< 1161475779 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rodgerthegreat: i heard you so i added some output statements. < 1161476133 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i have 12 statements done < 1161476362 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes
< 1161476550 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1161476669 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@about/copyleft/user/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1161476677 0 :Keymaker!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'll self-terminate. good night < 1161476681 0 :Keymaker!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1161477191 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wahoo i'm done with my 15 statements < 1161477304 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What? Huh? Eh? < 1161477313 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wait, um... < 1161477316 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope_: what? < 1161477456 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Tbbq avtug." < 1161477481 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see. < 1161477489 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ihope_: do you want to participate too? < 1161477530 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sure. < 1161477536 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. < 1161477547 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Can I submit just one statement? < 1161477581 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uhm the rules say 5 < 1161477597 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just think of 4 other stupid features < 1161477613 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bet yes if you just submit 1 it won't be a problem < 1161477630 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's about having fun not about enforcing the rules ^^ < 1161477654 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wgat's this? < 1161477665 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: see tha lst link in the topic < 1161477666 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*last < 1161477668 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*the < 1161477802 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION saw
< 1161477818 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A bit after I asked though < 1161477837 0 :GregorR-L!n=GregorR-@c-24-21-138-66.hsd1.or.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161477853 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi GregorR-L < 1161477877 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix, is it possible that two statements can be literally incompatible with eachother being in the same language somehow? < 1161477967 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: i don't know what you are talking about but i assume yes < 1161478020 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :uh i just found an article about alpaca http://scienceblogs.com/goodmath/2006/10/a_metalanguage_for_pathologica.php < 1161478039 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If one person submits "a = b" to set a to the value of b, and one person submits "a = b" to set b to the value of a, I don't think they'll both get in :P < 1161478056 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well one could still say it depends on context < 1161478073 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or every even time it gets executed... every odd time it gets executed... < 1161478078 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :goal is to get them ALL in < 1161478248 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION can't wait to see the finished product
< 1161478281 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :neither me < 1161478338 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix, but you have some idea < 1161478342 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beforehand < 1161478343 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.< < 1161478352 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i know my 15 instructions < 1161478360 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't look into the other ones beforehand < 1161478401 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah < 1161478406 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Non-cheater >.< < 1161478426 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i want the big surprise when i read them all at once < 1161478437 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i must be like OMGLOLROFLORLYYARLYNOWAYBBQ!!!! < 1161478828 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION should write more specs for his language
< 1161478829 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :>.< < 1161478881 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If anyone has any opinions/comments about http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/esoteric/MKBL.txt please state them now. < 1161478984 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i go to bed now < 1161479016 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Night jix < 1161479087 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1161479092 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION sees the irony in "order is never evaluated"
< 1161479109 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@about/copyleft/user/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1161479122 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should really say that order is evaluated automatically at the beginning of a step, and can't be specified as a table to be evaluated < 1161479124 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi bsmntbombdood < 1161479145 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1161479202 0 :anonfunc!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1161479215 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht" < 1161479760 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1161479844 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@ppp-70-251-151-218.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161480704 0 :tgwizard!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1161480877 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1161480925 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@ppp-70-251-151-218.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161481362 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1161481431 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1161482242 0 :kipple_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1161483453 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1161483543 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my entry includes some basic flow control, one or two math primitives, some variable related things, and some basic output. I think the main thing we need to be sure to include is a good set of math and flow control operators. < 1161484364 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mingle, select, and next/forget ? < 1161484424 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's not what I have, but something similar to that could make a useful addition. < 1161484525 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh; jix left too soon. . . < 1161484538 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :? < 1161484558 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Was going to answer his (much) earlier questions. . . < 1161484564 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if you're interested in joining the factory run, there's plenty of time, pikhq. < 1161484568 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1161484602 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: My previous basm build was about 7100 characters. < 1161484616 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah- still quite an improvement. < 1161484653 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my pong game is at 330 bytes, and I think I may be able to shave it down further. < 1161484666 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My first attempt was nearly 17000 characters. . . < 1161484673 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow < 1161484682 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Incredibly inefficient. ;) < 1161484703 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I assume this means your macro package has been gaining some significant upgrades during this process. < 1161484724 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not at all. < 1161484742 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Only upgrade was stdcons.bfm, provided by oerjan. . . < 1161484752 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Everything else was just dicking with the code. < 1161484761 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1161484792 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The basm.bfm code, that is. < 1161484812 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err. . . I made *one* change; @ automatically calls is0 now. < 1161484837 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that doesn't change the output code much, just makes a variable declaration shorter. < 1161485009 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/Adjudicated_Blind_Collaborative_Design_Esolang_Factory <- do you plan on contributing? < 1161485030 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just for the hell of it. < 1161485049 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why else would you? :) < 1161485309 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is proud of basm. . .
< 1161485337 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let's see if I can make it *smaller*. < 1161485374 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Looking at the BFM code. . . Hell yeah, but I don't feel like it right now. < 1161485548 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you could join my "classic game crunching" competition in ##Nonlogic. < 1161485581 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I made pong in Chipmunk BASIC, Zashi built tic-tac-toe, and feesh is working on blackjack. < 1161485591 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In Chipmunk BASIC? < 1161485616 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hell yeah. I got it down to 330 bytes, which is not too shabby no matter how you look at it. < 1161485637 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I might try rock-paper-scissors in an esolang next.. < 1161485673 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Zashi's perl implementation of Tic-tac-toe is pretty impressive. < 1161485923 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1161485951 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what? It's some light programming fun. < 1161486115 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :here's my 384-byte version with an AI: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/text/1161482453.html < 1161486427 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If anyone has any opinions/comments about http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/esoteric/MKBL.txt please state them now. < 1161486453 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone please state some ideas on how to do ifs < 1161486512 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And what operations should I have? < 1161486529 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably add, subtract, mult, div < 1161486537 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Anything else? < 1161486566 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1161486573 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should have a timetable < 1161486644 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :perhaps a variable swap operator? < 1161486653 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :useful for sorting algos and the like. < 1161486681 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How would that work? < 1161486738 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1161486794 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I guess I don't fully understand your language. < 1161486846 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's meant to be in a metakit dblikething < 1161486890 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Think of order[0,"main","outgoing"] as being a row in table "order" with fields that have values 0, "main", and "outgoing" < 1161486932 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :order[time:I,branch:S,tables:S] specifies the fields in the table. order is the table, time is a field that holds an int, branch and tables hold a string < 1161486988 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1161487103 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brb < 1161487130 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BTW, Basm's BFM source is now up. . . < 1161487137 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/basm.tar.bz2 < 1161487299 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1161487347 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bbs < 1161487913 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1161487918 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1161487921 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Should I explain the language more? < 1161488111 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION pokes pikhq
< 1161488115 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and RodgerTheGreat < 1161488123 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not paying attention. :p < 1161488131 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1161488146 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION goes to add a time table
< 1161488437 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OMG I just realized that the time table will make it easy to change branches, or even make branches unneccessary < 1161488732 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Look at http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/esoteric/MKBL.txt for an explanation of time < 1161488818 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/esoteric/MKBL.txt < 1161488820 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :err < 1161489033 0 :ivan`!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1161490557 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@about/copyleft/user/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1161490942 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1161490970 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :#esoteric: Where we all talk about our own projects and listen to no-one else :P < 1161491058 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I finished the specs for SLUMTP. < 1161491081 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Self-Load UDP Mass Transfer Protocol.) < 1161491087 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Japanese, then implementation! < 1161491118 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@ppp-70-251-151-218.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161491124 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :NOW you're gettin' it! < 1161491141 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And your priorities are f***'d up if you're translating the spec before implementing it ... < 1161491189 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, I would implement it first (which is what I normally do because I'm too lazy to write a spec :P) but I'd forget some key thing I decided on earlier every time I'd neglect to write my notes down. < 1161491211 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So I started making some notes so that I wouldn't forget the decisions I made and then decided to flesh the notes into a cursory set of specs. < 1161491234 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And this somehow has to do with /translating/ the specs? < 1161491254 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Japanese means doing my daily vocabulary in Japanese -_-'' < 1161491296 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OH < 1161491301 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1161491863 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1161493168 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Heheheh. . . < 1161493227 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is proud of basm. . .
< 1161493234 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wonders if anyone else cares :p
< 1161493241 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No. < 1161493265 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's the smallest BF->C compiler in BF. Why should you not care? < 1161493270 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was absolutely shocked that somebody mentioned Plof - that's about the most recognition anybody in this channel will give to anybody else :P < 1161493287 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, yeah. < 1161493306 0 :Eidolos!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1161493349 0 :Eidolos!n=Sartak@c-24-61-30-218.hsd1.ma.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161493682 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Plof? < 1161493686 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hi Eidolos < 1161493693 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION likes BFComp
< 1161493708 0 :Eidolos!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hiya. < 1161493716 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :At least, I think I _would_ like it if I had any interest in writing BF stuff < 1161493769 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BFM > BFComp. . . < 1161493785 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(for efficiency purposes; for nonesotericness, BFComp wins) < 1161493797 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's BFM? < 1161493837 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A macro language for Brainfuck (by me (with much thanks to oerjan)). < 1161493848 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1161493918 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(if you request proof of my statement, allow me to show you basm, as done (naively) in BFComp, and as done in BFM. . .) < 1161493949 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1161494001 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok.. < 1161494006 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whynot? < 1161494041 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@about/copyleft/user/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1161494043 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/basm.tar.bz2 contains the BFM version (BFM source, and compiled). < 1161494112 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/basm.bfc contains the BFC version, and http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/basm.bf the compilation of the same. < 1161494145 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thing is, you don't really need to understand and work in BF to do BFComp ;) < 1161494173 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think < 1161494178 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You don't need to understand BF to do BFM, either. < 1161494190 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It just makes things assloads more efficient if you do. < 1161494307 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Although BFM has a semiTcl syntax, instead of a semiC one. < 1161494393 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is BF bitwidth? < 1161494473 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Most of the included macros assume cells wrap and 8 bits per cell, but BFM can produce code for whatever bitwidth you want (although you might not be able to use stdlib). < 1161494492 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION meant what is http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Brainfuck_bitwidth_conversions for
< 1161494500 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. < 1161494522 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Some Brainfuck implementations use 8 bits per cell, others 16, and still others 32. . . < 1161494600 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Those allow you to convert code between bitwidths, so it can run on other implementations. < 1161494971 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And one 64 < 1161494990 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GregorR-L: And no code. < 1161494999 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: :P < 1161495004 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I wrote those conversions, btw 8-D < 1161495042 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Surely there are implementations with unlimited bitwidth? < 1161495064 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not unlimited. < 1161495071 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bignum implemenations exist, though. < 1161495083 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant, limited only to the comps own memory < 1161495090 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(these are limited by the available memory on the machine running the program) < 1161495099 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah ok < 1161495117 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should write bignum support into EgoBF ... < 1161495126 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Conversions can be piled on top of conversions, right? < 1161495133 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using GMP? < 1161495321 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's GMP? < 1161495371 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :GNU MultiPrecision [math library] < 1161495383 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: Yeah, but it gets exponentially slower < 1161495890 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Remote closed the connection < 1161495962 0 :bsmntbombdood!n=gavin@about/copyleft/user/bsmntbombdood JOIN :#esoteric < 1161495974 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1161497634 0 :calamari!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1161497964 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo[ZadocOnStri < 1161497996 0 :Sgeo[ZadocOnStri!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo[ZadocStriki < 1161498005 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :back < 1161498009 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's up? < 1161498010 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::) < 1161500417 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :kick ASS, I think I just had a breakthrough brainstorm. < 1161500424 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoo. < 1161500433 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shall define the syntax of SYNTHESYS tonight! < 1161500442 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Evil bastard. < 1161500449 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :making it stack-based solves *everything* < 1161500451 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha < 1161500466 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again: evil bastard. < 1161500537 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I shall unveil my beautiful creation when a reference interpreter is complete. (still may be a while). < 1161500549 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and I shall implement it... in Java. :D < 1161500655 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Bad man. < 1161501194 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, let's see... concat, split, inc/dec, replace, assign... what else do people want to do with strings? < 1161501560 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh, got it. < 1161501592 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a specialized form of replace to avoid needing escape sequences. < 1161501812 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :DONE! < 1161501828 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :allow me to tease you all with a hello, world: < 1161501829 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"Hello, World!"! < 1161501843 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :or, the more interesting version: < 1161501844 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"XHello, World!X!":# < 1161503321 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1161503999 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1161504000 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1161504181 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :g'night, everyone. < 1161504551 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey! BF friends! < 1161504581 0 :Razor-X!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not create a special cell in BF for Linuxes that let you execute kernel syscalls based on adjacent memory positions? < 1161506373 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like. < 1161509131 0 :GregorR-L!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1161513633 0 :tgwizard!n=tgwizard@c-103fe155.178-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1161513924 0 :ihope_!n=foo@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161513942 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1161514068 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518103 0 :lindi-!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518115 0 :ihope_!n=foo@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518117 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518123 0 :lindi-!n=lindi@kulho150.adsl.netsonic.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518137 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=RodgerTh@wads-5-233-121.resnet.mtu.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518145 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518145 0 :fizzie!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518146 0 :ghostless!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518146 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518146 0 :puzzlet_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518146 0 :sp3tt!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518146 0 :pgimeno!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518146 0 :CakeProphet!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518147 0 :bd_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518147 0 :Anders!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518147 0 :cmeme!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518148 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518148 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161518171 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :CakeProphet!n=CakeProp@h148.233.213.151.ip.alltel.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :puzzlet_!n=puzzlet@58.77.172.41 JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :fizzie!n=fizban@sesefras.zem.fi JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :pikhq!n=pikhq@67-21-19-37.clspco.adelphia.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :ghostless!i=cd46c6dd@neon.trighost.org JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :sp3tt!n=sp3tt@80-162.cust.umeaenergi.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :pgimeno!n=pgimeno@124.Red-80-59-211.staticIP.rima-tde.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :bd_!n=bdonlan@donlanbj3.umeres.maine.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :Anders!i=anders@unaffiliated/anders1 JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :cmeme!n=cmeme@boa.b9.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :SimonRC!i=sc@bylands.dur.ac.uk JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518171 0 :EgoBot!n=EgoBot@c-24-21-138-66.hsd1.mn.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161518924 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1161518927 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1161519704 0 :kipple_!n=kipple@167.80-202-102.nextgentel.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161519769 0 :kipple_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Client Quit < 1161519834 0 :kipple_!n=kipple@167.80-202-102.nextgentel.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161520108 0 :jix!n=jix@L61f3.l.strato-dslnet.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1161524112 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161526609 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When's the last time somebody said something? < 1161526800 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people are saying things all the time < 1161526816 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :mu < 1161526896 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is the answer to the question I meant to ask? < 1161527010 0 :kipple_!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :42 < 1161527184 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't know i haven't read the logs yet. but no one has spoken since i last logged on. < 1161527263 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Nor here. < 1161527674 0 :Arrogant!i=Paragon@64.orlando-04-05rs.fl.dial-access.att.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161528814 0 :Sgeo[ZadocStriki!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[3:39] I like. < 1161528825 0 :Sgeo[ZadocStriki!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oops < 1161528828 0 :Sgeo[ZadocStriki!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Sgeo < 1161528865 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grrrr < 1161528882 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I don't really know my own nickserv pass < 1161528892 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just have XChat do it < 1161528930 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Lamer. :-P < 1161529045 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I can't believe I spoke while "striking" though < 1161529056 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Has anyone here read 1/0? < 1161529398 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't even know what 1/0 refers to < 1161529596 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://undefined.net/1/0/ < 1161531276 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1161531556 0 :Sgeo_!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf61f7.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161532109 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Connection timed out < 1161532155 0 :ihope_!n=foo@c-71-205-100-59.hsd1.mi.comcast.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161532165 0 :ihope_!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :ihope < 1161532205 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why do we need so many naive set theory paradoxes? < 1161532207 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Isn't one enough? < 1161532226 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :...Wrong channel. < 1161532288 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so that we don't get to close the holes by just doing simple tricks? < 1161532345 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is removing comprehension one of those simple tricks? < 1161532444 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's not removed, it's divided into lots of little pieces. < 1161532477 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :most of the ZFC axioms are really just pieces of comprehension... < 1161532479 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What happens if it's removed? < 1161532506 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you then have nothing to build sets with < 1161532522 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So no sets exist, necessarily? < 1161532531 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only extensionality and choice < 1161532538 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :indeed < 1161532942 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Looked at the basm BFM source yet? < 1161532950 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1161532954 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(just assuming you might be interested) < 1161532976 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/basm.tar.bz2 Source to the smallest BF->C compiler in C (that I know of). . . < 1161533028 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in BF, i take you mean < 1161533039 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yes. . . < 1161533053 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brain not working. :p < 1161533228 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, an immediate problem: that initial comment in basm.bfm contains some brainfuck commands < 1161533251 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr. . . You're right. < 1161533270 0 :Arrogant!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1161533270 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Put [] around it. < 1161533334 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Done. < 1161533344 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net < 1161533352 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1161533366 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And new tarball up. < 1161533411 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :haha in my current application i'm calling ruby from objective-c then i call objc from ruby again then javascript from objc..... < 1161533484 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :! < 1161533487 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? < 1161533570 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that strings.bfm - it seems a bit inefficient to use cons* macros for everything < 1161533651 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It is a bit. < 1161533654 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a bit of copying and small additions could compress that < 1161533676 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've just not bothered with a complete rewrite yet. < 1161533681 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok < 1161533700 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Using cons* as a stopgap until I get it completely done. < 1161533705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and still this is the largest part of the program? < 1161533724 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :should expect some major savings then < 1161533732 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, it's now about half of the program. < 1161533755 0 :Azstal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161533837 0 :Azstal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1161533839 0 :n1\fijikuwai!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161533840 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it seems like there really ought to be defaults for the second argument of @ < 1161533844 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1161533852 0 :n1\fijikuwai!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Asztal < 1161533874 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Could be a good idea; it'd make things much easier in that large of a program. < 1161533883 0 :Sgeo_!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1161533989 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) < 1161533991 0 :n1\fijikuwai!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161533993 0 :n1\fijikuwai!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Asztal < 1161534150 0 :n1\fijikuwai!n=asztal@cpc1-{tkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161534227 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :these out* macros, are they that way to avoid long stretches of > and < ? < 1161534249 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easiest way to avoid it for outputting the strings set by strings.bfm. < 1161534275 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's what i thought < 1161534295 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[<]<[<]>[>.]>[>] < 1161534299 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err. < 1161534302 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[<]<[<]>[.>]>[>] < 1161534304 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :;) < 1161534727 0 :n1\fijikuwai!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Asztal: DIE < 1161534759 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1161534761 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :n1\fijikuwai: nickserv ghost. < 1161534766 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There you go. < 1161534768 0 :n1\fijikuwai!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :Asztal < 1161534770 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1161534799 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that part setting sc looks suspiciously like cons57 followed by add 2. why not use cons59 instead? < 1161534904 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Because doing that adds 2 characters to the compiled output. < 1161534978 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i don't understand how that can be.. < 1161534995 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :. . . Oh. < 1161535001 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just realised what you're saying. XD < 1161535054 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah; that works. < 1161535070 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :while cons59 actually uses 63-4 rather than 57+2, those options have the same length. < 1161535101 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except when I need to set the temp cell used to 10 after I'm done. < 1161535129 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons57 sc : nl;add nl 10 gets the job done just as efficiently; thanks for the tip. < 1161535154 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you mean cons59, i think < 1161535204 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just remove the add sc 2 line < 1161535247 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Err. < 1161535256 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons57 sc : nl;add nl 10;add sc 2 < 1161535256 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :of course those variable should really be included in the complete rewriting for strings.bfm when that happens < 1161535279 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons59 sc : nl;add nl 10 gets the job done inefficiently < 1161535281 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Of course. < 1161535299 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's inefficient about it? < 1161535318 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :2 extra pointless characters. < 1161535323 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(pointer movements) < 1161535353 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[>+<-]++++++++++>++ vs. [>+<-]>++<++++++++++ < 1161535364 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(forgive me for not using the actual loop) < 1161535435 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh, now i realize what you mean < 1161535506 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1161535549 0 :SimonRC!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I suspect that optimisations could be made if you can prove that the pointer is always at a ceretain place relative to some other place at a certain point in the program < 1161535579 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the out* macros essentially do that < 1161535642 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :now i've got it: move the set nl 10 first, and use cons59 sc : as < 1161535670 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still some extra pointer movements. < 1161535674 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(I've tried it) < 1161535725 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[>>sc<>++ vs. [>sc++ < 1161535761 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :cons57 sc : nl;add nl 10;add sc 2 works. < 1161535827 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, no, sc and as are just 1 apart, for some reason the addresses are not assigned in order < 1161535839 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, right. < 1161535859 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I played with that portion of the memory setup a bit. . . < 1161535867 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And forgot I did that. < 1161535916 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but i think you are still right. < 1161535921 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh; that still adds 2 extra character movements. < 1161535952 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pointer. < 1161536012 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :this happens essentially because cons10 is a 1 cell operation < 1161536036 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1161536037 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it pays to do it while you happen to be at nl < 1161536074 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Makes things a bit harder to understand, but not severly so. < 1161536213 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the only other option is to move nl last in the variable list < 1161536376 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, no that's not the point either < 1161536513 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or just leave it as-is. ;) < 1161536525 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually there is one possibility for cons59 which does not make any final additions. _that_ would work. < 1161536537 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1161536583 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :----[>+++++<----] < 1161537450 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i modified my stdcons generating program to prefer algorithms that don't add/subtract at the end. new version at http://home.nvg.org/~oerjan/stdcons.bfm < 1161537459 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wakes up
< 1161537464 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi everyone. < 1161537486 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'Lo. < 1161537490 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: Yay! < 1161537491 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi < 1161537524 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :note that it naturally still selects only among the shortest algorithms. < 1161537548 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so it affects cons59 but not, say, cons58. < 1161537560 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: That brought the size down radically. < 1161537566 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5128 characters now. < 1161537676 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wow, it apparently was a widespread problem then. what was the size before? < 1161537696 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION seems to recall 7000
< 1161537705 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i mean before the latest change < 1161537709 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :5140. < 1161537742 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That somehow wasn't quite as radical as I expected :P < 1161537762 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not much, but it seems rather signifigant for a change that doesn't change the size of the individual macros. < 1161537782 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it only avoids some possible pointer movement afterward < 1161537798 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1161538014 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is rather good for a change that only affected a few numbers: 59, 93, 123, 125 and 163. < 1161538033 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Indeed. < 1161538167 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::o < 1161538310 0 :Sgeo!n=Sgeo@ool-18bf61f7.dyn.optonline.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1161538585 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :a quick check shows that strings.bfm contained 3 instances of cons59 followed by cons10 - to be expected, as this is ";\n". < 1161538655 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would explain it. < 1161538669 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Someone should make an esolang based on http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buffalo_buffalo_Buffalo_buffalo_buffalo_buffalo_Buffalo_buffalo. < 1161538712 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :as well as two instances of 123 10 which is "{\n" < 1161538734 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Again: that would explain it. < 1161538745 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so by a coincidence two of the affected numbers were very common in C < 1161538941 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you know what? change that cons125 cb : end at the beginning of basm.bfm into cons125 cb : nl < 1161538980 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That doesn't change a thing size-wise. < 1161538988 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm... < 1161538995 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it might have < 1161539033 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Still 5128 characters. < 1161539149 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, right, it would only change the placement of a movement from end to nl < 1161543269 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: yet another BF clone? < 1161543279 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1161543341 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :buffalo buffalo buffalo = +; buffalo buffalo Buffalo = -... < 1161543362 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Easy to make a compiler. < 1161543389 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Now, here's an idea that just sort of hit me: for that BF instruction minimalization thing, make it accept Unary programs terminated with an asterisk. < 1161543479 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Shouldn't be especially hard to do. < 1161543526 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :rather hard to program though < 1161543557 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hard to program in, or hard to program? < 1161543602 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hard to program in < 1161543618 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So is Brainfuck; your point? :p < 1161543644 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just use a compiler. < 1161543649 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually, impossible to program in < 1161543692 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Practically impossible, you mean? < 1161543702 0 :Asztal!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1161543724 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unary can be compiled to and from Brainfuck, you know. < 1161543760 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sure, if you have more than the lifetime of the universe... < 1161543932 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://thegriddle.net/unary/ < 1161544032 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that's fine. now convert basm.b to unary. tell me when you are finished :) < 1161544084 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Argh; said script is a bit borken. < 1161544139 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: see, practically impossible. < 1161544165 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Use Fibonacci codes if you want something a bit more linear rather than exponential. < 1161544298 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unary could be one way of compressing a BF program. . . < 1161544316 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Transmit the number of zeros instead of the actual BF code. ;) < 1161544351 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that wouldn't be unary, but binary < 1161544369 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That... wouldn't be compression. < 1161544390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Unary gives you a large amount of 0s. < 1161544404 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Count the number of 0s, and you've got the compressed BF. < 1161544420 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the string of zeros is unary. their number in binary is binary. < 1161544422 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Uncompression: run that number of 0s through Unary->BF. < 1161544429 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that wouldn't be compression. < 1161544434 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well. < 1161544438 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, it wouldnt. < 1161544457 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You should compress your BF code into more BF code. < 1161544485 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :,[.,] vs 56623. < 1161544521 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(56623 can be represented very efficiently in binary) < 1161544548 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. < 1161544551 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Stupid as hell, but it'd work. < 1161544564 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :3/8 compression from bf ascii representation to binary < 1161544570 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You could probably be more efficient by just representing each BF opcode using 3 bits. < 1161544586 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh, maybe. < 1161544589 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :eh, Unary is defined by going through that representation < 1161545688 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/BF-RLE < 1161545709 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wrote it :p
< 1161545733 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BFZ is simpler. :p < 1161545746 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BFZ? < 1161545774 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Something I wrote for the esoteric programming contest. < 1161545786 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RLEs +, -, > and <. < 1161545863 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :How are loops and I/O done? < 1161545937 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[]., < 1161545954 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It's a compression program for inefficient Brainfuck. . . < 1161545992 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh < 1161545998 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I misunderstood what you said < 1161546029 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are specs available? < 1161546040 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Not really; quick hack. < 1161546063 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Is it safe to say that BF-RLE is more efficient =P? < 1161546074 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION keeps trying to find a reason to gloat
< 1161546107 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No, BF-RLE probably isn't. < 1161546114 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BF-RLE isn't even implemented. < 1161546121 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BFZ is implemented. . . In Brainfuck. < 1161546490 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There's a language somehow based on BF-RLE :p < 1161546530 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION recently discovered Trainfuck. . .
< 1161546545 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Brainfuck+network I/O+file I/O. < 1161546558 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should write an HTTP daemon in it, just for the hell of it. :p < 1161546966 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esolangs.org/wiki/User:Sgeo/binbf < 1161547090 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1161547097 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm not sure if it's ever even useful < 1161547178 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION wrote that stuff waaay too long ago
< 1161547316 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Though if you want pain, look at previous revisions < 1161547498 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oO Network Headache is implemented?? < 1161548889 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I oughta run my own server. < 1161549733 0 :bsmntbombdood!i=gavin@gateway/tor/x-922afc282039a782 JOIN :#esoteric < 1161550834 0 :Asztal!n=asztal@cpc1-stkn2-0-0-cust919.midd.cable.ntl.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1161551280 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is bored. . .
< 1161551287 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I should play with FukYourBrane a bit. < 1161551301 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Perhaps a self-replicator? < 1161551564 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: why use adaptive huffman coding < 1161551576 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :why not use some arithmetic coding like a range coder? < 1161551581 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :range coder? < 1161551610 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: you know arithmetic coding? < 1161551617 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :no.. < 1161551647 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a better form of entropy encoding than huffman < 1161551674 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :huffman approximates the optimal information that is needed for each symbol by whole bit lengths.... but that isn't optimal < 1161551693 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arithmetic coding isn't limited to that.... so it generates smaller output < 1161551695 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arithmetic_coding < 1161551712 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and the range coder is a patent free way of doing arithmetic coding (many others are patented) < 1161551752 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one of the big advantages is that there is no sorting involved... you can work right from the probabilities... no need to generate a tree... that makes it faster for adaptive encoders < 1161551798 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The thing was really designed for Huffman < 1161551804 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Don't know if it can be changed < 1161551811 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sgeo: it can < 1161551828 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :arithmetic coding does roughly the same as huffman < 1161551830 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :only a bit better < 1161551904 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm what's fgk? < 1161551937 0 :Eidolos!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"[arithmetic coding] will often approach optimal entropy encoding much more closely than Huffman can." < 1161551949 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Whoohooo. I created a program which actually fails against nothing.fyb. < 1161551967 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :imho fyb is seriously flawed < 1161551985 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I was attempting to make a replicator. . . < 1161551992 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And I made nothing.fyb win. < 1161552011 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix, I saw it mentioned under the Huffman entry < 1161552023 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well it is just too easy to get some non looping code to setup bombs in some critical parts very fast that any attempt to do some logic will fail < 1161552026 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I chose FGK just so there's some standard one used < 1161552171 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And he's got programs combating that. < 1161552321 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: huh what? < 1161552464 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION laffs at http://www.inference.phy.cam.ac.uk/mackay/itila/Potter.html
< 1161552604 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bwahargh < 1161552639 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1161552689 0 :bd_!unknown@unknown.invalid PART #esoteric :? < 1161552774 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :In conclusion, we can give a cautious recommendation of Harry Potter only to speakers of Welsh and Latin; for everyone else, we recommend Information Theory, Inference, and Learning Algorithms. < 1161553149 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think I've got a self-replicator. < 1161553361 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There is one problem with it. . . As it's a self-replicator, it doesn't really write bombs. < 1161554269 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :IRP: Please provide the decimal expansion of Ackermann(4,3) < 1161554928 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ERROR: Don't wanna. < 1161555390 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I've created a guaranteed-lose FYB program. < 1161555404 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nothing.fyb beats it. < 1161555409 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm? < 1161555416 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :h/o < 1161555444 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!fyb http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/foo.fyb < 1161555446 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Running... < 1161555448 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Watch and laugh. < 1161555453 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Grr. < 1161555467 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Where are the specs?? < 1161555479 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :-13. < 1161555483 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/files/fyb/ < 1161555494 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It lost against ever program EgoBot has. < 1161555544 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Including ones you can't lose against. < 1161555546 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Wouldn't * be an all-lose? < 1161555618 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That would explain why it doesn't work. XD < 1161555638 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I meant just a standalone * < 1161555648 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm. . . Still an all-lose. < 1161555650 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Probably. < 1161555665 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah. < 1161555704 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :My * would lose even against your all-lose I think =P < 1161555751 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!fyb http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/esoteric/all_lose.fyb < 1161555760 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Running... < 1161555809 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :total points: -12 < 1161555833 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : all_lose.fyb < 1161555833 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric : [x] all_lose.fyb < 1161555846 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It does. < 1161555923 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm? < 1161555943 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1161555974 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :{+!>} < 1161555979 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Seek and mangle. ;) < 1161556015 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq, what about it? < 1161556068 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh wow couldn't that choke due to trying to commit a @? < 1161556089 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :It attempts to find the pointer; at the same time, it mangles the array. . . < 1161556089 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Well, * would still suicide < 1161556092 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Yeah, it would. < 1161556298 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION needs to beat logicex-2.fyb
< 1161556459 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What is logicex? < 1161556485 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!fyb http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/bomber.fyb < 1161556488 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Running... < 1161556490 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :A horrible good FYB program. < 1161556539 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :6 points on that one. < 1161556548 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Beats logicex-1.fyb. :) < 1161558516 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION has it subverting defects now
< 1161558614 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, yes- corewar's painfully deformed cousing- FYB. < 1161558620 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :*cousin < 1161558768 0 :tgwizard!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1161559134 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :!!!!! < 1161559137 0 :EgoBot!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Huh? < 1161559145 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :lol < 1161559152 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(Nothing happened; I just feel like using an extra exclamation mark or two!!!!!) < 1161559158 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1161559172 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Dunno why; just... need a vent. < 1161559183 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :See, my vents are always nice little ones. < 1161559210 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Except I need to vent a little of this too: :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) < 1161559214 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :There. < 1161559250 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :refreshing. < 1161559375 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION registers #vents as a place for venting
< 1161559390 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Actually, ##vents would be a better channel. < 1161559435 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so, anyway, I completed the spec for a language I've been working on for a while last night, and I'm debating between releasing the spec now and trying to get help building libraries for it or waiting until I finish a reference interpreter. < 1161559465 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Why not release it now? < 1161559522 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, it always seems pretty lame to come up with a language and show it off before you've completed the hard part- a functioning interpreter. < 1161559549 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That's what I've been doing. < 1161559553 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Let me implement it; no nasty Java for us. :p < 1161559561 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hey who are you calling lame :) < 1161559565 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what would you implement it in? < 1161559574 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Java2000! < 1161559579 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or whatever that's called. < 1161559585 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. Java2K < 1161559587 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Tcl or C. < 1161559602 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or, if I'm insane, Brainfuck. < 1161559607 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Thue. < 1161559615 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or Glass. < 1161559616 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION didn't make an interpreter for BF-RLE..
< 1161559618 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Maybe ORK. < 1161559621 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or even Thubi. < 1161559622 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, I'd still most likely implement it in Java regardless, but if there's interest, what the hell... < 1161559623 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Then again, I think I'm just lame < 1161559624 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Ah, Glass. < 1161559637 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :And the language is rather trivial < 1161559859 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, here's my creation- SYNTHESYS: http://www.nonlogic.org/dump/text/1161556217.html < 1161559923 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's a stack-based language with named string variables and some macroing and self-modification abilities. < 1161559960 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :people where are your entries? < 1161559971 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I already sent mine in. < 1161559981 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: yeah but you are the only one < 1161559995 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :woo. I have defined the language spec singlehandedly. < 1161560049 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hmm < 1161560060 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could do statements from MKBL < 1161560072 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But that would break the language irreversibly I think < 1161560161 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: is there a bfm tutorial anywhere or documentation or at least something? < 1161560250 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :jix: I unfortunately rewrite the interpreter much faster than I update the specs. < 1161560303 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :If anyone wishes it, I shall begin the BFM tutorial here (in a similar manner to the Glass tutorial Gregor did a while back). < 1161560350 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ok, I'll take this as showing no interest in synth. < 1161560364 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm actually wondering how I shall interpret it right now. < 1161560368 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :
ACTION is rather interested
< 1161560405 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: i'm interested but i don't get it from the specs < 1161560416 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I think this is the best combo of concise syntax and extensibility without being cripplingly hard. < 1161560429 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm. < 1161560447 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I could explain one of the code examples, if you think that would help. < 1161560483 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just don't see how one declares macros. < 1161560525 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :you push a named variable to assign it to, then a string literal (or equivalent), and then use the assignment operator. (@). < 1161560556 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then you can call the macro by pushing it's parameters, then it's name, and using the execute operator (#). < 1161560567 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah < 1161560576 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oh. . . I see. < 1161560576 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i'm very interested now < 1161560578 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So. . . < 1161560600 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'sum' "[-~+],"@ < 1161560601 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is there a way to split a string literal? < 1161560613 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :??sum# < 1161560615 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :That it? < 1161560643 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :if I do 'sum' "[-~+~],"@ and then "4""5"'sum'# < 1161560649 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then that will add the two. < 1161560660 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :idea make macro names and string literals the same < 1161560664 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So, my call would be ??'sum'#, not ??sum# < 1161560667 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"4" 5 'sum' also works. < 1161560677 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(adding two chars from stdin) < 1161560707 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :macros are just strings, in effect, and so invoking them works the same as pushing a string reference (which is what you're literally doing) < 1161560725 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm thinking about how I'd parse this; it wouldn't be all *that* hard to do. . . Just need to do it. . . < 1161560736 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :there is a difference between 9 and "9", of course. < 1161560749 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one is a numeric literal and one is a string literal. < 1161560755 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: but there is adifference between 'asd' and "asd" or is ther none? < 1161560766 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I designed it to be pretty easy to parse. < 1161560768 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :'asd' is a variable, "asd" is a string. < 1161560774 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :exactly < 1161560775 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i say remove the difference < 1161560779 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :... < 1161560787 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :"asd"'asd'@ < 1161560787 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :then how would you use named references? < 1161560801 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :RodgerTheGreat: well variables are pushed on the stack right? < 1161560803 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :strings too right? < 1161560823 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :variables are *references* to strings, not the string itself. < 1161560831 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah < 1161560843 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nargh < 1161560847 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can't explain < 1161560848 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :being exclusively stack-based could make this a great deal harder to use. < 1161560873 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it would be possible to use strings as references to strings < 1161560874 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I see it being a bit easier in some ways. < 1161560884 0 :pikhq!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(stacks don't bother me all that much. . .) < 1161561015 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :well, the language would need need more stack-management operators. < 1161561459 0 :ihope!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Pointy is all about pointers. < 1161561592 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :pikhq: btw i want a bfm introduction...