof it's linux 18:45:53 I did MkLinux on my PPC Performa, it was really fiddly. 18:45:56 It's "System 7", kmc!! 18:46:01 kmc: I never got that working. 18:46:02 i bought a bunch of 68k macs from my school for $1 each 18:46:14 Except for 7.6 after. 18:46:15 most of them had the 68LC040 chip though 18:46:20 I was using a $25 yard sale something. 18:46:23 Also I think the early ones were System Software 7? 18:46:26 which has an erratum that breaks FPU emulation 18:46:34 so it couldn't run most binary linux distros :/ 18:47:30 I think I had 7.5.3 on the Performa. 18:47:33 Hmm, I don't remember what this was. 18:47:40 Yes, Performa. That name sounds familiar. 18:48:11 > let map mар maр = mар : map mар maр; mаp mар = map mар mар in mаp "map" 18:48:11 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 18:48:23 Damn you lambdabot 18:48:47 In ghci it's an infinite list of "map" 18:48:51 The low-numbered Performas were 68k things; the four-digit ones were PPC. 18:48:54 > let map map = map in let map map = map in map map map "map" 18:48:55 "map" 18:50:53 PowerPC was the future. 18:51:25 why are there two lets there 18:51:58 > let map map = map map map in let in let map map = map in map map "map" 18:52:00 Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: 18:52:00 t2 = t1 -> t2 -> t0Occ... 18:52:04 Ah well. 18:52:09 Bears. http://i.imgur.com/ZJPxIpq.gif 18:52:44 ion: that's the best 18:53:14 i want a bears :( 18:53:32 regarding bear-proof trash cans: "There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists" 18:55:36 * shachaf is tired 18:56:48 kmc: hah 18:56:49 > let map map = map in map map map "map" 18:56:51 "map" 18:57:19 > let map in = map in map map map "map" 18:57:20 :1:9: parse error on input `in' 18:57:29 > let map pam = map in map map map "map" 18:57:31 Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: t1 = t0 -> t1 18:57:37 weak 18:57:44 @ty let a x = (x,x); b = a . a; c = b . b; d = c . c; e = d . d; f = e . e in f 18:57:58 help 18:57:59 thread killed 18:58:08 @ty let a x = (x,x); b = a . a; c = b . b; d = c . c; e = d . d in e 18:58:17 is this some billion laughs thing 18:58:25 Pretty much. 18:58:27 thread killed 18:58:29 @ty let a x = (x,x); b = a . a; c = b . b; d = c . c in d 18:58:37 t -> ((((((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))))), (((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, 18:58:38 t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))))), ((((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, 18:58:38 t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))))), (((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, 18:58:38 t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))))))), (((((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, 18:58:38 t))))), (((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))))), ((((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), 18:58:40 (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))))), (((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, 18:58:41 t)))), ((((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t))), (((t, t), (t, t)), ((t, t), (t, t)))))))) 18:58:47 I love it. 18:59:13 I like how typechecking-as-security is useless because it's too slow. :( 18:59:47 elliott: THE FATAL FLAW IN @ 19:00:43 @ty let (@) x = (.) x x in let a x = (x,x) in (@) a a a a 19:00:49 parse error on input `@' 19:00:53 @ is syntax 19:00:56 no! 19:01:18 @ty let fuck everything = everything . everything in let shit fuck = (fuck,fuck) in fuck fuck fuck shit 19:01:21 Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a0 = (a0, a0) 19:01:22 Expected type: a0 -> a0 19:01:22 Actual type: a0 -> (a0, a0) 19:01:30 > "map" == "mар" 19:01:30 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 19:02:05 k i'm actually not sure what i did wrong there 19:02:47 The types are the problem. 19:03:05 Bike: You violated the occurs check!! 19:03:12 thx 19:03:40 @ty let f g = g . g in f 19:03:48 (a -> a) -> a -> a 19:03:50 See? 19:04:18 > "map" == "mар" 19:04:18 mueval: recoverEncode: invalid argument (invalid character) 19:04:25 * FreeFull smacks lambdabot and mueval 19:04:42 @ty let shit fuck = (fuck,fuck) in fuck everything = everything . everything in fuck fuck fuck shit 19:04:45 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 19:05:03 thread killed 19:05:10 wow, ty really is slow 19:05:13 @ty let shit fuck = (fuck,fuck) in fuck everything = everything . everything in fuck fuck shit 19:05:19 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 19:05:24 lambdabot is being really slow right now 19:05:30 thread killed 19:05:31 Bike: this is an "infamous" bad case for hindley-milner in general 19:05:34 double-exponential, I think 19:05:41 oh right i remember that now 19:05:46 is there any way around it? 19:05:51 other than the classic "why are you doing that" 19:06:02 "stop hitting yourself" 19:06:05 right 19:06:08 > 1 19:06:13 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 19:06:19 "the infamous double exponential case" 19:06:21 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Client Quit). 