> 1622764833 778379 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Counting Calculus14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83942&oldid=83939 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+54) 10Categorize > 1622764952 269634 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Salpynx/Braneflage14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83943&oldid=83941 5* 03Salpynx 5* (+2) 10/* Program Commands */ that looks better. Hopefully it's correct too. < 1622766052 838772 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e how does Wuste Ebenen translate? https://i.imgur.com/vbqqJtI.png < 1622766117 857423 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :Wüste = desert, Ebene(n) = plain(s) < 1622766213 869153 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :because there is a obscene word Ebenya meaning "something fucking far/disconnected", that is traditionally considered made out of such word as "ebat'" "fuck", "zaebenit" "fucking make smth"; but now seeing the word "Ebenen" on the map I'm thinking that the etymology is not like people use think < 1622766282 472728 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :hah, cool, because that's exactly how another map says: https://i.imgur.com/9D72Uk2.png < 1622766723 700266 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :ah so it's similar to the English term "bumfuck" / "bumfuck nowhere"? < 1622766731 312012 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :Wiktionary says that "ебать" is protoslav "*jěbati" and is the same in Serbian, Czheh, Slovak, Pol; and is related to sanskrít . यभति (yabhati) and ancient greek. οἴφω, οἰφέω; but now I don't believe Wiktionary that ебеня is from there, because it's too close to your word < 1622766801 251547 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :found one reference to the russian word on twitter https://twitter.com/cybersandwitch/status/1285193689732718593 < 1622766811 874375 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :i actually have a dead-tree book of photos of soviet bus stops < 1622766818 482136 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :what Wiktionary says on German Ebene: From Middle High German ebene, from Old High German ebanī, from Proto-Germanic *ebnaz, whence also Old English efen (English even), Old Norse jafn. < 1622766821 238575 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :i saw it at a bookstore and was immediately like yes I need this < 1622766868 884185 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :keegan how do I see the parent tweet? < 1622766985 166925 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :either I'm idiot in twitter or it's deleted ( < 1622767369 797776 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :in C, do we know what format __DATE__ will have after year 10000? I want to use it to give a likely branch hint in a date formatting routine so that before 9995 or so the branch that writes a four digit year is considered likely, but after 10000 the branch that writes a five digit year is considered likely instead < 1622767421 330434 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :nakilon: https://twitter.com/ItsDanThomas/status/1284808430167957504 < 1622767443 993670 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :b_jonas: excellent idea < 1622767471 661719 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I guess I could just have something in the build script that detects the date instead and defines macros accordingly, and then test those macros instead of __DATE__ < 1622767483 682545 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :yes, this is the book I have https://twitter.com/ItsDanThomas/status/1285306157645660161 (vol 2 only) < 1622767504 306206 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :keegan heh you'll never find such stops < 1622767838 391687 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :I admire your long-term planning b_jonas < 1622767899 728417 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :nakilon: I mean, I probably won't < 1622767904 488134 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :because I'm unlikely to visit Russia any time soon < 1622767912 257484 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :these blogs posts copypasting these images made it impossible to google real examples lol < 1622767916 786163 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :heh < 1622767960 531231 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Preprocessor Macro of the Long Now. < 1622768082 741599 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :keegan this is a little bit closer to reality https://www.goingthewholehogg.com/soviet-bus-stops/ < 1622768130 646213 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :but really it's just 1-3 walls with a roof and maybe a little piece of mosaic < 1622768147 412071 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :real bus stop just won't be photographed and posted in web < 1622768205 163941 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :and it would be by magnitude harder to find soviet one in Russia than in Ukraine or maybe Moldova < 1622768273 98330 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :I see < 1622768380 911516 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh nice, the Yandex Images search is expectedly more relevant and shows some real things instead of just top-10 blog articles: https://yandex.ru/images/search?text=%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%8F%20%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BA%D0%B0%20%D0%B2%20%D0%B5%D0%B1%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%8F%D1%85 < 1622768424 242201 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :this is it: https://yandex.ru/images/search?pos=74&p=1&img_url=https%3A%2F%2Fi7.photo.2gis.com%2Fimages%2Fgeo%2F0%2F30258560046534811_308c.jpg&text=%D1%81%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%82%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B0%D1%8F+%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D0%BA%D0%B0+%D0%B2+%D0%B5%D0%B1%D0%B5%D0%BD%D1%8F%D1%85&rpt=simage < 1622768444 218701 :pikhq!sid394595@user/pikhq PRIVMSG #esolangs :keegan: well there's a subject i didn't realize i was interested in but i absolutely am now < 1622768445 15040 :pikhq!sid394595@user/pikhq PRIVMSG #esolangs ::3 < 1622768529 989517 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :and there are all Ukrainian as I see https://bugaga.ru/jokes/1146723770-sdelano-v-sssr-avtobusnye-ostanovki.html < 1622772580 995670 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :heh, about privacy: 5 years ago here https://www.google.com/chrome/browser/desktop/ there was a Chrome, i.e. not a Google Chrome but almost a Chromium, that is almost without telemetry and stuff; but now it's Google Chrome there, and the FreeSMUG project was closed in 2020 too < 1622772753 950598 :dyeplexer!~dyeplexer@user/dyeplexer JOIN :#esolangs < 1622772940 855842 :dyeplexer!~dyeplexer@user/dyeplexer QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1622773656 236133 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esolangs :I write software without telemetry; the telemetry is a waste of energy. < 1622773802 770979 :mla!~mla@162.253.176.229 JOIN :#esolangs < 1622774898 361342 :Corbin!~Corbin@c-73-67-140-116.hsd1.or.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :Is there an esolang which is just a presentation of a Turing category? I found the language "Finite Groups", and I'm thinking of a cross between that and Cat/Kitten/Grace/etc. < 1622774924 320735 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :my QuakeLive browser extension was sending users usernames to my Spreadsheet so I knew who used it; Google didn't catch me with it < 1622777043 469320 :tiggilyboo!~tiggilybo@82-197-202-43.dsl.cambrium.nl JOIN :#esolangs < 1622777166 646708 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 264 seconds < 1622777231 686630 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN :#esolangs > 1622777879 582723 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:Polyglot14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83944&oldid=83833 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy 5* (+46) 10/* Challenge */ > 1622778130 717215 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Hello, world!14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83945&oldid=75658 5* 03ColorfulGalaxy 5* (+254) 10 < 1622778384 432265 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :wtf does kolmogorov have to do with hello world < 1622778778 98817 :Corbin!~Corbin@c-73-67-140-116.hsd1.or.comcast.net PRIVMSG #esolangs :Some numbers are more compressible than others, in the Kolmogorov sense that they can be printed out by relatively short programs. "Hello world" is a number. I think that that's all that they're thinking of. < 1622779184 796302 :tiggilyboo!~tiggilybo@82-197-202-43.dsl.cambrium.nl QUIT :Quit: tiggilyboo < 1622784367 233023 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esolangs :Do you think that this trademark license is suitable? http://sprunge.us/iagkJb < 1622786898 971019 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :cd: Hi ;-) < 1622786904 441660 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :hiii < 1622786928 104498 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :i've been (trying) to run a hb instance for a bit, damn thing's fiddly but it works < 1622786931 768835 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs ::P < 1622786940 180385 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :thought it'd be funny to see what that network makes of it < 1622786942 9777 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :congrats < 1622787326 940126 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :int-e: atm the hiccups it has are 1) I didn't fully fix the ping code so it randomly times out on pissnet (I'm tired gimmie a breakkkkk), and 2) very very rarely umlbox init hangs for no apparent reason, and I can't seem to ever repro it < 1622787364 709375 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :cd: sounds like fun < 1622787538 228200 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` mknod stall p && cat stall < 1622787548 636556 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :ACTION is curious if this is the first "oops eso broke" in a while < 1622787624 745686 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: ^ > 1622787992 634409 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83946&oldid=83881 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (-1) 10 > 1622788031 640996 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83947&oldid=83946 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (+0) 10 < 1622788038 30235 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No output. < 1622788086 462631 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh hey, a no output < 1622788089 736096 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :only uh < 1622788094 846818 :cd!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony PRIVMSG #esolangs :nearly 10min later < 1622788170 290942 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :`sleep 3600 < 1622788343 166011 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No output. < 1622788426 499355 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :generous, but not quite 10 minutes :) < 1622791884 433682 :imode!~imode@user/imode QUIT :Ping timeout: 272 seconds < 1622792450 389989 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer < 1622793515 656156 :FireFly!firefly@user/firefly CHGHOST firefly :glowbum/gluehwuermchen/Firefly < 1622794255 440568 :hendursaga!~weechat@user/hendursaga QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1622794502 460144 :hendursaga!~weechat@user/hendursaga JOIN :#esolangs < 1622796388 821895 :Thelie!~Thelie@2a02:8106:215:3300:e7ad:5ab7:4ea0:e177 JOIN :#esolangs < 1622799826 144043 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Ooh, first-ever recorded CHGHOST: https://logs.esolangs.org/libera-esolangs/2021-06-04.html#lmb < 1622799830 616272 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :And how come that takes long? Sure, it's a blocking read, but so's many other things, it should react to SIGTERM just as usual. < 1622800027 702069 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :that's just cloaking, right? had to be recorded earlier < 1622800047 550933 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It was recorded as a simulated quit-and-rejoin pair, not as a CHGHOST. < 1622800087 319023 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I just turned on the extension that allows it to report it as a single thing, is all. < 1622800098 798328 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :I see < 1622800164 809267 :FireFly!firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :lol < 1622800193 85381 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :FireFly: You made history. (Not in a very big way, but still.) < 1622800233 528216 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I vaguely remember there used to be something screwy about how umlbox handles time, maybe it's just that its notion of 30 seconds gets real skewed. < 1622800404 970956 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 1; echo a second < 1622800406 945616 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :a second < 1622800412 790933 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 2; echo two seconds < 1622800415 705879 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :two seconds < 1622800422 566394 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 4; echo four seconds < 1622800427 523590 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :four seconds < 1622800445 191460 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :That seems to check out, roughly. But last time it broke when I went for five, somehow. < 1622800452 20027 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 5; echo five seconds < 1622800464 52230 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :five seconds < 1622800476 94286 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Well, that was definitely more than 5. < 1622800480 726878 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 10; echo ten seconds < 1622800514 897624 :FireFly!firefly@glowbum/gluehwuermchen/firefly PRIVMSG #esolangs :the world's longest ten seconds < 1622800535 130646 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :...nine... < 1622800590 972326 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yeah. I wonder if it's something like, its "wall" clock only runs when there's actually CPU activity, so while a busy-loop gets terminated roughly in the allotted 30 seconds, an entirely idle wait can run for much longer. < 1622800694 788721 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :...eight... < 1622800739 567000 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Still running, but I don't have any way to tell how far it's gotten. < 1622800767 733831 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esolangs :If someone puts in a busy loop will that be enough for the sleep 10 to catch up < 1622800771 3796 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :ten seconds < 1622800789 446780 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It'd be a separate UML instance, so probably not, they should be fully independent. < 1622800802 460332 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :...seven... < 1622800852 929530 :Taneb!~Taneb@runciman.hacksoc.org PRIVMSG #esolangs :4 minutes and 51 seconds < 1622800936 455220 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :"Real-time Clock makes UML time deltas match wall clock deltas. This should normally be enabled." Says some random excerpt from an UML book from 15 years ago. < 1622800975 367710 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :I lost count. < 1622800987 5172 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :...five... < 1622800987 910594 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :;-) < 1622801290 349390 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I don't see anything relevant in the kernel config options, really. < 1622801499 559404 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :There apparently used to be an option called UML_REAL_TIME_CLOCK. But I can find no sign of it in the kernel I've got there (4.19), which might mean it's either no longer an option because it's now on by default, or it's no longer an option because it just isn't supported any more. < 1622801511 973559 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :https://cateee.net/lkddb/web-lkddb/UML_REAL_TIME_CLOCK.html says "found in Linux kernels: 2.6.9–2.6.23" which was pretty long time ago. < 1622801530 751539 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` rasel @ < 1622801532 601905 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No output. < 1622801553 935205 :nakilon!~nakilon@user/nakilon PRIVMSG #esolangs :ah it responded already < 1622801623 37966 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Fortunately timeouts don't really block other non-writing commands from going ahead, so it's not a huge deal if there's a stuck idle process for a few minutes. Still, would be nice to have time work more properly. < 1622801639 365031 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Maybe I'll just go with the cheap fix and add an external timeout. < 1622801693 141711 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :`cat ../canary < 1622801693 934385 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Why are you taking Polly down into the mine? Polly's a parrot, not a canary! And where's my cracker? < 1622801712 409274 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Although there's this whole fancy thing with the internal one, where it has a two-phase thing: after 30 seconds, it sends TERM, and then gives the process a 5-second grace period to stop cleanly before sending KILL to it. < 1622801745 148594 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :shouldn't there be a watchdog outside < 1622801789 429739 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I guess I could try to figure out how to trigger the soft timeout from the outside, and then have an even harder one (just terminate the UML kernel) if both of those fail. < 1622801873 925807 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :And of course there's the whole R/W-lock thing that we underatand well enough to make this completely blocking. < 1622801891 820297 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I mean, it still times out *eventually*. < 1622801893 902570 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :ACTION shrugs < 1622801915 378382 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :...0.23111... < 1622801936 251980 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :In case you missed it, the "10 seconds" did already finish. < 1622801967 643565 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :ah yes, I ddi < 1622801969 370225 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :did < 1622801984 328285 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :what a pity though < 1622802005 83676 :int-e!~noone@int-e.eu PRIVMSG #esolangs :but 5 minutes is a good effort < 1622802055 934535 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think I'll probably add an extra TTY to signal in the TERM and KILL timeout triggers from the outside (where I expect time probably does run in a linear fashion), and then add one more phase which just kills the UML process. That'll simplify the init too. < 1622802064 805319 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :But not now. < 1622802128 436165 :dyeplexer!~dyeplexer@user/dyeplexer JOIN :#esolangs < 1622802398 285836 :Thelie!~Thelie@2a02:8106:215:3300:e7ad:5ab7:4ea0:e177 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1622804217 442881 :dutch!~DutchIngr@user/dutch QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 3.0.1 < 1622805541 154057 :dutch!~DutchIngr@user/dutch JOIN :#esolangs > 1622805791 167976 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83948&oldid=83947 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (+0) 10 > 1622806109 405456 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83949&oldid=83948 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (+120) 10Added a link to my python interpreter > 1622806183 492031 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83950&oldid=83949 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (+4) 10Put the links into an unordered list. > 1622806244 850116 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83951&oldid=83950 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (+18) 10Added the page to the 2021 category. < 1622809405 484637 :Thelie!~Thelie@2a02:8106:215:3300:e7ad:5ab7:4ea0:e177 JOIN :#esolangs > 1622810229 344718 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07NOTE14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=83952 5* 03ResU 5* (+729) 10Created page with "NOTE is an esolang created by [[User:ResU]] in 2021. It uses one-based indexing. ==Arrays== Arrays are created like this: example = Hello, world! In this case, 1622810825 782451 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07NOTE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83953&oldid=83952 5* 03ResU 5* (+21) 10/* Commands */ > 1622811275 15852 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07NOTE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83954&oldid=83953 5* 03ResU 5* (+35) 10/* Commands */ > 1622813039 221277 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07NOTE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83955&oldid=83954 5* 03ResU 5* (+395) 10/* Examples */ > 1622813072 930059 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07NOTE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83956&oldid=83955 5* 03ResU 5* (+0) 10/* Examples */ < 1622813123 119647 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.226.66.dynamic.ufanet.ru JOIN :#esolangs > 1622813257 257026 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Rayuela14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83957&oldid=82823 5* 03Xanman12321 5* (+0) 10minor fix > 1622816437 62890 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Jumping True14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83958&oldid=83931 5* 03MathR 5* (+56) 10 > 1622816771 606463 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Jumping True14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83959&oldid=83958 5* 03MathR 5* (+17) 10 < 1622816960 46712 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN :#esolangs < 1622816971 95104 :Thelie!~Thelie@2a02:8106:215:3300:e7ad:5ab7:4ea0:e177 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1622818824 333781 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-074-060-026.092.074.pools.vodafone-ip.de QUIT :Quit: WeeChat 3.0.1 > 1622819271 725953 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:ResU14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83960&oldid=83877 5* 03ResU 5* (+15) 10 > 1622821941 512492 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Epidemic714]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83961&oldid=83624 5* 03Epidemic7 5* (-113) 10 > 1622822417 521968 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Jumping True14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83962&oldid=83959 5* 03MathR 5* (+24) 10/* External resources */ > 1622822444 814312 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[0725 bytes o:14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=83963 5* 03Epidemic7 5* (+308) 10Created page with "[[Category: Joke languages]] 25 bytes o: is an esoteric programming language designed to be as least functional as possible with the smallest compiler. To it's name, it's 25 b..." > 1622822648 118988 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[0725 bytes o:14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83964&oldid=83963 5* 03Epidemic7 5* (-5) 10 > 1622822694 884578 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[0725 bytes o:14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83965&oldid=83964 5* 03Epidemic7 5* (+68) 10 > 1622823379 23454 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07FALSE14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83966&oldid=58762 5* 03MathR 5* (+0) 10Changed "Computational Class" to "Computational class" > 1622825293 357893 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83967&oldid=83845 5* 03ResU 5* (+38) 10/* NOTE */ < 1622826612 629503 :keegan!~beehive@li521-214.members.linode.com PRIVMSG #esolangs :`coins < 1622826618 572665 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :​042ivncoin 07wilsonacoin 08q-ballendsartrecoin 09mesolammalcoin 02draysnaterreludenjarercoin 06bakcoin 13haifficidumbscoin 04owlacoin 07disorcoin 08witcoin 09lockcoin 02tsummagemoneycoin 06bincoin 13befernogcoin 04fcccoin 07thrugcoin 08fruntecoin 09cronycoin 02adedfourcoin 06uixcoin < 1622831668 67788 :dyeplexer!~dyeplexer@user/dyeplexer QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1622831708 559507 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:Categorization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83968&oldid=83270 5* 03ResU 5* (+186) 10 < 1622832677 727419 :winircuser-780!~winircuse@170.250.221.149 JOIN :#esolangs < 1622833152 113978 :winircuser-780!~winircuse@170.250.221.149 QUIT :Quit: Powered by WinIRC > 1622835596 154901 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:Categorization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83969&oldid=83968 5* 03Ais523 5* (+181) 10/* Category:No input */ [[:Category:Output only]]? < 1622836228 822206 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm, what's the standard clean C way to wait for either a child process to terminate or a file descriptor to become ready for reading, whichever happens first? I know on modern Linux there's pidfd_open, but that's Linux >= 5.3, and this should work on 4.19. Is it just "poll on the fd and rely on SIGCHLD to cause the poll to fail with EINTR"? And do I need to change the default disposition from ignore to < 1622836234 830703 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :something else for SIGCHLD to interrupt the poll? Hmm, I guess I can just try it out. > 1622836427 950676 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Deadfish14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83970&oldid=83743 5* 03Dnm 5* (+713) 10Deadfish in Rexx < 1622837545 266725 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :" Maybe I'll just go with the cheap fix and add an external timeout." => what? that's not a cheap fix, that's the proper method, because you trust the outer machine more than the inner one < 1622837572 78536 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :you can also have a timeout in the inner machine so it can prepare to shut down more properly, but it's the outer one that you rely on < 1622837669 209921 :Thelie!~Thelie@2a02:8106:215:3300:e7ad:5ab7:4ea0:e177 JOIN :#esolangs < 1622837673 942446 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: you can use signalfd if you wish < 1622837706 147946 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :or let libev or some other event loop figure out the internals and you only tell it what events you want it to wake you up for < 1622837796 347066 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It's a cheap fix in the sense that it doesn't fix the behavior of time measurement. I agree it's proper to have (also) an external timeout, but I was really just talking about the specific problem of being unable to measure time. < 1622837827 795265 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Not that I can think of any particularly important use cases for having HackEso do accurate timing. < 1622837957 7125 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :but yes, you can use signals: sigaction to set a signal handler on SIGCHLD, block the signal with sigsetmask, wait nonblocking to check child still alive, if it is then poll on filehandle which temporarily unblocks the signal without a race condition. but this kind of thing is messy, I' < 1622837969 638539 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :d rather libev handles it, at least if this is supposed to run on Linux < 1622838044 550426 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :also the incantations are different in a multithreaded program < 1622838066 13357 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It does run on Linux (though as part of init). < 1622838126 16577 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :because threads have separate per-thread signal masks, and signals can be directed to either a single thread or to the whole process, etc < 1622838146 963033 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Well, this is a single-threaded case. < 1622838223 897208 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :the alternative is to have both ends of an internal pipe or eventfd, have the signal write to that as well as to memory, and make every poll wait on its reader side, so that if the signal arrives, that poll wakes up from that, even if the signal arrives shortly before the poll call, then you needn't modify the sigprocmask < 1622838253 882607 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :this is what libev uses to allow you to wake the event loop up from what's possibly another thread of the same process < 1622838260 651811 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :(it also works from the same thread) < 1622839057 787984 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :there might be other solutions but I don't know them > 1622840435 100056 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07NOTE14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83971&oldid=83956 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (-64) 10/* Examples */ Change code to pre < 1622840643 783231 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Quit: Laa shay'a waqi'un moutlaq bale kouloun moumkine > 1622840719 678446 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:Categorization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83972&oldid=83969 5* 03ResU 5* (+187) 10 > 1622840801 38057 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Esolang talk:Categorization14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83973&oldid=83972 5* 03ResU 5* (-4) 10/* Category:No input */ < 1622840806 733816 :Melvar!~melvar@dslb-092-074-060-026.092.074.pools.vodafone-ip.de JOIN :#esolangs < 1622840894 601057 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN :#esolangs > 1622841666 818792 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Commlang14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=83974 5* 03Monochromeninja 5* (+4619) 10:) > 1622841700 841511 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Monochromeninja14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83975&oldid=81516 5* 03Monochromeninja 5* (+46) 10 < 1622842272 130948 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 3600 # this should take roughly 30 seconds < 1622842312 720525 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No output. < 1622842396 803316 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :22:31:12..22:31:52 as observed from here. That's so suspiciously close to 40 seconds, it's making me think that (unlike at home) the 30- and 35-second soft and medium-hard timeout signals did not in fact work, and only the 40-second actually-hard timeout made it stop. < 1622842503 267466 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :The way it is supposed to work now is, 30 seconds after starting the UML kernel, we write a 0 byte to one of its TTY inputs; if it hasn't terminated in 5 more seconds; we write a 1 byte; and if it *still* doesn't terminate in 5 more seconds, we send a SIGKILL to all the UML processes. < 1622842659 631159 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :And the umlbox init's "run" command handler is supposed to watch that TTY for input; if it reads a 0, it sends a SIGTERM to the running command; and if it reads a 1 (well, any non-zero byte), it just does a `reboot(LINUX_REBOOT_CMD_POWER_OFF);`, which is what it normally does to gracefully stop. < 1622842723 964748 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It does work at home, terminating at the 30-second mark. But of course it's a different system. < 1622842927 653248 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hmm. It also does terminate in exactly 10 seconds, and cleanly, if I just manually execute something like `umlbox --no-stdin --base-mounts --cwd / --timeout 10 --verbose /bin/sleep 3600` on the HackEso system. Which is very very close to the command it runs under multibot, except with a bunch of extra mounts and environment variables and resource limits. < 1622842981 995113 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Hrm. It takes 20 seconds if I omit `--verbose`. But if I omit `--verbose`, I don't know what's going on. > 1622842997 440077 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nevermind14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83976&oldid=83951 5* 03OfficialCraftCGame 5* (+9) 10 < 1622843050 351937 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Actually, maybe part of what --verbose does enables the read from that TTY. Because I used just the debugging console's "input" side, since it had no other existing purpose. < 1622843248 907063 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :The flag does change whether I issue a tcsetattr command to configure it to raw mode. Maybe it's doing some sort of terminal line buffering otherwise. > 1622843450 648719 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Alivefish14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=83977 5* 03ResU 5* (+474) 10Created page with "Alivefish was created by [[User:ResU]] in 2021. It is very similar to [[Deadfish]] and [[AEWNN]]. ==Commands== {| class=wikitable !Command !Description |- |v- |Is..." < 1622843503 373408 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Yeah, that seems plausible. I managed to actually fix it by just adding a newline after the 0 or 1. Hmm. Can't decide whether to go with that fix, or just make it use a dedicated TTY. > 1622843561 1009 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:ResU14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83978&oldid=83960 5* 03ResU 5* (+20) 10 < 1622844059 776417 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`` sleep 3600 # this should be a little closer to 30 seconds, but who knows really < 1622844095 425056 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No output. < 1622844150 835137 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :23:00:59..23:01:35 as seen from here. Hmm, that's closer to 35 seconds now, rather than 30. < 1622844200 113448 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :But `time .../umlbox --no-stdin --base-mounts --cwd / --timeout 10 /bin/sleep 3600` says 0m10.255s, which is much closer. Odd. < 1622844371 466829 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh, maybe there's something about invoking /hackenv/bin/` that makes sending SIGTERM to the primary child process (the shell?) not actually terminate the whole thing. Yeah, because we still wait for the cat (and don't send it SIGTERM in case the command had something to output), and there's bound to be some other subprocess then keeping the cat's input pipe not EOF. I bet that's it. < 1622844457 87907 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Eh, it's probably good enough. I guess I could get a little closer by making the actual command child start a new process group, and then do kill(-child, SIGTERM) instead of kill(child, SIGTERM), but I think maybe we're at the point of diminishing returns here. < 1622844616 217102 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :`perl -esleep 3600; # if that hypothesis is right, this should be closer still to 30 seconds < 1622844646 845493 :HackEso!~h@techne.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :No output. < 1622844680 519347 :fizzie!fis@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :23:10:16..23:10:46, yay. < 1622846477 121440 :arseniiv_!~arseniiv@94.41.226.66.dynamic.ufanet.ru QUIT :Ping timeout: 244 seconds < 1622847205 305600 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :fizzie: if the first signal is SIGTERM and it's delivered only to the shell, not to sleep, then it's no wonder it has no effect. you should try SIGHUP instead. < 1622847229 359887 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :or send to the whole process group, or to the foreground process group of the terminal, or to every process except init since you're shutting down the whole machine < 1622847239 225001 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :but even so send a SIGHUP after the SIGTERM\ < 1622847251 985454 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :or don't, the SIGKILL will kill everything < 1622847314 425995 :b_jonas!~x@catv-176-63-11-223.catv.broadband.hu PRIVMSG #esolangs :ah, you found the bug < 1622847495 982137 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think that it might be useful to define some new signals, such as SIGMEM (normally does nothing, but for some programming languages it might be possible for the standard library to reduce memory usage) and SIGOOM (normally terminates the process; if it isn't terminated and there still isn't enough memory, then it is forcibly terminated anyways) and SIGUSR3. < 1622847517 227931 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-14-22.public.eastlink.ca PRIVMSG #esolangs :(That is not applicable to your specific case, but still I think it might be of some use for other things) < 1622848683 751670 :Thelie!~Thelie@2a02:8106:215:3300:e7ad:5ab7:4ea0:e177 QUIT :Remote host closed the connection > 1622850506 591315 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Alivefish14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83979&oldid=83977 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+38) 10/* Commands */ Seems to have them > 1622850524 337177 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Alivefish14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83980&oldid=83979 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+23) 10/* Hello, world! */ cat > 1622850759 714110 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Truth Machine (language)14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83981&oldid=83878 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+48) 10Confused formatted cats > 1622850817 564726 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Truth-machine14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=83982&oldid=83520 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+51) 10Confusion