< 1596240013 317501 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1596240333 552079 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1596240433 264638 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1596240733 285992 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1596243884 723023 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76360&oldid=76326 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+27) 10wording > 1596245266 311383 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76361&oldid=76360 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+1036) 10Document subfinite loops > 1596245326 127233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76362&oldid=76361 5* 03RocketRace 5* (-243) 10/* Subfinite loops */ > 1596245400 714225 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76363&oldid=76362 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10Change the . instruction to reduce ambiguity for parsing < 1596245558 186823 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you were to give a different name to 2 KiB, what would it be? > 1596245603 413193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76364&oldid=76363 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+133) 10Make subfinite loops deterministic; otherwise they are not possible to implement > 1596246095 928000 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76365&oldid=76364 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+106) 10Empty pops > 1596246345 831816 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76366&oldid=76365 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+76) 10The ~ instruction > 1596246569 648458 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76367&oldid=76366 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+136) 10Document the binding strength of + and - in literals and instructions > 1596246581 267964 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76368&oldid=76367 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10- < 1596246964 229610 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1596247003 161836 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1596247260 444185 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So in gcc, "int foo(void) { int i = 0; void bar(int d) { i += d }; bar(1); return i; }" does not make your stack executable, apparently. < 1596247289 926911 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But "int foo(void) { int i = 0; void bar(int d) { i += d }; void (*f)(int) = bar; f(1); return i; }" does. < 1596247507 218470 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1596248082 211491 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1596248435 27868 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1596248646 566350 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76369&oldid=76368 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+402) 10Computational class > 1596248670 191205 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76370&oldid=76369 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+6) 10Categorization. > 1596248738 958414 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76371&oldid=76370 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10Red links?! > 1596248851 87656 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76372&oldid=76371 5* 03RocketRace 5* (-9) 10No longer a stub. > 1596250633 839551 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07WCDA14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76373&oldid=68642 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (-691) 10Some changes, more to come. < 1596250844 447420 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596250871 699971 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that the compiler can optimize it, although the second case could be possible to be optimized too (even if it currently doesn't), but can "volatile" be added? < 1596251009 882717 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net PART :#esoteric < 1596251139 478482 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1596251885 241097 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1596253410 430003 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596253525 264714 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1596253525 408406 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1596255633 968593 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596255725 552923 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1596255789 621122 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1596257344 423743 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596257637 395712 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1596257698 379966 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1596257773 195642 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1596258728 473170 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operator-precedence_parser#Pseudocode looks way too complicated. Why does it have two nested loops? Is that necessary somehow? My parser only has one loop. < 1596259394 858910 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the answer is that someone put up that code on Wikipedia in 2006 and it just stayed there since then, and I shouldn't go to Wikipedia for algorithms. < 1596259709 437921 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or maybe it's to limit the stack depth? < 1596260000 303062 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did anyone mention it on the talk page? < 1596260320 310405 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes the first six astrological signs are designated as "learn" and the other six as "share", but I think would be better "northern signs" and "southern signs", since, the first six signs are north of the equator, and last six signs are south of the equator. (As can be seen on the map, the "Tropic of Cancer" and "Tropic of Capricorn".) < 1596260484 963989 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, I do see someone making the exact complaint in the talk page, I missed it at first. < 1596260584 402964 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596260624 939947 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1596260647 220002 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I see why they do this now, but it doesn't seem like a great explanation. < 1596260719 668797 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1596260905 471848 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1596261725 224493 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1596262553 867348 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1596263834 592808 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596263885 456953 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596264086 455070 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1596264115 994870 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1596264518 432537 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596264959 801740 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric > 1596266270 276045 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Nezbednik 5* 10New user account > 1596266630 387094 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76374&oldid=76356 5* 03Nezbednik 5* (+264) 10 < 1596267352 946602 :shinh!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp JOIN :#esoteric < 1596268313 173524 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1596268373 713495 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1596269301 647339 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1596269423 787552 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1596269440 246114 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76375&oldid=76198 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+127) 10/* Medium */ < 1596273728 351031 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric > 1596273767 202815 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Math&Matrix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76376&oldid=76355 5* 03FLeckami21 5* (+742) 10 > 1596274663 409029 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Math&Matrix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76377&oldid=76376 5* 03FLeckami21 5* (-87) 10/* Matrix form */ < 1596275076 211291 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Quit: reboot > 1596275145 258777 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Babalang14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76378&oldid=76310 5* 03FLeckami21 5* (+18) 10Add Babalang into 2020 category < 1596275157 193055 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1596275832 230074 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1596277204 100278 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1596279484 106820 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric > 1596280348 448998 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76379&oldid=76375 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+314) 10/* Hard */ < 1596281176 460485 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: how does that thing with gcc-style local function definitions even compile without the auto keyword? < 1596281221 935764 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why would auto do anything? Where? < 1596281225 393672 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :adu: halfpage < 1596281254 862309 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe you need auto only to declare a local function before defining it? < 1596281258 390895 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me check the manual < 1596281272 880501 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I never use gcc local functions < 1596281353 91120 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neither do I. < 1596281370 454027 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I saw someone suggesting to use them and I was all, like, whoa, dude, that'll make your stack executable (if you know what I mean). < 1596281375 858861 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-10.2.0/gcc/Nested-Functions.html#Nested-Functions sorry, you only need the auto to declare a nested function early < 1596281409 384941 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder whether I should get in the habit of always declaring my functions extern or static. < 1596281584 402006 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm reading BCPL compiler source code. < 1596281612 255747 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What was the first context of the style of precedence parser called "precedence climbing" or "Pratt-style" or various other names? > 1596281718 737974 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unleash14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76380&oldid=76358 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+231) 10Add a new example and fix instruction description > 1596283525 698713 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unleash14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76381&oldid=76380 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+267) 10Another example > 1596283657 788743 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unleash14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76382&oldid=76381 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (-6) 10 < 1596284543 863494 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1596286017 568216 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76383&oldid=76379 5* 03D 5* (+212) 10/* Legendary */ > 1596286028 479126 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76384&oldid=76383 5* 03D 5* (-1) 10/* COME BACK LYXAL!!! */ < 1596286062 57656 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596287776 824311 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1596288362 884267 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1596288381 985771 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1596289496 430681 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1596291903 263599 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1596294658 582349 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1596294661 666927 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1596294808 960470 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1596296586 5504 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596296765 327768 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1596296774 320133 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1596296836 72062 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, the B language supported single-statement functions without curly braces. < 1596296858 865635 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The manual gives this example: "char(s,n) return((s[n/4]>>(27-9*(n%4)))&0777);" < 1596296883 266324 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i hate that in "if" already < 1596296972 678485 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :... that example < 1596297288 611131 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's an untyped language. < 1596297328 144041 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like how it uses "x =- y;" instead of "x -= y;" < 1596297363 303901 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's confusing < 1596297386 494097 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :do x = -y and x =- y behave differently? < 1596297396 178074 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1596297401 536624 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ew < 1596297409 489676 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh man, extern variables are declared with "extrn". < 1596297417 455198 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :C is positively luxurious with its vowels. < 1596297425 205679 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :gotta save those bytes < 1596297440 819958 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: if it's an untyped language, why does it have functions that return char? < 1596297446 528648 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or is char the function name? < 1596297451 577130 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :its the name < 1596297452 527770 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :char is the function name. < 1596297454 535462 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1596297456 119738 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the function is not anonymous < 1596297465 960137 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.bell-labs.com/usr/dmr/www/btut.html < 1596297531 694472 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want a typeless compiled language that uses even less vowels, look at Viktor Toth's W language (I think there's a wiki entry) < 1596297542 361513 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Strings are terminated by ASCII EOT (U+0003)? Exciting. < 1596297552 457262 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :nopw, no wiki entry < 1596297574 651128 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :www.vttoth.com/w.htm then < 1596297630 235772 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :links without protocols make my terminal sad < 1596297700 393740 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :This manual has a section called "Function nesting". < 1596297719 670031 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it'd be some fancy feature that C doesn't have. But it turns out they mean you can write things like putchar(getchar()). < 1596297748 396180 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which, to be fair, the idea of expressions is one of the major features of high-level languages! < 1596297766 39479 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, but it has to be supported by the compiler < 1596297821 915198 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"W may be elegant but it's also practical." < 1596297846 419722 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"i am intelligent as well as humble" < 1596298385 16022 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there any programming languages based on string diagrams? < 1596298426 335823 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I disagree with that C is luxurious with vowels: strcpy, strcmp, strncmp, strchr, strspn, tmpnam, SIGABRT, SIGCHLD/SIGCLD, SIGTSTP, SIGPWR, BUFSIZ, ESRCH, SHRT_MAX, FLT_MAX, mknod, and the most infamous examples creat < 1596298479 590503 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, most of those are library features rather than keywords. < 1596298497 718026 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, they all are < 1596298510 173101 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the joke I was going for was that C is known not to be luxurious with its vowels. So it's funny for B to be even more so. < 1596298512 74273 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but most of them are from K&R < 1596298520 77404 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah I see < 1596298528 708809 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even less so? < 1596298534 204702 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: what do you consider a string diagram? < 1596298534 889871 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Do you count languages that use index notation? < 1596298553 292652 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's possible to argue for Prolog here, though it's a bit of a stretch. < 1596298604 454776 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, and there's sbrk < 1596298630 889815 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :luckily we're rid of creat now, instead we have a versatile vararg function < 1596298842 748026 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :statc cnst extrn dbl x; // please ignore mixing static and extern in the same declaration < 1596298912 927148 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I write "int const x;" instead of "const int x;"? < 1596298918 607550 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, actually. < 1596298935 577656 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's beautiful by the way, in unix, the creat function is obsolete, you create or open files with open; in winapi, the OpenFile function is obsolete, and you create or open files with CreateFile < 1596298939 475477 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is more cosistent with "int const *const p;", for example. < 1596298958 13433 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :That consistency was why I was typing up "maybe". < 1596298984 205522 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I think the FAQ answer to that is "it doesn't matter, do whatever you want", same as with `char *x` versus `char* x` < 1596299000 609468 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, "char *x" is clearly better, because it follows the grammar of the language. < 1596299010 336258 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always write `const int x;` and `char *x` these days, but it's your preference < 1596299015 411064 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just like "sizeof x" is better than "sizeof(x)" < 1596299030 93534 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it's fine to have preferences, but that doesn't mean all preferences are equal. < 1596299040 284114 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: those are not the same though < 1596299051 252859 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`sizeof x` versus `sizeof(x)` < 1596299053 5338 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :sizeof? No such file or directory < 1596299057 680372 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1596299060 30444 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. For types I write "sizeof (T)" < 1596299060 135604 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1596299067 390228 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just don't write `int static x;`, because "the placement of a storage-class specifier other than at the beginning of the declaration specifiers in a declaration is an obsolescent feature" (C11 6.11.5p1). < 1596299069 275274 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, "should I prefer X to Y" can still have a useful answer. < 1596299087 360793 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm pretty irritated that gcc warns about "struct Foo { ... } typedef Foo;" < 1596299097 723016 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd think that you only have to write char* x, y; once and get confused before you switch to char *x, *y; forever ;) < 1596299099 262536 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I used to write all my struct typedefs like that. < 1596299125 960536 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Since typedef is a storage-class specifier, I think that's an obsolescent feature too. < 1596299133 128519 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It sure is. < 1596299142 274471 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What a great storage class. < 1596299161 175448 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can only say my preferences. I write `char *x;` and `const int x;` and `char * < 1596299170 50707 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :f(char *) < 1596299171 397706 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :{` < 1596299200 300637 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i prefer not to write c < 1596299215 74327 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, but C seems like a big upgrade over B. < 1596299217 877616 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: no no, I write these in C++ < 1596299224 659184 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So your suggestion of writing B instead doesn't sound right. < 1596299232 777370 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: okay, in that case, i _would_ prefer writing c < 1596299296 5106 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes, that's because an angel visited K&R and told them about the original language used in heaven that would inspire C, and K&R remembered that and became prophets and copied as much of that language as they could remember in C. it's not a perfect copy, but they got a lot of good features from that. < 1596299541 687378 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: does the story continue with Stroustrup getting a visit from the devil? < 1596299569 694891 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :...it would explain a lot... < 1596299580 460191 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the string diagrams that I was thinking of is also called Penrose notation < 1596299622 7541 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, this is pretty good. < 1596299623 316597 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: what about cat's cradle < 1596299629 206993 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :All error messages are two characters long. < 1596299636 616095 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1596299643 100342 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that was my `ed` impression) < 1596299644 245907 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :In B. < 1596299651 368011 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I don't know < 1596299652 870733 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah. < 1596299677 669782 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: Penrose's paper that talks about those diagrams also talks about abstract index notation. < 1596299682 777408 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And introduced both, maybe?) < 1596299688 277785 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's good, I like that paper. < 1596299808 742349 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I think you can argue that something like Prolog counts. < 1596300238 429413 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1596300388 166130 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1596301184 60740 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, right, they recommend making the first six characters of function and extern variable names unique. < 1596301188 492694 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good reason for the economy. < 1596301293 109256 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that's because of ancient linkers. C also recommends that. even seebs' IAQ references that. < 1596301309 899233 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right, I remember seeing that before. < 1596301366 836918 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.seebs.net/faqs/c-iaq.html#question-10.8\ < 1596301370 325114 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :argh < 1596301371 641270 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.seebs.net/faqs/c-iaq.html#question-10.8 < 1596301446 946555 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why the C threading and thread synchronization functions (which nobody uses, because we already had pthreads, windows threads API, a pthreads compatibility layer for the windows threads API, boost threads, and eventually also the C++ threads library) have such silly names < 1596301667 118116 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The best thread API is Linux clone(2) < 1596301683 170107 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is so good that you can only call the system call from assembly, not from C using the syscall wrapper. < 1596301694 421520 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what < 1596301698 309008 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's one of the low-level calls that implement pthread functinos < 1596301715 993992 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd never call it directly < 1596301722 254822 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, not for threading < 1596301726 781683 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for namespaces, sure < 1596301740 607620 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What if you aren't using libc? < 1596301747 917940 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pthreads is done quite well, there's no need to use the low-level stuff < 1596301766 449543 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: do you mean no libc on linux, or no libc on windows? < 1596301777 509842 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :On Linux. < 1596301788 328187 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :On Windows you'd use the Window thread API either way presumably. < 1596301794 349212 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think I ever do that. that's for esoteric stuff only. < 1596301807 702267 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, on windows I'd use one of the wrappers that I mentioned above < 1596301823 509767 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is called CreateThread. The OpenThread API is deprecated, whereas in Unix the situation is reversed. < 1596301833 750708 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, avoiding libc doesn't seem that esoteric to me. < 1596301850 852288 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Compiling programs for Linux that are backward compatible is already a pain. < 1596301940 581952 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe not esoteric, but then it's not really useful for the programs that I want to write < 1596301957 639163 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for linux, again < 1596301966 633555 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :linux userspace < 1596302012 944618 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Usually the glibc wrappers around Linux system calls are worse APIs than the system calls themselves. < 1596302022 458618 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :clone is an exception, I suppose. < 1596302041 511605 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but pthreads is rather carefully designed < 1596302054 372392 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has all sorts of limitations to not add overheads for features that you don't use < 1596302060 278269 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, that's the theory < 1596302063 932544 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The reason you can't use clone to create threads yourself is that it returns twice in the same thread, but in the same address space, so you don't want both threads to continue executing and using the stack.) < 1596302164 959765 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: that's why you also can't use vfork, right? < 1596302193 34725 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you're allowed to use vfork and use the stack. < 1596302242 885672 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in both children? < 1596302243 549866 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The original process is suspended until you exec, so modifying unused stack memory is not so bad. < 1596302265 484952 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You just can't modify anything else. < 1596302275 276203 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1596302280 128855 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I dunno how these things work tehn < 1596302294 379824 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe I should use vfork more. < 1596302331 52453 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, posix_spawn, which I use when possible, uses clone(CLONE_VFORK) on glibc. < 1596302338 10759 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's not so bad. < 1596302349 651686 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it actualyl guaranteed that it stays stopped, as opposed to that being just an optimization that happens in the common case, but not always happening? < 1596302353 958588 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Too bad fork/vfork/clone is a silly API. < 1596302373 591953 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Guaranteed by what? < 1596302378 152783 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the kernel < 1596302399 168177 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :posix_spawn is implemented by glibc, it can do all sorts of ugly stuff that I don't want to see. < 1596302419 387790 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The parent thread is suspended according to the man page. < 1596302436 464463 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other threads may continue to run. < 1596302440 953620 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, but does it remain suspended? < 1596302459 217951 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"vfork() differs from fork(2) in that the calling thread is suspended until the child terminates (either normally, by calling _exit(2), or abnormally, after delivery of a fatal signal), or it makes a call to execve(2)." < 1596302527 377913 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought there was like a 30 year old email where Linus threatens everyone that if they abuse vfork, he'll make it a synonym of fork, and I think that's still canon, in that if a future kernel does that, you keep the pieces < 1596302553 950943 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right, if that happens, the two children have a stack each < 1596302555 306724 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry < 1596302595 485541 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, vfork is very restricted in what it can do. fork would be a valid implementation. < 1596302611 347384 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote this wrapper around posix_spawn: https://slbkbs.org/tmp/dspawn.h < 1596302655 89156 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But then I never ended up using it. < 1596303122 523881 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't like vfork() and had idea implementing cfork() instead, which is different in some ways, such as registers being shared too; in this case it is possible for execve to return 0 if it is successful < 1596303398 907290 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :My preference would be to abandon fork entirely. It's mostly silly. < 1596303410 798788 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Instead, have system calls to create threads or processes directly. < 1596303432 71909 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :One way to get the benefits of fork would be to allow some system calls to affect other processes. < 1596303466 977097 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1596303474 721778 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So you could create a blank process, and then tell it to open, dup2, etc., and then to execve. < 1596303622 187796 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Being able to call e.g. mmap in another process's address space would also be useful for debuggers. < 1596303639 604784 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows's VirtualAllocEx takes a process handle argument. < 1596303764 336246 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :being able to call mmap on another process's address space would be useful for attacking software > 1596303978 360500 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Abbin21 5* 10New user account > 1596304362 981105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76385&oldid=76374 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+296) 10/* Introductions */ < 1596306662 207761 :ineiros!ineiros@kapsi.fi QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1596307045 208638 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1596307333 317974 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1596308847 213743 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1596309194 642213 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1596310284 228775 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Won't that make the interface for open/dup2/etc complicated though? > 1596314496 408430 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76386 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+1902) 10Created page with "== Operators and INTs == There are four operators in casinii, which are represented by the four colors of playing cards.
 /\ | /\/\ |  o  |  /\ \/ | \  / | o|o | /  \..."
> 1596314533 245184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76387&oldid=76386 5* 03Abbin21 5* (-1) 10
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< 1596315733 448910 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Well, maybe you can have a "run system call in child" interface, though you probably want to limit it.
< 1596316216 526748 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but then you also want to check the error that the system call returns
< 1596316230 263696 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so eventually it's easier to just have fork than to have some insane interface 
< 1596316530 817654 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is what I think my "cfork" would be better. For compatibility with other programs, you can also define the macro:   #define fork() (cfork()?:detach())
< 1596316550 661580 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
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< 1596317502 362838 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: If you fork you still have to check the error.
< 1596317525 962239 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes, but then you can, because you still have a program running
< 1596317526 182511 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596317543 961053 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't have to rewrite your normal ifs to some extra kernel interface that you have to learn
< 1596317549 751666 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can just write normal code
< 1596317741 503713 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, if you fork, then you can check the error normally. However, the normal fork() function it is a bit difficult for the parent to detect errors in the child process, I think. So, fork is good, and for some purposes, cfork is a better alternative.
< 1596317748 627031 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't follow.
< 1596317772 431347 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, there are many options. posix_spawn lets you specify open/close/dup2 actions and doesn't even let you check for errors.
< 1596317796 375651 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is cfork?
< 1596317807 547344 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't seem to have something called "posix_spawn" in my computer
< 1596317883 18030 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: posix_spawn is a windows thing, a crutch because they don't have a real fork, but gives a sort-of unix-like interface rather than a winapi interface
< 1596317890 273232 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is not a system call, just a POSIX API for running programs.
< 1596317891 845196 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually it also exists on linux)
< 1596317934 661014 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :posix_spawn is a Windows thing? I am skeptical.
< 1596317983 51971 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Windows implemented fork in the kernel for WSL1.
< 1596318054 726942 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/research/uploads/prod/2019/04/fork-hotos19.pdf
< 1596318107 951045 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well cfork would be a bit like vfork, but improved; it returns either 0 to the child process, or -1 to the parent process in case it can't fork (it won't do both), and then exec or detach or _exit will return to the parent process (detach returns to both the child and parent process; exec and _exit return only to the parent process). Until the parent process resumes, the memory, registers, stack, etc are shared.
< 1596318120 474384 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is what it is. Can it be understand now?
< 1596318155 845513 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the benefit of allowing detach?
< 1596318159 949862 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(You can then also see why fork() is the same as (cfork()?:detach()); this also explains the return value of detach(). I can also provide other example if wanted.)
< 1596318165 156739 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems like it'd make the implementation a good deal more complicated.
< 1596318302 553800 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, since some programs may use fork(), and in some cases it is more useful than cfork(), too; maybe you might also want to change other things before detaching (or to more easily report some things from initialization to the parent before detaching).
< 1596318335 855468 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, that is why, instead of a fork() system call, it is just implemented as (cfork()?:detach()) instead.
> 1596318974 284665 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76388&oldid=76387 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+59) 10
> 1596319024 461490 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76389&oldid=76388 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+62) 10
< 1596319038 556538 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
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> 1596324949 557809 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Casini14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76390 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+225) 10Created page with "==Example== Wouldn't the example represent 54 + 9 * 54, since diamonds represent multiplication? If so, do operations in Casini follow BEMDAS? - ~~~~"
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> 1596326467 701741 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76391&oldid=76384 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-6) 10/* COME BACK LYXAL!!! */ Removed two more bytes
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< 1596327889 850503 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
> 1596328008 583331 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Math&Matrix14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76392 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+251) 10Created page with "I feel like this language should be more related to math itself. It seems to haved syntax represented with "matrix" but real math doesn't do much. ~~~~"
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< 1596331651 776275 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Idea: Machine with infinitely wide Möbius band as memory. It can only write one symbol onto the band, which looks like ^, but if it walks around in the finite direction and makes its way back to that cell, it will see v instead.
< 1596331748 326906 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I like that idea, make up something with that, or perhaps to put in list of ideas in wiki, maybe
< 1596331968 284823 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
> 1596332579 235130 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76393&oldid=76391 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+172) 10/* Do-while loop */
< 1596332693 571762 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: is that basically like a turing machine with one tape and three symbols where the head can only write over blank cells?
< 1596332726 280605 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :It can also write over filled cells, I think
< 1596332735 440054 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it can only write ^
< 1596332749 331393 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you can have both ^ and v in the same cell?
< 1596332758 484295 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it'll just replace what's in the cell
< 1596332764 452481 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh
< 1596333728 776520 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:855:f94d:7217:96e6 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596334168 488185 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1596335092 243251 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: Cute
< 1596335249 58159 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :posix_spawn() IIRC was spec'd just to give an interface that can have some of the perf benefits from vfork() without having the utter specification nightmare
< 1596335290 605073 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and on good implementations, for things that can be done with posix_spawn it will use vfork() or something analogous for implementation)
< 1596336976 686312 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would seem that opponent can pay life to protect your lands too, with the Magic: the Gathering card "Cleansing"; sometimes this is useful.
< 1596337090 444637 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(See https://allthetropes.org/wiki/Topic:Vr9ekwbia7l4g6jp for one example)
> 1596337373 486889 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76394&oldid=76393 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-205) 10/* Hard */
< 1596337470 46973 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Too bad the posix_spawn API is awful.
< 1596337479 601076 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is.
< 1596337505 251469 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :My wrapper is a bit better at least.
< 1596337532 680848 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do they actually expect people to check error conditions a for every file action and everything?
< 1596337555 40805 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is a great idea
< 1596337577 71488 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :When the main way these things can fail is ENOMEM.
> 1596337626 766214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76395&oldid=76394 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-85) 10/* Equality */
< 1596337754 808438 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes
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< 1596339919 44981 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1596340819 635203 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sprunge.us/VRsf3B Do you like this? Do you have other ideas please?
> 1596342119 181761 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PRASCAL14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76396 5* 03Salpynx 5* (+2093) 10Stub for a high-level `Pataphysical programming language based on PASCAL, from 2016
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> 1596342381 576640 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76397&oldid=76395 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+75) 10
> 1596346042 403390 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76398&oldid=76397 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+24) 10/* Hard */
< 1596346121 587780 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Apparently, someone said that the best design of Unix is that a line break is only one byte.
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< 1596365756 674915 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that's akin to saying that Ferrari has the best cars because they're red.
< 1596366286 955458 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596368503 832191 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1596371414 645382 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1596372222 767566 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596374698 463786 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: unix isn't the only thing that's designed in a way that the terminal device replaces the line separtor to a crlf on output (because that's what line printers want) and a cr with a line separator on input (because cr is what the keyboard gives). older platforms just do it more sanely by using the cr as the line separator, which means there's only one replacement.
< 1596374883 869442 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1596379639 161452 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
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< 1596381467 580855 :MDude!~MDude@74.5.140.76 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596381638 197628 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
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< 1596383037 743656 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596383258 8215 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1596383258 262479 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596385992 151532 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: OK, although I just mentioned what someone else said, whether or not it is any good.
< 1596386037 796803 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Yes, although I thought I remembered seeing that Unix was designed with using with terminals having keys for both carriage return and line feed, but either one would do in many cases.
< 1596386180 552256 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596386218 62088 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: and some keyboards have backspace so you don't have to press shift-left-arrow to go left one position then delete to delete a character. what luxury!
< 1596386655 709228 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is the road to anarchy.
< 1596386818 786424 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :just 26 letters, 10 digits, a space bar, and three modifiers, on a cheap foil keyboard, where you have to wait for the cpu to process your previous key to press the next one. who needs backspace?
< 1596390058 281740 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596391982 739679 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-104-154.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596392948 569834 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like the ideas I posted before about a role playing game and do you have some further ideas?
< 1596393928 130845 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit
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< 1596396765 556829 :grumble!~Thunderbi@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Quit: Just put a quit message down and we'll change it later. Seriously Kevin, just goddamn put something. No, not what I just said. A quit message ffs
< 1596397155 340084 :grumble!~Thunderbi@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596399685 46582 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Nicerobot 5*  10New user account
< 1596399887 646852 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: did you know that 2.5937424601^2.85311670611 = 2.85311670611^2.5937424601?
< 1596399887 792587 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: and the channel wasn't active
> 1596400055 117857 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76399&oldid=76385 5* 03Nicerobot 5* (+126) 10Introduction
> 1596400065 947179 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Nicerobot14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76400 5* 03Nicerobot 5* (+5) 10Created page with "Nice!"
< 1596400366 20650 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, there's like a whole one-parameter solution for that thing
< 1596400404 333478 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: yeah that's what I've (re-)discovered, and been playing with.
< 1596400422 42723 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found this one cute because despite the use of decimal points it's exact.
< 1596400432 143549 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: oh
< 1596400463 22837 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :a = (1+1/k)^k, b = (1+1/k)^(k+1) (note the connection to e) satisfy a^b = b^a; I took k=10.
< 1596400500 659117 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :something like that
< 1596400641 193238 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :bonus: k must be an integer (which we can take to be positive) for both a and b to be rational.
< 1596401604 116220 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: rebooting
< 1596401658 27985 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596401804 623443 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596401815 708565 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :test
< 1596401855 154809 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`relcome AidanBaidicoot 
< 1596401857 96899 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​09AidanBaidicoot: 02Welcome 06to 13the 04international 07hub 08for 09esoteric 02programming 06language 13design 04and 07deployment! 08For 09more 02information, 06check 13out 04our 07wiki: 08. 09(For 02the 06other 13kind 04of 07esoterica, 08try 09#esoteric 02on 06EFnet 13or 04DALnet.)
< 1596401914 435800 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have been here before I was just checking if anyone from the esolangs discord was here yet. the admin is being annoying and so we are testing out a move
< 1596401983 720030 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? discord
< 1596401985 446870 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :The unofficial Esolangs and code golf Discord server: https://discord.gg/3UXSK5p
< 1596401986 185447 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this one?
< 1596402017 49257 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep
< 1596402021 45207 :Anima!4d95aaad@173.170.149.77.rev.sfr.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596402031 26518 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596402050 125814 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596402066 404097 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :greetings, apioids.
< 1596402074 367994 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :greetings
< 1596402085 179086 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, palaiologos runs this? Hmmm.
< 1596402106 345669 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think she does but idk. she keeps logs afaik
< 1596402134 145896 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know much about IRC. Do channels have a single "owner"?
< 1596402139 527401 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think so.
< 1596402174 141271 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, there was someone who kept logs, who were they?
< 1596402195 994723 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The esolangs website has logs.
< 1596402196 500340 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :palaiologos once said she keeps logs
< 1596402198 380163 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it says so in the topic.
< 1596402203 883367 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also my crawler found them by accident.
< 1596402221 217176 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :osmarks: no, palaiologos is one of the three people who keeps logs
< 1596402224 471022 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? logs
< 1596402226 148406 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​#esoteric channel logs: https://esolangs.org/logs/ http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/?C=M;O=D http://codu.org/logs/_esoteric/ https://github.com/KrzysztofSzewczyk/esologs/
< 1596402232 570916 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ three of those are active, one is historical only
< 1596402266 384574 :AidanBaidicoot!~AidanBaid@cpc85744-newc19-2-0-cust224.16-2.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, thank you.
< 1596402315 104271 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting.
< 1596402366 307618 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, some people (such as myself) do not like Discord, and IRC is better. As for who owns it, whether or not that is the case can depend on the IRC server and on the channel registration; Freenode has channel registration, so you can examine it using the CS command (try CS HELP for help about how to do it).
< 1596402563 365537 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Discord and IRC are fundamentally different and hard to compare.
< 1596402586 184810 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Discord has tons of features I like that IRC lacks
< 1596402612 528544 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In some cases, it is true, in some cases, people think so but actually it isn't true.
< 1596402628 891485 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's because IRC is a tool, Discord is a framework. we're unix guys, we like tools.
< 1596402633 807804 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tools that do one thing.
< 1596402895 910672 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the one hand, IRC is a network protocol designed in 1989 and it shows.
< 1596402909 754186 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the other hand, IRC is a network protocol designed in 1989 and it shows.
< 1596402930 470475 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :^
< 1596402942 62277 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Find me a programmer with one hand!
< 1596402944 544850 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRC can be used even without the IRC software (although, use of IRC software is helpful)
< 1596402956 323693 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION has done so, in fact
< 1596402964 272334 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by IRC software?
< 1596402968 605978 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so many PONGs
< 1596402972 277868 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :mhm
< 1596403017 66941 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that means the protocol is simple enough for client side and made of mostly stuff that is optional for clients, so you can implement your own software
< 1596403025 10867 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :An IRC client that speaks the IRC protocol so you don't have to worry about the commands (like "PRIVMSG #esoteric :so much text")
< 1596403054 833531 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, PONG is one reason why IRC software is helpful, since if you do not have it, then you would have to write PONG manually instead.
< 1596403089 390339 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Separating messages by target is also very helpful. So... yes, you *can* use netcat but it's not fun at all.
< 1596403159 191379 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what hole?
< 1596403180 508585 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Couldn't you *technically* use Discord with a custom client the same way? It's not an open protocol, so you'd have to reverse engineer it. Or use the public API which might have somewhat reduced functionality.
< 1596403181 525365 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :just walk
< 1596403190 760668 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, wrong channel again
< 1596403205 196484 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sinthorion: perhaps you could, but it's much more complicated
< 1596403222 980952 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :And unlike with IRC, not an intended property of how things work
< 1596403244 783265 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is a decision with upsides and downsides both.
< 1596403259 134076 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1596403286 252460 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, although Discord is complicated and proprietary, and is only a single company, and other problems, and still needs some client software; IRC can be used even without any client software.
< 1596403448 387346 :Sinthorion!54389b8e@dslb-084-056-155-142.084.056.pools.vodafone-ip.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've never seen an IRC channel not on Freenode. So while technically it can be hosted by any organisation, the fact is that everyone still uses the same.
< 1596403481 525962 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have seen other IRC networks, but mostly Freenode.
< 1596403632 377869 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've seen more IRC channels on freenode than on the dozen or so other IRC networks that I ever joined taken all together
< 1596403653 427268 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, same with me
< 1596403676 502164 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I currently have no IRC service in my computer, but I do have a NNTP server, and implemented a nonstandard command for convenience of people who are not using NNTP software, too.
< 1596403777 969471 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Because, I think that IRC and NNTP are much better than many of the more modern stuff.)
< 1596403779 697930 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :NNTP? Isn't that usenet?
< 1596403784 666703 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. very ancient?
< 1596403795 525369 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm currently on 3 distinct IRC networks.
< 1596403821 74356 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :osmarks: Yes, although it is still in use, and improvements have been made since the original version.
< 1596403849 492063 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Actually, I may be responsible for increasing the article numbers from 31-bits to 63-bits.)
< 1596403892 925832 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like how IRC gets a lot of new optional features all the time too
< 1596403910 959302 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I suppose so.
< 1596403954 395273 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the good part is that they're all optional so you can support only the ones you want on your client
< 1596403964 732515 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the bad part is that many of them differ from network to network
< 1596403972 308850 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, is good that it is optional.
< 1596404062 95331 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, the server often includes help files, and commands can be entered manually, so it isn't too much problem.
< 1596404144 230105 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :tradeoffs!
< 1596405168 139466 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sadly the help file doesn't tell about everything
< 1596405181 599170 :spirulina!6db636d5@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.109.182.54.213 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596405195 668788 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some of the other stuff will be mentioned in the RFC
< 1596405345 471140 :spirulina!6db636d5@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.109.182.54.213 PART :#esoteric
< 1596405870 931397 :Anima!4d95aaad@173.170.149.77.rev.sfr.net PART :#esoteric
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> 1596412164 638544 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76401&oldid=76399 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+265) 10/* Introductions */
> 1596412363 998720 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76402&oldid=57291 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+121) 10/* The Instruction set */
> 1596412533 995365 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76403&oldid=76402 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+390) 10/* The Instruction set */
> 1596412586 722126 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76404&oldid=76403 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+6) 10/* The Instruction set */
> 1596412610 507211 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76405&oldid=76404 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+5) 10/* The Instruction set */
> 1596412632 32629 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76406&oldid=76405 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+5) 10/* The Instruction set */
> 1596412682 109364 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76407&oldid=76406 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+101) 10/* The Instruction set */
> 1596415536 180411 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:JonoCode937414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76408&oldid=70795 5* 03JonoCode9374 5* (+69) 10
> 1596417969 164342 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76409&oldid=76372 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+319) 10Clarify that this is not super-turing complete
> 1596418032 962327 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76410&oldid=76409 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10Turing-complete => Turing complete
< 1596418094 101841 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody interested in working on an esolang project.
< 1596418659 266758 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-45.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1596418922 607628 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76411&oldid=76410 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+1) 10infinite -> subfinite
> 1596418936 631417 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76412&oldid=76411 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+1) 10/* Control flow operations */
> 1596418980 424287 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76413&oldid=76412 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10/* Surreal literals */
< 1596418996 186573 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What esolang project is that?
< 1596419656 968429 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :idk, maybe, maybe not
< 1596419662 670067 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :been a while since i esolanged
< 1596420062 136178 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596420440 71131 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1596420729 963695 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would want to know what esolang project it is, and then maybe we can know the answer.
< 1596420785 552448 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it involves writing a bunch of stuff on top of what amounts to a thue interpreter.
< 1596421220 367600 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:ccad:82f4:31a5:ba55 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596421719 885242 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK
< 1596421850 83620 :lifthrasiir!~lifthrasi@ec2-52-79-98-81.ap-northeast-2.compute.amazonaws.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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< 1596425289 709119 :salpynx!794954f8@121.73.84.248 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm interested in hearing more about the esolang project based on Thue.
< 1596425321 10261 :salpynx!794954f8@121.73.84.248 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been playing with using substitution lists to interpret different languages. I'm working on something that can take a list of substitutions and interpret a language from that, using extended regexes. SKI beta-reduction and substitution based bf interpretation are the current targets.
< 1596425480 348196 :salpynx!794954f8@121.73.84.248 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"bunch of stuff on top of what amounts to a thue interpreter" sounds potentially similar?
< 1596426324 278422 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596426345 276237 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596426404 197920 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
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> 1596426894 803188 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07PureBrainz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76414&oldid=75361 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+84) 10added repo link
< 1596427662 802109 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :salpynx: yeah, I have a feeling you'd be interested. pm me if you want details.
< 1596428284 204896 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's gonna be building a tower of successive abstractions that reduce to rewrite rules to be run on an interpreter that can do rule matching in parallel.
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< 1596441396 231120 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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< 1596443254 972755 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596443379 587398 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596444611 145261 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm missing the daily Schlockmercenary update...
< 1596444618 508588 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: entertain me
< 1596444618 616239 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: ( now implement it. :)
< 1596444622 125410 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ouch
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< 1596450783 765727 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596451667 623920 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-jjovwkvpqsqqizvl QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596451749 959694 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr QUIT :Read error: No route to host
< 1596452684 591539 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-qnwdyanvdtmkobxb JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596454801 52170 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:4d4e:177d:a42f:7920 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596454912 791095 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh did I mention that I had an opportunity to use the Pause key last week... still works, such fun.
< 1596455002 731742 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use the pause/break key several times every day.
< 1596455009 829881 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because I couldn't remember (possibly I never knew) how to enable the pager in grub.
< 1596455027 254861 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, I've bound the "lock screen" action to it, since it's what I press when it's time to take a break. So maybe that doesn't count.
< 1596455093 224997 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have not bound anything to it somehow...
< 1596455136 579353 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only problem is, laptop keyboards tend not to have it, so I need to have a redundant binding (mod-shift-l) for the laptop use case.
< 1596455144 612582 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I did mean in the good(?) old-fashioned way that pauses a real mode program as long as the standard BIOS keyboard interrupt is in use. (Or does grub emulate that... either way it worked.)
< 1596455253 224518 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mod3-L here, where Mod3 is Caps_Lock
< 1596455444 833599 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596455832 881383 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596469531 565139 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596469731 989537 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596471414 430244 :osmarks!~osmarks@2a00:23c7:5415:d300:c5b6:68c5:de34:b3b4 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1596471533 113244 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"if you want to learn about conditional jump instructions, turn to chapter 8 (page 190)"
< 1596471552 426356 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, do we have a wisdom like that?
< 1596471572 894009 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also 
< 1596471575 741447 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1209
< 1596471578 97252 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1209.html: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas
< 1596471826 162069 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596472217 952888 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596473039 306088 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596473542 520393 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596474779 708588 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596475214 596562 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596475402 857648 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596477434 194243 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think we have a wisdom exactly like that. We have a subversion of the obvious recursion joke, though, which is in the same general area of things.
< 1596477437 261750 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? recursion
< 1596477438 984244 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might expect a reference to recursion here, but to make it interesting you'll actuallSTACK OVERFLOW
< 1596477526 98411 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`forget ladder jump
< 1596477528 500997 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Forget what?
< 1596477697 58367 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`` learn 'A snake is just a directed vertical bridge in the negative orientation.'  # just to complement the entry on ladder
< 1596477700 134790 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'snake': A snake is just a directed vertical bridge in the negative orientation.
< 1596477813 11974 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cat bin/#
< 1596477814 192233 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :cat: bin/#: No such file or directory
< 1596477822 809332 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right.
< 1596477823 454597 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`cbt #
< 1596477824 469404 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :sep='//`' \ [[ "$1" == ?*"$sep"* ]] || { echo 'Usage: `# '"$sep"'' >&2 ; exit 1; } \ nur "${1#*$sep}"
< 1596477842 96570 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose having comments at the end is useful.
< 1596477997 127930 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? ladder
< 1596477998 730196 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :A ladder is just a directed vertical bridge in the positive orientation.
< 1596478020 632618 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? #
< 1596478022 463161 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​`# //` is useful if you want to add a comment to HackEgo history for things like `sled or `le/rn.
< 1596478032 147193 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I usually just use the shell's comment feature though
< 1596478134 596128 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Likewise. Though it's a little bit risky, you have to get quoting right.
> 1596478265 532894 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07VD314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76415&oldid=69816 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+552) 10added interpreter link and categories
< 1596478301 713246 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure
< 1596478377 746781 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, comments are useful for that purpose, I think.
< 1596478429 39913 :MTGBusyBeaver42!4925260f@c-73-37-38-15.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596478442 642860 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now the ticket menu of TeXnicard is alternating red/green each line (merely by the coincidence, I suppose).
< 1596478645 310573 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe a version of # that scans for the rightmost # would be useful.
< 1596478688 785280 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't find these useful simply because I already know and want to know how the unix commands work, I don't want to learn extra stuff unless it's really specific to HackEso
< 1596478712 537678 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you would use such a tool, sure, create such a command
< 1596479980 907281 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1596480035 764969 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some older high-color graphics modes could display 4, 32 or 64 kibicolors, and for a long time "true color" referred to having 16 mebicolors available, but HDR10 can represent a full gibicolor.
< 1596480039 774773 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I just wanted to use the binary SI prefixes for colors, there's no other point to that statement.)
< 1596480247 196026 :user24_!~user24@95.90.176.189 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1596480288 604665 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Amiga can display many colours but there is restriction how many colours next to each other, in the hold and modify mode.
< 1596480538 336207 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: see https://bendwavy.org/doodle/ that uses fractal stuff to show all colors in a 3D RGB color space in a 2D image
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> 1596483385 287280 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03AlexIsOK 5*  10New user account
< 1596483851 649696 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1596486411 502583 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76416&oldid=76401 5* 03AlexIsOK 5* (+302) 10/* Introductions */
> 1596486422 1614 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07E62qpodb59314]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76417 5* 03AlexIsOK 5* (+1846) 10init, needs some formatting though, for some reason code blocks won't work.
> 1596486572 488510 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07E62qpodb59314]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76418&oldid=76417 5* 03AlexIsOK 5* (+8) 10
< 1596487177 401501 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1596492248 908297 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Casini14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76419&oldid=76390 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+138) 10/* Example */
> 1596492263 258738 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Casini14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76420&oldid=76419 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+2) 10/* Example */
> 1596492283 481061 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76421&oldid=76389 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+0) 10/* Example code */
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> 1596492891 650957 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Casini14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76422&oldid=76420 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+31) 10
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> 1596494870 190544 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76423&oldid=76421 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+32) 10/* Example code */
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> 1596504075 377886 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Orangeyy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76424&oldid=60182 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (-12) 10
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< 1596507542 802462 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596511061 326673 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a way in CSS to scale pictures to the current font size?
< 1596512805 164903 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596512847 206057 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596513920 875527 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596517290 75949 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596522606 804409 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596524539 77074 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596524575 814334 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596525889 950806 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1596528167 204124 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:9940:7ed:fd58:45ff:f1b0:c541 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596528465 66139 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596528623 853665 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596528830 542131 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: Rebooting
< 1596528886 927715 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596529675 876049 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596530584 853862 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596530585 172568 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-146-112-4.natnow.res.rr.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596531576 779294 :izabera!izabera@unaffiliated/izabera JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596531710 78217 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596532698 898749 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
> 1596532764 244331 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76425&oldid=76398 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-8) 10/* COME BACK LYXAL!!! */
< 1596533533 541406 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`"
< 1596533536 104139 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/1:1293)  What time zone has time as a complex number? \ 539)  elliott: so what are the two issues with xfce?   they're very unlikely to fuck up Xfce, and it can be made to work basically exactly like gnome two
< 1596533612 134731 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596534419 930695 :j-bot!~jbot@hagall.firefly.nu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596535156 765620 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596535177 953418 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596536779 364754 :salpynx!794954f8@121.73.84.248 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596538007 846198 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: do you think that there's a way to do CVS right?
< 1596538008 275587 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: and there is therefore much higher. for someone to integrate your libraries into their libraries by trying to adhere to the boundries defined by these pages. you are mad.
< 1596538667 163633 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596538984 920752 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1596539254 521360 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone should write a version control system that stores all data in comma-separate files, they could call it CSVS.
< 1596539378 137409 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not CSVCS?
< 1596539402 204911 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :in that case, i think absurdity gets better with more letters
< 1596539515 721981 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did in fact type CSVCS first, but then thought it's missing the CVS reference somewhat.
< 1596539548 638328 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :DCSVCS would of course be the distributed variant.
< 1596539690 875794 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was just reminsicing anyway... and I remembered Torvald's excellent burn of SVN :)
< 1596540708 943783 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596542563 780279 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596542592 732501 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596543062 84350 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596543495 538732 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://forums.swift.org/t/swift-type-checking-is-undecidable/39024
< 1596543666 614191 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :go ask c++ about it :D
< 1596546439 585247 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
< 1596546455 944485 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596547096 222243 :joast!~rick@cpe-98-146-112-4.natnow.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596551152 175453 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596551423 812523 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596552457 930888 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1596554871 985916 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596555181 40579 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596556102 720503 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596556202 184094 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1596556273 805643 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596556558 821037 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596560344 5954 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596560776 254143 :LKoen!~LKoen@176-150-177-3.abo.bbox.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1596562194 838181 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07E62qpodb59314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76426&oldid=76418 5* 03AlexIsOK 5* (+322) 10/* Examples */
> 1596562514 46185 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07E62qpodb59314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76427&oldid=76426 5* 03AlexIsOK 5* (+78) 10/* Implementations */
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< 1596564103 871123 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596564163 817613 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596564693 405654 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596564783 856132 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596565617 851183 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :question about English. how do I say "This museum is open all days of the week except Mondays." in such a way that an accidental truncation can't cause the listener to think that the museum is open on all days of the week including Mondays?
< 1596565764 306492 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"this museum is open tuesday to sunday"?
< 1596565795 310533 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: ah yes, that should work, thank you
< 1596566254 548702 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1596566777 969580 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596567038 699322 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :except for Mondays, the museum is open on all days of the week :-P
< 1596567065 991900 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596567099 414738 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I guess you can truncate on both ends and then this will not help)
< 1596567108 927741 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But what if it's truncated to "the museum is open"?
< 1596567117 34788 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :People will assume that it's open unconditionally.
< 1596567131 455821 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: hmm
< 1596567140 123402 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :good question
< 1596567150 877611 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is why I hate English with its stupid rigid word ordr
< 1596567189 315057 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596567413 468988 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I read somewhere that the word order was less rigid in Old English, instead using a suffix to indicate a verb and so on. But, I am not sure; maybe I am mistaken.
< 1596567474 279607 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, in English the first letter of a sentence is capitalized. Also, there may be ways to arrange the stuff on the sign to mitigate the effects of truncation.
< 1596567633 344073 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596568467 981973 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: "open from Tuesday to Sunday the museum is". And then a Yoda noise.
< 1596568611 300614 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: no, I think the right order is either, "The museum except on Mondays all days is open." 
< 1596568637 648955 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even "The museum is open excepting Mondays all days." is better than "The museum is open all days except Mondays."
< 1596568817 293696 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Museum hours: Tue-Sun, 11:00-19:00
< 1596568842 150491 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes, that's nice too
< 1596568884 79564 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sentences aren't holhograms or fractals
< 1596568924 609934 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now how did I manage that extra h.
< 1596568993 825106 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You really went the hol hog there.
> 1596569240 292932 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03McGoodmen 5*  10New user account
> 1596569501 289268 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76428&oldid=76416 5* 03McGoodmen 5* (+245) 10/* Introductions */
< 1596570448 133769 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1596571086 332564 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: That way probably is best, I think
< 1596571190 111184 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596571624 825720 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MdX14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76429&oldid=72754 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-96) 10fixed title
> 1596572723 687569 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Hanzlu14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76430 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+390) 10Created page with "I'm not sure why you want a 3LEB Hello World program so desperately as to refuse to release the interpreter until you have one. It's literally trivial anyway:   GAU 72  GAU 10..."
> 1596574292 740538 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Sillycon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76431&oldid=72973 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+4) 10standardized capitalization
> 1596574308 425396 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Sillycon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76432&oldid=76431 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+2) 10formatting is hard
> 1596574317 862864 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03LegionMammal978 5*  10moved [[02Sillycon10]] to [[SillyCon]]: fix capitalization
< 1596576914 239959 :Cale!~cale@2607:fea8:9940:7ed:fd58:45ff:f1b0:c541 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1596581732 640997 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca QUIT :*.net *.split
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< 1596581733 255905 :oren!~oren@ec2-18-234-164-48.compute-1.amazonaws.com QUIT :*.net *.split
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< 1596581840 185457 :oren!~oren@ec2-18-234-164-48.compute-1.amazonaws.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596581840 185494 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596581867 40155 :clog!~nef@bespin.org QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
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< 1596582979 348657 :xelxebar_!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596583003 826143 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1596584520 2488 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76435&oldid=76423 5* 03Abbin21 5* (-150) 10/* Things worth noting */
> 1596584557 6543 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76436&oldid=76435 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+1) 10/* Example code */
> 1596584709 272455 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Casini14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76437&oldid=76436 5* 03Abbin21 5* (+69) 10
< 1596587207 314977 :ATMunn!ATMunn@gateway/shell/hellomouse/x-ibwhbzcuhjjiwgva QUIT :Quit: lol rip
< 1596587318 774421 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@hellomouse/dev/Bowserinator QUIT :Quit: Blame iczero something happened
< 1596587589 128188 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@hellomouse/dev/Bowserinator JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596587719 915448 :ATMunn!ATMunn@gateway/shell/hellomouse/x-ueubxpvgkvmpluzr JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596587746 437222 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596588851 623457 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596589041 946737 :clog!~nef@bespin.org JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596590472 313315 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596590906 180326 :shinh_!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596590960 916453 :shinh_!~i@39.110.229.193 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596590986 293196 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:ZippyMagician/Ideas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76438&oldid=76352 5* 03ZippyMagician 5* (-2292) 10Fix a major issue in the docs
< 1596592989 820821 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596593910 974834 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :All right, here's my favorite OEIS sequence today.
< 1596593917 942912 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://oeis.org/A139138 - Numbers divisible by at least two of their digits. :D
< 1596594856 51288 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aw, that's a cute sequence
< 1596597486 365975 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596597601 311825 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596599315 681736 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596599400 83507 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596604966 283863 :xelxebar_!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.7.2+deb3 - https://znc.in
< 1596604990 866060 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596606182 814566 :shinh_!~i@39.110.229.193 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596606213 993859 :shinh_!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596608187 208832 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Grid14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76439&oldid=71289 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (-10) 10
> 1596608229 540116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76440&oldid=76413 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+754) 10Examples: Fib!
< 1596608368 756798 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596609601 788550 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596610540 239970 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596610900 184879 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76441&oldid=76440 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+46) 10/* Control flow operations */
> 1596611654 605804 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:E62qpodb59314]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76442 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+314) 10Created page with "== Golfing language? ==  This looks too verbose to be a golfing language. Most golfing languages have straight-forward string outputting like "Hello, World!", not..."
> 1596611830 783067 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76443&oldid=76425 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+90) 10/* Pop */
> 1596611871 370920 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76444&oldid=76443 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-10) 10/* Easy */
< 1596613153 857399 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://oeis.org/A087140
< 1596613884 754550 :BWBellairs!~bwbellair@hellomouse/dev/bwbellairs QUIT :Quit: Quit
< 1596614017 372009 :BWBellairs!~bwbellair@hellomouse/dev/bwbellairs JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596614224 873604 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NoRAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76445&oldid=76407 5* 03TheCoderPro 5* (+79) 10/* External resources */
< 1596614878 116987 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596614983 851475 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596615050 82746 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596615757 211064 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I imagine A139138 would increase roughly logarithmically
< 1596615846 858276 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
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< 1596621343 868962 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-46.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving
> 1596623240 800661 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76446&oldid=76441 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+26) 10Base 32!
> 1596624019 155025 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03RealestLink 5*  10New user account
> 1596624284 529243 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76447&oldid=76428 5* 03RealestLink 5* (+237) 10
> 1596624536 295904 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Community portal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76448&oldid=75596 5* 03RealestLink 5* (+1) 10Fixed the invite link to "Compilers and Interpreters"
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< 1596627424 100128 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596628844 37984 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1596630739 77997 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :question. have you designed or implemented some kind of network protocol, like HTTP or IRC or ssh but not something as well-spread but possibly just a toy application that only you use, and that intends to have a tcp server listening on a fixed port for a long time, whether to do all the communication or just for initiating a connection? if so,
< 1596630739 617155 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :have you tried to add a feature such that if someone accidentally connects to that tcp server with an entirely wrong client, such as a HTTP browser or telnet client, then the server will likely send them a human-readable message that tells them what they did wrong and optionally what this tcp server is for?
> 1596630793 503878 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Razetime 5*  10New user account
< 1596630818 241515 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and if so, have you tried to optimize this such that you can send this reply possibly immediately as a fixed header, or at least after the other party sends just very little data to you and without having to wait for a long timeout?
< 1596630997 247020 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: "I imagine A139138 would increase roughly logarithmically" => impossible, it is a strictly increasing sequence of integers that contains every integer that is congruent to 11 modulo 100
> 1596631053 386781 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76449&oldid=76447 5* 03Razetime 5* (+160) 10/* Introductions */
> 1596631064 425098 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76450&oldid=76131 5* 03Razetime 5* (+40) 10Added truth machine
< 1596631220 549123 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: that is true
> 1596632721 124299 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76451&oldid=76191 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-41) 10/* Commands and syntax */ Wrong
> 1596632962 208131 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Snippets14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76452&oldid=76444 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+124) 10/* Hard */
< 1596634752 873815 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
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> 1596635165 435657 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76453&oldid=76450 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-447) 10/* Computational class */ The proof is completely wrong.
> 1596635370 675609 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76454&oldid=76453 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+88) 10/* Computational class */
> 1596635393 289613 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76455&oldid=76454 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-2) 10/* Computational class */
< 1596636486 35701 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596636525 28925 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: I implemented such a service, but the outermost layer is TLS and if someone unexpected tries to connect, the TLS won't even work
< 1596636532 120457 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so there's no scope to do something like you're suggesting
< 1596636550 224459 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you would need to put such a fixed-error-message output into the TLS implementation rather than the application
< 1596636558 852432 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Copyrighted material are also strictly prohibited." -- always a good laugh, that.
< 1596636569 747802 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine other people in the same situation would have had the same issue
< 1596636597 161214 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: thank you. but will it fail also if someone connects with a different client that uses TLS, such as a HTTPS client or IRC client with TLS enabled?
< 1596636625 178438 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :or does TLS have a built-in high-level protocol marker that you're using for this?
< 1596636665 530738 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, for that you'd probably have to modify the TLS library to support this
< 1596636671 99877 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the server end wouldn't be able to see what the client end was sending due to a certificate error
< 1596636690 955211 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the client end, I think it'd just see the connection closing
< 1596636702 117379 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: you don't need to see what the client is sending to send an error message
< 1596636706 529166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could modify the TLS library to send something using the client's actual certificate even if it wasn't recognised
< 1596636710 131159 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: so you're using a client certificate?
< 1596636711 43161 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok
< 1596636715 910240 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, client certificate
< 1596636724 61705 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, that explains it
< 1596636733 844416 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess most people don't do that
< 1596636738 261606 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's a very simple way to do auth
< 1596636786 129463 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but you could also do it optionally, as in run a single Apache that listens on https, and some of the things it serve require a client cert, but just a hello world page or an error message doesn't
< 1596636796 760182 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/serve/serves/
< 1596636882 540384 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess you could make it work
< 1596636908 356536 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, I'm not going to for my project, because the amount of development effort required, and the risk of introducing a security bug, would be disproportionate to the benefit
< 1596636926 558088 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(especially as this was for work so I need to justify what I'm spending my time on)
< 1596636937 548506 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not "make it work", if I want to serve something on https, as opposed to tls in general, than I will probably put it behind an Apache because it handles the peksy server-side details of HTTP
< 1596636940 976956 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, what's the story on the discord front? (This change, https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76448&oldid=75596 ... basically I'm wondering whether there are now two competing rooms/channels/whatever the name, or whether the former is gone)
< 1596637004 109912 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I think discord links can expire after some time, maybe it expired?
< 1596637055 344838 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just something to keep an eye for a while on I suppose.
< 1596637066 278038 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not curious enough to actually try out discord for this.
< 1596637083 234059 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a bit weird, they use time-limited invite links, but the links have so little entropy that you could brute-force yourself into random discords easily such that any discord can't be kept private from that
< 1596637096 400097 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: they both look to go to the same discord server fwiw
< 1596637098 651109 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't use discord so maybe this is not true and I just don't understand it
< 1596637151 954262 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I hear from other people who use discord (and just this morning I just found out that another IRC channel that I'm on had a bridge from discord and two more forums in two more chat protocols different from IRC or discord)
< 1596637163 537922 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/this morning/this night/
< 1596637249 213872 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :uplime: thanks, that's reassuring
< 1596637561 658109 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :does anybody know why the esowiki has lemons for its logo?
< 1596637674 699364 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are limes
< 1596637689 621359 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it was originally just picked from a list of placeholder images as a placeholder, but we grew to like it
< 1596637772 339653 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think its a good logo personally
< 1596637776 541019 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers PRIVMSG #esoteric :unobjectively
< 1596637805 305268 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: ah, like the colored wavy lines in the left side of my homepage, which were placeholders and I meant to replace them with better images, at least with wavy lines with different shapes, but nice vertical banners for this purpose aren't easy to find, and I was lazy, so I just have wavy lines there forever.
< 1596637885 728404 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe another 12 years from now, when I do a major revision on that homepage ...
< 1596638019 953591 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for meaningless images that I never replace, I have another story. I sometimes set different desktop background images on different desktop computers just so it's easier to tell at a glance which computer I'm working on. 
< 1596638131 770755 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've started doing that with shell prompts
< 1596638147 416062 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easy to miss the hostname in the prompt if you aren't concentrating, so I've been making them different colors on different computers
< 1596638161 683601 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now at my current job, I use some virtualized windows machines, and I even have some where I installed some software and then gave copies of the image to coworkers to use. I put different desktop backgrounds to them for the above mentioned reason, and now I also replace the background before I give a copy to a coworker, because they're sometimes
< 1596638162 218803 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :lazy to change the background and then I ended up with a vm that has the same background as vms that another coworker uses.
< 1596638211 146002 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, in fact, I should look for a replacement background image for that particular vm image right now, and replace it in my local copy the next time I boot it up, because that situation still hasn't got resolved;
< 1596638306 543207 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :though with the more recent image that I distributed, I was careful enough to change the background immediately, so now the latest vm has rape seed field as the background in my version buy cotton bale as the background in the distributed version.
< 1596638349 248397 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, the images also lead to easy naming the vm.
< 1596638414 958821 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm yeah, in fact I should change the descriptive name of this vm instance (which is for information display purposes only, doesn't change anything, but easily visible even when the VM is not running) to include "rape seeed"
< 1596638457 86591 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh crap, I'm not allowed to change the descriptive name while the VM is running
< 1596638530 519135 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so anyway, this also gives a possible solution for the hard problem of naming
< 1596638552 486609 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly the descriptive name of the VM also has some meaningful non-arbitrary parts
< 1596638565 716541 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those keep clashing too much
< 1596638624 163770 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because, you know "I know, I'll call this vm 'win10' to distinguish from the previous vm which runs windows 7" then 6 months later "crap, now the next vm will be running windows 10 as well"
< 1596638659 609548 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: cheers, I can stop wondering about a hidden meaning then :)
< 1596638698 625496 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's easier not to choose another rape seed photo as background for the next meaningless background image 
< 1596639721 12001 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596641999 357215 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yebtpdryroitsotp JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596642543 386530 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596642641 65711 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1596642713 850661 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596643993 232110 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course I also have to choose a background that is not such a cliche that someone else would independently choose to use it as a desktop background, eg. I won't use a plain grass or wheat pasture hill or partly clouded sky unless it has some more specific recognizable feature.
< 1596644048 925381 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :A rape seed field is common enough in reality in Hungary that it feels pleasant and neutral enough for a background, but not cliche enough that I'll have coworkers with confusable rape seed fields as their desktop background.
< 1596644055 475290 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed
< 1596644337 62157 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: To your question from before, does NNTP count? However, I have not implemented any attempt to answer HTTP requests, and am not sure how.
< 1596644693 955206 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596644843 953268 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596645013 179141 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76456&oldid=76455 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+1) 10automaton is the singular form
< 1596647005 777749 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596648455 995098 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596649003 776127 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596649095 523584 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596649477 190697 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the user does type HELP though then it does mention which RFC to read
< 1596649595 704788 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596650021 386003 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1596650071 616185 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596651859 265770 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Osmarks/!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76457 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+2190) 10Created page with "{{Deletedpage}}  {{infobox proglang |name= |paradigms=imperative |author=[[User:Heavpoot]] |year=[[:Category:2020|2020]] |memsys=No memory |dimensions=No dimensions |class=No..."
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> 1596654525 382608 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07HELP (Preprocessor)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76458&oldid=74795 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+78) 10added repo link
< 1596655405 228572 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596655715 883936 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1596655759 577823 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596656678 611317 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Auo14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76459&oldid=75196 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+15) 10/* External resources */ fixed it
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< 1596657255 889097 :LegionMammal978!181e4e3e@c-24-30-78-62.hsd1.ga.comcast.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596658053 282794 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like the kind of random padding that I had made up for cryptographic use?
< 1596658399 513554 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what padding you made up.
< 1596658415 706132 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mentioned it on this IRC before, probably a few days ago
< 1596658475 131257 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that makes sense.
< 1596658775 465487 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yebtpdryroitsotp QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1596658866 810675 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
> 1596659086 531070 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Spite14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76460&oldid=75643 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-15) 10/* External resources */ fixed link
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< 1596659861 88754 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-084-063-063-106.084.063.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
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< 1596660413 817220 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will repeat it, I suppose.
< 1596660501 520101 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Start with one byte length of random data, and then random data, and then a checksum of the entire stream so far, and then the sequence number (which is the first sequence number is secret), and then the length of the payload data, and then the payload data; that makes one frame.
< 1596660521 73226 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Data can be arbitrarily split into frames)
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< 1596660702 655640 :heroux_!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-pufcjvaenlkbcnrn NICK :heroux
> 1596660773 821608 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Polynomial14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76461&oldid=75933 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-1642) 10don't use that it's broken
> 1596661490 655006 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Main Page14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76462&oldid=76109 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-1) 10The About and Policy pages call it Esolang
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< 1596664448 400798 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Oh the July Ponder This challenge solutions is published. They list German as a possible way to get the Fibonacci sequence, from A = AH and H = HAH. (I found this, but I thought that being a native speaker was *not* an advantage in this case.)
< 1596664504 406828 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? password
< 1596664507 515652 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :The password of the month is still up for grabs.
< 1596664516 306476 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: do you have a link handy?
< 1596664519 114131 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( Time for shachaf to have another panic attack. )
< 1596664531 947273 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: this? http://www.research.ibm.com/haifa/ponderthis/solutions/July2020.html
< 1596664539 719992 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a datastructure better suited for representing an AST than say a linked list?
< 1596664545 723421 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: or this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_spelling_alphabet#Basic_alphabet
< 1596664547 224205 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Hmm?
< 1596664561 642071 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks
< 1596664565 711551 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: It's another month and I just queried the potm
< 1596664568 353893 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the former
< 1596664587 495251 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought the solution had more details
< 1596664609 234591 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I do hope that you're not suffering from literal panic attacks.
< 1596664624 203833 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Yeah it's a bit disappointing that it doesn't.
< 1596664671 113625 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn The password of the month is the same as last month's.
< 1596664673 760403 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f 'a' = "ah"; f 'h' = "hah" in take 10 $ map length (iterate (>>= f) "a")
< 1596664675 985628 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,2,5,13,34,89,233,610,1597,4181]
< 1596664691 168607 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: it's not the Fibonacci sequence, it's every second term.
< 1596664699 21769 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> let f 'a' = "ah"; f 'h' = "hah" in take 10 $ map length (iterate (>>= f) "h")
< 1596664701 109670 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : [1,3,8,21,55,144,377,987,2584,6765]
< 1596664705 345403 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and those are the other terms
< 1596664747 86497 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes
< 1596664843 25936 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: http://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/p2020-07.txt were my notes for the bonus part
< 1596665072 498541 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there something that generalizes certain ordinal notations to let us compute with a certain subset of surreal numbers? 
< 1596665125 960489 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok stupid question, sorry
< 1596665156 232041 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :obviously http://www.madore.org/~david/weblog/d.2011-11-13.1964.nombres-surreels.html answers that. I should have looked there first
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< 1596668727 199193 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :looking for some stupid bit-twiddling tricks help: can anyone suggest an efficient way to identify the fifth-least-significant set bit in a number?
< 1596668797 342620 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: sorry, uh, I'm too tired for that, look in Warren's Hacker's Delight 2nd ed, which is right here on my shelf but I'm going to bed and can't think clear enough to interpret the book
< 1596668806 791735 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, actually, there's a shortcut in my problem: I know that all bits above it will be set (but the bit immediately below might also be set, so I can't just look for the top 0)
< 1596668838 948849 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: in that case don't you just do a popcount and then a subtraction or something?
< 1596668841 539256 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so I can count the number of set bits and that probably gives the answer directly?
< 1596668842 991806 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1596668846 279423 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that
< 1596668899 738871 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this doesn't actually need to be efficient, but I can't bear to write the loop
< 1596668937 343097 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: popcount then, and find an existing implementation of popcount for whatever you're writing this in, I can even help in that part if you need
< 1596668963 457087 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm writing in Rust which has popcount in the standard library, fortunately
< 1596668976 206719 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :good
< 1596669095 553832 :callforjudgement!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596669102 201517 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Disconnected by services
< 1596669104 92009 :callforjudgement!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 NICK :ais523
< 1596669352 487282 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: By "loop", do you mean four times  x = x & (x-1), followed by x & -x?
< 1596669392 76314 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I was thinking about something stupider; that version, I /could/ bear to write, although it still seems less elegant than it needs to be
< 1596669417 18464 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, I figured it out, anyway, start with 0b10000 and then do an inverse select on the original number
< 1596669424 750841 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(inverse-select is a builtin on x86)
< 1596669452 585061 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although that probably isn't in Rust's standard library
< 1596669453 777935 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's https://www.felixcloutier.com/x86/pdep (which apparently is really slow on Zen)
< 1596669494 66779 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which would allow you to deposit 0x10 into the work you want to analyze to give you the 5th bit)
< 1596669531 370003 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right, pdep is what it's called
< 1596669535 674959 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there's an intrinsic for that.
< 1596669544 127595 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's the instruction I was thinking of, I remembered the instruction but couldn't remember the name
< 1596669550 36588 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you need the index of the bit or just to have it set?
< 1596669550 814482 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(probably but I hate looking this up)
< 1596669575 228155 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :pext/pdep aren't methods of u64 in Rust, at least
< 1596669577 542176 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: need the index
< 1596669590 409088 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what else... bsl in a loops (eww)
< 1596669602 367491 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :*loop
< 1596669621 533265 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the index is just a popcount away from finding the mask
< 1596669626 423981 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :my superoptimiser almost certainly isn't powerful enough to find this
< 1596669637 854862 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Rust supports inline assembly now, right?
< 1596669659 930165 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you wouldn't use it in this situation anyway, if you want to write platform-specific code there are bindings to all the asm instructions individually
< 1596669666 327456 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"inverse-select is a builtin on x86" => only on cpus newer than the ones that have popcount though
< 1596669685 883020 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: how does popcount solve this problem?
< 1596669688 263749 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think they do have a library that contains most x86 intrinsics though
< 1596669689 368350 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in this case, pub unsafe fn _pdep_u64(a: u64, mask: u64) -> u64
< 1596669691 72737 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think it does
< 1596669716 803793 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: it solves it in the situation where you know that all the bits above the one you want are 1 bits (but some of the bits immediately below might be too)
< 1596669719 440436 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is the case for me
< 1596669719 550294 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I think it works here, since all the higher bits are set?
< 1596669736 152111 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I still don't see how
< 1596669761 119795 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: you know that there are precisely four 1 bits below the one you want, so all but five 1 bits must be above
< 1596669774 962234 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh right.
< 1596669777 169968 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the functions in the rust library are btw named the same as the intel compiler intrinsic functions, which all of intel, ms, gcc compilers have in a standard header
< 1596669779 46697 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, that was stupid.
< 1596669787 949550 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there are no 0 bits above, thus knowing how many 1 bits are above gives you the number of bits above and thus the index of the bit you want
< 1596669808 646721 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at it once, and found a few things missing that I reported, but haven't bothered to write the patch for it yet 
< 1596669836 15753 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, that stuff you said, _pdep_u64
< 1596669845 108238 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :come to think of it, this might make an interesting codegolf problem
< 1596669863 702327 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the "fifth-least-significant set bit" problem in the general case)
< 1596669897 389743 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm looking for a reference on the first use of the reasonable precedence parsing algorithm (sometimes called "precedence climbing" or "Pratt parsing" or other names).
< 1596669921 248316 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone attributes it to the BCPL compiler, but I can't find the code for that.
< 1596669923 163027 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. I wonder how the 1252 threashold in http://www.research.ibm.com/haifa/ponderthis/challenges/August2020.html was chosen.
< 1596669935 331780 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :... threshold
< 1596669943 219031 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a book about compilers that uses BCPL for its examples, and talks about "operator-precedence parsing"
< 1596669957 747690 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which book?
< 1596669970 171666 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :from memory, "Understanding and Writing Compilers" by Bornat
< 1596669974 504032 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I may have misremembered
< 1596669978 248845 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: reference on first use of the reasonable precedence parsing algorithm => look in TAOCP volume 5, TAOCP usually tells about the history
< 1596669980 584156 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(It seems too high to make this interesting. And the * bonus looks too hard.)
< 1596670063 867626 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I didn't realise how restrictive that additional constraint (no 0 bits above the one you want) really is.
< 1596670078 451359 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So... yeah, stupid.
< 1596670102 657527 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The algorithm is so simple that it seems silly to give it a name, but also many people (including me) find it nonobvious before they see it.
< 1596670137 20478 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But people write much more complicated precedence parsing code all the time.
< 1596670160 621749 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: my guess is that the people setting the problem tried to solve it for some length of time and 1252 was their best score
< 1596670176 173506 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: those are some of the best algorithms, the ones that are trivial and beautiful after you understand it, but look like magic that nobody could possibly have invented before that
< 1596670196 743342 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I don't have TAOCP unfortunately (except for two fascicles).
< 1596670208 91806 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ayacc will generate operator-precedence parsing code as an optimisation in some cases
< 1596670210 95976 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Yeah but the first thing I tried got it down to 1235.
< 1596670213 326299 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I think Floyd's algorithm that we discussed the other day is like this.
< 1596670223 754495 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: maybe you just got lucky?
< 1596670233 886548 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Doubt it.
< 1596670272 283815 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: no problem, nobody has volume 5 yet, it's not yet written, you have many years before it will be published, so since you already have to wait, it doesn't matter that you haven't bought it yet
< 1596670292 52556 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This is hardly a spoiler, it's pretty much the most obvious attempt: I added a single losing position, and no winning position.)
< 1596670316 743629 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :adding a losing position may cause some losing positions to become winning, though
< 1596670327 308372 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the exact details would matter
< 1596670340 601076 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried all possibilities.
< 1596670357 541891 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs.
< 1596670371 273368 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tortoise-and-hare cycle-finding algorithm is something I found very non-obvious before I saw it
< 1596670396 11473 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And yes, it turns some losing positions into winning positions. That is the point really, because the goal is to get as few losing positions as possible.
< 1596670431 291995 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah well.
< 1596670454 114463 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Oh, that wasn't the Floyd's algorithm I meant, I meant the one for sampling.
< 1596670459 487688 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose Floyd has many algorithms.
< 1596670474 242676 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: huh, that's coincidence, I thought of the algorithm itself without realising the Floyd connection
< 1596670505 594402 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(also, Wikipedia isn't sure that Floyd actually created the tortoise-and-hare algorithm)
< 1596670530 804257 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nevertheless I've heard people call it "Floyd's algorithm".
< 1596670545 90881 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes
< 1596670549 235432 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the Pollard's lambda algorithm for finding cycles.
< 1596670553 101636 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah. and the algorithm to find a birthday attack on a black box function with range 2**n with O(2**(n/2)) queries but with memory usage of only a O(2**(n/4)) sized hash table of values
< 1596670561 439079 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It seems much more practical in situations where you can use it.
< 1596670579 920409 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycle_detection attributes it to Floyd
< 1596670591 386182 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, the Pollard rho algorithm for prime factorization, which is based on that
< 1596670601 932191 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: it states that it's often referred to as Floyd's algorithm, but starts by disputing that attribution
< 1596670624 88059 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, Floyd's algorithm is also like that
< 1596670625 522403 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: the point of that one is that it's parallelizable, right?
< 1596670625 854839 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose that for Pollard's rho factoring algorithm you have to use the "turtle and hare" method, you can't use the lambda trick, right?
< 1596670629 750709 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: we're assuming that the function has an infinite domain, right?
< 1596670644 516026 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean Floyd's algorithm to compute each pair of distances in a graph with weighted edges
< 1596670647 496337 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because you don't actually have an identity you can distinguish.
< 1596670654 786247 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: Funny, it doesn't do that in the initial description.
< 1596670675 511084 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: that's just one point, but that part isn't too surprising, more surprising is that it needs less storage
< 1596670714 990111 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric : I mean Floyd's algorithm to compute each pair of distances in a graph with weighted edges ← for TAEB::AI::Planar I created my own pathfinding algorithm designed to be efficient at doing that
< 1596670722 119066 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but also at updating the cache when the graph changed slightly
< 1596670731 83675 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brent's variant is usually faster anyway.
< 1596670745 45845 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, let me remember how Pollard's factoring algorithm works.
< 1596670758 594916 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: But that's a lot of memory...
< 1596670780 787093 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: The basic cycle finding just needs to keep track of a couple of values.
< 1596670782 38389 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: um, that depends on how large n is
< 1596670793 360744 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how fast is the birthday attack for finding collisions in a function where you start with a value that isn't in the range, then you repeatedly feed it its own output?
< 1596670812 748544 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's O(n) memory, but I'm not sure what the efficiency is
< 1596670818 481063 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: ok, then the point IS that it's parallelizable, you pay memory to be parallelizable
< 1596670835 536472 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Yes that was my point.
< 1596670839 638805 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I found Floyd-Steinberg dithering unintuitive at first. But maybe I just initially saw it explained badly. On the other hand, there's a cute cat in the Wikipedia page about it.
< 1596670863 794884 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: This is what the "distinguished point"/lambda trick is about, right?
< 1596670872 950790 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I find this important because for a crypto hash of size n=256, you need 2**64 entries of storage instead of 2**128, and while 2**128 storage is something I can't imagine, 2**64 entries of storage is tantalizingly close to what Google could have in a few years if they really wanted to, whereas 2**128 entries of memory is something I can't imagine without our civilization being totally unrecognizable
< 1596670874 386072 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume it's O(2**(n/2)) because I've used it in practice to find a collision in SHA-256 truncated to 64 bits
< 1596670886 209475 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that seems like it would take too long if it were O(2**64)
< 1596670889 18482 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: It's expected to be O(2^(n/2)), but parallelizes badly (d parallel processes doing that end up taking O(2^(n/2)/sqrt(d)) time, I think)
< 1596670903 88396 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: ah, OK
< 1596670909 32020 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in particular, there's an estimate that all hard disk existing in year 2018 have a total capacity approximately 2**88 bits
< 1596670915 554130 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or 2**85 bytes or so
< 1596670919 308394 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You have a time/memory tradeoff that you can set however you want. There's no real reason to set it to the square root, is there?
< 1596670939 608687 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I can imagine 2**64 storage entries, however I can't imagine a system that can fill them in reasonable time
< 1596670941 51715 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it's reasonable to assume that a large quantity of those hard disks are used by Google in their server rooms
< 1596670945 699637 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can set it based on how much storage you want to use.
< 1596670951 480923 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if these are random access and we assume we don't use most of them, it's believable
< 1596670991 953957 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, it's still not a feasable attack yet, but the storage size is not the limit
< 1596670999 899736 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: That's a pretty cute cat.
< 1596671027 722575 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes, it needn't be exactly the fourth root
< 1596671034 189235 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The undithered version is a bit less cute.
< 1596671058 568007 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: actually, I think Google almost certainly uses more than 2**-21 of the world's storage capacity, that's less than a millionth
< 1596671069 331519 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so Google probably had 2**64 bits of storage already in 2018
< 1596671140 311236 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: https://crypto.stackexchange.com/questions/52231/what-is-the-best-and-fastest-algorithm-to-generate-a-hash-collision has some references
< 1596671164 365246 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, that's what I'm thinking too, but I also think 2**64 *bits* might not be enough, you need 2**64 half-entries, each 64 bits long, (or maybe quarter entries or so), so it's more like 2**70 bits
< 1596671190 123377 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah right
< 1596671215 269042 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm not sure about either number here so I can't tell if Google has reached this yet
< 1596671231 152365 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'd check how much data is stored in [REDACTED], but it'd almost certainly be a confidential number.
< 1596671265 210465 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( so many [REDACTED] bytes )
< 1596671290 101887 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yeah, though I've seen some estimates based on public data
< 1596671327 457280 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's pretty hard to find public information about that sort of thing, I think Amazon has also only publicly said how many *objects* there are in S3, not how many bytes.
< 1596671385 159016 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was also wondering how many devices (smartphones) are there that run Android (2**31 right now, it turns out), and how much total GPU FLOPS, total CPU FLOPS, total storage, total RAM, and median RAM they have;
< 1596671400 38563 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I wonder how that changed since I had access to [REDACTED]
< 1596671422 92799 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, curiosity got the better of me, and I checked [REDACTED]. I can in strictest confidence let you know it's still a number, it hasn't turned into any sort of weird concept that transcends numbers. Well, unless the interface hides that.
< 1596671437 67991 :salpynx!794954f8@121.73.84.248 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596671456 339136 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I do admit that an attack that backdoors a significant number of android devices such that it uses them for some meaningful computation would be very impractical.
< 1596671472 333440 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh man, we should do some sort of millionaire problem.
< 1596671474 10935 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't necessarily need to be a backdoor
< 1596671476 106483 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was asking about this on another channel, but I haven't found out anyting other than the number of devices yet
< 1596671501 674811 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yeah, that's what I was thinking of, to determine if the redacted problems are equal
< 1596671519 469819 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh wait, you mean not whether the projects are the same but for which one uses more storage?
< 1596671529 764818 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are apps that are installed on a high proportion of phones, if one of them decided to do some distributed computing (perhaps even with the users' permission) it could get a lot done
< 1596671555 177371 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was a ridiculous spike in capacity of Folding@home with the covid thing.
< 1596671577 737135 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"With heightened interest in the project as a result of the COVID-19 pandemic,[7] the system achieved a speed of approximately 1.22 exaflops by late March 2020 and reaching 2.43 exaflops by April 12, 2020,[8] making it the world's first exaflop computing system."
< 1596671600 825853 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is exa one level above peta?
< 1596671605 394815 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, I know, but still it's hard to make them do a computation that does anything useful
< 1596671629 526739 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :these are numbers so large that I find it hard to remember even what they're named
< 1596671630 197887 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Exa is indeed one level above peta, and it's also the last level that sounds even borderline reasonable.
< 1596671637 684724 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because nobody's going to take zetta and yotta seriously.
< 1596671646 60871 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"IBM announced Thursday[don't you love such references in an online article without date] that after five years of work, its researchers have been able to reduce from about one million to 12 the number of atoms required to create a bit of data."
< 1596671664 450697 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, tera is 1000**4, peta is 1000**5, exa is 1000**6, zetta is 1000**7, yotta is 1000*8, the mnemonic is that the words are similar to tetra, penta, hexa, septa, octa
< 1596671671 229596 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :with one consonant removed from each
< 1596671684 843942 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: huh, was that intentional?
< 1596671695 712782 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a hard pattern to notice unless it's pointed out
< 1596671730 700670 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, I didn't know it for a while and I kept confusing them all the time. I think it was intentional for at least for some of them, though perhaps not for tera
< 1596671733 512113 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it doesn't generalize backwards, "giga" is nothing like "tri"
< 1596671753 394837 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well mega and giga are just large
< 1596671753 835858 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: nor for the prefixes smaller than 1
< 1596671761 887664 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I finally heard a mnemonic for stalactite/stalagmite that I can actually remember the other day: stalaGmites rise from the Ground, while stalaCtites hang from the Ceiling.
< 1596671772 205672 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: and tera is like terra which is earth which is large... very helpful
< 1596671777 409214 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I learned that in school, I think
< 1596671796 842572 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It doesn't work in Finnish, I'm sure they'd've told it to us too otherwise.
< 1596671822 410840 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I didn't bother to remember the stalagmite thing, I don't do spelunking and will never do it in the future, so I don't think that nomenclature can ever matter for anything I do
< 1596671837 437819 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: statlacTITeS hang from the ceiling... that one works in german as well :P
< 1596671854 481489 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :plus all my spelologist friends speak Hungarian and you can just use the Hungarian names which aren't so crazy
< 1596671854 990505 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(ignore the ceiling, it's all about hanging)
< 1596671890 151079 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are combined from simple words and have obvious etimologies, just like rare words do in any sane language except English
< 1596671894 642980 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how many spelologist friends do you have?
< 1596671898 532845 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's why people have proposed extending the prefixes with stuff like "xona"
< 1596671905 843940 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I think I learned this as a teenager... not in school though, for some reason. :P
< 1596671938 591397 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: depends on how you count "friend", they're all my mother's friends because she goes to caves a lot, although not as a spelologist, but as a teacher
< 1596671939 114427 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Stephen Fry said the mnemonic he was taught in school was based on "tights hang down".
< 1596671950 386399 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but like a dozen
< 1596671952 951079 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: cute
< 1596671959 59413 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(This was in QI, which is where I got the ground/ceiling bit too.)
< 1596671963 503176 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've heard a bunch of mnemonics, but I
< 1596671973 227979 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :'ll always remember Hagrid in Harry Potter just failing
> 1596671985 280154 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07The Past14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76463&oldid=76129 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+253) 10fixed implementation
< 1596671988 686104 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arcorann: aww, I was hoping for "I don't remember any of them"
< 1596672030 462942 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are nice company, I don't have any problem with them, I only have a problem with *me* going into a cave 
< 1596672035 243093 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at school, we got taught things like mnemonics for what order the colors in the rainbow were in
< 1596672051 44331 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it isn't very useful because people aren't taught basic things like what colours indigo and violet actually are
< 1596672071 626608 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(violet is especially problematic because most computer screens are incapable of showing it accurately, and most printers are incapable of printing it accurately)
< 1596672095 56877 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arcorann: yes, because just like me, Hagrid knows that that nomenclature doesn't matter for anything he does and so doesn't try to remember it. he's not a school age child anymore, having to learn thousands of useless facts to get a good grade, nor a lawyer or doctor
< 1596672138 730685 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think one reason they teach what they do in school is that it is hard to know in advance which facts will be useful
< 1596672152 204353 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they're also incapable of showing or printing just about any pure one-wavelength light color
< 1596672177 307208 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could probably make a laser monitor that can show a few of them, but not all
< 1596672181 825942 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed
< 1596672184 964481 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it would be horribly impractical
< 1596672203 908923 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: then again our perception of colors is very limited too
< 1596672205 476883 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, colours outside the red-blue range seem like they're a bigger problem to show than colours inside but not matching your pixel colour
< 1596672213 363316 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least you can interpolate for colours in range
< 1596672226 778825 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: yes, although there are very good reasons for why they're limited
< 1596672284 400830 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I imagine you could make some sort of a refraction-based monitor that could do arbitrary wavelengths by having a mask in-between prisms or something for the color, and then something DLP-style to do the image.
< 1596672315 714050 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder what color we'd get if something would trigger only one of the green or orange receptors in the eye. (M and L types here, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIE_1931_color_space)
< 1596672316 834243 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not a particularly bright one, but still.
< 1596672345 457996 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: specifically you can't see infrared light because your body at your eye emits them as thermal radiation and the light emitted by your body that reaches your eyes will drown out any useful signal from the outside
< 1596672350 586254 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: you can see something like that by looking at something intensely purple for a long time so that the red and blue receptors run out of neurotransmitter
< 1596672359 882679 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and then looking at something green
< 1596672361 258297 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(this would require something special... probably a laser aimed at individual cone cells)
< 1596672375 914461 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1596672381 139506 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting idea
< 1596672420 137655 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've done that experiment with orange, the resulting colour just looks orange, but is perceived as "more orange" than an orange thing nearby (viewed by receptors with a normal neurotransmitter supply)
< 1596672424 631373 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: one of those impossible colors that you can only see as an afterimage, green or yellow that is purer than the green or yellow of a single frequency light
< 1596672446 464131 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah yes, what ais523 says
< 1596672486 577471 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what you can do more easily is to see objects that are brighter than pure white is:
< 1596672493 828649 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ha, someone's done something a little like that, except (of course) with a diffraction grating rather than a prism.
< 1596672505 751142 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :something I learned recently is that we actually know what colours colorblind people see, at least for protanopia and deuteranopia
< 1596672509 468853 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Agile Spectrum Imaging: Programmable Wavelength Modulation for Cameras and Projectors"
< 1596672528 807007 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because there are some people who are colourblind in only one eye, and they can use one eye to learn what colours are named and the other eye to view them colorblindly
< 1596672534 944260 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We use a diffraction grating to disperse the rays into different colors, and introduce a mask (or LCD/DMD) in the optical path to modulate the spectrum."
< 1596672542 411993 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess we do get pretty pure red and pure blue, so the middle range (closer to orange than to green? maybe.) is indeed the interesting one.
< 1596672564 64080 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why non-black washing detergents have a pigment-thingy that remains on the clothes and converts incoming ultraviolet light to visible light, fluorescent or something, so ideally those clothes can be brighter than white, though usually they're just brighter than before but still darker than white, 
< 1596672578 140222 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the easiest way to see actually brighter than white is car registration plates with a white background
< 1596672586 203953 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least if they're not dirty
< 1596672591 746365 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, converting UV to visible light is known as fluorescence
< 1596672622 177090 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, I didn't think registration plates fluoresced, they're just reflective
< 1596672636 95316 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :road signs in the UK are retroreflective, they reflect in a directed way along the path the light came from
< 1596672645 66604 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.nist.gov/programs-projects/hyperspectral-image-projector-hip well maybe it's not quite ready for consumer use yet
< 1596672652 52141 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which means that they're visible in low illumination as long as you're standing next to the source of illumination
< 1596672655 824757 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're always dirty by the way, because it's not worth for anyone to clean it, but part of the reason for the fluorescent paint is that it makes the dirty license plate more visible in infrared photos
< 1596672673 741354 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or something like this, I probably got some important detail wrong
< 1596672733 779116 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: wait, there are people who are colorblind in only one eye? how is that possible? I thought all forms of human colorblindness were strongly linked to genetics
< 1596672754 664721 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: some people have two different sets of DNA, that might be the cause
< 1596672788 296172 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yeah, but that's very rare in humans that survive infanthood I think
< 1596672790 830763 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you're only meant to inherit half a set of DNA from each parent, but sometimes that mechanism goes wrong
< 1596672804 967576 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, that thing, not chimerism
< 1596672836 878968 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :those can be quite bad, polyploidy stuff, but I don't see how they'd cause different colorblindness in eyes
< 1596672869 146888 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: they're not fluorescent? hmm
< 1596672876 260550 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :chimerism isn't that rare, it seems, at least on small scales
< 1596672882 975681 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: road signs are retroreflective, that's true
< 1596672906 842706 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but roads signs isn't the same as car registration plates: car reg plates are in a place that gets dirty much more easily
< 1596672908 245861 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :apparently it's quite common for fraternal twins to belong to multiple blood groups simultaneously as a consequence of small-scale chimerism
< 1596672920 359644 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: nice
< 1596672946 609434 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"maybe it's not quite ready for consumer use yet" => I don't think that will become practical any time soon;
< 1596672987 429491 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there were printers on sale to consumers that used six colors + black rather than three colors + black
< 1596672995 726959 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if anyone bought them, but I saw them advertised
< 1596673010 958022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although of course, that won't get you a full spectral range (especially as it would be hard to make appropriate ink)
< 1596673037 178348 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, I would be happy if there were color consumer cameras with more than three color channels. technically there are a few with four channels, but they're rare and just optimized to give a better RGB picture output, though you can probably get a raw image from them; plus there are cameras that have a built-in motor to insert or remove the infrared filter
< 1596673052 117577 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: blood groups sure, but blood groups is different
< 1596673078 589888 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :full chimerism seems to be rare, or at least rarely confirmed; however, it also typically has no visible symptoms, or symptoms easily mistaken for other things
< 1596673093 60683 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it's likely to usually go undetected
< 1596673095 637504 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: printers => interesting, though I'd be specifically more interested in cameras rather than displays or printers for this
< 1596673104 284952 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I see
< 1596673114 802439 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: I think printers sold specifically as "photo printers" still use multiple inks.
< 1596673121 224919 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well I'm not a doctor or a biologist, so anything I say about those is often wrong
< 1596673146 267196 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :especialyl anything I say two hours after I should have gone to bed, curse you #esoteric
< 1596673167 670149 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_vapor_process is something old that fits into this niche
< 1596673174 987714 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, I think some use magenta, light magenta, blue, light blue, yellow, black
< 1596673177 141665 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for a completely different reason)
> 1596673194 809710 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76464&oldid=76345 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-21) 10not a language
< 1596673206 451808 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: oh yeah, I think that came up in the last two #esoteric discussion about this
> 1596673214 502680 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turinf machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76465&oldid=76308 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+11) 10it's not a programming language if it doesn't have syntax
< 1596673221 65447 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epson's page managed to crash all of Chrome somehow (shouldn't happen, should file a bug), but I can still see the blurb about "enhanced level of quality produced by its 6-colour inks".
< 1596673266 640449 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I learned about this from a making of video of The Birds)
< 1596673272 598320 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: well sure, they must say "enchanced level of quality" or something vague and hard to disprove if they want to sell you a printer for which it's harder to find third-party ink cartridges
< 1596673310 248937 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :though the other trick of putting electronics with a usage counter in ink cartridges such that the printer refuses to use refilled cartridge is much more effective and dirtier
< 1596673312 410379 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think Epson's pretty good with inks, actually. Maybe not the photo ones, but in general I got the impression they haven't been doing as much copyright misuse and so on to control the ink markets.
< 1596673344 78440 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if anyone optimized a break for the electronic ink cartridge thing yet, and if that's legal
< 1596673344 901608 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I may not be remembering the right manufacturer though.)
< 1596673354 616816 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, I wonder if there's some way of figuring out which Chrome process would be good to kill without being able to bring up the Chrome task manager.)
< 1596673372 545570 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what's a "right manufacturer" :-)
< 1596673394 558996 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :A manufacturer of rights.
< 1596673416 90587 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, that goes without saying.
< 1596673501 213127 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sony made a couple of those RGBE color filter cameras (red, green, blue, "emerald") with four primaries.
< 1596673524 114116 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Emerald" is a more marketing-friendly way of saying "cyan".
< 1596673532 625436 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :emerald doesn't look anything like cyan though
< 1596673572 759834 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, well.
< 1596673588 966842 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.dpreview.com/articles/1471104084/sonyrgbeccd
< 1596673593 282277 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :just imagine if Canon or Nikon made cameras that check the signature of the lens and deliberately dumb themselves down on any lens whose manufacturer doesn't pay a license fee for that. I think the first one of the two that does instantly lose their market share to the other
< 1596673620 946339 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: The Bornat book's approach looks pretty complicated.
< 1596673644 157422 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it covers lots of different approaches
< 1596673673 604437 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas some printer manufacturer can do this for cartridges, and Intel can have a cpu library that deliberately pessimizes operations on AMD x86 cpus such that if you just patch all those checks out you instantly get much better performance
< 1596673710 210740 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much should I know about parsers?
< 1596673733 344230 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that rather depends on how much you need to know about parsers
< 1596673744 232509 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :despite that their architecture reference manual spends a lot of words explaining how you should detect cpu features, and that you should never try to guess them from the cpu type or brand, which btw has very good reasons, and yet their own libraries don't folow that
< 1596673746 150477 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're writing a parser generator, for example, you would need to know quite a lot
< 1596673761 923505 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Say I know what LL(k) is. Should I know about LR, LALR, GLR, and all those things?
< 1596673782 325834 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The BLARG parser gives up as soon as it encounters any error.
< 1596673784 802126 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's useful to know what LALR(1) is capable of doing, because that's what most parser generators use in practice
< 1596673801 228228 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I know about packrat, earley, cyk, and so on?
< 1596673802 354953 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :knowing the fine distinctions between the various categories isn't much use unless you're writing a parser generator, though
< 1596673805 352959 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: those four colors aren't really colors, they're filters where the full spectrum matters, so you can't really name them with human color names like red green blue accurately anyway
< 1596673814 744983 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :just like the cone cells
< 1596673824 355859 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you'd need to give a graph of the frequency response
< 1596673829 957075 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're dual spectrums
< 1596673841 957268 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably I should just know all of these things and be a turbo-expert.
< 1596673852 534166 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"red", "green", "blue" are good names for cone cells because different people have slightly different cone cells anyway, so vague names are good for lumping them into vague groups
< 1596673855 282767 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :dual in the linear algebra sense of course
< 1596673902 283902 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: blue sure, but I don't think red and green are. 
< 1596673910 786361 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for camera filters red green blue is better
< 1596673975 617878 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :GLR is cheating because it's fully general but nondeterministic, so the performance gets bad in situations where the generality is needed
< 1596674030 109448 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: you should probably know about LR(k), at least at the level of detail of how it differs from LL(k), not necessarily to how it differs from LALR(k)
< 1596674063 926876 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :LALR(k) is a mild optimisation of LR(k) that sometimes introduces ambiguities but normally only in really contrived situations
< 1596674068 122147 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :mostly because there are grammars that are LALR(1) but not LL(1) that you will meet often
< 1596674096 249831 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so LR(k) is more powerful than LALR(k) but not in any way that's likely to matter in practice
< 1596674120 500550 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :whereas LR(k) versus LL(k) does matter
< 1596674126 37316 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :even in practice
< 1596674134 583416 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, LR(1) is much more powerful than LL(1)
< 1596674143 35329 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and so does LL(k) versus regular grammar obviously)(
< 1596674182 505281 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think LR(k) is intermediate in power between a deterministic push-down automaton and a nondeterministic push-down automaton, isn't it?
< 1596674188 741950 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 100% sure on that
< 1596674223 92081 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I don't have a good idea of what extra power you get from a nondeterministic push-down automaton, either.
> 1596674234 165213 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turinf machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76466&oldid=76465 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+580) 10Added formal syntax
< 1596674247 403629 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess quite a lot?
< 1596674266 401278 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: er... not technically, because you could cheat to convert an LR(k) parser to a push-down automaton by rolling a window of k symbols that the LR parser peeke
< 1596674275 53449 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :peeks into the state of the automaton
< 1596674297 506096 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that converts LR(k) to LR(1)
< 1596674298 545983 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in which case you get a deterministic push-down automaton
> 1596674299 825371 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76467&oldid=76464 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+21) 10Undo revision 76464 by [[Special:Contributions/LegionMammal978|LegionMammal978]] ([[User talk:LegionMammal978|talk]]) - Added formal syntax so it is a language now
< 1596674310 949063 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but ah right, LR(1) does compile into a deterministic PDA
< 1596674314 533564 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: does it? hmm
< 1596674327 938577 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that basically what yacc/ayacc do?
< 1596674334 749516 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe you also need to roll the top m elements of the stack into the state where m is the longest rule you have
< 1596674340 49450 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the legnth of the longest rule you have
< 1596674352 683901 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :your basic operations are shift (push), reduce (pop+branch), and reading input
< 1596674386 387028 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: you can't do that, because a reduce could cause deeper elements to become shallower
< 1596674395 302639 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although you could probably simulate it by popping all the elements and then pushing them back
< 1596674400 210258 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ais523: yes, but the control is also important: LR can look at multiple elements on top of its stack
> 1596674407 503313 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turinf machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76468&oldid=76466 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+14) 10
< 1596674416 131472 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm
< 1596674418 674155 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I dunno then
< 1596674421 259472 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: no it can't, the only time it reads the stack is to read its top element
< 1596674429 427153 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh yeah, it has a state for that
< 1596674432 993535 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry I'm stupid and tired
< 1596674439 518077 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should just go to bed, good nigth
< 1596674442 874035 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :night
< 1596674450 732280 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I stayed up too long last night reading about cryptography
< 1596674469 355171 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-193.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and https://noiseprotocol.org/ btw which I recommend looking at
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< 1596677579 893547 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Speaking of trying to use copyright to control what people do with technology, ran across Apple's "our hard work / by these words guarded / please don't steal" copyright haiku the other day.
< 1596677663 27180 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Other than having a confusing name, the Boyer-Moore majority algorithm is pretty neat and does something that doesn't seem possible at first.
< 1596677691 951151 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Find the majority element in a stream using constant space.)
< 1596677781 523048 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : Clever.
< 1596677797 185701 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :where "majority" strictly means "more than half"
< 1596677811 328422 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :otherwise it's unsolvable
< 1596677860 883735 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right.
< 1596677868 39076 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But you can do "strictly more than 1/k" for any k.
< 1596677912 48284 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, in O(k) space
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> 1596678141 959925 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:RocketRace14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76469&oldid=72180 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+159) 10AAA
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< 1596690700 531456 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I looked at Boyer-Moore in Wikipedia, and it requires to rewind the data to read it again a second time, which depending on how the data is read, may require more space. (But, if you know how many different kind of items there are, it is possible to make a list indexed by that too, I suppose)
< 1596690768 734176 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It requires a rewind if you're not sure there's a majority element.
< 1596690820 745024 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, yes. If you don't care what the answer is if there is no majority (such as because you know there is a majority), then you do not need to rewind it.
< 1596690888 577446 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I forgot that, but, yes you are correct)
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> 1596692628 698409 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Introduction to esolang design14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76470&oldid=44838 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+359) 10/* Methods of Design */
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> 1596693851 972175 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Bangyen14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76471&oldid=76327 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+140) 10/* Implementations */
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< 1596697273 531122 :grumble!~Thunderbi@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Quit: Thanks for coming to or show and being an amazing audience. We have been Look Ma We Made A Band.
< 1596697341 535229 :grumble!~Thunderbi@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596698940 787824 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596701318 382029 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596701443 792090 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596702468 773048 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596703787 701771 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596705332 40206 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596708220 567475 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:a9bf:14f5:d68:131c JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596709174 777139 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596709485 225035 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know about this Boyer-Moore thing, interesting
< 1596709733 774279 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surprised Wikipedia doesn't have a "List of algorithms with ambiguous names" page.
< 1596709976 747578 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh, do they do that? Seems kind of meta...
< 1596709997 266712 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: hehe
< 1596710014 693954 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how many Euler's algorithms and Gauss's algorithms are
< 1596710074 2486 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what I would expect is a disambiguation page for "boyer-moore" algorithm, or at least cross links between the two (or maybe there are others?)
< 1596713335 172655 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is such a page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boyer%E2%80%93Moore
< 1596713424 380005 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was told it is pretty common in bioinformatics to just ask a friend you didn't published with yet to be a co-author to make names less ambiguous
< 1596719985 134044 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1596721244 956948 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596721603 646729 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Turinf machine14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76472 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+1249) 10Turinf machines are Turing-complete
< 1596722518 674350 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:a9bf:14f5:d68:131c QUIT :Quit: Leaving
> 1596723912 365072 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Hanzlu14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76473&oldid=76430 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+58) 10
> 1596723919 370385 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Hanzlu14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76474&oldid=76473 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+105) 10
< 1596724542 814147 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596724686 703368 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: so... what's missing then are the links back to the disambiguation page. Do I care enough... probably not.
< 1596724863 513502 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: But thanks for pointing it out :)
< 1596724952 22643 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: hmm, does that conflict with http://phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=562 the convention where they just include everyone in the lab as an author?
< 1596726667 279600 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :As a person who was the non-first author in 4 out of the 9 publications making up their thesis, I'm happy about these conventions.
> 1596726684 283893 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turinf machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76475&oldid=76468 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+0) 10Reword the specification to make it more clear; add missing halting states syntax
> 1596726689 305659 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Turinf machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76476&oldid=76472 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+1147) 10
< 1596727490 892425 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed
> 1596728150 690945 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07UM814]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76477&oldid=75350 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+11) 10/* Implementations */ fixed link
> 1596728328 382562 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07UM814]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76478&oldid=76477 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+1) 10https
< 1596728489 936449 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596728721 370794 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
> 1596728809 176310 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07714]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76479&oldid=75563 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+129) 10/* Example programs */ added truth machine
> 1596728850 772456 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07714]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76480&oldid=76479 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+27) 10/* Truth machine */
< 1596728945 425964 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596729098 7702 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1596729116 963154 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596729218 962633 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596729408 746166 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ARCAL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76481&oldid=25344 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+127) 10/* External resources */ fixed link
< 1596729894 709732 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596740791 275202 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1596747924 472193 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Bangyen14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76482&oldid=76471 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+26) 10/* Implementations */
> 1596747970 875659 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Number Seventy-Four14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76483&oldid=75463 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+101) 10
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< 1596756188 916683 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1596761167 801748 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76484&oldid=75909 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+621) 10Babalang
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< 1596764656 46122 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:58f3:f67:91a3:9275 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596764919 74662 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:58f3:f67:91a3:9275 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
> 1596765030 212142 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76485 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+3750) 105D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel
> 1596765066 274037 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76486&oldid=76485 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+2) 10RedLink
> 1596765116 444736 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76487&oldid=76486 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+37) 10badlink
> 1596765197 731553 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76488&oldid=76467 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+47) 105D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel
> 1596765279 311006 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76489&oldid=76488 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+41) 10Babalang description
> 1596765316 458405 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76490&oldid=76489 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+14) 10Padlock
> 1596765445 766761 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:RocketRace14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76491&oldid=76469 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+59) 105D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel
> 1596765461 57674 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:RocketRace14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76492&oldid=76491 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+11) 10a
> 1596766371 414736 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76493&oldid=76487 5* 03RocketRace 5* (-1) 10s
> 1596766572 123206 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76494&oldid=76493 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10this
> 1596767572 111099 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76495&oldid=76494 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+378) 10Examples!
> 1596767582 880637 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76496&oldid=76495 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+3) 10/* Undefined behavior time, wonder which prints first */
> 1596767798 628114 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76497&oldid=76496 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+27) 10/* Cat, but faster since the loop doesn't waste one step */
< 1596767917 470824 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:58f3:f67:91a3:9275 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596768205 438058 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:58f3:f67:91a3:9275 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
> 1596769074 848727 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76498&oldid=76497 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+503) 10Notes
> 1596769228 622256 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76499&oldid=76498 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+1) 10/* Notes */
> 1596769237 217029 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76500&oldid=76499 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+0) 10/* Notes */
> 1596769400 24241 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76501&oldid=76500 5* 03RocketRace 5* (-79) 10/* Cat, but faster */
< 1596769588 951508 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :World Trap {?} World Enchantment - Aura ;; Enchant permanent ;; When ~ dies, exile enchanted permanent and add its mana cost into your mana pool.
< 1596769598 465586 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-elwptpdnebmkvtap QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1596770161 491386 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What should be mana cost? (And, should totem armor be added?)
> 1596770432 995122 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D 5D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76502 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+5239) 10i'm not sorry
< 1596770433 977183 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596772200 339315 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596772327 168754 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596774393 62682 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:58f3:f67:91a3:9275 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1596775803 180869 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76503&oldid=76456 5* 03Razetime 5* (+47) 10Added smaller truth machine
< 1596777577 829703 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1596787236 30228 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76504&oldid=76503 5* 03Dion 5* (+269) 10
> 1596787266 132878 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76505&oldid=76504 5* 03Dion 5* (+0) 10
< 1596788599 594277 :kspalaiologos2!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596795816 874548 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-157.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596816108 248118 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596816306 238409 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed
< 1596818596 272211 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596820073 282942 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596821331 690806 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1596822559 479694 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Osmarks/214]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76506 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+198) 10Created page with "My esolangs:  * [[Turi]], a Turing-complete and nightmarish to implement language * [[Embedded HQ9+]], an esolang for use in embedded system design. * possibly others I forgot..."
> 1596822577 484115 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Osmarks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76507&oldid=76106 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+54) 10
< 1596823763 783946 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596824095 648957 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596825363 883645 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1596825958 642132 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Community portal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76508&oldid=76448 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (-9) 10deadname removal
< 1596826068 652694 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It also happened so I was elected the new owner of Esolang discord server
< 1596826096 990274 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we've got some very cool and very smart people like Daniel Cristofani here
< 1596826108 563588 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(and well, quite legendary)
< 1596826191 490715 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596826213 720291 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :kspalaiologos: we also have some very cool and smart and legendary people on #esoteric
< 1596826227 963496 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm well aware of that
< 1596826248 789597 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact, there are a lot of cool and smart people here
< 1596826260 822420 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always liked both you and ais lol
< 1596826302 327372 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596826621 549335 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596826621 870136 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Write error: Broken pipe
< 1596826839 864743 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never knew there is a discord server
< 1596826898 386871 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :``` : myname:; \? discord
< 1596826901 119400 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :The unofficial Esolangs and code golf Discord server: https://discord.gg/3UXSK5p
< 1596826909 878240 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, I know we have an @ command
< 1596826914 351346 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`@ myname ? discord
< 1596826915 941212 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: The unofficial Esolangs and code golf Discord server: https://discord.gg/3UXSK5p
< 1596826952 203022 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also https://esolangs.org/wiki/Esolang:Community_portal
< 1596827010 683021 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is a Discord in case you want to, but IRC is better
< 1596827339 918731 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there are also hidden forums that have to be accessed in some esoteric way
< 1596827372 269770 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, I dunno, running on a webserver written in befunge
< 1596827405 57212 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If so, I do not know of any.
< 1596827425 257889 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe kspalaiologos knows
> 1596827456 729672 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SoundOfScripting14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76509&oldid=76178 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+77) 10Added 5D 5D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel With Multiverse Time Travel
< 1596827492 410689 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :esolang communities I know that are currently closed are, well, closed.
< 1596827511 306925 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although they exist, there's no point in trying to get in because either there are no valuable people there or they're simply inactive.
< 1596827531 976678 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :> There is a Discord in case you want to, but IRC is better - IRC will always be better but it doesn't mean one can't build a good Discord community.
< 1596827533 664861 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : :1:20: error: parse error on input ‘in’
< 1596827551 3274 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is true, you can build a good community, regardless
> 1596827557 716686 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76510&oldid=76490 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+78) 10Added 5D 5D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel With Multiverse Time Travel
> 1596827711 848403 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[075D 5D Brainfuck With Multiverse Time Travel With Multiverse Time Travel14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76511&oldid=76502 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (-7) 10Changed category
< 1596828389 309608 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596830544 158550 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1596830899 274485 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe they should also set up a NNTP server at esolangs.org
< 1596830996 554202 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1596832479 755914 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How to compute the outline path of a Bezier path drawn by a arbitrary pen shape?
< 1596832594 689487 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: that is actually hard
< 1596832623 789313 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: maybe look at Inkscape for what it does, but I think it only does a reasonable approximation
< 1596832688 633417 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, maybe, although I would want a implementation of such a algorithm in PostScript
< 1596833066 643855 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I think you first split your pen shape to convex polygons, and you take the time derivative of your path and intersect it with velocity lines through the origin parallel to the sides of the convex part of the pen to see which vertex of the polygon is in the outline on which segments, and for those segments you get the part of the outline by translating the bezier curve by the position of the 
< 1596833072 850391 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :vertex, or something like that
< 1596833106 546860 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I think METAFONT uses convex polygons as pen shapes, and I did think of using the derivative of the path
< 1596833163 998568 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, Metafont offers two choices: either a convex polygon as the pen or an ellipse as the pen
< 1596833176 915056 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, wait, this has a fancy name
< 1596833182 449324 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's Minkowsky sum
< 1596833255 312611 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can specify an ellipse, but it will be automatically converted into a convex polygon.
< 1596833261 412306 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah
< 1596833318 740347 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that is btw probably because in general the Minkowski sum of a bezier curve path with an ellipse isn't a bezier curve, because an ellipse isn't precisely a bezier curve, though the approximation that we use is so close that it works well enough
< 1596833683 334284 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The reason I would want this is not for fonts; for fonts I can just use METAFONT instead. Rather, it is in case you want to draw stuff other than fonts using the similar methods.
< 1596833718 905938 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596834797 777674 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zivlvbvedlcrpowi JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596835871 919583 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5*  10New user account
< 1596835902 416094 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers NICK :[
> 1596836021 456565 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76512&oldid=76449 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5* (+228) 10/* Introductions */
> 1596836317 298005 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76513 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5* (+1926) 10created penisscript
> 1596836330 713845 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76514&oldid=76513 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5* (-1) 10
< 1596836332 354150 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: sure
> 1596836461 524547 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76515&oldid=76514 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5* (+126) 10
> 1596836649 295880 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76516&oldid=76515 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5* (+11) 10/* Hello, world! program */
> 1596836670 604040 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76517&oldid=76516 5* 03BluebsTopCAt 5* (+6) 10
< 1596836702 163583 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1596836788 106546 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Someskid 5*  10New user account
> 1596837284 11794 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76518&oldid=76512 5* 03Someskid 5* (+155) 10
> 1596837295 417526 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76519&oldid=76517 5* 03Someskid 5* (+0) 10Minor Grammatical Fixes
> 1596837323 469994 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76520&oldid=76519 5* 03Someskid 5* (+1) 10Missing Period
> 1596837387 321367 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Penisscript14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76521&oldid=76520 5* 03Someskid 5* (+0) 10Fix Title Capitalization
< 1596838982 877150 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596840203 138675 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596842850 283198 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will not buy this fungot, it is scratched
< 1596842850 428017 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: you could always fight about the css have any results so far... i've already written
< 1596842896 292685 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Branching out to webdev, are you? 
< 1596842896 604195 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: fnord/ view/ 782) describes some of the places. two allow shadowing, one is sicp... what is your major malfunction? bah
< 1596842978 898767 :shinh_!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1596845059 954070 :shinh_!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596845070 806633 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are you thinking of my "World Trap" card?
< 1596845116 523263 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man. How come writing programs with UIs is a completely ridiculous endeavor these days?
< 1596845145 583512 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's so bad. There are five platforms you need to target and they're all trying to maximize lock-in by having incompatible APIs for everything.
< 1596845146 856585 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596845167 870161 :shinh__!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596845168 593638 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They don't even want you to use the same language, because apparently we're in the 1950s and high-level cross-platform languages haven't been invented yet.
< 1596845326 64232 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depending what you are writing, you could use some VM code, such as Z-machine code or Glulx code; that is why Infocom invented the Z-machine code, for their Zork game.
< 1596845349 60537 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might also be able to use SDL for some stuff, maybe.
< 1596845353 949751 :shinh_!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1596845478 319200 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596845574 55106 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zivlvbvedlcrpowi QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1596847035 898388 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596847069 554794 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596847090 798658 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I was doing some "classic iOS" ObjC things recently, and it was kind of interesting, that whole NeXTSTEPpy object feel and the Interface Builder and stuff.
< 1596847090 906003 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596847107 413236 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although AIUI that's kind of obsolete with Swift and SwiftUI and declarative UIs, which seems like a bit of a shame.
< 1596847112 225018 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's called "classic" now? Is Objective-C deprecated?
< 1596847135 681232 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't get it. I want to write my program in one language, which I get to choose, and I want to compile it to all the different target platforms.
< 1596847164 70405 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't want a Swift-only or Java-only or .NET-only or JavaScript-only or C++-only library as the basic thing the platform provides. That just seems absurd.
< 1596847166 968295 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know about "deprecated", but I think it's not definitely "the new thing".
< 1596847215 418336 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Swift is to Objective-C what Kotlin is to Java, or that's the impression I got.
< 1596847239 972229 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Swift sounds like an OKish language to me.
< 1596847265 865432 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I'm not going to write my program, which needs to be efficient and cross-platform, in Swift. That's just silly.
< 1596847269 977527 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Even better, you don’t even need to type semi-colons."
< 1596847287 321754 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure I'd highlight that as a big selling point on the very top of https://developer.apple.com/swift/ though.
< 1596847303 845924 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think the semi-colons were the problem.
< 1596847312 737803 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Objective-C is a superset of C, I think, so you can write everything else except the UI in C, I think.
< 1596847367 307472 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really want to write my UI six times.
< 1596847385 299960 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, see, you get six software development teams who each write the UI once.
< 1596847395 212554 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Six: Mac OS, iOS, Android, Windows, Linux, web.
< 1596847416 489968 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mac OS and iOS are converging a little, aren't they? 
< 1596847458 599292 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sort of outside my field of view, but that's what it felt like. Or at least they were already much closer than Android and [anything else].
< 1596847484 919303 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, maybe. Writing a different UI for desktop and mobile actually does make some sense.
< 1596847530 435863 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you know... "Qt is the fastest and smartest way to produce industry-leading software that users love."
< 1596847534 9825 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596847539 60139 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really want to use C++, though.
< 1596847552 503720 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Qt might be one fo the most reasonable answers? But that doesn't seem great.
< 1596847573 248226 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I remember Nokia's Linux phones were kind of heavily banking on Qt.
< 1596847689 846373 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What you will do, it might depend what program you are writing, too.
< 1596847727 856763 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would write my own UI code, except for a few things that make it tricky.
< 1596847744 459733 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The main things are: Rendering text, and handling text in general; accessibility.
< 1596847747 820582 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What program are you trying to write?
< 1596847793 175623 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nothing at the moment. I gave up on some programs I was trying to write.
< 1596847803 946073 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Even the idea of making a simple GUI program is kind of daunting, though.
< 1596847806 61331 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1596847842 959055 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I generally write command line programs instead, since many thing we don't need the GUI.
< 1596847996 95696 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But sometimes you might be able to use SDL or something like that
< 1596848011 322673 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although, SDL doesn't handle text)
< 1596848044 982163 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, even with rendering/handling text, it still depend what stuff you need to do, since different applications require different text handling.
< 1596848106 355980 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :All applications require the same text handling: They must render "Professional Octopus of the World" in 12pt Arial.
< 1596848242 583461 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, that isn't quite correct. Even if needs to render arbitrary text, it might not need 12pt Arial, and even if it is, it can depend on if the render is on the screen or printer, too.
< 1596848343 542528 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :
< 1596850042 217403 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596850499 122817 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is then consideration of kerning, ligatures, line breaking, etc, depending on what is needed.
< 1596850787 439978 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596851754 893061 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1596852188 852278 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596852204 998095 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1596852386 646598 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596852589 852443 :Phantom__Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1596852947 100463 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, how much is twelve points depend on the application too. Some programs use 1/72 inch, and some use 1/72.27 inch. The PostScript documentation specifically says that 1/72 inch isn't a point, but it is approximately equal to one point (it doesn't give an exact number of how much is one point).
< 1596853007 504426 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, I will suggest to call 1/72.27 inch a "small point" and 1/72 inch a "big point", I suppose.
< 1596853046 605726 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596853048 860443 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :A smoint and a boint, for short.
< 1596853113 118041 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK.
< 1596853341 738047 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know how solvers for forall-exists kinds of problems work?
< 1596853373 714685 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean Σ_2 or Π_2, I guess.
< 1596853384 604339 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How much harder is it than SAT?
< 1596853617 812899 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-hqqrcxaddehikowt QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596853840 419804 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wazyaewkvaygjhzg JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596854032 448245 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596854313 481220 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1596857279 477471 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596857581 430103 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1596858983 39726 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596859039 608771 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there any programming KOTH competitions running currently?
< 1596859193 197759 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :bobbeh
< 1596859226 826564 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Programming?
< 1596859380 349960 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596859530 766661 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596859531 80178 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596859934 311445 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what is "KOTH competitions"
< 1596859983 332974 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Competitions where user-submitted programs battle it out, to be King of the Hill (KotH)
< 1596859999 826746 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK
< 1596860380 163667 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :There was one on here a while back, that orbitaldecay ran, as a brainfuck competition, but no more have occurred since.
< 1596860530 779337 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596860696 959748 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, there was one before, but I don't know if it is at this time, now.
< 1596860827 780460 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596861011 476817 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you want any other programming languages with it?
< 1596861040 113101 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Any programming language will do, but I'd prefer esolangs.
< 1596861059 169541 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, zzo, I finished proving Eldritch TC a while ago.
< 1596861134 144689 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. You should add a esolang wiki article about Eldritch then.
< 1596861154 60051 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that it is sufficiently notable to be on the wiki.
< 1596861310 22876 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, although I think esolang wiki doesn't require so much notability as Wikipedia does.
< 1596861359 896737 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz PRIVMSG #esoteric :Eldritch bears many similarities to existing languages, such as Befunge, though I didn't even know about them before you mentioned it. For this reason I won't post it.
< 1596861393 608158 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, if you do not want to post, is OK
< 1596863434 170103 :Antebrationist!ca9a855d@202-154-133-93.ubs-dynamic.connections.net.nz QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596864393 942038 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1596867386 380024 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596867405 792631 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596869634 497833 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:313b:65f8:b919:b4a0 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596870321 691242 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-180.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: yes, writing UI programs sucks these days. other people have noticed that too.
< 1596870463 768640 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596870526 909102 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596871832 773189 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596874058 353910 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596874203 857361 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1596882322 412449 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596882631 228563 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1596883004 461507 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596883262 11351 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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< 1596887527 548312 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: do your bridges work on the first try?
< 1596887527 829483 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: so far no mime types" http://srfi.schemers.org/ srfi-27/ is that once the basics are working, and stuff like that
< 1596887772 60535 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :application/x-broken-bridge
< 1596887832 139039 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do I feel like I saw a funny MIME type just recently? No recollection what it could've been.
< 1596887898 907514 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe it was the 'application/vnd.PHE-COVID19.v1+json' content type used by the UK COVID-19 data API, but that's not especially funny, just maybe oddly specific.
< 1596888385 563732 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I'm playing https://www.gog.com/game/bridge_constructor
< 1596888443 459539 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm finding that the addition of sloped bridges made this much more fun.
< 1596888465 187208 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I played a little bit of Poly Bridge (1) recently, which that looks quite similar to.
< 1596888546 141384 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah there are a number of clones of the original (I think) Bridge Builder
< 1596888625 464754 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like there's also a Bridge Constructor / Portal crossover game.
< 1596888643 959736 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how they compare, the Bridge Constructor franchise is the only one I've played.
< 1596888879 413903 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've tried that one too (gog has a promo bundle with three variants including that one, https://www.gog.com/promo/20200806_launch_promo_bridge_constructor)
< 1596888981 421612 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have portals, they have accelerating goo and bouncing goo, they have turrets, they have switches and companion cubes... they may be overdoing it a little, but it's still enjoyable. I kind of miss the budget constraints actually.
< 1596889002 607541 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm kind of unhappy that I only have the Android version of Poly Bridge (had some expiring Play Store credits to lose, at it was on sale for something like £0.99), and the small-touchscreen user experience really isn't quite the same as having a monitor and a mouse.
< 1596889004 22070 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(They still display a cost, so you /can/ minimize that.)
< 1596889050 144420 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It runs okay on Chrome OS's Android app support, and you can click on buttons with the mouse, but none of the actual bridge parts deign to be interacted with the mouse.
< 1596889050 854660 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The portals mean that you have cars going vertically, and also can be used to flip car directions... some levels have you cross the car's own path.
< 1596889061 387454 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, yeah, it's cute.
< 1596889062 188737 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Presumably the code is specific to "touch" events on those.)
< 1596889211 675977 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596889314 770802 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But the sloping really got me... instead of connecting start and end in a straight line you get to do things like http://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/bbslope.jpg (partial bridge, I removed the supporting structures, from a (the?) christmas themed level set)
< 1596889956 187982 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how many civil engineers this game has ruined. "I can make this bridge at half the cost, you just have to be careful when driving on it."
< 1596890335 495029 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still remember Armadillo Run, has anyone else heard of that?
< 1596890374 562527 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
< 1596890389 892095 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596890570 582741 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, not I
< 1596890832 980687 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. I do remember the TIM games though.
< 1596890975 872432 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hit the fish bowl with the rocket so that the cat chases the mouse to the switch...
< 1596890989 756943 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :TIM was great.
< 1596891053 136803 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Much like bridge-building, the best parts (for me, anyway) are the ridiculous almost certainly unintended "somehow, it all worked" solutions.
< 1596891072 849165 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://classicreload.com/sites/default/files/styles/game_image/public/dosx-the-incredible-machine-screenshot.png
< 1596891161 548472 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : It's funny how the magnifying glass can magically focus light exactly on the flammable object, no matter what the orientation, as long as it's roughly the right way round.
< 1596891176 162092 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Must have some control circuitry and optics in it.
< 1596891332 649113 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nah, it's just Maxwell's demon directing the photons, violating the laws of thermodynamics.
< 1596891495 749930 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is trying to figure out which elements are *missing* from the title screen. Amazingly there is quite a few... hamster wheel, generator, motor, dynamite, candle, rocket, tennis ball, basket ball, all the steel parts... I'm almost certain I'm forgetting something, there were just too many things.
< 1596891541 40215 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The bellows.
< 1596891789 952221 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and a bouncy trampoline.
< 1596891817 402246 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh the the trampoline...
< 1596891821 435001 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://the-incredible-machine.fandom.com/wiki/The_Incredible_Machine_(game)/Parts   of course someone's made a list
< 1596891841 75810 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those things were annoying, so much fiddling to find a good placement.
< 1596891883 97761 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean sure, that's basically the whole game, but trampolines actually stood out in that regard.
< 1596892016 793686 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh the monkey, how did I forget the monkey.
< 1596892044 588351 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's easily the most adorable thing in the whole game.
< 1596892114 55718 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I didn't know about the special parts.
< 1596892434 168333 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :One cute idea in the medieval bridge constructor is that it makes non-working bridges a feature: you lure enemies onto a bridge and let them plummet to their death. It has to collapse at the right moment for this to work.
< 1596892575 975513 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.mdpi.com/2073-8994/7/3/1289/htm
< 1596896623 757799 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596898649 138832 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MailBox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76522&oldid=57701 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+777) 10added interpreter link and TC proof
< 1596900233 261915 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I didn't know about the special parts either.
< 1596900428 776476 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :look at this nice load distribution... https://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/load.jpg (bridgebuilder, possible spoiler for one wood only train bridge)
< 1596900435 932559 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/builder/constructor/
< 1596900930 162912 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1596902625 257884 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1596903154 865144 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1596903162 895994 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596903770 995377 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1596905189 317471 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :did you like this link about computing with tangles?
< 1596905203 797316 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1596906310 628804 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:The Insane Esolang14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76523&oldid=68139 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+239) 10/* Invalid submissions */
< 1596907349 63546 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I didn't remember TIM being this clunky when it comes to the interface though. Wonder if that's just DOSBox acting up.
< 1596907361 776022 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596909303 787539 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1596909494 545177 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596910626 939107 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596910694 742470 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1596911445 751019 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember 320x200 being an acceptable graphics resolution ;)
< 1596911489 745701 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Depending how many things you need to display, maybe it is.
< 1596911527 468295 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the idea ist that the resolution and smoothness of, say, mouse movements, are related)
< 1596911902 80708 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that it is
< 1596912277 945980 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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> 1596913056 811092 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brotlipython14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76524 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+1424) 10Created page with "{{infobox proglang |name=Brotlipython |paradigms=multiparadigm |author=[[User:Osmarks|osmarks]] |year=[[:Category:2020|2020]] |class=:Category:Turing complete|Turing complet..."
> 1596913250 415814 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Osmarks/214]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76525&oldid=76506 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+68) 10
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< 1596913809 191973 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just visited a small museum in Budapest in which the best part is a small and cheap but well-composed representattive selection of digital computers, from the first many-cupboard vacuum tube machines up to recent enough stuff that they won't have a time gap when they later try to expand it. The 80s and 90s home microcomputer era in the middle is the most interesting, because it has a mixture of models 
< 1596913815 283526 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imported from West Europe and ones produced locally. 
< 1596913911 636341 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There were a few pocket calculators, only Eastern ones, but of course the best ones of those are clones of calculators from the West. The two programmables on display are http://www.rskey.org/CMS/index.php/7?manufacturer=H%EDrad%E1stechnika&model=PTK-1023 and http://www.rskey.org/CMS/index.php/7?manufacturer=H%EDrad%E1stechnika&model=PTK-1072
< 1596913973 757472 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :While the collection is good, the labels are terrible. With the digital computers, where I had some foreknowledge to be able to recognize stuff, but in general, there are barely any labels from which you could find out anything about objects you're not familiar with.
< 1596914010 126887 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for reference: https://www.mmkm.hu/hu/kiallitasaink/a-muszaki-tanulmanytar-allando-kiallitasa Magyar Muszaki es Kozlekedesi Muzeum, a Muszaki Tanulmanytar allando kiallitasa, 11. kerulet Lagymanyosi hid labanal.
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< 1596917646 868632 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe my new format for a printing document file (like PDF and DjVu) can be called "PDQ", since it is a alternative of PDF. One of the parts of this project would be to write a complete specification, another part would be to write a Ghostscript driver to target it, and the other part is to write the viewer software.
< 1596917954 68645 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The full specification should be available in a plain text format, so that you do not require an implementation to already exist in order to read it.
> 1596919121 912448 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Suspicious Garbage 5*  10New user account
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> 1596919616 759004 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76526&oldid=76518 5* 03Suspicious Garbage 5* (+242) 10/* Introductions */
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< 1596932612 811358 :h!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net NICK :hhhhh
< 1596932640 932234 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello. does anyone here know much about golfscript? im slightly confused about how arrays work. for example, how would i take an array on the stack and increment its 3rd value by 1?
< 1596932664 871459 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know a bit about GolfScript but not much
< 1596932673 925782 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it has many fewer builtins than you'd expect from a golfing language
< 1596932721 166296 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but in most cases, arrays in golfing languages are treated as a single object, rather than being modified
< 1596932738 900534 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the operation you want, you should think of as "replace this array with a copy in which the third value is incremented"
< 1596932759 115457 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see. how would one go about doing so?
< 1596932805 150616 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :GolfScript is one of the older ones though I think; there are many newer ones with more commands
< 1596932827 244069 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :for an array of length 3, [0,1,2 1+]? that seems really ungolflike.
< 1596932827 993119 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm trying to find a good builtin to use
< 1596932843 827708 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :[0,1,2,1+] oops
< 1596932858 541938 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38 any good examples?
< 1596932905 54153 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually this is a hard operation in most golfing languages I think
< 1596932915 932332 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :strange.
< 1596932942 134417 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i was thinking of doing so because im trying to find a nice esolang to implement an esolang interpreter in#
< 1596932945 225105 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :hhhhh: Well, there are many, actually; there may be a list or category on esolang wiki (and if not, maybe there should be? Discuss and figure it out, I suppose)
< 1596932968 124524 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Jelly it would be something like 1+$3¦
< 1596932971 962766 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i need to store a direction, a PC and the program itself, i was thinking of doing that in an array
< 1596932978 862251 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :jelly seems complicated, ive looked at it
< 1596932997 204006 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, https://tio.run/##y0rNyan8/99QW8X40LL///9HG@oY6RjrmOiYxgIA
< 1596933014 705844 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :only ¦ is really weird and unintuitive, and that's still a lot longer than you'd expect
< 1596933022 97934 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is "$3¦"?
< 1596933126 724080 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :¦ is a quick that combines two code fragments
< 1596933139 945558 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the first fragment is 1+ which adds 1 to things
< 1596933150 389743 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although, I should just have used the increment builtin, ‘
< 1596933158 60643 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the second fragment is 3 which is the array index to affect
< 1596933174 369791 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :whats $
< 1596933179 954192 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ¦ operates on an array only at certain indexes (although it does this by operating on the whole of the array)
< 1596933198 967021 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :$ is a grouping command that effectively puts the previous two code fragments into a group, like putting parentheses around them
< 1596933208 321960 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also indicates that they take one argument (in this case, an array)
< 1596933233 698255 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we need to group them because otherwise ¦ will operate on + and 3, not on 1+ and 3
< 1596933248 72629 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I replace 1+ with the builtin, the $ isn't needed: https://tio.run/##y0rNyan8//9RwwzjQ8v@//8fbahjpGOsY6JjGgsA
< 1596933269 793649 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is the ¦ needed?
< 1596933286 100817 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, nvm.
< 1596933322 190055 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :so (chain) (number) ¦ executes (chain) on array index (number)?
< 1596933327 423022 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :right
< 1596933336 452809 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm neat.
< 1596933347 669941 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :except it doesn't, what it actually does is to execute the chain on the entire array, then put all the indexes other than the listed one back to what they were
< 1596933354 986220 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this might be a bug
< 1596933363 602118 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes that does seem strange
< 1596933404 528634 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it comes to the same result in most cases, but when it doesn't it can be very confusing
< 1596933558 881911 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in Brachylog, the best I can do is to rotate the element to the start, increment it, then rotate the array back into order: https://tio.run/##SypKTM6ozMlPN/r//1HbrkdNTdqPmhpPbXjUthvI/v8/2lDHSMdYx0THVMcs9n8UAA
< 1596933577 255298 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, unicode characters
< 1596933580 998476 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`! brachylog [1,2,3,4,5,6]↺₂+₁ʰ↻₂w
< 1596933583 244646 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :do they count as a single byte for golfing purposes
< 1596933584 3203 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[1,2,4,4,5,6] \ true.
< 1596933606 16436 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it isn't Unicode, most modern golfing languages make use of their own character sets with 256 different characters
< 1596933615 825438 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they aren't encoded as Unicode, but they are encoded as a single byte each
< 1596933640 833452 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay. so if i make a golfing language it should only have up to 256 characters?
< 1596933662 172057 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the number of characters used should be a power of 2, using 256 different characters is nicely usable because you can have one byte per character
< 1596933680 736132 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if, say, you only use 16 different characters then you can fit in two per byte, which halves the length of your code
< 1596933701 974775 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, in this case they are all characters which are present in Unicode; I don't know if some uses characters which are not present in Unicode, although I do not expect so; there may be some whose Unicode representation is ambiguous, though, possibly
< 1596933704 667119 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most people use 256 though, or rather, they have 256 but don't use all of them (which makes their code somewhat suboptimal)
< 1596933726 680728 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, it's common to use characters that all exist in Unicode, but to use a non-Unicode encoding for them
< 1596933765 474420 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this isn't always the case, e.g. Mathematica uses one character that isn't in Unicode (and when encoded as Unicode, encodes it to a private-use character), although it isn't a golfing language despite sometimes being used as one
< 1596933782 968192 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What character is that?
< 1596933845 82140 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1596933849 22834 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a sort of lambda-like operator, according to the source I got it from it looks quite similar to ↦
< 1596933872 743429 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(but Mathematica treats it as a distinct character )
< 1596933874 525421 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode 
< 1596933876 233552 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+F4A1  - No such unicode character name in database]
< 1596933911 532563 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :very great language design
< 1596933918 112646 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you ask Mathematica to save in a Unicode encoding then decode it using a different program, it becomes the private use character U+F4A1
< 1596933984 125110 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jelly's character set was chosen to be typable on at least one pre-existing keyboard layout, without use of a compose key
< 1596934028 390810 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK, so that is what it is.
< 1596934072 341634 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've had enough problems in Jelly with the distinction between Đ and Ð
< 1596934075 892321 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode Đ
< 1596934077 99080 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+0110 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER D WITH STROKE]
< 1596934082 112156 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`unidecode Ð
< 1596934084 749472 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​[U+00D0 LATIN CAPITAL LETTER ETH]
< 1596934122 142657 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :U+00D0 is in Jelly's character set, U+0110 isn't, and it's easy to accidentally type the wrong one and have the UTF-8 to Jelly convertor produce an invalid program as a result
< 1596934127 149626 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it doesn't even error…)
< 1596934153 578638 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the lowercase forms are đ and ð respectively, which is why they're different characters
< 1596934191 938379 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Presumably the converter should convert both U+0110 and U+00D0 into the same Jelly character code, when you are using input in Unicode, to avoid such a problem. (When converting into Unicode, you would only do U+00D0 out and not U+0110, I suppose)
< 1596934193 68270 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't distinguish the uppercases in the font I'm using, though
< 1596934201 162517 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which would be better, I think.
< 1596934206 558301 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I agree
> 1596934272 790497 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76527&oldid=76446 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+52) 10Jumpey
> 1596934303 840082 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76528&oldid=76527 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+2) 10/* Control flow operations */
> 1596934379 506395 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76529&oldid=76528 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+92) 10/* Surreal literals */
> 1596934422 161552 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76530&oldid=76529 5* 03RocketRace 5* (+17) 10/* Stack operations */
< 1596934457 36159 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The font I have does not seem to distinguish those two characters either, it look like to me)
> 1596934476 916601 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Subreal14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76531&oldid=76530 5* 03RocketRace 5* (-17) 10/* Stack operations */
> 1596934507 817373 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Varsig14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76532&oldid=20557 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+224) 10added interpreter link and categories
< 1596934519 224120 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://tio.run/##S85KzP3/v1BdQb9aKcrV3y8kPMTDzd/NM9gz2NXV089TKcbIRtlIv1b1/39/P1eFkHB/hRCPIFcICyTi5h8apBDsGQEA CJam is cool
< 1596934588 996768 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not very experienced with CJam, but it's basically best thought of as GolfScript 2
< 1596934599 266050 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's very similar to GolfScript but has a much better set of builtins
< 1596934634 205222 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, i thought it was pretty crazy that golfscript had you type entire english words like "do", "while", "if"...
< 1596934778 238854 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the things I like least about Brachylog is that it supports multiple-character variable names
< 1596934815 135673 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :does it require them?
< 1596934818 585510 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :from my perspective, it is unlikely that you will need more than 26 generic variables in a golfing language program (in fact, needing more than 2 is rare)
< 1596934824 24118 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, single-character variable names are allowed
< 1596934837 34839 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but, it means that syntax consisting of two consecutive letters can't be used for another purpose
< 1596934837 537309 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how is it a bad thing to support things that arent required to be used?
< 1596934840 862009 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, i see.
< 1596934865 423924 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a good compromise would be to require multiple-character variable names to all start with the same letter
< 1596934871 257444 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. Z
< 1596934902 189926 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :then any of the other 25 variables could be used for syntax where concatenating them meant something (the obvious meaning in Brachylog is to have an implicit "and" between them)
< 1596934902 532287 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :imagine not having 676 variables in your esolang. how terrible.
< 1596934927 835286 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this only becomes less space-efficient than the original when you have 53 or more variables
< 1596934940 251900 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even using 3 is a bit of a stretch
< 1596934961 985023 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(most golfing languages have very concise ways to deal with temporaries)
< 1596934980 715442 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Jelly has only one variable for the entire program, which feels a bit restrictive sometimes, but it's rarely an issue in practice
< 1596935095 406613 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :fair enough
< 1596935122 166860 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :most programs don't use it
< 1596935128 728287 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i need to make an esolang interpreter where the PC has direction, so storing the program, the PC and its direction would be probably good for what i need to do
< 1596935155 56978 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have suggested that Jelly should have a global *dictionary*; this would allow you to simulate arbitrary many global variables if you needed them by using one key per variable, and would also be useful for other purposes)
< 1596935240 704791 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, no built in base conversion in cjam?
< 1596935278 393399 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :people have gotten better at making golfing languages over time
< 1596935308 974506 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :time to find "cjam but actually utilizing the 256 character limit slightly more"
< 1596935313 166609 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think the best way to make one is to look at existing golfing languages to see which builtins you need, but come up with something innovative in terms of encoding or control flow or data flow
< 1596935350 911979 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, id be quite happy with just cjam+extra builtins like base conversion, really
< 1596935359 816651 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does Jelly have any dictionary object at all? Also, if you were to extend it, how to do?
< 1596935404 800656 :hhhhh!925af2f5@245.242.90.146.dyn.plus.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah cjam does have base conversion i missed it oops
< 1596935438 501682 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I started writing a new specification of a golf programming language too, but it is not finish yet.
< 1596935473 368890 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: it has some support for interpreting an array of key-values pairs as though it were a dictionary
< 1596935506 998305 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but probably doesn't have any actual dictionaries (unless you can somehow jailbreak the interpreter into running arbitrary Python)
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> 1596940881 610640 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Rui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76533&oldid=76233 5* 03DanielCristofani 5* (+198) 10/* Examples */
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> 1596944760 652997 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Two14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76534 5* 03Caenbe 5* (+1351) 10Created talk page with attempt at a rigorous def.
< 1596945506 431436 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0b7:14e4:7381:d50f JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596946442 145511 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
> 1596949468 501105 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bit~14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76535&oldid=63897 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+103) 10
< 1596949523 994022 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596949832 635566 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Bangyen14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76536&oldid=76482 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+126) 10/* Implementations */
> 1596950070 305624 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:MAWP14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76537 5* 03JonoCode9374 5* (+278) 10Created page with "= Negative Numbers = I used to be able to. Now I can't.  How do I do it? ~~~~"
< 1596950607 190665 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
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> 1596952306 525986 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Bangyen14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76538&oldid=76536 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+26) 10
< 1596953904 132593 :[!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers NICK :uplime
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> 1596975968 937122 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03LegionMammal978 5*  10moved [[02Penisscript10]] to [[PenisScript]]: fix capitalization
< 1596976759 87422 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I can't distinguish the uppercases in the font I'm using, though" => I can distinguish icelandic Eth and serbian Dje but that's because it's in my terminal font and I specifically want all common non-space chars distinguishable even if that makes one of them ugly
< 1596977025 461207 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so the icelandic Eth has a slanted stroke
< 1596977684 569687 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596983057 788290 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76541&oldid=76001 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+241) 10
< 1596987341 781987 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596989237 907106 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596989240 23465 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Divzeros14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76542&oldid=20843 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+196) 10added interpreter link and categories
< 1596989670 148858 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1596989753 3711 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1596994417 950366 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1596994822 554085 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Btw, annoyances... why does https://github.com/ (coming there without a cookie) give me a prominent signup dialog, but no direct way of logging in? That requires an extra click...
< 1596994887 556745 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Rhetorical question, I think I know why. I don't think it's a *good* reason.)
< 1596994891 862976 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? device
< 1596994894 418311 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :A device is a browser session. Please verify your device.
< 1596994895 63015 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(related)
< 1596995023 966349 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :logging into bitbucket is horrible as well
< 1596995070 560541 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot. I removed the bitbucket account that I once had.
< 1596995073 899307 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1596995245 918637 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The best part of that was the final paragraph here: http://sprunge.us/OWUWYH
> 1596995598 817036 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76543&oldid=75792 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-23) 10
> 1596995772 741222 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Qu 1.014]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76544&oldid=75492 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+6) 10
< 1596996108 395235 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1596996221 691294 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76545&oldid=76543 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-85) 10
> 1596996266 914277 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bigspace14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76546&oldid=75158 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-55) 10removed the first warning
> 1596996439 208297 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Espaol14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76547&oldid=75008 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+26) 10
> 1596996627 945066 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07XPML1714]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76548&oldid=50647 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+15) 10+stub
< 1596996907 235181 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Oh, I heard it through the grapefruit / Oh, I'm just about to lose my mind" makes equally much sense as the actual lyrics.
> 1596996963 537642 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Anarchysm14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76549&oldid=75798 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-27) 10-uncomputable category
> 1596997160 373129 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Flv 5*  10New user account
> 1596997242 224760 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76550&oldid=76545 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+111) 10
> 1596997381 430516 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76551&oldid=76526 5* 03Flv 5* (+96) 10/* Introductions */
> 1596997456 885675 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Flv14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76552 5* 03Flv 5* (+127) 10Created page with "hello ! i am currently studying esolangs in general ! for a talk !  i have been involved in the creation of the esolang fleuve."
< 1596997561 578664 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit
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> 1597002348 607908 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Trueclone14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76553 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+2515) 10Created page with "{{lowercase}} '''Trueclone''' is an esoteric language designed to make [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaghetti_code Spaghetti code].  == trueclone == * trueclone uses goto st..."
> 1597002398 97892 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76554&oldid=76550 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-24) 10
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> 1597005383 282544 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Number Seventy-Four14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76555&oldid=76483 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+63) 10
> 1597006364 83738 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Complode14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76556&oldid=53084 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+189) 10added interpreter link and categories
> 1597006825 154788 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:BytFuck14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76557 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+280) 10Created page with "==Questions== *  and  move both pointers, correct? * Which bit is the first bit? * Are cells still unsigned? * Is the tape still right unbounde..."
< 1597006834 456892 :Davenz!~davenz@37.163.149.102 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597006883 505511 :Davenz!~davenz@37.163.149.102 PRIVMSG #esoteric :accidenti,ne cercavo una in italiano!
< 1597006976 593934 :Davenz!~davenz@37.163.149.102 QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1597008734 75943 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello ! does anyone have links/resources related to esoteric interpreters ? def: an unusual interpreter that can be used on any language. i have been googling but most things I find are about esoteric language interpreters, and not general interpreters... does this make sense ? thanks !
> 1597009700 960992 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Number Seventy-Four14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76558 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+257) 10Created page with "==Questions== * If the data string is only output once the program terminates, doesn't that mean that the truth machine never outputs anything when the input is 1..."
> 1597009811 322088 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Number Seventy-Four14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76559&oldid=76558 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+97) 10
< 1597010218 8267 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :flv: there's no interpreter that can interpret any language. that's literally impossible.
< 1597010259 357677 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, yes, but also, it depends what you mean by interpreter ?
< 1597010298 700432 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :elanamirellam: also we know he's in a place with no good wired internet suppliers, so maybe you can guess location from that
< 1597010470 619367 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I assume amazon.de and amazon.nl and amazon.fr doesn't have enough computer parts that ship there too
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> 1597011434 831533 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:AlvinBalvin32114]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76560&oldid=76335 5* 03AlvinBalvin321 5* (+0) 10
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> 1597014926 843284 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Iah 5*  10New user account
> 1597015179 323856 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76561&oldid=76551 5* 03Iah 5* (+91) 10
> 1597015227 471428 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76562&oldid=76561 5* 03Iah 5* (+0) 10
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> 1597019873 944531 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Number Seventy-Four14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76563&oldid=76559 5* 03Bangyen 5* (+82) 10
< 1597020013 703982 :portalrat!~muskrat@trivialand/player/muskrat JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597021473 30992 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder how many significantly different media types there are for which a language can be optimized, for how many of them has an entirely new language unrelated to any previously existed language or an entirely new script ever get created, and whether there are esoteric possibilities there waiting for us.
< 1597021516 659130 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you give any examples?
< 1597021605 928045 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :For writing, there are forms of writing optimized for writing in soft clay that may later be burned to hard, carving in hard stone, carving in wood, writing on paper with ink, on paper with typewriter, on paper with traditional professional metal press, on paper with digital graphics-capable monocolored printer, 
< 1597021679 727202 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK. Yes, there are, but I don't know if other media than what you mentioned.
< 1597021682 299946 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :on paper with digital graphics-capable multicolored printer, punched on paper with a hand-operated stylus and read tactile, punched on paper by more complicated means and read tactile, formed from bended neon lights;
< 1597021720 732262 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, yes, although often neon lights don't use a different alphabet, just a different style
< 1597021743 107812 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for sign languages there's ordinary sign languages, variants optimized for signing mostly or completely one-handed, and more tactile versions for communications to blind-deaf; 
< 1597021776 528607 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :from spoken there's ordinary speech, whispering, shouting, whistling, humming, and maybe some musical instruments.
< 1597021788 54712 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Somehow I thought you only meant writing at first, but yes, there is that too.
< 1597021806 785990 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yes, for most of these I can only think of examples that are just modified variants of others, which is for practical reasons of not having to learn too many different languages or forms of writing.
< 1597021912 471506 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, and there's optimized for speech in a noisy environment, for which we have the English-based language used in air traffic communication.
< 1597021928 690713 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's probably a lot of untapped esoteric potential.
< 1597021932 287233 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, yes.
< 1597021938 861463 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: in my thoughts, I am envisioning interpreters as an artistic interpretation of a program, like in a drama. e.g. let's say, i was to write an interpreter that reads only fully-formed words in English that are part of the program ? does this make sense ?
< 1597021983 863081 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :this interpreter could work with any given program, no matter which language it was written it. it's just that it's not a very useful interpretation...!
< 1597022023 1374 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :flv: I don't really understand. How is it still an interpreter for that language if it doesn't execute the program?
< 1597022067 387948 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I'll have to sleep on this and try to think of the best untapped esoteric potential.
< 1597022117 353434 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolangers have already invented a lot of strange esolangs that use weird types of media of course, probably popularized a lot by Piet.
< 1597022117 502323 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I mean, you could then write something to execute the code that follows the interpretation
< 1597022189 661585 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I should start a list of interesting esolangs on my esowiki userpage, with short spoilery descriptions, because many esolang names are easy to forget even if you remember what the language does.
< 1597022222 781014 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: e.g. associate each English word with a certain binary number and call it a day ?
< 1597022355 885273 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Efghij is my favorite esoteric media type for esolangs
< 1597022549 981015 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Yes, make such a list including descriptions; I might like to see too (and maybe I forgot, too)
< 1597023813 93004 :flv!c0de8242@192-222-130-66.qc.cable.ebox.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1597024700 87284 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Eodermdrome14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76564&oldid=63648 5* 03Ais523 5* (-29) 10/* Implementations */ unpipe link
< 1597025494 933943 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1597025791 350906 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76565&oldid=50841 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-6) 10fixed title
> 1597025802 228614 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76566&oldid=76565 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+1) 10
> 1597025817 387334 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76567&oldid=76566 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+2) 10
> 1597025853 754464 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76568&oldid=76567 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+2) 10I should really use the preview
< 1597026748 317369 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose other possibilities may include multi-peoples hand signs, hand signs with flags, non-humans signs/writing/speech, computer displays (both low and high resolutions can be considered, and both mono and colours), air writing with smoke (or magic, if you want to consider stuff other than actual stuff), speech with especially short or long durations, etc.
< 1597026788 846779 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I also think I read somewhere about different languages being different due to the different acoustics of the environment, such as how many trees there are, etc)
< 1597026849 312827 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Actually, in the case of computer displays, still or animation can be another possibility.)
< 1597028401 307075 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org QUIT :Quit: I seem to have stopped.
< 1597028493 776794 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597033022 22870 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
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< 1597044500 605456 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, I suppose another possible media with writing might be writing with chalk.
< 1597044566 136349 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :And, I suppose another possible variant for sign language might be by feet.
< 1597045451 846286 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597045859 592788 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1597046030 233599 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Swc 5*  10New user account
> 1597046286 908789 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76569&oldid=76562 5* 03Swc 5* (+245) 10
< 1597046826 451072 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597046855 50613 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello
> 1597047910 329729 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Tru14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76570 5* 03Swc 5* (+5405) 10Created page with "'''Tru''' is an esoteric programming language of brackets using prefix-free code, designed by [[User:Swc]].  The language runtime has two built-in stacks. The instructions to..."
> 1597047960 756463 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Swc14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76571 5* 03Swc 5* (+36) 10Created page with "True programmers program in [[Tru]]."
< 1597047973 408251 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-48.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal
> 1597048020 704805 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76572&oldid=76510 5* 03Swc 5* (+10) 10
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< 1597057179 554282 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
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> 1597066776 110254 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76573&oldid=76505 5* 03Razetime 5* (+331) 10/* Example Programs */
< 1597067630 360003 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597067728 108137 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: well, I've known the non-esoteric possibility that I want: I'd like a good family of sans-serif fonts with a consistent look for text including mathematical formulas, optimized for slides with the contemporary mid-resolution LCD projectors.
< 1597067829 100507 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :The CM and other mathematical fonts are serif fonts, and optimized for printing on paper, rather than viewing from a distance on a projected screen, so they're not ideal, but there don't seem to be good quality sans serif mathematical fonts that qualify.
< 1597067868 765012 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So there's a gap between handwritten mathematics (either overhead projector slides or whiteboard or chalkboard) and printed on paper that should be filled.
< 1597067889 195031 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ideally I should make such a font set, but learning to make good fonts and making good fonts takes a ton of times.
< 1597067970 132100 :portalrat!~muskrat@trivialand/player/muskrat QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1597068179 60391 :bumblee_!~sf@112.198.73.91 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597068189 717877 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: I don't know if it's any good really, but https://github.com/firamath/firamath is meant for your use case as far as I can tell. (The showcase images are clearly beamer slides.)
< 1597068273 778809 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597068274 481643 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that looks at least interesting, thank you
< 1597068366 26649 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that's probably the thing I landed on when I made some slides in beamer for a course I was TA for, and I think I got there by going through https://tug.org/FontCatalogue/mathfonts.html and looking for anything without serifs. There's a few other candidates on the list too, though the vast majority are serif fonts.
< 1597068392 991513 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( "A lot of times", of course, alludes to the multitude of newspapers called "___ Times", some of which commissioned their own fonts. )
< 1597068422 686016 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/lot/ton/, sorry.
< 1597068872 280525 :huntingcryptos!~huntingcr@1.235.118.78.rev.sfr.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597069135 165537 :bumblee_!~sf@112.198.73.91 QUIT :Quit: Hello my friends. If you want to discover something just check here. https://bit.ly/33tb5lx
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< 1597071055 63402 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric : Ideally I should make such a font set, but learning to make good fonts and making good fonts takes a ton of times. => also there seem to be no font creating software which is comfortable to work with, in drawing and editing glyphs. AFAIU people just edit in some other software and then import, but I see a lot of problem with this approach and at least it’s problematic for me to make a routine. I can’t even make a font for a conscript w
< 1597071055 214284 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ith ink-looking glyphs in Inkscape from an image with layers a layer for a glyph each
< 1597071187 18569 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: that is certainly part of the software
< 1597071267 126207 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :more realistically, I should update my fecupboard20 font with more characters, and better images for some of the existing characters. the ASCII parts are stable and haven't needed a change for years, I've been using it in terminals in my home machine a lot, but there are characters missing and ones that are ugly. 
< 1597071315 633656 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I started a tiny bitmap font, and for that I actually collected a decent list of characters that I want, so I can start from that list to add characters to fecupboard. 
< 1597071364 394160 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the tiny font is variable pitch
< 1597071511 705508 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what are the uses for tiny bitmap fonts nowadays aside from oldskooly games with big pixel graphics?
< 1597071555 474133 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm FontForge’s website looks like the software got a revamp some time ago?..
< 1597071566 931699 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: mostly just esoteric uses, yes, but it's also that a bitmap font is easier and faster to make than a graymap font, even though I could use a graymap font and it would look better
< 1597071594 974716 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :although some people want to use tiny font in some hardware like led displays or magnetic displays
< 1597071613 749387 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are a lot of led displays that are only 8 pixels tall, and that's really limiting
< 1597071667 140962 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :some are actually double height, so a pixel is made of two leds and is approx twice as high as wide, but the two leds don't seem to be individually controlled. but these double height ones are used mostly for advertising
< 1597071700 699833 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I'm making an even smaller font, one that's only 6 pixel tall, with 1 pixel ascender and 1 pixel descender
< 1597071716 159537 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :TI calculators are a good use case for tiny bitmap fonts.
< 1597071802 692647 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for 8 pixel tall fonts, or 8 pixel tall with 8 pixels of gap, those were useful for games running on old hardware with small ROM and not too capable graphics chip, like NES, SNES, Game Boy, GBC
< 1597071811 550617 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meen small ROM on the game cartridge
< 1597071857 527727 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :on SNES and GBC a few games even used 8 px tall and 4 px wide fonts for their English version, with the CPU copying two characters into one tile definition dynamically as it prints text
< 1597071922 712037 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was quite surprised when I first saw that, because displaying such text seems impossible on that hardware at first. I think I've only seen two games that does this, IIRC Earthbound and GBC Pokemon TCG but there might be more
< 1597071977 675356 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a lot of games use 8x8px fonts, or 8x8px fonts with an empty row between that is sometimes used for dakuten, the arch-example being GB Pokemon red/blue
< 1597072128 423656 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed
< 1597072269 696626 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597072430 650395 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made a couple of small pixel fonts myself in Fontstruct :D though that was a while ago and my goal of wide codepoint coverage wasn’t quite reached at all
< 1597073683 878091 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only font I've ever done is the one for https://zem.fi/rfk86/ which is a 4x6 cell with mostly 3x5 characters. But that definitely didn't aspire to (or need) high codepoint coverage. I think I just drew it in Gimp with the grid set to 4x6 pixels, into an image with a couple of 64x48 pixel (16x8=128 character) layers.
< 1597074645 969939 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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< 1597076101 792710 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597076123 823201 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I cam across https://dwarffortresswiki.org/Tileset_repository a while ago which has some really tiny bitmap fonts
< 1597076174 699303 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have an incomplete list of sub-8x8 bitmap fonts that I can locate in a bit
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> 1597077558 661543 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:BytFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76574&oldid=76557 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+217) 10
> 1597077583 763334 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:BytFuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76575&oldid=76574 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-38) 10
> 1597077622 235717 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BytFuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76576&oldid=75007 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-10) 10
> 1597077666 49759 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BytFuck14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76577&oldid=76576 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+42) 10
> 1597077774 783885 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76578&oldid=76554 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-1) 10
< 1597078304 788555 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://up.firefly.nu/tmp/fontlist.note.html  has some assorted tiny bitmap fonts
> 1597078426 519430 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76579&oldid=76578 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-13) 10
< 1597078442 96361 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :for whatever reason I've always enjoyed really tiny bitmap fonts (both studying and making them)
< 1597078844 205612 :portalrat!~muskrat@trivialand/player/muskrat JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597079099 894574 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Trueclone14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76580&oldid=76553 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+172) 10+Categories
< 1597079676 971401 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597079928 573492 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I didn't claim that I'd have wide codepoint coverage. I'd only have slightly more than in fecupboard20, but some of those few characters are important to me.
< 1597079988 19836 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? fonts
< 1597079990 701529 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :​#esoteric bitmap fonts include: \oren\'s font http://www.orenwatson.be/fontdemo.htm , lifthrasiir's font https://github.com/lifthrasiir/unison/ , b_jonas's font http://www.math.bme.hu/~ambrus/pu/fecupboard20-c.pcf.gz , fizzie's font https://github.com/fis/rfk86/tree/master/web/font , FireFly's fonts http://xen.firefly.nu/up/fonts/
< 1597080010 25994 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :we might need to convert this to a page on the esolang wiki, even though it's not really esolang-related
< 1597080014 497730 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because it's getting long
< 1597080110 786322 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :could have it as a userpage somewhere
< 1597080166 734980 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :more fun with bridges, https://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/wobbly.jpg
< 1597080186 603648 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(it doesn't look like much but it was really cheap!)
< 1597080219 910362 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: which bridge builder game is that?
< 1597080232 916958 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i miss armadillo run
< 1597080250 6337 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :awesome physics game, would love an android port
< 1597080326 859806 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and are those orange road sections orange because they're stretched?
< 1597080348 39563 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :color should be the stress on each segment
< 1597080454 907857 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, then those road segments are probably stretched
< 1597080463 94001 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Bridge Constructor Medieval
< 1597080563 905539 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know how the Bridge Constructor franchise compares to Polybridge. It's obviously a bit smoother and more diverse (if you count the various spinoffs) than the original Bridge Builder.
< 1597080565 958229 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :medieval? so those are supposed to be wooden beams, not steel?
< 1597080681 288026 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the colors indicate stress... https://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/wobblyc.jpg is the construction without stress indication.
< 1597080695 242171 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and this is under Linux, the graphics may not be perfect.
< 1597080882 381697 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hehe, [[///]] is not parsed as a link to the /// language on the wiki, you have to write eg. [[:///]]
< 1597081368 157815 :portalrat!~muskrat@trivialand/player/muskrat QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1597081456 942066 :portalrat!~muskrat@trivialand/player/muskrat JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597082026 180364 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:B jonas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76581&oldid=70006 5* 03B jonas 5* (+675) 10start Incomplete list of some interesting or notable esolangs
> 1597082176 793722 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:B jonas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76582&oldid=76581 5* 03B jonas 5* (+64) 10/* Incomplete list of some interesting or notable esolangs */
< 1597082229 773671 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Funciton?
> 1597082293 557667 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:B jonas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76583&oldid=76582 5* 03B jonas 5* (+34) 10
> 1597082818 150667 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ZeptoBasic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76584&oldid=57785 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+4) 10grammar++
< 1597082946 81168 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you try making up fonts with METAFONT?
> 1597083059 83352 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Category:ICFP contest14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76585&oldid=73618 5* 03B jonas 5* (+91) 10
> 1597083261 410872 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:B jonas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76586&oldid=76583 5* 03B jonas 5* (+897) 10
< 1597083284 421147 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: no sorry, I don't much like Funciton
< 1597083323 565642 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't usually talk about that because people don't keep inventing variants or using it for everything like for brainfuck 
< 1597083332 691496 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it's just not a language I like. no specific reason. 
< 1597083365 273271 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but Funciton was a featured language, so it's already two clicks from the front page I think
< 1597083372 569371 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :one click
< 1597083381 499510 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Previously featured: Funciton · Brainfuck · Deadfish · Emmental · more…"
< 1597083409 609490 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so no need to advertise it more. I could mention Intercal.
< 1597083420 693906 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: no, but I have made a few simple illustrations with metapost,
< 1597083495 422928 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 PRIVMSG #esoteric : but it's just not a language I like. no specific reason. => ah. I understand
< 1597083565 167726 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not even that it's a two-dimensional language, I'm fine with fungeoids if they're not misused, and I have some ideas for a two-dimensional functional language that is more like funciton than befunge in semantics, but I haven't managed to put together a sane combination yet
< 1597083603 563627 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have some very specific ideas about the basic syntax, but I might have to split this to multiple different languages semantics-wise depending on how user-defined functions are defined and called
< 1597083627 232725 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't really tried to work much on this yet
< 1597083635 50226 :huntingcryptos!~huntingcr@1.235.118.78.rev.sfr.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597083682 19806 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just an idea that I think has to be done because there doesn't yet seem to be an esolang like that, but it isn't too esoteric, and I don't mind too much if someone else does it well first
< 1597083821 806759 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's just a silly 2D syntax for an ordinary imperative or functional language (there may have to be two or three different versions depending) where variables are encoded not with names, not implicitly with pointless programming, not with stack indexes, but with columns in the source code
< 1597083874 955765 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-100.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it translates both ways into some ordinary programming language with plain syntax, it's not some actually interesting and unique idea like Consumer Society
> 1597084786 365695 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76587&oldid=76568 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-12) 10
> 1597084994 312746 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:DmilkaSTD14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76588&oldid=76579 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+63) 10
< 1597088254 898596 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597088372 31007 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:e1cb:9ecc:ea7b:e2ba QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1597090409 69221 :portalrat!~muskrat@trivialand/player/muskrat QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1597092464 920954 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597093527 484153 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597093577 889832 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597094861 513536 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Set14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76589&oldid=75712 5* 03Qwertyu63 5* (+75) 10/* Links */
> 1597094871 518562 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Set14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76590&oldid=76589 5* 03Qwertyu63 5* (+1) 10/* Links */
< 1597095047 441515 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.238.198 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds
> 1597095487 675857 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Set14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76591&oldid=76590 5* 03Qwertyu63 5* (+160) 10/* Example code */
> 1597095525 804311 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Set14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76592&oldid=76591 5* 03Qwertyu63 5* (+16) 10/* 99 Bottles of Beer */
> 1597095619 984118 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Set14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76593&oldid=76592 5* 03Qwertyu63 5* (-13) 10/* Truth Machine */
< 1597095820 16325 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-kjkdfkywkjdrajek JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597096504 93437 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1597104120 443141 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ucsvkryaecttpgkg JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597119373 719614 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597119465 178376 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597119465 499839 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1597121785 20704 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597122440 527190 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ejhnivfcrhwvfqgi JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597124662 430327 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597125971 271560 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597126556 972455 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597129617 884008 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know if any version of Firefox implements RFC 5147? My computer doesn't seem to do.
< 1597129887 647927 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=660583 maybe not
< 1597130232 96161 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:9037:5053:c058:3a7a JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597133275 931813 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597136533 589125 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597139607 202652 :shinh___!~i@39.110.229.193 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597142180 496853 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:81db:9d69:31d6:5a59 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597142308 898450 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597148092 958641 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
< 1597148109 830096 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597149895 786767 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07List of ideas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76594&oldid=76162 5* 03B jonas 5* (+372) 10/* Partially Silly Ideas */
< 1597154123 153195 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everyone, I have a good idea.
< 1597154144 536919 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want to write an operating system for the 8088 IBM PC in Rust.
< 1597154438 513813 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :That might prove to be incredibly difficult, especially if I want to use several different kinds of pointers.
< 1597154529 817632 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :This is a 16-bit pointer into the data segment. This is a 16-bit pointer into the stack segment. Don't know which segment you need? Whoops, looks like you need a 32-bit pointer.
< 1597154916 151670 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :And let's hope you never need protected mode! 
> 1597156061 589660 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stopwatch14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76595&oldid=71434 5* 03GDavid 5* (+74) 10Break, continue
< 1597156864 130027 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597157200 853405 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stopwatch14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76596&oldid=76595 5* 03GDavid 5* (+202) 10Global variables, lambdas, nested function declarations, variable declaration scope
< 1597162668 715129 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597162691 670718 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597162838 39017 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1597163022 216153 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does Rust support 8088?
< 1597163198 61348 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: seems to: https://ideone.com/FNZvRv
< 1597163362 258789 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, as long as llvm supports it, i don't see a reason why not to
< 1597163396 320817 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :operations on larger integer types may be slow as hell
< 1597163430 556161 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( hello world may not fit into your code segment )
< 1597163453 782326 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :just point the instruction pointer to you rom
< 1597163456 419355 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :more seriously, what does the runtime support for that look like
< 1597164110 995346 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597164392 498809 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-233.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597164678 664810 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-233.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1210
< 1597164680 533449 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1210.html: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas
< 1597164755 685384 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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> 1597165251 208767 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76597&oldid=76541 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+31) 10
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< 1597165510 874258 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597168997 62968 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:81db:9d69:31d6:5a59 PRIVMSG #esoteric :create a language in which you don't write a program, but give its "fourier components" - the reccurence of each keyword in the sequence of statements (amplitude of a certain 'keyword frequency') and their collective shift (phase), some cancelling each other out
< 1597169319 934583 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 NICK :callforjudgement
< 1597169324 294184 :callforjudgement!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 NICK :ais523
< 1597169409 674034 :user24!~user24@2a02:810a:1440:7304:81db:9d69:31d6:5a59 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1597169904 587764 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a restricted subset of Markdown without HTML? I would suggest such a variant for use with some NNTP services, where additionally text with @ within <> is treated as a message ID. If there is a header "Content-type: text/markdown" then some implementations may display it formatted; if not, it will be displayed raw and still work perfectly OK anyways. (Other restrictions may also be added, such as no pictures, and no relative URL
< 1597170023 93529 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I believe there are multiple such subsets, incompatible with each other, because people find it useful and invent something without standardising it
< 1597170072 282882 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: sorry for my connection
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< 1597170108 226098 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-233.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I prefer HTML without markdown
< 1597170138 827572 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: For writing HTML documents, that works, but not all documents are going to be HTML based documents.
< 1597170166 386611 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Markdown dialects *with* HTML probably aren't any better standardized. Though maybe GFM has gotten some amount of adoption, and at least it's got a spec.
< 1597170367 105098 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't use Markdown myself when writing HTML documents, but not all documents will be HTML.)
< 1597171262 996734 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:9037:5053:c058:3a7a QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597172015 814603 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :How common is the .so and .ds commands in man pages?
< 1597172412 544900 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597172905 296234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esofun14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76598&oldid=72285 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (-3) 10
< 1597174587 479177 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:9037:5053:c058:3a7a JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597174808 981905 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597174849 418686 :tromp_!~tromp@ip-213-127-104-154.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597174881 424312 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:9037:5053:c058:3a7a QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1597174884 244359 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to create my own unambiguous markup language that was Markdown-like, designed to be more readable and round-trip properly with HTML
< 1597174892 712818 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I haven't managed to find a syntax for block elements that I like
< 1597175019 225207 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://nethack4.org/pastebin/mf-spec-unfinished.txt if you're interested in the syntax for inline encoding
< 1597175042 658622 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it basically uses a combination of spaces and hyphens to resolve ambiguities, in a way that looks natural in non-contrived situations
< 1597175291 537075 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I managed to get Lisp up and running in Malbolge
< 1597175295 294005 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and it requires only 1,7GB of RAM
< 1597175303 605059 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you can run it in finite time, and it computes 2 + 2 in just 40 seconds
< 1597175306 256778 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, you heard it right
< 1597175391 807512 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Esolang idea: incredibly hard to type terms.
< 1597175395 387063 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well done!
< 1597175410 828987 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did put some thought into how to design a faster Malbolge-20 interpreter but didn't reach any conclusions
< 1597175473 357877 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://kspalaiologos.now.im/doc/MalbolgeLisp/MalbolgeLisp.gif
< 1597175478 884429 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://kspalaiologos.now.im/doc/MalbolgeLisp/MalbolgeLisp.7z
< 1597176055 87719 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.234 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
> 1597177391 877247 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76599&oldid=76597 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-10) 10
> 1597177470 721852 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Anguish14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76600&oldid=73686 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+9) 10added stub
< 1597177637 21925 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1597177850 261221 :thblt!~thblt@unaffiliated/thblt JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597178428 66649 :thblt!~thblt@unaffiliated/thblt PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, I have a stupid question.  Provided that Turing completeness is determined under the hypothesis of infinite memory, have there been attempts to make languages that are Turing complete under that hypothosis, but that make it impossible to implement any algorithm under any finite memory amount?
< 1597178466 177719 :thblt!~thblt@unaffiliated/thblt PRIVMSG #esoteric :The obvious trick would be to make allocation fail if it would only leave a finite amount of memory available, but that's cheating.
< 1597180088 606826 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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> 1597180985 486983 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stones14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76601&oldid=76587 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+0) 10pretty sure the name is in lowercase, given the two README files' titles
> 1597181259 783691 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76602 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+9142) 10Created page with "Computerdeutsch ("Computer-German") is an esolang by User:Orangeyy based on the grammar of the German language. Basic knowledge of German is recommended. It is a work in progr..."
> 1597181725 698929 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Full Stack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76603&oldid=66977 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+110) 10change the spec to permit loops
< 1597181861 995080 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597182651 489393 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it sad that https://ro-che.info/ccc/11 made me laugh?
> 1597184339 133964 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Rui14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76604&oldid=76533 5* 03Sinthorion 5* (-65) 10
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< 1597187185 187533 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1597187612 115754 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:JonoCode937414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76605&oldid=76408 5* 03JonoCode9374 5* (+10) 10/* Languages I like */
< 1597188554 962475 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597189006 939994 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597189203 782893 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Full Stack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76606&oldid=76603 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+46) 10
< 1597189506 917305 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1597190114 420210 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
< 1597190452 756883 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :thblt: What do you mean by "impossible to implement any algorithm under any finite memory amount"?
< 1597190471 289644 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you mean make it so that all algorithms require an infinite amount of memory?
< 1597190516 173863 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or do you mean make it so that there's a particular amount of memory such that if less than that much memory is available, no algorithms can be implemented?
< 1597190547 658123 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or do you mean make it so that there's a particular amount of memory such that if an algorithm requires less than that much memory, then it cannot be implemented?
< 1597190822 914078 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-fibgouyioygerxzk PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm guessing you meant the first of those.
< 1597193509 933683 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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< 1597205809 324328 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597205916 80553 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1597208340 917427 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597214884 344767 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
> 1597215041 89411 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Full Stack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76607&oldid=76606 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+233) 10
< 1597216055 547065 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597217874 699195 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597218001 861911 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597218385 917085 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1597219632 976469 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597220079 348897 :thblt!~thblt@unaffiliated/thblt PRIVMSG #esoteric :tswett[m]: something like that, it's not very clear to me. I just had the idea that it could be possible to play with the “infinite memory” hypothesis by making a langage that only actually works on infinite memory.
< 1597220546 182762 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597221062 61389 :d3pp!~d3pp@2600:1700:1850:8d40::2c JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597221081 15402 :d3pp!~d3pp@2600:1700:1850:8d40::2c QUIT :Client Quit
> 1597221184 767734 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76608&oldid=76451 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+18) 10/* See Also */
< 1597223140 955025 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-xoxpussdzlztkiix QUIT :Quit: killed
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< 1597223663 929003 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-upbryisukhedawap JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597225550 230457 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-xyafxfjmybgfrmax JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597227675 911491 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597229975 608522 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Programs14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76609 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+1975) 10Created page with "{{Back|1+}}  This page provide links to most, if not all, 1+ programs ever written, excluding the example programs on the [[1+]] page.  == CGCC ==  From oldest to newest. Thes..."
> 1597229990 865536 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Programs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76610&oldid=76609 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-206) 10/* CGCC */
> 1597230272 181891 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07APL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76611&oldid=75941 5* 03Amakukha 5* (+32) 10
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< 1597233124 268018 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.”
< 1597233146 613970 :d34db33f!~u@5.248.112.57 PART :#esoteric
< 1597233156 551545 :d34db33f!~u@5.248.112.57 JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1597239346 588448 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Programs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76612&oldid=76610 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+162) 10/* CGCC */
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< 1597240464 58825 :duckologist!4e945aa0@host-78-148-90-160.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597240495 490896 :duckologist!4e945aa0@host-78-148-90-160.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hello
< 1597241687 887377 :duckologist!4e945aa0@host-78-148-90-160.as13285.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597241852 43456 :duckologist!4e945aa0@host-78-148-90-160.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597243266 678032 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Trueclone14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76613&oldid=76580 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+0) 10fixed title
> 1597243316 416565 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76614&oldid=76602 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (-25) 10
> 1597243407 423942 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76615&oldid=76614 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+10) 10/* Logical operators = */
< 1597243784 156007 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1597244932 604774 :duckologist!4e945aa0@host-78-148-90-160.as13285.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1597245394 578955 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Code is eso14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76616&oldid=75794 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-91) 10
> 1597245477 789323 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Trueclone14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76617&oldid=76613 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-180) 10
> 1597245877 388400 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Mornington Crescent14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76618&oldid=47057 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+0) 10/* Interpreters */ fixed capitalization
> 1597246107 285972 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Swearjure14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76619&oldid=73439 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (+9) 10
> 1597246135 279128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Swearjure14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76620&oldid=76619 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-9) 10
< 1597246276 857472 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rukqtknreokojehc JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597247004 219385 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07BF-ASM:814]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76621&oldid=75793 5* 03DmilkaSTD 5* (-1026) 10
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< 1597253633 3170 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/733242619567800383/743142414352515142/unknown.png
< 1597253635 231766 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :another lisp session
< 1597253638 262044 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this time printing a factorial
< 1597253654 129975 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :now I'm going to try something more complex; most probably some sort of a sort (lol)
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> 1597253824 897598 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Cliff L. Biffle14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76622&oldid=66848 5* 03Lucas 5* (-34) 10update personal website links
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> 1597254670 476310 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Asm2bf14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76623&oldid=76204 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (-4) 10link revival
> 1597254751 54920 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MalbolgeLisp14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76624 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (+890) 10Created page with "{{infobox proglang |name=MalbolgeLisp |paradigms=imperative |author=[[User:Palaiologos|Palaiologos]] |year=[[:Category:2020|2020]] |memsys=list |class=Turing-complete|Turing..."
> 1597254761 89626 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MalbolgeLisp14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76625&oldid=76624 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (-42) 10
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< 1597256434 261012 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1597256438 784714 :dnm_!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mvmxoeoxmkzytvkf NICK :dnm
< 1597256490 167006 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-upbryisukhedawap QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597256491 568550 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-xyafxfjmybgfrmax QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597256936 134936 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597257485 791191 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76626&oldid=76615 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+1718) 10Computerdeutsch is an esolang based on the grammar and vocabulary of the German language.
< 1597257499 17334 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c59a:56b3:99df:6eb7 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1597257591 292873 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Orangeyy14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76627&oldid=76424 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+95) 10
> 1597257620 423815 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Orangeyy14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76628&oldid=76627 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+2) 10
> 1597257645 484136 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07EWagon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76629&oldid=60164 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (-5) 10
< 1597258872 387024 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-imxxwvmhptdzookn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597258972 881420 :SoniEx2!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 NICK :Soni
< 1597259415 516227 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c59a:56b3:99df:6eb7 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597259539 989409 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76630&oldid=76626 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+1891) 10
> 1597259608 935375 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76631&oldid=76572 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+22) 10
> 1597259784 958988 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76632&oldid=76630 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+4) 10/* Loop */
< 1597259960 784324 :olsner_!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se NICK :olsner
> 1597260080 161897 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Computerdeutsch14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76633&oldid=76632 5* 03Orangeyy 5* (+232) 10
< 1597261134 546324 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c59a:56b3:99df:6eb7 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597261276 72985 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers QUIT :Quit: so long and thanks for all the fish
> 1597262075 14317 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bitter14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76634&oldid=61387 5* 03DMC 5* (+335) 10add an explanation showing how to use Bitter
< 1597262863 38385 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e6:2616:f638:7436 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597262917 7994 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597263298 614477 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1597263553 712613 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e6:2616:f638:7436 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597263914 548035 :xkapastel!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-agzdvqwfwtwdbbnz QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1597263918 345102 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e6:2616:f638:7436 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597265123 994139 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597266341 999946 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597267561 917274 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597267746 745026 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Client Quit
< 1597268758 615108 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it so hard to write a CV even when a friend helps with it at a highest degree and guides you with various questions and suggestions?
< 1597268790 97193 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I’m not sure that it will come to something useful at all
< 1597268814 487983 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e6:2616:f638:7436 QUIT :Read error: No route to host
< 1597268873 944945 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-104-154.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597268911 717446 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there an exit when all pet projects you have are written to be seen only by yourself and usually even not finished to be compilable (not always but often)
< 1597269136 78847 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a sun when essentially all you know you do despite—not thanks to—education which is also unfinished, and you have no geographically local peers in these matters to compare your achievements to and something something
< 1597269137 380164 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry
< 1597269158 290678 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-124.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: get a job where you can write pet projects useful for work
< 1597269179 734174 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: yeah but that requires a CV usually?
< 1597269180 404044 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-124.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, writing a CV is high
< 1597269195 549105 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-124.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/high/hard/
< 1597269206 774070 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-124.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :as are all the other things associated with getting a job
< 1597269209 263966 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe I also should be high to succesfully write it without too much pain :D
< 1597269326 236657 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric : as are all the other things associated with getting a job => I don’t think all of them are. I presume making yourself known to potential employers is tedious but that should be more or less mechanical instead of mind-numbing
< 1597269381 929085 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-124.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not really making yourself known, but doing the interviews right and all that
< 1597269468 697235 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I’ll better not think about this aspect for now or I’ll bail out again
< 1597270673 702230 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wrote a long addendum but I bet this isn’t a therapy channel so I better keep it for myself
< 1597271085 235123 :shinh___!~i@om126133233183.21.openmobile.ne.jp QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597271779 743189 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-104-154.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597272412 98907 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597272489 489153 :mmmattyx!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jmrhtbnqidlrwjwv JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597274033 965923 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597275049 952889 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1597275501 966084 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597276277 30624 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Full Stack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76635&oldid=76607 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+12) 10
< 1597280144 146710 :mmmattyx!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jmrhtbnqidlrwjwv QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1597280541 886694 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597284604 802979 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597285580 212241 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597285929 994070 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Number Seventy-Four14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76636&oldid=76555 5* 03Bangyen 5* (-164) 10
> 1597286350 409125 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+/Programs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76637&oldid=76612 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+0) 10
< 1597288398 47815 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597288659 115074 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1597289208 591243 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Goblins of Healing {(W/R)(W/R)} Creature - Goblin (1/1) ;; Bands with other white Goblins ;; {1}, {T}: Flip a coin. If heads, or if any white mana was spent to pay the cost of this ability, prevent the next 1 damage to target damageable this turn. If tails, or if any red mana was spend to pay the cost of this ability, ~ deals 1 damage to target damageable. If your mana pool contains both white and red mana as this ability resolves, the 
< 1597289317 970933 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mixed Worlds {-} Legendary World Land ;; The world rule and legend rule do not apply. ;; {T}: Add one mana of any color into your mana pool. This mana can only be spent on the cost of a world spell; if you do, then that spell loses the world supertype. ;; Cumulative upkeep {1}
< 1597289349 409116 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like this?
< 1597290534 825651 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1597291684 546870 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal
< 1597292284 923266 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597292341 684646 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597292356 948976 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597292422 97237 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1597294954 765663 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597295656 369320 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597295949 380051 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1597299697 778630 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597300800 151313 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597301418 765886 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597301941 769406 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597302002 294942 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597304143 7747 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597304170 959848 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597304728 943115 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1597305179 511342 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597305206 798814 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1597305222 170752 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597305234 911464 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1597305622 382807 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597306158 345240 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597306236 395430 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:JonoCode937414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76638&oldid=76605 5* 03JonoCode9374 5* (+11) 10/* Languages I like */
< 1597306263 846950 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597306754 697249 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rukqtknreokojehc QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
< 1597307123 576082 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-124.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving
< 1597311669 113004 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597315026 187754 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597315875 638075 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76639&oldid=76573 5* 03Dion 5* (+93) 10
< 1597316583 840880 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1597317825 271138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76640&oldid=76639 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+110) 10/* Computational class */
> 1597318942 769544 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76641&oldid=76640 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+6) 10/* All integers */ "All integers" is rather inaccurate too, as there are negative integers.
< 1597319018 116398 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597319747 566725 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597320418 29913 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76642&oldid=76641 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+238) 10/* Computational class */
< 1597321961 9467 :kspalaiologos2!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597321979 307437 :kspalaiologos2!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh, what
< 1597322108 140051 :kspalaiologos2!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Client Quit
< 1597322138 734 :kspalaiologos2!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597322154 149544 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597322162 413163 :kspalaiologos2!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 NICK :kspalaiologos
> 1597322497 66534 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76643&oldid=76642 5* 03D 5* (+142) 10Turing Complete as well
< 1597322804 548033 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
< 1597322819 850360 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597322831 62585 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76644&oldid=76643 5* 03D 5* (+144) 10
> 1597323279 774404 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Volatile14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76645&oldid=70282 5* 03D 5* (+168) 10Simplify the language
< 1597324693 927868 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1597324781 925528 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597325282 780227 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1597325399 936893 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597328527 834728 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597329622 931871 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
> 1597330385 471820 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Polarz 5*  10New user account
> 1597330515 866000 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76646&oldid=76569 5* 03Polarz 5* (+66) 10/* Introductions */
> 1597330530 313220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Polarz14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76647 5* 03Polarz 5* (+46) 10Created page with "Interested in writing in and writing esolangs."
< 1597330633 563550 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597331251 986973 :Arsi!~Arsi@185.69.186.3 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597331426 227234 :Arsi!~Arsi@185.69.186.3 QUIT :Client Quit
> 1597335216 168422 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MATL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76648&oldid=73677 5* 03Luis Mendo 5* (+10) 10
< 1597335596 523651 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597335659 674866 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597335768 742511 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1597336592 855978 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ffwulwlepikucbuy JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597336618 655387 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597336856 43442 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597339147 991520 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597339198 705422 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597339214 599116 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597340799 550632 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-ziorsovbbtcojhxy JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597341978 604716 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e9c1:7978:7763:8d9f QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1597358089 154424 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1597362868 198695 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597363473 207368 :mmmattyx!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rnbfrxgeipvulrdo QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity
> 1597363531 291996 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Ona li toki e jan Epiphany tawa mi 5*  10New user account
< 1597363906 74683 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
> 1597365090 657991 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76649&oldid=76646 5* 03Ona li toki e jan Epiphany tawa mi 5* (+491) 10/* Introductions */
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< 1597372642 830706 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597372695 856954 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597373631 139292 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :*.net *.split
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< 1597373631 324445 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1597373631 500863 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1597373631 648476 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :*.net *.split
< 1597373631 892982 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de QUIT :*.net *.split
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< 1597373987 144964 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597373987 288665 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597373987 288675 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597373987 288685 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597373987 288716 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597373987 288727 :oren!~oren@ec2-18-234-164-48.compute-1.amazonaws.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597374515 31352 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:8f:6f84:3aea:7b93 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597376066 238097 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds
< 1597376304 646492 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597376383 776063 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597378818 961767 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1597378900 221369 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
> 1597381704 431953 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76650&oldid=76644 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-2) 10/* Computational class */
> 1597383591 992718 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Mornington Crescent14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76651&oldid=68666 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+161) 10/* A Game of Mornington Crescent */
< 1597386482 121550 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1597389823 84875 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e0b3:6f0c:eaa5:7a5f JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597390832 427113 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d853:ecf2:f344:89f1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597392592 676887 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597392723 873385 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597393653 144276 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597393741 770757 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/400_tuba/status/1293536424789028869 <-- bottle of dihydrogen monoxide
< 1597395658 948954 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597400255 866316 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597400492 69253 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :today's https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/soul-3 says there aren't enough souls so not all humans have one, and "The soul wait-list for new babies is basically eternal." I see two possible interpretations: either every new baby gets onto the waiting list but get a soul only if they have been waiting on the list for the longest time when a soul
< 1597400492 601102 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :becomes free, in which case only the oldest people have souls, in this case only people way over 100 years old;
< 1597400567 974158 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other interpretation is that only new babies can get a soul, and if there's no soul available just when a baby is at soul-getting age, then they missed their chance forever, in which case a few people, chosen at more or less random, have souls for life.
< 1597400601 962078 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which reading do you support, fungot?
< 1597400602 174801 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: have you looked into set theory, respectively)
< 1597400613 330186 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, not deeply
< 1597401563 6697 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597401700 895245 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Polarz14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76652 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+442) 10Created page with "== Hi!! ==  Hello, I'm TwilightSparkle, an Esolang enthusiast. Here are some esolang recommentations for you:  - [[><>]]. A fun language. - [[1+]]. My main interest. - [[MAWP]..."
> 1597401716 384483 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Polarz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76653&oldid=76652 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+5) 10/* Hi!! */
< 1597403483 801668 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1597405413 292808 :thblt!~thblt@unaffiliated/thblt PART #esoteric :"ERC (IRC client for Emacs 28.0.50)"
< 1597406804 816363 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597407594 462538 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursaga
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< 1597407903 819565 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
> 1597408148 966415 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76654&oldid=76649 5* 03Stormboy876 5* (+111) 10
> 1597408165 530952 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ie14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76655 5* 03Stormboy876 5* (+1546) 10Created page with "'''ie''' is a  [[esoteric programming language]] designed in July 2020 by [[User:Stormboy876]]. It is identical to [[brainfuck]], except that the instructions >..."
< 1597408478 725373 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597409994 663143 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
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> 1597410125 245404 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Firethrone 5*  10New user account
> 1597410462 532154 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76656&oldid=76654 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+105) 10/* Introductions */
> 1597410504 680330 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76657&oldid=76656 5* 03Firethrone 5* (-11) 10/* Introductions */
> 1597410523 297435 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76658&oldid=76631 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+16) 10/* C */
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< 1597410864 376138 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
> 1597410983 969627 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CAPscript14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76659 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+891) 10Created page with ""CAPscript" is a programming language created by [[User:Firethrone]] in August 2020 cause he was bored during online classes and had nothing better to do. Its called CAPscript..."
< 1597411013 727255 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
> 1597411057 915820 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CAPscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76660&oldid=76659 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+15) 10
> 1597411096 132646 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CAPscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76661&oldid=76660 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+12) 10
> 1597411120 410366 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CAPscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76662&oldid=76661 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+1) 10
> 1597411132 409752 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CAPscript14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76663&oldid=76662 5* 03Firethrone 5* (+0) 10
> 1597413430 846378 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07NULL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76664&oldid=72363 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+41) 10some bruteforced programs of mine
< 1597415080 210642 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d853:ecf2:f344:89f1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1597416129 286107 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SUL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76665&oldid=51037 5* 03Douira 5* (+217) 10added bugs section
< 1597416794 359240 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597418561 252434 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( github, what are you thinking, adding a visible reply box to every single comment )
< 1597418660 224366 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( It can be disabled by signing out. Not sure that's what they want people to do :-P )
< 1597418797 894254 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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< 1597419419 984914 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
> 1597419502 552863 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07SUL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76666&oldid=76665 5* 03Douira 5* (+11) 10added github link to version 3
< 1597419741 923559 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: isn't that just the fallback for missing javascript, and the javascript hides it?
< 1597419757 301822 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: No. I do allow github to use javascript.
< 1597419784 894756 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it's a recent change, happened last week I think.
< 1597419799 775656 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :They also made the reactions thing twice as big as before.
< 1597419823 596141 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(where big = high)
< 1597419893 494439 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm probably exaggerating.)
< 1597420056 819697 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why is it that "bike" is kind of ambiguously either a bicycle or a motorcycle, but a "biker" is almost always a person who rides a motorcycle, and likewise a "cyclist" for a bicycle?
< 1597420122 691188 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :obligatory reference to casually explained
< 1597420136 565462 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5EE8m8mmq1k
< 1597420148 654155 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :by "reaction thing", do you mean the toolbar with the single-emoticon replies under comments?
< 1597420235 965894 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are sort of required to make that big and obvious, that's one of their trademarks, making their site distinguishable. mind you, skype does sort of the same, but they don't make the single-emoticon toolbar always visible, and I think they don't have a flower bouquet among the choices
< 1597420704 511023 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's bad enough without the extra input line. http://int-e.eu/~bf3/tmp/waste.png
< 1597420707 552952 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: yes
< 1597420733 731781 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(the blue shading is by me and indicates space that I consider to be completely wasted.
< 1597420736 712408 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :)
< 1597420751 5351 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not
< 1597420757 752385 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is to me
< 1597420781 248930 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :change the css and look at it, then
< 1597420789 663111 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's horrible
< 1597420977 604649 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's the thing though. I don't *need* things to be aesthetic. I want to have as much information on the screen as possible.
< 1597421010 705314 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I know that this goes against current UI theory.
< 1597421011 54203 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :too much information just hides what actually is important
< 1597421023 104316 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The *comments* are important.
< 1597421059 314370 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :People don't put 1cm of whitespace between paragraphs in books either, they rely on a rather subtle indicator, indenting the first word, for separating those.
< 1597421061 184921 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, there is a reason practically every irc client has the option to wrap lines in a way that line starts of the message match
< 1597421072 437431 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :even more offer the ability to right-align nicknames
< 1597421150 456958 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs.
< 1597421185 775416 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I use bold face for nicknames and that's plenty indication to find them on the screen for me.
< 1597421189 718703 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what is a good umbrella term for preconditions as well as benefits of an effect?
< 1597421289 127418 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: It's also worth noting that I don't have a smartphone so I'm not exposed to touch-optimized UIs (where the extra space is required because the precision of the inputs is so low). I believe that had a huge impact on this idea of wasted space.
< 1597421307 614289 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, less exposed
< 1597421335 600734 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm old, I grew up with 80x25 terminals which really had no space to waste at all.
< 1597421339 463458 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the precision of touch input is actually higher than one would expect
< 1597421370 213743 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am currently in the process of writing a terminal game because i am pretty annoyed by the existing ones
< 1597421375 65074 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know it's significantly better than the size of a finger.
< 1597421551 842076 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The main thing with touch inputs is... you hide the target as you touch it. That's a huge deal.
< 1597421705 31356 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, i am currently using 32 rows but only 52 colums
< 1597421717 638618 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe i should re-arrange my ui
< 1597421768 551442 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :80x25 terminal is the spice
< 1597421773 924929 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :3 rows less is easy, 8 rows is touch
< 1597421776 763278 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I still have some bbs accounts
< 1597421780 70985 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :*tough
< 1597421961 916835 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm currently using 76x37, or 76x61 if I hide the on-screen keyboard. But then again, this is one of those smartphones.
< 1597422085 85346 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my default terminal size is 98x36 but it's much higher on my smartphone
< 1597422110 45341 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
< 1597422374 655526 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gnkvprqbfbnxuykp JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597422388 659927 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597422463 147753 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :My most common terminal size is probably "half the screen" (I'm a BSP-layout-pretty-exclusively kind of person), which would be 159x92 or 159x94, depending on whether it's the screen with the extra bar on it.
< 1597422586 144798 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's huge without vertical splitting
< 1597422701 729175 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they're mostly either IRC or command prompts, so the immediately interesting bit is at the bottom, and what's higher up is just conveniently visible history.
< 1597422873 408880 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :> 1080`div`13
< 1597422875 470613 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric : 83
< 1597422948 535879 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(81 is what I actually get)
< 1597422980 373912 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :height is easy to fill, width not so much
< 1597422995 376927 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am way more comfortable with longer terminals than with wider ones
< 1597423024 157179 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it's fair to say that the 80 column problem has kept me away from tiling WM.
< 1597423027 414507 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :*WMs
< 1597423096 230900 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what problem?
< 1597423197 685850 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the desire to have 80 character wide terminals
< 1597423201 163226 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and editors
< 1597423213 895484 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, exactly?
< 1597423216 720212 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes.
< 1597423222 906978 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you haven't noticed yet, my habits die hard.
< 1597423277 891985 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting
< 1597423327 986273 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my setup is basically splitting into a master are with a browser and some slaves to the right with terminals of a precise widths
< 1597423342 308823 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 80 though, that would be far to narrow for my taste
< 1597423416 364468 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I could afford 102 or so.
< 1597423467 296440 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :before I run into the hard constraint which is fitting three terminal windows side by side on the screen.
< 1597423531 667973 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :just use a font that isn't as wide :p
< 1597423548 214607 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that isn't really an option
< 1597423799 155029 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed
< 1597424382 145230 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I'm sure some tiling window managers are sufficiently customizable to, in theory, permit you to write a layout that will make terminals 80 characters wide, and just resize other kinds of windows (or leave gaps if there are only terminals).
< 1597424437 470983 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, laziness is a factor.
< 1597424497 269459 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :`xmonad-contrib` has a very simple variant of that in the XMonad.Layout.FixedColumn module, which will use a fixed multiple of the window's minimum resize dimension (which for terminals tends to be 1 character cell) for the master pane. But it's not particularly flexible.
< 1597424498 349381 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :xmonad-contrib`? No such file or directory
< 1597424501 921560 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also I'm not unhappy with my current WM (which has been the same for more than two decades)
< 1597424528 611 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was trying to remember my progression of window managers the other day, but couldn't. :/
< 1597424576 196340 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy. fvwm -> fvwm2. Plus some exposure to Sun's CDE.
< 1597424624 615714 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :my progression was gnome -> pekwm -> notion -> herbstluftwm
< 1597424631 181948 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I spent quite a bit of energy on customizing fvwm2
< 1597424666 378854 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the main source of pain was the lack of multiple screen support for laptops, especially when giving presentations.
< 1597424669 818092 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I went something like fvwm2 → fvwm95 → Enlightenment → WindowMaker → blackbox → fluxbox → evilwm → awesome → XMonad.
< 1597424688 728480 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(CDE only for the SPARC workstations at the university.)
< 1597424705 317875 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, my CDE exposure has the same cause.
< 1597424748 695553 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might have gotten the boxes wrong, maybe one of those was openbox.
< 1597426094 988288 :applehattie!~hattie_@50-81-10-13.client.mchsi.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597427107 208999 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: You can consider adding your own CSS codes to adjust stuff on web pages. (I find such adjustment is generally unnecessary when the web page does not use CSS anyways, though)
< 1597427436 869548 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:f5af:98e4:913b:9c44 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597427757 248619 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What font are you using in the terminal window?
< 1597427877 950092 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The 6x13 fixed font.
< 1597427883 511186 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Same as you I believe.
< 1597427930 188068 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I use the same one
< 1597428100 480035 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'm on my third cycle of swapping between bitmap and vector fonts, and have now stuck with Tamzen8x15r.bdf for a while.)
< 1597428803 213061 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-131.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597428911 194821 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've been thinking about something weird
< 1597429150 521277 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit
< 1597429556 8836 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:f5af:98e4:913b:9c44 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597429696 813235 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, ZZT was written by the Epic founder?
< 1597429701 855452 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Funny.
< 1597429746 250193 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: Yes, it is
< 1597429757 789405 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :written by the Epic founder
< 1597429777 186649 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And, it was the first game they released)
< 1597431864 15605 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597431881 404670 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597432325 765861 :applehattie!~hattie_@50-81-10-13.client.mchsi.com PART #esoteric :"Leaving"
< 1597432509 39669 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:f5af:98e4:913b:9c44 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1597432663 792738 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597432704 843708 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597432877 26697 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597432899 328003 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
> 1597433037 372892 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Palaiologos14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76667&oldid=76254 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (+59) 10MalbolgeLisp mention
< 1597433166 119944 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597433889 409418 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e879:290a:4d6:41c6 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
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< 1597435106 345195 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving
< 1597438202 629917 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.6
< 1597438248 258764 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597438317 886082 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1597441712 518533 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1597444127 123089 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597444271 27244 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597444718 9256 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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< 1597448281 177933 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597450585 714251 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597453284 228986 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Orby14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76668&oldid=72969 5* 03Orby 5* (-81) 10
< 1597460072 472623 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wazyaewkvaygjhzg QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds
< 1597460508 356864 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-aavkzbyxlfyhsuqn JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597460601 31911 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-aavkzbyxlfyhsuqn QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded
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< 1597461962 109132 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xcgmkhghufhdnqrv JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597465245 211117 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
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< 1597469447 280305 :shikhin!~shikhin@unaffiliated/shikhin QUIT :Quit: Quittin'.
< 1597469475 370255 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6442:40d5:e6fc:4763 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597481697 9174 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:6442:40d5:e6fc:4763 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
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< 1597484641 967752 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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< 1597485841 462063 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:79:db41:ccb8:1e88 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597488158 769859 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597488810 308426 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-131.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's spread the false etimology that "barbarians" were named after the Holy Roman Emperor Frederick Barbarossa 
< 1597489863 837050 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597490788 6344 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597490924 202235 :ubq323!~ubq323@host86-165-21-38.range86-165.btcentralplus.com JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597490991 349972 :ubq323!~ubq323@host86-165-21-38.range86-165.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1597492203 753529 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597492922 434099 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76669&oldid=76658 5* 03Bauripalash 5* (+13) 10/* M */ added MewMew
> 1597493017 478128 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MewMew14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76670&oldid=75902 5* 03Bauripalash 5* (+582) 10/* Examples */
> 1597493143 612849 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MewMew14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76671&oldid=76670 5* 03Bauripalash 5* (+162) 10/* Examples */
> 1597493904 806312 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MewMew14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76672&oldid=76671 5* 03Bauripalash 5* (+353) 10added language overview
> 1597493964 569376 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MewMew14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76673&oldid=76672 5* 03Bauripalash 5* (+23) 10
< 1597494063 543334 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Excess Flood
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< 1597495442 73122 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Client Quit
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< 1597497602 549850 :zeroed!~admin@unaffiliated/zeroed JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597499683 771110 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597499788 32031 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-131.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: Changing server
> 1597500600 437753 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Palace14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76674&oldid=76062 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+668) 10Add more examples
< 1597500619 955514 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597502061 839351 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-131.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric
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> 1597506844 338937 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Pikobrain14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76675&oldid=73022 5* 03Hanzlu 5* (+107) 10
> 1597507200 53705 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Hanzlu14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76676&oldid=76474 5* 03Hanzlu 5* (+74) 10
> 1597507444 358908 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Hanzlu14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76677&oldid=76676 5* 03Hanzlu 5* (+37) 10
> 1597507502 236249 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ALIMBIHNN14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76678&oldid=70713 5* 03Hanzlu 5* (+12) 10
> 1597507621 515055 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[073LEB14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76679&oldid=74889 5* 03Hanzlu 5* (+118) 10
> 1597507722 485729 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Hanzlu14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76680&oldid=76677 5* 03Hanzlu 5* (+142) 10
< 1597508435 384503 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597508615 331825 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
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< 1597514823 892696 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597516849 584445 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Arn14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76681 5* 03ZippyMagician 5* (+15928) 10Version 1
> 1597516866 585087 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:ZippyMagician14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76682&oldid=76323 5* 03ZippyMagician 5* (+9) 10Add Arn to page
< 1597517154 836231 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric
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< 1597524063 430749 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d0e7:987a:8b3f:f25a QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1597525082 571723 :ubq323!~ubq323@host86-165-21-38.range86-165.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597525360 684931 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597525895 435301 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597526257 27612 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Sgeo" (https://matrix.to/#/@freenode_Sgeo:matrix.org): I think I'm gonna read Homestuck again. I'll plan to start on October 25th and then read 100 pages a week from that point on.
< 1597526257 772667 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it'll take, what, about two years? 
< 1597526293 824613 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Man, Matrix is just the worst.
< 1597526312 105748 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah! What did it do this time? 
< 1597526346 458908 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia says 8,123 pages. 8123 / 100 / 52 ~= 1.56
< 1597526369 369912 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yup, that's a fair bunch.
< 1597526392 689337 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :100 pages a week would probably feel a bit inconsistent though, when a page can be anything from a 13 minute animation to just an image
< 1597526398 473734 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :idk
< 1597526412 580654 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :When people using Matrix post something on IRC it becomes decorated with all sorts of nonsense.
< 1597526413 783700 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :By Homestuck I actually mean all of MSPA, so add the rest of it in. :D
< 1597526418 17705 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can look at the IRC logs.
< 1597526421 341615 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's true. Maybe I'll go by hours instead.
< 1597526429 118427 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sometimes it's worse, like quoting half of the message of the person they're replying to.
< 1597526441 377113 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The only nonsense from Matrix I see is when I was mentioned and it gave a full path to me
< 1597526442 771681 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not just a little nonsense? Interesting.
< 1597526453 433426 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And then after that it's just normal
< 1597526455 557674 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :'"Sgeo" (https://matrix.to/#/@freenode_Sgeo:matrix.org):'
< 1597526461 374245 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:98ce:e4d1:3800:920e JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597526466 171230 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Were you pinging me? Maybe it inserts that on a ping
< 1597526472 211958 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :Interesting. Bardzo interesting.
< 1597526474 917028 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I was.
< 1597526732 86279 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can Matrix be used as a bouncer? >.>
< 1597526761 402508 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:98ce:e4d1:3800:920e QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds
< 1597526763 808023 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would switch to IRCCloud but one network I'm in prohibits it
< 1597526772 189488 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.6.6+deb1ubuntu0.2 - http://znc.in
< 1597526817 121270 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597527224 790128 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597527446 322646 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, Matrix is very much like a bouncer.
< 1597528210 958632 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds
< 1597529596 488446 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5149:5f19:c66a:96fa JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597531315 170481 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5149:5f19:c66a:96fa QUIT :Read error: No route to host
< 1597531352 366689 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597531526 488265 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597531805 665159 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597532008 306834 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597532063 822289 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597532502 474101 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d099:b7f8:7ebd:2a18 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597532575 682064 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d099:b7f8:7ebd:2a18 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
< 1597535072 349056 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :I pretty much wouldn't use IRC any more if it weren't for Matrix.
< 1597535091 414783 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember the good old days, before Discord, when IRC was where it's at :D
< 1597535981 748154 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :When I started using Discord, I was weirded out by how centralized it is. I think I've given up on caring
< 1597535989 685261 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cloud is too convenient
< 1597536113 365013 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I will continue using IRC; Discord is no good.
< 1597537396 733943 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597539007 410695 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
< 1597539021 873307 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597539603 236531 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597544460 37446 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree with zzo38 
< 1597547390 908510 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597551708 406867 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597551722 106290 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
< 1597551789 973616 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life
< 1597552073 897908 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu
< 1597553813 9197 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597555879 751291 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76683&oldid=76650 5* 03Razetime 5* (+1647) 10Added Quine for MAWP
< 1597556834 961881 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597557114 947726 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds
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< 1597561858 954917 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597561937 160190 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76684&oldid=76683 5* 03Razetime 5* (+78) 10/* Quine */
> 1597563597 699758 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:MAWP14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76685&oldid=76537 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+396) 10
< 1597565407 94443 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597565523 776124 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds
< 1597568622 215246 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597573601 741888 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Aepoch14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76686&oldid=66051 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (-13) 10
> 1597574078 452806 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76687&oldid=58874 5* 03Voltage2007 5* (+461) 10
< 1597574232 894015 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer
< 1597574599 508927 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? gregor
< 1597574601 180612 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Gregor took forty cakes. He took 40 cakes. That's as many as four tens. And that's terrible.
< 1597575009 651503 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I tried to google how to broadcast my terminal, shortened the search query, and got the cast for the films Terminal and The Terminal
< 1597575070 836562 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds
< 1597577301 411280 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597578063 888079 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`5 w
< 1597578067 682728 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/2:taneb//Taneb is not elliott, no matter whom you ask. He also isn't a rabbi although has pretended in the past. He has at least two backup keyboards with dodgy SHIFT KEys, cube root of nine genders, one of which is a Czech woman, and above average, not too voluminous, but calm eyebrows. He sometimes invents without noticing it (see: tanebventions). \ hat//hatee-hatee-hatee-hooo \ arrow//Arrows are just strong monads in the category of
< 1597578071 19225 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :`n
< 1597578072 498830 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :2/2: profunctors. Time flies are attracted to them. \ craptimum//A craptimum is a non-optimal optimum. \ ratatouille//A ratatouille is a stuttering rodent.
< 1597580476 383205 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597581498 375637 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07CAPscript14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76688&oldid=76663 5* 03IFcoltransG 5* (-14) 10Reformatted categories
< 1597583032 764451 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1
< 1597583047 784438 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597585105 14927 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric
> 1597585437 657033 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Kaftejiman 5*  10New user account
> 1597585448 735625 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Clunk14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76689&oldid=13050 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+2) 10newer link
< 1597585626 946666 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597585666 473857 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Client Quit
< 1597585889 934357 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597585941 427713 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1597586147 435454 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76690&oldid=76657 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+347) 10/* Introductions */
> 1597586261 406560 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76691&oldid=76669 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+29) 10/* D */
< 1597587201 177252 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric
< 1597587222 476906 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection
> 1597587226 69870 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg: Python for thugs14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76692 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+6071) 10Created page with "= Dawg: Python for thugs =  [[File:https://github.com/kaftejiman/dawg/blob/master/dawg.png?raw=true|frame|none|alt=|caption coolDawg]]  For thugs that like to code.  
1597587271 997165 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/upload14]]4 upload10 02 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* 10uploaded "[[02File:Dawg.png10]]": cool dawg > 1597587347 611560 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg: Python for thugs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76694&oldid=76692 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (-72) 10/* Dawg: Python for thugs */ > 1597587476 423222 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg: Python for thugs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76695&oldid=76694 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+82) 10/* Using Dawg */ > 1597587989 697077 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg: Python for thugs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76696&oldid=76695 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+517) 10/* Dawg: Python for thugs */ < 1597588279 780321 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:201f:9d5c:e236:e036 JOIN :#esoteric > 1597588326 844620 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76697&oldid=76690 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+41) 10/* Introductions */ > 1597588382 950499 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg: Python for thugs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76698&oldid=76696 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+2) 10/* Dawg: Python for thugs */ > 1597588397 313985 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg: Python for thugs14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76699&oldid=76698 5* 03Kaftejiman 5* (+1) 10/* Dawg: Python for thugs */ < 1597588547 780926 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:201f:9d5c:e236:e036 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597591085 424243 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:201f:9d5c:e236:e036 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597591220 318667 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: rebooting < 1597591280 632964 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1597591361 454889 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:201f:9d5c:e236:e036 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597591361 601533 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mvmxoeoxmkzytvkf QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597591371 520864 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cpmpjjwutfkmyahj JOIN :#esoteric < 1597591583 420718 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:a808:479b:b521:146e JOIN :#esoteric < 1597591874 428815 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:186e:aefe:7ac9:c31 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597591993 429358 :tromp__!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:701c:df23:fcfa:1eb0 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597592007 467353 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:a808:479b:b521:146e QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597592159 389699 :tromp_!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:186e:aefe:7ac9:c31 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597592194 388559 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:cd44:4b5:180e:7601 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597592273 394032 :tromp__!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:701c:df23:fcfa:1eb0 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597592463 453077 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:cd44:4b5:180e:7601 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597592525 403808 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597594989 718608 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597595075 56441 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597595161 429837 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597595818 891727 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597596681 921011 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597597828 71962 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597598132 130009 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597598231 74128 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.8 < 1597598411 529740 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597599628 132231 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597600692 570976 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597600770 772820 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597600866 751385 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597601221 24575 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Spare Change14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76700&oldid=75861 5* 03The Esolanger 5* (+12) 10/* The Commands */ > 1597601538 150081 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Spare Change14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76701&oldid=76700 5* 03The Esolanger 5* (+71) 10New heading > 1597601592 192831 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Spare Change14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76702&oldid=76701 5* 03The Esolanger 5* (+1) 10Minor edit < 1597601829 337457 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597602861 785322 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597602908 70692 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597602924 379025 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597603556 850737 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597603676 34577 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597603777 85139 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1597603842 436614 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1597604458 334318 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597605146 997043 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597605217 387695 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597606600 262180 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597609429 790215 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1597609970 207873 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597610525 551982 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597611982 733219 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597612700 160175 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597617899 182609 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597618313 779931 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597619204 4240 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597620001 906032 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1597621453 353638 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597621460 45461 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: https://termcast.org/ < 1597621494 784846 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597621570 803077 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, it's come along a bit since I last used it < 1597621598 502175 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it even has an account system now < 1597621608 625370 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it used to have some sort of rudimentary username/password system but nobody was quite sure how it worked < 1597621659 940964 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597621972 783172 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597622885 140188 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597624462 877827 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597627810 261944 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597627835 922540 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1597628657 419463 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Melbourne? < 1597628973 394845 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597629266 746531 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-131.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597629285 430228 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597634965 173012 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597636242 372891 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597636543 410819 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597637741 501302 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1597638159 378587 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597638167 819315 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597638245 282831 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597638248 248362 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597640818 991706 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597647729 393361 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597648589 821001 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597649043 430169 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597650397 706123 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :@tell ais523 Thanks, termcast was what I had in mind < 1597650397 878905 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Consider it noted. < 1597650792 202835 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some cards in Magic: the Gathering are cantrip cards that say "draw a card"; a variant is "draw a card at the beginning of the next upkeep". Another variant I can think of is to write "the active player draws a card" < 1597651250 773058 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597651389 556208 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Nominate a player to draw a card"? < 1597651626 230843 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Taneb draws a card." < 1597651744 219809 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597652665 385422 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597653723 810716 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597654158 319536 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597654504 78597 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597655206 955424 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597655212 666717 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76703&oldid=76216 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+5082) 10I'm way too lazy to translate these by myself. So I used Google Translate & in parvas oportet video. > 1597655284 546433 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Sandbox14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76704&oldid=76703 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-6) 10/* ==== */ < 1597655290 165711 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Player must place a card face-down on the top of their deck" < 1597655394 65898 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-clfptxdaujhcobju QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597655551 456238 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn't that the opposite? < 1597655565 445026 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes < 1597655648 135167 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :"place a card from the top of your deck into your hand" < 1597655738 483882 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vpmichetvehbbpfq JOIN :#esoteric < 1597659066 957002 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1597659932 276821 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597660330 244865 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597663871 771841 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597667688 685468 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597667783 771076 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597668733 586529 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric > 1597668863 875419 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Palaiologos14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76705&oldid=76667 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (+15) 10um8 note > 1597669697 599144 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Kekcsi 5* 10New user account > 1597670134 86369 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Seed14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76706&oldid=70706 5* 03Palaiologos 5* (-7) 10adjust a deadlink > 1597670177 892039 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76707&oldid=76697 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+356) 10/* Introductions */ < 1597670798 385251 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597670859 977083 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`ioccclist 2020-07-25 The winners of the 27th IOCCC have been announced. Congratulations! < 1597670863 270845 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :ioccclist 2020-07-25 The winners of the 27th IOCCC have been announced. Congratulations! : b_jonas rain2 rain1 < 1597670865 541165 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I totally missed this by like two weeks < 1597671012 572569 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is the first year when someone had four winning entries, isn't it? < 1597671646 699534 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi; interesting < 1597672825 961721 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric ::O < 1597672858 990576 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to enter some time < 1597672862 50617 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just have no idea what to do for it < 1597672885 95200 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :winning entries will be posted soon? < 1597673023 892899 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597673260 591599 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: "soon", i.e. 80% likely posted within a year < 1597673310 31687 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yusuke Endoh had four winning entries in 2015 < 1597673334 505404 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Page says mid-August for the winning entrries being posted < 1597673447 73430 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Arcorann: ah great, thanks, so that's not quite the first < 1597673682 100826 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lámatyávë (pl. lámatyáver) is a noun in Quenya which refers to phonaesthesia of the Elves. It means "sound-taste" and refers to individual pleasure in the sounds and forms of words. < 1597674408 946368 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597674601 196567 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should maybe enter ioccc one day lol < 1597677725 128127 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597678306 797575 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597679889 368167 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597680462 261134 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597680489 909234 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597680675 462466 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597681439 925644 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597681554 786395 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597681609 346720 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597683215 239129 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597684520 780084 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597685856 994867 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed < 1597686098 723796 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597686357 22234 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597687101 899793 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you use lazy evaluation to make a probability of exactly the error function? < 1597687466 737049 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, what do you mean < 1597687575 328835 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597687656 552946 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can take computable reals, make them probabilistic, and then ask whether you can implement a machine that produces outputs that are distributed as N(0,1). < 1597687699 272827 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the answer will be positive, yes you can do that. The details will probably(!) be tedious. < 1597688763 59606 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1597689767 389754 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597690157 778490 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597690261 378663 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :anybody here plays one deck dungeon? < 1597690511 76332 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597690613 417345 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597690861 565666 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: and that might actually cause less problems than the typical things you want to do with computable numbers, because you won't run into a comparison problem where you have two numbers that are equal and you try to evaluate them more and more precisely to tell if the first one is less than the second < 1597691160 879342 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597692037 899000 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1597692183 47595 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1597692219 418962 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597692420 185499 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1597692940 219999 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1597693190 446763 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597694180 779550 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597694929 273892 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597696094 489177 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597696724 438447 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597697746 480168 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597698468 345245 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597700833 443902 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597701143 389547 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597702837 863248 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1597703372 382955 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597703651 468082 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597704455 97920 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597704507 424899 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wish Microsoft and the IANA together staged a coup where they announce as that they now effectively control timezone offsets in most of the non-islamic parts of the world, they declare themselves authoritive about future timezones, and politicians and local media are no longer allowed to change timezone rules without their permission, and they only give permission for rule changes announced at least < 1597704513 373977 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :20 years in advance. < 1597704538 917952 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :They'd have to add a new time-dependent flag to the format about which timezones they claim to be ruling. < 1597704552 325331 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :to the format of the Olson's timezone database that is < 1597704696 610771 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe they'd need Google to join as well. I think they could convince everyone to believe the time of their smartphones and computers rather than whatever the politicians announce and possibly force news agencies to use. < 1597704740 149887 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It might cause the usual temporary chaos with people confused about the timezone offset, but eventually the governments would give in. < 1597704808 232791 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Realistically though, why should they take any interest in that. < 1597704825 678167 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which they? < 1597704835 39076 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :MS et al. < 1597704941 117447 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :For the same reason as most techies want that, because it's annoying to have to treat every fucking government's whim as an urgent security update that has to be propagated to every device, sometimes faster than normal update schedules, including devices that have no reason to be connected to anything and wouldn't normally need updates. < 1597704952 562910 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the server side you just use a smoothened version of UTC. And you update type zones with your monthly update for clients. < 1597704959 331565 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because we want to be able to plan future events and announce them in localtimes. < 1597704984 233005 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's basically a solved problem. < 1597704985 314864 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or adjust to plans by typical people who define their times in a localtime. < 1597704989 326755 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's not a solved problem. < 1597705059 85359 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :For a big tech company? I think the two things I said solve it for them, or reduce it to a nuisance. > 1597705115 28290 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unary Except Every Zero Is Replaced with the Title of This Programming Language or, Alternately, Is Replaced with the Smallest Counter-Example to the Goldbach Conjecture. Compilers and Interpreters Only Have to Implement the Former Option14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76708&oldid=52676 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+1) 10/* Implementations */ fixed interpreter < 1597705210 488398 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh great, a second order Brainfuck derivative. < 1597705274 742956 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597705292 284496 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597705327 756418 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597705351 305412 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597705410 958164 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: That, but timezones are abolished < 1597705511 134459 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: I don't think that's a good idea, and even if you really wanted that, do that with the 20 years (or more) of notice < 1597705553 614970 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it is what you do right now by using UTC and smoothing over leap seconds. < 1597705592 456897 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The worst that will happen is that some schedules will be slightly harder to express, since they will change time based on the date. > 1597705649 341800 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unary Except Every Zero Is Replaced with the Title of This Programming Language or, Alternately, Is Replaced with the Smallest Counter-Example to the Goldbach Conjecture. Compilers and Interpreters Only Have to Implement the Former Option14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76709&oldid=76708 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+0) 10/* Implementations */ wait no I'm stupid < 1597705650 421557 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that's just for those people who actually give a shit about exactly where the sun is in the sky during whatever it is they're doing. < 1597705840 622623 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The worst affected by time zones are real people (because of DST changes and having schedules tight to the resulting clock, resulting in a biannual jetlag), followed by travel companies (airlines, railways). > 1597705845 100242 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Unary Except Every Zero Is Replaced with the Title of This Programming Language or, Alternately, Is Replaced with the Smallest Counter-Example to the Goldbach Conjecture. Compilers and Interpreters Only Have to Implement the Former Option14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76710&oldid=76709 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-216) 10testing in production is fun! < 1597706059 59407 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that DST should be abolished. < 1597706108 342161 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :tight -> tied (ouch) < 1597706307 745985 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Either permanently 1 hour ahead or permanently not 1 hour ahead; I would prefer the latter, but would also accept the former. I am not the only one. Even people that want to abolish DST some prefer one hour ahead and some not, though.) < 1597706531 821938 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The collaboration of Google is probably not needed, only that of IANA and Microsoft. < 1597706535 385449 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, early birds < 1597706562 832906 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, at least I think so. I can't be sure they won't start a fork out of it. < 1597706569 876052 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose not everyone would use Microsoft and IANA for planning events anyways, though, and not everyone can announce changes twenty years in advance. Not everyone will use smartphones or computers either. But, CBC has a national official time signal on the radio, so you can still have that. (But, if you need accurate timekeeping then probably you will have a computer machine, too.) < 1597706708 265538 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, I would want that even if you use a sundial you can get close enough (if the weather is OK, and accurate timekeeping isn't needed). > 1597706838 816354 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Asra 5* 10New user account < 1597706916 492970 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like sun dial? > 1597706944 600372 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76711&oldid=76707 5* 03Asra 5* (+64) 10/* Introductions */ > 1597707035 446701 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76712&oldid=76711 5* 03Asra 5* (+73) 10/* Introductions */ > 1597707178 296492 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Mattisfond 5* 10New user account > 1597707289 972219 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03JCG 5* 10New user account > 1597707461 958769 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76713&oldid=76712 5* 03JCG 5* (+115) 10Added myself, John Griffin. > 1597707583 201813 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asra14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76714 5* 03Asra 5* (+14) 10Created page with "this is a test" > 1597707603 163639 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Asra14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76715&oldid=76714 5* 03Asra 5* (+23) 10/* wait what */ new section > 1597707800 610143 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76716&oldid=75353 5* 03JCG 5* (+126) 10 > 1597708590 553876 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Faces14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76717 5* 03Asra 5* (+1463) 10Created page with "Face is a programming language that is made up of entirely faces, there are 16 faces in total and are used as commands and arguments or seperators. There is also one value int..." > 1597708633 418800 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76718&oldid=76691 5* 03Asra 5* (+12) 10/* F */ < 1597708635 462148 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1597708680 910521 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Faces14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76719&oldid=76717 5* 03Asra 5* (+0) 10 < 1597709818 991974 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1597710070 977129 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597713901 817398 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597717030 118409 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597717526 473317 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597721195 150591 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597721206 584120 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso JOIN :#esoteric < 1597721363 290924 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-hpzxlpfyjrdmebes QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597721365 663002 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-imxxwvmhptdzookn QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597721818 127042 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ieqxwcedqwdglgpt JOIN :#esoteric < 1597723827 943129 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597723926 531939 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-kgyplhrkrdhrltdv JOIN :#esoteric < 1597724628 60204 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597724645 254982 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597724708 334629 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597726089 799154 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Write error: Connection reset by peer < 1597726089 958687 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597726289 813379 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1597726775 332160 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597728236 22887 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597730374 466305 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Write error: Broken pipe < 1597730374 720208 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597730577 356040 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597730582 826146 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1597731030 929857 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597731145 962000 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1597733913 227950 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1597734258 454402 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597734601 15628 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello! Does anybody know a simplistic wiki which uses Markdown, allows math and may well be unversioned? (and maybe even no merge functionality, I plan to use it only myself). And just maybe it also generates/refreshes static HTMLs? That would be optimal. Wait, it could also add Disqus widgets to the bottom of selected pages. Now that’s complete < 1597734674 455407 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I’m well afraid I’ll need to write that myself. That would be a simple and good Python ecosystem exercise but… laaazy < 1597734972 6203 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe describe better what you are trying to make with that? < 1597734999 155760 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Fossil supports Markdown, but not the other stuff you mention.) < 1597735340 140115 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I use miraheze with tags, prefer $ but i have a userscript to transform < 1597735354 438216 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597735364 719430 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think tiddlywiki can do mathjax though, which would be nice < 1597735368 204994 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :specially for self hosting < 1597735381 322298 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://mathjax-tw5.kantorsite.net/ < 1597735685 906977 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some TeX commands I used in math formulas many other systems can't use, so it isn't very good. < 1597735842 6212 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: just a site with a couple of posts < 1597735940 529173 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: Then maybe just use a static page generator that can convert Markdown to HTML (and render the math with another program too, I suppose, and then you can include the pictures, with alt text containing the original text), I think. < 1597735960 223555 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If you need discussion forums, I can suggest setting up NNTP) < 1597735994 685369 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: how hard is it to host TiddlyWiki these days? (Without someone else being able to edit it) < 1597736050 235157 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose you could password POST and PUT requests in your server configuration, if the software supports writing but you want to restrict it. < 1597736068 636550 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think it is just a html file you can save on your computer < 1597736107 8471 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: yeah, I still consider that but I don’t want to sync files to the server. Hmm maybe git pull once a couple of minutes wouldn’t harm the server but I don’t know how to do that yet < 1597736147 895265 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already have a repo and pandoc here and on the server. That’s cheap for a static site generator but it will do maybe. But a wiki-like thing would be even better still < 1597736208 438900 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: yeah, but uploading it to the server each time would be tedious :\ < 1597736214 659483 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :what server? < 1597736224 851841 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some server to host a website < 1597736241 920023 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh you want to host it online < 1597736246 746508 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you are only editing it yourself and do not need history, then why do you need a "wiki-like thing"? < 1597736260 528950 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :(anyway thanks! Right now I don’t use TW but maybe that plugin would be useful in the future for local notes) < 1597736277 681073 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i think i don't fully understand what you need < 1597736285 18865 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought this was local notes < 1597736296 504892 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :should it be readable by everyone but writable by you only? < 1597736302 79431 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I mean, wiki-like in that it allows you edit it in the browser < 1597736306 815170 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :rain1: exactly < 1597736359 247491 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe miraheze has a option for it < 1597736364 478476 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can be writable by more than one person too, just ones I can keep track of somewhere in the config < 1597736408 354827 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:User_rights_and_groups < 1597736486 266519 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :miraheze is a good thing too, my friends and me use it for some other notes a bit in a shared wiki, but sometimes it’s slow and has small issues < 1597736559 295133 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1597736570 711441 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :github pages could be an option < 1597736584 424132 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :because you can invite people to edit it < 1597736587 332136 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah mediawiki (and miraheze also) is a, well, thing, but it would be too big in a sense that it’s far more than needed. Thanks once more though! Maybe I really just need to install it, why not… but… < 1597736677 553178 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that thing too, yes. Though it requires a public repo. That’s not bad, I just wanted to experiment a bit in a private one, but maybe < 1597736694 148434 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :also I think one can write small posts in github gists :D < 1597736774 727692 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm for early drafts that may even be well enough < 1597736822 992870 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the math.stackexchange editor where you get feedback on the latex < 1597737037 655111 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I generally find it suitable and useful to just host plain text files. Better compatibility, faster, etc. < 1597737113 743228 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: ASCII math is a pain sometimes though :) too much parentheses and less digestable expressions, and sometimes an ambiguous syntax < 1597737208 979105 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, although for some things it works (for math, it is not as good as TeX, though, of course) < 1597737493 73142 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://bookstore.ams.org/car-36/ < 1597738213 224376 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597738305 199241 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597738359 959998 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ieqxwcedqwdglgpt QUIT :Quit: killed < 1597738360 354129 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-kgyplhrkrdhrltdv QUIT :Quit: killed < 1597738378 665421 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597738928 488725 :wmww!wmwwmatrix@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-flhbzsewafbvwkrd JOIN :#esoteric < 1597740801 479746 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :what a book > 1597740848 28753 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03CatLooks 5* 10New user account < 1597740939 754306 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ehalaboapnkcudvc JOIN :#esoteric > 1597741300 238474 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76720&oldid=76713 5* 03CatLooks 5* (+182) 10/* Introductions */ > 1597741527 324234 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:CatLooks14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76721 5* 03CatLooks 5* (+135) 10Created page with "Hi, I'm CatLooks. I like Python. I'll post links to esolangs, that I create. ( It's empty right now :( ) Thanks for visiting my page." > 1597741641 694131 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:CatLooks14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76722 5* 03CatLooks 5* (+13) 10Created page with "Talking page." < 1597742271 340563 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-104.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1597743914 958997 :mniip!~mniip@freenode/staff/mniip QUIT :Ping timeout: 604 seconds > 1597746206 298352 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:CatLooks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76723&oldid=76722 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+124) 10 < 1597749958 691606 :mniip!~mniip@freenode/staff/mniip JOIN :#esoteric < 1597750271 536708 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmf. I have a daemon thing written in Go, and I need a way to control it a little (ask for status, force it to perform scheduled tasks right now, that sort of thing). What's the best way to make that happen? < 1597750280 68123 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm vacillating between (a) a Unix domain control socket (with maybe gRPC on it, if that's kosher) and a corresponding `fooctl` command-line program to complement the `food` (no pun intended), auth handled by filesystem permissions; or (b) a HTTPS server providing a browser-based control surface, with client certificate fingerprints saved in the config file for auth. < 1597750285 368791 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :But maybe there's something obviously better than either. < 1597750469 402985 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I recommend not using dbus? < 1597750544 565905 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ooh, I didn't even think of that. Maybe I should use D-Bus? < 1597750591 230837 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :dbus uses approach a, for what it's worth. < 1597750629 823006 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it sure isn't something I want to use. < 1597750737 333394 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it haad some sort of custom authentication mechanism on top too. < 1597750768 834033 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it has multiple authentication methods? But when I actually run a dbus fooctl program it seems to be filesystem-based. < 1597750809 195871 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, or maybe not. < 1597750861 652828 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Mhm. Well, I've also heard there's a PolicyKit. But I'm not sure I want to get involved with that. < 1597750867 620409 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it's something more complicated. < 1597750874 80459 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh well. < 1597750888 857513 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't actually know a really nice canonical sort of answer to your question. < 1597750908 376750 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597750961 223895 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway I should sleepulate. < 1597750967 492977 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Did they pick up the "PolicyKit" "ConsoleKit" etc. naming scheme from NextStep / OS X, which I think has a bunch of Kits?) < 1597751010 887801 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think I'll go bicyclate a little, maybe that'll tell me what to do. < 1597752458 966107 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597753718 889506 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1597753734 835215 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597754172 489040 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597756488 25354 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597757809 972955 :Deewiant_!~deewiant@de1.ut.deewiant.iki.fi NICK :Deewiant < 1597760040 129516 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597760391 152191 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597760677 653258 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0e8:1e43:d35:4272 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597760683 242287 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597762170 849793 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597762973 780898 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597763731 668858 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597765713 29782 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1597766300 178720 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597766924 728520 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1211 < 1597766926 826562 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1211.html: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas < 1597767198 970104 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://pastebin.com/KXuAKfDa actual config file for the game i am implementing < 1597767606 460692 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.8 < 1597767989 126691 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597768057 24739 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597768807 324700 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed < 1597769248 258375 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597769306 933215 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric > 1597771121 163668 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Faces14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76724&oldid=76719 5* 03Asra 5* (+378) 10 < 1597772784 770450 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597772883 868483 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597774332 674871 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597774755 111086 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597775089 85475 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit > 1597776317 576239 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Half-Broken Car in Heavy Traffic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76725&oldid=49827 5* 03Nqpz 5* (-14) 10Update external source code URLs < 1597776759 304594 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :WTF, seriously? Epic is trying to frame their addition of a new payment option as a "hotfix"? > 1597776805 785230 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Half-Broken Car in Heavy Traffic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76726&oldid=76725 5* 03Nqpz 5* (+174) 10Add link to BF-to-HBCHT transpiler < 1597776828 45958 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://cdn2.unrealengine.com/epic-v-apple-8-17-20-768927327.pdf starting on page 8, line 23. > 1597776907 680050 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Half-Broken Car in Heavy Traffic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76727&oldid=76726 5* 03Nqpz 5* (+29) 10Argue for Turing completeness based on the new BF-to-HBCHT transpiler < 1597777017 186640 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: spooky > 1597777026 882962 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Half-Broken Car in Heavy Traffic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76728&oldid=76727 5* 03Nqpz 5* (+37) 10Clarify ambigious word use < 1597777029 713517 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: how so? < 1597777062 421209 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i got bored of rewriting rendering stuff after getting ideas for rearrangements < 1597777073 86087 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i basically just parse those directly < 1597777103 249357 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I just didn’t know what word to say :D definitely a good idea < 1597777277 476170 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: If they call adding a new character to a game a "hotfix", it seems like a similar degree of change? < 1597777293 693027 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vpmichetvehbbpfq QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597777296 613821 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: Sure, that is the argument they're trying to make. < 1597777313 874345 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why is it important if something is a hotfix or not? < 1597777325 170194 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But this is... they anticipated the need for an alternative payment processor in a market that they *know* has only one payment processor. < 1597777336 801415 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: because hotfixes are an accepted industry practice. < 1597777358 889328 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, so? what difference would a normal feature addition make? < 1597777368 793910 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So they have by no means circumvented Apple's review process, they're totally innocent and acting in good faith. < 1597777377 506213 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i see < 1597777386 663557 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, they're arguing that Apple's behavior is illegal, right? < 1597777396 987497 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I agree that it's a little silly to add support for payment methods that way. < 1597777422 581671 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: in that case, i would have tried sueing them _first_ and not after i explicitly work against their policies < 1597777436 250621 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing is, they could make their antitrust case while distributing a perfectly ToS-abiding version of Fortnite... as they've done for year. < 1597777439 258411 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :*s < 1597777443 759542 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't know what the strategy is. < 1597777450 500891 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope it works out for them. < 1597777457 435022 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course it wouldn't attract nearly as much attention. < 1597777467 539797 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am not sure on which side i am < 1597777478 261069 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, this is bullies fighting. < 1597777498 715358 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything Epic has done with regard to these online stores has seemed positive to me. < 1597777503 686747 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :epic in itself is a bit weird < 1597777504 11328 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :With some luck, ordinary developers will get some of the crumbs (better terms for entry into Apple's iOS market.) < 1597777528 541734 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epic is a bloodsucking vampire. < 1597777548 698081 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you figure? < 1597777575 652529 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i remember hearing them putting money in forests and stuff, that's neat, but i hate how aggressive they are with their store < 1597777576 411322 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a big corporation making loads of money, that's basically all the evidence I need :P < 1597777601 405215 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :They think loot boxes, pay to win and all that are great innovations. < 1597777613 236560 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, sure. < 1597777621 614872 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have pay to win? < 1597777625 679926 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: do you have sources for that? < 1597777627 148775 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I'm sure if I search for 5 minutes I'll find half a dozen stories of developers being treated badly. < 1597777640 223114 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean, it's not bathesda or ea we are talking about < 1597777644 728875 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought it was all skinning. < 1597777653 727046 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortnite is all skinning, yeah < 1597777655 252729 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Which developers? Selling things on Epic Game Store? < 1597777669 223811 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: The Google brief actually has an example for innovation that is a video game where you pay for extra lives seamlessly during gameplay. < 1597777678 260893 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: pay to win in its purest form. < 1597777690 409260 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch JOIN :#esoteric < 1597777697 173215 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :fortnite is an interesting phenomenon. it's f2p, you cannot pay for gaming advantages, yet they make plenty of money < 1597777717 882356 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: how so? < 1597777749 638016 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :[citation needed] < 1597777769 108927 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What Epic has been doing seems pretty pro-developer to me. < 1597777786 112603 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least above industry average < 1597777796 303578 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is pretty low) < 1597777802 28494 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: It is pay to win, it's just that the game isn't obvious. It's about coolness. < 1597777832 180639 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: what gaming advantage can you get with money in an epic game? < 1597777833 154022 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"I'm an original gamer, I have all the Season 1 goodies" < 1597777843 10134 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are clothing stores also pay to win? < 1597777847 554752 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not pay to win < 1597777855 995956 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: As I said, it's not the obvious game. < 1597777868 948611 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seems hard to get that worked up about people playing a game and paying to change their character's appearance. < 1597777891 139054 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: It's about looks, like not sailing in on an umbrella like Mary Poppins. < 1597777950 398755 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: i strongly disagree about that being p2w. you may have some sort of community circlejerking, but i can choose whether or not i participate there and i will have no disadvantage in the main game if i choose not to < 1597777986 685655 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: thank god for not being a teenager < 1597778002 660245 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :21:10:43 Are clothing stores also pay to win? < 1597778004 649106 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :^ < 1597778058 354956 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"an example for innovation that is a video game where you pay for extra lives seamlessly during gameplay" => how is that innovation? didn't many of the earliest arcade and pinball games do that? < 1597778079 664622 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: you have to ask Epic and their lawyers < 1597778247 620977 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway, I want Epic to prevail on their antitrust claims. I don't care about the Fortnite sideshow. I think it'd be perfectly reasonable to force Epic to adhere to Apple's ToS for the time being (meaning adhering to the requirement of using Apple's payment processor) and then wait for the antitrust case to settle. < 1597778274 607228 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Imagine if they actually succeed at their stated goal of reducing game store fees from 30% to 12%. < 1597778296 718565 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And also at breaking Steam's monopoly. < 1597778303 168321 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder if google has it easier as you can pretty easily install third party apps on android < 1597778345 16698 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'd like them to break steam's monopoly without actually breaking steam, pretty please < 1597778367 734532 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: is it easier to install third party apps on android than to install third party apps on apple? < 1597778394 201641 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: you can toggle a setting in android and can install downloaded apks < 1597778400 758985 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: Maybe. Their main complaint against Google is actually that they enter agreements with OEMs that mandate having Google Play displayed prominently and prevents OEMs from having alternative stores preinstalled (with the exception of Samsung's Galaxy, which is a case where the OEM has their own store)> < 1597778403 54975 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :on ios, you need to jailbreak < 1597778438 862434 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: And sideloading is just to scary for most users, says Epic. < 1597778473 979346 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they cite the European Commission who found that Google Play has a 90% market share worldwide in the Android app market. < 1597778496 960327 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, what is their idea on how the play store gets financed? < 1597778540 703214 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Epic, for the time being, thinks a 12% share is enough to finance a store. < 1597778562 475668 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and they would remove their own payment option then? < 1597778565 200119 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems fair < 1597778565 495434 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And they do mention that they would establish their own Android and iOS stores, given the chance. < 1597778573 80049 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: No they wouldn't. < 1597778586 824227 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fortnite *is* a sideshow here. < 1597778587 475775 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they already do have their own stores < 1597778612 203205 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Reading between the lines they really want their own store, on all platforms. < 1597778612 420063 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wanted to play an epic game for android and needed to install their store < 1597778619 643667 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: hmm, but isn't apple trying to jail software to hardware in the other direction instead, as in, ensuring that their OS and programs can only be ran on hardware that they sell, as opposed to android and windows, for which third party companies are allowed to make and sell hardware < 1597778661 933811 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: And btw, if Apple has problems with making profit from free to play games... I'm sure they can come up with a payment model for those that works independently of in game payments. < 1597778665 709232 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: both < 1597778693 108362 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :not that it's *easy* to make hardware for android in practice, mind you < 1597778693 880425 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: like the game pass? < 1597778719 622500 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: Like charging the developer for every sold copy and every shipped update. < 1597778725 878312 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sold" < 1597778736 100744 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess "every download" sums it up better. < 1597778750 920989 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's interesting to watch how apple and google basically try to make the same thing with their passes yet they have significant differences < 1597778786 908281 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: charging for every download if you have no other choice will lead to another lawsuit, i guess < 1597778813 189532 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: Not really, not if the fees are "reasonable" by a pretty broad standard. < 1597778836 895987 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would feel pretty blocked out if i am not allowed to offer a game that makes me no money without having to pay regularly < 1597778850 194744 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It'll be the same lawsuit, which, again, is about opening up the market to alternative stores, not really about Fortnite. < 1597778854 401701 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you have ads in the game, sure, apple can get their share < 1597778910 515667 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I'm sure stores can distinguish between commercial games (with in game revenue stream) and non-commercial ones if they like. < 1597778928 3785 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs. < 1597778935 294283 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least if they adhere to the tos, yeah < 1597778947 188641 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually we have too many things going on in this discussion, it's getting confusing. < 1597778950 824290 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :the play store lists if an app contains IAP or ads < 1597782226 732934 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you like The Corrs’ “Runaway” composition-wise/sound-wise? < 1597784399 961868 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1597785187 974202 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597786520 565934 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597786997 462147 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric > 1597787152 916568 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:CatLooks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76729&oldid=76723 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+90) 10 > 1597787299 937422 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:CatLooks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76730&oldid=76729 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+36) 10 > 1597787323 761226 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76731&oldid=71315 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+0) 10 > 1597787482 992369 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:A/ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76732 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+95) 10Created page with "you found it the r < 1597788430 286254 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597791346 247368 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597791713 886623 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597791746 686554 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597791768 954874 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597791779 754878 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :supposing I want to display three values whose meaning is mostly self-explanatory, but then also want to display the three keys for them (as in what they are values for), and I want to put the values first and in a particular order to make this more informative in case the display is truncated (and possibly scrollable), what punctuation would I put around and between the keys for that? would it be like < 1597791786 215489 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"valueA, valueB, valueC (keyA, keyB, keyC)"? < 1597791836 836470 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :by mostly self-explanatory I mean eg. valueA is a timestamp, and you can guess that it's a timestamp because it's formatted like a timestamp, and you can guess what it is timestamp for because that's what makes sense in context. < 1597793423 681766 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think it depends on the program and other stuff < 1597796890 47302 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why does the PK font format not pad scanlines and most other uses of packed bitmaps (e.g. PBM, PostScript, X windows) do pad scanlines? < 1597802656 441863 :APic!apic@apic.name QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597802743 671173 :V!v@anomalous.eu QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597802775 802970 :V!v@anomalous.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597802801 227052 :V!v@anomalous.eu NICK :Guest7215 < 1597802901 555917 :Guest7215!v@anomalous.eu QUIT :Client Quit < 1597803062 972360 :V_!v@anomalous.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597803091 247810 :grumble!~Thunderbi@freenode/staff/grumble QUIT :Ping timeout: 619 seconds < 1597803159 600288 :V_!v@anomalous.eu QUIT :Client Quit < 1597803165 68344 :grumble!~Thunderbi@freenode/staff/grumble JOIN :#esoteric < 1597803199 943096 :V_!v@anomalous.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597803352 255253 :APic!apic@apic.name JOIN :#esoteric < 1597803550 259841 :V_!v@anomalous.eu NICK :V < 1597803843 573843 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597806905 230766 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597807107 288874 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597807860 259127 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597808897 583955 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597809090 932865 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597811216 938691 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597811233 985980 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1597811300 442828 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597819487 779763 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597819792 786823 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597819885 442817 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597820112 273696 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597820288 550493 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597820920 893499 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597824639 828384 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597824783 779190 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1597825651 632066 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76733&oldid=71260 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+37) 10 < 1597826393 806226 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-6.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1597827160 834901 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597827863 175194 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597828419 453438 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1597828841 370614 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597830588 294887 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597830616 803076 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`bots < 1597830619 108590 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :bots? No such file or directory < 1597830634 875984 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`prefixes < 1597830636 463664 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bot prefixes: fungot ^, HackEso `, EgoBot !, lambdabot @ or ?, thutubot +, metasepia ~, idris-bot ( , jconn ) , j-bot [ , bfbot =. < 1597833057 219498 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1597833349 792230 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like level 4 PostScript? I can think of many improvements of level 3 PostScript that perhaps should be to make up level 4 PostScript, including alpha transparency, auto-allocation for some operators, some Ghostscript features, FFI, many other improvements, etc. Some features also are not needed, such as the job server and DSC. < 1597833618 687209 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Such as, I think the %pipe% device and makeimagedevice command in Ghostscript can be good to have, and have use them.) < 1597834369 958967 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597834885 897837 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597835708 214170 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597835809 789038 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In which programming languages (esolangs or otherwise) could you implement conditions out of stuff other than conditions, and in what ways (e.g. with or without using other boolean operations)? < 1597835873 82578 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :every language that can cast bool to int and do pointer arithmetic < 1597835984 736140 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is a case where it can be done. However, I also mean such things like: http://esolangs.org/wiki/Talk:GASOIL < 1597836188 926100 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I do not merely mean operations such as "if", and casting bool to int might count as a "boolean operation" (or might not, depending how you count it). < 1597836212 114230 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, note that in C, any nonzero number will be true. < 1597836289 715863 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i don't know if rust allows you to cast a boolean to a number < 1597836320 106101 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can do it with the ternary operator, but that's kind of an if imho < 1597836336 182677 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also don't know; I don't know Rust programming < 1597836338 81406 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: in systems with self-modification, such as ByteByteJump, changing jump addresses provides conditions < 1597836360 780522 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...though, you probably already know that... < 1597836435 44960 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :t20kdc: Yes, there is that. Perhaps make a list of the different ways. I know of some ways, but maybe not all, and even if I do know, that does not mean I know all of them. Also, some that already have conditions, implementing it differently may be inefficient of course, but that isn't my concern of course. < 1597836516 68809 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :A technique I think I've seen in shader programming is to use multiply-by-0/multiply-by-1 as a conditional add. < 1597836558 526315 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do this all the time < 1597836559 529444 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I think I once also figured out how to make up some conditions in TeX without using any of the condition commands, too) < 1597836569 760953 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :t20kdc: Yes, and I think I have done that < 1597836675 711783 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I have also done something similar in BASIC, which has no ?: command like C has, but note that in BASIC, the operators that make a boolean value will be -1 if true rather than +1) < 1597836750 86828 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not that uncommon < 1597836770 571560 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :true being -1 makes boolean operations somewhat nicer < 1597836787 665230 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, I know that it does in some ways. < 1597836873 194523 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In LLVM, a boolean is just a one bit integer, so you can sign-extend or zero-extend. < 1597836892 35343 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1597836966 624019 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In PostScript, you can do this: /if << true /exec load false /pop load >> def /if {exch //if exch get exec} bind def < 1597837057 510452 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Actually, eq can also be implemented in a similar way, except for the name length limit and the fact that null is not a valid key in a dictionary.) < 1597837133 876632 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I don't know if it could for lt and gt though.) < 1597837246 557436 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suppose, in programming languages with arbitrarily big numbers, you might be able to check less/greater by doing subtraction, convert to a string, and check if the first character is a minus sign by using a dictionary. < 1597838207 775578 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597840121 235402 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597840747 830239 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1597840765 995059 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597841526 331831 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I some cases, loops with repeat counts can be used. < 1597841768 355994 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597842790 554232 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today's Girl Genius: Albia asks what we're all thinking < 1597843411 3508 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597845323 822666 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597845430 959687 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there test files to test a DVI reading program? < 1597845478 872705 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597846378 945491 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597846466 293270 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MONOD/interpreterv114]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76734&oldid=14780 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-114) 10fixed genome parsing bug > 1597847493 105917 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Galaxtone14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76735&oldid=55602 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+29) 10/* Talk */ new section > 1597847516 427553 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Galaxtone14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76736&oldid=76735 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+110) 10 > 1597847562 49534 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Digital Hunter14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76737&oldid=55279 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+125) 10 < 1597847943 809477 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597848424 974794 :osminee!4fd6fe14@p4fd6fe14.dip0.t-ipconnect.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1597848434 799560 :osminee!4fd6fe14@p4fd6fe14.dip0.t-ipconnect.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1597848466 680979 :osminee!4fd6fe14@p4fd6fe14.dip0.t-ipconnect.de QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597848774 622270 :APic!apic@apic.name PRIVMSG #esoteric :Impatience sucks. < 1597848844 217871 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :dont worry you wont be impatient forever < 1597853313 804284 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597854381 63879 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597854398 266181 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597855729 738883 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1597857201 641080 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597858519 973919 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597858825 509016 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric < 1597858905 881502 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597859003 867839 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597859012 737539 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597859393 821707 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597860648 12518 :kekcsi!b03f17a7@catv-176-63-23-167.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1597860672 738633 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1597860710 847944 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-ziorsovbbtcojhxy QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597860736 356240 :heroux!sandroco@gateway/shell/insomnia247/x-xykyltbopmvgikfz JOIN :#esoteric > 1597860917 875075 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76738&oldid=76718 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+14) 10 < 1597861792 181835 :kekcsi!b03f17a7@catv-176-63-23-167.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597862510 326425 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597862533 906483 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1597866569 470003 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597866709 962093 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1597866992 257381 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597867157 755284 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Client Quit < 1597867438 614442 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597869854 927305 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1597870676 203227 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597871017 251001 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1597871380 507960 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1597871770 31883 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597871800 416650 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597871809 441369 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric < 1597874212 96559 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds > 1597874485 505919 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Cameron 5* 10New user account > 1597874726 681416 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76739&oldid=76720 5* 03Cameron 5* (+209) 10/* Introductions */ > 1597875210 426847 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* 10moved [[02Dawg: Python for thugs10]] to [[Dawg]]: "Python for thugs" doesn't appear to be part of the name > 1597875258 178278 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Dawg14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76742&oldid=76740 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-1038) 10there's already an automatic ToC? < 1597875300 29964 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1597875355 746257 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* 10moved [[02Faces10]] to [[Face]]: "Face" appears to be the actual name > 1597875425 179003 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76745&oldid=76738 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (-19) 10fixed links < 1597875446 506087 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds > 1597875637 774710 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stax14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76746 5* 03Cameron 5* (+462) 10Created page > 1597875694 375216 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stax14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76747&oldid=76746 5* 03Cameron 5* (+1) 10/* External resources */ wrong category < 1597876135 490237 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric > 1597876146 560869 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Stax14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76748 5* 03Cameron 5* (+506) 10Created page with "== Programs I've made with it == ===== 99 bottles of beer ===== assign bottles to Number assign lyrics to String push 99 to bottles push Take one down, pass it around to l..." < 1597877523 454962 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597877863 950847 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597878308 120500 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597878369 187051 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597878393 163760 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597883270 345973 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today I wrote this program: http://sprunge.us/3AtNod (I don't know if it is any good to you, but, there it is.) < 1597883450 220544 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597883482 809118 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: What language is that? < 1597883523 304893 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :moony: PostScript. < 1597883610 140585 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1597884399 948933 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although, with some features specific to Ghostscript, such as the %pipe% device, and the makeimagedevice operator.) < 1597884471 932966 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: what does it do? < 1597884496 312594 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :kmc: It parses and renders a DVI file (such as output from TeX). < 1597884547 827709 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, cool < 1597884634 489970 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597884987 480988 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597886435 721457 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597886566 970754 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597886640 261354 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597892371 973080 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds > 1597893815 542077 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Troll Online14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76749&oldid=65983 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+49) 10replace private repo with clone > 1597896908 213723 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07E62qpodb59314]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76750&oldid=76427 5* 03AlexIsOK 5* (-5) 10 < 1597897583 935822 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597897689 273242 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597897689 585883 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597899186 448333 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597899460 474819 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1597899654 805187 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597899851 855447 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@unaffiliated/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597900069 307171 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@unaffiliated/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597900116 805098 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@unaffiliated/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597903077 24699 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xcgmkhghufhdnqrv QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1597903190 786873 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session JOIN :#esoteric < 1597907852 509089 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597908999 445828 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597909026 853662 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597909217 802494 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lksinjkctjabetze QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597909567 561246 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597910251 777952 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles JOIN :#esoteric < 1597910542 949718 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session JOIN :#esoteric < 1597910988 188363 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597911023 851793 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597911103 832895 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597912203 730685 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@unaffiliated/kritixilithos QUIT :Changing host < 1597912203 730738 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597912204 365579 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session QUIT :Changing host < 1597912204 365619 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jqadwdgmrpwtoxqe JOIN :#esoteric < 1597912205 983550 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session QUIT :Changing host < 1597912206 865274 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-aduggknuxskguxam JOIN :#esoteric < 1597915015 114715 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597915754 418766 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597919880 805723 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.7.2+deb3 - https://znc.in < 1597919904 871357 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1597921903 868214 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597922694 817420 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597925323 818817 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597925415 384516 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1597925430 903893 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597925576 815892 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597926863 870950 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597927391 811229 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597928398 824895 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597928429 561893 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597928960 151979 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597930033 938263 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597930054 590250 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597930228 998014 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1597934913 979580 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597934969 188642 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what type of integer does getsockopt(fd, IPPROTO_IP, IP_MTU, &i, sizeof(i)); expect? < 1597936500 847232 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man7/socket.7.html < 1597936657 52689 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :spruit11: "Unless otherwise noted, optval is a pointer to an int." that suggests int, but I'm not sure it applies to IP_MTU, which is doc'ed in ip(7) < 1597936674 884915 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lemme check. < 1597936733 994061 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's not listed as an option you can pass? < 1597936791 925158 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ip(7) says "Returns an integer." < 1597936817 298189 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably an int, that's wide enough for all IP MTU < 1597936841 946462 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Success... < 1597937189 45172 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah look https://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man2/getsockopt.2.html says "Most socket-level options utilize an int argument for optval." < 1597937268 163254 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, isn't that exactly the same as man 7 socket's "unless otherwise noted, optval is a pointer to an int" that you quoted? < 1597937343 35469 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :As in, it's not strictly a "socket-level option" if you pass IPPROTO_IP as the level, so if you don't think one of them necessarily applies, the other shouldn't either. < 1597937361 801860 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I'd assume `int` anyway.) < 1597937446 515765 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: yes, but there are sockopt options associated with different layers, distinguihsed by the second arg of ?etsockopt, so SOL_SOCKET layer doc'ed in socket(7), IPPROTO_IP layer doc'ed in ip(7) etc, and ip(7) does not have such a ocmment, but the getsockopt(2) comment is for any layer < 1597937478 24093 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: and eg. libcurl I think uses long or long long as default type for options < 1597937529 509685 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, I don't think it's for any layer. < 1597937533 582801 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It says "socket-level options". < 1597937540 697180 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1597937555 958073 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The second parameter of getsockopt is called `level`, not `layer`. < 1597937559 226202 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but does "socket-level" mean socket(7) level or any level of sockets? < 1597937584 724621 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would *assume* it means level == SOL_SOCKET. < 1597937584 724703 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should look at the header file, it may have useful comments < 1597937591 378823 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :"To manipulate options at the sockets API level, level is specified as SOL_SOCKET." < 1597937596 792898 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Another bit from man getsockopt.) < 1597937643 412125 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably < 1597937675 224607 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yep, the header "/usr/include/x86_64-linux-gnu/bits/in.h" has a clear comment that says int < 1597937679 638995 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's where I should have looked at first < 1597937712 353691 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :although... it also says "bool" for some types, and iiuc those are of int type, not of the C99/C++ bool type (which has sizeof 1 on x86) < 1597937739 262057 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but these comments may have been written when wasn't a usual thing so bool wasn't a macro or keyword < 1597937747 55123 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or at least by people who were used to that < 1597937785 312823 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, I imagine `bool` in that context just means "int with value 0 or 1". < 1597937826 142832 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact there's a comment for that too: "bool" means a boolean value stored in an `int'. < 1597937830 946605 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in the same header file < 1597937862 737378 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :headers are often useful, I should look at headers more often < 1597937881 360166 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're not useful for all libraries, but for linux ones they are < 1597937930 477054 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597938013 885696 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I did a class on Objective-C and iOS things once, and the instructor was firmly of the opinion that it's better to read Apple's header files than their documentation. < 1597938022 235636 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They have surprisingly few comments in there though. < 1597939844 939768 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is the a classification of finite categories analogous to that of the finite groups? > 1597940772 564753 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Joaomilho 5* 10New user account < 1597940818 800863 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597940986 200716 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1597940990 36111 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1597941677 188111 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1597942076 153903 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597942859 575959 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76751&oldid=76739 5* 03Joaomilho 5* (+207) 10Introduce myself < 1597943232 777447 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :finite categories < 1597944863 968948 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597945578 735425 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Taneb: try to count those finite categories as a function of size modulo whatever kind of isomorphism you want and search on OEIS to find out < 1597946143 828390 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597946224 221649 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597946360 926910 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597949005 654013 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :a friend of mine asked how often there is a type like “angle32” or “angle64” which encodes angle values (R/2πR or R/R as you prefer) in an obvious manner (fixed point without overflow and without allowing multiplication or division by values of the same type, only multiplication by integers if one really wishes to do that)? < 1597949085 139169 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there is an algorithm to compute cosine/sine from that representation and that it’s used in some special hardware but I doesn’t know more. Maybe there are interesting things related to that < 1597949238 445692 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, there would also be of course useful an intrinsic operation (x, m) ↦ 2π(x mod m) which doesn’t resort to floating-point operations (x, m may be non-angular fixed-point numbers or integers) < 1597949331 906813 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :the friend came to this noting that expressing angles in floating point makes some values less precise than others, which is quite unnatural for angle representation < 1597949443 666485 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: hmm... I don't know, I've only seen sin and cos routines for various floating points, including arbitrary precision. so if you gave me a fixed point value with some known range, I'd just scale it to a floating point value of the required precision and compute the sin that way. < 1597949493 903144 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could probably do it directly with fixed points if you really wanted to, but the fact is, double precision floats (64 bit) is almost always eonugh precision for computations like this, and they're fast < 1597949518 130960 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so usually just use double precision or single precision, and even then you can choose a full sincos routine or some faster but less precise approximation < 1597949545 935831 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :trying to do the computation with integers would just slow this down < 1597949563 86184 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :at least on the modern fast x86_64 hardware that I work on < 1597949633 539696 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :you can still use a scaled fixed point value for storage or communication if you want < 1597949635 742106 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :in a usual system, yes, but there happen to be a dedicated hardware for doing that… < 1597949731 962521 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, dedicated hardware for measurements for example. at our work we do industrial control, and all the analog sensors have a hardware that gives fixed point numbers with a known scale (the scale is known from the type of hardware) to the computer, but then our program on the cpu just scales that to a single-precision floating point number before we do anything with it < 1597949753 920567 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :except possibly an out of range checks (to detect hardware failures), that may be before the scaling < 1597949840 930616 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :though we very rarely need to compute anything like a sincos from them, I believe the only case is a tank where we're estimating the volume of the contained liquid from a distance sensor that measures the height, and we know the shape of the tank in advance < 1597949874 41383 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's for the operator UI, not for the control < 1597951526 415691 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah double is very precise and even single is sometimes good, damn you IEEE 754 for being so good < 1597951540 172782 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, sometimes single is good, sometimes not < 1597951576 866167 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course you also have to write your program correctly, if you write it bad so it has additions that cancel out or such similar problems, then no amount of precision is enough < 1597951589 584387 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :Minecraft used single in some places but then in very big worlds very far away this caused entities to misalign. Not long ago they changed to double in those places to alleviate that < 1597951840 570548 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that's why when kids grow up to programmers, we tell them that their teachers lied to them about the quadratic equation a*x**2 + b*x + c = 0 where a, b, c are given real numbers: its actual solutions are x_0 = -(b + sgn(b) * sqrt(b**2 - 4*a*c)) / (2*a), x_1 = c / (a * x_0) < 1597951964 746723 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and when you understand why exactly that is true, you've done the first step on the long path to become a numeric programmer > 1597953245 944322 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Imeight14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76752 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+2589) 10Created page with "== What is imeight == ''imeight'' is an imaginary eight-bit machine imagined by Csaba Skrabk. As an open source project, its emulator is also implemented and available onli..." < 1597953695 5156 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597953771 675778 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Imeight14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76753&oldid=76752 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+188) 10 < 1597954336 925892 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597954346 976262 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net QUIT :Quit: leaving > 1597954419 555065 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Imeight14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76754&oldid=76753 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+8) 10/* Interpreted? */ < 1597954800 996191 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597954849 287462 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1597955549 566543 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fucking Google. < 1597955843 987963 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597956095 966186 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://paste.debian.net/1160688/ <-- all I wanted to do is send an email. < 1597957625 901310 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric : and when you understand why exactly that is true, you've done the first step on the long path to become a numeric programmer => yeah numerics are hard < 1597957657 975672 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :x_0 = -(b + sgn(b) * sqrt(b**2 - 4*a*c)) / (2*a), x_1 = c / (a * x_0) => I think I saw something more sophisticated < 1597961520 585456 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c8f:6b36:e2e4:5ad1 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1597961972 186075 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Imeight14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76755&oldid=76754 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+1050) 10 < 1597962462 853735 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds > 1597963443 173077 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Imeight14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76756&oldid=76755 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+4) 10/* Interpreted? */ < 1597964005 595158 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597964047 509699 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Kekcsi14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76757 5* 03Kekcsi 5* (+309) 10Created page with "Hello World! I am a professional user of programming languages, interested in the development of the languages actually used, and a fan of languages that are too interesting..." < 1597965174 504086 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: more sophisticated how? handles complex a,b,c? can avoid some rare overflows/underflows? < 1597965227 63089 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or the much more complicated but still practically important cubic solver? < 1597968993 816235 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1597969684 90109 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597970024 857471 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmf. Can't seem to convince Chrome to pass this client certificate to a server. It worked fine with `curl --cert cert.pem --key key.pem https://...`, and `openssl pkcs12 -export -out foo.p12 -in cert.pem -inkey key.pem -name foo` created a file that could be imported into Chrome, but it shows up on the list as "UNTRUSTED" (maybe normal), and Chrome doesn't show up any certificate picker when trying to < 1597970030 925705 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :connect. Chrome's internal netlog says ERR_BAD_SSL_CLIENT_AUTH_CERT, which (ssl_client_socket_impl.cc) seems to mean "certificate was requested, but had none to send". < 1597970033 888168 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a feeling maybe Chrome wants this to be signed by a CA that's in the trust store or something (it's self-signed). But who knows. The state of client certificate authentication is such a mess. < 1597970076 153957 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1597972818 987424 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597973118 769701 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597982343 869159 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597982435 780345 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597984135 982300 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597984188 900185 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1597984216 519130 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life > 1597984281 371447 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Stax14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76758&oldid=76748 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+338) 10 < 1597985886 947291 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1597987043 810708 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597987229 567617 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597987525 39094 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:eca9:1870:8b7c:ee18 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597987796 43277 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:eca9:1870:8b7c:ee18 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597989378 293826 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why did the designers of PNG include the prediction type bytes in the same stream as the picture data? Since they are two different data, that probably wouldn't cause it to be compressed as well as putting them separately, I think. < 1597989681 421125 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do they predict? < 1597989713 912127 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The value of the pixel < 1597989813 913566 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what sense would it make to put that at the end of the image? you know the values by then < 1597989937 709172 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, unless you require partial decoding. < 1597990823 808284 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597991871 151815 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any huffed format, if some values are known to be not meaningful in some positions, and when reading the bits all of the meaningful values have the same value for a bit, then it can skip encoding that bit, I think. < 1597991895 647585 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If it is designed for that; I don't know of any format that is, other than some that I have experimented with making) < 1597991933 188751 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :*.net *.split < 1597991933 974136 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc QUIT :*.net *.split < 1597991934 205965 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister QUIT :*.net *.split < 1597991934 832704 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley QUIT :*.net *.split < 1597991964 31845 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know if some does? < 1597992151 195882 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :A similar thing would also be possible with prediction, for example in picture compression depending on the colour space some values might be meaningless in some places, so the prediction can know that such a value will not occur. < 1597992225 783852 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597992225 887874 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1597992225 887911 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc JOIN :#esoteric < 1597992225 887918 :kmc!~beehive@unaffiliated/kmcallister JOIN :#esoteric < 1597992225 887925 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley JOIN :#esoteric < 1597992359 470575 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1597993083 799537 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597993109 844744 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597993284 19560 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597993483 858088 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597993613 567281 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric > 1597993633 666707 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Enterprise14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76759 5* 03Joaomilho 5* (+2522) 10Created page with "Enterprise defines itself as a "non-deterministic-unnecessarily-statically-typed Turing-complete-ish, [https://github.com/joaomilho/Enterprise/issues/41 Quantum-out-o..." < 1597993677 262265 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1597993736 957432 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Enterprise14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76760 5* 03Joaomilho 5* (+88) 10Created page with "For the Enterprise language, redirect [https://esolangs.org/wiki/Enterprise here]." > 1597993834 602137 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76761&oldid=76745 5* 03Joaomilho 5* (+20) 10 < 1597993887 878446 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597995137 780250 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:eca9:1870:8b7c:ee18 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597996223 84536 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :*.net *.split < 1597996223 229788 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :*.net *.split < 1597996383 813188 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597996798 877008 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597997345 582790 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1597997503 828169 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1597998048 417781 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1597998132 77119 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597998132 77193 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1597998284 227740 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:eca9:1870:8b7c:ee18 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597998394 472360 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1597998474 66758 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597998514 952617 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1597998591 957952 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.239.186 JOIN :#esoteric < 1597998747 571281 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.226.147.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1597999226 800544 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1597999323 789275 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598000141 907028 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? cattitude < 1598000144 655810 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :cattitude? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1598000344 218992 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`learn Cattitude is a combination of pride, entitlement, indifference, and cruelty that humans can never hope to achieve. < 1598000346 832429 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Learned 'cattitude': Cattitude is a combination of pride, entitlement, indifference, and cruelty that humans can never hope to achieve. < 1598001270 384528 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:eca9:1870:8b7c:ee18 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598002496 889204 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598002511 174942 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598004525 158974 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1598004560 75943 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598008803 842645 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598009258 833225 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: but it's not just a huffed stream, it's a deflated stream, and you need those prediction types as you decode the image data from top to bottom and the encoder figures them out as it encodes the image from top to bottom < 1598009304 227500 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: and as it's a deflated stream, not a huffed stream, compressing it together with the pixel data makes slightly more sense, and gives a simpler implementation < 1598009685 673945 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: PNG is an old format, so simple implementation was important so that you can decode a PNG on cheap old devices < 1598009854 622443 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: constrast this to JPEG, which does huffmanize DCT coefficients (with some species RLE cases for runs of zeroes). Traditionally JPEG encoded all coefficients together in the same huffmanized stream, which isn't too efficient. But they fixed that later with progressive JPEG. Almost all JPEG decoders, except a few cheap phones, can decode that now. Progressive JPEG splits coefficients to groups, < 1598009860 732472 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :each of which is encoded in its own huffmanized section, with possible separate encodings, which both reduces files size and gives better outputs for partially decided streams. < 1598009913 415308 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric > 1598010197 440071 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:TwilightSparkle14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76762 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+156) 10Created page with "created this page bc the user didn't had it -- ~~~~" > 1598010244 998481 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Jsfunc14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76763&oldid=72954 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+9) 10 > 1598010290 74930 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76764&oldid=76731 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (-22) 10 > 1598010302 62367 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76765&oldid=76764 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (+1) 10 < 1598011906 524701 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598012042 129217 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598012062 932767 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598013675 968665 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598013963 868285 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598014233 748825 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598017855 999305 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598018286 325159 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598020466 821936 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598021186 886411 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598021203 812805 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598021346 779707 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598021483 816751 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598025641 13215 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598026716 878091 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598027334 381434 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598027471 85155 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598027471 318062 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598028978 878499 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Yes, I know that. But my other question was not only about PNG. < 1598029171 81496 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Also, what I mentioned about meaningless values isn't applicable to PNG anyways; all pixel values are meaningful, unless you are for some reason using prediction filters for indexed colours, which isn't normally done.) < 1598029224 513585 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The prediction types themself do have meaningless values; one way they could do without complicate the decoder much is to ignore the high bits of the prediction type byte) < 1598029566 467950 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: prediction filters are useful for indexed colors, if your image has a lot of areas of solid color < 1598029574 698645 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, maybe not too much < 1598029584 898290 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :because deflate already compresses that well < 1598029590 401898 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they're not entirely useless < 1598029716 249197 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think other formats (e.g. Maki-chan, and YZIP picture libraries) that use prediction for indexed colours use XOR filters for prediction instead, though. < 1598029857 758917 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :YZIP picture format uses huffed RLE of the XOR filtered data. What algorithm for reordering the palette (including duplicates, if that would be helpful) would help to optimize this? < 1598031463 632416 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`" < 1598031465 522493 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/1:484) "Do a sea monster while whatever." \ 838) Conext coyou'll cotell come cothat coyou cocan't coprefix coeverything cowith co"co". pikhq: coof urse conot! < 1598031643 50980 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION is coproud of that < 1598031720 783311 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I draw the line at coconut and coworker jokes. < 1598031740 182097 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :ACTION shrugs < 1598031758 794579 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything beyond that is just abstract nonsense. < 1598031982 646846 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like abstract nonsense < 1598031993 706380 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :As my college studies can attest > 1598031996 896818 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76766&oldid=76244 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+146) 10/* Advanced techniques */ functions, to be continued < 1598032000 555679 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/8/20/21377305/postal-service-steve-bannon-arrest is interesting. And then there's that tweet they cite: "The Postal Service has police? That’s really pushing the envelope." < 1598032013 151417 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :no coconut jokes? coward. < 1598032019 106026 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? coconut < 1598032020 610291 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :coconut? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1598032049 594034 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: I described a closed set, not an open one. < 1598032067 797247 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`grWp coconut < 1598032069 765153 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1598032075 679233 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`" coconut < 1598032076 996570 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :1/0: < 1598032079 39315 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1598032085 50329 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`quote coconut < 1598032086 309863 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :No output. < 1598032099 330039 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does a double-co cancel out? < 1598032104 373618 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is a co-co-nut just a nut? < 1598032116 515768 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: that is the joke. < 1598032119 595331 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends < 1598032122 633242 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: alas < 1598032122 633315 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's funny because coconuts are not nuts. < 1598032132 918523 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :nor are peanuts, and yet < 1598032166 822996 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: Let's agree on "funny" then. < 1598032177 559875 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes < 1598032208 166760 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :An office worker moves items from the TODO pile to the DONE pile. A coworker... < 1598032221 398943 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :where are cocoons in that set? > 1598032233 394609 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76767&oldid=76766 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+114) 10/* Logic flow */ < 1598032242 62224 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess they're on < 1598032243 653182 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Outside, I think. < 1598032246 990433 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :*wince* < 1598032532 426475 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I want a truth in cookie related messages law. < 1598032535 945106 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :"We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website." < 1598032540 448854 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure you do. < 1598032573 987607 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch PRIVMSG #esoteric :"we use cookies because fuck you" < 1598032595 898525 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, that's how I read it. < 1598032810 862899 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://blog.apnic.net/2020/08/21/chromiums-impact-on-root-dns-traffic/ <-- At which point does this qualify as distributed denial of service? < 1598032987 498248 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.239.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi it seems there are no illustrated videos about mathematically defined spinors for people not too keen with maths < 1598033009 77179 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.239.186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that’s pretty bad as we have a general theory for a long time < 1598033010 571135 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Add message such as "Cookies and JavaScripts are not needed for this web page." and then add a link to a message to explain how to disable JavaScripts < 1598033012 130098 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@136.169.239.186 NICK :arseniiv < 1598033458 787644 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598033618 14122 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598033736 169977 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1598035897 582981 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1598035962 539414 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Psychairefatback (Archive)14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76768 5* 03Ashtons 5* (+679) 10Created page with "== Oof == I'm going to be honest, it kinda hurt a bit (in a good way) to see that someone actually liked my idea for an esoteric language and decided to archive it when past..." < 1598035975 231619 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598037175 405701 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Ashtons14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76769&oldid=68832 5* 03Ashtons 5* (+269) 10 < 1598038069 636465 :hakatashi1!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598038169 210938 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598038197 611080 :craigo_!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598038256 27179 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 269 seconds < 1598038269 549336 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598038346 1591 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598039652 853339 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598041715 574012 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76770&oldid=76767 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+96) 10/* Example programs */ > 1598042958 723228 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Surtic14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76771&oldid=76770 5* 03Digital Hunter 5* (+1298) 10/* Advanced techniques */ > 1598044597 764199 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Psychairefatback (Archive)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76772&oldid=76768 5* 03Ashtons 5* (-1) 10 < 1598046224 637191 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.8 < 1598046672 672009 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598049985 968533 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@136.169.239.186 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1598050100 736563 :MaryMagdalene!~Leeloo__@91.221.67.198 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598050107 488122 :MaryMagdalene!~Leeloo__@91.221.67.198 PART #esoteric :"Leaving" < 1598050111 996151 :MaryMagdalene!~Leeloo__@91.221.67.198 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598050117 539059 :MaryMagdalene!~Leeloo__@91.221.67.198 PART #esoteric :"Leaving" > 1598054429 603357 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stax14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76773&oldid=76747 5* 03Cameron 5* (+279) 10 > 1598054452 58460 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stax14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76774&oldid=76773 5* 03Cameron 5* (+3) 10 > 1598054478 913112 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stax14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76775&oldid=76774 5* 03Cameron 5* (-1) 10 > 1598054572 748751 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Stax14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76776&oldid=76775 5* 03Cameron 5* (+89) 10 > 1598054607 306836 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Cameron14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76777 5* 03Cameron 5* (+21) 10Created page with "Hello I am Cameron..." > 1598054788 228918 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Stax14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76778&oldid=76758 5* 03Cameron 5* (+440) 10 > 1598054817 497940 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Stax14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76779&oldid=76778 5* 03Cameron 5* (-48) 10 > 1598054957 465186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Stax14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76780&oldid=76779 5* 03Cameron 5* (+1008) 10/* Programs I've made with it */ < 1598055912 586232 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: It kinda seems like this is ISPs fault for breaking things in the first place < 1598055991 916248 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: they decided they were going to make requests return false information, and if the comments on that article are to be believed, made the situation worse by working around previous detection methods < 1598056048 592743 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: (said comment therefore implies that there were previous detection methods, therefore Chromium didn't just start doing this for no apparent reason) < 1598056233 55661 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598057044 347585 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1598057045 735147 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02User:TwilightSparkle10]]": userpage not created by the user it belongs to, with unusual talk-page-style content > 1598057177 667411 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete10 02 5* 03Ais523 5* 10deleted "[[02User:A/ttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttttt10]]": vandalism / intentionally useless page; also < 1598060055 612915 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598061005 41219 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bet14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76781 5* 03D 5* (+106) 10Created page with "[[Bet]] is a language that had ATaco's hopes up that a "Bet" language actually existed for a second there." > 1598061077 238952 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bet14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76782&oldid=76781 5* 03D 5* (+78) 10 > 1598061086 330557 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bet14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76783&oldid=76782 5* 03D 5* (+0) 10 > 1598061123 132883 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bet14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76784&oldid=76783 5* 03D 5* (+29) 10 > 1598061164 690231 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bet14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76785&oldid=76784 5* 03D 5* (+54) 10 > 1598061554 624835 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Bet14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76786&oldid=76785 5* 03D 5* (+156) 10 < 1598062335 300116 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598062387 863210 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598063326 345677 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jqadwdgmrpwtoxqe QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598063555 127780 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lzqgpomlkpgojizh JOIN :#esoteric < 1598063929 484813 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-lzqgpomlkpgojizh QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598064071 423576 :ProofTechnique!sid79547@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wnlthubrgqiqcpbk JOIN :#esoteric < 1598067221 894205 :craigo_!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1598067267 639913 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598070001 829358 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598070625 175633 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598070748 793605 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598072294 544816 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Does "Among Us" cause imposter syndrome? < 1598072294 834547 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: why should he have to? :) imagine if the imagination of the images moved to elmorex. i < 1598075853 446 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598076090 82586 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598077315 994924 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598082125 741532 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Ashtons14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76787&oldid=76769 5* 03Ashtons 5* (+52) 10 < 1598082187 225487 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1598082674 501259 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598083787 928338 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598083883 897027 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598085454 686269 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598087665 530162 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds > 1598089156 568660 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03HDWithZeroes 5* 10New user account < 1598089403 572289 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598089555 535327 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598089581 873924 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598090243 713183 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598090261 695896 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598090445 373715 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598091943 953688 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598092084 684047 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598092125 211737 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598094760 92858 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598095058 271885 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598095849 464656 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07List of ideas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76788&oldid=76594 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+27) 10/* Ideas for Names */ > 1598095930 998041 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07List of ideas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76789&oldid=76788 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+36) 10/* Ideas for Names */ > 1598096848 228890 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76790&oldid=76599 5* 03Orisphera 5* (-104) 10 > 1598097319 913687 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76791&oldid=76608 5* 03Razetime 5* (+2648) 10Added online interpreters for 1+ < 1598099757 305098 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598099833 780312 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598099853 953490 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598102557 862869 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598103581 300859 :Frater_EST!~adrianbib@172.242.0.73 PART :#esoteric > 1598104396 561910 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76792&oldid=76751 5* 03HDWithZeroes 5* (+245) 10 < 1598105092 892478 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598105518 398445 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric > 1598105886 743848 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* 10New user account < 1598108582 973964 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598110233 697203 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598113448 560296 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598113473 36110 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598113476 850184 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76793&oldid=76792 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+223) 10Hello World! > 1598113680 892788 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76794&oldid=76793 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+87) 10Forgot signature! > 1598113773 836081 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76795&oldid=76794 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Why am I so bad at this? > 1598113820 755959 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76796&oldid=76795 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10... > 1598113902 113986 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76797&oldid=76796 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1) 10Do not mind my business < 1598113943 814550 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598113955 608340 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598114025 388355 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598115459 654908 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1598116353 655315 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598118652 987208 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598118908 982341 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric > 1598119264 231145 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:HDWithZeroes14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76798 5* 03HDWithZeroes 5* (+27) 10Created page with " nice wiki you got there :D" > 1598119289 862066 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:HDWithZeroes14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76799&oldid=76798 5* 03HDWithZeroes 5* (-27) 10Blanked the page < 1598119974 222973 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds > 1598126269 374491 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:HDWithZeroes14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76800&oldid=76799 5* 03HDWithZeroes 5* (+179) 10 > 1598128988 203756 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*() +14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76801 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+3880) 10Created my first wiki page! > 1598129165 422724 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76802&oldid=76761 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+30) 10Added a language I have not made. > 1598129217 440368 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76803&oldid=76802 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1) 10The wiki did an error. > 1598131603 462997 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Pipe14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76804&oldid=65479 5* 03Redwolf10105 5* (-37) 10Removed interpreter link (no longer exists) < 1598132238 722729 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What can be good way of picture compression with indexed colours? I know of a few different things which have been done, including XOR, LZW, and RLE. < 1598132313 677454 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I usually just use PNG for that < 1598132320 593736 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you know how that works < 1598132394 434749 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it is DEFLATE. There might be better ways though; I don't know. < 1598132554 412384 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some formats support storing both a monochrome and colour version together, such as XPM format and Infocom's format (although XPM isn't compressed). Stippling is also supported in both formats, although I do not know of any implementation that does it other than my own (the reference implementation of XPM can probably decode stippling, but as far as I know it cannot encode stippling). < 1598132611 29104 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Infocom's YZIP picture library format uses huffed RLE with XOR, either the line above or the line above that. < 1598132672 306833 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Although the PC variant seems to be based on LZW instead. I don't know what bits in the header specify the variant and exactly how it is done, although there seems to be some.) < 1598133035 177986 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, I don't know if any format other than XPM supports symbolic colours in the way that XPM has, although I invented an extension to PNG to support it (the "xpMC" chunk). < 1598133164 574003 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :there exists good. Rifling through some old things I found a MIDI 1in/1out-to-USB cable which I presumed earlier didn’t work ever once and tried to test it once more (it should have been working at least on winXP without explicit installation but nope). I went to the manufacturer’s website and found not only this cable, discontinued long ago but having a neat archive page nonetheless, together with some its discontinued predecessors < 1598133164 720930 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric : and siccessors, but also there was a page with drivers and there was a driver for win7 (which I currently use) and it suddenly worked! like a charm! < 1598133196 28898 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :successors* < 1598133329 563672 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean, it didn’t have a CD with a driver, that was a feature it should just auto-install from whatever memory it does have on itself, and work. But that didn’t happen in my case, or maybe I was too dumb in 2007 < 1598133347 487287 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes I forgot to mention that it was bought and manufactured in 2007 < 1598133508 500282 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hopefully those folks are well-paid. For some reasons many companies don’t maintain their old product archive as well < 1598133545 931553 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: yeah. especially publishers once their books sold out. I hate it. < 1598133569 233572 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are three books for which I have a long errata list that I couldn't get the publishers host. < 1598133598 815791 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: hopefully that will see some improvement in the future < 1598133701 129687 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :that’s cool you compiled the errors in a list instead of just pencil-editing them at the corresponding pages or just plain forgetting about them. I don’t have such a good habit for example :( < 1598133759 342558 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: it's not such a good habit because I only published them for one and a half book, and didn't push hard enough on the publishers < 1598133795 263907 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :though I don’t have books in paper form which I’d consider gems, so maybe I would collect errata if I’d have one such < 1598133853 473876 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: at least you can publish them somewhere. This makes a small difference but < 1598133863 747771 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I only have two of those. the third one is K&R, which I don't have because I don't think I need it anymore, I only borrowed them from the library < 1598133863 982740 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm < 1598133884 40331 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :isn’t there a book errata project somewhere? < 1598133904 71058 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :dunno < 1598133918 463615 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe there's one on wikibooks or something < 1598133987 105874 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :if there was no more than a few of them that would be good as people would search these places easily, and updating them with their own finds would be also not hard < 1598134006 860057 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: yes < 1598134020 781860 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :someone should start such a project if it doesn't exist yet, good idea < 1598134050 201985 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :anyway collecting small book fixes is good. I don’t think books are on the level of current-day software issue trackers yet < 1598134054 961026 :BWBellairs!~bwbellair@hellomouse/dev/bwbellairs QUIT :Max SendQ exceeded < 1598134088 671980 :BWBellairs!~bwbellair@hellomouse/dev/bwbellairs JOIN :#esoteric < 1598139670 33355 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :For automatically making up a palette for a picture, in addition to specifying how many colours, and specifying some colours are fixed, also the possibility of hold and modify, extra half brite, interleaved colour mode, attribute zones, etc. < 1598141006 61333 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598141907 959206 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598141968 50567 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598141993 202773 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598142664 289164 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598143603 902214 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598143675 829564 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598144066 11545 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598144771 677685 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1598144788 947189 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598145017 378139 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598145094 677842 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is there a system function to create a file without creating a directory entry (in case the directory entry will be created later)? < 1598145216 654057 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: in latest Linuxen, yes < 1598145245 118727 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: O_TMPFILE < 1598145276 185153 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: a flag for open < 1598145289 749394 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :see man 2 open < 1598145573 368793 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe I am using a old version of Linux, I suppose < 1598145586 184634 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But, OK, thanks. < 1598145698 411334 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I believe you can detect that by trying to open with that flag and checking the error you get < 1598145707 188004 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and fall back to creating a named file and unlinking it < 1598145991 366685 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, and you could also use #ifdef to check if the system it is being compiled on supports it, I suppose. < 1598149519 941930 :ATMunn!ATMunn@gateway/shell/hellomouse/x-ueubxpvgkvmpluzr QUIT :Quit: lol rip < 1598149545 48120 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598149545 519955 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598149643 189089 :ATMunn!ATMunn@gateway/shell/hellomouse/x-ermwzlwfbhvtquah JOIN :#esoteric < 1598149919 52013 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN :#esoteric < 1598149928 989026 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid JOIN :#esoteric < 1598150430 343666 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598154558 249365 :izabera!izabera@unaffiliated/izabera PRIVMSG #esoteric :O_TMPFILE has been around since 2013 < 1598154738 36053 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598157143 76388 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598157240 621859 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598157240 768686 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598160273 24932 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598162616 792521 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598170207 951016 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598170343 894560 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598170785 560983 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gohxyujbnzttexch QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598170867 419844 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qwqyulpnfshhunht JOIN :#esoteric < 1598173373 49094 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1598174003 593472 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598174192 883602 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:eca9:1870:8b7c:ee18 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598174237 17072 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5585:94b0:5c1a:43b9 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598174990 66777 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*() +14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76805&oldid=76801 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+3) 10Minor grammatical error. > 1598175971 417834 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*() +14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76806&oldid=76805 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+9) 10Just learned that removing means dropping. < 1598176242 291975 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1598176673 307989 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* 10moved [[02!@$%^&*() +10]] to [[!@$%^&*()+]]: There is an annoying space in the title. > 1598176775 789800 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76809&oldid=76803 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-1) 10Who is removing the hash? < 1598180803 785269 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598182407 7397 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03SLiV 5* 10New user account > 1598183165 107806 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76810&oldid=76797 5* 03SLiV 5* (+174) 10/* Introductions */ Added my introduction. < 1598183307 176951 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Many months ago during a conversation about Unicode I found a page where someone proposed a mechanism to extend UTF-8, UTF-16 and UTF-32 indefinitely. I thought I posted the link here but I didn't and now I've lost it < 1598183419 647866 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://ucsx.org <-- found it < 1598184139 873328 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :You might as well go back to ascii and assume that any combination of characters encodes a code point. > 1598184277 604695 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07List of ideas14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76811&oldid=76789 5* 03447xpro 5* (+67) 10/* Looks Like */ < 1598184427 887962 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5585:94b0:5c1a:43b9 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598184695 823191 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598185755 513174 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598186455 550932 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5585:94b0:5c1a:43b9 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598187431 160386 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76812&oldid=76807 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+145) 10Added a new program. > 1598187479 479301 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76813&oldid=76812 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Oh, there is a hyphen in 'Truth-machine' < 1598187593 611025 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598187622 980917 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598187706 125422 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Masldobehere 5* 10New user account < 1598187904 501321 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598187924 912993 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric > 1598188045 208982 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76814&oldid=76810 5* 03Masldobehere 5* (+270) 10Added meh > 1598188056 638197 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76815&oldid=76813 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+166) 10Another program! > 1598189150 603814 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76816&oldid=76815 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+438) 10And another program. < 1598191012 781239 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598191091 843327 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Quit: reboot > 1598191157 331343 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76817&oldid=76484 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+103) 10Added a probably lesser known language. > 1598191286 986422 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07STBF14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76818 5* 03Masldobehere 5* (+6282) 10made page lel > 1598191446 224716 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76819&oldid=76816 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-320) 10Ah, the code looks much better! > 1598191546 901785 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Masldobehere14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76820 5* 03Masldobehere 5* (+380) 10Created page with "Idk Hi there! I am Marcel! (Some random person that's interested in programming and Computer Science!) I made [https://esolangs.org/wiki/STBF STBF] (a compiler/translator..." > 1598191700 300993 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76821&oldid=76819 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+74) 10Added another program (this language is rather fun! :D) > 1598191794 258440 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76822&oldid=76821 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-46) 10I guess the users will figure out what I want > 1598192011 894415 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76823&oldid=76822 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Decapitalization part 1 > 1598192041 917477 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76824&oldid=76823 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Decapitalization part 2 > 1598192686 464147 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Pizza Delivery14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76825&oldid=60049 5* 03LegionMammal978 5* (+167) 10added interpreter link and categories < 1598194449 41873 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598194528 983757 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5585:94b0:5c1a:43b9 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598194739 460918 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5585:94b0:5c1a:43b9 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598195100 355388 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76826&oldid=76824 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+81) 10Another snippet < 1598198710 861583 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598199227 796633 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598200459 487603 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598200526 87405 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598200543 324290 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598200659 535251 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598200826 986296 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598200879 847375 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598200915 982960 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598201660 67247 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598202113 186229 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598202852 481980 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598204248 206464 :TheLie!~TheLie@2a02:8106:215:3300:844d:dece:9bd4:fbb2 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598204698 489357 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :UTF-G-8 is just standard UTF-8, although extending beyond the Unicode range. The man page for utf8 on my computer says that ISO 10646 uses 31-bit codes, and "UTF-8 encoded UCS characters may be up to six bytes long, however the Unicode standard specifies no characters above 0x10ffff, so Unicode characters can only be up to four bytes long in UTF-8." < 1598204803 375011 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :But now they can extend it more. < 1598205102 901361 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1598205326 989168 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598206415 682090 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, now, if you want UTF-8 only up to 0x10FFFF then it can be called UTF-M-8, and if you want up to 0x7FFFFFFF then it can be called UTF-G-8, so that it can be distinguished. < 1598206702 149662 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598208581 182863 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1598208619 904957 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598210880 407080 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: excuse me for a second. *turns to UTF-16* "This was your fault, UTF-16! YOU DID THIS!" *turns back to zzo38* everything's ok now. < 1598211231 25685 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :overemphasis on UTF-16 over UTF-8 has been breaking C programs for decades, and UTF-16 never had any benefits over UTF-8 < 1598211557 659386 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell, technically "UTF-G-8" is actually just UTF-8 as originally specced... < 1598211612 334367 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :not even extending, really - it was always that extended and was later reduced < 1598211752 901506 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that is what UTF-G-8 is. UTF-G-8 limited to Unicode is UTF-M-8. < 1598212899 233219 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598213995 966725 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598214313 214781 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76827&oldid=76826 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+278) 10I realized that these examples can be spoilers. (And I add ANOTHER program) > 1598214928 539124 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Osmarks/!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76828&oldid=76457 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+41) 10 < 1598215578 938842 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have started to implement UTF-G-8 in Enhanced GlkTerm. Glk works with 32-bit characters, so it is actually part of UTF-E-8 too. < 1598215840 44461 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The version of GlkTerm that the code was taken from already implements a superset of UTF-M-8, although only up to four byte characters.) > 1598216159 243812 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76829&oldid=75432 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (-1575) 10 < 1598216674 326578 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1598216886 17809 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:!lyriclydemoteestablishcommunism!14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76830&oldid=76236 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+137) 10 < 1598218384 951533 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: ... < 1598218986 749362 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598219533 661183 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598220350 965921 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1598220382 321570 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598223605 217203 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598223726 603997 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598224353 871517 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598224441 638673 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1598224513 4726 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598226306 955275 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598235246 319604 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: ... < 1598236243 881081 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598237326 326083 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: ... < 1598237372 935630 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover QUIT :Quit: rebooting < 1598237441 645026 :FreeFull!~freefull@defocus/sausage-lover JOIN :#esoteric < 1598239449 207631 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598240412 224167 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Quit: Lost terminal < 1598240749 961007 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598240767 927533 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598241056 311174 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598243000 991198 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598243696 56580 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598243696 305479 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598243775 847358 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598244316 615239 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598248024 99577 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598248137 944726 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598248227 891677 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Client Quit < 1598248240 32774 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598248836 200871 :ais523!~ais523@unaffiliated/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit < 1598248861 869705 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598251865 192587 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598253346 556466 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.7.2+deb3 - https://znc.in < 1598253378 923892 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598254289 575105 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598254362 224815 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598254754 381644 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN :#esoteric < 1598255977 992319 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1598256008 901865 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598256645 244192 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598256743 857813 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598257515 260779 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-168.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598259662 234885 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598261162 175497 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1598261184 435107 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good morning < 1598261212 114782 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^8ball is it a good morning? < 1598261212 234291 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1598261223 724452 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :My mistake. < 1598261252 608572 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't decide whether I'm lucky or unlucky here :P < 1598261324 183745 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :o/ morning! < 1598261364 367199 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :How do you pronounce "o/"? < 1598261373 575635 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^8ball is it a o/ morning? < 1598261373 695115 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1598261376 867499 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^8ball is it an o/ morning? < 1598261376 984894 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1598261383 554422 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah it doesn't matter. Phew :) < 1598261435 969481 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Can you dance for us? < 1598261436 209352 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: you didn't have to insert ( values x) and ( b) > 1598263016 64239 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76831&oldid=76827 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-1) 10Golfed the truth-machine a bit. > 1598263620 936641 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76832&oldid=76307 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+44) 10New language! < 1598264144 426015 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds > 1598264897 198189 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76833&oldid=76831 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+4) 10br tag! < 1598266091 799855 :Soni!~quassel@unaffiliated/soniex2 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598266465 559579 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598266641 670489 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76834&oldid=76833 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+22) 10Added some links. < 1598267541 901697 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :The use of the word "infinite" in phrases like "infinite loop" and "infinite list" seems a bit... uninformative. These are definitely on the "potentially infinite" side of things, not the "completed infinity" side of things. How about "ω-loop", "ω-list", how d'you like those. < 1598267581 13593 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :what do you mean by completed infinity < 1598267746 733306 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I mean what is conventionally meant by the phrase when mathematicians use it conventionally < 1598267801 285847 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never heard that phrase < 1598267860 85425 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikipedia's article on it is called "Actual infinity", which might be the more common phrase, but I've heard both < 1598267947 944209 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that page explicitly names natural numbers. and an infinite list is pretty easily injectively mappable onto those < 1598268007 273096 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :One can certainly regard the naturals as potentially infinite, can't one? < 1598268051 918095 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't get what point this definition is trying to make. are countable infinities "actual" or not? if so, why not when N is? < 1598268297 161330 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess if one talks about "countable infinities", presumably versus "uncountable infinities", one has, like Cantor, already concluded they're "actual". < 1598268308 178107 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it should be called a non-terminating loop < 1598268313 898431 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is not infinite, but it does not stop < 1598268324 491864 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :(actually it will stop, but only in practice not in theory) < 1598268514 774629 :FireFly!znc@freenode/staff/firefly PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess "infinite loop" is a bit of a misnomer... < 1598268761 166405 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't really see how "infinite list" would still be acceptable terminology if "infinite loop" isn't, though. The list is not infinite, it just does not end. < 1598268868 321998 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or the other way around, you could easily have an infinite list of successive configurations of an executing Turing machine; if that list is "really infinite" then the loop that the TM is in is "really infinite" too. > 1598268925 993520 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:OsmineYT14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76835&oldid=76765 5* 03OsmineYT 5* (-22) 10 > 1598268988 344011 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03OsmineYT 5* 10moved [[02User:OsmineYT10]] to [[User:Osminee]]: "Changed" nickname > 1598268988 418577 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03OsmineYT 5* 10moved [[02User talk:OsmineYT10]] to [[User talk:Osminee]]: "Changed" nickname > 1598269136 298520 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move_redir10 02 5* 03OsmineYT 5* 10moved [[02User:Osminee10]] to [[User:OsmineYT]] over redirect: Undid previous move operation > 1598269136 452684 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move_redir10 02 5* 03OsmineYT 5* 10moved [[02User talk:Osminee10]] to [[User talk:OsmineYT]] over redirect: Undid previous move operation > 1598269136 460974 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete_redir10 02 5* 03OsmineYT 5* 10OsmineYT deleted redirect [[02User:OsmineYT10]] by overwriting: Deleted to make way for move from "[[User:Osminee]]" > 1598269136 467021 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/delete14]]4 delete_redir10 02 5* 03OsmineYT 5* 10OsmineYT deleted redirect [[02User talk:OsmineYT10]] by overwriting: Deleted to make way for move from "[[User talk:Osminee]]" > 1598270292 654396 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76844&oldid=76834 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-20) 10/* Syntax */ This is confusing. < 1598270317 999779 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-200-146.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: Lunch. > 1598270672 251623 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76845&oldid=76844 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+1) 10/* Hello world */ > 1598270858 728286 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76846&oldid=76845 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+26) 10/* Syntax */ < 1598271830 666595 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598272999 795190 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598273014 948320 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric > 1598273032 560943 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76847&oldid=76846 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+65) 10A note > 1598273050 845842 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76848&oldid=76847 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1) 10. > 1598273476 492742 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76849&oldid=76848 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-23) 10/* Even or odd */ Golfed < 1598274282 980898 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-248-90.host.pobb.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598275801 269400 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76850&oldid=76849 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-10) 10/* Even or odd */ Forgot... > 1598276131 277251 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76851&oldid=76850 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-4) 10/* Snippets */ Improved < 1598277116 664068 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24257630 ppcg's collaborative polyglot of 200+ langs got posted to hn > 1598277424 659035 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Masldobehere14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76852&oldid=76820 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-29) 10 > 1598277522 134121 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76853&oldid=76851 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-8) 10Replaced a snippet with a better variant (Thanks, TwilightSparkle) < 1598277899 775118 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598277982 906661 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds > 1598278128 346233 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76854&oldid=76853 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+169) 10/* LOLOL */ < 1598279391 230760 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598279760 33426 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76855&oldid=76854 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-43) 10/* Snippets */ > 1598279815 518207 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76856&oldid=76855 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-5) 10/* Even or odd */ < 1598280376 472172 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 2.8 < 1598280434 985480 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-248-90.host.pobb.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598280762 899452 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-248-90.host.pobb.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598280949 57171 :Melvar!~melvar@dslc-082-082-054-030.pools.arcor-ip.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598281687 677733 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598281931 947599 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid JOIN :#esoteric > 1598282054 504802 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76857&oldid=76856 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-6) 10The not gate can be shorter! > 1598282507 722280 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76858&oldid=76857 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-1) 10Golfed the parity program a tiny bit more. < 1598282546 164021 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282547 397207 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598282562 718681 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ehalaboapnkcudvc QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282562 868905 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gnkvprqbfbnxuykp QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282562 985974 :^[_!sid43445@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ryhptfjhruxocndj QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282563 101354 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282563 357701 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282563 460653 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-aduggknuxskguxam QUIT :*.net *.split < 1598282564 910258 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cpmpjjwutfkmyahj QUIT :*.net *.split > 1598282625 836507 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76859&oldid=76858 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+57) 10Clarification > 1598282686 710375 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76860&oldid=76859 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-1) 10Tiny mistake! :P < 1598283135 413799 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283237 321853 :tswett[m]!tswettmatr@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-ehalaboapnkcudvc JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283237 321911 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gnkvprqbfbnxuykp JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283237 321923 :^[_!sid43445@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ryhptfjhruxocndj JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283237 322055 :ski!~ski@remote11.chalmers.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283250 499296 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283250 499354 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-aduggknuxskguxam JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283250 499361 :dnm!sid401311@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-cpmpjjwutfkmyahj JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283405 233729 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598283590 860153 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598285001 563601 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-248-90.host.pobb.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598285997 551133 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598286020 725695 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598287006 577669 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598287065 257744 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598287181 15273 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598287862 236272 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598288515 328394 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck code generation14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76861&oldid=67106 5* 03Masldobehere 5* (+40) 10added STBF to Languages that compile to BF < 1598289689 497926 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598290540 909727 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598290605 845403 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598290967 938511 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598291164 365643 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598291188 884391 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe QUIT :Quit: Hugs~ <3 < 1598291396 650271 :Lymia!lymia@magical.girl.lyrical.lymia.moe JOIN :#esoteric > 1598292590 179999 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* 10New user account > 1598292757 207763 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76862&oldid=76814 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+274) 10 < 1598292930 540108 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`olist 1212 < 1598292932 565776 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :olist https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1212.html: shachaf oerjan Sgeo FireFly boily nortti b_jonas > 1598293241 261956 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brotlipython14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76863&oldid=76524 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+21) 10add .py.br extension < 1598295245 801826 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598295343 886256 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598295761 428935 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Joke language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76864&oldid=75835 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+69) 10 < 1598295932 699335 :kritixil1!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1598296034 264689 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover JOIN :#esoteric < 1598296070 353436 :Phantom_Hoover!~phantomho@unaffiliated/phantom-hoover QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1598296156 835309 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76865 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+568) 10Created page with "'''DirectBrainFUCK''' is a BF like programming language, but you can directly move the pointer.
However, the number of cells has to be limited to either 64 or (if some int..." > 1598296182 411849 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76866&oldid=76865 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+12) 10 > 1598296422 925587 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76867&oldid=76866 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (-41) 10 > 1598296508 663824 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76868&oldid=76867 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+7) 10 > 1598296546 18978 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76869&oldid=76868 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+3) 10 > 1598296633 883034 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76870&oldid=76869 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+28) 10 > 1598296732 507442 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76871&oldid=76870 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+0) 10 > 1598296741 903167 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76872&oldid=76871 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+0) 10 > 1598296749 272455 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76873&oldid=76872 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+1) 10 > 1598296841 369213 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76874&oldid=76873 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+27) 10 > 1598296863 915639 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07DirectBrainFUCK14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76875&oldid=76874 5* 03Zdrmonster1 5* (+8) 10 < 1598297822 919692 :rain1!~rain1@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1598297846 640367 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598299935 275620 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1598301274 160074 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? amount < 1598301275 786945 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :amount? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1598301293 66369 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was wondering if that's some variant of mount and umount < 1598301314 385132 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it sounds like a syscall name that does something related to mount points < 1598301843 937595 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :the famous WinAPI functions MountA and MountW from kernel32.dll < 1598301949 2555 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also GetMountainRangeEnumeratorEx^W^W^W < 1598303037 37584 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think those functions exist, not because MountA and MountW don't fit Windows naming style, < 1598303045 819927 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :but because such a function would be too simple for Windows < 1598303084 470774 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at the difference between the Windows memory-mapping API versus the Unix memory-mapping API to understand what I mean by that < 1598303711 975539 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :t20kdc: they don't fit current naming conventions, but some very old functions in winapi have bad names inherited from windows 16 api, the worst offenders being graphics primitives like Arc, Chord, Ellipse, Escape, Pie, Polygon, Rectangle: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/wingdi/ < 1598303753 306331 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: to be clear, MountA/MountW do fit the naming conventions I've seen so far < 1598303802 541892 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :they've narrowly avoided having a function called "Bar", that was actually used in some very old graphics libraries for I think filled rectangles < 1598303864 576647 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's also Beep https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/api/utilapiset/nf-utilapiset-beep < 1598304015 631016 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :all of this stuff feels relatively mundane in comparison to CreateFileMappingA, which doesn't actually memory-map a file, it merely creates an intermediate, useless object < 1598304091 744714 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and on linux, the shutdown system call doesn't shut down the computer or has anything to do with that, to shut down the computer the final step is the reboot system call < 1598304157 434663 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be clear: CreateFileMappingA isn't useless in that it isn't a part of mapping a file - it is, in fact a mandatory one < 1598304203 473921 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric : shutdown is also not useless < 1598304210 217436 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :the useless part is that it basically involves repeating the information you then have to give - with the file mapping object - to MapViewOfFile < 1598304237 518396 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :i.e. the mmap-equivalent is a 2-step process which involves CreateFileMappingA, then MapViewOfFile < 1598304260 759213 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, shutdown(2) and shutdown(8) are unrelated < 1598304344 843615 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :as for shutdown... I wonder if the reason Windows adopted the BSD sockets API was because it was sufficiently over-complicated < 1598304376 141959 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and at one point I mentioned that on linux, you open and possibly create a file with the open syscall, the creat syscall also does that but it's obsolete and should never be used; on windows you open and possibly create a file with the CreateFile syscall or its variants, the OpenFile syscall also used to do that but it's obsolete and should never be used. < 1598304582 840610 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...ah, yes, I can tell that OpenFile should never be used, because it's actually a relatively simple function (but has some name length issues) < 1598304674 19190 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :looks at CreateFile and I can tell that this is Microsoft-recommended because it has... way too many parameters (though see CreateFile2 which has less of them, but is also Windows 8+) < 1598306308 993168 :LKoen_!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1598306439 565907 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598307856 747726 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :t20kdc: hehe a neat heuristic < 1598307895 956577 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wouldn’t know, I mostly saw WinAPI function names a while ago and rarely < 1598307916 926072 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I occasionally have to interact with the Windows API when porting stuff < 1598307946 99109 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :in practice, accounting for the things SDL2 successfully paves over, there are two APIs that one has to deal with: Not-Windows and Windows < 1598308834 179829 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598310036 594156 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598310070 385849 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598310096 972609 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598310266 366402 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can use #ifdef if needed, as well as making your own compatibility layers, or writing for Windows and using Wine to run it on Linux, or writing for Linux and using WSL to run it on Windows, or using a kind of VM code, are some possibilities. Which is suitable depends on the program being written, I think. < 1598310518 820858 :LKoen_!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1598312538 524129 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does any version of SDL have a environment variable for auto zoom? < 1598312706 189156 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :The list of environment variables for SDL 1.2.15 doesn't mention any such thing < 1598313466 497921 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598314819 846508 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38, do you have any thoughts about the Gemini protocol? (I feel like someone asked you that before, but I only learned of Gemini today, because of a mention of a client being written in Racket) < 1598314945 940295 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1598315127 18907 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm https://gemini.circumlunar.space/clients.html looks more styled than is possible for a text/gemini document < 1598315138 829060 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Text other than the link on the same line as the link) < 1598316140 192551 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I think I'd prefer if the MIME type and whether it's likely to initiate a query was part of a URL < 1598316179 503738 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :GemiNaut seems to try to guess that say, a link is to an image, but it has to be a guess (unless it's prefetching which it shouldn't be) < 1598316766 228026 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: I did try it on the ssh. One thing that I think of Gemini is that there should be a unencrypted version, perhaps "pgemini://" (the default can be encrypted; that is fine). < 1598316786 56123 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you prefer the type and if it initiates a query to be a part of the URL, there is Gopher, which does that. < 1598316997 250275 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-143.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598317219 932774 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although maybe there could be an optional specification in the URL to indicate that; if the specification is wrong, then the client displays an error message. < 1598319013 30693 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598320628 616857 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Connerylang 5* 10New user account > 1598320853 933106 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76876&oldid=76862 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+185) 10 > 1598322278 272178 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Connery14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76877 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+1745) 10Created Connery page > 1598322467 541220 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76878&oldid=76809 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+14) 10Added Connery > 1598322664 828646 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Connery14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76879&oldid=76877 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+334) 10 > 1598322882 221989 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76880&oldid=76860 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+198) 10/* Syntax */ > 1598322893 633070 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76881&oldid=76880 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-23) 10/* Undocumented instructions */ > 1598323173 808435 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76882&oldid=76881 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+58) 10Author is not unknown at all... > 1598323233 498408 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Connery14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76883&oldid=76879 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+300) 10Added infobox < 1598323263 548680 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Quit: Leaving > 1598323375 207892 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Connery14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76884&oldid=76883 5* 03Connerylang 5* (-68) 10removed cell based because I'm not sure it fits > 1598323577 176188 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07ArnoldC14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76885&oldid=72913 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+25) 10Added Connery influence > 1598323966 39272 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Connery14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76886&oldid=76884 5* 03Connerylang 5* (+7) 10fixed typo < 1598324559 458582 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net NICK :Arcorann < 1598330184 839176 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598330247 480802 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598330264 913755 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598330302 64128 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598331856 530923 :adu_!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598331881 39374 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1598331881 159128 :adu_!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net NICK :adu < 1598334242 499482 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598337340 836724 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turinf machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76887&oldid=76475 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+117) 10 > 1598337387 224939 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Turinf machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76888&oldid=76887 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+20) 10 < 1598338100 603501 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598338997 753230 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Halticopter14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76889 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+3575) 10+[[Halticopter]] > 1598339001 518304 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76890&oldid=76878 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+18) 10+[[Halticopter]] > 1598339004 722659 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Hakerh40014]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76891&oldid=76340 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+18) 10+[[Halticopter]] < 1598339217 165757 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598340891 683842 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :@dice 3d6 < 1598340891 828656 :lambdabot!~lambdabot@haskell/bot/lambdabot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: 5+1+5 => 11 > 1598341098 931187 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76892&oldid=76882 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+88) 10Inserted important fact. < 1598341268 756637 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^8ball will it finish? < 1598341268 900650 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1598341278 26464 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :^8ball will it finish in time? < 1598341278 147621 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. < 1598341298 487696 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't believe it. < 1598341352 891461 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What are you trying to finish in time? > 1598341408 256218 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76893&oldid=76892 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+3) 10Commenting is actually very easy! < 1598341434 244939 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: working on something for http://www.research.ibm.com/haifa/ponderthis/challenges/August2020.html < 1598341554 597372 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(The small size, 0 <= a,b,c <= 10, but I think it's still too computationally expensive. And I see no way to prove interesting lower bounds except by brute force.) > 1598341701 812699 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76894&oldid=76893 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-11) 10If the question mark is defined, this might spark some confusion. < 1598342879 837072 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1598343051 990413 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598343108 39581 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598343123 819323 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598344551 821083 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598345792 13684 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric > 1598346080 522598 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:!@$%^&*()+14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76895 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+332) 10Created page with "== A seperate algorithm page? == To keep things cleaner, the main page should only contain the specs and a seperate algorithms page should be created similar to 1+/Snippets..." < 1598346158 642578 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :On the subject of potential infinity w.r.t. computer programs, it occurs to me that one could make a good argument that the most appropriate language in which to make statements like "this program will never stop" or "calling tail() on this list will always return another list", is temporal logic. < 1598346472 112792 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or perhaps even "Given a potentially infinite list L of potentially infinite lists of digits, the potentially infinite list of digits formed by taking the diagonal and inverting it will never appear in L". < 1598347295 51050 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you're seeing a connection between kripke frames and coinduction, I suppose. < 1598347395 762353 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :But meh, my modal logic knowledge is very weak. < 1598347462 683458 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay, so what was the esocrypt channel about? < 1598347551 711304 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmmm cryptozoology? < 1598347573 279965 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(In case it isn't obvious: I don't know.) < 1598347752 569091 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Kripkezoology < 1598348165 502249 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's nice that we can imagine programs that run infinitely long < 1598348496 629027 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how so? isn't it pretty obvious that this is possible? < 1598348561 81928 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: We can dream. < 1598348575 629264 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also we do like the idea of eternity. < 1598348581 155880 :cpressey1!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598348587 778938 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :We like it so much that we've built religions around the very concept. < 1598348695 969928 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-203-228.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598348795 695996 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: but it's pretty obvious that it's *not* possible ;) < 1598349101 908951 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598349104 847492 :cpressey1!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net NICK :cpressey < 1598349120 388230 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :we cant make algorithms that do it but we can mathematically analyse them < 1598349443 672666 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: why not? i mean, yeah, technically we are limited by the end of the universe, but is that really a difference? < 1598349487 72535 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: I think it is. < 1598349497 557912 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And for most purposes it's much sooner. < 1598349516 356905 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't expect my laptop to last until the end of the universe, that's for sure < 1598349539 702619 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :it could, though < 1598349565 336899 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and even if not, you could transfer the computation to another laptop, if you design your system around that < 1598349618 285502 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next power outage, next RAM failure, next computer upgrade, year 2036, year 2038, everybody who cared is dead, including extinction of all humans (probably long before Earth cools down and becomes uninhabitable)... < 1598349634 183498 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :like the natural numbers, i think algorithms are all about finiteness < 1598349654 76411 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :how are natural numbers about finiteness? < 1598349655 172244 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but they are infinite in some way too < 1598349660 177064 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :induction for example < 1598349661 33172 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :All these things will happen long before a gnab gib (if there is one, which I think is currently the favored theory) < 1598349684 853949 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: every natural number is finite < 1598349698 339430 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but the set of all of them is not < 1598349710 576084 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or so we like to think because non-standard models are hard to grasp. > 1598349716 481833 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76896&oldid=76895 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+244) 10Yes < 1598349764 103470 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: But you're making a leap of faith when you say that you can collect natural numbers like Pokemon. < 1598349782 453935 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :What I'm talking about has nothing to do with physical limitations; it's far more to do with whether you can say things like "the set of all of the natural numbers" sensibly. That there is a completed infinity. < 1598349793 649166 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm happy to allow that but we're leaving the physical realm when we do so. < 1598349842 627495 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598349870 677076 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's all imagination. A different society could label all mathematicians as clinically insane; I don't see an objective argument against that :P < 1598349905 646496 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The closest to an objective argument against that that I've seen is that mathematics is "unreasonably effective", i.e. just amazingly useful < 1598349917 916971 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just so really good at figuring out how many apples you owe Jane < 1598349925 690250 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :And suchlike < 1598349975 201960 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, it's somehow useful, which indeed explains why mathematics is tolerated (but not exactly respected) by society. < 1598350227 956039 :cpressey1!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598350407 887949 :cpressey1!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: I know a tiny bit about temporal logics, and other modal logics. I recently learned there is a modal logic (called S4 I think?) that corresponds *exactly* with the general definition of topology. Which is pretty neat. < 1598350416 158611 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-250-141.host.pobb.as13285.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598350452 431632 :cpressey1!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :But modal logics do seem a little less attractive somehow, than classical logic, to me. < 1598350469 549869 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598350474 517332 :cpressey1!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net NICK :cpressey < 1598350516 629452 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-aduggknuxskguxam QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598350549 978811 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles JOIN :#esoteric > 1598350574 559852 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76897 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+239) 10Created page with "This page provides common code snippets for easy [[!@$%25^%26*()%2B|!@#$%^&*()_+]] programming, inspired by [[Brainfuck algorithms]]. == Comment == xx_+()+ == Decrement ==..." > 1598350613 393246 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76898&oldid=76897 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+22) 10/* Comment */ < 1598350650 482953 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dhcjquwfwkpxzkce JOIN :#esoteric < 1598350992 407377 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anyway it's not that I philosophically *reject* completed infinity -- as a formalist I can't, and wouldn't want to, stop anyone from writing theorems about exotic cardinalities, it's just that I'm not entirely convinced that they mean anything. More to the point, I don't seem to find a use for completed infinity in any of my interests. I think I could get by happily with only potential infinity at my < 1598350994 551511 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :disposal. < 1598351039 13785 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(And if I could somehow define potential infinity using temporal logic, all the better. But that's largely aesthetics.) < 1598351064 21620 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :(OK, arguably this is mostly aesthetics, but whatever.) > 1598351977 397826 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76899&oldid=76894 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-544) 10Provided path to algorithms page. < 1598352524 529362 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric > 1598353589 610154 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76900&oldid=76898 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+837) 10 > 1598353707 785166 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76901&oldid=76900 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+4) 10 < 1598353942 65468 :sprucewood!94fbea04@static.4.234.251.148.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1598353978 839737 :sprucewood!94fbea04@static.4.234.251.148.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1598354092 767663 :sprucewood!94fbea04@static.4.234.251.148.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Client Quit > 1598354566 88581 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76902 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+213) 10Created page with "== Too Trivial == The multiplication thing looks 2trivial4me. Almost all stack-based language have this... ~~~~" > 1598354638 618355 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76903&oldid=76901 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-183) 10/* Subtraction */ Algorithms page are not for these stuff > 1598354658 973754 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76904&oldid=76903 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-157) 10/* Multiplication */ > 1598354734 269007 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76905&oldid=76899 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-5) 10 > 1598354743 346263 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76906&oldid=76905 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-10) 10/* See Also */ > 1598354969 377330 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76907&oldid=76904 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-72) 10Alright... > 1598355236 766981 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+/Algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76908&oldid=76907 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-55) 10/* Push zero */ "Push zero" sounds clear enough for me. Also what is "to be used for later"? < 1598355581 51416 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598356822 903794 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598359507 793426 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1598359533 28953 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598359565 172986 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598359652 917744 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric > 1598359685 264968 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76909&oldid=76906 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10I am clearly embarrassed about this mistake < 1598359820 58838 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598359836 985823 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598360869 585067 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598361977 504899 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07!@$%^&*()+14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76910&oldid=76909 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10... < 1598362420 573576 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598362459 736681 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN :#esoteric < 1598362675 162284 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598364619 921215 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598364678 847374 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598364705 596358 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598372064 580860 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed < 1598372907 589257 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598373532 781200 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598373583 664629 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-65-251-31.host.pobb.as13285.net QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598373586 6369 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598374365 597300 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:5585:94b0:5c1a:43b9 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598375701 963211 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598376879 428868 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598377255 37772 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-72.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598379121 777475 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598379373 824497 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598379386 977874 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598381843 660529 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598382956 694000 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598385943 726983 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving > 1598386055 300438 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:99 bottles of beer14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76911 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+388) 10Can we? < 1598386157 851556 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1598386276 922202 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:99 bottles of beer14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76912&oldid=76911 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-5) 10Grammar Fix < 1598386642 777498 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598387716 505780 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598388303 548507 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598389363 629031 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598389495 177364 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598389495 470343 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598390287 18413 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598391775 629421 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598392073 557178 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b4c0:ab43:9ea8:5777 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598392484 490202 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598393961 979937 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598394044 689601 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598394502 777781 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598394807 785786 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598395858 465656 :Frater_EST!adrianbibl@172.242.0.73 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598396038 176782 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598396069 907971 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598396094 654527 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598400653 305381 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: how many CPU-hours are there in a day? < 1598400653 548384 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: to fnord you notes online so i can part channels with :wq :) < 1598400688 712085 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: Is the universe just a large computing system? < 1598400688 919456 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: riastradh also owns the upstairs apartment, so i could put the cable in car and when list in cdr of a 3 element list? < 1598400704 125257 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That last part. Cute. I don't think the context it long enough to connect 'part' with ':wq' though :) < 1598400787 203015 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :The universe isn't very central. < 1598400788 268260 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It was, in fact, a literal quote from #scheme from May 2005. < 1598400796 902237 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, it learns nicks. Wow. > 1598400806 614722 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:RocketRace14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76913&oldid=76492 5* 03RocketRace 5* (-7) 10E < 1598400810 684110 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : Bodger: I can part channels with :wq :-) < 1598400817 436549 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1598400834 604932 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's kind of sad. < 1598400851 811562 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I liked it better when I thought it was fungot's invention.) < 1598400851 934296 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: i'm mainly thinking of downward continuations. < 1598400870 734440 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fungot: That way leads straight into hell. < 1598400870 856425 :fungot!~fungot@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/fungot PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: uh... okay. thanks, krystof.) < 1598400883 7274 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, more nicks. < 1598400887 100796 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. I was kind of expecting it to be a #esoteric quote rather than a #scheme quote, because it feels like people on this channel would be more likely to do that. < 1598400903 483509 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo typical? < 1598400919 281378 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598400962 928553 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I stripped out "[:;,]" at the beginning of each line, but it still learns nicks if they're mentioned often enough in a context other than that. < 1598401046 552570 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So we should be talking less about Riastradh and Krystof? :-P < 1598401076 271057 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, it's too late *now*. < 1598401077 352698 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :As said, ... < 1598401100 223411 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assumed it was too late, otherwise I'd have ^O-protected those. < 1598401103 817309 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I haven't been retraining any of the styles because of the complex ethical questions it involves. < 1598401150 719331 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Does that include GDPR? < 1598401190 291039 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't think that counts as "ethical", but it's certainly complex, a question, and probably involved if you think too long about it. < 1598401207 545093 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, that's borderline tautological. < 1598401220 879529 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :And it becomes more tautological the more you think about it ;-) < 1598401769 530754 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598402260 556496 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598403910 896642 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598405342 360835 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( pretty: https://paste.debian.net/1161232/ ) < 1598405421 22751 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, my ISP's website is down for the third day when attempting to access it from their own network, but it's been working fine all the time from other connections ("is it down" sites, the mobile network, my workstation at the office). < 1598405443 472837 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :They've probably done something clever. < 1598405486 280200 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's clearly a cost savings measure. < 1598405501 192860 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Outside users are more important because they may be prospective customers. < 1598405504 552411 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1598405535 557584 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair point. < 1598405565 995285 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only noticed because I was trying to download my bill for expensing it though. < 1598405632 645602 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm there may be a flaw in my logic. Getting paid is kind of important. < 1598405917 111106 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric : Well, it's direct debit, they get paid anyway. *I* just don't get reimbursed. < 1598405963 743699 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I imagine they have some customers that actually manually pay the bill though. < 1598405986 514125 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :But maybe the site works for them, who knows. < 1598406611 965082 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :. o O ( Dear C++, why can't I assign constexpr-s inside an if (constexpr bool) context ;-) ) < 1598407112 949335 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is a "if (constexpr bool) context"? < 1598407130 685087 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's some sort of "metaprogramming language" / "met a programming language" pun lurking in there, but I can't draw it out. < 1598407166 440992 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: I meant something like if (foo) { ...... } else { ...... } where foo is a constant expression of type bool. < 1598407222 996107 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course C++ doesn't allow you to assign constexpr variables at all. < 1598407249 425892 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can make a new variable and use the ternary operator. But it's ugly. < 1598407286 908235 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Next on the wishlist: compile-time evaluation of loops without jumping through hoops with templates. < 1598407576 229364 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I thought you could do some amount of guaranteed-to-happen-at-compile-time loops (without templates) already. < 1598407662 189838 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I remember writing a silly class for doing arrays of enums that had a constexpr constructor with a std::initializer_list and did some for loops over the internal array, and that at least produced (in the generated code) just whatever those loops left in the array. < 1598407683 263224 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Basically as a workaround for the lack of designated initializers.) < 1598407736 711648 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :But no clue. I think I *almost* learned C++ 17-or-so to some degree, but then got side-tracked by something else and all that knowledge evaporated. < 1598408655 859758 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, "C++14 constexpr functions may use local variables and loops". < 1598408686 241618 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think my compilers default to C++11 < 1598414033 66077 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598414070 543431 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: What did you end up with for the thing? < 1598414076 99100 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I hope not dbs. < 1598414920 940086 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598416512 449537 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598416729 954204 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598416741 36871 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598416797 480562 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598416810 285553 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598416836 545211 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1598423759 608298 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598424022 436613 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:c0c4:164a:50c5:ec63 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598424455 946131 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598424547 641870 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598425377 948696 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598426304 665780 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:HDWithZeroes14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76914&oldid=76800 5* 03HDWithZeroes 5* (-179) 10Blanked the page < 1598427409 974482 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1598429489 489134 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598429603 886443 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598429924 436795 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Spontaneous 5* 10New user account < 1598430819 510043 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-qwqyulpnfshhunht QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598431279 261011 :pikhq!sid394595@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yletbajgqdhhhtvx JOIN :#esoteric < 1598432122 923550 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598432436 586655 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-72.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598435545 536801 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I ended up with a web server and client cert auth. < 1598435577 958122 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes sense. < 1598435582 518656 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's too bad TLS is so complicated. < 1598435830 784956 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was planning to do a thing where I don't actually do PKI, but instead just have self-signed client certs and have the thing's config file hold authorized cert fingerprints. It worked fine with curl, but I just couldn't make Chrome present that certificate anyhow. < 1598435841 133635 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :In the end I went with some random private CA tool to create a CA cert, a server cert and a client cert, which did work out. < 1598436455 58354 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598438990 973663 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598443095 488705 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598445791 827847 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh the feeling when a heuristic works well in small cases and becomes useless for larger ones that take long to compute :-/ < 1598445816 136167 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(in a backtracking search) < 1598446167 477141 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Otoh I didn't expect this to pay off, really. The problem feels too nasty for effective and cheap pruning (you can have one of those, I think). < 1598446314 988739 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598446356 944290 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598446371 973515 :craigo_!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598446375 194120 :gitlogger!~gitlogger@206.ip-51-91-102.eu QUIT :Excess Flood < 1598446514 904173 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598446787 948506 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598446811 907429 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598446814 304835 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598446838 491436 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d5ab:22ab:23d1:56e3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598450391 423379 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: hi, sorry for you < 1598450395 829730 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru NICK :arseniiv < 1598450879 636671 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d5ab:22ab:23d1:56e3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598451002 778157 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d5ab:22ab:23d1:56e3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598454987 154470 :hakatashi!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598455205 530913 :hakatashi1!~hakatashi@104.131.49.125 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds > 1598455664 136753 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* 10New user account > 1598457298 88535 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76915&oldid=76876 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+114) 10 > 1598457415 280666 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang:Introduce yourself14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76916&oldid=76915 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+28) 10 < 1598458087 961015 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed < 1598459292 587350 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598459654 896394 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598459899 667230 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598460094 900815 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598460096 821728 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598460947 60603 :craigo_!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1598461205 764368 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1598461299 679703 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598462764 853254 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598465761 969973 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric < 1598465980 432982 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :do the eyes of a basilisk glow so that its stare works even in the dark? < 1598465992 119094 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm wait, this isn't the channel that's expert in that question < 1598466041 977838 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I once read a story where they used blue glasses to resist a basilisk stare attack. > 1598466284 797102 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76917 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+2594) 10Created page with "'''Modulous''' is a 1D [[esoteric programming language]] that is inspired by the [[assembly language]]. ==Commands== {| class="Commands" ! Command |} {| class="wikitable"..." > 1598466357 532394 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76918&oldid=76917 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (-23) 10 < 1598467312 94434 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :supposing you have a byte string that can have any bytes, and you want to serialize it through IRC messages, which can only have any byte other than the three magic bytes "\x00\x0A\x0D", are there any eso-interesting ways to do that? < 1598467380 187599 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :because base64 is boring? < 1598467404 876205 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was thinking that one thing I could do is to generate a random key, then encrypt the string using symmetric cryptography with that key, then serialize the key and the ciphertext to IRC using some method that is only efficient when the string looks like random, eg. using a method that is slower if the string has a lot of instances of the magic bytes < 1598467480 912160 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but this has the key as the overhead in transmission, which may be significant because you usually only want to serialize short strings this way > 1598468104 35204 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76919&oldid=76918 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+1405) 10 < 1598468294 66306 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh great, so there are at least two popular games for the Nintendo Switch that care about wall time such that some in-game event only happens after some amount of real world time passes, even if the game is not running, in such a way that they look at local time, so to speed things up you don't have to change the wallclock time of the operating system, only change the timezone, or set the wallclock and < 1598468300 209827 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :zone to schedule a timezone offset change during the game < 1598468316 232946 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :why would games do that, watching local time instead of UTC time? > 1598468339 445364 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76920&oldid=76919 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+1) 10 < 1598468404 658751 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598468958 505885 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :At the beginning of your end step, remove a lore counter from target saga you control. If you can't, you lose the game. < 1598469098 493347 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gnkvprqbfbnxuykp QUIT : < 1598469110 635760 :dingwat!uid70835@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-trbwiwomoopbzfbr JOIN :#esoteric < 1598469821 640478 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598469941 150687 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76921&oldid=76920 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+0) 10/* Commands */ < 1598469948 389603 :LKoen!~LKoen@lstlambert-657-1-123-43.w92-154.abo.wanadoo.fr QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1598470622 687451 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76922&oldid=76921 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+32) 10 < 1598471161 72574 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric : why would games do that, watching local time instead of UTC time? => sometimes it’s just that people don’t know that exists somewhere, or how to get to it, or they think the local time is UTC time because it’s not documented in a good way which is it < 1598471226 550074 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Cale: OK. What card will it be, and what (if any) other abilities? < 1598471251 938988 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I understand it when software written in the 80s or 90s does it < 1598471299 51787 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: An enchantment with just that, I think < 1598471302 774710 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Note that if it has no valid targets, it won't trigger and you won't lose the game, however. But if you change "target Saga" to "a Saga" then it won't be like that) < 1598471320 994166 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yeah > 1598471373 52813 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Abyxlrz14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76923 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+122) 10Created page with "Hello there! I am Abyxlrz, I really like [[esoteric programming language]]s. You can check out my esolang(s) [[Modulous]]" < 1598471375 443131 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are so many Saga abilities which are completely obnoxious if repeated > 1598471388 624828 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76924&oldid=76923 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+1) 10 < 1598471406 477371 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol, this + Fall of the Thran < 1598471523 502510 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name Hex Par < 1598471526 13361 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hex Parasite \ 1 \ Artifact Creature -- Insect \ 1/1 \ {X}{(b/p)}: Remove up to X counters from target permanent. For each counter removed this way, Hex Parasite gets +1/+0 until end of turn. ({(b/p)} can be paid with either {B} or 2 life.) \ NPH-R < 1598471577 897799 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598471612 50813 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also have a idea of a Saga which can be: MCCXXXIV--You win the game. > 1598471657 662056 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76925&oldid=76922 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+109) 10/* Other things */ > 1598472413 94767 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76926&oldid=76925 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+106) 10 > 1598472916 339036 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76927&oldid=76926 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+82) 10 > 1598473165 645099 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76928&oldid=76890 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+15) 10 > 1598473733 162717 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76929 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+193) 10Created page with "==Interpreter== if anyone makes a modulous interpreter (i don't think anyone will make one, but i hope someone does) you can message me on twitter (I'm @Abyxlrz) and i can put..." > 1598473914 730417 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Helen14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76930&oldid=76337 5* 03Helen 5* (-102) 10Undo revision 76337 by [[Special:Contributions/AlvinBalvin321|AlvinBalvin321]] ([[User talk:AlvinBalvin321|talk]]) > 1598474158 81736 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76931&oldid=76927 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+3) 10 > 1598476372 403066 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck algorithms14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76932&oldid=71978 5* 03Rdebath 5* (+181) 10Add fixed version > 1598476409 391680 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Brainfuck algorithms14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76933&oldid=76932 5* 03Rdebath 5* (-1) 10Sigh, space < 1598477646 965070 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598479185 900684 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:d5ab:22ab:23d1:56e3 QUIT : < 1598480216 410111 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh also < 1598480223 281427 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :`card-by-name By Gnome Means < 1598480224 785862 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :By Gnome Means \ 2W \ Enchantment \ {1}{W}, Remove a counter from a permanent you control: Create a 1/1 colorless Gnome artifact creature token. \ {1}{W}, Sacrifice an artifact: Choose any kind of counter a printed card refers to, then put one of that counter on target permanent. \ UST-R < 1598480253 426023 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Remove all the lands and make 1/1 tokens forever < 1598481776 43520 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Quit: “It’s only logical. First you learn to talk, then you learn to think. Too bad it’s not the other way round.” < 1598482498 660151 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598482977 981640 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598483395 35612 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598484231 309101 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598484536 38213 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598484892 540057 :craigo_!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598485806 784191 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598486122 783877 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598486931 3803 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598486959 853299 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598491448 523561 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598491706 701462 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598492560 268213 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598494792 985707 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598498405 210558 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598499281 165558 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598499729 42066 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598501685 934795 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1598501796 463348 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you canonicalize code? < 1598502136 263135 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :To canonicalize what code? < 1598502706 926983 :xelxebar_!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598502738 525623 :xelxebar_!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598502763 899054 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598502765 677975 :xelxebar_!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598503193 235325 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598503218 739927 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: all code < 1598503305 100403 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598503305 342990 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598503856 953245 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598504138 119178 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's your favourite solution to the halting problem? < 1598505741 581869 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :twoducks < 1598506782 605025 :Cale!~cale@CPEf48e38ee8583-CM0c473de9d680.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Might be possible to write a lambda calculus canonicaliser in that < 1598506993 194267 :Palaver!~Palaver@adsl-99-93-137-225.dsl.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598507017 962158 :Palaver!~Palaver@adsl-99-93-137-225.dsl.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net NICK :mookil < 1598508464 627086 :mookil!~Palaver@adsl-99-93-137-225.dsl.ltrkar.sbcglobal.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598510084 553505 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598511522 20999 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598512222 13041 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1598512357 387725 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598512762 444165 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598513211 981645 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598514803 999513 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598514816 382314 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1598515741 611730 :craigo_!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598515943 834134 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598515954 24262 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://www.quantamagazine.org/can-computers-solve-the-collatz-conjecture-20200826/ < 1598516229 657088 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1598516341 225608 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not sure how you would put something recursive into something which checks finite statespaces? < 1598516426 863236 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's why these are impossibility results < 1598516439 362217 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :you only need to show its impossible for some finite n then you're done forever < 1598516458 617546 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess they are trying to find a loop in collatz ??? < 1598516623 756057 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can you solve the Collatz conjecture with a halting oracle? < 1598516629 900423 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What program would you give it? < 1598516672 308381 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :can i only invoke the oracle once? < 1598516789 269109 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i suppose there is a generic construction that makes invoking a halting oracle once equivalent to invoking it arbitrarily many times < 1598516823 166124 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a program that finds the Collatz sequence for every natural number. Give it that? < 1598516852 333358 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not quite, I guess. < 1598516861 602016 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that takes n as input. i was thinking of we could loop over every n -- but i need to invoke the oracle many times < 1598516861 845267 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Good morning < 1598516865 50815 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :morning! < 1598516873 573271 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :You can't invoke the oracle nestedly. < 1598516907 471396 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant, give the oracle the single program that runs the Collatz sequence repeatedely, for every n < 1598516917 761266 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :But of course that doesn't halt even if Collatz halts for all of them < 1598517003 37836 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was replying to the rain. < 1598517012 462889 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :So was I < 1598517025 218989 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh no. < 1598517136 308609 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, there's two failure cases for collatz conjecture: either there's a loop, or an unbounded increase < 1598517151 444924 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think you can find the first failure case with an oracle, but I don't think you can find the second < 1598517195 684025 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, the second case is the harder one. < 1598517206 873468 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is so interesting < 1598517235 86227 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ehm, wouldn't a halting oracle just tell us that it halted or not? > 1598517307 740687 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76934&oldid=76924 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (-17) 10 < 1598517336 110232 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe Taneb has some other kind of oracle in mind, otherwise I am completely confused about why there would be a distinction there. < 1598517336 469175 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but can't i run infinitely many programs all at once and ask if that halts? < 1598517369 747864 :Taneb!~Taneb@2001:41c8:51:10d:aaaa:0:aaaa:0 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: the program I want to put into the oracle is "Try each number until we find one that cycles, then halt" < 1598517590 86884 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, that. < 1598517596 10516 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598517597 245770 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK > 1598517655 437209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76935&oldid=76931 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+90) 10 < 1598517709 424958 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric : i suppose there is a generic construction that makes invoking a halting oracle once equivalent to invoking it arbitrarily many times <-- I think there actually isn't, and that this is why there's a hierarchy of uncomputable problems, actually < 1598517767 257845 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1598517917 275323 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :e.g. the uniform halting problem (does this TM halt on every input) is higher up than the halting problem (does this inputless TM halt). Collatz is like the uniform halting problem. < 1598517936 429214 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :That is my fuzzy morning take anyway < 1598519289 934102 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598519337 430049 :xelxebar_!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.7.2+deb3 - https://znc.in < 1598519354 850946 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598520263 296959 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-232.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598521134 991676 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598521527 910236 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how did i never hear about this before! < 1598521530 389675 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :this is cool < 1598521791 528102 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598521859 994810 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric < 1598521960 824337 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :i really hope these guys solve collatz < 1598521976 252717 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's so cool that they have an appraoch they are working on < 1598522129 480289 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://imgur.com/a/9Rgv3lU i had never seen this string rewrite version of collatz before < 1598522923 633666 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric > 1598523581 475275 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03MINIPRIME 5* 10New user account < 1598526658 868705 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598526884 138642 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :in windows, it's very annoying how when certain drivers are loaded, sound that I'm listening to on my headphones can be temporarily redirected to the laptop speakers for a few seconds. this happens when I start a virtual machine with Virtualbox (even though I disabled audio for that machine), and even when starting the VPN software (which is < 1598526884 669622 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :admittedly annoying and badly written in other ways, adds two fictitious IP addresses as DNS resolvers slowing down all DNS queries, and thinks it's supposed to be an antivirus, not only a VPN tunnel. < 1598526933 918897 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean I could understand if the sound was temporarily muted for a few seconds when an audio driver is installed, but no, it has to go to the loudspeaker for all the room to hear. < 1598526953 767816 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598527003 383757 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder if I should use a hardware workaround for this, as in plug in a dummy headphone plug into the laptop headphone socket to make it mute the built-in speaker. < 1598527038 511316 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :but that would just lead to too much debugging when I do want to use the laptop speaker < 1598529313 534072 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: doesn’t disabling the speakers work? Or you don’t want to disable them in case they are needed other time? < 1598529365 107480 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, they aren’t their own device, I get it now < 1598529410 844015 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :though maybe they can be muted in the settings of their corresponding audio device < 1598529411 327915 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :arseniiv: I do sometimes want the speakers, especially when doing an online phone call to a remote co-worker such that a third person is next to me on my side and needs to listen. and yes, it's a work laptop, not owned by me, so no I won't try to deliberately permanently harm it. < 1598529437 789597 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru PRIVMSG #esoteric :okay < 1598529454 661389 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598529463 980510 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :They can be muted, but it seems (I haven't done enough experiments) that that doesn't work, maybe the volume setting gets carried over from the headphones when it switches over or something. < 1598529525 453803 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I forgot to mention that the headphones are connected to the audio jack port in the docking station. < 1598529610 497467 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's another audio jack port on the notebook. Both of these are technically headset ports, so they can carry a headset with headphones and microphone together. I think that is impractical on the docker, since it means you can't plug in an external microphone through analog audio port, but makes sense on the laptop chasis itself where space for < 1598529610 985361 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :ports is constrained. < 1598529646 155015 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :This docking stations provides very few ports in general. < 1598529702 728406 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's only an HDMI port on it, no DVI, (this may be deliberate conspiracy by hardware manufacturers to sell the expensive HDMI cables or converters). < 1598529763 894930 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's also a third audio device, namely the monitor's built-in speaker connected through HDMI, but the speaker in this cheap monitor has such bad audio quality that I don't use it at all. < 1598529937 16348 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heh, I wonder if the headphone sensing works such that you could actually make a mute switch from a 3.5mm plug and a switch. I imagine they're all based on electronics, not some microswitch in the hole or anything like that. < 1598530142 483132 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :My work laptop (Debian, PulseAudio) has a pretty unintuitive behavior with headphones and volume. If I turn the volume down with no headphones plugged in (because I don't want the laptop speaker going "bong" every now and then), it'll retain that volume level if I plug in headphones (so I can't hear anyone on the video call). Then, if I turn up the volume temporarily for the call, and then unplug the < 1598530148 524389 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :headphones, it actually resets the volume back to the low level it used to be. But when I plug headphones back in, it remains low, and I miss the first few seconds of the next meeting trying to fiddle with the volume controls again. < 1598530231 697029 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's clearly got some sort of separate notion of volume levels for the different configurations (since it resets the volume back when unplugging the headset), but that somehow doesn't extend to remembering what I wanted the volume to be *with* the headset plugged in. < 1598530341 956964 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's odd. I do see the effect of having two separate settings with and without headphones but it manages to switch on both relevant events. < 1598530349 413754 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :On a PC though. < 1598530372 486163 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Laptopts may be harder... they tend to sleep a lot. < 1598530396 431910 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :`? topt < 1598530398 463341 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :topt? ¯\(°​_o)/¯ < 1598530498 853703 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598530552 847675 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598530733 664585 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :The output device selection also feels slightly nondeterministic. Usually it does the reasonable thing, but sometimes it ends up using the HDMI output (of the monitor with no speakers). < 1598530864 997270 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's also got three display-related outputs ("HDMI1/DP1", "HDMI2/DP2" and "HDMI3/DP3"), and I have no idea what those map to. There *are* three connected monitors (the built-in panel, and two external, both connected through a single USB-C cable doing the DP Alt Mode + MST thing), but that might be purely a coincidence. < 1598530880 188372 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Two of them say they're "plugged in" and one is "unplugged". < 1598530892 315336 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :But none of these things are actually capable of making any noise, so. < 1598530894 297921 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: it more or less has to be nondeterministic, or at least appear nondeterministic to a casual observer, since you can just plug in audio devices through USB or wifi at runtime, or have them plugged in from boot, and it doesn't seem like you could make a canonical ordering of them that's obvious to humans. < 1598530931 262141 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not a canonical ordering, but I feel like it maintains some sort of preference list or a mapping between apps and devices somewhere. < 1598530940 838752 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the HDMI/DP things is sensible then it should map to fixed connectors :-/ < 1598530953 689476 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :There aren't that many holes in the thing. :) < 1598530977 201066 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Smiley because often things are not sensible.) < 1598530986 407038 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: that's also why we can't just use the simple old ways to select hard disk as boot device or mount source, /dev/sda could mean a hard disk connected anywhere, not only on the first of two physical ATA ports on your motherboard. < 1598530986 894532 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :And that would mean you couldn't stream audio over to the monitor connected over DP chaining ("MST"). < 1598531062 880274 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"that many holes" => again, USB and bluetooth audio devices < 1598531093 81794 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :USB can have passive hubs, at which point the hardware can't even tell which hole on the hub you plugged a device into < 1598531106 986035 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, but I mean, it can't be mapping three "HDMIn/DPn" outputs to three "fixed connectors" because of that. < 1598531159 662453 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have in fact used both USB and bluetooth audio devices on a work laptop, though I think not on this work laptop, and bluetooth is often not very reliable < 1598531182 655462 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :In any case, after you've selected a particular sink for a particular app, it feels like it remembers those associations (up to switching to the USB DAC when I turn that on, if I previously "preferred" that), except that sometimes it just doesn't. < 1598531488 326624 :craigo!~craigo@144.136.206.168 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1598531498 98724 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598531997 866191 :kspalaiologos!~kspalaiol@176.221.122.69 QUIT :Quit: Leaving < 1598532151 774752 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :"sink" because the ports are not specialized, you can connect anything including the kitchen sink through USB3 < 1598532157 48317 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1598532195 976679 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, i found a duplicate site. Either a catphisher or something: https://techne.zem.fi/wiki/Main_Page < 1598532239 134642 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oakley: compare the IP addresses :P < 1598532247 815828 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :one sec < 1598532261 987790 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yo lmao < 1598532281 892123 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why are there two domains registered to the IP tho? < 1598532292 225971 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not? < 1598532306 952616 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oakley: anyone can point their domain to an IP address, they don't need permission by the IP address < 1598532313 997544 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, huh < 1598532352 936373 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and zem.fi is one of our regular's domain, so they can point a subdomain to the wiki < 1598532385 920806 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :weird, huh. I didn't know you could do that < 1598532429 705580 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems like there's a chance that could be used for malicious purposes with odmains < 1598532558 95016 :Oakley!411b7e0a@cpe-65-27-126-10.new.res.rr.com QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598532648 68858 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :note though that (1) the HTTP client sends the hostname to the server in a request header, and on many servers, the webserver actually looks at that and serves different pages for different domains, though this can be problematic because it can make it harder to access a webpage if the DNS server is down even if you know the IP address, < 1598532670 634362 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and (2) SSL/TSL certificates are restricted by domains, so you usually can't access a HTTPS website through just any random domain name pointed to it. < 1598532725 505738 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oakley left. < 1598532732 274000 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :however, malicious webservers do sometimes show a lookalike website on a domain and server that they control, for phishing purposes, such as a website that look like your bank's website < 1598532735 744288 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :meh, we have a log < 1598532903 152012 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't see much potential for malicious purposes in pointing different domains to the same address, though < 1598532919 200974 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't the main reason that control over esolangs.org was (maybe still is, I forgot what happened at last renewal time) unclear for a while? So it should be accessible by bare IP address, and that makes namevirtualhost shenanigans less attractive. < 1598532928 368559 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i guess i could kinda pretend to have a page i really don't, but where's the use in that < 1598532939 187571 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: you could serve subtly different contents :P < 1598532954 486286 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :int-e: if you own the server behind the ip address, yes < 1598532973 454544 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really, the main reason is pure laziness, AIUI nginx has to select *some* site to serve, and there's just one configured, so that's the one it serves no matter what the host is. < 1598532976 195526 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: All I'm saying is that there's evil beyond phishing :P < 1598533000 706866 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the way i interpreted it was that he saw potential for malicious purposes by pointing a domain to an address that doesn't belong to you < 1598533004 766353 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and i don't see how < 1598533007 939920 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :It would've taken extra work to not serve the wiki for non-esolangs.org host headers, and I'm averse to work. < 1598533009 393313 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :there are like a dozen websites living from serving a reformatted mirror of en.Wikipedia, often with ads, yes < 1598533038 166839 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: I recommend that you do serve it from other host headers too < 1598533046 499113 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: They thought it was a clone hosted by a different party. < 1598533054 524496 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: well yeah, but you can't do that by just pointing a domain somewhere < 1598533072 473388 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: Which is why I mentioned the IP addresses :P < 1598533075 52922 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: I'll probably keep it the default. But I might maybe *not* serve it at some specific domain names, including techne.zem.fi. < 1598533082 670388 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure < 1598533089 67093 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :that works < 1598533095 826609 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :also, there are loads of auto-translated stackoverflows and i hate them < 1598533121 643505 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :auto-translated stackoverflows? I don't recall having ran into them, but I don't search for non-english websites too often < 1598533137 219211 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :how do you even auto-translate programming content? < 1598533152 320262 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there good translator software for that? < 1598533239 80797 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, deepl i guess < 1598533246 902417 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i never said they were good < 1598533293 762414 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for what language(s) have you seen that? < 1598533342 338466 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :german and some asian languages < 1598533540 182100 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598533634 155952 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess it makes sense. StackOverflow is popular, and large, but not too large, not as large as en.Wikipedia, you can serve it from just one hard disk < 1598533684 89354 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, I should check the numbers < 1598533725 184189 :Arcorann!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598533769 404737 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wouldn't bet on it even mirroring it < 1598533783 173763 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's really no need to not just translate on the fly < 1598533822 571668 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm no, you can actually serve all of en.Wikipedia's text, not counting images and other media, from a single hard disk. < 1598533833 773714 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :a mirror I mean < 1598533858 247555 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but why, just make an iframe for it < 1598533874 186887 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :but those may be bad for seo < 1598533932 229249 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1598534065 325005 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It actually looks like en.Wikipedia is not that much larger than Stackoverflow now, at least if you only count posts, not media. < 1598534076 798202 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's crazy, I didn't know that < 1598534174 84937 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wikidata is somewhat larger, and just the metadata content of Commons is smaller, but of course the media content of Commons is HUGE compared to any of that < 1598534334 676284 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :Commons has 256 terabytes of media right now, of which 225 terabytes are images, and it's growing fast. < 1598534398 430581 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :All the other sites mentioned are dwarfed compared to it (though of course Google's and archive.org's databanks are larger still) < 1598534444 982911 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :256 terabytes is still in the order that a dedicated IT geek can have at home in actively connected storage. < 1598534612 359049 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, but mirroring that would not be fun < 1598534633 293815 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it wouldn't be, but some geeks store that amount of some other data < 1598534914 396010 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...look if you had that much storage wouldn't you use it for prime numbers? /s < 1598534959 6718 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :no, you don't need much storage for prime numbers, you need parallel computation power for them < 1598535143 275297 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :...then what other data < 1598535160 900017 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i wonder where they store that much data < 1598535189 940457 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am looking for a reasonably priced solution to store about 10 tb and that's rough enough already < 1598535196 437344 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :t20kdc: raw (but compressed) videos mostly, for people who produce videos for money < 1598535216 333547 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can also be raw photos, but those pile up a bit slower < 1598535242 227380 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :10 terabytes fit on a single hard disk or two these days < 1598535279 960349 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :though you may still want more than two disks for redundancy or speed < 1598535339 800824 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a home user who doesn't want to store the data, the redundancy for backups can be more of a limiting factor than the total data capacity < 1598535358 76194 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :which is good, that only started like a decade ago < 1598535392 350717 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm glad we no longer have to live with slow computers with tiny amounts of RAM and small disks anymore < 1598535414 898808 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :wib_jonas: fitting on a hard disk doesn't help much if you want to access it through the internet < 1598535471 744599 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :well that's different, yes, for that you also need an internet connection with high bandwidth upload, and ideally static IP < 1598535531 453969 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't have either of those < 1598535540 416016 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :therefore, i want cloud storage < 1598535563 443389 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :cloud storage is that plus part of a server < 1598535569 195687 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :it can work too < 1598535601 694434 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, but you rarely have the option to attach 10 tb to a server at a reasonable price < 1598535609 629843 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure > 1598535637 710481 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76936&oldid=76935 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+87) 10 < 1598535639 290550 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :do you have access to cheaper microsoft office licences through work? that is often the cheapest way to get remote storage. < 1598535752 598334 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :office 365 licences aren't that expensive, but those don't have that much storage < 1598535786 267196 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they don't? I thought they came with a lot of storage. ok. also how fast bandwidth and stable do you need this to be? can a home internet connection not work? < 1598535862 371198 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i want to kinda back up data i have online and uploading 10 tb of data in case of a needed recovery is horribly slow < 1598535900 784443 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :like, my current upload speed is about 100 kb/s < 1598535956 484877 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i would need about 3.5 years to recover < 1598536022 342108 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :why do you need the backup to be online? are remote backups in a different builing where you physically carry the data on hard disks not enough? < 1598536048 524594 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :with possibly a smaller amount of more quickly changing data backed up online in addition < 1598536082 655869 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :eg. if you're writing a thesis, do back it up online every hour, but that's much smaller size < 1598536097 945157 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :and also back it up locally of course > 1598540774 541984 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76937&oldid=76936 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+9) 10 < 1598541843 262856 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598542187 352545 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598542775 30109 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76938&oldid=76937 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+1131) 10 < 1598543946 544138 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598543951 526394 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598544238 565189 :tromp!~tromp@ip-213-127-101-220.ip.prioritytelecom.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598544866 90454 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed < 1598544973 559513 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598545804 623641 :trn!jhj@prone.ws QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598546270 974640 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598546515 995999 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598546545 386644 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598546551 315965 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598546625 826841 :trn!jhj@prone.ws JOIN :#esoteric < 1598546630 464956 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598547252 350336 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598547483 40218 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598547539 553486 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598548802 556507 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric > 1598549843 814593 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76939&oldid=76938 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+7) 10 > 1598550181 844070 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76940&oldid=76939 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+305) 10 < 1598550201 17191 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598550776 390321 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598550978 273015 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I notified a webpage maintainer about an error on their page. They replied to me that they'll fix the error "immediately". That was 23 hours ago. Any guesses for how long it will take for them to actually fix it? < 1598551743 508179 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598551905 183553 :sprocklem!~sprocklem@unaffiliated/sprocklem JOIN :#esoteric > 1598552099 520693 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76941&oldid=76817 5* 03Masldobehere 5* (+37) 10added STBF code > 1598552388 365750 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76942&oldid=76929 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (-31) 10 > 1598553092 715074 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76943&oldid=76940 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+2) 10 > 1598554204 577372 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76944&oldid=76943 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+7) 10 < 1598554863 768994 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursaga < 1598554904 986414 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598554969 49997 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598555015 892502 :xelxebar!~xelxebar@gateway/tor-sasl/xelxebar JOIN :#esoteric < 1598555192 163438 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Today's discovery: C's arrow operators in the wild: https://github.com/tcltk/tcl/blob/master/generic/tclCompile.c#L3561 < 1598555683 579157 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :fizzie: ah you mean the --> operator, not the ordinary arrow -> operator < 1598555722 522257 :mmmattyx!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pvfghmzzbihjcgdp JOIN :#esoteric > 1598555770 829138 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76945&oldid=76944 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+6) 10 < 1598555893 31513 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yep. < 1598555901 324691 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Neat, you all had me fooled for a moment. < 1598555922 995463 :fizzie!fis@unaffiliated/fizzie PRIVMSG #esoteric :Found a bunch without any whitespace, as in `while (i-->0)` and so on, but the real honest `i --> 0` seems pretty rare. < 1598556249 663330 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't use this, as I generally write counter loops like that as for loops in C++ and C < 1598556379 430981 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i do think "i --> 0" is pretty ugly in the sense that it disguises its real meaning to the reader < 1598556475 298780 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: how about if it's written the same but spaced properly, as `i-- > 0` ? < 1598556494 739244 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's fine by me < 1598556526 592001 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I also almost never use the > or >= operator in C or C++, always use < and <= instead < 1598556614 677114 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, i probably wouldn't write 0 < i-- < 1598556635 327360 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i tend to put the "comparison value" to the right < 1598556636 846055 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(obviously I use the > token as punctuation for templates, but then it's not the > operator) < 1598556724 47523 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a == or != comparison, I usually put the more constant value on the left, so it's `0 == x` rather than `x == 0`, and `x == y` if x is changed in the outer loop and y in the inner loop or x is the expected value and y is the observed value, though there are edge cases when it's not obvious which one should be first; < 1598556744 102305 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i am not a fan of yoda conditions < 1598556780 687632 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I don't use this rule for < and <= comparisons, and for scalar values I usually prefer < or <= over == or != comparisons when there's no difference in meaning > 1598557041 964928 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76946&oldid=76945 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+134) 10 < 1598557353 423741 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598558329 64457 :iscordian[m]!discordi1@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-yjwosxajnrfltylf JOIN :#esoteric < 1598558823 758294 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If C's dereference operator was postfix, it wouldn't need the -> operator. > 1598559143 657908 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76947&oldid=76942 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+18) 10 < 1598559201 225375 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so you don't know whether x*y is a multiplication or a reference to a struct value? < 1598559326 524991 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.37.134.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds > 1598559328 557370 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76948&oldid=76946 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+5) 10 < 1598559355 780287 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598559657 778840 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds > 1598559661 274569 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76949&oldid=76948 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+63) 10 < 1598559709 665201 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :when you put it that way < 1598559714 161480 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: no, it would be written as x*.y < 1598559720 19799 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 PRIVMSG #esoteric :It makes me wonder why they didn't do it like that < 1598559724 920038 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or x^.y if ^ is used as the dereference operator < 1598559753 907591 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :but the problem is, then you'd need a space to write an indirect assignment like x* = y < 1598559768 376175 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or parenthesis obviously (x*)=y < 1598559972 878724 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :If it was a postfix operator it should hopefully not also be an infix operator. < 1598559977 162960 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :So maybe something other than *. < 1598560014 240140 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :in cryptography, there is such a thing as https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_timestamping , which means that you send a fingerprint to a trusted third party, and they append a timestamp and sign it with public key cryptography, then you can use that signature to prove to anyone that you knew the digest at the given time. (instead of a trusted third party, a collectively trusted distributed set of < 1598560020 545364 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :users could be used, but that's not relevant to what I'm about to ask.) < 1598560052 530651 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: well sure, but it's hard to find new *short* operator spellings, and you want concise syntax for this in C < 1598560082 139810 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, you could use ^ and then use something else for xor. < 1598560084 145347 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: what's the reason to keep the dot < 1598560103 720502 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah nvmd < 1598560123 764293 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :what they could do instead is to make not only dereferencing a prefix, but also make subscripting and dotted member access and function call prefixes < 1598560156 214309 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or maybe not function call, only the others -- that would result in some extra parenthesis with function calls, but not too often < 1598560158 370324 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would also work, but it'd be a bigger change. < 1598560178 619865 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that of course would have put Stroustrup in a tight place, because now you can't have method calls with the current syntax < 1598560318 411638 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :So back to cryptography, is there a sort of reversed version of trusted timestamping, where the trusted authority generates a fresh random token, append a timestamp, and sign it, and then you can use the signature to prove that the key is random and there was no way for anyone to predict anything about it before that timestamp. < 1598560430 644376 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :This could be made even more useful if they released such keys regularly with a small enough period, and stored them for at least a week, so you could get a token for any exact timestamp chosen in advance, and they'd also guarantee that they only generate one token for any given timestamp. < 1598560573 543336 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could use such a service to perform an experiment or zero-knowledge proof that needs randomness, such as for sampling inputs because trying all inputs would be inefficient, publish the exact protocol and timestamp in advance, and you could prove to anyone, even to someone learning about this later, that you used a truly random seed, not a random seed that you chose to get the outcome you want, and < 1598560579 561375 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :that you couldn't even retry the experiment with multiple random seeds and selectively publish the results. < 1598560611 235825 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Technically you'd use a trusted timestamp with earlier timestamp and a trusted reverse timestamp with later timestamp in combination for this.) < 1598561065 774305 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc QUIT :Quit: ZNC 1.6.6+deb1ubuntu0.2 - http://znc.in < 1598561098 1798 :orbitaldecay!~bob@forder.cc JOIN :#esoteric < 1598561609 909016 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :does this make sense, or should I give an example? < 1598562141 582836 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598564388 979829 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Quit: This computer has gone to sleep < 1598564841 678747 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1598566608 425186 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598566897 455866 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598567110 724647 :mmmattyx!uid17782@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-pvfghmzzbihjcgdp QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1598568073 5165 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598568987 7655 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598570067 219881 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598572035 981740 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598576210 736541 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :what can someone do to speed up a Thue interpreter? < 1598576221 373389 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, I guess, rewriting in general. < 1598576335 674016 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :have already tried using tries instead of doing linear matching for rules, have started using a looping queue to do rewrites in place, but I never seem to break the 10us barrier. < 1598577530 218916 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's just an awful formalism to implement. :P < 1598577900 635816 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://twitter.com/gro_tsen/status/1295431867026542593 < 1598578170 165165 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esoteric :imode: hmm so you have a particular program you're testing? Also, do you care about being nondeterministic? Because I think that can make quite a big difference. < 1598578226 132790 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, we're testing sums of various numbers in various bases, summing of lists of base16-encoded numbers. < 1598578359 826276 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :https://hastebin.com/raw/uvetucawib < 1598578390 445623 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :this finishes in 104us. it uses built-in rules to move to hot parts of the string. < 1598578508 348611 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :along with actually performing the addition. < 1598578645 895860 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode PRIVMSG #esoteric :there's a rule matching order that's determined by a trie. practically eliminated the overhead of searching for a match linearly. < 1598580326 959825 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-115.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598585250 346642 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598585434 986560 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598587363 327728 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Challenger514]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76950&oldid=67372 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+149) 10 > 1598587562 961617 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Full Stack14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76951&oldid=76635 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+105) 10 > 1598589583 281999 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76952&oldid=76947 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+45) 10/* Interpreter */ > 1598589635 213429 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76953&oldid=76952 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+145) 10/* Interpreter */ < 1598589725 355718 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598589804 738437 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could say how I would do operator overloading and method calls in C, difference from C++. For one thing, the set of operators which can be overloaded would be different, such as, you cannot override the comma operator or the direct assignment operator, but you can overload the indirect assignment operator and the call operator. < 1598589869 365945 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :If the first few members of a structure are zero length structures that overload the call operator, then you can use this to implement the method calling syntax. < 1598589919 12806 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598589946 624066 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would also use parentheses for parameterized types. < 1598593573 541772 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598593677 617172 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598594199 338868 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598594326 234747 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76954&oldid=76949 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+7) 10 > 1598594765 379101 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76955&oldid=76953 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+81) 10 > 1598595245 449110 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76956&oldid=76955 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+36) 10 > 1598595750 25436 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76957&oldid=76954 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+80) 10 < 1598596017 779054 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598598932 483353 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598601650 15194 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1598602211 413811 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598602303 890112 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598602729 579628 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598603085 603567 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76958&oldid=76941 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+87) 10Fish and starfish! > 1598603407 242853 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07List of quines14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76959&oldid=75585 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+83) 10Fish and starfish! > 1598603475 854437 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76960&oldid=76958 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1) 10Where did you go, full stop? > 1598603781 821118 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76961&oldid=76832 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+90) 10Fish and starfish! > 1598605110 987757 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76962&oldid=76956 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (-18) 10 < 1598605676 952830 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1598605736 225912 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76963&oldid=76790 5* 03Orisphera 5* (-3) 10/* The language */ > 1598605779 353505 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76964&oldid=76963 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+3) 10/* Hello, World! */ > 1598605860 48894 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76965&oldid=76964 5* 03Orisphera 5* (+50) 10/* Infinite loop */ > 1598605878 680159 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Ix14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76966&oldid=76965 5* 03Orisphera 5* (-56) 10/* Infinite loop */ < 1598605889 216341 :ByFate\`!~sedx_drea@49.145.197.51 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598606164 780969 :ByFate\`!~sedx_drea@49.145.197.51 QUIT :Quit: pls buy at my indecent blog https://bit.ly/385Z1qS > 1598607896 589389 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76967&oldid=76957 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+9) 10/* Cat program */ > 1598608216 968068 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76968&oldid=76967 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+5) 10/* Truth-machine */ > 1598608279 697020 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76969&oldid=76968 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+0) 10/* Counter */ < 1598608522 220186 :kspalaiologos!~root@206.ip-51-91-102.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598608556 179487 :kspalaiologos!~root@206.ip-51-91-102.eu QUIT :Client Quit < 1598608571 535422 :gitlogger!~gitlogger@206.ip-51-91-102.eu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598615170 328910 :atslash!~atslash@static.231.107.9.5.clients.your-server.de QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1598616081 862391 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76970&oldid=76962 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+410) 10 < 1598616191 695421 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 < 1598616780 505106 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :FYI: I worked out two non-monadic prime sieve examples, one with streams and one with continuations/callbacks: https://github.com/egel-lang/egel/blob/master/examples/sieve.eg https://github.com/egel-lang/egel/blob/master/examples/sieveK.eg < 1598616788 59890 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am actually quite pleased with the yield. > 1598617449 351057 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76971 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+2315) 10This text is on the bottom of history. < 1598618303 842600 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598618506 611984 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598618798 983902 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598619221 440739 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76972 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+203) 10Created page with "Everyone knows [[!@#$%^&*()_+]], but no love for Commata? Where's the second collabration effort? ~~~~" < 1598619263 817067 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598619296 679813 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76973&oldid=76972 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (-1) 10 > 1598619349 517048 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76974&oldid=76973 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+18) 10 < 1598619632 183418 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric > 1598619938 981380 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76975&oldid=76974 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+224) 10Answer: I am doing it. < 1598620684 93729 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursa1 < 1598620709 992312 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric > 1598621083 20680 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76976&oldid=76975 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+183) 10 > 1598621341 552264 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76977&oldid=76976 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+202) 10... < 1598621585 558993 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com JOIN :#esoteric > 1598623546 715993 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76978&oldid=76977 5* 03TwilightSparkle 5* (+158) 10 > 1598624026 527372 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76979 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+657) 10Its just the start! > 1598624105 638214 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76980&oldid=76970 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+86) 10 > 1598624110 904244 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76981&oldid=76978 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+122) 10PUBLICATION ALERT! < 1598624438 728617 :uplime!nchambers@learnprogramming/staff/nchambers JOIN :#esoteric < 1598624563 247519 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598625261 734747 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76982 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+17) 10Created page with "you can talk here" > 1598627336 704221 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76983&oldid=76979 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1466) 10,,, commands part 1 < 1598627677 248929 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598629286 352745 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598630314 682940 :cpressey!~cpressey@79-72-202-192.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 1.9.1 > 1598631293 154116 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76984&oldid=76983 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1532) 10,,, commands part 2 < 1598631590 960825 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598632573 753994 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598632801 873861 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.39.129.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598633050 354374 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598633105 68205 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1598633131 453999 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598634100 943210 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598634145 345364 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598634193 154037 :sebbu!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598634210 200137 :stux!stux2@grid9.quadspeedi.net QUIT :Quit: Aloha! < 1598634265 306556 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598634265 452496 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598634285 305193 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598634318 447174 :erdic!~erdic@unaffiliated/motley JOIN :#esoteric < 1598634373 745858 :stux!stux2@grid9.quadspeedi.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598634387 359838 :rain1!~My_user_n@unaffiliated/rain1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598635245 60353 :LKoen!~LKoen@81.255.219.130 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598637210 807122 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-41.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric > 1598638188 390870 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Categorial14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=76985 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+5135) 10!!! > 1598638348 491286 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Categorial14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76986&oldid=76985 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (-58) 10 < 1598638378 584071 :aaaaaa!~ArthurStr@nat-pool-13-124.soborka.net QUIT :Quit: leaving > 1598638538 408955 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76987&oldid=76982 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+127) 10 > 1598638961 35175 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Osmarks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76988&oldid=76092 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+215) 10 > 1598639053 641982 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76989&oldid=76987 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+51) 10 > 1598639098 252715 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76990&oldid=76989 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+82) 10 > 1598639196 35980 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Challenger514]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76991&oldid=70529 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+189) 10 > 1598639418 528776 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76992&oldid=76990 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+227) 10 > 1598639503 839501 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76993&oldid=76992 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+102) 10 > 1598639587 515343 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Osmarks14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76994&oldid=76988 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+26) 10 > 1598639776 872658 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76995&oldid=76984 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10-_- > 1598640610 702489 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76996&oldid=76981 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+8) 10link... > 1598641285 220455 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76997&oldid=76993 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (-512) 10Replaced content with "this is here ~~~~" > 1598642116 492826 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76998&oldid=76995 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1955) 10,,, commands: The Finale > 1598642284 328287 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=76999&oldid=76998 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+14) 10Stretched the introduction a bit. > 1598642402 623324 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Heavpoot14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77000&oldid=76107 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (-1096) 10 > 1598642457 219081 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77001&oldid=76999 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+97) 10A bit more expansion! > 1598642565 157426 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77002&oldid=76997 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+176) 10 > 1598642758 866733 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Abyxlrz14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77003&oldid=77002 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+90) 10 > 1598642975 615358 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77004&oldid=77001 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+187) 10Some categories... < 1598643481 917246 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.39.129.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds > 1598646144 915276 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Categorial14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=77005 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+96) 10Created page with "categories. ~~~~" > 1598646173 815950 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Categorial14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77006&oldid=76986 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+0) 10 > 1598646616 2367 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07MediaWiki talk:Common.js14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77007&oldid=66830 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+162) 10 < 1598649367 657648 :sebbu2!~sebbu@unaffiliated/sebbu NICK :sebbu > 1598649650 499052 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77008&oldid=76928 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+64) 10 > 1598650148 359524 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=77009 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+2029) 10anyone can edit this page, so feel free to do so. > 1598650491 461755 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77010&oldid=77009 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+122) 10 < 1598652130 805875 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:e07c:1068:1328:75c3 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598652349 369317 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598654160 86414 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77011&oldid=77010 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+89) 10 > 1598654312 109213 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77012&oldid=77011 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+6) 10 < 1598654919 45363 :Heavpoot!5284d81e@82-132-216-30.dab.02.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598654923 387030 :Heavpoot!5284d81e@82-132-216-30.dab.02.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello. > 1598655617 869031 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77013&oldid=77012 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+805) 10/* Language specifications */ > 1598655723 860997 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77014&oldid=77013 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+1) 10Fixed typo. > 1598655789 881848 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77015&oldid=77014 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+1) 10Minor formatting adjustment. < 1598656722 962668 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598657114 401496 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77016&oldid=77015 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+36) 10 < 1598657412 31495 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598657447 733932 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1598657470 442362 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77017&oldid=77016 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+321) 10 < 1598657472 22418 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric > 1598657743 925448 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77018&oldid=77017 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (-826) 10/* To be improved */ < 1598657842 561936 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598658103 476693 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1598659154 487895 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598659287 461272 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77019&oldid=77018 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (-138) 10 > 1598659316 686039 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:1CP=1ICL14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=77020 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+108) 10Created page with "dont be soundofspouting ~~~~" < 1598659629 718795 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598660200 695187 :t20kdc!~20kdc@cpc139340-aztw33-2-0-cust225.18-1.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1598664765 162683 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:1CP=1ICL14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77021&oldid=77020 5* 03SoundOfScripting 5* (+124) 10* do > 1598665316 743428 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77022&oldid=77019 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+150) 10 > 1598665382 813626 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77023&oldid=77022 5* 03Heavpoot 5* (+3) 10 < 1598667831 577538 :Heavpoot!5284d81e@82-132-216-30.dab.02.net QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598668811 90370 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598668935 303965 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Generic data structures in Zig are just compile-time functions, and I think my brain broke < 1598669900 286120 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598671112 738512 :kkd!~memxor@unaffiliated/kartikeya JOIN :#esoteric < 1598672325 457606 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598672613 501308 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1598675769 378385 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: whoa, what's going on in SATland? < 1598675839 312046 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: huh? < 1598675847 52297 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't remember what I last said about my solver. I added (very simple) clause deletion, and Luby restarts, and it actually became reasonably fast on some inputs. < 1598675886 992794 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But it sounds like your solver is way fancier and also world-famous now. < 1598675943 407747 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not famous at all, it's good enough to be practically useful but it's not state of the art stuff < 1598675967 699105 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but a somewhat well known rust person started using it (for some not (yet?) public project) < 1598676005 555866 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and that person seems to have quite a few followers on github, so now the traffic on my project suddenly increased < 1598676129 166419 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha. < 1598676252 835799 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should get back to working on it. < 1598676263 142150 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so do I... < 1598676275 414563 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I want to rewrite half of it... again < 1598676277 830198 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It got more fun when I stopped using random instances and started using real instances. < 1598676286 708806 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598676291 684256 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should pick a good representative set of instances to be testing on. < 1598676337 396470 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah first that makes it more fun.... but then you realize you need a good way to benchmark stuff and that's another rabbit hole < 1598676354 605261 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, definitely trickier than I thought. < 1598676368 293494 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 265 seconds < 1598676368 876935 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598676560 151647 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's it being used for? < 1598676604 695521 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or is the project unknown? < 1598676605 779925 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I wonder whether I should improve my SAT solver or try figuring out how SMT solvers work. < 1598676777 509927 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :unknown, but he commented on an open issue related to timeouts and mentioned that he added cancellation from another thread and asked whether I'd be interested in merging something like that < 1598676814 705679 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :where he mentioned that he's using it in an interactive setting... and IIRC he recently started working on games, so that'd be my guess < 1598676821 390341 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Aha, the Io person. < 1598676836 986897 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :My friend was using a SAT solver to design levels in a puzzle game. < 1598676844 420181 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :Io? < 1598676857 245628 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://canonical.org/~kragen/raph-io.html < 1598676966 800894 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: For my own solver, instead of a timeout, I was thinking of adding a more iterator-like API for the solver loop. < 1598677002 261358 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I guess for a SAT solver it's pretty simple, if it looks like a classic CDCL solver. < 1598677069 166787 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I also thought about that, (for the same reason, it's somewhat natural given the CDCL loop), but I do want to offer convenience APIs for a) callback based termination to match the IPASIR api and b) cancellation from a different thread using an atomic bool as flag and c) timeouts without requiring a second thread < 1598677110 72892 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :The loop looks like while (1) { unit_propagation(); if (conflict) { if (level == 0) return false; backtrack(); } else { if (all_assigned) return true; guess(); } }, right? < 1598677127 131088 :Arcorann__!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598677129 681471 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where most time is spent in unit propagation. < 1598677145 805346 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes, makes sense that you've had the same thought. < 1598677169 194628 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :What puzzle game levels are designing by SAT solver? < 1598677170 801079 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :well there are also restarts but roughly like that < 1598677171 176850 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Convenience APIs seem good to provide, but as the core API I think something like this is much nicer. < 1598677192 783487 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was already getting into more detail than I meant to. < 1598677232 820937 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Really I should have said while (1) { /* something that takes a relatively long time */ }. I was just trying to remember how it worked. < 1598677265 907222 :glowcoil_!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fyvfdbrycpraeptr JOIN :#esoteric < 1598677272 345968 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :more like while (1) { /* something that takes a short amount of time, but you need to do it many, many, many times */ } < 1598677273 348088 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: It's still a secret game unfortunately. < 1598677294 545955 :glowcoil!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dhcjquwfwkpxzkce QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598677294 697379 :Arcorann_!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598677294 945871 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598677295 48885 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598677295 48941 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598677295 213674 :glowcoil_!sid3405@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fyvfdbrycpraeptr NICK :glowcoil < 1598677302 731055 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess the thing I was wondering was whether having an API boundary there would have a performance impact. < 1598677311 472072 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I doubt it. < 1598677317 775607 :ocharles!sid30093@musicbrainz/user/ocharles JOIN :#esoteric < 1598677355 443020 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :so returning after each conflict should be perfectly safe (in my solver and IIRC many others)finding a conflict is a sub-loop) < 1598677361 498745 :sftp!~sftp@unaffiliated/sftp JOIN :#esoteric < 1598677385 534997 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :returning each time after running unit propagation to completion, I'm not quite sure < 1598677413 820722 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure, unit propagation + handling the conflict sort of goes together. < 1598677439 555746 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though I guess it doesn't have to, you can just save your state. < 1598677472 237605 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah but I meant if you need multiple guesses to find a conflict, returning inbetween might not be a good idea performance wise < 1598677497 756792 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if returning implies you're going to check termination criteria and potentially other stuff that could slow down things) < 1598677529 700364 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but I haven't tested that at all, I just know you're pretty safe doing that after a conflict given all the other stuff that happens anyway for a conflict < 1598677612 366351 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :whoa, I just looked up IPASIR, I didn't know about this at all. < 1598677685 691789 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I always end up needing functionallity outside of that API, sometimes supported by solver specific APIs... but often enough not even that, even though it wouldn't be too hard to add it < 1598677717 587770 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's too bad it's callback-based. Callback APIs aren't fun when you can avoid them. < 1598677729 339822 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :And you should certainly be able to, for something like this. < 1598677748 513488 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's inteded to be easy to add to existing solvers, and callbacks make that easier < 1598677764 248682 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Fair enough. < 1598677786 862050 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :for a lot of uses you don't even need any of the callback APIs though < 1598677821 975289 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just being able to add new clauses without deleting the clause database is presumably most of the incrementality people need. < 1598677839 81806 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah that and solving under assumptions < 1598677874 800199 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, how do assumptions work? I guess that just means adding things to the trail? < 1598677907 258182 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah it's exactly just that, you fix a prefix on the trail and if you'd backtrack beyond that you return unsat (under assumptions) < 1598677933 332624 :olsner!~salparot@c80-217-180-83.bredband.comhem.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1598677940 415174 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was briefly wondering whether you'd learn wrong clauses that way but of course you wouldn't. < 1598677971 116730 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :from the conflict analysis you do to detect that you'd backtrack beyond that you also get a subset of assumptions causing the conflict for free (which is also part of the IPASIR api) < 1598678007 547839 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, that's nice. > 1598678027 570343 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User talk:Challenger514]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77024&oldid=76991 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+107) 10 > 1598678062 740470 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:Challenger514]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77025&oldid=76950 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+16) 10 < 1598678090 358706 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you know if SMT solvers need more of an API than this? < 1598678112 181520 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :it depends AFAIK < 1598678138 211368 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not knowing much about what is SMT solvers, I don't know really > 1598678150 318692 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Aubergine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77026&oldid=74883 5* 03Challenger5 5* (+95) 10 < 1598678180 52985 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :you don't need more than that for CDCL(T) or for bitblasting AFAICT < 1598678218 239942 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :but if you want to do eager theory propagation (not sure if that's an established term) you need a way to hook into unit propagation < 1598678233 755554 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have no idea how much that is done or if it is important at all < 1598678296 42110 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just a few minutes ago I found and corrected a bug in TeXnicard involving division by zero when the total available vertical space is rigid, resulting in alternating lines of text being displayed and hidden. < 1598679575 776820 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598679882 783923 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1598680630 410110 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :zzo38: Do you like SAT solvers? < 1598680871 107986 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: I do not know much about SAT solvers. < 1598680887 348335 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :(If I knew, maybe I would be able to answer your other questions too, but I don't know.) < 1598680897 275694 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Do you like graph coloring solvers? < 1598680936 616239 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :they are more logic solver systems than one might expect and they are competing against themselves quite regularly < 1598681113 754007 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm, maybe I should actually learn about integer programming solvers. I hear they're pretty good.. < 1598681116 727754 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :s/.$// < 1598681138 972799 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plus I don't even really know about linear programming. < 1598681159 492769 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :a friend of mine writes a mip solver in his spare time to optimize his factorio world < 1598681185 423941 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :linear programming is not that hard, really < 1598681270 815770 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: as you already know how SAT solvers work, learning about MIP will make you annoyed that SAT solvers are bad at what MIP solvers are good at and that MIP solvers are bad at what SAT solvers are good at (well, at least it does that for me) < 1598681275 161966 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :integer programms make it quite a bit harder < 1598681312 599093 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :and apparently it's difficult enough to combine them in a way that gets the advantages of both < 1598681327 141060 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :iirc linear programms are in P < 1598681335 36697 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: That was my impression. Well, I really only know one direction, in seeing some problems that MIP solvers are good at and SAT solvers are bad at. < 1598681345 176095 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :But I heard it went both ways. < 1598681372 167289 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a lot more industrial use of MIP, I think? < 1598681398 833659 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah I think so < 1598681413 102882 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :even for problems where SAT or SMT solvers would be better < 1598681430 808061 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not that surprising, SAT solvers only decide, MIP solvers optimize < 1598681470 631826 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :myname: that's not really a distinction that matters though, if you can do one you can do the other, in theory as well as in practice < 1598681491 174526 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :now it might be that it works in theory but is too slow in practice, but with incremental SAT solvers optimizing is also fast in practice < 1598681493 674756 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: well, at additional cost, yeah < 1598681554 600794 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :and you have to state your problem in such a way that you can make good guesses about what change in the corresponding sat problem < 1598681598 415138 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not having seen graph coloring solvers, I don't really know. But at least I can understand a bit of what is meant, I suppose. How difficult are they to solve, though? < 1598681629 571056 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :graph coloring is NP complete < 1598681639 901107 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :so i guess it's about as hard as SAT solvers < 1598681694 319195 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :O, OK. < 1598681741 379443 :Hooloovo0!Hooloovoo@sorunome.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :to be fair, a lot more work has been put into sat sovlers, I think, and polynomial time is... well theoretically not that bad but in practice it can get pretty bad < 1598681851 734247 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yes, depending on the algorithm and how much data, it can be, considering, there are many kind of polynomials, some of which are big. < 1598681853 170955 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, we had a lecture on algorithms to solve euclidean tsp that aren't really worth attempting with real data sets, if you could just brute-force < 1598682087 454880 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598684501 453630 :tromp!~tromp@2a02:a210:ca3:2800:b531:aeb2:5015:9484 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598684652 975485 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just now I found the new documentation about the schema table for SQLite, and about the new name "sqlite_schema" instead of "sqlite_master". I knew about this before from the Fossil timeline. I am glad that "For historical reasons, callbacks from the sqlite3_set_authorizer() interface always refer to the schema table using names (1) or (3)" because that is the part that I was concerned about. < 1598684669 365907 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, good, now my concern has been considered, so it is OK now. < 1598685413 928297 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :How should I choose which learnt clauses to delete? < 1598685419 49926 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Right now I just delete the longest ones. < 1598685431 402533 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :Also, how should I store watch lists? < 1598686361 436635 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unfortunately, I don't know. Hopefully, we can learn which way is good. < 1598687397 326473 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: the classic approach (used by minisat and probably solvers before it) uses clause activities, glucose added LBDs (aka as clause glues or glue levels) as a metric for that, chanseok oh's solvers added a strategy that partitions learned clauses into 3 tiers and uses activities and LBDs and whether they've been part of a conflict recently (IIRC it's been a time) and that's the state of the < 1598687399 553602 :jix!~jix@static.71.5.69.159.clients.your-server.de PRIVMSG #esoteric :art unless something changed in the past 1.5 years < 1598688626 412529 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598688743 909663 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598690306 438606 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77027&oldid=77004 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-46) 10I am going to talk about this later. > 1598690376 967186 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77028&oldid=77027 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-83) 10And this too. < 1598692243 99565 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-12-41.catv.broadband.hu QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1598692345 507290 :Sgeo_!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598692705 157792 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds > 1598693407 747513 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77029&oldid=77028 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+490) 10Introducing IO! < 1598694753 969372 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dfvtdkdugtqnlyts JOIN :#esoteric < 1598696120 540612 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598696168 583171 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :spruit: what does "non-monadic" mean in that context? < 1598696792 172172 :hendursa1!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598696819 403503 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598697109 359672 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :wth just how many ways can you spell fairy in English? "fairy, fairie, faerie, færie, faery, fae, fey, fay"; plus any of those suffixed with " folk" and "fair folk" apparently < 1598697129 140381 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :they're worse than djinns > 1598697536 942032 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[0711001000010011011001014]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77030&oldid=74384 5* 03Stasoid 5* (+4) 10 > 1598699943 996694 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77031&oldid=77029 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+720) 10Introducing DATA TYPES! < 1598702537 805394 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598702981 956267 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga QUIT :Quit: hendursaga < 1598702997 867861 :hendursaga!~weechat@gateway/tor-sasl/hendursaga JOIN :#esoteric < 1598703863 784535 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598704328 599900 :S_Gautam!uid286066@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dfvtdkdugtqnlyts QUIT :Quit: Connection closed for inactivity < 1598705479 447552 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598705980 312483 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1598706009 747137 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric > 1598706619 124850 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77032&oldid=77031 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+731) 10Introducing CONTROL FLOW! > 1598706692 873040 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77033&oldid=77032 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Emphasizing 'if'. > 1598706846 281390 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77034&oldid=77033 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+95) 10Introducing I! < 1598707003 886350 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598709571 874761 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric > 1598711078 995013 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77035&oldid=76960 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+76) 10 > 1598711375 545482 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77036&oldid=76961 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+101) 10 < 1598713300 988868 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598713483 890112 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598714537 759570 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 PRIVMSG #esoteric :`pbflist https://pbfcomics.com/comics/obscenery/ < 1598714539 196750 :HackEso!~h@unaffiliated/fizzie/bot/hackeso PRIVMSG #esoteric :pbflist https://pbfcomics.com/comics/obscenery/: shachaf Sgeo quintopia ion b_jonas Cale > 1598714570 782931 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77037&oldid=77034 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+666) 10Introducing PROGRAMS! > 1598714631 281070 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Modulous14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77038&oldid=76980 5* 03Abyxlrz 5* (+150) 10 > 1598715121 687435 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77039&oldid=77037 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+181) 10Introducing EXTERNAL RESOURCES! < 1598715965 517742 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598716247 154741 :wib_jonas!25bf3cd1@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.37.191.60.209 QUIT :Quit: Connection closed > 1598716378 331197 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77040&oldid=77039 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+23) 10Introducing REDIRECTS! > 1598716404 614165 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77041&oldid=77040 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-23) 10Wait what? > 1598716563 487850 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Commata14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=77042 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+17) 10Redirection fora golfing language. > 1598716659 876798 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77043&oldid=77041 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Capitalization: The beginnings > 1598716705 817362 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77044&oldid=77043 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+4) 10Link to the esolang page > 1598716860 4470 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77045&oldid=77044 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+133) 10A bit more clarification. < 1598716866 985034 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1598716887 408645 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric > 1598716888 681269 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77046&oldid=77045 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+9) 10Grammar Fix > 1598717000 410008 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77047&oldid=77046 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+45) 10Space is a nop! > 1598717085 670049 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77048&oldid=77047 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10Actually, these 'nops' do have a purpose. < 1598717165 125778 :Arcorann__!~awych@121-200-5-186.79c805.syd.nbn.aussiebb.net QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1598717435 896631 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Language list14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77049&oldid=77008 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+10) 10,,, Joins the battle! > 1598717918 2278 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77050&oldid=77048 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+57) 10Bit more ClaRiFiCaTion. > 1598717980 531021 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77051&oldid=77050 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-83) 10AHH MY FOCUS > 1598718096 479396 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77052&oldid=77051 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+11) 10ClArIfIcAtIoN > 1598718135 673378 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77053&oldid=77052 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10... > 1598718180 563764 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07,,,14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77054&oldid=77053 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+0) 10.:.:. < 1598719593 721222 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 JOIN :#esoteric < 1598719659 775540 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 QUIT :Ping timeout: 258 seconds < 1598719763 746064 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1598721027 178653 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.39.129.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esoteric < 1598721778 250786 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu JOIN :#esoteric < 1598724163 908951 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Ping timeout: 240 seconds < 1598724361 314206 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos JOIN :#esoteric < 1598724698 964321 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@ool-18b982ad.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598725041 931524 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu < 1598725285 891830 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1598725939 616455 :kritixilithos!~kritixili@gateway/tor-sasl/kritixilithos QUIT :Quit: quit < 1598726502 119614 :adu!~arobbins@c-76-111-99-194.hsd1.md.comcast.net QUIT :Quit: adu > 1598726700 394839 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77055&oldid=76971 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+143) 10Something more... > 1598726994 699189 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07QuineLang14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77056&oldid=69523 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+8) 10When creating articles, it is good to write them in 3rd-person perspective. :) > 1598727272 760462 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77057&oldid=77055 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-175) 10I guess this sentence is not needed. > 1598727345 289371 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77058&oldid=77023 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+199) 10 > 1598727510 21954 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77059&oldid=77057 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+152) 10A bit more stuff about esolangs. > 1598727550 176195 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77060&oldid=77059 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (-10) 10Aw man > 1598727622 870203 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[071CP=1ICL14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77061&oldid=77058 5* 03Osmarks 5* (+79) 10 > 1598727705 394750 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77062&oldid=77060 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+48) 10More... MORE! > 1598727757 646605 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07User:SunnyMoon14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77063&oldid=77062 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+1) 10OH NOES < 1598728065 523852 :imode!~linear@unaffiliated/imode JOIN :#esoteric < 1598728460 296828 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :another homepage where if the browser window isn't very wide, then essential links are hidden. I was searching for how to log in. > 1598728640 962284 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77064&oldid=77035 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+30) 10,,, < 1598729074 149465 :arseniiv!~arseniiv@94.41.39.129.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1598729076 451750 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: Non-monadic in the sense that you don't use an explicit structure like the monad from Haskell? < 1598729201 165829 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :spruit11: ok, though I don't understand how that would apply to a prime sieve < 1598729343 220737 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's surprising that this is possible: https://tomas.rokicki.com/logic_puzzle.html < 1598729346 461654 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :"You can use any number of 'and' and 'or' gates, with any number of inputs each, but only two 'not' gates. You must build a circuit that computes for inputs A, B, and C, the three separate values not A, not B, and not C." < 1598729423 200761 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :huh, interesting < 1598729429 453952 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :i will think about that < 1598729488 194224 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it possible? i would assume it works with stuff similar two the variable switch without a temporary one < 1598729552 562092 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is possible. < 1598729563 837428 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: hmm < 1598729594 282604 :shachaf!~shachaf@unaffiliated/shachaf PRIVMSG #esoteric :I have a computer-found solution but I'm not sure I understand how it works entirely. < 1598729606 747858 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: let me think about that one < 1598729726 260014 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I know there's some easy description of functions that you can build from just & and | gates, IIRC think a function can be built that way iff it is monotonous, gives 0 for all-0 input, and gives 1 for all-1 input. < 1598729752 416418 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds about right < 1598729856 743500 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :b_jonas: My language is eager. So the 'standard' Haskell short definition of a prime sieve doesn't work. < 1598729899 947784 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :There are ways to deal with that. I listed two manners which mimic lazy lists. > 1598729940 590282 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Esolang talk:Categorization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77065&oldid=74234 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+663) 10/* Subcategories for the Non-Textual category. */ new section < 1598730112 714464 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :The manner which I didn't list would be to use monads to model lazy behavior in an eager language. < 1598730125 729821 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am trying to avoid that. < 1598730432 131380 :myname!~myname@ks300980.kimsufi.com PRIVMSG #esoteric :shachaf: is your computer-found solution a boolean function or a circuit? < 1598730747 114872 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah I see < 1598730808 917247 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would not specifically think of monads to avoid lazyness, just of a list-like iterator interface < 1598730839 950812 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :or possibly the caching style a lazy list, since that's what you need for a prime sieve < 1598731060 446135 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, but iterators fit into monads too. If you want it. < 1598731112 582941 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :If you have any other possible solutions I would be very interested. < 1598731212 739661 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, but just the monad interface isn't really enough here < 1598731250 696314 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I don't even see why it would really help much < 1598731294 423202 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the (>>=) method for lists is mapConcat, but you just need a filter, which is a special case of that, plus you need to iterate on the list of divisors and stop when they grow too large, for which monads don't really help < 1598731370 287068 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looks like we have tangent thoughts on this. > 1598731491 765859 PRIVMSG #esoteric :14[[07Talk:Truth-machine14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=77066&oldid=38410 5* 03SunnyMoon 5* (+315) 10/* Is it possible to add "psuedo-truth-machines"? */ new section < 1598731654 81530 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, ideally I should try to read your code and write the sieve with lazy lists like I thought, to make this clearer, but right now I'm busy with some stupid webpage < 1598731705 774944 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a webpage where I ordered something and want to order more, but I'm trying to write a userstyle to make the important control link visible, it's currently hidden by some stupid HTML+CSS thing that sets a height too small < 1598731725 423960 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :and no, changing the height isn't enough, because then it overlaps something else < 1598731789 479990 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't understand why this user CSS rule doesn't match this element < 1598731875 886160 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Did you check its effects in the inspector? (At least, that is what I did.) < 1598731905 494577 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes, that's what I'm trying to do < 1598731972 688550 :spruit11!~unknown@86-82-44-193.fixed.kpn.net PRIVMSG #esoteric :For if you change your mind. https://github.com/egel-lang/egel/blob/master/examples/sieve.eg https://github.com/egel-lang/egel/blob/master/examples/sieveK.eg < 1598732010 240407 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, what I think would be useful to have "meta-CSS" which is only usable in user CSS codes and cannot be specified by the web page author, and can be used for making selections based on other CSS commands, setting priorities differently, etc. < 1598732041 444533 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-192.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esoteric :the inspector says `