01:11:25 -!- ihope has joined. 01:12:11 'Ello 01:12:24 Yesterday I figured out what monads were. 01:17:18 -!- kipple has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 01:29:06 Night all 01:29:16 G'night 01:30:29 -!- jix has quit ("Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht"). 02:02:22 -!- Sgep has quit. 02:25:01 -!- echeese has quit ("Leaving"). 02:30:39 -!- CXII has joined. 02:32:36 -!- CXI has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 02:32:36 -!- sekhmet has quit (brown.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 02:37:48 -!- CXII has changed nick to CXI. 02:37:48 -!- Isole has joined. 02:38:27 -!- sekhmet has joined. 02:40:06 -!- Isole has quit (Client Quit). 02:40:14 -!- sekhmet has quit (Connection reset by peer). 02:43:08 -!- sekhmet has joined. 02:44:07 sekhmet: Hello grey-haired woman! 03:32:02 -!- ihope has quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.7/20050915]"). 03:52:57 -!- int-e has joined. 03:53:13 -!- int-e has quit ("Bye!"). 04:48:25 * sekhmet didn't realize that sekhmet had grey hair 04:48:28 But I can dig it 05:07:44 -!- GregorR has quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.7/20050920]"). 07:41:13 -!- puzzlet has joined. 07:48:12 -!- kipple has joined. 07:48:25 hi kipple 07:55:43 hello 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 08:48:17 -!- GregorR has joined. 08:58:11 -!- kipple has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 08:59:01 -!- kipple has joined. 09:12:50 -!- kipple has quit ("See you later"). 09:13:55 -!- kipple has joined. 09:18:42 -!- EgoBot has joined. 09:35:54 -!- int-e has joined. 09:49:39 -!- jix has joined. 10:20:37 -!- jix has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 10:29:20 -!- jix has joined. 10:44:26 -!- jix has quit ("Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht"). 10:44:35 -!- jix has joined. 11:38:45 -!- Keymaker has joined. 11:39:08 hi Keymaker 11:39:30 how goes your bizarre basic project? 11:41:32 hi kipple 11:41:45 to be honest, i haven't worked it at all 11:41:53 since the beginning of it 11:42:23 i mean, i haven't worked on it at all since the last time i talked about it, in the beginning of the project 11:42:41 :( 11:43:17 Keymaker: I chiseled off another 14 bytes from my entry last night :) 11:44:42 aaarg :D 11:44:56 int-e: i was just about to say that impressive job with the solution 11:45:03 i mean entry 11:45:24 i wonder whether we have used the same algorithm 11:45:31 we'll see in a day :) 11:49:33 but well, i assume your way is different, and obviously simpler 11:52:16 hehe. that is a common fate for many esolang ideas I think :) (I have a lot of those myself) 11:52:23 :) 11:52:35 yeah 11:54:45 Keymaker: we'll see 11:55:33 it's amazing program size.. when the competition began i was sure it'll be very hard for anyone to get the size under 500 instructions 11:57:03 i didn't bother to shorten my program yesterday, since that wouldn't have helped that much.. at least get to release a nice 40x10 or 20x20 program block on my site when the competition is over.. 11:57:41 i'll post the md5 for the 400 instruction version after the simpsons.. 11:57:49 although there's no point basically :) 11:58:01 it's 400 bytes 11:58:07 that's a magical number :) 11:58:07 yes 11:58:13 oh, didn't know that :) 11:58:55 it's a round number, it's a perfect square, it has no prime divisor >5 so it's quite smooth ... 11:59:48 nice :) 12:00:15 oh, btw, there are no boring integers. 12:00:18 proof: 12:00:21 hehe 12:00:24 err, natural numbers. 12:00:35 proof: assume that there are boring natural numbers 12:00:41 by the way, gotta go for half an hour: the simpons :) 12:00:42 then there'd be a smallest boring natural number 12:00:50 as such, it'd be whooly remarkable. 12:00:53 contradiction. 12:01:10 :) 12:01:17 bbl 12:03:43 wholly. I knew I made a typo there. 12:05:04 -!- pgimeno has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 12:13:50 int-e: but there are boring reals, then? 12:15:16 lament: definitely 12:15:27 hahahaha 12:15:37 Pi is boring 12:15:44 it seems that the statement "there are no boring reals" is equivalent to the axiom of choice 12:15:48 lament: because the things we can say about real numbers are countable 12:15:53 since it seems obvious that some reals are boring 12:15:59 lament: so there are real numbers we can't really say anything about 12:16:01 then the axiom of choice must be false 12:16:09 QED 12:16:13 * lament bows 12:16:31 lament: hmm. not really. 12:16:33 * puzzlet bows back 12:16:41 int-e: Yes. the well-ordering principle! 12:16:44 what are you talking about though 12:16:48 "boring"? 12:17:14 lament: there's a countable model of set theory; this means that for every thing that can be proved, you only need countable many examples (witnesses) ... 12:18:41 (at least as far as I remember, the von Neumann axioms can be modelled as first order formulas built on top of the 'element of' relation) 12:19:47 what's that have to do with anything? 12:20:34 it means that even if the axiom of choice is true, you can still have uninteresting real numbers. 12:20:41 you just don't need to use them anywhere. 12:21:15 no 12:21:15 -!- pgimeno has joined. 12:21:19 if the AC is true 12:21:33 then exactly the same proof as for integers works for reals, too 12:21:59 nope. you can say that the set of uninteresting reals has a member - but you can't name it 12:22:31 there's nothing that helps you select one and only one out of them as being interesting. 12:22:37 you need a well-ordering to do that. 12:22:41 exactly 12:22:49 one that you can name 12:22:56 and the well-ordering principle is equivalent to AC 12:23:22 lament: still, that only tells me that there are well orderings of the real numbers - but there are many of them; which one will you use? 12:23:43 * int-e sees nothing that makes one better than all others 12:24:07 int-e: what makes the <-relation ordering the best ordering for integers? 12:24:17 lament: it's natural 12:24:48 you have a point. 12:24:51 good night :P 12:25:18 sleep well 12:35:33 back.. 12:36:37 int-e: what kind of test calamari ought to run? 12:37:29 i think the following: 1. file with only one new-line 2. file with few k of pattern "abc" 3. file with few ks of a, b, and c 12:37:57 and perhaps something like bbbbccccaaaa 12:37:58 Keymaker: I don't know. I've tested my program with short inputs (<=9 characters) and some selected long ones 12:38:19 ok 12:41:22 there are 29524 inputs of length <=9, which seems manageable 12:41:53 hm? 12:42:04 for i in "" {a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c} {a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}{a,b,c}; do echo $i | ./bfigolf entry.b; done 12:42:29 that's the basic idea 12:55:28 . o O ( feeding invalid input to a program that does no error checking is bad ) 12:56:06 yes 12:56:08 :) 12:56:26 and I wonder why I'm getting Cell value too small (-1) errors :) 12:56:56 there's an off-by-one bug in bfigolf.c (probably not serious though) 12:57:03 what kind of? 12:57:09 (i've used another interpreter) 12:57:21 namely, the realloc should be realloc(mem, (maxmp+1024+1)*sizeof(unsigned char)) 12:57:34 uh, i don't understand about that :) 12:57:35 instead of the same without +1 12:58:00 aha.. well, maybe you should inform calamari, i think 12:58:05 just in case 12:59:58 int-e: any others than we going to enter the competition? 13:01:23 Keymaker: I'll write a forum post 13:04:21 Keymaker: I don't know; the usual suspects would be Laurent and Daniel. I've not heard anything from them for a while (but I've been staying away myself, too, so I wouldn't know.) 13:07:45 -!- jix has quit ("Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht"). 13:08:18 yeah.. laurent asked the value of new-line to be defined when the competition began, but haven't heard of him since then 13:08:42 i hope we will get more entries 13:10:09 jix was at least working on one, i think.. and calamari 13:14:19 -!- jix has joined. 13:16:38 heh. jix, are you still working on your bfgolf entry? 13:16:51 no... 13:17:01 aww. 13:17:20 (Keymaker and I are wondering if there will be more than 2 entries) 13:19:16 well, at least it'll be interesting to see the different ways we (probably) are using 13:19:26 It was the a^n b^n c^n case? 13:20:04 yeah 13:20:24 I did consider trying to write an entry, but haven't had the time. 13:20:30 yeah 13:20:36 -!- Sgep has joined. 13:20:39 time seems to be a problem with many, i suppose 13:23:48 int-e: got e-mail address? i'd need to ask one thing kinda related to this contest 13:24:42 int-e: i can't use private messages 13:24:50 int-e: unregistered users can't 13:25:16 the reason i don't ask here in public is that the project is a surprise, kind of.. 14:38:51 *sigh* about 16 hours or something till the end of the competition.. 14:46:35 I'll definitely not write another entry nor optimize the one I have further *eg* 14:46:56 unless someone submits a 331 bytes one 14:48:03 yeah, it's a winning solution i'd assume 16:10:33 Keymaker: eh, shouldn't that be 40 hours? 16:11:11 yeah 16:11:15 i'm good at math ;) 16:54:10 bye 16:54:12 -!- Keymaker has left (?). 17:30:06 -!- Sgep has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 17:31:57 -!- Sgep has joined. 17:44:47 -!- {^Raven^} has quit (Remote closed the connection). 17:47:20 -!- int-e has left (?). 18:53:37 -!- kipple has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 18:54:35 -!- kipple has joined. 19:19:58 -!- ihope has joined. 19:20:10 ```si`k``si`k``sii``s``s`kski 19:21:06 I think that's the Church numeral for Steinhaus's Mega. 19:30:14 And ```si`k``si`k``si`k``sii``s``s`kski is much, much bigger... 20:15:32 Now here's a nice sequence: !1 = 2, !2 = 8, !3 = 402653184*2^402653184. 20:29:38 -!- lirthy has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 20:39:58 -!- nooga has joined. 20:40:05 Halloo 20:40:26 hi nooga 20:43:16 hah 20:44:28 i want finally to develop own, huge, usefull language and become lie Larry Wall or Bjarne Stroustrup 20:44:36 :-) 20:45:06 like* 20:46:39 -!- lirthy has joined. 20:46:44 who wants to help me? ;p 20:48:05 Me, maybe. 20:48:08 You want to become like Larry Wall, the primary developer of a language so huge and obnoxious that it's /not/ useful? 20:49:11 you mean "\/not\/" ? ;) 20:49:28 XD 20:49:29 oh, i will begin with simple things... like compiling arithmetic expressions, flow control and simple types 20:49:57 heh, i've spent the last two days writing a compiler for a school project 20:50:09 Wait! Functional or imperative? 20:50:18 i've spend last year trying to write complete compiler :] 20:50:39 nooga: oh :) 20:50:47 nooga: you obviously lack some deadlines :) 20:50:58 ihope: ? 20:51:08 nooga: Finish a compiler for it tomorrow or I WILL HUNT YOU DOWN 20:51:15 Tada, deadlines. 20:51:26 i think it should be like C++ (but more like Java) + perl + ML ;] 20:51:40 All imperative, then? 20:51:47 yea 20:52:36 doesn't ML support functional programming well? 20:52:48 it does 20:52:59 but i meant "a little bit of ML" 20:53:32 to allow something like this: a = {something; something; something;} + b; 20:53:41 Aha. 20:53:52 soemtimes it's usefull 20:54:09 a = map (+b) [something,something,something] 20:55:42 and i plan builtin perl-like regexp 20:56:03 no fuc**g headers like in C++ 20:56:27 methods implemented inside classes 20:56:33 * GregorR tries to figure out what curse word is spelled fuc__g ... one too few letters for fucking ... 20:56:56 but treat * like in wildcards... 20:57:14 I'll treat it like regex :P 20:57:20 So it could be fucccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccg 20:57:29 Fucing, I suppose... 20:58:07 oh -.-' 20:58:13 FUCKING allright? 20:58:31 GASP YOU TYPED A CURSY WORD!!!!!!! 20:58:43 i forgot about the FUCKING K before FUCKING C 20:59:03 * ihope stares in some ranom direction 20:59:41 (The random direction happens to be exactly towards the screen) 20:59:48 -!- calamari has joined. 20:59:50 no 20:59:52 damn 20:59:53 idk 20:59:54 after 20:59:57 whaterver 20:59:59 ;/ 21:02:37 !help 21:02:58 hi 21:03:03 EgoBot: Ping? 21:03:05 !help 21:03:05 hi calamari 21:03:35 * calamari suggests Linguine for the Ego Bot 21:04:42 * ihope wonders if IRCbots like lignuine 21:04:54 linguine? 21:05:08 help ps kill i eof flush show ls 21:05:10 1l 2l adjust axo befunge bch bf{8,[16],32,64} glass glypho kipple lazyk malbolge pbrain rail sadol sceql udage01 21:05:14 yeah, but they can only take one line.. :) 21:05:15 Yay lag! 21:05:37 help ps kill i eof flush show ls 21:05:37 1l 2l adjust axo befunge bch bf{8,[16],32,64} glass glypho kipple lazyk malbolge pbrain rail sadol sceql udage01 21:05:48 unless Gregor changed it so that programs can use \n for multiple lines 21:05:48 lol 21:05:49 SADOL 21:05:58 there's SADOL there!!! 21:06:03 nooga: maybe http://www.cs.hut.fi/Opinnot/T-106.550/Harjoitustyo/vaihe3.pdf could be helpful to you? 21:06:17 !sadol !"1a 21:06:25 a 21:06:31 aha ;p 21:07:07 It can use URLs. 21:07:12 Just use pastebin for multiple lines. 21:07:44 !pastebin 21:07:50 !sadol (3~f1(5:a0:b1:i2@| http://www.pastebin.ca/ 21:08:20 thanks for the irp :) 21:08:42 Canadia, eh? 21:08:58 1 1 2 3 5 8 13 21 34 55 89 144 233 377 610 987 1597 2584 4181 21:09:43 What would happen if I !bf +[]? 21:09:51 It'll stop after a bit. 21:09:59 or you can kill it 21:10:06 Or you can kill it :P 21:10:09 What a lag 21:10:27 !ps 21:10:36 lindi-: who makes this minijava? 21:10:46 1 GregorR: ps 21:11:00 nooga: what do you mean? 21:11:24 Testing 21:11:38 who's Lina Salmela 21:11:55 Leena* 21:12:07 Hmm... did somebody just say "Testing"? 21:12:47 minijava? 21:16:03 hyvaa paivaa 21:16:24 sounds almost like minijavaa 21:19:27 Maybe I could make a language called Lava... 21:20:18 -!- ihope has quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.68.5 [Firefox 1.0.7/20050915]"). 21:20:37 bybyy 21:22:04 mm Lava.. write hot code, spewing ash and poisonous fumes.. then let your code harden into an impenetrable mass 21:22:47 Sounds like perl! 21:22:55 shut..up... 21:23:11 perl is cool ;> 21:23:35 excuse me for that "shut up"...0.0 21:23:35 perl is so 90's 21:23:45 not perl 5 ;p 21:23:59 hehe 21:24:02 i got to lear ruby 21:24:07 learn 21:24:27 I'd buy a new perl book for version 5, if I ever used the books I currently have 21:24:51 I could sell them as "Like New" :( 21:30:00 i elarn new languages from the net and documentation 21:30:10 i think the first two is the worse 21:30:19 then every another is much easier 21:30:49 i learnd the first language from a computer magazine... 21:35:07 my first was pascaal 21:35:21 my first was real-basic 21:35:28 a visual-basic clone for mac os 21:48:37 -!- jix has quit ("Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht"). 21:53:24 oh 21:53:25 mac 21:54:08 lindi-: tell me, is "Leena" name for a woman or man?? 21:55:31 nooga: at least in finnish that's woman's name 21:57:43 mhm 21:57:52 what about Mika? 21:59:50 nooga: that's man's name 22:00:09 ha 22:01:21 in Polish most woman's names are ended with 'a', only exeption is diminution for name Jakub - Kuba 22:01:28 Kuba is man's name 22:01:42 ok 22:02:39 i think that avoids mistakes :> 22:06:09 hm, does most adjectives in finnish end with -nen ? 22:06:49 nooga: some do but i wouldn't say that most 22:07:26 i'm just flipping through a finnish dictionary 22:07:31 heh 22:07:54 i've tried to learn finnish but there's no good courses 22:08:15 only phrase books and dictionaries ;/ 22:11:37 hmm 22:12:03 and it's hell hard! 22:13:10 probably :) 22:13:44 Polish is well known as a truly hard one 22:14:08 but Finnish is worse ;d 22:14:57 well.. maybe that's because I use Polish fluently from child 22:15:09 and it's my natural, native language 22:15:33 for english-native, it's really hard to learn korean 22:15:46 but for korean-native, learning english is somewhat easier 22:16:01 same here i think... 22:16:25 since korean is refered to be more complex than english 22:16:31 so may the force be with you, nooga 22:16:37 english is easier than Polish, Korean, Chineese, Finnish, Hungarian, Russian, Nyjorsk, Dannish... and some other ;;p 22:16:50 English* 22:17:24 i think you(and i)'ve got a good condition to learn another language... having a complex lang for own native lang 22:17:53 that's true 22:19:51 frend of mine have learned hangul 22:24:48 but i saw a Finn in out TV who speaks Polish fluently and without any odd accent 22:24:56 our* 22:25:21 hmm 22:25:39 nooga: just try to IRC on finnish channels :) 22:26:15 how do you "21th" in Finnish? 22:26:22 *say* 22:26:51 tfu tfu 21st 22:27:07 kahdeskymmenesensimmäinen 22:27:10 hahah 22:27:12 i knew! 22:28:00 and kuka means "who" but kukka means "a flower" 22:28:07 yep 22:28:26 mato - worm, matto - carpet 22:29:03 puro - stream, puuro - porridge 22:29:08 -!- kipple has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 22:29:09 right. it shouldn't be a problem if you write them. pronouncing might be trickier for a foreigner though 22:29:24 yep, i tried... 22:29:57 those 16 diphtongs are also quite hard 22:31:04 for me it's hard to say something between a and e and i :) 22:31:18 because Polish is rather hard 22:32:16 i mean we've got hard speech sounds 22:33:58 got to go 22:34:02 bye 22:34:47 -!- nooga has quit.