< 1391472851 553868 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 0.4.0 < 1391472913 746437 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly JOIN :#esoteric < 1391474469 723410 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1391474576 174706 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1391476378 223515 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rule 100.6b Players can use the _Magic_ Store & Event Locator to find tournaments in their area < 1391476504 67203 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is weird knowing people IRL who know me as "Taneb" < 1391476836 657578 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1391476841 279024 :coppro!raedford@taurine.csclub.uwaterloo.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yes, it's the best rule < 1391476925 403342 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: does that mean they are allowed to do so during a game? < 1391477814 256651 :yorick!~yorick@oftn/member/yorick QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391478238 370013 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1391480329 318352 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would assume so. < 1391480565 376253 :augur!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391480640 128361 :augur_!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391480669 11876 :augur!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391482988 230315 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella QUIT :Quit: It is tiem! < 1391485392 214467 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/EvilHaskellTips < 1391485715 868290 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: <3 < 1391486034 41047 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/mtabini/status/430159283683360768/photo/1 < 1391486101 419154 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is CGFloat an IEEE single float? < 1391486161 737050 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. It is a float with the property sizeof(CGFloat) == sizeof(void*). :( < 1391486227 686666 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... it can't actually even store a full US phone number on 32-bit systems. < 1391486274 817757 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"+1 555 867 5309" is greater than 2^24-1. :( < 1391486341 828752 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :amazing < 1391486365 636673 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell, so's "+1 000 000 0000". < 1391486403 823333 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is not a legal number, but that's neither here nor there. < 1391486405 69945 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :who needs this +1 though < 1391486406 736916 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is america < 1391486436 491363 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :even ITU agrees that we're number one < 1391486444 147109 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are places in the country where you actually have to dial "1 XXX XXX XXXX" though. < 1391486447 822145 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even for local numbers. < 1391486450 680853 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1391488535 473005 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"+82 10 XXXX YYYY"? (that's a lot greater than 2^24-1) < 1391488585 182102 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think E.164 allows the maximum of 15 digits < 1391489777 239522 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1391489811 736224 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391490085 736713 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1391490517 270296 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that the sort of trick people would try in the 1970s? < 1391490543 237780 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right alongside two digit years? < 1391490555 65017 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not sure why I'm blaming the 70s specifically) < 1391490770 780563 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1391490842 16703 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :i for one have no idea what you are talking about < 1391490878 642285 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y2k, storing two digits of the year in order to save memory < 1391491229 83733 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :using a float for phone numbers is also space-inefficient, though < 1391491333 312404 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :> logBase 2 (10**15) < 1391491334 372968 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 49.82892142331043 < 1391491473 581094 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lifthrasiir: I was assuming this was American, and also I'm only really familiar with the North American dialing plan. :) < 1391491537 391082 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1391492448 27842 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :+358 40 NNN NNNN is a typical Finnish mobile phone number. < 1391492578 919246 :polytone!~monotone@room208.org QUIT :Quit: Server updates < 1391492690 72956 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1391493186 628621 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :+1 NNN NNN NNNN is a North American number. < 1391493227 999076 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:f790:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(can't be more specific than that; that's the scheme, there's not a more nation-specific easy prefix, nor is there such a thing for cell numbers) < 1391493234 456471 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kindle is so annoying to hold compared to the Nook < 1391493241 114523 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Trying to remind myself that the software is far better < 1391493261 764843 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have to remind yourself, is it really better? < 1391493299 686222 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm likely to get used to the lack of bugs and ability to do simple things like hilighting across pages and likely to take that for granted < 1391493300 700319 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you like buy both < 1391493307 906299 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: yes. Not at the same time though < 1391493314 522521 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1391493352 488770 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think partially wanted the glow light stuff, partially sick of the Nook's perpetual bugginess, partially ... ads maybe < 1391493369 194468 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also remembering that the Kindle had a feature that I kept wishing the Nook had < 1391493472 950405 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :040, 041, 044, 0450, 046 and 050 (the initial 0 is dropped when used with the country code) used to be operator-specific prefixes for mobile phone networks, but they changed it so that you can keep the number when switching operators, so they're all mixed up these days. < 1391494279 273808 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :how consumerist < 1391495560 52999 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: the same thing happened in Korea, +82 (0)10 vs. +82 (0)1[1-9]. < 1391495646 240414 :jix_!~jix@jixco.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1391495648 85234 :heroux_!~heroux@50708181.static.ziggozakelijk.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1391495738 869247 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://necros.gibdon.com/scene-music-minor < 1391495763 467850 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pentagonal Dreams is "less in quality than average, or short" according to this person < 1391495763 953464 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1391495861 2336 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric < 1391495896 210362 :conehead_!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1391495925 97947 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495925 514844 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495925 817971 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495925 818130 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495925 818200 :Vorpal_!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495926 497151 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495926 932046 :jix!~jix@jixco.de QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495927 821652 :heroux!~heroux@50708181.static.ziggozakelijk.nl QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495928 39220 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi QUIT :*.net *.split < 1391495954 210739 :heroux_!~heroux@50708181.static.ziggozakelijk.nl NICK :heroux < 1391496106 459339 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :'infinity' which is on the main list, is about as short as pentagonal dreams < 1391496459 466015 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1391496526 181254 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1391497732 700350 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it must be "less in quality than average". < 1391498875 963278 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly JOIN :#esoteric < 1391499953 216844 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oona Räisänen‏ @windyoona: "Russians keep referring to me as Финский инженер (Finnish engineer). I wonder if it means something else." < 1391500050 163414 :augur_!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1391500274 173679 :augur!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391500314 146522 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I read (some of) the Slashdot comments about that helicopter thing, and I wish I hadn't. < 1391500323 286289 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why < 1391500345 154367 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it seemed to be approximately 90% about her gender. < 1391500359 6979 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :sigh < 1391500678 170861 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :she's pretty awesome < 1391500700 631375 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :waiting for your meal at a restaurant? why not reverse engineer the wireless paging protocol http://www.windytan.com/2013/09/the-burger-pager.html < 1391500753 326247 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391500761 318340 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391500803 866910 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391500838 539612 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder what her job is < 1391501071 795650 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1391501113 587439 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Software developer, I think. We have some friends in common. (You know, Finland; it's not such a giant community.) < 1391501152 946662 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the company with the silliest YouTube ads. < 1391501156 561256 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see if I can find one. < 1391501174 691618 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Jym9rfQgec there you go < 1391501209 408230 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I keep getting that in front of my videos, it's probably a geographically Finland-localized ad.) < 1391501297 644372 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow. what? < 1391501301 323260 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yeah obviously the comments should be about how she's finnish < 1391501314 734056 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: Right, exactly! < 1391501327 709554 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There was a bit of that too, since it said "Finnish" in the title.) < 1391501333 66285 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, good < 1391501367 275663 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow this video is available in 4K < 1391501368 517401 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :thank god < 1391501468 129227 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does it make you want to go work there? < 1391501495 688591 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It didn't really "work" for me, personally.) < 1391501646 904606 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :... it kind of does, yeah < 1391501660 575940 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also makes me feel like i'm not cool enough to work there < 1391501687 874769 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the problem with this sort of thing < 1391501744 955808 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but their incredible committment to the "rockstar" trope is almost enough to make it un-terrible < 1391501761 190841 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@141.70.114.6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391501771 278873 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like they do some haskell too < 1391501782 246396 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf JOIN :#esoteric < 1391501878 274490 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They were "best place to work at" (according to the Great Place to Work Institute's survey) in Finland for 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011, but not in the last couple of years. < 1391501982 239458 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder what happened < 1391502049 208967 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I guess in 2012 at least they just didn't take part. < 1391502073 104295 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, to be fair to other companies and all that. < 1391502198 990497 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1391502376 60200 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you work at the best place to work at does that mean there's nowhere to go but down :'( < 1391502407 870215 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just by joining you're probably making the company worse :( < 1391502454 493383 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you're supposed to think of it so that if you switch jobs, you'll just have to help make the new place even better. < 1391502488 492839 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently i work at the "best place to work at" (according to the Great Place to Work Institute's survey) < 1391502507 555549 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Globally, or regionally? (Do they even do a global ranking?) < 1391502510 552150 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"best place at which to work" (according to grammar pedants) < 1391502540 707924 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've honestly never heard anyone do the preposition thing < 1391502541 430196 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: p. sure that's a rule grammar pedants invented to have something to ped < 1391502557 401211 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i don't know, i just went to their web page and clicked around < 1391502592 822256 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :but these are all us companies so i guess it's regional < 1391502595 883567 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :guys, I realized something < 1391502652 195845 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 220 V cable between the mains and the power supply is the oldest piece of technology we have in our computers. it's been exactly the same type of cable since the XT. < 1391502663 85280 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine's only 115 V :( < 1391502680 114648 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :almost everything else in the hardware and software have been replaced with something more modern since much later. < 1391502685 583494 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :This one's 230V, nominally. I'm sure that was the point. < 1391502705 272496 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: anyway that's an interesting observation < 1391502707 447405 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, it used to be 220 V nominal back then, now it's 230 V nominal. < 1391502730 333075 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the cable is IEC 60320 C13, for what it's worth) < 1391502762 787914 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :At home I'm still using the same computer as the one I've first had on my own, since about 18 years ago, but it's only the same computer because I think of it like that. < 1391502776 491696 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every part has been replaced at least once, most parts have been replaced multiple times, < 1391502791 291497 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't replace the same part twice < 1391502797 940296 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and at one point almost the whole hardware got replaced at the same time (but the hard disk stayed the same at that point). < 1391502799 706947 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just the same part because you think of it like that < 1391502807 721321 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have like 20 of those cables < 1391502815 378274 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but then did you truly replace it........!!) < 1391502818 266941 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: exactly, and it's the same computer only because I think of it like that. < 1391502835 401273 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think i use desktop computers anymore < 1391502853 179649 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: when all the hw got replaced, I could have decided it's a new computer only I migrated the hard disk and the software and the desk and some other stuff. < 1391502889 716876 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think i trust this Great Place to Work Institute v. much < 1391502909 257729 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION -> sleepytime
< 1391502915 569206 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :good neegan < 1391502928 226748 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :good night < 1391502941 787458 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So anyway, the power cable isn't the same piece either, but that's the only part that hasn't been upgraded to something more modern. The same power cable I first used might still work today. < 1391502973 470757 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the really old days it was just a cable < 1391503012 761872 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now it's a 4p2o3w5e7r cable < 1391503018 851406 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :that has to be an upgrade < 1391503024 310334 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the power led might be another candidate. Since when has that been using the same two-pin arrangement on the motherboard? < 1391503116 473096 :augur!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391503124 149347 :augur!~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391503250 895329 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 3.5mm jack is also a reasonably old design. < 1391503291 946878 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :god, hooking up the main bus on the motherboard was a pita. fucking speaker on a wire with this shitty ass hookup. < 1391503408 459806 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :came out at least four times during build, and that's where the fucking power button connects! < 1391503958 896647 :conehead_!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1391503959 114005 :conehead__!uid16140@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xjhhfblnvodqsngu NICK :conehead_ < 1391504480 58111 :Tritonio!~Thunderbi@212.251.54.186 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391504511 695096 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: true < 1391505107 292553 :Tritonio1!~Thunderbi@93.115.94.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391505260 124909 :Tritonio!~Thunderbi@212.251.54.186 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1391506245 358925 :Slereah__!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1391509151 813673 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1391509266 787985 :elliott!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391509290 252420 :elliott!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com NICK :Guest1732 < 1391509338 375754 :Guest1732!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PART :#esoteric < 1391509338 555950 :Guest1732!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391509347 184554 :Guest1732!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :SeeNoEvil: CTCP TIME? < 1391509350 989621 :Guest1732!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com QUIT :Client Quit < 1391509360 776913 :elliott_!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391509382 522688 :elliott_!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com NICK :Guest50025 < 1391509411 856017 :Guest50025!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com QUIT :Client Quit < 1391509421 753525 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391509710 525218 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guest1732: trying to understand IRC commands, and what time zone you are in. < 1391509813 520771 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seem to recall some earlier chat where you seemed interested in eigenratios. < 1391509829 57698 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :eigenratios are pretty cool < 1391509834 374407 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know much about them though... that must have been ages ago < 1391509847 307135 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. I've been reading the logs. < 1391509903 642145 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my condolences, the further you go back the more annoying I am :P < 1391509966 721091 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :You had a novel idea for defining a self-interpreter that wasn't "cheating" - having an eigenratio > 1. < 1391510000 17573 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might not have been you. But I think it was - at least an "elliot". < 1391510020 58445 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that was mine, I think, though perhaps not originally or solely < 1391510037 583653 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I quite like it, but IIRC you can just cheat in a more elaborate way by defining the host language in a way that lets you do a cheating self-interpreter with an eigenratio slightly above 1 < 1391510059 428635 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, an eval instruction that adds a slight slowdown. < 1391510166 374229 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it might be a bit tricky to do I think. < 1391510182 174795 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think. Yes. I do... :-) < 1391510206 187827 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think... I think... I think... it might be a bit trick. < 1391510245 514775 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you should create an actual working example. < 1391510249 216066 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, for instance < 1391510264 872162 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's say you have an implementation where every instruction takes 1s to execute < 1391510273 867366 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but when you call eval, any evals in the code you're evalling take 2s instead < 1391510279 264978 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then 4s when you nest deeper, etc. < 1391510298 802823 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this runs into another problem with this kind of stuff -- eigenratios are sort of an implementation-dependent notion rather than something inherent to the language) < 1391510393 174298 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not always. Implement your own interpreter for the SUBLEQ interpreter on eigneration.blogspot,com and see it you do it in a way that produces a different eigenratio from the 34.xxx value. < 1391510459 291763 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you create the bottom level interpreter, and then run a stack of the self-interpreter on the blog..... < 1391510630 76963 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :In your example with eval(eval(eval(something))), how would the inner instances "know" to run slower? < 1391510884 941751 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :This one: http://eigenratios.blogspot.co.nz/2006/09/mark-ii-oisc-self-interpreter.html < 1391511088 106811 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gotta go. "I'll be back" some other time. < 1391511100 507145 :SeeNoEvil!~chatzilla@ip-118-90-126-229.xdsl.xnet.co.nz PART :#esoteric < 1391511180 183356 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1391512330 267938 :jconn!~va@1-130.ipswich.cc.colocall.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1391512339 180036 :jconn!~va@1-130.ipswich.cc.colocall.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391513112 607943 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-17-206.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1391513146 476481 :sebbu!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-17-206.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1391513146 656386 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1391514031 846322 :yorick!~yorick@oftn/member/yorick JOIN :#esoteric < 1391518934 259484 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391519296 139030 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391519757 196147 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella JOIN :#esoteric < 1391521098 989917 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391521380 944070 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1391521402 216284 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391521408 319392 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391521430 400122 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :good SSL morning! < 1391521652 791006 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1391521727 916502 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :~metar ENVA < 1391521728 444069 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ENVA 041320Z 12008KT 080V150 CAVOK 06/M04 Q1008 TEMPO 16015G25KT RMK WIND 670FT 15010KT < 1391521789 27460 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~metar CYUL < 1391521789 537253 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYUL 041342Z 21006KT 8SM SCT037 BKN120 M12/M14 A3045 RMK SC3AC4 SLP314 < 1391521799 844219 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :~metar EFHK < 1391521800 285392 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :EFHK 041320Z 17006KT 2500 FZDZ BR BKN002 M00/M01 Q1023 TEMPO 1000 BKN001 < 1391521806 451260 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still doing the M00. < 1391523095 707076 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? Nooodles < 1391523105 196373 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1391523136 970469 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? ramen < 1391523143 439681 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1391523171 425323 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor`: USE YOUR NECROMANCY SKILLZ AND REVIVE YOUR BOTS PLZKTHX. < 1391523224 450128 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: the Wisdom doesn't have /no+dles/i, but it has ramen: 拉麵是一種類型的麵條縫製從原始樹木。hth < 1391523241 270199 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The wisdom so does have Nooodles I'm looking at it right now < 1391523259 790347 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :would anyone like to take over hosting the wiki < 1391523262 267526 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have time for it any more < 1391523286 699840 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: eh? < 1391523294 476139 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh Hey I'm still alive! < 1391523296 462959 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/tmp/input.31598: line 1: unexpected EOF while looking for matching `'' \ /tmp/input.31598: line 2: syntax error: unexpected end of file < 1391523299 837351 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or not. < 1391523302 672616 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1391523306 640565 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily, page 17 < 1391523308 482607 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo Hey I'm still alive! < 1391523308 965796 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/tmp/input.31656: line 1: unexpected EOF while looking for matching `'' \ /tmp/input.31656: line 2: syntax error: unexpected end of file < 1391523321 554916 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo Hey I'm still alive\! < 1391523322 30687 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/tmp/input.31732: line 1: unexpected EOF while looking for matching `'' \ /tmp/input.31732: line 2: syntax error: unexpected end of file < 1391523334 859135 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo 'Hey I'm still alive!' < 1391523335 332123 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/tmp/input.31784: line 1: unexpected EOF while looking for matching `'' \ /tmp/input.31784: line 2: syntax error: unexpected end of file < 1391523340 708561 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I have a lecture to attend 2 miles away < 1391523340 925217 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :rgh < 1391523343 176540 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I fail at grep. < 1391523345 804864 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION ----> away
< 1391523351 463842 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo "Hey I'm still alive!" < 1391523351 893423 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey I'm still alive! < 1391523356 857117 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :SEE < 1391523404 188904 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh echo "~echo !sh echo \"~echo hello\"" < 1391523404 661143 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​~echo !sh echo "~echo hello" < 1391523410 529024 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh. < 1391523495 92275 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :metasepia: ~echo hi < 1391523502 132066 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah. < 1391523531 889384 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION shields his bot from meddling Scandinavians
< 1391523582 274628 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mwahahahandinavians < 1391523662 4757 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that is not a reassuring response < 1391523979 293175 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott__: btw, by “hosting over”, you mean only yielding your admin responsibilities to someone else, or move everything to a new server also? < 1391524044 32729 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the latter; handing over root access on the box I store semi-sensitive stuff and IRC from isn't my idea of fun :p < 1391524077 47366 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the problem isn't sysop duty so much as upgrading mediawiki and so on -- it's not actually much effort, I've just been neglecting it and appear likely to continue to do so for the forseeable future < 1391524187 511204 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, it's been two years since I took over the wiki < 1391524188 786814 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :time flies < 1391524295 912460 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :elliott__: where has your time gone < 1391524310 479542 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you started doing the booze < 1391524318 613070 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :?? < 1391524346 258620 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1391524380 626812 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(o dear he do the booze.) < 1391524465 170862 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I've been drunk for the past year < 1391524485 785628 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :getting my affairs in order before my inevitable death from liver failure, etc. etc. etc. < 1391524491 491192 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no seriously I'm just lazy < 1391524568 766747 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :SO UMM WHY DID YOU SAY "elliott__> I don't have time for it any more" IF YOU MEANT THAT YOU ARE JUST LAZY, THAT SEEMS A BIT ILLOGICAL COULD YOU EXPLAIN < 1391524675 353644 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds better < 1391524681 434625 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :so my phd thesis is currently 114 pages < 1391524689 690363 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :*draft < 1391524719 92759 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :how proud are you on a scale from 1 to \omega < 1391524733 383835 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable NICK :trout < 1391524821 945991 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :(most of it is doodles of dicks and walruses) < 1391524956 996782 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: ω² - 2ω, but only iff your dick-to-walrus ratio is within φ±ε. < 1391524976 100390 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"only if and only if". < 1391525024 580456 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry. I RAS syndromized that. < 1391525036 457300 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :how surreal! < 1391526322 247869 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: that isn't even between 1 to omega < 1391526330 219709 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, it doesn't even make sensee < 1391526379 567939 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know ^^ < 1391526408 387277 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391526538 448593 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :!sh bin/relcome password2 < 1391526539 10097 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/tmp/input.397: line 1: bin/relcome: No such file or directory < 1391526553 230827 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor`: I can't relcome people! < 1391526590 999596 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oklopol: I'm 1075000000 proud of you on that scale < 1391526598 339258 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :approximately < 1391526803 615371 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems appropriate < 1391526819 371057 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :although i think that's a bit closer to 0 than \omega :( < 1391526858 431453 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :also ω² - 2ω is a perfectly cromulent surreal number < 1391527506 455777 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, a question remains unanswered: of what use are surreal numbers? < 1391527621 178920 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like them as an example of a field that fails to be complete because there are too many numbers between 0 and 1 < 1391527645 739134 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I am, btw, still amazed that they form a field at all.) < 1391527664 24399 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION 's brains choke on int-e's affirmation
< 1391527695 436657 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ... ordered field. < 1391527833 742521 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hyperreal numbers are used in non-standard analysis. is there a nice way to map those into the surreals? < 1391527881 367061 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is non-standard analysis, and while we're on the subject, standard analysis? < 1391528089 448348 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah I don't know this stuff. I'd say that analysis is abstract calculus; you have measure theory, integrals, derivatives, function spaces, many notions of convergence ... but ultimately based on real numbers. non-standard analysis has inifiniesimals and inifinities, allowing things like the dirac delta function. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dirac_delta_function < 1391528090 833209 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-standard analysis is when you take an ultrafilter U on N, and say that a hyperreal number is a function R^N and a < b if the set of coordinates i s.t. a_i < b_i is in U (exactly one of the sets {i | a_i < b_i}, {i | a_i > b_i}, {i | a_i = b_i} is in U, because it's an ultrafilter) < 1391528115 242153 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and oklopol just provided the definition of a hyperreal number) < 1391528119 565154 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1391528121 618307 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then you have a lot of numbers between 0 and any number larger than it, because any sequence going to 0 provides you with one < 1391528130 844982 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There should probably be a backup relcome in fungot.) < 1391528131 80058 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: fnord? alice? < 1391528137 336781 :oklopol!~oklopol@dyn60-339.yok.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah definitions are totally better than explanations < 1391528162 821527 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391528169 108502 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh fungot is back. I wonder whether it's become smarter. < 1391528169 383809 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: but a computer science textbook than a scheme source that exercises every aspect of a lisp name, i presume < 1391528210 964977 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^help < 1391528211 144673 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ ; ^def ; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool < 1391528255 625822 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the 0-9 in ^str? < 1391528281 701377 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1391528313 743375 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :A number. < 1391528316 105496 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ten slots for strings, that could be referenced as str:N in a ^def I suppose < 1391528317 74011 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 42 get < 1391528317 253654 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text] < 1391528321 467783 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 4 get < 1391528321 647498 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Empty. < 1391528325 687269 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1391528328 276574 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 0 get < 1391528328 459113 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :+++++++++++++++[>++++++++>++++>+++++++>+++++++<<<<-]>>++++++.>++++++.<<----.>----------------------------------.<----.>>+++.<<-----------.+.>>>.<++++++.<<-.>>-----.<++++++++++++++++++++++++++.--------------------------.<+.>>++.>+++++.<<<+.>>>+.<-.<.>----------------------.<++++++++++++.------------.>----------------------.<<------.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>>----.<---.<++++.++++++++.>- < 1391528381 753144 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf ,[.,]!test < 1391528381 933122 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1391528382 112812 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@bf +++++++++++++++[>++++++++>++++>+++++++>+++++++<<<<-]>>++++++.>++++++.<<----.>----------------------------------.<----.>>+++.<<-----------.+.>>>.<++++++.<<-.>>-----.<++++++++++++++++++++++++++.--------------------------.<+.>>++.>+++++.<<<+.>>>+.<-.<.>----------------------.<++++++++++++.------------.>----------------------.<<------.>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.>>----.<---.<++++.+++... < 1391528382 802856 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEgjjj < 1391528388 93192 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :...+++++.>- < 1391528394 673953 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. darn. < 1391528408 367349 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should be easy enough to add a backup welcome, then < 1391528419 908103 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that string is incomplete anyway. < 1391528452 941583 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bf str:0 < 1391528465 272248 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1391528473 550494 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it only likes that in ^def's < 1391528481 44854 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1391528495 105992 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: thanks. and about the Dirac: I guess that's why the teachers told us that it wasn't kinda like a regular function, waved their hands, and continued teaching. < 1391528520 108678 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(yay engineering! we do stuff with advanced maths, but don't know why!) < 1391528531 441817 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ^str does not necessarily print completely, if it's too long. < 1391528545 193131 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def tmp bf str:0 < 1391528545 410251 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1391528546 272170 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp < 1391528546 452354 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEgo `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, jconn ), blsqbot ! < 1391528550 209154 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, it's fine. < 1391528574 424219 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's like that because of the ). < 1391528659 626380 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's problematic with the ) ? < 1391528701 626906 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I forget to close an opening parenthesis (like this < 1391528714 997697 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1391528717 364351 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :) then the closing one will typically be on the next line ;) < 1391528717 740407 :jconn!~va@1-130.ipswich.cc.colocall.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: |syntax error < 1391528717 919811 :jconn!~va@1-130.ipswich.cc.colocall.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: | then the closing one will typically be on the next line;) < 1391528732 959476 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: ( < 1391528736 337654 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1391528743 677012 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still unbalanced. < 1391528745 328993 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :( < 1391528745 859922 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :STOP UNBALANCING THE UNIVERSE, YOU VILE FUNGOTTER! < 1391528748 394219 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :))))))) < 1391528762 556578 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: you closed a parenthesis that I closed as well. < 1391528770 317922 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :((((((( < 1391528783 170195 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: A lone ) is not outputtable with Underload, which is what static strings like that on fungot usually use. < 1391528783 584559 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: there is nothing behind the grape-0 includes all brainfuck programs with up to sixty five thousand states. feel particularly compelled to read it. < 1391528796 97322 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :（）（）（）（）（）（）（）（） < 1391528806 484369 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: you should be happy that I'm not compensating for the smileys. < 1391528809 649549 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I see < 1391528847 420910 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def tmp bf ,[.,]!does i/o work here too? < 1391528847 600898 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1391528851 514492 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp < 1391528857 524708 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp test? < 1391528857 704100 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :test? < 1391528861 477084 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1391528867 549883 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp ^tmp test? < 1391528867 729643 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp test? < 1391528884 297293 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528884 476881 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :~echo ^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528884 676363 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528884 856131 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :~echo ^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528885 35532 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp ~echo ^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528885 215197 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :~echo ^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528885 394921 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp ~echo test! < 1391528885 574503 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :~echo test! < 1391528885 754279 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :test! < 1391528894 332885 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION grins like a maniac
< 1391528895 500149 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 1 get < 1391528895 680092 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :>,[>,]<[<]>[<++++[>--------<-]+>-[-------[--[<+++[>----<-]+>[< < 1391528919 93367 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def aux ^bf str:1 < 1391528919 273000 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: ^def < 1391528924 804367 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def aux bf str:1 < 1391528924 984259 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mismatched []. < 1391528934 4233 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 2 get < 1391528934 184208 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Empty. < 1391528946 856798 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 0-9 get < 1391528947 37109 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usage: ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text] < 1391529091 177354 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No need to be so literal. < 1391529119 608971 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's something in 5 and 9 too. < 1391529128 360678 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def tmp bf str:5 < 1391529128 540215 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1391529131 88760 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp foo < 1391529131 268311 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEgo `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, jconn ) , blsqbot ! < 1391529137 210343 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that's just the same. < 1391529139 888477 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^def tmp bf str:9 < 1391529140 68217 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Defined. < 1391529141 664390 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp foo < 1391529141 846060 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoterica, ... < 1391529147 253261 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nice < 1391529169 215080 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^str 9 get < 1391529169 394746 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :,[.,]++++++++++++++[>++++++++>++++>+++++++>++++++<<<<-]>>++.--------------------------.>>+++.++++++++++++++.+++++++.<+.>+++.--.<++.<.<++++.>>>++.<<.>>+++++.<+++.---.<.+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++.+++++.>>.<.>--.----.<----.<<.>-----.>>+.-.<.>--.<-----------------------------------------------------------------.<-.+++++++++++++.>>----------.<.>++++.<<------.<--.>>.+++++++++++++++++++++ < 1391529174 223081 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Output length limits strike again. < 1391529191 590627 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The program is probably complete, it's just that the bf interpreter has an overly short maximum length limit. < 1391529191 782678 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style ... < 1391529191 962372 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not found. < 1391529203 360649 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1391529203 542311 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc* iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack pa qwantz sms speeches ss wp youtube < 1391529261 199982 :Tritonio1!~Thunderbi@93.115.94.148 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1391529305 873028 :Tritonio!~Thunderbi@93.115.94.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391529556 565280 :passby!~mypirc@120.168.1.225 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391529579 422880 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :^tmp passby < 1391529579 602612 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :passby: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page. (For the other kind of esoteric ... < 1391529595 473539 :passby!~mypirc@120.168.1.225 PART :#esoteric < 1391529605 777623 :passby!~mypirc@120.168.1.225 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391529742 447932 :passby!~mypirc@120.168.1.225 PART :#esoteric < 1391530191 122297 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391530199 974183 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That's one reason to have rle bf < 1391530202 328152 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :DDOS still going on? I couldn't connect earlier < 1391530209 61689 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and was close to pinging out on this attempt < 1391530290 660346 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: weird. I thought it calmed down yesterday fternoon, and SSL is back on track today. < 1391530389 856605 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :why don't people think about anyone else? < 1391530392 165838 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi boily < 1391530458 430944 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :because people. < 1391530461 8537 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi quintopia < 1391530528 213523 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is new job < 1391530563 794284 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1391530596 786007 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: unknown. I start next week. if it is yours, also unknown. < 1391530611 901535 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Frhellooxius. < 1391530621 880488 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: i don't have a new job. you never got me one. < 1391530657 944531 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: so what are you doing this week? < 1391530737 928137 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: documenting what I was working on, tutorialing the teammates, (subtly) lazying around on IRC and wikipédia... < 1391530757 676685 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: sounds like a good week to invent a new esolang < 1391530775 408158 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: you're already better at it than. you're on cpressey's list! < 1391530797 433658 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :This channel has plenty of lists, doesn't it? < 1391530802 368414 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is cpressey's list a list of people who asked about cpressey's list? < 1391530805 805618 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if so, I'm on it now, I guess < 1391530817 425787 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is cpressey's list? < 1391530842 371335 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: you were apparently on it already, no point in asking < 1391530890 727982 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh well. time to retroactively bask in the Glory of being in Cpressey's List. < 1391530896 575009 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: of course you are on it. you are also better at esolang than me < 1391531005 673837 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anyone know what year Half-Broken Car in Heavy Traffic came out? < 1391531057 532065 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I'm not convinced I'm better at BF Joust than you, though < 1391531085 496703 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I horribly suck at the Joust. < 1391531091 912371 :Tritonio!~Thunderbi@93.115.94.148 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1391531110 599615 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i'll concede we are roughly equal there, but that only says we have too much timme on our hands roughly once a year < 1391531128 827724 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I don't have too much time on my hands right now < 1391531145 508738 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm upset at my latest strategy not being able to top the hill < 1391531153 408237 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even when it beats every other program, it still doesn't top the hill < 1391531158 856985 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is really frustrating < 1391531166 521135 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have to, like, make it beat every other program by more, or something < 1391531181 72211 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm the original document for HBCHT says it was created 2011. does anyone remember seeing it anywhere before 2011? < 1391531210 872130 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Having a Baby Cat Hurl on the Table? < 1391531239 826659 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Half-Broken Car in Heavy Traffic seems likely from context < 1391531241 324312 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :slereollah < 1391531265 17442 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woops < 1391531268 955448 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wrong channel < 1391531273 701124 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait < 1391531274 381902 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No < 1391531277 366721 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is the correct one < 1391531281 519391 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a HBCHT < 1391531286 76550 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1391531305 470133 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh right < 1391531308 113021 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You answered < 1391531311 981314 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEVERMIND < 1391531348 339475 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is cpressey's list: http://catseye.tc/node/Esolang < 1391531362 325250 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a number on here i never looked at before < 1391531369 530005 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alternatively, it's a BCT variant which uses '0', '1', and 'H'; the 'H'es don't do anything but you have to sprinkle them into the program anyway, much like PLEASE in INTERCAL < 1391531439 622552 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it seems I'm quite good at guessing which of my esolangs would appeal to cpressey < 1391531454 822414 :nooodl_!~nooodl@61.97-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1391531462 751913 :nooodl_!~nooodl@61.97-242-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391531632 645519 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :re Aubergine: “nothing spectacular, but somewhat cute.” heh :D < 1391531638 856811 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391531673 419041 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, who's online right now? < 1391531679 488118 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Im surprised at how big this channel is < 1391531692 94195 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its pretty big, isn't it? < 1391531701 955126 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1391531723 715656 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get the feeling that we're probably the only two active users right now. < 1391531735 549864 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1391531737 794414 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are we being trolled? < 1391531738 395877 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1391531743 92236 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or three. < 1391531748 1873 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's been pretty active today < 1391531753 135732 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh that's good < 1391531758 614613 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely never seen these two before < 1391531761 972998 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I've never seen either of you here today < 1391531762 937776 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah i see lots of words here < 1391531768 461262 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means rainbow welcome time? < 1391531773 109449 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome password2 johnnie < 1391531775 226572 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope. and I couldn't `relcome them properly. *cough* Gregor` *cough* < 1391531781 335931 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, the rainbow welcome bot is down < 1391531782 244881 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the gregorbots are dead. < 1391531795 7222 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i though the relcome is a typo < 1391531804 124809 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: it's a Rainbow wELCOME. < 1391531813 660570 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1391531813 840446 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh don't worry about it. I'm new to the whole process anyway. I have only one entry on the Esoteric wiki. < 1391531824 205261 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("I'm a gregorbot and I'm not dead!\n"); < 1391531827 960052 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :johnnie: neat! that's a good start. < 1391531828 139751 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a gregorbot and I'm not dead! < 1391531829 844974 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, thanks :) < 1391531836 739135 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have nada < 1391531844 965279 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: dammit now i'm singing the lumberjack song :( < 1391531865 465898 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: uhm. I would like to say that it's not my fault, but then... < 1391531878 891850 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :SPAM/1...I'm going to flesh it out some more tonight. I have a lot of good ideas about it. But I need to iron those out. < 1391531880 198819 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1391531892 577724 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, good, Phantom_Hoover isn't here, so you're safe even if it's a BF derivative < 1391531908 672526 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but SPAM/1 isn't a BF derivative so that works even better < 1391531912 690112 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :johnnie: have you looked at the PDF in the /topic? < 1391531925 397765 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't, boily, no. < 1391531978 184270 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to work in SPAM/1 as part Monty Python joke. SPAM/2 was supposed to have been "SPAM/EGGS/SAUSAGE/SPAM" and SPAM/3 as "I/DONT/LIKE/SPAM" < 1391531978 438916 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, any esolang that requires snailmail to implement is pretty creative < 1391531983 657803 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if unlikely to actually be implemented < 1391531995 339617 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think SPAM/1 is probably better just as it is < 1391532046 670905 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :johnnie: what order does XMTR retrive the stored data in? < 1391532046 965084 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the idea of BF. I took SPAM/1 is a different direction by making the input minimal instead of making the language minimal. < 1391532114 865258 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing about BF is that BF itself is pretty good, but people have a tendency to make uncreative minor variations on it < 1391532118 741120 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which gets really annoying after a while < 1391532138 822499 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF is great as hell < 1391532146 761417 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's pretty good to prove Turing completeness < 1391532159 273969 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used Dartmouth-BASIC as a model for the bulk of the commands. XMTR is nothing more than a Basic DATA statement. < 1391532194 15832 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so good that people start to have strange ideas like "this isn't turing-complete because it's not readily obvious how to directly reduce BF to it" < 1391532206 670846 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :johnnie: oh right < 1391532208 736774 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also if someone asks you to make a compiler at gunpoint? < 1391532213 34128 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bam, make a BF compiler! < 1391532215 114015 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're done < 1391532224 32300 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: boring, like half my languages there's no obvious way to reduce BF to them directly < 1391532233 20545 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i get asked to make a compiler at gunpoint every Tuesday < 1391532236 591841 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: can't I make a Quiler self-compiler? < 1391532244 676370 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that targets Quiler? < 1391532245 644560 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: that's not a situation I think I'd find myself in in the foreseeable future... < 1391532265 376418 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(contrary to quintopia, who lives the American Dream every week.) < 1391532266 817765 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think any sequence of bytes fulfils that restriction < 1391532270 860743 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You never know! < 1391532301 340372 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: being forced to write a compiler while a moose is charging towards you, that is more likely for me. < 1391532306 863019 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Quiler is defined as folows: given any input, a Quiler compiler ignores it and outputs a Quiler compiler) < 1391532325 885022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it is not a massively useful language) < 1391532354 278328 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Canadian eh? < 1391532365 33480 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: pretty much so. Québécois, even. < 1391532379 17510 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are mooses inherently Canadian, or just associated with Canada < 1391532382 305116 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :umm… meese? < 1391532387 869431 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :meeseses. < 1391532402 641581 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: are the squirrels black in your area of Quebec too? or just Ottawa? < 1391532404 34789 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm mulling over a BASIC version of the "LIST" command for SPAM/1. How does this sound...in SPAM/1, LIST "program name" @ "address" will send a printed copy of the list program to the specified address. < 1391532414 181739 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :johnnie: that seems useful < 1391532446 904428 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think mine is going towards a Chindogu. :) < 1391532452 529432 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I'm trying to work out if SPAM/1 has the ability to store infinite data < 1391532455 572312 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I had an esolang idea < 1391532462 384718 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: there are also meese in maine and alaska and other such northerly places < 1391532481 98479 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i always have esolang ideas < 1391532486 468457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :here it is: the only unlimited-size data store available, you can add a datum to it (of fixed maximum size), and remove a random datum from it < 1391532491 993113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's it < 1391532497 82492 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've got at least 3 just sitting around on paper < 1391532503 650217 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can this be TC, I wonder? < 1391532522 534467 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: depends on the rest of the language < 1391532526 149543 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I gotta get back to work. But it's good to know this place is useful for peer reviewing these ideas. < 1391532528 726437 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: regardless of the rest of the language < 1391532554 432991 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :remember, this is the /only/ unlimited store, you're pasting it onto an FSM < 1391532569 124641 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we can't disregard the rest of the language. if the rest of the language provides a means to recognize which datum was removed... < 1391532582 596202 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: the store is unordered < 1391532594 36740 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: our squirrels are gray. sometimes you get a glimpse of an albino one. < 1391532594 933121 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or as in, we have the rest of the language, and we have the store < 1391532596 652816 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bye guys! < 1391532608 136752 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :johnnie: adieu! < 1391532608 447250 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :bye < 1391532613 522192 :johnnie!801771a4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.23.113.164 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1391532618 69137 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the only way they can communicate is via "add this element", "retrieve a random element" < 1391532653 172146 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391532673 607117 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: okay but still. consider an instruction like "test for divisibility by x and branch" < 1391532691 944150 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: the data themselves are finite size < 1391532699 248126 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: then you can store bits as primes < 1391532700 904722 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's equivalent to a really really large switch-case < 1391532911 168612 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a22a.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1391532979 956597 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what makes a programming language esoteric < 1391533020 623539 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure there's any hard answer < 1391533034 47985 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah i think the unordered thing mostly breaks TC. if only aggregate data are available, you end up with no more than a single perceptron at best. < 1391533034 600534 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's lots of gray area < 1391533041 633377 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :any soft ones then :p < 1391533052 791818 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: yes on the wiki < 1391533059 656180 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1391533083 393632 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the wiki is? < 1391533091 764691 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a working answer of "there wouldn't be any point in trying to create a useful standard library", but that excludes some languages like Funge-98 < 1391533095 318350 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Main_Page < 1391533097 277373 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolangs.org or something < 1391533105 405298 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that < 1391533109 707978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you haven't gone there yet, do so, the channel makes no sense if you haven't seen the website it's associated with < 1391533144 35375 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have been on ther i think , but it was a few moons ago < 1391533177 412203 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tbh i just randomly joined this channel after listing channels on freenode < 1391533388 306876 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? this channel totally makes sense without that wiki, as long as you know esoteric programming languages from other sources < 1391533395 635611 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :um < 1391533405 619860 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least it makes as much sense as it makes with the wiki < 1391533416 123554 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i think your definition holds anyone. just because people make libraries for esolangs doesn't mean that there was any point in doing so. < 1391533421 955440 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :why don't we have the url of the wiki in the channel topic though? < 1391533430 625698 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :*anyway < 1391533461 285861 :Bike!~Glossina@gannon-wless-gw.resnet.wsu.edu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe because we relcome everyone anyway < 1391533486 296576 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :or we would < 1391533500 228814 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we had another bot that could < 1391533508 232502 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot can't even finish a sentence < 1391533508 450468 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: did either book mention schroedinger's cat? :() but i'll put it online :p < 1391533511 507102 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1391533515 687225 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense < 1391533535 267794 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :relcome < 1391533653 427096 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, and apparently the url to the wiki is in the chanserv welcome message < 1391533668 275108 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or so chanserv claims < 1391533713 32411 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow , my internets is slow < 1391533777 108639 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: care to take any bets on how many kb in a SELECT. 99 bottles program. assume it singularizes correctly and prints the optional verse. < 1391533888 183330 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/SELECT. < 1391533894 383128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not aware of the language < 1391533964 126713 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is scary < 1391533972 951446 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this SELECT. language < 1391534005 876687 :atriq!9020800e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.144.32.128.14 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391534028 951824 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it doesn't seem that different from BF in terms of storage and flow control, so the main difficulty is just the storage for the images < 1391534050 434299 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing of the order of tens of KB because of that < 1391534074 129249 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do these EXP. and LOG. and SELECT. commands work? < 1391534146 104108 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :very rapidly < 1391534177 697478 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: haha. no and very unlikely. < 1391534226 719438 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it not jump by the distance of the result? < 1391534231 412494 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: more reasonable would be in the hundreds of kb with comments and indentation stripped. < 1391534242 579877 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I think that by picking an appropriate base, you can construct a value that has real>imag change after 256 exps, which are reversible by logs < 1391534242 798967 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but i'll let you know once i've written it. < 1391534253 999467 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends on what font you use, ofc < 1391534269 2771 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you copy numbers exactly in this SELECT. language? < 1391534273 188654 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: 7pt deja vu sans mono < 1391534277 847487 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: same way as in BF < 1391534286 5444 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really, the numbers are a red herring < 1391534296 203993 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't want to work with the numbers specifically < 1391534300 792196 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with their mathematical properties < 1391534305 588079 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah complex number , not used to seeing them in a programming language < 1391534310 84095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a typical program's going to store integers, BF-style, but not store them /as/ integers < 1391534317 945167 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: RIGHT. EXP. LEFT. SELECT. RIGHT. LOG. RIGHT. SELECT. LEFT. will copy a number one cell to the right. < 1391534324 785730 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but rather by extracting them from a set of complex numbers that are easily inter-converted < 1391534343 401801 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least, it seems that quintopia's method of esolang programming is entirely different from mine :-) < 1391534359 167660 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: hmm < 1391534397 443285 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: that seems strange < 1391534441 546042 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but my first rule of esolang programming is: even if the esolang has numbers, it's often a bad idea to use them, you can go synthesize your own arithmetic instead if it's easier < 1391534468 974183 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so QUIT :Write error: Broken pipe < 1391534490 482872 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: is that something you learnt from intercal? < 1391534492 60750 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@libdl.so JOIN :#esoteric < 1391534505 916483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: no, actually using numbers as numbers in INTERCAL isn't so bad < 1391534542 868913 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although modern versions are actually TC with no variables involved at all, I think < 1391534561 7901 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, you could definitely just store your numbers as nth exponentiations of i^(1/4)^((1/2)^(1/256)) i suppose, but you'll still have to convert them to output them. < 1391534576 988469 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I/O is normally comparatively minor although I guess not in 99bob < 1391534595 534894 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: um, no variables is a bit going too far < 1391534615 798998 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because intercal has very convenient operations variable < 1391534625 776791 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: sure, but they're also unreadable < 1391534628 722713 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it has array indexing and indexed assignment < 1391534639 830094 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you eschew variables entirely, it mostly just looks like COBOL, which isn't so bad < 1391534641 395802 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/1/2/2/ < 1391534670 957305 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you forgot to escape the second / < 1391534676 765038 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :making that substitution pretty hard to read < 1391534687 764837 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :well i was lagged out at the time and i knew you'd understand < 1391534704 556992 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it took me like 10 seconds to figure it < 1391534740 187089 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, so in SELECT., the SELECT. statement doesn't write to the cell under the pointer. it writes to where the pointer was when you last did LOG. or EXP. < 1391534755 365697 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1391534832 999332 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: even then that sequence you gave doesn't make sense to me < 1391534843 495177 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"RIGHT. EXP. LEFT. SELECT. RIGHT. LOG. RIGHT. SELECT. LEFT. will copy a number one cell to the right." < 1391534875 705935 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: you have to assume both cells to the right contain the same constant k. < 1391534903 771858 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. but how do you get such a state if the tape starts from random numbers? < 1391534916 250102 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :correct me if I'm not mistaken , to write a brainfuck simulator would not be very difficult? < 1391534935 300487 :atriq!9020800e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.144.32.128.14 PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: it isn't at all. < 1391534936 331524 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: not very, no < 1391534942 715613 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mmm < 1391534957 589686 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: the tape starts like ...k k k k k k k k k... < 1391534996 922985 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! < 1391535008 788103 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :k is ostensibly randomly selected, but they are all equal, so it doesn't matter < 1391535017 732160 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: Funnily enough, the under-the-hood representation is RLE-ish. < 1391535019 603885 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^show tmp < 1391535019 783525 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :,[.,]+14[>+8>+4>+7>+6<4-]>2+2.-26.>2+3.+14.+7.<+.>+3.-2.<+2.<.<+4.>3+2.<2.>2+5.<+3.-3.<.+73.+5.>2.<.>-2.-4.<-4.<2.>-5.>2+.-.<.>-2.<-65.<-.+13.>2-10.<.>+4.<2-6.<-2.>2.+69.<2+.>.+5.>.<-2.>+4.>-3.-67.<2-2.<-.-3.-8.>+2.<-6.>-5..>.<+.<+6.>3.<2-2.>-8.<+2.<.>+7.>.<2.-2.>3.<3-.>2+4.<-2.>+4.-2.<-5.>2.<-6.<.>+3.>.<3.+.>+2.<+7.>-.+10.<+.>2+.<2+.>-5.>2+.-.<-31.<2+.>-2.>2.<2-5.+2.+3.>+31.>.<+4.<-4.-8.>+6.+3.<2-2.>-5.>+2.<2-4.+6.-.>3+12.-12. < 1391535022 882593 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If i'm bored enough , it would make an interesting easter egg < 1391535031 131322 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Away for now.) < 1391535110 24174 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :easter egg for what < 1391535123 536883 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::} < 1391535125 334737 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you figure out anything about that brainfuck-dowhile language btw? < 1391535134 706150 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a td < 1391535175 322194 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should eat i've been laying here for two hours being hungry < 1391535222 893236 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh , i'm waiting for mince to defrost so i can start making stirfry < 1391535225 282066 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I created a language like that < 1391535228 511522 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure if it's on the wiki < 1391535247 968273 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: huh, I didn't think of combining those two foods, but it's kind-of obvious in retrospect < 1391535264 531395 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1391535270 390451 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1391535276 631920 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :students tends to summon weird combinations < 1391535278 171849 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch JOIN :#esoteric < 1391535302 897883 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they'll eat bread dipped in anything less runny than bread < 1391535345 387309 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: we talked about it yesterday. it's a bf variant where a bracket loop runs at least once, so it's like a do-while instead of a while loop. +- commands are modulo 256. < 1391535363 854733 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: int-e asked yesterday whether it's turing complete, to which I handwaved a proof that it is. < 1391535392 831335 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e might have a code generator by today or something. < 1391535399 397056 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I designed that ages ago < 1391535409 924259 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I was learning Python live on #esoteric < 1391535414 3382 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1391535414 258745 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :by entering it into codebots < 1391535423 418217 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun fact: I originally learned to write Python with no newlines < 1391535429 368298 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: i'd like to see your version of programming SELECT. honestly, seeing as how mine is so wasteful of tape. or would you just build a compiler from boolfuck or something? < 1391535453 27403 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: did you learn it? < 1391535456 736472 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is basically unreadable because you do exec "first line of loop:\n inside of loop", etc. < 1391535459 395750 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: the basics < 1391535472 245667 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, I'd just compile from either boolfuck, or 8-bit non-wrapping BF < 1391535480 636270 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so none of the functional programming/object-oriented aspects? < 1391535492 865506 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I learned those later, not live in #esoteric < 1391535494 878388 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume in BF the instructions and memory is not the same space? < 1391535499 96146 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it doesn't really have any functional programming aspects < 1391535503 602441 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from functions being barely first-class < 1391535517 154347 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I think they were upgraded from economy class rather than buying the more expensive ticket < 1391535519 445575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: indeed < 1391535525 508609 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1391535526 466588 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: bf has a lot of repeated symbols, so rle is perfect < 1391535526 646408 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically I argued that you can translate (bf without the io) to bf-dowhile, for which you have to simulate each cell with a sequence of multiple cells. the translation is a bit wasteful but nothing unexpected for bf. < 1391535526 646578 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :completely seperate < 1391535534 358669 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is usually (but not always) the case in esolangs < 1391535534 581771 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well yeah, but you can treat it functionally by having functions that take and return functions < 1391535543 420134 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's faster to add 30 at once than to add 1 30 times < 1391535552 562895 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, bf-dowhile can't quite have all values of a bf program because there's some io you can't do. < 1391535553 364486 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can see http://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:Self-modifying for esolangs where the code can be used as data, in one way or another < 1391535566 337029 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: we decided it was TC last time this came up, too < 1391535569 246204 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I can't remember why < 1391535585 71506 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, it's obviously impossible to write a dofuck program which sometimes produces output and sometimes doesn't < 1391535597 336968 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can't write cat, for instance, if you want it to work correctly on null input < 1391535598 774904 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called dofuck? we didn't know it had a name < 1391535611 328134 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I called it, back then < 1391535615 99245 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in camelcase, DoFuck < 1391535615 278820 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :great < 1391535623 417466 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's such an obvious idea it's probably been invented more than twice < 1391535636 554295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :DoFuck's easier to impl than BF, btw < 1391535649 905781 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you only have to be able to move the IP backwards, not forwards < 1391535654 590708 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1391535660 646986 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, by more than one instruction at a time < 1391535683 524201 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a language where the IP /only/ moves backwards is going to be sub-TC unless it's self-modifying or has first class functions or uses some other loophole I didn't think of < 1391535725 244775 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the first version looks something like SMITH, the second version arguably describes Underload) < 1391535737 134992 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I have to choose, I prefer bf < 1391535750 5245 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have to choose, normally < 1391535751 34949 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :over dofuck that is < 1391535760 274488 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about a language where values are stored in the IP? < 1391535761 714758 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: if you like languages with the instructions and data mixed , ire  recommend Aubergunine (hi oboily) < 1391535780 428669 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :stupid lag dropping my backspaces < 1391535789 399376 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's Aubergine < 1391535790 143513 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: that's almost equivalent to just storing them in a register < 1391535794 906212 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly completely equivalent < 1391535800 217606 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: your backspaces echoed literally < 1391535803 990201 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is quite impressive < 1391535813 37335 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Except it jumps where you are in code < 1391535820 23466 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia, by no means < 1391535827 45900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: you mean storing them in the instruction? < 1391535828 520890 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its get confuzing < 1391535837 205008 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first, still unpublished, esolang worked like that < 1391535845 500927 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: No, the instruction pointer itself < 1391535855 799958 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and my client doesn't even understand the characters of what you said < 1391535861 309434 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: you mean the memory address that holds the location of the instruction pointer? < 1391535862 34345 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't arm-32 sort of work like that? < 1391535862 214301 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I guess that wouldn't be useful unless you had instruction memory aliasing < 1391535884 623190 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've already written a cheat-quine in Aubergine. I should write a self-deleting program. That sounds ... i don't even know it's possible. it probably isn't < 1391535889 395487 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really, I don't understand what FreeFull wants to say < 1391535899 56676 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I mean, you write a value to the instruction pointer, so now it points at a different position in the instructions < 1391535909 676885 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :So basically storing data in a jump < 1391535910 597423 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: that's just a computed jump < 1391535932 810563 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: oh, so you just mean memory-mapping the instruction pointer? < 1391535933 256709 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but certainly, the instruction pointer /stack/ is a very common way to store data in esolangs < 1391535940 308824 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :With aliasing for the instruction memory, you could use it to pass a value to the code < 1391535953 54161 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one nice rule of thumb is "two stacks = TC", which obviously has loads of exceptions but is still reasonably reliable in practice < 1391535976 604101 :atehwa!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1391535976 826774 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Read error: Operation timed out < 1391535978 275603 :atehwa_!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1391536009 710841 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about two queues? < 1391536010 922081 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're having trouble proving a language TC, using the call stack as one is often a wise idea < 1391536011 569100 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it miiiiiiiiiiight be possible to write a Aubergine program that overwrites itself with a's < 1391536012 388808 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: even one queue is often (but not always) enough < 1391536016 766450 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: one queue is enough < 1391536023 13506 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :see http://esolangs.org/wiki/DownRight, for instance < 1391536047 510334 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's much easier to design a one-queue language that isn't TC than a two-stack language that isn't TC, by accident < 1391536094 27728 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obviously both are trivial if you're trying, e.g. you could have two stacks but no commands that manipulate them) < 1391536153 910593 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :one queue reminds me to those very old home-built computers using a disk, before ram existed < 1391536154 94224 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1391536157 870960 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi, int-e < 1391536161 130894 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i want to design a language that has two stacks and a queue and is TC, but becomes sub-TC if you remove any one of the three < 1391536189 584585 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: now you reminded me of delay line memory < 1391536202 220786 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you heard of that? it was used before magnetic core memory was invented, as in a really /really/ long time ago < 1391536225 167152 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: that bf-dowhile language we were talking about, ais523 calls it "DoFuck", says he also thinks it's turing-complete, and says "it's such an obvious idea it's probably been invented more than twice" < 1391536228 54836 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically data is stored using vibrations in a trough full of mercury, you put the data in at one end, and it comes out the other end a few seconds later < 1391536236 226444 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes < 1391536275 783306 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's crazy < 1391536283 263352 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too young for these < 1391536347 173159 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :back from lunch, and I didn't eat aubergines. hi o quintopia! < 1391536354 778240 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you also know that PAL decoders involve delay lines in quartz crystals? < 1391536370 113610 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have seen one of those delay memorys on hackaday < 1391536373 713785 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :very awesome < 1391536376 886391 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: I didn't know that < 1391536390 305240 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sound and piezo works as makeshift version < 1391536398 404626 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :(electric signals go in, vibrate the quartz, the vibrations zig zag across the crystal for exactly 60µs (or whatever the delay is), reach the other end and become electricity again) < 1391536398 967144 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1391536407 412477 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy < 1391536437 108714 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the outgoing signal (the last scanline) is compared to the current scanline to figure out the colors < 1391536558 871065 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not an EE or a hardware guy, I don't really understand how classical television works in general. < 1391536566 554863 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :me neither < 1391536584 768498 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am an EE, so I have more of an idea < 1391536592 475285 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I treat it as a black box, so to speak < 1391536616 645186 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hi there, fellow engineer :D < 1391536640 767318 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't use analog video signals these days at all if I can avoid them < 1391536784 158914 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oo a EE < 1391536794 168313 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you see more of em than CE on the tubes < 1391537037 84430 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1391537038 153108 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1391537052 46074 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maaaan < 1391537061 681849 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried changing my registers to optimize some stuff < 1391537072 709233 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then "Gotta use ax for that!" < 1391537072 888710 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dang < 1391537076 336826 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ax you are a monster < 1391537083 439871 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Your thirst for power knows no end < 1391537140 136608 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds dangerous "i tried changing my registers to optimize some stuff" < 1391537140 863902 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::p < 1391537170 399088 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well i'm doing some basic graphics with x86 < 1391537183 829475 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1391537184 583396 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And i'm like "man, I'm tired of having to switch registers around" < 1391537194 822287 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I tried to do another order with less saving involved < 1391537195 876645 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But no < 1391537223 411548 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol i read that as resistors , instead of registers < 1391537264 125563 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2: just about the same thing. make a mistake and *FOOM* there goes the magic smoke. < 1391537272 147251 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1391537274 222800 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe < 1391537285 84524 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I did learn about the bswap trick < 1391537287 801639 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is quite neat < 1391537297 932681 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less shitty than popping and stacking < 1391537308 545774 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck bwsap < 1391537308 987648 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :--- No relevant information < 1391537311 423393 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :~duck bswap < 1391537311 870213 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 PRIVMSG #esoteric :--- No relevant information < 1391537319 103554 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION mapoles the Duck
< 1391537336 337232 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bswap is to swap the 16 bits in a 32 bits registers < 1391537350 768627 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought bswap reversed all the bytes in a register < 1391537355 89326 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: oh. shiny! < 1391537371 638723 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like [abcd....][xyz...] -> [xyz...][abcd...] < 1391537395 897283 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :x86 bswap does reverse the order of all 4 or 8 bytes. < 1391537404 545334 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't swap the two 16-bit halves. < 1391537409 837758 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't it? < 1391537410 484718 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1391537414 206439 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Misread it I guess < 1391537429 510660 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :a rotate by 16 bits should work though < 1391537436 708833 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh , am in a sound war with a firstyear < 1391537457 978943 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Reverses the byte order of a 32-bit (destination) register: bits 0 through 7 are swapped with bits 24 through 31, and bits 8 through 15 are swapped with bits 16 through 23. " < 1391537459 472023 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah yes < 1391537504 453290 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.c-jump.com/CIS77/asm_images/bswap_eax.png < 1391537507 818781 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So close and yet so far < 1391537546 941688 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's go with a ROL < 1391537551 361723 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that gives you abcd -> dcba, you just need abcd -> badc to turn that into abcd -> cdab < 1391537551 573374 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1391537552 351996 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that a dedicated instruction? bswap, I mean < 1391537566 139536 :elliott__!~elliott@li278-81.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know whether there's an instruction for that though < 1391537576 282242 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: It is, though only since the 486. < 1391537611 277089 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well a rotation will work < 1391537629 583686 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get more mileage out of 32 bit registers that way < 1391537716 850885 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :If all you want is to use the high bits of eax as "shadow space" for ax, you can keep using bswap too. < 1391537732 540072 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since the byte order reversal doesn't matter. < 1391537780 902828 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1391537783 233189 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :True < 1391537790 755641 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's go back with bswap then < 1391537817 19907 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks < 1391537876 519427 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus unlike pops, you can disregard the order < 1391538024 372890 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably saves two bytes, too, if the 486-dependency isn't a problem. ("0F C8+rd BSWAP" vs. "C1 /0 ib ROL r/m32, imm8" with an operand-size override prefix byte in 16-bit mode.) < 1391538070 60041 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, well. I can't really deduce whether BSWAP also needs an operand-size override. < 1391538130 829110 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"When the BSWAP instruction references a 16-bit register, the result is undefined", it says. Maybe that means it does. Saves a byte, anyway. < 1391538271 766427 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it means intel and amd do it differently < 1391538486 998729 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was sort of assuming that since BSWAP only exists for 32 bits, it'd have an implicit default operand size of 32, but if they've bothered to put in that statement (and don't say so explicitly), I guess it probably doesn't. < 1391538693 121677 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, my gay squares stopped changing color < 1391538702 891732 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I changed the value of ah by mistake < 1391538787 939024 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: do you change ah, eh? < 1391538788 191171 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: what does gnu stand for? yeah reading, wiki, so it doesn't need to < 1391538814 383166 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: I don't think that's on the Wiki™ < 1391538814 562726 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: ' right' < 1391538836 752113 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, stosb inputs al, not ah < 1391538840 217984 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dang < 1391538854 847492 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: GNU's Noodly Unix. < 1391538855 175262 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh ok, what file format should be scheme :) somebody'd probably implement it < 1391538900 278491 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm fairly sure somebody's already implemented scheme < 1391538989 719906 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: did you forget? they already did implement scheme < 1391538989 938071 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: darn this tab completion. i defined the scheme callback with a c world. < 1391539029 422465 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woo, my squares are gay again < 1391539090 702286 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the screen clearing still fucks up < 1391539172 708727 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: you sound like me, blasphemating against the Evil Tab Completion. < 1391539172 894737 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: ( define ( safe-apply func. args) ( for-each display args) ( car ' ' a" to *a* < 1391539195 522470 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ehm, wtf, my internet bank is running some kind of analytics script ... from a third-party web server with an expired certificate < 1391539283 388627 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_, were they straight? < 1391539323 10337 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :password2 : The program displays squares, and then increment the color < 1391539331 454261 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making them going through rainbow cycles < 1391539346 253677 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah , but you said they are gay < 1391539357 798098 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1391539364 554518 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1391539367 6684 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :As gay as a three dollar bill, if bills were square < 1391539399 419214 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1391539417 912639 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pastebin.com/Yx1V0kK6 < 1391539434 841458 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: block it < 1391539435 986333 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does someone have any idea why the screen clearing hides the upper part of the screen < 1391539444 234096 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yep, done < 1391539449 698984 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Every cycle, I delete the screen by blackening it < 1391539458 859682 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And redoing the squares in the next cycle < 1391539474 332625 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But for some reason, the first 15 or so rows are totally black no matter what < 1391539475 668578 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oooh , i cant remember when last i used assembly < 1391539518 35822 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :third-party scripts you can't verify are a major malware source < 1391539572 651098 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i found a easyway to make any linux fanboy install malware < 1391539626 27664 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tried moving the screen clearing to various places < 1391539642 943082 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Before the drawing, after the drawing, after checking for the next screen display < 1391539646 638328 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But nothing works < 1391539682 352600 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably need to vsync < 1391539688 539540 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did < 1391539701 619490 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :At label vsync0 and vsync1 < 1391539769 445887 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, are you sure dx has the expected value when you get there? I don't know what the calling convention of those interrupts are, but they might clobber it < 1391539817 616642 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see < 1391539830 793040 :atriq!9020800e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.144.32.128.14 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1391539891 38296 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. the guys over at /r/vxjunkies don't have much information pertaining to vsync problems. < 1391539897 154312 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: are you back from your lecture? < 1391539979 71658 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1391539986 250284 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess a test would be to remove the vsyncs and see what changes < 1391539999 706533 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or add a mov dx whatever < 1391540001 988800 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or both! < 1391540052 931960 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh < 1391540062 151622 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Removing the vsync actually works slightly better! < 1391540074 741253 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see all squares, but they all kinda flicker < 1391540088 508578 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it's a speed problem? < 1391540120 237676 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe the emulator isn't emulating vsync at all < 1391540306 712807 :ggherdov_!sid11402@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iricgftaevfavhgr QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1391540365 979647 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Possibly < 1391540380 237785 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :.com files don't play on my computer unfortunately < 1391540407 684409 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I played many vidyah gehms on dosbox and it seems to have no problem with graphics < 1391540439 908319 :password2!~password@197.76.53.211 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1391540445 314557 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a good place to ask assembly questions? < 1391540457 542355 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Outside of "The 1970's") < 1391540613 112280 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 1980's might also be ok < 1391540639 339964 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have any hairband < 1391540805 746202 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is #assembly (iirc) on freenode, and when it's not plagued by "I almost know a bit of C, how do I make an OS?" #osdev would have people that know assembly < 1391540814 784733 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you just ask fizzie < 1391540841 268841 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: is there a #fizzie chännel? < 1391540850 101984 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: I'm guessing not < 1391540878 294398 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: also, pretty sure it's spelled channel < 1391540971 16578 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :beuh... < 1391541002 96867 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :böilü < 1391541025 938102 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ïn̈ẗ-ë < 1391541034 528890 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm slightly disappointed, is there really no lower case version of Ÿ? < 1391541046 946052 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :ÿ? < 1391541047 125705 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ÿ? < 1391541049 77716 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: boily has been umlauting random letters for a while < 1391541067 675106 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and isn't ÿ the last character in Latin-1? < 1391541074 109107 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1391541099 476853 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh. indeed. < 1391541116 139487 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that gives it some sort of distinction < 1391541129 772347 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ultimate letter < 1391541147 720177 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ÿ < 1391541154 269907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right < 1391541165 589293 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION unicodely mapoles Gregor`
< 1391541176 549068 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :no hackego? *gasp* < 1391541210 910494 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :`help < 1391541212 971804 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("%x", 'ÿ') < 1391541215 89919 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :c3bf < 1391541220 933972 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, it's Firefox that causes my compose key to stop working < 1391541241 1189 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :> fromEnum 'ÿ' < 1391541242 760989 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric : 255 < 1391541246 838670 :evalj!~jeval@4E5C4F20.dsl.pool.telekom.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1391541247 18323 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, EgoBot interpreted my UTF-8 as Latin-1 < 1391541259 822762 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can tell it's 255 anyway if you have UTF-8 encoding memorised < 1391541265 796730 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't, but I know about the C2 and C3 ranges < 1391541354 288113 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, so that became a multicharacter character literal < 1391541418 49182 :ggherdov_!sid11402@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xwwfothbgxldfgvg JOIN :#esoteric < 1391541602 443180 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, and those are impl-defined < 1391541611 876131 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I believe gcc's handing is to concatenate the bytes < 1391541643 988600 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is usually the right handling anyway < 1391541666 670282 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("%x", *u8"ÿ"); < 1391541668 148188 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does not compile. < 1391541681 260805 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if I got the syntax right, that's C11 < 1391541691 849145 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :!c printf("%ld", __STDC_VERSION__); < 1391541694 95716 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :199901 < 1391541699 120063 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that compiler's C99 < 1391541703 378991 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would sort of be happier with "nope, that's not a character", but I think there's some legacy that needs them < 1391541765 542299 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does *u8"ÿ" mean? < 1391541785 700150 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think u8"string" means "this string is UTF-8", in some sense < 1391541787 831593 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that < 1391541789 884375 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check the docs < 1391541797 708251 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the * is just a pointer dereference as normal < 1391541815 475595 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :which on a utf8 string just gives the first byte? < 1391541819 298083 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1391541871 886318 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I remembered right, it is u8"string" for a UTF-8 literal < 1391541875 306386 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm looking up what those do < 1391541913 63334 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :] 3 u:7 u: 'ÿ 0A[é' < 1391541913 503447 :evalj!~jeval@4E5C4F20.dsl.pool.telekom.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: 255 32 48 65 91 233 < 1391541926 99258 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha, if you do u8"string", then the contents of the string are interpreted as in the source multibyte character set, and converted to UTF-8 < 1391541937 621822 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas normally they'd be converted to the execution narrow or wide character set < 1391541949 752804 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :aah, that seems actually useful < 1391541949 932457 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ^ that can show the unicode values < 1391541957 870878 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :] 3 u:7 u: 'őű' < 1391541958 233757 :evalj!~jeval@4E5C4F20.dsl.pool.telekom.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: 337 369 < 1391541962 647544 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :takes utf8 < 1391541963 318292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does J have an explicit map command, or is map too low-level? < 1391541980 262918 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sort of yes < 1391541981 510128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, is that second letter a ü or a ű? < 1391541984 841784 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they look pretty similar in this font < 1391541988 312756 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ű I guess < 1391541997 743148 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, ű (with double acute) < 1391542008 794239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, is double acute what it's called? < 1391542015 22764 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always thought of it as an acute umlaut < 1391542016 74868 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :double acute accent < 1391542025 124628 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ő < 1391542026 733776 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an umlaut made of acutes < 1391542031 163499 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEgo... < 1391542037 55725 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I guess you don't write ȯ for the un-umlauted, un-acute version < 1391542041 479356 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :a cute accent, hmm. < 1391542043 77367 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: what did you do with HackEgo < 1391542043 256958 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: riastradh believes beginners have to know < 1391542067 91477 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: I want to know < 1391542067 271080 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: are you looking for an angry fix! < 1391542073 197420 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :was Riastradh in here at some point? < 1391542075 451611 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, #scheme < 1391542130 417283 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :@remember Riastradh Actually, there are a lot of 'factorization challenges' where you can win a lot more than 200,000 USD if you manage to factor a 2048-bit RSA modulus, but you might have to watch out for the cops if you enter and win these challenges. < 1391542130 773701 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Done. < 1391542180 997466 :shachaf_!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1391542185 753698 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hichaf_ < 1391542198 404030 :shachaf_!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com QUIT :Changing host < 1391542198 583913 :shachaf_!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf JOIN :#esoteric < 1391542206 595024 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1391542211 62857 :shachaf_!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf NICK :shachaf < 1391542220 974337 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :higan < 1391542238 380587 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi fungot < 1391542238 620947 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: or is there a way to make scheme code readable to people who are using scheme in your head < 1391542242 249466 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: i'm looking for an angry fix! < 1391542242 465507 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: i would, but no cryptanalysis stuff. he does not know about them < 1391542254 876877 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :scheme? in *my* head? it's more likely than you think < 1391542268 176581 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: there is a crack in everything, that's how the scheme gets in < 1391542268 512996 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: but i mean for " touching" < 1391542275 726176 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: you generally don't let other people use scheme in your head ... at least not in public < 1391542276 58440 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner: the pointer is the instruction layer featuring all the instructions like ". though britain is more humid than finland i guess. it's the sort of thing < 1391542277 490612 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: good touch or bad touch < 1391542277 793741 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: is it still not yet even a complete superset of the lambda symbol... who cares that an os should never need to touch asm to get anything across. < 1391542341 545012 :EgoBot!~EgoBot@libdl.so QUIT :Write error: Broken pipe < 1391542347 313291 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-203-32.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if my laundry is done so I can go to bed < 1391542373 659245 :EgoBot!dlopen@libdl.so JOIN :#esoteric < 1391542388 967263 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :EgoBot: are you HackEgo? < 1391542399 146892 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome kmc < 1391542450 390062 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: i just opened a bag of Takis, and the act of pulling the bug open launched a tiny crumb of peppery deliciousness directly into my right eye. < 1391542458 461223 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :WITH MY GLASSES ON < 1391542500 27879 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: are you HackEgo? < 1391542500 207328 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: how's life? :o < 1391542509 868769 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: :o < 1391542510 85999 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: i think i've almost maybe got it. < 1391542530 737405 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: got what < 1391542530 917082 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: but they too were small, something like hash-tables consisting of variable-name/ value? i'm not sure it will! < 1391542610 933780 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: usually only grapefruits being peeled can manage to snipe one's eyes. a piece of Takis must be painful too! < 1391542659 860193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION confuses boily with fungot
< 1391542660 77950 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: have a look when i get around 30 spam per day on the bike < 1391542681 722573 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i too confuse fungot < 1391542681 902276 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: last year, their servers were cracked. < 1391542685 584703 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: o no < 1391542685 897192 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: like in the case of scheme48, every structure has its own scripting language and compiler)?? has type fnord, it messes up vim's highlight mode < 1391542719 711617 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am a Master Confungotter! < 1391542720 120958 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: take the difference of whether or not it deserves to be read. this wouldn't be so surprised. few people ever use the ( cl-style), you have to browse deitti.net before i find myself in an annoying and stupidly offensive way too, so... < 1391542796 434660 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523 uses fungot to confuse boily < 1391542796 653917 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: we have one of each. :) it's so absurd it's hilarious. my favorite topping is pepperoni. interesting... < 1391542809 249519 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :cofungot < 1391542809 429422 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: way to go if i were obfuscating it i wouldn't have, but it < 1391542820 804371 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: but it < 1391542821 121389 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: let me see if i have a function that returns the source of a builtin function, not sure if i ever think something geeky is funny, because so many people < 1391542877 918942 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: so many people < 1391542878 119142 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: and i don't know if that is what i was thinking it had something to do < 1391543288 973475 :atehwa_!atehwa@aulis.sange.fi NICK :atehwa < 1391543391 315247 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1391543480 769430 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1391544079 877463 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: got fun? < 1391544080 93979 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: i understand the problem now? can i use < 1391544195 892336 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION selfconfuses himself
< 1391544264 794840 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION uses full heal
< 1391544311 858319 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION impersonates a spacial vortex and randomly blinks around
< 1391544386 425633 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I won't be healed as easily as you think you are healing, Mr. FireFly! muah ah ah ah ah! < 1391544394 478836 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(said in a bad supervillain voice) < 1391544404 42295 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh < 1391544419 563944 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, btw, I surmised you're of the “Mr.” kind. < 1391544437 652246 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is indeed the case < 1391544725 207403 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391545470 820557 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe I have finally mastered Assembly https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/19940612/Graphic8.COM < 1391545502 282961 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: if I happen to want to potentially execute that on my machine, what should I do? < 1391545552 103452 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :dosbox, mount, type the name? < 1391545590 818709 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's what I did, and I now understand the “gay squares”. < 1391545595 139645 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either you can just open it directly (esc to quit) or use dosbox < 1391545615 755479 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just ron "dosbox graphic8.com" can't you < 1391545618 748733 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :run* < 1391545625 122291 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: fongut < 1391545625 301555 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: my answer: probably :p probably good for prototype. chicken will probably be using is ( fnord < 1391545641 403553 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Huh, that's convenient. < 1391545641 938478 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :see, you can probably run that < 1391545683 149251 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I probably ran that. < 1391545705 160587 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :if i run an arbitrary .com file with dosbox can it do things to my computer outside the dosbox < 1391545744 579799 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: i spent a little while looking for such exploits, but didn't find any < 1391545757 711367 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think dosbox is really focusing on sandbox security, however. < 1391545762 753402 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is easy to segfault dosbox with an invalid x86 instruction but it's just a NULL dereference < 1391545784 768248 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: How about a TSR that manages to fake in some commands to the dosbox shell, which has mount &c.? < 1391545795 721980 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can run mount /some/directory somedrive: in dosbox, can't you < 1391545800 222882 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :can a .com program not do that < 1391545808 203691 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that could work; I don't know if mount is restricted < 1391545813 764515 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: it could probably insert the keystrokes for that into the keyboard buffer < 1391545818 176243 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not restricted when you type it in, at least. < 1391546199 183173 :evalj!~jeval@4E5C4F20.dsl.pool.telekom.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1391546306 722466 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interestingly, the "mount" is not a shell builtin, but a separate MOUNT.COM on the virtual Z: drive. < 1391546313 394493 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can copy it elsewhere, and run, and it still works. < 1391546338 970644 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The contents are the 20 bytes ndisasm'd at http://sprunge.us/aiAF) < 1391546379 867395 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So presumably you might not even need to play tricks with the input buffer, just use the same int 21h interfaces. < 1391546485 331186 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(All the other commands in Z: are also 20-byte files that only differ in their last bytes.) < 1391546604 459975 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the record, int 21h/AH=4Ah is supposed to be "DOS 2+ - RESIZE MEMORY BLOCK" -- resize the block pointed to by ES to have a new size of BX paragraphs. < 1391546660 245472 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you look that up in RBIL < 1391546671 515461 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, of course. < 1391546704 53112 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1391546723 269320 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hooray for RBIL < 1391546772 665062 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually learned that DOS has malloc/free/realloc as interrupts from a paper book < 1391546893 241435 :impomatic!~chatzilla@79.251.125.91.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has a copy of Ralf Brown's Interrupt List as a paper book!
< 1391547238 983360 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Damn MS DOS is way too fast for an animation! < 1391547240 978824 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: the really funny thing is that the files on Z: are almost the same; they only differ in their last byte, as far as I can see. < 1391547253 891374 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I try to move a square to simulate MOVEMENT I see three at once! < 1391547255 812165 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: (All the other commands in Z: are also 20-byte files that only differ in their last bytes.) < 1391547261 876031 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I should use the timer instead < 1391547264 901579 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: move it more slowly then < 1391547273 153381 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But how! < 1391547277 801522 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: sorry. < 1391547279 74566 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, the timer in DOS runs at 19.2Hz < 1391547282 734260 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is normally too slow to be useful < 1391547285 798698 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Turns out the int 21h/AH=4Ah bits are just regular code, and it's the invalid opcode FE /8 that does something DOSBox-specific. < 1391547287 657937 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I think you can customize it to be faster < 1391547297 594875 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: exactly < 1391547304 891470 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but I need the screen to refresh at like < 1391547309 78269 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :24 per second or something < 1391547311 543468 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(FE /0 is INC r/m8, and FE /1 is DEC r/m8, but the other reg digits of FE are not used.) < 1391547314 805631 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That should be enough no? < 1391547335 304347 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait, I guess that's 24 hertz < 1391547335 484110 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1391547346 472586 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I can wait for a couple of vsyncs < 1391547366 52158 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: though you probably want FE /7 < 1391547373 967495 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Yes, a typo/thinko. I think there's actually just two pointers following the FE /7. < 1391547386 49436 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's wait for 16 vsyncs < 1391547487 303480 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the code's right there in misc/programs.cpp: http://sprunge.us/SCHM < 1391547576 536267 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the final byte is an index into a table. < 1391547638 688408 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/iWHa love that "//MEM LEAK" comment. < 1391547896 623807 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently two vsyncs are enough < 1391547998 754337 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Notwithstanding the funky callback mechanism, it still seems possible for a program to programmatically call the mount-program callback, by setting up the memory properly. < 1391548206 809156 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 320x200 mode, vsyncs should have a frequency of 70 Hz. < 1391548218 779340 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: do you notwithstand funkies? < 1391548218 959558 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: great. should i care about" level. < 1391548624 77796 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e : So 2 in a row is about 30 images per second < 1391548626 551908 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is fine < 1391548640 745406 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@141.70.114.6 QUIT :Quit: MindlessDrone < 1391548866 166718 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1391548930 851083 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Once I do two vsyncs, I have less problems with the screen clearing < 1391548937 899183 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the upper part of the screen still flickers < 1391548985 335440 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The first 30 pixel rows or so < 1391549004 65746 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it takes a while to clear the screen and draw the squares < 1391549066 552553 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but the squares stay on the screen for a while as well < 1391549080 530222 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1391549084 655574 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what to do < 1391549105 484238 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could do a function that removes the shapes instead < 1391549196 360002 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't suppose I can do something much faster to clear the screen than rep stosd < 1391549355 175871 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :tough. draw to a memory buffer; copy that over. or learn to use VGA's "unchained mode". then there's 4 pages worth of graphics memory, but you need some IO to actually access it (it interleaves 4 planes of memory). I never really did that. < 1391549469 933022 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mode_X links to http://www.gameprogrammer.com/3-tweak.html which looks useful < 1391549501 376850 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the best solution is to implement a function that deletes the shapes and move them before reprinting them < 1391549529 212309 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: honestly I'd probably do the render to screen buffer, then blit thing. < 1391549539 873015 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :err. to memory buffer < 1391549563 104683 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :blit? < 1391549566 118910 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :copy < 1391549594 462587 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :"block image transfer" < 1391549758 679251 :boily!~boily@mtl.savoirfairelinux.net QUIT :Quit: FISHY CHICKEN < 1391549760 558804 :metasepia!~metasepia@2607:fad8:4:6:f2de:f1ff:fe6c:6765 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1391550316 316705 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soon, I will be able to do a pong! < 1391550316 900399 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also see http://www.brackeen.com/vga/unchain.html for a simplish overview, I think I have used that page. < 1391550338 720702 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks < 1391550408 773519 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has both basic double buffering (draw to in-memory buffer and memcpy -- in your case, perhaps rep stosd -- to video memory) and proper page flipping which needs the masked-write stuff. < 1391550511 317307 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er, mov, not sto. < 1391551439 11465 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :What you can do is chained mode 256x256 with 256 colours < 1391551448 433991 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is convienient for some stuff < 1391551501 630972 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :256x256 would be great < 1391551521 748224 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of doing sums and substractions I can just check for overflows < 1391551723 238309 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1391551839 747945 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, this seems fun < 1391551854 411531 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently the trøndelag region has had more wildfires so far this year as _all_ of last year. and about half of them last week. < 1391551864 454504 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*than < 1391551866 334630 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ouch < 1391551906 356149 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Norway has wildfires in February? < 1391551914 162443 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't seem like an obvious month for them < 1391551918 723807 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and january < 1391551933 303549 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's very unprecedented. < 1391551987 483369 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically no precipitation since jan 11 < 1391552001 576912 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and plenty of strong wind. < 1391552005 291280 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's less than usual in the UK, too, in that it hasn't been /constantly/ raining < 1391552015 36128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although there was a thunderhailstorm at one point < 1391552023 117376 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is rare in January, those normally happen in the summer < 1391552055 635765 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall also in the newspaper some firefighter saying they hadn't experienced such a bad month before at _any_ time of year. < 1391552140 910253 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's start a conspiracy that putin made this to get good weather in russia for the olympics. < 1391552156 172032 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :meanwhile california is in the middles of our worst ever drought < 1391552182 915602 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: oh i thought the us was buried in snow. i guess not all of it. < 1391552187 894283 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1391552277 205930 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i understand much of europe is having bad weather of various kinds < 1391552306 164210 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least strange < 1391552344 4984 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: all of the northern hemisphere is, I think < 1391552358 421142 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the polar vortex that's meant to be over the arctic went and visited the US instead < 1391552391 177473 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: well that's the us, but does that explain the high pressure zone over russia too? < 1391552407 124342 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly < 1391552418 216652 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not that knowledgeable about how weather works < 1391552424 893858 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but then, neither is anyone else) < 1391552450 158370 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i understand they can connect the polar vortex moving to global warming, although not in a way that convinces republicans. < 1391552483 294828 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it" < 1391552531 210457 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: is that a quote < 1391552536 939355 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1391552540 475745 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence the marks of quotation < 1391552547 682531 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"this is not a quote" < 1391552554 457766 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ceci n'est etc < 1391552572 879085 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: what we need to do is convince them that it will kill their children. < 1391552616 661036 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :good luck < 1391552640 764113 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's the only thing americans are more furious about than money, isn't it < 1391552695 898505 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on the cause < 1391552727 894346 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's school shootings then there's nothing we can do, the government has no place in regulating devices whose literal only purpose is to kill large numbers of people quickly < 1391552852 171240 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sense sarcasm < 1391552918 604654 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :sarcasm and insanity are the two only ways for americans to (temporarily) survive < 1391553039 856577 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: so how's the weather in poland < 1391553130 246100 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not in Poland, I was just born there < 1391553136 205259 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1391553138 670952 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm in England, and the weather sucks. Lots of flooding < 1391553165 310632 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :I HAVE BEEN DECEIVED < 1391553296 569996 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :here it's nice, warm (night temperature record yesterday) and dry. got a match? < 1391553569 538362 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: can you ship some of your water over to california < 1391553635 181984 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Don't have the means of doing that, sorry < 1391553638 452866 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also here < 1391553703 794173 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd happily swap water for snow < 1391553715 596036 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I guess others wouldn't appreciate it as much < 1391553860 420334 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Oh, that's just the same. <-- 5 is the most recent version. < 1391553961 201555 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1391554745 995235 :ais523!~ais523@cpc6-king9-2-0-cust765.perr.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1391554746 396969 :ais523!~ais523@cpc6-king9-2-0-cust765.perr.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Changing host < 1391554746 576586 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1391554886 575123 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : can this be TC, I wonder? <-- it seems to me that this is a bag of tokens where you cannot reliably detect that a token is not present unless the bag is completely empty. < 1391554946 775794 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yep < 1391554970 245377 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and with only finitely many tokens < 1391554978 651442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps you could do something based on probabilities, though < 1391554996 869019 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there would be a chance of failure < 1391555033 271355 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like, you have just too little to implement fractran < 1391555039 925334 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or Bag) < 1391555040 104936 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but you can just reset the program if you detect a failure < 1391555057 767320 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd work fine if you could detect failure reliably < 1391555071 759153 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think it can be detected... < 1391555113 790635 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, say you use a representation where you have X copies of element A, Y copies of element B, min(X,Y) copies of element C < 1391555137 783255 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm < 1391555141 384405 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can compare X to Y by repeatedly removing items in the order C, A, B, C, A, B… < 1391555148 289168 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and restarting the entire program if they come out in the wrong order < 1391555154 578012 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's unclear how you'd set that situation up to start with, though < 1391555157 129651 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Woo < 1391555165 555551 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a rectangle that moves if you press up or down < 1391555174 503283 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :THE FUTURE OF VIDEO GAME IS NIGH GUYS < 1391555179 954898 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I AM WORKING ON THIS AMAZING IDEA < 1391555188 363989 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :TABLE TENNIS ON A COMPUTER < 1391555197 447489 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll see it will be huge < 1391555213 215673 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I call it electric entertainment < 1391555221 635932 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Slereah_: I'm not sure it'll work, computers aren't particularly flat, making it unfair, and there might not be enough space to get a decent serve either < 1391555227 317024 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok maybe you can do something that works like a nondeterministic turing machine, in that _if_ it halts without detecting a failure it will have calculated the right result. < 1391555227 615383 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although attaching the net shouldn't be too difficult < 1391555241 667581 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll see ais523 < 1391555247 287873 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: right, that's the computational class I was aiming for anyway < 1391555247 505879 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it might not be able to restart a computation. < 1391555252 567806 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will be even bigger than Ball in a Cup < 1391555257 238575 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if a failure is detected. < 1391555264 464234 :Slereah_!~jackal@169.111.101.84.rev.sfr.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vx4IEmZNegg < 1391555354 306356 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: just keep extracting tokens until there aren't any more < 1391555361 607859 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then jump back to the start of the program < 1391555364 851298 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :restarting is trivial < 1391555375 360342 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1391555407 435692 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok as long as input is encoded in the program, which is enough for tc of course < 1391555426 558763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1391556136 222729 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, it's not obviously TC < 1391556142 899593 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not obviously sub-TC < 1391556149 695708 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is always a property I like in esolangs < 1391556264 671604 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now all we need is an interesting FSM to hook it up to < 1391556274 357014 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :preferably a pretty powerful one < 1391556282 705981 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we have a new interesting esolang < 1391556778 210855 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, there's a neat equivalent way to write this that's more efficient < 1391556796 418178 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of removing entirely at random < 1391556807 269012 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :commands can give a set of values they want to remove < 1391556821 93992 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if any are in the random bag, one is removed at random, otherwise the program enters an infinite loop < 1391557059 768093 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i vaguely recall there is a theorem that is relevant to this, if i can find it again. < 1391557258 23690 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1391557711 475597 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so you are accepting that a program might loop infinitely instead of ever halting even if it could? < 1391557722 742803 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, but with zero probability < 1391557732 55492 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1391557741 242067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I normally only care about positive probabilities when it comes to nondeterministic languages < 1391558003 623173 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION cannot remember what it's called
< 1391558178 906971 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh i think it may be https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dickson%27s_lemma < 1391558198 393424 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's not what i remember, but it may be the relevant special case) < 1391558265 653888 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this reminds me of subturing oracles < 1391558289 56513 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or well, subturing language + oracle that might bring it up to some higher computational class < 1391558357 567943 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Couldn't Fancy L be called a subturing oracle