< 1442534408 63218 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[077Basic14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44264&oldid=44263 5* 03161.184.231.102 5* (+189) 10Added compiler section. < 1442534445 660006 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just realized something < 1442534466 728870 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which is what? < 1442534470 193252 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Given a board with infinitely repeated sections, snakes & ladders is turing complete < 1442534480 259133 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, sho wthe proof < 1442534511 269644 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok imagine you have an infinite repeated grid < 1442534530 832105 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :except the first row and first column have different contents < 1442534557 907415 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :your x and y position in the grid are basically 2 counters < 1442534574 383651 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't snakes&ladders one-dimensional though? < 1442534620 894102 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :each cell on the grid contains a repeat of the same snakes & ladders squares < 1442534639 223120 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's one dimensional but it's repeated in a 2d infinite grid < 1442534670 175375 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, OK < 1442534678 296762 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :since the top row and left column have different contents, you can test if your x or y counter are zero by having a different path in those cells < 1442534706 30919 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can increment the x counter by having a path that goes rightways to the next repeated cell < 1442534729 452731 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :likewise, you can decrement x by going left, increment y by going down, or decrement y by going up < 1442534776 686741 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1442534781 319997 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, you're in a current "state", one of N finite states < 1442534802 741018 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that state is represented by the current path you're on in the current cell < 1442534853 949700 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means you have a 2 counter minsky machine -> https://esolangs.org/wiki/Minsky_machine < 1442534880 768733 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is turing complete < 1442534910 187157 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the 2 counter minsky machine works by taking the infinite tape, encoding it as 2 stacks < 1442534929 854923 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :encoding the stack as 2 infinitely large counters < 1442535033 248068 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(using the last digit of the counter as top of the stack, doing counter *2 to push a zero, counter *2+1 to push a one, counter /2 to pop, checking for odd/even to read the top of the stack... the second counter is present for manipulation) < 1442535063 956077 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means you can get your infinite tape with only 4 counters < 1442535129 900087 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can represent your 4 counters using 2 counters by representing your 4 counters as 2^c[0] * 3^c[1] * 5^c[2] * 7^c[3] < 1442535140 467143 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and using the second counter for manipulation < 1442535200 33411 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a version that's based on befunge but with only PC direction change commands but it's the same thing: http://esolangs.org/wiki/nopfunge < 1442535311 548967 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works for any 2d path as long as you can merge 2 paths and you have wire crossings < 1442536538 407724 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sooooooooooooooooooooo < 1442536834 398434 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :My computer isn't turing complete < 1442537141 189006 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :... oooooooooooooooooooooo... < 1442537461 464876 :mihow!~mihow@50-206-98-70-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Quit: mihow < 1442537501 8657 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: NiTC < 1442538146 785534 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hioly! < 1442538159 331277 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily! < 1442538188 957682 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :NEW INFORMAL CS TERM: < 1442538192 624987 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :CETC < 1442538199 616107 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Close Enough to Turing Complete < 1442538225 530555 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's that? < 1442538246 873585 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :bound storage machines that would be turing complete given some means to access infinite storage? < 1442538255 624821 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1], if your language isn't tc then do the job properly and figure out what class it's in < 1442538266 276910 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a bunch of sub-turing classes for exactly this reason < 1442538268 286781 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: NO < 1442538270 697198 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :*No < 1442538279 128459 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean to describe computers < 1442538304 39966 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since we can't build a computer with Infinite Memory, we can't build TMs < 1442538316 98745 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you mean the fact that actual computers have memory limits or whatever then i've always thought of that in terms of abstractions < 1442538318 410014 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose a "Bounded State Automaton" is the proper term for that < 1442538360 945486 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: True, true. A language might not be able to emulate a TRUE TM on a given computer, but it can still be TC < 1442538397 910184 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If we allow it to work such that it doesn't have an aribtrary memory limit AS PART OF the language < 1442538400 589135 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it comes down to the spec < 1442538408 963961 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exactly < 1442538434 823859 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you could have a conformant implementation that's TC then the language is TC < 1442538443 367820 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so C is subturing because of the memory limit) < 1442538451 144477 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the spec says "Arrays can only be 1000000 items long", and it isn't under "Implementation notes" or the like, then it isn't TC (assuming we make all the other assumptions) < 1442538492 20041 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I would propose we define "CETC" which describes something that /would/ be TC if it weren't for the fact that we're in the real world < 1442538600 528754 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would prefer a different kind of definition, such as, the number of bits in stuff is implementation-defined but is otherwise TC < 1442538621 174674 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That works too < 1442538742 354750 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you should also have ABNQEUTC. < 1442538797 146048 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 QUIT :Quit: COCONUT CHICKEN < 1442538805 479702 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How is b::=~0 < 1442538805 749991 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b::=~1 < 1442538805 927842 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ac::=abc < 1442538805 927898 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :::= < 1442538805 927925 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :abc nondeterministic? < 1442538814 608188 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seems like it would just constantly output "0" < 1442538888 581846 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, when multiple definitions for a word is given, does the Spec not define how to interpret it? < 1442539132 635910 :adu!~ajr@c-73-133-129-229.