< 1562374529 591266 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 248 seconds < 1562374678 422619 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1562374772 389535 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1562377177 103329 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1562377389 264926 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562381789 235854 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1562382458 516677 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07A:;14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63930&oldid=62159 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+244) 10 < 1562383327 77884 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1562385660 509494 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1562387572 582594 :MDude!~MDude@c-174-55-101-236.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1562389553 16154 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT : < 1562393770 190333 :[!uplime@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers NICK :uplime > 1562394342 893022 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63931&oldid=56519 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+299) 10 > 1562394772 736373 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07A:;14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63932&oldid=63930 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (-218) 10 < 1562396916 345476 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1562397346 783060 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcdc6imrwoapg3.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1562397950 783925 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcdc6imrwoapg3.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds > 1562402612 426783 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Pistons & Pistons14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63933&oldid=63923 5* 03A 5* (+170) 10/* Infinite Loop */ < 1562402980 457850 :LKoen!~LKoen@194.12.134.148 JOIN :#esoteric > 1562403028 831318 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Pistons & Pistons14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63934&oldid=63925 5* 03A 5* (+541) 10 > 1562403216 247778 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Pistons & Pistons14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63935&oldid=63933 5* 03A 5* (+121) 10/* Infinite Loop */ > 1562403384 686773 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Pistons & Pistons14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63936&oldid=63934 5* 03A 5* (+139) 10 < 1562403399 670603 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1562404402 622743 :john_metcalf!~digital_w@host31-54-142-171.range31-54.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1562404852 282278 :mniip!mniip@freenode/staff/mniip QUIT :Ping timeout: 600 seconds < 1562406400 594877 :Sgeo__!~Sgeo@ool-18b98455.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1562406489 240912 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1562406578 364447 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b98455.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds > 1562406668 496658 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Arcorann 5* 10moved [[02SLOBOL10]] to [[SLOBOL (2015 language)]]: If you've invented a language with the same name as an existing one yours should have the bracketed bit afterwards > 1562406668 508224 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Arcorann 5* 10moved [[02Talk:SLOBOL10]] to [[Talk:SLOBOL (2015 language)]]: If you've invented a language with the same name as an existing one yours should have the bracketed bit afterwards > 1562406878 219031 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SLOBOL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63941&oldid=63938 5* 03Arcorann 5* (+752) 10 > 1562406929 975543 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63942&oldid=63927 5* 03Arcorann 5* (+8) 10/* A */ < 1562407267 32492 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: did you invent any good data structures or algorithms lately twh < 1562407313 89175 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not recently I'm afraid < 1562407320 154424 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't had much free time for experimentation lately < 1562407409 159243 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh no :'( < 1562407594 117578 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have any old ones for me < 1562408656 695051 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: you don't want to think about the Old Ones. and if you have to, at least don't remind everyone else on the channel about them. < 1562409333 959931 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the harm of thinking abou the Old Ones? < 1562409336 91547 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They're great. < 1562409364 216057 :john_metcalf!~digital_w@host31-54-142-171.range31-54.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds > 1562410007 314293 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=63943 5* 03A 5* (+515) 10Simplify Pistons & Pistons > 1562410639 581896 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63944&oldid=63943 5* 03A 5* (+605) 10/* Symbols */ > 1562410915 207778 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63945&oldid=63944 5* 03A 5* (+434) 10 > 1562411265 601983 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63946&oldid=63945 5* 03A 5* (+544) 10 > 1562411977 969067 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63947&oldid=63946 5* 03A 5* (+621) 10 > 1562412165 708477 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63948&oldid=63947 5* 03A 5* (+114) 10/* Symbols */ > 1562412322 303431 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Forks & Forks14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63949&oldid=63948 5* 03A 5* (+189) 10 < 1562413392 759019 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1562415089 27115 :LKoen!~LKoen@194.12.134.148 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” > 1562417449 887559 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:YamTokTpaFa/sandbox314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63950&oldid=62026 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (-2) 10 > 1562417567 30712 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:YamTokTpaFa/sandbox314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63951&oldid=63950 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+101) 10 > 1562417603 828837 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07POGAACK14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63952&oldid=49935 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+288) 10 > 1562417979 873039 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ante14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63953&oldid=41535 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+42) 10 > 1562418384 363285 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Nairb14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63954&oldid=50931 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+168) 10More edits plz. > 1562418413 613618 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Tweet14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63955&oldid=49061 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+29) 10+CAT > 1562418470 141173 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Print "deadfish"14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63956&oldid=47289 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+24) 10Y U NO +CAT ? > 1562418584 439764 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category:Works-in-Progress14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63957&oldid=44863 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+24) 10Let's +CAT < 1562418687 81815 :LKoen!~LKoen@194.12.155.190 JOIN :#esoteric > 1562418774 956412 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Oerjan14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63958&oldid=62023 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+515) 10/* I have lots of things I'd like to discuss. */ new section > 1562418819 162527 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Oerjan14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63959&oldid=63958 5* 03YamTokTpaFa 5* (+122) 10/* I have lots of things I'd like to discuss. */ < 1562419238 942101 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric : shachaf: you don't want to think about the Old Ones. and if you have to, at least don't remind everyone else on the channel about them. => too late, I’m already here < 1562419309 552380 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PART #esoteric :"gone too far" < 1562419317 118400 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1562419709 303889 :MDude!AdiIRC@c-174-55-101-236.hsd1.pa.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1562420431 308584 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1562420544 705575 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562421128 271947 :MDude!AdiIRC@c-174-55-101-236.hsd1.pa.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 245 seconds < 1562421590 546119 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@41.251.97.218 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562422705 610830 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1562423305 965400 :mniip!mniip@freenode/staff/mniip JOIN :#esoteric < 1562423813 90093 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@41.251.97.218 QUIT :Quit: Cya guys! < 1562426687 418954 :LKoen!~LKoen@194.12.155.190 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1562429329 507204 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b1a0:2a00:5c23:a12a:76b0:56c2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562430735 625013 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcdc6imrwoapg3.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be JOIN :#esoteric < 1562431633 508326 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b1a0:2a00:5c23:a12a:76b0:56c2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds < 1562431656 581435 :border!5e6ddd62@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.94.109.221.98 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562432299 614557 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@41.251.97.218 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562432546 345014 :unlimiter!~unlimiter@41.251.97.218 QUIT :Client Quit < 1562433267 116497 :border!5e6ddd62@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.94.109.221.98 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1562434267 622400 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b1a0:2a00:e50f:db75:2294:8ca6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1562434278 550028 :iconmaster!~iconmaste@2604:6000:b1a0:2a00:e50f:db75:2294:8ca6 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1562435152 317870 :mniip!mniip@freenode/staff/mniip QUIT :Ping timeout: 615 seconds < 1562435452 480082 :mniip!mniip@freenode/staff/mniip JOIN :#esoteric < 1562438334 955770 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling JOIN :#esoteric < 1562439019 821268 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you like the Niagara board game? < 1562439261 891065 :yaewa!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1562439332 411012 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1562439697 410554 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1562439841 418325 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1562439906 857897 :yaewa!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1562440878 819708 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what game < 1562441586 957973 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, it's easy enough to come up with a Turing machine that halts if and only if ZFC is inconsistent. < 1562441595 382395 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder about going the other way, though. < 1562441633 985472 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider a Turing machine C that halts if and only if the Collatz conjecture has a looping counterexample. < 1562441666 925796 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can we come up with a set theory that is inconsistent if and only if this Turing machine halts? < 1562441674 731754 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: The opposite would make consistency of ZFC decidable, wouldn't it? So you would be showing that ZFC is inconsistent, I think. < 1562441721 132139 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm asking mostly because Niagara is a multiplayer game that could be reasonably played on irc, using a bot that implements the game rules < 1562441728 125422 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But this is not what you asked.) < 1562441751 920853 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, we could do something boring, like take an existing set theory and add an axiom asserting that the Collatz conjecture has no such counterexamples. < 1562441779 960983 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well... boring is good. :P < 1562441781 368966 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if we could do it in a more interesting and "natural" way. < 1562442270 930159 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I doubt it. I don't know. Ask a proof theorist :) < 1562442609 647938 :AnotherTest!~turingcom@ptr-82l26zcdc6imrwoapg3.18120a2.ip6.access.telenet.be QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1562442872 812650 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am sure I can play chess on IRC, as well as most other methods of communication. < 1562442921 137454 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, it's not the only such game. some card games work too. < 1562442954 717754 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe it is, but I think card games is more difficult. < 1562443093 611193 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What card game do you think will work? < 1562443105 153203 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know how to play poker on IRC? < 1562443140 843461 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :with a trusted bot that does the randomness. I don't want to mess with the cryptographic magic that lets you avoid that. < 1562443158 652211 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't even understand how some of that cryptographic magic works. < 1562443166 889612 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would think poker would be difficult to do. But chess you can do easily; just write the moves, is all that is needed. < 1562443194 736084 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and in poker, you just write the raises and keeps and folds < 1562443203 299902 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is that harder? < 1562443210 601250 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you need the cards. < 1562443222 747551 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Poker could be done with a bot that displays private cards to private messages and then public cards could be mentioned in the channel, though. < 1562443226 913491 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure. the GM bot tells the cards to you in private messages < 1562443232 749136 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1562443253 118036 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you want the inverse for Niagara, where you send simultaneous move choices to the bot in private message < 1562443260 881362 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK. < 1562443261 625350 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I meant the cryptographic magic version without a trusted bot. < 1562443271 775558 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :part of the game has each player choose a card from their hand secretly, then revealing all of them < 1562443282 722526 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I meant is that chess you don't need the bot or any private messages < 1562443289 786260 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I really don't understand how that works for poker and similar card games, even in theory < 1562443299 107274 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: O, so it is a card game. < 1562443312 762599 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is reputed to be possible though, and I believe that < 1562443321 928260 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, that's true, for chess you don't need private messages < 1562443333 119118 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's a full information game < 1562444221 76911 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: is there a light TL;DR description of Niagara you could link to? < 1562444241 105469 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I’m interested in playing games over text channels via bots < 1562444310 940588 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I’m also very partially interested in that cryptographic magic, purely for understanding sake, so if that topic will arise in the future, I’m in < 1562444349 350019 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, e4 < 1562444383 862763 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I don't know. https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/13308/niagara has full description. but I can try to give a short description in a few lines of irc, without the full rules < 1562444413 578786 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is a German style board game for 3 to 5 players < 1562444453 672976 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the fluff is that you are controlling canoes to collect gems on a river that has a waterfall, if you collect gems you win, if you fall down the waterfall you're penalized < 1562444493 278454 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the board has a river that's like five map squares of straight river, then below that, a fork with two map squares on either branch, then below that a waterfall < 1562444572 168393 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are five mines on the shore where the gems start, three next to the lower three squares of the straight part, one shared between the upper squares of the two branches of the fork, and one shared between the lower squares < 1562444604 920308 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a base camp on the shore next to the topmost square (there's nothing at the shore next to the square below that) < 1562444673 836801 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the gimmick of the game is that the river flows down, which moves the floor of each water square one square down in the main branch, then the fifth square moves to one of the branches of the forks alternatingly, pushing the upper square of that branch to the lower square and the lower square to destruction by waterfall, while the other branch doesn't move in that flow < 1562444691 92310 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :when floors move this way, canoes on them move with them < 1562444716 652361 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the way how the river flowing is computed is interesting: < 1562444750 770919 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :each player has a hand of seven cards, called 1 2 3 4 5 6 R, that they use up in seven consecutive turns then get the full hand back < 1562444775 700723 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :at the start of the turn, each player simultaneously secretly chooses a card from their hand to use for that turn, then they reveal it < 1562444803 591021 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :then they do actions with their canoes, generally they paddle as many tiles up or down with each canoe as their card shows, but the details are complicated < 1562444840 960794 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then the river flows as many tiles as the smallest number card revealed among the players, modified by the weather which can be one of -1, 0, 1, 2, and stays constant until a player uses the R card to adjust it < 1562444877 228926 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so if you use a high card, you get to move your canoe long distance, but you risk that other players also bid a high number, in which case the river flows a lot down, bringing your canoes closer to the peril at the waterfall < 1562444956 510529 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :your can a gem from the mines on the shore into your canoe, or steal them from an other player's canoe, and transport them with your canoe. you can unload them at your base, where they're owned by you and mostly safe, the aim is to collect enough gems at your base; you can also strategically unload a gem at a mine < 1562445028 96231 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric : then the fifth square moves to one of the branches of the forks alternatingly => oh, nice, actually! < 1562445038 271784 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for the movement, each of your two canoes move, except when both are at your home base, in which case only one moves. they either move as many tiles as your card shows, up or down, or two tiles less than that in which case you load or unload a gem to that canoe from a mine either before or after moving the canoe, and you choose the move independently for your two canoes < 1562445077 471735 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the movement itself is sequential in seating order amongst the players, the player who moves first in this round moves last in the next round < 1562445110 986679 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can't move less than the card says, except when you move to the home base, in which case it's free < 1562445141 244344 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the details are more complicated, boardgamegeek has a full rules sheet and photos of the board that you can use to reconstruct everything < 1562445308 117469 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: thank you, seems very decent! < 1562445356 818115 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :if someone starts writing a bot in a language I understand, maybe I’ll try to help < 1562445398 902276 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@95.105.10.226.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :though not knowing the rules in detail as of now, I can’t suggest anything useful < 1562447047 647042 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I decided to load up a PC emulator and start writing an operating system in machine code. < 1562447058 865361 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :After about 20 minutes of effort, I managed to write an instruction that jumps to itself. < 1562447064 472795 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's a success! < 1562447109 209353 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: nice. next, try one that prints hello world and then enters an infinite loop < 1562447134 575851 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoa whoa, *prints*? That's a bit much to ask. :D < 1562447180 530134 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: you can choose between serial port and video, and in either case, you can choose between BIOS services or doing it on your own using the PC hardware < 1562447845 233017 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm now trying to save the machine state so that I can pick up where I left off instead of having to start over every time I close the page. < 1562447931 780916 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :write the relevant parts of the memory to the diskette > 1562448209 649359 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Symbols14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63960&oldid=58540 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+1263) 10 < 1562448556 923018 :user24!~user24@p2E50C34D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1562448987 883362 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :DOSBOX does not have the function to save the machine state but I would hope that in a later version they might add such thing possibly > 1562449384 341370 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07AAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63961&oldid=41034 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+461) 10 < 1562449679 451668 :laerling!~laerling@unaffiliated/laerling QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1562450089 986179 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :PCjs is awfully underdocumented... > 1562450209 894830 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Argh!14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63962&oldid=53674 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+6) 10 < 1562450281 102867 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :The documentation says that you can create a "Save" button, but there's no documentation on what that button actually does or what is required to make it work. < 1562450345 306834 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( Buttons are for pressing. Or for buttoning. ) < 1562450825 875226 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote this http://zzo38computer.org/gurpsgame/1.ui/wiki?name=Session+22 and try to think of what to write where it says "[Four weeks have passed.]". Mostly, Ziveruskex is studying mathematics, but other stuff could happen too, related and unrelated. I should see if anyone (including myself) has some idea what to write. < 1562451035 179704 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Completely unperturbed, Earth moves silently through space, traveling 72 million kilometers around the Sun. < 1562451066 461441 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, of course that is one thing, but is probably not remarkable to this. < 1562451227 829199 :user24!~user24@p2E50C34D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1562451432 483604 :moei!~moei@softbank221078042071.bbtec.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving... < 1562451898 748753 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, it turns out that the earth is completely stationary and the universe is rotating around it. The motion is kept uniform and circular by various inertial forces. < 1562451939 405875 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :For example, the sun and the moon (like almost everything in the universe) are moving east very quickly, which causes them to experience a downward Coriolis force. < 1562452560 800456 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm having a hell of a time with PCjs. < 1562452574 103946 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :The vast majority of its functionality is undocumented, so you have to look at the source code. < 1562452596 540691 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :The funny thing about that is that there's also no documentation about how to *use* the source code. < 1562452623 827208 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Like, they give you a collection of JavaScript files, and they say "here's the source code", but they don't explain how to do anything with those JavaScript files. < 1562453662 179591 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: There are some package.json sprinkled in the source code which presumably are understood by npm. the build system is called gulp, and there's at least one 'gulpfile' around. The .js files are actually clojure sources? > 1562453700 975325 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ABC14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=63963&oldid=53728 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+754) 10 < 1562453946 234902 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: So... 'npm build' at the root should do something, I imagine. < 1562454401 122060 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I feel like I'm committing the great sin by commenting on how terrible npm and npm culture is but it's so bad I'm going to say it anyway. < 1562454424 641797 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a little program and it has over 300 dependencies. < 1562454438 471980 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of them seem to be nonsense. < 1562454470 282340 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( cabal install criterion ) < 1562454497 997018 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :49 packages, okay, not quite 300 < 1562454531 733858 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also people seem to be incompetent and have no taste. They just write bad code and have no idea about anything. < 1562454536 723564 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIL about 'gauge' which is 'criterion' but some non-essential features and a lot of dependencies cut. < 1562454550 800455 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It works, therefore it can be shipped. < 1562454554 805410 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry < 1562454564 168466 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems to work, therefore it can be shipped. < 1562454581 839187 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have it backwards. < 1562454587 798497 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was shipped, therefore it seems to work. < 1562454600 143251 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see I still have a lot to learn. < 1562454643 222396 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you know NPM has over a million packages now? < 1562454651 22162 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you imagine? < 1562454654 329379 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :No I did not. < 1562454663 935087 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The NPM greatest hits include packages like https://www.npmjs.com/package/ansi-red < 1562454681 708120 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :A million downloads a week. < 1562454718 488336 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one is ... brilliant < 1562454732 972204 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean... it has a dependency! < 1562454752 899207 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. It's impossible to write software without dependencies. < 1562454775 174293 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The npm command line program takes over 500ms to print the help message. < 1562454780 264261 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What could it be doing? < 1562454804 239082 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is JavaScript; it has to start the JavaScript code, unlike the C code which is compiled into native code before you try to execute it. < 1562454820 738250 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the author has 834 repositories on gituhub < 1562454831 767706 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the first time, or also the subsequent times? < 1562454880 509208 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also subsequent times. < 1562454894 133847 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: sadly I can see how "modern" software engineering might make such a "package" popular. < 1562454894 465148 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, it almost gets down to 400ms some runs. < 1562454921 881153 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: make a cheating benchmark that doesn't count the startup time then < 1562454946 422436 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: And yet the Ruby `gem` program, written in Ruby, takes 100ms (which is still absurdly long). < 1562454965 73691 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I bet there's an umbrella package that uses them all, and then some semi-useful library with actual functionality that depends on that for colorful messages. < 1562454973 620366 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If "it's written in JavaScript" is an excuse for making the program bad, the solution is not to write it in JavaScript. < 1562454998 875335 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm pretty sure JavaScript programs don't have to take 400ms to print a help message, though, so it's not really an excuse.) < 1562455010 217543 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I don't know why npm is slower. < 1562455014 191083 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :though, hmm, https://www.npmjs.com/package/ansi-bgcyan has only 100k downloads. < 1562455025 680106 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or you could realize that just because you're using javascript, you don't have to use the most popular library for doing whatever you want < 1562455053 840258 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: How much Javascript does node have to JIT-compile before that help message is printed? < 1562455083 629425 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably a trillion lines. < 1562455106 702014 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I wouldn't even blame JavaScript for that. You can do an OK job in JavaScript for this kind of thing. < 1562455134 453045 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :... hence my question < 1562455156 889754 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1562455160 245227 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you can get to the help message before you compile 100k lines of code, maybe half a second would be node's fault. < 1562455201 451208 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that number is pulled out of thin air) < 1562455206 877571 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good news, I got persistence working in PCjs. \o/ < 1562455219 305301 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the other hand I'm timing Python pip and it's over 900ms. < 1562455231 451649 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m] unlocks "persistence" achievement. < 1562455232 903774 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So maybe terrible software is just the norm. < 1562455272 815780 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, Python can do better as well. < 1562455300 382876 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :guess how long apt takes to print a help message < 1562455300 884843 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-iymizcemcftxwygc PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I have to figure out how the heck keyboard input works on an IBM PC. :D < 1562455378 70571 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a timing program and it's better in terms of the information it shows than my /usr/bin/time or bash builtin time. < 1562455400 355502 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I felt bad about one of our academic tools taking 0.2s to print the help message. < 1562455423 157193 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How many people use your academic tool? < 1562455453 136135 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It's written in ocaml. It used to be much faster, but then ocaml decided to go the first-class module route, punishing the separation of interfaces and modules...) < 1562455464 727648 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, a couple of dozen maybe. < 1562455467 27538 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :npm has millions of users. If they use it once a day on average, that's several days of waiting for it to print the help message, every day. < 1562455492 364359 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Obviously the right thing to do is to print out the help message once and for all. < 1562455510 967832 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right. < 1562455564 659718 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Of course every npm action other than printing a help message takes longer than 400ms, even the trivial ones.) < 1562455736 461742 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well, you'd have to design for this, rather than starting your file with all the 'requires' that are potentially relevant (as I presume npm is doing). < 1562455754 915656 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Or maybe it's worse and it's actually a huge minimized javascript file) < 1562455783 256665 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously I hardly know what I'm talking about < 1562455796 723120 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> time npm --help < 1562455796 866061 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :bash: npm: command not found < 1562455797 3998 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :real 0m0.001s < 1562455797 43310 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :user 0m0.000s < 1562455797 43392 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sys 0m0.001s < 1562455799 574964 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : error: Variable not in scope: time :: t0 -> terror: Variable not in scope: npm < 1562455810 757271 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :@botsnack < 1562455811 45233 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1562455835 599800 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: ^^ can't reproduce < 1562455844 345313 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Oh, you have the best version of npm installed. < 1562455849 680954 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://slbkbs.org/tmp/tym.c -- I guess I already posted this here. < 1562455914 697816 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess that's a tiny bit more informative than /usr/bin/time < 1562455942 69087 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :/usr/bin/time supports almost all that information with a format string. < 1562455947 100513 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least the one on Debian does. < 1562455958 192367 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it doesn't have precise timestamps. < 1562455978 38996 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't using the right incantation of options to time enough? < 1562455987 228095 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which time? < 1562455993 938319 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh I've never looked at the manpage for 'time'. < 1562455996 92402 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the GNU one, not the builtin one < 1562456004 848249 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: it's an info page because it's GNU software < 1562456022 114832 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a manpage which seems comprehensive enough < 1562456038 888269 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: No, it can only give you second precision for elapsed time. < 1562456054 207021 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see < 1562456055 886887 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otherwise yes. I used to use it. < 1562456080 534952 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jhesyjptqmrnijgb JOIN :#esoteric < 1562456087 382626 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh. SEE ALSO: tcsh, prinf... that seems a bit random. < 1562456132 356408 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :especially since it's printf(3) < 1562456171 753710 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh I see why. < 1562456219 848927 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tcsh is referenced because it extends the tcsh `time' builtin, and printf for the similarity in format specifiers. Never mind. < 1562456240 955204 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In bash time is not a builtin. < 1562456245 635150 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a keyword. < 1562456268 741522 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That means that if you alias the keyword "time" to something else, you have no way to invoke it. < 1562456280 18204 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: you do, you can use (builtin time foo) < 1562456289 903915 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you also alias builtin to something else, then you're screwed < 1562456296 937221 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :presumably it's a keyword so that it can apply to a whole pipe... < 1562456305 366832 :zzo38!~zzo38@24-207-15-213.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I write programs in JavaScript generally I try to avoid too many dependencies < 1562456308 271924 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes < 1562456333 733257 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: No, it's not a builtin, it's a keyword. < 1562456345 376911 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1562456346 496448 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1562456374 80379 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only way I know is to unalias it. < 1562456738 690822 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's a pretty good package: https://www.npmjs.com/package/is-unc-path < 1562456759 203687 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It takes a string and matches it against a regular expression. < 1562456777 596874 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It has a dependency, which is a different package by the same author that exports that regular expression. < 1562456819 475473 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 weekly megadownloads < 1562456854 76574 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's the same author as ansi-red < 1562456891 427408 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: some perl modules pull in a large dependency forest through a module that it uses for author-only documentation coverage tests, where that module pulls in another module for finding the difference between two sets, to pretty print the set of functions that do not have doc coverage < 1562456891 508666 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. He has over 1400 npm packages. < 1562456912 680523 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But he's not the only one with the coveted comma in the number of packages. < 1562456986 938909 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :different author: https://www.npmjs.com/package/is-finite < 1562456989 404177 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-24-158.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol "coveted comma" < 1562457032 297083 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Yep. < 1562457049 741763 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :A slacker with only 1.1 kilopackages < 1562457087 537602 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so unpopular... https://www.npmjs.com/package/leading-zeros < 1562457185 589090 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a good time type a package name into https://npm.anvaka.com/ < 1562457189 770506 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :words of wisdom: While polyfills are naughty, ponyfills are pure, just like ponies. < 1562457207 170514 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Despite my choice of language, I do not want to see that as a wisdom entry.) < 1562457321 907149 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://npm.anvaka.com/#/view/2d/npm < 1562457349 671935 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now I see why npm takes 400ms to start up. < 1562457386 406584 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I guess this is a glimpse into the wonderful Javascript/npm culture you mentioned... https://kikobeats.com/polyfill-ponyfill-and-prollyfill/ < 1562457427 773656 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here's me hoping it's just an esoteric subculture. < 1562457482 313247 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe exotic. < 1562457557 580156 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I read that article and derived no pleasure from it.