00:00:21 var null; 00:00:28 brainfuckcode(string, null); 00:00:29 >:D 00:01:29 And to make a Glass interpreter: 00:01:30 var string; 00:01:32 that reads in some brainfuck code then executes it? 00:01:32 var null; 00:01:49 brainfuckcode("[>,]", string); 00:01:55 glasscode(string, null); 00:01:59 Asztal: Yup. 00:04:18 * Sgeo wants Asztal's statements to look like 2. 00:04:24 hmm 00:05:03 I was thinking of a syntax more like ASSURE,CASVS etc 00:05:24 the stack ones were going to be: 00:05:32 Does anyone like my branches? 00:05:36 var1, meet var2 (for merging stacks) 00:07:18 How many statements are Stackaware? 00:07:21 Just Asztal's? 00:07:54 well p00p and q00q are 00:07:54 bbl 00:08:07 they are defined to store eveyrything associated with a variable 00:08:26 well UNDO probably uses its own stacks :) 00:08:30 Ahh, so it will have to store the whole variable stack? 00:08:35 right 00:08:40 including all bitsinks 00:08:41 oerjan, let's make those stacks manipulable! 00:09:00 The programmer can break UNDO! 00:09:26 UNDO is broken by design, in case you haven't noticed :) 00:10:41 (i.e. interleaving UNDOs for different statements is going to be really weird) 00:10:45 -!- bsmntbom1dood has joined. 00:10:54 Hi bsmntbom1dood 00:11:00 http://www.harderweb.de/tmp_jix/allofthem.txt 00:11:05 -!- Sgeo has set topic: the international hub for esoteric programming language design and deployment - map: http://www.frappr.com/esolang - forum: http://esolangs.org/forum/ - EgoBot: !help - wiki: http://esolangs.org/wiki/ - logs: http://tunes.org/~nef/logs/esoteric/ or http://meme.b9.com/cdates.html?channel=esoteric - for brainfuck-specific discussion, go to ##brainfuck - http://esolangs.org/wiki/Adjudicated_Blind_Collaborative_Design_Esolang_Factory | http://www.ha. 00:11:12 Meh 00:11:18 YOU LOSES AGAINS 00:12:17 Incidentally, unless there's a GOTO, only statements in branch 0 are executed >.< 00:12:24 (At least, that's what I intended) 00:13:14 hmm 00:13:20 wrt the "poop stack" 00:13:33 "poop" should be a predeclared variable 00:13:34 I read them like line labels from olde BASIC 00:13:49 Branches are essentially cases of statements :) 00:14:08 is it a p00p stack or a p00p stack stack? or stack stack stack? 00:14:40 -!- GregorR-L has quit ("kill(getpid(), SIGTHISJOKEISNOWSTALE)"). 00:14:43 "cases of" statements? 00:15:08 WARNING: Parsing error in English 00:15:09 -!- bsmntbombdood has quit ("foo"). 00:15:20 in the sense of CASVS: the order of statements in different branches don't matter? 00:15:27 -!- bsmntbom1dood has changed nick to bsmntbombdood. 00:15:28 switch(branch){ case 0: ASSURE 1=x;} 00:16:06 I intended it to basically be like each branch is a seperate program 00:16:17 Err 00:16:22 Well, variables and stuff stay 00:16:25 -!- bsmntbombdood has left (?). 00:16:37 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined. 00:16:46 <0> ASSURE «x = y» 00:17:04 ERROR: ILLEGAL BRANCH <0> 00:17:07 <0> isn't allowed 00:17:29 oops. 00:17:35 Branch 0 is simply the branch when you don't specify the branch 00:17:49 you can't specify the default branch >.< 00:18:08 ERROR: BRANCH 0 IS THE TRUNK 00:18:39 Branches like <-1> are allowed 00:18:43 part 00:19:05 Hmm 00:19:10 -!- bsmntbombdood has left (?). 00:19:20 allowing vars in branch labels would be, erm, interesting 00:19:24 no 00:19:28 please... 00:19:35 Those would be roots, then 00:19:39 jix, what if I said that in the email? 00:20:02 well 00:20:06 it is hard enough ... 00:20:14 he means "no, for the love of god, do you have to make this any more difficult!?" 00:20:30 well, that's what I read it as . 00:20:31 * Sgeo knows 00:20:44 -!- bsmntbombdood has joined. 00:20:48 But wouldn't he have had to have if it was in the original email? 00:21:48 2222231231231232113123 00:21:51 oops. 00:23:34 5213111213111213111213122113111213 00:24:23 how coincidental 00:24:41 what? 00:25:21 that we both accidentally typed numbers :P 00:25:32 mine wasn't accidental 00:25:36 I was trying to change views in trackmania, but this had stolen focus :( 00:26:17 i was trying to be a smartass :) 00:26:37 Incidentally, can one CHANGE branch labels? 00:26:58 Hmm, no :( 00:27:12 but almost anything else can be CHANGEd, right? 00:27:24 What if an ASSURE is changed after it has been executed? 00:27:41 hm, the 0th used value could be the branch label 00:27:52 Muahaha 00:27:59 Sgeo, I imagine it will use the change value next time you land on the assume? 00:28:34 Would the branch label need to be present? 00:28:50 var foo; 00:29:05 And I think it's impossible to change something TO branch 0 >.< 00:29:49 ASSURE <,]", var);>> 00:29:51 bah, that's not impossible at all compared to some other things in this language :) 00:29:52 Waitamin 00:30:00 This is a very, very evil language. 00:30:09 gn8 00:30:17 you can't change the 0th value because it's declared illegal 00:30:23 i'll read logs tomorrow and start writing a spec in the wiki 00:30:58 * Sgeo wish he saw the possibilities of var branch labels and accessibility via CHANGE 00:30:59 i see no such declaration. 00:30:59 The saddest thing is that each of these alone would be enough for a crazy language. 00:31:13 "5 and 6 can be replaced with any positive integer except 0." 00:31:20 Bleh at redundency 00:31:32 pikhq, yours is sensible 00:31:41 Methinks 00:31:51 * oerjan is going blind apparently 00:32:20 Sgeo: You've never seen Glass, have you? 00:32:22 Oh, and GOTO 3 is illegal 00:32:23 mine makes no attempt at being a whole language 00:32:38 Mine is 2 languages in one. 00:32:45 -!- jix has quit ("Bitte waehlen Sie eine Beerdigungnachricht"). 00:32:57 R.I.P. 00:33:01 pikhq: /me wonders about adding stacks to each cell to befunge 00:33:09 Asztal: Dear lord. 00:33:13 But it's slow enough already 00:33:46 i had an idea about a language in which everything is a stack, including the values in stacks 00:34:04 "A stack is defined as a stack of stacks." 00:34:08 How would var_b = var_a work? 00:34:22 (Or whatever equiv.) 00:34:30 Is the stack copied over, or just the top value 00:34:41 push(pop(var_b)); 00:34:54 push(pop(var_b), pop(var_a)); 00:35:00 Sorry; first one was wrong. 00:35:01 I know there was a language where everything is a queue 00:35:43 That, in his hypothetical language, would (in theory) make the first stack's first stack be the second stack's first stack. 00:35:53 Strings count as values for CHANGE's purposes btw 00:36:17 I meant in ABCDEF, not the stack language 00:36:43 what is ABCDEF? 00:36:50 Look at the title of the contest 00:36:53 >.< 00:37:57 the title of the contest is Adjudicated Blind Collaborative Design Esolang Factory, which has _absolutely_ nothing to do with ABCDEF. this is official contest policy. 00:38:26 Whereisthat? 00:38:54 And what will the language be called? 00:39:11 see the logs for when we discussed the name 00:39:31 URL? 00:40:36 oh and NEVER abbreviate Adjudicated Blind Collaborative Design Esolang Factory 00:40:47 http://meme.b9.com/cview.html?channel=esoteric&date=061021 00:41:55 we haven't decided a name for the language. 00:42:28 although there were some suggestions on that page 00:42:43 oO /me liked to read FRC archives 00:43:21 yeah, those were the days 00:43:31 WHINE whinecode("Ow") 00:43:46 OW!!!!!!!!!!!!! 00:43:50 Or: 00:44:48 Where Have I Seen Programs Esoterically Remarked 00:44:51 (WHISPER) 00:45:18 * Sgeo wrote up a compiled ruleset for Zuber 00:45:22 (sp?) 00:46:34 -!- tgwizard has quit (Remote closed the connection). 00:47:47 * Sgeo found a contradiction incidentally 00:48:24 where? 00:48:42 The rules wrt U 00:49:05 Holdon 00:50:15 Dangit, why can't I get the thing? 00:50:27 ftp://ftp.nvg.ntnu.no/pub/frc/24 is the thing, right? 00:50:35 it's a bit slow, i noticed 00:51:08 i'm reading that page now 00:52:13 "Special letter (vowel): 'U'. No pieces may be moved or placed on the board. 'U' can only 00:52:13 be removed by being surrounded. (This seems to contradict an earlier rule: "Pieces of type 00:52:13 {W,X,Z} may not be placed on the board." If you wish to use the earlier rule, you may 00:52:13 disregard anything about 'U' not being destroyable.) 00:52:13 " is what is in my compilation 00:53:14 http://sgeo.diagonalfish.net/Zuber.pdf 00:53:53 * Sgeo also slightly changed the rule for winning 00:55:28 what number is that rule? 00:56:15 * Sgeo shrugs. I wrote the thing a long time ago 00:58:34 The "no other pieces" is 24.29 00:59:33 24.18 is "No pieces of {W,X,Z} 01:00:00 Imean, I guess 24.29 includes 24.18.. 01:02:25 -!- pgimeno has quit (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 01:02:26 -!- puzzlet_ has quit (zelazny.freenode.net irc.freenode.net). 01:02:49 -!- puzzlet_ has joined. 01:02:49 -!- pgimeno has joined. 01:03:19 SAPERLIPOPELEPET 01:05:53 yes, it does seem to include it. so it is not a direct contradiction. 01:06:31 Hmm 01:06:39 * Sgeo thinks that U is too powerful 01:08:00 that would not be so unusual for FRC :) 01:08:44 Yeah, but my compilation thing was also to make it usable 01:08:59 Or at least, no terrible stuff 01:09:34 14 Feb 2005 was the last time I edited that thing 01:09:52 -!- wooby has joined. 01:10:02 Hi wooby 01:10:03 oh, i note the style comment on 24.29: the judge clearly noted the 24.18 issue. 01:10:10 hi 01:11:22 * Sgeo should make it be the 24.18 thing with a note about the 24.29 thing 01:13:17 strange. i don't understand how 24.34 could be valid, given 24.29... 01:15:27 * Sgeo should get back to working on MKBL-LN 01:37:19 In the Factory language thing 01:37:43 SOLVE « x*2/2 = 5 » FOR x 01:37:52 .. 01:38:17 not the most difficult... 01:39:00 But there was a (no identity operations) thing 01:39:16 But *2/2 still makes it simple 01:40:39 indeed 01:43:04 for that matter, you could do SOLVE << x+1 = 5+1 >> FOR x (can't be bothered to find the write quotes) 01:43:10 *right 01:43:49 Well, ASSURE « x = 5 » would work 01:44:00 If you wanted x to effectively be a constant 01:44:04 ASSURE << pi=3 >> 01:44:06 >:D 01:44:58 hm, something tells me in this case the command name should be BEHOLD 01:45:02 Is jix's comment thing the only way to comment? 01:45:09 -!- calamari has joined. 01:45:17 * pikhq figures out a paradox 01:45:18 hi 01:45:26 ASSURE <> 01:45:29 Hi calamari 01:45:34 ASSURE <> 01:45:37 hi Sgeo 01:45:51 pikhq, it could use a CHANGE >.< 01:45:53 Sgeo: I've got two options for it. 01:46:19 hm? 01:46:22 First: in brainfuckcode blocks. Second: in glasscode blocks. 01:46:28 Oh 01:47:00 ASSURE <> 01:47:04 the SWAP thing was intended to foil comments and the language itself if it was a brainfuckish language 01:47:43 calamari: Then you've got it trying to assure pi=3,235, and pi. 01:47:50 Good luck with that. 01:48:05 I have no idea what you're doing.. just being silly 01:48:12 http://www.harderweb.de/tmp_jix/allofthem.txt 01:48:30 pikhq, like I said, one of the ASSURE's could CHANGE another ASSURE, right? 01:48:48 * Sgeo wonders if anyone really likes his CHANGE idea 01:50:34 what is this language? 01:50:39 a community project? 01:51:37 It was a contest thingy 01:51:50 We each sent in statements without seeing the other statements 01:51:52 http://esolangs.org/wiki/Adjudicated_Blind_Collaborative_Design_Esolang_Factory 01:52:19 entries at http://www.harderweb.de/tmp_jix/allofthem.txt 01:53:06 Sgeo: The ASSUREs are ran after each statement is executed. 01:53:30 Thus, that would, after each statement, ASSURE that pi=three things. 01:55:19 Idea: If ASSURE cannot make the expression TRUE, destroy the universe 01:55:25 (or maybe just the users HD) 01:55:51 Really though, the source file 01:56:07 There's another thing that deletes source file 0:) 01:57:57 it could just remove the ASSURE statement itself from the source file :) 01:59:34 an interpreter that fixes unsolvable problems with revisionism... 02:02:18 Make it remove nonvalid syntax. 02:06:38 -!- deltab has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 02:26:32 -!- GregorR-L has joined. 02:29:05 -!- CakeProphet has quit (Excess Flood). 02:30:04 -!- CakeProphet has joined. 02:31:29 back 02:32:16 Front. 02:32:48 white 02:33:39 mauve 02:33:53 salami 02:33:58 Pastrami 02:34:06 Rubik's Cube. 02:34:09 GregorR-L, do not put the baby in the Solar Death Ray 02:34:24 http://www.solardeathray.com/baby.html 02:36:28 sounds like a good candidate. 03:04:43 -!- GregorR-L has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 03:05:15 -!- GregorR-L has joined. 03:24:52 var zero; 03:25:08 zero/-0 03:26:00 -!- oerjan has quit ("Good night."). 03:49:14 -!- ihope_ has joined. 03:57:03 ASSURE «zero != 0» 03:58:06 ASSURE <<0 != 0>> 04:05:52 -!- ihope has quit (Connection timed out). 04:07:09 -!- |wez| has joined. 04:07:33 <|wez|> damn this Insomnia =( 04:16:06 zero/-0 in the main thread is a good way to quit 04:16:14 * Sgeo wonders why it has to be a variable 04:16:19 ^-^ 04:20:40 <|wez|> atleast the insomnia made me release a new verson of monkeycode to night 04:21:33 <|wez|> Soo I guess it wasn't a totaly waste of perfectly good sleep 04:23:59 Why why why is there a statement: 04:24:00 /*^&/_'@%!/(?`_., 04:24:06 //*^&/_'@%!/(?`_., 04:28:24 -!- CakeProphet has quit (Read error: 145 (Connection timed out)). 04:31:16 Is SOLVE the only way to do math on numbers? 04:32:12 You can ASSUME, too 04:32:18 ASSUME? 04:32:27 ASSURE 04:32:47 If I don't want the result to be a constant.. 04:33:00 :) 04:33:01 Suppose I want to put x+y into result 04:33:26 SOLVE « x+y+1=result+1 » FOR result; 04:33:48 If I didn't want result permanantly tied to x and y, that's the only way? 04:34:07 seems so. 04:34:34 -!- GregorR-L has quit (Read error: 148 (No route to host)). 04:34:45 oh, you can use brainfuck() and glass() too 04:34:53 and make macros 04:35:10 Well, gnight all 04:35:17 good night 04:37:57 Hmm 04:38:16 Is it in any way possible to predict which variable ASSURE will change? 04:38:54 Oh, and ASSURE «x+y=result» might preserve result and change x or y 04:38:58 Sounds awfully implementation-defined to me 04:39:04 If result is just assumed to be 0 04:39:20 So the safest thing is SOLVE 04:39:38 <|wez|> http://nocluestudios.com/MonkeyCode any comments? 04:40:49 Gnight all forreal 04:41:51 -!- Sgeo has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 04:59:55 hm... fairly unique. 05:00:42 some vague similarities to BF, some unique characteristics. 05:01:03 kinda MMX to BF's RISC. 05:23:03 <|wez|> MMX? 05:29:38 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMX 05:30:17 it was an analogy- it's a shitload of extended opcodes for x86 introduced with the pentium. 05:30:46 <|wez|> ahhh, I see 05:37:49 <|wez|> now I need a shower, damn insomnia, I wants to go to sleep 05:38:06 heh 05:43:06 -!- anonfunc has joined. 05:55:13 -!- calamari has quit ("Leaving"). 06:10:47 -!- Asztal has quit ("Chatzilla 0.9.72-rdmsoft [XULRunner 1.8.1b2/0000000000]"). 06:14:10 -!- GregorR-L has joined. 06:17:09 good night, everyone. 06:26:13 <|wez|> good night 06:38:46 -!- |wez| has quit ("school'n'stuff"). 07:59:15 -!- GregorR-L has quit ("kill(getpid(), SIGNEWJOKE)"). 07:59:59 -!- clog has quit (ended). 08:00:00 -!- clog has joined. 11:11:05 -!- jix has joined. 11:11:26 -!- jix has quit (Remote closed the connection). 11:33:33 -!- ihope__ has joined. 11:33:44 -!- ihope__ has changed nick to ihope. 11:50:33 -!- ihope_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 13:11:41 -!- jix has joined. 14:59:29 There was a "do not put the baby" moment in the speech processing lecture today. The lecturer was talking about speech recognition, more specifically on how humans possibly learn to recognize speech, and said (paraphrased from the Finnish to be more dnptb.com-like) "it's probably not wise to put the baby in the white noise". 15:14:49 -!- Asztal has joined. 15:33:12 -!- anonfunc has quit (Remote closed the connection). 16:27:41 -!- kipple_ has joined. 16:31:22 -!- tgwizard has joined. 16:35:01 -!- sekhmet has quit ("leaving"). 16:37:42 -!- sekhmet has joined. 16:53:01 * SimonRC wonders if ASSURE should actualy be spelt ENSURE, which more accurately describes its effects. 16:57:52 -!- oerjan has joined. 17:03:13 nah, spell it INSURE 17:03:20 and have it take money 17:19:30 pikhq: the second comment in basm.bfm contains a comma 17:21:51 in general having comments go into the bf code may not be a good idea if the point is to make the result as short as possible. Maybe an alternative command? 17:22:28 Perhaps tcl's comment syntax is available automatically, whatever it is 17:24:30 hm... 17:24:49 oerjan: Tcl's comment syntax would be easy to add. 17:25:02 actually you could probably define it as a macro: macro comment x {} 17:25:23 interp alias slave # {} # 17:25:25 * {} {} 17:25:28 I'll do just that. 17:27:12 oerjan: And said second comment isn't in the current BASM build, anyways. 17:27:46 right, it's not necessary after cons59 was modified 17:28:32 perhaps rename "comment" to "inline"? 17:28:56 -!- |wez| has joined. 17:29:24 I'll make "comment" "inline", and "com" "forceinline". 17:29:28 although calling it comment is obviously more esoteric :) 17:30:39 oerjan: WTF?! you responded to a comment I made 5 minutes befre you joined! 17:30:43 And "#" shall be the comment delimitr. 17:30:48 SimonRC: He looks at logs. 17:30:51 ah, ok 17:31:09 * oerjan has *eerie* powers 17:32:19 pikhq: shhh! ;) 17:35:05 has there been any other changes to basm.bfm since then? 17:36:01 I'll upload the new tarball of both packages here. 17:37:57 http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/basm.tar.bz2 and http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/bfm.tar.bz2 17:41:29 Shit; basm.b is broken. 17:42:58 you forgot to remove "comment" from the foreach loop 17:43:25 or rather, there was a duplicate to begin with 17:44:18 Fixed basm up. . . 17:46:46 'morning, everyone. 17:47:10 Same for bfm. 17:48:22 -!- wooby has quit (Read error: 113 (No route to host)). 17:51:57 there are a number of places in basm.bfm where it seems like you are expanding cons* macros... 17:52:59 -!- GregorR-L has joined. 17:56:05 ah, forget it 17:56:59 you are actually subtracting constants. then, it might have been an idea to have macros for that, too. 17:59:22 well, later. need to buy groceries. 17:59:32 -!- oerjan has quit ("Bye"). 18:53:24 Well, basm.b is currently 5334 characters. . . 18:56:38 5298, I mean. 18:58:51 -!- wooby has joined. 18:59:00 -!- wooby has quit (Remote closed the connection). 19:02:06 * pikhq has finally figured out *why* basm.b fails on large pointer movements 19:02:34 The loop I've set up to make it handle that correctly, unfortunately, drops a character from being processed. 19:03:02 Not sure how to fix it, though. 19:03:08 GregorR-L: Care to take a look? 19:05:16 * pikhq realises that bfm could probably be refactored significantly. . . 19:05:46 The Brainfuck version, at least, could be defined in terms of "inline", "forceinline", "#", and "macro". 19:05:51 Err. . . 19:05:54 Never mind. 19:05:58 Not. Thinking. 19:07:57 "while" could be defined in terms of that, though. ;) 19:08:12 And "out" and "in" and "set". 19:11:59 * pikhq has no idea *how* to fix his bug; will work on it after school 19:24:12 * pikhq will ask oerjan if/win he returns 20:00:03 -!- GregorR-L has quit (Read error: 148 (No route to host)). 20:02:17 -!- paparent has quit ("leaving"). 20:28:18 -!- oerjan has joined. 20:53:18 -!- CakeProphet has joined. 20:55:39 -!- |wez| has quit. 21:04:57 -!- oerjan has quit ("Leaving"). 21:07:20 -!- Sgeo has joined. 21:21:01 For the ASSURE statement 21:21:29 It could attempt to first change the variable that was altered the longest time ago 21:55:33 -!- cmeme has quit (Remote closed the connection). 21:56:28 -!- cmeme has joined. 21:56:57 -!- cmeme has quit (Remote closed the connection). 21:57:29 -!- cmeme has joined. 22:02:43 -!- pgimeno_ has joined. 22:03:12 -!- pgimeno has quit (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)). 22:04:03 -!- pgimeno_ has changed nick to pgimeno. 22:05:23 Hmmmm 22:05:48 I'm conceptualizing a language whose primary focus is iterations... of any sort 22:06:08 I'd want it to be able to do stuff like.... 22:07:32 &ListName = & + 5 22:07:49 Which would take each item in ListName and add 5 to it 22:08:59 and x = &SeqName 22:09:11 Er... 22:09:18 and x = x + &SeqName 22:09:42 That would add all the contents of a sequence together. 22:29:58 and then being able to "goto" a specific iteration in a foreach loop. 23:16:21 -!- pikhq has quit (Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)). 23:17:28 -!- pikhq has joined. 23:21:41 -!- tgwizard has quit (Remote closed the connection). 23:25:34 -!- kipple_ has quit (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). 23:53:15 Should brainfuck() and glass() be changed to use and modify the entire variable-stack? 23:53:22 instead of just the top value? 23:56:01 var something = 0 should be different from var something 23:56:09 Maybe 23:56:13 Or maybe not 23:57:48 * pikhq has declared that brainfuckcode(); sets the BF memory to the var-stack, and that glasscode(); just starts with it's stack that of the var-stack. 23:58:10 brainfuckcode()? 23:58:20 That's the name of the operation. 23:58:30 I see "brainfuck()" 23:58:34 Lies. 23:58:38 no "brainfuckcode()" 23:59:04 Oh. Dur. 23:59:13 s/code//g 23:59:32 * pikhq should flesh his contributions out into a full language