< 1400889665 149305 :MDream!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1400889886 950183 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could also just do it directly in LLVM by telling it that you want undefined behavior on unsigned overflow in this circumstances. < 1400890379 679645 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400890496 511636 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, the problem with base 10, and all other positive integer radix bases, is that they're topologically incorrect. < 1400890565 346303 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you saying they outright don't have topoligies? < 1400890587 530520 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I think they have topologies. But the topologies are incorrect. < 1400890637 921631 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say that a set of sequences is open if and only if, for every sequence in the set, there's a finite prefix of that sequence such that every sequence with that prefix is in the set. < 1400890675 588614 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For example, the set of all sequences containing at least one "b" is open, because given the sequence "aaaabaaaaaaa", there's a prefix, "aaaab", such that every sequence with that prefix is in the set.) < 1400890711 137130 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then there's no continuous function taking a regular Cauchy sequence and returning a decimal expansion for its limit. < 1400890742 683305 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've been pinged < 1400890760 977830 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1400890763 51438 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1400890765 658712 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wasn't me < 1400890771 603511 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know system F < 1400890779 459088 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i appreciate the faith in me < 1400890837 316477 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think. < 1400890846 293692 :mhi^!~mhi@unaffiliated/mhi/x-9993184 QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1400890915 239950 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. Given the sequence 1.1, 0.9, 1.01, 0.99, 1.001, 0.999, 1.0001, 0.9999, ..., you can never find any digits of the decimal expansion because you don't know whether the first digit is 0 or 1. < 1400890952 759440 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The most obvious bases that don't have this problem are the negative integer radix bases. < 1400891018 639664 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that's not quite true. < 1400891031 717483 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're the negative integer radix bases where you're allowed to use digits at least as large as the base. < 1400891033 89522 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yw < 1400891044 367629 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The absolute value, rather. So, e.g., base -2 with 0, 1, and 2 as digits. < 1400891118 988047 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :is system F brainfuck? i don't even remember < 1400891150 797483 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: no it's lambda calculus with explicit rank-n types < 1400891196 912954 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ghc's core intermediate language is an extension of it < 1400891217 88997 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the basica version allows only terminating functions < 1400891220 36419 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-a < 1400891240 409855 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once made some kind of RLE where some values are data values and some are RLE values, and the RLE values are small-endian shifted numbers so, for example, you might have eight data values and eight RLE values, then the digits are 1 to 8. If RLE values are present, you add two to determine how many. < 1400891282 447342 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i don't understand anything even remotely related to ghc. i feel like the dude in that codeless code "the monolith" < 1400891294 571607 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wat < 1400891303 187297 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly there is still some redundancy though. < 1400891666 972298 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn, how could everyone have missed a flaw in numbers this whole time < 1400891695 214964 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :is mathematics inconsistent < 1400891697 531136 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: That isn't a flaw, though. < 1400891733 312272 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks to me like an error in trying to use then with topologies even though it shouldn't apply. < 1400891763 820248 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait is Bike talking about what zzo38 thinks he is talking about < 1400891769 840908 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, yes. < 1400891823 859507 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo will see that everything he loves is a lie as soon as he tries getting digits of the limit of 1.1, 0.9, etc etc < 1400891828 392095 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :doom! doom!! < 1400891836 769795 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1400891847 718621 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's because it doesn't have a limit. < 1400891888 728165 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many things don't have a limit! < 1400891899 842883 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a cruel thing to say. < 1400891948 252662 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't care if it is cruel or not. < 1400892024 144426 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1400892036 606073 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ironically that is also a cruel thing to say < 1400892094 890536 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400892184 616980 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1400892268 562158 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :cruelly, that is not actually ironic hth < 1400893402 940029 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :and incidentally (neither cruelly nor ironically) it is/was my birthday < 1400893442 580739 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :happy olsner day! < 1400893466 895919 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com TOPIC #esoteric :Happy olsner day! | PSA: fizzie is running the wiki now, contact him for any problems | brainfuck survey: https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/L82SNZV | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/ < 1400893473 755338 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you feel < 1400893485 717777 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :somewhat inebriated? < 1400893497 252676 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's just as well, we're 90% of the way through megasecond 1400) < 1400893524 58351 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :not older, because really I'm pretty much exactly as old as I used to be < 1400893613 11935 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :420 build LLVM every day < 1400893687 406104 :yorick!~yorick@oftn/member/yorick QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400893703 873808 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I don't do drugs, but if I did I wouldn't do llvm < 1400893730 528674 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some people's birthday is on Feb.29 and it has to be moved to Mar.1. One way to avoid is to use your actual sun sign rather than the calendar; then you don't have to worry about leap years. However, in such a case, it will then change which date it is on each year much more often. < 1400893800 151090 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how are you inebriated if you don't do drugs < 1400893906 600626 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :high on life tbh < 1400893912 397259 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :my impeccable logic has been peccled < 1400893924 799048 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :high on inebriation itself < 1400893953 294414 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a snake smoking its own tail < 1400893982 780825 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know what is the ecliptic longitude of sun at the time of your birth, to the nearest degree, and what time this year is corresponds to the same number? (I am not asking you what it is; I only ask if you know it or not.) < 1400893995 122740 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know < 1400893999 766970 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but I think I could look it up? < 1400894002 772155 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't actually care what the result is.) < 1400894050 941827 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Using ephemeris you certainly can look it up, yes. But you may need to know the time of day too, in such a case. < 1400894072 936130 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know the approximate time of day when I was born < 1400894076 198416 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I start using rust's format macros, I wonder if it would bloat my kernel horribly < 1400894081 121626 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1400894089 761232 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, my thought exactly < 1400894353 916475 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can either use software on your computer to calculate it (such as Swiss Ephemeris, or Astrolog), or use a webpage form such as http://ephemeris.com/ephemeris.php It will display the current positions by default. You should leave the longitude/latitude/meters blank. The columns "Longitude" and "Latitude" are ecliptic positions (you can tell because of the units used), while "Right Asc." and "Declination" are equatorial coordinates. < 1400894366 504662 :hogeyui!~hogeyuiVP@vps.usamimi.biz QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400894669 387729 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Ephemeris can also be used for date/time in the future, too.) < 1400895112 107811 :hogeyui!~hogeyuiVP@vps.usamimi.biz JOIN :#esoteric < 1400895260 795727 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.theonion.com/video/christ-article-a-video,36101/ < 1400895350 510159 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel this. < 1400895710 634444 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1400895712 469243 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In a tarot deck, one card is called a "Fool" (or sometimes, an "Excuse"). This card is often labeled zero, but I disagree, and believe it should instead remain unlabeled. Generally, either it is either the highest trump, or it is a card which can be played even though you are able to follow suit, but always loses the trick. < 1400895758 139323 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone once told me why it is labeled zero, which is because it represents the beginning of the journey, which is what the trump cards represent. I can understand this, but do not consider it to be a valid excuse. What do *you* think? < 1400895839 250967 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another document agrees with me that it should not be numbered, but has an entirely different reason which does not agree with mine. < 1400895871 82773 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would i care < 1400895874 521161 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Have you played any card games at all which have a card which can be played even though you are able to follow suit? < 1400895889 789179 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am wondering what other games use such a feature. < 1400896295 68959 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that game with the eights? < 1400896359 98574 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crazy_Eights < 1400896375 195921 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :uno and speed uno < 1400896399 216621 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that upstream downstream one i think < 1400896567 843065 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I meant about trick taking games, where you lose the trick if you don't follow suit. < 1400896604 231727 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :other than spades? < 1400896633 28442 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know how Spades is played, but I can try to learn < 1400896657 63524 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll play spades with you < 1400896947 189641 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In hearts it is played that you cannot lead a heart until one is played (and also a similar rule is sometimes used in spades). But what if, all you have are hearts? < 1400897006 456162 :hk3380!~test@natvip29.york.ac.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400897031 489460 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia says they can play it anyways in such a case. < 1400897104 833286 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps the following variant rule of Hearts is similar to the Excuse card in tarot: "Non-distinct Jokers are valueless cards that cannot win tricks. They may be played at all times (except to lead tricks)" < 1400897258 25963 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: in spades, if you have all the spades, you must call for a redeal < 1400897308 784021 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK, why is that? < 1400897347 372067 :xk002!~001@a83-132-31-139.cpe.netcabo.pt QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400897586 558155 :xk002!~001@a83-132-31-139.cpe.netcabo.pt JOIN :#esoteric < 1400897787 834161 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: because if you have all the spades, you will automatically win every trick, which means you will declare 13 tricks, the other side will declare 0, everyone will make their bids, and no fun will be had by all. boring. < 1400897848 528888 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to keep on hoping that, despite this image, Creatures 4 will have a real genetics editor < 1400897848 895589 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110825065432/creatures/images/4/44/Creatures_4_Editor.jpg < 1400898282 506244 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd think it will. < 1400898314 73444 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just that because it's free-to-play, you'd have to pay for each custom egg you hatch or something. < 1400898374 851360 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you a Creatures fan? < 1400898389 641349 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, though it's been a while since I've played. < 1400898407 471690 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep scratching my Creatures 3 disks, hoping to get it on gog.com sometime. < 1400898409 120719 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cool, which games? < 1400898414 67472 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1400898430 177061 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just 3, though I wouldn't mind playing the others. < 1400898485 117660 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pretty much only DS+C3 here < 1400899027 781879 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella QUIT :Quit: It is tiem! < 1400899068 111274 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400899227 951972 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400900078 609817 :kmels!kmels@190.148.177.219 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1400900124 414790 :kmels!kmels@190.148.176.170 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400900314 135536 :hk3380!~test@90.219.231.23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400902086 607475 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t mconcat < 1400902088 414461 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Monoid a => [a] -> a < 1400902735 387890 :hk3380!~test@90.219.231.23 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400903574 873484 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDream < 1400904008 835903 :MoALTz!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400904134 594564 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1400905071 696547 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: https://github.com/kmcallister/rfcs/blob/lints/active/0000-loadable-lints.md < 1400905141 36762 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and discussion here: https://github.com/rust-lang/rfcs/pull/89 < 1400905146 664251 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like mcpherrin's suggestion of CSS selectors for ASTs < 1400905173 786422 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :jQuery for Rust < 1400905220 545191 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1400905222 712952 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :rQuery < 1400905442 433075 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[070(nop^)14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39667&oldid=39666 5* 03John Misciagno 5* (+101) 10 < 1400905537 954738 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can xQuery selectors be used for ASTs? < 1400905667 601887 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to know a code that can convert something like CSS selectors for ASTs into a SQL code. < 1400905831 725830 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is xQuery? < 1400905874 78097 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Queries XML documents < 1400905891 634515 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does it compare to XPath? < 1400905903 262669 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think pcwalton's idea here is pretty #esoteric: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/mozilla.dev.servo/49g2izLWsls/VRlR_dSws_EJ < 1400905908 893934 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so Blink has a JIT for CSS selectors < 1400905921 659817 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and he wants us to do the same, but also throw out any other representation of CSS nodes < 1400905927 21243 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it just me, or is 'API' coming to mean 'HTTP-transported API returning JSON objects'? < 1400905929 503467 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and get it dynamically by decompiling the JIT code < 1400905936 397290 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: this is why we can't have nice things < 1400905959 189363 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.mashape.com/ sgeo < 1400905972 928395 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :a hilarious site fyi < 1400906011 99145 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: an ad for that site is exactly what made me think of that < 1400906067 442072 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://blog.mashape.com/post/69006514021/list-of-25-email-validation-apis man they even advertise it < 1400906074 507381 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have a million of everything and it all costs moneys < 1400906084 561326 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait. Why is that site suggesting hitting it for using the APIs? Do people make HTTP/JSON APIs on that site based off other APIs that might not be so "friendly"? < 1400906121 32246 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"EmailValidate is a web service which validates email addresses using various methods, including: Syntax validation, MX record lookup, SMTP availability" < 1400906130 870397 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have sliced my thumb by attempting to use a knife as a different kind of tool < 1400906132 415586 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :SMTP? Isn't that obsolete, shouldn't we be HTTP POSTing emails? < 1400906136 722072 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :not badly, just enough to feel stupid < 1400906158 322143 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: did you try to use it as nail polish < 1400906162 621396 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: one day in the future, software archaeologists will attempt to discern the purpose of all these mysterious protocol layers under HTTP < 1400906162 944020 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it is call obsolete, but it shouldn't be. We should be using SMTP and deprecating the ability tp HTTP POSTing emails. < 1400906165 624210 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: no < 1400906203 472069 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe if browser developers applied their mystic powers of understanding thirty layers of historical garbage i wouldn't have so much trouble with bug biology < 1400906209 907604 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are many better protocols than HTTP. < 1400906246 363952 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :HTTP isn't the protocol we want but it's the protocol we deserve < 1400906248 30079 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that literal example isn't quite happening yet. Except to the extent that webmail clients work, but that is, so far, just to a server which itself will use SMTP. < 1400906258 57827 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, there are totally services that let you send email by HTTP APIs < 1400906273 890565 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i feel like i should spend some time actually learning rust < 1400906283 276556 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: it's pretty cool < 1400906302 531579 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: http://www.mailgun.com/ is a popular one < 1400906327 762848 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: you should do it so that you can implement rustc features that i want < 1400906346 379875 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :application/x-www-form-urlencoded? < 1400906351 985171 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeez, seems like a novelty these days < 1400906366 369882 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in 11 months as a professional Rust developer, I have opened 48 issues on the Rust bugtracker < 1400906382 621854 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, meteor shower tonight < 1400906386 814340 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah? < 1400906389 15931 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still insist to use SMTP (or TFTP). If the server requires HTTP to be used, you should instead immediately deprecate it and write a SMTP server that translates the signals, and then eventually fix it so that it works other way around. < 1400906392 510565 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd almost say I'm weirdly happy about that, except it exposes security issues because what's an SOP,

inventor? < 1400906404 298228 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is why we can't have nice things < 1400906431 136522 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:31 < kmc> should I be scared when the WHATWG spec says "for historical reasons"? because I feel like that phrase already applies to the entire document < 1400906434 140034 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:31 < Ms2ger> Correct < 1400906436 647451 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :11:32 < Ms2ger> That just means "for historical reasons we dislike particularly" < 1400906518 190310 :pdxleif!~pdxleif@ec2-50-112-124-255.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in < 1400906525 671881 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a006.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400906562 503428 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :HTTP is very wasteful, and HTTPS isn't as secure as they want it to be. < 1400906577 417207 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you're writing a whole browser you should write a whole hypertext replacement, realistic adoption be damned < 1400906589 504909 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :moxanadu < 1400906602 579873 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1400906657 936890 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what do you think are the main security issues with HTTPS? < 1400906661 941271 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: there's a TCP-like protocol that lives on top of HTTP(S). It's becoming quite popular. < 1400906664 953371 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are so many, I don't even know where to begin < 1400906688 198212 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't write the whole browser anyways. Use different program each purpose. Using telnet and SSH when you want interactive sessions without hypertext and so on (SSH also allows a few other things; you can send a command directly for batch processing, and you can use X forwarding if you need a GUI, but hopefully you don't need a GUI and can avoid that complexity). < 1400906689 331980 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess 'on top of' isn't quite accurate. More initiated by < 1400906693 27858 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :today somebody asked me whether using "EFF" was worth it. after some needling i found out he meant their HTTPS Everywhere gizmo < 1400906701 520998 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1400906705 502805 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: websockets? < 1400906708 361272 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: yes < 1400906711 961270 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :good times < 1400906731 18469 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was like, are you trying to set up donations or sumfin < 1400906733 906536 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: and the company you're working for is building a mobile OS on top of this mess. < 1400906751 16138 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as god intended < 1400906751 241641 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, does Mozilla count as a company? < 1400906761 265564 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just 'organization'? < 1400906763 981296 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well they're a bunch of people < 1400906766 494910 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, company < 1400906792 255694 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should use SSH instead of HTTPS, and avoid use of HTML too. Make the command-line to upload/download/access bank statements and so on, using bank statement format, payment format, etc < 1400906834 641306 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey zzo are your parents computer people? < 1400906836 308894 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a006.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400906850 220411 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: fantastic idea! Now, what do we do when our customers think that we're an utterly backwards company because we have no web site? < 1400906870 519462 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Well, make a web site! But, put a notice on it that says, "Deprecated"! < 1400906938 231253 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No matter how bad the existing stack is, anything you ask a bank to come up with will be worse. < 1400906964 842754 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just having a hard time imagining you being you if you've ever had to help an unsavvy parent with the computerbox < 1400906972 132824 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making a non-web GUI is also going to be 'fun', involving possibly asking customers to trust that we're not evil (maybe warranted for an ISP, possibly not so much for, say, sharing 'meme images') < 1400907007 528435 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Best is not GUI at all, if it can be avoided. < 1400907015 638138 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: there's the alternative possibility they're so unsavvy they refuse to touch a computer, ever < 1400907029 14276 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was actually my first guess < 1400907033 951746 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you do need a GUI, use non-trusted X forwarding. < 1400907075 799924 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But try to allow it to work without a GUI if that is at all possible, even if a GUI is available. < 1400907078 95302 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :You want to let people run X programs on bank servers? < 1400907108 421688 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The web is the worst cross-platform GUI stack there is, except for all the others. < 1400907111 184829 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :monotone: No, you should disable GUI, to avoid that. < 1400907123 518855 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :geez monotone do try to keep up < 1400907153 552810 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400907181 840566 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400907200 934357 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :still thinkin' jwz("I'll invent a new protocol!") < 1400907220 94166 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like building a bookcase out of mashed potatoes < 1400907221 884085 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you do need to run X programs, well, you can fake it, and whatever. Ensure both sides are secure. It may be easier to secure than a webpage. But first try to use, don't use GUI at all if it is possible to avoid GUI. < 1400907231 904719 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`uname -a < 1400907232 413849 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Linux umlbox 3.13.0-umlbox #1 Wed Jan 29 12:56:45 UTC 2014 x86_64 GNU/Linux < 1400907236 986899 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi mcpherrin < 1400907242 104572 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: hi kmc! < 1400907246 163012 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi m28. < 1400907281 914478 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: HackEgo is a bot which executes each command by booting a new Linux virtual machine, running the command, and then merging filesystem changes using Mercurial < 1400907296 299724 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: At least you tried? < 1400907302 872863 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, it's User Mode Linux so both "booting" and "virtual machine" are something of an overstatement there < 1400907306 606135 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's how it works < 1400907311 456741 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :UML is cool < 1400907311 609068 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`coins < 1400907313 87507 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​09boatwanvcoin 02bilcoin 06dugocoin 13goto+coin 04piecodecoin 07subsidcoin 08minarcoin 09uncepticoin 02cobcoin 06alpaincoin 13ultisismcoin 04javcoin 07pinquinaboracoin 08tudcoin 09ornicoin 02juggariolacoin 06pckivcoin 13mempovecoin 04tarylancoin 07ballcoin < 1400907315 813549 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cat bin/coins < 1400907316 276954 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :words ${1---eng-1M --esolangs 20} | sed -re 's/( |$)/coin\1/g' | rainwords < 1400907325 746183 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monotone: (i think that's how jwz described using xlib) < 1400907353 422644 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did they install SQLite yet in there? It could be installed, if you want to write a survey program in SQL, to run in HackEgo. < 1400907360 604796 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hey this paper cites "McAllister". kmc are you a biophysicist < 1400907366 222981 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1400907371 844321 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm also not a street in san francisco < 1400907373 373749 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Oh, I see. Was talking about the greeting anyway. < 1400907402 861153 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: those mashed potatoes should go well with the edible book festival < 1400907404 85643 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor one of the dorms at my school, which has been repurposed into having the air force and fashion classes, i imagine < 1400907404 233543 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Imagine if there were no languages except PHP... is this an accurate way to describe the web? < 1400907409 826189 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1400907416 164622 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no hell below us < 1400907418 938200 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Javascripttttttttt < 1400907420 269071 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :no part of the web technology stack is as bad as PHP < 1400907428 86444 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :JavaScript is bad but it's not irredeemably bad < 1400907430 354773 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: No; it isn't the only way to program it, too. You can use CGI programs in C, too. < 1400907443 594308 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :JS is a really weird demonstration of the Lambda the Ultimate principle < 1400907448 906853 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :JavaScript is a fine programming language actually. It is used really badly though. < 1400907458 240060 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHP is much worse. < 1400907460 299601 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: sending browsers text data that contains both trusted and untrusted data, with the only separation being context-sensitive escaping < 1400907469 137932 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :partly it's that everyone has to use JS, so they come up with ways to make it not suck < 1400907471 981388 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :web escaping is awesome < 1400907479 745198 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that what the fuck even < 1400907481 769681 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(PHP can also be used for command-line programs; in fact, so can JavaScript.) < 1400907488 611636 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas people who use PHP and realize how bad it is can just use something else < 1400907491 585423 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :with some exceptions < 1400907513 453297 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, I worked somewhere that had a mixed Rails / PHP codebase and used both langugaes for batch processing as well as webapps < 1400907536 514273 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :PHP also has a tendency to "fix" things by making them worse. < 1400907546 259399 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you are using JavaScript for something other than client-side coding on webpages, then you usually can easily use something else. For example, Synchronet door programs are written in JavaScript, but you can just as well use a native code program or a DOS program. < 1400907566 647460 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :emscripten that shit < 1400907614 159063 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :asm.js wooooo < 1400907619 918707 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :XULrunner programs are also JavaScript; you can try to use C++ instead but that probably makes it more difficult and more confusing. I think JavaScript is really not too bad. < 1400907637 586409 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1400907639 182975 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :dos.js < 1400907644 404429 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: hail xpcom? < 1400907703 208211 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: I know about XPCOM. < 1400907726 791215 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :xpcom.js < 1400907737 528061 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: there is interest in writing Gecko components in Rust < 1400907743 471378 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :xpcom.rs woooo < 1400907762 276108 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I have written enough xpcom to know that I don't want to do that ;) < 1400907796 869680 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have written webpage server programs in SQL, though. It was at someone's request; they had SSH clients and all that stuff on their computers but I (and the system administrator) are the only ones who didn't refuse to use them. I later found my program was rewritten in Ruby by someone else. < 1400907806 272153 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :another fun macro is let string = objc![[NSString alloc] initWithCString: "Hello, world!"] < 1400907836 331968 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Possibly because they didn't know SQL, or something like that?) < 1400907859 279891 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or maybe they hated SQL) < 1400907859 728998 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, should have expected that when I searched for a JS interpreter in JS, I'd find one that's just SpiderMonkey compiled to asm.js with Emscripten. < 1400907861 797821 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: let me know when you can embed a Smalltalk IDE into Rust < 1400907872 699580 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400907890 169623 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :monotone: i'm imagining an ICE where the pistons are themselves engines < 1400907890 357409 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone was compiling webkit to asm.js too < 1400907956 114720 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :monotone: https://github.com/mozilla/narcissus/ < 1400907981 588661 :monotone!~monotone@room208.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So now we're talking about running a full-fledged browser in your browser, in a way that's somewhat more efficient than the current state of the art, running a browser in an x86 emulator in your browser. < 1400908044 313469 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :man anyone remember xzbit jokes? those were the dayzzzz < 1400908073 585377 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1400908077 358761 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :high times < 1400908088 186959 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rip < 1400908236 465916 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400908359 355019 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want structured menus of files and stuff, which is suitable for any device with any user interface (including scantron), then gopher protocol is very suitable for such a thing. < 1400908506 131827 :password2!~password@197.77.106.224 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400908517 598210 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :take these words to heart < 1400909144 38912 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400909303 974375 :MoALTz!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400910762 530445 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a006.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1400911198 300185 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :god javascript is such a shitty language < 1400911212 961160 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it even worse than mortal javascript < 1400911217 14088 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1400911233 647494 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it this time < 1400911308 857462 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For what things are worse in JavaScript? < 1400911356 655655 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Devil Javascript < 1400911909 278710 :not^v!~notnot^v@2601:4:4500:887:35b4:e4e:490a:524c JOIN :#esoteric < 1400912006 658175 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :how can you make a website as awful at getting information to people as http://www.theatrebayarea.org/events/event_list.asp < 1400912032 753939 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to be ~one page with all sorts of plays < 1400912056 847198 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it was ~4 pages grouped geographically < 1400912060 337269 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's 67 pages < 1400912096 202538 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :am i missing something < 1400912369 392499 :kmels!kmels@190.148.176.170 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1400912859 311819 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sounds like what muni did < 1400913142 621162 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's an announcement: http://www.theatrebayarea.org/news/159235/Welcome-to-Our-New-Website.htm < 1400913713 191982 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep < 1400913974 178101 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: While you are letting your guard down / I will be letting myself go / While you keep running your ship aground / I will be setting myself alight < 1400913974 596232 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: reloaded the python plugin. it is implemented... < 1400914315 473864 :not^v!~notnot^v@2601:4:4500:887:35b4:e4e:490a:524c QUIT :Quit: http://i.imgur.com/Akc6r.gif < 1400914333 55581 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400914349 217846 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1400914355 314815 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Good answer. < 1400914355 583115 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i still think s/ coming and s/ pheromone/ mark/ blog/ images/ p6_cover_big.gif amusing) < 1400914465 313859 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :Implement fungot in /// < 1400914465 461048 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: where x y and t is injective. < 1400914492 188465 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1400914583 107494 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400914846 880523 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: why do you know about XPCOM? < 1400914859 519796 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: Because I worked with it a bit once < 1400914875 285708 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400914895 564221 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did you make? < 1400915073 715407 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400915073 874768 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: http://www.theonion.com/video/christ-article-a-video,36101/ < 1400915092 449761 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400915095 613937 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1400915124 56544 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently my idea of fun on a friday night is to consume a large amount of alcohol and marijuana and then read the dlopen(3) manpage < 1400915148 627615 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1400915188 462833 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was modifying a XULrunner program. < 1400915975 285592 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: woohoo dlopen(3) < 1400916014 360829 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :\m/ < 1400916025 759303 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION reads it too
< 1400916110 289759 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :stoned dlopen partay < 1400916118 557766 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sober by now
< 1400916126 25901 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :moar whiskey perhaps < 1400916509 239620 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi mcpherrin < 1400916515 194522 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi shachaf < 1400916713 400772 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I feel like I forget who you are ( I mean, I know you're in the other IRC channel too ) < 1400916769 93211 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think we've met. < 1400916803 211746 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably not :) < 1400916833 533749 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen your name before but probably just in IRC and/or Rust contexts. < 1400916878 400650 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: oh so we're in three overlapping IRC channels :P < 1400917284 624959 :drdanmaku!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wbklosgbyukfxpop QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1400918041 323005 :xk002!~001@a83-132-31-139.cpe.netcabo.pt QUIT :Quit: Saindo < 1400918073 396081 :xk002!~001@a83-132-31-139.cpe.netcabo.pt JOIN :#esoteric < 1400918367 205786 :hogeyui!~hogeyuiVP@vps.usamimi.biz QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1400918940 803638 :password2!~password@197.77.106.224 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400919147 456159 :hogeyui!~hogeyuiVP@vps.usamimi.biz JOIN :#esoteric < 1400919263 127171 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400919361 240422 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42986.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1400919735 744792 :impomatic!~digital_w@43.16.208.46.dyn.plus.net QUIT :Quit: impomatic < 1400919773 490933 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1400919939 111997 :password2!~password@197.77.48.239 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400920411 402056 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: 'undefined' and the way it makes errors manifest in the wrong place < 1400920419 816270 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo no better than mapping a page of zeroes at address zero < 1400922303 682090 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`coins < 1400922305 361937 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​13formcoin 04exedcoin 07bitacoin 08furncoin 09rigencoin 02penccoin 06inscoin 13ennecoin 04oddycoin 07allecoin 08arbroocoin 09whenecoin 02wjthcoin 06dobridcoin 13sted!coin 04minenreanencoin 07cationcancecoin 08dissantinguadcoin 09bancoin 02warcoin < 1400922778 934547 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you ever look at some code you wrote and think "why" < 1400922789 105059 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"why the hell did I think this would be a good idea" < 1400922989 417649 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@unaffiliated/mindlessdrone JOIN :#esoteric < 1400923337 775256 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1400923376 831059 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"lambda shapes: all([shape in self.ships for shape in shapes])" < 1400923417 986194 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1400923576 249050 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's numberwang < 1400923637 715426 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :This line (which was written by me) came from something I was doing from a friend, for a competition where we had to write in Python. < 1400923663 160086 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was originally largely based on his earlier C++ code, with parts based on my earlier Haskell code. < 1400923692 283118 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :At some point we renamed a bunch of things from "shape" to "ship" or possibly the other way round, but we were horribly incomplete about it all < 1400923787 893100 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of it was then written by a very over-tired me < 1400923820 456336 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of it I have had to justify as "it came to me in a dream" because that's what it felt like. < 1400923879 222071 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I think that line is shipshape. < 1400923883 969042 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi fizzie < 1400923892 550461 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Himc. < 1400923923 436799 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how strange it is to be anything at all < 1400923994 913972 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :My next "hi" will probably be from Kyoto, incidentally. < 1400924009 867930 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi fizzie < 1400924051 896039 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I can't say "hi" back because it'd make me a liar. :/ < 1400924067 987519 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be PRIVMSG #esoteric :(evil laughter) < 1400924132 576035 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :just remember: SUNTORY BOSS is the boss of them all since 1992 < 1400924527 968146 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400925536 927060 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: The connection from solving systems of polynomial equations to Gröbner bases is as follows: if X (a vector of real numbers) is a solution of P_i(X) = 0 for 1 <= i <= n, then any polynomial Q in the ideal I = _{1 <= i <= m} has X as a solution. Now the Gröbner basis B of I is a subset of I, so X is also a solution of the set of equations given by B. Furthermore, B generates I, which contains all P_i, so any... < 1400925542 920863 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :...solution to the equations in B is also a solution of each P_i. So B has the same set of solutions as the original polynomials. But the polynomials in B are often (maybe always, but I don't see why. did I mention that I'm not an expert on Gröbner bases?) easier to solve than the original ones, because by a suitable choice of order on monomials it's possible to separate variables (so you get a polynomial in x_1, then one... < 1400925548 925130 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :...in x_1 and x_2, then one in x_1 to x_3, and so on). < 1400925647 200826 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION hugs int-e
< 1400925681 616501 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? < 1400925741 694372 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1400925825 516949 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~chatzilla@unaffiliated/kingofkarlsruhe JOIN :#esoteric < 1400927381 523148 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400927753 105760 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1400928059 854140 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hevisaurus is a Finnish heavy metal children's music band, who dress in dinosaur costumes." < 1400928203 392596 :mhi^!~mhi@unaffiliated/mhi/x-9993184 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400928206 539345 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1400928838 735119 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: There was a schism in the Hevisaurusverse, I remember reading about it. < 1400928848 183022 :KingOfKarlsruhe!~chatzilla@unaffiliated/kingofkarlsruhe QUIT :Read error: Connection timed out < 1400928853 942650 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jafet: Something about current rightsholders and the original founder and blah blah this and costumes that. < 1400928877 271240 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I guess the wiki article mentions it. < 1400928889 547414 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In early 2011, the founder of the band, Mirka Rantanen, got into a disagreement with the band's record label Sony Music. Because of this, Rantanen and three other band members belonging to the band's live assembly founded a new band called SauruXet, which has continued making children's power metal music with the original concept and nearly identical artist names. The band Hevisaurus keeps ... < 1400928895 237380 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :... its lead singer, its producers and the original stage costumes." < 1400929047 62399 :impomatic!~digital_w@43.16.208.46.dyn.plus.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400929383 481481 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42986.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400929678 74182 :hk3380!~test@90.219.231.23 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400931297 476582 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400931659 908654 :MDream!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1400933174 358995 :xk002!~001@a83-132-31-139.cpe.netcabo.pt QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400933583 186913 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:Brainfuck14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39668&oldid=39559 5* 03Rdebath 5* (+302) 10/* My optimizing interpreter again */ < 1400933748 407790 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400933909 742433 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400933917 727771 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:Brainfuck14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39669&oldid=39668 5* 03Rdebath 5* (+169) 10/* My optimizing interpreter again */ < 1400934113 381368 :password2!~password@197.77.48.239 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1400934868 943161 :password2!~password@197.77.43.197 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400935267 233116 :password2!~password@197.77.43.197 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1400935687 899110 :yorick!~yorick@oftn/member/yorick JOIN :#esoteric < 1400936655 475468 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1400938569 422378 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDream < 1400938577 572546 :MDream!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude < 1400938707 227645 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400938787 427726 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 QUIT :Client Quit < 1400939553 992498 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400940182 285619 :hk3380!~test@90.219.231.23 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400940484 461054 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1400940616 420367 :Patashu_!Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400940765 611997 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is true, that sometimes I have written some program code and think, why would I think it is good idea at the time? < 1400940932 191214 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :goto hell; // it seemed a good idea at the time < 1400941008 657497 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually I have used "goto hell" in a few programs in error handlers, and do not consider it so bad < 1400941020 23424 :drdanmaku!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kainzxrparzfmzkh JOIN :#esoteric < 1400941208 966503 :sign!nyuszika7h@pdpc/supporter/active/nyuszika7h NICK :systemd < 1400941240 455305 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-201-82.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1400941630 199664 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400941812 398730 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400941911 442803 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, ooh, don't tell ais about that < 1400943034 104270 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1400943060 477365 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-4570a006.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400943072 595235 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella JOIN :#esoteric < 1400943105 708236 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1400943190 325488 :Sorella!~queen@oftn/member/Sorella JOIN :#esoteric < 1400943554 672982 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be QUIT :Quit: Ik ga weg < 1400943732 818956 :hk3380!~test@natvip29.york.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400943815 938385 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ripley once went to Hell on the suggestion that he go there several times. < 1400943829 713930 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It is a place in Norway.) < 1400944078 980817 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm just a few minutes' drive from there, actually < 1400944104 970257 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's next to trondheim's airport. < 1400944121 905435 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, Hell is Trondheim's Heathrow < 1400944142 415376 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, Hell is next to Trondheim's Heathrow, which is name Værnes. < 1400944148 72489 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*named < 1400944148 699813 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, OK < 1400944216 603600 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 minutes walk to the airport, i read in an article about the Blues in Hell festival (very small but praised festival) < 1400944262 469144 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i also recalled someone once suggested renaming the airport to Hell airport instead. i think it's like on the border between the two villages. < 1400944300 212779 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(well Værnes might count as a town, but Hell is smaller.) < 1400944372 451077 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course with a name like that and extremely good connectivity a festival just has to be successful. < 1400944376 388959 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a Hel in Poland < 1400944383 759256 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't there a Hell in Jamaica? < 1400944400 901226 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: i think that was mentioned last time we discussed this < 1400944423 731601 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there is a Hell in Pennsylvania < 1400944425 978095 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably by me :) < 1400944443 977369 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :plausible < 1400944526 63490 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn there i go talking before opening the logs again < 1400944557 294933 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400944579 796475 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(IE's search makes it awkward to go to hits on my nick that aren't close to the beginning or end of the file, so now i have to click past everything i just said) < 1400944610 518346 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :back in IE 8 it was easy, i could just click in the document to tell it to start searching there :( < 1400944637 854731 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but obviously they thought that was too conven*Wconfusing < 1400944742 853259 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if you use the F7 cursor mode? < 1400944825 367590 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400944835 285407 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm what is that.... < 1400944892 457476 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, no effect. in fact the cursor was already where i had clicked, just invisible. < 1400944923 92988 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400945280 697569 :Sgeo!~quassel@ool-44c2df0c.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :[1,2,3,4,] // DIE IE8 DIE < 1400945731 457264 :erdic!erdic@unaffiliated/motley QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400945741 567814 :trout!root@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1400945873 681355 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Going to see the new X-Men film tonight < 1400946206 890820 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Quit: Computer has gone to sleep. < 1400946355 192070 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1400946365 941879 :Froox!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Read error: No route to host < 1400946368 625727 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400946404 845856 :systemd!nyuszika7h@pdpc/supporter/active/nyuszika7h NICK :sign < 1400946464 277869 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1400946533 557037 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, oh, what a coincidence, so am i < 1400946622 460886 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, it would be amusing if by some bizarre coincidence we ended up sitting next to eachother < 1400946623 667855 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1400946630 627445 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The bizarre coincidence would be more amusing < 1400946640 551499 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt you would travel to York to watch a movie < 1400946655 194968 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i can't see why anyone would travel to leamington spa, ever < 1400946701 977739 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where even is that < 1400946717 857193 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty much glued to warwick the town < 1400946740 115915 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the glue is some weird clay with healing properties, clearly > 1400947106 981397 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947111 63891 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947111 571844 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947132 99702 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947136 171951 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947136 680300 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400947140 969959 :glogbot!dlopen@libdl.so JOIN :#esoteric < 1400947146 4445 :kornbluth.freenode.net NOTICE #esoteric :[freenode-info] help freenode weed out clonebots -- please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup < 1400947236 896495 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murdoch_Mysteries < 1400947236 898391 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Clearly the same person < 1400947236 898458 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly JOIN :#esoteric < 1400947236 898484 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :OKAY < 1400947248 704063 :erdic!erdic@unaffiliated/motley JOIN :#esoteric < 1400947283 402636 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :his death 60 years earlier was clearly faked > 1400947492 622159 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947496 691719 JOIN :#esoteric > 1400947497 200783 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400947509 92275 :glogbot!dlopen@64.62.173.65 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400947531 456333 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :glogbot: STAY PUT < 1400947634 56238 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not like anyone posted any 40 line rant about the sorry apathy in the European Parliament in the 12 seconds glogbot was absent < 1400947812 403553 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style europarl < 1400947812 460564 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Selected style: europarl (European Parliament speeches during approx. 1996-2006) < 1400947821 202715 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: i think you have a job to do < 1400947822 695671 :fungot!fis@eos.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: six questions have been received. in view of such negligence, we are going to vote tomorrow on a cursory text. the proposal put forward and the conditions in which the fnord world, in east asia opens up an appalling vista. this is also a fellow countryman. there is extremely wide agreement in the committee before on mr cassidy's report linking the need for our proposals to a very low sulphur content, unlike mediterranea < 1400947859 8972 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first two sentences are nice < 1400947875 626202 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know that europarl was also infested by that f-word though < 1400947899 881143 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a brainfuck JIT, it works with Hello world and a few other simple examples, but it seems to be crapping itself with longer programs, like bottles to the wall < 1400947971 397643 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyone wanna take a look? < 1400947984 785707 :idris-bot!~ircslave@dslb-092-072-175-242.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Quit: Terminated < 1400947999 363016 :idris-bot!~ircslave@dslb-092-072-175-242.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400948002 504129 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :99 bottles of Segmentation fault (core dumped) < 1400948046 275352 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :our jit expert never seems to be active these days. < 1400948114 258085 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be curious what the code looks like but I'm not optimistic about actually spotting bugs. < 1400948144 745228 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: who would that be? < 1400948162 262756 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be Gregor < 1400948179 955189 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, making a jit for IOCCC makes you an expert, right? < 1400948203 43266 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that and winning < 1400948214 128222 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to someone who has never made a jit at all, certainly :) < 1400948250 529393 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tsk tsk < 1400948255 169911 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm an expert in all hackery things. < 1400948262 876615 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: Is the koth hill still active? < 1400948274 798571 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I submitted something days ago but I havent received any feedback < 1400948364 165235 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: how can you be idle for 4 days and still see pings < 1400948369 730282 :impomatic!~digital_w@43.16.208.46.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: definitely still active. You need to submit the program in the body of the email and ensure the email is plain text. < 1400948389 554420 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Just because I'm not chatting on IRC doesn't mean I'm not online. < 1400948396 123535 :impomatic!~digital_w@43.16.208.46.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: also, there's the SAL hills which have a beginner hill. < 1400948410 652674 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: also, i'm still grieving for HackEgo's lack of log search ;_; < 1400948414 545733 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. hm. < 1400948425 380848 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might be the case that Outlook Web App prefers sending html :) < 1400948436 913491 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, MY CHANNEL MEMORY IS GOING, I CAN FEEL IT < 1400948541 776390 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: anyway M28 needs code review for his buggy bf jit twh < 1400948562 494959 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :gimme a sec, fixing a bug with getchar < 1400948643 329118 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead JOIN :#esoteric < 1400948644 759170 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also don't like that you removed the log access from HackEgo. When will you fix that? < 1400948760 635067 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(now Gregor remembers why he never speaks on the channel any more) < 1400948784 606726 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. < 1400948825 412367 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor: are you an internet expert, too? < 1400948836 426050 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric : I'm an expert in all hackery things. < 1400948875 800798 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, you aren't dead and your last name isn't Jong-il, right? < 1400948894 441518 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :No comment. < 1400948905 656847 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor never said that he invented the Internet, as far as I know. < 1400948967 339384 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will you install SQLite on HackEgo? < 1400948967 601023 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i find it _somewhat_ unlikely that kim jong-il said that. < 1400948984 393614 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :if only because north korea doesn't have internet < 1400948993 799176 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :He's claimed to be "an internet expert too" < 1400948997 796208 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.foxnews.com/story/2007/10/05/north-korea-kim-jong-il-im-internet-expert/ < 1400949003 777426 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :...according to Fox news, I notice < 1400949007 332473 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1400949013 109199 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :`sqlite3 < 1400949013 576977 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: sqlite3: not found < 1400949019 81833 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :... hm. < 1400949031 353213 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: They have internet? < 1400949050 900987 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://puu.sh/8ZgV6/e9826ca5cb.png < 1400949052 787387 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ops < 1400949056 741187 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just recently read in a paper that they have a handful (<5) PCs with internet connection < 1400949057 172962 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong key < 1400949057 880855 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1400949063 199952 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://puu.sh/8ZgVX/48c18d9d9f.txt < 1400949069 346294 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least plan to have them. Can't remember exactly :( < 1400949072 575760 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's C++ < 1400949078 977751 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: still, he probably didn't claim to invent it. < 1400949084 804849 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :`sqlite3 < 1400949090 419281 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"," is broken for whatever reason < 1400949115 372446 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :SQLite version 3.7.13 2012-06-11 02:05:22 \ Enter ".help" for instructions \ Enter SQL statements terminated with a ";" \ sqlite> < 1400949124 467516 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ^^^ < 1400949127 799703 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I read that some of the .kp domains now point to servers in north korea < 1400949131 951673 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, it works now < 1400949135 811977 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas earlier they were hosted in Germany IIRC < 1400949201 55383 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :excellent, Gregor is also our local C++ expert < 1400949221 808873 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: what about programs that contain more than 127 < or > signs in a row? < 1400949232 480899 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, no one actually cares >_> < 1400949240 463433 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1400949254 466482 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should probably split it once it hits 127 < 1400949270 424391 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I don't exactly know x86 machine code by its hex X-D < 1400949282 871616 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pfft < 1400949317 598444 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :We could now use this SQLite to write programs for polls and various other things < 1400949334 654922 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: it's just that this might actually happen if the brainfuck code is generated by some sort of compiler. < 1400949343 315110 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1400949356 431983 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a B to Brainfuck compiler once < 1400949370 425637 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(B is the language that comes before C, really) < 1400949395 379054 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I plan to eventually rewrite the JIT to optimize code generated by the compiler < 1400949402 692590 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any clues whether a stack-based programming language with one Register (stack contains register values, so no stacks of stacks, register are bounded in size) with random read access to the stack could be turing complete or not? < 1400949442 735757 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :is register unbounded? < 1400949449 206496 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :$d < 1400949453 250399 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you even need a register if you have a stack, as long as you can push, pop, add, etc. on the stack < 1400949457 695492 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: the [ case looks wrong: you have to test for zero before the first loop iteration < 1400949477 865318 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, wait what < 1400949487 466801 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a while loop, not a do while loop < 1400949487 815601 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1400949489 849149 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH < 1400949493 514274 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks < 1400949497 935049 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgot about that ;_; < 1400949513 602193 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(an unconditional jump to the ] code will do the trick) < 1400949522 140023 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: is the random read access like in false? < 1400949530 262580 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is looking ahead < 1400949543 735260 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways, thanks < 1400949549 217060 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tell me if you can spot anything wrong in , < 1400949552 250595 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: reserve space for the destination, patch it up in the ] case. < 1400949556 818309 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep < 1400949560 946956 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what I'm gonna do < 1400949561 430782 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: that is not TC because your stack addresses become bounded as well... < 1400949568 485511 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: You can treat the stack as a "tape" for read access < 1400949580 944155 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e you can move around in the stack brainfuck-style with < and > < 1400949598 609385 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are no "addresses" < 1400949601 329356 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :then, I think one could do that, by simulating a queue < 1400949644 749016 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only write access is push/pop/peek < 1400949651 151882 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If the logs would still be on, then we can also copy the logs into SQL format in order to query them by use of SQL queries.) < 1400949653 169986 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: a stack doesn't give you turing-completeness unless the stack cells are unbounded. you get just a pushdown automaton. < 1400949653 784479 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wait < 1400949661 406759 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually just push and peek < 1400949663 509691 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't pop < 1400949709 57329 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can push the register, peek the top of the stack, or read a specific element of the stack < 1400949742 521983 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :(peek and read overwrite the register's contents) < 1400949750 315618 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: what happens with the INT3 in there? < 1400949824 278603 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, it's a break point < 1400949829 130951 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was using it to debug < 1400949837 14810 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't this work: you keep the peek pointer in the "start of queue" and when you dequeue, you just move the ptr one topwards < 1400949868 557800 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :enqueueing could be done with just the push < 1400949879 991457 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would build up a lot of garbage, tho < 1400949899 247995 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/ZcodA1m2 <- that's my sketch so far < 1400949904 984155 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: oh that looks good < 1400949923 850693 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the no-auto-commit-mode < 1400949931 297141 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :in auto-commit mode + - automatically perform a push < 1400949966 710236 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works! < 1400949967 302788 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay < 1400949976 559339 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://puu.sh/8ZhWl/2b2e2efac9.txt < 1400949984 536585 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's able to run 99 bottles of beer to the wall < 1400949989 990551 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's incredibly fast :p < 1400949994 962906 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: now try lostkingdom *cackles evilly* < 1400949999 452628 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I need to fix , < 1400950016 184720 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lo? < 1400950019 577755 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ops < 1400950021 308029 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what?* < 1400950037 605387 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: adventure game compiled to brainfuck < 1400950060 572216 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1400950066 382548 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :need to fix "," first < 1400950089 37570 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly the biggest brainfuck program seriously made < 1400950095 8000 :password2!~password@197.77.35.153 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400950115 125752 :elliott!~elliott@unaffiliated/elliott PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really much of a brainfuck program. < 1400950115 271409 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Anyway, I should be going < 1400950207 508725 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: I don't know what's wrong with the getchar. I'd compile and disassemble a C program that makes a call to getchar and, say, prints the answer. < 1400950226 442622 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a cdecl call < 1400950251 734261 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oh and I have not checked the opcodes) < 1400950274 486259 :newsham!~chat@udp217044uds.hawaiiantel.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :getchar not working? < 1400950275 878991 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have, they're fine < 1400950356 389476 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://puu.sh/8ZikE/4295510bcf.png < 1400950367 125637 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are the first lines of "-,+[-[>>++++[>++++++++<-]<+<-[>+>+>-[>"... < 1400950399 195627 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first 5 instructions is just the start of the JIT code < 1400950469 427759 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait < 1400950470 408841 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1400950472 58345 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it works... < 1400950474 145396 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :welp < 1400950478 188997 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's call it magic < 1400950574 917728 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's run the lost kingdom now < 1400950666 711729 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :msvc crashed < 1400950667 553200 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1400950678 421163 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I tried to save the lost kingdom into the source code < 1400950683 454547 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll just read it from a file < 1400950766 222427 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400950889 213395 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1400950957 451821 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400951008 868473 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works! < 1400951018 639403 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://puu.sh/8Zj1F/96d44324c6.png < 1400951117 847973 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neat < 1400951168 474047 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1400951186 930698 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It looks like some line breaks are omitted in the list of objects in room < 1400951242 568788 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's possible that cmd.exe only recognizes \r\n line brekas < 1400951244 698916 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :breaks* < 1400951250 756635 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's printing \n line breaks < 1400951331 776790 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: is the peek pointer relative to top of stack or to bottom of stack? < 1400951369 584448 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://puu.sh/8Zjq0/ef2f4fa7ea.png < 1400951742 180824 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually from what I could tell, in text mode it will work with just \n and convert to \r\n. Also, I don't think it is related only to cmd.exe; it is part of the Windows command-window environment in general. < 1400951770 466611 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is < 1400951786 934417 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not quite sure though. < 1400952105 478000 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shouldn't putchar('\n') produce \r\n? < 1400952131 329894 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on that platform) < 1400952218 348601 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, yeah I made a wrapper for that < 1400952239 875785 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/Matheus28/BrainJIT/blob/master/src/main.cpp#L15 < 1400952266 992394 :variable!root@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1400952301 775959 :impomatic!~digital_w@43.16.208.46.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: did you try that koth hill again? < 1400952373 663712 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: the lost kingdom *does* contain long runs of > and <. < 1400952395 913734 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I did fix that < 1400952406 186795 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/Matheus28/BrainJIT/blob/master/src/main.cpp#L95 < 1400952449 225024 :shikhin!~shikhin@unaffiliated/shikhin JOIN :#esoteric < 1400952450 765581 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the way < 1400952458 881455 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that thing isn't really written in brainfuck, is it? < 1400952461 91785 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400952481 234475 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I hope someone wrote it in another language, and wrote a compiler to brainfuck for it < 1400952514 114986 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: but something is going wrong: In that hut, all I see is "a small wooden box of matches sitting on the table (2)" < 1400952552 755288 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: iirc it was written in bfbasic < 1400952572 272815 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't see any error, where do you see that? < 1400952613 599758 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :M28: running LostKng.b in a "normal" brainfuck interpreter < 1400952665 492868 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I chose long descriptions there < 1400952673 760794 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one has short descriptions http://puu.sh/8Zjq0/ef2f4fa7ea.png < 1400952681 178890 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the text is reworded < 1400952685 300247 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you using the same version? < 1400952687 768213 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/lk.png < 1400952719 844396 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1400952720 974399 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1400952728 915882 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea, tbh < 1400952763 84471 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :sha1sum says 587dc8ebf682dd78f413ebf599ca0552c1d7bdcc LostKng.b for LostKng.b btw. < 1400952778 643779 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sec < 1400952831 10650 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh < 1400952836 738685 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll take a look at it later < 1400952839 546889 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda tired atm < 1400953035 245707 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic: I did < 1400953047 586529 :yorick!~yorick@oftn/member/yorick QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1400953048 465803 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: relative to the top < 1400953076 110966 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :haven't got an answer though so far < 1400953099 835529 :mroman!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's been more than an hour < 1400953740 54130 :conehead!~conehead@unaffiliated/conehead QUIT :Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com < 1400954414 349538 :hk3380!~test@natvip29.york.ac.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400954694 336420 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : I think there is a Hell in Pennsylvania < 1400954703 317277 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also a town that has been on fire since 1962 < 1400954709 400120 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centralia,_Pennsylvania < 1400954883 268147 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Odd how there is a Reading in Pennsylvania < 1400955477 256505 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that odd < 1400955794 458387 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :code I wrote 2 years ago that has mfence() in various places with no explanation < 1400955797 537112 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :B| < 1400955958 605431 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does it do? < 1400955967 519493 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: thanks. < 1400955996 948131 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/it/the instances of it in the code/ < 1400956219 585179 :hk3380!~test@natvip29.york.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400956326 349363 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: that is the question isn't it < 1400956423 320082 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it stop working if they are removed < 1400956592 900219 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :another fine question < 1400956611 282326 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400956663 584045 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not something I can easily test < 1400956706 984708 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: isn't it a bit dangerous to assume that it is working now? < 1400956790 238779 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400956812 853374 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one reason it's hard to tell if it stops working < 1400957291 702466 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does mosh make a ^G when it reconnects? < 1400957734 786514 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1400957738 6972 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:Meta Turing-complete14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39670&oldid=30910 5* 03GermanyBoy 5* (+202) 10/* ℒ */ < 1400957741 679606 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would it < 1400957761 599110 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/shelajev/status/469735994464690177/photo/1/large so easy < 1400957831 107972 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How well does it work to make a key using a 3D printer? Can it be done if you only have the lock and not the original key? I tried to make a copy of a key in the ordinary way but it did not work; maybe it is a copy of a copy. < 1400957880 187179 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the ordinary way? < 1400957946 430897 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you just mean a tumbler < 1400957947 497114 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :By giving the key to the locksmith and having them use their machine to do it. < 1400957977 335686 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of thet times I've cut keys by hand, I did it by loading a lock with the appropriate pins and then filing away bits of the key until it turns < 1400957988 407054 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :duplicating a key by hand directly from another key is harder < 1400957993 23595 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i've done it < 1400958075 536723 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yeah, key copying machines often do a poor job < 1400958097 483818 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind of key was the one you copies by hand? < 1400958116 581915 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's nothing quite like a lovingly hand-cut key < 1400958165 371725 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're not restricted to the usual key shapes < 1400958185 222952 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can cut a perfectly smooth spline between the control points < 1400958205 407491 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: I don't remember specifically which key I duplicated by hand directly < 1400958302 807896 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42986.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1400958339 499897 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400958361 630976 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly I have hand-made master keys for various buildings and tunnels at Caltech < 1400958391 736988 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :without having another master key to work from < 1400958423 461533 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did you construct those? actually, how do master keys word in general < 1400958428 902711 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :+? < 1400958486 399748 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :jeez the word "tumbler" looks weird with an e < 1400958510 13513 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I don't know why it would but whenever I resume my computer from suspend, and also just now when my Internet connection came back, I hear a bell sound. < 1400958510 461070 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so here's how a pin tumbler lock works: http://i.imgur.com/pEQoB9a.gif < 1400958542 326169 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1400958546 471566 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to learn how to make the key from using only the lock, so that I can try to ensure I have a key that works, rather than the copy that doesn't work. I can't use their key, because it doesn't belong to me; but I am authorized to use the lock. < 1400958550 139492 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a master key system, some of those columns contain 3 or more metal cylinders, so that it can open at 2 or more different heights < 1400958561 623665 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right < 1400958605 300388 :Slereah_!~jackal@176.222.51.233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400958630 95232 :MindlessDrone!~MindlessD@unaffiliated/mindlessdrone QUIT :Quit: MindlessDrone < 1400958637 876121 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can take the lock out of a door, disassemble it (quickly and quietly in the middle of the night in a bathroom or out of the way machine room or something) < 1400958643 790256 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and measure all the bits with calipers < 1400958660 957556 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :do this for a few different locks in the same master domain; compute the unique key which opens all of them < 1400958739 427653 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-072-175-242.pools.arcor-ip.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I’ve seen a key (that I believe is a master key) that has a row of round indentations in the side close to the top edge. < 1400958802 684039 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1400958810 60808 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-072-175-242.pools.arcor-ip.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do those do? < 1400958845 226614 :Slereah!~jackal@176.222.51.233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1400958983 963551 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about those specifically, but there are various high-security key systems that have another coding mechanism besides pin heights < 1400959061 900689 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly I know about the Medeco system, which rotates each pin to one of three angles in addition to lifting it < 1400959064 785105 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://modernlock.com/medeco.jpg < 1400959121 719445 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :this does more than increase the number of combinations by a factor of 6*3 < 1400959126 624803 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes picking much much harder < 1400959175 507432 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :picking depends on getting the lock to a state where there's just one particular part which is prevent it from turning the next little bit < 1400959204 73255 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can't do this when there are multiple orthogonal mechanisms preventing it from turning < 1400959307 407394 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's just hard to manipulate the pin rotations with standard lockpicking tools < 1400959343 653160 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i was never very good at lockpicking, anyway < 1400959372 452614 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and unauthorized medeco keys are not particularly hard to make (claims of the manufacturer notwithstanding) < 1400959415 77165 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :measuring and cutting the rotations is easy, and they must be the same for every key in a master domain < 1400959516 903451 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting, apparently abloy locks are hard to pick (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disc_tumbler_lock) < 1400959607 725102 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :medeco also assigns a different keyway shape to each customer (from some finite set, presumably) and tries to restrict who can buy blanks of which shape < 1400959616 158227 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this is not a very effective measure < 1400959616 417501 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION uses abloy locks
< 1400959639 56302 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can buy blanks from sketchy companies in china that are close enough, and then cut them to fit by hand or using a dremel < 1400959639 903183 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :medeco blank restriction is somewhat effective against casual key-copying < 1400959657 440494 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren't abloy locks kind of universal or is my perspective skewed by me being a fin? < 1400959661 651166 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :+n < 1400959672 330817 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nortti: that's a scandanavian thing; they're much less available worldwide < 1400959674 121911 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the latter < 1400959681 827556 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ic séo < 1400959685 918866 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah douglass_ was telling me about abloy locks; apparently they are very hard to hax < 1400959695 113723 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if you cannot use key cutting tools, would you be able to use 3D printers to duplicate it? Probably you would need more sophisticated 3D models of the key in such a case than ordinary keys, but maybe it can still be used sometimes? I don't know how well it would work at all < 1400959696 707899 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :she has more key-fu than i do < 1400959706 102469 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, I think you can use 3D printers to duplicate keys < 1400959711 9087 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is Medeco a lock vendor? < 1400959713 304011 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1400959715 937213 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :abloy 20/70 is my favourite padlock < 1400959718 151458 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, okay < 1400959752 261849 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: you could also use a 3D printer to do a variation of the master key privilege escalation that doesn't require disassembling any locks < 1400959769 615669 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: you can also copy medeco keys onto plastic sheets easily enough; we used spent gift cards a lot < 1400959812 712518 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have a legit key for some door in the building, you can fabricate a set of ~50 keys to test, and from which ones open the door you can compute the master key < 1400959819 275119 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: haha, that's awesome < 1400959829 947947 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :are those strong enough to turn the tumbler, or do you use it with a tension tool < 1400959851 604025 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: you can turn the tumbler with them < 1400959861 584653 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're very limited-use though, only opens a lock 3-4 times < 1400959867 669222 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1400959909 373785 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah keyway doesn't matter when you can just force the plastic in and it conforms :p < 1400959918 11791 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :However, what I am trying to do isn't duplicate a key (since I tried it and it didn't work). I wonder if I can make a working key from only the lock (without breaking, disassembling, or uninstalling it). I tried to copy a working key but the copy didn't work; maybe it is a copy of a copy, or something like that? I don't really know why it doesn't work. < 1400959968 693656 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: so it depends how you copy a key: If you're using a key cutter that follows an existing one, you definitely lose fidelity < 1400959984 569689 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: the advantage of cutting from another lock loaded with the right pins is that it quantizes the heights to the 10 or so official heights < 1400959995 744462 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :+/- variation in the pins and other components, of course < 1400960001 514978 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this prevents the copy-of-a-copy problem < 1400960028 590130 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are key duplicating machines that will cut by code rather than just following the profile of an existing key < 1400960040 563159 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.ricklab.com/keymart/images/ta_lkgks.jpg < 1400960049 996442 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can get a thing like this and use it to read out the code for the key < 1400960054 473024 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1400960068 805459 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"kwikset" is a hilarious name for a brand of locks :3 < 1400960080 144516 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then if you have a CNC mill (who doesn't), you can easily CNC a new key perfectly < 1400960084 359660 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: have you seen https://keysduplicated.com/ < 1400960090 61564 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I think they use a CNC mill < 1400960105 510841 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: haha yeah, I was considering writing an open source version < 1400960112 614258 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have a HTTP API for ordering keys o_O < 1400960143 510807 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least for kwikset keys since that's what I'm most familiar with < 1400960175 7408 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait ... they collect key profiles together with addresses? what could possibly go wrong?! < 1400960188 988953 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where would you go to get them to cut by code? < 1400960198 635505 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I'm not sure < 1400960200 440634 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: most lock smiths should be able to do that < 1400960205 98506 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :become a locksmith? < 1400960211 988296 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :like a real lock smith, not a teenager in the corner of a hardware store < 1400960215 744298 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably a locksmith or a lock supply shop can at least tell you where to go < 1400960229 858627 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cna probably order them on the internet < 1400960238 230178 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :silk road < 1400960273 405050 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could write a program that generates a picture of the key and uploads it to keysduplicated.com ;P < 1400960275 313666 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: they could deliver the keys to your table < 1400960291 627538 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or if you're feeling like a lot of tedium, you could file the key yourself. < 1400960299 837129 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: that does sound convenient. < 1400960310 79167 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not *easy*, but you can just take a file to a key blank. < 1400960319 772944 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I was espousing the virtues of that approach before < 1400960326 786240 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: Yes, interesting idea, if you have a good 3D rendering software!! < 1400960328 80406 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:01 < kmc> there's nothing quite like a lovingly hand-cut key < 1400960331 328245 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:02 < kmc> you're not restricted to the usual key shapes < 1400960334 178735 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :12:03 < kmc> you can cut a perfectly smooth spline between the control points < 1400960347 203273 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: hmmmm interesting point < 1400960367 281019 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: :) < 1400960380 172951 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a lot of social infrastructure at my school for encouraging frosh to do this kind of thing and teaching them how < 1400960438 536075 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should get a key gauge and some blanks < 1400960444 240548 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :make myself some bespoke keys :p < 1400960452 628863 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :even better, take pics of somebody else's keys and have them delivered to your home < 1400960454 119706 :hk3380!~test@natvip29.york.ac.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400960521 557853 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :the terms of service are cute. "You may only use this service to copy keys that you are authorized to copy." and "You may not use this service as a locksmithing service, and agree to use Shloosl only to duplicate existing keys." < 1400960535 893725 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a rule that you shouldn't cut keys from data you haven't measured yourself, even though you could get it from someone else < 1400960549 188555 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in order to keep alive the skills of obtaining said data < 1400960640 996583 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm kinda tempted to buy a http://www.amazon.com/Lab-LKG001-5-N-1-Key-Gauge/dp/B000ZHB31I < 1400960709 340139 :nortti!nortti@nano.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGXTF6bs1IU < 1400960723 38009 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was also a kind of secret society / occult knowlegde thing < 1400960740 99124 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :keegan of 2005 would be aghast that I am telling you all of this stuff < 1400960760 453332 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: key copying is secret society stuff? lolwut < 1400960777 168435 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I guess for anybody who hasn't been to maker faire or defcon or ... < 1400960787 301659 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or hung out with hardware store employees....) < 1400960800 139850 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaiu locksmiths are still unhappy about books being published about lockpicking < 1400960822 355724 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pfft, that cat is long out of the bag < 1400960832 205801 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :mcpherrin: that was the culture at my university < 1400960862 136488 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was one house which did most of the key hacking and tried to keep stuff secret from non-members < 1400960882 306160 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the general principles of lockpicking etc. are easy enough to find online < 1400960891 631340 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but things like details of how to make suitable medeco blanks, or that this could even be done < 1400960897 312851 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: heh, we did the oppsite in univeristy < 1400960898 14411 :not^v!~notnot^v@2601:4:4500:887:cd30:c743:fdd1:10ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1400960905 625628 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :flyer bombed campus with instructions on how to do things < 1400960910 489661 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :make sure everybody knows! < 1400960912 338624 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think at the time, Medeco claimed it was impossible, and there wasn't so much information online as now) < 1400960915 248859 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1400960917 788980 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's awesome < 1400960960 94056 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the people who were taking and manufacturing illegal drugs were a lot less discreet than the people making keys :P < 1400960979 486590 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the time, campus security didn't really give a shit about the former < 1400960981 824672 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :we had a "student newspaper" < 1400960997 194974 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was us sneaking into photocopy rooms and making an issue < 1400961012 847407 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :samizdat, good < 1400961029 952030 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes exactly < 1400961032 153536 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400961038 695890 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm always up for some good samizday < 1400961042 313651 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm always up for some good samizdat < 1400961072 790296 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey mcpherrin you should write something like http://subterfugue.org/ but for Linux 3.x and in Rust < 1400961097 363001 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man7/rtld-audit.7.html is another fun way to screw with programs < 1400961162 827231 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the thing that ais made for nethack TASes again? < 1400961186 239344 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@google nethack tas tools < 1400961187 78941 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://gitorious.org/nethack-tas-tools < 1400961220 722662 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I'm thinking of something else < 1400961410 293532 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to go buy new bike shoeees < 1400961468 419722 :hk3380!~test@natvip29.york.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400961705 738570 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do bikes need shoes < 1400961718 906099 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you mean tires < 1400961753 502918 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I mean shoes for me to wear while on a bike < 1400961899 682789 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::3 < 1400961917 894505 :mcpherrin!~mcpherrin@c-50-185-88-3.hsd1.ca.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :though tires are like shoes for a bike < 1400962016 163530 :password2!~password@197.77.35.153 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400962243 210841 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if you put on tires on the bike, does it get tired? < 1400962297 870516 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd be getting tyred in British English, hth. < 1400962371 973383 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-072-175-242.pools.arcor-ip.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn’t Tyre a place in Lebanon? < 1400962409 484930 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what Wikipedia just told me. < 1400963357 947141 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400964367 182515 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39671&oldid=39665 5* 03Icepy 5* (+3) 10 < 1400964393 585009 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39672&oldid=39671 5* 03Icepy 5* (+17) 10 < 1400964759 657893 :clog!~nef@bespin.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400965338 605754 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400965419 558286 :MoALTz!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1400965430 222721 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1400965525 99068 :MoALTz_!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400965537 903598 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1400965592 508820 :MoALTz__!~no@user-5-173-28-196.play-internet.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1400965704 853450 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400965794 310197 :not^v!~notnot^v@2601:4:4500:887:cd30:c743:fdd1:10ca QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1400966147 69808 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39673&oldid=39672 5* 03Icepy 5* (+838) 10 < 1400966198 283556 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A42986.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1400966731 164094 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39674&oldid=39673 5* 03Icepy 5* (+25) 10 < 1400967067 145915 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39675&oldid=39674 5* 03Icepy 5* (+40) 10 < 1400967145 265051 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I tried to think of ways to make a better lock just now. < 1400967181 321112 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought, what if each key had to be in a specific shape that encodes some data, and then the lock just works by mechanically reading off the data from the key such that it can only turn if the data is correct? < 1400967183 391700 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :just throw bricks at anyone with a lockpick < 1400967193 465218 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Course, that's what a cylinder lock is. < 1400967211 894678 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or throw bricks at anyone with a brick, since they could use the brick to break a window. < 1400967250 49838 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The great thing about throwing bricks at people who have bricks is that they're likely to throw bricks at you, making it impossible for them to use those bricks to break windows. < 1400967271 323950 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are the known non-brute-force methods of attacking a cylinder lock? Picking and bumping? Are there others? < 1400967381 124442 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on what level of nested wheres does haskell starting to get ugly? < 1400967391 281756 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rephrase readably plz < 1400967393 337441 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400967404 329711 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :On what level of nested wheres does Haskell start to get ugly? < 1400967404 599904 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :douglass_: you may know the answer to What are the known non-brute-force methods of attacking a cylinder lock? Picking and bumping? Are there others? < 1400967415 419729 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 PRIVMSG #esoteric :impressioning < 1400967418 617734 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wrong < 1400967428 55431 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.lockwiki.com/index.php/Impressioning#Manipulation-based_Impressioning < 1400967464 769663 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: mho: the maximum indentation level is six stops, assuming each stop is four columns. < 1400967469 329554 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if you fill the lock with a magnetic fluid and manipulate it magneticallly until it opens, then freeze the liquid?? < 1400967471 964407 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: amusingly, attacking a lock with "brute force" could mean two different things < 1400967479 990169 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: hm, true. < 1400967481 974873 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you don't mean enumerating all the keys < 1400967492 224008 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could let the key melt later, so, the perfect crime < 1400967494 809887 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, I mean actual brutish force. < 1400967501 878547 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you have a legit non-master key, you can do a tractable enumeration to get the master key < 1400967504 826456 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :as I described above < 1400967514 521475 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had better luck with it than bumping, but never got it to work on more than 4 pins. Though maybe this, like bumping, is a method that works better with well-made locks, and my practice lock was shit. < 1400967549 540402 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I enjoyed the movie < 1400967569 829917 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I have a fantasy of a device with an electrical probe that uses time-domain reflectometry to measure pins without removing or disassembling the lock < 1400967574 958383 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know if this is practical < 1400967583 895532 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what movie? < 1400967585 220225 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: I liked the idea of looking at keys of several locks that have the same master key < 1400967612 465843 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: that works sometimes, yeah < 1400967624 76769 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike, the new X-Men film < 1400967624 908458 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: the new X-Men film < 1400967631 203574 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you have to make some assumptions about how the master keying is done, which don't always hold < 1400967639 114979 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There should be a law stating that trespassing is legal if you do it in a sufficiently clever and interesting way. < 1400967653 309122 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: fun fact, most shapes that will open a lock aren't easily removable from it afterwards < 1400967665 824829 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oooh. < 1400967681 501294 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :countering my attack before i thought of it. very clever, locksmiths < 1400967688 332884 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should acquire a lock and try to pick it < 1400967695 388899 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot to smooth out a key I made once. It resulted in an awkward situation. < 1400967718 837229 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: it already works that way; if you get caught you were not "clever" enough. < 1400967742 61400 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this reminds me that i don't understand the lock my car uses. the key is a flat bar with a curvy depression down the middle < 1400967750 933094 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: oh yeah. < 1400967770 410494 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno. You should be able to call off the investigation by filing a report. < 1400967788 260383 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: you can also imagine noninvasive imaging of the lock, but I'm not sure what kind will work < 1400967796 599429 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bike: Oh, an internal cut key. Neat. < 1400967832 146281 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yes that seems to be it < 1400967841 426650 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39676&oldid=39675 5* 03Icepy 5* (+192) 10 < 1400967855 105374 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The mechanism is pretty mundane on those, I'm pretty sure. < 1400967875 117004 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the housing will block x-rays < 1400967903 903177 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's metal so MRI is no good < 1400967907 965978 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe ultrasound < 1400967943 396472 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39677&oldid=39676 5* 03Icepy 5* (-6) 10 < 1400967962 371759 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make some sort of electrical wave inside a conductive material, right? < 1400967972 8630 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, obviously you can transmit signals through wires. < 1400967973 647978 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39678&oldid=39677 5* 03Icepy 5* (+6) 10 < 1400967980 273876 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it mostly wants to go on the surface < 1400967982 159761 :douglass_!~iridium@18.9.64.16 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1400967992 853990 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that the skin effect? < 1400968014 909987 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could put a radioactive substance inside the keyway, or bombard the lock with neutrons until it's radioactive < 1400968049 583993 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Place a neutrino source on one side of the lock and a neutrino detector on the other side. < 1400968052 731802 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1400968072 953431 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39679&oldid=39678 5* 03Icepy 5* (+48) 10 < 1400968092 314852 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have a neutrino source and detector of nontrivial power then I think that lockpicking is the least of your priorities. < 1400968102 994055 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could vibrate a pin up and down very quickly and maybe measure something < 1400968196 959749 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq probably doesn't like my plan to train a slime mold to climb in and then climb out and reproduce the shape, either < 1400968214 453751 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: I imagine that the key lifts pins by some sort of hook that moves along the internal cut. < 1400968216 893976 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, here's an idea. < 1400968231 445412 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fill the lock with some sort of gel that sets permanently but remains soft. < 1400968248 840466 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :After the gel sets, pull it out, and it'll return to the shape of the air spaces inside the lock. < 1400968286 767148 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39680&oldid=39679 5* 03Icepy 5* (-225) 10 < 1400968300 364582 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You know, it must be possible, in theory, to create a "sound camera" that creates an image of where sound is coming from. < 1400968328 221764 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or my other plan to determine the initial condition of the universal wavefunction by observing cosmic background, and then use this to determine the history of the universe up to the point where the lock is being made < 1400968349 481806 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Frsrs, ultrasound. < 1400968416 347082 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or my other other plan to take over ZEVS in a daring military operation, and carefully measure the distortion of ELF waves through the lock < 1400968440 558428 :clog!~nef@bespin.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1400968470 269549 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's ignore noninvasive imagining for the moment; that's boring. So, locks can be defeated by picking. Use the behavior of the lock to measure the code one pin at a time. < 1400968511 530603 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you could make it so that the cylinder turns as long as the pins are in a valid position, but it doesn't turn all the way unless they're all in the correct position. < 1400968513 567209 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: if you have access to both sides of the lock, somehow I think picking it is a bit redundant < 1400968549 952797 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: not necessarily. I can access both the north side of a building and the south side of a building without being able to access the interior. < 1400968575 494577 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, true < 1400968597 507542 :mhi^!~mhi@unaffiliated/mhi/x-9993184 QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1400968644 382274 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39681&oldid=39680 5* 03Icepy 5* (+47) 10 < 1400968843 97324 :mhi^!~mhi@unaffiliated/mhi/x-9993184 JOIN :#esoteric < 1400969107 952019 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how the ear behaves as a demultiplexer. < 1400969144 503641 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The brain can't handle signals with a bandwidth higher than 100 Hz or so, so it takes this 20,000 Hz signal and transforms it into a whole bunch of narrower signals. < 1400969193 848622 :ion!ion@heh.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/demultiplexer/Fourier transform/ < 1400969230 968348 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't say it behaves as a Fourier transform. It doesn't completely take audio from the time domain to the frequency domain. < 1400969251 588407 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it did, we'd only ever hear one sound, but we'd know its frequency components exquisitely well. < 1400969393 692041 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can definitely demultiplex, though. You can, to a degree, listen to multiple simultaneous sounds and make them all out. < 1400969999 138680 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb < 1400970052 503910 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1400970326 365393 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39682&oldid=39681 5* 03Icepy 5* (-145) 10 < 1400970433 676052 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i like how the ear reduces the frequency using a bunch of bones sitting in goop < 1400970546 990522 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, fixed that bug < 1400970553 301538 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, damn it was a hard bug < 1400970557 826414 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to spot, not to fix < 1400970558 847991 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb < 1400970570 25003 :M28!~M28@unaffiliated/m28 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had typod 0x82, instead of 0x80 in part of the asm code < 1400970602 207882 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. A mechanical demultiplexer. < 1400970619 144074 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does stuff that operates mechanically on sound waves still count as "mechanical"? < 1400970639 483325 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, a whistle produces sound "mechanically", right? < 1400970643 709287 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1400970719 989152 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :considering there are no moving parts... < 1400970751 603242 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if the word isn't "mechanical", then what is it? < 1400970765 675193 :Bike!~Glossina@67-5-251-179.ptld.qwest.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you trying to oppose it to? < 1400970783 353966 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, as opposed to something without moving parts. < 1400970801 624014 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, say, a maraca definitely produces sound "mechanically". Stuff hits other stuff, making noise. < 1400970839 267623 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A whistle doesn't have moving parts; it's a resonant chamber along with an amplifier that operates fluidically. < 1400970845 552651 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's the word I want. Fluidically. < 1400970846 660850 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39683&oldid=39682 5* 03Icepy 5* (+268) 10 < 1400970877 873655 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39684&oldid=39683 5* 03Icepy 5* (+22) 10 < 1400970887 794443 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The ear isn't a "proper" Fourier transform, but it is implementing an approximation of a Fourier-related transform being used in a very similar way to its use in audio compression. < 1400970941 536387 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's almost like the human ear was designed not to notice MP3 compression artifacts. < 1400970947 618936 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1400970998 109820 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1400971016 94952 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400971024 644778 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have multiple copies of a picture or audio with different watermarks, can you then detect them and tamper with them? < 1400971068 575211 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1400971178 699047 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The clock without moving parts is sundial (including digital sundials). < 1400971209 135104 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, could you make a computer that operates using sound waves? < 1400971211 609659 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, do you know which timepiece has the most number of moving parts? < 1400971226 205525 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I don't know. < 1400971239 702704 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: nice question < 1400971246 755364 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: some clock tower? < 1400971250 715686 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or... < 1400971269 421693 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see someone arguing that the timepiece with the greatest number of moving parts is the night sky. < 1400971291 984409 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I suppose someone can argue that, but it isn't what I meant. < 1400971329 346629 :tswett__!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400971351 55680 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :think low tech < 1400971351 138606 :tswett__!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sound waves mostly interact linearly. There are definitely ways of doing non-linear things, though. < 1400971356 963443 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39685&oldid=39684 5* 03Icepy 5* (+158) 10 < 1400971493 102520 :tswett__!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The easiest logic gate to implement should be the buffer. Outputs 1 upon receiving 1; outputs 0 upon receiving 0. Amplifies the signal and doesn't pass it in the wrong direction. < 1400971521 245766 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: but which of those has the most parts? the one in a museum in Nima perhaps? < 1400971528 94825 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1400971528 658070 :tswett__!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net NICK :tswett < 1400971542 34967 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I don't know that either. < 1400971570 417755 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb < 1400971626 29919 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39686&oldid=39685 5* 03Icepy 5* (-13) 10 < 1400971706 716299 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39687&oldid=39686 5* 03Icepy 5* (+22) 10 < 1400971757 210440 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@S010674440130be65.cg.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400971767 404506 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@S010674440130be65.cg.shawcable.net QUIT :Changing host < 1400971767 514979 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1400971772 706289 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: isn't that made by putting two inverters in a row? < 1400971788 165098 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: it can be. < 1400971824 669037 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making an inverter sounds tough. Make a device that produces sound if and only if it is not receiving sound. < 1400971862 536898 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you could use destructive interference. < 1400971959 358610 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :In theory, you could just use a device that always produces sound of the relevant frequency. Stick that together with your input line, and it should just work, as long as everything is of the right length and whatnot. < 1400971992 298964 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1400972012 915356 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you have to make the device output sound of the right phase, too. < 1400972054 417451 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you could just make some sort of non-linear one-directional amplifier, I think you ought to be able to make everything else. < 1400972156 866410 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1400972200 685308 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1400972220 19101 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd think inverting sound would be easy. < 1400972241 490676 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDude: how would you do it? < 1400972244 798399 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just swich the coils on the speaker around, and it'll push whne it'd otherwise pull and vise-versa. < 1400972249 197572 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1400972257 347773 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*when < 1400972266 65416 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now do that without any wires. < 1400972309 42663 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd think it'd involve something with the hardware. < 1400972353 13352 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a transformer or something. < 1400972354 150250 :Patashu_!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1400972367 154470 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1400972419 3422 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to make something in circuit simulator, but first dinner. < 1400972420 909681 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39688&oldid=39687 5* 03Icepy 5* (-56) 10 < 1400972482 744511 :edwardk!~edwardk@pdpc/supporter/professional/edwardk JOIN :#esoteric < 1400972572 611648 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The software "Astrolog" includes some nice features, such as the "timed exposure" feature, and the ability to overlay constellations on the world map; however, this is unfortunately not Free Software. (However, GPL ephemeris software does exist.) < 1400972633 994874 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb < 1400972662 223454 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@S010674440130be65.cg.shawcable.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1400972667 336232 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@S010674440130be65.cg.shawcable.net QUIT :Changing host < 1400972667 393508 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1400972785 702821 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that one should have about 40 billion moving parts. :) < 1400972797 8482 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the one in Nima) < 1400972808 321445 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't been at Nima < 1400972860 769926 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither have I < 1400972933 607351 :shikhout!~shikhin@unaffiliated/shikhin JOIN :#esoteric < 1400973044 288043 :nooodl_!~nooodl@207.169-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1400973071 995379 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atomic_clock is another fun candidate (I read as far as "atomic fountain") < 1400973117 312241 :shikhin!~shikhin@unaffiliated/shikhin QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1400973130 717721 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then we need to discuss moving electrons in the next step, which makes things a bit silly. < 1400973134 966068 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do something like: INSERT INTO WINDOW(TITLE,CONTENT) SELECT 'Horoscope',COMPUTE_HOROSCOPE(ID,GLYPH,JULIANDAY('now'),GET_GEOLOCATION()) FROM PLANETS; < 1400973172 684119 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why are you capitalizing identifiers? < 1400973209 206504 :nooodl!~nooodl@72.153-241-81.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1400973218 594761 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just like to do that. You can also put the identifiers in "..." if you prefer. < 1400973276 355287 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :insert into "WINDOW"("TITLE","CONTENT") select 'Horoscope',"COMPUTE_HOROSCOPE"("ID","GLYPH","JULIANDAY"('now'),"GET_GEOLOCATION"()) from "PLANETS"; < 1400973318 996406 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-51-179.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are also case-insensitive, so you can use any combinations of uppercase/lowercase letters. < 1400973368 165087 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :THERE SHOULD BE A stereotype THAT computer programmers put emphasis ON ALL non-content words IN THEIR speech. < 1400973509 585159 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is RECOMMENDED that programmers follow RFC 2119 in their everyday speech < 1400973564 593720 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :My "recommendation" is that all "programmers" "put" all "content" "words" inside of "double" "quotation" "marks". < 1400973830 830865 :pikhq!~pikhq@2602:100:18b2:fbfb:a60:6eff:fece:493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :77 DECLARATION VALUE IS "It is my belief that all programmers should use syntactically valid COBOL". < 1400974296 467555 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : what's the thing that ais made for nethack TASes again? <-- web o' flies? < 1400974296 738252 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, so the sound needs to be transformed mechanically. < 1400974342 12705 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the medium otherwise? Taunt wire, like in a tin can phone? < 1400974393 283479 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39689&oldid=39688 5* 03Icepy 5* (+89) 10 < 1400974423 414824 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39690&oldid=39647 5* 03Icepy 5* (+15) 10/* Non-alphabetic */ < 1400974428 710986 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell kmc what's the thing that ais made for nethack TASes again? <-- web o' flies? < 1400974428 906624 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1400974445 507932 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39691&oldid=39663 5* 03Icepy 5* (-52) 10 < 1400974497 650296 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39692&oldid=39690 5* 03Icepy 5* (+0) 10 < 1400974594 409861 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07User:Icepy14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39693&oldid=39657 5* 03Icepy 5* (+77) 10 < 1400974644 829542 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If that's the case, you might be able to use a mechanical gate like what would be used with rod logic, it'd just have to be sensitive to small/low torque motions. < 1400974747 395519 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39694&oldid=39689 5* 03Icepy 5* (+0) 10 < 1400974773 782575 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39695&oldid=39694 5* 03Icepy 5* (+0) 10 < 1400974782 596521 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've tried looking up mechanical amplifierd before, and the best I came up with in terms of analog equipment was something that worked using belts. < 1400974837 668737 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Everyone should speak in Haskell string literals." < 1400974848 462746 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDude: I was thinking tubes or something. < 1400974877 625649 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about... Tube ON Belts < 1400974884 260031 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should sleep < 1400974906 172881 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A fluedic transistor I've heard about apparently worked well, but it also seemed inheriently digital.' < 1400974916 565141 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean by "digital"? < 1400974936 645653 :tswett!~tswett@c-107-5-152-253.hsd1.mi.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Digital logic is what I'm trying to implement here. < 1400974991 790823 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean it was set up so that the power being fed into it would go out one of two outputs. < 1400975059 799708 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was for warer, actually, and relied on vorticies forming into the device. < 1400975089 584787 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to look it up, the image explains nicely. < 1400975149 991559 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it's right on the Wikipedia page for fluedics: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluidics < 1400975189 402479 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Basically, a pre-existing vortex in the system will perpetuate itself if power is supplied. < 1400975227 852441 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Place a neutrino source on one side of the lock and a neutrino detector on the other side. <-- i think you might just possibly be confusing neutrons and neutrinos there < 1400975266 466901 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's the one < 1400975275 763234 :kmc!~keegan@ec2-50-17-127-187.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages < 1400975293 112272 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that seems to presume one-directional flow, wheras sound would alternate. < 1400975335 462431 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but it's funnier with neutrinos < 1400975343 791489 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: tru dat. < 1400975355 846413 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno about making a fluedic rectifier. < 1400975387 840560 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd need really sensitive check valves, I guess? < 1400975414 5217 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless you're going for high amplitude subsonic waves. < 1400975424 66442 :MDude!~fyrc@or-67-238-17-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :In which case regular check valves. < 1400975449 422944 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : pikhq probably doesn't like my plan to train a slime mold to climb in and then climb out and reproduce the shape, either <-- i don't see how anyone could possibly not love that hth < 1400975611 8563 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it also reminded me of this: http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2014-03-23 < 1400975788 218488 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[075command14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=39696&oldid=39695 5* 03Icepy 5* (+48) 10