00:03:19 <ihope> Now... can a language with limited input be Turing-complete?
00:03:48 <ihope> ...where "input" includes both the program itself and anything the user inputs?
00:16:29 <ihope> There should be only two non-esoteric languages.
00:17:11 <ihope> Programmers write in pre, then it gets compiled into post, which the computer executes.
00:36:51 <ihope> Well, I think /// is Turing-complete.
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01:13:36 <ihope_> Grumble grumble mouse fell out of the laptop allowing it to close for enough that it figured I was done using it and went into hibernate mode which caused it to lose its Internet connection grumble.
01:15:02 <ihope_> Now let's see what Linux is...
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01:38:20 <lament> what's a limited input?
01:38:40 <lament> input is irrelevant to TC
01:38:45 <lament> the turing machine has no input :)
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06:24:30 <GregorR> Is that noogaspeak for "Oh damn, just him."
06:24:51 <nooga> thank godness some1 is here
06:25:18 <nooga> it's early morning here, so our european irc channels are rather empty
06:26:29 <nooga> i've read c2bf code
06:27:00 <nooga> there should be some automaic tools for AST
06:27:37 <GregorR> There are for CST (concrete syntax tree)
06:27:43 <GregorR> But you just don't use CST ^^
06:33:25 <nooga> http://esolangs.org/wiki/Brainfork
06:34:44 <nooga> in future c2bf could compile to brainfork, but it would be hard task to use Y properly
06:38:19 <nooga> i can't access sourceforge's CVS
06:39:53 <GregorR> Just keep trying, eventually it'll work :(
06:40:12 <GregorR> Care to implement div and mod (and perhaps take this conversation to ##brainfuck :P)
06:43:01 <nooga> whan do you plan making some other types, like char and arrays?
06:43:35 <fizzie> Usually logging to shell.sf.net, doing a "cvs -d :pserver:anonymous@cvs1:/cvsroot/... co", then tarballing and scp'ing the checked-out sources home, works.
07:14:02 <nooga> because i wanted to say something about my new language
07:14:55 <GregorR> For all non-BF-related esoteric programming talk, here. BF is it's own amazing, powerful entity for elsewhere :P
07:15:29 <nooga> im working on Idiot's Arithmetics (tm)
07:16:53 <nooga> {5*3} = {555} = (in normal mode) 5+5+5 = 15
07:17:29 <nooga> i don't have an idea for doing - and negative numbers
07:17:58 <nooga> brb, switching to linux
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07:27:09 <nooga> additionally 2*3+4 is like 2*(3+4)
07:29:45 <nooga> assignment is reversed: istead of a = 5 you'll write 5 = a
07:30:35 <nooga> and variables are recognized by their soundex index
07:32:03 <nooga> so: 123 = brute; flint cute;
07:32:42 <nooga> is like in normal language: x = 123; print x;
07:35:26 <nooga> hehe, i must make arithmetics complete
07:36:25 <nooga> normal 12*5 would be: {(3*4)*5}
07:37:11 <nooga> {3333*5} = {3333 3333 3333 3333 3333} = 60
07:39:21 <GregorR> You sure it's still possible at that point?
07:39:33 <GregorR> Isn't there an ambiguity problem?
07:43:53 <nooga> that's my dilema :>
07:45:09 <nooga> is which rhyme are still the best
07:56:45 <GregorR> Though doing so makes coding a pest.
07:59:38 <nooga> what r u doing @ the moment?
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16:02:18 <J|x> moin nooga
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16:11:56 <nooga> how to shift array in rb?
16:13:39 <jix> ri Array#shift
16:39:25 <nooga> what is equivalent of flex for use fith racc?
16:40:05 <jix> write your own... it's very easy (take a look at the calc.y example)
16:40:46 <nooga> but what is the format of token stream?
16:40:53 <nooga> and how to include semantics?
16:41:22 <jix> take a look at the examples
16:41:34 <jix> or learn Japanese and read the docs
16:42:00 <nooga> only example i've managed to obtain haven't got any semantics
16:42:10 <nooga> and teher's no clue how to produce tokens
16:43:24 <jix> the token stream is an array of [:TOKEN_NAME,value] or ["token name",value] (afaik)
16:43:39 <jix> you can refer to :TOKEN_NAME using TOKEN_NAME and to "token name" using "token name"
16:43:48 <nooga> good, as i expected
16:44:04 <nooga> i use simmilar format in my hand written parser
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19:37:48 <Keymaker> http://bf-hacks.org/hacks/kbfi.b
19:46:03 <Keymaker> isn't anyone going to check it? :\
19:51:03 <kipple> keymaker:wow. sounds very cool
19:52:31 <kipple> so, is it wrapping or non-wrapping?
19:52:47 <Keymaker> it's non-wrapping, naturally :)
19:53:29 <kipple> "infinite" number of cells too?
19:54:16 <Keymaker> this program should keep it busy for a while: +[[>++<-]>]
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20:00:31 <jix> infinite memory and every cell is infinite too?!
20:00:53 <jix> and it runs on a 8bit bf?
20:01:27 <Keymaker> it won't run on 4bit because of the output thing and input
20:02:21 <kipple> what happens when you decrement below 0?
20:02:34 <Keymaker> something error behaviour starts to happen
20:02:41 <Keymaker> the interpreter doesn't check any errors
20:03:14 <Keymaker> although some of those would've been easy to implement
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22:38:01 <EgoBot> help ps kill i eof flush show ls bf_txtgen usertrig daemon undaemon
22:38:02 <EgoBot> 1l 2l adjust axo befunge bch bf{8,[16],32,64} glass glypho kipple lambda lazyk linguine malbolge pbrain rail sadol sceql trigger udage01 unlambda
22:38:28 <ihope> Just how do the 2D languages work with EgoBot?
22:39:22 <ihope> Well, who's written a non-trivial /// quine? >:-)
22:45:15 <ihope> This definitely won't work: /{\/}/{\/}/{\/}{\/{\\\/}\/{\\\/}\/{\\\/}}
22:50:39 <ihope> http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Slashes
22:50:49 <ihope> Or something like that.
22:51:04 <ihope> If not, you'll just have to guess. >:-D
23:41:26 <ihope> (And I managed to keep my Internet connection all these many... minutes...)