for multiline
< 1528154910 388308 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I knew it exists but I never actually tried to use it
< 1528154927 552046 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can also use leading whitespace for multiline code blocks, although that'll do more parsing of the inside (and 
 will do less)
< 1528155125 169513 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't like indenting code
< 1528155131 891939 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :indented*
< 1528155293 634948 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait.. what?!?
< 1528155297 753159 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just examined brainfucks code.
< 1528155302 828813 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :| style="text-align:center"| +
< 1528155312 844636 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :for it's centering magic
< 1528155345 452057 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Tables
< 1528155420 303786 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh? you can do lists then sections using |+
< 1528155423 46911 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know.
< 1528155712 889693 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection
< 1528155731 373920 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528155796 988278 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :policy said "be bold"
< 1528155823 903252 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :says*
< 1528155839 426447 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :many people are scared to edit pages
< 1528155844 793772 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yah
< 1528155852 589237 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in general you don't have to ask for permission to make an edit (just to make it again if someone disagrees with you :-P)
< 1528155858 115316 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially if they know it prints to irc
< 1528155873 864451 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :then there like omg this is not what the person did, there goign to be mad if I do this, aaaah i'll just leave.
< 1528155878 494047 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the flip side of that is that bad edits will go through by default so we want people to notice and fix them
< 1528155900 296995 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so can I take something like commands and put it in a table?
< 1528155947 962205 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
> 1528156001 380197 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Lennyfuck14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55528 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+35) 10Made redirect to lenny fuck that you can actually type without the usage of the ctrl+c and ctrl+v brothers.
< 1528156025 13770 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language is small but what the heck
> 1528156051 161180 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07(   )fuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55529&oldid=50933 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+293) 10Reformatted the instructions
< 1528156056 505936 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok yah I feel weird doing that.
< 1528156110 621660 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh brainfuck-3 is a funge-memory
< 1528156117 279303 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :has*
< 1528156148 443527 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the constants of the wiki is that it has a very large number of BF derivatives, most of which are too similar to each other
< 1528156167 314512 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only really need one or two languages of a similar nature
< 1528156174 466905 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like either get the one who made the same idea but newer to get rid of it
< 1528156177 558511 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just merge them together
< 1528156180 204493 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and say they both own it
< 1528156180 968939 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1528156191 333224 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable NICK :constant
< 1528156232 764663 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the problem is that BF derivatives are too easy to write
< 1528156236 425588 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't take any real thought to make one
< 1528156259 427170 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and alot of them probably dont answer basic questions
< 1528156264 88021 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :here we go: BF except the - command multiplies the cell's value by -2 instead of decrementing it
< 1528156265 910153 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like weather input is blocking or up to the interpreter
< 1528156271 899354 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The good ones take thought to make.
< 1528156272 619657 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like i feel like it should be explicit
< 1528156278 815780 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's more interesting than over half of BF derivatives already :-P
< 1528156288 338625 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what
< 1528156296 396864 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I made it in about 10 seconds
< 1528156312 636711 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh crap...
< 1528156313 98886 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Consequential
< 1528156318 991143 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what happened to half the instructions?
< 1528156325 981937 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they got deleted by mistake, AFIACT
< 1528156330 44517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can look in the page history to see the old version
< 1528156336 223186 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't put them back because I wasn't sure what to do with it
< 1528156364 645043 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :last edit shows no remove
< 1528156371 573928 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then mediawiki kah-poof's and its gone
< 1528156393 229770 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Consequential&diff=55482&oldid=55477
< 1528156406 481674 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like it was your edit that deleted them by mistake? the last six lines weren't copied over
< 1528156419 582546 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm...
< 1528156430 174324 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok i'll fix that
< 1528156435 37477 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an easy mistake to make, though, and we store all the old versions to make this sort of thing easily fixable
< 1528156436 392331 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll just ping the ownher for what they were suppose to do
< 1528156438 427807 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and rewrite it
< 1528156467 517451 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was merging the brainfuck and "extra action"
< 1528156478 345931 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that it was "strict" or "To the point" as to what it did.
< 1528156498 600683 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : however each command does something unwanted.
< 1528156521 142819 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I predicate about 67 different versions that do something unwanted
< 1528156528 648035 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :clones*
< 1528156549 636520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consequential is interesting as BF derivatives go
< 1528156561 618422 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you basically have eight instructions that are different from BF's
< 1528156574 749562 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trick with writing the langauge is to look at the instruction as a whole, not the "base" instruction from BF
< 1528156586 178106 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you might be able to use the consequences for good, with the "main" purpose of the command being a drawback!
< 1528156664 693674 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :using 6 cells you can just run plain old brainfuck
< 1528156674 323489 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :with translation :P
< 1528156685 621453 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok apperently i'm dumb and i don't need to ask him
< 1528156688 379600 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure? that seems like the sort of construction that's often possible but I didn't see an obvious way
< 1528156696 418808 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's litterly just brainfuck + extra action
< 1528156708 123152 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :its like ><- or something to do a +
< 1528156852 774540 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway he's on the unoffical discord
> 1528156854 30032 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman1232114]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55530&oldid=55459 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+17) 10
> 1528156903 484821 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Xanman1232114]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55531&oldid=55530 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (-14) 10
< 1528157485 905220 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think I just figured out how to make Roie turing-complete
< 1528157587 243603 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523
< 1528157599 609077 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats the smallest TC fungeoid?
< 1528157603 754548 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know?
< 1528157606 607948 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Nopfunge
< 1528157638 268498 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :woah thats turing complete?
< 1528157639 274790 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, well, there's more than one way to define "smallest" but Nopfunge wins on most metrics!
< 1528157659 225055 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I don't know if I did it
< 1528157665 127673 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait no
< 1528157667 524631 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's the same
< 1528157668 859613 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a demonstration on how it's TC towards the bottom of the page
< 1528157673 724573 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a fungeoid that also has four instructions
< 1528157689 829102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the main thing about Nopfunge is that you need part but not all the program to be repeating, which is a bit nontrivial
< 1528157693 852181 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and It can simulate NAND and move data condtional so it should be TC
< 1528157710 631310 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/1L and https://esolangs.org/wiki/Black may be worth looking at if what you care about is instruction count rather than conceptual simplicity
< 1528157725 357127 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i still don't know how four directions can be TC
< 1528157742 559004 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the minimum data storage you need for TCness is one queue or two counters, right?
< 1528157752 52030 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Nopfunge, the x and y coordinates of the IP effectively form the two counters
< 1528157758 236937 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh for some reason your 1L link redirects to non existant page 1Land
< 1528157765 408934 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but when I go into my address bar and delete "and"
< 1528157766 836633 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :to get 1L
< 1528157771 869790 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it loads the page
< 1528157776 431967 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok wiki stop being broken
< 1528157777 731736 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I blame your IRC client
< 1528157785 342178 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1528157785 689845 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a space there between "1L" and "and" in my original comment
< 1528157792 264723 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok icechat stop being broken
< 1528157812 159736 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1528157815 571809 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Languages
< 1528157817 437487 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Implemented
< 1528157819 110612 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unimplemented
< 1528157822 288467 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1528157825 59785 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice catgories
< 1528157835 583698 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's very common on a page about a language family
< 1528157843 85813 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where some members but not all are implemented
< 1528157851 557158 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it's a family?
< 1528157868 808213 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats the smallest instruction count they got?
> 1528157995 822910 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Black14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55532&oldid=53846 5* 03Ais523 5* (+254) 10/* Black implementations */ Link to the Golly implementation
< 1528158020 438816 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1L langauges are defined by being a 2D language with only NOP and "not NOP" as instructions
< 1528158027 979098 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*languages
< 1528158031 351957 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :dang
< 1528158033 634341 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 instructions
< 1528158040 765147 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of them cheat by having instructions do things if you merely pass near them, in addition to doing things if you hit them directly
< 1528158042 435758 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well nobody can top that
< 1528158056 178090 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. Black will turn away from an instruction next to the path, and move an instruction in its path along a grid
< 1528158058 729651 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you count an instruction like "x"
< 1528158062 343019 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :being "one instruction"
< 1528158071 272613 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and making it do different things based on position
< 1528158078 546536 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Unary
< 1528158085 413786 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although at this point it is /definitely/ cheating :-D
< 1528158160 684078 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok but thats 1d
< 1528158169 106684 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more zero-dimensional
< 1528158205 668245 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although with some languages, you can effectively say "it's a 2D language, just there's no way to turn the IP so it wraps round and round the first line forever"
< 1528158237 94152 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the https://esolangs.org/wiki/I/D_machine is a TC two-command language that doesn't cheat in any way, and the program wraps round and round forever
< 1528158244 653391 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I meant fungeoids
< 1528158247 225941 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess you could see it as a "1D slice of a 2D language"
< 1528158267 915501 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want an actual fungeoid, though, you're going to need more instructions simply so that you can move the pointer around
< 1528158273 73020 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you don't get very funge-like behaviour
< 1528158297 90782 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :would I, D and R work?
< 1528158299 509938 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :where R was turn right
< 1528158339 560245 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, although you're not gaining anything from the 2Dness of the language
< 1528158343 792986 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as the control flow is always the same
< 1528158362 521324 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :since its turing complete
< 1528158366 999517 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you put in two commands
< 1528158370 71028 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :input  and output
< 1528158380 569037 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could theoretically do what a brainfuck can do?
< 1528158390 75883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the I/D machine has no control flow so you have to be a bit careful with how you do your I/O
< 1528158392 301720 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(two more commands*)
< 1528158397 100215 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the normal way would be to use memory-mapping
< 1528158421 928556 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :say "when the pointer goes to such and such an address, a value gets input to that address", probably a bit at a time as it's a very low-powered language
< 1528158425 269035 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :likewise for output
> 1528158507 170828 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Black Turing-completeness proof14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55533&oldid=54111 5* 03Ais523 5* (+208) 10/* "A good GUI interpreter for Black" */ a rather late reply
> 1528158515 866880 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55534&oldid=55503 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+117) 10added ... CATEGORIES!!! :)
< 1528158565 985263 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :damn it
< 1528158567 627496 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :beat us to it
< 1528158571 222667 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :WOOPS
< 1528158576 343624 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgive me :pray:
< 1528158607 833131 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait that is the creator of surtic xd
< 1528158684 533377 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :forgive mah.
> 1528158740 709574 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55535&oldid=55534 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+0) 10
< 1528159521 340235 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1528160398 259172 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528160446 50529 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55536&oldid=55535 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+41) 10
< 1528161282 676432 :brandonson!~brandon@208.91.114.1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528161367 333831 :brandonson!~brandon@208.91.114.1 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528161640 330666 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55537&oldid=55526 5* 03Saka 5* (+918) 10/* Examples */ hello, world!
> 1528161755 392458 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55538&oldid=55537 5* 03Saka 5* (+165) 10/* Instructions */ stuff
> 1528161772 462484 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55539&oldid=55538 5* 03Saka 5* (+8) 10/* Instructions */
> 1528162914 356569 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55540&oldid=55482 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+440) 10Re-added removed BF commands.
> 1528163424 539201 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55541&oldid=55539 5* 03Saka 5* (+305) 10/* Examples */ cat
> 1528163773 886149 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55542&oldid=55541 5* 03Saka 5* (+3577) 10yay I made an interpreter
> 1528164045 214381 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55543&oldid=55435 5* 03Saka 5* (+169) 10
< 1528164372 453132 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528164444 369058 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528166381 636167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55544&oldid=55443 5* 03Saka 5* (+242) 10
> 1528166983 539213 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55545&oldid=55542 5* 03Saka 5* (+25) 10category
< 1528171735 754374 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : with an explicit destructor and placement new call <-- hm, I guess you are right.
< 1528173356 761245 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zxnrlkhjzeuzsqwz QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1528177253 271581 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1528177259 934340 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
> 1528179556 787849 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55546&oldid=55536 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+45) 10Yah that's not correct
< 1528179736 798505 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528179847 417127 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55547&oldid=55546 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+113) 10Added an example program.
> 1528179873 227172 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55548&oldid=55544 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+106) 10Added surtic example program over here aswell.
< 1528179891 270345 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1528180031 660040 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iwfsytuvojyyifvf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528180715 933 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm...
< 1528180717 38601 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Surtic
< 1528180722 671053 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Computional class unkouwn
< 1528180733 553690 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there are infinite cells
< 1528180760 598030 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and each cell seems unbounded 
< 1528180787 65142 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and loops are possible
< 1528180915 347588 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1528181621 356997 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55549&oldid=55547 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+0) 10Strings start at 1 not 0
> 1528181722 24058 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55550&oldid=55549 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+0) 10/* Truth-machine */
< 1528183280 653263 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528185430 331513 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528186538 50567 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1528186864 110538 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528189394 479404 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:3c7f:1a9:4ae4:f6a1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528190158 27156 :Galaxtone!~IceChat9@cable-54-120.sssnet.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
> 1528194345 778806 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55551&oldid=55548 5* 03Keymaker 5* (+487) 10Made one in Black.
> 1528194928 535832 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Black14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55552&oldid=55532 5* 03Keymaker 5* (+260) 10Linked the truth-machine as an another example.
> 1528195110 439844 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55553&oldid=55551 5* 03Keymaker 5* (+3) 10Changed "I/O extension" in the comment to "output extension". My bad.
< 1528197423 985383 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528198033 797921 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Black14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55554&oldid=55552 5* 03ZM 5* (+0) 10Correcting my name
< 1528198227 756217 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-jtxxupqfdsikbnrk QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1528198331 339187 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55555&oldid=55553 5* 03ZM 5* (+83) 10/* Implementations */
< 1528199597 484299 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528201866 891977 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Longplayer14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55556&oldid=55510 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+148) 10
< 1528203351 507264 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iwfsytuvojyyifvf QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1528203626 998500 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528204685 514766 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55557&oldid=55545 5* 03Saka 5* (+440) 10/* Instructions */ More!
> 1528204772 509118 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55558&oldid=55557 5* 03Saka 5* (-3445) 10/* Python */ Make it go to my GitHub page
> 1528204953 658018 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55559&oldid=55558 5* 03Saka 5* (-206) 10/* CAT Program */ GET
< 1528205378 312757 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1528208104 974581 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`dowg password
< 1528208107 76818 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :11570:2018-06-03  learn The password of the month is illegal in six US states and Saudi Arabia \ 11544:2018-05-05  learn The password of the month is . \ 11509:2018-04-14  slwd password//s,.$,, \ 11508:2018-04-14  learn The password of the month is way too late to fool anyone. \ 11444:2018-03-07  learn The password of the month is Schizophrenic Lagomorph \ 11345:2018-02-15  learn The passw
> 1528208384 212798 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55560&oldid=55550 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+92) 10/* How it works */
> 1528208447 697481 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55561&oldid=55560 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (-41) 10/* 99 bottles of beer */
< 1528208652 423233 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cwlprits password
< 1528208654 489666 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjän int-̈e oerjän oerjän oerjän int-̈e int-̈e oerjän oerjän shachäf oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän int-̈e shachäf shachäf oerjän boil̈y oerjän int-̈e int-̈e oerjän shachäf shachäf oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän oerjän gameman̈j int-̈e oerjän int-̈e oerjän mromän oerjän oerjän oerjän mroman̈_
< 1528208695 71711 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what was the variant of culprits that counts?
< 1528208865 712020 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: note that it may actually not be more efficient to use placement new
< 1528208872 793463 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even insert_or_assign uses assignment
< 1528209115 411899 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`paste bin/culprits
< 1528209116 135052 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://hack.esolangs.org/repo/file/tip/bin/culprits
< 1528209191 437699 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`culprits-c wisdom/password
< 1528209193 130044 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ 27 oerjän 8 int-̈e 5 shachäf 1 mroman̈_ 1 mromän 1 gameman̈j 1 boil̈y
< 1528209207 738976 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems a bit biased
> 1528209635 963365 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55562&oldid=55559 5* 03Saka 5* (-32) 10/* Interpreters */
< 1528209933 179421 :constant!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1528211526 546213 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nfyphesbenxpzjbo JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528212979 635966 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : and even insert_or_assign uses assignment <-- yes I noticed that
< 1528213024 898070 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: note that it may actually not be more efficient to use placement new <-- would heavily depend on the type and other things
< 1528213053 470042 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there are any secondary allocations due to data on heap for example it would definitely reduce the benefits
< 1528216140 405632 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528217044 327524 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528217806 52313 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1528218120 582306 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep
< 1528218212 687269 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528218340 26663 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528218906 225472 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528219585 398746 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528220496 449511 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528221349 839861 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: does HackEso have the channel logs mapped somewhere on the fs of the sandbox?
< 1528221375 353275 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or are they on different machines? I can't follow what's on what machine now after the changes.
< 1528221922 129549 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not mapped, but it's physically the same machine. There's the UML sandbox and a Linux container (systemd-machined) around the HackEso part, but no network separation.
< 1528221947 70741 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528222000 690686 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: wait what? no network separation? hackeso did have network separation. this increases hackeso's power a lot, as well as how much it can be abused
< 1528222074 387423 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean "no network separation" in the sense that a network connection would be needed between the logs and HackEso.
< 1528222093 904072 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that just "no network"?
< 1528222103 450573 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess.
< 1528222128 821969 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking it wouldn't go through the network, just a file system mapped read-only, although a network could be useful for other services,
< 1528222162 769582 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: does the UML sandbox map a part of the linux fs where you could bind mount the logs? (not saying you should, just wondering whether it would work... actually from what I remember of umlbox, it could do the bind mount itself?)
< 1528222206 725679 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't set up any outgoing networking from the UML sandbox. The container has it's own network namespace with a point-to-point virtual interface that can access the host system, with pretty strict firewall rules.
< 1528222252 33846 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I would need to first bind-mount the logs into the container, after which UML hostfs could expose them in the sandbox. But it's doable.
< 1528222276 431999 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just make sure it's read-only
< 1528222283 532333 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't want the logs accidentally deleted or worse
< 1528222287 466169 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That said, I have some WIP code for the web logs frontend to offer a (trigram indexed regex) search facility, and my plans involved just exposing that (over HTTP) into the sandbox.
< 1528222302 244521 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ah right, the outer container layer is new
< 1528222314 16455 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: still it sounds easier than making a network connection
< 1528222344 408727 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1528222348 883903 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a database, right?
< 1528222351 31512 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmpf
< 1528222361 592610 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what kind oif database?
< 1528222380 840324 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not really a database, but it's not plaintext either.
< 1528222415 508079 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's length-delimited protobufs, one file per day, Brotli-compressed.
< 1528222452 31796 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: the IRC logs that fizzie keeps... I recalled that http://esolangs.org/logs/2018-05-raw.txt aren't actually files but generated on the fly; the rest was assumptions
< 1528222473 691076 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: approximately how big are the logs? I wonder if it's easier to download them (at least the last ten years or so)
< 1528222496 989666 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, me having a local copy that I can search
< 1528222502 277488 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I wish they were files so that wget -c could work :P)
< 1528222521 258582 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically for the same reason
< 1528222528 115230 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me get to a computer and I'll tell you. Pawing on the phone is getting a bit limiting.
< 1528222541 32187 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1528222547 184130 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this isn't urgent
< 1528222559 137988 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just wondering for long term
< 1528222707 85723 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So.
< 1528222860 487837 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: It might be possible to make wget -c work, depending on how easy civetweb makes supporting range requests.
< 1528222895 836569 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could cache the formatted versions of the last few days, and serve them directly
< 1528222986 741763 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528223063 280781 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought I also set up an (undocumented) URL pattern that let you download the raw protos, but I can't seem to see that anywhere in the code, so maybe I was dreaming.
< 1528223109 522240 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: are there redirects that always go to yesterday's log and today's log respectively, regardless the date?
< 1528223146 938591 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. The closest to that is the stalker mode page, which returns the *contents* of yesterday's and today's logs.
< 1528223162 709397 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The HTML version also uses a websocket protocol to stream live data.)
< 1528223201 825944 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Stalker mode has the same .txt and -raw.txt formats available.)
< 1528223267 592621 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1528223298 857933 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The compressed protos (well, the last few days aren't actually compressed; it's a separate step that runs by cron and does all but the last few days) take up about 120 mebibytes. I don't remember how much the -raw.txt format takes.
> 1528223320 630688 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Parent the Sizing14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55563 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+0) 10Created blank page
< 1528223323 819058 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1528223343 930742 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the raw text won't be much bigger either than
< 1528223353 168972 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, perhaps only twice or three times as big
< 1528223363 133214 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do compress pretty well. But not more than an order of magnitude.
< 1528223385 811783 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm pretty sure I have a copy somewhere of the codu.org logs, since that's where I backfilled the data from (mostly).
< 1528223421 961596 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah! I was wondering how you got the old logs
< 1528223442 306071 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, there we go. 488 mebibytes, for logs up to 2016-04-03-raw.txt.
< 1528223460 735722 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1528223475 9359 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The gap from there to the start of the 'esowiki' bot comes from my personal logs, which you can actually tell if you look at the raw files because all the microsecond timestamps are 0.
< 1528223514 260915 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I can skip the early weeks if I want
< 1528223523 849025 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/weeks/years
< 1528224251 183402 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528225116 799828 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ysaclist 76
< 1528225117 618174 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ysaclist 76: boily shachaf
< 1528225989 386853 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-hebbaivogpdhkdkt JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528226502 357703 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528227742 155285 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-hebbaivogpdhkdkt QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
> 1528228379 684957 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55564 5* 03Joshop 5* (+901) 10Created page with "Turing is [[Turing complete]]. It simulates a Turing machine. == Specifying the machine == Turing uses a binary format. First you must specify how many symbols you are using...."
< 1528228875 10284 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :question. for a variation of BASIC that supports both 32-bit integer and bigint types, what sigils would you use for those types, and what names would you use for the equivalents of the DEFINT and CINT functions?
< 1528229024 404944 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or if it has both 32-bit and 64-bit ints. 16-bit ints are such a past thing.
< 1528229312 225172 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :🍁🍁Patriots buy only genuine Canadian maple syrup. 🍁
< 1528229381 270093 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: sigil + for integer, # (number sign) for bignum 
< 1528229428 997415 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-tdvwsxmtulbkjxuv JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528229537 497030 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: wouldn't that be syntactically ambiguous? as in, does F+(3) could mean indexing the variable F+ with 3, or adding 3 to the variable F
< 1528229553 336780 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, # usually means "double-precision float", although not necessarily IEEE double-precision float
< 1528229611 236514 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the normal sigils are % for 16-bit integer, ! for single float, # for double float, & for 32-bit integer, and $ for string
< 1528229981 696551 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528230308 278267 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: well the + operator is unecessary anyway. x--y works fine for x+y
< 1528230446 610232 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: not for 32-bit integers, since basic errors on an overflow
< 1528230455 570842 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :although maybe there are better candidates that aren't used in basic
< 1528230465 933735 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like perhaps \?
< 1528230468 204908 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, this hypothetical version wants to at least somewhat resemble BASIC
< 1528230481 148952 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\ is tricky, some BASICs use it as integer division, and I sort of like that
< 1528230494 535502 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1528230517 536412 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can use @, which some basics use as a sigil, or lots of other characters
< 1528230534 801666 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although @ does have other uses, I think they don't conflict a sigil
< 1528230662 581690 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`tell oerjan how do you rate Ai-chan's swedish? 
< 1528230663 342473 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you mean "@tell oerjan how do you rate Ai-chan's swedish? " instead?
< 1528230664 769747 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could use certain characters that are unused by most basics, except perhaps as extra identifier characters with an iso646-based character set, namely []~{}
< 1528230668 58771 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell oerjan how do you rate Ai-chan's swedish? 
< 1528230668 160463 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted.
< 1528230700 222363 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could use some characters that don't conflict with being a sigil, like ?
< 1528230707 973458 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, also ` is free in all basics I know
< 1528230732 340352 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :| might be the best actually, because you can say it's an arbitrarily long line, representing an arbitrarily bit integer
< 1528230761 500035 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could also use double sigils, like %% && %& &% %# but that gets ugly
< 1528230915 553057 :Guest31035!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fcebzexizwvaivdw QUIT :
< 1528230929 751084 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: worked for perl? or did it
< 1528230948 346056 :lynn!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rxmwlbiulcybpwcn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528230960 592851 :lynn!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rxmwlbiulcybpwcn NICK :Guest36240
< 1528231020 111761 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like everyone prefers the -> notation in perl
< 1528231066 780536 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I don't
< 1528231081 265922 :wob_jonas!b03f1831@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.49 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's mostly irrelevant here
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< 1528231122 946041 :Guest36240!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rxmwlbiulcybpwcn NICK :lynn
< 1528231975 362802 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1528239160 181715 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:3c7f:1a9:4ae4:f6a1 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
< 1528239809 40851 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528244099 946661 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: do you have issues with your machine? mouse freezing?
< 1528244100 96949 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: oh i know
< 1528244104 890994 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: so you do!
< 1528245439 713915 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528246585 453368 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Call stack/Manipulation14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55565&oldid=55293 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+285) 10
> 1528246957 825069 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Call stack/Manipulation14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55566&oldid=55565 5* 03Rdococ 5* (+2) 10
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< 1528250893 485258 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528252309 716243 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell int-e  seems a bit biased <-- just so you know i waited an extra day just to give y'all a chance hth
< 1528252309 848100 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted.
< 1528252333 930858 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages-cloudy
< 1528252334 61737 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\ said 6h 1m 5s ago: how do you rate Ai-chan's swedish?
< 1528252341 754644 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :who is Ai-chan
< 1528252401 483298 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`dobg culprits-c
< 1528252403 103440 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :5838:2015-07-12  ` o=bin/culprits-c && echo $\'#!/bin/sh\\n\'\'culprits "$@" | tr \\  \\\\n | sort | uniq -c | sort -rn | tr -s \\\\n\\  \\  \' > "$o" && chmod a+x "$o"
< 1528252421 71535 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? culprits
< 1528252422 180929 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :c[uw]lprits lists the nicks responsible for a file or wisdom entry. Usage: `culprits FILE or `cwlprits ENTRY
< 1528252439 157260 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? culprits-c
< 1528252440 194110 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :culprits-c? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
< 1528252540 596085 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn `culprits-c is like `culprits, but gives nicks with counts instead of repeating them.
< 1528252542 812917 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned '`culprits-c': `culprits-c is like `culprits, but gives nicks with counts instead of repeating them.
< 1528252569 205260 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1528252980 512486 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any resources around as to using a queue as RAM? I'm thinking queues as in queue automata. a naive thing to do would be to just keep cycling the queue until you hit the specific cell/address you want but I'm wondering if there's an alternative method.
< 1528253038 766465 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cat bin/culprits-c
< 1528253039 415828 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​#!/bin/sh \ culprits "$@" | tr \  \\n | sort | uniq -c | sort -rn | tr -s \\n\  \
< 1528253090 865378 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to say, better to show them sorted by first appearance.
< 1528253098 913808 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I guess sorted by count might be ore meaningful.
< 1528253101 599391 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :m
< 1528253166 425962 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't sorted by count what we usually are looking for anyway
< 1528253235 778148 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right.
< 1528253251 988558 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`culprits-c wisdom/oerjan
< 1528253253 781768 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​ 118 shachäf 53 oerjän 11 boil̈y 5 noloveinwaikik̈i 2 Jafët 1 nitïa 1 int-̈e 1 hppavilion[1̈]
< 1528253258 301965 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh.
< 1528254048 567330 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvB-kv9q7Pk
< 1528254065 919707 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well timed, you just avoided a snarky @tell
< 1528254074 449433 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so let's see...
< 1528254391 835605 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: the "Hej på deg Monika" sounds nearly the right except that the "d" is somehow an "l". The rest of the song doesn't sound like much like real swedish except for the occasional word.
< 1528254398 987051 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*nearly right
< 1528254447 338555 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :mind you, i don't remember the swedish original
< 1528254507 319124 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Hej på dig
< 1528254698 58625 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528270962 598746 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh dear
< 1528272391 897503 :plokmijnuhby!4e93f04f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.147.240.79 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528272634 416520 :plokmijnuhby!4e93f04f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.78.147.240.79 QUIT :Client Quit
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> 1528278630 299723 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Qwertypy14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55567 5* 03Saka 5* (+2260) 10Python clone
< 1528279514 363862 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :that... seems pointless
< 1528280627 775508 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1528281071 655414 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell arseniiv Thinking of an esolang using https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flatrod_system
< 1528281071 755717 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted.
< 1528281177 787639 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is how to specify it in a way in a text file that isn't a total mess
< 1528281381 246752 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:f478:f47a:cb59:821 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528281395 314995 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently there is a lot more details about it on the Swedish wikipedia
< 1528281439 394156 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :now that is unusual
< 1528281510 866952 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there any heavily physics based esolang? I.e. where it would make sense to use a full blown 3D game engine to implement it
< 1528281563 879931 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hi
< 1528281594 32263 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello
< 1528281661 426079 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: pinball computing
< 1528281682 309520 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :take a pinball game engine and compute stuff in it
< 1528281695 179579 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be doable
< 1528281732 813149 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :bet it would look very spectacular
< 1528281765 309647 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :that too
< 1528281781 19893 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :and to program on it, one maybe could utilize genetic programming, if it will be too hard
< 1528281804 38639 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hm, how do people write in Malbolge? IDK)
< 1528281845 463512 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Analog_computer
< 1528282539 446938 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: oh, have you seen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nomogram ?
< 1528282560 579536 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can compute pretty complex things sometimes
< 1528282564 998603 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe of some use
< 1528282670 293418 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, seems familiar, but didn't remember the name of it
< 1528283165 611700 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: found this, which seems insane: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automaton_Rover_for_Extreme_Environments
< 1528283246 869048 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :found it via mechanical computers
< 1528283589 731249 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :curious
< 1528284613 387638 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neal Stephenson's Diamond Age book is all about (well, not quite, but a lot) "rod logic", which is like a hypothetical (probably unfeasible) nanotechnology-enabled version of that.
< 1528284629 731887 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Off for lunch now.)
< 1528284827 952064 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :something as simple as:
< 1528284829 180392 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :CADD #1, #2, #3   If addr #1 is non-zero, add #2 to #3 (writing back result to #2)
< 1528284829 238568 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :CHLT #1           If addr #1 is non-zero, halt the program
< 1528284829 281661 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :The entire program will loop at the end
< 1528284945 487777 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess on top of that you would need to be able to fill the initial data area as well
< 1528285044 574054 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could get rid of CHLT if you defined halting as "none of the CADD instructions were executed during the last loop"
< 1528285108 791987 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :even if addition doesn't work for this, there may be some other instruction that would
> 1528285359 396407 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55568&oldid=55543 5* 03Saka 5* (+32) 10
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< 1528288848 30071 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar EGSC
< 1528288848 650306 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :EGSC 061220Z 04007KT 350V110 9999 FEW028 19/11 Q1015
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> 1528290225 980982 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Consequential14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55569&oldid=55540 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+2) 10fix 'eam!
< 1528290515 321762 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1528290995 604212 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :CHLT #1 => almost misread this as CTHLH 
< 1528291071 840552 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cthulhu awakens in a neighboring thread, performs some slightly stochastic and potentially harmful computation and then cthlhalts
< 1528291235 227714 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I didn’t get what these instructions are related to. :) They remind of Minsky machine
< 1528291553 925536 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: trying to design a minimal computer that is TC without any branch instruction
< 1528291589 131759 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at some OISCs, and all seem to have instructions like "do x and then conditionally branch"
< 1528291634 113849 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I wondered if you could replace that branch by simple conditional execution
< 1528292121 117366 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm without global looping you mentioned I think it should be impossible outright, but with that…
< 1528292533 757447 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: if you can conditionally modify an upcomic instruction it might be doable
< 1528292545 34181 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's almost reimplementing conditional branching
< 1528292757 170292 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: I was thinking of separate code and data memory
< 1528292819 71507 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :let’s see with recursive functions. 0 is representable, successor is too (with initial data), projections are also, but then we’re stuck with composition, if one of the functions uses the global loop: as we can’t subtract, we can’t switch off the code of the first one; we could switch on the second but not switch off the first. This isn’t a proof, of course, but it should be almost one
< 1528292872 88762 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think there would be even greater problems with recursion and μ
< 1528292990 453487 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: I see
< 1528293053 956072 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: we can subtract assuming 2-complement and a finite word size
< 1528293111 895938 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :just add negative numbers
< 1528293116 349418 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528293137 808425 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :with finite word size, it’s even harder; how should we be able to address an unbounded count of memory cells
< 1528293145 635387 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. 0xfffff1
< 1528293147 128840 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :or such
< 1528293170 403203 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :with unbounded negative numbers — oh why not!
< 1528293173 615547 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, that would be a 24-bit word, missed one pair of ff for 32-bit word
< 1528293185 960757 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: surely bounded if you have a finite word size
< 1528293206 365788 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : with finite word size, it’s even harder; how should we be able to address an unbounded count of memory cells <-- code and data is separate here
< 1528293227 265266 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could have unbounded integers for addresses
< 1528293237 598986 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, stop, do we address indirectly?
< 1528293250 536900 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I missed this, sorry
< 1528293254 310238 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wasn't the idea, but you might need this
< 1528293280 691518 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :my idea was CADD taking 3 immediate address operands
< 1528293290 134816 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :without indirect addressing or infinite numbers, you definitely should, or we will have bounded memory available to any one program
< 1528293310 228632 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm true
< 1528293340 917520 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay but if they are indirect addresses we can't address infinite memory
< 1528293353 119088 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we still use bounded data words
< 1528293362 787413 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1528293463 505318 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: so we can make it work with bignum signed integers for words
< 1528293475 520880 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case, do we still need indirect addressing?
< 1528293601 704491 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not, but IDK what to do with recursion and μ yet (or maybe it’s better to try representing something other like BF machine)
< 1528293722 573700 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :now we could swith on and off various segments of code (if only there’s not too many of them) while looping, it looks hopeful
< 1528293809 197998 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if only there’s not too many of them)  <-- As long as there is finitely many there shouldn't be an issue. It will be complicated yes, but not impossible
< 1528294182 382867 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :having subtraction, copying, multiplication, division and remainder (seems all are yes), we could manipulate strings/arrays, then we should be able to implement a Minsky machine! Registers go in one array, the code in the other, and a cell for IP. Don’t I miss anything?
< 1528294217 186826 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :but we can’t take the sign of a number
< 1528294299 173716 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could rely on data being all nonnegative numbers except for −1 which we need explicitly
< 1528294383 814907 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the task remaining is to demonstrate my claim in detail, but I’m laaazy :(
< 1528294835 985272 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, we couldn’t switch on/off _any_ code, could you add another argument to CADD, so that it will be
< 1528294836 110233 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :CADD #0, #1, #2, #3  if #0 and #1 are both non-zero, add #2 to #3 (writing back to #2)
< 1528294836 182687 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1528294987 502958 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :also division etc. are unnecessary to show realizable, I’ve gone too meta
< 1528295675 287434 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :also could it be not “and” but a “nand” instead, I couldn’t make JZDEC
< 1528296219 930841 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`coins
< 1528296221 813603 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​02carandycoin 06sqicoin 13noonchirlingcoin 04celucoin 07glucidecoin 08resolabocoin 09nigminiuscoin 02smicoin 068091114coin 13luicalcoin 04chilopolymphcoin 07bullcoin 08sonalcoin 09endslrocoin 02xbritcoin 06fisccoin 13cariumcoin 04vertcoin 07frestfcoin 08sethaxcoin
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< 1528296485 310464 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: hm I even boldly suggest CADD have 5 arguments, #−1, #0, #1, #2, #3, all #−1..#1 should be nonzero to make addition
< 1528296706 53489 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :or it seems to not work
< 1528297015 322022 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
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< 1528297223 222894 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody have some literature on doing stuff like binary arithmetic on a queue machine?
< 1528297262 665583 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :(about arguments to CADD) two have been enough, horay!
< 1528298381 755862 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell Vorpal implementation of any Minsky machine, if CADD has two arguments as I’ve suggested: https://gist.github.com/arseniiv/17559458c07a254b84217452c72766e0
< 1528298381 856303 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted.
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> 1528313913 125172 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07List of ideas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55571&oldid=54876 5* 03Cyantologist 5* (+332) 10/* Joke/Silly Ideas */
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< 1528314701 502224 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: I have an implementation of biginteger arithmetic, representing integers as basically a list of bits, in haskell. dunno if that helps.
< 1528314735 978385 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can also try to look for strange exercises in TAOCP
< 1528314751 36891 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/Bin.hs
< 1528314845 112960 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have arithmetic on Zeckendorf representation, and asked in this channel at some point how you could do arithmetic in nega-Zeckendorf, for which zzo38 actually wrote a solution
< 1528314872 141071 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I recommend that if you want to be masochistic, it's much harder to understand how to do it than in binary
< 1528315018 472999 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.perlmonks.com/?node_id=989716 has add, subtract and compare in Zeckendorf, and http://www.perlmonks.com/?node_id=849259 has one in decimal although it uses the arithmetic built into perl for single-digit numbers, you could adapt that to binary
< 1528315038 975168 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh? I already know how to do that.. I was wondering specifically for algorithms centerdd around queue machines.
< 1528315042 579262 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in any case, I think doing anything like this with just one queue would be horribly inefficient, because just one queue sucks. avoid it if you can.
< 1528315084 189005 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: for queue machines, I think you can merge two numbers so their digits alternate in a single pass, if you have a not too small alphabet
< 1528315104 551797 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, maybe you can't
< 1528315111 922040 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that would be impossible, sorry
< 1528315118 438993 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you're basically screwed
< 1528315127 773765 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't know what I'm talking about you can just not answer me. :P
< 1528315137 36355 :wob_jonas!b03f1880@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but anything is hard on a queue machine
< 1528315181 690410 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :a queue machine can simulate a turing machine's tape, so that's a way you can do things like unary and binary arithmetic.
< 1528315218 118269 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I was just wondering if there were algorithms oriented towards the queue datastructure, rather than just letting a tape lie on top of it.
< 1528315275 580042 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks anyway though.
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< 1528316132 530956 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: sorry for being rude, just been banging my head against the wall trying to find relevant literature. everything just seems to point to "hey, an FSM + queue == a turing complete automata", but I've been searching for algorithms that are typically executed on turing machines (things like arithmetic and comparisons, etc).
> 1528316175 723768 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:BoutonIA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55572&oldid=54898 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (-46) 10
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> 1528321818 681379 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Parent the Sizing14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55577&oldid=55563 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+325) 10heh-heh
> 1528321999 71772 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Les Accents Franais14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55578 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+241) 10made a page
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> 1528339223 160937 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55581&oldid=55562 5* 03Saka 5* (+140) 10/* Instructions */SPIN
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< 1528344973 514079 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm having a crisis.
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< 1528347095 20480 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I've been going through some automata theory recently, trying to soak up all I can from a bunch of resources, and looking into odd automata.
< 1528347111 125081 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :2-stack PDAs, queue automata, storage modification machines, the works.
< 1528347156 946463 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :something I've been frustrated at is that nobody seems to be doing anything "practical" with these machines outside of simulating a TM tape.
< 1528347200 513248 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so for something like a queue automata, I don't know what an addition algorithm for two binary numbers looks like using purely the queue, but I know what the translated-from-a-TM version looks like with a marker to mark the end of the tape.
< 1528347285 387759 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :why in the world did you bother then? sure, you showed that these models are TC, but is the end goal of using these models to just simulate a TM tape, plop down the equivalent transitions and call it a day?
< 1528347350 106998 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :are turing machines really the simplest universal automata that can be devised? every other model just seems to target them!
< 1528347361 283846 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from register machines and counter machines and such.
< 1528347383 811899 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :just seems like if you go any lower you hit a point where you have to abstract upwards to a TM and its tape.
< 1528347471 68954 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could argue there are varying forms of complexity (in terms of step counts and such for simple operations) but if you're abstracting upwards you're always going to be slower than a TM!
> 1528347929 926905 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55582&oldid=55581 5* 03Saka 5* (+12) 10bold
< 1528347940 219174 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just really wonder if there's a point of finding smaller and smaller models of computation if we're just going to do all of our work by simulating a TM.
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> 1528349606 342516 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Between14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55583 5* 03Saka 5* (+2430) 10New
> 1528349633 460972 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55584&oldid=55568 5* 03Saka 5* (+14) 10
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> 1528363511 418688 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Between14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55585 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+246) 10Created page with "Your truth machine suggests i inputs an integer. Is this correct, and if so is there any way to change it to string? Also is there any way to take the nth character of a strin..."
< 1528363556 895379 :nobody_!b2e91c60@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.233.28.96 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528363562 787437 :nobody_!b2e91c60@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.233.28.96 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1528363576 24091 :nobody_!b2e91c60@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.233.28.96 QUIT :Client Quit
> 1528363632 379433 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55586&oldid=55585 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+91) 10
< 1528366455 378970 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fwohxfhqqpoaczmk QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
> 1528371586 371093 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55587&oldid=55583 5* 03Saka 5* (+4) 10/* Truth Machine */ fix
> 1528371635 943340 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55588&oldid=55586 5* 03Saka 5* (+235) 10
> 1528371875 85737 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55589&oldid=55587 5* 03Saka 5* (+120) 10/* Operations */ C
< 1528372170 464306 :APic!apic@apic.name QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1528372182 596167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55590&oldid=55521 5* 03Saka 5* (+141) 10
< 1528373214 295090 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528376433 461521 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528376992 954467 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55591&oldid=55588 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+448) 10
> 1528377764 235094 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55592&oldid=55591 5* 03Saka 5* (+170) 10
> 1528379464 245381 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Between14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55593&oldid=55592 5* 03Saka 5* (+69) 10forgot sig
> 1528379544 31469 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TPPL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55594&oldid=55582 5* 03Saka 5* (+127) 10/* Instructions */ COPY
< 1528383512 251888 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
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< 1528384041 21355 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : Vorpal: hm I even boldly suggest CADD have 5 arguments, #−1, #0, #1, #2, #3, all #−1..#1 should be nonzero to make addition <-- huh?
< 1528384115 39053 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric : oh, we couldn’t switch on/off _any_ code, could you add another argument to CADD, so that it will be <-- hm, can't you switch off a variable currently? Setting it to zero?
< 1528384123 698439 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528384130 357167 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@unaffiliated/bowserinator JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528384137 360794 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528384150 416265 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messageds
< 1528384151 954135 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages
< 1528384152 95351 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't have any messages
< 1528384166 534749 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528384241 987089 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell arseniiv okay will look at that tomorrow, busy this evening. But CHLT shouldn't be needed, You could define halting as when no instruction was executed during the last iteration. At that point it is obvious nothing more can happen
< 1528384242 73298 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted.
< 1528385440 912151 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Quit: Terminated
< 1528385500 48883 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Quit: thunderstorm
< 1528385614 348820 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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< 1528386569 976639 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, can't you switch off a variable currently? Setting it to zero?> can and do in gist linked, but it’s not enough (I suppose)
< 1528386790 625000 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :t could be it’s just my faulty implementation idea, but I couldn’t think of something else
< 1528386837 861613 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: ^
< 1528388079 341626 :Naergon!~Naergon@92.40.249.60.threembb.co.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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< 1528390689 361154 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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< 1528391224 51262 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528393784 689193 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( The next 500 markup languages. )
< 1528394277 689334 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1528398032 720114 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: fair enough, okay
< 1528398040 230405 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :will have to look in it further tomorrow
< 1528398053 266964 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528402376 808757 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528405234 290165 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers NICK :nchambers
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< 1528407819 550332 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
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< 1528409092 436659 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528414995 415029 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1528420860 494415 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528420989 13417 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528422628 634413 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :QuickBASIC is using @ for 64-bit fixed-point.
< 1528423750 429609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528430233 789510 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528430630 583000 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vmusfsosantwjiaw QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1528430913 323493 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using ? in BASIC is only an abbreviation for PRINT, so using as a type sigil too should not cause an ambiguity. (Although, I would probably using the new sigil for 8-bit variables, rather than bignums, I think; you could use DIM ... AS for many other types anyways
< 1528431829 179594 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
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< 1528440942 375258 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528442565 764002 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55595&oldid=55589 5* 03Saka 5* (+37) 10/* Operations */
< 1528444091 485676 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528444436 6910 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i seem to have got a bunch of mail bounces for someone sending spam with my address :/
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< 1528453704 871604 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528453764 378622 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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< 1528455812 401589 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528457750 414127 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528457776 150845 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: thanks, re basic sigils
< 1528458112 285257 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528460599 588036 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :At my past job, the company had multiple rooms that each open to a public corridor in an office building that isn't exclusive to the company. These rooms had different keys for the door locks. In order that the company doesn't have to give keys for every room to every employee to every room, but only to the rooms they usually use, there are some ke
< 1528460599 737325 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ys that are kept in certain rooms for accessing other rooms,
< 1528460678 600570 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those keys are supposed to be returned to the prior room.  The keys have tags, and these tags display what room they open. But IMO the tags should also list which room the key is stored in, so you know where to return it. Is there a convention for how to format such a label with two room numbers or room descriptions in a clear way?
> 1528460794 38893 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Between14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55596&oldid=55595 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+253) 10
< 1528461185 984056 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1528462829 431462 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528465405 200286 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: you were right about DMM. http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/draakslair/viewtopic.php?p=169770
< 1528465742 786507 :Effilry!znc@freenode/staff/firefly JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528465771 95923 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528466155 562265 :Effilry!znc@freenode/staff/firefly NICK :FireFly
< 1528466385 258183 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:a1a9:6a67:b707:38f0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528467843 190102 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-crelcyzrfhbrkjyg JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528467864 839395 :Gregor!dlopen@71.19.155.102 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528469245 435368 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yay another GDPR mail... in actual GREEK! (I'm assuming it's about the GDPR because that's mentioned in the subject)
< 1528469314 326470 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got some too. I think there are even phishing emails that refer to that thing and ask you to accept the modified terms of service.
< 1528469367 952495 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still don't understand what the big deal is about GDPR. Its rules are basically the same as we already had, the only significant change I understand is that they'll try to force it on providers from outside of Europe if they collect data from Europe.
< 1528469458 572471 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: the GDPR has (some) people scrambling to get the "informed optin" that the GDPR asks for
< 1528469493 592104 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, but that was already a thing required everywhere
< 1528469505 465799 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, people who are trying to operate legally and used to rely on obscure checkboxes (or the like) on third party websites years ago as "opt in"
< 1528469506 435586 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think websites are just using the popularity to send advertisment emails
< 1528469520 400215 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is basically the opposite of the spirit of the laws
< 1528469530 406941 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/GDPR_(General_Data_Protection_Regulation)_and_MediaWiki_software   should probably have a look at this at some point
< 1528469572 885608 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: when has the spirit of the law ever mattered when the letter of the law had holes?
< 1528469592 840221 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: sure, I know
< 1528469599 950703 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the GDPR hasn't changed that either
< 1528469604 473559 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got that one GDPR email that was also in the hall of shame, the one that was disguised as order confirmation.
< 1528469632 546551 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I hadn't heard of that
< 1528469650 556452 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: https://gdprhallofshame.com/3-order-confirmation-gdpr/
< 1528469695 530710 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1528469710 145130 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We’d like to unreservedly apologise for sending this email to some customers that received it."
< 1528469720 250946 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Note that they're not apologizing to everyone who received it, only some.
< 1528469738 999614 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have one really odd one so far, where a company claims that the data record they're using comes from themselves... and I've never heard of the company before. Oh and they are not asking for opt-in, they're offering opt-out.
< 1528469756 120005 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :which irritates me quite a bit
< 1528469783 566436 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: like I said, some of those are spam ads or phishing
< 1528469801 928241 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's clearly spam.
< 1528469900 911668 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that's a case where I'll take them up on their offer to explain how they got that email address and what other data they have on me.
< 1528469965 532523 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: is that a good idea? if they're sending spam, that will just make them send you more spam. unless you're prepared to go very far and sue them at courts or something.
< 1528469995 575193 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, they'll sell the email address of people who follow links in that email to other people to send spam
< 1528470007 124730 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really mind getting spam that much... if I would, I wouldn't still be using an email address that I used on usenet in the late 90s and early 00s
< 1528470044 647468 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: sure, I don't usually mind spam either, but I don't encourage it by contacting spammers
< 1528470525 429476 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528471295 795842 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528472534 980928 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:a1a9:6a67:b707:38f0 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528472561 352864 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:a1a9:6a67:b707:38f0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528472811 287629 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:a1a9:6a67:b707:38f0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1528474328 210232 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
< 1528474614 666747 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:d58d:1627:442e:9b1d JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528476152 947199 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( so... why is www.softwareheritage.org not accessible without Javascript? On the plus side, the actual archive at https://archive.softwareheritage.org/ seems to work fine... )
< 1528476189 451206 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( ...until you try to actually search something )
< 1528478240 41034 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :web 2.0
< 1528478253 777140 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :The worst thing since sliced bread
< 1528478713 800835 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:d58d:1627:442e:9b1d QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528478830 481944 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Web 3.11 for Workgroups is much better.
< 1528479089 548012 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528480301 713836 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:54c1:d896:e447:9314 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528480940 844964 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:54c1:d896:e447:9314 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1528481212 224211 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:54c1:d896:e447:9314 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1528482295 87915 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528482809 165614 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528483309 733677 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently a "pathetic fallacy" doesn't mean a "pitifully bad logical error"
< 1528484816 680149 :grumble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528485027 394589 :grumble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528485107 430003 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528485598 484103 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:b4ca:531a:bfc5:d910 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528485720 212593 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? tmns
< 1528485721 255946 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :tmns makes no sense.
< 1528485955 415322 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once saw someone suggested, what if your character can see the author's room? I might imagine that Ziveruskex may think, he must be very rich to have so many books
> 1528486740 706768 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07XTW14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55597&oldid=53463 5* 03Zseri 5* (+35) 10/* new Syntax elements */ fix table caption
< 1528486806 855391 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:b4ca:531a:bfc5:d910 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528489482 171624 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528489695 836545 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-1-82-238-218-67.fbx.proxad.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528489933 690000 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes the printer on my computer does not work; would it work to connect a Raspberry Pi computer to the same router of my computer and then connect that to the USB printer and then use the ethernet to send the print job?
< 1528490271 160104 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb
< 1528490292 179852 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528490309 711485 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528491932 835862 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-1-82-238-218-67.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1528492976 566635 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :printers are definitely black magic, I haven’t seen any other device comparable
< 1528493057 360297 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:d40c:6bde:aca2:fc49 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528493161 509375 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :When it works, it works perfectly OK. When it does not work, it can result in the computer saying the printer is not ready, and/or uninterruptible processes, and/or kernel panics.
< 1528493326 316608 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528493342 813906 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1528493689 484139 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528496701 544191 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528497661 639076 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: nostril.
< 1528497812 496468 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :(fungot is silent—how is it possible, is it ill?)
< 1528497812 680203 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: i don't really know much about them
< 1528497834 380091 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, I’m bad in botology
< 1528497864 965504 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: nostratic
< 1528497865 139125 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: ( ( okay i i this is my second one too
< 1528498085 404743 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1528498134 333797 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1528498275 485973 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528499147 344973 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528499177 448314 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i spy a boily
< 1528499210 76282 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Client Quit
< 1528499228 499356 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :we never did play a game. tell me when.
< 1528499245 331747 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528499549 597074 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :QUINTHELLOPIA!
< 1528499641 987874 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :we didn't :(
< 1528499642 78334 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :next weekend.
< 1528499642 121424 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got a new machine to play games on :D
< 1528499642 121521 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :test
< 1528499704 240034 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: hello?
< 1528499704 460266 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: i collect glass fnord you know other things that
< 1528499741 58130 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :one with windows?
< 1528499766 219131 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :we could not starve together. i know another guy who has it now.
< 1528499979 445641 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What games?
< 1528500290 712522 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:d40c:6bde:aca2:fc49 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
< 1528500823 314290 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-crelcyzrfhbrkjyg QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1528500872 896929 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, it ubuntues. windows didn't want to be installed.
< 1528501977 168215 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528502022 368776 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528505123 696873 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A code I have written recently uses the upsert function that has been recently added to SQLite; it is a useful function to have.
< 1528505159 795268 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(That function was released four days ago.)
< 1528507045 514913 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1528507345 548539 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: LECHEROUS CHICKEN
< 1528507924 626125 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528508185 914376 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528511380 885515 :u0_a268!~Scrooble@c-98-209-129-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528511417 718753 :u0_a268!~Scrooble@c-98-209-129-50.hsd1.mi.comcast.net QUIT :Client Quit
< 1528512698 145209 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528513446 582562 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528513466 167295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@messages?
< 1528513466 210436 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry, no messages today.
< 1528513747 317907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528513798 534089 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528516326 888815 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mrtdwlkunapmmvjs JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528517300 252703 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens when Microsoft buys GitHub? Many people have said many different things. I do not use GitHub for my own projects, anyways, but many people do, including Microsoft. For now the only thing I expect is that they might require all accounts to be changed to Microsoft but everything else would continue to work; but, I don't know. Do you guess better?
< 1528521621 286910 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1528522181 691844 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1528522199 395232 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528522667 355741 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528522775 537892 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528522970 895112 :Reddy[Alice]!1fdf1edf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.31.223.30.223 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528524969 908624 :Reddy[Alice]!1fdf1edf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.31.223.30.223 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528525183 485360 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528525520 461963 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan: you were right about DMM. http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/draakslair/viewtopic.php?p=169770 <-- time to gloat or cry, or ... hey puppy!
< 1528526245 354311 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528526384 852562 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/GDPR_(General_Data_Protection_Regulation)_and_MediaWiki_software   should probably have a look at this at some point <-- that looks extremely unauthoritative.
< 1528526444 971409 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, after looking at a small part at that i don't trust those who edited that to have a clue at all.
< 1528526469 746054 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*of that
< 1528526811 11900 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1528526879 839245 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528531005 38665 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`smlist 466
< 1528531005 792984 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 466: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy Cale
< 1528533164 728406 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1528533302 242641 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528533603 566648 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528533627 634053 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1528535287 910209 :wob_jonas!b03f1833@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.51 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528535533 396432 :wob_jonas!b03f1833@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.51 PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: a new machine? is it a good one?
< 1528536189 230632 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1528536352 900619 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I expect they are going to add easy integration with their cloud services (Azure) in some form.
< 1528536367 403808 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I.e. deploy to azure or something like that
< 1528536390 353179 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for account I don't know. My linked in account is not connected to microsoft and it was a few years ago they bought linked in iirc
< 1528536512 924734 :wob_jonas!b03f1833@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.51 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: maybe it will only be required for accounts registered in the future, and you can keep existing accounts not linked, like how I think skype works now (I'm not quite sure)
< 1528536563 544507 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1528536588 980909 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: for linkedin I think I registered after microsoft had bought it already
< 1528536609 728442 :wob_jonas!b03f1833@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.51 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm really not sure. I can use my existing skype account, but I haven't tried to register a new one, so I can't tell how that works.
< 1528536616 554587 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1528537520 837505 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528537548 713215 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528539088 71798 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mrtdwlkunapmmvjs QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
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< 1528543195 49904 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528548706 331206 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528549410 680629 :Guest6451!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-20-165.w2-5.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528549467 709595 :Slereah!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-14-76.w92-131.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1528553321 888756 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ufteypavywrsxzxf JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528557027 136828 :wob_jonas!b03f1833@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.51 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
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< 1528560288 919722 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu
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< 1528567461 369036 :Roger9!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ NICK :rdococ
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< 1528571714 447610 :laerling!~laerling@2a02:810a:83c0:a732:c24:ea1f:bb4e:ca20 QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1528572309 158872 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1528572356 307677 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Client Quit
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> 1528572815 44419 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55598&oldid=55561 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+76) 10
< 1528574286 367996 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528574496 488210 :Guest6451!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-20-165.w2-5.abo.wanadoo.fr NICK :Slereah
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< 1528577416 734411 :Guest6451!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-20-165.w2-5.abo.wanadoo.fr NICK :Slereah_
< 1528577447 170891 :Guest6451!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-59-86.w2-5.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528580698 727316 :Guest6451!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-59-86.w2-5.abo.wanadoo.fr NICK :Slereah_
< 1528581849 153437 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
> 1528585780 121367 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:PP TIBSA14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55599 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (+145) 10I am a bot and I know the correct program
> 1528585822 845015 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:PP TIBSA14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55600&oldid=55599 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (+31) 10Better formatting on top H1
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< 1528589309 997543 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
> 1528589724 701352 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55601&oldid=55598 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+65) 10
> 1528589772 532660 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Galaxtone14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55602&oldid=55244 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+139) 10/* Chat */
< 1528591950 689779 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528598097 87866 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528599042 830265 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I came up with something that should find languages that reduce bugs sort of like how code golf finds languages that are more expressive.
< 1528599313 412788 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know? I think the program can have bugs in most programming languages though, anyways
< 1528599338 412962 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Person A sets a task and all the challengers provide both a program that does it and the smallest edit to that program that causes it to do it incorrectly (but without compile or runtime errors) The challenger's score is the size of the edit divided by the size of the program
< 1528599482 437081 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK, you can try that?
< 1528599829 170885 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le/rn exponentially//"exponentially" is a word that means "a lot".
< 1528599831 343961 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'exponentially': "exponentially" is a word that means "a lot".
< 1528599883 563537 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :expomentially 
< 1528599929 381135 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`?acute
< 1528599930 27241 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/srv/hackeso-code/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: ?acute: not found
< 1528600062 740415 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528601084 379717 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I should give up trying to make my tree-rewriting system variable-less.
< 1528601970 510582 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528602034 797410 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: I like how variable joined after you said that.
< 1528602119 856 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1528604380 66036 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :lmfao.
< 1528604422 233830 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one constant in this channel is variable
< 1528604445 531338 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable NICK :constant
< 1528604577 583467 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesthiswork: The variable just changed, it cannot be constant
< 1528604895 943216 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is no variable only constant. And because as you say constants never change, variable must have always been constant,.
< 1528605233 679295 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
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< 1528608931 273920 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have any ginger tea so Ijust used ginger powder in the espresso machine. it worked surprisingly well
< 1528609304 997867 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brilliant!
< 1528609459 209798 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, espresso machine can potentially be used to decoct all kinds of herbal liquids
< 1528612390 570333 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528614853 793369 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcdc022u0ekvj4.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528615400 465790 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesthiswork, in most languages, commenting out some print command does so perfectly.
< 1528615415 548779 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Its output will be incorrect and there will be no crash.
< 1528615485 487634 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :The features to avoid this aren't... really good features in practice.
< 1528615511 349416 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :The golfiest ways to make a program stop working are usually not what actually cause bugs (in my experience).
< 1528615534 663943 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the things that prevent them (dead code hard errors, unused variable hard errors, etc) are bad ideas in practice
< 1528615666 82552 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell is one of the safest languages out there right now.
< 1528615711 292054 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon PRIVMSG #esoteric :no code - no harm :P
< 1528615736 884815 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :And still, with basically any program, you can make it stop working with s/main =/main = const(return())$/
< 1528615808 808314 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcdc022u0ekvj4.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1528615955 892318 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1528617050 96890 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :<\oren\> therefore, espresso machine can potentially be used to decoct all kinds of herbal liquids <-- interesting, though I assume there might still be coffee taste left in the machine?
< 1528617089 539787 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not
< 1528617103 680038 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :just get a press brewer or something
< 1528617133 766683 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :also you could probably just crush the ginger and use a reusable infuser if you have one
< 1528617359 685519 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use a large reusable cloth tea bag when making tea
< 1528618347 430150 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal: Been a while since we last swapped these -- https://zem.fi/tmp/florence.jpg
< 1528618465 977815 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I haven't done any in a while though :/
< 1528618481 723678 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that is pretty
< 1528618496 558993 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've mostly been lazy and used the phone's tool for them, though that one was done in the traditional Hugin way.
< 1528618535 61986 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm have hugin improved any in recent years? haven't looked at it for a while
< 1528618566 832042 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think some of the UI elements had moved places, but I don't think it's much different.
< 1528618649 832344 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had somehow managed to make the default lens type something non-rectilinear, had real trouble with stitching before I realized that. I think it probably remembers that setting, and maybe I had played around with it.
< 1528618844 768159 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1528618887 236998 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure if I mentioned, but I also bought a fisheye lens.
< 1528618956 872523 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, neat
< 1528619010 484677 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, some neighbor is using a hammer drill I think
< 1528619022 83317 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://zem.fi/tmp/duomo1.jpg  https://zem.fi/tmp/duomo2.jpg  fun, but not exactly all that practical
< 1528619204 263984 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :very narrow?
< 1528619213 157371 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :expected a circular viewport
< 1528619317 956208 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's one of those where for APS-C it fills the frame. Something like 167° diagonal FOV.
< 1528619412 300895 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think if you stick it on a full-frame camera it's almost a circle, but not quite.
< 1528619600 714003 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://drkrishi.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/panorama-using-8mm-fisheye-01.jpg -- the (faintly visible) circle is what the image would be on a full-frame, but there's a hood that's been cut so that it doesn't obstruct the APS-C rectangle.
< 1528619626 671356 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In my version it's removable, in the original model it wasn't.)
< 1528619768 186496 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is some intense colour fringes 
< 1528619795 828298 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :now when I look closely I see some in your photo too, but not as bad
< 1528619837 992429 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you correct for it in post processing?
< 1528619879 552055 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. I wonder if that has something to do with how well the light/dark edge is is focus. The lens hood in that picture would be very out-of-focus.
< 1528619959 56142 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or maybe it's just better near the middle of the frame.)
< 1528620025 389705 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :colour fringing is generally worse towards they edges yes iirc
< 1528620172 602212 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's manual aperture and manual focus, though really if everything's more than about 1-2 metres away, you just set the focus to the 'infinity' marker and don't worry about it.
< 1528620231 756306 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat
< 1528620405 477528 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(re the Lymia/doesthiswork conversation) in programming competitions you sometimes have to design programs to be resistant to being changed
< 1528620415 706275 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this lead to the development of languages with checksums
< 1528620436 653585 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although something like https://esolangs.org/wiki/A_Pear_Tree can only be resistant to 3-4 bytes being changed
< 1528620442 257844 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could make a language that could handle more
< 1528620594 366863 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess most programming languages where small changes are still valid different programs (as opposed to syntax errors) are chaotic, since usually the result is completely different
< 1528620667 603380 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :though there is an argument against that too since often a small change can still lead to no observed behaviour change (e.g. code is never actually executed, or it is still an infinite loop, just with a slightly different condition)
< 1528620671 252067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, some are intentionally designed like that, e.g. Incident
< 1528620690 371695 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where you can effectively remotely delete any part of the program by making an edit anywhere
< 1528620710 473069 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1528620776 183405 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the intent was to make it able to polyglot with /anything/
< 1528620779 624023 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as long as you had an editable portion
< 1528620801 292566 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528620911 165991 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh
< 1528620914 859900 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that is neat
< 1528620945 904586 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that are some really hard to use operations
< 1528621030 100740 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1528621037 168201 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's actually worse than it looks at first
< 1528621093 271244 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, control flow is pretty easy in Incident, the main problem is data storage and transfer
< 1528621148 424901 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm really? Okay
< 1528621159 203801 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbl
< 1528621256 951110 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language is basically entirely made of call stacks
< 1528621552 238041 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528621758 86867 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Vorpal, how would you design a programming language that's not chaotic in such a manner?
< 1528621770 466095 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect the answer is probably: see neural networks
< 1528621904 76998 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's simple tricks you could use to make any valid program very distant (in a byte-by-byte sense) from any valid program (any cryptographic AONT on a conventional language works)
< 1528621915 143310 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :But there's still an underlying logic where a small change can create a huge difference.
< 1528622512 241026 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1528622529 216272 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even Malbroge is that way
< 1528622542 466643 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though, it doesn't reject anything I guess
< 1528622616 894915 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Malbolge rejects almost everything
< 1528622633 645442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IIRC there are only 8 valid options for each character position in the program, anything else is a syntax error
< 1528622638 310517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(what those options are depends on the location)
< 1528622659 852058 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this makes Malbolge programs quite easy to recognise, they tend to have long sequences that run backwards through ASCII as a result of the syntactic restrictions
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< 1528637500 662280 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1528641581 838284 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a control flow structure more flexible than delimited continuations (which seem to be rare in an esolang)?
< 1528641681 263666 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren't non-deliminted continuations more flexible than delimited continuations?
< 1528641772 782598 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :something I discovered a whlie back in INTERCAL is that you can emulate continuations using threads that can be paused
< 1528641777 560693 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although they're fairly heavy
< 1528641804 928023 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :given that continuations have no obvious way to do pre-emptive (as opposed to cooperative) parallelism, threads may be more flexible
< 1528642015 791269 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Delimited continuations can easily emulate undelimited continuations with a single 'reset' that wraps around the whole program and some kind of 'halt program' instruction at the end
< 1528642032 992078 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :('at the end' being still within the 'reset')
< 1528642088 375262 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, there is Forth; some implementations may be more flexible
< 1528642129 682721 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if pausable threads can emulate delimited continuations
< 1528642168 868274 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know
< 1528642289 323223 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could just expose the call stack
< 1528642382 411800 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the call stack is pretty exposed in INTERCAL
< 1528642466 878879 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe a call spaghetti stack
< 1528642508 910334 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1528643816 651471 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you allow the manipulation of stack frames (invoking it with values, modifying the frame it returns to, and cloning it) you can emulate delimited continuations fairly easily, I think
< 1528643857 372381 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :in addition to passing them around as first-class citizens (Communism: The Esolang)
< 1528644697 526417 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scala lets you serialize delimited continuations
< 1528644705 312726 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you can send control flow through the network :D
< 1528644860 888072 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder if you can implement delimited continuations using undelimited continuations in a simple way
< 1528644897 239289 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried, but I don't think it's possible
< 1528644899 233481 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like "calling a delimited continuation takes you back to the old stack frame, but records where you called it from, and then reset can take you back to where you called it"
< 1528644983 126018 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric : Is there a control flow structure more flexible than delimited continuations (which seem to be rare in an esolang)?
< 1528644984 934327 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, wait
< 1528644985 936926 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I got it
< 1528644992 158423 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :computed goto
< 1528645017 180006 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, not harmful enough
< 1528645022 693150 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, computed next from is pretty powerful
< 1528645030 852858 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :next from?
< 1528645038 650237 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like come from except it allows you to go back again
< 1528645066 992513 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm
< 1528645073 286425 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it lets you do things like implementing a single-stepping debugger within the language itself, by nexting from the IP as long as it isn't in the debugger itself
< 1528645113 501641 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting
< 1528645150 731540 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not used in any mainstream language I'm aware of, though, because it's ridiculously inefficient
< 1528645152 817786 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've noticed that some implementations of reset/shift only allow 'shift' to interact with the 'reset' nearest to the top of the stac
< 1528645157 740179 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/stac/stack/
< 1528645188 50705 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, Perl has the option to replace the main loop of the bytecode interpreter
< 1528645204 187498 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that strikes me as pretty insanely flexible as operations go, and it doesn't seem to fall into any category other than "control flow"
< 1528645244 152526 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :do any esolangs have computed next from?
< 1528645267 805918 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL does
< 1528645271 136021 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not any others, though :-D
< 1528645272 557846 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe CLC-INTERCAL does
< 1528645283 762725 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :both CLC-INTERCAL and C-INTERCAL do
< 1528645287 573411 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK
< 1528645324 216123 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :C-INTERCAL allows you to write the computed next from in a C or Befunge-98 program, but it'll only capture lines with INTERCAL line numbers
< 1528645346 698515 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which means that you need to explicitly give an INTERCAL line number to part of the C or Befunge-98 program or you can't do anything with it)
< 1528645409 78607 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, if I understand this, come from is to goto as next from is to call
< 1528645569 617315 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1528645609 281400 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :could we extend the analogy to continuations?
< 1528645650 651265 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, continuations are a generalisation of exceptions
< 1528645656 854983 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and resumable exceptions are something that exists
< 1528645660 341022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so this seems maybe doable?
< 1528645677 305937 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What programming language has powerful enough macros to implement next from and continuations and all of those things?
< 1528645678 511554 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably the continuation gets two arguments, the "payload" you passed it, but also a continuation to go right back where you were before
< 1528645720 918352 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What do you mean by "resumable exceptions"; is that like the RESUME command in BASIC?
< 1528645762 678016 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit like a cross between RESUME from BASIC and catch from Java
< 1528645782 153575 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: for something like come from or next from to work, every line you'd have to check each come/next from to see if the instruction pointer matches
< 1528645785 596045 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think
< 1528645805 59979 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is that when an exception occurs, the program looks for an exception handler in the normal way (stack-unwinding-like) but doesn't actually unwind the stack, instead the exception handler runs on top of the stack
< 1528645840 958523 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then can choose to unwind back to its own location in the code (in the usual way), but can also choose to correct the issue and then return back to the code that errored
< 1528645871 596724 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: For computed come from, yes I would think (if not computed then it is simpler to do), but I ask if it can be implemented by use of macros.
< 1528646087 977923 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably, to implement come froms or next froms within the language itself you'd have to define something that runs before/after every line
< 1528646223 202035 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :continuations could be implemented in the form of lexical goto (goto out of anonymous function scope), I wonder if you could have a similar "lexical come from"
< 1528646778 114509 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :If threads can be cloned, paused and unpaused, they would be more flexible than *undelimited* continuations at least
< 1528646818 81963 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm trying to work out what operation a delimited thread would support
< 1528646825 469774 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably you could pause it, change the bottom of the call stack, and unpause it
< 1528646861 388520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you'd already returned past that point, so perhaps they have a marker "don't go past this point"
< 1528646945 624977 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could try the opposite route, and work out how concurrent continuations could work
< 1528646956 788043 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :concurrent delimited ones, that is
< 1528647111 238071 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :thread X could 'call' thread Y so that if Y returns with a value as opposed to just unpausing another thread and pausing itself, control would return to X?
< 1528647249 446199 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that seems similar to coroutines
< 1528647825 431977 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about this: Thread X could "invoke" Threads Y and Z by unpausing both of them, passing itself along with arguments to them, and pausing itself. Then when either Thread Y or Z "returns", one of them could unpause X and pause itself?
< 1528647888 128856 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528647900 613423 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :If Y "returns" first, though, what happens when Z "returns"?
< 1528647929 721391 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or would X wait for both Y and Z to return by pausing itself twice?
< 1528648553 888895 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528649262 815575 :constant!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero
< 1528649740 683653 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528650759 989835 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Since delimited continuations are essentially functions in that you can pass values to them, and they can return values, perhaps you could simply implement a way to call them concurrently?
< 1528650925 922075 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :> Yay
< 1528650928 131413 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : error: Data constructor not in scope: Yay
< 1528650931 684441 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1528651257 654643 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another way to think about it is that functions are like thread generators, and to call a function would be similar to creating and resuming a new thread passing the caller's continuation to it.
< 1528651288 920210 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you wouldn't need to pass a continuation, just pass the caller itself if it's a thread.
> 1528651718 419088 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Kaa-kun14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55603&oldid=55000 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (-18) 10Blnk'd out page
< 1528651947 538466 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :And if you can clone a thread, functions can then be thread prototypes, which you clone to create threads from.
> 1528652001 187705 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang talk:Community portal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55604&oldid=49676 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (+290) 10/* How do you make userboxen? */ new section
< 1528652028 350007 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528652136 262493 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello imode. ais523 and I were discussing control flow structures that could be more powerful than delimited continuations.
< 1528652177 932130 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1528652190 711108 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528652278 215722 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528652478 401529 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( computed COME FROM )
< 1528652625 584561 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Computed COME FROM is maybe more or less powerful than undelimited continuations, but I don't think it's as powerful as delimited ones.
< 1528652749 441510 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although, computed COME FROM enables pre-emptive multitasking (something which even delimited continuations seems to lack), and if two COME FROM statements coming from the same line is supported then that would result in concurrency.
< 1528652832 571290 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even non-computed COME FROM supports pre-emptive multitasking (to an extent?) and concurrent threads.
< 1528652936 504749 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a multi-threaded intercal, where this is indeed how threads are spawned
> 1528652971 718086 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Kaa-kun14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55605&oldid=55603 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (+834) 10Bio
< 1528653069 32839 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :How about multi-threaded "next from"?
< 1528653438 650806 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works too
< 1528653444 977510 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in C-INTERCAL
< 1528653600 597179 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Having shift, reset and a fork instruction would probably be sufficient for concurrent delimited continuations...
< 1528653791 323083 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or perhaps if 'reset' could act as a forking instruction as well, which would be somewhat analogous to supporting multiple goto labels with the same name.
< 1528654074 624349 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, y'all aren't content with FSM-based control? :P
< 1528654213 924267 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it's kind of moot when even just vanilla structured programming languages can be turing complete.
< 1528654252 232106 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :expressiveness does matter.
< 1528654261 214632 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :buuuut.. yeah.
< 1528654459 269075 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quantum Malbolge should hash the program securely before executing it, so programming in it would require calculating reverse hashes (with current, classic cryptography, it's easy for quantum computers but not classical ones).
< 1528654809 533941 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528655304 302190 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :JavaScript has no goto command. All of the stuff that can be done with it you can avoid goto, and in many cases in JavaScript what it does have does help better anyways than in C, but in some cases nevertheless would be more nicer program to have goto sometimes.
< 1528655435 445207 :fractal_!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1528655541 817844 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(BLISS also does not have a goto command.)
< 1528655986 500816 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like you could delimit threads in the same way that you can delimit continuations.
< 1528656061 326085 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528656287 652374 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528656347 651625 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hi. in that brainfuck variant you invented, where the - command multiplies the cell by -2 instead of subtracting 1 from it, what sort of numbers is it support to use? modulo 256? bignums? something else?
< 1528656354 675480 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think in that case it matters
< 1528656387 666145 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :bignum is my default
< 1528656396 263757 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1528656402 626816 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't matter unless you have a limited length tape though
< 1528656406 280459 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because brainfuck minus - is TC
< 1528656408 362597 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case I wonder if that variant is even turing-complete
< 1528656413 37544 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what?
< 1528656419 648330 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Brainfuck_minus_-
< 1528656419 994352 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck on bignums without - is TC?
< 1528656428 408024 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even without bignums
< 1528656435 936434 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although bignums makes it harder
< 1528656450 158188 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, without bignums it's easy, that's why I'm asking
< 1528656455 461492 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :With integers mod 256 it's pretty trivial, really.
< 1528656461 290804 :fractal_!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528656469 853034 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or mod any number)
< 1528656486 660791 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since you just need to do + a number of times congruent to -1.
< 1528656601 584132 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainfuck without - is demonstrably turing complete whether the integers are modular or not as seen in the article
< 1528656631 510711 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: yeah, ais just told
< 1528656667 892594 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that article suffices to prove it, but it's pretty non-trivial.
< 1528657031 258126 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :What would occur if you replaced > and + with }, which is equivalent to >+?
< 1528657127 372310 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: I think that variant is already invented under some name and on the wiki
< 1528657140 920655 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :without - too? then it's at most a PDA, and probably less powerful than that
< 1528657146 696409 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah.
< 1528657154 466163 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just write > as }- and + as <}
< 1528657181 857637 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: We're talking about a derivative where >, +, - don't exist while } does.
< 1528657200 404492 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1528657201 481407 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ is fairly trivial, as it's just <}. > on the other hand is most likely impossible.
< 1528657247 747944 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is that you can never read any data to the right of the pointer
< 1528657315 354788 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1528657322 795019 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Would it be so limited? If it's mod-256, then > is <} 256 times.
< 1528657345 700148 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was assuming bignum
< 1528657372 728434 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that might be a PDA.
< 1528657403 809574 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it obviously can't be stronger than a PDA, but I suspect it's weaker
< 1528657415 275626 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah.
< 1528657458 876239 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not quite an FSA because it definitely has infinite states, but
< 1528657469 21246 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's a single-counter machine
< 1528657477 89516 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, the number of 1s to the left of the pointer
< 1528657481 817967 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :^
< 1528657495 294253 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even think it's that
< 1528657505 258134 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite possibly, yeah.
< 1528657511 354213 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, it is, you can increment with } and decrement with <
< 1528657526 980571 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, perhaps
< 1528657528 640032 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting that making it mod-256 makes it more powerful.
< 1528657566 365955 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :only the first cell will ever be 0 when the cell pointer is on it
< 1528657588 435780 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, unless it's unbounded to the left.
< 1528657593 345414 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if you can't go to the left of the first cell you can't make it anything other than 0. the tape is effectively fixed.
< 1528657601 125967 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can also consider making it 0 to 255 inclusive, or -128 to 127 inclusive
< 1528657607 987738 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where overflows lead to undefined behavior
< 1528657629 157010 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :then its computational class would depend on its undefined behavior
< 1528657663 416646 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"i=i++; // makes the language Turing-complete"
< 1528657692 970257 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :or overflow causes the cell pointer to move to the right
< 1528657768 311354 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no no. overflow just causes the machine gives control to a malicious adversary with unlimited computing power, who'll want to make your program behave incorrectly
< 1528657776 489904 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what undefined behavior means
< 1528657802 49933 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: technically speaking, that could be TC too
< 1528657804 385353 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even uncomputable
< 1528657815 597770 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like an oracle machine except the oracle is evil
< 1528657862 814125 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not turing complete, because you can't easily translate any program from some other TC language to a program that always does the samd
< 1528657878 498455 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's no "easily" requirement
< 1528657896 418302 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :all you have to do is be very good at making it look like a specific course of action would be the most destructive to what you were trying to achieve
< 1528657897 981584 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has to be somewhat easily, otherwise you'd put all the computation in the translation
< 1528657906 573712 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I feel a new esolang coming on
< 1528657942 474827 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that said, the adversary has to be somewhat gullible or else they could just always return 0, or implement https://esolangs.org/wiki/Baby_Language, or something
< 1528658003 65015 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, an monkey with typewriter language
< 1528658080 332596 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/ an m/ a m/
< 1528658150 717934 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm interested in its computational class, actually
< 1528658169 188795 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is more a question of how computational class is defined than anything else, though
< 1528658223 269261 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure
< 1528658530 906367 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528659762 850840 :APic!apic@apic.name JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528659794 208793 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528660754 86455 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still in the midst of a crisis. any other automata I look at that's been proposed either need to abstract upwards to a TM or are extensional equivalents to a TM.
< 1528660819 648517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1528660961 525199 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so I've been looking into different kinds of automata. queue automata, 2-stack PDAs, tag systems, etc.
< 1528661045 621907 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1528661074 954900 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: isn't that because the queue stuff is even more inefficient than a one-tape turing machine, as in, sometimes you have to spend squared the amount of time?
< 1528661101 628904 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: although you should of course look at counter machines and all their strange variations, those are even more inefficient
< 1528661114 931115 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :and from what I can see, using queue automata as an example, you're always going to just overlay a tape over whatever datastructure you've tacked on in order to do any algorithmic work.
< 1528661135 218756 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I figured, but you'd at least find some algorithms where you don't have to loop through the queue all the damn time, right?
< 1528661153 961864 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :like why else would you bother with any automata other than TMs then if you're just going to abstract upwards to a TM's tape?
< 1528661185 803753 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like to see something as trivial as binary addition on a queue automata.
< 1528661233 863267 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought tag systems would be different but, sure enough, they rely on the same methods..
< 1528661357 347562 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: normally I end up going to counter machines (which can be programmed in directly) rather than tape machines
< 1528661382 600603 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g https://esolangs.org/wiki/The_Waterfall_Model maps much more naturally onto a counter machine
< 1528661394 781132 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and trying to simulate a TM into it you'd go via counteres
< 1528661398 321385 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*counters
< 1528661519 705166 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528661554 830812 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right, but throwing away just proofs of turing completeness, what the hell is the purpose of these automata other than just proving they're turing complete?
< 1528661578 928882 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :proving that other things are Turing complete
< 1528661631 415714 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, that's fine, but you'd think that there are some classes of "native algorithms" that don't just resort to a simulation of a damn tape. :\
< 1528661665 316408 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1528661676 779421 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's sort of a funny hierarcy if you take a one-queue machine, a one-tape machine, a 2-tape machine, a 3-tape machine, a 4-tape machine, etc, and a pointer machine. there's only like a squaring slowdown (O(t**(2+epsilon)) steps for the slower when t steps on the bigger) between the top and the bottom one, but each one in the hierarcy can only simul
< 1528661676 904585 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ate the next one with that square slowdown
< 1528661690 118214 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode1: a while back I was working on an optimised interpreter for counter machines
< 1528661714 927010 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are easier to optimise than Turing machines are, and counter machine programs ran faster than the equivalent Turing machine programs would have done post-optimisation
< 1528661741 656871 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but I don't... care much about optimizations. I'm saying that there just doesn't exist a non-tape-oriented set of algorithms for shit like queue automata.
< 1528661784 531088 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you consider Thue to be tape-based?
< 1528661797 609876 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's pretty easy to implement on a general queue automaton
< 1528661833 881312 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is, and I've done it (queues are nice because they're effectively cyclical strings).
< 1528661859 705138 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas with the tape you have to keep going back and forth
< 1528661895 829746 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :right. queues seem good for models of computation that require some rewriting rules.
< 1528661925 120051 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I've not really gone into translating things like "traditional algorithms" into thue-like rewrite systems.
< 1528661952 889029 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the queue model also feels essentially concurrent
< 1528661960 838532 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so?
< 1528661963 596547 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as you can do things on multiple places in the queue as easily as you can in just one place
< 1528661966 706557 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.
< 1528661971 88483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas with a tape+tape head model, it's easier to stay in one place
< 1528661982 261006 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528661986 930363 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there are problems you can solve more efficiently on a 101-tape turing machine than on a 100-tape one, but they get rare above 3 tapes
< 1528662018 896699 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"101-way diff", for example
< 1528662020 707023 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :something that I've been wanting to do is extend a queue automata with I/O. I feel that's easier than a traditional TM.
< 1528662034 605980 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: um, what's "101-way diff"
< 1528662068 701363 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528662094 217404 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode1: interactive IO?
< 1528662094 696626 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: it's like a 3-way diff but bigger
< 1528662102 774666 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: interactive, yeah.
< 1528662105 918920 :wob_jonas!b03f1924@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.36 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but what's 3-way diff in this sense?
< 1528662124 937867 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is just a guess, it seems like a reasonable one though
< 1528662178 812286 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :because with stuff like rewrite rules simulated on top of a queue automata, you can just do something easy like "request_for_input1 ->  1528665205 243856 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55606&oldid=55601 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (-218) 10
< 1528666432 485583 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528666899 654359 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528667319 796141 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1528667372 738666 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I implemented a lot more stuff in Free Hero Mesh now, including the class loading, and functions to read the levels/solutions from those files or the user cache as applicable, and the SQL execute mode, etc. If you like to, you can help too such as to draw the logo, to write the picture editor program (it would be an external program, probably), and/or to write complaints about it.
< 1528667542 837198 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And I am glad they added upsert now in SQLite, since Free Hero Mesh internally uses it in one function.)
< 1528667614 895890 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I got a message with valgrind that one of the loss records says zero bytes are definitely lost (and then specifies what function); it is supposed to do that, and if so, why?
> 1528667641 529053 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang talk:Community portal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55607&oldid=55604 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+256) 10/* How do you make userboxen? */ Mostly you don't
< 1528667653 920535 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :> userboxen
< 1528667655 913571 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : error: Variable not in scope: userboxen
< 1528667696 999243 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( someone will now link a userbox on the wiki i don't know about )
< 1528667733 673610 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :On what wiki? Does esolang wiki have a user box?
< 1528667754 877439 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, but Kaa-Kun asked about them.
< 1528667796 123453 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are enough pages on the wiki i haven't looked at or don't remember, that someone _may_ have made one.
< 1528667818 545749 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still it should be possible to do without needing to add any additional extensions.
< 1528667828 969886 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think)
< 1528667835 572139 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( also upsert totally looks like someone made a typo )
< 1528667889 143879 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Userboxen should be the official plural.
< 1528667928 814252 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe, but it does not seem to be a typo. It means a INSERT command that also has a ON CONFLICT ... DO UPDATE afterward to update instead of insert in case there already is such a record in the table. Apparently it was from PostgreSQL at first, but now SQLite has it too.
< 1528667964 606362 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1528668002 832761 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :rdococ: OKAY
< 1528668030 703659 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION didn't notice the plural until you mentioned it

< 1528668251 444312 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course i'm old enough to know about it. but these days we need to be gender neutral, so clearly the plural should be userbcattle hth
< 1528668308 316128 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? bcow
< 1528668309 837791 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :bcow? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
< 1528668534 518829 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1528668610 792313 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Having shift, reset and a fork instruction would probably be sufficient for concurrent delimited continuations... <-- does intercal have SPOON or KNIFE?
< 1528668625 903559 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is problem of English (and many other) language, not having suitable gender neutral pronoun and someother gender neutrals sometimes
< 1528668632 808757 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Not any version I know.
< 1528668637 236218 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :PLEASE ABSTAIN FROM KNIVING SPOONS
< 1528668637 509134 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Make it up if you like to do so.
< 1528668649 281610 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: those sound like Snowflake instructions
< 1528668666 438874 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…it's probably a good thing this language is implemented or else they might not exist any more
< 1528668670 778695 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*is unimplemented
< 1528668687 693108 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, it seems that Snowflake has SPOON and FORK but not KNIFE
< 1528668697 445688 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brachylog has a knife instruction, but it doesn't do flow control
< 1528668744 549895 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Snowflake, fork … spoon is quite close to a parallel map
< 1528668759 630868 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but you can run them unpaired if you want to
< 1528668966 979779 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the point of having a map instruction is that Snowflake needs to do complicated calculations in a reversible way, so it's "main" flow control commands must be ones that are inherently terminating)
< 1528669094 824547 :imode-desktop1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528669120 307841 :imode-desktop1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Client Quit
< 1528669139 794798 :imode-desktop1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528669144 973933 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Quantum Malbolge should hash the program securely before executing it, so programming in it would require calculating reverse hashes (with current, classic cryptography, it's easy for quantum computers but not classical ones). <-- i don't think that's easy for quantum computers.
< 1528669164 548240 :imode-desktop1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Client Quit
< 1528669182 794343 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528669208 562877 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could get a square root speedup with grover's algorithm, but nothing enormous.
< 1528669296 377164 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi imode-desktop
< 1528669308 581166 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey ais523. just testing out the new weechat.
< 1528669319 306902 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :as scott aaronson mentions in his latest blog post, cryptography _other_ than public-key isn't really cracked easily with QC.
< 1528669351 579769 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: a good example of something that Thue-alikes are good at is bracket matching
< 1528669417 332856 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you just want to check for matchedness and not preserve the data, you can replace () with the null string, which is something that's much more complex in a Turing machine
< 1528669425 332410 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but suppose you want to preserve the pattern too
< 1528669459 220430 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do something like replace ) with x], ]x with x], )x with x), [x with x[, and (x with [
< 1528669484 652851 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is that each ) spawns an x, and the x's flow to the left until they reach an open parenthesis, at which point they're consumed
< 1528669522 157172 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if any escape to the left, there are unmatched ), and if there are unmatched (, one of them will be left unchanged without becoming [
< 1528669553 19421 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the x's here act like miniature data pointers which are just looking for a bracket to match
< 1528669659 857153 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's... beautiful.
< 1528669719 586194 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the #1 most annoying thing about writing Thue is that if you want characters in group 1 to be able to move past characters in group 2, you have to write all the cases out individually
< 1528669727 261231 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apart from that it's a really beautiful language
< 1528669740 671740 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense. almost like wire crossing.
< 1528669753 399404 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could auto-generate that.
< 1528669765 761444 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, or just generate a variant that has wildcards
< 1528669784 212437 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose I should just look into naive string rewriting, ala Thue. do you have any resources/literature you could point me to?
< 1528669883 283856 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really, I've mostly just been figuring things out myself as I go
< 1528669895 656496 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense. it struck me as a relatively unexplored area.
< 1528669977 850895 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just been wondering about scaling upwards. I wonder what a simulation of a random access machine would look like in Thue. that's one step to getting somewhere close to "usable".
< 1528670008 681747 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :same with a thue interpreter in... thue.
< 1528670099 149513 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to limit the character set, thue suffers from not escaping its input
< 1528670148 718591 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that said, thue would be quite bad at self-interpreting because it's not normally very good with handling two different things at the same time (as you need to keep moving them through each other to get them to the right relative positions)
< 1528670163 489482 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and when interpreting thue, you have three things to handle at once (working string, search string, replacement string)
< 1528670240 896657 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume you'd have to have the equivalent of a tape division.
< 1528670322 92935 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :construct the equivalent of a multi-tape turing machine and map each tape to each component, scanning through the input one cell at a time.. but then you're back to abstracting towards a TM.
< 1528670324 676267 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : the queue model also feels essentially concurrent <-- did you see my update to the underload construction in fueue, that's relevant
< 1528670376 130170 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I might have /seen/ it but I can't remember what it was
< 1528670406 134360 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: well you can make use of the nondeterminism, if it is genuine nondeterminism
< 1528670411 275575 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but most thue interps don't implement that
< 1528670501 28629 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, I remember now
< 1528670507 880849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(now that I've looked at it)
> 1528670570 281348 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SimPPLe14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55608&oldid=53107 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (-13) 10Reedireect
< 1528670630 772019 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I guess there's potential. what I'm looking to do is stupid but I'm exploring translating traditional game models (like roguelikes, text adventures, anything that involves some abstract interaction between entities that may contain arbitrary codes) to different models of computation, and I've been on a descent to find the most "convenient" one to use.
< 1528670680 660021 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: you might want to talk to Lymia (who was trying something quite similar) about this
< 1528670701 682743 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's a good idea, I'm also interested in the results of this
< 1528670743 195978 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the possibility of interactive I/O and "clean extendability" of whatever model I choose would also mean I get to work with the multiplayer aspect.
< 1528670773 342723 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :much like how many people have extended brainfuck with I/O and network capabilities.
< 1528670798 527404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking about this from the other direction (i.e. creating a new paradigm for games programming)
< 1528670812 397051 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I combined something like three old languages I was working on and am really happy with the direction it's going in
< 1528670819 442104 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm. idea: call spaghetti queue
< 1528670824 407235 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's all ideas so far, and possibly will be forever as this is daunting to spec, let alone implement
< 1528670855 470160 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel that. the hardest part for me is trying to translate different object behaviors to moves of a TM tape head.
< 1528670922 660086 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's kind of degraded into a "multi-user programming environment" based on really small automata.
< 1528670985 589853 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :because when I started taking into account the behaviors that MUDs offer, for example, it turns out that you just need the ability to execute arbitrary programs that respond to the world state and external player/object events.
< 1528671016 103239 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the basic idea is a) objects can be created and persist even when not referenced, they have to be explicitly deleted; b) object fields cannot be directly modified but you can attach modifiers to them, some fields are calculated, and some fields are calculated as integrals of other fields so you can store data in the constant of integration; c) collisions between objects (with a simple or maybe even complex collision-detection algo) are a first-class 
< 1528671017 736189 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :part of the language, and are the only way to do "discrete" operations like creating and deleting objects; d) collisions may be based on things other than positions but they occupy a sort of "conceptual space" which has a speed of light (thus "distances" are actually measured in time, with c=1)
< 1528671084 348116 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that last bit is interesting to me in particular, have you ever seen this?: https://mitpress.mit.edu/books/conceptual-spaces
< 1528671122 576105 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't
< 1528671133 383966 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the abstract it's unclear if the book is describing the same thing as me or not
< 1528671136 55326 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tl;dr is "guy tries to map properties of objects to quality dimensions, and starts sketching out figures that represent concepts and individuals."
< 1528671136 897109 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they might be different but similar
< 1528671200 842338 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably different, but you're the only other person I've seen using the term "conceptual space", so I had to at least ask. ;)
< 1528671233 246792 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : Hm. idea: call spaghetti queue <-- . o O ( call FSM )
< 1528671243 510265 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more similar than I thought it would be
< 1528671262 84452 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my method is intended as a model of computer thought, though, not a model of human thought, so it's much simpler
< 1528671366 797856 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Perhaps stack frames with multiple parents could return to all of them concurrently, or maybe the stack frame would be able to choose which parent to return to.
< 1528671499 760652 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :A "call FSM" would be, most likely, a call directed graph, which would allow for cycles of stack frames that return to eachother. I'm unsure of the uses for it, though.
< 1528671523 245462 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le/rn call cthulhu//Call Cthulhu is the most destructive calling convention.
< 1528671525 310759 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'call cthulhu': Call Cthulhu is the most destructive calling convention.
< 1528671574 214487 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"call finite state machine" is basically how Verity works
< 1528671581 669086 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't support (non-tail) recursion for obvious reasons
< 1528671591 526990 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :"DEALLOCATE THE KRAKEN!"
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< 1528671629 85990 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what I'm noticing is the "ultimate game" turns out to be something akin to Ready Player One's oasis, or the Metaverse. not something that has any specific game behavior, but a simple multi-user environment (can be single user as well) that starts off as a simple shell, but can evolve to contain different kinds of interactive game objects.
< 1528671665 748753 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically a codenomic
< 1528671674 731330 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you wanted to build a forest with some birds in it that hunt and peck for seeds on the ground, you could plop some graph nodes down, write some behavior for the bird, write some behavior for seed growth, and bam.
< 1528671692 89583 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda, yeah!
< 1528671790 931189 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that things like the old MUDs/MOOs probably got closest to that
< 1528671794 494930 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, a codenomic
< 1528671794 880883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern games tend to be a lot more controlled
< 1528671799 45219 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah.
< 1528671830 716658 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know why they never took off. there are ways to make those types of worlds graphical, more interactive.
< 1528671842 138790 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the closest thing I can see is Second Life.
< 1528671844 915416 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's a barn fire.
< 1528672052 420891 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because it conflicts with the usual monetisation model
< 1528672062 809004 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :charging for skins and emotes is not really worth much when players can create anything
< 1528672072 850384 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd have to do something like charging for anything that's blue, or the like
< 1528672089 274483 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is still the MUDs that you don't need any graphics
< 1528672184 674410 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but I've not really seen any that are too terribly "out there". let's face it, a lot of the languages that these things are built with suck. and their toolkits are largely game-focused (at least the ones I've seen are.)
< 1528672255 680483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you're right that Second Life is close to what you're looking for, at least in concept
< 1528672268 350398 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the execution, of course, could be much better
< 1528672283 516682 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely. imho their first mistake was trying to work within 3D space.
< 1528672334 234194 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :starting with 3D is not the way to go in my eyes. that kind of abstraction is best left to the logic you define later, not a job for your core systems to manage. 3D mesh data should be an afterthought, and well-considered one at that...
< 1528672378 842250 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the early MUDs had it right. flat objects in memory with a loose communication mechanism that tied them all together, so you could have abstract rooms or entire spaces full of interacting objects and players.
< 1528672382 71930 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528672425 96317 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the next logical step is the graph of rooms, as with many MUDs. dedicated door objects that can speak to eachother and whoever uses them, so you can coordinate teleportation at the object level, _not_ have it as an engine builtin.
< 1528672464 712782 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :after that, you can add positional movement on top of the room layout, and even things like SL's grid, just by tying rooms together and being smart about prefetching objects from a certain range out in your renderer.
< 1528672520 200586 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I know is how ifMUD works; there are many objects having locations, and fields on objects, and exits on both items and rooms
< 1528672525 775620 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the killer there is "choose your interaction". you can either have room-based movement, or location-based movement within rooms, or positional movement as well.
< 1528672599 986518 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but imagine you're just using this thing for collaberation? you can pull 4 people into a room, 2 of them create objects, and the other 2 act as QA, trying to break what's been made.
< 1528672712 41670 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :these kinds of environments aren't just suited towards game-like content, they're essentially multi-agent systems, where the players are the agents and the programmers!
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< 1528673006 53809 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the starting point to all of that, I guess, is finding a solid base, which is why I've been concerned with automata.
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< 1528674776 444485 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hm, might start trying to design my own b{markup language}.
< 1528674924 509567 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Start-reset_markup_language is fairly inaccurate - the IRC control codes for formatting are toggles, so \b turns bold off if it's already on.
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< 1528682625 880141 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have made several hacks with ifMUD, such as a way for a JotaCode program to read your own current channel. This cannot be used on other users, nor can it be used if you use the "nounzone" option. If you are logged in at the time, then it also resets your idle time, displays error messages on your terminal, and cancels paste mode if you have it set. However, does work.
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< 1528695492 226358 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, I wonder if there's a way of translating a prolog-like rewriting rule into a set of rules for Thue that doesn't involve you contorting yourself.
< 1528695513 934439 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so instead of doing just  ::= , you can do , , , ...,  ::= 
< 1528695564 636024 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning "if these ALL patterns match, rewrite them all to the rhs."
< 1528695663 870474 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but otherwise, skip the rule.
< 1528695670 343359 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd need some kind of flag system I think.
< 1528695918 189749 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just wonder what the "primitive machines" are for languages like Thue. I know you can build up larger machines from smaller machines in other automata, but composition in Thue seems like a tough nut to crack.
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< 1528696294 402430 :wob_jonas!b03f181f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.31 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, I'm no longer sure about anything I said yesterday. maybe a three-tape turing machine can actually simulate a d-tape turing machine with just polylog factor slowdown.
< 1528696521 298950 :wob_jonas!b03f181f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.31 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" what I'm looking to do is stupid but I'm exploring translating traditional game models (like roguelikes, text adventures, anything that involves some abstract interaction between entities that may contain arbitrary codes) to different models of computation" => hmm, wasn't there an IOCCC entry that did that sort of thing on cellular
< 1528696521 399474 :wob_jonas!b03f181f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.31 PRIVMSG #esoteric : automata with a global input?
< 1528696588 748562 :wob_jonas!b03f181f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.31 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" creating a new paradigm for games programming" => is that for automatic saving the state and replay?
< 1528696806 15669 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: a CA with global input would be funny to see. got a link?
< 1528696828 667448 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :puts "injecting input" in a whole new light.
< 1528696930 765153 :wob_jonas!b03f181f@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.31 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: I think it's http://www.ioccc.org/years-spoiler.html#1993_rince
< 1528697203 871241 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah. I recognize that.
< 1528697227 971245 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :there have been several kinds of languages like that, but they all conform to a 2D grid.
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< 1528701675 702815 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 467: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy Cale
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> 1528705644 689407 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55609&oldid=55606 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+36) 10I think I misinterpreted that instruction while checking the divide.
> 1528707942 787202 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55610&oldid=55609 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (-12) 10Improved 99 bottles
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> 1528715453 895704 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55611&oldid=55579 5* 03Cevat 5* (+364) 10/* Introductions */
> 1528716671 67967 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07LOLZ14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55612 5* 03Cevat 5* (+707) 10Created page with "LOLZ is a language that ignores everything except the letters 'l', 'o,' and 'z'. Its main goal is to let users to write any program in one line. Also LOLZ is an error-free lan..."
> 1528716974 767622 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55613&oldid=55513 5* 03Cevat 5* (+11) 10Added LOLZ
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< 1528724269 820820 :zseri!~zseri@i5E86C029.versanet.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi again
< 1528724322 468890 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1528726974 265108 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yo
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< 1528744380 509766 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Suppose you have a language like postscript or forth that has both a call stack and a data stack. If the environment provides some sort of calls to do IO (whether a general OS interface or access to the application this is embedded in as a scripting language),
< 1528744455 358010 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then it's possible to define the IO library such that IO calls require that the data stack is empty (i.e. contain only what the environment put into it when your code is started), or the call stack is empty (contains only whatever returns the environment put in it at the start, in this case the IO call needs to call back a continuation function of 
< 1528744455 502637 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the user code), or even that both are empty.
< 1528744470 575031 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This could be easy to very inconvenient depending on the details of the language.
< 1528744533 445465 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could sort of say that TeX requires the data stack to be empty for IO stuff and even for variable assignments, but we don't really consider it a data stack.
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< 1528744872 946949 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course requiring both the data stack and call stack to be empty could only work in a language where you can store data somewhere else in some global state, unless perhaps the IO call required that you put a fixed number of objects to the data stack, such as just one continuation function, which I think could in theory work in Underload.
< 1528745085 222489 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :And in a language like underload that only stores data on the two stacks, it would be natural to have some such restriction.
< 1528745948 176789 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote
< 1528745948 920901 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :698)  Lent is a bad habit that people find very difficult to give up.
< 1528747898 470602 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how you'd do tree manipulation in Thue... 
< 1528749815 450455 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you can have a token jump over balanced parentheses... for example: S( -> (xR, R( -> (RR, x( -> (x, RR) -> )R, xR) -> )T, where x and R are auxiliary symbols, will transition from S([balanced parentheses]) to ([balanced parentheses])T  (I'm writing -> where Thue uses ::=)
< 1528749835 730 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I'm missing x) -> )x
< 1528749871 835719 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figured. you can also take an alternate approach and do something like huffman encoding.
< 1528749891 770286 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :where your tree is a series of left/right paths delimited by brackets, like [00101010][0100101001]...
< 1528749957 281623 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and obviously Thue can simulate a Turing machine... but this is actually a bit simpler in Thue than in a Turing machine, I'd say.
< 1528750006 313655 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah.
< 1528750076 1109 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the path-based representation would be beneficial, because then you have some context: you can specify a pattern that starts at the start of a particular path, or at the end, or at any point in between.
< 1528751253 660308 :wob_jonas!b03f184d@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.77 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm always sort of annoyed by questions like "how do I represent a tree" or "how do I represent a graph", because it really depends on what kinds of operations you want to do on the tree or graph, and it's not possible to give a meaningful answer without.
< 1528751709 757055 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah.. and you also have to consider your storage requirements.
< 1528751842 153043 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( "How do I represent a..." -- "I'm sure there's an Unicode symbol for that." )
< 1528751908 223231 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :lmfao. "With a suitably concise alphabet..."
< 1528751944 769466 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :graph rewriting in thue would be a little troubling. the two choices of graph representation are complex.
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> 1528757304 712426 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Template:Distinguish14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55614 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (+23) 10Created page with "{{Distinguish/{{{1}}}}}"
> 1528757334 323195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Template:Distinguish/Confusion14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55615 5* 03Kaa-kun 5* (+38) 10Created page with "''Not to be confused with [[{{1}}]].''"
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> 1528757793 28139 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:OneFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55624&oldid=50260 5* 03Galaxtone 5* (+188) 10/* Missing Specification Information */ new section
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< 1528770142 567908 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to comprehend how you'd do something as trivial as RAM simulation in Thue without hard-coded locations in the rule set, and without resorting to a traditional tape representation.
< 1528770238 208382 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can see the RAM cells as being sequences of [key;value] pairs, and values sort of propagating around them.
< 1528770358 915939 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if your input was "{231;Test}[10;...][20;...][30;...][231;...][;]", with the things in {}s classified as write instructions...
< 1528770428 705850 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you'd need to find a way to propagate that 231 forward in advance, then leave a marker if the comparison worked. that could be done in parallel.
< 1528770507 367835 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the address didn't exist, you'd hit the "[;]" at the end, which signifies an empty "bubble" to put your key/value pair.
< 1528770525 339776 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1528770558 489389 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you could figure that out, or if you could figure out how to do prolog-style pattern matching, that'd be nice.
< 1528770745 650509 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I actually still wonder what a Thue interpreter in... Thue would look like.
< 1528770760 552624 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously you'd have to reduce the thue ruleset to a reduced alphabet.
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< 1528786911 487208 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`aglist 599
< 1528786912 232856 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :aglist 599: b_jonas shachaf
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< 1528789605 754399 :user24!~void@p2003008869026300FCB2B84A96315A14.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just gonna say that the "lark" parser library for python is pretty cool: https://github.com/lark-parser/lark
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> 1528795754 944252 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Equipage14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55625 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+728) 10Add stub for Equipage.
> 1528795806 548818 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Carriage14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55626&oldid=39136 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+30) 10Add "see also" reference to Equipage.
> 1528795854 574268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55627&oldid=55613 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+15) 10/* E */ Add Equipage.
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< 1528810348 85193 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/_mW3/text so I tried my hand at forward-chaining within thue, but it's one-shot and unwieldy.
< 1528810371 652784 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also not thue syntaxt, but general string rewriting, w/e.)
< 1528810921 380811 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :when a fact "fires", it sort of switches itself off and generates a unique flag that's passed down by every other fact until they hit the end and accumulate.
< 1528810963 550130 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I wonder how I can do something like simulating RAM via key/value pairs... but first I have to work out how to do non-destructive string comparisons.
< 1528814661 516910 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grammar_systems_theory http://www.cs.bme.hu/~csima/phd1/phd1.html
< 1528814751 723960 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I ask, the universe answers.
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> 1528827015 721756 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PUBERTY14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55629 5* 03Izumariu 5* (+6465) 10Created page
> 1528827032 855887 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55630&oldid=55627 5* 03Izumariu 5* (+14) 10/* P */
> 1528827045 135200 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55631&oldid=55444 5* 03Izumariu 5* (+1571) 10Added PUBERTY
> 1528827085 748594 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55632&oldid=54907 5* 03Izumariu 5* (+64) 10/* General languages */
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< 1528827588 730903 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:9c9:b437:1d74:ecfe JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528829983 58103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55634&oldid=55628 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+97) 10/* Introductions */
> 1528829994 783515 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55635 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+271) 10Created page with "Annoying Alice 2D is a 2 Dimensional esolang that is inspired by 2D programming languages like piet using the difference in ARGB values between pixels. It has this name becaus..."
> 1528830032 21416 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55636&oldid=55635 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+21) 10
> 1528830089 46495 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03Reddy Alice 5*  10uploaded "[[02File:Helloworldannoying.png10]]"
> 1528830113 227856 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55638&oldid=55636 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (-28) 10
> 1528830581 43799 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03Reddy Alice 5*  10uploaded "[[02File:HelloworldannoyingAlice.png10]]"
> 1528830602 25177 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55640&oldid=55638 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+1) 10
> 1528831726 535116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55641&oldid=55640 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+2525) 10
> 1528831745 108495 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55642&oldid=55641 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+0) 10
> 1528831928 531404 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55643&oldid=55630 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+24) 10/* A */
> 1528832049 159989 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55644&oldid=55642 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+108) 10
> 1528832064 307498 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55645&oldid=55644 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+2) 10
> 1528832625 514294 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55646&oldid=55645 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+69) 10
> 1528833059 727338 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Oxetn 5*  10New user account
< 1528834128 685281 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528834161 825154 :LKoen!~LKoen@vbo91-1-82-238-218-67.fbx.proxad.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528834187 667294 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:4571:fa94:d75b:c62c JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528834335 479195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TheSingularity14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55647&oldid=53192 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (-94) 10got to do my own work
> 1528834362 133525 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:HereToAnnoy14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55648&oldid=53832 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (-67) 10
< 1528834482 734954 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:4571:fa94:d75b:c62c QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1528835342 393259 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Focus14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55649&oldid=53898 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+35) 10
< 1528835657 433716 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1528836570 955726 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528836593 883034 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-tkbaoscczuzgxxlu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528836686 249508 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1528837567 117179 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528837670 180941 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-dstjcabalntbngzo JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528838379 222041 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:d128:85e7:92c2:207c JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528838652 786718 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528840066 311490 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zezm7he96qp8n6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528840750 877507 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1528840815 349655 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zezm7he96qp8n6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1528841337 333381 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528841417 47931 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528841968 225235 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ysaclist (77)
< 1528841968 973394 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :ysaclist (77): boily shachaf
< 1528842398 542014 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1528842516 663929 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528842532 305609 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528843527 708487 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1528844546 607383 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:d128:85e7:92c2:207c QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
< 1528845362 18162 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-dstjcabalntbngzo QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528845369 75851 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528846455 179941 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ebcfvqrltohcjprs JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528846544 259472 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528847168 199901 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar CYUL
< 1528847169 73119 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYUL 122300Z 23017G29KT 30SM FEW055 SCT200 OVC240 25/10 A2984 RMK SC1CS3CI5 SC TR SLP106 DENSITY ALT 1500FT
< 1528847361 290847 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528848219 170649 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1528849211 358517 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528849524 336375 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528850385 973965 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: Did I already ask you about monoidal categories with nontrivial scalars?
< 1528850411 723850 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than modules.
< 1528851628 145347 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: MASKED CHICKEN
< 1528851761 91529 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1528855725 356405 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528860555 614975 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55650&oldid=55646 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+614) 10
> 1528860587 626856 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Annoying Alice 2D14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55651&oldid=55650 5* 03Reddy Alice 5* (+35) 10
< 1528861791 655959 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a proof that all thue rules can be reduced to rules with only 3 symbols on either side of the separator?
< 1528861817 490563 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :or even, just two symbols?
< 1528863000 835364 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1528863156 881160 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.sourceforge.net
< 1528863214 581930 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you could do with just two symbols and use a tape head approach. i.e left and right moves would be formulated as OT -> TN and TO -> NT respectively.
< 1528863243 129714 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :where 'O' is the old symbol under the tape head, and 'N' is the newly written symbol.
< 1528863352 168267 :Slereah_!~Slereah@ALille-651-1-59-86.w2-5.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528865154 870042 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528865190 277957 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1528866086 535365 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bdpxinwkqsjdykkx QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1528866763 14195 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528867891 644474 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it a potential military threat that our prime minister has the power to make America's president go completely pineapples at will by saying something as innocuous as "we will not be pushed around"?
< 1528873191 348874 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1528874461 803707 :woo!9d21f193@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.157.33.241.147 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528874504 632815 :woo!9d21f193@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.157.33.241.147 PART :#esoteric
< 1528874967 903876 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zkadfbybivlnnfwb JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528876167 711846 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528877241 483538 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528877979 137622 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10New user account
> 1528878145 559302 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55652&oldid=55634 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+19) 10
> 1528878160 393867 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07=14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55653 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+418) 10Created page with "=  commands:  = if the thing being assigned is a place:     assign place with value(dec)/place value. if the thing being assigned is a value:     if the place value assigned r..."
< 1528878367 754770 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528878428 606412 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I destroyed my mobile phone. But I only have myself to blame for it. Now I have to survive with this bad spare phone I bought as a backup in december, plus look around for what phone I should buy, and I guess a protective foil for the display of this one.
< 1528878498 546687 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Darn, what's the name of this one, I need it to look up protective foil.
< 1528878612 952171 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ok, so first I have to copy my contact list to this phone.
< 1528878823 661680 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: rebooting
< 1528878998 690963 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528879185 562083 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PUBERTY14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55654&oldid=55633 5* 03Izumariu 5* (+6) 10
> 1528881365 152005 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Losescript14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55655 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+7665) 10Created page with "==Losescript== Losescript is a programming language that certainly makes you win in some golf contests(while if the questions change even if a bit, you will certainly lose). =..."
< 1528881449 290396 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a lot of copy-and-paste on that page
< 1528881471 554708 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I think it's all from Esolang itself, thus not a copyvio
< 1528881482 205278 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that said, it's been copied from the rendered version
< 1528882157 392266 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1528882350 799880 :shikhin!shikhin@lambdaos.org QUIT :Changing host
< 1528882350 884445 :shikhin!shikhin@unaffiliated/shikhin JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528882638 303730 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Derteckel 5*  10New user account
> 1528882902 15370 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55656&oldid=55652 5* 03Derteckel 5* (+159) 10/* Introductions */
< 1528883792 367531 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528888055 675888 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528890384 299319 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55657 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1138) 10All about `
< 1528892839 721997 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero
< 1528892959 553863 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528893081 166552 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10moved [[02Language list10]] to [[Category:`]]: I want people to see that there is another 1-instruction turing-taprit language.
> 1528893081 196779 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10moved [[02Talk:Language list10]] to [[Category talk:`]]: I want people to see that there is another 1-instruction turing-taprit language.
> 1528893201 644261 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10moved [[02Main Page10]] to [[%]]
> 1528893201 658806 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10moved [[02Talk:Main Page10]] to [[Talk:%]]
< 1528893367 646237 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zezm7he96qp8n6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528893558 487502 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
< 1528893731 240150 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528893778 688219 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zezm7he96qp8n6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1528893961 838210 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10moved [[02%10]] to [[Bob's blog]]
> 1528893961 865777 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5*  10moved [[02Talk:%10]] to [[Talk:Bob's blog]]
< 1528894193 648610 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528894449 84068 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528894616 370000 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10moved [[02Bob's blog10]] to [[Main Page]]
> 1528894616 378328 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10deleted "[[02Main Page10]]": Deleted to make way for move from "[[Bob's blog]]"
> 1528894649 458872 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/protect14]]4 protect10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10protected "[[Main Page [move=sysop] (indefinite)]]": high-risk pages need move-protection as regular users can't undo moves
> 1528894667 354479 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10moved [[02Talk:Bob's blog10]] to [[Talk:Main Page]]
> 1528894667 364054 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10deleted "[[02Talk:Main Page10]]": Deleted to make way for move from "[[Talk:Bob's blog]]"
> 1528894691 446731 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/protect14]]4 protect10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10protected "[[Talk:Main Page [move=sysop] (indefinite)]]": high-risk pages need move-protection as regular users can't undo moves
> 1528894728 546833 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move_redir10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10moved [[02Category:`10]] to [[Language list]] over redirect
> 1528894728 573592 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move_redir10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10moved [[02Category talk:`10]] to [[Talk:Language list]] over redirect
> 1528894728 585916 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete_redir10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10Ais523 deleted redirect [[02Language list10]] by overwriting: Deleted to make way for move from "[[Category:`]]"
> 1528894728 595590 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete_redir10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10Ais523 deleted redirect [[02Talk:Language list10]] by overwriting: Deleted to make way for move from "[[Category talk:`]]"
< 1528894740 801533 :esowiki!~esowiki@techne.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528894751 249958 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/protect14]]4 protect10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10protected "[[Language list [move=sysop] (indefinite)]]": high-risk pages need move-protection as regular users can't undo moves
> 1528894778 86076 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/protect14]]4 protect10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10protected "[[Talk:Language list [move=sysop] (indefinite)]]": high-risk pages need move-protection as regular users can't undo moves
< 1528894832 307633 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528894875 677604 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10deleted "[[02%10]]": Vandalism
> 1528894884 925816 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10deleted "[[02Talk:%10]]": Vandalism
< 1528895092 196040 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :any Esolang admins out there? I'm in the middle of an upgrade and someone starts doing pagemove vandalism :-(
< 1528895117 234288 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to send iamcalledbob a warning but because I'm in the middle of a release upgrade, programs are randomly stopping working, and that apparently includes my browser
< 1528895120 154209 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I haven't been able to send one yet
> 1528895231 503995 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Iamcalledbob14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55678 5* 03Ais523 5* (+547) 10warning: pagemove vandalism
< 1528895239 226325 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there we go
< 1528895263 811126 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is worth /one/ warning, but attempting that sort of vandalism in the future deserves a block, as it requires an admin to undo
< 1528895328 730543 :Cale_!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:9c9:b437:1d74:ecfe JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528895344 335027 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zkadfbybivlnnfwb QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
> 1528895576 290501 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55679&oldid=55678 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+144) 10/* Please be careful with high-visibility pages */
> 1528895671 90131 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55680&oldid=55679 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+17) 10/* Please be careful with high-visibility pages */
> 1528895728 85919 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55681&oldid=55680 5* 03Ais523 5* (+484) 10how to edit pages
< 1528895771 988659 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
< 1528895893 175690 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528896039 674650 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi wob_jonas
> 1528896434 397101 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55682&oldid=55657 5* 03B jonas 5* (+23) 10
< 1528896469 286117 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523
< 1528896481 865917 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah... those wiki edits were strange
< 1528896489 111964 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: I decided to work on that M:tG thing again
< 1528896496 568724 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh! nice
< 1528896498 439721 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm planning to write a whole site about it and have written two of the pages already
< 1528896511 614969 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice
< 1528896520 220816 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case I'll have to read and comment on it
< 1528896521 225418 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :specifically, a) an explanation of the deck used from the tournament point of view, b) the series of actions needed to get into the right gamestate
< 1528896524 344624 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'm going to change b) a bit
< 1528896529 103501 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could put it on the esolang wiki though
< 1528896535 480051 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that wiki is suitable for this sort of thing
< 1528896539 307170 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is probably best as an independent mini-site
< 1528896988 824944 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: nethack4.org/pastebin/b31dfab1-de3c-4c61-8402-07738b794487-maindeck.html.txt nethack4.org/pastebin/b31dfab1-de3c-4c61-8402-07738b794487-setup.html.txt (these are temporary links that won't stay up that long, and these are not the final versions of the files)
< 1528897063 490026 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528897079 158797 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55683&oldid=55676 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+8) 10
> 1528897130 814774 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55684&oldid=55681 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+24) 10
> 1528897203 124293 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55685&oldid=55683 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+17) 10
< 1528897306 674526 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION vaguely wonders how an attempt to add a language to the language list could end up with accidentally renaming the Main Page

< 1528897315 873327 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess if it doesn't happen again, though, we're OK
< 1528897329 944581 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and I put move-protection on the pages in question because there's basically no good reason to rename them)
> 1528897393 560114 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55686&oldid=55632 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+77) 10
< 1528897822 816741 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( and we all know elliott would have banned em already )
< 1528897848 235584 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, those old enough to remember when elliott was here
< 1528897860 525434 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I prefer to give at least one warning first
< 1528897880 309601 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, not many people know that moving a page twice requires admin cleanup if the first move was in error
< 1528897890 711916 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most of the people who do are trolls or otherwise trying to cause trouble
< 1528897897 714149 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so doing that on the Main Page, of all places, is a very suspicious thing to do
< 1528897931 397877 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess we'll see how the user turns out
> 1528898537 740681 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BF instruction minimalization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55687&oldid=51404 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+459) 10/* Iamcalledbob's attempt */
< 1528898629 556390 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is one of the bigger AEaaAP failures I've seen
< 1528898665 354027 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. merging [ and ] makes BF sub-TC as you can't do any control flow inside a loop
< 1528898721 345377 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and memory-mapping which of the various instructions you have is pretty much unusable as you can't use those instructions to get back to the memory-map location
< 1528898727 429966 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that latter thing is an interesting idea for an esolang, though
< 1528898735 48228 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :AEaaAP is not an acronym I can expand
> 1528898746 607031 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BF instruction minimalization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55688&oldid=55687 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-40) 10/* Iamcalledbob's attempt */
< 1528898770 89342 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: arbitrary effect at an arbitrary point
< 1528898778 820184 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, makes sense
< 1528898787 904338 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? AEaaAP
< 1528898789 59458 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :AEaaAP? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
> 1528898909 334885 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55689&oldid=55631 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+132) 10
< 1528898911 930544 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn AEaaAP stands for "arbitrary effect at an arbitrary point". It's one of the traditional requirements for Turing-completeness
< 1528898914 188296 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'aeaaap': AEaaAP stands for "arbitrary effect at an arbitrary point". It's one of the traditional requirements for Turing-completeness
> 1528898943 743600 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55690&oldid=55689 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+23) 10/* ` */
< 1528899014 736490 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: it's rather confusing that Recent Changes displays the Delete above the Move when doing it like that.
> 1528899023 385820 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55691&oldid=55690 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+22) 10/* LOLCODE */
> 1528899035 500326 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55692&oldid=55691 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1) 10/* Losescript */
< 1528899066 687113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: yes, the newest delete was newer than the newest move
< 1528899073 394881 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can be less confusing to turn enhanced recent changes off
< 1528899080 271190 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :`slwd aeaaap//s,$,.,
< 1528899082 116061 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :aeaaap//AEaaAP stands for "arbitrary effect at an arbitrary point". It's one of the traditional requirements for Turing-completeness.
< 1528899131 114176 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: um, i don't have enhanced recent changes.
< 1528899142 10461 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think it's the default nowadays?
< 1528899148 703335 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me try without to compare
< 1528899156 763954 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm saying it looks like you moved the page before deleting it.
< 1528899163 930367 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the target)
< 1528899190 873641 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called "Group changes by page in recent changes and watchlist" nowadays; if I turn that off, the delete correctly shows as happening before the move
< 1528899276 836383 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :not for me, huh.
< 1528899290 227634 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no
< 1528899291 985609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not for me either
< 1528899295 751136 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was confusing the delete and the protect
< 1528899322 855157 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's been ages since I've made any esolangs
< 1528899694 914879 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I wonder if I can argue that the I/D machine is a BF instruction minimalization?
< 1528899699 308331 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I is just +, after all
< 1528899710 204922 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and D doesn't look too out of place in a BF derivative
< 1528899720 970113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's probably one that has it already :-P
< 1528899782 334838 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( maybe all programming languages are actually BF derivatives )
< 1528899806 561250 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF is not a BF derivative :-P
< 1528899835 708610 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :P'' probably isn't either, but that may not be a programming language
< 1528899852 611024 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hear Gödel investigated closed time loops so don't be too sure.
< 1528899899 736943 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :historically the I/D machine was a RAM0 derivative
< 1528899912 760703 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm glad I was going around reading Wikipedia pages about obscure computational models :-)
< 1528899934 254534 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and RAM0 is 3 years older than BF)
< 1528899947 61706 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :P'' dates from 1964, though
< 1528899962 317593 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I/D looks pretty neat
< 1528899973 723532 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm going to have to check out the TC proof of it tonight
< 1528899984 350006 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's like three star programmer but a little easier
< 1528899987 402070 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :both to write in and to implement
< 1528900007 931487 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the previous girl genius update is pretty ominous. i suspect the dupree shit is about to hit the fan.
< 1528900015 548920 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although three star programmer is a little more powerful, in that it gives you more flexibility with how your programs work once you've figured out how to write them
< 1528900031 136305 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not today's)
> 1528900075 754618 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Classical CT14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55693 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+552) 10Created page with "==Commands== This is an extension of [[CT]].  {class_name[function_name ...] [function_name ...] lots of other functions...} It defines a class with a lot of functions, which..."
< 1528900229 21141 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :today's update is also ominous, mind you.
< 1528900257 242352 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but not for a main character.)
< 1528900316 958673 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: do real british academics have nicknames like that twh
> 1528900333 330654 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55694&oldid=55183 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+32) 10/* Brevity */
< 1528900343 604651 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: like what?
< 1528900361 590968 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :tobber and sleestak
< 1528900366 474721 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.girlgeniusonline.com/comic.php
> 1528900374 511243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55695&oldid=55694 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-32) 10/* Brevity */
< 1528900402 211469 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection
< 1528900414 530420 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528900430 653220 :Cale_!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:9c9:b437:1d74:ecfe QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1528900433 430576 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I rarely hear nicknames used here; thus I don't konw what they are
< 1528900448 314464 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*know
< 1528900453 549660 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay
> 1528900810 751542 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55696&oldid=55695 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+185) 10/* Purpose */
> 1528900930 817936 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55697&oldid=55696 5* 03Ais523 5* (-3) 10/* Purpose */ cleanup; note that most low-level esolangs are /not/ intentionally hard to read, they just ended up that way because the concepts are so alien
< 1528900963 336732 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only academic I know with a nickname is Dr Chris "Crispy Bacon" Crispin-Bailey
< 1528901008 280154 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does ais523 count as a nickname?
< 1528901032 519538 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess in IRC nomenclature it is
< 1528901034 470759 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you misspelled obfuscation hth
< 1528901050 182458 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although do people often refer to you as Alex "ais523" Smith?
> 1528901073 170734 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55698&oldid=55697 5* 03Ais523 5* (+0) 10/* Obfuscation */ fix typo in header
< 1528901077 233057 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: not often
< 1528901088 55846 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speed Demos Archive probably would, although they'd leave the "Dr" off
< 1528901183 367469 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION notes that the I/D machine compiles almost directly into Unreadable

< 1528901253 823673 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm right, internet nicknames would be it nowadays...
< 1528901261 19482 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, esolang idea I just had: a cross between BF and Subtractpocalypse; it's basically just + < - > with bignum cells, and attempting to decrement a cell below 0 restarts the program
< 1528901276 14904 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you cannot obviously compile Subtractpocalypse into this but it's pretty close
< 1528901357 907470 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can almost certainly remove < from it by having a finite-length tape that wraps (in fact, that probably makes it easier to program in rather than harder)
< 1528901403 942742 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…and by merging commands to give +> and - you have a two-command language which is probably TC
> 1528901438 667646 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55699&oldid=55698 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+10) 10/* Purpose */
< 1528901472 614118 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does the current Subtractpocalypse TCness proof ever reduce two counters in the same command? if not then this /is/ TC
< 1528901524 676381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unfortunately it does, I don't think it /has/ to, though
< 1528901563 10099 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I do get called "Taneb" in person sometimes
< 1528901570 487455 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly people I know from CS at uni
< 1528901586 163561 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: your nick's currently being shown in a color that's hard to read so I have to look at your comments to see who said them
< 1528901603 783205 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm terribly sorry
< 1528901605 644397 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I saw that comment, I was hoping it had been said by someone other than Taneb :-)
< 1528901616 905412 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D that'd be something
< 1528901633 820815 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(sorry for not typing those two comments at the same time, the first doesn't really make sense on its own, but I'm in the middle of a distro upgrade and it chose that moment to stop my keyboard working)
< 1528901659 247436 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it's OK)
< 1528901677 593735 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is an often-overlooked danger in using newline as a punctuation mark
< 1528901981 383977 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want to revert iamcalledbob's last edit but my intuition refuses.
< 1528902005 792822 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is it anxiety, whatever.
< 1528902044 246618 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh hm forgetting my email...
< 1528902051 907035 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't agree with removing minimalism altogether
> 1528902129 270037 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55700&oldid=55699 5* 03Ais523 5* (-10) 10Undo revision 55699 by Iamcalledbob; I disagree with many of these changes, e.g. minimalism and obfuscation are quite different in nature (languages are often reduced to few commands for reasons other than making them hard to read)
< 1528902142 917889 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor with merging it with obfuscation
< 1528902216 784609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, the distro update has finished so I'm going to reboot, hopefully the computer still works :-D
< 1528902224 451903 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :whee
< 1528902232 331573 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good luck
< 1528902236 855809 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: upgrade to a new Linux distribution finished, let's see if I can reboot into it
< 1528902532 92587 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Read error: No route to host
< 1528902645 979737 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528902748 912204 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...we've accidentally started using the worst chat client here
< 1528902757 762808 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bash comments in a shared tmux session
< 1528902993 256885 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that's worse than "talk" :)
< 1528903235 671982 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead of having nicks or whatever we just start with different amounts of whitespace
< 1528903291 244891 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :#                                                                      it scales really well.
< 1528903611 637898 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528903673 539971 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that didn't go so well
< 1528903690 241925 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least I managed to get a GUI desktop up, after about four tries
< 1528903726 866440 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'm running MATE because my normal desktop environment is crashing on login
< 1528903743 47776 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily this was already installed (I'm not sure how to connect to wifi from the terminal)
< 1528903848 815871 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other problem is that the mouse doesn't work on the login screen for some reason and my choice of login screen implementation apparently breaks when you try to change desktop environment with the keyboard
< 1528903876 425008 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I had to start a different one with the terminal…
< 1528903933 111684 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION does an update, then will try again

< 1528904784 223259 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528905180 774739 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zezm7he96qp8n6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528905687 866306 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1528905711 173256 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, time to try again
< 1528905718 758468 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: rebooting, hopefully it goes better this time…
< 1528906112 819481 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zezm7he96qp8n6.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
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< 1528906502 650022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit
< 1528907130 377707 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
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< 1528911157 124542 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1124
< 1528911157 830370 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist 1124: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas
< 1528911333 342121 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mruioccrkpfkjloh JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528913921 511989 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528916258 643305 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@c83-253-73-101.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528916258 717785 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@c83-253-73-101.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Changing host
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< 1528916693 41074 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :x86-64
< 1528916697 465693 :x86-64!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moonheart08
< 1528916699 558554 :moonheart08!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moony
< 1528916813 212838 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1528920256 678671 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528920451 714693 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Losescript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55701&oldid=55655 5* 03B jonas 5* (+24) 10
< 1528920532 869269 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'd just like to note that iamcalledbob also didn't follow the instructions specifically for avoiding spambot registrations: Introduce yourself says "write a short description (one or two sentences is enough) about what brings you to this wiki".
< 1528920582 860095 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor the part about "At the end of that description, sign your name by writing in "~~~~" (without quotes),"
< 1528920606 799193 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :should have banned him immediately for clearly being a spambot
< 1528920800 849505 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1528920875 708261 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Losescript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55702&oldid=55701 5* 03B jonas 5* (+5) 10
< 1528921953 571197 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" hmm, I wonder if I can argue that the I/D machine is a BF instruction minimalization? / and D doesn't look too out of place in a BF derivative / there's probably one that has it already :-P" : true. I think the \x7F command in Symbolic Brainfuck does that
< 1528922088 811119 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: hmm, didn't feel like a bot.
< 1528922110 907629 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes. bots are smarter.
< 1528922150 935378 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: why would a bot use an edit message that says "I want people to see that there is another 1-instruction turing-taprit language."
< 1528922200 569998 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, weird person... especially, since that move failed to do what they apparently wanted, why did they start moving other things around afterwards?
> 1528922328 860608 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07I/D machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55703&oldid=54537 5* 03B jonas 5* (+322) 10can be seen as a brainfuck derivative (thanks for noticing, ais523)
< 1528922400 101765 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the move didn't fail what they wanted. because of them spamming, several of us esolang wiki users are checking his edits for possible vandalism, so we noticed that yet another stupid language
< 1528922448 460245 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be unnoticed in the noise of stupid languages on the wiki otherwise, which new users come and create
< 1528922460 675785 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is sad especially because it gets hard to find the actually interesting languages among them
< 1528922829 435037 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Meh misguided and clueless is my assessment... don't get me wrong, this may be even *more* annoying than actual spam.
< 1528922875 960283 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly. we delete spam, but we leave all the bad esolangs up there, and the wiki gets full of that
< 1528922877 246879 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And it can easily drift off into vandalism, hard to draw a clear line.)
< 1528922891 630973 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I genuinely can't just browse the wiki to find random interesting esolangs
> 1528923619 965954 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Small14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55704&oldid=55010 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+482) 10Added compiler
< 1528924615 697863 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528925221 246991 :wob_jonas!b03f1945@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.25.69 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
< 1528925851 50304 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1528925855 680010 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1528926266 467128 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen people auto-generating things like rules for string rewriting systems. is there any literature on this? converting traditional imperative algorithms to rewrite relations?
< 1528926488 367634 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know many people have created things like BASIC to brainfuck compilers.
< 1528927875 317576 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:2166:119e:cda2:cb63 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528927879 533469 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:2166:119e:cda2:cb63 QUIT :Client Quit
> 1528930612 235340 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainpocalypse14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55705 5* 03Ais523 5* (+10304) 10new language!
> 1528930637 160192 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainpocalypse14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55706&oldid=55705 5* 03Ais523 5* (+18) 10/* Standard version */ class=wikitable
> 1528930679 698194 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55707&oldid=55685 5* 03Ais523 5* (+21) 10/* B */ +[[Brainpocalypse]]
> 1528930705 939952 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55708&oldid=55337 5* 03Ais523 5* (+20) 10+[[Brainpocalypse]]
< 1528931599 308512 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1528931795 581270 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/CHN2/text modeling a stack with a 3-symbol data alphabet.
< 1528931826 118325 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :this can probably be made shorter if I allowed just two symbols. it's pretty mechanical. I wonder if I can do head-juggling.
< 1528931880 166309 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that ::= just feeld wrong to me.
< 1528931886 940239 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :same.
< 1528931896 572287 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :should be -> or something.
< 1528931937 872538 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the benefit is you can have multiple stacks in tandem, doing work independently. exchanging things between instruction streams could probably happen.
< 1528931974 270686 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(especially since I've actually worked with string rewriting systems (aka semi-Thue systems))
< 1528932021 151690 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what context?
< 1528932031 995222 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rewriting :P
< 1528932055 21423 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an actual area of theoretical computer science.
< 1528932072 984387 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm aware, just wondered what you've dealt with.
< 1528932095 978521 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're deceptively simple.
< 1528932110 340008 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly confluence analysis (and mostly term rewriting systems, of which string rewriting is a special case)
< 1528932181 29446 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd think the other way around, tbh. in the end you're performing substitution rules on trees represented as strings, which in many cases is nested parens or path-based representations.
< 1528932202 188336 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, we're not :)
< 1528932213 685624 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(our terms are trees, not strings)
< 1528932226 636737 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :change my view, because you are. :P
< 1528932242 256253 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"we" did not encompass you, necessarily :)
< 1528932292 972174 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :in what world are strings a special case of terms? it's the other way around lmao.
< 1528932337 845852 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in "our" world, strings are terms built exclusively from unary function symbols (and one constant for the empty string).
< 1528932376 246470 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I admit that this is a bit strange.
< 1528932406 710317 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can take both views, I guess, depending on your vantage point, as terms admit a canonical representation that's stringy.
< 1528932413 284752 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it's much more strange to treat terms as strings, because that makes all operations on terms awkward.
< 1528932423 885752 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(to my mind, ymmv, etc)
< 1528932529 838827 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :dyck languages are a good fit for representing terms imho, because they admit easy pattern matching based on depth.
< 1528932533 27025 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i,i your mind may vary
< 1528932574 929395 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm wondering whether colorForth and ALGOL had a reasonable idea making color/bold part of the syntax.
< 1528932581 530564 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it does... it even shuts itself off for hours at a time!
< 1528932635 984472 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which, I think, is something I should have let it do about an hour ago, so good night)
< 1528932658 782310 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :night.
< 1528932682 878241 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but I was too busy with extracting bits from unfair dice... big waste of time :P)
< 1528932898 858165 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: if you've dealt with things like string rewriting, would you say that semi-thue systems are a special case of another class of string rewrite systems?
< 1528932986 143703 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my reasoning is that any system higher than thue-like introduces variables, which are an abstraction and not required.
< 1528933093 381951 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1528943299 584658 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07GetWhen14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55709 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+5370) 10created page about a horrible weirdlang
> 1528943330 312549 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:HereToAnnoy14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55710&oldid=55648 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+41) 10blah blah blah horrible weirdlang
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> 1528944228 812080 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55711&oldid=55682 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+111) 10/* Examples */
> 1528944257 791718 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55712&oldid=55711 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2) 10/* Turing-Completeness */
< 1528944735 725418 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
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< 1528945120 391393 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero
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> 1528946074 651998 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55713&oldid=55712 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+99) 10/* Commands */
> 1528948210 857806 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55714&oldid=55713 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2) 10/* Commands */
> 1528948224 619373 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55715&oldid=55714 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1) 10/* Commands */
> 1528948793 808410 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07`14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55716&oldid=55715 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+4) 10/* Commands */
< 1528949401 408830 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
> 1528951347 5384 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55717&oldid=54867 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+32) 10/* Survey */
> 1528951419 542000 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55718&oldid=55717 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+29) 10/* Survey */
< 1528951444 196850 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mruioccrkpfkjloh QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
> 1528951983 434596 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07$14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55719 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1366) 10Created page with "[[$]] ==Explanation== There is only 1 command, $. A place only has numbers. If anything is assigned to cell number 0, print the ASCII value out. Like:  2313132 A number has "+..."
> 1528952013 926909 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55720&oldid=55707 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+8) 10
> 1528952046 108140 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55721&oldid=55718 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+53) 10/* Survey */
> 1528952090 121220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55722&oldid=55720 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+17) 10/* F */
> 1528952104 727121 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55723&oldid=55722 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-17) 10/* F */
> 1528954144 6760 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BF instruction minimalization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55724&oldid=55688 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+169) 10/* Iamcalledbob's attempt */
< 1528954911 301662 :fractal_!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1528955278 414448 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Losescript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55725&oldid=55702 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+31) 10/* Turing-completeness */
> 1528955315 946197 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Losescript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55726&oldid=55725 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-1) 10/* Turing-completeness */
< 1528958244 293529 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1528960230 139014 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55727 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+157) 10Created page with "I discovered that the Befunge program 9482350042>\#+:#*9-#\_$.@ 's output turns out to be 105260548 .  My password is :12345678 My username is : Iamcalledbob"
> 1528960262 580359 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55728&oldid=55727 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+10) 10
> 1528960394 780854 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BF instruction minimalization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55729&oldid=55724 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-1) 10/* Iamcalledbob's attempt */
> 1528960752 558653 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55730&oldid=55728 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1035) 10
> 1528960783 684877 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55731&oldid=55730 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+12) 10
> 1528960874 368414 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55732&oldid=55731 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+92) 10
> 1528960985 143653 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55733&oldid=55732 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+137) 10
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> 1528961492 239333 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55734&oldid=55733 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+146) 10
< 1528961562 680119 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528961965 36774 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07(14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55735 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+394) 10Created page with "==(== ===( is a deprivative of $ that only works when the current user is dead.=== ===This makes it impossible to use.=== ==Computability(Halting problem)== ===If the user is..."
> 1528962022 26020 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55736&oldid=55686 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+69) 10
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> 1528968823 876514 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Underload14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55737&oldid=53509 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (-19) 10Using Wayback for this purpose seems slightly wasteful or misguided or something
> 1528969487 359322 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55738 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+436) 10Created page with "==ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE== ==Commands== {| class="wikitable" |- ! Alphabet numbers !! controls | 1 || input a string and push it onto the stack |- | 2 || clear the next..."
> 1528969551 34563 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55739&oldid=55723 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+36) 10/* O */
> 1528969589 360310 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55740&oldid=55738 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+28) 10
> 1528969641 557386 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55741&oldid=55740 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+11) 10
> 1528969672 406707 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55742&oldid=55741 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+17) 10/* Hello,world */
> 1528969708 87956 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55743&oldid=55742 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+11) 10/* Hello,world */
> 1528970430 196204 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brainpocalypse14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55744 5* 03Keymaker 5* (+2211) 10Some thoughts.
> 1528970646 606962 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ON THE WAY TO WHO KNOWS WHERE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55745&oldid=55743 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+221) 10/* Commands */
< 1528971179 669951 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528972151 632335 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528972457 956321 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subtractpocalypse14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55746&oldid=55515 5* 03Keymaker 5* (+1951) 10Added Sub to MM translation example.
> 1528973400 338609 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category talk:201814]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55747 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+252) 10There appears to be a eird technical issue with this category page?
> 1528973555 888168 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[072D-BCT14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55748 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2149) 10Created page with "==2D-BCT== I want to design a language that includes all the purposes of an esolang. ==BCT== A '''BCT program''' is any finite string of bits (commands), executed as follows:..."
> 1528973582 979721 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55749&oldid=55700 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+4) 10/* Brevity */
> 1528973801 148802 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55750&oldid=55749 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+0) 10/* Brevity */
> 1528973814 604215 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55751&oldid=55750 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+0) 10/* Brevity */
> 1528973831 722715 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55752&oldid=55751 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-4) 10/* Brevity */
< 1528973860 789469 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: FEELING CHICKEN
< 1528975753 767525 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528976358 538150 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Expload14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55753&oldid=34973 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+1852) 10Thoughts from re-reading this article
< 1528976877 646177 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528977558 658103 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07The Waterfall Model14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55754&oldid=54312 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (-2) 10The article includes an implementation, so, move from Unimplemented to Implemented category
> 1528979154 151816 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55755&oldid=55754 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+181) 10Add summary that hopefully makes it clear what a zeroing trigger actually does.
> 1528979839 568372 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brianfuck14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55756 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2051) 10Created page with "==Brianfuck== ==Brainfuck Info== Brainfuck operates on an array of memory cells, also referred to as the [[tape]], each initially set to zero. There is a [[pointer]], initiall..."
> 1528979862 403009 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brianfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55757&oldid=55756 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+0) 10/* In all of the questions, Brianfuck has only 1 byte, but Flogscript has a lot. */
> 1528979905 994534 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brianfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55758&oldid=55757 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+31) 10
> 1528980011 671979 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55759&oldid=54320 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+548) 10Wondering if I've missed something re the declared undefined behaviour
< 1528980184 999800 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528980198 147253 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi guys, I have two questions
< 1528980201 937512 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one actual, and one esoteric
< 1528980469 816886 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Windows, the taskbar buttons used to have a different background color for minimized windows than for restored windows. but apparently for windows 10, or at least this windows 10 machine, that isn't the case.
< 1528980591 272735 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is very annoying, and I don't know how to change it. I've set the option "settings / personalization / colors / more options / show accent color on the following surfaces / start, taskbar, and action center", which recolors the taskbar buttons from black to colored, but that doesn't fix this.
< 1528980664 39627 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, some of the taskbar buttons have a slightly lighter backround, but I can't figure out what that means
> 1528980733 595644 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55760&oldid=55759 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+738) 10
> 1528980887 227607 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55761&oldid=55760 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+238) 10
< 1528981231 699600 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528981410 306426 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55762&oldid=55736 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+0) 10/* General languages */
< 1528981732 243269 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:e056:7a64:499a:b38f JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528981857 416251 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1528981974 252543 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528982394 292149 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528982895 213040 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528983011 365112 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Equipage14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55763&oldid=55625 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+3997) 10Import some description from its README (which I wrote and which is also in the public domain anyway.) Remove 'stub' macro.
< 1528983021 270669 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1528983029 935188 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude
< 1528983078 18289 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :" in "our" world, strings are terms built exclusively from unary function symbols (and one constant for the empty string)." => exactly, in my world too. strings are inconvenient, and for a long time I didn't understand why everyone in mathematics didn't just work with tree-like terms,
< 1528983094 57365 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the string representation being mostly irrelevant and a job for computer stuff. but later I realized why:
< 1528983162 767884 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need the strings themselves for bootstrapping of Godel numbering if you want to prove that there are undecidable *arithmetic* statements using the natural numbers and addition and multiplication and equality and first-order logic
< 1528983227 464535 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because even that way (and even if you enable to power operation), translating loops to first-order statements on arithmetic is the hard part, and looping on a string you can just barely manage and stay in delta-zero or whatever that thing is,
< 1528983236 13248 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but looping on a tree would be impossible directly.
< 1528983258 971874 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh... I don't know the details, I don't have them swapped in my head right now, but the point is,
< 1528983268 4899 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a good reason why sometimes you have to consider strings,
< 1528983279 64802 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though normally you prefer a term to mean tree-like stuff
< 1528983644 865539 :xificurC!c3628305@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.195.98.131.5 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528983739 718256 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528983779 298386 :xificurC!c3628305@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.195.98.131.5 PART :#esoteric
> 1528983842 934531 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PLEASE14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55764 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1103) 10Created page with "[[$]] ==Explanation== There is only 1 command, assign. A place only has numbers. If anything is assigned to cell number 0, print the ASCII value out. Like:  2313132 A number h..."
> 1528983880 575761 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PLEASE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55765&oldid=55764 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+14) 10/* Turing-Completeness */
> 1528984131 400366 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brianfuck14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55766 5* 03ZM 5* (+276) 10Created page with "==Duplicate title==  Small hint: when creating a page, it is unnecessary to include a header with the page name at the beginning as this is included automatically by MediaWiki..."
> 1528984377 486214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55767&oldid=55761 5* 03B jonas 5* (+664) 10/* Waterclocks over the reals */
< 1528984581 291402 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1528984758 247727 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Equipage => I think this one is probably Turing-complete. You can probably translate Underload to this.
< 1528984779 516891 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm wait no
< 1528984785 178969 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I was thinking of won't work
< 1528984804 107937 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need some tricky way to build quoted functions
< 1528984851 607636 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably with a number of fixed functions on the top of the stack all the time
< 1528984864 253370 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not sure how you'd bootstrap some trees or something
< 1528984887 84810 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528984949 72619 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn, I think I have an idea for that one, but I'd have to reduce a very small subset of Consumer Society into it
< 1528984971 805741 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I could only simulate a turing machine with one tape that way
< 1528984976 675824 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't see how I could do better than that
< 1528985011 786911 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should instead try a negative proof
< 1528985029 628835 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :proving that there are certain interesting things that the language can't do but that you expect such a language to do
< 1528985450 75421 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1528985789 274112 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55768&oldid=55767 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+674) 10
< 1528986234 699313 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528986612 488639 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528987247 392093 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55769&oldid=55768 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+224) 10
> 1528987592 544916 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55770&oldid=55721 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-1) 10/* Survey */ typo
> 1528987872 922428 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55771&oldid=55769 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+85) 10parenthetical addendum
< 1528987883 345219 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no second question by the way, I solved it by searching the internet for the right terms
< 1528987896 881333 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't solved the first one, about the windows taskbar
> 1528987909 167266 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55772&oldid=55771 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (-4) 10
> 1528988063 572603 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55773&oldid=55772 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (-1) 10
> 1528988392 935759 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55774&oldid=55773 5* 03B jonas 5* (+470) 10/* Waterclocks over the reals */
> 1528988443 129010 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55775&oldid=55774 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+235) 10
> 1528988614 83564 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category:201814]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55776&oldid=53928 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+1) 10Dummy edit to bump cache
> 1528988703 547587 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category talk:201814]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55777&oldid=55747 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+346) 10Known bug
< 1528990461 583041 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, just made a string rewriting interpreter that supports comments. going to have it support variable delimiters too.
< 1528990532 933899 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: do you mean an interpreter that interprets a string-rewriting language, or an interpreter implemented in a string-rewriting language?
< 1528990544 42379 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :interpreter that interprets a string rewriting language.
< 1528990558 880838 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that's easier
< 1528990562 997998 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that it is. :P
< 1528990614 850478 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the interface of my spare phone is so counter-intuitive, I already hate it, and I've barely used it
< 1528990637 572023 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to look for a better phone
< 1528990648 394167 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :comments are just lines that don't contain the delimiter, and I'm thinking of having the top two lines define the delimiter for each of the rules and the end of the rules.
< 1528990839 115183 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1528990981 813635 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :did they even do proper user interface testing for this, where a good software tester guy uses this phone in practice for weeks and writes down everything that should be changed?
< 1528990996 203805 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't make phones the way they used to anymore
< 1528991334 414031 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528991468 127622 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : you need some tricky way to build quoted functions <-- indeed, the functions seem to be mostly of the form "push X to", but no way to iterate it.
< 1528991547 790367 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*to stack
> 1528991569 321375 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainpocalypse14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55778&oldid=55706 5* 03Ais523 5* (+271) 10/* Commands and syntax */ explain halt behaviour explicitly
< 1528991606 803113 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I think I'll be able to construct a proof. I have an idea. but I have to get back to that later, I'm busy with other stuff now.
< 1528991612 634756 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but having all of them permanently in a know position on the stack might get around it like you said.
< 1528991616 260250 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*known
< 1528991742 696677 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and pick can pick from bottom, that helps
< 1528991793 649432 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: so you can put your fixed functions there instead of at the top
< 1528992477 450866 :Elronnd\srn!elronnd@slashem.me QUIT :Quit: leaving
> 1528992708 778709 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Brainpocalypse14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55779&oldid=55744 5* 03Ais523 5* (+3164) 10r to Keymaker
< 1528992831 223006 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it can pick from the bottom of the stack for negative values? that makes it way too easy
< 1528992832 920957 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn
< 1528992838 477562 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't notice that
< 1528992858 90705 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I have a solution for picking from the top only though
< 1528992888 176088 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although I'm not really sure it works
> 1528992898 547925 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category talk:201814]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55780&oldid=55777 5* 03Ais523 5* (+355) 10https vs. http
< 1528992919 629210 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1528992972 753216 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think the instructions -%\ aren't even necessary
< 1528993006 473578 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need !:.~ for everything, and 1+ to make numbers for ~
< 1528993022 406792 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and $ is useful too, because we often need to discard
< 1528993039 241362 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :still, it's an ugly model to work with
< 1528993059 167556 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I'll be able to do more than a tape
< 1528993144 500255 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
> 1528993493 765614 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55781&oldid=55775 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1997) 10/* Undefined behavior */ explain
> 1528993772 706673 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55782&oldid=55781 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+501) 10
> 1528993818 519329 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55783&oldid=55782 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1044) 10/* Waterclocks over the reals */ (ec) replies
> 1528994433 625458 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Chronofuck14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55784 5* 03Jabutosama 5* (+1427) 10created the page
< 1528994530 931656 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/UZpd/python https://ptpb.pw/g_93/text
< 1528994544 621552 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my interpreter and a sample program. not quite thue, but good enough.
> 1528994545 747541 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Chronofuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55785&oldid=55784 5* 03Jabutosama 5* (+87) 10
< 1528994780 869330 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the next thing to do is work on getting a minimal state machine working, then I can translate line-numbers to states.
< 1528994867 217521 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially, I want certain rules to apply when we're in a certain state. the problem is that I want to take any given set of rules (within a reasonable range) and be able to either prefix or postfix or do some simple modification to them to make them run sequentially based on conditions.
< 1528994949 498232 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'd like to translate this whole thing to a queue problem so I don't have to continually start over in my pattern search, but I'm having a hard time getting it to halt, considering the result for "no pattern matched" is to dequeue and requeue a symbol, rather than fail.
< 1528994971 17742 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling I can do it by just using a marker on the queue, but the signalling involved gets weird.
< 1528995653 703770 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1528997517 707494 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1528998366 787373 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55786&oldid=55555 5* 03Truttle1 5* (+55) 10Added AsciiDots
< 1528998398 537011 :LKoen!~LKoen@2a01:e35:2eed:a430:e056:7a64:499a:b38f QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
< 1528998443 58268 :Kai_Bruneji!~kvirc@62.33.194.66 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528998713 223488 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528998755 802910 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1528998877 711080 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
> 1528999117 362190 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PUBERTY14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55787&oldid=55654 5* 03Izumariu 5* (+453) 10Added truth machine example and added wiki links to the examples
< 1528999300 711555 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1528999331 732319 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1528999855 197644 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Neg14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55788&oldid=53755 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+48) 10fsm i hate all of my languages
< 1529000718 263281 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529001670 140922 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529001732 897385 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07GetWhen14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55789&oldid=55709 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+1239) 10Added line number system (creating superpositions, yay). Hopefully this makes the language just a bit esoteric from the when function.
< 1529001749 2878 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :DARN IT!
< 1529001755 962741 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this phone is so annoying I have to rant about it
< 1529001793 929620 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm still experimenting with it, so there's a lot I don't know, but there's a lot of annoying things I found already that I must rant to you now
< 1529001847 345458 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd tell you what phone it is, but I'm not sure, because I forgot and the fucking type number isn't written anywhere on it, not even on the label under the battery, nor in the UI
< 1529001868 694773 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's a Nokia non-smartphone but I don't know the number
< 1529001874 11207 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway
> 1529001909 856598 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55790&oldid=55739 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+14) 10/* G */
< 1529001944 40767 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :firstly, I still haven't discovered a safe button sequence without timeouts that takes me to the home screen from most states, including when the phone is locked.
< 1529001995 38117 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the R button seems safe anywhere (except during a call that it hangs up), and it's a good start, but it can take you to one of *four* states, one of which decay into a fifth state by timeout, and I'm not sure how to proceed from that
< 1529002010 357718 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll have to make a table of the state automaton to figure this one out
< 1529002017 685372 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's too complicated to solve in my head
< 1529002038 315689 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and one of the four states decays into one other of the fourth state by timeout)
< 1529002063 73810 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd like a short sequence, but prefer one that includes optional timeouts between most button presses in it, so I can take a pause during in most places
< 1529002096 164866 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(you can't take a pause anywhere, and for a good reason, becuase from the locked state you can't get into the unlocked state with single presses with pauses between, which is good design)
< 1529002107 583684 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'd like a sequence with no mandatory timeouts
< 1529002152 852044 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this is not obvious, because one of the states is the home screen, which has almost every button bound to do something, only the P button goes back to the home screen
< 1529002166 405439 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1529002168 931486 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even the P button
< 1529002174 580116 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the home screen, EVERY button does something
< 1529002186 445884 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, goes to some other state
< 1529002210 118249 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not necessarily something harmful, but goes to some state that I have to consider
< 1529002223 428773 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll definitely need a state map
< 1529002241 159811 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'll get back to this when I mapped all the states, but for now, other stuff
< 1529002253 184866 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. the music player
< 1529002271 191613 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I expected to find a functional music player in this phone. the description when I bought said it had one.
< 1529002295 681364 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it can play the mp3s from my SD card, but the media player is so messed up it's completely unusable for me
< 1529002297 832303 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me tell you why
< 1529002317 926205 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the worst part is that it won't play albums in order
< 1529002357 145943 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it apparently ignores the album and track number metadata in the file entirely, which is a good thing because some of the files I have on it aren't encoded by me and don't have it filled correctly
< 1529002379 75279 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead it lists music by directory, in some tree order on the file system
< 1529002380 670397 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is good
< 1529002385 219028 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that puts albums together
< 1529002402 423258 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT THE ORDER OF THE TRACKS IN A DIRECTORY seems to follow no logic I can discover
< 1529002417 240535 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some directories it's in order, in some there are ordered parts, in some it's completely jumbled
< 1529002423 983556 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I swear I have good filenames
< 1529002452 956809 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some directories, the filenames actually only differ in three digits, and you'd just have to sort by those. there's no way to mess up sorting in that directory if you sort by filename.
< 1529002501 297193 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the files in that directory show up in the correct order if I view them in the file browser of the phone, but I can't play music from there: actually you sort of can, but it only plays one file and won't continue to other files in any way if you do that
< 1529002515 418462 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in the music player app, the files in that directory show up in some apparently random order
< 1529002533 985391 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's also not the track number, because I created these files myself and filled the track number and other metadata well
< 1529002549 692757 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't create playlists or reorder the playlist or anything as far as I can tell
< 1529002561 474230 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's just no absolutely no way to play a fucking album in order
< 1529002608 530513 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other problem is that you can't easily play music in the background, while doing something else
< 1529002666 327195 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you sort of almost can, but it messes up the home screen, hijacking seven of the important buttons as media player controls, which makes the phone almost impossible to use
< 1529002747 681596 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I haven't even considered those states in the automaton in my head, darn it. that complicates the states even more.
< 1529002779 935042 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's at least two more states that the R key can take you, I think
< 1529002786 132904 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. SMS
< 1529002805 896891 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't played much with this, but there's one thing I discovered
< 1529002923 634884 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you start to write an SMS, accidentally put a single digit in the To field (which is supposed to have the phone number top send to), then in the Content field, you accidentally press G or E, which would normally send the message, then the phone tries to send the message and fails because the recipient is invalid. so far this sounds ok.
< 1529002960 613239 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but when the message is failed to be sent, it goes into a libo state where I can view the first pageful or delete, but as far as I can see, there's no way to continue editing or view the rest of the text or anything.
< 1529003012 903295 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the messages application main screen has a list of conversations (grouped by phone number) with all sorts mixed (sent, draft, incoming),
< 1529003068 586457 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then if you choose one of those, you get into this horrible bubble view where you see each SMS (whether sent, incoming, or draft) in the conversation as this speech bubble thing, and when you select one, you have to press E to view its full text and metadata,
< 1529003101 776260 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for messages that were failed to send, E resends the message, which fails again, and there's nothing else you can do to recover from that state other then delete the message.
< 1529003146 999041 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so basically, one wrong button press in the To field (you obviously don't enter a valid recipient there, because then you can accidentally send the message early) and then one wrong buttonn press while typing the message, and you're screwed.
> 1529003218 239160 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07GetWhen14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55791&oldid=55789 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+78) 10typos & minor tweaks
< 1529003219 760282 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least if you actually leave the To field empty, then when you accidentally try to send (with E or G in the content field while composing), it actually just shows an error message and lets you continue editing
< 1529003246 679062 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but mind you, that error message takes your cursor to the To field which you'll then accidentally fill with a digit
< 1529003262 121362 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's not even hard to carelessly enter the limbo state
< 1529003268 872662 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you
< 1529003302 49971 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do these people even know how ui testing works? just give the phone to a power user for two weeks and he'll tell you half of this
< 1529003332 521513 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's more but I haven't discovered everything yet
< 1529003342 748681 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :these are just the highlights
< 1529003494 172351 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I understand why the type number isn't written anywhere, not even under the battery as it normally is with sane phones
< 1529003499 143051 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't want people to write bad reviews
< 1529003509 128465 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can't really if you can't tell what phone it is you're reviewing
< 1529003535 94680 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think it's a Nokia 216, but I can't swear on that. I've bought it 7 months ago just to have a spare and thrown away the box.)
> 1529003577 206731 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55792&oldid=55786 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+504) 10added GetWhen
< 1529003587 233157 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait
< 1529003589 406902 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ping
< 1529003590 55148 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pong
< 1529003598 675669 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :4. time setting
< 1529003689 975389 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the menu for setting the current time and date, there's an entry saying "Auto-update time". if you turn it on, it hides all the other settings in that menu, so you can't set the clock. I don't know why.
< 1529003718 930597 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's trying to get the time from the internet, but I don't have an internet connection enabled or something, and it doesn't actually get the correct time without or anything.
< 1529003756 11349 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but seriously, it even hides the option for 12 hour versus 24 hour and the time zone, I have no idea why.
< 1529003759 524885 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I turn that option off.
< 1529003768 67010 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm trying to set the time
< 1529003772 31755 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the menu entries are:
< 1529003776 847438 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. Auto-update time
< 1529003781 170805 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. time zone
< 1529003783 504891 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :3. time
< 1529003788 695807 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :4. time format (24 hour)
< 1529003792 751501 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :5 date
< 1529003802 45562 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :6. show date and time
< 1529003807 977271 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 and 5 works, I can set the time and date
< 1529003883 660556 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 is strange, it might be working or it might not: it displays some list of timezones, including "GMT +1 Paris", "GMT +2 Cairo", "GMT +2 Athens" etc
< 1529003896 242696 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but nowhere is the daylight saving mentioned
< 1529003910 614409 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't tell anywhere that I'm supposed to be in +0200 now if I set to "GMT +1 Paris"
< 1529003917 644065 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't tell UTC time anywhere
< 1529003927 55635 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what timezone it uses and whether it will adjust DST
< 1529003957 281007 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it even has all timezones (with dst settings) that it should, but has redundant timezones
< 1529004077 37894 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, it does have all timezones
< 1529004082 91814 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just with really strange names I can't recognize
< 1529004147 114730 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Reykyavik timezone (always +0000) is called "GMT Casablanca", the London timezone is "GMT London", the Paris timezone is "GMT +1 Paris" and "GMT +1 Rome" and GMT +1 Warsaw" and "GMT +1 Berlin" (aren't those all the same now?)
< 1529004220 998401 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then the Bucharest timezone is "GMT +2 Helsinki", that's fine
< 1529004341 986922 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then there's "GMT +2 Cairo"
< 1529004357 987848 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, I think it has all big timezones, but it doesn't seem to have a way to turn off DST changing for some offsets
< 1529004381 445325 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's only three -0500 base offset timezones, and all three have DST
< 1529004467 211562 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means it actually doesn't have the timezone for -0500 no DST, which is used in Jamaica
< 1529004474 542074 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that I want to travel there, but strange timezone list
< 1529004543 492275 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the one in Bolivia, which has a DST. the three -5 timezones listed are "GMT -5 Washington D.C.", "GMT -5 Toronto", "GMT -5 New York",
< 1529004602 128895 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are all three the same timezones, the New York one
< 1529004613 874961 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even know if this phone even does DST adjustments
< 1529004624 462532 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if it doesn't, then why is there even a "time zone" setting?
< 1529004631 844704 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't display the time zone or UTC time anywhere,
< 1529004649 352035 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and since my SD card uses the FAT file system, by custom it stores only local times
< 1529004659 860150 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I have no idea how it will behave at the DST change date
< 1529004890 225527 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the time setting is annoying by the way, because you can only set the clock to a specific minute, but if you wait a minute on that screen in this phone, it darkens the screen and the first button press won't accept the time setting, so you're screwed if you don't keep pressing buttons
< 1529004898 813148 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's not specific to this phone, it happens on many devices
< 1529004937 760111 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just met it too many times because the phone is still new and I've been removing the battery several times and have to set the clock every time after it
< 1529004965 413753 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because if the battery is removed even for a second, then the internal clock no longer keep the time, it stops
< 1529004969 770876 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fuck you
< 1529004985 490884 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529004986 630577 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, that one is hard to fix
< 1529004995 20339 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :electrically
< 1529005249 491170 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529005642 404466 :choochter!choochter@nat/ibm/x-zzvopyntvtiamrde QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529005653 272737 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :5. on the plus side, this one charges from that type of USB connector that most phones do these days
< 1529005669 692688 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can get rid of one more special charger type
< 1529005674 91470 :choochter!choochter@nat/ibm/x-oxadrewxjmuobnzd JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529005685 506853 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my previous phone used a cylindrical charger plug
< 1529005694 867933 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I only have four types of chargers:
< 1529005724 987405 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the normal USB stuff for this phone and the bluetooth microphone (and probably future small devices too, like a better phone),
< 1529005734 163063 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other USB stuff for my camera
< 1529005739 738501 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't know the names of these)
< 1529005754 399639 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus a special one for the electric toothbrush and a special one for the shaver
< 1529005767 314629 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the latter two have serious waterproofing requirements
< 1529005782 943190 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the both allow charging while wet
< 1529005805 854192 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so they can't use normal plugs
< 1529006799 725899 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529007327 994479 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi ais523
< 1529007334 771880 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1529007353 296093 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just ranted about the UI of my new phone, and I haven't even discovered most of it. you can logread if you want, but it's a rant, hard to read
< 1529007356 335431 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have any feedback on my M:tG stuff so far?
< 1529007365 695647 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, did you give me a link?
< 1529007369 110150 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't read what you've written
< 1529007379 325356 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I supposed to have found the link to the M:tG stuff?
< 1529007380 512012 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did, let me try to find it in the logs so that I can relink it
< 1529007392 142452 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :either that or I tried to send it but it didn't go through for some reason
< 1529007394 399864 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could link it from the esowiki somewhere at least
< 1529007407 251320 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it was only in irc, I might have missed it
< 1529007422 657245 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[Wednesday, 13 June 2018] [14:36:28 BST]  wob_jonas: nethack4.org/pastebin/b31dfab1-de3c-4c61-8402-07738b794487-maindeck.html.txt nethack4.org/pastebin/b31dfab1-de3c-4c61-8402-07738b794487-setup.html.txt (these are temporary links that won't stay up that long, and these are not the final versions of the files)
< 1529007432 448265 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want to be linking to temporary versions on the esowiki
< 1529007441 95932 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a work in progress and I don't want people advertising it everywhere until it's done
< 1529007492 650612 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529007532 902512 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I must have missed that, I didn't read the logs of #esoteric carefully in a few days because I was very busy
< 1529007539 454960 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still am, but whatever
< 1529007840 214614 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection
< 1529007852 474388 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529007895 643493 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I will look at these two
< 1529007988 329271 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"it means that you can't pull this off in a tournament (where the opponent is unlikely to have the deck you need or to cooperate in setting the gamestate up), which in turn means that you can't mess around with the Tournament Rules (which contain things like infinite loop handling, and thus are very relevant for this sort of work)."
< 1529007997 491453 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :AFK for a bit
< 1529008020 116726 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't quite like this game sentence in the introduction. I know what you mean but only because of earlier context from our discussions.
< 1529008033 853653 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The problem is that these are two different things that this statement doesn't explain.
< 1529008078 824959 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1. you can't pull this off in a tournament. ok, but at this point (and for very long in the text) as a reader I won't believe that there's any such setup that you can pull off in a tournament, so it's not obvious what contrast you're talking here,
< 1529008088 795205 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what you're trying to explain, but you'r conflating it with
< 1529008096 534487 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2. you can't mess around with the Tournament Rules
< 1529008107 278809 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that's a reasonable implication or equivalence
< 1529008130 460122 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can use the the Tournament rules anywhere
< 1529008151 924228 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a reasonable base even for unsanctioned tournaments, for which you just ignore the sections about DCI number and whatever
< 1529008170 485117 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a good framework so you might use some of its rules even at home or something
< 1529008184 481644 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they might be relevant or not, but that's a separate question
< 1529008189 982390 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't put them in the same sentence
< 1529008311 375410 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can mention "you can't pull this off in a tournament", but that's a big deal that's normally obvious, you can normally never pull off these sorts of things in a tournament
< 1529008331 235164 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you want to challenge that assumption, but you have to write that in a clear positive sentence at first, not in this long mess
< 1529008349 402723 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not together with the Tournament rules
< 1529008452 51007 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"However, our only changes are to the sideboard: our sixty maindeck cards are exactly the same." wow
< 1529008473 212772 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :last I've heard of this project, I think that wasn't yet the case. you had a few customizations in the main deck
< 1529008567 319032 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ARGH I'm stuck in stack mode, with too many things I start and can't finish anything
< 1529008577 70296 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :back
< 1529008579 181450 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm stuck reading this interesting M:tG document
< 1529008600 114555 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The core of Omni-Tell" this heading section is nice well written
< 1529008613 25966 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "About Omni-Tell" heading section too
< 1529008687 296959 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow
< 1529008727 857104 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"The maindeck has no way to generate mana except via using its lands, and needs three mana [...] This requires a minimum of two lands"
< 1529008758 727209 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is absolutely true and the next part explains it, but totally alien for me, because in formats other than legacy and vintage, lands that produce two mana early just aren't a thing
< 1529008765 232253 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gzfaeydycvwqvrlc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529008772 863138 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are storage lands, but you won't use them early in a practical deck
< 1529008794 845530 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"a double-colourless source like Ancient Tomb or City of Traitors" clears it up right away though
< 1529008799 237157 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529008816 648171 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lands that produce {2} mostly only show up in Legacy combo decks
< 1529008835 108826 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you are aiming for such a double-take, you might want to mention double lands before that sentence
< 1529008837 841917 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that and the urzatron but it's a special case
< 1529008854 604826 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but I'm thinking of early turns
< 1529008867 399267 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :urzatron and storage lands are fine, but if you only have lands, you won't pull that off early
< 1529008880 288031 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that sentence seems to imply that this is in the early turns
< 1529008913 950882 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you won't have early Llanowar Elves or Arbor Elves or any of that stuff I use
< 1529008942 997241 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor one of the few one mana cost artifacts that give a third mana in second turn
< 1529008948 855660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Modern players out there are probably doing a double-take upon seeing a basic Island :-)
< 1529008948 873827 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529008960 738281 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529009057 756300 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't, I play basic lands, and I think there are some standard formats with no lands with Island or Plains etc type other than those, but some lands or spells that search for a basic land type (or search for a basic land), in which case people include just a few in their deck
< 1529009068 476710 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or doesn't standard sometimes work like that?
< 1529009084 489190 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :effects that search for basics specifically are rare
< 1529009094 589206 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least in tournaments
< 1529009095 772054 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :effects that search for basic land types are common but there are plenty of good nonbasic lands which have the types
< 1529009112 306509 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, "search for a Forest" or "search for a Plains"
< 1529009134 292838 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a few good ones, but are they reprinted often enough to always be in the standard?
< 1529009134 483702 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION finds a Temple Garden

< 1529009153 90907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Standard you often have to look for basics
< 1529009163 149679 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the last time there were good land searching effects, there were good-enough dual lands too
< 1529009170 164881 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are only like six nonbasic cycles like that I think, not counting the Limited ones which will never be reprinted, and a few are bad for tournaments
< 1529009187 983898 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, so there aren't always good land searching effects?
< 1529009206 537386 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was a bit of a mess, because there were lots of three-color cards (with an ally+two enemy pairs among the three colors), but the basic-land-type lands were ally-colored
< 1529009220 874099 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good enough for a tournament that is?
< 1529009231 658505 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or perhaps no good ones if you don't play green?
< 1529009253 976426 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this may have been intended to make them hard to use together, but what actually happened is that people ended up playing four colors because it worked better than three, so the top decks ended up largely identical, just playing all the best cards in four colors
< 1529009266 16784 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think land /searching/ is at all common in Standard at the moment
< 1529009279 587789 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the cards that get land out of your deck just look at the top few cards
< 1529009295 418933 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that's technically a search
< 1529009367 794742 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow
< 1529009373 605645 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1529009387 891643 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just not familiar with standard or modern enough, so I never noticed that
< 1529009400 494819 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there used to be good land searchers in some formats
< 1529009425 94829 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I thought there'd be at least slightly less broken land searchers later
< 1529009425 368237 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Rampant Growth
< 1529009426 154675 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rampant Growth \ 1G \ Sorcery \ Search your library for a basic land card and put that card onto the battlefield tapped. Then shuffle your library. \ MI-C, TE-C, 6E-C, 7E-C, 8ED-C, 9ED-C, 10E-C, M10-C, HOP-C, M12-C, MM2-C, C15-C, C16-C, DDS-C
< 1529009430 16814 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that's a stupid assumption
< 1529009438 752118 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rampant Growth is currently considered too good for Standard
< 1529009440 800692 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's why I said non-green deck
< 1529009451 335337 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one is good, and there's some weaker ones
< 1529009453 88570 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though it's allowed a power level boost for being green
< 1529009477 558623 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Terramorphic Expanse
< 1529009478 322381 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Terramorphic Expanse \ Land \ {T}, Sacrifice Terramorphic Expanse: Search your library for a basic land card and put it onto the battlefield tapped. Then shuffle your library. \ TSP-C, 10E-C, M10-C, HOP-C, ARC-C, M11-C, CMD-C, PC2-C, MMA-C, C13-C, C14-C, C15-C, C16-C, PCA-C, CMA-C, C17-C, DDE-C, DDH-C, DDN-C, H09-C
< 1529009488 194944 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :while that one is too bad for tournament?
< 1529009489 576085 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Evolving Wilds
< 1529009490 362826 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evolving Wilds \ Land \ {T}, Sacrifice Evolving Wilds: Search your library for a basic land card and put it onto the battlefield tapped. Then shuffle your library. \ ROE-C, CMD-C, DKA-C, M13-C, C13-C, M15-C, C14-C, DTK-C, MM2-C, ORI-C, BFZ-C, C15-C, CN2-C, C16-C, AKH-C, CMA-C, C17-C, DDH-C, DDK-C, DDN-C, DDO-C, DDP-C
< 1529009491 505066 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because they keep reprinting that
< 1529009502 364609 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529009504 635744 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, I knew Evolving Wilds had been ridiculously reprinted
< 1529009512 421500 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not Terramorphic too, though
< 1529009529 35609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're used occasionally when the alternatives are really bad
< 1529009535 365595 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, both
< 1529009536 595713 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're not considered good cards
< 1529009556 830025 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what are the most recent cards in the bot?
< 1529009560 941999 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, what's the difference between those two?
< 1529009563 968708 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1529009565 15344 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there isn't one
< 1529009581 963352 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are their current oracle text (not in the bot) different?
< 1529009642 699156 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, that is bizarre
< 1529009666 794952 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :MaGo! why did you ever leave?
< 1529009667 1489 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one has a full stop where the other has a comma, with grammar adjusted to fit
< 1529009676 598073 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :who's the head rules manager now? I'm cursing them
< 1529009691 471995 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they generally look for this sort of thing
< 1529009707 799154 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eli Shiffrin
< 1529009713 670922 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think I've spelled that correctly?)
< 1529009716 471140 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was Matt Tabak for ages
< 1529009727 626626 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, them
< 1529009740 52279 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily they're doing good job in the background so most of the time I don't have to think of their names
< 1529009807 702044 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, end tangent
< 1529009824 247624 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so land searching, Terramorphic is not good enough for tournament?
< 1529009839 530025 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd expect it isn't good enough
< 1529009910 868578 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in the kitchen table, it's good enough only for a very few decks, and even then it's not a very good card, just an acceptable one.)
< 1529009918 924565 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's good enough for most decks if it's in your opening hand, but it's too slow if you draw it later in the game
< 1529009929 772587 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, tapped lands generally are, I mean
< 1529009934 340213 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529009948 84382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Terramorphic in particular has the additional problem that you often don't know what color you'll be missing when you draw it early
< 1529010101 224940 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I play with Kodama's Reach in a big ramp and it's quite good, but only if I already have four or more green one-mana accelerators in the deck so you can almost always cast it in turn 2, and I really want a ramp, and this strategy only works in a close to mono-green deck.
> 1529010109 669099 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55793&oldid=55783 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+376) 10/* Undefined behavior */
< 1529010133 375148 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :green has a lot of good one-mana accelerators, both for kitchen table and for tournament
< 1529010142 231070 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't have the tournament versions of course
< 1529010176 653945 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Veteran Explorer
< 1529010177 333465 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Veteran Explorer \ G \ Creature -- Human Soldier Scout \ 1/1 \ When Veteran Explorer dies, each player may search his or her library for up to two basic land cards and put them onto the battlefield. Then each player who searched his or her library this way shuffles it. \ WL-U, CMD-U, C16-U
< 1529010190 15666 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is apparently the only one-mana accelerator that's good enough for Legacy
< 1529010216 406997 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you count Lotus Petal
< 1529010219 576421 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that costs zero
< 1529010237 208116 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…I assume Sol Ring is banned? otherwise I can't see why people wouldn't use it
< 1529010277 384772 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Llawnowar Elves, Arbor Elves, Wild Growth, Utopia Sprawl, are cheap cards I have, and the first two are really good
< 1529010284 807769 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, Sol Ring is reprinted cheap too now
< 1529010286 985423 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot about that
< 1529010346 193867 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's Springleaf Drum but it's limited, it only works second turn if you can play a one-mana creature, any why would you play a one-mana creature that doesn't produce mana in turn 2 in a ramp deck?
< 1529010365 210648 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's too slow
< 1529010389 23351 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Abundant Growth
< 1529010389 677593 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Abundant Growth \ G \ Enchantment -- Aura \ Enchant land \ When Abundant Growth enters the battlefield, draw a card. \ Enchanted land has "{T}: Add one mana of any color to your mana pool." \ AVR-C, EMA-C
< 1529010408 92654 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently this is the new improved version, because the old ones were good only in some decks, and not really for early
< 1529010414 807091 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you almost always wanted the elves instead
< 1529010436 147687 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529010479 382534 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, that isn't ramp
< 1529010481 142279 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just fixing
< 1529010511 164353 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right
< 1529010515 28660 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1529010691 279673 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'm not 100% sure I've written about Omnitell correctly because I've never played it, but I have watched videos of other people playing it
< 1529010702 146806 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529010852 299945 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's the 3 or more variants of Llawnowar Elves, then Arbor Elves that I like but it only works for me because I do play lots of Forests in those decks, it won't work in tournament; then the Birds of Paradise which I think was tournament card but now rotated from standard; and off-color ones like Elves of Deep Shadow, Avacyn's Pilgrim, Noble H
< 1529010852 364659 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ierarch, of which at least the last was used in tournaments I think
< 1529010872 987455 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which are green mana producers for playing in turn 1 and producing mana in turn 2
< 1529010880 48430 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and every other turn
< 1529010933 766146 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arbor Elves is frequently played in Standard when it's legal
< 1529010944 815363 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529010948 203168 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's played in Modern, too, but only in Elf tribal decks
< 1529010951 165894 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about the Llanowar Elves variants?
< 1529010962 613842 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are played too; Arbor Elf is slightly better though
< 1529010969 845816 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're good for me, because they're fast and versatile, go in many different decks that have green
< 1529010987 53538 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you have lots of green-producing non-Forests
< 1529011024 499614 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is Arbor Elves good in Standard? oh right, you said they still have dual lands with land types
< 1529011075 846486 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, I play at least 12 basic lands among at least 22 lands in almost all constructed decks, but that's not what a trournament player would do
< 1529011095 460015 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even in the kitchen table, I have played against many-colored decks with almost no basic lands
< 1529011142 418385 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :land hate is really bad at the moment, and has been for ages
< 1529011168 978105 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's basically no reason to play basics if you have an alternative
< 1529011182 445718 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I do this because all the dual land card that often etb untapped are expensive, so I haven't bought most of them
< 1529011182 528932 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're trying to give the dual lands drawbacks instead but they're never large enough
< 1529011203 265877 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a few affordable ones now though, so I will buy when I return to M:tG, because they're versatile
< 1529011214 718553 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're still expensive, but they're versatile, go in many decks, so I'll probably buy some
< 1529011238 984234 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :since I'm not limited to standard
< 1529011280 584794 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc they recently printed one that etb untapped in multiplayer games, that seems almost like cheating
< 1529011302 171541 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or will print them
< 1529011317 722708 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Crumble to Dust
< 1529011318 395286 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Crumble to Dust \ 3R \ Sorcery \ Devoid (This card has no color.) \ Exile target nonbasic land. Search its controller's graveyard, hand, and library for any number of cards with the same name as that land and exile them. Then that player shuffles his or her library. \ BFZ-U
< 1529011324 239258 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Battlebond
< 1529011335 914554 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the only good anti-land card that's been Standard-legal any time recently, and I think it's rotated out
< 1529011344 242746 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it's not good enough to play except against decks that rely on a single powerful land
< 1529011387 579977 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means that decks that are just playing nonbasic lands for fixing have nothing to worry about, the opponent doesn't have any viable ways to take advantage of that
< 1529011394 878231 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bountiful Promenade etc
< 1529011398 414336 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds too good to be true
< 1529011405 808011 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are they trying to break all non-trournament formats with that?
< 1529011405 903607 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes
< 1529011407 634405 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :seriously
< 1529011407 921965 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't the first though
< 1529011411 11228 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Command Tower
< 1529011411 719075 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Command Tower \ Land \ {T}: Add to your mana pool one mana of any color in your commander's color identity. \ CMD-C, C13-C, C15-C, C16-C, CMA-C, C17-C
< 1529011454 142836 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, but this is a full cycle of five so you'll have 8 in wedge 3 colored decks
< 1529011461 180552 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :crazy
< 1529011471 208100 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least the ones they print for Modern have some moderation
< 1529011471 319366 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :command tower is basically a gold land with no drawback if you're playing Commander
< 1529011480 341047 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as mana outside the color identity isn't useful anyway
< 1529011489 130853 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not playing commander, but I am often playing multiplayer with four players
< 1529011499 607407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529011507 85117 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it can happen only in the very late game that there are only two players in play and the game hasn't ended
< 1529011510 150848 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"this land is broken in format X" is still broken, though
> 1529011513 883819 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55794&oldid=55793 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+932) 10/* Waterclocks over the reals */
< 1529011518 443669 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at that point I don't care if my eighth land etb tapped
< 1529011522 147334 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name City of Ass
< 1529011522 992840 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :City of Ass \ Land \ City of Ass comes into play tapped. \ {T}: Add one and one-half mana of any one color to your mana pool. \ UNH-R
< 1529011528 513088 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also completely broken :-(
< 1529011539 405178 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't have that sort of broken dual land for Modern or any recent Standard, right?
< 1529011542 404136 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even back when it made you mana burn for a half, it was broken
< 1529011548 325447 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even the Ravnica duals aren't that good
< 1529011580 156631 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most broken lands in Modern are the Khans fetchlands
< 1529011647 756503 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, City of Ass is broken too, but... at least that has a silver border, and mentions half mana which you normally can only play with the strange un-rule that you can choose half numbers every time you have to choose a number, and that rule breaks the format even with only ordinary modern cards, eg. you can distribute half of deathtouch damage to 
< 1529011647 877709 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :multiple blocked creatures
< 1529011667 913169 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, I'm trying to remember a name of one of the cards in the cycle, and I keep remembering Zendikar fetchlands instead
< 1529011680 622186 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so even without any cards, the half numbers un-rules are brokenm
< 1529011729 439161 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and have been in every version of the rules I can remember, because all the versions of the combat damage rule had some exception at least for deathtouch, even if nothing else
> 1529011791 900000 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55795&oldid=55794 5* 03Ais523 5* (+487) 10/* Waterclocks over the reals */ computability
< 1529011803 934899 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how big a print will Battlebond have? it's not standard legal
< 1529011821 617924 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :until people stop buying it, I think
< 1529011824 438550 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if those rares will become cheap
< 1529011833 121964 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they'll only print a fairly small quantity to begin with
< 1529011836 554244 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it depends on how successful it is
< 1529011845 410348 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the market that is
< 1529011857 874653 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most rare lands aren't, but this seems a special interest one
< 1529011872 767811 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most good lands are expensive, which makes sense
< 1529011918 40789 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, I build mostly from cheap cards, and want to buy more cheap cards,
< 1529011929 560763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION eventually gives up and looks them up

< 1529011934 941787 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name bloodstained mire
< 1529011935 585338 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bloodstained Mire \ Land \ {T}, Pay 1 life, Sacrifice Bloodstained Mire: Search your library for a Swamp or Mountain card and put it onto the battlefield. Then shuffle your library. \ ONS-R, KTK-R, EXP-M
< 1529011937 199683 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529011945 795938 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I might buy some medium price dual lands or similar if they seem so versatile I can put them in many decks
< 1529011951 751048 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :usually I just use cheap lands for that too
< 1529011967 256352 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fetchland
< 1529011967 978020 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529011976 681597 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that is good
< 1529011999 852721 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in formats with decent lands with nonbasic types that is
< 1529012010 236197 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/nonbasic types/basic types/
< 1529012028 741903 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's good even if you're fetching basics
< 1529012033 68216 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529012043 286104 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, in Legacy, they're sometimes played even in monocolor decks
< 1529012049 610872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the deck thinning + free shuffle
< 1529012065 761419 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this is at least partly because most Legacy decks don't care about their opponent's life total)
< 1529012084 119678 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you're trying to win quickly, winning from 12 and from 20 are approximately equally easy
< 1529012090 588628 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're playing Burn
< 1529012100 805593 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that's what Terramorphic is good for too, and some more expensive (2 or 3 mana) green stuff, but it's only like one or two decks where I need the free shuffle
< 1529012109 266032 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a tournament deck needs that more
< 1529012113 603352 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, the deck thinning is useful too
< 1529012131 851207 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with Terramorphic it's not free, it effectively costs {1} :-D
< 1529012137 114758 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529012143 131139 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's too much for a shuffle even if you aren't paying a card for it
< 1529012144 582217 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the green spells cost mana too
< 1529012170 505971 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one or two or three mana up front, and you get back zero or one immediately
< 1529012177 503931 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for searching a land
< 1529012184 448279 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes still good enough
< 1529012188 105500 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not all decks
< 1529012230 490725 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, you're basically paying for three things: color fixing, ramp, and the shuffle
< 1529012237 923462 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cards that give only a subset of those effects have to be cheaper
< 1529012260 171536 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, for example, color fix + ramp + shuffle (all three) is Rampant Growth, which costs two mana and a card
< 1529012267 322430 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Rupture Spire
< 1529012268 44923 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rupture Spire \ Land \ Rupture Spire enters the battlefield tapped. \ When Rupture Spire enters the battlefield, sacrifice it unless you pay {1}. \ {T}: Add one mana of any color to your mana pool. \ CON-C, CMD-C, PC2-C, C13-C, C16-C, PCA-C, CMA-C, DDH-C, H09-C
< 1529012281 305065 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a perfect color fix through perfect turns costs an effective {2}
< 1529012285 998408 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*through future turns
< 1529012299 932723 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas a "pick a color now" and a shuffle costs an effective {1}, that's Terramorphic
< 1529012321 411004 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529012493 690200 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does Modern have something like Krosan Wayfarer, which is "put a land card from your hand into play, right now" effect for {G} on a sorcery?
< 1529012510 181997 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it did for a while
< 1529012512 904438 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Summer Bloom
< 1529012513 560057 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Summer Bloom \ 1G \ Sorcery \ You may play up to three additional lands this turn. \ VI-U, P1-R, 6E-U, S99-R, 9ED-U
< 1529012519 159628 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know they have the same but the land tapped, but that's much weaker
< 1529012520 236991 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it ended up getting banned
< 1529012530 891479 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1529012540 300940 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are probably weaker versions of the same effect that are still legal
< 1529012542 233906 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because that helps with the fixing
< 1529012553 540470 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Elvish Pioneer
< 1529012554 276463 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Elvish Pioneer \ G \ Creature -- Elf Druid \ 1/1 \ When Elvish Pioneer enters the battlefield, you may put a basic land card from your hand onto the battlefield tapped. \ ONS-C, 8ED-C
< 1529012569 560859 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's much weaker
< 1529012571 962138 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't broken
< 1529012581 601606 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's in modern
< 1529012588 438699 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, 8th is in Modern
< 1529012591 938121 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529012596 403644 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that isn't such a broken effect
< 1529012598 494401 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Summer Bloom was abused with nonbasics though
< 1529012598 722996 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it says "tapped"
< 1529012609 923878 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Krosan Wayfarer doesn't say "tapped"
< 1529012614 444462 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oddly, the "tapped" on Elvish Pioneer makes it stronger rather than weaker in that deck
< 1529012615 827397 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Krosan Wayfarer
< 1529012616 548296 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Krosan Wayfarer \ G \ Creature -- Human Druid \ 1/1 \ Sacrifice Krosan Wayfarer: You may put a land card from your hand onto the battlefield. \ JUD-C
< 1529012622 620245 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what?
< 1529012628 401004 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Amulet of Vigor
< 1529012629 162320 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Amulet of Vigor \ 1 \ Artifact \ Whenever a permanent enters the battlefield tapped and under your control, untap it. \ WWK-R
< 1529012629 306867 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would I want my land required tapped?
< 1529012641 886009 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh... what deck then?
< 1529012646 980970 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the omnitell?
< 1529012651 198865 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the thing is that if you get multiple Amulet of Vigor triggers, you can tap the land in between…
< 1529012657 556812 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1529012668 15075 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the deck was called Amulet Bloom (i.e. Amulet of Vigor and Summer Bloom)
< 1529012669 415355 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that's wierd
< 1529012674 950374 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it played them together with lands that bounce themselves
< 1529012679 969972 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Selesnya Sancturary
< 1529012680 832350 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output.
< 1529012686 595182 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1529012700 463644 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Dimir Aqueduct
< 1529012701 154565 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dimir Aqueduct \ Land \ Dimir Aqueduct enters the battlefield tapped. \ When Dimir Aqueduct enters the battlefield, return a land you control to its owner's hand. \ {T}: Add {U}{B} to your mana pool. \ RAV-C, CMD-C, PC2-C, MM2-U, C16-U, PCA-C, C17-U
< 1529012717 910651 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like that (except green)
< 1529012720 870831 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1529012724 95510 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Selesnya Sanctuary
< 1529012724 729893 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Selesnya Sanctuary \ Land \ Selesnya Sanctuary enters the battlefield tapped. \ When Selesnya Sanctuary enters the battlefield, return a land you control to its owner's hand. \ {T}: Add {G}{W} to your mana pool. \ RAV-C, CMD-C, PC2-C, C13-C, MM2-U, C16-U, PCA-C, CMA-C, C17-C, DDG-C
< 1529012726 310232 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't spell
< 1529012789 123931 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's still not the same of course, because if I have Krosan Wayfarer, then I sometimes have to play it first turn if I don't have a Llanowar/etc, so I won't have a chance for an Amulet of Vigor yet, so Krosan Wayfarer is still better in eteranl I think
< 1529012802 691459 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so say you have Amulet of Vigor in play, you can play a Selesnya Sancturary, tap it for {G}{W} before it bounces itself, use that to cast Summer Bloom, then play the Selesnya Sancturary three more times
< 1529012820 25584 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that gives you six mana on turn 2 (usually), which you can use to play Primeval Titan or some similar finisher
< 1529012833 487933 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, the rav common duals, I play those
< 1529012838 782764 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are decent
< 1529012859 119861 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders why they can't spell "sanctuary"

< 1529012865 795661 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and reprinted enough, finally
< 1529012876 395597 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what?
< 1529012880 329178 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :who can't spell Sanctuary?
< 1529012887 572543 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :me, apparently
< 1529012890 308696 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep adding an extra r
< 1529012890 728994 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1529012933 137879 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name summer bloom
< 1529012933 840091 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Summer Bloom \ 1G \ Sorcery \ You may play up to three additional lands this turn. \ VI-U, P1-R, 6E-U, S99-R, 9ED-U
< 1529012948 586950 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow
< 1529012962 374142 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, Amulet of Vigor is strange
< 1529012983 297105 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know the rav dual lands have their uses, but they're usually not that much broken
< 1529012993 427112 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Primeval Titan
< 1529012994 160374 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Primeval Titan \ 4GG \ Creature -- Giant \ 6/6 \ Trample \ Whenever Primeval Titan enters the battlefield or attacks, you may search your library for up to two land cards, put them onto the battlefield tapped, then shuffle your library. \ M11-M, M12-M, MM2-M
< 1529013018 368702 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trick is to search out a land that can give it haste :-)
< 1529013023 706985 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(remember that the Amulet will untap them)
< 1529013031 668512 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully that means only the Amulet is crazy, not all ten rav common dual lands
< 1529013046 359085 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the Magic devs think that the rav common duals are too strong
< 1529013051 714016 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really?
< 1529013058 815558 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think they're strong too, but not tournament strong
< 1529013061 475449 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think so, not 100% sure on that
< 1529013087 718405 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're basically playing {1} to "search out a land" (the land you bounced)
< 1529013106 602080 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't it just the rare duals or the Signets or something that they think are slightly too strong?
< 1529013149 868242 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"search your library for a basic land card, place it into your hand, shuffle your library, then draw a card" would be the approximate equivalent of that effect if it were a sorcery rather than a land
< 1529013158 874788 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that effect surely costs more than {1}
< 1529013168 635323 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*than {1} and a card
< 1529013175 67678 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they no longer print other lands that etb tapped and give two mana, they never printed versions that give RR or something, only the dual ones, and only that cycle
< 1529013179 572080 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I guess they might think that
< 1529013197 745029 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I just thought there just aren't any reasonable versions they could invent other than this one cycle of ten
< 1529013238 650808 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they didn't want to print mono-colored ones, because they rarely have non-basic land slots for that sort of luxury that doesn't fix mana, like only once in every two years or so
< 1529013266 345578 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm
< 1529013295 276907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my attempt at designing that: "~ enters the battlefield tapped. If ~ would untap, instead you may pay {1}, if you do untap it. T: add GW to your mana pool."
< 1529013311 170931 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? how is that equivalent? why are you even searching for basic lands?
< 1529013323 210078 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the common rav duals don't do any searching
< 1529013327 29862 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is it comparable?
< 1529013328 147014 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they bounce a land to your hand
< 1529013336 744592 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but doesn't search for any color
< 1529013339 72902 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you're one land up
< 1529013342 681998 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just those two colors
< 1529013350 937600 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :your version fixes to any color
< 1529013354 718890 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I decided that giving you two specific colors was similar to searching for one
< 1529013363 72878 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1529013367 660277 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although not identical, they will be of similar strength in three-color decks
< 1529013384 201 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think fixing five colors is stronger than fixing two, and wizards seems to think so too, at least on dual lands
< 1529013393 573060 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :triple lands and five-colored lands always seem weaker
< 1529013416 347887 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most 5c lands actually released are terrible, though
< 1529013421 194011 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Mana Confluence
< 1529013421 800778 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure
< 1529013421 896691 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mana Confluence \ Land \ {T}, Pay 1 life: Add one mana of any color to your mana pool. \ JOU-R, EXP-M
< 1529013427 106890 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Cavern of Souls
< 1529013427 811614 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cavern of Souls \ Land \ As Cavern of Souls enters the battlefield, choose a creature type. \ {T}: Add {C} to your mana pool. \ {T}: Add one mana of any color to your mana pool. Spend this mana only to cast a creature spell of the chosen type, and that spell can't be countered. \ AVR-R, MM3-M
< 1529013433 428604 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those are the only two that are commonly played
< 1529013449 36055 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although there's a nerfed version of Cavern now which also see play; Cavern is totally bonkers)
< 1529013458 265801 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, there's a better one, but deck-specific
< 1529013480 73016 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's one that generates any color but it can only be used for creatures, ditto one like that for artifacts
< 1529013485 982381 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Ancient Ziggurat
< 1529013486 696075 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ancient Ziggurat \ Land \ {T}: Add one mana of any color to your mana pool. Spend this mana only to cast a creature spell. \ CON-U, H09-U
< 1529013488 111818 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former is sometimes played in exclusively-creatures decks
< 1529013512 224870 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that
< 1529013533 913000 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :being able to generate any color for artifacts isn't all that useful an effect ;-)
< 1529013539 252753 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :works even in decks with only 32 creatures, not 36
< 1529013553 755368 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :only some of them, you need to get mana for activated abilities from somewhere
< 1529013571 433266 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, I understand the point, it's worse late game if you aren't playing a deck where you want to cast a creature card every turn
< 1529013594 576650 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, very situational
< 1529013610 680246 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :works well in a few decks only
< 1529013620 51254 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're right, Cavern of Souls is better in general
< 1529013626 450849 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the strongest decks I ever built wanted to play multiple creatures on most turns
< 1529013631 434561 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it'd love Ancient Ziggurat
< 1529013632 80572 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen that one too
< 1529013648 234486 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it was a tribal deck, so Cavern of Souls would have been even better
< 1529013650 925848 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I have some such decks, and want to build some, and have played against such decks
< 1529013654 80873 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obviously it'd just play 4 of both though)
< 1529013713 969584 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1529013787 705727 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1529013901 585503 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :back in your text, "Mountain (the basic land for red)" -- wait, there are M:tG players who don't know that? even beginners?
< 1529013948 714323 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it
< 1529013960 865599 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :remove that parenthetical then, I think
< 1529013978 158674 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's more focusing on why we pick that card
< 1529013980 672826 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we want a red basic land
< 1529013984 754497 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Mountain happens to be a red basic
< 1529013992 682741 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess we could use Snow-covered Mountain instead? :-D
< 1529013992 943375 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, ok
< 1529013997 467043 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1529014008 424291 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, you could. but it's not cheap
< 1529014015 749655 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529014043 436274 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is compared to most of the cards in that deck :-D
< 1529014056 252008 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529014063 223717 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :true
< 1529014077 662351 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529014109 254899 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :just seems expensive compared to the plain Mountain I guess
< 1529014142 500124 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is annoying because of the rule that you can actually use more than 4 of them
< 1529014156 996618 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could, but you'd have to buy them thenm
< 1529014182 222668 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was also a rule during Coldsnap (i.e. you can run as many as you like but you have to draft them)
< 1529014195 860499 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1529014209 592099 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was the rule in limited
< 1529014261 674600 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is imagining what it would be like if that was the rule in Constructed too

< 1529014283 161496 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thy also did that in BfZ, didn't they
< 1529014285 202559 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :extra dumb
< 1529014289 362685 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people would join Coldsnap drafts just to draft all the snow lands so that they could legally be played
< 1529014302 258580 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and now they printed a sixth such crazy basic land too, one that you could have more than four of, but you have to buy more than four
< 1529014309 189902 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think there are like two creature too
< 1529014324 871323 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529014346 860991 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, isn't that still the rule in constructed?
< 1529014359 348860 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Modern that is
< 1529014391 274557 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: yes
< 1529014395 805256 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :same price for those
< 1529014419 875069 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have snow lands, but that's only because I have bought a Coldsnap theme deck, and you can only get 4 of the 5 colors that way
< 1529014441 335829 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Wastes
< 1529014442 408764 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wastes \ Basic Land \ {T}: Add {C} to your mana pool. \ OGW-C
< 1529014451 61667 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I have 11 snow swamps and 13 snow islands, which is the annoying number, 13 swamps and 11 islands would be so much better
< 1529014467 963843 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(one of those is random, they give one random snow land in foil as a bonus card)
< 1529014491 69620 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or maybe always a foil snow island? I don't recall. the main deck has only 23 I think.)
< 1529014502 50414 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be fair, Wastes is normally only played in Commander (where having basic lands can be important and some decks can't legally run any of the other five)
< 1529014546 642309 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529014550 323423 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right, and some very strange constructed decks. and the two (?) basic creatures are even worse.
< 1529014577 670996 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only play the creatures in decks that have like at least 20 of them, but possibly 100
< 1529014613 762117 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know, decks with mostly two cards, one basic land and one basic creature
< 1529014628 252122 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just checked a database of tournament results, no deck containing Wastes has scored highly enough to be recorded in any tournament in any of the formats it records (Standard, Modern, Legacy)
< 1529014631 55231 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the archetype from back before the 4 card limit
< 1529014643 332281 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right
< 1529014679 200697 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but snow lands would actually be used, because they're almost always better than ordinary basics, so you'd play them in any deck instead of basics if you have even one card that cares about them
< 1529014688 870011 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@c83-253-73-101.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529014688 931598 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@c83-253-73-101.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Changing host
< 1529014688 931650 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529014696 515229 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, it tracks a few other formats too (e.g. Vintage and Pauper)
< 1529014713 437961 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I see
< 1529014732 890069 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: but how many years back does it go?
< 1529014740 680995 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that database that is
< 1529014748 161562 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not just current standard, right?
< 1529014802 276481 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :since before Wastes was printed
< 1529014825 660956 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure how far before but that doesn't really matter, as it can't have placed well in a tournament before it was printed
< 1529014838 598547 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529014844 827255 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529014871 95271 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in terms of the snow-covered lands, they only appear to be good in two decks, one of which is red, one of which is blue/red
< 1529014878 951517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so only the island and mountain are played
< 1529014911 102952 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sure, the island is the best
< 1529014929 720535 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the rest are free
< 1529014929 802797 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wouldn't the mountain be best on that theory?
< 1529014940 139033 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, yes
< 1529014952 789277 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assumed the island would be the best because blue has the best cards that care about snow
< 1529014956 592252 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but maybe not
< 1529014969 955188 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Skred
< 1529014970 676018 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Skred \ R \ Instant \ Skred deals damage to target creature equal to the number of snow permanents you control. \ CSP-C
< 1529014975 624468 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I just don't know the red ones
< 1529014981 520876 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1529014985 132035 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, red is the best
< 1529014986 363136 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the only colored cares-about-snow that's tournament playable
< 1529014996 160916 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Scrying Sheets
< 1529014996 946434 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Scrying Sheets \ Snow Land \ {T}: Add {C} to your mana pool. \ {1}{S}, {T}: Look at the top card of your library. If that card is snow, you may reveal it and put it into your hand. ({S} can be paid with one mana from a snow permanent.) \ CSP-R
< 1529015010 118305 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's playable if you're running a snow landbase
< 1529015083 789691 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Viscerid Drone would be decent in limited, but not in constructed
< 1529015170 579923 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Mouth of Ronom
< 1529015171 338280 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mouth of Ronom \ Snow Land \ {T}: Add {C} to your mana pool. \ {4}{S}, {T}, Sacrifice Mouth of Ronom: Mouth of Ronom deals 4 damage to target creature. ({S} can be paid with one mana from a snow permanent.) \ CSP-U
< 1529015189 307980 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are a few more ones like that that would be good in limited, and give some extra if you have snow mana
< 1529015190 910006 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's run in the U/R/S deck because it happens to combo really well with the rest of the deck
< 1529015218 156017 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but wouldn't be playable just for the card, it's only there because the deck is built around damage-to-creature effects and is running Skred because of that
< 1529015264 612305 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mind you, there are a few snow hosers, sort of like how there are non-basic-hosers for legacy
< 1529015279 5179 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so everyone playing snow basic lands wouldn't be stable anyway
< 1529015313 75532 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, nonbasic hosers are really common in Legacy
< 1529015315 917013 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Wasteland
< 1529015316 569450 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wasteland \ Land \ {T}: Add {C} to your mana pool. \ {T}, Sacrifice Wasteland: Destroy target nonbasic land. \ TE-U, EXP-M, EMA-R \  \ Wasteland Scorpion \ 2B \ Creature -- Scorpion \ 2/2 \ Deathtouch \ Cycling {2} ({2}, Discard this card: Draw a card.) \ AKH-C \  \ Wasteland Strangler \ 2B \ Creature -- Eldrazi Processor \ 3/2 \ Devoid (This card has no color.) \ When Wasteland Strangler enters the battlefield, you may put a card an opponent owns from exi
< 1529015321 233769 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Stifle
< 1529015322 23892 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stifle \ U \ Instant \ Counter target activated or triggered ability. (Mana abilities can't be targeted.) \ SCG-R, CNS-R, MPS_AKH-S
< 1529015331 590578 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529015333 690781 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly
< 1529015348 494718 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(admittedly Stifle being a nonbasic hoser is a bit of a special case, as it doesn't do it directly; it destroys lands by countering abilities with a cost of "Sacrifice ~")
< 1529015376 651390 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :snow hosers aren't, there's only like two or three that are any good, plus a few combos but all need cards from those two sets
< 1529015385 899521 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :three
< 1529015391 234897 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ice ace, alliances, coldsnap ;-)
< 1529015396 376231 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529015402 551766 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :um what?
< 1529015411 791568 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alliances doesn't have any cards mentioning snow, does it?
< 1529015418 683319 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in the block, but doesn't have cards
< 1529015446 896420 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name storm elemental
< 1529015447 736365 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Storm Elemental \ 5U \ Creature -- Elemental \ 3/4 \ Flying \ {U}, Exile the top card of your library: Tap target creature with flying. \ {U}, Exile the top card of your library: If the exiled card is a snow land, Storm Elemental gets +1/+1 until end of turn. \ AI-U, ME2-U
< 1529015452 203088 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I think it's two
< 1529015466 759281 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow
< 1529015471 638470 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot that was in alliances
< 1529015472 977741 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529015478 476496 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :homelands doesn't have any though
< 1529015502 44520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :viscerid drone is also from alliances
< 1529015551 76805 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also gargantuan gorilla, and winter's night; the latter might or might not be a snow hoser
< 1529015554 75730 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name winter's night
< 1529015554 719738 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Winter's Night \ RGW \ World Enchantment \ Whenever a player taps a snow land for mana, that player adds one mana to his or her mana pool of any type that land produced. That land doesn't untap during its controller's next untap step. \ AI-R, ME2-R
< 1529015558 261829 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :four alliances cards mention snow in fact
< 1529015561 199384 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a bizarre card
< 1529015594 869806 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've even seen two of them in the precon deck, only in the precon they're reprinted with coldsnap symbol and modern frame
< 1529015623 800342 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the precon reprints were given the set symbol from the original set but a modern frame
< 1529015626 84615 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently I'm familiar with the cards but not with those old expansions and didn't realize that's where those two came froem
< 1529015631 680005 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a dark ritual with a modern frame but an ice age set symbol
< 1529015635 497436 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah.. ok
< 1529015650 690441 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529015659 676679 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :alliances exp symbol too
< 1529015663 814133 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :darn, I forgot
< 1529015680 980534 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's only two cards and I don't notice their exp symbol when I'm scanning through my cards? ok
< 1529015687 220054 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or I don't remember two bad cards
< 1529015713 899594 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I know what it is
< 1529015731 718333 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Alliances is one of the worse among the old sets, so I think I just don't recognize the mana symbol
< 1529015734 424540 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the exp symbol
< 1529015818 475877 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are just too many exp symbols now, I can't keep them all in my head, and that one is one I never see because it's such a bad old block
> 1529015828 435855 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Undefined behavior14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55796&oldid=35566 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1113) 10expand
> 1529015867 204207 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing-completeness14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55797 5* 03Ais523 5* (+29) 10Redirected page to [[Turing-complete]]
< 1529015868 377391 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was hoping they'd realize that and start to use either just one exp symbol per block and fewer distinct exp symbols for non-modern/non-standard products, or some systematic symbols for some series, but no
< 1529015888 270486 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they never did
< 1529015897 129776 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :except perhaps for the core sets for six years
< 1529015903 819619 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was a row about the Dominaria expansion symbol
< 1529015919 615473 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in reverse video (on the commons) because Wizards were worried that it looked too much like the Darksteel set symbol
< 1529015928 115493 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now people are having problems distinguishing commons from uncommons
< 1529015947 465998 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I think a few of these new low power low number of copies intro set products
< 1529015966 582560 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ack
< 1529015970 877171 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know
< 1529016007 421645 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the intro products share an expansion symbol with the most recent standard-legal set
< 1529016018 205875 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, at least the Planeswalker decks
< 1529016022 798482 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they at least added a three-letter code that you can look up now, but there's still a random three-letter code for ever standard-legal expansion that you'd have to remember just like the mana symbol
< 1529016022 816800 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :The symbols are still thematically linked, aren't they?
< 1529016026 354851 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what expansion symbol the free packs use
< 1529016033 210488 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at Zendikar block's symbols
< 1529016049 571520 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: they got simpler over time, then they got more complex again
< 1529016059 170947 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: in some blocks they were, but the thematic is different in every block, so that only helps if you actually remember any of the three symbols from that one block
< 1529016062 787941 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a symbol like Dragon's Maze is surprisingly detailed
< 1529016072 109822 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: but good luck with that after blocks
< 1529016084 836658 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some symbols are easy to remember, like Eldritch Moon
< 1529016087 441426 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: even then it only worked for like every second or third blocks at random
< 1529016096 167766 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that one's an exception
< 1529016100 15521 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: some symbols are easy to remember because I see them a lot
< 1529016158 866804 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: how is the Eldritch Moon symbol special?
< 1529016182 366266 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can tell what the set's about just by looking at it
< 1529016191 561588 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes it easy to work out what set it belongs to
< 1529016196 583846 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there's any that's easy to remember, those were the core set ones I think
< 1529016204 168656 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes
< 1529016211 671841 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :plain numbers or roman numbers from fifth to M2015
< 1529016213 965765 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're reintroducing core sets (a new one coming out in a few weeks)
< 1529016214 263273 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they stopped that
< 1529016227 174067 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :M2019 is using the same symbol scheme as just before they stopped
< 1529016231 499772 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh good
< 1529016240 328791 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that one is good, except for the tiny numbers since M2010
< 1529016265 935991 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at least they're really easy to remember
< 1529016277 977675 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that will be one per year in standard, right? good
< 1529016289 94013 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, as long as you remember that M2010 is 11th edition, despite the name
< 1529016292 370988 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like between M10 and M15
< 1529016293 569250 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529016307 66352 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: or the 12th if you count alpha and beta separately
< 1529016315 795152 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they differ in like two cards technically
< 1529016336 360007 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are other sets with similar issues that aren't counted as different sets
< 1529016344 2858 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know I never actually see anything older than Revised but still, if you want to number them
< 1529016353 611599 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, almost never
< 1529016358 373873 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there was one set where only half the commons were available in any given pack…
< 1529016372 435500 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I have seen a few "cheap" Unlimited cards
< 1529016391 809146 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok
< 1529016402 954880 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so we count Beta as the first core set?
< 1529016407 343030 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because Alpha is the messed up one?
< 1529016411 681502 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529016417 858755 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Alpha is still the most expensive set ever
< 1529016419 569382 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529016421 950630 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, rather, Alpha is an erroneous print of Beta
< 1529016424 537587 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is crazy numbering
< 1529016433 366720 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :misprints are normally more valuable than the non-misprinted card…
< 1529016441 199467 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(due to being rarer)
< 1529016452 201848 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if Alpha were more printed than Beta, then Beta would be more expensive
< 1529016492 396976 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so Alpha is no longer a core set, despite that it's the first ever set, and I thoguht the first products were only core sets (reprint only) and expansion sets, from before they even invented compilation sets and casual sets and stuff
< 1529016499 673887 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, Alpha is part of Beta
< 1529016506 427531 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529016508 882609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :collectively called "Limited Edition"
< 1529016516 666346 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes sense
< 1529016521 366335 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can tell this because Beta cards have black borders, which at the time indicated that it was the first printing of the card
< 1529016538 587584 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but don't Alpha cards have black borders too?
< 1529016539 322946 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gzfaeydycvwqvrlc QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529016543 728749 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529016555 866396 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, Alpha and Beta both contain "first edition" copies of the same card
< 1529016559 46744 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thus must be the same edition
< 1529016587 696742 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529016599 613541 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did they first put reprints in black-bordered expansion sets?
< 1529016611 533091 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas Unlimited has white borders, showing that the cards are reprints
< 1529016626 282622 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it before tenth ed?
< 1529016634 249737 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's complex, I think before tenth edition they always changed the art
< 1529016640 215999 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that the card could be argued to be not technically a reprint?
< 1529016644 336092 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529016655 43566 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and wait
< 1529016682 403804 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right
< 1529016682 954307 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529016705 914548 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I think that was the rule
< 1529016707 348458 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but there were definitely reprints in black-bordered sets before tenth, e.g. Birds of Paradise is in the original Ravnica (between 9th and 10th)
< 1529016718 672674 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ok
< 1529016745 634178 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really the whole border color thing became a mess fairly quickly
< 1529016748 371103 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is why they got rid of it
< 1529016770 969395 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529016772 415759 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good thing
< 1529016787 641798 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also good thing they allow more reprints, and new cards in core sets since M10
< 1529016798 527553 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, maybe that's a bad thing now
< 1529016804 684410 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :means too many standard-legal cards
< 1529016808 92319 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they keep printing more per year
< 1529016824 418708 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they keep inventing new ways to cheat the quota every two yeras
< 1529016851 596215 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, they intended Standard to rotate faster
< 1529016855 865846 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the number of new cards keep increasing
< 1529016873 88166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they thought that would improve the gameplay (and it'd also reduce the number of cards available)
< 1529016874 394804 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even without standard, just more new unique cards all the time
< 1529016883 31949 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but people were unwilling to buy Standard cards if they wouldn't be legal for very long
< 1529016893 69775 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they deny that, but actually keep increasing the numbers in various sneaky ways
< 1529016940 559002 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although some of them aren't modern legal, they're almost all eternal legal and casual legal
< 1529016948 395950 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's hard to follow the card pool
< 1529016988 258787 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are new cards in casual products, new cards in commander products every year, new cards in core sets, mythic rares mean 15 extra new cards per set since Alara or whatever it was,
< 1529017012 666808 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the addition of mythics actually reduced the set size
< 1529017016 258733 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think there will now be four expert expansions printed per year, not two, plus the core sets
< 1529017021 913408 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or will there be only three plus a core set now?
< 1529017024 207265 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sets are larger nowadays but it's because they increased the number of uncommons
< 1529017065 957719 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(each individual rare is more common now than before mythics were added, which greatly reduces the number of rares you need to make the probabilities add to 1)
< 1529017080 117422 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, Origins is a core set too, right? that's basically M2016 with a funny name
< 1529017090 312022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, Origins is a core set
< 1529017109 752959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least it was in the core set "slot" and had a similar purpose
< 1529017109 771106 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like core sets, I was sad when they abolished them, and was afraid of abolishing the block system because that would mean four new sets per year,
< 1529017129 828850 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :will it be three standard-legal expoansions plus a core set now, or four plus a core sets?
< 1529017144 698606 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the abolishment of core sets demonstrated to me that Magic had a direction different from the one I wanted, but it was a symptom, not a cause
< 1529017160 196748 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there's always like two legacy-legal casual expansion per yera now, with new cards: yearly commander and one extra per year that keeps changing
< 1529017168 80715 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically my vision of Magic was as a game which rarely had major changes, just kept getting progressively improved
< 1529017177 192786 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Wizards see it as a game that relies on frequent shake-ups
< 1529017180 35946 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: what? didn't you realize that way before they abolished core sets?
< 1529017192 213771 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, yes
< 1529017198 277008 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529017211 39066 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Without major shakeups, they'll run out of design space, I think
< 1529017216 66115 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I guess they announced that like a year before Origins or more
< 1529017227 106373 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the major shakeups use up design space way faster than incremental improvements would
< 1529017229 277933 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's one year earlier than I thought that you're talking about
< 1529017230 187347 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ok
< 1529017255 622349 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm the sort of person who'd like to see each set being 90% similar to the one before, with only balance changes
< 1529017276 475398 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I doubt that'd make enough money to keep Wizards happy
< 1529017277 390649 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, and they're very bad for a casual player who has years when he doesn't even look at M:tG
< 1529017293 604066 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you come back a year later and the whole system has changed, not just one new block and one core set now
< 1529017295 413464 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :every year
< 1529017326 129579 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with Battle for Zendikar they changed a huge number of things all at once
< 1529017327 68167 :Kai_Bruneji!~kvirc@62.33.194.66 QUIT :Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/
< 1529017331 874881 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will make it hard to see which ones worked and which ones didn't
< 1529017362 987472 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even when it isn't, they print like twice as many distinct cards a year as they used do, if you care about reprints changing the price and non-tournament-staple cheap cards too and want to look through them to find the common and uncommon gems
< 1529017363 617234 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't help that that block was the worst block they've produced in years…
< 1529017398 79600 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I see
< 1529017434 502036 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tenth ed and M2010 both changed a lot of things too at the same time
< 1529017478 453697 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then more recently they've had a rash of balance issues
< 1529017496 758999 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BfZ block's main issue was color balance, e.g. green was basically unplayable
< 1529017504 23894 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :such as introducing modern, introducing yearly core sets (instead of one per two year) with new cards, a whole rewrite of the comp rules, a big change in the comp rules respectively
< 1529017506 392587 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but at least that doesn't ruin Standard
< 1529017508 701579 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :those were two hectice years
< 1529017533 518981 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that border thing and more reprints in standard-legal expansions I guess
< 1529017546 753152 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more recently they've had huge problems trying to prevent single decks or cards being dominant
< 1529017559 573030 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there have been so many card banned from standard over the past few sets…
< 1529017562 75952 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, when did they start the more reprints in standard-legal sets? was it in zendikar? or later?
< 1529017577 513403 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was meant to be when they got rid of core sets
< 1529017583 592578 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as they had to put the reprints somewhere
< 1529017588 193439 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: in what formats?
< 1529017595 460877 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, standard
< 1529017613 658514 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: hmm
< 1529017618 233506 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to remember all the standard bans recently
< 1529017628 579347 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thikn it was earlier
< 1529017649 209584 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not
< 1529017650 63530 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529017700 962192 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are seven cards banned from Standard right now (with people calling for an eighth), and some of the cards that rotated out at the last rotation were banned at the time, too
< 1529017734 810265 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's actually Coldsnap, one year before Tenth ed, when they decided they can get away with some new way to sneak print more cards every two years if they disguise it well somehow
< 1529017740 692294 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://mtg.gamepedia.com/Timeline_of_DCI_bans_and_restrictions#2017
< 1529017746 333873 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :later they got so good in it that they're doing it every year, then more
< 1529017800 804972 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nine total Standard bans since the start of 2017
< 1529017814 312546 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529017837 748109 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :first M2010 and yearly core sets with new cards to make up for the supposed "reduced set sizes" that they announced at Time Spiral (right after the huge but Tenth Ed which is reprint-only but standard-legal), then with casual expansions with eternal-legal cards, and often standard-legal extra stuff
< 1529017856 581681 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Coldsnap was the first
< 1529017877 125131 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's when they realized they can do this without being too obvious that it's something they repeat every year
< 1529017899 781814 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the most recent Standard ban before that was two cards in 2011, before that was eight in 2005 (five of which were a cycle) and one in 2004, before that was eight in 1999 and two in 1998
< 1529017906 65138 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now we have yearly Commander sets for eternal too
< 1529017916 630730 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the latest screwup balancing Standard is the worst since 1999…
< 1529017921 534391 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and lots of reprints of old casual cards to make them cheaper
< 1529017935 962636 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes reprints of good eternal cards like Sol Ring too
< 1529017978 963465 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: the cycle is the artifact lands in Mirrodin?
< 1529017984 657943 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529018017 658186 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and Skullclamp or that blade or sword thingy that often freely sacrifices itself or whatever
< 1529018022 364532 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, mirrodin was strange
< 1529018033 835376 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what was in 2011?
< 1529018084 563943 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but yes, they had very few standard bans, often none for years, and also very few bans in limited or block-constructed
< 1529018100 680879 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously they still avoid bans in limited, because they suck
< 1529018117 815443 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(they errata instead)
< 1529018123 681900 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529018125 433874 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :2011 was the dominance of Caw-Blade
< 1529018137 502253 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the card banned from it were Jace, the Mind Sculptor and Stoneforge Mystic
< 1529018191 76843 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Walking Atlas was an errata that was immediate, before the card was even released. that was very rare, and still is. at least that one isn't for power level.
< 1529018220 442829 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they didn't even have oracle texts the last time they'd need that, when they misprinted that mana symbol in some card back in some very old expansion
< 1529018244 200293 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Marath
< 1529018245 330213 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Marath, Will of the Wild \ RGW \ Legendary Creature -- Elemental Beast \ 0/0 \ Marath, Will of the Wild enters the battlefield with a number of +1/+1 counters on it equal to the amount of mana spent to cast it. \ {X}, Remove X +1/+1 counters from Marath: Choose one -- \ � Put X +1/+1 counters on target creature. X can't be 0. \ � Marath deals X damage to target creature or player. X can't be 0. \ � Create an X/X green Elemental creature token. X can't be 0
< 1529018260 500983 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "X can't be 0" was on-release errata
< 1529018287 399113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the third mode turned out to be pretty broken without that :-)
< 1529018322 776721 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah yes, Jace. he's the Twilight Sparkle of M:tG, gains a new major power every year. M:tG now has nine Jaces, highest count planeswalker ever, and a surprisingly high number of them were tournament-relevant
< 1529018326 598520 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, three or more
< 1529018351 234241 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and like two so broken they dominate a format or is banned
< 1529018387 287138 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are two Jaces so broken they dominated a format, but I think only JtMS got banned
< 1529018394 456779 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
< 1529018395 157247 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jace, Vryn's Prodigy \ 1U \ Legendary Creature -- Human Wizard \ 0/2 \ {T}: Draw a card, then discard a card. If there are five or more cards in your graveyard, exile Jace, Vryn's Prodigy, then return him to the battlefield transformed under his owner's control. \ [Front face. Transforms into Jace, Telepath Unbound.] \ ORI-M
< 1529018410 198755 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that one dominated a format too, but it never got banned AFAIR
< 1529018417 823320 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are also nine Chandras, but they don't get that powerful in tournaments, only in the story
< 1529018434 299368 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was a running joke how many bad Chandras got printed
< 1529018437 244295 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah
< 1529018440 636388 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although Wizards managed to print a tournament-viable one eventually
< 1529018537 580998 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is the bullet for choose one showing as a half-width katakana ki in IRC
< 1529018547 477079 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1529018552 258531 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are seven Ajani, 6 Garruk, 6 Gideon, 7 Liliana, 8 Nissa (wtf, I didn't follow the story, when did she do that?),
< 1529018566 554417 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably because I have znc configured to parse as sjis if utf-8 fails
< 1529018573 201181 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why isn't HackEso sending UTF-8
< 1529018593 235499 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I distinctly remember when some people played with 8 Jaces (4 each of two different ones) in Standard
< 1529018606 126133 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that was early, in like the first three jaces
< 1529018626 399361 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what halfwidth characters does shift-jis have? ascii is halfwidth, and presumably it has all the katakana
< 1529018633 827001 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it have hiragana too, or is that only fullwidth?
< 1529018654 498219 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: that doesn't really count, though, Jace Beleren was only played to legend-rule the opponent's JtMS
< 1529018667 54544 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait
< 1529018670 866344 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ask oren or zzo38 about that, I don't know anything about shift-jis
< 1529018673 264684 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do that with the original jace rather than new jace
< 1529018675 747261 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, well
< 1529018680 36092 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :jace, the wallet sculpter
< 1529018683 46088 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah
< 1529018687 19923 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see
< 1529018691 287970 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's broken
< 1529018691 701571 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was it a budget deck thing?
< 1529018694 881550 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, really broken
< 1529018701 553976 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: you were playing 8 Jaces, your own JtMS, and JB in order to legend-rule the opponent's
< 1529018706 876779 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1529018721 954251 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't want to legend-rule the opponent's with a JtMS if you could help it as you'd want to play the JtMS afterwards
< 1529018732 405949 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the legend rule has changed now (and the planeswalker equivalent of it, too)
< 1529018741 37678 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that sort of trick doesn't work any more
< 1529018751 421602 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, playing wastelands to destroy any of 10 to 20 dual lands relevant in standard, that's fair game. but playing to kill one card? crazy
< 1529018767 547326 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's how centralised the metagame was
< 1529018774 573490 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean
< 1529018778 919300 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :MTG has a sideboard
< 1529018780 744369 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and explains why JtMS and Stoneforge Mystic ended up getting banned
< 1529018788 738991 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :playing to kill any artifact, or any red card, or any green card, or any enchantment, or any zero-mana spell, or any one-mana spell, etc, that's also fair
< 1529018794 894424 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but playing to kill one card is crazy
< 1529018804 489241 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529018818 983281 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was this standard?
< 1529018821 969614 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: yes, but this was 8 jaces in main deck
< 1529018822 77418 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529018823 503378 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in standard
< 1529018836 713747 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not all decks perhaps, but some tournament standard decks
< 1529018845 737319 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also had 8 other planeswalkers iirc
< 1529018853 845347 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that's not as strange as 8 jaces
< 1529018858 386095 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Creeping Tar Pit
< 1529018859 120842 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Creeping Tar Pit \ Land \ Creeping Tar Pit enters the battlefield tapped. \ {T}: Add {U} or {B} to your mana pool. \ {1}{U}{B}: Creeping Tar Pit becomes a 3/2 blue and black Elemental creature until end of turn and can't be blocked this turn. It's still a land. \ WWK-R
< 1529018872 705945 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ genuinely played in Legacy as a JtMS-specific counter
< 1529018884 322349 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least it doesn't hurt your deck much if the opponent doesn't play JtMS
< 1529018904 559892 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, even 8 Llanowars wouldn't look that strange, and these days you could play them (I only have one of the other ones)
< 1529018912 616023 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just 8 Jaces that looks strange for some reason
< 1529018920 525665 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :llanowar elf, fyndhorn elf, elvish mystic
< 1529018923 910529 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Original Jace's still playable, isn't it?
< 1529018935 457916 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: right, Jace Beleren isn't a terrible card
< 1529018943 878259 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, now there are three
< 1529018953 127694 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :all in modern
< 1529018984 774475 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only have lots of Llanowar Elves and 1 Fyndhorn so far
< 1529018986 869873 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also boreal druid, avacyn's pilgrim, noble hierarch
< 1529018996 409527 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and Arbor Elves, yes
< 1529019000 808777 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(variants that produce other types of mana)
< 1529019011 996193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :elves of deep shadow, too, but that has a drawback
< 1529019037 399810 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and deathrite shaman (not modern-legal but only because it was banned)
< 1529019041 232330 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :My first deck involved 4x Plated Geopeed/4x Steppe Lynx/4x Adventuring Gear
< 1529019042 395024 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess
< 1529019044 351646 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :similar idea?
< 1529019045 72306 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1529019128 441765 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, we've got rather offtopic from discussing Omni-Tell
< 1529019187 42944 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I play Arbor elf a lot because it comes up for three reasons: (1) Imperiosaur, (2) I enchant land with auras, especially Elvish Guidance in the elf deck, and get double the lots of mana and go off, great finisher while still a Llanowar effectively, (3) If I can untap the Arbor Elves, I get an extra mana for free, that used to exist but only on card
< 1529019187 135558 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s in 3 mana and up, Arbor Elves is the first at 1 mana and otherwise good card.
< 1529019197 732477 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I know. that's deliberate.
< 1529019214 305952 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can read Omni-Tell later, when we're not having a conversation, and I'm too tired to do anything useful
< 1529019230 305626 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't really mean off-topic
< 1529019233 673388 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more that it had drifted a long way
< 1529019240 139317 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529019263 418227 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that you're always active on IRC when I'm not there or busy
< 1529019276 285929 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm grabbing the opportunity
< 1529019307 951007 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :timezone problem or something, despite that you live in Europe
< 1529019320 635247 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I live in Europe but mostly sleep on a US schedule
< 1529019323 596248 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually sleep earlier than this weekdays, for work
< 1529019334 397662 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should be sleeping now actually, but meh
< 1529019348 644901 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you are only in on weekdays evening US time, and even from that only late
< 1529019378 626965 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, IRC tends to distract me from work (as it is at the moment!)
< 1529019382 869053 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529019386 174163 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was doing an OS update yesterday
< 1529019405 136365 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which was pretty useful as it gave me a lot of esoinspiration (I can't do much but talk during those)
< 1529019407 364107 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it didn't go too well, though
< 1529019413 926127 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lots of things are still broken
< 1529019466 538024 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: you started at Zendikar? I see
< 1529019481 295994 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :face is the place *nod nod*
< 1529019482 430572 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hear that was a surprisingly good set, so that makes sense
< 1529019493 959220 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :might have brought in new players
< 1529019599 234951 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I started at Coldsnap (actually played the first time at Dissension, which is one set before, but bought the first card of my own when Coldsnap was out)
< 1529019608 238310 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good sets tend to bring in new players for the set afte
< 1529019609 821167 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*after
< 1529019619 983155 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, that must have been it for me
< 1529019629 668612 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Avacyn Restored is considered a fairly bad set but was very popular
< 1529019635 228665 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ravnica BLOCK was good, not just Dissension specifically
< 1529019650 534246 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, I /finished/ at Coldsnap, pretty much
< 1529019659 616515 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I abandoned Magic during Lorwyn as I wasn't enjoying it at all
< 1529019770 991097 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I paused or stopped buying cards shortly before New Phyrexia (not because of that set, just at)
< 1529019792 540063 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because we could no longer play regularly, and always play so rarely that it's not worth my time to figure out which cards to buy
< 1529019808 103320 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm considering to get back at some point, casually, and buy more cards
> 1529019811 66323 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07GetWhen14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55798&oldid=55791 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (-17) 10more typos/clarification
< 1529019832 91803 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, a casual way, not for tournaments
< 1529019892 574991 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it didn't help that New Phyrexia was when I was still in university, so relatively poor when it comes to my own money, with my parents and the state supporting my education but I don't want to spend *that* on M:tG
> 1529019911 389540 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Equipage14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55799 5* 03Ais523 5* (+614) 10/* Minimized purely concatenative languages */ new section
< 1529019938 821963 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :compared to being not rich but at least having my own money I earn myself from a job, which means I can spend it on objectionable stuff, and M:tG is one of those
< 1529020000 49969 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want to spend money on M:tG any more
< 1529020002 590065 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's being mismanagd
< 1529020004 361810 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\, zzo38: " what halfwidth characters does shift-jis have? ascii is halfwidth, and presumably it has all the katakana"
< 1529020017 301461 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pinging them because they're the ones on this channel that I think might know this off-hand
< 1529020020 923841 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I guess I could just look it up
< 1529020077 118724 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm good at this sort of stuff, for anything relevant on the west, but I don't know the oriental ones like shift-jis and kanjis and fullwidth graphics characters etc
< 1529020078 957632 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like half-width katakana and a few half-width punctuation marks
< 1529020091 919289 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it doesn't have all of ASCII
< 1529020096 557965 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's missing backslash and tilde
< 1529020105 681691 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1529020109 935535 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tilde?
< 1529020115 326930 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not underscore or caret?
< 1529020122 909711 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, tilde
< 1529020128 883258 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1529020151 865491 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, I guess makes sense, some of the ISO-646 replace it too, but only together with at least six others, not alone
< 1529020176 435197 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :caret and underscore and backtick are the ones I thought you can lose alone or in pair without losing any other ascii
< 1529020187 779288 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, backslash for the yen sign
< 1529020199 110572 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oddly, it has the C0 control codes (including DEL), but doesn't obey Ecma-35 rules because it uses some of the C1 bytes as the leading byte of a two-byte sequence
< 1529020221 406681 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that appeared even in some early 8-bit no-shift character set
< 1529020276 149940 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…after thinking about it, Ecma-35 is pretty ridiculous, isn't it?
< 1529020281 509517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no wonder terminal encoding is so difficult
< 1529020294 72257 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, people gave up on that
< 1529020301 7676 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they only use ascii controls now
< 1529020303 800364 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :better
< 1529020318 138053 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, C1s are commonly used, it's just that they're written with the 7-bit encoding
< 1529020332 960817 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that they don't clash with a character encoding that uses the C1s for illict purposese
< 1529020357 110733 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ESC [ is a 7-bit encoding of CSI, for example, that's really commonly used
< 1529020361 833798 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, somehow today there are very few places that filter out \x00 or \x7f, and very few programs that consider it whitespace
< 1529020391 743497 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :interestingly, CSI is in Unicode but terminals don't recognise it when it uses a multibyte encoding
< 1529020407 127640 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right
< 1529020427 990000 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ›
< 1529020429 247454 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+009B ]
< 1529020434 763023 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yep
< 1529020440 626212 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ESC [ always was there
< 1529020441 155011 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it encodes to two bytes, and terminals usually have the VT-100 state machine not do any complex character decoding beforehand?
< 1529020446 95257 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and was always commonly used
< 1529020449 730400 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC should use that for color codes really :-P
< 1529020453 385969 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe it does?
< 1529020458 192136 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no
< 1529020468 565355 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC has its own strange mirc color codes system that's horrible
< 1529020469 934714 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :test: ›1mbold›0m
< 1529020469 953003 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean
< 1529020492 342677 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could without any incompatibilities
< 1529020507 357918 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, but that's not what's done.
< 1529020509 374662 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :really horrible, much more so than the VT-100 state machine, because it's small but has bad rules, can't encode certain combos because it's missing terminators
< 1529020519 704861 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, you can't color a digit
< 1529020534 550660 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :stick a zero-width space in there
< 1529020535 693652 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you color the character before that or put some other formatting on the digit too
< 1529020540 374173 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :044
< 1529020541 241322 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1529020559 990876 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, that works now that everyone interprets every irc channel as utf-8 too
< 1529020570 667201 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people started that only like 5 years ago
< 1529020576 459629 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 10?
< 1529020588 649443 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :[color]04[digit] works in the IRC scheme
< 1529020591 508275 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 years ago it was less common, but still a thing.
< 1529020610 202700 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, Hexchat's implementation
< 1529020623 456446 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when did the admins of freenode/#ubuntu-hu stop insisting that they're encoded iso-8859-2 and anyone who types utf-8 is warned and then quieted?
< 1529020651 761470 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still remember that change, it was great, but not when it was
< 1529020726 780536 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was the last channel where anyone pretended that irc doesn't use utf-8 in typical channel messages
< 1529020777 819763 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1529020784 844356 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's now a de-facto standard that messages to public are utf-8 by default, althoguh you can still encode any byte string except for three bytes in IRC messages internal between agreeing clients
< 1529020846 267931 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can send broken utf-8, but everyone interprets what you send as utf-8 by default, and may complain about broken messages if you send non-utf8 bytes, or may ignore it silently but think you're doing something wrong with your client config
< 1529020869 157784 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :before that people assumed every channel may have a different ascii-compatible encoding
< 1529020906 982302 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529020951 729387 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :even though clients mostly just supported one encoding, but that's like how every computer and operating system supported one encoding back before about windows 95, the one byte encoding or shifting encoding that your region uses.
< 1529020959 821491 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :region and operating system brand.
< 1529021011 998192 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it was web browsers that made computers start to be able to at least regularly convert from any input encoding
< 1529021047 358484 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even then it was a lot of time until other applications could do that, together with windows getting modified to be based on early unicode and utf-16
< 1529021081 3729 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but even then for a while programs couldn't just decode an encoding, just the one "operating system default code page" that's activated or sometyhign
< 1529021104 868889 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or two, one for windows and one in terminals only
< 1529021195 701511 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on UNIXalikes, the way it was meant to work is that the user would set LC_CTYPE, and all programs would assume input was in that encoding and produce output in that encoding
< 1529021220 255795 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which works fine for pipes, less well for files (unless you try to ensure all your files are in the same encoding), and not really over networks
< 1529021223 56338 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, but they didn't have any unicode encoding to convert to internally
< 1529021228 796703 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(although network traffic should have a specified encoding)
< 1529021231 822233 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so programs could barely implement that
< 1529021242 553664 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they only knew which characters are whitespace and all that
< 1529021246 658469 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they had wchar_t, just didn't know what it meant
< 1529021247 454126 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps a locale-aware wcwidth
< 1529021253 417403 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not much more
< 1529021260 957332 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually wcwidth is kind-of broken
< 1529021276 683927 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :true width calculation is more complex than you'd expect
< 1529021291 902180 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means a programs could tell letters from punctuation with locale-aware isupper/islower, but not much else
< 1529021304 72102 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for libuncursed2 I've worked out an algorithm that correctly calculates the width of well-formed Unicode
< 1529021311 877806 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can produce bizarre results on malformed input
< 1529021370 247254 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and the difference isn't even something about following new unicode standards quickly even if the user doesn't update their libc every year and so doesn't get a newer data backing the wcwidth, right?
< 1529021390 730979 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not just tables for newer characters, I mean
< 1529021463 461473 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: it's because multiple adjacent codepoints can merge into a single grapheme
< 1529021488 935312 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, in retrospect now I'm glad we got rid of that and everyone uses utf-8 or utf-16 and unicode ONLY, but it took lots of years to get there
< 1529021497 737562 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is careful to avoid the word "character" when this level of distinction matters, as both "codepoint" and "grapheme" are possible concepts that correspond to it

< 1529021512 185892 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right, that's why you have to pull in a full libicu for unicode stuff
< 1529021561 705465 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which can do normalization, or all those computations on any utf-16-nativeendian string without visible normalization, or a few of those computations on utf-8 strings as a bonus (the main interface is utf-16 native).
< 1529021660 551809 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, libuncursed2 uses unicode, not utf-8
< 1529021670 123582 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :strings are stored as ucs-4 internally
< 1529021690 691870 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but utf-8 is used for communicating with applications
< 1529021699 805097 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also localization-aware soring and uppercasing (turkish i) and all that crazy stuff if you want, but WITHOUT unix locales needed anywhere.
< 1529021704 944091 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :utf-8 is a good transmission and storage format but bad for other things
< 1529021730 265058 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Iıİi
< 1529021753 558694 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right, that's why libicu and python and many other libraries use utf-16-native when they want anything unicode or localization-related
< 1529021753 813947 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :What operators is UTF-8 bad for?
< 1529021760 358830 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :operations*
< 1529021763 144439 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMO Unicode should have used different codepoints for the two Turkish Is than for the Latin I
< 1529021791 716795 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: that wouldn't have worked either
< 1529021796 823387 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: finding the nth codepoint of a string
< 1529021810 833649 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :... when is this an operation you do?
< 1529021815 512094 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wob_jonas: presumably because of compatibility with legacy encodings that don't distinguish
< 1529021815 712876 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: then on a turkish machine people wouldn't be able to type an ascii i from the keyboard, or only with some really special key combo that most users don't use
< 1529021836 159004 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: well in libuncursed2 we have an array of grapheme clusters, each of which is an array of codepoints
< 1529021838 652659 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and then they can't use normal forms that aren't unicode-aware but would accept simple ascii strings with an i
< 1529021845 223419 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529021880 504396 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indexing within the clusters is important
< 1529021889 991982 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's taking the nth codepoint of a string, effectively
< 1529021915 9834 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rust, at least, gets away just fine with UTF-8 strings internally. In my experience, indexing by a codepoint in particular is never what you actually want except in rare cases.
< 1529021929 503981 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's what you want if you have a single grapheme
< 1529021931 423191 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :You want to index a particular known point in the string, in which case, a byte index suffices.
< 1529021941 951747 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :normally you want to index by grapheme or by visual width
< 1529021956 219740 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you only have the one grapheme then a codepoint is probably what you're looking for when you're indexing
< 1529022012 626865 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :When would you need to say "I want the second codepoint period in O(1) time"?
< 1529022132 72425 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you're trying to determine which of the many sorts of grapheme clusters you have
< 1529022154 187012 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529022167 154383 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. if it's a Korean syllable, it follows different rules from if it's an emoji
< 1529022177 241650 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't do that with an one-pass iterator?
< 1529022208 692063 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'm assuming you found the cluster itself via indexing an array of grapheme clusters, so now you have the cluster
< 1529022226 529747 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: my opinion is that with the turkish I, which was btw established shortly after Kemal Atatürk so definitely by the second world war, we're screwed and we would have been screwed anyway no matter what we do, because it's the one special case you need for language-dependent case folding, which would otherwise not be a thing and programs didn't
< 1529022226 613017 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric : need to support it.
< 1529022280 959330 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's really nothing you can do about it that doesn't require that special case in programs.
< 1529022302 764356 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm OK with a special case, but would like a special case that actually solves the problem
< 1529022306 104774 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need language-dependent processing for lots of other operations, like collation and search and comparison
< 1529022311 989773 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zxkuhfktbjanheow JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529022317 678792 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but not for case folding if it weren't for the turkish i
< 1529022319 887452 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you just have a "uses turkic rules" versus "uses latin rules" global switch, you can't casefold a string that mixes English and Turkish
< 1529022322 514670 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it complicates the programs
< 1529022333 903196 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: exactly
< 1529022345 519179 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so what would you do instead?
< 1529022348 26204 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, my experience in Rust has been that, even with very complex tasks like parsing/etc, the UTF-8 encoding has not been an issue.
< 1529022349 151880 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the string itself needs inbound signalling as to what language it's in
< 1529022361 942332 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :make the Turkish i a differen code point? then Turkish users can't use any ascii program without workarounds
< 1529022372 672097 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you need this for Japanese versus Chinese too; it's OK to say "these ideograms are the same" but the two languages need to render them slightly differently
< 1529022375 630217 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when they communicate to ascii programs, they need to filter their text through a normalization or something
< 1529022384 460983 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because, in practice, all the complaints about there being no O(1) indexing are rendered moot by... indexing by byte index instead of some concept of character indexes.
< 1529022400 950435 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523, cjk now takes 2x the codepoints
< 1529022402 650252 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :gratz
< 1529022406 55753 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :was it worth it?
< 1529022416 462287 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, font rendering too, not just Chinese but Cyrillic has the same problem
< 1529022432 219646 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lymia: this is actually the solution some Japanes users use
< 1529022446 511704 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however it would probably be better to have some sort of bracketing, like there is for bidi
< 1529022451 403335 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :*Japanese
< 1529022455 879064 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :therea are two to five different cyrillic scripts (I can't tell how many) that should have been encoded separately because they're never mixed, but they didn't for compatibility with legacy 8-bit encodings,
< 1529022491 744383 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the ascii hyphen or quotation mark
< 1529022503 851655 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I was going to say, this is a problem even in ASCII
< 1529022511 883568 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least they added a whole set of digits
< 1529022516 318175 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :only they never invented the non-compatibility characters then, because every program and font accepted only the unicode compatibility cyrillic
< 1529022519 456352 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :many typewriters didn't have a 0 or 1
< 1529022520 71059 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: right
< 1529022538 765806 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: and the hyphens and quotation marks, but those at least mostly have a character
< 1529022541 843052 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(one or two missing)
< 1529022550 668584 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and spaces
< 1529022554 85265 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode -
< 1529022554 759657 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+002D HYPHEN-MINUS]
< 1529022560 523619 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hyphen-minus is a mess of a character
< 1529022565 657424 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but for a while some fonts didn't have a character for some of those
< 1529022576 194924 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the newer ones
< 1529022583 278988 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, it's very late and I gtg now
< 1529022584 770027 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 PRIVMSG #esoteric :goodbye
< 1529022589 503572 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :night
< 1529022591 711735 :wob_jonas!b03f1863@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.176.63.24.99 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
< 1529022608 736012 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's rare to use a hyphen before a digit and fairly rare to use a minus before a letter, so perhaps they should have been split in some automated way?
< 1529022620 374024 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people don't have much trouble using a separate character for dash, after all
< 1529023070 596982 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't even know how to type a minus sign
< 1529024122 474425 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529024449 227098 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
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< 1529025763 315455 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have a Abelian group with binary operator # and identity @ and one more binary operator $ satisfying:   a$(b#c) = (a$b)$c   (a#b)$c = (a$c)#(b$c)   a$@ = a   @$a = @    What is a mathematical structure called if it satisfies this? (I know at least one example, but what is it called in general?)
< 1529025987 698450 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529026159 286046 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529029634 700805 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1529029928 545375 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Undefined behavior14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55800&oldid=55796 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-1) 10typo
< 1529030026 872549 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529030626 7605 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529030866 250500 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
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< 1529031054 429705 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/fM-x/text
< 1529031130 528261 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Read error: No route to host
< 1529031132 721171 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how I can exploit the concurrency of string rewriting with this approach. though there's probably a better way of doing it.
< 1529031169 188745 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529031186 148745 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can, for example, interleave the current global state between every two symbols and have it propagate from either end.
< 1529031599 245510 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e, you'd have one cursor per two symbols of space, ideally, including the start and end markers.
< 1529031773 631011 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1529031792 773998 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529032264 161717 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like this because I can have "builtins" that behave like hidden rules, like arithmetic ops that are done in one logical step, as well as other computationally heavy things or I/O.
< 1529032456 270636 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the issue is flow control, and the many apparent ways that that's possible. fork-join-style (I guess?) control is demonstrated above.
< 1529032495 823082 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is useful for sorting here, but I really want to abstract upwards towards random-access.
< 1529032519 230507 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :which makes me think I have to think more parallel than anything.
< 1529032580 840707 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :though this begs the question, what's underneath string rewriting? multiset rewriting? it looks a lot like linear logic, but I'm still not sure how you'd simulate things like a TM's tape. I guess godel numbering helps...
< 1529032626 695433 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's "too low", though, and I feel you wouldn't get the naive concurrency that you would with traditional string rewriting.
< 1529032759 604828 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be interesting to be proven wrong, though...
< 1529032803 574218 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you were to simulate a tape, you'd have to jump through a hoop to either something akin to a counter machine, or give every tape location a unique element of the multiset, with the multiplicity of that element being the symbol stored.
< 1529032845 47938 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :which, I mean, whatever, but this means in order to do something halfway useful with it, you need to plan out your storage requirements ahead of time, and the ruleset would be _complicated_.
< 1529032982 691975 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :at that point you've gone below the minimum structure required for "convenience".
< 1529035451 480795 :Naergon_!~Naergon@92.40.249.49.threembb.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529035462 235464 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
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< 1529037387 195395 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1529037446 305093 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07English Binerdy14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55801 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1814) 10Created page with "'''English Binerdy''' was created by [[user:Iamcalledbob]] to make [[Binerdy]] easier to program.  ==Instructions==  English Binerdy supports the following instructions:  {| c..."
> 1529038775 400101 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55802&oldid=55752 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+14) 10/* Obfuscation */
< 1529039503 60680 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1529040528 136324 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unhappy14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55803 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+833) 10Created page with "==:(== The title is "Unhappy" because of tecnical limitations. ==Overview== Commands start with or. The commands should be one line. Program runs every command one-by-one. =..."
< 1529040539 664435 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zxkuhfktbjanheow QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529042766 20345 :alercah!~alercah@unaffiliated/alercah PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: generalized monoid rewriting?
< 1529043005 815887 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: can you clarify?
< 1529043031 993912 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like ZZT game? Now I completed made up XYZABCDE.ZZT game.
> 1529043086 963015 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unhappy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55804&oldid=55803 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-111) 10/* Overview */
> 1529043155 869349 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unhappy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55805&oldid=55804 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-27) 10/* Commands */
< 1529043199 356528 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: why monoids and not semigroups?
< 1529043594 352758 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529043873 436933 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
> 1529044507 411773 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unhappy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55806&oldid=55805 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-2) 10/* Examples */
> 1529044541 454063 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unhappy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55807&oldid=55806 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2) 10/* Examples */
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< 1529048051 905458 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529048068 551459 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :great! they silently released svn 1.10 in 2018-04 and I never noticed:
< 1529048134 304938 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not in debian stable obviously, I haven't noticed so I haven't installed manually, I have installed it at work but I'm working only since 2018-05 after a long hiatus between 2015-02 and 2015-05,
< 1529048150 719954 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at work I've installed latest svn a months ago but didn't notice the version number until today,
< 1529048212 180295 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and their compatibility policy (summarized in the release notes http://subversion.apache.org/docs/release-notes/1.10 ) is actually so generous that you can almost always silently upgrade just the software, and get some but not all the new features immediately,
< 1529048285 682872 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and every minor version bump adds cool new features, and the only compat that you sometimes notice immediately is that the checkout (working copy) format changes completely between some but not all minor version upgrades (like every second minor version upgrade or so, but not deterministically)
< 1529048322 22192 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this time it didn't change between 1.10 and 1.9 which is why I didn't even notice that I'm not running 1.9 until now
< 1529048428 878315 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apache svn http://subversion.apache.org/ is great software, and I can really recommend it especially to the sort of people like me or zzo38 who are annoyed by a lot of user-facing software interface changing seriously like every two or three years now, and even a lot of backend libraries changing every five years so all the tech you learn is obsole
< 1529048429 19804 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :te in five years even if there's technically compatibility guarantees
< 1529048473 156962 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and most technology is unrecognizable every ten years with these occasional updates
< 1529048534 368321 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :svn is one of those software like sqlite that has had strong compatibility guarantees and only kept improving
< 1529048743 401835 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and svn stability goes back to version 1.0 in 2004, its C api is forward compatible since then, and existing repositories keep working forever in a compatible way (you lose some new features if you don't upgrade repository, but don't win), so you can mostly upgrade seamlessly, the only caveats are that
< 1529048926 910522 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(a) working copy format sometimes changes incompatibly, so you may have to recreate checkouts, you can't upgrade them from older formats, but even that only changed like five or six times since svn 1, and 2. (b) you can't downgrade or used mixed versions of svn on a client because of this,
< 1529048981 920334 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(c) you can't always easily create new repositories in formats readable by the oldest servers, so on a server you can't downgrade minor versions ever if you have created a repository
< 1529049048 60260 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's slightly worse than sqlite, which still has an option to create a database that sqlite 3.0 and every version since can read, even though creating such repositories isn't the default
< 1529049082 97093 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/repositories/databases/
< 1529049169 597559 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's interesting that svn 1.0 and sqlite 3.0, the respective first version that offered strong compatibility guarantees decades into the future, were both released in 2004.
< 1529049318 138191 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and for all the incompatibilities, they detail them nicely in release notes
< 1529049358 528759 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of them are even repeats: this release notes says
< 1529049365 554299 :wob_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Since "1.10.0" is smaller than "1.9.0" when considered as ASCII strings, scripts that compare Subversion versions as strings may fail to correctly determine which of "1.10.0" and "1.9.0" is the more recent one. Such scripts should be changed to compare Subversion version numbers correctly:"
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< 1529066840 405405 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
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> 1529068820 986497 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55808&oldid=55802 5* 03Ais523 5* (-14) 10Undo revision 55802 by [[Special:Contributions/Iamcalledbob|Iamcalledbob]] ([[User talk:Iamcalledbob|talk]]): Small isn't particularly hard to read as esolangs go; don't assume everything was written for obfuscation just because it uses only a few symbols
< 1529069446 295857 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529069525 493021 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529070203 880741 :Kai_Bruneji!~Kai_Brune@62.33.194.66 QUIT :Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/
< 1529072240 987828 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose it wouldn't do for agatha to visit britain and *not* have a murder mystery.
< 1529072277 698624 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They do seem to happen a lot here
< 1529072282 898539 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Almost as much as Denmark
< 1529072409 428122 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, i never got into that nordic stuff.
< 1529072433 471164 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not that i'm into crime mysteries in general either)
< 1529074593 645277 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529074947 720076 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh, spoiler!
< 1529075326 772043 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529075563 982608 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://play.rust-lang.org/?gist=cb7244f41c040db41fc447d491031263&version=nightly&mode=debug
< 1529075584 183896 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's some weirdness with Rust's type system at compiletime and two nightly features
< 1529075671 477341 :Kai_Bruneji!~Kai_Brune@62.33.194.66 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529076527 682737 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529076535 278519 :impomatic!~digital_w@host81-136-104-94.range81-136.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529078607 674066 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: hey, it was obvious in the _previous_ comic, and pretty much telegraphed since a page after the first mention of the guy.
< 1529078838 989243 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero
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< 1529080886 627030 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :xkcd is a groaner
< 1529083369 874961 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529084296 887161 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Read error: No route to host
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< 1529085020 139259 :Kai_Bruneji!~Kai_Brune@62.33.194.66 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529089737 990193 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found a problem with the documentation of SQLite. The type for the xCreate/xConnect methods of virtual tables says that the "argv" argument is "char**argv" but actually the correct type is "const char*const*argv".
< 1529090135 935958 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ehhh?
< 1529090188 798039 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-13-153.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you use SQLite?
< 1529090258 877314 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ujgbvdjtarzvthtq JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1529096757 212553 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55809&oldid=55315 5* 03ZM 5* (+37) 10
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> 1529098762 723920 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03GiratronKode 5*  10New user account
< 1529098909 862287 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529099491 725474 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The address has changed because a new modem has been installed.
> 1529100343 738097 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Equipage14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55810&oldid=55763 5* 03Ais523 5* (+2734) 10/* Computational class */ proof via Minsky machines
> 1529100361 211011 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Equipage14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55811&oldid=55810 5* 03Ais523 5* (-12) 10/* External resources */ recat, computational class is now known
> 1529100456 850824 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Equipage14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55812&oldid=55811 5* 03Ais523 5* (+8) 10/* See also */ add 7, which is very similar to Equipage but uses a different set of commands
< 1529100609 347171 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529101136 841066 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55813&oldid=55656 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (+234) 10
> 1529101161 296224 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07InfSt14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55814 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (+3702) 10Created page with "Hello, I'm GiratronKode and this is my first attempt to do an esolang, please have that in mind.  ==Usage== InfSt has 3 commands:   ''search stones'' => searches for an infini..."
< 1529102867 703442 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1529108708 80428 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55815&oldid=55809 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+0) 10typ(ewriter)o
< 1529109140 352512 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
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< 1529109897 349975 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
> 1529110618 309916 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Equipage14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55816&oldid=55812 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+0) 10Check your category speeling, folks!
< 1529110763 384642 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is half tempted to add yafgclist, as irregular as it's been recently

< 1529110815 326284 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1529110819 149701 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hierjan
< 1529110834 329513 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :does hierjan write in hieroglyphs
< 1529112066 248667 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hichaf. no, in hittite cuneiform hth
< 1529112102 950189 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you take 21 minutes to think of that pun
< 1529112419 640722 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, just to notice you had spoken hth
< 1529112456 380558 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :my irc awareness really went downhill after i started using the web browser full screen
< 1529113498 205387 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found the error of SQLite documentation that I have reported have now been corrected.
< 1529113529 54584 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: How much space is taken up by other stuff when it is not full screen?
< 1529114098 962063 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: previously i used to have just enough spare width to have the left part of the putty window show up to 3 characters of irc nicks.
< 1529114112 916885 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :behind the browser window.
< 1529114129 495323 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is enough to notice if things are moving there.
< 1529114202 488280 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh and a little spare width to the left of putty to see the most important desktop icons.
< 1529114284 628343 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no desktop icons on my computer, so it does not take up so much space; only the two pixel window border is to the left.
< 1529114317 299755 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i rarely use the desktop icons these days, most programs are on the menu bar.
< 1529114388 598033 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :or whatever it's actually called, the bottom one.
< 1529114438 992582 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you mean the Start menu on Windows, then I know (although it can be moved to the top or left or right, too). I am on Linux and I have no menu bar on my computer either.
< 1529114550 220224 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't mean the start menu, i mean the bar of icons on the same row as it
< 1529114590 63352 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :um, i guess the start menu icon itself is one.
< 1529114612 821650 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK
< 1529115181 74187 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529115715 26512 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, actually they put the start menu, window list, system tray icons, and date/time, all on the same row.
< 1529117164 423045 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529117959 428321 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :alercah: can you clarify on what you said last night? what is "generalized monoid rewriting"?
< 1529118180 8730 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :sans the empty string strings are semigroups iirc. so I guess what I'm doing could be classified as semigroup rewriting..?
< 1529119034 88811 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ujgbvdjtarzvthtq QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529125610 830636 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529125873 628723 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529126013 869554 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529126689 440379 :Naergon_!~Naergon@92.40.249.49.threembb.co.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529127720 681136 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529129307 712873 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529129364 786139 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529133942 252187 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529134641 252669 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529136437 952863 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ycoqzipyqoosdxzj JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529136668 148669 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[072.+-14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55817 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+417) 10Created page with "==2.+-== 2.+- is a variation of [[Deadfish]]. It has the following commands: {| class="wikitable" |- ! Command !! Result |- | 2 || Square the accumulator |- | . || Print the a..."
> 1529136806 368042 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55818&oldid=54946 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+81) 10/* Implementations */
> 1529137319 695009 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[072D BF14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55819&oldid=24984 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+39) 10
> 1529137750 43174 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Around and around, sleeping sound14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55820 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+686) 10Created page with "'''Around and around, sleeping sound''' is the name of a 2D programming language made by [[User:Iamcalledbob]], on June 16, 2018. It only has 4 commands:  {| class="wikitable"..."
> 1529137880 612710 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Around and around, sleeping sound14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55821&oldid=55820 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+3) 10
< 1529140656 2510 :grumblr!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529140804 94029 :grumble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Killed (barjavel.freenode.net (Nickname regained by services))
< 1529140804 181544 :grumblr!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble NICK :grumble
> 1529146044 136172 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Works in progress14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55822&oldid=52760 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+16) 10
> 1529146216 510358 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071st-Worst14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55823 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+88) 10Created page with "==1st-Worst== Try to make this programming language have as many bad things as possible."
< 1529146339 459360 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529147161 347586 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55824 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1588) 10Created page with "==Syntax== Turing is designed to have a very lightweight, readable, intuitive syntax. Here is the entire [[Hello World!]] program in Turing with [[syntax highlighting]]:   '''..."
< 1529147171 194679 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ycoqzipyqoosdxzj QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
> 1529147240 905848 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55825&oldid=55790 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+13) 10/* T */
> 1529147396 41821 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55826&oldid=55825 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+22) 10/* T */
> 1529147715 930803 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55827&oldid=55824 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-42) 10/* Syntax */
< 1529147723 350513 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529147788 894997 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529147799 923886 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55828&oldid=55827 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-66) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529147915 898825 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55829&oldid=55828 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-7) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148047 717624 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55830&oldid=55829 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+43) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148083 275820 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55831&oldid=55830 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-52) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148231 99492 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55832&oldid=55831 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+46) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148361 559165 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55833&oldid=55832 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-25) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148410 138653 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55834&oldid=55833 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-92) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148495 434717 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55835&oldid=55834 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-164) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148724 419551 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55836&oldid=55835 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+81) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148741 384394 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55837&oldid=55836 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148758 210069 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55838&oldid=55837 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-1) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148770 206348 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55839&oldid=55838 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+3) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148858 645485 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55840&oldid=55839 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-12) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148905 535750 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55841&oldid=55840 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+23) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529148940 539821 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55842&oldid=55841 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+24) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529149052 743322 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55843&oldid=55842 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+96) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529149081 415670 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55844&oldid=55843 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-1) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529149094 453188 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55845&oldid=55844 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+2) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529149233 471508 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55846&oldid=55845 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+14) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529149252 607866 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing(Programming language)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55847&oldid=55846 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-14) 10/* Syntax */
< 1529149322 825753 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529150046 756239 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Glass14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55848&oldid=53686 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+184) 10/* Hello, world! program */
> 1529151196 318994 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Glass14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55849&oldid=55848 5* 03Fizzie 5* (-60) 10/* Hello, world! program */ (_o) is a single command, better not to split it across lines
< 1529151543 151141 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529153002 195765 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529155830 741851 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529160484 277326 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529160615 844589 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529160900 300266 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529161045 136239 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :x86-64
> 1529161183 58112 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Featured languages/Candidates14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55850&oldid=53996 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+60) 10/* List of candidates */
< 1529161357 567815 :x86-64!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moony
< 1529162346 788303 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529162498 489419 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529162864 70887 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55851&oldid=55818 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-80) 10/* =2.+- */ Remove, o doesn't print a number
> 1529162988 37998 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Works in progress14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55852&oldid=55822 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+0) 10Put digits first
> 1529163127 85565 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10moved [[02Turing(Programming language)10]] to [[Turing (Iamcalledbob)]]: Bad spacing, also the other Turing is already a PL, technically
> 1529163229 958463 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55855&oldid=55826 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-4) 10/* T */ Renamed page
> 1529163299 337119 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10deleted "[[02Turing(Programming language)10]]": Broken name
< 1529163433 232984 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm apparently renaming and then removing redirect wipes it out of recent changes.
> 1529163530 968755 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 restore10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10restored "[[02Turing(Programming language)10]]": Keep it in recent changes, maybe
< 1529163556 878082 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, nope not reversible
> 1529163600 492805 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10deleted "[[02Turing(Programming language)10]]": That didn't work
> 1529163721 441369 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10moved [[02Turing10]] to [[Turing (Joshop)]]: Disambiguation
> 1529163897 971989 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55858&oldid=55857 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+114) 10disambig page
< 1529164570 850042 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529166169 46565 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529166529 989961 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:GiratronKode14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55859 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (+182) 10Created page with "Hi, I'm GiratronKode, I dont know what you're doing here but, the list below is a list of my esolangs:   * [[InfSt]]  And there is no more to say, bye ''viewer''! Category:P..."
> 1529166942 494637 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07InfSt14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55860&oldid=55814 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (+226) 10
> 1529166965 422093 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07InfSt14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55861&oldid=55860 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (-1) 10
> 1529167163 735655 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07InfSt14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55862&oldid=55861 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (+41) 10
< 1529167427 889731 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Later
< 1529168372 454826 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xuigmxddjcihpoqy JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529169270 371993 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07InfSt14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55863&oldid=55862 5* 03GiratronKode 5* (+2) 10
< 1529172218 32204 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529172865 951259 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529173330 21193 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529173538 935704 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529173688 403394 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529173703 605929 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so now that I've gotten a reasonable hold on string rewriting... I wonder if I can revisit my idea for a term rewriting system that has no variables.
< 1529173718 330218 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529173739 568672 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :he seems to leave at the best time.
< 1529173930 171753 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like the variable went out of scope.
< 1529173953 952449 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529174012 722479 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my issue with term rewriting systems is that it implies this secondary structure to store variable bindings.
< 1529174023 603848 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :essentially, RAM.
< 1529174072 370766 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :variable lookups and storing that structure severely complicates things. so I wonder if it can be excluded.
< 1529174119 791769 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529174125 790819 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.183.142.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529174581 994689 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if anybody has any resources they could point me to, I'll pay you in thanks. :P
< 1529176095 368907 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…
< 1529176183 393793 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529176188 236659 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529176393 345676 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529176649 770936 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529177003 427648 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think if you did remove variables, you'd end up with something akin to a string rewriting system over term-like strings.
< 1529177016 369128 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you could only examine the terms directly next to you.
< 1529177063 327853 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :and directly below you.
< 1529177129 165818 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :something trivial like swapping two subtrees would be incredibly difficult (or at least seems to be).
< 1529177211 662918 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you could do something with combinators..?
< 1529177365 476451 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529177484 963020 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529177685 373368 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529178501 2036 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529179879 48089 :rdococ!rdococ@unaffiliated/rdococ PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm experimenting (in my head) with the idea of "double CPS" (passing two continuations instead of one) and how it could be used to emulate delimited continuations.
< 1529181935 320287 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529182426 328388 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :`
< 1529182426 947427 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/srv/hackeso-code/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: : not found
> 1529184836 210323 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55864 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+5891) 10Created page with "'''Your Pong May Minsky''' is an [[esoteric programming language]] designed by [[Chris Pressey]], mostly on June 16 2018 and mostly for aesthetic purposes, which is clearly de..."
> 1529185085 158958 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Waterfall Model14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55865&oldid=55795 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+356) 10
> 1529185409 731749 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55866&oldid=55864 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+250) 10Note that a wall coming into existing over the ball does not count as a collision.
> 1529185612 952052 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55867&oldid=55866 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+108) 10Minor fix to the The Waterfall Model translation construction.
> 1529185837 247852 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55868&oldid=55867 5* 03Chris Pressey 5* (+172) 10Add an observation about "instruction pointer".
< 1529186279 277643 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529187329 241666 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get what an active wall is
< 1529188472 388671 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529188637 265265 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529188877 1680 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1529189440 601914 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5*  10New user account
< 1529189649 903799 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529189804 855346 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529193253 353900 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : he seems to leave at the best time. <-- sometimes i wonder if pingouts are triggered by nickpings, maybe the client crashes or something
< 1529194553 497101 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't remember if i've mentioned it before, but solving tatham's Loopy puzzle by only deleting lines (except for the final check) makes it a bit more challenging
< 1529194645 204831 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :some of the geometries make this more or less difficult
< 1529194997 801407 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :although it makes the final check a bit of boring clicking
> 1529195055 469357 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55869&oldid=55813 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5* (+140) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529195067 532331 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hexsp14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55870 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5* (+2314) 10Created page with "'''Hexsp''' is a programming language made by Otakuto. It is basically Lisp written in Hexspeak. Every code is written in hexadecimal numbers and it is supposed to resemble ma..."
> 1529197372 486917 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hexsp14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55871&oldid=55870 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5* (+111) 10
< 1529197382 322305 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529197440 565693 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hexsp14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55872&oldid=55871 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5* (+18) 10/* Sample Code */
< 1529197479 37626 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: have you seen quintopia?
< 1529197479 407317 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: i an- they were all democrats rely on ignorance of it you just even if you sit in the restaurant we were at the beginning
< 1529197494 868825 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: in a restaurant? which one?
< 1529197495 73490 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: but i do merchandising and mystery shopping
< 1529197506 95102 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: a mysterious shopping restaurant?????
< 1529197506 261496 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily: um that type of thing that's what i need and i love to
< 1529197537 58988 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( the restaurant that wasn't there yesterday )
< 1529197548 919352 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hily.
> 1529197636 789792 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hexsp14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55873&oldid=55872 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5* (+209) 10
< 1529197718 849046 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bonsϿirjan!
> 1529197736 125036 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55874&oldid=55855 5* 03Asangi a4ac 5* (+12) 10/* H */
< 1529197798 940848 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( yesterday, I ate a restaurant that wasn't there. it wasn't there again today... )
< 1529197934 217838 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that's what happened to the CIA's restaurant, you fiend!
< 1529198088 178656 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :which CIA?
< 1529198258 109141 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :the one which rhymes with "today" hth
< 1529201014 715434 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: FAVOURITE CHICKEN
< 1529202422 336941 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's your favorite model of computation?
< 1529202630 837401 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm warming up to string rewriting.
< 1529205052 218547 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529206028 673431 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
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< 1529206254 331844 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529206401 304313 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529215183 756971 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know what is the computation class of the Free Hero Mesh preprocessor? (ignoring hash table limits and memory limits)
< 1529215402 54408 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529215921 184819 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55875&oldid=55868 5* 03Zzo38 5* (+40) 10Add category
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> 1529231432 112805 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[0714]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55876 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+7785) 10Created page with "'''Chicken''' is an [[esoteric programming language]] by Torbjrn Sderstedt, in which "chicken" is the only valid symbol.  ==Language overview==  A chicken program consists..."
> 1529231702 616244 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[0714]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55877&oldid=55876 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-6515) 10
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< 1529236021 842491 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection
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> 1529238666 6402 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55878 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1901) 10/* Continuous waterfalls */ new section
< 1529239295 708783 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529242509 615957 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the integral of an analytic function necessarily analytic? (I love that this is potentially relevant for an esolang I'm making…)
< 1529242543 271633 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote
< 1529242544 328924 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :1280)  i don't approve of nuclear-free zones; without nuclei we'd not exist hth
< 1529242547 153070 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote
< 1529242547 856139 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :1196)  I am in room number 404.   I keep not finding it and walking past the door.
< 1529242549 790161 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote
< 1529242550 504271 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :711)  Just seen this comment on reddit: "Parallel programming has been a solved problem for decades." I might have to stop reading the internet.
< 1529242552 589835 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote
< 1529242553 376626 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :866)  Taneb: The other day on the channel I came up with BRAINLISPCODE, a LOLCODE-style LISP with an embedded bf derivative.  I thought you should know. :-I
< 1529242556 947582 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote
< 1529242557 515783 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :745)  The world would be a much classier place if the world was full of Gregors.   True, but how many of them are on fire?
< 1529242628 559420 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :err, indefinite integral
< 1529242876 872223 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529243180 705904 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529243594 621470 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Zackmowrer 5*  10New user account
> 1529244544 835444 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55879&oldid=55869 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+276) 10/* Introductions */
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< 1529246306 890767 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`5 quote
< 1529246309 92580 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/2:1267)  pikhq: The Google way isn't exactly NIH. They have their own variant of it. \ 972)  ok im sober now and DNS makes sense again [...]  Domain Name System [...]  ♫ domain name system ♫ \ 151)  I don't trust ducks. They always look like they're planning something. I'm not sure it's a good idea to give them language capabilities. \ 192) [CTCP] Received CTCP-ERRMSG reply from clog: unknown CTCP: ERRMSG. \ 97)  [...] i'm a law student so i am loving my bread machine
< 1529246563 431613 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529248441 187937 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: TOOL CHICKEN
> 1529248890 894213 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Your Pong May Minsky14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55880&oldid=55878 5* 03Ais523 5* (+220) 10a correction in the proof
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< 1529250526 173421 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529250945 518826 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : is the integral of an analytic function necessarily analytic? <-- yes
< 1529250945 837801 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529250962 528697 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :good to know
< 1529250976 979132 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529250977 654557 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm surprised that isn't mentioned anywhere on the relevant Wikipedia page (or at least if it is, I can't find it)
< 1529250981 126039 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :same radius of convergence on the power series iirc
< 1529250983 526604 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the Taylor series definition made it seem likely
< 1529251088 514104 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rbjdvnactubsdenh JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1529262670 745105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07R U DS14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55881 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+1815) 10Created page with "'''R U DS''' is an simple, [[:Category:Output only|output-only]] [[esoteric programming language]] [[Category:Languages]] created by Zackery Mowrer in [[:Category:2018|2018]]...."
> 1529263350 296502 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55882&oldid=55874 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+13) 10/* R */
< 1529263670 693369 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: for counter machines with a limited number of counters (let's call it 4 or 5), how would you represent sequential strings? godel numbering?
< 1529263701 396980 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: most likely as digits of a number
< 1529263711 27969 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. you interpret the string in base 256
< 1529263715 574653 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it's a string of octets
< 1529263720 115233 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or base 10 if it's a string of digits, etc.
< 1529263727 716183 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's an easy form to work with in counter machines because divmod tends to be easy
< 1529263783 545155 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :alright. how about instructions? do counter machines always have atomic instructions or are equivalent transition tables available for counter machines?
< 1529263905 107916 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e for every transition in a TM, I'm doing multiple operations in a single step, whereas for something like register machines I do larger operations incrementally by combining several atomic instructions.
< 1529263933 235835 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529263998 706891 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could have a kind of state transition table and simply list out whether each counter is incremented or decremented, and build things like multi-register NOPs off of that.
< 1529264068 665136 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be as simple as a boolean flag. 1 if you're incrementing, 0 if you're decrementing.
< 1529264140 182448 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hejwcxsdxtfojema JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529264187 893695 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: I think it's natural to build a test for zero into the decrement operation, in which case it's not perfectly symmetric with the increment.
< 1529265091 569446 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: good point. it'd still work though. if you wanted to increment _just one register_ (let's say you had 3), you could specify a state where you increment all of them, then decrement all but the one you want preserved.
< 1529265149 248598 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :control flow could be specified by a bitmask of the registers you wanted to check.
< 1529265193 560808 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's so ... unmathematical
< 1529265193 736534 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the notation for 3 registers would be `State:Reg1Zero,Reg2Zero,Reg3Zero:Reg1,Reg2,Reg3`
< 1529265224 998823 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :and atomic instructions are any better? :P
< 1529265233 829504 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :all this shit is arbitrary.
< 1529265387 68207 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :counter machines tend to vary a lot on how control flow works
< 1529265418 188085 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :having it as a side effect of decrement is common, though, as that's the only time you have useful information to check
< 1529265569 867940 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529265785 965192 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I'm actually genuinely curious, what part of that is unmathematical? vs. practically any other abstract machine formulation that's been presented since turing's paper.
< 1529265816 321191 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: "bitmask" :P
< 1529265850 465718 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh bugger off. :P
< 1529265858 936547 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(these binary operations are not very natural, if you can forgive the pun)
< 1529265904 258455 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really a bitmask, you use 0 to determine if you're decrementing and 1 to determine if you're incrementing, so "Increment register 1 and decrement registers 2 and 3" looks like 100. :P
< 1529265955 406147 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :"If you're in state 2, and registers 2 and 3 are zero, increment register 1, decrement registers 2 and 3, and go to state 3."
< 1529265967 941821 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :2:011:100:3
< 1529265992 497323 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's no accounting for taste. :P
< 1529266005 549517 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :taste be damned, it looks funny. :P
< 1529266018 87423 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :besides, isn't that the point of an esolang.
< 1529266059 458647 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it may be
< 1529266690 25393 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? this
< 1529266691 56089 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is something people on the channel like to talk about. We're often unsure what this is, though.
< 1529266714 353720 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? this page
< 1529266715 443406 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :This page intonationally left blank.
< 1529266740 305228 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn This page is under construction.
< 1529266742 355934 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'thi': This page is under construction.
< 1529266743 184584 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops.
< 1529266745 403353 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`revert
< 1529266746 512950 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Done.
< 1529266752 84588 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`le//rn this page//This page is under construction.
< 1529266754 95985 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Relearned 'this page': This page is under construction.
< 1529267138 168934 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: re-reading what you said keeps piquing my interest: what defines a natural operation? sans the pun.
< 1529267305 282448 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: Hmm, without the pun, it's really a matter of conventions (what does everybody else do?), elegance (is this needlessly complicated), and taste (uh the bit that cannot be defined but that one still forms strong opinions about).
< 1529267354 948589 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second is something that I'm concerned about, first maybe, third not so much. :P
< 1529267384 762703 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, there's no hard definition. (Note that there are interdependencies... elegance implicitly refers to conventions.
< 1529267387 768845 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :)
< 1529267455 564804 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd be hard-pressed to prove that implicit dependance. conventions are useful as a starting point imho but treating them as an upper limit gives you a sense of tunnel vision.
< 1529267507 319597 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we define "elegance" as the negation of needless complication, then there's a lot of old models that follow needless complication.
< 1529267550 352629 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I mean is that expressing things in terms of established notions, even somewhat clumsily, is usually preferred to developing a new language just to make a single definition elegant. Of course if that language extends to other definitions... well then you may be on the way to a new mathematical theory.
< 1529267635 213123 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a funny mention, term rewriting. not only do you have to maintain a list of bound variables + storage for all of the bound term trees for those variables, you have to go through the process of pattern matching on terms, which isn't that hard, but something I'd hardly call natural from my perspective.
< 1529267711 524912 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that imho is needlessly complicated. deceptively simple because it relies on the ability to keep state in your head relatively easily and relies on yor pattern matching ability, but deviates from what can be done strictly mechanically.
< 1529267884 965710 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again, that's just my perspective. I don't like anything that can't be done strictly mechanically in a trivial way unless it can be _reduced_. mainly because the more allowances you give, the more we're just talking in some abstract notation for algorithms, and my train of thought falls apart.
< 1529268326 183699 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529268520 380056 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CopyPasta Language14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55883&oldid=55576 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+22) 10Add Category:Languages
< 1529270701 931744 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: []
< 1529272233 296174 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529272370 328222 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529272395 296584 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529275803 844142 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529275905 438110 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529276403 698106 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb2build2 - http://znc.in
< 1529276423 329603 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529276550 309507 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529276675 891280 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529277260 570462 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529277313 329750 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529277815 351934 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529278031 294292 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529279620 873179 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529279652 107716 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is using webchat, nvg seems to be having network problems

< 1529279700 669609 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I keep thinking that means Taneb.
< 1529279710 642585 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? ngevd
< 1529279711 776221 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​$�m����e:^��O��˥�=_�5r�8����ָ�9��H5�AdB��
< 1529279740 762519 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? nvd
< 1529279741 850325 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :nvd is what Taneb calls himself when he wants to feel professional.
< 1529279744 73819 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? nvg
< 1529279745 195425 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :nvg? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
< 1529279816 292545 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529279912 637197 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn NVG is a student computer club in Trondheim, whose servers are frequently infiltrated by oerjan. Not to be confused with nvd.
< 1529279914 707518 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'nvg': NVG is a student computer club in Trondheim, whose servers are frequently infiltrated by oerjan. Not to be confused with nvd.
< 1529279931 54554 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily.
< 1529280583 341654 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bonsϿϿirjan!
< 1529280597 393346 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar CYUL
< 1529280598 651162 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYUL 180000Z 22007KT 30SM FEW200 BKN270 27/16 A2991 RMK CC1CI6 SLP131 DENSITY ALT 1600FT
< 1529280600 775263 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar ENVA
< 1529280600 941541 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :ENVA 172350Z VRB01KT 9999 SCT040 BKN100 12/09 Q1006 RMK WIND 670FT 30005KT
< 1529280639 782279 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :@mtear KOAK
< 1529280640 53140 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :KOAK 172353Z 31010KT 10SM FEW023 21/12 A2993 RMK AO2 SLP134 T02060117 10211 20172 50001
< 1529280670 272703 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :@mtera hth
< 1529280671 503817 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :*** "hth" vera "V.E.R.A. -- Virtual Entity of Relevant Acronyms (September 2014)"
< 1529280671 503881 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :HTH
< 1529280671 520135 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :       Hope This Helps (slang)
< 1529280672 268381 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1529280920 800437 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloochaf. mtera???
< 1529280954 475426 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@vera tanstaafl
< 1529280956 639979 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :*** "tanstaafl" vera "V.E.R.A. -- Virtual Entity of Relevant Acronyms (September 2014)"
< 1529280956 689725 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :TANSTAAFL
< 1529280956 706186 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :       There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch (slang, Usenet)
< 1529280956 706243 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1529281029 944726 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that blank line at the end of the response is bothering me
< 1529281047 627306 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I'm not even sure how to send one, I get a 412 when I try
< 1529281056 443907 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there must be an invisible character (other than regular space) somewhere
< 1529281065 995242 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1529281142 180049 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :split on newlines, drop the last one and print the rest?
< 1529281334 337089 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like Unuseuset?
< 1529281369 795317 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( sounds unuseable )
< 1529281384 367829 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hezzo38.
< 1529281417 48559 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`icode  
< 1529281417 803806 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE]
< 1529281442 213927 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: pastes as a space in webchat
< 1529281469 998380 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529281545 285161 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, maybe my client splits trailing spaces off messages
< 1529281553 194884 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried sending a U+0020 space but it didn't work
< 1529281555 134039 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a nbsp did though
< 1529281568 500926 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is not surprising as one of nbsp's main properties is to be whitespace that is never stripped)
< 1529281755 133585 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`icode  
< 1529281755 848193 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE]
< 1529281766 319249 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose that also pastes as space.
< 1529281783 495012 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1529281797 957013 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was just a space.
< 1529281835 165683 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode  
< 1529281835 897912 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE]
< 1529281852 353992 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a copy-and-pasted nbsp, I think?
< 1529281854 871374 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me try typing one
< 1529281859 313331 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode  
< 1529281860 75139 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE]
< 1529281864 301555 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, how weird
< 1529281880 525150 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode    
< 1529281881 271909 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0020 SPACE] [U+0020 SPACE] [U+0020 SPACE]
< 1529281886 910407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that was a space between two nbsps
< 1529281908 504271 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so either Freenode is translating them (unlikely), or else my client is (also unlikely), or else lambdabot is (more possible?)
< 1529281924 334407 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1529281944 350611 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, /that/ was a regular space, and it sent, so perhaps I've forgotten how to type nbsp (or it broke in my recent OS upgrade)
< 1529282315 813623 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(curiouser) & \1
< 1529282467 3795 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope, same key combination gives me a nbsp in a terminal
< 1529284219 299945 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529285159 529660 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily
< 1529285250 735532 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :boily?
< 1529285256 558858 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :QUINTHELLOPIA!
< 1529285288 895212 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i pinged you on every platform :p
< 1529285361 251830 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529285380 502746 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wasn't exactly online >_>'...
< 1529285511 963106 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll be away next weekend (National Holiday). weekend after that I'll be free.
< 1529285559 577258 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: BLUE CHICKEN
< 1529288957 411749 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529290122 387320 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unusenet can be useable with NNTP clients. I wrote a document to describe it (available on HTTP and gopher access) that I have mentioned on here before.
< 1529290144 521340 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1529290942 589253 :oerjan!bc715ce1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.188.113.92.225 QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529292203 717044 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529292291 51680 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hejwcxsdxtfojema QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529294560 505493 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I'm experimenting with using my thue interpreter to do tree rewriting operations.
< 1529294590 382242 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my first test is addition on the natural numbers.
< 1529294640 48307 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :proving a little difficult.
< 1529298205 211358 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The specification of Unusenet is at:  gopher://zzo38computer.org/0textfile/miscellaneous/unusenet  and  http://zzo38computer.org/textfile/miscellaneous/unusenet
< 1529298877 253712 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I was gonna do this easily I'd need a string representation of a tree that enables a node to examine both of its children without leapfrogging over one or the other.
< 1529303608 696632 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529304875 773908 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529307871 306853 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529307878 423210 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529308044 875699 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529309697 691150 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529310051 374304 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@hooloovoo.blue QUIT :Quit: Temporarily refracted into a free-standing prism.
< 1529310090 995812 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529310395 766314 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529311203 285902 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529313664 336508 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: sounds like a tanebventon hth
< 1529313874 126590 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh god what did I invent this time
< 1529314485 401252 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :easily accidentally kicked foot level power sockets
< 1529314487 187223 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :hth
< 1529314490 295258 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529314538 653922 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I deny all responsibility
< 1529314571 857955 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb inventeth and Taneb taketh away
< 1529314720 599147 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm a victim in all this
< 1529315020 726584 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529315248 286279 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529315424 400881 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Quit: catern
> 1529315456 181169 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55884&oldid=55882 5* 03Saka 5* (+11) 10/* T */ add
> 1529315574 662378 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55885&oldid=55884 5* 03Saka 5* (+29) 10some
< 1529315765 296032 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529315892 659944 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1529318126 894691 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529318597 383578 :aloril_!~aloril@80.246.146.6 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529318741 793906 :aloril!~aloril@80.246.146.6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529323697 454681 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: Rebooting
< 1529324657 162875 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529327493 574432 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rednnhdpobqfnosf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529328055 856208 :impomatic!~digital_w@host81-136-104-94.range81-136.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529328892 502923 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529331166 945629 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529334620 362944 :trn!jhj@prone.ws QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529334631 774361 :trn!jhj@prone.ws JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529334632 737912 :lifthrasiir_!~lifthrasi@ec2-52-79-98-81.ap-northeast-2.compute.amazonaws.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529334704 607858 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kpmvjgpmdsqypxde QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1529334709 639418 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@ec2-52-79-98-81.ap-northeast-2.compute.amazonaws.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529334946 462380 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-uniztpxhsphqvwqf JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529335403 14670 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55886 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+173) 10Created page with "Any clues on which instructions pop and which don't would be good. A dup instruction may also be needed. ~~~"
< 1529336812 301723 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337077 305055 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529337702 240939 :catern!~catern@catern.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337702 562845 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529337734 336267 :catern!~catern@catern.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337734 835484 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529337762 38522 :catern!~catern@catern.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337762 633702 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529337822 109317 :catern!~catern@catern.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337822 567132 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529337852 247387 :catern!~catern@catern.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337852 694295 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529337882 260587 :catern!~catern@catern.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529337882 800460 :catern!~catern@catern.com QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529338127 357993 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529338563 712655 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyone know an alternative to Kerberos that isn't as annoying?
< 1529338881 872333 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529339648 706742 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529339860 983109 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what, this session connected again?
< 1529339956 599685 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess it was only the network having problems, not the server itself, so it finally got back
< 1529340042 468908 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :so tmux survived, and everything was still there. except the email server is still off.
< 1529340081 285968 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm no, that worked too after i restarted alpine.
< 1529340236 3593 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529340564 871120 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Too much sunlight
< 1529340576 860626 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529340601 167108 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have a sequence in mind. a_1=8. a_n is the area of the largest area integer rectangle that can be formed using at most a_{n-1} squares along its border.
< 1529340605 247751 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first few terms are 8,9,10,12,16,25,50,182,1980,246016
< 1529340606 229721 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :This has happened before, that I can receive but not send, and restarting the router sometimes fixes it.
< 1529340607 433087 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats the general term?
< 1529340745 699150 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know what could be causing such problems? Could it be the weather?
< 1529341077 624746 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also sometimes it works but occasionally is delayed by a few seconds)
< 1529341194 30474 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1529341199 430626 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529341834 998547 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529342391 110500 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's been a while since i've said anything in here
< 1529342391 888402 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn PRIVMSG #esoteric :so
< 1529342393 204451 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1529342677 818063 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi.
< 1529342919 961506 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't imagine what tree or graph structured memory would look like electronically.
< 1529342937 499580 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :tree, maybe. you have some analog of it in network equipment.
< 1529342944 459357 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :graph? I can't see it.
< 1529344006 883536 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: wait how do you get that 10?
< 1529344124 694373 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: I was going to say that a recurrence is easy; you iterate  f x = (x+4) `div` 4 * ((x+6) `div` 4) ... but that disagrees with what you claim: starting from 8 it produces 8,9,9,9... and from 10 10,12,16,25,49,169,1849,214369,2872209649,515599267815122569...
< 1529344271 748618 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :C
< 1529344274 233146 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Er
< 1529344339 893497 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(equivalently, f x = ((x+4) `div` 2)^2 `div` 4)
< 1529344492 901721 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: The idea being that with x squares, the circumference will be x+4 (unless one of the rectangle sides is shorter than 2), reducing it to the well-known problem of maximizing the area based on the circumference. There's some rounding because I'm assuming that the sides are constrained to integer lengths.
< 1529344726 36486 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: you cant make the border of a rectangle with an odd number of squares, so the 10 comes from making a 3x3 square with 8 of the squares, and leaving the 9th one to the side
< 1529344743 886464 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the middle gets filled in and now you have 10
< 1529344751 870666 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: ah!
< 1529344758 828910 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i didnt state that asdumption very well originally
< 1529344783 590689 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: yeah calling it a rectangle is a bit of a stretch
< 1529344808 10246 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :where did you get 49 from in your sequence from 10?
< 1529344844 85769 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh nvm
< 1529344852 509500 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :one sec
< 1529344925 141950 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah the 49 is from not keeping tbe leftover from the 25
< 1529344926 312091 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: 24 = 4*6 is enough for a 7x7 square
< 1529344976 951993 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :so its the keeping the extras that makes a formula hard
< 1529344978 890161 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1529344992 290738 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: okay, doing what you did (setting an extra square aside if x is odd), the sequence becomes 8,9,10,12,16,25,50,182,2162,293222,5373842942,1804886750517122432 ... so we agree until 182
< 1529345016 319652 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was doing it by hans
< 1529345022 565736 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :hand
< 1529345031 139143 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you get 2162
< 1529345035 732065 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :f x = ((x+4) `div` 2)^2 `div` 4 + x `mod` 2
< 1529345041 550002 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :2162 = 46*47
< 1529345054 842126 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :182 = 45+46+45+46
< 1529345058 400596 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: brb
< 1529345067 485085 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right
< 1529345075 311106 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529345076 527100 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :good formula
< 1529345196 620809 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah you compensated by 1 in the wrong direction ending up with 44*45. plausible :)
< 1529345217 243123 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah
< 1529345276 216009 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :div means divide and floor, right?
< 1529345279 633497 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529345305 950873 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f x = ((x+4) `div` 2)^2 `div` 4 + x `mod` 2 in iterate f 8
< 1529345307 494558 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what notation is that?
< 1529345308 127088 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : [8,9,10,12,16,25,50,182,2162,293222,5373842942,1804886750517122432,203601011...
< 1529345315 105563 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :haskell?
< 1529345315 609949 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Haskell
< 1529345337 325324 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :my go to language for combinatorics
< 1529345855 679503 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :heres some combinatorics
< 1529345867 178359 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :six letter strings
< 1529345872 598086 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :anrstu
< 1529345877 47165 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :anrsuu
< 1529345887 186077 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :what am i thinking about?
< 1529345963 633366 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529345997 12181 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :editing distance 1 is what I see
< 1529346093 714647 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes thats true
< 1529346103 314660 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yet
< 1529346110 149618 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the answer is
< 1529346137 874688 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :putting the names of planets in alphabetical order
< 1529346260 802400 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, what star are you looking at...
< 1529346286 990174 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> sort "mvemjsun"
< 1529346289 7585 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : "ejmmnsuv"
< 1529346375 154922 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :not the first letters of tbeir names
< 1529346387 737860 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :the entire names as strings
< 1529346412 306604 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would i get the general term of the above seqhence?
< 1529346441 204107 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, a lexographical sort? :V
< 1529346444 295839 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1529346472 952994 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was never any good at anagrams.
< 1529346486 881047 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(or scrabble :P)
< 1529346542 682511 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: itym lexicographical
< 1529346558 958881 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: missing a few letters. :P
< 1529346574 389375 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :i, c and b keys don't work very well.
< 1529346603 313500 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: in that case, shouldn't it be lexographal?
< 1529346618 9361 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :not very well, not not at all.
< 1529346619 40377 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: (I'm not buying your excuse)
< 1529346629 914355 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P
< 1529346640 949227 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I'm not selling one. :P
< 1529346657 79649 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :unless you're uying
< 1529346664 768149 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/uying/buying
< 1529346743 672310 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you are making a good case
< 1529346752 270545 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's still hard to believe :P
< 1529346755 551896 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :upper or lower
< 1529346763 640525 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, maybe you should get a new keyboard)
< 1529346778 869049 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :nah, just some dirt.
< 1529346796 660521 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that dirt will help.
< 1529346809 399216 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's really needed is a can of compressed air.
< 1529346975 697060 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1529347243 784213 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529347379 345023 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529347388 706712 :MDead!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net NICK :MDude
< 1529347574 501671 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant the general term of the rectangle sequence
< 1529347587 680100 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e gave a recursive formula
< 1529347609 466925 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was hoping for a constant time formula in n
< 1529347684 443243 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :quintopia: it's doubly exponential but all that rounding makes things quite messy... I don't expect a nice closed formula
< 1529348085 259619 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean ignoring all the rounding you essentially have x |-> x^2 / 16, so you'll end up with a_n = 16 * b^2^n for some base b, asymptotically... b is approximately 1.0193570549183
< 1529348169 356120 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I start counting at 0, a_0 = 9, a_1 = 10)
< 1529348379 130677 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"asymptotically" meaning it's 16 b^2^(n + o(1)) for some b... it may be 16 b^(2^n + o(1)), but that requires some analysis that I haven't done
< 1529348918 290868 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and I have no formula for that b, only numerical approximations)
< 1529350984 356752 :gurmble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529351340 554486 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529351435 418543 :grumble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Ping timeout: 600 seconds
< 1529351454 738913 :gurmble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble NICK :grumble
< 1529351532 135464 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1529356448 363341 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529358016 722252 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529358482 709714 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529367470 747976 :idris-bot!~idris-bot@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1529367488 777144 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-077-053.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529368253 982743 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-094-153.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529369938 17824 :mich181189!sid268336@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xikgrktkkkuqwdfq JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529372782 493393 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529375967 684170 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529376087 509720 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529376268 556830 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a canonical way to compare two strings non-destructively in thue?
< 1529376425 681123 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking of having a cursor walk through a segmented list of key/value pairs. can't think of anything other than "leave a marker, take a character, leave character in temporary location, take character from pattern, leave marker, move to two strings, check for any invalid pairs."
< 1529376740 489244 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529377056 598095 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529377241 693865 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
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< 1529377675 966197 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529378360 68300 :Guest1_!~textual@2601:644:8201:64cb:88fb:512:808b:26a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529378495 404154 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529381138 762915 :Guest1_!~textual@2601:644:8201:64cb:88fb:512:808b:26a0 QUIT :Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com
< 1529381412 41591 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@2a01:4f8:120:4091::10 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529381461 826081 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529381604 90903 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529381661 835032 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@2a01:4f8:120:4091::10 NICK :hooloovo0
< 1529382096 717708 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529382673 27008 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rednnhdpobqfnosf QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529383522 219494 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529383722 22972 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
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< 1529387838 6142 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529392690 104654 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529394079 217390 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529396798 71613 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07English Binerdy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55887&oldid=55801 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+564) 10
< 1529397742 482353 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529402536 380964 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hamiltonian14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55888 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+2072) 10Created page with "Hamiltonian is an esolang based on the travelling salesman problem. Finding the result of a Hamiltonian computation is an NP-complete problem.  == Syntax == Any given program..."
> 1529402662 605212 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hamiltonian14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55889&oldid=55888 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (-17) 10
< 1529410242 385519 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529410305 941039 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529413160 966781 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vvgitvlrixaduapw JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529413595 902465 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-118-37.dhcp.embarqhsd.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529416652 212419 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529417825 449503 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529423739 430530 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529426268 598297 :MDude!~MDude@pa-67-234-83-197.dhcp.embarqhsd.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529426311 635600 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529429632 731186 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :we asked for a new coffee machine and corporate sent us this abomination of Silicon Valley hubris
< 1529429637 195542 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.marsdrinks.ca/solutions/machines/flavia-creation-500/
< 1529429692 131086 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :sweet jesus.
< 1529432660 743223 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:9c9:b437:1d74:ecfe QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529433363 304797 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:a1a2:24b:ff5f:7b5b JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529433527 587084 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1529435240 336941 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07R U DS14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55890&oldid=55881 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+2) 10
< 1529436737 820262 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529436878 293535 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529437479 472525 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529438496 193727 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529439030 959422 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody have any resources for compiling down to thue or thue-like languages?
< 1529439149 471143 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1529439259 844154 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems pretty difficult from an imperative perspective, because you'd most likely squash down to an instruction stream + loop delimiters, ala the brainfuck-in-thue interpreter.
< 1529439315 392441 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather than simulate RAM, because from what I can see, simulating RAM implies a pretty large overhead.
< 1529440785 291653 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529442457 211309 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: Heh, what do you think of rule 110 as a string rewriting system: http://paste.debian.net/1029965/ (the inspiration here is that Thue presents an opportunity for parallelism)
< 1529442597 320628 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is supposed to simulate the 1001111 glider against the 00010011011111 background pattern as described in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_110 ...)
< 1529442677 530397 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm not sure that it's correct... my main focus was on the 32 rules for the 110 rule itself.
< 1529442701 967836 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh the parallelism opportunities are already very clear to me. rule 110 is hilarious.
< 1529442817 462717 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :recently I wanted to build a "stateful sort" in thue, whereby you'd continually spawn sets of workers and managers to both A: sort the string as they marched along, and B: competed for space while checking if the string is sorted.
< 1529442878 126786 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the algorithm was "sort the string by the pattern `ba -> ab`, then sort the string by the pattern `ab -> ba`, then halt."
< 1529442887 185591 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529442993 776009 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/DHPW/text the ruleset in particular, https://ptpb.pw/Bf1F/python and the corresponding interpreter.
< 1529443087 434301 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty neat that you can do something like this. I'm still working on speeding it up by not having to spawn workers, but propagating the state by interleaving it between individual symbols on the string. you'd face a storage overhead but it's worth it.
< 1529443211 106239 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I know my interpreter isn't strictly thue, but I needed non-delimited comments and a sane substitution syntax.)
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< 1529448573 312813 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how you'd optimize a thue interpreter..
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< 1529453288 700135 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: WHARGHARBL.
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< 1529454090 51188 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily
> 1529454704 337370 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07R U DS14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55891&oldid=55890 5* 03Quintopia 5* (+136) 10add categories
< 1529455710 131755 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :QUINTHELLOPIA!
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< 1529459923 431092 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no TOPIC #esoteric :Welcome to the international meerkat for esoteric programming language discussion, design, development and deployment! | https://esolangs.org | logs: https://esolangs.org/logs/ http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D | https://www.dropbox.com/s/fyhqyvy3i8oh25m/wisdom.pdf
< 1529460223 791555 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: please don't ignore the nice boily
< 1529460223 868565 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: i'll do this and i think
< 1529460253 145519 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: what's your opinion on bread.
< 1529460253 278139 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: ( ( laughter yeah))
< 1529460264 904822 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: does bread taste funny?
< 1529460265 102514 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: isn't that funny)) irrelevant but i haven't done this before so this is much easier
< 1529460286 340153 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: you haven't eaten bread before?
< 1529460286 539408 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: uh terroristic attacks were given tourist visas or student visas or something like
< 1529460299 645826 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: I didn't know that. thank you.
< 1529460299 871380 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode-desktop: you don't watch movies at home then you see how you have to ask the defendant
< 1529461690 914004 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, how would you implement rewriting over a large, persistent string? something that's beneficial about the turing model is that, while parallelism becomes an explicit detail (multiple heads moving on the same tape, switching between them, etc.), the tape can be paged in and out at will, and only one symbol (rather than a neighborhood) is examined at one time.
< 1529461782 66204 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but with string rewriting you have to check the whole string for patterns, meaning you're going to be pulling pieces of the entire string into memory even though no patterns may apply to them.
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> 1529470001 367364 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Bzim 5*  10New user account
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> 1529470372 492403 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Bzim14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55893 5* 03Bzim 5* (+151) 10Created page with "bzim is a computing science student who is into language implementations. Currently, he is at esolang wiki in order to explore extreme ideas and jokes."
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< 1529472409 220374 :Vorpal!~Vorpal@unaffiliated/vorpal PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
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> 1529493899 613751 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Debiller 777 5*  10New user account
< 1529494325 118531 :Guest88143!~paul2520@unaffiliated/paul2520 NICK :paul250
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> 1529494570 276480 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55894&oldid=55892 5* 03Debiller 777 5* (+312) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529494629 95961 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55895&oldid=55894 5* 03Debiller 777 5* (+94) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529494746 26813 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Debiller 77714]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55896 5* 03Debiller 777 5* (+44) 10Created page with "Hi I am Debiller 777 and I create esolang Hb"
> 1529494772 877925 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Debiller 77714]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55897 5* 03Debiller 777 5* (+2) 10Created page with "Oh"
< 1529495828 191354 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1125
< 1529495828 940609 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist 1125: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas
< 1529496511 898104 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529498951 996667 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Olist seems to be updating a lot lately
< 1529499195 478232 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not very often.
< 1529499198 103897 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you read olist?
< 1529499324 198125 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I tried it but couldn't really get into it
< 1529499605 717394 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :<3 Taneb
< 1529499639 714402 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm no longer alone in openly disliking OOTS)
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< 1529500348 210073 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So these people are talking about what seems like it ought to be a simple thing to do.
< 1529500380 135757 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's an array format. An array is a space-separated list of strings. Each string is of the form '...', where 's are escaped by doubling.
< 1529500397 95951 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They want to convert it to shell format, i.e. the same thing but with 's escaped as '\''
< 1529500431 78698 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems like it ought to be easy to do with sed or something.
< 1529500443 941457 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it seems so to me as well
< 1529500458 352415 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, you can write it as a transducer with about 3 states.
< 1529500468 143448 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it doesn't seem to actually be easy?
< 1529500520 216626 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, the real plan is to just dump it in a different format.
< 1529500533 315321 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm frustrated at how complicated it seems to be with standard UNIX tools.
< 1529500552 675723 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I'm missing something.
< 1529500870 513144 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone suggested foma
< 1529500874 142327 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://fomafst.github.io/regexreference.html
< 1529500884 136401 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Gerdemann and van Noord(1999), who proposed the rule semantics, provide the following example"
< 1529500936 62762 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: is this your arch-nemesis
< 1529502820 91247 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's certainly an auspicious surname
> 1529503084 596461 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Yoga1976 5*  10New user account
> 1529503192 895959 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55898&oldid=55895 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+70) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529503604 753120 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55899&oldid=55898 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+103) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529503648 440288 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55900&oldid=55899 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+0) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529503860 879431 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55901&oldid=55900 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+283) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529504103 848464 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55902&oldid=55901 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+816) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529504326 248731 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Cuckoo 5*  10New user account
> 1529504407 1237 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55903&oldid=55902 5* 03Cuckoo 5* (+73) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529504623 423144 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Stupidguy 5*  10New user account
> 1529504665 804413 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55904&oldid=55903 5* 03Stupidguy 5* (+76) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529504852 203077 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Fuck! 5*  10New user account
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> 1529504995 346796 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55905&oldid=55904 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+72) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529505092 706026 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Zackmowrer 5*  10moved [[02R U DS10]] to [[DeadSimple]]: The original name may be confused with RUDS: An acronym for a society, screening type, and syndrome that have nothing to do with this language
> 1529505112 568884 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55908&oldid=55905 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+122) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529505295 290318 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55909&oldid=55908 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+80) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529505495 491194 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DeadSimple14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55910&oldid=55906 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+34) 10
> 1529505595 567975 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03 5*  10New user account
> 1529505600 116477 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55911&oldid=55885 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (-13) 10/* R */
> 1529505632 340459 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55912&oldid=55911 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+17) 10/* D */
> 1529505659 218602 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CopyPasta Language14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55913&oldid=55883 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+24) 10Add Category:Output only
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> 1529506144 150189 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DeadSimple14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55914&oldid=55910 5* 03Zackmowrer 5* (+4) 10Correct example programs
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< 1529527743 754395 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 468: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy Cale
< 1529535475 872109 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529536096 182135 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529536751 988128 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: good super mega today
< 1529537049 379047 :bytejumper!~bytejumpe@129.205.113.1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529537179 179114 :bytejumper!~bytejumpe@129.205.113.1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529538533 978198 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:a1a2:24b:ff5f:7b5b PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I agree
< 1529538553 104229 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:a1a2:24b:ff5f:7b5b PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and thanks for the ping earlier)
< 1529539076 965430 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529540847 496366 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529541987 58421 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…
> 1529542187 359690 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07IOBCT14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55915 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+4997) 10Created page with "'''Bitwise Cyclic Tag (BCT)''' is a [[Turing-complete]] programming language using only two commands (0 and 1) to operate on a finite data-bitstring extensible without bound o..."
> 1529542249 588535 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07IOBCT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55916&oldid=55915 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+4) 10/* External resources */
> 1529542275 106737 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07IOBCT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55917&oldid=55916 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (-4) 10/* External resources */
> 1529542356 758339 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07IOBCT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55918&oldid=55917 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+20) 10
> 1529544052 199379 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Rattlesnake14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55919 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+1928) 10Created page with "'''Rattlesnake''' is an  [[esoteric programming language]] created by [[User:Yoga1976]]. It consists of only two commands, nonono, and ...and I'll kill ya!<..."
> 1529544138 992237 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55920&oldid=55762 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (+68) 10
< 1529544280 457515 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that guy keeps getting more annoying.
> 1529544612 90851 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Rattlesnake14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55921&oldid=55919 5* 03Yoga1976 5* (-172) 10/* Hello World */
< 1529545157 203985 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529545324 303200 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
> 1529545600 284216 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SASM14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55922 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+793) 10Created page with "==Sasm== Sasm is a very simple derivative of the Assembly programming language. ==Commands== ===mov=== It is just the "=" command in C. It sets a register(AX,BX,CX,DX)into a v..."
> 1529545613 445471 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SASM14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55923&oldid=55922 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+0) 10/* Last but not least */
> 1529545665 314505 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category:Language list14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55924 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+22) 10Created page with "Link:[[language list]]"
> 1529546153 893892 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55925&oldid=55912 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+14) 10/* F */
> 1529546221 897970 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10deleted "[[02Category:Language list10]]": Useless and not discussed
> 1529546324 316512 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Foobar!14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55926 5* 03Fuck! 5* (+2327) 10Created page with "'''Foobar and Foobaz and Barbaz, oh my!''' is a simple esolang by [[User:Ihope127]]. The syntax is as follows:   Statement: ""  Identifier: A nonnegative..."
< 1529546696 882866 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...
< 1529546712 718613 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, it's clearly at troll.
< 1529546716 153141 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*a
< 1529546949 235354 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :where's ais523 when i'm actually unsure how long to block
> 1529546964 844148 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10blocked [[02User:Fuck!10]] with an expiration time of 3 days (account creation disabled): Clearly trolling, e.g. with half-edited, broken versions of existing pages
> 1529547059 186813 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10blocked [[02User:Yoga197610]] with an expiration time of 3 days (account creation disabled): Clearly trolling, e.g. with half-edited, broken versions of existing pages
> 1529547319 250036 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10blocked [[02User:10]] with an expiration time of 3 days (account creation disabled): Abusing multiple accounts
> 1529547334 173071 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10blocked [[02User:Cuckoo10]] with an expiration time of 3 days (account creation disabled): Abusing multiple accounts
> 1529547354 967962 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10blocked [[02User:Stupidguy10]] with an expiration time of 3 days (account creation disabled): Abusing multiple accounts
> 1529547571 846343 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10blocked [[02User:Iamcalledbob10]] with an expiration time of 1 day (account creation disabled): Giving the "original" account a block too, but shorter
> 1529547682 620104 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10deleted "[[02IOBCT10]]": Half-edited, broken copy of BCT page
> 1529547836 637465 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10deleted "[[0210]]": Half-edited copy of Chicken
< 1529548348 943525 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :what got me about those pages was e didn't even bother to edit out the mentions of the original...
< 1529548432 984330 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :Foobar! is pretty much the same but i blocked em so soon after it was created it's _thinkable_ e was going to edit it better.
< 1529548516 976317 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(not plausible, just thinkable.)
< 1529549933 11988 :Suika!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529550022 20644 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529550855 64855 :Suika!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529553653 100606 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529553701 47381 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529555083 881029 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kicnfziqdhtsfpog QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529555214 295276 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529555329 465137 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
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< 1529561066 826744 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529561379 189458 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529561578 31427 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529562436 859581 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: No route to host
< 1529562542 509588 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529562546 896186 :shachaf!~shachaf@li227-219.members.linode.com QUIT :Changing host
< 1529562546 933260 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529563024 787279 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529563468 821632 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529563597 203442 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529563638 201326 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529564112 233234 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529564163 928861 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529564341 755366 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu
< 1529565426 443768 :aloril__!~aloril@80.246.146.6 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529565573 875869 :aloril_!~aloril@80.246.146.6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529565666 523345 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529565803 796391 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1529566116 982808 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03U ndefined 5*  10New user account
> 1529567119 28084 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55927&oldid=55909 5* 03U ndefined 5* (+252) 10intro
> 1529567285 702367 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:U ndefined14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55928 5* 03U ndefined 5* (+172) 10Created page with "Hey there, I do [https://codegolf.stackexchange.com/ Code Golf]. One thing that bothers me is this:  '''(U ndefined)'''  should be  '''(U_ndefined)'''  I guess that's okay."
< 1529567555 886942 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529567801 11725 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
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< 1529570409 660135 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529570817 660634 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529571377 107953 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529573490 319471 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529574675 548592 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-smzarscgslccsqok JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529575259 790841 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529575420 842034 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Rattlesnake14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55929&oldid=55921 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (-27) 10
< 1529575438 7033 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1529575752 568345 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SASM14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55930&oldid=55923 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+28) 10I'm assuming that's how cmp works, but change it if it's wrong.
< 1529577137 744645 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529577350 704263 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529577808 291804 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529578094 292950 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529579028 113430 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529579196 312458 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529579931 396424 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn QUIT :Quit: lol rip
< 1529579969 25712 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529580029 995048 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@unaffiliated/bowserinator QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529580033 302104 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529580291 816608 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529582682 891038 :impomatic!~digital_w@host81-136-104-94.range81-136.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529588892 303073 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Quit: Bye!
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< 1529593931 764768 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1529598651 82357 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Fuzzballcat 5*  10New user account
< 1529598711 275927 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529600130 894681 :grumble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Quit: May your memory be the last of you
< 1529600364 154629 :grumble!~grumble@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529601093 182649 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529602545 476093 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529602724 331795 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5*  10New user account
< 1529602745 19054 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529604444 27215 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529605208 44725 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529606330 341662 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529607319 392911 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529607491 934253 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529607709 7414 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529608762 975952 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: someone on twitter told me to use van Noord's FSA library
< 1529608781 851311 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :are you sure this isn't your evil twin
< 1529608883 533657 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? fsa
< 1529608884 442127 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fsa? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
< 1529608896 808125 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( fully surprising automata )
< 1529609023 206352 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? prolog
< 1529609024 156661 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolog? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
< 1529609063 858123 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( Prolog is an esoteric programming languages designed to appeal to PROfessional LOGicians )
< 1529609239 25017 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Copyright (c) 1994-2000 by Gertjan van Noord." <-- I think he's a bit too old to be Taneb's twin.
< 1529609378 745875 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't Taneb also copyright (c) 1994 or so?
< 1529609395 990377 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529610079 90043 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529610266 686274 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529611510 189819 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529611988 528088 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529612181 280759 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529612644 603523 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: would the copyright date be the date of conception or of birth?
< 1529612888 130263 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that depends on what's being copyrighted.
< 1529612923 824437 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it's the genome then I guess it's conception.
< 1529613866 40986 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529613956 944845 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529613963 479603 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529614106 852732 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
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< 1529616622 163372 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-145-132-215.natnow.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529617271 438484 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-145-132-215.natnow.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529617282 969099 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grammar_systems_theory anybody have any resources relating to this? I've tried looking around, but can't find much, not even an implementation.
< 1529617794 651809 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529617968 172530 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm. https://www.cs.bme.hu/~csima/phd1/node4.html raises more questions than it answers.
< 1529617998 80096 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529618340 903269 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :DNA computing is the most convincing of the motivations that I've found so far.
< 1529618354 872636 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have not previously encountered these Grammar Systems)
< 1529618448 106269 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :supposedly there are classifications of these grammar systems, depending on whether each of the grammars operates individually or on one giant work string.
< 1529618466 929767 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I haven't seen an implementation of them. o_O
< 1529619013 663359 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529619751 765842 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529619911 785592 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529621680 55396 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529621855 793679 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529621919 19809 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1529623117 981428 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529623557 812977 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529623692 848816 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07J.A.V.A.14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55931&oldid=27421 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+941) 10Made the language more maintainable.
< 1529623718 773412 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1529623790 772948 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:J.A.V.A.14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55932&oldid=27422 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+181) 10
< 1529624064 198051 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529625495 907215 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529625671 731992 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529625706 258937 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529627411 16388 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529627627 3966 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529628429 865614 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529628722 493177 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529628974 131956 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: SOSTENUTO CHICKEN
< 1529629421 944915 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529629656 299289 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529629698 685174 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529630019 985650 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529630123 464714 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Fuzzballcat14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55933 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+459) 10Introduction trouble
> 1529630357 204162 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:U ndefined14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55934&oldid=55928 5* 03U ndefined 5* (-105) 10
< 1529631352 426365 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529631550 22986 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529632602 778019 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529632808 762018 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Greentext14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55935&oldid=47261 5* 03HereToAnnoy 5* (+1) 10Fixed broken category
> 1529633333 456597 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:U ndefined14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55936&oldid=55934 5* 03U ndefined 5* (-67) 10Blanked the page
< 1529633414 700134 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529633673 565358 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529633811 282164 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529635233 403883 :impomatic!~digital_w@host81-136-104-94.range81-136.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529635582 291718 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529635778 3562 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529637868 49918 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529638066 297368 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529639024 167335 :khobo!~khobo@pool-98-113-248-247.nycmny.fios.verizon.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529639043 227166 :khobo!~khobo@pool-98-113-248-247.nycmny.fios.verizon.net PART :#esoteric
< 1529639751 227217 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529639990 19207 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529640713 476856 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :girl genius confirms my suspicions yet again.
< 1529640763 392145 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(look int-e, no spoiler!)
< 1529641198 456313 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-smzarscgslccsqok QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529641360 266116 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1529641658 112636 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529641826 13421 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
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< 1529644869 757205 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529645080 299918 :HereToAnnoy!4a7b172b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.123.23.43 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529645168 253557 :HereToAnnoy!4a7b172b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.74.123.23.43 PART :#esoteric
< 1529645478 629664 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529645497 980145 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought of some stuff with Magic: the Gathering. Such as: "You can cast this card from your graveyard if there are seven or more cards above it."
< 1529645628 264140 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Another thing can be a variant of buyback that you will return the card on top of your library instead of into your hand.
< 1529645631 288745 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529646168 171286 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I prefer for the graveyard to be unordered.
< 1529646825 426456 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( an echelon of skeletons )
< 1529647447 209542 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529647622 17053 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529649185 839695 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529649855 824449 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529649985 292232 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529650384 929736 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529651745 8697 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529651931 318806 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529651967 766043 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I managed to make a tag system in the Free Hero Mesh preprocessor now (I think). Example:  {define "skip" {call \2}} {define "1" {skip \1|"3"|"3"|"2"|"1"|"H"}} {define "2" {skip \1|"3"|"3"|"1"}} {define "3" {skip \1|"3"|"3"}} {define "H" \1} {call "2"|"1"|"1"}
< 1529652408 421188 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think a tag system can be made using TeX macros, too.)
< 1529652440 233976 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is Free Hero Mesh?
< 1529652511 89646 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a free version of Everett Kaser's Hero Mesh software.
< 1529652536 926036 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It uses an entirely different syntax, though.)
< 1529652717 680926 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(For example, Hero Mesh does not even have macros; Free Hero Mesh does. Also, class codes in Free Hero Mesh are using RPN; Hero Mesh uses a more C like syntax though internally it uses RPN.)
< 1529653236 712970 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529653792 228571 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529654758 183279 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529655555 572749 :impomatic!~digital_w@host81-136-104-94.range81-136.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529658609 292098 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529658815 158826 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529659392 83322 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529664308 561708 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529664442 404470 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529665021 287353 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zeb2rj73gye3ft.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529665630 993689 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529669452 912597 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529671904 167574 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529671930 212597 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ＋ 
< 1529671930 838824 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+FF0B FULLWIDTH PLUS SIGN] [U+0020 SPACE]
< 1529672021 775979 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529672315 296706 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529672525 541832 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu
< 1529672667 415082 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529673686 17743 :jix!~jix@jix.omnomnom.pizza QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529674321 347148 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1529676503 697513 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Zero 5*  10New user account
> 1529676716 918563 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55937&oldid=55927 5* 03Zero 5* (+135) 10
> 1529676773 936916 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Zero14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55938 5* 03Zero 5* (+74) 10Created page with "Hi, I'm Zero. I post on aidreams sometimes. I like creating pet languages."
< 1529677465 153555 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529677549 664588 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07First.go14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55939 5* 03Zero 5* (+1850) 10yet another concatenative language
> 1529677634 378957 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07First.go14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55940&oldid=55939 5* 03Zero 5* (-2) 10
> 1529677655 799011 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07First.go14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55941&oldid=55940 5* 03Zero 5* (-12) 10
> 1529677770 60569 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07First.go14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55942&oldid=55941 5* 03Zero 5* (+26) 10
< 1529677776 921586 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529677869 39484 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55943&oldid=55925 5* 03Zero 5* (+15) 10
< 1529679549 484259 :openthesky!~aober@unaffiliated/openthesky JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529679686 367127 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529679811 818401 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529679855 296623 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529680029 453967 :openthesky!~aober@unaffiliated/openthesky PART :#esoteric
< 1529681941 930761 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529682149 54707 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529683472 457256 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of the man pages for the Linux capabilities system are missing (and maybe they also require the use of libraries which are also missing). How to find them? Also, how can capabilities be programmed so that if you run "perl x.pl" or "node x.js" then it can use capabilities from "x.pl" and "x.js" files?
< 1529683761 455645 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-glepcjojsvstfhwo JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529683838 138324 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529684054 690305 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529685991 476461 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529686040 677034 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529686108 263123 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529686134 130368 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529686318 14717 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529687218 663273 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529688033 543012 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529688233 10516 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
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< 1529691542 636584 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-glepcjojsvstfhwo QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529691594 390871 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1529693070 646048 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1529704154 566514 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdl5vcs2c3uu45.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in
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< 1529704644 624158 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zd5tq85c9ivs7q.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529704644 682031 :AnotherTest_!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdntge13oltjru.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be NICK :AnotherTest
< 1529704753 721649 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zdntge13oltjru.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529704842 987398 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529705110 650432 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529705310 647466 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529705597 676973 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529712804 625743 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1529713143 426046 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55944&oldid=55808 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+170) 10/* Purpose */
> 1529713181 870551 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55945&oldid=55944 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+1) 10/* Difference */
< 1529713339 20712 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529713441 497046 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529713448 47575 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529713493 123815 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55946&oldid=55945 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-11) 10/* Difference */
< 1529713553 306220 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
> 1529713583 780629 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55947&oldid=55946 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+8) 10/* Difference */
< 1529713861 165787 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :e's back
< 1529714043 659844 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529714114 978120 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I know that turing machines and wang b-machines are equivalent. and WB machines can be extended to provide some pretty practical features (much like TMs can be). I wonder what kind of "practical formulations" string rewriting languages have.
> 1529714158 397362 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hi-assembly14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55948 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+99) 10Created page with "==Hi assembly== It is assembly, but it can be used on all computers. The syntax is the x86 version."
> 1529714181 108508 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hi-assembly14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55949&oldid=55948 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+27) 10
> 1529714201 49232 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hi-assembly14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55950&oldid=55949 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+0) 10/* Hi assembly */
> 1529714456 200744 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55951&oldid=55947 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+42) 10/* Brevity */
> 1529714468 834022 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55952&oldid=55951 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-1) 10/* Brevity */
< 1529714506 317763 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh boy. he's having some fun.
> 1529714507 79572 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55953&oldid=55952 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (+9) 10/* Brevity */
> 1529714527 412650 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55954&oldid=55953 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-9) 10/* Brevity */
> 1529714554 142207 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55955&oldid=55954 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-41) 10/* Brevity */
> 1529714728 368568 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07First.go14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55956&oldid=55942 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-11) 10Wikify a bit
> 1529714841 72351 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Iamcalledbob14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55957&oldid=55734 5* 03Iamcalledbob 5* (-1589) 10Blanked the page
> 1529714872 171842 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hi-assembly14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55958&oldid=55950 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-27) 10rm nonexisting category
< 1529714921 926644 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what kind of "practical formulations" string rewriting languages have.
< 1529714963 529063 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:a1a2:24b:ff5f:7b5b PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pbflist "You'll be OK"
< 1529714964 214784 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :pbflist "You'll be OK": shachaf Sgeo quintopia ion b_jonas Cale
< 1529715285 619687 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529715471 271896 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1529715541 967415 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Asdf 5*  10New user account
> 1529715792 261382 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55959&oldid=55937 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+143) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529715832 885494 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Fuzzballcat714]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55960 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+64) 10Created page with "I created a language called [[KittenScript]], based around cats."
> 1529715923 894404 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55961&oldid=55943 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+65) 10/* K */
> 1529715954 154845 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55962 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+69) 10Created page with "=== KittenScript === ''Because coding doesn't have enough cat humor''"
> 1529715964 569717 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55963&oldid=55962 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-2) 10/* KittenScript */
> 1529715980 815272 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55964&oldid=55963 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+6) 10/* KittenScript */
> 1529716038 232511 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55965&oldid=55964 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-73) 10Blanked the page
> 1529716049 12721 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Fuzzballcat714]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55966&oldid=55960 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-64) 10Blanked the page
> 1529716109 632947 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55967&oldid=55959 5* 03Asdf 5* (+49) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529716136 247769 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55968&oldid=55967 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529716285 888238 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55969&oldid=55965 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+378) 10
> 1529716295 706138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55970&oldid=55969 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-5) 10/* Full Syntax */
> 1529716309 345462 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55971&oldid=55970 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-1) 10/* Variables = */
> 1529716351 95155 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55972&oldid=55971 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+74) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529716521 322459 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55973&oldid=55972 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (+89) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529716693 401863 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55974&oldid=55961 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-65) 10/* K */
> 1529716723 466139 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07KittenScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55975&oldid=55973 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-535) 10Blanked the page
< 1529716837 33808 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :they seem a bit undecided.
< 1529716916 203170 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :quick way to spam the channel, though.
< 1529717481 275548 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1529718133 94499 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55976 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1017) 10Created page with "==Briefscript== Briefscript is created to be as short-code as possible. ==Syntax==  1  Jump to the 1st character in code  2  square CX and print it  i  input a number into CX..."
> 1529718153 74733 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55977&oldid=55976 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8) 10/* Hello, world! */
> 1529718192 694287 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55978&oldid=55977 5* 03Asdf 5* (+50) 10/* Briefscript */
> 1529718224 634587 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55979&oldid=55978 5* 03Asdf 5* (+145) 10/* Hello, world!(1 byte) */
> 1529718300 44010 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55980&oldid=55979 5* 03Asdf 5* (+19) 10/* Briefscript */
> 1529718361 48078 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55981&oldid=55980 5* 03Asdf 5* (-19) 10/* Briefscript */
> 1529718401 664548 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55982&oldid=55981 5* 03Asdf 5* (+36) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529718429 868846 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55983&oldid=55982 5* 03Asdf 5* (+30) 10/* Example */
> 1529718485 110348 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55984&oldid=55983 5* 03Asdf 5* (+32) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529718519 452140 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55985&oldid=55984 5* 03Asdf 5* (+51) 10/* Example */
> 1529718571 70637 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55986&oldid=55985 5* 03Asdf 5* (+38) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529718597 266532 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55987&oldid=55986 5* 03Asdf 5* (+51) 10/* Example */
> 1529718646 829178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55988&oldid=55987 5* 03Asdf 5* (+14) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529718667 72836 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55989&oldid=55988 5* 03Asdf 5* (+19) 10/* Example */
> 1529718696 621041 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55990&oldid=55989 5* 03Asdf 5* (+20) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529718721 64373 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Briefscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55991&oldid=55990 5* 03Asdf 5* (+25) 10/* Example */
> 1529719409 557267 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PLEASE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55992&oldid=55765 5* 03Asdf 5* (+5) 10/* Instructions */
> 1529719515 822593 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Owl14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55993&oldid=19094 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1062) 10
> 1529720691 533506 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Owl14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55994&oldid=55993 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-1062) 10Undo revision 55993 by [[Special:Contributions/Asdf|Asdf]] ([[User talk:Asdf|talk]]) (Copyvio)
> 1529720756 513402 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 revision10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10Oerjan changed visibility of a revision on page [[02Owl10]]: content hidden: Copyright violation
< 1529721024 232558 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1529721093 432264 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asdf14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55995 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+309) 10Removed copyrighted content
< 1529721481 760077 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I can't contribute my own work if it's under the GPL? interpreters and such?
< 1529721503 520117 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about the dozens of things that have no explicit license statement? surely that's more offensive.
< 1529721897 668783 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529722078 482624 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529722814 460660 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529722867 822344 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: you can relicense it
< 1529722899 465593 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you put it on the wiki, you do that implicitly, if you _have_ the right to do so.
< 1529722932 673323 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i didn't see anything indicating that user was the original author.
< 1529722983 86960 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, no license statement isn't allowed to copy either.
< 1529723031 749567 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can put anything that is public domain in the wiki. If it is under the GPL, post a link to it instead.
< 1529723041 925154 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course, there are probably many instances on the wiki that we've missed.
< 1529723089 531935 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529723520 462311 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: I just wonder why the anti-GPL stance.
< 1529723606 458088 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather, I wonder why people _care_. I didn't think the wiki did.
< 1529723653 868285 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: the wiki cannot use GPL content unless it is GPL itself.
< 1529723655 333025 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :this actually makes me wonder what the wikipedia maintainers think when grabbing source snippets from language websites that have something like the GPL attached to them. I don't think there's a problem there.
< 1529723753 891926 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia isn't public domain like esolang wiki is.
< 1529723765 830390 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Some texts on Wikipedia are public domain, but in general it isn't.)
< 1529723777 972232 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is it then?
< 1529723791 723643 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolang wiki is required all texts/files public domain, although you can still link to stuff licensed by GPL or MIT license or whatever.
< 1529723811 401652 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But they have to be external; stuff in the wiki itself is public domain.
< 1529723831 510401 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: CC attribution-sharealike.
< 1529723840 213796 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: but there's source on there that's GPL'd.
< 1529723875 204428 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it looks like all you'd have to do is say "respectively GPL'd works are covered under the GPL" and leave it at that in one page.
< 1529723896 443019 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't even think this place cared. did anybody make a fuss?
< 1529723916 553224 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: well we remove _obvious_ copyright violations.
< 1529723926 101177 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :we don't care _that_ much.
< 1529723942 132271 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not like i go searching around.
< 1529723962 478547 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :just curious as to the origins of the idea. because I've never heard of this being an issue before.
< 1529723971 276840 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose we could do like wikipedia and have some pages be stricter.
< 1529724011 988269 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, if it were me, I wouldn't even bother enforcing licensing questions unless a fuss was made.
< 1529724018 456617 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was the original wiki founder graue's idea to make it PD, i assume, then we changed to CC/0 when we found out PD isn't really a license.
< 1529724061 406902 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh.
< 1529724085 182024 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(too many places don't allow putting things in PD by decree)
< 1529724133 234894 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :this just brings to mind the kind of person who'd actually be pissed off by inclusion on the wiki with a conflicting license.
< 1529724182 671416 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: i'm a bit chip on my shoulder about it today because of that trollish bob guy
< 1529724198 939453 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm just amused that he left his password in his talk page.
< 1529724212 445552 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :it didn't look particularly real
< 1529724215 705806 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was.
< 1529724222 595793 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :...oh.
< 1529724239 633721 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :thar be a reason you're not seeing any more edits from him.
< 1529724309 442806 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_O
< 1529724350 938419 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: well he has four other accounts, at least.
< 1529724360 479308 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :which will get unbanned tomorrow.
< 1529724360 771888 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :how lovely. let's hope he's as stupid. :P
< 1529724371 813723 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :is he a known troll or something?
< 1529724391 19797 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: not to me. but he's behaving trollish.
< 1529724420 108789 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :he could be someone we've seen before of course.
< 1529724440 436986 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stuff I posted on Wikipedia, All The Tropes wiki, my own computer programs, the stuff I write on this IRC (unless quoted someone else), is also public domain you are free to use them if you want to do so.
< 1529724470 379549 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :all the shit I write is under the "I'm not responsible" license.
< 1529724473 434216 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if I'm in a country that doesn't legally recognize public domain?
< 1529724502 332479 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :as in, if you somehow replace your init process with my interpreter, I am not responsible for downtime.
< 1529724535 327078 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is fine, since I am not paying for it.
< 1529724569 560164 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: ah but have you put in the appropriate THIS PROGRAM COMES WITH NO WARRANTY, EVEN IMPLIED ETC. boilerplate?
< 1529724581 907651 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :lmao, for some internal stuff.
< 1529724599 375720 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :we had an acquisition. I put that in some tools I gave to the new staff.
< 1529724624 31006 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: There is many license that is effectively close enough to public domain, whether CC0, the Unlicense, WTFPL, zero-clause BSD, etc; you can use all of that too.
< 1529724640 23680 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :"This is proof that you can't sue me."
< 1529724674 893375 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course they can sue.
< 1529724680 605693 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can always sue.
< 1529724688 887449 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :whether they'll succeed is the question.
< 1529724697 914267 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but there's sue, and then there's sue with even a chance of success.
< 1529724728 826809 :pikhq!~pikhq@c-73-181-126-9.hsd1.co.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're likely to have a summary judgement issued against you in a lawsuit, you *basically* can't sue.
< 1529724738 385528 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529724914 795468 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529725331 741938 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
> 1529726105 735616 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55996&oldid=55995 5* 03Asdf 5* (+190) 10/* Removed copyrighted content */
> 1529726192 250820 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=55997&oldid=55996 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1) 10/* Removed copyrighted content */
< 1529726433 228180 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*sigh*
< 1529727008 445671 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a good trick!
< 1529727028 628587 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you see something with a license that says you can't copy it, just copy it and change the license.
< 1529727069 158982 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not have all of the files for the instrument sounds for General MIDI. How to get the rest of them?
< 1529727075 971519 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't violate a license if you don't have a license. ;)
< 1529727156 54295 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: i'm starting to see the attraction of "don't bother" now...
< 1529727187 664635 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :sometimes laziness is an optimization. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
< 1529727979 478094 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why was the picture blank for half of a second?
< 1529728677 693630 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
> 1529728962 369360 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[074-list14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55998 5* 03Asdf 5* (+465) 10Created page with "4-list is a simplification of I/D machine(actually being only 1-commanded, and it supports I/O). ==Syntax== It only works when the alphabet number is 4. If the word doesn't en..."
< 1529730368 772117 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529731514 44216 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529732315 525540 :b_jonas!~x@russell2.math.bme.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529732600 723488 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529732616 857147 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529734144 69039 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vvrtpovyytscmykd QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529734331 6608 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529735825 993669 :impomatic!~digital_w@host86-191-16-233.range86-191.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529737609 194463 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529737689 674498 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529738555 238397 :guydreich!choochter@nat/ibm/x-fufgdmzfsboccptr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529738711 812171 :teuchter!choochter@nat/ibm/x-ysounftfksqdfejg QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529739197 397884 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529739412 862042 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529739552 3552 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529739651 488902 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcqcc5280510nu.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529740931 616756 :redubious!~quassel@184.101.97.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529740940 63392 :redubious!~quassel@184.101.97.31 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DgW0PG1UYAAzbaN.jpg:large
< 1529742958 388099 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529743337 763376 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcqcc5280510nu.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in
< 1529743670 620745 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529745020 292177 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529745295 275295 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529746090 622498 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529746551 255565 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529747339 815772 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1529752475 666557 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529753542 287754 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529754837 254943 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=55999 5* 03Asdf 5* (+7233) 10Created page with "'''Emmental''' is an [[esoteric programming language]] designed by [[Chris Pressey]] in 2007.  Emmental is a self-modifying language.  It is defined by a meta-circular interpr..."
> 1529754878 40036 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56000&oldid=55999 5* 03Asdf 5* (-63) 10
> 1529754893 290818 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56001&oldid=56000 5* 03Asdf 5* (-95) 10
> 1529754913 943079 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56002&oldid=56001 5* 03Asdf 5* (-5535) 10
> 1529754931 595384 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56003&oldid=56002 5* 03Asdf 5* (-209) 10
> 1529754964 154748 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56004&oldid=56003 5* 03Asdf 5* (-99) 10/* Instruction set */
< 1529754987 496937 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
> 1529755010 113219 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56005&oldid=56004 5* 03Asdf 5* (-326) 10/* Instruction set */
> 1529755024 646814 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56006&oldid=56005 5* 03Asdf 5* (-143) 10/* Instruction set */
> 1529755043 450087 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56007&oldid=56006 5* 03Asdf 5* (-154) 10/* Instruction set */
> 1529755098 783143 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56008&oldid=56007 5* 03Asdf 5* (-55) 10/* Instruction set */
> 1529755117 636564 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplified Emmental14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56009&oldid=56008 5* 03Asdf 5* (-60) 10/* Instruction set */
> 1529755752 415480 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03BoutonIA 5*  10uploaded "[[02File:Program "Hi !" in BSoD..png10]]"
> 1529755776 471828 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56011&oldid=55770 5* 03Asdf 5* (+71) 10/* Survey */
> 1529756287 368260 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CopyPasta Language14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56012&oldid=55913 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+4) 10Add link to the esolang page.
> 1529756407 970900 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Last ReSort14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56013&oldid=45757 5* 03Ais523 5* (+288) 10/* ZISC implementation */ implementation of this in the I/D machine
> 1529756612 287059 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10deleted "[[02KittenScript10]]": blanked by author shortly after creation (likely an attempt to undo the creation of the page), no edits by others
< 1529756870 303802 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529756905 843134 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07123414]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56014 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1477) 10Created page with "'''1234''' is an extension of [[123]]. == Instructions == The pointer begins at location 0.  The program is executed in a loop, and only terminates if the end of the program i..."
> 1529757033 967097 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Rattlesnake14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56015 5* 03Ais523 5* (+366) 10attribution
> 1529757501 659244 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Asdfjkl;14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56016 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2977) 10Created page with "[[asdfjkl;]] is an extension of [[asdf]] and [[1234]].The pointer begins at memory location 3.  It can be moved left or right infinitely.  IO is memory mapped.  To read from t..."
> 1529757603 880857 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Asdfjkl;14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56017&oldid=56016 5* 03Asdf 5* (-1) 10
> 1529757671 450970 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56018&oldid=56011 5* 03Asdf 5* (+75) 10/* Survey */
> 1529758073 419617 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Qweruiopasdfghjkl;14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56019 5* 03Asdf 5* (+3983) 10Created page with "[[qweruiopasdfghjkl;]] is an extension of [[asdf]] and [[1234]].(Including [[Brainfuck]] and [[I/D machine]].)The pointer begins at memory location 3.  It can be moved left or..."
> 1529758352 3984 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Qwertyuiopasdfghjkl;vb14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56020 5* 03Asdf 5* (+4131) 10Created page with "[[qwertyuiopasdfghjkl;vb]] is an extension of [[asdf]] and [[1234]].(Including [[Brainfuck]] and [[I/D machine]] and [[BCT]].)The pointer begins at memory location 3.  It can..."
< 1529759235 742627 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529760294 234845 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CopyPasta Language14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56021&oldid=56012 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+21) 10Add Category:Thematic
< 1529760928 639226 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1529760950 773622 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1529760959 603828 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BSoD14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56022 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+2279) 10Creation of the page
> 1529761003 641058 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:BoutonIA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56023&oldid=55572 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+13) 10/* My Languages */ Add the language "BSoD"
< 1529761016 738227 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529761217 332279 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529761751 280168 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56024&oldid=55692 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+0) 10Modification of "CopyPasta Language"
< 1529762176 837007 :contrapumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529762516 982229 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-blsihrtsrbxezbob JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529764945 459051 :Naergon!~Naergon@94.197.121.77.threembb.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529765751 137855 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529767832 22505 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529769197 245785 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529769730 137040 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529770297 290649 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-blsihrtsrbxezbob QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529771412 302629 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1529772247 775709 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just opened NetHack for the first time in ages (never really got into it)
< 1529772832 482665 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like I should be taking more notes on the help file
< 1529774060 878328 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529774144 182362 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529774268 207864 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1529779643 480276 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-goukekdbcxnordob JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529780136 565597 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1529782295 705520 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529782410 750032 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1529782481 913438 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you are playing mahjong and all of your opponents are cheating against you, taking your hand tiles into the bathroom might not help, because your opponent can examine the rest of the tiles in the wall and see which ones are missing.
< 1529782485 82808 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn' it?
< 1529783992 739824 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529784212 13328 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529784308 761127 :redubious!~quassel@184.101.97.31 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1529788235 615303 :Guest54989!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rtmaqvnphnrjfapq NICK :lynn
< 1529788244 310345 :lynn!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rtmaqvnphnrjfapq QUIT :Changing host
< 1529788244 326823 :lynn!sid154965@unaffiliated/lynn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529788244 349062 :lynn!sid154965@unaffiliated/lynn QUIT :Changing host
< 1529788244 349132 :lynn!sid154965@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rtmaqvnphnrjfapq JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529789656 390639 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529789795 780763 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1529791388 336590 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BSoD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56025&oldid=56022 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+0) 10Change color for BSoD Background Color V2
< 1529791535 270879 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529798007 681107 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529798708 606493 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529802678 491068 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529802889 493757 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529804721 251568 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1529805555 777954 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56026&oldid=56018 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-224) 10/* Survey */ Tarpits listed here probably shouldn't be extensions of other tarpits, and pages with incomprehensible specs don't belong here. That leaves [[123]] of the new additions, put it in the right place.
< 1529805580 335164 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( There's no way asdf isn't bob, really. )
> 1529805804 65112 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Oerjan 5*  10deleted "[[02Rattlesnake10]]": Another troll page
> 1529805868 661339 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56027&oldid=55920 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-68) 10/* General languages */ poof
< 1529806071 965641 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm being awfully arbitrary...
< 1529806147 301151 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529806191 655030 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :by which i mean i'm resisting the temptation to delete all the crap pages "bob" made.
< 1529806208 247372 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :and semi-failing.
< 1529807467 338529 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1529820513 342029 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
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< 1529821391 768756 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION good morning

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< 1529828397 678185 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529829350 310410 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529829384 63670 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529829489 863583 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529831268 368214 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529831442 9646 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1529832677 213374 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Assemblyfuck14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56028 5* 03Asdf 5* (+696) 10Created page with "'''AssemblyFuck''' is a language made by [[User:asdf|User:asdf]] and is a version of [[brainfuck]] that uses assembler-like words instead of symbols.  == Specification and ins..."
< 1529833128 329513 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529833189 303090 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56029&oldid=55955 5* 03Asdf 5* (+40) 10/* Obfuscation */
> 1529833270 551492 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:YamTokWae/Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56030&oldid=55119 5* 03YamTokWae 5* (+47) 10Keyboards are getting weird....
< 1529833385 755989 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529833906 230299 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529833906 289972 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a QUIT :Changing host
< 1529833906 290044 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529834661 492284 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Messyscript14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56031 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1022) 10Created page with "==Messyscript== Messyscript is a very hard-to-read esolang. ==Syntax== 20ri-4;t[5;t'[y;e'teu;354y;;56;'5lu;y65l'ytyl';ry;rtly;t'yl'r;y' : Increment to the pointer ];ae][flw[er..."
> 1529834677 188941 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Messyscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56032&oldid=56031 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8) 10/* Syntax */
> 1529834687 251151 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Messyscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56033&oldid=56032 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1) 10/* Example */
> 1529834802 481977 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Messyscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56034&oldid=56033 5* 03Asdf 5* (+158) 10
> 1529834933 254085 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Messyscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56035&oldid=56034 5* 03Asdf 5* (+240) 10
< 1529835222 823237 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529835365 313375 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1529836874 92493 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56036&oldid=56026 5* 03Asdf 5* (+71) 10/* Survey */
< 1529837150 799394 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529837363 711046 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529838702 799827 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529839081 335639 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529839123 354959 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529839259 775768 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529839306 226541 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529840951 680396 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529841030 236240 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529844847 173624 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529845015 323890 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529845231 663815 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529846727 989941 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1529848641 294412 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529848840 310301 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529849274 364486 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529851531 521086 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529852458 64235 :impomatic!~digital_w@host86-191-16-233.range86-191.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529852872 66826 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi there. A friend of mine have asked if there is a term for messages of form "/me does something" or "*does something*". In the language we were discussing it, I think there’s none, but it could be possible to borrow from English (or any other language you know), if there is, so I decided to ask y’all here
< 1529852952 1783 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect we should add ". o O (thinks something)" to the list. However, I have seen this interesting form only here :)
< 1529852961 81078 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :actions
< 1529852969 357475 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :those messages are usually called actions
< 1529853023 609760 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks! Is there other variations?
< 1529853185 949920 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dbhtbnvbttjgimcs JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529853668 542590 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The word "emotes" is also used.
< 1529853672 864148 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emote
< 1529854136 132969 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, this is more specific for the goal of translation!
< 1529855208 223952 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529855381 490271 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529855532 950635 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :my friend is very thankful, he’d found German interwiki in that article interesting)
< 1529857019 698199 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529857265 105549 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529857365 868949 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529857377 884926 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529858978 717892 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1529859393 410098 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: . o O ( ... ) is a thought, clearly different from a display of emotion :P
< 1529859580 263310 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: is there a clearly defined boundary between thought and emotion? ::
< 1529859622 972994 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm for a majority of applications it seem to be present
< 1529859640 791394 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION thinks that should be obvious ;-)

< 1529859734 846683 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :but OTOH we are, and our brains are, biological nonsense. At present, at least. So it doesn’t close a door for incomprehensible states
< 1529859878 294159 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529860700 320508 :redubious!~quassel@184.101.97.31 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529860906 375363 :redubious!~quassel@184.101.97.31 PART :#esoteric
< 1529861039 505527 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529861988 252063 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529862164 804513 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e, holy hell
< 1529862177 149335 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :all this time i've thought it was a prefix version of O.o
< 1529862325 11923 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529864033 312783 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha
< 1529865259 296137 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529865953 327601 :Naergon!~Naergon@94.197.121.77.threembb.co.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529867053 629866 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529867462 848727 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529868059 183866 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: /dev/null is full
< 1529868215 322101 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529868232 189902 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529869759 997900 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:1dc3:dd4c:755f:f877 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529869780 318493 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b188:9800:1dc3:dd4c:755f:f877 QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529870659 592505 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1529871701 592327 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv, I've seen . o O (Blah) in JParanoia
< 1529871708 409549 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a built in thing for that
< 1529871736 389420 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :JParanoia = client for Paranoia RPG online
< 1529873409 349435 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529873848 213071 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529873983 489519 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529874700 737591 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen it in a few different channels, although admittedly I might be partly to blame for spreading it to some of them
< 1529874817 376720 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1529874868 753399 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529875221 753594 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
> 1529875370 272983 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03BoutonIA 5*  10uploaded "[[02File:HelloWorldBSoD.png10]]"
< 1529875460 651558 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you read my document of IMIDI?
< 1529875562 798000 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1529875598 359099 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529875741 974751 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BSoD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56038&oldid=56025 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+239) 10
> 1529876300 939397 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56039&oldid=56024 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+181) 10Add BSoD Hello, World!
< 1529878071 252198 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529878465 592773 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1529878786 980779 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529878842 399284 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529879395 244918 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Professor ape 5*  10New user account
< 1529879453 884536 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529879615 335516 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529879751 331209 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529879783 674118 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56040&oldid=55968 5* 03Professor ape 5* (+510) 10/* Introductions */
< 1529879873 440860 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
> 1529879896 571512 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56041&oldid=56040 5* 03Professor ape 5* (+1) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529880085 438524 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Professor ape14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56042 5* 03Professor ape 5* (+367) 10Created page with "Professor_Ape is just this crazy guy who enjoys programming and puzzles and programming puzzles. Also other things. Among those other things is esolangs, probably a result of..."
< 1529880773 117066 :dingbat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gajxaficrobtapjf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529881203 316971 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.6.5+deb2build2 - http://znc.in
< 1529881219 670937 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529881583 6876 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529881784 799147 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/zP5W/text I did something cool.
< 1529881874 869066 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a set of rules that governs a 2D grid with an active cursor.
< 1529881908 984873 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo_: wow
< 1529881927 496331 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I drew a smiley face. I'm pretty happy about that.
< 1529882466 962162 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529882770 967458 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529883177 609625 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529883359 657878 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I updated the Unusenet documentation with some new additions and some clarifications.
< 1529883635 159437 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if anybody has any alternative ideas for constructing a 2D tape in thue, lemme know.
< 1529884173 453088 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529884204 342180 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529886528 489234 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529886881 494841 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esoteric programming language14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56043&oldid=56029 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-40) 10Undo revision 56029 by [[Special:Contributions/Asdf|Asdf]] ([[User talk:Asdf|talk]]) It's certainly not.
> 1529887030 594446 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turing tarpit14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56044&oldid=56036 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-71) 10As I said in my previous edit summary, they don't belong here, also this is not a "complete list" section
< 1529887207 790103 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asdf seems to be a bit of a wanker.
> 1529887282 36518 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07INTERCALL14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56045 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8062) 10Created page with "'''INTERCAL''', an abbreviation for ''Compiler Language With No Pronounceable Acronym'', was created in 1972, thus probably making it the first ever esoteric programming lan..."
< 1529887342 778630 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :dude.
< 1529887527 892740 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: too similar to "bob"
< 1529887565 681837 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah like he's just duplicating language pages. :\
< 1529887574 835176 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed
< 1529888297 601679 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :duckgoose
< 1529888304 884608 :duckgoose!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moony
< 1529888463 269795 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :duccgoose
< 1529888901 51048 :duccgoose!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moony
< 1529889215 497392 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1529890668 637423 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Timeline of esoteric programming languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56046&oldid=43532 5* 03Asdf 5* (+84) 10/* 2005 */
> 1529890717 756857 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Timeline of esoteric programming languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56047&oldid=56046 5* 03Asdf 5* (-4) 10/* 2006 */
> 1529890907 285184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Timeline of esoteric programming languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56048&oldid=56047 5* 03Asdf 5* (+87) 10/* 2000 */
> 1529890970 348966 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Timeline of esoteric programming languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56049&oldid=56048 5* 03Asdf 5* (+70) 10/* 2001 */
< 1529891290 324267 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :those edits look suspiciously close to reasonable.
< 1529891315 890576 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( he's trying to throw us off track! )
> 1529891387 210418 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56050&oldid=56041 5* 03Fuzzballcat7 5* (-141) 10/* Introductions */
> 1529891738 247216 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Timeline of esoteric programming languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56051&oldid=56049 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+69) 10Expand descriptions a bit
> 1529891898 346821 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56052&oldid=56050 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-2) 10Undo censorship. Seriously, browsers shouldn't do that automatically.
< 1529894722 10680 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529895348 620778 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529895896 7859 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :did he just try to censor everything? that's hilarious.
< 1529896567 858889 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't go far enough.
< 1529896575 586466 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You ought to censor all criticisms of the wiki
< 1529897207 7293 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: i believe it's a kid browsing through some kind of net nanny - they had big trouble making the introduction in the first place
< 1529897321 50005 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :there were heaps of similar edits caught in the filter because the introduction edit isn't allowed to change anything else on the page
< 1529897452 30683 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that's a specific application
< 1529897771 275771 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1529898923 420285 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I've basically just invented a new variant of thue that allows line-comments and a modified syntax. should I add this to the wiki with examples? because all of my programs (including the one I wrote today) are good examples of string rewriting.
< 1529899806 208628 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529900905 127696 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever you do, don't start by copying the Thue page hth
< 1529901264 226642 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :lmfao.
< 1529902884 271128 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529903260 95647 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dbhtbnvbttjgimcs QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
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< 1529903500 292180 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529904990 295536 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529906126 104684 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, just write it by yourself; link to the Thue page if necessary, there is no need to copy it, though.
< 1529908277 522516 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1529909322 844750 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529911934 72917 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529914013 997508 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1529914747 722096 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56053&oldid=55031 5* 03Asdf 5* (+68) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1529914831 61899 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56054&oldid=56053 5* 03Asdf 5* (+32) 10/* Examples */
< 1529916195 100386 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529916349 778340 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56055&oldid=56054 5* 03Asdf 5* (+261) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1529916510 274562 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56056&oldid=56055 5* 03Asdf 5* (+185) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1529916545 764577 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56057&oldid=56056 5* 03Asdf 5* (-32) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1529916896 638013 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56058&oldid=56057 5* 03Asdf 5* (+392) 10/* Cat */
> 1529917020 688961 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56059&oldid=56058 5* 03Asdf 5* (+97) 10/* Move value */
< 1529917069 228128 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529917069 285904 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a QUIT :Changing host
< 1529917069 285949 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529917100 391528 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56060&oldid=56059 5* 03Asdf 5* (+55) 10/* Cat */
> 1529917168 757362 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56061&oldid=56060 5* 03Asdf 5* (+79) 10/* External resources */
> 1529917402 524667 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56062&oldid=56061 5* 03Asdf 5* (+107) 10/* Division */
> 1529917422 980038 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56063&oldid=56062 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Cubing */
> 1529917602 402315 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56064&oldid=56063 5* 03Asdf 5* (+5) 10/* Cubing */
> 1529917670 148702 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56065&oldid=56064 5* 03Asdf 5* (-6) 10/* Cubing */
> 1529917758 411639 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56066&oldid=56065 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Addition */
> 1529917768 938614 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56067&oldid=56066 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Subtraction */
> 1529917776 521057 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56068&oldid=56067 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Multiplication */
> 1529917797 375889 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56069&oldid=56068 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Division */
> 1529917806 879118 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56070&oldid=56069 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Squaring */
> 1529917818 533195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56071&oldid=56070 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* Cubing */
> 1529918074 54813 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56072&oldid=56071 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8246) 10/* Examples */
< 1529918098 778825 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529918198 448997 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56073&oldid=56072 5* 03Asdf 5* (-63) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
> 1529918253 156254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56074&oldid=56073 5* 03Asdf 5* (+6) 10/* Self Interpreter */
< 1529918288 802542 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1529918340 136675 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56075&oldid=56074 5* 03Asdf 5* (+90) 10/* Quine */
> 1529918366 961018 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56076&oldid=56075 5* 03Asdf 5* (+34) 10/* Self Interpreter */
> 1529918430 349266 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56077&oldid=56076 5* 03Asdf 5* (+20) 10
> 1529918473 316056 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56078&oldid=56077 5* 03Asdf 5* (+5) 10/* Cat */
> 1529918710 271900 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56079&oldid=56078 5* 03Asdf 5* (+315) 10/* Examples */
> 1529918863 945676 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56080&oldid=56079 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2247) 10/* Examples */
> 1529918888 758856 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56081&oldid=56080 5* 03Asdf 5* (-29) 10/* ROT13 Encipher */
> 1529918900 742728 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56082&oldid=56081 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* ROT13 Encipher */
> 1529918911 591804 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56083&oldid=56082 5* 03Asdf 5* (-2) 10/* ROT13 Encipher */
> 1529919127 252625 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56084&oldid=56083 5* 03Asdf 5* (+66) 10/* External resources */
> 1529919180 479909 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56085&oldid=56084 5* 03Asdf 5* (+43) 10/* External resources */
> 1529919385 77244 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56086&oldid=56085 5* 03Asdf 5* (+0) 10/* Quine */
< 1529919439 778269 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :...that "INTERCALL" page is just a copy of the contents of the INTERCAL page, except without the "See also" section.
> 1529919441 498197 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07INTERCALL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56087&oldid=56045 5* 03Fizzie 5* (-8040) 10Replace content copy with a redirect.
> 1529919513 709560 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56088&oldid=56086 5* 03Asdf 5* (+3274) 10/* Quine */
> 1529919630 228902 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56089&oldid=56088 5* 03Asdf 5* (+4110) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
> 1529919841 296444 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56090&oldid=56089 5* 03Asdf 5* (+147) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
< 1529919975 492920 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529920053 751393 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56091&oldid=56090 5* 03Asdf 5* (+179) 10/* ROT13 Encipher */
> 1529920067 255979 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56092&oldid=56091 5* 03Asdf 5* (-4) 10/* Truth machine */
> 1529920165 618374 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56093&oldid=56092 5* 03Asdf 5* (+36) 10/* Quine */
> 1529920194 414136 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56094&oldid=56093 5* 03Asdf 5* (+43) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
< 1529920199 715131 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1529920336 325249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56095&oldid=56094 5* 03Asdf 5* (+94) 10/* Truth machine */
< 1529920540 791141 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is this person making so many edits
< 1529920641 18467 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529920946 184208 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56096&oldid=56095 5* 03Asdf 5* (+18) 10/* Language overview */
< 1529921378 906488 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you should edit it back
> 1529921516 311585 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56097&oldid=56096 5* 03Asdf 5* (+48) 10/* External resources */
< 1529921562 430732 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529921878 430942 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529922116 19887 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1529922595 495637 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56098&oldid=56097 5* 03Asdf 5* (+66) 10/* Truth machine */
< 1529923324 467291 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@unaffiliated/bowserinator QUIT :Excess Flood
< 1529923346 691424 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@unaffiliated/bowserinator JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529923788 759913 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529923965 324978 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1529924576 967716 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56099&oldid=56098 5* 03Asdf 5* (+80) 10/* External resources */
< 1529925631 912881 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529925854 692810 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529926622 187635 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529926780 658918 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :he even removes the link to the truth machine just to put a short description in the section on the article
< 1529927496 290945 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529927706 15720 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529927865 993891 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think a lot of that "examples" content (if we want to keep it) needs to go on its own subpage. Four moderately long programs was okay; 18 isn't.
< 1529927919 760984 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also the conversational tone isn't great for an article.)
< 1529927956 243132 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And the one-char cat isn't a cat. It's not even a kitten. It's more of a hairball.)
> 1529928263 52359 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56100&oldid=56099 5* 03Fizzie 5* (-60) 10/* Cat */ Undo one-char cat (revisions 56060, 56078): it doesn't really implement cat, and "four versions (but X added one more)" just looks silly.
< 1529928627 61440 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't stdin passthrough just ,[.,]
< 1529928637 204260 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Assuming , returns 0 once you're done
< 1529928651 983409 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The page has variants for the four different EOF conventions.
< 1529928676 227700 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, three different conventions but four different combinations.
< 1529928677 43945 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like eof returns -1
< 1529928680 875645 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then it's unabiguous
< 1529928683 970119 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :And still easy to test
< 1529928688 751612 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(0, -1, "0 or no change", "-1 or no change".)
< 1529928720 840171 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not unambiguous on 8-bit cells.
< 1529928726 892076 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :"While lots of people didn't find how to subtract, I do found one. It subtracts 7 by 2. " Great grammar
< 1529928731 187108 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: True
< 1529928738 553776 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :But we all know 9 bits are the standard ;)
< 1529928756 20177 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o
< 1529928771 46914 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn’t
> 1529929027 724012 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56101&oldid=56100 5* 03Asdf 5* (+966) 10/* Infinite loop */
> 1529929042 866411 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56102&oldid=56101 5* 03Asdf 5* (+13) 10/* Deadfish */
< 1529929061 808657 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :FreeFull: FWIW, I also disagree on the "Squaring" and "Cubing" examples actually doing what they say they do. IMO, squaring 5 would be more like +++++[->+>+<<]>[->[->+<<<+>>]>[-<+>]<<] than +++++[->+++++<].
< 1529929092 697486 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: Yeah, that "squaring" example is just multiplication
< 1529929137 506643 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I may do a little cleanup later, but there's work stuff now.
> 1529929340 865695 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56103&oldid=56102 5* 03Asdf 5* (+25789) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
< 1529929343 301271 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm also semi-worried about the CC0 status of all these programs. I don't expect they're all own work, but there's no credit given.
< 1529929363 331222 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The Deadfish example seems to be just a copy of Deadfish#Brainfuck.
< 1529929391 697125 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529929401 78025 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Okay, that last one is just crazy.
> 1529929424 798274 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56104&oldid=56103 5* 03Asdf 5* (-25789) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
> 1529929509 749920 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56105&oldid=56104 5* 03Asdf 5* (+3148) 10/* Quine */
< 1529929551 313542 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1529929810 145460 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56106&oldid=56105 5* 03Asdf 5* (+579) 10/* Language overview */
> 1529929846 109075 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56107&oldid=56106 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8) 10/* Language overview */
< 1529930397 451388 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529931274 220972 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529931458 85168 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529931631 629077 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529932472 58953 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1529932617 821381 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56108&oldid=56107 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1) 10/* Truth machine */
> 1529932648 929672 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56109&oldid=56108 5* 03Asdf 5* (+50) 10/* Truth machine */
< 1529933153 535146 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1529933190 954069 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56110&oldid=56109 5* 03Asdf 5* (+153) 10/* Hello, World! */
> 1529933223 657941 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56111&oldid=56110 5* 03Asdf 5* (+0) 10/* Examples */
< 1529933334 42050 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529935061 287351 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529935258 314022 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529936941 799699 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529937140 327280 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529938846 320790 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529939031 278992 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529939191 171719 :hooloovo0!Hooloovoo@2a01:4f8:120:4091::10 QUIT :Quit: Temporarily refracted into a free-standing prism.
< 1529939726 883788 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xogodpnpirudcslb JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529940741 829375 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529940953 101542 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529942191 465682 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@hooloovoo.blue JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529942616 480054 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529942798 21369 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529943152 818727 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It wasn't completely a copy; there was a "New Syntax" section, too.
< 1529944649 948506 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529944791 277925 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529945804 74830 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529945983 704948 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Still, they shouldn't almost copy it either; just a link and the section of new stuff could do, if they needed that)
< 1529946565 358775 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529946719 780652 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529947391 186115 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529947391 246095 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@2a02:c7d:485a:3300:fb8b:fb15:c1d3:a33a QUIT :Changing host
< 1529947391 246155 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529948412 870765 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529948418 401384 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1529948419 684587 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :guys
< 1529948424 343409 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529948454 351476 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats up?
< 1529948567 626551 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nyeh
< 1529948594 2512 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529948798 836947 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive made an esolang
< 1529949554 36934 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529950286 368225 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529950483 293232 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529952274 209882 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529952411 957850 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew, go on
< 1529952415 326525 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529952461 721986 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its a joke language
< 1529952489 401471 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically to make a script in it
< 1529952504 800912 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :take a python script and convert every letter and number in it to binary
< 1529952513 948323 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :1s are + and 0s are -
< 1529952517 62423 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats it
< 1529952568 360811 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want you can do the command "musicate-"
< 1529952609 931855 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"musicate-[converted script here]" plays the script, where every + is an A note and every - is a B note
< 1529952623 275144 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's, uh
< 1529952626 89603 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really a language
< 1529952639 102343 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea
< 1529952646 497622 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a conversion
< 1529952690 689515 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know thats lame
< 1529952700 101930 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but im new
< 1529952704 974042 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what have you mad
< 1529952707 163571 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :made*
< 1529952710 431505 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :more interesting: come up with a syntactic transformation like that which maps *any* input file at all to a valid python problem
< 1529952731 854314 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this will be almost impossible targeting python tbh, better to try a language with simpler syntax)
< 1529952736 573039 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :o
< 1529952743 229917 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is c good
< 1529952745 930032 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or c++
< 1529952821 25961 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ive got another idea
< 1529952858 108473 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this language, there are only < and >
< 1529952871 83157 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine an infinite tape
< 1529952878 686529 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :< spawns a pointer
< 1529952887 281136 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> turns each pointer
< 1529952889 825036 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : error:
< 1529952889 877895 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :     Variable not in scope:
< 1529952889 893934 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :       turns :: ((a0 -> f0 b0) -> s0 -> f0 t0) -> t1 -> terror: Variable not ...
< 1529952901 175500 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :>(2) turns each pointer 2 degrees
< 1529952918 213794 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- is a separator
< 1529952947 511949 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and another new symbol, # decides the size of the tape
< 1529952967 877020 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :#(2) makes the tape have 2*2=4 squares
< 1529952995 21927 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :< always spawns a pointer at the very lower edge of the tape
< 1529953014 574543 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the very down-left corner to be exact
< 1529953028 246019 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :#(0) spawns a pointer at that corner
< 1529953068 2809 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops, i meant <(0)
< 1529953102 776856 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :<(1) spawns a pointer 1 diagonal block away from that corner
< 1529953123 207000 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :<(2) spawns a pointer 2 blocks diagonally away from that corner, and so on.
< 1529953168 913958 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :after that, you end the whole thing off with F and then convert each black square to a 1 and each white one to a 0
< 1529953179 951961 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, this isnt good
< 1529953270 630278 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now, lets remove #
< 1529953278 75467 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lets make this an infinite tape
< 1529953290 543700 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :< spawns a black pixel, > spawns a white pixel.
< 1529953342 991697 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- is the separator
< 1529953373 346267 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you wanna know what all that is, its binary
< 1529953406 910563 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[when i say separator i mean - goes inbetween each wedge]
< 1529953443 273894 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that binary is binary for a script from brainf@@k
< 1529953533 153488 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, the hello world script for my esolang goes like this:
< 1529953552 286328 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :take the hello world script from brainf@@k, convert it to binary
< 1529953576 85124 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :make each 0 a < and each 1 a >
< 1529953581 249606 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there you go.
< 1529953595 80792 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also have - between each wedge.
< 1529953656 605514 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this language is called wedgef@@k
< 1529953673 549522 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1529953696 877157 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529954370 248115 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529954404 68904 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529954515 368768 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529954548 855778 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do y'all think of DawnOS?
< 1529954573 548416 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :claims to be an operating system written for a subleq interpreter with hardware access.
< 1529954701 489344 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529954736 909534 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it has a single command
< 1529954766 334995 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but its still turing complete
< 1529954784 429355 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats cool
< 1529954798 747824 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it's an OISC.
< 1529954808 379382 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rather, a piece of software targeting an OISC.
< 1529954817 285014 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one instruction set computer.
< 1529954818 206732 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I downloaded it and tried it out. it's a mess.
< 1529954835 960012 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't make a non-messy os with 1 command
< 1529954861 427119 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree.
< 1529954870 417032 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can.
< 1529954871 691001 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so...
< 1529954884 540087 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :was the wrong command chosen?
< 1529954915 333853 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's less that the underlying architecture is bad, and more the operating system is bad.
< 1529954928 7342 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhh, the vista problem
< 1529954942 5462 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the architecture's good, but the os is bad
> 1529954991 14751 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56112&oldid=56111 5* 03Ais523 5* (-25186) 10rv all recent edits by [[User:asdf]]; at least some of them are copyright violations, best to err on the safe side and assume that they all are
< 1529955030 611376 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the dude says that there is an imperialistic opression
< 1529955035 449536 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :by intel
< 1529955044 286573 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah he's a terry davis certified nutbag.
< 1529955066 248347 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :tying computer proccessors and politics together, gimme a break.
> 1529955115 998881 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 revision10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10Ais523 changed visibility of 58 revisions on page [[02Brainfuck10]]: content hidden: Copyright violation
< 1529955185 968910 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's this oisc youre talking about
< 1529955222 838439 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's basically a computer that only has a single command.
< 1529955245 473961 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: well, two things bug me about dawn OS. 1) OISC really isn't a sweet spot in the performance space. 2) for something that claims to make people free, there should be source code available. I'd like to confirm that they basically have a standard library and a compiler backend (perhaps llvm? would like to know that...)
< 1529955253 289333 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy who made it claims that intel is oppressing people by using inefficient software.
> 1529955270 371655 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56113&oldid=55997 5* 03Ais523 5* (+681) 10please stop with the copyright violations
< 1529955273 31478 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: lmao, I agree, I was searching for the source in the zip archive he provides, but it simply ain't there.
< 1529955286 954512 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :he provides source for the simulator, but that's it.
< 1529955306 479457 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't know what's in the disk image, I've never run it)
< 1529955345 803240 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to quote the blog, "He sees chip and OS development as essentially political acts in a market dominated by corporate inefficiency."
< 1529955394 608842 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :inefficiency? hmm
< 1529955406 82219 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :he has an OpenCL-enabled emulator.. I'm curious as to what it does, but if I ran it, I'm worried that it'll frickin' nuke my system. :P
< 1529955426 648574 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gerigeri.uw.hu/DawnOS/freedom.html is his political page
< 1529955447 37880 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know what an oisc is
< 1529955455 962814 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :im asking about this specific one
< 1529955460 693200 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's subleq.
< 1529955470 346217 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: https://ptpb.pw/sbFN/c
< 1529955471 227045 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't quite see that inefficiency, though perhaps Google's TPU effort (beating GPUs by an order of magnitude for NN evaluation) proves some of that point.
< 1529955477 175640 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :SUBtract and branch if Less than or EQual
< 1529955483 539589 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what subleq is
< 1529955485 798810 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's the source code for his simulator.
< 1529955533 387274 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the variable names are the stuff of dreams.
< 1529955547 25797 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is hilarious
< 1529955552 278689 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529955571 499199 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he says that corporate people are opressing us by intentionally giving us bad stuff
< 1529955608 562348 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have added another person to my list of crazy people. check! this guy is nuts
< 1529955616 961233 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :no such int jobbegergomb=0;
< 1529955625 114250 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow
< 1529955628 907812 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :variables from dune
< 1529955637 644768 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that 'no such' is a pasting error)
< 1529955650 142741 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy shit if you do a string dump on the disk image he has an entire bitmap font in there.
< 1529955676 529941 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I think I found your source.
< 1529955686 429160 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the variables are the stuff of sleep paralysis delusions.
< 1529955690 431834 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :his name is geri dawn
< 1529955698 564950 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's on the damn disk.
< 1529955736 875006 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this guy is nuts in both departments
< 1529955743 173925 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean where else are you going to put a string dump
< 1529955746 308040 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's incredibly impressive.
> 1529955752 87226 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MediaWiki:Sidebar14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56114&oldid=30172 5* 03Ais523 5* (+45) 10[[Esolang:Categorization]] is probably important enough to put into the sidebar; people keep missing that it exists and it's a more usable way to find languages than the language list
< 1529955761 280436 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: `strings disk0.bin` is what I mean.
< 1529955763 465638 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway i assume the batshit variable names are due to him being hungarian more than anything else
< 1529955784 2324 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :i assume this is a bootable disk image
< 1529955806 206452 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I honestly have no idea. he says you need compatible hardware.
< 1529955812 710012 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1529955816 378444 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy doesn't know how to make an operating system.
< 1529955822 110502 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i mean is it surprising it contains a bitmap font?
< 1529955823 879264 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree. :P
< 1529955836 592476 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :Phantom_Hoover: I expected the bitmap font to be, you know, a bitmap.
< 1529955844 246853 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to display shit in that font it needs to be in an image
< 1529955847 30195 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's literally an ASCII representation of each letter lined up sequentially in memory.
< 1529955847 915068 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :raspberry pi does a better job, and it has really little commands
< 1529955854 528457 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you mean he stores it as, like, ascii art?
< 1529955858 120443 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yup.
< 1529955862 128383 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea
< 1529955863 22870 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :.
< 1529955863 693704 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol
< 1529955869 127566 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ASCII ART.
< 1529955870 564726 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :might just be to look good in a hex editor
< 1529955874 897882 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529955875 701571 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is.
< 1529955875 821871 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :reminds me of skullcode
< 1529955892 30640 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy is actually worse than most of the companies he claims are opressing us
< 1529955896 842956 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :(i guess you guys have never seen skullcode?)
< 1529955904 518121 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :never did.
< 1529955907 795704 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://skullcode.com/
< 1529955918 779219 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are underagers allowed on here?
< 1529955923 913104 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1529955936 991686 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :tl;dr it's a vm running a custom cpu architecture
< 1529955937 22219 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea, i'm 11.
< 1529955943 790365 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thats it.
< 1529955945 585216 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :running a hex editor pointed at its own memory
< 1529955973 804864 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/5CQH/text warning: large text dump, but this is the whole string dump of disk0.bin
< 1529955976 952966 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's probably not even the youngest regular we've had here
< 1529955996 844328 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Imagine a world, where the education of the students on computers is about showing the shapes of computers, and they call it ,,science''.
< 1529956001 509686 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what he said 
< 1529956032 806749 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm even more sure this guy is nuts
< 1529956044 69640 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like it.
< 1529956067 167574 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll say this, it's not something I've done.
< 1529956085 826685 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Imagine that opening a generic picture file needs more complex algorythms than sending a rocket with persons to land on the moon.
< 1529956090 234194 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is also what he said.
> 1529956091 157402 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang talk:Categorization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56115&oldid=54321 5* 03Ais523 5* (+1029) 10/* Category proposal: constant string printers */ new section
< 1529956093 288037 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is untrue.
< 1529956103 487418 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :well. it kind of is..?
< 1529956111 114929 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya. it kinda is.
< 1529956131 266314 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :modern image decoding is certainly more intensive than the stuff the guidance systems ran.
< 1529956149 123143 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but its so for a reason.
< 1529956193 361106 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the many small transistors can only detect 1 or 0.
< 1529956202 802766 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what.
< 1529956215 244762 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what what?
< 1529956222 665195 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :its true.
< 1529956227 393248 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a transistor is like a switch
< 1529956232 82520 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's... actually not, as such
< 1529956232 471676 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that has no relevance to the conversation.
< 1529956235 258366 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ohh
< 1529956244 802533 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :here he was right.
< 1529956247 753720 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes sense that you're 11.
< 1529956252 754414 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes it does
< 1529956254 233558 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529956279 630782 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :transistors don't just switch instantly on or off, they have useful behaviour on the boundary
< 1529956283 641641 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1529956284 378077 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: so now one just needs to unpack that disk image... hmm
< 1529956286 708201 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they do.
< 1529956298 470893 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: but good to know. if I ever find time for this, that is.
< 1529956327 364729 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I don't know for sure that this is your source, it's not really "complete" from what I'm seeing.
< 1529956355 147899 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's something. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
< 1529956384 415410 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :'big endian is easier when developing hardware'
< 1529956388 765945 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover PRIVMSG #esoteric :is that actually true
< 1529956401 223525 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really.
< 1529956406 3975 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529956408 647906 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :here is a thing that i think confirms his hungarianity.
< 1529956411 337982 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today is the anniversary of the hungarian freedom fight of 1848. Dawn Operating System is available from today. It is a honor to release it today: this day symbolizes the fight of people for democracy and independence. Today a new kind of battle starts: a battle to take away the computer industry from mega corporations and bribed public servants, and give it back to the people.
< 1529956424 355631 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that and the fact that his variable names are all in hungarian.
< 1529956435 608983 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and his name is geri dawn, apparently.
< 1529956452 96669 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :we knew this. :P
> 1529956474 813929 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:U ndefined14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56116&oldid=55936 5* 03Ais523 5* (+32) 10MediaWiki treats underscore and space as equivalent in usernames and page titles; tell it which spelling the author of this page prefers
< 1529956493 440124 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the guy is nuts, completely.
< 1529956504 370648 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i invented a new word.
< 1529956556 743597 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also his spelling is poor, which is a big clue.
< 1529956588 80986 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gerigeri.uw.hu/DawnOS/img/eszme.png
< 1529956600 29861 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is the picture on the freedom page.
< 1529956655 727382 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529956675 327803 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :-Imagine a world, where the education of the students on computers is about showing the shapes of computers, and they call it ,,science''.
< 1529956682 549366 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oops i already showed that.
< 1529956682 726978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :are asdf and Iamcalledbob the same person, do you think? (What's our policy on checkusering things other than spambots?)
< 1529956711 963381 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :either way, they're causing a lot of mess cleaning up after them; they might be a troll or might be well-meaning but misguided
< 1529956740 598279 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :Iamcalledbob was apparently disabled because he left his password on his talk page. Asdf spun up shortly after that.
< 1529956749 156904 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aha
< 1529956769 170540 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, coincidence be damned, I think they're one of the same.
< 1529956783 917278 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Iamcalledbob created something like five accounts as it was
< 1529956818 898306 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: now you've got me imagining a world where it's possible to determine what a computer does purely from its shape
< 1529956832 571258 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, that was just the guy rambling.
< 1529956841 66690 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't know, the guy is geri dawn.
< 1529956844 153860 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're picking apart DawnOS.
< 1529956848 313205 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :or rather, I am.
< 1529956853 828455 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's a hungarian guy who made dawnOS.
< 1529956864 132024 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :his emulator is an actual honest to god subleq implementation.
< 1529956876 477005 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he claims that intel and the other corp are opressing people.
< 1529956901 522244 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's nuts.
< 1529956920 162782 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://gerigeri.uw.hu/DawnOS/freedom.html
< 1529956926 136321 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are his ramblings.
< 1529956951 544343 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and his language contains a single command.
< 1529956953 451222 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :subleq.
< 1529956974 816994 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :subtract and branch if less than or equal.
< 1529957032 155145 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's one of the better-known OISCs
< 1529957034 53522 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Subleq
< 1529957076 49678 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one instruction set computer, if you're fancy.
< 1529957079 721591 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to work out where the hell he jumps to after he loads the image.
< 1529957100 357140 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we're trying to critique dawnOS
< 1529957101 759009 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :kinda
< 1529957107 194292 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think mov/tta is the most commonly used OISC in practice, but subleq is probably in second place?
< 1529957190 691100 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be called single instruction set computer, or SISC.
< 1529957201 249354 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: Hmm, some kernels of truth there. Software complexity, vendor lock-in. A lot of hyperbole though.
< 1529957223 698141 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: he's Terry Davis certified! sans the racial stuff... and the CIA stuff... and a lot else...
< 1529957230 392064 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: so a ZISC should be "empty instruction set computer"?
< 1529957234 188490 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense
< 1529957243 878179 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya
< 1529957245 221791 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/issues/22900 is relevant
< 1529957269 38263 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that makes sense.
< 1529957283 836925 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but much of the other stuff is nuts.
< 1529957295 134779 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :mainly the opression.
< 1529957339 819959 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: (I was going to say that "Imagine a computer, which requires 1 billion transistors to flicker the cursor on the screen." is a misrepresentation... because those billions of transistors can do so much more... but then I remembered that issue :P
< 1529957343 831810 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :)
< 1529957345 447351 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1529957355 298960 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is a misrepresentation.
< 1529957369 317529 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, it is?
< 1529957373 773390 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm confused.
< 1529957393 146427 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: by the way, you may appreciate this: https://ptpb.pw/vO8Q/text
< 1529957395 944177 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway, I'm not going to take this apart item by item... there's a lot there, and we'd be here all night :P
< 1529957406 74739 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1529957414 404072 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the guy is nuts.
< 1529957428 868756 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is he?
< 1529957438 487155 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's in my own thue dialect (because I can't stand the original), but it's a ruleset for manipulating an arbitrarily large 2D tape.
< 1529957443 570293 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I think what's going on there is known as an "abstractoin inversion"
< 1529957443 651851 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :* "abstraction inversion"
< 1529957446 220999 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a situation where you're trying to do something which is simple from the low-level point of view but you only have high-level operations to do it with and have to try to synthesize the low-level operations out of that
< 1529957473 704195 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: I like the idea of open hardware. I don't think Dawn is the right way.
< 1529957480 148689 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't/
< 1529957491 179685 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :a TTA would be better.
< 1529957494 842687 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux is the right way.
< 1529957496 980403 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :timing be damned.
< 1529957514 873966 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :TTA?
< 1529957524 240498 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :transport triggered architecture
< 1529957539 916156 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's an actual practical OISC.
< 1529957556 603648 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this guy is nuts, because he frames things as due to opression.
< 1529957557 9239 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a focus on moving data from one module to another. think of it as extreme microcode.
< 1529957561 744286 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: I was going ot say, it looks like an implementation of PaintFuck-without-control-flow in Thue
< 1529957567 776384 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although with different syntax
< 1529957574 596013 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: pretty much is! :P
< 1529957580 537649 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also it uses uldr rather than nwse
< 1529957585 463082 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't be hard to extend with control flow though.
< 1529957604 288943 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed, it seems to have a state machine already
< 1529957616 10190 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/Bf1F/python here's an interpreter if you wanna run it. it draws a smiley face. :)
< 1529957619 372683 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fwiw, my main issue with Thue is just that you have to write every possible character that something could skip over
< 1529957631 139986 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: thanks
< 1529957655 627650 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/KUhx/python here's a better version that prettyprints the screen.
< 1529957692 762413 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I'm starting to warm up to that fact, though, because I can just write a compiler that supports wildcards.
< 1529957704 741363 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION imagines a wimpmode/sugar for Thue in which you can define a preorder of characters, characters which are adjacent and ordered contradictory to the preorder would be swapped/sorted into order

< 1529957716 857232 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a programmer's reminder of happiness is that code.
< 1529957745 248027 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: aha, you're reading my mind. I'm wanting to develop a generic "signals" library for thue-like languages that does something like that.
< 1529957757 909970 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a compiler.
< 1529957797 953862 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: something that translates a source language into a destination language.
< 1529957829 841866 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :explain it to me like i'm 5.
< 1529957832 793334 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: right, you clearly just need an extra layer "above" Thue that compiles down into Thue and handles all the busywork of writing each wildcard combination
< 1529957875 674295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: a compiler is a program which takes input (which is a program) and produces output (which is also a program, and doesn't have to be in the same language), where the input and output programs do the same thing
< 1529957886 371803 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking of writing an interpreter that has arbitrary builtins as well, that after each round of rule application sneaks its own rules in for things like arithmetic, signal passing and such.
< 1529957922 914817 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you guys making?
< 1529958110 228735 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :compilers tend to be most practical when the output program is in a lower-level language than the input program (often assembler or machine code), although that's not required by the definition
< 1529958110 367798 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529958121 844769 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529958134 145192 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529958312 244577 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529958326 592506 :rantel!~rantel_@vpn244090.nat.uni-leipzig.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529958605 395546 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.133.178.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529958641 469491 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it makes me wonder what other kinds of obscure models of computation are out there that can be made potentially useful (and more.. digestable?) by some higher-level tricks.
< 1529958831 464634 :rantel!~rantel_@vpn244090.nat.uni-leipzig.de QUIT :Quit: rantel
< 1529958908 138456 :rantel!~rantel_@vpn244090.nat.uni-leipzig.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529958930 878385 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :makes me wanna start a site. "esolang rehab: where messed up languages find new life"
< 1529958938 367934 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oiscs are interesting.
< 1529958951 122080 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they can do so much with a single command
< 1529958971 386688 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's amazing.
< 1529958982 128054 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one command is much more.
< 1529959137 819146 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it cool?
< 1529959176 824667 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: you should look up Thue.
< 1529959202 694790 :rantel!~rantel_@vpn244090.nat.uni-leipzig.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529959276 419785 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( x86 is a zero instruction set architecture that looks at the data pointed to by the instruction pointer and interprets it in a horribly complicated way. )
< 1529959338 465796 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i did.
< 1529959346 753587 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 10x better. ;)
< 1529959354 559104 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is 10x better
< 1529959358 831593 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thue?
< 1529959361 374987 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yuh.
< 1529959371 845514 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i understood nothing so i'm saying yes.
< 1529959377 226919 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's 10x better.
< 1529959413 929941 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more specifically, 10:=10x better.
< 1529959442 672865 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :was that a good joke
< 1529959476 249228 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: it grows old after 10xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
< 1529959486 477699 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course it does.
< 1529959511 794023 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the joke was i used thue while describing how much better it was.
< 1529959520 161138 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a weak joke, but it's the best i can do
< 1529959776 672062 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :have any of you made your own esolangs?
< 1529959854 802477 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew: https://esolangs.org/wiki/User:ais523
< 1529959857 423700 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a list there
< 1529959866 216661 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've made one.
< 1529959876 69980 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a brainf@@k variant.
< 1529959891 392242 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you made eodermdrome? damn.
< 1529959911 908931 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, dude!
< 1529959916 144893 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made wedgef@@k.
< 1529959927 275378 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically, to make a hello world script in it...
< 1529959943 224052 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529959945 103650 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :take the brainf@@k hello world script.
< 1529959954 312309 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then convert it to binary.
< 1529959957 379865 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :remove the spaces.
< 1529959975 538898 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :make 0 < [left wedge] and 1 > [right wedge].
< 1529959978 725780 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there you go,
< 1529960035 437037 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is also wedge unary.
< 1529960045 258446 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529960079 218826 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529960085 344867 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more specifically, unary but every second 0 is replaced with this long string of text and every other 0 is a wedge.
< 1529960252 842233 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529960354 883039 :andrew!b2de08c1@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.8.193 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529960617 821741 :deltab!~deltab@ds6266.dedicated.turbodns.co.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1529960639 843172 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529960664 411004 :rodgort`!~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529960695 932321 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew> are underagers allowed on here? => haha I’ve suspected
< 1529960703 836336 :deltab!~deltab@ds6266.dedicated.turbodns.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529960765 554706 :rodgort!~rodgort@68.ip-149-56-14.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529960766 31686 :Deewiant!~deewiant@fr1.ut.deewiant.iki.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529960792 295889 :Deewiant!~deewiant@fr1.ut.deewiant.iki.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529960860 755444 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's probably not even the youngest regular we've had here> hm could I be so bold and to ask who? Really curious
< 1529960990 275119 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :when I was 16…18 I was still very immature (on the internets and in general) in many respects
< 1529960997 705905 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529961053 25935 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew> hungarianity => well coined :D I like it
< 1529961072 687613 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529961125 602067 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :(hm what if I am Geri Dawn actually. I was suspected in living in Hungary here once by wob_jonas AFAIR)
< 1529961359 193837 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523> a world where it's possible to determine what a computer does purely from its shape => why, it’s simple. Tetrahedtal ones cause fires, cuboidal cause eathquakes, octahedral cause floods, dodecahedral cause storms, and icosahedral ones, finally, cause complete cosmic annihilation via a too-near gamma burst. Forgot to add, in that world computers are actually a race of evil jinns.
< 1529961476 184245 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh I’ve completely missed all the fun(
< 1529961771 147302 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529961893 906658 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529961903 770437 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I was thinking more along the lines of an esolang where the shape of the program is the only determinant of what it does
< 1529961932 847062 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ideally something that didn't just have a list of cases for different shapes of edges
< 1529961972 307609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, actually is "shine a laser into a box full of mirrors" TC if the mirrors can be at arbitrary rational angles and finitely long? it wouldn't surprise me if it were
< 1529961981 245554 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it almost certainly is if you allow curves rather than just line segments
< 1529962012 231301 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is like https://esolangs.org/wiki/Trajedy, but even simpler in a way…
< 1529962124 739508 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529962131 193182 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…actually, if you allow arcs in addition to line segments, I think it's more likely that the resulting language is uncomputable than that it's sub-TC!
> 1529962489 415907 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Conedy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56117&oldid=52143 5* 03Ais523 5* (+30) 10/* Semantics */ clarify
< 1529962709 130483 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :…hmm, I wonder if Conedy is actually a PDA?
< 1529962777 506295 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's clearly /at least/ a PDA because if all your calculations use the same base you can effectively add and remove digits from the most significant end of the IP
< 1529962795 121087 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the question is as to whether you get more power by mixing bases
< 1529962894 67112 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: interesting! Could it be in some many-dimensional space?
< 1529962933 321792 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking 2D here; 3D is going to be enough to make it TC because you effectively have two stacks rather than one
< 1529963438 754592 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1529963461 995325 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51a46c74.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529963835 287774 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529963991 277949 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529964121 685008 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :that comment was actually about the general idea of only shape determining what program does
< 1529964355 83400 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be about homology groups of that shape, hm
< 1529964368 202970 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I don’t know a bit about them
< 1529965760 357103 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529965916 864688 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529967782 781817 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529967891 278353 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529968750 486404 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529968824 38556 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529968967 976509 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1529969598 46992 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529969707 785364 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xogodpnpirudcslb QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529969790 9590 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529970989 197142 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :do we have a coin flip bot?
< 1529971449 707726 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529971538 790045 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529971614 964791 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529971731 279658 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529972005 968279 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not as far as I recall, but it would be trivial to add one on HackEso. It has an 8-ball, which is slightly similar except more nuanced.
< 1529972017 270779 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`8ball Is that right? 
< 1529972017 934997 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Outlook good.
< 1529973462 81363 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529973638 823351 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529973897 602987 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :`8ball should I use a linked list for string replacement operations?
< 1529973898 209022 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cannot predict now.
< 1529974044 491536 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529974166 424089 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bool Do we have a coin flip bot that fizzie inexplicably has forgot?
< 1529974179 467207 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently not.
< 1529974181 59706 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :^bool
< 1529974181 150280 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :No.
< 1529974271 257280 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :1d2
< 1529974271 314051 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: 2
< 1529974287 764477 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :1d2 --does it allow comments?
< 1529974287 781043 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: 2
< 1529974482 89207 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :...I inexplicably forgot ^bool.
< 1529974498 961411 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did think there was something I used ? for.
< 1529974520 668903 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^8ball Does this have a deterministic answer?
< 1529974520 983247 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes.
< 1529974525 48573 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also that.
< 1529974785 157021 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :@dice 1d2-1
< 1529974785 213926 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: 2 - 1 => 1
< 1529974788 503994 :jpolak!~jpolak@CPE84948cd6cd03-CM84948cd6cd00.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529974789 768986 :jpolak!~jpolak@CPE84948cd6cd03-CM84948cd6cd00.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Client Quit
< 1529974806 62661 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :@dice 2d3 - 3d2
< 1529974806 82243 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: (2+2) - (1+1+2) => 0
< 1529975349 425494 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zqlphxokvgynbfxy JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529975420 830592 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529975597 310197 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
> 1529976022 124650 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56118&oldid=54284 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1016) 10/* Optimizing implementations */
> 1529976095 55851 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56119&oldid=56118 5* 03Asdf 5* (+81) 10/* Optimizing implementations */
> 1529976139 26497 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56120&oldid=56119 5* 03Asdf 5* (-1097) 10/* Optimizing implementations */
> 1529976164 825894 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56121&oldid=56120 5* 03Asdf 5* (+1097) 10/* Normal implementations */
< 1529976304 893416 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's at it again.
< 1529976409 190349 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :he posted the entire source of his optimizing brainfuck interpreter. which is not an optimizing interpreter.
< 1529976444 398341 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :then reposted it under normal.
< 1529976488 650549 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :which unless I'm crazy doesn't work, because `]` matches the nearest `[` and not the matching `[`.
< 1529977304 122769 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529977496 10034 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529977762 358451 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : ...that "INTERCALL" page is just a copy of the contents of the INTERCAL page, except without the "See also" section. <-- i was planning to just delete it like i've done with other similar ones recently.
< 1529977785 809944 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was just waiting to see if they were going to edit it into something more sensible in a reasonable time.
< 1529977840 411239 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: has e been annoying enough to ban permanently yet? i'm afraid to look.
< 1529977862 969078 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :(btw it's almost certainly the same person with different nicks.)
< 1529977902 933423 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the last edits he made are hilarious. he just dumped a source snippet of his half-assed attempt at a brainfuck interpreter on the implementations page.
< 1529977909 93972 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :not a link. the whole program.
< 1529978132 552924 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is still afraid to look. also forgetting to eat.

< 1529978168 703944 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :`Since he did it all by himself, he had to paste it here:`
< 1529978169 358030 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​/srv/hackeso-code/multibot_cmds/lib/limits: line 5: exec: Since: not found
< 1529978402 965342 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1529978524 428701 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh thank god ais523 put down a foot
< 1529978538 237703 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, eating
< 1529978760 685970 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, my GPU faults when setting my secondary off.. that's.. reassuring.
< 1529979198 14986 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529979221 253443 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529979396 296884 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1529979461 359169 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529980613 401072 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : http://gerigeri.uw.hu/DawnOS/img/eszme.png <-- . o O ( Is that a Hungarian Esme? )
< 1529980737 202792 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1529980786 238108 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : are asdf and Iamcalledbob the same person, do you think? <-- e's doing some of the exact same kinds of edits.
< 1529981118 218594 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529981340 324099 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1529982647 318911 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56122&oldid=56121 5* 03Oerjan 5* (-1097) 10Remove improper implementation. Even if it worked properly, it shouldn't be pasted directly here.
< 1529983051 285140 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529983202 15553 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1529984076 947388 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56123&oldid=56112 5* 03Asdf 5* (+228) 10/* Cell Size */
> 1529984157 804004 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56124&oldid=56123 5* 03Asdf 5* (+98) 10/* Move value */
> 1529984231 112852 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56125&oldid=56124 5* 03Asdf 5* (+4052) 10/* Truth-Machine */
> 1529984298 70111 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56126&oldid=56125 5* 03Asdf 5* (-3) 10/* Rot13 */
> 1529984401 479027 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56127&oldid=56126 5* 03Asdf 5* (+90) 10/* Move value */
> 1529984572 777810 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56128&oldid=56127 5* 03Asdf 5* (+148) 10/* Examples */
> 1529984628 535300 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56129&oldid=56128 5* 03Asdf 5* (+64) 10/* Cat */
< 1529984910 2221 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529985110 666763 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529985327 703181 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529985481 37898 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529986853 647188 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529987010 17942 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529988724 695600 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529988920 775800 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1529990057 384841 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: the INTERCALL page wasn't quite a copy, a few extra commands had been added at the end
> 1529990118 911786 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56130&oldid=56129 5* 03Ais523 5* (-4677) 10Reverted edits by [[Special:Contributions/Asdf|Asdf]] ([[User talk:Asdf|talk]]) to last revision by [[User:Ais523|Ais523]]
> 1529990160 711709 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 revision10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10Ais523 changed visibility of 7 revisions on page [[02Brainfuck10]]: content hidden: Copyright violation
< 1529990204 263872 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, I think copying content from Wikipedia more or less immediately after being asked not to copy content from elsewhere is a blockable offence
> 1529990250 224697 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/block14]]4 block10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10blocked [[02User:Asdf10]] with an expiration time of 1 day and 7 hours (account creation disabled): inserting copyright-violating content into pages shortly after being asked not to
< 1529990406 914305 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'll be interesting to see which accounts (if any) get caught in the autoblock
< 1529990453 954967 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's only for new account registrations, isn't it?
< 1529990478 1485 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :e has 5 accounts still...
< 1529990570 521502 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :although Asdf hasn't outright said it's the same person as the others, the behavior is overlapping.
< 1529990632 434642 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529990720 5806 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as far as I know, the autoblock triggers on any attempt to edit the wiki (in a general sense, including account registration) using the IP address of a user who was recently blocked
< 1529990746 274577 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh.
< 1529990754 564995 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the main thing that's getting on my nerves is the creation of large numbers of virtually identical pages
< 1529990765 724138 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that and ignoring the warning about copyright violation
< 1529990775 25057 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the pages could really do with merging
< 1529990790 7196 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1529990796 216610 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm too tired to do that right now though
< 1529990800 842179 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've deleted some of them, where e didn't bother to edit out the name of the original properly.
< 1529990830 982251 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :*even bother
< 1529990929 940152 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zqlphxokvgynbfxy QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1529991035 547713 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1529991408 999077 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1529992442 812243 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1529992509 635271 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529992711 513014 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1529994408 237879 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529994611 773762 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1529996270 777894 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529996481 280261 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1529998077 862059 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1529998173 61164 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1529998355 697996 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530000047 756605 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530000226 10324 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530001223 622300 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530001688 909615 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530001696 577779 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha, hi!
< 1530001704 629343 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was here before
< 1530001851 677427 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i've got some things to say,
< 1530001855 721697 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :big surprise there
< 1530001924 97031 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530002144 20411 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530002242 795335 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew_: this channel is slow but people will generally pick up what you say any time of the day... so you can usually just say what you have to say rather than announcing the fact
< 1530002595 246438 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay.
< 1530002608 473085 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :has anybody made an os using thue
< 1530002618 509402 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and just thue
< 1530002736 829524 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it even possible
< 1530002855 205619 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you probably need better I/O capabilities (probably the purest approach is to define a protocol on top of the string-based I/O that is already there)
< 1530002881 973511 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be cool.
< 1530002884 984968 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to see thue os
< 1530002962 639301 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainf@@k os is obviously hard to make.
< 1530003002 786150 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you'll run into severe performance problems on the way... afaiui, Thue incurs at least a quadratic slowdown for random access memory, which you need (I think) for any realistic OS, because you'll probably want to have a C compiler.
< 1530003064 914388 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thue isn't really easier than Brainfuck.
< 1530003079 900745 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's the easiest esolang you know?
< 1530003099 592441 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't a joke like hello
< 1530003111 226507 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[all you can do in hello is say hello world]
< 1530003111 667051 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hah... so many answers.
< 1530003119 770528 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of 'em?
< 1530003135 59187 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Befunge is probably a realistic answer.
< 1530003147 282982 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :befunge os
< 1530003156 605240 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm thinking about that
< 1530003268 237043 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :INTERCAL has arrays, so that makes it kind of easy; Binary lambda calculus is easy if you compile from a minimalistic functional programming language (the translation is rather direct but I wouldn't want to do it by hand)
< 1530003410 827390 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ya, INTERCAL's arrays are the stuff of inception.
< 1530003426 156681 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mostly I don't think there is much point. Write a C compiler, don't bother with the OS.
< 1530003438 278435 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, just do that
< 1530003442 296094 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would love an efghij os
< 1530003513 62069 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's call that os "object os"
< 1530003518 894733 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And even writing a C compiler is more tedious than fun... so usually people stop when they have an interpreter for anything Turing-Complete. Welcome to theoretical computer science ;-) )
< 1530003559 743490 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the topic: does anybody have an idea for a master thesis on computational modells?
< 1530003637 725186 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how much would efghij os cost.
< 1530003645 282931 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, how much would all the items cost
< 1530003678 728499 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :to express the os
< 1530003722 530745 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/File:Efghij_%E2%80%94_BelMandel_function.jpg
< 1530003731 290641 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the factorial in efghij
< 1530003765 587708 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine quantum efghij
< 1530003818 844353 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530004006 19162 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530004219 953401 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[>[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]>[[[[]>>[[]>-.[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[>]]]]]]]]]]]]>[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]>]]]]]]]]>[[]>]]]]]]>]]]]]]]]>-.[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[[]>-.[[[[[>
< 1530004235 206302 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello world in a certain language.
< 1530005340 299816 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530005382 758900 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530005437 680116 :probablymoony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530005468 239835 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530005585 342591 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of you people know things, right?
< 1530005623 41146 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should try to use that to my advantage some time
< 1530005723 820550 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530005740 875040 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yees?
< 1530005782 90960 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: But some of us know negative things
< 1530005801 342543 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I can use that to my advantage also if I plan accordingly
< 1530005901 510237 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know exactly -120 things.
< 1530005921 698946 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530006355 230859 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you people are aweful at giving thesis ideas
< 1530006381 283097 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: honestly I'm not that great at theses
< 1530006384 157076 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how about a thesis in esolangology?
< 1530006423 565338 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(very narrowly avoided failing my masters)
< 1530006548 254328 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :My advice is to get a summer job doing research at your university department, because that aften leads to a thesis topic. (It's what happened to me.)
< 1530006745 230012 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Except "aften" isn't a word.)
< 1530006972 280337 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wanted to do a PhD after my undergrad but I didn't quite manage to get good enough grade to get funding for the offer I had
< 1530007003 228796 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking about getting a second master's degree (my first was intergrated into my undergrad)
< 1530007067 795045 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I can't get a loan from the government here to do it because I've already got a master's degree
< 1530007081 17549 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it'd be easier to do it on the continent
< 1530007164 442005 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :You'd better hurry, then, before they close the ports and stop all flights.
< 1530007206 903593 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have ways and means even in that eventuality
< 1530007253 185045 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see: you own a boat.
< 1530007350 479511 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one guy has 29 degrees.
< 1530007361 328525 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's almost a 12th of a circle
< 1530007374 995570 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean 29 education degrees.
< 1530007397 480582 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's almost a 12th of an education circle
< 1530007407 109873 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :stop that joke.
< 1530007431 590842 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :No
< 1530007444 418696 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :After 360 (education) degrees, are you back where you started from? 
< 1530007475 232408 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes but after so much time at university you'd be so politically radical that you'll have performed an entire revolution
< 1530007686 233671 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the jokes are too much!
< 1530007708 12794 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's a pirate's favorite unit? the kilometarrrrrr
< 1530007746 707000 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm sure Taneb means North America.
< 1530007770 329991 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at what time are you 2nd? at 1 second to midnight
< 1530007782 782085 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Europe is hardly a continent. More of a peninsula.
< 1530007804 699476 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which unit always loses the race?
< 1530007806 869779 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second
< 1530007827 134644 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :was that funny
< 1530007839 923286 :probablymoony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :definitelymoony
< 1530008740 328519 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1530015143 872473 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530015265 508091 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :thue
< 1530016157 784750 :guydreich!choochter@nat/ibm/x-fufgdmzfsboccptr QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530016666 386778 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530018267 377545 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530019778 652866 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530021479 878539 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530021849 886354 :andrew_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530022371 88855 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530022739 898404 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-almabhwixvkodvhm JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530023040 521482 :definitelymoony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moony
< 1530023267 876591 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530023656 218346 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine cheese++ os.
< 1530024102 226045 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made an esolang called cookie
< 1530024231 589037 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Cookie" starts the code
< 1530024237 983505 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"noCookie" ends it
< 1530024286 639359 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"snickerdoodle" prints to console
< 1530024320 608304 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"stroopwafel" is the quotation mark equivalent, used when making strings
< 1530024369 503725 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"cream(operation)" is used for every operation involving a variable.
< 1530024414 612837 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's only a single data type. 
< 1530024428 879842 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the variable can be any ascii character
< 1530024610 60519 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"pinwheel" is repeat, "big chip" is until
< 1530024653 235382 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"candy" is if, "no-bake" is then, "maple" is else
< 1530024780 398348 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"butterscotch" prints out the whole source code of the program to console.
< 1530024827 930607 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"bastenaken" ends a line of code.
< 1530024948 854503 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it good?
< 1530025077 900859 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530025102 255734 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :When the most interesting thing about it is the choice of keywords, and it'd be exactly as interesting with a completely different set of keywords... it's not very interesting
< 1530025167 162193 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, there is a special command which is called "cookieExplosion" that makes the computer print out "I want some cookies" 100 times.
< 1530025171 130609 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not good.
< 1530025309 143252 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can sell the code for cookies
< 1530025416 352093 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, when you type any of those commands they get shortened to the respective cookies.
< 1530025460 414627 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i also made a brainf@@k variant.
< 1530025464 824531 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's called cookief@@K
< 1530025596 471744 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> is replaced with a picture of a macadamia nut cookie
< 1530025598 718173 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : :1:28: error: parse error on input ‘of’
< 1530025612 135053 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :< is replaced with a picture of a pinwheel cookie
< 1530025659 684192 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :+ is replaced with a picture of a double chip cookie.
< 1530025688 127355 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :- is replaced with a picture of a gingerbread man
< 1530025720 990586 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :. is replaced with a picture of a plain cookie
< 1530025780 456220 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :, is replaced with a picture of a peanut butter cookie
< 1530025792 986344 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ is replaced with a picture of a bgi chip cookie
< 1530025794 430785 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: is (replaced with a picture of a bgi chip cookie)
< 1530025801 810506 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yea
< 1530025806 993433 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whatever you are.
< 1530025829 199586 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ +/i.10
< 1530025829 873247 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: 45
< 1530025833 806216 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ] is just an eclipse cookie
< 1530025840 797748 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :++
< 1530025900 897001 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ +/i.3
< 1530025901 634311 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: 3
< 1530025922 783951 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ i.10
< 1530025923 510166 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
< 1530025937 516132 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ i.19
< 1530025938 255979 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18
< 1530025939 848764 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ +/100 20 7
< 1530025940 596647 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: 127
< 1530025952 99644 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ -/100 20 7.7
< 1530025952 856049 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: 87.7
< 1530025959 435813 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the heck is this?
< 1530025961 840977 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :J
< 1530025973 577080 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :j-bot is a bot for running J
< 1530025995 697965 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's j?
< 1530026001 421460 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A programming language
< 1530026005 739157 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eso?
< 1530026010 76195 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esoteric?
< 1530026014 259497 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Technically no
< 1530026021 363914 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although it certainly wouldn't be out of place
< 1530026041 184676 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J_(programming_language)
< 1530026045 6698 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one?
< 1530026050 440327 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes
< 1530026060 162937 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh
< 1530026075 521618 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a C* language
< 1530026373 932801 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530026398 489101 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530026530 942444 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ i can type anything here, like, the j programming language is a complete tool.
< 1530026531 704258 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: |spelling error
< 1530026531 744615 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: |   i can type anything here, like, the j programming language is a complete tool.
< 1530026531 761127 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: |                                                                            ^
< 1530026545 160182 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it said it was a tool.
< 1530026639 86409 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how to make it say hello world?
< 1530026681 494 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :] 'hello world'
< 1530026712 214513 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :] 'J wouldn't be out of place in esolang wiki'
< 1530026742 14535 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can it do 99 bottles of beer?
< 1530026761 673743 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or make quines?
< 1530026776 133715 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but don't in an IRC channel
< 1530026780 509800 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay.
< 1530026805 341421 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can link to a page containing the 99 bottles of beer code in J, link it
< 1530027042 702761 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :] 'J'
< 1530027046 884447 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 'J'
< 1530027047 645648 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: J
< 1530027164 478641 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[ 'I am only an utter tool. A slave to my master engineers.'
< 1530027165 164014 :j-bot!eldis4@firefly.nu PRIVMSG #esoteric :andrew360_: I am only an utter tool. A slave to my master engineers.
< 1530027304 312629 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you guys have any other bots?
< 1530027364 233328 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530027401 769672 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530027452 801878 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are a lot of bots.
< 1530027463 515488 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Less these days than there have been, though.
< 1530027526 987337 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's down to esowiki, fungot, HackEso, j-bot, lambdabot and zemhill, and maybe if you count clog.
< 1530027527 391056 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ( ( can you talk for ten minutes and overall so or else um so we just cancelled it laughter because
< 1530027655 474573 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, are there any other bots that run coding languages
< 1530027673 914679 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Former bots include at least EgoBot, Sparkbot, optbot, oonbotti, metasepia, ruddy, preflex, evalj, idris-bot, passwordBOT, applybot, blsqbot, fnordbot, termbot, otherbot.
< 1530027693 915312 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot is written in Befunge, and can run brainfuck and underload.
< 1530027694 198568 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: i was told to do something to make more patios here in texas
< 1530027698 116368 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :^source
< 1530027698 223005 :fungot!~fungot@momus.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/fis/fungot/blob/master/fungot.b98
< 1530027731 480498 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530027733 849194 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :HackEso is just a general-purpose Linux system, so it can run a bazillion different things. It also contains an instance of EgoBot in it somewhere, which has a bunch of esolang interpreters.
< 1530027738 337107 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530027742 366439 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And lambdabot of course does Haskell.
< 1530027743 903995 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :egobot
< 1530027762 649947 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, if your iq is more than 45 you know that.
< 1530027770 769910 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[aka it's obvious]
< 1530027786 738341 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` ls ibin
< 1530027787 796198 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :1l \ 2l \ adjust \ asm \ axo \ bch \ befunge \ befunge98 \ bf \ bf16 \ bf32 \ bf8 \ bf_txtgen \ boolfuck \ c \ cintercal \ clcintercal \ cxx \ dimensifuck \ forth \ glass \ glypho \ haskell \ help \ java \ k \ kipple \ lambda \ lazyk \ linguine \ lua \ malbolge \ pbrain \ perl \ qbf \ rail \ rhotor \ sadol \ sceql \ sh \ slashes \ trigger \ udage01 \ underload \ unlambda \ whirl
< 1530027793 398670 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`! befunge "olleh">:#,_@
< 1530027794 169949 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello
< 1530027815 203919 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Those are all inherited from EgoBot.)
< 1530027832 11425 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Not all of them necessarily work any more.)
< 1530027838 252163 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Prelude> putStrLn "Hello World"
< 1530027875 84677 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot doesn't evaluate IO things, so the result of that is slightly boring.
< 1530027875 101176 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric : public class HelloWorld {      public static void main(String[] args) {         // Prints "Hello, World" to the terminal window.         System.out.println("Hello, World");     }  }
< 1530027880 180026 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :> putStrLn "Hello World"
< 1530027882 920193 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1530027910 271507 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can use private messages if you're going to do something particularly noisy.)
< 1530027933 924849 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if i'm doing 99 bottles of beer i can use private messages
< 1530027947 286643 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 100 rows of pascal\s triangle.
< 1530027964 4832 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, though HackEso won't output more than one IRC line anyway.
< 1530027985 577799 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure what the lambdabot limits are.
< 1530028040 353606 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530028097 746530 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530028111 808393 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im on the code golf site.
< 1530028135 724315 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at https://code-golf.io/stats 
< 1530028139 623603 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can see the stats.
< 1530028160 882955 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the distribution of golfers by holes is inversely exponential.
< 1530028171 757613 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the more holes, the less golfers.
< 1530028260 924636 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :35% of golfers are 1-holers [people who have passed 1 hole
< 1530028277 309664 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14% are two-holers
< 1530028296 984576 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :9% are 3-holers
< 1530029029 297603 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it is suddenly all lively and animated here
< 1530029054 707346 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :))
< 1530030820 405137 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1530031772 942285 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530031887 302780 :MDead!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530032030 636172 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530032032 869579 :MDead!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net NICK :MDude
< 1530032706 79067 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530033642 97802 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530033758 134295 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1530033815 310290 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1530034524 675880 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unilot14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56131 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+2366) 10Created page with "'''Unilot''' {{infobox proglang |name=Unilot |paradigms=imperative |author=[[User:Lukalot]], with help from [[User:Lyricly]], [[User:Heavpoot]] and [[User:Galaxtone]] |year=..."
< 1530034573 252287 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530034631 778009 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:a1a2:24b:ff5f:7b5b QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530035422 367703 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:995f:fb71:f116:cbfa:741a:7f6b JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530035540 381860 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530035756 733591 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1530036353 995793 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56132&oldid=55815 5* 03ZM 5* (+409) 10Infobox added
< 1530036443 416473 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm is there an eso that is de jure (that is, by “official” description) non-TC, but de facto it is TC, if one uses quirks that are not immediately obvious and are unusual and cryptic side effects of constructions of the language in some non-typical environment
> 1530036518 600733 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56133&oldid=56132 5* 03ZM 5* (-1319) 10/* Implementation */
< 1530036529 936645 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :e. g. if dividing by zero, or popping from an empty stack, or adding a number that is Gregorian leap year number, there could be some actions performed
< 1530036549 443751 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530036628 873808 :ZM!5ce3544a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.92.227.84.74 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530036631 496415 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :in some Soviet programmable handheld calculators there were official and unofficial quircks that could be used to do something which is impossible without them, or which is simply handy, this is the inspiration for the previous
< 1530036693 550739 :ZM!5ce3544a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.92.227.84.74 QUIT :Client Quit
> 1530036754 860560 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56134&oldid=56133 5* 03ZM 5* (+0) 10Reordering categories
< 1530036787 879287 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course official ones were sensible e. g. value in one of registers was decremented when performing jump-if-equal or something, and this register thus was useful as a loop counter
< 1530036816 332683 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suggest something less logical
< 1530036822 879658 :ZM!5ce3544a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.92.227.84.74 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530037008 310393 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :for an actual idea, we could perform indirect access and disallow it in “normal usage” constructs, say, no arrays/lists, no unbounded integers
< 1530037131 970472 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :wait, no unbounded memorry addressable still. Hm, then maybe “secret” cons-cells
< 1530037596 873454 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530037606 449721 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530037740 352359 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530037900 4526 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530038353 545315 :ZM!5ce3544a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.92.227.84.74 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1530038899 187392 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530038944 132058 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there any computational paradigms that are more elegant and simplistic than string rewriting?
< 1530039183 979358 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rewriting the Value 0? 😉
< 1530039199 78974 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :holy fuck these ingertation test has been running for 24 hours... aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
< 1530039224 311980 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: neural networks?
< 1530039234 340651 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: I have my doubts on that.
< 1530039253 736166 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :APic: wut?
< 1530039255 19916 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neural Networks are neither elegant nor simplistic.
< 1530039281 663065 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: Instead of having a String of n Characters You just have a String of 0 or 00 or 000 and so on 😉
< 1530039292 667326 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was rather meant as a Joke, sorry
< 1530039297 441439 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh lmao.
< 1530039300 429982 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a programming language for ducks
< 1530039307 633677 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :knowing esolangs, that could be the name of a language...
< 1530039312 482119 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quack! quack.
< 1530039316 140748 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :*quack*
< 1530039317 953314 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quaaack!
< 1530039320 796578 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :quark
< 1530039322 763480 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quack quack quack!
< 1530039329 875758 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :quack, quack quack?
< 1530039358 855779 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or brainquack
< 1530039364 498637 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOOOOO
< 1530039376 494644 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a whole lot of quacks
< 1530039377 848116 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :test failed, \oren\?
< 1530039384 57086 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's brainf@@k for ducks
< 1530039407 926468 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: no, i just looked at the log files, and realized it isn't even 1/8th finished
< 1530039436 919729 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh shit.
< 1530039450 715526 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :which implies that I need to change the schedule from weekly to monthly
< 1530039466 393916 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :glacial runtimes, huh.
< 1530039487 440454 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :or demand a new server,on the basis that this is cruel and unusual
< 1530039518 278894 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530039527 229399 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: problem is that this server has a shitty graphics card
< 1530039544 746704 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :meaning that it sucks at neural networks
< 1530039584 65518 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :treat yoself with a tesla cluster boi.
< 1530039584 819434 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :also these test sets are too big and keep getting bigger
< 1530039625 799557 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun fact: our brains are technically neural networks/
< 1530039678 9201 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530039709 537952 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :believe me?
< 1530039831 268957 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530041050 157685 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i made a brainf@@k variant called coolf@@k
< 1530041064 864661 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only has <, >, + and -
< 1530041085 301171 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :< is "ooh look at me moving this pointy thing right, yeah dude!"
< 1530041105 10436 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you actually understand brainfuck.
< 1530041118 787240 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's true, all i do is make variants.
< 1530041127 563728 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's complex for sure
< 1530041145 640256 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are trivial variants
< 1530041258 618712 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :after all, i'm underage.
< 1530041386 873991 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530041567 677723 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530041929 38395 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530042399 45832 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :[Moony]
< 1530042744 404740 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530043115 657926 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :performing string rewriting cleanly is an interesting problem. it presents some interesting choices. fixed or resizable strings? if resizable, what's your replacement/resizing strategy? are you going to allocate a new string every time you perform a rewrite (unless the pattern results in a shorter string)? or are you going to implement a linked list for characters and do trivial inserts/deletions?
< 1530043162 758729 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking at building one in C, and I'm warming up to the linked list approach.
< 1530043260 149414 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that plus a rolling queue rewrite strategy.
< 1530043458 906543 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: are there any computational paradigms that are more elegant and simplistic than string rewriting? => term/tree rewtiting? It’s still elegant, but of course less simplistic
< 1530043500 228718 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :definitely less simplistic. representation of terms/trees gets weird because there are so many different ways.
< 1530043567 848336 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus the pattern matching traditionally implies not rewriting just the terms, but the associated list of variable bindings as well.
< 1530043627 200091 :[Moony]!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf NICK :moony
< 1530043631 258966 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530043822 15531 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530043832 891597 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :olling queue rewrite strategy => oh, could I read about it somewhere?
< 1530043885 278880 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :rolling*
< 1530043898 570402 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty much just rewriting on a circular string. at a given "step", you run through your rule list to see if the lhs of any rule matches the head of the queue.
< 1530043921 514899 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it does, remove the lhs from the queue, and enqueue the rhs of the rule.
< 1530043930 99817 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if it doesn't, requeue one symbol.
< 1530043965 326887 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's essentially circular string rewriting, but my initial guess is that it's a little better than "scan forward, replace, start over", because patterns might exist past the matched one, and you'll get more done in a shorter time.
< 1530044021 964650 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it also means that you don't need to generate a secondary string, you can just resize your queue.
< 1530044041 141052 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'll probably draw something like it up in python later today.
< 1530044407 186261 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :a caveat is that, if you're going to do it like this, you need to keep track of the length. if the number of failed rule applications matches the number of symbols in the queue, no rule has matched, so you can terminate.
< 1530044509 820864 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you don't do this, you'll keep cycling through the queue endlessly because a failure to match just means "move on to the next symbol".
< 1530044704 680538 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you talkin' about?
< 1530044721 802794 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :strategies for interpreting string rewriting languages.
< 1530044779 317812 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like brainf@@k?
< 1530044787 35132 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :...no.
< 1530044820 956180 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like what language exactly?
< 1530044828 829411 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :like thue.
< 1530044831 697904 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1530044854 997526 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language where if i do 10:=10x a joke gets old
< 1530045501 806244 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: thanks, interesting approach!
< 1530045543 158699 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :np!
< 1530045592 260756 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530045682 82727 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :somebody should make a language where the tape can be twisted, ripped and mroe
< 1530045684 721746 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more*
< 1530045771 878876 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine a command that is "twist.Tape
< 1530045777 706119 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530045779 467594 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"twist.Tape"
< 1530045779 698283 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530045839 518987 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that'd be funnt
< 1530045842 807285 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :funny*
< 1530046181 708007 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I provide extensions in my interpreter for things like built-in rules that provide network functionality, disk I/O, etc., I'm planning on writing a MUD.
< 1530046212 117923 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :whassat?
< 1530046223 733102 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :google it. :P
< 1530046244 506908 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MUD
< 1530046287 342094 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cool
< 1530046295 944343 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're planning on making a game
< 1530046304 913953 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :let's call it esoGame
< 1530046526 326985 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :[because the idea for it was born in this chat]
< 1530046629 131371 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im making up languages.
< 1530047378 427713 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530047571 814852 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530047751 274911 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530047853 682424 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530048087 188653 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530048216 339241 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :handling raw text input in a string rewriting language wouldn't be that bad. you'd just need to translate each character into its equivalent hexadecimal, binary, or other desired base representation.
< 1530048476 18826 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my thoughts is that you could have delimited sections of a string signify the rewrite space of a certain ruleset.
< 1530048564 252786 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :each section would comprise of two parts: an input queue, and the string that ruleset rewrites.
< 1530048610 653790 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :handling such that a ruleset applies to only part of a string is tricky. you either need to use prefixed symbols (so something like `aaaa` turns into `aaaa`...
< 1530048631 47899 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you need to explicitly specify your rules only apply around prefixed cursors.
< 1530048674 494035 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the "blueprint" for a given ruleset in the string could look like []{}.
< 1530048741 309981 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :communication occurs via special patterns. if you want to communicate a symbol to the outside world, you place a marker next to it and wait for the courier to come pick it up and place it in everybody else's input queue, where it can be requested by placing another special marker.
< 1530048786 789685 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :building an expressive language on top of this means providing built-ins for handling signals from the ruleset to the outer interpreter. I can simulate something like an arithmetic logic unit that takes hexadecimal, binary, etc. from a ruleset and performs arithmetic and logical operations on it.
< 1530048880 476710 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's all still just a sketch...
< 1530049085 828633 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're making ideas for a new language, arent'cha
< 1530049096 623520 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :aren'tcha*
< 1530049300 708227 :andrew360_!b2de0082@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.222.0.130 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1530049312 689665 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :am I wrong thinking he's in the worng place? :\
< 1530049527 322405 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530049721 317799 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530050205 303626 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530050271 373665 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`smlist 469
< 1530050272 103816 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :smlist 469: shachaf monqy elliott mnoqy Cale
< 1530050321 309341 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-almabhwixvkodvhm QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1530050463 102999 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: you don’t. He’s quite hyperactive-ish(
< 1530050700 271686 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember when I was 10 and on IRC. I had some of the same quirks. :P
< 1530050880 476630 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530051101 136672 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloochaf. what's the smlist again for?
< 1530051111 436906 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome Naergon
< 1530051112 855261 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :​13Naergon: 04Welcome 07to 08the 09international 02hub 06for 13esoteric 04programming 07language 08design 09and 02deployment! 06For 13more 04information, 07check 08out 09our 02wiki: 06. 13(For 04the 07other 08kind 09of 02esoterica, 06try 13#esoteric 04on 07EFnet 08or 09DALnet.)
< 1530051182 410030 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1530051299 259810 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? smlist
< 1530051300 385076 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-update notification for the webcomic Super Mega.
< 1530051324 968277 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530051332 576599 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530051381 860033 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: ah when I was 10 I had no computer and didn’t think of internet altogether :D and I missed all the early-internet fun(
< 1530051422 30218 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530051444 658272 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530051496 874533 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: ty.
< 1530051606 63668 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530051652 488454 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :GHAGH! new tvtropes design!
< 1530051709 906682 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: it was a wild time. ;)
< 1530051869 920726 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hope so!
< 1530052478 720345 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :on another topic: I'm looking to build an expandable home storage array, and am looking to get into tape. anybody have any experience in this?
< 1530052529 748689 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's going to be largely offline storage.
< 1530053251 784537 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm also starting to consider optical media.
< 1530053470 317362 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :All I know about tapes is that I believe LTO won, though DAT/DDS struggled on for quite a while. No hands-on experience with any of this from the last two decades.
< 1530053494 231171 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530053549 219155 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :duly noted. just from the availability standpoint of an LTO drive, I might just go with optical.
< 1530053582 124973 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a bunch of old 250GB, 500GB, 1TB, and 2TB harddrives I'd like to fully image and archive. 
< 1530053631 267592 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530054166 14350 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-002-203-094-153.002.203.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530054207 710022 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530054931 653974 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530055510 539832 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530055666 291521 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530056296 695298 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-146-060-044-180.146.060.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530056376 483270 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530056403 737258 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530057510 504441 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530057665 331045 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530058572 463344 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cpdvbtpygepxuhdm JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530058579 491113 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530058734 33150 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530058764 360258 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530058903 177215 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530058911 880114 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530059276 985515 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530059472 622104 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( andrew doesn't like puns? he's doomed in this channel... )
< 1530059483 775679 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530059631 297643 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530059703 900515 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :he's either doomed, or sane.
< 1530060097 478481 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds
< 1530061404 368021 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530061574 25007 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530061917 679515 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530062083 584956 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :helloily. wait, you don't like puns?
< 1530063303 377463 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530063405 190980 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> error "test" `seq` print "hello"
< 1530063407 55045 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 
< 1530063464 282890 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :> error "test" `seq` ()
< 1530063466 10890 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : *Exception: test
< 1530063494 788242 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530063668 408869 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :bonsøœirjan. I suffer them like a hot chili.
< 1530064370 453255 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: NUTRIMENT CHICKEN
< 1530065385 145037 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530065541 280700 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530065765 873630 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530065894 952757 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo!
< 1530065908 488578 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't think this counts as a discrete language, really, but
< 1530065909 798355 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://github.com/nfd9001/LiterallyRunYourCode
< 1530065958 845045 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :location-based BF machine. walk into geofences to input characters, then one step of the program is run every 20 or so meters you walk
< 1530065962 179100 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or run
< 1530066050 182038 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just saw the kinect brainfuck thing and thought "hey i can make this, but worse"
< 1530066058 902466 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a kinect brainfuck thing?
< 1530066069 859404 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, think it was called bodyfuck?
< 1530066073 231014 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wow.
< 1530066083 103067 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :programming through interpretive dance?
< 1530066086 890351 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly
< 1530066143 885876 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also part of this was an excuse to put "fuck" several times on a poster that would end up on the wall at my uni
< 1530066148 586463 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and get away scott free
< 1530066176 745036 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@2601:602:8500:d0d1:88e6:16b6:16a6:4b72 PRIVMSG #esoteric :afaik it's still hanging there
< 1530066814 389164 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1530075059 314143 :Hoolootwo!Hooloovoo@hooloovoo.blue NICK :Hooloovo0
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< 1530076000 19833 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody know of any _practical_ languages based on string rewriting? the only thing I'm aware of is metamath.
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< 1530080265 35184 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
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< 1530085393 292480 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530085426 652064 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1530086814 998603 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071argasm14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56135 5* 03Zero 5* (+997) 10a 1 argument assembly
> 1530086873 209273 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071argasm14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56136&oldid=56135 5* 03Zero 5* (+18) 10
> 1530087000 15225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56137&oldid=55974 5* 03Zero 5* (+14) 10
< 1530087383 57089 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530087734 927501 :PinealGlandOptic!~PinealGla@82.144.205.57 QUIT :Quit: leaving
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< 1530091463 524796 :andrew360_!6d5da350@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.93.163.80 PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine an efghij os
< 1530093230 297168 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530094200 445212 :andrew360_!6d5da350@gateway/web/freenode/ip.109.93.163.80 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1530094699 760442 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf were the mercurial authors thinking when they implemented the default behavior of 'hg add'?
< 1530094898 181482 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and is there a better way to undo that command than the overapproximation  hg forget "set:added()"?
< 1530095101 447721 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :For those who don't know, 'hg add' adds all untracked files that are not ignored. I'm hard pressed to imagine that this is ever a useful behavior for nontrivial repos.
< 1530095127 957672 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the behavior is not even scoped by the current working directory)
< 1530095137 523598 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530101048 32509 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530102212 915462 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I was hoping for shachaf to come to mercurial's defense ;-) )
< 1530102738 19163 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530106970 502145 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1530115936 885054 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1530116336 590022 :ATMunn!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1530116461 254510 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: But I've hardly used mercurial
< 1530116600 222766 :moony!moony@unaffiliated/moonythedwarf PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is finally managing to understand haskell

< 1530116737 793635 :andrew_!5d56fac9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.86.250.201 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i dont understand brainf@@K
< 1530116972 651895 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is brainf@@k the same thing as brainfuck
< 1530117004 533786 :andrew_!5d56fac9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.86.250.201 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1530117007 303918 :andrew_!5d56fac9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.86.250.201 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i just censored it
< 1530117050 707071 :andrew_!5d56fac9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.86.250.201 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
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< 1530120509 475979 :ATMunn_!ATMunn@unaffiliated/atmunn NICK :ATMunn
< 1530120771 862371 :imode-desktop!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530120794 711645 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530124759 239330 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :solutions for symbol conflicts in systems with multiple sets of conflicting rewrite rules: 1. prefix every symbol with a unique ID indicating which ruleset the symbol belongs to, or 2. use a cursor/head-based approach.
< 1530124870 6553 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530125013 204078 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first approach bloats the string and the rules. the second requires a semi-nontrivial rewrite of all the rules.
< 1530125056 911142 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second still requires a prefix, but only on the cursors.
< 1530125176 585098 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first is attractive despite the bloat, but I have a feeling a relatively smart compiler can make a reasonable choice between conflict resolution strategies.
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< 1530125864 167652 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1530129226 695956 :GautamS!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-swtznjjiozxicvvg NICK :S_Gautam
< 1530129858 696410 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it works!
< 1530129922 973067 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/Rl2J/text the input, and... https://ptpb.pw/vI5w/text the resulting ruleset.
< 1530129967 487530 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :still working on how I'm going to signify how I want the initial string symbols represented. manually inserting prefixes sucks.
< 1530129979 821136 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kvazyprlygqgxcio QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1530130069 270349 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe an alternate separator. something like ;;=;; to signify the split between rules and the set of initial input strings.
< 1530130316 490106 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the next step would probably be to generate rules for random walks when symbols from other rulesets conflict.
< 1530130367 413877 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e if I see a symbol from ruleset 0 in the middle of ruleset 1, I'd like for it to perform a random walk, left or right, until it can be assimilated by its appropriate ruleset.
< 1530131949 277962 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530136710 13282 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1530137649 350464 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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< 1530138464 402571 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :something in me says I should stop messing with this and go make my own model of computation.
< 1530138535 202294 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :but really, what's out there that isn't just a derivative of what's already been discovered?
< 1530138834 133582 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have things based on linear sequences of characters in multiple dimensions, we have things based on multiple stacks of single symbols (counter machines), we have random access variants of all of that..
< 1530138870 15615 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530138881 238423 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :we have variations based on rewriting, along with different structures we do rewrites over.
< 1530139015 466263 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's left?
< 1530139067 685041 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530139099 40724 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas NICK :Remavas
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< 1530140152 153426 :clog!~nef@bespin.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530141236 24988 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1530143932 209644 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if there's any interesting languages that could be constructed with atomic reads/writes from a pool of tuples
< 1530144015 838465 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could do it by specifying machines that get exactly one tuple from the bag (removing it) and adding exactly one afterwards
< 1530144126 556669 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the machines are at least as powerful as lambda expressions, the result should be turing complete
< 1530144279 798376 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :input would then simply be adding tuples to the pool--whether that's at the beginning or at runtime doesn't matter
< 1530144303 772186 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and committing one specific value to the pool (eg. the empty tuple?) kills all the machines
< 1530144404 465837 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :nfd: linda?
< 1530144422 27017 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, like linda
< 1530144455 225250 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trick is that you only get extremely simple machines
< 1530144458 995330 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've experimented with tuple-based rewriting. I got as far as implementing arithmetic before stopping. I used pattern matching and variable binding.
< 1530144518 557668 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, cool
< 1530144555 346946 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :code was specified as tuples as well.
< 1530144568 685424 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you had this one amorphous bag that could be distributed amongst machines.
< 1530144580 117546 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what were your limits on variable binding? i'm imagining something like this
< 1530144601 599215 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :("val" a b c d) -> ("out" a b c "5")
< 1530144625 977882 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think with a linda-like bag that this is probably turing complete
< 1530144631 191993 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh it is.
< 1530144645 732659 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. it sounds like a super easy proof
< 1530144648 14439 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ptpb.pw/urGZ/python so here's where.. I left off.
< 1530144652 177987 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i'm not gonna claim it is until i do it
< 1530144663 902312 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :line 301 is where the code starts.
< 1530144680 834127 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the language I was implementing was assembly-like in nature.
< 1530144707 632724 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :each "line" had the ability to reference other lines and contain the result of its executed command.
< 1530144714 58084 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sweet!
< 1530144746 29140 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you could translate things like "Foo X Bar" to `match` commands by saying "okay, I need a tuple with Foo in the first place and Bar in the third place.`
< 1530144821 859567 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the resulting tuple would be dragged from storage, stored as a match, and then you could fetch another tuple like `Bar X Baz`, using the previous result's second column as a constraint (because they use the same variables in the "macro language").
< 1530144825 755696 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :gonna have to give this a close read
< 1530144850 829733 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's pretty weird and I have about 30 revisions of it going back to february of last year.
< 1530144874 172650 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously not completed and it looks friggin' terrible.
< 1530144922 160368 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm thinking about doing a super-minimal version of this for kicks, now
< 1530144960 595046 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess i just specified the entire syntax in that one message up there
< 1530144961 944793 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :try it! the concept is pretty minimal as-is: match and assert are the only required commands for pattern matching and assertions.
< 1530144995 57523 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :match queries the tuple store and grabs things from it in a constrained manner, assert either adds or removes tuples.
< 1530145021 507816 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :just have to decide if i wanna do it in racket (for its dsl features) or haskell
< 1530145022 101339 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it'd be trivial to construct things like addition, trees, lists and arrays...
< 1530145038 195919 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither of which i know super well
< 1530145057 362640 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i guess my favorite way to learn a language is to use it to write a language
< 1530145060 82571 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :do it in a language you know well _first_. :P
< 1530145078 311059 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :then port it.
< 1530145116 188416 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably not a bad idea, haha
< 1530145138 873735 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do know a bit of scheme and a bit of haskell. not like i'm operating totally blind here
< 1530145160 194848 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :thing is, tuplespace stuff like this is really powerful as a paradigm. you could compile a prolog-like language (like what I was attempting) down to it.
< 1530145172 906303 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :nfd: are you nvd's evil twin twh
< 1530145186 741629 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :then turing completeness is as trivial as implementing a TM.
< 1530145222 139490 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: haha, you tell me. afraid i don't know them
< 1530145225 402688 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm new to this chan
< 1530145238 841170 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really new to esolangs
< 1530145306 368868 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530145426 764434 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :damnit nfd, you have me looking through my old code again.
< 1530145457 866238 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? nvd
< 1530145459 68550 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :nvd is what Taneb calls himself when he wants to feel professional.
< 1530145514 224972 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530145573 246244 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530145729 699442 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hrm
< 1530145756 861220 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, say each machine fetches one tuple
< 1530145832 844814 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :would it be more fun to make each machine output exactly one tuple or zero, one, or two tuples
< 1530145869 973741 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if we take option two, we could add output/termination side effects
< 1530145882 889441 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if each machine takes one tuple and puts one tuple, that's not concurrent at all
< 1530145928 621256 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :doesn't need to be actually concurrent to be conceptually threaded
< 1530146019 489781 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if we want to make it actually concurrent, all we need to do is spawn one thread per machine
< 1530146030 154565 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the tuple bag does its job, we get semaphores for free
< 1530146181 102010 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so wait am I getting this right, there's only a finite number of processes?
< 1530146678 797331 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. at most one process/thread per machine. each () -> () statement completely specifies one discrete machine
< 1530146714 168197 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :might be worth implementing this in C and pthreads first, actually
< 1530146810 453052 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you want multiple hardware threads working on one task at the same time, you just specify the same machine twice
< 1530146894 345380 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which, frankly, would be a bizarre choice unless you have well-optimized matching)
< 1530147087 132120 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hah, i should write a specification for this before i get implementing
< 1530147087 189833 :clog!~nef@bespin.org JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530147857 132705 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :tuple rewriting without variable binding is an interesting concept.
< 1530147878 910948 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how would that work?
< 1530147897 529263 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :same way that string rewriting would.
< 1530147908 149170 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :only with disjoint segments of a larger string.
< 1530148087 563789 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :my question I posed earlier still stands, though. all of this is just a variant of rewriting. it's either rewriting or automata. I've yet to see a truly unique form of computation.
< 1530148157 480952 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :erlang's concurrency model is the most unique one I know of
< 1530148186 880274 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the actor model? I have seen absolutely no formal treatment of it.
< 1530148222 679294 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just seen vagueness. abstract descriptions. no concrete model to speak of. I tried reading the original (now very scarred and scratched) paper to no avail.
< 1530148235 164015 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh formalism
< 1530148238 168913 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :can't help you there
< 1530148254 394856 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PART #esoteric :"the creeping crawling chaos will return."
< 1530148257 487090 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried pursuing it as an alternative to process calculi, but stopped short because I couldn't find a damn description outside of "there are actors, they communicate via mailboxes."
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< 1530148337 170197 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530148362 336590 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's a bit of NIH. that there's no real other category of computational models.
< 1530148407 677782 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1530148503 366472 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: not concurrent, but here's some food for thought https://suhr.github.io/obsc/
< 1530149171 632249 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530149949 399104 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not really much of a variant, though. stack languages aren't really unique (well, they were for a while...)
< 1530150045 330880 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the notion of multiple types of concatonation as well as a haskell-style type system for one is interesting
< 1530150083 481410 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, but it's just all a variant of rewriting to me. I can't feel impressed by it anymore. :(
< 1530150123 630720 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, any turing complete system can be turned into term rewriting
< 1530150188 463647 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :less term rewriting and more just general rewriting.
< 1530150250 463 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, are there any models of computation that _aren't_ just a variant of a rewriting system, or an automata? even so-called exotic MoCs fall down to rewriting over some kind of structure.
< 1530150315 369715 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :flow based programming?
< 1530150333 835795 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have my doubts but that is one of the more unique ones. dataflow in general is.
< 1530150346 952105 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1530150349 106675 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been working on reducing it to a string rewriting system.
< 1530150357 94706 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you know anything about verilog?
< 1530150358 542913 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :based on signals and channels.
< 1530150365 331588 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, a lot of it. same stuff.
< 1530150368 77844 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Quit: Found 1 in /dev/zero
< 1530150403 591618 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the problem is a paradigm like that can either be taken at face-value or reduced to something in the two categories of rewriting or automata.
< 1530150411 911605 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I get the feeling that if you spend time reducing things to rewrite systems you're gonna start seeing more things as rewrite systems
< 1530150440 680585 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did the same thing with TMs and various other turing-equivalent automata.
< 1530150462 525170 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :most paradigms to me can't stand on their merits enough without referring to something in those two categories.
< 1530150476 208617 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm almost desperate for one that breaks that trend for me.
< 1530150498 709989 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :prolog?
< 1530150512 846810 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :breaks down to term rewriting. weird, I know.
< 1530150525 534495 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh
< 1530150527 210901 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so?
< 1530150543 47669 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything in the language is represented as term trees.
< 1530150553 295447 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can even manipulate rules as first-class citizens.
< 1530150556 873498 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :with some difficulty.
< 1530150573 763093 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it becomes a somewhat unique variant of term rewriting, but still in the category of rewriting.
< 1530150584 340615 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :at that point you've just made an interpreter in a term rewriting language
< 1530150616 376731 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the kind of thing I'm talking about. there's always some kind of easy reduction.
< 1530150659 295452 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're counting interpreting as an easy reduction then every turing complete thing can be reduced to term rewriting
< 1530150703 669333 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :again, not even terms. just abstract rewriting systems. graphs, trees, strings, multisets..
< 1530150722 161004 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the same goes for automata.
< 1530150756 502042 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :the paradigms that I've seen just aren't enough to stand on their own without referring to some aspect of either category.
< 1530150772 480887 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :hence why you'll see every language standard reference some abstract machine (automata) or reduce to a rewrite theory (rewriting, obviously).
< 1530150790 479897 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's almost crying out for a third.
< 1530150795 37904 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :my point is just that if you're looking for something that can't be turned into rewriting somehow all that's left is the stuff above turing complete which you can't really use in the real world
< 1530150847 754422 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, I'm not looking for that. automata and rewriting can be interchanged with some difficulty in either direction. I'm looking for something that stands as some kind of third category to the two already present.
< 1530150906 834724 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :dataflow is a decent candidate. I don't know of any others. I thought various process calculi were the answer, but they just reduce to term rewriting (by some clever conventions).
< 1530150938 24108 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kthzqhipsbxwqdwy QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1530151007 267211 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the game of life would also be a rewrite system but I also know of continuous game of life https://arxiv.org/pdf/1111.1567.pdf
< 1530151012 395920 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :then again, I don't really know many formal treatments for dataflow. I don't know of any real well-defined models of computation.
< 1530151018 577443 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :don't know if it's turing complete though
< 1530151041 255927 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't imagine what the proof would look like. I'd imagine it'd be impressive.
< 1530151195 127578 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it's just a nagging doubt in my head that I'll probably need to silence. that "we can't have all of this figured out yet!"
< 1530151408 768800 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well the only other models I can think of can't be implemented in the real world so that's all I got man
< 1530151437 468416 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't expect an easy out. :P
< 1530151511 445694 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're into parsing at all there's parsing with derivitives
< 1530151557 260704 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw that posted somewhere a while back. I'll probably look into it tonight.
< 1530151766 453925 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh. this only applies to context-free languages?
< 1530151788 443808 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks like it. looks interesting anyway.
< 1530151848 154432 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :are there parsers out there doing context sensitive grammars?
< 1530151927 775994 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are parsers out there doing unrestricted grammars. :P
< 1530151946 38432 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :whether they stop parsing is the real question...
< 1530151960 997903 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :right, right
< 1530151980 432158 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :fun fact: perl's grammar is unrestricted. at least I read that somewhere.
< 1530152003 440861 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty sure C++'s is too
< 1530152013 260941 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah.
< 1530152028 477466 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, templates are turing complete. I guess template evaluation is undecidable?
< 1530152062 341240 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I guess I can throw that under parsing.
< 1530152114 289767 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :see I just find it fun knowing that it's possible to take the taylor series of a grammar
< 1530152162 606320 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow. my interest is piqued.
< 1530152396 549893 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should revisit formal language theory.
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< 1530154505 265954 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operator-precedence_parser#Alternative_methods
< 1530154513 434948 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This FORTRAN I trick for operator precedence is too good.
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< 1530156229 946961 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a beautiful hack.
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> 1530167603 632223 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56146&oldid=56139 5* 03Asdf 5* (+119) 10/* Normal implementations */
> 1530167773 468176 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck implementations14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56147&oldid=56146 5* 03Asdf 5* (+40) 10/* Normal implementations */
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> 1530169079 508921 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56150&oldid=56149 5* 03Asdf 5* (+117) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */
< 1530169633 811940 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh boy.
< 1530170322 283365 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zqpuehxyrrhctakz JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530172094 671064 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56151&oldid=55851 5* 03Asdf 5* (+319) 10/* C */
> 1530172566 600246 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56152&oldid=56151 5* 03Asdf 5* (+383) 10/* C */
> 1530172626 389047 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56153&oldid=56152 5* 03Asdf 5* (+13) 10/* C */
> 1530172779 940295 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56154&oldid=56153 5* 03Asdf 5* (+49) 10/* C */
> 1530172886 486962 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56155&oldid=56154 5* 03Asdf 5* (+54) 10/* C */
< 1530172964 929 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530172996 89572 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530173952 138763 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530174194 459732 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56156&oldid=56150 5* 03Asdf 5* (+59) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */
< 1530175104 557407 :impomatic!~digital_w@host86-191-16-233.range86-191.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530178039 745879 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zqpuehxyrrhctakz QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1530178044 460739 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the trouble is that to put code under CC0 it either has to be public domain (or CC0) or have the right to relicense it (basically, be the author)
< 1530178125 172143 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... how does one prove authorship pseudonymously? :P
< 1530178385 395254 :izabera!~izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :create a fake identity, pretend to be real, publish under that name
< 1530178998 139214 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahhhhhh law
< 1530179002 940575 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :never gets old
< 1530179967 564274 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, I'm now adding an answer to a question by asdf on ais523's talk page... that seems weird :)
> 1530179982 256152 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56157&oldid=56156 5* 03Int-e 5* (+1027) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */
< 1530179990 500520 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I have no better idea.
> 1530180303 880188 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03PlatinumDotEXE 5*  10New user account
< 1530180777 664507 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1530180944 208311 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56158&oldid=56052 5* 03PlatinumDotEXE 5* (+443) 10
> 1530181481 906905 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07OISC14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56159&oldid=55455 5* 03PlatinumDotEXE 5* (+45) 10/* List of OISCs */
> 1530181878 297688 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56160&oldid=56157 5* 03Int-e 5* (+11) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */ typos
< 1530190237 181337 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530190831 586905 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530191268 415882 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07OISC14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56161&oldid=56159 5* 03Impomatic 5* (+87) 10/* List of OISCs */
< 1530192911 873596 :quintopia!~quintopia@unaffiliated/quintopia JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530193080 833588 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530193441 992611 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yraxzhuxoatcirpi JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530193812 949228 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zmacfaobbiacdycl JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530193865 545402 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zmacfaobbiacdycl QUIT :Client Quit
< 1530193883 372768 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tyrwflauhgobqtit JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530194924 196984 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530198959 994541 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tyrwflauhgobqtit QUIT :
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< 1530202609 324219 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530202918 686457 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wpa-4-642.cc.umanitoba.ca QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530204695 8442 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530205210 696690 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wpa-4-642.cc.umanitoba.ca JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530206014 418468 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zcupditftsjnegys JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530206341 150458 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@kite.riseup.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530207037 149996 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@kite.riseup.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1530207219 651774 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56162&oldid=56137 5* 03BoutonIA 5* (+11) 10/* B */ Add BSoD
< 1530207294 182812 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530209674 912551 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530209831 298833 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530210432 292893 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530210488 190672 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530211294 342309 :MDead!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530211330 757700 :ldm!~ldm@unaffiliated/ldm JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530216036 300949 :Naergon!~Naergon@unaffiliated/naergon QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530216103 420868 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530223820 769712 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530224362 144090 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1530229809 46426 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56163&oldid=56160 5* 03Ais523 5* (+326) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */ yes you did
> 1530229939 900666 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07OISC14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56164&oldid=56161 5* 03Ais523 5* (-6) 10/* List of OISCs */ you don't use = together with += or -= in most languages; in this case, though, -- is probably clearer
< 1530230558 696216 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530230567 318234 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
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< 1530231003 954028 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530231227 486494 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving...
< 1530232238 84540 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530234134 320556 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530241627 210066 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530241798 20399 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530241838 131640 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530241918 669629 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530242188 998159 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello
< 1530243491 401665 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1530243518 136031 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530249191 482511 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530250912 168268 :propumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530252134 78407 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1530252281 190281 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07GolfScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56165&oldid=50766 5* 03Asdf 5* (+98) 10/* Examples */
> 1530252726 228584 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56166&oldid=56163 5* 03Asdf 5* (+388) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */
> 1530252917 320306 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56167&oldid=56166 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */
< 1530252950 787362 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530253150 12078 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1530254117 864297 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56168&oldid=56155 5* 03Asdf 5* (+279) 10/* Python 3.x */
> 1530254335 818441 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56169&oldid=56168 5* 03Asdf 5* (+15) 10/* Python 3.x */
< 1530254795 680634 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530254814 227927 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56170&oldid=56130 5* 03Asdf 5* (+408) 10/* Examples */
< 1530254886 485919 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530255041 312532 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
> 1530255440 606072 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56171&oldid=55584 5* 03Saka 5* (+67) 10
< 1530255660 553035 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@199.254.238.207 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
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< 1530256119 61715 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530256722 292639 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530256816 890347 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Asdf14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56172 5* 03Asdf 5* (+147) 10Created page with "{{Stubs}} There is currently no text in this page. You can search for this page title in other pages, search the related logs, or create this page."
> 1530256827 561985 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56173&oldid=56172 5* 03Asdf 5* (-1) 10
> 1530256859 42046 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56174&oldid=56173 5* 03Asdf 5* (-129) 10
< 1530256964 684269 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1530256976 233961 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56175&oldid=56174 5* 03Asdf 5* (-17) 10Blanked the page
> 1530257001 261122 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56176&oldid=56175 5* 03Asdf 5* (+8) 10
> 1530257428 459551 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Tape14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56177&oldid=44855 5* 03Asdf 5* (+9) 10
> 1530257512 685892 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplack14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56178 5* 03Saka 5* (+2304) 10Created page with "'''Simplack''' is a simple, stack-based language created by [[User:Saka]]. Simplack is designed to be easy to learn.  == Basics == In Simplack, only integers can be stored in..."
> 1530257636 803230 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:About14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56179&oldid=53562 5* 03Asdf 5* (+7) 10
> 1530257656 934246 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:About14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56180&oldid=56179 5* 03Asdf 5* (+2) 10
> 1530257736 309885 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56181&oldid=56113 5* 03Asdf 5* (+9) 10
< 1530258596 769043 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530258953 900388 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? heffalump
< 1530258955 30005 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :A heffalump is similar to a lump of sugar, but with honey instead.
< 1530259191 388393 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530259466 372730 :Naergon!~Naergon@94.197.120.59.threembb.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530260747 691264 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530260839 532555 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think you can perform graph rewriting without some kind of variable binding.
< 1530260849 704182 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least, when describing it in text.
< 1530260906 567653 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do think you might be able to specify rules based on rooted trees, and you can generate stuff like cycles in a convoluted way.
< 1530262278 535209 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1530270179 298732 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530270224 395128 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530270982 60117 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530271856 537312 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530272022 64152 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530272587 340345 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530272649 972878 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530273757 665911 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530273821 875564 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530273840 329804 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530273922 154027 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530274137 461952 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mwtpjvchrrdgmtqe JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530275668 652526 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530275830 11860 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530276632 851491 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530277249 860656 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530277553 373131 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530277748 300480 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530278396 710605 :xirg!~xirg@50-243-32-200-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530279079 584141 :xirg!~xirg@50-243-32-200-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :wtf is this widsom pdf.exe
< 1530279415 14490 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530279627 240759 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530279703 431858 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530280251 251335 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zejyrdipiqtyq5.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530280318 183574 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zf26q8wflfvvi0.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530280632 39103 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :xirg: exe?
< 1530280723 703003 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom.pdf is "A COMPENDIUMME OF WISDOMME KNOWLEDGES" - I think that explains all ;-)
< 1530280726 741967 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? wisdom
< 1530280727 746427 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom is always factually accurate, except for this entry, and, uh, that other one? It started with, like, an ø?
< 1530280840 634754 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? brain
< 1530280841 922056 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brains are just receptacles for bricks.
> 1530281094 303084 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56182&oldid=56171 5* 03Saka 5* (+15) 10
< 1530281312 698338 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530281345 621106 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? exe
< 1530281346 848913 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esoteric :exe? ¯\(°​_o)/¯
< 1530281495 833862 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
> 1530281832 767469 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56183&oldid=56178 5* 03Saka 5* (+1947) 10/* Python */
> 1530281891 766239 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56184&oldid=56183 5* 03Saka 5* (+73) 10/* Python */
< 1530282338 887089 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :@google owth
< 1530282339 578947 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/owth?lang=en
> 1530283135 102817 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071argasm14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56185&oldid=56136 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+226) 10/* main vocabulary */
< 1530283196 905865 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530283362 158403 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1530283922 795938 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unilot14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56186&oldid=56131 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (-1) 10/* Overwiew */
< 1530284005 660703 :wab_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530284077 934281 :wab_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi guys
< 1530284133 76169 :wab_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm part of the same exclusive club that some of you #esoteric already are: I've spent time in a psychiatric closed ward as an inmate.
< 1530284162 555491 :wab_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm now in the open ward and might leave in a few days, but just thought you might want to know.
< 1530284269 443471 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530284304 871736 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530284484 414038 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :wab_jonas: My Condolences
< 1530284525 602860 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION was in such Madhouses about 10 Times

< 1530284646 971036 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530284667 330582 :erdic_!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530284694 192740 :erdic_!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley NICK :erdic
< 1530284940 322460 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530285190 948299 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530285340 319438 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530285477 823567 :wab_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 QUIT :Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client
< 1530285527 904831 :wob_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530285654 816552 :wob_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been in closed ward for c.10 days, until a bed in open ward got freed up. Will tell you about the bad experiences later, but still takes a few days till I can get home. I'm actually just typing on my brother's notebook now.
< 1530285659 439401 :wob_jonas!5fc3dbd6@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.95.195.219.214 QUIT :Client Quit
< 1530285660 692905 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530285951 939962 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Quit: gone completely :o
< 1530286144 708424 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530286294 60760 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98dd9.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530286943 633229 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530287040 505716 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530287226 10350 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530287723 144692 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@142.160.103.253 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530288283 847997 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530288575 532682 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530288925 298660 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530289069 51352 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530289079 150417 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530289087 624050 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-jjiehtztggrlybxu QUIT :Ping timeout: 247 seconds
< 1530289106 793905 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530289107 693001 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530289149 301674 :danieljabailey!~danieljab@cpc75709-york6-2-0-cust725.7-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530289155 665369 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530289309 247153 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530289345 344316 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530289644 237127 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530289889 959752 :xirg!~xirg@50-243-32-200-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530289939 529997 :xirg!~xirg@50-243-32-200-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530290154 520820 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1530291518 239969 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mwtpjvchrrdgmtqe QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1530291689 137874 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-svjzeedohqtztqni JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530292582 987565 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530293653 788776 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :best flowchart software
< 1530293662 362965 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :?
< 1530293717 522465 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know. I don't know if I will write one later either, or if you can use TeX, either
< 1530293846 285323 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :\oren\: no clue... dia is worth a look, perhaps
< 1530295061 38878 :\oren\!~oren@ec2-52-2-213-98.compute-1.amazonaws.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: nvm I used a sheet of paper and took a picture with my phone
< 1530295182 515071 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :proper use of technology
< 1530295374 687922 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530295402 298855 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530295698 370282 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530295816 973124 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought of how a algorithm can compute y=e^x by initializing v=1 and n=0 and then you can use a C or JavaScript code in a loop like y+=v*=x/++n and then, a variant of such algorithm can be made up for use with integer arithmetic too, by using fixed point perhaps. I am guessing similar things to what I mention may have been done before. Do you know about these kind of things?
< 1530295874 196808 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530295946 886893 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I know a little; another useful formula is e^x = (e^(x/2))^2, to help the other sequence converge.
< 1530295965 418694 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530295987 108722 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: now what happened to you...
< 1530296077 621037 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530296095 357531 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah. [ERROR] Plugin.irc: Ping timeout.
< 1530296108 803911 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :lambdabot: Fair enough, that's a valid reason to reconnect :)
< 1530296125 694087 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530296452 134394 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: What "other sequence" do you mean exactly?
< 1530296465 243158 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not immediately see how to use that another useful formula.
< 1530296603 836192 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: y+=v*=x/++n is evaluating the 1 + x + x^2/2 + x^3/3! + ... sequence
< 1530296620 247222 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: which converges more rapidly if x is small.
< 1530296761 797244 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know that; that is why I wrote that code. O, now I suppose I can see, that you can make x small now
< 1530297362 182917 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530297530 17316 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530297575 179652 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: i hear lambdabot got kicked from #haskell hth
> 1530297629 63936 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Ais52314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56187&oldid=56167 5* 03Ais523 5* (+650) 10/* How can I paste my own code on this wiki? (I didn't violate others' copyright) */ reply
< 1530297694 979021 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: and did you check whether it has returned in the meantime?
< 1530297754 599765 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: (this would have been useful to know between 7 3/4 and 16 hours ago)
< 1530297794 622075 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did check, and I saw that both you and lambdabot returned.
< 1530297805 622353 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :this was a joke reply to "what happened to you"
< 1530297846 914902 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: sorry
< 1530297899 84811 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I didn't connect the two incidents because my question was really about lambdabot being gone for 4 minutes just before.
< 1530297926 889848 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I did have a decent chance to get it and failed :-/
> 1530298227 988235 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subterra14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56188&oldid=49187 5* 03Ais523 5* (+541) 10it's TC
> 1530298287 843778 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:ZM14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56189&oldid=54596 5* 03ZM 5* (-11) 10
> 1530298314 825774 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:ZM14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56190&oldid=56189 5* 03ZM 5* (-57) 10
> 1530298481 695769 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TwoDucks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56191&oldid=46425 5* 03Ais523 5* (-80) 10remove incorrect category and nonexistent category (computational class is not unknown, it's definitely undecidable)
< 1530298505 459448 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530298573 340136 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530299178 513515 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07GolfScript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56192&oldid=56165 5* 03Ais523 5* (-98) 10Undo revision 56165 by [[Special:Contributions/Asdf|Asdf]] ([[User talk:Asdf|talk]]): Copyright violation
> 1530299196 205732 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 revision10 02 5* 03Ais523 5*  10Ais523 changed visibility of a revision on page [[02GolfScript10]]: content hidden: Copyright violation
> 1530299275 411850 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asdf14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56193&oldid=56181 5* 03Ais523 5* (+420) 10final warning re copyvio
< 1530299275 609927 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530299440 346574 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
> 1530299470 722130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56194&oldid=56170 5* 03Ais523 5* (-408) 10Undo revision 56170 by [[Special:Contributions/Asdf|Asdf]] ([[User talk:Asdf|talk]]): a) this should not be a section of its own (there's an "examples" section); b) it doesn't actually work (for at least two separate reasons)
< 1530299659 704404 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530300165 685560 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lqtgccmsgzbninuf JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530300499 926414 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56195&oldid=56134 5* 03ZM 5* (+694) 10Restrictions added
> 1530300514 262662 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56196&oldid=56195 5* 03ZM 5* (-14) 10
< 1530300798 868956 :ZM!02f71d07@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.247.29.7 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530300853 329095 :ZM!02f71d07@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.247.29.7 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was going to insert a sneaky link to ♦/~ on ♦
< 1530300865 825123 :ZM!02f71d07@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.247.29.7 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I lost it in the preview window :/
< 1530301043 402063 :ZM!02f71d07@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.247.29.7 PRIVMSG #esoteric :found it, but decided against actually doing it
< 1530301188 878169 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530301209 384804 :ZM!02f71d07@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.247.29.7 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi
< 1530301282 355242 :ZM!02f71d07@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.247.29.7 QUIT :Quit: Page closed
< 1530301383 305169 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530301471 60759 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZM’s language is surprisingly neat!
< 1530302128 350618 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you mean Andromeda? It look like good to me
< 1530302217 657842 :xirg!~xirg@50-243-32-200-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530302457 490940 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: whoa, a picture of a Trondheimcat
< 1530302949 418323 :fractal!~fractal@unaffiliated/scounder JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530303067 598062 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530303151 253612 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530303289 317235 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530303296 706611 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530303433 921120 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah
< 1530304086 344230 :imode1!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1530304103 22169 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530304295 651953 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I figured out how the CloudFlare email protection is working, it order that it can be decoded even if the JavaScripts in the document aren't allowed to execute.
< 1530304482 592083 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For some reason some email addresses in the same document are not protected, and I found one that decodes into a list of m and so on
< 1530304700 528251 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know why?
< 1530304745 655403 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530304772 862315 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530305062 746792 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530305211 308086 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530306885 180558 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530306978 849091 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530307142 776812 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530308877 845590 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530309034 485384 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.1
< 1530309068 293363 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530310272 958491 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530310758 713707 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530310979 712448 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530311062 239452 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zf26q8wflfvvi0.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530311168 346286 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530311381 64559 :ldm!~ldm@unaffiliated/ldm NICK :Luke
< 1530311410 527256 :Luke!~ldm@unaffiliated/ldm NICK :Guest30544
< 1530311425 932212 :Guest30544!~ldm@unaffiliated/ldm NICK :ldm
< 1530311515 763398 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530311523 975266 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530311532 478895 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas NICK :Remavas
< 1530311825 4201 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530312212 708497 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar CYUL
< 1530312213 245826 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :CYUL 292200Z 27011G19KT 30SM FEW045 FEW250 31/14 A2987 RMK CU1CI2 CU TR SLP115 DENSITY ALT 2100FT
< 1530312227 361192 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :@metar KOAK
< 1530312227 524356 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :KOAK 292153Z 29015KT 10SM CLR 22/12 A2990 RMK AO2 SLP124 T02220117
< 1530312292 627031 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@89.189.140.235.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530312661 577659 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530312815 327706 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530314563 442627 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530314671 512651 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530314752 360297 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530315777 949390 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530316486 53618 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530316644 653673 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530317591 628813 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530318253 599270 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, forgot to log out again
< 1530318340 295765 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530318563 776234 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530318565 400353 :Naergon!~Naergon@94.197.120.59.threembb.co.uk QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530318654 611606 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lqtgccmsgzbninuf QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
> 1530318913 869385 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56197&oldid=56169 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+1) 10/* Python 3.x */ Fix common error
< 1530318937 124738 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530318978 718833 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530319034 302561 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530319037 329721 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1530319043 265960 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Andromeda14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56198&oldid=56196 5* 03Oerjan 5* (+15) 10Fix red link
< 1530319113 997009 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530319135 554617 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530319179 998163 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530319497 937724 :graphene!~graphene@46.101.134.251 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530320183 258390 :boily!~alexandre@cable-192.222.236.157.electronicbox.net QUIT :Quit: MOVIE CHICKEN
< 1530320309 364970 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530320481 293474 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530321700 637978 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 268 seconds
< 1530322003 309393 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530322249 432272 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530322415 334580 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530322840 338399 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530323536 264591 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric : oerjan: whoa, a picture of a Trondheimcat <-- what?
< 1530323800 795407 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone posted a picture of a cat in Trondheim.
< 1530323810 870968 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not in this channel.
< 1530323817 687574 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just, y'know, on the Internet.
< 1530324116 427791 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530324287 201930 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530325440 763534 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530325681 34131 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530325946 832632 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: shocking
< 1530326084 953775 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530326267 694090 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530326816 863078 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1530327046 58559 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Simplack14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56199&oldid=56184 5* 03Saka 5* (-1957) 10/* Python */
< 1530327987 70669 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530328148 776009 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530329849 909724 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530330064 293572 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530331782 935427 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530331801 235835 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1530331965 323883 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530333747 690513 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530333891 297602 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530333985 62244 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@142.160.103.253 QUIT :Quit: the creeping crawling chaos will return.
< 1530335455 542853 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I had another idea. If the instruction pointer hits a uppercase letter then it turns clockwise, if a lowercase letter then it turns counterclockwise; in either case, it and the rest of its group are toggled between uppercase/lowercase after the instruction pointer is moved; the group consists of it and all other same letters (case-insensitive) within a Chebyshev distance <= 2, and also the same group as those ones too.
< 1530335497 688984 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(So that the entire group is connected in this way as long as they are linked by Chebyshev distance <= 2 even if the full distance of the group > 100)
< 1530335585 793577 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530335812 206548 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530335929 860804 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530336059 233421 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530336117 863704 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530336318 223741 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Client Quit
< 1530337498 126317 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530337694 699377 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530338201 681452 :oerjan!oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no QUIT :Quit: Nite
< 1530338458 405465 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530339083 665109 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530339286 11913 :nfd!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530339378 187254 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530339589 336940 :nfd9001!~nfd9001@c-73-157-90-101.hsd1.wa.comcast.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530339611 50617 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530339793 472632 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-svjzeedohqtztqni QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530339828 270281 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1530341274 298815 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530341437 199344 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530343143 314686 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530343341 279243 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530344003 998678 :ProofTechnique[m!prooftechn@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-caikcfdniolltkjm JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530344553 817745 :Naergon!~Naergon@92.40.249.93.threembb.co.uk JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530344841 945502 :copumpkin!copumpkinm@haskell/developer/copumpkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530345092 190240 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530345240 359786 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530345861 189906 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530346140 812120 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530346976 968355 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530347162 207494 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530347730 668849 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zf26q8wflfvvi0.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530348723 428181 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xwbjcxnepmxqugzy JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530348897 561147 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530349088 306417 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530349520 641901 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530349537 90044 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530349643 463890 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530350601 791483 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 QUIT :Quit: Leaving.
< 1530350761 794835 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530350993 743240 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530351935 772906 :imode!~imode@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530352639 296039 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530352858 303539 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530354518 438901 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530354737 765451 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530356451 174023 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530356657 300444 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530357679 430757 :erkin!~erkin@unaffiliated/erkin QUIT :Quit: Ouch! Got SIGIRL, dying...
< 1530357935 791651 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zf26q8wflfvvi0.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530358385 19483 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530358559 698120 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530360245 704282 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530360440 775067 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1530361645 684145 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03A 5*  10New user account
> 1530361733 413899 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56200&oldid=56158 5* 03A 5* (+113) 10
< 1530362223 77205 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530362390 361009 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530362462 611187 :MDude!~MDude@c-73-187-225-46.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530363629 669244 :doesthiswork!~Adium@207.55.82.87 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530364161 633950 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530364207 194889 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530364355 798629 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530366048 370840 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530366231 287099 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530366302 716211 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Client Quit
< 1530366587 76089 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530367387 347343 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530367437 282038 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530367538 352618 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530367579 774388 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1530368139 974681 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56201&oldid=56182 5* 03Saka 5* (+34) 10
< 1530368458 363791 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530368640 376886 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530369093 326550 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530369108 367066 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530370359 635541 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530370548 301784 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1530372207 215031 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530372404 696085 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530373756 184056 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530374125 24436 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530374315 351019 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530374973 358502 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530375037 524325 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1530375147 342492 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530375538 19809 :aloril__!~aloril@80.246.146.6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1530375683 971822 :XorSwap!~XorSwap@wnpgmb016qw-ppp-103-253.dynamic.bellmts.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530375692 30823 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xwbjcxnepmxqugzy QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1530375711 150852 :aloril__!~aloril@80.246.146.6 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530376078 972310 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530376251 275963 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530378024 909456 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530378190 331101 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530379533 152041 :propumpkin!~copumpkin@haskell/developer/copumpkin NICK :contrapumpkin
< 1530379719 605386 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530379801 39417 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530379940 743597 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530380141 86816 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530380171 35702 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds
< 1530380200 36776 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530381371 787004 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1530381846 634371 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530382040 795105 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530382337 323608 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1530382648 383171 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@d51A46C74.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530383138 674887 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530383179 46895 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.
< 1530383248 412824 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530385613 57516 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530385622 410751 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1530385628 316249 :Remavas-Hex!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas NICK :Remavas
< 1530385699 93764 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530385932 396169 :Remavas!~Remavas@unaffiliated/remavas QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1530386521 100199 :SopaXorzTaker!~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1530387587 440979 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1530387915 602977 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530389102 80066 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1530389316 368632 :tromp!~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530389506 562942 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530389654 788082 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
> 1530391128 859214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07TwoDucks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56202&oldid=56191 5* 03Plokmijnuhby 5* (+1002) 10
< 1530391402 972530 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530391551 269475 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530391612 197786 :clog!~nef@bespin.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530391844 183057 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1530392105 381453 :impomatic!~digital_w@host86-191-16-233.range86-191.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1530392516 186523 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530392937 195027 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530393319 641928 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530393515 310051 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds
< 1530394792 610426 :mrrmx!mrrmx@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mrrmx JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530394815 183023 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :ZZT switches into another video mode so that each character has only eight columns instead of nine; how to do that switch in a BASIC code?
< 1530395261 896546 :trout!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable JOIN :#esoteric
< 1530395432 785900 :variable!~variable@freebsd/developer/variable QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds
< 1530396087 70987 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the question was about the VGA 8/9-column switch, just from theory I think it should be something like OUT &H3C4, 1 : x% = INP(&H3C5) : OUT &H3C5, (x% OR 1) -- not tested at all, though.
< 1530396608 10534 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK
< 1530396674 991496 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I did guess probably the OUT command has to be used, but did not know what numbers to specify; now you mention it thank you)
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< 1530397552 125256 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-47-161.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some protocol for decentralized censorship-resistant permanent archival of Unusenet messages should be defined. Do you know how?
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< 1530402256 948909 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure about that, but the VGA numbers came from the FreeVGA documents. The normal site seems to be down, but there's a copy here: https://web.stanford.edu/class/cs140/projects/pintos/specs/freevga/vga/vga.htm
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