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442539387 32624 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both the rule b::=~0 and b::=~1 are possible to use, so which one is used is not specified. < 1442539477 278026 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1], exactly that < 1442539521 430404 :madbr!boulam@69-165-212-148.cable.teksavvy.com PART :#esoteric < 1442539528 153052 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're guaranteed that a valid substitution will be performed but which one specifically is down to undefined behaviour < 1442539537 795844 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y'know, I think I don't like languages that are purely dynamically typed. < 1442539552 24425 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1442539555 564769 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want my static typechecking. < 1442539574 103078 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I don't know what sort of value a variable will hold, I'll say so. < 1442539671 95935 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :We need to compoile a list of TC mathematical systems. < 1442539698 123076 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's a "mathematical system"? < 1442539702 765650 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: So you want Dynamic AND static typechecking? Basically, you should have a "dyn" type? < 1442539716 836496 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I just needed a quick term for something I don't entirely understand < 1442539722 101291 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Examples are: < 1442539772 949433 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Re static and dynamic typechecking: more or less. C# has static typechecking, but you can also cast anything to "object", and it performs dynamic typechecking when you try to cast it back. < 1442539817 191807 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :C# also *does* have a "dynamic" type; if you have a variable of type "dynamic", then you can attempt to call any method or access any property, and the existence of such a method or property will be checked at runtime. < 1442539852 504102 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Unrestricted Grammars (Thue) < 1442539852 828602 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Turing Machines (every normal language) < 1442539853 5969 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Combinatorics (Unlambda) < 1442539853 6049 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :* Lambda Calculus (Haskell) < 1442539856 868726 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Et cetera. < 1442539888 516552 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nod* Mathematical models of computation. < 1442539888 943064 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just a database so that people can find a system (or more) on which to base a new esolang < 1442539897 430067 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: THERE we go! < 1442539971 128294 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is: "List of Turing-Complete Models of Computation" a good place to put that list? < 1442539978 97033 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett? < 1442540017 469471 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is SOLELY for the TC stuff and generally things you'd WANT to make a language based on) < 1442540035 22189 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sounds good. Put in sentence case, though. < 1442540040 630258 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"List of Turing-complete models of computation" < 1442540189 308661 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, in my imaginary programming language, you can define "varieties", which are essentially (finitely generated) categories with all finite limits. < 1442540249 524276 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Individual varieties are categories. Varieties also form a category; homomorphisms between varieties are the objects. < 1442540279 131311 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can also define a variety called "Category", which is the variety whose algebras/models are categories. < 1442540321 746351 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Please make up the document so that we can see its working < 1442540370 591113 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably do that at some point. < 1442540408 474292 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: by the way, I'd say normal languages really don't resemble Turing machines much at all. < 1442540426 388493 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Fair enough < 1442540441 306982 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say that Turing machines are a somewhat bad model of computation, in that it's hard for a computer programmer to come up with a Turing machine that executes a given algorithm. < 1442540457 436624 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lambda calculus is much better in that respect. < 1442540477 622310 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the reason we keep talking about Turing machines is mostly tradition. < 1442540508 961255 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, probably it is < 1442540509 608854 :MDude!~fyrc@67.235.0.195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What about a reverse turing machine where the tape is the code and the state macine is the data? < 1442540548 784488 :MDude!~fyrc@67.235.0.195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if there's entirely a difference other than which one changes at run time. < 1442540553 464913 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, you *should* be able to express the fact that since varieties are categories, and categories are models of the variety "Category", varieties are models of the variety "Category". < 1442540578 36758 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So far, I haven't found a way to tie these three levels of categories together. < 1442540683 205341 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been working at sort of a dizzyingly high level of abstraction. < 1442540718 564970 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider an ordinary mathematical value, like, I dunno, the string "abc". < 1442540781 393952 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This string is an element of some algebra—namely, the algebra of strings over a certain alphabet. This algebra is a model of some variety—namely, the variety of monoids. This variety is an object in an overarching category—namely, the category of varieties. < 1442540899 28158 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Level 1 things are elements of the algebras. Level 2 things are the algebras which model the varieties. Level 3 things are the varieties that classify the algebras. There's only one level 4 thing I'm dealing with, which is the category of varieties, but I can foresee adding a finite number of additional level 4 things. < 1442540901 612823 :Dante!627c5733@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.124.87.51 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442540908 448710 :Dante!627c5733@gateway/web/freenode/ip.98.124.87.51 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442540968 491047 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I suppose what I want is a way to treat higher-level things as being lower-level things. < 1442541012 255632 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The category of varieties (a level 4 thing) isn't explicitly mentioned in the language, but I should be able to treat it as being a variety (a level 3 thing). < 1442541029 767332 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I should be able to look at any variety (a level 3 thing) as if it were an algebra (a level 2 thing). < 1442541047 455928 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, finally, I should be able to look at any algebra (a level 2 thing) as if it were just an element of an algebra (a level 1 thing). < 1442541086 411143 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 N10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=44265 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+1429) 10Created page. I'm not very good at this. < 1442541128 431316 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: good start. < 1442541134 304354 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yuy < 1442541214 880790 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just realized "included for completeness" is a joke xD < 1442541227 63003 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the way, I think you want to say "combinator calculi" instead of "combinatorics". < 1442541312 699651 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44266&oldid=44265 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+0) 10Fixed a CN < 1442541503 118153 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44267&oldid=44266 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (-20) 10Fixed some stuff < 1442541539 420103 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44268&oldid=44267 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+0) 10Fixed it. One last time. < 1442541552 177692 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Oh. < 1442541599 355857 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: Perhaps Combinatory Logic is what I meant? < 1442541637 502065 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :More or less the same concept, I think. I don't totally understand the distinction between the terms. < 1442541641 690341 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44269&oldid=44268 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+11) 10s/Combinatorics/Combinatory Logic/ < 1442541680 7999 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like these idea but you should need some document to tell it better. < 1442541693 347042 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you know what to write so far!) < 1442541715 9342 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just linking to the Wikipedia pages for now xD < 1442541725 621718 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does anyone here know of MOAR TCnesses? < 1442541755 860827 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many things are Turing-complete, including Wang tiles < 1442541834 957324 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION googles wang tiles < 1442541844 824511 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH GOD WHY WOULD YOU SEND ME TO THIS PAGE < 1442541854 485375 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look in Wikipedia isn't it? < 1442541962 404751 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was kidding < 1442542039 604365 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: WANG-TILE BASED PROGRAMMING LANGUAGE < 1442542044 321842 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that feasible? < 1442542051 788617 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's definitely possible. < 1442542063 179067 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But is it feasible? < 1442542089 589755 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know < 1442542109 726567 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1442542111 869956 :sc00fy!~scoofy@catv-89-135-80-2.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1442542118 493982 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you were to search my house, would you be able to find a toy zebra? < 1442542118 739515 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :People have implemented Rule 110 in CSS < 1442542137 273621 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: That's exactly why I think it may be infeasible < 1442542140 47781 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes, you don't know whether something is possible or not until you've done it. < 1442542155 911383 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: I don't know. That depend on many things including whether or not you have a toy zebra in your house and where it is. < 1442542158 797129 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I imagine it's probably feasible. < 1442542185 367730 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And if you tell me to get out and call the police for breaking and entering into your house) < 1442542269 146001 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made up this Dungeons&Dragons prestige class: http://zzo38computer.org/dnd/class/wizard_of_knowledge Do you have opinion/complaint of it? < 1442543665 285611 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not very good at this Minesweeper game I made up; my best time is 878 < 1442543734 823015 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The game is 30x16 with 95 bombs) < 1442544978 957785 :MDude!~fyrc@67.235.0.195 NICK :MDream < 1442545924 182991 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44270&oldid=44269 5* 03Zzo38 5* (-48) 10Using interwiki links < 1442546353 330204 :oren_!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :man there are a lot of apl symbols < 1442547026 102282 :bb010g!uid21050@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pxqupznpbejhqksx JOIN :#esoteric < 1442548549 936998 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-092-072-164-084.092.072.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1442550118 646049 :oren_!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :⍀⍁⍂⍃⍄⍅⍆⍇⍈⍉⍊⍋⍌⍍⍎⍏⍐⍑⍒⍓⍔⍕⍖⍗⍘⍙⍚⍛⍜⍝⍞⍟ < 1442550306 312882 :Jafet!~jafet@unaffiliated/jafet PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (length "⍀⍁⍂⍃⍄⍅⍆⍇⍈⍉⍊⍋⍌⍍⍎⍏⍐⍑⍒⍓⍔⍕⍖⍗⍘⍙⍚⍛⍜⍝⍞⍟", length ['a'..'z']) < 1442550308 32327 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : (32,26) < 1442551078 947164 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net < 1442552348 488921 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1442552371 306475 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1442552419 74477 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1442552973 649875 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Blackberry14]]4 N10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=44271 5* 03Virgolang 5* (+1141) 10Created page with "It Is a programming language that is stack-based, imperative and long-liner. And I wrote this article from my BB 8520. = Instructions = Instructions is base of Blackberry. == ..." < 1442553539 706229 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is that last bit supposed to be relevent? < 1442553585 587544 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Nopfunge14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44272&oldid=44256 5* 03Keymaker 5* (+1776) 10Fixed my MM translator and added it back. < 1442553841 439312 :copumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1442553926 98979 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1442554644 407720 :adu!~ajr@c-73-133-129-229.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1442555879 135608 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1442555925 122651 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442556338 654804 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It looks like wang tiles AREN'T TC < 1442556353 548876 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :YOu probably read the Wiki Page before that was corrected < 1442556361 852426 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :OR it was corrected wrongly < 1442556533 565407 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: How is that? I don't see anything like that? < 1442556553 81082 :JesseH!~JesseH@oftn/member/JesseH QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1442556563 899854 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I read the wiki page. It didn't mention Turing Completeness. < 1442556567 651154 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I read the talk page < 1442556581 968991 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone said they'd corrected it and that it wasn't TC < 1442556593 880051 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :How WOULD it be TC, anyway? < 1442556623 294926 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, I can see on the talk page, but the article says you can translate any Turing machine into Wang tiles < 1442556691 18922 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: If and only if that TM does not halt < 1442556700 260828 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyways, someone is asking for a proof that it is not possible to compute functions. Well, I have no proof or disproof of such a statement < 1442556720 724978 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ not// < 1442556729 56911 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think they were kidding < 1442556772 424001 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm googling ""is turing-complete"" < 1442556780 488707 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :To find new and exciting TC things < 1442556809 972749 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: It says they tile the plane if and only if that TM does not halt. < 1442556833 579346 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1442556835 93096 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Weird < 1442556845 22059 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could've sworn it only works if it does < 1442556903 152659 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that isn't what it says? < 1442556988 294081 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure "translating any Turing Machine into Wang tiles" counts as being Turing Complete... < 1442556990 422072 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :<Sgeo>30 "If there is a curb, turn your steering wheel completely away from it if your vehicle faces up the hill," < 1442556990 599890 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :20<Sgeo>30 I'm confused, if the wheel is pointed away from the curb and the car starts moving backwards, won't it move away from the curb? < 1442556990 599975 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :20<Sgeo>30 Or am I confused about steering wheels < 1442557001 749907 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, where is the computation in a wang tile? < 1442557078 851591 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless it means converting it into a /set/ of Wang Tiles for which the /solution/ can be converted /back/ into the TM's solution < 1442557080 806574 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well < 1442557083 715333 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Solution" < 1442557100 328359 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also am not quite sure by now, but it seem to me that it would be somehow, but I am not quite sure < 1442557104 666707 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose TMs don't have a solution, especially not ones that don't halt < 1442557229 156205 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A Turing machine halts if and only if there exists a proof that it halts. (But you cannot necessarily prove that it does not halt.) < 1442557278 270811 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think that "if and only if" means you can < 1442557291 520242 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wait < 1442557297 108850 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :No it doesn't < 1442557306 560333 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because that proof is hard to find xD < 1442557819 64578 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@133-171-58-66.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1442559870 451688 :^v!~^v@68.41.215.101 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1442562070 554895 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, that is correct < 1442562139 610714 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz JOIN :#esoteric < 1442562626 966392 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@94-224-66-163.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1442562881 903385 :bender|!~benderx2@unaffiliated/bender/x-9459530 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442563954 269016 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-64-199.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1442565260 822396 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@cust-101.ktknet.cz QUIT :Quit: *bubbles away* < 1442565657 900342 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1442566829 377197 :heddwch!heddwch@76.8.3.189 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1442566881 445951 :heddwch!heddwch@76.8.3.189 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442567132 390835 :impomatic_!~digital_w@212.159.126.45 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442568849 443165 :sc00fy!~scoofy@catv-89-135-80-2.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1442571173 863271 :sc00fy!~scoofy@catv-89-135-80-2.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1442571349 364310 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1442571456 573415 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-117-239.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1442571532 367514 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442573669 19742 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 TOPIC #esoteric :ɛ̃ˈglɪʃ spɛˈliŋ ʀɘfɔʀm/ | https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2023808/wisdom.pdf http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/ | https://esolangs.org/ < 1442575508 824736 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 QUIT :Quit: POSSESSED CHICKEN < 1442577266 678918 :x10A94!~x10A94@178.252.73.97 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442577539 566908 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-117-239.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1442577826 833298 :ashl!~ash@185.83.217.70 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ɛˈglɪʃ? < 1442578112 542309 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's only spoken in igloos < 1442578179 705638 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1442578658 806887 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@37-219-117-239.nat.bb.dnainternet.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1442579200 96207 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ask hppavilion[1] um, you _do_ know about https://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:Computational_models, right? i'm not saying there shouldn't be a main page but you don't need to link to wikipedia for most of these. < 1442579200 274142 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1442579429 553982 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are petri nets not on this list? < 1442579494 469382 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :because no one wrote a page, i guess. < 1442579649 634080 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i see you changed the wikipedia links to be interwiki. this is a perfect example of why i dislike those: these are links to wikipedia pages that could mostly have been to our own pages instead, but there's no visual difference in my browser so if i don't click them or look at the source i won't see that there is something to correct. < 1442579854 465589 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: what? don't interwiki links have a different color than intrawiki ones? < 1442579898 217151 :impomatic_!~digital_w@212.159.126.45 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are people still playing BF Joust? < 1442579933 367285 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic_: sure < 1442579953 656756 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic_: the next expansion set is coming out in a few days < 1442579991 701062 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: if there's a difference it is ridiculously subtle. < 1442580017 372517 :impomatic_!~digital_w@212.159.126.45 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Modified rules? < 1442580026 958405 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :far smaller than the difference between visited and unvisited links < 1442580094 215633 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: these are _not_ ordinary external links, but special namespaces for wikipedia etc. that mediawiki allows by default < 1442580176 669033 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :impomatic_: b_jonas is joking, however zemhill is now working again, so there was recently a little activity. < 1442580206 233731 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :EgoBot also works, though. < 1442580261 578362 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I'm joking about M:tG, sorry. < 1442580386 834108 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1442580416 953921 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44273&oldid=44270 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-2) 10Fix case and make links point to our own wiki, see also < 1442580483 665785 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07List of Turing-complete models of computation14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44274&oldid=44273 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+4) 10missed one < 1442581052 236199 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :too stupid, eh... < 1442581147 7385 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: what < 1442581241 728625 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: just quoting randomly from that esolang wiki article < 1442581642 842898 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`2014 < 1442581643 488556 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1442581668 70957 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cat bin/2014 < 1442581670 514364 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​#!/bin/sh \ if [ $(date +%Y) = "$(basename "$0")" ] \ then echo "Hello, world!" \ fi < 1442581816 725441 :impomatic_!~digital_w@212.159.126.45 QUIT :Quit: http://corewar.co.uk < 1442582452 354403 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1442582953 46454 :TieSoul!~quassel@86.89.119.147 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442584019 38712 :trn!jhj@trnsz.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1442584105 405082 :trn!jhj@trnsz.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1442584108 447457 :Wright!~Wright@98.225.44.92 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442584925 422991 :tswett!~tswett@192.241.237.138 QUIT :Changing host < 1442584925 601252 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett JOIN :#esoteric < 1442584961 482368 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07User:B jonas14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44275&oldid=40175 5* 03B jonas 5* (+120) 10 < 1442585102 449782 :Wright!~Wright@98.225.44.92 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1442585668 74384 :bender|!~benderx2@unaffiliated/bender/x-9459530 NICK :bender\ < 1442585673 166203 :bender\!~benderx2@unaffiliated/bender/x-9459530 NICK :bender| < 1442585736 886536 :bender|!~benderx2@unaffiliated/bender/x-9459530 NICK :bender < 1442586118 512617 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover NICK :FreeFull_ < 1442586126 479840 :FreeFull_!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover NICK :Mooji < 1442586134 891858 :Mooji!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover NICK :FreeFull < 1442587955 142809 :Crazy4Tech!~death@ip-asfortal-30.143.fortalnet.com.br JOIN :#esoteric < 1442589550 147417 :nortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :rhyfel < 1442589576 991622 :rhyfel!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :lirael < 1442589582 102975 :lirael!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :snorttiu < 1442589583 307885 :snorttiu!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :snortti < 1442589620 291788 :snortti!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :wombatman < 1442589663 311681 :wombatman!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :unbender < 1442589673 788592 :unbender!nortti@ayu.smar.moe NICK :nortti < 1442589787 106615 :Crazy4Tech!~death@ip-asfortal-30.143.fortalnet.com.br QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1442590099 451370 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-32-83.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1442590099 666568 :sebbu2!~sebbu@ADijon-152-1-32-83.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Changing host < 1442590099 666605 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1442590118 344023 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1442590120 301478 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu < 1442590290 4448 :bender!~benderx2@unaffiliated/bender/x-9459530 QUIT :Quit: [g2g] < 1442590606 261521 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@c83-253-72-191.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1442590606 439549 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@c83-253-72-191.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Changing host < 1442590606 439609 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric < 1442591882 247267 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell hppavilion[1] Who says you have to be able to be able to *use* a model of computation? You can just convert a program into Wang tiles and call it a day. < 1442591882 462554 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1442592711 770989 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want my quantum computer already < 1442592796 974898 :bb010g!uid21050@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pxqupznpbejhqksx QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1442592893 751300 :MDream!~fyrc@67.235.0.195 NICK :MDude < 1442593187 649020 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that requires a time-traveling quantum computer < 1442593330 586579 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :this might be slightly relevant and i might eventually get through enough of my tabs to read it myself http://www.scottaaronson.com/blog/?p=2464 < 1442593367 87932 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :now back to elliotts and extraterrestrials. < 1442593377 742825 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :* & < 1442594535 874686 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442594719 513991 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1442594872 217842 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :What combinators are there? < 1442594880 277840 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :SKI, BCKW, Y, what else? < 1442594976 443311 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1442595036 354280 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :several called "X", I remember reading about a few more < 1442595112 201860 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't there a whole combinator bird book < 1442595114 410537 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't even need I, SK is enough < 1442595148 24065 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_Mock_a_Mockingbird < 1442595165 517985 :^v!~^v@c-68-41-215-101.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442595191 709145 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :this has a list http://www.angelfire.com/tx4/cus/combinator/birds.html < 1442595199 646315 :olsner!~salparot@c83-252-193-184.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I should read that book < 1442595232 469418 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could you use CSS to change interwiki links to a different colours? < 1442595277 370106 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1442595324 61287 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: i'm pretty sure we asked elliott about that some time, and there was a problem... < 1442595327 609216 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: But the other reason I changed them is because one of them wasn't working anyways < 1442595360 165380 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well now i changed most of them to point at our own wiki < 1442595373 157816 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is better anyways < 1442595547 124652 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Oh right, To Mock a Mockingbird < 1442595553 333075 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's on my Amazon Wishlist :) < 1442595575 80070 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interwiki links have the "extiw" CSS class, so you should be able to change the colours using that in your user CSS < 1442595595 229219 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh < 1442595642 857841 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to make a non-tarbit based on Combinator Calculus < 1442595650 82212 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably called Bluebird < 1442595667 684133 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can format self links too) < 1442595691 892992 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Alps, named after the SKI combinator calculus < 1442595699 358575 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/tarbit/tarpit/ < 1442595725 856827 :Thisbe!~Thisbe@207.197.114.192 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442595744 212738 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: as usual, i'd prefer it to work for everyone < 1442595745 371696 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :.extiw { color: blue; } < 1442595754 628280 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :B(BBB)(B(BBB)) < 1442595760 141075 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bald Eagle Combinator < 1442595773 353301 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can set it in the global CSS then, and then users who do not want that can disable it in their user CSS. < 1442595835 881890 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait < 1442595842 713987 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the guy in charge ON IRC with us? < 1442595894 775613 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in charge of what? < 1442595953 254985 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of the Wiki < 1442595966 769490 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: are you with us? < 1442595974 819185 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: i'm pretty sure i could set it too < 1442595978 464139 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as could ais523 < 1442595989 269228 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh < 1442595990 973611 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting < 1442595991 941051 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie is currently in charge of the wiki (in terms of having the highest level of permissions) < 1442595998 225750 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaaah < 1442596001 219766 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Didn't know that < 1442596004 264936 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but several people here have pretty high permissions, such as me and oerjan < 1442596013 196758 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1442596020 8224 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't sure who was who in this world xD < 1442596028 864888 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've changed CSS before < 1442596050 151525 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :We should fix the page on Combinatory Logic < 1442596062 589472 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It only talks about the SKI cominbators, which is wrong < 1442596094 549719 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: you can fix that yourself if you like, although probably in a separate section < 1442596097 208775 :^v!~^v@c-68-41-215-101.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1442596100 856224 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or at least talk about other than just important combinators < 1442596113 29292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambda calculus maps pretty well onto S, K, I, Y < 1442596129 478641 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :untyped lambda calculus doesn't need the Y, because you can implement it in terms of the others < 1442596144 326536 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can be implemented as (SK)K, although that's mostly just coincidence < 1442596155 414278 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Combinatory logic14]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44276&oldid=38949 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+17) 10Added a heading for when I update this later to talk about other important combinators < 1442596159 440102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I is like ~ from Underload, it isn't technically needed but it fits really neatly into the language < 1442596201 940916 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: ais523: We have interwiki links? What color are they now? < 1442596211 335704 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stack Based Combinatory Logic Language < 1442596219 445126 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are currently afaict identical to internal links < 1442596228 637953 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'd use the S, B, C, and L combinators (see what I did there?) < 1442596230 534887 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: we have one to Wikipedia, and I thought they were light blue < 1442596258 523813 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or well, they might be _slightly_ lighter blue < 1442596268 442634 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can be implemented as SKK? < 1442596270 121357 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :same colour as external links, but without hte arrow < 1442596287 382604 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make them even more difference if you want to then < 1442596288 512228 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what i'd liked is to add the arrow. < 1442596301 244938 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps their own symbol < 1442596312 16592 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Esolang:Sandbox14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44277&oldid=43900 5* 03Ais523 5* (+59) 10testing various links < 1442596318 985121 :JesseH!~JesseH@oftn/member/JesseH JOIN :#esoteric < 1442596323 624970 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :here, spot the difference: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Esolang:Sandbox < 1442596339 657056 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like night and day. < 1442596365 277274 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure you could also add a symbol with CSS. < 1442596394 880773 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately, I've visited the pages on intercal xD < 1442596406 997934 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i vaguely recall there was some problem doing that < 1442596442 309969 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least in Mozilla it is possible to turn off visited links formatting globally < 1442596442 487914 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The external link icon seems to be added by a "background-image: url(data:...);" style. < 1442596452 15957 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442596456 406105 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Which I have done) < 1442596477 303193 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: more over there are heaps them for different formats < 1442596479 934886 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442596480 902607 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*- < 1442596492 96027 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: more over there are heaps them for different formats < 1442596495 419962 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*- < 1442596497 218590 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mm. < 1442596517 894900 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found a way to make Combinatory Logic languages a /little/ easier to read < 1442596534 848080 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, later -> < 1442596539 560955 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make the lexer detect combinators with this regex: /[A-Z][a-z]*/ < 1442596555 309736 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And ignore whitespace, of course < 1442596571 515474 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :And colons at the end of combinators < 1442596571 783276 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442596585 929164 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442596687 43148 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442596705 68678 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1442596711 51552 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That'd make it easier to read < 1442596726 357516 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442596758 355177 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Constant: x (Conatant: x) < 1442596771 81277 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That produces the Identity combinator < 1442596807 64866 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442596830 33486 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you add with combinators? < 1442596840 472823 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442596927 157345 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442596941 869069 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442597171 781139 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442597201 552415 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442597259 424575 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1442597291 869216 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442597778 447269 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598131 735455 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442598144 580163 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598247 30397 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442598335 601626 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598624 629350 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598800 866347 :Thisbe!~Thisbe@207.197.114.192 QUIT :Quit: Thisbe < 1442598827 664792 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again < 1442598831 799269 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you add with combinators? < 1442598834 441670 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442598900 640954 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, numbers? < 1442598900 858844 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you have to figure out how you're representing numbers first. < 1442598905 361601 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Church numerals are good. < 1442598912 275101 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598922 324050 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1]: you add with combinators the same way you add with any other Church numeral < 1442598946 934194 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION looks up the definition of addition in The Underlambda Project < 1442598947 622179 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION forgets what Church Numerals are < 1442598958 999916 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see. Zero is KI, one is I, two is... eh, who cares about two. < 1442598962 574822 :nycs!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598967 185698 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442598970 803234 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION thinks they're how you represent numbers in Lambda Caclucus < 1442598983 60028 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :All right, let's do lambda calculus numbers instead. < 1442598983 447027 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442598992 180021 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the formal definition is apparently a(:)~*(~a*^)*~*(~*)* < 1442598993 609983 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zero: \f. \x. x < 1442598998 221043 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :One: \f. \x. f x < 1442599009 793620 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Five: \f. \x. f (f (f (f (f x)))) < 1442599013 879360 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :You get the picture. < 1442599026 216125 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there's a note that it can be optimized < 1442599040 537128 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you kow for a fact that you're dealing with integers < 1442599060 215339 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett: you can convert \f.\x.f(f(x)) to combinators using the usual algorithm < 1442599065 345308 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I jus forget what the usual algorithm is < 1442599090 141763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's probably on the unlambda website (that is, the algorithm definitely is, the result of applying it to 2 might be) < 1442599124 81110 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see. Start with the first bit, you get \f. S (K f) f. < 1442599134 315243 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then do it again, and it's, uh. < 1442599152 588529 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1442599158 379712 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :S (S (K S) S) I, I think? < 1442599173 482637 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Um, make that... < 1442599179 912901 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :S (S (K S) K) I. < 1442599201 406779 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Unlambda website says 2 is ``s``s`kski < 1442599215 818917 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it agrees with you < 1442599224 90321 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 3 is ``s``s`ksk``s``s`kski < 1442599234 492265 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see. S (S (K S) K) I f x = S (K S) K f (I f) x = K S f (K f) f x = S (K f) f x = K f x (f x) = f (f x) < 1442599277 558015 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is "so easy". < 1442599278 182193 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Parenthesis are important in Combinatory Logic, correct? < 1442599282 784721 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup. < 1442599286 181876 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or are they just decorative? < 1442599287 34821 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1442599294 399176 :tswett!~tswett@unaffiliated/tswett PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or some other way of specifying precedence. < 1442599300 237969 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :That makes making a Combinatory Logic language a /bit/ more difficult < 1442599307 159632 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : To decrement (and hence to substract) Church integers is by no means impossible. I don't know if it can be done with even moderate efficiency, however. < 1442599326 438442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Underlambda Project subtracts integers via forming a lookup table of all possible subtractions, and then indexing it < 1442599531 452647 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Combinatory Haskell, anyone? < 1442599597 617953 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1442599599 567628 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :So < 1442599807 9156 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442599819 297521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442600051 746787 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442600241 297738 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442600287 45898 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442600373 447286 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442600826 421445 :hppavilion[1]!~Lordofthe@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1442601247 2965 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442601839 815928 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442601909 160764 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1442602062 112379 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do I tell Mozilla to request HTTPS resources from a proxy rather than tunneling the connection through the proxy? < 1442602430 463265 :sc00fy!~scoofy@catv-89-135-80-2.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1442603154 109078 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sure, if you want efficiency, you'd use some sort of radixal numerical representation, like base 2 or a higher base for efficiency < 1442603177 465743 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have haskell code for binary integers at http://www.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/Bin.hs < 1442603206 323298 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously then you have to know how to translate algebraic structures to lambda calculus or directly to unlambda < 1442603229 312040 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1442603256 392339 :sc00fy!~scoofy@catv-89-135-80-2.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1442603407 49399 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442603487 607928 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442603836 455287 :MDude!~fyrc@67.235.0.195 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1442603958 53 :NewHorizons!~Horizons@174.110.41.80 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442604367 19490 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442604403 376970 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442604611 739891 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1442604641 216289 :NewHorizons!~Horizons@174.110.41.80 PART #esoteric :"See #NewHorizons for info" < 1442604976 334295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442605652 879016 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Stare/1.014]]4 M10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44278&oldid=44206 5* 03Hppavilion1 5* (+2) 10Changed the procedure with arguments syntax (I DID say it was frozen, but I realized this makes lexers stateless and thus easier) < 1442605811 733126 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442605916 67337 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PART :#esoteric < 1442605922 364024 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1442606051 11728 :mihow!~mihow@50-206-98-70-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442606832 995042 :nycs!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1442607389 624577 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much do you know of the very old rules of Magic: the Gathering? I don't know much about it. < 1442607427 843365 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How old? < 1442607490 283369 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :From before Alpha up to Fifth Edition < 1442607575 342882 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they had things like interrupts until Fifth Edition. < 1442607607 500568 :atrapado!~atrapado@unaffiliated/atrapado JOIN :#esoteric < 1442607618 119502 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, they had complicated timing rules I do not completely understand, although I saw a diagram, the diagram doesn't explain everything. There was also damage prevention steps. < 1442607703 316866 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they may not have understood the rules completely either. < 1442607724 496380 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could only target spells (to counter it or whatever) *before* it was placed onto the stack, I think; once it reached the stack it was too late. < 1442607726 540237 :x10A94!~x10A94@178.252.73.97 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1442607727 185154 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa whoa whoa, they had so many great cards back then < 1442607735 301492 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like Illusionary Mask < 1442607768 539986 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were a lot of interrupt steps inside of other interrupt steps, and I think even the damage prevention step is a normal step inside of an interrupt step, but with the restriction that only damage prevention effects can be played. < 1442607811 65185 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you don't lose due to running out of life points until the end of a phase. < 1442607822 889221 :Hoolootwo!~Hoolootwo@d1g1t4l.be QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1442607835 291905 :Hoolootwo!~Hoolootwo@knexflux.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442607970 74382 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Artifacts were disabled when tapped, I think also mana abilities were interrupts (although on lands this was implied, on other cards it must be specified) < 1442608098 708498 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pre-sixth edition rules? no, luckily I don't know them. < 1442608159 421043 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have also seen some cards from before Alpha, and can see how those work too (but I am not certain about any of this): The large mana symbol on lands existed before Alpha, activation costs implicitly included tapping (there was no "Mono Artifact"), activation costs were printed next to the casting cost, mana costs like "5GG" meant "five manas, at least two of which are green", Plains cards had pictures of airplanes on it < 1442608451 399297 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The old Magic: the Puzzling are using old rules, so it would help to know all of the old rules of various editions < 1442608501 315627 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442608726 75181 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a idea though, a kind of Magic: the Puzzling where it has one solution that works only without manaburn and another solution that works only if manaburn is reinstated < 1442608736 402784 :puckipedia!puck@irc.puckipedia.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1442608866 431993 :puckipedia!puck@irc.puckipedia.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1442608894 773486 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to see if any of you who can see my "Wizard of Knowledge" prestige class of Dungeons&Dragons game to see any suggestion to fixed or whatever < 1442609386 270371 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1442610351 670897 :TieSoul!~quassel@86.89.119.147 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1442611501 469105 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :}<}}}<}}<}}}<}}<}}<}}<}}}}<}}}<}}<}} < 1442611529 826547 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :S1: Which is what? < 1442611546 167426 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/BitChanger < 1442611573 424929 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :KO < 1442611574 692184 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK < 1442611576 244192 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ignoring the memory mapping of Gregor Richards and simply mapping every next eight bits to one ascii char, my program should be a valid greeting < 1442611683 283630 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(cause I'm not sure if that Gregor Richards mapping belongs to the specification or just is an extra idea) < 1442611697 12924 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(so I'm ignoring it for now) < 1442611790 256111 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Specification" is pretty arbitrary with esolangs. < 1442611806 720408 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forced that style of I/O on the world by being the only person who implemented the language. < 1442611807 736961 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what I mean < 1442611818 820136 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1442611825 974241 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'll have to get used to that, oh well < 1442611837 647598 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or make your own impl *shrugs* < 1442611843 617697 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea yea some day < 1442611845 950880 :Gregor!dlopen@libdl.so PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or modify egobch to do whatever you'd like < 1442612751 921172 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :do the laundry? < 1442612818 835014 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@94-224-66-163.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in < 1442613521 804271 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442614210 373920 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1442614293 908002 :APic!apic@apic.name QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1442614476 959827 :Wright!~Wright@c-98-225-44-92.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442614567 122834 :APic!~apic@apic.name JOIN :#esoteric < 1442614684 615145 :staffehn!~quassel@2001:41d0:52:d00::1d3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1442614834 843002 :staffehn!~quassel@2001:41d0:52:d00::1d3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1442614919 72936 :APic!~apic@apic.name QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1442614962 553574 :S1!~S1FeHa@p4FF93031.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Quit: We are the revolutionaries < 1442616978 792385 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you tell Mozilla to request HTTPS stuff from a proxy rather than making the connection through the proxy? < 1442617147 986457 :hppavilion[2]!~Devourero@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1442617193 725228 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1442617290 507143 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-9.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://forums.mozillazine.org/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=358889 This is what I want it to do < 1442617597 924053 :oren_!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hell♨! < 1442617633 127729 :atrapado!~atrapado@unaffiliated/atrapado QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1442617695 100639 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellore! < 1442617718 97140 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(let's check the logs. not sure it went through correctly.) < 1442617738 821312 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, nah. < 1442617768 597530 :oren_!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unicode  < 1442617769 911429 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :U+F6A7 - No such unicode character name in database \ UTF-8: ef 9a a7 UTF-16BE: f6a7 Decimal:  \  () \ Uppercase: U+F6A7 \ Category: Co (Other, Private Use) \ Bidi: L (Left-to-Right) < 1442617818 762681 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was supposed to be U+1F6A7 CONSTRUCTION SIGN. somewhere the astral plane character was basicified. < 1442617820 214408 :oerjan!oerjan@sprocket.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :bohily < 1442617826 248574 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellørjan! < 1442618194 606644 :Patashu!~Patashu@c27-253-115-204.carlnfd2.nsw.optusnet.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1442618197 506385 :hppavilion[2]!~Devourero@74-114-87-67.dynamic.asdk12.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1442618465 741594 :llue!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu JOIN :#esoteric < 1442618468 842339 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ask ais523 whoa, what's rnz() all about? < 1442618469 20490 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1442618564 830252 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? rnz < 1442618565 398441 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rnz? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1442618573 302184 :lleu!~gnomebad@unaffiliated/lleu QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1442618839 810900 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=44279&oldid=44261 5* 0374.122.187.254 5* (+13) 10Ajsone < 1442618918 498226 :oren_!~oren@65.94.102.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: maybe it's a typoed nrz? < 1442618997 692186 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Ajsone14]]4 N10 02http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=44280 5* 0374.122.187.254 5* (+686) 10Ajsone < 1442619211 122743 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No Raptor Zone? Natural Rhinoceros Zoo? fungot? < 1442619211 338663 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: i find there is no < 1442619221 120385 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, so the no raptor zone it is. < 1442619798 262416 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a random variable with the best distribution. < 1442619829 59154 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://nethackwiki.com/wiki/File:Rnz100.svg < 1442619866 610498 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many natural processes are well approximated by the rnz distribution. (Disclaimer: lie.) < 1442619918 277156 :boily!~alexandre@96.127.201.149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's used in a nasty perverse roguelike. it's a direct manifestation from the RNG. it's an EVIL distribution! < 1442620222 752379 :^v!~^v@c-68-41-215-101.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1442620703 365640 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric : I guess I should ask coppro. < 1442620713 110989 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :coppro: What's with rnz()? < 1442620778 580692 :hppavilion[2]!~Devourero@93-231-58-66.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric