00:00:16 <ehird1> no, that isn't how long my interpreter takes to run
00:00:19 <ehird1> i really don't give a fuck
00:00:26 <ehird1> right now i'm trying to work out why my nesting breaks randomly
00:02:42 <oklopol> pretty much the same speed as an empty program
00:02:49 <oklopol> let's try a more complex program :D
00:03:12 <ehird1> i can't, seeing as my interpreter keeps claiming unmatched braces
00:03:52 <ehird1> http://www.hevanet.com/cristofd/brainfuck/fib.b
00:03:55 <ehird1> goes unimaginably fast
00:04:17 <ehird1> just now, i ran it and then as soon as i could - i.e. right after hitting enter, i hit Ctrl-C to terminate it
00:04:20 <ehird1> 077649278811148299629990130790497978399974693652401690797312244381
00:04:26 <ehird1> 1284057871006996373036197088663606849580363983512256652839038466984
00:04:47 <oklopol> you have some big variables
00:05:01 <oklopol> or my python prog or what?
00:05:18 <ehird1> i just checked the whole output --
00:05:21 <ehird1> and it generated - get this
00:05:24 <ehird1> 319!!! fibonacci numbers
00:05:39 <ehird1> in the shortest time i could make it run that my reflexes (which are good) would allow
00:05:52 <oklopol> i don't really find that impressive... fib is O(1), and O(n) if you do one by one
00:06:08 <ehird1> how about i leave it going for 10 seconds
00:07:00 <ehird1> ok, in 7.812s it calculated 3190 fibonacci numbers
00:07:06 <ehird1> now are you impressed? at least mildly? ;)
00:08:25 <oklopol> mine doesn't do that right i think
00:08:52 <ehird1> using the standard brainfuck text reversal program
00:09:01 <ehird1> if i pipe my interpreter's source code to itself running that program
00:09:07 <ehird1> it takes 0.047s to run
00:10:24 <oklopol> what should the fibonacci program output?
00:10:28 <staplegun_> do you start with 1 and 1 as the first two in the array b4 u start the sequence?
00:10:58 <ehird1> oklopol: fibonnaci numbers in decimal, one per line, continuously until halted
00:11:04 <ehird1> http://www.hevanet.com/cristofd/brainfuck/fib.b
00:11:15 <oklopol> >< >< >< >< >< >< >< >< ><['<', '<', '+', '>', '+', '>', '-']><['>', '+', '<', '-', ['>', '+', '<', '-', ['>', '+', '<', '-', ['>', '+', '<', '-', ['>', '+', '<
00:12:10 <oklopol> my program doesn't do any output before the program finishes.
00:12:29 <ehird1> speaking of which i should flush stdout on each bit of output, shouldn't i?
00:13:07 <ehird1> it should output when it gets the output
00:14:21 <oklopol> oh yeah, school tomorrow ->
00:14:32 <ehird1> would you like it if python did that?
00:16:32 <oklopol> i generally dislike side-effects in programs where they're not needed
00:16:58 <ehird1> i fixed my interpreter
00:17:08 <oklopol> tralso, my screen is black now. wonder what happened....
00:17:13 <oklopol> and wonder what i'm typing
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02:37:34 <Fa1r> i meenz that i can sii my staple
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02:38:15 <pikhq> I think is the first time that someone has been in #esoteric without knowing Brainfuck.
02:39:13 <pikhq> How *dare* you not make sense of >,[>,]<[.<]!
02:40:17 <Fa1r> pikhq, actually those are just different types of symbols o_O -.-
02:40:27 <pikhq> Fa1r: It's a valid Brainfuck program.
02:40:39 <pikhq> And a fairly simple example of Brainfuck at that.
02:40:45 <Fa1r> so if you are coding bf, the spectator knows it, if not, then maybe not
02:40:54 <stap1egun> looks like an input char until char is null then go back and overwrite it
02:41:22 <pikhq> This is #esoteric. . . And Brainfuck is the canonical esoteric language.
02:41:29 <Fa1r> hum... sounds like useful one ^___^
02:41:32 <pikhq> stap1egun: Well, yeah. . . Really, it just reverses its input.
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02:43:06 <schad> if im writing a 2d esoteric language which uses a stack, would it be easier to write the interpreter in python or c?
02:43:19 <schad> sorry, not 2d, grid based
02:43:21 <pikhq> I'm not sure about *easier*. . .
02:43:35 <pikhq> But I'd still do C.
02:43:42 <pikhq> (largely because I don't know Python)
02:43:54 <schad> i know c but im a nub
02:44:22 <Fa1r> inventing a language is first thing to do as a "nub"?
02:44:42 <pikhq> Fa1r: A dc clone would be a fairly simple thing to do as a C n00b.
02:44:45 <Fa1r> oh shite, i must have missed something..
02:44:53 <schad> i just dont program c very well
02:45:02 <pikhq> (doing it *right* would be tricky, though. :p)
02:45:12 <schad> i made a piet interpreter
02:45:13 <Fa1r> c is quite fun, err, shit.
02:45:43 <pikhq> http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/bubble.c
02:45:47 <Fa1r> s/n.+b/newbie/
02:45:50 <pikhq> Bubble sort in obfuscated C.
02:46:17 <Fa1r> fuck those ff plugins updating every night.. ;(
02:47:05 <schad> http://esolangs.org/wiki/PHAWN
02:48:32 <Fa1r> sound like something easy to maintain..
02:48:54 <Fa1r> keep your work! switch to any esolang today!!
02:49:16 <pikhq> I'm reminded of Befunge.
02:49:47 <Fa1r> unixcat is long :>
02:50:12 <schad> yea its alot like befunge i guess
02:51:33 <schad> i wanted it to look so messy and confusing, like when you open an exe in notepad >_>
02:53:12 <pikhq> Cute; a Windows user.
02:53:56 <schad> well, i wud use linux, but i cant get company of heroes to run on it
02:54:09 <schad> also i have to do all my assignments in ... omfg ... vb
02:54:27 <Fa1r> pink teddies for the bosses ;-A
02:54:58 <schad> lucky ive got my last high school exam in a few weeks and i can start my conversion to linux
02:55:03 <pikhq> Where do you go to school, and may I recommend you go to somewhere more prestigious, like the local degree mill?
02:55:28 <pikhq> Who the fuck still uses VB6?
02:55:29 <schad> the it manager is a complete dumb ass
02:55:34 <pikhq> Who the fuck ever uses VB?
02:55:55 <schad> he says he doesnt want to upgrade to 2005 because its .net and a completely different language
02:56:02 <schad> i had to stop my self from loling in front of him
02:56:28 <pikhq> The words "Visual Basic" say that it's a bad choice.
02:56:46 <schad> my teacher couldn't debug this line
02:56:54 <schad> textBoxMain.Text = Hello World!
02:57:04 <pikhq> (of course, you must remember that I've been coding since I was 8. . . Programming is. . . Simple.)
02:57:13 <schad> i love programming
02:57:54 <pikhq> But are you any good?
02:58:11 <schad> in the languages ive taken time to learn i guess
02:58:19 <pikhq> How long have you been coding?
02:58:40 <schad> when did dark reign 2 come out? cause i started programming in c code for their mods
02:58:51 <schad> i didnt realise it was c at the time though
02:58:58 <schad> and i had to program it in a text file
02:59:05 <schad> so since 2000 i guess
02:59:45 * pikhq has been coding for 10 years. :)
03:00:27 <Fa1r> "and i had to program it in a text file" <- err.. where d'you put it now, then?
03:00:57 <schad> the game interpreted it, it was actualy c, but it read structures and functions like it was
03:01:09 <schad> ill see if i can find an example
03:01:15 <pikhq> Then I doubt that it's C.
03:01:41 <schad> omg have they finally taken the dr2 site down?
03:02:29 <schad> no, it wasnt c it was c style
03:03:25 <schad> gah its all zipped up in zwp
03:04:45 <schad> i tried leanring c++ with opengl so i can make games
03:05:05 <schad> i could get the c++ but game engine architecture i was terrible at
03:05:54 <Fa1r> well.. games are kinda "no man's job"
03:05:59 <Fa1r> you know what i'm saying
03:08:27 <schad> do you guys program in assembly ever/
03:08:55 <pikhq> It's amazing how small you can make a "Hello, world!" program.
03:09:33 <schad> i want to learn it after i learn how to do something significant in c
03:10:01 <pikhq> At last count I was at 76 bytes. . .
03:12:24 <schad> what kind of stuff do u program? just esoteric languages?
03:13:08 <schad> its way more interesting than trying to code an fps in c++ or ... game maker for that matter
03:14:58 <pikhq> Compilers are fun to write, too.
03:14:58 <Fa1r> programming in esoteric? well.. the point is you never get anything usable with esoteric
03:15:24 <schad> writing an interpreter
03:15:27 <Fa1r> they're mostly made of showoff and fun
03:15:40 * pikhq has written a game in Brainfuck.
03:15:52 <schad> i want to see that
03:15:53 <pikhq> Granted, I cheated, via a language I developed that targets Brainfuck. . .
03:16:10 <pikhq> http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/game.b IIRC.
03:16:23 <schad> hmm browsing these config files 5 years later tells me i didnt have any clue what the c prorgamming language was
03:16:41 <Fa1r> game = usable, console game = fun. right
03:16:46 <Fa1r> .. there you have it.
03:17:13 <pikhq> Try googling "Lost Kingdom" for something more astounding.
03:17:57 <pikhq> It's a larger game in Brainfuck.
03:19:23 <schad> holy fucking christ
03:20:01 <Fa1r> now that was a _surprise_... japanese && anime && based on cards && echo "Hell yeah! ;E"
03:23:42 <pikhq> http://jonripley.com/i-fiction/games/LostKingdomBF.html
03:24:06 <schad> 2.5 mb source code
03:28:02 <schad> visual c++ can compile c code cant it?
03:28:33 <pikhq> Try Cygwin or Mingw.
03:37:31 <schad> http://www.java2s.com/Code/C/Data-Structure-Algorithm/StackinC.htm is that an ok way to handle a stack? or wud there be a better way?
03:38:54 <pikhq> I recommend implementing it via a linked list.
03:39:00 <pikhq> http://pikhq.nonlogic.org/dc.c.tar.bz2
03:41:00 <pikhq> stack.c and stack.h are a decent stack implementation.
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05:14:33 <immibis> "....using Microsofts malicious software removal tool." <--- Microsoft's software removal tool is malicious?
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05:20:18 <RodgerTheGreat> oh snap, somebody applied a restriction enzyme to immibis' quit message virus!
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10:39:39 <oklopol> i think the reason that virus isn't spreading is that it's not self-modifying
10:40:53 <oklopol> pikhq: i win with 11 years!
10:41:20 <oklopol> (unless this is also about coding capabilities, in which case you most likely beat me ;))
10:41:45 <oklopol> let's just hope oerjan doesn't see this
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10:59:55 <oklopol> errr immibis' quit message virus
11:38:15 <oklopol> opinions here, since i'm not that good at designing gui:s anyone but me would enjoy, i'm making a program for drawing elecrical circuits, how should it behave when the window is resized?
11:39:36 <oklopol> i mean, should it have a fixed amount of divisions x- and y-wise, so that no matter what the size is, the grid would have the same amount of points; or should i have it just draw less of the circuit so that the distance betwen two points is fixed?
11:52:18 <oklopol> i already implemented the latter one
11:52:42 <oklopol> it looks kinda nice, i'll add something to inc/dec the gridsize if necessary.
11:53:01 <staplegun> it hindsight the latter would be better for me, i have a 1920x1200 display lol
11:53:32 <staplegun> too bad it cant help my python code ....
11:54:01 <oklopol> you mean the size of your window won't compensate for your lack of skills?
11:56:04 <oklopol> magnets are unbelievably cool.
11:56:32 <oklopol> trying to do without the ++
11:57:11 <staplegun> everyone tries to make me do ++ style casting, when c is far superior
11:58:36 <oklopol> i should get back to coding...
11:59:16 <staplegun> u toking about magnets irl? or the ones ur programming?
12:00:11 <oklopol> the circuit thing is very primitive, it just knows basic logic ports, wires and err transmitters
12:00:30 <staplegun> is it a modelling tool? or just something for fun
12:01:26 <oklopol> we are using this thing called TINA pro at school for this, it kinda sucks as it's just a trial version
12:01:58 <oklopol> so i'm basically making this to be able to save my models
12:02:12 <oklopol> i dunno if i'll add anything that actually let's you do anything complicated
12:04:55 <staplegun> no matter what, px will decrease by one right? even if the exception causes a break? (its in a while loop)
12:05:33 <staplegun> that saves me having to write a flag
12:06:38 <staplegun> thats why it wasnt working i never actually set the variable to the users input ...
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13:35:21 <staplegun> woot i got fib 10000 to run on my esolang
13:39:06 <oklopol> time.clock() gives a number representing the current time
13:39:21 <oklopol> i guess it's that unix timestamp or whaddyacallit
13:46:16 <oklopol> hmph, i've really gotten lazy having used python for so long :P
13:46:46 <staplegun> printed fibonacci numbers up to 1,500,520,536,206,896,083,277 in 0.0194 seconds
13:46:49 <oklopol> in python, everything takes a second to do, and never has bugs
13:47:01 <staplegun> lol i love python, i started learning it today
13:47:03 <oklopol> in c, i actually have to think about the details, and still i get bugs :|
13:47:22 <staplegun> and ive pretty much finished writing my esolang interpreter
13:48:22 <staplegun> now, if i can get hello world workin
13:51:12 <SimonRC> staplegun: what the f is that?
14:17:04 * SimonRC is crating a forthlike language, due to boredom
14:24:18 <staplegun> someone linked me to a site earlier where you could post code blocks and it would highlight in the language you specify
14:24:30 <staplegun> like a read only browser based syntax highlighter
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14:29:40 <Figs> http://blog.wolfram.com/2007/10/the_prize_is_won_the_simplest.html <-- you guys see this yet?
14:40:25 <Figs> I thought it was kind of interesting since the solver was described as having a "background in mathematics and esoteric programming languages" :P
14:40:31 <Figs> (the math aside)
14:41:22 <staplegun> im happy cus i finally got a working version of my interpreter
14:41:33 <Figs> made me think -- "Hey, I know some esoteric programmers... wait a sec, I wonder if this is one of them..."
14:41:53 <Figs> what interpreter?
14:42:11 <Figs> revise: an interpreter for what?
14:47:10 <Figs> what does it look like?
14:48:18 <Figs> http://www.springerlink.com/content/uxuc20mnurg4qjug/ <-- DNA = UTM? Nifty.
14:49:02 <Figs> I don't think I'd understand the chapter though :(
14:49:35 <Figs> we need a DNA Esolang! ... assuming no one has done it yet
14:49:50 <staplegun> but ill stick to my ascii .. took me hours just to write my hello world example ...
14:50:24 <staplegun> it is actually most influenced by piet lol
14:50:50 <Figs> hmm, imagine that it'd give you 4 'base pairs' like ZXCV or something, and you'd write lines like
14:51:42 <Figs> pairs of three would count as coding-units...
14:51:46 <Figs> err... sets of three
14:51:50 <Figs> pairs of three = wtf? :P
14:52:21 <Figs> yes... my pair of boots is actually three shoes... O.o
14:52:45 <Figs> you could code "virtual Proteins"
14:53:08 <Figs> that would end up running in parallel...
14:53:43 <Figs> they would "contort" to various mathematical shapes based on Figsics
14:54:18 <Figs> I think I have invented a mental nightamre
14:54:28 <Figs> too bad I can't write it
14:54:47 <Figs> I've been up all night again
14:55:02 <Figs> well, at least there's not school tomorrow
14:55:30 <Figs> California fires
14:55:39 <Figs> school got cancelled.
14:56:36 <Figs> if I got two turing machines together...
14:56:48 <Figs> so that each time I need to look up a state
14:56:55 <Figs> it launches another machine...
14:57:10 <Figs> is that more complicated than a single turing machine?
14:57:20 <staplegun> i think uve been awake too long :D
14:57:59 <Figs> yeah, I should be going to bed, in theory
14:58:03 <Figs> damn ye paper!
14:58:09 <Figs> ... I've been trying to write this paper
14:58:11 <Figs> since I got up
14:58:16 <Figs> ...wtf am I doing here? :P
14:58:22 <Figs> *brain random*
14:58:35 <Figs> summary of a sci. am. article
14:58:48 <Figs> (the argument in the article, not the article itself)
14:58:57 <Figs> and 2 pages = amt for me to write
14:59:01 <Figs> (the article itself is longer)
14:59:43 <Figs> seriously though, can I have a turing machine with an infinite number of states? O.o
14:59:55 <Figs> does that even make sense? O.o
15:00:01 <staplegun> depends how many turing machines u can handle
15:00:02 <Figs> my brain must be broken
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15:09:02 <Figs> China + Japan are in a space race?
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15:13:03 <bsmntbombdood> http://blog.wolfram.com/2007/10/the_prize_is_won_the_simplest.html?lid=title
15:13:56 <Figs> still cool though
15:14:25 * Figs prods bsmntbombdood and says "Hi!"
15:15:08 <Figs> wtf, it smells like smoke
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15:26:52 <ehird`> wow, you're still here?
15:29:17 <staplegun> but i was up for a while working on stuff
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15:29:43 <ehird`> my bf interp only kind of works =(
15:30:45 <Figs> missed him by a minute
15:31:04 <ehird`> hi i'm perfecting my bf interpreter
15:31:17 <Figs> I wrote a BF interpreter a while back...
15:31:25 <ehird`> hopefully it should run The Craziest BF Program Ever (the Lost Kingdom text adventure) smoothly
15:31:29 <Figs> I forgot about that :P
15:31:33 <ehird`> but right now it just spews out "Hangup" and dies
15:31:50 <Figs> I wonder if my program would work
15:31:59 <Figs> how long is the program?
15:32:19 <ehird`> (it's compiled from basic)
15:32:53 <Figs> I only wrote my program to accept up to 9999
15:32:57 <Figs> so that won't fit :P
15:33:08 <ehird`> mine dynamically resizes all of its storages
15:33:27 <Figs> IIRC, mine you type in by hand at the prompt, so...
15:33:34 <ehird`> if you have enough memory you can store up to MAX_UINT (maximum unsigned int value) elements in each
15:33:51 <ehird`> On a 32bit system that's 4,294,967,295 elements in each array
15:33:51 <Figs> (why with a k? I don't know.)
15:34:02 <ehird`> past that it'll just die but i doubt i have to worry ;)
15:34:15 <ehird`> if it used 64-bit ints? Then 18,446,744,073,709,551,615
15:34:47 <Figs> well, in theory...
15:34:53 <Figs> you could load it from the file
15:35:04 <Figs> and only work with a small subset of the bytes ...
15:35:21 <ehird`> you will need shitloads of RAM anyway to run a program of that size ;)
15:35:29 <ehird`> (it pre-parses brackets)
15:35:57 <ehird`> also, mine can save and load state
15:36:00 <Figs> "No one will ever need more than 640K of RAM" (BIll Gates)
15:36:10 <ehird`> SIGSUSP (aka ^Z) asks for a file name and then saves a dump to it
15:36:17 <Figs> [did I get that right?]
15:36:25 <ehird`> you can then reload the dump (and the source file if you did not include it with the dump) and it'll resume from there
15:36:34 <ehird`> this is because i am going to write a Forth system in brainfuck
15:36:37 <ehird`> so that will be how i save images
15:37:26 <Figs> I need to finish that fucking parser system...
15:37:33 <Figs> or move to a better language
15:37:51 <Figs> does D have operator overloading?
15:38:03 <ehird`> C is the best for writing interpreters for esolangs, most of the time
15:38:09 <ehird`> since speed is good when your language itself is fscking slow
15:38:23 <Figs> this isn't for an eso-lang...
15:38:23 <ehird`> my debug output is great
15:38:27 <Figs> (at this point :)
15:39:00 <Figs> it was me ol' general parser system
15:39:18 <Figs> the one that looks like
15:39:32 <Figs> it ain't CS, I don't think
15:39:48 <Figs> since I don't allow x Y z = A >> B >> C...
15:40:00 <Figs> just Y = A >> B >> C
15:40:33 <Figs> sadly, I don't know how to handle errors in ambiguous grammars :(
15:41:24 <Figs> how to even get around some of the issues of ambiguity
15:41:38 <ehird`> okay, my problem is this line: memset(new + *current, 0, try);
15:41:44 <ehird`> when resizing the code array to 2000 elements
15:41:58 <ehird`> *current is the previous size of the array, try is - AHA
15:42:09 <ehird`> it's segfaulting because it's overflowing the memory
15:42:28 <Figs> memory overflow shouldn't get a :) from me
15:42:47 <ehird`> well... it is marginally better now
15:42:51 <ehird`> as in, it gets a bit further ;)
15:42:54 <ehird`> but i have a segfault LATER...
15:43:19 <ehird`> Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
15:43:19 <ehird`> 0x00401702 in main (argc=2, argv=0x662008) at bf.c:131
15:43:19 <ehird`> 131brackets[code_ptr] = stack[stack_ptr];
15:43:37 <Figs> sigh, CF ambiguity is undecidable
15:43:54 <ehird`> that's a lot of just read
15:44:25 <Figs> it says "Exprot this chapter as RIS|Text"
15:45:13 <Figs> wait, wtf, it's almost 8 am?!
15:45:42 <ehird`> oh no now you're doing to leave
15:46:16 <Figs> no, I'm going to have to figure out how to write my essay real fast
15:46:35 <Figs> I was supposed to turn it in almost 15 hours ago...
15:46:35 <ehird`> :( maybe it's my crazy casting
15:46:48 <ehird`> i have this: expand_array((unsigned char **)&stack, &stack_size);
15:47:06 <Figs> hehe, I've had my head in java for too long at this point
15:47:15 <ehird`> yeah well i don't want to duplicate my expand_array code
15:47:22 <Figs> brainwashing, I say...
15:47:35 <Figs> Ooh! http://www.springerlink.com/content/fp7p38r0333p1441/fulltext.pdf
15:48:04 <ehird`> i just added this debug message
15:48:05 <ehird`> printf("I'm in ur ptrs, not segfaulting\n");
15:48:12 <Figs> I should just give all failure points for error, shouldn't I?
15:48:15 <Figs> (as a list...)
15:48:25 <ehird`> I'm in ur ptrs, not segfaulting
15:48:25 <ehird`> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
15:49:24 <ehird`> damn my segfault isn't even in expand_array
15:50:48 <ehird`> i'm not stepping through, it reads like half the file before dying
15:50:55 <ehird`> i don't have ten years :P
15:51:09 <Figs> make it catch in a special place
15:51:45 <Figs> (I'm an evil masochistic bastard, I guess, but *cough* setjmp + goto */cough*)
15:51:55 <ehird`> brackets[code_ptr] = stack[stack_ptr];
15:51:55 <ehird`> brackets[stack[stack_ptr]] = code_ptr;
15:52:00 <ehird`> the segfault happens on these two
15:52:21 <Figs> you be askin' da wrong guy
15:52:29 <ehird`> i'm just talking to no-one
15:52:31 <Figs> I left my pointers at the door
15:52:37 <ehird`> hacking away in urxvt and gvim
15:52:37 <Figs> when I started Java-class :P
15:52:44 <ehird`> ... on windows, because i'm stuck on a windows box right now
15:53:02 <ehird`> with my nice X interface
15:53:07 <ehird`> not any of that lame windows gvim
15:53:15 <ehird`> this stuff anti-aliases text properly
15:53:29 <Figs> I've had to use it on Red Hat for CS...
15:53:38 <Figs> and I hate not being able to highlight shit
15:53:46 <Figs> and use what I'm used to doing in a text editor
15:54:10 <Figs> I started using something else.
15:54:11 <ehird`> you can highlight shit
15:54:15 <ehird`> i guess you just don't know vim
15:54:19 <Figs> no, I don't :P
15:54:20 <ehird`> but even gvim, lets you use even the mouse to highlight
15:54:32 <ehird`> it lets you scroll with a scroll-wheel... it's practically notepad except it's modal
15:54:48 <ehird`> i use a lot of its notepaddy features actually
15:54:48 <Figs> maybe the way they have it configured here is weird
15:54:58 <ehird`> i am guilty of selecting text with the mouse and pressing d
15:55:00 <Figs> I am a noob at it though :P
15:55:03 <ehird`> i also use the scrollbar a lot
15:55:12 <ehird`> but i like vim's commands, so
15:55:48 <Figs> I started using a different program
15:55:52 <Figs> I forget the name
15:56:28 <Figs> I think it was something generic like 'text'
15:56:34 <Figs> memory != good
15:57:20 <Figs> I'll play with it later and babble again another day
15:57:27 <Figs> when school starts again
15:57:32 <ehird`> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
15:57:35 <Figs> (closed all week due to fire)
15:57:41 <ehird`> both of the first two numbers are lesser than the latter
15:57:44 <ehird`> so why am i getting a segfault
15:58:04 <ehird`> printf("%i VS %i\n", code_ptr, brackets_size);
15:58:04 <ehird`> printf("%i VS %i\n", stack[stack_ptr], brackets_size);
15:58:04 <ehird`> brackets[code_ptr] = stack[stack_ptr];
15:58:04 <ehird`> brackets[stack[stack_ptr]] = code_ptr;
15:58:33 <ehird`> since they're both within the boundries of brackets-size as you can see in my previous paste
15:58:39 <ehird`> why on earth would it segfault on those brackets lines
15:58:52 <ehird`> (x_ptr is an int index of an array, always)
15:59:04 <ehird`> x_size is the size of the x array
15:59:52 <Figs> too much recursion?
16:00:01 <ehird`> i don't recurse, in the whole thing
16:00:04 <ehird`> brackets[code_ptr] = stack[stack_ptr];
16:00:05 <Figs> then not that :P
16:00:17 <Figs> gdb always gives me BS
16:00:33 <ehird`> but the debug output is right
16:00:36 <ehird`> it prints the ones before
16:00:38 <ehird`> and not the ones after
16:00:45 <ehird`> but code_ptr<brackets_size so wtf
16:02:54 <ehird`> hehe, in my interpreter
16:03:06 <ehird`> +[>+] has already forced the interpreter
16:03:09 <ehird`> to resize to 30720000 cells
16:03:22 <ehird`> (and it resizes to current*2 by default -- so that's pretty impressive)
16:03:52 <ehird`> (it also happens to be extremely fast at generating fibonacci numbers)
16:04:54 <Figs> touch. touch. touch touch. touch touch touch. touch touch touch touch touch...
16:05:15 <ehird`> might get a bit hard after the first few..
16:05:24 <ehird`> touch touch touch... (ten years) ...touch touch touch touch ...
16:10:18 <ehird`> give me a program to test my interp with
16:11:01 <Figs> +++[>++++++++++++<-]>.
16:11:11 <Figs> !bf +++[>++++++++++++<-]>.
16:11:47 <ehird`> it runs in 0.015 seconds, and outputs $
16:12:18 <ehird`> it runs in infinity seconds and outputs nothing
16:12:26 <Figs> did the computer tell you that? :P
16:12:26 <ehird`> but, it just sits there, obviously
16:12:39 <ehird`> i have a halting problem solver built in
16:12:56 <ehird`> oh, +[] also consumes 99% cpu
16:13:08 <ehird`> but it doesn't lag the sytsem, heh
16:13:30 <Figs> heh, I should write that like
16:13:37 <Figs> it looks cooler
16:13:46 <ehird`> that one also takes up insane amounts of cpu
16:13:48 <ehird`> but hangs there memory-wise
16:13:53 <ehird`> as, of course, it wraps from 255 to 0
16:14:04 <ehird`> of course, it will use 99% cpu most of the time
16:14:17 <Figs> +[>+<->>++<->]+
16:14:26 <ehird`> if you're not getting input or bottlenecked by output, you want to execute the instructions as fast as possible
16:14:33 <ehird`> so, i think that's desired behaviour
16:14:44 <ehird`> also, it uses a little over 1mb of ram by default it seems
16:14:46 <ehird`> remember, this is windows
16:14:52 <ehird`> so that overhead will be MUCH LESS on other os
16:15:00 <ehird`> i'll try +[>+<->>++<->]+
16:15:07 <ehird`> and i tried the reverse program a while ago
16:15:13 <ehird`> it runs basically as fast as the equivilant c program
16:15:23 <ehird`> most trivial programs do
16:15:33 <ehird`> it doesn't even optimize
16:15:55 <Figs> []_[] >> -[-]-_-[-] << []_[]
16:16:06 <ehird`> it just pre-parses the brackets so that [ and ] are just a conditional followed by setting the code pointer to the entry in the array
16:16:19 <ehird`> also +[>+<->>++<->]+ just biggifies the array, heh
16:16:26 <Figs> that's the idea
16:16:45 <Figs> does that other program work?
16:16:51 <Figs> (are you doing wrap-around?)
16:16:55 <ehird`> +[>+<->>++<->]+, when run for 10.250s
16:17:01 <ehird`> resizes the array to 122880000
16:17:11 <ehird`> (it'll use a lot less though, just over 61440000)
16:17:15 <ehird`> since, of course, it resizes to double
16:17:37 <ehird`> mine does 0-255 wrap around yes
16:17:40 <ehird`> i'll run []_[] >> -[-]-_-[-] << []_[]
16:18:10 <ehird`> but it's immediate to my eyes ;)
16:18:22 <ehird`> it's basically a little slower than a nop program haha
16:18:38 <Figs> d(O_O)b <[Hello Friggen World]
16:18:59 <Figs> I wrote a poem in a java app before
16:19:05 <ehird`> i can tell you without even testing that one
16:19:10 <ehird`> it will just execute with "error: tape underflow"
16:19:17 <ehird`> since you can't go < from element 0
16:19:48 <ehird`> (in old-style implementations it'd wrap around to the last cell, but of course with an "infinite tape" (well, dynamically resized, but from BF it is percieved as infinite, it makes no sense)
16:20:01 <Figs> expanding universe!
16:20:03 <ehird`> that runs in the same time as your nop program
16:20:14 <Figs> it should give 3 nulls as outputs
16:20:17 <ehird`> and produces three null bytes
16:21:18 <ehird`> "error: unmatched [" is a kimian quine in my implementation
16:21:38 <ehird`> "error: unmatched ] at 17" is a vaguely more interesting one
16:22:27 <Figs> (lim x->0 d/dx x^2+2x+1) [>+++<]>.
16:22:54 <ehird`> runs forever, seemingly
16:23:11 <ehird`> what platform are you on?
16:23:12 <Figs> me = stupid with that.
16:23:21 <ehird`> please say linux, please say linux, please say linux so you can run c2bf
16:23:36 <ehird`> i wanted to try hello world
16:24:03 <ehird`> do you know anything about writing a forth?
16:24:43 <ehird`> do you want to read http://www.annexia.org/_file/jonesforth.s.txt and http://www.annexia.org/_file/jonesforth.f.txt as a combined implementation-tutorial and then help me implement BrainForth? ;)
16:24:49 <Figs> ++++++++++[>+++++++>++++++++++>+++>+<<<<-]>++.>+.+++++++..+++.>++.<<+++++++++++++++.>.+++.------.--------.>+.>.
16:25:01 <Figs> If I had time :(
16:25:10 <Figs> sadly, I am procrastinating already
16:25:19 <ehird`> and that's just a hello world
16:25:28 <Figs> I thought you wanted a hello world?
16:25:39 <Figs> (I pulled it out of wikipedia magic land)
16:26:11 <Figs> ,----------[----------------------.,----------]
16:26:18 <ehird`> hello world /from c2bf/
16:28:32 <Figs> http://www.inteldaily.com/?c=173&a=3993 beware, disturbing!
16:30:36 <Figs> http://ineedawriter.com/blog/2007/10/contextual-advertising-mistakes.html
16:32:45 <Figs> "shake and bake"
16:32:49 <Figs> what a terrible thing to say
16:32:54 <Figs> [about california]
16:33:14 <Figs> -- apparently there was a minor earthquake earlier ;P
16:33:37 <ehird`> http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2400/1634346479_af8e068ebd.jpg?v=0
16:33:51 <Figs> I like the one at the end
16:34:09 <Figs> also the black mcdonald's ad
16:34:44 <ehird`> i love the last video one
16:34:52 <Figs> didn't watch it
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16:59:32 <Figs> http://www.flickr.com/photos/dcreeves2000/139184796/
17:08:47 * ehird` is writing a simple stack-based-language-to-BF compiler
17:09:25 <ehird`> name call call call ; another call call call
17:09:41 <ehird`> i.e. first word is the new word to define's name, after that what words to call
17:09:46 <ehird`> ; terminates the definition and starts again
17:09:49 <ehird`> the last word defined is called
17:17:32 <ehird`> http://pastie.caboo.se/pastes/93052 i have never heard of this language before
17:17:35 <ehird`> is it TC? i don't think so
17:20:12 <ehird`> certainly i doubt you can write a bf interpreter in it
17:20:17 <ehird`> but, what about a tag machine?
17:20:27 <ehird`> wait, it doesn't have any control structure
17:20:35 <Figs> can you even test for equality?
17:20:45 <ehird`> it doesn't matter, there's no control structure
17:21:13 <ehird`> that interpreter is in ruby, yes...
17:21:17 <Figs> I thought it was python :P
17:21:20 <Figs> but I don't use either
17:21:25 <ehird`> does python have "end"? ;)
17:21:33 <Figs> I don't use either :P
17:21:35 <ehird`> python's blocks are indentation based
17:22:40 <Figs> can you add or subtract?
17:22:53 <ehird`> XOR is add without carry...
17:23:03 <Figs> can you branch? :P
17:23:09 <ehird`> nope, i told you that already
17:23:20 <ehird`> you MIGHT be able to simulate a tag machine in it, rhough
17:23:35 <Figs> could you push pop the stack to simulate branching?
17:23:57 <Figs> *Engage brain before talking*
17:24:09 <ehird`> http://www.contextfreeart.org/ i am going to play around with this
17:24:19 <ehird`> a logo that produces better quality images, and can recurse /infinitely/?
17:24:38 <ehird`> seriously. it can recurse to infinite depth as long as the drawings small to -infinity in size
17:24:45 <ehird`> which is... very often
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17:33:13 <Figs> http://eightsolid.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/18.jpg
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18:00:12 * ehird` ponders whether you can draw a sierpinski triangle in cfdg
18:29:15 <oerjan> oklopol: ABANDON ALL HOPE
18:30:11 <oerjan> <oklopol> let's just hope oerjan doesn't see this
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18:47:24 <ehird`> oerjan: i fixed my BF interpreter :-)
18:47:35 <ehird`> now it works on EVERYTHING aprat from that 2mb text adventure (and i'm trying to fix tha)
18:49:40 <oerjan> bsmntbombdood: i am sure he is interested
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19:40:09 <ehird`> woot, my brainfuck interp no longer crashes on LostKng.b
19:40:16 <ehird`> however, it lags forever
19:40:20 <ehird`> so something is taking Too Long
19:40:52 <ehird`> ah, it's just slow execution
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20:09:11 <bsmntbombdood> the other guy in this room is loudly stuffing his face with popcorn and grunting
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20:38:56 <ehird`> pix of his fixed sex organs, or the other guy?
20:49:12 <bsmntbombdood> i would get charged with the production of child pornography and child molestation
20:49:39 <bsmntbombdood> and transporting child pornography across state lines
20:49:54 <GregorR> Hmmmm ........ I wonder if you can be charged for making child pornography of yourself :P
20:51:07 <bsmntbombdood> given the minimum sentences for those i would go to jail for at least 15 years or so on conviction
20:51:47 <bsmntbombdood> it would be the ultimate irony when they charged me as an adult
20:51:52 <oklopol> that would also be a crime in my part
20:52:37 <oklopol> looking isn't all that dangerous in my opinion.
20:56:00 <oklopol> i think you know more words than me
20:56:11 <bsmntbombdood> that doesn't mean i know all the words that you know
20:56:21 <bsmntbombdood> and you know more words than mean, considering all languages
20:57:36 <bsmntbombdood> i should use my irc logs to find how many words i us
20:58:48 <oklopol> i prolly at least have known a lot of english words you don't, since i used to browse the dictionary quite a lot, but i can't really conjure anything up just like that :<
21:02:00 <ehird`> bsmntbombdood: i don't know, but it's "" in WordUsage
21:02:31 <oklopol> it's like 10 lines of python
21:03:48 <ehird`> actually it's one line of python
21:04:06 <ehird`> well, if you have a string of all the text he's said.
21:06:15 <oklopol> [a[i] for i in range(len(a)) if not a[i] in a[i+1:]]
21:06:29 <ehird`> dict((w, said.count(w)) for w in dict(map(lambda i: (i,1),said.split(" "))).keys())
21:06:29 <oklopol> somehow i insisted on using a dict
21:06:42 <ehird`> returns {word: count, ...} for each word, with no duplicates
21:06:50 <ehird`> (that is what the crazy lambda trick is for)
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21:07:04 <ehird`> assuming said is "i said this line and then this line abc abc def"
21:07:09 <ehird`> i.e. a string of all his text
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21:09:08 <ehird`> sorted((w, said.count(w)) for w in dict(map(lambda i: (i,1),said.split(" "))).keys()) <-- sorted list version
21:09:34 <oklopol> count don't word of course
21:09:45 <oerjan> import Data.Set; main = interact $ show . size . fromList . words
21:09:52 <ehird`> why doesn't count work
21:09:58 <oerjan> (you knew i couldn't resist, right?)
21:10:00 <oklopol> >>> said="i said this and that"
21:10:00 <oklopol> >>> dict([(w, said.count(w)) for w in dict(map(lambda i: (i,1),said.split(" "))).keys()])
21:10:00 <oklopol> {'i': 3, 'this': 1, 'and': 1, 'said': 1, 'that': 1}
21:10:32 <ehird`> i'll improve it incrementally
21:10:47 <ehird`> dict((w, said.count(w)) for w in set(said.split(" ")))
21:11:50 <ehird`> again, replace "dict" with "sorted" for a sorted list of (word, usage)
21:11:51 <oklopol> except you lose the linearity
21:13:58 <oklopol> oklotalk!! set split Saidstuff
21:15:25 <ehird`> ListLang! {for \e, said, [e,count], \unique}
21:15:30 <oklopol> why not {freq Saidstuff}, adding built-in functions is easy when you don't have an implementation
21:15:32 <ehird`> (note: has no implementation, yet)
21:27:50 <oerjan> and ehird` is back misunderstanding
21:28:53 <oerjan> afaic recall, i have not yet done that while trying to use lambdabot for anything other than demonstrating on #haskell...
21:29:26 <ehird`> ok, what were you doing then? :P
21:29:55 <oerjan> er, did i use too many negatives?
21:32:25 <oerjan> i was demonstrating on #haskell
21:37:31 <ehird`> NEAR-IMPOSSIBLE TASK #341: implementing an associative array in brainfuck
21:38:31 <oklopol> if you do char->char, it's pretty trivial
21:38:49 <ehird`> string->char or string->string
21:38:56 <ehird`> latter more impressive, former more realistic
21:39:54 <GregorR> I think C2BF is probably sufficient to make that right now :P
21:39:58 <ehird`> if you can do string->(string, char) you're well on your way to a markov chain in BF ;)
21:40:15 <ehird`> GregorR: i can't run c2bf on any platform i run
21:40:18 <oklopol> string->string=string->char
21:40:25 <ehird`> (windows right now, unfortunately. OS X most of the time)
21:40:30 <oklopol> string->string=string->(string,char)
21:40:35 <ehird`> it segfaults on OS X :<
21:41:08 <ehird`> i think that could actually be possible
21:41:34 <ehird`> but of course no way to get a random number in brainfuck (you can get a 'random-looking' number using cellular automata and the like but it's the same on each run)
21:41:41 <ehird`> so it'd spew the same things out over and over
21:42:04 <ehird`> unless... you hashed up all of the data in the hash table (and presumably other used memory) and used it as a seed each time it's updated...
21:42:08 <oklopol> i don't think it matters if the hash table is predictable...
21:42:14 <ehird`> oklopol: no, for a markov chain
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21:47:25 <ehird`> oklopol: what text editor do you use, by the way?
21:50:04 <oklopol> wordpad is almost perfect, occasionally it changes fonts at random, and it doesn't have an option to level text on both ends, but otherwise
21:50:09 <oklopol> vi i've just used a few times.
21:50:21 <ehird`> wordpad doesn't do much
21:50:24 <ehird`> like, say, syntax highlighting.
21:50:35 <jix> http://files.method-missing.org/pics/pic3.jpg << which wire is connected the wrong way
21:50:46 <ehird`> in fact, that's all i really need in a text editor
21:51:02 <jix> oklopol: which blue one?
21:51:04 <ehird`> good search+replace algorithm, reasonable navigation/insertation/deletion keys, and syntax highlihgting
21:51:07 <ehird`> i don't use auto-indent
21:51:11 <oklopol> jix: the one in the middle
21:51:25 <jix> hmm my sound laggs
21:51:33 <oklopol> auto-indent is nice except it usually fails.
21:52:09 <jix> but at least i want auto-indent the next line the same as the current line
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21:53:35 <ehird`> i don't even auto-indent the next line
21:53:48 <ehird`> but my programs rarely go above 3 amounts of indentation
21:53:51 <ehird`> and basically never go over 4
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21:55:50 <Sgeo_> Um.. I hard-reset out of Linux into Windows, tried playing a game in Windows, safe-reset, went back into Linux... and that nick was still alive?
21:56:11 <Sgeo_> It is VERY odd to see your own nick disappear when you're not expecting it
22:00:08 <GregorR> I've seen a message of mine arrive from one nick after I'd already been disconnected, logged in as another nick and started conversing with it.
22:02:34 <oerjan> just as long as it doesn't converse back :D
22:13:51 <oerjan> just as long as it wasn't the brakes
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22:16:30 <ehird`> one interesting thing related to text-generation bots is that some of them can imitate other users
22:16:36 <ehird`> i always wondered what a conversation with myself would be like
22:17:03 <oerjan> just as long as they don't imitate me
22:17:24 <ehird`> i should make one that imitates whoever talks to it :-)
22:27:43 <ehird`> i'm coding one now incidentally
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22:55:13 <ehird`> some people have lives
22:58:13 <GregorR> That's either a smiley representing an extremely deformed man, or a very strange bit of code in a language I don't recognize.
22:58:34 <staplegun> it's runnable until it reches the _
22:59:00 <staplegun> but all it will do is push 0 on the stack twice, add it and then terminate from error
23:00:28 <staplegun> python must be the greatest language ever
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23:14:02 <staplegun> who wants to help me get linux set up :D
23:14:36 <staplegun> just what i expect from a linux community ...
23:14:48 <ehird`> since when is this a linux community
23:30:29 <pikhq> This is the esolang community.
23:30:40 <pikhq> And setting up linux is not that difficult, oddly enough.
23:31:13 <pikhq> I hate to brag, but I first did it when I was 12. . .
23:31:40 <ehird`> pikhq: i first did it earlier than you did! ;)
23:31:53 <ehird`> "youngest person to set up linux" competition, in #esoteric, time: now
23:31:56 <pikhq> ehird`: But which distro was it?
23:32:07 <ehird`> pikhq: i cannot recall right now, i'll give it a think
23:32:24 <ehird`> i can barely set up slackware even now, haha
23:34:14 <GregorR> I was running it in the womb.
23:34:19 <GregorR> I had to port it to human cells first.
23:34:32 <ehird`> lots of hieisenbugs i'd imagine
23:35:05 <GregorR> Well, it's probabilistic, yes, but redundancy allows the probabilities to be >99.99999% in all cases.
23:35:15 <ehird`> did you distribute it?
23:35:44 <GregorR> I couldn't get a consistent Internet connection, and now the plans are lost :(
23:36:02 <ehird`> it's a bitch to get a trans-womb internet connection installed
23:36:06 <ehird`> i should know, i've tried
23:37:26 <GregorR> I think NetBSD runs on it, but I haven't seen a Linux port, no.
23:37:43 -!- staplegun has quit ("ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.8/2007100816]").
23:37:55 <ehird`> he used chatspeak anyway, no big loss
23:38:08 <GregorR> Apparently the suggestion of ChristBSD was offensive :P
23:38:26 <pikhq> It's not ChristBSD, though. . .
23:38:34 <pikhq> A bit more general. ;)
23:38:46 <ehird`> "It Runs The Universe..." (literally)
23:39:05 <ehird`> gosh imagine the race conditions in universe
23:39:15 <pikhq> The Universe is in Lisp.
23:39:30 <ehird`> no, it was hacked together in perl
23:39:49 <ehird`> [i would say something to the effect of, "points for the reference" but everyone here probably reads xkcd religiously, so.]
23:52:30 <ehird`> "of course, you are not the world. worlds sure are not the world."