< 1173830753 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :made my board game ai into an irc bot < 1173830754 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :[01:02:13] Human 48 - computer 2644 < 1173830759 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::P < 1173830998 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i lasted for like 10 rounds though! < 1173831839 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what board game? < 1173832251 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sujomilo... my own < 1173832261 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds esperantoish < 1173832264 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :bsmntbombdood: research to support the thesis that you can't concentrate on reading books after taking that test < 1173832279 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :graue: oh, that's just my own experience < 1173832330 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it doesn't mean anything though < 1173834327 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1173834792 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1173836925 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1173837953 0 :Caphi!n=Miranda@128-193-138-192.public.oregonstate.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1173838309 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will someone please say a random number between 1 and 20, inclusive? < 1173838343 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14 < 1173838349 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Thank you. < 1173838375 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :You're welcome. < 1173838382 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :\[\]=a < 1173838387 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :0 < 1173838402 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Sorry. Someone else tried to take my computer. < 1173838627 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :56`1 < 1173838858 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: 17 has been proven to be more random than 14 < 1173838861 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric ::D < 1173838930 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Hey, you think I'll give away my best random number for free? < 1173839005 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I like the number 17. < 1173839028 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :14 is a good random number. Half perfect, in fact. < 1173839089 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Quite so. < 1173839105 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :man < 1173839115 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :prefix application makes parsing so easy < 1173839121 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(unlambda style) < 1173839126 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I just realized, I didn't actually specify an integer. < 1173839167 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Or indeed a rational number. < 1173839195 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :e^pi - pi < 1173839230 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :OK, try e*sqrt 2 - pi/omega < 1173839253 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :just to be completely surreal < 1173839267 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Omega? I'm not familiar with that constant. < 1173839294 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :probably because it isn't a real number. < 1173839338 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :BB(144) < 1173839343 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :By which you mean that it's complex or that it's undefined? < 1173839350 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is perfectly well ordered though. < 1173839358 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope :) < 1173839370 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :So it's complex? < 1173839374 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :nope < 1173839389 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it's surreal < 1173839394 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :defined, but uncomputable < 1173839419 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh that too. omega means too many different things. < 1173839425 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Oo. I learned stuff today. < 1173839436 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :although the uncomputable number is still real < 1173839448 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Out of curiosity < 1173839454 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :What's the definition for it < 1173839497 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i can never remember the correct notation for surreals. < 1173839523 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but something like (0,1,2,... | ) < 1173839541 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the simplest infinite surreal. < 1173839555 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Caphi: for what purpose do you request this number? < 1173839562 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Just curious. < 1173839581 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so am I, that's my point. :) < 1173839591 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :No other reason. Oerjan mentioned it. < 1173839605 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :on the other hand, omega comes from the ordinal numbers as well. < 1173839633 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the ordinal numbers can be considered a subset of the surreals. < 1173839673 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :those with empty right parts, i believe < 1173840575 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm, that's interesting < 1173840609 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my combinator iterpreter fails to simplify ``S``S`KS``S`KK``S`KS``S``S`KS``S`KKI`KI`K``S``S`KS``S`KKI`KI < 1173840636 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(extensionally equal to S) < 1173840735 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I'm writing an abstraction eliminator < 1173840862 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh man < 1173840865 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :``S``S`KS``S`KK``S`KS``S`K`S`KS``S`K`S`KK``S``S`KS``S`KKI`KI`K``S``S`KS``S`K`S`KS``S`K`S`KK``S``S`KS``S`KKI`KI`K`KI < 1173840879 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :church numeral addition < 1173840961 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :my simplifier completely fails to do anything with that, even though there are obvious simplifications < 1173841052 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :that ``S`KKI inside is pretty severe. < 1173841204 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :``S`KxI -> x is the most trivial case of eta reduction. < 1173841266 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yeah :/ < 1173841348 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wonder why it doesn't reduce it < 1173841372 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oh < 1173841410 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :When reducing extensionally, it only works with the whole expression < 1173841578 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ahh, now it at least does something < 1173841596 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :and ``S``S`KS``S`KK``S`KS``S``S`KS``S`KKI`KI`K``S``S`KS``S`KKI`KI is reduced to S < 1173841896 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Good night" < 1173842644 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :dummy variables are annoying < 1173845676 0 :GreaseMonkey!n=thematri@222-153-190-125.jetstream.xtra.co.nz JOIN :#esoteric < 1173846477 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :good night, guys < 1173846527 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1173848741 0 :Sgeo!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1173851642 0 :GreaseMonkey!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"gtg guys, cya" < 1173856631 0 :ShadowHntr!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"End of line." < 1173858293 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Will someone please produce two random numbers between 1 and 10, inclusive, and tell me their sum? < 1173858408 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Never mind. I was trying to demonstrate to someone, but that person left. < 1173858456 0 :tokigun!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :18. < 1173859192 0 :oklopol!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Request noted. Minding disabled. < 1173859199 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :ended < 1173859200 0 :clog!unknown@unknown.invalid JOIN :#esoteric < 1173861913 0 :Caphi!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org" < 1173866644 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1173870137 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-080-228-190-241.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1173882671 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1173888218 0 :nooga!i=nooga@xdsl-6552.lubin.dialog.net.pl JOIN :#esoteric < 1173888221 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :y0 < 1173888316 0 :graue!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1173888793 0 :nooga!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :SADOL.com wtf?!?!?!? < 1173890191 0 :jix__!n=jix@dyndsl-091-096-055-078.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1173890197 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Nick collision from services. < 1173890205 0 :jix__!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :jix < 1173890313 0 :RodgerTheGreat!n=Rodger@24-236-191-30.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com JOIN :#esoteric < 1173890327 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hi everybody < 1173893995 0 :Robdgreat!n=ecc@70.43.98.34.nw.nuvox.net JOIN :#esoteric < 1173894450 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1173894890 0 :tgwizard!n=tgwizard@c-a73ee155.178-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1173895638 0 :Robdgreat!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT : < 1173898901 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1173900620 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"leaving" < 1173900665 0 :oerjan!n=oerjan@hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no JOIN :#esoteric < 1173901092 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-109-120.w86-218.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1173904464 0 :nazgjunk!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1173904621 0 :jix!n=jix@dyndsl-091-096-055-078.ewe-ip-backbone.de JOIN :#esoteric < 1173906362 0 :sebbu2!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-54-13.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1173907488 0 :sebbu!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1173908110 0 :sebbu!n=sebbu@ADijon-152-1-33-46.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr JOIN :#esoteric < 1173908709 0 :UpTheDownstair!n=htitan@wikipedia/Nazgjunk JOIN :#esoteric < 1173908790 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) < 1173908920 0 :tgwizard_!n=tgwizard@c-a73ee155.178-1-64736c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se JOIN :#esoteric < 1173909171 0 :UpTheDownstair!unknown@unknown.invalid NICK :nazgjunk < 1173909291 0 :sebbu2!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1173909610 0 :tgwizard!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) < 1173910043 0 :Caphi!n=Miranda@128-193-139-245.public.oregonstate.edu JOIN :#esoteric < 1173913340 0 :jix!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"This computer has gone to sleep" < 1173914408 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ooh fun < 1173914420 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :the max shifts function solves the halting problem < 1173915001 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :wha? < 1173915143 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :The value of the max shifts function is uncomputable < 1173915213 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :But given the value of S(n), you can solve the halting problem on an n state turing machine < 1173915316 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :This gave me an idea which I don't know if I've seen the answer to: < 1173915319 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :ah, I see < 1173915341 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hmm < 1173915341 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :Are there uncomputable problems strictly weaker than the halting problem? < 1173915358 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :sounds unlikely < 1173915362 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :S(4) on a 2 symbol machine is known < 1173915386 0 :bsmntbombdood!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :so on a 4 state, 2 symbol turing machines, the halting problem is solvable < 1173915483 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :it is analogous to how there are, if P!=NP, problems strictly between them. < 1173915558 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(that is, problems which are neither in P nor NP-complete) < 1173915571 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :what's strictly weaker anyway < 1173915599 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is it trivial to map one type of turing machine to another via any well-understood algorithm? < 1173915600 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :is the problem of sorting apples strictly weaker than the problem of sorting oranges? < 1173915602 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :say you have a problem which you can solve if you have a halting oracle, but not vice versa < 1173915650 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :I mean by "strictly weaker" that you have a reduction one way but not the other. < 1173915679 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :oerjan: is the problem of deciding the halting of a program equipped with a halting oracle strictly stronger than just the regular halting problem? < 1173915693 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :yes. < 1173915701 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :one would assume so < 1173915727 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :in fact that is the premise of one of the languages on the wiki. < 1173915788 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :actually two: Banana Scheme and Brainhype. < 1173915796 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm < 1173915801 0 :RodgerTheGreat!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :interesting < 1173915834 0 :nazgjunk!unknown@unknown.invalid QUIT :"Leaving" < 1173915898 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :brainhype doesn't really care < 1173915920 0 :oerjan!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :but going downward in strength (while still being uncomputable) seems harder. < 1173915945 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :(banana scheme mostly appeared exactly because it was unclear what could interpret brainhype) < 1173916578 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :hm, this /// lang seems cool < 1173916590 0 :lament!unknown@unknown.invalid PRIVMSG #esoteric :i totally missed it