00:03:36 that's surprisingly profound. 00:04:58 So, let me see if I think Kripke-Platek set theory is "obviously" arithmetically sound. 00:07:57 -!- mauris has joined. 00:08:40 Hmm. Axiom of union. Hmmmm. 00:08:47 -!- hppavilion[2] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 00:09:18 how do you see what you think? 00:11:45 -!- hppavilion[2] has joined. 00:12:11 -!- hppavilion[2] has changed nick to hppavilion[1]. 00:13:50 I wanted to make up a Magic: the Gathering card with "Entwine {0}", and also there can be possibility such as noncreatures with devour, or creatures with "Devour 0", or strange effects with overload, or dash on noncreatures, and there can be other thing 00:15:15 Imma create a List of Operators 00:15:31 hezzo38. what's entwine again? 00:15:44 . o O ( smooooth list of operators ♪ ) 00:22:20 Entwine is an additional cost you can pay to choose all modes of the spell instead of just one 00:24:37 -!- j-bot has joined. 00:28:59 [wiki] [[List of operators]] N http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=45688 * Hppavilion1 * (+2971) Basic arithmetic 00:36:20 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45689&oldid=45688 * Hppavilion1 * (+780) /* The operators */ Roots and logarithms 00:37:40 olsner: by means of squirrels. 00:38:41 tswett: I see 00:39:01 tswett: So where /is/ `neutral ? 00:40:17 So I'm pondering what a model of KPST might be. 00:40:27 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45690&oldid=45689 * Hppavilion1 * (+74) /* The operators */ new categories, completely empty 00:40:30 hppavilion[1]: nobody's made it. 00:41:58 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45691&oldid=45690 * Hppavilion1 * (+82) /* The operators */ Formatting 00:42:34 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45692&oldid=45691 * Hppavilion1 * (-74) Removed additional sections 00:43:43 Hm... 00:43:49 What other types of operator are there? 00:44:29 Arcturian mega-operators? 00:45:11 Man, there are so many. 00:45:18 Lemme name a few... 00:45:29 Integration, differentiation, convolution, Fourier transform and its buddies. 00:45:33 Like the Laplace transform. 00:46:02 Unary exponentiation, the famous exp(x) function. 00:46:20 The power set operator. 00:46:36 Inverse and composition of functions. 00:47:19 Dot product, cross product, absolute value/norm, signum. Outer product, tensor product. 00:47:27 Direct product, direct sum. 00:48:02 Opposite--not the additive inverse operator, but the operator that takes an algebraic structure and returns a flipped-around version of it. 00:48:07 `? opposite 00:48:08 opposite? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ 00:49:19 `le/rn opposite/Eht etisoppo yrogetac fo a yrogetac si tsuj taht yrogetac, tub sdrawkcab. 00:49:21 Learned «opposite» 00:50:05 The constant-function operator. 00:50:12 tswett: also known as mov 00:50:14 Union, intersection, complement. 00:50:17 wait, no 00:50:27 mov operator ignores its right argument and returns the value of the left argument 00:50:33 like comma from C, but with the arguments reversed 00:50:38 err, no, same as comma 00:50:41 it's returning its right argument 00:50:55 "MOV a, b" means "a = a MOV b", which means "a = b" 00:51:16 #define COMMA 00:51:19 a = COMMA(a, b); 00:51:37 Anyway... 00:51:49 String concatenation. 00:51:54 tswett: that's both beautiful and ugly at the same time 00:52:05 Cartesian product, which is a special case of direct product. 00:53:09 -!- ais523 has quit (Quit: my computer's fan is acting up, trying to standby and destandby the computer to fix it, this breaks my Internet connection for a while). 00:53:30 Disjoint union, a special case of direct sum. 00:53:35 Set exponential. 00:53:41 Interior, closure. 00:54:10 I think Gaussian blur counts as an operator. 00:54:12 -!- ais523 has joined. 00:54:30 Limit, summation. 00:55:22 isn't Gaussian blur a convolution? 00:55:29 Yes. 00:55:47 Vector projection. 00:57:06 Rotation, translation, scaling, shearing, and so forth. 00:57:40 hppavilion[1]: ^ ^ ^ there are a couple to get you started. 00:58:18 <\oren\> 成戦投折拾持指挙整料旅族旗昔昨昭景暑暗 00:58:20 tswett: Thanks 01:00:35 Integration, differentiation, convolution, Fourier transform, and Laplace transform work on numeric functions and similar things. 01:00:55 Unary exponentiation works on numbers. 01:01:08 -!- ^v has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:01:11 Fuzzy Ternary Logic? Value is any real number between -1 and 1? 01:01:27 That sounds interesting. 01:01:46 <\oren\> yay I fixed the glitch in Thai 01:02:57 <\oren\> hmm but ๆ็่้๊๋์ํ๎ is still happening 01:03:18 <\oren\> `unidecode ๆ็่้๊๋์ํ๎ 01:03:19 ​[U+0E46 THAI CHARACTER MAIYAMOK] [U+0E47 THAI CHARACTER MAITAIKHU] [U+0E48 THAI CHARACTER MAI EK] [U+0E49 THAI CHARACTER MAI THO] [U+0E4A THAI CHARACTER MAI TRI] [U+0E4B THAI CHARACTER MAI CHATTAWA] [U+0E4C THAI CHARACTER THANTHAKHAT] [U+0E4D THAI CHARACTER NIKHAHIT] [U+0E4E THAI CHARACTER YAMAKKAN] 01:05:23 <\oren\> that's not su much a bug in my font as a bug in my character lisitng program 01:05:57 <\oren\> Oh I know, I'll output a zwnbsp between each character 01:06:14 that whole sequence of characters renders vertically in Konversation 01:06:25 so maybe it's meant to look like that? 01:06:40 <\oren\> it is, but I don't want it to 01:06:51 <\oren\> I want to show each character on its own 01:07:02 -!- ^v has joined. 01:07:06 Isn't zwnbsp the byte-order mark? 01:07:30 <\oren\> yah 01:07:44 And isn't that deprecated? 01:07:55 <\oren\> but it will prevent the combining characters from doing so 01:07:57 Like, you're supposed to use the... word non-joiner? 01:08:06 <\oren\> oh fuck that noise 01:09:03 Here we go. Zero-width non-joiner. U+200C. 01:09:03 <\oren\> everything is deprecated 01:11:35 <\oren\> doesn't work 01:15:35 <\oren\> wow zwnbsp doesn't work either 01:18:58 <\oren\> aha 01:19:14 <\oren\> ๆ ็ ่ ้ ๊ ๋ ์ ํ ๎  01:21:31 <\oren\> eh good enough 01:23:34 <\oren\> ไม่เป็นไร 01:24:26 <\oren\> สวัสดีครับ 01:24:56 <\oren\> hmm the accents (?maybe not called tat) aren't showing up in my terminal 01:26:01 <\oren\> but this terminal is optimized for CJK... 01:26:24 <\oren\> ...whitch doesnt' have any accents, so ok then 01:26:30 -!- mauris has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:27:50 -!- jaboja has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 01:38:14 good job, \oren\ 01:40:21 Perhaps I should develop a functional language 02:02:18 you should finish one implementation of one language 02:03:35 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 02:08:30 -!- ais523 has quit. 02:13:43 -!- ais523 has joined. 02:19:26 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined. 02:37:10 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 02:41:04 vinestalker monk with blade hands. mwah ah ah ah ah ah AH AH AH AH AH :D 02:43:38 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 02:43:55 -!- Patashu has joined. 02:57:27 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 03:11:21 -!- doesthiswork has joined. 03:13:17 -!- boily has quit (Quit: NURSING CHICKEN). 03:55:46 -!- ais523 has quit. 04:01:12 -!- ais523 has joined. 04:32:31 hello ais523 04:32:39 hi quintopia 04:34:25 i wrote you a 3sp in python. python handles the dynamic memory allocation 04:34:37 so 04:34:48 yep, I saw it patrolling the wiki 04:34:50 now can you explain to me how one would go about doing anything of interest in it 04:34:57 it's probably less efficient than the C 04:35:09 PROBABLY 04:35:57 -!- gonad has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 04:36:53 quintopia: http://nethack4.org/esolangs/cytag-to-3*.pl is my notes on how to program in it (is eventually planned to be a compiler but so far I've only written the docs) 04:38:18 however it has most of a complete program there, with "fill in the gaps" suggestoins 04:38:31 just needs me to get motivated to finish it; the problem is a rather more complex construction is needed to produce output 04:51:00 -!- MDude has changed nick to MDream. 04:51:54 ais523: okay makes sense. sort of what i expected i guess. would it be possible in any way to make input of any sort work and do anything useful? 04:52:17 the problem is trying to come up with an input method that fits the flavour of the language 04:52:36 so you've got nothing, is what you're saying? 04:52:44 yep 04:52:59 or, well, you'd probably have to write -1 in the program to take input 04:53:08 but it's unclear precisely what it would do if you did 04:53:31 you couldn't take input unconditionally (or else you'd be forced to input faster than output), so it'd have to do nothing based on the value of a particular tape element 04:53:36 the obvious thing to me is to specify an "input register" that, for each character of input, gets run ord(c) times 04:54:10 what do you mean by "gets run"? you mean that it gets dereferenced three times and that target is incremented ord(c) times? 04:54:17 yes 04:54:31 and let it be specifiable by the program 04:54:34 which one does it 04:54:51 how do you control whether input is even read, though? 04:54:52 (unless that's not necessary) 04:55:00 same as you just said 04:55:03 right 04:55:17 one thing I care about is not breaking backwards compat on programs that don't understand I/O 04:55:22 that's easy with output but harder with input 04:56:13 well if you could fix which register is the input register, then do that. two even numbered registers like with output 04:57:04 output is odd numbered registers (intentionally, because I had something like the construction I linked in mind when I set things up) 04:57:17 although it turns out that all that's really required is for them to have low numbers and skip 0 04:57:43 ah 04:57:44 well 04:58:08 as far as backwards compatibility, don't you already include a flag for turning IO on and off in your interpreter? 04:58:37 nah, the first interp I wrote is very basic 04:58:43 oh 04:58:45 it always gives debug output and I/O, although to different output channels 04:58:55 so you can pipe them to /dev/null 04:59:10 also it's very slow as it re-parses the input each main loop 04:59:19 well, perhaps you could just have it be nonblocking IO. do nothing if it fails to read a byte. then it's backwards compatible. 04:59:30 haha, I like that actually 04:59:50 it fits in excellently with some plans I had for something related 05:00:03 also doesn't "fragment the language" like adding an option would 05:00:46 it'd be harder to golf an interp (and Three Star Programmer is by far the simplest OISC I know, and I've looked at a bunch recently), so there are downsides 05:00:55 but you can always make a no-input interp to get it as small as possible 05:06:20 yes 05:06:47 i think 3sp will go in the record books for "shortest interp" 05:07:03 even with IO its like three statements in a loop 05:07:30 -!- MC8 has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 05:07:36 (compared to resplicate's 6 w/o IO) 05:08:18 quintopia: you can write the main loop of a MiniMAX in eight bytes 05:08:23 of 8086 asm 05:08:40 that's possibly beatable but I don't know how 05:08:52 ofc, reading in the program, I/O, et., are all expensive 05:09:04 compared to that 05:11:34 -!- lleu has joined. 05:17:28 i can't wait to chain your resp->cytag compiler with your cytag->3SP to get rot13 in 3SP 05:17:38 (although, i'd have to add I/O to the former) 05:26:55 -!- MC8 has joined. 05:27:03 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined. 05:27:54 -!- j-bot has quit (*.net *.split). 05:30:47 quintopia: err, my compiler's the other way round, cytag->resplicate 05:31:00 oh right 05:31:09 well 05:31:43 i'll figure out the other way. sounds like a hard problem 05:32:17 cyclic tag shouldn't be an awful compilation target, though; it's based on tag systems (and has a pretty direct compilation from them), which in turn have a relatively direct construction from Turing machines 05:32:29 the problem is that you have an O(n) slowdown 05:45:39 The following command can be used to calculate how much it is worth in Scrabble: tr a-z A-Z | tr -dc A-Z | tr A-Z 133214241813113A11114484A | utftovlq 8w | tr \\0 + | dc -e '0?p' 05:52:03 what does utftovlq do? 05:53:23 It converts the input; in the case "utftovlq 8w" it will add a null byte after each byte of input. 06:02:17 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 06:18:44 zzo38: that sounds like a good golfing challenge 06:36:29 zzo38: did you create that command yourself 06:36:55 zzo38: could you also include in the command a check that the word is in the ospd 06:37:54 zzo38: or else at least make sure it is the right length and doesn't contain more copies of a letter than are included in a scrabble set 06:40:42 I did write both utftovlq and the full pipeline text by myself. I did not intend it to check validity, although that can be another program. 06:45:11 -!- Alcest has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 06:48:14 what all can utftovlq do? 06:48:25 To do a Pythagorean numerology method you can do: tr A-Za-z 1-91-91-81-91-91-8 | tr -dc 0-9 | dc -e '?8+9%1+p' 06:49:09 can i see the utftovlq program? 06:49:42 -!- Alcest has joined. 06:51:42 http://zzo38computer.org/prog/utftovlq.zip 06:52:23 It is compatible with both text and with binary data. 06:54:34 -!- ais523 has quit. 06:54:49 It includes the man page too 06:54:50 -!- ais523 has joined. 06:56:43 And it contains several examples of how to do it! 06:58:33 -!- doesthiswork has quit (Quit: Leaving.). 07:33:40 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined. 07:58:35 ais523: why is it that in the reduction at https://esolangs.org/wiki/Reversible_Brainfuck the first block of four has the search mark and data cell positions swapped? 07:59:23 quintopia: you might want to ask oerjan (who wrote that construction) rather than me (who merely invented the language) 08:07:14 ah 08:07:21 zzo38: neat 08:11:15 <\oren\> I've successfully generated a TTF version of b_jonas's fecupboard20 08:12:11 -!- heroux has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 08:12:12 -!- idris-bot has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 08:12:12 -!- Melvar has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 08:12:48 -!- FreeFull has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 08:13:02 <\oren\> (so I can try it in my terminal) 08:13:47 -!- heroux has joined. 08:14:21 -!- FreeFull has joined. 08:15:14 <\oren\> this is how it looks http://www.orenwatson.be/fecupboard20.png 08:17:17 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45693&oldid=45692 * Hppavilion1 * (+1138) /* The operators */ New sections, !! 08:17:50 <\oren\> the native size appears to be 15 points 08:23:46 <\oren\> wait, that's obvious: 20 px * 0.75 pt/px = 15 pt 08:24:50 <\oren\> qwertyuiopasdfghjklxcvbnm 08:25:04 -!- Melvar has joined. 08:25:12 <\oren\> hi Melvar 08:38:11 hppavilion[1]: it needs a section for string/sequence operators 08:38:31 quintopia: Right, right. Could you add that? 08:40:04 nope 08:43:06 i just had an idea though. a tape language with two tapes where the only control flow is swap tapes. dp becomes ip and v/v. (or you specify ip when swapping). its reversible! 08:59:36 have the data pointer only able to move backwards 08:59:47 and see if you can still make it TC 09:00:15 (almost certainly you can if the language is complex enough, I was thinking more of a tarpit) 09:00:16 I hope you can 09:06:15 ...i like it 09:07:21 one further: swap tapes also swaps the meanings of instructions to their reversed equivalents :p 09:07:50 A language based on excellent-bifurcation 09:08:07 what 09:08:38 Jafet: Bifurcation as in ~ATH, or is that a word outside of ~ATH I haven't heard before outside that context? 09:10:20 Hmm, maybe that doesn't make sense 09:10:53 hppavilion[1]: "bifurcation" is a generally applicable English word, but one that isn't used very often 09:11:14 https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bifurcation 09:11:42 wow, it has a lot of definitions, but most of them are just more specific versions of the general one 09:11:45 It would need to have two threads, each of which has a fixed behaviour, and the crucial control flow is to swap them 09:11:55 specialized to certain themes 09:11:59 Jafet: cyclic tag? 09:14:18 Not quite, the threads would run in parallel, and don't swap every cycle 09:15:13 https://www.allegro.cc/depot/ExcellentBifurcation 09:51:30 -!- evalj has joined. 09:55:23 hppavilion[1]: ~ATH? 09:55:57 FireFly: It's on the wiki 09:56:13 Hard to explain 09:56:20 So I'd just check the page on it 09:56:28 oh 10:26:11 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 11:02:28 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined. 11:02:52 -!- andrew has joined. 11:22:47 -!- Welo has joined. 11:31:59 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 11:49:08 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 12:21:07 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 12:25:44 -!- oerjan has joined. 12:30:45 cool, allegro is still active 12:30:56 -!- mauris has joined. 12:31:00 i used it years ago 12:31:22 ah, the memories... :') 12:33:12 actually most of those memories are related to my high school crush because he taught me 12:36:38 is this allegro the rendering library? 12:36:46 err, also input and so on, but mostly rendering 12:36:55 yes that one 12:37:14 I used that in my second year project for drawing the predicted path of a robot with various motion algorithms 12:37:25 mostly because I wanted to compare the algorithms, prior to placing them into the robot 12:42:39 did you name it Karel 12:45:33 hm would that have been a double reference 12:45:39 no, I didn't 12:55:10 -!- evalj has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 13:04:09 -!- boily has joined. 13:04:31 hoily 13:05:26 hellørjan! 13:07:20 next up, trying to understand your 3 year old brainfuck derivate code 13:07:27 *your own 13:10:23 obviously quintopia is right about the layout, now i'm wondering about the [ ] reductions... 13:12:34 as in, i'm starting to be pretty sure the translation for [ should start [<< not [>> 13:12:56 no, wait 13:13:41 i have to remember that [ works opposite to normal brainfuck. aaargh 13:14:27 that's the whole point of the language, after all :-) 13:14:57 argh i don't have vim on this rented pc 13:15:07 (and i cannot install it, it's too locked down) 13:17:19 what programming languages do you have available, if any? 13:17:30 heh 13:17:33 are any of them IO-complete enough to write a quick vi clone? 13:17:49 well technically i can use vim inside the putty tmux, which is on a linux system. 13:17:54 :P 13:18:08 ais523: that seems a little excessive 13:18:35 OK ed then 13:18:42 O KAY 13:19:13 actually i mainly wanted it to match brackets for me, but i found them by eye. 13:20:21 that sounds like almost as much overkill as the time I wrote a bracket-matcher using the MediaWiki API 13:20:30 isn't there a standalone vim version for windows? 13:20:42 his523. that sounds painful. 13:20:47 (admittedly it was intended to match brackets in MediaWiki markup, which has both {{ }} and {{{ }}} as bracket-pairs and writing things like {{{{{{{ is perfectly legal) 13:21:04 (so using the existing parser over the API is easier than trying to figure out wtf the input means) 13:21:22 evil 13:21:46 is {{{{{{ {{ {{ {{ or {{{ {{{? 13:22:13 or { {{ {{{? 13:22:39 boily: it's {{{ {{ {{ or {{ {{{ {{ or {{ {{ {{{ depending on what sort of closing brackets you match it with 13:23:08 oh, there are seven of them. 13:23:15 oerjan: about the layout of what? 13:23:25 boily: now you see why I wrote the bracket matcher ;-) 13:24:56 also wow, that sounds horrible, about {{{{{{{ 13:26:41 FireFly: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Reversible_Brainfuck#Computational_class 13:27:42 fff carpentry 13:29:27 fahrenheit furlong firkin? 13:29:41 ESSENTIALLY 13:31:22 -!- ais523 has quit. 13:31:34 -!- ais523 has joined. 13:31:58 OKAY 13:34:58 -!- atslash has joined. 13:35:08 ok i think my [ ] code is still correct 13:35:20 [wiki] [[Reversible Brainfuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45694&oldid=33896 * Oerjan * (+18) /* Computational class */ Whoops 13:35:31 “a bracket-matcher using the MediaWiki API” hehe 13:35:57 -!- boily has quit (Quit: APOSTATIC CHICKEN). 13:37:38 @tell quintopia FIXED 13:37:38 Consider it noted. 13:40:51 -!- MDream has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:41:05 hm right the code was correct so testing wouldn't have revealed it. not that i remember if i did any... 13:41:07 -!- MDeam has joined. 13:41:31 -!- ais523 has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 13:44:11 <\oren\> good morjan! 13:44:28 good afternoren! 13:45:22 -!- rdococ has joined. 13:45:57 good moren 13:46:43 -!- ais523 has joined. 13:48:18 * oerjan thinks ais523 has an unstable connection 13:48:33 this is actually much more stable than usual atm 13:48:47 shocking 13:48:54 I have multiple unstable connections 13:49:02 * int-e wonders when oerjan sleeps these days 13:49:06 I connect to irc from the least unstable. 13:49:30 int-e: woke up an hour ago 13:50:02 but it's been unstable 13:51:20 @time oerjan 13:51:21 Local time for oerjan is Sun Nov 29 14:51:20 2015 13:51:33 only an hour off 13:52:17 meh, everyone here is either from Norway or the UK, so everyone is within an hour localtime. 13:52:20 not lambdabot's fault if oerjan's client is lying 13:52:31 b_jonas: not \oren\ hth 13:52:52 or shachaf hth 13:53:10 -!- sebbu has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 13:53:13 my client is quite accurate. 13:53:35 @time shachaf 13:53:36 Local time for shachaf is Sun Nov 29 05:53:35 2015 13:53:49 mine isn't hth 13:54:22 oerjan: and liftrashir is from the antipodes, yeah 13:54:45 s/liftrahsir/lifthrasiir/ 13:54:54 um 13:54:55 or something 13:54:58 fix spelling 13:55:14 i recommend tab completion hth 13:56:03 your client is so broken it doesn't even support VERSION tdnh 13:57:52 I don't think we have a lot of regulars from Norway 13:57:54 perhaps that's intentional 13:58:03 I don't know how russian works. <-- afaiu russian has a completely sensible system for marking stress that no one uses. probably a trap to keep foreigners from learning proper pronunciation (the stress affects _everything_ else) 13:59:29 also, Ё 14:00:40 -!- jaboja has joined. 14:01:06 oerjan: yeah, basically. but also, I hear they do mark stress in a few cases where the word would be ambiguous without. 14:01:09 or something. 14:01:41 but where are the precomposed vowels with stress marks? 14:01:52 fiendish 14:02:15 and don't say they're rare, because so what? unicode is full of precomposed combinations that are rare. I think it even has korean syllables that were never used. 14:02:49 (although maybe there are some people who have it as their life goal to invent words with all ten thousand possibly syllables, or something.) 14:06:09 Meanwhile characters in APL that are clearly two characters with one overstruck on the other are all precomposed, meaning one can't easily extend it to new ones 14:06:11 :( 14:07:07 FireFly: well, you can't have more than 2**12 characters all together even with overstriking, because there's only 12 holes in a column, right? 14:07:19 so it's a bounded set, even if we haven't exhausted it all. 14:08:10 -!- digitalcold has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 14:08:34 hm wait, did the /bits/ in the encoding overstrike as well? 14:08:39 -!- digitalcold has joined. 14:08:39 and not just the glyphs? 14:08:50 -!- nvd has changed nick to Taneb. 14:08:58 or where does "12 holes in a column" come from? 14:09:11 FireFly: not in APL, but in some punch card programming languages yes 14:09:17 Huh 14:09:24 Fascinating, I didn't realise that 14:13:20 b_jonas: my survey indicates that every precomposed korean syllable is used somehow, even very infrequently (the minimum frequency of 1 over 10 years of IRC log) 14:16:05 Now use that corpus to produce a (syllable, count) table? 14:16:16 might be interesting to see which ones are least frequent 14:16:39 FireFly: I have that, wait a min 14:17:05 anyway, I believe that the primary rationale for the full set of 11,172 hangul syllables is that it is not easy to split "frequently used characters" from "infrequently used characters" (the set is very variable, ranging from 2,000 characters to 8,000 characters) and the split is not really beneficial at that point 14:17:29 algorithmic assignment of hangul syllables simplified the job of every implementor a bit 14:17:59 FireFly: http://cosmic.mearie.org/2012/06/hangeulusage/freqs.txt 14:18:18 Hm, what is the third column? 14:18:29 Oh, cumulative sum 14:18:34 yup 14:19:45 KS X 1001 is a widely used set of "frequent" characters (cardinality 2,350), but in my dataset the first character not in KS X 1001 was at #636 14:20:02 ah 14:20:03 wait 14:20:38 my count was wrong, there *are* some precomposed hangul syllables not in my dataset 14:20:46 I confused that with KS X 1001 characters 14:21:01 there are 1,454 characters left unused out of 11,172 syllables 14:21:37 I should learn hangul, it seems so easy and systematic 14:21:50 lifthrasiir: oh, being used in IRC doesn't count. people paste random stuff to IRC. 14:22:12 (or re-learn, if you will. I read through a description of how it works once, but didn't really make an attempt to learn it properly) 14:22:15 -!- doesthiswork has joined. 14:22:29 but sure, it's probably worth to include all them 14:22:44 b_jonas: my analysis was that these are either mojibakes or typos (approximately equally probable) 14:22:56 and sometimes, Aheui code :) 14:23:00 ok 14:36:20 I'm surprised that oren still hasn't automated drawing all ten thousand for his font though. 14:38:43 [wiki] [[CompressedFuck]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45695&oldid=44688 * LegionMammal978 * (+62) 14:52:00 <\oren\> I'll eventally do that when I'm done with joyo kanji 15:06:56 -!- ais523 has quit. 15:12:09 -!- ais523 has joined. 15:22:08 -!- ais523 has quit. 15:27:22 -!- ais523 has joined. 15:37:07 -!- mauris_ has joined. 15:40:04 -!- andrew has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 15:40:08 -!- mauris has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 15:40:51 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Later). 15:41:14 compression algorithm tailored to brainfuck seems to be a niche 15:52:32 -!- sebbu has joined. 16:01:35 -!- lleu has quit (Quit: That's what she said). 16:04:38 https://www.destroyallsoftware.com/talks/useing-youre-types-good very funny 16:09:57 :D 16:29:36 -!- ais523 has quit. 16:31:41 izabera: oh, great 16:33:21 <\oren\> hhahsaha 16:34:32 <\oren\> omg win98 good times 16:38:04 <\oren\> no way would win98 boot that fast tho 16:39:17 <\oren\> hahahah dependedncy injection attack 16:40:06 <\oren\> omg it's in comic sans too 16:43:59 <\oren\> b_jonas: should I put the ttf version of fecupboard20 up on my website? 16:47:52 -!- tromp has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 16:49:28 <\oren\> Or perhaps you'd like to ost it on your webitE? 16:49:42 <\oren\> goddamn laggy ssh 16:54:28 <\oren\> why doesn't windows support any bitmap fonts anyway? 16:56:30 -!- Sgeo_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 16:58:50 -!- zgrep has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:01:30 -!- zgrep has joined. 17:05:25 -!- tromp has joined. 17:06:06 -!- Lord_of_Life has joined. 17:17:06 -!- J_Arcane has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:35:13 <\oren\> I have 100 characters to add left before I reach 6000 17:36:24 what a huge project 17:40:49 \oren\: http://cosmic.mearie.org/2015/11/font/test-sample.png I've beaten you! (of course, kidding) 17:41:22 I've converted the *existing* compositional font into my system 17:44:26 \oren\: http://ix.io/mxH this comment may be useful for you 17:44:59 <\oren\> that does help 17:45:07 the actual commercial fonts go through additional adjustments (mostly for KS X 1001 characters), but that should give a baseline 17:45:39 `pastequote univers 17:45:40 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: pastequote: not found 17:45:46 `quote univers 17:45:48 12) IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: First, invent the direct mind-computer interface. Second, learn the rest with your NEW MIND-COMPUTER INTERFACE. \ 16) IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: there is plenty of room to get head twice at once \ 17) In an alternate universe, ehird has taste \ 18) IN AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE: quintopia: it is made huger by the fact I draw every character by hand sepaaretly 17:49:16 <\oren\> (thats why in early versions there were differences among characters that are suppoesed to be the same with different accents) 17:53:34 -!- idris-bot has joined. 17:56:13 <\oren\> Theoretically it should be possibleto generate Chinese characters from radicals. But I've never heard of anyone doing it 18:02:23 To the best of my knowledge, many have tried, but nobody has made it work satisfactorily. 18:10:05 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 18:15:38 <\oren\> ok, so today's additions bring it to 5978: 22 characters to go!!!!!! 18:20:31 :D 18:25:33 1355 characters so far here :) 18:25:40 \oren\: you should definitely look at CHISE dataset. 18:25:51 \oren\: sth like this: http://git.chise.org/gitweb/?p=chise/ids.git;a=blob;f=IDS-UCS-Basic.txt 18:26:39 also, on the synthetic composition of Chinese fonts, see http://glyphwiki.org/ 18:30:03 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 272 seconds). 19:05:32 -!- Sgeo has joined. 19:05:42 My client claimed I was K-Lined.... 19:06:00 Or D-lined or something 19:06:03 * *** You have been D-lined 19:06:04 * Closing Link: ool-44c0f875.dyn.optonline.net (K-Lined) 19:07:09 Before that, got something like "(Sorry, server is full - try later)" 19:29:10 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 19:30:46 -!- mauris_ has changed nick to mauris. 19:33:56 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 20:01:21 -!- rdococ has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 20:09:40 Are there any experiments with implementing "bleem"/"gird" integer (the hidden integer between 4 and 5) into an integer type? 20:15:57 <\oren\> What should the 6000th character be? 20:16:42 the deathly hallows symbol 20:16:43 `unidcode 𐄧 20:16:43 ​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: unidcode: not found 20:16:49 `unidecode 𐄧 20:16:50 ​[U+10127 AEGEAN NUMBER SIX THOUSAND] 20:25:30 -!- oerjan has joined. 20:30:17 <\oren\> I'm going with 飛 as in 飛ぶ 20:31:20 -!- Patashu has joined. 20:38:53 <\oren\> 6000! 20:39:35 -!- idris-bot has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 20:40:11 it's over five thousaaaand 20:40:14 -!- Melvar has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 20:42:11 -!- oerjan has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 20:46:47 -!- oerjan has joined. 20:51:15 \oren\: how do people usually do it 20:55:04 <\oren\> I think they typically draw one e and then add the accents automatically 20:55:45 lazypants 21:01:41 -!- Patashu has quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds). 21:05:51 -!- Melvar has joined. 21:11:02 -!- oerjan has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:04 -!- tromp has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:04 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:05 -!- MoALTz has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:06 -!- myndzi has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:07 -!- jameseb has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:08 -!- fractal has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:08 -!- nchambers has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:08 -!- nortti has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:09 -!- Nithogg has quit (*.net *.split). 21:11:09 -!- shikhin has quit (*.net *.split). 21:13:13 <\oren\> and nothing of value was lost 21:13:36 <\oren\> er, wait. oerjan? NOOOOOO!!!!!! 21:14:06 -!- jameseb has joined. 21:14:09 fungot: ... 21:14:10 int-e: time travel allows hypercomputation. i 21:14:56 -!- Welo has quit (Quit: Leaving). 21:15:39 -!- MoALTz has joined. 21:15:44 -!- tromp has joined. 21:15:50 -!- Nithogg has joined. 21:18:15 -!- shikhin has joined. 21:22:17 -!- nchambers has joined. 21:23:01 -!- nortti has joined. 21:25:28 -!- boily has joined. 21:26:01 @massages-loud 21:26:01 shachaf said 7h 17m 10s ago: cabot du chien 21:26:21 hellochaf. le cabot du chien, c'est pas quelque chose qu'on voit souvent. 21:28:43 bonjouroily 21:30:45 boppronjour! 21:31:03 as-tu déjà vu le cabot d'un chien? 21:36:17 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 21:37:30 AnothellorTest. 21:48:50 -!- Nithogg has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 21:48:50 -!- cnr has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 21:49:25 -!- cnr has joined. 21:49:25 -!- cnr has quit (Changing host). 21:49:25 -!- cnr has joined. 21:54:49 <\oren\> !@#$%^&*()_{}|:"<>?1234567890-=[]\;',./ 21:56:00 -!- Wallacoloo has joined. 21:58:44 -!- Wallacoloo has left. 22:00:45 -!- Nithogg has joined. 22:01:24 -!- Lord_of_Life has joined. 22:02:41 he\\oren\. testing your font? 22:05:36 -!- mbrcknl has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 22:06:02 -!- mbrcknl has joined. 22:06:56 <\oren\> testing b_jonas' font actually 22:07:00 -!- fractal has joined. 22:09:00 -!- augur_ has joined. 22:11:28 -!- boily_ has joined. 22:12:57 -!- FreeFull_ has joined. 22:12:58 -!- perrier__ has joined. 22:12:58 what if i write a firefox extension to hide ads on $site and then i link it in the comments on $site ? 22:13:09 -!- shachaf_ has joined. 22:13:09 will they ban me? 22:13:41 i mean it could be useful to others 22:13:46 Probably? 22:13:51 damn 22:14:17 Do the ads slip through the usual adblock extensions? 22:14:24 yep 22:14:50 I wonder if it's just a matter of missing lines from a blacklist 22:14:53 or if they do something clever 22:15:11 no that blacklist can't work because this particular ad is hosted on their own server 22:15:23 Maybe one could blacklist based on path 22:16:26 -!- atriq has joined. 22:16:59 -!- Gregor has joined. 22:17:01 -!- fizzie` has joined. 22:18:05 -!- AnotherTest has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:11 -!- boily has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:17 -!- FreeFull has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:17 -!- heroux has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:19 -!- augur has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:20 -!- Deewiant has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:20 -!- kline has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:22 -!- Sprocklem has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:22 -!- fizzie has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:22 -!- lifthrasiir has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:24 -!- nisstyre has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:24 -!- Jafet has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:24 -!- \oren\ has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:24 -!- SirCmpwn has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:25 -!- perrier_ has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:25 -!- Taneb has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:26 -!- mtve has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:27 -!- Gregor` has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:27 -!- APic has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:27 -!- ineiros has quit (*.net *.split). 22:18:28 -!- shachaf has quit (*.net *.split). 22:19:41 -!- heroux has joined. 22:20:18 izabera: I expect it might depend on the site. Some sites will be fine with it. Some sites might ban you. Others might modify their site. 22:21:01 -!- boily_ has changed nick to boily. 22:23:24 -!- Deewiant has joined. 22:23:51 -!- coppro has quit (Ping timeout: 260 seconds). 22:27:27 -!- atriq has changed nick to Taneb. 22:28:24 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 22:29:41 -!- kline has joined. 22:39:49 I think most places would remove the comment, but I suppose it depends on the site and some might be more tolerant 22:42:58 -!- skarn has quit (Max SendQ exceeded). 22:43:22 -!- APic has joined. 22:44:36 -!- oren has joined. 22:44:50 ittai nani ga attanda! 22:45:41 -!- oren has changed nick to \oren\. 22:47:01 -!- Sprocklem has joined. 22:47:25 -!- Sprocklem has changed nick to Guest49439. 22:47:30 -!- SirCmpwn has joined. 22:48:25 -!- Jafet has joined. 22:48:36 -!- Jafet has quit (Changing host). 22:48:36 -!- Jafet has joined. 22:48:56 -!- lifthrasiir has joined. 22:51:48 -!- pikhq has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 22:55:44 \oren\: エッ? 22:59:07 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in). 22:59:46 <\oren\> boily: 俺のIRCコンネクトが中止された 23:00:16 なるほど 23:01:28 -!- skarn has joined. 23:02:24 -!- coppro has joined. 23:03:31 -!- vifino has quit (*.net *.split). 23:05:20 * boily throws chicken bones in a ceremonial circle and does the unnetsplit dance 23:08:26 -!- pikhq has joined. 23:10:25 quintopia, I don't understand ligatures 23:14:09 -!- nisstyre has joined. 23:14:50 [wiki] [[MATL]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45696&oldid=45682 * Luis Mendo * (+465) /* Specification */ 23:15:59 -!- Jafet has left. 23:16:28 -!- relrod_ has joined. 23:16:31 -!- relrod_ has quit (Changing host). 23:16:31 -!- relrod_ has joined. 23:17:02 -!- relrod has quit (*.net *.split). 23:17:16 -!- relrod_ has quit (Excess Flood). 23:18:43 [wiki] [[MATL]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45697&oldid=45696 * Luis Mendo * (+0) /* Compiler */ 23:20:23 -!- hppavilion[1] has joined. 23:25:12 -!- hppavilion[2] has joined. 23:25:37 -!- relrod_ has joined. 23:25:37 -!- relrod_ has quit (Changing host). 23:25:38 -!- relrod_ has joined. 23:25:59 -!- hppavilion[1] has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 23:29:00 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 23:33:49 -!- cnr has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 23:39:08 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45698&oldid=45693 * Hppavilion1 * (+2967) /* Bitwise */ Normal Bitwise Operators (NOT, AND, OR, XOR, NAND, NOR, XNOR) 23:39:13 -!- relrod_ has changed nick to relrod. 23:43:55 -!- cnr has joined. 23:43:55 -!- cnr has quit (Changing host). 23:43:55 -!- cnr has joined. 23:45:53 -!- ineiros has joined. 23:49:28 -!- myndzi has joined. 23:54:36 [wiki] [[List of operators]] http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=45699&oldid=45698 * Hppavilion1 * (+2753) /* Bitwise */ INTERCALlian operators 23:57:18 boily: hello 23:57:53 I just submitted !eso as a bang for Duck Duck Go to autosearch the wiki 23:57:56 quintopia: hello 23:58:12 <\oren\> hipp[2] 23:58:37 -!- vifino has joined. 23:58:48 Sgeo: its just displaying pairs of characters differently than individual characters 23:59:15 But that character that qntm mentioned isn't involved at all for the man/man and woman/woman ones, that's what confused me