00:12:47 [[User:Cortex]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60227&oldid=60224 * Cortex * (+360) 00:19:01 [[Befunge]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60228&oldid=60220 * Oerjan * (-1) /* Language overview */ sp 00:19:48 mediawiki's default diff is so annoying for checking anything other than small localized changes (and even then beware of newlines) 00:20:20 although i guess i trust b_jonas not be doing vandalism when moving sections :) 00:20:49 ...i cannot see whether he edited anything at the same time, though. 00:21:47 * oerjan always uses WikEdDiff [sp?] on wikipedia, unless the changes are so big it starts gobbling cpu 00:22:30 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 00:23:27 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 00:24:56 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 00:25:56 [[Works in progress]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60229&oldid=60221 * Oerjan * (+95) Make a policy for putting the foot down so I can start deleting things that don't belong 00:28:31 hm that doesn't quite work. 00:30:33 oerjan: you shouldn't trust me. and I did edit something: I turned the Etymology thing to a deeper level header 00:30:37 `? itymology 00:30:38 Itymology is the science of understanding the true meaning of a statement. 00:31:05 [[Works in progress]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60230&oldid=60229 * Oerjan * (-95) Undo revision 60229 by [[Special:Contributions/Oerjan|Oerjan]] ([[User talk:Oerjan|talk]]) (OK this doesn't work, the already existing entries have too much ambiguity) 00:31:37 b_jonas: i think i noticed that. i meant editing things inside what you moved. 00:31:40 I mean, I probably don't vandalize it, but I might still make bad changes 00:32:13 true, you made a spelling error :P 00:32:33 several, on IRC today 00:34:35 that Works in progress page should probably have been a category from the start. 00:36:22 it seems like some entries are just collaborations between a couple people 00:36:39 which doesn't imply everyone else is invite to change the specs 00:36:46 oerjan: yes, but you all have been scaring people from creating categories. 00:37:02 that occured to me too 00:39:50 -!- adu has joined. 00:42:27 itymology is such a good word 00:42:39 well, a wiki may be a good tool to collaborate on creating a specification 00:42:49 adding a blurb for befunge when nominating it was a good idea, although i'm not sure if we should require it from nominators 00:43:03 (it'll probably speed up things) 00:43:18 well, the hard part is probably still getting the article to a betters tate 00:43:37 but we have to start writing the blurb tool, so I thought I'd start 00:44:18 the instructions on the nomination page seem a bit obsolete, and not reflecting the current reality of how the featured language box works now 00:45:39 well the current reality is that it didn't work for 5 years 00:45:48 exactly 00:51:02 -!- Phantom_Hoover has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:02:13 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Windows * New user account 01:20:43 -!- xkapastel has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 01:25:47 good username 01:30:35 -!- ais523 has joined. 01:36:17 ais523: i think we need some kind of policy that admin involvement in a featured language doesn't count if all active admins agree to it. otherwise we'll never get Underload featured :P 01:36:48 persuade fizzie to do it :-P 01:36:58 i nominate underload, hth 01:37:04 he implemented it in fungot :P 01:37:04 oerjan: but fnord is written in 01:37:25 well, everyone has implemented bf 01:37:29 and it was still featured 01:37:33 Yeah, I don't think that counts as "involvement". 01:37:38 fungot: Are you feeling involved? 01:37:38 fizzie: ( iirc) is a good 01:37:49 imo fungot for wiki admin 01:37:49 shachaf: the l is somewhat like on the piano :) i spend most of your life 01:38:12 fungot: I've never seen an l key on the piano. 01:38:12 shachaf: i can see 01:39:33 -!- ais523 has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 01:39:45 -!- ais523 has joined. 01:39:50 this is not for nomination, non-admins can nominate. but ais523 seemed loathe to _select_ his own languages even when others nominated them. 01:40:47 (also nominations must be on the wiki hth) 01:40:58 tdnh 01:41:16 oerjan: there has to be somewhere where we can draft the front page text _before_ nominating a language to the feature box 01:41:25 fwiw, I wouldn't object to admins featuring pre-reset nominations, the reset was just because 7 years is an awfully long time to be locked out of making a second nomination 01:41:38 b_jonas: it used to be that people just nominated the language and the featuring admin wrote the front page text 01:41:42 which is part of the reason that it hardly ever got done 01:42:18 oh, that reminds me. I wanted to ask something about intercal 01:42:24 hm i've thought about this before 01:42:54 There's a limited number of nominations? 