←2018-07-11 2018-07-12 2018-07-13→ ↑2018 ↑all
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02:19:04 <esowiki> [[Turing-machine]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56631&oldid=56623 * A * (+41) /* Computational class */
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04:16:13 <esowiki> [[SimpleScript]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56632 * A * (+3251) Created page with "==Commands== <any integer literal n not part of another command> -> Increment first register by n "<any sequence of characters>" -> Push the unicode ids of the characters in..."
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05:50:40 <esowiki> [[Talk:Main Page]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56641&oldid=56640 * A * (+83) /* Someone should change the featured language. */
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09:25:44 <esowiki> [[Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56644&oldid=56548 * A * (+150) /* Hello, World! */
09:31:11 <esowiki> [[Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56645&oldid=56644 * A * (+87) /* Hello, World! */
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09:33:45 <esowiki> [[Hello world program in esoteric languages]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56646&oldid=56447 * A * (+2) /* Brainfuck */
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10:12:59 <esowiki> [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Lvl * New user account
10:16:23 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56647&oldid=56575 * Lvl * (+170)
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12:22:29 <esowiki> [[Tip]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56648 * Ais523 * (+15510) new language!
12:23:00 <esowiki> [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56649&oldid=56627 * Ais523 * (+10) /* T */ +[[Tip]]
12:23:33 <esowiki> [[Language list]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56650&oldid=56649 * Ais523 * (+0) /* T */ apparently I can't alphabetise today
12:23:57 <esowiki> [[User:Ais523]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56651&oldid=56484 * Ais523 * (+9) +[[Tip]]
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12:26:03 <esowiki> [[OISC]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56652&oldid=56164 * Ais523 * (+103) /* List of OISCs */ +[[Tip]]
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13:08:52 <esowiki> [[Tip]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56653&oldid=56648 * Ais523 * (+194) external resources; also a clarification to what initial IP values are allowed
13:10:35 <Taneb> @tell ais523 Tip seems neat!
13:10:35 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
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13:24:00 <esowiki> [[Tip]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56654&oldid=56653 * Ais523 * (-159) /* External resources */ rm section; the content at the link was wrong (and was taken down as a result), meaning the section's now blank. Hopefully this will be fixable.
13:42:28 <esowiki> [[Tip]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56655&oldid=56654 * Ais523 * (+159) complex undo revision 56654 by [[Special:Contributions/Ais523|Ais523]] ([[User talk:Ais523|talk]]): issue now fixed, although unfortunately it cost an extra byte :-(
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13:55:39 <wob_jonas> @tell ais523 Opponent has a Sigarda, Host of Herons and a Seedborn Muse and three Amoeboid changelings, each but the Sigarda enchanted by a Diplomatic immunity. In each upkeep, Opponent uses Amoeboids to make Sigarda and Muse have all creature types. How do you clear his table with your Omnitell once you go off?
13:55:39 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
13:57:42 <wob_jonas> @tell ais523 More importantly, given that the Omnitell deck runs eight wishes, how can you be sure that it's still tournament-viable after you replace much of its sideboard?
13:57:42 <lambdabot> Consider it noted.
13:58:14 <wob_jonas> Since apparently ais523 still only comes in during the night when I must sleep to be able to work the next day, I'll try tell instead of catching him online.
13:58:35 <wob_jonas> Or rather, catching him on IRC. Because he does keep editing the wiki during the day.
13:59:28 <Taneb> Not going on IRC during the work day is probably sensible
14:02:22 <wob_jonas> Taneb: yes, but he _could_ go to IRC in the evening.
14:03:09 <Taneb> Oh, of course
14:04:55 <wob_jonas> Which were those two esolangs where the instruction pointer moves in a 2-plane like in fungeoids, but can be at rational points, not constrained to a grid?
14:05:40 <wob_jonas> And one of them had no or very little state other than its instruction pointer I think.
14:05:51 <wob_jonas> I'm asking because Tip reminds me of that.
14:07:05 <esowiki> [[Collatz function]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56656&oldid=51400 * Ais523 * (+24) /* See also */ +[[Tip]]
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14:31:39 <esowiki> [[Tip]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56657&oldid=56655 * Ais523 * (-4) /* Variations */ probably one decimal place is enough, but that wasn't actually proven above
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17:57:20 <shachaf> Sgeo: what's going on with olist twh
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19:47:35 <zzo38> Pentragrams are neither good luck nor bad luck. There is a normal circled pentagram, and then there is the upsidedown Satanic pentagram.
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19:50:38 <wob_jonas> Right. The pentagrams are just tools to summon a demon and attempt to bind them to your will. It's your command to the demon that may be good or evil.
19:52:58 <zzo38> It is just a mark. The marks they use for demon summoning rituals might or might not resemble pentagrams, but anyways having a pentagram does not imply anything about demon summoning.
19:53:58 <zzo38> The circled pentagram is a common Wiccan symbol; it is not used to summon demons in this way.
19:55:07 <zzo38> (I don't know much about demon summoning stuff (I am skeptical if it is even possible), but a pentagram is just the geometric shape and is related more to Wicca than demon summoning anyways.)
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19:56:03 <wob_jonas> ais523!
19:56:05 <LKoen_> I think according to most sources, the pentagram's role is to prevent the demon from escaping and killing the summoner
19:56:35 <wob_jonas> I have some nitpicking questions to your M:tG construction because I can't find real problems with it!
19:56:35 <LKoen_> the pentagram itself doesn't actually help with the summoning or binding
19:56:36 <ais523> wob_jonas: huh, I didn't see your comment on IRC but I'm logreading it and saw it on the log
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19:56:56 <ais523> are my messages getting through now?
19:56:59 <zzo38> LKoen_: Yes, I think that is what I have read too, actually.
19:57:03 <ais523> apparently so
19:57:07 <zzo38> ais523: Yes, at least to me they are getting through
19:57:14 <wob_jonas> ais523: yes
19:57:18 <ais523> maybe I shoud just use my client for sending and stalker mode in the logs for receiving :-P
19:57:28 <wob_jonas> ais523: sure, that works
19:57:37 <zzo38> The pentagram itself is just a shape (which isn't used only by demon summoners, if it is even used by them at all).
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19:57:57 <ais523> <wob_jonas> Which were those two esolangs where the instruction pointer moves in a 2-plane like in fungeoids, but can be at rational points, not constrained to a grid? ← Trajedy/Conedy; see also Nopfunge
19:58:22 <ais523> @messages
19:58:39 <ais523> lambdabot: ping
19:59:22 <ais523> wob_jonas: re: wishes, some of the sideboard is more important than other parts, I kept all the most vital parts
19:59:36 <wob_jonas> yep, trajedy and conedy are the ones
19:59:42 <ais523> the deck's unlikely to have as high a win rate but it should still be high enough to pull the combo off at least once in a tournament
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20:00:23 <wob_jonas> ok, that seems a reasonable thing to say
20:01:53 <ais523> Taneb: re: Tip, it's basically just a case of looking at iterated collatz functions (because thanks to quintopia, it holds the record for shortest implementation of a TC language in a non-eso language) and realising that it's more complex than necessary
20:02:04 <ais523> although the need for rationals rather than integers is painful when you're implementing it in something low-powered
20:03:39 <ais523> all the messing about with finite fields that I did semi-recently was helpful, though
20:05:45 <wob_jonas> yeah, although you only need exact division, no other difficult integer operations such as division and remainder or gcd
20:06:02 <ais523> well, in practice you need modulo to be able to figure out which command to run
20:06:09 <ais523> but apart from that, yes
20:06:13 <wob_jonas> hmm, true
20:06:33 <wob_jonas> and even those can be difficult to implement in something like M:tG :-)
20:06:53 <ais523> right, Tip doesn't seem like a good language to implent in M:tG
20:07:16 <wob_jonas> Tip is like conedy or fractran in how it stores data
20:07:19 <ais523> although divmod is generally very easy if you have a state machine available, which is why it's the usual building block used for counter-machine-like TC proofs
20:07:53 <ais523> well, Tip is a "dispatch on remainder" type of language, those tend to be TC
20:08:01 <ais523> compare to conedy which is "dispatch on integer part"
20:08:13 <ais523> which I'm beginning to suspect is only PDA-strength
20:09:10 <ais523> that said, I thought the same about Something?Oops!, which turned out to be TC
20:09:24 <ais523> even though it's dispatch-on-remainder
20:09:43 <ais523> (it's one of A/Asdf's languages, most of them are atrocious but that one got me thinking)
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20:12:18 <wob_jonas> wait, A/Asdf makes OISC languages? Do we know he's not also Iamcalledbob then?
20:12:30 <ais523> we think he probably is iamcalledbob
20:12:42 <wob_jonas> oh good
20:12:50 <wob_jonas> I only saw you mention that A and Asdf was the same
20:13:03 <ais523> I've been respecting GDPR and not running checkuser or anything like that (that's reserved for spambots) but it's just obvious based on the way they're acting
20:13:07 <wob_jonas> but I probably missed a lot during being in a psychiatric hospital for 18 days
20:13:10 <ais523> either the same person (most likely) or a group of friends (less likely)
20:14:04 <wob_jonas> of which the last four nights were on a bed that makes it almost impossible to speak, while the psychiatrist told me that for a stress-related problem like this, sleeping well is very important.
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20:14:36 <wob_jonas> that was the worst part though. the hospital and its drastic sedation seems to have worked to at least temporarily reset me
20:15:53 <ais523> good luck with your recovery!
20:18:32 <ais523> Tip is frustrating because of all the special cases in Jelly's syntax
20:18:37 <wob_jonas> ais523: you didn't answer my other crazy nitpicking question though
20:18:51 <ais523> wob_jonas: oh, I simply didn't expect the situation to come up :-D
20:19:15 <ais523> in a game as complex as M:tG, there have to be some board states which are impregnable short of Karn Liberated (whose effect is generally considered to trump anything else)
20:19:23 <wob_jonas> yeah, it's not something that will happen in an actual Legacy tourney game. the opponent would win or lose before it comes up.
20:19:52 <ais523> on the other hand, most decks are focused enough that even a relatively weak survival combo can be enough
20:20:02 <ais523> `card-by-name fortune thief
20:20:03 <HackEso> Fortune Thief \ 4R \ Creature -- Human Rogue \ 0/1 \ Damage that would reduce your life total to less than 1 reduces it to 1 instead. \ Morph {R}{R} (You may cast this card face down as a 2/2 creature for {3}. Turn it face up any time for its morph cost.) \ TSP-R
20:20:07 <ais523> `card-by-name shielding plax
20:20:08 <HackEso> Shielding Plax \ 2(g/u) \ Enchantment -- Aura \ ({(g/u)} can be paid with either {G} or {U}.) \ Enchant creature \ When Shielding Plax enters the battlefield, draw a card. \ Enchanted creature can't be the target of spells or abilities your opponents control. \ DIS-C
20:20:58 <ais523> I won a game against a serious tournament deck with that combo a while ago because, fragile though it is, the deck only had one answer (Pyroclasm) and didn't draw it
20:21:55 <esowiki> [[Tip]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56658&oldid=56657 * Oerjan * (+1) typo
20:22:12 <ais523> [CTCP] Received CTCP-PING reply from ais523: 80 seconds.
20:22:21 <wob_jonas> ah, I know that feeling. not from tournaments, but from casual games, where I often play green or white, which have very few answers to some things.
20:22:37 <ais523> every colour is supposed to have things it can't answer
20:22:48 <wob_jonas> sure
20:22:48 <ais523> except white, which can actually answer anything but is meant to have problems with card flow
20:22:59 <wob_jonas> yeah, that's also sort of accurate
20:23:37 <wob_jonas> white can run out of steam
20:23:52 <ais523> green can also answer everything but normally takes multiple cards to do so
20:24:05 <ais523> err, except instants/sorceries, it has no answer to those
20:25:31 <ais523> actually it's probably only red that has a really hard weakness (can't get rid of enchantments except by killing their controller)
20:25:49 <ais523> as black and blue both have general-purpose answers which are restricted in timing (discard and counterspells respectively)
20:26:40 <wob_jonas> there are some ways how my casual white decks try to defend against that: (1) win with Armored Ascension, which goes against the normal white rules that white doesn't have large creatures or auras that increase power by more than one, (2) Arcane Spyglass to burn away my lands for cards, (3) just make the deck fast enough, which is possible since Lo
20:26:40 <wob_jonas> rwyn, although not as much as in red-white, (4) blue splash
20:27:42 <ais523> tournament white decks normally try to slow their opponent down instead
20:28:10 <ais523> typically using "symmetrical" effects that make certain things more expensive or unplayable for both players, when those things happen not to be in your deck ;-)
20:28:17 <ais523> `card-by-name Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
20:28:18 <HackEso> Thalia, Guardian of Thraben \ 1W \ Legendary Creature -- Human Soldier \ 2/1 \ First strike \ Noncreature spells cost {1} more to cast. \ DKA-R
20:29:07 <wob_jonas> I'm still considering to eventually go back to Magic though, and there are a lot of things in each color that exist on cards now that didn't use to exist
20:29:15 <wob_jonas> the power level has increased
20:29:23 <esowiki> [[Talk:Tip]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=56659 * Oerjan * (+369) /* Computational class */ new section
20:29:40 <wob_jonas> there's like a ton of cards I'd like to buy
20:29:53 <wob_jonas> ton of cheap cards
20:30:14 <ais523> Magic's being really mismanaged at the moment, I suspect
20:31:19 <esowiki> [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56660&oldid=56647 * Oerjan * (-39) Let's not confuse the next editor.
20:31:40 <wob_jonas> no, quite the contrary, at least from their point of view. they manage to produce more and more new cards every year, and get a lot of income, ever since Tenth Edition, but they always do it so sneakily that it's not obvious to notice
20:31:59 <wob_jonas> they're doing good business where they're always selling more and more, even potentially to me if I ever return
20:32:26 <wob_jonas> without making it too obvious that they're doing such a business
20:33:06 <ais523> I'm not sure, they've had a few disasters recently, such as Iconic Masters
20:33:58 <wob_jonas> and they make it really look like it will never stop, which they have to, because there's basically no clean way to stop producing new Magic sets, for if people ever suspect that Wizards is trying to do that in the next three years, they will stop buying Magic immediately
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21:15:45 <esowiki> [[Talk:Tip]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56661&oldid=56659 * Ais523 * (+743) somehow I missed that the Fractran calculation didn't use the s part of the Collatz function
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21:20:16 <esowiki> [[List of ideas]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=56662&oldid=56230 * Igorrto * (+75) /* Looks Like */
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