< 1388966659 99582 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> ৭٩ < 1388966660 191175 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : :1:1: lexical error at character '\2541' < 1388966676 869971 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: you disappoint me. < 1388966757 988524 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run python -c 'print int("৭٩")' < 1388966760 178982 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Traceback (most recent call last): \ File "", line 1, in \ ValueError: invalid literal for int() with base 10: '\xe0\xa7\xad\xd9\xa9' < 1388966788 398939 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run python -c 'print int("৭٩".decode("utf-8"))' < 1388966789 869403 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :79 < 1388966842 188763 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run python -c 'print ৭٩' < 1388966843 838583 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ File "", line 1 \ print ৭٩ \ ^ \ SyntaxError: invalid syntax < 1388966873 288822 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :> read "৭٩" :: Int < 1388966874 273596 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: Prelude.read: no parse < 1388966964 658959 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit its my birthday < 1388966983 648357 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, happy getting older day < 1388966996 870400 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which getting older day is it? < 1388966997 838764 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1388967006 48323 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :19 < 1388967013 890762 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay < 1388967025 998646 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did not get you anything, I'm sorry < 1388967030 788570 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :soon i will be older than you < 1388967037 99290 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :that knowledge alone is enough < 1388967085 188554 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am afraid I have engineered events such that I am always approximately 64 days older than you < 1388967111 558888 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :bastard! < 1388967138 848792 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a dastardly scheme tracing back to approximately 19 years ago < 1388967145 130456 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait if i kill you you technically stop getting older don't you < 1388967151 898932 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I... am not sure < 1388967160 68550 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But do you really think you can kill me? < 1388967163 764156 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahahahahahaha! < 1388967168 72966 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can turn into an elf! < 1388967187 689259 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb you know how i feel about elves < 1388967203 869488 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only way you could make it easier still for me to kill you is if you also turned into a swede < 1388967221 749654 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you ever successfully killed an elf, though? < 1388967239 138403 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm not talking about one of those pixies you get down the bottom of your garden, either. < 1388967277 48344 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: but swedes are not elves, and as a swede it would be trivial to kill you < 1388967292 249419 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, I'm also an Australian < 1388967301 158711 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can a Swede kill an Australian!? < 1388967309 289323 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't be if you turned into a swedish elf < 1388967318 449075 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: australia = austria = switzerland = sweden < 1388967325 638596 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foiled again! < 1388967328 138815 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION dies
< 1388967447 168638 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, on the bright side, you're older than elliott < 1388967469 89317 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means he'll try to kill me! < 1388967477 328495 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: who isn't? < 1388967488 615281 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, hmmmmmm < 1388967510 778588 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :asie wasn't was he < 1388967520 549091 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, I guess < 1388967520 749265 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: and write as fnord as i'd like. but quality for sure. :) i just remembered < 1388967526 618083 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've been here quite some time though, I guess elliott might now be older than he used to be < 1388967536 498513 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :by extension nooodl probably was/isn't either? i forget though < 1388967541 289223 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: are you older? < 1388967541 648746 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: but there is naturally limit soon ( although not strictly conformant) c. this is only valid in one store, which is a problem < 1388967668 839442 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1388967716 429782 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1388968083 869632 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, seriously, though, happy birthday < 1388968114 658136 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's my first day back at uni HOW CAN THIS DAY BE HAPPY < 1388968149 8363 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you can run around the streets of Coventry screaming to the heavens about the oncoming angels < 1388968178 919073 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you by any chance know anyone by the name of Mr Green? < 1388968185 658247 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would i ruin my birthday by going into coventry < 1388968209 329362 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :God knows < 1388968212 978537 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :i went there last term for a social, we got lost and some youths on skateboards started circling in for the kill < 1388968233 783518 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :On Freshers' something similar happened to me, except they were jugglers < 1388968259 758354 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's when they're mimes you need to really be afraid. < 1388968260 178787 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jugglers can be terrifying < 1388968316 455382 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a generic god help me i'm doomed linux help channel or something < 1388968330 608465 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric, probably < 1388968337 428725 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"##Linux"? < 1388968353 184459 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :aaaaah < 1388968361 198323 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :1241 users, I'm sure you'll get very personal attention. < 1388968389 778975 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The purpose of ##Linux is to provide a fun and friendly medium for new and hardcore Linux users alike seeking help, advice and constructive discussion on Linux-related topics. The channel is for ALL levels of user experience, including none." < 1388968406 279382 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Do you self-identify as a "hardcore Linux user"?) < 1388968406 479841 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :very zen. < 1388968427 818449 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's really exciting being dumped to some absurd initramfs 'emergency shell' and being gold i might want to save whate ever the fuck to a usb and then it doesn't let me use the keyboard and god < 1388968449 508668 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :getting fucking usb power errors it's ridiculous < 1388968495 218374 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried turning it off and on again < 1388968509 338435 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: well i won't help you as my recent logreading has uncovered evidence that you may be a tzetze fly posing as a bike. < 1388968521 438539 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that so < 1388968555 114646 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also because i have no clue how to fix linux.) < 1388968613 758705 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1388968643 848273 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I certainly don't know as much about Linux as a kernel hacker or sysadmin would < 1388968644 48794 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, good sysadmin < 1388969034 112500 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :a kernel hacker wouldn't necessarily know much about what goes on in the rest of the system < 1388969049 770640 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :"that's a userspace problem" < 1388969165 628963 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed the APIs used within the kernel are often a lot cleaner than the APIs by which userspace talks to the kernel < 1388969182 738505 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there is no stability requirement on the former and a near-absolute stability requirement on the latter < 1388969359 728446 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think windows had the right idea with putting all "kernel" APIs in userspace and making the real kernel api private (but I do wonder exactly how freely they can actually change that) < 1388969370 818559 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1388969389 478553 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do some pretty insane compatibility hacks within that "userspace" component < 1388969506 108707 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2014/01/05/3120451/wyoming-law-says-better-drive-high-possess-unsmoked-joint/ < 1388969876 198980 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: oh, is that what they do? < 1388969894 789784 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never understood windows programming and none of the resources I read spelled it out < 1388970121 349254 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the bottom there's a DLL exporting functions for all "syscalls" that does int X/sysenter/syscall with the appropriate syscall number (and those change wildly between windows versions) < 1388970156 229927 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but even that might technically not be part of the API you're allowed to rely on, not entirely sure) < 1388970195 436076 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a windows programming book for unix people? < 1388970255 299029 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@S010674440130be65.cg.shawcable.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1388970376 269116 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: kernel32.dll actually is guaranteed solid API. < 1388970389 118884 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though the name is a bit of a misnomer. < 1388970407 148823 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was kinda-sorta the kernel in 16-bit Windows. < 1388970431 949613 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's why it's called kernel32 amirite < 1388970459 9579 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :All DLLs that were in 16-bit Windows made it to 32-bit Windows by just adding a "32" suffix. < 1388970465 388541 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :usb 5-1: device descriptor read/64, error -32. supposedly indicates automatic shutoff of usb device due to high power draw. but the usb devices work fine on another OS on the same computer. < 1388970477 238540 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, this kinda-sorta was the case on Windows 9x. < 1388970501 328790 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_API is more what I was thinking about, seems to be below kernel32.dll maybe < 1388970501 529011 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, like mario 64 < 1388970515 968811 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows is made up of dubious legacy decisions. < 1388970567 798572 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :computer is made up of dubious legacy decisions < 1388970582 519258 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :I,I A20 < 1388970584 898781 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :life is made up of dubious legacy decisions < 1388970587 858802 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though in the case of Windows it's decisions that were dubious at the time far too often. < 1388970603 888503 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lfimduodboseayeiin < 1388970638 88563 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(what sort of monster would use UTF-16 in '93?!?) < 1388970653 539589 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :did UTF-16 exist then? < 1388970658 628703 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1388970669 398605 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, arguably UCS-2 is the proper name. < 1388970671 528771 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not UFT-64 < 1388970677 558656 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF* < 1388970684 48816 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF-16 is from 1996 < 1388970694 108651 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you believed the Unicode people when they said it would remain a 16-bit code, then using UCS-2 seems sensible < 1388970713 425983 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that switch happened in 1996 yeah < 1388970753 300343 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except that Windows at the time did crazy stuff to make 16-bit code build on Win32. But didn't seem to care about the idea of making Unicode-unaware code work in Unicode land. < 1388970763 308531 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And indeed still don't. < 1388970876 268951 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And now Windows is a crazy land where you either do UTF-16 or do 8-bit legacy charsets. < 1388970975 98903 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://support.microsoft.com/kb/99884 < 1388970975 337864 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION honestly doesn't know why they don't let you just use UTF-8 for their char* APIs
< 1388971041 888866 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice, wikipedia seems to have quite a lot of articles about windows internals < 1388971046 718602 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not all that relevant. UTF-16 was a bad decision at the time. < 1388971062 100431 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF-16 didn't exist at the time < 1388971073 68576 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blah. < 1388971078 848961 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :UCS-2 was a bad decision. < 1388971080 668860 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor did UTF-8, probably < 1388971086 429547 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF-8 certainly did. < 1388971104 631215 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF-8 was *new* to be sure, but hey. < 1388971121 218582 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plan 9 was completely on UTF-8 in September '92. < 1388971174 918791 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :draft unicode standard: 1988; first unicode volume: 1991; windows nt release: 1993 < 1388971180 451603 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :utf-8 first officially presented: 1993 < 1388971197 79203 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also doesn't matter that much: UCS-2 was an awful decision even if there was no alternative way of encoding Unicode. < 1388971212 127838 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows has had enough opportunities to redesign that portion of the code and keep legacy APIs around only where necessary < 1388971212 328066 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my theory is that they had to pretend it would stay a 16-bit code or nobody would adopt it at all < 1388971313 508572 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should try to learn about Windows internals < 1388971374 808724 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hmm, all text is in ASCII or a superset thereof. Let's use something completely incompatible! Oh, and then make it so that everyone has to rewrite all their code to work with it. Great!" < 1388971380 322231 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: nooooo you have so much to live for < 1388971396 405936 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: but everyone else here knows Windows internals. It sounds fun < 1388971417 689073 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: but they were getting ready for The Future! < 1388971469 208669 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This from a company that is yet to break DOS compatibility. < 1388971540 388933 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't knock DOS. it lets you use / as a directory separator! it's practically unix < 1388971911 249079 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but doesn't it also use / for flags < 1388972154 649645 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://paste.debian.net/74463/ woot woot. < 1388973337 978695 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: there's an option to have / as separator and - for flags < 1388973341 38708 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's kind-of hidden < 1388973423 278955 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it actually work, or does it only work for programs that happen to use some DOS api for parsing the command line? < 1388973483 828885 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: probably the latter < 1388973543 249904 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc on DOS/Windows a program gets a single arg string and not an argv < 1388973556 468890 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the job of the c stdlib to break it up for main() < 1388973587 19191 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: on DOS, the first command argument is actually parsed out into a file control block for you < 1388973599 149514 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but people stopped using that feature after a while because it's too inflexible < 1388973638 799447 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just thought of something < 1388973650 278699 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :minimum ascending number partition < 1388973685 690075 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :So for example, 18249 could be partitioned into [18,249] < 1388973713 549521 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 31415926535 into [3,14,159,26,5,35]? < 1388973716 529651 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :But [1,8,249] would be better < 1388973721 839509 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the sum is smaller < 1388973732 989204 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: Nope < 1388973735 870177 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what? so they just assume the first arg will be a file? < 1388973737 66440 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get the point, [1,8,2,4,9] would be the best < 1388973738 879309 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :159 is larger than 26 < 1388973742 103662 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1388973745 458660 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has to be ascending < 1388973750 89575 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1388973763 619477 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: if it isn't, you don't use the FCB < 1388973766 169413 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can partition any part of the numeric string but the parts should be increasing, right? < 1388973769 548712 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah, really inflexible < 1388973773 440945 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it doesn't work with directories < 1388973775 199633 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :A worst case would be something like 987654321 < 1388973775 869154 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :drive and filename only < 1388973782 479719 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so people don't use it past, like, DOS 1 < 1388973838 738786 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which would partition into [9,876,54321] I think < 1388973865 870037 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [9,87,654321] < 1388973867 27287 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 654417 < 1388973871 219938 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [9,876,54321] < 1388973872 398326 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 55206 < 1388973883 290251 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I think [9,876,54321] is minimal < 1388973889 338483 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so < 1388973948 960008 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that in unary, all partitionings are minimal < 1388973961 289045 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :So binary is the first interesting case < 1388974006 369506 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can't do this to complex numbers since those don't have a built-in ordering < 1388974423 518885 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [98,765,4321] -- i disagree < 1388974424 469032 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 5184 < 1388974450 558886 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought so* < 1388974457 941669 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1388974603 99383 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :now find one where minimizing the length of the final one is _not_ optimal. < 1388974653 368644 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: should it be strictly ascending < 1388974669 414088 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Nice < 1388974694 628860 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there one? < 1388974719 734997 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't even know what's causing this error. < 1388974724 908569 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's reporting the error < 1388974733 278510 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's try the first 7 digits of pi < 1388974734 209600 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> pi < 1388974735 288464 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 3.141592653589793 < 1388974744 509199 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :3141592 < 1388974757 889519 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1388974760 979789 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> e < 1388974761 935141 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : e < 1388974764 198960 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1388974769 988769 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> exp 1 < 1388974771 108528 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 2.718281828459045 < 1388974795 429052 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :271828182 make that 9 digits < 1388974810 825589 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: do you know a way to raise a continued fraction (given as a left-to-right digit generator) can be raised to a power (also a continued fraction in the same format)? < 1388974813 8975 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [27,182,8182] < 1388974813 930085 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 14 15 92 looks plausible < 1388974814 288795 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 8391 < 1388974817 78669 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :31, 41, 592 < 1388974845 298796 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, lost. < 1388974851 881045 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cackles evilly
< 1388974866 439324 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: integer power? < 1388974874 628527 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if we should stay as strictly ascending, or if we should make it strictly non-descending < 1388974917 638712 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: i don't even know if there's an efficient way to _add_ numbers. < 1388974934 659313 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: i don't even know a way to do it with integer power except a crap ton of adding and multiplying using the binomial theorem, but i want to know about real powers too. < 1388974952 759548 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably you'd exponentiate < 1388975007 628748 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Very tricky < 1388975022 574608 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: adding only inefficient if the bottom part of the fraction is the same < 1388975023 418534 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: presumably. < 1388975035 338525 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, only efficient < 1388975141 239215 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [2,7,18,28,182] -- tip, there's never a point in keeping the first two digits together if they're ascending < 1388975142 448684 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 237 < 1388975163 849021 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :this problem FreeFull posed seems almost as difficult as the one about free-form series for brainfuck constants < 1388975215 368944 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Good point < 1388975233 19092 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think extending that to multiple digits is the answer < 1388975234 648901 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think any example that _doesn't_ fulfil my idea of making the length of the last one minimal must be pretty long. < 1388975251 38709 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Does it exist? < 1388975324 478844 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [98,765,4321] < 1388975325 657087 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 5184 < 1388975343 939507 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm. < 1388975355 924966 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: something like 12121212121212199 < 1388975379 928743 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [1,2,12,12,12,12,12,12,12,199] < 1388975380 959704 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 286 < 1388975412 110145 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [1,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,99] < 1388975413 198846 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 268 < 1388975419 448770 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops not quite < 1388975460 148789 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [1,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,99] < 1388975461 248729 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 331 < 1388975463 488993 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Not strictly ascending anymore < 1388975467 569413 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [1,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,99] < 1388975468 688898 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 331 < 1388975477 81503 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [1,2,12,12,12,12,12,12,12,12,12,12,199] < 1388975478 219159 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 322 < 1388975505 8968 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: i didn't hear a clear policy statement on that. < 1388975519 189706 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's make it strictly ascending, for now < 1388975538 549030 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 is basically free? < 1388975561 319152 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1388975563 650556 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 is nasty < 1388975565 410028 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the only case where you could have a longer sequence followed by a shorter one < 1388975574 89005 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1,042,99] < 1388975584 478777 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :for 10000000, you can't split the sequence at all. < 1388975589 148649 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the other way around < 1388975596 858557 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would have assumed you cannot have initial zeros. < 1388975598 518485 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Yeah, there are unsplittable numbers < 1388975621 999023 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how the ratio of unsplittable to splittable changes < 1388975626 69971 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :As you go up < 1388975649 592987 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you can split off the first digit for almost all numbers < 1388975660 999936 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :All one-digit numbers are unsplittable < 1388975684 788585 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two digit numbers are unsplittable if the first digit is larger or equal to the second < 1388975704 419289 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should we count 03 as a two-digit number? < 1388975758 299210 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: splitting off the first digit isn't always optimal. < 1388975766 668650 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we do, that's 10 + 9 + 8 + 7 + 6 + 5 + 4 + 3 + 2 + 1 unsplittable two-digit numbers, I think < 1388975775 348788 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is that splittable < 1388975785 269532 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sum [1..10] < 1388975786 398870 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 55 < 1388975807 349381 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm three quarters asleep < 1388975827 549510 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right sleep < 1388975837 498719 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow i don't like the strictly ascending rule. narrows the possibilities too much < 1388975853 998938 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Gnith < 1388975931 711908 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: 45 splittable, 55 non-splittable, that includes numbers with leading zeros like 00. < 1388976024 989059 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Three-digit numbers are trickier < 1388976035 208964 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.twitch.tv/speeddemosarchivesda < 1388976069 69183 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, for three digit numbers it might just depend on the first two digits anyway < 1388976080 378909 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: not really. 55 of those are non-splittable. < 1388976082 638880 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it doesn't < 1388976098 698944 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: because if the middle digit is non-zero then the number is splittable < 1388976099 398940 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, for 3-digit < 1388976108 718349 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: so do I < 1388976119 849898 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: 100 isn't splittable < 1388976131 999437 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :that has a zero center digit < 1388976146 502492 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, I misread your sentence < 1388976160 496601 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, you're right < 1388976172 759510 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you sure it's 55 though? < 1388976200 528643 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, 001 to 009 are splittable < 1388976222 899436 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :000 is splittable too < 1388976235 659341 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :a(0)b is splittable if a < b. < 1388976241 599276 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the same as with two digits. < 1388976291 109154 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, you're right < 1388976297 29009 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about four digits? < 1388976310 958634 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :55 nonsplittable ones, again < 1388976325 849370 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :n000 is non-splittable, trivially < 1388976337 9222 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :For any number of zeroes after the n < 1388976362 668656 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then I guess there is a00b for any number of 0s < 1388976372 778757 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :more to the point, you can split abcd into a,bcd if bc>0 or if a let v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n <= head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) . show in f 987654321 < 1388977869 769172 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [98,765,4321] < 1388977888 220802 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n <= head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) . show in f 9876543210 < 1388977889 239101 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [9,87,654,3210] < 1388977907 689626 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a brute force search? < 1388977936 440255 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n <= head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) . show in f 1212121212121212199 < 1388977937 379076 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,21,99] < 1388977941 759064 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1388977946 329472 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n < head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) . show in f 1212121212121212199 < 1388977947 449235 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,12,121,212,1212,12199] < 1388977970 189391 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's the "natural" dynamic programming approach. So it's rather efficient. < 1388978014 569272 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :not clear what the natural dynamic programming approach would be here < 1388978020 479392 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i am shit at parsing haskell < 1388978085 329533 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :explain? < 1388978334 349612 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, we have this sequence d_i (1 <= i <= n) of digits that we somehow split into numbers. Assume that one of these numbers is d_(k..l). Then how to split d_(l+1)...d_n optimally does not depend on d_1..d_(k-1). < 1388978458 190696 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let splitOptimal = f where v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n < head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) . show < 1388978459 62102 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : .L.hs:152:62: < 1388978459 263796 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (Show a0) arising from a use of `show' < 1388978459 263955 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : The type variable `a0' is ambiguous < 1388978459 264049 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : Possible cause: the monomorphism restriction applied to the following: < 1388978459 264144 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : splitOptimal :: a0 -> [Integer] (bound at .L.hs:143:1) < 1388978495 520305 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let splitOptimal :: Show a => a -> [Integer]; splitOptimal = f where v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n < head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) . show < 1388978496 879341 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : Defined. < 1388978506 779398 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :A bit hairy < 1388978524 349914 :ter2!~tertu@143.44.70.199 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1388978528 36534 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal 100001 < 1388978530 251763 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [100001] < 1388978540 939226 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal 101101 < 1388978542 329423 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,1101] < 1388978557 869127 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal 101102 < 1388978559 259420 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [101,102] < 1388978560 369901 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :v n < head t <-- that's the strictly increasing version. < 1388978567 210738 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal 31415926535897932 < 1388978567 899500 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep < 1388978568 599451 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [31,41,59,265,3589,7932] < 1388978584 140016 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be nice to have some sort of proof it is optimal < 1388978588 599006 :myndzi\!~myndzi@50-194-51-62-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net NICK :myndzi < 1388978593 329511 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal $ 2^100 < 1388978594 919660 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,6,76,506,22822,94014,96703,205376] < 1388978614 211720 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :trust me? ;-) < 1388978632 959275 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal 10000000000000000000001 < 1388978634 359405 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [10000000000000000000001] < 1388978850 859146 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimal 0000032 < 1388978852 160293 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [32] < 1388978861 429132 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see, it just truncates the zeroes off < 1388978934 280283 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let splitOptimalS = f where v = foldl' (\n r -> n*10+r) 0;m = minimumBy (comparing sum);b [] = [[[]]];b xs = let b' = b (tail xs) in [v n : m t' | (n,t) <- zip (tail (inits xs)) b', let t' = filter (\t -> null t || v n < head t) t, not (null t')] : b'; f = m . head . b . map (fromIntegral . digitToInt) < 1388978935 508512 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : Defined. < 1388978963 389520 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> splitOptimalS "000000000000001" -- hmm, it'll still drop zeros in the output. < 1388978964 969765 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : [0,1] < 1388979661 679206 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: http://sprunge.us/fPSP works out a couple of steps of the dynamic programming idea. < 1388979753 719805 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: no what little you explained is enough. it's kind of what i was thinking of anyway. < 1388979845 959768 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: and the running time should be something like n^2? < 1388979937 426742 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :n^3, I think (for each pair 1 <= k < l <= n, we have up to n candidate lists to sift through. Oh and as implemented it's worse, because the sums of the list elements are not cached.) < 1388980076 150086 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: it still looks like n^2 to me (not counting the recomputation of sums) < 1388980109 469643 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: if it's n^3, what are the three dimensions of the "table"? < 1388980119 286996 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: just look at the worked out example; there are O(n^2) rows, and each row has O(n) lists to consider. < 1388980131 699984 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: there are only two dimensions, but computing each entry takes O(n) steps. < 1388980137 99628 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1388980195 769728 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which I think can be reduced to O(log(n)) but that would be messy and require arrays, perhaps even mutable ones. So ... no.) < 1388980275 489940 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i see. n^3, but the coefficient is very low (like 1/3 maybe) < 1388980279 509747 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/6 < 1388980330 929591 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. < 1388980422 282588 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"ask for 11 numbers to be read into a sequence S" < 1388980426 64860 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is this shit? Groovy? < 1388980437 959696 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought Groovy was supposed to be like a scripting Java < 1388980448 110275 :myndzi!~myndzi@50-194-51-62-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel slightly embarrassed every time i go to hang out in sda chat because i have ops and probably nobody knows why < 1388980448 929808 :myndzi!~myndzi@50-194-51-62-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1388980455 709419 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that's from pseudocode describing an algorithm < 1388980456 409692 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :derp < 1388980468 579743 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good job < 1388980528 279615 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pah. A program should not simply ask for numbers. It should beg, it should plead, it should grovel! < 1388980619 689603 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :YUCK. (x > 400 ? cout << "TOO LARGE" : cout << x) << endl < 1388980641 89925 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somebody really went out of their way to prove that C++ code would be shorter than C. < 1388980949 952646 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ugly < 1388980964 310199 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :<< returns the stream? < 1388980966 440136 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unnecessary spaces though < 1388980968 869628 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :x > 400 && puts("TOO LARGE"); // Like this? < 1388980972 130560 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Yes. < 1388981001 639654 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: yes. that's why std::cout << x << "," << y << std::endl; works. < 1388981006 319860 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :great < 1388981012 619567 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Doesn't output the x < 1388981067 831378 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: Humbug. < 1388981100 160687 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :x > 400 || printf("%d\n", x) && puts("TOO LARGE"); I think. < 1388981109 799616 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could be shorter < 1388981212 929554 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: use ?:. printf returns the number of characters printed. < 1388981234 719867 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :So when x <= 400, that will print x and also TOO LARGE. < 1388981243 455387 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good catch. < 1388981266 59934 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :You only need one printf and cleverness < 1388981278 439697 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure how much cleverness < 1388981299 550472 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that printf's arguments not matching the format spec is UB. < 1388981472 344350 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :And x was supposed to be a double. < 1388981553 339400 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, there's nothing like sprintf except returning a new string. HOW UNFUNCTIONAL < 1388981571 164421 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a standard definition of topological spaces that doesn't use weird set-theoretic concepts like "union" and "intersection" and "subset" but instead talks about monomorphisms and maybe pullbacks or something like that? < 1388981578 141849 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess maybe you could end up with the whole frame/topological system that Vickers talks about. But is there something more direct and closer to the classical definition? < 1388981599 800246 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice easy concepts like pullbacks < 1388981793 187099 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you hate pullbacks < 1388981800 609846 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. < 1388981803 210153 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could have A -> B if A \subset B. But why anybody would do that to a set of sets is beyond me. < 1388981863 989647 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: homotopy theory? Not sure < 1388982082 100319 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: What do you mean? < 1388982192 749752 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://imogenquest.net/comics/2014-01-05-podbay.jpg < 1388982398 369905 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's such a dumb thing < 1388982447 750204 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :should i see that movie < 1388982471 269725 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: do you think there is virtue in distinguishing between one-element sets < 1388982512 300252 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{4} and {7} seem pretty different? < 1388982530 59911 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're isomorphic........... < 1388982547 99638 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric ::'( < 1388982640 756787 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: anyway look at section 1 of http://arxiv.org/pdf/1012.5647v3.pdf or something < 1388982661 840640 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nahhhhh < 1388982705 550495 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :h8r < 1388982707 459702 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pst i'm not confident in basic category theory or actually anything < 1388982723 110418 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok then look at http://arxiv.org/pdf/1212.6543v1.pdf < 1388982739 660539 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't even talk about categories < 1388982752 370720 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've read that and whyyyy do you direct link the pdfs :( < 1388982764 520666 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that's what i have open in my browser?? < 1388982852 801154 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1388982973 176826 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1388982983 350714 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke JOIN :#esoteric < 1388983055 293515 :preflex!