01:43:09 shachaf: only one per person until it resets 01:43:22 although i'm pretty sure A had sneaked in under two accounts :P 01:43:32 we should probably let peopel change their nomination as often as they were 01:43:34 Can you swap your nomination for a different one? 01:43:48 oerjan: I deleted the second nomination, after checkusering to verify that it was two accounts of the same user 01:44:11 (that's one of the few things you can legally checkuser for on Wikipedia: pretending to be two people on a poll or vote) 01:44:43 *as often as they like 01:44:46 But this isn't Wikipedia. 01:44:49 shachaf: no, but I disagree with that rule 01:45:04 ais523: Iamcalledbob was also him, i suspect 01:45:18 shachaf: yes, but there's a very long-standing (as in, from the moment the wiki was created) rule of "if we don't come up with a rule ourselves, we use Wikipedia's by default until a new agreement is established" 01:45:45 ais523: you know how there's this redundant representation, where you represent an n-bit integer as a difference of two n-bit integers, with the advantage that you can do addition or subtraction on such a representation in such a way that carry has to be propagated only two levels, or only one level for adding a constant 01:45:51 I nominate ais523 for unilateral dictator of the wiki. 01:46:04 ais523: and it can also be done in a not too complicated way using ordinary bitwise operations and shifts 01:46:32 ais523: what I'd like to ask is, has that ever been used to represent 16-bit integer computations efficiently in Intercal? 01:46:45 b_jonas: I don't believe so 01:46:58 interesting 01:46:58 it should be possible to implement, I just don't think it's been done 01:47:16 the vast majority of INTERCAL programs aim for space-efficiency rather than time-efficiency 01:47:39 I don't think it's too inefficient though 01:47:45 compared to other things you can do in intercal that is 01:47:53 indeed 01:48:01 I have not heard of such a representation before now, I think 01:48:04 aiming for space-efficiency is a habit from 1972, I think, when computers had less memory 01:48:19 ais523: Isn't it more important nowadays than before? 01:48:35 Now that memory bandwidth is the bottleneck for most computation. 01:48:48 what, space-efficiency? it is in the sense that cache misses tend to bottleneck things more than CPU execution units, yes 01:49:08 but in that case you also have to take the space iin the instruction cache into account 01:49:19 Of course. 01:49:23 so there's a three-way tradeoff between memory usage, instruction length and instruction speed 01:49:56 I think pipeline flushes have a cost that's comparable to that of an L1 cache miss, so you can't neglect instruction speed entirely 01:51:27 shachaf: no, but I disagree with that rule <-- i suggest allowing changes after a suitable time period (a year maybe?), seems better than a complete reset 01:51:50 is there any reason not to allow changes to be made arbitrary often? 01:52:12 but yes, we could undo the reset if we're allowing people to change anyway 01:52:16 What's the difference between allowing changing your nomination and allowing any number of nominations? 01:53:28 admins have a much shorter list to look through when they have to decided on a language 01:54:19 Can I nominate multiple languages with different weights? 01:54:30 So you can sample my nomination when you want to look through the list. 01:54:56 really our whole featured languages process is fairly badly thought out :-D 01:57:26 zzo38: http://mmix.cs.hm.edu/doc/mmix-doc.pdf paragraph 40, on page 32 01:58:15 ais523: the way I phrased is, the instructions on https://esolangs.org/wiki/Esolang:Featured_languages/Candidates are badly thought out. I'm not srue that's the actual process you follow though. 01:59:55 that's the process we follow, maybe it shouldn't be though 02:02:17 what about this process: 02:02:31 ais523 decides whatever he wants 02:02:50 shachaf: I'd recommend that *fizzie* decides whatever he wants 02:03:07 if it's ais523, then we'll never be able to feature his languages 02:03:18 although if fizzie decides them, then we won't be able to feature befunge 02:03:19 hmm 02:03:41 I'd like a process along the lines of "we try to decide on a schedule for language featuring in advance" 02:04:04 e.g. someone suggested featuring BF Joust, and I realised October would be a good month for it; likewise, there was some suggestion of featuring a joke language for April 02:04:28 why October in particular? 02:04:59 it's the largest uptick for online gaming communities 02:05:11 if you're running one of those, you normally get a spike in new members in October 02:05:20 this is probably related to the fact that the academic year starts in September 02:05:20 huh... I didn't know that. I thought that was the Christmas break 02:06:05 Christmas break is often pretty much dead, to the extent that Agora and BlogNomic have both, at some point in the past, had rules that shut them down entirely over Christmas 02:06:37 agora still has a rule that nullifies deadline penalties then 02:07:01 I see 02:10:06 Is the cures of the featured language that people make erivatives of it? <-- did anyone make a funciton derivative recently? :P 02:14:17 b_jonas: O, yes, there is the carry save addition 02:16:40 oerjan: one language I'm working on has a few similarities to Funciton, but it's not really a derivative 02:17:32 it also generalizes to when you already have, say, 32-bit addition primitives, but want to do carries from one word to another only up to one step, I think you can do that with the words storing like one or two extra bits 02:20:23 i recall thinking of something like this when verifying that adding an arbitrary list of numbers (or counting the number of set bits in input) can be done with a circuit of logarithmic depth 02:20:31 as for funciton, what I've been thinking of independently of that language is a notation where (local) variables are represented by columns in the code, a function call (or call to a primitive) is written with a comma in the right column to put an output in a variable and 02:21:16 an apostrophe for an input argument or backtick for an earlier input argument (so you can easily swap arguments), or a semicolon or comma for both input and output, 02:21:41 b_jonas: mechanical analog computers are normally programmed vaguely like that, the computer itself has a matrix of axles, columns represent variables, rows represent execution units, and you connect them at the intersections to write the program 02:21:47 and you can have multiple calls in the same line as long as they're more or less separated horizontally. 02:22:00 this way the code sort of represents a circuit, with information flowing from top to bottom. 02:23:32 and you can also put functions next to each other, where to define a function, you use a header pseudo-instruction that defines the name and parameters and an extra formal marker, plus a function end line that takes the output values (returns) and the formal marker in the same column to know which function header it matches 02:23:40 (the set bit counting part being a way to prove the complexity class inclusion TC_0 \subset NC_1) 02:23:50 ais523: yeah, though this would be a bit higher level 02:24:50 also, if you use short names for the most frequent functions, then the output variable could default to the first column of the function name. 02:25:08 I know this is really vague, it doesn't come to a full specification, not even close, and I haven't figured out any of the details. 02:26:44 but yes, if you only use higher level stuff, then this lends naturally to programming with either a punch card, or those things used for player pianos with little pins in places on a grid 02:26:58 to lift levers that connect parts of the mechanism 02:27:29 but I think more of the higher level version 02:28:45 perhaps I should make at least a simple prototype language, to serve as an example for something that has explicit variables (not just, say, a data stack or the unlambda/underload no-variable thing), but no variable names 02:29:52 it's a pity the clc intercal webpage is still down by the way 02:34:56 ok, I refuckulated my radio statistics code so it's less heinous 02:35:10 RAAAAADIO 02:35:16 📻 02:35:16 shachaf: imo you should get a ham license 02:35:24 then we can chat using our radios 02:35:47 I'm pretty sure there are VHF/UHF repeaters that cover Berkeley and the Sunset 02:35:51 but we can already chat 02:36:06 But IRC isn't the maximally nerd way to do so. 02:36:14 it's true 02:36:17 hams are the O.G. nerds 02:36:26 I really wanted to get a http://ronja.twibright.com/ back when I and a friend lived at the university campus with line-of-sight between the apartments. 02:36:29 ham radio is at the same time profoundly un-cool and extremely punk rock 02:36:32 kmc: imo let's play internet relay cat 02:36:34 I love it 02:36:34 Unfortunately that didn't last long enough. 02:36:36 where you get a cat 02:36:47 and then send me pictures of the cat through the internet 02:36:51 and then i visit you + the cat 02:36:56 fizzie: is that one of those line-of-sight laser network links? 02:37:18 kmc: IIRC, it's not actually laser, but the same sort of thing. 02:37:21 yeah, neat. 02:37:22 mhm 02:37:37 cool stuff 02:37:51 Do you have the ability to post ARRL radiogram messages? 02:38:10 The Tetrapolis model has a visible wavelength, so I think in theory on foggy nights you should've been able to see the beam. (Well, and/or it would've stopped working.) 02:38:30 zzo38: I don't really know anything about that, but probably? I have a General class license so I can do most things on most parts of the bands 02:38:42 do you know morse code 02:39:20 fizzie: our friendly local WISP uses laser links, in addition to milimeter wave and traditional microwave links 02:39:28 shachaf: no, but i'm learning a bit 02:39:43 shachaf: I'm using the method where you learn at full speed, adding one character at a time 02:39:51 rather than learning the whole alphabet slowly and trying to speed up 02:40:01 beep boop 02:40:08 the former method (Koch method) is said to be better 02:40:39 smiling cat face with cat face shaped eyes 02:41:01 because at any decent speed, you don't have time to decompose into individual dots and dashes 02:41:24 you have to recognize each letter (and eventually words and codes) as a single thing 02:41:28 if there's line of sight, can one of you wave semaphore flags and the other watch with a telescope? 02:41:38 like reading by sounding out words, vs reading fluently 02:41:47 b_jonas: yes, and it would be amusing to do TCP/IP over such a transport 02:41:49 zounds 02:41:59 kmc: do deaf people read faster than hearing people 02:42:13 if you're not married to the idea of traditional semaphores, you could use 8 flags to represent one octet at a time 02:42:20 shachaf: idk 02:42:41 kmc: there's some esoteric representation with showing one hexit at a time with two flags 02:43:04 kmc: and I think there's been a traditional semaphore that showed six trits, but I think the trit thing is a bad idea 02:43:55 back to the statistics project: my current approach is as follows 02:44:34 1) calculate the average power across the whole frequency range at each timestep, and subtract it from each individual measurement. this subtracts out the slow variation in broad-spectrum noise 02:44:40 kmc: what exposure time and frame rate do you use when measuring the signal strength? 02:45:15 2) calculate the average power (after the adjustment in (1)) on each frequency 02:45:32 3) calculate the % of time spent more than 1.5 dBm above the average 02:45:38 this is a crude way to look for a bimodal distribution 02:45:54 b_jonas: I already answered that, but it averages over 4 seconds 02:46:10 oh, I must have missed it in the logs 02:46:46 and during that time it quickly scans over the whole range 02:47:26 so 4 seconds is the recip framerate, right? 02:47:30 but what's the exposure time? 02:47:37 I don't know what you mean 02:47:42 it averages power over 4 seconds 02:47:45 is that not an exposure? 02:47:49 that's the exposure then 02:47:59 and the time between exposures starting is 4 seconds 02:48:03 I thought "scans over the whole range" meant it doesn't scan all ranges at the same time 02:48:04 so the frame rate is 0.25 Hz 02:48:16 sorry 02:48:28 I don't know how quickly it hops frequencies, if that's what you're asking 02:48:38 it digitizes 2.048 MHz of spectrum at once, and the band is 4 MHz (144 - 148 MHz) wide, and there is some overscan for Reasons 02:48:45 so it does it in 3 chunks 02:48:57 the tool is rtl_power if you want to look into it more 02:49:12 ok 02:49:57 anyway I think the above analysis may be about as good as I can do in a time invariant way (i.e. same result if you permute the frames arbitrarily) 02:50:03 but that is a silly restriction so I think I can do much better 02:50:13 so did your computation seem to work? have you found stations that you could listen to and figure out something about? 02:50:30 it finds stations that are already clear in the waterfall graph 02:50:43 that's still useful, since it's automated 02:50:46 yeah 02:50:48 that is the challenge 02:51:01 to automate it, and gather statistics over many days or weeks 02:51:14 for example if a certain frequency is active at the same time on the same day of the week, every week, it's probably a scheduled "net" 02:51:18 which I may not already know about 02:51:27 I can already scan the whole spectrum with one of my other radios, but it doesn't log anything 02:51:52 a typical FM scanner has a much better way of identifying frequencies in use 02:51:59 noise squelch 02:52:25 rather than just looking at the RF power, it demodulates the signal into audio and then looks at the high frequency (super-audible) components 02:52:46 if those components have a lot of energy, it indicates that you're picking up static 02:53:11 in terms of the original signal, it is looking for a strong carrier whose frequency is not varying too quickly 02:53:23 I see 02:53:30 but wouldn't that be slower in scanning the spectrum? 02:53:45 could it miss broadcasts that are active only for shorter times, to transmit short messages? 02:54:28 I gtg soon, but good luck, find useful channels 02:54:35 presumably at some point the hard disk ends up full [...] <-- as i recall from last time i ran a memory-slurping haskell program without thinking, my windows has some swap size limit 02:54:45 b_jonas: yes, it's slower 02:55:09 although, you could maybe do it quickly with an SDR 02:55:16 if you can do a lot of FM demodulation in parallel 02:55:25 anyway that's much more towards the hard signal processing side of things 02:55:31 and right now I'm looking for a rough statistical approach 02:56:02 yeah, GPS magic and sparse fourier transformas 02:56:12 crazy stuff 02:58:40 and electronics magic, like you explained 02:59:04 yay 02:59:56 -!- b_jonas has quit (Quit: leaving). 03:05:52 I do know how to format a ARRL radiogram message. 03:12:04 zzo38: cool 03:12:08 are you / have you been a licensed ham? 03:13:38 [[ALLSCII]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60231&oldid=60226 * Cortex * (+1561) 03:16:29 `? phantom_hoover 03:16:30 Phantom Michael Hoover is a true Scotsman, hatheist, and completely out of the loop. 03:17:02 No, but I do know how to format the message. A few fields must be filled in by the radio operator, although I can fill in everything else, if someone else can send it. (I have no need to write a ARRL radiogram message now, but I can write one if needed) 03:20:20 [[ALLSCII]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60232&oldid=60231 * Cortex * (+104) 03:21:30 [[Language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60233&oldid=60160 * Cortex * (+14) 03:34:41 -!- bobby has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 03:38:40 -!- bobby has joined. 03:51:52 -!- FreeFull has quit. 03:55:12 -!- bobby has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 04:00:05 -!- bobby has joined. 04:00:42 -!- danieljabailey has joined. 04:01:18 -!- imode has quit (Quit: WeeChat 2.4). 04:01:38 -!- imode has joined. 04:02:20 zzo38: I haven't learned morse code yet, but I'm working on it 04:02:23 it seems like a good thing to know 04:02:41 you can communicate with very weak radio signals, and it's also applicable to many things besides radio 04:17:00 -!- S_Gautam has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 04:47:09 A chess variant called "Hexabeast" has English rules, Chinese pieces, and Latin notation. (The reason for the Latin notation is that the name of each piece starts with a different letter if they are written in Latin, but this is not the case in English, and of course the Chinese names are not ASCII.) 04:52:59 -!- salpynx has joined. 04:55:51 I missed the Works in Progress discussion earlier, but there is already a https://esolangs.org/wiki/Category:Works-in-Progress category that I thought (perhaps mistakenly) was official. 04:56:40 I was going to add a 'see also' on the other page, but maybe that won't help clear the confusion 04:58:09 I don't know if it is official 05:00:05 I don't think it's official 05:00:16 OK 05:02:09 Now I look at the other langs on that list it does not look official, a couple of users had added multiple languages to it and it has swept in a few others along the way 05:07:12 It's used in a template here: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Template:WIP just figured out why I used it on one of my languages 05:14:33 -!- xkapastel has joined. 05:41:17 -!- danieljabailey has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 06:08:09 -!- atehwa has joined. 06:16:37 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tA3_YKCW2LU 07:12:08 the situation in girl genius seems to be turning tense 07:12:22 but at least the guy uses pronouns properly 07:15:31 `5 w 07:15:34 1/2:boorjan//boorjan is oerjan's uneducated twin. \ adjective//Adjectives are words frequently found attached to chickens. \ cgi//CGI stands for uh... C, goblin, interface? \ remavas//Remavas is a revolution in human biology. He's cofriends with oerjan. He's apparently from Frankfurt, Germany, but he's actually from Mars. His typing skills are so incredibly bad, some say he writes in a different orthography designed for a different language. \ res 07:15:37 `n 07:15:38 2/2:taurant//A restaurant is a type of transactional resource-distributing system powered by lazy evaluation. 07:15:43 `cwlprits boorjan 07:15:45 shachäf 07:15:52 would you look at that. how unexpected. 07:16:48 `? funpuns 07:16:49 funpuns fceƀ fbz fryyrev naq pbfcynlf Arcrgn Yrvwba ba jrrxraqf. Ur ungrf oryy crccref jvgu n cnffvba. Gur havg bs sha chaarel vf anzrq nsgre uvz. 07:17:09 `` \? funpuns | rot3 07:17:10 ​/hackenv/bin/`: line 5: rot3: command not found 07:17:11 `` \? funpuns | rot13 07:17:12 shachaf sprø som selleri and cosplays Nepeta Leijon on weekends. He hates bell peppers with a passion. The unit of fun punnery is named after him. 07:17:27 `? shachaf 07:17:28 Queen Shachaf of the Dawn sprø som selleri and cosplays Nepeta Leijon on weekends. He hates bell peppers with a passion. He doesn't know when to stop asking questions. 07:18:22 `? kmc 07:18:23 kmc did not run the International Devious Code Contest of 2013. 07:18:30 `? zzo38 07:18:31 zzo38 is not actually the next version of fungot, much as it may seem. 07:19:16 `` echo -n $(cat wisdom/shachaf) The unit of fun punnery is named after him. | rot13 > wisdom/funpuns 07:19:18 No output. 07:19:27 ... hmm should have used tee 07:19:31 `` cat wisdom/funpuns 07:19:32 Dhrra Funpuns bs gur Qnja fceƀ fbz fryyrev naq pbfcynlf Arcrgn Yrvwba ba jrrxraqf. Ur ungrf oryy crccref jvgu n cnffvba. Ur qbrfa'g xabj jura gb fgbc nfxvat dhrfgvbaf. Gur havg bs sha chaarel vf anzrq nsgre uvz. 07:24:46 Hmm, can you send two files to diff on stdin? 07:24:55 You can do it interactively, with diff - /dev/stdin and ^D 07:25:12 But can you do (foo; eof; bar) somehow? 07:26:18 `` cat wisdom/funpuns | rot13 | cmp wisdom/shachaf - 07:26:19 wisdom/shachaf - differ: byte 169, line 1 07:26:26 Hmm, no. But you can use <(...) to good effect. 07:27:35 Is it really a thing you can only do interactively? 07:27:46 No way to make a read of size 0 happen? 07:28:47 -!- S_Gautam has joined. 07:30:28 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 07:30:52 <(...) is too good 07:33:29 you are addicted to calling things too good 07:33:31 like me 07:36:16 tg is tg 07:36:40 `? tg 07:36:42 TG is short for Turing-Gödel, the highest possible level of difficulty for a multiplayer game. At this level, it's undecidable whether you can manage to halt before losing or not. 07:37:00 what about Superturing-Gödel 07:37:05 is superturing a superhero 07:37:20 wtf... 07:37:26 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) 07:37:27 ​--- /dev/fd/632019-03-04 07:37:26.716895926 +0000 \ +++ /dev/fd/622019-03-04 07:37:26.636894902 +0000 \ @@ -29,0 +30,9 @@ \ +The \ +unit \ +of \ +fun \ +punnery \ +is \ +named \ +after \ +him. 07:37:29 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat 07:37:30 No output. 07:37:32 ?! 07:37:33 Maybe you meant: v @ ? . 07:38:42 Why does piping the result of diff to another command cause the output to become empty? 07:39:32 `which diff 07:39:32 ​/usr/bin/diff 07:40:44 `run diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) 07:40:45 ​--- /dev/fd/632019-03-04 07:40:45.256264591 +0000 \ +++ /dev/fd/622019-03-04 07:40:45.266264719 +0000 \ @@ -29,0 +30,9 @@ \ +The \ +unit \ +of \ +fun \ +punnery \ +is \ +named \ +after \ +him. 07:40:50 `run diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat 07:40:51 No output. 07:45:13 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat -v 07:45:14 ​--- /dev/fd/632019-03-04 07:45:14.229664713 +0000 \ +++ /dev/fd/622019-03-04 07:45:14.229664713 +0000 \ @@ -29,0 +30,9 @@ \ +The \ +unit \ +of \ +fun \ +punnery \ +is \ +named \ +after \ +him. 07:45:53 `which cat 07:45:54 ​/bin/cat 07:46:27 oerjan: Why did that work? 07:46:32 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat -v 07:46:33 No output. 07:46:58 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat; echo $? 07:46:59 No output. 07:47:08 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat -A 07:47:09 No output. 07:47:22 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat; echo hi >&2 07:47:23 No output. 07:47:34 tdnh 07:47:58 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | hexdump 07:47:59 No output. 07:48:39 nothing you do will do anything hth 07:48:47 it's nondeterministic too. terminating the thing for some reason. 07:49:13 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat -v 07:49:14 No output. 07:49:18 oh i see 07:49:40 `` diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) No output. 07:50:01 or not. 07:50:14 `` strace -o tmp/trace diff -u0 <(< wisdom/shachaf fmt -1) <(< wisdom/funpuns rot13 | fmt -1) | cat 07:50:15 ​/hackenv/bin/`: line 5: strace: command not found 07:50:23 ?! 07:50:29 you gotta have strace 07:50:55 diffs of diffs are the best 07:51:24 kmc: imo can you make an infinity-category out of it 07:51:45 i was wondering 07:51:47 and, probably 07:54:09 -!- xkapastel has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 07:56:18 [[ALLSCII]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60234&oldid=60232 * Cortex * (+37) 07:58:49 -!- arseniiv has joined. 08:07:50 [[ALLSCII]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60235&oldid=60234 * Cortex * (+160) 08:50:21 -!- oerjan has quit (Quit: Nite). 09:21:10 Something I was thinking over the weekend: 09:22:00 The category of monoids and monoid homomorphisms, and the category of abelian groups and group homomorphisms, both have an internal hom functor 09:22:03 But Grp doesn't 09:22:59 How come? 09:24:39 Monoid homormorphisms form a monoid pointwise, with (f<>g)(a) = f(a)<>g(a) 09:25:48 -!- orbitaldecay has joined. 09:27:09 If we extend this to groups, and take f^-1(a) = f(a)^-1, we get f(a<>b)^-1 = f^-1(a<>b) = f^-1(a)<>f^-1(b) (by the fact it's a homomorphism) = f(a)^-1<>f(b)^-1, but this is only true in general when the codomain is abelian 09:29:09 Of course, this isn't actually a proof of my original statement, just that what to me is the obvious formulation fails for Grp 09:42:34 -!- danieljabailey has joined. 10:00:27 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 10:00:54 -!- Sgeo has joined. 10:10:15 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 10:14:24 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 10:26:56 -!- salpynx has quit (Quit: Page closed). 10:28:42 -!- mich181189 has quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds). 10:28:55 -!- mich181189 has joined. 11:02:15 -!- ais523 has quit (Quit: sorry for my connection). 11:02:24 -!- callforjudgement has joined. 11:02:50 -!- callforjudgement has changed nick to ais523. 11:02:57 -!- ais523 has quit (Client Quit). 11:24:29 -!- danieljabailey has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds). 12:21:29 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has joined. 12:24:37 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 12:24:37 -!- Lord_of_Life_ has changed nick to Lord_of_Life. 12:38:11 -!- S_Gautam has quit (Quit: Connection closed for inactivity). 13:01:09 [[Multiply]] N https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=60236 * A * (+354) Created page with "=Syntax=
 This programming language only implements multiplication. It uses only 3 values: x as -3, y as -2, and z as -1. Whitespace means multiplication. 
=Example..." 13:02:42 [[Joke language list]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60237&oldid=60080 * A * (+71) /* General languages */ 13:05:13 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60238&oldid=60236 * A * (+30) /* Examples */ 13:05:30 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60239&oldid=60238 * A * (+30) /* Examples */ 13:06:11 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60240&oldid=60239 * A * (+33) /* Examples */ 13:06:29 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60241&oldid=60240 * A * (-1) /* Examples */ 13:09:15 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60242&oldid=60241 * A * (+202) 13:12:50 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60243&oldid=60242 * A * (+373) /* Implementation */ 13:13:00 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds). 13:13:03 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60244&oldid=60243 * A * (+13) /* Implementation */ 13:13:24 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60245&oldid=60244 * A * (+13) 13:15:14 [[Multiply]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60246&oldid=60245 * A * (+63) 13:35:21 [[SPADE]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60247&oldid=59400 * A * (+40) 13:37:00 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 15:05:38 -!- adu has joined. 16:07:26 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 16:07:48 -!- imode has joined. 16:26:24 -!- Taneb has quit (Quit: I seem to have stopped.). 16:26:35 -!- atriq has joined. 16:27:40 -!- atriq has changed nick to Taneb. 16:29:12 [[Special:Log/newusers]] create * Erwijet * New user account 16:34:45 [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60248&oldid=60217 * Erwijet * (+227) Introduced myself 16:35:46 [[Esolang:Introduce yourself]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60249&oldid=60248 * Erwijet * (+0) Fixed a spelling issue on my name 16:45:27 -!- imode has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 16:59:39 Taneb: You'd probably know -- what's there to see and do in Hexham? 17:00:17 fizzie: the Abbey's worth a visit, the Old Gaol is a history museum, there's some little art galleries dotted about, a theatre, a cinema 17:00:59 Why do you ask? 17:01:39 I might stop by sometime in the summer. It's on the way, and it's got all that #esoteric glamour. 17:02:25 `` grwp -il hexham 17:02:26 english channel \ fentimans \ ham \ helsinki \ hexchat \ hexham \ wegian 17:02:59 There's a bus that goes to a bunch of old Roman sites as well 17:03:15 (the AD122) 17:05:46 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 246 seconds). 17:06:28 -!- sebbu has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 17:08:34 -!- sebbu has joined. 17:10:26 -!- LKoen has joined. 17:14:27 -!- tromp has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 17:16:50 [[Brainfuck]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60250&oldid=59396 * Erwijet * (+139) Added an interpreter 17:21:04 [[Brainfuck]] M https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60251&oldid=60250 * Erwijet * (-7) Fixed formatting 17:21:50 -!- moei has joined. 17:22:58 Taneb: The old Roman sites are kind of the thing Hexham is on the way to, though I think we might rent a car. 17:26:36 -!- AnotherTest has joined. 17:28:49 -!- tromp has joined. 18:05:07 -!- Essadon has joined. 18:16:57 -!- Phantom_Hoover has joined. 18:39:28 -!- b_jonas has joined. 18:46:20 Game of XYZABCDE Part II is not much yet (I have to think of what rooms to add, and that part is difficult to think of, I think), but nevertheless is possible to download to see so far: http://zzo38computer.org/xyzabcde/2.zip 18:46:38 Type VERBS for a list of verbs (there are a few hidden verbs which are not listed here). 18:50:34 -!- adu has joined. 19:01:13 (You can also make suggestions/questions/complaints if you have any, I suppose.) 19:10:17 -!- Sgeo has quit (Quit: Leaving). 19:10:38 -!- Sgeo has joined. 19:13:12 -!- adu has quit (Quit: adu). 19:15:00 zzo38: if you want esoteric people to try text adventures, you can try to wire them up to IRC so they play on channel (or on #esoteric-blah if it gets annoying), with HackEso or with a custom bot. 19:17:01 I don't know if there is a such thing as IRC-Glk, but perhaps it can be written if it does not yet exist. (Yet, if you want to test the status window, then that won't work with IRC-Glk.) 19:17:21 oh, you need a status window? that's more difficult then 19:17:22 (I do not have time right now, but you can try, and/or perhaps later I can try.) 19:17:45 The game doesn't need a status window; it can work without. However, the status window can be helpful. 19:23:01 could /topic be the status bar 19:23:30 It is a text grid window of more than one line in this game 19:35:17 "The reason for the Latin notation is that the name of each piece starts with a different letter if they are written in Latin, but this is not the case in English" => like a king and a knight in chess or tarot? 19:35:56 `? adjective 19:35:57 Adjectives are words frequently found attached to chickens. 19:35:59 huh what? 19:50:51 -!- xkapastel has joined. 19:59:23 -!- imode has joined. 20:01:42 -!- FreeFull has joined. 20:11:52 -!- atslash has joined. 20:37:55 [[ALLSCII]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60252&oldid=60235 * Cortex * (+123) 20:45:07 [[ALLSCII]] https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=60253&oldid=60252 * Cortex * (+39) 20:56:48 -!- S_Gautam has joined. 21:06:16 -!- orbitaldecay_ has joined. 21:09:13 -!- orbitaldecay has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 21:29:18 -!- orbitaldecay__ has joined. 21:32:07 -!- orbitaldecay_ has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 21:35:48 b_jonas: that text adventure bot is a good idea 22:01:51 -!- orbitaldecay_ has joined. 22:01:58 -!- moei has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer). 22:02:34 -!- moei has joined. 22:04:10 -!- orbitaldecay has joined. 22:04:40 -!- orbitaldecay__ has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 22:06:07 -!- orbitaldecay_ has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 22:06:33 -!- LKoen has quit (Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”). 22:07:59 -!- Lord_of_Life has quit (Ping timeout: 268 seconds). 22:13:04 -!- Lord_of_Life has joined. 22:27:38 -!- nfd has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds). 22:47:47 -!- nfd has joined. 22:49:04 -!- tromp has quit (Remote host closed the connection). 22:49:12 -!- moei has quit (Quit: Leaving...). 22:49:39 -!- tromp has joined. 22:52:08 -!- nfd has quit (Ping timeout: 245 seconds). 22:57:27 -!- housecarpenter has joined. 22:59:27 -!- AnotherTest has quit (Ping timeout: 240 seconds). 23:03:27 -!- nfd has joined. 23:07:43 -!- moony_ has joined. 23:07:54 https://github.com/Globidev/corewa-rs https://glo.bi/corewar/ someone made their own corewars 23:07:55 it looks fun 23:09:23 favorite part from what i've looked at is it's usage of less abstract opcodes 23:09:37 meaning really fun(tm) tactics like rewriting the opponent are possible 23:25:53 At least just on a glance, it doesn't look *that* different from regular Redcode. 23:27:35 I mean, the field stuff is a little abstract, I guess, but you can definitely rewrite your opponent there too. 23:29:26 -!- arseniiv has quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds). 23:35:29 -!- b_jonas has quit (Quit: Lost terminal).