19:06:23 hee 19:06:24 well you can set arbitrary limits on type inference 19:06:31 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 19:06:40 @yarrbi trarry 19:06:40 Ahoy mateys 19:06:42 probably there are less expressive algorithms which are just, like, exponential at worst 19:06:47 and also a pain to use because they're less expressive 19:07:19 they might also be slower in non-pathological cases 19:07:36 > 1 19:07:40 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 19:07:43 What 19:07:56 I don't know but it's Jafet's fault. 19:08:22 Anyway maybe I'll try to sleep for a bit? 19:08:50 good luck 19:09:57 > 1 19:10:03 mueval: ExitFailure 1 19:10:03 mueval: Prelude.undefined 19:10:20 who borked lambdabot? 19:10:41 ) 1 + 1 19:10:42 shachaf: 2 19:11:45 ) pi 19:11:46 boily: |value error: pi 19:12:13 ) let 2 = 3 in 2 + 2 19:12:13 boily: |value error: in 19:12:13 boily: | let 2=3 in 2+2 19:12:23 ) exp 5 19:12:23 boily: |value error: exp 19:12:23 boily: | exp 5 19:12:25 ) 2 = 3 19:12:25 shachaf: 0 19:12:29 ) exp(5) 19:12:29 boily: |value error: exp 19:12:30 boily: | exp(5) 19:12:30 ) 2 := 3 19:12:30 shachaf: |domain error 19:12:30 shachaf: | 2 :=3 19:12:40 ) o 1 19:12:41 Bike: |value error: o 19:12:41 Bike: | o 1 19:12:48 ) o. 1 19:12:48 Bike: 3.14159 19:12:56 ) i. 10000000000000000000000 19:12:56 shachaf: |domain error 19:12:56 shachaf: | i.1e22 19:12:59 no. oh no you didn't. 19:13:10 there's a J bot here now? 19:13:17 welcome to the future, boily 19:13:17 what is jconn supposed to be accomplishing 19:13:23 I can't wait until we get an Ada bot. 19:13:37 shachaf: i'll write an Eiffel bot okay 19:13:40 I'd fall off my chair in astonishment, but then I'd probably disturb my colleagues. 19:13:41 ) (+%#) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 19:13:42 elliott: 0.1 0.2 0.3 0.4 0.5 0.6 0.7 0.8 0.9 1 19:13:45 can it be a Sgeolang bot 19:13:47 ) (+/%#) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 19:13:48 elliott: 5.5 19:13:52 ) +/%# 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 19:13:52 elliott: 0.1 19:13:59 good, I still remember how it all works, roughly 19:13:59 elliott: mind your language...................... 19:14:23 shachaf: wait wait, i'll write a algol 68 bot! 19:14:40 i'm going to imagine that, unbeknownst to the channel, elliott has spent ten years in the financial industry programming j 19:14:49 quintopia: That was going to be my next language for Sgeo. 19:14:59 :D 19:15:02 quintopia: imo algol w 19:15:14 algol ω 19:15:25 algoljack just ate him 19:15:48 -!- monqy has joined. 19:15:57 Bike: they use K a lot more in finance, AIUI 19:16:11 i don't even know anything about k 19:16:14 Bike: Algol W isn't wirth the trouble. 19:16:19 Bike: I admit hiring a 7 year old to program finance in J would make an utterly fantastic story 19:16:19 is that the one that's all "what's this OOP business" 19:16:25 yes, yes it would 19:17:21 Bike: K is like J except different 19:17:30 "h t h" 19:17:37 ) "h 19:17:37 shachaf: "h 19:17:40 ) "h t h" 19:17:41 shachaf: |syntax error 19:17:41 shachaf: | "h t h" 19:17:45 ) "h + "h 19:17:45 shachaf: |syntax error 19:17:45 shachaf: | "h+"h 19:17:48 help 19:20:19 ) 19:20:41 ) . 4 5 $ 50 19:20:42 boily: |syntax error 19:20:42 boily: | .4 5$50 19:20:52 ) ?. 4 5 $ 50 19:20:52 boily: 46 5 29 2 4 19:20:52 boily: 39 10 7 10 44 19:20:52 boily: 46 28 13 18 1 19:20:52 boily: 42 28 10 40 12 19:21:01 these are probably the least helpful syntax error notices i've ever seen 19:21:05 -!- derdon has joined. 19:21:29 ) (#:D.1) 1 2 3 19:21:30 elliott: 0 1 19:21:30 elliott: 0 0 19:21:30 elliott: 0 0 19:21:30 elliott: 19:21:30 elliott: 0 0 19:21:30 elliott: ... 19:21:34 ) (#:D.1) 123 19:21:34 elliott: 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 19:21:38 ) (#:D.1) 1235 19:21:39 elliott: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 19:21:42 great function 19:22:49 ) 3 + 3 19:22:50 FreeFull: 6 19:22:52 :O 19:23:07 elliott: what the hell is that 19:24:04 first derivative of antibase two (http://www.jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/d402.htm) 19:26:26 * Bike stares 19:28:56 ) #: 2 19:28:57 FreeFull: 1 0 19:29:03 ) #: 139 19:29:04 FreeFull: 1 0 0 0 1 0 1 1 19:29:09 Isn't that just base 2 19:29:45 Yeah, but D.1 means first derivative. 19:30:32 ) (#:D.1) 124 19:30:32 Bike: 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 19:30:37 right. 19:31:49 not exactly sure what the derivative of #: *is* 19:32:29 ) (+,#:) 1 2 19:32:30 elliott: 1 2 19:32:30 elliott: 0 1 19:32:30 elliott: 1 0 19:32:45 ) (+,#:) 123 19:32:46 elliott: 123 1 1 1 1 0 1 1 19:32:49 right 19:32:57 can anyone access nortti.dy.fi or even ping it? 19:32:59 ) (+;#:) 123 19:32:59 elliott: +---+-------------+ 19:32:59 elliott: |123|1 1 1 1 0 1 1| 19:32:59 elliott: +---+-------------+ 19:33:07 ) (#:;#:D.1) 123 19:33:07 elliott: +-------------+-------------+ 19:33:08 elliott: |1 1 1 1 0 1 1|0 0 0 0 0 0 1| 19:33:08 elliott: +-------------+-------------+ 19:33:09 I guess #: is sort of the identity function, meaning the derivative is 1 19:33:12 ) (#:;#:D.1) 12345 19:33:12 elliott: +---------------------------+---------------------------+ 19:33:12 elliott: |1 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 1 1 0 0 1|0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1| 19:33:12 elliott: +---------------------------+---------------------------+ 19:33:27 looks like you get 0 0 0 0 0 ... 1 padded out to how many bits the input is 19:33:32 yeah 19:33:33 makes sense 19:34:22 ) (#:D.2) 12345 19:34:22 Bike: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 19:34:34 sensible 19:34:35 nortti: pings get lost in the great wide black Internet. 19:34:46 ) (#:D.3) 12345 19:34:47 elliott: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 19:34:50 astonishing 19:35:04 ) (#:D._1) 12345 19:35:04 elliott: |nonce error 19:35:04 elliott: | ( #:D._1)12345 19:35:08 aw c'mon 19:35:13 boily: ok. that is what I get too (on the very machine you were trying to ping) 19:35:13 what's wrong with the -1st derivative 19:35:14 wait are there really antiderivatives 19:35:17 tell me there are 19:35:27 well apparently J does not acknowledge their existence 19:35:33 what! 19:35:48 look J, D is a linear operator. that's right a MATRIX. you're good with those right! 19:35:58 so tell me the negative pi'th derivative of #:! 19:36:28 ) (D. b. _1) 19:36:28 elliott: |syntax error 19:36:28 elliott: | ( D.b._1) 19:36:31 ) D. b. _1 19:36:31 elliott: |syntax error 19:36:31 elliott: | D.b._1 19:36:37 does J actually have infinite matrices 19:36:40 i would like that 19:36:40 " wait are there really antiderivatives" in J or in general? just checking 19:36:48 ) f=: D. ; f b. _1 19:36:48 elliott: |syntax error 19:36:48 elliott: | f=: D.;f b._1 19:36:56 imo go fuck yourself j 19:36:57 oklopol: in J. what do you take me for :< 19:37:03 ) - b. _1 19:37:03 elliott: - 19:37:07 ) + b. _1 19:37:07 Bike: a bike. 19:37:07 elliott: + 19:37:10 oh hmm 19:37:16 oh. i guess that makes sense. 19:37:20 yes 19:37:38 ) (D.&1) b. _1 19:37:38 elliott: |syntax error 19:37:38 elliott: | ( D.&1)b._1 19:37:47 ) f=: D.&1 ; f b. _1 19:37:47 elliott: |value error: f 19:37:48 elliott: | f=:D.&1; f b._1 19:37:55 :/ 19:38:20 ) f=:D.&1; (f #:) 123 19:38:21 elliott: |value error: f 19:38:21 elliott: | f=:D.&1; (f#:)123 19:38:26 ) f=.D.&1; (f #:) 123 19:38:26 elliott: |value error: f 19:38:26 elliott: | f=.D.&1; (f#:)123 19:38:30 ) q=.D.&1; (q #:) 123 19:38:30 elliott: |value error: q 19:38:30 elliott: | q=.D.&1; (q#:)123 19:38:40 am i just an idiot 19:38:42 i'm pretty close to getting on to #jsoftware to ask why D isn't a matrix 19:38:43 help 19:38:54 ) ((D.&1) #:) 123 19:38:55 elliott: |syntax error 19:38:55 elliott: | (( D.&1)#:)123 19:38:58 oh hmm 19:39:14 I guess I have to whip out the stuff for this 19:39:29 ) f:= D.&1 ; f b. _1 19:39:30 Bike: |spelling error 19:39:30 Bike: | f:= D.&1 ; f b. _1 19:39:30 Bike: | ^ 19:39:44 yeah ok i have no damned clue 19:40:17 ) f =: 1 : 'x (u D.1) y'; (f #:) 123 19:40:17 elliott: |value error: f 19:40:17 elliott: | f=:1 :'x (u D.1) y'; (f#:)123 19:40:23 ok i'm getting there 19:41:07 J has complexes right 19:41:16 i wanna see if D is defined for gaussian integers at least 19:41:28 ) f =: 1 : 'x (u D.1) y'; f #: 1 2 3 19:41:28 elliott: |value error: f 19:41:28 elliott: | f=:1 :'x (u D.1) y'; f#:1 2 3 19:41:29 er 19:41:32 ) f =: 1 : 'x (u D.1) y'; #: f 1 2 3 19:41:33 elliott: |value error: f 19:41:33 elliott: | f=:1 :'x (u D.1) y';#: f 1 2 3 19:41:38 ughughugh fuck me 19:41:43 ) f =: 1 : 'x (u D.1) y'; f #: 19:41:43 elliott: |syntax error 19:41:43 elliott: | f=: 1 :'x (u D.1) y';f#: 19:41:46 dijeijeoijeoijefoi 19:41:57 sgeo you're going to break elliott!! 19:42:02 ) hello =: 1 : 'x u y'; 1 2 (hello +) 3 4 19:42:02 elliott: |value error: hello 19:42:02 elliott: | hello=:1 :'x u y';1 2 (hello+)3 4 19:42:06 WAHT ???? 19:42:19 -!- asiekierka has quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net). 19:42:20 oh hmm 19:42:24 ) hello =: 1 : 'x u y' 19:42:24 elliott: |ok 19:42:25 ) hello 19:42:25 elliott: 1 : 'x u y' 19:42:28 aww friend 19:42:32 ) 1 2 (hello +) 3 4 19:42:32 elliott: |syntax error 19:42:32 elliott: | 1 2( hello+)3 4 19:42:37 ) hello + 19:42:37 elliott: |syntax error 19:42:38 elliott: | hello+ 19:42:39 ) + hello 19:42:40 elliott: + (1 : 'x u y') 19:42:44 ) 1 2 (+ hello) 3 4 19:42:44 elliott: |domain error 19:42:44 elliott: | 1 2 (+hello)3 4 19:42:48 ) 1 (+ hello) 3 19:42:48 elliott: |domain error 19:42:49 elliott: | 1 (+hello)3 19:42:50 hm 19:42:51 ) o 19:42:52 oklopol: |value error: o 19:42:53 ) (+ hello) 1 19:42:53 elliott: |value error: x 19:42:53 elliott: | x u y 19:42:59 interesting 19:42:59 ) 0+2 19:43:00 oklopol: 2 19:43:08 ) hello =: 1 : 'u y' 19:43:08 elliott: |ok 19:43:08 ) 0+.0 0 0 0 19:43:09 oklopol: 0 0 0 0 19:43:10 ) (+ hello) 1 19:43:10 elliott: 1 19:43:15 wow i'm good 19:43:23 ) hello =: 1 : '(u D.1) y' 19:43:23 elliott: |ok 19:43:26 ) (#: hello) 123 19:43:26 elliott: 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 19:43:30 yesss 19:43:35 ) hello b. _1 19:43:35 elliott: |syntax error 19:43:35 elliott: | hello b._1 19:43:38 ugh 19:43:54 right I have absolutely no idea how to ask J what it thinks the inverse of (? D. 1) is 19:43:55 i'd say "you can do it!" but i don't know what you're doing and find it slightly frightening 19:43:58 Sgeo: you're my only hope 19:45:39 Bike: have you seen the original J interpreter 19:45:47 http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Essays/Incunabulum 19:46:22 well they managed to make C look like J 19:46:50 my eyes 19:47:36 "good job" 19:47:58 has this ever been submittedt o IOCCC 19:51:06 http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Essays/PianoTuning 19:52:05 nice 19:56:31 wow thats a lot of essays 19:57:26 http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Essays/JforC%20Front%20Cover 19:57:55 best cover i've seen since forth for the atari 19:58:36 -!- oerjan has joined. 19:58:36 forth on the atari is a good cover 19:59:30 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 20:00:01 -!- augur has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 20:00:15 -!- augur has joined. 20:00:33 whoah 20:00:37 google image search changed 20:02:23 http://www.jsoftware.com/jwiki/Essays/The%20Art%20of%20Shaving 20:03:21 Try to remember when and why I've wanted this. 20:03:56 Comprehensive Burma Shave billboard collection 20:05:03 wut 20:05:09 Oh 20:05:12 OK, that makes more sense. 20:05:20 I thought it would actually be something related to "the art of shaving" 20:05:35 well the piano tunin one is actually about piano tuning 20:07:28 So is the J software /Essays/ directory like an everything2 niche or what? 20:08:25 ooh i left a literal n in the fueue program 20:09:21 -!- sebbu has joined. 20:09:35 -!- sebbu has quit (Changing host). 20:09:35 -!- sebbu has joined. 20:10:41 -!- TwilightSpockle has changed nick to Gregor. 20:14:28 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 20:18:29 *MWAHAHAHA* 20:19:29 ? 20:19:59 œrjan evily laughing is never a good omen. 20:21:01 -!- sebbu has joined. 20:25:24 I beg to differ. 20:25:29 It is ALWAYS a good omen. 20:26:18 -!- Gregor has set topic: char*a,b[9999];main(){gets(a=b);while(*a){a+=(b[*a]-=b[a[1]])?3:a[2];}puts(b+1);} | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/. 20:31:36 -!- asiekierka has joined. 20:32:50 Gregor: is that program supposed to take a single line of input, drop its first character then print the rest? 20:33:02 Nope. 20:33:10 Although that is one possible behavior. 20:33:47 Taneb: um isn't fueue supposed to allow return as whitespace? 20:33:54 `pastelogs fueue 20:34:25 No output. 20:34:44 `pastelogs fueue 20:35:15 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.7500 20:35:28 What constitutes "whitespace" isn't clear from the spec 20:36:07 However, Unicode specifies both LF and CR are whitespace 20:36:14 the C interpreter only allows literal ' ' :( 20:36:29 Then Arc_Koen is the one to complain to. 20:36:51 mind you it _does_ take the program as a command line argument... 20:37:25 I believe my Haskell interpreter allows \n. 20:38:14 Arc_Koen: your fueue interpreters only allow literal ' ' as whitespace (and i suspect the ocaml one doesn't accept even that inside loops) 20:38:30 * oerjan has only tested the C one 20:38:43 and has no idea where to find the haskell one *COUGH* 20:39:22 oerjan, basically, there's one copy of it and it's on this computer. 20:40:09 @tell Arc_Koen your fueue interpreters only allow literal ' ' as whitespace (and i suspect the ocaml one doesn't accept even that inside loops.) this ruins my pretty indentation and is therefore UNACCEPTABLE hth 20:40:09 Consider it noted. 20:40:53 http://www.vandoorn.talktalk.net/esoteric/fueue.hs 20:41:04 The step function is about as ugly as Haskell gets 20:41:53 @tell boily IIRC, lambdabot won't tell stuff to yourself. 20:41:53 You can tell yourself! 20:42:12 Taneb: wow, what the fuck is with that step function 20:42:14 why did yo uwrite it like that 20:42:21 monqy: look at that 20:42:35 elliott, it used to be a lot uglier 20:42:41 amazing 20:43:29 I tried to comment my code, then... didn't 20:43:40 also you misspelled "further" 20:43:46 hm i didn't know about Numeric.Natural 20:44:01 oerjan: it's in semigroups. guess who by 20:44:13 elliott, it's been moved to its own package now 20:44:20 oh right. 20:44:24 "nats" 20:45:28 Taneb: "futher" 20:45:39 and "progam" 20:45:43 oerjan, I have a vague feeling you wrote most of the main function 20:45:51 -!- monqy_ has joined. 20:46:07 quite possible. 20:46:11 monqy_: http://www.vandoorn.talktalk.net/esoteric/fueue.hs look at the step function 20:46:17 12:42:27 monqy: look at that 20:46:30 was just about to 20:46:35 i 20:46:37 yes but then you got disconnected 20:46:40 whaaaaaat is thissssss 20:46:49 -!- monqy has quit (Disconnected by services). 20:46:55 -!- monqy_ has changed nick to monqy. 20:47:06 Someone put some of my code onto Uncyclopedia once. 20:47:10 That's how much I suck as a programmer 20:47:18 -- We store operators which did not have enough operators -- 20:47:20 *operands? 20:47:29 ...yes 20:47:47 this step function hurts 20:47:47 fr operators which did not have enough operators 20:47:57 Look, I had enough difficulty getting it to run correctly. 20:48:12 thats because it's 20:48:13 it 20:48:24 when people sound like fungot quotes, then something important (and / or confusing) is happening. 20:48:25 boily: disable case-switching keys i/ o register you want to set a string) an 65371-67407 ( ff5b-ff7f). only then did the message ?syntax error will occur. 20:50:42 monqy, elliott, anyone else, constructive criticism on how to improve my code would be much appreciated 20:51:06 start over, maybe? 20:51:20 Taneb: hm your interpreter does not run my program correctly, whether or not i put it on one line. (Arc_Koen's C interpreter runs it correctly as one line.) 20:51:20 Bike, that's destructive, not constructive. 20:51:35 i shall modify his C interpreter to accept \n 20:51:39 This may be an old stupid broken version 20:51:41 Hang on 20:51:45 Taneb: ok what i would do is throw away step 20:51:46 and start over 20:51:47 at a certain point i think it's better to just begin fresh 20:52:05 -!- Snowyowl has joined. 20:52:09 pattern synonyms 20:52:18 would help slightly 20:52:24 with some of that syntactic noise 20:52:26 I believe I started over at least twice 20:52:32 but i think a major restructuring is probably needed 20:52:46 like factor out some of the common stuff out 20:54:00 monqy: pattern synonyms aka...... prisms 20:54:05 like 20:54:06 step (viewl -> FPlus :< (viewl -> FNum arg1 :< (viewl -> FNum arg2 :< queue))) = queue |> FNum (arg1 + arg2) <$ put 0 20:54:09 step (viewl -> FPlus :< (viewl -> FNum arg1 :< (viewl -> FCache (viewl -> EmptyL) :< (viewl -> FNum arg2 :< queue)))) = queue |> FNum (arg1 + arg2) <$ put 0 20:54:12 this sort of pattern is pretty common 20:54:13 really tho he has pattern synoynms 20:54:14 since he has view patterns 20:54:18 he's just not utilising them 20:54:27 ye 20:54:42 2 bad view patterns sux 20:54:54 there you go 20:55:41 Taneb: for stuff like that snippet i pasted, since you use that sort of thing everywhere where you check the queue and do that stuff you should make a function that does that for you, then just use that function in all of the cases with stuff like that. at the very least you could use that to clean up your binary operators 20:58:16 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 20:58:16 Taneb: and instead of having those crazy nested view patterns you could make a helper-view that views the stuff in the way you want to view them 20:58:49 Taneb: once you apply that sort of thinking to step it might be easier to see what further refactorings you can do since it'll be cleaner &c &c 21:01:32 Okay 21:01:39 -!- boily has quit (Quit: Poulet!). 21:02:08 I'm still not sure about the complexity of shortest non occuring sequence :( 21:02:25 alt. rewrite it using lens. lens is cool right 21:06:49 Taneb: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Deadfish#Fueue 21:07:34 :) 21:07:38 oerjan, well done 21:07:54 thank you 21:09:00 also elliott, i know he likes Deadfish interpreters 21:10:15 i do 21:11:43 -!- Snowyowl has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 21:17:33 -!- Snowyowl has joined. 21:28:06 Well, I've significantly shortened the "step" function 21:28:32 i hope you kept the old version 21:28:34 for me to preserve 4eva 21:28:50 It's... still online 21:29:08 I'd make a local copy if you want to keep it that badly 21:32:15 `done 21:32:16 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: done: not found 21:32:17 *done 21:32:34 whats the new one look like 21:33:50 Still not great 21:34:26 Refresh the old link 21:35:22 thats some interesting function naming 21:35:26 step (viewl -> FPlus :< (viewQueue2 -> Just (FNum arg1, FNum arg2, rest))) = rest |> FNum (arg1 + arg2) <$ put 0 21:35:30 step (viewl -> FMult :< (viewQueue2 -> Just (FNum arg1, FNum arg2, rest))) = rest |> FNum (arg1 * arg2) <$ put 0 21:35:33 step (viewl -> FDiv :< (viewQueue2 -> Just (FNum arg1, FNum arg2, rest))) = rest |> FNum (arg1 `div` arg2) <$ put 0 21:35:36 you can abstract this out 21:35:40 Probably 21:45:53 Taneb: for a start you can make it 21:46:08 step (erm -> (FPlus, x, y, r)) -> r |> FNum (x + y) <$ put 0 21:53:05 Taneb: (I assume you can figure out erm there) 21:53:20 Yes 21:53:37 also you can drop the _ pattern from viewQueue1 there I think 21:53:39 since your patterns are total 21:57:10 It's to appease -Wall 21:58:08 -Wall shouldn't complain since they look completely total to me? 21:58:26 -Wall doesn't know about view patterns 21:59:01 is ghc smart enough not to apply viewl once per pattern in the above? 21:59:19 oerjan: yes 21:59:24 ok 22:01:41 `olist 22:01:43 shachaf oerjan 22:02:07 maybe Sgeo should be on that list too 22:02:20 except that's illogical 22:02:23 -!- derdon has quit (Quit: WeeChat 0.3.8). 22:02:45 Is olist for when Homestuck doesn't update? 22:02:54 no, it's for when oots does 22:03:19 oh hey awesome 22:03:28 Also my sleep schedule is now messed up beyond repair 22:03:30 So tired... 22:04:03 `run echo ' Sgeo' >>bin/olist 22:04:06 No output. 22:04:15 oerjan: nice try 22:04:22 wat 22:04:25 `olist 22:04:26 shachaf oerjan \ /hackenv/bin/olist: line 2: Sgeo: command not found 22:04:29 oops 22:04:35 f 22:05:16 `run sed -i '1P; s/\n//' bin/olist 22:05:19 No output. 22:05:24 `olist 22:05:25 shachaf oerjan \ shachaf oerjan \ /hackenv/bin/olist: line 3: Sgeo: command not found 22:05:34 wat 22:05:38 "That made it worse" 22:05:42 `revert 22:05:45 Done. 22:05:54 `run sed -i '1N; s/\n//' bin/olist 22:05:58 No output. 22:06:00 `olist 22:06:01 shachaf oerjan Sgeo 22:06:03 yay 22:06:07 :) 22:08:24 what's the olist? 22:08:52 * oerjan swats olsner with his DRY swatter -----### 22:09:12 I'm not repeating anything, swat yourself 22:09:30 why should i, i didn't repeat anything either, although you tried to make me 22:09:42 it was a test of determination 22:09:59 what's oots then? 22:14:41 Order of the Stick, by the way 22:15:15 Wow, the only Fueue Deadfish program doesn't work on any Fueue implementations 22:16:37 technically incorrect. the _other_ Fueue Deadfish program works on the C interpreter at least. it consists simply of removing unnecessary whitespace from the public one. 22:17:29 i haven't tested the ocaml one, since i don't have ocaml handy 22:18:39 The Haskell implementation does the Hello World, Alphabet, and Thue-Morse programs easily 22:18:54 what about the Truth machine? 22:19:05 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:19:23 if it doesn't work, there might easily be something wrong with input 22:19:39 -!- augur has joined. 22:19:43 Inexplicable parse error 22:19:50 hah 22:20:52 After working out what that was 22:21:01 (bash doesn't like dollar symbols in strings) 22:21:08 It's got a problem with input 22:22:07 Okay, that fixed it 22:24:02 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 22:28:09 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:28:27 oerjan, refresh the old link? 22:28:29 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 22:33:23 -!- Snowyowl has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 22:35:51 Yay I'm vaguely awake 22:35:51 -!- Taneb has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 22:35:56 Is J not doing derivatives? 22:36:05 erm, antiderivatives 22:36:46 ) 9!:14 '' 22:36:47 Sgeo: j701/2011-01-10/11:25 22:37:27 ) 9!:24 '' 22:37:27 Sgeo: 1 22:40:07 I don't understand D. 22:40:38 ) 9!:D.124 '' 22:40:38 Bike: |syntax error 22:40:38 Bike: | 9!:D.124'' 22:43:12 Why was elliott using help for J 4 22:43:31 ) 9!:D.1 24 '' 22:43:32 Bike: |syntax error 22:43:32 Bike: | 9!:D.1 24'' 22:43:33 i googled j vocabulary i think 22:43:37 awwwww 22:43:43 or what do you mean 22:44:01 elliott, just as in, why you linked to a 402 dictionary 22:44:10 do you mean http://www.jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/d402.htm 22:44:13 Yes 22:44:15 perhaps actually click the link 22:44:34 some more J versions: http://www.jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/d212.htm http://www.jsoftware.com/help/dictionary/d112.htm 22:44:46 oh 22:44:50 :/ 22:45:12 Anyway, "What's the inverse of version" 22:45:29 ) 9 (!:^:_1) 24 '' 22:45:29 Sgeo: |syntax error 22:45:29 Sgeo: | 9( !:^:_1)24'' 22:46:01 )(>:^:_1) 24 22:46:07 ) (>:^:_1) 24 22:46:08 Sgeo: 23 22:46:09 oh duh 22:46:17 !: isn't a verb, is it 22:46:24 what! 22:46:42 ) (9!:24)^:_1 '' 22:46:42 Sgeo: |domain error 22:46:43 Sgeo: | (9!:24)^:_1'' 22:47:10 It's a conjugation 22:47:19 Because it needs to return a verb 22:47:27 a conjugation of what 22:47:31 So (9!:24) is a verb, !: isn't 22:47:37 erm, conjunction 22:48:04 oooookay 22:48:11 ) (9!:24)D.1 '' 22:48:11 Bike: 22:48:20 glad we got that settled. 22:52:55 ) 22:53:48 ) 42 22:53:49 oerjan: 42 22:54:20 ) :[):] 22:54:20 oerjan: |spelling error 22:54:20 oerjan: | :[):] 22:54:20 oerjan: | ^ 22:54:35 shockingly not a superset of fueue 22:55:44 hm. i dream of a language based around overlapping brackets 22:55:54 [like(this]see) 22:56:22 ) #:t.3 22:56:22 Bike: |domain error 22:56:22 Bike: | #:t.3 22:56:56 ) 9! 22:56:56 oerjan: |syntax error 22:56:57 oerjan: | 9! 22:57:05 ) !9 22:57:05 oerjan: 362880 22:57:06 elliott, ~ATH ? 22:57:37 um i hear that's not a real language. i think taneb told me. 22:57:44 or was it you 22:57:49 ) (#:D.3) 123 22:57:49 Bike: 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 22:57:56 ) (#:t.1) 22:57:56 Bike: |domain error 22:57:57 Bike: | ( #:t.1) 22:58:17 this is crap 22:58:35 The domain of the adverb t. is the same as the left domain of the derivative D. . 22:58:55 so shouldn't it be working 22:59:06 ) < < < < < < < < "j isn't crap!!!!" 22:59:06 monqy: |open quote 22:59:06 monqy: | < < < < < < < < "j isn't crap!!!!" 22:59:06 monqy: | ^ 22:59:09 :( 22:59:16 i forgot how to do quotes 22:59:18 rip: me 22:59:30 ) < < < < < < < < "j isn't crap!!! 22:59:31 Bike: |open quote 22:59:31 ) < < < < < < < < 'j isn''t crap!!!!' 22:59:31 Bike: | < < < < < < < < "j isn't crap!!! 22:59:31 Bike: | ^ 22:59:31 Sgeo: +------------------------------+ 22:59:31 Sgeo: |+----------------------------+| 22:59:31 Sgeo: ||+--------------------------+|| 22:59:31 Sgeo: |||+------------------------+||| 22:59:32 Sgeo: ||||+----------------------+|||| 22:59:32 Sgeo: ... 22:59:40 oh come on you can do better than that j 22:59:49 good 22:59:59 ) < < < 'monqy 22:59:59 Bike: |open quote 22:59:59 Bike: | < < < 'monqy 22:59:59 Bike: | ^ 23:00:01 ) < < < 'monqy' 23:00:01 Bike: +---------+ 23:00:02 Bike: |+-------+| 23:00:02 Bike: ||+-----+|| 23:00:02 Bike: |||monqy||| 23:00:02 Bike: ||+-----+|| 23:00:02 Bike: ... 23:00:04 ) i. 10 1 23:00:05 Sgeo: 0 23:00:05 Sgeo: 1 23:00:05 Sgeo: 2 23:00:05 Sgeo: 3 23:00:05 Sgeo: 4 23:00:05 Sgeo: ... 23:00:12 monqy why don't you fit in the box? 23:00:17 is that what i'm supposed to ask you? 23:00:28 no 23:00:35 you're not supposed to ask anyone that 23:00:38 you're not supposed to ask that 23:00:44 ok what am i supposed to ask you then 23:00:47 idk 23:00:53 dammit 23:00:56 ) < < 'asking' 23:00:56 Bike: +--------+ 23:00:56 Bike: |+------+| 23:00:56 Bike: ||asking|| 23:00:56 Bike: |+------+| 23:00:56 Bike: +--------+ 23:01:15 ) (<^:100) 'hi' 23:01:15 Sgeo: +--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ 23:01:16 Sgeo: |+------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+| 23:01:16 Sgeo: ||+----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+|| 23:01:16 Sgeo: |||+--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+||| 23:01:21 -!- noam__ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 23:01:23 Sgeo: ||||+------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+|||| 23:01:23 Sgeo: ... 23:01:30 i concur 23:01:39 wtf 23:01:44 -!- noam__ has joined. 23:01:52 ) (<^:1000) 'x' 23:01:56 i am disappoint at the lack of box drawing characters 23:02:10 hm 23:02:18 sgeo how do we redefine the box printing 23:02:32 Um. At least locally there's a thing to switch it 23:02:46 Any system related stuff is likely in here http://www.jsoftware.com/docs/help701/dictionary/xmain.htm 23:03:01 ) 'are you still there' 23:03:12 elliott......... 23:03:40 good job me 23:03:42 ñó í þhíñœ åé ßhóúøð bé åëíþíñg þhé öëíñþéë fúñ©þíóñß éëbß° íñ Ï ðíëé©þøüç §géó 23:03:46 i blame sgeo for bringing that bot in here 23:03:51 ) 9!:12 '' 23:03:57 so is it frozen in jsoftware too 23:04:49 :t (^:) 23:04:51 Not in scope: `^:' 23:04:51 Perhaps you meant one of these: 23:04:51 `^' (imported from Prelude), `^^' (imported from Prelude), 23:04:59 It is frozen in jsoftware 23:05:04 gj 23:05:10 hex edit the binary 23:05:11 every day 23:05:14 boxes are hard man 23:05:40 There is a thing for execution time limit 23:05:57 -!- jconn has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 23:06:11 rip 23:06:30 good time limit 23:06:45 did i do a bad thing 23:06:46 my local jconsole uses box drawing chars 23:06:53 jealous???????? 23:07:11 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:07:43 @let (^:) fn 0 = id; (^:) fn n = fn (fn ^: (n-1)) 23:07:46 Defined. 23:07:54 what 23:07:57 monqy: yes 23:08:01 Bike: um... 23:08:03 :t (^:) 23:08:05 (Eq a, Num a) => ((a1 -> a1) -> a1 -> a1) -> a -> a1 -> a1 23:08:10 thats not quite right 23:08:14 ok good 23:08:16 @undefine 23:08:22 for a second i thought i did it right and was confused 23:08:29 @let _ ^: 0 = id; f ^: n = f . (f ^: (n-1)) 23:08:30 Defined. 23:08:32 :t (^:) 23:08:33 (Eq a, Num a) => (a1 -> a1) -> a -> a1 -> a1 23:08:56 Can it do infinity? 23:09:06 yes 23:09:07 :t fix 23:09:09 (a -> a) -> a 23:09:29 > (((+) 1) ^: 1000) 9 23:09:32 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 23:09:38 hooray! 23:09:46 ((+) 1) can also be written (1 +) 23:09:49 :t Succ 23:09:50 lambdabot knows where it's at 23:09:51 Not in scope: data constructor `Succ' 23:09:52 :t S 23:09:54 Not in scope: data constructor `S' 23:09:55 :t succ 23:09:56 Enum a => a -> a 23:09:57 eh 23:10:01 :t Just 23:10:01 how can I construct this piece by piece 23:10:03 a -> Maybe a 23:10:04 monqy: i'm trying to get lazy nats 23:10:10 > (Just ^: 1000) 9 23:10:12 oh, lazy nats 23:10:13 :t infinity 23:10:13 Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: 23:10:13 a10 = Data.Maybe.Maybe... 23:10:15 Not in scope: `infinity' 23:10:19 :t Data.Number.Natural.infinity 23:10:21 Data.Number.Natural.Natural 23:10:29 wait where's the infinite type 23:10:35 > (("hi" ++) ^: Data.Number.Natural.infinity) "end" 23:10:37 Not in scope: `Data.Number.Natural.infinity' 23:10:39 nooooo 23:11:08 @src 23:11:08 src . Display the implementation of a standard function 23:11:12 uh 23:11:13 @litas 23:11:13 Unknown command, try @list 23:11:14 @list 23:11:14 http://code.haskell.org/lambdabot/COMMANDS 23:11:20 shouldn't the type be just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just Just 23:11:33 http://code.haskell.org/lambdabot/State/L.hs 23:11:41 how do we get the conaturals from this 23:11:53 Just is not a type 23:12:04 there's an Int at the end there. 23:12:11 elliott: something with Mu and Maybe? 23:12:13 Just ... Int is not a type 23:12:19 Maybe you mean Maybe 23:12:22 fine, that 23:12:41 and then monad laws should fold it to Maybe Int anyway 23:12:47 monqy: that has no Num instance tho 23:12:47 :t Just Just Just 9 23:12:49 The function `Just' is applied to three arguments, 23:12:49 but its type `a0 -> Maybe a0' has only one 23:12:49 In the expression: Just Just Just 9 23:12:50 and (^:) needs Num,Eq 23:12:58 Maybe (Maybe Int) contains information that Maybe Int doesn't 23:13:08 man ugh 23:13:13 :t Just (Just (Just 9)) 23:13:15 Num a => Maybe (Maybe (Maybe a)) 23:13:23 elliott: oh right, ugh 23:13:25 :t Just ^: 3 23:13:26 Occurs check: cannot construct the infinite type: a10 = Maybe a10 23:13:27 Expected type: a10 -> a10 23:13:27 Actual type: a10 -> Maybe a10 23:13:38 elliott: clearly redefine (^:) 23:13:47 monqy: wow thats cheating friend 23:13:48 it's a crappy definition anyway 23:13:50 You can always join it if it's like Maybe (Maybe a), but that doesn't mean it's a good idea 23:13:54 also seriously what's even going on here 23:14:21 oh i have a silly idea 23:14:24 :t Just . Just . Just 23:14:25 a -> Maybe (Maybe (Maybe a)) 23:14:27 > (("hi" ++) ^: var "x") "end" 23:14:29 "hihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihihi... 23:14:33 heheheheheheh 23:14:38 thats too silly 23:14:41 what the fuck is that 23:15:01 i prefer my Mu Maybe just because it doesn't use stupid instances 23:15:15 monqy: by way of lacking the instance we need 23:15:19 yes 23:15:40 :t (1 +) ^: 1000 23:15:41 Num a1 => a1 -> a1 23:15:54 :t 1 + 23:15:55 parse error (possibly incorrect indentation) 23:15:59 :t (1 +) 23:16:00 Num a => a -> a 23:16:14 oh, wait, now i get it. 23:16:17 :t (^:) 23:16:19 (Eq a, Num a) => (a1 -> a1) -> a -> a1 -> a1 23:16:25 what an oddysey that was 23:16:54 :t (****) 23:16:55 Not in scope: `****' 23:16:55 Perhaps you meant one of these: 23:16:55 `***' (imported from Control.Arrow), 23:17:06 how old is that L.hs 23:17:08 so uh 23:17:15 is there any reason this L.hs has Portal jokes in it 23:17:33 :t cake 23:17:35 [[Char]] 23:17:40 nooooo 23:17:51 > text $ concat cake 23:17:53 is that a portal joke? 23:17:54 One 18.25 ounce package chocolate cake mix.One can prepared coconut pecan f... 23:18:09 also 23:18:13 :t fromChuch 23:18:14 Not in scope: `fromChuch' 23:18:21 huh 23:18:26 15:17:04 how old is that L.hs 23:19:08 since (****) is "a lot like" (^:) 23:19:28 but :t couldn't find it?? 23:19:46 :t (!!) 23:19:47 [a] -> Int -> a 23:20:00 > [1..x] 23:20:02 *Exception: not a number 23:20:09 wow that seems like a really weird way to write it but ok 23:20:12 WEAK 23:22:00 @hoogle (****) 23:22:00 No results found 23:22:32 i dont think its a portal joke????? 23:22:37 i never finished portal tho 23:22:40 i think it's the cake recipe from portal 23:23:00 so a portal reference, but not one of the ones that's been run into the ground 23:23:02 > text $ unlines cake 23:23:05 One 18.25 ounce package chocolate cake mix. 23:23:05 One can prepared coconut pecan... 23:23:08 though I think portal references are cool again 23:23:09 but that's just me 23:23:13 NO 23:23:25 > cake !! 14 23:23:27 "Pull and peel licorice." 23:23:37 > cake !! 20 23:23:39 "Fiberglass surface resins." 23:27:32 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 23:40:07 -!- impomatic has left. 23:40:08 -!- impomatic has quit (Quit: impomatic). 23:46:26 -!- impomatic has joined. 23:49:04 I suck at being a wolf 23:49:21 ??? 23:49:45 me too, sgeo. me too 23:50:27 fungot: Be a wolf. 23:50:28 fizzie: the details of a line of the first byte of the kernal clall routine is called to update that pointer, changing the character rom at 49152 ( c000). 23:50:55 I didn't know wolves were so interested in programming. 23:51:06 kernal clal 23:51:08 *clall 23:51:13 ^style 23:51:13 Available: agora alice c64* ct darwin discworld europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack pa qwantz sms speeches ss wp youtube 23:51:22 ah of course 23:51:50 The "clall" bit might be an OCR mishap, I think some of those books were scanned. 23:52:09 Or maybe it's the actual name of the routine. 23:52:59 Indeed, it seems to be. 23:53:15 (It CLoses ALL files.) 23:53:54 monqy: the "kernal" gives it away 23:54:31 haha 23:54:40 im not familiar with c64 style :( 23:54:42 But there are some actual mishaps, like 0's in place of o's, in regular text. (Unless of course it's from a l33t b00k.) 23:55:26 monqy: the c64 has a thing called a "kernal", sort of like how http has "referers" 23:55:32 fungot: Tell me a little bit more about the character ROM. 23:55:33 fizzie: 50 if a or b is set to 1 and setting the character data table is used as a logical file number here. 23:56:00 fungot: shocking 23:56:00 oerjan: 1) call this routine sets up three windows, and 23:56:33 fungot: ...and? 23:56:34 fizzie: in the 23:56:50 fungot: ...in the what? 23:56:51 fizzie: chrin 804, 61783, 65487 ( decimal) 23:57:11 It's like pulling teeth from a hard-to-pull-teeth-from object. 23:57:48 pulling teeth from a rock 23:57:55 i see you are pulling metaphors 23:59:08 I think I found a channel that may tolerate my constant language blather 23:59:14 what is it 23:59:21 yfl 23:59:33 what's a yfl......... 23:59:38 Your Fucking Language? 23:59:57 You Fancy Languages?