00:01:56 -!- nooodl_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 00:02:02 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 00:02:23 -!- nooodl_ has joined. 00:07:07 -!- augur has joined. 00:30:01 -!- kiwi_93423 has quit (Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand-crafted IRC client). 00:31:08 ~yi 00:40:13 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:21:51 > y u no support data 01:21:53 :1:16: parse error on input `data' 01:22:12 i thought it was because statements let bla bla expression bla, bla bla bla bla 01:23:53 Well, @let doesn't take expressions. 01:24:04 @let bike = flip bike 01:24:07 Defined. 01:24:15 @let data Bike = Impossible 01:24:15 Invalid declaration 01:24:45 With @let, it verifies that your declaration is OK and then just sticks it into a file. 01:25:29 I said bla 01:26:06 Bike: People are talking about you in #haskell now 01:26:13 Why do timers in Open Sound Control always use absolute timestamps? I suggest, allow the program using it, to have an option for a specific starting timestamp to cause it to consider it to have that timestamp instead of the actual date/time. 01:27:00 shachaf: why the hell 01:27:12 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 01:27:20 01:24:14 :t bike 01:27:21 Bike: You can blswett for it. 01:28:03 You can indeed blme. 01:28:59 I tried to look at http://www.gutenberg.org/files/308/308-h/308-h.htm 01:29:08 And somehow I got http://shachaf.net/jkj.html 01:29:35 no the pictures 01:30:11 ? 01:30:20 The &ldN dw whspske Tt is aWqeloite pwoe e an,at w,h oneirch ,ne segmedoeohseaseiseo hameen on guilt sbronr w;ereflecte; iaerh& faces od oen ntt we The posInhsioence,dwesdragghe eu0 alm s tohaulh; tlehGladotoho Tt is aWqeloite pur e o but w n thd wn e o but w;une raessqubwas iursur w!>The &ldTwtntor d-d hoalaterhemrres figursg,hf,n,ewce boaa shi od- uitie edo , mougheha rge marsetrscrsteht snbaltrilymm. The &ldBlack lee witeshssg,hdrr y;isuit , .en 01:30:46 lkj looks the same except without pictures 01:30:50 scroll down 01:30:50 jkj 01:31:00 Search for "I was thinking" 01:32:00 deep 01:32:04 i like how it all gets crossed out 01:33:39 And that's what happens when you try to parse HTML using regular expressions. 01:35:03 Did you do that shachaf? 01:35:20 Bike: I just looked at the page in my browser...................................................... 01:35:29 Good. 01:35:34 We can delay the ritual cleansing. 01:36:11 perhaps it got corrupted by shachaf's malignant aura 01:36:17 cleanse immediately 01:36:20 i have a malignant aura? 01:44:47 -!- FreeFull has joined. 01:46:13 monqy: elliott has a malignant aura too now........ 01:46:42 oops 01:46:48 did you do this 01:47:12 yes it's contagious 01:47:22 am i next???? 01:49:34 what about my aura 01:49:47 kmc: aura is a euphemism 01:50:08 kmc: remember how I said you should rejoin #haskell for a day to see what it's like now? 01:50:19 I take it back. it's completely terrible as of now 01:50:36 ok 01:50:43 my judgement is vindicated 01:50:52 it's all shachaf's fault, I think 01:51:55 That's pretty terrible. 01:53:48 what has happened 01:54:30 wait elliott is an op now? 01:54:56 They'll take just anyone these days. 01:55:02 wow 01:59:03 𝐛𝐨𝐥𝐝 𝐭𝐞𝐱𝐭 01:59:07 𝐛𝐨𝐥𝐝 𝐭𝐞𝐱𝐭 01:59:22 I wish that didn't break in screen. :-( 02:00:18 Do you know if any FPGA is available in through-holes? 02:01:37 very unlikely, maybe some simple PLD 02:01:48 but also you can get breakout boards 02:02:06 either specifically for that FPGA or just for the SMT form factor 02:02:24 eg http://microcontrollershop.com/product_info.php?products_id=2811 02:05:03 18:04 > ?src bike 02:05:03 18:04 mueval-core: internal error: PAP object entered! 02:05:03 18:04 (GHC version 7.4.2 fo... 02:05:05 good going Bike 02:05:46 :( 02:05:53 (what is a PAP object, is it like a pap smear) 02:06:36 basically the same thing 02:07:34 (I think it stands for partial application or something.) 02:08:24 http://hackage.haskell.org/trac/ghc/wiki/Commentary/Rts/Storage/HeapObjects#Partialapplications 02:09:08 even though Haskell only has 1-arg functions, for efficiency GHC implements different arities 02:09:29 and even though (f x) would be equivalent to a simple function closure (\y -> f x y) 02:09:32 it's not represented that way 02:09:33 why can't you enter them 02:09:50 how does looking up source enter one 02:09:58 these are fine questions 02:10:09 i think you can't enter them becuase they're known to already be evaluated 02:10:15 but i'm not sure why it should be an error vs. just a no-op 02:11:14 Well, if you can statically guarantee that they're never entered, then making entering one an error seems reasonable to me. 02:11:26 but i don't know why that's a static guarantee 02:11:31 Anyway, in this case there's an implicit param involved -- I think it's a GHC/GHC API bug. 02:11:35 what if I write something like (mod 2) `seq` () 02:11:54 -!- azaq23 has joined. 02:12:01 > (mod 2) `seq` () 02:12:03 () 02:12:04 -!- azaq23 has quit (Max SendQ exceeded). 02:12:09 neato 02:12:18 yeah you can force functions 02:12:22 which is a little weird 02:12:28 it's actually really terrible :( 02:12:40 elliott: well if it weren't allowed, people would just use dumb wrappers 02:12:49 you couldn't just use a dumb wrapper 02:12:57 i guess not 02:13:01 seq on functions is what lets you distinguish _|_ vs. const _|_ 02:13:08 and hence breaks 2389427394872389428934728934728934 quadrillion useful properties 02:13:09 you would also disallow data Fun a b = Fun !(a -> b) 02:13:14 elliott: that's alot 02:13:20 -!- azaq23 has joined. 02:13:45 it's v. useful operationally to allow it tho 02:13:59 what about data Foo a = Foo !a; ... :: Foo (a -> b) 02:14:16 kmc: Well, it makes life harder for people writing optimizers too. 02:14:22 shachaf: well maybe Foo :: (Eval a) => a -> Foo a 02:14:24 Since you can't simplify (\x -> f x) to f, for instance. 02:14:27 "like the good old days" 02:14:33 tru 02:14:43 This ends up being relevant in all sorts of ways. 02:14:45 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 02:15:12 ok can i be dumb for a second, i want to understand why you couldn't simplify (\x -> f x) to f in any situation. 02:15:22 > undefined `seq` () 02:15:23 Bike: consider f = undefined 02:15:24 *Exception: Prelude.undefined 02:15:26 > (\x -> undefined x) `seq` () 02:15:28 () 02:15:47 > :t undefined 02:15:49 :1:1: parse error on input `:' 02:15:54 ... 02:15:54 oh Bike 02:15:56 :t undefined 02:15:57 :t undefined 02:15:57 a 02:15:58 a 02:16:05 ss 02:16:08 undefined is bottom 02:16:17 there's an object in bottom? 02:16:35 ? 02:16:38 not really 02:16:47 'undefined' is denotationally equivalent to an infinite loop 02:16:48 not bottom the type 02:16:49 bottom is a value that inhabits all types. It itself isn't a type. 02:16:56 though there is a bottom type. 02:17:01 > (let x :: Int -> Int; x = x in x) `seq` () 02:17:05 mueval-core: Time limit exceeded 02:17:05 (Void, conventionally; which actually is inhabited (by bottom!) in Haskell) 02:17:14 elliott: Not really! 02:17:14 that seems like a pretty weird value to have 02:17:21 the fact that some undefined terms print an error message rather than melting your CPU is an operational detail 02:17:22 There's only a botton type if you allubtyping. 02:17:27 in fact GHC can detect some infinite loops too 02:17:29 why is elsewhen not a word 02:17:33 I'm going to make it a word 02:17:34 coppro: It is. 02:17:38 shachaf: it is not 02:17:41 Yes it is? 02:17:51 except maybe it is because this is english 02:17:58 You're never going to make it a word with that attitude, coppro. 02:18:04 Bike, it's the same value as the value of an infinite loop (conceptually) 02:18:06 this is madness &c 02:18:47 ฬђ๏ค ๔ย๔є 02:18:50 Sgeo_: I get that. I'm just not used to it being "a thing" in whatever weird-ass sense undefined is a thing. 02:19:12 Bike: It's like a function returning an infinite loop. Except it's a value. 02:19:21 yes but why is it a value 02:19:22 int foo() { return foo(); } 02:19:24 Well, there are things you can't do with it 02:19:36 > undefine 02:19:36 [afk] 02:19:37 > undefined 02:19:39 Not in scope: `undefine' 02:19:39 Perhaps you meant `undefined' (imported from Prel... 02:19:39 can't find file: L.hs 02:19:42 Bike: undefined just throws an exception. 02:19:43 > undefined 02:19:44 You can't compare against it, check for it. f _|_ = 5 means f _ = 5. iiuc 02:19:45 *Exception: Prelude.undefined 02:19:45 it's as simple as that 02:20:06 someone should mention lub at some point 02:20:08 but i gotta go 02:20:20 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Good night). 02:20:26 g'noerjan 02:20:32 lub? 02:21:14 lub is all you need 02:21:40 kmc: Did you see Simon Marlow's book on Parallel and Concurrent Haskell? 02:21:46 "It provides a lub function that is consistent with the unamb operator but has a more liberal precondition. Where unamb requires its arguments to equal when neither is bottom, lub is able to synthesize a value from the partial information contained in both of its arguments, which is useful with non-flat types." 02:21:47 It looks pretty great. 02:23:49 kmc: should they mention that lub is unsafe too 02:24:43 lub presumably uses unsafePeformIO. Pretty sure unamb does, anyway 02:25:01 lub uses unamb 02:28:15 better to have lubbed and ⊥ed than never to have lubbed at all 02:28:16 -!- linuxnewb2 has joined. 02:28:18 "as they say" 02:30:45 * Sgeo_ vaguely wonders if HCSMP is scarier than DayZ, considering that I don't think DayZ does a ban for the month for dying 02:32:17 ฝɦѻค ɗપɗﻉ 02:32:56 > lub 02:32:58 Not in scope: `lub' 02:32:58 Perhaps you meant `nub' (imported from Data.List) 02:33:03 > unamb 02:33:05 Not in scope: `unamb' 02:33:08 > mor 02:33:09 Not in scope: `mor' 02:33:09 Perhaps you meant one of these: 02:33:09 `or' (imported from... 02:33:16 -!- doesthiswork has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 02:33:19 shachaf: true facts 02:33:35 Which facts? 02:34:39 dunno 02:34:41 many of them 02:34:49 i did not know of this book 02:35:17 http://ofps.oreilly.com/titles/9781449335946/index.html 02:55:57 -!- sebbu3 has joined. 02:56:12 -!- sebbu3 has quit (Changing host). 02:56:12 -!- sebbu3 has joined. 02:58:40 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 03:23:56 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 03:28:19 -!- jdvorak has joined. 03:29:09 Hi. What is the purpose of this channel? 03:29:18 hi jdvorak 03:29:19 `welcome jdvorak 03:29:27 jdvorak: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.) 03:29:39 jdvorak: there isn't one 03:29:41 hi jdvorak 03:30:14 Hi everyone. 03:30:14 Are you related to ddvorak? 03:30:27 No, jdvorak is a pen name. 03:30:30 Are you related to this other jdvorak I talked to once? 03:30:32 Oh. 03:30:45 Actually I know of multiple jdvoraks. 03:30:53 * elliott bets jdvorak = John C. Dvorak 03:31:38 is that good or bad 03:31:57 You might know my cousin, Ronald Qwerty. 03:34:46 多分、ディヴォラックさんじゃ。 03:35:24 多 looks cool, like it's being dragged 03:35:45 unfortunately my char thing only knows it as "U+591A", blugh. 03:36:35 🈕 03:39:36 I know nothing of esoteric programming languages. I was thinking about using the channel logs to power a chatterbot, but I'm not sure if that would work well. 03:40:02 APL looks pretty hot though IMHO. 03:40:02 there is already one and it is found quite amusing, so it oughta work 03:40:14 fungot: working now? 03:40:14 Bike: telepathy is just a snake, to stand before the mast, by rudyard kipling) 03:40:22 ^style 03:40:22 Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack* pa qwantz sms speeches ss wp youtube 03:40:28 that's not the right style 03:40:32 Nethack has Kipling in it? 03:40:37 ^style irc 03:40:37 Selected style: irc (IRC logs of freenode/#esoteric, freenode/#scheme and ircnet/#douglasadams) 03:40:44 fungot: do you like cheese..? 03:40:45 jdvorak: and designed the original command set of emacs macros then? how about a length cell followed by that other stuff 03:40:47 fungot, why does Adams even have a channel? 03:40:47 Bike: intel doesn't make cpus like that because they think fnord tastes good. or something. ;p http://www.slengpung.com/ v3/ fnord 03:41:09 This is a weird site. 03:41:10 fungot: i like kosher bacon 03:41:11 jdvorak: the bot's logging still isn't working... ram is merely an implementation detail? 03:41:32 i've said it before and i'll say it again: zzo38_ebooks 03:41:52 zzo38_ebooks is actually just a live twitter feed of everything he says 03:42:08 im craving that ebooks quote now 03:42:10 `quote ebooks 03:42:11 841) fungot, sing me to sleep GreyKnight: 53. file://localhost/ mnt/ space/ media/ books/ 1000+sci-fi%20books/%5bebooks%5d%201000+%20sciencefiction%20%26%20fantasy%20novels%20%28.lit%20forma/ pratchett%2c%20terry/ text/ 14/ fnord This is not a very good song \ 859) i would subscribe to @zzo38_ebooks oh noo 03:42:18 `quote 859 03:42:19 859) i would subscribe to @zzo38_ebooks kmc: I have no ebooks which can subscribe to 03:42:28 ♥ 03:43:16 fungot: cheese NOW 03:43:16 jdvorak: and i have big heat sinks... on the one page before i go on? :) 03:44:19 ^src 03:44:24 ugh what is it 03:44:27 ^help 03:44:27 ^ ; ^def ; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool 03:44:31 Hmm.. I'm not sure if the channel logs for this channel will work well. The conversations in this channel tend to be a bit cryptic. 03:44:37 ^show 03:44:37 echo reverb rev rot13 rev2 fib wc ul cho choo pow2 source help hw srmlebac uenlsbcmra scramble unscramble asc ord prefixes tmp test celebrate wiki chr ha rainbow rainbow2 welcome me tell eval elikoski list 03:44:51 ^show source 03:44:51 (http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98)S 03:44:52 ^elliottski 03:45:02 jdvorak: would your chatterbot be coherent enough for it to matter? 03:45:17 right http://git.zem.fi/fungot/blob/HEAD:/fungot.b98 that's some good code 03:45:18 Bike: making image, item, and prevent it from running, and you can't interpret what that means 03:45:43 i would subscribe to @kmc_ebooks 03:45:46 monqy: I hadn't really thought about it. 03:45:58 are chatterbots ever coherent 03:46:03 is language inherently representational? 03:46:05 coherently constructive chatterbots 03:46:09 it's a question that needs to be answered 03:46:18 The answer is no. 03:46:23 oh 03:46:23 hi shachaf 03:46:28 cool 03:46:31 monqy: is that you disapproving at me 03:46:34 thanks lambdabot i'd been wondering 03:46:45 np 03:46:48 shachaf: :-) 03:47:00 monqy ˙☹˙ 03:47:13 Right now I am running a script to strip all of the license information out of all the public domain Project Gutenberg etexts and downloading Wikipedia. 03:47:31 oh no 03:47:34 are you allowed to do that 03:47:37 wait, does gutenberg have non-public-domain texts? 03:47:49 but then how will you know they're public domain 03:48:02 Yeah, about 20% of them are not public domain. 03:48:08 Bike: gutenberg is dead 03:48:20 and all his copyrights are expired by now 03:48:37 they didn't even have copyrights in the fourteenth century, but anyway what kind of licenses are the other things under 03:48:45 the public domain ones have a message stating that they are copyrighted 03:49:02 In the 14th century almost nobody had books 03:49:10 Copyrights were a rather useless notion 03:49:39 picturing a monk slapping another monk for copying the wrong gospel (motherfucker) 03:49:46 The PG complete works of Shakespeare are copyrighted.... seems a little silly, right? 03:50:01 Oh, right, eternal copyright of the crown or whatever 03:50:13 copyright of the transcriber 03:50:14 kmc: Want another fun game? 03:50:19 gütenbørg would be a good name for a band 03:50:21 shachaf: yes 03:50:21 Oh, this one looks like it might be a mosh bug. 03:50:22 guess that covers KJV and Peter Pan in nobodycaresland 03:51:14 kmc: In irssi, type ˙͜˙ and then repeatedly ^W/^Y it 03:51:17 Inside mosh 03:51:18 Whoever typed in the PG Shakespeare complete works wants royalties if you produce a derivative work. 03:51:32 That's U+02D9 U+035C U+02D9 03:51:40 (Probably works with other sequences too.) 03:51:53 haha shachaf 03:51:59 how did you discover this 03:52:07 is it a mosh bug or an irssi bug or? 03:52:11 what happens 03:52:11 Looks mosh-related. 03:52:13 it seems to be ok here 03:52:14 but i copied 03:52:20 But anyway, I am going to go try to figure out how to program girls' pants zippers. 03:52:23 Doesn't happen to me in plain irssi 03:52:26 elliott: it munches up the prompt 03:52:36 Going to finally get modern Haskell 03:52:43 Take care. 03:52:49 Oh, it's just a combining character thing... 03:53:04 Well, not every character. 03:53:07 jdvorak: ???? 03:53:32 a͜a works too 03:53:46 And a͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜aa͜a works better! 03:53:48 -!- jdvorak has quit (Quit: leaving). 03:53:52 bye jdvorak 03:54:02 bdvorak 03:55:47 Or maybe it's some specific thing about the interaction of mosh and irssi. 03:59:18 -!- Nisstyre has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 04:13:13 -!- Nisstyre has joined. 04:42:56 -!- Frooxius has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 05:03:57 -!- upgrayeddd has changed nick to abumirqaan. 05:10:05 -!- constant has changed nick to trout. 05:11:55 -!- doesthiswork has joined. 05:14:42 -!- TeruFSX has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 05:18:11 -!- tswett has quit (Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.). 05:20:08 -!- tswett has joined. 05:20:08 -!- tswett has quit (Changing host). 05:20:08 -!- tswett has joined. 05:30:41 -!- ogrom has joined. 05:44:26 -!- azaq23 has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 05:59:57 -!- nooodl_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 06:00:41 -!- nooodl_ has joined. 06:22:22 -!- nooodl_ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 06:23:10 * Sgeo_ has some J-like thoughts that might fit better in a dependently typed environment 06:23:28 Mostly because I think it really wants a list in the type 06:31:56 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 06:40:04 -!- ogrom has quit (Quit: Left). 06:46:58 `slist 06:47:00 Sgeo is a jobby 06:47:18 :( 06:47:20 ^list 06:47:20 Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo ThatOtherPerson alot 06:47:28 Did someone vandalise slist? 06:47:49 `help 06:47:49 Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ 06:48:11 Yes, Phantom_Hoover did 06:48:18 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/rev/16641639a4cf 06:48:38 @tell Phanton_Hoover not to vandalize slist 06:48:38 Consider it noted. 06:49:04 wtf is a jobby 06:49:27 `undo 2243 06:49:31 help 06:49:32 patching file slist \ Hunk #1 FAILED at 1. \ 1 out of 1 hunk FAILED -- saving rejects to file slist.rej 06:49:36 how does it even work 06:49:52 `run grep '' slist* 06:49:54 slist.rej:--- slistMon Feb 25 12:50:34 2013 +0000 \ slist.rej:+++ slistSun Feb 24 20:51:34 2013 +0000 \ slist.rej:@@ -1 +1 @@ \ slist.rej:-echo Sgeo is a jobby \ slist.rej:+echo Taneb atriq Ngevd Fiora nortti Sgeo ThatOtherPerson alot 06:50:19 `? jobby 06:50:21 jobby? ¯\(°_o)/¯ 07:03:12 -!- wareya_ has joined. 07:03:15 -!- wareya has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 07:07:38 -!- wareya_ has changed nick to wareta. 07:07:40 -!- wareta has changed nick to wareya. 07:09:28 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 07:25:42 MEENAH: oh my glub the serk twins bein adorbubble again 07:30:45 Is that a real word? 07:30:54 Yes. 07:34:59 Are the words Shakespeare used real words? 07:35:02 What makes a word real? 07:36:04 a word is real if the limit of the geometric mean of its continued fraction's terms is khinchin's constant 07:36:41 -!- oklofok has joined. 07:38:51 Bike: but that's not true for all reals :< 07:39:09 Words aren't numbers, Fiora. 07:39:17 -!- oklopol has quit (*.net *.split). 07:39:17 -!- kallisti has quit (*.net *.split). 07:39:17 -!- iamcal_ has quit (*.net *.split). 07:39:17 -!- pikhq has quit (*.net *.split). 07:39:18 -!- lifthrasiir has quit (*.net *.split). 07:40:11 Sgeo_: Shakespeare isn't real =, so how could he have used real words? 07:40:19 but how can you average words 07:40:20 (Wait, does Sgeo_ still believe in Shakespeare?) 07:40:57 Fiora: Well, words are monoids. 07:40:59 So it's easy. 07:41:04 ^ 07:41:17 -!- kallisti has joined. 07:41:17 -!- kallisti has quit (Changing host). 07:41:17 -!- kallisti has joined. 07:41:32 If words form a field they probably even have continued fraction expansions, huh. 07:41:34 -!- pikhq has joined. 07:41:45 Puzzle: From an alphabet of size 3, generate a string of length n that has no identical consecutive substring. 07:41:57 I.e. no aa or abab, but abcb is allowed. 07:42:01 "b" 07:42:02 done 07:42:09 n = 100 07:42:10 -!- lifthrasiir has joined. 07:42:33 without loss of generality, n = 1 and the answer is "b" 07:42:33 shachaf: is there a clever way 07:42:44 * Sgeo_ wonders if it's even possible... it must be 07:42:51 After all, pi doesn't... erm, hmm 07:42:58 i would just write a program that searches for it 07:43:28 Yes, there's a clever way to do it without backtracking. 07:43:41 ok 07:43:47 (Not that I figured it out, or even understand how it works.) 07:43:50 hm can you even use dynamic programming? probably not since you have to break into 50-50 but also 33-33-34 and 20-20-20-20-20 and so on and so forth 07:43:54 the decimal expansion of pi has an alphabet of size 10, and ... well, parts might repeat locally, but the whole thing doesn't repeat 07:44:03 It was presented to me as a "write a program to search for it" problem. 07:44:14 I should probably figure out the clever way. 07:44:27 Why is the alphabet size three specifically, do you know? 07:44:32 Well, 2 is too small. 07:44:41 And you can do any length string with 3. 07:44:45 mm. 07:44:47 3 is the interesting size for most things ;P 07:44:53 how about 2 and a half 07:44:57 3-SAT, 3-coloring graphs 07:44:58 not real math if you're dealing with numbers over three etc etc 07:45:02 threesomes 07:45:09 monqy makes a good point 07:45:10 2 and a halfsomes??? 07:45:18 Sgeo_: it's called a normal number, but that's not what shachaf asked for 07:45:19 creepy 07:45:24 two and a halfsomes sound quite exciting. 07:45:27 Your alphabet is abᶜ 07:45:34 Is one of the parties dead? Or maybe an albatross. 07:45:39 or a small child :x 07:45:48 That's gross, dude. 07:45:51 maybe it's a bunch of half-people 07:45:56 like, 5 of them 07:46:01 hey it's not my fault there's a popular (terrible) TV show called two and a half men 07:46:12 which is about two dudes and a kid 07:46:13 Is the cocaine guy still on that? 07:46:17 that's the one with the Foodfight! guy in it right 07:46:20 no he died on the way back to his home planet 07:46:25 Perhaps an infinite series of people decreasing in size. 07:46:26 :( 07:46:40 the Foodfight! guy is dead????? 07:46:50 shachaf, so jainist? kinky. 07:46:52 now they have Ashton Kutcher instead 07:47:04 now i am wondering though 07:47:12 if you have a field you can have continued fractions on it right 07:47:27 i don't know who the Foodfight! guy is or what Foodfight! is or what television is or how it's possible for anything to exist 07:47:47 r u ok 07:47:55 yes 07:48:01 k good 07:48:18 Foodfight! is beautiful, a work of art 07:48:29 am i a work of art 07:48:50 if you try hard and believe in yourself you can be anything you want to be 07:49:02 what if i want to be monqy 07:49:05 is that possible 07:49:08 or is it too ambitious 07:49:13 (im trying) 07:49:31 well i didnt have to try at all to be monqy? maybe youre trying too hard 07:51:04 -!- iamcal_ has joined. 07:52:40 oh 07:52:54 monqy: imo you should start a cult 07:53:14 sounds like a bad idea 07:53:19 maybe we should all start cults and see who wins 07:53:22 we can have a metacult 07:53:26 Good thing for a forward thinking entrepeneurial Chinese friendshop monqy to do. 07:54:39 * shachaf suspects miaui is a cheap knockoff of miuaf. 07:55:43 -!- nooga has joined. 08:08:37 -!- augur has joined. 08:09:49 -!- monqy has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 08:10:37 -!- monqy has joined. 08:26:29 -!- hagb4rd|lounge has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 08:31:47 -!- monqy has quit (Quit: hello). 08:48:02 -!- impomatic has quit (Quit: http://about.me/john_metcalf). 08:54:20 -!- Bike has quit (Quit: nope). 09:04:06 -!- FreeFull has quit. 09:04:30 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 10:03:19 Can something be so disordered that any attempt to further disorder it will increase not the amount of disorder, but the amount of order? 10:04:09 Perhaps it depend what kind of order it is supposed to be and isn't? 10:04:20 Or vice versa? 10:14:46 well you can obviously have systems with maximal entropy 10:16:18 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 10:24:07 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has quit (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0/20130215130331]). 10:26:08 -!- oklofok has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 10:41:10 -!- carado has joined. 10:55:08 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 11:08:21 -!- zzo38 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 11:10:56 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 11:30:11 -!- doesthiswork has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 11:51:02 -!- aloril has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 12:03:29 -!- aloril has joined. 12:36:03 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 12:42:18 `help 12:42:18 Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ 12:59:37 -!- TeruFSX has joined. 13:04:27 -!- ais523 has joined. 13:17:23 -!- Arc_Koen has joined. 13:17:28 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has joined. 13:26:48 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 13:27:36 -!- ais523 has joined. 13:33:53 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 13:34:52 -!- ais523 has joined. 13:40:14 -!- KingOfKarlsruhe has left. 13:41:29 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 13:42:12 -!- TeruFSX has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 13:59:28 -!- impomatic has joined. 14:04:47 -!- stuntane has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 14:06:13 -!- ais523 has joined. 14:07:15 help 14:07:19 i'm playing DF again 14:08:31 nooga, go play Frog Fractions 14:10:03 http://twinbeardstudios.com/frog-fractions 14:10:06 (It's a flash game) 14:12:08 -!- ais523 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 14:14:06 -!- stuntaneous has joined. 14:23:36 Skrillex Drops One http://youtu.be/8qIdGkGFMLg 14:25:39 -!- boily has joined. 14:30:59 -!- sirdancealot7 has quit (Quit: KEEP SPARKS. FLAME AWAY.). 14:40:09 Sgeo_, when i first saw the name i thought it was frog factions 14:40:22 and i thought it was going to be some sort of frog-themed grand strategy game 14:41:40 well it kind of is 14:44:54 -!- sebbu has joined. 14:45:09 -!- sebbu has quit (Changing host). 14:45:09 -!- sebbu has joined. 14:47:38 -!- sebbu3 has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 14:54:23 -!- doesthiswork has joined. 14:54:43 Can I argue that no random generate can exist which generates uniformly distributed random numbers in the range 0..Infinity? 14:55:15 Because the probability of a number to occur would each be 1/Infinity ~= 0 => no number actually occurs 14:59:19 that's not really what probability 0 means 14:59:30 if you throw a dart at a dartboard, the probability of hitting the spot you do hit is zero 15:00:17 though you can use this to argue that the continuum is a ridiculous concept 15:00:37 assume a perfectly circular dartboard 15:01:23 assume a perfectly spherical dartboard 15:01:54 "assume a spherical dartboard in simple harmonic motion, in a vacuum..." 15:06:02 -!- stuntaneous has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 15:11:16 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 15:13:26 -!- Taneb has joined. 15:16:52 I need to learn how to money 15:17:23 "I don't know monetary stuff that well" is probably a signal to companies meaing "We don't have to pay a decent salary at all" 15:17:37 Take nightclasses? 15:19:36 imo ask kmc for advice 15:19:51 why are you telling them that 15:21:06 Because they're asking how much I'm looking for 15:21:11 And I don't have an answer 15:21:32 well you should research an answer 15:21:45 this is an entry level software job, in what area of the world? 15:21:49 -!- Frooxius has joined. 15:21:54 New York 15:22:08 Actually, person said it was a Junior developer position 15:22:15 $50K 15:22:19 ask for $110,000 15:22:26 you probably won't get it 15:22:41 i don't know about NY but the average salary in SF area is now $120k 15:22:47 and NY ain't cheap either 15:23:02 kmc is a lot more optimistic than I am 15:23:16 $50k is a pittance for programmers 15:23:30 The figure they mentioned is lower than that :( 15:23:36 well fuck them then 15:23:37 Although they said something about bonuses 15:23:40 unless you think you can't get a higher paying job 15:23:44 Sgeo_ is this a finance job 15:23:49 wait, is this Jane St? 15:23:53 Not Jane St 15:24:03 this sounds like a horrible scam 15:26:19 Taneb, how the fuck are you so worldly-wise about programmer wages in america... 15:26:41 I googled "new york average entry-level salary" 15:26:42 And I am starting to think I can't get a higher paying job 15:27:00 Taneb, for, like, any profession? 15:27:02 how many have you interviewed with? 15:27:12 I haven't actually gotten any interviews yet. 15:27:13 Yes, Phantom_Hoover 15:27:17 Sgeo_ 15:27:24 no 15:27:39 you can't say that you can't get a job if you haven't interviewed 15:27:44 how many have you applied to? 15:27:53 If I can't get an interview, how could I get a job? 15:27:54 are you getting rejected before the interview stage? 15:27:59 I've applied to a bunch 15:28:01 And pretty much 15:28:01 ok 15:28:05 maybe i misunderstood then 15:28:10 how many is "a bunch" 15:28:29 here you get about 1200/month and that should make you happy :D 15:28:34 I don't remember offhand. I should start keeping track of every application 15:28:36 that's euros 15:28:59 where's 'here' 15:29:07 for *entry* level, 1200 are considered much 15:29:09 Greece 15:29:20 15:29:27 the US programmer salaries are silly and bubbly but that's what they are 15:29:31 what state ? :D 15:29:52 Apparently only applied to 3 via LinkedIn. I remember more. 15:29:58 Let me see how many via Dice 15:30:16 Sgeo_: if you're going to take a crappy job, make sure there's nothing in your contract preventing you from leaving later 15:30:20 i.e. noncompete clause 15:30:29 -!- ais523 has joined. 15:30:31 kmc, istr people saying we were in the middle of a second dot com bubble, like, two years ago 15:30:33 common in NY finance especially 15:30:37 Phantom_Hoover: yep 15:30:49 2 on Dice.com within the last 180 days 15:30:53 And iirc 4 on CyberCoders 15:31:04 also the overpaid web brogrammers are driving everyone else out of SF by raising rents 15:31:04 kmc, good advice 15:31:06 thanks 15:31:08 it pretty much sucks 15:31:08 this was shortly after someone paid a tonne of cash for twitter when it was making a massive loss 15:31:32 Remember Vark.com 15:31:44 no... 15:31:47 is that the joke 15:32:06 http://www.jerkcity.com/jerkcity554.html 15:32:15 Phantom_Hoover, I misremembered the name 15:33:06 what was the actual name 15:33:13 Question-and-answer site that Google bought out and subsequently discontinued 15:34:15 have google actually succeeded in any of their Big New Ventures lately 15:34:38 :) 15:34:53 wasn't cybercoders a scam ? 15:34:54 in 10 years SF will be full of former brogrammers who are now flipping burgers and picking up trash and doing all the shitty jobs that actually make a city work 15:35:09 your garbage man will solicit you for angel investment in his shitty iphone app 15:35:10 c00kiemon5ter: there is actually exactly one website that isn't a scam 15:35:14 but I haven't figured out which one it is yet 15:35:19 heh 15:35:26 Have I completely made up vark.com 15:35:32 Taneb, apparently not 15:35:33 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 15:35:44 Taneb: I think it's funnier not to find out 15:36:11 It was kind of like a stackoverflow of EVERYTHING 15:36:17 ais523: haha, this B scam is fantastic 15:36:18 It was written inn Ruby on Rails 15:36:23 elliott: indeed 15:36:28 Taneb: do you mean um... quora? 15:36:39 isn't stackexchange kind of like a stackoverflow of everything? 15:36:43 no, he means vark.com, aka aardvark 15:36:45 apparently 15:37:00 YES, that was it 15:37:27 vark.com gives absolutely no relevant hits on google, which is fairly telling 15:38:09 ais523: has this been a while in the making? 15:38:26 elliott: the B scam? I think Wooble just came up with it out of nowhere 15:38:43 I don't think it's possible to come up with it unless you're really cynical 15:38:49 ais523: it's just, there's been a few posts in B out of nowhere the past few days 15:38:51 -!- nooga has joined. 15:38:53 along with G.'s motion in Agora 15:39:01 yeah 15:39:06 they are indeed out of nowhere, as far as I can tell 15:39:09 isn't woobl that guy you hate 15:39:12 but as soon as one starts, people are reminded of b 15:39:31 Phantom_Hoover: Wooble's like some sort of snark elemental 15:39:33 Phantom_Hoover: wooble is that guy who hates everyone 15:39:38 he just exists to make snarky comments about things 15:39:56 ais523: no, he also deregisters 15:39:57 elliott, yes but you even wrote a poem about how much you hated him! 15:40:12 I... did? 15:40:19 don't answer that 15:40:22 I choose to believe it is true regardless 15:40:36 I have posted a message to the public forum explicitly stating my wish to become a player more recently than I last forfeited the game. 15:40:44 err, that's missing a 15:40:56 anyway, it's hard to believe, because I thought Wooble was platonically forfeiting at every possible moment 15:41:12 also he spelled your name wrong 15:41:20 given that this is B, that quite possibly matters 15:41:30 yes, I mentioned that on the list 15:41:37 B is kind of like the formal logic version of nomic 15:41:44 to Agora's law 15:47:10 I wonder if we made a nomic how long it would last 15:48:05 "Fun fact: If you have garbage collector, it may swoop in the middle of swapping and release your memory under your feet." 15:48:07 da fuck? 15:48:13 http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/19941q/swap_two_variables_without_using_a_temp_variable/c8lwvjv 15:48:38 if you are storing pointers 15:48:44 yeah, if you're swapping two pointers 15:48:50 and you're running the gc in a different thread for some reason 15:48:57 and you're using a conservative GC 15:48:59 interesting 15:49:07 conservative GC also can't deal with e.g. XOR linked list 15:50:17 XOR linked lists make me feel really uneasy 15:50:42 conservative GC makes me feel really uneasy 15:50:45 yep 15:51:42 yeah 15:51:45 they're /both/ awkward ideas 15:52:57 the standard Ruby interpreter uses a conservative GC :( :( :( 15:53:36 a conservative GC for a C program, which happens to be a Ruby interpreter 15:53:54 Wouldn't a conservative GC make lots of space leaks 15:53:56 well the standard ruby interpreter does a great many things 15:54:03 -!- GOMADWarrior has joined. 15:54:13 kind of a pain to write C extensions with a precise GC though 15:54:29 ruby does call/cc by copying the C stack btw 15:54:29 Taneb: on 32-bit arches especially 15:55:16 conservative GCs can't do any sort of interesting memory operations other than deallocation, can they? 15:55:30 because they can't change pointers because they don't know whether they're pointers 15:55:41 think that's correct 15:55:49 so they can't fix heap fragmentation 15:55:54 elliott: btw, what do you think of OCaml-style GCs? they work like conservative GCs but the runtime agrees not to use certain integers 15:56:00 so that if those bit patterns are found, they're definitely pointers 15:58:01 that's just standard tagging, no? 15:59:16 part of what makes that work is that 'normal' code can't do things like XOR linked lists 15:59:37 the language has opaque references but not pointers 15:59:37 elliott: yeah but I like that way of describing it better :) 16:00:42 I wonder how ocaml does arrays 16:00:45 now i want to write an Acme.XorLinkedList module for Haskell 16:00:47 just to horrify people 16:01:31 yesss 16:01:32 do it 16:08:10 did you know SPARC has instructions for pointer tagging 16:08:44 -!- cuttlefish has joined. 16:09:30 kmc: like, an addressing mode that ignores tags when using a pointer? 16:09:59 "Performs the addition of rs1 and op2, using two’s complement arithmetic, storing the result into rd. Trap if either of the source operands’ low-order two bits are not zero" 16:10:57 they call these 'tagged arithmetic' instructions 16:11:26 CPU trap on dynamic type error :) 16:11:53 oh wow! 16:12:08 I guess the inverse would be trapping on using a non-pointer as an address 16:12:27 you can do that too but you have to use the high order bits ;) 16:12:40 ... oh true, paging and things 16:12:58 actually 16:13:03 SPARC enforces alignment doesn't it 16:13:12 so that's built in and always enabled :) 16:13:18 beautiful 16:13:27 genius 16:13:33 well but that's backwards then :/ 16:13:46 ... yeah, I guess normally integers don't get a tag right 16:13:46 if the arithmetic instruction also wants the low bits to be zero 16:13:47 damn 16:13:49 or er, are zero 16:14:00 oops. there goes that one 16:14:08 maybe we can make a chip that can only do unaligned loads 16:14:10 and traps on aligned loads 16:14:42 "The UltraSPARC III - A magical mystery tour" 16:14:45 i must read this immediately 16:15:29 "address space identifier" that's... huh o_O 16:16:04 configurable branch delay slots? O_O 16:16:44 14 stage pipeline o_O 16:16:58 "Direct call – 30-bit address in instruction" <-- so they must have been like, okay whatever we're using 25% of the entire instruction space for call 16:17:09 Fiora: yeah, I guess it just lets you use a single bit rather than 32 bits for a NOP after the branch 16:17:32 14 stages sounds like a lot, but I don't really know 16:17:38 is it in-order? 16:17:46 thinking about designing a CPU with more than 2 stages makes my head spin ;P 16:17:47 yes 16:17:49 I guess it probably would be 16:18:02 I guess I'm thinking of modern chips which have like, 14-25 stage pipelines 16:18:14 the atom is 16 apparently 16:18:16 that's insane 16:18:19 i did not know 16:18:46 core 2 is 14, sandy bridge is ~16-19 (I don't think the specifics are public) 16:19:09 oh I see, variable pipeline length 16:19:21 bulldozer is like... 22 16:20:06 I think pipelines have been around that depth for a loooong time now 16:20:12 interesting 16:20:18 what are all the stages? 16:20:37 * Fiora looks up some others. cortex a9 is 8-11 stages, cortex a8 is ~14 (?) 16:21:23 * kmc knows so little about how computers actually work 16:21:43 * Fiora tries to find some diagrams and things... 16:21:59 i understand the basic 5 stage RISC pipeline 16:22:05 instruction fetch 16:22:12 though it's extremely unlikely I could design one with all the bypasses and whatever 16:22:26 instruction predecode (figure out instruction length, might be done in the fetch unit, might be a separate stage, etc) 16:22:32 instruction decode 16:22:48 instruction fetch, instruction decode, lunch break 16:22:54 then there's an instruction queue and the microcode system to split up things into multiple uops 16:22:59 memory fetch, tea & crumpets 16:23:06 and allocating registers from the renamer and stuff 16:23:09 mm 16:23:20 so is the rest of the pipeline a pipeline for uops 16:23:25 then stuff gets sent to the scheduler which dispatches uops around 16:23:38 http://docs.notur.no/uit/archive/HPCiA07/hpcia07-documents/intel-tools-tutorial/1.%20Core%20Architecture.pdf 16:23:42 page 10 of this? 16:23:51 Yeah, I think the rest is for uops 16:23:55 isn't it cool that basically every part of a computer system contains a scheduler and a storage manager somewhere 16:24:08 it really is 16:25:21 I remember reading that the 'bottleneck' for modern pipelines (i.e. limiting factor for speed) is often things like "select the first 4 executable instructions from a 40-long queue" 16:25:28 "Trade off LSD with conventional loop unrolling" 16:25:47 interesting 16:26:04 http://processors.wiki.ti.com/index.php/Cortex-A8_Architecture#Cortex-A8_Pipeline_Diagram 16:26:10 okay ARM's diagram is a gazillion times better 16:26:16 this one's an in-order chip too. 16:26:21 kmc: snicker snicker lsd, etc. 16:26:24 Non-IEEE FP? 16:26:52 I'm... guessing it has like, a slow fallback mode for denormals and things? <_> 16:26:52 WUT? that's possible? 16:27:05 the playstation 2 had non-IEEE FP! 16:27:52 Hey, what VPN software should I use? 16:28:08 it had a FLOAT_MIN/FLOAT_MAX (no infinity), and no denormals, and all operations were saturating 16:28:11 it was kinda cool 16:28:39 -!- azaq23 has joined. 16:28:42 neat 16:28:52 -!- azaq23 has quit (Max SendQ exceeded). 16:29:01 this has the 'upside' of contributing to making it incredibly obnoxious to emulate... XD 16:31:52 Fiora: interesting to know :) 16:32:09 (there's a bunch of other reasons that it's hard that I could ramble about but... ) 16:32:19 tswett: openvpn. the one, the only, the open, the other qualifiers that begin with "o". 16:32:33 kmc: oh um... I think a lot of operations on CPUs nowadays can have multiple cycle latency which is one way the pipeline gets longer. 16:32:34 PPP over SSH 16:32:42 like simd multiplies are 5 cycles on sandy bridge 16:32:44 kmc: you can do that? 16:32:48 `addquote Hey, what VPN software should I use? tswett: openvpn. the one, the only, the open, the other qualifiers that begin with "o". 16:32:52 970) Hey, what VPN software should I use? tswett: openvpn. the one, the only, the open, the other qualifiers that begin with "o". 16:32:54 tswett: i've done it, not a serious suggestion though 16:33:06 you can find various articles about it 16:33:28 Fiora: not bad, but then, neither excellent. 16:33:38 they used to be 3 :< 16:33:48 You know that SK calculus interpreter I wrote yesterday? 16:33:59 I'm translating it into C 16:34:06 they've come up with some interesting ways to reduce the effective pipeline length I think, like, maybe it was starting with nehalem or something but they added the ability for the cpu to go in and cancel uops after a branch misprediction 16:34:10 Help me 16:34:46 Taneb: godspeed you 16:34:49 so if it knows the branch mispredicts early, like the comparison for the branch doesn't have many dependencies or something, it can go in and toss all the uops from the mispredicted path and save lots of resources 16:35:08 iirc it helps double with hyperthreading, since that makes it easier for the cpu to keep doing something 16:36:43 ~yi 16:36:44 Your divination: "Dwelling People" to "Dwelling People" 16:37:01 Taneb: tough luck with your C-slation. 16:38:06 ~yi 16:38:07 Your divination: "Corrupting" to "Corrupting" 16:38:11 o no 16:38:15 ~yo 16:38:15 --- Possible commands: dice, duck, echo, eval, fortune, metar, ping, yi 16:38:18 ~yi 16:38:19 Your divination: "Gnawing Bite" to "Abounding" 16:38:25 that sounds good! 16:38:31 * Fiora sorry for rambling, cpu architecture is fun <.< 16:38:48 branch prediction scares me 16:39:00 i too think it is fun 16:39:38 what if one day, the branches start predicting... us 16:39:50 Phantom_Hoover: they already do. 16:39:59 :A 16:40:21 holy shit i just realised, that's some sort of bird smiley 16:41:04 I like the whole branch prediction hash table thing 16:41:05 :{ 16:41:09 :} 16:41:30 :N 16:41:35 brunch prediction 16:41:59 Fiora: what's that? 16:42:25 branch prediction is one of the things that companies are really secretive about nowadays so I don't know much but 16:42:57 from what I remember hearing, modern intel chips keep a sort of hash table based on the location of the branch, some history information like the call stack, and so on 16:43:09 kmc: P(brunch) ~ Pois(7) 16:43:46 fish for brunch 16:44:16 so like I guess it effectively contains the X thousand most common combinations or whatevers 16:44:27 -!- carado has joined. 16:44:34 so how many operating systems are we running at any given time 16:44:40 since evidently CPUs have one now 16:44:53 and a lot of VMs basically count, especially ones with userspace threading 16:45:06 browsers are operating systems 16:45:11 that too yes 16:45:15 though you can argue that falls under VM 16:45:18 sure 16:45:28 but I guess the JS operating system they have is almost a separate thing to the whole multiple processes thing they do 16:46:33 and of course only the tragically un-hip use software without virtualization 16:46:43 so you have a VM hypervisor in there too 16:46:52 kmc are you going to start complaining about other people again... 16:47:00 I'm running some free android emulator thing to play android games <.< 16:47:19 Phantom_Hoover: are you going to start complaining about me too 16:47:37 this is getting uncomfortably meta 16:47:59 -!- sebbu has changed nick to sebbu2. 16:48:26 -!- azaq23 has joined. 16:48:37 i like kmc complaining 16:48:47 helps towards my gda of 10 complaints / day 16:49:23 you can approximate kmc's brunches and complaints by a skellam distribution. 16:50:52 brunch sounds excellent. i haven't eaten today 16:52:20 * boily runs to the nearest nutritionist grave to strap a dynamo to it 16:54:00 kmc: can you upgrade esolangs.org's mediawiki installation for me. 16:54:09 what do nutritionists have to say about brunch 16:54:39 no elliott 16:55:22 can you answer that question differently 16:55:28 no 16:56:17 you're awful 16:56:21 quintopia: that's the point, I don't know. I need a simple way to measure the nutritio-zombo-electromagnetic force of a random brunch. 16:56:23 terrible 16:56:25 possibly the worst 16:56:35 "Benedict XVI to Keep His Name and Become Pope Emeritus" 16:57:00 haha what 16:57:03 good 16:57:10 apparently this is what happens if the pope resigns 16:57:23 boily: are you sure you aren't measuring a brunch of convenience? 16:57:46 quintopia: dunno. lunchtime. be back in an hour or so... 16:57:51 Phantom_Hoover: haha, the weather forecaster on TV just brought up a weather map with only two temperatures showing: 3 in the midlands, and 17 in the scottish highlands 16:57:58 -!- c00kiemon5ter has left. 16:58:12 the rest of the weather has stopped 16:58:28 apparently England doesn't even get to console itself with "at least Scotland's weather is even worse" any more 16:59:56 ais523: OTOH, Scotland's everything else is worse 17:00:15 doesn't it have a better education system? 17:00:37 Scotland's education system is like Harry Potter's 17:01:33 Taneb: there are many ways to interpret that analogy, but I can't make any of them work 17:02:31 ais523, high school until age of 17 instead of 18 17:03:30 I didn't even know that was true about Harry Potter 17:03:36 it's not the most obvious detail of the books 17:03:45 also they're all wizards 17:05:38 we do actually get taught maths and english in scottish schools, so that's different 17:06:24 Phantom_Hoover: we don't get taught scottish in english schools 17:06:39 that was by analogy to hogwarts 17:06:46 oh 17:07:33 We do get taught magic, though 17:08:12 Taneb: who's "we" here? 17:08:19 The English 17:08:21 ah 17:08:40 Hexham isn't quite north enough to be in Scotland 17:08:45 * ais523 wonders when the last time an english/scottish flamewar happened 17:08:49 probably on Wikipedia 17:09:01 Taneb: yeah, I know, but I was wondering if it was "all northeners" or some concept like that 17:09:07 i remember there being a really pointless edit war on wikipedia 17:09:16 hmm… we should find someone here from London, so we can mock them 17:09:18 Phantom_Hoover: that happens a lot 17:09:23 over how ireland was referred to in the article 'rock pool life of the british isles' 17:09:48 was this the "british and irish isles" thing, or something else? 17:09:58 i made a really excellent pun based on a christy moore song about it but i don't think anyone truly appreciated it 17:10:40 Was it referred to as "The land of the bloody catholic splitters"? 