< 1510704778 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1510704847 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510705907 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1510706136 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1510706513 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1510707694 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510708677 0 :hppavilion[0]!~dosgmowdo@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510708782 0 :hppavilion[0]!~dosgmowdo@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1510708831 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1510710491 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510712491 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510712726 0 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1510715715 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510717717 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1510723101 0 :oerjan!~oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite < 1510727457 0 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-100-233.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510729002 0 :jesusFnatic!~jesusFnat@adsl-108-71-32-142.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510729089 0 :jesusFnatic!~jesusFnat@adsl-108-71-32-142.dsl.lsan03.sbcglobal.net PART #esoteric : < 1510729596 0 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric < 1510730522 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510730574 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510730604 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510730728 0 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero < 1510730872 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510730896 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510730947 0 :fractal_!fractal@unaffiliated/scounder QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1510730998 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510731179 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1510731282 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510731303 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510731308 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510731715 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510732507 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@58-0-174-206.gci.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510732518 0 :hppavilion[1]!~dosgmowdo@58-0-174-206.gci.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510732790 0 :pdxleif!~pdxleif@ec2-54-68-166-10.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1510733125 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1510733179 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510733199 0 :pdxleif!~pdxleif@ec2-54-68-166-10.us-west-2.compute.amazonaws.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1510733990 0 :fractal!fractal@unaffiliated/scounder JOIN :#esoteric < 1510734221 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1510735602 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds < 1510736436 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6IhK6x_gDo < 1510736439 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy how he can interleave two weapons like that < 1510736450 0 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :duel weilding < 1510737224 0 :MrBusiness!~ArcMrBism@mobile-166-172-56-114.mycingular.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510737231 0 :MrBismuth!~ArcMrBism@mobile-166-172-56-114.mycingular.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510738691 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@193.190.253.145 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510739106 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving. < 1510740237 0 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bescrzjcrahdylzw QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1510742486 0 :MrBismuth!~ArcMrBism@mobile-166-172-56-114.mycingular.net QUIT :Quit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIIqYqtR1lY -- Suicide is Painless - Johnny Mandel < 1510742486 0 :MrBusiness!~ArcMrBism@mobile-166-172-56-114.mycingular.net QUIT :Quit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIIqYqtR1lY -- Suicide is Painless - Johnny Mandel < 1510744601 0 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510746557 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT : < 1510746882 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510747641 0 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510747705 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Question. Is there a practical cheap source of something coke bottles, in that it's a liquid container with volume around 0.5 liter or 1 liter that closes airtight even after mechanical stress, but that are different enough from coke bottles that I can put poisonous liquids in them and be sure it won't be mistaken for a drinkable liquid? < 1510747830 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alternately, a practical and cheap way to mark coke bottles somehow for such a purpose, such that the marking is durable to mechanical stress and washing with water and soap and alcohol and rubbing (but not necessarily to washing with petrol or other solvents)? < 1510748242 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The existance of such a thing might be a logical impossibility, because such a container would automatically be a practical way for storing drinks, and so would actually be used for storing drinks, and so can be confused with drinks. < 1510748250 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: i think you are required to add smelly/bitter components to poisons to avoid accidental consumption < 1510748309 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: yes, that's a possible solution too, but in that case, is there some practical and cheap bitter component that I can add at home? < 1510748316 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: and there are thousands of bottle types, just check what productions you have local (i do have some bottles like milk bottles production nearby) < 1510748396 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: naoh even in low concentration is very unpleasant to taste, but check what is added usually < 1510748431 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: why do you have so much poison and what are you doing with it < 1510748437 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: there are lots of bottle types, but many aren't sold empty (I am actually buying cheap bottled water to get PET bottles for example) and ones that are sold with soap or milk are practically impossible to clean the original contents off them. < 1510748443 0 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1510748473 0 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: you might be able to find the bottle manufacturer < 1510748488 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1510748489 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: check manufacturers who do sell them empty for business, order a pallet of bottles, might be cheaper even if you wont use every bottle < 1510748498 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: household cleaning agents, which I want to package to a more durable or smaller container for traveling < 1510748542 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :cleaning agents i did see are nasty in smell already < 1510748594 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: natrium hydroxide? seriously? I mean, that one is more scary than almost all the things I have at my house already. I don't know what it's like in small quantity though. < 1510748602 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do they seriously use natrium hydroxide for this? < 1510748711 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: as liquid cleaning agents? I guess not < 1510748741 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdvv6lcpljuq7d.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1510748745 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at least it definitely makes ingestion almost impossible, hehe =) < 1510748763 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: some cleaning agents are nasty in smell, but some aren't. examples are (a) dishwasher rinse aid, which doesn't have a specific smell, and also is as viscous as water, (b) isopropanol, which seems to be cheaper to buy in laboratory clean version than as a mixture cleaning product. < 1510748779 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what dishwasher rinse aid tastes like, it might already be bitter. < 1510748789 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm also not sure it's poisonous < 1510748800 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I still don't want to get it mixed with a drink < 1510748813 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did taste the isopropanol and it was the worst thing ever. But i guess it already had some stuff added in it for a bad taste < 1510748835 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: yes, there are denatured versions with bitter additives, but the pure one doesn't taste too bad < 1510748844 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I think it doesn't, I'm not willing to try < 1510748900 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heck, even if the thing isn't poisonous, I'd like a nice durable way to label bottles to distinguish between different similar liquids. < 1510748933 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use sticky paper for that, but for some things like soap bottles I use in a shower that doesn't work, the label peels off quickly < 1510748938 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :stuff that is used in pepper spray can be bought as a powder, and if person isnt mexican or indian, he wont be able to tolerant this < 1510748971 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :but proper stuff thst is used works in very small concentration, so is cheaper (because you need just a droplet) < 1510748980 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can use permanent marker on bottles, but for isopropanol in particular that won't work, because isopropanol solves the permanent marker ink, and even without that it sometimes smudges on some bottle surfaces. < 1510749037 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pepper spray powder? Does that leave a residue? Some of the bitter additives for alcohol-based cleaners live a solid residue, which is very annoying and sometimes defeats the whole purpose of using an alcohol-based cleaner. < 1510749052 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1510749087 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus, I think pepper spray powder might irritate the skin more than an alcohol-based disinfectant. < 1510749122 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can dilute it more < 1510749150 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :it irritates the skin only in defence-grade concentration (10% mass) < 1510749214 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :about 1% by mass is what some of the peppers are, but most people cant tolerate that. And 0.1% by mass is what some cultures may tolerate, so probably too few < 1510749267 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: hmm... still doesn't seem like a good idea if I want to use the isopropanol as a disinfectant, but can work if I only use it for whiteboard cleaning. would it leave a residue on the whiteboard? < 1510749302 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or a residue on the cleaning rag, if I use reusable textile for that? < 1510749342 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, 1% is quite a lot of residuals < 1510749364 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :and its a sugar-like component, so it might be sticky < 1510749445 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you want residual-free then you either need very low concentration (professional stuff), or quickly evaporating stuff (like acetone) - but acetone-like stuff will leave the mixture with time and it wont be so unpleasant to taste < 1510749474 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually this has turned to a specific other sub-question that I could ask on a forum: what cheap practical additive I could put in isopropanol (between 50% to 90%) that makes it have a bad taste but I can still use it as skin disinfectant, cleaning glasses, help drying bottles after washing, or cleaning whiteboard. < 1510749502 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It mustn't leave a residue after evaporating, and mustn't irritate the skin or even open wounds more than the isopropanol itself does. < 1510749521 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cleaning glasses would need no residuals at all, even 0.1% or so will be noticed i think < 1510749541 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Acetone... hmm, that might work, because it's definitely cheap and evaporates well. Is that bad tasting? < 1510749558 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh. "wont be so unpleasant to taste". < 1510749566 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Its not that bad in taste but it is so dense in smell that its hard to breath < 1510749576 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: exactly, and helping bottles dry also requires no residude. < 1510749576 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:e494:d8c3:b25a:89d2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510749596 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :and people tend not to drink stuff that is so unpleasant to breathe < 1510749615 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if by "leaving the mixture in time" only means it evaporates quickly, that's fine for isopropanol, because that also evaporates quickly < 1510749644 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, i remembered now, for methanol government used kerosene and gasoline < 1510749665 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"and people tend not to drink stuff that is so unpleasant to breathe" => I dunno. I keep hearing of accidents about people drinking liquors (esp. pálinka) from a mineral water bottle accidentally, when they consume a large amount before realizing it's not water. < 1510749667 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :kerosene is a bit slow to evaporate. But gasoline is a bit faster < 1510749690 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :gasoline doesn't have a bad smell or bad taste in small amounts I think < 1510749700 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can add more < 1510749715 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :its very bitter and has distinguishable smell < 1510749725 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in ~10% concentration < 1510749740 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :and leaves no residuals, evaporates a bit faster than isopropanol < 1510749749 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is about as irritating as isopropanol < 1510749751 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm... interesting. although then it might solve things I don't want to solve when used for cleaning, although for the specific examples I gave that's not a problem < 1510749811 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can simply buy denaturated methanol and add some % of it, hoping that concentration of denaturat is enough < 1510749879 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :substances like aromatic oils, especially cheap ones are often disgusting , btw =) can biy those too. But their smell is way too strong < 1510749889 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, that reminds me, what's the price and composition of these denatured alcohol mixtures sold as coolant for cars? < 1510749897 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could that be usable as a cleaning agent as is? < 1510749907 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or does that have methanol? < 1510749933 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think its ethylene glycole + proper denaturat < 1510749962 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :ethylene glycole by itself is similar to isopropyl , but isn't as good < 1510750002 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm. is it watered up much? < 1510750003 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Price is about the same as gasoline, may be even cheaper < 1510750009 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :about half water < 1510750026 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might work if I mix it with the isopropanol. < 1510750050 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to look this up. < 1510750061 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :not by the ethylene glycol though. You will be just using that small fraction of proper densturat < 1510750084 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case you can just buy proper denaturat. Will be cheaper < 1510750114 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I can mix a large enough amount in the isopropanol, like 25% of car coolant with 75% isopropanol. < 1510750124 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where do I buy the denaturant? < 1510750144 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could ask in the chemical agent store or the pharmacy or something. < 1510750146 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ebay? they sell almost everything < 1510750173 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :They sell almost everything but won't ship fire hazard liquids, which some of these are. < 1510750195 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :They certainly shouldn't ship isopropanol or gasolene in mail. < 1510750211 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's why this sort of stuff is hard to get in first place. < 1510750228 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't just order cheap denatured isopropanol from China. < 1510750339 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pyridine is used in densturated alcohol < 1510750452 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pyridine? < 1510750553 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :And aniline < 1510750591 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Both of them smell fishy, which might be a bad idea for cleaning agent < 1510750640 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, for labeling bottles, I wonder about these sticky strips that are printed with a handhelp heat printer they sell for cheap but with expensive tapes, like Dymo. I hear they stick well. I wonder if they'd still well enough to a coke bottle. < 1510750671 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdvv6lcpljuq7d.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510750689 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: I think the point is that the alcohol or bleach based cleaning agent can smell bad, if that smell evaporates about as quickly as the alcohol or bleach itself. < 1510750702 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitterant - 5 more things (not as smelly, but bitter) < 1510750727 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you will leave the cleaning agent to just evaporate in those cases, and while it's not evaporated, the smell should be there as a warning. < 1510750765 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of like for the bad smelling agent for city methane gas. < 1510750803 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So a bad smell is a good idea for these even if you don't try to drink them. < 1510750865 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of the above dont evaporate (leave residuals) < 1510750880 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: the above what? the bitterants? < 1510750888 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pyridine and aniline? < 1510750902 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :No,those two do evaporate. The 5 of bitter agents < 1510750943 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1510750961 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess for a car coolant liquid that is not a problem < 1510750980 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they are bitter in 0.08ppm. Layer will be invisible even on glasses < 1510751071 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :layer is invisible if its thinner than 100nm or so. For 1ppm this allow to evaporate 100mm of liquid (usual evaporation thickness is 100um or so). so up to 100ppm is safe (can't be seen even on glasses) < 1510751130 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is still can change the feel when you touch it and increase the speed of dust accumulation, but people wont notice it < 1510751181 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, that's an idea. I could use bleach bottles! They're already used for poisonous stuff, and the bleach is easier to clean from them than soap or oily stuff from their bottles, I already buy bottles of bleach for cleaning, and some of them are durable enough. < 1510751211 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510751235 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you need more than 100 bottles - call people who actually do the bleach bottles and buy a pallet of them =) < 1510751255 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lighter fluid bottles might be even better, but I don't generally buy lighter fluid so I'd have to buy them normally. < 1510751265 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/normally/specfically/ < 1510751310 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not a perfect solution, but marking a bleach bottle might be better than marking a coke bottle. < 1510751336 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if anywhere's selling cheap bleach in half-liter bottles instead of one liter bottles. < 1510751353 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But even a one litter bottle is fine. < 1510751388 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there's these ugly gray square-shaped bleach bottles that nobody will confuse with drink bottles. < 1510751408 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have to mark them so people don't confuse them with bleach, but it's better. < 1510751413 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kids are stupid enough to drink it anyways < 1510751459 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1510751478 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but kids will also try to eat the dishwasher tablets and stuff like that. It's a much harder problem to kid-proof things. < 1510751491 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :My apartment is not small-kid-proof. < 1510751511 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thats why detergents are added =) to make it kid proof < 1510751591 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And note that some bleach bottles have these safety caps, the ones that are supposedly kid-proof, although I don't think they really prove difficulty for a kid, that open if you press down or press on the side or something. < 1510751607 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not all bleach bottles have these though. < 1510751617 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :Its hard to open those though < 1510751621 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(My vitamin bottles have such caps too.) < 1510751626 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean physically, kids might not be strong enough < 1510751643 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :or smart enough to figure out where to press < 1510751663 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the strongest and smartest kids only will die ^=^ < 1510751664 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :garit: I can do that with a coke bottle too. If I screw the cap hard enough, then my mother can't open it. < 1510751684 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But doing that could make the bottle less durable, so I try not to. < 1510751759 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It makes sense for the vitamin bottle, it's not easy to overdose those vitamins, but a kid eating the whole bottle of 100 pills would be a bad idea.) < 1510751888 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, note to self, re-ask these questions when ais523 arrives. < 1510752188 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510753089 0 :HW_!0eae4a9b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.14.174.74.155 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510753349 0 :HW_!0eae4a9b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.14.174.74.155 QUIT :Client Quit < 1510754112 0 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@icon-thinkpad.wireless.rit.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1510754262 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1510756993 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1510757101 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510757827 0 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@icon-thinkpad.wireless.rit.edu QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1510759872 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510761867 0 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:e494:d8c3:b25a:89d2 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1510762014 0 :david3x3x3!3425a618@gateway/web/freenode/ip.52.37.166.24 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1510763927 0 :david3x3x3!3425a618@gateway/web/freenode/ip.52.37.166.24 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510764902 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdvv6lcpljuq7d.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1510765881 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, in fact I could use bottles of rinse aid. That's probably easy enough to clean, and they come in small bottles. < 1510765895 0 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I wanted to ask you something, but I have to afk now for like three hours, so I can't. < 1510765924 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, ask me later then < 1510766719 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@5.196.225.175 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510768608 0 :garit2!~garit@188.28.38.231.threembb.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1510768608 0 :garit2!~garit@188.28.38.231.threembb.co.uk QUIT :Changing host < 1510768608 0 :garit2!~garit@unaffiliated/garit JOIN :#esoteric < 1510768747 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1510769421 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1510769474 0 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric < 1510769660 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:1061:fc6d:8307:32a2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510769660 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:1061:fc6d:8307:32a2 QUIT :Changing host < 1510769660 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1510770000 0 :sleffy!~sleffy@c-24-7-67-0.hsd1.ca.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510770251 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510770394 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1510770860 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@5.196.225.175 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510771713 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510772232 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1510772576 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1510772588 0 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510772635 0 :atslash!~atslash@broadband-46-188-0-82.2com.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1510773081 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510773246 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510773505 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1510773711 0 :augur!~augur@192.195.83.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510773776 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510774548 0 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Excess Flood < 1510774572 0 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric < 1510775604 0 :`^_^v!~nycs@gw.hq.meetup.com QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1510775632 0 :jaboja!~jaboja@jaboja.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1510776077 0 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@129.21.122.210 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510776236 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07FISHQ9+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=53364&oldid=46742 5* 03Zseri 5* (-148) 10improve c code < 1510777783 0 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yqagqxhrgdtwahim JOIN :#esoteric < 1510777937 0 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGABRT, dying... < 1510778524 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510778583 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510778697 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, so I think the best solution so far for isopropanol is this. Rinse with water then dry an empty bottle of dishwasher rinse aid. Mark it as "FIRE HAZARD POISON" with colored nail polish, as well as put a more detailed (but easier to peel) sticky paper label written with pen, and possibly also a strip of colored PVC insulation tape around the bot < 1510778697 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tle. < 1510778713 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you're still here? good. here's my question < 1510778725 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not "still", I just rejoined < 1510778773 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, ask your question < 1510778818 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to take say 0.2 liters of isopropanol to my office for cleaning whiteboards. What is the right container for this? It should be watertight, should clearly not look as something that can be drunk safely, these properties should be durable to mechanical stress and cleaning the exterior with soap water and rubbing with a sponge, < 1510778842 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not an expert on isopropanol < 1510778842 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and should also be durable to the isopropanol itself (which is why writing with a sharpie isn't an option). < 1510778851 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd be better off asking someone who knows about it < 1510778876 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like a pharmacist? I should probably do that. < 1510778908 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, the easier solution might be to buy a dedicated whiteboard cleaner spray; although the ones I'm aware of tend to damage whiteboards in such a way that you can't remove ink from them without the spray, presumably to persuade you to buy more spray < 1510778933 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eww < 1510778979 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it so hard to clean your whiteboards, anyway? with a good whiteboard and whiteboard pen, pressure is enough, and in extreme cases water < 1510778981 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually the easier solution would be to buy denatured alcohol, which is much less poisonous, and so can be put to an ordinary coke bottle. < 1510778997 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn't recommend cleaning the whiteboard with poison < 1510779038 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's easy to clean if you clean it immediately, but hard to clean if you leave the marks on for weeks, and in any case, cleaning leaves a lot of residue that becomes ugly after a while. < 1510779069 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is cleaning it with poison a bad idea? < 1510779082 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it puts poison on a surface that people might plausibly touch by mistake < 1510779093 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll presumably evaporate readily < 1510779093 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah. http://www.peachridgeglass.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/3SkullsAprill.jpg < 1510779110 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: then you have poison in the air < 1510779135 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, so you should make sure it's well ventilated < 1510779135 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Touching is safe. Isopropanol is like bleach, it evaporates quickly and is safe after that. I clean my floor with bleach, and if you open the windows and wait for an hour that's also safe. < 1510779144 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1510779155 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :PH: yes, open the window to let the fumes leave. < 1510779173 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :'poison on surfaces is bad' just sounds like... ais logic < 1510779176 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.cleanyourcar.co.uk/polishing-accessories/polish-inspection-sprays/isopropanol-alcohol-ipa-500ml/prod_818.html <-- serious version < 1510779178 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd say that you would at least need the container to carry the standardised warning symbols for poisonous chemicals < 1510779207 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(out of stock, but those orange warning labels look serious) < 1510779211 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob how did you even get the isopropanol < 1510779214 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :what did it come in < 1510779236 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :PH: In a one little sized bottle. I don't want to take all of it to the office. < 1510779241 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/one little/one liter/ < 1510779243 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I bought it < 1510779376 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the standardized warning symbol is a good idea. that's a red diamond frame with some incomprehensible black drawing inside it. < 1510779437 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just feel really uncomfortable discussing this sort of subject at all < 1510779443 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, hmm < 1510779446 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :give me a moment < 1510779610 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: should I ask about repainting the wooden window frames with the kind of paint that requires these much more poisonous aromatic solvents first, to make this sound safer in comparison? < 1510779670 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I happen to know a chemistry teacher, I was asking her for advice on the subject < 1510779686 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that's why I went AFK) < 1510779708 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren't you a chemistry geek yourself? < 1510779731 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :she says that she hasn't seen anyone try to use isopropanol outside the lab (and wouldn't use it in experiments), but uses acetone plus an air drier for cleaning chemicals off lab equipment, and very occasionally on whiteboards too < 1510779734 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it has similar properties < 1510779758 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :she says you mustn't let anyone drink or inhale the isopropanol < 1510779787 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably you have to store it somewhere that only you have access to in order to avoid it being used inappropriately by other people < 1510779795 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still pretty concerned about the whole subject though < 1510779994 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mustn't let anyone drink or inhale => yes, it's poisonuos < 1510780007 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[wiki] 14[[07Esolang talk:Funding14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=53365&oldid=53361 5* 03Rottytooth 5* (+586) 10suggestions about funding < 1510780038 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't acetone worse? I can buy acetone if it works on whiteboards, but I thought it was worse, because it's similarly a fire hazard even in vapor form, it's poisonous to ingest, and solves more things than isopropanol < 1510780041 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isopropyl_alcohol#Toxicology ... I can imagine worse poisons. Also "Rubbing alcohol, hand sanitizer, and disinfecting pads typically contain a 60–70% solution of isopropyl alcohol in water." (dilution affects toxicity but will happen anyway *if* you ingest the stuff.) < 1510780051 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :acetone is what you get if you ingest it < 1510780127 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: isopropanol metabolises to acetone, so they're similarly poisonous < 1510780164 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but I thought acetone was a more powerful solvent for household stuff, I could be wrong in that < 1510780221 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, the reason she uses acetone is I think precisely because its a powerful solvent, she's trying to clean substantially more dangerous chemicals off glass < 1510780228 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most of them disolve in either water or acetone < 1510780231 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :denatured ethanol might be better, because it's less poisonous, but has similar properties as a solvent, as in works for whiteboard cleaning, and is similar fire hazard < 1510780251 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've used ethanol to clean permanent marker off glass myself < 1510780273 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess it's in the category of chemicals I'm not afraid of < 1510780296 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, ethanol works for that, it even lets you clean permanent marker from more rough surfaces by rubbing (it's easier to clean from glass) < 1510780504 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'm really not an expert at this sort of thing; I think I have an A-level in chemistry but didn't score amazingly well at it < 1510780520 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, thanks for the help anyway. < 1510780576 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll try to look up where I can get cheap and already denatured hand disinfectants based on alcohol or isopropanol, but so far I've found they're generally sold pretty expensive in most places. < 1510780599 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those would work as whiteboard cleaner and similar too. < 1510780628 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But even then I want to figure out this bottle thing. < 1510780749 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think storing it in a locked cabinet where only you have the key, + written warnings, + the standardised warning pictographs < 1510780817 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a locked cabinet might just about be possible, but a locked cabinet for which only I have the key sounds unrealistic for the office (this isn't at home) < 1510780839 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :written warnings are definitely what I want, but I'm asking how I can make them durable on the bottle < 1510780870 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, in my office everyone has a cabinet to which only they have the key < 1510780879 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how could you possibly keep private records and the like without that? < 1510780901 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In theory I could take in a small metal casette for which only I have the key or something, but that's a bit expensive. < 1510780962 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also a bottle whose entire purpose is to contain a chemical that cleans ink off surfaces is unlikely to be able to write warnings on < 1510780970 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they'd have too much of a chance of being rubbed off by the same chemical < 1510780980 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wait, really? Isn't only one person having the key usually impractical? Most keys have copies at different people because anyone might lose keys by accident or pickpocketing or robbing? < 1510781005 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even then, most workers at our office don't have separate lockers for which only few people have a key. < 1510781013 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: oh, there are master keys I think < 1510781017 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they'd be unlikely to be used < 1510781028 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you're the only person who has a key intended for genreal use < 1510781043 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :We have expensive equipment in lockers for which only few people have the key, plus we have the system administrators' room for which I think only the three sysadmins have the key, or perhaps one more person. < 1510781058 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also the server room for which similarly only the sysadmins have the kye. < 1510781086 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I definitely don't have such a lockable closet at work, and most other co-workers don't have one either. < 1510781113 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use mine for storing my laptop in sometimes when I go out to eat, that sort of thing < 1510781120 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't store poisonous chemicals in mine) < 1510781147 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have my own desk and unlocked boxes labeled with my names where other people are unlikely to touch my belongings, and there's some personal things like my home keys that I always keep on my person at work. < 1510781204 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, we have something of a theft problem in our department < 1510781237 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, we have things stolen too, but it's mostly valuable things. My less valuable personal belongings are less likely to be stolen, and even if they are, they're cheap to replace. < 1510781256 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I wouldn't leave valuable equipment out in the open. < 1510781259 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at one point someone set off the fire alarm then started stealing things while people were evacuated, but they got caught fairly quickly because they had to use a swipe card to get through some of the doors < 1510781326 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's scary. Is that a crime even if not actually stealing anything, only intending to steal? In any case, it's a pretty bad idea. < 1510781361 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think anybody does that here. They just walk in open doors when nobody pays attention and remove things acting as if they have authority in case anyone watches. < 1510781363 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it's technically illegal? it's a firable offence though < 1510781395 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not a lawyer. < 1510781417 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :interestingly, in the UK I think (not sure, not a lawyer) it's legal to take something you don't own as long as the owner doesn't need it at the time and you give it back undamaged; at least, I know it isn't theft, it might violate some other law though < 1510781471 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's definitely not the case here. We've had things disappear, not just used for a bit and returned. < 1510781483 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of it might be accidental loss, but we believe some of it is deliberate theft. < 1510781508 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want to give any ideas, but the security is really terrible here, so it's easy to steal stuff. < 1510781568 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except for the stuff that is stored in the rooms that only few people have keys for and aren't left open. We have a large storage room for valuables like that, plus the server room and sysadmin's room which are even safer. < 1510781997 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meanwhile, M:tG is previewing the third un-set. < 1510782137 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1510782179 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a pity they're releasing it just a year after the second Conspiracy set, because some of the conspiracy cards in that feel like un-cards. < 1510782179 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :incidentally, it's added a new card for the "allow people to deduce the game rules purely by reading cards" deck < 1510782182 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Un sets are good for that < 1510782201 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. the card that reverses the order of phases lists them all in its reminder text < 1510782263 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, you mean a deck that lets a future person reconstruct the rules if they don't have access to the comp rules or similar, but only to a deck of cards preserved in a durable photo or something. < 1510782301 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought at first of a deck based on R&D's Secret Lair < 1510782382 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :As for cards for the deck you mean, I've been asking for a Sea's Claim with reminder text. < 1510782400 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although I must admit that I like the mountaintop boatmaker. < 1510782420 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Decimation Clock < 1510782422 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1510782422 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So maybe a Spreading Seas with reminder text instead. < 1510782428 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card_by_name Decimation Clock < 1510782429 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/home/hackbot/hackbot.hg/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: card_by_name: not found < 1510782435 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's it called < 1510782447 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name spreading seas < 1510782448 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Spreading Seas \ 1U \ Enchantment -- Aura \ Enchant land \ When Spreading Seas enters the battlefield, draw a card. \ Enchanted land is an Island. \ ZEN-C < 1510782450 0 :Cale_!~cale@192.190.0.144 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510782551 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :cute. < 1510782575 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Decimator Web < 1510782576 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Decimator Web \ 4 \ Artifact \ {4}, {T}: Target opponent loses 2 life, gets a poison counter, then puts the top six cards of his or her library into his or her graveyard. \ MBS-R < 1510782581 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go, that's the core of the deck < 1510782619 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, nice! < 1510782629 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tells about the sixty cards < 1510782636 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 10 poison, and 20 life < 1510782637 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :decimator < 1510782668 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name lich's mirror < 1510782668 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but the 10 poison is easy, it's mentioned in a lot of reminder text, and the 20 life can be guessed from some other cards < 1510782669 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lich's Mirror \ 5 \ Artifact \ If you would lose the game, instead shuffle your hand, your graveyard, and all permanents you own into your library, then draw seven cards and your life total becomes 20. \ ALA-M < 1510782674 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then that gives you the 7 cards < 1510782689 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(once you've established that life totals start at 20 it's clear that it's restarting the game) < 1510782713 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow that card has a lot of rulings < 1510783131 0 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@129.21.122.210 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510783150 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: for the 20 starting life, Rebirth might be the best. 7 cards is trickier, Contract from Below (together with Rebirth) or Backup Plan could help, or if you have thousands of cards, you might notice that several refer to drawing seven cards, but none refer to six or more than seven. < 1510783188 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Enter the Infinite normally draws more than seven :-P < 1510783217 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1510783221 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maximum hand size is a hard rule to convey; you can use something like Spellbook to imply that there is a maximum, but not what it is < 1510783300 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And there are some cards like "Once with Feeling" that are specifically confusing if you're reconstructing rules this way. < 1510783312 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: for establishing that there is a maximum, Day's Undoing might be the best < 1510783329 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or Glorious End, that's even cleaner < 1510783350 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name glorious end < 1510783351 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Glorious End \ 2R \ Instant \ End the turn. (Exile all spells and abilities on the stack, including this card. The player whose turn it is discards down to his or her maximum hand size. Damage wears off, and "this turn" and "until end of turn" effects end.) \ At the beginning of your next end step, you lose the game. \ AKH-M < 1510783361 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's very clean < 1510783370 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also explains the cleanup step < 1510783370 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Time Stop < 1510783371 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time Stop \ 4UU \ Instant \ End the turn. (Exile all spells and abilities on the stack, including this card. The player whose turn it is discards down to his or her maximum hand size. Damage wears off, and "this turn" and "until end of turn" effects end.) \ CHK-R, 10E-R < 1510783371 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even better < 1510783388 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But some rules, like the combat rules, are really hard to explain on cards. < 1510783404 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And good luck trying to explain banding. There's reminder text for it, but it's never printed, and probably never will be,. < 1510783414 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name benalish hero < 1510783415 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Benalish Hero \ W \ Creature -- Human Soldier \ 1/1 \ Banding (Any creatures with banding, and up to one without, can attack in a band. Bands are blocked as a group. If any creatures with banding you control are blocking or being blocked by a creature, you divide that creature's combat damage, not its controller, among any of the creatures it's bei < 1510783427 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, it doesn't even fit on one line of IRC < 1510783452 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I know how banding works but agree that it's complex; it was less complex back in the damage-on-the-stack days, which oddly postdate banding disappearing) < 1510783460 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even without banding, the rules of combat are hard to guess. < 1510783479 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, Glorious End should also have many rulings < 1510783480 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But seriously, there are a lot of cards that do something like discard all cards and draw seven cards. < 1510783486 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name master warcraft < 1510783487 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Master Warcraft \ 2(r/w)(r/w) \ Instant \ Cast Master Warcraft only before attackers are declared. \ You choose which creatures attack this turn. \ You choose which creatures block this turn and how those creatures block. \ RAV-R, CMD-R, CMA-R < 1510783489 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That probably lets you figure out that the starting hand size is around seven. < 1510783497 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :only 5, disappointing. < 1510783497 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the best one I know < 1510783501 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for explaining combat rules < 1510783503 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's not complete < 1510783520 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might not let you figure out that every player draws every turn except for the first player in two-player games (we house-rule that because it's stupid). < 1510783539 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: it's an attempt to reduce the first player advantage, it's not enough though < 1510783548 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :first player nearly always has the advantage except in some veryr weird matchups < 1510783563 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(some control mirrors have a second player advantage, as do most matches involving Manaless Dredge) < 1510783595 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: no, that's fine. the bad part is that in multiplayer games, the first player also draws. we believe that's a bad rule and so in our 2 vs 2 multiplayer games, the first player doesn't draw, and the players of a team sit opposite of each other. < 1510783631 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right, multiplayer < 1510783649 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :M:tG would possibly benefit from Hearthstone's attempt to nullify the first player advantage < 1510783664 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Time Reversal < 1510783665 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Time Reversal \ 3UU \ Sorcery \ Each player shuffles his or her hand and graveyard into his or her library, then draws seven cards. Exile Time Reversal. \ M11-M, M12-M < 1510783680 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not only does the first player skip their first draw step, the other player starts with an instant that's effectively "{0}: add {1} to your mana pool") < 1510783692 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, a free gold for the second player < 1510783698 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, an instant, not a permanent? ok < 1510783701 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, sorcery, not instant, but hearthstone doesn't have instants < 1510783709 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was a permanent you sacrifice < 1510783720 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, cast from hand and goes to graveyard < 1510783725 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok. < 1510783757 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That might be even better, or worse, depending on the meta. < 1510783789 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1510783799 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be great in storm (and IIRC works in storm-like combos in Hearthstone) < 1510783819 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :What storm? M:tG-like storm? < 1510783820 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: oh you can use that on any turn you wish? < 1510783846 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: right < 1510783847 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: yes < 1510783855 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: only once per game usually < 1510783866 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hearthstone doesn't have an exact equivalent of M:tG storm but it does have things that care about you having played spells already < 1510783868 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kind-of like Surge, actually < 1510783884 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1510783887 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: yeah but not restricted to the first turn, which is what I initially thought < 1510783899 0 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and that would be far less useful) < 1510783928 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does it have spells that make your opponent discard a card, or spells that let you choose a card from opponent's revealed hand to discard? < 1510783939 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: probably < 1510783942 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not an expert < 1510783962 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those don't violate any of the rules I'm aware of for what hearthstone cards can do and they're fairly obvious effects < 1510783979 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the former would probably be random, due to the way that hearthstone's turn timers work < 1510784103 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :random discard exists in M:tG too, but is less convenient < 1510784143 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name hymn to tourach < 1510784144 0 :HackEgo!~HackEgo@162.248.166.242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hymn to Tourach \ BB \ Sorcery \ Target player discards two cards at random. \ FE-C, EMA-U, VMA-U, MED-U, V13-M < 1510784167 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's a good one power-wise < 1510784201 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :heck, discard at random is more common than I thought. probably because it's common on red cards, which I notice less. < 1510784213 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm searching for it now) < 1510784226 0 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: on red cards it mostly affects the user, though, doesn't it? < 1510784235 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1510784873 0 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdvv6lcpljuq7d.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510785710 0 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510785818 0 :wob_jonas!b03f18b8@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.184 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client < 1510786383 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit JOIN :#esoteric < 1510786467 0 :garit2!~garit@unaffiliated/garit QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1510786704 0 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@129.21.122.210 JOIN :#esoteric < 1510787073 0 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@129.21.122.210 QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1510787628 0 :garit2!~garit@unaffiliated/garit JOIN :#esoteric < 1510787743 0 :garit!~garit@unaffiliated/garit QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1510788383 0 :Cale_!~cale@192.190.0.144 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1510788789 0 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1510789800 0 :david3x3x3!3425a618@gateway/web/freenode/ip.52.37.166.24 PART #esoteric : < 1510790277 0 :watered!~water@2405:204:54a9:4e22:42f7:a1c8:b1d5:9a49 JOIN :#esoteric