< 1467849779 0 :carado!~carado@savhon.org QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467849822 0 :cocoabotter!~thepengui@47.23.81.82 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1467851571 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467851883 0 :carado!~carado@savhon.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1467852596 0 :MoALTz!~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1467852628 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467852758 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467854616 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467854881 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467855136 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467855335 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : \oren\: Why write to the root directory rather than to tmp/? <-- if you ever get people to do that, it'll be so fun when they hit the tmp/ mv bug. < 1467855362 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"bug"? < 1467855381 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway that file didn't look like it was even intended to be used. < 1467855386 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ls < 1467855401 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :true, but it's a dangerous habit if you don't know what you're doing. < 1467855417 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​!\.´ \ advice \ bin \ canary \ cdescs \ emoticons \ esobible \ etc \ evil \ factor \ good \ hw \ ibin \ interps \ karma \ le \ lib \ ls \ misle \ out \ paste \ ply-3.8 \ ps \ quines \ quotes \ share \ src \ test \ theorems \ tmflry \ tmp \ wisdom \ wisdom.pdf < 1467855422 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :not knowing what you're doing is a dangerous habit hth < 1467855429 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`hoag test < 1467855429 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`file test < 1467855447 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect that file was never written anyway. < 1467855455 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :test: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for GNU/Linux 2.6.26, BuildID[sha1]=0x6ac7051385eeb76321be46a3b04a8a608b00d31c, not stripped < 1467855461 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1467855472 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the difference is, that with almost any other mistake in HackEgo, you can `revert. < 1467855495 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, but you can always reconstruct what happened, since you made the tmp/ file in public. < 1467855496 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and not lose information. < 1467855503 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since HackEgo modifications are always in public. < 1467855504 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right? < 1467855527 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't expect that apply to tmp/ if people used it for scratch. < 1467855545 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact it would be the perfect place to try out things. < 1467855557 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what does mv in tmp do? < 1467855596 0 :spiette!~spiette@198-200-116-42.cpe.distributel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467855605 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`hoag test < 1467855609 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​<\oren\> ` echo -e \'#include \\nint main(){printf("hello\\\\n");int i=30;printf("this won\'\\\'\'t work\\\\n");}\' | gcc -std=c90 -xc -otest - \ rm test \ touch test \ rm test \ mkx test//moonwashere \ rm test \ ` echo b > test \ ` echo a > test \ rm-p te < 1467855615 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: because of HackEgo's lock-and-rerun mechanism, it wipes out the tmp file with no trace. < 1467855621 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`rm test < 1467855625 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1467855637 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Well, we can fix that by having mv check if its first argument is in tmp/. < 1467855640 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it did add one. < 1467855643 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: true. < 1467855653 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess we can't fix `mv, though. < 1467855655 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or can we? < 1467855658 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` echo $PATH < 1467855660 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/hackenv/bin:/opt/python27/bin:/opt/ghc/bin:/usr/bin:/bin < 1467855665 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess we can. < 1467855670 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: except some people here like to use mv -v < 1467855690 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :a? < 1467855697 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1467855699 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mv -v? < 1467855712 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it tells whether it actually did something. < 1467855728 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :with HackEgo timing out all the time, a good practice. < 1467855749 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, a fancy mv can still support that. < 1467855939 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1467856050 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467856775 0 :spockers!~spockers@unaffiliated/spockers PART #esoteric :"bye http://i.imgur.com/nkzOWAv.jpg" < 1467857069 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467857796 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (>>-) < 1467857797 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: ‘>>-’ < 1467857797 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Perhaps you meant one of these: < 1467857797 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : ‘>>’ (imported from Control.Monad.Writer), < 1467857878 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh lambdabot no longer imports logict? < 1467857896 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467857902 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t interleave < 1467857903 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in scope: ‘interleave’ < 1467857909 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :scow. < 1467857951 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Control.Monad.Logic.interleave < 1467857952 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Control.Monad.Logic.Class.MonadLogic m => m a -> m a -> m a < 1467858246 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [1..]Control.Monad.Logic.>>-repeat < 1467858248 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: ‘Control.Monad.Logic.>>-’ < 1467858248 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Perhaps you meant one of these: < 1467858248 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : ‘Control.Monad.Cont.>>’ (imported from Control.Monad.Cont), < 1467858279 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@ask int-e why isn't Control.Monad.Logic in lambdabot tdnh < 1467858279 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1467858896 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION had got the misguided impression cabal-install now supported incremental cabal update. < 1467858908 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it seemed to take as long as last time. < 1467858929 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(was just testing my line above) < 1467858973 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell int-e [1..]Control.Monad.Logic.>>-repeat < 1467858973 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1467859008 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course that relies on a very specific implementation of >>- for lists. < 1467859061 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [1..]CML.>>-repeat < 1467859063 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: ‘CML.>>-’ < 1467859068 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [1..]L.>>-repeat < 1467859069 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Not in scope: ‘L.>>-’ < 1467859087 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@where L.hs < 1467859087 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :What lambdabot has in scope is at < 1467859096 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay that worked < 1467859121 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for the 404ing < 1467859467 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell int-e @where L.hs lies tdnh < 1467859467 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1467859690 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t (^.) < 1467859691 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :s -> Getting a s a -> a < 1467859720 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the one i found at lambdabot/lambdabot is not right, anyway. (no lens) < 1467859727 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (^.) < 1467859729 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : No instance for (Typeable s0) < 1467859729 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : arising from a use of ‘show_M668101704439807834720385’ < 1467859729 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : In the expression: < 1467860500 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467860554 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467861028 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1467861136 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? obsolate < 1467861139 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :obsolate? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1467861759 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467862466 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT : < 1467863348 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1467864089 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467864141 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467864332 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467864462 0 :spiette!~spiette@198-200-116-42.cpe.distributel.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467864497 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, rdococ is HaliteBird? < 1467864714 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't know. < 1467865337 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467865383 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467865471 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1467866264 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467866475 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467866481 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"One pound is one kilogram." -- Randall Munroe < 1467866508 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's about half right. < 1467866539 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it about 2 right? < 1467866541 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in the context of order of magnitude estimation, it's not wrong. < 1467866593 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: any pooch news? < 1467866611 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, wrong channel. < 1467866643 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: fermily agreed < 1467866657 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: is obsolate a word to describe very old people just after they die? < 1467866702 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: well that wasn't the use in the logs. < 1467866735 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( ^style doggy ) < 1467866767 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: this isn't even the first time you made that joke hth < 1467866774 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't? < 1467866782 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't believe so. < 1467866792 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :has this channel been going to the dogs for this long < 1467866844 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to make some "posthumous" pun in response to quintopia. < 1467866849 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I couldn't think of a good one. < 1467867033 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you shouldn't joke about dead people. that's posthumorous. < 1467867058 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that one was a candidate. < 1467867066 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But neither of us could make it work. < 1467867071 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ic < 1467867082 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, I oughtn't be rude for no reason. < 1467867103 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: maybe you can be helpful instead? < 1467867104 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i realised immediately it should have been s/that's/they're/ hth < 1467867110 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a verb or verb phrase for when you are fired because your employer no longer needs *anyone* to do the job you were doing? < 1467867182 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless they've died after eating middle east cuisine, then they're posthummus. < 1467867193 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: downsized < 1467867215 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: position eliminated < 1467867283 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: or if they are left in the woods to rot, decompose entirely, and be washed away in rainstorm, in which case they are posthumus < 1467867301 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I can't hope to be as helpful as oerjan. < 1467867312 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not can I help to be as hopeful as oerjan. < 1467867319 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan mostly hopes that helps. < 1467868227 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467868294 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467868450 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? hth < 1467868494 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hth is help received from a hairy toe. It is not at all hambiguitous. < 1467868909 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1467869907 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467870213 0 :tromp_!~tromp@ool-944bc34f.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1467871017 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467871033 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467871207 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467871225 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467871681 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Quit: ( < 1467871720 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*POOF* < 1467871811 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happened?! < 1467871828 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot quit tdnh < 1467871872 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :mniip found a vuln < 1467871879 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1467871881 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :another one?! < 1467871891 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :some unicode crap < 1467871899 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :what crap?! < 1467871906 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467871924 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :< mniip> @let data QUIT = QUIT < 1467871930 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :< mniip> @let data Њ a b = Њ a b < 1467871936 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :< mniip> :t Њ QUIT (Њ () ()) < 1467871942 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric : -!- lambdabot [~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot] has quit [Quit: (] < 1467871944 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1467871949 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1467871957 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1467871959 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode Њ < 1467871974 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+040A CYRILLIC CAPITAL LETTER NJE] < 1467871975 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric < 1467871988 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ord Њ < 1467871988 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :208 138 < 1467871996 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :possibly a different encoding? < 1467872004 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :one that contains a \n somewhere? < 1467872023 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well ghc haskell uses utf-8 < 1467872027 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that seems unlikely < 1467872049 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1467872097 0 :lambda-11235!~lambda-11@75.106.27.42 QUIT :Quit: Bye < 1467872100 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let data A = A; data B = B < 1467872108 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t B A (B () ()) < 1467872119 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: < 1467872136 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmph < 1467872172 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait what < 1467872176 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway i'm mostly amazed by the fact that people actually understand haskell < 1467872180 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> "hi" < 1467872187 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems locked up :( < 1467872281 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: did it really quit immediately after that? < 1467872283 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1467872288 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes < 1467872301 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode QUIT < 1467872308 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :mniip had it deafen itself to protect against someone abusing it to e.g. steal the account < 1467872321 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1467872325 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE] [U+0051 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER Q] [U+0055 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER U] [U+0049 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER I] [U+0054 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER T] [U+0020 SPACE] < 1467872351 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: hmph. you're supposed to make it quit twice. < 1467872356 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it won't rejoin. < 1467872408 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess +g works. < 1467872463 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ord Њ < 1467872470 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait i see < 1467872470 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1034 < 1467872477 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 1024 + 10 < 1467872505 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it gets printed cast to 8 bit < 1467872526 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: has someone told int-e (who seems asleep) what happened? < 1467872550 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1467872558 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm @tell won't work :P < 1467872590 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll try memoserv < 1467872700 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...he's disabled it. < 1467872719 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fine, github next -> < 1467872798 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm i see no way to contact him there < 1467872874 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :do i have his email somewhere... < 1467872967 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that i can see < 1467873029 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm not sure i want to say this in a more public place < 1467873105 0 :alercah!raedford@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: was pinged in #haskell < 1467873120 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: well... < 1467873142 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh well i suppose he won't get it any earlier otherwise < 1467873261 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess this is what happens when every module in lambdabot is supposed to handle its own output issues. < 1467873393 0 :J_Arcane!~chatzilla@2001:999:32:fc7:3cf6:89cc:568f:1c7 QUIT :Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.92-rdmsoft [XULRunner 35.0.1/20150122214805] < 1467874655 0 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18e43ef5.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467874736 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :deafen? < 1467874759 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, server-side ignore. < 1467876240 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467876562 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467876717 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone just woke up < 1467876727 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Orly? < 1467876756 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: int-e has a security vulnerability in lambdabot to handle today. < 1467876819 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1467876827 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Curious what the vuln was. < 1467876835 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something to do with UTF-8? < 1467876846 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric < 1467876886 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :t prints its output converted from codepoints to 8-bit and no \n check seems to be applied after that < 1467876898 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Oh*. < 1467876901 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@2a02:1811:d22:cc00:b8ec:f175:9395:123f JOIN :#esoteric < 1467876919 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so someone discovered the Њ < 1467876922 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :character < 1467876924 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's serializing as UTF-8 incorrectly? < 1467876961 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: no, it's serializing codepoints as 8bit clamped < 1467876978 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that is "incorrectly". :P < 1467876983 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose :P < 1467877015 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :more disturbing is that this important check isn't applied uniformly to all lambdabot modules. < 1467877076 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1 < 1467877078 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 1 < 1467877094 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Proxy :: Proxy "hi" < 1467877095 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proxy "hi" < 1467877127 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t Proxy :: Proxy "ЊPING" < 1467877128 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Proxy "\1034PING" < 1467877140 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks better < 1467877143 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or wait < 1467877157 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that gets passed through show < 1467877160 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1467877205 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it really does need at least one @let first < 1467877206 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let data Њ = Њ < 1467877207 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : .L.hs:169:1: < 1467877207 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Multiple declarations of ‘Њ’ < 1467877207 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Declared at: .L.hs:155:1 < 1467877211 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah < 1467877236 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@let data ЊPING = ЊPING < 1467877237 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : Defined. < 1467877243 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric ::t ЊPING < 1467877244 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :PING < 1467877249 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot is a mess. < 1467877261 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone fixed it speedily >:) < 1467877284 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is int-e online? < 1467877290 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, he is < 1467877300 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: does your fix work for all lambdabot modules, else someone might find another loophole... < 1467877337 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl ЊPING < 1467877338 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :(line 1, column 2): < 1467877338 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :unexpected '\138' < 1467877338 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :expecting letter or digit, variable, "(", operator or end of input < 1467877340 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Quit: brb < 1467877356 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@pl xЊPING < 1467877360 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: it's on the IRC connection level < 1467877369 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: good < 1467877406 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and while I am at it that's also the perfect place to get rid of the CTCP and color codes :P < 1467877417 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :AWWW < 1467877471 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: hey careful not to break @time < 1467877492 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's just filtering some bytes. < 1467877505 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you'll still get *some* output. < 1467877515 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean that @time uses CTCP to do its job < 1467877541 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right, hmm. < 1467877568 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, I just broke that :P < 1467877638 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric < 1467877735 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, ACTIONs, i'm not sure if any commands officially support those though < 1467877767 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, @time is kind of silly. < 1467877784 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Y U HATE TIME < 1467877792 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can always use ctcp directly. < 1467877885 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not very demonstrative tdnh < 1467877885 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, fine, CTCP can stay for now while I mull over it < 1467877893 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Quit: brb < 1467877986 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, @time is a bit silly. < 1467878027 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't go as far as hating it though < 1467878040 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :too much effort; I prefer indifference < 1467878073 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No one here hates @time. < 1467878084 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for Cale, maybe. < 1467878087 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@where L.hs < 1467878097 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1467878134 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(oops, it's not here yet) < 1467878143 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would explain it. < 1467878165 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many of these entries does lambdabot have anyway... < 1467878169 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric < 1467878236 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@where+ L.hs what lambdabot has in scope is at http://silicon.int-e.eu/lambdabot/State/Pristine.hs < 1467878241 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will never forget. < 1467878242 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: Do you hate time? < 1467878264 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :without time, when would you do all the hating... < 1467878295 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: It would be compressed into an instantaneous fit of intense rage < 1467878297 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm pretty sure Control.Monad.Logic _used_ to be in there, anyway. < 1467878332 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I don't know what you're really referring to < 1467878339 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The lambdabot plugin? < 1467878340 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would have been when Cale run it... mokus or I probably cleaned it up a little < 1467878357 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you think of the speed of light, anyway? < 1467878371 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :your cleanup was illogical tdnh < 1467878384 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I suppose... Cale please correct me if I'm wrong) < 1467878423 0 :Cale!~Cale@2607:fea8:9840:324:40b:704e:d648:8268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might have imported Control.Monad.Logic at some point < 1467878466 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@where Pristine.hs < 1467878466 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know nothing about pristine.hs. < 1467878474 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@2a02:1811:d22:cc00:b8ec:f175:9395:123f QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1467878521 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :People don't like single-layer perceptron networks, but they seem to be inexorable. < 1467878538 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: i noticed the github repository has three Pristine.hs* files for some reason. < 1467878564 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: is that a pun because it smells like one < 1467878581 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :MAYBE < 1467878595 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: "for some reason" - I think the reason should be easy to guess given their names < 1467878606 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1467878622 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :706 and 708 are GHC versions? < 1467878625 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1467878628 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh duh < 1467878654 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there I was thinking it was Jul 6 and Jul 8. < 1467878664 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And today we're right in between, which is why were having lambdabot issues. < 1467878672 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: thausible. < 1467878693 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:d9bc:7552:d22:e258 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467878741 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway... later < 1467879010 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: the last TODO seems obsolete with (:~:) around. < 1467879192 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what if we start reading todo as a spanish word < 1467879208 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :We already do. < 1467879224 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any todo list ultimately progresses toward its Spanish meaning. < 1467879284 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :todo loco < 1467879742 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: s/last //; s/ with.*// < 1467879763 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :the todo list is a historical artifact < 1467879868 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :or actually... which TODO? < 1467879876 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@todo 43 < 1467879876 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : @todo has no args, try @todo-add or @list todo < 1467879878 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :@todo 44 < 1467879878 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : @todo has no args, try @todo-add or @list todo < 1467879887 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1467879924 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: um i meant the todo in your Pristine.hs < 1467879954 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1467879976 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think mokus added that one < 1467880919 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@2a02:2c40:400::1:6e46 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467882092 0 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-67-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467882246 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-67-218.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1467882247 0 :MDead!?@? NICK :MDude < 1467883931 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1467884223 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@2a02:2c40:400::1:6e46 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1467884453 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@2a02:2c40:400::1:6e46 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467885318 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1467886148 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467886482 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467886856 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467887351 0 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1467887935 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:d9bc:7552:d22:e258 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467888475 0 :MoALTz!~no@78-11-183-124.static.ip.netia.com.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1467888583 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467888624 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a game with 10 rounds and 2 players. Each player in every round must say a number 1..10 but they can never say the same number twice. < 1467888648 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :If your number is higher you get two points, if it's lower no points and if both numbers are the same each gets one point. < 1467888764 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What strategy would you use? < 1467888801 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: and in each round, the two players choose the numbers without learning about the other, but having learnt the numbers from the previous rounds? < 1467888830 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467888879 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: this game reminds me sort of to the game Niagara, which is a german style board game for between 3 and 5 players ideally, but which interestingly has a quite small space state, so that it could conveniently (even for humans) be played through irc < 1467888880 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, you know the numbers from the previous rounds. < 1467888897 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you exactly know which numbers your opponent still has available < 1467888944 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually this should be bruteforcable quite nicely < 1467888955 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :10! possible games would be my estimate < 1467888977 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe not < 1467888983 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: aren't there more like 100*10! games? still, probably brute-forcable < 1467889005 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :3628800 does sound like too few games < 1467889016 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like this game, Niagara has some hidden state, so it needs a trusted third party (e.g. a bot) to validate things over irc, or a simple cryptographic protocol. < 1467889035 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: it's not 10! games, but 10! states < 1467889044 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are much more games, about 10!**2 of them < 1467889056 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but only about 100*10! states < 1467889068 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(even less if you cut a bit) < 1467889089 0 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1467889099 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so yes, it's brute-forcable < 1467889116 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467889163 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeh but brute-force doesn't really tell you immediately the strategy behind it < 1467889177 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might tell you that some orders have a higher chance of winning < 1467889206 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is actually comparing every permutation of [1..10] with every other permutation of [1..10] < 1467889208 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:c530:bb34:13db:236b JOIN :#esoteric < 1467889211 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the brute force would tell you whether you can win from any particular state, and how to win from it < 1467889230 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if the other player makes a theoretical mistake, you can win if you've done the brute force computation < 1467889230 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is 10! squared < 1467889245 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the game is symmetric, so the starting state is a draw < 1467889710 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/2StFKlse < 1467889713 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1467889730 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no permutation that wins more :) < 1467889752 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wait, I'm stupid < 1467889760 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's actually less states < 1467889781 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so overall the chance of winning when they play perfectly is 0% < 1467889784 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it'll draw each time < 1467889804 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's only 184756 states < 1467889839 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: no no, you said you don't choose the permutation in advance, but choose each number after you know what (you and) the other player chose on each of the previous rounds < 1467889870 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes the game different < 1467889881 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why? < 1467889886 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This crunches through every possible game < 1467889890 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:c530:bb34:13db:236b QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467889958 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: think about it. or should I brute force it and demonstrate or something? < 1467889982 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it at least means that no order has a higher chance of winning per se < 1467890004 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: yes, but you don't decide the order in advance, and nor does the opponent, so that's irrelevant < 1467890189 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well if you start with the highest and the other player with the lowest you'll loose :) < 1467890315 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/CNwt8JTN < 1467890423 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: I'm writing a brute forcer and a particular player now, please wait < 1467890426 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not that complicated < 1467890427 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just make sure you test with an even amount of numbers so there's no middle number) < 1467890443 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might end up depending on who has the higher number in the first round < 1467890445 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? you said there are 10 numbers exactly < 1467890449 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1467890477 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I figured to detect tendencies 1,2,3,4 should work too) < 1467890490 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(less permutations) < 1467890678 0 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1467890924 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: mind you, an odd number might give an interesting game, because then there are no ties. < 1467890965 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'll stick with 10 for now < 1467890973 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :still writing a program < 1467891257 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467891742 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2016/07/05/bot-bot/ < 1467892179 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, I'm stupid, there'd be ties even for an odd number < 1467892263 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: you win the round if you have more points than 10, and lose if you have less points than 10, right? < 1467892277 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the total points is 20 < 1467892495 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no you win the round when you have more points than the opponent < 1467892576 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is probably equivalent to saying you win when you have more than 10 points :) < 1467892626 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if every round draws it's 10, 10. Each round can hand out 2 points so total 20 < 1467892627 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1467892631 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're equivalent. < 1467892959 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :still writing my program, please wait < 1467892973 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have the brute force done, but chose the wrong strategy < 1467892979 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to fix it < 1467893041 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it already wins against random strategy more often than not, but it can be beaten with a particular strategy. I'll fix it now. < 1467893054 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :then I'll have to add a network or irc interface or something < 1467893066 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can play against < 1467893079 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh damn, it doesn't even seem to work against a random strategy < 1467893082 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :something's wrong with it < 1467893085 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'll fix it < 1467893091 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know at least one bug < 1467893403 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467893852 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467893972 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, something is still buggy < 1467894009 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait < 1467894049 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1467894056 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I'm trying can't work < 1467894059 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn < 1467894097 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe it can, I dunno < 1467894299 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably have to think about this later < 1467894303 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't write it now < 1467894610 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.252.9.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: WRAITH CHICKEN < 1467894767 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467895145 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-dhwdvhmsoelsrrmi QUIT :Excess Flood < 1467895238 0 :Lord_of_Life!Elite12246@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-fkeqqtflbgcjhxdx JOIN :#esoteric < 1467895404 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1467895417 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe there's not even a better strategy then doing random() < 1467895756 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/SraTcU2M < 1467895757 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoo! < 1467895768 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well at least 'player_mid_first' seems to suck a bit < 1467895770 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing more satisfying than Google identifying you as a potential bot < 1467895779 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't search for porn too long < 1467895784 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it will immediately flag you as a bot . < 1467896042 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://codepad.org/nZNEw6zE <- if anybody want's to write a player :D < 1467896044 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wants < 1467896134 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking at hppavilion[1] < 1467896136 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1467896152 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: What's crazy is that wasn't even it < 1467896155 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: Wait, well, actually < 1467896169 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interestingly, I kind of was < 1467896180 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Specifically, I was looking for the smbc forum thread for http://www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=2408#comic < 1467896190 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because the forum doesn't have a search feature < 1467896191 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1467896199 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :mroman: Do you have spyware running on my computer? < 1467896293 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://thecatapi.com/ < 1467896465 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cat executions: Done with the Electric Box? < 1467896572 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :"In 2000, some conservative associations sued the government for granting the movie Baise-moi, which contained graphic, realistic scenes of sex and violence, a non-X classification." < 1467896580 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :France, I think your conservatives are broken < 1467897971 0 :hppavilion[1]!~Doslowdow@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1467899224 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467899423 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467900965 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467902259 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467902454 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467905671 0 :Xylon_!51cf9f6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.207.159.107 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467905897 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@2a02:2c40:400::1:6e46 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467905922 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467906412 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1467906892 0 :mroman!~mroman@160.85.232.167 QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1467906987 0 :kuroro!~kuroro@69-165-253-74.cable.teksavvy.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467907561 0 :nisstyre!~yourstrul@oftn/oswg-member/Nisstyre QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467907733 0 :Xylon_!51cf9f6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.207.159.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi, I'm trying to implement a very simple line in Pyth, but it seems like I keep doing something wrong. I was wondering if someone could point me in the right direction. < 1467907739 0 :Xylon_!51cf9f6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.207.159.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is it in normal Python: "reduce(lambda x,y: x^y, input)", where input is a list of integers. I figured out the following in Pyth: u^GHQ0, where u indicates that it's a reduce, G and H are the accumulator and sequence variable (G^H), Q is the input list and 0 is the initial value of the accumulator afaik, but it doesn't seem to give the wanted results. < 1467908654 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467908916 0 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1467909378 0 :nycs!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467909411 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1467909642 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1467909883 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xylon_: hmm, ^ is exponentiation; x is xor? < 1467910038 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/chrislgarry/Apollo-11 < 1467910076 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone should write an emulator < 1467910344 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmmm. PINBALL_GAME_BUTTONS_AND_LIGHTS.s < 1467910521 0 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta spend time somehow < 1467910523 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1467910610 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :izabera: anyway http://www.ibiblio.org/apollo/download.html looks like an emulator already exists < 1467910612 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :all hail ##math's lord and protector Cale < 1467910623 0 :Xylon_!51cf9f6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.207.159.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: You're right! I expected that ^ would be the same as it would be in python. But with languages like this I shouldn't assume things. Thanks! < 1467910729 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :Xylon_: in general you are probably more likely to be able to get help like that in the Pyth chat, or in the 19th byte if no one is there < 1467910888 0 :Xylon_!51cf9f6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.207.159.107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: Thanks, hadn't even thought of chat channels on stackexchange < 1467911388 0 :bauen1!~bauen1@2a02:810d:1980:1584:bc5f:dd29:fc23:3575 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467911409 0 :bauen1!~bauen1@2a02:810d:1980:1584:e477:a7c1:6156:23c9 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467911584 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like stackexchange < 1467911821 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, that euclidthegame.com game has a bug where it resets the counter but does not remove all elements used so far... < 1467912033 0 :nycs!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1467912034 0 :I!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467912058 0 :I!?@? NICK :Guest97615 < 1467912252 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, I don't like Quira or stack overflow either < 1467912300 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :not liking things is a fun activity for all to enjoy! < 1467912318 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ok, now it's your turn < 1467912483 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? \oren\ < 1467912507 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​\oren\ is an attempt to improve upon oren. The only thing it actually improved was name recognizability, and it made everything else... well, there isn't much else in a nick, is there? < 1467912515 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? oren < 1467912518 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oren is a Canadian esolanger who would like to obliterate time zones so that he can talk to his father who lives in the same house. He'll orobablu get the hang of toycj tuping soon. He also has a rabid hatred of the two-storey lowercase a. < 1467913284 0 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: i dont like misanthropy < 1467913773 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :misanthropy? < 1467913781 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're websites! < 1467913807 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, poorly designed and annoying to use ones < 1467917207 0 :augur!~augur@76-218-206-38.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467917248 0 :augur!~augur@76-218-206-38.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467917350 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:10be:67e9:3025:233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467917447 0 :Sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1467917789 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :A friend of mine suffers from depression, so she took a vacation... to finland. < 1467917826 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finland is great. Sounds like a good plan. < 1467917830 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? finland < 1467917851 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Finland is a European country. There are two people in Finland, and at least nine of them are in this channel. Corun drives the bus. < 1467917960 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dunno, finland does not seem like a very cheerful place, but she's apparently loving it < 1467918002 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467918074 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellwob_jonas! < 1467918088 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm watching the SGDQ videos < 1467918095 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the temporary youtube encodes for now) < 1467918183 0 :Kaynato!~Aedile@cpe-75-187-129-201.neo.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467918439 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy crap the war between clinton and the goppers is getting intense < 1467918540 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hope they start televising the senate < 1467918822 0 :Xylon_!51cf9f6b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.207.159.107 QUIT :Quit: Page closed < 1467919442 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: it should be fine in summer, I suppose < 1467919486 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty too... and she could look for Slartibartfasts signature... (hey, this is #esoteric...) < 1467919605 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to figure out what to do with my life ;) < 1467920326 0 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't that in Norway though < 1467920330 0 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :them fjords < 1467920335 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :HireFly < 1467920369 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: what are you going to do with your life < 1467920373 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: you're right, I keep mixing up the nordic countries. < 1467920395 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I could start by not mixing up IRC channels. < 1467920409 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which channels did you mix up? < 1467920428 0 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi < 1467920428 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one, and another. < 1467920434 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :you sure are curious today < 1467920436 0 :FireFly!~firefly@firefly.xen.prgmr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Soon Tetris TGM on SGDQ < 1467920463 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Well, maybe I need to figoure out what to do with my life. < 1467920518 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :figure < 1467920552 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :What kind of animal would shed bikes? < 1467920597 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I also imagine that the process would be quite painful. but nature is often cruel.) < 1467920713 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe the answer has to do with the bicyclic monoid. < 1467920745 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, wait, the diversion is already over. < 1467920755 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So back to my life. < 1467920837 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: :) < 1467921006 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:3868:eabe:de85:deff:fe55:967a JOIN :#esoteric < 1467921034 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1467921259 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467921303 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@2a00:f41:3868:eabe:de85:deff:fe55:967a QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1467923112 0 :Froox!~Frooxius@194.108.5.201 QUIT :Quit: *bubbles away* < 1467923341 0 :gniourf!~gniourf@pdm-l03.insa-lyon.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1467923856 0 :nycs!~nycs@38.125.127.189 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467923952 0 :Guest97615!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1467924325 0 :`^_^!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467924330 0 :nycs!~nycs@38.125.127.189 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1467924926 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Deewiant, hi! < 1467925033 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell Deewiant Working anything on mycology? I lifted some code from cfunge's DATE fingerprint and found a bug that apparently wasn't tested by mycology. Basically for dates pre-dating the Gregorian calendar I used Julian calendar, but only when converting from JDN to YMD, not the other way around. It probably isn't specified what calendar to use, but it should be the same for both directions I think < 1467925033 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1467925072 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell Deewiant I'm going to change it to use the proleptic Gregorian calendar. That is, backdated Gregorian to apply before that point in time. < 1467925072 0 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1467925323 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably wise. The date of Gregorian changeover is actually region-specific. < 1467925397 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(spanning from 1582 to 1923) < 1467925557 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, yes. I just think mycology should actually test you do the same thing in both directions :) < 1467925571 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1467925602 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, I basically ported those functions to a different language (for a different project), and then I threw property based testing on it (like quickcheck) and it found that issue < 1467925632 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, watching summer games done quick? < 1467925642 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :They are playing tetris right now. And it is super-impressive < 1467925644 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1467925651 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :(on twitch) < 1467925691 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467925700 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup! < 1467925720 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, How can this NOT be the TAS segment < 1467925731 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Vorpal < 1467925735 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1467925761 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking about git clones of a subdirectory of a repository and things like that. < 1467925777 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might be that hg has advantages over git for that sort of thing. < 1467926131 0 :wob_jonas!59858794@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.89.133.135.148 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1467926273 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, hm? < 1467926284 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :can you clone only a sub-directory? < 1467926290 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so. < 1467926291 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe? < 1467926292 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know if you can in hg. < 1467926296 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I heard they were working on it in hg. < 1467926301 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never had the need for it < 1467926304 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe Facebook was working on it. < 1467926309 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, in CVS you can. Same for SVN < 1467926320 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but that's much easier, of course. < 1467926410 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`smlist 446 < 1467926415 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`smlist 447 < 1467926426 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 446: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy < 1467926431 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 447: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy < 1467926548 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :CVS has a file-oriented storage < 1467926561 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :SVN doesn't fetch any history, just snapshots < 1467926606 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, if Facebook uses hg for their whole repository, they're probably doing some interesting things to make that work. < 1467926616 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trouble with git isn't checking out subdirectories (there's "sparse" checkouts which do, essentially, that) but that fetching a repo means fetching its commits, and that will pull in the whole history for all subdirectories < 1467926654 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Well, I want to not clone out the contents of trees other than the one I'm looking at. < 1467926662 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(of course the object structure itself would support partial fetches) < 1467926667 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, we use sub-repositories at work < 1467926673 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, not one hg repo for everything < 1467926686 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but I don't think that the software does... it's fetching a full transitive closure) < 1467926690 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But using one big repository for everything is the best. < 1467926702 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :then for any given project we have a shell repo that just pulls in the sub-repos (there is no code in the shell repo, well okay there is a CMakeLists.txt, but that is it) < 1467926735 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, well, that has issues when there are many different products that don't need the same code < 1467926793 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I know. What I was trying to say is that bringing up SVN or CVS is not very meaningful. < 1467927053 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467927104 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would say git has the features for 90% of use cases, svn has the features for 80%, and a tgz file with a bunch of back versions is enough for 70%. < 1467927130 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, no... tgz is not enough when developing < 1467927142 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure if you just want to download a software < 1467927172 0 :`^_^!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1467927199 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I mean a tgz file containing subdirectories like project_June12/ project_June14/, etc. < 1467927216 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, *puke* < 1467927254 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats how many of my amateur things are done < 1467927274 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, and it is terrible < 1467927297 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pretty much create a repo (hg) before I even write a line of code. < 1467927305 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :And even for small personal projects < 1467927355 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I mean, I think git/hg might be able to do that reasonably well. < 1467927376 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least in theory. < 1467927390 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, no I was just wondering what tools *can* do what he asked for < 1467927397 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :VCSs keep metainformation and allow you to separate changes into logical commits... doing that with tar would be really hard. (Sure, one could maintain a changelog... but that's extra effort and will still lose information) < 1467927398 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the answer "no distributed ones"? < 1467927431 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about source safe? < 1467927432 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I need any of that in most cases < 1467927433 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :XD < 1467927464 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, distributed is easier to set up in most cases. You don't need a server until you want to publish it < 1467927466 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: so you never ask yourself why a particular line made it into your code? < 1467927479 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :with svn (and presumably cvs?) you absolutely do need that from the get-go < 1467927511 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :with tar you don't need a server um. ever. < 1467927528 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :an http server will work fine < 1467927581 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :git works quite well without a server < 1467927584 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I believe shallow clones are a thing now, up to a point. < 1467927590 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Re "the whole history". < 1467927614 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, but they are only shallow in that the history is pruned... shachaf wants to prune subtrees < 1467927628 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but indeed I should've been more precise < 1467927705 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :50% of my projects are written as a single file < 1467927771 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I'm objecting to the notion that tar files come even close to a version control system. < 1467927822 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it's more like you know a bunch of commands that let you use diff, tar, and the shell together as a vcs < 1467927827 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's okay to develop some things without version control. < 1467927886 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, the major thing that this helps me do is track down regressions. i have the version from yesterday, and the version from 4 days ago, etc. < 1467927927 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Here's an idea: why don't you go and use one giant Perforce repository for everything, and then a layer of scripts to allow "cloning" particular sets of subdirectories as local git repositories, maybe with a bit of FUSE to still make a unified read-only view of the entire in-the-cloud repository possible. < 1467927933 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :without any vcs at all I wouldn't have that ability < 1467927989 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That sounds pretty good. But I might just reimplement Perforce myself if it doesn't scale to the size of my repository. < 1467928005 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I guess the point of disagreement is that your 70% number, in my view, is closer to perhaps 20%. < 1467928093 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: For example, I can have two copies of the project at home and at work, have changes in both, and merge them sanely. That will be a quite horrible mess with tar and diff and patch. Not impossible, sure, but a lot more effort than it should be. < 1467928094 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Sounds good. Maybe you could call the whole thing "Tuber" or something like that, and then let's say "git9" for the git bridge tool. < 1467928135 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: well, yeah there is a learning curve in using diff and patch well < 1467928159 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :<\oren\> with tar you don't need a server um. ever. <-- sure. I was talking about svn and cvs < 1467928167 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, I don't consider tar a serious alternative < 1467928174 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Anyway, those git scripts wouldn't clone a "true" clone of the repository. < 1467928189 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's much better than not using any vcs at all < 1467928191 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those hashes would lead to nowhere. < 1467928201 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, you know what I mean. < 1467928205 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's kind of scow. < 1467928212 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not expressing myself very well right now. < 1467928226 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, also git or hg is easier than tar. Just: hg commit -m "Changed stuff" < 1467928229 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can certainly see the seams, yes. < 1467928229 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :or hg add . < 1467928234 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: Why wouldn't you just use git instead of tar+diff+patch? < 1467928239 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So much easier. < 1467928241 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, the tar thing actually needs more commands! < 1467928243 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: git is not easy < 1467928250 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just: git commit -m "Changed stuff" < 1467928253 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, agreed. hg is though. < 1467928263 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, and TortoiseHg is a GREAT gui for it < 1467928273 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :which git lacks < 1467928273 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :then use mercurial... mercurial is only hard for git users, I believe :P < 1467928291 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, well said. I'm a hg user, and I find git confusing. < 1467928300 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(mercurial is so close to git that I want to use it like git, and then it falls short all the time.) < 1467928301 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Did you read _The Gone-Away World_? < 1467928322 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I didn't. < 1467928327 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, branches work differently. Otherwise it is mostly the same I believe. But git has a more confusing user interface. < 1467928337 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That book is pretty good. < 1467928351 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway there's a machine in it called "Piper 90". < 1467928357 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found that git has too many concepts < 1467928359 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm perforce, is that central or distributed? < 1467928362 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, and is it FOSS? < 1467928377 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I'm not disagreeing. Actually the thing that I find most confusing in mercurial is the "tip" thing that jumps around randomly when there's more than one head. < 1467928384 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@2601:647:4b00:63aa:eade:27ff:fe08:b48b PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Central, proprietary. < 1467928387 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :("randomly" meaning I can't reliably predict it) < 1467928391 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The whole "multiple heads" thing in hg sounds bizarre to me. < 1467928424 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, you generally shouldn't have more than one head in a given named branch I would say. Also you probably want "default" instead of tip then? < 1467928441 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, oh and I mostly use TortoiseHg. It is actually a great GUI. < 1467928457 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :... shell user here < 1467928469 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only complicated thing about git is that the commands are bizarre and arbitrary. < 1467928479 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And each one does several different things. < 1467928481 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, fair enough. Just saying that sometimes when things get complicated, a visual look at the tree can be easier to understand < 1467928492 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :X is useful so that I can have 9 xterms on the screen simultaneously. < 1467928504 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, especially in projects with multiple persons and complicated merges < 1467928520 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: and stashes. I would like there to be no such thing as a stash < 1467928521 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :then a visual look can be superior for understanding what the f**ck is going on. < 1467928531 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually I use hg view quite a lot. < 1467928532 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: Then don't use "git stash"? < 1467928540 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't exist if you don't want them to. < 1467928548 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: but that;s the only way to discard changes < 1467928548 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ hg view < 1467928548 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hg: unknown command 'view' < 1467928548 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :'view' is provided by the following extension: < 1467928548 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : hgk browse the repository in a graphical way < 1467928549 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1467928551 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay < 1467928571 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, how does it compare to thg workbench? < 1467928571 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: ? < 1467928582 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What does discarding changes have to do with git stash? < 1467928615 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you discard the changes in your working directory by saying ``git stash'' < 1467928619 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, https://www.mercurial-scm.org/wiki/HgkExtension suggests it is deprecated and hgview or tortoisehg should be used instead < 1467928628 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I don't? < 1467928641 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hg view is not very useful really... it's a stripped down clone of gitk. It helps me that it looks familiar. I wouldn't recommend it. < 1467928651 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, well, I thought you were actually being sinceret or something. < 1467928652 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1467928658 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should've known better. < 1467928666 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am. that's the way I learned git < 1467928690 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The name "stash" might be a clue that it's not discarding anything. < 1467928738 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :git add my files with changes I want to keep, git commit to do... something. then git push which does an actual commit. finally git stash to discard uncommited changes < 1467928791 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess git commit is how you add the message to your commit < 1467928818 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe you should spend half an hour or an hour learning how git works. < 1467928819 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's such a bizarre use of terminology. < 1467928836 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, for your usage, hg would probably be simpler. < 1467928866 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, especially given the amazing cross platform GUI that TortoiseHg provides < 1467928904 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :imo trollminology < 1467928905 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you alias on top of existing commands? You could alias 'git stash' into actually being about discarding changes. < 1467928940 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what is the proper way of discarding changes in git? < 1467928951 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: well how would you discard the changes in your working copy that you don't want to commit? < 1467928961 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :git reset --hard? < 1467928966 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, in hg it is "hg revert" < 1467928983 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. well that sounds legit < 1467928991 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or `git checkout file` to restore a file to its state in HEAD. < 1467928997 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, is that per file? < 1467929000 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the ENTIRE tree? < 1467929009 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1467929010 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :git reset --hard is the entire tree. < 1467929014 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1467929022 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't do it too often. < 1467929024 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I don't. < 1467929030 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, what does --hard do? < 1467929041 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :reset the staging area as well < 1467929053 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the working tree. < 1467929069 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that (the staging area) is really the bit that you have to understand before git stops being confusing. < 1467929070 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, compared to --soft, which just adjusts what the head points at. < 1467929123 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, that entire "staging area" concept is confusing and annoying I find < 1467929124 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: isn't the staging area just the list of files I want to commit? not confusing at all? < 1467929125 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: What git-reset actually does is change your current branch to point to some commit. The commit is implicitly HEAD, i.e. where you are right now. < 1467929125 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's invisible at first, but that's where you prepare the commit. "git diff" shows differences between working tree and staging area. "git diff --cached" shows differences between staging area and the last commit; *those* are the changes "git commit" actually commits. < 1467929127 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :And quite pointless < 1467929141 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: git-reset --hard doesn't change only the current branch, but also the things that int-e and fizzie said. < 1467929142 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: it's a love or hate thing; there's no middle ground :P < 1467929157 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1467929177 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find it quite powerful. And there's commit -a for the fairly common case that you want to commit all changes. < 1467929179 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I have no strong feelings about the git staging area. < 1467929179 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, agreed. And sure, there are things that hg could do better. But it is still less confusing than git < 1467929186 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could take it or leave it. < 1467929188 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: damn you! :P < 1467929205 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, with hg you just list the files you want to commit if not all of them on the "commit" command line < 1467929209 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense to me < 1467929220 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, like svn < 1467929226 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :also why does "git ci" not alias to "git commit" < 1467929229 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do that with git-commit too. < 1467929231 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does for hg, and it is shorter < 1467929237 0 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@194.108.5.201 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467929242 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make that alias if you want. < 1467929257 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I have an alias for that in my configuration. < 1467929258 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :git config --global alias.ci commit < 1467929278 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair enough. < 1467929282 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is it not default though < 1467929286 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :"log1 = log --oneline --decorate=full --graph" is an alias I've started to use a lot. < 1467929306 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: is there a way to add a staging area to svn < 1467929319 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know? < 1467929322 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :The main issue I have with git is that there is no *good* GUI. For some reason I'm a GUI person when it comes to version control < 1467929329 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a terminal person otherwise < 1467929335 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, use git-svn? < 1467929364 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Ah, maybe I should use that instead of --decorate. I guess =full shows more information. < 1467929386 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1467929392 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :It shows what sort of ref it is. < 1467929396 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean it would be nice if I could add files to my 'svn ci' line one at a time < 1467929420 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: --all is also a useful flag there, sometimes. < 1467929423 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, I could use bash and a variable < 1467929437 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of git add < 1467929439 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I think the =full part is slightly redundant in that at least some of the prefixes have their own colors. < 1467929512 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a good version control system for unmergable binary files? At work we use svn for that, due to the locking support < 1467929517 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :And hg for everything else < 1467929557 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: It's true that in order to use git effectively you need to spend a bit of time up-front learning how it works. < 1467929585 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :staged=$staged' 'some_file.cpp < 1467929604 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :svn ci $staged < 1467929616 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't mean learning what the commands do, which is kind of arbitrary but pretty easy to look up, but getting a mental model of what a git repository is. < 1467929702 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also was happy about "git worktree" getting in the real git. < 1467929718 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what does that do? < 1467929747 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lets you have multiple working trees (with different branches checked out) linked to the same repository. < 1467929752 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: whoa whoa whoa, fancy < 1467929772 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found http://eagain.net/articles/git-for-computer-scientists/ useful when I started using git... http://nyuccl.org/pages/gittutorial/ looks more recent but similar in spirit. < 1467929943 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I've really needed git worktree at home, but some IDEs (not naming names here) are a little bit too enthusiastic about having everything indexed all the time whenever anything in the filesystem changes to make jumping around between branches pleasant. < 1467929982 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :And (as far as I can tell, anyway) git doesn't really have a generalized way of saying "do this thing in a branch without checking it out". < 1467930000 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can do some things. < 1467930012 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But not in general, I guess. < 1467930028 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I never used anything with a name similar to git9. < 1467930050 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's the kind of thing you can't do to a branch without checking it out. < 1467930129 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hm hg had something like that for ages < 1467930169 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use something with a name similar to git9, but only ever do the synchronize-with-the-world operation in a single branch called "clean", which I've found is a relatively nice way to manage whatever unpleasantess there is with the boundary to the Other System. < 1467930169 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, basically it has a command (as a bundled extension) to hardlink the shared revision data files between multiple repos. < 1467930235 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :In fact hardlinking is how a local same-filesystem clone works < 1467930238 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hard link? What happens if you edit a file? < 1467930254 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What you really want is a copy-on-write hard link, isn't it? < 1467930255 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, hg is made to handle that for the internal revision file data < 1467930256 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't edit the repository data files manually, hopefully. < 1467930261 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :the working tree is NOT hardlinked < 1467930268 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the repository data files. < 1467930275 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's more or less how 'git worktree' works, except there's some automatic administrative bookkeeping as well. And there's long been custom scripts to do it, they just weren't included in the stock distribution until relatively recently. < 1467930282 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The working tree ought to be COW hard-linked, though. < 1467930302 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in a perfect world. < 1467930304 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, that is harder though. Probably possible with FUSE, btrfs or zfs? < 1467930316 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I heard that btrfs supports that, at least. < 1467930346 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-6-78-245-243-132.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1467930361 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Anyhoo, I use something with a name similar to git9, but only ever do the synchronize-with-the-world operation in a single branch called "clean", which I've found is a relatively nice way to manage some of the unpleasantess there is with the boundary to the Other System. < 1467930383 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then you can pretend 'clean' is just a tracking branch for a remote, more or less. < 1467930395 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I saw that when you said it earlier. < 1467930397 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1467930409 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought I didn't say that because I started to say something else. < 1467930419 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'll notice I further edited it a little bit. < 1467930436 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :E.g. "whatever" -< "some of the". < 1467930457 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes I do that. I start editing a long line in the irssi buffer, ^U it, send it, send something else, then paste the ^U-ed text and forget I sent it already. < 1467930506 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, what is ^U? < 1467930523 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ctrl-U < 1467930528 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get THAT < 1467930530 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delete (cut) the current line. < 1467930533 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :it it like ctrl-x in modern editors? < 1467930544 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ctrl-X for the current line. < 1467930549 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay < 1467930581 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/git-users/7b40Ie89Vqs < 1467930591 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's funny when people post things like that. < 1467930601 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I ended up there as well. < 1467930630 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you know the right strings to search for, you can find a lot of bug reports that are full of secret HTTP headers containing all sorts of secret data. < 1467930660 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's not that secret. < 1467930662 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I'd just like to voice my disapproval of the world making C-w in Emacs kill-region, but in browsers close-tab. < 1467930682 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've closed a number of tabs while trying to edit text in a box. < 1467930684 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's terrible. < 1467930691 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done the same thing. < 1467930693 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm very happy about C-S-t. < 1467930706 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But at work I use Mac OS, where you close a tab with Cmd-W. < 1467930709 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's a bit better. < 1467930722 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, hah. I'm a sublime user these days < 1467930730 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Unfortunately I do all my browsing in Chrome's Incognito mode, so I can't C-S-t. < 1467930741 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that's nasty. < 1467930746 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do some of it in Firefox' Private Browsing mode, I guess. Firefox does support it. < 1467930895 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use vim < 1467930898 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :next < 1467930907 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do use vim. < 1467930916 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not for IRC, though. < 1467930960 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have typed ":wq\n" into a number of text boxes as well. < 1467930964 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's generally less dramatic. < 1467930989 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can actually do that with extensions < 1467930990 0 :int-e!~noone@static.88-198-179-137.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :ls ;-) < 1467931003 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'ts annoying how ^O saves on nano but open on everything else < 1467931074 0 :myname!~myname@84.200.43.57 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't save on vim :p < 1467931117 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Speaking of secret stuff, there's a bunch of Chrome bug reports containing all kinds of internal nomenclature as well. < 1467931141 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=52734 for example. < 1467931190 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yes, that's what I meant. < 1467931204 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I was talking about some chrome bug reports. < 1467931206 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not that one. < 1467931285 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But any of them that include an http response. < 1467931300 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1467931328 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :One time there was a picture of a data center in Finland that had pictures of machines with labels on them specifying their hostnames. < 1467931344 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was kind of funny. I think it's gone now, though. < 1467931356 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least the knowledge of there being a data center in Finland is no longer a secret. < 1467931371 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, what *is* git5? < 1467931397 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: fizzie described it by the name "git9" above. < 1467931407 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, okay and what actually is it? < 1467931409 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone tried to tell me we still haven't publicly acknowledged the existence of the Hamina data center, which is patently untrue. < 1467931420 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, https://www.google.com/about/datacenters/inside/locations/hamina/ < 1467931435 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: You might have acknowledged its existence, but have you acknowledged the acknowledgement of its existence? < 1467931456 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I read about it in the Swedish technology news paper "Ny Teknik" several years ago < 1467931483 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, so git9 is some kind of google-internal wrapper script for git? < 1467931496 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's really git5, I just wanted to be fancy. < 1467931522 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's the bridge from local git to the well-published Perforce-based VCS we generally use. < 1467931532 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was surprised to learn about this one thing that says "the existence of [this thing] is confidential". < 1467931542 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But in retrospect I shouldn't have been surprised. < 1467931548 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But maybe that's why it was confidential. < 1467931551 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :So that people who're conversant with git can keep using it. < 1467931552 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, do you pump waste heat into the district heating system? < 1467931555 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've probably said too much. < 1467931559 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I believe some data centers in Sweden do that < 1467931563 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't know. < 1467931571 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :If I knew I couldn't tell, unless it's something we advertise. < 1467931587 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie never talks about corporate secrets in public IRC channels. < 1467931600 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unless someone else has accidentally talked about them in public bug reports, I guess. < 1467931632 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even in the latter case, I might still apply some caution. < 1467931660 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but do you store work emails on a private server in your home? < 1467931683 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie probably stores personal emails on a private server at work. < 1467931706 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking of storing personal data at work, just because of the tools. < 1467931735 0 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-120-181.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: the magical thing about the "staging area" is that it's a lot more than a list of files to commit, it's really a snapshot of the entire tree that will be committed, so e.g. the staged files don't have to look the same as the files on disk... which probably sounds useless and confusing until you start using it all the time < 1467931745 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's a rude way to refer to your colleagues hth < 1467931768 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that's true. < 1467931779 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, fair enough I guess. Most of the time it isn't really that useful a feature though. Or when it is I want multiple versions of it (similar to MQ patches in hg) < 1467931787 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: If you modify a file, and then git add it, and then modify it again, and commit, only your first modification will be committed. < 1467931837 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4pnJdEZ2Iw is a song about that data center, I assume. < 1467931852 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, I do use MQ, and MQ is a more advanced version of that, where you can have multiple snapshots as kind of editable non-pushable-until-you-convert commits. And you can reorder then and unapply them and reapply them and so on < 1467931864 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, also you can version control your actual MQ patch queue itself < 1467931864 0 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-120-181.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: :D < 1467931865 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: AAAAAAAAAA < 1467931877 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOO that is awful < 1467931895 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because what you're really "adding" is the current state of the file, not just the file name. < 1467931897 0 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-120-181.bredband.comhem.se PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: that sounds close to how I use branches < 1467931904 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, I can see the use of it. I don't think it should be the default behaviour though < 1467931921 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :olsner, branches are pushable though? MQ patches are not. < 1467932237 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Man, that *is* a lot of internal headers in bugs.chromium.org. Maybe they should have some sort of a thing. < 1467932335 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, oh? Link to an example? < 1467932350 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I should. < 1467932364 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, well it is public, I could probably find it anyway? < 1467932374 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably, but maybe you won't care enough. < 1467932378 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need to tell me what they mean < 1467932518 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah a lot of internal jargon so far at least < 1467932526 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie, I assume you mean HTTP headers? < 1467932526 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the principle of the thing. If the names and values are something we don't show to external users, I probably shouldn't be linking to them either, even if they leak all kinds of ways. < 1467932530 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or bug headers? < 1467932543 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :HTTP, yes. < 1467932694 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah yes, quite a few ones with weird headers < 1467932976 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably all of them would have a particular header with a value of the form /x/y/z/y/x/... < 1467932985 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably I'm saying too much anyway. < 1467933097 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf, you don't work at google do you? < 1467933108 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, but I used to. < 1467933111 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1467933444 0 :Froox!~Frooxius@194.108.5.201 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467933511 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467933566 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:10be:67e9:3025:233 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1467933633 0 :Frooxius!~Frooxius@194.108.5.201 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1467933829 0 :augur!~augur@2602:304:cdac:e260:10be:67e9:3025:233 JOIN :#esoteric < 1467934556 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1467934961 0 :JenElizabeth8!~jenelizab@cpc76804-brmb10-2-0-cust651.1-3.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric