< 1726012802 135030 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think modern processors are slow if you use leave a value in the top half of the YMM registers and then use SSE instructions, older ones had a special case for that < 1726012820 48127 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but, modern compilers know that doing that is slow, and take care to not leave a value in the top half < 1726012878 898447 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I remember being disappointed that AVX and AVX2 don't have any multiplications bigger than a 32-to-64-bit widening multiply < 1726012898 352297 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :to be honest a lot of the newly added instructions feel weird to me, like they're there either for marketing to boost the number of mnemonics, or to help beginner programmers who don't understand enough programming to use the smaller but versatile SSE/SSE2/SSE3/SSE4_2 instruction set. not all instructions are like that, some are genuinely useful new features, just a lot of them. < 1726012903 657737 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :if I need to do 64-bit multiplies, it is not even worth vectorising, as I'd have to use the entire vector unit just to do the individual parts of the multiply < 1726012936 758884 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :b_jonas: I think they're there for marketing but for a different reason: companies paying Intel to add really specific commands that would help some particular project they're working on < 1726012943 677665 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and Intel not caring that they're useless for everyone else < 1726012948 867781 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: yes, unless you can use double float multiplications < 1726012980 234671 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: possible < 1726013004 338027 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :float multiply on integers only gives you 53 or 54 bits, right? so that's worse than 32-to-64 widening multiply unless your arguments are very unbalanced < 1726013022 117777 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(assuming a double-precision float) < 1726013024 122986 :mtm!~textual@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1726013126 241485 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: yes, but only if you want the whole integer result. sometimes you'll want only the high bits. < 1726013175 11573 :mtm!~textual@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN #esolangs mtm :Textual User < 1726013199 773371 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :though maybe that doesn't happen that often when 32 bits aren't enough and you aren't already working with double floats < 1726013424 918754 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but I think the double float multiply can be useful for geometric distorting high bit depth (between 10 and 16 bits inclusive, such as raw from camera sensor) pixmap images without losing much precision < 1726013647 282015 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(well not raw camera sensor really, but after debayering)\ < 1726013886 469093 :FreeFull!~freefull@46.205.206.114.nat.ftth.dynamic.t-mobile.pl JOIN #esolangs FreeFull :FreeFull < 1726013998 11999 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I use a keyboard with a 101/104 key style enter key at home, and a keyboard with a 102/105 key style enter key at work. You have to press enter at somewhat different places between the two. This results in me often pressing enter wrong, and *in both directions* that often results in pressing the backslash key by accident togethr with enter. This is probably the closest I have to a true "walked uphill < 1726014004 20477 :b_jonas!~x@88.87.242.184 PRIVMSG #esolangs :both ways" story. < 1726014263 837857 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hmm, the UK keyboard layout has a confusing Enter key placement, but backslash is on the entire opposite end of the keyboard < 1726014291 168009 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Return and # together occupy the space that would be occupied entirely by Return on a US keyboard < 1726014332 492475 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :although, if you press # on a keyboard that's physically a UK keyboard, but set to a US keyboard layout, you get \ (which is a little weird – I would have expected it to act as Return) < 1726017860 871033 :amby!~ambylastn@ward-15-b2-v4wan-167229-cust809.vm18.cable.virginm.net QUIT :Quit: so long suckers! i rev up my motorcylce and create a huge cloud of smoke. when the cloud dissipates im lying completely dead on the pavement < 1726019134 282530 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo PRIVMSG #esolangs :Smalltalk-72 is... interesting. It's not very Smalltalky, it's more like.... Smalltalk + fexprs or forth or... whatever allows functions to parse whatever comes next < 1726020543 898874 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1726020609 882289 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@hellomouse/dev/bowserinator QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds < 1726020614 435420 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :Ping timeout: 252 seconds > 1726020745 708632 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Unname479814]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138750&oldid=138748 5* 03Tommyaweosme 5* (+168) 10/* Move warring */ < 1726021670 454317 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN #esolangs moony :Kaylie! (she/her) < 1726021907 698483 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony QUIT :Client Quit < 1726022054 333979 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523, b_jonas: I agree with all your points. I was hoping to show wwwww that, when it comes to programming machines, you can't really set the machine to an undefined state, only a state you don't know much about. < 1726022086 963703 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Like, the entire reason why programming is so difficult is because no matter what you do, all you can really give the computer is a pile of details, each one perfectly observed. < 1726022112 927498 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Or to paraphrase the classic film Anchorman, the computer will read *exactly* what you tell it to read. < 1726024339 965976 :craigo!~craigo@user/craigo JOIN #esolangs craigo :realname < 1726024970 408517 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 QUIT :Quit: quit > 1726025082 849549 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Triforce14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138751&oldid=35497 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+77) 10Categories < 1726025443 475909 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 JOIN #esolangs Lord_of_Life :Lord < 1726025469 478255 :Lord_of_Life!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1726025526 906321 :Lord_of_Life_!~Lord@user/lord-of-life/x-2819915 NICK :Lord_of_Life < 1726028271 320557 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] ipadwwwww > 1726029083 460382 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:1L AOI14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138752&oldid=23348 5* 03Gggfr 5* (+188) 10/* No null output? */ > 1726029284 827983 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Xx14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138753&oldid=134577 5* 03Gggfr 5* (+39) 10 < 1726029355 877701 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed < 1726029474 320032 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] ipadwwwww < 1726029581 738431 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :is dis a gud esolang? https://esolangs.org/wiki/Xⁿxₙ < 1726029920 445922 :moony!moony@hellomouse/dev/moony JOIN #esolangs moony :Kaylie! (she/her) < 1726030334 98234 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed < 1726030428 320650 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] ipadwwwww < 1726031028 186400 :Bowserinator!Bowserinat@hellomouse/dev/bowserinator JOIN #esolangs Bowserinator :No VPS :( < 1726031101 350290 :iovoid!iovoid@hellomouse/dev/iovoid JOIN #esolangs iovoid :locally euclidean earth society > 1726031710 864871 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Solve for x14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138754 5* 03Gggfr 5* (+720) 10Created page with "'''Solve for x''' is a esolang that yet you cant program in. this is becuase Solve for x is a esolang that you must solve for. == properties == (from now on i will be saying x) these are the properties of x * there is only one [[Quine]] for x but infinite [[Narcissist < 1726031729 806546 :ipadwwwww!~ipadwwwww@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed < 1726031759 332375 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] wWwwW > 1726031841 344634 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Solve for x14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138755&oldid=138754 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+36) 10 < 1726032491 81103 :perlbot!~perlbot@perlbot/bot/simcop2387/perlbot QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1726032572 83037 :simcop2387!~simcop238@perlbot/patrician/simcop2387 QUIT :Ping timeout: 255 seconds < 1726032634 790942 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed < 1726033333 113886 :simcop2387!~simcop238@perlbot/patrician/simcop2387 JOIN #esolangs simcop2387 :ZNC - https://znc.in < 1726033398 96986 :perlbot!~perlbot@perlbot/bot/simcop2387/perlbot JOIN #esolangs perlbot :ZNC - https://znc.in < 1726035331 478621 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo QUIT :Read error: Connection reset by peer > 1726036580 736714 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Yayimhere14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138756&oldid=138624 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+18) 10 < 1726037941 61078 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User > 1726041377 172645 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Input hello world or else:/the file in questoin14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138757&oldid=138440 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+0) 10 > 1726041393 713669 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Ractangle 5* 10moved [[02Input hello world or else:/the file in questoin10]] to [[Input hello world or else:/the file in question]] > 1726041414 884497 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Input hello world or else:14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138760&oldid=138486 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+0) 10 < 1726041780 889506 :__monty__!~toonn@user/toonn JOIN #esolangs toonn :Unknown < 1726041840 169982 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1726042181 420510 :chiselfuse!~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse QUIT :Ping timeout: 260 seconds < 1726042292 886449 :chiselfuse!~chiselfus@user/chiselfuse JOIN #esolangs chiselfuse :chiselfuse < 1726043036 870218 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1726046946 357109 :dawids!~dawids@109.76.180.99 JOIN #esolangs * :realname > 1726047069 790445 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Tommyaweosme14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138761&oldid=138747 5* 03Unname4798 5* (+250) 10 < 1726047162 286530 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… < 1726047476 278645 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1726049124 604831 :dawids!~dawids@109.76.180.99 QUIT :Quit: Leaving > 1726051119 966192 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07How dare you fuck the brain14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138762&oldid=138738 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+59) 10/* Hello, world! */ > 1726051147 153181 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages (H-M)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138763&oldid=138732 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+59) 10/* How dare you fuck the brain */ < 1726055781 391323 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-52-143.public.eastlink.ca QUIT :Ping timeout: 276 seconds > 1726055902 338779 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Hello world program in esoteric languages (T-Z)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138764&oldid=137211 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-50) 10/* Waretel BASIC */ < 1726056234 465313 :mtm!~textual@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net QUIT :Ping timeout: 246 seconds < 1726056355 364727 :mtm!~textual@c-71-228-84-213.hsd1.fl.comcast.net JOIN #esolangs mtm :Textual User > 1726057063 623226 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Brainfuck code generation14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138765&oldid=125035 5* 03Heathcorp 5* (+17) 10Add Mastermind link to languages that compile to brainfuck < 1726057997 726676 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… > 1726059364 145667 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07How dare you fuck the brain14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138766&oldid=138762 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+73) 10/* Move data from a cell to an another cell */ > 1726059453 463532 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07A+B Problem14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138767&oldid=138407 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+90) 10/* Headache (lang that compiles to brainfuck) */ > 1726059499 770726 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07A+B Problem14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138768&oldid=138767 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-2) 10/* How dare you fuck the brain */ < 1726059828 535293 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User < 1726061347 320044 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] wWwwW < 1726061549 284235 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :can YOU solve for x? https://esolangs.org/wiki/Solve_for_x > 1726061593 51202 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Solve for x14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138769&oldid=138755 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+47) 10 > 1726061827 657198 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Solve for x14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138770&oldid=138769 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+14) 10 > 1726062055 449335 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Solve for x14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138771&oldid=138770 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+49) 10 > 1726062191 955898 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Solve for x14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138772&oldid=138771 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (-866) 10Blanked the page < 1726062204 806054 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wait im moving it > 1726062259 198378 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Ironlang14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138773&oldid=135125 5* 03Froginstarch 5* (+84) 10/* Instructions */ > 1726062333 771132 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Final Word Of The Day14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138774 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+911) 10Created page with "'''Final Word Of The Day''' is a esolang that yet you cant program in. this is becuase Solve for x is a esolang that you must solve for. it was created by [[User:Yayimhere]] == properties == (from now on i will be saying x to represent Final Word Of The D > 1726062348 897680 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Final Word Of The Day14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138775&oldid=138774 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+10) 10 > 1726062458 949121 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Yayimhere14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138776&oldid=138756 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+10) 10 < 1726062735 243471 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :can YOU solve for x? https://esolangs.org/wiki/Final_Word_Of_The_Day > 1726062912 879090 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Final Word Of The Day14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138777&oldid=138775 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+34) 10 < 1726063054 76277 :amby!~ambylastn@ward-15-b2-v4wan-167229-cust809.vm18.cable.virginm.net JOIN #esolangs amby :realname < 1726063533 15949 :craigo!~craigo@user/craigo QUIT :Remote host closed the connection < 1726064455 320489 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726064842 204592 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i wonder if anybody can tho... > 1726064993 901202 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:013414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138778&oldid=136413 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+151) 10 > 1726065013 391216 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:013414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138779&oldid=138778 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+2) 10 > 1726065046 207845 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:013414]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138780&oldid=138779 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+19) 10 < 1726065106 385082 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua QUIT :Quit: Client closed > 1726065691 149336 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fixed Repeating Output14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138781&oldid=128753 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-84) 10/* :] */ > 1726065699 401461 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fixed Repeating Output14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138782&oldid=138781 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+85) 10 > 1726065824 558827 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07How dare you fuck the brain14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138783&oldid=138766 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-14) 10/* Interpreter */ > 1726065899 109532 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fixed Repeating Output14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138784&oldid=138782 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+70) 10/* Brainfuck+2 */ > 1726065923 369497 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fixed Repeating Output14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138785&oldid=138784 5* 03Ractangle 5* (-69) 10Wrong place > 1726065934 630055 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Fixed Repeating Output14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138786&oldid=138785 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+69) 10There > 1726066642 156633 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Seclusion14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138787&oldid=118684 5* 03Hakerh400 5* (+0) 10 < 1726067350 513765 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz… > 1726067599 689697 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Talk:SubI machine14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138788 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+160) 10Created page with "delete TC tag while its not prooven bro. i will do it if you dont [-~~~~-]" > 1726068084 833235 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/newusers14]]4 create10 02 5* 03Graypinkfurball 5* 10New user account < 1726068467 823426 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl JOIN #esolangs * :Textual User > 1726069251 203045 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Looping counter14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138789&oldid=138404 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+43) 10/* G# */ < 1726069370 319945 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 > 1726069525 585102 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:XKCD Random Number14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138790&oldid=137592 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+46) 10/* Hexdump */ > 1726069650 909420 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Looping counter14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138791&oldid=138789 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (-125) 10/* G# */ its no a unary looping counter > 1726069813 662158 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Looping counter14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138792&oldid=138791 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (-44) 10/* How dare you fuck the brain */ also not a looping counter since its not unary < 1726070043 677188 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua QUIT :Quit: Client closed > 1726070366 280416 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07REG.TYPE = STR TRUE14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138793&oldid=134005 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+0) 10/* examples */ > 1726070386 772840 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Looping counter14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138794&oldid=138792 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+0) 10/* REG.TYPE = STR TRUE */ < 1726070824 150579 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :now i need help < 1726070838 55566 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :its kinda boring on the https://esolangs.org/wiki/Final_Word_Of_The_Day page < 1726070847 87542 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :its jyst the properties < 1726070858 627490 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so can i get help finding a eso,.ang that works < 1726071328 399703 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wWwwW: What will you do with it? < 1726071338 862951 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :code < 1726071341 953836 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hate myself < 1726071349 248837 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :add to page < 1726071354 341783 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :to make it interesting < 1726071433 979495 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wWwwW: Sure, code, but code *what*? What do you want to express? What do you want to communicate? What do you want your art to mean? < 1726071579 248159 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i want my art to mean: < 1726071579 748348 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im bored all day < 1726071580 249279 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i think many things are interesting < 1726071580 748494 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :concepts are to be tested an used in the wrong places < 1726071581 247996 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :what i want to code(bascially my goals): < 1726071581 752226 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :truth machine < 1726071582 248891 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :looping counter < 1726071582 748678 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :TC proof(since it has to be) < 1726071584 122590 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk < 1726071697 681417 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Am I right in guessing that you're a young student still learning about the world? Or are you an adult returning to this world after experiencing real life? < 1726071708 830012 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :first < 1726071713 229832 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so yes < 1726071717 840523 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also i < 1726071725 946985 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :..lets say i have a hard time in school < 1726071727 152508 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I would encourage students to examine many *different* ways of existing. For computers, this means many different languages. < 1726071732 994605 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh, no worries. I'm a dropout. < 1726071739 390960 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh ok < 1726071747 70847 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :very smart then < 1726071748 551766 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but yea < 1726071753 602861 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Nonetheless studying is required. Try to draw a distinction between work done for grades and work done for exploration. < 1726071754 124131 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i like to browse the wiki < 1726071759 343093 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :with random < 1726071772 186271 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :to see different stuff < 1726071783 429084 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :One technique I really liked at university was forcing students to explore different "paradigms" of programming, from different families of language design. < 1726071798 50498 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ive *tried* to do that < 1726071801 799438 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :like < 1726071805 503542 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :object < 1726071808 837479 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :declarative < 1726071822 876731 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :other stuff < 1726071829 678392 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :functional < 1726071837 782090 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Like, you should spend 4wks *each* with a language from each of the families: Prolog, Smalltalk, Forth, Lisp, ML, and then an ALGOL for comparison. < 1726071841 250306 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :string rewriting < 1726071857 964284 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(^rlly like dis one^) < 1726071908 346081 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :will try that < 1726071913 343302 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Nah, you need an immersion in the *languages*, not just the "paradigms". Like, concretely try writing programs in miniKanren, Pharo, Factor, Racket, OCaml (or Haskell?) and then return to Python to see what you've learned. < 1726071927 519348 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :not haskell < 1726071937 805135 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also i don think i have time for that < 1726071941 67882 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :to learn stuff < 1726071950 540202 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also im a slow learner < 1726071969 425144 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Explore what makes them useful. miniKanren is great for constraint solving (CSP). Pharo has interesting GUI and Web tools. Factor and OCaml will bend your mind. Racket will show you how to make new languages. < 1726071990 209783 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok < 1726072021 779167 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :...Weren't you just saying that you were bored? A bored artist is not interesting. To be artistic is to constantly struggle to express oneself. < 1726072037 654233 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :well i do that too < 1726072040 298555 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im bored < 1726072046 70528 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but i still don have time < 1726072064 885027 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :More seriously, I'm a musician and I used to spend hours at the piano practicing trills. My roommates do visual arts and are constantly talking of color theory, shading, etc. If you want to get into this stuff, you have to get *into* it. < 1726072075 256214 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ik < 1726072082 151865 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i get *into* programming < 1726072088 374345 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :as much as i can < 1726072094 178940 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :atleast i try < 1726072095 129264 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but also < 1726072100 826376 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk if i work differently < 1726072106 112358 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but my stuff gets gud < 1726072116 356253 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :when im bored < 1726072119 452521 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk what to do < 1726072122 64094 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i get into it < 1726072125 354228 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and then < 1726072129 361772 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i get somethin good < 1726072154 350432 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Two things. First, relax and let your thoughts form complete sentences. You're not in a rush here; it's okay to take a minute and say what you want to say. < 1726072169 563215 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i am in a rush < 1726072172 277684 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i have like idk < 1726072191 259514 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :until 8 o clock in denmark < 1726072196 889009 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :then i need to go to sleep < 1726072198 831229 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :school < 1726072200 314865 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :go hom e < 1726072203 433841 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :*home < 1726072333 570609 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :so i kinda am ig < 1726072335 194007 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ah sorry < 1726072338 155710 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im just < 1726072340 650699 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Sure. Society asks too much of students. So, here's the second thing: at your age, you aren't expected to contribute to the future of esolangs. You certainly are allowed to contribute, but you're expected to take care of yourself and learn fundamentals first. < 1726072340 729379 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :... < 1726072382 599852 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :sorry < 1726072384 660776 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :It's *okay* to not have any dreams for new languages yet. I didn't start building languages until I was like 25 or 26 maybe, and I've only really written two serious languages, including one esolang. < 1726072396 60551 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i do < 1726072400 877758 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :like thats what i am < 1726072404 691072 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :basically alli < 1726072408 43456 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i am < 1726072415 282253 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :is esolangs < 1726072421 598854 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :they fly around in my head < 1726072481 790280 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk what to do with them < 1726072483 869408 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk < 1726072509 227102 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Learn a few dozen more languages and your head will quiet down. Right now you don't have many "schemata" (fancy psychology word), so each new language is going to seem like a radically new thing. Very interesting, much to learn. < 1726072562 325578 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :can they be esolangs < 1726072577 912415 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :my memory cant take like C or something < 1726072663 674775 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :They could be esolangs, but it'll be easier and more efficient to learn languages intended for serious use. I gave you a bunch of options earlier. < 1726072675 329799 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ik < 1726072679 971408 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but i dont have like < 1726072688 158470 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the memory capacity < 1726072730 590781 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Take your time. Keep the docs open and refer to them often. Don't force yourself to memorize anything. Focus on *expressing* the parts of the *problem* that you want to solve. < 1726072744 673734 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok < 1726072757 518386 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I've been writing Python professionally for over a decade. I still look at the docs daily. < 1726072798 149042 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ill try haskell then < 1726072852 776290 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but also the only reasaon ive learned pythonsi cuz i had another human involved < 1726072904 882052 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Sure. When you're just starting out, you might need in-person discussions from tutors or classes. That's common. < 1726072918 870091 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i don have mone < 1726072922 599285 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :or the social skill < 1726072936 532292 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :*money < 1726072968 212375 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Python meetups are usually free. Ask the people who introduced you to programming. There's likely something nearby. < 1726073003 67986 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :#im danish and my teacher is southafrican < 1726073004 745710 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :lol < 1726073015 461015 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :And yes, you'll have to build social skills if you don't want to teach yourself by reading lots of books. You have to have information presented to you one way or another. < 1726073028 742453 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :like conferences f my brain < 1726073042 236530 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :mostly cuz i go bullied at school and still do < 1726073044 73054 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh well < 1726073053 222928 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :thats not something to talk about here < 1726073053 612763 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Me too. Don't worry, eventually school ends. < 1726073060 76865 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ik < 1726073065 498461 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but fuuuuuu < 1726073071 679536 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :is it annoying every day lol < 1726073123 726458 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh well < 1726073137 785618 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the worst thing is that they bully my brother < 1726073142 916317 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ig im just a "nerd" < 1726073228 505542 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh well < 1726073232 4901 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i hate life ig < 1726073233 788337 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :anyway > 1726073339 284975 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07By+14]]4 N10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?oldid=138795 5* 03Catto.4 5* (+2549) 10created page for by+ < 1726073392 234075 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok < 1726073397 92581 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :haskell in < 1726073398 91672 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yay < 1726073402 664145 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im taking totorial < 1726073411 36977 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :*tutorial < 1726073413 621483 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :or whatever < 1726073420 34597 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wtf is in < 1726073422 754588 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh well < 1726073426 160335 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ill find out < 1726073461 9418 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh so in atou applies < 1726073462 8385 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :tf < 1726073463 374842 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh well < 1726073464 563661 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :golf ig < 1726073483 814951 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Haskell is a community flavor of Miranda, itself an attempt to make Lazy ML practical. Miranda was not Free Software for a long time, and the Haskell community formed to fix that. < 1726073504 911636 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh < 1726073506 102096 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok < 1726073507 582754 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :damn < 1726073527 948867 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :It's worth knowing about e.g. OCaml, which also inherits from ML via SML but is not lazy. The whole lazy-vs-eager thing, or strict vs non-strict, is a big deal. < 1726073561 544350 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :rn im doing haskell < 1726073574 93004 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also why the hell is there the lambda symbol? < 1726073630 56163 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wait < 1726073644 393606 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the in makes definitions < 1726073657 264837 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :When Alonzo Church went to typeset his work, he wanted to write something like a hat or overbar on top of each variable, like `ô.î.o` for what Haskellers would write as `\o -> \i -> o`. < 1726073676 842976 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :However, the typesetter couldn't really do that, and the best they could do was to write a lambda before each variable name. < 1726073680 710288 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :just auto walrus < 1726073692 796435 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :It could be worse; Pythonistas would write `lambda o: lambda i: o`. < 1726073697 589100 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :k korvo < 1726073919 867335 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wWwwW: As you learn more history, you'll be like "oh yeah, Church's lambda calculus". And later, you'll be like "oh that's the K combinator!" > 1726073922 408173 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07By+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138796&oldid=138795 5* 03Catto.4 5* (+127) 10added optional argument to base < 1726073936 345132 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ik about both < 1726073944 269594 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ig im stupid idk < 1726074421 327956 :impomatic!~impomatic@host86-155-106-106.range86-155.btcentralplus.com JOIN #esolangs * :[https://web.libera.chat] impomatic < 1726074950 555291 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Nah, "smart" and "stupid" don't really mean much. You're *inexperienced*, and that's okay. < 1726075166 451656 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@31.22.147.66 JOIN #esolangs X-Scale :[https://web.libera.chat] X-Scale < 1726075485 54538 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :k < 1726075496 326069 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726075767 730136 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk < 1726075773 779127 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i dont want to go so deep < 1726075775 670314 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk < 1726075859 307208 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :hello < 1726075864 793845 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hey < 1726075866 819534 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hello < 1726075878 505359 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :how are you? < 1726075884 645954 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :gud < 1726075889 528044 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :way < 1726075898 700641 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :me2 < 1726075900 814996 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :What About You < 1726075912 863064 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yay < 1726076073 411071 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :what are you doin rn < 1726076082 129449 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im questioning my own person < 1726076102 983101 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :me? < 1726076117 258165 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wut < 1726076125 531900 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :but yea < 1726076130 918718 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :what are you doing? < 1726076149 127624 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :not much < 1726076171 326674 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :want somethin to do(lol) < 1726076232 935904 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :cuz then i have something < 1726076365 441257 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :what is it? < 1726076381 978805 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :helping me solve for dis: https://esolangs.org/wiki/Final_Word_Of_The_Day < 1726076463 333586 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@31.22.147.66 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1726076510 653184 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :idk < 1726076537 389917 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :I also can't solve it < 1726076548 44774 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok > 1726076615 87187 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Final Word Of The Day14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138797&oldid=138777 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+49) 10 < 1726076894 319697 :Europe89!~Europe204@vm-exclusive-1.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726076992 901615 :Europe89!~Europe204@vm-exclusive-1.la.net.ua PART :#esolangs < 1726077007 319899 :Europe2048!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1726077046 320229 :Europe2048!~Europe204@vm-exclusive-1.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726077053 960027 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :holeee i forgot this: https://esolangs.org/wiki/W) < 1726077311 380666 :Europe2048!~Europe204@vm-exclusive-1.la.net.ua PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok..? < 1726077337 941659 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wut is dis < 1726077345 385564 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :like why did i make tht < 1726077350 311203 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :what do you think? < 1726077368 893628 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also bracket part of link < 1726077513 323217 :Europe47!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726077514 341849 :Europe47!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua QUIT :Client Quit < 1726077526 319972 :Europe71!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726077528 150463 :Europe71!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PART :#esolangs < 1726077549 320485 :Europe70!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua JOIN #esolangs Europe2048 :[https://web.libera.chat] Europe2048 < 1726077565 57831 :Europe70!~Europe204@host-176-37-233-219.b025.la.net.ua PART :#esolangs < 1726077755 319706 :Europe2048!~Europe204@vm-exclusive-1.la.net.ua QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1726078132 709169 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think that joke languages shouldn't be the primary targets for disambiguations, unless they are as notable as INTERCAL. < 1726078145 926295 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wut < 1726078155 66691 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it aint a joke < 1726078165 279176 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wait wut < 1726078169 943322 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im confused < 1726078201 718449 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Oh, I was looking at W, sorry. < 1726078211 413451 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 JOIN #esolangs ais523 :(this is obviously not my real name) < 1726078212 688008 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh < 1726078214 686187 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :k < 1726078224 627943 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :although iNTERCAL is a joke by normal language standards, it is not a joke by esolang standards < 1726078234 351438 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :true < 1726078235 447330 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I don't have any serious opinions about Final Word of the Day yet. I can't really say much about a language without seeing its syntax: tokens, grammar, encoding, etc. < 1726078248 936400 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :true < 1726078298 66103 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Final Word of the Day makes me wonder if it would be possible to design an esolang in that style, sufficiently to narrow it down to only one possible language < 1726078318 64368 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :in a way, it is a declarative esolang specification, as opposed to the normal imperative style of writing specifications < 1726078326 362717 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :true > 1726078338 647575 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07W)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138798&oldid=134904 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+179) 10 < 1726078406 467849 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Ah, I see now. w> looks fun. I've seen similar 2D languages before but I'm struggling to recall any of their names. < 1726078419 918466 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :thx! > 1726078498 543480 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Yayimhere14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138799&oldid=138776 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+12) 10 > 1726078570 131502 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Yayimhere14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138800&oldid=138799 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+0) 10 < 1726078619 768448 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :this doesn't explain whether the pointer turns left or right, when turning 90 degrees < 1726078633 130569 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :well < 1726078646 626462 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also, starting in the top left moving left is weird – you would have to change the pointer direction immediately to prevent it escaping the program < 1726078665 460287 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it turns 90 degrees < 1726078669 655161 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :from current direction < 1726078678 765629 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :if its going down it would go right < 1726078680 916095 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think most 2D languages solve the "does it turn left or right?" problem by having two commands, one for each direction < 1726078689 115602 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :going left is also 90 degrees from down, though < 1726078699 266075 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :no < 1726078702 31351 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :thats -90 < 1726078704 347341 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :right? < 1726078706 961573 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im confused < 1726078707 962562 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :aaa < 1726078714 309619 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oh, there is more than one convention for this < 1726078732 349381 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :some mathematical conventions have it always measured anticlockwise, in which case you can say "90 degrees anticlockwise" < 1726078733 880813 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :how would i write that < 1726078742 793813 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think that's the one you're using < 1726078754 983614 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok < 1726078756 963453 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :thx! > 1726078768 993379 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07W)14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138801&oldid=138798 5* 03Yayimhere 5* (+14) 10 < 1726078784 301283 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :fixed it :) < 1726078790 753680 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :korvo: re: existing languages, there's https://esolangs.org/wiki/Shove but it's different enough to probably not be a see also – there might be a more similar one < 1726078835 708769 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: I always think of these as "laser tank" languages after a childhood puzzle game that involved shooting laser beams at mazes of mirrors. < 1726078865 507454 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :https://esolangs.org/wiki/Black was vaguely inspired by such a game < 1726078871 129616 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :although all the rules are different < 1726078875 250120 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :wait no way < 1726078877 507477 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :DAAAAAMN < 1726078882 803491 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :also i love Black < 1726078913 497317 :korvo!~korvo@2604:a880:4:1d0::4d6:d000 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Nice. Very similar vibe, yeah. < 1726078931 918362 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :early in esolangs.org's history, people were looking to make a 2D language with only one command + NOP < 1726078932 758299 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :BLACK IS THE BEST(im a black lover lol) < 1726078952 171005 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ais523: like 1L_x? < 1726078955 356449 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yep < 1726078963 149565 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ok < 1726078968 708536 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Black was my attempt, although looking at adjacent squares makes it cheating in a way < 1726078989 876576 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(much later I produced https://esolangs.org/wiki/Nopstacle) < 1726078992 642355 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :i dont think so < 1726079055 18680 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :oops, I think I tagged Nopstacle as implemented by mistake < 1726079068 913048 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the fact that Turnfunge is insane to me > 1726079075 802823 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Nopstacle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138802&oldid=130573 5* 03Ais523 5* (+2) 10fix categorisation mistake < 1726079078 248114 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :the things that are TC man < 1726079105 41747 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :it took a lot of practice as a community before we got that style of language to be TC that simply < 1726079119 116340 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yes < 1726079120 178620 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :back when we were starting out, we couldn't do much better than https://esolangs.org/wiki/1L_a < 1726079187 708725 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :Turnfunge reminds me of https://esolangs.org/wiki/OFFICIAL < 1726079219 102846 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(also apparently 1L_a still hasn't been proven TC? I might have a look at that) < 1726079229 963502 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :yea < 1726079238 642213 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :im the one who talked 'bout that right? < 1726079267 382507 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :no < 1726079287 200530 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :that was on i think 1L_A somethin somethin < 1726079364 469846 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :dis one: https://esolangs.org/wiki/1L_AOI < 1726079403 795291 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :my guess is that OFFICIAL is sub-TC, although it is able to count arbitrarily high I don't think there's any way to read any form of counter it has when it gets large enough to escape the original bounds of the program < 1726079478 927155 :zzo38!~zzo38@host-24-207-52-143.public.eastlink.ca JOIN #esolangs zzo38 :zzo38 < 1726079509 551765 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :true < 1726079542 836051 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :if prooved < 1726079558 931667 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 PRIVMSG #esolangs :bye < 1726079562 868178 :wWwwW!~wWwwW@94.147.203.75 QUIT :Quit: Client closed > 1726079720 146350 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Special:Log/move14]]4 move10 02 5* 03Ractangle 5* 10moved [[02User:Ractangle/(x10]] to [[Gora]] < 1726079868 901391 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :hmm, I'm not convinced 1L_AOI is TC, it looks like there is no way to set a zero cell to nonzero because if the MP is over a zero cell, you can't change direction and thus can't change the command from an MP-moving command to a value-changing command < 1726079924 720209 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and cpressey noticed the same thing a while ago > 1726080005 465634 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[071L AOI14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138805&oldid=31425 5* 03Ais523 5* (-28) 10remove Turing tarpits category although it was intended to be one, it has no way to change zero values to nonzero (see comments by Chris Pressey on talk), and needs to change values to zero in order to test them, thus can only read memory finitely many times and is not TC > 1726080218 329244 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[071L14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138806&oldid=90777 5* 03Ais523 5* (+104) 10add Turnfunge and Nopstacle > 1726080242 654440 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138807&oldid=138803 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+181) 10 < 1726080265 406967 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :OK, so what if we average Turnfunge (turn left when there is a solid cell behind the pointer) and Nopstacle (turn left when there is a solid cell in front of the pointer), producing a "turn left when there is a solid cell at the pointer" language < 1726080303 39682 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :I initially assumed that was sub-TC because otherwise Turnfunge would have been defined like that, but that isn't actually valid reasoning so I should think about it properly > 1726080325 462579 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138808&oldid=138634 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+52) 10/* Esolangs */ < 1726080362 617397 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :ah, I see, it's reversible, which doesn't necessarily make it sub-TC but makes the proof much harder < 1726080447 332861 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :even in 2024, I think it is still the case that we have no good tarpits for TCness proofs of reversible counter machines (https://esolangs.org/wiki/Flow_of_Holes was designed as a step in that sort of proof but it isn't a very simple one) < 1726080508 787849 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :and in particular I am not sure that two counters is enough for a reversible counter machine to be TC < 1726080532 236471 :ais523!~ais523@user/ais523 PRIVMSG #esolangs :(but I am also not sure that it is not enough) > 1726080591 612166 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User:Ractangle14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138809&oldid=138808 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+36) 10/* Esolangs */ > 1726080767 801214 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138810&oldid=138807 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+156) 10 > 1726081584 122220 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138811&oldid=138810 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+7) 10 > 1726081780 120962 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138812&oldid=138811 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+44) 10 > 1726082565 305678 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138813&oldid=138812 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+40) 10 < 1726082793 166378 :impomatic!~impomatic@host86-155-106-106.range86-155.btcentralplus.com QUIT :Quit: Client closed > 1726083090 345311 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138814&oldid=138813 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+30) 10 > 1726083422 635587 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138815&oldid=138814 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+70) 10/* Syntax */ > 1726083472 878854 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Gora14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138816&oldid=138815 5* 03Ractangle 5* (+132) 10/* Examples */ > 1726083640 304304 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07By+14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138817&oldid=138796 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+14) 10Lowercase > 1726083751 762784 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07Spacechem Programming Language14]]4 M10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138818&oldid=40146 5* 03PythonshellDebugwindow 5* (+23) 10Category < 1726085389 419408 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@83.223.234.132 JOIN #esolangs X-Scale :[https://web.libera.chat] X-Scale > 1726085915 813524 PRIVMSG #esolangs :14[[07User talk:Tommyaweosme14]]4 10 02https://esolangs.org/w/index.php?diff=138819&oldid=138761 5* 03Tommyaweosme 5* (+296) 10/* gd auto level */ < 1726086294 384994 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :Bah. Tried to use a test query of "Could you explain what the Funciton language is all about?" for the LLM thing (updated the model), but the keyword extraction scheme helpfully extracted the keyword "function", which of course doesn't find anything relevant, so the model output was just: > The "Funciton" language is not mentioned in the text. It's likely a typo or a term not relevant to the < 1726086296 778567 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :provided context. < 1726086358 761175 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :It's now using Gemma 2.0 rather than 1.1, since they released the 2B(-ish) parameter size version of Gemma 2 as well. But really the model quality hasn't been the (main) problem in getting useful responses: the search and article selection is (plus context size limits that haven't changed). < 1726086391 327629 :X-Scale!~X-Scale@83.223.234.132 QUIT :Ping timeout: 256 seconds < 1726086426 361814 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :I think I probably just need some sort of maybe TF-IDF-ranked full text search thing on the original question, as-is, rather than asking the model to extract search keywords. < 1726086506 348155 :fizzie!irc@selene.zem.fi PRIVMSG #esolangs :(Or maybe I could just use the custom Google search API, they've indexed the wiki anyway and it has a free tier of 100 queries per day. I just liked the notion of this being entirely self-hosted.) < 1726090844 848884 :Sgeo!~Sgeo@user/sgeo JOIN #esolangs Sgeo :realname < 1726091317 761584 :__monty__!~toonn@user/toonn QUIT :Quit: leaving < 1726092512 898302 :tromp!~textual@92-110-219-57.cable.dynamic.v4.ziggo.nl QUIT :Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…