17:10:51 Because I could see why that would be controversial 17:10:57 It leaves out Northern Ireland 17:11:16 Taneb: … 17:11:39 i don't think that would be it 17:12:15 (also apparently at least one of the more important iras was marxist! i find this strangely interesting) 17:12:21 ais523: using the unicode one makes you impossible to take seriously, btw 17:12:35 elliott: I do it out of habit 17:12:42 well 17:12:45 even when it breaks people's backends that don't understand non-ASCII encodings 17:12:48 also being ais523 makes you impossible to take seriously 17:12:59 you know the logs still show you using unicode ellipses elliott 17:13:08 on the rare occasions I use Windows, I end up turning caps lock on a lot by mistake 17:13:08 …...…...…...…...…...…... 17:13:16 and off almost as often, although mostly intentionally 17:13:28 kmc: wow pretty 17:13:37 elliott: are you using a fixed-width font? 17:14:00 elliott, just out of curiosity, are you connected to Clan El[l]iot[t] at all? 17:14:07 ais523: yes 17:14:09 Taneb: I have no idea 17:14:18 elliott, research your family tree! 17:14:38 Taneb: what regex-like format uses [] to mean "maybe what's in the square brackets"? 17:14:46 Taneb: I hear there's a haskell program for that 17:14:49 i like how the wp article on clan elliott can't make its mind up about how to spell it 17:14:51 ais523, when did I say it's regex 17:15:06 Taneb: you didn't, and I don't expect it to be, I said "regex-like" for a reason 17:17:46 i also like how there's apparently a newcastleton in the borders 17:17:58 Yeah, I think I've been there 17:18:02 There isn't much there 17:19:12 Taneb: now I'm imagining a field with a few stones in it 17:19:18 and a collapsing hut 17:19:49 Apparently it's new (castleton), not newcastle (ton) 17:20:36 "The Elliotts, with the Armstrongs, were the most troublesome of the great Scottish Border families in the Middle Ages." 17:20:48 sounds like elliott all right 17:21:39 -!- Taneb has quit (Quit: AWAY). 17:22:08 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 17:26:43 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 17:27:07 -!- nooga has joined. 17:30:28 > (209/50,218/50) 17:30:29 (4.18,4.36) 17:30:56 > 50*4.5343 17:30:57 226.715 17:35:52 btw, I think I got into an argument with an Apple fanboy on rgrn, of all places 17:36:28 I've mostly stopped now, when their argument reached the level of "there's no such thing as a free development environment because you still have to buy a computer to run it on2 17:36:31 s/2/"/ 17:40:29 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:40:41 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 17:43:09 -!- impomatic has left. 17:45:32 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:45:44 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 17:45:57 ais523: lol 17:46:57 haha 17:51:47 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 17:51:53 `pastelog horizontal 17:52:01 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 17:52:24 No output. 17:52:34 `pastelog vertical 17:52:37 -!- sirdancealot7 has joined. 17:52:39 this seems unlikely 17:52:57 `quote horizontal 17:53:02 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.5219 17:53:05 No output. 17:53:30 What I love is that the pastelog vertical includes log lines with horizontal in them. 17:53:55 (FYI, it probably timed out) 17:54:00 ais: I, too, would be agitated if I spent $2000 on a computer to play slaves to armok 17:54:27 :/ 17:54:33 Gregor: any way to avoid that? 17:54:47 `run file bin/pastelog 17:54:48 bin/pastelog: POSIX shell script text executable 17:54:52 I could up the timeout limit X-D 17:54:54 `cat bin/pastelog 17:54:55 ​#!/bin/sh \ cd /var/irclogs/_esoteric \ \ pasterandom() { \ if [ "$1" -gt 150 ]; then \ echo "No." \ exit \ fi \ for i in $(seq "$1"); do \ file=$(shuf -en 1 ????-??-??.txt) \ echo "$file:$(shuf -n 1 $file)" \ done | paste \ } \ \ if [ "$1" ]; then \ if expr "$1" + 0 >/dev/null 2>&1; then \ 17:55:16 Then what, fungot? 17:55:17 Jafet: fnord ' who's me?' and actually read that ' watcom' 17:55:25 I don't think that's how it goes. 17:58:21 what the fuck 17:58:23 why is shuf in there? 17:58:41 Was "Then what, fungot" supposed to rhyme? 17:58:42 Gregor: there's just common standards. they do not end up coding bash/ python background. the updates rarely took more than a power failure. 17:58:55 why isn't it just grep? 17:59:12 Don't ask me, I didn't write it. 17:59:16 That's the beauty of HackBot. 17:59:23 how do I write a new script again? 17:59:39 It's Unix. You Unix. 18:00:39 `run timeout 3 echo ':-)' 18:00:41 coppro how do you still not know how HackEgo works... 18:00:43 ​:-) 18:00:49 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:01:06 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 18:01:11 Jafet: The timeout is 30 seconds. 18:01:11 Phantom_Hoover: quotation marks are hard 18:01:25 coppro: So pastebin it and `fetch 18:01:37 `cat bin/fetch 18:01:38 cat: bin/fetch: No such file or directory 18:01:43 `fetch is magic. 18:01:47 `run sed -i... -e 's/grep/timeout 25 grep/' bin/pastelog 18:01:53 No output. 18:01:57 Jafet: lol, nice of you. 18:02:08 `pastelog horizontal 18:02:30 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.28302 18:02:39 Gregor: how does `fetch work? 18:02:45 coppro: It fetches a URL. 18:02:47 filename url? other way around? 18:02:57 Just URL, it'll write it to whatever name it feels is appropriate. 18:03:01 `fetch http://pastebin.com/dkVb20VL 18:03:01 You have to Unix it into place after that. 18:03:10 2013-02-26 18:03:09 URL:http://pastebin.com/dkVb20VL [12720] -> "dkVb20VL" [1] 18:03:20 `cat dkVb20VL 18:03:22 ​ 18:03:25 I wonder if you can exploit the name it picks 18:03:27 you suck 18:03:44 `rm bin/pastelog... 18:03:47 No output. 18:03:49 elliott: Idonno, can you make wget choose to name a file ../../../../etc/passwd or something? 18:03:56 Gregor: yeah that's what I'm wondering 18:04:05 coppro: that script is a bad idea btw 18:04:08 elliott: why? 18:04:09 If wget fetches one file, it uses the basename 18:04:11 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Client Quit). 18:04:14 ls /var/irclogs/_esoteric to see one reason why 18:04:18 (unless you're dumb enough to tell it not to) 18:04:22 `ls /var/irclogs/_esoteric 18:04:23 2003-01-18-raw.txt \ 2003-01-18.txt \ 2003-01-19-raw.txt \ 2003-01-19.txt \ 2003-01-20-raw.txt \ 2003-01-20.txt \ 2003-01-21-raw.txt \ 2003-01-21.txt \ 2003-01-22-raw.txt \ 2003-01-22.txt \ 2003-01-23-raw.txt \ 2003-01-23.txt \ 2003-01-24-raw.txt \ 2003-01-24.txt \ 2003-01-25-raw.txt \ 2003-01-25.txt \ 2003-01-26-raw.txt \ 2003-01-26.txt \ 2003-01- 18:04:30 oh 18:04:35 anyway 18:04:37 `cat bin/pastelogs 18:04:38 ​#!/bin/sh \ cd /var/irclogs/_esoteric \ \ pasterandom() { \ if [ "$1" -gt 150 ]; then \ echo "No." \ exit \ fi \ for i in $(seq "$1"); do \ file=$(shuf -en 1 ????-??-??.txt) \ echo "$file:$(shuf -n 1 $file)" \ done | paste \ } \ \ if [ "$1" ]; then \ if expr "$1" + 0 >/dev/null 2>&1; then \ 18:04:42 should do what you want 18:04:44 why the fuck is shuf there? 18:04:45 `url bin/pastelogs 18:04:46 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/bin/pastelogs 18:04:53 well if you read the script you will see 18:05:02 no, I don't 18:05:03 `run diff -u bin/pastelog{,s} 18:05:05 ​--- bin/pastelog2013-02-26 18:01:52.000000000 +0000 \ +++ bin/pastelogs2013-02-13 16:28:35.000000000 +0000 \ @@ -16,7 +16,7 @@ \ if expr "$1" + 0 >/dev/null 2>&1; then \ pasterandom "$1" \ else \ - lines=$(timeout 25 grep -P -i -- "$1" ????-??-??.txt | head -n 301) \ + lines=$(grep -P -i -- "$1" ????-??-??.txt 18:05:10 well read more closely then 18:05:11 I don't understand 18:05:11 ~yi 18:05:11 Your divination: "Humbling" to "Limping" 18:05:15 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/bin/pastelogs 18:05:16 Yup. 18:05:23 why the script does anything that is not grepping the logs 18:05:51 anyway 18:05:53 `pastelogs 120 18:05:53 `pastelogs horizontal 18:05:57 because that ^ 18:06:10 that's ununixy 18:06:55 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.2874 18:07:03 http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/index.cgi/raw-file/tip/paste/paste.14865 18:07:34 well what is unixy is just using grep yourself 18:07:36 it is a convenience script 18:09:28 `run diff --suppress-common-lines bin/pastelog{,s} 18:09:33 19c19 \ < lines=$(timeout 25 grep -P -i -- "$1" ????-??-??.txt | head -n 301) \ --- \ > lines=$(grep -P -i -- "$1" ????-??-??.txt | head -n 301) 18:09:47 what, they're not symlinked? 18:09:49 I blame Gregor 18:10:06 `run rm bin/pastelogs && ln -s pastelog bin/pastelogs 18:10:10 No output. 18:16:56 -!- impomatic has joined. 18:17:53 if the probability of an event A to occur is p, then the probability of it occuring n-times in a row decreases 18:18:08 however, as in the above case: If the probability of event A is zero 18:18:30 does that mean that it appearing once is as much likely as it appearing 1mio. times in a row? 18:18:36 Or is that also wrong? 18:19:14 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 18:19:15 yes, it's right? 18:19:19 That's true, but you missed the other corner case: If the probability of an event A occurring (within some timespan) is 100%, then the probability of it occurring n times in a row does not decrease, it's also 100%. 18:19:35 > 50*4.361 18:19:36 218.04999999999998 18:19:57 Gregor, well it does decrease if you use the non-strict definition 18:20:00 Gregor: Yes, but that edgecase seems more natural. 18:20:26 You would assume that something very unlikely to happen twice in a row would be even less unlikely 18:20:51 I guess if you define "as likely" as meaning "having the same probability", then yeah. 18:21:04 -!- Bike has joined. 18:21:07 Though I wouldn't quite assume that it wouldn't be even less likely for the event to happen twice in a row. 18:21:10 That assumes, by the way, that P is independent. 18:21:14 mroman, you didn't say 'very unlikely' 18:21:18 you said 'impossible' 18:21:26 probability 0 is not impossible Phantom_Hoover 18:21:28 i.e., there are some events which are more probable to happen twice than once. 18:21:33 If an event is impossible, then the occurrence of the event twice in a row isn't double impossible. It's just plain impossible. 18:21:45 I'm aware that p = 0 does not mean it's impossible. 18:21:52 elliott, how dangerously nonconstructive of you 18:21:54 that's why i said Phantom_Hoover 18:22:02 but I thought the probability of all events should be zero 18:22:14 Oh dear, are we playing with infinitesimals >_> 18:22:20 but sum_{i=0)^{infinity}(1/infinity) is not 1 18:22:29 not to the math I know. 18:22:39 toot 18:22:41 That's the actual confusing part. 18:22:59 mroman, what even is that notation 18:23:09 Pseudo-LaTeX. 18:23:13 LaTeX 18:23:18 if you ignore the wrong bracket ;) 18:23:21 oh wait right 18:23:32 well it depends on what you mean by infinity 18:23:34 imo cauchy distribution 18:23:38 it's not really latex in that you don't want / or infinity there 18:23:43 or "sum" 18:23:53 best distribution 18:23:54 yeah 18:23:58 LaTeX would be \infty 18:23:58 Yeah, "infinity" doesn't have one single definition. 18:23:59 1/infinity isn't well-defined in the context you're probably thinking of 18:24:10 -!- nooga has joined. 18:24:27 I guess it's *usually* defined as that one element of the extended real numbers. 18:24:44 certainly you can say sum_0^n 1/n approaches 1 as n goes to infinity 18:24:45 In which case 1/infinity is 0, and so the sum from 0 to infinity of 1/infinity is also 0. 18:24:59 You could also do that, in which case you'd end up with 1. 18:25:10 ergo 0 = 1 18:25:28 dibs on the paper 18:25:53 hmm 18:25:59 actually elliott, you do the paper 18:26:02 Let elliott's number = 0. Let elliott's number = 1. By symmetry of equality, 0 = elliott's number. By transitivity of equality, 0 = 1. 18:26:23 deep 18:26:25 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 18:26:26 the horde of angry mathematicians will have a harder time lynching you 18:26:52 it's true, scots die easy 18:27:30 Not True Scotsmen. 18:28:01 well i mean if they actually find you they can just wring your pale, stick-like english neck without much trouble 18:28:09 but who even knows where hexham is, really 18:28:22 10.65.84.0/24. 18:28:38 We could just destroy the British isles *shrugs* 18:29:27 I like the implication that scots aren't pale. 18:29:31 REMINDER: you get no sun? 18:30:43 elliott: but they stay out in it several hundred percent of the time 18:31:05 just to make their insults slightly more effective 18:31:21 ais523: that is just because they do not have houses. 18:31:26 -!- aloril has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 18:31:52 elliott, that's so it's harder to lynch us 18:31:56 don't be silly, who'd go without a house just to make their insults slightly more effective? 18:32:00 Phantom_Hoover's explanation is much better 18:32:02 harder to jury-rig a gibbet 18:32:06 ais523: are you suggesting Scots are rational. 18:32:20 elliott: are you suggesting they're transcendental? 18:32:24 also I never said it was voluntary! 18:32:36 could *you* build a house in the wasteland that is Scotland? 18:33:09 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 18:33:13 -!- nooga_ has joined. 18:33:21 so tell me elliott how did that whole harrying of the north thing work out for you guys 18:33:25 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 18:33:39 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 18:33:46 at least we never got laid waste by the french 18:34:27 Phantom_Hoover: you can point to the past all you like if it helps distract you from how awful scotland is in the present 18:34:53 RRRRIGHT MAIT 18:35:05 shut up nooga_, everyone hates poland 18:35:25 It's adorable when North Britain and South Britain argue. *sips high fructose corn syrup directly from the jug* 18:35:47 at least we don't have to eat haggis 18:35:48 so elliott how many leading figures in functional programming live in northumberland then 18:35:54 Phantom_Hoover: um poland is at least 50x better than scotland 18:36:00 oh now you've done it 18:36:06 1. me 18:36:08 -!- c00kiemon5ter has left. 18:36:08 2. taneb 18:36:15 3. me, 4. me, 5. me, 18:36:24 oh, we'll just have to make do with conor mcbride and edwin brady then 18:36:31 Gregor: this is more north england versus scotland 18:36:36 phil wadler 18:36:36 I'm just chipping in with absurd comments 18:36:43 still, we're all jealous of the newcastle haskell compiler 18:36:50 nooga_: he is in northumberland? 18:37:07 ummm.... no, Edinburgh 18:37:19 same thing 18:37:20 Phantom_Hoover: just because they're on a humanitarian mission to educate scotland's poor, deprived youth doesn't mean you can hold them up as examples 18:37:21 ais523: The joke was that Americans don't understand British geography. 18:37:23 the edinburgh haskell compiler sucks 18:37:40 Gregor: those people would have said England, though, not Britain 18:37:46 *snaps* 18:37:49 oh and we really wish we'd come up with lancaster prolog 18:37:52 the joke doesn't work if you acknowledge there's a difference 18:38:12 Would it help if I said "Britland"? 18:38:13 I did something dangerous when in Edinburgh 18:38:14 Phantom_Hoover: do you... even know Prolog. 18:38:18 (i couldn't keep focusing it on northumberland because i ran out of significant places in northumberland) 18:38:20 Gregor: perhaps 18:38:33 elliott, remember that it class i bitched about endlessly back when i first joined 18:38:44 Phantom_Hoover: there's Morpeth 18:38:46 ph all i remember about you is a continuous stream of complaints 18:38:49 how can I remember them all 18:38:55 ais523: erm... let's not get into Morpeth 18:38:57 i said that i'm in england when i was in scotland 18:38:59 uuuuu 18:39:04 elliott: is it that bad? 18:39:07 well anyway after we finished with javascript on ie5 for mac we moved on to prolog 18:39:17 I only know about Northumberland because of BlogNomic 18:39:23 ais523: I know nothing about Morpeth but I think it was pretty funny to say that anyway 18:39:25 i don't think i'll ever again see such depths of non-understanding 18:39:44 OK, so Morpeth's distinguishing feature is that people pretend to know something about it 18:39:52 like… monads 18:39:58 monads are like Morpeth 18:40:12 I love morpeth, it is so easy 18:40:31 Phantom_Hoover: my department teaches prolog, to second years I think 18:40:44 some people choose it because it isn't ocaml, and then are disappointed to find it has lists 18:40:44 so have the americans had their election or not 18:40:45 `run echo ' Much like Morpeth.' >> wisdom/monads 18:40:49 No output. 18:40:50 I honestly have forgotten 18:41:03 `revert 18:41:06 it's obama's second term, I Think 18:41:06 Done. 18:41:08 *think 18:41:12 newlines, i guess? 18:41:16 I'm trying to remember who he beat 18:41:18 who did he actually run against again 18:41:20 was it that romney guy 18:41:24 yeah, that's right 18:41:27 it was romney 18:41:27 who codes ocaml anyway 18:41:29 ok goo dto know 18:41:38 * ais523 challenges the americans here to remember who lost in the most recent UK general election 18:41:39 `addquote Phantom_Hoover: my department teaches prolog, to second years I think some people choose it because it isn't ocaml, and then are disappointed to find it has lists 18:41:42 971) Phantom_Hoover: my department teaches prolog, to second years I think some people choose it because it isn't ocaml, and then are disappointed to find it has lists 18:41:52 ais523: humanity 18:42:02 elliott: actually I was pretty happy with the result 18:42:06 ais523, the lib dems 18:42:12 Phantom_Hoover: haha 18:42:13 Phantom_Hoover: haha :) 18:42:19 ais523: that is just more evidence you're not human 18:42:38 * ais523 wonders how many foreigners will get the joke 18:42:45 `? qdbformat 18:42:47 qdbformat is: message; * nick action; two spaces between messages; all elisions marked with [...] other than irrelevant intervening messages; for messages separated by elision, one space on each side, not two 18:42:49 let's add it to the qdb 18:42:59 `addquote * ais523 challenges the americans here to remember who lost in the most recent UK general election ais523, the lib dems 18:43:02 972) * ais523 challenges the americans here to remember who lost in the most recent UK general election ais523, the lib dems 18:43:08 * ais523 challenges the americans here to remember who lost in the most recent UK general election // you could challenge me to remember who WON in the most recent UK general election, I'd do no better. 18:43:10 that way we will get a good amount of data on who gets it or not over time 18:43:17 Gregor: also the lib dems 18:43:19 actually I can't even remember who the leader of Labour is 18:43:26 milipede guy 18:43:27 because both the possibilities have similar names and look identical 18:43:33 or nearly so 18:43:34 ed centipede 18:43:41 I'm bored. 18:43:42 wow, I guessed the wrong one as well 18:43:45 Ed Centipede 18:43:46 -!- sirdancealot7 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 18:43:48 mroman: of /this/ conversation? 18:43:49 Let me design a brainfuck cpu 18:43:53 If my name was Ed Centipede, I'd run for public office. 18:43:54 No. Generally :) 18:44:04 Gregor: it's not his actual name, unfortunately 18:44:23 -!- aloril has joined. 18:44:47 -!- Gregor has set topic: #esoteric welcomes its new prime minister, Ed "Brainfuck Derivative" Centipede | http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/. 18:44:47 Nothing here 18:44:48 which one did ais523 guess? 18:44:57 elliott: david centipede 18:45:18 That is, how much brainfucky it can be with 256 Byte of RAM 18:45:57 mroman: just make the bytes infinitely large 18:46:39 also, what hardware architecture are you targeting to make this CPU? even small FPGAs have more than 256 bytes of RAM 18:46:47 err, of memory 18:46:56 the ones that have RAM have RAM 18:47:06 some of them have memory where you sort-of decide how random the access is 18:47:35 random acts of access 18:47:36 Hm. 18:48:47 We need a language in which each memory cell holds a map N -> {0,1}, interpreted as the decimal expansion of a number that is allowed to be infinite on the left. 18:49:14 And where every possible memory cell value is the address of a memory cell. 18:49:31 -!- FreeFull has joined. 18:49:39 i note that elliott deftly steered the discussion away from how superior scotland is 18:49:55 And you're allowed to perform an infinite loop in one step, as long as it never overwrites a 1 with a 0. 18:50:01 Phantom_Hoover: it just gets so sad hearing a scot try to pretend he's alright 18:50:04 I can only handle so much at a time 18:50:11 Maybe you're just never allowed to overwrite a 1 with a 0 ever. 18:51:18 'pretend he's alright' man you english are terrible at your own language 18:52:06 i guess that's why all the greatest writers in the english language were scots 18:52:22 ALSO: the best cooks? 18:52:32 ph my english was perfectly fine 18:53:35 as if i'd trust an englishman to know that 18:54:15 YOU STOLE OUR LANGUAGE 18:54:16 + 18:54:35 well you just stole it from the germans 18:55:22 * ais523 tries to work out if this is technically racism 18:55:23 ais523: I'm going to have to demand you kick Phantom_Hoover. 18:55:23 wouldn't a better insult be "well the french gave it to you" or something 18:55:38 Bike: but I like the French 18:55:46 more evidence ais523 isn't human 18:55:49 hmm… I think I potentially like far too many people 18:56:03 Bike, oh that's much better, thanks 18:56:18 Phantom_Hoover: stealing your jokes from americans of all people 18:56:25 also known as: the least funny people in the universe 18:56:32 er Bike is from luxembourg 18:56:34 elliott: the americans have humor, not humour 18:56:36 it's different 18:56:47 Phantom_Hoover: luxembourg's in a UTC-8 timezone? 18:56:54 parts of it. 18:56:55 american luxembourg 18:57:11 it's like american samoa I guess 18:57:25 elliott, well the americans still saved your asses in world war 2!! 18:57:29 "2" 18:57:32 world war 2.0 18:57:36 As did the Luxembourgish, I might add. 18:57:41 * boily feels safe in his halfway-existing Canada 18:57:48 I guess this is what happens when Conor McBride has to teach you history because you don't have any other teachers 18:57:54 Phantom_Hoover: I had to check your nationality when you said that 18:57:57 and do a double-take 18:58:06 Bike: you mean the Luxembourgeoisie 18:58:13 i thought you were swiss boily... 18:58:15 AND WITH THAT PUN I HAVE WON THE ARGUMENT 18:58:23 i like how ais checked my presented timezome to see where i was 18:58:38 Bike: the great thing is, I did that /before/ Phantom_Hoover said you were from Luxembourg 18:58:38 guys come on that was amazing 18:58:47 9/10 would be luxembourgianisie again 18:58:57 Phantom_Hoover: `? boily 18:59:01 boily is in UTC-5 18:59:05 elliott, what about edwin brady... 18:59:06 We should invent a programming language that consists entirely of the nicks of people in here 18:59:12 And as people join and part the language changes 18:59:12 which is reasonable for somewhere that doesn't exist that's in vaguely the same location as Canada 18:59:16 Phantom_Hoover: same person. 18:59:20 `? boily 18:59:23 boily is Canadian or something. We are not sure about Canada's existence. 18:59:31 `? freefull 18:59:32 FreeFull is either full of freedom or free of fulldom, we are not sure. 18:59:36 there. indubitable proof that I'm canadian. 18:59:36 boily: I think we've established that Ottawa exists 18:59:41 1? bike 18:59:42 it's quite surprising that with our one teacher we still have an education system which isn't hopelessly broken 18:59:43 but we're less clear on the rest of Canada 18:59:44 `? bike 18:59:50 Bike is from Luxembourg. 18:59:52 ais523: when did that happen? 18:59:54 ais523: 19:00:13 boily: quite recently, but I forget exactly when 19:01:37 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_the_United_Kingdom 19:01:39 Phantom_Hoover: more teachers just means more arguments over how to teach. 19:01:47 i like how a third of this is in ireland 19:02:10 by orangemen or of orangemen or wait i don't care 19:02:29 -!- sirdancealot7 has joined. 19:02:29 both and neither, i should think 19:02:34 Phantom_Hoover: that's not really something to like, if those massacres hadn't happened there'd have been fewer massacres 19:02:41 and massacres are generally considered a bad thing 19:02:53 ais523 are you doing the whole overly literal thing again 19:03:07 hmm, it starts in 61 AD 19:03:15 Phantom_Hoover: that's not really being overly literal, it's something else 19:03:18 huh there are two different violent orangemen organizations there but they both use a red hand 19:03:21 I interpreted the words exactly as you mean them 19:03:27 I just inferred something different from the sentence 19:03:32 Bike, welcome to northern ireland politics 19:03:41 there are at least 3 different versions of any given organisation 19:03:48 rad 19:03:53 -!- nooga has joined. 19:04:00 even more if they're republican 19:04:04 the ira should use a red foot to fit in 19:04:08 -!- nooga_ has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 19:04:32 this isn't something to joke about, seriously 19:04:46 i think i will attempt to write a roguelike in a purely functional manner 19:05:05 i am almost certain you have ignored jokes about more serious matters in the past, ais, so don't start getting all moral 19:05:06 luckily, you're probably safe because I've forgotten what that command is that kicks everyone else from the channel, clears all the channel modes, sets it invite-only, and invites you 19:05:19 Phantom_Hoover: I'm kind-of an oblivious person 19:05:27 whether I start getting all moral really depends on how much attention I'm paying 19:05:39 Does using the State monad count as purely functional? Sure, all the ... code is, but the style that do allows, it looks imperative even if it's all functional inside 19:05:46 and not really what the joke is about 19:06:06 Sgeo_, are you just trying to post kmcbait... 19:06:30 Not really, although seems like the sort of thing kmc would rant about 19:06:44 well, you have to output state once in a while, but all functions just take the state and return a new one 19:06:48 I'm sure I remember discussions along this line of thought before, at least reading such discussions 19:06:56 Sgeo_: "C is a purely functional language" 19:07:09 * Fiora imagines a cardboard box propped up by a stick with a pile of monads inside 19:07:10 also, Unlambda is a purely functional language, although it accomplishes that by redefining "purely functional" 19:07:42 I tried to add closures to INTERCAL once (just in the "mental specification" stage, I didn't write any code) 19:07:44 it didn't end well 19:07:47 Fiora: that is actually what Haskell is. 19:07:48 considering words and phrases as meaning things is the path to ruin 19:08:04 C is a purely functional language. It really does function. As a language. 19:08:21 Lisp is an imperative language because it does stuff 19:08:37 lisp is an imperative language because it was designed by Kant 19:08:52 I like how we successfully transitioned from Irish massacres to functional programming in ~7 messages 19:09:27 "I asked an electronic engineer whether a dog had Buddha-nature. His answer was 'high-impedance'. Now I just have more questions." 19:09:36 33 19:09:37 oops 19:09:37 well it's not like i'm going to keep joking about a period of history where lots of people died for bad reasons if it's actually going to anger someone 19:10:01 wait I thought the idea of #esoteric was to anger ais523 as much as possible, all the time 19:10:14 I... have been thoroughly mislead 19:10:16 i'm a newbie here elliott 19:10:21 elliott: intentionally angering ops is usually a bad idea 19:10:35 ais523: well #esoteric is all about bad ideas 19:10:41 ALSO: has anyone yet died over arguments about what "purely functional" means 19:10:42 hmm, I hadn't thought of it that way 19:10:51 Bike: hmm 19:11:03 I choose to misinterpret "over" as "directly above" because it's a more interesting question that way 19:11:10 fair, fair 19:11:19 how often do arguments about pure functionality happen? how often is it on the lower floor of a building 19:11:25 presumably it'd have to be a coincidence 19:11:32 but it seems like a coincidence that could plausibly happen 19:11:46 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/25/aaron-swartz-white-house-taxpayer-funded-wish_n_2758744.html whoah (sorry for huffpo link) 19:11:47 traditional sumo rings are made with packed purely functional dirt. 19:12:03 `I've heard a good argument that over meaning ab 19:12:04 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: I've: not found 19:12:42 ais523: well how often do people die in buildings where people argue about programming 19:12:57 elliott: sweet 19:12:58 well what if it is like a university 19:13:07 I've heard a good argument that over meaning about is descended from listener's reanalysis of over uses to mean above. 19:13:09 yeah, a university seems like a likely option 19:13:13 or a hotel that's hosting a conference 19:13:20 right a big hotel is a good candidate 19:14:25 doesthiswork: you should put some quotation marks in that sentence in order to make it readable 19:15:00 ais523: No @FPGA 19:15:14 It'd be a *real* Brainfuck CPU 19:16:27 mroman: you mean an ASIC? 19:16:38 they're generated from the same descriptions as FPGAs 19:16:43 so you may as well use one for prototyping 19:16:49 Gabe Newell: "The programmers of tomorrow are the wizards of the future. You know, you're gonna look like you have magic powers compared to everybody else." 19:16:50 it's hundreds of thousands of dollars cheaper 19:16:52 yeah 19:16:55 this is esoteric 19:16:58 for developing one I would use an FPGA 19:18:25 Gregor: you are correct re: salt and vinegar pringles 19:18:49 I think FPGAs are used for development even by major companies 19:19:07 elliott: /me wonders what opinions or facts about salt and vinegar pringles might plausibly wonder verification 19:19:10 elliott: Glad you agree. 19:19:20 ais523: they're created by aliens to destroy the universe 19:19:25 do intel test their new x86 chips on fpgas 19:19:39 ais523: I observed that salt and vinegar Pringles are surprisingly good, having the ideal mix of potato and vinegar. 19:19:39 it seems implausible to me but then what do they do 19:19:39 I'll stay with my ketchup flavour. 19:19:39 elliott: I don't know; I know some CPUs are 19:19:42 but I'm not sure if that's true for very high-end CPUs 19:19:48 ketchup flavour crisps are weird 19:19:48 due to requiring a prohibitively expensive CPU 19:19:50 (Most salt and vinegar chips are more like vinegar and vinegar chips) 19:19:51 for low-end ones, it makes sense 19:20:08 Gregor: well, I wasn't so much agreeing 19:20:17 you stated they fnarfed well but I have no sense of fnarf 19:20:25 from what I remember a lot of chips get simulated on really huge FPGA arrays, like, dozens or more 19:20:33 Fiora: that would make sense 19:20:33 elliott: and? they taste good. 19:20:43 although just wiring those together would be awkward 19:20:43 like I remember hearing that a prototype cortex A9 (which was a pretty small chip) was a cube of FPGAs hooked up to an SD card for cache 19:20:47 it ran at like 500khz 19:20:48 you'd probably need to run them underclocked 19:20:51 fuck i read "chips" as meaning pringles 19:20:53 due to the length of the connecting wires 19:20:55 Fiora: I'm imagining a room filled with FPGA s 19:20:59 yeah, 500kHz sounds about right 19:21:00 like old gigantic computers 19:21:00 oh yeah, they'd probably run like, 10000x slower 19:21:07 I think there's actually companies that sell boards of these 19:21:10 i'm told nvidia has a refrigerator size box of FPGAs for prototyping graphics cards 19:21:12 Bike: hahaha 19:21:17 costs a few megabucks 19:21:27 Bike: I was considering misreading that intentionally, but accidental is better 19:21:35 did y'all see nvidia's GTC video with water reflections and shit 19:21:42 unfortunately the sentence makes no sense with that reading 19:21:51 Bike: no, link? 19:21:55 sec 19:22:08 shit sounds like a weird thing to simulate with a graphics card 19:22:19 thanks ais523 19:22:19 "look at all these pretty water reflections, also here is some shit" 19:22:33 thais523 19:22:33 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=um6rMjwSNdU#t=255s 19:22:36 * impomatic has a refrigerator size box of real CPUs :-) 19:22:43 I also like the end bit of his 19:23:01 where he's like "we can dump billions of $ into R&D for games. now what if we used the products for something remotely useful?" 19:23:17 Bike: we do that at our university 19:23:22 I used to teach the course but don't any more 19:23:32 the course on what 19:23:38 taking money from games? 19:23:42 doing remotely useful things 19:23:45 ais523 isn't very good at it 19:23:48 that's why he doesn't teach the course any more 19:23:49 did y'all see the PS3 demo of Kara. a nice retake on the classic accidental-singularity story 19:23:51 oh 19:23:52 it looks really incongruous seeing a technician going around a lab full of computers in a university 19:23:55 with high-end gaming GPUs 19:23:58 hehe 19:24:07 yeah, that's kind of what he's saying, that GPUs are pretty useful otherwise 19:24:10 in their original packaging, which is clearly aimed at gamers 19:24:18 i mean, after showing off rendering crystalware getting shot in realtime 19:24:20 it was the course on, mostly, GPU programming 19:25:19 or, well, accidental-self-awareness i should say 19:25:19 oh, so like OpenCL or whatever? 19:25:19 http://hitechglobal.com/Boards/MultiFPGA.htm oh I think I found one 19:25:19 that looks cool 19:25:19 Bike: yeah, we were using CUDA but OpenCL is the same sort of thing 19:26:08 Bike: wow 19:27:11 quintopia: 'and i am entirely at your disposal as a sexual partner' great 19:27:31 kmc: cool, right? 19:27:49 yeah 19:30:57 -!- monqy has joined. 19:31:29 Bike: what is that 19:31:46 what is what 19:32:06 i meant re quintopia 19:32:14 oh, the kara thing 19:32:17 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhoYLp8CtXI 19:32:25 do I want to click 19:33:10 -!- linuxnewb2 has quit (Read error: Operation timed out). 19:33:45 yeah it's fine 19:33:51 just a short film 19:36:16 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 19:36:19 -!- linuxnewb2 has joined. 19:37:40 -!- sebbu2 has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 19:40:40 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 19:40:45 Hello 19:40:45 AnotherTest: You have 1 new message. '/msg lambdabot @messages' to read it. 19:41:05 hmm, leonard nemoy ends all his tweets with "LLAP" 19:41:22 lick dong and grope her? 19:41:33 what 19:41:41 LIVE LONG AND PROSPER 19:41:42 mroman: Alright, thanks. I'll do that once I got the interpreter working... 19:41:58 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:43:49 I wonder if the twitter form of that should be #livelong #prosper 19:44:28 you'd only want one hashtag, really 19:44:33 Prosper? I hardly know her! 19:44:40 btw, are hashtags are inspired by IRC channels? 19:44:45 they have asiilar purpose 19:44:48 *a similar 19:45:46 Hashtags are like macro's in C++: don't use them 19:45:55 *macros 19:46:18 * ais523 searches #define on Twitter 19:46:26 ~duck #define 19:46:27 --- No relevant information 19:46:35 why does it not have a search page 19:46:41 its homepage is a login screen 19:46:42 -!- c00kiemon5ter has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 19:46:55 -!- c00kiemon5ter has joined. 19:47:10 ais523: the Wikipedia article implies that htey are. 19:47:15 #if probably has a higher chance of existing than #define 19:47:42 AnotherTest: yeah but #define does macros 19:48:24 ais523: #if checks if a macro is defined? That's using macros too right? 19:48:40 AnotherTest: no, #ifdef does that 19:48:45 -!- sebbu has joined. 19:48:49 #pragmas all the way down! 19:48:51 ":info:build ld:ld : warningwarning: directory '/lib' following -L not: directory '/ found" 19:48:51 #if checks the truth value of a boolean expression 19:49:06 tswett: using unbuffered output? 19:49:09 I hate it when ld ld gives warningwarnings. 19:49:16 ais523: I have no idea. 19:49:31 I guess that sounds right. 19:49:46 what were the original interleaved messages? 19:49:53 ais523: alright 19:49:56 that's true 19:53:14 -!- ogrom has joined. 19:59:10 #howdoihashtag 20:01:55 you need a friend (preferably a good one, but not too good), a tennis racket, and a few pints of kerosene. 20:02:02 -!- Taneb has joined. 20:05:18 boily: and gerbils 20:07:35 boily: am i your friend (good, but not too good)? 20:07:35 > 2010/3 20:07:36 670.0 20:09:36 quintopia: you are. 20:10:17 is kerosene the same thing in the US as it is in the UK? 20:11:12 probably. for me it's what goes in airplanes. 20:11:23 apparently kerosene is the american term, according to wikipedia you might call it paraffin 20:11:24 ais523: it is the most-efficient oil derivative in terms of power 20:11:50 olsner: oh right 20:12:50 in swedish it's "fotogen" 20:14:28 something that generates photos? 20:14:38 that looks like something that would mean "generating light" 20:14:54 hmm, indeed 20:15:05 paraffin lamps used to be common 20:15:14 paraffin means wax to me 20:15:14 it could be swedish for the photo gene, but I think it comes from its use in lamps 20:15:33 yes. thanks to standard oil :) 20:16:03 paraffin means that cheap stuff used in cheap chocolate. 20:16:13 and...who was it? carnegie was steel, vanderbilt was trains, ....damn i'm so bad at history 20:16:43 ah rockefeller 20:16:44 of course 20:16:45 cheap chocolate is made from kerosene? 20:17:04 rockefeller is responsible for kerosene's use in lamps 20:18:39 -!- epicmonkey has joined. 20:18:54 olsner: http://homecooking.about.com/od/cookingfaqs/f/faqparaffin.htm 20:19:55 the toxicity section for kerosene is really disappointing though 20:20:15 ingestion is "harmful or fatal", end of story 20:20:25 meh. disappointing indeed. 20:20:29 olsner: probably not enough people have tried to have reliable data 20:20:56 where is my writhing in furious agony? toxic substances nowadays... 20:21:24 hmm… if that's the case, I'm sort-of glad we don't have reliable data 20:22:05 well, i'm sure we could get it 20:22:34 all we have to do is build a time machine and go back in time to the 1930s and tell Goebbels and Goering that we really need that data 20:22:57 really easy...except the first part 20:23:03 finally, "sure" and "time travel", together in the same paragraph 20:23:04 hmm, where's oklopol when we need him to sample hydrocarbons 20:23:19 olsner: hopefully not where you can reach him 20:23:30 oklopol is too valuable to be wasted on hydrocarbon experiments 20:23:43 IT'S PERFECTLY SAFE. IT'S MADE FROM THE SAME STUFF YOUR CELLS ARE MADE FROM. 20:24:01 `quote petrol 20:24:03 352) what would you ever need petrol for newsflash: it doesn't actually taste that good \ 353) [on petrol] oklofok: it's actually poisonous, so I advise against drinking it ais523, also contains benzene, my carcinogen of choice. 20:24:15 `pastlog petrol 20:24:39 2007-09-24.txt:09:47:50: why are you making a decaf espresso orange juice with an infinite number of sugars in a petrol tanker with last year's milk for #arianne? 20:24:55 we should `pastlog more often :) 20:25:03 A guy around here keeps getting fined for drinking petrol straight from the pump. 20:25:07 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 20:25:14 impomatic: what? 20:25:16 what does pastlog do? 20:25:24 ais523: does it search the logs in chronological order to find the oldest reference? 20:25:27 olsner: a random line containing the word you give that isn't from today 20:25:30 -!- augur has joined. 20:25:33 ais523: cool 20:25:35 oh 20:25:37 `pastlog gasoline 20:25:51 `pastlog chicken 20:25:52 it has several uses, but plugging random words into it is a good one 20:25:54 2012-12-06.txt:01:09:16: no thanks HackEgo 20:25:58 `pastlog twilight sparkle 20:25:59 2010-12-28.txt:04:39:01: Quadrescence, chicken 20:26:06 2012-03-23.txt:01:15:32: KAPLA, TWILIGHT SPARKLE, KAPLA 20:26:19 `pastlog acciacatura 20:26:24 maybe I spelt that wrong 20:26:32 `pastlog pistacchio 20:26:35 2008-12-05.txt:16:50:32: so is acciacatura 20:26:41 No output. 20:26:43 `pastlog heisenbug 20:26:45 maybe I spelt that wrong then, too 20:26:51 2010-03-27.txt:23:28:02: heisenbug! now you are talking my way! 20:26:52 -!- FreeFull has joined. 20:26:56 `pastlog pop-tart 20:27:06 2011-09-12.txt:06:49:02: though it's buttered toast and not a pop-tart 20:27:06 `pastlog spandex 20:27:15 No output. 20:27:23 `pastlog spanking 20:27:31 2011-01-22.txt:23:09:51: oerjan: are you into leather? <-- er what, no. is that because i approved of your spanking comment? 20:27:34 `pastlog Emplosions 20:27:47 2008-09-15.txt:12:06:22: Silly Emplosions looks a little too silly. 20:28:06 `pastlog quarantine 20:28:10 `pastlog bondage 20:28:13 2011-10-04.txt:04:32:37: * oerjan puts Sgeo|web in shouting disease quarantine 20:28:18 are you trying out weird words? 20:28:18 2011-07-20.txt:04:43:49: funny, python feels more like bondage and discipline 20:28:21 or what 20:28:30 i dont remember saying that 20:28:34 Vorpal: pretty much 20:28:39 `pastlog perl 20:28:40 it's the "think of a word, plug it into `pastlog" game 20:28:50 is that a game now 20:28:54 elliott, was that in approval of python or not? Hey I don't know your tastes so I better ask.. 20:28:56 `pastlog acquiesce 20:28:58 it has been at least once 20:29:00 2009-05-12.txt:03:01:18: !addinterp slashes perl http://oerjan.nvg.org/esoteric/slashes.pl 20:29:03 hm. sadly ørjan isn't there to ask if, indeed, he is into leather. 20:29:06 No output. 20:29:10 ! 20:29:10 Vorpal: is it time for the usual "elliott is underage" joke? 20:29:16 we should make it so you don't even have to put in a word 20:29:18 guys I'm not underage any more 20:29:21 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 20:29:25 elliott: you sure? 20:29:30 then we can use it as the new five times `quote game 20:29:31 boily: good question 20:29:33 olsner: you mean pull a random word from dictionary? 20:29:33 ais523, not exactly. General "sexual orientation" joke I think 20:29:42 olsner: that's just `log, but putting in random words gives you better lines 20:29:43 `pastlog archaeology 20:29:45 quintopia: or a random line from the logs more likely 20:29:51 2010-10-30.txt:21:43:02: zzo38: ...Good luck with that, I think they were joking ;P 20:29:51 `log 20:29:52 `log 20:29:54 2010-05-11.txt:21:55:29: nah I just have a simple webpage 20:29:54 2004-06-27.txt:08:00:00: -!- clog has joined #esoteric. 20:30:06 `pastlog cvs 20:30:09 `pastlog quibble 20:30:15 it's worrying me how often the random words turn out to be nicks 20:30:17 `pastlog scarf 20:30:17 2005-11-24.txt:13:06:59: let's see if i can retrieve source of jogl-demos with http://iki.fi/lindi/cvsweb-dump.pl 20:30:18 `pastlog harry potter 20:30:18 2011-01-09.txt:23:53:32: pikhq, well, her quibble was more that I had used it between sentences that weren't very logically connected. 20:30:20 `log aardvark 20:30:32 `pastlog foible 20:30:35 `pastlog epimorphism 20:30:39 nothing? 20:30:44 `pastlog quanta 20:30:47 `pastlog aardvark 20:30:48 `pastlog die die die 20:30:51 No output. 20:30:53 No output. 20:30:53 `pastlog wil wheaton 20:30:55 No output. 20:31:03 I think it is pretty lagged 20:31:09 `pastlog `pastlog 20:31:10 No output. 20:31:12 No output. 20:31:12 it takes a while to search logs 20:31:15 it's timing out because 5000 queries 20:31:23 /over/ 5000 20:31:26 No output. 20:31:26 * boily innocently whistles 20:31:27 quintopia, should use a more efficient representation then 20:31:30 No output. 20:31:35 ais523, not over 9000, so we are all good 20:31:41 No output. 20:31:41 No output. 20:31:42 Vorpal: then you rewrite it 20:31:44 it needs a SQL database. 20:31:44 Vorpal: more efficient than flat files of plain text? unpossible! 20:31:47 No output. 20:31:50 `pastlog asterism 20:31:55 remind me never to try humour in the presence of Vorpal 20:31:57 `pastlog No output. 20:31:57 `pastlog harry potter 20:31:59 it needs a full text search index 20:32:05 I think you may have broken it 20:32:07 2009-03-30.txt:19:59:14: ASTERISM 20:32:13 `pastlog unpossible 20:32:13 2010-03-02.txt:13:37:43: No output. 20:32:15 2011-02-27.txt:00:51:29: i read the last harry potter like umm on sunday 20:32:18 it's catching on! 20:32:21 `pastlog aardvark 20:32:21 oh no, it's just badly out of order 20:32:23 2009-05-12.txt:16:14:29: ehird: Unpossible 20:32:29 `pastlog aleatoric 20:32:30 2010-07-11.txt:05:48:02: Aardvark Wagon 20:32:32 `pastlog automagical 20:32:36 `pastlog alimentary 20:32:45 lots of a words 20:32:45 No output. 20:32:46 2011-01-25.txt:23:33:35: it translates the PATH automagically 20:32:48 No output. 20:32:54 ais523, is it just me, or is aardvark just a really funny word? 20:32:54 `pastlog banana 20:32:57 ais523: it's in order 20:32:58 `pastlog beautiful 20:33:03 2008-02-10.txt:19:25:28: => "abcbananaasd222di" 20:33:07 2010-07-15.txt:00:13:12: pikhq: I have a beautifully typeset The Metamorphosis. 20:33:13 `pastlog bisque 20:33:18 `pastlog abaci 20:33:20 `pastlog bezoar 20:33:24 No output. 20:33:25 elliott: btw, hilarious moment from #nethack: listen, if you want to edit ESR's work... go right ahead 20:33:26 elliott, " 2010-07-15.txt:00:13:12: pikhq: I have a beautifully typeset The Metamorphosis." <-- really? 20:33:27 `pastlog burundi 20:33:28 why 20:33:30 2012-11-11.txt:22:51:51: Traditionally, Chinese abacii were hexadecimal. 20:33:32 2012-11-02.txt:22:35:29: bezoar 20:33:34 boily: are you feeding in your entire dictionary 20:33:36 No output. 20:33:49 elliott: covering words in «b». 20:33:49 `ls /usr/share/dict 20:33:51 No output. 20:33:51 ais523: not about C-INTERCAL, I presume? 20:33:51 hmm, I've said bezoar? I wonder why I did that 20:33:55 -!- zzo38 has joined. 20:33:59 -!- oerjan has joined. 20:33:59 elliott: yeah, it was about the NetHack guidebook 20:34:04 olsner: bezoar got a hit? wooooah. 20:34:09 `pastlog zzo39 20:34:14 `pastlog corundum 20:34:21 2012-02-10.txt:22:29:14: zzo39? ¯\(°_o)/¯ 20:34:22 `pastlog bitcoin 20:34:27 `pastlog django 20:34:27 2008-01-11.txt:11:01:46: As in an abbreviation of Corundum, :-) 20:34:29 (to annoy olsner) 20:34:32 2011-04-29.txt:17:47:50: the way it works is, if anyone manages to produce a history of every transaction ever, it becomes official, and they get a small bitcoin reward for doing os 20:34:35 2011-04-07.txt:21:40:46: 353) django is named after a person? thought it would be a giraffe or something 20:34:55 `pastlog hovercraft 20:35:05 2011-11-20.txt:13:17:09: Hi Taneb|Hovercraft. 20:35:08 `pastlog eels 20:35:10 `pastlog ais52[^3] 20:35:19 `pastlog ais532 20:35:26 `pastlog zebra 20:35:30 `pastlog lion 20:35:33 ais523: speaking of django, there's a new movie out called something with django ... I expect it to be about web development 20:35:33 `pastlog elephant 20:35:34 tooo many 20:35:37 elliott: I'm pretty sure there have been some ais524 sightings 20:35:38 stoooooooop 20:35:40 No output. 20:35:43 :( 20:35:43 No output. 20:35:52 No output. 20:35:52 `pastlog tangent 20:35:54 `pastlog eels 20:35:55 olsner: it doesn't look like that from the adverts, but admittedly I haven't watched it 20:36:03 No output. 20:36:06 `pastlog ankeria 20:36:08 No output. 20:36:09 No output. 20:36:13 `pastlog eels 20:36:19 2009-02-28.txt:21:25:55: Ah, but you see, intelligence is all about approximating the universe, and what better approximation to use than a tangent line? 20:36:22 2011-09-26.txt:12:54:07: A mantra: "tekken tekken virtua fighter / oh my brain feels so much lighter". 20:36:27 lol 20:36:28 2012-08-22.txt:00:12:24: minun ilmatyynyalus on täynnä ankeriaita 20:36:30 ais523: me neither 20:36:30 2010-09-12.txt:04:25:57: Sometimes it feels to me as if I'm just being used. 20:36:39 `pastlog é 20:36:46 `pastlog \ 2009-10-31.txt:19:52:26: touché 20:36:53 huh, who was kerlo? 20:36:55 No output. 20:36:55 I read that as kerio 20:37:03 and thought "whoa, kerio was in #esoteric?" 20:37:12 I remember the name kerlo 20:37:14 kmc's been speaking in the black tongue of finlandor. 20:37:18 ais523: make it search for the word eels so that feels doesn't match 20:37:24 `pastlog \beels 20:37:25 kerlo was tswett and tusho was elliott, or the other way around 20:37:30 oh right 20:37:33 2010-10-14.txt:04:50:35: My hovercraft is full of eels. 20:37:35 it was a lojban name, or something 20:37:44 quintopia: there you go 20:37:47 thx 20:38:07 and oerjan was ais523 20:38:29 imo this game is boring 20:38:32 Yeah, I was kerlo. 20:38:36 yeah, it's running out of steam 20:38:52 sadly we don't have a /usr/share/dict/words 20:38:57 to generate random words automatically 20:38:59 Wow, that was almost four years ago. 20:39:51 `pastlog pluto 20:40:00 2009-09-03.txt:18:34:21: It's also a bit further away, though, so I think it might have less of a gravitational influence. Still, at perihelion it seems to be closer than Pluto at aphelion. 20:40:25 i wonder where zzo38 is 20:40:30 quintopia: here, I think 20:40:40 alternatively, 20:40:42 `quote at Canada 20:40:43 `words 20:40:44 374) as i was filled with zzo38 mystery at the moment i saw quintopia: I am at Canada. 20:40:50 founda 20:40:55 at? 20:41:12 boily: you didn't know he was at Canada? 20:41:18 it's pretty common knowledge here now 20:41:23 ais523: can't find a reference online... It was in one of the local paper. He would just turn up at the petrol station, slash the pipe and drink direct from the pump. 20:41:32 impomatic: and is still alive? 20:41:39 presumably people had to keep stopping him 20:41:41 `words 50 20:41:45 bay cir ruf mirb morao incus orgonnat belle maile halshin possim especita bottoa prespe fait uncl sete oscordeclaship willin runt hijk eing ohi bir jaul 20:41:56 who needs /usr/dict/words 20:41:56 quintopia: you and your real, tangible world! don't you forget some of us here are not as solid and material as you are! 20:42:04 the problem with `words is that they tend not to have been spoken 20:42:05 *+/share 20:42:11 boily: enjoy being locked in your matrix of solidity! 20:43:30 `pastlog wensleydale 20:43:38 No output. 20:43:41 `pastlog wensleydale 20:43:44 * ais523 wonders if boily was thinking of that reference when he said that 20:43:50 No output. 20:44:01 hmm, I thought of another command by analogy to `list 20:44:04 not sure of the name yet 20:44:05 if you use it 20:44:11 all it does is tell you if it's been used recently 20:44:16 Gregor: you know it would be very helpful if HackEgo gave a different response on timeout than on ordinary lack of output 20:46:23 ooh, c++: bool* board[1][1]; board[size][size] = { nullptr }; 20:46:26 (size is 5, btw) 20:47:45 is this something to do with bool acting weird? 20:47:57 no, it's just really bad code 20:48:09 the one who wrote that wants to know why it's not working 20:48:49 When I have bagels I will cut a notch in it. Do you? 20:48:58 actually, might as well give you all the code: http://ideone.com/W6Ev77 20:49:52 olsner: oh 20:50:01 I thought you meant that that somehow assigned 5 to size 20:50:04 just in that bit of code there 20:50:14 and as it's C++, I thought that was plausible 20:52:11 ais523: back from coffee. no, I wasn't thinking. 20:52:51 ais523: still alive as far as I know. Couldn't find the article online, but found this instead http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/5877824/Boy-drinks-petrol-to-become-Transformer.html 20:53:34 impomatic: somehow I don't want to know :) 20:53:51 Gregor: you know it would be very helpful if HackEgo gave a different response on timeout than on ordinary lack of output // TOO BAD 20:55:39 U.S. researchers have succeeded in re-animating a dead sparrow. 20:55:51 apparently by fitting a robot inside it 20:56:13 it got destroyed by some actual sparrows 20:58:06 ais523: that's new. didn't know jack about that. 20:58:25 boily: pun attempt? 20:58:46 * boily silently drinks his coffee. very silently. 21:07:54 Gregor: it's _your_ resources that get used because i redo commands when i'm not sure if they really should have no output. hth. 21:09:27 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 21:09:39 (admittedly i guess i misuse your resources more for other reasons.) 21:11:18 -!- sebbu has joined. 21:11:18 -!- sebbu has quit (Changing host). 21:11:18 -!- sebbu has joined. 21:20:21 I'm translating it into C <-- what, but you need bignums... 21:20:51 gmp has bignums for C 21:21:05 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:21:13 big gnomes 21:21:16 Yeah, I'm using gmp 21:21:19 scary 21:21:37 In fact, I've done it all except for run' and parseSK 21:23:42 are you making an esolang? 21:24:08 Not right now, no 21:24:26 what else are you doing with gmp, run and parseSK? 21:24:37 Ridiculous SK-calculus interpreter 21:25:31 how do you even make a SK calc interpreter ridiculous 21:25:57 By encoding it into positive integers first 21:26:01 Bike: http://hpaste.org/83052 is a demonstration hth 21:26:18 oh i have a textbook that does that 21:26:44 In the same way as me? 21:26:50 haha no 21:26:57 bitstrings ofc 21:27:18 What's cool about mine is it makes literally no assumptions about how integers are implemented 21:27:22 -!- augur has joined. 21:27:25 -!- monqy has quit (Quit: hello). 21:27:28 ?? 21:27:39 As in, it doesn't have to be bitstrings 21:27:54 Could be roman numerals for all I care 21:27:59 using the bits doesn't mean the implementation of integer has to be anything related to bitstrings 21:28:10 what he said. 21:28:18 Ah, true 21:28:41 (especially considering that the bitstrings were implemented as linked lists of SK combinators) 21:29:27 i feel like you should use godel encoding 21:29:31 for maximum stupid mathiness 21:29:51 Bike: isn't that just "put the program in a file"? 21:29:56 Bike, I think I am 21:29:58 we use gödel encoding all the time 21:30:03 what does eval() do, for instance? 21:30:09 an argument could be made that we should use it less 21:30:18 well it refers to a _specific_ encoding. 21:30:24 wait I should be letting oerjan do this for me 21:30:35 No, I mean the thing with primes. 21:30:42 hmm, I thought the original proof didn't care about the specifics of the encoding 21:30:44 Bike: hmm 21:30:51 It doesn't, i don't think, but it's what he used? 21:31:02 [4,7,3] = 2^4 + 3^7 + 5^3 and so on 21:31:36 2328. nice and inefficient 21:32:12 Wouldn't it be 2^4 times 3^7 times 5^3? 21:32:20 oh yes 21:32:22 durr. 21:32:25 > 2^4 * 3^7 * 5^3 21:32:26 4374000 21:32:49 actually i think the textbook might have used cantor pairing now that i think about it 21:32:59 maybe i should read it again and do more exercises to fix my incompetence a bit 21:33:45 btw i like that you mentioned implementation dependence after clarifying the C library you had to be using :3 21:34:03 wait I should be letting oerjan do this for me <-- but i'm lazy and also logreading 21:34:58 i think i mentioned my idea of using a combination of bitstrings and fibonacci base? 21:35:05 (long ago) 21:35:50 basically, an arbitrary number in binary can be split into a list of numbers in fibonacci base separated by 1's. and this is a bijection. 21:36:43 is that a prefix code 21:36:46 Bike, algorithm isn't program 21:36:54 -!- DHeadshot has joined. 21:37:12 Bike: well it's meant to be a bijection between naturals and finite length lists of naturals 21:37:14 Nevermind the fact that in both implementations that currently exist are entirely dependent the same implementation 21:37:29 Taneb: yes and C doesn't have integers anyway, i just thought it was funny 21:37:32 there may have been subtle details about it. 21:38:20 i don't think very many algorithms particularly care about how integers are represented, though 21:38:25 so it seems like a weird thing to have said 21:38:29 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:38:46 Bike: xor swap? 21:38:56 hmm. radix sort? 21:39:03 Bike, I mean, I'm not using bitstrings at all 21:39:22 Taneb: but you can use bitstrings regardless of how integers are represented. 21:39:39 True 21:39:49 ais523: what do you need for that? 21:40:07 wikipedia even goes through it with linear operator matrices, pff 21:40:34 Bike: well you need things to be represented as bits to xor swap them 21:40:51 why 21:40:57 you can define bitwise xor on integers 21:41:05 same with bases, fiora 21:41:52 -!- augur has joined. 21:41:59 I guess so 21:42:10 i mean hey it might be slow as hell 21:42:14 but this is math! who cares right 21:42:28 theory has no 21:42:40 something something 21:42:45 agreed 21:42:46 not sure what went after that 21:42:53 elegantly stated, olsner 21:42:58 something something, olsner 21:43:33 something something. 21:43:51 Bike: maybe algorithmic complexity? like X algorithm implemented with O(f(n)) requires some integer representation? 21:43:52 this is what this channel is all about. intellectual discourse. 21:44:07 Fiora: oh sure 21:44:43 Fiora: long multiplication for an easy example. that's gonna be pretty fucking slow if you have to convert out of modular residues first 21:44:43 -!- lambdabot has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 21:44:49 Bike: well it wouldn't be xor swap if you went and simulated the xor 21:44:57 "simulated" 21:45:01 who's simulating anything 21:45:01 because the point of xor swap is the number of instructions it requires 21:45:23 "that's a program, not an algorithm" 21:45:26 Bike: I guess the point is that the algorithm is defined in terms of what instructions it uses 21:45:28 hmm 21:45:32 yeah, that seems possible 21:45:39 except it's a program that exists in many assembly languages 21:45:59 you can define bitwise xor on integers <-- conway's nimber addition extends that even to transfinite ordinals 21:46:05 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:46:07 so it's a bit more general than just a single program 21:46:10 i've always wanted to xor swap transfinite ordinals 21:46:10 haha yes 21:46:22 * ais523 wonders what kmc is agreeing with 21:46:22 `quote i've always wanted to xor swap transfinite ordinals 21:46:23 Bike: I smell an esolang 21:46:26 No output. 21:46:28 kmc: addquote 21:46:28 `addquote i've always wanted to xor swap transfinite ordinals 21:46:33 yeah i remember 21:46:34 973) i've always wanted to xor swap transfinite ordinals 21:46:44 so first i've got to do the linear operator thing and now this 21:46:56 Bike: linear as in linear logic? 21:47:04 no as in linear operators 21:47:15 -!- impomatic has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:47:21 oerjan: what's conway's nimber addition? 21:47:38 i was really tired a few nights ago and was talking about a language where the only functions are infinite matrices 21:47:46 and elliott commanded me to make an esolang 21:47:49 and i can't like, disobey 21:47:51 olsner: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Z2%5E4;_Cayley_table;_binary.svg hth 21:48:17 you can compute with transfinite ordinals to some degree right? 21:48:24 elliott: is it common to have a finite supply of files? 21:48:37 data Ordinal = Zero | Succ Ordinal | Omega | some other things 21:48:40 how far does that get you 21:48:40 my situation at work is: I need to edit some files, and the webserver needs to be able to read them 21:48:42 kmc: i think there are even software packages for fuckin' with 'em 21:48:51 -!- lambdabot has joined. 21:48:55 but I need to not be able to read arbitrary files that the webserver can read 21:49:04 so at the moment, the files have my user, and its group 21:49:14 and group read permissions 21:49:24 this allows me to modify them, but not to create new files 21:49:24 olsner: oh hm it's not actually conway's, he just generalized them to games and surreal numbers. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimber 21:50:03 * ais523 has got into the habit of M-x set-variable backup-by-copying t 21:50:34 kmc: presumably you can get up to church-kleene? 21:53:13 you can compute with transfinite ordinals to some degree right? <-- yep, see Cantor normal form 21:53:31 which is like base omega notation 21:54:21 -!- nooodl has joined. 21:55:16 -!- TeruFSX has joined. 21:55:44 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cantor_normal_form#Cantor_normal_form 21:56:47 `pastlog something.*something 21:56:49 you need to use ordinals as exponents in their own representation some times? awesome 21:56:57 2010-05-23.txt:21:55:22: And the idea of wanting something makes me want to do something else. :P 21:57:16 http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/3/3/d/33d48c263ce795ad60a4505f58860913.png 21:57:19 my new favorite number 21:57:34 damn straight 21:57:42 so this is basically base ω? 21:57:52 Bike: yep, also you can have omega^x = x which gives you the epsilon ordinals (which you then need to handle separately to distinguish them) 21:58:09 kmc: except you have e.g. epsilon_zero = omega^epsilon_zero making things a bit trickier 21:58:37 Bike: also this notation is how you prove goodstein sequences terminate 21:58:51 yeah i suppose this is a bit more than peano eh 21:58:58 -!- Taneb has quit (Quit: Leaving). 21:59:08 did remind me of hereditary base notation 21:59:13 (peano cannot prove that the epsilons exist) 21:59:18 right 22:00:00 if only there was some way to define undefinable ordinals............. 22:00:11 ... 22:01:26 -!- augur has joined. 22:02:11 Bike: i think i linked this last time we discussed such things http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_countable_ordinal 22:02:19 already there~ 22:03:10 Bike: i think the problem with reaching church-kleene is you get some kind of analogy to the halting problem: you have enough notations but you cannot prove any given notation gives an ordinal 22:03:23 sucks 22:04:03 (given that there are almost 7 more seasons of voyager, I suspect that *maybe* they don't all get home in episode 7) 22:04:28 the other seven seasons just consist of wide-angle shots of the skies where voyager would have been 22:04:31 hm i guess the introduction mentions that 22:05:08 `olis 22:05:09 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: olis: not found 22:05:10 `oliss 22:05:11 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: oliss: not found 22:05:12 `olist 22:05:13 shachaf oerjan Sgeo 22:05:22 "Larger and larger ordinals can be defined, but they become more and more difficult to describe." i love math 22:05:27 olsner: now i vaguely recall someone writing about the idea of publishing a book where they didn't bother to fill in all the pages 22:07:01 you know what's annoying? Emacs versions too old to have M-x visual-line-mode 22:07:13 (I don't mind versions sufficiently old that it isn't on by default, because I can just turn it on) 22:07:19 it makes navigating in very long lines annoying 22:07:22 -!- c00kiemon5ter has left. 22:07:51 -!- ogrom has quit (Quit: Left). 22:08:06 oerjan: what a waste of pages 22:11:21 saves ink though! 22:11:36 -!- Taneb has joined. 22:11:39 oerjan: there was a joke in the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy 22:11:41 about time travel grammar 22:11:51 someone wrote a book about it, but everyone got bored at around the same point 22:11:59 so they left all the pages after that point blank to save on printing costs 22:12:19 ais523: ah. i probably read that, but that's not what i was referring to. 22:12:43 * oerjan doesn't remember where what he's referring to is from, though 22:12:44 "Most readers get as far as the Future Semiconditionally Modified Subinverted Plagal Past Subjunctive Intentional before giving up; and in fact in later aditions of the book all pages beyond this point have been left blank to save on printing costs." 22:13:33 *editions. bad webpage i stole this quote from 22:14:11 ...ok today the sidebar of the previous page in oots looks right :P 22:15:12 -!- boily has quit (Quit: Poulet!). 22:15:14 hello 22:15:19 wb 22:15:40 * ais523 fails to see any way to interpret that as disapproval, also it's "hello" not "hi" 22:16:22 does elliott have other modes of expression beyond disapproval? 22:16:40 olsner: it's more that "hi" as a non sequitur is a mark of disapproval 22:16:46 I think monqy started it 22:16:47 indeed 22:16:51 `quote hi 22:16:52 6) His body should be given to science. He's alive :P Even so. \ 9) Lil`Cube: you had cavity searches? not yet trying to thou, just so I can check it off on my list of things to expirence \ 14) Finally I ha 22:16:59 `quote \bhi\b 22:17:00 150) comex: what? *vorpal comex: hi, tab-complete completed c to comex instead of Vorpal, dunno why \ 207) [on Walter Bright] I went to chat with him after his talk at the ELC and he was like "hum, right - humans. How do they work again... oh, hi!" \ 729) Sgeo: I used to have strict requirements 22:17:19 i think i've seen more shachaf asking monqy about disapproving "hi"s than disapproving "hi"s themselves 22:17:29 did monqy actually start it or did he just said hi once and everyone built a myth around it? 22:17:50 `quote 729 22:17:51 729) Sgeo: I used to have strict requirements for when I said hi but then everyone started saying hi and it all got weird 22:18:13 olsner: he said it more than once 22:19:11 I've started seeing hi as ominous in other circumstances as well ... someone starts an IM conversation at work with the word "hi", and you know it only goes downhill from there 22:19:19 hmm 22:19:27 -!- cuttlefish has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 22:19:28 "hi" on IM (or IRC PM) is quite a common "are you there?" 22:20:34 the people I know usually just start with the actual question/message 22:21:41 -!- impomatic has joined. 22:22:29 olsner: for me it depends on what the actual question/message is 22:22:43 "since the Greek alphabet does not have transfinitely many letters it is better to use a more robust notation" 22:22:47 -!- NuclearMeltdown has quit (Changing host). 22:22:47 -!- NuclearMeltdown has joined. 22:23:18 NuclearMeltdown the AntiLiberal 22:23:20 good hostname 22:23:23 maybe it's just a general case of people usually communicating because there's some problem they need help with, and "hi" just happens to be a common first communication 22:24:26 but I can still blame #esoteric for making "hi" sound ominous 22:24:42 I can blame you for anything 22:25:13 “Unrecursable” recursive ordinals <-- http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/attachments/2011-mustang-talk/162030-who-would-win-race-warning-danger-manifold.gif 22:25:46 hmm, I wonder if this is one of those episodes where someone gets falsely accused and sentenced for some crime 22:26:07 -!- epicmonkey has quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds). 22:27:07 "A distinctive characteristic of his logic classes was that in the middle of each class, a previously selected student would have to get up and tell a joke. The joke had to be short, funny, and inoffensive to receive credit." 22:28:13 yep, that and mosshaired aliens 22:31:42 -!- Taneb has quit (Quit: Leaving). 22:32:16 Bike: ? 22:32:18 (context?) 22:32:29 look up gerald sacks 22:32:47 (no relation to oliver, i guess) 22:33:48 Bike: good characteristic 22:34:44 http://www.math.harvard.edu/~sacks/sacks.html here is his "HyperMedia Plan File" 22:35:00 generated by Netscape on SunOS 5.8 apparently 22:35:01 that's kind of a mean class 22:36:05 Would it help if I said "Britland"? <-- the land of the britneys and their fearsome spears 22:36:05 yeah i'd hate it 22:36:14 it sounds silly in the worst way 22:36:44 oerjan: Nice necromany bro 22:37:15 elliott: i'm surprised i've never seen an academic page telling me it's optimally viewed on Mosaic 22:37:37 you stole britland from me 22:37:38 oh right i forgot the britneys are dead 22:37:49 what I want to know is, do you have to invent the joke 22:37:55 or can you just give a good performance of an existing joke 22:38:06 depends 22:38:08 wait no, that's the whitneys. Gregor, you are confusing me... 22:38:11 is the joke "the aristocrats" 22:38:30 it says "inoffensive" 22:38:31 so no 22:41:45 OK, so Morpeth's distinguishing feature is that people pretend to know something about it <-- no it's distinguishable feature is that its name cannot possibly be real. 22:42:03 oerjan: it's the capital of northumberland 22:42:11 and apparently has the most dangerous stretch of railway in the UK 22:42:18 (which, if you think about it, has to be /somewhere/) 22:42:27 > "morpeth" \\ "northumberland" 22:42:28 "p" 22:42:42 > "morpeth" \\ "northumberland capital" 22:42:44 "" 22:42:58 see, they just made up a name from letters in the phrase 22:43:23 am I going to have to visit Morpeth to determine its existence? 22:43:28 that'd probably be quite expensive 22:43:31 obviously. 22:43:32 it's at the far end of the country 22:43:41 we can send elliott or Taneb instead, I guess, they're a lot nearer 22:43:53 yes, but you're in the middle, not in cornwall 22:44:02 ais523: we could go to morpeth together 22:44:07 that would be stornger evidence 22:44:11 it ankh morpork a pun on morpeth 22:44:21 elliott: we wouldn't be going there directly unless we were coming from the same place 22:44:23 *together 22:44:23 maybe it's the other way around 22:44:34 otherwise we'd be arriving there together, but not going there together 22:44:35 ais523: well, we could both go there 22:44:37 and then be there, together 22:45:12 you'd be doing something together 22:45:19 quintopia: i'm not sure pratchett uses puns much for his place names? 22:45:21 but, "chatting in #esoteric" is also something 22:45:59 actually, chatting in #esoteric is nothing 22:50:24 well 22:50:27 in a sense yes 22:50:44 if someone were to ask me what i'm doing right now, i'd say "shopping for health insurance" 22:50:48 and if i weren't doing that 22:50:51 "nothing" 22:55:31 oh no I forgot how awful the US's health system is 22:56:01 health insurance exists in the UK too, but because the government runs a free health service, the health insurers have to do a lot in order to offer value for money 22:56:20 what we lack in useful services we make up for with FREEDOM 22:56:43 FREEDOM to pay a lot for healthcare! 22:57:01 * Bike sets loose a crying, anemic eagle 22:57:55 as an example: a while ago I woke up on Sunday morning and discovere that one of my eyes was swollen, we went to an NHS-run clinic that was open on Sundays, they had a doctor look at it, (correctly) tell me what was wrong, prescribe some medicine, and let me know what shops would be able to sell the medicine to me that were open on Sunday 22:58:05 and the cost of the medicine was subsidized by the government 22:58:08 ais523: but your FREEDOM 22:58:16 diagnosis was free, the medicine was less than £10 after the subsidy 22:58:42 `help quote 22:58:42 Runs arbitrary code in GNU/Linux. Type "`", or "`run " for full shell commands. "`fetch " downloads files. Files saved to $PWD are persistent, and $PWD/bin is in $PATH. $PWD is a mercurial repository, "`revert " can be used to revert to a revision. See http://codu.org/projects/hackbot/fshg/ 22:58:54 how do I add quote 22:58:59 Fiora: `addquote 22:59:02 okay 22:59:06 `? quotestyle 22:59:08 quotestyle? ¯\(°_o)/¯ 22:59:21 `qdbformat 22:59:22 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: qdbformat: not found 22:59:27 `? qdbformat 22:59:29 qdbformat is: message; * nick action; two spaces between messages; all elisions marked with [...] other than irrelevant intervening messages; for messages separated by elision, one space on each side, not two 22:59:31 stupid everything 22:59:33 `? qdbformat 22:59:35 qdbformat is: message; * nick action; two spaces between messages; all elisions marked with [...] other than irrelevant intervening messages; for messages separated by elision, one space on each side, not two 22:59:49 Bike: no fair doing that while I'm reading scrollback and so can't see recent messages 22:59:55 oh do I have to add ;s? 23:00:04 no, you don't 23:00:05 eh, no 23:00:06 that bit's misleading 23:00:10 just two spaces between messages 23:00:10 double-spaces 23:00:19 `addquote Sgeo_, are you just trying to post kmcbait... *Fiora imagines a cardboard box propped up by a stick with a pile of monads inside. Fiora: that is actually what Haskell is. 23:00:19 also imo you should just add whatever and let whoever actually cares fix it 23:00:23 974) Sgeo_, are you just trying to post kmcbait... *Fiora imagines a cardboard box propped up by a stick with a pile of monads inside. Fiora: that is actually what Haskell is. 23:00:30 Fiora: you did it wrong 23:00:33 :< 23:00:34 Fiora: it will be deleted 23:00:37 ;-; 23:00:42 the tyranny of the qdb 23:00:57 I like that quote 23:01:15 but yeah, you want a space between * and Fiora 23:01:22 <_> oops 23:01:24 how do I fix that 23:01:31 `delquote 974 23:01:33 `echo quote 23:01:35 ​*poof* Sgeo_, are you just trying to post kmcbait... *Fiora imagines a cardboard box propped up by a stick with a pile of monads inside. Fiora: that is actually what Haskell is. 23:01:37 wow 23:01:37 quote 23:01:38 just 23:01:40 i need to stop 23:01:42 `addquote Sgeo_, are you just trying to post kmcbait... * Fiora imagines a cardboard box propped up by a stick with a pile of monads inside. Fiora: that is actually what Haskell is. 23:01:45 974) Sgeo_, are you just trying to post kmcbait... * Fiora imagines a cardboard box propped up by a stick with a pile of monads inside. Fiora: that is actually what Haskell is. 23:01:55 Bike: good command 23:01:57 a cardboard box with read and blue pipes 23:02:00 `quote quote 23:02:01 28) i can get an erection out of a plank, you can quote me on that. \ 68) [Warrigal] `addquote hahaha, Lawlabee is running windows 'cuz it's pretty awesome. [Lawlabee] Warrigal: :( \ 69) Note that quote number 124 is not actually true. \ 77) let's put that in the HackEgo quotes files, just to completely mystif 23:02:03 *red 23:02:23 it might also have lead pipes 23:02:30 red led pipes 23:04:11 * ais523 defines Tetris 23:04:31 `quote 77 23:04:33 77) let's put that in the HackEgo quotes files, just to completely mystify anyone who looks back along them in the future 23:05:33 `quine quine 23:05:37 ​`quine quine 23:05:44 i.e. let's put the quote about putting something in the quotes files in the quotes files to mystify us now? 23:05:56 `quine no 23:05:59 ​`quine no 23:06:21 `quote 76 23:06:23 76) so a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.com might be self-relative, but a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.com always means a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.com.? 23:06:24 `quine race condition 23:06:26 oko 23:06:28 oko 23:07:33 `run echo eniuq | rev | sh 23:07:36 ​`run echo eniuq | rev | sh 23:08:07 `run quine | rev 23:08:10 ver | eniuq nur` 23:08:15 "| sh" ? 23:08:35 oh, I see 23:08:44 you're running quine but encrypting its name 23:09:56 how did the race condition thing happen 23:10:15 does `quine just echo back the last line sent to the channel? 23:10:24 MAYBE 23:10:24 Is that how domain names work? 23:10:33 that's a pretty lame implementation 23:10:33 zzo38: no. 23:10:59 hm... 23:11:02 `ps 23:11:04 ​ PID TTY TIME CMD \ 280 ? 00:00:00 init \ 282 ? 00:00:00 sh \ 284 ? 00:00:00 ps \ 285 ? 00:00:00 cat 23:11:10 quintopia: on the flipside it's hilariously bad 23:11:30 Bike: actually, it's the only way to get stuff like oerjan's encrypted call to work 23:11:39 `ps | sed s'/ */ /g' 23:11:40 ERROR: Garbage option. \ ********* simple selection ********* ********* selection by list ********* \ -A all processes -C by command name \ -N negate selection -G by real group ID (supports names) \ -a all w/ tty except session leaders -U by real user ID (supports names) \ -d all except session leaders 23:11:42 quintopia: `quine reads the logs and copies the last line 23:11:44 `run ps | sed s'/ */ /g' 23:11:45 ​ PID TTY TIME CMD \ 280 ? 00:00:00 init \ 282 ? 00:00:00 sh \ 284 ? 00:00:00 bash \ 285 ? 00:00:00 cat \ 287 ? 00:00:00 ps \ 288 ? 00:00:00 sed 23:11:53 HackEgo: wat. 23:11:57 well, i suppose it isn't the only way 23:12:16 but it is the only way without modifying HackEgo's core code 23:12:36 oerjan: sed -e 23:12:38 quintopia: i was wondering if it would be possible to get the information out of ps instead 23:12:58 elliott: no i was just missing `run 23:13:08 oerjan: what are you trying to get out? 23:13:37 olsner: the current HackEgo command line 23:14:01 oerjan: hmm maybe 23:14:33 `run ps | sed s'/ */ /g' 23:14:34 ​ PID TTY TIME CMD \ 280 ? 00:00:00 init \ 282 ? 00:00:00 sh \ 284 ? 00:00:00 bash \ 285 ? 00:00:00 cat \ 287 ? 00:00:00 ps \ 288 ? 00:00:00 sed 23:14:38 `run ps -e | sed s'/ */ /g' 23:14:40 ​ PID TTY TIME CMD \ 1 ? 00:00:00 init \ 2 ? 00:00:00 kthreadd \ 3 ? 00:00:00 ksoftirqd/0 \ 4 ? 00:00:00 kworker/0:0 \ 5 ? 00:00:00 kworker/0:0H \ 6 ? 00:00:00 kworker/u:0 \ 7 ? 00:00:00 kworker/u:0H \ 8 ? 00:00:00 cpuset \ 9 ? 00:00:00 khelper \ 10 ? 00:00:00 kdevtmpfs \ 11 ? 00:00:00 netns \ 12 ? 00:00:00 kworker/u:1 \ 45 ? 00:00:0 23:15:00 `run ps -e | sed s'/ */ /g' | grep ps 23:15:01 ​ 287 ? 00:00:00 ps 23:15:20 doesn't look promising 23:16:28 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 23:17:04 `run ps -e | sed s'/ */ /g' | grep run 23:17:05 No output. 23:21:08 -!- augur has joined. 23:21:11 `run ps -o cmd 23:21:12 CMD \ /init \ sh -c 'env' 'PATH=/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin' 'HACKENV=/hackenv' 'http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1:3128' 'LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8' '/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits' 'bash' '-c' 'ps -o cmd' | cat \ ps -o cmd \ cat 23:22:16 nice jorb 23:22:39 not sure what you were trying to do, hope that helps 23:23:52 `run ps -o cmd | grep 'ps*' 23:23:53 sh -c 'env' 'PATH=/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin' 'HACKENV=/hackenv' 'http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1:3128' 'LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8' '/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits' 'bash' '-c' 'ps -o cmd | grep '\''ps*'\''' | cat \ bash -c ps -o cmd | grep 'ps*' \ ps -o cmd \ grep ps* 23:24:07 `run ps -o cmd | grep "'ps*'" 23:24:08 No output. 23:24:16 i am terrible at regex 23:24:24 `run ps -o cmd | grep "\'ps*\'" 23:24:26 No output. 23:24:30 `run (echo '#!/bin/sh'; echo "ps -o cmd") >bin/psocmd; chmod +x bin/psocmd 23:24:34 No output. 23:24:38 `psocmd 23:24:39 CMD \ /init \ sh -c 'env' 'PATH=/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin' 'HACKENV=/hackenv' 'http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1:3128' 'LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8' '/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits' 'psocmd' | cat \ /bin/sh /hackenv/bin/psocmd \ cat \ ps -o cmd 23:25:56 `run ps -o cmd | grep limits 23:25:57 sh -c 'env' 'PATH=/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin' 'HACKENV=/hackenv' 'http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1:3128' 'LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8' '/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits' 'bash' '-c' 'ps -o cmd | grep limits' | cat \ bash -c ps -o cmd | grep limits \ grep limits 23:26:29 `run ps -o cmd | grep 'lim[i]ts' 23:26:30 sh -c 'env' 'PATH=/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin' 'HACKENV=/hackenv' 'http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1:3128' 'LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8' '/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits' 'bash' '-c' 'ps -o cmd | grep '\''lim[i]ts'\''' | cat 23:27:51 `run ps -o cmd | grep 'lim[i]ts' 23:27:53 sh -c 'env' 'PATH=/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin' 'HACKENV=/hackenv' 'http_proxy=http://127.0.0.1:3128' 'LANG=en_NZ.UTF-8' '/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits' 'bash' '-c' ' ps -o cmd | grep '\''lim[i]ts'\''' | cat 23:30:37 oh the limits one probably does an exec or something 23:30:48 `cat /home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits 23:30:49 ​#!/bin/bash \ ulimit -f 10240 \ ulimit -l 0 \ ulimit -u 128 \ exec -- "$@" 23:30:59 yeah 23:34:08 -!- GOMADWarrior has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 23:34:11 looks complicated anyhow 23:38:13 -!- nooodl has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 23:42:41 clojure is actually pretty good 23:42:49 i think i like it 23:44:29 -!- carado_ has joined. 23:50:40 -!- carado has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 23:52:23 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 23:54:54 -!- nooga has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 23:59:08 -!- SirCmpwn has quit (Excess Flood).