< 1432598427 577157 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is 78.245.243.132? < 1432598436 49084 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolangs.zem.fi is a temporary domain name fizzie set up < 1432598506 577490 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it's Koen < 1432598544 341820 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does he manage to use an IP which doesn't exist... < 1432598686 879547 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :who's Koen in IRC? < 1432598688 176944 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell fizzie whatever you did to make esolangs.zem.fi work has made esolangs.org partly broken < 1432598688 362645 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1432598701 317332 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: Koen_ usually, but he's not always here < 1432598725 187437 :hilquias!~user@unaffiliated/hilquias QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1432598734 763450 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :confusingly, Koen without _ is someone else iirc < 1432598792 566915 :ZombieAlive!~N3cr0naV@unaffiliated/zombiealive JOIN :#esoteric < 1432598841 711482 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell fizzie e.g. https://esolangs.org/wiki/Special:RecentChanges has stylesheet links mentioning //esolangs.zem.fi/ < 1432598841 896716 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1432598872 352095 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07User:Lesidhetree14]]4 N10 02http://esolangs.zem.fi/w/index.php?oldid=43049 5* 03Lesidhetree 5* (+79) 10Little crappy intro < 1432599441 990211 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :Simplest "Cat" Program I can think of, terminating on Ctrl-@ (aka NUL): !A000SIB1[01_SOB1SIB1]01_Q000@ < 1432599655 177189 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think equivalent to void main(){char a=0,b; b=getc(); while(a != b){ putc(b) ; getc(b); } } < 1432599671 777639 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :assuming i used getc() and putc() right < 1432599692 755265 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean < 1432599705 949072 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :void main(){char a=0,b; b=getc(); while(a != b){ putc(b) ; b=getc(); } } < 1432599768 331889 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :is a bowl of ice cubes a good heat sink? < 1432599870 846330 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:Fourfuck14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.zem.fi/w/index.php?diff=43050&oldid=43048 5* 03Lesidhetree 5* (+176) 10added a little disclaimer < 1432599894 470921 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're trying to charge an old laptop without overheating it < 1432599894 656125 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1432599915 776202 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: int main() < 1432599921 935562 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops < 1432599939 284978 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :int main(){char a=0,b; b=getc(); while(a != b){ putc(b) ; b=getc(); } return 0;} < 1432600025 727454 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Z < 1432600156 629557 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I have a metal bowl filled with ice cubes on top of the charger brick < 1432600306 131819 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you guess what this does? ![00=]00=Q000@ < 1432600334 232826 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :loops infinitly? < 1432600344 757986 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it that obvious? < 1432600375 768720 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you guess what this does? ![00=SIB1SOB1]00=Q000@ < 1432600379 500116 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well [00= means while(c1 == c1) < 1432600385 370202 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :er c0 < 1432600395 50113 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :c[0] < 1432600399 921265 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1432600413 726988 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a cat program < 1432600431 222848 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :that runs forever < 1432600445 153620 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(From my working memory of your language's spec) < 1432600478 105098 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98841263/fourfuck%20language/Fourfuck%20v0.0-pre_alpha-0003b.pdf < 1432600510 231689 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have that in front of me < 1432600610 282589 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :it an now run commands stored in memory < 1432600617 747197 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :*can now < 1432600712 83670 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :though i have not yet debugged it < 1432601079 485413 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :!A000A101A20DSIB2[02_SIB3SOB3+010]02_Q000@Hello, World! < 1432601089 987319 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that cheating? < 1432601459 422390 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :!A000T0D0A000T3D0Q000@Hello, World! < 1432601816 300087 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine... !A048A165A26cA36cA46fA52cA620A757A86fA972AA6cAB64AC21AD00AE01AF0D[DF /047%746+366SOB6 |000 }000 %046+366SOB6 P0A0 +010]03< Q000 @ < 1432609109 256855 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: URIs are fairly simple to parse and quite well supported. (though for identifying properties a URN might be more appropriate) < 1432609118 976821 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: So yes, that overall makes sense. < 1432609201 104804 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have a MAC address but no domain name or permanent IP address or anything like that, you can still generate a UUID. < 1432609260 548864 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION realizes that, not only does fourfuck no longer have anything to do with brainfuck, it may soon have 7 or 8 character command/argument blocks, as the arduino is a 16-bit environment < 1432609283 727753 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: An RNG will also suffice. < 1432609308 896444 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that also works, but not as good in my opinion. < 1432609325 407816 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :so much for the name of my anguage meaning anything... < 1432609364 289639 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Frankly an RNG isn't at all worrying -- 122 actually random bits are basically *not* going to collide. < 1432610022 608030 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you make up the Magic: the Gathering card like Notion Thief but reversed, should power/toughness/cost be changed a bit? < 1432610188 352926 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:Fourfuck14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.zem.fi/w/index.php?diff=43051&oldid=43050 5* 03Lesidhetree 5* (+547) 10 < 1432610296 231932 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, as the language seems to increasingly become less and less like Brainfuck, with the 4-character command/argument blocks becoming a pain due to anticipating needing 16-bit integers for the exact project it was designed for, I am gonna have to switch active development to a six or eight character version for intended use. I plan on coming back to developing Fourfuck as a simplified variant when I have finished the project this was designed for < 1432610311 648293 :supay!sid47179@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-owwuzctlnleohyqc QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1432610313 768418 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :there. < 1432610326 663294 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: you always have Unicode. < 1432610348 269804 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@115.68.131.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, well, Brailles? < 1432610380 143914 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i might need to store UTF-16 in the intended project... < 1432610520 857807 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :ike my note said on the talk page, i'll simplify whatever i make back into 4 chars < 1432610582 501940 :supay!sid47179@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fjjctxsfqumcahwq JOIN :#esoteric < 1432610683 756176 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should not use Unicode < 1432610714 675239 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And, even if you do, UTF-16 isn't really the best way to use Unicode, anyways.) < 1432610765 320083 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general you should use Unicode if at all applicable, but UTF-16 is uniquely terrible and should only be used for compat purposes. < 1432610769 302189 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1432610783 113465 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c2a85f.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, not as bad as UCS-2 which afaik is what Javascript does < 1432610790 950457 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fuck UCS-2 so hard. < 1432610808 475359 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general you should use ASCII if possible. < 1432610812 414771 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c2a85f.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rust has a "WTF-8" encoding for UCS-2 compatibility < 1432610825 75280 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c2a85f.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://simonsapin.github.io/wtf-8/ < 1432610830 523515 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c2a85f.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"WTF-8 (Wobbly Transformation Format − 8-bit) is a superset of UTF-8 that encodes surrogate code points if they are not in a pair. It represents, in a way compatible with UTF-8, text from systems such as JavaScript and Windows that use UTF-16 internally but don’t enforce the well-formedness invariant that surrogates must be paired." < 1432610843 323668 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general you should use UTF-8, which for most code is "use ASCII and don't do things that break UTF-8". < 1432610868 982571 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For programs that use Unicode, yes UTF-8 is much better than other encodings since then it works even if you are using only ASCII. < 1432610903 798920 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I thought Wikipedia says CESU-8 is encoding individual surrogate codes in UTF-8? < 1432610936 840373 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still, VGMCK supports both that as well as proper UTF-8 (this is because the actual output file contains text in UTF-16 format) < 1432610971 494725 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: WTF-8 is different -- it's UTF-8 except it defines a representation of invalid UTF-16. < 1432611009 226489 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK < 1432611018 2829 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not UCS-2 compat, it's "dumb shit that acts like UTF-16 units are Unicode codepoints" compat. :) < 1432611066 503301 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recommend in any program that uses input normally in ASCII but writes output into a file that contains UTF-16 text, that it would support both CESU-8 and proper UTF-8. < 1432611106 600435 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In other programs that need Unicode I do not recommend adding support for CESU-8 since it isn't important.) < 1432611123 168879 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Supporting CESU-8 as well as UTF-8 without it being an explicit option (i.e. --enable-cesu8 or some such) is a bad idea though. < 1432611151 135518 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(non-obvious behavior with two non-identical strings mapping to the same string can be real dangerous) < 1432611345 88319 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It depends much on the program, I think. < 1432611482 927996 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not necessarily a bad idea. In the cases where it is, there is probably no point supporting CESU-8 anyways if you can just use an additional filter program to convert it at first. < 1432611557 242333 :password2!~password@197.77.40.10 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432611668 869671 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the cases where I used it, there is no such danger. < 1432612061 823848 :KnightArm0!~irc@200.109.209.88 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432612123 908833 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbiab < 1432612382 411427 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :utf-8 is a good transport and file format, but for internal purposes Unicode-aware porgrams should use WTF-32 < 1432612402 297301 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? What does UTF-32 buy you? < 1432612423 987063 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ability to count characters, move them around, etc, easily < 1432612437 104177 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Count characters" For what purpose? < 1432612439 401901 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it depends on the program! < 1432612458 867866 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, not really: a Unicode character is composed of one or more codepoints. < 1432612463 799701 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many programs that have some support for Unicode don't need to count characters or anything else like that < 1432612522 204807 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many of my programs do not support Unicode at all and I am not going to add any support. A few do, but only do what they need to do with Unicode, and not more than that. < 1432612589 213105 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, my RDF Turtle parser library has some support for Unicode; specifically, it allows Unicode in identifiers and will decode \u escapes into UTF-8. < 1432612694 917823 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Allowing Unicode in identifiers is part of the specification of RDF Turtle syntax; I do not really like it much or recommend using that feature when it can be avoided, but it is there for completeness.) < 1432612742 396121 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, UTF-32 essentially reduces the complexity of reading a character to fread()ing 4 bytes < 1432612765 306800 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :But why are you reading 'a character'? < 1432612775 847203 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: Yes, if that is what you need to do; like I said it depend on the software. I find that is rarely necessary anyways. < 1432612778 141699 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :and allows to seek N characters through a string by adding n*4 < 1432612791 642062 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, not really because a character is not 4 bytes. < 1432612792 77527 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reading bytes tends to work better, and is compatible with ASCII. < 1432612802 392604 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Unicode character is one or more codepoints. < 1432612860 711886 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: for eaxample? < 1432612865 614934 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unicode has a lot of stupid stuff, really. < 1432612917 567923 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider LATIN CAPITAL LETTER A + COMBINING GRAVE ACCENT. < 1432612919 617280 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For my own stuff I generally prefer PC character set. < 1432612922 868085 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is a single character. < 1432612929 16632 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is two codepoints. < 1432612930 60978 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you claiming that formally, the combining characters are not characters? < 1432612978 897044 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Essentially. Or, at least, if you treat them as "characters" you're dealing with a very different concept of "character" than the end user is likely to. < 1432613006 897916 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For practical purposes, I have no toruble selecting a combining character and pasting it somewhere... < 1432613055 575356 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not "two characters" to most users that's "an A with a `" and if you treat it as an A followed by something that modifies it into an "A with a `" you're gonna have some fucking weird behavior. < 1432613067 72833 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c2a85f.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does "right arrow" move by one character or one codepoint? < 1432613096 669185 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's stupid stuff in Unicode. < 1432613117 856139 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Sure, it would be vastly easier if they didn't put in any of the combining stuff. < 1432613131 363530 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is a legacy of them trying to fit everything in 16 bits. < 1432613140 310822 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even then, there is much stupid stuff remaining. < 1432613149 124287 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode y ̄ < 1432613150 12632 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0079 LATIN SMALL LETTER Y] [U+0020 SPACE] [U+0304 COMBINING MACRON] < 1432613182 787348 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you didn't have the space there the macron would be above the y. < 1432613222 575125 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, and I find it annoying that I can't put my cursor between them. < 1432613237 232511 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: Yes I agree too < 1432613244 611843 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That should be a property of the font metrics and not of the character set anyways. < 1432613248 145765 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're gonna find similar stuff with decomposed hangul. :) < 1432613285 748691 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Complex scripts, combining characters, text direction, ligatures, etc all of that should be defined in the font metrics only. < 1432613300 155019 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hint, nobody things of the individual jamo as "characters", but they can totally be represented as individual codepoints!) < 1432613302 120355 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then they can use whatever character encodings you want. < 1432613338 783945 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, it will be a problem if Korean user types a word, gets the last jamo wrong by typo and can't adjust it by simply pressing backspace < 1432613368 484528 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is right it is the problem < 1432613523 801100 :KnightArm0!~irc@200.109.209.88 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1432613688 665723 :GeekDude!~GeekDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Quit: {{{}}{{{}}{{}}}{{}}} (www.adiirc.com) < 1432613854 481314 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION makes a daily system backup < 1432613930 142630 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Irssi appears to do what I proposed: treat combining characters like other characters. if I type ñ and then backspace, it deletes the tilde but not the n < 1432614004 396730 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, I can't put by cursor inside ñ. So it does half of what I think it should do < 1432614019 480661 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION uses irssi < 1432614036 111479 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now find a Spanish speaker that doesn't know about Unicode and see if that behavior is what they think it should be. < 1432614039 280542 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(tip: no) < 1432614128 591193 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, but that is the fault of unicode by making the wrong behaviour easy to implement < 1432614147 803890 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well sure. < 1432614148 766004 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use the precomposed character then if you are Spanish like that < 1432614171 30087 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Unfortunately for you, OS X prefers decomposed characters. :) < 1432614195 533691 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are at least 100 problems with Unicode, I think.............. < 1432614210 681536 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's still the least awful solution. < 1432614261 402825 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it isn't. What TeX does is better < 1432614277 948823 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uh, doesn't TeX not even support multilingual code that well? < 1432614289 190938 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Erm, multilingual text < 1432614321 5426 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actuall TeX does have stuff for multilingual text, you can use different hyphenation pattern for each language in one file, and you can make the font for different language text too < 1432614395 114647 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :DVI can even use 32-bit character numbers, and so can METAFONT < 1432614413 546631 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it is more than Unicode and it mean you can even do made-up languages < 1432614495 944351 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1432614569 525434 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i am gonna try and figure out how a six-character or 8-character version of fourfuck would work < 1432614630 392373 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :as, like i probably said, the arduino is 16-bit, why am i making an 8-bit language? < 1432614726 775353 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf < 1432614757 624440 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone writes a JIT for BF and posts it to reddit, and Urban Müller (or someone impersonating him) turns up to say hi < 1432614787 458699 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I don't know which one; ask Muller < 1432614789 417023 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :could easily be an impersonator, actually < 1432614818 929964 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like my "deanonymizing operator" and "cons operator" extensions I added into RDF Turtle syntax? < 1432614886 456098 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example now (1 2 3 4) and (1,(2,(3,(4,())))) is same thing. < 1432614960 465276 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :night all < 1432614998 3762 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat NICK :Lyka|Away < 1432615017 765802 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or you can make a "incomplete list" by (1 2 3 4,) < 1432615048 41381 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And a list can "loop" such as (!_:x 1 2 3 4, _:x) < 1432615096 189015 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You don't have to loop from the beginning; you can loop from in the middle too) < 1432616390 71725 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :With pure tokenizing highlighters it looks difficult to properly highlight IRC because I do not see how you can highlight the command name (or number) in this way. Well, maybe if you are using regular expressions that support looking behind you at what has already been parsed, then maybe you can, but I am not sure. < 1432616590 183939 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1432616817 524411 :MDude!~fyrc@c-71-58-118-227.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDream < 1432617843 998940 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: [ < 1432617912 814801 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432619062 146545 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you do loop like stuff in a mathematical language with assignment but not loops? I know I'm being really vague, but - say I have multiplication - can I, without loops, do exponentation by a variable value? < 1432619082 922744 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you are too vague < 1432619114 669573 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1432619182 211943 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay-- can I - without a built-in exponentation function - without using any loops - and only using numbers and enumerable types - do exponentation by a variable value? < 1432619454 101449 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nvm < 1432619647 525 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have logarithms? < 1432619658 569118 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, well, you still need /one/ exponentiation for that to work < 1432619670 117853 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in general, no because of computational complexity problems < 1432619690 606936 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't produce a number of size O(2^n) in time O(1) without some operation that grows numbers exponentially < 1432619700 783239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the lack of loops means you can't write programs slower than O(1) < 1432619722 254995 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*grows numbers exponentially or faster < 1432619736 35667 :password2!~password@197.77.40.10 QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1432620233 184735 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh ok < 1432620303 171458 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I decided to do is add unconditional goto < 1432620338 124062 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(since everything is a number you can do logic with 0's and 1's) < 1432620344 342359 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in the language I'm making of course) < 1432620366 775336 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://iq0.com/notes/deep.nesting.html do you guys know this? < 1432620376 163871 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :very nice reading < 1432620613 113109 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eww c < 1432620624 305352 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or c++ or whatever or c with pants < 1432620633 506416 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :LOL < 1432620763 694566 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've always done it that way with multiple returns < 1432620798 959917 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I will read it later < 1432620989 243651 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow this is longer, it goes into many ways to simplify code < 1432621447 350052 :Lyka|Away!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat NICK :Lyka < 1432621460 832200 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98841263/fourfuck%20language/Fourfuck%20Octopus-0000.pdf < 1432621482 468784 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the octopus is just a random word i picked) < 1432621523 367577 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a different approach than the one i had been planning < 1432621559 204714 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i had to modify some commands to allow for optional 16-bit arithmetic < 1432621724 994184 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, i looked at the backlog. nobody seems to say goodnight here. < 1432621876 345452 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually fall asleep with no warning < 1432621989 927409 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not find "goodnight" necessary on computer much < 1432622550 732700 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Windows you can still count how many lines in a file: find /v /c "" < 1432622586 896327 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm gonna get something to munch on. maybe it will help me pass out < 1432622792 521849 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :forget it I'm making a BF derivative -.- < 1432622841 657612 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it common to use a goto command in parsers more than in other programs? < 1432622887 510380 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes < 1432622902 440096 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or to generalize, heavy use of goto is common in state machines < 1432622908 682577 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and parsers are one of the main applications of state machines < 1432623050 203823 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know why careful use of goto in other settings has not come back into vogue since "'GOTO considered harmful' considered harmful" came out. It seemed a pretty good argument to me. < 1432623105 496053 :hilquias`!~user@189.115.169.219 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1432623175 303735 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOTO is not harmful? < 1432623194 502078 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :GOTO is not necessarily harmful. < 1432623520 224496 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :in c/c++, is this possible: int main(){f1();return 0;} void f1(){f2();} void f2(){f1();} < 1432623581 478789 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1432623586 336151 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, that sort of thing < 1432623661 239960 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you declare the functions at first then you can do like that, although such thing isn't going to work. < 1432623671 969837 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will just run out of stack space < 1432623691 477384 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't do that program, of course < 1432623691 662544 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Either that or get into an infinte loop without using any stack space < 1432623695 806643 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :This depends on the compiler < 1432623786 773114 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the only time I ever used setjmp in a C code is this: while(setjmp(exception_buffer)); (I do mean exactly that, including the semicolon) < 1432623821 240876 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :the R--- set of commands in my language reads 4 chars and runs them as if it were a command < 1432623825 493772 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I normally put the semicolon on the next line when doing that < 1432623856 82526 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't sure whether or not it is allowed to reuse the same buffer, and got conflicting answers, so I did it like that rather than setjmp by itself. < 1432623859 402788 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a) I think it's equivalent to setjmp without the loop (/unless/ you're copying exception_buffer elsewhere and then jumping from the new location); b) if you want to be compatible with old versions of C you should compare to 0 explicitly < 1432623863 534929 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's menu --- run_commands --- menu --- < 1432623909 385019 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :wel, it compiles for the arduino, but i have not yet tested it < 1432623909 873956 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable NICK :trout < 1432623924 295586 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbiab < 1432623971 322595 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Talk:Folder14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.zem.fi/w/index.php?diff=43052&oldid=42543 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+154) 10/* Name dispute */ < 1432623991 233788 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: O, you put in next line, OK, but in this case I am not copying the buffer at all; see above why I did that < 1432624020 341618 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have other times too used a while loop with no body, but this is the only time I used setjmp at all) < 1432624086 57200 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok so I just learned something. In addition to chmod there is a command chattr which, rather than being a chat program, is used to set extra attributes to ext2 files. < 1432624120 23035 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What extra attributes is it? < 1432624126 539201 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So if you don't know about chattr, and there is a file which has been chattr +i on it < 1432624132 539418 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't delete it < 1432624155 73668 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :i for immutable < 1432624272 981791 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :a file with i in its lsattr output can't be modified in any way, even by root < 1432624296 397287 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :and only root can take off the i with chattr -i file < 1432624365 604427 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, now I know that < 1432624694 918175 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1432624747 332615 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry i talk a lot about the language i am making due to having nothing better to do. < 1432624790 467840 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm thinking out loud, but am willing to hear comments < 1432624870 327082 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is fine with me < 1432624926 326934 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems like i keep kiling chat whenever i talk about octopus ( octopus is the clean alias of fourfuck's crrent development branch ) < 1432624939 432175 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no point posting all of your thinking about it on here unless you are willing to hear comments, which you are, so it is OK < 1432625037 447613 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :People that discuss other thing can do so it doesn't seem a problem to read different set of message mixed up in this way (it occurs even in books), but if someone does have a problem it is possible to program the computer to temporarily suppress such messages if they are interfering with the others. < 1432625078 977590 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? < 1432625177 55710 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :if someone needs the channel's soapbox and i am aware, of course i will yield to the while they are on it < 1432625187 899963 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to them < 1432625207 28666 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1432625376 294799 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello? < 1432625440 199510 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you wanted to talk a lot about the language you are making due to you have nothing better to do; so, if you have something to write, do so. < 1432625459 644538 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if nobody comments right now, it would be logged < 1432625502 522722 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can only say so much < 1432625519 777846 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1432625547 244021 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am making the language due to having nothing better to do < 1432625567 481148 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i talk about th language to get feedback < 1432625581 121168 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry if there was confusion < 1432625605 854697 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1432625748 94808 :e_svedang!~erik@c83-254-7-124.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1432625820 462035 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK. < 1432625824 417972 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1432625852 377531 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, post here; if I have any comment I may write some, or possibly someone else might. However it might come late but that's OK because we have logs < 1432625853 752764 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have this epic idea < 1432625868 951745 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: What kind of epic idea is that? < 1432625902 61778 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :an idea for an esolang < 1432625941 638870 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wont spoil the details but it's going to be called And. < 1432625955 484984 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1432626063 597122 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98841263/octopus%20language/Octopus-0000.pdf < 1432626080 783867 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98841263/octopus%20language/octopus_0000a.ino.txt < 1432626100 71088 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i should go to sleep soon < 1432626147 548139 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :since chat's logged and stuff, you don't have to wait for me to wake up to comment < 1432626196 262485 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :night all < 1432626277 530581 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat NICK :Lyka|Away < 1432626294 27531 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is all that stuff at the top for? < 1432627168 595227 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1432627174 610239 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a few more details: < 1432627185 910674 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is at least as good as a push down automaton < 1432627493 978227 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell oerjan I'm not surprised. Anyway, the real domain seems to be back, so I undid the MediaWiki changes. < 1432627494 163520 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1432627796 542614 :Lyka|Away!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat NICK :Lyka < 1432627975 948756 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what stuff? < 1432627979 353594 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07And14]]4 N10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=43053 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+1708) 10/* And */finished typing it for now < 1432628026 282785 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07And14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43054&oldid=43053 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+6) 10/* Cat Program */ < 1432628055 274555 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1432628085 58222 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07And14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43055&oldid=43054 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+2) 10... < 1432628106 661112 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :All of the const char cx00[17] PROGMEM = " "; and so on < 1432628139 456575 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an arduino thing < 1432628149 806148 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :cxarray is in flash memory < 1432628333 321595 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :cxarray is part of the program, but never copied to ram < 1432628440 629064 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :program as in the interpreter setch < 1432628451 195455 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sketch < 1432628589 230087 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: does this make sense to you now? < 1432628788 891302 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :that cxarray[256] is a array of 256 17-byte char strings? < 1432628798 460605 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning. < 1432628936 288634 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, pointers to 17-byte char strings < 1432628937 431710 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :are morphisms that are both epimorphisms and monomorphisms isomorphisms? < 1432628956 295847 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea < 1432629064 648673 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1432629165 257393 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: I know that, but among other things they are all const and all spaces too < 1432629174 61250 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :also.. < 1432629185 352205 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any other endomorphisms other than the identity function? < 1432629214 867559 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :seeing as they are f: X -> X < 1432629305 328157 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: cause i haven't filled them in yet? < 1432629364 587816 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :did i not say that cxarray is read-only? < 1432629371 785942 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: O, that's why, OK < 1432629403 475926 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it is read-only; you told me that and I can see it from the program too, but I don't know much about Arduino stuff or about your program, therefore it seem strange to me at first. < 1432629412 739163 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is f(x) = -x and endomorphism as well? < 1432629415 920642 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-d < 1432629425 233186 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: Yes there are other endomorphisms < 1432629542 371067 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: Not necessarily. < 1432629549 88011 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it depends what category. < 1432629553 522486 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In some categories there aren't any < 1432629554 643752 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: http://ncatlab.org/nlab/show/bimorphism < 1432629707 948476 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: In that example though, if you have f: Integer->Integer then yes it can be < 1432629860 822202 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I just changed that mage a few seconds ago < 1432629873 908503 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because it said "Contemts" by mistake instead of "Contents" < 1432629886 133367 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a standard for naming of mp3's < 1432629930 343447 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :should the filenames be Artist - Album - Song.mp3 or the reverse? < 1432629945 812549 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: I think that depends what you want to sort by < 1432629967 126225 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also MP3 isn't very good; FLAC is much better) < 1432629993 551784 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :well yeah... mp3's, flacs, wav's etc < 1432630030 118804 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :the extension isn't the point, that already has a standard :) < 1432630060 910619 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK < 1432630192 664374 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although arranging the stuff in that filename in my opinion mostly depend how you want to sort by; I prefer filenames without spaces though. However you might also like to organize in a SQLite database then you can easy sort by whatever you want to < 1432630308 832598 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A database is a good idea. Or if there is a separator in each filename like Artist-Song then we can sort using sort -t- -k2 or the like < 1432630354 33741 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is another way < 1432630905 749854 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And can help even if you do have a database, perhaps < 1432630955 561558 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although - might not be best one depending on if the artist's name has a hyphen, too (unless you change it for purposes of the filename, which is also possible; the correct name can be placed into the database instead). < 1432632556 489451 :rdococ!95feea39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.234.57 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1432633955 679521 :e_svedang!~erik@c83-254-7-124.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1432634077 810452 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: Artist/Album/Song.mp3 ;) < 1432634271 894630 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I second that suggestion < 1432634713 897758 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, just don't put literal names of artists or albums or songs in filenames, beacuse those strings can be crazy < 1432634750 457816 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can put sanitized versions of them in the filename if you wish, as long as you keep them short, not have strange characters, and make sure the filename is unique. < 1432634770 836170 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Keep the actual names somewhere else, such as in the file metadata or in separate files, whether text or database or whatever. < 1432634805 11746 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Making the filenames sort in the way you want to play them is a good idea though. < 1432634818 534071 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Helps playing whole album sorted on mobile phone. < 1432635183 392216 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, they should be in the metadata as well < 1432635216 394866 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as the filenames are descriptive, I'm happy < 1432635520 24200 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1432635564 1113 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages- < 1432635564 186510 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie said 2h 14m 30s ago: I'm not surprised. Anyway, the real domain seems to be back, so I undid the MediaWiki changes. < 1432635671 591322 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Where's my wine? < 1432635672 748176 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: mr president, on a permanent basis, developing employability, seeking alternatives to closures, then the commission would like to reiterate my thanks for the comments made today by the rapporteur, per gahrton, and now we are of the opinion of the wto that it is clear that the european parliament has new opportunities, for example, we have reached a consensus, mostly with countries with which we have acquired a living c < 1432635682 319964 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style irc < 1432635682 505459 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Selected style: irc (IRC logs of freenode/#esoteric, freenode/#scheme and ircnet/#douglasadams) < 1432635684 927396 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Where's my wine? < 1432635685 249235 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: i'm researching scheme for a while until this thing clears up. maybe as a list < 1432635912 654827 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432635975 673035 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: are you using natural clarification or some chemical? < 1432635975 906325 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: by a simple macro; what advantage does being able to solve this < 1432635993 174188 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alternatives to closures? < 1432636018 73973 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Many substances have historically been used as fining agents, including dried blood powder,[5] but today there are two general types of fining agents — organic compounds and solid/mineral materials." < 1432636074 833518 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Because potassium ferrocyanide may form hydrogen cyanide its use is highly regulated and, in many wine producing countries, illegal." < 1432636113 378947 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, is Potassium Ferrocyanide an alternative to closures? < 1432636165 902336 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :crap. I have no less than four copies of the same song. mtimes: 2006 2011 2013 2014 < 1432636175 626386 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: i dunno; my TC proof for potassium ferrocyanide is not yet very far < 1432636302 341048 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I really like E-Type - Life.mp3, aka etype life.mp3 aka life by etype.mp3 aka Etype: life (CD ver.).mp3 < 1432636344 182779 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boidily < 1432636541 947172 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey E-Type is from sweden! I didn't know that! < 1432636568 925091 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :a surprising number of people are swedes < 1432636661 41420 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :The winner of this year's Eurovision Song Contest, for example < 1432636673 796860 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that too < 1432636685 242621 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION didn't watch, as usual < 1432636687 958208 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And at least two people in this very IRC channel! < 1432636697 93306 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least three < 1432636709 349014 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, my statement is still true! < 1432636724 404481 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :That statement of yours is /also/ true < 1432636731 499621 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So is that!" < 1432636731 979003 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly has established a better bound on it though < 1432636745 830876 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :You are very truthful today, Taneb < 1432636762 558402 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren, did you know that Graham's number is at least 11! < 1432636764 546411 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellørjan. you're all having a very fungottian conversation this morning. < 1432636764 816846 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: http://java.sun.com/ j2se/ 1.4.2/ docs/ latest/ html/ r5rs-z-h-7.html%_idx_138 put < 1432636771 859300 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might even be more than 12! < 1432636784 220901 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: no, no java yet for me, at least for the next two hours. < 1432636784 463294 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: you should focus on the feature differnce, not the < 1432636790 816712 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: fungot seems to have gone into the wine business < 1432636791 142960 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i might as well as the type-checking and deconstruction. the pre-scheme compiler. http://www.bloodandcoffee.net/ campbell/ txt/ fnord and this: < 1432636810 605619 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: although e still manages to use scheme for it < 1432636833 576545 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Blood and coffee?! < 1432636847 204504 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot is scary < 1432636847 389982 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: fnord big lexical factor was miranda a couple of hours < 1432636856 318023 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Château de Scheme 2015. Type checked and well rounded. < 1432636887 553482 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: are you referring to graham's humongous number or to what he was actually approximating < 1432636895 712650 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, both < 1432636899 18648 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have three copies of Masterboy - Show Me Colours.mp3 < 1432636901 309157 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of Eurovision, I think I heard an E-type song in our ESC qualifier competition once < 1432636923 289545 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :because with those things, the lower bounds are ridiculously lower than the upper ones, it seems < 1432636945 425636 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the time, the lower bound was 6 and the upper bound was Graham's number < 1432636964 548180 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now the lower bound is 13 and the upper bound is the Hales-Jewett number < 1432636995 133827 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: don't worry, he's just using the blood and coffee as a fining agent hth < 1432636999 137647 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a list of songs that have won somewhere < 1432637029 958853 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wiki has it < 1432637034 699703 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :his wine will be a hit with the sleepless vampire segment < 1432637141 287733 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: wait, are you male or female < 1432637141 509774 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: if you look at the source. when you try to say something < 1432637149 849149 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^source < 1432637150 34451 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/fis/fungot/blob/master/fungot.b98 < 1432637220 533255 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I do not believe fungot has a gender < 1432637220 730794 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: i just threw away a lot, not use the site rules as a way to transmit information! < 1432637296 189982 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot is a fungot. < 1432637296 375302 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: " metamodel"?? haha. < 1432637321 61163 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: i found your source unenlightening on the matter tdnh < 1432637321 246553 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that's already there.)) < 1432637339 421570 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: flblblblblbl! < 1432637339 606841 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: " write search terms in box. click search.") well, i < 1432637423 562690 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :if fungot is hebrew it could be plural male < 1432637423 785734 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: so you want to)) < 1432637574 659656 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :because -ot is how you make plural on male nouns apparently < 1432637601 953576 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shellochaf. expert advise on fungot's gender? < 1432637602 384764 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: while foo fnord. _) a _, _ cannot be evaluated by the outer procedure. you then remove x1 from the set of polynomials is dense in the space < 1432637615 897636 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or genders, because apparently the 'got is plural.) < 1432637630 695641 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: as a gender pluralist, any idea on fungot? < 1432637630 880899 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: make the keys those small rubbery things < 1432637660 402160 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot, what would you say your gender or genders are? < 1432637660 587396 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: ( scariest thing i could see some use for it. :p < 1432637690 831208 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily, fungot is unnerved by the concept of gender, and is terrified that they can see some use for it < 1432637691 30161 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: i think the avoidance is just for nomic-sh. i'm not set at all on that page are funny. < 1432637775 464688 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily, I think that says it all < 1432637840 240723 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tdh. < 1432637852 628693 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fsvoh, bidh.) < 1432637919 88433 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :taaabc < 1432637983 497311 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tanebs Are Almost About ABCs? < 1432637996 123338 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :These acronyms are a bit confusing < 1432638026 178033 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am fairly sure there is only one Taneb < 1432638040 566797 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean there used to be a racehorse called Taneb back in the 20's or something < 1432638087 196153 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :remind me where you got 'taneb' from anyway < 1432638096 661181 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, shared account with my brother < 1432638109 549472 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the time he had the nickname "Neb" because it was Ben backwards < 1432638131 230985 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tacked the first three letters (reversed) of my name onto that, "Tan" < 1432638134 821980 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :To make "Taneb" < 1432638186 122008 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :idswicaa < 1432638207 529511 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I Don't See Why It Could Also Abort. < 1432638219 873742 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do sometimes wish I could articulate acronyms < 1432638225 380353 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: a good start < 1432638237 663457 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: not such a good start < 1432638457 493440 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::( < 1432638484 187914 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I don't see what is confusing about acronyms" hth < 1432638484 429081 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have an exam in 6 hours about computability and complexity < 1432638499 206316 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finally putting my years here to good use < 1432638507 428116 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: look at the bright side, it's pretty sure to terminate < 1432638543 837583 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :good < 1432638547 146251 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a 90 minute exam, I should hope so < 1432638557 582270 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jeez, I've been here for like 5 years < 1432638575 626724 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, ah yes, i had the same experience when i took automata and formal systems last year < 1432638586 198749 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...so why do i keep thinking of you as a newbie... < 1432638595 98318 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, because I'm like half your age < 1432638608 166306 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION corrects brain < 1432638644 927143 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: because he sometimes asks beginner questions here? < 1432638651 22060 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also I kind of feel like a newbie wherever I go < 1432638655 701434 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an experience I enjoy < 1432638700 69109 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sometimes get lost for fun < 1432638710 366421 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's oddly liberating < 1432638719 86565 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I may be an odd person < 1432638767 245185 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait wait wait. oerjan is twice Taneb? < 1432638777 37387 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily, roughly, I think < 1432638781 994902 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, how old are you? < 1432638792 129598 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :44, for about another month < 1432638806 267615 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan is 2*Taneb + 4 < 1432638813 181487 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, 2*(Taneb + 2) < 1432638829 353992 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so in two years you can stop being a newbie < 1432638872 849703 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps < 1432638887 792257 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1432638887 967912 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :By then I may have almost graduated! < 1432638907 271769 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :why again did I need inlining for my static typed stackbased programming language < 1432638912 874649 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, the esolangs.org wiki is up again at the original address, great < 1432638931 29189 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: performance hth < 1432638935 50965 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :no < 1432638944 140907 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :it had something to do with it not type checking unless inlined < 1432638965 617166 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: technically i never noticed it stop working, although its CSS got screwy because of fizzie's temporary workarounds < 1432638977 327400 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/DtRAbW0q < 1432638987 473903 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: the dns was down < 1432638999 838199 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because you could not assign a unique type to the function "mother" < 1432639009 468720 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it would accept both hans susi and hans fritz < 1432639036 943997 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: oh right, statically typed stack is tricky when you have eval-like commands, i remember the old CAT discussions < 1432639049 944776 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think he ever completely solved it < 1432639081 816079 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: i did notice the discussion thank you very much < 1432639092 419303 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, I have like ten songs under both DJ S3RL - song name and S3RL - song name < 1432639121 674697 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's should be some ISSN < 1432639127 580930 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*-'s < 1432639145 893545 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I solved it by inlining < 1432639163 835999 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :@= does not really define a new function < 1432639164 11738 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you meant: v @ ? . < 1432639175 554324 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a macro actually < 1432639184 38162 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :like #define mother parent female < 1432639193 625017 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can't assign mother a type < 1432639200 519288 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can use "parent female" < 1432639217 274716 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't really understand the scoping rules of metafont. It's confusing. Is there a good description of it somewhere? < 1432639226 925089 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 QUIT :Quit: COTYLEDON CHICKEN < 1432639239 940265 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/bxNCwGbU <- that's the full code btw < 1432639240 763308 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, when is a tag token used for its name, and when is it used for its current assigned meaning? < 1432639263 463850 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does the latter matter only when it's the first component of a variable name, or also when it's an index? < 1432639271 237995 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: you'll probably get problem with recursion, then... < 1432639285 668167 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah :) < 1432639290 216250 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :some functions can't be recursive < 1432639338 817131 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact if you don't have recursion, hindley-milner types are exactly equivalent to simple LC types + pervasive inlining < 1432639353 714249 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like I've implemented a "poly" flag < 1432639357 241468 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :that handles such cases < 1432639370 785406 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` mf <<<'\ show 2+2' # do we have mf available in the sandbox? < 1432639371 548409 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: mf: command not found < 1432639375 361877 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` mpost <<<'\ show 2+2' # do we have mf available in the sandbox? < 1432639376 9433 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: mpost: command not found < 1432639377 460374 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nopw < 1432639384 971521 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :will test locally then < 1432639401 475947 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: do you have polymorphic types, if not that'd seem related (although not enough to solve typing in the presence of closures and eval) < 1432639462 192787 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In 2005 what *was* www.ginogina.ca? < 1432639497 582061 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: http://codepad.org/GM3Ik2p4 < 1432639511 886932 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I read my code correctly $- delays type checking until later < 1432639519 816261 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Supposedly I got a few songs from there that appear not to exist anymore. Hell the artists aren't showing up at all < 1432639530 520552 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you have to specify every combination of acceptable types < 1432639545 515569 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: your language looks like a weird cross of stack and prolog/mercury < 1432639578 742273 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :well you can do some prolog like stuff in it < 1432639585 847647 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it type checks it means "true" :) < 1432639596 463794 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh so that's all compile time? < 1432639615 480763 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :the type checking? yes < 1432639622 265495 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/oFsuRpEu < 1432639625 579921 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :^- boolean logic < 1432639662 12991 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm ISSN already means something < 1432639700 711729 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :mind you that "true" and "false" are both types here < 1432639702 437096 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :not values < 1432639716 393706 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :upper case letter are type placeholders < 1432639726 34215 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i.e. id :- A -> A) < 1432639727 452802 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: i think zzo38 knows metafont hth < 1432639738 668439 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: agreed < 1432639748 87889 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :(dup :- A -> A A; swap :- A B -> B A and so forth) < 1432639820 981738 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: how do you define functions that invoke other functions? < 1432639847 944868 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :With := ? < 1432639853 623595 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric ::= defines the function body < 1432639855 410279 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric ::- the type < 1432639860 324269 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can;t believe how hard it is to get info on something that existed only 10 years ago < 1432639861 270738 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1432639876 530375 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or :- A true -> true; or := swap pop < 1432639886 67501 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: yeah... some things are underdocumented on the internet < 1432639901 785821 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :is like or :: a -> True -> True in Haskell < 1432639913 615126 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :except Haskell doesn't really allow this < 1432639919 648606 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in Haskell True isn't a Type < 1432639965 207227 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: http://web.archive.org/web/20051219014320/http://www.ginogina.ca/content.php?about < 1432639997 583270 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I apparentely only implemented type checking so far < 1432640065 807373 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I guess I must have had an account there and downloaded mp3's from links that were posted? < 1432640109 391497 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe my friends did and gave me the mp3's? who knows? < 1432640126 958607 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :with :- and := the type checker will try to check the type of the function against the type you try to give it < 1432640151 4871 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :with $- the type checker won't do that but only check the types in calls to that function < 1432640170 445994 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning uhm < 1432640189 539289 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :foo $- -> false; foo := true; would type check as long as you never call foo < 1432640216 340524 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: True can be a promoted type with the DataKinds extension hth < 1432640238 375724 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't have values though < 1432640276 171714 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking at that web page makes me want to cry, the internet used to work fine without all this JQuery CSS3 HTML5 bullshit < 1432640296 186793 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly useful for things like mother := parent female where the function on the left can't be assigned "a single type" < 1432640314 423590 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :which either has to be inlined through a macro or by defining it with $- < 1432640329 277554 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :which tells the compiler to not type check mother := parent female < 1432640333 159384 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but type check calls to it < 1432640340 319821 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :er.. *tells the type checker < 1432640476 716850 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: cat has a successor called kitten now < 1432640499 799866 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not by the same author though < 1432640638 180684 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've noticed < 1432640666 283851 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :btw i misspoke, hindler-milner without recursion is equivalent to duplicating let definitions, not inlining them < 1432640673 476759 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*y < 1432640716 238159 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, you let each use site have its own type for a let-defined variable, but it still needs to have a type < 1432640805 28729 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. < 1432640826 639563 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. if mother is used, you infer from the context what type it should have < 1432640839 102489 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then check it < 1432640844 716571 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or < 1432640871 356454 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I could've done instead is that the type checker automatically creates overloaded versions of mother with all combinations of accepted types < 1432640979 757357 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if that works with recursion though < 1432641038 448312 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: kitten seems to be by evincar who was a regular here for a while, cat was by christopher diggins and my memory is vague on whether he came here or whether i just saw him elsewhere < 1432641068 27606 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :It surely works if you can't overload the return type :) < 1432641133 874630 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the cat language site seems to have vanished < 1432641324 172 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would work. < 1432641340 491706 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just lazy to implement it < 1432641345 377828 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :*too < 1432641492 448513 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Frankly an RNG isn't at all worrying -- 122 actually random bits are basically *not* going to collide. <-- * imagines a far future in which civilization is destroyed by an unexpected hash collision < 1432641572 161444 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :if(hash(time()) == 0xEAFFF44789ABCD17DBA) { /* start war on 6571-10-10 */ } < 1432641588 359034 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i said unexpected hth < 1432641599 8127 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is unexpected < 1432641611 752293 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :who had known that 6000-8-8 would also produce the same hash . < 1432641621 435079 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1432641657 173439 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's semi-expected < 1432641729 535184 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was imagining more like a future where we're all living as uploaded minds in computronium < 1432641767 352172 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and every individual is stored under the key hash(individual.dna)? < 1432641770 622333 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the world computer uses hashes for security < 1432641785 247330 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :somebody is up for being erased and replaced by somebody else < 1432641789 530417 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand < 1432641791 27046 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is good < 1432641805 94668 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :that way you know that your population won't grow infinitely < 1432641832 211319 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the hashes were more than big enough when the system was designed, you see < 1432641835 978170 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :someday a newborn cyberbaby will overwrite somebody < 1432641857 60128 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1432641865 341707 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :nobodys gonna use that not-enough condoms! < 1432641888 130422 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly cybercondoms < 1432641897 563639 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what you're plans about that are in the computronium. < 1432641901 54088 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :*your < 1432641911 491537 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact they still _seemed_ to big enough. nobody actually expected the hash collision. < 1432641918 971736 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to be < 1432641957 125537 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but hash collisions are an inherent property of hashing < 1432641957 817394 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it wasn't in something as mundane as a single person's hash, it was in a security proof for the fundamental OS < 1432641962 178482 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean < 1432641965 75213 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are there. Always. < 1432641983 698847 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: well < 1432641992 833082 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doesn't git sorta have this problem? < 1432642007 449314 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't read about what bad things will happen if a hash collides < 1432642034 81694 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I possibly have but already forgotten it. < 1432642034 868000 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah there are lots of places where it would be bad, surely < 1432642064 224722 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'll be already dead by then so who cares" - L. Torvalds < 1432642137 572589 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that can't be an actual quote, too polite < 1432642208 814738 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :"fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck shit fuck" -- L. Torvalds < 1432642219 630342 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :too incoherent < 1432642242 481495 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are both welcome to prove me wrong with actual links < 1432642302 289195 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1432642364 55491 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not going to google "fuck l. torvalds" < 1432642380 175850 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_36yNWw_07g < 1432642413 308266 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats what came up, torvalds saying "Nvidia, fuck you" < 1432642499 843683 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://lkml.org/lkml/2012/12/23/75 "Mauro, SHUT THE FUCK UP!" -- L. Torvalds < 1432642545 332615 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Microscript14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43056&oldid=42965 5* 03SuperJedi224 5* (+21) 10The imports disappeared. < 1432642555 138689 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: that was coherent, doesn't count hth < 1432642568 918052 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :[...] SHUT THE FUCK UP < 1432642989 457322 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1432642993 61541 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :your compiler is pure < 1432642994 583313 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :and utter *shit*. < 1432643007 299909 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :-- L. Torvalds, to the GCC team < 1432643068 90680 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it's pure, has to count for something < 1432643096 519417 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1432643124 260026 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1432643152 214325 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Microscript14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43057&oldid=43056 5* 03SuperJedi224 5* (+0) 10Fixed an implementation error. < 1432643475 594757 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :a search for linus torvalds shit led to < 1432643487 448515 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mormonism as a religion is a fairly close second to the Scientologists in the race to "Batshit Crazy" -- L. Torvalds < 1432643510 420894 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mormons are cool. < 1432643639 582493 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :. Hurd will be out in a year (or two, or next month, who knows), -- L. Torvalds 1991 < 1432643643 381255 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1432643668 390981 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it has a beta now, right? < 1432643835 531861 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In short: just say NO TO DRUGS, and maybe you won’t end up like the Hurd people. -- L. Torvalds 2001 < 1432643848 875668 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1432644120 457604 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If any Intel people are listening to this and you had anything to do with ACPI, shoot yourself now, before you reproduce. -- L. Torvalds < 1432644204 169256 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Microscript14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43058&oldid=43057 5* 03SuperJedi224 5* (+89) 10/* Example programs */ < 1432645271 114976 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1432645344 733005 :FreeFull!~freefull@97e179d4.skybroadband.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1432645349 435960 :FreeFull!~freefull@97e179d4.skybroadband.com QUIT :Changing host < 1432645349 649332 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1432645717 365498 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :arguably intel architecture is probably worse than it could be < 1432645853 443599 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :*shrug* < 1432645854 762876 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :AMD > * < 1432645869 18497 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :And Cyrix was the Hell of a Mess. < 1432645906 822139 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: bring your elves < 1432646086 818518 :GeekDude!~GeekDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude JOIN :#esoteric < 1432646731 874135 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the opposite of altruism? < 1432646805 430975 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Misanthropy? < 1432646814 941018 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kleptomania? < 1432646816 346471 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ wn altruism -antsn < 1432646816 522148 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Antonyms of noun altruism < 1432646816 522232 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :1 sense of altruism < 1432646816 522255 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sense 1 < 1432646817 83340 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :altruism, selflessness < 1432646818 836276 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : Antonym of egoism (Sense 2) < 1432646821 337992 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : =>egoism, egocentrism, self-interest, self-concern, self-centeredness < 1432646890 84053 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :malbenevolence? < 1432646894 376718 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that a word? < 1432646913 39895 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :malevolence is < 1432646922 450397 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. malevolence, malignity -- (wishing evil to others) < 1432646922 626121 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. malevolence, malevolency, malice -- (the quality of threatening evil) < 1432646926 892505 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1432646929 316826 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1432646950 434860 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking for a word for "doing good without external motivation" < 1432646953 688872 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the opposite of that < 1432647009 538302 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1432647040 108860 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is, if such a pure thing exists < 1432647044 361256 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and isn't some form of compensation < 1432647077 147866 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The opposite" is not really well-defined, since it's unclear whether the opposite should invert the "good" part, the "external motivation" part, or both. < 1432648054 723914 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :the good part < 1432648149 912562 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :doing good without egoistic benefits, doing evil without egoistic benefits. < 1432648230 831387 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda like where mother theresa is helping children just for the sake of helping them (altruistic) < 1432648246 218700 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :father theresa is just robbing people for the sake of robbing them (....?) < 1432648404 915471 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or punching them in the face < 1432648409 164377 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :just doing general evil of some sort < 1432648430 740156 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :or polluting the environment < 1432648460 781437 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pointlessly malicious? < 1432648467 537843 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know if such a word exists... < 1432648489 928090 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :If there's such a thing as pointlessly kind < 1432648496 412916 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :then there must be a pointlessly malicous < 1432648504 827351 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps not, but "maltruistic" would sound good. < 1432648522 214608 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even if the construction would make no sense. < 1432648557 287055 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :People seem to think that you can do good without involving your ego < 1432648569 963166 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but refuse to believe that you can do evil with the same motivation < 1432648610 846942 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1432648673 614714 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :but "maltruistic" would make a good word < 1432648751 865998 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :although there are already some google results for it < 1432648771 361964 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it seems to be defined as "fake altruism" < 1432649015 737736 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Excess Flood < 1432649022 966619 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm also a terrible philosopher. < 1432649031 733329 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1432649074 534790 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Are you interested in Philosophy? < 1432649074 807900 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: i've been thinking about fnord, other than gambit doesn't have a whois referral pointing at a dead-end position in life. < 1432649094 751030 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 < 1432649259 147619 :TieSoul!~quassel@86.89.119.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432649556 529107 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Excess Flood < 1432649588 455778 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1432650363 281019 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Do you know Peter Popoff? < 1432650363 674030 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: any particular code you were reading was not the connotation i had a netgear first, but for ash it happens in other areas < 1432650713 714356 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1432651090 451541 :Weloxux!~hato@546A4E77.cm-12-3b.dynamic.ziggo.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1432651542 649697 :hjulle!~hjulle@ankadagen.vth.sgsnet.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1432653473 524084 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I liked the "whois referral pointing at a dead-end position in life" part. < 1432653480 449408 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it's perhaps a bit cruel. < 1432653493 260275 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: You'll need to have some niceness programmed in you. < 1432653493 436066 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: cannot open input file: invalid argument" < 1432653502 67686 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So snarky. < 1432653622 364169 :KnightArm0!~irc@200.109.194.199 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432653706 487660 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: I think people would appreciate if you refuted the argument instead of just dismissing it as invalid < 1432653706 706332 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: looking at it... it has a typo. i'll fix that < 1432653744 994793 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no. fungot's growing self-sentient, fixing typos in its own source < 1432653745 208118 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: you can see. < 1432653754 405744 :FireFly!~firefly@oftn/member/FireFly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm scared. < 1432654427 587861 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07And14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43059&oldid=43055 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+886) 10/* Examples */ < 1432655350 417272 :Weloxux!~hato@546A4E77.cm-12-3b.dynamic.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1432656461 709166 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully fungot is not synet. < 1432656462 47935 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: 1-n words of mostly human language. i was thinking about that the next pixels according to the error somehow < 1432656581 370100 :Sprocklem!~Sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1432656693 709952 :KnightArm0!~irc@200.109.194.199 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1432656791 413569 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1432657176 430415 :bb010g!uid21050@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kkucqxasyvvhmdqd QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1432658036 783288 :rdococ!95fee0f8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.224.248 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432658870 143098 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember I had a book once that described a chess variant known as "Emperor Wars". (I don't know if it may have been the only copy (it was made of plain paper, probably printed by computer or typewriter, did not mention any author's name or copyright notices, had hand-written corrections in it), and I don't know where it is now.) < 1432659562 468183 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: tell us more about those pixels < 1432659562 852649 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: unleash your creative side shine, while painting and marking your keyboard the way you put that in your average defun? < 1432659571 828301 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1432659572 4107 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc* iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack oots pa qwantz sms speeches ss wp youtube < 1432659746 72537 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, people who have [y] in their native languages! < 1432659756 917964 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :To me, an English speaker, [y] sounds like a cross between [u] and [i]. < 1432659810 379426 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would you say the same? < 1432661573 638371 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@dsl-trebrasgw1-50dff2-22.dhcp.inet.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: speaking from Finnish, I wouldn't quite say that. < 1432661711 207843 :nortti!~juhani@ayu.smar.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :y and i are articulated in the same place, and the height and roundedness of y and u is the same < 1432662437 581606 :rdococ!95fee0f8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.224.248 PRIVMSG #esoteric :. < 1432662467 883748 :rdococ!95fee0f8@gateway/web/freenode/ip.149.254.224.248 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1432665131 571434 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98841263/octopus%20language/octopus_0000b%20commands.pdf < 1432665181 843146 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/98841263/octopus%20language/octopus_0000b.zip (the arduino source code. a *.ino is ascii text) < 1432665332 269783 :lleu!~gnomebad@158.223.174.95 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432665332 484186 :lleu!~gnomebad@158.223.174.95 QUIT :Changing host < 1432665332 484262 :lleu!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1432666795 263143 :hjulle!~hjulle@ankadagen.vth.sgsnet.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1432667333 994294 :bb010g!uid21050@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fhukeoqvlqcerpum JOIN :#esoteric < 1432667382 980780 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :crap...have to double the amount of cache variables < 1432667388 931942 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :...somehow < 1432667475 251070 :lleu!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1432667530 202122 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1432668374 906848 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: At least I'd put [y] "between" [u] and [i] if I had to sort them on a "scale". And also what nortti said. < 1432668505 212865 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: The problem you mentioned was kind of a known one, in the sense that I set up the backup address knowing people using https:// would have certificate problems, and sort of vaguely expecting it might cause something like that even when the regular domain name returned. Anyway, things should be back to normal now. < 1432668549 519170 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huzzah < 1432668580 936637 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I could've generated an esolangs.zem.fi certificate and have it serve that to anyone using the backup address and supporting SNI, but that felt like quite a hassle for up-for-less-than-a-day workaround.) < 1432668607 380566 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as a norwegian, i'd put [y] between [ʉ] and [i] < 1432668668 114455 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and [ʉ] between [y] and [u] < 1432668822 169152 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i suspect swedes do the same < 1432669472 211312 :mroman_!~roman2@fmnssun.ibone.ch PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: so... how's that Philosophy going? < 1432669472 440488 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman_: you can get a correct result, namely ( 3 ( l 3 i 1) < 1432669908 73985 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently it's solved. < 1432670092 644477 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I think the standard should be Artist - [Album -] Song [feat. Vocalist] [(DJ Blah mix)] [(from Game)].mp3 < 1432670120 584011 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :where [] indicates that it might not be there < 1432670318 911720 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if that will eliminate all conflicts, but it should come close < 1432670832 298402 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt that'd work for classical music very well. < 1432670859 406225 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I guess you can stuff multiple things in the 'Artist' and 'Song' fields. < 1432670930 683679 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also doesn't really disambiguate between different remasterings of the same song. Unless the "DJ Blah mix" field counts for that, too. < 1432670969 527829 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could put in (Radio Mix) or whatever < 1432671027 560317 :hilquias!~user@unaffiliated/hilquias JOIN :#esoteric < 1432671074 840428 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :right now I'm just manually changing things to roughly that format... I'm not sure how to account for songs that I literally have zero information... the mp3 has no info and is named the url of a long deleted youtube video < 1432671095 391244 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Play it back and run SoundHound on it. < 1432671105 748617 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: /me makes emself sparse for a while < 1432671153 300455 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say "run Google Music Search on it" since I kind of (very tangentially) work on that thing, but I can't honestly recommend it all that much -- it didn't even recognize this year's Eurovision songs! (SoundHound did.) < 1432671567 498861 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh geez... now that I'm playing it. it's a nightcored version of whatever the hell it is < 1432671675 252651 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess I can put it on my 3ds, open soundcloud on the samsung, and play it at various speeds until it recognizes it? < 1432671718 474083 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The Nintendo 3DS has the ability to adjest the speed of a song with the stylus) < 1432672007 57999 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1432672228 345899 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm... and searching for lyrics "jungle jungle jungle jungle jungle jungle jungle jungle jungle" doesn't work either < 1432672424 888825 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :HA! found it < 1432672621 702720 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a song from the Bollywood horror film "Agyaat" < 1432672690 892620 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07And14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43060&oldid=43059 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+18) 10edited examples < 1432672731 540242 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07And14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43061&oldid=43060 5* 03Rdococ 5* (-3) 10/* 99 bottles of beer */ < 1432672740 116212 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1432673489 92531 :hjulle!~hjulle@ankadagen.vth.sgsnet.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1432673827 760065 :ZombieAlive!~N3cr0naV@unaffiliated/zombiealive JOIN :#esoteric < 1432673853 489386 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1432674237 893568 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1432675217 991173 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1432675381 715967 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :man why did i avoid reading about homotopy type theory for so long < 1432675433 956638 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no they got Phantom_Hoover < 1432675477 100335 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :relax man i only read like 2 articles < 1432675505 390854 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :THAT'S HOW IT STARTS < 1432675523 948636 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey oerjan do you know much about knot theory < 1432675538 565251 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :knot a lot < 1432675543 823311 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1432675556 852067 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: that was pretty predictable hth < 1432675567 709687 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :my oerjan simulator is complete < 1432675568 380548 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: i thought so too < 1432675618 831028 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1432675644 885444 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: why do you hate hott < 1432675806 87184 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, do you not then know why there are so many fucking polynomials < 1432675866 582485 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I was in high school I thought polynomials all looked either like x^2 or x^3 < 1432675882 938046 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I have done quite well on my computability and complexity exam < 1432675894 916826 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, you can have polynomials over any semiring < 1432675900 980317 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are a lot of semirings < 1432675904 924804 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hence a lot of polynomials < 1432675910 970840 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then one day I realized x(x-1)(x-2) had three roots and you could not have three roots while looking like x2 or x3 < 1432675927 156309 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, yes but that doesn't explain why they're all tied up in knots < 1432675938 728899 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never believed in santa claus so I guess that realization was kind of the big thing < 1432676085 519795 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the three roots of santa claus < 1432676488 104803 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, why are you scared of hott anyway < 1432676492 616658 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen: Most of them do in physics < 1432676547 171065 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :believe in santa claus? < 1432676555 776302 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah physicists have all kind of weird beliefs < 1432676574 500230 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of ideas14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43062&oldid=43035 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+144) 10/* Game */lol < 1432676726 382387 :ZombieAlive!~N3cr0naV@unaffiliated/zombiealive QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1432676822 985410 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: it's the followers - their empty eyes collapsed into a point < 1432676848 547132 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that not common to all homotopy theorists < 1432676859 339082 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :could be < 1432677092 955870 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :otoh you get articles from them talking about how hard it's been to define the n-sphere or prove that the torus is the product of two circles < 1432677112 323731 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it does not inspire confidence in its practicality < 1432677163 604491 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the very straightforward parametric equation of the torus is literally a product of two circles < 1432677169 730234 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is that hard to prove? < 1432677222 323104 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably homotopists don't accept that definition < 1432677279 997712 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it too constructivistish? :( < 1432677297 146473 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :you define the torus in hott in terms of its homotopies < 1432677304 4450 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1432677345 428997 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess what they meant is "it's been hard to prove that our definition of the torus defines in fact a torus" < 1432677359 602734 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a point a, two loops p and q from a to a, and a homotopy h from q.p to p.q < 1432677369 471093 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_, more or less < 1432677537 620838 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1432677602 709743 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Koen_ < 1432677610 305426 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Lyka < 1432677635 957475 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I am a little annoyed < 1432677654 994667 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :was that you who helped out with the fourfuck page? < 1432677675 382389 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, why < 1432677699 389254 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, because people are complaining that the exam I just did was way too hard < 1432677712 549980 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was a little more difficult than the past papers, sure, but not that much more < 1432677716 166327 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it not in fact very hard < 1432677735 325919 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was the #esoteric exam right < 1432677755 820992 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: no. computational complexity exam or some such thing I believe. < 1432677778 422386 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, computability and complexity, so, yes, #esoteric < 1432677804 9149 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Questions involved "Is n^n in O(n!)? (3 marks)" < 1432677808 952057 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :your perspective might be a bit skewed :p < 1432677820 254703 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, it... fuck < 1432677821 875244 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps < 1432677825 76992 :hilquias!~user@unaffiliated/hilquias QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1432677828 746057 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've forgotten simpson's theorem < 1432677834 786398 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've forgotten if that's even simpson's theorem < 1432677836 178485 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover, the answer is "no < 1432677836 803457 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :" < 1432677874 799677 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not sure what Simpson's theorem is < 1432677904 334106 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it's stirling's approximation < 1432677969 416997 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's... not? < 1432677976 547739 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: people are always complaining about every exam < 1432678009 803884 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: yes < 1432678026 349165 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :n! is O(nn^n) then? < 1432678036 646511 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In my opinion LADSPA is a bit too simple and LV2 is a bit too complicated but I have the new idea of something similar actually < 1432678063 43624 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, yes < 1432678085 864519 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :if that was a typo for O(n^n), yes < 1432678116 197756 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :n! ~ k*(n^n)/(e^n), where k is root 2pi or some shit < 1432678141 706509 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's a bit overkill < 1432678144 824502 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :that times sqrt(n) < 1432678173 597065 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :n! is n * things smaller than n and n^n is n * things not smaller than n < 1432678173 873085 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed it's overkill < 1432678235 308749 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although the last question was a bit nasty, I thought < 1432678276 774082 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Language L_1 is in P, and Language L_2 is neither \emptyset or \Sigma*. Prove that L_1 can be reduced to L_2 in polynomial time" < 1432678276 960280 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a hello world, a 0 to 99, a 0 to 999, a fibonacci below 65536, and a non-terminating cat < 1432678425 761573 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm strting to doubt that the language is a brainfuck-derivitive < 1432678481 929352 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :integrate it and see if you get brainfuck hth < 1432678516 399467 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: hmmm are you talking about fourfuck? as far as i'm aware the author hasn't disclosed much more than "it's loosely based on brainfuck" and "commands are four characters long" so I don't know how you would have all those programs < 1432678519 845164 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_, just showing it's smaller isn't enough, you need to show it overwhelms constant multiplication < 1432678540 420384 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: one of the smaller factors is a 1 < 1432678542 976678 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's much smaller < 1432678550 331559 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so n! < n^(n-1) < 1432678552 120003 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-terminating cat? < 1432678556 55035 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that like http://spl.smugmug.com/Humor/Lambdacats/i-dVj9xxz/1/O/recurcat.gif ? < 1432678560 328772 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_: fourfuck is my language < 1432678565 899629 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: oh < 1432678568 108997 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's two ways of showing it we've come up with < 1432678590 282258 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or like http://cameronhunter.github.io/flight-edge/ ? < 1432678619 558466 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lyka: well, the things I added are mere suggestions; if this is your language, feel free to edit the page as much as you like < 1432678630 248180 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :including by removing or adding categories < 1432678635 507507 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :only 32683px? disappoint < 1432678686 498712 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It should keep expanding. < 1432678687 855888 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: correct me if I understand your problem wrong < 1432678741 342133 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Quit: *bubbles away* < 1432678761 184044 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: but "L_1 can be reduced to L_2 in polynomial time" is the same as "if I have a machine M2 that recognizes L2, then there exists a polynomial-time machine M such that M \circ M2 recognizes L1" < 1432678776 56758 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like that < 1432678782 125093 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1432678785 596849 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may have misremembered the question < 1432678792 537237 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and we already know L1 is polynomial-time < 1432678799 175359 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can just discard your M2 machine < 1432678840 564200 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :which should i do: leave the page alone and focus on getting the language to work for things other than fibonacci output and hello world? or delete the page and remove the link for now? < 1432678873 454263 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't work well having to document every step < 1432678874 778547 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well in my humble opinion, designing a language is much more interesting that editing a wiki page < 1432678879 266701 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_, hang on, let me check I am not misremembering the question, because that is backwards from what I put < 1432678920 366234 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1432678925 781814 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hanging on < 1432678950 795919 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable NICK :trout < 1432678964 723222 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :without objection, i'm gonna delete the page from the wii and remove the link in language list < 1432678978 28037 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the wiki < 1432679031 943491 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat PRIVMSG #esoteric :th language is changing too much < 1432679155 894405 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_, http://i.imgur.com/QC3ecg3.jpg < 1432679165 935885 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Question 8 there < 1432679187 417370 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, well I hold by what I said < 1432679208 929149 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"L1 is P" means you can solve L1 in P-time < 1432679212 561840 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I sort of interpreted it the other way round to you < 1432679227 819511 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1432679244 134362 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because L2 is non-empty, there is at least one string in it, say "a" < 1432679250 231404 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1432679255 834285 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because L2 is not full, there is at least one string in it, say "b" < 1432679266 504574 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not in it* but okay < 1432679288 360595 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, for a string w, if we define w' := if w is in P then a else b < 1432679295 455669 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which we can do in polynomial time) < 1432679303 12628 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then w is in L1 if and only if w' is in L2 < 1432679328 927792 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1432679335 228514 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is what I said < 1432679352 945487 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1432679359 481921 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in my exam. that is < 1432679361 457538 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1432679364 12096 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you check "if x is in P" in polynomial time? < 1432679375 369597 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean in L1 < 1432679377 171783 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry < 1432679386 491425 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1432679407 444622 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well okay that sounds great < 1432679469 287999 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to use every detail given in the question, which is a good sign < 1432679478 781020 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Fourfuck14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43063&oldid=43047 5* 03Lesidhetree 5* (+0) 10Removing my name... < 1432679511 669990 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07User:Lesidhetree14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=43064&oldid=43049 5* 03Lesidhetree 5* (-21) 10Removing my name... < 1432679528 817895 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :...64% of this exam was "What does this Turing machine do?" < 1432679556 276587 :MDream!~fyrc@c-71-58-118-227.hsd1.pa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It computes a value. < 1432679575 653746 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :MDream, in more detail than that, unfortunately < 1432679584 363686 :MDream!~fyrc@c-71-58-118-227.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDude < 1432679599 711459 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what value??? that's the question < 1432679621 527166 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of them instead recognized a language! < 1432679635 130101 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I guess I didn't really know the formal definition of language reduction, only the idea of problem reduction < 1432679648 38434 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: they computed a boolean value didn't they < 1432679656 522823 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess... < 1432679689 970434 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well "accept / reject / don't halt" isn't strictly speaking boolean maybe < 1432679708 45482 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_, the one that recognized a language was total < 1432679747 905955 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they they did do compute a value!! < 1432679752 426499 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1432679769 116481 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I need to revise for my Groups, Rings, and Fields exam on Thursday... < 1432679789 693917 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :surprise interrogation! < 1432679800 972257 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a syllow subgroup < 1432679802 335525 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whose? < 1432679808 989223 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh! I know this! < 1432679828 720088 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a subgroup of order p^n where p is prime and n is the multiplicity of p in the order of the group! < 1432679830 307509 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :or sylow or howevermany L there are < 1432679849 235782 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :One l I think < 1432679857 259757 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's an ideal? < 1432679886 800121 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :A subring I of a ring R such that for a in I and b in R, ab is in I < 1432679918 546556 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a field? < 1432679941 265752 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :A ring whose units are all elements other than zero < 1432679958 12305 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1432679966 211178 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does "unit" mean "inversible element"? < 1432679972 652430 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I think < 1432679978 37521 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought the unit was the neutral element for multiplication < 1432679983 327968 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :a is a unit if there exists a b such that ab = 1 < 1432679993 10425 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_, I'm just using the definitions I'm given, I am afraid < 1432679999 854093 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup that's good enough < 1432680011 232010 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a and b are in the ring, of course) < 1432680030 685040 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION carefully points out the ring should probably be commutative < 1432680048 987388 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lord of the rings < 1432680049 485613 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing some courses assume rings are or are not commutative so that would be the afraidful definitions < 1432680076 862609 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :my guess was the same except with "fields" < 1432680107 911126 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: you should probably know the chinese theorem as well < 1432680118 743788 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not gonna be in the exam but it's a fun story for parties < 1432680141 623235 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you missing a remainder or is this something i haven't heard of < 1432680151 454454 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, I think you *might* get commutativity for free? < 1432680165 9425 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I'm wrong < 1432680168 684979 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :You need commutativity < 1432680169 825427 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: no, there are "skew fields" or "division rings" < 1432680179 817252 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :err the french name is "théorème chinois", that might not be the english name though < 1432680199 218484 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :silly french < 1432680199 902108 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, you don't if it's finite, apparently < 1432680222 315012 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it says if you've got an unknown number N but you know two remainders of N by say a and b (and a and b are distinct and big enough) then you can calculate N < 1432680240 15042 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the legend says it was used by a chinese general to count his soldiers < 1432680241 700839 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_: "chinese remainder theorem" < 1432680245 365710 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1432680250 905452 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I was indeed missing a remainder < 1432680257 58016 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :thought so < 1432680273 627426 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am going to bed now < 1432680290 522951 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goodnight < 1432680291 87540 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION used that on the one question he managed to solve when in the IMO < 1432680302 746161 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thanks for the pop quiz, Koen_, it did help < 1432680309 832641 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're welcome < 1432680335 13279 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're is probably more to know about silow subgroups than their definition, though < 1432680340 976359 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there < 1432680387 437764 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1432680426 869043 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the chinese remainder theorem is an important (although not the hard) part of the theorem that you can do integer division in logarithmic space < 1432680429 765262 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar CYUL < 1432680430 55715 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYUL 262200Z 23015KT 30SM FEW050TCU BKN240 28/17 A2997 RMK TCU1CI6 SLP150 DENSITY ALT 1500FT < 1432680439 931209 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :summer has come. < 1432680447 148715 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar ENVA < 1432680447 556720 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ENVA 262150Z 27010KT 9999 FEW035 BKN049 09/05 Q1010 RMK WIND 670FT 28012KT < 1432680450 809583 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :SKEPTICAL < 1432680455 37037 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OKAY < 1432680584 444499 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: erm we learned how to do integer division in primary school didn't we? < 1432680593 114680 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_: not in logarithmic space < 1432680612 930627 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well we used digits < 1432680661 497686 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, a quadratic amount of them, i am guessing < 1432680704 397567 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough < 1432680721 482734 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although with mutable memory you can relatively easy reduce it to linear) < 1432680832 600911 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, I was wondering whether studying mixed time/space complexity was a thing? < 1432680849 23826 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i assume so < 1432680873 698987 :lleu!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1432680882 821043 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a lot of problems that can be solved in either very small space or very small time but the usual method to reduce space is to keep forgetting what you've already done and redoing everything a quintillion times < 1432680893 770753 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, mutable paper would be nice, like if erasers ersaed, as opposed to just spreading the graphite acros the page < 1432680928 371305 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :aquarel erasers do < 1432680974 173754 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Koen_: hm i am thinking of path reachability, it can be done in polynomial time or in log^2 space < 1432680988 287665 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can you get both at the same time? < 1432681009 333109 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I think that one was the problem that made me wonder < 1432681009 678061 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's the canonical NLOGSPACE-complete problem) < 1432681137 164414 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kneaded_eraser < 1432681189 545768 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more suited in painting when you want to erase the sketch without leaving pencil marks < 1432681208 94938 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1432681414 860318 :hjulle!~hjulle@ankadagen.vth.sgsnet.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1432681487 351914 :Lyka!scat@unaffiliated/schrodingerscat NICK :Lyka|Away < 1432681812 108573 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c2a85f.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION saw CESU-8 today :( < 1432681973 339987 :Koen_!~Koen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: The struct held his beloved integer in his strong, protecting arms, his eyes like sapphire orbs staring into her own. "W-will you... Will you union me?" < 1432682370 889605 :hilquias!~user@unaffiliated/hilquias JOIN :#esoteric < 1432682375 759673 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: my condolences < 1432682409 459932 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: 1 found in /dev/zero < 1432682456 89335 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cones with very large cone angles make good paper fans < 1432682461 600029 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? imhotep < 1432682462 346802 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imhotep? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1432682469 622585 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wasted potential < 1432682579 593035 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1432682599 362659 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1432683071 704324 :gde33!kvirc@546A0B75.cm-12-3a.dynamic.ziggo.nl QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1432683197 716838 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is this document clear to you? http://zzo38computer.org/textfile/miscellaneous/rdf/c_rdf < 1432683698 447779 :gde33!kvirc@546A0B75.cm-12-3a.dynamic.ziggo.nl JOIN :#esoteric < 1432683809 492529 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Sgello. what's a CESU-8? < 1432683940 970832 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :CESU-8 is encoding the UTF-16 codes of Unicode texts into UTF-8. < 1432684275 191151 :oren!~oren@TOROON0949W-LP130-01-1242511869.dsl.bell.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other words, codes outside BMP end up as 6 bytes instead of 4. < 1432684539 24008 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is how it is work < 1432684542 390877 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1432684578 423683 :pikhq!~pikhq@2001:470:c47a:1:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the UTF-8 encoding algorithm on UTF-16 units. Mostly a consequence of bad UTF-16/UTF-8 implementations and backwards compat with 'em. < 1432684666 687398 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily! < 1432684688 365054 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar KATL < 1432684688 680231 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@silicon.int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :KATL 262352Z 00000KT 10SM -RA FEW005 BKN120 BKN150 OVC200 20/18 A3021 RMK AO2 SLP221 P0002 60108 T02000178 10289 20194 55007 $ < 1432684691 989517 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :you got that right < 1432684724 12159 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A program I have written called "utftovlq" has no built-in CESU-8 support; however, you can convert between proper UTF-8 and CESU-8 by using a pipe of the program twice. If you tell it to convert UTF-8 to UTF-16 and then back again, you get proper UTF-8 out. If you tell it to convert UTF-8 to UTF-16 and then RAW-16 to UTF-8, the output will be in CESU-8 format. < 1432684785 662662 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the rain is incessant this part of summer. thunderstorms daily.)