~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1388983191 369850 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: you have a zillion pdfs, right < 1388983194 589877 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you keep track of them < 1388983196 250782 :preflex!~preflex@unaffiliated/mauke/bot/preflex JOIN :#esoteric < 1388983233 881035 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i thought you knew all of maths?? < 1388983287 729807 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :vague categorizations and spite < 1388983299 50131 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i only know the maths marked with an orange sticker < 1388983310 110069 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does the orange sticker mean < 1388983357 859890 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :orange stickers mark literature for fourth grade readers < 1388983368 910168 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1388983929 98422 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is installing a linux on a hard drive from a linux on a different hard drive in the same computer a sane thing to want to do < 1388983952 233403 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've done that < 1388983954 672973 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not < 1388983960 279905 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1388983971 30169 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :though i don't know how to do it. < 1388983996 70007 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :linuxfromscratch.org hth < 1388984005 882550 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, some distributions make it easier than others < 1388984044 644842 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it depends on what you're installing < 1388984118 270085 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :arch or debian i guess < 1388984150 230642 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Hard_Disk_Installation http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/ch04s04.html.en hth < 1388984156 620007 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something < 1388984164 946306 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1388984226 150038 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this seems like i'll probably fuck it up < 1388984244 520290 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you can fix it, learning all around < 1388984292 490111 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember the time when i wanted grub in the mbr so i did dd if=/dev/hda4 of=/dev/hda bs=512 count=1 < 1388984316 500443 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i even made a backup in my home directory first in case something got messed up, how helpful < 1388984407 883577 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the joke is that the partition table is stored in the mbr, as i discovered that day) < 1388984430 500241 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the worst sound of all sounds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5h411OcttA < 1388984436 54442 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good effort < 1388984486 720095 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :having an install fail by the usb inexplicably not working during boot sucks < 1388984660 172722 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1388984691 450248 :gully_foil_Ja!~theghost2@63.142.161.6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1388985666 471117 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1388986542 162067 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1388986575 261472 :tromp!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1388986830 281854 :tromp!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1388987331 358805 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.yopmail.com/en/alternate-email-address.php I somehow doubt this is secure < 1388987352 690326 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would have to check the code to see if it looks reasonable < 1388987356 560549 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which doesn't mean it is < 1388987474 820386 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sends the typed email over to the server to convert it, I think < 1388987771 517398 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just PCI passthrough and virtualize everything with dom0 snapshot unicycle. < 1388987836 610316 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, youtube now hosts 4 GB videos. < 1388988144 470142 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yeah they can read your email, huge vulnerability < 1388988186 110272 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The question is, if random person X can get the real email address from the alias < 1388988197 615826 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How does translation from lambda calculus to B,C,K,W () work? < 1388988213 140320 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depends on the distribution of X, but unlikely. < 1388988232 866434 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :translate to ski and then translate ski to bckw, oooooooobviously < 1388988253 800080 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tht's pronounced with an 'oo' like 'cool' < 1388988353 572020 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :thx < 1388988363 429951 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there something nice and structural like ski < 1388988374 526419 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :structural? < 1388988493 73128 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :who knows what i mean < 1388988552 860539 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok jstor i'm not going to pay you $24 for curry's thesis from 1930 which is in german so i won't even be able to read it < 1388988879 320221 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, zsh puts the return code of the last call just before your line < 1388988917 710473 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can get that in bash too < 1388988945 73563 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :just put $? in your PS1 < 1388988957 860280 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :gosh. < 1388989017 79980 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does zsh even do that "by default"? < 1388989285 659680 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know, the install thingie is, that's all i know < 1388990185 389748 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I added into HWPL, some new functions such as TAKE and PHYSICAL, and a few other things. I also made up a file of examples, although maybe it contains some errors, since it isn't tested. < 1388990675 381308 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1388990776 882 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1388992306 50326 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like these kind of codes? FOR ?X IN ?ADDRESS BITS: BEGIN LOCAL .REG; REGISTER .REG(?DATA); CONNECT .REG TO .DATA WHEN .READ&~|(?X^.ADDRESS); LATCH .WRITE&~|(?X^.ADDRESS) SET .REG TO .DATA; END Maybe it is wrong or inefficient or something though, but it is trying to implement RAM. Also, use of TAKE and unary % operation will be like: CONNECT TAKE(MUX(%.S,{%.I1,%.I0}))&~-./E TO .Y; < 1388992373 341668 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is ugly as fuck. < 1388992388 780174 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :To you it is! < 1388992496 234781 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You must hate it a lot, but I find it better. Maybe there is other feature other people hate of other hardware programming languages too; it is one reason why other people try to invent more possible hardware programming languages, isn't it? < 1388992523 979953 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't mean the content, i'm just saying, that has fucking "&~|(?X^." in it, that is some fucked shit. < 1388992541 90804 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can space it out more if you prefer. < 1388992575 902931 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The individual tokens there will be .WRITE & ~ | ( ?X ^ .ADDRESS ) < 1388992692 531017 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you prefer it this way? < 1388992841 730068 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the purpose of these commands clear from the example, or not? If not, you can ask for clarification, please. < 1388992898 726091 :impomatic!~digital_w@87.114.58.47 JOIN :#esoteric < 1388993206 872450 :tromp__!~tromp@rtc35-161.rentec.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1388993230 780961 :tromp__!~tromp@rtc35-161.rentec.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1388993252 73832 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT : < 1388993477 901714 :^v!~NotPing@c-71-238-153-166.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: http://i.imgur.com/MHuW96t.gif < 1388993727 990623 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/06/tech/california-crop-circle-hoax/index.html?hpt=hp_t2 < 1388993731 741641 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that... vandalism? < 1388993747 250666 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm alive... I'm alive.. I'm alive... and how I know it... but for chips and for freedom I could die < 1388994159 540746 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/1991-04-24/ < 1388994494 416836 :myndzi!~myndzi@50-194-51-62-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net NICK :2JTAAB023 < 1388994498 607157 :qlkzy!qlkzy@2a01:7e00::f03c:91ff:feae:4a4a JOIN :#esoteric < 1388994498 807449 :myndzi!myndzi@2600:3c00::f03c:91ff:fedf:3d4e JOIN :#esoteric < 1388994498 807589 :CADD!uid21876@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ukxbjokcwwtzhwco JOIN :#esoteric < 1388994537 291432 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"So Nvidia is marketing this new chip to braille users? This way blind people can see computer graphics more clearly with vivid colors. It turned out to be a public service announcement. Mystery solved!" < 1388995382 11571 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zooko%27s_triangle < 1388995388 432298 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not used to thinking of this as disproved < 1388995822 502227 :Bike!~Glossina@75-164-162-106.ptld.qwest.net QUIT :Quit: loud < 1388996659 915438 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which instructions sets would include a triple-indirect-jump-with-post-increment instruction? < 1388997031 921774 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :none < 1388997174 851749 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: [[[ax]++]]? < 1388997206 561939 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yes, like that < 1388997242 632206 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't think of an instruction set that would allow that, but not arbitrary combinations of addressing modes < 1388997522 512248 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kind of bothers me that all .bit registrations are browsable < 1388997536 964887 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't DNS attempt to deliberately prevent browsing of all registrations? < 1388997540 52605 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or am I mistaken? < 1388997565 201673 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm… I think there's a much simpler Zooko's triangle solution < 1388997577 159213 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in particular, the web-of-trust that's used for public keychains < 1388997604 693033 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's obviously decentralized, it's secure in that you know exactly how much you trust each individual entry < 1388997627 574572 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's memorable in that the keys are associated with human-readable names, and you can adopt the name associations listed by people you trust < 1388997682 272165 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's not a global naming system < 1388997692 482087 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :making names relative is one way of squaring the triangle < 1388997711 952417 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: hmm, the description doesn't imply "global" < 1388997713 621849 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus, there's no way of going name -> key uniquely < 1388997722 791944 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there is relative to any particular person < 1388997730 542073 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the "name" would be an IP < 1388997734 352059 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can't adopt two name→key mappings with different names < 1388997736 732074 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Each application type that want to store data associated with an identity must be added in the registered applications list with a description on how data will be formatted." < 1388997740 124206 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then it fails human-readable (because key identifiers are not human readable) < 1388997747 191732 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How decentralized < 1388997754 279209 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess my goalposts are in different places from yours < 1388997775 802139 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I don't even quite understand what you're proposing or how it's even a naming system I guess :/ < 1388997844 112494 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't realise that the article was about naming systems < 1388998257 712577 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delegate your domain and subdomains to DNS servers: < 1388998257 950451 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Recommended : < 1388998257 950643 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :{"ns": ["ns0.web-sweet-web.net", "ns1.web-sweet-web.net", "ns0.xname.org"]} < 1388998269 995431 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh.... so basically, point to normal DNS? < 1388998330 151940 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think "DNS" itself really attempts to prevent browsing of all entries, though maybe the DNSSEC no-enumeration NSEC3 stuff counts. < 1388998342 703056 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Common DNS deployment practices do, sure.) < 1388998373 983379 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1388998391 691954 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are .pif files still alive in some shape or form? (Sure it's relevant.) < 1388998582 992170 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I think so. < 1388998591 862148 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though they should not work on windows 64-bit anymore < 1388998615 682201 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and as far as I know windows 32 bit requires you to enable a feature to execute 16bit programs < 1388998625 782194 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but 64bit versions don't ship with support for 16bit programs anymore < 1388998640 605650 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you should need an emulator, I suppose, in such a case. < 1388998646 719590 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and by windows 32 bit I mean windows >= 7 perhaps? < 1388998659 397648 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :windows xp executes 16bit programs by default < 1388998737 297220 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :although < 1388998742 811934 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :PIF's aren't really executables < 1388998777 65298 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, I should try to get Microsoft Ants working in VM < 1388998784 392013 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I miss Ants < 1388998810 400210 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's to blame for my habit of saying ??? when I'm confused (I did eventually drop that habit) < 1388998857 671709 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can PIFs point to 32/64bit programs? < 1388998985 731859 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interweb is saying that 32-bit Windows 8 still makes a .pif file if you try to make a shortcut to a 16-bit DOS executable. < 1388999043 833288 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok. < 1388999063 152665 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows 64bit might still do that without being able to actually run a 16bit program < 1388999084 662649 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :which would not be really helpful at all < 1388999116 252662 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1388999121 121897 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :where can I see if I have Win64? < 1388999136 671945 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah there < 1388999138 941938 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :SysWOW64 < 1388999139 602050 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1388999199 272482 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. < 1388999213 182827 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :rightclick -> create shortcut on a .com-file does not work < 1388999224 972412 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I just created an empty txt file and renamed it to com < 1389000486 31817 :oklopol__!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi NICK :oklopol < 1389000495 571536 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i did some google searching with python < 1389000510 491765 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and apparently google banned me forever (except if i use chrome) < 1389000534 232265 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did a search every minute or so, and when the search failed i added another minute < 1389000555 682179 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what they have APIs for. < 1389000565 102722 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ioccc winning sources are released < 1389000573 991794 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i didn't find it < 1389000575 862454 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: See: topic. < 1389000578 572862 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1389000581 971885 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found apis for everything but search < 1389000590 693854 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1389000595 41777 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i mean i found one < 1389000596 1860 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Why didn't you... Google for it. < 1389000608 937296 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it seemed too hard to use < 1389000618 201691 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pygoogle was much easier < 1389000656 152463 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Don’t misuse our Services. For example, don't -- try to access them using a method other than the interface and the instructions that we provide." < 1389000659 382467 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's what they say. < 1389000690 161933 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you talking about the deprecated one? < 1389000693 532986 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :or which one < 1389000712 189384 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fun fact: If you desperately google for something < 1389000714 831538 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :they'll ban you too < 1389000726 551668 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :the custom search they link looked more like something that lets you put a search box on your website < 1389000741 12144 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got banned googlig (manually) for about 10 minutes. < 1389000776 293095 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Ban forever? < 1389000794 345220 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :well obviously i haven't checked that < 1389000802 252773 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, obviously < 1389000817 741573 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I thought they give you the chance to answer a captcha < 1389000836 591892 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably, i don't know what's going on because i'm using pygoogle < 1389000839 141699 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :to prove that your not some bot. < 1389000839 981118 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i don't know what it does < 1389000845 371911 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :*you're < 1389000851 375605 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: That may be what it looks like, but it has the https://developers.google.com/custom-search/json-api/v1/overview half. < 1389000917 811869 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also the "custom search box" side is not only for "search my site only", but also "make a topical search engine that rewrites queries" or whatnot.) < 1389000923 161972 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it comes out as json then it's already a million times harder than pygoogle < 1389000935 753140 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but perhaps doable < 1389000977 152414 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :C and C++ have so crazy corners < 1389001073 321788 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow that sounds complicated < 1389001095 792205 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have used an api key thingie once but it was php so i could just copypaste stuff < 1389001160 32556 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1389001212 232695 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :For smaller sites, Google Site Search starts at just $100 for up to 20,000 annual searches. For usage above one million searches, enterprise-level support and offline purchasing are available. < 1389001227 722062 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :20000 annual ones is 100 dollars? < 1389001239 761505 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1389001241 191779 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to do 1400 queries, i figured that's nothing < 1389001250 141811 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :GSS is a whole another thing than CSE, though. < 1389001254 511459 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know, but still < 1389001284 841716 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"For CSE users, the API provides 100 search queries per day for free. If you need more, you may sign up for billing in the Cloud Console. Additional requests cost $5 per 1000 queries, up to 10k queries per day." < 1389001360 581503 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's this "pygoogle" anyway? The first hit I get just goes "Unfortunately, Google no longer supports the SOAP API for search, nor do they provide new license keys. In a nutshell, PyGoogle is pretty much dead at this point", and the second and third ones seemed to be using the deprecated-but-still-working web search APIs. (Which I think has just a "50 queries per day without an API key" limit ... < 1389001366 571721 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :... and no more complicated bans than that.) < 1389001399 693537 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pygoogle is what i found by searching for python google search < 1389001402 821785 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :consistently < 1389001421 855045 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :also xgoogle and some other thing but someone somewhere said they don't work anymore so i didn't try them < 1389001443 722618 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also the https://developers.google.com/api-client-library/python/start/get_started thing. < 1389001468 690310 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently i never found the page that's the first hit with "pygoogle" < 1389001473 340971 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i never searched for pygoogle) < 1389001514 883054 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The official Google-provided Python thing does seem to list Custom Search as one of their supported APIs. But it does have that 100-queries-a-day limit if you want it to be entirely free.) < 1389001537 151481 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :that looks like i need to spend hours decrypting it < 1389001565 771723 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pygoogle was more like import pygoogle and a = pygoogle.search(url).number_or_results() < 1389001572 521708 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yeah i guess i need to do that < 1389001573 571542 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :asdsad < 1389001595 959338 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :money is not an issue, but yeah paying is a bit too complicated < 1389001633 931687 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The "Simple API example" code is not really all that more complicated. < 1389001682 291877 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's also not terribly complicated to make a "project" in their "console"; I did that once for their big-data query-executing thingamajick. < 1389001759 981529 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Though I admit they could provide more "anonymous access is supported with one query per minute" kind of features.) < 1389001783 841431 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably not complicated once you get it, but understanding apis and such is the hardest thing in the world < 1389001787 521499 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for me) < 1389001813 491961 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's not like they'd notice that in their flood of search requests via the web interface, and nobody's going to be building a Real Service on something like that, hopefully.) < 1389001840 312006 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah basically my hope was that they wouldn't mind me slowly querying over the night < 1389001873 363067 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should've probably just used something that crawls the web interface for that. :p < 1389001906 803043 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They got (in 2013), on average, 5922000000 requests per day. < 1389001935 1528 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i considered that, but again that sounded a bit complicated < 1389001975 892940 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially as i'm on linux and i have no idea how the api works (or whatever it's called) < 1389002016 419803 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcolor used to just use the web interface of Google image search, because they didn't have a programmatic API for it at the time. < 1389002069 161518 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I'm not sure if they do have one now either. < 1389002126 501347 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently, since that, they made one and deprecated it already, then spent some more time API-less, then added image search functionality in the Custom Search thing. < 1389002295 721296 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried to make an api key and now i made a client id and have no idea how to make an api key < 1389002311 641347 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i have no idea what a client id is < 1389002370 391234 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently it's for those things that require authentication. < 1389002387 402718 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think the custom search one does. < 1389002520 311679 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :From what I recall, the "workflow" is such that you get in the google cloud service buzzword developer console, make a "project", go to "APIs" and toggle the ones you want to use "on", then go to "credentials" and select the "Public API access" one (and not the "OAuth Client ID" one). < 1389002569 1746 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I need to go meet some relatives now. < 1389002582 41392 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :have fun < 1389002585 484186 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to do the same soon < 1389002814 421265 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.machinadynamica.com/machina31.htm < 1389003904 296930 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella JOIN :#esoteric < 1389005460 951671 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@HSI-KBW-37-49-6-33.hsi14.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1389006793 49724 :ter2!~tertu@143.44.70.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389006978 67940 :tertu!~tertu@143.44.70.199 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1389007339 738424 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi NICK :yesrtti < 1389007359 237871 :yesrtti!nortti@nano.smar.fi NICK :nortti < 1389007487 999142 :heroux!~heroux@50708181.static.ziggozakelijk.nl QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1389008009 463021 :tertu3!~tertu@143.44.70.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389008210 90874 :ter2!~tertu@143.44.70.199 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1389008446 715432 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1389008557 100516 :jix!~jix@jixco.de QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1389008564 460643 :jix!~jix@jixco.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1389008952 450536 :ter2!~tertu@143.44.70.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389009183 437244 :tertu3!~tertu@143.44.70.199 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1389009225 956126 :atrapado!~dro@unaffiliated/atrapado QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1389010159 782760 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389011746 939611 :tertu3!~tertu@143.44.70.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389011747 177820 :ter2!~tertu@143.44.70.199 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1389012378 452784 :heroux!~heroux@50708181.static.ziggozakelijk.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1389012713 729801 :tertu3!~tertu@143.44.70.199 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1389012906 609772 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1389012926 389792 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389014462 319349 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? arrows < 1389014466 501560 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1389014481 907347 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn arrows are just strong monads in the category of profunctors < 1389014486 979705 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew that. < 1389014493 989472 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? arrow < 1389014496 49926 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :arrows are just strong monads in the category of profunctors < 1389014502 441575 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn Arrows are just strong monads in the category of profunctors < 1389014507 39860 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew that. < 1389015277 716740 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1389015426 344150 :Chillectual!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389015621 780196 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1389016633 900544 :boily!~boily@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389017072 110399 :upgrayeddd!uid2969@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vyvhsnhnddsfiqxv QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1389017249 550274 :upgrayeddd!uid2969@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-evlwlpchxhvdgtiz JOIN :#esoteric < 1389017297 589631 :Chillectual!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com NICK :LinearInterpol < 1389017309 900877 :boily!~boily@96.127.201.149 QUIT :Quit: Poulet! < 1389017322 59460 :conehead_!uid16140@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ffldruzqmfkysvkn JOIN :#esoteric < 1389018216 930250 :conehead_!uid16140@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ffldruzqmfkysvkn QUIT :Changing host < 1389018217 130603 :conehead_!uid16140@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1389018217 130734 :conehead_!uid16140@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Changing host < 1389018217 130807 :conehead_!uid16140@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ffldruzqmfkysvkn JOIN :#esoteric < 1389018561 39897 :atrapado!~ddd@unaffiliated/atrapado JOIN :#esoteric < 1389019062 801084 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1389019246 189027 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1389019482 931306 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1389019505 691963 :yorick!~yorick@oftn/member/yorick JOIN :#esoteric < 1389020515 524673 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@HSI-KBW-37-49-6-33.hsi14.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de QUIT :Quit: MindlessDrone < 1389021309 775891 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389021330 832706 :atrapado!~ddd@unaffiliated/atrapado QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1389021952 359097 :llamavioleta!ircap@171.157.78.188.dynamic.jazztel.es JOIN :#esoteric < 1389023012 789870 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? monad < 1389023014 545020 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monads are just monoids in the category of endofunctors. < 1389023021 309467 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? endofunctor. < 1389023022 899043 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :endofunctor.? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1389023024 149069 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? endofunctor < 1389023026 17260 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Endofunctors are just endomorphisms in the category of categories. < 1389023026 217520 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol. < 1389023032 597753 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? arrow < 1389023034 459314 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arrows are just strong monads in the category of profunctors < 1389023045 797128 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run sed -i 's/$/./' wisdom/arrow < 1389023049 78887 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023051 769479 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? arrow < 1389023053 759163 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arrows are just strong monads in the category of profunctors. < 1389023082 650075 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: YOU JUST CANNOT PLEASE US, GIVE UP < 1389023165 9857 :llamavioleta!ircap@171.157.78.188.dynamic.jazztel.es QUIT :Quit: • IRcap • 8.71 • < 1389023399 89005 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo nixon | grep '/bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls/' < 1389023400 586610 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023424 820131 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo clinton | grep '/bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls/' < 1389023426 260540 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023433 689682 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh oops < 1389023441 160728 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo nixon | grep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023442 612957 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023450 338860 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo clinton | grep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023451 946635 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023479 853761 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait. < 1389023489 290751 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think munroe is bullshitting. < 1389023495 79966 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :You think? :P < 1389023534 608617 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mrhmouse: i only started checking because i vaguely recalled nixon was _both_ a president and an opponent. < 1389023573 888024 :nooodl!~nooodl@91.177.100.12 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389023607 587118 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I didn't know that! Either way, the regex doesn't contain an 'x' (so Nixon is right out). It's also missing an 'ob', so the current president is out as well. < 1389023609 289605 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo test | grep 'e|a' < 1389023610 619402 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023614 919939 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1389023633 499845 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo nixon | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023634 892523 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :nixon < 1389023641 150296 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :!!! < 1389023646 117239 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i was just doing something wrong < 1389023648 255960 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1389023670 528028 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: you got closer than usual, i admit < 1389023686 239656 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe next time I'll get there < 1389023692 419737 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: am I missing something about that regex, or are my eyes just too tired to read it properly? < 1389023694 230044 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo obama | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023695 639464 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :obama < 1389023708 409255 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mrhmouse: it's not anchored at the ends, might be it. < 1389023719 619708 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo romney | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023721 210437 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023722 165263 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ahhh, it's only partially matching. < 1389023722 509719 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo kerry | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023724 240716 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023764 49695 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo abbott | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023765 411850 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389023767 744537 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :HMMM < 1389023779 770394 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conclusion: Tony Abbott isn't president of the US < 1389023785 310068 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo obama | egrep -o 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023786 789899 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :ma < 1389023792 370517 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's what I was missing. < 1389023969 409951 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo carter | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389023970 779807 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :carter < 1389023996 810273 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :he of course was also an opponent, since he lost to reagan. iirc. < 1389024250 495 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't Nixon lose to Kennedy? < 1389024264 962814 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that's what i was remembering < 1389024356 802909 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1389025189 780054 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are quite a number of presidents who were also opponents, so i imagine the list of "don't match" strings is a good bit shorter < 1389025306 62969 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo ford | egrep 'bu|[rn]t|[coy]e|[mtg]a|j|iso|n[hl]|[ae]d|lev|sh|[lnd]i|[po]o|ls' < 1389025307 419998 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1389025313 549793 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pointed out on forum < 1389025328 599670 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :asdasd < 1389025362 180609 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the only one who was an opponent, a president, but never elected as one) < 1389026041 570104 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1389026377 850414 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Gerald Fnord < 1389027552 400299 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1389027890 866355 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can HackEgo pipe to haskell? < 1389027896 420555 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :somehowe < 1389027899 360487 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :-e < 1389027968 760441 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389027993 790635 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1389028055 335564 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1389028247 786503 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie JOIN :#esoteric < 1389028510 116593 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389028566 446096 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1389030301 45699 :atrapado!~ddd@unaffiliated/atrapado JOIN :#esoteric < 1389030643 397454 :LinearInterpol!~RJones@cpe-76-178-249-81.maine.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389032115 820866 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389032628 841383 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1389032763 470240 :Picky_Nurse!~Flowers@8ta-229-253-06.telkomadsl.co.za JOIN :#esoteric < 1389032795 500976 :Picky_Nurse!~Flowers@8ta-229-253-06.telkomadsl.co.za PART :#esoteric < 1389032837 321383 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's a language for you. < 1389032841 111098 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program is a graph. < 1389032875 71052 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The memory state consists of a coloring of its nodes black or white. Initially, all nodes are black.' < 1389032914 135291 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :One execution step consists of nondeterministically selecting a node that's the same color as a majority of its neighbors, and flipping its color. < 1389032924 502189 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Execution halts when there are no longer any such nodes. < 1389032940 782745 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1389032965 248296 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :("A majority", as always, means "more than half".) < 1389033467 220032 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@141.70.114.6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389033529 713746 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: nondeterministically as in a nondeterminisitc automaton, or as in random? < 1389033592 531476 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's say nondeterministic as in "unspecified behavior". < 1389033601 873586 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which, I suppose, isn't necessarily nondeterministic at all. < 1389033753 306506 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean does it pick an ideal path, or just according to some probability distribution/ < 1389033835 601691 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A valid implementation can use any method to select the node. In particular, it doesn't have to pick an ideal path. < 1389034015 366750 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1389034028 61502 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. assume it's adversarial < 1389034108 913396 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: How would that be used to commpute things? < 1389034111 922387 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :compute* < 1389034173 414815 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: you would have to ensure that every possible path gives you a useful result < 1389034176 521562 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :this may be tricky... < 1389034204 832922 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to think how you could propagate a signal, like you'd have to in a CA. < 1389034247 432168 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: undirected graph? < 1389034252 817079 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: yeah. < 1389034292 182212 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem I see is fanning out < 1389034300 142876 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389034302 311803 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :once you have that you can propagate an arbitrary distance by shrinking at each step < 1389034326 344945 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :reuse is also a problem. I don't see how most components would reset < 1389034347 311750 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I don't immediately see how you could make something that continues running forever. < 1389034452 134601 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think this is turing complete < 1389034704 801846 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like the idea < 1389034733 869019 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would however force it to be deterministic < 1389034855 411652 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using a directed graph instead would make this a lot easier. < 1389034875 157773 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you could construct logic gates pretty trivially. < 1389034891 713732 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you start getting near petri nets now < 1389034930 452240 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that reminds me. Petri nets of song lyrics would look pretty cool. < 1389034951 84850 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? < 1389034994 705961 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Petri net where each transition is labeled with a fragment of a song's lyrics. < 1389035023 132260 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which should do wat? < 1389035025 242372 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Petri net executes deterministically (because there's only one possible execution path), and the order of execution produces the song's lyrics. < 1389035127 771550 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, imagine a net with three places, A, B, and C. Initially, A has 11 tokens, B has none, and C has I-dunno-a-bunch. < 1389035164 371183 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a transition labeled "NAH" taking one token from A and putting one token in B. Then there's a transition labeled "HEY JUDE" taking 14 tokens from B and one from C, and putting one in A. < 1389035174 847701 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1389035175 771462 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/14/11/ < 1389035187 658349 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The result is that you get "NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH NAH HEY JUDE" a bunch of times. < 1389035482 91824 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I'm not sure a directed graph is TC. I'm still unsure about how resets would work < 1389035489 264885 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, you might be able to get away with this < 1389035516 783418 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :NAND and FANOUT are all you need for TC, right? < 1389035530 1618 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :or AND, OR, NOT, FANOUT? < 1389035540 101524 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :FANOUT is trivial, so that's easy < 1389035567 552689 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389035576 561681 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, just need AND and NOT since that gets NAND < 1389035581 902804 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make NOT just by doing FANOUT to two and having both of them point at another node. < 1389035582 381904 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :AND is also easy, which just leaves NOT < 1389035591 861408 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: wha? < 1389035598 671554 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I completely forgot the semantics < 1389035600 109013 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, yeah < 1389035605 100360 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :with directed graphs it's easily TC < 1389035663 151659 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@doc System.IO < 1389035663 352133 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://haskell.org/ghc/docs/latest/html/libraries/base/system-io.html < 1389035713 992442 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1389035791 755905 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu QUIT :Quit: updating < 1389035813 821524 :rodgort`!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1389035914 437122 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389036033 298856 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1389036036 513743 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@doc System.IO < 1389036041 337184 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://haskell.org/ghc/docs/latest/html/libraries/base/System-IO.html < 1389036099 842193 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, how am I going to make this Petri net... < 1389036323 231526 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some fragments, like "HEY JUDE", are used all over the place. So I'd probably just have a "HEY JUDE 'in' place" and a "HEY JUDE 'out' place", and the HEY JUDE transition just takes from one and puts in the other, and... yeah. < 1389037230 548048 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1389037851 534488 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you writing a petri program that prints the hey jude lyrics < 1389038145 336291 :2JTAAB023!~myndzi@50-194-51-62-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1389038151 730584 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was, and then I got bored. < 1389038265 181882 :myndzi\!~myndzi@50-194-51-62-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1389038519 805560 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389038613 956441 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1389038614 156801 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1389038704 585166 :rodgort!~rodgort@li125-242.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1389040358 864981 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42892.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1389041190 700993 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@141.70.114.6 QUIT :Quit: MindlessDrone < 1389041307 271573 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: you can't look up anything from this book on the google without finding spoilers :'( < 1389041431 939023 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1389041970 662722 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :How to Fix a Guitar http://youtu.be/glxAKmY8p1k < 1389042123 354488 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1389042171 752421 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, spoilers are overrated < 1389042425 561629 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20140106/00442525768/fbi-admits-its-not-really-about-law-enforcement-any-more-ignores-lots-crimes-to-focus-creating-fake-terror-plots.shtml < 1389042652 612302 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, national security theater < 1389042710 663135 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't even blame them much ... the easiest way to find a terrorist plot is to make one up yourself. < 1389042790 141580 :Oj742!irc2gowebc@131.252.206.23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389043106 328723 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389043409 250912 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just filed my second bug report to gcc ever. < 1389043446 321970 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that counts as esoteric programming work because it needed some abuse of the C++ language. < 1389043476 356033 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcc has an asm injection bug < 1389043516 37048 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: what? < 1389043526 201287 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :joke failures < 1389043532 837826 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: do you mean the old one that involves strange filename for #line directives? < 1389043545 342095 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=52554#c3 < 1389043591 898497 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah... < 1389043592 859300 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: nice < 1389043677 332891 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the starting dollar marks an immediate number there in the assembler, right? < 1389043681 71786 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1389043687 761991 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :gcc should quote or mangle it, or reject it < 1389043708 862070 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree it's a bug if it doesn't do any of those < 1389043728 566581 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, that counts as suitably esoteric as well < 1389043812 740898 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=20140 this one was reported in 2005 and fixed in 2012 < 1389043831 393491 :Oj742!irc2gowebc@131.252.206.23 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1389043975 221919 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll now try to understand the C++ overloading rules to figure out whether I can reproduce the crazyness I want without variadic functions and preferably without templates < 1389044047 384090 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :what craziness is this? < 1389044126 301300 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"(void)s;" < 1389044130 908014 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens when you cast something to void? < 1389044136 163516 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing < 1389044138 331636 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: nothing special. the value is lost. < 1389044146 316805 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish C++ supported void values. :-( < 1389044148 301238 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can cast anything to void to get a void expression < 1389044152 294493 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, void values don't exist < 1389044191 901335 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can use void expressions as a statement, or as the left argument of the comma operator, or in a few other places < 1389044195 508737 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: how did you ever discover 20140? < 1389044219 622766 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :by reading this channel < 1389044224 933308 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: ask mauke, that wasn't me < 1389044245 581967 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: how did you ever discover 20140? < 1389044257 888822 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's see < 1389044259 121837 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=59704 is the bug, the story is a bit complicated < 1389044268 2574 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :(void)s; is used to make gcc/g++ not throw "unused variable" erros when compiling with -Werror < 1389044273 99629 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least gcc supports void f(); void g { return f(); } < 1389044279 731193 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't quite remember what I used the buffers for < 1389044300 186889 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: not only that. it has other uses too < 1389044307 761208 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not void x = f(); return x; :'( < 1389044314 720874 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: for example, it allows you to use the comma operator on any value without fearing of triggering an overloaded comma < 1389044317 888891 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, I mean void g(), of course. < 1389044360 352740 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you declare a void variable at all? < 1389044364 36335 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: basically, Jens Gustedt has discovered a way in C to test whether an expression in compile time constant: http://gustedt.wordpress.com/2013/08/22/testing-compile-time-constness-and-null-pointers-with-c11s-_generic/ < 1389044374 1120 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: no, nor a void parameter < 1389044391 312231 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: but his solution uses a quirk that doesn't work in C++, so we were wondering if it's possible in C++ too < 1389044405 242908 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: I think it's possible, but there seems to be a gcc bug that breaks it < 1389044434 402831 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42892.access.telenet.be QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1389044438 605912 :AnotherTest_!~turingcom@d51A42892.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1389044450 711737 :AnotherTest_!~turingcom@d51A42892.access.telenet.be NICK :AnotherTest < 1389044483 581946 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: it may have been for runtime code generation < 1389044536 446377 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, cast to void can be useful to write a ?: expression where you don't care of the return value but the two arms have completely incompatible types < 1389044565 417242 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and cast to void also helps in some nice macro tricks < 1389044568 871975 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it was for the generic constructor? < 1389044580 704277 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if condition then action1 >> return () else action2 >> return () < 1389044587 882055 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks legit. < 1389044614 462516 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't it nice how every language can be written in Haskell... < 1389044697 161793 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, haskell is crazy in a different way than C++ is crazy < 1389044756 707754 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there might be a second gcc bug here, I'll have to examine this < 1389044759 102044 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :if condition then void action1 else void action2 < 1389044785 80361 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :if (condition) action1; else action2; < 1389045106 994076 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1389045108 922654 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this si wierd < 1389045239 742871 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's something I really don't understand here < 1389045245 311442 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to ask the c++ guys < 1389045310 802996 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, what's _Generic? typecase? < 1389045318 259577 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1389045320 191582 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: yes < 1389045326 251717 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :new in C11 iirc < 1389045558 492519 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1389045950 512410 :atrapado!~ddd@unaffiliated/atrapado QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1389046097 616656 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42892.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1389046136 791404 :tertu3!~tertu@143.44.70.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389046137 684141 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1389046143 784919 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :constexpr int v = argc - argc; compiles < 1389046145 822269 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :So do all C compilers get this right? :-) < 1389046154 883059 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: oh! < 1389046169 475647 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is ... interesting. < 1389046172 484167 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :but covl(0, v) says it's nonconstant < 1389046230 912576 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :char *p; constexpr ptr_diff_t d = (p+4) - p; // is this supposed to work? < 1389046293 541650 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389046294 701242 :atrapado!~dro@unaffiliated/atrapado JOIN :#esoteric < 1389046332 607149 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1389046342 340506 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :too esoteric for me < 1389046349 591603 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no second bug, it was a misunderstanding at my part < 1389046365 901405 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: no < 1389046370 590085 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: covl? < 1389046384 861542 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: v doesn't convert to a pointer but 1*v does, because v is an lvalue < 1389046386 431436 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott: http://gcc.gnu.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=59704 < 1389046390 763420 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I think p+4 may be undefined, depending on what p points to < 1389046399 366236 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: only _prvalue_ constant expressions of integral type and value zero convert to a null pointer < 1389046411 72071 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not counting nullptr_t expressions) < 1389046445 781415 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: so v must not convert to a null pointer < 1389046463 191753 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even if you say const int v = 0; < 1389046489 853019 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's complicated < 1389046507 191187 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :try.cc:5:32: error: '* &' is not a constant expression < 1389046507 391676 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric : const constexpr int &v = argc-argc; < 1389046507 391849 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric : ^ < 1389046512 125022 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :u wot m8 < 1389046537 772152 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: good luck trying to understand C++, I must go now < 1389046605 556560 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I was speculating about why constexpr int v = argc - argc might be supposed to work. Taking the difference of pointers seems to be the most useful case where such cancellation might turn up. < 1389046633 151641 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: (But I don't know whether it is supposed to work.) < 1389046646 241570 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if argc is NaN, huh! < 1389046688 991985 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an int. < 1389046695 211754 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't compile if argc is a double < 1389046707 692062 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and argc-argc can't even overflow. < 1389046724 212711 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(close one!) < 1389046727 242507 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm testing with constexpr int v = x == x; < 1389047402 891527 :callforjudgement!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389047450 932812 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1389048040 253539 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1389048172 591895 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run ghc -e 'putStrLn "Yes"' < 1389048179 94266 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1389048254 293287 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`run echo 'main = putStrLn "Maybe."' | runhaskell < 1389048258 181035 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe. < 1389048296 937402 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell mroman Can HackEgo pipe to haskell? <-- `run echo 'main = putStrLn "Yes."' | runhaskell < 1389048297 137665 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1389048411 463376 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell mroman `run ghc -e 'putStrLn "This also works."' < 1389048411 701916 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1389048576 241426 :callforjudgement!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ‑ - < 1389048578 250766 :HackEgo!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE] [U+2011 NON-BREAKING HYPHEN] [U+0020 SPACE] [U+002D HYPHEN-MINUS] < 1389048982 504839 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389049131 119861 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1389049317 903662 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so JOIN :#esoteric < 1389049331 291581 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1389049338 612520 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so JOIN :#esoteric < 1389049440 35554 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It definitely seems like most programming languages are subsets of Haskell. < 1389049495 486009 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett, what about Agda < 1389049507 659058 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Agda is one of the programming languages that is not a subset of Haskell. < 1389049530 700121 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think Haskell is a subset of Agda, either. Not sure about that one. < 1389049536 830084 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They might both be subsets of Idris. < 1389049560 849594 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I'm trying to think how E could be seen as a subset of Haskell. < 1389049580 540384 :Taneb!~Taneb@213.138.101.13 PRIVMSG #esoteric :E, esoteric, ire to see < 1389049589 103825 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :My first thought, as with all my attempts to interpret a programming language as Haskell, is "use a monad!" < 1389049614 30129 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PART :#esoteric < 1389049617 180181 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1389049617 550998 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: it seems to me like your graph thing is harder to program because you have all nodes be black at the outset, which means _any_ node can change on the first step. < 1389049659 679332 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: huh, you're right. < 1389049787 489370 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to know the twoducks subset < 1389049792 569543 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, in E, there are these things called objects, and there are these things called references (which can be futures, as in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Futures_and_promises). A fancy thing you can do with an object is to "eventual send" a message to it, with some references as arguments. < 1389049811 279729 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: obviously you need the Tardis monad somewhere. < 1389049834 878867 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a fancy thing you can do with a reference is to "wait" on it, given a function from an object to a reference; the result is a reference to the eventual result. < 1389049836 397709 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, uh. < 1389049853 807805 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something like this: wait :: ERef a -> (EObj a -> ERef b) -> ERef b < 1389049875 729848 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which looks suspiciously monadic already. < 1389049888 903272 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :>>= takes a continuation < 1389049927 859022 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you drop the EObj constructor (and I see no reason not to), that's wait :: ERef a -> (a -> ERef b) -> ERef b. Very monadic-looking. < 1389049939 673658 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes it looks monadic, but for what category (if you don't drop the EObj)? < 1389049942 793050 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, of course, given an object, you can make a reference to it: a -> ERef a. < 1389049961 507248 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, give me a few moments to remember how monads and categories relate. < 1389049979 560416 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monoid on the category of endofunctors < 1389049993 38324 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :@quote copumpkin lax < 1389049993 238625 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :copumpkin says: a monad is just a lax functor from a terminal bicategory, duh. fuck that monoid in category of endofunctors shit < 1389050007 589847 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am pwend < 1389050015 479702 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :also i can't tell if Bike is saying that to be helpful or unhelpful or what < 1389050026 433488 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-233-232.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither can i < 1389050046 85633 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A monad is a type of endofunctor, right? And... it sounds like the question of "what category" is just the question of what the domain of "ERef" is. < 1389050049 657387 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :endomeme < 1389050088 191292 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the case of Haskell the functor is from and to the category of Haskell functions. < 1389050096 414883 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it maps Haskell functions to Haskell functions. < 1389050109 660084 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proposal for a new conjunction: eqv'ly. "a eqv'ly b" asserts that "a" and "b" are the same thing, and means "a", or, equivalently, "b". < 1389050119 860901 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Yes, a monad is a endofunctor with return and join added following certain laws (or, alternatively, a Kleisli category) < 1389050132 695921 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :a monad is just a free monad monad monad algebra < 1389050149 879493 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A monad is just an element of the collection of monads. < 1389050196 281785 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But a monad needs return :: forall x. x -> m x not ERef a -> (EObj a -> ERef b) -> ERef b; so it isn't quite a monad on (->) (if you drop the EObj then it might be, if it still follows the monad laws, though) < 1389050199 666127 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@199.185.88.147 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1389050216 450087 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty sure this follows the monad laws. < 1389050223 509871 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1389050231 28667 :^v!~NotPing@c-71-238-153-166.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1389050237 792082 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those are what, again... < 1389050253 199562 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-57-25.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :One way to mention the monad laws is simply to say that the Kleisli category is, in fact, a category. < 1389050315 329354 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :mauke: What if argc is a trap value? < 1389050345 688571 :mauke!~mauke@p3m/member/mauke PRIVMSG #esoteric :no such thing < 1389050349 587387 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. I'm quite sure this follows the monad laws. < 1389050413 20051 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, the semantics of eventual sends are really pretty complicated. < 1389050619 881393 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have an event queue (which need not actually be a queue, but does need to have certain ordering properties). Every ERef is a reference to the result of one of these events (perhaps an event that hasn't happened yet). < 1389050654 531127 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that, at least to an approximation, creating an ERef is the same thing as putting an event on the queue. < 1389050714 795662 :mrhmouse!~jordan.br@firewall1.photobooks.com QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1389050728 472447 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This means that both return :: a -> ERef a and >>= :: ERef a -> (a -> ERef b) -> ERef b put events on the queue. It's likely that this can be done without side effects. < 1389051045 106085 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :return creates a pretty boring event; this event just immediately returns a value. >>= also creates a boring event; it just waits for a first event to finish, calls a second event with the result, waits for the second event to finish, and returns the result. < 1389052208 184215 :^v!~NotPing@c-71-238-153-166.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1389052347 993017 :^v!~NotPing@c-71-238-153-166.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1389052650 5381 :ter2!~tertu@143.44.70.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1389052692 399630 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, suppose I want to create an E object with a single method, which nominally takes a Char and returns an Int. Well, when I do that in E, my method doesn't actually necessarily get a Char; it merely gets a reference to a Char. But it doesn't have to return an Int; it merely has to return a reference to an Int. < 1389052739 259971 :tswett!6b0598fd@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.5.152.253 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if I have a function "ERef a -> ERef b", I ought to be able to create one of those E objects with a single method. Let's call it an EFunc, how about. So the function is (ERef a -> ERef b) -> EFunc a b.