< 1587429609 399928 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” > 1587429666 457543 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Solo14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71279&oldid=68168 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+116) 10Example + cats > 1587429715 692569 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71280&oldid=71265 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+11) 10/* S */ add Solo < 1587430489 830754 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1587430518 818926 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1587432073 849138 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1587432152 321684 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1587432471 330907 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1587432501 213783 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1587433081 779318 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.179.83.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1587435069 78728 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1587435132 929187 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1587436044 624029 :iczero!iczero@hellomouse/dev/iczero QUIT :Quit: rip < 1587436070 897310 :iczero!iczero@hellomouse/dev/iczero JOIN :#esoteric < 1587437359 419943 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a command in CSS to replace a sequence of text characters with a picture? < 1587440920 373196 :ArthurStrong!~ArthurStr@slow.wreckage.volia.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1587442183 172440 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: rebooting < 1587442234 260683 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1587442879 810064 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now the source code of Super ZZT is also available. Super ZZT has some creatures that ZZT doesn't have, but two are unimplemented, and one is only partially implemented (it looks like to me that it is meant to chase the player with a zig zag path, although it tries to use unsigned variables as signed and fails to even update the sign correctly, too) < 1587444388 845369 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e06b:4fbc:747c:681b JOIN :#esoteric < 1587444454 877140 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:bd4f:13ea:792b:36ad JOIN :#esoteric < 1587444528 993447 :tromp__!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:f8c0:e181:d702:34c2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587444656 845401 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e06b:4fbc:747c:681b QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1587444719 854714 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:bd4f:13ea:792b:36ad QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1587444823 999309 :tromp__!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:f8c0:e181:d702:34c2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1587444936 59128 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d JOIN :#esoteric < 1587445200 988629 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1587446096 368985 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587448593 698915 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1587448927 989339 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1587448962 535472 :atslash!~atslash@46.188.0.82 JOIN :#esoteric > 1587449168 763809 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Jsfunc14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71281&oldid=71267 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+18) 10 > 1587449234 874323 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Jsfunc14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71282&oldid=71281 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+0) 10 < 1587449360 839071 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1587449422 2106 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1587450533 479429 :atslash!~atslash@46.188.0.82 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1587450560 473553 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1587450593 991225 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1587451290 443870 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1587451408 875139 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d JOIN :#esoteric < 1587451589 262112 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 250 seconds < 1587451691 841775 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1587453046 731814 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I added into TeXnicard a command to use the external editor to edit user variables (which may be used for such things as notes for the card set). I also started making a card set using TeXnicard now. < 1587454265 74082 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d JOIN :#esoteric < 1587457593 781990 :cpressey!~cpressey@88.144.95.220 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587457849 442504 :cpressey!~cpressey@88.144.95.220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since we call the numbers 0, 1, 2, ... the natural numbers, I've taken to calling all other numbers, unnatural numbers. < 1587457861 486840 :cpressey!~cpressey@88.144.95.220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :-1 is unnatural. < 1587457866 653016 :cpressey!~cpressey@88.144.95.220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :0.5 is also unnatural. < 1587458443 709619 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1587458523 576646 :cpressey!~cpressey@88.144.95.220 QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1587458562 303169 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: and call (1+i) an unimaginary number < 1587458944 700282 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1587459509 654080 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587459898 598300 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what about a big number nobody commented on yet? > 1587460842 766299 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Jsfunc14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71283&oldid=71282 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+147) 10 > 1587460859 220640 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Jsfunc14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71284&oldid=71283 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (-1) 10 > 1587460974 856715 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Jsfunc14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=71285 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+239) 10Created page with "== General discussion == Yeah, I know this is stub, because I don't had enough time to write this article. Maybe this will be changed in the future. --~~~~ duh." > 1587461034 734195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71286&oldid=68691 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+34) 10 > 1587461065 663224 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71287&oldid=71286 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+27) 10 > 1587461074 345365 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71288&oldid=71287 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+4) 10 < 1587461372 162818 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-178-007-125-076.178.007.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds > 1587461603 429570 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Grid14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71289&oldid=70015 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (-44) 10Use internal links for wikipedia articles rather than external references < 1587461708 668518 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tfeztlrdwllkmxbd JOIN :#esoteric < 1587462121 311425 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-084-060-190-149.084.060.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1587462616 433802 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587462706 157570 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1587462706 490122 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1587462711 153639 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1587463579 300761 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-084-060-190-149.084.060.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds > 1587464175 66501 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Saka14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71290&oldid=66469 5* 03Saka 5* (+53) 10 < 1587464385 182944 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-088-070-039-139.088.070.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1587465835 735556 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :real queston: how constraining is it, when underload strings may be at most 32 bytes lonf < 1587465841 573037 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it make the language unusable or something? < 1587465886 128521 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :What exactly do you mean by "strings"? < 1587465955 191288 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :values on the stack are strings < 1587465960 47605 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now what if < 1587465974 949157 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I limited their length to 32 bytes a string < 1587465978 804332 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :instead of unlimited bytes < 1587465985 333977 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it break Underload severely? < 1587466462 669677 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there something that prevents me from implementing my own c-style like strings on there? < 1587466518 204016 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, if the last byte is not a zero, get the next value from the stack and interpret it as a continuation of the current string < 1587466537 651657 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :slight drawback is a maximum of 31 byte overhead per string < 1587467373 860085 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Underload is hard enough (well, IMO) anyway, even without attempting to deal with a limitation like that. < 1587467768 54007 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :A lot of programs contain (...):^ where ... is a substantial chunk of the program, and that involves having ... on the stack. It's not immediately obvious how to translate that to requiring less stack size. < 1587469451 859657 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tfeztlrdwllkmxbd QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1587469609 858453 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no I don't mean that < 1587469611 864596 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :stack is unlimited < 1587469615 934514 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a size of a string is fixed < 1587469628 375062 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can push as many things onto stack as you want < 1587469637 104837 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :BUT size of a single element can't exceed certain size < 1587470016 380474 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587470025 166332 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1587470131 467851 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587470492 865668 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: was able to complete a BB(37) search with latest code. got 49 TODOs... < 1587470866 638152 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow that's exciting! < 1587470887 350898 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :kspalaiologos: That's what I meant. If you have a big outer loop, the natural construction is (...this is a long sequence of code, probably more than 32 bytes...):^ and it's not trivial (if it's even possible) to do that in pieces. < 1587470926 791333 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587472266 413315 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suspect that BB(37) = BB(35) + 2 :-( < 1587472501 853746 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the worst-case slowdown translating a turing machine into lambda calculus, I wonder? < 1587473006 394660 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.179.83.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1587474332 691783 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: it's basically functional programming... the tape becomes two stacks (cons lists), and the rest is finite control, so it's a constant factor for any fixed TM. < 1587474385 548776 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it therefore appropriate to expect BB_TM to be proportional to BB_LC? < 1587474394 539838 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1587474419 562249 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The finite control plus two stacks is a vanishingly small fragment of what LC can do. < 1587474441 84479 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But on the other hand, sizes are not comparable at all either. < 1587474515 402237 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you're explicit about the construction you'll find functions f and g (probably polynomial) such that BB_TM(n) <= BB_LC(f(n)) and BB_LC(n) <= BB_TM(g(n)). < 1587474575 429432 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But those bounds will be very coarse. < 1587474615 572434 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Because they'd be obtained by mapping lambda terms to a small fragment of Turing machines, and Turing machines to a small fragment of lambda terms.) < 1587474987 726285 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(n) <= 2*n*ceil(log_2(4*n+4))+O(1) < 1587475122 852606 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d PRIVMSG #esoteric :g(n) is probably sublinear < 1587475248 183574 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tromp: Uhm, that's a different BB_LC. < 1587475272 62679 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(One with input.) < 1587475369 76665 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The one we're currently studying (more you than I) doesn't have a dense encoding for bitstrings. < 1587475573 617478 :ArthurStrong!~ArthurStr@slow.wreckage.volia.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1587475654 381321 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d PRIVMSG #esoteric :so then the 2*n shld be replaced by 28*n < 1587475661 805564 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's easy to encode 1 bit in 4-5 bits or 2 bits in 3-7 bits. < 1587475694 902839 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do stuff like 1 (2 (1 (2 3))) for [0,1,0,1]. < 1587475724 732894 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, right < 1587475748 398367 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(4-7, not 3-7, of course) < 1587475786 695907 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you can get quite a bit more elaborate than that and get some way below 3.5 bits per bit. < 1587475829 84552 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 8/logBase 2 5 < 1587475830 824397 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 3.4454124645871445 < 1587475851 517873 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(But base 5 is ugly when talking about bitstrings.) < 1587475876 85553 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1587476170 928596 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (4.5, 5.5/2, 6.5/logBase 2 6, 7.5/3) -- actually we can reverse the meanings of 1 and 2 (or 1..4) to make sure we get an encoding that only uses the average length, even in the worst case. < 1587476173 144919 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : (4.5,2.75,2.5145432470245206,2.5) < 1587476188 639413 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh. < 1587476200 458755 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> (4.5, 5.5/2, 7/logBase 2 7, 7.5/3) < 1587476202 666159 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : (4.5,2.75,2.493450309756155,2.5) < 1587476225 903374 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I misread which base gave the optimal number of bits in this setting) < 1587476284 740765 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, 2.5 bits per bit if we encode in base 8. That's... better than expected already. < 1587476364 977366 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> [(4 + (n-1)/2) / logBase 2 n | n <- [2,4,7,8]] < 1587476367 225793 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : [4.5,2.75,2.493450309756155,2.5] < 1587477812 452228 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :kspalaiologos: my guess is that 32 bytes would be very limiting, but with a much larger constant size you could probably still implement a turing machine < 1587477827 828360 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or a finite control two-stack machine or whatnot < 1587477855 234894 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just that each of those elements will be very long because they each contain full a program for that two-stack machine, < 1587477866 293704 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but since you can write a univeral machine for that, the size is effectively constant < 1587477872 278814 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could be wrong here < 1587478023 737199 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1587478052 756711 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this would be a rather inefficient means of computation of course, worse than brainfuck < 1587478067 632970 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because I thought about implementing underload in Brainfuck < 1587478070 30684 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but now, meeeeh < 1587478091 663681 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it requires a lot of dynamic memory allocation I can't really simplify this much < 1587478238 540859 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1587480312 219330 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587481328 604846 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587481435 588684 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 JOIN :#esoteric > 1587481997 543678 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07I like frog14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71291&oldid=71188 5* 03Apollyon094 5* (+2) 10 < 1587482043 700434 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1587482274 708667 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07I like frog14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71292&oldid=71291 5* 03Apollyon094 5* (-1) 10 < 1587483088 924057 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1587483136 751629 :atslash!~atslash@46.188.0.82 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587483341 781815 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :did wolfram discover rule 30 < 1587483842 808412 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh philosophy < 1587483846 309244 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was always there < 1587483849 74159 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:9960:35:d1e4:94fc:5e34:251a PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that is one thing that is genuinely due to him. He invented the numbering scheme used for the simple 1D cellular automata. < 1587483963 118653 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I was going to ask about the numbering scheme < 1587483978 919407 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and also about who made this study systematic) < 1587484018 595201 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it blows my mind that nobody enumerated the 1d CAs before < 1587484022 817367 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:9960:35:d1e4:94fc:5e34:251a PRIVMSG #esoteric :In general, Wolfram seems to like taking credit for other people's work though, so it wouldn't really surprise me much to find out that it was someone else. < 1587484025 160773 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and noticed that rule 30 was interesting < 1587484036 284300 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that's my reason for asking < 1587484051 34391 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, who knows what people do in their basement (so to speak). < 1587484202 551187 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> The concept was originally discovered in the 1940s by Stanislaw Ulam and John von Neumann while they were contemporaries at Los Alamos National Laboratory. While studied by some throughout the 1950s and 1960s, it was not until the 1970s and Conway's Game of Life < 1587484205 777932 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : :1:39: error: parse error on input ‘in’ < 1587484255 482587 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:9960:35:d1e4:94fc:5e34:251a PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a point in time at which if you wanted to know how cellular automata would play out, your best bet would be to get some graph paper and start filling in squares < 1587484320 319711 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :im trying to look into what these 2 folks did on CA first < 1587484321 823237 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah hard to imagine doing this systematically without at least a matrix dot printer, and preferrably a pixel-oriented monitor. < 1587484413 663601 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But also the basement thing... it's easy to dismiss concrete cellular automata as a cute hobby that's not worth publishing. < 1587484647 877815 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Von_Neumann_cellular_automaton < 1587484661 286702 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like the original guys were working on 2d CAs, similar to wireworld kind of < 1587484693 267888 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine the self-replication by simple rules was the driving idea there. < 1587484866 6197 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/cellular-automata/#BrieHist < 1587485144 672599 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curtis%E2%80%93Hedlund%E2%80%93Lyndon_theorem is anyone familiar with this? < 1587485212 188347 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: we have an article at https://esolangs.org/wiki/Von_Neumann%27s_29-state_cellular_automaton too < 1587485575 575065 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is anyone reading any good new math or CS books? < 1587485999 796814 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587486673 381573 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm reading some good old maths or CS books (there's a lot of them to work through) < 1587486733 514812 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are your favorite ones? < 1587486781 81229 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Currently reading Quantum Computation and Quantum Information by Nielsen and Chuang < 1587486789 345191 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah that's a good one < 1587486790 418083 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1587486810 743412 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1587486834 13562 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d JOIN :#esoteric < 1587486950 114781 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1587487016 389640 :batman_nair!~batman_na@103.228.221.83 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587487085 623826 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ghyzuqdvajivhjps QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1587487265 886061 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1587487275 467252 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vxsogqhlxlhjgaib QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1587487327 54999 :mich181189!sid268336@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xchlnniznwjwexfe QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1587487404 393528 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles JOIN :#esoteric < 1587487440 143860 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hbquoxnigqhhniax JOIN :#esoteric < 1587487546 20988 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iszpkuvpwrnzlqms JOIN :#esoteric < 1587487569 257948 :mich181189!sid268336@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xmettwmszgwfhuak JOIN :#esoteric < 1587487620 414787 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6883:b0c3:8e60:616d QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587488219 994352 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-95-129.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1587488319 369851 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-95-129.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587488335 869983 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4980:e58a:282a:5feb JOIN :#esoteric < 1587489027 272591 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4980:e58a:282a:5feb QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587489255 330142 :atslash!~atslash@46.188.0.82 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1587489265 61436 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1587489822 397138 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.229.28 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587489890 729591 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1587489955 394383 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@77.79.179.83.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1587491223 36217 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are you reading rain1? < 1587491276 274190 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing right now! I'm trying to find something good < 1587491298 781267 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I last read a good one about basic particle physics explained via lego < 1587491810 333237 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4980:e58a:282a:5feb JOIN :#esoteric < 1587492982 976643 :batman_nair!~batman_na@103.228.221.83 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587493443 723771 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1587493892 724197 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1587493996 156896 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4980:e58a:282a:5feb QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587494023 306968 :dnm_!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jitcmpemkqzepcqv NICK :dnm < 1587494052 849671 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jitcmpemkqzepcqv NICK :Guest95546 < 1587494228 124580 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: cool, do you have a link to that? < 1587494310 943806 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've started reading these lecture notes on computablity, arithmetical hierarchy, ... https://www.comp.nus.edu.sg/~fstephan/recursiontheory-pdflatex.pdf, but have been meaning to get back at it sometime < 1587494350 114929 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1587494510 602497 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.amazon.co.uk/Particle-Physics-Brick-Ben-Still/dp/184403934X < 1587494558 22878 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :these notes look fun < 1587495891 105027 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4980:e58a:282a:5feb JOIN :#esoteric < 1587496211 749385 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would hope that some of us can make working together on making TeXnicard and on the templates. Even though I would probably write most of the C/SQL/PostScript codes myself, I would hope other people can help too, such as contributing templates, making bug reports and feature requests, examining the way the codes are written in order to complain about it, improving documentation, etc. < 1587496369 814517 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I do not know who to ask, really. < 1587496541 837848 :Guest95546!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jitcmpemkqzepcqv NICK :dnm < 1587496903 292814 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.71 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1587497413 134325 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.twitch.tv/stephen_wolfram < 1587497500 189924 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jitcmpemkqzepcqv PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: TeXnicard? < 1587498066 38237 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :dnm: It is a program to managing and rendering custom cards for games such as Magic: the Gathering. It is an alternative to Magic Set Editor. > 1587498109 395847 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07FileCode14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71293&oldid=69675 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+69) 10cat adds > 1587498940 740646 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:PythonshellDebugwindow/Sandbox14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71294&oldid=71189 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+24) 10 < 1587499159 476940 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps, I should add a frequently ask question section too. < 1587499173 52047 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a Fossil repository available at: http://zzo38computer.org/fossil/texnicard.ui < 1587499400 141306 :rain1!~debian@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1587499405 86768 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jitcmpemkqzepcqv PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Thanks for the link. Just checked out the Fossil site. < 1587499497 974153 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jitcmpemkqzepcqv PRIVMSG #esoteric :Among other things, I had never heard of Farbfeld before, so now I know something about that (mostly, that it exists). < 1587499729 813413 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The link to Farbfeld Utilities describes the file format, which is simple. Farbfeld can be a useful format to process pictures within pipes; I personally do not use it as an on disk storage format, although the inventor of the format suggested using farbfeld compressed with bzip2 as an on disk storage format. > 1587501822 327257 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Sandbox14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71295&oldid=71245 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+29) 10 > 1587501940 155902 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:PythonshellDebugwindow/Sandbox14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71296&oldid=71294 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+2384) 10/* Unnamed language 2 */ > 1587501968 797092 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:PythonshellDebugwindow/Sandbox14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71297&oldid=71296 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+0) 10/* Unnamed language 2 */ < 1587504248 601161 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote limerick < 1587504251 26605 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1587504751 103185 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote animated < 1587504752 134292 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :1107) Sgeo: oh yeah those animated characters were built into the operating system and there was an API for them < 1587504753 420178 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :unicode < 1587504762 347224 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :animated emojis < 1587504794 920217 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or just a blink attribute < 1587504805 152066 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :handled by the VGA card < 1587504857 819588 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do VGA cards even have a mode with blink attribute for text mode? blinking cursor, that I can see, but blinking characters are just annoying < 1587504867 1884 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :why'd they build that into hardware? < 1587504922 284439 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, in VGA it's mostly redundant because you could just emulate it by changing palette colors < 1587504925 622937 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but still < 1587504949 433604 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The other PC video cards have that too in text mode < 1587504954 479021 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It isn't only VGA < 1587504964 173078 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: right, but why? < 1587505014 720928 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not really sure why they put that in, although that function can be disabled. < 1587505018 64761 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing it was less of a "this is super useful" and more of a "we have this leftover attribute bit and this can be implemented with minimal hardware" < 1587505036 262617 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could be used for error messages to get the user's attention < 1587505062 261536 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, probably. ZZT also uses it for flashy water < 1587505080 186191 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or as decoration in like moves about hacking < 1587505084 149595 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the hardware supports blinking cursor then not much extra hardware is required for blinking arbitrary text < 1587505120 652989 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, although the CRTC chip they used already supports cursor blinking, and yet they didn't use it, implementing their own instead. < 1587505134 642308 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, the cursor blinking rate and text blinking rate are different (although they are synchronized). < 1587505235 916073 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh < 1587505236 901711 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1587505243 389527 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1587505256 326315 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587505273 880260 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1587505404 330768 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4551:5089:e36:8f84 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587505578 64754 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4980:e58a:282a:5feb QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1587505605 74752 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4551:5089:e36:8f84 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1587505838 589713 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587505974 374569 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1587506006 870563 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1587506302 790438 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca QUIT :Disconnected by services < 1587506309 666486 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-48-139.public.eastlink.ca JOIN :#esoteric < 1587507205 392869 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.229.28 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1587507601 14201 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4551:5089:e36:8f84 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587507898 991295 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:4551:5089:e36:8f84 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1587508222 759515 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if the time cube < 1587508227 13017 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? time cube < 1587508228 354003 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :EARTH HAS 4 CORNER SIMULTANEOUS 4-DAY TIME CUBE IN ONLY 24 HOUR ROTATION. 4 CORNER DAYS, CUBES 4 QUAD EARTH. Bible A Lie & Word Is Lies. Navel Connects 4 Corner 4s. God Is Born Of A Mother - She Left Belly B. Signature. Your dirty lying teachers use only the midnight to midnight 1 day (ignoring 3 other days) Time to not foul (already wrong) bible time. Lie that corrupts earth you educated stupid fools. < 1587508243 680110 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :teaches that Earth is a cube, then is http://www.rogermwilcox.com/square_earth.html the Time square? < 1587508469 872234 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:8072:f253:7f2b:d619 JOIN :#esoteric < 1587508657 476674 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok gn < 1587508748 840224 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:8072:f253:7f2b:d619 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1587508922 489605 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O (And how's that linked to Times Square?) < 1587510573 705112 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1587510795 139729 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, follow a road to Rome, then find the road from Times Square (which also leads to Rome) and traverse it backwards. < 1587510816 310467 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(universal directions) < 1587510883 338190 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode ⊠ < 1587510884 277033 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+22A0 SQUARED TIMES] < 1587510980 546085 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :i,i MAY YOU LIVE IN N-ARY TIMES OPERATOR < 1587511203 842870 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-50.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: oh nice > 1587512840 931471 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Sandbox14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=71298&oldid=71295 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+0) 10