< 1503188358 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1503188627 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503189086 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hily < 1503189147 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :diais523 duit < 1503189681 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellørjan! < 1503189694 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hellorcah! < 1503189695 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hichaf < 1503189705 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloochaf. < 1503189935 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :こんぶわりは < 1503190236 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :「ぶわり」って?変。 < 1503190268 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :「ブワリ」は自分です < 1503190316 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You pronounce your name similar to "buwari" rather than "boirii"? < 1503190322 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :変。 < 1503190465 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my name's pronounced /bwali/ hth < 1503190500 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not 変, just French :D < 1503190521 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :OIC < 1503190538 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, being French means it's weird ipso facto. :P < 1503191129 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: you haven't seen irish clearly < 1503191360 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503191397 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503191475 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bah. You want weird, try transcribing "六百" as "rot̄uhi̊ȳaku". < 1503191477 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503191515 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503191729 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :dheartháireacha < 1503191757 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me guess. that one's pronounced throatwarbler-mangrove? < 1503191761 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly! < 1503191763 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :it means brothers < 1503191817 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is post spelling reform even < 1503191862 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's egregiously outrageous spelling. < 1503191902 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pronounced something like yerarech < 1503191912 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ch as in german) < 1503191936 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ach-laut or ich-laut? < 1503192030 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dearth%C3%A1ireacha < 1503192078 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :ach in this case < 1503192149 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1503192154 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how in fungot's name can you say [dʲɾʲ]??? < 1503192154 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: t-rex, i have big news the other! you can see, i've thought of the best story! oh goodness, i must have put that in your pipe and smoke it? < 1503192169 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jellonas. < 1503192184 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"dheratháireacha" < 1503192240 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: like [dɾ] but palatalized? < 1503192275 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is "i̊" even a thing? what does that accent do? < 1503192433 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"rot̄uhi̊ȳaku" seriously < 1503192655 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: as in, ʲ is a modification of the previous sound, not a separate one. it means that the middle of the tongue is lifted towards the palate, like in an english "y" sound. < 1503192848 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but it's the [dɾ] sequence that baffles me :/ < 1503192851 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but without necessarily moving the main articulation of the letter < 1503192856 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. < 1503192921 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well in this case i guess it's your r's that are the problem. < 1503192938 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my rs are perfectly fine :P < 1503192954 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(okay, very French rs.) < 1503192976 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :norwegian has plenty of [dɾ]s, anyway. < 1503193065 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :[dʁ] is saner. < 1503193130 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would imply people from Bergen are sane, an absurdity! < 1503193499 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(don't tell wob_jonas about today's wikipedia main page picture. oh woops.) < 1503193533 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lundomys molitor? < 1503193554 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the article, not the picture hth < 1503193592 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :please scroll down a bit twh < 1503193609 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thukkachi Abatsahayesvar temple??? < 1503193612 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is confuzzled? < 1503193620 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh! < 1503193625 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :more scrolling. < 1503193660 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :where do you see that *reloads* < 1503193686 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that section hadn't updated when i loaded last < 1503194410 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`5 w < 1503194490 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION lightly mapoles fizzie < 1503194609 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm wiki is up < 1503194769 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503195637 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :My monitoring says it was down for an hour. < 1503195657 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably was enough to make HackEgo go down as well, though not sure why it didn't come back up automagically. < 1503195710 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's the socat process, but it's using 99.9% of CPU. < 1503195714 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's just confused. < 1503195772 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's just kill that one, I think the starter script has a loop around the socat. < 1503195809 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503195812 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :See. < 1503195814 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`botsnack < 1503195815 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​>:-D < 1503196032 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well that was intresting. I just had half a dozen experienced linux users try and beat umlbox to the ground. < 1503196175 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I don't think anyone's broken umlbox in this channel < 1503196189 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEgo itself has been successfully broken a couple of times, but via HackEgo-specific exploits < 1503196409 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, same thing happened to my bot. Altho no breaks were serious, all were just mistakes in the code that caused it to crash :P < 1503196445 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :people managed to break HackEgo? < 1503196456 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`5 w < 1503196460 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/2:elliott//elliott wrote this learn DB, and wrote or improved many of the other commands in this bot. He probably has done other things? He is also tire. And a lystrosaur. \ all the single objects//All the single objects / went to form a class / but then they got a unit test / which none of them did pass. \ mothball//Mothballs are the main ingred < 1503196462 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ǹ < 1503196464 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`n < 1503196465 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2/2:ient of a traditional soup of Eastern European origin. \ overflow//Overflow is a phenomenon that occurs when too much water pours into the inner tanks of a hydraulic computer. \ nød//Nød is French for vertex. < 1503196476 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :how long has hackego been around anyways? < 1503196495 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quite a while now < 1503196501 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was originally meant to be an egobot replacement < 1503196505 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but people didn't really use it for esolangs < 1503196514 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :any estimate in years for hackego? :P < 1503196515 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think about 8 years < 1503196535 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is a sign of the decline of this channel :-( < 1503196573 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I started college in 2009 and also joined irc, and I vaguely remember an egobot < 1503196628 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :egobot was basically our version of TIO, only it probably came first < 1503196640 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIO? < 1503196641 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`! underload (test)S < 1503196642 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :test < 1503196646 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: http://tio.run < 1503196651 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, its been so many years since I dropped out < 1503196657 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :2009-06-20 for HackEgo, as far as my logs can tell. < 1503196662 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was originally just esolangs, but it's added a bunch of practical languages since < 1503196691 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :2005-10-25 for EgoBot. < 1503196712 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is the other way round from what most people might expect) < 1503196723 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1503196730 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :knowing this channel, thats perfectly normal < 1503196756 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it doesn't seem to be associated with this channel at all < 1503196769 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of its development was driven by PPCG on Stack Exchange < 1503196873 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I helped out a bit, like getting INTERCAL running there < 1503196928 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, you know how the version control system was set up? Im considering making something similar for my bot < 1503196943 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which version control system? hackego's? < 1503196949 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea hackego's < 1503196954 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one of the most fragile parts, and doesn't really work < 1503196958 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I wouldn't recommend copying it < 1503196961 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mk < 1503196978 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's wrong with it, some bugs have been fixed < 1503196997 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: doesn't it give really weird results if you run a nondeterministic command? < 1503197005 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about the bots that store every persistent data version controlled, like buubot or wikiplia? < 1503197017 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well then it runs it twice < 1503197033 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :discarding the first run. < 1503197059 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1503197063 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not what most people would expect < 1503197088 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can certainly fool it into producing even more counterintuitive results < 1503197100 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also that time when I permanently broke `revert… < 1503197113 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(technically, it still works to do the reverting, just produces an error message every time) < 1503197113 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but it's hard to do anything better. jevalbot is really stupid and just loses the result of whichever computation finishes first when you run two commands at the same time < 1503197147 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that's one of the bugs that are fixed hth < 1503197154 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, would be fun if you could run two conflicting commands at the same time < 1503197158 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and end up with conflict markers in the file < 1503197167 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably more harmful than useful, but fun < 1503197173 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that could break things a lot < 1503197197 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely < 1503197299 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've got an arguably semi-reasonable thing for a half-completed bot, but it involves doing the filename-to-file mapping on your own. < 1503197311 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't recall what buubot does. It allows multiple commands to run at the same time, and I think they just access the same (version controlled) persistent database, and only individual stores or loads are atomic and a command can do any number of those. < 1503197315 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( reason tells me "are fixed" is correct but the rest of my brain isn't convinced. ) < 1503197320 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no locking primitives. < 1503197443 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In theory you could make a bot that exposes you ways to lock parts or do atomic ops on the database < 1503197530 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a buubot/wikiplia-like system < 1503197541 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you don't have to version control everything for that < 1503197561 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: hmm… "the bugs are fixed", "one of the bugs is fixed", so what happens if you add "that"? < 1503197579 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess logically you can only parenthesize it as the first case < 1503197598 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the point is, the locking or atomic would be explicit in programs, and if you don't use them and something splinches, you get to keep the pieces < 1503197599 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of ((the bugs) that are fixed) < 1503198028 0 :ATMunn!~ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn26 QUIT :Quit: See ya! o/ < 1503198418 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: PROGRESSIVE CHICKEN < 1503198782 0 :Antoxyde!~Antoxyde@AAnnecy-654-1-74-189.w90-27.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1503198961 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503199314 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1503199342 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503199467 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Width14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=52879 5* 03Stestoltz 5* (+427) 10Created page with "'''Width''' is an esoteric stack-based language created by [[User:Stestoltz|Stephen S]]. All characters except letters are ignored. For more information, see the Github link...." < 1503200358 0 :wob_jonas!b03f187d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.125 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1503201649 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503206545 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503207942 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is the solar eclipse soon. One way to calculate when and where is by use of Swiss Ephemeris. Have you looked at or used Swiss Ephemeris at all? < 1503207964 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you asking me? < 1503207966 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1503207971 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I haven't. < 1503207978 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you see the eclipse? < 1503207988 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it hasn't happened yet. < 1503207997 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes I know that < 1503208015 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you going to Oregon to see the eclipse properly? < 1503208051 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Swiss Ephemeris is reporting happening on 2017-08-21T18:13:14.199Z, at 36 N 58' 15", 87 W 39' 23". If it is wrong then I might have done something wrong < 1503208077 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used https://eclipsemega.movie/simulator to check. < 1503208103 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :By the use of the interface to use Swiss Ephemeris with JavaScript, now you can use with the Node.js REPL to figure it out, such as by entering: swe.fromJulian(swe.occult(swe.planet.Sun).time) < 1503208174 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: What did they tell you? < 1503208196 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, no I am not going to Oregon to see the eclipse properly; I will remain here, and not see it properly < 1503208207 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1503208234 0 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They told me 'You may seek it with thimbles— and seek it with care; You may hunt it with forks and hope; You may threaten its life with a railway-share; You may charm it with smiles and soap—' < 1503208302 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not see how that helps, and how you can use thimbles to seek a solar eclipse or to charm it with soap? < 1503208654 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not all of the functions of Swiss Ephemeris have been put in yet, although I have also put in some functions that are not in Swiss Ephemeris, such as converting between JavaScript Date objects and Julian day numbers, numeric formatting (for angles, such as ecliptic or equatorial coordinates, geographic coordinates, azimuth, astrological signs, etc), a few new house systems that I made up, and map projections. < 1503208758 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I also wrote my own implementation of converting to horizontal coordinates, since I found that the one included in Swiss Ephemeris cannot use hour angle as input.) < 1503209064 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(There is also no reverse map projections yet, so if you want a interactive map that you can click on, it doesn't implement yet.) < 1503211394 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also want to know how I could add artificial satellite positions and terminator lines < 1503211833 0 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-sbhzedjebiiscxre QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1503212684 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Main Page14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52880&oldid=43201 5* 03LyricLy 5* (+234) 10 < 1503212947 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@76.14.249.98 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503213473 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1] ! < 1503213927 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503214024 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503214061 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503214314 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503214603 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1503215509 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :zseri! yay! < 1503215957 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503217169 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503218809 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503219981 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, oerjan is totally out of phase again < 1503221809 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1503221947 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503221966 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1503222144 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: why do you have a subpage Esolangs (User:Rdococ/Esolangs) on your profile which is less complete than the Esolangs list on the main profile page User:Rdococ < 1503222997 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@76.14.249.98 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1503223305 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:6dfa:16bd:df3d:3a4b JOIN :#esoteric < 1503223324 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@76.14.249.98 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503223714 0 :MrBusiness!~ArcMrBism@2602:306:8325:a300:9d0c:f7e5:5331:bc8 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1503223753 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1503223857 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503224156 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :zseri: idk < 1503224157 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hppavilion[1], hi < 1503224165 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1503224424 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Main Page14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52881&oldid=52880 5* 03LyricLy 5* (+4) 10 < 1503224587 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503225317 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1503225355 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :zseri: what about a low level language where the main array type is a linked list? < 1503226340 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like brainfuck, but you can drop the current cell or insert one (e.g. after the current cell) < 1503226347 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice idea < 1503226637 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe < 1503226668 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh! what if the cells started as all ones, and all you could do was insert a 0 cell after the current cell? < 1503226903 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck minus - (and non-wrapping bits) seems to be TC; what if you had to insert the 1 cells? < 1503227041 0 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1503227216 0 :augur!~augur@198-27-215-123.static.sonic.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503227398 0 :augur!~augur@198-27-215-123.static.sonic.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503227410 0 :augur!~augur@198-27-215-123.static.sonic.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503228166 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking of combining the continuation thing with http://esolangs.org/wiki/Upsilon < 1503229431 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07YABC14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52882&oldid=37129 5* 03Int-e 5* (+3744) 10from Brainfuck to YABC < 1503230393 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://gist.github.com/zserik/280f3126e2141d7bad223c3c1e9a1b9d (updated again) < 1503230459 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets try creating a mash-up of Assignless, first-class continuations (implicit created and passed, usage explicit) and Upsilon. < 1503230624 0 :Antoxyde!~Antoxyde@AAnnecy-654-1-74-189.w90-27.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1503230677 0 :augur!~augur@198-27-215-123.static.sonic.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503232917 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503233222 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://xkcd.com/660/ < 1503233408 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_o < 1503233474 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm working on an esolangs article for assignless + the continuation thing < 1503233488 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Hitchhiker universe has ships driven by bad news < 1503233506 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, so the more esolangs I create, the more fuel it has? < 1503233517 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they're highly unpopular though) < 1503233535 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: "Bad news: ship ran out of fuel." < 1503233637 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like "Bad news: the ship is running low on fuel." < 1503233658 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :which gives it more fuel < 1503233684 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bad news: The ship has too much fuel. < 1503233689 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O < 1503233706 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then at some point it stops being news < 1503233711 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and starts just being *bad* < 1503233711 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. < 1503233718 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :then fuel will decrease again. < 1503233744 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :does good news decrease it then? < 1503233750 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1503233780 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might be able to use it to create good news to make the world a better place, using the "Bad news: machine is running out of fuel." as fuel < 1503233784 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know I could see the ship not having "fuel" per se, but having to be driven by a constant stream of bad news < 1503233788 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :in other words, instant utopia < 1503233791 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :worse news = more thrust? < 1503233797 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course < 1503233815 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're actually only mentioned in passing < 1503233849 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should read Hitchhiker < 1503233860 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda surprised I haven't done so yet honestly < 1503233906 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Nothing travels faster than the speed of light with the possible exception of bad news, which obeys its own special laws. The Hingefreel people of Arkintoofle Minor did try to build spaceships that were powered by bad news but they didn't work particularly well and were so extremely unwelcome whenever they arrived anywhere that there wasn't really any point in being there." < 1503233982 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bad news travels faster than the speed of light? < 1503233996 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would mean if you frame something as bad news < 1503233999 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :time traveling information < 1503234014 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :powerful < 1503234041 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :TieSoul: did you look at the xkcd link? The way I see it it's really based on that concept. < 1503234083 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bad news: information has to be passed at faster than light speeds again < 1503234098 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does that qualify as bad? < 1503234108 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bad news: the magical yay machine is working again" < 1503234110 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is the objective qualification of bad news < 1503234120 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I bet it's subjective to your reference frame < 1503234121 0 :MrBusiness!~ArcMrBism@2602:306:8325:a300:c801:d7f:77e1:92be JOIN :#esoteric < 1503234281 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503234590 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi bioly < 1503234895 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Helloily! < 1503234964 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhh < 1503234967 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good moilyng? < 1503234986 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, boilogy < 1503234990 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? boily < 1503234992 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​“Only sane adverb” boily is monetizing a brotherhood scheme with the Guardian of Lachine. He is also a NaniDispenser, a Trigotillectomic Groan Man Eating Chicken, a METARologist, seriously lacking in the f-word department, a thwack doctor, a Quintopial antipodist, and a renowned Capitalist who helps keep the world boring. < 1503235010 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1503235155 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? wisdom < 1503235156 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom is always factually accurate, except for this entry, and, uh, that other one? It started with, like, an ø? < 1503235182 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( wisdom is often born out of boredom < 1503235184 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :) < 1503235203 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zsellori, rdochelloc, TieSelloul, int-ello, HellockEgo! < 1503235212 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? ø < 1503235213 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ø is not going anywhere. < 1503235235 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that settles that < 1503235271 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( Heh, I forgot that I talked about boredom on https://esolangs.org/wiki/User:Int-e ) < 1503235388 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? wisdome < 1503235390 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07User:TieSoul14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52883&oldid=40229 5* 03TieSoul 5* (-426) 10Replaced content with "I made [[Befunk]] I guess" < 1503235390 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Wisdome is the place where all of HackBot's wisdom is stored and forced to fight to the death for the freedom of being printed out when you type `wisdom. Strictly speaking, it should be called the "Wissphere". < 1503235394 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that reminds me < 1503235397 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it's better < 1503235521 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`wisdom < 1503235522 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503235522 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eol//EOL stands for End Of Lawn. It's often found past the wabe. oerjan requests your presence there immediately. < 1503235537 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :twas brillig < 1503235657 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn The Boredome is a dangerous place swarming with woodpeckers, dentists, and bookworms. < 1503235660 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'boredome': The Boredome is a dangerous place swarming with woodpeckers, dentists, and bookworms. < 1503235692 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? dentist < 1503235693 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dentist? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1503235706 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :a master bore < 1503235740 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Dentists are professional workers whose main line of work is forming dents on various surfaces." < 1503235777 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1503235795 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn Dentist Dentists are professional workers whose main line of work is creating dents on various surfaces. < 1503235797 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'dentist': Dentist Dentists are professional workers whose main line of work is creating dents on various surfaces. < 1503235805 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le//rn Dentist//Dentists are professional workers whose main line of work is creating dents on various surfaces. < 1503235807 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relearned 'dentist': Dentists are professional workers whose main line of work is creating dents on various surfaces. < 1503235825 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dentist Dentists < 1503235860 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's dentists who are discriminatory to dents < 1503235867 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Bookworms are a species of worm known for thriving in books, feeding from the cellulose in the paper." < 1503235903 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le//rn bookworm//Bookworms are a species of worm known for thriving in books. They are known to be unusually intelligent. < 1503235906 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'bookworm': Bookworms are a species of worm known for thriving in books. They are known to be unusually intelligent. < 1503235923 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Woodpeckers are a class of wooden sculptures, depicting a 'peck' or kiss." < 1503235939 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll stop now, before someone calls me out for adding bad wisdom entries. < 1503236186 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: FWIW, there's auto-pluralization handling -- you can "`learn Dentists are such and such." and it will learn 'dentist'. < 1503236210 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm aware of that but I am more comfortable with //. < 1503236220 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but what if a word ends in s < 1503236234 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :TieSoul: Then you need to use the alternatives. < 1503236239 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1503236247 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also doesn't work for nonstandard plurals. < 1503236258 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1503236288 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nonstandard plurals would require more or less encoding a partial dictionary < 1503236295 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is too much effort for a slight convenience < 1503236334 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503236396 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :In other news, the Telegraph magazine has made me a lot less excited about 4G and 5G, since apparently their speeds top up at 1 and 10 megabits, respectively: https://zem.fi/tmp/telegraph.png < 1503236448 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure makes it look good with that bar graph though < 1503236487 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, that can't be right < 1503236525 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also yeah I'm pretty sure 4G is faster than 1Mb/s < 1503236593 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've gotten >1Mbit/s over 3G (well, one of the standards before LTE using 3G's infrastructure) at least and >20 over LTE < 1503236618 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1503236620 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they were just ulling arbitrary numbers < 1503236625 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :pulling* < 1503236632 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: Yeah, the 384 kbit/s is from the original UMTS spec, they've dropped the HSPA steps. < 1503236651 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :before 4G, I seemed to get better results with what my phone OS called "H" connection than with 3G < 1503236652 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :And 300 Mbit/s would be the conventional figure for LTE, though I think they've gotten their "1000" from gigabit LTE news. < 1503236685 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is off by three orders of magnitude then < 1503236687 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice < 1503236717 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing they just switched from kbit/s to Mbit/s halfway through their chart. < 1503236728 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :TieSoul: that'd be HSPA or HSPA+ then < 1503236752 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right < 1503236753 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :or "3.5G" and "3.7G" according to Maemo 5 IIRC < 1503236765 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh cool < 1503236789 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's a bit convenient of them to squeeze everything in a genertions scale < 1503236799 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :though using fractional "G"s is unwieldy < 1503236816 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly: I think HSPA+ is quite often referred to as "3.75G", but that doesn't fit in a status bar as well. < 1503236828 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense < 1503236830 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that should get rounded to 3.8G then < 1503236874 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I suppose that'd be slightly misleading < 1503236937 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean the fraction is pretty arbitrary < 1503236945 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's true < 1503236952 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Maemo used 2.5G for EDGE as well. < 1503236954 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's easier to tell that 3.5 > 3 than "H" > "3G" < 1503236962 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1503236966 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I believe it did < 1503236986 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :This Android phone does G, E, 3G, H, 4G, I think. < 1503237005 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mine uses 3G, H, H+, and 4G. I don't think I've dipped below that. < 1503237021 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on my current phone that is < 1503237035 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only recall eeing 2G, 3G and 4G on Sailfish I think < 1503237060 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess it uses 2G for both GSM and EDGE etc < 1503237073 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense I guess < 1503237089 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easier to see the easy to compare numbers than to memorize the abbreviations < 1503237450 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how 5G development is coming along < 1503237456 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw a 5G test rig a couple years ago < 1503237546 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure exactly what technology, but whatever they were working on at uni two years ago I guess < 1503237575 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :The article that bogus graph was from is about UK 5G spectrum auctions, and how a few lawsuits are going to slow them down. < 1503237578 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/08/19/bts-mobile-unit-wades-5g-battle-against-three/ < 1503237612 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1503237633 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503237686 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, according to wikipedia, "LTE Advanced Pro (LTE-A Pro, also known as 4.5G, 4.5G Pro, 4.9G, Pre-5G, 5G Project, and so on)" < 1503237699 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems they're getting progressively more optimistic about LTE-A Pro < 1503237712 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1503237724 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't wait until 7G < 1503237847 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :TieSoul: for the longest time LTE was also considered "not quite 4G" until it became defacto 4G < 1503237863 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey, apparently my country is ranked 5th in LTE coverage < 1503237872 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Omega-G, anyone? < 1503237872 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :the numbered generations are as much for marketing as the fractional in-between generations are really < 1503237883 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I figured fire < 1503237904 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1503237920 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :LTE coverage is pretty good here, but I dunno how well it ranks on an area-of-country-covered basis < 1503237928 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :since northern sweden is.. pretty rural < 1503237934 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like epsilon-zero G, rdococ < 1503237944 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :epsilon-epsilon-one-G < 1503237952 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I had LTE coverage whilst hiking last week in the mountains, so that's cool :P < 1503237961 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the name for epsilon-epsilon-epsilon-...? < 1503237962 0 :fizzie!?@? PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scotland was very low in G's. < 1503237980 0 :lord_EarlGray1!~slawek@static-dwasiedem-dwapiec0.echostar.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1503238033 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :4G - Normalhastighet 10 - 40 Mbit/s < 1503238033 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :4G+ - Normalhastighet 20 - 60 Mbit/s < 1503238035 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1503238044 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if that'sa different technology or if both are just LTE < 1503238081 0 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :suspect they are both LTE < 1503238085 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the speeds are close < 1503239113 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric < 1503239410 0 :lord_EarlGray1!~slawek@static-dwasiedem-dwapiec0.echostar.pl PART #esoteric : < 1503240273 0 :ATMunn!~ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn26 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503240495 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moony the moony moon! < 1503240578 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :moo < 1503241783 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1503242069 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1503242383 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :neh < 1503242477 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :nuh? < 1503242527 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hn < 1503242573 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :asdfbable < 1503242586 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :honk < 1503242772 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1503244332 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503244364 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523 < 1503244529 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi zseri < 1503244633 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1503244641 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feather sounds nice btw < 1503244741 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@pool-173-61-30-116.cmdnnj.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503244852 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: what motivated you to say something like /that/ just after I joined? :-D < 1503244870 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily, I've been growing more Feather-resistant over time, I'm starting to come to terms with it a bit more < 1503244902 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're really ticklish < 1503244932 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder if standard user turnover in #esoteric will eventually result in nobody knowing what Feather is except that it's a meme < 1503245016 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@76.14.249.98 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503245041 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@76.14.249.98 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503245105 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@76.14.249.98 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503245160 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1503245190 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Feather clearly comes from a Bird :P < 1503245593 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I've added a translation from Brainfuck to YABC < 1503245743 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which might be interesting in how it handles skipping of loops... that was my primary inspiration) < 1503245774 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503245803 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode 😎 < 1503245805 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+1F60E SMILING FACE WITH SUNGLASSES] < 1503246050 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hee < 1503246093 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: you should use the whole chicken for the best experience. < 1503246099 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: feather is future-proof. < 1503246121 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: very much so < 1503246140 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503246146 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PART #esoteric :"HOLISITC CHICKEN" < 1503246146 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1503246151 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good old Future. < 1503246153 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503246155 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode 😎 < 1503246156 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+1F60E SMILING FACE WITH SUNGLASSES] < 1503246156 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1503246176 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: how does that handle nested loops? < 1503246179 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION really wishes he could stumble on an original idea for once. < 1503246190 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: by moving further to the left. < 1503246346 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the pointer is somewhere in the 41 -37 ... 41 -37 part, pointing to a 41 if scanning to the left or to a -37 if scanning to the right; the further nested the loops, the further left the pointer will be in that part. < 1503246402 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I see, you're using the position of the data pointer to track the nesting level, not the position of the instruction pointer < 1503246407 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1503246409 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is how I'd expected it'd be done < 1503246438 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :which allows me to have a very uniform (if inefficient) trranslation. < 1503246473 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503246483 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode 😎 < 1503246484 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+1F60E SMILING FACE WITH SUNGLASSES] < 1503246492 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :It will not get better over Time. < 1503246493 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503246506 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode 😎 < 1503246508 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+1F60E SMILING FACE WITH SUNGLASSES] < 1503246511 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs < 1503246528 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :APic: I don't see the actual character and there are many smileyds < 1503246539 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should switch to privmsg, perhaps < 1503246556 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: originality is an itch. you can't strike it, just scratch it. find what irks you. what are your wishes? what are your "man, it'd be so nice to have..."? < 1503246715 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: come to think of it, there's probably a construction which uses the value of a tape element < 1503246744 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just put the nesting level directly on the tape, and use it as a value to branch on to see if you've gon far enough yet < 1503246746 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: I don't have much of an idea, to be honest. Sometimes, something looks like an appealing idea to me, and then it loses its subjective value over time. < 1503246819 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I started writing a small Rust program to learn the language < 1503246835 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and already ended up doing heavy amounts of type-level metaprogramming and had an idea for a new language feature and a new optimisation < 1503246951 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503246959 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: True. < 1503246971 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had the idea that functions could be manipulated by a program as a linked list of statements, with expressions that could be modified on the fly < 1503246980 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Type-Safety ♥ < 1503246988 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, for example, say we have a function f. f[1] is the first statement, f[2] second, etc. < 1503246988 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ♥ < 1503246989 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+2665 BLACK HEART SUIT] < 1503246995 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aaaah < 1503247003 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good old 4-Letter-Codes. 😎 < 1503247024 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :say f[5] was an if conditional - then f[5].condition would be the condition, f[5].ifblock would be another list of statements, f[5].elseblock, and then f[6] after it. < 1503247059 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, explain what feather is < 1503247083 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Feather < 1503247088 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I can't; the wiki page may help < 1503247102 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at a very rough approximation, it's an esolang I started to write, couldn't pin down the details < 1503247116 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then got really upset because not only did nobody else understand my esolang, I didn't understand it either < 1503247139 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: explore the idea. build a working prototype. draft sketches on random pieces of paper. doodle. have a feel for it. where shall it lead? < 1503247151 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION actually misread „moony“ as „money“, lol. < 1503247162 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: a working prototype? I can't even do that. < 1503247163 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION goes insane thinking about feather < 1503247168 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's very maddening because looking at individual parts of it, it feels like it /should/ work, and yet I can't grasp the whole, and even when just focusing on individual parts, there's always complications which means you can't pin down exactly how they work < 1503247193 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, if you'd let us look at individual parts, we could help < 1503247197 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, do it like i do it: implement and test each little bit at a time, with little/no order lol < 1503247210 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again, I don't want to go mad either :P < 1503247214 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: I don't understand any of them either :-( < 1503247225 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I have worked out the correct order in which to approach them, I think < 1503247228 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, i volunteer my brain < 1503247236 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: yes you can. < 1503247242 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :just so i can figure out what it is < 1503247242 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: you can? < 1503247245 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of my Feather-related work has been on what must be the first step: to work out a language that it's theoretically possible to implement Feather in < 1503247260 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1503247268 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( aka, Feather? ) < 1503247270 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :other than Feather itself, that is < 1503247282 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you need to get started somehow < 1503247282 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1503247293 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony talks, People listen. < 1503247301 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah but how do you know it won't be precursors to Feather all the way down... < 1503247305 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :k < 1503247313 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the looks of the unfinished article, it does sound like a cool concept < 1503247318 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1503247323 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :once you have a working proto-Feather interpreter (i.e. one that implements Feather but doesn't fulfil all the provenance restrictions needed to be a Feather interpreter), you can then retroactively change it to have been written in Feather itself < 1503247330 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: good morning to you < 1503247345 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's another of the steps where I think I know how it works but I don't have a working set of precise details < 1503247347 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :well first, we need to build a time machine and put a computer inside it with a link to the time machine < 1503247385 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what, I'm going to borrow Feather's specification from the future, brb. < 1503247387 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :then we need to solve the halting problem so ais523's brain wont asplode < 1503247388 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: good afternoon < 1503247399 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :done we made feather < 1503247407 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :halting problem is easy to solve - use Banana Scheme < 1503247412 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, the language in which the proto-Feather interpreter is written needs the following properties: functional with minimal side effects (nothing beyond what you need to communicate with the user, and ideally not even that); a working call/cc; an eigenratio of 1, ideally for all idiomatic interpreters rather than just one of them; a syntax simple enough that self-interpreting is easy < 1503247424 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :eigenratio? < 1503247424 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb rewriting ais523 in banana scheme < 1503247431 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and ideally it wouldn't go into an infinite loop just because the program mentioned one < 1503247438 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait how do i write things in banana scheme < 1503247444 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: imagine running a program through a large stack of self-interpreters < 1503247466 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :functional and call/cc is easy < 1503247471 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, minimal side effects? hmm. you may have to make a entire new language for that < 1503247480 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :not sure about the eigenratio, and the infinite loop thing - maybe not :P < 1503247480 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the eigenratio is the amount of slowdown you get by adding another interpreter to the stack, expressed as a ratio between the execution times < 1503247497 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. why don't you want it to speed up? < 1503247509 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in other words, eigenvalue < 1) < 1503247517 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/eigenvalue/eigenratio/ < 1503247521 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: it's clearly impossible to get an eigenratio < 1, because that means that the more self-interpreters you had in the stack, the faster it would get < 1503247533 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning you could create an arbitrarily fast impl via stacking an arbitrary number of interps < 1503247551 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and necessarily outpacing the "programming speed of light" for the computer you were running on < 1503247556 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@pool-173-61-30-116.cmdnnj.fios.verizon.net QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1503247560 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, go make a fork of the rust compiler. i think (tm) it has a eignratio of 1 < 1503247570 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eigenratio = 1 is possible if each level of self-interpreters only adds a constant time < 1503247570 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :the compiler is written to be compiled by itself < 1503247577 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: most compilers have eigenratio 1 :-P < 1503247605 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, the most promising approach to writing an eigenratio-1 interpreter is to have it work as a compiler + eval < 1503247606 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: a self-interpreter that writes the code to be interpreted to the current file, and then restarts the file. < 1503247624 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like Lua's load(). < 1503247644 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, go ask in #xkcd. they're esoteric enough to help maybe? :P < 1503247659 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but if the compiler is being freshly compiled, doesn't that give it eigenratio > 1? < 1503247662 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, just claiming this now: inb4 brainfuck but with more instructions < 1503247663 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I think a simple eval() would do < 1503247697 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: the point is that if you repeatedly compile the compiler with itself, then eventually run a different program with the final compiler in the chain < 1503247700 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the program doesn't run any slower < 1503247704 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ohh ok < 1503247711 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I thought you were including the time to compile the compilers < 1503247717 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so each layer of compiler didn't give you a slowdown of a factor, but a slowdown of a constant amount of time, which doesn't show up on the ratio < 1503247811 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, is memory usage counted as a side effect? < 1503247852 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: hmm, I guess for this to work it needs to avoid using notable extra memory for each level of self-interps, too < 1503247877 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I guess it's probably OK to have a Feather interpreter that crashes due to memory loss, or gets very slow after a while, at least to start with < 1503247882 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm, well your 'functional with minimal side effects' requirement seems to be fulfilled by unlambda. < 1503247885 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could perhaps optimize it later? maybe even retroactively? < 1503247904 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: Unlambda actually does very well in a number of categories as a language in which to write Feather < 1503247910 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its main drawback is being almost impossible to write in < 1503247926 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, why not make a abstraction of unlambda? < 1503247931 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or, actually, it's not that hard to write but is hard to do anything else with) < 1503247939 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, let me see how that could be done... hrm. < 1503248010 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :so user output as only side effect? leme think < 1503248014 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you treat unlambda as an asm it's not that bad < 1503248036 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I think I've figured out how to do I/O in a pure functional language without making evaluation order visible < 1503248055 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the general issue of doing I/O in Feather is a pretty awkward one, especially output < 1503248060 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, well, ...Damn, you got me into a feather problem < 1503248066 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because after you've output something, you can retroactively change things so that you didn't output it < 1503248076 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: really, I recommend not thinking about it < 1503248091 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe the problem actually is unsolvable! < 1503248102 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, talking through this here has helped, because it's making Feather seem less possible rather than more < 1503248109 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, who knows. if it is this could be a issue with modern mathematics...... < 1503248122 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Don't worry, I'm already mad, I think I might be able to solve it (after trying everything else first :P) < 1503248122 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :not feather, but our form of mathematics and logic < 1503248154 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe we can use anger to disguse our thoughts so the universe doesnt notice us thinking about feather. < 1503248187 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1503248208 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, hey, its worth trying. < 1503248227 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: sorry, but anger has the opposite effect hth < 1503248279 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? hth < 1503248280 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hth ([ʰtʰh̩]) is help received from a hairy toe. It is not at all hambiguitous. < 1503248285 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :unhelpful as usual < 1503248296 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? hambiguitous < 1503248296 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right 'hope that helps' < 1503248297 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :We're not sure what hambiguitous means, but it's definitely not hth. < 1503248378 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503248382 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan, would a feeling of calm help? Cats make calmness. *prepares to flood chatroom with kittens* < 1503248386 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? Boobies < 1503248387 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Boobies? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1503248390 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :🙌 < 1503248490 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Main Page14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=52884&oldid=52881 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-238) 10You failed to discuss this in the right place hth < 1503248548 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they probably discussed it on the discord server :-P < 1503248565 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, a "discord server" isn't actually a server, it's more like a channel < 1503248596 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: probably < 1503248973 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, i figured out this: Feather is likely a purely functional language that is self interperting with minimal/no side effects < 1503248996 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :and throwing the word "retroactively" around a lot < 1503249008 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. " in Feather, you create objects by cloning+modification, and if you retroactively change the parent object, that changes all its decendants, so it comes to the same thing" < 1503249017 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :that actually sounds coo. < 1503249018 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :l < 1503249056 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, if it wasn't a cool language I don't think I'd have spent this much mental effort on it < 1503249081 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, Feather itself (as opposed to the language in which it's originally implemented) sort-of has side effects because a retroactive change is similar to an assignment in that sense < 1503249082 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :do we have any more feather info? :P lets see if we can try and piece it together. Communal brainpower only thinking about PARTS cant be as bad as thinking about the WHOLE < 1503249110 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: or let me think about the WHOLE, because I'm already INSANE :P < 1503249112 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, one big problem is "how do you encapsulate things well enough that a retroactive change doesn't create an infinite loop" < 1503249116 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :say I retroactively change something to itself < 1503249126 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Feather does that by going back in time to the point at which it was created, changing nothing < 1503249127 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is this retroactive change, first of all? < 1503249131 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then running hte program from there < 1503249160 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: you can define the core operation pretty easily; when an object is "created" it gets a handle (which is probably just a continuation) that describes the object < 1503249175 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can retroactively change the object via using the handle; it replaces what the object was at the time it was created < 1503249178 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, object continuations? < 1503249181 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is basically what call/cc already does < 1503249190 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_o < 1503249210 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, so the idea is you have a continuation on an object, but you implement that via call/cc at the time the object's created < 1503249239 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, i assume once its done it goes back in time to program start and gives output immediately? < 1503249240 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you later want to change what the object was, you use the continuation to rewind back to the time it was created < 1503249247 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and put a different object (taken from the future) there instead < 1503249259 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: not necessarily, although that's an interesting idea < 1503249287 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :then just use up the needed compute time, or even cut program execution out of the timeline entirely, making it have no side effects (in essence) < 1503249300 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a program is basically a "chunkstream" that works like Easy; it's a program followed by input to it, but the program is meant to be a self-interpreter (or approximately so) so it recognises the input as more code to run < 1503249324 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O < 1503249336 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the whole notion of retroactively replacing the whole program execution with the output does actually solve most of the major problems with the output, though < 1503249424 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, your welcome :) < 1503249455 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :im happy to not erase that moment frm the timeline and keep it to myself as long as you dont do the same < 1503249548 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: so I don't have an actual time machine < 1503249553 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ideally, when you retroactively change something in Feather < 1503249575 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's carefully crafted so that the change has no visible effect until the moment you tried to go back in time and change it < 1503249592 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, just keep a state tracker. Sure it'll eat memory like hell by keeping track of all timelines, but it'll do the job for a theoretical system < 1503249616 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tracking state isn't a panacea here < 1503249686 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb, i swear i'll erase you from the timeline /s < 1503249693 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Be my guest ;) < 1503249705 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION wonders if they realise this universe is a program on moonys computer < 1503249714 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O < 1503249728 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope they noticed. < 1503249746 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION prepares timeline wipe before remembering it only creates a new branch, he fucked this timeline up < 1503249746 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yay! Can moony use the program to give me lots of money? < 1503249759 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, no < 1503249762 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aw. < 1503249777 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in 'i refuse to go through the effort of making a template' < 1503249782 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can moony use the program to metaprogram, so he can generate code that gives me the ability to give myself lots of money? < 1503249793 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, no < 1503249803 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1503249806 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i refuse to give you a shitty life hack < 1503249807 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can moony prove that the universe is on his computer? < 1503249822 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, sure. You now no longer exist in the branch of this timeline. < 1503249828 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :a branch tho < 1503249831 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :YaaaaY! < 1503249833 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :you exist here because i cant undo it. < 1503249835 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Phœnix-Feathers pwn. At least in the final Fantasies. 😎 < 1503249844 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: Sad but true. < 1503249859 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you remove APic from another branch in the timeline? < 1503249863 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, done < 1503249868 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :YaY! < 1503249870 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: In my Dreams, probably. < 1503249877 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i deleted everyone assosiated eith #esoteric in another timeline besides me. < 1503249883 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: Also, in other Branches, my Nick is actually „ACTPic“. < 1503249889 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, can you force APic's current subconscious to enter the timeline in which he does not exist? < 1503249899 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, i refuse < 1503249899 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/sub// < 1503249903 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why? < 1503249907 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :bcuz its mean < 1503249918 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eh, true. < 1503249930 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :APic: hmm, the translation used for the English versions of Final Fantasies is "Phoenix Down", but I know that several details, both major and minor, are different in different language versions < 1503249938 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :here, i'll force APic from 10 seconds ago to branch off and then be shoved into the timeline where he doesnt exist < 1503249941 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there may well be a language where they're phœnix feathers insetead < 1503249971 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, tip: your 'feather' language will be awesome according to this timeline over here, from 2 years ago. < 1503249983 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: Can you create a branch in the timeline which has developed the technology necessary to broadcast information across branches - even to branches which don't have the technology necessary to receive those messages? < 1503250001 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: well, Feather's time-travel model is basically one in which retroactively changing something destroys your current timeline and recreates it via replaying from that point with the change < 1503250006 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, that'd make the program crash. do you want that? (: < 1503250008 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( At each time step, the universe is recreated from scratch. The trick is to make it appear smooth and efficient. ) < 1503250021 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: Ooh! I want to know what it feels like to crash! < 1503250021 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you get a timeloop if the retroactive change happens again in the new timeline, thus you need every change to somehow negate the fact it was made < 1503250029 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, eeexxxaaaccctttllly < 1503250039 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, it means you no longer exist. in every timeline. forever. < 1503250051 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: Is the crash local to me, or global? < 1503250065 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :psst, someone kline him and scramble the DNS cache so he thinks i deleted freenode < 1503250072 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1503250104 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Moony, I'll still have these logs. < 1503250107 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not dumb. < 1503250123 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, oh right. Oh well. < 1503250133 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I am pretty stupid. < 1503250138 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, are italics standard on IRC nowadays? < 1503250142 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :if onyl i could disable the auto timeline split safety feature. < 1503250146 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client interprets tab as toggle-italics, but I thought most didn't < 1503250158 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure they are. altho tab italics is NOT standard < 1503250169 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client uses ctrl+i for italics < 1503250175 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :my client doesnt even let me enter a tab < 1503250181 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither does mine < 1503250195 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: control-I /is/ a tab < 1503250196 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even sure where it tabs to < 1503250213 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, oh. ok it is standard then. < 1503250214 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it isn't, they are two distinct characters < 1503250216 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I just realized that thing int-e keeps doing is a thought bubble < 1503250219 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like control-J is a newline, control-M is a carriage return, control-[ is escape, etc. < 1503250221 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...can't believe I didn't see that earlier < 1503250230 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :TieSoul, wonder what took you so long < 1503250236 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric : I copied and pasted tabs from a text editor. see? not italic. < 1503250243 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I know right < 1503250260 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can type italics with ctrl-i too < 1503250275 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :bolditalicunderline4color < 1503250288 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: it used to be that copy-pasted tabs would italicise on this client < 1503250295 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh < 1503250333 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyways back to feather < 1503250337 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, any known syntax? < 1503250370 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I can't remember the details, but the intention was that it should be similar to Smalltalk but work for different reasons < 1503250404 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a b" would normally call method b on a, but if a was "unboxed" it'd provide b as an argument to a < 1503250425 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was some method you could call on things to get an unboxed version of them, but I can't remember whether it was ^ or # < 1503250430 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whichever one you'd use in that situation in Smalltalk < 1503250461 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I believe ^ is return in Smalltalk < 1503250464 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also the method name for the low-level retroactive change was <<= < 1503250475 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :by the way, you guys are lucky. this is timeline '0' persay < 1503250497 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Branchporting pwnd in the NetHacks. < 1503250533 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: We had the Phönixfeders in the Germanies, at least so i believe. < 1503250536 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: so did you create timeline 0 with everyone in it, or...? < 1503250545 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :because if so, why do I exist here < 1503250564 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, how do you think it started? Im not going to spend milleniums handcrafting a universe. i let it do its thing. < 1503250604 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: if you think it's such a bad idea to spend millenia hand-crafting a universe, maybe you should tell the kinds of people who hand-craft universes for fun! < 1503250635 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, its not a bad idea. i just dont wanna spend it. even if i DO live several billion years. < 1503250645 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503250684 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? esoteric < 1503250686 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This channel is about programming -- for the other kind of esoterica, try #esoteric on EFnet or DALnet. < 1503250690 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i recall some universe that had a world on the back of a giant turtle that had 3-4 elephants on it... I also remember leaking it into this world by mistake < 1503250700 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, might wanna revise that. its so much more now. < 1503250705 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm wondering if I've fallen into the wrong #esoteric by mistake :-P < 1503250715 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, lol < 1503250715 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: discworld? < 1503250723 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, i refuse to say < 1503250730 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Concept: OOP language where methods themselves are objects < 1503250732 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I preferred it when it was mostly about programming < 1503250733 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :now back on topic before i blow you to bits < 1503250739 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ah. < 1503250745 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the offtopic discussion is much less objectionable than it was a couple of decades ago < 1503250754 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, more like 1½ < 1503250754 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, theoreticals are fun too! < 1503250777 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ended up leaving #esoteric for long periods of time because I just wasn't interested in the topics it normally discussed < 1503250785 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mm < 1503250796 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats normal. #xkcd is better anyways :P < 1503250838 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :discussion of every kind there. from the comic to space-time < 1503250874 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and hppa lurks there. hasnt been here in a while has he < 1503250890 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not lurks, really, he's a active talker) < 1503250900 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :saw him yesterday, i think < 1503250921 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, joining. < 1503251145 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :A housemate taught me a cool way to represent scenes for graphicsy stuff yesterday < 1503251157 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :As functions from points to the distance to the closest surface < 1503251169 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you can take the union of two scenes with, like, liftA2 min < 1503251184 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, signed distance functions < 1503251192 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're neat < 1503251208 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah! < 1503251213 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, i have a suspicion: are you named after the show/movie/book/whateveritis < 1503251229 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: no < 1503251234 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :common misconseption < 1503251235 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always assumed FireFly was an aquatic insect < 1503251238 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :misconception too < 1503251245 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: http://iquilezles.org/www/articles/distfunctions/distfunctions.htm < 1503251246 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :o_o < 1503251272 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :has a nice collections of primitives and tricks for sdf's < 1503251282 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :raymarching is fun :) < 1503251346 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also if you take the derivative of the signed norm function at a surface point, you get the surface's normal < 1503251400 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, so you can use an approximation of the gradient (like central difference) to get the normal < 1503251405 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :handy for light computations < 1503251486 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been working on something that uses automatic differentiation for that today < 1503251544 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :kill me < 1503251589 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I find Sundays difficult because I tend to forget to drink < 1503251606 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: just hold your breath < 1503251623 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: that doesn't work < 1503251654 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: well the underlying theory is sound. < 1503251675 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway... < 1503251685 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: why sundays in particular? < 1503251719 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I learned about the idea of automatic differentiation a while ago, it seems like it'd be really handy for that, yeah < 1503251742 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, my office has a sink that I can see from my desk, so I remember to drink Mondays through Fridays < 1503251743 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :in cases when the distance function is possible to express neatly < 1503251748 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1503251751 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : what's the name for epsilon-epsilon-epsilon-...? <-- phi_2(0) iiuc. < 1503251786 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1503251810 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that certainly sounds like it could be it < 1503251815 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veblen_function although it's pretty dense. < 1503251835 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, I'm a bit crap at looking after myself today tbh :( < 1503251841 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general, in fact < 1503251877 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I see < 1503251885 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I think you're right < 1503251892 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-1zEo7DD8w ← this from Revision earlier this year is pretty cool, LJ (to the right) is livecoding a scene expressed as an sdf and rendering it with raymarching in half an hour < 1503252023 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :(leave it to demosceners to do crazy stuff like that in half an hour :P) < 1503252083 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, the housemate who told me about this is into demoscene < 1503252103 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503252127 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've played a bit with raymarching and distance fields, but not enough.. < 1503252705 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :While I'm thinking about it I'm going to get a drink < 1503252710 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1503252724 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about an OO language where even the methods are objects? < 1503252775 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-80-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503252776 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: you could try keeping a bottle of water by the desk < 1503252783 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could try getting addicted to tea, I find that works pretty well too < 1503252788 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, ais523 has me trapped trying to figure out how to make a precursor functional language feather could be implemented in < 1503252813 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't mean to; feel free to stop thinking about it if you like! < 1503252822 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :no. never < 1503252862 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :FireFly, I really don't like the taste of tea < 1503252891 0 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503252894 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the bottle suggestion might work < 1503253537 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION explodes < 1503253799 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :exploding moons are so last century < 1503254159 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :one thing i don't recall ais523 ever explaining, is what's supposed to happen if you replace an object with something that _contains_ the original, but isn't identical to it. < 1503254183 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, might wanna explain that... could be a issue. dont want to crash the universe do we? < 1503254185 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you can smuggle back objects from previous timelines like that < 1503254192 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the new-timeline object contains the old-timeline object < 1503254208 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :from before the retroactive replacement < 1503254211 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :the old-timeline object would be modified in the old timeline right? < 1503254221 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the old timeline no longer exists < 1503254242 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you make a retroactive change, that /always/ ends the current timeline, and starts from a new timeline that branched off from the previously current timeline at the point at which the object was created < 1503254249 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :then what happens if you write to the old timeline object which supposedly should be gone < 1503254255 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's only one timeline at a time < 1503254290 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: there is a consistent answer to this, but I'm not 100% sure offhand what it is < 1503254300 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, think of it in terms of call/cc < 1503254303 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the best conversation to happen here in months < 1503254312 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ikr < 1503254337 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whenever you create an object, you do so within a call/cc function, the function that's called/cc takes the continuation and adds it to a field of the object, then returns the object < 1503254377 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that means that if you have a smuggled object then you also have its timeline, through its continuation. < 1503254379 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then to retroactively change the object, you take the continuation (which you can access because it's in a field of the object), and give it the new object as an argument (thus effectively rerunning the program from the point at which the object was created) < 1503254408 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: right, this is indeed correct, although you only have the timeline at the point the object was created < 1503254416 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess there's only one active timeline at a time, but you can have plenty of dormant timelines < 1503254419 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, uh, how would a self referencing object behave? < 1503254434 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: I don't believe it's possible to create a self-referencing object in Feather < 1503254446 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :mk < 1503254457 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have any way to change the current value of a field, only retroactively change the object's value at creation time < 1503254487 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the equivalent of "an object reference" is "an object's continuation", as that's the only thing that differs between an object and a clone of an object; but an object has its own continuation available already < 1503254511 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: also, I don't think you can reasonably get mad at me for not knowing how Feather works :-P < 1503254515 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :cant you just go back in time, put the object inside its own field, and have a recursive object? < 1503254536 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: no, then the object has a copy of itself from the /previous/ timeline < 1503254541 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is not an exact copy of itself < 1503254550 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503254556 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eventually, if you follow the chain of objects, it'll bottom out because you'll reach a timeline in which the object didn't self-reference < 1503254565 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think not being reasonable is one of the characteristic features of going mad. < 1503254576 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however! you can have an object that tracks the number of nesting levels you want < 1503254590 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and use accessor functions for the nested copies which, if they don't find a nested copy, retroactively increase the number of nesting levels < 1503254592 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that they can give you one < 1503254617 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this allows you to have an object that's observationally indistinguishable from one with an infinite number of nested copies of itself from previous timelines < 1503254651 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you have a logical system to express this in? < 1503254659 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, you can also (probably? as usual, I'm unsure as to the details) do this with Feather interpreters, allowing you to have a Feather interpreter that's written in Feather and which runs using a chain of interpreters that's observationally indistinguishable from infinitely large < 1503254665 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: no < 1503254695 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this gives you really powerful introspection properties, as if you need a new debug feature, you can just retroactively add it to the interpreter and the feature is now there < 1503254769 0 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503254782 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you may have a hard time finding pieces of history to discard though, which is a bit ironic for something that wants to be a light-weight smalltalk < 1503254836 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, "how is it possible to make all of this not incredibly inefficient and getting slower as the program runs" is a major problem < 1503254853 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, I guess it can be lightweight in syntax and language features required to be sufficiently powerful, and yet still almost impossible to run in practice? < 1503254884 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, ...wow, i just got trapped in a logical paradox: If i were to be erased permanantly from the timeline, would i notice? Intersects heavily with the 'where does the brain go after death if anywhere' problem < 1503254891 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :it feels to me like having a formal logic might be a useful stepping stone, though making a self-modifying logic may be no easier I guess < 1503254892 0 :GeekDude!~G33kDude@unaffiliated/g33kdude JOIN :#esoteric < 1503254894 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503254927 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: from my point of view, the time travel mechanics are the /least/ confusing part, I just use the call/cc-based definition < 1503254935 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: eh, fair < 1503254946 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :😎 < 1503254949 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that said, call/cc is fairly confusing as operations go, but once you understand it everything else is fairly straightforward < 1503254957 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :,o0(Call Collect.) < 1503254973 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :0800-333-42 42 here in the Germanies. < 1503254977 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm < 1503254979 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, there's a fairly simple definition in terms of fork(1) and blocking I/O operations that's clearly insane from an efficiency point of view but is very simple to understand) < 1503254982 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe another 42 at the End. < 1503254983 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno. < 1503255000 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1503255005 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :APic: huh, free-to-call phone numbers are 0800 in Germany too? I'm a bit surprised, because that's also the prefix for them in the UK < 1503255019 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: there's a EU norm < 1503255023 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: To dial in the united Kingdom for free, we would need 00800. < 1503255023 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to be 0130 < 1503255027 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: True. < 1503255059 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not sure when that was phased out, 15 or so years ago?) < 1503255078 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cannot… remember… the… Past… < 1503255085 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :,o0(Must not.) < 1503255162 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :End of 2000, lucky guess. < 1503255165 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :the UK is shit < 1503255202 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. < 1503255211 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION does not quite like that they separated from the EU again. < 1503255220 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we haven't yet < 1503255221 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, the UK is shit < 1503255223 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :With their Pounds and Stuff… < 1503255226 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1503255227 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 48% of Brits don't like it either < 1503255231 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Thanks for Telling. < 1503255233 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a very close referendum < 1503255233 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is news to me. < 1503255234 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :🙌 < 1503255238 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/new/New/ < 1503255257 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :welcome to what will soon become corporate hell if Theresa May gets her way (heh, rhyme) < 1503255295 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1503255306 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: Theresa May is only prime minister because nobody else both a) actually wants the job and b) has the support of enough MPs that they wouldn't immediately be removed if they became Prime Minister < 1503255340 0 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :,o0(Mana-Points…) < 1503255341 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wait, what about the Labour party? < 1503255371 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that would be part b)? < 1503255377 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503255381 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: they fail b), there are enough MPs in parties who strongly dislike Labour that they would be able to vote out any Prime Minister from that party < 1503255413 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the fundamental rules of being the prime minister is that you need the confidence of at least half the MPs < 1503255415 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, but none of them trust the Tories anymore < 1503255426 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: most of them /are/ the Tories < 1503255437 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I agree that many Tories don't trust each other < 1503255471 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and let's not forget that DUP thing < 1503255502 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :dup, dup. < 1503255526 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote democrats < 1503255528 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1503255530 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote democratic < 1503255531 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :701) Why does CL get called functional? it's sort of like how you call ancient greece democratic. < 1503255544 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote election < 1503255544 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :529) Hulu's movie selection is like MST3K without the MST3K characters. \ 944) * ais523 challenges the americans here to remember who lost in the most recent UK general election ais523, the lib dems < 1503255581 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends what you mean by lost. < 1503255614 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: that quote is older than the most recent election, i think. < 1503255620 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503255660 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the coalition government was actually the best government we've had for a while IMO < 1503255666 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` doag quotes | grep 'challenges the americans' < 1503255669 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :you seriously think so? < 1503255673 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2267:2013-02-26 addquote * ais523 challenges the americans here to remember who lost in the most recent UK general election ais523, the lib dems < 1503255706 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :tories seem to really like privatization - or at least the tories that currently control the party do < 1503255713 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: they didn't screw a whole load up (and most of what they did was the conservatives backstabbing the lib dems to make them less popular) < 1503255728 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pro-privatization is a standard Conservative position, I think < 1503255784 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :privatization helps to perpetuate the rich-poor divid < 1503255785 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :e < 1503255794 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least what we've seen of it < 1503255848 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( privatization is for when you want to have things run to the ground, not when you want to conserve them ) < 1503255890 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :privatization paves the way for cyberpunk < 1503255891 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, I don't think there's ever been a political party who's name's been accurate for more than a century or so < 1503255994 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the main argument in favour of privitization is that history has shown that the British government is fairly bad at running sections of the economy itself < 1503255997 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 241 < 1503255997 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :241) shit would make great currency, because everyone would have it and you could literally be filthy rich < 1503256016 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote 941 < 1503256016 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :941) I stand by the argument that fungot is the one making the most sense in this channel. < 1503256037 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I wouldn't leave it to for-profit organizations either < 1503256038 0 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.245.222.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION pats fungot < 1503256039 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: so, hey, it was our table! if he's interested, he'll push it back to your side. the salt shaker over to their side, this means that, for all intents and purposes < 1503256053 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION hugs fungot < 1503256053 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: but in a metaphorical sense. what metaphor would that be, exactly? presents dino never coexisted! your interaction could have dire repercussions. it could tear you apart, and the person in a book, and what's more, it's a book about a tugboat that employs superseded scientific theories for locomotion! < 1503256071 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :how does fungot generate malformed lines like that? < 1503256071 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: in this fallacy, t-rex? i am so happy! it's impossible, utahraptor." then, hey presto, you're a muslim! < 1503256080 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit < 1503256097 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` tail -n1 <(cat -n quote) < 1503256098 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat: quote: No such file or directory < 1503256102 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` tail -n1 <(cat -n quotes) < 1503256103 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ 1313 IMO, the best thing to do with wisdom is ignore it < 1503256118 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: fungot's sentences only locally make sense, it basically aims for each stretch of n words (where n would typically be around 3) to make sense individually and has no idea of where the sentence as a whole is going < 1503256118 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: are you you're going trick-or-treating this year, a balloon! the balloon goes up some of the way, we can consider the real question, which is a good thing! stupid problems? that is hilarious right < 1503256132 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503256150 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^style < 1503256150 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Available: agora alice c64 ct darwin discworld enron europarl ff7 fisher fungot homestuck ic irc iwcs jargon lovecraft nethack oots pa qwantz* sms speeches ss wp youtube < 1503256151 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a way to change n? < 1503256166 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :^help < 1503256166 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ ; ^def ; ^show [command]; lang=bf/ul, code=text/str:N; ^str 0-9 get/set/add [text]; ^style [style]; ^bool < 1503256169 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ, that'd be very tricky I imagine < 1503256180 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:: PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are you familiar with how Markov chains are implemented? < 1503256191 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: well the whole model is kind of static; fizzie is tuning the knobs which probably involves picking n. < 1503256212 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503256220 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh.. I forgot aboutt this esolang. (its one i made, and can only be computed by solving the halting problem) < 1503256221 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/HBL < 1503256232 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :models come out of variKN, IIRC: https://github.com/vsiivola/variKN < 1503256318 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had the idea of incorporating floats into brainfuck using some command. < 1503256323 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think n might be slightly variable, too? < 1503256352 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a / command to take the left branch in the surreal number tree? < 1503256506 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do you think mindscrew could do with an additional feature like non-integers? < 1503256553 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea, it's hard to know what features should and shouldn't be in BF derivatives < 1503256579 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, atm mindscrew is a derivative of pbrain with its own procedure tape and procedure pointer < 1503256859 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later < 1503257541 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1503257688 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1503257775 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the idea is that there would be two new commands: / and *. / would take the left branch in the surreal number tree, * the right branch. (if it's at the top, it just adds one). here -> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/49/Surreal_number_tree.svg < 1503257794 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :so +/ results in one half, ++/ results in one and a half, etc. < 1503257818 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :+/* is 3/4, +/*/ would be 5/8 < 1503257820 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have ways to undo that, too? < 1503257827 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :good point < 1503257827 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happens if you do one and undo another < 1503257839 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :there'd probably be one to go up the tree < 1503257842 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bear in mind that the only way to read a value in BF in a way that affects control flow is to bring it back to zero < 1503257848 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you have two downs and one up, then the two downs are equivalent < 1503257884 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :/ to branch left, * to branch right, and ^ to branch up, maybe? < 1503257914 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, what if we used those as the only commands, disregarding + and -? < 1503257921 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : so if you have two downs and one up, then the two downs are equivalent < 1503257934 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a "down"? < 1503257946 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm talking about going the left branch, the right branch, and up < 1503258008 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :having one up operation also means a [^] loop will always set the cell to 0, which is interesting < 1503258012 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :(0 is at the top of the tree) < 1503258037 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :left and right are both opposites of up, thus down < 1503258047 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my point is that / and * are observationally equivalent < 1503258051 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1503258055 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no way to distinguish between them from within the language < 1503258060 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :...ah. < 1503258068 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because the only way to get an [] loop to exit would be to ^ enough to take it back to zero < 1503258081 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hum. < 1503258223 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1503258684 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi Phantom_Hoover. < 1503258690 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :helo < 1503258716 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503258894 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ẙåẘẙ < 1503258895 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+1E99 LATIN SMALL LETTER Y WITH RING ABOVE] [U+00E5 LATIN SMALL LETTER A WITH RING ABOVE] [U+1E98 LATIN SMALL LETTER W WITH RING ABOVE] [U+1E99 LATIN SMALL LETTER Y WITH RING ABOVE] < 1503258961 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1503259444 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1503259654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:1061:fc6d:8307:32a2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503259654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:1061:fc6d:8307:32a2 QUIT :Changing host < 1503259654 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1503259844 0 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-24-8-135-139.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode h̄ů < 1503259844 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0068 LATIN SMALL LETTER H] [U+0304 COMBINING MACRON] [U+016F LATIN SMALL LETTER U WITH RING ABOVE] < 1503259871 0 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oo < 1503260259 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :YaY < 1503261131 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1503261160 0 :TieSoul!~TieSoul@2a02:a448:4a62:1:5502:45fb:bd0d:b9a2 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1503261471 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi imode < 1503262062 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi rdococ. < 1503262444 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I invented editable floating point format. < 1503262518 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is stored by 40-bits, consisting of a unsigned 34-bit integer, a sign bit, and a 5-bit number of decimal places (0=no decimal places but the dot is still included, 1-29=that many decimal places, 30=divide by zero, 31=no decimal places and no dot) < 1503262523 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like this? < 1503262728 0 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Decimal places? < 1503262748 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503262757 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, in decimal < 1503262774 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The integer part is stored in binary though) < 1503262846 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, the intention is that it will be converted to IEEE format when you are doing calculations with it; the editable format is only for editing, and there are multiple ways of representing the same number) < 1503263006 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why does it have a specific option to divide by zero? < 1503263027 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :To represent positive and negative infinity, and NaN. < 1503263045 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right < 1503263083 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might want to change it so that almost all of those patterns are NaN, other than a specific pattern each for +∞ and -∞ < 1503263380 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could, although the way I have it now just seem simpler to convert to IEEE format, since the "number of decimal places" field can index a table of what to divide by. < 1503263537 0 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-56-48.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The sign bit can also be taken together with the number of decimal places field to index such a table, if wanted) < 1503264347 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1503264589 0 :zseri!5e86d9fe@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.134.217.254 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1503264808 0 :augur!~augur@noisebridge130.static.monkeybrains.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503265548 0 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-80-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503265679 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-80-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1503265684 0 :MDead!?@? NICK :MDude < 1503267903 0 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGABRT, dying... < 1503268654 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1503269236 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:6dfa:16bd:df3d:3a4b QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503269280 0 :ATMunn!~ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn26 QUIT :Quit: brb restarting router < 1503269457 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1503269884 0 :ATMunn!~ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn26 JOIN :#esoteric < 1503269943 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1503270447 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503270715 0 :moonythedwarf!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric < 1503270790 0 :moony!~moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1503273314 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric