< 1119571226 0 :calamari_!~calamari@dialup-4.240.114.53.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119571332 0 :calamari_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :re's < 1119571974 0 :harkeyahh!~chatzilla@206-81-148-32.slkc.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119572316 0 :harkeyahh!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :CharServ STFU! < 1119572329 0 :harkeyahh!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :U r always on my case abotu something ChanServ < 1119572350 0 :harkeyahh!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you wanna serve me get me something to drink and then get down on your knees... < 1119572373 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1119572712 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :harkeyahh: did you package arrive safely to Mumbai? < 1119572717 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*your < 1119572738 0 :harkeyahh!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, yes it did i meant to change the topic < 1119572796 0 :harkeyahh!unknown@unknown.invalid TOPIC #esoteric :Another brainfuck site (http://www.bf-hacks.org/) is open! ~ http://chriscoyne.com/cfdg/ ~ Esolang wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/ Thank you for your prayers my children. The package arrived safely into the arms of a 10,000 pound elephant. < 1119573438 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there has been confusion regarding turing-completeness of smallfuck < 1119573475 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the amount of available memory. < 1119573503 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made up my mind. Available memory is limited. Smallfuck is not turing-complete. < 1119574658 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :desafinado: on that topic, you might be interested in this: http://catseye.webhop.net/projects/sf2tab/src/sf2tab.c < 1119574666 0 :cpressey!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it compiles smallfuck programs into lookup tables < 1119575135 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey that's cool < 1119575176 0 :heatsink!~heatsink@c-24-61-94-111.hsd1.nh.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119575682 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cpressey: hahaha < 1119575789 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neat < 1119580802 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.3/20050414]" < 1119581890 0 :malaprop!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"bounce" < 1119582882 0 :desafinado!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :lament < 1119587056 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I added pages to the esowiki on Archway and Qdeql < 1119588191 0 :calamari_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1119589338 0 :heatsink!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1119591555 0 :harkeyahh!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.4/20050511]" < 1119599999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1119600000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1119600899 0 :pgimeno!pgimeno@124.Red-80-59-211.pooles.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119601868 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1119612993 0 :tokigun!~tokigun@dor204226.kaist.ac.kr JOIN :#esoteric < 1119613003 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1119613117 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i've submitted three beer song program to 99-bottles-of-beer.net; one of them is already uploaded. < 1119613118 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://www.99-bottles-of-beer.net/language-whirl-761.html < 1119615521 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice work, tokigun < 1119615563 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1119615843 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've voted it as top-geek < 1119616413 0 :puzzlet!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nice work tokigun :) < 1119617466 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :thanks ;) < 1119619093 0 :malaprop!~ph@adsl-69-208-101-159.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119619698 0 :jix!jix@p5489F07B.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119628239 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Banned from network" < 1119635208 0 :calamari_!~jeffryj@lilly.csoft.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119635213 0 :calamari_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1119638566 0 :graue!~graue@ip68-100-130-21.dc.dc.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119639168 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1119639322 0 :comet_11!Sanity@dialup-215.89.221.203.acc50-kent-syd.comindico.com.au JOIN :#esoteric < 1119639337 0 :CXI!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1119639356 0 :comet_11!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :CXI < 1119639687 0 :calamari_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi graue < 1119640113 0 :calamari_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"bbl" < 1119644616 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1119645388 0 :calamari!~calamari@dialup-4.240.150.251.Dial1.Phoenix1.Level3.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119646150 0 :graue!~graue@ip68-100-130-21.dc.dc.cox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119648739 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :regraue < 1119648757 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hello < 1119650043 0 :jix!jix@p5489F07B.dip.t-dialin.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119650341 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Banned from network" < 1119650933 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1119651307 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi raven < 1119651341 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :how's things? < 1119651381 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :better now that I've taken my math test :) < 1119651412 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1119651475 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm considering writing an adventure game.. need to see if my idea is feasible though. Of course an extra 8k of data storage helps a lot :) < 1119651502 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just 2.8k is suficcient for a large game < 1119651535 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :depends on how much time you spend compressing things < 1119651566 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing in the rules says not to use the data file, so why not? hehe < 1119651575 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I enjoy squeezing every last byte out of code. optimisation is fun < 1119651613 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, don't get me wrong.. it's just that if I limit myself to 2.8, it's not going to be the same game as 2+8k < 1119651638 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :still only 2k of code.. the 8k is for data < 1119651737 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I need to write a quick assembler, though, so that I can use a compressed source format.. 2929 bytes of standard asm source code won't get me much < 1119651786 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :last year assembler games were accepted without source code < 1119651793 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think that source rule is silly, though.. it's the binary that matters.. actually a lot of the rules are silly, it's all for the fun of it, I suppose < 1119651812 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oic.. that makes things considerably easier < 1119651904 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with 2k of code, I could probably write a semi-generic engine < 1119651922 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :once that fits your game perfectly < 1119651956 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you want to follow the rules as posted then a zip of your engine + your data file has to be under 2.7Kb and that's pretty impossible < 1119651980 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the organiser has not thought about the rules, think of them as general guidelines < 1119651996 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and there should be an OR clause between rules one and two < 1119652021 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it was funny how he called it RAM, that makes no sense in the context < 1119652033 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the source code limit is for games written in BASIC or interpreted languages < 1119652062 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the executable code limit is for compiled/assembled games < 1119652163 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, it implies that a UPXd EXE (!) when decompressed must be within the 2.79Kb [sic] limit < 1119652174 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should e-mail him to see what the actual rules are < 1119652233 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people have tried this year and last year to clarify them but to no avail. Good Luck! < 1119652261 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :raven: I think it'd be pretty hard for him to verify how much ram is being used < 1119652308 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pretty much impossible without disasseming the source, on game systems such as the atari 5200 < 1119652359 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah. I'm still strying to get the whole concept of a 1024-2048 byte game competition that allows entries up to almost 3K in size < 1119652481 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not 3K < 1119652482 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a lot more < 1119652496 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean come on < 1119652497 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i meant only for the game object < 1119652501 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :8k is for "data" < 1119652506 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what the fuck is "data" < 1119652511 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe my "data" is Python code < 1119652515 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1119652518 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :non-executed code < 1119652526 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :define "executed", eh < 1119652526 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*oops, non-executed stuff < 1119652539 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :define non-executed < 1119652544 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :an interpreter doesn't execute anything, it just looks at "data" and decides what to do < 1119652547 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :right? < 1119652552 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is data < 1119652556 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1119652558 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :everything is data. < 1119652618 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course for an interactive fiction game < 1119652628 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you probably need much more "real data" than code < 1119652649 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it might be possible to fit Scott Adams' engnine in 2k < 1119652661 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and any scott adams' game fits easily (zipped) in 8k data < 1119652667 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :easily, you could do it in much less < 1119652680 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(which is exactly what i was planning to do for the competition :)) < 1119652718 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Previously I used my own custom data compression code rather than relying on any external libraries < 1119652806 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :For this I would prefer to do the same to keep the 'game' as self contained as possible (not saying that I won't though) < 1119652892 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wisdom from the dunric file: http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.games.video.classic/browse_thread/thread/5110daaa04a82c2c/0267f0dcc89cbaf5?q=rec.games.video.classic+dunric&rnum=8&hl=en#0267f0dcc89cbaf5 < 1119653114 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Here is a "clarification" of the rules (at the bottom) http://groups-beta.google.com/group/rec.arts.int-fiction/browse_frm/thread/68e352749cb768ff/cc85e00f30ff941d?q=dunric&rnum=6&hl=en#cc85e00f30ff941d < 1119653149 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if accepted as true it allows for some major abuse of the rules < 1119653175 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1119653181 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he says you can use "TADS, Adrift, etc" < 1119653184 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :which also means inform < 1119653194 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ha < 1119653221 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :for instance you could write a *huge* generic game engine without any size limitations (the interpreter) < 1119653247 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the code (game logic) would have to fit in 2.83Kb which would allow for a huge amount of logic < 1119653264 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and all data (strings etc) would go in the 8Kb data file < 1119653301 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMHO that's what dunrics clarification allows and that goes against what I feel to be the spirit of the competition < 1119653335 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :TADS, Adrift, Inform ARE "huge, generic game engines" < 1119653340 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and what's better, you don't have to write them yourself. < 1119653418 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but it means that you could really submit anything, you can compress the logic (code) to fit within 2.83Kb and not suffer from the EXE/UPX clause in rule one < 1119653495 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :basically the rules of the competition are kinda dumb :) < 1119653505 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :completely and utterly < 1119653507 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he should have restricted them waay more < 1119653531 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this needs to be sorted out, the rules need to be revised < 1119653648 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My entry from last year was fully self contained at 2,803 bytes of BBC BASIC, it even ran on a BBC < 1119653827 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :He states that the absolute maximum source size is 2.83Kb and later adds 'give or take a few hundred bytes' and gives a new limit of 2.86Kb < 1119653861 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no-one, to my knowledge has ever understood what dunric's rules mean < 1119653952 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :including him, I'd imagine.. where would 2.83k come from? not exactly a common file size :) < 1119654054 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :~2.831Kb = 2899 bytes. Since when are there only 1000 bytes in a kilobyte? Any programmer (aside form dunric!) should know this. < 1119654103 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and 2.83Kb is waaaay outside the 1Kb to 2Kb remit of the contest < 1119654114 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't matter tho, in the end :) < 1119654163 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :not really, but knowing the original reason why the competition started makes it seem silly < 1119654278 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, if I don't have an external data file, I'd better think harder about compression. Maybe perl? :) < 1119654354 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#defining common operations as macros would allow a good degree of compression. < 1119654375 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm think more along the lines of text compression < 1119654426 0 :CXI!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :test < 1119654430 0 :test!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :CXI < 1119654440 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm, the main problem is the trade off between the space gained by compression and the code size required for decompression < 1119654491 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :finding an optimal or beneficial balance is difficult but possible if you limit yourself to only 2.83Kb for the entire game < 1119655007 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is possible to decompress in very little code, depending on the compression used. For example, dictionary compression < 1119656100 0 :KarlMarx!~chatzilla@206-81-148-32.slkc.qwest.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1119656480 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've e-mailed him.. hopefully I'll get a response since we used to hang out online all the time < 1119656693 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what have you asked? < 1119656733 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I asked for clarifications, and also offered alternate rules that made sense to us < 1119656762 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmmm...i am doing the same (but not sent yet) < 1119656785 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :let me paste the rules I suggested to see if you agree < 1119656790 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :please < 1119656810 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :1) The size of the unzipped game file may be no larger than 2048 bytes in < 1119656811 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :size, whether source or binary in nature. The internal details or methods < 1119656811 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :used in the binary or source file are unimportant (feel free to use UPX < 1119656811 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :compression, platform tricks, etc), so long as the game file itself is no < 1119656811 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :more than 2048 bytes in size. < 1119656813 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2) External game engines or language interpreters may be used to run the < 1119656815 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :game, so long as it can be verified that the engine or language employed was < 1119656817 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :written prior to the contest starting date. < 1119656835 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :.. That was it :) < 1119656923 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :very well pu calamari < 1119656990 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he relied already, basically ignoring the rule suggestions < 1119656994 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :replied rather < 1119657010 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I would have suggested that the original 2899 byte limit be allowed for this year only < 1119657023 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps you can suggest that < 1119657053 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why was the limit set at 2899 bytes? < 1119657064 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no idea.. absolutely none < 1119657069 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IMHO it's an interesting story < 1119657094 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe a certain auto-adventure generator saves files of that size? < 1119657110 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :with the external data file < 1119657126 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :maybe so < 1119657130 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :seems VERY far fetched < 1119657135 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It may not be 'entirely' true, but it fits the events surrounding the announcement of the original competition last year < 1119657167 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Each year in the interactive-fiction community there is a competition called IF-Comp < 1119657207 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunric submitted his game B-Venture to the 2004 IF-Comp < 1119657220 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah, I heard he placed last? < 1119657237 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :his entry was disqualified because it broke the 'entries must not have been previously released' rule < 1119657246 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1119657270 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that sux.. so he probably made his own contest in spite? < 1119657270 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :he discussed this fervently (to understate reality) with the organisers and community at large < 1119657289 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and yes, in spite he made his own competition < 1119657306 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what I think would be really neat < 1119657309 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in his competition there were no rules to disallow previously released games < 1119657312 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a modular music studio, using Brainfuck programs < 1119657331 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :effects would be programs that read samples on stdin and produce samples on stdout < 1119657349 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And B-Venture was 2,700(ish) bytes long, so he set a max code limit which was a little larger < 1119657363 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :heh < 1119657374 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This was part of the reason why the first competition was ignored by the IF community < 1119657379 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graue: go for it! < 1119657406 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the other part of the reason is probably because the vast majority of the IF community couldn't care less about "old-school" crappy games which fit in a few K < 1119657410 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graue: very nice idea < 1119657419 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could even get fancy and have wave in, wave out bookends < 1119657432 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I am not familiar with the use of the term 'bookend' in this context < 1119657446 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sorry, my lack of vocabulary < 1119657504 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the idea is that you'd give a regaular wav file, it'd be decoded and sent to the next filter, which would only be dealing with a raw file, then after the last filter you'd feed the raw into the last program and it'd becomes a playable wav again < 1119657508 0 :{^Raven^}!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: it's not that miniature masterpieces in general are crap, coding small elegant programs with a apurpose is a lost art. The quality of the works of certain authors (not mentioning names here) does leave a lot to be desired < 1119657527 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{^Raven^}: it's an art the IF community isn't terribly interested in. < 1119657543 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :they have their own art to worry about < 1119657565 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :calamari, I guess so, but I was thinking the environment executing the programs would do that sort of coding < 1119657567 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lament: maybe not, but it is interesting, nonetheless < 1119657579 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graue: oic, that'd make sense