00:02:20 http://rifers.org/03_numberguess/src/ 00:02:37 Exactly what I want to see when I click to browse example source code for a web framework 00:04:04 -!- tromp_ has joined. 00:12:31 -!- w00tles has joined. 00:19:21 Looks enterprisey 00:22:12 It's trying to translate a cool concept to an enterprisey language 00:27:37 -!- luserdroog has joined. 00:36:38 -!- yorick has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 00:43:40 -!- augur has joined. 00:44:23 -!- augur has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 00:44:30 -!- augur has joined. 01:05:33 scott aaronson sarcasts on science journalism (scroll to the MAGIC 8-BALL) http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=1679 01:21:00 funnily enough i saw him extensively quoted in some pop sci today 01:21:31 Help I am game programming in Haskell 01:21:32 http://lpaste.net/99581 01:21:38 fizzie: i've been watching the status of parallel matlab jobs through windows task manager. 01:22:06 Bike: well he was quoted in the thing he's blogging about, too 01:22:51 yeh 01:23:08 the one i read was a basic "holy shit, halting problem!" thing 01:23:49 ... 01:23:58 just noticed I've been writing my lambdas backwards 01:24:28 what was the end quote. something like "it's good to know electronic brains can't be perfect" 01:25:10 Taneb: what's with the "fmap Right"s 01:26:05 nooodl, in theory I could instead do a Left thingy which would be treated as a sort of "missing value" error by netwire 01:32:41 kmc: i should figure out how people solve yao's millionaire problem 01:48:03 "Smokers will need to fetch an older copy of cigarettes.txt from CVS after October 1st " 01:48:20 oh i get it 01:48:21 -!- Sorella has quit (Quit: It is tiem!). 01:49:42 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:55:05 -!- nooodl has quit (Quit: Ik ga weg). 02:12:25 -!- conehead has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.). 02:19:43 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 02:21:23 elliott__: you're no help 02:55:10 -!- conehead has joined. 02:55:37 -!- Frooxius has joined. 02:57:09 data Stream b = SCons (b, Stream b) 02:57:14 Why a tuple? 02:57:28 Rather than two arguments to SCons? 03:02:41 Ok, fine, makes sense 03:16:16 "Note that this has nothing to do with execution. printFibN does not execute a print statement. No more than writing printFibN on a piece of paper will cause it to magically evaluate." 03:16:42 Wonder if that will catch on as a description 03:17:02 sounds like if it did, that would be some damn useful paper, though 03:32:19 does anyone remember which language of ais523 is the one where there's like a table of memory cells and the only instruction is like copy the contents of that one to this one and jump to that other one? 03:33:46 Bike: lol at that quote. "perfect" meaning "omniscient" I guess? 03:34:25 something silly 03:35:44 "By slaying the mythical loop snooper, Turing taught us that there are fundamental limits to what computers can do. We all have our limits, and in a way it's comforting to know that the artificial brains that we create will always have theirs too." 03:36:00 [whatever] brain is such a shitty word for computers, grr 03:43:51 "let's call the subset of computers which aren't brains [blah] brains! so the all computers are brains, yay!" 03:44:23 it's okay as long as [blah] is Matryoshka 03:45:42 only because those are so sci-fi it doesn't matter. 03:47:26 here's my best reword: "it's good to know that things which are made out of stuff in this universe will always be incapable of doing things which are impossible in this universe." 03:52:39 Oh no am I going to start watching these now? 03:52:41 http://www.youtube.com/playlist?annotation_id=annotation_3883136257&feature=iv&list=PL4NL9i-Fu15hhYGB-d0hmSWD1fcIvLvn1&src_vid=oOGJQD0WXkk 03:56:30 -!- conehead has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.). 04:18:17 kmc: a paper on occurence typing: http://www.ccs.neu.edu/racket/pubs/icfp10-thf.pdf 04:21:52 Although really, the use of such predicates often makes me uncomfortable 04:22:00 Like it indicates someone likely doing something silly 04:32:22 silly... or extraordinary? 04:34:38 the goggles do nothing 04:56:55 coppro: ? 05:09:01 -!- tromp_ has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 05:39:28 Bike: OHSHIT NOT THE BLINKY TEXT 05:39:57 it doesn't show on this term, i really should fix this stupid thing 05:40:02 by which i mean use something else. 05:42:38 how do you do that again 05:45:25 ^F 05:45:39 -!- Bike has quit (Quit: term term term, wei wei). 05:45:58 -!- Bike has joined. 05:46:08 test 05:46:13 sweet. 05:46:32 it's too bad you can't adjust the phase 05:46:39 sawtooth wave 05:48:00 there's probably some term somewhere that let you feed analog functions to the monitorssss 06:09:00 oh god not this again 06:30:02 -!- Bike has quit (Quit: leaving). 07:12:19 -!- Sellyme has quit (Excess Flood). 07:12:33 -!- Sellyme has joined. 07:14:16 -!- w00tles has quit (Quit: quit). 07:22:32 -!- FreeFull has quit. 07:25:02 -!- MindlessDrone has joined. 07:26:21 -!- MindlessDrone has quit (Changing host). 07:26:22 -!- MindlessDrone has joined. 07:31:26 ~metar EFHK 07:31:34 Bah. 07:32:01 I wanted to see the VISIBILITY, it is very FOGGY here. 07:36:45 EFHK 070720Z 12005KT 0200 R04R/0550N R15/0375N R22L/0550N R04L/0500N FZFG VV001 M03/M03 Q1003 TEMPO 0600 07:37:59 So FZFGgy. 07:38:21 you can ask dirac for the weather. dirac is online usually and prints human-readable weather. 07:45:31 -!- w00tles has joined. 07:51:41 * kmc !important; 07:52:52 There's just something about them METARs. 07:54:39 Huh. Amazon has a Kindle edition of The Reasoned Schemer, but B&N doesn't have an epub version 07:54:53 Is that going to be a trend, or is that just me rationalizing having gotten a Kindle? 07:55:28 `quote metar 07:55:29 994) metar lead to canada, more metar and cows 07:59:33 -!- Frooxius has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 08:04:25 -!- Frooxius has joined. 08:06:20 -!- Sellyme has quit (Excess Flood). 08:07:33 -!- Sellyme has joined. 08:18:01 "make: stat: GNUmakefile: Transport endpoint is not connected" huh 08:18:18 Oh, it's just a disconnected sshfs thing, never mind. 08:23:50 -!- w00tles_ has joined. 08:24:14 -!- w00tles has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 08:37:37 yay ResPlicate page posted 08:39:09 -!- Tritonio has joined. 10:16:24 -!- ais523 has joined. 10:19:48 -!- luserdroog has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 10:40:11 -!- itsy has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 10:42:51 ais523: I just found a ResPlicate sequence that goes 12850 cycles before deleting itself! how are you? 10:43:04 I'm not doing great, but I'll survive 10:43:11 and it's an interesting language 10:43:49 ais523: feel better! 10:43:53 I haven't "broken" it in terms of TCness yet, although my first thoughts are a) try to avoid the same queue element being used for both a length and a repeat count if possible, b) try to simulate a tag system 10:45:15 ais523: well that first condition is easy to meet. just make sure all the odd numbered elements of the sequence are even numbers :) 10:45:31 quintopia: yep, that's why I thought of it 10:45:31 (and that there is an even number of numbers in the sequence) 10:45:37 it seems trivial and make reasoning about the language much easier 10:46:09 but it seems to do much more interesting things when you let them be odd :P 10:52:59 ais523: besides yourself, what's your short list of "esolang experts" 10:53:29 quintopia: oerjan's highest on the list, he's better at it than I am 10:53:31 -!- nooodl has joined. 10:54:07 nooodl: I improved your ResPlicate interpreter and am having so much fun I can't go to sleep 10:54:34 :D 10:54:47 ais523: really? I would have had a tough time deciding between you two. And maybe John Conway also. 10:55:01 fwiw i think Resplicate looks better than ResPlicate 10:55:10 TOO LATE 10:55:52 hm, the problem with trying to program in ResPlicate is that you don't have any external source of data, copying is the /only/ way to make the string longer 10:56:48 yes. if you want a number in there, you better start with it in there. 10:57:34 and you have to keep it in there too. that's even harder. 10:58:50 nooodl: the sequence family 6 3 10 1 6 2 2k+1 1 is amaaaaaaaaaaaaaazing. try it! 11:25:03 -!- yorick has joined. 11:30:45 quintopia: i don't see the pattern i think 11:41:23 nooodl: there's no pattern! that's what's so great! most of them delete themselves, some of them become all-twos, and a few grow. 11:58:52 -!- oerjan has joined. 12:05:16 -!- conehead has joined. 12:13:31 sounds like if it did, that would be some damn useful paper, though <-- note to future logreaders: back when this was written, most paper was _not_ ... heck we haven't even decided what to call it yet. 12:14:20 also, google and wikipedia were most unhelpful. 12:14:38 oerjan: I think it's just called smart paper. 12:14:43 ah. 12:14:50 quintopia: I have a plan for proving resplicate TC already, not sure if it works or not though 12:14:56 future logreaders: see fizzie ^ 12:15:13 (Source: Neal Stephenson, "The Diamond Age".) 12:16:17 ais523: well i could already visualize how a tag system might be shaped, but it wasn't readily apparent how to do some parts of it 12:16:24 ais523: i'm ready to hear what you've got 12:16:31 I'm not ready to explain it yet though 12:17:06 okay i'll go back to not sleeping and reading about bytebeat 12:17:28 one of the things I'm bad at is converting thoughts into a medium that other people can understand 12:17:37 I can normally manage it eventually, but it takes a while 12:18:07 ais523: it seems similar to Self BCT? although with the ability to handle somewhat larger sequences in one step. 12:18:25 oerjan: not really, doesn't self BCT have two pointers? 12:18:39 oh maybe. 12:30:08 -!- w00tles_ has quit (Quit: quit). 12:32:41 -!- w00tles has joined. 12:35:00 -!- conehead has quit (Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.). 12:39:25 -!- Sorella has joined. 12:40:48 quintopia: i cannot compete with conway, i've fought him and lost. 12:45:55 -!- yorick has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 12:49:56 "Authors retain the right to use the accepted author manuscript for personal use, internal institutional use and for permitted scholarly posting provided that these are not for purposes of commercial use or systematic distribution." "Systematic distribution means: policies or other mechanisms designed to aggregate and openly disseminate, or to substitute for journal-provided services --" 12:51:55 Is this why faculty websites always look unsystematic 12:52:27 Perhaps. 12:53:16 Also any "Institutional, funding body or government manuscript posting policies or mandates that aim to aggregate and openly distribute the work by its researchers or funded researchers", no matter how haphazardly implemented, count as "systematic distribution". 12:54:19 researchers or funded researchers 12:54:39 Yes, I noticed that too. 12:57:05 I guess it could imply that it considers policies that apply to researchers, or policies that apply to funded researchers. (As a corollary, a policy that applies to "all researchers except this one guy" would then not be systematic distribution.) 12:59:46 (The "loophole" person, whose work would not be included, could be an annually changing position.) 13:01:27 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:02:42 -!- boily has joined. 13:04:46 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 13:09:16 -!- augur has joined. 13:20:17 -!- spiette has joined. 13:22:19 -!- metasepia has joined. 13:22:27 good unmechanical morning! 13:22:36 @massages-loud 13:22:37 oerjan said 14h 19m 41s ago: `learn now removes english articles hth 13:22:47 oerjan: shiny! 13:22:53 Supershiny. 13:23:17 fungot: Why don't you do an AI-complete fact database thing? 13:23:18 fizzie: this is too stupid to talk to my roommate this fall who's into public sex, lose any aesthetic sense as it is 13:23:31 Oh, okay. 13:24:14 -!- itsy has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 13:24:41 it's... actually a sensible reason. 13:25:03 I guess even bots can be affected by public sexing roommates. 13:26:06 I'm a bit puzzled about it, though, since fungot's hardware is in our apartment, and we're not into public sex at all. 13:26:06 fizzie: yes. but not planning writing actually.)) be () 13:28:01 fizzie: we're not in the Fall season yet. maybe fungot's planning to go study abroad or something? 13:28:01 boily: when placed on each 13:28:11 fungot: on each what? 13:28:11 boily: finally a sane network topology with the firewall physically between local network and internet... no esoteric) 13:28:39 fizzie: that confirms my theory. he's going to MIT to study network topologies between firewalls. 13:29:07 boily: Have you been sending fake student exchange applications again? 13:29:10 Ar. 13:29:13 fungot: ^ 13:29:14 fizzie: something like fnord should execute the handler, so it would be 13:32:55 incidentally, me neither. I didn't send fake student exchange applications again. 13:33:13 fungot: nothing is like fnord. 13:33:13 boily: what is your native language?)... that made it difficult. 13:33:22 fungot: French. I know it makes everything difficult. 13:33:23 boily: last time what? scheme hardly has any guterals, although the universities now have changed to an ascii value. 13:33:30 ~duck guteral 13:33:30 --- No relevant information 13:33:42 uhm. what is a guteral, and its ASCII value? 13:33:52 it's probably a misspelling of guttural 13:34:07 and indeed scheme has none 13:37:59 "Gutenberg" would be a good unit for amount of written text. 13:38:16 * boily pharyngealizes C0 and C1 codes “FF US NUL GS OSC *cough*” 13:38:33 1 Gutenberg equals the amount of material in Project Gutenberg. Er, except now that I think of it, it's not a very stable unit. 13:41:57 -!- w00tles has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:42:09 -!- w00tles has joined. 13:44:55 -!- w00tles has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:45:00 -!- w00tles_ has joined. 13:46:21 whell00tles. 13:57:14 -!- lambdabot has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 13:58:26 huh? 13:58:37 int-e: did you accidentaly lambdabot? 13:58:54 -!- w00tles_ has quit (Quit: quit). 14:00:58 -!- w00tles has joined. 14:01:19 -!- lambdabot has joined. 14:15:57 -!- w00tles has quit (Quit: quit). 14:34:21 -!- utkarsh has joined. 14:50:35 -!- w00tles has joined. 14:52:11 So I hear fungot's going abroad 14:52:11 FireFly: are you even asking me this? snakes fnord with human evolution? somewhere in between them 14:52:56 Very knowledgeable in biology, I hear 14:54:58 -!- Johnnie has joined. 14:55:55 A friend of mine told me today that I am now in the Turing tarpit. I had to google that up to realize that I'm on the right track with SPAM/1 ^__^ 14:55:57 `relcome utkarsh 14:55:58 ​utkarsh: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.) 14:56:20 Jellohnnie! good tarpitual morning! 14:56:21 Johnnie: tarpits are a large category of esolangs 14:56:26 @localtime Johnnie 14:56:27 Local time for Johnnie is Fri Feb 07 09:59:36 2014 14:56:40 and one of the categories that more commonly produces interesting research 14:56:45 I had forgotten it's a global community. 14:57:06 Had no idea, but I'm gathering this is a really good thing. 14:57:10 Johnnie: I think I can ask you the The Question: what are your approximate geographic coördinates and body weigh? 14:57:25 hello everyone 14:57:32 sup 14:57:38 soup. 14:57:50 ...body weight? 14:58:27 boily: you typoed The Question 14:58:40 not that it's an interesting question, IMO 14:58:59 I did? 14:59:14 Johnnie: no, you did nothing wrong 14:59:23 this is just a stupid meme that I'd love it if it had died ages ago 14:59:33 I never thought I did, ais523. I'm actually quite pleased. ^__^ 14:59:37 ais523: it's actually meant to be body weigh 14:59:39 boily: when this channel is discussing esolangs, please discuss esolangs :_) 14:59:41 fsvo "meant" 14:59:52 elliott__: what's with the double underscore these days? 15:00:02 I'm not worried about impersonation because I can tell it's you in two lines 15:00:08 but I am a little confused 15:00:25 My language, SPAM/1 is about technologies that died ages ago ^__^ 15:00:25 -!- elliott__ has changed nick to elliott_________. 15:00:40 As for my coords: 32°47′00″N 79°56′00″W 15:03:10 And body weigh....under two bags of cement. 15:04:00 (using the hundredweight measurement) 15:06:10 that's far too accurate for me _not_ to paste into google maps. 15:06:28 it's only accurate to the nearest minute 15:06:42 hm good point 15:06:43 That's okay, I snatched it off of Wikipedia. 15:07:07 ais523: well it's pretty close to a college... 15:07:36 and a starbucks. 15:08:29 That's funny! 15:08:51 I'd thought Wikipedia would use coords close to the Harbour. 15:09:16 Wikipedia probably just rounded to the nearest minute 15:09:34 how much _is_ a minute anyway. 15:09:36 link for me to click on: http://esolangs.org/wiki/ResPlicate 15:09:50 oerjan: 1/(60*360) of the Earth's circumference 15:10:05 > 40000/(60*360) 15:10:07 1.8518518518518519 15:10:30 at any meridian, it equals one nautical mile exactly 15:10:37 for latitude, anyway. 15:10:41 yep 15:10:50 A man wanted to talk to me about Jesus, at the bus stop in front of the CS building. That was *so* un-Finnish. 15:10:53 Wikipedia says 1852m by definition 15:11:51 for a nautical mile 15:12:03 i'd say the harbour is on the border of plausible rounding range 15:12:25 In other words: close enough. 15:13:51 Strangeish to put the seconds in after rounding to minutes, but maybe it's convention. 15:13:57 ais523: it's not a typo. it's traditionnal to write “weigh”. 15:14:18 boily: are you actively trying to drive me from the channel agin? 15:14:20 *again 15:14:36 I think I figured out the goal for the Wiki. I have no intention of implementing SPAM. But I want to document it enoough that implementation is entirely possible. 15:14:41 "Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, even the Finnish, [...]" 15:14:51 ...enoough?....too many 'o's. 15:15:24 ais523: sorry, I was in a meeting, and I answered before seeing your other reply. I will esolang when esolanging is happening. 15:19:25 hm i'm wondering how close resPlicate can emulate something Fueue-like, if you make sure all blocks have "statically" known lengths and you avoid explicit swapping (but maybe it can be simulated, like in underload) 15:20:00 I'm still thinking about ResPlicate 15:20:58 it's the most minimalistic queue language we've had so far, i think 15:21:06 I have an idea of creating a tag system, using a dictionary of all necessary rule-pieces that gets copied around (as multiple copies) at regular intervals so that the rule-pieces can be extracted from it 15:21:23 and hmm, it sort-of competes with http://esolangs.org/wiki/DownRight (and cyclic tag) for the title of "minimalistic queue-language" 15:23:09 um it has no program/data separation, which i think is a big boost 15:23:37 The Norweigans ruled Britian under Cnut the Great and Sweyn Forkbeard...maybe the Finnish can rule the world under esolangs? 15:24:03 wasn't Knut danish? 15:24:11 He probably was. 15:24:23 Again, I was reading Wikipedia. 15:30:10 -!- shikhin has joined. 15:30:59 ...fake diamonds that are glued to eyes of plastic cows?....I noticed that just now. XD 15:33:04 Okay. I'm off. See everyone later. Have a good weekend 15:33:49 good spamming/1! 15:33:51 -!- Johnnie has quit (Quit: Page closed). 15:43:05 oerjan: program/data separation normally makes things easier rather than harder, but maybe not 15:44:13 ais523: yes of course, but it makes it less minimalistic. 15:44:56 I mean, my definition of "minimalistic" is "easy to implement in a range of ridiculously limited languages" 15:53:55 ...i think we shall have to agree to disagree :P 15:54:18 although that is of course useful too 16:04:32 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: leaving). 16:06:03 -!- olsner has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 16:06:31 -!- stalem has joined. 16:07:21 -!- olsner has joined. 16:11:00 when every idea of a language has been invented, reinvented, mangled, modified and regurgitated; what left is there to do? create a new paradigm? 16:13:02 Life's worthless, you mean to say? 16:13:31 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 16:13:41 idle on IRC 16:14:51 hm in a sense, yeah 16:15:30 -!- Tritonio has joined. 16:17:01 stalem: creating new paradigms is what I really want to do 16:17:03 but it's hard 16:17:21 about the best I've managed in that direction is http://esolangs.org/wiki/Underload (which turned out to be pre-existing but niche) 16:18:13 we live in a world were even crab-based computing exists. it's hard to come up with something new. 16:18:19 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 16:18:59 ah yeah i've read that page multiple times. i bet it's a headache creating new paradigms, it's hard enough finding a good idea for a language. not to mention the amount of paradigms are getting to vast the possibilities must be getting drained 16:19:14 what? crab-based computer? like live crabs? 16:19:27 Yes 16:19:29 language innovation wasn't that easy ten years ago, either 16:19:30 stalem: http://techland.time.com/2012/04/18/crab-computing-the-future-of-computers-powered-by-crabs-wait-what/ 16:19:41 elliott_________: it's getting uneasier. 16:19:42 Wait, what? 16:19:47 "the future of computers" lol 16:20:13 shellokhin. long time no see! 16:20:35 boily: Yeah, lost my auto-join list and then never added this channel back :-) 16:20:35 an analog boid computer using crabs haha 16:21:09 boily: But, recently, got involved with some fun stuff involing a couple of norttis and a couple of esoteric languages, so got back here. 16:21:23 there are multiples norttis??? 16:21:34 Probably; can't be sure. 16:21:34 fungot: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! 16:21:34 boily: are you looking for? fnord/ fnord/ fnord 16:38:41 -!- w00tles has quit (Quit: quit). 16:43:02 -!- Tritonio has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 16:53:33 anyone play with microcorruption.com ? 16:56:18 is there an english word similar to "want" or "need" that takes both a noun without preposition or a verb without "to"? or can that not exist because it would cause ambiguities between noun and verb? 16:57:31 b_jonas: hmm, I remember studying this sort of thing for grammartree 16:58:00 it needn't be a single word, it can be a phrase 16:58:08 "I want food" "I need food" works without preposition, but I think you need the "to" for verbs to make it "infinitive" 16:58:35 there are verbs like "should" that don't take "to" 16:58:44 true 16:58:52 newsham: yes, after a verbs like that you usually need either a to-infinitive or gerund 16:58:52 but they tend not to work with nouns 16:58:56 ais523: exactly 16:59:12 what does "can has" take? 16:59:31 "i can has catnip?" 16:59:37 “I want to food”. 16:59:38 it means "can I have" in cat talk 16:59:54 incidentally, verbs that appear in the portion of NetHack I converted to grammartree that take verbs without infinitives: can, had better, should, may 17:00:05 yes, but what form of verb, as in "I can has go out" or "I can has to go out" or "I can has going out" 17:00:17 and some verbs take participles, or possibly gerunds: stop, like, see 17:00:26 and "can has" is lolcat speak, not actual English 17:00:39 thus it doesn't obey normal grammar rules 17:00:43 ais523: yeah, it wouldn't suit me because of that, I was wondering 17:00:48 I'll check the lolcat bible 17:00:50 and in fact the grammar is mostly made up on the pot 17:00:52 *spot 17:00:59 no! 17:01:06 there is some sort of consistency 17:01:21 adb lolcat 17:01:23 see http://lolcatbible.com/index.php?title=How_to_speak_lolcat and similar 17:03:33 oh right! grammartree 17:03:40 -!- stalem has quit (Quit: Page closed). 17:03:42 ais523: whatever happened to that 17:04:08 nooodl: we put it on hold because it was taking up all our time, we're planning to reintroduce it later but a bit at a time 17:04:21 like originally reserve it for the bits that benefit the most 17:05:07 -!- Bike has joined. 17:06:34 -!- aergus has joined. 17:13:34 http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/7451e31a-8f90-11e3-9cb0-00144feab7de.html wack, yo 17:14:42 It requires registration. 17:14:49 That thing wants me to sign up to read the article 17:14:51 to be able to read 8 articles per month 17:15:24 and they don't seem to do the nice thing of sending the webpage with an overlay covering the actual content 17:15:29 ibm's thinking of selling their semiconductor division 17:15:32 you plebs. 17:16:24 oh 17:17:28 int-e: did you accidentaly lambdabot? 17:17:35 no I didn't. 17:18:50 it just lost its connection to the server (aka ping timeout) 17:24:03 Aaaah what should I have for dinner 17:24:07 Something quick to cook preferably 17:24:36 Also I accidentally learnt pandoc when I wanted to learn rust 17:24:39 http://runciman.hacksoc.org/~taneb/Fibs.pdf 17:24:56 common mistake 17:25:21 make a turkey. here's an instructional video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4FSew0vmUQ 17:26:16 british thanksgiving is coming up, right 17:26:36 I don't think Britain /has/ a Thankgiving 17:27:49 what a rude thing to say. 17:28:57 btw if anyone wants to critique the rust code in that pdf feel free to 17:31:19 Also I still don't know what to have for dinner 17:36:49 Taneb: recently I've mostly been combining some sort of prepackaged chicken with some sort of prepackaged salad with some sort of prepackaged carbohydrate 17:36:58 you can get a lot of variations out of that, and it's pretty fast 17:37:28 ais523, are the west midlands 300 years into the future? 17:37:36 yes 17:37:37 -!- Tritonio has joined. 17:37:39 can confirm 17:43:24 Taneb: well a chicken salad sandwich is all three of those at once 17:43:35 so it's not massively difficult to achieve 17:43:43 but you can't live on /only/ those 17:46:21 man cannot live by chicken salad sandwiches alone 17:47:56 this private-use character renders funnily in my font: '' 17:48:25 in this font it looks like a solid circle 17:49:12 For me it's a bunch of waves approx. 12 characters wide, which looks kind-of odd in a terminal 17:50:50 nice 17:50:56 -!- shikhout has joined. 17:51:19 -!- oklopol has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 17:54:31 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 17:54:32 -!- shikhout has changed nick to shikhin. 18:00:55 -!- aergus has quit (Read error: Operation timed out). 18:01:12 Here, it's a box. 18:02:36 Though if I open the logs in a browser, it looks like... well, it looks like a very small uppercase A, on top of which (as a diacritic) there's a thing that looks vaguely like a small lambda. 18:03:43 Zooming in reveals that the diacritic is instead a caret and a grave accent, stacked vertically, with the grave on top. 18:05:32 (Approximately ᴀ̂̀.) 18:06:47 that's a pretty nice letter 18:08:38 Is there a way in Unicode to say that "this following stack of combining characters should go vertically in this order, instead of being all on top of each other"? 18:11:55 Apparently there's a character called Combining Grapheme Joiner, which can be used to block reordering of combining characters during normalization ("For example, -- [as] one way to maintain distinction between differently ordered sequences of certain Hebrew accents and marks"), but that's a different thing. 18:15:22 And double diacritics (two-character ones, that is) will float over any diacritic marks of the participating two characters, but that's also different. 18:17:00 And you can put other diacritics on top of a double diacritic by following the double diacritic with the CGJ and a diacritic, but that's still not quite it. 18:32:24 back from lunch, and it diacriticise. 18:32:33 (it also winds and snows outside. stupid weather.) 18:32:39 ~metar CYUL 18:32:40 CYUL 071800Z 23021G28KT 15SM DRSN OVC035 M08/M13 A3011 RMK SC8 SLP197 18:32:52 ~metar EFHK 18:32:52 EFHK 071820Z 13010KT 0800 R04R/P1500U R15/0900N R22L/P1500U R04L/P1500U FG VV002 00/00 Q1002 NOSIG 18:33:03 Our FZFG has turned to plain old FG. 18:33:42 It's been a very foggy day, however. 18:34:05 you're also suffering from 0800 and chronic VV002, it seems. 18:34:24 There was a note in the news that there's been delays at EFHK. 18:34:32 (ground visibility: 800 m or 1/2 mi, vertical visibility 20') 18:34:46 20' sounds like not a much. 18:35:40 I'm checking the units. I'm currently doubting it. 18:36:40 200'. missed a magnitude there. 18:37:24 ~metar ESSA 18:37:24 ESSA 071820Z 13014KT 5000 -RA OVC006 02/01 Q0990 R01L/29//95 R08/29//95 R01R/29//95 TEMPO 4000 -RA 18:41:00 Plenty of light rain? 18:41:23 looks like so. 18:42:09 I wonder why there's two -RN's there 18:42:15 er, -RA 18:42:39 the first is a regular -RA, the second is a TEMPOrary change. 18:42:48 Ah 18:43:42 so you have -RA, and light -RA with 30% lest fat. 18:43:45 Do you call people who read METARs METARologists? 18:44:13 `? boily 18:44:14 boily is the brother of Roujo's brother and he's monetizing the company Roujo works at, or something Canadian like that. He's also a NaniDispenser, and a Man Eating Chicken. 18:45:00 `learn boily is monetizing a broterhood scheme with the Guardian of Lachine. He's also a NaniDispenser, a Man Eating Chicken and a METARologist. 18:45:01 I knew that. 18:46:30 A broterhood scheme, you say 18:46:42 with Pouti and Roujo. 18:47:34 ~metar BIRK 18:47:34 BIRK 071800Z 01011KT 9999 FEW020 02/M01 Q0978 18:48:02 BIRK? 18:48:12 oh. BIRK. 18:49:34 FireFly: visiting iceland? 18:49:47 Nope, just curious about the weather there 18:56:50 -!- tromp has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 18:57:32 -!- tromp has joined. 19:01:27 TIL the Perl CGI module contains some kind of wacky (and not very good) DSL for outputting HTML code (rather, XHTML 1.0 only) 19:02:24 I updated my house's accounting system (a venerable Perl script) to output nicer-looking Bootstrap-y HTML 19:04:43 wtf 19:04:50 what's this fascination with Bootstrap by everyone? 19:05:05 what's so good in it 19:05:07 ? 19:05:18 it just makes a page look decent with very little effort 19:05:28 more specifically? 19:05:35 what do you mean by "look decent"? 19:05:43 more readable, more pleasing to the eye 19:05:57 is it like shiny stuff marketing asks for? 19:06:02 aren't you doing this page for yourself? 19:06:05 what crawled up your ass 19:06:08 s/shiny/shiny bling/ 19:06:13 U CARE AESTHETICS U NO REAL PROGRAMR 19:06:44 sorry, I don't mean to be so negative, there is probably something bootstrap does well, I just don't know it and I'd like to find out what it is 19:06:54 "make it nice" doesn't seem like something that would make you use it alone 19:07:15 b_jonas: I'm not a web designer so I can't describe specifically the aspects which make it good design, but I appreciate the result 19:07:25 definitely a few things like better fonts and good spacing are obvious 19:07:30 bootstrap has a 12-column grid. granted, nearly all starting bases have them, but bootstrap does some aggressive marketing. 19:07:48 I'm a programmer and so I delegate design things to professional designers, and importing Bootstrap is a no-effort way to do that for small personal projects 19:07:51 so why not do it? 19:08:05 do I need a super strong reason to use it? it's one line of HTML 19:08:10 ok, if that's all it's probably not something made for me 19:08:24 I like columns. 19:08:37 another specific thing it does that's useful in this context (accounting) is the thing where alternating rows of a table are shaded differently 19:08:43 and when you hover over a row it's shaded differently still 19:08:58 kmc: ok, now that's something specific I can understand 19:09:18 even if it's just like a few lines of css, but yes, it's good that a framework handles taht 19:09:54 yeah, the problem is probably that I don't like "frameworks" in general 19:09:59 well, if you can get something with a few fancy flashy gradients and buttons and stuff with little effort, I don't see why not 19:10:13 -!- w00tles has joined. 19:10:43 FireFly: because I don't want fancy gradients. I'm old school in typography and believe that text should be put on a uniform colored background only. 19:11:16 it doesn't do fancy flashy gradients 19:11:30 it's a very simple clean design 19:11:34 "flat design" is the fad now so it's even simpler 19:11:48 that's also why I don't understand people using transparent windows, esp transparent menus and transparent terminal windows, or terminal windows with backgrounds 19:11:53 http://getbootstrap.com/css/ http://getbootstrap.com/components/ 19:12:14 but I admit that I also don't like frameworks in general 19:13:42 Bootstrap also makes responsive layouts easy and you can be p. sure that it works everywhere without testing it everywhere yourself. 19:14:07 ion: I like columns. 19:14:53 boily: Me too, except when using a very narrow display. 19:15:33 b_jonas: I do the minimal terminals, minimal WM thing too 19:15:39 b_jonas: however the default unstyled HTML isn't "minimal" 19:15:46 it uses a fucking serif font 19:15:55 in many respects bootstrap'd HTML looks simpler and cleaner 19:16:04 it's not about fancy gradients and impressing marketing 19:16:33 kmc: as for that, I do like serif fonts, but I decide about that in my browser settings. 19:16:37 if "design" is such a tainted word to your ultra programmer sensibilities then call it "information presentation engineering" or whatever 19:16:46 imho, it's very hard to achieve a nice formatting with serif fonts on a retro-lit display. 19:17:09 anyway i got to go 19:17:11 sometimes I make my browser forcibly override fonts in all html to a good serif font instead of letting browsers choose, but then I usually turn it back eventually except for some bad websites 19:17:30 b_jonas: what are your favourite serif fonts? 19:17:47 boily: maybe it is if you're using small font sizes. I prefer large sizes 19:18:43 boily: sadly I don't really have any font I'm completely satisfied with. I would eventually like to design my own fonts, in like the next few decades, but for now I only have a good bitmap terminal font I've drawn. 19:19:02 in browser I usually use either bitstream vera serif or times 19:19:24 I dislike times. I'm more of a palatino guy. 19:20:18 a nice example of serifed text → http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116443/new-york-citys-french-dual-language-programs-are-mostly-pointless 19:20:32 (they use ‘Publico Text’) 19:20:53 hmm, actually I think I do currently have the font forced on all websites in this browser 19:33:59 That reminds me, I haven't read ILT in a long time 19:34:19 http://ilovetypography.com/ that is 19:40:45 boily: 'Thanks, boily! Thoily!' reads much better than 'Thanks User:Boily, Thoily!'. Here's one case where policy gets in the way of style. almost makes me want to delinkify it. 19:41:49 quintopia: pipe-link it 19:42:02 and is that like a rello? 19:42:50 `thanks b_jonas 19:42:50 Thanks, b_jonas. Thonas. 19:42:59 b_jonas: we have bots for everything! 19:43:35 -!- evalj has joined. 19:44:10 `relcome evalj 19:44:11 ​evalj: Welcome to the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment! For more information, check out our wiki: . (For the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on irc.dal.net.) 19:45:16 not enough colors 19:45:42 -!- conehead has joined. 19:48:06 -!- w00tles has quit (Quit: quit). 19:53:26 b_jonas: he did. then ais523 un-pipelinked due to wiki policy. 19:54:27 is it just me or did that last relcome say 'Forcthe' 19:54:41 quintopia: it is you. fnord. 19:55:03 oh the extra c disappeared when you spoke 19:55:13 temprary rendering error 19:55:46 boily: have you invented yucca yet? 19:55:52 boily: we're all waiting 19:56:47 not yet, not yet. as I said some time ago, I need to have a “fit of a stroke” of inspiration. 19:56:57 ] consonants =: a.{~,66 98+/I.#:31324125 19:56:58 b_jonas: |ok 19:57:18 and once again I `relcomed a bot. 19:57:45 evalj has no problems with that 19:57:48 quintopia: in fact, there was a spark the other day when we were discussing undecideble sequences. 19:57:51 evalj, ping: relcome 19:57:52 b_jonas, pong: relcome 19:57:55 boily: you can't just wait for inspiration to smite you. you have to be thinking about esolangs in EVERY SPARE MOMENT 19:58:22 boily: i wasn't there. what was said? 19:58:22 quintopia: I like the feeling of beeing smitten. I stalk orc priests and hellwings. 19:58:39 quintopia: something about... eeeeh... I'm kinda having a blank here. 19:58:47 it's related to the halting problem. 20:00:13 boily: 'stalking orc priests' is the metaphorical equivalent of thinking about esolangs ALL THE TIME 20:00:56 ] thanks=: 3 :'''Thanks, '',y,''. Th'',''.'',~y}.~i.&0 y e.consonants' 20:00:56 b_jonas: |ok 20:01:07 quintopia: trouvé! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post_correspondence_problem 20:01:12 ] thanks 'boily' 20:01:12 b_jonas: Thanks, boily. Thoily. 20:01:36 ] thanks 'Firefly' 20:01:37 b_jonas: Thanks, Firefly. Thirefly. 20:01:51 what should this do for names like 'kmc' though? 20:01:56 ] thanks 'aaaaa something with a vowel' 20:01:56 boily: |value error: thanks 20:01:56 boily: | thanks'aaaaa something with a vowel' 20:01:59 ] thanks 'kmc' 20:02:00 FireFly: |value error: thanks 20:02:00 FireFly: | thanks'kmc' 20:02:17 `cat bin/thanks 20:02:17 ​#!/usr/bin/perl \ $_ = (join " ", @ARGV) || `words`; s/^\s+|\s+$//g; print "Thanks, $_. "; if (/[aeiouyAEIOUY]/) { s/^[^aeiouyAEIOUY]*/Th/; } else { s/^./T/; } print "$_."; 20:02:44 boily: try 'evalj load: b_jonas,' or something first. stupid bot defaults to separate states per nick. 20:02:46 quintopia: I'm having ideas. something MALBOLGIAN. 20:02:47 evalj, pwd: 20:02:47 b_jonas, working session is b_jonas,#esoteric 20:03:02 evalj cd: , 20:03:02 b_jonas, changed to ,#esoteric 20:03:03 evalj load: b_jonas 20:03:03 boily, copied boily,#esoteric from boily,b_jonas 20:03:09 ] thanks 'aaaaa something with a vowel' 20:03:09 boily: |value error: thanks 20:03:09 boily: | thanks'aaaaa something with a vowel' 20:03:11 boily: no, the comma is needed 20:03:17 evalj load: b_jonas, 20:03:18 b_jonas: say wut? 20:03:18 b_jonas, copied ,#esoteric from b_jonas,#esoteric 20:03:24 evalj load: b_jonas, 20:03:24 boily, copied boily,#esoteric from b_jonas,#esoteric 20:03:27 ] thanks 'aaaaa something with a vowel' 20:03:27 boily: Thanks, aaaaa something with a vowel. Thaaaaa something with a vowel. 20:03:45 boily: i am scared 20:04:00 boily: whatever it is, we should be able to talk to metasepia in it 20:04:03 ] thanks 'kmc' 20:04:04 b_jonas: Thanks, kmc. Th. 20:04:08 ] thanks 'evalj' 20:04:09 b_jonas: Thanks, evalj. Thevalj. 20:04:31 I think 'Thevalj.' is right. Isn't that sort of how pig latin works? 20:04:38 I'm not good in these English language games 20:04:48 quintopia: of course. I'd like to have it understand aubergine also. 20:05:13 hmm, maybe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Name_Game is more relevant than pig latin? 20:07:28 I think pig latin cuts up and reorders stuff 20:08:28 I still don't know what it should give for a nick with only consonants 20:08:32 like kmc 20:09:16 `thanks kmc 20:09:17 Thanks, kmc. Tmc. 20:09:26 b_jonas: ↑ that's one possible solution. 20:09:29 hmm, ok 20:09:52 boily: post seems pretty cool 20:10:38 boily: it should be WrItTeN In iN aUbErFGiNe 20:10:58 agh stupid lag echoing backspaces instead of doing them 20:11:31 you squished an ERF in my aubergine. 20:12:46 gihvjck 20:12:58 imagine it the way it looked to me before udp mangled it 20:14:59 spelling guterals won't help you there, you Infamous Squisher. 20:15:54 but I think I'm still going to go a step further than that. something more... arduous. tortuous. painful, like a stubbed toe on a rabid stove. 20:16:06 hmm 20:16:10 it's been done 20:16:22 `thanks strong 20:16:23 Thanks, strong. Thong. 20:16:41 quintopia: beuh. 20:17:03 quintopia: make something that is a JOY to program in! even more than aubergine! 20:18:07 oh. so, pain inducing, but more like a quality hot sauce where you put your tongue on fire and your brains on dopamines? 20:19:58 (btw, is there yucca flavoured hot sauce out there? I'd buy a bottle of that if thausible.) 20:22:27 `thanks Hanks 20:22:28 Thanks, Hanks. Thanks. 20:23:59 boily: http://honest-food.net/2011/06/15/eating-yucca-flowers/ there's this at least. your language should be like eating fried flowers with hot sauce 20:24:22 oh. 20:24:28 you are tempting me. 20:24:37 quintopia: fire flowers? as in super mario ones? 20:24:57 oens that make you powerful 20:25:25 sadly, flowers tend not to shoot fire in real life 20:25:33 there are plants with projectile weapons, though 20:26:24 ais523: have you broken resplicate yet. we're all waiting :P 20:27:01 quintopia: no, I need to spend overnight I think 20:27:07 I can't concentrate when I have Internet access 20:27:12 this is why most of my BF Jousting is done offline 20:27:14 for instance 20:27:28 :D i understand 20:28:01 * quintopia EMPs the area around ais523 20:28:21 it's not the flowers that shoot fire 20:28:32 it's super mario that shoots fire after he takes a fire flower 20:30:32 quintopia: careful not to destroy my laptop 20:30:48 b_jonas: the flower itself shoots fire in Smash Bros. 20:31:27 ais523: i focused on isp hubs and cell towers 20:31:40 ais523: hmm 20:31:50 you can ignore the cell towers, I don't have any sort of cellular equipment 20:32:00 because then I wouldn't be able to concentrate /ever/ :-) 20:32:56 well, mario games also have flower-like enemies that duck in and out of pipes, some of which shoot flowers, but I don't know what those are called 20:33:30 i used to know their names 20:34:00 gb super mario 2 has cannons instead of flowers only I think 20:34:03 I'm not sure 20:34:13 no wait 20:34:21 the cannons don't duck in and out of pipes 20:34:23 I dunno 20:34:32 http://www.mariowiki.com/Piranha_Plant ? 20:34:43 b_jonas: piranha plants I think 20:35:03 also, the canons duck in and out of pipes on super mario land /1/ 20:35:08 piranha plant or packun flower 20:35:16 /2/ has piranha plants, like in the NES and SNES games 20:35:25 and the fire shooters are venus firetraps 20:35:27 err, didn't mean to italicise the2 20:35:31 * 2 20:35:46 actually from that wiki http://www.mariowiki.com/Venus_Fire_Trap is the variant that shoots fire 20:36:22 hurray we are all good at googling 20:36:31 hey, I'm doing this from memory 20:36:34 but what's the black cat-head-like thing in gb super mario 1 that ducks from pipes and shoots horizontally moving bullets? 20:36:47 as I said, learning about computer games I've never played is one of my hobbies 20:36:49 I didn't google, I just clicked on a link from the Piranha Plant article 20:36:52 (also, I have actually played SML1 and 2) 20:36:58 (and completed both of them) 20:37:02 I have played both, but sml2 much more 20:37:24 I haven't completed sml2, but I've done all but the wario level 20:37:30 the wario level turns out to be too difficult to me 20:37:35 turned 20:37:40 it's an order of magnitude harder than anything else in the game 20:37:40 * quintopia aims at birdo at ais523. "beat super mario sunshine or you get the egg!" 20:37:53 -!- zzo38 has joined. 20:38:04 b_jonas: for quite a lot of it, memorization helps 20:38:21 I also recommend grinding lives (or coins to buy lives) so that you don't have to go and refight all the bosses when you screw up 20:38:27 the reason why sml2 is easy is that you get lots of retries because it's really easy to get lots of extra lives 20:38:36 exactly 20:38:51 I continuously had over 90 lives when playing 20:38:59 but the wario castle is long 20:39:09 yes, long and no checkpoints 20:39:16 and the first room is the second-hardest room in the castle 20:39:28 well that's nice of them 20:39:31 I don't want to finish it anymore, but I would like to finish commander keen 2 20:39:36 yeah, hard room first helps 20:39:38 -!- metasepia has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 20:39:43 the hardest room is like halfway through 20:39:57 I've finished all other commander keen games (on easy level at least), 20:40:02 but I'm stuck in ck2 20:40:05 no wait 20:40:08 it's ck3 I'm stuck in 20:40:12 I've done ck2 20:40:18 sorry for the confusino 20:40:19 time to wipe and clean and nuke and polish and apply febreeze to my machine. 20:40:24 -!- boily has quit (Quit: NUCULAR CHICKEN!). 20:40:42 gah, that sentence is leaving me with cognitive dissonance 20:40:52 and yeah, I could finish those too only because of infinite lives you get by saving after each level 20:40:56 because half of it is ambiguous, and the other half gives mixed signals as to how to interpret it 20:41:04 and, in the second series, in the middle of levels too 20:41:34 I find ck5 the easiest by far 20:41:47 no wait 20:41:57 yes, ck5 20:42:00 I always mix them up 20:42:06 I don't know much about the commander keen series 20:42:53 ais523: what you should know is that ck1..3 is completely different from ck4..6. 20:43:09 OK, this is not very much information because I don't know much about /either/ series 20:43:40 ck1..3 has more different (and imo more difficult) controls (reacts slower, sort of like prince of persia), different graphics (smaller tiles), different rules (can't save during levels), different level design 20:44:51 it's also older and targets earlier computers, so the graphics isn't as good (simpler tiles, horizontally scrolls only in multiplies of 8 pixels so it works on EGA or something, which makes it sometimes jerky). 20:44:52 like, I don't even know what genre this is 20:46:24 ais523: it's a 2D platformer where you control a single superhero, the young (8 year old or so) Commander Keen, who dies from a single hit but has a pistol he can use to kill or stun most enemies (limited number of shots in ck1..3) 20:46:40 and a pogo he can use to jump bigger but more difficult to control than normal jumps 20:46:52 hmm right 20:46:53 http://www.shikadi.net/keenwiki/ is the wiki 20:47:21 this doesn't really sound like the sort of game I enjoy 20:47:23 also, ck4..6 has lots of secret areas, mostly invisible passages inside walls, but sometimes just places that are hard to reach 20:47:40 wow i'm playing commander keen as we speak 20:47:45 what the heck 20:47:48 I quite enjoy ck4..6, enjoy ck1..3 somewhat less but now I'd like to complete it 20:48:01 nooodl: high five 20:48:12 nooodl: the important question is, is it in {1..3} or {4..6}? 20:48:16 ck5 20:48:25 (NB. I've never played any CK game either) 20:48:56 i'm doing speedruns. very fun 20:49:13 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Keen3Gameplay.png nice colour palette 20:50:04 i have to do a full 100% run at some point. ck5 speedrunning is aaaactive, ish, but everyone skips through the game with a glitch, even though the levels are very fun 20:50:46 nooodl: by 100% run, you mean no death and no save? 20:50:56 i mean beat all the levels 20:50:58 ah 20:51:03 that's easier 20:51:04 b_jonas: 100% means you achieve all the goals of the game 20:51:15 although, for "beat all the levels", the normal terms are either "all levels" or "warpless" 20:51:25 do you want to reach all the secret places in levels and the secret level and all the hidden items too, even the really difficult to get extra lives? 20:51:26 warpless means you don't skip levels, all levels means you do all of them 20:51:36 the difference mostly being when you have a choice of which level to take 20:51:39 It looks to be a standard PC color palette, I think 20:51:42 in warpless, you can pick either of them 20:51:49 in all levels, you do one, then go back and do the other 20:51:49 "warpless" and "all levels" differ one level in keen 5 20:51:50 ais523: yes, some commander keen games have optional levels or choices between levels 20:51:51 (the secret level) 20:52:14 I try to go for all levels except the secret level, that's how I did ck{1,3,4,5,6} I think 20:52:31 but I definitely cannot reach all the hidden places in all levels 20:52:46 I want all levels because that's how I get the most fun from the game 21:04:41 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 21:07:45 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 21:07:50 -!- yubisaylozada has joined. 21:08:12 -!- augur has joined. 21:12:42 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 21:12:42 -!- spiette has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 21:12:54 -!- yubisaylozada1 has joined. 21:13:59 -!- yubisaylozada has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 21:16:21 -!- boilyphone has joined. 21:16:49 Wiping the machine. 21:18:00 -!- ais523 has quit. 21:20:50 -!- yubisaylozada has joined. 21:22:28 -!- yubisaylozada1 has quit (Ping timeout: 265 seconds). 21:22:35 quien habla en espaol 21:22:42 `bienvenido yubisaylozada 21:22:43 yubisaylozada: ¡Bienvenido al centro internacional para el diseño y despliegue de lenguajes de programación esotéricos! Por desgracia, la mayoría de nosotros no hablamos español. Para obtener más información, echa un vistazo a nuestro wiki: http://esolangs.org/. (Para el otro tipo de esoterismo, prueba #esoteric en irc.dal.net.) 21:23:20 `run ls bin/tervetuloa 21:23:21 ls: cannot access bin/tervetuloa: No such file or directory 21:23:36 I think it's a factoid 21:23:38 fizzie, ion: ☝ 21:23:40 wisdom, I mean 21:23:43 `? tervetuloa 21:23:44 tervetuloa: ask shachaf 21:23:47 ;-) 21:23:48 B| 21:23:49 eh. good enough 21:24:10 does FireFly speak Finnish maybe 21:24:15 'fraid not 21:24:31 Apart from 'ei saa peittä' 21:24:49 That should be "peittää". 21:25:01 hi fizzie 21:25:05 hizzie 21:25:16 "hizzie" sounds like some sort of a rap thing. 21:25:19 yes 21:26:07 fizzie: ah. 21:26:36 fungotizzle 21:26:36 kmc: s/ it's/ its/ 21:26:56 -!- augur has joined. 21:27:13 wow thanks a lot fungot 21:27:13 shachaf: but with " a" rant... it makes it harder for programs written in scheme 21:27:36 :) 21:28:25 I'm not sure whether yubisaylozada understands english, or is just smiling and nodding along... 21:30:01 :) 21:30:16 FireFly: you might say the same about fungot 21:30:17 shachaf: try searching for " library procedure", on the same lines 21:30:19 fungot: :) 21:30:19 kmc: apparently it's also from greek platypous, but i'm confused about continuations being used in so many ways. for example, 21:30:30 i was going to suggest we should mention not speaking spanish in the welcome but... there it is 21:30:39 yeah somebody added that 21:30:44 somebody++ 21:30:56 “Tervetuloa esoteeristen ohjelmointikielten suunnittelun ja {deployment}:n kansainväliseen keskukseen! Lisätietoa saat wikistämme: . (Muu esoteerisuus: kokeile kanavaa #esoteric irc.dal.net:ssä.)” Help, what’s deployment in Finnish? 21:31:42 that bienvenido message has no color 21:32:01 shachaf: good point 21:32:05 käyttöönotto? 21:32:08 `run bienvenido b_jonas | rainwords 21:32:09 ​b_jonas: ¡Bienvenido al centro internacional para el diseño y despliegue de lenguajes de programación esotéricos! Por desgracia, la mayoría de nosotros no hablamos español. Para obtener más información, echa un vistazo a nuestro wiki: 21:32:18 huh 21:32:28 thanks 21:32:45 kmc: length limit? 21:32:46 ​b_jonas: ¡Bienvenido al centro internacional para el diseño y despliegue de lenguajes de programación esotéricos! Por desgracia, la mayoría de nosotros no hablamos español. Para obtener más información, echa un vistazo a nuestro wiki: 21:32:46 hey how do i set my locale 21:32:47 (16:56:23) kmc: huh 21:32:54 seeing question marks in irc is sad 21:32:56 -!- boilyphone has quit (Quit: AndroIRC - Android IRC Client ( http://www.androirc.com )). 21:33:33 it's only fun when they speak in spanish :/ 21:33:44 general they, here 21:33:50 oh nevermind i found a wiki entry 21:34:36 is that message in spanish or obfuscated spanish btw? it seems like it has too many long words. 21:34:37 typeof(*p) *elliott_________ = (typeof(*p)*__force )ACCESS_ONCE(p); 21:35:01 b_jonas: it's the consensus between Google Translate and my half remembered high school spanish knowledge 21:35:05 plus some edits by others 21:35:10 ah! 21:35:23 so you don't actually have spanish speakers here? 21:35:45 I don't think we have any regulars who are fluent spanish speakers... but I'm not sure 21:36:01 isn't that what "la mayoria de nosotros no hablamos espanol" means 21:36:02 mmkay 21:36:52 ion: what does the ":n" mean 21:37:38 `learn welcome.fi Tervetuloa esoteeristen ohjelmointikielten suunnittelun ja käyttöönoton kansainväliseen keskukseen! Lisätietoa saat wikistämme: . (Muu esoteerisuus: kokeile kanavaa #esoteric palvelimella irc.dal.net.) 21:37:40 I knew that. 21:38:11 shachaf: It’s the inflection equivalent to “of ___”. 21:38:12 is that message in finnish or obfuscated finnish btw? it seems like it has too many long words. 21:38:36 ion: well, i specifically wondered about the ':' 21:38:37 Is there a difference? 21:39:05 ;) 21:39:07 shachaf: It’s how you attach an inflection into something that can’t be inflected. 21:39:38 3 – kolme – three 21:39:46 3:n – kolmen – of three / three’s 21:40:59 ah 21:41:37 kolme yksin 21:41:38 IBM:n – IBM’s 21:42:03 IBM:lle – for IBM 21:42:15 why the fuck is there a keyboard layout called 'unicode'... 21:44:10 you literally use a colon for that in finnish? weird/cool 21:44:17 fizzie: You should improve my translation, esp. for “deployment”, kthx 21:45:06 If you ever see someone write “IBM:s” in English shklee’s probably a native Finn. 21:45:08 kmc: Hungarian uses a hyphen for that (and removes the period from before it if the word before ends in a period) 21:45:25 The colon+suffix thing gets used wrong in many ways. 21:45:31 @tell Sgeo you might be interested in https://air.mozilla.org/incremental-parallelization-of-dynamic-languages/ 21:45:32 Consider it noted. 21:45:34 i haven't watched it yet 21:45:49 as for the colon, someone has suggested to use a dot 21:45:54 erase that 21:46:10 E.g. it's "IBM:n" because that's read letter by letter, but "OPECin" because that's read as a word. 21:46:37 paamayim nekudotayim 21:46:44 as for the colon, someone has suggested to use a middle dot as a new punctuation mark in Hungarian to separate the subject (and words attached to that) from the predicate (and words attached from that) in ambiguous sentences, 21:46:56 but I think we should use the colon for that actually. 21:47:01 Swedish also uses : for ordinals (1:a, 2:a, 3:e for 1st, 2nd, 3rd) 21:47:08 ;-) 21:47:09 fizzie: IBM:n and OPECin are correct usage or they're the wrong usage you object to? 21:47:11 (this one doesn't make sense in English, where that kind of ambiguity doesn't come up) 21:47:33 kmc: They're both correct. But different, obviously, since the other doesn't have a colon. 21:48:22 ion: I can't really figure out a better word for deployment. 21:48:35 -!- Bike has quit (Quit: sigh). 21:48:57 as for abuse, the blogs http://www.apostropheabuse.com/ and http://www.apostrophecatastrophes.com/ have lots of examples where apostrophe is used in English to attach plural "s" to words 21:49:15 often to abbreviations 21:50:06 -!- Bike has joined. 21:50:22 `bienvenido 21:50:23 ​¡Bienvenido al centro internacional para el diseño y despliegue de lenguajes de programación esotéricos! Por desgracia, la mayoría de nosotros no hablamos español. Para obtener más información, echa un vistazo a nuestro wiki: http://esolangs.org/. (Para el otro tipo de esoterismo, prueba #esoteric en irc.dal.net.) 21:50:27 `run sed -re 's/\.es\>/.fi/g' ​#!/usr/bin/perl -w \ if (defined($_=shift)) { s/ *$//; s/ +/ @ /g; exec "bin/@", $_ . " ? welcome.fi"; } else { exec "bin/?", "welcome.fi"; } 21:50:37 i can feel the american sloughing off me 21:50:46 `run sed -re 's/\.es\>/.fi/g' bin/tervetuloa && chmod 755 bin/tervetuloa 21:50:48 No output. 21:51:08 `tervetuloa Adolf 21:51:09 Adolf: welcome.fi Tervetuloa esoteeristen ohjelmointikielten suunnittelun ja käyttöönoton kansainväliseen keskukseen! Lisätietoa saat wikistämme: . (Muu esoteerisuus: kokeile kanavaa #esoteric palvelimella irc.dal.net.) 21:51:14 uh 21:51:27 um 21:51:37 `? bonjour 21:51:38 bonjour? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ 21:51:41 s/welcome.fi // from taht output 21:51:56 It's in the wisdom file. 21:51:57 `sed -i -re 's/^welcome\.fi //' wisdom/welcome.fi 21:51:58 Usage: sed [OPTION]... {script-only-if-no-other-script} [input-file]... \ \ -n, --quiet, --silent \ suppress automatic printing of pattern space \ -e script, --expression=script \ add the script to the commands to be executed \ -f script-file, --file=script-file \ add the contents of script- 21:52:00 Which is weird. 21:52:15 -!- conehead has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 21:52:23 `run sed -i -re 's/^welcome\.fi //' wisdom/welcome.fi 21:52:25 No output. 21:52:31 `tervetuloa Adolf 21:52:32 Adolf: Tervetuloa esoteeristen ohjelmointikielten suunnittelun ja käyttöönoton kansainväliseen keskukseen! Lisätietoa saat wikistämme: . (Muu esoteerisuus: kokeile kanavaa #esoteric palvelimella irc.dal.net.) 21:52:52 better 21:53:01 next up relvetuloa 21:53:16 Rainbow is sateenkaari in Finnish hth 21:53:24 shachaf: um... does that make sense in finnish? 21:53:33 Oh, it's not weird, it's just the way `learn has always worked. 21:53:34 selvetuloa 21:54:12 tervekaari. 21:54:26 sateentuloa 21:54:37 `words --finnish 12 21:54:38 kaivaihtuvilta syrjistisemme venemienollisemmaksen finimittumalta hulluvinänsä lyömaaliseen hakeutuvinansa rastani raan keskuumanansa naisempientaisi naisemmalla 21:54:50 rastani 21:55:03 "kaivaihtuvilta" is borderline okay. 21:55:19 "from the probably-changing" or some such. 21:55:26 oooh! is that some sort of stochastic model random generation? 21:55:35 It's character... trigrams? 21:55:38 I think it's trigrams. 21:55:49 I made one of those once, a bit more complicated, 21:56:04 And then some separate word length model, I think. 21:56:07 what other languages does `words know? 21:56:11 `words --help 21:56:12 Usage: words [-dhNo] [DATASETS...] [NUMBER_OF_WORDS] \ \ options: \ -l, --list list valid datasets \ -d, --debug debugging output \ -N, --dont-normalize don't normalize frequencies when combining \ multiple Markov models; this has the effect \ of making larger dataset 21:56:16 `words --list 21:56:17 valid datasets: --eng-1M --eng-all --eng-fiction --eng-gb --eng-us --french --german --hebrew --russian --spanish --irish --german-medical --bulgarian --catalan --swedish --brazilian --canadian-english-insane --manx --italian --ogerman --portuguese --polish --gaelic --finnish --norwegian --esolangs \ default: --eng-1M 21:56:24 It barely fits in the output. 21:56:32 `words --canadian-english-insane 21:56:33 mality 21:56:46 Isn’t that redundant? 21:56:55 It can interpolate between two, which is I guess fancy. 21:57:01 `words --finnish --swedish 5 21:57:02 gruosiatriken sänsä tahandeintamilja isras firman 21:57:11 -!- yubisaylozada has left. 21:57:18 taught it the list of ~3300 Hungarian town names and made it generate a mix of random town names and real town names so you have to guess, 21:57:19 `words --eng-1M 12 21:57:20 defica ced tigl magnant spagne bellus dellslotoet remark coversigna inramound congd trailch 21:57:21 Quite often the interpolation sticks to one of the models, unsurprisingly. 21:57:27 english is such a beautiful language 21:57:34 `words --german 12 21:57:35 kmc: You're such a magnant guy. 21:57:35 tandenentalthar erung droismenais pannell tubenbau kelligio verrichtetermelz stavent argoverspretelloh infachgeselbuch importfreism far 21:57:40 often it gave obviously fake gibberish, but it also gave good fakes 21:57:51 `words --manx 12 21:57:52 corpoin aesa cad hagh cummalreas per glooagey grein cleayreyda anchoobalan aasaayn yn-least-chei 21:57:57 `words --canadian-english-insane --esolangs 12 21:57:58 thulg stant [] snusplia pan intymphiloquiet thingy tage cal perpropoma () purphlor 21:58:06 The esolang dataset is my favourite. 21:58:15 (It's esolang names from the wiki.) 21:58:20 `words --swedish --esolangs 20 21:58:21 suicerylan ist orkar threa surn carant tmmlpte um-32 ransion2 numstränktif thundskatterwangiva iotets inveyor pyrels ortfal drivar flykt keminius cirke pointinan 21:58:30 the best fake it generated is Nemes, which is actually the Hungarian name for a town in Romania, so it wasn't in the input dataset 21:58:40 thundskatterwangiva, eh? 21:58:51 `words --english --esolangs 20 21:58:52 Unknown option: english 21:59:07 `words --eng-1M --esolangs 20 21:59:08 frak verix paxo bita mar etruelativenu bf-pda rssble splayne subskia pumpt mer inhydr mkblnk dobin ite pil dogranscrips pau bran 21:59:13 my favourite from its output is Rúgonya though 21:59:17 dogranscrips! 21:59:41 i read a story today that involved a doge and the meme fucked me up 21:59:53 `run for w in $(words --english --esolangs 20); do echo -n "${w}coin "; done 21:59:54 Unknown option: english 21:59:59 `run for w in $(words --eng-1M --esolangs 20); do echo -n "${w}coin "; done 22:00:00 I also tried to teach it to generate ordinary Hungarian text, but there the output is much more gibberish 22:00:01 fercoin mencoin notcoin ovecoin hallycoin worlcoin tolmbacoin paxcoin abclarecoin geomegaplcoin whencoin valuscoin standfoocoin hattancoin wielcoin .yachiewcoin 0.75coin rssomskjcoin sentowcoin expenbecoin 22:00:18 mencoin? isn't that just bitcoin? zing 22:00:22 notcoin 22:00:22 Geomegaplcoins could be such a thing. 22:00:47 `run echo 'for w in $(words --eng-1M --esolangs 20); do echo -n "${w}coin "; done' > bin/coins && chmod +x bin/coins 22:00:47 Actually, a majority of them sound like plausible cryptocurrencies. 22:00:48 No output. 22:00:50 `coins 22:00:51 devlcoin 1cnigmantcoin braincoin orthcoin gorgicoin maginacoin pnruncoin crtoncoin koticurcoin verstanfpacoin full+coin lytejudecoin andypacoin starmocoin puzzellcoin hosphacoin wlucoin fityrdahlecoin anycoin chapycoin 22:01:08 `coins 22:01:10 netweeumonodycoin 0.9602coin hanoldbcoin gasoignimalcoin monterwacoin tweensidcoin suellowfoocoin forcoin dzzzcoin gotoncoin hobbacoin kroecoin obarandcoin verationcoin probelcoin nuitabllcoin ctorcoin sessprocoin .boxcoin aaromancoin 22:01:25 It keeps working. 22:01:30 `run words --eng-1M --esolangs 20 | sed -re 's/\>/coin/g' 22:01:32 incincoin chocoin ovecoin iihromodercoin insoncoin wertcoin ersioneranacoin divzcoin paxicoin adjustcoin vcoin rentacoin brillecoin beincoin qwertainspathogelycoin fannacoin vercoin brashmencoin coniacoin tyvercoin 22:01:42 ion: much better 22:01:59 `run echo 'words --eng-1M --esolangs 20 | sed -re '"'"'s/\>/coin/g'"'"'' > bin/coins 22:02:01 No output. 22:02:03 `coins 22:02:05 bentacoin platorylancoin homoucoin rcepticoin pithcoin timissecoin guadecoin penfernoncoin pongcoin tsedumbcoin glycoin tgcoin netwocoin cratumcoin 2dcoin-refcoin colnicoin nabcoin mcoin-codcoin parecoin modecoin 22:02:14 mcoin-codcoin 22:02:55 `espletive coin 22:03:15 `espletive 22:03:16 infuck 22:03:25 No output. 22:03:50 `run espletive | sed -e 's/fuck/coin/' # workaround 22:03:51 memcoin 22:04:05 Good enough 22:04:25 `espletive 20 22:04:30 2050706 22:06:22 `run words --eng-1M --esolangs 20 | sed -re 's/( |$)/coin\1/g' 22:06:23 woudrycoin quoiacoin cardcoin uniniftysnaicoin revergingcoin con-of-unbabtcoin ><>coin heicoin quotcoin morecoin entcoin perlincoin monozcand.nexcoin msgacoin cycliptcoin cufcoin workcoin braincncoin oversecoin leszecoin 22:07:26 `run printf '%s\n' 'words --eng-1M --esolangs 20 | sed -re '\''s/( |$)/coin\1/g'\' | tee bin/coins 22:07:28 words --eng-1M --esolangs 20 | sed -re 's/( |$)/coin\1/g' 22:07:39 `coins 22:07:41 cutanginencoin befuckencoin aldinguncoin zenocoin doniacoin gloversecoin genorcoin infiniscoin vertcoin ooooocoin parcoin poglyoncoin anocoin presonalcoin checoin leurcoin retcoin brakillicoin rainecoin whencoin 22:07:56 Befuckencoins. 22:08:03 -!- oerjan has joined. 22:08:19 -!- MindlessDrone has quit (Quit: MindlessDrone). 22:08:48 oerjan: Got any zenocoins on you? 22:09:23 whencoin? 22:09:30 Doesn't seem like a safe investment to me 22:09:46 yeah, personally i'm going for thisisascamdontuseitcoin 22:09:47 fizzie: i somehow never manage to finish getting any 22:10:08 Bike: make that scamcoin for short 22:10:18 scamcoin is totally distinct! 22:10:32 ok, scamcoin1.1 then 22:22:58 -!- FreeFull has joined. 22:24:48 quintopia: found a "useful" resplicate pattern 22:25:28 which alleviates most of my doubts that it is TC 22:26:23 what is that pattern? 22:27:11 4 2 4 2 4 2 4 2 0 ? n 1 ...any n integers... 22:27:54 it's self-producing and allows embedding any data 22:28:13 hmm, that reminds me 22:28:44 does the esolang wiki have entries for the three simple automata Smullyan has defined in his books? 22:28:57 if not, maybe I should write about them 22:29:01 i don't recall 22:29:16 also i don't know smullyan's automata 22:29:24 yes, that's why I should write about them 22:29:58 hm i may vaguely recall someone writing something related on the wiki 22:30:30 hm no hits for "smullyan" 22:31:44 two of them are defined in the book ''The Lady or the Tiger'', one in ''The Riddle of Scheherazade''. 22:32:19 the three are very simlar, they're functions from digit strings to other digit strings, 22:32:51 partial functions actually, with very simple rules, and often applied repeatedly with the question being whether it ever reaches a digit string not in the domain 22:33:42 mhm 22:34:36 the other questions are finding a quine (there is at least one for each automaton) 22:35:40 I should write them up on the wiki later 22:36:44 I'm reminded to this by this Resplicate 22:40:26 -!- evalj has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:47:37 -!- conehead has joined. 22:58:31 -!- augur has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:59:05 -!- augur has joined. 23:03:24 -!- augur has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 23:08:23 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 23:35:23 -!- Phantom__Hoover has joined. 23:37:21 `? welcome.fi 23:37:22 Tervetuloa esoteeristen ohjelmointikielten suunnittelun ja käyttöönoton kansainväliseen keskukseen! Lisätietoa saat wikistämme: . (Muu esoteerisuus: kokeile kanavaa #esoteric palvelimella irc.dal.net.) 23:39:00 -!- Zuu has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 23:39:17 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 23:43:42 -!- Zuu has joined. 23:44:12 -!- Zuu has left. 23:54:34 -!- shikhin has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds).